[12:58] <mjg59> ROCK
[12:59] <jdub> COCKFOSTERS
[12:59] <daniels> This train is for
[01:01] <mjg59> This train is for the GIANT ICONS
[10:48] <rburton> oh i see
[10:48] <rburton> all this time everyone in gnome slags my theme off
[10:48] <rburton> and now ubuntu uses the same colours
[10:48] <seb128> :)
[10:48] <seb128> ok
[10:49] <seb128> oups
[10:49] <seb128> morning rburton :)
[10:49] <rburton> morning
[10:49] <seb128> what's up ?
[10:49] <rburton> work
[10:50] <rburton> :(
[10:50] <rburton> hald crashed again, yay
[10:56] <seb128> I'll drop the hal support in gnome-vfs today
[10:56] <seb128> nautilus is broken in browser mode here
[10:56] <seb128> could you test on your box if you have the same problem ?
[10:56] <seb128> nautilus --browser and just test if it hangs
[10:56] <rburton> yeah. dead
[10:57] <seb128> ok
[10:57] <seb128> I'm bothering teuf about this :)
[11:09] <rburton> seb128: are there any changes to desktop-file-utils you've got hidden away?
[11:09] <rburton> i've merged your patches and am about to upload to sid
[11:09] <seb128> no
[11:10] <seb128> You've added the update-desktop
[11:10] <seb128> update-desktop-database
[11:10] <rburton> postinst?
[11:10] <rburton> yeah
[11:10] <seb128> in the postinst
[11:10] <seb128> ok, so that's fine
[11:12] <rburton> isn't marillat fun? :)
[11:15] <jdub> yo rburton 
[11:15] <jdub> rburton: enjoying ubuntu?
[11:15] <rburton> aye
[11:16] <rburton> apart from super being sticky and no xemacs anyway
[11:16] <rburton> but i'll fix the former and get used to the latter
[11:16] <rburton> ephy is forcing me to sort out my bookmarks too
[11:18] <rburton> arse, the lisp detection mojo in desktop-file-utils is crap
[11:18] <rburton> i've created a no/ directory in the top level
[11:20] <jdub> xemac should be in universe ;)
[11:20] <rburton> i was trying to at least try emacs
[11:20] <seb128> rburton, somebody should really kick that guy *hard*
[11:23] <jdub> heh, d'oh
[11:23] <jdub> we're in the uk!
[11:25] <edd> yeah. cellphone coverage pretty patchy here too
[11:31] <Keybuk> not too long then
[11:32] <Keybuk> check if my house is on fire on the way through -- it's by the trainline on the way out
[11:32] <rburton> it would be really cool if ubuntu boot knew that /usr wasn't mounted over nfs and started nis before nfs
[11:32] <seb128> Keybuk, we need depends in init scripts :p
[11:33] <Keybuk> what about pre-depends? :p
[11:34] <seb128> don't forget to add a Conflicts to force the update :)
[11:50] <Keybuk> edd: oh, random point ... we're listed as FieldWave Ltd here
[11:53] <edd> Keybuk: Thanks. That's actually rather useful to know :)
[12:11] <edd> conductor pronounces us 40m late now
[12:12] <Keybuk> heh
[12:12] <Keybuk> where abouts are you?
[12:12] <edd> standing still between cov and leamington
[12:12] <Keybuk> erk
[12:13] <edd> it is not a place i'd choose to stop in
[12:16] <jdub> pants off
[12:17] <jdub> edd: on yer bike!
[12:17] <Keybuk> bad combination ... saddle rash
[12:39] <rburton> would begging for the gtk+ emacs get anywhere?
[12:44] <Keybuk> gtk+ emacs works ... it lacks pango cuteness though
[12:45] <rburton> matching the gtk+ colours would be nice for now
[12:48] <Keybuk> font sizes are all off :(
[12:48] <Keybuk> so it takes up more room than emacs-in-gnome-terminal
[12:48] <Keybuk> and is thus pointless
[12:53] <rburton> xemacs does stuff like actually use the right mouse button for context menus
[12:53] <rburton> which is nice if you happen to have a hand on the mouse
[12:54] <seb128> stop talking about xemacs dude, we have emacs :)
[12:59] <fabbione> stop talking about *macs .. we have vim
[01:00] <rburton> ewwww
[01:02] <rburton> emacs is officially crap, it is refusing to open a makefile with a lisp error
[01:15] <seb128> rburton, I've added a build-dep on libxt-dev in warty for zenity
[01:16] <rburton> seb128: arse. xt-dev? i added libx11-dev
[01:16] <seb128> that's why I'm saying it
[01:16] <rburton> maybe i should setup my pbuilder
[01:16] <seb128> sorry, I've forgotten to give you the fix for this one
[01:18] <seb128> or maybe I should wait for the new release :)
[01:20] <rburton> now now now
[01:24] <rburton> seb128: so just libxt-dev or libxt and libx11?
[01:24] <seb128> libxt-dev
[01:25] <rburton> ta
[01:25] <rburton> ah it deps on libx11-dev
[01:26] <seb128> oh yeah
[01:26] <seb128> I've a fucking bug with my panels at home and here
[01:26] <seb128> dynamic changes doesn't work sometime
[01:26] <seb128> ie: if I change the width or add a panel
[01:27] <seb128> I need to killall gnome-panel to get the changes
[01:27] <seb128> the gconfs key are updated but no graphical changes
[01:27] <rburton> i've seen that with the typing monitor
[01:44] <rburton> seb128: for future note, the xmodmap line in that X sticky-super fixes the problem for me
[01:48] <seb128> ok
[03:01] <rburton> erm, emacs won't save a file it just opened
[03:02] <rburton> "Lisp nesting exceeds max-lisp-eval-depth"
[03:05] <rburton> bah
[03:05] <rburton> xemacs isn't installable in universe
[03:05] <rburton> (depends on libtiff3g still)
[03:27] <seb128> rburton, we have planned to speak about menu organisation during the 2 weeks
[03:27] <rburton> excellent
[03:27] <seb128> so if you have some idea please let me know
[03:28] <rburton> ok
[03:30] <rburton> maybe a system configuration menu under actions would be nice
[03:32] <seb128> configuration is not really an action
[03:32] <rburton> but its not an application either really
[03:32] <rburton> a system top-level a la XD2?
[03:32] <rburton> Applications | System | Actions
[03:32] <seb128> I don't like the idea to get a new menu
[03:33] <seb128> and System is not used enough to be in the panel
[03:33] <seb128> I mean you don't change your configuration every 5 minutes
[03:33] <rburton> right just looked at a XD2 box
[03:33] <rburton> they have Applications | System | Help
[03:33] <seb128> and where are the configuration tools ?
[03:33] <rburton> system has personal settings, system prefs>, then actions as usual
[03:34] <seb128> hum
[03:34] <seb128> that's an option
[03:34] <rburton> would a screenshot help?
[03:35] <seb128> yes please, still good to have
[03:35] <seb128> jdub, around ?
[03:39] <rburton> www.burtonini.com/computing/screenshots/xd2-system-menu.png
[03:40] <rburton> oooh ubuntu is the first g2 desktop i've used in which the logout fade isn't jerky
[03:42] <Oskuro> yet another channel...
[03:42] <Oskuro> hi guys
[03:42] <seb128> hey Oskuro
[03:43] <seb128> good place to speak about menus in warty with ross and jdub I think
[03:43] <seb128> but jdub seems to not be around right now
[03:44] <Oskuro> nod
[03:45] <rburton> in warty? and sid :)
[03:45] <rburton> and sarge :)
[03:45] <seb128> harder to get a result in sarge
[03:46] <seb128> first they have the crapy Debian menu
[03:46] <Oskuro> I doubt anything is happening with Sarge's menus at this point. :)
[03:46] <rburton> you're not determined enough
[03:47] <Oskuro> ross is too optimistic. :)
[03:48] <rburton> woot aquired gigabit to my desktop
[03:48] <seb128> sarge will stay in the middle of the schemas move with a crappy menu
[03:48] <seb128> we can't hardly do anything
[03:48] <seb128> can even
[03:50] <rburton> i count 17 packages on my box with /etc/gconf in postinst
[03:50] <rburton> one of which is mine, fixing
[03:50] <seb128> there is around 60 packagse
[03:50] <seb128> IIRC
[03:51] <seb128> I've runned an apt-file search with some sed, sort, uniq, wc magic 
[03:51] <seb128> and it was around 60 in unstable
[03:53] <rburton> i guess build-depends (>= 4.2.13) is the best way of forcing the right dh_gconf
[03:53] <seb128> Oskuro, ?
[03:54] <seb128> rburton, I need we don't need to force it
[03:54] <seb128> it builds fine with previous one as long as you have dh_gconf
[03:54] <seb128> ok, schemas are not in /usr but that's not really a problem
[03:55] <rburton> i'm worried about an autobuilder using an old debhelper
[03:55] <seb128> the schema will be in /etc
[03:55] <seb128> no big deal
[03:56] <rburton> in that case i'll leave of the upload to save the buildd's time
[03:57] <rburton> regexxer is gtkmm, thus takes time, and doesn't have a postinst to break
[04:01] <seb128> ok
[04:08] <jdub> yeah, menus will come up in desktop vision discussion tomorrow
[04:08] <seb128> jdub, what's going on about desktop files ?
[04:08] <seb128> not sure to understand the mails on the list
[04:13] <rburton> gar
[04:13] <rburton> s-j is state D
[04:27] <seb128> jdub, around ?
[04:30] <seb128> Jeeeeeeeeeeeffffffffffff
[04:35] <mjg59> I'm building a kernel with all the latest nifty ACPI crack if anyone fancies testing it
[04:35] <mjg59> High quality rocking video resumption code that might even work
[04:37] <seb128> question for the sounders
[04:37] <seb128> did you get a mail or something like that ?
[04:44] <seb128> rburton, ?
[05:01] <Oskuro> the minimal thing we want to test for is a debhelper with dh_gconf, which was 4.1.lownumber iirc.
[05:02] <Oskuro> But if we're bumping versions, we might as well  go for /usr/share-happy dh_gconf, which is what I've been doing lately.
[05:02] <rburton> seb128: was away, you said ?
[05:03] <seb128> did you get a mail about ubuntu/sounder/whatever ?
[05:03] <seb128> teuf is on the sounder list and he didn't get anything
[05:03] <Oskuro> if the sounder list is what you sign up to at n-n-y.com, I didn't get a thing either.
[05:04] <seb128> no
[05:04] <Oskuro> I've never got a mail from n-n-y.
[05:04] <seb128> that's a list of people interessed by testing the distro
[05:04] <Oskuro> hmm
[05:04] <Oskuro> I think Carlos added me to that list too.
[05:04] <rburton> seb128: nope
[05:04] <seb128> ok
[05:04] <Oskuro> If not, I should have been.
[05:04] <seb128> so I guess it's ok if I invite teuf here ?
[05:04] <seb128> jduuuuub
[05:05] <rburton> i've never heard of sounder until now
[05:05] <seb128> how have you found the chan ? and how do you get the login/pass for the archive ?
[05:05] <seb128> jdub directly ?
[05:06] <rburton> i was invited here, and what archive?
[05:06] <seb128> I was thinking you get a standard mail about this or something like that
[05:06] <rburton> jdub told me to come here
[05:06] <seb128> rburton, the warty repository
[05:06] <seb128> ok
[05:06] <seb128> thanks
[05:07] <rburton> for the iso? jdub gave me a url which wasn't protected
[05:07] <seb128> oh yes, we have removed the login part
[05:07] <seb128> I hate gaim
[05:07] <rburton> but i've never received a mail about ubuntu/warty/sounder/etc
[05:08] <seb128> you enter "/j #chan" and it displays "/j: command not supported"
[05:08] <seb128> that's crap
[05:08] <seb128> rburton, ok, fine. Thanks
[05:08] <seb128> GRRR, same with //j
[05:09] <seb128> damned, fucking soft
[05:09] <seb128> welcome teuf
[05:09] <rburton> afternoon teuf
[05:09] <Oskuro> hi ye
[05:09] <Oskuro> damn
[05:09] <Oskuro> teuf: 
[05:10] <rburton> oh fun a new X
[05:10] <rburton> what is new? fixed sticky super? :)
[05:10] <teuf> hi everyone
[05:10] <seb128> I don't think so
[05:11] <seb128> rburton, nice to get packages update every 30min instead once a day, isn't it :)
[05:11] <rburton> yeah ;)
[05:30] <rburton> seb128: you'll be glad to know i've fixed my missing arrows in thinice bug
[05:30] <rburton> user error, i had libthinice in ~/.gtk-2.0/engines/
[05:30] <seb128> Oh, I've still understood the problem
[05:30] <rburton> so much crack left in ~ from rh9
[05:30] <seb128> oh ok
[05:31] <seb128> that's why I didn't get it
[05:31] <rburton> but i wish i knew why hald and sound-juicer hung all the time
[05:31] <seb128> second user error after the gdm problem :)
[05:31] <rburton> sssh
[05:31] <rburton> hald and sj are both D again, dammit
[05:32] <seb128> rburton, I've uploaded the gnome-vfs without hal support should be available rsn
[05:32] <rburton> i'm doing daily reboots atm
[05:32] <teuf> rburton: nautilus and rhythmbox tends to hang quite a lot on my home system when I use a hal enabled gnome-vfs
[05:32] <rburton> hopefully its hald which is causing sj to lock
[05:32] <seb128> teuf, when hald is fucked nautilus just hangs
[05:33] <rburton> what, the HIG isn't in main?
[05:33] <rburton> this is an outrage!
[05:34] <seb128> the HIG is in debian ?
[05:34] <rburton> yeah
[05:34] <rburton> doc-gnome-hig
[05:34] <seb128> perhaps we could support it :)
[05:34] <rburton> i package all the great docs in debian, diveintopython, doc-gnome-hig, the png book
[05:34] <rburton> :)
[05:34] <rburton> i appear to have a packaging addiction. anything more than 2k i package first
[05:36] <seb128> it would be nice if you could make your gnome packaging policy rocks more with an update :)
[05:36] <rburton> ross@hactar ~/Programming/debian/pkg-gnome/tools
[05:36] <rburton> $ svn status
[05:36] <rburton> ?      gnome-pkg-tools/gnome-policy.xml
[05:36] <rburton> i'm working on it
[05:36] <seb128> cool
[05:37] <rburton> hopefully shortly i'll have deleted enough of the clearly wrong stuff to commit it and let everyone argue about it again
[05:38] <seb128> ok, nice