[12:08] <mdz> npmccallum: how is usplash going?
[12:11] <Kamion> ... and it's even documented in the isolinux help screens ...
[12:15] <mdz> npmccallum,thom: the usplash changes need to get into warty today if they're going to release with Warty
[12:15] <mdz> this is a major change to the boot process and needs a lot of testing
[12:31] <Kamion> ideally they'd get into Sounder 7
[12:32] <Kamion> if I'm assured that they'll be in Warty by tomorrow then I can postpone Sounder 7 until then, but I'd rather not push it any later
[12:39] <mdz> Kamion: what time were you planning to roll Sounder 7?
[12:43] <Kamion> if I'm doing it tonight it needs to be roughly now in order for me not to be still working on it when my girlfriend gets here; if tomorrow, whenever really
[12:48] <Kamion> hm, this business of removing /cdrom etc. from /etc/fstab is going to suck for users who don't use our default magic
[12:48] <Kamion> I do 'mount /cdrom' all the time
[12:48] <Kamion> oh well
[12:48] <Kamion> FYI I'm not making that change right now because I think some of prebaseconfig/base-config relies on the existing code and I don't want to muck about with it right before a Sounder
[12:59] <mjg59> Is there going to be another test release before the weekend?
[12:59] <mdz> Kamion: you're free to statoverride /bin/mount and edit fstab
[01:00] <mdz> I'm personally quite happy to have it automounted by g-v-m
[01:01] <mdz> Kamion: if you need to start now, then do it.  it's more important to get sounder 7 out than to have usplash
[01:01] <mdz> I'm uncomfortable enough about intrusive changes to the boot process this close to release
[01:06] <Kamion> mjg59: you mean including Sounder 7 or not?
[01:07] <mjg59> Including that - I have no real idea how long it takes you to actually get something on the server once it's done :)
[01:08] <Kamion> oh, I build on a box in our LAN, it takes all of ten seconds or so to get it to the mirror once I throw the switch
[01:08] <Kamion> thom: hey, sulogin worked
[01:09] <Keybuk> Kamion: watch out, it probably makes all your files writable or something
[01:09] <Kamion> if thom wants to exploit all newly-installed Ubuntu systems, it's his paycheque ;-)
[01:12] <Kamion> excellent, DTRT with a set root password too
[01:12] <Kamion> mjg59: righto, hopefully tonight but I have no idea how late
[01:12] <Keybuk> http://en.wiktionary.org/
[01:12] <Keybuk> ^ Oooh
[01:13] <Kamion> I seem to be seeing ACPI errors from GNOME on startup with the current daily
[01:14] <Kamion> "Can't access ACPI events in /var/run/acpid.socket! Make sure the ACPI subsystem is working and the acpid daemon is running.@
[01:14] <Kamion> "
[01:16] <Oskuro> Kamion: acpid not running?
[01:16] <Kamion> it appears to be
[01:16] <Kamion> although /var/run/acpid.socket doesn't exist
[01:17] <Oskuro> weird. I guess the box isn't using apm, right?
[01:17] <Kamion> we don't have APM in warty kernels AFAIK
[01:17] <Kamion> I do have /proc/acpi
[01:17] <Oskuro> nod
[01:18] <mdz> Kamion: that's a known bug in thom's acpid upload
[01:18] <mdz> it starts, and then its socket is removed
[01:18] <mdz> Kamion: please do file a bug to remind him
[01:18] <Kamion> isn't that kind of a showstopper for a test release? :-)
[01:19] <Kamion> totally rad laptop support and all
[01:19] <Oskuro> heh, I vote for that
[01:21] <mdz> Kamion: if you have time to do it, reverting ubuntu4 is fine with me
[01:38] <Kamion> that'll be 1:33 at the earliest before I can start the build - I think this is going to have to wait until tomorrow, sorry
[07:20] <fabbione> morning guys
[08:45] <mdz> morning
[08:45] <fabbione> hey mdz!
[08:46] <fabbione> what's up?
[08:47] <mdz> sleep soon
[08:48] <fabbione> still walking on walls?
[08:48] <fabbione> ;)
[10:34] <rburton> morning seb128
[10:34] <seb128> hello rburton 
[10:37] <seb128> rburton: have you tried the nautilus sendto extension ?
[10:39] <rburton> no
[10:39] <rburton> i looked at the code
[10:39] <rburton> its crap
[10:39] <rburton> well, not really crap
[10:40] <Gman> 'less than ideal'
[10:40] <rburton> good phrase
[10:40] <seb128> lol
[10:41] <Gman> heh
[10:41] <Gman> oh gnome debian dudes
[10:41] <Gman> i'm getting no nice icons on my desktop
[10:41] <Gman> that's a known bug, right?
[10:42] <seb128> define "nice"
[10:42] <rburton> you running nautilus? ;)
[10:42] <Gman> well, doesn't seem to be picking up the icon theme
[10:42] <Gman> just blank page icons
[10:42] <seb128> ps ax | grep settings
[10:45] <Gman> hrm, gnome-settings-daemon seems to be running alright
[10:45] <Gman> most of the icons in the menu seem to be picked up
[10:45] <Gman> just not the nautilus desktop icons
[10:45] <Gman> and recent documents menu
[10:47] <seb128> which theme ?
[10:48] <Gman> ahh
[10:48] <Gman> thanks seb128
[10:48] <seb128> np
[10:48] <Gman> didn't think about that
[10:48] <Gman> duh
[10:54] <rburton> xemacs21 is uninstallable from universe atm
[10:55] <rburton> xemacs21-basesupport isn't available
[10:56] <seb128> bah, xemacs
[11:00] <rburton> yay i can watch the kde streams with totem
[11:01] <rburton> well, it appears that 200kb/s isn't enough for streaming
[11:01] <rburton> hm, no, its the video which sucks
[11:02] <seb128> yes
[11:02] <seb128> the video sucks
[11:02] <rburton> bit jerky
[11:02] <rburton> theora needs optimisation love
[11:02] <rburton> the camera is slowly dropping, which is quite amusing
[11:35] <Mithrandir> *grumble*, isn't rhythmbox supposed to use esd?
[11:35] <seb128> rhythmbox use whatever you have as audiosink in gst
[11:35] <seb128> esd, oss, alsa
[11:36] <seb128> gconftool-2 -g /system/gstreamer/0.8/default/audiosink
[11:37] <Mithrandir> hm, ossink.
[11:38] <seb128> you can change it by esdsink 
[11:48] <Mithrandir> seems like rhytmbox doesn't accept dragging and dropping files from nautilus.. well, I'll use totem, then.
[11:50] <thom> Kamion: just reverted acpid
[11:50] <seb128> you can right click on the file in nautilus
[11:51] <seb128> and add to the playlist
[11:51] <Mithrandir> seb128: nope, doesn't work.
[11:51] <Mithrandir> seb128: not over sftp.
[11:51] <seb128> oh, ok
[11:51] <Mithrandir> that really sucks.. why should I have to copy all my media to ~ ?
[11:52] <seb128> ?
[11:52] <Mithrandir> I have about 100G of music.. I really don't want to copy that to my workstation.
[11:53] <seb128> it doesn't work with a sftp dir ?
[11:54] <Mithrandir> right-clicking on a directory in nautilus does not show the "add to music library" if the directory is accessed through sftp, no.
[11:55] <seb128> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=140355
[11:56] <seb128> perhaps you can try the .application change to add the sftp method
[11:56] <seb128> not sure if you will get the crash reported after or not ...
[11:59] <Mithrandir> it doesn't report that rhytmbox can't open sftp, though
[01:01] <sabdfl> Kamion: what's the rsync url for the latest warty daily nowadays?
[01:06] <Mithrandir> rsync -av --partial --progress ftp.no-name-yet.com::cdimage/daily/current/warty-i386-1.iso warty-i386-1.iso is what I use
[01:09] <sabdfl> thanks mithrandir
[01:15] <Kamion> Mithrandir: use nfs, sucky though it is?
[01:16] <Mithrandir> Kamion: nfs over untrusted network?  I'm not completely on crack.
[01:16] <Kamion> oh, I thought you were local
[01:16] <Mithrandir> fairly local, but university network.
[01:16] <Kamion> ah
[01:16] <Mithrandir> so it's all untrusted.
[01:17] <Kamion> sftp is not exactly designed for streaming though
[01:17] <Mithrandir> well, it's a 100Mbit untrusted network, so I wouldn't really care. ;)
[01:17] <Kamion> thom: thanks, attempting another sounder 7 build now
[01:33] <sabdfl> kamion: will that latest build show up in cdimage/dail/current ?
[01:51] <Kamion> sabdfl: yes
[03:18] <seb128> lol
[03:18] <seb128> rburton: your "patches" blog entry is funny :)
[03:21] <Kamion> hm, trashapplet seems to totally crash and burn for me
[03:22] <Kamion> but anyway, Sounder 7 looks at least plausible; I'll pull the switch once I get back from the optician's
[03:23] <seb128> Kamion: trashapplet doesn't work at all for you ? 
[03:52] <rburton> aes: your blog entry was a little confusing
[03:53] <rburton> i'd say 90% of packages are in universe, so no extra repositories would be needed
[03:53] <rburton> no need for pinning etc
[03:53] <aes> rburton: that probably means I'm confused
[03:54] <rburton> probably, yes
[03:54] <rburton> :)
[03:54] <aes> You're saying "deb http://ftp.no-name-yet.com/no-name-yet warty main" is wrong, I suppose?
[03:54] <rburton> add "deb http://ftp.no-name-yet.com/no-name-yet/ warty universe"
[03:54] <aes> aha!
[03:54] <aes> Thanks :)
[03:54] <rburton> np
[03:54] <rburton> i only discovered it when i moaned about the lack of xemacs :)
[03:54] <thom> rburton: that's a feature
[03:55] <rburton> xemacs being broken?
[03:56] <rburton> i'm sure it is
[03:56] <mjg59> has the scary artwork gone in yet?
[03:56] <lamont> rburton: xemacs21 should be there soon
[03:56] <aes> mjg59: there is some scary artwork
[03:56] <rburton> lamont: its all in apart from xemacs21-basesupport
[03:56] <mjg59> aes: Does the scary artwork involve people?
[03:56] <aes> mjg59: not as far as I've seen
[03:57] <lamont> yeah - I fixed xemacs21 last night, will look at the rest of the xemacs-suite
[03:57] <aes> ok, so ubuntu rocks even more than I thought :)
[03:57] <mjg59> Ah, so not the really scary artwork yet
[03:57] <aes> mjg59: apparently not
[03:58] <rburton> jdub: contact-lookup-applet 0.8 is now in experimental, for when you wake up
[03:59] <rburton> urgh
[04:01] <daniels> mjg59: \o/ UBUNTU
[04:06] <lamont> rburton: we can't build xemacs21-packages (source for xemacs21-basesupport) because xemacs21-basesupport isn't built.  sigh.
[04:07] <lamont> I'll break the circle sometime today or so
[04:18] <lamont> I think the scary artwork was planning to arrive once they'd posed the actual models, rather than the stock footage they used in the mockups...
[04:19] <fabbione> hey guys
[04:19] <fabbione> lamont: any news from the X buildd front?
[04:20] <rburton> ok, talk of scary artwork is worrying me
[04:22] <Oskuro> rburton: you're going to love it :)
[04:22] <rburton> oooh let me see
[04:23] <rburton> pleeeease
[04:23] <Oskuro> I don't have it :)
[04:24] <fabbione> noone does
[04:24] <lamont> fabbione: -6ubuntu7 is installed on all 3
[04:24] <fabbione> lamont: good.. i was more thinking about the mime stuff :-)
[04:24] <lamont> rburton: it was more the people that were scary - the actual models aren't so scary
[04:25] <lamont> fabbione: thought about it afterwards - I need to rewrite some perl code into python to fix it, that'll happen sometime soon, but today isn't very likely
[04:25] <fabbione> ok. i am planning an upload for tomorrow
[04:25] <fabbione> just that you know
[04:26] <lamont> ok.
[04:27] <lamont> it has been observed recently that i386 and powerpc buildds apparently manage to upload (at least most of the time), while amd64 has not been observed to succeed without help
[04:28] <thom> it's also been observed that some people have been playing too much Mao
[04:45] <lamont> thom: well, yes.  But then, I'd have to actually do research to explain the rules definitively...  Not entirely sure which buildd's have hacked around the problem and which have not...
[04:48] <Kamion> anyone got anything special they'd like people to test in Sounder 7?
[04:49] <thom> logging in as root to single user? ;-)
[04:49] <thom> and, of course, TRLS
[04:50] <Kamion> oh, I meant to mention the root thing and forgot, thanks
[04:50] <Kamion> TRLS?
[04:51] <thom> totally rad...
[04:51] <Kamion> heh, ok
[04:54] <rburton> LS?
[04:55] <Kamion> laptop support
[05:01] <rburton> ah
[05:10] <rburton> so, no root password and initial user is sudo
[05:11] <Kamion> yup
[05:11] <rburton> can this be skipped?
[05:11] <Kamion> what do you mean?
[05:11] <rburton> i've forgotten what d-i actually does here -- can i trivially not setup an initial user and set a root password?
[05:11] <Kamion> no, you'd have to fix it up after the install
[05:12] <rburton> alrighty. can i file a bug? :)
[05:12] <Kamion> 'sudo passwd root', 'sudo deluser rburton' or whatever
[05:12] <Kamion> sure - sounds like an expert mode thing
[05:12] <rburton> i'm planning on ubuntu for our work desktops you see, and i am *so* not putting people in sudoers ;)
[05:13] <Kamion> sounds like an excellent reason; we need to collect data on the cases where people don't want this kind of setup
[05:13] <Kamion> making it the default for a CD release is a good way to get that data :-)
[05:30] <mjg59> thom: What does "Totally Rad Laptop Support" actually involve?
[05:31] <edd> working acpi, i gotta hope :)
[05:31] <mjg59> Haha
[05:31] <mjg59> edd: Are you still planning on doing an article on acpi at some point?
[05:32] <edd> mjg59: yes
[05:32] <mjg59> Cool
[05:36] <thom> mjg59: currently, laptop mode, some acpi stuff that doesn't send machines to sleep permanently, etc
[05:36] <mjg59> Cool
[05:42] <sabdf1> kamion: is the copy-on-install magic to boot with "linux anna/choose_module=archive-copier" ?
[05:43] <Kamion> choose_modules rather than choose_module
[05:43] <Kamion> but yes
[05:43] <sabdf1> ok
[05:44] <sabdf1> thanks, testing it now
[05:44] <Kamion> you can also boot in expert mode and select archive-copier from the extra bonus udeb list when that appears, then change debconf priority back to critical; but I figured this would be easier than that dance
[05:44] <sabdf1> also testing install-on-pcmcia-wifi network :-)
[05:45] <Kamion> you should see the name archive-copier flick past when it's retrieving installer components from the CD
[05:53] <sabdf1> kamion: archive-copier looks great
[05:53] <sabdf1> any attempt to find an optimal sequence?
[05:54] <Kamion> doing mkisofs -sort on the CDs has got up to the top three entries on my stack
[05:54] <Kamion> it's probably quite suboptimal atm
[05:56] <Kamion> three entries> not including having lunch ... hm, let's go and do that now, 5pm is time enough for lunch right? :)
[05:57] <sabdf1> you're running on new york time. excellent :-)
[06:04] <mjg59> Do you have Centrino drivers in the main install?
[06:12] <sabdf1> kamion: used the archive-copier, but it's still checking for the CD after the reboot
[06:14] <thom> mjg59: ipw2{1,2}00 you mean? we will do
[06:14] <mjg59> But don't yet?
[06:14] <thom> sabdf1: that's known about
[06:14] <thom> mjg59: yeah
[06:15] <Kamion> sabdf1: yep, as mentioned in the announcement base-config integration isn't complete
[06:33] <dieman> *yawn*
[06:35] <seb128> Kamion: could you add ~/Documents and ~/.Trash to the default skel ?
[06:36] <Kamion> I was in the middle of an install so that I could test whether creating ~/.Trash did the right thing ...
[06:36] <Kamion> can't some GNOME package just drop them into /etc/skel?
[06:36] <Kamion> hm, I guess they need to be there before the initial user is created though, which is before any of Desktop gets installed
[06:37] <seb128> yes ...
[06:37] <seb128> ~/.Trash is created by nautilus
[06:37] <Kamion> the thought of having non-dotfiles in /etc/skel just turns me right off :(
[06:37] <seb128> I'll do the same for the applet, so perhaps no need to add it to the skell
[06:37] <Kamion> I think that would be better
[06:38] <seb128> but ~/Documents would be nice
[06:38] <Kamion> it feels to me that that should only happen for people who log in at a desktop
[06:38] <Kamion> remote users have no need for it
[06:38] <seb128> we want to make ~/Documents the standard place for all the apps
[06:39] <seb128> hum, wondering where is the right place to create it
[06:39] <Kamion> surely just all desktop apps?
[06:39] <seb128> yes
[06:39] <Kamion> right
[06:39] <Kamion> so it's a desktop thing :)
[06:39] <seb128> ok :)
[06:39] <Kamion> that X -noswitchvt bug is ugly
[06:40] <fabbione> Kamion: yeah
[06:40] <fabbione> and daniels won't be able to work on it until next monday
[06:40] <fabbione> is there any package already using it?
[06:41] <Kamion> I assumed that was why I get crap all over my screen before gdm gets round to starting ...?
[06:41] <fabbione> hmmmm
[06:41] <fabbione> no i don't think so
[06:41] <fabbione> try to stop gdm
[06:41] <fabbione> and just startx
[06:41] <fabbione> kill X
[06:41] <fabbione> startx -novtswitch
[06:42] <lalo> is there a root password in the livecd?
[06:42] <fabbione> and you should be able to see the difference.. if there is any
[06:42] <fabbione> anyway
[06:42] <fabbione> i am off for today
[06:46] <Kamion> lalo: to be honest I think Alex is really the only person who knows much about how the live CD works right now
[06:46] <Kamion> 'Ubuntu 4.10 "Warty Warthog" perimadeia tty1'
[06:46] <Kamion> much better
[06:46] <lalo> Kamion: :-P
[06:47] <Kamion> fabbione: seems to do the same kind of thing
[06:48] <Kamion> except I'm not sure -novtswitch works there, odd
[07:06] <fabbione> Kamion: i am pretty sure the option is broken. gotta go for real
[07:31] <npmccallum> fabbione, Kamion: usplash will use X -noswitchvt
[07:53] <mdz> Kamion: I believe the final scheme for the version number was with a dash (4-10)
[07:58] <Kamion> it kept changing, it's possible I got confused
[08:00] <mdz> might want to ping the list
[08:19] <Mithrandir> we rock.  or sane rocks, or something.  Installed xsane, installed hpoj and It Just Works.
[08:19] <mdz> daniels: speaking of hpoj......
[08:21] <Mithrandir> what is The Recommended Email Client in ubuntu?  Evolution?
[08:21] <npmccallum> Mithrandir: yes
[08:22] <mdz> evolution and mutt are both available by default
[08:22] <mdz> mozilla-thunderbird is also supported
[08:22] <Kamion> /usr/bin/mkisofs: No such file or directory. Invalid node - -sort
[08:22] <Kamion> thank you, mkisofs, for your tremendously helpful error messages
[08:22] <Mithrandir> Kamion: wtf?
[08:23] <Mithrandir> evo needs a bit of convincing to build for amd64, though.  I'll have to take a look at that as soon as I have ia32-libs and amd64-libs in the archive.
[08:23] <Kamion> ah, I think it might be trying to treat -sort as a filename
[08:46] <sabdf1> kamion: is "Mozilla Web Browser" a dependency, or deliberately installed?
[08:47] <Kamion> sabdf1: Desktop has only mozilla-firefox; mozilla-browser is in Ship (so on the CD but not installed by default)
[08:48] <sabdf1> kamion: it installs by default on sounder7
[08:49] <sabdf1> what's the best way to figure out which binary is listening on an open port?
[08:50] <Kamion> netstat -anp
[08:51] <sabdf1> gem :-)
[08:52] <Kamion> hm, mozilla-browser is installed by default here too, which is extremely weird
[08:53] <Kamion> /var/log/base-config.log suggests something depends on it
[08:54] <Kamion> ah, I have a sneaking suspicion that aptitude is being naughty and installing Recommends:
[08:55] <jdub> hey hey hey
[08:57] <mdz> libdevhelp-1-0 Depends: mozilla-browser
[08:58] <Kamion> sabdf1: fixed in base-config 2.35ubuntu20
[08:58] <mdz> according to germinate, it's only in supported
[08:58] <Kamion> mdz: indeed. it's a Recommends: thing, fixed
[08:58] <mdz> ah
[09:02] <Kamion> OK, CDs hopefully now sorted with all the udebs at the front in Packages file order followed by all the debs in Packages file order
[09:02] <Kamion> and the Packages files alphabetically sorted by source then package name
[09:03] <Kamion> wonder how long that'll take to rsync ...
[09:05] <jdub> Kamion: oooh 
[09:05] <mdz> I thought we decided we wanted debootstrap order for base
[09:07] <Kamion> this will do for now
[09:07] <Kamion> doing it at all was hard enough, debian-cd being what it is
[09:07] <Kamion> mdz: actually, if we're going the archive-copier route we absolutely want this approach
[09:07] <Kamion> since archive-copier uses Packages file order
[09:08] <mdz> Kamion: archive-copier would handle base as well?
[09:08] <Kamion> yes
[09:08] <mdz> ah
[09:08] <Kamion> if you try it in Sounder 7, it runs before base-installer
[09:08] <mdz> I'm burning sounder 7 now
[09:10] <mdz> Kamion: does this include all of the shipseed additions we made in Oxford?
[09:10] <mdz> it's still only 512M
[09:10] <Kamion> mdz: that's all entirely automatic now, so yes
[09:10] <mdz> maybe we should add kernel-headers-x.y.z-386 to shipseed too, then
[09:10] <Kamion> I got bored of making the changes by hand so I automated it and had it just mail me any changes it made
[09:10] <mdz> that's handy for being able to build a kernel module with only what's on the CD
[09:11] <Kamion> and corresponding for other arches, yes
[09:11] <mdz> that's about 25M
[09:11] <mdz> on i386
[09:12] <mdz> it might even be a good idea to install it by default
[09:12] <mdz> then building kernel modules 'just works'
[09:13] <Kamion> we don't even have powerpc kernel headers in Supported at the moment
[09:13] <Kamion> that seems like a bug
[09:13] <mdz> yes, please add the right packages
[09:13] <mdz> amd64 as well, if you know which ones we should have
[09:14] <Mithrandir> I guess I'm supposed to pop in now and tell you what package you want for amd64, but I don't remember.
[09:14] <Kamion> Mithrandir: it'll be easy to find out
[09:16] <Mithrandir> lamont: did the xresprobe build on amd64 die?
[09:17] <lamont> it died on one arch with a parse error - emailed daniels about it
[09:17] <lamont> I think it was amd64
[09:18] <lamont> but that window is busy...
[09:18] <Mithrandir> yeah, I'll try it by hand
[09:18] <lamont> newt has non-PIC in shared libs, fails.
[09:18] <lamont> amd64, that is
[09:18] <lamont> gcc -g -Wall -O2   -c -o ddcprobe.o ddcprobe.c
[09:18] <lamont> ddcprobe.c: In function `main':
[09:18] <lamont> ddcprobe.c:274: error: parse error at end of input
[09:18] <lamont> that's xresprobe/amd64
[09:19] <Kamion> ddcprobe.c has very strange }-inside-#ifdef-itis
[09:19] <mdz> Mithrandir: kernel-headers-`uname -r` should do
[09:20] <Mithrandir> I'm running a non-ubuntu kernel atm, though
[09:20] <Mithrandir> I should whack the mkinitrd script into supporting sata
[09:20] <Kamion> somebody should fix the lunacy from lines 65 to 106 of ddcprobe.c
[09:52] <mdz> Mithrandir: indeed
[09:52] <Mithrandir> since a lot of amd64 users only have sata.
[09:52] <Kamion> the grub source package is barking
[09:53] <Kamion> it contains a patch in debian/patches/ which only changes a file in debian/
[09:53] <Kamion> although fortunately it isn't actually enabled
[09:58] <mdz> Kamion: barking?
[09:58] <Kamion> mad
[09:58] <Kamion> (UK slang)
[09:59] <Keybuk> really? and I thought it was a place just outside Reading <g>
[10:06] <Keybuk> heh, libtiff
[10:06] <lamont> Kamion: that's about 10 minutes work, all told
[10:06] <Keybuk> would it be possible to separate warty-changes and universe changes?
[10:07] <lamont> Keybuk: the w-b stuff is all the same place, so somehow I kinda doubt it...
[10:07] <lamont> but then you can look at the body of the message and sort...
[10:12] <Keybuk> well, universe is ultimately "uninteresting" from a company POV ... and flooding the list with it kinda makes -changes less interesting to subscribe to
[10:12] <sabdfl> hopefully our community will take an active interest in universe though
[10:12] <sabdfl> so there should be ongoing updates from trusted maintainers there
[10:15] <Keybuk> there can be a "too much traffic" problem though, especially if it gets to the level of debian's
[10:15] <mdz> Kamion: archive-copier seems to do the right thing for me, as far as copying
[10:16] <mdz> aptitude and dpkg-preconfigure still read the CD
[10:16] <Keybuk> hmm
[10:17] <Keybuk> is it me or is gnome dev current uninstallable
[10:17] <Keybuk> half seems to depend on libgcrypt7-dev and the other half on libgcrypt11-dev
[10:22] <Keybuk> ok
[10:23] <Keybuk> stupid question time
[10:23] <Keybuk> WHY is glade-gnome-2 in universe and not in warty?
[10:23] <Kamion> mdz: apt-cdrom add, too
[10:24] <mdz> Kamion: by the time I logged in on vt2 to look, /var/cache/apt/archives was empty
[10:24] <mdz> I assume something is cleaning up after debootstrap
[10:25] <Mithrandir> base-config cleans it by default
[10:25] <Mithrandir> iirc
[10:29] <Kamion> mdz: oh, damn, I forgot to mention that; you also need to boot with KEEP_DEBS=yes
[10:29] <mdz> ah
[10:29] <Kamion> (on the second boot)
[10:29] <Kamion> I'll mail sounder@
[10:32] <mdz> daniels: ping?
[10:32] <mdz> xserver-xfree86 is asking me a question
[10:33] <lamont> mdz: the unmitigated gall of it. :-)
[10:34] <Kamion> mdz: apparently this happens when xresprobe can't
[10:34] <mdz> Kamion: yeah, I'm prodding it now.  but it was detecting my LCD OK in Oxford
[10:35] <lamont> mdz: please sudo ls /var/spool/postfix/{public,private}
[10:35] <mdz> lamont: both empty
[10:36] <lamont> and the errors were coming out before or after that first reboot?
[10:36] <lamont> I'll assume 'both'
[10:37] <mdz> both
[10:37] <mdz> and every time I run sudo
[10:37] <lamont> does /usr/sbin/postfix stop; /usr/sbin/postfix start make it go away?
[10:38] <mdz> lamont: no
[10:38] <lamont> hrmpf.
[10:38] <mdz> lamont: this should be trivial to reproduce with a fresh Warty install; others are seeing it as well
[10:38] <lamont> yeah - just have to suck down the iso. :-(
[10:39] <Kamion> what's the bug? I just did an install
[10:39] <lamont> postfix fifo dirs appear to wind up empty
[10:39] <lamont> sudo ls /var/spool/postfix/{public,private}
[10:39] <Kamion> hm, but not on a network-connected machine, which might not be terribly helpful
[10:41] <lamont> and, for whatever reason, that's not happening - mdz: is postfix running? (ps aux| grep master)
[10:41] <mdz> lamont: no, it isn't
[10:42] <mdz> aha, I think I see the problem
[10:42] <lamont> /usr/sbin/postfix start should have started it... /var/log/mail.log should have some bitchiness in it then.
[10:42] <mdz> loopback is unconfigured
[10:42] <mdz> Kamion: this is the d-i-with-no-network case
[10:44] <Kamion> you ctrl-c'ed "configuring network interfaces"
[10:44] <Kamion> I bet
[10:45] <mdz> no, I did "go back"
[10:45] <Kamion> I mean after the first reboot
[10:45] <mdz> no, I didn't
[10:45] <Kamion> hm
[10:45] <Kamion> well, I plan to overhaul that code anyway ...
[10:46] <Kamion> anyhow, time for !work
[10:48] <lamont> so does this make it a net-config issue, not a postfix issue?
[10:48] <lamont> OTOH, I should just create the directories
[11:06] <aes> wheeeeeeeeee
[11:06] <aes> Hello panel
[11:11] <seb128> what with the panel ?
[11:13] <aes> tis a new panel
[11:13] <seb128> oh, yes
[11:13] <aes> :)
[11:14] <seb128> I was fearing a crasher or something like that :)
[11:14] <aes> nah :)
[11:14] <aes> seems quite a nice logical layout
[11:14] <seb128> just first version, some changes are already pending for tomorrow
[11:22] <aes> Only gripe is that Computer contains an eclectic mix of all sorts of things, but I couldn't suggest anything better...
[11:22] <aes> (not without having a "Files" menu too, but that makes things get cluttered.)
[11:22] <aes> Anyway. You don't want me whinging here ;)
[11:24] <seb128> all the advices/opinions are welcome
[11:27] <Mithrandir> hi aes :)
[11:28] <aes> Hello Mithrandir
[11:28] <aes> oh, I know you :)
[11:29] <Mithrandir> yes, we met at GUADEC this summer
[11:29] <aes> yes
[11:29] <aes> just slow on mapping irc nicks <-> real life :)
[11:29] <Mithrandir> :)
[11:29] <Mithrandir> well, I'm off to bed now.
[11:29] <Mithrandir> see you around
[11:30] <aes> night