Hrdwr_BoBthen I'll go to the snow, and lug along this ridiculous dell laptop with windows on it with no battery12:00
KamionCD1/pool/main/i/id3lib3.8.3 -74112:05
KamionCD1/pool/main/i/id3lib3.8.3/libid3-3.8.3_3.8.3-4_powerpc.deb -74212:05
KamionCD1/pool/main/i/ifupdown -74312:05
KamionCD1/pool/main/i/ifupdown/ifupdown_0.6.4-4.8_powerpc.deb -74412:05
Kamionthat should do nicely12:05
mdzKamion: let me know when there's a CD up and I'll give it a try; I'm quite interested to see the difference12:06
Kamionwill do, just waiting for my new archive-copier and base-config to hit the archive to save having to hack those in by hand12:08
Kamionsource is there so it'll be grinding through the lamont machine now12:08
Kamionhm, I think that means it's time for a whisk[e] y12:09
Kamion(haven't decided whether it's with e or without yet)12:09
=== jdub fears current upgrade.
jdub139 upgraded, 4 newly installed, 2 to remove and 0 not upgraded.12:09
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mdzKamion: Scots prefer the spelling whisky; Americans follow instead the Irish spelling, so Kentucky bourbon is whiskey.12:11
mdzaccording to random google result12:11
mdzjdub: current daily seems to have the desktop icon breakage; is that fixed yet?12:12
jdubi uploaded an ubuntu-artwork yesterday for that12:12
jduband am working on very fresh nice pacakge for it12:13
jdubbut i hate it how automake still doesn't handle trees of files12:13
mdzhmm, I wonder if I could use growisofs to swap a new version of grub onto a warty ISO12:22
jdub * Stopping Common Unix Printing System...12:25
jdubinvoke-rc.d: initscript cupsys, action "stop" failed.12:25
jdub * Starting Common Unix Printing System...12:25
jdubinvoke-rc.d: initscript cupsys, action "start" failed.12:25
mdzgah, sudo with timeout=0 is ANNOYING12:30
Kamionmdz: I know which is which, certainly :-)12:46
Kamionmdz: I had been wondering whether to have Scotch or Irish12:46
Kamion(Ardbeg, in the end, a rather fine Scotch.)12:46
mdzKamion: ah :-)12:46
mdzI did not realize the distinction until I read that12:47
mdzwhile spelled differently, they sound the same when slurred to the bartender12:47
Clinti think the canadians do "whisky" too12:47
=== npmccallum [~npmccallu@24-48-54-75.ironoh.adelphia.net] has joined #ubuntu
jdubnpmccallum:   cupsys dbus-1 fam12:56
jdubhaving problems with those12:56
jdubinit scripts b0rked12:56
mdzjdub: file bugs12:56
Kamionit's not clear to me that the directory sorting stuff is having the desired effect on the .iso12:57
Kamionthe extent numbers look pretty much the same to me12:58
Kamionwill the dentry cache deal with it if I just ls all the directories first?12:59
mdzKamion: maybe01:00
mdza nice find+stat might do the trick01:00
Kamionhell, just find -type f01:02
=== Kamion goes to experiment
mdzdpkg: warning, architecture `amd64' not in remapping table01:03
mdzKamion: yeah, that's what I meant01:03
mdzany find command that needs a stat to work01:03
npmccallumjdub: can you give me any more info than that?01:03
jdubwhat info do you need?01:04
jdubPreparing to replace cupsys 1.1.20final+cvs20040330-4ubuntu8 (using .../cupsys_1.1.20final+cvs20040330-4ubuntu9_i386.deb) ...01:04
jdub * Stopping Common Unix Printing System...01:04
jdubinvoke-rc.d: initscript cupsys, action "stop" failed.01:04
jdubdpkg: warning - old pre-removal script returned error exit status 101:05
jdubdpkg - trying script from the new package instead ...01:05
jdub * Stopping Common Unix Printing System...01:05
jdubinvoke-rc.d: initscript cupsys, action "stop" failed.01:05
jdubdpkg: error processing /var/cache/apt/archives/cupsys_1.1.20final+cvs20040330-4ubuntu9_i386.deb (--unpack):01:05
jdub subprocess new pre-removal script returned error exit status 101:05
jdub * Starting Common Unix Printing System...01:05
mdzKamion: grub-installer is missing from the amd64 CD; is that intentional?01:05
jdubinvoke-rc.d: initscript cupsys, action "start" failed.01:05
jduband then it just sits there01:05
jdub(that's on apt-get install cupsys)01:05
npmccallumI can't get it to fail01:05
mdzjdub: do you have the latest lsb-base?01:05
jdubii  lsb-base          1.3-9ubuntu301:06
npmccallumyeah, its a dependency01:06
mdzjdub: sh -x /etc/init.d/cupsys stop01:06
mdzand/or start01:06
=== mako_ is now known as mako
mdzKamion: that is, it's not on the CD at all01:07
jdubmdz: that looks fine01:08
jdub$? == 1 though01:08
npmccallumjdub: what is the last command executed?01:09
jdub++ /usr/bin/tput hpa 8701:09
Kamionthat was a startling difference01:11
Kamion$ ls01:12
Kamiongrub-installer_0.50ubuntu3.dsc  grub-installer_0.50ubuntu3.tar.gz  grub-installer_0.50ubuntu3_i386.udeb01:12
Kamionmdz: not in the archive01:12
KamionPackage: grub-installer01:12
KamionArchitecture: i386 hurd-i386 amd6401:12
KamionI'm betting P-a-s is wrong01:13
npmccallumjdub: what is the result if you do echo $TERM?01:13
Kamionlamont: yep, it is. could you add hurd-i386 amd64 to the grub-installer line in P-a-s, please?01:13
jdubjdub@lazarus ~/src $ echo $TERM01:14
jdubi'll try outside01:14
jdubit works outside a screen01:14
npmccallumtry it in screen01:15
npmccallumbut before you run the script set TERM=xterm01:15
npmccallumactually, set it to TERM=linux01:15
lamontKamion: done - I assume that you'll poke elmo to freshen warty's PaS?01:16
npmccallumjdub: ok, we just need to filter out the TERM=screen setting01:16
Kamionlamont: didn't know I had to01:16
Kamionlamont: I'll remind him next time I see him01:16
lamontKamion: I think it's under the same freeze as the rest of debian stuff.01:17
=== lamont had fun brutalizing lockers today. With hammer, prybar, and pliers.
npmccallumjdub: I'm going to close those bugs and open a new one01:18
lamontKamion: does #1008 close with elmo sync'ing things?01:18
mdzKamion: bug filed01:18
jdubnpmccallum: ok, ta01:18
=== jdub fears - lucky it was tested in screen...
lamontmdz: will look at #363 again this weekend and figure out what was actually done in Debian, and how hard porting it over will be.01:20
mdzlamont: please do01:21
mdzlamont: CCed elmo on the bug relating to grub-installer01:22
mdznpmccallum: forcing the terminal type is not the right solution01:22
mdznpmccallum: what you need to do is fall back gracefully if _any_ of those commands fail01:23
npmccallummdz: I know01:23
npmccallummdz: I'm not going to force the terminal type01:23
jdubmdz: all that error checking is going to drown the performance of my initscripts!01:25
mdznpmccallum: ok, I must have misunderstood what you meant when you said we needed to filter out the TERM=screen setting01:25
npmccallummdz: I just meant we need to check for it, but we should just check for a tput failure instead01:26
jdubmdz: i would like ubuntu-artwork to depend on gnome-accessibility-themes for a short period of time01:29
jdubmdz: though that conflicts with some of #50101:29
jdubmdz: thoughts?01:29
jdubmdz: or, i can split the grub bit out into another package01:30
jdub(which seems a bit silly)01:30
jdubnot entirely silly01:32
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npmccallummdz: what do you want the script to do if it can't use tput? show [ ok ] /[fail]  at the beginning of the next line?01:36
Kamionlamont: think so; reassign to James?01:36
lamontKamion: will do01:37
Kamionnpmccallum: maybe just fall back to something like the old-style output instead01:37
Kamionthat would be more readable than taking up two lines for every script01:37
=== lamont wonders what he broke.. stick a dvd in, and it doesn't autoplay anymore.
lamontlikewise, inserting the CF card doesn't cause it to be recognized.01:37
npmccallumKamion: thats a little difficult with the way it is currently structured01:39
Kamionnpmccallum: doesn't have to be exact by any means01:40
jdub * Starting foo... done.01:40
Kamion...done or ...failed01:40
jdub * Starting foo... failed.01:40
mdznpmccallum: it should just do something sane that doesn't require tput01:40
mdzdisplaying on the next line sounds fine01:41
jdubif it looked like the above all the time, that'd be k-rad ;)01:41
mdzjdub: why would it need to depend on gnome-accessibility-themes?01:41
mdzjdub: no need to split the grub bit; I explained in the bug exactly how I think it should be solved01:41
jdubmdz: i want to inherit from an a11y theme01:42
Kamionlamont: when do the BuildDI jobs run?01:42
lamont06:05 machine-local (aka British) time01:42
jdubmdz: (the grub dir and image is going to look funny on other arches, nothing important, plus it would give us the base action while letting ubuntu-artwork depend on wacky gnome stuff)01:42
mdzjdub: I don't think the comment about GNOME and Base applies anymore01:43
mdzjdub: since we don't use the grub splash image01:43
jdubwe don't even use it?01:43
mdzjdub: well, we won't when you finish with ubuntu-artwork and let npmccallum finish that bit01:43
mdzor is it done already?01:43
npmccallumjdub: its not removed yet, but it needs to be01:44
mdzjdub: we decided that since the grub menu isn't even displayed by default anymore, it doesn't need a pretty background01:44
Kamionlamont: good, so the upload I just made should easily make it01:44
jdubmdz: so we don't need the splash stuff in the package at all, and i'm free to depend on whatever i like?01:45
lamontKamion: unless it needs by-hand loving, or is openoffice... :-)01:45
npmccallumjdub: 501 has to get fixed, cause otherwise removing grub-splash will break upgrades01:45
mdzjdub: you don't need to install the splash image at all, no01:45
mdzjdub: it still needs to call update-grub, as described in 501, so that the splash gets removed from menu.lst01:45
Kamionlamont: just a little cdrom-detect01:46
jdubso i just need the postrm01:46
npmccallumjdub: yes01:47
=== jdub growls at mdz ;)
jdubmdz: that didn't actually kill the splash image line in grub/menu.lst02:15
mdzjdub: why are you growling at me?02:16
jdub(the build-essential thing)02:16
mdzjdub: running update-grub when the splash image is no longer present in the filesystem should remove it from menu.lst02:17
mdzif it doesn't, that's an update-grub bug02:17
mdzbut I suspect that part works02:17
jdubso it did manually02:17
jdubbut not when postrm ran02:18
mdzthat depends entirely on how the postrm is written02:22
mdz"postrm upgrade" will be run while the file is still there02:22
mdz"postrm remove" doesn't get run unless the package is removed from the system02:22
mdzpostrm isn't enough to do the job02:22
mdzin fact, postrm isn't needed at all02:23
mdzpostinst is where this needs to be done02:23
mdzpostrm would only be needed if the package still provided the splash image02:23
mdzpostinst should get an "if configure && dpkg --compare-versions && which grub then update-grub" bit02:25
npmccallummdz: take a look at bug #1010 and tell me what you think if that output02:35
jdubwhat's the largest widescreen res we've seen?02:35
npmccallum1200 on a dell02:36
jdubsurely bigger...02:36
mdzjdub: all the ones we were able to collect in Oxford are in the xfree86 debconf list02:36
mdznpmccallum: fine with me; it doesn't matter much what it looks like as long as it works02:37
Hrdwr_BoBthe apple 30" will do 2560 x 1600 02:37
Clintsomeone mail me one of those02:41
Hrdwr_BoBbest monitor evar02:42
Kamionnpmccallum: is it impossible to get it onto the same line?02:42
Kamiondoesn't have to be right-justified or anything02:42
npmccallumKamion: To get it on the same line requires tput02:44
Kamionhow come? have you already output the newline or something?02:44
npmccallumKamion: yes02:45
KamionI'm tempted to say "don't do that then", but I haven't looked at the code :)02:45
npmccallumKamion: this is only the cases where tput doesn't work on the specified terminal and when /usr isn't mounted02:45
npmccallumKamion: it probably isn't impossible, but makes the api wierd02:46
npmccallumKamion: we'd have to make all the messages not output newlines and instead put newlines at the beginning of each message02:47
npmccallumKamion: but then if text we can't easily control gets printed in the meantime, it will look funky02:48
Kamionmy expectation was that the newline would go at the end of [ ok ] 02:48
Kamionbut I can see the argument about text you don't control02:49
npmccallumyes, a newline would go there.  But what about other messages?  We also have colord output on the left (at the beginning of the column) when something goes wrong, (so its easy to tell what exactly went wrong)02:50
Kamionevidently I need to look at all this in more detail when I have time. :)02:51
npmccallumbrb, reboot02:58
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Kamiongramps is quite funky04:24
Kamionbeats trying to draw charts out on paper04:24
spivOoh, it's Python too.04:32
Kamionexhibited some slightly odd almost-crashy behaviour at one point04:38
Kamionbut seems mostly ok04:38
mdzjdub: can anything be done about famd running as root?04:46
jdubwell, there's the replacement, gamin04:50
jdubbut that's hoary04:50
jdubi don't think we can replace fam04:50
jdubbut when we do, we can get rid of portmap too :)04:50
jdubholy crap people05:37
jdubnormal human beings don't use gcc05:37
jdubit's totally irrelevant for the desktop seed05:37
mdzand with that, good night05:45
mdzok, I take it back. she isn't ready to leave yet05:46
mdzseriously, we ship a lot of stuff in desktop that human beings don't use.  it's infrastructure, and tools that let you get under the hood a little if you want to05:47
jdubthe problem i'm finding05:47
jdubis that your argument is 'why not?'05:47
jdubwhen a long time ago we decided 'no'05:48
mdzmy argument is that many of our users *today* expect it to be there05:48
mdzand it costs us *nothing*05:48
jdub'expect it to be there'05:49
jdubi don't think that's true05:49
jdubwhen i install debian, i don't get a compiler05:49
jdubon most of the other distros, you have to check a checkbox to get developer tools05:50
mdzhave you installed Debian recently?05:50
mdzyou sure as fuck do05:50
mdzgcc is priority: standard05:50
jdubi never have :)05:50
jdubdebian is of course a very different case05:51
jdubs/have :)/have had gcc by default on my debian systems/05:54
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danielsbdale: hey dude :) how did the violin thingy go?07:43
Riffit's official07:43
RiffI don't think there is a single laptop I want to buy07:43
danielsRiff: x40? powerbook?07:43
Riffsomeone must have a laptop they like07:44
Riffdaniels: I was looking at the X3107:44
Riffbut it doesn't have a Synaptic touchpad07:44
danielsyeah, synaptics touchpads are love07:44
danielstotal crack, though07:44
RiffI had considered a powerbook, but running Linux on PPC makes you a second class citizen07:44
danielsRiff: then, er, half of canonical are second-class citizens07:45
Riffdaniels: lots of things are lacking due to supportability problems07:45
danielsiirc, bob2, elmo, limi, lulu, thom (although he is now x40-compliant), stub, kamion and a few others have them07:45
Riffas a result, I would be forced to run OS X on it07:45
danielsyeah, lacking the wireless would suck hard07:45
jdubRiff: i've just ordered a dell x30007:46
Riffwhich isn't so bad, but kind of defeats the purpose07:46
Riffjdub: I dislike Dell immensely due to my bad experiences with them, as a result I haven't looked at their product range07:46
Riffperhaps I should07:46
jdubsteven hanley had one07:46
jdubwhich i played with last weekend07:47
jdubit seemed pretty good07:47
jduband the price was right07:47
RiffI hate their support line so much07:47
Riffreally, my favourite brand is Toshiba, but all their current products are behind07:47
Riffseriously behind07:47
jdubmako and jane have a particular model of toshiba that i've seen around quite a bit07:48
Riffthey just don't seem to have a sane offering on the market over here07:48
Riffthey've got a few things in the US and UK07:49
Riffbut even those aren't fantastic07:49
bdaledaniels: I'm home, but the violin thing isn't until tomorrow... it's nearly midnight Fri night here now07:55
danielsbdale: oh right, neat07:55
danielsbdale: how was the rest of auug? sorry i had to dash off so quickly -- had a sister to collect from school and all07:55
jdubyo bdale 07:56
jdubgetting a mobile phone + deal ends up being harder than getting a laptop07:57
Riffmmm, grahame mentioned bdale was at AUUG07:57
RiffI'm also told I'm going to the AUUG meet here in Perth on Tuesday apparently07:58
bdaledaniels: it was fun.  I caught a couple interesting talks between interviews and customer visits, and it was good meeting a bunch of people I've known about for a long time and/or emailed, but never met.07:59
danielsbadrock :)08:02
danielsbdale: rock :)08:02
jdubuh oh08:02
jdubdaniels got some bad rock08:02
danielsjdub: it was pretty easy for me, although it took a turn for the worst when they asked me where i worked08:02
danielsjdub: butbutbut08:03
danielsi want crack!08:03
cefbdale: hey there.. long time08:13
cefbdale: couldn't make it to auug unfortunately, otherwise would have said hello in person08:14
bdalecef: hi!  oh well...08:15
cefbdale: place I'm working as is moving offices.. and of course, I'm the poor sod that is organising the move08:16
bdalecef: been there...08:16
cefas = at.. *sigh* .. my typing is getting worse08:16
=== bdale is tired, but not sleepy, ergo up reading email
cefmakes sense.. always a good thing.. though sometimes replying isn't always warranted *grin*08:17
RiffI still haven't found a laptop I want08:26
Riffwhy has noone made a laptop I want08:26
cefcos you're a picky bastard? *grin*08:42
Riffyes, I think I am08:45
jdubSetting up gdm ( ...08:57
jdub * Reloading GNOME Display Manager configuration...08:57
jdub * Changes will take effect when all current X sessions have ended.08:57
jdub   ...done.08:57
jdub$ sudo /etc/init.d/cupsys restart08:58
jdub * Restarting Common Unix Printing System...08:58
jdub   ...done.08:58
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cefinetd needs to die!09:55
Riffyou're not going to replace it with xinetd are you?09:55
cefnot me, no.. but unfortunately netbase depends on netkit-inetd, which imho is just stupid09:56
cef(least in debian)09:56
cefand without netbase, you tend to miss things like /etc/services, /etc/protocols, etc09:56
cefbut there is no reason for inetd on a desktop usually09:58
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cefbugzilla upgrade eh?10:02
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=== justdave heads to bed so he can be awake then :)
Riffcef: it handles useful things10:24
Riffmost of the things in there should be disabled though10:25
Riffit does mean you can do things like run samba/apache unprivledged iirc10:25
Riffsince inetd listens on the ports rather then the program itself10:26
ceftrue, but it's slow at starting them10:47
cefand it's started by default at boot, which imho is bad10:48
cefshould have an entry in /etc/defaults that you can enable/disable, and by default is disabled10:48
ceferm, /etc/default/ even10:49
Riffcef: it depends on what you're after10:49
RiffI think for the desktop, having to fire up apache wouldn't be that big a deal10:49
Riffand apache could serve the load, then eventually the apache server will shut down10:50
Riffsimilarly for samba10:50
RiffI haven't looked into it much10:50
Riffit was more some random thinking I was doing10:50
cefsamba will have trouble keeping track of netbios machine names afaik.. so lookups could take significantly longer, or even fail (SMB/CIFS is a horrid piece of shit like that)10:51
=== Riff thinks about it
Riffif I was designing it, I would probably do a two stage system10:52
Riffinvolving a part that hooked into inetd and a part to hold state10:52
Riffboth of them could run as an unprivledged user10:53
Riffbut they would need some IPC lov10:53
Riffit sounds shonkey10:53
cefwell you could seperate that.. run nmbd directly, and run smbd from inetd.. no reason you couldn't do that10:53
Riffthe correct solution is to probably give the whole thing a sane privledge esculation model10:53
Rifflike SElinux I guess10:54
RiffTheo Deraat wouldn't agree with me though apparently10:54
cefthe main problem is binding to the port. if you can get away from that, you don't need root10:55
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debianisthi all10:55
debianistthe morphix based livecd, when boot up on a dell inspiron 8200 laptop, uses only a small square of the screen, any clue?10:56
cefcentre/left-top/bottom-right ?10:57
cefhrm, my stomach is grumbling10:59
debianistcef : you want coordinates?11:00
debianistsorry about that, just got up :)11:01
debianistcef : go get some serials dude ;)11:01
debianistcef : I've seen this problem also in knpooix and mandrake move, could it be something unrelated to ubuntu ?11:02
debianistor something resulting from using morphix as the livecd base?11:04
cefdebianist: probably. most likely it can't detect the resolution the screen is doing, or it's using vesafb in eg: 640x480, and not scaling the screen to the full res (not that you want to do it that way, as it looks terrible)11:04
debianistcef : I thought also that this is the nvidia free driver problem, but after testing the drive on the debian sid I have on the same system, I was proven wrong.11:05
debianistboth free and proprierity drivers work ok11:06
cefyeah it's either x's resolution settings, or vesafb bugs11:06
cefwhat happens if you use ctrl alt + or ctrl alt - ?11:07
debianistcef : i'd test it and come back to you , need to reboot into the livecd again :)11:07
debianistanother thing,11:07
debianistHAL is not gnome specific right? It's a linux wide daemon?11:08
cefcool.. also might want to grab a copy of XF86config-4 when you boot it too11:08
debianistyou mean snapshot the autodetected X config file?11:08
debianistok, I'd save it to sid's partition and come back here tell you the outcome11:09
debianistHAL is on be default on the livecd right?11:09
cefnot sure if HAL is on the livecd.. haven't played with HAL at all myself11:11
=== debianist is booting ubuntu livecd
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debianistcef : back11:38
debianistcef : ok, trying to reset solution doesn't yeild nothing. seems like it's ignoring my keystrokes.11:38
debianistcef : i have all 4 XFree configs (.in also) 11:38
debianistcef : my usb mouse wasn't detected / installed (noticed an entry on the Xfree86-4 file, but coudln't figure if this is the one it was using)11:39
debianistcef : correction, was detected (infra red light on and everything) however not responding.11:39
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debianistcef ?12:10
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=== Topic for #ubuntu: SSDS | http://sounders:oink@wiki.no-name-yet.com/ | Sounder CD 7 released | bug tracking at https://bugzilla.no-name-yet.com/
=== Topic (#ubuntu): set by Kamion at Fri Sep 3 16:30:19 2004
jdublamont: ping?03:58
elmo_jdub: you forgot a b-d on cdbs04:09
jdubelmo_: just uploaded :)04:11
Kamionargh, base installation broken04:24
jdublamont: 04:27
jdubGnome Pilot 2.0.12 (Recompile no more) has been released:04:27
jdubGnome Pilot Changes:04:27
jdub* Fix USB syncing (Frederic Crozat)04:27
jdub^ might be useful, not sure of the details though :)04:27
aesMaybe it's related to http://bugzilla.ximian.com/show_bug.cgi?id=3374904:32
aesaka "USB syncing is totally and utterly completely broken"04:32
jdubi'm sure lamont hopes so :)04:33
seb128jdub: hey04:37
seb128jdub: about ~/Documents ... when/where should we create it ? We said nautilus some times ago, but I'm not sure here or skel04:39
seb128we don't want to recreate it if user has deleted it04:39
jdubthere was a mail waaaay back about the stuff that should be in skel04:39
jdubDocuments was one of them04:39
jdubi'll find the msg-id04:40
seb128and some times later Kamion said he doesn't like the idea to have files which are hidden in the skel04:40
seb128because remote users don't carre to get a ~/Documents for example04:40
jdubideally they'd only be created for local/desktop users04:43
jdubbut we don't have all the bits to make sure that happens yet04:43
Kamionfiles which *aren't* hidden :)04:50
Kamionlet's not make Ubuntu too ugly for remote users04:51
jdubthis was discussed/decided a long time ago04:51
seb128Kamion: oups :p04:51
Kamionif jdub 04:51
jdubi've just asked matt to double-check it04:51
Kamionjdub: I was under the strong impression it had been decided in favour of not having non-dotfiles in skel04:51
jdubit's not that hard to kill a bunch of dirs if you decide you don't want them04:51
KamionI'm sure I remember talking to Mark about it04:52
Kamiongah, another distribution with a crap skel then04:52
Kamionthere's a good reason debian policy says "don't overload skel"04:52
jdubi've raised the idea of having a desktopseed-only package that has those dirs in it04:52
Kamionskel is the wrong place; if you need new directories for existing users it's hopeless04:53
jdubHaving thought about it a bit, I'm not too worried about the controversy04:53
jdubhere.  Users who don't like the clutter can delete it and it won't come back04:53
jdub(except for the Nautilus exception you mentioned on IRC; that's a separate04:53
jdubissue anyway), or they'll copy their home directory wholesale from04:53
jdubelsewhere.  I've been accustomed to deleting whatever /etc/skel provides for04:53
jdubyears now.04:53
Kamionit shouldn't even be an optional package installing stuff in /etc/skel04:53
jdubwe don't need new dirs for existing users04:53
Kamionso far ...04:53
jdubwell, if we're going to redecide yet another thing we decided months ago04:53
jdubwe'd better do it soon04:53
KamionI'm sure we talked about this at the conference04:54
seb128jdub: so what are we doing ? Just let me know if I need to make some hack in nautilus for this04:54
jdub(i mailed matt off-list because it was a previous discussion dating back to before sounders)04:54
jdubseb128: not for the moment04:54
KamionI should get into the habit of carrying a dictaphone :P04:54
jdubDate: Thu, 6 May 2004 23:49:10 -070004:54
jdub^ previous discussion04:54
seb128ok, thanks04:54
Kamionplease see the thread on sounder@ starting at Message-ID: <20040824164510.GC30846@riva.ucam.org>04:55
seb128jdub: have you tested the Documents place on the desktop ?04:55
jdubseb128: wait for matt to get back04:55
KamionDate: Tue, 24 Aug 2004 17:45:10 +010004:55
jdubKamion: i also read that one04:55
KamionMark replied to it and seemed happy04:55
jdubKamion: but i'm not into rehashing stuff we've decided previously04:55
seb128jdub: still the same problem, one week to make changes, lot to do, blablabla .. the sooner the better if we need to make changes :)04:56
Kamiona.k.a. "better something we've decided than something that's right"?04:56
Kamionthis decision will stay with us04:56
jdubKamion: depends what's right04:56
jdubseb128: yeah ;)04:56
Kamion/etc/skel/ has historically proven to be wrong04:56
=== jdub is going to bed, will let matt figure it out.
Kamionpeople keep rediscovering that, though ...04:56
seb128'night jdub 04:57
jdubKamion: if you can fill mdz+jdub's inbox with why it's 'wrong' rather than 'messy', please do :)04:57
Kamionum, I said my piece on sounder@04:58
Kamionthis seems like it should be an on-list thing04:58
jdub(it's referring to a previous thread that wasn't on list, after that's dealt with, it'll be on-list)04:59
=== jdub actually goes to bed.
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hypatiaSorry if this is in scrollback, but what do I do about this "there was an error loading theme Human" thing I get when my laptop (latest Warty from apt) starts gdm?05:49
hypatiaI press OK and get the same error over and over.05:49
=== hypatia justturns of gdm and uses startx
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KeybukErrors were encountered while processing:06:34
Keybuk tetex-bin06:34
Keybuk tetex-extra06:34
Keybukedd: Sub-process /usr/bin/dpkg returned an error code (1)06:34
KeybukAck!  Something bad happened while installing packages.  Trying to recover:06:34
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Keybukseb128: are you really sure you've fixed the gnome-settings-daemon problem?  nautilus is currently refusing to respond to a background change notification06:56
seb128Keybuk: which problem ?07:40
SteveArhythmbox comes installed with a bunch of "radio" stations.07:42
SteveAthey don't work for me.07:42
SteveACould not open vfs file "http://sc1.magnatune.com:8004/" for reading.07:42
SteveAfollowed by07:42
SteveACould not pause playback07:42
seb128is gstreamer0.8-gnomevfs installed ?07:42
SteveAI dunno, this is just what warty installed ;-)07:43
SteveAyes it is07:43
seb128ok, so that's not the problem07:43
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Keybukseb128: well, nautilus wasn't reacting to any changes in the background (from the properties) dialog until it was killed and respawned07:44
seb128Keybuk: it was supposed to be fixed ?07:45
seb128I think it's a different problem than the panel/gconf listeners one07:45
seb128but I've no idea of where is the problem ...07:45
SteveAwget -d  "http://sc1.magnatune.com:8004/"   tells me that the address gives me a "malformed status line"07:46
SteveAand sure enough:07:46
seb128I can play it with xmms07:46
seb128I'm trying with gst07:46
SteveAHTTP request sent, awaiting response... ICY 200 OK07:46
SteveAClosing fd 307:46
SteveA20:45:17 ERROR -1: Malformed status line.07:46
npmccallumjdub: just installed the new ubuntu-artwork -- my icons are *huge*07:48
seb128npmccallum: that's industrial icon theme07:48
npmccallumseb128: they take up most of my screen07:49
npmccallumseb128: and I'm running at 1600x120007:49
seb128SteveA: ok, according to a gnomevfs guys that's a problem with GNOME 2.7 apparently, I'm following on an upstream bug report07:49
Keybukseb128: and I can't change icon theme either ... nothing happens when I change the selection07:50
seb128npmccallum: ok, so that not. i've the feeling that industrial icon are like 1.5 bigger here, but not taking most of the screen07:50
SteveAcool, it isn't just me ;-)07:50
seb128Keybuk: yeah, the theme manager is fucked sometimes. I've already talked with some redhat guys about this, they have the problem too but no real idea of the problem07:51
seb128Keybuk: control-center has virtually no upstream for some months now ...07:51
=== justdave pokes at the bugzilla machine in preparation for the upgrade
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npmccallumseb128: https://bugzilla.no-name-yet.com/attachment.cgi?id=34&action=edit08:02
=== justdave backs up the databases
justdaveok, it's done.  I'd appreciate if anyone wants to play around and see if anything's broken08:08
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aesjustdave: around?08:41
aesjustdave: a while ago I made myself a bugzilla account and never got a password.08:41
justdaveyeah, the mail went out, and gnome's mail server accepted it08:45
justdaveI replied to the thread saying so, and offering to set the password if you still couldn't get the password reset mail08:46
aesOh, I didn't get that mail either08:46
aesHow bizarre08:46
justdavethat was actually posted to the sounders list I think08:47
aesit's not in my sounders archive though.08:47
aesAnyway, I just submitted a change password request, so I'll see if that gets through08:47
justdaveyep, 8/24 7:36am EDT (-0400)08:48
justdaveok, if you don't I can set one for you.  Won't help your mail any, but you'd be able to get in at least08:48
aesIf I can't debug my mail I'll get back to you, thanks08:57
=== aes pokes gnome sysadmins
Mithrandirhi aes09:01
mjg59What's the apt sources line again?09:58
Mithrandirhttp://ftp.no-name-yet.com/no-name-yet warty main {,universe}10:03
Mithrandiriirc, at least10:03
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seb128SteveA: I've just uploaded a gnome-vfs2 package which fixes the problem with rhythmbox/gstreamer11:11
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