Kamionmdz: done12:00
debianistepoch v.numbers are to avoid conflicts with upstream version numbers?12:00
Kamionepochs are when you make a mistake in version numbering and need to start again. see the Debian policy manual for details12:00
Clintthey're not for Debian mistakes.  see the policy manual for details.  :P12:01
Clintoh, did that get changed?12:02
Kamion    It is provided to allow mistakes in the version numbers of older versions12:02
Kamion    of a package, and also a package's previous version numbering schemes, to12:02
Kamion    be left behind.12:02
Kamionit's always said that AFAIK12:02
Clintplease stop msging me12:02
ClintPerhaps I remembered incorrectly.12:03
Clintdebianist: there is more than one place in the policy manual where epochs are discussed12:05
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debianistpitti : Hi!12:29
pittidebianist: Hi!12:30
debianistpitti : i see you keep coming and going, had a good time off? ;)12:30
carlosKamion: hmm, did you saw my mail about the yaboot configuration to boot from a firewire device?12:30
Kamionyes, but rather swamped I'm afraid, I'll try to remember to have a look at it12:31
pittidebianist: no, I just installed the new Warty on my Desktop12:31
Kamionprobably not before preview though, sorry12:31
pittidebianist: and now its done :-)12:31
pittidebianist: still had some rough edges12:31
pittidebianist: at the first attempt, grub crashed with an "error 21"12:31
debianistpitti : have you spotted the topic?12:32
carlosKamion: don't worry, It's not urgent. Should I file a bug about it?12:32
Kamionyes, that's probably the best way to make sure I remember12:32
pittidebianist: yes, I had a special BIOS setting enabled which speeds up bootup12:32
Kamionouch, my activity report for today is longer than for most weekdays12:32
pittidebianist: and I added a new hd today (before I did not have enough space to test Warty on my desktop, only my laptop)12:32
carlospitti: I didn't forgot the NM process, I will try to finish it this week (and this time it will be true :-P)12:33
pittidebianist: and the BIOS did not yet recognize my new hd, so grub did not either12:33
pitticarlos: good to hear :-)12:34
pittimdz: here?12:34
Kamiondebianist: hm, to my knowledge there was nothing about broken grub in the 20040912 brokenness12:34
debianistKamion : i guess it was something to do with the special bios functio he used.12:35
pittiKamion: Now I tried to install Warty on two totally different computers. On none of them snd-pcm-oss and snd-mixer-oss are loaded. Do you think we can get this in by the release?12:35
Kamiondebianist: yes, read that12:36
pittiKamion: that wasn't d-i's fault12:36
Kamionpitti: already sorted, see bug #116612:36
pittiKamion: thanks. This just missed today's daily :-/12:38
Kamionit *considerably* missed today's daily, I only changed debootstrap half an hour ago :)12:39
pitti;-) I downloaded the ISO about an hour ago12:39
Kamionshould be in tomorrow's, anyway12:39
pittibut of course it's already a bit older12:39
pittiKamion: can I upload a new base-config with updated German translations tomorrow or does that somehow interfere with your actions?12:41
pittiKamion: or is there another translation strategy?12:41
Kamionfile a bug with them attached, I'll see that they get into my next upload12:43
KamionI'm sure there'll be at least one before preview anyway ...12:43
pittiKamion: okay, I will do that12:43
mdzpitti: here12:45
mdzKamion: thanks for the new debootstrap12:46
pittimdz: already sorted out (#1166), thanks12:46
pittigood night, guys!12:47
lamontis there no python bzip2 module?01:41
elmoit's builtin, 'bz2'01:51
debianistlamont : security wise, we do not support pkgs with priority "optinal", section "net"01:52
debianistlamont : ?01:52
debianistlamont : nm. wrong section. disregard01:56
Kamionpriority and section are not interesting for Ubuntu02:08
Kamionwe support what's in our main archive02:09
debianistanything without "universe" in it is supported?02:09
debianistok, anything under pool/main02:11
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Kamionand pool/restricted/02:12
debianistok, thanks again.02:13
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debianisthi haggai03:31
danielsfabbione: ??03:34
danielsfabbione: oh yeah -- i see the problem. hm.03:35
debianistKamion : here?03:38
elmodebianist: no, he's asleep03:39
danielsfabbione: 0.4.3 uploaded03:39
debianistelmo : i try 'aptitude show tomcat4' that's my output = 'Package: tomcat403:45
debianistelmo : if the package is there, should it show me it's desc?03:45
debianistelmo : also, chcked the *Packages files, and tomcat4 is only suggested by another pkg.03:46
elmodebianist: no idea sorry, I've never used aptitude03:46
debianistelmo : same for apt, could you run over your machine tell me the output?03:47
elmoI think tomcat4 is not in warty at all, even universe03:47
elmowe only imported debian/main into universe and IIRC tomcat is in contrib03:47
debianistthat explains it,03:47
debianistguess aptitude is just grepping the packages files and gave the line from the suggested03:47
debianistthanks elmo03:47
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jdubyo jamesh 03:49
jameshhi jdub03:49
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elmonight all04:33
debianistnight elmo04:40
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danielselmo: night dude05:11
whiprushjdub: ping05:24
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lamontmy computer icon is back.. how sweet.05:47
debianistmorning lamont05:48
lamontalthough clicking on Home is less happy...: Failed to execute the child process\n"kfmclient" (No such file or directory)05:48
debianistare you using recent daily?05:49
jameshlamont: are you sure those icons aren't left over from running KDE?05:51
lamontjamesh: this was a flatlined install about sounder 3 timeframe... 05:52
=== lamont has never run kde.
jameshI wonder what the kfmclient stuff is about then?05:53
lamontapt-get dist-upgrade and a reboot is why I left channel...05:53
debianistlamont : could you tell me what you think about DSA-102, fixed/not ?05:53
lamontjamesh: no clue.  It's remotely possible that I ran kde once back when, or rather, had it installed for some other packages...   /home/lamont carried over across the flatline05:53
jameshlamont: is there any files in ~/Desktop that look like they might be icons for your home dir?05:53
jameshlamont: (there shouldn't be with Gnome)05:53
lamontls ~/Desktop/05:54
lamontHome  starthere.desktop  Trash05:54
lamontsounder 3 timeframe had a Home icon.05:54
jameshlamont: delete the Home and Trash files05:54
jameshlamont: if you want to turn on the home, computer or trash icons, use gconf-editor05:54
jameshgo to /apps/nautilus/desktop05:54
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jameshthere are a number of boolean *_visible keys05:55
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fabbionemorning guys06:04
debianistmorning fabbione06:07
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jdubmdz: so06:09
jdubmdz: i'd like to lock down uploads now06:09
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jdubmdz: and require confirmation from you and i for every change06:10
jdubmdz: perhaps barring artwork06:10
jdubmdz: are you happy with that now?06:10
jdub(we've been appropriately loose so far)06:11
mdzmaybe with s/and/or/06:11
mdzotherwise we are timezone bottlenecks06:11
jdubokay, for this release, that's okay, but later on, we should shift toward double-confirms06:12
debianistmdz : what about security review? i'm nearly done..in about 30mins06:12
jdub(we'll have a team anyway, so it'll be less bottlenecky)06:13
debianisthmm, make that extra 30 mins then ;)06:13
debianistdon't get it. have 2 php4 packages in my *Packges files, one in /pool/main the other in universe..06:48
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fabbionedaniels: ping06:53
debianistmorning doko06:53
dokofabbione: X-testing: you mean the guidelines from "Second call for X testers"?06:53
debianistdoko : php4 is universe right?06:53
jblackfabbioone: I'm doing dual-head tonight! 06:53
fabbionedoko: yes06:53
fabbionejblack: it won't be aoutdetected, but if you need a working config i have one for you :-)06:54
jblackI've already got it working... well, kinda.06:54
fabbionejblack: and dual head rocks !06:54
jblackI can't seem to drive the monitor at 1600x1200, but it seems to be quite usable at the weird resolution it did pick.06:54
dokodebianist: yes, universe/web06:55
jblackThe only thing I haven't figured out yet is how to move windows betwen screens.06:55
dokojblack: AFAIK there is a difference between dual head and extended desktop (at least for the ATI drivers)06:55
fabbionejblack: extended desktop you need xinerama06:56
debianistdoko : so that's completely un reasonable that i have another php4 entry on the packag file, saying it's in /poo/main/p/php4 ?06:56
jblackOh, that's not enabled by default? 06:56
fabbionejblack: for the resolution can you check Horiz/Vert freq?06:56
jblacksure. How do I do that? 06:56
fabbionejblack: nope.. xinerama needs to be enabled06:56
debianistdoko : section web, not universe06:56
fabbionejblack: in the config file06:56
jblackI take it that needs a Load "xinerama" option.06:57
fabbione        HorizSync       30-10906:57
fabbione        VertRefresh     48-16006:57
fabbionejblack: i can't remember how to enable xinerama.. just a sec that i will RTFM06:57
=== jblack feels sheepish. :)
fabbione(oh btw the values are only examples from my monitor)06:57
fabbioneOption "Xinerama" "true"06:58
fabbionein the server section06:58
fabbioneSection "ServerLayout"06:58
fabbione        Option "Xinerama" "true"06:58
fabbioneand so on...06:58
fabbionethat should work06:58
jblackOk. restarting X.06:59
=== debianist is taking an 1.5hrs nap. be back soon
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jblackfabbioone.... 07:04
jblackDid I ever tell you just how cool you are? 07:04
jblackI screwed with that for like two hours.07:05
fabbionedid it hook up proper resolutions and freq too?07:05
jblackand you just go "Oh. add these two lines, and all will be good"07:05
jblackOh, I hit google for the freqs.07:05
fabbionejblack: it would be the same for me towards RCS :-)07:05
jblackHeh. revision control systems are easy.07:06
jblackIts making X do everything exactly right thats impossible.07:06
jblackxwininfo reports "3320x1200". :) 07:07
fabbionebecause it catches the entire desktop07:07
fabbionesince it's on one viewport07:07
jblackI wonder if I can do this at 24bpp07:08
fabbionethat only depends on how much ram you have on the video card07:08
fabbionebut if you are dual head, i am pretty sure you can07:08
=== fabbione guesses at least a nv with 128Mb
jblackbrb after I find out.07:09
jameshxdpyinfo is probably the command you want07:09
fabbionejamesh: the output is correct07:09
fabbionehe is using 2x1600x1200 (or similar) in xinerama07:10
fabbioneso one huge desktop07:10
jameshor 1660x120007:10
fabbioneit's not 2 separate 1600x120007:10
dokofabbione: for the first test: is "(EE) No input driver matching `synaptic' expected"?07:10
fabbionedoko: yes. but it should not be a fatal error07:10
fabbionejamesh: yeah.. 07:11
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jameshfabbione: apparently Keith reckons the new X extensions will get rid of the need for Xinerama07:11
jblackNope. 07:11
jameshfabbione: since you'd be able to composite windows from one screen to the other07:11
jblackI guess 3320x1200x24 was a little much to ask for07:11
fabbionejblack: can you check in /var/log/XFree86.0.log how much ram do you have on the board?07:11
jameshand redirect user input07:12
dokofabbione: hmm, it is fatal.07:12
fabbionejamesh: we will see after switching to x.org :-)07:12
fabbionedoko: it can't be fatal07:12
jameshfabbione: I don't know if it is possible yet though ...07:12
fabbionedoko: because you have psmouse and mousedev loaded07:12
jblack(--) RADEON(1): VideoRAM: 32768 kByte (128 bit DDR SDRAM)07:12
fabbionejblack: with 32MB of ram you are lucky you can do dual head :-))))07:13
jameshfabbione: it does open up a number of possibilities though, such as dynamically changing the relative positions of the screens07:13
jamesh(doing it from client side)07:13
jblackcould X be confused about how much ram I have?07:14
fabbionejamesh: well right now the hardcoded position of the screen is a (quite) simple barrier to kill07:14
fabbionejblack: yes.07:14
jblackIt's a 1 month old laptop that just sent me back $2600.07:14
fabbionejblack: if you believe to have more ram you can force it07:14
jblackHow do I check? 07:15
fabbionejblack: you need to check the video card specs on google :-)07:15
fabbioneand i am checking how to force it07:15
jblackHrmmm. Well, I'm already back a step.07:15
jblackthe sticker on the machine says its an ati radeon mobility 9700, but lspci lists it as a 9600.07:15
fabbionethat can be a lspci glitch07:16
jblackgeeze this is a big desktop.07:16
fabbionein X config where you define the video card:07:16
fabbioneSection "Device"07:16
fabbioneIdentifier "whatever name you picked up"07:16
dokofabbione: starting X shows me a blinking screen, somewhat looking ascii-ish, screen resolution 640x480, console messages like AUDIT ... X: client 20 rejected from local host07:17
jameshfabbione: well, it does provide a generic solution that could handle rearranging of spanned desktops, mirroring the desktop, and a11y apps like magnifiers07:17
jameshand switching between the modes at runtine07:17
jameshruntime, even07:17
fabbioneVideoRam <value>07:17
fabbionejblack: where value is expressed in kB07:18
jblack16bpp is fine for me.07:18
jblackNow if only I could hook up a third monitor.... 07:18
fabbionejblack: well for the sake of it you should push it to 24bit :-)))07:18
fabbionedoko: ok.. give me 2 minutes and we will go step by step on it07:19
jblackWhat happens if I lie to X and say the card has 64 megs, if it only has 32? 07:19
fabbionejblack: it would possibly crash07:19
fabbionebut trust me.. you have more than 32Mb07:19
fabbionejust check the specs07:19
fabbioneand force the ram with a proper value07:19
fabbionebe back in a few minutes!07:20
jblackYup. its got 64 megs07:21
jameshFor most apps, 16bit is sufficient though07:23
jameshand can be faster07:23
fabbionehe already left :-)07:24
fabbionehmm perhpas X detects 64Mb and split the ram 2x32 for dualhead07:24
fabbionei haven't tought about it07:24
fabbionedoko: ok... let's start07:24
fabbionedoko: apt-get --purge remove xserver-xfree8607:24
fabbionedoko: be sure there is no /etc/X11/XF86Config-407:25
fabbionedoko: apt-get install xresprobe laptop-detect mdetect discover107:25
dokofabbione: done07:25
fabbioneand be sure xresprobe is at version 0.4.407:25
fabbioneis it at that version?07:26
dokoyes, 0.4.407:26
fabbioneok. did you stop X?07:26
dokoyes, before I purged the package07:26
fabbionewhich video card do you have?07:27
dokoNvidia GForce4 440 Go07:27
fabbionexresprobe nv07:28
dokotells me: grep: /tmp ... file or directory not found, id: res: freq: with no values07:29
fabbioneok, this is partially correct07:30
fabbionedo you have a /etc/X11/X symlink?07:30
fabbionenow install xserver-xfree8607:31
dokodone, the screen did "blink" one time07:31
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fabbionedoko: ok07:32
fabbionenow run again xresprobe nv07:32
dokosame result07:32
fabbioneit gives an error?07:32
jblackfabbioone: According to the web, I have 64 megs of ram. but when I set that for both devices, It corrupted one of the displays07:33
fabbionejblack: yes.. i realized it a sec after you left07:33
dokoexit status 0, but same output as mentioned07:33
fabbionejblack: 64 Mb of ram is detected correctly. 2 heads = 32Mb of ram each07:33
fabbionedoko: ok. first open a bug on xresprobe becuase it returns crap07:34
jblackoh man. now I need a new desk.07:34
fabbionenow.. when you installed xserver-xfree86, did X asked you about the resolution you wanted to run?07:34
=== fabbione will get one next month
dokofabbione: no question07:35
fabbionedoko: ok... the problem is xresprobe returning crap07:35
fabbionedoko: and X can't really validate xresprobe output07:36
fabbionedoko: at this point...07:36
fabbioneyou can only reconfigure X manually07:36
dokoany information you need?07:36
fabbionedpkg-reconfigure xserver-xfree8607:36
fabbionedoko: you need to send daniles some log stuff.. he added some debugging stuff in the environment, but i am not sure what yet...07:37
fabbionedoko: hadn't the time to catch up during the weekend07:37
dokook, will do so. won't be online today until the evening.07:38
fabbioneexport it and then run xresprobe nv07:38
fabbionesend all the output to daniels07:38
fabbionethat should be enough07:38
dokofabbione: X error message when called from /usr/share/xresprobe/xprobe.sh: Unrecognized option: -logfile07:43
fabbionedoko: add everything up to the report for daniels07:46
mdzdoko: huh?  -logfile is a valid option07:54
mdzdoko: do you have some other X in your PATH or something?07:54
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fabbionemdz: i am afraid xresprobe is still seriously borked08:00
mdzfabbione: it is working fine for me08:00
mdz0.4.3 was, anyway08:00
fabbioneyeah.. what about 0.4.4?08:00
mdzI'll try it shortly08:00
mdzdoko: set -x in xprobe.sh and find the command line which is producing that error08:02
mdzfabbione: where does the /etc/X11/X symlink point?08:02
mdzdoko: ^^^08:02
fabbionemdz: considering that he is using xserver-xfree86 it should point to /usr/X11R6/bin/Xfree86 or something like that08:03
mdzit should, yes08:03
mdzbut I don't see why /usr/X11R6/bin/XFree86 would say "Unrecognized option: -logfile"08:03
mdzdaniels: awake?08:04
fabbioneperhaps the way the command line is built?08:04
fabbionemdz: i think he is at the uni08:04
mdzfabbione: hmm?08:04
fabbione| away     : daniels - uni08:04
fabbionenow he is not away anumore08:05
mdzI found a way to reproduce that error08:05
mdzif you run XFree86 as non-root :-)08:05
mdzthat is the only way I can cause that to happen08:05
fabbionemdz: even via sudo?08:05
mdzif the X server itself runs as non-root08:05
mdzthen it will not honor -logfile08:06
mdzperhaps doko was running xresprobe as an unprivileged user08:06
fabbionedoko: ?08:06
dokohmm, seems I'm looking stupied ... :-( I'll retry 08:06
dokofabbione, ok I now get id: res: 640x480 freq:08:08
mdzdoko: did you run with XRESPROBE_DEBUG=yes?08:09
mdzif you do, it will leave behind a directory in /tmp08:09
mdzand you should send the logfiles in it to daniels08:09
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mdzm_tthew: welcome :-)08:13
dokowhich directory is supposed to be left in /tmp? I don't see anything, double checked for typos in the env var setting08:13
mdzdoko: you have xresprobe >= 0.4.3?08:13
mdzdoko: should be /tmp/xprobe.<pid>08:14
pittiGood morning guys!08:14
m_tthew-mdz ahoy'hoy08:14
mdzdoko: ah, seems to be a bug with the debug setting08:14
mdzdoko: set both XRESPROBE_DEBUG and XPROBE_DEBUG08:14
doko0.4.4, ah, ok, the directory is left when running /usr/share/xresprobe/xprobe.sh directly.08:20
mdzdoko: anything interesting in it?08:23
mdzdoko: this is a laptop, right? (you said geForce Go)08:25
mdzdoko:   EGREPLINE="\(--\) NV\(.*\): Virtual size is .*x.* \(pitch .*\)"08:26
mdzthat's the pattern it's searching for in xfree86.log08:26
dokoyes, only complain is: can't open /etc/X11/rgb.txt, although the file exists.08:26
dokomdz: the only line that matches is the 640x480 line.08:27
mdzdoko: look at the rest of the log file08:29
mdzall of the NV(0) stuff08:29
mdzI'm going to sleep soon, but file a bug, attach those files, and assign it to daniels08:30
fabbionenight mdz08:31
dokomdz: night. tommorow is team meeting?08:31
=== fabbione doesn't have any email for a tomorrow
fabbione's meeting08:32
fabbione(DAMN ENTER)08:32
dokofabbione: that was a question, I don't have email either.08:33
fabbioneyou scared me for a sec08:33
fabbionedaniels: are you around?08:34
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mdzno plans for a meeting tomorrow08:46
pittiKamion: the untranslated string during base-install is in passwd, not base-installer; shall I send you a bug report or directly upload?08:47
fabbionemdz: i am doing a few changes to X to simplify debugging08:53
fabbionemdz: daniels told me you asked him to do so...08:53
mdzfabbione: he said I asked him to do what exactly?08:54
fabbionemdz: to make the postinst easier to debug...08:54
fabbionemdz: like adding a XRESPROBE_DEBUG08:54
fabbionethat would switch to set -x08:55
fabbioneat least this was my understanding08:55
fabbione+ you were also concerned about making the postinst easier to debug08:55
mdzI think we talked about it in Oxford08:55
=== fabbione can't remember
mdzthere is already a debug variable in postinst, is there not?08:55
fabbionethere is one in config.in08:56
mdzwhat is DEBUG_XFREE86_PACKAGE?08:56
fabbioneoh yes...08:57
fabbionesorry but some stuff gets included at build time08:57
danielsfabbione: pong08:58
danielsmdz: pong08:58
fabbionedaniels: i am kinda implemeting the changes you were talking about X09:00
fabbionedaniels: do you have any patch or bug fix you want to give to me?09:00
fabbionedaniels: i have been re-reading the talk we had and i was srong on a couple of things09:00
fabbionedaniels: so i kinda agree on the stuff that had to be done09:00
danielson the via/i810 stuff?09:01
fabbionedaniels: yes09:01
danielsmy position was just that if xresprobe can't do it, then we should do the checks for it in xresprobe, becuase that's where the bug lies09:01
danielsi don't have patches just yet, but i hope to have them bny the end of tonight09:01
danielswhen are you around 'till?09:01
mdzpitti: how is the security review going?09:02
danielsfabbione: we already have a XRESPROBE_DEBUG; it could be a lotmore friendly (by sayig wht it's throwing away and what it's keeping), but it's verbose enough that we canbeat l the info out of it pretty easily09:02
danielsso it's low on my priority list09:02
fabbionedaniels: it's 9 am here and i will be around until 5 pm. probably back around 9 pm09:02
danielsthe r4xx stuff looks pretty easy to integrate09:02
pittimdz: doko finished (most of?) DSA 2003, sivan wanted to finish 2002 yesterday09:02
fabbionedaniels: check here:09:02
fabbione  * Fix framebuffer detection. (Closes #1176)09:03
fabbione  * Add XRESPROBE_DEBUG env var check to wrap xresprobeint with set -/+x09:03
fabbione    in xserver-xfree86.postinst.in.09:03
fabbione  * Set XRESPROBE_DEBUG to true if DEBUG_XFREE86_PACKAGE has been defined.09:03
fabbione  * Attempt to probe for all drivers but only if we are installing09:03
fabbione    for the first time.09:03
fabbione  * Add XF86FORCEPROBE env var check to force probe even on upgrades.09:03
pittimdz: so far I did not yet hear about the status of 2004 (lamont wanted to do this)09:03
mdzpitti: I don't see any bugs remaining in bugzilla; are there no pending issues from the review?09:03
pittimdz: there are some; currently they are in the wiki since I wanted to deal with them today09:03
mdzpitti: please send him an email ping, CC me09:03
pittimdz: but I can file bugs anyway09:03
mdzI think he has gone to bed tonight09:03
danielsfabbione: that's awesome, thankyou very much09:03
pittimdz: I will mail him or ask doko to do 2004 as well09:03
mdzpitti: ok09:04
danielsthey were all the xfree86 changes i was talking about that i wanted to see done09:04
fabbionedaniels: ok... we will keep the drivers update for ubuntu17 if that's ok for you?09:04
pittidoko: did you already finished the DSAs 2003?09:04
fabbionedaniels: also because the nv driver is a real bitch09:04
mdzpitti: do you think you can find patches to take care of #1177 and #1179?09:04
=== pitti looks
jdubahr crap09:04
mdzpitti: there is a patch filed in GNOME bugzilla, linked from the bug09:05
jdubi so need to get acpi sorted on this machine09:05
pittimdz: I will do this today09:05
mdzpitti: I will assign the bugs to you; if you do not have time today, pass them on to someone else working on the security review09:05
pittimdz: yes please; then I see them on my start page :-)09:06
jdubmdz: can we set some kind of sensible option for not cleaning tmp on every reboot?09:06
mdzpitti: if you do not want to file bugs in bugzilla for the fixes you will do yourself, that is OK, but remember that I will not be able to take that workload into account when assigning you more work :-)09:06
mdzif they are in bugzilla, then I can see what you already have on your list09:06
=== fabbione shakes daniels
mdzjdub: hmm?  cleaning /tmp on every boot is sensible, in my opinion09:06
fabbionejdub: it is already configurable09:07
elmoand is pretty much mandatory if we're going to use tmpfs ;-)09:07
pittimdz: there is the ominous wget bug ( #261755) I'm not sure about09:07
jdubelmo: ;)09:07
jdubfabbione: that's not what i asked :)09:07
pittimdz: and there are a bunch of bugs I'm not sure whether they need updates, so I hesitated to file bugs09:07
pittimdz: they need a closer examination09:07
jdubmdz: mostly, yeah, but not when you're writing emails in mutt and your machine turns off ;)09:07
pittimdz: But I can handle the imlib bugs09:07
mdzpitti: better to file bugs if you are unsure; then I and others will see them and can comment09:07
pittimdz: okay09:08
mdzjdub: seems like a mutt bug09:08
mdzprecious data doesn't belong in /tmp09:08
m_tthewmore like an editor bug09:08
pittimdz: I wanted to start sorting this out now anyway, I'm done with my other tasks09:08
jdubmutt should use dotfiles in the homedir?09:08
m_tthew"editors should use tempfiles in more reliable places like /var/tmp09:10
jdubit's not the editor's fault09:10
m_tthew"oh after the editor write but before a send from mutt?09:10
jdubno, mutt tells the editor what to edit09:11
m_tthew"I see what you are saying09:11
mdzjdub: I believe mutt has a muttrc setting for it09:12
mdzbut /tmp is a crap default09:12
jdubthanks, i'll find the setting09:13
jdubseems to be tmpdir-- yeah :)09:15
pittimdz: I knew this imlib bug - I recently fixed qt3 which had the same error. Nice to know where upstreams copy from each other :-)09:15
pittimdz: okay, they did not copy 'literally'09:16
mdzit is not unusual with these file-format-related bugs for independent implementations to share the bug, unfortunately09:17
mdzpitti: if you have bugs which correspond to Debian bugs, send me the bug numbers and I can import them into bugzilla using debzilla09:20
mdznight all09:20
pittimdz: good night09:20
fabbionenight mdz09:20
danielsmdz: gah!09:22
danielsmdz: i take it you want the page on n-n-ny?09:22
fabbionedaniels: uploading ubuntu16 right now09:39
danielsfabbione: with just those changes?09:39
fabbione  * Update Italian, Danish and French debconf templates translations09:40
fabbione    from Debian trunk.09:40
fabbione  * Rename 989_warty_add_extra_modelines_from_xorg.diff to09:40
fabbione    989_ubuntu_add_extra_modelines_from_xorg.diff09:40
fabbione  * Import from Debian trunk:09:40
fabbione    + In the Xsession script, attempt to create a file of non-zero length in09:40
fabbione      /tmp; a full filesystem can cause mysterious X session failures.09:40
fabbionethis more09:40
fabbionedo we need more for ubuntu16?09:40
fabbionei still have to push to jackass09:41
fabbioneso there is time09:41
=== Keybuk [scott@descent.netsplit.com] has joined #ubuntu
jdubmorning Keybuk 09:46
pittiKeybuk: Good morning!09:46
fabbionehey Keybuk09:47
fabbionenice 3rd place for button09:47
KeybukSuch enthusiasm.  You guys must've been dissing me before I came in ;o)09:47
fabbioneoh come on.. a 3rd place at monza is a good result09:48
Keybukyeah, though F1 is seriously starting to need a "red cars are banned from racing" rule09:49
fabbionethis sounds pretty nice!09:50
fabbioneKeybuk: well we can change color.. it won't change the result09:50
Keybukwhich is the problem.  one team winning all the time is killing the sport09:50
Keybukit was a good race, but the way they took the lead back without sweating does make you wonder why you bother watching when you know who's going to win09:52
fabbionedude.. if we have a cool set of cars and drivers... other teams should go back to work and improve instead of sitting on "no matter what.. they always win philosophy"09:54
danielsfabbione: schumacher didn't come first, what a tragedy09:54
danielsfabbione: nope, that's fine with ubuntu1609:54
fabbionedaniels: no it's not a tragedy09:54
fabbionedaniels: barrichello was supposed to win..09:55
danielsfabbione: i might do something extra for ubuntu17, but i forgot what it is09:55
Keybukfabbione: none of the other teams have the *money* to get near Ferrari at the moment09:55
fabbioneschummy already have the world championship09:55
danielswrt xsession and starting stuff that should be started09:55
danielsoh, right09:55
Keybuktheir budget is roughly that of all the other teams combined09:55
danielsadding use-bluez-pin to the default Xsession.options, and making bluez install a bluez-pin --dbus Xsession.d script09:55
jdubmdz: did you go to bed?09:55
jdubdaniels: i played with that the other day09:55
fabbionedaniels: ok.. let's keep that for ubuntu17.09:55
MithrandirKeybuk: then limit the budget you have, like in US presidential campaigns.09:56
jdubdaniels: very silly to have all these daemons09:56
danielsjdub: i've been playing with it a bit09:56
jdubdaniels: wait -- you're adding that to Xsession.options?09:56
danielsjdub: hm, i don't think it's so bad if it's really lightweight, kind of makes sense09:56
Keybukyou have to really feel for teams like Minardi09:56
danielsjdub: thinking of doing so09:56
danielsjdub: won't do any harm if bluez-tools isn't installed, no?09:56
Keybukthey're in serious shit at the moment because they might not have the money to race for the rest of the season09:56
danielsjdub: (don't tell me it's in desktop)09:56
fabbioneKeybuk: well.. we have money because we win :-)09:56
jdubdaniels: nooooooo09:56
danielsKeybuk: yeah09:56
jdubdaniels: no changes like that09:56
danielsjdub: we're going to need it if we seed gnome-bluetooth and g-p-m09:57
jdubdaniels: concentrate on bugs only, please09:57
jdubdaniels: those will only be in hoary09:57
danielsjdub: yeah. it is only a one-liner, mind; getting it in x now means that we don't have to change conffiles on people09:57
Keybukfabbione: most of Ferrari's budget comes from Fiat/Ferrari ... it has little to do with their actual performance09:57
jdubdaniels: it's a frivolous change09:57
danielsKeybuk: and they're a bloody nice team, too -- stoddart gave webber his start and then sent him off to jaguar with no worries, and only encouragement09:58
jdubdaniels: we should *NOT* be making changes like that09:58
danielsjdub: 'k09:58
fabbionedaniels, jdub: ubuntu16 is up...09:58
fabbione2 bug fixes and debugging improvments09:58
danielsjdub: (note that bluez-utils doesn't even have an Xsession.d right now -- it was mainly about not changing conffiles lately)09:58
danielsfabbione: cool. i'm honing the ati shit right now, and I'll drop you 17 with ati and wacom later tonight09:58
lifelessati prop driver ?09:59
fabbionedaniels: ok send me the patches for testing.09:59
danielsnv will come tomorrow, it's a little more difficult, since the driver is SO DAMN OBSCURE that you actually have no clue what's going on (thanks nvidia!)09:59
danielsfabbione: 'course09:59
danielslifeless: no09:59
fabbionedaniels: if you can manage the nv driver it would be very nice09:59
danielslifeless: backporting basic 2d support for r4xx cards09:59
fabbionedaniels: for a full nv driver drop, you need also xaa and other bits.09:59
danielsfabbione: yeah. my current strategy is just a wholesale backport rather than trickling in individual changesets since there's no way to tell what they're even doing09:59
danielsfabbione: yeah, i'm working on that09:59
jdubdaniels: (all the bluetooth stuff has been deferred to hoary)10:00
danielsfabbione: i think i can get rid of the new-xzz dep10:00
danielsjdub: (good plan)10:00
jdubdaniels: (see HoaryHedgehog/DesktopSeed for more)10:00
lifelessfor hoary, is having the ati driver supplied as part of hoary on the cards ?10:00
fabbionedaniels: ok... don't mess too much around10:00
jdubdaniels: (i built all of edd's stuff on my x300 - it's pretty sweet)10:00
danielsjdub: (mad phat)10:00
jdubdaniels: (_totally_)10:00
danielsjdub: (yeah, i've been using it here too with a usb bluetooth adaptor, pretty rad except for a couple of firmware bugs on my phone that lock it solid)10:00
fabbione xresprobe (0.4.5) warty; urgency=low                                                                                             10:00
fabbione .                                                                                                                                10:00
lifelessjdub: where are the debs ?10:00
fabbione   * The 'uploading more often than Thom' release.              10:00
danielsyeah, only another 3 today till I equal his record with a210:01
jdublifeless: haven't really got a sensible place to upload them10:02
jdublifeless: might put them on my gnome.org repo in the mean time10:02
lifelessput em on the hosting network10:02
jdubi don't have a sensibly public homedir yet10:06
jdubbut that is down at the moment :)10:07
lifelessoh, I thought it was a few- minute thing ?10:07
debianistmoning again fellows10:20
fabbionejdub: 118710:21
fabbionejdub: who is responsable for setting that stuff on ppc?10:21
fabbionejdub: for sure X is not10:21
jdubfabbione: sysctl10:24
jdubfabbione: but perhaps powerpc-utils could do it?10:24
fabbionejdub: i dunno really.. i don't have a ppc and i don't know all the specific ppc packages around10:24
fabbioneperhaps ppc-utils10:24
jdubfabbione: i think kamion would have good ideas for this one10:24
fabbioneit will also require a config file and all the nice things around it10:26
fabbioneto preserve user settings and so on...10:26
=== rburton [~ross@82-44-126-41.cable.ubr03.croy.blueyonder.co.uk] has joined #ubuntu
jdubyo rburton 10:27
rburtonyo yo jdub10:27
fabbionedoko: are you still around?10:29
rburtondoes the ubuntu d-i grab the hostname from dhcp if it was sent?10:33
fabbionerburton: yeps10:36
rburtonrock on10:36
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=== lulu [~lu@host217-37-231-28.in-addr.btopenworld.com] has joined #ubuntu
danielsjdub: um, people.n-n-y.com has been working fine for me on rookery for a while now10:54
danielssilbs, lulu: 'morning :)10:54
lulumorning! :o)10:54
pittilulu: Good morning!10:54
lulupitt: hiya!10:55
=== fabbione needs to put up a page on people
cefdaniels: want some video cards? *grin*10:59
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danielscef: heh :) 'twould be nifty11:04
danielscef: i take it you don't have an r4xx? ;)11:04
cefdaniels: if I had one, I wouldn't be giving it to you!11:05
jameshdaniels: Mark won't send you one? :)11:06
cefhey, I'm guessing this channel is going to get fairly busy once the preview is out.. has anyone given any thought to setting up another channel for sounders/dev/whatever ?11:07
=== seb128 [~seb128@ANancy-111-1-6-214.w81-249.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #ubuntu
pittiseb128: morning!11:16
SurcouFhi seb128 11:17
danielsjamesh: haven't asked, really11:26
jdubcef: me might split off a developer channel if it gets too crowded, eyah11:27
Keybukyou could have another one for black-belt users ... #kung-fubuntu11:28
fabbionewell... an ubuntu-devel channel will be almost mandatory11:40
fabbionei doubt we will be able to keep the load otherwise11:40
cefand the other question that then comes to mind, is can we steal apt? *grin*11:41
fabbioneuhu Seb is on fire!11:42
fabbionefirst 2.8 packages :-)))11:42
fabbioneGO SEB! GO SEB!11:46
cefis it ok to lart 'John' till he figures out what's wrong? *grin*11:46
Mithrandircrazy seb. :)11:46
=== cef thinks about food
=== fabbione agrees with def...
fabbionefood is good :-)11:57
jdubSEB! SEB! SEB! SEB! SEB!11:57
ceffabbione: esp since it's 8pm here11:57
Kamionpitti: please file a bug for that11:57
fabbionecef: 12 here :-)11:57
pittiKamion: I did11:57
fabbioneKamion: thanks for reassigning the ppc thingy... i was waiting for you to wake up and ask :-)11:58
fabbionehey thom11:58
pittithom: hi!11:58
=== AndyFitz [~Andy@c210-49-88-50.rochd3.qld.optusnet.com.au] has joined #ubuntu
cefok time to see how 20040913 goes11:59
jdubyo AndyFitz 12:00
=== cef wants 20040913 to work so that he can go to dinner
AndyFitzg'day jdub12:04
AndyFitzhow are the application icons ?12:05
fabbionejdub: can we open hoary season while warty is in deep freeze?12:10
fabbionejdub: we might want to take advantage of this month time12:10
fabbionejdub: otherwise hoary will have a 5 months release schedule :-)12:11
ceffabbione: but then so will warty cos no one will be fixing bugs when they can hack on hoary12:11
fabbionecef: that's not completely true...12:12
fabbionebecause warty bug fixing is a must12:12
ceffabbione: true.. but probably still hoary will be a distraction. perhaps hoary could be opened up once the number of bugs gets small..eg: 2 weeks time12:13
fabbionecef: sure.. i didn't mean to open it right now12:13
fabbionecef: but in a decent time frame and not the day after warty is released12:13
cefactually.. there is an idea.. set a goal that once we get down to less than 10 RC bugs, hoary will open *grin*12:14
pittijdub: I'm right at building a new snmpd that does not run as root any more (see #1151) and now I saw your freeze mail. Good timing...12:14
fabbionecef: 21 RC bugs found. :-)12:14
pittijdub: it's a trivial change and another process not running as root any more is probably a good thing12:15
pittijdub: can I upload it?12:15
cefhey, would it be worth adding a wrapper around apt-get in the after first reboot stage, so that people aren't staring at a boring apt display of packages being downloaded from archive.ubuntu.com ??12:17
fabbionedaniels: i am afraid our ubuntu17 has been just trashed :)12:17
pittifreeze = suddenly stop all work? :-)12:18
ceffreeze = fix bugs12:18
fabbionepitti: that's why i was asking for hoary ;)12:18
=== fabbione hides
pitticef: sure, that's why I put the :-) there12:18
cefpitti: from what you're describing, you're fixing a bug12:18
fabbionetime to cook some food12:18
pitticef: just kidding12:18
pitticef: yes, #1151 is a bug, but it's only 'major'12:19
ceffabbione: cook me something!12:19
pittifabbione: me too12:19
pitticef: but I think the food will be cold and rotten until it arrives in Germany, let alone Brazil :-((12:20
cefpitti: and I'm in Australia.. *8-(12:20
pitticef: oops, sorry, mixed that up. But same argument 12:20
pitticef: can we have apt-get install food-replicator for hoary?12:21
Kamionjdub: are translation changes allowed?12:21
KeybukKamion: had an interesting conversation with Vidar about that re: dpkg in debian12:22
debianistKamion fried himself a warty before he went to sleep last night ;-)12:26
Keybuknow there's a euphemism that was waiting to happen12:27
Kinnisonouch :'(12:28
debianistKeybuk : ?12:31
Keybukdebianist: trust me, you're better off *not* understanding my sense of humour12:31
=== Keybuk is going to the *special* hell
=== Kinnison nods
danielsfabbione: ahr, heh12:32
debianistKeybuk : ok ;)12:33
=== thom grins at keybuk
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fabbionepitti, cef: pasta with broccoli and saugages in white cream...12:34
AndyFitzanyone using the artwork  update with  application icons in the human theme ?12:34
fabbionei am hungry :-)12:34
debianistfabbione : can I come? :-)12:34
fabbionedebianist: hehehe12:34
ceffabbione: right.. I'm definitely off to buy food12:34
=== debianist just LOVES white cream pasta
cefbtw: I still can't see any way to create .iso files, or to raw copy disks.. *sigh*12:35
cefand fwiw: 20040913 worked great otherwise12:36
cefthe archive manager will open .iso's, but it won't create them.. *8-(12:36
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Keybukmorning boss12:39
sabdflhey Keybuk, all12:40
fabbionehey sabdfl 12:40
Kinnisonhi sabdfl 12:40
sabdflthink we should have gone for "winsome warthog" instead of "warty"?12:40
seb128hi sabdfl 12:41
sabdflyo seb12812:41
=== lulu [~lu@host217-37-231-28.in-addr.btopenworld.com] has joined #ubuntu
sabdflseb128: great work on the gnome packages, thank you!12:41
seb128thanks :)12:41
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=== seb128 [~seb128@ANancy-111-1-6-214.w81-249.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #ubuntu
lifelesssabdfl: no way, warty has style01:01
sabdflbut relatively few warts :-)01:01
cefthink hoary was probably not the best choice tho *grin*01:01
jameshwould it really be a warthog without warts?01:02
cefrelatively few warts is good! that way, people will think "and they think this is warty? wow, I've gotta see the next release!"01:02
lifelesssabdfl: do you think I can get access to an amd64 to fix a gnu-smalltalk ftbfs ?01:02
lifeless(in my own time, of course)01:03
sabdfl"hectic hedgehog"?01:03
lifelesshungover ?01:04
thomsabdfl: too south african :-)01:04
cefheh.. hungover sounds good.. it's what everyone will be after warty goes out the door..01:04
lifelessok, now thats too sa01:04
sabdfllifeless: not one of our buildd's, sorry, rulez01:05
cefthom: we can only hope.. *grin*01:05
fabbionelifeless: are you in contact with Paolo?01:05
lifelesssabdfl: thats fine, had to ask.01:05
lifelesswill we be providing such machines in the future? (ppc etc too I mean ?)01:05
lifelessfabbione: yes01:06
=== jamesh mutters about evil battstat-applet code
lifelessfabbione: he's just gone on holiday for a bit.01:06
fabbionelifeless: ok.. so am i for m68k and ia64 :-)01:06
lifelessfabbione: have you got fixes for 241258 ?01:06
fabbionecef, debianist, pitti: http://www.fabbione.net/pasta.jpg ;)01:07
fabbionelifeless: no. we are working on it01:08
fabbionelifeless: paolo gave me a bunch of patches, but none of them work01:08
pittifabbione: thanks! But as much as I love virtual reality, there are times in life when one wants to bury it :-)01:08
pittifabbione: enjoy!01:08
lifelessfabbione: ah.01:08
fabbionelifeless: pitti: i already did :P01:08
fabbione^^pitti only01:08
lifelessfabbione:  have you tried 2.1.8 ?01:09
lifelessonly 2.1.7 is in debian at the moment.01:09
fabbionelifeless: 2.1.8-2 is the last one i uploaded to debian01:09
fabbionelifeless: Version: 2.1.8-201:09
fabbionei sponsor Brett (that is also one of my NM)01:10
ceffabbione: 1. mmmmm! 2. is that a washing machine under that bench?01:10
fabbionecef: 1) it was gnammy 2) yet01:10
lifelessfabbione: arh. Ok, I must be seeing warty :}01:11
cefnot sure if I want to know why there is a washing machine in your kitchen, or wether it's your kitchen.. no, please don't tell me!01:11
lifelesswell 2.2.0 will be hosted in tla :}01:11
fabbionecef: because there is not much space in the house.. so the washing machine is in the kitchen... nothing too fancy ;)01:12
Oskuroseb128: ping01:12
fabbionelifeless: yeah ehhehe01:12
=== Kamion has a washing machine in his kitchen too
fabbionecef: it's not like i wash the food in it :-P01:12
Keybukmy washing machine's in my kitchen01:12
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fabbionewhat is the general feeling for 1160?01:18
fabbionethe first decision was: "if you can connect to no-name-yet.com, don't ask for the proxy"01:19
fabbioneKamion: when you updated base-config & Co, did you also update choose-mirror?01:19
fabbioneoh yeah.. goody :-)01:20
=== debianist have just plugged in his new logitech thingy, sure nice having ubuntu on remote mouse and kbd
seb128Oskuro: pong ?01:23
Oskuroseb128: has ubuntu thought about PageMaker like apps to include, or is that completely outside of the scope?01:24
seb128no idea, I don't even know PageMaker01:25
jdubOskuro: definitely in scope for our next release :-)01:25
jdubOskuro: but not for warty ;)01:25
jameshof course, Adobe doesn't really push PageMaker these days01:25
jameshInDesign seems to be the replacement product01:26
Kamionfabbione: yes, as you saw :)01:28
KeybukOskuro: we have TeX, what more do you want? :p01:28
jameshOne thing that surprised me is how buggy PageMaker and InDesign are (PageMaker more so)01:29
jameshthe knowledge base articles frequently tell you to save often with different filenames01:30
jameshand if you run into problems to go back to the last working file01:30
jamesh(rather than giving real fixes for problems)01:30
Kamionfabbione: if the stuff that adds archive.ubuntu.com used the same framework as the normal ftp/http questions rather than being a totally independent thing stuck on the end of apt-setup, it would be a lot better01:31
fabbioneKamion: complain with cdrom installation :(01:31
=== AndyFitz [~Andy@c210-49-88-50.rochd3.qld.optusnet.com.au] has left #ubuntu []
Kamionfabbione: EPARSE01:31
fabbioneKamion: the main loop is not entered at all when installing from cdrom01:31
Kamionfabbione: like it or not, it's our default01:32
fabbioneKamion: i don't complain but i can't use the same framework01:32
Kamionwell, ok; maybe split that stuff out into a function?01:32
Kamionit's certainly annoying that you can't pick the hostname01:32
KamionI have a local mirror which is much faster than archive.ubuntu.com01:32
fabbioneKamion: so do i...01:33
fabbionenetinstall will respect the mirror you select01:33
fabbionei can't do the same for cdrom install01:33
Kamionmaybe we shouldn't be using quite such a big stick on cdrom installs then01:33
fabbioneat least not without asking a question01:33
Kamionapt-setup in Debian was not designed to be clobbered that way ...01:33
fabbioneKamion: i was told to do so.. by sabdfl and mdz...01:34
Kamionthey didn't specify implementation01:34
fabbioneto test the line and add it if it works or add it commented if not01:34
fabbionewell i took that kind of operation from security01:34
fabbionei didn't reinvent the wheel01:34
Kamionyes, I know, but security is quite different01:34
fabbionethe only thing i added was the check of deb-src01:35
KamionI think that approach is sane for security, it's just not sane for the normal archive01:35
fabbionethat was in the TODO list anyway01:35
fabbioneKamion: i understand what you mean... but than even on CD install we need to ask for a mirror01:35
fabbioneif that's ok for people, it is ok for me01:35
fabbioneand perhaps it can come up much cleaner than it is now01:36
KamionI've mailed sounder@01:39
Kamionseb128: isn't fixing poor English grammar like that just a matter of unfuzzying translations?01:42
seb128yes, probably01:42
cefany plans to add multisync at some stage?01:42
seb128Kamion: patches are welcome :p01:43
Mithrandircef: to Ubuntu?  I think there's interest in it, yes.01:43
Kamionseb128: heh, like I have time at the moment ... :-)01:43
seb128Kamion: and you think I have more time ? :)01:43
Kamionnot really :)01:44
cefok well I can test it with a number of PocketPC/CE devices of varying models/versions01:44
cefand probably various palms as well (this is if I raid work for them all)01:45
Mithrandircef: try talking to mdz about it?01:45
cefMithrandir: perhaps.. no use now till hoary anyway01:45
Mithrandircef: look at wiki:WartyWarthog_2fBounties, last one01:46
MithrandirI guess it'll be a hoary thing, then01:48
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Kamioncef: ftp.no-name-yet.com -> archive.ubuntu.com02:00
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Kamionwow, gnome-stones is a really poor version of the classic game02:20
Kamionor at least the level choice is poor02:20
jdubKamion: what's your preferred recent daily for mass testing?02:25
Kamiontoday's seems fine02:26
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=== ..[topic/#ubuntu:Kamion] : SSDS | http://sounders:oink@wiki.no-name-yet.com/ | Bugs: https://bugzilla.no-name-yet.com/
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Oskurojdub: good to hear :)02:31
Oskuropassepartout seems to have some potential02:31
debianistthe sensitivity level for the mx700 wireless mouse is too high, tried setting the lowest i could on gnome ouse settings - still too high02:31
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jaqthese are some damn fast bug response and fix times :-)02:36
=== thom whimpers gently at the noweb maintainer
thomtempfile was invented for a reason!02:40
thombase="`basename $1 | sed '/\./s/\.[^.] *$//'`"02:40
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debianistpitti : around?02:50
pittidebianist: sure02:50
pittiI'm overwhelmed in security bugs02:50
debianistpitti : DSA-129-1 , again a pkg in (/pool/main && /pool/universe)02:51
debianistpitti : what does it mean when a package is in both?02:51
pittidebianist: just as in Debian, the highest version number is preferred02:52
pittidebianist: so if a bug is not fixed in main, but fixed in a higher version of universe, it should get fixed in main02:52
debianistpitti : ok02:53
pittidebianist: but actually main packages shouldn't have a lower version than packages in universe, this could lead to hard-to-find errors02:53
pittidebianist: can you please ask elmo about this?02:53
cefjdub: i installed 20040913 earlier.. worked like a charm02:53
debianistpitti : about this specific dsa?02:53
pittidebianist: about this multiple-versions problem in general02:54
debianistpitti : ok.02:54
debianistelmo : here?02:54
thompitti: i have an upload ready for noweb, btw02:56
pittithom: with the fixed tmp creation?02:56
pittithom: I'm right at fixing it.02:56
pittithom: great timing, thanks!02:56
pittidid you also completely rewrite patch 002_tmp_fix?02:56
thomcos that's a fugly mess02:57
pittithom: great! Can you upload it and annouce it to #271146?02:57
thomjust waiting for the build-deps to come down so i can test it, then i will02:57
pittithom: thanks!02:58
=== pitti hugs thom
thomheh, no problem :-)02:58
debianistpitti : boy that was hot stuff ;)03:02
pittidebianist: finished?03:03
debianistpitti : on my way03:03
pittidebianist: congrats!03:04
pittithom: ah, I just saw that duplicate bug. that explains the duplication of effort :-)03:06
thomoh well :-)03:06
jdubcef: thanks!03:09
Kamionhmm, archive-copier could do with some special cases03:09
Kamionit copies linux-image-{power3,power4,powerpc}03:09
Kamioncopying all three is rather unnecessary03:09
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pittiKamion: why this archive-copier is enabled by default anyway? To me it looks like a waste of hd space and time03:10
Kamionpitti: Mark's decision; it lets you avoid having to put the CD back in in the second stage03:10
KamionMark's idea, too03:10
pittiKamion: the powerpcs don't boot from cd by default anyway, so the CD could be left in the drive03:10
pittiKamion: okay; unavoidable argument :-)03:11
Kamionworks on powermac but not elsewhere, and it's probably better to be consistent03:11
KamionI'm not terribly happy with the waste of time either, but you *can* boot with archive-copier/copy=false to disable it03:11
debianistpitti : i can't reach elmo03:12
Kamionwe'll be documenting that03:12
pittiKamion: ah! That should be explained in the help texts. thanks for that hin!03:12
pittiKamion: s/hin/hint/03:12
Kamionprobably won't fit on the boot screens but we'll have a manual to play with ...03:12
pittidebianist: mail?03:12
debianistpitti : right03:12
debianistpitti : apache pkg is also on both pools03:12
pittidebianist: or maybe somebody else can help03:13
pittiKamion: do you happen to know why some packages are in main _and_ universe?03:13
Kamionno ...03:13
Kamionsounds like a bug03:13
pittiKamion: if a package is never in universe, it will be prefered, right?03:13
pittiKamion: and the Warty changes are lost.03:13
Kamiononly if it has a higher version in universe, which is rather unlikely isn't it?03:14
pittidebianist: maybe you can bring this up at the ailing list03:14
Kamionsince we haven't been syncing universe03:14
pittiKamion: I don't know about the sync policy in the future03:14
pittiKamion: if we don't sync, we lose security and other fixes03:14
=== Kamion wonders about the usefulness of asking between Europe/London and Europe/Belfast timezones
pittiKamion: on example is gnocatan, I requested a sync to get rid of a security bug03:15
Kamiongiven that they're (AFAIK) identical03:15
Kamionpitti: yes but I mean not routinely03:15
thomjdub: you happy with an upload to fix 1158?03:15
Kamionpitti: I don't think there's a need to debate the rights and wrongs really, it's clearly a bug :)03:15
pittiKamion: okay, thanks for that info03:15
debianistpitti : i started spotting this only when i searched after the first oocurence...03:17
debianistpitti : how can we decide if a package should be on main or universe?03:17
debianistpitti : i'm taking this to the mailing list03:18
pittidebianist: main is calculated automatically from the Seeds03:18
pittidebianist: so every package that is in main shouldn't be in universe03:18
debianistpitti : ok, we need a script ot fix up bugged packages list. find each package on main, and remove from universe.03:18
pittidebianist: this should be easy to do on the apt lists03:19
debianistpitti : problem is, i had already disregarded package in sake of saving time, because the first oocurence on the pkg file was _universe_03:19
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pittidebianist: ugh. I removed universe from the apt sources when doing apt-cache things during the review03:20
debianistpitti : that was a good idea03:20
debianistpitti : shame I didn't03:20
pittidebianist: no reason to be ashamed :-)03:21
pittidebianist: if you even considered the universe packages and found no vulnerability, then the Warty packages cannot be worse03:21
pittidebianist: the only pitfal would be if you discovered a vulnerable universe package which is also in main03:22
pittidebianist: but we would like to know about them anyway because they must be fixed in Debian, too03:22
debianistpitti : ok, i need a main only pkg list, and after my first scan through the DSAs, i'll work my universe list, see which pkgs are truely in main, and consder those03:23
debianistpitti : all the unconsidered pkgs (due to universe) are in one list, so i'll work them out with a main's only list.03:24
pittidebianist: maybe the fastest method would be to first determine the packages which are in main _and_ universe03:24
pittidebianist: and then intersect this list with the DSA-affected packages03:24
pittidebianist: the remaining ones shouldn't be too many :-)03:25
debianistpitti : ok, i can try through a perly at it, however might take some time03:25
pittidebianist: I can do the script if you want03:25
debianistpitti : great!03:25
debianistpitti : zip it before you send03:27
debianistpitti : i have to go now , be back in about half an hour. send me the script when you're done, i'll continue then03:29
debianistpitti : have the script output _only_ those in main, so i'll know to drill down them03:31
pittidebianist: the script will print out the packages which are in main+restricted _and_ universe03:31
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pitti@all: can anybody test rdesktop? I would like to have a word about the status of http://bugs.debian.org/18938104:12
=== Kinnison can try
pittiKinnison: that would be great! I don't have any Windows boxes to connect to04:15
Kamionseb128: FYI, the pmu error message is different now (has been for a little while)04:15
Kamionseb128: it says "Permissions on the file /dev/pmu are broken"04:15
Kamionseb128: I can't easily get to bugzilla right now, but maybe that helps you to grep04:15
seb128yes, I've seen that on the bug reopened04:16
Kamionah, ok04:17
seb128I'm wondering if I should just remove the msg04:17
Kinnisonpitti: If I have an rdesktop window open; and I choose lock-screen from the gnome menu; it doesn't lock until I de-focus the rdesktop window04:17
seb128since it seems to work accordind to the comments04:17
Kinnisonpitti: and my password doesn't turn up in a notepad inside the rdesktop04:17
KamionI don't notice anything gratuitously failing to work, but of course my powerbook doesn't sleep anyway ...04:17
=== Kinnison will try a time-based xlock now
pittiKinnison: that's great! So this means that the bug has been fixed now.04:18
pittiKamion: Thanks a lot!04:18
pittiKamion: do you want to write a followup to the bug on your own or shall I do that?04:18
Kamionpitti: would you mind? my bugzilla password is, er, somewhere, and the firefox on the freshly installed system obviously doesn't remember it ...04:19
pittiKamion: I meant the Debian bug, but I can do that anyway.04:19
pittiKamion: sorry, wrong adress; should be Kinnison04:19
pittiKinnison: I write the followup. Did the time-based lock work as well?04:20
Kamionpitti: aha, right04:20
Kinnisonpitti: yep; time-based lock worked too; I don't have time to do a writeup just now; but you're welcome to quote that I tested it and it seemed to work04:25
Kinnisonpitti: rdesktop 1.3.1-104:25
Kinnisonpitti: I'm dsilvers@debian.org04:25
pittiKinnison: thanks a lot!04:25
Kinnisonpitti: that's okay04:25
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debianistpitti : back, i want the script to output only those packages which i need to consider, you're opting for that?05:05
pittidebianist: did you already read the mail?05:06
debianistpitti : in the while, has anybody any clue about that pkg lists bug?05:06
pittidebianist: I did not find any duplicates05:06
=== debianist is reading mail
pittidebianist: maybe you should apt-get update?05:06
pittidebianist: although I doubt that the seeds changed recently05:06
debianistpitti : darn, i think i don't have restricted on my sources.05:08
debianistpitti : how's that line going?05:08
pittidebianist: but that should not lead to duplicates in the other two05:09
pittidebianist: just add restricted where main and universe are05:09
debianistpitti : done, apt-get updating, than checking an example duplicated pacakge.05:10
pittidebianist: stop05:10
debianistpitti : stopped05:10
debianistpitti : btw, i am using aptitude, could this be the issue?05:10
pittidebianist: before you upgrade, can you please check with the script whether your old apt lists have duplicates?05:10
pittidebianist: I don't know, but aptitude should use apt05:10
debianistpitti : just exec the script from the directory i put it in?05:10
debianistpitti : (chmod ofcourse)05:11
pittidebianist: yep05:11
debianistpitii : hold on, checking...05:11
debianistpitti : Source packages that occurr both in (main+restricted) and universe:05:12
debianistcat: /var/lib/apt/lists/*restricted_source_Sources: No such file or directory05:12
debianistBinary packages that occurr both in (main+restricted) and universe:05:12
debianistcat: /var/lib/apt/lists/*restricted_binary-*_Packages: No such file or directory05:12
debianist: command not foundline 14:05:12
debianistpitti : i don't have restricted packages list...05:12
pittidebianist: so if you don't have the restricted packages, just delete them from the script05:12
pittidebianist: or add them to your apt sources05:12
debianistpitti : ok, hold on05:12
thompitti: have you looked at 1199 or shall i take it (Samba DOS)05:22
pittithom: so far I did not look at it05:23
pittithom: so if you have time for it, go ahead :-)05:23
pittithom: you didn't upload noweb yet, did you?05:24
sabdfllamont: ping05:24
sabdfli just installed postfix on a machine which used to have exim405:24
sabdflgot a ton of questions05:24
thompitti: nope, waiting on approval05:24
lamontis the debconf priority < high?05:25
lamontthen you'll get lots of questions05:25
lamontand can hit return to almost all of them.05:25
sabdflyes, and we need to clean those up, because many of them seem spurious05:25
sabdflfirst, is there any reason to have retained the HP option?05:26
lamontthe "get rid of postfix questions" changes were all done by changing the debconf priority, and adjusting the priority of a few questions that used to be high, but could be low.05:26
lamontnot breaking translations05:26
lamontbut that's the only reason05:26
sabdflwe really need to clean the package up05:26
lamontI'll upload a new postfix to debian with the HP option gone, to get things headed the right way on translations05:27
sabdflit's a major piece of infrastructure, and having it crufty beneath the surface is giving me the shits05:27
sabdfltranslations we can fix over time05:27
=== jdub furrows his brow slightly.
lamontIf you don't mind the translation issues, I can certainly pull the HP option after wednesday05:28
sabdfljdub: i understand it's not great for warty05:28
sabdfljdub: for hoary, we will have split out translations, so they can continue to be improved post-release05:28
lamontunsure what parts are crufty, other than the install still being very debian in flavor...05:28
jdubsabdfl: yeah, that'd be nice.05:28
sabdfllamont: i'm going to run through it with you now, should we switch to a separate channel?05:28
lamontworks for me..05:29
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debianistpitti : here?05:29
pittidebianist: yep05:30
debianistpitti : darn, my house is going under redecorations and remount, the painter disconnected my power cord :-p05:30
debianistpitti : retrying ths script...05:30
pittidebianist: ugh, disconnecting power is ugly :-/05:31
pittilamont: is #1198 the only outstanding issue from the 2004 DSAs?05:31
debianistpitti : good i had the sweetest reiserfs install with this version of warty05:32
pittidebianist: BTW, did you find any open issues in the 2002 DSAs? How far did you come with it?05:32
debianistpitti : not really :) i have left more 132-->150 , and reconsider duplicates05:33
lamontpitti: no - I got hijacked and saveed my changes until I could get back to them.05:34
lamont540,496, and Debian #26361205:34
lamontDSA-{540,496}, that is05:34
pittilamont: they are unapplied in Warty? I have a look at them and file bugs, if necessary05:35
lamont540 is the sync request in our bts05:36
lamont486 is proof that I can't read my fonts some days...05:36
lamontCAN-2004-{0180,0405} are 486, and I couldn't find them in the debian bts, which could just be age, or it could be that they're not fixed.  No mention in changelog05:37
sabdflanybody know why I have *:sunrpc (tcp and udp) and *:bootpc (udp) listening after a fresh warty install?06:03
Keybuksunrpc is portmap, needed for fam06:03
Keybukbootpc is your dhcp client06:03
jdub(but portmap is configured to refuse all connections anyway)06:03
jdub(and we can remove it from the desktop release in hoary, because we'll replace fam)06:03
sabdflKeybuk: why does dhcp client need to listen?06:05
sabdflmdz: hi06:06
mdzsabdfl: for portmap, see #50506:07
Kinnisonsabdfl: it has to have a port open in order to receive the DHCP replies from the server06:07
sabdflKinnison: but then surely it can close the thing and be done with till its lease expires?06:07
=== Kinnison would have to check; but I have a little tingle in my brain saying that the server can opt to inform a client about an expiry or something
KinnisonHmm, doesn't look like that's the case06:10
lamontKamion: you around?06:11
Kinnisonrfc2131 isn't exactly readable :-(06:11
mdzdaniels: yes, the public wiki06:11
Kinnisonsabdfl: unless I'm totally wrong in my interpretation of the DHCP state transition diagram in rfc2131 it would be correct within the protocol to close the socket when in the BOUND state06:13
KinnisonI guess the client isn't that clever though06:13
pittilamont: CAN-2004-0405 is fixed, it's contained in the upstream tarball of cvs06:13
lamontand the other?06:14
Kamionlamont: yep?06:14
pittilamont: still checking...06:14
lamontKamion: what fqdn does the poor machine get at install time?06:14
lamontor hostname, rather?06:14
Kinnisonsabdfl: which dhcp client are you using?06:15
lamontKamion: really trying to figure out what the magic guesses d-i makes are, wrt hostname06:15
KamionTBH I'd suggest you look at the netcfg source06:15
Kamion$ hostname06:15
Kamion$ hostname --fqdn06:15
KamionI'm not entirely convinced by all of those but it's very hard to get it right without asking questions06:16
KamionKinnison: dhcp3-client's the warty default06:16
KinnisonKamion: *nod*06:17
lamontKamion: yeah - let me rephrase that... is there a way that postfix's config script can find out if you asked those questions or not?06:17
pittilamont: CAN-2004-180 is also fixed06:17
pittilamont: upstream just did it differently from the original patch06:17
=== Kinnison adds "prod gently at dhcp3-client" to his "things to do if the world stands still for long enough"
pittilamont: so cvs is clean :-)06:17
Kamionlamont: doubt it06:17
lamontKamion: yeah - I was afraid of that. :-(06:17
Kamionlamont: you can't really get at the d-i cdebconf database unless you're base-config06:18
Kamionand even that's gross06:18
lamontpitti: well, of those two, anyway06:18
pittilamont: yes :-)06:18
pittilamont: I take a look at this mozilal bug06:18
pittilamont: mozilla06:18
lamontpitti: couldn't reproduce on firefox, btw06:19
pittilamont: I just tried it on my own, firefox does not crash.06:19
pittilamont: http://scary.beasts.org/misc/pngtest_bad.png ?06:19
pittilamont: nevertheless, I look into the sources to verify06:19
lamontbut we should check the other moz-based browsers, yes?06:20
pittilamont: I had a similar imlib bug this morning which were not reproducible with a test picture06:20
pittilamont: however, the overflow still existed.06:20
thomi've checked all the mozilla based browsers for the pngtest06:20
thomdid it ages ago06:20
lamontpitti: thanks06:21
pittilamont: np06:21
mdzpitti: doing a quick test of your snmp changes, and then I'l OK it for upload06:21
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pittimdz: thanks06:22
pittimdz: BTW, why does it hurt to sync gtksee to universe?06:22
pittilamont: when will they learn _not_ to include library code in other packages? *sigh*06:25
lamontpitti: when people start making shared libs for their packages?06:25
debianistpitti : we should ask upstream maintainers and advice them about it06:26
pittilamont: err, there have been shlib packages for libpng for ages now06:26
lamontyeah, well, if it ain't broke don't muck with it. :-(06:26
lamontmind you, I agree with you.06:26
lamontit's always a hysterical^Whistorical reason when they do it.06:27
lamontwell, almost always06:27
pittilamont: well, mozilla-browser is at 1.7.2, which is claimed to be fixed...06:27
lamontpitti: kewl06:29
pittilamont: what does "kewl" mean?06:29
=== pitti goes to download a big hunk of mozilla and firefox sources
thompitti: it's"cool" spelt sillily06:30
pittithom: ah, thanks.06:30
debianistthom : i heared germen dudes use that for cool :)06:30
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pittidebianist: I doubt that06:31
pittidebianist: cool is a genuine German word!06:31
pittidebianist: (or so)06:31
debianistpitti : hahah06:31
debianistpitti : you from germany? 06:31
pittidebianist: 90% of today's youngsters from Germany would claim that06:31
pittidebianist: I am06:31
debianistpitti : yey! i might be visiting there sometime soon ;)06:31
pittidebianist: today's German is so infiltrated by English words...06:31
debianistpitti : somebody told me KDE is from Kool Desktop envir..06:32
pittidebianist: when they first invented it, the K had no special meaning (AFAIK)06:32
pittibut Kool is certainly not the worst interpretation06:32
debianistpitti : well, that also. but the Kool (he explained me that C is stressed in germen, and sounds like K06:33
lamontpitti: yesterday's German is derrived from yesterday's english, you know... :)06:33
debianistpitti : sound kooler ;)06:33
pittilamont: so much for Blitzkrieg, Sauerkraut and Kindergarten :-)06:34
pittilamont: or Zugzwang (I've hear that in some English chess discussions)06:34
lamontpitti: I meant that language called 'Old English'06:34
pittilamont: don't know much about it06:34
lamontmodern english and german both derrive from it.06:34
pittilamont: well, the German translation ("khl") sounds very similar06:35
=== debianist is enlighted. he has strong ostro hungerian roots and germen/yedish is a familiar sound
Mithrandirpitti: KDE certainly stood for Kool Desktop Environment at some point; I distinctly remember seeing it on kde.org06:36
pittiMithrandir: yes, some time ago they officially declared it as K interpretation06:37
debianistpitti : 15 to go06:37
pittiMithrandir: I just talked about the birth of the project; at that time it was supposed to resemble CDE, so C -> K06:37
Mithrandirpitti: I think this was around KDE 1.0 or something..06:38
pittiMithrandir: yes06:38
pittilamont: the mozilla 1.7.2 contains a totally different libpng version, but it seems that another thing (libpr0n) is used now. The latter one is patched06:45
pittilamont: same for mozilla-firefox06:49
npmccallum__Kamion: ping06:54
Kamionnpmccallum__: yes?06:57
npmccallum__Kamion: I'm updating the initscript for ssh-server, but when I do debuild -S it changes the debconf translation, how do I get around that?06:57
Kamionwhat are the changes?06:58
npmccallumKamion: I'll email you a diff06:58
npmccallumKamion: which email should I use?07:00
=== ..[topic/#ubuntu:jdub] : SSDS | http://sounders:oink@wiki.no-name-yet.com/ | Bugs: https://bugzilla.no-name-yet.com/ | Sneak preview invitations time - see the list :-)
npmccallumKamion: sent07:02
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Kamionthis auto-browse thing is annoying when you're installing packages from CD07:10
pittiKeybuk: why did you close #canonical?07:11
Keybuk#ubuntu is the channel to discuss everything on07:11
pittiKeybuk: I thought we wanted to have a private channel in addition07:12
Keybukeverything distro-related is public now07:13
Keybukrelease is day after tomorrow, dude :p07:13
Keybukwell, preview07:13
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Kamionnpmccallum: looks like you don't have po-debconf installed; I suggest installing it07:16
Kamionnpmccallum: shouldn't 'start' do check_for_no_start and check_privsep_dir *before* saying "Starting OpenBSD Secure Shell server"?07:17
=== jdub is going to sleep for three hours
jdubback soon :-)07:17
Kamionjdub: lazy tramp07:18
KamionI mean, a whole three hours07:18
npmccallumKamion: its nice to know what script is running, but if you want something different, thats ok07:18
jdubKamion: hey, i traded it up on the sleep bonds scheme!07:18
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lamontKeybuk: bouncy bouncy...:-)07:29
Keybukyeah :-/07:30
KeybukIRC cusk07:30
[Clint] how rude07:31
=== [Clint] sniffs.
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KeybukI was getting worried there was an upper limit on kicks-per-second or something07:32
Keybukthough I did pause for a second before kicking Mark off <g>07:32
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lamontnpmccallum: you around, or just bouncing?07:37
=== lamont tries to understand what was added to "pretty init script" handling in postfix...
npmccallumlamont: I'm around07:40
lamontah, found stuff.  Gotta learn to read better.07:41
npmccallumKamion: I *do* actually have po-debconf installed, so that isn't the issue with the ssh-server changes07:43
seb128lamont: could you check if nautilus is building/ftbfsing/... ?07:49
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lamontRequested 'eel-2.0 >= 2.8.0' but version of eel is 2.7.9207:51
lamontand not versioned in the Build-Depends, either... 07:51
=== lamont gives it back
lamontyou saw the libgnomeprint bug?07:51
seb128not fixed ?07:52
=== lamont hasn't looked
seb128lamont: what about nautilus/eel ... wrong Build-dep ?07:52
lamontseb128: fixed.07:53
seb128ok, thanks07:53
lamontseb128: I expect that the version of the build-dep doesn't match the requirement checked in the source...07:53
seb128Build-Depends: ... libeel2-dev (>= 2.7.92)07:54
lamontI also expect that you uploaded eel2 2.8.0, and it just hadn't made it to the archive when we tried to do nautilus07:54
seb128that's it :)07:54
lamontso the build-deps were met, but not well enough..:-(07:54
lamontit'll build this pass.07:54
seb128ok, better if I re-upload with the right Build-Depends BTW07:55
lamontit certainly wouldn't be a _bad_ thing to do so.07:55
lamontfabbione/daniels around?08:01
=== lamont believes that nvidia-settings wants to be i386/amd64 only, but would like confirmation...
=== sparkes is away: chille-con-carne! food of the gods only surpassed by a good yuk shung or tacos
lamontNVCtrl.o: ELF 32-bit LSB relocatable, Intel 80386, version 1 (SYSV), not stripped08:03
lamontthat'd be a 'yes' :-)08:03
=== lamont lunches
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mdzlamont: if it depends on the nvidia X bits, then it wants to be i386-only08:39
=== thom nudges mdz towards his jabber window
diemanis it ok if i rsync the archive off of ftp.no-name-yet.com?08:40
mdzthom: I have no messages pending in my jabber window08:41
mdzunless it is lying to me about being disconnected08:41
mdzor to you :-)08:41
mdzthom: it says you are away08:41
thommdz: gaim claims to me that you're available08:41
thomand i'm not away08:42
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thomyou're happy for a new upstream version of samba ?(just want to clarify your comment in #1199)08:42
kagouhi guys08:42
thomdamn modern technology08:42
thomdieman: archive.ubuntu.com may well prove to be more stable08:42
npmccallumdoes anyone know why when I do debuild -S it screws up debconf templates?  I do have po-debconf installed...08:43
thomdieman: (that's the ...canonical... location, anyway) ;-)08:44
kagoumdz, i'v have found some ideas for the bug 115308:44
mdzthom: yes08:44
mdzthom: samba is very sane in their release management08:44
thomi assumed that was what you meant, and am doing it. just wanted to check08:45
thom(damn, i wish we had hct)08:45
=== mdz prods Keybuk
mdzhah, he's hiding08:46
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diemanstupid packetshaping thing here on campus is screwing me08:52
diemanon inbound traffic.08:53
diemani think its broken today :|08:53
thommdz: what's the status of 986? 09:04
mdzthom: it's in elmo's hands09:04
mdzelmo: ping?09:05
diemanhes fairly idle09:11
diemanhe tried catching me last night, but i was busy, i've not seen him since09:11
debianistpitti : send you emails :-).09:13
debianistpitti : s/send/sent09:13
mdzah, elmo is elmo_dc09:16
Kamionnpmccallum: see the first couple of pages of debian/rules; there's a bunch of encoding-munging there09:20
justdavehmm, guess that's a couple weeks old (just noticed the date)09:20
justdavesomeone else had just pointed that out to me :)09:21
Kamionnpmccallum: make sure that the stuff that sticks 1 in debian/po/output is firing09:21
whiprushhey alextreme, been a long time. ;)09:25
alextremehey whiprush, how's life? :)09:25
whiprushgood good. Good to see you in here, heh.09:25
npmccallumKamion: its happening on multiple packages, not just ssh09:25
alextremeit's a small world :)09:26
Kamionnpmccallum: want me to do the openssh one, if you have a deadline? I know I can build it reliably :)09:27
Kamionnpmccallum: you might have too-old versions of some things, perhaps09:27
Kamionnpmccallum: might wanna mail me the build log ...09:27
Kamionanyway, off to relax now09:28
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mdzjabber.org is borked10:01
=== kagou [kagou@AMontpellier-251-1-11-240.w83-113.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #ubuntu
[Clint] deborked10:13
Mithrandirmdz: have you seen any of the NX stuff?  It would be cool to have a nice and working terminal server for hoary.10:14
lamontmdz: around?10:16
diemanone of my coworkers had reservations about the nsfw image at http://sounders:oink@wiki.no-name-yet.com/WartyWarthog_2fImages10:17
diemani had to explain, 'oh, thats marks fault i bet.'10:18
=== lamont finally discovers the attachment in the bts. sigh.
mdzlamont: yes10:20
mdzMithrandir: right now, Hoary is a place where I make lists, and little more :-)10:21
lamontfinally actually saw that there was an attachment...  Which failed to apply to my kernel source tree, since it's already there...10:21
=== lamont tries rebooting into -3 just to make sure.
Mithrandirmdz: if you think "terminal server which leaves MS in its tracks" is a good goal, chalk it up? :)10:22
mdzMithrandir: go ahead and add it to the list with a question mark10:23
mdzlamont: as Herbert said, you need to _revert_ that patch10:24
lamontah, revert...10:24
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mdzfabbione, daniels: here?10:39
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pittiGood night, guys!10:59
=== lamont watches the kernel compile chunk along
lamontmdz/keybuk: any clues on how to fix the fact that apt-get install postfix-tls fails (postfix is not to be installed) on a machine with exim installed? (postfix-tls Depends: postfix, which provides/conflicts with mail-transport-agent)11:12
=== lamont would like 'apt-get install postfix-tls to just work...)
lamontbut that's not really a warty issue, since we install both postfix and postfix-tls, which causes exim to go byebye11:13
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diemanim watching the mirroring slowly progress here11:16
diemanabout 10% done11:16
lamontGAH.  yet another X upload. :-(11:17
thomoh, fuck. there goes my bandwidth11:18
thom(and my housemate just got on the beta of evercrack 2, so that's a 2GB download)11:18
lamontthom: see - fat pipes just make you want _MORE_...11:19
thomi'm seriously tempted to see if we can upgrade to a megabit link11:19
diemani get 1.5mbps/1mbps at home11:21
diemanat work we have oodles, tho11:21
diemanbut i think the packetshaper is wacked out today11:21
=== lamont just drives 4 miles to his friends house and snarfs DSL bandwidth (~1.5MB) when he's desparate.
lamontor was that disparate?  or desperate? :-)11:21
diemani love my 1mbps upload11:21
diemani might setup puppycam when the puppies are born11:22
diemanfigure out how to do a theora http stream11:22
lamontdieman: what kind of puppies?11:22
diemangolden retriever11:22
lamontkewl.  papered?11:23
lamontbtw, mitzi got her master groomer cert in June.11:23
diemanpapered, both sides have an akc championship (obedience on one side, conformation on the other), all genetic tests on both sides checked out ok, etc.11:24
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diemantheres the pedigree11:25
thomdieman: 1.5/1 is just greedy :-)11:25
thommdz: stopped pogoing? :-)11:25
diemani *had* 3mbps/256kbps11:25
diemanbut i got sick of only having 256kbps11:25
mdzthom: mumble mumble circuit breaker11:25
diemanso i went up to 1.5/111:25
diemanlost 1.5mbps downlink tho :)11:25
thomyeah, upload is a killer11:25
lamontdieman: awesome11:26
thommdz: heh11:26
lamonthoary feature goal: Xfonts in their own source package11:27
diemanlamont: yeah, its working out pretty well11:27
ceflater ppl11:27
diemanlamont: we might break a bit over even since theres 8(!) puppies.11:27
diemanlamont: we were hoping for at least 511:27
mdzlamont: fabbione has already done it11:28
diemanhttp://winterstar.info/ <-- somewhat out of date website11:28
diemani need to go clean it up11:28
lamontmdz: yeah, but both of us said no to uploading it for warty.  I wanna see it in late october.. :-)11:28
lamontdieman: and I assume you did the right thing and pre-sold based on availability, yes?11:28
diemanlamont: we've pre-sold some of them, yes11:29
=== lamont would hate to consider dieman a puppy-miller... :)
diemanlamont: you can't easily sell 'all' the puppies.11:29
lamontdieman: good11:29
diemanlamont: plus, this isn't the boonies11:29
diemanlamont: and we know there is demand via the local club11:29
diemanthey get calls all the time, but don't have anyone to refer to at the moment11:29
lamontdieman: well, you _can_ presell all of them, but then the sales (and really in any case) have to be based on actually having the puppies born/healthy/etc.  Then you sell order of pick.11:29
diemanyeah, if we lived out in the middle of nowhere i think we would be a tad more careful.11:30
diemanwe had over half the litter figred out until it was 8 ;)11:31
mdzanyone tested the unmute script from the mailing list?11:31
mdzif not, WHY NOT? ;-)11:31
diemanmdz: im not in front of my ubuntu box? :)11:32
cefmdz: cos I'm just about to walk out the door and go to a training session on wireless security?11:32
ceflater ppl11:32
lamontdieman: cool11:33
diemanlamont: plus, we do something a puppy mill would never do -- genetic health gaurantees.11:33
diemanlamont: which is pretty much the norm with decent breeders out here11:33
lamontand you probably interview the prospective parents, I expect11:34
diemanhips bad? we'll take it back or negoiate some money11:34
diemanoh yes11:34
diemanwe did a 3 hour spheil with the last one11:34
lamontI've also seen first-refusal clauses.11:34
cefok, outta here11:34
lamont"if you ever decide to sell the dog, we have the right to buy it back at what you paid for it" type stuff11:34
diemanyeah, we're not going to be playing the first-refusal game with 'pet' contracts11:34
lamontvery true11:35
diemani might do it with show contracts, but we've not been looking for show contracts yet, want to see how this litter turns out11:35
diemanthe people we did stud service at want her back tho, they loved her attitude.11:36
debianistdieman : aren't all needed nvidia packages in universe?11:36
debianistor restricted ?11:36
diemandebianist: oh, they might be11:36
diemandebianist: i didn't look.11:36
debianistdieman : (just got your mail)11:36
diemani thought ubuntu had an anti-non-free policy on drivers11:37
lamontdebianist: I expect that (1) they belong in restricted, and (2) may need some overrides love before they get there...11:37
debianistreed the wiki, in order to support multimedia there's a restricted11:37
debianistfor pro. drivers11:37
diemani need to re-read11:37
diemanive not looked in a while11:37
debianist(non open source)11:37
lamontdieman: firmware blobs --> main, object blobs --> restricted11:37
debianistlamont : thanks.11:38
diemanthey still have to be redistributable, though, right?11:38
diemani'll read the wiki11:38
diemanmdz replied too11:38
lamontrestrnvidia-glx-dev nvidia-glx nvidia-kernel-common nvidia-kernel-source nvidia-settings are in restricted11:38
debianistlamont : still, i have manually to compile to kernel moudle? we should have nvidia ready k images11:39
diemannope, it sounds lke you should just be able to install the package11:40
diemanlamont: is keyspan in restricted?11:40
thomdebianist: no, there's linux-restricted modules with the nvidia module in11:41
lamontwhat they said11:41
debianistthom : targetted at the waty shipped kenrels?11:41
debianistfor instance, 2.6.{7|8} ?11:41
thomdebianist: it'd be pretty silly otherwise, wouldn't it? :-)11:42
debianistthom : yeppers. silly question, erase from protocol :)11:44
debianistif mdz answer works out (installing now) this is COOOL11:44
diemanall the sudden my mirror sped up11:44
debianistmine's too.11:44
diemanand now it slow down again11:44
debianistbeen 50kb/s most of the day11:44
diemanso its not just mee11:44
diemanme, rather11:45
debianistboy, i'm getting 100kb/s11:45
debianistit updated grub without approval11:49
=== lamont wanders
lamontfire call.  bbiab11:49
debianistSearching for GRUB installation directory ... found: /boot/grub .11:49
debianistTesting for an existing GRUB menu.list file... found: /boot/grub/menu.lst .11:49
debianistSearching for splash image... none found, skipping...11:49
debianistFound kernel: /boot/vmlinuz-
debianistFound kernel: /boot/vmlinuz-2.6.7-1-38611:49
debianistUpdating /boot/grub/menu.lst ... done11:49
debianistmdz : back in sec11:57
bdalelamont: debian-only package (debootstrap) that I'm about to NMU has version 0.2.44 ... is the right version for me to use for a source NMU?11:59

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