jdubseb128: yes, thanks12:01
jdubcheck if they're sane, of course ;)12:01
jdubbut the current releases look ok12:01
seb128jdub: ah, and a guy asked for a gmane archive of ubuntu-fr, I guess that's ok ? :)12:02
seb128don't worry, for big package I run them one day one my box before uploading most of the time12:02
seb128or at least time to reboot and make basic tests12:02
jdubseb128: i think it's already on gmane12:02
jdubsome dude mailed me to say some of the posts were missing ;)12:02
seb128oh, ok, cool :)12:02
seb12837 people on the -fr list, that's a good start :)12:03
jdubyou are beating spain and germany ;)12:10
seb128he he12:13
mdzKamion: still here?12:32
lamontT-Bone: you modify the source...12:38
T-Bonethis is what i did, eventually ;)12:39
T-Boneunfortunately gcc takes _time_ to build12:39
lamontbut build deps get dealt with early...12:47
lamontRejected: file 'linux-686-smp_2.6.8.1-10_i386.deb' has invalid priority 'restricted/optional' [contains '/'] .12:48
Kamionmdz: current daily is candidate12:49
mdzKamion: ok, I'll download and test12:50
Kamionyou can probably make amd64 your bottom priority, I've tested that12:50
mdzlamont: can you and/or elmo arrange for those messages to go someplace useful?12:54
lamontmdz: will do12:55
mdzlamont: warty-changes should be a reasonable place12:55
lamontyou want all REJECT mail to go there?12:56
mdzyes, unless there's a bunch of spam I don't know about12:56
Kamionhm, WinXP boots for me after installing Ubuntu01:03
=== Kamion wonders what the variable is
lamontmdz: all katie mail that would have gone direct to me now goes to warty-changes.01:03
mdzlamont: thanks much01:05
mdzlamont: new linux-meta happier?01:05
=== lamont checks
lamontmdz: give it 2.6 minutes.01:07
mdzjdub: new exciting sounder CD candidate to test01:07
lamonteither warty-changes should get the reject mail shortly after 16:10 your time,01:07
Kamioni386 WFM01:07
lamontor the new linux-meta -11 package will hit the archive at 16:3301:07
mdzran out of disk space, restarted rsync01:08
Kamiondisk is cheap :)01:08
mdzyeah, but adding disks is not01:08
Kamionjust testing daily+new-parted for good measure, even though I can't reproduce the problem with old-parted01:09
mdzall my disk is being eaten by mythtv01:09
jdubmdz: btw, what's the status of mythtv in sid or universe?01:09
KamionFree  PE / Size       14499 / 56.64 GB01:09
jdubKamion: what was the package update cutoff point for the new sounder?01:09
azeemdid you guys see the latest gnoppix announcement?01:10
mdzjdub: waiting for elmo to bring in lame01:10
Kamionjdub: about 1300 GMT or something01:10
azeem"You'll find a new 0.8.1beta ( codename Ubuntu ) with bugfixes and Gnome 2.8 at:"01:10
jdubmdz: "oh."01:10
jdubazeem: haha01:10
jdubKamion: cool, ta01:10
jdubmdz: so the non-free universe is still going to be called 'multiverse'?01:11
jdubwe *so* need livecds for testing :|01:11
jdubmdz: i punted alex bugging to you, btw.01:11
mdzjdub: noticed, followed up01:11
azeemperhaps gnoppix is the first case of a CUD, as opposed to CDDs01:12
jdubazeem: it is all in the CDD family :)01:12
Kamionjdub: actually later than that01:12
Kamioncjwatson@little:~$ head -n 2 cdimage/log/daily-20040928.1.log01:12
Kamion===== Syncing Ubuntu mirror =====01:12
KamionTue Sep 28 15:55:48 BST 200401:12
jdubazeem: but yes, CUD explosion is very much in the plans ;)01:12
azeemI talked to amu about gnoppix for quite a while at LinuxTag, and he said they entirely repackage GNOME for gnoppix. Perhaps now with ubuntu he finally got driven to sanity :)01:13
mdzmako: will there be an ubuntu traffic coming soon?01:15
mdzKamion: what do you think we should do about #1608 (some CD-ROM drives screw up DMA)?01:21
mdzKamion: disabling DMA on all CD-ROM drives seems awfully heavy-handed, but it's simple and safe to implement01:22
Kamionthere was a bug in Debian about this ...01:22
KamionI think01:22
Kamion  * Osamu Aoki01:22
Kamion    - When CD mount fails, unmount it and try again, to work around DMA01:22
Kamion      issues. Closes: #25512801:22
Kamionthat was an error on mount, though01:23
=== sabdfl [~mark@host217-37-231-28.in-addr.btopenworld.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel
sabdflKamion: ok, nothing in the syslog about firmware loading01:24
Kamionmdz: killing DMA on failure works for me, don't like the idea of doing it unconditionally01:25
Kamionsabdfl: have you run the hw-detect stage yet?01:26
sabdflKamion: interesting, detect hardware comes after configure network01:27
sabdflbut even after jumping through it, nothing about the firmware load01:27
Kamionsabdfl: um ... configure the network definitely has a higher menu-item-number than detect network hardware01:28
Kamionsabdfl: ok, well, it was untested code, guess it doesn't quite work :-/01:29
=== T-Bone hopes to start ia64 stage2 by tomorrow, calls it a night in the meantime
Kamionmdz: didn't you have an ipw2100 you could play with too?01:29
sabdflT-Bone: wow, good progress?01:30
sabdflKamion: on my system it is showing:01:30
sabdflLoad installer components from CD01:30
sabdflDetect network hardware01:31
sabdflConfigure the network01:31
Kamionthat's not what you said above ...01:31
Kamion00:27 < sabdfl> Kamion: interesting, detect hardware comes after configure network01:31
sabdflDetect hardware01:31
Kamionoh, that's detect disks01:31
sabdflnice :-)01:31
sabdfl"configure the network" shows the wifi card01:32
Kamionshould fix the string there01:32
KamionTemplate: debian-installer/hw-detect-full/title01:32
KamionType: text01:32
Kamion#  Main menu item01:32
Kamion_Description: Detect hardware01:32
sabdflbut it doesn't seem to work01:32
sabdflstill, it's not screaming spam log messages :-)01:32
sabdflto console01:33
T-Bonesabdfl: i'll post the m-l as soon as i start "stage2" (ie: building warty main against warty binaries, stage1 was building warty main against debian binaries)01:33
T-Bonesabdfl: this should hopefully happen tomorrow01:33
Kamionsabdfl: guess it just egregiously failed to load firmware then. does that machine have PCMCIA?01:34
sabdflcan i force a firmware load?01:34
KamionI hacked the firmware loading stuff onto the side of PCMCIA, which is kind of broken but I figured would work for now01:34
mdzKamion: I have only a 220001:34
Kamionnot sure; mdz, do you know?01:34
Kamionmdz: that would do01:34
mdzKamion: I'm not sure that there's a condition we can detect to automatically disable DMA01:35
T-Bonesabdfl: another that should happen soon is my beginning to work on the installer for ia64. probably before the end of the week, or in the worst case next week01:35
mdzyou can force a firmware load by loading the driver01:35
Kamionchinstrap:~cjwatson/warty-i386-hacked.iso if you want to give this a go, no firmware on that image so you'll have to bring it in by USB stick or whatever01:35
sabdflmdz: already did that, but nothing showed up in syslog01:35
KamionT-Bone: give me a shout if you need help, some ia64 love with the Ubuntu customizations will be needed01:35
T-BoneKamion: that's noted, and I will undoubtly bother you alot ;)01:36
mdzsabdfl: it doesn't log anything when it's successful01:36
Kamionmdz: it so does01:36
mdzmine doesn't01:36
Kamion                        log "Firmware for $FIRMWARE loaded successfully."01:36
Kamionmdz: it does in d-i01:36
T-Bonesabdfl: side note, i've started "for fun" an hppa builder. But that's "for fun". For now ;)01:37
Kamionsabdfl: what's in /proc/sys/kernel/hotplug at the moment?01:37
mdzKamion: oh, that01:37
mdzI'm pretty sure it loads the firmware every time the ipw2200 module is loaded01:37
sabdflit says /sbin/hotplug01:38
mdzshouldn't that be /sbin/hotplug-special-d-i-variant?01:38
sabdflwhich doesn't exist01:39
mdzI think it's hotplug-pcmcia01:39
sabdflneither of those exist01:39
Kamionthe special d-i variant is /bin/hotplug-pcmcia, and that's only loaded for brief periods while the PCMCIA queue is run01:39
KamionI think that's probably the bug01:39
sabdflcan i reset that and try to reload the driver?01:39
Kamionthere's no rmmod in d-i, you'd have to reboot01:39
T-Bonethat's probably the biggest pain in d-i, actually01:40
sabdfli really need to spend some face time with my launchpad code01:40
Kamionsabdfl: after reboot, you could try copying /bin/hotplug-pcmcia to /sbin/hotplug and removing the non-firmware parts (since I think those will have unintended side-effects if run with non-PCMCIA)01:40
Kamionsorry for awkwardness, will clean it up once an approach has been demonstrated to work01:42
mdzKamion: I did this experiment a while back; it does work01:43
mdzif I poked all the bits in the right places, the firmware was loaded01:44
Kamionmdz: in d-i?01:44
mdzKamion: yes01:44
Kamionmdz: is your ipw2200 card PCMCIA?01:44
mdzKamion: no01:44
Kamionmdz: then you must have had to set up /sbin/hotplug?01:44
Kamionor possibly make /bin/hotplug-pcmcia the hotplug handler temporarily01:44
mdzKamion: I did echo /bin/hotplug-pcmcia > /proc/sys/kernel/hotplug or whatever01:45
mdzthat was one of the bits that needed poking :-)01:45
Kamionhow about I create a hotplug-misc which sits in /sbin/hotplug for the rest of the time, then?01:46
Kamionwe don't have time to port proper hotplug now, will be doing that for hoary01:46
mdzsounds fine to me01:48
sabdflwhat are the non-standard firmware parts01:49
Kamionpatch is trivial, I'll upload if there are no objections01:49
sabdflyour comment above... remove the "non-firmware parts"....01:50
sabdflsorry, not non-standard, non-firmware01:50
sabdflso i've got the firmware in /lib/firmware and /usr/lib/hotplug/firmware for good measure01:50
Kamionnetwork events and cardbus events01:50
mdzKamion: is #1586 RC for Warty?01:50
sabdfli've echo >/bin/hotplug-pcmcia /procy/sys/kernel/hotplug01:51
mdzKamion: no objections to having an /sbin/hotplug01:51
jdubKamion: sounder + current daily are the same today?01:51
Kamionmdz: it's RC for me to look at it at the very least01:51
sabdflnow can i just modprobe the ipw2200?01:51
KamionI just haven't had time :(01:51
sabdflwhat about the depmod?01:51
Kamionif modprobe doesn't work then depmod ...01:51
Kamionthe build was hacked-up, hopefully shouldn't act that way if built normally01:52
sabdflFATAL: module ipw2200 not found01:52
Kamionjdub: aye, not that I've actually blessed S9 yet01:52
sabdflok, now:01:52
Kamionburning powerpc now, I've tested the others01:52
sabdflhotplug pcmcia says it detected pcmcia network interface eth001:52
sabdflthen ieee80211_crypt gets loaded01:53
sabdflthen the driver comes on stream01:53
sabdflbut says nothing about firmware being loaded01:53
sabdflah, hold on this is interesting01:53
Kamion00:51 < sabdfl> i've echo >/bin/hotplug-pcmcia /procy/sys/kernel/hotplug01:53
sabdflif i dmesg i see a message at the end:01:53
Kamionhope the position of the > there was a typo01:54
sabdflKamion: yes it was, that's all correct afaics01:54
sabdflbut listen to this01:54
jdubKamion: cool, thanks01:54
sabdflit says "Radio frequency kill switch is on"01:54
sabdflwhich was also in the syslog01:54
sabdflthen it says:01:54
sabdflKill switch must be turned off for wireless networking to work"01:55
mdzthat'll be the wifi button/switch on the laptop somewhere01:55
Kamion+To determine if you have such a switch, you can check the contents of:01:55
Kamion+       /proc/net/ipw2100/eth1/state01:55
sabdfli don't have /proc/net/ipw210001:56
sabdflthis is a 220001:56
Kamionprobably same difference01:56
hazmatis there a formal mechanism to suggesting a package for inclusion in ubuntu?01:57
Kamionor maybe not, the ipw2200 driver's /proc-handling code seems different, oh well01:58
lamontKamion: is there an option to debootstrap to tell it that the archive is not in a {dists,pool} form?01:58
mdzhazmat: email to ubuntu-devel01:58
hazmatokay.. thanks.01:58
Kamionlamont: debootstrap couldn't care less about pool, it uses Filename: fields01:59
lamontit cares about Release, though. :-(01:59
Kamionlamont: it does indelibly want dists/$SUITE/Release01:59
lamontwhich needs to have the packages md5sums?02:00
Kamionand dists/$SUITE/$COMPONENT/binary-$ARCH/Packages*02:00
KamionI usually just fill the right values into the Release file from whatever CD image I have handy02:00
mdzsabdfl: /sys/bus/pci/devices/xxxx/rf_kill02:01
mdzseems like the right place02:01
sabdflmdz: just found it too02:01
sabdflusing the fn-f8 sequence doesn't seem to affect that02:01
Kamion00:51  * joeyh notices we just got ntfsresize support02:01
sabdflBUT i can echo 1 > /sys/..../rf_kill02:02
sabdflor vice versa02:02
sabdflwill play with that02:02
mdzI don't think my laptop has a switch; the sysfs flie says 002:03
mdzseveral of the test laptops in oxford had switches02:03
mdzsome of them in unlikely places02:03
mdzKamion: I think we need to change the default sources.list again02:08
mdzshould have one line with main and restricted02:08
mdzand then another line, commented out, with only universe02:08
KamionI thought I already fixed that02:08
mdzI'll find out soon, doing a new install02:09
Kamionit was part of the universe changes a couple of days ago02:09
Kamion  * Remove 'main restricted' from the universe line, so people don't end up02:09
Kamion    with duplicate sources.list entries.02:09
sabdflthe switch was well hidden, in the off position02:10
sabdflWELL hidden02:10
sabdflKamion: please could you file a bug to detect those rf-kill switch situations, and alert the user, because i *bet* a lot get bitten by that02:11
mdzKamion: oh, ok02:11
mdzyou even updated the bug02:11
mdzoh, you did that just now. cheat :-)02:11
Kamionyes :)02:11
lamontsabdfl: if you configure postfix, edit main.cf, and say 'dpkg-reconfigure postfix', do you (a) expect it to overwrite your changes, or (b) preserve them? (for questions that we ask in configure, that is)02:11
Kamionsabdfl: ok02:11
sabdfllamont: it's too late for me to give you a reliable answer to that :-)02:12
lamontsabdfl: ok.  something to ponder in the morning then?02:12
sabdflperhaps it should figure out you've made changes, offer to (a) show you a diff, (b) forget about it, (c) forge ahead02:13
sabdfland backup the old config?02:13
lamonttoday we preserve them.  which is why postfix is broken (see 1711)02:13
Kamionsabdfl: sounds like ucf02:13
lamontthat'd be ucf02:13
lamontwhat postfix actually does is to set the defaults to what you have configured currently.02:14
lamontso that hitting return all the way through produces no change.02:14
sabdflthat's pretty neat02:14
lamontand then debconf and base-config run: debconf does the wrong things because we haven't set things up yet, and base-config does nothing because the defaults are all what you said in debootstrap  time...02:14
mdzelmo: PowerEdge 2650 is on the HardwareSupport page, but without a comment about whether it worked.  did it?02:15
mdzelmo: we have a success report from a user on one02:15
lamontsabdfl: neat, but breaks ubuntu install of postfix02:15
jdub^ :-)02:15
Kamionlamont: the debconf/debootstrap fix would work around this, AIUI ...02:16
KamionI worked out the problem with my earlier change after talking to joeyh; I'd just implemented noninteractive multiselect wrong02:16
lamontah, ok.  that was the default vs seen thing?02:16
Kamiontrying to get debconf to set the seen flag on questions that would be asked if the frontend weren't noninteractive02:17
Kamionmy earlier fix caused all systems to have the aa_DJ locale configured02:17
Kamiondidn't upload that one :)02:17
sabdflcustom install just went all the way through with wifi on ipw2200 and just worked02:18
lamontKamion: it would be nice if debootstrap would accept Packages.gz in place of Packages. :-(02:19
mdzmessages read in 2004-08: 6288, messages read so far in 2004-09: 1329602:19
sabdflactually, that's fnny02:19
mdzI was wondering why it took mutt so much longer than usual to open this month's read-mail folder02:19
sabdflduring the pre-boot it configure eth0 (wired)02:19
sabdflthen it rebooted, and ifup'd the wifi02:19
sabdflwhich Just Worked02:19
mdzsabdfl: I guess you got lucky and the ipw2200 is later on the pci bus02:19
sabdflno, it's earlier02:20
makomdz: it's almost done02:20
makomdz: UT taht is02:20
sabdflpre-boot, it didn't detect it, and configured eth0 (wired) for dhcp02:20
lamontmdz: where'd you get that stat?02:20
mdzmako: cool, that's a ton of mail to process02:20
mdzlamont: bzgrep -c '^From '02:20
mako~17k messages :)02:20
sabdflthen post-boot, the kernel finds ipw2200 and makes that eth002:20
sabdflbut now, with the rf_kill switch on, it actually boots02:20
mdzoh, heh02:21
sabdflso the solution to the bug is turn off the rf_kill, or turn on the radio02:21
mdzso it wrote a config for eth0 for the wired net02:21
mdzand then used that config for the wireless?02:21
sabdflwhich just worked02:21
makothe friday-friday stat is 17k02:21
makoit's picked up02:21
sabdflinterestingly it doesn't need the essid02:21
mdzmako: 17k what?02:21
sabdflit seems to just go with the closest / best ap02:21
sabdfland go02:21
makoergh.. 1.7k02:21
mdzsabdfl: the 0.8 driver grabs whatever has the strongest signal if it's set to scan02:21
makodecimal error02:21
mako1.7k mesasges02:22
sabdfli'll update the bug,and file upstream02:22
sabdflholy crap you guys need a more time-efficient sabdfl02:22
Kamionsabdfl: kill-switch bug is #187702:22
sabdfli can't belive i spent two whole nights on this at this stage :-)02:23
makosabdfl: i'm just going through user now and picking up the last few threads i flagged for possible inclusion02:23
makoergh.. for mdz02:23
sabdflbut it feels good to find the bug ;-)02:23
sabdflpossible inclusion?02:23
makosabdfl: don't worry about it, it was misdirected02:23
sabdflmako: btw, thanks for the lurker tip02:23
=== mako nods
mdzsometimes I want to strangle the genius at apple who eliminated the cd-rom eject button02:27
mdzthe system is powered off, and I want to boot it from CD02:27
mdzI have to boot it up, software-eject the CD, and then reboot it02:28
m_tthewmdz: or have the always-useful paperclip handy.02:28
Kamionyou mean you want to boot it from a different CD from the one already in the drive?02:29
mdzm_tthew: they even put a door in front of the thing, making the hole difficult to get to (it's below the lip)02:29
mdzKamion: the drive is empty, and I want to put in a CD and boot from it02:29
Kamionoh your drive isn't slot-loading02:29
Kamionmdz: try 'eject cd' in Open Firmware02:29
mdzit's a tray with a door in front of it02:29
m_tthewmdz: a door? ugh02:30
mdzah, I'll keep that in mind next time02:30
Kamionthen mac-boot02:30
Kamionnever tried this myself but it's what the net claims02:30
jdubis ndiswrapper in the current -3 kernel?02:30
Kamionmdz: one rumour claims holding down the left mouse button during boot also ejects the CD ...02:31
mdzooh, DMA is working on the hard disk now02:31
mdzI didn't think that was working before02:32
mdzjdub: yes it is02:32
sabdflmdz: you won't believe this02:32
sabdflwith hotplug setup, and the firmware there02:32
sabdflthe installer sees the wifi and lets you use it02:32
Kamionhey, warty-powerpc.iso burnt, time to reboot and try this stuff out myself02:32
sabdflbut it configures it as eth102:32
mdzKamion: i386 and powerpc in progress now02:32
sabdfli suspect, after reboot, it will be eth002:32
mdzdiscover vs. hotplug02:33
sabdflcould it be because discover ran first?02:33
mdzdiscover must scan in a different order02:33
mdzmaybe even exactly the reverse; wouldn't that just be grand?02:33
sabdflwell, discover goes first, doesn't find the wifi02:34
mdzsabdfl: give it a try; it really should preserve them02:34
sabdflthen hotplug could go, and find it02:34
mdzif they're both detected in the installer, ifrename should be able to do its job02:34
mdzcheck that they're both in /target/etc/iftab02:34
sabdflkamion, this is looking good to me (hotplug)02:34
sabdflmdz: yes02:34
mdzhmm, so let's just switch d-i over to use hotplug exclusively, shall we?02:35
=== mdz runs for cover
sabdflmdz: you can stay. you've clearly got the cohones for the position :-)02:35
sabdflmdz: (also, you're ifrename magic seems good so far, they are both in there)02:36
mdzin theory, when hotplug finds them after the reboot, it'll look in that file and switch the name before bringing it up02:36
mdzso it'll find the wifi first, but call it eth1, then find the wired and name it eth002:36
sabdflwe'll see in about 15 minutes :-)02:36
mdzthis may be the first valid test of that code, ever :-)02:36
mdzthat was an "oh, look, all the bits are already there, we just need to write iftab and it'll work" sort of job02:37
sabdflso if it works this time, we ship it?02:37
sabdflwell it wrote iftab02:37
mdzi386 stage 1 successful02:37
mdzgah, 12M of updates on top of the daily CD already02:40
sabdflmdz: do you know which was the bug i filed on the ipw200 loop of death? can't find it02:43
sabdflKamion: final dialo pre-boot still says "Finishing the installation"02:43
sabdflcan it say "Rebooting to finish installation"?02:44
mdzsabdfl: #175102:44
sabdflmdz: thanks02:45
mdzjdub: can I get the name and address of the person who tied gnome-system-tools to wvdial, so I can send them a lump of coal?02:45
jdubyou trying to untie them?02:52
jdubyo tseng 02:57
Kamionsabdfl: all depends how many translations you want to trash :)03:17
Kamionsabdfl: but sure, can do03:17
Kamionmdz: powerpc worked for me, xresprobe apparently hung solid on i386 ...03:17
Kamionsuspect it's specific to that machine, it's one of the Vias03:18
Kamionmdz: incidentally that hold-down-left-mouse-button-during-boot-to-eject-CD trick worked for me too03:19
mdzKamion: I tried it during the reboot for stage 2, but either I was too late, too early, or it didn't work03:20
Kamionmdz: shout if i386 works for you03:20
mdz<mdz> Kamion: i386 install is a success03:20
mdz<mdz> Kamion: powerpc as well03:20
Kamionmdz: it's at the same time as you would have to hold down 'c' to boot from CD03:20
mdzI'm never sure exactly when that time is, since my monitor switches on and off a few times during the boot and I can't see anything03:21
mdzI just hold it down forever03:21
=== jdub removes old install cd, inserts new install cd. hrm.
mdzI usually end up with about 3 'c's at the prompt by the time I can see again03:21
jdubwhoa, keymap question03:22
Kamionfor me there's a clear moment when it switches from black screen to white and starts reading the CD03:23
jdubat least ppp is out, that keeps us below quota03:23
Kamionjdub: arch, CD date?03:23
jdubi386, today03:23
Kamionoh, you mean in the first stage?03:23
Kamionyes, that was deliberate03:23
Kamiongood, thought you were talking about a bug :)03:23
Kamionyes, 'xresprobe via' hangs03:24
KamionI'll file a bug and ship anyway, seems chipset-specific03:24
mdzKamion: hangs during which bit?03:24
Kamionmdz: can't tell, it blanks the screen and leaves the system inaccessible03:24
mdzKamion: oh, _that_ sort of hang :-)03:24
Kamionthe fatal kind :)03:25
mdzmust be while it's starting the X server03:25
makomdz: around?03:32
mdzmako: yep03:32
makocan you clarify the conclusion of the universe multiverse thing from the meeting?03:33
makoi think i have it but want to make sure i got it right03:33
makoand also, is theere no problem with putting that in traffic?03:33
makoi'm assuming anything in ubuntu-* is fair game03:33
mdzthe conlcusion was that non-free/sketchy stuff should go in a separate component, named 'multiverse'03:33
makobut it has no connection to origin?03:34
mdzyeah, as far as I know it's fair game03:34
mdzno connection to the origin: header03:34
makoalright, that's what i thought03:34
makofixed conclusions can be hard to get sometimes re-reading irc meetings03:34
=== hazmat [~hazmat@c-24-15-10-12.client.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel
makojdub: oi!03:37
jdubi should redirect archive.ubuntu.com to my local apt-proxy ;)03:37
jdubmorning mako03:37
=== tseng wonders about making sound-juicer rip multiple formats at once
tsengala abcde03:40
tsengcheckmarks in the prefs instead of a radio03:40
jdubthat would be... odd03:40
jdubalthough i grok the reason03:40
tsengi use flac at home.. mp3 on ipod03:40
jdubnice and fast install on my desktop03:46
Kamionmdz: linux-restricted-modules-2.6-386 is uninstallable in the current daily, just noticed03:46
Kamionmdz: (I know you've fixed it since then)03:47
Kamionmdz: do you think I can ignore this, given that it's not used by default yet?03:47
mdzthe current daily that we just tested for sounder 9?03:47
mdzoh, it isn't?03:47
mdzno problem, then03:47
Kamionyeah, we use the concrete package currently03:47
lamonthrm.. guess the postfix discussion belongs here more..04:02
=== lamont wonders if he should notice that the already-existant alias file lacks a root alias and fix that...
lamontKamion: want to look at a diff and comment?04:09
=== lamont sends it anyway. :-)
Kamionlamont: will have to be tomorrow, sorry04:18
Kamionmdz: is the warty-changes list public?04:18
lamontKamion: np. about to sleep here too.04:18
Kamion(-ly advertised)04:18
jdubKamion: yes04:19
Kamionso I can mention it in the Sounder announcement, then04:19
lamontoooh... new sounder?04:19
lamonttest cd04:20
Kamiontseng: will explain on ubuntu-users shortly04:20
lamontsounder is the collective noun for warthogs04:20
lamontgcc-3.4 is making t-bone's life a pain, and therefore affecting me as well.... sigh.04:21
lifelessjdub: thanks for that :)04:21
jdublifeless: you might want to ask edd about the bluetooth ones04:22
jdub(wrt imports)04:22
lifelessthe bluez ones?04:23
lifelessoh lol.04:23
danielslifeless: when do I get to announce xorg? :)04:24
lifelessdaniels: when its cooked.04:24
mdzKamion: yes, warty-changes is entirely public04:47
lamontso how do I (1) de-mimeify something, or (2) get a usable patch from bugzilla?04:58
lifelesslamont: mimutils04:59
mdzKamion: I thought therm-windtunnel was supposed to be detected and loaded now05:07
mdz(wasn't for me)05:07
=== hazmat [~hazmat@c-24-15-10-12.client.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel
fabbionemdz: permission to upload radvd for 186805:49
fabbionediff is here05:49
fabbione2 cosmetic + the real bug fix05:49
fabbionecosmetic are 1 typo and add one line to the output (looks better in case o failure)05:50
mdzyep, OK by me05:50
mdzis ||true more appropriate than --oknodo?05:50
mdzI suppose so05:50
fabbionemdz: --oknodo has no effect there05:50
fabbionealready tested05:50
fabbionestart-stop-daemon will still die05:50
mdzI wonder about start-stop-daemon sometimes05:54
mdzI expect it to do many things because they are the right thing to do05:54
mdzbut it simply doesn't05:54
=== fabbione knows
mdzfabbione: if you run out of RC bugs, I think that kamion and seb128 currently have more than their share and could use an extra pair of eyes05:57
fabbionemdz: yes i know.. i keep tracking bugs..06:00
fabbionemdz: also the one "assigned" to debzilla ;)06:00
mdzthere are very few unassigned RC bugs now, and two of them are sort of fuzzy bugs06:00
mdzone is tollef's bug that I have no idea about06:01
mdzgoing to get some food, back later06:01
fabbionemake[5] : *** [libglx.a]  Illegal instruction06:03
danielsfabbione: ... nice one06:03
fabbionethat's the ppc buildd on x -806:05
lamontfabbione: Illegal instruction on ppc is something that "just happens".  That is, it's a kernel bug that no one is working on...  Just gotta retry it..06:11
fabbionelamont: it still sucks tho :-)06:14
danielsisn't that the exec_shield crack?06:20
lamontnot on ppc06:20
jdubdaniels: ppc has bugs to do that for you06:21
danielsjdub: huzzah06:23
=== tseng updates mono and friends
tsengthe edge gets sharper !06:23
tsengcdbs is rock.06:25
tsengi replaced the monodevelop rules w/ yours06:26
tsengit was doing some nasty stuff.06:26
hazmathas anyone noticed that powerbook sleep seems to be broken with the latest iso nightlies ?06:28
justdavemine sleeps but I've been having trouble getting it to wake up on occasion06:32
tseng Depends: ${gdi:Depends}, ${wine:Depends}, ${shlibs:Depends}, mono-assemblies-base-${m ono:upversion}06:33
tsengwhat does that mean06:33
hazmathmm.. i saw a few refs to that on the list... i just did an install on a tibook gen4 (ati mobility) wiping an existing gentoo setup.. which did sleep properly (2.4 kernel though).. i'm wondering if its a 2.6.8 kernel regression, i see a few refs to the not waking up issue while googling around in relation to that kernel version 06:34
justdaveI'm wondering if it's airport card related...06:35
justdavethere's an error about attempting to access the wireless when the wireless isn't active in the middle of the output it gets on the screen before it hangs06:35
justdaveand that message isn't there on the times when it wakes up properly06:36
=== lamont always thought cdbs was crack
hazmatjustdave, what powerbook version do you have? 06:37
justdavedual USB 500MHz iBook (white)06:37
hazmatso its ati radeon mobility (>9100) ?06:37
hazmatfor the gfx card06:38
=== doko [doko@dsl-084-057-022-219.arcor-ip.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel
=== justdave looks for the actual driver description
lamontdoes apt-ftparchive just run dpkg-scanpackages eventually, or does it do it's own thing?06:40
fabbionei think the latter06:40
tsengit does the same thing, but its own way i believe06:40
fabbionelamont: if you try dpkg-scanpackage and apt-ftparchive on one package you also notice that the output is slightly different06:41
justdaveATI RAGE Mobility M306:41
fabbionelamont: like the order of the fields06:41
lamontfabbione: ah, ok06:41
=== lamont finds a debootstrap bug. (well, actually it's a warty.buildd bug, but...)
hazmatjustdave, do you see any ati related error messages on bootup?06:43
hazmati see a few and i'm suspicious since they werent present with gentoo previously..06:44
justdaveaty128fb: Invalid ROM signature e78c should be 0xaa5506:45
justdaveaty128fb: BIOS not located, guessing timings06:45
justdaveaty128fb: Rage128 LF M3 AGP [chip rev 0x0]  8M 128-bit SDR SGRAM (1:1)06:45
justdaveRegistered "ati" backlight controller, level: 15/1506:46
hazmatyah.. i have the same invalid rom sig line with atiradeonfb06:46
danielsapparently these suspend problems could well be caused by radeonfb06:47
hazmatit could be a red herring.. but i'm suspicious06:48
hazmatthe follow up has some more analysis06:51
justdavehmm, there's a bunch of new bugs assigned to me on Bugzilla that I never got bugmail for06:54
danielsoh wow, no edid. that sucks horribly.06:57
lamontx needs 4.5 GB to build?  sheesh06:59
danielslamont: ya-huh06:59
fabbionelamont: only if you build -all06:59
lamontwell, I have 6gb - hope that's enough.06:59
danielslamont: every time there's a sid upload, we have to poke the arm and s390 folks to build on a box with enough space06:59
danielslamont: plenty06:59
fabbionelamont: if you build -B it will be a 500Mb less07:00
fabbionelamont: or probably more.. i can't remember07:00
lamontfabbione: this is -B07:00
lamonton ia64, though07:00
fabbionelamont: ah07:00
lamontso is P1 more urgent than P2?07:01
=== lamont sleeps
lamontfabbione: btw, you can/should drop the > make_world.build.log hack on your next upload of X...07:05
fabbionelamont: just a sec07:05
=== lamont doesn't sleep.
fabbioneFinished at 20040721-125007:05
fabbioneBuild needed 02:21:38, 4685680k disk space07:05
fabbioneFinished at 20040928-181807:06
fabbioneBuild needed 02:09:09, 4454612k disk space07:06
fabbionei guess ia64 doesn't really benefit of the BuildFonts=NO07:06
lamontis it building the fonts?07:06
fabbionethe first one is -6 that was still building the fonts07:06
fabbionethe second is -7 that does not build fonts and docs07:07
lamont200MB, 12 minutes07:07
fabbionebut for instance on m687k it saves up to 30% of time07:07
=== lamont falls over. night all
fabbionenight lamont 07:07
danielslamont: night dude07:52
fabbionemdz: 1485 permission to upload base-config07:54
mdzfabbione: yes07:54
fabbionemdz: useless reassing ;) i am done already :P07:54
mdzfabbione: you never know; it could get rejected :-)07:54
fabbionetsk :P07:55
mdz1 down, 38 to go08:00
fabbionei am on another one08:02
mdzthe ones I am really concerned about are #1724 and #163208:02
mdzand #185408:03
mdz1854 and 1724 I have no idea what is broken08:03
mdz#1632 I can at least reproduce and start adding printks08:03
fabbione1834 <-08:08
fabbionei will check the others in a few minutes08:08
mdzI think 1834 is a dupe of that bug where seb fixed it by adding a dependency08:09
mdzbut I wasn't sure08:10
fabbioneyeps.. i am checking that..08:10
fabbioneDepends: libpt-plugins-alsa | libpt-plugins-oss08:12
fabbioneit's not versioned08:12
fabbioneso for a pure warty that's not an issue, but it can be in mixed environment08:13
fabbionemdz: do you want me to strict the dependencies?08:13
mdzdoes it need to be versioned?08:14
mdzI don't know anything about libpt08:15
fabbioneneither do i, but according to the maintinaer it needs to be08:15
mdzthe plugins have an exact versioned dep on libpt08:15
mdzand gnomemeeting has a >= dep08:15
fabbione"Pwlib is not compatible among different versions.08:15
fabbioneComment #208:16
mdzI don't think pwlib is related; he must have meant libpt08:17
mdzmizar:[/tmp]  apt-cache show libpt-plugins-alsa | grep-dctrl -nsDepends ''08:17
mdzlibasound2 (>> 1.0.5), libc6 (>= 2.3.2.ds1-4), libgcc1 (>= 1:3.3.4-1), libstdc++5 (>= 1:3.3.4-1), libpt-1.6.3 (= 1.6.5-3ubuntu1)08:17
mdzit already has an exact dependency, so I don't see how it could be tighter08:17
fabbionei missed that :-)08:17
fabbioneok.. so it's a duplicate.. let's figure of which bug ;)08:18
mdz  * debian/control.in: Added a Dependency on video plugins, so at least one is08:19
mdz    going to be always installed (Warty: #1542).08:19
fabbioneok.. gone08:22
fabbione1724 smells of nvidia crack08:23
fabbionethat's something i debugged a while ago and added info to the relevant bugs08:24
fabbioneas soon as you have nvidia-glx installed, the system becomes.. hmm funny08:25
fabbioneX -> FTBFS08:25
fabbionepyopengl -> as X08:25
mdzone of the comments in 1724 swears they removed nvidia08:26
mdzbut even if it is nvidia, many people posted to ubuntu-users saying xmms did not work08:26
mdzI wonder if I can reproduce it just by installing nvidia-glx, not using the driver08:27
fabbionemdz: yes you can08:27
fabbionewith kernel 2.608:27
fabbionethe nvidia-glx creates /usr/lib/tls08:27
fabbioneand boom08:27
fabbionethe libraries provided by nvidia-glx are pure crack08:28
mdzhmm, yes, I can08:28
mdzwtf is nvidia doing providing libraries which are used by xmms??08:28
fabbione1632 <- i don't have 2GB of ram.. if Mark wants to sponsor them i can buy another Giga and give serial access to Xu ;)08:28
fabbionemdz: no no.. it doesn't08:29
fabbioneldso goes on crack with tls08:29
fabbionebecause the libs are pure crack08:29
fabbionethere is another package that puts stuff in there (can't remember shich one)08:29
mdzbut everything else works fine for me08:29
fabbionethat you can use as test case08:29
mdzwhen I don't install nvidia-glx08:29
mdzit is still using tls libraries08:29
fabbioneremove nvidia-glx, install that package and that's it08:29
fabbioneyu will see that xmms works fine08:30
mdzremoving /usr/lib/tls/* and running xmms gives a nice segfault08:32
mdzwhat is nvidia-glx changing which breaks it?08:33
fabbioneit installs some tls libs required for the driver to work on kernel 2.608:33
mdzwhich ones?  how do they end up linked into xmms?08:34
mdzit is the opengl spectrum plugin08:34
fabbionexmms overabuses dlopen08:34
mdzrm /usr/lib/xmms/Visualization/libogl_spectrum.so08:35
mdzand it works fine08:35
mdzok, that makes much more sense now08:35
mdzI didn't know that xmms used GL stuff08:36
fabbioneif it there is something available, xmms uses it :P08:36
mdzxmms is not doing anything wrong; nvidia seems buggy08:38
fabbioneas i said before :-)08:38
fabbionethere is a scary override in nvidia-glx08:39
fabbionelike: lib not linked with libc6 or something08:39
mdzMithrandir: ping?08:44
fabbionemdz: 1859. you already disabled the init script completely08:50
fabbionemdz: that kinda avoid discover1 to trash /media08:50
fabbionemdz: but i think we can safely add joeyh fix to change the default in the template08:52
fabbioneas extra safety08:53
mdzfabbione: I think d-i might call discover to create that stuff, I'm not sure08:53
mdzor it might create it itself08:53
fabbionemdz: See comment #1408:54
fabbioneand comment 908:55
fabbioneSorry for the late reply. It seems to mee that discover1 is the culprit08:55
fabbioneand it probably deleted the directories created in prebaseconfig.08:55
=== fabbione checks prebaseconfig
fabbione90prepare-base-config 08:56
fabbione# Set up /dev/cdrom link to point to the device used for /media/cdrom0 in08:57
fabbione# /target; various programs including base-config want a /dev/cdrom.08:57
fabbione[SNIP] 08:57
jduboh man09:02
jdubg-s-m has a "run as root" thing all of its own09:02
mdzsounds bad09:03
jdubso mcuh cock09:03
mdzit doesn't have any setuid stuff in it, though09:03
mdzso it must eventually call out to su or something09:03
fabbionemdz: so should we leave discover1 as it is?09:03
jdubmdz: yeah, it does09:04
jdubi can evilly hack around it09:04
mdzfabbione: hmmm09:05
mdzfabbione: I thought someone had reported this in ubuntu09:05
mdzfabbione: but now that I am looking, I only see Debian reports09:05
fabbionemdz: i am more to apply the patch from joeyh09:05
mdzso I think you are right, and it is just discover wiping out the links at boot time09:05
mdzin which case it may be NOTWARTY09:06
mdzfabbione: joeyh's patch has no effect because it only changes the init script behaviour09:06
mdzfabbione: I think we can close it NOTWARTY09:07
fabbionemdz: ok09:07
fabbionemdz: gone09:08
mdz36 to go09:08
fabbionewe ARE ROCKING!09:09
mdzfor #1301, I really think we should just tell the user not to use XFS for root09:10
mdzLinux XFS is crap anyway09:10
fabbionewtf happened to bugzilla????09:10
mdzfabbione: justdave is changing things09:10
fabbionethe fonts become GIANT in a sec?09:10
fabbioneah ok09:10
mdzthe CSS and such09:10
mdzall of the hyperlinks became not-visited for some reason09:10
fabbionemdz: i have 38 to go here09:11
jdubyay! kill xfs, reiser and jfs! yay!09:11
mdzjustdave: did you change the visited link color to be the same as the not-visited color?09:11
mdzfabbione: I have 36 WartyWarthog bugs >= major09:11
mdzfabbione: maybe you are getting website bugs as well?09:11
justdaveno, visited should be purple, non-visited blue09:11
mdzjustdave: both are blue09:12
fabbioneoh could be yes09:12
=== justdave surfs the stylesheet for visited again
mdzas of a few minutes ago09:12
justdaveok, the ones in the header are working, nothing else is.09:13
justdavemust be something overriding the main one09:13
justdaveno other mentions of visited in the stylesheet...  hmmmm09:14
justdavethere we go, got it.09:17
justdavethere was no explicit declaration for :visited or :active outside of a <p>09:18
justdaveso it was inheriting the generic <a> style09:18
justdavewhich was explicitly declared as blue09:18
justdavethat stylesheet is really funky :)09:19
justdaveno offence intended to the main website :)09:19
=== pitti [~martin@] has joined #ubuntu-devel
pittiMorning guys!09:20
=== fabbione grabs 2 CDs and checks 1479
fabbionesound-juicer just decided to hang completely09:26
mdzpitti: morning09:27
mdzpitti: what is your feeling on the new utopia packages?  I am quite happy with them so far09:27
pittimdz: Did you try again to burn a CD? Should work better now09:27
mdzpitti: I see you have not read your mail yet ;-)09:27
pittimdz: with yesterday's changes, they work really good09:28
pittimdz: no, I just got up. Stayed up too late last night; 09:28
pittimdz: I'm at the bugzilla mail stage :-)09:28
mdzpitti: see my comments in #123409:28
pittimdz: the new packages already work quite well, but there are still problems:09:30
pittimdz: for once, I experienced a hal crash yesterday; I cannot reproduce it, though09:30
pittimdz: the second thing is that hal now correctly detects volumes on raw (i. e. unpartitioned) devices09:30
pittimdz: but if you had an unpartitioned device before, and then partition it and put a new file system on the partition, hal detects _two_ volumes: sda and sda109:31
pittimdz: this causes overwriting of one volume by write operations on the other and kills the stick09:31
pittimdz: I already asked upstream about this and dived deeply into the hal code, but I was not yet able to solve that09:32
pittimdz: could you reproduce your hal crash after CD burning?09:32
mdzpitti: I never saw hal crash09:34
mdzwith the previous packages, nautilus-cd-burner crashed09:34
mdzthis time, I only saw g-v-m crash, and I think it was because of the upgrade09:34
pittimdz: Hmm, my brain told me that hal crashed yesterday; I even asked you whether you run it as --daemon=no09:35
mdzfabbione: hmm, sounds like you are finding new bugs, that does not help the bug count :-)09:35
pittimdz: but maybe this was a misunderstanding09:35
pittimdz: after installing the new packages, the user must log out and relogin09:35
mdzpitti: oh, that was unrelated09:35
mdzthe hal crash was something else09:36
pittimdz: I'm not sure how we can achieve that09:36
pittimdz: but even if it was sth else, it should not crash :-/09:36
mdzI think it was the old version of hal09:36
pittimdz: ah, so much the better :-)09:36
mdzanyway it was a corner case, powering off a USB device, much less important than #123409:37
pittimdz: there is a possibility to restart much of the user's session: killall gnome-vfs-daemon nautilus09:37
pittimdz: but I don't think that we should write this into the postinst script...09:37
mdzpitti: I did log out and log in, but I was impatient09:37
mdzand I was logging in already before the login completed09:37
mdzI am not sure at what point g-v-m starts09:37
pittimdz: pretty early09:38
mdzprobably my fault, then09:38
mdzas I said in bugzilla09:38
pittimdz: so the conclusion is: in principle they work well09:38
pittimdz: I only need to solve this corner case of a repartitioned device09:39
mdzI think the only way they will get more testing is if we put them into warty09:39
mdzpitti: yes, that sounds dangerous09:39
mdzpitti: why does it cause writes to the disk, though?  I don't understand that09:39
pittimdz: if it breaks too badly, we could upload a 0.2.98+really0.2.92 or so, not?09:39
mdzhal doesn't even have permission to write to the disk, does iT?09:39
mdzyes, we can always fix it if we find something terrible09:40
pittimdz: if both sda and sda1 are recognized as volumes, g-v-m mounts _both_09:40
pittimdz: but sda is not really a volume any more, it's just the first block (where the MBR belongs)09:40
pittimdz: so as soon as something writes to sda, it will destroy the file system on sda109:40
pittimdz: the problem is that the partition detection code in hal is wrong: it reports 0 partitions for such an USB stick09:41
mdzpitti: how can it mount sda if there is no filesystem there?09:41
pittimdz: okay, again: I format /dev/sda with VFAT  (as I used to do earlier; this works well with fstab-style mounts)09:42
pittimdz: then I come to Ubuntu and see that the old hal does not recognize raw devices09:42
mdzoh, I see, so you are switching from raw to partitions without blanking it09:42
pittimdz: so I put a partition on the stick and format it as VFAT09:42
mdzthat seems like an invalid format to me09:42
mdzthere is no way to tell which one is valid09:42
pittimdz: this alone could be regarded as a corner case, yes09:42
pittimdz: but plovs tried it yesterday with a ZIP drive (which he never touched, partitionwise)09:43
pittimdz: and also for this thing _two_ volumes were detected09:43
mdzZIP disks come with two partitions from the factory I think09:43
pittimdz: he was not able to unmount it again, file writes did not sync; he had to rip it out and reboot09:43
mdzone for PC and one for Mac, something like that09:43
pittimdz: but then they share the files written to it?09:44
pittimdz: we are able to mount both partitions... (we are too good :-) )09:44
mdzOn the other hand, ZIP disks prepared by IOMEGA utilities actually have a partition table (usually having a single entry, the fourth, spanning the whole disk, so that access to such disks with partition table goes via mounting /dev/sda4 (in the SCSI case, say)). On disks for the Mac one has 6 partitions, and again the fourth can be mounted, with filesystemtype "hfs".09:45
mdzso actually it is only one partition09:45
mdzbut it is partition #409:45
mdzI remember there was some PC/mac compatibility thing09:46
=== fabbione just discovered that HIS cdrom drive is broken
fabbionemdz: no worries :-)09:46
=== carlos [~carlos@69.Red-80-33-181.pooles.rima-tde.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel
fabbionemy cdrom is either dirty or broken09:46
mdzfabbione: well that is good news in a way09:46
fabbionebut i found a new bug in the kernel09:46
pittimdz: ah, I got a mail from plovs with his lshal listing09:46
mdzfabbione: STOP FINDING BUGS09:46
mdzfabbione: :-)09:46
=== m_tthew laughs
fabbionemdz: if i leave the cdrom tray open, when cd<something> module is loaded, it will start spawning a lot of errors09:47
fabbione(this is at boot time)09:47
fabbioneand i can reproduce it on 2 machines09:47
fabbioneif i revert to the previous kernel there are no problems09:47
mdzhmm, doesn't happen with my usb one09:47
fabbioneit's ide-cdrom probably09:47
mdzwhich previous kernel?09:47
fabbionetitle           Ubuntu, kernel 09:48
fabbionetitle           Ubuntu, kernel 09:48
mdzno ide stuff has changed since then09:48
fabbionei know...09:49
fabbionebut it's not fatal or anything09:49
fabbioneit is just scary :-)09:49
pittimdz: yep, with plov's ZIP drive both sda and sda4 are mounted09:49
mdzpitti: I suppose the safe thing is to not mount the device itself if it contains a partition table09:50
pittimdz: yep; actually this should be fixed in hal; if there are partitions, skip the raw device and do not report it as block.is_volume09:51
mdzpitti: agreed09:51
pittimdz: I try again today to fix that; if this one works, I think we could throw it at the public09:51
=== pitti shakes
mdzpitti: does the current hal in warty not have the same problem?09:52
pittimdz: it does not detect volumes on raw devices at all09:52
pittimdz: this was the sole reason why I put a patrition on my stick09:53
pittimdz: a quick fix would be to disable volumes on raw devices completely :-)09:53
mdzpitti: if that is simple and safe, I am not opposed09:57
mdzthat would let us get the new utopia into warty and then you can continue to work on the raw device problems09:57
pittimdz: we could sell it as "compatible to 0.2.92 :-)"09:57
pittimdz: it would be a dirty hack, but it should be not too intrusive/unsafe09:57
pittimdz: on every occasion where block.is_volume is set to TRUE, I would leave it to false if the device is raw09:58
pitti(that's my first idea)09:58
pittimdz: the hal code is a mess, I cannot find a clean solution quickly09:58
sjoerdpitti: is the block.no_partitions property correct on such devices ?10:02
pittisjoerd: unfortunately not10:02
pittisjoerd: at least this flag does not work properly, its always false10:03
pittisjoerd: (IIRC)10:03
sjoerdit's true on my cdrom drive10:03
pittisjoerd: the partition detection in hal is screwed, it always returns partition_count = 0 for such devices10:03
pittisjoerd: all the flags are based on this number10:03
sjoerdpitti: try moving the msdos partition detector to the beginning in the volume_id code10:05
pittisjoerd: you mean in the big switch VOLUME_ID_ALL case?10:06
sjoerdpitti: yes10:06
pittisjoerd: first probe for msdos, then for raid/ntfs?10:06
pittisjoerd: worth a try10:06
sjoerdpitti: it was moved to the end because i had an empty msdos partition signature on my /dev/sda1 :)10:07
pittisjoerd: which does not have VFAT?10:07
pittisjoerd: argh, an msdos part?10:07
sjoerdpitti: msdos partition map, not vfat of some other fs10:08
pittisjoerd: hmm; I don't like to fix a bug by unfixing another...10:08
sjoerdpitti: no it's safe. the msdos partition prober check if a partition table is empty and doesn't recognize it10:08
sjoerdpitti: see the 2004-08-23 of key siever10:09
pittisjoerd: okay, thanks for that hint. I will try that after breakfast10:09
=== sjoerd had to go shower get to the uni
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fabbionemdz: why 1805 is a major?10:40
mdzfabbione: inflated from Debian10:41
fabbionemdz: ok -> enanchement10:42
mdzhowever since the only change is to add some files to the package which are already built, i think it would be nice to have in Warty10:42
fabbionemdz: ok, i can take care of it. is that ok for you?=10:42
mdzfabbione: argh, my saved search was not including bugs marked NEEDINFO or UNCONFIRMED or PENDINGUPLOAD because those are new10:43
fabbionemdz: i only search for severity10:44
mdzso now I see 45 bugs10:44
fabbioneyou are right!10:44
mdzsearching only severity would find closed bugs too10:44
=== seb128 [~seb128@ANancy-111-1-17-129.w80-13.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #ubuntu-devel
pittiHi seb128!10:45
fabbionemdz: same here10:45
elmo_mdz: you put linux-$SUBARCH in restricted?10:45
mdzelmo_: yep10:45
fabbionemdz: ok i am on that samba stuff10:45
mdzelmo_: they depend on the restricted-modules10:45
=== elmo_ takes mdz's big hammer away
mdzelmo_: I thought hard about it, and it is pretty much the right thing10:45
mdzour default kernel offering is the combination of the image and the restricted modules10:46
mdzso the combination is restricted10:46
mdzelmo_: if you have another idea which makes more sense, I am interested10:46
=== mdz mumbles some more about how nobody cared about this when he solicited input
mdzjustdave: I think the simple search has the same bug10:48
mdzjustdave: I don't think it recognises NEEDINFO as an open state10:48
justdavemdz: ok, should be fixed now, probably have to shift-reload to dump the old js from your cache10:49
elmo_Kamion: ?10:56
elmo_mdz: low-ping about wvdial, btw10:56
elmo_and mozilla-locale10:56
elmo_oh, there's an assigned bug about the latter so nm that10:57
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mdzelmo_: what about mozilla-locale?10:59
mdzthe uninstallable stuff? yeah, that's known10:59
pittimdz: I patched gnome-system-tools for #1485 (trivial patch); can you please approve?11:00
mdzpitti: go ahead11:00
elmo_mdz: yeah11:01
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fabbionemdz: permission to upload samba for 180511:14
mdzfabbione: only for 1805, or the other samba bug also?11:14
fabbionemdz: only 180511:15
fabbioneare there more samba bugs?11:15
mdzyes, 143311:15
mdzI think that we probably need to disable sendfile by default unless there is a patch available11:15
mdzbut it needs some investigation11:15
fabbionei am reading11:17
pittimdz: yes! yes! yes! I fixed hal!!!11:17
pittimdz: sorry for the noise11:18
mdzpitti: the mounting problem?11:18
pittimdz: yep; now it correctly detects only sda111:18
pittimdz: and if there are no partitions, it still detects sda11:18
pittimdz: now it works as it should11:18
=== pitti hugs sjoerd for a great hint where to look
mdzyes, that was quick11:19
pittimdz: I prepare an updated package and put it onto my unofficial repo11:19
mdzpitti: let me know when to upgrade, and I will give it some testing11:20
mdzand then I should probably sleep11:20
pittimdz: it will take me another 20 minutes to clean my debugging stuff and prepare a clean package11:20
fabbionemdz: well i think the default should be set to no11:21
pittimdz: I will try to catch plovs to test the new package with his ZIP drive11:21
mdzfabbione: yes, I think sendfile is probably only interesting for high-volume servers and such11:22
fabbionemdz: yeah i will see what's the best way to revert the default11:23
fabbionemdz: if there is a way to change it in the code rather than in the config11:23
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mdzfabbione: I found an upstream bug report, might be worth looking at11:25
mdz(emailed to debian as well)11:25
mdzfabbione: upstream says 2.4.x is broken and 2.6.x is OK, while Debian says the reverse11:27
fabbioneyes i can see that11:27
fabbionei trust neither of them :-)11:28
fabbionewe will just switch sendfile off ;)11:28
mdzdid 3.0.6 enable it by default, while in 3.0.5 it is disabled?11:28
pittimdz: the new hal crack is up11:32
mdzpitti: the only change is this partition stuff, right?  so I shouldn't need to retest everything I did today11:32
fabbionemdz: i am not sure.. i am checking how this crack works11:32
pittimdz: yes, I only changed partition/fs detection11:32
pittimdz: even more precise, I just changed the _order_ of the detection11:33
justdavehmm...  thought...  when a bug is NEEDINFO, should we have the radio button default to "make the bug ASSIGNED" so the next time someone touches it the needinfo goes away, unless they set it to "leave as NEEDINFO" before submitting?11:33
pittimdz: now it first attempts to detect a partition table and then raw file systems11:33
seb128yes please11:33
seb128a lot of people add comment and let the bug as NEEDINFO11:33
mdzjustdave: however, another common case is for the assignee to make another comment11:34
mdzjustdave: reiterating the request for more info before closing the bug11:34
mdzand the state should not be reset in that case11:34
justdavecould change the default only if the viewer is the reporter...   but that won't work if they aren't logged in when they view it11:35
mdzI can't think of any way to DTRT automatically11:35
justdavemaybe a checkbox right next to the comment area "I am providing the requested information"11:36
mdzjustdave: that sounds reasonable11:37
mdzpitti: hmm, it seems unhappy11:37
mdzpitti: I plugged in my card reader and it isn't appearing in hal11:37
justdaveor with the default radio button change, you could assume the assignee is more likely to remember to change it to "leave as NEEDINFO" before submitting11:37
pittimdz: you need to relogin11:38
pittimdz: if hal is restarted, this gnome stuff stops to work 11:38
pittimdz: (I assume because of the lost dbus connection)11:38
mdzpitti: this is not gnome stuff; it doesn't show up in lshal11:38
mdzbut I did logout and login11:38
pittimdz: hmm. Had it partitions before?11:38
pittimdz: can you please replug?11:39
mdzpitti: it has a single partition11:39
pittimdz: I also noticed that: the very first time after package upgrade my devices are not recognized as wekk11:39
pittimdz: s/wekk/well/11:39
pittimdz: I have no idea why11:39
mdzI have replugged several times11:39
mdzno change11:39
pittimdz: damn11:39
mdzpitti: I think that the init script is buggy11:40
pittimdz: of hal?11:40
mdzpitti: when running /etc/init.d/dbus-1 restart, hal is not restarted11:40
mdzhal      22730  0.0  2.6  8048 6776 ?        Ss   Sep28   0:09 /usr/sbin/hald --drop-privileges11:40
mdzthat is the old hald process from before the upgrade11:40
pittimdz: stop and start should work11:40
pittimdz: but thanks for that hint, I will look at the dbus init script11:41
mdzmdz@potpal:~ $ sudo /etc/init.d/dbus-1 stop11:41
mdz * Stopping system message bus...11:41
mdz * Stopping Hardware Abstraction Layer...                                [ ok ] 11:41
mdzmdz@potpal:~ $ !ps11:41
mdzps aux | grep hald11:41
mdzhal      22730  0.0  2.6  8048 6776 ?        Ss   Sep28   0:09 /usr/sbin/hald --drop-privileges11:41
pittistill the old process...11:41
mdz/var/run/hal/ is empty11:41
mdzI assume there should be a pid file in there11:41
mdzperhaps it was deleted by the failed restart11:41
pittiindeed, it should11:41
pittiit is from start-stop-daemon11:41
pittinext thing on my TODO list :-)11:42
mdzI will restart it by hand so I can test11:42
mdzyes, restarting hald let it pick up the device11:42
=== pitti is greatly relieved
mdzI had a similar problem before11:43
mdzbut I blamed it on g-v-m11:43
pittimdz: so dbus tries to stop hald, but that fails somehow?11:43
mdzpitti: it displays [ok] , but apparently does not succeed11:44
mdzfabbione: X is segfaulting on me :-(11:44
mdzfabbione: sabdfl was seeing this, too (should be in scrollback)11:44
mdzoh, I know what it is11:45
mdzI installed nvidia-glx11:45
mdzto test that bug11:45
sabdflmdz: my glitch was fglrx11:45
pittimdz: odd, the init script works for me...11:45
mdzfabbione: apparently, if nvidia-glx is installed, it breaks the X server even if it is using ati11:45
mdzpitti: try it with a package upgrade11:45
fabbionemdz: ah11:46
fabbionemdz: going back to send file11:46
pittimdz: okay, I can reproduce it11:46
fabbionevn diff -r 1312:1262 svn://svnanon.samba.org/samba/tr11:46
fabbionesvn diff -r 1312:1262 svn://svnanon.samba.org/samba/trunk/source/param/11:47
=== chestie [~chestie@dsl-202-173-130-86.nsw.westnet.com.au] has left #ubuntu-devel ["Leaving"]
fabbionethat's the commit that turns on sendfile by default11:47
fabbionei can just revert it11:47
mdzpitti: hal is not finding my partition volume :-(11:47
fabbionemdz: if that's ok with you11:47
pittimdz: on the card reader?11:47
mdzfabbione: that is fine, also fine to change in the config file11:48
mdzpitti: correct11:48
mdzpitti: the volume does not seem to show up at all11:48
fabbionemdz: there is no need to change the config file11:48
fabbionemdz: a user that wants sendfile will have to explicitly say so11:48
fabbioneotherwise it's off11:48
mdzpitti: ok, so I logged out11:50
mdzpitti: shut down dbus/hal11:50
mdzpitti: started dbus/hal11:50
mdzpitti: logged in11:50
mdzand now it works11:50
mdzperfectly, just as before11:50
sabdfllamont: mdz: im getting a ton of postfix errors in syslog after a fresh install11:51
sabdflseems related to /etc/aliases.db not being present11:51
mdzyes, me too11:51
mdzSep 29 02:51:05 localhost postfix/local[13672] : fatal: open database /etc/aliases.db: No such file or directory11:51
mdzSep 29 09:51:06 localhost postfix/master[3624] : warning: process /usr/lib/postfix/local pid 13672 exit status 111:51
mdzSep 29 09:51:06 localhost postfix/master[3624] : warning: /usr/lib/postfix/local: bad command startup -- throttling11:51
sabdflpitti: also, hald has a habit of suckng 99% cpu for a few minutes on startup11:52
mdzfabbione: sounds fine11:52
pittisabdfl: minutes? another thing I cannot reproduce :-(11:52
fabbionesamba (3.0.7-1ubuntu3) warty; urgency=low11:52
fabbione  * Apply patch from https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=180511:52
fabbione    and start shipping mount.cifs.11:52
fabbione    (Closes: #1805/#227791)11:52
fabbione  * Set sendfile default to no, reverting upstream change:11:52
fabbione    svn diff -r 1262:1312 \11:52
fabbione    svn://svnanon.samba.org/samba/trunk/source/param/loadparm.c11:52
fabbione    (Closes: #1433/#261917)11:52
pittisabdfl: you also have the most recent hal package? 11:53
fabbionemdz: permission to upload ;)11:53
mdzfabbione: yes11:53
pittisabdfl: 0.2.98-1ubuntu2?11:53
mdzpitti: I think it has always done this11:53
mdzit is the getty/vc/hotplug/hal race11:54
mdzall 6 consoles do it at once11:54
pittimdz: ah, this would explain it11:54
sabdflmdz: is the postfix problem a known one?11:54
pittimdz: I think the source of this is udev, isn't it?11:54
fabbionemdz: going back to the X <-> nv problem... 11:55
fabbionemdz: it means that X segfaults with nvidia-glx installed?11:55
fabbionemdz: indipendently of the driver?11:56
mdzfabbione: correct11:56
fabbionemdz: hold on a sec11:56
mdzfabbione: easy way to reproduce for me: apt-get install nvidia-glx, then log out of GNOME11:56
mdzX doesn't come back11:56
mdzpurge nvidia-glx -> OK again11:56
fabbionePackage: nvidia-glx11:57
fabbioneStatus: install ok installed11:57
fabbionei am running ubuntu2211:57
mdzthis is using Driver "ati"11:57
fabbioneand i am in X11:57
fabbionei am not using nvidia binary driver11:57
fabbionei am using the nv free driver11:57
mdzperhaps someone else here can try with a non-nvidia card11:58
fabbionethat's an option11:58
m_tthewI have an ati11:58
fabbioneotherwise we should really install nvidia stuff only if there is an nvidia card11:58
fabbionem_tthew: can you try installing nvidia-glx and the latest X packages?11:58
m_tthewapt-get install nvidia-glx ; logout. see what happens?11:58
m_tthewfabbione: absolutely. lemme update && dist-upgrade11:58
fabbionemdz: and btw the last upload didn't change anything fancy on the driver side11:59
fabbionem_tthew: thanks11:59
fabbionemdz: it was only a fix contained into the nv driver11:59
mdzfabbione: yes, I remember11:59
mdzi don't think it is specific to the latest X11:59
mdzI have never tried installing nvidia-glx before (obviously I had no use for it)12:00
mdzpitti: yes, udev is at the core of the problem12:01
mdzgetty needs to learn to wait for udev I think12:01
m_tthewfabbione: ii  xserver-xfree8 4.3.0.dfsg.1-6 the XFree86 X server12:01
fabbionem_tthew: are you on Debian or Ubuntu?12:01
m_tthewfabbione: so, I should apt-get install nvidia-glx and the n logout, login to gnome to test?12:01
m_tthewfabbione: ubuntu12:02
fabbionem_tthew: that it should be -6ubuntu2212:02
m_tthewI am on amd64, if that is a factor here12:02
fabbionem_tthew: logout -> switch to console -> stop gdm -> start gdm12:02
mdzthere is no nvidia-glx for amd6412:02
fabbionem_tthew: ah12:02
mdzyou'd need an i38612:02
fabbionenever mind12:02
m_tthewI can test x8612:03
m_tthew"give me about 20 minutes12:03
fabbionem_tthew: thanks12:03
mdzI knew this nvidia binary driver was crack, but I did not realize the extent12:04
mdzbreaking things when you don't even use it12:04
mdzit will need to be some kind of taint flag in all bug reports12:04
m_tthewmdz: the binary driver thing is such a drag and I didn't really grok that until I read all this stuff about nvidia12:04
m_tthewfabbione: np, just waiting on the iso; it is my pleasure to help12:05
fabbionem_tthew: i really really appreciate it12:05
mdzwe will collect all such bug reports in a special place and point people there when they ask about binary drivers12:05
m_tthewfabbione: daily iso the right stuff?12:05
m_tthewmdz: haha12:06
m_tthewfabbione: more like 45 minutes, but we'll get there12:06
fabbionemdz: daily iso should do fine, otherwise install from the net ;)12:08
=== m_tthew smiles
m_tthewI'll do the mini-iso to make this as fast as possible12:09
fabbionem_tthew: don't worry12:10
fabbionetake the time you need12:10
sabdflmdz: the only postfix bug i can find that mentions aliases is not the one about /etc/aliases.db not be there12:10
fabbionei need to get some food and take a shower12:10
elmo_will the gnome auto-magic stuff not work for my camera if it uses usb-storage?12:10
mdzsabdfl: yes, I think that one is still around12:11
elmo_('cos it appears as /dev/sda1)12:11
mdzelmo_: by default, it'll launch the photo application, which should DTRT12:11
mdzelmo_: if it doesn't, you can uncheck the box for that, and it'll just mount it instead12:12
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azeembtw, gnoppix really uses ubuntu GNOME packages in their latest beta, dunno if somebody tried it already, I did last night12:13
fabbioneoh fuck.. i just closed 2 bugs and debzilla reports one more12:15
fabbionemdz: 1872 - 1881: duplicates?12:17
fabbioneor should we leave them separate (for $arch)12:18
=== fabbione goes and get some food
mdzfabbione: I am not sure if they are the same bug or not12:22
mdzeven if they are both missing discover data, they are probabyl different devices which need to be added12:22
fabbionegood night12:31
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pittimdz: good night!12:37
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rosspitti: does eject use pmount etc now?12:58
fabbionedaniels: ping01:08
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sivangHi fabbione01:08
fabbionehi sivang 01:08
sivangI'd like to continue the Xfree discussion, #ubuntu then?01:08
fabbionesivang: yes, but i am almost off for today01:09
fabbionesivang: woke at 4:50 am and it's almost 13:10 ;)01:09
m_tthewwhomever made the pxe installer Just Work, I owe you a pint.01:10
sivangfabbione : boy why so early?01:10
=== m_tthew . o O ( because apparently I have more functional eepros than I do functional cd burners )
sivangm_tthew : you still need to config mac address on the server? :)01:10
fabbionesivang: insomnia01:11
m_tthewsivang: dhcp server? yes, but I have one of those and I've been doing pxe installs of open&netbsd all week01:11
m_tthewsivang: sooo ... it was more of a filename ""; change than a MAC thing :)01:11
m_tthewfabbione: before you go, what bug # is this nvidia library mess I am working to duplicate?01:12
sivangm_tthew : i want to do the same! (I've been fighting with PXE for 2 days and gave up, even with mac address it didn't work)01:12
fabbionem_tthew: no bug number.01:12
fabbionem_tthew: they told me here on irc01:12
fabbionem_tthew: i know as much as you do :)01:12
m_tthewfabbione: delightful :) ; I'll mail mdz, what should I cc: you at?01:12
pittiross: npmccallum said so, yes (sorry for the delay; lunch break)01:13
fabbionem_tthew: you need to install nvidia-glx and see if X crashes given that you are not using a nvidia card01:13
m_tthewfabbione : yeah, I understand (logout, restart gdm after apt-get install nvidia-glx)01:13
rosspitti: when i do eject /dev/sda to "eject" my ipod, it blocks until i physically unplug. the old eject returned straight away so i could still charge01:13
pittiross: I did not touch that package, but I can take a look at it; can you please file a bug?01:14
fabbionem_tthew: that's it :-)01:14
m_tthewsivang: for me, the key has always been a host <hostname> { hardware ethernet <MAC>; address <IP>; filename "pxelinux.0"; next-server <my tftp server IP>; }; block in dhcpd.conf01:15
pittiross: I'm currently busy with fixing hal, and that's high priority :-/01:15
m_tthewfabbione: ack, will email mdz with results, can CC: you once you give me an email address.01:15
rosspitti: sure01:15
pittiross: thanks01:15
fabbionem_tthew: fabbione@canonical.com01:15
pittiross: please assign it straigt to me (martin.pitt@canonical.com)01:15
sivangfabbione : any tasty X bugs to reproduce if we arelady talking about it? :-)01:16
fabbionesivang: not really because you have a nvidia card01:17
m_tthewfabbione: ack, will CC:01:17
fabbionem_tthew: thanks01:17
sivangfabbione : Ah! Darn, I knew I would be better off with ATI ;->01:17
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pittiross: nautilus really shows "eject" instead of "unmount" in the context menu for your iPod?01:26
pittiross: and this hangs?01:26
=== pitti has to go to the city to have his broken TFT repaired :-(
pittisee you later, guys01:37
thominterdiff -z mozilla-firefox_0.99+1.0PR-0ubuntu3.diff.gz mozilla-firefox_0.99+1.0PR-0ubuntu4.diff.gz|wc -l01:39
thommore interestingly:01:40
thominterdiff -z mozilla-firefox_0.99+1.0PR-0ubuntu3.diff.gz mozilla-firefox_0.99+1.0PR-0ubuntu4.diff.gz|grep "^-|^\+\+" |wc -l01:40
thomgo mozilla, your distclean target works really well01:40
elmo_should I have to 'pmount /dev/sda1' or should it automagically mount?01:42
rosselmo_: my ipod automatically mounts if it isn't plugged in when gnome starts01:42
rossif its in when i boot it doesn't01:42
elmo_do hal/dbus write logs anywhere?01:46
lamontanybody know what CD image sabdfl was seeing the aliases.db issue with?01:49
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=== lamont notes that dh_shllibdeps running on the X libraries is a _DOG_.
lamontseb128: is moz-firefox yours?02:11
lamontnope.  thombos02:11
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lamontKamion: I got tired of "fixing" it. :-(02:26
=== lamont prepares to upload a new-and-improved debootstrap for t-bone
Kamionlamont: including ia64?02:30
=== lamont fatfingered and said 'without_package' instead of 'subst_package'
Kamioncan you make sure the changes are done via the required-base.py script?02:31
lamontbad juju02:31
Kamionadding 'exclude-ia64: hfsplus hfsutils libhfsp0' and excludes for the bootloader to warty.overrides should get you started, and you'll need to suck the right bits of the base system down into warty.base02:32
Kamionthis way just means that it's maintainable automatically from germinate output02:32
lamontKamion: I'm still just bootstrapping the chroot...02:32
lamontthis is in warty.overrides, yes?02:33
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lamontrequired-ia64: libc6.102:34
lamontexclude-ia64: libc602:34
lamontlike that?02:34
Kamiondon't need to exclude-ia64 that, since it isn't present on ia6402:36
Kamionyou could just add libc6.1 to required in fact, less maintenance for alpha later :)02:37
lamontah, ok.02:37
lamontwhat about warty.base: does it need to clone the entries?02:37
lamontor is it autogenerated?02:37
Kamionwarty.base should contain what germinate spits out for your architecture02:37
Kamionin 'base'02:37
Kamion    < base tail -n +3 | head -n -2 | cut -d' ' -f1 | xargs >> "$OUT"02:37
Kamioner, prefixed with base-ia64: of course02:39
Kamionlamont: might be best to get permission to add all the ia64 entries back to the seeds?02:40
Kamionshould just be kernels and bootloaders and stuff02:40
lamontKamion: yeah, but that's not really a warty thing...02:40
Kamionyeah, but it'll make it manageable :)02:41
lamontpoint.  I'll chat with jdub/mdz later today about it.02:41
lamontbut t-bone will be the one finding most of the missing packages...02:41
Kamion(normally, updating the debootstrap package for a seed change is a one-command operation for me)02:41
Kamionediting the script by hand was too error-prone02:42
lamontdoes the script build foo.buildd as well?02:42
lamontor just foo?02:42
Kamionjust foo at the moment02:43
Kamioncould be updated02:43
lamontKamion: although that probably requires a buildd seed?02:44
Kamionor manual overrides for what goes in the buildd base02:45
Kamionyou want the same required and a different base, right?02:45
lamontbuildd's required is quite a bit shorter too02:46
Kamionoh, ok02:46
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Kamionmight be worthwhile having the buildd list seeded somewhere, I guess, for buildd-ng ...02:47
lamonton that note, I think I'll leave it with the warty.overrides changes (libc6.1 in required, exclude-ia64 entry), and let t-bone come up with the rest of the edits as he actually bootstraps ia64.02:48
lamontBuild needed 07:46:14, 4467964k disk space02:48
=== lamont beats fabbione and daniels with the build log
T-Bonelamont: gcc-3.4 won't build02:49
T-Bonelamont: and my box is fucked up. Awaiting aw to see with him whether he wants to take a look at it02:50
T-Bonelamont: i'm setting up another one on a zx200002:50
lamontT-Bone: ok.  I'm up to dealing with gtk+2.0, etc.02:50
T-Bonelamont: well; if you have a workaround that would allow me to bootstrap stage2 without gcc-3.4, that'd be nice02:50
lamontT-Bone: fwiw, stage2 chroot debootstrapped with just gcc-3.3, coreutils, and perl carried forward.02:51
T-Bonecare to tell me how to do that? ;)02:51
lamontln snapshot/*3.3.4-2*_ia64.deb stage102:51
lamontthen rename *%3a*3.3.4* to *:*3.3.4*02:52
lamontand smashArchive02:52
=== lamont points at rule 2.
lamont(rule 1 being "never get involved with someone more messed up than yourself" :-)02:52
Kamionis rule 2 broken as often as rule 1?02:53
lamontKamion: rule 2 is the prefix to each step of the process: "Do whatever it takes to ..."02:53
lamontbootstrapping an architecture is an _UGLY_ business. :-)02:53
T-Bonelamont: come to think of it, your trick is ugly: we're not going to bootstrap stage2 against clean warty binaries, that way...02:54
lamontright.  It's actually stage 1.502:54
T-Boneconsidering how often i kill my boxes... (who said ia64 had a stable kernel??)02:54
lamontwe declare stage 2 as soon as we can debootstrap _WITHOUT_ sarge binaries.02:54
lamont 06:54:48 up 15 days, 10:05,  2 users,  load average: 0.10, 0.58, 1.0102:54
lamontand that was a power outage02:54
T-Bonelamont: itanium1?02:55
T-Bonelamont: that doesn't count02:55
T-Bonei2000 _IS_ stable02:55
T-Bonei can kill pretty well any itanium2 box02:55
lamontI'll remember that02:55
T-Bonelamont: remember my killing-fu ;)02:55
T-Bonelamont: did you succeed on building perl eventually?02:56
lamonter, and perl.02:56
T-Bonegive me 5mn to finish the setup on the zx200002:57
lamont<lamont> T-Bone: fwiw, stage2 chroot debootstrapped with just gcc-3.3, coreutils, and perl carried forward.02:57
T-Bonehmm right. I didn't catch the meaning of "carried forward" in the first place02:57
T-Bonelamont: there's an interesting mail from thierry awaiting moderator approval on u-devel, fyi ;)02:57
=== lamont pokes jdub
lamontKamion: so with libc6.1 in required, I shouldn't need to add the subst_package to warty.template, correct?03:01
T-Bonelamont: is db.d.o deadN03:02
lamontlooks that way from here, but that'd be that other channel... :)03:02
T-Bonelamont: it's just that i can't fetch sbuild :P03:03
lamontwonder if it's one of these machines in disguise: down until further notice: raff, debussy, rameau, bruckner, lully03:03
=== lamont lobs a copy - which architecture?
T-Bonelamont: db is newsamosa03:04
lamonthrm.. no copy lying around on caballero.03:05
=== T-Bone guesses that's a "n", fetches mail ;)
T-BoneFrom:Debian/IA64 non-US Build Daemon <buildd@caballero.debian.org>03:11
=== T-Bone ^5s ladude ;)
=== lamont can't type
T-Boneshit happens ;^)03:13
lamontthis happens, you mean?? :-)03:13
T-Bonelamont: i guess i should run your script before doing the symlink stuff, right?03:14
lamontwhat symlink stuff?03:14
T-Boneln snapshot/ ...03:14
lamontdo _you_ see a -s there?03:14
lamont(apache won't follow symlinks...03:15
T-Boneright, i misexpressed myself03:15
T-Boneanywya, should i run your script first?03:15
lamontsmashArchive creates Packages, so you'll need to do it after each change to the archive directory03:15
T-Boneoic, smashArchive is your script03:16
T-Bonei didn't have its name in the mail, since it's inlined, my stupid webmail won't show the filename03:16
lamontpoor name, but it was late...03:16
lamontdebootstrap uses Filename, but requires Release and an md5sum for Packages03:17
lamontanything else from you (or anyone else, for that matter) before I disappear for a few hours?03:18
lamontKamion: I assume sounder 8 was pre-"seen debootstrap", yes?03:19
lamontT-Bone: mind you, I _tried_ symlinks first, too. :-)03:20
T-Bonelamont: heh03:20
Kamionlamont: was observing that rule 1 is broken just under half the time :)03:21
Kamionlamont: hmm, actually this might be tricky ...03:21
T-Bonelamont: asa aw has settled with my buggy box, i'll wipe /home out and rebuild it03:22
Kamionlamont: making libc6 be per-arch required (and therefore later in the required list) has been known to break things in Debian03:22
T-Bonelamont: i hope i'll have less troubles with stage 1.5. I'll only be building missing packages, for stage 1.5, i guess (gcc-3.4, perl & coreutils)?03:23
Kamionlamont: maybe sticking with the subst_package hack for now, given how close we are to warty, would be a better plan03:23
Kamionlamont: pre-"seen debootstrap"? don't understand03:23
lamontKamion: before your fix that I need for postfix03:24
Kamionlamont: everything's before that fix, since it doesn't exist except in my home directory yet ...03:25
=== Kamion is building a mirror in order to test it at the moment
lamontKamion: hence my assumption03:26
lamontKamion: rule 1 is broken in 100% of relationships. :-)03:27
lamontgenerally only by one party, though. :-)03:27
T-Bonelamont: sbuild postinst is silly: doesn't check for a proxy, btw03:31
lamontsbuild assumes a functional (and apt-get update'd) chroot03:31
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T-Bonelamont: nah03:31
T-Bonei'm talking about the package postinst03:31
lamontsbuild's postinst shouldn't be fetching anything, I thought.03:32
lamontor you mean /etc/source-depend*03:32
T-Boneit's trying to run update-sourcedeps, which fails if no direct internet connection is possible03:32
=== lamont changed the wget to a touch
lamontwell,actually :>03:32
lamontubuntu doesn't believe in hacking around broken source packages03:32
lamontthe mantra is "fix the package, don't kludge it"03:33
T-Bonethis sounds good to me ;)03:33
lamonthrm...  I think I fixed our sbuild package...03:33
lamontyeah, but we have more ftbfs's that way...03:33
lamontT-Bone: off to the shower, will try to kick a gcc-3.4 build off on my chroot before I run away03:35
T-Bonelamont: that'd be nice, just in case i fail ;)03:35
=== lamont needs to go run several errands in town today, will be gone for some time.
lamontmaking the change to the sources.list line for my archive should get you where I am.03:36
lamontwell, a few hours later, damn throttles.03:36
T-Bonelamont: woops, i wiped out your home on envy, i'll rebuild your .ssh folder03:37
lamontthus reminding us of the meaning of "crash and burn" machine.03:37
T-Boneenvy:~# journal_bmap_R618276b0: journal block not found at offset 3334 on sd(8,7)03:37
T-BoneAborting journal on device sd(8,7).03:37
=== T-Bone considers the system as dead
lamontback in a few, then will be gone...03:37
pittijdub: #1769, permission to upload?04:13
=== lamont wanders off for a few hours.
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=== T-Bone wonders who's moderating u-devel
=== lamont bets it's jdub
T-Bonelamont: dude; i thought you were off!04:59
lamontyeah, well...  I got distracted.04:59
T-Bonelamont: i'm building gcc-3.4 on my own too, just in case ;)04:59
lamontreally going to leave shortly04:59
=== lamont runs off to save his marriage.
lamont(or she'll kill me..)05:00
T-Bonelamont: i know that feeling ;^)05:00
=== T-Bone is not married, tho ;)
lamontand you haven't met my wife. :)05:01
Kamionhm, that's odd, the diff between debootstraps with old and new debconf only consists of newly set values, not newly set seen flags05:04
trukulofabbione, e u there?05:04
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Kamionoh, DUH05:08
Kamionmissing 'export'05:08
Kamionnow notes *don't* get marked as seen, but everything else does?!05:19
Kamionoh, of course, I turned off DEBCONF_ADMIN_EMAIL05:29
mykcarlos: ping05:35
carlosmyk: pong05:36
mykis there any way to distinguish between releases in mirroring the package archive?05:36
mykwell, i guess my question is05:37
mykwill the growth in size be in the package archive or the ISO archive?05:37
carlosmyk: I don't know those details05:37
mykcarlos: who should I ask?05:37
carlosor perhaps mdz, I'm not sure05:38
elmo_carlos: yeah?05:39
carloselmo_: myk is preparing a ubuntu mirror05:39
carlosand wants to mirror only warty05:39
carlosbut not hoary 05:39
elmo_unfortunately there isn't an easy way to do that - the easiest solution is probably 'debmirror'05:39
elmo_that should at least be in 'universe'05:39
mykelmo_: the problem is limited space.  i only have about 25 gigs to play with05:40
elmo_myk: it's a mirroring script that allows you to mirror by suite (== warty, hoary etc.)05:40
elmo_myk: we're going to be changing the mirror layout, RSN so that it'll drop to more like 12Gb05:40
trukulowhy not rsync?05:40
elmo_trukulo: debmirror can use rsync05:40
mykelmo_: i've never heard of RSN.  what is it?05:41
elmo_myk: basically archive.ubuntu.com will become 'main' (6Gb)+cdimages (4Gb)  and universe.ubuntu.com will contain the real space killer (17Gb)05:41
elmo_myk: ==> Real Soon Now05:41
trukuloelmo_: ok05:42
mykelmo_: ahh, okay.  sounds like i should just wait until that happens05:42
mykelmo_: will that be announced on any of the ubuntu lists?05:42
trukulomyk, you can mirror main part only, if you want05:42
trukuloand let universe out05:42
elmo_myk: yes, before and after05:43
elmo_(to pre-warn existing mirrors)05:43
mykwhich list? devel?05:43
elmo_myk: both, and -announce if we have it (I can't recall off hand)05:43
Kamionthe preview release announcement went to -announce I believe05:44
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elmo_myk: what trukulo suggests is also an option, btw - it's as easy as adding --exclude=universe/ to the rsync command line05:50
trukuloelmo_: you need to write that in wiki05:50
trukuloof course, when you are ready for that05:51
mykelmo_: /pool/universe, eh?05:53
elmo_yeah, that's what's taking all the space05:54
sivangwe ought to find a way to make nv use 100hz for ver refresh rate on FLATRONs05:54
sivangalthough I have overcome my flickering problem, was a nasty AC adaptor that caused this.05:54
mykoof.  20 k/s.  this'll take a bit06:03
Kamionanyone GNOMEish notice that evolution failed to build?06:10
Kamionlamont: marking noninteractive questions as seen during debootstrap doesn't seem to have any effect on postfix at all06:12
Kamionlamont: I suspect they're being asked at a priority lower than high06:12
elmo_kamion: am I good to remove old kernels?06:14
Kamionelmo_: aye06:15
trukuloumm, how can we put new packages in ubuntu?06:16
trukuloas atmel wireless drivers06:16
trukulolike this one: http://at76c503a.berlios.de/06:17
=== T-Bone wonders whether Gnome crashing after an upgrade is actually a "feature"
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npmccallumtrukulo: the atmel drivers are already in Ubuntu06:31
trukulonpmccallum, not these one06:32
npmccallumtrukulo: they are in the 2.6 kernel upstream and the firmware is in our kernel package06:32
trukulothese one are for USB wifi cards06:32
trukuloas mine06:32
trukuloi can compile it, it's not a problem06:32
trukulobut it would be better to be in a repository06:32
npmccallumtrukulo: send an email to the dev list propsing that we add it to the linux-restricted-modules package.  It probably won't go in until Hoary though (we are in deep freeze)06:34
trukulonpmccallum, umm, the good ones are in CVS, i'm afraid06:35
trukuloforget it, too much problems06:35
npmccallumwhy is that a problem? We are using the madwifi drivers from CVS06:36
trukuloah, so i'll send email06:36
npmccallumthat package is not supported anyway, so if there is a bug, tough luck :)  Its provided as a convenience06:36
trukulo:) yes, i understand06:37
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thommdz: marnin'07:54
Kamionmdz: anyone looking at fixing the evolution build failure? #ubuntu is buzzing about it07:56
mdzKamion: I have only begun reading bugzilla mail07:56
mdzI didn't know we had a new evolution yet either07:57
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mdzis seb not aware of it?07:57
KamionI think he's gone for the day; his upload failed to build07:58
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Kamionseb128: ah, you're back08:08
Kamionmdz: #1618, ping?08:08
Kamionseb128: you know about the evolution build failure?08:08
seb128Kamion: no08:09
seb128just looking on the build log08:10
Kamionyou do now I guess :)08:10
Kamionunfortunately it makes evolution uninstallable so #ubuntu has been confused08:10
seb128yes, ok, need to bump the depends on libgtkhtml08:11
seb128fixing right now08:11
seb128still the same problem with eds/evolution08:11
mdzKamion: sorry, I thought I gave blanket approval for discover1-data updates. go ahead08:13
mdz(additions anyway; those are pretty low-risk)08:14
Kamionalrighty, thanks08:14
mdzKamion: do you intend to run the 1781 patch by joeyh?08:15
Kamionhe's fine with the general idea, but yeah, I'll drop the bug a mail08:16
mdzKamion: I stared at the debconf patch a bit, and it seems right08:17
mdzdebootstrap stuff is obviously correct08:18
Kamionit turned out to be a hairier problem than I'd expected08:18
mdzhaving to add all those noninteractive modules is...unfortunate08:18
Kamionwe need to do the same DEBCONF_ADMIN_EMAIL thing in debian-installer-utils, BTW, but that's a separate bug08:18
Kamionshould squash all those /dead.letter complaints08:19
mdzKamion: any clever way I can verify the fix for #1895 (alsa-base modprobe thing)?08:22
mdzI'd like to verify that debootstrap works, but I don't have a local mirror or such08:22
Kamionah, it's awkward without a local mirror08:22
Kamionyou could debootstrap on a Debian system and then install the new .deb, that might do it08:22
Kamionmdz: alternatively send me the patch and I'll try it out08:23
KamionI'm well set up to do that kind of thing after the debconf/debootstrap testing08:23
trukulomdz, using qemu08:26
trukulothere's a "installing ubuntu in qemu" in the wiki08:26
Kamiontrukulo: wouldn't be any easier08:26
trukuloKamion, just a hint, don't know the problem08:27
Kamiontrukulo: mdz is asking for an easy way to inject a single modified package into the base system08:27
Kamiontrukulo: for the problem at hand, debootstrap is already considerably easier than qemu08:27
mdzKamion: trivial patch for 1895 sent to you08:27
trukuloumm, i agree08:27
mdzKamion: thanks for spotting that; I had run into that but couldn't see past the end of my nose08:28
trukulodebootstrap is easier for that than qemu (and faster)08:28
mdzKamion: I thought it was update-modules which was bombing, and meant to look at it later08:28
Kamiontrukulo: and more likely to show up the problem to boot, since qemu would probably have you using the Ubuntu kernel08:28
mdz(it would be nice if the module-init-tools tools printed their names with errors...)08:28
Kamionmdz: it was kind of a guess that modprobe was failing, I hadn't really dug into it08:29
trukuloKamion, well qemu it's an emulation of a machine, you can install debian in suse i.e. but uses ubuntu kernel08:30
trukulo(i'm not very good at english, forgive me if i am understanding wrong)08:30
trukulosorry, you can install debian in suse, and uses debian kernel in qemu08:30
mdzKamion: well, it was obvious once you said it, because I added modprobe commands to postinst08:30
Kamiontrukulo: sure, but then you'd have to construct some kind of installation image with the Debian kernel, probably a bunch of Debian udebs to cope with that, and the Ubuntu base system; I doubt it would work very well at all.08:31
Kamion(and it would take somebody who knew the installer very well to do it)08:31
mdztrukulo: if you look at #1895, it should be clear why debootstrap is a better test environment08:31
trukulogoing to see #189508:31
mdzqemu wouldn't exhibit the problem because it only happens in a chroot with no kernel installed in it08:31
Kamiontrukulo: I'm familiar with qemu, and it is indeed cool08:32
trukulo:) just trying to help08:32
trukuloah, i see08:33
trukulohere qemu has nothing to do08:33
trukulook, ok, i'll get the idea08:33
trukuloit's only debootstrap related, ok08:34
Mithrandirmdz: pong08:38
=== T-Bone is now known as T-None
mdzMithrandir: wanted to try to get more info out of you about that futex problem08:51
mdzbut need to reboot, brb08:51
Kamionjustdave: um, I don't seem to be able to select a component that isn't in the first page of the scrolly drop-down box thing08:53
KamionI know what the component *is*, why can't I just type it?08:53
Kamiona single click on the scrollbar makes the drop-down disappear08:54
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mdzif firefox could save and restore all its tabs as part of my gnome session, I would be such a happy guy08:58
trukulomdz, no, but you can save a "group of tabs"08:58
trukuloi imagine you know that08:59
mdzI had been using the tabbrowser extensions to do that sort of thing08:59
mdzbut it broke with some firefox upgrade08:59
trukulofirefox can make it without extensions, as i know08:59
Mithrandirmdz: opera does that for me, one of the reasons I'm sticking with it.08:59
Mithrandirmdz: what do you want me to debug wrt the futex bug?09:00
mdzI believe the word is BONG09:00
mdzMithrandir: find out what caused it to start happening, and why it doesn't happen to anyone else? :-)09:00
Mithrandirmdz: strace makes the problem go away; we don't have snapshot.ubuntu.com, do we?09:00
=== Kamion resorts to w3m to reassign that bug
mdzMithrandir: we don't have it all apt-ified and nice, but we have copies of all packages09:01
trukulomdz, if you save bookmarks in a folder09:01
trukuloyou can open folder directly09:02
trukuloand there you have, grouped tabs09:02
trukuloMithrandir, same for you09:02
trukuloright button on folder and: open in tabs09:02
Mithrandirtrukulo: bookmarks don't preserve history.09:03
Mithrandirso it's useless.09:03
Mithrandirand it's a large number of clicks when I restart the browser, which is annoying.09:03
Mithrandirmdz: can I get to them?  If so, I could install into another drive on the same machine and do a binary search.. possibly, at least.09:04
trukuloMithrandir, that's right09:04
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Mithrandirmdz: assuming that the patch in http://lists.debian.org/debian-amd64/2004/08/msg00162.html works for fixing autofs -- permission to upload? (#1880)09:08
mdzMithrandir: yes09:14
mdzMithrandir: regarding the morgue, you'll need to ask elmo09:15
Kamionmdz: Setting up alsa-base (1.0.5a-1ubuntu5) ...09:15
KamionI: Configuring alsa-base...09:15
KamionFATAL: Could not load /lib/modules/2.6.8-powerpc/modules.dep: No such file or directory09:15
mdzMithrandir: I'd try backing out your kernel first09:15
Kamionbut it then continues successfully09:15
Kamion(as expected)09:15
mdzah, phew09:15
mdzthanks for the test09:16
Mithrandirmdz: iirc, it's the one I installed with.09:16
Kamionhm, I'd like to have the component name listed in bug lists09:17
mdzMithrandir: oh, you've never let apt upgrade your kernel?09:17
mdzKamion: yeah, that's a weird bugzilla-land difference09:17
MithrandirI don't think so, but I don't remember, this is just my workstation at the university.09:17
Mithrandirmdz: I can look at it when I sit down tomorrow09:18
mdzMithrandir: ok, thanks09:18
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T-Bonelamont: ping?09:21
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mdzKamion: any reason not to move pcmcia-cs out to ShipSeed for the next daily?09:25
Kamionmdz: not that I know of09:26
thommdz: permission to upload for #1349 ?09:28
mdzthom: yes, thanks09:29
thommdz: ta.09:29
Kamion#1826 raises a good point, distinct from the very-hard-to-solve general problem of figuring out whether all partitions are big enough09:30
thomalthough space is no longer at a premium, so it's not so urgent to get rid of source packages :-)09:30
Kamionmdz: mind if I make archive-copier stop copying Supported? It's useless until we have better integration in base-config to set up a proper apt archive for it, and all it achieves right now is to eat space by copying stuff that will just be deleted later09:30
mdzKamion: right09:31
mdzno objection09:31
mdzsamba-common just asked me a bunch of questions when it was upgraded09:33
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sivangwhat's the state of the FAT32 fsck bug?10:14
sivangor it's bug#10:14
Kamionsivang: see ubuntu-users10:17
KamionI'm assuming you mean the problem where Windows no longer boots after an Ubuntu install?10:18
sivangKamion : this also :-)10:26
mdzKamion: I think he meant the bit where fsck.vfat complains all the time10:27
sivangmdz : hmm, yes. sorry for being so obscure.10:27
sivangThe thing with fat32/windows installations boot up already worked, I mean grub knew how to detect it.10:28
sivangor whatever script that did ut10:28
sivangI'll test again with today's daily10:28
sivangmdz : is there a known list for the nv driver limitation list? (the opensource one)10:31
=== sivang rebooting after fixing fstab
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sivangKamion : any way to rerun the script that supposed to configure grub automagically for other OSs ?11:26
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