[12:00] <Anna> Does anyone know if there's documentation on how to set up a scanner on Ubuntu / Debian and where that's at?
[12:01] <Anna> All I can seem to find is nightmarrish command prompt stuff with files that have to be copied all over the place and arguments (arguments?) and who knows what.
[12:02] <hkcc2_> Anna: try applications->graphics->xsane image scanning program
[12:02] <Anna> Tried that, but it tells me that there is no device..
[12:02] <hkcc2_> maybe your scanner is not supported by linux
[12:03] <Anna> how would I know if it is or isn't?
[12:03] <LinuxJones> what type of scanner do you have ?
[12:03] <inklingx> Anna: command-line: sane-find-scanner
[12:03] <Anna> hp scanjet 3500c
[12:03] <Baumi> ubuntu has many modules... search google for the one for your scanner
[12:03] <theantix> So Warty is due in October-- anybody know more specific than that, is it targeting the end of October or just "whenever it's done" or some other date?
[12:04] <Anna> i'll try the command line
[12:04] <hkcc2_> theantix: the 20th i believe
[12:04] <Anna> modules, hmm.
[12:05] <Baumi> usb scanner?
[12:05] <Anna> yes, it's usb
[12:05] <theantix> hkcc2_, thanks
[12:05] <Drenkas> hi
[12:05] <Drenkas> can i ask if ubuntu is able to see and resize ntfs partitions?
[12:06] <Anna> I'll try the command line and brb
[12:06] <Drenkas> because i didn't managed to do that
[12:06] <schnick> has the Gnome Settings Daemon cause anyone any issues?  i'm gattine error 'Failed to activate 'OAFID:GNOME_SettingsDaemon'
[12:06] <Baumi> @drenkas - qtparted can resize ntfs partitions
[12:07] <Drenkas> it's in ubuntu?
[12:07] <Drenkas> i mean in the install cd
[12:07] <Baumi> i dont think... but try apt-get or search google. its easy to install
[12:07] <Drenkas> the problem is to get place for linux
[12:08] <Baumi> i didnt already install ubuntu... Im downloading
[12:08] <Drenkas> it's not a problem for me anymore but it was when i tryed
[12:08] <Baumi> in Knoppix/Kanotix qtparted is included
[12:08] <Baumi> these are live-cds
[12:08] <Drenkas> you can resize with knoppix?
[12:08] <Drenkas> that's good
[12:09] <Baumi> yeah. i did it already
[12:09] <Baumi> look for "qtparted"
[12:09] <Drenkas> i know qtparted
[12:09] <Baumi> o.k.
[12:09] <Anna> If I try the command 'sane-find-scanner', can I just plug in my scanner prior or do I have to reboot? Because right now it's telling me 'bash: sane-find-scanner: command not found'.
[12:10] <Drenkas> but i don't know if it is on ubuntu
[12:10] <Drenkas> i think it's important for user-friendly distrib
[12:10] <Baumi> sorry... i am burning ubuntu at the moment.. 
[12:11] <longsleep_> anybody got an ubuntu/debian apt source for mplayer, divx and transcode ?
[12:12] <Baumi> @anna... plugin the scanner and type dmesg ... there should be something like usb.c, scanner.c, hub.c,... 
[12:13] <theantix> longsleep_, see the FAQ...look for debian-marillat archives, work for me
[12:14] <dialtone> is a debian deb, compatible with ubuntu? (I'm thinking about universe)
[12:14] <Anna> k
[12:14] <phin|work> yes, but if its in the ubuntu repository, you really should use that instead
[12:14] <dialtone> ah! good to know, thx
[12:16] <Anna> It spat a whole lot of data at me know that doesn't mean anything to me. But the final line was:usb 1-3: new full speed USB device using address 2
[12:17] <longsleep_> theantix, found them .. thanks :)
[12:18] <mdz> alextreme: ping?
[12:18] <vasi> if i want to add knotes (from kdepim) to my ubuntu system, what's the best way of doing so? should i grab the .debs from debian? is there another repo somewhere i could use?
[12:19] <hkcc2_> Anna: have a look at device manager (computer->system configuration) and see what usb devices linux has detected
[12:23] <Anna> I see 'scanjet 3500c' under one of the USB, so the device has been properly detected.
[12:24] <hkcc2_> Anna: well thats good news, you could try xsane again, other than that i have no more ideas
[12:24] <Baumi> u could try "modprobe scanner"
[12:24] <Anna> But Xsane is still telling me that there is no device.
[12:24] <LinuxJones> vasi: apt-get install kdepim ?
[12:24] <Baumi> i hope ubuntu has the scanner module precompiled
[12:25] <Baumi> but disconnect the scanner first
[12:25] <Baumi> !
[12:25] <Anna> modprobe scanner as a command at the command prompt?
[12:25] <vasi> LinuxJones, it depends on things not in apt...
[12:26] <LinuxJones> vasi: ohhh
[12:26] <vasi> kinda silly for kdepim to be sitting in universal even though it's not installable, but there you go
[12:26] <Anna> thanks hkcc2, at least we know know that it's somehow 'there' in the system.
[12:26] <hkcc2_> Anna: no problem, hope it gets sorted out soon
[12:27] <Anna> Well, I hope I learn fast enough so I pass this dreadful newbie phase
[12:27] <Anna> quick
[12:28] <hkcc2_> don't worry people usually learn linux fast
[12:30] <Baumi> yes.. try the command at the console
[12:32] <LinuxJones> Anna, It takes at least about a month before you start feeling comfortable with basic Linux stuff.  
[12:32] <eddyp> re
[12:33] <eddyp> how can I find out how many packages are available in ubuntu/debian
[12:33] <Deft> the number?
[12:33] <hkcc2_> Anna: according to the sane project's website your scanner is unsupported
[12:34] <hkcc2_> http://www.sane-project.org/unsupported/hp-scanjet-3500c.html
[12:34] <eddyp> Deft: yes
[12:34] <jdub> eddyp: approx 2000 supported, approx 10000 unsupported
[12:34] <Deft> eddyp: apt-cache stats
[12:34] <alextreme> mdz: pong
[12:35] <WW> Anna: I just got here... what kind of scanner?
[12:36] <mdz> alextreme: how is the live CD going?  you sounded nearly ready to upload
[12:36] <Anna> I have to scroll back abit...."I had a situation here"
[12:36] <Anna> ;-)
[12:38] <alextreme> mdz: yeah, i was nearly ready to upload. ran into more problems again, but trying round it up
[12:39] <lamont> dieman: yep
[12:39] <Anna> ok@hkcc2, but does that mean the scanning is only possible through xsane, therefore it is impossible at all to get the scanner working?
[12:40] <Anna> Hi 
[12:40] <Anna> WW
[12:40] <Anna> It's a scanjet 3500c from HP, but hkcc2 has found out that xsane isn't supporting it...
[12:40] <hkcc2_> Anna: i don't know of any other programs other than sane, so without sane support there's not much else you can do
[12:41] <Anna> I see
[12:41] <hkcc2_> don't worry my scanner isn't working either
[12:41] <jordi> for Linux, Scanner stuff is either SANE or get another one.
[12:41] <jordi> mine doesn't work eithe.r
[12:41] <Slackeerb> Does anyone know how to get a logitech quick cam working on linux
[12:41] <jordi> Althogh I haven't checked in a while.
[12:41] <jordi> Slackeerb: sure
[12:42] <jordi> have you tried the qce module in the kernel?
[12:42] <jordi> Slackeerb: what kernel version, for a start?
[12:42] <Slackeerb> jordi: How do i check that. i know I type somethign in the terminal
[12:42] <Anna> Luckily scanners aren't that expensive. I'll keep the scanner for the winDOS box
[12:42] <Anna> I'm a novice jordi...
[12:43] <Anna> so expert things aren't optional for me, that's what I was trying to say.
[12:43] <jordi> Anna: it's strange that an HP scanner doesn't work though.
[12:44] <jordi> Slackeerb: wait a sec
[12:44] <Anna> Yes, especially since the system detected it...
[12:44] <Anna> the device manager listed it under usb correctly, even the name.
[12:44] <WW> Anna: I took a look here: http://www.hamrick.com/, but apparently he doesn't support the HP 3500c either. 
[12:45] <chapeaurouge> hey... interested in metacity transparency? got this from the slackware world... quite cool
[12:45] <chapeaurouge> http://www.dropline.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=3361
[12:45] <jordi> Slackeerb: is it a colour qc?
[12:45] <jordi> Slackeerb: is it a qc, or a qc express?
[12:45] <Slackeerb> jordi: yes
[12:45] <Slackeerb> jordi: i think express
[12:47] <jordi> ok
[12:47] <Anna> WW, that is indeed weird that they skipped my scanner while supporting other HP's
[12:47] <jordi> Slackeerb: does "modprobe c-qcam" as root show anything interesting in dmesg?
[12:48] <chapeaurouge> anyone for a tomboy pkg (http://beatniksoftware.com/tomboy/) ?
[12:48] <Anna> But given all the noise HP is making regarding GNU/Linux, they ought to deliver drivers...
[12:48] <Slackeerb> jordi: says blah blah blah not found
[12:49] <jordi> Slackeerb: hmm, probably out of luck without recompiling stuff I guess
[12:49] <jordi> there was a working driver for Linux 2.4 at least
[12:49] <Slackeerb> jordi:shouldnt it detect it automaticly?
[12:50] <Slackeerb> jordi: and do you know any good p2p software im useing limewire currently but it keeps asking me to upgrade to pro.
[12:50] <jordi> Slackeerb: hey that's quite a topic change. :)
[12:50] <Anna> While I'm here <cough>. Is there a special magic I need to know about RW-CD? Can I rewrite CD's in nautilus and I've just been too daft to figure it out?
[12:50] <jordi> I use an emule clone, "amule"
[12:51] <Slackeerb> jordi: the emule networks seemed real slow when I used it.
[12:51] <jordi> Anna: I have no cd-rw's here, but I thought nautilus would allow you to clean them before burning
[12:51] <jordi> isn't there an option?
[12:51] <jordi> Slackeerb: do you have a permanent link to the internet?
[12:51] <Slackeerb> Anna: just drag the files from the disc 2 the trash?
[12:51] <Slackeerb> jordi: yes
[12:52] <Slackeerb> Anna: if its a cd rw. =)
[12:52] <Anna> Yes;-)
[12:52] <Anna> lol
[12:52] <seb128> jordi: the problem with cdrw is the automount ... CD get mounted so device is busy when you want to clean it
[12:52] <jordi> Slackeerb: emule's protocol is based on credits. You download more if you share more, and if you keep it going for a while.
[12:53] <jordi> afaik.
[12:53] <jordi> seb128: ah, bad.
[12:53] <seb128> should be fixed soon
[12:53] <Slackeerb> jordi: ahh i see well thx off to wtach tss
[12:53] <Slackeerb> peace everyone!
[12:53] <seb128> pitty is working on a hal/dbus/n-c-b/h-d-m/... update
[12:53] <Anna> bye
[12:54] <jordi> wtf is tss?
[12:54] <Anna> Well, I tried slacks advice, but it told me that it's read only data...
[12:54] <jordi> seb128: cool
[12:55] <Anna> I dragged the files from RW-CD into the trash and then got the nono
[12:55] <jordi> seb128: besides the gtk bug, is there anything outstanding that we don't have in sarge at this point?
[12:55] <jordi> hmm, this should be in #g-d probably
[12:55] <seb128> yeah
[12:57] <vincent> jordi: you can try these packages it's working fine for me. http://people.no-name-yet.com/~pitti/utopia/ 
[12:57] <hkcc2__> Anna: try opening a nautilus window (e.g. computer->disks) and then choosing go->cd creator
[12:59] <jordi> vincent: I'm not on Ubuntu in this system rightn ow
[12:59] <jordi> although I should..
[12:59] <dieman> *yawn*
[12:59] <dieman> long day at work
[01:00] <Anna> but when I'm in the cd creator, it is empty as the files are on cd...?
[01:00] <vincent> jordi: oups excuse me
[01:01] <Anna> I also noticed under properties that the CD drive seems to be a 'root' controlled device and 'write' isn't ticked off, so perhaps I have to sign in as root and allow write under the properties of that device?
[01:02] <hkcc2__> Anna: are you going to be replacing the contents of the cd-rw with something new?
[01:02] <Anna> no, not really. I was planning the delete the files on CD
[01:03] <Anna> to delete..
[01:03] <hkcc2__> you mean blank it?
[01:03] <Anna> yes
[01:04] <Anna> but dragging the files to the trash won't work
[01:04] <Anna> (actually it copies copies to the trash, but the files on CD remain...)
[01:04] <hkcc2__> i don't think it can be done via the cd creator.  one can use the command-line cdrecord tho.. :-)
[01:05] <Anna> ouch
[01:05] <hkcc2__> well its not that difficult
[01:05] <Anna> But shouldn't I try to change the properties for the CD drive under 'root'?
[01:06] <hkcc2__> no i don't think that's part of the problem
[01:06] <hkcc2__> is the cd mounted right now? it should be if you double-click the cdrom icon
[01:06] <Anna> ok. So which command would I use for the cp?
[01:07] <hkcc2__> double-click the cdrom icon to make sure its mounted
[01:07] <Anna> yes it's mounted
[01:08] <hkcc2__> then open a command line and type mount
[01:08] <Anna> ok..
[01:08] <hkcc2__> do you see a line which has cdrom in it?
[01:09] <Anna> lulu@lulu ~ $ mount
[01:09] <Anna> /dev/hda1 on / type unknown (rw,errors=remount-ro)
[01:09] <Anna> proc on /proc type proc (rw)
[01:09] <Anna> sysfs on /sys type sysfs (rw)
[01:09] <Anna> devpts on /dev/pts type devpts (rw,gid=5,mode=620)
[01:09] <Anna> tmpfs on /dev/shm type tmpfs (rw)
[01:09] <Anna> usbfs on /proc/bus/usb type usbfs (rw)
[01:09] <Anna> /dev/hdc on /media/cdrom0 type iso9660 (ro,noexec,nosuid,nodev,user=lulu)
[01:09] <Anna> lulu@lulu ~ $
[01:09] <hkcc2__> ok your cdrom is /dev/hdc in command line land
[01:09] <Anna> sorry, I didn't intend to paste the whole shabang
[01:09] <Se7h> hey there
[01:09] <hkcc2__> Anna: type sudo umount /dev/hdc
[01:10] <hkcc2__> and enter your password
[01:10] <Anna> ok
[01:10] <Se7h> is x cd roast available at universe?
[01:10] <hkcc2__> then type 'cdrecord dev=/dev/hdc blank=fast'
[01:11] <hkcc2__> that should be it
[01:11] <LinuxJones> Se7h, yes it is and so is k3b
[01:11] <Anna> well, something is going on...<g>
[01:12] <Anna> is it like formatting the cd now?
[01:12] <Se7h> hmm
[01:12] <Se7h> whats the name of it?
[01:12] <hkcc2__> Anna: its basically overwriting a part of the cd that contains the index of the files
[01:13] <LinuxJones> Se7h, xcdtoast
[01:13] <LinuxJones> Se7h, err xcdroast
[01:13] <Anna> I see. But are you telling me that there is no way to delete individual files from a CD RW?
[01:13] <Se7h> cant find it :|
[01:14] <LinuxJones> Se7h, sorry maybe it is in restricted oops
[01:14] <hkcc2__> Anna: in general, no. it can be done tho if it was written with packet-writing software, which is not that common
[01:14] <hkcc2__> perhaps it can be done with multisession cds as well
[01:15] <Anna> but that would mean that RW-CD's under Linux are meaningless in a way.
[01:15] <hkcc2__> yeah, they don'e function the same as hard disks
[01:16] <hkcc2__> cdrws are mainly for trying out linux distros ;-)
[01:16] <Se7h> xcdroast_0.98+0alpha15-0.backports.org.1_i386.deb
[01:16] <Anna> lol
[01:16] <Se7h> this should do it
[01:18] <Anna> I'll copy the commands...
[01:19] <Kamion> for CD-RWs you basically have to build the entire filesystem and write it in one shot
[01:21] <Anna> Well, I was under the impression that files can be deleted from the CD at will (individually or as a selection), because I believe that's how it worked under the system of the one whose name we mustn't mention.
[01:22] <vincent> hmmmm nice http://www.es.gnome.org/~telemaco/
[01:22] <knackko> hi oo people
[01:22] <Anna> hi
[01:23] <tmp> yo guys, i have powerprefs now, just did apt-get update/install  
[01:23] <tmp> thx
[01:26] <Anna> BTW, I live in Holland (I'm German though), where are you from. (Is social chat appropriate here?)
[01:26] <Baumi> hi. 
[01:26] <Baumi> how can i install nvidia drivers?
[01:27] <jdub> Baumi: apt-get install nvidia-glx
[01:27] <Baumi> my ubuntu didn recognize my TI4200 correctly and my highest available resolution is 640 x480
[01:27] <Baumi> thx
[01:27] <jdub> Baumi: but beware, those are the non-free drivers
[01:27] <jsubl2> Baumi, http://wiki.ubuntu.com/FrequentlyAskedQuestions
[01:28] <jsubl2> Hello Anna.  I am from Dallas Texas USA
[01:29] <whiprush> jdub: dude ... you will not believe what I found at work today.
[01:29] <jdub> whiprush: an old banana in your drawer?
[01:29] <jdub> i *hate* that
[01:29] <jdub> of course, i can't blame any of my co-workers for things like that
[01:29] <jdub> and i don't have any drawers either
[01:29] <jdub> but nevertheless
[01:29] <knackko> i launched a bootsplash chooser with python/gtk for mdk, but what about ubuntu? http://knackko.dyndns.org/chertault/weblog/bootsplashchooser.html
[01:30] <whiprush> http://www.arslinux.com/~jorge/lisa4.jpg
[01:30] <Kamion> Anna: I imagine Windows fakes it up somehow by rewriting the whole thing
[01:30] <jdub> knackko: we have some seriously amazingly cool non-bootsplash graphical boot stuff coming in hoaryhedgehog
[01:30] <whiprush> dude ... it has rounded corners on the panels. heh/
[01:30] <WW> jdub: No drawers?  So where do you keep your banana?
[01:30] <jdub> A LISA?!
[01:30] <WW> jdub: ... sorry...
[01:30] <jdub> HOLY SHIT DUDE
[01:30] <whiprush> http://www.arslinux.com/~jorge/lisa-ubuntu.jpg
[01:30] <jdub> that's intense!
[01:30] <whiprush> in perfect working order
[01:30] <whiprush> 10mb hardrive
[01:30] <whiprush> built in 1983.
[01:31] <jdub> woooooooooaaaaah
[01:31] <vasi> heh
[01:31] <knackko> jdub: what is hoaryhedgehog (next ubuntu)?
[01:31] <jdub> knackko: yes, sorry, our next release, preview due march next year :)
[01:31] <jdub> whiprush: dude, this just goes to show
[01:31] <whiprush> http://www.arslinux.com/~jorge/lisa8.jpg
[01:31] <whiprush> look at the rounded clock, heh.
[01:31] <knackko> whiprush: nice lisa
[01:31] <jdub> whiprush: that gnome needs rounded corners again
[01:31] <whiprush> heh
[01:31] <whiprush> http://www.arslinux.com/~jorge/lisa9.jpg <-- preferences screen
[01:32] <whiprush> dude when it goes into powersaving mode, the monitor dims
[01:32] <whiprush> and undims when you move the mouse ....
[01:32] <jdub> whiprush: dude, you should totally blog these pics, i'll url them up on planet gnome and get some rounded corner action going ;)
[01:32] <whiprush> it's so ninja
[01:32] <hazmat> i'm trying to figure out how to debug sleep mode on a powerbook, any suggestions? all the reports i see on the net suggest that it should work out of the box, and it was on a gentoo install that i wrote over.
[01:32] <whiprush> heh ok.
[01:33] <whiprush> the program paradigm is weird.
[01:33] <Anna> I see about the RW.CD.
[01:33] <Anna> Texas, cool
[01:33] <whiprush> you don't launch programs, you like, tear of sheets of stationary
[01:33] <whiprush> took me like 10 minutes to figure out
[01:34] <Anna> Texas is the Bavaria of the U.S.
[01:34] <punkass> bc, canada here 
[01:35] <vasi> woooo, canada!
[01:35] <punkass> ;)
[01:35] <Baumi> o.k. nvidia drivers didnt worked for me
[01:35] <vasi> there, that's my quota of nationalistic fervor for the year
[01:35] <knackko> jdub: is there any contribution lack for the amazingly cool non-bootsplash graphical boot stuff?
[01:35] <Anna> Canada is cool too
[01:35] <jsubl2> Anna, ok
[01:35] <punkass> lol
[01:35] <Baumi> i mean - i cant set a higher res
[01:36] <vasi> Baumi, are the higher resolutions in your x config?
[01:36] <jsubl2> Baumi maybe your monitor section needs work
[01:36] <Anna> So this is a pretty anglocentric chat then. Am I the only European?
[01:37] <Anna> No Brits?
[01:37] <splinta>  <- brit
[01:37] <Anna> hihi
[01:37] <splinta> hey :o)
[01:37] <vasi> oh cripes....rhythmbox suddenly froze again
[01:37] <vasi> that's getting quite annoying
[01:37] <punkass> hazmat: yeah i am trying to figure out sleepmode stuff on a dell D600 too
[01:37] <Baumi> no. in my x-config i only see one res and one frequency rate
[01:37] <Anna> crikey mate
[01:38] <jdub> knackko: it hasn't really started yet, but as soon as the hoaryhedgehog development branch opens, it'll be out there to hack on :-)
[01:38] <vasi> Baumi, so add another res :-)
[01:38] <vasi> do dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xfree86
[01:38] <jsubl2> Baumi in mine i have HorizSync       24-82 ;      VertRefresh     55-77
[01:38] <Kamion> Anna: we have I think 5 UK people working for Canonical
[01:38] <vasi> yeah, and set the rates for your monitor
[01:39] <jsubl2> Baumi, besides installing the drivers right you might need those tweaked if they are no accurate
[01:41] <Anna> One thing about Canonical I've wondered is how will you earn revenue? Are there add-on products planned? (I"m not sure if this is an appropriate question.)
[01:41] <Anna> If it's not, just ignore it
[01:41] <Kamion> Anna: well, it's on the front page of http://www.ubuntulinux.org/ ...
[01:41] <Kosai> Anna: Have you looked at the site?  It mentions support.
[01:41] <Anna> it is?
[01:42] <Kamion> "Canonical's business model is to provide technical support and professional services related to Ubuntu."
[01:42] <Baumi> oh man, i love high resolution ;-)
[01:42] <Baumi> thanks a lot
[01:42] <LinuxJones> jdub,  where are you located Austrailia or South Africa ?
[01:43] <Anna> Ok, it was detailed in the last paragraph
[01:43] <jdub> LinuxJones: sydney, australia. at least that's what i say online. ;-)
[01:44] <Anna> So basically Ubuntu is actually more of a business desktop aimed at companies, or can bottom feeders also buy support?
[01:44] <LinuxJones> jdub,  heh, I am going to email you tomorrow a very cool project I have in mind, to see what you think.
[01:45] <knackko> jdub: ok, i will watch on this branch
[01:45] <Kosai> Anna: I think they actually care about making a kickass distribution, and will go with support to try and make ends meet; but it's not why the company exists.
[01:45] <Kosai> (Not that I work for them, just know the motivation of a few individuals.)
[01:45] <knackko> jdub: you are a direct maintainer of ubuntu?
[01:45] <jdub> Anna: it's not just a business desktop :-)
[01:46] <jdub> Anna: so, we're going to be concentrating on professional services and partnering with local support companies.
[01:46] <jdub> knackko: yeah
[01:46] <Anna> I see
[01:47] <Anna> Well, I was one of your first fans.
[01:48] <neighborlee> Im having trouble ( albeit in fedora its compiling just fine with no errors argh) compiling a library I need badly here in ubuntu for a game project....i'm not getting any missing header errors so I dont know how to diagnose...anyone here could lend a quick hand possibly in PM ??
[01:48] <Kosai> neighborlee: No, don't have time for that.  If you paste the exact error, someone may offer advice.
[01:49] <neighborlee> well its multli-line
[01:49] <neighborlee> but okay here goes
[01:49] <knackko> jdub: one more congrulat : ubuntu is a great idea for those who love gnome and debian, i enjoy it!
[01:49] <neighborlee> .libs/mdll.o(.text+0x0): In function `main':
[01:49] <neighborlee> /usr/local/games/nwn/nwmouse/libnw/libnw/mdll.c:1: multiple definition of `main'
[01:49] <neighborlee> .libs/setl.o(.text+0x0):/usr/local/games/nwn/nwmouse/libnw/libnw/setl.c:1: first defined here
[01:49] <jdub> knackko: cool, thanks :)
[01:50] <neighborlee> thats it..no missing header error or anything
[01:53] <Baumi> which program do u use for watching TV? 
[01:53] <Kosai> xawtv.
[01:53] <Kosai> neighborlee: main is the function that a C program starts from.
[01:53] <Anna> Basically the reason I was attracted to Ubuntu  was because of the installer. I know too little about computing in general  to be in a position of making a quality judgment about the different distros. Being German, there was of course a tendency towards Suse/KDE, but I also had purity issues with Qt.
[01:53] <whiprush> jdub: blogged, pics are probably too big though
[01:54] <Kosai> neighborlee: You are compiling two pieces of code that both contain competing main() functions.  The linker doesn't know which one to use.
[01:54] <neighborlee> Kosai, hmmm
[01:54] <neighborlee> Kosai, question is why is it spewing this here in debian and not in fedora
[01:54] <Anna> But I should shut up again, I tend to interrupt the flow with my babble. 
[01:55] <neighborlee> Anna, na dont worry
[01:55] <Anna> Well, what can I say, I'm a GIRL
[01:55] <neighborlee> Anna, people here are multifunctional <G>
[01:55] <Anna> lol
[01:55] <neighborlee> heh
[01:55] <hazmat> how do you suggest a package for ubuntu?
[01:55] <neighborlee> and we're damn glad your here
[01:55] <neighborlee> enough guys already!!
[01:56] <neighborlee> heh
[01:57] <nojo> when install ubuntu is there someway to set up PPP over ethernet for adsl to do the intial install?
[01:57] <hazmat> nojo there is some discussion in the mailing list archives bout it...
[01:58] <nojo> oh ok
[01:58] <Kosai> nojo: I doubt you'd find any distro that supports PPPoE for an install.  Use the CD, and then update once the install's finished.
[01:58] <neighborlee> anna: purity issues for kde?
[01:58] <neighborlee> Anna: albeit I think I know where your going with that <G>
[01:58] <nojo> ok Kosai
[01:58] <nojo> thanks
[01:58] <neighborlee> Anna: german huh..my ancestry resembles that remark ;-00
[01:59] <Anna> but your grandmother is from Chicago?
[02:00] <Anna> Ok, that is a lame joke I admit
[02:02] <Anna> With purity I actually meant the confusing situation regarding trolltech. I feel guilty using KDE knowing I'll be supporting a (Qt) license that isn't very "pure". Or did I completely misunderstand that situation?
[02:02] <nojo> so far pretty painless install
[02:03] <Kamion> Anna: Qt is dual-licensed QPL/GPL
[02:03] <jdub> Anna: totally misunderstood
[02:03] <jdub> Anna: Qt is 100% Free Software
[02:03] <Kamion> both licences are free
[02:03] <ioslipstream> jdub: shhh, spread the gtk lovin'
[02:03] <Kamion> the only historical issue is that once upon a time Qt was QPL-only and KDE was (still is) GPL, and the two licences are incompatible
[02:03] <jdub> Anna: you're more likely to have purity issues with C++ or something like that.
[02:03] <Kamion> but Qt going QPL/GPL made that issue irrelevant
[02:04] <jdub> ioslipstream: no way dude, full disclosure rocks.
[02:04] <ioslipstream> heh
[02:04] <Anna> OK, I'll have to research this a bit more thorough
[02:04] <punkass> i thought the windows vesion of qT cost $$
[02:08] <Anna> In any case, I lie Gnome better anyway. BTW, my screenshot is at http://zazam.com/stuff/screenshot.png
[02:09] <Kosai> Anna: Nice; looks passingly like an old screenshot of mine -- http://printf.net/shot-cjb.jpg
[02:09] <theantix> Anna, what is the "blue dot" applet in the upper right of your screenshot?
[02:09] <Anna> yeah the exploding galaxies stuff
[02:10] <ioslipstream> theantix: firestarter
[02:10] <Anna> the dot is my firewall firestarter, which depends on an open root terminal I've shifted to the second work space during the day
[02:10] <theantix> ioslipstream, thanks
[02:12] <ioslipstream> my favorite desktop i've had... i'll be a happy camper when xorg is in ubuntu: http://members.arstechnica.com/x/ioslipstream/milkshot.jpg
[02:12] <Anna> (I haven't figured out yet how to configure programs that demand root privs, so I discovered that firestarter runs from the root terminal)
[02:12] <Anna> Oh wow, yes that is a beautiful desktop.
[02:13] <Kosai> ioslipstream: Mmm, compost.
[02:13] <LinuxJones> the dropshadows are awesome looking
[02:13] <ioslipstream> thanks... i think ubuntu is nice enough to warrant going without the eye candy for awhile though
[02:13] <nathan_> i have a question. how do i shutdown the x server so i can install the official nvidia drivers?
[02:13] <zenwhen> composite still isnt stable on any video card, and isnt workable at all with ati's drivers
[02:13] <whiprush> that's real pretty ioslipstream 
[02:13] <nathan_> somebody told me to change my runlevel to 3 but that didn't work
[02:13] <Kosai> nathan_: sudo /etc/init.d/gdm stop
[02:14] <ioslipstream> zenwhen: xcompmgr-cvs was pretty stable for me on an nvidia fx5700
[02:14] <ioslipstream> whiprush: thanks
[02:14] <LinuxJones> nathan_, the nvidia drivers are available for through apt if you want pre-compiled binaries.
[02:14] <WW> nathan_: ctrl-alt-backspace
[02:14] <nathan_> thanks
[02:14] <nathan_> :)
[02:14] <nathan_> LinuxJones, official drivers or "nv" package?
[02:15] <ioslipstream> i was able to keep the eye candy up most of the time, except for when playing ut
[02:15] <LinuxJones> nathan_, official
[02:15] <nathan_> coool
[02:15] <nathan_> you don't happen to know the package name, do you?
[02:15] <LinuxJones> nathan_,  >> http://wiki.ubuntu.com/FrequentlyAskedQuestions see # 3
[02:16] <Anna> it's 2:15 here in the morning, I think I'm fading. Good night beautiful people.
[02:16] <LinuxJones> night anna
[02:16] <m_tthew> anybody have the link handy?
[02:18] <nathan_> my real problem is that i can't select a refresh rate above 60Hz at my preferred resolution. could the video drivers be the culprit?
[02:19] <LinuxJones> nathan_,  I had some problems with the nv driver as well works fine now
[02:19] <Zomb> nathan_: you can override the default modelines if you monitor fails to communicate with the video card
[02:20] <Kamion> m_tthew: we don't have Ubuntu netinst images, not in the Debian sense anyway
[02:20] <Kamion> m_tthew: you might mean http://archive.ubuntulinux.org/ubuntu/dists/warty/main/installer-i386/
[02:21] <m_tthew> Kamion : thanks, that is exactly what I meant. My vocab sucks.
[02:21] <nathan_> ok, time to reboot. thanks guys. :)
[02:21] <punkass> something odd, when you goto change your background image...the dialog selector box doesnt show thumbnails
[02:22] <punkass> background image of desktop that is
[02:22] <Kamion> the netinst image is not very well named, really
[02:22] <moyogo> punkass: that's a bug filed already in one of the bugzillas
[02:23] <moyogo> punkass: or did jeff mention it in his list of 28 things to do
[02:23] <punkass> oh cool k thanks...just noticed thats all..thought it was odd
[02:24] <moyogo> punkass: it is very odd indeed
[02:24] <nictuku> hi
[02:25] <moyogo> punkass: it's been like that for a while i guess
[02:25] <moyogo> punkass: http://www.gnome.org/~jdub/blog/1085895965
[02:25] <nictuku> :( j. waugh ignored my mail
[02:26] <jdub> nictuku: which mail?
[02:26] <jdub> i tend to get a lot, so it needs to stand out from the crowd ;)
[02:26] <nictuku> oh you're there. nevermind, really :)
[02:27] <jdub> (unless you sent it to @canonical.com)
[02:27] <nictuku> I guess it was to @canonical
[02:27] <nictuku> but don't worry, really. it's no big deal hehe
[02:28] <nictuku> To: jeff.waugh@canonical.com
[02:28] <nictuku> hehe spose it was filtered as spam He He
[02:29] <nojo> and thast it im installed
[02:29] <nojo> prett flawless
[02:29] <nojo> lol
[02:31] <drag> is there any xorg support in the current ubuntu release? would i be able to install it in any clean way
[02:31] <drag> i'm thinking of switching from debian right now
[02:32] <LinuxJones> drag, not atm
[02:32] <nathan_> ok, that driver didn't work LinuxJones
[02:32] <LinuxJones> nathn, it didn't work ?
[02:32] <nathan_> it crashes when i start x telling me "no screens found"
[02:32] <LinuxJones> nathn, you have to modprobe nvidia
[02:32] <drag> ahh ok thanks
[02:33] <punkass> is there a way to use the windows key for shortcuts
[02:33] <nojo> is X.org gonan be in the october release or no?
[02:33] <nathan_> just type "modprobe nvidia" at the shell?
[02:33] <drag> i've heard that i should definitely go with ubuntu even if i'm happy with debian
[02:33] <jdub> nojo: no
[02:33] <LinuxJones> nathan_, yes
[02:33] <drag> so i'm going to give it a shot
[02:33] <punkass> eg  Win + D for desktop etc
[02:33] <nojo> jdub ok
[02:33] <nathan_> and that's it?
[02:33] <nathan_> heh, i'm paranoid now :)
[02:33] <LinuxJones> nathan_, then type gdm
[02:33] <jdub> nojo: though, it will turn up very quickly in the devel branch once it opens.
[02:33] <nictuku> are you guys needing volunteer perl developers work? helping debian is too bureaucratic hehe
[02:33] <punkass> when i press it i get Super_L  but cant add anything else to it
[02:33] <nojo> jdub: ahh ok very nice
[02:34] <nathan_> LinuxJones, alright, i'll try that. thanks :)
[02:34] <nojo> well this is great i mpretty happy with this..this is pretty much how i would setup my debian system anyway
[02:34] <LinuxJones> nathan_, give it a go
[02:35] <housetier> drag, if you are really happy with debian, why change?
[02:36] <drag> for the more up-to-date packages
[02:37] <nojo> why dont u just track unstable
[02:37] <drag> well, i've asked people the same questions and they said to still go with ubuntu (these were long time deb users)
[02:37] <drag> so i'll give it a shot and see what it's all about heh
[02:37] <hazmat> odd, when i change the default theme for ubuntu, it doesn't actually change the color scheme.. is it some sort of metacity hardcode?
[02:38] <nathan_> ok, LinuxJones, that worked, but now i still can't select a refresh above 60Hz. is there some file i have to manually edit?
[02:38] <baietas> is there a quick way to install MS true type fonts in ubuntu?
[02:38] <LinuxJones> nathan_,  type sudo nano /etc/X11/XF86Config
[02:38] <nathan_> my file is XF86COnfig-4
[02:39] <drag> mstt fonts should be on apt
[02:39] <drag> look for msttcorefonts
[02:39] <nathan_> but i did what you said :)
[02:39] <LinuxJones> nathan_,  ya config-4 sorry
[02:39] <nathan_> k, done
[02:40] <LinuxJones> nathan_,  ok scroll down to the screen section
[02:40] <nathan_> k, there
[02:40] <nictuku> :(
[02:40] <LinuxJones> nathan_,  opps back up to monitor
[02:40] <nathan_> k, there :)
[02:41] <LinuxJones> nathan_,  wher eit says 60 change to a range that your monitor can support
[02:41] <nathan_>         VertRefresh     50-85
[02:41] <baietas> drag: This may mean that the package is missing, has been obsoleted, or is only available from another source
[02:41] <m_tthew> actually, guys, the 'right' way to fix that is to run dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xfree86
[02:41] <nathan_> my monitor can do 1600x1200/75, but it'll only let me do above 60 at 1152x864 and lower
[02:41] <drag> apt-get update, apt-cache search mstt
[02:42] <m_tthew> if you've edited XF86Config-4 by hand already, follow the instructions in the top of it to make dpkg-reconfigure work again.
[02:42] <drag> debian's got it, so i'd think ubuntu would have the package available as well
[02:42] <LinuxJones> m_tthew, I had to change the value manually it would not take using dpkg-reconfig
[02:42] <m_tthew> LinuxJones: ah, sorry. why wouldn't dpkg-reconfig take it?
[02:42] <liz> how do i start smb support so i can share files on a LAN?
[02:42] <LinuxJones> m_tthew, I do not know :(
[02:42] <nathan_> i changed it from 50-80 to 50-120
[02:43] <nathan_> i'll see if that works
[02:43] <nathan_> bbias
[02:43] <baietas> drag: apt-cache search mstt openoffice.org - high-quality office productivity suite
[02:43] <m_tthew> LinuxJones: If you edited the config by hand before using dpkg-reconfig, it won't write a new config file for you.
[02:43] <baietas> does that mean oo includes the fonts?
[02:43] <drag> i wouldn't install oo just for the fonts
[02:43] <LinuxJones> m_tthew, ahh that's what it was thanks
[02:44] <baietas> drag: its installed by ubuntu automatically 
[02:44] <m_tthew> LinuxJones: np, I only know that because I was bitten myself by it in the past. (I somehow overlooked the warning at the top of XF86Config-4 :)
[02:44] <drag> oh :o still using deb sorry
[02:44] <LinuxJones> m_tthew, I don't read half the stuff I see I seem to have tunnel vision :D
[02:44] <drag> baietas, just go to http://corefonts.sourceforge.net/
[02:45] <baietas> thank you
[02:48] <moyogo> hmmm... how do i find how much ram i have on my nvidia card again? i'm too lazy to open the box
[02:49] <LinuxJones> moyogo, what model card to you have ?
[02:50] <hazmat> the device manager might have it
[02:50] <moyogo> LinuxJones: er... i don't remember, but HAL says it's a PCI NV15 (GeForce2 GTS/Pro)
[02:52] <moyogo> ah... well... i guess i'll have to open my box at one point
[02:52] <LinuxJones> moyogo, sorry :D
[02:52] <moyogo> LinuxJones: thanks anyway
[02:52] <LinuxJones> moyogo, sure
[02:59] <mherweg> is the kernel source available as a package install?
[03:00] <m_tthew> mherweg: absolutely. apt-cache search linux-source
[03:00] <mherweg> thanks
[03:01] <nojo> hehe
[03:01] <nojo> this is great i love this
[03:06] <trae> hmm
[03:07] <jdub> hey trae
[03:07] <trae> tried to apt-get install bzflag and it doesn't seem to be in the repo
[03:07] <trae> jdub, heyaz, I like indubstrial
[03:07] <jdub> :)
[03:07] <trae> :)
[03:07] <jdub> it's not in universe?
[03:07] <trae> heh not in my universe it seems :)
[03:08] <jdub> must be a b0rken build
[03:08] <trae> jdub, are you responsible for the nice default look and feel of ubuntu?
[03:08] <jdub> want to apt-get source bzflag and see what it's up to? :)
[03:08] <jdub> trae: for the current temporary artwork, yeah.
[03:08] <jdub> trae: there's some slicker stuff coming for the final release. :-)
[03:08] <trae> jdub, sweet work... best debian install I've ever had
[03:09] <trae> heh
[03:09] <trae> actually, it rates up there with the RH/FC installs even with the crappy curses initial installer
[03:09] <jdub> heh
[03:10] <jdub> clicky-clicky coming in our next release :)
[03:10] <trae> no surprise there
[03:10] <trae> yah
[03:10] <nojo> i kind ofl iek the isntaller the way it is
[03:10] <nojo> lol
[03:10] <trae> I'm sure... but I'm still impressed
[03:10] <nojo> wuts the differnce
[03:10] <jdub> nojo: one is clicky-clicky, one is pressy-pressy.
[03:10] <nojo> ahah
[03:10] <trae> nojo, I think I concur there should be both present.
[03:10] <nojo> yeah
[03:10] <trae> but... you can't make everyone happy
[03:11] <trae> no matter what you do
[03:11] <nojo> ahah yeah
[03:11] <trae> so shoot for a certain target audience
[03:11] <jdub> both will have to be there
[03:11] <nojo> this was the smoothest install I have ever had on this laptop though
[03:11] <jdub> for different kinds of installs
[03:11] <trae> jdub, any ideas on how to get bzflag?  should I get a different sources.list or something?
[03:12] <nojo> it would be really great if u could get the PPPoe goign for he intital install
[03:12] <trae> don't want to go breaking my system though
[03:12] <trae> oh, where is emacs keybindings in gnome 2.8?
[03:12] <jdub> trae: if you want to help fix the build;
[03:12] <trae> I can't find it
[03:12] <jdub> apt-get source bzflag
[03:12] <jdub> sudo apt-get build-dep bzflag
[03:12] <trae> jdub, you know I can't code 
[03:12] <jdub> then see if you can build it
[03:13] <trae> heh
[03:13] <trae> I'll try that
[03:13] <jdub> trae: neither can most gentoo users... *cough*
[03:13] <drag> bleh why does my download keep timing out from cdimages.whatever
[03:13] <nojo> hehe
[03:13] <drag> :/
[03:13] <nojo> good ole gentoo
[03:13] <nojo> I had to get that off my laptop
[03:13] <nojo> everytime i would install soemthing took me liek 10 horus to compile
[03:13] <nojo> lol
[03:13] <trae> Reading Package Lists... Done
[03:13] <trae> Building Dependency Tree... Done
[03:13] <trae> E: Unable to find a source package for bzflag
[03:13] <jdub> now that's a bonus
[03:13] <trae> nojo, yah... that's a silly way to go.
[03:13] <hiweed> would you tell me how to create or modify a task for tasksel or aptitude use??
[03:14] <hiweed> I googled for it but...
[03:14] <jdub> trae: do you have universe in your sources.list? looks like there's a bzflag package for i386 built
[03:14] <trae> jdub, sorry to sound stupid, but don't know what universe is
[03:15] <trae> thought you were joking about that.
[03:15] <jdub> trae: edit sources.list, uncomment the universe lines :)
[03:15] <trae> just installed ubuntu fairly recently
[03:15] <crimsun> it's essentially everything unsupported by ubuntu
[03:15] <jdub> trae: almost all of debian main is available in universe (which is our unsupported set)
[03:15] <trae> ahh
[03:16] <trae> should I comment out restricted?
[03:17] <trae> cool, grabbing bzflag build now
[03:17] <jdub> trae: restricted is where binary drivers come from
[03:17] <jdub> trae: you should just be able to apt-get install bzflag now
[03:18] <nojo> if you install somethign form the universe and then if the package makes it into the main section for ubuntu will that break the package?
[03:19] <jdub> no
[03:19] <nojo> like when u trakc for security update
[03:19] <jdub> it'll just be upgraded
[03:19] <nojo> so it automatically recognizes it
[03:19] <nojo> ok awesome
[03:21] <trae> jdub, yah... sorry, was trying it out ;)
[03:21] <trae> jdub, hehe
[03:21] <trae> I love that game
[03:26] <tberman> so, i just installed ubuntu, and my usb keydrive doesnt get mounted by g-v-m
[03:26] <tberman> this happened automagically with fc development just before installing.
[03:29] <clee> pay no mind to tberman, he sucks
[03:29] <tberman> clee: lies.
[03:29] <chapeaurouge> lol
[03:34] <tvon|x31> automounting wasnt working for my usb stick either
[03:34] <daniels> tberman: interesting, we haven't seen that before
[03:34] <daniels> tberman: anything interesting in syslog?
[03:34] <tvon|x31> s/wasnt/isnt/
[03:34] <tvon|x31> oh, but mine is a pcmcia
[03:35] <tvon|x31> oh, but it doesnt work on my desktop either
[03:35] <tvon|x31> oh oh
[03:39] <tberman> daniels: naw
[03:39] <tberman> daniels: well, dmesg gives a /dev/scsi/etc and i dont have a /dev/scsi
[03:40] <tberman> daniels: and like i said, its clee's usb keydrive, that worked an hour and a half ago in fc development
[03:40] <tberman> so the drive and my hardware and g-v-m are known good
[03:40] <daniels> tberman: weird
[03:40] <nictuku> jdub, I've sent you a message about a support partnership in sept 23, I think.
[03:40] <jdub> nictuku: can you resend?
[03:40] <lonewolff> good morning
[03:41] <nictuku> :) of course
[03:41] <lonewolff> can anyone assist me, what is the default root pasword for a new install or ubuntu? i notices it doesent ask for one during install
[03:41] <jg_> jdub: you here?
[03:41] <jdub> jg_: yeah
[03:41] <tberman> daniels: oh yo
[03:41] <jdub> jg_: how's it going?
[03:41] <tberman> daniels: yes.
[03:41] <jg_> jdub: you are missing a major bet....
[03:41] <drag> i don't think you can use root in ubuntu
[03:41] <drag> use sudo
[03:41] <jg_> jdub: I reinstalled.
[03:41] <lonewolff> drag: no root??
[03:42] <drag> (thats what i gathered from what i read about ubuntu)
[03:42] <joem> ..read the faq about root passwd
[03:42] <jg_> jdub: your printer stuff isn't what it should  be....
[03:42] <drag> use sudo
[03:42] <jdub> jg_: oh? :-)
[03:42] <jg_> jdub: it should be listening for IPP advertizements from cups servers....
[03:42] <jdub> oh right
[03:42] <tvon|x31> there is no root login perse, if hard pressed you can get a root shell, but you shouldnt need it
[03:42] <jdub> so, we have a no listening policy by default
[03:42] <WW> lonewolff: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/support/documentation/faq/ 
[03:42] <jg_> makes a big difference in usability.
[03:42] <tberman> daniels: i can paste you some syslog info if you want.
[03:42] <jdub> we'd need a clikcy-clicky thing to turn that on
[03:42] <jg_> why not listen?
[03:42] <daniels> tberman: if you could email it (daniel.stone@canonical.com), that'd be neat
[03:43] <tberman> daniels: wiil do
[03:43] <jdub> also, i think in future, we'd be doing all of that via dns-sd anyway
[03:43] <daniels> jg_: i believe that is on the radar, yah
[03:43] <lonewolff> i am just used to doing su - before i need to use root ocmmands will just have to get used to using sudo
[03:43] <jdub> jg_: nothing (except portmap, which is locked down, and will not be there for our next release) listens on the network
[03:43] <jg_> jdub: it works today, works well, and is part of IPP.
[03:44] <trae> hmmm
[03:44] <jdub> jg_: unfortunately, gnome-cups-manager doesn't have a widget to turn it on
[03:44] <trae> no snap-to-grid in nautilus?
[03:44] <jdub> trae: 'keep aligned'
[03:44] <jg_> jdub: that sucks.
[03:44] <trae> the grid must be super small or something
[03:45] <trae> cause I can stick icons on top of each other
[03:45] <jdub> trae: it is a wacky grid, yeah ;)
[03:45] <nictuku> ok, Jeff. sent to jeff.waugh@canonical.com
[03:45] <lonewolff> ah ha sorted out now ...
[03:45] <jdub> it doesn't stop you doing that if you really want to
[03:45] <trae> hmm
[03:45] <trae> oh, there are "half-steps"
[03:45] <trae> ok... I see
[03:45] <trae> actually, that's kinda smart
[03:45] <trae> heh
[03:45] <trae> just didn't know what I was seeing
[03:45] <jdub> jg_: combination of policy and a missing feature. :-)
[03:46] <trae> hmm
[03:46] <trae> heh, maybe not
[03:46] <jg_> jdub: major missing feature, in my book :-(
[03:46] <jdub> jg_: can you turn it on in the cups web thingy?
[03:47] <jg_> jdub: I've never seen how...
[03:47] <jg_> I've had to go figure out what to put in cupsd.conf.
[03:47] <jg_> which sucks.
[03:47] <jdub> mmm
[03:47] <jdub> perhaps we can put a comment in our cupsd.conf
[03:47] <jdub> and look at adding that setting to g-c-m in future
[03:47] <jdub> jg_: printer stuff in gnome is really not with the times, still :)
[03:48] <trae> hmm
[03:48] <jg_> automagic printer discovery is a *big* deal to end users...
[03:48] <trae> I can't seem to hack in my "F1 launches gnome-terminal" in gnome-edit anymore. 
[03:48] <jg_> jdub: yes, unfortunately.
[03:48] <trae> I used to be able to get metacity to do F1 to launch a term.
[03:48] <jg_> jdub: we keep trying to get IPG to wake up, but so far, no luck.
[03:48] <trae> (and have done that for eons in metacity, sawfish, windowmaker, E, whatever
[03:49] <jdub> jg_: actually, i think the next release will have per-user cupsd, which will let us do that
[03:49] <jamesh> jdub: is that for the case of no local printers?
[03:49] <whiprush> jdub: heh, thanks for the mention
[03:50] <jdub> jamesh: should work with local printers too
[03:50] <m_tthew> while there is cups/gnome-print-* talk, what is the 'right' way to enable sharing my local printer over the network? I am cups - retarded.
[03:50] <whiprush> dude I found a local mac guy who will give the lisa a good home ...
[03:50] <jamesh> jdub: so you give the user direct access to the parallel port or USB device?
[03:50] <jdub> jamesh: ask the red hat dudes (J5 i think)
[03:51] <jamesh> of course, the nicest way to handle it is to assume your printer has a network card :)
[03:53] <trae> remember gang, ubuntu is utnubu spelled backwards.
[03:54] <whiprush> jdub: dude you totally forgot the case for rounded panel corners.
[03:54] <jdub> oh good point
[03:54] <jdub> i am a bad person
[03:54] <lifeless> then we can have the MacOS 5 theme
[03:55] <nojo> the MacOS 5 theme
[03:55] <nojo> lol
[03:56] <jg_> jdub: so I turn on browsing and now my gnome-print-manager hangs when I try to mess with it....
[03:57] <whiprush> jdub: heh, if you see the animation for opening windows .. it's like the current metacity animation ... distrubingly so.
[03:57] <tberman> daniels: sent.
[03:57] <jdub> jg_: heh, ouch :|
[03:57] <phlaegel> does enabling cups browsing by default even really constitute listening?
[03:58] <daniels> tberman: rad, thanks
[03:58] <chutwig> anyone want to write my paper for me
[03:58] <jg_> phlaegel: yeah, it got so far as to show what printers I have here....
[03:58] <chapeaurouge> any chance the transparent metacity patch gets included in ubuntu ?
[03:58] <phlaegel> jg_: same here. my point is that I don't think it violates the no-listening policy
[03:59] <jdub> chapeaurouge: we don't ship Xorg or composite
[03:59] <jdub> chapeaurouge: so, no point
[03:59] <jdub> jg_: what's the cupsd.conf snippet?
[03:59] <jg_> jdub: Browsing On
[04:00] <jg_> phlaegel: it does mean that cupsd is listening for incoming broadcast packets.
[04:00] <whiprush> tberman: around?
[04:00] <chapeaurouge> jdub: correct... do you have a link why you dont ship xorg? 
[04:00] <phlaegel> jg_: yeah, but in the same way that samba shares work.
[04:00] <jdub> chapeaurouge: because we didn't have time to handle it on top of everything else. next release.
[04:01] <chapeaurouge> jdub: way cool :) thx
[04:01] <whiprush> chapeaurouge: search teh Debian X lists.
[04:01] <jdub> whiprush: they don't have much to do with why we didn't ship xorg. :)
[04:02] <whiprush> guys like daniles don't see a benefit in packaging the monolithic stuff.
[04:02] <jg_> JD: I think one should also default to BrowseAddress @LOCAL
[04:02] <whiprush> jdub: dude I asked the guy. :p
[04:02] <jdub> whiprush: still doesn't have much to do with why we didn't ship it. :-)
[04:02] <whiprush> yes, I read the stuff.
[04:03] <whiprush> I think even morons like me would have done the same thing.
[04:03] <tberman> whiprush: yeah
[04:03] <jg_> jdub: the print manager won't even let me set the default printer without hanging.  Not good.
[04:04] <whiprush> plus, it's not like shipping Xorg _today_ matters. Maybe when upstream ships support for it, it will rule.
[04:04] <lonewolff> sorry to be a pain but is there a gui i can use in ubuntu to configure my network interfaces
[04:04] <whiprush> dude
[04:04] <whiprush> todd
[04:04] <whiprush> say it isn't so.
[04:04] <jdub> jg_: so with browsing on / browseaddress @LOCAL, it's listening for udp broadcasts
[04:04] <whiprush> "Todd Berman of the Mono project helped us out when we started up, and served as our sort of CTO," said Daniel Lang, a Seven L representative. "Todd pushed us to use Gentoo; he was really excited about its customizability and flexibility."
[04:04] <whiprush> tberman: tell me you're off the gentoo kick.
[04:04] <tberman> whiprush: im on ubuntu now
[04:04] <jg_> jdub: I think so, IIRC when I configured my debian box.
[04:04] <jdub> lonewolff: computer > system configuration > networking
[04:05] <tberman> whiprush: clee made me install it
[04:05] <whiprush> tberman: thank god.
[04:05] <tberman> whiprush: dude
[04:05] <tberman> whiprush: do me a favour
[04:05] <whiprush> dude/
[04:05] <tberman> whiprush: link my blog on just "Todd"
[04:05] <clee> heh. favour.
[04:05] <tberman> im trying to google-push my "Todd" stats
[04:05] <lonewolff> oops
[04:05] <jdub> jg_: hrm, print manager is working ok here, but i only have one printer on the network ;)
[04:05] <whiprush> which link?
[04:05] <tberman> whiprush: i thought that was an ars article
[04:05] <whiprush> oh oh
[04:05] <whiprush> crap
[04:05] <whiprush> that's hard
[04:05] <whiprush> give me a day or two on that
[04:05] <tberman> whiprush: dude
[04:06] <jg_> jdub: the BrowseAddress @LOCAL lis also important; you don't a cups server you run to trigger dialouts.
[04:06] <tberman> whiprush: hook a brother up
[04:06] <clee> and 'clee' as well.
[04:06] <tberman> Todd Berman gets my blog
[04:06] <clee> it's pretty neat.
[04:06] <tberman> but Todd gets fuckall about me
[04:06] <whiprush> dude, I just work for them ... this is no joke, the whole site is done by hand.
[04:06] <tberman> because everyone links me as Todd Berman
[04:06] <tberman> whiprush: haha :)
[04:06] <whiprush> it's hard. but i'll work it
[04:06] <joem> tberman, hmm..spawn is a tough one to beat
[04:06] <tberman> whiprush: well, if you can, that would own :)
[04:06] <whiprush> yes yes
[04:06] <tberman> joem: yeah
[04:06] <jdub> guys, off-topic stuff elsewhere please :-)
[04:06] <ioslipstream> hey whiprush, is that lisa pic running ubuntu real?
[04:06] <ioslipstream> =p
[04:06] <whiprush> ioslipstream: no
[04:07] <ioslipstream> rol, i know
[04:07] <ioslipstream> i saw your little disclaimer
[04:07] <jdub> jg_: hrm, i wonder if my printer even broadcasts.
[04:08] <phlaegel> ok, gnome-cups-manager really doesn't work very well, does it?
[04:08] <chutwig> not really
[04:08] <phlaegel> a printer shared on another machine show up, but I can't do anything with it.
[04:08] <jg_> jdub: I think the right thing is to have local printers *not* be advertized by default, and the local cups server "see" all broadcasts.
[04:08] <whiprush> oh dude
[04:08] <whiprush> the new print page is sweet
[04:08] <chutwig> phlaegel: in my experience it's been pretty broken
[04:08] <jg_> jdub: you don't want N cups servers advertizing the same printer.
[04:08] <phlaegel> the cups stuff in fedora works pretty nice
[04:08] <jdub> jg_: mmm
[04:08] <phlaegel> and kde
[04:09] <phlaegel> too bad I don't particularly like fedora or kde. :-)
[04:10] <drag> has gnome gotten faster? last time i tried it was about 5-6 months ago and it was really really slow
[04:10] <jdub> drag: depends on how much ram you have.
[04:10] <jg_> jdub: after maybe a 3 minute timeout, the manager finally pops up a window on the printer I wanted to examine the properties of....
[04:10] <lonewolff> does anyone know why my wireless card wouldnt show up in the network config app?
[04:11] <nojo> i dont know this gnome 2.8 feels more responsive to me too
[04:11] <joem> lonewolff, is it supported?
[04:11] <Mais> Hey- is there any updates on a nvidia driver for x86-64?
[04:11] <lonewolff> joem: it worked fine under linux before using the atmel_cs driver
[04:11] <WW> I'm use Synaptic to get a package called bluefish.  It started downloading, but now a window has popped up that says:
[04:11] <WW> Please insert the disk labeled:
[04:11] <WW> Ubuntu 4.10 _Warty Warthog_ - Unofficial i386 Binary-1 (20040915)
[04:11] <WW> in drive /cdrom/
[04:12] <joem> lonewolff, do you have the drivers for it loaded, and is the card working otherwise?
[04:12] <lonewolff> and i have set up wireless.opts the same way but the card does not show up as hardware in the network config app
[04:12] <lonewolff> yes the module atmel_cs is loaded and the loght is on on the card so its getting power and the card is not broken in any way
[04:12] <jdub> WW: insert your install disk, or you can remove that line from your sources if you don't want it
[04:13] <jg_> jdub: well, I have to go to bed....
[04:13] <WW> jdub: Ah, I forgot that line is still there.  I've never gotten this window before.
[04:15] <drag> i got a gig of ram.. 
[04:15] <drag> but even with that it used to be slow
[04:16] <drag> ok time to try this thing out :>
[04:16] <lonewolff> if only i coudl get this wireless to work 
[04:16] <nojo> lonewolff wuts the prob
[04:16] <lonewolff> the hardware is not showing up when i go to add a new wireless network connection 
[04:23] <jdub> does glxinfo always say indirect when you've got the ati drivers installed?
[04:23] <daniels> nope
[04:23] <daniels> it shouldn't
[04:23] <jdub> hrm, so does fglrxinfo
[04:24] <cybrjackle|lappy> someone tell my ubuntu just works?
[04:24] <jdub> daniels: hrm
[04:24] <cybrjackle|lappy> I feel like I need to go back to gentoo/slackware/fedora just so i can make things work right :)
[04:24] <daniels> jdub: are you sure you're using the fglrx driver, and not still using ati?
[04:25] <jdub> i changed XF86Config-4
[04:25] <jdub> hrm:
[04:25] <cybrjackle|lappy> You guys/gals have done some remarkable work!
[04:25] <jdub> $ fgl_glxgears
[04:25] <jdub> Error: couldn't get fbconfig
[04:25] <cybrjackle|lappy> When are we going to see a dev tree with say something like, xorg in it?
[04:25] <jdub> cybrjackle|lappy: soon, but after the final release
[04:26] <cybrjackle|lappy> final of worty?
[04:26] <jdub> yeah
[04:26] <jdub> we're concentrating on that atm
[04:26] <cybrjackle|lappy> thats like mid/late October right 8)
[04:26] <joebeastie> i assume after the final we wont see so many updates in warty main as we do now?
[04:26] <jdub> cybrjackle|lappy: yes
[04:26] <cybrjackle|lappy> cool
[04:26] <ioslipstream> seeing as ubuntu seems to do everything but send the girls to your door... can we expect the Hoary release to fill that gap, or should I file a bug report?
[04:27] <jdub> joebeastie: none, apart from security fixes, dataloss and high-impact bugs
[04:27] <cybrjackle|lappy> btw, your pre-release seems like a final 8)
[04:27] <jdub> ioslipstream: you're not using it right.
[04:27] <mike> Hello?
[04:27] <ioslipstream> jdub: heh
[04:27] <jdub> ioslipstream: i would close that bug "WORKSFORME"
[04:27] <cybrjackle|lappy> lol
[04:27] <ioslipstream> rol
[04:27] <joebeastie> jdub: that was what i thought. thanks. i heard about someone making or thinking about making an ubuntu applet to check for updates as well?
[04:28] <mike> I have a question and I am afraid I'll be slammed for it but...  how do I apt-get the kernel sources so I can build an SMP kernel?
[04:28] <jdub> joebeastie: that'll be in the next release too
[04:28] <jdub> mike: smp kernels are available already
[04:28] <mike> How?
[04:28] <joebeastie> jdub: thanks :)
[04:28] <mike> It didn't install...
[04:28] <cybrjackle|lappy> $ uname -a
[04:28] <cybrjackle|lappy> Linux neo 2.6.8.1-2-686-smp #1 SMP 
[04:28] <jdub> mike: apt-cache search linux smp :-)
[04:28] <lamont> mike: apt-cache search linux-image
[04:28] <lamont> gah
[04:29] <mike> O.K.  I'll try that... is it a matter of simply installing an image, or will I need to rebuild?
[04:29] <cybrjackle|lappy> jdub, are you going to move to gamin instead of fam in the final or in horay?
[04:29] <lamont> jdub: maybe we should create kernel-image packages that do nothing but Depend on the linux-image package... :-)
[04:29] <jdub> it's a binary kernel package, just install it
[04:29] <jdub> lamont: heh
[04:29] <jdub> cybrjackle|lappy: in hoary
[04:29] <thursday> is it normal to get 30-60 updates on a daily basis?
[04:30] <jdub> cybrjackle|lappy: but you can install it now from universe
[04:30] <jdub> cybrjackle|lappy: i'm using it atm :)
[04:30] <clee> daniels: you'll note that I have converted tberman not only from bash to zsh, but also from FC2 to Ubuntu
[04:30] <cybrjackle|lappy> does it remove or should you remove fam
[04:30] <jdub> thursday: between preview and final, with lots of bugfixing, sure :)
[04:30] <daniels> clee: impressive
[04:30] <mike> Thanks!  I'll give it a shot!!
[04:30] <jdub> cybrjackle|lappy: apt-get install --purge gamin
[04:30] <cybrjackle|lappy> thx
[04:30] <jdub> cybrjackle|lappy: that'll kill fam good :)
[04:30] <clee> daniels: Yeah, I rule. I sold him on zsh in about two minutes.
[04:30] <thursday> jdub, ahhh thanks
[04:30] <jdub> actually
[04:30] <daniels> clee: if only it was a two-minute job on you
[04:30] <jdub> if you don't need portmap, remove --purge it too
[04:31] <clee> daniels: I know, it was more like two years for me.
[04:31] <cybrjackle|lappy> jdub, was portmap only a dep of fam or is it used for something else?
[04:31] <mike> Yikes.  There's a hundred of 'em!
[04:31] <jdub> it's used by all kinds of things, but only by fam in the desktop install
[04:32] <jdub> daniels: so do you know what this lack of fbconfig foo is?
[04:32] <daniels> jdub: gbconfig?
[04:32] <jdub> or why i do not have gl love
[04:32] <daniels> jd	-users?
[04:32] <jdub> no, i pasted above
[04:32] <jdub> wrt ati drivers
[04:33] <tberman> clee: yeah
[04:33] <tberman> like i said
[04:33] <tberman> you owe me KDE->gnome and C++->C#
[04:33] <clee> now tberman thinks he's going to convert me from KDE development in C++ to GNOME in C#
[04:33] <jdub> dudes
[04:33] <jdub> off-topic stuff elsewhere please
[04:33] <tberman> jdub: does ubuntu detect a windows partition and setup dual-boot-fu?
[04:33] <lonewolff> hey again, i have my wireless hardware recognised but why cant i set the wep key in the gnome netork config ?
[04:33] <daniels> jdub: erm, that's really weeird
[04:33] <daniels> jdub: you can bounce me your xfree86 log if you like
[04:33] <jdub> tberman: yes, though you have to press escape quickly when it's booting (we don't show the grub menus atm)
[04:34] <tberman> jdub: thats a cfg option?
[04:34] <tberman> jdub: and you can set it to default to windows, right?
[04:35] <jdub> daniels: dri initialisation failed! (maybe driver kenrnel module missing or bad) 2d acceleration available (mmio) no 3d acceleration available
[04:35] <jdub> daniels: bong
[04:35] <jdub> tberman: yes
[04:35] <jdub> tberman: er, it's a menu.lst config option
[04:35] <tberman> jdub: nod.
[04:35] <daniels> jdub: have you got the fglrx module probed?
[04:35] <daniels> jdub: oh
[04:35] <jdub> in future, it'll show the menu if you have multiple OSes on install
[04:35] <jdub> daniels: yes, it's loaded
[04:35] <daniels> jdub: try setting Option "UseInternalAGPGART" "0" (or whatever it is)
[04:36] <locu> hello all
[04:36] <WW> Gosh darn it! I keep getting windows with the bottom hidden below the task bar at the bottom of the screen.
[04:36] <locu> got a quick question maybe somebody can help. I just downloaded the iso all excited about giving unbuntu a try. 
[04:37] <locu> however when i get to installing the base system  i get an "expected )" error
[04:37] <Slackeerb> how would I burn an audio cd on ubuntu; Like to play in a cd player?
[04:37] <jdub> daniels: (btw, nvidia_agp and agpgart are loaded, too)
[04:37] <Mais> speaking of 2d/3d acceleration.......jdub: anything related to being able to launch xserve with an AMD64 and a Nvidia card?
[04:37] <daniels> jdub: yeah, I'd say it's the internal agpgart bong biting you
[04:38] <jdub> Mais: i'm not sure if the drivers are in yet, but they might be
[04:38] <jdub> Mais: try installing nvidia-glx
[04:38] <thaytan> jdub: does the ubuntu kernel have any funky patches applied?
[04:39] <thursday> wait can you explain what main universe is or what's in it? so that i can decide about uncommenting it in sources.list
[04:39] <thaytan> I'm debating installing a 2.6.9-rc1 kernel in order to try out some patches that purport to support my SD slot
[04:39] <Mais> they still come up as outdated and removed or missing, mabye an upgrade will fix that, thanks
[04:39] <jdub> thaytan: not... amazingly funky
[04:40] <jdub> thursday: it's unsupported software from debian main
[04:40] <WW> Wow, this is messed.  I now have window whose top line is underneath the top task bar, and whose bottom edge is underneath the bottom task bar. TSNH.
[04:41] <jdub> daniels: using built in AGPGART module: yes
[04:41] <WW> Is this a know bug?
[04:41] <jdub> daniels: and then the same error as before
[04:42] <WW> known*
[04:42] <thursday> jdub, from woody?
[04:42] <jdub> WW: press alt and drag the window away
[04:42] <punkass_> any one know how to use the "windows" key for shortcuts?
[04:42] <jdub> thursday: no way dude, from sid. we branch off sid.
[04:42] <thursday> jdub, ahhh ok
[04:42] <daniels> jdub: you want to not use the built-in agpgart modlue
[04:42] <daniels> jdub: maybe it's NoUseInternalAGPGART
[04:42] <jdub> daniels: oh.
[04:42] <daniels> (this is why I hate fglrx.)
[04:42] <jdub> no, my config mistake
[04:42] <cybrjackle|lappy> whats the command to see how many pacakges are in the repo?
[04:43] <jdub> set to UseInternalAGPGART false
[04:43] <jdub> cybrjackle|lappy: apt-cache stats
[04:43] <daniels> ahr
[04:43] <WW> jdub: Thanks.  
[04:43] <cybrjackle|lappy> thx
[04:43] <cybrjackle|lappy> shwoing a deb fan some stuff
[04:43] <cybrjackle|lappy> and it's been awhile sine i've been in debian
[04:43] <jdub> daniels: should i expect bong ati adverts or anything?
[04:44] <Slackeerb> So no one at all knows how to burn a audio cd for cd players on ubuntu? =(
[04:44] <jdub> Slackeerb: there's no app that does it in supported
[04:44] <thursday> jdub, thanks much
[04:44] <jdub> Slackeerb: if you want to try things from universe, i hear k3b can do that well
[04:44] <WW> Is gnome/metacity supposed to allow me to drag the top of a window into the upper task bar?  Normally it does, but the height of this window spanned the height of the screen.
[04:44] <daniels> jdub: Option "UseInternalAGPGART" "no", apparently
[04:44] <daniels> jd	nope
[04:44] <daniels> jdub: just direct rendering
[04:44] <Slackeerb> jdub: isnt k3b a kde app thow?
[04:44] <WW> s/it does/it does _not_/
[04:45] <jdub> daniels: seems to grok both
[04:45] <jdub> daniels: using built in AGPGART module: no
[04:45] <daniels> rad
[04:45] <jdub> and same error ;)
[04:45] <daniels> BONG
[04:45] <daniels> want to bounce me your complete log?
[04:45] <tseng> boo
[04:45] <tseng> chvt 1 doesnt help
[04:45] <jdub> aha
[04:45] <daniels> tseng: does not doing chvt at all, help?
[04:45] <jdub> unable to acquire AGP, error "xf86_ENOMEM"
[04:45] <tseng> lettuce see
[04:46] <daniels> jdub: oh man
[04:46] <cybrjackle|lappy> hey, since there are some many devel's in here, how about a sparc port 8)
[04:46] <daniels> jdub: yeah, I got that, and I think disabling the internal AGPGART fixed that
[04:46] <jdub> cybrjackle|lappy: there are a couple of us with sparc machines who might start building
[04:46] <daniels> jdub: maybe try enabling it, and removing nvidia_agp and agpgart
[04:46] <jdub> cybrjackle|lappy: but it's not supported
[04:46] <lifeless> daniels: the -12 ati drivers gave me my opengl luv bacl.
[04:46] <lifeless> *back*
[04:46] <lifeless> but xrandr is still not happy.
[04:46] <tseng> here goes the button, wish me luck
[04:46] <cybrjackle|lappy> jdub, i don't care about support, just want a iso with packages to install.
[04:46] <cybrjackle|lappy> ;)
[04:47] <cybrjackle|lappy> jdub, i have a lot of sun hardware, can i help?
[04:47] <cybrjackle|lappy> tired of gentoo on sparc, takes to long, want to move to debian
[04:47] <thursday> The following packages have been kept back:
[04:47] <daniels> lifeless: yeah, apparently fglrx doesn't do xrandr. bong.
[04:47] <thursday>   bind9-host dnsutils gnomemeeting
[04:47] <jdub> daniels: hrm, can't remove nvidia_agp ;)
[04:47] <lifeless> daniels: arh.
[04:48] <baietas> hey guys.. i'm using kernel 2.6.8 but i can't find the sources with apt-get.. is that normal?
[04:48] <daniels> lifeless: i can't do anything about it
[04:48] <daniels> jdub: guh
[04:48] <lifeless> daniels: I know that phool :)
[04:48] <daniels> jdub: in this case, the only thing I can suggest is Google
[04:48] <jdub> cybrjackle|lappy: not sure yet, we haven't really thought about it much given work on warty
[04:48] <jdub> i might reboto into single user mode
[04:49] <cybrjackle|lappy> any good how-to's on porting to sparc?
[04:49] <jdub> no idea
[04:49] <cybrjackle|lappy> damn you man, what good are you ;-)
[04:49] <jdub> start with debian something, and start bootstrapping
[04:49] <jdub> but it won't be fun without a buildd
[04:50] <cybrjackle|lappy> hum
[04:50] <lifeless> apt-build might help
[04:50] <baietas> where do i find the kernel source for my 2.6.8? apt-get doednt have them
[04:50] <jdub> baietas: apt-cache search linux source
[04:50] <cybrjackle|lappy> is there any docs on what you did differnt from a normal debian build to your ubuntu build?
[04:51] <jdub> daniels: hah, gar, even in recovery mode it loads nvidia_agp and something mysterious is using it...
[04:53] <tseng> daniels: no love
[04:53] <daniels> tseng: ugh. what sort of chipset do you have?
[04:53] <daniels> jdub: yeep :\
[04:53] <tseng> intel + radeon mobility
[04:53] <baietas> how do i edit my Gnome Menu to remove/add Applications?
[04:53] <daniels> tseng: hooray
[04:54] <whiprush> anyone testing the new utopia stuff?
[04:54] <theantix> I am, yes
[04:54] <tseng> whiprush: how do you mean new
[04:54] <punkass_> baietas: right click on menu
[04:54] <whiprush> my usb2 connection to my ipod stopped working, and the firewire started working
[04:54] <baietas> looooollll
[04:54] <baietas> punkass thank you
[04:54] <punkass_> lol np
[04:54] <whiprush> tseng: the sources posted to the list.
[04:56] <tseng> haha i made the news page!
[04:56] <tseng> rock.
[04:56] <joebeastie> ?
[04:56] <whiprush> link?
[04:56] <jdub> daniels: erm
[04:56] <tseng> http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~mako/ubuntu-traffic/u20040924_05.html#4
[04:56] <jdub> daniels: no matching device section for instance ... found
[04:56] <RossT> Hey guys, I'm having some serious problems during install with the computer just flat shutting itself off. It seems to happen most often during package copying. Is this a known bug and/or should I try a nightly instead of the Warthog release?
[04:56] <jdub> daniels: then the same unable to acquire agp error
[04:57] <daniels> jdub: so much bong
[04:57] <cybrjackle|lappy> http://www.debian.org/ports/sparc/porting
[04:57] <cybrjackle|lappy> lookie there
[04:57] <whiprush> man, I must have missed "kernel cousin ubuntu".
[04:57] <joebeastie> did not realized there was one :)
[04:58] <joebeastie> now i have something new to read at work
[04:58] <whiprush> you know might what rule ... 
[04:58] <whiprush> something like the mandrake club, for ubuntu.
[04:58] <whiprush> so I can just pick a package, pay money, and have someone package it.
[04:59] <joebeastie> hum
[04:59] <cybrjackle|lappy> whiprush, that sounds like a hell of an idea
[04:59] <cybrjackle|lappy> um, no it doesn't 
[04:59] <cybrjackle|lappy> ;)
[04:59] <whiprush> heh
[04:59] <tseng> daniels: hmm
[04:59] <tseng> daniels: my birthday is oct 21
[05:00] <cybrjackle|lappy> with 13K + packages, is there something missing?
[05:00] <tseng> thx for the present.
[05:00] <cybrjackle|lappy> happy early birth day tseng, how old are you going to be :)
[05:00] <tseng> 20.
[05:00] <jdub> tseng: pipka's bday is 20th ;)
[05:00] <cybrjackle|lappy> ah, getting old
[05:00] <tseng> jdub: man
[05:01] <tseng> we'll be partying like mad that week
[05:01] <RossT> Almost ready for Social Security there. ~_^
[05:01] <fabbione> morning
[05:02] <vasi> has anybody had any problems with the hfsplus fs?
[05:02] <jdub> daniels: so it seems like it might work with the other drivers loaded
[05:02] <jdub> daniels: but that's a skanky error
[05:02] <vasi> it seems to be convinced atm that i have a FS mounted read-only, but mount says it's read-write
[05:03] <RossT> Little more bug info if it helps (probably doesn't): Kernel locks at ACPI on boot without the noacpi option so the shutting off maybe an acpi related issue except the shutdown still happens after it's booted with noacpi? Really confused, honestly.
[05:03] <tseng> vasi: yeah i read something like that on gnomeplanet today
[05:03] <daniels> jdub: try disabling AGP 8x in the BIOS
[05:03] <Jasona90> I just started using Ubuntu today, but i cant get web pages to load
[05:03] <daniels> tseng: no worries
[05:03] <vasi> thanks tseng, i'll take a look
[05:04] <Jasona90> I can ping GOOGLE but cant load the page
[05:04] <Jasona90> help!!!
[05:04] <RossT> Do you have a dns set, Jasona90?
[05:04] <Jasona90> im not sure i never have to mess with this stuff cus i mostly use windows
[05:04] <Jasona90> im trying to get into the linux stuff
[05:05] <RossT> Okay, well, I'm coming from a gentoo world, but can you look inside your /etc/ folder and see if you have file called resolv.conf?
[05:05] <Jasona90> k
[05:05] <jdub> daniels: bong, okay :)
[05:06] <punkass_> RossT: have you tried noapic or nolapic ?worked for me with issues on a laptop
[05:06] <Jasona90> yea There is
[05:06] <RossT> Using both, punkass_. Neither one seems to help.
[05:06] <RossT> Can you open it in gedit, Jasona90?
[05:06] <RossT> Tell me if there's anything in there?
[05:06] <punkass_> oh k, thought u said noacpi
[05:06] <baietas> does anyone know if the Philips WebCam Driver works with debian?
[05:06] <Jasona90> update-libc.d
[05:07] <Jasona90> is the only thibng
[05:07] <Jasona90> thing
[05:07] <Jasona90> *
[05:07] <RossT> I probably did, punkass_. Typo. My bad.
[05:07] <daniels> jdub: also, increasing your AGP aperture size (should be a BIOS option) can help
[05:07] <punkass_> ah
[05:07] <RossT> Try putting this in there Jason: "nameserver 4.2.2.1"
[05:07] <jdub> daniels: i'll try that next, if this doesn't work
[05:08] <jdub> daniels: currently 64MB
[05:08] <Jasona90> k
[05:08] <lifeless> daniels: is dbus a freedesktop project product or is dbus its own project just hosted @ freedesktop ?
[05:08] <daniels> jdub: try 128
[05:08] <RossT> Jasona90: Just put that in there as the only line, then save it. Then try to load up www.google.com.
[05:08] <daniels> lifeless: freedesktop project
[05:09] <jdub> daniels: hr, ok, that didn't work
[05:09] <jdub> will do 128 now
[05:09] <defendguin> when ubuntu releases for real i would hope the packages will be a little bit more stable
[05:09] <daniels> jdub: ber
[05:10] <jdub> defendguin: there will be no updates apart from security, dataloss and high impact fixes after the final release date.
[05:10] <jdub> defendguin: preview is precisely what it says it is. :-)
[05:10] <defendguin> i understand
[05:10] <daniels> defendguin: if any packages in particular are giving you problems, please file bugs at http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com -- we'd love to fix them
[05:10] <defendguin> im used to this being called a test release
[05:11] <jdub> daniels: same error
[05:11] <defendguin> can i file bugs against the network config app sucking?
[05:11] <jdub> defendguin: if you explain the problem usefully, sure.
[05:12] <cybrjackle|lappy> app sucking is a hard error to fix
[05:12] <defendguin> i think i can do that
[05:12] <daniels> jdub: this is with internalagpgart off?
[05:12] <daniels> jdub: if so, try Option "UseFastTLS" "2"
[05:13] <jdub> daniels: this is with useinternalagpgart true
[05:13] <jdub> i'll try the other way
[05:13] <daniels> jdub: yeah, try with false
[05:14] <jdub> daniels: btw, can we use -br? :)
[05:14] <daniels> jdub: the backing store?
[05:14] <jdub> black background
[05:14] <daniels> jdub: oh yeah
[05:14] <daniels> jdub: totally
[05:14] <jdub> cool
[05:15] <jdub> doesn't work with agpgart off and the nvidia_agp module loaded
[05:15] <jdub> will try with fasttls 2
[05:15] <Jasona90> The file is acually called resolvconf not resolv.conf
[05:15] <daniels> jdub: do you want black, or grey?
[05:15] <Jasona90> im assuming there is a big difference
[05:15] <jdub> same error
[05:16] <jdub> daniels: black seems nicer
[05:16] <daniels> fair cop
[05:16] <tseng> Jasona90: not the same.
[05:16] <jdub> nup same rrors all around town
[05:16] <daniels> argh, still ENOMEM?
[05:16] <Jasona90> yea
[05:16] <jdub> yeah
[05:16] <daniels> jdub: ugh
[05:16] <Jasona90> K so how do i Set up dns
[05:16] <daniels> jdub: anything useful in dmesg?
[05:16] <tseng> resolv.conf
[05:16] <jdub> aha
[05:16] <tseng> nameserver x.x.x.x
[05:16] <Jasona90> so make the file resolv.conf
[05:17] <tseng> yes.
[05:17] <jdub> agp detected, agpstate = 0x00000000 (hardware caps of chipset)
[05:17] <RossT> Jasona90: Make a file called resolv.conf, put it in /etc, then nameserver x.x.x.x         I use to use 4.2.2.1 for testing, it may still work.
[05:17] <jdub> fglrx:firegl_unlock]  *ERROR* process 648 using kernel context 0
[05:17] <daniels> jdub: bongish
[05:18] <daniels> jdub: mind bouncing the full log my way?
[05:18] <jdub> x log?
[05:18] <tvon|x31> jdub: Is there anyone slated to give ubuntu.com & co a 'design'?  Is that an in-house sorta thing or are volunteers wanted?
[05:18] <daniels> jdub: yeah
[05:18] <jdub> tvon|x31: in-house atm
[05:18] <Dashiva> is anyone going to do a forum?
[05:19] <jdub> Dashiva: on its way
[05:19] <jdub> Dashiva: in the mean time, try this:
[05:19] <jdub> http://lists.ubuntu.com/lurker/splash/index.en.html
[05:19] <cybrjackle|lappy> i'm off to bed, been working to much and no sleep and i'm in a websphere class for work <-- which is like sleeping, so i'm out ;)
[05:21] <cybrjackle|lappy> get this, last complaint of the night, we install websphere on aix/solaris but the class work is paying for has us installing it on windows??  The weblogic class i was in 2 weeks ago same thing, linux/solaris/hp-ux, class = windows
[05:29] <RossT> Okay, stupid question. I've managed to make it through the install, and get the thing booting, but it died halfway through the user setup. What options do you guys recommend I put on my kernel bootline to make 100% sure apic is gone? (pci=noapic, apic=off, etc)
[05:32] <RossT> Okay, it's noacpi, acpi=off, etc for grub. ....That's...really confusing.
[05:33] <tseng> i have: pci=noacpi nolapic
[05:33] <tseng> two different things
[05:33] <tseng> that you are mixing up.
[05:34] <RossT> tseng: Guess it's dyslexia. I finally know what it's like to be president.
[05:34] <RossT> Slightly different question then. It died half way through the firstboot series of questions. Is there a way I can rerun it to finish that setup?
[05:35] <tseng> run base-config
[05:35] <RossT> Thankee.
[05:35] <tseng> nps
[05:35] <clee> tseng: so when are you going to update to some newer mono and monodevelop builds?
[05:35] <tseng> clee: whats wrong with the ones now?
[05:36] <clee> tseng: tberman says that 0.5.1 is much better than 0.5
[05:36] <clee> (for monodevelop)
[05:36] <daniels> jdub: ehm, that log still has useinternalagpgart on
[05:36] <daniels> jdub: try making that false
[05:36] <tseng> clee, what could tberman possibly know? :P
[05:36] <clee> tseng: he also wants to know how you got 0.5 to work with 1.0.1
[05:36] <tseng> with a patch
[05:36] <tseng> of magical goodness.
[05:36] <clee> heh.
[05:37] <tseng> i have a source package up
[05:37] <tseng> got the patch from latexer.
[05:37] <clee> if you package 1.1.1, he says there's a patch that will make 0.5.1 work with 1.1.1
[05:37] <hornbeck> tseng: you do the ubuntu mono stuff right?
[05:37] <tseng> yes i do that.
[05:37] <clee> hornbeck: why else would I bitch at him about outdated packages? :)
[05:37] <tseng> clee: yes, I know
[05:37] <clee> tseng: well, ok then :)
[05:37] <hornbeck> clee: I have not been reading :)
[05:38] <hornbeck> how about a dbus-sharp?
[05:38] <tseng> 0.5.1 didnt work right off from the debian source
[05:38] <clee> tseng: "well if he knows, where are the packages?" -tberman
[05:38] <hornbeck> so we can play with beagle
[05:38] <tseng> i didnt get to tweaking it to much yet
[05:38] <tseng> tberman: speak for yourself, foo!
[05:38] <xf> howdy, trying to install ubuntu-amd64 on an asus k8v motherboard, grub doesn't seem to be installing properly. any ideas?
[05:38] <tberman> yeah yeah yeah
[05:38] <tberman> i walked over here
[05:38] <tseng> ya ya
[05:38] <tberman> thats a lot of effort
[05:38] <xf> /boot/grub/menu.lst looks fine to me, not sure what's going on
[05:38] <whiprush> jdub: dude. after you posted your blog I've had three calls to my house asking for dibs on the lisa.
[05:39] <tberman> 0.5.1 wont compile with 1.1.1 and gtk# 1.0.2 (mcs bugfix causes it) and it wont build assemblies without a different patch
[05:39] <tberman> tseng: latexer has a 0.5.1 patch to fix it up compilation and runtime w/ 1.1.1
[05:39] <tberman> tseng: it works fine as is with 1.0.2
[05:39] <tseng> he told me :)
[05:40] <tberman> tseng: aaah
[05:40] <tberman> tseng: good :)
[05:40] <tseng> ill try again
[05:40] <subterrific> anyone have experience working with SWIG+Python?
[05:40] <subterrific> and uhh, wrapping C++
[05:40] <xf> hi, anybody?
[05:41] <subterrific> with callbacks
[05:41] <hornbeck> xf: I don't know
[05:41] <subterrific> cause it's a really pain
[05:41] <xf> hornbeck: makes two of us
[05:41] <eldados> hey guys
[05:41] <tberman> tseng: cool cool
[05:41] <tberman> tseng: just wondering why ubuntu isnt all up to date and shit :)
[05:41] <xf> i'm installing it on my master secondary hd if that makes any difference.  tried booting from the ubuntu cd, mounting the hd, chroot'ing, then grub-install /dev/hda, all with no success
[05:42] <ultrafunk> xf: using Warty? or a nightly ISO?
[05:42] <xf> warty amd64
[05:42] <tseng> tberman: hit me with that patch
[05:43] <tberman> tseng: k, lemme pull it outta the archives
[05:43] <tberman> i lost it when clee made me format
[05:43] <tberman> he said he wouldnt feed me unless i formatted
[05:43] <tberman> he is a bastard
[05:43] <tseng> hm, im going to need to get patch for muine and blam too..
[05:43] <xf> it's hanging at the "GRUB loading, please wait..." prompt
[05:43] <tseng> if we go to 1.1.1
[05:43] <ultrafunk> xf: try - http://archive.ubuntu.com/cdimage/daily/20040924/warty-amd64.iso
[05:43] <xf> ok, ta
[05:43] <RossT> Things seem to be going well. Thanks very very much for the help everyone.
[05:43] <tseng> ill start with just monodev 0.5.1 and we'll go from there..
[05:43] <daniels> jdub: oh man
[05:43] <eldados> xf do you have another linux on?
[05:43] <daniels> jdub: when you come, you get to see my snoop doll
[05:44] <ultrafunk> xf: that's the ISO I used, for some reason Warty failed the same way when I tried to install it from CD
[05:44] <xf> eldados: no, but it's not hard to boot up a knoppix cd et al if needed
[05:44] <xf> ah, fair enough
[05:44] <xf> i mean, it installed fine, grub just doesn't want to play ball
[05:45] <eldados> ultrafunk what's the diff with this iso to the one from sep 15?
[05:45] <xf> doh, only getting 10kb/sec off that site
[05:45] <tberman> tseng: http://lists.ximian.com/archives/public/monodevelop-patches-list/2004-September/001566.html
[05:45] <xf> theoretically i should be able to boot from a cd, mount the hd, chroot into it, then apt-get update && apt-get -u dist-upgrade, right?
[05:45] <tseng> thanks dude.
[05:45] <tberman> tseng: the middle piece of the patch is unneeded, but wont hurt.
[05:45] <xf> assuming if it's a problem solved by a later grub?
[05:47] <hornbeck> nice planet.ubuntu
[05:47] <eldados> xf i tried ubuntu 64 b 4 and grub was fine, the problem i had was with X didn't pick my 6800...
[05:47] <tvon> ooh
[05:47] <tvon> http://christopher.aillon.org/blog/dev/fedora/20040928-gtk-file-chooser-builds.html
[05:47] <xf> what motherboard?  i'm randomly guessing here but maybe it's an ide chipset issue
[05:48] <daniels> eldados: the 6800 thing should be fixed now
[05:48] <eldados> daniels, with the 15-sep iso?
[05:48] <xf> never mind, i just reinstalled ubuntu exactly the same way i did before and now it's booting
[05:48] <daniels> no, a more recent daily build
[05:49] <eldados> is it xf86 or xorg?
[05:49] <ultrafunk> xf: mine was the k8v, same as yours
[05:49] <xf> what video card?
[05:49] <xf> i'm curious how well the amd64 nvidia drivers run on a 64-bit distro
[05:49] <eldados> 6800
[05:49] <xf> fingers crossed ut2004 etc runs faster than on win32 :-)
[05:50] <xf> ah, have a 5900, seemed decent for the price
[05:50] <eldados> xf I had gentoo 64 and unreal does not really run that much faster
[05:50] <xf> does a 64-bit kernel/userland really make things feel faster?
[05:51] <tseng> was the a 64 bit unreal build?
[05:51] <xf> i'm wondering why i'm going through amd64 distro pain if there isn't much advantage, heh
[05:51] <xf> i believe so, yes
[05:51] <tseng> or are you comparing apples to raisens
[05:52] <eldados> xf I'm asking the same... my yoper runs faster than gentoo 64!
[05:52] <xf> heh, probably because you aren't compiling everything in the background? :p
[05:52] <xf> i installed gentoo last night, but i'm too damn impatient, didn't even get past stage3
[05:52] <eldados> well, I must say compiling gentoo was fast, very fast. but day to day..
[05:53] <eldados> i started from boot strap and took about a week to get it up and running! sick of it :)
[05:53] <xf> heh
[05:54] <calc> xf: depends on the app
[05:54] <xf> yeow, any au ubuntu archive mirrors? i'm getting awful apt-get speeds
[05:54] <calc> xf: some things are much faster on amd64
[05:54] <xf> calc: ok, nice
[05:55] <jason__> ubunto didnt ask me for a root password
[05:55] <crimsun> for instance, loading that monstrosity called kde 3.3 :>
[05:55] <jason__> I dont know my root password
[05:55] <eldados> jason__ ther isn't any use sudo
[05:55] <vasi> jason__, there isn't one
[05:55] <crimsun> jason__: sudo. 'root' is not the way to go.
[05:55] <vasi> use sudo
[05:56] <jason__> oh k
[05:56] <calc> crimsun: run gnome, that will help ;)
[05:56] <mdz> http://www.ubuntulinux.org/support/documentation/faq/helpcenterfaq.2004-09-15.5722653677
[05:56] <crimsun> calc: i do ;)
[05:56] <vasi> tseng, the hfsplus problem i saw was fixed by doing hpmount/hpumount for some reason...
[05:57] <tseng> yeah
[05:58] <eldados> anyone got amd64 up and runing and can tell the diff?
[05:58] <jason__> I have never used Sudo what does it do
[05:58] <calc> eldados: things like oggenc run ~ 50% faster
[05:59] <eldados> cool, what about opening apps, office... 
[06:00] <calc> eldados: all depends on the app
[06:00] <tseng> tberman: so i got the deb updated and building
[06:00] <jason__> how do i use sudo to set up the password
[06:00] <calc> nothing is slow on my box even in i386 though so i can't tell on normal non cpu bound apps
[06:00] <tseng> tberman: when i go to the new project thinger, i get an error about a missing template, is that your bug or mine?
[06:01] <xf> sounds like 64-bit is better for number-crunching stuff
[06:01] <calc> xf: it has lots more usable registers which helps
[06:01] <jason__> what is sudo
[06:02] <eldados> jason__ did you follow the link above?
[06:02] <jason__> i cant get wep pages to load 
[06:02] <jason__> thats why i need root access so i can change the resolv.config file
[06:03] <jason__> resolv.conf
[06:03] <eldados> jason__ it's just using the root as a normal user, just like when you type su and password
[06:03] <jason__> i dont know the password for Su
[06:04] <jason__> i dont remeber setting one
[06:04] <eldados> it's your user pass
[06:04] <jason__> yea i tried that
[06:04] <jason__> but it says authentication failed
[06:04] <eldados> did you sudo command?
[06:04] <jason__> i have never used sudo
[06:05] <jason__> dont know anything about it
[06:05] <jason__> i always have used distrobutions that set all this stuff up for me
[06:05] <jason__> like suse and redhat
[06:05] <eldados> :) type sudo and than the command you want it will ask you for a password, enter your user pass
[06:05] <xf> if you're lazy you can always 'sudo /bin/bash', or 'sudo -s'
[06:06] <xf> which is the same as su, really
[06:06] <xf> best to use sudo to invoke individual commands, though, concept is that you only use it when you do things that can potentially be dangeroud
[06:06] <xf> s/od/os/
[06:06] <xf> er, ud/us even. more coffee i think
[06:07] <eldados> xf what speed did you get from the daily site?
[06:07] <xf> 10kb/sec
[06:08] <xf> same speed as i'm getting in my initial ubuntu install apt-get
[06:08] <eldados> :) i'm getting 80-100kb ...
[06:08] <xf> 3 hours remaining :-(
[06:08] <xf> you in au?
[06:08] <eldados> yes
[06:08] <xf> oh
[06:08] <xf> haha, my fault then
[06:08] <xf> other machine's downloading at 180kb/sec
[06:08] <eldados> :)
[06:09] <eldados> I have to share with the rest of the office :)
[06:09] <xf> i have to share with myself
[06:09] <xf> which is hard enough, heh
[06:09] <tseng> sharing with yourself is the suck.
[06:09] <tseng> never enough to go around
[06:09] <xf> right on
[06:10] <eldados> got to go and do some work, i sepose...
[06:10] <eldados> c u guys l8tr
[06:10] <xf> later
[06:13] <Zolrath> Curse you GRUB! Or my own stupidity.. one of the two.
[06:14] <xf> haha, sounds like a familiar problem
[06:14] <Zolrath> Upon restart even if I reformat the whole drive I am lucky enough to get to stare at the grub loading prompt.
[06:14] <Zolrath> Am I doomed for failure?
[06:14] <xf> i'm having exactly the same problem
[06:14] <xf> as stupid as this sounds
[06:14] <xf> reinstall
[06:14] <xf> it seems to work on every 2nd install. i don't know why either.
[06:14] <Zolrath> Ive done it about six times heh
[06:15] <Zolrath> Perhaps 7 times is the charm
[06:15] <xf> heh
[06:16] <jason__> some of my pages will load like ubuntu but most do not
[06:16] <Zolrath> GRUB loading, please wait...
[06:16] <Zolrath> how long does it take for you when it finally worked xf?
[06:16] <xf> well
[06:16] <xf> it did
[06:16] <xf> then i reinstalled because i realised i put it on the wrong hd
[06:16] <xf> and having the same issue now
[06:16] <Alexa> hey all
[06:16] <xf> so trying a reinstall
[06:17] <jason__> so if i dont have resolv.conf this will cause most pages not to load
[06:17] <Alexa> i need some help setting up a pcmcia port and a wireless card on debian, im really used ot gentoo, so i dont really know how the package system works
[06:17] <Zolrath> I'm assuming when it finally works it will be pretty much instant?
[06:17] <xf> reinstalling to solve a linux issue makes me feel stupid
[06:17] <xf> but beats me what the issue is. grub's config file looked fine.
[06:17] <fragment> xf: what's the problem?
[06:18] <xf> waht Zolrath said, on reboot after install grub hangs
[06:18] <jason__> alexa you go to WT
[06:18] <fragment> xf: Any other OSes on the box?
[06:18] <Alexa> jason__ hahaha
[06:18] <jason__> lol whats up
[06:18] <xf> there's a winxp ntfs install on the first hd, but i'm about to wipe it anyway
[06:19] <xf> only thing that could be throwing grub/the installer out is i'm installing on the primary slave
[06:19] <Zolrath> Mine had windows xp the first time, so after a few reinstalls I just reformatted the whole drive
[06:20] <fragment> xf: Oh, also, something bizarre that happened to me the other day, I had a drive set to cable select and it and everything disagreed on what should be happening.  The motherboard swore it didn't exist, GRUB swore it was the slave, even though it was the only drive on the cable.  I jumpered it to be the master, and (ugh) reinstalled, and everything was great.  I probably could should have...
[06:20] <fragment> ...just tweaked the fstab and reinstalled grub, but the install is painless.
[06:21] <xf> heh, CS certainly gives headaches
[06:21] <fragment> xf: So your slave drive install could be a culprit.
[06:23] <fragment> I've also had issues in the past swapping back and forth from Windows to Linux installs.  Usually blowing away the MBR works.
[06:23] <fragment> I used to keep a Win98 boot disk handy for just such an occasion.  fdisk /mbr
[06:24] <fragment> XP recovery console can do the same, and it will still boot into XP.  Handy if you need to kill an old GRUB install.
[06:24] <fragment> Though, I haven't run XP at home in over a year, I think.
[06:24] <calc> fragment: erm xp recovery console has no fdisk
[06:25] <calc> i tried doing that yesterday since someone had previously said it did
[06:25] <fragment> calc: Yeah, but it has something that does the same trick.  bootsomething
[06:25] <calc> oh
[06:25] <fragment> makeboot, fixboot....that's it.  Fixboot
[06:26] <calc> thx :)
[06:26] <xf> fragment: yeah, tried all that, didn't work
[06:26] <fragment> If I remember correctly, fixboot actually just erases the MBR and the machine boots to the first bootable partition instead.
[06:26] <defendguin> hmm i just had a problem when trying to play a dvd 
[06:26] <xf> but i just reinstalled
[06:26] <xf> and now it booted up.
[06:26] <xf> this is wierd
[06:26] <defendguin> X Error of failed request:  BadAlloc (insufficient resources for operation)
[06:27] <xf> like i said, i feel stupid doing a reinstall to solve a linux problem
[06:27] <defendguin> Major opcode of failed request:  141 (XVideo)
[06:27] <xf> it's like when a client reboots a linux server because 'it's not working'
[06:27] <xf> and it always turns out to be a client windows issue
[06:27] <defendguin> anyone spead DVD?
[06:27] <fragment> I've had two painless ubuntu installs so far, and I'm sold.  I've always been a Debian fan, though.
[06:27] <defendguin> speak
[06:27] <fragment> defendguin: Sorry, not here.
[06:27] <xf> i've been saying for years i want a debian with 6 month release cycles
[06:28] <xf> as soon as ubuntu's stable enough for server use, i'll definitely be deploying it
[06:28] <fragment> defendguin: Though, it almost sounds like an out of memory issue.  Just for kicks, did you try to fire up the DVD player with sudo?
[06:28] <xf> kudos to the ubuntu team if they manage to keep their promise of 6 month cycles, supported for 18 months
[06:28] <xf> that's a hell of a lot of work
[06:28] <defendguin> hmmmm
[06:28] <defendguin> good suggestion
[06:28] <fragment> xf: I'm thinking of setting up a netatalk server for a friend using Ubuntu, just to see how it goes.
[06:29] <xf> i'm curious how the company supporting ubuntu actually makes a living, considering all is oss and free
[06:29] <fragment> defendguin: It might also be worth a 'apt-get update && apt-get dist-upgrade'
[06:29] <xf> given some smart business planning, i guess they could act as a consultancy for linux deployments, particulary for goverments; certainly needed
[06:29] <fragment> Is it really a company doing the support?  I thought it was a community effort.
[06:29] <subterrific> xf: the same way any open source company makes money: selling support
[06:30] <defendguin> fragment, i am fully updated
[06:30] <xf> subterrific: sure, but many open source companies that give everything they have away for free barely make enough to support theirselves
[06:30] <xf> which is dissapointing; i love oss business models, but go figure
[06:30] <defendguin> fragment, you think this might have something to do with the amount of memory on my video card?
[06:30] <fragment> Also, almost worthy of going toe to toe with Lindows in the Grandma-Enabled Linux department :)
[06:30] <xf> take redhat and the whole fedora/rhel move
[06:31] <fragment> defendguin: Maybe.
[06:31] <Niterider> quick question, when dual booting, how do i access my windows partition with ubuntu, i'm used to other deb based distros and kde, where my partition was on the desktop, i couldn't seem to find out how to jump to my windass partition in ubuntu, can it be done in gnome and ubuntu?
[06:31] <subterrific> xf: you don't think redhat is doing well?
[06:31] <xf> subterrific: sure, they're doing brilliantly now
[06:31] <xf> but to move to such a model would have raised questions about its profitability before
[06:32] <fragment> Niterider: You'll want to see if you have the NTFS filesystem module installed (I'm on a Windows laptop at the moment, so can't check).
[06:32] <subterrific> well now that redhat proved it can be done, canonical can follow
[06:32] <fragment> Niterider: cat /proc/cpuinfo
[06:32] <fragment> whoops, make that /proc/filesystems
[06:32] <Niterider> k..but i don't need ntfs, just fat 32
[06:32] <fragment> Niterider: Oh, perfect
[06:32] <fragment> Niterider: Windows on the first partition?
[06:32] <subterrific> digium is another company that is doing fantastic giving away their software product as oss
[06:32] <xf> heh, if ubuntu sold something like rhel, i'd almost definitely buy it
[06:32] <Niterider> yup
[06:33] <Niterider> it was my only real prob with it
[06:33] <diente> hi
[06:33] <fragment> Niterider: Try opening a command line, and: sudo mount -t vfat /dev/hda1 /mnt/floppy
[06:33] <fragment> (or some other mount point)
[06:34] <diente> am having some trouble with my sound....
[06:34] <Niterider> otherwise i love it (need to really get used to Gnome though) but it's seems to finally be one i can say i'll stick with
[06:35] <Niterider> super...thanks fragment
[06:35] <fragment> Niterider: If that works, and you can see your Windows filesystem, you can modify /etc/fstab so it'll always show up in a mountpoint (i.e. folder) of your choice.  'man fstab' is a good place to start
[06:35] <diente> i had been all the afternoon tryng to get it up....
[06:35] <xf> subterrific: nice, they have any financial reports et al?
[06:35] <Niterider> now i'll put it back on
[06:35] <mr_hat> where are the ppc iso's of ubuntu
[06:35] <fragment> diente: When I have that problem, I start thinking 'Viagra'....
[06:35] <Niterider> k
[06:35] <fragment> :D
[06:35] <diente> fragment,  LOL
[06:35] <Niterider> thanks a million
[06:36] <xf> i recently left a company where we were supporting an oss project, company changed their mind and went completely closed source
[06:36] <fragment> Niterider: No problem!
[06:36] <diente> that bluepill
[06:36] <Zolrath> Curses
[06:36] <fragment> diente: Sorry, couldn't resist the joke.
[06:36] <Niterider> bbl
[06:36] <diente> fragment, np
[06:36] <mr_hat> anyone?
[06:36] <xf> despite the fact we never "lost" any sales to oss; in fact, it gave us some as the endusers needed support
[06:36] <fragment> diente: Which sound card or chipset is in your machine?
[06:36] <mr_hat> is there a ppc iso?
[06:36] <subterrific> xf: not sure, i just know the guy who started digium and wrote asterisk
[06:36] <diente> intel 810
[06:37] <fragment> mr_hat: No idea.  I  saw ppc mentioned on the Web site, but haven't seen it.
[06:37] <xf> ah, see, they'd be making loads in support
[06:37] <fragment> diente: Does it get autodetected?
[06:37] <diente> yup
[06:37] <xf> it's an area quite in demand, and there's very little offerings
[06:37] <fragment> diente: but no sound?
[06:37] <diente> in fact alsaconf tell me it is installed then
[06:37] <diente> alsactl: load_state:1134: No soundcards found...
[06:37] <subterrific> xf: yup, and they sell hardware too. they've got to be making a killing
[06:37] <xf> when you start to delve into commidity items (such as operating systems), things become quite a bit harder, imho
[06:37] <diente> after i get that message
[06:37] <fragment> diente: hmm.
[06:37] <xf> subterrific: i'd be bloody surprised if they wern't :-)
[06:38] <diente>  Now ALSA is ready to use.
[06:38] <diente>  For adjustment of volumes, use your favorite mixer.
[06:38] <Zolrath> Still getting the GRUB loading hang.. curses
[06:38] <fragment> diente: My wife's iBook is in for repair, so I can't check my desktop.  I use the same drivers.
[06:38] <xf> Zolrath: what kind of hd are you installing on, ata or sata?
[06:38] <Zolrath> ata
[06:38] <diente> this is very strange...
[06:38] <fragment> diente: And if you pop open a mixer (gmix?  mixer applet?) what happens?
[06:39] <diente> no soundcard installed...
[06:39] <xf> Zolrath: btw, with my install i told the partitioner thingy to automatically allocate one entire hard drive.  i'm guessing that perhaps made a difference (although i did do a dud install with it, too)
[06:39] <fragment> Zolrath: Does GRUB give you any error message?
[06:39] <Zolrath> Nope it it just sits at GRUB loading, please wait...
[06:39] <fragment> diente: Anything interesting if you 'dmesg |
[06:39] <eazel7> hi
[06:39] <fragment>  'dmesg | less' ?
[06:39] <fragment> Hi eazel7 
[06:39] <punkass_> diente: what happens if u run alsamixer?
[06:40] <diente> punkass_ alsamixer: function snd_ctl_open failed for default: No such device
[06:40] <punkass_> hmm ok..will i would guess that an oss driver is getting loaded before the alsa one
[06:41] <jason__> If i can get a Some pages to Load But not all is this a DNS problem
[06:41] <fragment> jason__: probably
[06:41] <eazel7> may I suggest something to the packagers?
[06:41] <fragment> jason__: You can test by doing a DNS lookup of the site and then trying with the IP.
[06:41] <diente> hmmm
[06:42] <diente> i dont see any oss derived driver when i try lsmod
[06:42] <fragment> jason__: pop open a terminal and try 'host www.google.com' or 'nslookup www.google.com' and then substitute the IP for the hostname in the URL.
[06:42] <diente> fragment,  nothing strange in dmesg
[06:42] <punkass_> hmm yeah, ubuntu has the 810 oss drivers pre-black listed to i think
[06:43] <Zolrath> I think I may fail.
[06:43] <xf> nope, still only getting 10kb/sec from archive.ubuntu, and definitely have bandwidth available
[06:43] <diente> yup, they are blacklisted
[06:43] <Treenaks> punkass_: which is good, because they're very b0rked on my laptop
[06:44] <punkass_> i agree
[06:44] <fragment> Treenaks: heheh
[06:45] <diente> hehehe
[06:45] <fragment> Actually, she can't either.
[06:46] <diente> well, i will continue googleing, maybe it can answer me lol
[06:46] <hiweed> would you tell me how to create or modify a task for tasksel or aptitude use?
[06:46] <fragment> diente: good luck
[06:46] <diente> thx
[06:46] <punkass_> yeah..im not sure..good luck
[06:47] <fragment> diente: It might also be worthwhile to download Knoppix or Morphix or one of the other live-cd-based distros and see what happens with your sound.
[06:47] <fragment> diente: If it works, you might be able to work backwards and figure out what's different between the two (other than driver versions)
[06:48] <punkass_> diente: use mepis...it uses alsa and is based on debian
[06:48] <diente> fragment,  got sound wit knoppix
[06:48] <punkass_> im not sure what knoppix uses for sound
[06:48] <diente> punkass, fragment, my base sistem its debian...
[06:48] <diente> and i dont have any trouble with it..
[06:48] <fragment> diente: download, or borrow.  Even with broadband, it's no fun to download a few hundred megs just for a test....
[06:49] <diente> am tryng to make a tut, for my LUG
[06:49] <Alex_> i need to find out what my actual PCMCIA port is, and what driver i need for it
[06:49] <punkass_> does alsaconf find your card?
[06:49] <diente> punkass_ it does
[06:49] <jdub> diente: is this with an ubuntu live cd, or with an install?
[06:50] <diente> installed
[06:50] <jdub> your sound hardware?
[06:50] <diente> i810
[06:50] <jdub> lsmod | grep 810
[06:51] <diente> jdub, got it, as 8x0
[06:51] <jdub> oh yeah ;)
[06:51] <jdub> what's in /dev/snd/ ?
[06:51] <diente> controlC0 and timer
[06:52] <jdub> lsmod | grep ^snd -> what else is loaded?
[06:53] <diente> ac97, pcm, timer, pagealloc, snd_seq_device, soundcore
[06:53] <diente>  snd_intel8x0m,snd_intel8x0,snd_ac97_codec,snd_pcm,snd_timer,snd_mpu401_uart,snd_rawmidi,snd_seq_device
[06:54] <fragment> Who was looking for the PPC ISO?
[06:54] <jdub> diente: hrm
[06:54] <punkass_> anyone here use eclipse with there visual editor?
[06:54] <diente> diente@chica /dev/snd $ cat /proc/asound/cards
[06:54] <diente> --- no soundcards ---
[06:54] <fragment> Looks like it's at http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily/current/
[06:55] <fragment> punkass_: Nope, but the Ubuntu Web site has a link to the Java on Debian page that mentions something about it.
[06:56] <punkass_> hmm ok..just installed and there no create Visual class menu item...
[06:58] <fragment> http://wiki.osuosl.org/display/DEV/Java+on+Debian looks like the URL, but just checked, it's probably not helpful in your case.
[06:59] <punkass_> thanks anyways
[06:59] <fragment> Anyone know if Ubuntu plans to use jigdo?
[07:00] <jdub> fragment: there's been a bit of discussion, but not much forward motion
[07:00] <jdub> fragment: you can always rsync daily to daily (or otherwise)
[07:00] <fragment> jdub: Ah, good idea.
[07:00] <fragment> jdub: Are you an Ubuntu developer?
[07:01] <jdub> i am a robot from the future, currently naked and looking for clothes
[07:01] <jdub> although i look suspiciously like one of the ubuntu developers
[07:01] <mako> fragment: he likes to think he is :)
[07:01] <fragment> heheheh
[07:01] <fragment> Well, for anyone present and responsible, nice job.
[07:01] <Agrajag> I thought I saw jigdo files for the daily ubuntu isos
[07:01] <diente> oh, yeah i agree
[07:02] <mako> fragment: i wouldn't believe him for a second if his name wasn't on all the release manager's mail
[07:02] <fragment> Agrajag: Ah, yeah, I'm blind: http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily/current/warty-i386.jigdo
[07:02] <fragment> Agrajag: Thanks!
[07:03] <mako> jdub: can i get source for your ubuntu talk?
[07:04] <Alex_> if i copied and compiled this, would it work? http://www.linuxhq.com/kernel/v2.6/8/drivers/pcmcia/o2micro.h
[07:04] <mako> jdub: it appears i will be giving a couple of those here in The Big Apple :)
[07:06] <jdub> mako: http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~jdub/ubuntu-1-2-3/
[07:06] <jdub> oh
[07:06] <jdub> except i have to update them a bit
[07:06] <jdub> but there's a start
[07:06] <mako> jdub: i saw those
[07:07] <mako> jdub: i was looking for the source, i am blind and missing a link somewhere?
[07:07] <jdub> ah, no
[07:07] <defendguin> hey jeff is ubuntu getting any support contracts?
[07:07] <jdub> that's just the html
[07:07] <jdub> defendguin: we're doing ok :)
[07:08] <thursday> you guys offer support?
[07:08] <jdub> yes, via canonical.com
[07:08] <punkass_> jdub: so python is going to play a big part?
[07:08] <defendguin> it just seems like such a nice project i dont wanna see it not be profitable
[07:08] <jdub> if you're interested, mail jeff.waugh@canonical.com
[07:08] <jdub> punkass_: indeed
[07:08] <punkass_> cool...just made my first python/pygtk/glade app the other day
[07:09] <punkass_> jdub: do you know of any good tutorials/howtos on making applets with python?
[07:09] <subterrific> i'm working on some python code right now
[07:09] <Nafai> punkass_: I think there is one on pygtk.org...just a sec
[07:09] <subterrific> actually, trying to wrap a horribly designed c++ library in python using SWIG
[07:09] <theantix> punkass, there are some good ones you can find on google
[07:09] <subterrific> it's a total nightmare
[07:10] <punkass_> i did up a little app that scans for wireless networks and connects/ and stores wep keys etc
[07:10] <Nafai> punkass_: Plus I have a very brief example in my PyGtk talk I gave at PyCon: http://www.travishartwell.net/pycon2004/
[07:10] <punkass_> works pretty good
[07:10] <subterrific> punkass_: i wrote an applet in python, there aren't really any good tutorials. most of what i found on the internet was out of date
[07:10] <Nafai> punkass_: http://www.pygtk.org/articles/applets_arturogf/
[07:10] <punkass_> subterrific: yeah thats all i found too
[07:11] <punkass_> Nafai: been all over that one..but i couldnt even get his example to run
[07:11] <fragment> jdub: Mind if I ask, what kinds of contracts come your way?
[07:11] <punkass_> kept getting bonobo activation errors
[07:11] <Nafai> Hrm.
[07:12] <Nafai> It's been a while since I've tried his example.
[07:12] <fragment> jdub: Training? Integration? Customization?
[07:12] <punkass_> he has a run-in-window switch and that works...still get the error but it works
[07:12] <vasi> who would i talk to about getting mol (mac-on-linux) into ubuntu? it's quite essential for a lot of ppc linux users
[07:12] <jdub> fragment: we do professional services for ubuntu, and can be very flexible in terms of services offered
[07:12] <jdub> vasi: it'll be in universe, whether it builds or not. perhaps check out why it's not building.
[07:13] <jdub> hrm
[07:13] <justdave> it's in universe.  it's built.  but it doesn't work.
[07:13] <jdub> actually
[07:13] <justdave> compiled against the wrong kernel
[07:13] <jdub> justdave: ahar
[07:13] <justdave> mol has kernel-specific drivers
[07:13] <vasi> yeah, the drivers aren't prebuilt
[07:14] <vasi> i have it working locally, i just want to help get it working for everyone
[07:14] <justdave> I grabbed source and tried to build it the other day, but didn't get very far.  all the depends have the debian package names for the kernel packages
[07:14] <vasi> er, s/have/HAD/
[07:14] <jdub> vasi: if you patch up the source package to do the right thing, we can fix it in universe
[07:14] <Nafai> punkass_: Here's something very brief, starting here: http://www.travishartwell.net/pycon2004/fslc/slides-27.html
[07:14] <punkass_> Nafai: on # 14 now ;)
[07:15] <vasi> jdub, it needs a rebuild for every kernel upgrade though...is that doable?
[07:15] <Nafai> punkass_: :)
[07:15] <jdub> vasi: we can build all of debian sid's main in less than a week :)
[07:15] <fragment> jdub: Nice
[07:16] <jdub> (at least the bits that work in universe atm)
[07:16] <vasi> alright, just making sure it's ok...i'll log everything i have to do to make it work, and then i'll come back and get help with debianizing everything
[07:16] <subterrific> jdub: what kind of build setup is that? bunch of opterons?
[07:16] <punkass_> Nafai: ah that was probably it...do think i had the server file in the right spot
[07:16] <jdub> vasi: if you apt-get source mac-on-linux (or the drivers package if it's separate)
[07:16] <jdub> vasi: just make a patch
[07:16] <lifeless> subterrific: intels for the ix86 
[07:16] <Nafai> punkass_: *nods*
[07:16] <jdub> subterrific: we have amd64 machines for those
[07:17] <lifeless> mac xservs for ppc 
[07:17] <punkass_> how is multi-threading in python?
[07:17] <jdub> subterrific: g5 xserves for ppc32 (and hopefully ppc64 next release)
[07:17] <vasi> oooh xserves
[07:17] <lifeless> punkass_: it works well, with one caveat.
[07:17] <subterrific> thats gotta be one sweet setup
[07:17] <lifeless> which is the thing called the GIL - global interpreter lock.
[07:17] <Nafai> punkass_: Avoid threading anyway.
[07:17] <jdub> Nafai: haha
[07:18] <Nafai> jdub: Sorry.  I can't help myself.
[07:18] <punkass_> well how do u seperate a button press with the execution of something
[07:18] <lifeless> which means that C modules block all threads as they enter the module, until the module has released the GIL, and so forth.
[07:18] <punkass_> i want the gui to stay active will foo is running
[07:18] <lifeless> punkass_: usually via an event queue & event loop.
[07:18] <lifeless> non blocking IO is your friend.
[07:18] <punkass_> ah ok...more reading for me
[07:18] <lifeless> if you're going gtk, there is good stuff in there,
[07:19] <lifeless> and gnome vfs has async io support abstracted for you.
[07:19] <jdub> Nafai: when you really think you want threads, eat an apple. and write a state machine.
[07:19] <punkass_> lots more reading fo rme :)
[07:19] <punkass_> lol
[07:19] <subterrific> lifeless: you wrap blocking i/o calls in Py_BEGIN_ALLOW_THREADS so it doesn't block
[07:19] <subterrific> or did i misunderstand?
[07:20] <Nafai> I guess I should sleep sometime soon
[07:20] <subterrific> threads are ok for one case: long computations
[07:21] <Zolrath> whoo hoo
[07:21] <Zolrath> It only took 12 tries
[07:21] <Zolrath> but after all those reinstalls it finally let me finish installation
[07:21] <fragment> jdub: Any Stormix refugees on the Ubuntu project?
[07:22] <chutwig> hah, i remember stormix
[07:22] <fragment> Not a bad distro.  I was sorry to see it go.
[07:22] <chutwig> i just remember the blinding blue-and-green installer
[07:23] <theantix> a friend of mine used to work for stormix... wow that brings back memories
[07:23] <fragment> I kept waiting for their clustering bits and pieces to come together.
[07:23] <jdub> fragment: no idea. :)
[07:24] <fragment> What was the marketingspeak?  NOW...Network of Workstations.   Lots of good ideas in there, though.  Good people, too, I hear.
[07:24] <jdub> NOW was progeny, wasn't it?
[07:24] <justdave> what's the difference between linux-powerpc and linux-image-powerpc?
[07:24] <fragment> jdub: Oh, yep, you're right.
[07:25] <fragment> jdub: Mixing my history
[07:25] <fragment> jdub: Must be past my bedtime.
[07:27] <theantix> fragment, why not just use ssh for file sharing and remote access?
[07:27] <fragment> Something Mac-like.  Drop someone's public key in a folder and it gives them permission....
[07:28] <fragment> theantix: SFS works like NFS, so no FTP/SCP-style client issues.
[07:29] <fragment> theantix: Unless there's some way to mount a filesystem through SSH that I don't know about...which is likely....
[07:29] <justdave> yeah, that'd be cool... have an authorized_keys.d/ directory :)
[07:29] <justdave> drop the .pub files in it instead of having to cat them onto a single file
[07:29] <fragment> exactly
[07:29] <theantix> fragment, you can use shfs to do that, works pretty good but has to be a kernel module so not newbie-friendly
[07:29] <fragment> theantix: Ah
[07:30] <fragment> theantix: I'll have to look into that.  Thanks!
[07:30] <theantix> no problem -- there are a few other similar projects too,though I don't know the names offhand
[07:31] <fragment> I suspect there's something lurking in GNOME's VFS somewhere, too.
[07:31] <subterrific> you can mount sftp:// with gnome-vfs
[07:31] <fragment> I've been too lazy to go hunting.
[07:31] <jdub> of course
[07:31] <subterrific> i do it all the time
[07:31] <subterrific> has a few bugs, but generally works great
[07:31] <jdub> fragment: connect to server... -> sftp:// etc.
[07:31] <jdub> fragment: looks just like a filesystem mount
[07:32] <fragment> Oh, heck, OK.
[07:32] <jdub> and will work in (most) of your gnome apps
[07:32] <subterrific> hell yeah, i just got this callback working from c++->python
[07:33] <vasi> is the linux-source package contain the same sources as are used to build linux-image? or do i have to patch?
[07:34] <defendguin> no ubuntu stickers yet?
[07:34] <subterrific> vasi: same source
[07:34] <vasi> er, s/is/does/
[07:34] <vasi> thanks subterrific
[07:34] <fragment> At one time, I was messing around quite a bit with Zope, LDAP-authentication and WebDAV to get some convenient access, but it was just too cumbersome and no (easy?) SSL support.
[07:34] <theantix> defendguin, the first release isn't even out yet... =)
[07:34] <subterrific> vasi: and if you want to use a vanilla kernel and patch, just use the linux-tree package
[07:34] <subterrific> it pulls in the patches and source
[07:34] <fragment> And Apache doesn't have decent multiuser WebDAV.  You end up stuck with MS or Novell.
[07:35] <fragment> I really wanted WebDAV-enabled home directories.
[07:35] <defendguin> theantix, yeah but i need a sticker to put on my laptop
[07:35] <subterrific> how do you think apple handles that with .Mac?
[07:35] <fragment> subterrific: No idea.
[07:35] <subterrific> fragment: i think they use apache but no SSL?
[07:36] <subterrific> or maybe they've got some crazy webobjects app for it...
[07:36] <fragment> subterrific: I tried for a long time to work something with Apache, but no go.  Oracle's Collaboration Suite will do something similar, and apparently Novell can do it pretty handily, but I would love to know how Apple swings it.
[07:37] <aitrus> ubuntu doesn't see my usb keyboard when i try to install
[07:37] <fragment> subterrific: If you only want WebDAV, that's not a huge issue, but I wanted SMB, AppleShare and WebDAV access to the same filesystem.
[07:37] <aitrus> i can use it at the boot: prompt, but once the installer loads, i'm done
[07:37] <subterrific> appleshare? are you crazy?
[07:37] <aitrus> any ideas as to what to try?
[07:38] <fragment> subterrific: Yeah, or whatever they call it these days.  AFS (but not Andrew FS).
[07:38] <vasi> i think netatalk can do that
[07:38] <fragment> subterrific: I work in education, so you're always trying to support everything under the sun.
[07:38] <vasi> aitrus, did you select a weird keymap maybe?
[07:38] <justdave> AFP  Appleshare File Protocol
[07:38] <aitrus> i can't select a keymap
[07:38] <subterrific> fragment: appleshare is so horribly slow. apple doesn't even support it in the finder well...it's the best way to freeze the finder.
[07:38] <aitrus> i don't get that far
[07:38] <justdave> afp://machinename/sharename
[07:39] <aitrus> vasi: as soon as the first curses screen comes up, my keyboard no longer works
[07:39] <fragment> vasi: Yeah, I was doing netatalk and samba, having both authenticate to a Windows domain.  Worked well, but the Mac users could always get access from the Internet via AppleShareIP (supported via netatalk).
[07:39] <fragment> SMB over the Internet -- not goot.
[07:39] <fragment> s/goot/good
[07:39] <fragment> WebDAV would have simplified a lot.
[07:40] <justdave> I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if most firewalls and public routers block SMB by default these days because of all the viruses that hack it
[07:40] <fragment> subterrific: One of the districts I work in now, we saw issues with Adobe's InDesign and image previews not working correctly via SMB.
[07:41] <fragment> subterrific: Might be fixed now in Panther, but it forced us to go back to AFP there, too.
[07:41] <subterrific> fragment: right because of resource forks
[07:42] <fragment> subterrific: alternate data streams on NTFS -- that's a whole nightmare, too, and I'd much rather deal with it on ext2/3 than on NTFS.
[07:42] <fragment> (Windows stores resource forks in ADS on NTFS)
[07:43] <fragment> So, long story short, if you hear of WebDAV+SSL for home directories, let me know! ;)
[07:48] <fragment> Don't know what they were running, either, and they were reluctant to talk much about it before they could work out how much it would cost.
[07:48] <jdub> java stuff
[07:49] <fragment> Yeah?
[07:51] <aitrus> is yaboot-installer the system installer?
[07:52] <fragment> They didn't consider it as an opportunity until I pointed out to them that (especially before SharePoint) they were one of the few user-oriented WebDAV solutions around.  It was actually someone there that said I should also look into Novell, which they turned down but said could also be a (more expensive) solution.
[07:54] <fragment> Actually, I didn't consider it an opportunity, either.  I was just looking for a solution, and realized I was already using one in their demo.
[07:55] <plovs_> jdub, requested features for nautilus should they be put in bugzilla as well (nautilus-sendto)
[07:55] <fragment> The guy on the phone said, "Uh, would you be willing to pay for something like that?"
[07:55] <punkass_> i have a laptop on one wifi network and its working then move to another network and i cant get to the web
[07:55] <punkass_> then i find that the dns settings are different for the other network
[07:55] <punkass_> ie 10.237.1.1    now 192.168.1.1
[07:55] <punkass_> but it doesnt update
[07:56] <fragment> punkass_: Maybe add a set DNS server accessible from anywhere as the first entry?
[07:56] <punkass_> now shouldnt dhclient figure that out?
[07:56] <fragment> punkass_: It should.
[07:57] <punkass_> but how can you if you are always behind a router
[07:57] <punkass_> and they may all be different
[07:57] <aitrus> anyone have any ideas that i could try to get this usb keyboard working for an install?
[07:57] <fragment> punkass_: hopefully NAT/PAT will handle it.
[07:57] <fragment> punkass_: Which it should, if you can still get on the Web without going through a proxy.
[07:58] <punkass_> yeah like i can type an ip in and it will work but no address work
[07:59] <punkass_> what would be a DNS server accesible from anywhere?
[07:59] <fragment> punkass_: Yeah, I can't remember the technique, but there's a way to keep entries in resolv.conf through dhclient changes, so if you can find a public DNS server (like maybe your ISP?) you can keep it as the first entry, and hopefully it will always go out and grab it.
[07:59] <fragment> punkass_: Or, look for another dhclient option to better update the resolv.conf
[08:00] <punkass_> yeah i think thats what ill do...and if all else fails ill write my own little script that will edit resolv
[08:00] <fragment> punkass_: The DNS server where I went to college was public for years.  When I was an AT&T cable customer and their DNS servers would always crap out, I got in the habit of setting it to Someone Else's DNS so I could just ride out the storms.
[08:01] <fragment> punkass_: I just checked, and it's no longer public. :(
[08:02] <punkass_> well if i make the resolv just point at the router, the router normally has a dns that it looks at
[08:04] <fragment> punkass_: The router does dns resolution?
[08:05] <fragment> So, if you add your default gateway to resolv.conf, it works?
[08:05] <fragment> That should be easy to script.
[08:05] <punkass_> yeah like even my little aopen router here gets dns addys from shaw
[08:05] <punkass_> yeah but not ever router is set to the same ip range
[08:05] <fragment> punkass_: Mine pulls it, but then passes it via DHCP
[08:05] <fragment> You can't actually query mine.
[08:06] <punkass_> well i think mine just sends it through the gateway to the DNS servers
[08:06] <fragment> (mine = my router)
[08:06] <fragment> cool
[08:07] <fragment> Oh, dude!  That works on mine, too.
[08:07] <punkass_> hehe
[08:07] <fragment> That is a slick trick.
[08:07] <punkass_> yes
[08:08] <fragment> Yeah, so that should be cake to code.
[08:08] <punkass_> so if thats common for most routers, than rewriting the resolv should be easy
[08:09] <punkass_> i already have my little app that detects and brings up the network so i can just add it to that
[08:09] <fragment> Well, that's enough excitement for one day.  Morning comes in like six hours, and the commute sucks if I don't get enough sleep.
[08:10] <punkass_> how long is the commute?
[08:10] <fragment> 'night, everyone
[08:10] <fragment> Just under an hour
[08:10] <punkass_> yuck
[08:10] <fragment> Yeah
[08:10] <punkass_> takes me 10mins to get to work
[08:10] <fragment> But I take the backroads.  It keeps me off the freeway and is a lot more fun.
[08:10] <punkass_> and its all along the waterfront
[08:10] <punkass_> lol nice
[08:11] <punkass_> nite
[08:12] <fragment> I used to work about a half hour away -- and a half-hour at 30 MPH through town -- but I took a new job about 40 miles away that netted me a hefty raise, so it's worth it.
[08:12] <fragment> ...or almost worth it, now that gas is going up.
[08:12] <punkass_> ah yes..more money is always nice
[08:13] <fragment> the big thing is my wife and I are trying to have kids, and there's no way we could have made it on one income at the old job.  Now, it's not likely, but it's doable.
[08:13] <fragment> She's just gone half-time.  We call it practice for being broke.
[08:13] <punkass_> i just got my wife knocked up :)
[08:13] <fragment> Hey, congratulations!
[08:13] <punkass_> thank man
[08:13] <punkass_> s/thank/thanks
[08:14] <punkass_> yea being tight for $$ sucks
[08:14] <fragment> Yeah.  Her first half-check is Thursday, so I guess we'll see.
[08:14] <punkass_> i finally got a good paying job and is much nicer
[08:14] <fragment> I'm already sweating it.
[08:15] <punkass_> but i dont live in a big city or anything so the cost of living is pretty cheap
[08:15] <fragment> We'll make it OK, but we have another, what, two years to go to pay off our student loans.  Plus, she's a teacher, so she's got to get a Masters in the next 2-3 years just to keep her job.
[08:15] <punkass_> the one thing i found when it comes to money, is that somehow it always seems to work out
[08:15] <fragment> ....so there's another student loan....
[08:16] <punkass_> ouch
[08:16] <fragment> punkass_: Yeah, everyone keeps saying so, and I believe it.  Doesn't mean I'm not nervous, but I believe it.  :)
[08:16] <euler> Man, I wish it was only 2-3 years till my student loans are paid off.
[08:16] <punkass_> well it is true...but it still sucks 
[08:17] <punkass_> well i was lucky and got this funding to pay for my schooling..
[08:17] <punkass_> and i dont have to pay it back :)
[08:17] <euler> I've been fortunate enough to make enough money that my wife hasn't had to work.
[08:17] <fragment> If we can squeak by until the student loans are paid off, that'll be a huge weight off and we'll be fine.  Within a 3-month window, I think we pay off both student loans and her car, so it'll feel like we're rich overnight.
[08:18] <fragment> punkass_: Very nice!
[08:18] <punkass_> yeah totally 
[08:18] <punkass_> 3-months?
[08:19] <fragment> punkass_: Yeah, it'll work out something like that.  Summer of '06, I think, May hers is done, June or July mine is done, and August the car is done.  I think that's it.
[08:19] <euler> That's cool.
[08:19] <punkass_> nice...
[08:19] <fragment> Total, about $1k a month difference.
[08:19] <punkass_> http://www.totallycrap.com/media/indexpaint.html  quicktime mov...kinda funny
[08:20] <punkass_> yeah that'll make a big difference eh
[08:20] <fragment> But damn, 10 years on the student loans, you'd think you'll never get to the end.
[08:20] <punkass_> 10 years...holy crap
[08:20] <fragment> Yeah
[08:20] <punkass_> how long were u in school for?
[08:22] <fragment> Five years.  Almost six.  Five for my undergrad (foreign language minor declared too late for a 4-year stint), then took a semester off, then took a bunch of stuff for fun for a semester.  The loans didn't have to be paid back for a year after the last time I was a full-time student, so figure six years after becoming a freshman in college I had to start paying them back.
[08:23] <fragment> ...or seven.
[08:23] <punkass_> lol
[08:23] <fragment> too late to do math
[08:24] <punkass_> yeah i should eat some food and go to bed
[08:24] <fragment> fifth, grad, sixth, play, seventh, payback.  That's right.
[08:24] <fragment> 'night guys
[08:24] <punkass_> thats cool..ive just done a 2 and half year stint geting my CS diploma
[08:24] <punkass_> nite
[08:25] <voyaman> hi
[08:25] <voyaman> can anybody help me
[08:26] <voyaman> a just install ubuntu and dual boot doesn't work
[08:26] <voyaman> only can login linux
[08:26] <euler> voyaman: Describe.
[08:26] <euler> voyaman: Ah, I had this problem yesterday.
[08:26] <voyaman> euler, que bien, mejor en espaol
[08:26] <voyaman> no domino bien el ingles
[08:27] <euler> voyaman: I'm sorry, I don't know spanish.
[08:27] <voyaman> do u speak spanish
[08:27] <voyaman> ok
[08:27] <voyaman> don't worry
[08:27] <voyaman> tell me how do u solve this problem
[08:27] <euler> Let me look up the web page that had the solution...
[08:28] <voyaman> know, when boot the system, say various warning
[08:28] <voyaman> filename are too long
[08:29] <voyaman> like linux scanning the fat partitions
[08:30] <euler> voyaman: So when you try to boot windows, what happens?
[08:30] <voyaman> euler, on the menu of grub doesn' appear window partition
[08:31] <euler> Ok, that is different.  The ubuntu installer autodetected my windows partition and put an entry in the menu for it.  Have you tried to create a menu entry for the windows partition in the grub menu?
[08:32] <voyaman> how do that
[08:32] <euler> edit /boot/grub/menu.lst.  There is an example in there for setting up an entry for booting a windows system.
[08:36] <euler> Basically your entry will look something like this:
[08:37] <euler> title		Windows NT/2000/XP
[08:37] <euler> root		(hd0,0)
[08:37] <euler> savedefault
[08:37] <euler> makeactive
[08:37] <euler> chainloader	+1
[08:37] <euler> Wow, that didnt' work so well.
[08:37] <euler> Let's try that again.
[08:37] <euler> title Windows NT/2000/XP
[08:38] <euler> root (hd0,0)
[08:38] <euler> savedefault
[08:38] <euler> makeactive
[08:38] <euler> chainloader +1
[08:38] <euler> If that doesn't work, you can remove the savedefault line and try again.
[08:39] <theantix> savedefault shouldn't mess anything up
[08:39] <euler> theantix: some people here in IRC have reported problems with dual booting that have been solved by removing that line.
[08:40] <theantix> euler: ah, okay... never been a problem for me in fedora/debian grub before, but I'll defer to your judgement
[08:40] <euler> I'm not saying that there isn't another solution, just that when I was having my problems dual booting, several people reported that they also had issues and that removing that line allowed them to boot.
[08:41] <euler> Hopefully that will help that guy.
[08:41] <euler> It's odd that his windows side didn't get autodetected at install time.
[08:51] <jblack_> Hiya. 
[08:51] <jblack_> I'm trying to use module-assistant to build lufs modules, but its complaining that it can't get the 2.8.1.1 kernel headers
[08:52] <euler> jblack_: Hey!  I have glanced through a couple of your arch tutorials.  I hope to be able to run through them in greater detail this week.  I would have already done so, but I had to fix my dual booting on my computer...
[08:52] <euler> Odd
[08:52] <jblack_> euler: Ok.
[08:57] <Greensky> has anyone here tried to compile galeon in ubuntu?
[08:57] <euler> bbiab
[08:57] <Greensky> I get an error "configure: error: C++ preprocessor "/lib/cpp" fails sanity check"
[09:02] <thaytan> Greensky: is the cpp package installed?
[09:02] <Greensky> yeah
[09:02] <Greensky> cpp --v   :   Reading specs from /usr/lib/gcc-lib/i486-linux/3.3.4/specs
[09:04] <thaytan> I don't know then :)
[09:04] <thaytan> I haven't had trouble compiling anything, but I haven't tried galeon
[09:04] <Greensky> thaytan, hehe, thanks for trying, I'm not good at compiling software in non-gentoo dists myself
[09:05] <Greensky> galeon is the one thing I'm really missing in ubuntu so far
[09:05] <thaytan> Greensky: the normal way would be to apt-get build-dep galeon
[09:05] <lifeless> edd: got a sec ?
[09:05] <Greensky> thaytan, well galeon isn't in the repository
[09:05] <thaytan> then apt-get -b galeon
[09:05] <thaytan> Greensky: oh right, hadn't noticed
[09:06] <defendguin> why did ubuntu pick a brown theme for its default theme?
[09:07] <Greensky> defendguin, hehe, I dono... seems like they should have different colors available to pick 
[09:07] <vasi> i like the theme, it feels very natural
[09:07] <jdub> defendguin: we're going for earthy, human colours.
[09:07] <vasi> and i'm a mac guy, so you'd expect me to be picky :-)
[09:07] <jdub> it'll be even browner later ;)
[09:07] <Greensky> I like it, but I would like a choice of a few other colors, but the same theme
[09:07] <hiweed> the Ubuntu CD-ROM installed Debian Base System first, and then aptitude install a task named ~tubuntu-desktop. I wanna know where is the task on the disk? how to modify it? and how to create a new task myself? thanks!
[09:08] <subterrific> i like the brown
[09:08] <Greensky> the widgets/borders look just fine, but brown isn't the best
[09:08] <defendguin> jdub, what about the gorilla theme? is earthy
[09:08] <defendguin> it's
[09:08] <subterrific> it stands out, it's easy to see which window has focus
[09:08] <Greensky> BUT, the brown is a lot nicer than other standard themes
[09:08] <Greensky> subterrific, yeah, it's a pretty good theme, better than most for sure
[09:09] <deFrysk> Greensky seen my theme ?
[09:09] <defendguin> i dunno i liked glider
[09:09] <y0ann> where could i precise my Wireless LAN Service Area ? 
[09:09] <Greensky> deFrysk, nopers, got a screenshot online?
[09:09] <deFrysk> http://www.geocities.com/johanvrt/ubuntu.png
[09:10] <Greensky> looks pretty good...
[09:10] <defendguin> eeek
[09:10] <defendguin> crystals and spheres
[09:10] <deFrysk> yup
[09:10] <subterrific> very...uhm, grey and aquaish...
[09:10] <deFrysk> the nicest
[09:10] <defendguin> look at xchat you cant even see what you are typing
[09:10] <deFrysk> defendguin, yes you can (now)
[09:11] <deFrysk> they fixed it
[09:11] <defendguin> whew
[09:11] <defendguin> for a while thats the reason i never used pixmap based themes
[09:11] <deFrysk> see the topic in xchat in screenshot
[09:11] <defendguin> that and the fact they are slower
[09:11] <subterrific> that theme is too bland and busy for me
[09:11] <subterrific> i like contrast
[09:12] <deFrysk> I like it , but a cool alternative for ease is glider imho
[09:12] <deFrysk> the best (normal) theme
[09:12] <subterrific> i'm so glad we can all agree to disagree and pick whatever theme we want
[09:12] <defendguin> has anyone tried the Suede icon theme?
[09:12] <Greensky> heeh
[09:14] <deFrysk> err ?
[09:15] <deFrysk> bluecurve anyone ? ;p
[09:15] <Greensky> bluecurve is pretty nice
[09:16] <deFrysk> seen it for too long in fedora/redhat
[09:17] <Greensky> my desktop: http://hiddenspiral.net/images/screenshot.png
[09:18] <Greensky> (xfce4)
[09:22] <deFrysk> good old xfce4
[09:22] <deFrysk> used it for a wile
[09:22] <deFrysk> but liked gnome better
[09:23] <deFrysk> I used it wth the iconbox and without the panel
[09:23] <deFrysk> window list panel that is
[09:25] <Greensky> gnome was always just a little too sluggish for me
[09:25] <Greensky> but I don't have 2+ ghz machines :P
[09:26] <vdaron> Hi all
[09:26] <vdaron> Still can't have any sound with my beautifull Ubuntu install ....
[09:27] <vdaron> Working on a INSPIRON 8200, AC97 with i810_audio ....
[09:28] <vdaron> during startup, i810_audio is marked as blacklisted ... what does it mean ?
[09:28] <Treenaks> vdaron: that it doesn't use OSS but ALSA (where it
[09:29] <Treenaks> is called differently
[09:29] <vdaron> Hum ... well ok, 
[09:30] <vdaron> and ... what can I do ??
[09:30] <supertux_> did anyone comment on my bluecurve in apt comment?
[09:30] <Treenaks> vdaron: it loads automatically..
[09:30] <zolrath> Hmm what video formats should totem be able to play?
[09:30] <vdaron> the sound card devices files are'nt created
[09:30] <Treenaks> vdaron: it's just a different driver (imho, a better one ) for the same hardware
[09:31] <vdaron> Ok, fine.
[09:31] <Treenaks> vdaron: if you type "lsmod" you should see snd-something
[09:31] <vdaron> How can I create the /dev/dsp, /dev/mixer, ...
[09:31] <Treenaks> snd-intel-i810 or something like that
[09:33] <vdaron> I see an snd_intel8x0m
[09:33] <vdaron> and snd_intel8x0 
[09:33] <Treenaks> then the driver is loaded
[09:33] <Treenaks> you can just play sound .. try ti
[09:33] <Treenaks> it even
[09:34] <vdaron> the problem is that /dev/dsp, /dev/mixer etc didn't exists
[09:41] <vasi> anybody have any ideas how i can get my console to have > 8-bit color?
[09:42] <vdaron> Thanks a lot Treenaks
[09:42] <defendguin> http://www.starmicroinc.net/home.aspx this site maxes out my processor.  and it doesnt even use flash
[09:42] <vdaron> Will try again latter
[09:42] <Treenaks> vdaron: they don't need to exist, because ALSA uses different devices for that
[09:42] <vdaron> ALSA isn't supposed to be compatible with OSS ?
[09:43] <vdaron> Totem for example complains about /dev/dsp ...
[09:43] <vdaron> SOund applet complains about /dev/mixer ...
[09:43] <Treenaks> vdaron: only if you don't load the compatibility modules.. which ubuntu does by default afaik
[09:44] <vdaron> But I've these modules loaded : snd_pcm_oss  snd_mixer_oss 
[09:45] <Treenaks> vdaron: then maybe your udev daemon died? (which is a Bad Thing)
[09:45] <vdaron> I did'nt have the /udev entry ...
[09:45] <Treenaks> vdaron: that's not what I said
[09:45] <Treenaks> daemon != directory
[09:45] <vdaron> udevd is running
[09:46] <Treenaks> that's weird then..
[09:46] <vdaron> :)
[09:47] <defendguin> hmm maybe time to get redhat-artwork package from FC2 and use alien
[09:47] <defendguin> FC3
[09:48] <Treenaks> vdaron: rebooting doesn't help (yikes, a windows solution)
[09:48] <vdaron> It's not the first time a reboot my ubuntu
[09:48] <vdaron> And sound never works
[09:48] <Treenaks> check the logs? maybe udev has a problem somewhere?
[09:49] <Treenaks> try blacklisting the snd-intel8x0m driver in /etc/hotplug/blacklist
[09:50] <mdz> vdaron: is this a fresh install? if not, what have you changed?
[09:50] <mdz> if snd-pcm-oss is loaded but you don't have /dev/dsp, something is Wrong
[09:57] <vdaron> Treenaks / mdz : Nothing in logs about sound
[09:58] <jsan> hi, i can't seem to find the nautilus script menu, is it normal? should i file a bug?
[10:01] <crimsun> vdaron, do you mind recapping in a few sentences what problems RE: ALSA you're having? I joined after you had begun.
[10:01] <vdaron> ok
[10:01] <mdz> hiweed: the task is defined by the Task: headers in the Packages files
[10:05] <vdaron> I'm running DELL INSPIRON 8200. And I did'nt have any sound. the ALSA drivers seems loaded (snd_intel8x0m, snd_intel8x0, snd_pcm_oss,   snd_mixer_oss). But I don't have any /dev/dsp or /dev/mixer node ...
[10:05] <vdaron> udevd is running fine
[10:09] <HenrikLind> Hi All , just tryed to install flash, but the flash installer says "Your architecture, \'x86_64\', is not supported by the Macromedia Flash Player installer."
[10:11] <hiweed> mdz: thanks
[10:11] <crimsun> vdaron, did you try blacklisting snd-intel8x0m?
[10:11] <vdaron> not yet
[10:13] <hiweed> mdz: but I noticed that, there is not a sector named "Task: " in any package. I only find them in such file: http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/warty/main/binary-i386/Packages.gz
[10:16] <hiweed> I dunno how to generate such a Packages file to inlude a section named "Task". I use apt-ftparchive to generate it, but there is no such a section was genertated.
[10:17] <defendguin> would anyone like a bluecurve theme deb?
[10:19] <LeeColleton> I would like to mount my compact flash card on system startup.  I've added a line to /etc/fstab that will work with 'mount -a' but for some reason it isn't mounted at boot.  The card needs ide-cs which I added to /etc/modules.
[10:19] <hiweed> mdz: Would you please tell me, if the Task: headers was defined nanually or generated automatically?
[10:19] <defendguin> hmmm i fear that this deb alien made might have damaged my setup
[10:20] <vdaron> snd_intel8x0m well blacklisted (not load) but still no /dev/dsp and a "No Soundcard Found" at startup during alsactrl
[10:20] <crimsun> vdaron, but snd-intel8x0 is loaded (check via `lsmod')?
[10:20] <vdaron> Yes
[10:21] <crimsun> vdaron, are you using a printer port (lpt*)?
[10:21] <vdaron> nope
[10:21] <vdaron> only an usb mouse
[10:21] <crimsun> vdaron, would you disable that and the modem in bios?
[10:21] <vdaron> ok, fine, I did'nt use them
[10:23] <tof_> i'm trying to install vmware and i can't find directory of C header files
[10:23] <Treenaks> tof_: apt-get install kernel-headers-`uname -r` ?
[10:24] <crimsun> tof_, to install vmware, i used: apt-get install build-essential kernel-package linux-source
[10:25] <tof_> thx all lemme check that
[10:25] <crimsun> tof_, i then did: cd /usr/src && tar xfj linux-source-2.6.8.1 && cp /boot/config-$(uname -r) linux-source-2.6.8.1/.config && cd linux-source-2.6.8.1
[10:26] <crimsun> tof_, then i edited the toplevel Makefile to read .1-2-<your arch> for the EXTRAVERSION
[10:26] <edd> lifeless: here now
[10:26] <crimsun> tof_, then I ran: make prepare
[10:26] <tof_> :)
[10:26] <crimsun> tof_, that should do it for you
[10:26] <tof_> ouch
[10:26] <tof_> lot of work ;)
[10:27] <crimsun> i did it two days ago, takes about 3 minutes depending on the speed of the HD for the untarring ;)
[10:27] <tof_> ;)
[10:27] <vdaron> Youuuuuu
[10:27] <crimsun> vdaron, any luck?
[10:27] <vdaron> It's working !
[10:28] <crimsun> :)
[10:28] <vdaron> Why did I have to disable the // port ?
[10:28] <crimsun> vdaron, more than likely an irq conflict. this happens with quite a few dell laptops, actually.
[10:29] <vdaron> Humm
[10:29] <vdaron> Welll, thaks a lot for your help !
[10:29] <crimsun> npmccallum, glad to hear(read) it's working.
[10:29] <crimsun> err, silly nick complete.
[10:29] <knackko> hi people
[10:29] <vdaron> Ubuntu rocks !
[10:29] <tof_> lo
[10:33] <mdz> hm, he left
[10:33] <mdz> does anyone here have a laptop which exhibits that bug?
[10:33] <PerdiX> which bug?
[10:34] <hiweed> mdz: Would you please tell me, if the Task: headers was defined nanually or generated automatically?
[10:34] <mdz> hiweed: I'm not sure what you are asking
[10:34] <crimsun> mdz, it has struck the inspiron 8200s and the d800s iirc
[10:34] <crimsun> i have to double-check that, however.
[10:34] <PerdiX> alsa breakage?
[10:35] <crimsun> it's not clear whether it's ALSA's fault
[10:35] <mdz> the IRQ7 conflict issue
[10:35] <crimsun> yeah.
[10:35] <mdz> nothing in particular to do with ALSA, it breaks all sorts of PCI devices
[10:35] <PerdiX> I have that
[10:35] <mdz> hiweed: the Task: header is added to the Packages file by the archive management software
[10:35] <PerdiX> mdz, I have that anyway
[10:36] <hiweed> mdz: thanks. is it apt-ftparchive?
[10:36] <mdz> https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1254
[10:36] <mdz> hiweed: no
[10:36] <mdz> could anyone who experiences the problem in #1254 follow the instructions in the most recent comment and post the results in bugzilla?
[10:36] <tof_> crimsun, make prepare mode on ;)
[10:36] <jdub> mdz: so that "tack a new dsdt thingy to the end of your initrd" thing went into -3, right?
[10:37] <crimsun> tof_, :)
[10:37] <mdz> jdub: no
[10:37] <jdub> oh
[10:37] <mdz> jdub: what went into -3 was the latest ACPI patch
[10:37] <mdz> which solved the same problem which was reported solved by the crazy DSDT/initrd thing
[10:37] <Mayday> anyone using gossip? can the version in ubuntu handle more transports than plain jabber?
[10:37] <hiweed> mdz: what is the archive management software, please?
[10:38] <jdub> mdz: unless you actually want to load a different dsdt ;)
[10:38] <mdz> hiweed: it is called "katie", and it's very complicated, and you don't want it unless you're building a distribution the size of Debian
[10:38] <hiweed> okay thanks, mdz
[10:38] <hiweed> ~_~
[10:39] <mdz> jdub: tacking things onto the end of the initrd is crack
[10:39] <jdub> i agree
[10:39] <jdub> but it is less crack than rebuilding the kernel
[10:40] <lonewolff> morning all
[10:41] <ross> Mayday: configure some transports in another jabber client and gossip will use them as they appear as jabber to the client
[10:41] <Safari_Al> Hi guys.  Can someone please tell me how I can add this mono repository for ubuntu to my apt sources using synaptic?  http://www.getsweaaa.com/~tseng/ubuntu/debs/
[10:42] <Mayday> ross: aah ill try, thanks
[10:42] <tof_> crimsun, just this Unable to build the vmmon module no
[10:42] <tof_> w
[10:42] <jdub> Safari_Al: i don't know why synaptic makes this hard...
[10:42] <jdub> Safari_Al: load it up
[10:42] <jdub> Settings > Repositories
[10:42] <jdub> hit New
[10:43] <Safari_Al> yep
[10:43] <jdub> the uri should be http://www.getsweaaa.com/~tseng/ubuntu/debs/
[10:43] <jdub> the distribution should be ./
[10:43] <crimsun> tof_, what's the exact error? use #flood if necessary
[10:43] <jdub> the section should be blank
[10:44] <Safari_Al> jdub, Ah!  I was trying to fill in both fields.  Thanks for your help.  Still trying to get used to the debianisms :)
[10:44] <Kinnison> Morning
[10:45] <Safari_Al> jdub, just one other question. what does the little ubuntu logo in the 2nd column in the package list in synaptic sigify?  that it comes from the CD?
[10:46] <jdub> Safari_Al: that it's supported
[10:47] <Safari_Al> jdub, ok.  why would newer packages with "ubunutu" in the version number not have this then?
[10:47] <ross> they are from universe?
[10:48] <SuperLag> I did an install, and I don't remember being asked to set the root password, so now I can't log in.
[10:48] <crimsun> SuperLag, log in as the user you created.
[10:48] <SuperLag> crimsun: I can do that.
[10:48] <crimsun> Ubuntu uses sudo by default. You cannot log in as root.
[10:49] <SuperLag> Oh my.
[10:50] <hiweed> mdz: is it http://cvs.debian.org/dak/?cvsroot=dak ? I searched for the deb pacakge named 'katie', but not found.
[10:50] <mdz> hiweed: yes
[10:50] <hiweed> okay thanks
[10:50] <Kinnison> hiweed: dak isn't packaged IIRC
[10:51] <hiweed> okay thank you, Kinnison
[10:51] <hiweed> I am remastering the Ubuntu ISO, su, ...
[10:51] <mdz> Safari_Al: sometimes we make fixes to unsupported packages, for example if they don't build at all
[10:51] <hiweed> I am remastering the Ubuntu ISO, so, I need it.
[10:52] <mdz> hiweed: no, you do not need it for that
[10:52] <hiweed> oh?
[10:52] <mdz> if by "remastering", you mean that you are changing the set of packages on the CD, then apt-ftparchive should do nicely
[10:53] <mdz> with a couple of scripts
[10:53] <Safari_Al> mdz, ah.  thanks.
[10:53] <hiweed> but the Packages index file I generated via apt-ftparchive does not contain a section named "Task:" at all.
[10:53] <SuperLag> crimsun: can you su - root, after you log in as user?
[10:54] <hiweed> so the aptitude install ~tubuntu-desktop does not work.
[10:54] <crimsun> SuperLag, use sudo.
[10:56] <hiweed> All the "Task: ubuntu-desktop" words were lost.
[10:56] <SuperLag> hmm.
[10:56] <SuperLag> don't like sudo, never have
[10:56] <ross> SuperLag: sudo passwd root
[10:56] <ross> set a password
[10:57] <jdub> SuperLag: except don't do that
[10:57] <jdub> SuperLag: use sudo for a while
[10:57] <defendguin> open a root terminal
[10:57] <jdub> ugh, don't do that
[10:58] <jdub> if you want a root session for whatever reason
[10:58] <jdub> sudo su - or sudo -s
[10:58] <ross> sudo lets you limit the time you are root for, which is A Good Thing
[10:58] <defendguin> jdub, why do you even have that option there if its not good?
[10:58] <|trey|> jdub: site says theme, icons, and "desktop imagery" will be changed for final release, any chance I could get a peak  8)
[10:58] <Safari_Al> jdub, yeah I really like this sudo poop
[10:59] <jdub> ross: does s-j *require* a very new HAL?
[10:59] <jdub> defendguin: because i haven't removed it yet
[10:59] <defendguin> :(
[10:59] <ross> jdub: colin walters thinks so, he mailed me the patch :)
[10:59] <ross> jdub: pitta is testing a new HAL
[10:59] <mdz> hiweed: they need to be specified by an override file
[10:59] <jdub> |trey|: switch to the Human icon theme to see some of those icons
[10:59] <ross> jdub: today i'm going to install it and check it actually works
[11:00] <jdub> pitti: which hal version?
[11:00] <defendguin> jdub, its annoying when i have to do like 5 things as root to sudo everytime
[11:00] <pitti> jdub: ? I'm currently packaging 0.2.98
[11:00] <mdz> hiweed: you need to tell it which packages should have which task: headers; it does not know unless you tell it
[11:00] <ross> defendguin: "sudo -s"
[11:01] <|trey|> jdub: ahh, thanks  :)
[11:01] <mdz> actually it's quite convenient, because you only need to type the password once
[11:01] <defendguin> i never maned sudo to see that one
[11:01] <defendguin> sudo --help
[11:01] <defendguin> whoops
[11:01] <SuperLag> OKay... this does NOT work.
[11:01] <|trey|> jdub: default theme will still be based on Industrial?
[11:01] <SuperLag> sudo ifconfig ath0 up
[11:01] <crimsun> sudo(8) has a great man page.
[11:01] <hiweed> thanks
[11:01] <SuperLag> password:
[11:01] <hiweed> thanks mdz
[11:02] <SuperLag> it should NOT be asking me for a password if sudo really works
[11:02] <hiweed> you mean via apt-ftparchive?
[11:02] <jdub> |trey|: yes
[11:02] <mdz> SuperLag: refer to the FAQ for more information
[11:02] <pitti> jdub: what is s-j?
[11:02] <jdub> sound-juicer
[11:02] <jdub> the cd ripper
[11:02] <jdub> for gnome
[11:03] <jdub> which rocks everyone's socks
[11:03] <ross> IT ROCKS
[11:03] <|trey|> SuperLag: umm, but then any fool with physical access can mess with system vital files while you are away... a password provides sufficiant security for this situation...
[11:03] <joem> heh
[11:03] <joem> it does rock
[11:03] <jdub> ross: eugenia wants us to upgrade hal so she can build s-j... ;)
[11:03] <jdub> ross: she *might* just get it as a bonus
[11:03] <SuperLag> |trey|: I'm not a fool.  I know why.  But I've never had a distro FORCE me to use sudo, before.
[11:03] <|trey|> SuperLag: for instance, I haven't logged out of my user account since I last installed...
[11:03] <ross> jdub: she can build it without hal like everyone else
[11:04] <pitti> jdub: ah, I see. It's nice, I agree. But why does it need a newer hal?
[11:04] <jdub> ross: OH NO THE NEWER VERSION IS NEEEDED
[11:04] <|trey|> SuperLag: you're not forced, they just don't make you create 2 passwords during boot... beats the heck outta some distro's that just don't create a user  :/
[11:04] <ross> jdub: well tell her it won't compile anyway :)
[11:04] <jdub> pitti: oh, i'm not asking for s-j's sake
[11:04] <|trey|> jdub: no yelling  ;)
[11:04] <jdub> pitti: ignore that thread entirely
[11:04] <pitti> jdub: anyway, I have to fix one last major bug, then mdz and I agreed to throw it at our victims^W^Wthe public
[11:05] <jdub> cool
[11:05] <ross> rock on
[11:05] <mdz> jdub: downgraded just to make sure we're clear :-)
[11:05] <|trey|> SuperLag: s/boot/installation/ ... you probably gathered that though  :/
[11:06] <Unicat_> Does Ubuntu work with X.org Xserver?
[11:06] <jdub> between uk and france
[11:06] <jdub> Unicat_: probably, but it doesn't come with it.
[11:06] <|trey|> Unicat_: umm, it works with it... but its not included yet...
[11:06] <ross> and left a bit
[11:07] <Unicat_> Mh... okay.
[11:07] <jdub> mdz: downgraded?
[11:07] <|trey|> jdub: oh, I doubted it was even an actual place  8)  pretty cool how plays on the 'Ubuntu' theme though in a way  :)
[11:08] <|trey|> I missed an 'it' in there someplace  :/
[11:08] <jdub> mdz: oh.
[11:08] <jdub> mdz: i resolved it wontfix too
[11:09] <SuperLag> What does Ubuntu use in place of /etc/resolv.conf?
[11:09] <ross> /etc/resolv.conf
[11:09] <crimsun> hehe
[11:09] <crimsun> SuperLag, using dhclient?
[11:09] <|trey|> SuperLag: thats one of those files that just doesn't change... too many unix programs look for it...
[11:10] <mdz> jdub: yes, I downgraded it when it was already resolved
[11:11] <|trey|> SuperLag: else RedCrap... uhh, I mean RedHat would likely find a reason to put it in /etc/sysconfig/network  :/
[11:11] <mdz> Unicat_: x.org will be a feature of our next release
[11:15] <|trey|> mdz: whoever won the argument of xorg vs xfree86 for warty should be slapped a few times  :(
[11:16] <mdz> |trey|: Mr. ReleaseWartyOnTime won that argument
[11:16] <crimsun> |trey|, ubuntu's xfree86 is heavily sanitised and patched and practically is x.org
[11:16] <|trey|> mdz: blah... debian I can understand... it has to port xfree86 to several arch's before it can release... Ubuntu doesn't have this problem  :/
[11:16] <mdz> it just wasn't ready at the time that we needed it
[11:17] <|trey|> crimsun: I'm aware... however the package naming alone will scare away some users... just by the amount of people that have asked, that is obvious...
[11:18] <mdz> anyone who knows the difference between x.org and xfree86 should know better :-P
[11:19] <|trey|> mdz: granted... some just think "I should be using xorg because xfree is evil" though... a bad outlook, but some don't care about the details  :/
[11:19] <mdz> |trey|: those people should be content to know that we will be moving to x.org in the near future :-)
[11:19] <|trey|> The average user doesn't even know what X is, so its kinda lost on them  ;)
[11:20] <ross> fabbione: thanks for reverting the altwin change to X, now my metacity behaves itself
[11:20] <SuperLag> okay... now we're talking
[11:21] <SuperLag> having a hard time connecting to Freenode from that box though...
[11:21] <SuperLag> bunch of updates, since I couldn't connect to the net on the install
[11:21] <fabbione> ross: you need to thank Denis Barber :-)
[11:22] <ForsaKen> if i will just sudo apt-get install linux-image-2.6.8.1-3-k7, will it fuck my system ? or will it work ?
[11:22] <ross> ForsaKen: it will work
[11:22] <ForsaKen> ah good
[11:22] <fabbione> |trey|: there is only one little detail.. approx 300K lines of patches that needs to be review before switching tree :-)
[11:23] <fabbione> |trey|: and sometimes i like to sleep at night :-P
[11:23] <|trey|> fabbione: haha... yes, I suppose that would be a good thing  :)
[11:23] <|trey|> Thats a lot of patches  :o
[11:24] <Kinnison> ForsaKen: assuming you have a k7 based system of course :-)
 SuperLag: umm, but then any fool with physical access can mess with system vital files while you are away... a password provides sufficiant security for this situation... <-- MORE so an issue if all it takes to get root privileges is YOUR password (the user's password)
[11:24] <ForsaKen> it's for AMD
[11:24] <fabbione> |trey|: yeah :-)
[11:24] <ForsaKen> i got amd athlon 2500+
[11:25] <|trey|> Hmm, one thing I have kinda wondered... what kind of system tools are planned for ubuntu? any plans to simply port redhat tools? or recreating the wheel?
[11:25] <ForsaKen> linux-image-2.6.8.1-3-k7 - Linux kernel image for version 2.6.8.1 on AMD K7.
[11:25] <ForsaKen> this one is for amd athlon right ?
[11:25] <|trey|> SuperLag: umm, that is all that is required with sudo  :/
[11:27] <|trey|> catastrophy*
[11:28] <SuperLag> catastrophe
[11:28] <|trey|> (yes I know there are some tools already, however hardly a complete set)
[11:29] <|trey|> SuperLag: blah... my language skills suck... thus why I am majoring in something logical  ;)
[11:30] <SuperLag> What, English? :)
[11:30] <|trey|> SuperLag: no... english also encompasses spoken word... I got that down pretty well  :)
[11:31] <|trey|> Its the part where I transfer that to paper that I fail at  :(
[11:32] <|trey|> damnit, its 3:30am already... I have tests and stuff tomorrow, I should sleep  :(
[11:32] <epsas> whoa... this channel is WAY smaller than #debian's
[11:32] <epsas> jeje
[11:33] <|trey|> epsas: bah, Ubuntu hasn't even reached release status yet... Debian had a 10 year headstart  :)
[11:33] <epsas> anybody know of good makejail *.py's?
[11:33] <|trey|> epsas: ahh... latino?  :)
[11:33] <epsas> |trey| - nein, mon frau.
[11:33] <|trey|> epsas: you lost me  :(
[11:34] <|trey|> jeje is usually used my latino's though... my mistake  :(
[11:34] <epsas> trey - ahh, sorry.  was j/k (=
[11:34] <pitti> plovs_: here
[11:35] <pitti> plovs_: I just uploaded a new hal package into my archive which should fix the issues with your USB stick and your ZIP drive; can you please test it?
[11:37] <stojanos> How to get C header files to match ubuntu (warty) kernel so that I can compile new module?
[11:38] <|trey|> stojanos: linux-headers-yourkernelver
[11:38] <|trey|> apt-get install that
[11:39] <stojanos> thanks, I am coming from redhat so debian is new for me.
[11:39] <epsas> stojanos - is there a build-essentials package on your system?
[11:39] <stojanos> I'll check
[11:39] <|trey|> stojanos: it is not installed by default, so if you didn't install it, its not there...
[11:40] <epsas> stojanos - that has the compilers and dev libraries
[11:40] <stojanos> it's not so I will install that too
[11:40] <epsas> there are probably meta-packages that weigh less, but i don't know of them
[11:41] <|trey|> Stupid question... does the installer install "linux-image-2.6-$ARCH' or just the most recent kernel? if the prior is installed, it will also upgrade to 2.6.9 when its released, which is kinda handy  :)
[11:41] <|trey|> epsas: build-essentials is pretty much exactly what it says... about as small as is required  :)
[11:41] <Treenaks> |trey|: but it could also break on some hardware..
[11:41] <|trey|> You can install individual packages, but thats a pain  :/
[11:42] <knackko> i have got ubuntu on my compaq 2109 k7, with powernowd but ubuntu does not do the modprobe powernow-k7 for powernowd ! (it is just a note, i do it manualy now)
[11:42] <epsas> trey - except if 2.6.1? or whatever turns out to be completely rotten =/
[11:42] <Treenaks> knackko: file a bug
[11:42] <|trey|> Treenaks: I've never seen something break via upgrades enless through major upgrades (ie, some things broke from 2.4 > 2.6)
[11:42] <Treenaks> knackko: if it's not already there
[11:43] <knackko> Treenaks: i am going to, ok
[11:43] <|trey|> knackko: do yourself a favor and type "echo powernow-k7 >> /etc/modules"
[11:44] <knackko> |trey|: thanks
[11:44] <kinema> so what is ubuntu's claim to fame?  what sets it apart from debian?
[11:45] <|trey|> knackko: basically, that file contains modules to be loaded at boot... with discover1 installed, most are not necissary to include in there, just things that aren't detected  :)
[11:45] <|trey|> kinema: read the main page "www.ubuntulinux.org"
[11:46] <|trey|> kinema: basically... a supported sid with a tweaked gnome, regular releases... and incorporation back into debian...
[11:47] <kinema> according to the web page ubuntu == debian + stated multilingual support + 18 month release cycle
[11:47] <|trey|> (the last one is more a differentiator between ubuntu and other debian based distro's such as linspire or xandros etc...
[11:47] <ross> hm the powernow modules can be detected, surely, based on the cpu id
[11:48] <Kinnison> ross: for the most-part. some northbridges are odd
[11:48] <|trey|> kinema: releases every 6 months also, you forgot that part  ;)
[11:48] <Treenaks> Kinnison: 18-month? not 6-month?
[11:48] <jono> hi all
[11:48] <knackko> |trey|: thanks trey, it is the bug 1444, Frequency shown on gnome-cpufreq-applet changes randomly, in fact, the powernow modules are not "modprobe"
[11:48] <Kinnison> Treenaks: ?
[11:48] <jono> anyone know if there is an orinoco wireless kernel module for ppc ubuntu?
[11:48] <|trey|> Treenaks: eol is 18 months... so support spans 3 releases  :)
[11:49] <Treenaks> eol != release cycle
[11:49] <Treenaks> release cycle = time between releases = 6 months
[11:49] <|trey|> Treenaks: he got his wording wrong... just go with it  ;)
[11:52] <|trey|> Always wanted to play with it... can't be asked to compile it though  :(
[11:53] <|trey|> No webcam... but would like to view others  :(
[11:53] <ross> what does it do over gnome-meeting?
[11:54] <Treenaks> plug into gaim, probably
[11:54] <|trey|> ross: it supports yahoo and msn cam... not just netmeeting...
[11:54] <|trey|> (ie, it doesn't only use H232
[11:54] <|trey|> Infact I don't think it even uses H232 due to none of the IM protocols using it...
[11:55] <|trey|> For instance, Yahoo apparently streams successive jpegs over their protocol...
[11:56] <jono> can we unload kernel modules yet in linux?
[11:56] <|trey|> jono: man rmmod
[11:56] <joem> jono, rmmod?
[11:56] <|trey|> jono: its been possible since 2.2 AT LEAST!!
[11:56] <jono> |trey|, really?! I thought kernel module unloading was a recent thing?
[11:56] <Treenaks> |trey|: not if you disable the option in the kernel configuration
[11:57] <|trey|> jono: not so much  :/
[11:57] <|trey|> Treenaks: oh... I use prebuilts mostly... don't have the processing power or patients to compile...
[11:58] <Treenaks> |trey|: I've only started using prebuilt kernels with ubuntu..
[11:58] <|trey|> Treenaks: cooliez :/  I've used the Debian kernels for like 3 years  :/
[11:59] <jono> I need to patch the kernel and compile another module
[11:59] <|trey|> jono: have fun... the joys of having a system designed for easy linux configuration  :)
[12:00] <|trey|> Not to mention as cheap as possible while still being tolerable  :)
[12:00] <jono> :)
[12:00] <jono> the driver seems to be the same as the one in the kernel but without rfmon monitoring built in for some reason
[12:00] <Qo-noS> jono: btw thanks for all those nice articles inLinuxFormat and the likes ;)
[12:01] <jono> Qo-noS, no probs, cheers :)
[12:01] <Qo-noS> jono: :)
[12:01] <jono> hmmm, my powerbook just beeped loudly - is there something in Ubuntu that does this?
[12:07] <jono> aaha, it seems the orinoco bug has been filed :)
[12:08] <joem> same here
[12:09] <jono> is it possible to indicate in an existing bug report that it affects me too ?
[12:09] <Mirno> Bonjouir
[12:09] <Telep> Bonjour
[12:09] <Mirno> woops
[12:09] <Mirno> Hello
[12:09] <Telep> bonjouir? :D
[12:09] <Telep> freudian slip?
[12:10] <Mirno> hehe no
[12:11] <Mirno> Jouir is like uh .. enjjoy very much .. linda sexual conotation. 
[12:11] <joem> jono, comment on it I guess
[12:11] <Telep> Mirno: I know :)
[12:12] <jono> how can I subscribe to the bug to get emails about its progress?
[12:12] <Mirno> Telep,   I say that on purposes .. it's no slip.
[12:12] <joem> add your self to the cc list
[12:12] <Mirno> Telep,   said*
[12:12] <joem> top righthand corner
[12:12] <Telep> Mirno: ah, OK :)
[12:13] <Telep> d'accord
[12:14] <jono> right off to work on some writing
[12:15] <jono> seeya soon folks
[12:15] <Mirno> Telep,   so, um, what's up in the wonderful world of Ubuntu ?
[12:16] <|trey|> Hmm, just found http://www.aboutdebian.com/ ... looks very good for our newer users, perhaps we should link to it someplace?
[12:17] <Telep> Mirno: well, I'm just a user :)
[12:17] <Telep> Mirno: but it's running fine on my HP laptop :)
[12:17] <|trey|> (only briefly browsed it, but it looks to be a pretty good resource for newer users)
[12:17] <Mirno> Telep,   i'm waiting for the cd
[12:17] <Mirno> +s
[12:18] <Telep> Mirno: you haven't got access to broadband?
[12:18] <Mirno> Telep,   Looks greate, but did not tested yet.
[12:18] <Mirno> Telep,   I do
[12:18] <Mirno> Telep,   I prefere to wait for the final
[12:18] <Telep> I was suprised how well everything "just worked" on my laptop even though it's a preview
[12:19] <Telep> well, everything I need, anyway :)
[12:19] <Mirno> Telep,   yup, It's gonna ba something huge.
[12:20] <Telep> I couldn't wait to try Gnome 2.8, and someone mentioned Ubuntu in the Gentoo forums :)
[12:20] <Mirno> Telep,   lookslike it's gonna replace mandrake on desktops I install for my custumers
[12:20] <Telep> so I downloaded it for fun and now probably won't be going back to Gentoo :)
[12:21] <Mirno> Telep,   yup gentoo I left gentoo for Nasgaa a year ago, i just installed some thing else (I was still in gnome 2.2 hh)
[12:22] <|trey|> Telep: it should be noted that Ubuntu isn't mainstream GNOME 2.8... Computer and trashapplet are the most obvious deviances  :)
[12:22] <Telep> How are they different?
[12:23] <|trey|> Telep: trashapplet will make 2.10... Computer menu is something different for Ubuntu...
[12:23] <Telep> ah, ok :)
[12:23] <|trey|> Telep: mainstream has Actions as you have probably seen before  :)
[12:24] <Qo-noS> Telep: well, take a look at these screenies and compare them to Ubuntu's and see how GNOME 2.8 on Debian differs from GNOME 2.8 on Ubuntu >
[12:24] <Qo-noS> http://www.oamweb.com/personal/iamdiablo/28GNOME_23rdSept2004d.jpeg
[12:24] <Qo-noS> http://www.oamweb.com/personal/iamdiablo/28GNOME_23rdSept2004b.jpeg
[12:25] <|trey|> Qo-noS: bad examples... those aren't exactly mainstream either  :/
[12:25] <Qo-noS> of course, GNOME like most other DEs and WMs can be configured to look anything you want ;)
[12:26] <Telep> yup
[12:26] <Qo-noS> |trey|: ;)
[12:26] <Qo-noS> but some indication of some diffs ;)
[12:26] <|trey|> Qo-noS: everything in use there is available for Debian?
[12:27] <|trey|> Qo-noS: not really... Actions menu isn't even shown... most things other then that are the same  :/
[12:27] <|trey|> Indubstial is even default theme afaik
[12:27] <Qo-noS> |trey|: yeah I took it out to make space ;)
[12:28] <|trey|> Qo-noS: question right before that is more important to me :)
[12:28] <|trey|> I kinda want that theme (and the icons)
[12:28] <Qo-noS> |trey|: and almost every app you see is indeed in Debian Unstable/Experimental save for GnomeBaker that is
[12:29] <|trey|> Qo-noS: whats GnomeBaker?
[12:29] <Qo-noS> its the Aero theme think I got it from either http://art.gnome.org/ or http://www.gnome-look.org/
[12:29] <Qo-noS> GGnomebaker is a CD burning app ala k3b ;)
[12:29] <|trey|> Oh... I just use cdrecord itself :/
[12:29] <Qo-noS> there's an Aero theme for gkrellm as well btw
[12:29] <|trey|> Themes name?
[12:30] <|trey|> ahh, you already said that, sorry
[12:30] <Qo-noS> Aero is the name;)
[12:30] <bob2> hm
[12:30] <bob2> sudo complains that it's not setuid
[12:30] <bob2> but according to ls it is
[12:31] <Telep> is GnomeBaker good?
[12:33] <Qo-noS> Telep: not bad but not a k3b as yet by any measure...still early stages ;)
[12:33] <bob2> hat is so good about k3b?
[12:33] <|trey|> Qo-noS: you working on it yourself?
[12:33] <bob2> people seem transfixed by it
[12:33] <|trey|> bob2: it lets a moron burn a cd
[12:33] <bob2> so does nautilus
[12:34] <|trey|> And on top of that its pretty...
[12:34] <bob2> 'drag files here.  click "burn"'
[12:34] <Qo-noS> Coaster-gui, Optimystic are coming along fine as probable k3bs of the GNOME desktop...Gcdw is not bad as it is
[12:34] <Qo-noS> |trey|: nah I'm just you typical lazy bastard ;)
[12:34] <|trey|> bob2: I don't consider having the iso burned on a cd a functional burner... that is kinda useless  :/
[12:35] <bob2> |trey|: what more do you want it to do?
[12:35] <|trey|> Everytime I see a CD with somefile.iso on the cd, I want to scream
[12:35] <bob2> that's not what nautilus does
[12:36] <|trey|> bob2: thats what I have ended up with everytime I have tried...
[12:36] <Qo-noS> But Ubuntu amongst the countless Debian-derivatives Ihave evaluated (just this knack of trying new distros) is the best I must say...maybe I'm just biased but it is hehe
[12:36] <bob2> |trey|: filed a bug?
[12:36] <bob2> that seems amazingly broken
[12:36] <|trey|> bob2: its happened on 4 or 5 different distro's, using cdrecord on its own is just easier  :/
[12:36] <cef> bob2: what about copying a cd?
[12:37] <bob2> cef: ah, good point
[12:37] <cef> bob2: particularly if it's a format you can't read, but still need to copy
[12:37] <Qo-noS> heard gthumb is incorprating a cd burning feature for pixies, and hmmm totem for movies and with Nautilus doing data...hehe nice combo even without all these other frontends like gcdw and gnome baker
[12:38] <|trey|> Totem can burn stuff?  :o
[12:38] <bob2> wel
[12:38] <|trey|> Damnit, so much porn lost for no reason  :'(
[12:38] <bob2> now I need to find some way to root my own machine, since sudo's fucked.
[12:38] <Qo-noS> |trey|: no but soon me think
[12:39] <|trey|> bob2: shoulda given root his own password  :)
[12:39] <pisuke> it's better to have burn facility provided by the app, imho
[12:39] <Safari_Al> bob2, tried booting into single user mode?
[12:39] <Qo-noS> |trey|: I have 1 GB os pr0n pixies atm...talk abt backing them up :P
[12:40] <|trey|> pisuke: indeed... more logical...
[12:40] <bob2> Safari_Al: yeah, just trying to avoid a reboot
[12:40] <bob2> |trey|: hehe
[12:40] <pisuke> nautilus data, totem movies, rb music and gthum pics. :)
[12:40] <Safari_Al> bob2, if you can avoid a reboot, then I'd be interested to know how you did it :)
[12:41] <bob2> Safari_Al: haha
[12:41] <|trey|> Qo-noS: bah... images don't do it for me... need motion and sound... if I need to use my imagination, I might as well not have visual aid at all  :)
[12:41] <bob2> that is a good point
[12:41] <Qo-noS> pisuke: now that is a thought...hint hint devels ;)
[12:41] <pisuke> Qo-noS, heh
[12:41] <|trey|> bob2: init requires root access huh?  :(
[12:41] <|trey|> bob2: you're fucked... I get to laugh now k?  8-)
[12:42] <bob2> |trey|: boot: Linux init=/bin/bash
[12:42] <bob2> 0wned.
[12:42] <|trey|> bob2: cept you said without rebooting  8-)
[12:42] <bob2> yeah.
[12:42] <|trey|> bob2: that really ought not to work... but it does... not on most distro's though  :(
[12:42] <bob2> bastard mdz for making ubuntu secure.
[12:42] <bob2> |trey|: it works on all distros I know of
[12:43] <bob2> I've never seen one set a default bootloader password
[12:43] <|trey|> bob2: tried it on SUSE and Fedora (class, fellow classmate bothered me  :/)
[12:44] <|trey|> bob2: usually asks for roots password when you boot... thus a stumbling block
[12:44] <|trey|> Although some folks set 'password' as roots password.... soooo original  8)
[12:45] <bob2> |trey|: they both block you from specifying boot options?
[12:45] <|trey|> bob2: no... just when you boot, it requests roots password  :/
[12:45] <bob2> ok
[12:46] <|trey|> If root doesn't have a password... you're still fucked  :/
[12:46] <|trey|> bob2: have a recent ubuntu install cd handy? 
[12:47] <joem> if you are really stuck, you can just boot from cd and chroot
[12:47] <joem> then set the passwd
[12:47] <|trey|> Hope nothing important isn't backed up  :(
[12:47] <bob2> of course, I know how to reboot and get in
[12:48] <|trey|> bob2: I know what you said earlier... and I have yet to see it work  :/
[12:48] <|trey|> bob2: I even lost $5 cuz it didn't work on Gentoo  :/
[12:49] <bob2> hah.
[12:49] <|trey|> (teacher's box is gentoo  :/)
[12:49] <bob2> could someone with working sudo run this for me: "ltrace sudo ls 2>&1 | grep geteuid"?
[12:50] <thom> 2:45 ~% ltrace sudo ls 2>&1 | grep geteuid
[12:50] <thom> geteuid()                                        = 1000
[12:50] <|trey|> same
[12:50] <bob2> hm, same here, then it prints that it needs to be setuid
[12:51] <thom> 2:45 ~% ls -la =sudo
[12:51] <thom> -rwsr-xr-x    1 root        97864 2004-09-28 18:10 /usr/bin/sudo
[12:51] <bob2> -rwsr-xr-x  1 root root 94032 ...
[12:52] <bob2> I do know how to use ls, thom :)
[12:52] <thom> bob2: i'm never sure that your hair doesn't get in the way ;-)
[12:52] <[Bas] > bob2, tried gksu or gnome-sudo?
[12:52] <|trey|> [Bas] : gksudo calls sudo  :/
[12:52] <pisuke> have you consider having "Open Location (ctrl+l)" below "Find Files" in computer menu? imho it would be nice.
[12:52] <bob2> it prints the error twice.
[12:53] <bob2> gksu won't work since I have no root password
[12:53] <plovs_> pitti, hal seem to be working ok today, your work or just happy bits today
[12:53] <plovs_> in metacity keybindings what is the abbreviation for page-up?
[12:53] <bob2> well, I'll just submit it, hope someone else figures it out
[12:54] <|trey|> pisuke: what advantages would that provide over Computer >> disks?
[12:55] <|trey|> That + Applications >> run = same functionality :/
[12:55] <bob2> hm, sudo upload two days ago, suspicious
[12:56] <pisuke> |trey|, i think it should work like applications -> run
[12:56] <|trey|> bob2: just upgraded for me today... perhaps contained a fix?
[12:56] <bob2> |trey|: before that it hadn't been changed since august
[12:56] <pisuke> |trey|, computer -> open location
[12:57] <|trey|> pisuke: I dunno, still doesn't seem useful... if you become familier with the vfolders in use, you can add it yourself?
[12:57] <pisuke> without the disks step
[12:57] <|trey|> bob2: wierd... I upgrade at least once a day... it came along with the last but one upgrade
[12:58] <|trey|> (so about 3 hours ago)
[12:59] <|trey|> pisuke: perhaps it would be useful... I garentee I wouldn't use it though  :/
[12:59] <cef> bob2: so you don't wanna reboot but wanna hack root?
[12:59] <|trey|> cef: I think he rebooted already  ;)
[12:59] <bob2> cef: oh, I'm just bitter that my laptop fucked up at all, don't mind me
[01:00] <cef> bob2: heh.. fun fun
[01:00] <|trey|> bob2: *coughnexttimesetapasswordforrootcough*
[01:00] <cef> bob2: well spose this does point out a possible problem for ubuntu.. huge reliance on sudo
[01:00] <cef> and if sudo dies, bye bye
[01:01] <cef> you know, it could be pretty easy to just automatically set the root password to the first users password by default
[01:01] <cef> at install time
[01:01] <bob2> |trey|: I installed it ten minutes ago
[01:01] <bob2> ie sudo never worked
[01:02] <bob2> cef: yeah
[01:02] <thom> cef: true, but sudo has been pretty damn reliable for me; never seen it die except when the binary gets nuked by disk corruption
[01:02] <bob2> cef: I don't think it will be a common problem, it's never bothered me before
[01:02] <thom> cef: talked about that, what happens when the user changes his password?
[01:02] <cef> and mebbe even add it so that if the user changes his password, the root password also gets changed
[01:02] <|trey|> thom: the password is different?
[01:02] <pisuke> mmm. synaptic doesn't does apt-get clean automagically?
[01:03] <thom> |trey|: yes, and now we've broken user expectation and potentially broken their system
[01:03] <cef> store the strings on disk in shadow as identical copies, that way you can't use the pair of them to cut the search space in half if you try a brute force (assuming that they can access the shadow file)
[01:03] <|trey|> pisuke: no... apt-get clean can fuck up deps... a very bad thing when you wish to remove something like KDE (trust me on this  ;)
[01:04] <bob2> ggr, now sudo is hung because there's no DNS
[01:04] <|trey|> thom: I think sudo should maybe be the "recommended method" and root should be configured as normal...
[01:04] <pisuke> |trey|, heh
[01:04] <thom> |trey|: apt-get clean deletes stuff from /var/cache/apt/archives nothing else.
[01:04] <thom> it absolutely can *not* fuck up deps
[01:05] <thom> |trey|: why?
[01:05] <cef> thom: re: sudo and corruption: true.. but what if (and this is my whole point).. there is a security bug in sudo. they rush to release a fixed package, and in the process it breaks something for the majority of users, but not the developer who tested it (eg: a lib dependency).. suddenly, you have lots of non-working systems
[01:05] <|trey|> thom: ok... install Debian... install GNOME and KDE... upgrade to sid... remove kdebase (for instance) and look at what is removed... hint, most of KDE remains...
[01:05] <bob2> |trey|: that has nothing to do with apt-get clean.
[01:06] <|trey|> thom: Its caught me out about 4935794357653 times
[01:06] <|trey|> bob2: it usually happens after an apt-get clean :/
[01:06] <thom> |trey|: that's removing, not *clean*
[01:06] <|trey|> never see it if I keep them around  :/
[01:07] <[Bas] > pisuke, in synaptic go to settings --> prefs --> temp files  and choose the methode you like (clean after install)
[01:07] <bob2> |trey|: apt-get clean reall yreally only deletes .debs from /var/cache/apt/archives/.  it does not install or remove any packages.
[01:07] <bob2> what'
[01:07] <bob2> s the sysrq key on powermacs?
[01:07] <thom> cef: well, this assumes that the distribution doesn't test at all, either. but yes, i understand what you're saying, but the same could happen with PAM and a stack of other things
[01:07] <cef> |trey|: I can confirm bob2's comment.. (and that's cos I've looked at the apt source previously)
[01:08] <|trey|> bob2: I dunno... explain it any other way... apt-get clean is the only common difference in that working and not working  :/
[01:08] <bob2> |trey|: then you did something else.  it would be a critical bug in apt if it did that, and I've never heard of it happening before.
[01:08] <cef> thom: true.. but we don't want to put in too many layers, else it's a testing nightmare.. (ie: lots of variables)
[01:08] <bob2> cef: my condolences :-)
[01:08] <|trey|> Its the reason I started using Debfoster, it allowed me to avoid that problem...
[01:09] <pisuke> [Bas] , thank you. i was searching for that option but don't know why i did not see it. 8)
[01:09] <bob2> if you can reproduce it, file a bug
[01:09] <joebeastie2> is it me or should the motd be changed. i dont want to see a copyright when i login to the console :)
[01:09] <cef> thom: no, I'm not saying giving root a password is the right thing, but it's one way to attack the issue (as I see it anyway)
[01:09] <joebeastie2> actually i think it is the issue
[01:09] <bob2> you can change it
[01:09] <|trey|> joebeastie2: sudo vi /etc/motd  :/
[01:09] <joebeastie2> i know but why not have something very ubuntu instead and have more /etc/copyright for copyright info
[01:09] <joebeastie2> all i am saying :)
[01:10] <sivang> fabbione : well, just to let you know - I tested with xphome, and i have a pretty good OSD for that flatron, whenever I am in ubuntu it says "85Hz"
[01:10] <thom> joebeastie2: post to the users list, see what people think
[01:10] <fabbione> sivang: ok. it might be a limitation of the nv driver
[01:10] <thom> i think it's fine as is
[01:10] <fabbione> sivang: DDC doesn't detect more than 85Hz and there is nothing i can really do to override it
[01:11] <fabbione> sivang: you might want to check man nv and see if there is any option to do that manully. like NoDDC
[01:11] <sivang> fabbione : Can
[01:11] <cef> sure it should detect > 85Hz? 85Hz is usually very flickery or possibly interlaced in some cases
[01:11] <pitti> plovs_: sorry for the delay, just had lunch
[01:11] <sivang> fabbione : funny thing is, that ddc was disabled on my monitor
[01:11] <pitti> plovs_: did you upgrade the hal package?
[01:11] <pitti> plovs_: 0.2.98-1ubuntu2 should fix it
[01:12] <fabbione> sivang: if DDC was disabled xrepsrobe would not have worked at all
[01:12] <joebeastie2> thom: i might just add a bugzilla report on it. i dont want to get on any more mailing lists :P
[01:12] <thom> set it to trivial or enhancement
[01:12] <thom> please :-)
[01:12] <sivang> fabbione : then maybe the monitor lies
[01:12] <joebeastie2> will do. i know it isnt a bug
[01:13] <cef> fabbione: quick q.. does the nv or nvidia driver support widescreen style resolutions?
[01:13] <sivang> fabbione : ok, ddc is on now. lemme try agian
[01:13] <|trey|> joebeastie2: you realize you don't have to sign up for mailing lists to send to most of them right?
[01:13] <fabbione> cef: i don't remember sorry. i would have to check
[01:13] <fabbione> sivang: ok
[01:13] <|trey|> Thats why they stick archives everywhere  :)
[01:14] <cef> fabbione: 'scool.. thanx anyway
[01:14] <fabbione> cef: no problem :-)
[01:14] <sivang> fabbione : ok, ddcprobe gives this among it's other output --> dtiming: 1600x1200@98
[01:14] <sivang> fabbione : does the @98 means someting ? :)
[01:14] <fabbione> sivang: i told you that the driver doesn't lie!
[01:15] <fabbione> ;)
[01:15] <|trey|> joebeastie2: you should kick your imposter man  :)
[01:16] <|trey|> kinda annoying having to type the 2 everytime I type your nick  :(
[01:16] <sivang> fabbione : no it doesn't. It is a hell of a driver, what could be needed to make it usable as the proprierty one?
[01:16] <joebeastie2> |trey|: no that is me as well. just have it on my desktop but i am on my laptop :)
[01:17] <fabbione> sivang: only the 3D support :/
[01:17] <|trey|> joebeastie2: grr... its annoying though  :/
[01:17] <joebeastie2> |trey|: for who?
[01:17] <sivang> fabbione : oh. well, why won't them release an api to work with so we can add the support?
[01:17] <bob2> npmccallum: (if you're still artwork dude) is the gnome startup splash supposed to have a white shadow o nthe text?
[01:17] <|trey|> joebeastie2: everyone but you...
[01:17] <fabbione> sivang: that's the stuff they are not releaseing 
[01:17] <joebeastie2> |trey|: :P
[01:17] <fabbione> sivang: otherwise it would be too easy
[01:18] <|trey|> joebeastie2: ok, I'll just /ignore both, k  :/
[01:18] <sivang> fabbione : i see. Hmm, well, so you suggest to man nv and see if there's an option to use explicit mode?
[01:18] <sivang> fabbione : and if so, why won't it work in XF86COnfig?
[01:19] <joebeastie2> |trey|: no i will get off of this one. :(
[01:20] <joebeastie> sorry bout that
[01:21] <cef> fabbione: actually sivang has a good point.. what if the 3d support could be added as a binary module of some type to the existing nv driver? now that'd rock.. it'd be a bit of work for nvidia of course
[01:21] <cef> fabbione: it'd get rid of this '2 driver shuffle' issue.. hrm.. now if only we can convince nvidia.. *grin*
[01:21] <sivang> cef : for nvidia? assuming they would agree
[01:21] <sivang> ?
[01:22] <sivang> cef : can't we reverse engineer it and hack it to our needs?
[01:22] <cef> sivang: true.. that is the thorn of course.. then again.. it'd reduce the code they'd have to maintain
[01:22] <sivang> :->>
[01:22] <fabbione> sivang: now you need to change the Horiz/Vert frequency entry in X config and restart X
[01:22] <Treenaks> watch out that it doesn't become a second 'pwc'...
[01:22] <sivang> fabbione : ok, what values?
[01:23] <sivang> pwc?
[01:23] <fabbione> sivang: the one you get from xresprobe
[01:23] <cef> sivang: that'd take a while.. and why not let nvidia bring the code closer to what we have first before we bother to do that. *grin*
[01:23] <fabbione> sivang: just re-run it again
[01:23] <fabbione> sivang: and it should get the new freq range
[01:23] <fabbione> sivang: if freq are the same, you only need to restart X to let the driver figures that it can run at 100Hz
[01:24] <fabbione> cef: welcome to do so. i have binary drivers enough already ;)
[01:24] <cef> Treenaks: that assumes that we'd be trying to get the nvidia kernel module integrated into the kernel.. which would not be a good idea
[01:24] <fabbione> s/have/hate
[01:24] <sivang> cef : I think I'll try to approach them about that. I love the free driver, would love see it has 3d
[01:24] <cef> fabbione: heh..
[01:25] <fabbione> ok i guess i will have to stay awake more
[01:25] <sivang> cef : but we shall not ask them to release the implementation, just and ADT's header file I reckon.
[01:25] <fabbione> you guys are a drug for me
[01:25] <sivang> fabbione : this whole ubuntu thing is like a drug to me :)
[01:25] <cef> fabbione: the world is a drug!
[01:26] <sivang> fabbione : ok, the freqs are the same. the server booted. Still 85Hz
[01:26] <cef> fabbione: Never turn your back on a drug. Especially when it's waving a razor sharp hunting knife in your eye.
[01:27] <fabbione> cef: ehm.. that wasn't really the point
 sivang: woke at 4:50 am and it's almost 13:10 ;)
[01:28] <sivang> fabbione : :-)))))
[01:28] <cef> fabbione: there has to be a point? *grin*
[01:28] <sivang> fabbione : maybe you do need to try get some sleep, I'm concered about you fabbione. We need xorg in hoary :)
[01:28] <fabbione> cef: well yes.. i am very tired :P
[01:29] <cef> fabbione: you'll get sleep when daniels gets there.. he promotes sleep
[01:29] <fabbione> cef: AHAHA
[01:29] <fabbione> sivang: it's not like i am the only one that can do X.org ;)
[01:29] <fabbione> sivang: you are allowed to credit me for the good stuff and blame daniels for the problems
[01:29] <sivang> fabbione : ofcourse! you let me know, and I will bang my head against it for as long as I have strangth :_)
[01:29] <fabbione> that's what we agreed with cef ;)
[01:30] <sivang> fabbione : daniels is australian right?
[01:30] <cef> fabbione: usually the "You're mad daniel, you know that? ahh stuff this, I'm going to go to sleep and ignore you for a while." type of thing
[01:30] <fabbione> sivang: yes.. 
[01:30] <cef> sivang: he is
[01:30] <sivang> fabbione 
[01:30] <sivang> well, I wouldn't want to mess with him..
[01:30] <sivang> althouhg you are an italian, that might be even dangerous :-)
[01:30] <cef> fabbione: though the other type of sleep is the "I'm too pissed to stand" style
[01:30] <fabbione> uh do you prefer to mess with an italian?
[01:31] <sivang> hahah
[01:31] <fabbione> cef: lol
[01:31] <sivang> notice my former line
[01:31] <fabbione> oh
[01:31] <fabbione> yeah ehehehe
[01:31] <sivang> anyway, i will man nv and drill down it - try to see if I can overide autodetection
[01:32] <cef> fabbione: I must admit, from what I've seen of daniels' driving skills, he could be italian.. has a reckless attitude to speed..
[01:32] <fabbione> sivang: I think that NoDDC should do
[01:32] <sivang> fabbione :X.org compiles on the buildds already?
[01:32] <sivang> fabbione : on XF86Config ?
[01:32] <fabbione> sivang: no. there is no X.org
[01:32] <fabbione> sivang: yes, just check the manpage for nv
[01:32] <Treenaks> fabbione: you sound like that boy from The Matrix.. "There is no spoon."
[01:32] <sivang> fabbione : oh, but it's a feature goal I think I saw on the wiki
[01:33] <fabbione> Treenaks: how true!
[01:33] <sivang> Treenaks : *lol*
[01:33] <fabbione> sivang: correct. it's a feature goal.. but hoary is in 5/6 months...
[01:33] <fabbione> sivang: it's not like i create packages from one day to another ;)
[01:33] <fabbione> ^^^ it doesn't really work that way :P
[01:33] <cef> fabbione: nah, usually it only takes 3-4 hrs after finding another bug
[01:34] <thom> fabbione: hrm, it's not where i thought you pulled them from
[01:34] <fabbione> thom: ehehhe
[01:34] <fabbione> ok
[01:34] <fabbione> i need to go and crash a bit on the bed
[01:34] <cef> thom: tsk tsk.. he doesn't pull them out of daniels' arse.... tho I think daniels does.. *grin*
[01:34] <fabbione> later guys
[01:34] <thom> sleep well duder
[01:35] <fabbione> thanks thom
[01:35] <cef> fabbione: yeah, rest up
[01:35] <thom> cef: *g*
[01:35] <fabbione> thom: you have my phone number if the world will start to fall down ;)
[01:35] <sivang> fabbione : haha
[01:35] <cef> thom: then again, most of what daniels does is like that.. *coughapache2cough*
[01:35] <sivang> fabbione : Go get this sleep going, don't let it slip away
[01:35] <manou_> hi there, I'm trying to start a ssh server on ubuntu with classic /etc/init.d/ssh start but as there is no root account it says me I can't. Does anyone know what I am supposed to do to start ssh server on ubuntu ?
[01:36] <spiv> Use sudo.
[01:36] <sivang> manou_ : sudo /etc/init.d/ssh start
[01:36] <sivang> give your CURRENT users's pasword
[01:36] <thom> cef: don't i flippin' know it. "hi, i've done a new release, and it uses this whole new packaging system"
[01:36] <manou_> okay thanks spiv and sivang :)
[01:36] <m_tthew> when I ran 'sudo apt-get install ssh', it started sshd for me
[01:36] <thom> cef: i think i still have the email ;P
[01:36] <cef> thom: heh
[01:36] <sivang> a new packaging system?? :-)
[01:38] <sivang> fabbione : I am going for a couple of restarts to test vert freq - brb
[01:40] <cef> hrm, I have way too much shit in my room
[01:41] <sivang> man nv sends me to man XF86Config-4
[01:45] <sivang> fabbione : still here?
[01:47] <sivang> anybody here? seems like i am disconnected or something
[01:47] <patw> yep.
[01:47] <sivang> oh
[01:47] <sivang> I was worried :-)
[01:48] <cef> argh! I need more power points
[01:48] <cef> right, that does it! time to break out the 12 way power board
[01:48] <sivang> hah
[01:48] <sivang> I have 2 dozen
[01:49] <sivang> and still it sometimes isn't enough
[01:49] <cef> yeah I have about that
[01:49] <cef> but still.. this 12 way power board is useful
[01:49] <sivang> how many machines do you have there? (dorms,home etc?)
[01:50] <cef> at the moment? about 6.. and it's my bedroom
[01:50] <sivang> cef : wow. 6?? why so many?
[01:50] <cef> sivang: some are going to various places soon
[01:50] <sivang> cef : is it a canonical branch? ;-)
[01:51] <cef> sivang: hahaha.. I wish!
[01:51] <m_tthew> 6 is too many :)
[01:51] <cef> thom: one of these days, I'll consider getting the sparc I have online
[01:51] <Noodles> I have 6 Alphas in my bedroom.
[01:51] <m_tthew> if you have more than 3 in one room, it is time to figure out how much power you are using
[01:51] <sivang> Noodles : can you spare me one :)
[01:51] <cef> thom: if only for the novelty value
[01:51] <m_tthew> :)
[01:52] <Noodles> sivang: They're all earmarked for Debian people.
[01:52] <Noodles> They're just in the bedroom as the study already has many machines that are actually in use.
[01:52] <sivang> Noodles : debian people? as in p.d.o ?
[01:52] <Noodles> No, people involved in Debian.
[01:53] <thom> must go and get mine
[01:53] <sivang> Noodles : oh, are you donating those to the debian project?
[01:53] <Noodles> Not quite; people involved with it rather than the project.
[01:54] <sivang> Noodles : shall I want to purchase one, are they pricy or reasonable due to ALPHA decline?
[01:54] <Noodles> They still seem to shift for quite a lot; compared to Sparcs for example.
[01:55] <sivang> or someoether place that still has those
[01:59] <sivang> cef : anyway, do a machine list , how many differemt archs?
[02:00] <cef> sivang: erm, only one.. *grin*
[02:01] <cef> sivang: 1 x pIII-600 (my current lappy), 1 x celeron 1Ghz (firewall), 1 x Athlon 600, 1 x Athlon 500, 1 x Celeron 566, 1 x 1 Ghz celeron (rackmount machine for a usergroup)
[02:02] <cef> one athlon and the celeron 566 are going to someone else shortly (when they bother to pick em up)
[02:03] <cef> and the firewall was the machine I loaned to daniels so that he could fix an X problem
[02:05] <manou_> another question: I want to install kernel-headers for 2.6.8.1-2-386 in ubuntu, for beeing able to install the nvidia driver, but there are no packets in normal or universe for kernel 2.6.8, am I supposed to change kernel ?
[02:05] <Treenaks> manou_: you don't need the headers, the nvidia driver is included
[02:06] <manou_> Treenaks, for 3D too ?
[02:06] <Treenaks> manou_: yes
[02:06] <manou_> Treenaks, omg !
[02:06] <manou_> Treenaks, okay I try :) thanx for the tip 
[02:06] <Treenaks> manou_: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/BinaryDriverHowto
[02:09] <manou_> Treenaks, great ! 
[02:27] <cef> well that's a bummer.. set up my (no so) new printer, and just realised, I don't have any paper! doh!
[02:31] <phill> Hi, I was just wondering if anyone has tried/had success with getting an ati 9500/9700 card working with ati's driver in ubuntu? (as in their binary drivers, and have 3d acceleration)
[02:34] <cef> phill: tried the stuff at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/BinaryDriverHowto ?
[02:34] <phill> no, currently i'm running gentoo and have 3d acceleration, but i'm interested in switching to a debian based system
[02:34] <phill> i will check out the link now
[02:34] <cef> no probs
[02:35] <Tarka> Is there an issue with missing packages in amd64/universe?  Or am I just doing something wrong?
[02:35] <cef> well some stuff doesn't build on amd64
[02:36] <cef> nnot that  I've got details, nor do I (yet) own an amd64
[02:36] <Tarka> It's stuff that should, like gkrellm.  It's certainly in the debian pure64 archive.  msttcorefonts is missing too, and that's arch-all.
[02:36] <phill> so ubuntu uses xfree?
[02:37] <cef> currently
[02:37] <cef> after warty (the current one) the plan is to move to x.org
[02:38] <Tarka> phill: you can install x.org next to xfree; see http://incubator.vislab.usyd.edu.au/roller/page/Steve/20040909#installing_a_non_intrusive_x
[02:39] <Mirno> Treenaks,   you mean Nvidia/ATI drivers are included in Ubuntu ? You mean Canonical pays Nvidia ATI liscence for a free producte ?
[02:40] <phill> the nvidia/ati binaries are next to unsupported for linux, perhaps they pay for that? 
[02:40] <phill> anyways, thats for your help, might give it a shot tonight :) sick of compiling crap
[02:40] <Mirno> Treenaks,   Ubuntu is definitvlysomething huge ...
[02:41] <Mirno> _
[02:50] <lonewolff> can anyone help me with a printing problem
[03:01] <thom> so, LVM2 or evms?
[03:04] <bob2> thom: ok, laugh away, nosuid "somehow" breaks sudo.
[03:04] <thom> *gosh*
[03:04] <thom> i'm shocked by this relevation
[03:04] <thom> revelation
[03:05] <bob2> hey, I thought I set it on /home, not /
[03:05] <thom> i have one word for you. it starts with "p" and ends in "rat" ;-)
[03:07] <bob2> I love you too, thombot.
[03:09] <Kinnison> thom: plutocrat?
[03:10] <bob2> bwaha
[03:11] <Mayday> is it just me or doesent nntp work in evolution?
[03:12] <thom> Kinnison: not the word i was thinking of, but... ;-)
[03:13] <Kinnison> thom: Were you thinking of the word which apparently means "the fleshy part of the human body that you sit on" ?
[03:14] <bob2> prottom?
[03:14] <Kinnison> 'dict prat'
[03:17] <bob2> well, I never!
[03:24] <sebest> hello anyone using ubuntu with a dhcp?
[03:24] <Treenaks> sebest: yes, works great
[03:24] <pisuke> nautilus should be able to umount a cd-rw before erasing it. it complains the device is busy i had to umount manually.
[03:25] <sebest> Treenaks: i think there is a bug when the dhcp server doesn't answer a domainname
[03:25] <sebest> look in /etc/dhcp3/dhclient-script
[03:26] <sebest> in the first test of function make_resolv_conf there is a "-a" meaning instead of "-o"
[03:36] <Kosai> Coo.  Might qemu be able to emulate OS X on x86?
[03:38] <beezly> Kosai: see... http://fabrice.bellard.free.fr/qemu/
[03:39] <lonewolff> hey there, is there a way i can make cups let me do admin stuff in the web interface?
[03:41] <cef> admin like?
[03:41] <cef> (says me who is playing with cups on 2 PC's atm)
[03:41] <lonewolff> adding printers and deleting them, it says its been diabled for security purpouses
[03:41] <lonewolff> because the cups-gnome-ui wont add my printer properly
[03:42] <cef> ahh, hrm
[03:42] <cef> whats the cups-gnome-ui do wrong?
[03:42] <lonewolff> the program tells me the printeris thereand i chooe it
[03:42] <lonewolff> choose
[03:42] <cef> remote or local printer?
[03:43] <lonewolff> and all is well but if i look in properties it has added a network printer on usb://145?serial=CNblah/ and it should be a localprinter on /dev/usb/lpo like i told it
[03:44] <Treenaks> lonewolff: upgrade to the latest versions of those packages, I believe that was fixed
[03:44] <lonewolff> oh ok, i asumed i would have them from the apt-get that ubuntu did but i shall try that
[03:45] <lonewolff> Treenaks: does apt-get update update any packages forwhihc new ones are in the repo?
[03:46] <lonewolff> ah no its upgrade oops
[03:46] <Kinnison> "update" updates the package lists stored on your computer
[03:46] <Kinnison> "upgrade" upgrades the packages themselves
[03:46] <Treenaks> upgrade upgrades them to the latest versions know
[03:46] <lonewolff> ok,ive been using yum for too long lol
[03:46] <Treenaks> yum?
[03:47] <lonewolff> its a package manager used in fedora core
[03:47] <pisuke> lonewolff, you can use apt-get update && apt-get dist-upgrade to upgrade the whole system
[03:47] <lonewolff> pisuke: thanx
[03:47] <lonewolff> i have t-shirt transfers that need printing lol
[04:08] <Sandrofiol> http://www.forumfree.net/?c=18463
[04:08] <Sandrofiol> http://www.forumfree.net/?c=18463
[04:08] <Sandrofiol> http://www.forumfree.net/?c=18463
[04:08] <Sandrofiol> http://www.forumfree.net/?c=18463
[04:08] <Sandrofiol> http://www.forumfree.net/?c=18463
[04:08] <Sandrofiol> http://www.forumfree.net/?c=18463
[04:08] <Sandrofiol> http://www.forumfree.net/?c=18463
[04:08] <Sandrofiol> http://www.forumfree.net/?c=18463
[04:08] <Sandrofiol> http://www.forumfree.net/?c=18463
[04:08] <Sandrofiol> http://www.forumfree.net/?c=18463
[04:09] <pitti> Sandrofiol: wanting to catch attention? :-)
[04:11] <Vorph777> I've just installed ubuntu but getting no xwindows love...
[04:11] <Vorph777> "kernel:  Device 'i823650' does not have a release() function, it is broken and must be fixed."
[04:11] <tof_> any experiences with wireless on ubuntu ?
[04:11] <Treenaks> tof_: works fine
[04:11] <Vorph777> can anyone help?
[04:11] <Treenaks> (prism54 chip)
[04:12] <tof_> i've centrino
[04:12] <Treenaks> Vorph777: the i823650 is a pcmcia driver, don't worry...
[04:12] <Treenaks> Vorph777: what kind of video card do yuo have?
[04:12] <Treenaks> tof_: should work
[04:12] <longsleep> tof_: i use driverloader from linuxant without problems
[04:13] <Treenaks> longsleep: you don't need that for centrino..
[04:13] <Vorph777> ok, in that case I wil explore other avenues and try and suss it out myself, thanks for your help...:)
[04:13] <longsleep> Treenaks: i know .. i got another card
[04:13] <tof_> i've signal icon on taskbar but tells "no wireless device"
[04:13] <longsleep> Treenaks: just wanted to say that driverloader works with ubuntu :)
[04:14] <longsleep> just the signal quality shows 100% anytime
[04:16] <tof_> is there a  gui for wireless config ?
[04:18] <pisuke> tof_, computer -> system config -> network
[04:19] <pisuke> there's a wizard to add a network connection
[04:22] <thom> /dev/evms/home        143G  4.1G  139G   3% /home
[04:22] <thom> we
[04:22] <thom> eee
[04:25] <Sandrofiol> http://www.forumfree.net/?c=18463
[04:25] <Sandrofiol> http://www.forumfree.net/?c=18463
[04:25] <Sandrofiol> http://www.forumfree.net/?c=18463
[04:26] <tof_> i've a gui error when i tried to launch network-admin
[04:26] <xf> question before i ask any other stupid questions; anybody maintaining third party ubuntu faq's, howto's, etc - particulary with amd64?
[04:27] <leonel> Hello :  I have a problem with the mouse pointer , all works fine  but when  I switch to console and back to the Xwindow  shows up a  X window X cursor  static in the center of the screen  but the real mouse pointer works fine     any clue ?
[04:30] <xf> ok, failing that: anybody installed nvidia 64-bit drivers on ubuntu amd64?
[04:31] <lonewolff> i have done an upgrade now but i am still having the same printing problems
[04:31] <tof_> how can i change kb language at login screen ?
[04:32] <pisuke> lonewolff, try to add a printer with the new printer wizard
[04:33] <lonewolff> pisuke: when i get to the end of the wizard i get an error "The Application "gnome-cups-manager" has quit unexpectedly"
[04:34] <tof--> re
[04:35] <tof--> when i try to launch network-admin i get this error
[04:35] <tof--> (network-admin:7110): GnomeUI-WARNING **: While connecting to session manager:
[04:35] <tof--> Authentication Rejected, reason : None of the authentication protocols specified are supported and host-based authentication failed.
[04:37] <[Bas] > leonel, maybe this can help you: http://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-users/2004-September/002102.html
[04:39] <leonel> [Bas] : reading ....
[04:40] <lonewolff> pisuke: when i get to the end of the wizard i get an error "The Application "gnome-cups-manager" has quit unexpectedly"
[04:40] <mkyc-ubuntu> heya guys
[04:41] <mkyc-ubuntu> downloaded and installed ubuntu tonight on my dell latitude csr and its flawless
[04:41] <mkyc-ubuntu> the best install ever on this machine.  Very very good
[04:42] <leonel> [Bas] : Thanks  but still the same 
[04:45] <mkyc-ubuntu> anyway just wanted to say cool job to any of the ubuntu team here - this is a distro i will be reccomending to all
[04:48] <bob2_> Kamion: hm, I noticed gtkpbbuttons isn't on the cd, and gnome's equivalent doesn't seem to work for the brightness at least
[04:51] <elim> thanks dev team for the myspell uk dictionary it has solved my problem with open office's spelling not working
[04:58] <stojanos> which tool I should install for burning CDs from iso image
[04:58] <trukulo> cdrecord
[04:58] <trukulo> but you can do it with nautilus
[04:58] <stojanos> is it X gui app
[04:59] <bob2_> stojanos: you could just try it and see
[04:59] <trukulo> select with left button of the mouse, and it gives you an option to record in cd
[04:59] <bob2_> but no, cdrecord is a command line app
[04:59] <bob2_> which every other tool on linux calls to burn cds
[04:59] <stojanos> thanks
[04:59] <trae> stojanos, you need help with that?
[04:59] <trae> stojanos, you have an ISO already downloaded?
[05:01] <trae> do this:  dmesg |grep channel
[05:01] <trae> hmm
[05:01] <stojanos> nautilus shows iso icon for file with is ext. but right click does not list "record to cd" option
[05:01] <trae> that's not exactly helpful.
[05:01] <trae> heh
[05:01] <trukulo> stojanos, you said it's an iso?
[05:01] <myk> hey all
[05:01] <trae> stojanos, that would be intuitive wouldn't it?
[05:01] <trae> hehe
[05:02] <trae> stojanos, do dmesg, and scroll back up and look for your CDburner
[05:02] <trukulo> stojanos, sudo apt-get install nautilus-cd-burner
[05:02] <myk> i'm curious about adding a ubuntu mirror to the file mirror i maintain here at school -- is there anyone here that I can talk to about it?
[05:03] <trukulo> MyK: read wiki
[05:04] <myk> trukulo: i have.  i'm curious if the statement about the size "doubling in the immediate future" refers to the main rsync or the cdimage rsync, or both, or what
[05:04] <trae> odd, don't see it in my dmesg now.
[05:04] <trukulo> myk, try to talk with developers
[05:05] <myk> trukulo: that's what i came to do.  thanks for the help though
[05:05] <trukulo> myk, #ubuntu-devel
[05:05] <trukulo> but don't disturb there
[05:05] <trukulo> they are very serious at working *cough*
[05:06] <carlos> myk: we are going to start hoary development soon
[05:06] <carlos> so you will have two versions instead of only one
[05:06] <myk> ah
[05:06] <trukulo> devel and stable, that's correct
[05:06] <myk> carlos: would you be against us just mirroring the stable releases?
[05:06] <myk> right now i only have about 20 gigs i can spare
[05:07] <carlos> myk: no, I don't think it's a problem if you only have a mirror for the stable release
[05:07] <myk> great
[05:16] <jasona90> any one know how to set up DNS correctly
[05:16] <bob2_> edit /etc/resolv.conf
[05:17] <jasona90> k i dont have a resolv.conf file
[05:17] <jasona90> im not sure what is supposed to be in it
[05:17] <bob2_> are you using DHCP?
[05:17] <trae> how does one reload .Xresources again?  xrdb -merge ~/.Xresources ?
[05:17] <trae> I always forget
[05:17] <jasona90> no Manual 
[05:17] <bob2_> yes.
[05:18] <bob2_> jasona90: are you using DHCP?
[05:18] <jasona90> No should i be
[05:18] <trae> hmm
[05:18] <trae> bbiab
[05:19] <jasona90> I can only get a few web pages to load
[05:19] <herzi> does anyone know a good linux live cd to rescue my ubuntu on ppc?
[05:19] <jasona90> so i assume that my DNS is messed up
[05:19] <cliff> herzi: don't knoppix have a ppc CD ?
[05:19] <bob2_> herzi: if you have I/O errors from your disk, a rescue CD is unlikely to help you
[05:19] <Kamion> herzi: you can rescue with the install CD, if you try ...
[05:20] <bob2_> jasona90: that's a very poor assumption.
[05:20] <cliff> otherwise probably the gentoo live CD for that arch.
[05:20] <jasona90> lol k
[05:20] <herzi> Kamion, it doesn't contain the xfs repair stuff
[05:20] <bob2_> jasona90: can you resolve names using "host name.com"
[05:20] <bob2_> ?
[05:20] <ricky_clarkson> bob2_: What's your main raisin?
[05:20] <jasona90> i can ping hold on ill try
[05:20] <Kamion> herzi: oh, you can't even mount the partition?
[05:20] <arthurgeek> i think gentoo for ppc can be used..
[05:20] <bob2_> ricky_clarkson: heh, working for canonical, I guess
[05:20] <Kamion> herzi: you could probably pick it out of the xfsprogs .deb, but that's an expert path :)
[05:20] <ricky_clarkson> bob2_: Who's that?
[05:21] <herzi> nope i suddenly got IO errors during an update after that i rebooted
[05:21] <ricky_clarkson> Oh, got it.
[05:21] <jasona90> yea host www.google.com works 
[05:21] <ricky_clarkson> bob2_: So you've finished Uni now?
[05:21] <bob2_> jasona90: ok, dns is fine then
[05:22] <bob2_> ricky_clarkson: the company behind ubuntu
[05:22] <ricky_clarkson> bob2_: I saw that.
[05:22] <bob2_> ricky_clarkson: nah, just putting it off for now
[05:22] <jasona90> k
[05:22] <herzi> i see i've got access to that udeb, but how do i "install" it into the ramdisk, there seems to be no dpkg
[05:22] <ricky_clarkson> bob2_: So are you employed to be here now? ;)
[05:22] <herzi> memo to myself: create a ppc fallback solution
[05:22] <lml> Is there a prefered way of specifying the type of monitor connected to a Ubuntu system?
[05:23] <bob2_> ricky_clarkson: hah, no, fortunately not
[05:23] <bob2_> lml: how do you mean? the refresh rate, etc?
[05:24] <ricky_clarkson> bob2_: Congratulations.  What do you do for them, and are you working in Australia?
[05:24] <jasona90> bob2_: so is it possible that my drivers are messed up
[05:24] <bob2_> ricky_clarkson: heh, thanks...just some infrastructure stuff, yeah
[05:24] <bob2_> jasona90: I doubt it...which websites don't work?
[05:24] <lml> bob2_: The Fedora installer tells me that it is unable to detect the type of monitor and let me select from a list of known monitors. Something similar would be nice so I can get more than 60Hz.
[05:24] <jasona90> google works sometimes and the ubuntu home page kinda works
[05:25] <bob2_> lml: sudo dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xfree86
[05:25] <bob2_> jasona90: "kinda works"?
[05:25] <lml> bob2_: Thanx, I will try that.
[05:25] <jasona90> it wont ever completly finish loading
[05:25] <bob2_> jasona90: sure your network connection/hardware is ok?
[05:25] <jasona90> i think
[05:25] <jasona90> it works fine in windows
[05:26] <bob2_> ok
[05:26] <jasona90> so possibly i need to configure something in my router settings
[05:26] <jasona90> ?
[05:27] <bob2_> well, I can't think of anything that would make web pages half-load
[05:27] <bob2_> try asking on the ubuntu-users lsit?
[05:27] <jasona90> it can connect fine to the Ubuntu.com but then it trys to load some ads or something and it times out
[05:27] <jasona90> Amazon.com
[05:28] <Kamion> ubuntu.com doesn't seem to be working at the moment ...
[05:28] <Kamion> try www.ubuntulinux.org
[05:28] <Kamion> ah yes of course, www.ubuntu.com is deliberately not there
[05:29] <jasona90> or sorry yea thats the page i was talking about ubuntulinux.org
[05:32] <vrln> ubuntulinux.org works fine here, your internet connection might have some problems atm
[05:32] <jasona90> i can connect to it
[05:32] <jasona90> it just never finished loading
[05:33] <jasona90> the page doesnt appear to be partial either
[05:34] <jasona90> If i use the IP instead of the web adress of google.com it load 100% of the time
[05:36] <jasona90> IrC seems to be the only thing that works well on my internet
[05:36] <jasona90> I cant use Gaim it times out
[05:37] <jasona90> everything times seems to time out
[05:37] <jasona90> even though i can ping the ip with no problem
[05:45] <elim> kde libs and core don't install (universe)
[05:45] <trukulo> elim, universe is not supported
[05:45] <elim> what is the 'universe'?
[05:46] <trukulo> universe is a snapshot of debian sid
[05:46] <elim> ah\
[05:46] <trukulo> all packages in universe, aren't supported
[05:46] <trukulo> but if you want to take risk, you can
[05:46] <trukulo> all packages are compiled against ubuntu in the moment of the snapshot
[05:46] <elim> i am tis good 2.6.81 kernel :D
[05:47] <trukulo> so, if it's broken in universe, it's broken, period
[05:47] <elim> nobody fixes it?
[05:47] <trukulo> no, at the moment
[05:47] <trukulo> later perhaps some packages in universe will be maintained by someone
[05:48] <elim> that sucks how does anything ever get done?
[05:48] <trukulo> not now
[05:48] <trukulo> if you want to maintain one package, talk to developers
[05:48] <Kamion> elim: the current set of Ubuntu developers don't have time to support universe as well as everything else
[05:48] <Kamion> we have enough to do supporting main and restricted
[05:49] <Kamion> but community help with maintaining bits of universe (at which point they could possibly move out of universe) is welcome
[05:49] <trukulo> there are more than 1.000 packages supported in ubuntu
[05:49] <trukulo> and 35 developers: am i wrong kamion?
[05:50] <hypatia> If I download a source package from Debian non-free (sl-modem-source), how can I get kernel-package to build it with a dependency on LINUX-image rather than KERNEL-image?
[05:50] <thom> trukulo: not even close to 35, more like 10 full time
[05:51] <thom> canonical has about 35 staff total
[05:51] <trukulo> so it's amazing they can support well that amount of packages
[05:51] <Kamion> hypatia: you might well have to patch either kernel-package or the source package in question or both
[05:52] <Zomb> hypatia: perl -pe 's,kernel-image,linux-image,g' -i /usr/src/modules/sl-modem/debian/*.in ; m-a build sl-modem
[05:54] <hypatia> Is evolution uninstallable at the moment?
[05:54] <elim> how do i maintain/package .debs?
[05:54] <hypatia> It's complaining about conflicts with evolution-data-server
[05:55] <elim> packages*
[05:55] <cliff> hypatia: are you running it inside gnome ?
[05:55] <zolrath__> Perhaps using the i386 version instead of the amd64 version would be a better idea.  I've gotten a few architecture not supported occurances.
[05:55] <cliff> or KDE for that matter
[05:55] <hypatia> cliff: I never run it at all. But I have it installed, I just did an "update" and now aptitude wants to uninstall it.
[05:55] <cliff> oh ok.
[05:55] <hypatia> cliff: further investigation reveals that it conflicts with the new version of evolution-data-server
[05:56] <cliff> which version is it trying to remove ?
[05:56] <cliff> 1.6.4?
[05:56] <hypatia> No, 2.0
[05:56] <Kamion> elim: that's a very long story best answered at the Debian web site
[05:56] <hypatia> 2.0 evolution conflicts with data-server 1.0.1\
[05:56] <cliff> oh, awesome.
[05:56] <hypatia> or >= 1.0.1 rather
[05:56] <Kamion> zolrath__: evolution should be fine on amd64 now, I think
[05:57] <cliff> do you use the data server ?
[05:57] <Kamion> zolrath__: please do report any amd64 problems you see
[05:57] <trukulo> elim, first, you have to know how to make good packages
[05:57] <trukulo> so, you need to know debian very good
[05:57] <hypatia> cliff: no, but evolution also depends on it.
[05:57] <hypatia> cliff: it looks like the only solution is to hold data-server at 1.0.0
[05:57] <cliff> hypatia: if you're not using either of them, just remove it.
[05:57] <hypatia> But aptitude doesn't work that out on its own.
[05:57] <cliff> I didn't know there was a 1.0.1 version of the data server.
[05:57] <zolrath__> Kamion: I haven't had evolution problems but just in general with things such as flash
[05:58] <cliff> I don't know why you have it installed, I use evolution, but don't have the data server installed
[05:58] <hypatia> cliff: evolution lists it as a dependency (2.0.0-ubuntu3)
[05:59] <Kamion> Zolrath: ah, I mean with stuff in Ubuntu
[06:00] <Zolrath> Totem on the other hand does seem to show no video for anything, simply audio.
[06:00] <Kamion> hypatia: hm, nothing evolution-ish is in the current list of uninstallable packages
[06:00] <Kamion> ... how about I put that list somewhere that isn't company-private ...
[06:00] <cliff> hypatia: the box I'm referencing isn't actually tuning ubuntu.
[06:01] <Kamion> http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~cjwatson/testing/warty_probs.html
[06:02] <spiv> Kamion: that list has evolution in it
[06:03] <hypatia> Kamion: does that mean the problem isn't real?
[06:03] <hypatia> Kamion: I don't quite understand what you're trying to tell me :)
[06:05] <Zolrath> Totem can't seem to show any video whatsoever and only plays audio streams, no matter what codec the video is in.
[06:05] <tvon|x31> Zolrath: I think totem-gstreamer is broken, totem-xine should work
[06:06] <Kamion> spiv: oh, bah, it didn't until like five minutes ago ...
[06:06] <Kamion> hypatia: nah, just trying to diagnose
[06:09] <Kamion> hypatia: a newer version of evolution was uploaded recently, give it a while to build, seems they're just out of sync
[06:10] <hypatia> OK
[06:10] <hypatia> aptitude is annoying in that circumstance
[06:10] <hypatia> Its solution is "just uninstall all effected packages"
[06:10] <hypatia> affected
[06:10] <Kamion> ah, the build failed
[06:10] <Zolrath> totem --xine says that --xine option is unknown and what ignored
[06:11] <hypatia> Anyway, the annoying thing about that is that you have to remember to reinstall.
[06:11] <jasona90> Hey Thanks whoever helped me i got My DNS thing fixed and all my pages load now
[06:11] <Kamion> yeah, stick 'em on hold for now
[06:12] <Zolrath> downloading I guess
[06:12] <Telep> wtf, I selected "mark all upgrades" in Synaptic, and now it want's to remove evolution?!
[06:12] <Telep> (didn't apply yet)
[06:13] <hypatia> Telep: discussed just above
[06:13] <hypatia> Telep: put evolution-data-server on hold
[06:13] <hypatia> (that's an annoying thing with aptitude/synaptic -- it makes it hard to find the magical package to hold)
[06:14] <elim> o my goodness, the documentation for the development of packages is Vast!
[06:14] <elim> why not make it simple?
[06:14] <Kamion> producing quality packages is not easy; it involves being able to support users ...
[06:15] <Kamion> better to filter out the people who can't deal with that early on :-)
[06:15] <trukulo> and a lot of knowledges
[06:15] <jasona90> does ubuntu come with a firewall
[06:15] <Telep> hypatia: on hold? mm, how do I do that?
[06:15] <Kosai> jasona90: see the first FAQ entry :)
[06:15] <trukulo> jasona90, iptables
[06:15] <Kosai> (on the wiki)
[06:16] <jasona90> k ty
[06:16] <trukulo> iptables it's the best firewall
[06:16] <trukulo> :P
[06:17] <hypatia> Telep: I don't know how to do in in synaptic, sorry
[06:18] <Zolrath> When configuring xine I get WARNING! No X11 output plugins will be built.
[06:18] <netvistun> We have a couple of computers that have slow internet, due to dns problem. But I fixed it in one compter by intalling packages and I can't reproduce it.
[06:19] <Telep> hypatia: how do I do it otherwise then? Does putting on hold mean simply that it will not be upgraded?
[06:19] <hypatia> Telep: yes, until you explicitly ask that it be upgraded
[06:19] <netvistun> Short of copying the etc what other solution is there, because this is not a problem for fedora core 1
[06:20] <hypatia> Telep: I only know how to do it in aptitude, if you don't know aptitude already it's a bit of a pain to use
[06:20] <hypatia> Telep: might be easier to find someone else who knows synaptic
[06:20] <Telep> well I noticed, yes :)
[06:20] <Kamion> Telep: lowest-common-denominator approach is 'echo evolution hold | dpkg --set-selections' in a root terminal
[06:20] <Kamion> (or 'echo evolution hold | sudo dpkg --set-selections)
[06:20] <Kamion> '
[06:21] <hypatia> Kamion: I don't think holding evo helps
[06:21] <hypatia> Kamion: you need to hold evolution-data-server
[06:21] <Zolrath> It can't seem to find aalib or pretty much anything whatsoever when trying to configure even if its installed
[06:21] <trukulo> Zolrath, devel packages?
[06:21] <elim> im gonna try to package some kde packages would u be interested for me to do this or is somebody else doing this?
[06:22] <Telep> well isn't it enough that after "marking all upgrades" in synaptic I simply manually unmark the packages I don't want it to touch?
[06:23] <Zolrath> trukulo, Thanks, I was foolish.. Although the other problems I might not be so lucky.
[06:25] <trukulo> Zolrath, :)
[06:27] <elim> any devs here?
[06:27] <trukulo> elim, package kde it's VERY difficult
[06:28] <elim> hmm i think ill just start smaller then and try to package bash or somthing
[06:28] <elim> what do u recommend?
[06:28] <elim> to start with
[06:28] <trukulo> umm, try with bygfoot
[06:29] <Kamion> elim: you think bash might be already packaged? :-)
[06:30] <trukulo> or wifi-radar grom gnomefiles.org
[06:34] <punkass_> i couldnt get wifi-radar to work cuz it requires dhcpcd
[06:34] <punkass_> and dhcpcd was causing me greif
[06:34] <elim> hmmm  i think ill just install kde from source code and then possible develop at a later date, i dont have that much free time,
[06:36] <hypatia> Is it against ubuntu policy to have icons appear on the desktop without the user explicitly adding them?
[06:36] <hypatia> I ask because it is happening and I want to know whether I should file a bug.
[06:36] <ggi> elim: Why are you installing kde from source?
[06:36] <punkass_> well i know they dont put any on there by default
[06:36] <trukulo> hypatia, with what program?
[06:37] <Jaramin> anyone knows how to open a nautilus window with root privileges? I need to edit smb.conf...
[06:37] <hypatia> trukulo: when I plug my USB digicam in, an "sda1" icon appears on the desktop.
[06:37] <ggi> Jaramin: sudo nautilus
[06:37] <trukulo> hypatia, send a bug report, then
[06:37] <Telep> hypatia: that's normal, it mounts it as a drive
[06:37] <Telep> or at least it should be
[06:38] <Telep> same thing if you pop in a cd
[06:38] <hypatia> Telep: I know it's normal to mount it, but I think Ubuntu has decided that having any icons appear without the user asking for them is a problem
[06:38] <hypatia> Hence, it may be a bug in Ubuntu even if its normal gnome behvaiour
[06:39] <Telep> hmm... well I hope they still allow for that behaviour :)
[06:39] <Telep> even if they change the default
[06:39] <Jaramin> ggi: tried that, but it's fugly, even if it works. the terminal window gets into some sort of waiting mode and it won't get out of it until the window I opened with it is closed
[06:39] <Vorph777> Hello all. I just installed ubuntu - starts X and brings up the login screen ok but when I log in it loads for a bit then hangs at the "ubuntu" splash screen. Any ideas?
[06:40] <Telep> Vorph777: did you try clicking the splash screen?
[06:40] <ggi> Jaramin: Couldn't you just edit the file with a console text editor? If you must, you can do 'sudo nautilus &' to detach it from the terminal.
[06:40] <Vorph777> Telep - aye, no luck. Mouse cursor still moving but that's it
[06:40] <Telep> hmm
[06:42] <Jaramin> ggi: I guess I could, but I come from the windows world, I like gui apps, that's the reason I love Ubuntu :) I'll try with the "&".
[06:44] <parkerc> I just upgraded via "Smart Upgrade" and evolution was uninstalled.  Evolution will not install without evolution-data-server > 1.0.0 (1.0.1 is installed)
[06:45] <Jaramin> ggi: not working, it asks for my password, though it's in clear text when I enter it, and then does nothing :-/
[06:46] <jayeola> hi guys. 1st attempt to install ubuntu on a laptop :)
[06:47] <punkass_> hypatia: you can turn off mounted icons in Gconf
[06:47] <ggi> Jaramin: Are you typing the command in a terminal?
[06:47] <Jaramin> ggi: in other distros there's often a "open file explorer as root" icon, as much as there is already a "open terminal as root" shortcut, think it would be a nice addition.
[06:47] <punkass_> its on by default so i assume they want mounted icons to show up
[06:48] <Jaramin> ggi: yep... I shouldn't?
[06:48] <hypatia> punkass_: yep, but I want to know whether it *already should be* off.
[06:48] <ggi> Jaramin: No, that's ok. Let me try...
[06:49] <ggi> Jaramin: Ah, I get it. Try 'gksudo nautilus &' instead.
[06:50] <hypatia> spiv told me that they'd decided "no random icons on desktop", so *shrug*
[06:52] <elim> kde wont install from apt-get
[06:52] <Jaramin> ggi: it works, but the console window is still open, and the cursor is on a line with no prompt, is that normal?
[06:53] <ggi> Jaramin: Yeah, probably. Just hit return a couple of times.
[06:55] <Jaramin> ggi: yup, one return did the trick, still, if I close the nautilus window while the terminal is still open, it spits out a gnome ui warning and a bonobo warning, try it
[06:58] <ggi> Jaramin: Yes, it does.
[06:59] <ggi> Jaramin: I don't think you have to worry about that too much.
[07:01] <Jaramin> ggi: ok. I'll try to figure out a way to make a shortcut that does the same thing as for the root terminal... any place to post that suggestion to developpers?
[07:02] <ggi> Jaramin: The mailing lists, I guess. I'm not entirely convinced it's a sane thing to have though.
[07:06] <Jaramin> ggi: thanks! well, it's sane enough for other distros... maybe they could put a warning pop-up telling you that it's dangerous if you change important files and bla bla bla...
[07:06] <Jaramin> ggi: anyway, thanks for the help :)
[07:13] <jayeola> hmmm... it seems as if you have to tell the installer yr n/work details, otherwise it stops
[07:13] <maswan> Mithrandir: let me know when you have fixed the problem and give me a link to an iso and I'll try another install
[07:13] <herzi> yes
[07:13] <herzi> i beat my hard disk
[07:15] <Tomcat_> Hi xTina ;)
[07:15] <xTina> hi :)
[07:16] <jayeola> has anybody successfully upgraded their kerenl once they have installed ubuntu?
[07:17] <Kamion> hypatia: no, that's deliberate
[07:17] <Kamion> hypatia: we turned that behaviour back on for some devices, because otherwise there was no discoverable way to unmount a device
[07:18] <Kamion> hypatia: if you can find the logs of the last technical board meeting, it was discussed there
[07:19] <dep> in my country ubuntu mean fucked-up. 
[07:20] <Kamion> dep: can't win 'em all, that sort of thing happens with all kinds of names
[07:23] <tseng> hm any chance of newer ipw2200 driver in warty? bugfixes.
[07:23] <dep> buntu
[07:23] <dep> blocked or closed
[07:23] <dep> kebuntuan: deadlock
[07:23] <dep> http://dictionary.bhanot.net/index.html
[07:25] <dep> i need wide area project plan template....
[07:26] <_axel> damnit, i simply cant burn a single cd with my burner under ubuntu -- i've tried nautilus, k3b, raw cdrecord/crdao and they all give me nice coasters with "unknown error 254", i know the burner works cause i can use it under xp and it worked under sid/sarge
[07:27] <dep> install back sarge imho
[07:28] <_axel> yeah sure
[07:29] <_axel> maybe something less radical will do - i really like ubuntu so far
[07:31] <hypatia> Kamion: thanks
[07:31] <Kamion> tseng: I thought we already had 0.8
[07:33] <peteog> anyone had any issues when dist-upgrading that evolution is unistalled
[07:34] <hypatia> peteog: yes
[07:35] <hypatia> peteog: you should put evolution-data-server on hold
[07:35] <peteog> cool
[07:41] <Tsjoklate> hi everybody
[07:41] <herzi> any ppc user around?
[07:41] <Tsjoklate> did anyone have evo removed after doing apt-get upgrade?
[07:41] <punkass> Kamion: you guys going to include ndiswrapper at all?
[07:42] <Tsjoklate> I just did an upgrade and evolution got removed.. when I want to reinstall it it wants to remove half of my system
[07:44] <peteog> Tsjoklate, same prob here
[07:45] <Tsjoklate> I guess we are out of our email client peteog
[07:45] <peteog> yup :)
[07:45] <Tsjoklate> perhaps they are working on it right now and with the next update it will be fixed
[07:45] <Tsjoklate> first time Ubu does something this weird lol
[07:45] <Tsjoklate> I got spoiled by having a working machine too long I suppose
[07:46] <peteog> Tsjoklate, I was thinking the same thing :)
[07:46] <Tsjoklate> mmm seems my entire computer is not a very happy camper at this moment... can't do anything
[07:46] <Tsjoklate> I'll reboot see if that fixes it
[07:46] <Tsjoklate> bbiab
[07:47] <hypatia> Tsjoklate, peteog: you need to downgrade evolution-data-server to 1.0.0 and then put it on hold
[07:47] <myk> how long is "this long" ?
[07:47] <Tsjoklate> can't do
[07:47] <peteog> hypatia: how do I downgrade?
[07:48] <Tsjoklate> when I want to remove it it wants to flush half my box
[07:48] <hypatia> peteog: depends on what you're using to upgrade
[07:48] <Tsjoklate> synaptic
[07:48] <peteog> was using synaptic
[07:48] <hypatia> I only know how to use aptitude, sorry
[07:48] <hypatia> Tsjoklate: you don't need to remove anything
[07:48] <Tsjoklate> lol
[07:48] <Tsjoklate> I don't want to
[07:48] <Tsjoklate> but synaptic does
[07:48] <hypatia> yep
[07:48] <Tsjoklate> when I want to install evo it wants to do it
[07:49] <peteog> so how do you do it with aptitude?
[07:49] <Tsjoklate> when I try to remove the data server it wants to do it
[07:49] <hypatia> because evolution conflicts with the latest version of evolution-data-server
[07:49] <Tsjoklate> not my idea
[07:49] <hypatia> hence, if you have an old version of evolution-data-server still around on your harddrive or in package lists, you should use that.
[07:49] <hypatia> or wait until they fix the build errors in the latest evolution
[07:50] <Tsjoklate> so stick with the number one version?
[07:50] <Tsjoklate> peteog: select the data-server package, click package and click force
[07:50] <hypatia> yeah, stick with 1.0.0
[07:51] <hypatia> At least until a new version of evolution is available which works with 1.0.1
[07:51] <Tsjoklate> bad oops ain't it
[07:51] <hypatia> Apparently you can find out about uninstallable packages from http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~cjwatson/testing/warty_probs.html
[07:54] <Tsjoklate> well it made my box crash
[07:54] <Tsjoklate> oh joy
[07:54] <Tsjoklate> ok so downgrade to 1.0 and then what?
[07:55] <Kamion> punkass: we already have
[07:55] <Tsjoklate> well I guess I put a lock on the evo data thing
[07:55] <Kamion> herzi: what's up?
[07:56] <Tsjoklate> that was one scary deal
[07:56] <Tsjoklate> are they working on it?
[07:56] <punkass> Kamion: in the current or in the next release?
[07:56] <Kamion> punkass: it's already in warty
[07:56] <punkass> oh..is it installed by default?
[07:56] <punkass> or via apt-get
[07:56] <herzi> Kamion, i trashed my xfs
[07:57] <herzi> but i got it now
[07:57] <punkass> just curious, because i installed it from source...
[07:57] <Kamion> punkass: it's part of our standard kernel images as of linux-source-2.6.8.1 2.6.8.1-7
[07:58] <Kamion> +  * Added NDIS wrapper (Pontus Fuchs):
[07:58] <Kamion> +    . drivers/net/Kconfig
[07:58] <Kamion> +    . drivers/net/Makefile
[07:58] <Kamion> +    . drivers/net/ndiswrapper/*
[07:58] <punkass> oh..oops..guess i did a bunch of work i didnt need to..
[07:58] <herzi> Kamion, my gconf tree is a broken now, by time will heal these wounds
[07:59] <herzi> time, updates, ...
[07:59] <stratking> has anyone had any problems w/ getting an orinoco pcmcia card working?
[07:59] <herzi> stratking, specify "working"
[08:00] <stratking> well, in my situation, nothing happens at all, the lights on the card don't come on, the card isn't detected and the orinoco modules aren't getting loaded
[08:00] <stratking> i can manually modprobe orinoco_cs to load the modules but still can't get the card to be recognized
[08:00] <herzi> you have your pcmcia socket set up?
[08:00] <herzi> do other pcmcia cards work?
[08:01] <stratking> this is the only pcmcia card i use
[08:01] <herzi> does cardinfo work?
[08:01] <stratking> let me try that
[08:02] <herzi> cardinfo should live update its display when you plug the card in and pull it out
[08:02] <stratking> it just says unsupported card
[08:02] <herzi> what kind of orinoco is it?
[08:02] <stratking> gold
[08:03] <stratking> on a dell inspiron if that helps at all
[08:03] <herzi> let me check this (haven't used wireless since switching to ubuntu)
[08:03] <herzi> applepbook
[08:03] <stratking> lucky bastard
[08:04] <herzi> stratking, doesn't work yet, gimme your email address and i#ll contact you once it works
[08:04] <stratking> rdonahue@gmail.com
[08:04] <stratking> sweet, thanks
[08:04] <stratking> and now everyone else can drop me a line when they want to as well :)
[08:04] <herzi> np
[08:04] <stratking> oh well
[08:05] <gommans> let me write that down stratking!
[08:05] <stratking> haha
[08:05] <stratking> np, i have plenty more invites, ill just give myself another one
[08:05] <stratking> no one emails me anyway
[08:05] <stratking> *sniff*
[08:05] <Kamion> lucky you
[08:06] <stratking> its alright, whenever i feel lonely, i log into hotmail and check out all my spam
[08:06] <aspuru> stratking: we can subscribe yo to some spam lists
[08:06] <stratking> woohoo
[08:06] <stratking> oh well time for class
[08:07] <gommans> Any former mepis users here?
[08:13] <poj> hi..if I want to setup my source for testing ( since i no sur i trust unstable) will this work you think ?
[08:14] <Kamion> trying to do an upgrade run from Ubuntu to Debian isn't guaranteed to work particularly well
[08:14] <Kamion> we rebuild all packages from source without changing the version number; this can confuse apt if you try to mix the two
[08:14] <poj> ic ah
[08:15] <poj> okay well..I typical no sure bout unstable as I run business set...your way of using unstable maybe safer ?
[08:17] <Kamion> poj: neither
[08:17] <Kamion> poj: we suggest that people who need to run software that's not in Ubuntu use our universe repository (but note that it's unsupported)
[08:17] <poj> neither?..i no undestand
[08:17] <october> quit
[08:18] <poj> heh
[08:19] <poj> Kamion, what was main reason to go over testing if i can ask
[08:19] <poj> brb
[08:19] <Kamion> poj: don't understand the question
[08:20] <Kamion> poj: if you mean why did we branch from unstable rather than from testing, see http://www.ubuntulinux.org/ubuntu/relationship/document_view
[08:22] <lemonlysol> I just did a apt-get update apt-get upgrade and it wants to remove evolution.  Did something change?
[08:22] <tvon|x31> hrm
[08:23] <tvon|x31> Anyone know what the Amazon product is thats being used on the Ubuntu site?
[08:27] <lemonlysol> Actually it looks like a problem with synaptic mark all smart option
[08:28] <Kamion> lemonlysol: evolution is uninstallable in Warty at the moment; one of the developers is looking at it
[08:30] <lemonlysol> But it was working before.  Is this recent?
[08:32] <Kamion> lemonlysol: yes, it's recent
[08:32] <lemonlysol> If it is already installed will it continue to run?
[08:32] <LinuxJones> Hi everyone
[08:33] <theantix> lemonlysol, just don't upgrade until they fix it.. shouldn't be too long I'm guessing
[08:33] <Kamion> lemonlysol: yes, provided you don't upgrade evolution-data-server until it's fixed
[08:34] <lemonlysol> ok.  Thanks.
[08:35] <lemonlysol> I really love this distribution.  I have been a linux server guy for years, but this distro has finally got me a useful desktop distro.  I'm very impressed!
[08:35] <netvistun> Does any of you know anything about dns problems in Ubuntu?
[08:35] <Dr_Willis> ive had no dns issues 
[08:35] <trukulo> nor do i
[08:35] <Dr_Willis> netvistun,  its most likely a network config issue.
[08:36] <netvistun> The internet is terribly slow on a fresh install but I manged to fix it on one computer and I don't know how I did it.
[08:38] <trukulo> netvistun, here is right
[08:39] <netvistun> ping works so do fine, dis, host and dnstracer
[08:39] <Dr_Willis> how are you 'testing' its slowness?
[08:40] <tolo> Hi everyone
[08:40] <netvistun> if I put a ip address in the browser it jumps to that address but if it has to look it up then it takes from 10 - 20 sek for each domain.
[08:41] <netvistun> I tried stadic network configuartion so it's not the dhcp
[08:42] <Dr_Willis> ping www.google.com    is slow? vs.. ping the.ip.of.google.com    
[08:43] <trukulo> have you tried with different DNS Servers?
[08:43] <netvistun> ping works fine and everyting else but the browser
[08:43] <trukulo> i.e. 212.78.133.138
[08:44] <Dr_Willis> so Ping is fast.. but the browsers dns looking up is slow?
[08:44] <Dr_Willis> and ONLY the browsers looking up?
[08:46] <netvistun> epiphany and firefox
[08:46] <Dr_Willis> but browsers = slow to lookup www.google.com, while ping www.google.com is fast?
[08:48] <inklingx> and a "dig google.com" ?
[08:48] <netvistun> google.com is slow but 216.239.57.99 is fine
[08:48] <netvistun> dig is fast
[08:49] <Dr_Willis> almost sounds like a browser/proxy issue.
[08:50] <inklingx> some people on other sitro's have the smae problem, most of the time it is a problem with ipv6
[08:51] <Dr_Willis> ahh - i never use ipv6
[08:51] <Mithrandir> maswan: ping?
[08:52] <inklingx> you could try alias net-pf-10 off in /etc/modprobe.conf
[08:53] <netvistun> I disabled ipv6 it didn't change. And then I was messing with some stuff then I reanabled it and it worked.
[08:53] <maswan> Mithrandir: pong
[08:53] <maswan> Mithrandir: I verified the disk with badblocks -w, no problems at all
[08:53] <Mithrandir> maswan: what is the problem?
[08:54] <maswan> Mithrandir: I can't create filesystems. Syslog says lots of stuff regarding mptbase getting dma timeouts and so on with the occasional "page lost due to write fail" or similar in .err
[08:55] <Mithrandir> maswan: what kind of controller?
[08:55] <maswan> Mithrandir: lspci on ravel? :)
[08:55] <maswan> Mithrandir: mptfusion
[08:55] <|trey|> Hey, any peticular reason why the newest e-d-s wasn't the remove evolution and evolution-exchange?
[08:56] <|trey|> s/wasn't/wants
[08:56] <Mithrandir> maswan: hm, weird.. try mkfs-ing beforehand?
[08:56] <|trey|> s/the/to
[08:56] <|trey|> I just woke up  :/
[08:56] <lemonlysol> |trey|:Yeah, they are working on it.  They say try again in a while.  Just rying to fix it.
[08:56] <trukulo> |trey|, it's broken, wait until is being fixed
[08:56] <trukulo> perhaps today
[08:57] <maswan> Mithrandir: Well, it seems to be a generic "I can't write to disk" failure
[08:57] <lemonlysol> |trey|: as long as you don't try to upgrade evolution-serv you are alright
[08:57] <Mithrandir> that sucks.. have you tried building a normal 2.6.8.1 on her and seeing if that works?
[08:57] <hazmat> its strange how many people are using ubuntu on a powerbook, considering how much is missing for basic functionality in the base system
[08:57] <trukulo> |trey|, remember this is a beta
[08:58] <|trey|> lemonlysol: apt-get dist-upgrade is like an automatic step when I see "kept back"  :(
[08:58] <maswan> Mithrandir: Nope, not yet at least.
[08:58] <|trey|> trukulo: I would be bitching just as much if Sid was trying to steal packages too though  ;)
[08:58] <seb128> |trey|: the problem is that e-d-s an evolution need an update in the same time. The second needs the first to build, then it's built after ...
[08:58] <Mithrandir> maswan: I'd try that and see if it's a normal kernel regression or a ubuntu error
[08:59] <seb128> so you have a delay before getting both in sync
[08:59] <maswan> Mithrandir: ACK, I'll look for time to do that soon then.
[09:00] <|trey|> seb128: this is kinda why Debian has "incoming", to delay some packages, it tends to fix such things most of the time  :)
[09:00] <MyKq3> hello
[09:00] <seb128> |trey|: ah ah ah
[09:00] <|trey|> actually, everything is sent there... but yeah, its still delayed  :)
[09:00] <Mithrandir> maswan: goodie; want me to compile a kernel you can just pop in?
[09:00] <maswan> Mithrandir: yeah, I'd appriciate that
[09:01] <seb128> |trey|: and when you miss the run in Debian (and don't say it doesn't happen) you are stuck for a day
[09:01] <MyKq3> do u know what packages i need for my webcam ( i have LG expresscam)
[09:02] <|trey|> seb128: in 3 years of Debian... I've had that happen about a half a dozen times  :/
[09:02] <|trey|> seb128: happens more though when you start playing with experimental  :(
[09:04] <Kamion> hazmat: what's missing for basic functionality?
[09:04] <|trey|> NETSPLITS RULE
[09:07] <tvon|x31> heyyyy hazmat
[09:07] <tvon|x31> hazmat: Is PloneForge out in the wild?
[09:07] <netvistun> I tried disabling and reenabling ipv6 but to no avail. Lynx is also slow.
[09:07] <jayeola> lynx slow? naaaah
[09:08] <tolo> someone using snaptic right no?
[09:08] <tolo> some problems with spped?
[09:08] <tolo> speed?
[09:10] <netvistun> just some kind of dns lookup problem
[09:10] <hazmat> Kamion, the powermanagement doesn't seem to be working at all, additional items like gtkpbuttons and powerprefs.. re power. i'm wondering about usage of somethign like pmud..  my battery life is about an hour compared to 3.5 with osx and gentoo on the same machine
[09:11] <hazmat> tvon, not yet.. need to update some of the plugins for upstream changes and integrate in the notification/events subsystem
[09:11] <hazmat> tvon, target date is oct15
[09:12] <Kamion> hazmat: we're already using pbbuttonsd which replaces pmud, if that isn't working for some reason a bug report would be appreciated
[09:12] <stratking> herzi: thanks for the email, so did you have to do anything special to get it working?
[09:12] <hazmat> Kamion, okay.. i'm trying to track it down now
[09:12] <herzi> no
[09:12] <stratking> hmm
[09:13] <herzi> i just ran iwconfig and it seemed to work
[09:13] <punkass> hazmat: i am curious about power savings too, such as when i close the lid the system doesnt go into 'sleep/hibernate' mode
[09:13] <hazmat> Kamion, the scripts seem to be in place.. not sure if the events are being recieved.. additionally sleep hasn't been working for me :-( ... there was a new kernel upgrade for ppc last nite which i need to reboot and check if it helps.. additionally having the orinco/airport wireless scanning stuff would be nice.
[09:13] <stratking> yeah, its not picking up on any wireless connections when i run it
[09:13] <herzi> you might need to set the essid and the encryption key
[09:13] <punkass> im on a dell D600 laptop
[09:13] <herzi> man iwconfig
[09:13] <hazmat> punkass i've seen reports on the net that its suppoed to work out of the box, but its not for me.. big grain of salt, i used a daily cd from yesterday.
[09:15] <punkass> hmm well i am just using the first release...i had to use radeon tools to get the monitor to turn off when the lid was closed....but the machine stays up and running the whole time
[09:16] <stratking> when i try specifying the essid for eth1 it says there is no such device
[09:16] <punkass> and the screensaver/lcd power off, seems to be random...some times it comes after 1min sometimes after 10, sometimes never
[09:18] <punkass> does ubuntu have resolvconf package preinstalled?
[09:21] <seb128> |trey|: just upgrade and dist-upgrade, you get no problem
[09:21] <seb128> +no
[09:22] <inklingx> yeah! new evolution package is available :)
[09:24] <Kamion> punkass: it's not on the CD, so no
[09:25] <hazmat> sweet.. got sleep working.. 
[09:26] <punkass> sorry i dont have ubuntu in front of me..so i couldnt look
[09:26] <punkass> thanks
[09:35] <holger_> Hello, does someone know how to get a compaq nx9005 laptop to boot with apm. I had to disable acpi for booting.
[09:36] <mdz> holger_: add apm to /etc/modules
[09:38] <holger_> mdz: thanks I'll try
[09:38] <punkass> i had to do  nolapic   for my dell D600
[09:38] <punkass> but that was to get acpi to work properly
[09:42] <mdz> punkass: nolapic is automatically enabled on some Dell laptops already
[09:42] <mdz> punkass: if you file a bug with dmidecode output, we can add yours to the list
[09:43] <ilja> hi all
[09:43] <ilja> i'm wondering about something
[09:43] <punkass> mdz: ok..will do
[09:43] <ilja> what file(s) do I edit to have some kernel modules insmodded at boot time?
[09:44] <tseng> Kamion: hm it was .7 last i looked (ipw)
[09:51] <holger_> apm in /etc/modules failed while booting. If I try modprobe apm I get; no such device. Without ACPI=off for booting the system stopps at uncompressing the kernel. This is a compaq nx9005 and it seems that there is nothing in the BIOS to change. With fedora I got APM working after compiling a kernel with apm-support.
[09:52] <mxpxpod> are you guys going to put netapplet into universe?
[09:52] <inklingx> ilja: /etc/modules
[09:53] <wu_ming> hi, how do i change my splash picture?
[09:54] <JulHer> wu_ming: http://art.gnome.org/faq.php#8
[09:55] <ilja> @inklingx: thanks. I'm not used to kernel 2.6 distros I guess.. 
[09:55] <ilja> I'll have a go at it
[09:55] <wu_ming> thanks julher
[09:57] <longsleep> how do i install deb packages from debian unstable into my ubuntu .. is that a good idea btw?
[09:58] <cybrjackle|lappy> not considered a good idea
[09:58] <cybrjackle|lappy> you could pull them down and use dpkg -i
[09:58] <cybrjackle|lappy> or pull the source file down and rebuild it
[09:59] <longsleep> cybrjackle|lappy: ok .. so i shouldnt add debian unstable to by apt sources
[09:59] <cybrjackle|lappy> i wouldn't and i don't believe the devels recommend it either
[09:59] <stevedeo> Anyone know how to turn off that bloody single-quote-opens-the-find-dialog "feature"?
[09:59] <cybrjackle|lappy> to much over lapping can occure
[10:00] <longsleep> cybrjackle|lappy: i see .. so i will try to only get one package
[10:00] <jayeola> i've just installed ubuntu onto a box, when i rebooted the system, it went straight to an existing distro
[10:01] <jayeola> how can i edit gru.conf to include ubuntu?
[10:01] <jayeola> -grub.conf-
[10:01] <wu_ming> think its menu.lst at /boot/grub
[10:02] <mdz> longsleep: essentially everything in debian unstable is available in universe
[10:02] <mdz> longsleep: you should use universe instead
[10:02] <longsleep> mdz: mhm i have universe in my apt sources .. but it does not find "digikam"
[10:03] <Kamion> tseng: relatively recent change
[10:03] <beezly> longsleep: KDE isn't in warthog :(
[10:03] <tseng> Kamion: neat.
[10:03] <longsleep> beezly: right .. but digikam is neat 
[10:03] <mdz> longsleep: it looks like it failed to build from source
[10:04] <Kamion> tseng: (as in, Monday)
[10:04] <mdz> lamont: ping?
[10:04] <daf> Kamion: Kinnison just called me -- apparently, inspiration has struck regarding grub-install and XFS
[10:04] <daf> Kamion: can you call him?
[10:05] <Kamion> sure
[10:06] <sivang> howdy all
[10:06] <sivang> Can someone tell me what's going with ubuntu trying to fsck my fat32 partition on boot? 
[10:06] <sivang> I just can't boot it
[10:07] <theantix> sivang, check the faq on the wiki... you have to edit your fstab a little bit
[10:10] <stratking> herzi: ya mind if i ask ya one other question
[10:11] <|trey|> stratking: just ask...
[10:12] <stratking> well i've been having a problem w/ my orinoco card in my laptop not being picked up
[10:12] <stratking> and he asked earlier if i had any other pcmcia cards i tried to use but i said no
[10:13] <|trey|> stratking: you know the module you need for that?
[10:13] <stratking> but now that i think about it, i did try to connect me firewire cd-r but it didn't work either...
[10:13] <stratking> i've never had that burner work so i didn't think anything about it
[10:13] <stratking> but i was wondering now if it could be something w/ my pcmcia stuff instead of the card
[10:13] <stratking> trey: i think the module is orinoco_cs
[10:14] <stratking> but it also loads the hermes module
[10:14] <stratking> so im not sure
[10:14] <|trey|> stratking: ahh... need to know the modules... search google for 'device linux' and put those in /etc/modules
[10:15] <theantix> I got an Ubuntu review posted on the front page of kuro5hin.org, fwiw
[10:16] <stratking> trey: enhanced NBD?
[10:19] <jayeola> stratking: have u ever git the orinoco driver working ok under linux?
[10:19] <stratking> no, actually i just got the card a few days ago
[10:20] <stratking> its my first attempt at wireless under linux
[10:20] <jayeola> stratking: good luck
[10:20] <jayeola> have u got a w/less n/work at home? or ar u w/driving?
[10:23] <stratk1ng> sorry about that, got disconnected somehow
[10:24] <stratking> i can manually load the orinoco_cs module but then dont know what to do
[10:24] <stratking> if i run cardinfo it tells me its an unsupported card
[10:29] <mdz> stratk1ng: https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1438
[10:29] <mdz> stratk1ng: does the new version of the driver include support for your card?
[10:31] <stratk1ng> i probably sound like an idiot but ive never really used bugzilla before...
[10:31] <stratk1ng> should i just grab that one and from the link and see what happens?
[10:33] <mdz> stratk1ng: I suggest reading the release notes and/or changelog for the driver, and see if it is likely to help
[10:34] <jayeola> stratk1ng: hold on a sec. i'll give u a few urls. i'm trying to get orinoco to work myself
[10:34] <jayeola> are u root at the mo? co u know how to use a terminal?
[10:37] <beezly> anyone have problems with gpilotd not synchronising evo contacts properly?
[10:37] <beezly> I have changed a record in evo and I when syncing I get...
[10:37] <beezly> eaddrconduit-Message: iterating over 1 records
[10:37] <beezly> eaddrconduit-Message: Syncable
[10:37] <beezly> (gpilotd:15619): gpilotd-WARNING **: Synchronization failed!
[10:38] <stratk1ng> jayeola: yeah sure, send 'em over when ya find them
[10:39] <jayeola> stratk1ng: i'm in the process of writing my own howto. most of the ones i've seen are v technical
[10:39] <stratk1ng> have you had any luck getting yours to work yet?
[10:40] <jayeola> it -does- work but not in monito mode, which is what i want
[10:40] <jayeola> first url:- http://www.coofercat.com/stuff/linux/orinoco.html
[10:40] <jayeola> use that to identify yr card.
[10:41] <jayeola> something like :- cardcrl ident
[10:41] <lupus_> are there plans to upgrade to the new xchat
[10:42] <stratking> my damn eth. cable keeps popping out :(
[10:42] <jayeola> first url:- http://www.coofercat.com/stuff/linux/orinoco.html
[10:43] <theantix> lupus_, you can compile the debian experimental deb-src packages and run them on Ubuntu, if you are ambitious
[10:45] <jayeola> hmm, finished 1st stage of installing ubuntu. told to take out the cd and reboot
[10:45] <jayeola> it does reboot but straight back to my original distro....
[10:45] <jayeola> ....need to edit /etc/grub.conf but not sure how....
[10:46] <jayeola> i've looked at the wiki, not much help there
[10:47] <lupus_> euhm
[10:48] <lupus_> on my system xfs and jfs etc modules are loaded 
[10:48] <lupus_> is this normal?
[10:48] <lupus_> since I don't use those FS
[10:48] <Kinnison> Hi
[10:49] <oscar_h> hi, anyone using jabber?
[10:49] <UziMonkey> oscar_h: I'm sure _someone_ is.. ;)
[10:49] <oscar_h> :)
[10:49] <oscar_h> and, someone who knows about server applications?
[10:50] <UziMonkey> oscar_h: how about just asking your question?  If no one can help you, the worst thing that will happen is it will go unanswered.
[10:50] <mdz> you'll usually get more responses by simply asking your question, rather than asking to ask
[10:50] <jayeola> uh-huh
[10:50] <oscar_h> i would like t know if i can transfer my account from one server to another?
[10:50] <UziMonkey> wouldn't that be best asked in #jabber?
[10:51] <oscar_h> well, there's an extraodernary activity in that channel
[10:52] <oscar_h> sorry, found the answer myself..
[10:53] <lupus_> can someone do lsmod and tell me if xfs jfs reiserfs fat etc is in his list (all of them)
[10:53] <Kamion> lupus_: if you installed from the preview release, those modules would be present
[10:53] <Kamion> lupus_: if you installed from Sounder CD 9, they shouldn't be
[10:54] <lupus_> ic
[10:54] <lupus_> Sounder CD 9 ?
[10:54] <punkass> laptop at work...connects to wireless router..get on web etc fine, go home, connect to home wireless network, get connection, but cannot access web,  discover that dns settings are wrong
[10:55] <punkass> whats the easy way to make sure dns settings are updated when connecting to a wireless network?
[10:55] <punkass> i was going to write a small script, but i figured there must be something that i am just missing
[10:56] <|trey|> Kamion: how long ago was sounder 9? I reinstalled a few days ago, seemed to get newer packages etc, wondering if I might be technically using Sounder 9
[10:56] <UziMonkey> punkass_: check /etc/resolv.conf
[10:56] <UziMonkey> punkass: I mean you ;)  Damn, there's two of you
[10:56] <punkass> yes i know...i want that file to be updated automatically
[10:56] <punkass> hehe...left xchat on at home :)
[10:57] <UziMonkey> punkass: there's a bug that prevents resolv.conf from being updated if the DHCP server doesn't pass both a DNS server and domain name
[10:57] <punkass> ah
[10:57] <|trey|> punkass_: easiest way... just put an RNS in resolv.conf  :)
[10:57] <punkass> which is?
[10:57] <|trey|> That way it always works..
[10:57] <UziMonkey> there's a quick fix for the script
[10:57] <|trey|> punkass_: Root Name Server... the primary DNS's that hold the internet together
[10:58] <UziMonkey> (don't kick me if this fscks something else up too)
[10:58] <UziMonkey> punkass: in /etc/dhcp3/dhclient-script, change the -a in line 10 to an -o
[10:58] <UziMonkey> punkass: that _should_ fix your problem..  I've yet to move this machine to test it
[10:59] <|trey|> punkass_: you know the theory behind forwarding correct? well, when things take forever to load, you usually end up getting the info from a RNS... usually your ISP tries to keep current, but forwards requests if it doesn't know about it...
[11:00] <|trey|> punkass_: umm, do what UziMonkey said first... but yeah... I usually at least have an RNS in mine  :/
[11:00] <neighborlee> nice job ubuntu..after fresh install I have sound and a actually very soothing 'welcome' sound to the desktop...very nice ;-)
[11:01] <punkass> UziMonkey: thanks
[11:01] <punkass> |trey|: yeah i will...where do i find a list of RNSs?
[11:01] <|trey|> neighborlee: my first install didn't have all that... xresprobe didn't even work right  :(
[11:01] <morteoh> is it possible to turn off the fade when i click the log out button?
[11:01] <|trey|> punkass: google knows all and I'm too lazy right now  :)
[11:02] <punkass> ah of course..google...thanks
[11:02] <neighborlee> |trey|, hmm dunno..only thing different I did this time was to do the 'internet update' section which before wasn't working so they must have fixed that..after lengthy process I had a working desktop with even sound...
[11:02] <lupus_> how can I get a list with the packages and select the one's I want to install (like in the install of debian 2.2)
[11:03] <lupus_> sorry it's been a long time since I have been using deb
[11:03] <|trey|> lupus_: umm, aptitude or synaptic?
[11:04] <|trey|> console or gui respectively...
[11:04] <UziMonkey> um..  this is interesting
[11:04] <UziMonkey> /usr/share/dict/words links to /etc/dictionaries-common/words, which doesn't exist
[11:04] <punkass> neighborlee: sound on boot up?  are u using a newer release?
[11:05] <UziMonkey> my sound worked fine, except for the mixer levels..
[11:05] <|trey|> lupus_: aptitude replaces dselect in sarge..
[11:06] <ish> There is no floppy/ftp install is there?
[11:06] <|trey|> ish: I haven't seen one  :(
[11:06] <jayeola> ish: yes there is. have a look at the docs on the cd. i'm reading them right now
[11:07] <jayeola> i think that you have to pass parameters to the installer at boot time though....
[11:08] <jayeola> gah! i need to edit /etc/grub.conf to include ubuntu. i already have a linux distro but U- won't boot
[11:09] <cybrjackle|lappy> anyone know if reiser4 can reduce/resize lvm2 now?
[11:09] <neighborlee> I just changed ( via chown) a DIR so I can extract tarballs ( /usr/local/games/) but its still refusing me..and I think thats wude!
[11:09] <neighborlee> the chown command usually works ;-)
[11:09] <lupus_> does aptitude use /etc/apt/sources.list ?
[11:09] <Kinnison> neighborlee: you may need to extract the tarball using 'sudo tar' rather than 'tar' since a normal user can't write to /usr/local/games
[11:10] <neighborlee> Kinnison, well
[11:10] <neighborlee> Kinnison, im using fileroller which is hooked into mozillla
[11:10] <Kinnison> neighborlee: aah. Hmm
[11:10] <neighborlee> Kinnison, lemme try prefs in mozilla
[11:10] <Kinnison> neighborlee: Make a directory called 'Games' in your homespace ?
[11:10] <Kinnison> neighborlee: and extract it to there?
[11:11] <neighborlee> Kinnison, well ..I like to  use /usr/local in case I add users 
[11:11] <Kinnison> neighborlee: You could extract it into your homespace to begin with; then use 'sudo mv' to move the install into /usr/local/games ?
[11:11] <neighborlee> rad..what a surprise to see firefox 1.0 preview !! in unbuntu..sweet
[11:12] <neighborlee> Kinnison, yes I could..i'm going to try sudo tar first
[11:12] <Kinnison> neighborlee: *nod*
[11:14] <JulHer> bye
[11:14] <Kinnison> neighborlee: How's it going?
[11:14] <neighborlee> I guess fileroller isn't linked in mozilla..must be mime types
[11:14] <neighborlee> lol
[11:16] <spiv> Woah.  kacpid is eating all my cpu.
[11:17] <dieman> lamont: poke
[11:18] <makeio> buenas, alguien me puede decir alguna manera para saber si en mi kernel tengo soporte para el framebuffer, no hay manera de que se me va la tty* en letras de esas "txulas", pequeas, tengo en /etc/modules vesafb i en GRUB puesto la opcion de vga="791"que mefalta?
[11:22] <neighborlee> Kinnison, I just did a chmod on it and voila LOL
[11:22] <neighborlee> i WILL save where I want
[11:22] <neighborlee> lmao
[11:23] <makeio> sorry
[11:27] <Se7h> Error trying to open /dev/hda exclusively (Device or resource busy)... retrying in 1 second.
[11:27] <Se7h> im getting this error
[11:27] <Se7h> trying to burn a cd
[11:27] <Se7h> :|
[11:27] <Kinnison> is /dev/hda your cd-writer ?
[11:27] <theantix> your cd drive isn't /dev/hda is it?
[11:28] <mdz> Se7h: CD-R or CD-RW?
[11:28] <Se7h> rw
[11:28] <Se7h> oh
[11:28] <Se7h> the cd ?
[11:28] <Se7h> cd-r
[11:28] <Se7h> no
[11:28] <UziMonkey> are you sure hda is your burner?  most people don't set it up that way..
[11:28] <Se7h> no
[11:28] <Se7h> of course not
[11:29] <Kinnison> what is the commandline you are using to write the CD ?
[11:29] <jayeola> hda for a cd burner....? that's odd
[11:30] <UziMonkey> jayeola: but certainly possible
[11:30] <Se7h> using x cd roast
[11:30] <Se7h> if it pressists
[11:30] <Se7h> im adding it manualy
[11:31] <Se7h> very odd indeed
[11:31] <Se7h> /dev/hdc
[11:32] <Se7h> device not found
[11:32] <Se7h> o.0
[11:32] <UziMonkey> Se7h: where is your burner?  secondary master?
[11:32] <Se7h> no
[11:32] <Se7h> primary slave
[11:32] <Se7h> primary -  HDD -> burner
[11:32] <UziMonkey> it should be /dev/hdb then
[11:33] <Se7h> secondary - HDD -> dvd
[11:33] <Se7h> scsidev: 'ATAPI:0,1,0'
[11:33] <Se7h> devname: 'ATAPI'
[11:33] <Se7h> scsibus: 0 target: 1 lun: 0
[11:33] <Se7h> Error trying to open /dev/hda exclusively (Device or resource busy)... retrying in 1 second.
[11:33] <jayeola> do u have cdrecord?
[11:33] <Se7h> let me check
[11:33] <jayeola> if u did try cd record --scanbus
[11:34] <jayeola> or even read the output from dmseg
[11:34] <Se7h> seth@devil ~ $ cdrecord
[11:34] <Se7h> cdrecord: No tracks specified. Need at least one.
[11:34] <Se7h> yeah
[11:34] <Se7h> i do
[11:34] <UziMonkey> Se7h: cdrecord -scanbus
[11:35] <Se7h> hmmm
[11:35] <Se7h> cdrecord: No such file or directory. Cannot open '/dev/pg*'. Cannot open SCSI dr iver.
[11:35] <joeyh> just a quick note that ubuntu's default behavior of using the whole disk for one root partition fails on systems like mine, that make grub fail to boot sometimes if the /boot partition is too large
[11:35] <UziMonkey> hmm..  my bro had this same problem
[11:35] <joeyh> I really should track this annoyance down, but in the meantime you might consider giving an easier option for a small /boot
[11:35] <|trey|> Se7h: modprobe ide-cd
[11:35] <jayeola> yeah, i'm having problems dual booting
[11:35] <joeyh> in stock d-i I use the "multiuser system" layout to avoid it
[11:36] <Se7h> |trey| continues
[11:36] <Se7h> no scsi device
[11:36] <|trey|> joeyh: that works enless you have a fairly small hd...
[11:36] <joeyh> yes
[11:37] <|trey|> joeyh: multiuser on my 40 gig hd for instance gives / about 150mb... a little small  ;)
[11:37] <Se7h> so..
[11:38] <Se7h> does anyone can help more on this?
[11:38] <|trey|> joeyh: you who I think you are?  :)
[11:38] <Se7h> cdrecord: No such file or directory. Cannot open '/dev/pg*'. Cannot open SCSI driver.
[11:38] <joeyh> probably
[11:38] <Kinnison> Se7h: cdrecord dev=/dev/hdb -v -data flibble.iso
[11:39] <Se7h> sure
[11:39] <|trey|> Se7h: ide-cd is supposed to make it look at /dev/hdc (depending on where your cd is physically)
[11:39] <Se7h> but i would like to burn it with x cd
[11:39] <jayeola> ok that means that u don't have cdrecord -or- u do but you are not root -or- it is not in yr path
[11:39] <Se7h> hmm
[11:39] <Se7h> w8
[11:39] <|trey|> joeyh: well, thank you for bringing us d-i, very nice  :)
[11:40] <Se7h> not even with sudo
[11:40] <|trey|> SUCH an improvement over bf  :)
[11:41] <jayeola> Se7h: try 'man cdrecord' or 'locate cdrecord'
[11:44] <Se7h> yup
[11:44] <jayeola> ?
[11:44] <Se7h> it does exists
[11:44] <jayeola> Se7h: try 'whereis cdrecord'
[11:45] <Se7h> cdrecord: /usr/bin/cdrecord.mmap /usr/bin/cdrecord /usr/bin/cdrecord.shm /etc/cdrecord /usr/share/man/man1/cdrecord.1.gz
[11:45] <jayeola> Se7h: now u need to change yr path
[11:45] <neighborlee> this is a bit OT but i'm not experiencing it on my other distros so i'd like help if anyone knows..ie: ( getting this compile error from a needed lib) >> configure: error: C++ preprocessor "/lib/cpp" fails sanity check ???
[11:45] <joeyh> hey hey, I got lucky and grub actually booted this time
[11:45] <joeyh> I think it depends on where the initrd and kernel happen to fall on the large FS
[11:46] <jayeola> .... i use the vi editor but whatever one u use change this file '/root/.bashrc
[11:46] <Se7h> jayeola how so ?
[11:46] <|trey|> joeyh: have a RC1 netinst CD... only problems I have ran into are not paying attention to the size of / with multiuser, and trying to install with XFS had a few hiccups  :(
[11:46] <jayeola> and add this line PATH=$PATH:/sbin/usr/sbin
[11:46] <joeyh> multiuser / on 40 gb works for me, even if I do a desktop task install
[11:47] <joeyh> iirc we adjusted the root size a bit post rc1
[11:47] <jayeola> |trey|: are u dual/multi booting?
[11:47] <joeyh> all XFS issues are solved.
[11:47] <|trey|> joeyh: it worked, but after about a week, it started complaining that / was full  :(
[11:47] <|trey|> joeyh: that is good to hear though  :)
[11:47] <joeyh> hmm, I told ubuntu to use the net and now it's trying to do a huge download
[11:47] <jayeola> Se7h: i assume that u are using a terminal and that u are root
[11:48] <Se7h> hm hmm
[11:48] <richnrockville> Even a die hard windows xp person can install and use this. What a free os..
[11:48] <Se7h> export does the work
[11:48] <|trey|> jayeola: nope... no other OS's here right now  :/
[11:48] <jayeola> Se7h: that is how u change yr path. edit /root/.bashrc like i said above
[11:48] <Se7h> oh
[11:48] <|trey|> joeyh: working for canonical, or just interested?  :)
[11:48] <Se7h> u mean PATH
[11:49] <Se7h> didn't catch it
[11:49] <Se7h> ;p
[11:49] <joeyh> oh, just wanted to take a look at the final pre-release cut
[11:49] <joeyh> I try all the d-i using distros, even the chinese ones :-)
[11:49] <elim> grr why does qt take so long to compile its only 16 mb yet its been compiling for about 1 hout and a 1/2
[11:49] <|trey|> joeyh: :)
[11:49] <jayeola> PATH= $PATH:/sbin:/usr/sbin
[11:49] <|trey|> joeyh: what do you think of the options taken out? must be strange for you  :)
[11:49] <jayeola> so that all of the commands and apps will be available to u
[11:50] <joeyh> I enjoy the lack of a root password question.
[11:50] <joeyh> my installs at home typically have less questions than this though :-)
[11:50] <Se7h> cdrecord: No such file or directory. Cannot open '/dev/pg*'. Cannot open SCSI driver.
[11:50] <|trey|> joeyh: that kinda scared me actually... I thought I hit enter too many times or something  :(
[11:50] <Se7h> well...it's still there
[11:51] <jayeola> Se7h: have u changed yr path, like i said?
[11:51] <theantix> joeyh, what questions does d-i take out that ubuntu asks?
[11:51] <joeyh> none, but _I_ take _all_ of them out :-)
[11:51] <|trey|> joeyh: ahh... I want an image that doesn't ask anything... that would rule  :)
[11:51] <Se7h> jayeola yes
[11:51] <jayeola> i assume that nobody is dual/multi booting here?
[11:51] <bollocks_> i am
[11:52] <jayeola> Se7h: ok you need to 'source /root/.bashrc'
[11:52] <|trey|> theantix: joeyh = d-i primary developer  ;)   (just incase you didn't catch that yet  ;) )
[11:52] <jayeola> bollocks_: nice name :/
[11:52] <bollocks_> thanks, been reading Hellblazer ;)
[11:52] <Se7h> seth@devil ~ $ source /root/.bashrc
[11:52] <Se7h> devil:~$
[11:52] <Se7h> is this correct ?
[11:53] <theantix> trey, I did know that but thanks =)
[11:53] <|trey|> joeyh: how easy is it to customize d-i with your own settings etc? need to actually understand the code, orrr?
[11:53] <jayeola> heh ok ' bollocks_ ' u dual booting ok?
[11:53] <joeyh> it's fairly easy to preseed the answers to lots of stuff
[11:53] <bollocks_> yup, this is only my second linux attempt
[11:53] <jayeola> Se7h: yes that's good now try 'cdrecord --scanbus'
[11:54] <jayeola> bollocks_: hmm, did ya get ubuntu when the box rebooted? i never did, 2nd attempt now
[11:54] <joeyh> http://d-i.alioth.debian.org/manual/en.i386/ch04s07.html#id2511085
[11:54] <joeyh> iirc some of what's documented there is not yet merged into ubuntu
[11:54] <Se7h> cdrecord: No such file or directory. Cannot open '/dev/pg*'. Cannot open SCSI driver.
[11:54] <Se7h> :|
[11:55] <|trey|> joeyh: ahh, thank you very much  :)
[11:55] <bollocks_> jayeola, yes i got it as default on grub, albeit with a twist - hafta hit ESC to boot anything else
[11:55] <jayeola> Se7h: try 'lsmod'
[11:55] <|trey|> joeyh: prolly wouldn't try it with a ubunty anyways  :)
[11:55] <jayeola> ask if u can paste the output.
[11:56] <|trey|> jayeola: take him to #flood if he has to flood....
[11:56] <Pakal> Hi, I can hear music with XMMS using alsa but not with Rhythmbox
[11:56] <Pakal> need I something else?
[11:56] <|trey|> Pakal: apt-get install gstreamer0.8-alsa
[11:56] <jayeola> yeah Se7h , paste the results of 'lsmod' on the channel #flood
[11:56] <Se7h> ok, what do i look for?
[11:57] <Se7h> ok
[11:57] <Pakal> |trey|: I already have the package
[11:58] <|trey|> Pakal: hmm... lsof /dev/dsp ... maybe its just in use already  :/
[11:58] <jayeola> bollocks_: hmmm, u hit esc to see all of yr distros or just to start something that is not yr default?
[11:58] <jayeola> Se7h , paste the results of 'lsmod' on the channel #flood
[11:58] <mdz> joeyh: the xfs_freeze issue is solved?  #243835 is still open
[11:58] <|trey|> jayeola: via Ubuntu's grub, yes
[11:58] <MyKq3> when will ubuntu start to use Xorg?
[11:58] <comfrey> hey all,
[11:58] <|trey|> MyKq3: in just over 6 months
[11:59] <jayeola> sorry |trey|, what was that?
[11:59] <MyKq3> c0ol
[11:59] <|trey|> jayeola: via Ubuntu's grub, yes
[11:59] <|trey|> jayeola: mainstream grub doesn't make you hit esc  :/
[11:59] <jayeola> i'm at the 'install grub loader' stage. i already have that installed via my default distro
[11:59] <jayeola> not sure what 2 do...