[12:00] <will> nope, but i will try and mount it now
[12:00] <ynef> will: since you've got so much to do as root, you might as well spawn a root shell... "sudo /bin/bash" ;)
[12:01] <ynef> will: then all commands typed in that shell will be executed with root privileges.
[12:01] <akra> I'm a fan of "sudo su -" myself :)
[12:01] <clee> meh, too many characters
[12:01] <clee> sudo -s
[12:02] <akra> does sudo -s set the environment up too ?
[12:03] <Mitario> hmm, this is odd
[12:03] <Mitario> I'm trying to compile Marlin
[12:03] <Mitario> I have cpp installed
[12:03] <Mitario> but I still get this error:
[12:03] <Mitario> checking how to run the C++ preprocessor... /lib/cpp
[12:03] <Mitario> configure: error: C++ preprocessor "/lib/cpp" fails sanity check
[12:03] <tseng> akra: sudo keeps the user enviroment
[12:03] <clee> akra: not quite
[12:03] <tseng> in most cases
[12:03] <LinuxJones> Mitario, apt-get install build-essentials
[12:03] <will> oh dear argument!
[12:04] <akra> right
[12:04] <Mitario> LinuxJones, aha! thank you
[12:04] <LinuxJones> Mitario, sure someone had the problem yesterday :D
[12:04] <Mitario> :)
[12:05] <will> ynef its saying now that /mnt/d does not exist
[12:05] <ynef> will: but you've created that directory, right?
[12:05] <subterrific> ynef: security and because most people don't need to compile
[12:06] <LinuxJones> will mkdir /mnt/d as root user
[12:06] <LinuxJones> will then try again
[12:06] <will> ah maybe i was not root when i made it
[12:06] <ynef> subterrific: i just feel naked without a compiler... :) 
[12:07] <subterrific> have you tried putting clothes on?
[12:07] <will> YEAH!
[12:07] <will> it works now my knowledge is almost unlimited!
[12:07] <will> thanks guys!
[12:07] <ynef> subterrific: don't need to -- i installed build-essentials instead ;)
[12:07] <LinuxJones> will, lol
[12:08] <ynef> will: cool :)
[12:08] <will> but this totem movie player crashed after 1 sec of playing a file!
[12:09] <ynef> will: is the file on the windows partition?
[12:09] <ynef> will: does it work if you first copy it over to your home directory?
[12:09] <ynef> will: (just trying to rule things out here)
[12:10] <will> good idea
[12:12] <ynef> will: when i tried to access a pdf i had on a samba share, xpfd didn't do anything -- didn't show a window at all. but when i copied it to a local location, it worked without a hitch. your situation should be different, since it's on the physically connected disc and all, but you never know... 
[12:14] <will> didnt work got error: Internal GStreamer error: pad problem.  File a bug.
[12:14] <ynef> will: well that sucks... :( don't know the solution to that, i'm afraid
[12:15] <joem> will, use totem-xine
[12:15] <will> whats that?
[12:15] <joem> totem with a xine backend
[12:15] <sam0r2> ok, third time of re installing... and gnome still wont load
[12:15] <sam0r2> anyone know what the problem could be?
[12:16] <ynef> sam0r2: not without a more detailed description :(
[12:17] <sam0r2> well
[12:17] <sam0r2> the logs say somthing about font render for "xxxx" already registered at priority 0
[12:18] <sam0r2> i can log in, and failsafe works fine
[12:18] <sam0r2> but when i log in using gnome, it sits at the loading screen, doing shit all
[12:19] <sam0r2> ah
[12:19] <sam0r2> the last error in the log is 'Could not init font path element unit/:7100, removing from list!'
[12:20] <Averell> hiya.
[12:20] <Averell> i have a question: how do you finance this free CD sending?
[12:21] <sam0r2> whoops..
[12:21] <akra> lol
[12:21] <sam0r2> the sponsor isnt it?
[12:21] <Averell> as well as bounties, etc.
[12:21] <ynef> sam0r2: if you remove everything related to fonts from the XF86Config file, it will fall back on compiled in defaults. comment them rather than removing them, of course
[12:21] <sam0r2> hmm
[12:22] <Se7h> :D
[12:22] <Se7h> ubuntu reinstalled
[12:22] <Se7h> :)
[12:23] <Averell> the sponsor? who's it?
[12:24] <LinuxJones> Averell, Canonical I beilive
[12:24] <LinuxJones> err believe
[12:24] <Se7h> ok now
[12:24] <Se7h> i need to install nvidia drivers for this
[12:24] <Se7h> where r they?
[12:25] <LinuxJones> Se7h, >> http://wiki.ubuntulinux.org/FrequentlyAskedQuestions see # 3
[12:25] <Averell> ah. cool. thanks LinuxJones.
[12:25] <Se7h> thanks
[12:25] <LinuxJones> Averell, lots of good stuff in that FAQ :)
[12:27] <ynef> will: still having problems with the video player?
[12:28] <ynef> will: if so, you should install mplayer -- the best media player for linux that i know of. instructions that are incredibly simple to follow are here: http://www.princessleia.com/MPlayer2.html
[12:28] <sam0r2> hmm ynef: the font thing didnt seem to work
[12:29] <sam0r2> but i think its doing somthing
[12:29] <MyKq3> what package do i need to activate my webcam?
[12:29] <sam0r2> oh no its not, its just fan vibrations
[12:29] <tseng> MyKq3: that greatly depends on your webcam, google around for the model + linux
[12:31] <ynef> sam0r2: that's too bad... what does your /var/log/XFree86.0.log say?
[12:31] <MyKq3> i have but it gave me nothingy ralevant .... i guess i need to try hearder
[12:31] <MyKq3> thanks
[12:32] <sam0r2> Warning: font renderer for ".pcf" already registered at priority 0
[12:32] <sam0r2> and tehres a few more lines of that but different extentions
[12:33] <rovragge> hello. Can I mix ubuntu and regular debian unstable packages easily?
[12:33] <rovragge> let's say just have xfree86 packages from ubuntu and nothing else
[12:33] <ynef> rovragge: i just did that a second ago, so yeah :)
[12:33] <will> Ynef: thanks a lot, im off now goodnight!
[12:33] <rovragge> ynef: apt sources line ?
[12:33] <ynef> will: good night
[12:34] <ynef> rovragge: the same as you'd use in debian
[12:34] <rovragge> ynef: i'm running debian/unstable, which url for ubuntu packages?
[12:36] <ynef> rovragge: aha. :) well, then I don't know if it's mixable... i know you can theoretically switch over to ubuntu completely, but i don't know for just a few packages
[12:37] <rovragge> apt-get install -t warty foo ?
[12:39] <Se7h> ok
[12:39] <Se7h> nvidia done
[12:39] <Se7h> now...
[12:39] <rovragge> or do I have to fiddle with /etc/apt/preferences and do Pin:
[12:39] <Se7h> how can i add some resolutions..
[12:39] <LukasK> Whew, hi all. Kudos to the makers of ubuntu, I'm really impressed with what you did with Debian.
[12:39] <LukasK> Great work.
[12:40] <rovragge> Se7h: http://delenn.tky.hut.fi/amlc/
[12:40] <rovragge> Se7h: or did you mean standard resolutions?
[12:40] <rovragge> Se7h: in Subsection "Display" under Modes
[12:41] <rovragge> Se7h: Modes       "1600x1200" "800x600" "640x480"
[12:41] <tseng> ......
[12:41] <tseng> jesus dude.
[12:41] <Se7h> o.0
[12:41] <Se7h> wrong field
[12:41] <Se7h> sorry about that
[12:42] <tseng> thanks.
[12:42] <Se7h> there
[12:42] <Se7h> sorry once again
[12:42] <Se7h> brb
[12:42] <LukasK> The only thing I can't yet solve on my own: ubuntu ships postfix, I somehow got used to exim, and know I don't know how to tell postfix to to smtp-auth to my isp's-mailserver.
[12:42] <LukasK> Can somebody help me with that?
[12:44] <sam0r2> man exim
[12:44] <sam0r2> ;)
[12:44] <tseng> LukasK: postfix has tons of docs and howtos online
[12:44] <Sam0r> oops meant man postfix
[12:45] <LukasK> hm, ok.
[12:46] <LukasK> i think i got the wrong howto for that ... it hat things in main.cf that i didn't see in my local main.cf :)
[12:46] <LukasK> would be cool if one could configure that sort of thing with debconf
[12:53] <LukasK> ok, documentation is good. i thought, hey, everything was so easy, why should smtp-auth be as hard as always :)
[12:54] <tardmac> anyone here upgrade from debian testing to ubuntu?
[12:55] <Se7h> erg
[12:55] <Se7h> i have the resolutions there
[12:56] <Se7h> but they wont appear at gnome change resolution config
[12:57] <Se7h> i think its related to HS or VS
[12:57] <Se7h> cant rememeber
[12:58] <rovragge> xrandr lists available resolutions
[12:58] <Se7h> yeah
[12:58] <Se7h> list the ones possible on the config that u provided to xfree
[12:59] <Sam0r> how do i edit my network config? atm im using a dhcp supplied ip, but i want to make it static
[12:59] <Se7h> but i know i can make my monitor work at 1152
[12:59] <rovragge> generate own modes using amlc
[12:59] <HcE> Sam0r: vim /etc/network/interfaces ?
[12:59] <Sam0r> got it
[01:00] <Sam0r> whats the format?
[01:00] <rovragge> man interfaces
[01:00] <HcE> Sam0r: change dhcp => static, add address, hostmask, gateway, broadcast
[01:09] <Chriffer> why would you suggest vim to someone?
[01:14] <HcE> hmmm
[01:15] <HcE> I was thinking of that afterwards
[01:15] <HcE> just typed what I usually type
[01:15] <HcE> but hopefully he just took it for vim = your favorite editor
[01:17] <WW> Sam0r (and others): It looks like you could also use Computer -> System Configuration -> Networking
[01:19] <HcE> but for new users to Linux the GUI frontend is important :)
[01:19] <rovragge> Chriffer: http://vim.sourceforge.net/others.php
[01:25] <flopper> hi all :)
[01:25] <LinuxJones> flopper, hi
[01:26] <LinuxJones> It is so quite in here tonight :(
[01:26] <flopper> :\
[01:27] <HcE> LinuxJones: If you have little to do, you could allways have a look at my SSL application which have some problems ;)
[01:28] <Sam0r> what runlevel doesnt have x started?
[01:28] <HcE> Sam0r: 1
[01:28] <Sam0r> isnt that single user though?
[01:28] <HcE> Sam0r: look in /etc/inittab
[01:28] <LinuxJones> HcE, I am not "THAT" bored :D
[01:28] <Sam0r> i am
[01:28] <Sam0r> 1 says single user
[01:29] <HcE> 1 = single user yes
[01:29] <HcE> try 2?
[01:29] <Sam0r> 2 is default with x :|
[01:29] <HcE> should say in inittab though
[01:29] <Sam0r> it does
[01:29] <Sam0r> but its not very helpful
[01:29] <HcE> take a peek in /etc/rcx.d/ ?
[01:29] <HcE> where x = {1,2,3,4,5,6}
[01:30] <dickmorrell[away> right
[01:30] <dickmorrell> apparently 
[01:30] <dickmorrell> Ubuntu is not an effective form of contraception
[01:30] <LinuxJones> flopper, your refresh rate  is too low ??
[01:30] <dickmorrell> and I am being told to get off this workstation
[01:31] <flopper> LinuxJones, good question ;) I was just checking it.. effectively is quite low: 64/60!
[01:31] <flopper> LinuxJones, how can change it?
[01:32] <LinuxJones> flopper, my crappy monitor can only do 60 hz @ 1280x960
[01:33] <Sam0r> omfg
[01:33] <Sam0r> its gdm thats mucking up
[01:33] <LinuxJones> flopper, dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xfree86
[01:33] <flopper> LinuxJones, I test this monitor with another pc and it did 1280x1024 without any problem.. perahps it's a videocard problem?
[01:33] <LinuxJones> flopper, what video driver are you using ?
[01:33] <flopper> LinuxJones, thanks.. just trying
[01:34] <flopper> r128
[01:49] <NewComer> is it true that the x86 port of ubuntu is compiled for i686 and not for i386 as the name of isos imply?
[01:50] <jh|work> i am assuming so, but i am afraid to ask why you are asking
[01:51] <jdub> NewComer: it uses 486 instructions, tuned for p4
[01:51] <NewComer> u know, just hate the idea of i386 compiled distro
[01:52] <NewComer> so it should be kinda fast
[01:52] <NewComer> right?
[01:52] <jh|work> silly reason, but ok.
[01:55] <LinuxJones> NewComer, what are you using your computer for, general destop stuff ?
[01:56] <NewComer> LinuxJones: yeah
[01:56] <LinuxJones> NewComer, what kind of processor/ram do you have ?
[01:56] <NewComer> 1Ghz/192MB
[01:57] <NewComer> its not that i'm a Gentoo freak (never tried Gentoo), but I would prefer an optimized distro
[01:57] <Sam0r> NewComer: who wouldnt..
[01:58] <NewComer> Sam0r: some just don't care
[01:58] <LinuxJones> NewComer, that's not a bad system, you will not notice any difference for desltop stuff.
[01:58] <Se7h> lol
[01:58] <Se7h> i got it screwd up
[01:58] <bitserf> newcomer: you might be surprised at the performance of Gentoo compared to Ubuntu...its not much of a delta, to be honest
[01:58] <Sam0r> its still a preview release, so why would they bother making specific builds etc when the ones theyve made _work_
[01:58] <Se7h> what r the editors from command line?
[01:58] <bitserf> newcomer: the premise of gentoo is its flexibility more than the perf.
[01:59] <Sam0r> Se7h: pico or nano
[01:59] <Se7h> k
[01:59] <Se7h> ty
[01:59] <Se7h> New channel peak: 168 users
[01:59] <q2_> hey all
[01:59] <NewComer> Sam0r: yeah, maybe in the future people would like different builts.
[02:00] <Sam0r> i think its fine how it is, if you want a specific build, download the source code, compile it for us, and host it somewhere...
[02:00] <Sam0r> thats how it works.
[02:00] <Sam0r> you cant just walk up to a dev and say 'i want this. now.'
[02:00] <Sam0r> these guys are doing some great work, and theyre not even getting paid, so leave them alone
[02:00] <NewComer> Sam0r: ofcourse not, that's why I didn't :)
[02:01] <Sam0r> good
[02:01] <Se7h> New channel peak: 169 users
[02:01] <Se7h> New channel peak: 170 users
[02:01] <Sam0r> http://www.trippie.co.uk
[02:01] <Sam0r> does that work?
[02:02] <LinuxJones> Se7h, there were 193 users yesterday, I waited for an hour to crack 200 but it didn't happen :D
[02:03] <Sam0r> christ does anyone know what runlevel is the shell and not X11?
[02:04] <Kosai> 1.
[02:04] <bitserf> newcomer: you know about apt-get source
[02:04] <Kosai> (To Sam0r.)
[02:04] <Sam0r> hmm
[02:05] <LinuxJones> Sam0r, you can disable X from starting in any runlevel
[02:05] <Sam0r> yeah i know
[02:05] <Sam0r> i just wanted to do it an easier way
[02:05] <Sam0r> i'm used to using slackware
[02:05] <LinuxJones> Sam0r, what way are you doing it now ?
[02:05] <Sam0r> setting it up as a webserver
[02:06] <Sam0r> runlevel 1 is single user mode.
[02:07] <LinuxJones> Sam0r, rl 1 is no good as a webserver
[02:07] <Sam0r> yeah i know!
[02:07] <NewComer> bitserf: yeah
[02:07] <zenwhen> Linux stale.licorice 2.4.3-handcuffing5 #11 SMP Sat May 10:38:55 PST 2004 i586 Intel(r) Pentium(r) 4 processor 5.70GHz GNU/Linux
[02:08] <LinuxJones> Sam0r, update-rc.d -f gdm remove
[02:08] <Sam0r> update-rc.c -f gdm remove
[02:08] <Sam0r> shit ffs
[02:08] <LinuxJones> lol
[02:09] <Sam0r> command not found
[02:09] <Sam0r> brb need a piss
[02:09] <LinuxJones> that's nice
[02:09] <Sam0r> feels good too :)
[02:10] <flopper> LinuxJones, just done some tsts. The screen vibrate at 1024x768 @ 75Hz too :(
[02:10] <LinuxJones> flopper, cool :D
[02:11] <flopper> LinuxJones, grrr! :))))
[02:11] <LinuxJones> flopper, did you edit your XF86Config-4 file by hand ?
[02:12] <flopper> LinuxJones, just change resolution using ubunt tool
[02:13] <flopper> I'm waiting some packages upgrade to restart xfree
[02:13] <LinuxJones> flopper, ahh
[02:15] <LinuxJones> yikes I am only downloading @ 50 kb/s I usually can hit 575 from the repository :(
[02:15] <flopper> LinuxJones, if I well remember this video card had the same problem under win, I think it's time to trash it ;)
[02:16] <LinuxJones> flopper, ya it is VERY old time to break out the piggy bank :P
[02:16] <Sam0r> get a geforce 4 mx 440 from ebuyer or somthing
[02:16] <Sam0r> bout 30 quid afaik
[02:17] <LinuxJones> Sam0r, is a quid the same as a Euro ?
[02:17] <flopper> hehehe
[02:17] <Sam0r> lol
[02:17] <Sam0r> not that i know of
[02:18] <NewComer> man, low download rate from bittorrent
[02:18] <flopper> but it's incredible that a 32MB video card has proble at 1280x1024.. :\
[02:18] <Sam0r> what card was it?
[02:18] <subterrific> geforce4 440mx is a pretty crappy card
[02:18] <LinuxJones> Dude I am from Canada, I only have heard of a quid on Coronation Street :P
[02:18] <flopper> ati xpert 2000 pro
[02:18] <Sam0r> a what?
[02:19] <Se7h> im stuk
[02:19] <Pakal> hi, GDM does not start automatically at start up
[02:19] <subterrific> the ti4200 card would be better if you can find one
[02:19] <Se7h> i can't find a way to force my monitor to display in 1152
[02:19] <Sam0r> subterrific: i have that card
[02:19] <Pakal> Se7h: "dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xfree86"
[02:19] <LinuxJones> Pakal, does it display any errors on your screen ?
[02:20] <Se7h> Pakal i've already done that
[02:20] <Sam0r> hostname Server1.trippie.co.uk
[02:20] <Sam0r> oh ffs wrong keyboard again
[02:21] <Pakal> say: "gdm starting" even an OK message appear
[02:21] <Pakal> but does not start
[02:21] <LinuxJones> Pakal, when did you install ?
[02:22] <Pakal> I make a symlink /etc/init.d/gdm -> /etc/rc3/@S99gdm
[02:22] <Pakal> but don't fixed
[02:22] <Pakal> LinuxJones: two days ago
[02:23] <subterrific> yay, found a fun way to bring oracle to its knees. run 200,000 queries plus a full database export at the same time, while also dropping a few tables
[02:23] <subterrific>  load average: 21.96, 21.38, 21.83
[02:23] <WW> subterrific: Jeez, and I was just about to try that...
[02:23] <LinuxJones> Pakal, there were some problems with Gnome starting the last few days, do an apt-get update && apt-get upgrade
[02:24] <Pakal> "apt-get -f -y dist-upgrade" is correct?
[02:24] <q2> HOW DO I USE .DEBS IN GNOME?????
[02:24] <WW> q2: You're over here, too?
[02:25] <LinuxJones> Pakal, you have to update first to get new package lsit
[02:25] <Pakal> ok
[02:25] <LinuxJones> q2, dpkg -i (in console) to install a .deb package
[02:25] <q2> WW, yes
[02:25] <jayeola_afk> hi guys
[02:25] <q2> WW, im using Ubuntu
[02:25] <LinuxJones> jayeola_afk, hi
[02:26] <subterrific> WW: i'm sure a better machine could handle it, but this is just a 3ghz P4 w/ 2gigs of memory
[02:26] <Sam0r> holy shit elinks is fast
[02:26] <q2> LinuxJones: So like: dpkg -i /home/q2/thedebiwant?
[02:26] <WW> subterrific: Ah, that explains it.
[02:26] <LinuxJones> q2, ya
[02:26] <q2> kk
[02:27] <WW> q2: What .deb are  you installing?
[02:27] <q2> a few desktop environments
[02:27] <q2> Enlightenment, Afterstep
[02:27] <q2> window maker
[02:28] <WW> q2: Not sure about afterstep, but enlightenment is in ubuntu universe.  You can use apt-get to install it.
[02:28] <q2> aaah
[02:28] <q2> well it did not work when i apt-getted
[02:28] <Sam0r> whats this univerce thing
[02:28] <LinuxJones> q2, they are probably in universe
[02:29] <Sam0r> universe*
[02:29] <Liz> is it a good idea to update from the ubuntu archives?
[02:29] <Pakal> Liz: yes
[02:29] <LinuxJones> Liz, yes
[02:30] <dommi> dare I chime in, Liz: yes
[02:30] <Liz> gnome.control.panel didnt update well, it crashed on me
[02:30] <Pakal> what significant package is on Debina and not in ubuntu?
[02:30] <q2> it did not intsall
[02:30] <Liz> if one doesnt upgrade well, wil lthe others that got apt-getted?
[02:30] <dommi> Pakal, madwifi?
[02:30] <q2> AND I HATE GNOME!
[02:30] <Liz> i love gnome :D
[02:30] <jayeola_afk> ?
[02:31] <Pakal> q2: ubuntu is not for you
[02:31] <Zomb> q2: yea, Gnome sucks. Months/years behind KDE, always.
[02:31] <q2> i want to use fluxbox
[02:31] <Zomb> not that I would use any of them ;)
[02:31] <q2> can i use that with Ubuntu?
[02:32] <dommi> ubuntu needs an ad campaign
[02:32] <subterrific> did anyone have the latest hal break on install?
[02:32] <dommi> s/apple/ubuntu # the true *nix
[02:33] <q2> Im having dependency problems
[02:33] <q2> is there a list of packages that work with Ubuntu?
[02:33] <dommi> better question, is there a ubuntu repository web site
[02:33] <dommi> like packages.debian.org
[02:33] <subterrific> uhm, just use synaptic
[02:33] <Pakal> Im usign Windowaker, I proof fluxbox, XFCE, fvwm, but always return to WindowMaker 
[02:33] <Se7h> does anyone knows whats the Hsync that aneblas 1152 resolution ?
[02:33] <smo> last I heard it's planned, but not yet
[02:34] <smo> (a packages.debian.org equiv, that is)
[02:34] <jayeola_afk> ok, i've set a box's resolution to "millions of colours" no i've got a black screen. what do i do?
[02:34] <q2> windowmaker wont install for me
[02:34] <q2> none will
[02:34] <LinuxJones> q2, you can try adding a Debian repository for an app that you need, just don't go crazy downloading stuff from it.
[02:34] <jayeola_afk> -now-
[02:34] <subterrific> it's a better idea to not add debian repositories and just use ubuntu's universe
[02:34] <q2> LinuxJones, ???
[02:35] <dommi> jayeola_afk, edit /etc/X11/XF85Config to default display of 16 bit instead of 24 bit
[02:35] <jayeola_afk> i can't see anything at all :(
[02:35] <q2> i really do not like Gnome
[02:35] <dommi> how are you ircing?
[02:36] <LinuxJones> q2, you caqn add a Debian unstable repository to your /etc/apt/sources.lst file, you might however beak something if you go crasy downloading core stuff
[02:36] <jayeola_afk> dommi: it's another box
[02:36] <dommi> ok
[02:36] <q2> never mind then
[02:36] <subterrific> LinuxJones: or just enable universe and get the same stuff...
[02:36] <WW> I could swear I added "How do add universe?" to the wiki faq...
[02:36] <LinuxJones> god my typing is horrible :(
[02:36] <subterrific> WW: seriously.
[02:36] <jayeola_afk> just installed my distro on it as well, will i have to re-install?
[02:36] <q2> i really just want a low resource environment that works with ubuntu
[02:36] <subterrific> so much misinformation going around :(
[02:36] <Pakal> god, my english es horrible :(
[02:37] <Pakal> q2: try fvwm
[02:37] <dommi> isnt the entry commented out in /etc/apt/sources.list
[02:37] <dommi> for universe that is
[02:37] <q2> what is that like
[02:37] <q2> is it like icewm?
[02:37] <subterrific> q2: why do you want a low resource environment?
[02:37] <LinuxJones> subterrific, I thought that the Ubuntu and Debian trees were not inter-changeable ?
[02:37] <cokehabit> joem: you're quiet tonight
[02:37] <q2> because i have a slow linux box
[02:38] <joem> sorry
[02:38] <joem> cokehabit, you install it yet?
[02:38] <Pakal> q2: http://fvwm.org/screenshots/desktops/
[02:38] <subterrific> LinuxJones: they aren't, which is why unbuntu has universe. so you don't have to use debian's repositories
[02:38] <cokehabit> no joem 
[02:38] <jayeola_afk> dommi: any ideas? i can't see anything....
[02:38] <subterrific> LinuxJones: go read the FAQ
[02:38] <dommi> jayeola_afk, ok
[02:38] <cokehabit> i haven't downloaded it yet
[02:38] <dommi> does your box boot?
[02:38] <cokehabit> Linux leviathon 2.6.8-gentoo-r3 #1 Wed Sep 22 01:10:19 GMT 2004 i686 AMD Athlon(tm) XP 2400+ AuthenticAMD GNU/Linux
[02:38] <dommi> and do you get the black screen when it loads x?
[02:38] <cokehabit> see
[02:39] <jayeola_afk> yeah, dommi 
[02:39] <q2> pakal, AWESOME!
[02:39] <dommi> can you control alt function key to get to a text login?
[02:40] <cokehabit> cprov_: ahhhh a fellow englander
[02:40] <jayeola_afk> dommi: !!!!!! woooooot
[02:40] <jayeola_afk> hehe
[02:40] <jayeola_afk> engineer, eh? what kind?
[02:41] <q2> Pakal: SHould i download a .DEB package? or does RPM work? or waht should i do?
[02:41] <dommi> rpms dont generally work on deb
[02:41] <dommi> too many funkified things going on when you try to install them
[02:41] <subterrific> q2: for the third time, run synaptic
[02:41] <q2> subterrific, wtf is synaptic?
[02:41] <dommi> cokehabit, whats the word?
[02:42] <subterrific> q2: package management gui so you can browse packages by catagory
[02:42] <dommi> http://www.bumwine.com/tbird.html
[02:42] <dommi> in case you were wondering
[02:42] <cokehabit> dommi: erm... 
[02:42] <dommi> must be an american thing
[02:43] <subterrific> q2: you can also enable the universe respositories so you will see things like fluxbox
[02:43] <q2> im a very lazy linux user
[02:43] <cokehabit> dommi: t-bird, cool
[02:43] <cokehabit> how long has ubnutu been around then?
[02:43] <WW> q2: Then you want Computer -> System Configuration -> Synaptic Package Manager  :)
[02:44] <dommi> heh, isnt there an argument goin on about whether kde is available from the ubuntu repository?
[02:44] <dommi> apt-cache search kde shows it is available
[02:44] <dommi> as is kdm
[02:45] <cokehabit> dommi: is ubnutu source or binary?
[02:45] <Kosai> dommi: apt-get install kde worked fine for me.
[02:45] <dommi> binary?
[02:45] <joem> kde packages are available from universe
[02:46] <kremlyn> Does ubuntu change anything at all about Debian, other than the versions/locations of packages?
[02:46] <kremlyn> Anything learned on one can be applied to the other?
[02:46] <cokehabit> joem: what are the benefits of ubuntu
[02:46] <tseng> kremlyn: the basic workings are almost identical
[02:46] <q2> whats the flood channel?
[02:46] <cokehabit> what will i get from it that i dont from gentoo
[02:46] <tseng> kremlyn: as far as individual packages alot of things are patched in ubuntu for bug fixing action
[02:46] <kremlyn> tseng: i.e. kernel compilation, network configuration, locations of configuration files..
[02:46] <cokehabit> #flood
[02:47] <Kamion> cokehabit: preview release was 15th September
[02:47] <tseng> kremlyn: those all work the same
[02:47] <joem> cokehabit, easy to set up, easy to use, easy package management, frequent updates/6month release cycle, good maintainers
[02:47] <kremlyn> tseng: So what's different?
[02:47] <joem> cokehabit, things not compiled with a broken toolchain
[02:47] <joem> and that work
[02:47] <dommi> http://pastebin.com/
[02:47] <tseng> kremlyn: different from debian?
[02:47] <kremlyn> tseng: Yeah :-)
[02:47] <cokehabit> joem: you're not still going on about gcc are we
[02:47] <tseng> kremlyn: smaller set of "supported" packages, less flame wars, shorter release cycles
[02:48] <cokehabit> tseng: i recognise than name from somewhere
[02:48] <tseng> cokehabit: im a popular guy.
[02:48] <joem> tseng is known all over as the man
[02:48] <q2> subterrific, PM me so i can get this working easier
[02:48] <kremlyn> tseng: Awesome.. :-) But I mean technically.  No changes to apt (other than sources).. no changes to stuff any debian user would know..
[02:48] <cokehabit> tseng: you're a mate of lovechilds
[02:49] <Sam0r> which version of debian is ubuntu based on?
[02:49] <tseng> kremlyn: apt works the same. we dont recommend using debian targeted sources generally
[02:49] <dommi> from how I understand it and I could be wrong.  doesnt ubuntu stabilize sid?
[02:49] <tseng> cokehabit: erm, I wouldnt say that
[02:49] <Kamion> joem: our toolchain isn't that significantly differemt from Debian's
[02:49] <nonroot> Anyone know how to import _all_ (old) evolution data from 1.4.x into 2.0.1 (rather than one file at a time)?
[02:49] <tseng> cokehabit: i know the guy, yes.
[02:49] <Kamion> dommi: right
[02:49] <kremlyn> tseng: *nod*
[02:49] <Pakal> Sam0r: unstable
[02:49] <kremlyn> Hmm, so it would be fair to say that ubuntu is to debian, as dropline gnome is to slackware?
[02:49] <joem> Kamion, was talking about difference between ubuntu and gentoo
[02:49] <subterrific> q2: sorry i havent slept in 2 days, i need to go take a nap. i'm just here waiting for a process to finish running at work so i can sleep
[02:49] <cprov_> cokehabit: a kind of ...
[02:49] <Se7h> so
[02:49] <Se7h> does anyone knows whats the Hsync that aneblas 1152 resolution ?
[02:49] <tseng> kremlyn: hm, kinda like that
[02:50] <Kamion> joem: ah, the discussion above was mixed-up, couldn't quite tell
[02:50] <Se7h> *enables
[02:50] <cprov_> btw, I had a problem with the missed dependedes between wireless-tools and libw27, somebody knows Guus Sliepen <guus@debian.org> ?
[02:50] <joem> yea, its crazy in here
[02:50] <cprov_> \sdependedes\dependecies
[02:50] <kremlyn> Awesome. I can't wait for the release :-)
[02:50] <LinuxJones> Se7h, why are you hung up on 1152 resolution ?
[02:50] <Pakal> subterrific: "sleep 60m && init 0"
[02:50] <kremlyn> tseng: Thanks for the info :-)
[02:50] <Pakal> subterrific: so, you dont need wait
[02:51] <Se7h> LinuxJones cause i know the monitor is able to display it
[02:51] <cokehabit> hmmmm
[02:51] <Se7h> but not by default
[02:51] <subterrific> Pakal: it's a bit more complicated than that
[02:51] <Se7h> i got to force it
[02:51] <cokehabit> tseng: joem want to know something funny? Lovechilld just installed Ubnutu and his monitor burned out
[02:52] <tseng> ya he said
[02:52] <dommi> has anyone ever tried the velocd firewire cdrw from TDK on ubuntu?
[02:52] <jayeola_afk> thanks dommi . completely forgot about VTs!
[02:52] <dommi> not a problem
[02:52] <cokehabit> so tseng you still devv'ing all over the place then?
[02:52] <tseng> cokehabit: yeah.
[02:53] <tseng> cokehabit: im a freaking nut and a half
[02:53] <subterrific> Pakal: i have to sit here and baby sit this process. it's a pretty complex long running thing that touches oracle, mysql, and several other custom pieces of software all across 5 machines
[02:53] <cokehabit> Reporter: "Hey George, we still haven't found Osama yet..."
[02:53] <cokehabit> GWB: "Who?"
[02:53] <cokehabit> Reporter "Osama Bin Laden... The Billionaire who lives in a cave...?"
[02:53] <cokehabit> GWB: "Oh, Batman!!!"
[02:53] <Pakal> ok, good luck!!
[02:53] <subterrific> cokehabit: heh
[02:54] <tseng> on topic duder.
[02:54] <cokehabit> whats the topic?
[02:54] <cokehabit> just support?
[02:54] <tseng> the topic is ubuntu in general
[02:55] <mdz> you know, the operating system :-)
[02:55] <tseng> not politics or topical humor.
[02:55] <cokehabit> sorry, i just thought i'd give everyone a laugh
[02:55] <Kamion> we'd prefer if the conversation were kept fairly closely to Ubuntu; it means those of us who feel semi-obligated to at least scan the channel logs don't have *quite* so much to wade through when we get up in the morning. :-)
[02:55] <tseng> watch the episode of Family Guy for why topical humor is bad
[02:56] <cokehabit> mdz: well joem is getting me to install ubnutu so i thought i'd have a look
[02:56] <mdz> we hope that you like it
[02:56] <joem> tseng, blahblahblah ubuntu
[02:57] <cokehabit> well i have to write out a "email client how-to" for gentoo and do some college work so i should get some free time around........ february?
[02:57] <joem> tseng, what do you think about a muine-gstreamer package?
[02:57] <lifeless> .window 12
[02:57] <tseng> joem: hm
[02:57] <tseng> joem: is it using xine now? i didnt even look much at that package
[02:57] <joem> yea
[02:57] <tseng> hm.
[02:58] <tseng> seeing as its the default :)
[02:58] <joem> you have to edit the xine-conf file in the gnome2/muine dir to get it to use esd
[02:58] <tseng> ya, gstreamer worked almost as well on gen2
[02:58] <tseng> we could try it
[02:59] <joem> I like the gst backend because I can use gstreamer to set audio driver for all apps
[02:59] <tseng> right now all my packages are apperantly bunk
[02:59] <joem> yea?
[02:59] <joem> why is that
[02:59] <tseng> Todd Berman said so
[02:59] <tseng> so it must be true.
[02:59] <joem> ooh damn, don't want to go messing with him
[02:59] <joem> what did he say about em
[02:59] <tseng> he said
[02:59] <cokehabit> damn im getting sadder......... speechd is coooooool
 tseng: yer shizzle is bunk brother man!
[03:00] <joem> ha
[03:00] <DimSum> http://msbetas.net/HumanV1Final.png
[03:00] <tseng> hm
[03:01] <tseng> thatd be neat if it were reverted to indubstrial pallete
[03:01] <cokehabit> echo "ubuntu Owns Debians Arse" > /dev/speech
[03:01] <tseng> the brown sucks++
[03:01] <cokehabit> lol
[03:01] <DimSum> tseng: Are you saying that Human sucks, or the port? :\
[03:01] <tseng> DimSum: the port is very nice
[03:01] <DimSum> Ah
[03:01] <DimSum> Ty
[03:01] <tseng> i dont like the brown in human is all
[03:01] <DimSum> Ahhh :(
[03:01] <tseng> i like the indubstrial colors
[03:01] <LinuxJones> I like the brown
[03:01] <DimSum> Yeah, I like them both
[03:02] <tseng> you should also install firefox
[03:02] <DimSum> Can't stand it.
[03:02] <tseng> and stop stinking up the web
[03:02] <tseng> :P
[03:02] <DimSum> First thing I did when I installed Ubuntu was took FireFox off
[03:03] <DimSum> Unfortunately, there's no IE for Linux, so I replaced it with Epiphany
[03:03] <subterrific> yeah, IE is much better for getting exploits
[03:03] <DimSum> subterrific: Sure, if you don't patch
[03:03] <tseng> subterrific: thats not my point at all
[03:03] <cokehabit> anyway, im off to fix gcc
[03:03] <cokehabit> laters people
[03:03] <cokehabit> nice to see you again tseng 
[03:03] <LinuxJones> night
[03:03] <dommi> DimSum, you like using IE?
[03:03] <DimSum> I do indeed
[03:03] <subterrific> tseng: i know, IE's rendering sucks too
[03:03] <dommi> ok
[03:04] <DimSum> subterrific: Where'd you get that idea from?
[03:04] <mdz> tseng, DimSum: don't get too attached to the theme either way; it's entirely temporary :-)
[03:04] <DimSum> mdz: Shame :\
[03:04] <tseng> subterrific: what i mean is, people using IE encourages web designers to make broken sites
[03:04] <DimSum> Oh well, I guess it's here to stay on Windows XP, anyway ;P
[03:04] <DimSum> tseng: 20 says my site isn't "broken".
[03:04] <DimSum> In any way.
[03:04] <tseng> not yours
[03:05] <DimSum> I use IE... I test purely in IE
[03:05] <tseng> i was generalizing about web developers whos sites are frequented by Ie users.
[03:05] <DimSum> Why would my site be "broken" ?
[03:05] <joem> people don't bother to fix broken sites if the majority of people use a broken web browser
[03:05] <DimSum> My site probably has 99% of it's hits from IE
[03:05] <subterrific> DimSum: you don't check the logs?
[03:05] <DimSum> I do
[03:06] <DimSum> Last time I checked, it was 99 ;P
[03:06] <DimSum> %
[03:06] <dommi> http://www.stopdesign.com/log/2004/01/26/ie_factor.html
[03:06] <subterrific> DimSum: lets see this amazing website
[03:06] <DimSum> http://osfocus.net/
[03:06] <mdz> DimSum: IE has about 70% market share and falling
[03:06] <DimSum> Haven't updated it in a while
[03:07] <DimSum> Been too busy with Sixth Form and stuff
[03:07] <DimSum> Uni applications, etc
[03:07] <punkass_> i test my sites in IE 6, firefox, Opera, and IE 5.01
[03:07] <DimSum> punkass_: Good man
[03:07] <dommi> http://arstechnica.com/news/posts/20040928-4244.html
[03:07] <jono> anyone here know much about alsa?
[03:07] <dommi> ie 5.01?
[03:07] <dommi> wow you are a sadist 
[03:07] <punkass_> :)
[03:07] <DimSum> I don't actually need to, though, considering how everything I do is XHTML 1.0 Strict, Transitional, and 1.1 compliant
[03:07] <tseng> DimSum: ah good.
[03:08] <punkass_> lots o people still running 98/95 out there
[03:08] <DimSum> If Gecko has a problem with any of those, it can sod off, to be honest :)
[03:08] <tseng> validation of standards is a big plus.
[03:08] <DimSum> tseng: Indeed
[03:08] <DimSum> I also make use of the DOM, but I use a JS wrapper for compliance on non-IE platforms
[03:08] <LinuxJones> jono, what is wrong ??
[03:08] <DimSum> So again, everyone wins.
[03:08] <subterrific> DimSum: ghecko doesn't, IE does
[03:08] <DimSum> subterrific: My site looks fine in IE, thanks.
[03:08] <DimSum> Renders a lot faster, as well
[03:09] <mdz> DimSum: "focusing" has only one "s"
[03:09] <DimSum> mdz: You want to put 20 on that?
[03:09] <jono> LinuxJones, I am having problems getting sound from my line in
[03:09] <Kamion> mdz: that's American English
[03:09] <DimSum> I should warn you, I've made a lot of money this way
[03:09] <jono> LinuxJones, I have a four channel sound card
[03:09] <mdz> DimSum: you'd have to split it two ways
[03:09] <LinuxJones> jono, I am too drunk to help with that 
[03:09] <DimSum> ;P
[03:10] <mdz> English-English gets that one wrong
[03:10] <jono> hehe
[03:10] <LinuxJones> sorry :D
[03:10] <mdz> DimSum: is your site intentionally 600 pixels wide?
[03:10] <DimSum> Yeah, I'm british, so I'm allowed to say "focussing" and "colour"
[03:10] <DimSum> mdz: It is indeed
[03:10] <dommi> http://stonetable.org/2004/02/24/nifty-css-trick/ <-- very interesting for IE 5 developers
[03:10] <DimSum> Means that 640x480 users can read it
[03:10] <DimSum> Such as me, when I'm at college
[03:11] <mdz> 640x480 users can also read it if you don't make it a fixed width
[03:11] <DimSum> Yeah, but then the news articles would look teeny tiny.
[03:11] <dommi> DimSum, I checked the buffer and didnt see your site linked.  would you mind linking me to it?
[03:11] <DimSum> Anyway, it's not 600 pixels, it's 800 pixels
[03:12] <DimSum> I think :\
[03:12] <mdz> DimSum: then 640x480 users can't read it :-)
[03:12] <DimSum> dommi: http://osfocus.net/
[03:12] <DimSum> mdz: True.
[03:12] <DimSum> Actually, gah... lemme check how wide it is
[03:12] <mdz> it's really not important
[03:13] <mdz> no articles about ubuntu on this site :-(
[03:13] <DimSum> Yeah, it's 800.
[03:13] <DimSum> Oh, I haven't gotten around to posting it yet
[03:13] <DimSum> Still, I figured the visual style would be good publicity in the mean time :P
[03:14] <dommi> DimSum, interesting layout
[03:14] <DimSum> dommi: Ty
[03:14] <dommi> The logo needs work
[03:14] <DimSum> It does? :\
[03:14] <dommi> I dont like the tagline being above the brand
[03:14] <DimSum> Oh right
[03:14] <dommi> its a bit strange
[03:14] <dommi> I like the color layout
[03:15] <DimSum> Ty
[03:15] <DimSum> Click on the bit where it says "More Articles..."
[03:15] <dommi> you might want to consider using variable widths
[03:15] <DimSum> Should work in any major browser
[03:15] <dommi> firefox on ubuntu
[03:15] <dommi> pr1
[03:15] <DimSum> Should work then, give it a go
[03:16] <dommi> yes it does...  
[03:16] <DimSum> ;P
[03:17] <dommi> too lazy
[03:17] <dommi> I caught the toggle bit
[03:18] <DimSum> Hehe
[03:18] <DimSum> Yes, it pwns.
[03:18] <DimSum> Also, for those of you who are interested, I'm using a PNG DXAlpha loader filter to display the PNG files with 32-bit transparency under IE6; everything on the site is PNG, and therefore looks lovely.
[03:19] <punkass_> just did this one: www.licq.com
[03:20] <dommi> you ever use plone and zope?
[03:20] <subterrific> png's with transparency just work in other browsers
[03:20] <DimSum> dommi: Who, me?
[03:20] <punkass_> it was XHTML1.0 validated..but it looks like the guy who put it up changed a few things..so now its not :(
[03:20] <subterrific> like css just works
[03:20] <DimSum> subterrific: Yep.
[03:20] <dommi> DimSum, anyone
[03:20] <DimSum> punkass_: :(
[03:20] <subterrific> no need for extreme work arounds for broken IE
[03:20] <DimSum> dommi: Never even heard of them
[03:20] <DimSum> subterrific: Sure, "broken" IE.
[03:20] <dommi> www.plone.org
[03:21] <subterrific> DimSum: yes, it renders valid CSS with zero logic
[03:21] <DimSum> punkass_: Not a bad site.
[03:21] <DimSum> subterrific: IE renders CSS perfectly, thanks.
[03:22] <punkass_> i wish IE would do PNGs without the extra stuff..that would be nice
[03:22] <subterrific> http://www.stopdesign.com/log/2004/01/30/ie_factor_example.html
[03:22] <DimSum> punkass_: It will do, soon.
[03:22] <dommi> I wish IE would do more than that
[03:22] <subterrific> not so perfect
[03:22] <dommi> pngs are low priority
[03:22] <DimSum> dommi: Like what?
[03:22] <dommi> tabbed browsing
[03:22] <dommi> for one
[03:22] <punkass_> dommi: good point..:)
[03:22] <DimSum> Tabbed, ugh.
[03:22] <DimSum> That's reason #1 why I hate FireFox.
[03:22] <dommi> dont use it. :)
[03:23] <dommi> tabbed browsing that is
[03:23] <subterrific> thats a really stupid reason to hate it because you can turn it off...
[03:23] <punkass_> i could never live without tabs now
[03:23] <Hrdwr_BoB> no-one is forcing you to use tabs
[03:23] <DimSum> Unfortunately, it certain browsers, you have no choice.
[03:23] <Hrdwr_BoB> not to mention that tabbed browsing is the best thing since sliced bread
[03:23] <subterrific> like IE, because it has no tabs
[03:23] <DimSum> subterrific: Thank god.
[03:23] <smo> I must admit that it's an odd concept .. that gnome is moving towards a spatial concept, and browsers are moving .. backwards
[03:23] <Hrdwr_BoB> DimSum: I fail to see your point?
[03:23] <punkass_> tabs in my terminals, tabs in browsers.. tabs in editors...give me tabs!
[03:23] <Hrdwr_BoB> it's trivial to use firefox without tabs
[03:23] <DimSum> Hrdwr_BoB: You ever heard of ALT+Tab?
[03:24] <Hrdwr_BoB> yes, but I fail to see why that makes it bad
[03:24] <Hrdwr_BoB> you can choose not to use it
[03:24] <DimSum> No, you're missing the point
[03:24] <DimSum> ALT+Tab doesn't work in Tabbed Browsing.
[03:24] <DimSum> Which is why I hate it
[03:24] <dommi> cant you assign hotkeys in firefox?
[03:25] <DimSum> Probably?
[03:25] <tseng> its Ctrl+Tab
[03:25] <DimSum> Doesn't change the fact that ALT+Tab doesn't work
[03:25] <Hrdwr_BoB> alt 1/2/3/4/5/6/etc
[03:25] <dommi> http://forums.mozillanews.org/index.php?board=4;action=display;threadid=295
[03:25] <DimSum> tseng: I'm aware of this, but my left hand stays on the ALT and Tab keys in it's default position
[03:25] <Hrdwr_BoB> I think you've decided you don't like tabs
[03:25] <DimSum> Thumb on Alt, middle finger on Tab.
[03:25] <Hrdwr_BoB> and nothing could eve change your mind
[03:25] <subterrific> thats gotta suck, you have to tab through windows of every other app when all you want is to see another browser window
[03:25] <dommi> actually he probably would if you could alt tab through tabs
[03:25] <Hrdwr_BoB> DimSum: you don't use your keyboard enough then
[03:25] <DimSum> Hrdwr_BoB: Exactly
[03:26] <DimSum> Hrdwr_BoB: Sure I do
[03:26] <DimSum> I hardly ever touch the mouse
[03:26] <DimSum> Which is why I hate tabs so much
[03:26] <Hrdwr_BoB> your thumb should sit on space
[03:26] <DimSum> Sure, thumb of my right hand.
[03:26] <Hrdwr_BoB> with your fingers over the keyboard
[03:26] <punkass_> i had a buddy that was a full IE guy..said fire(bird)fox sucked etc...now thats all he uses..
[03:26] <Hrdwr_BoB> don't you use say... asddfqwertyzxcvbg
[03:26] <subterrific> DimSum: ctrl-tab gives only browser tabs which is more efficient than alt-tab which gives you a list of every single window for every app
[03:27] <DimSum> subterrific: I like that choice
[03:27] <DimSum> I like to be able to order my Windows via Alt+Tab
[03:27] <dommi> ooooh almost forgot, rhythm box is done importing music
[03:27] <subterrific> you don't have that choice in IE
[03:27] <DimSum> So that I can switch from porn, to explorer, to porn, to WMP9, to porn
[03:27] <DimSum> All just by pressing Alt+Tab twice.
[03:27] <subterrific> you can't just see browser windows with IE
[03:27] <subterrific> you can in firefox
[03:27] <Hrdwr_BoB> I switch from apps my .. moving my mouse
[03:27] <Hrdwr_BoB> FFN
[03:27] <DimSum> I don't WANT just to see browser windows
[03:27] <Hrdwr_BoB> *FFM
[03:28] <DimSum> Hrdwr_BoB: Which requires use of my right hand, which is generally busy when viewing porn.
[03:28] <subterrific> DimSum: you just said you did, you use alt-tab to switch browser windows
[03:28] <DimSum> subterrific: Exactly.
[03:28] <punkass_> lol
[03:28] <DimSum> But I like to have other windows in BETWEEN my browser windows
[03:28] <dommi> DimSum, makes a valid argument.  I dont see a reason to dogpile :P
[03:28] <DimSum> ty
[03:28] <dommi> np
[03:28] <Hrdwr_BoB> it is a valid argument
[03:28] <dommi> even though you are a windows user :D
[03:29] <Hrdwr_BoB> however it's more about refusal to retrain
[03:29] <smo> I'm curious wether that user-case turned up in Sun's studies   hehe
[03:29] <DimSum> Anyway, I'm porting Epiphany to Windows
[03:29] <Hrdwr_BoB> or relook at things
[03:29] <DimSum> Hrdwr_BoB: I don't WANT it.
[03:29] <DimSum> *to
[03:29] <Hrdwr_BoB> many things are more effecient
[03:29] <Hrdwr_BoB> however it required the user to change
[03:29] <Hrdwr_BoB> because they're using a broken idea to start with
[03:29] <DimSum> I'm insanely efficient as I am, and restricting the ordering of my windows merely limits my choices
[03:29] <punkass_> different bad, same good.
[03:29] <DimSum> If Linux is all about "choice", then Tabbed Browsing has to be one of the most retarded things the OSS comunity have ever come up with.
[03:29] <Hrdwr_BoB> er
[03:29] <punkass_> ;)
[03:29] <Hrdwr_BoB> CHOOSE NOT TO USE IT
[03:30] <Hrdwr_BoB> end of story
[03:30] <DimSum> With that said, Epiphany doesn't even give users the choice to disable Tabs, so you can't choose not to use it.
[03:30] <DimSum> == owned.
[03:30] <Hrdwr_BoB> don't use epiphany
[03:30] <Hrdwr_BoB> it's crap.
[03:30] <Hrdwr_BoB> IMHO)
[03:30] <punkass_> i agree
[03:30] <DimSum> Oh well.
[03:30] <DimSum> I happen to like it
[03:30] <LinuxJones> DimSum, is you don't like oS why are you in #Ubuntu ?
[03:30] <DimSum> LinuxJones: Because I like Ubuntu
[03:30] <DimSum> Graphically, that is
[03:30] <mdz> there's no requirement that you like anything in particular in order to participate in this channel
[03:30] <LinuxJones> DimSum, oh
[03:31] <mdz> we do ask that you keep the discussion vaguely on-topic, though
[03:31] <dommi> our class project is to turn DimSum into a 100% linux user
[03:31] <cyphos> nifty ;)
[03:31] <mdz> (hint)
[03:31] <DimSum> dommi: Um, no.
[03:31] <DimSum> Point is, I need to install VB .NET 2005 so that I can finish writing Epiphany for Windows
[03:32] <subterrific> DimSum: so you think IE renders CSS 100% perfectly and you ignore the example i give you of IE not rendering valid CSS correctly and requiring insane work arounds.
[03:32] <dommi> DimSum, <nerd response>resistance is futile</>
[03:32] <cyphos> is anyone having problems when clicking on an application from the Applications menu, the application is started twice
[03:32] <DimSum> subterrific: !care.
[03:32] <DimSum> My site displays fine.
[03:32] <cyphos> ie, if you clikc on terminal, two terminals are launched
[03:33] <DimSum> Idiots who use <h2> and <div> tags shouldn't be complaining about standards incompatabilities.
[03:33] <Hrdwr_BoB> "oh, what are you talking about, my site uses mime type text/plain, it works fine in IE..."
[03:33] <DimSum> If they used css font-family assignments and Tables, they wouldn't have these problems
[03:33] <Hrdwr_BoB> *ahem*
[03:33] <subterrific> DimSum: then you complain about tabbed browsing because you can't switch tabs with a keystroke, and refuse to use ctrl-tab and say you'd rather switch through a list of every window to get to whatever browser window you're looking for. all along ignoring the fact that firefox doesn't force tabbed browsing on you
[03:33] <DimSum> Hrdwr_BoB: http://osfocus.net/, XHTML 1.0 Transitional, Strict, and 1.1 compliant, as well as CSS compliant.
[03:33] <DimSum> subterrific: Like I said, I dislike FireFox.
[03:33] <subterrific> DimSum: you're text book fanatic. ignore all logic.
[03:34] <DimSum> It doesn't use a standard Win32 toolkit
[03:34] <cyphos> also too, what package do I need to get the kernel-sources? I merged kernel-package but there's no /usr/src/linux
[03:34] <Hrdwr_BoB> I'm sure it is but I was making an altogether alternative point
[03:34] <Kamion> guys, enough please, you obviously aren't going to convince each other and this isn't really the forum
[03:34] <DimSum> Doesn't use WTL, doesn't use MFC, doesn't use Windows.Forms, doesn't use anything that's even partially recognizable as a goddamn REAL interface on Windows
[03:34] <mdz> #browser-wars is next door
[03:34] <dommi> http://validator.w3.org/check?uri=www.osfocus.net
[03:34] <dommi> hes right
[03:34] <DimSum> Which means that oh, clicking on text boxes only sometimes works, clicking on buttons can sometimes do NOTHING if you click on them too fast, as well as various other inconsistencies
[03:35] <DimSum> dommi: Damn right I am. Force a 1.0 Strict check, as well ;P
[03:35] <LinuxJones> How do you ignore a user in XChat ?
[03:35] <jayeola_afk> ok guys, if i am gonna dual boot with ubuntu, when i'm asked about grub, what do i say? no grub (cos i have it alrady from aother distro)?
[03:35] <DimSum> LinuxJones: /ignore <nick>, I would assume.
[03:35] <LinuxJones> DimSum, ty
[03:36] <dommi> 1.1 trumps 1.0 strict
[03:36] <mdz> jayeola_afk: generally, you'll want to let Ubuntu install grub in the MBR, because it will add grub menu entries for other operating systems
[03:36] <spiv> LinuxJones: You can right-click on them and choose 'ignore', iirc.
[03:36] <DimSum> dommi, true; but 1.0 Strict is harder to validate to ;P
[03:36] <DimSum> Because it's... strict.
[03:36] <dommi> ok
[03:36] <DimSum> http://validator.w3.org/check?uri=http%3A%2F%2Fosfocus.net%2F&charset=%28detect+automatically%29&doctype=XHTML+1.0+Strict&verbose=1
[03:36] <DimSum> And, it does.
[03:36] <LinuxJones> spiv, jsut foud it thanks
[03:36] <DimSum> CSS checks out, as well ;P
[03:37] <DimSum> Anyway, to be perfectly honest, I'm somewhat of a fan of Camino, myself.
[03:37] <DimSum> The old Camino - without the gay FireFox-style tabs, though. Ones that you can't disable.
[03:38] <jayeola_afk> 'gay'?
[03:38] <mdz> DimSum: ok, let's let that particular subject lie
[03:38] <DimSum> Indeed
[03:38] <DimSum> jayeola_afk: No offence meant to any homosexuals.
[03:38] <jayeola_afk> !
[03:38] <jayeola_afk> DimSum: it's just a funny way to describe browsers and stuff
[03:39] <DimSum> Oh, lol
[03:39] <DimSum> Pfft ;P
[03:39] <DimSum> Anyway, I really do like this Human port.
[03:39] <jayeola_afk> need a hand bag icon?
[03:39] <DimSum> I'm actually rather proud, to be honest
[03:39] <dommi> I always thought safari was masculine and opera was effeminate
[03:39] <nate> I am having a bit of trouble starting Ubuntu after a fresh install
[03:40] <jayeola_afk> and IE is just .....
[03:40] <DimSum> jayeola_afk: Leet.
[03:40] <DimSum> nate: What's it doing?
[03:40] <punkass_> lol
[03:40] <nate> It comes up to the GNOME splash screen but doesn't get any further
[03:40] <DimSum> :\a
[03:40] <mdz> nate: sounds like #1943
[03:40] <DimSum> *:\
[03:40] <DimSum> Any error messages?
[03:40] <nate> ah...
[03:40] <LinuxJones> nate: apt-get update && apt-get upgrade might help
[03:41] <DimSum> Ubuntu + Anaconda == would be pwn.
[03:41] <pixelated> hello?
[03:41] <nate> hmm. I have an onboard audio device
[03:41] <LinuxJones> pixelated, hi
[03:41] <nate> was working fine with Fedora Core 2
[03:42] <sladen> DimSum: oh even better, ubuntu + Graphical d-i
[03:42] <nate> but I'll try apt-get update and upgrade from a console session
[03:42] <nate> oh wait
[03:42] <DimSum> Screenshots, sladen?
[03:42] <nate> well well well
[03:42] <LinuxJones> nate, some folks had problems the last few days but I think i tmus thave been fixed
[03:42] <nate> it did eventually load, it was just very very slow
[03:42] <mdz> nate: that's symptomatic of #1943.  was your sound device detected correctly?
[03:42] <LinuxJones> nate, good
[03:43] <sladen> DimSum: When it comes out...
[03:43] <DimSum> http://hackers.progeny.com/pgi/
[03:43] <DimSum> This?
[03:43] <nate> dunno, it still won't respond to mouse clicks
[03:43] <DimSum> If so, I'm not liking it.
[03:43] <DimSum> Not at all.
[03:43] <pixelated> coo.. i am checking to make sure there is a channel for ubuntu
[03:43] <nate> looks like something's chewing up the cpu
[03:43] <pixelated> tony, ello
[03:43] <mdz> PGI != d-i
[03:43] <DimSum> Hm.
[03:43] <mdz> PGI is Anaconda
[03:43] <DimSum> It is?
[03:43] <DimSum> Oh.
[03:43] <mdz> oh, no it isn't
[03:43] <dommi> pixelated, no ubuntu chatter around these parts
[03:43] <DimSum> PGI is a multi-architecture graphical installer creation system for Debian GNU/Linux, originally developed by Progeny Linux Systems, Inc. for our Debian-based "Progeny Debian" operating system.
[03:43] <dommi> :D
[03:43] <DimSum> Lol.
[03:44] <pixelated> heh..
[03:44] <mdz> PGI is what Progeny used before they went to Anaconda
[03:44] <dommi> anaconda is the red hat installer. no?
[03:44] <LinuxJones> ya
[03:44] <DimSum> Ah right.
[03:44] <nate> but no. Oh well. Switching to alt-F1 and back again made it come right
[03:44] <nate> weird
[03:44] <dommi> sarge would be the debian installer
[03:44] <DimSum> dommi: Yeah, Anaconda is lovely
[03:44] <dommi> it sucks
[03:44] <DimSum> No, it's waesome
[03:44] <DimSum> *awesome
[03:44] <sladen> DimSum: ``Anaconda, re-branded[*] ''    (* with a 300-tonne sledge-hammer)
[03:45] <DimSum> Most aesthetically pleasing installer ever created, Anaconda.
[03:45] <pixelated> tony is a friend of mine who is just starting linux, and he needs a little help getting gaim installed, its been a little while since i have used debian/debian based distro so he needs a little help
[03:45] <Kosai> I think gaim is installed by default.
[03:45] <LinuxJones> pixelated, is he using Ubuntu ?
[03:45] <sladen> nate: interesting, so when the GNOME splash screen is `hanging' on startup, switching to Alt-F1 and back again clears it?
[03:45] <dommi> pixelated, it should be on the ubuntu installer cd
[03:45] <dommi> and installed by default
[03:45] <jayeola_afk> ok, if i'm dual booting, should my -new- ubuntu part'n be a root one?
[03:45] <sladen> pixelated: go to the Menu at the top and select "Gaim"
[03:45] <dommi> jayeola_afk, root partition?
[03:46] <jayeola_afk> yeah, what kind of part'n should it be? primary + ext3 + ???
[03:47] <pixelated> heh he was trying to use something else for yahoo im... i told him gaim was it and now he sees its installed...
[03:47] <dommi> +bootable flag
[03:47] <jayeola_afk> roger that and thanks
[03:47] <jayeola_afk> oh yeah, mount point = /   ?
[03:48] <jayeola_afk> for the new ubunti part'n that is ...
[03:48] <jayeola_afk> -ubuntu-
[03:48] <nate> sladen: I don't think so actually. What seems to be happening is that raising dialogs is taking an extraordinarily long time. On the order of several minutes per window. Yet there's 300 MB RAM free and CPU's not going above 5%
[03:49] <nate> ie, it took about 2 minutes to bring up 'File Management Preferences' from the Computer menu right now
[03:49] <dommi> jayeola_afk, yurp
[03:49] <jayeola_afk> ;/
[03:49] <jayeola_afk> roger that!
[03:52] <nate> I like the general look and feel though, I thnk
[03:53] <jayeola_afk> if this is the topic, i like the general look and feel of ubuntu
[03:53] <jayeola_afk> the gui menus are very simple when compared to fedora
[03:54] <jayeola_afk> not sure about this sudo business, though.. <dives for cover>
[03:54] <nate> mmm
[03:54] <nate> I think sudo is a good idea actually
[03:54] <jayeola_afk> ?
[03:54] <nate> not exposing the root user strikes me as a very sensible design choice
[03:54] <RichNRockville> I think that Ubuntu is the easiest that I have ever tried to install, actually it is the first one that installed and came up to a graphic screen that worked without having to get a unix guru to come edit some files. It has a lot of promise..
[03:54] <nate> for security
[03:55] <LinuxJones> Thank god they got rid of that insane Debian menu ....that always drove me crazy
[03:55] <nate> what was that?
[03:55] <jayeola_afk> u haven't seen gentoo *sheeesh*
[03:55] <mdz> nate: are you on a laptop?
[03:55] <jayeola_afk> i am
[03:55] <mdz> someone was reporting something similar on (I believe) an HP laptop on ubuntu-users
[03:55] <tony> chris...
[03:56] <pixelated> tony: yo
[03:57] <tony> When I get my mail all the jpegs are "X" s...
[03:58] <tony> Thats the biggest turn off for newbies of Linux...you have do do a hundred things to make one thing work.
[03:58] <DimSum> Omg Marvilla said "thank you" to me for porting Human
[03:59] <nate> mdz: no, a second-hand Celeron 1GHz desktop from a couple years back
[03:59] <nate> it is my play box
[04:00] <nate> hmm, Synaptic reports 53 packages to be upgraded
[04:00] <pixelated> tony: well think of it this way... linux (and most unix like os's) werent really originally designed for end-users, so it has only been in the last few years that they have been getting the 'niceties' and they are still ruff around some edges...
[04:00] <jayeola_afk> uh-huh
[04:00] <nate> DimSum: what's Human?
[04:01] <DimSum> ...
[04:01] <DimSum> You have USED Ubuntu, right?
[04:01] <DimSum> 4.10?
[04:01] <tony> I'd really like to make this work just for the sake of knowing...So where do I start?
[04:01] <pixelated> is there a ppc version of ubuntu?
[04:02] <lifeless> yes
[04:02] <nate> yeah, I first saw it running on an iMac
[04:02] <nate> DimSum: this is the first time I have installed Ubuntu myself
[04:02] <pixelated> hmmm, does it support old world macs?
[04:03] <DimSum> You seen the default theme?
[04:03] <DimSum> That's Human.
[04:03] <nate> aha
[04:03] <nate> it's rather nice
[04:03] <DimSum> Yeah
[04:03] <DimSum> http://www.gfxoasis.com/board/index.php?showtopic=10933
[04:03] <DimSum> Windows XP Port of it, courtesy of moi.
[04:03] <nate> I thought it used Industrial or something though
[04:03] <DimSum> Nah, Human
[04:03] <DimSum> It's based on Industrial
[04:04] <pixelated> tony: best bet is to just ask here... i have never used ubuntu so i am not sure how everything is setup... you know what distro i use ;')
[04:05] <smeggy> what are you trying to make work tony?
[04:06] <tony> Im an idiot as pix will attest...to the operations of Linux...I do not know how to do anything...I need from the very most "basics" on up.
[04:07] <smeggy> What were you saying about not seeing images in your mail?
[04:08] <tony> Like in Outlook ....you see a jpeg.....in Evolution...nothing..just an X.
[04:08] <smeggy> That's a feature.
[04:08] <smeggy> It blocks images because some spam uses images to track who is viewing their spam email.
[04:08] <pixelated> ahhh in evolution, yeah you need to turn it on...
[04:08] <tony> How?
[04:08] <jayeola_afk> tony: tell evo to open images?
[04:08] <smeggy> tony, go to Tools menu, Settings.  "Mail Prefences"
[04:09] <smeggy> Then click the HTML Mail tab, the chose "Always load images from the internet"
[04:09] <jayeola_afk> tony, be carefull! that's how spammers track their prey
[04:09] <nate> yeah, HTML mail is usually mostly spam
[04:09] <nate> if someone wants to email you a photo they should send it as an attachment
[04:10] <nate> though many phones I notice use HTML mail, which is kinda annoying
[04:10] <tony> Wala....Du...ok...Perfect
[04:10] <pixelated> 0
[04:10] <LinuxJones> nate, I only have html email atm :D
[04:11] <tony> I told you guys I know absolutely nothing....
[04:11] <nate> LinuxJones huh? meaning you can't read attachments?
[04:11] <pixelated> install-safe
[04:11] <polok> why doesn't xcdroast find my cdrw when it scans for it
[04:11] <smeggy> tony, anything else troubling you? :)
[04:11] <pixelated> d'oh ww
[04:11] <polok> ?
[04:11] <polok> (also when I manually add it, it won't let burn a cd)
[04:11] <jayeola_afk> tony, have a look at this http://jayeola.org/dump/shot-mail.png
[04:12] <LinuxJones> nate, no in refernece to your comment abotu most html mail being spam, maybe none of my emails are getting thru :P
[04:12] <tony> I just loaded this last night before bed...Im sure I'll find something  
[04:12] <jayeola_afk> that's how you tell evo to open/not images by default
[04:12] <jayeola_afk> http://jayeola.org/dump/shot-mail.png
[04:13] <tony> I cannt hyperlink from here?
[04:13] <smeggy> tony, what?
[04:13] <jayeola_afk> you should be able to open it with a browser. what irc client are u using?
[04:13] <tony> Xchat
[04:13] <smeggy> Just right click on the link, and go to "Mozilla Firefox"
[04:13] <smeggy> and click Open :P
[04:14] <smeggy> Actually, just right click on it and click open in web browser.
[04:14] <tony> I got it...
[04:14] <jayeola_afk> it's a good idea _not_ to open images by default. loads of horrid ppl out there sending loads of nasty stuff
[04:15] <smeggy> Yeah.
[04:15] <smeggy> When does Warty get released officially?
[04:16] <Kosai> In about two weeks.
[04:16] <jayeola_afk> ok, so i'm installing ubuntu. it will be the second OS on a box. installer asking me where i wanna install grub
[04:16] <jayeola_afk> should it be (hd0,0)? like that?
[04:16] <jayeola_afk> i already have grub with fedora
[04:17] <jayeola_afk> tony: u ok? u see the image....
[04:17] <nate> is this still the preview release? I forget
[04:17] <smeggy> Yes.
[04:17] <LinuxJones> nate, ya
[04:17] <nate> it was mentioned on Slashdot so I downloaded it
[04:17] <tony> Ya perfect....Next ???
[04:18] <nate> well, Slashdot and everywhere really. And reviewed also.
[04:18] <smeggy> That's all you need to do Tony, like I told you and  jayeola_afk's screenshot showed.
[04:18] <tony> Gaim...yahoo. I signed in but my buddy list is gone
[04:19] <pixelated> tony: the buddy list is kept on the local machine...
[04:19] <tony> That was good smeggy....I need that kind of step by step.
[04:19] <tony> That sucks pix.....
[04:20] <smeggy> o.o
[04:20] <pixelated> tony: yeah it does... but aim keeps a copy remote, so i like it much better...
[04:20] <smeggy> I believe AIM and MSN store their lists serverside.
[04:20] <jayeola_afk> tony: better not to have images loaded by default, unless yr into that sort of thing, u will see some horrible images through spam
[04:20] <punkass_> yahoo does to
[04:20] <pixelated> smeggy yeah i know aim does, i dont use msn...
[04:21] <pixelated> punkass: did save mine server side...
[04:21] <pixelated> s/did/didnt
[04:21] <punkass_> i can throw in a live cd start gaim add my yahoo accound and it loads my buddy list
[04:21] <punkass_> oh..i have never have...maybe i lucked out and it did it for me 
[04:23] <tony> Do you have Gaim up Chris...uh pix?
[04:24] <pixelated> hmmm been a while since i have used shadowirc...
[04:24] <pixelated> tony: no, this machine doesnt run linux (the 18gig is in it and linux doesnt support the scsi card for ppc) and my other machine is busy testing a fresh install...
[04:25] <pixelated> being called pix is strange...
[04:25] <tony> When are we going to ...where ever to pick up those Macs?
[04:26] <tony> snoopy....shoopy...Iforget...
[04:26] <sloopy> i dunno... next weekend is the installation of the ball and chain... so i have been busy latly...
[04:26] <tony> sloopy?
[04:26] <sloopy> tony: yeah, for 20 years now...
[04:26] <jayeola_afk> ball and chain? u getting married?
[04:26] <sloopy> jayeola: yeah...
[04:27] <jayeola_afk> !
[04:27] <tony> Youre getting married?
[04:27] <sloopy> tony: yeah, you should have gotten an invite...
[04:27] <jayeola_afk> upgraded grilfriend 0.9 to wife 1.0.0
[04:28] <sloopy> jayeola: yeah with freesex 1.0 too! :')
[04:28] <jayeola_afk> !
[04:28] <tony> Tell the old lady to get off the phone...call me...I didnt...
[04:28] <sloopy> tony: she aint on the phone... she left :')
[04:28] <tony> Beta 2 in his case...
[04:29] <sloopy> jayeola: we have two kids together already, the wedding itself is actually a formality...
[04:29] <jayeola_afk> k
[04:29] <tony> Calling...
[04:29] <jayeola_afk> father = shot gun 3.2?
[04:29] <jayeola_afk> father in law?
[04:29] <sloopy> jayeola: nahh...
[04:30] <jayeola_afk> k
[04:32] <Mojo_Jojo> Hi i'm having troubles playing video files. I can get sound but no visual :(
[04:39] <sloopy> is there a graphical app for installing with dependancy resolution? (something like dselect but runs in X)
[04:39] <jayeola_afk> synaptic
[04:39] <jayeola_afk> synaptic = apt + gui
[04:40] <sloopy> tony: there is your answer...
[04:40] <robertj> heya all
[04:40] <smeggy> It's in the computer menu.
[04:40] <smeggy> Hey robertj.
[04:41] <neighborlee> sloopy, that and found here: gnome panel : Computer > system configuration > synatpic package manager
[04:41] <robertj> Finally go ubuntu going on my g3 ibook
[04:41] <robertj> I got pulled away from the install and the power went out
[04:41] <robertj> came back, had to futz with dhclient and do some dist-upgrades
[04:41] <robertj> seems like the only things still b0rk are hibernate and some permissions on /dev/pmu
[04:42] <sloopy> hmmm how do you run it with root priv's?
[04:42] <jayeola_afk> sudo - blah
[04:43] <smeggy> sloopy, if you're the first user account you'll automatically run it with root when you click it in the menu.
[04:43] <smeggy> Otherwise add the user to the sudo group and to the /etc/sudoers file.
[04:43] <robertj> hrmm, firefox isn't starting
[04:44] <glens> noob question:  how to I run a shell script with nautilus in gnome 2.8?  Just seems to want to open it with gedit every time.
[04:44] <jayeola_afk> right click on d-top
[04:44] <jayeola_afk> open new terminal
[04:45] <sloopy> smeggy: let me smack tony around... it is him asking... he is being lazy and not typing...
[04:45] <smeggy> o.o
[04:45] <smeggy> okay..
[04:45] <smeggy> glens, set it to executable, double click on it, then click run in terminal.
[04:45] <robertj> is this a known issue?
[04:46] <smeggy> (to set it to executable, right click, goto properties and tick the "Executable" box on owner.)
[04:46] <sloopy> smeggy: i use a rpm based distro and havnt used debian in a while, and have never used ubuntu so i am not familiar with the tools...
[04:46] <glens> smeggy, it's executable but double clicking opens in gedit.
[04:47] <smeggy> glens, are you sure it's executable? Because opening in gedit is the behaviour I get here when a script is not set to executable.
[04:48] <glens> smeggy, positive.  It's marked as owner rwx, group rx and otherw rx
[04:49] <smeggy> glens, I'm not sure then.  You could get around the problem by creating a launcher pointing to the script and telling it to run in the terminal.
[04:50] <tony> Thanks smeggy...
[04:50] <togs> anybody familiar with IP masquerading? I have a few questions
[04:50] <glens> smeggy, okay... thanks.  very strange.
[04:52] <smeggy> glens, try going to "File Management" preference in the Computer menu and in the Behaviour tab, set "Executable Text Files" to run when they are clicked.
[04:52] <q2> where would Icons for programs be? i want to find the Icon for Evolution????
[04:53] <smeggy> q2, /usr/share/pixmaps ?
[04:53] <robertj> Is there an easy way to remap right click from f12 to another key?
[04:53] <robertj> on this ibook f12 requires pressing the fn key
[04:53] <robertj> so thats two keys to right click
[04:54] <glens> smeggy, just tried but unfortunately it didn't things. :-(
[04:54] <glens> smeggy, didn't >>help<< things.
[04:54] <q2> smeggy, thanks
[04:55] <togs> I have my internal shares going with Samba, so my boxes can see each other. Even following the how-to in the LDP can't put the XP box on the net.
[04:55] <smeggy> q2, and /usr/share/icons i think.
[04:57] <robertj> anyone here have problems firefox on ppc?
[04:59] <togs> If my second ethernet interface on my ubuntu box is set to 192.168.0.10, is that what I put in the gateway for the XP box?
[05:00] <togs> the second interface is the connection from linux box to XP box - first is modem to linux box] 
[05:00] <robertj> Neither mozilla nor firefox will open at all
[05:01] <smeggy> Sounds about right togss.
[05:01] <smeggy> robertj, open a terminal and run them there to see what the error is.
[05:01] <robertj> no error
[05:01] <robertj> mozilla-browser isn't installed though
[05:01] <robertj> that's got to be bad
[05:01] <smeggy> Firefox doesn't need it.
[05:01] <togs> ok. it could be the norton firewall on the xp box, i'll have a look at that
[05:01] <smeggy> What happens in a terminal when you run "firefox"?
[05:02] <robertj> selected locale: en-US
[05:02] <robertj> thats it
[05:02] <smeggy> Then it terminates?
[05:02] <robertj> no
[05:02] <robertj> just sits
[05:02] <smeggy> Strange.
[05:02] <robertj> rhythmbox won't open either
[05:03] <smeggy> Does that get an error?
[05:03] <robertj> Yeah
[05:03] <smeggy> What error?
[05:03] <robertj> couldn't initailize, did I run gst-register
[05:04] <togs> do i need a gateway address in the second interface on the linux box?
[05:04] <smeggy> Odd.
[05:04] <robertj> I had all kinds of corba errors my first start as well
[05:05] <moyogo> does anyone have gvim with its icon in the applications menu? It doesn't have any icon for me
[05:09] <partially> had anyone had a problem with cdrom detection?
[05:09] <partially> (durring the install process)
[05:09] <Se7h> on fstab
[05:10] <robertj> reinstalled and its working
[05:10] <Se7h> is GUID=N,UID=N
[05:10] <Se7h> right?
[05:10] <jsubl2> moyogo, mine does not have an icon either
[05:10] <smeggy> Neither.
[05:12] <partially> i have a shuttle SB65G2 with a WD Raptor drive with a Plextor dvd/cd rewriter and durring the begining of the install it askes for a floppy or for me to select the correct modules
[05:12] <togs> partially, i did, but that was on an old box. it worked fine in this one :)
[05:12] <partially> twenty minutes later, I found out none of the modules worked
[05:12] <togs> i couldn't tell you why though :)
[05:13] <partially> togs: this box is supported fine under debian, and seeing as ubuntu is basically "fancy" debian, I am not to sure why it does not work
[05:13] <Hrdwr_BoB> well it does have an entirely different kernel
[05:13] <togs> mate, if you're using debian, you know more then I :)
[05:15] <partially> togs: heh, i *started* with debian a year ago, it was not the best choice to start with =p
[05:15] <togs> I just can't get my other XP box on the net through ipmasq, is all :)
[05:15] <togs> lol
[05:15] <togs> ubuntu is my first real linux experience for about a year or so
[05:16] <partially> Hrdwr_BoB: i had kernel 2.6.8-smp and debian installed fine on this computer, no problems, so i don't think it is the kernel
[05:17] <partially> ubuntu uses 2.6.8, correct?
[05:17] <Hrdwr_BoB> yes
[05:17] <robertj> Can anyone test out a possible rhythmbox bug here?
[05:18] <smeggy> Sure.
[05:18] <partially> robertj: i am game
[05:18] <robertj> Start Rhythmbox for the first time and then ask it to search on an sftp:// loc for your library
[05:19] <Se7h> i got a locker on my pasted files
[05:20] <Se7h> what does that mean =?
[05:20] <reddawn> 9OOD JO8 0N th3 d1s+rI8U+ION5 GUY5 
[05:21] <smeggy> Must you speak like that?
[05:21] <neighborlee> is there a fix for the mplayer weirdness ?LOL
[05:21] <reddawn> fine danmm.. 
[05:21] <partially> reddawn: i am not digging the caps
[05:21] <partially> heh
[05:21] <reddawn> anyways why is Gnome the default desktop!
[05:21] <wm_eddie> I knew it!
[05:21] <partially> why not! =p
[05:21] <reddawn> It sucks
[05:21] <wm_eddie> reddawn: Same reason KDE is the default on others.
[05:22] <reddawn> KD3 r0x0Rez 
[05:22] <neighborlee> reddawn, cause gnome rulez
[05:22] <reddawn> na..
[05:22] <neighborlee> wm_eddie, heh exactly
[05:22] <reddawn> gnome not much eyecandy..
[05:22] <partially> exactly
[05:22] <wm_eddie> reddawn: It has plenty.
[05:22] <smeggy> If you don't like it, install KDE.
[05:22] <smeggy> Simple.
[05:22] <reddawn> not by default
[05:22] <reddawn> i did
[05:22] <reddawn> hehe..
[05:22] <smo> I'd love to see r0x0Rez on a nice ibm-style advert
[05:22] <reddawn> kde 3.3
[05:22] <robertj> partially: did you get the same result?
[05:22] <smeggy> Then what is the problem?
[05:22] <partially> robertj: yes
[05:22] <reddawn> just asking why gnome was default
[05:23] <smeggy> Gnome is the default because there are Gnome developers working on Ubuntu.
[05:23] <robertj> I guess the next question is, anyone got a fedora 2 system laying around to test on?
[05:23] <wm_eddie> reddawn: Because it's the favorite.
[05:23] <smeggy> And Gnome is a sensible choice for a desktop oriented OS.
[05:23] <reddawn> oh ok. that explains
[05:23] <reddawn> it
[05:23] <reddawn> 1 think5 uBuNTU 15 9R3@T @Nd W1+h kD3 Th4t sh1T R0X0R eVeN M0R3! 
[05:23] <reddawn> hehe.
[05:23] <neighborlee> smeggy, yes that too...gnome being the one truly GPL wm doesn't hurt either <wink>
[05:23] <neighborlee> ;-)lol
[05:23] <smeggy> Please don't talk like that, reddawn.
[05:23] <smeggy> neighborlee, ;)
[05:23] <reddawn> I use Gentoo
[05:23] <wm_eddie> neighborlee: it's not a wm...
[05:23] <wm_eddie> I knew it!
[05:24] <togs> 2.8 is a big improvemnt over the version in RH 7.3, anyway :)
[05:24] <robertj> partially: have any other boxes to test rb on?
[05:24] <robertj> I nuked my f2 partition a few weeks ago
[05:24] <wm_eddie> reddawn had Gentoo/KDE ____ written all over him
[05:24] <smeggy> lol
[05:24] <neighborlee> heh
[05:24] <partially> i have a debian box and a suse
[05:24] <reddawn>   ____            _                ____                         
[05:24] <reddawn>  / ___| ___ _ __ | |_ ___   ___   |  _ \ _____  _____  _ __ ___ 
[05:24] <reddawn> | |  _ / _ \ '_ \| __/ _ \ / _ \  | |_) / _ \ \/ / _ \| '__/ __|
[05:24] <reddawn> | |_| |  __/ | | | || (_) | (_) | |  _ < (_) >  < (_) | |  \__ \
[05:24] <reddawn>  \____|\___|_| |_|\__\___/ \___/  |_| \_\___/_/\_\___/|_|  |___/
[05:24] <reddawn> 
[05:24] <partially> no fedora
[05:24] <smeggy> You can smell the Gentoo users a mile off..
[05:24] <reddawn> yup
[05:24] <reddawn> what wrong with gentoo?
[05:24] <smeggy> Actually, I lie.
[05:24] <wm_eddie> reddawn: everything.
[05:24] <smeggy> You can't smell them.
[05:24] <reddawn> like?
[05:24] <robertj> partially: anything besides sid that might have rb .8 series?
[05:24] <smeggy> You can smell their CPUs melting, from all that compiling.
[05:24] <neighborlee> reddawn, gentoo is fine..IF you dont mind compiling yourself into oblivion..SOME of us have lives outside of GCC
[05:25] <smeggy> That, and the .00005% speed increases they pull from their arse.
[05:25] <reddawn> hehehe not really if you have a fsck 3.4Ht
[05:25] <reddawn> 2Gb ram
[05:25] <smeggy> They smell a bit too.
[05:25] <neighborlee> wm_eddie, cuse me yes..its a desktop ENV>...metacity is our beloved WM LOL
[05:25] <partially> robertj: no
[05:25] <smeggy> <3 metacity
[05:25] <reddawn> you are just a freaking Debian.. no0b
[05:25] <wm_eddie> reddawn: http://www.funroll-loops.org/
[05:25] <reddawn> na.. thanks
[05:25] <smeggy> Who wants to take bets on how old reddawn is?
[05:25] <wm_eddie> just look there, and get embarrased.
[05:25] <reddawn> see what i mean..
[05:25] <smeggy> I'm saying 14.
[05:25] <wm_eddie> 15
[05:25] <reddawn> hehe.. not even.
[05:25] <partially> 14
[05:25] <reddawn> nope
[05:25] <partially> 13
[05:26] <smeggy> Oh, 12?
[05:26] <reddawn> Debian users i knew it..
[05:26] <reddawn> lol
[05:26] <smeggy> Hey, at least we have a sense of humour.
[05:26] <togs> why come in here if you are only gonna slag off debian?
[05:26] <reddawn> im not!
[05:26] <smeggy> And a life outside of recompiling our systems.
[05:26] <neighborlee> reddawn, is there anything else ?<G>
[05:26] <reddawn> you guys are bashing on Gentoo
[05:26] <smeggy> No we're not.
[05:26] <reddawn> did i say anything bad about debian
[05:26] <neighborlee> j/k of course..but you kinda had that coming ;-)
[05:26] <smeggy> We respect Gentoo.  That doesn't mean we have to use it.
[05:26] <smeggy> Right guys? :)
[05:26] <wm_eddie> reddawn: Gentoo is just a bad idea.
[05:26] <neighborlee> exactly
[05:26] <reddawn> thats right..
[05:26] <wasabi> i don't respect gentoo.
[05:26] <reddawn> u dont have to use it..
[05:26] <wm_eddie> I know, because I'm using it right now.
[05:26] <partially> i very much like gentoo, i just did not like the package system over debian
[05:26] <wasabi> am i suspose to?
[05:27] <smo> it's certainly a user-case that ubuntu doesn't cater to .. horses for courses
[05:27] <reddawn> nope
[05:27] <partially> emerge vs. apt-get, apt-get wins in my book
[05:27] <reddawn> I like both Debian and Gentoo
[05:27] <neighborlee> smo, lol
[05:27] <wm_eddie> apt-get > emerge definately
[05:27] <partially> heh
[05:27] <wm_eddie> nothing is more annoying than waiting half an hour, to see it fail!!!
[05:27] <wm_eddie> grr..
[05:27] <neighborlee> lol
[05:27] <smeggy> It doesn't really matter.
[05:27] <reddawn> na.. that cuz you people run freaking i386's
[05:27] <glens> why can't we all just get along? :-)
[05:27] <reddawn> lol
[05:27] <smeggy> This is the whole point of free software.
[05:27] <smeggy> Choice.
[05:28] <neighborlee> glens, we can and usually DO
[05:28] <wm_eddie> reddawn: or perhaps I have a Athlon-64...
[05:28] <neighborlee> reddawn, its all personal taste ;-)
[05:28] <reddawn> i dont have have to wait half an hour i wait secons on my 3.4HT
[05:28] <reddawn> so...
[05:28] <reddawn> same shit..
[05:28] <neighborlee> reddawn, some use JUST ubunt and some multi boot into oblivion LOL
[05:28] <smeggy> rofl.  I'd like to see you compile KDE in "seconds" on your mythical "uber beast".
[05:28] <neighborlee> ubuntu
[05:28] <reddawn> i have a dual Opteron and u dont see me bitching?
[05:28] <smeggy> I thought it was  Pentium?
[05:28] <wasabi> has ubuntu made any comments about what type of java support they might be doing?
[05:28] <smeggy> You seem quite confused.
[05:28] <reddawn> dont be stupid of course it will take a while.
[05:28] <phr0stbyte> Has any1 got an nVidia card running with the nVidia drivers here?
[05:28] <Kosai> wasabi: Yes.  Read the FAQ.
[05:29] <smeggy> phr0stbyte, yes.
[05:29] <reddawn> I have a P4 3.4HT as my main righ..
[05:29] <neighborlee> phr0stbyte, yes they work fine
[05:29] <reddawn> my server is a dual opteron 2.0
[05:29] <smeggy> reddawn, We really don't care.
[05:29] <reddawn> Get it!
[05:29] <phr0stbyte> smeggy: I cant get mine going....
[05:29] <phr0stbyte> =(
[05:29] <wm_eddie> I need to get both Java 5.0 and Java 1.4 on my laptop.
[05:29] <reddawn> They you ask?
[05:29] <smeggy> phr0stbyte, What's happening?
[05:29] <wm_eddie> (I need 1.4 for homework)
[05:29] <smeggy> reddawn, I didn't.
[05:29] <neighborlee> phr0stbyte, hmm what have you tried so far
[05:29] <partially> reddawn: you have told us abotu your computers and we are overly impressed, *new* topic
[05:29] <reddawn> Debian users..
[05:29] <smeggy> Yes, we're so impressed, we just can't bring ourselves to mention them again.
[05:29] <reddawn> sigh.
[05:30] <smeggy> Because if we mention these extremely high powered machines, we may cry.

[05:30] <partially> heh
[05:30] <wm_eddie> reddawn: Gentoo user... :p
[05:30] <wm_eddie> lol
[05:30] <reddawn> HOw @B0u+ J00 GUy5 JUS+ shUt +He FUxOR UP 4nD +4Lk 48OU+ $0MeTHinG eL53! 
[05:30] <phr0stbyte> smeggy: It works fine with just the "nv" driver, but when I change it to "nvidia" it borks out saying no usable screens
[05:30] <smeggy> We've been suggesting that for ages.
[05:30] <reddawn> apt-get install nvidia-gls i think  phr0stbyte
[05:30] <reddawn> apt-get install nvidia-glx i think  phr0stbyte*
[05:31] <neighborlee> phr0stbyte, reddawn is correct..then there is one command you run afterwards which sets the 3d driver up
[05:31] <reddawn> then modprobe nvidia
[05:31] <reddawn> not it should do it automatically
[05:31] <neighborlee> phr0stbyte, ie: you dont have to edit XF86Config anymore
[05:31] <reddawn> that how i did on my Ubuntu box
[05:31] <smeggy> Don't edit the X config file
[05:31] <neighborlee> no I mean to enable 3d..
[05:32] <wm_eddie> phr0stbyte: in fact do not ever edit XF86Config ever again.
[05:32] <smeggy> Because you'll break dpkg's handling of it.
[05:32] <reddawn> apt-get nvidia-glx, modprobe nvidia, edit xf84config and change the nv to nvidia
[05:32] <partially> how stable is ubuntu? i am thinking about implementing it on one of my server, any thoughts?
[05:32] <neighborlee> no
[05:32] <reddawn> Really stable for me atleast
[05:32] <neighborlee> partially, can't imagine any trouble you'd have
[05:32] <wm_eddie> reddawn: you sure? I thought dkpg handled that?
[05:32] <neighborlee> partially, its as stable as debian so far that i can see
[05:32] <wasabi> partially: it's debian.
[05:32] <reddawn> yes but i didnt need to do that. thouhg
[05:32] <smeggy> phr0stbyte, Install the module.  Do sudo modprobe nvidia.  Then run sudo dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xfree86
[05:32] <partially> wasabi: heh
[05:33] <wasabi> partially: mostly it's just debian with a more appropiate management structure. ie, releases.
[05:33] <reddawn> true..
[05:33] <reddawn> good point
[05:33] <wasabi> and a very nice default set up
[05:33] <neighborlee> wasabi, yup
[05:33] <partially> does it use XFree or X.org?
[05:33] <phr0stbyte> Doing it now
[05:33] <wasabi> XFree.
[05:33] <wm_eddie> I'm thinking about changing this system to Ubuntu... but other than the sometimes frustrating failed e-builds, It's not too bad.
[05:33] <smeggy> Its a polished Debiant without ancient packages.
[05:33] <reddawn> Xfree :(
[05:33] <normnmiles> but xorg next release
[05:33] <neighborlee> wasabi, very nice default setup..i WAS impressed having sound with gnome out of the box ;-))..very kewl
[05:33] <reddawn> nice..
[05:33] <reddawn> Xorg is fucking fast!
[05:33] <tony> smeggy...
[05:33] <partially> normnmiles: nice
[05:33] <smeggy> Yeah?
[05:33] <wm_eddie> I still use XFree :)
[05:33] <wasabi> I imagine XFree will hang around under debian gets xorg packaged (which I think it waiting for it to be modulized?)
[05:34] <reddawn> lol..
[05:34] <partially> i really hope debian also moves to x.org soon
[05:34] <stuckupfool> can Anone tell me what version of the kernel ubuntu 4.1 preview uses?
[05:34] <reddawn> it really fast
[05:34] <wm_eddie> because I have no want to compile X.
[05:34] <reddawn> 2.6.8.1
[05:34] <wasabi> partially: not until after sarge
[05:34] <stuckupfool> thanks
[05:34] <smeggy> Does it really matter if we use x.org or xfree, because as far as your average desktop system is concerned, it doesn't matter.
[05:34] <reddawn> ur welcome
[05:34] <reddawn> Xorg is faster
[05:34] <wasabi> smeggy: XDamage.
[05:34] <tony> ready for more questions?
[05:34] <wasabi> xorg isn't really faster.
[05:34] <smeggy> Nothing really noticable.
[05:34] <reddawn> a complete rewrite and taking stuff out that dont work
[05:34] <smeggy> Go ahead lol.
[05:34] <wasabi> and Composite support, which works for me. ;0
[05:34] <reddawn> it starts up faster!
[05:35] <wm_eddie> reddawn: X takes about 1 second to boot on this thing.
[05:35] <tony> lol
[05:35] <smo> I'll admit I just want some of that transparency crack .. eventually
[05:35] <reddawn> mine too..
[05:35] <wm_eddie> gnome is what takes the longest.
[05:35] <partially> smeggy: x.org is a *little* faster, but i just like how fast the [project has been moving, whereas xfree is moving like a snail =p
[05:35] <wasabi> reddawn: xorg isn't a complete rewrite....
[05:35] <reddawn> not really
[05:35] <wasabi> reddawn: xorg is nothing other than xfree forked
[05:35] <tony> Trying to install amule
[05:35] <normnmiles> checked out the wiki and they have xorg scheduled for hoary.
[05:35] <wm_eddie> I do want that shadow hack too :(
[05:35] <normnmiles> with some mods like transparency
[05:35] <wm_eddie> I'm a sucker for eyecandy I must admit.
[05:35] <reddawn> true but with the useless shit taken out..
[05:35] <smeggy> partially, Yeah, totally. I'm all for the move to x.org.  I'm just saying, that from a users POF, it doesn't really matter ATM.
[05:35] <wasabi> Xorg does not have transparency
[05:35] <wasabi> it has composite support.
[05:36] <reddawn> On my gentoo it does.!
[05:36] <phr0stbyte> smeggy: Then restart x?
[05:36] <reddawn> sudo killall -ABRT gdm  killall -ABRT X
[05:36] <smo> okay, I'll admit my n00bness and rephrase  "I want something resembling kp's screenshots".  I'm honest  lol
[05:36] <smeggy> phr0stbyte, yep.
[05:37] <wm_eddie> It's pretty sick, but it's not really needed, I'll manage.
[05:37] <reddawn> i need to add ram to this testbox
[05:37] <wm_eddie> I'd rather wait for "real" transparancy and shadows, not just a hack.
[05:37] <smo> well yeah .. following gnome's time-based releases is what sold me.  but I can dream of more candy
[05:37] <reddawn> KDE
[05:37] <reddawn> hehe.
[05:37] <reddawn> sorry guys
[05:37] <smeggy> I prefer no transparency.  It gets in the way IMO.
[05:38] <reddawn> sometimes yes..
[05:38] <partially> KDE is way to clubbered for me
[05:38] <wm_eddie> I used to be into KDE, but now --I don't know-- its strange.
[05:38] <reddawn> ehh people have theirs tastes..
[05:38] <reddawn> i use fluxbox sometimes
[05:38] <reddawn> well on my server i use fluxbox
[05:38] <wm_eddie> I use XFCE4 on my laptop :) It's awesome.
[05:38] <reddawn> on my desktop kde
[05:38] <normnmiles> reddawn you ever try xfce4?
[05:39] <partially> reddawn: fluxbox is not bad at all, and it is pretty speedy
[05:39] <reddawn> nope is it nice/
[05:39] <smeggy> I use Mac OSX on my laptop ;)
[05:39] <normnmiles> very nice
[05:39] <reddawn> do you have some shots?
[05:39] <wm_eddie> It's really nice, with a lot of features.
[05:39] <reddawn> nice..
[05:39] <normnmiles> wm_eddie stole my thunder  :(
[05:39] <reddawn> i might just look into that
[05:39] <wm_eddie> reddawn: they also have flash animations of it working
[05:39] <reddawn> link?
[05:39] <wm_eddie> http://www.xfce.org/index.php?page=screenshots&lang=en
[05:40] <reddawn> hey guys are we getting forums.. thanks let me check it out
[05:40] <wm_eddie> flash files are at the bottom of the page.
[05:40] <normnmiles> yes they are working on it
[05:40] <Se7h> can anyone tell me where i can get totem-xine from apt-get?
[05:40] <smeggy> They'd better hurry.
[05:40] <smeggy> I want my forums!
[05:40] <Se7h> i reinstalled ubuntu
[05:40] <phr0stbyte> Thanx all! nVidia driver is running!!!
[05:40] <neighborlee> phr0stbyte, kewl ;-)
[05:40] <Se7h> so i've lost the sources i had
[05:40] <wm_eddie> reddawn: I can't say much for it's file browser though.
[05:41] <neighborlee> phr0stbyte, now get those kewl linux native games! ;-)heh
[05:41] <reddawn> Woahh  im inpressed!
[05:41] <neighborlee> phr0stbyte, heh
[05:41] <smeggy> phr0stbyte, good job :)
[05:41] <reddawn> fast and nice eyecandy
[05:41] <wm_eddie> but Rox Filer is a good and very fast alternative
[05:41] <reddawn> yup..
[05:41] <reddawn> it is rox r0x
[05:41] <neighborlee> wm_eddie, never tried it but I know of it..i prefer gentoo FM &/or nautilus
[05:41] <phr0stbyte> Now I can install UT2004!
[05:41] <reddawn> lol
[05:41] <smeggy> How'd you get it going phr0stbyte?
[05:41] <neighborlee> gentoo is so light and very customizeable
[05:41] <reddawn> got it? phr0stbyte?
[05:41] <flamesrock> hey, I'm curious, has anyone recieved their free cd's?
[05:41] <phr0stbyte> smeggy: xactly as you said
[05:41] <flamesrock> I can't wait to install
[05:41] <phr0stbyte> thanx
[05:41] <smeggy> phr0stbyte, ah good. :)
[05:42] <reddawn> 3d working nice..
[05:42] <normnmiles> warty hasn't been finalized yet i don't think.
[05:42] <reddawn> cant live withoug 3d
[05:42] <normnmiles> middle of oct
[05:42] <flamesrock> ah
[05:42] <wm_eddie> reddawn: have you tried that Java3d WM?
[05:42] <reddawn> been wanting too.. havent gotten around too..
[05:42] <reddawn> looks kinda sexy and resource hungry
[05:43] <stuckupfool> can anyone direct me towards a good article on setting up ALSA in ubuntu?
[05:43] <reddawn> it should work already stuckupfool!
[05:43] <hello> stuckupfool: it didn't set it up automatically?
[05:43] <phr0stbyte> 4975 frames in 5.0 seconds = 995.000 FPS
[05:43] <phr0stbyte> 4940 frames in 5.0 seconds = 988.000 FPS
[05:43] <phr0stbyte> 4938 frames in 5.0 seconds = 987.600 FPS
[05:43] <phr0stbyte> 4946 frames in 5.0 seconds = 989.200 FPS
[05:43] <phr0stbyte> 4974 frames in 5.0 seconds = 994.800 FPS
[05:43] <phr0stbyte> not bad...
[05:43] <reddawn> open up a console and type  alsamixer
[05:43] <stuckupfool> I can't hear things so I'd say its not working
[05:43] <reddawn> and unmute everything
[05:43] <smeggy> reddawn, sexy and resource hungry eh? Sounds like KDE! :P
[05:43] <wm_eddie> 12498 frames in 5.0 seconds = 2499.600 FPS
[05:43] <wm_eddie> pwned :p
[05:43] <reddawn> hehe.. punk..
[05:43] <reddawn> lol
[05:44] <reddawn> holly shit... really pwned!!
[05:44] <phr0stbyte> wm_eeddie: you suck
[05:44] <wm_eddie> hehe
[05:44] <reddawn> heheh
[05:44] <phr0stbyte> wm_eeddie: my card is several years old....
[05:45] <reddawn> mines suck on here!
[05:45] <phr0stbyte> gotta get a new one soon
[05:45] <reddawn> this is my test system :(
[05:45] <reddawn> Equinox-Specs:  | Linux 2.6.8.1-2-386 | AMD Athlon(tm) Processor 748.856 MHz | Bogomips: 1474.56 | Mem: 144/314M [||||||||||]  | Diskspace: 84.78G Free: 46.87G | Procs: 88 | Uptime: 50 mins 10 secs | Load: 0.08 0.15 0.16 | Vpenis: 31.5 inches | Screen: @1024x768 (24 bpp) Core: 149.788 MHz Memory: 182.952 MHz Wifi: In: 9.56M Out: 2.71M 
[05:45] <wm_eddie> phr0stbyte: Just save up about $200 and you can get a real nice one.
[05:45] <reddawn> see..
[05:45] <wm_eddie> please no scripts.
[05:45] <reddawn> why not?
[05:45] <smeggy> Because they're annoying.
[05:46] <reddawn> ehhh.. shit atleast im not flooding
[05:46] <phr0stbyte> Linux Phr0sty 2.6.8.1-3-686 #1 Thu Sep 30 13:50:46 BST 2004 i686 GNU/Linux
[05:46] <reddawn> how come there is not OP
[05:46] <wm_eddie> because then this room will become like #DDRManiaX  with scripts going by so much you can't read what people are saying.
[05:46] <smeggy> Because FreeNode network policy encourages operators not to remain opped.
[05:46] <reddawn> im not like that i was just showing you guys how shitty the system is and how fast Ubuntu runs
[05:46] <partially> how is the packaege count for ubuntu compared to debian
[05:46] <reddawn> thats all
[05:46] <reddawn> sorry
[05:47] <reddawn> no wonder otw moved to Efnet
[05:47] <reddawn> hehe
[05:47] <phr0stbyte> No MPlayer in Ubuntu?!?!?!
[05:47] <hello> uh
[05:47] <smeggy> Just use Totem. ;)
[05:47] <reddawn> apt-get install mplayer
[05:47] <wm_eddie> phr0stbyte: http://www.arslinux.com/~jorge/sources.list
[05:47] <hello> apt-get install mplayer
[05:47] <wm_eddie> mplayer stuffs for ubuntu
[05:47] <hello> besides, totem is better :-)
[05:47] <wm_eddie> yeah totem is better.
[05:47] <phr0stbyte> hello: no way
[05:48] <wm_eddie> anyone know where I can get totem-xine?
[05:48] <reddawn> use synaptic to search for it!
[05:48] <reddawn> Google is your friend!
[05:48] <smeggy> It's not in the default Ubuntu repos.
[05:48] <reddawn> !google totem-xine
[05:48] <wm_eddie> I mean, like non-retarded totem-xine
[05:48] <reddawn> shit wrong channel
[05:48] <normnmiles> partially, check out components section on website.
[05:49] <smo> the testing component of the debian-marilliat (google for mirrors) appears to work ok .. but it's of dubious legallity, so don't expect it in universe any time soon
[05:49] <wm_eddie> reddawn: I'm asking for something I can put in my apt sources
[05:49] <reddawn> im recompilling my Ubunto kernel
[05:49] <reddawn> oh ok..
[05:50] <smeggy> totem-xine is in Universe.
[05:50] <wm_eddie> smeggy: non-retarted version?
[05:50] <smeggy> Define what you mean by "retarded"?
[05:50] <reddawn> not many things are included
[05:50] <reddawn> wont play certain files
[05:50] <reddawn> because of the copyright shit.
[05:50] <wm_eddie> Can't play certain file formats because of legality issues.
[05:50] <reddawn> yup
[05:51] <smeggy> You'll just have to try it and see.
[05:51] <smeggy> But I'm guessing its probably "retarded".
[05:51] <reddawn> i had to get w32codec to play WMA files on xine and mplayer
[05:51] <neighborlee> so anyone know how to stop the weird /dev/mixer 'flashing dialog warning' problem with mplayer ?
[05:51] <neighborlee> and yes I do have libdvscss2 installed
[05:51] <reddawn> got me there.. buddy
[05:51] <neighborlee> me too lol
[05:51] <wm_eddie> But unfortunately I can't get sound working so it doesn't matter yet.
[05:52] <neighborlee> never seen this behavior b4
[05:52] <wm_eddie> I need alsaconf T_T
[05:52] <reddawn> im updating udev, base layout
[05:52] <reddawn> and recompiling my Ubuntu kernel some missing modules issues
[05:53] <phr0stbyte> wm_eeddie: Wont the Debian packages in some of those sources break Ubuntu?
[05:53] <reddawn> does it even detect your soundcard wm_eddie?
[05:53] <wm_eddie> phr0stbyte: That's why I'm asking for people with experience.
[05:54] <wm_eddie> reddawn: I have a IBM 400E, Alsaconf detects it correctly.  It's kind of hard to explain.
[05:54] <wm_eddie> The souncard has Legacy emulation.
[05:54] <reddawn> ok..
[05:54] <wm_eddie> and the cs45XX driver doesn't work correctly.
[05:54] <reddawn> does it show up in /dev/
[05:55] <wm_eddie> so you just force alsa to use the legacy card, and it works perfect.
[05:55] <reddawn> oh ok..
[05:55] <reddawn> cuz i had a same problem kinda like yours..
[05:55] <reddawn> but it turned out that it was my tv-tuner sound card
[05:55] <wm_eddie> and they removed alsaconf because it was buggy (last time I checked)
[05:56] <reddawn> apt-get alsaconf  if your afraid that it will bork your system.. just backup /etc
[05:56] <reddawn> apt-get install alsa-utils
[05:56] <partially> wm_eddie: the latest testing release of it on debian still had alsaconf
[05:57] <wm_eddie> I guess I'll do an apt-get update and try installing alsa-utils again.
[05:57] <reddawn> try that..
[05:58] <wm_eddie> It's not too much of a problem. I use the laptop mainly for homework.
[05:58] <reddawn> have you tried recompiling your kernel?
[05:58] <normnmiles> anyone have know of a wireless pcmia card that works with ubuntu?
[05:59] <reddawn> i guess anything with a Prism chipset in it!
[05:59] <wm_eddie> 15014 frames in 5.0 seconds = 3002.800 FPS
[05:59] <wm_eddie> normnmiles: my orinoco gold card works fine.
[06:00] <normnmiles> wm_eddie, thanks!
[06:00] <reddawn> it is the prism chipset?
[06:01] <wm_eddie> hm...
[06:01] <reddawn> lspci ??
[06:01] <wm_eddie> good question.  It uses the orinoco_cs driver.
[06:01] <wm_eddie> I'd have to boot my laptop.
[06:01] <reddawn> no its okay
[06:01] <reddawn> it prob does
[06:01] <LinuxJones> night all
[06:01] <reddawn> nite
[06:02] <jayeola_afk> g'nite
[06:02] <partially> c ya
[06:02] <phr0stbyte> wm_eeddie: Now all I gotta do is get this Wacom Graphire3 working, and I'll be set!
[06:02] <phr0stbyte> (easier said than done)
[06:02] <wm_eddie> You're on your own there, I've never even seen a wacom...
[06:02] <phr0stbyte> Its a drawing tablet
[06:03] <partially> phr0stbyte: let me know if you get it working, my nextproject is getting linux on my toshiba m200 tablet pc; uses a wacom tablet
[06:03] <Se7h> can anyone tell me where i can get totem-xine from apt-get 
[06:03] <Se7h> and j2sdk1.4
[06:03] <jayeola_afk> Se7h: prolly da weirs
[06:03] <phr0stbyte> partially: From what I have read, it does work - IF you can ever get it configured correctly
[06:04] <phr0stbyte> very few have
[06:04] <jayeola_afk> -dag-
[06:04] <partially> heh
[06:04] <wm_eddie> Se7h: check out the site for info about Java.
[06:04] <Se7h> jayeola_afk wha ?
[06:04] <jayeola_afk> http://dag.wieers.com/
[06:04] <neighborlee> Se7h, just uncomment out the sources.list section universe and update and voila...
[06:04] <Se7h> wm_eddie k ty
[06:04] <jayeola_afk> try there, a massive repo
[06:05] <jayeola_afk> but do what neighborlee said. /etc/aspt/sources.list
[06:05] <jayeola_afk> uncomment the urls and you are away
[06:06] <[rain] > anyone have a clue why apm doesn't work with my bx-board in ubuntu? at least not when shutting down
[06:06] <Se7h> one more thing
[06:06] <phr0stbyte> rain: dissabled in the kernel?
[06:07] <Se7h> how do i list the available partitions?
[06:07] <Se7h> fdisk -l ?
[06:07] <wm_eddie> df?
[06:07] <[rain] > phr0stbyte: I haven't changed anything. It's vanilla ubuntu. Could be disabled by default you mean?
[06:08] <phr0stbyte> rain: could be
[06:08] <wm_eddie> Se7h: I can't seem to find that Java info right now, I'm looking
[06:08] <nate> so I am still getting used to the Debian way of doing things
[06:08] <nate> I take it Debian has no conception of a 'service'?
[06:08] <wm_eddie> ?
[06:08] <nate> I miss SysV init
[06:08] <wasabi> huh?
[06:08] <wasabi> debian is sysv init
[06:08] <nate> it is? Hmm
[06:08] <wasabi>  /etc/init.d
[06:09] <[rain] > phr0stbyte: hm, setting the screen to standy seems to work though. so at least there's some support
[06:09] <phr0stbyte> rain: you can check by going to the kernel header directory and running "make mrproper" and then "make menuconfig"
[06:09] <nate> then why is there no GUI tool for managing services like there is in Fedora?
[06:09] <wasabi> GUI == sysv init?
[06:09] <wasabi> suprise!
[06:09] <wasabi> because nobody wrote one?
[06:09] <jayeola_afk> Se7h: df -h
[06:09] <nate> wasabi: Red Hat have one, one would think it would be trivial to port across to Debian 
[06:09] <jayeola_afk> and mount -l
[06:10] <nate> and in the Fedora world such a tool is the very first thing you look at after installing
[06:10] <wm_eddie> [rain] : You could do it if you wanted to but it's not really that hard to edit text files.
[06:10] <nate> which surprises me that it's not there
[06:10] <[rain] > phr0stbyte: oh joy. I haven't touched a kernel config in years. about time I guess :)
[06:10] <wm_eddie> oops I didn't main rain I meant nate
[06:10] <[rain] > wm_eddie: I could probably do it too ;)
[06:10] <wm_eddie> [rain] : you could try booting with apm=on 
[06:11] <phr0stbyte> I got all my RAM reading now....
[06:11] <neighborlee> k dunno why but mplayer is borked here...totem-xine works fine for my dvd player it seems...I checked bugzilla but I found nothing for mplayer so I guess i'd better file one ;-) ( unless someone knows something about this that Idont?)
[06:11] <nate> there's no chkconfig either
[06:12] <nate> how can one admin SysV init without a chkconfig?
[06:12] <wasabi> huh?
[06:12] <wasabi> update-rc.d
[06:12] <jh|home> move them manually
[06:12] <wasabi> or make symlinks
[06:12] <nate> oww
[06:12] <nate> that's pretty primitive
[06:12] <wm_eddie> nate: or pretty advanced...
[06:12] <jh|home> heheh
[06:12] <nate> what's advanced about having to do that
[06:12] <nate> I can do that in Red Hat if I want to
[06:13] <nate> but chkconfig makes it a bit simpler to avoid shooting oneself in foot
[06:13] <wasabi> you aim at your feet?
[06:13] <wm_eddie> I aim at my head
[06:13] <nate> okay
[06:13] <nate> let me start again
[06:13] <nate> what is the Preferred Standard Debian Way of getting a list of what services are currently active and running for one's runlevel?
[06:13] <jh|home> a small perl script could do chkconfig's job too
[06:14] <nate> yes. Is such a small perl script provided?
[06:14] <wasabi> nate, look in /etc/rc*
[06:14] <jh|home> look in your runlevel directory
[06:14] <nate> hmm
[06:14] <nate> does that show the xinetd services also?
[06:14] <wm_eddie> nate: I'm sure there's something in universe that can guify that
[06:14] <wasabi> or write a nice program and share it all with us
[06:14] <jh|home> man, we want everything these days
[06:14] <wasabi> no. xinet != sysv init
[06:14] <nate> yes
[06:14] <wasabi> no joke!
[06:14] <nate> however, chkconfig also shows xinetd services
[06:14] <wasabi> you could use gst
[06:14] <nate> this is why such a program is a very useful thing
[06:14] <wasabi> g-s-t
[06:14] <wasabi> but i dislike it quite a bit
[06:14] <wm_eddie> nate: have you tried apt-get install chkconfig?
[06:14] <nate> and has been around for years in Red Hat
[06:14] <q2> Wow, this is my first day of using Ubuntu, AND I FUCKING LOVE THIS SHIT!
[06:15] <smeggy> As do I.
[06:15] <wm_eddie> q2: I'm glad you've seen the light.
[06:15] <q2> I love Debian based Distros
[06:15] <jh|home> hrmm
[06:15] <jh|home> wm_eddie, he just called it shit
[06:15] <nate> wm_eddie: could not find package chkconfig
[06:15] <jh|home> hehe
[06:15] <jh|home> :)
[06:15] <q2> Ubuntu, SuSe, And Libranet are my favorite!
[06:15] <wasabi> chkconfig is a redhat tool
[06:15] <smeggy> Suse isn't Debian based ;)
[06:15] <wm_eddie> nate: well at least we tried :)
[06:15] <q2> i know
[06:15] <q2> i still love it
[06:15] <[rain] > "No APM support in kernel"
[06:15] <nate> Redhat does not mean not-open-source
[06:16] <jayeola_afk> is there an ascii art app?
[06:16] <nate> so, let me get this straight
[06:16] <wasabi> nate then port it
[06:16] <q2> its blackjack time
[06:16] <nate> the normal, preferred, Debian way is to manually hack the rc*.d symlinks?
[06:16] <nate> this is what people do?
[06:16] <wm_eddie> nate: what is it you want to do anyway?
[06:16] <phr0stbyte> DVD is playing nicely with MPlayer...
[06:16] <jh|home> thats what i do
[06:16] <nate> wm_eddie I want to find out what services are active
[06:16] <jh|home> its not hard
[06:16] <nate> so as to know what I am vulnerable to
[06:16] <wm_eddie> nate: I haven't really ever messed with any of that.
[06:17] <wasabi> nate, no, update-rc.d
[06:17] <jh|home> in your rc.* directory they are labeled with an S in your init default
[06:17] <nate> what does update-rc.d do?
[06:17] <nate> is that the Debian equivalent of chkconfig?
[06:17] <jh|home> thats the possible service that could be running...but your best off just doing ps aux and see what service are active..
[06:17] <wasabi> nate, not really, try it
[06:18] <nate> hmm
[06:18] <nate> that's better, yes
[06:18] <wasabi> i'd question why you had a service installed you didn't want running
[06:18] <nate> looks like it can do everything except list currently running services
[06:18] <nate> wasabi: because sometimes you don't want to delete all your installation files just to disable a service
[06:18] <nate> also because I don't know what Ubuntu has installed by default and I want to sanity-check it
[06:18] <wasabi> nate, then don't.
[06:19] <jh|home> i hope you never run into an old linux install somewhere nate :P
[06:19] <nate> wasabi: er?
[06:19] <wasabi> ps
[06:19] <[rain] > so in other words the kernel is configured without APM support by default in Ubuntu? isn't that rather wierd?
[06:19] <jh|home> "boss i know this is a legacy system but i cant secure it because i dont have chkconfig to see what services are running" :P
[06:19] <nate> in that case I would ask why someone was running a system more than five years old, if it were Linux
[06:20] <wm_eddie> [rain] : Because acpi is the new thing.  But people like me who use old cards have to switch to 2.4 :(
[06:20] <wasabi> becuase it worked
[06:20] <wasabi> and never stopped working
[06:20] <jh|home> plenty of reasons
[06:20] <wasabi> welcome to the real world
[06:20] <jh|home> software is one
[06:20] <nate> meh, you Debian people with your supported-forever distributions. :)
[06:20] <nate> in the Redhat world we get our security updates pulled after 18 months and we PAY for that priviledge
[06:21] <wasabi> heh
[06:21] <nate> hence why I am switching away from Fedora. I just miss my creature comforts
[06:21] <wasabi> sounds like a wastge of jmoney
[06:21] <jh|home> security updates is a state of mind, right not the current sudo package in fc2 is vulnerable
[06:21] <wasabi> im sure ubuntu wants all those t hings
[06:21] <wasabi> it's just new.
[06:21] <jh|home> not/now
[06:21] <wasabi> and based on debian, which doesn't want all those things
[06:21] <nate> yeah, I'm just trying to find out how debian people survive
[06:21] <[rain] > nate: why would I buy a new system if the current one works?
[06:21] <nate> presumably there are equivalent tools just under different names
[06:21] <wm_eddie> nate: I'm asking around.
[06:22] <wasabi> nate, not really.
[06:22] <wasabi> nate we configure most stuff in the config files
[06:22] <wasabi> the tools we do have, are non-debian specific
[06:22] <wasabi> such as g-s-t
[06:22] <wasabi> and webmin
[06:22] <nate> chkconfig exists under both redhat and suse
[06:23] <wasabi> then port it
[06:23] <wasabi> and maintain it
[06:23] <wasabi> because nobody else wants to
[06:23] <nate> yeah, I'm just wondering why nobody else has wanted to
[06:23] <jh|home> damn right
[06:23] <nate> there's probably a reason
[06:23] <wasabi> because it serves no purpose
[06:23] <nate> ...
[06:23] <wasabi> ie waste of time.
[06:23] <jh|home> because its not interesting enough to waste energy on IMO
[06:23] <jh|home> there are plenty better things to work on 
[06:24] <jh|home> like figuring out why llvm is not compiling correctly on my amd64..
[06:24] <jh|home> >_<;
[06:24] <wasabi> not don't get me wrong man
[06:24] <nate> interesting
[06:24] <wasabi> i want cool utilities like that
[06:24] <wasabi> but i'd rather for instance have a better init system for
[06:24] <wasabi> first
[06:24] <jh|home> wasabi, admit it..its not _that_ cool..
[06:24] <jh|home> hehe
[06:24] <wasabi> i hate sysv init. =(
[06:24] <nate> this is more in the 'basic essential' rather than 'cool' box IMO
[06:24] <wasabi> i like gentoo's. i'd still it if I could.
[06:24] <nate> ie, I consider it part of a modern SysV system
[06:24] <wasabi> steal
[06:24] <Se7h> jayeola_afk sorry coulnd't get you there?
[06:24] <Se7h> df ?
[06:24] <jh|home> i actually like sysv init
[06:24] <wasabi> it's not
[06:24] <wasabi> chkconfig is redhat
[06:25] <wasabi> nothing to do with sysv
[06:25] <wasabi> sysv is the /etc/init.d and /etc/rc.d* LAYOUT
[06:25] <Mojo_Jojo> Hi, can someone tell me how to add java to my path so I can install my java apps :D
[06:25] <wasabi> read th faq
[06:25] <jayeola_afk> Se7h: are you talking about that url i pasted?
[06:25] <Se7h> hm...maybe
[06:26] <jayeola_afk> oh sorry, 'df -h' shows u disk usage space 
[06:26] <Se7h> i coulnd't understand what it was
[06:26] <wm_eddie> Mojo_Jojo: temporarily export PATH=$PATH:/path/to/java/bin
[06:26] <jayeola_afk> and 'mount -l' shows u all filesystems moumnted right now
[06:26] <Se7h> LOL
[06:26] <Se7h> that path triky trick
[06:26] <Se7h> gave me a pain in the ass
[06:26] <Mojo_Jojo> wm_eddie, how can I make it not temp?
[06:26] <jayeola_afk> ?
[06:27] <nate> hmm. I guess the equivalents for debian would be update-rc.d to change services and 'cat /etc/rc5.d' to list
[06:27] <Se7h> df -h
[06:27] <Se7h> k
[06:27] <Se7h> ty
[06:27] <jayeola_afk> try it
[06:27] <jayeola_afk> tell me what u see
[06:27] <jayeola_afk> there are a few simple ones....
[06:27] <nate> no easy way to see all in one hit what runlevels each service is set to, but since a desktop system only deals with runlevel 5 I guess that's sort of acceptable
[06:27] <wasabi> nate, try g-s-t
[06:27] <wasabi> gnome-system-tools
[06:28] <Se7h> jayeola_afk but i want to see my /hdx partitions (windows)
[06:28] <jayeola_afk> mount -l i think
[06:28] <jayeola_afk> mount -l 
[06:28] <jayeola_afk> try it
[06:28] <jayeola_afk> tell me what u see
[06:28] <nate> is gnome-system-tools installed by default in Ubuntu?
[06:29] <Se7h> that returns the fstab
[06:29] <wasabi> dunno
[06:29] <Se7h> lol
[06:29] <nate> hmm, I appear to have a 'ppp' service
[06:29] <nate> wonder what that is
[06:29] <nate> can't be a ppp server, surely?
[06:30] <nate> must be some kind of dynamic ppp dialer I guess
[06:30] <jayeola_afk> Se7h: try 'man -k mount'
[06:31] <jayeola_afk> that should list all the commands related to 'mount'
[06:31] <jayeola_afk> i have a listing called.....
[06:31] <wm_eddie> hmm, I can't remember how I permanently added java to my path.
[06:31] <jayeola_afk> mmount               (1)  - mount an MSDOS disk
[06:31] <jayeola_afk> and there's a few more
[06:32] <wm_eddie> nate: there's a KDE app called ksysv I think as well.
[06:32] <jayeola_afk> aha. Se7h try also 'man -k msdos'
[06:33] <goatboy> nate: gnome-system-tools is in the default install, but the runlevels tool isn't.
[06:33] <nate> hmm
[06:33] <Se7h> ok
[06:33] <Se7h> but i want a simple think
[06:33] <nate> gnome-system-tools in ubuntu does not seem to have a services manager
[06:33] <Se7h> that is to know my win partitions
[06:33] <Se7h> lol
[06:33] <Se7h> cant remember what command it was...
[06:34] <nate> maybe they decided making services visible would complicate things
[06:34] <goatboy> nate: it's disabled by default upstream.
[06:34] <nate> oh, ah
[06:34] <nate> interesting
[06:34] <nate> so that's a Debian policy decision?
[06:34] <jayeola_afk> Se7h: di you try 'man -k mount' and man -k msdos?
[06:34] <nate> not a Ubuntu one?
[06:34] <Se7h> jayeola_afk yeah
[06:34] <jayeola_afk> and...
[06:34] <goatboy> upstream as in from gnome.org.
[06:35] <q2> i have a problem
[06:35] <nate> curiouser and curiouser
[06:35] <q2> I dont know what my root password is
[06:35] <q2> wtf?
[06:35] <wm_eddie> q2: there is none
[06:35] <q2> i dont think i ever configured one
[06:35] <nate> Ubuntu uses sudo rather than root
[06:35] <wm_eddie> use sudo
[06:35] <q2> kk
[06:35] <jh|home> type it here we will let you know if it sounds familiar
[06:35] <q2> thanks alot
[06:35] <nate> so when it asks for your password use your own one
[06:36] <q2> thanks
[06:37] <q2> it works
[06:38] <jayeola_afk> if u must be root try 'sudo su -'
[06:38] <jayeola_afk> and u become root!
[06:38] <q2> it works
[06:38] <q2> YAY!
[06:38] <q2> Ubuntu is coool
[06:38] <nate> that's a feature I like quite a bit
[06:39] <wm_eddie> at first it was strange, but now I use sudo all the time.
[06:42] <phr0stbyte> wm_eeddie: How can I get my other 80GB HDD usable from the time of boot?
[06:42] <wm_eddie> phr0stbyte: adding it to fstab?
[06:43] <phr0stbyte> wm_eeddie: Its there, but it seems regular users cannot write to it....
[06:43] <nate> hmm, someone else on the mailing list asking why the g-s-t runlevel tool isn't included
[06:43] <nate> glad I'm not the only one who found that odd
[06:43] <phr0stbyte> wm_eeddie: not sure how to do that...\
[06:44] <wm_eddie> nate < piman> You should manage it with update-rc.d, and run them with
[06:44] <wm_eddie>                invoke-rc.d.
[06:44] <nate> any idea what the rationale was for GNOME desupporting it?
[06:44] <wm_eddie> sorry about the strange whitespace.
[06:45] <wasabi> "de"supporting?
[06:46] <cef> firstly, ubuntu uses the debian setup, which doesn't use the usual chkconfig and the like tools which the g-s-t runlevel tool supports
[06:47] <cef> secondly, there isn't anywhere as much distinction between runlevels on debian as there is in redhat. ie: there is no 'don't run X' runlevel.
[06:47] <phr0stbyte> wm_eeddie:
[06:47] <phr0stbyte> /dev/hda2       /               reiserfs defaults        0       1
[06:47] <phr0stbyte> /dev/hda5       /home           reiserfs defaults        0       2
[06:47] <phr0stbyte> /dev/hdb5       /warehouse      reiserfs defaults        0       2
[06:47] <nate> cef: ah, really? Interesting.
[06:48] <nate> no runlevel 3?
[06:48] <phr0stbyte> - /warehouse is not user writable for some reason
[06:48] <cef> debian usually defaults to runlevel 2 for everything
[06:48] <nate> oops
[06:48] <cef> 3, 4 & 5 are all copies of runlevel 2
[06:48] <nate> so me doing 'cat /etc/rc5.d' to check for running services would be a mistake?
[06:49] <wm_eddie> phr0stbyte: add user and auto to the options
[06:49] <cef> they're only there so you can set up custom runlevels 'if you wish'
[06:49] <wasabi> um
[06:49] <wasabi> duh
[06:49] <wasabi> since cat doesn't do that
[06:49] <Se7h> i can i erase a directory that's not empty ?
[06:49] <cef> nate: yeah.. look in /etc/rcS.d, then /etc/rc2.d
[06:49] <cef> nate: /etc/rcS.d has the startup stuff, which is always run
[06:50] <nate> I suppose that's simpler
[06:50] <cef> nate: it's a very powerful setup.. moreso than rh's usually.. but the tools do need an overhaul
[06:51] <wm_eddie> cef: it wouldn't be too hard to make them would it?
[06:52] <cef> wm_eddie: the tools? they're all scripts usually.. but it's basically that no one has wanted to touch them 'cos they work'
[06:53] <wm_eddie> But are there any good GUI front ends?
[06:53] <nate> yeah, it's just a matter of learning the little differences
[06:54] <hazmat> any java for for ppc around?
[06:54] <nate> I'm relieved to find out Debian has SysV. Last time I looked at it I thought it didn't, but that was several years ago
[06:54] <cef> wm_eddie: ahh no idea.. I've mainly done it via the cli.. things will be a lot better for hoary (next release)
[06:55] <nate> and the Ubuntu philosophy seems to be that everything should just work and be secure by default, which I think is a good idea
[06:55] <Se7h> erg
[06:55] <cef> that's the plan
[06:55] <Se7h> im getting error s on java
[06:55] <Se7h> :|
[06:55] <nate> if I could only work out why it is so slow to start up on my machine I would be very happy
[06:55] <cef> less things running as root, less things running that don't need to be
[06:55] <chutwig> because it's java, what more do you need to know
[06:55] <jayeola_afk> java is shyte
[06:55] <nate> it's not RAM and it's not CPU, but something is making it take over 5 minutes to get from login to desktop
[06:56] <cef> Se7h: web or local?
[06:56] <Se7h> local
[06:56] <cef> Se7h: so you're trying to write/run a locla java app?
[06:56] <nate> now I just need to learn how to understand the .deb format and I will be set
[06:56] <wm_eddie> ftp://ftp.tux.org/pub/java/JDK-1.3.1/
[06:56] <wm_eddie> ppc
[06:56] <cef> nate: what sort of machine?
[06:57] <calc> nate: read debian policy and debhelper manpages, etc
[06:57] <Se7h> cef y, that's it
[06:57] <Se7h> Invocation of this Java Application has caused an InvocationTargetException.
[06:57] <cef> hrm, I need breakfast
[06:57] <hazmat> wm_eddie, thks
[06:58] <jayeola_afk> i need sleep
[06:58] <cef> jayeola_afk: it's 3pm in the afternoon.. I only just got up.. *grin*
[06:58] <jayeola_afk> 06:02 here
[06:58] <cef> heh.. well then, you'll be getting up about the same sort of time as me.. *grin*
[06:58] <nate> hmm. Should one use apt-get or aptitude nowadays?
[06:59] <cef> apt-get is a great tool, but a lot of people only need aptitude
[06:59] <jh|home> synaptic is cool too
[06:59] <cef> nate: it comes down to personal preference usually
[06:59] <wm_eddie> nate: People say that we shouldn't be using apt-get as our front-end.
[07:00] <Se7h> how do i delete an intire directory ?
[07:00] <cef> calc: heh
[07:00] <Se7h> wich isn't empty
[07:00] <wm_eddie> we should be using dselect/aptitude/synaptic
[07:00] <wm_eddie> Se7h: rm -rf dir/
[07:00] <wm_eddie> careful with that one though.
[07:00] <nate> cef: Desktop 
[07:00] <calc> apt-get has issues with resolving problems so its usually better to use a package manager like dselect/aptitude/synaptic like wm_eddie mentioned
[07:00] <Se7h> rf
[07:00] <Se7h> ty
[07:01] <calc> i didn't like how aptitude works for sorting so just use dselect instead
[07:01] <wm_eddie> Se7h: or cd dir/ && rm -f * && cd .. && rmdir dir/ :p
[07:01] <nate> what tool does one usually use to a) see if a package is installed and b) what files it provides?
[07:01] <calc> fpkh
[07:01] <calc> er dpkg
[07:01] <nate> I found 'dpkg-query', is that the best one to use?
[07:02] <calc> dpkg -L foo and dpkg -l
[07:02] <wm_eddie> doesn't synaptic show you that info too?
[07:02] <calc> or apt-file for things not already installed
[07:02] <nate> maybe but Synaptic hurts my brane to try to understand
[07:02] <calc> wm_eddie: no idea never used synaptic
[07:02] <nate> its interface is pretty but very very busy
[07:03] <jayeola_afk> night/moring chaps
[07:03] <nate> hmm, next question
[07:03] <wm_eddie> Damn, It's already one.
[07:03] <nate> I notice Postfix is installed, but I've never used a mail server so far
[07:04] <wm_eddie> I told myself I'd make a couple of random GTK# apps today.
[07:04] <nate> When I configure Evolution, is the recommended way to point it at the local Postfix or just let it fetch mail itself?
[07:04] <q2> Whats a good system monitor?? one that can be transparent?????
[07:04] <Se7h> just to confirm
[07:04] <Se7h> unpack java bin
[07:04] <wm_eddie> q2: top in a gnome-terminal :p
[07:05] <Se7h> copy it to usr/local/lib
[07:05] <Se7h> and export path
[07:05] <Se7h> right?
[07:05] <wm_eddie> Se7h: Symlinking is better I think
[07:05] <Se7h> ls -s ?
[07:05] <crimsun> ln -s
[07:06] <Se7h> ln
[07:06] <Se7h> y
[07:06] <wm_eddie> ln -s /path/to/original /path/to/symlink
[07:06] <q2> WHATS A GOOD DOCKED SYSTEM MONITOR THAT CAN BE TRANSPARENT????????
[07:06] <wm_eddie> or I just cd into where I want it and do ln -s /path/to/original .
[07:06] <wm_eddie> q2: top in a gnome-terminal!!!!
[07:06] <nate> transparent, huh?
[07:06] <wm_eddie> oh docked...
[07:07] <nate> I like ones that plug into the gnome-panel myself
[07:07] <q2> like on the side of the screen
[07:07] <q2> or translucent, whichever is seethrough
[07:07] <wm_eddie> q2: GKrellm2 is a good app for that stuff
[07:07] <wm_eddie> not really a dock, but check it out. You'll like it.
[07:07] <nate> don't much care for transparent widgets myself, they distract me from seeing either what's underneath or what's on top. But that's me, I'm old-fashioned
[07:07] <wm_eddie> There's about a million and a half skins for it.
[07:08] <q2> I heard good things about GKrellm
[07:08] <wm_eddie> q2: I love it. It's like a dashboard for my computer.
[07:09] <wm_eddie> not to be confused with "Dashboard" which is another set of awesomeness altogether.
[07:09] <crimsun> i just use top.
[07:10] <wm_eddie> top sometimes makes 3d things strange
[07:10] <Se7h> damn
[07:10] <Se7h> dam errors...
[07:10] <Se7h> Stack Trace:
[07:10] <Se7h> java.lang.NoClassDefFoundError: javax/swing/JWindow
[07:10] <Se7h>    at java.lang.reflect.Method.invoke0 (Method.java)
[07:10] <Se7h> for ie
[07:15] <_kim> well
[07:15] <_kim> here goes 
[07:15] <_kim> going to install mythtv on ubuntu :)
[07:16] <wm_eddie> good luck with that
[07:16] <Hrdwr_BoB> mainly because I already have it installed and why change what works already
[07:17] <Se7h> can anyone give a hand here with java?
[07:17] <crimsun> sure
[07:17] <Hrdwr_BoB> it's in the FAQ
[07:17] <crimsun> what's up?
[07:18] <wm_eddie> I was looking in the FAQ for Java, I couldn't find anything but I swear that I saw something before...
[07:19] <crimsun> i'm using Tiger.
[07:19] <q2> whats with Gkrellm being in the taskbar
[07:19] <q2> i dont like that
[07:19] <wm_eddie> q2: you can change that
[07:19] <crimsun> fiddle w/ the Preferences.
[07:19] <wm_eddie> right click on it.
[07:19] <wm_eddie> it can do alot
[07:19] <q2> i see
[07:20] <q2> where do i set it too not be on the taskbar
[07:20] <wm_eddie> I wish there was a "Current GTK theme" theme for GTKrellM
[07:20] <q2> i found it
[07:22] <Se7h> im reading some foruns...none helping till now..
[07:23] <crimsun> Se7h: what are your objectives regarding Java?
[07:24] <crimsun> Se7h: what have you done thus far?
[07:24] <Se7h> running java apps
[07:24] <crimsun> do you plan to develop any Java code yourself?
[07:24] <Se7h> ive installed this before with no problem
[07:24] <Se7h> i dont get why this now
[07:24] <Se7h> crimsun no
[07:24] <Se7h> at least for now
[07:25] <crimsun> Se7h: ok. what have you done thus far?
[07:26] <q2> anyone know of a transparent gkrellm theme???
[07:27] <crimsun> q2: there are quite a few
[07:27] <q2> where can i ubtain these?
[07:27] <crimsun> (of course meaning pseudo-transparent)
[07:27] <wm_eddie> q2: Glass Glass-2 Glass-3
[07:27] <crimsun> in the gkrellm skins tarball linked on muhri.net
[07:27] <q2> i would like them
[07:27] <Se7h> crimsun unpacked the bin file
[07:27] <Se7h> a created a ln
[07:27] <crimsun> Se7h: which bin file?
[07:27] <Se7h> j2re
[07:28] <crimsun> sun's? version 1.5.0?
[07:28] <Se7h> 1.4
[07:28] <crimsun> what symlink did you create?
[07:29] <Se7h> hmm
[07:29] <Se7h> w8 just a sec
[07:29] <Se7h> let me just check one thing
[07:29] <crimsun> personally, across both my debian sid machine and my ubuntu machine, i use this:
[07:30] <crimsun> in /usr/lib/mozilla/plugins/, i have a symlink from /usr/local/jdk1.5.0/jre/plugin/i386/ns7/libjavaplugin_oji.so
[07:30] <q2> how do i install these themes
[07:30] <crimsun> the same symlink exists in /usr/lib/mozilla-firefox/plugins/
[07:30] <crimsun> q2: untar them in ~/.gkrellm2/themes
[07:30] <crimsun> in ~/.gkrellm2/themes/
[07:31] <q2> kk
[07:34] <Se7h> oh ok
[07:34] <Se7h> now i have another kind of prob
[07:35] <Se7h> OOPS, you don't seem to have a valid JRE [java = SableVM] 
[07:35] <Se7h> You need to upgrade to JRE 1.4.x or newer from http://java.sun.com
[07:35] <crimsun> java -version
[07:35] <crimsun> i'm using sun's jdk 1.5.0
[07:36] <Se7h> SableVM version 1.1.5
[07:36] <Se7h> o.0
[07:36] <wm_eddie> That's a open-source VM
[07:36] <wm_eddie> you'll need GNU Classpath if you want to run java applications.
[07:36] <Se7h> how can i tell ubuntu about the newer version on the sys ?
[07:36] <wm_eddie> uninstall the previous one?
[07:37] <crimsun> Se7h: the newer version of what?
[07:37] <Se7h> the one thing confusing me
[07:37] <Se7h> is just
[07:37] <crimsun> Se7h: what else did you install?
[07:37] <Se7h> last time
[07:37] <Se7h> i just unpacked the bin
[07:37] <Se7h> created the ln
[07:37] <Se7h> exportd path
[07:37] <Se7h> and i think that was it
[07:37] <crimsun> did you grab the bin from Sun?
[07:38] <Se7h> crimsun of java i guess
[07:38] <Se7h> yeah
[07:38] <wm_eddie> Se7h: I think you installed SableVM from before.
[07:38] <wm_eddie> using apt maybe
[07:38] <Se7h> j2re
[07:38] <crimsun> Se7h: where did you unpack it, /usr/local/ ?
[07:38] <Se7h> well now its at /home
[07:38] <Se7h> lol
[07:39] <crimsun> well, if you do that, only your $USER will have access to it
[07:39] <crimsun> (if you wish to do it sanely, that is)
[07:39] <Se7h> hmm
[07:40] <Se7h> but wont ln do the job?
[07:40] <crimsun> what did you ln?
[07:40] <Se7h> from home to usr local
[07:40] <crimsun> bad idea
[07:41] <wm_eddie> Se7h: next time run installers as root
[07:41] <wm_eddie> proprietary software is such a pain to install seriously...
[07:41] <crimsun> it's actually not
[07:41] <crimsun> takes about one minute.
[07:41] <Se7h> lol
[07:41] <Se7h> so
[07:41] <wm_eddie> apt-get install java would take less
[07:41] <Se7h> what do i do now?
[07:41] <wm_eddie> I think
[07:41] <wm_eddie> I don't know, apt spoiled me.
[07:41] <crimsun> Se7h: delete the symlink in /usr/local/ that you created
[07:42] <Se7h> k
[07:42] <Se7h> w8
[07:42] <crimsun> Se7h: cd /usr/local
[07:42] <crimsun> Se7h: sudo /path/to/sun's_jre
[07:43] <Se7h> btw
[07:43] <crimsun> i hope it can decipher, too, wm_eddie ;)
[07:43] <Se7h> how do i delte it?
[07:43] <Se7h> rm ?
[07:43] <Se7h> man i feel dumb
[07:43] <crimsun> Se7h: yes.
[07:43] <Se7h> lol
[07:43] <Se7h> k
[07:44] <wm_eddie> crimsun: yeah, it's a simple addition encryption program
[07:44] <wm_eddie> so the key would be the negative number of the key.
[07:44] <wm_eddie> man, I've been able to break monodevelop twice now.
[07:44] <wm_eddie> I"m on a roll!
[07:44] <Se7h> ok
[07:44] <Se7h> deleted
[07:45] <Se7h> im on usrlocal
[07:45] <Se7h> what now??
[07:45] <crimsun> 01:42 < crimsun> Se7h: sudo /path/to/sun's_jre
[07:45] <Se7h> sudo ?
[07:45] <crimsun> yes
[07:45] <Se7h> i mean...
[07:45] <Se7h> sudo /home?
[07:45] <crimsun> make sure the bin is marked executable
[07:45] <crimsun> no
[07:45] <Se7h> oh
[07:45] <Se7h> yes it is
[07:45] <crimsun> sudo ~/jre...bin
[07:45] <crimsun> substitute the actual filename
[07:46] <Se7h> wha ?
[07:46] <Se7h> ok
[07:46] <Se7h> running bin...
[07:46] <crimsun> 'lo Atticus 
[07:47] <Atticus> hi crimsun
[07:47] <Se7h> done
[07:48] <crimsun> Se7h: ok, now you need to create the symlinks, and then you need to correct the $PATH
[07:48] <Se7h> ok...symlinks
[07:48] <crimsun> Se7h: the first thing you need to do is to find the path of the java plugin
[07:48] <Se7h> proceed
[07:49] <Se7h> anda...where is it ?
[07:49] <Se7h> *and
[07:49] <crimsun> it resides under the jre directory
[07:49] <crimsun> you need to look for it
[07:49] <crimsun> for my installation, it's /usr/local/jdk1.5.0/jre/plugin/i386/ns7/libjavaplugin_oji.so
[07:49] <crimsun> for yours, i'm guessing it's going to be similar
[07:49] <Se7h> seth@devil /usr/local $ ls j2re1.4.2_05/plugin/
[07:49] <Se7h> desktop  i386
[07:49] <Se7h> is that it ?
[07:50] <Se7h> oh
[07:50] <Se7h> it is
[07:50] <crimsun> no, it will be /usr/local/j2re1.4.2_05/plugin/i386/ns7/libjavaplugin_oji.so
[07:50] <crimsun> find it?
[07:50] <Se7h>  j2re1.4.2_05/plugin/i386/ns610/libjavaplugin_oji.so
[07:50] <Se7h> got it
[07:51] <crimsun> kk
[07:51] <crimsun> now:
[07:51] <crimsun> with which browsers do you plan to use the java plugin?
[07:51] <Se7h> firefox
[07:52] <crimsun> ok
[07:52] <crimsun> then you need to create the appropriate symlink for mozilla-firefox/plugins
[07:52] <crimsun> cd /usr/lib/mozilla-firefox/plugins
[07:53] <crimsun> sudo ln -s ../../../local/j2re1.4.2_05/plugin/i386/ns610/libjavaplugin_oji.so .
[07:53] <cef> crimsun: sheesh! we've gotta automate that somehow..
[07:54] <crimsun> cef: agreed, it would be easier.
[07:54] <Se7h> ln: `./libjavaplugin_oji.so': File exists
[07:54] <crimsun> granted, i've done this for as long as sun has made a plugin available.
[07:54] <crimsun> Se7h: ln -sf   then
[07:54] <Se7h> k
[07:54] <Se7h> done
[07:55] <crimsun> ok, and now where did you set the $PATH ?
[07:55] <Se7h> well
[07:55] <Se7h> think is set to /usr/local/bin/....
[07:55] <crimsun> no
[07:55] <cef> crimsun: yeah.. actually need a little gui program to maintain it all, so you can switch between different JRE's and set up different browsers
[07:56] <crimsun> Se7h: set it in /etc/bash.bashrc
[07:56] <crimsun> sudo vi /etc/bash.bashrc
[07:56] <Se7h> vi?
[07:56] <crimsun> or another $EDITOR
[07:56] <crimsun> doesn't really matter
[07:57] <crimsun> you simply need to edit it.
[07:57] <Se7h> im there
[07:57] <Se7h> now need to add a line righjt?
[07:58] <crimsun> Se7h: yep
[07:59] <subterrific> i hate to break it to you now, but there is a FAQ on this
[07:59] <subterrific> and it is much easier than what you're doing
[07:59] <crimsun> indeed there is.
[08:00] <subterrific> there is even an apt source that will let you install java with a single command
[08:00] <subterrific> http://www.ubuntulinux.org/support/documentation/faq/helpcenterfaq.2004-09-16.3469703387/view?searchterm=java
[08:01] <Se7h> subterrific i did that tut
[08:01] <Se7h> got all screwd up as u can see
[08:01] <Se7h> lol
[08:01] <subterrific> why didn't you use the apt repos?
[08:02] <Se7h> i did
[08:02] <Se7h> but no vm was there
[08:02] <Se7h> i think
[08:02] <crimsun> Se7h: i'm apologize, the file to edit is /etc/profile, not /etc/bash.bashrc
[08:02] <Se7h> crimsun keep going
[08:03] <Se7h> crimsun im there
[08:03] <subterrific> Se7h: then you didn't follow the instructions correctly because i did it on 3 machines :\
[08:03] <cef> subterrific: how long ago?
[08:03] <crimsun> Se7h: insert the jre path so it reads thusly:
[08:03] <subterrific> last week
[08:04] <subterrific> i used the latest jre 1.5 rc from sun
[08:04] <crimsun> PATH="/usr/local/bin:/usr/local/sbin:/usr/local/j2re1.4.2_05/bin:/usr/bin:/usr/sbin:/bin:/sbin:/usr/bin/X11:/usr/games"
[08:04] <cef> hrm, shouldn't be any problems unless there is an issue with the repository
[08:04] <cef> subterrific: how'd you find the latest jre?
[08:04] <subterrific> java.com
[08:05] <cef> subterrific: no I meant how'd you find it operational wise?
[08:05] <cef> as in, how well does it work for you?
[08:05] <Se7h> crimsun done
[08:05] <crimsun> (technically you should set JAVA_HOME=/usr/local/j2re1.4.2_05 and also export that, and set your PATH=/usr/local/bin:/usr/local/sbin:$JAVA_HOME/bin:/usr/bin:/usr/sbin:/bin:/sbin:/usr/bin/X11:/usr/games"
[08:05] <crimsun> )
[08:05] <subterrific> it runs azureus, thats the only java app i use
[08:06] <cef> subterrific: cool.. I should try it with a few things I need to use.. might work a bit better than 1.4, which has issues
[08:06] <subterrific> oh, and ourTunes. i ran that at work
[08:06] <crimsun> 1.5.0 final ("Tiger") is vastly improved over 1.4.x
[08:06] <cef> then again, that's cos the app is only certified for 1.3 and painful under 1.4
[08:07] <Se7h> crimsun done?
[08:07] <crimsun> yep.
[08:07] <crimsun> now login shells will set $PATH correctly.
[08:07] <crimsun> make sure you remove your previous $PATH edit
[08:07] <cef> of course, now he needs to log out, and then log in again
[08:07] <Se7h> i just did the "export" thing
[08:08] <Se7h> well...brb then
[08:08] <cef> I should install ubuntu on my spare laptop drive.. rather than just the desktop
[08:12] <Se7h> erm
[08:13] <Se7h> well
[08:13] <Se7h> OOPS, you don't seem to have a valid JRE [java = SableVM] 
[08:13] <Se7h> You need to upgrade to JRE 1.4.x or newer from http://java.sun.com
[08:13] <crimsun> is your shell a login shell?
[08:13] <Se7h> how so ?
[08:13] <crimsun> what terminal emulator are you using, gnome-terminal?
[08:13] <crimsun> xterm?
[08:13] <Se7h> gnome
[08:14] <crimsun> Edit->Current Profile...->Title and Command-> click "Run command as a login shell"
[08:18] <Se7h> in the rterminal ?
[08:19] <crimsun> in gnome-terminal, yes
[08:19] <cef> ok, bbk, time to get serious with my desk...re-arrangement time. ran out of power points.. *8-(
[08:20] <crimsun> i should play more gnome mines.
[08:20] <Se7h> done crimsun
[08:20] <crimsun> Se7h: ok, start a new gnome-terminal
[08:21] <crimsun> Se7h: then echo $PATH and make sure it's there
[08:21] <Se7h> ....
[08:21] <Se7h> /usr/local/bin:/usr/local/sbin:/usr/bin:/usr/sbin:/bin:/sbin:/usr/bin/X11:/usr/games:/usr/local/j2re1.4.2_05
[08:21] <crimsun> why did you put it at the end?
[08:22] <Se7h> duno
[08:22] <crimsun> i was very specific about the order when i told you (twice)
[08:22] <Se7h> oohh
[08:22] <Se7h> didn't think about that
[08:22] <Se7h> sorry
[08:22] <crimsun> np
[08:23] <Se7h> where should i place it ?
[08:23] <crimsun> 02:05 < crimsun> (technically you should set JAVA_HOME=/usr/local/j2re1.4.2_05 and also export that, and set your PATH=/usr/local/bin:/usr/local/sbin:$JAVA_HOME/bin:/usr/bin:/usr/sbin:/bin:/sbin:/usr/bin/X11:/usr/games"
[08:25] <Se7h> done
[08:25] <crimsun> ok, log out and back in
[08:27] <Se7h> done
[08:27] <Se7h> lets see..
[08:27] <Se7h> :|
[08:27] <Se7h> no luck
[08:27] <crimsun> echo $PATH
[08:28] <Se7h> grrrrr
[08:28] <Se7h> sorry bout that
[08:29] <Se7h> ls: /usr/local/lib/j2re1.4.2_05/: No such file or directory
[08:29] <Se7h> why the hell is he looking there
[08:29] <Se7h> o.0
[08:30] <crimsun> you have to be precise when setting your $PATH
[08:31] <Se7h> erm
[08:31] <Se7h> i dont get it
[08:32] <Se7h> seth@devil ~ $ echo $PATH
[08:32] <Se7h> /usr/local/bin:/usr/local/sbin:/usr/local/j2re1.4.2_05:/usr/bin:/usr/sbin:/bin:/sbin:/usr/bin/X11:/usr/games:
[08:33] <crimsun> you left out the "/bin"
[08:33] <crimsun> it's /usr/local/j2re1.4.2_05/bin
[08:33] <crimsun> not /usr/local/j2re1.4.2_05
[08:33] <Se7h> ok but..
[08:34] <Se7h> ls: /usr/local/lib/j2re1.4.2_05/: No such file or directory
[08:34] <Se7h> OOPS, unable to locate java exec in  /usr/local/lib/j2re1.4.2_05//  hierarchy
[08:34] <Se7h> o.0
[08:34] <crimsun> why is it searching /usr/local/lib/j2re1.4.2_05/ ?
[08:34] <Se7h> dunno
[08:34] <Se7h> thats what im talking about
[08:34] <crimsun> what files did you edit $PATH in?
[08:34] <Se7h> profiles
[08:35] <crimsun> i know of no 'profiles'
[08:35] <crimsun> do you mean /etc/profile ?
[08:35] <Se7h> y
[08:35] <crimsun> paste me the PATH=  line from that file
[08:36] <Se7h> JAVA_HOME=/usr/local/j2re1.4.2_05 
[08:36] <Se7h> PATH="/usr/local/bin:/usr/local/sbin:$JAVA_HOME:/usr/bin:/usr/sbin:/bin:/sbin:/usr/bin/X11:/usr/games"
[08:37] <crimsun> see?
[08:37] <crimsun> you left out "/bin" after "$JAVA_HOME"
[08:37] <Se7h> uh?
[08:37] <crimsun> it's "$JAVA_HOME/bin" not "$JAVA_HOME"
[08:38] <Se7h> ok
[08:38] <Se7h> but even though
[08:38] <Se7h> ..
[08:38] <Se7h> grrrrr
[08:38] <Se7h> dam xchat
[08:38] <Se7h> lol
[08:41] <Se7h> aaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
[08:41] <Se7h> finaly
[08:41] <Se7h> :D
[08:43] <Se7h> thanks alot crimsun for the time spent
[08:43] <crimsun> np at all.
[08:53] <Se7h> erm
[08:53] <Se7h> noe its firefox that wont run
[08:53] <Se7h> :_|
[08:53] <Treenaks> Se7h: does it tell you why if you try to run it from the command line?
[08:55] <Se7h> INTERNAL ERROR on Browser End: No manager for initializing factory?
[08:55] <Se7h> System error?:: Success
[08:55] <Se7h> lol?
[09:00] <Treenaks> Se7h: what did you do before it broke?
[09:00] <Treenaks> Se7h: did you break of an upgrade that was halfway through?
[09:00] <q2> goodnight all
[09:01] <rexiboy> well... I got 3 ubuntu costers! tried to install 3 times and ubuntu could not deal with my 6800 card, waht a shame I really wanted a 64bit with gnome...
[09:02] <smeggy> Try the nvidia drivers instead of the nv ones.
[09:02] <baietas_> hey anyone messed around with pwcX? the Philips Webcam Driver?
[09:02] <rexiboy> feels like this preview shouldn't have been released
[09:02] <Treenaks> smeggy: that doesn't work on amd64
[09:02] <smeggy> Ahh right.
[09:02] <Treenaks> baietas_: people have been busy wrting an alternative for pwcx
[09:02] <smeggy> Well, that's hardly Ubuntus fault then is it.
[09:03] <Hrdwr_BoB> out of curiosity
[09:03] <Se7h> Treenaks just installed java
[09:03] <baietas_> treenaks: oh sweer... 
[09:03] <Se7h> nothing else
[09:03] <Se7h> :|
[09:03] <Hrdwr_BoB> hmm n/m
[09:03] <rexiboy> looks like the ubuntu team just rushing to get something out without proper testing or documantation
[09:03] <baietas_> Treenaks, know more info about it? website etc?
[09:03] <smeggy> It's working great for a large amount of people rexiboy.
[09:03] <Treenaks> Se7h: then that's the problem..
[09:04] <Treenaks> rexiboy: without proper testing? they make preview releases available, adn this is their first release
[09:04] <rexiboy> smeggy, I'm not new to linux, there are some serius problems with the ubuntu64!
[09:04] <Treenaks> rexiboy: they;ve been updating the preview release daily
[09:04] <subterrific> rexiboy: have you reported a bug?
[09:04] <subterrific> and have you tried one of the daily isos?
[09:05] <rexiboy> Treenaks, i downloaded 3 different daily's
[09:05] <smeggy> The snapshot from a day or so ago works great on my amd64 box :)
[09:05] <rexiboy> smeggy, what card do you have?
[09:05] <smeggy> Just and old nvidia gf4mx
[09:05] <smeggy> *an
[09:05] <subterrific> rexiboy: so open a bug, and help them get it fixed. that is the point of a preview release, to help them work out bugs. complaining and saying they shouldn't have released anything is worthless
[09:06] <rexiboy> i think the 6800 is not supported yet, which id weird
[09:06] <subterrific> it's a community effort
[09:06] <rexiboy> subterrific, i guess i'm a bit frustrated :) i will report a bug though
[09:06] <smeggy> Report a bug and then remember to stay around to help :P
[09:07] <Se7h> crimsun u there?
[09:07] <rexiboy> :) really wanted gnome 2.8! how is it?
[09:07] <smeggy> Fantastic
[09:07] <crimsun> Se7h: yes.
[09:07] <Se7h> crimsun firefox got screwd up
[09:08] <Hrdwr_BoB> reformed: shiny
[09:08] <Hrdwr_BoB> gnome 2.8 is all about smooth shininess
[09:08] <crimsun> Se7h: how so?
[09:08] <smeggy> And happy fuzziness ;)
[09:08] <Se7h> INTERNAL ERROR on Browser End: No manager for initializing factory?
[09:08] <Se7h> System error?:: Success
[09:08] <Se7h> like that
[09:08] <rexiboy> :) o.k no more salt on my wound
[09:09] <crimsun> Se7h: sudo /usr/sbin/update-mozilla-firefox-chrome
[09:09] <kuroishi> anyone know of any unofficial sources for ubuntu binaries? I need mplayer and i can't seem to get it to build properly.
[09:09] <Se7h> continues with it
[09:10] <crimsun> kuroishi: use christian marillat's repository, just as one would with woody/sarge/sid
[09:10] <Se7h> or do i need a ogout?
[09:10] <crimsun> Se7h: what happens if you remove the java plugin symlink?
[09:11] <Se7h> on the profiles?
[09:11] <kuroishi> crimsun, what would the line in sources.list look like? (i'm new at this and a few random guesses yeilded nothing.)
[09:11] <smeggy> Just use Synaptic to add it :P
[09:11] <crimsun> Se7h: no, from /usr/lib/mozilla-firefox/plugins/
[09:11] <kuroishi> ah, yes, i'm new to this GUI stuff, haha
[09:12] <Se7h> dunno
[09:12] <Se7h> should i try ?
[09:12] <crimsun> Se7h: yes.
[09:12] <Se7h> yup
[09:13] <Se7h> worked now
[09:13] <crimsun> Se7h: are you sure you're using the version of the java plugin compiled with gcc32?
[09:14] <Se7h> guess so...
[09:14] <crimsun> don't "guess" -- make certain.
[09:14] <Se7h> downloaded from sun
[09:14] <Hrdwr_BoB> ok
[09:14] <Hrdwr_BoB> time to break shit.
[09:14] <crimsun> in i386/, there should be multiple directories
[09:14] <Hrdwr_BoB> I am installing things from debian unstable
[09:14] <crimsun> under each of those directories, there are possibly multiple versions of the java plugin
[09:14] <subterrific> kuroishi: http://www.arslinux.com/~jorge/sources.list
[09:15] <Se7h> seth@devil ~ $ ls /usr/local/j2re1.4.2_05/plugin/i386/ ns4  ns610  ns610-gcc32
[09:15] <crimsun> aha.
[09:15] <Se7h> oooh
[09:15] <crimsun> that's why.
[09:15] <Se7h> ow i getted what u told
[09:15] <Se7h> ok
[09:15] <Se7h> aaaiii
[09:17] <kuroishi> subterrific, thanks a TON!
[09:18] <Se7h> done
[09:18] <subterrific> kuroishi: np, us reformed gentoo users have to help each other out ;)
[09:18] <kuroishi> hehe
[09:18] <Se7h> crimsun i was using one from /610
[09:18] <crimsun> Se7h: i know.
[09:19] <kuroishi> everything i love about gentoo, and everything i love from debian, without all the stuff i hate from both =D gotta love ubuntu.
[09:19] <kuroishi> damn i've been up for 36 hours straight and i'm not even tired.
[09:25] <cef> kuroishi: heh.. tell me what you're on so I can get myself some! *grin*
[09:25] <subterrific> kuroishi: i was in the same position about 6 hours ago, but then i crashed
[09:26] <subterrific> now i'm wide awake and it is midnight...
[09:26] <kuroishi> cef, i don't know... i didn't have much caffiene, not about my normal consumption
[09:26] <kuroishi> i've just been natually wired
[09:26] <kuroishi> starting to crash *whines about his mental uptime*
[09:27] <Se7h> gotta get some sleep
[09:27] <Se7h> c ya later
[09:27] <cef> heh
[09:28] <cef> I'm thinking I should live in another timezone.. that way I'll be awake during normal times for this timezone
[09:29] <Se7h> this?
[09:29] <Se7h> im from PT
[09:29] <Se7h> lol
[09:29] <Se7h> ;P
[09:49] <Treenaks> hey, I've found a bug :)
[09:49] <Treenaks> again..
[09:49] <Treenaks> the xterms started from the session manager when you login do not use all of your locale...
[09:49] <crimsun> great :)  did you file a bug with a workaround and/or resolution?
[09:49] <Treenaks> crimsun: not yet :)
[09:49] <Treenaks> crimsun: I must have some kind of bug record already :P
[09:50] <Treenaks> I mean.. the xterm menu show's UTF8, "locale charmap" shows UTF8, but still UTF-8 is displayed as if it is latin1
[09:52] <mayco> i have a question, i want to remove the top bar, but by doing so, i lose the "computer" menu, and then i can't enter the "desktop preferences" and "system configuration", is there a way to add it to the normal gnome startmenu?
[09:54] <mkyc-ubuntu> what do i need to play DVD's on ubuntu ?
[09:55] <kuroishi> mayco, i think you can from within nautilus
[09:56] <kuroishi> it's like preferances:// or something
[09:56] <kuroishi> add a launcher for that =D
[09:56] <mayco> nice, preferences works
[09:56] <mayco> and what about that other menu?
[09:57] <kuroishi> one sec i'll look
[09:59] <kuroishi> Mayco, hmm =/
[09:59] <kuroishi> don't see it
[09:59] <mayco> i've found it, preferences:///System
[09:59] <mayco> that's the same menu
[09:59] <kuroishi> cool =)
[10:00] <mayco> one more thing, is it possible to add the menufolders into the root of the gnomestartmenu instead of into some "Applications" submenu?
[10:01] <kuroishi> no idea.
[10:01] <mayco> hmm, ok, i will look abit further then, thanks anyway
[10:03] <mkyc-ubuntu> any suggestions as to why totem wont play WMV's ?
[10:04] <mkyc-ubuntu> and why mpeg movie files are blank?
[10:04] <kuroishi> because totem is utter crap, imo.
[10:05] <subterrific> mkyc-ubuntu: install totem-xine instead of totem-gstreamer
[10:05] <subterrific> totem is fine, it is gstreamer that needs work
[10:05] <mkyc-ubuntu> do i need to remove totem-gstreamer first?
[10:05] <subterrific> yes
[10:05] <mkyc-ubuntu> ok.. how do i do that, i havent uninstalled anything in ubuntu yet?
[10:06] <subterrific> mkyc-ubuntu: Computer > System Config > Package Manager
[10:06] <subterrific> search for totem
[10:06] <mkyc-ubuntu> ta
[10:06] <subterrific> should be easy from there
[10:06] <mkyc-ubuntu> much appreciated
[10:06] <kuroishi> how do you change default applications in Gnome 2.8?
[10:07] <kuroishi> for instance, i want to play videos in mplayer rather than totem
[10:07] <subterrific> kuroishi: right click on the file in nautilus > properties > open with
[10:08] <kuroishi> subterrific, that doesn't give me the option to set it so all of those files use that
[10:08] <subterrific> it does
[10:08] <kuroishi> hm, mine doesn't seem to be o.0
[10:09] <subterrific> read what it says at the top of the Open With tab
[10:09] <subterrific> "and others of type "...""
[10:10] <kuroishi> yeah, that adds the option to open with mplayer.
[10:11] <subterrific> then you select mplayer as the default
[10:11] <subterrific> using the little radio button to the left of the name
[10:11] <kuroishi> ah hah, in properties
[10:21] <tuo2> hmmm
[10:22] <tuo2> some might call that a net split
[10:22] <MyKq3> :)
[10:22] <MyKq3> itz all from the same network .... may b it went down
[10:22] <subterrific> mdz: re: that hal bug i just opened. would rebuilding my custom kernel with the 2.6.8.1-10 source fix the problem you think?
[10:23] <mdz> subterrific: I doubt it, but I'd be very interested to know if it happens with the stock kernel
[10:25] <subterrific> mdz: ok, i guess i can try both. i'd much rather use the stock kernel, but until ALSA 1.0.6 is stock, i'm forced to patch
[10:28] <nanotech> whaddup joe
[10:28] <joebeastie> not much
[10:28] <joem> how do I increase a variable that is an integer in bash?
[10:29] <joebeastie> variable++ ?
[10:29] <joem> by a set number
[10:29] <joebeastie> variable + number ?
[10:29] <joem> I tried VAR=$VAR+5
[10:29] <joem> but that just sets the value to say "0+5"
[10:29] <joem> instead of 5
[10:30] <cef> ahh try 'set VAR=$VAR+5'
[10:30] <joebeastie> i havent done it in bash but in awk i have...
[10:30] <subterrific> speaking of bash: http://unixnaut.com/skills/Languages/python/pysh.html
[10:30] <subterrific> if you like python, that should make you drool
[10:30] <joebeastie> speaking of bash: bash.org
[10:30] <joebeastie> :)
[10:30] <subterrific> hehe
[10:31] <clee> heh. bash.org rules.
[10:31] <joebeastie> clee: sure does. good time killer at work
[10:32] <cef> joem: try 'VAR=$(($VAR+5))'
[10:32] <cef> $(( )) is the arithmetic operator (ie: treat everything inside this as arithmetic)
[10:34] <cef> otherwise you can use 'let VAR=$VAR+5' (same sort of thing)
[10:34] <joem> clee,  cef, thank you
[10:34] <cef> (not set.. knew it ended in 'et' though!)
[10:34] <cef> joem: no probs
[11:16] <djuuss> help! after i installed nvidia drivers gdm tries to start but it can't (quits after 3 retries)
[11:16] <djuuss> have to modprobe nvidia before i start gdm
[11:16] <djuuss> and that works like a charm
[11:16] <ntunqn> depmod -ae
[11:16] <joem> djuuss, sudo echo nvidia >> /etc/modules
[11:24] <togs> has anybody had any luck with USB headsets?
[11:35] <deFrysk> djuuss, put nvidia in /etc/modules
[11:35] <deFrysk> hmm too late :s
[11:38] <djuuss> whoops ran out for a bit
[11:39] <djuuss> whereis nvidia --> /usr/lib/nvidia
[11:40] <djuuss> joem: and 
[11:40] <djuuss> deFrysk: i did that
[11:40] <djuuss> time for the test
[11:43] <joem> djuuss, then it will be loaded on boot
[11:44] <deFrysk> hmm , he seems to reboot his box
[11:47] <nate> hmm
[11:47] <nate> I am still having weird extreme-slowness problems
[11:48] <nate> Generally, each time I launch an application, or sometimes even when I click on a GTK widget
[11:48] <nate> I get delays on the order of a minute before that app repaints
[11:48] <nate> however, I can usually still interact with any other GUI components, such as panel applets, and context menus
[11:49] <joem> nate, see anything in .xsession-errors?
[11:51] <nate> yep, lots
[11:51] <nate> a few assertions failed
[11:51] <nate> 'Window manager working around an application which used XSetInputFocus'
[11:52] <nate> I have no idea how severe any of these are
[11:52] <nate> it boggles me that there still are GTK+ assertion failures in shipping GNOME apps, but that's always seemed to be the case
[11:56] <nate> even starting Gnome Terminal takes about 20 seconds to fully paint itself
[11:56] <nate> and doing so produces no new .xsession-errors
[11:59] <subterrific> nate: do you have any "feeling" on what is causing it? for example, does it feel like a kernel issue or xfree or what?
[12:02] <micX> hey, it works :)
[12:04] <nate> It feels like an application level thing to me
[12:04] <nate> maybe at the GTK level, dunno
[12:04] <nate> it doesn't feel systemwide
[12:04] <nate> it could be at the Bonobo level, but I think maybe below that
[12:04] <subterrific> ahh, so like xpdf launches fine?
[12:04] <nate> hmm, haven't tried that
[12:05] <nate> nope, takes 18 seconds even for xpdf to launch
[12:06] <subterrific> what about a command line only app like python or top?
[12:06] <nate> meanwhile the panel system monitor shows neither CPU nor memory problems
[12:06] <nate> top seems to start with no problems
[12:06] <nate> it only seems to be X apps
[12:06] <nate> and not just apps, but perhaps windows
[12:06] <nate> so, at the XFree level I guess
[12:07] <subterrific> have you tweaked you XF86Config at all?
[12:07] <nate> now, I don't have a 3D card in this machine. Is it possible it's trying to run mesa somewhere in the background?
[12:07] <monkeyc-unb> what is needed to get DVD's playing on ubuntu?
[12:07] <nate> I've been burned with that before on, eg, Fedora 2 where OpenGL screensavers will bring my machine to a crawl
[12:07] <nate> but that would normally show as CPU maxed out, and that's not it here
[12:08] <subterrific> monkeyc-unb: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/support/documentation/faq/helpcenterfaq.2004-09-16.3469703387/view?searchterm=DVD
[12:08] <nate> and no, I have a purely vanilla Ubuntu install, no XF86Config hacking
[12:08] <monkeyc-unb> thanks subterrific
[12:10] <subterrific> monkeyc-unb: http://www.arslinux.com/~jorge/sources.list
[12:12] <monkeyc-unb> subterrific, you are a champion
[12:18] <micX> nate, how much memory have u got? I'm on a celeron1200/256Mb and things a a little slow to launch, but fine when running.
[12:18] <nate> micX: 384 MB
[12:18] <nate> it's not using any swap
[12:21] <deepnarc> OK... just downloaded and installed Ubuntu (very nice!!), but cannot for the life of me work out how to get a remote X display connection over ssh (ssh-server installed via synaptic)-- any ideas?
[12:21] <nate> hmm, that's interesting. My swap partition, hda5, appears to be zero size
[12:21] <deepnarc> PS was working between my Fedora Core 2 machines
[12:22] <nate> wonder if that's a problem
[12:22] <nate> so much for auto-partitioning
[12:22] <micX> nate, heh, no wonder it isnt being used :)
[12:22] <nate> oh wait. cfdisk reports 512 MB
[12:23] <nate> but fdisk appears to be reporting that its start and end sectors are the same
[12:23] <nate> maybe fdisk is just wacky
[12:23] <nate> so, 512 MB would be correct for me
[12:24] <micX> 512 here too.
[12:24] <nate> sensible default
[12:26] <micX> Oo is pretty slow here, machine lags a bit, I might have to find another 256Mb memory stick for it.
[12:27] <micX> It is a tosser anyhow, won't even run windows...
[12:31] <nate> when I start, say, gnome-terminal or system montor, I will often get a window with window decorations up in say two seconds, with a few grey rectangles on it
[12:31] <nate> but the widgets aren't painted and responsive until about 20 seconds later
[12:32] <micX> hmm. have you got a dead.letter in / ? from debconf about udev?
[12:34] <nate> yes, I do
[12:34] <nate> hmm, another data point
[12:34] <nate> starting, say, gnome-terminal from a terminal is quick
[12:34] <nate> as opposed to starting it from the Applications menu, when it takes anywhere between 5-20 seconds
[12:35] <micX> ok, I'll do the same. what cpu have u got?
[12:35] <nate> starting xpdf from the terminal is fast
[12:35] <nate> micX: me? Celeron 1Ghz
[12:35] <micX> terminal from menu, about 5 seconds
[12:35] <monkeyc-unb> subterrific, mplayer works like a charm, cheers for the help :)
[12:36] <micX> terminal from terminal, less than a sec.
[12:36] <monkeyc-unb> im running ubuntu on a P2 400 notebook with 256mb ram and i have no speed issues.
[12:37] <micX> nate, yes, sorry. Looks like we have similar systems. you have more memory, I have a bit more cpu.
[12:37] <micX> monkeyc-unb, is that because you have no speed?
[12:37] <mdz> deepnarc: just run ssh -X <server>
[12:38] <monkeyc-unb> maybe :)
[12:38] <psi> my settings in .Xdefaults never take effect unless I explicitly use xrdb. is this a bug?
[12:38] <mdz> nate: have you tried turning off sound events?
[12:39] <nate> ooh
[12:39] <nate> good point
[12:40] <mdz> psi: you want ~/.Xresources rather than ~/.Xdefaults
[12:40] <micX> mdz, where do you do that?
[12:40] <mdz> computer->desktop preferences->sound
[12:40] <psi> mdz: oh! thanks
[12:40] <deepnarc> mdz, thanks that was it exactly [Doh! Now I feel stupid!] 
[12:41] <micX> doesn't look like sound events, hasn't changed terminal startup time from menu.
[12:42] <nate> aha
[12:42] <nate> I think that may have been it
[12:42] <mdz> nate: bug #1943
[12:42] <nate> yeah, someone mentioned that a few hours ago, and I didn't think it applied to me
[12:42] <mdz> or something similar
[12:42] <nate> but it looks like it might be
[12:43] <mdz> from what I have seen in investigating #1943, it seems like it would stall forever, rather than just making the system slow, but I'm not sure yet
[12:43] <deFrysk> writing isos with nautilus works like a charm here :)
[12:44] <nate> it seems to stall for about 30 seconds on each sound event
[12:45] <micX> nate, you mentioned xpdf. I can't find it in any menu?
[12:45] <mdz> micX: it isn't in the menu
[12:45] <nate> yeah, I was running it from 'Run Application'
[12:46] <micX> mdz, ok, that explains why I can't find it :)
[12:46] <nate> see, I have an onboard sound card in this box but no speakers
[12:46] <nate> so of course I didn't notice that I wasn't getting sound
[12:47] <monkeyc-unb> whats the difference between gpdf and xpdf ?
[12:47] <nate> hmm
[12:47] <bitserf> gpdf has a nicer UI
[12:47] <nate> on viewing #1943, I'm not at all sure that's my problem
[12:47] <mdz> monkeyc-unb: gpdf integrates more nicely with the desktop, but isn't quite as capable yet
[12:47] <nate> but similar
[12:47] <mdz> nate: it sounds like you just have a sound problem
[12:47] <monkeyc-unb> hmm i see
[12:48] <nate> I have some kind of sound problem, yes
[12:48] <nate> didn't have any problem under Fedora Core 2
[12:48] <mdz> nate: perhaps an IRQ conflict (laptop?)
[12:48] <nate> no, desktop
[12:48] <mdz> you might try booting with pci=noacpi, and if that doesn't work, noapic
[12:48] <nate> mdz: acpi messes with sound?
[12:49] <mdz> nate: acpi affects how IRQs are assigned
[12:49] <nate> hmm
[12:49] <nate> wouldn't that be kernel level though?
[12:49] <mdz> also make sure you are running the most recent kernel
[12:49] <mdz> yes
[12:49] <nate> oh, hmm. I've never run 2.6 on this box
[12:49] <nate> or ALSA
[12:49] <nate> so maybe that's part of the issue
[12:51] <richnrockvillemd> I have a toshiba laptop running windows xp with MS Virtual PC and have installed Ubuntu. The graphics was not working properly and after much knashing. some nice user on the lists said to try "sudo dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xfree86 and it worked. What a pleasure to use this in a vpc window.  I also installed it on a p4 2.8 and it really is the first iteration of linux that actually worked out of the .iso.  Thanks to these 
[12:51] <fridge> richnrockvillemd, interesting anecdote
[12:52] <richnrockvillemd> Fridge, I am amazed at how intuitive the graphic interface is. piece of cake for old diehard windows people..
[12:52] <richnrockvillemd> My sound still is not working but that is a small problem..
[12:53] <nate> I use GNOME 2.4 on my current home box (Fedora Core 1)
[12:53] <nate> it has rough edges which I am annoyed at how slowly they are being fixed, but 2.8 configured the way Ubuntu does is getting nicer
[12:53] <nate> a few little things still irk me
[12:53] <nate> such as why I can't drag or copy/paste a launcher icon from a menu or panel to the desktop
[12:54] <fridge> I just did that
[12:54] <micX> every iteration of gnome rocks.
[12:54] <nate> you can? Hmm.
[12:54] <fridge> in ubuntu I can
[12:54] <nate> interesting
[12:54] <nate> let me try
[12:54] <fridge> dragged the blender icon to the desktop
[12:55] <nate> hey neat
[12:55] <nate> maybe my sound problem was stuffing that up
[12:55] <nate> okay, that's another niggle gone
[12:55] <richnrockvillemd> Yesterday someone pointed me to a web site where it said that Ubuntu would not work with microsoft's virtual PC. Evidently the web site needs updating..:)
[12:56] <nate> ah, I see
[12:56] <nate> one has to Unlock the icon first
[12:56] <nate> but that makes sense
[12:56] <nate> still, getting better
[12:56] <fridge> one does?
[12:57] <nate> for me I do, yes
[12:57] <nate> if I try to drag a Locked panel icon nothing happens
[12:58] <fridge> oh, I hadn't changed panels from the default
[12:59] <monkeyc-unb> anyone seen this error before when playing movies with Mplayer : alas control: mixer attach /dev/mixer no such file or directoy
[01:00] <monkeyc-unb> works fine when i run the movie with run as but gives that error when i open from mplayer
[01:00] <monkeyc-unb> i know its not supported but thought maybe someone may have seen it before
[01:01] <Hmmmmm_> anyone know if the latest gnoppix can be installed on the hard disk?
[01:02] <deepnarc> Right... I'm off... going to see if I can get ndiswrapper working with Ubuntu. Hopefully see you all later ;-)
[01:02] <nate> there's a few issues with Nautilus still\
[01:02] <nate> I wish Spatial and Browse mode windows were more interchangeable
[01:03] <nate> in Windows, I live by turning on the toolbar on windows and clicking 'up'
[01:03] <nate> I like my switchable navigation panes and widgets, I don't like the way Nautilus currently forces a window to be either one folder only or a full browse window
[01:03] <Hmmmmm_> anyone know if the latest gnoppix can be installed on the hard disk?
[01:03] <nate> gnoppix?
[01:04] <Hmmmmm_> ya the latest one is based on ubuntu linux
[01:04] <nate> really? Cool
[01:04] <Hmmmmm_> yup
[01:04] <Hmmmmm_> checkout linuxbeta for screenshots
[01:04] <Hmmmmm_> http://www.linuxbeta.com/slideshows/slideshow.php?release=128&slide=1
[01:05] <nate> hmm
[01:05] <nate> okay, here's another Nautilus question
[01:05] <nate> how can I create a symlink?
[01:05] <nate> ie, I want to create a symlink to my home directory and put it on my desktop
[01:06] <nate> it would appear that I can't do anything so obvious as right-click my home folder in Nautilus and go 'create symlink' or 'create shortcut'
[01:06] <micX> nate, middle click and drag
[01:06] <nate> assume I don't have a middle mouse button
[01:06] <tseng> use both buttons at once
[01:06] <micX> here's 5 bucks. get one :)
[01:06] <Hmmmmm_> micX, thats a cool feature, thats for letting me know abt it
[01:06] <sanxiyn> (I like ROX way of drag-and-drop, that is, it asks copy/move/link on drop.)
[01:06] <nate> no
[01:07] <nate> sorry, I just really really hate UIs that try to force me to use middle-click
[01:07] <Hmmmmm_> sanxiyn, even konqueror does that
[01:07] <sanxiyn> No stupid "press control key' bullshit.
[01:07] <Hmmmmm_> it is a nice feature
[01:07] <tseng> button 1+ button2 at once = button 3
[01:07] <nate> there's gotta be a keyboard equivalent
[01:07] <micX> nate, most scrolwheels are actually buttons, have you got one of those?
[01:07] <tseng> ...
[01:07] <nate> yes, but I don't use it to click with
[01:07] <nate> because otherwise I accidentally generate scroll events
[01:08] <nate> there's got to be a keyboard shortcut, surely? GNOME being Accessible and all?
[01:08] <tseng> nate: last time
[01:08] <tseng> nate: use button 1 + 2 together
[01:08] <micX> yup. there will be.
[01:08] <nate> and again I say NO
[01:08] <nate> that is playing Twister with my fingers
[01:08] <nate> I will not do that
[01:08] <nate> any GUI which attempts to make me do that will lose my patronage
[01:09] <coravel> hi 
[01:09] <micX> heh.
[01:09] <sanxiyn> nate: Who cares. :-)
[01:09] <micX> try it nate, you will get better at it :)
[01:10] <nate> aha
[01:10] <nate> the answer is 'Ctrl+Shift'
[01:10] <nate> see, I knew there was a keyboard way
[01:11] <sanxiyn> IMO, drop target should ask about copy/move/link, and it is not to be done from keyboard or from drag source...
[01:11] <coravel> hi, i've never tried debian or debian based distros, i'm a long time slackware user, i wonder if ubuntu is for me as it is said to have releases every six months with new GNOME versions?
[01:11] <coravel> any ideas?
[01:11] <joem> uh, yes..I can tell it is for you
[01:11] <sanxiyn> That makes "drag and drop
[01:11] <sanxiyn> " uniform.
[01:12] <micX> coravel, you won't know unless you try...
[01:12] <nate> yeah, what I was really looking for was 'Paste as Shortcut' from the right-click desktop context menu
[01:12] <micX> coravel, no-one here will know.
[01:12] <coravel> it's the package system i hesitate :)
[01:13] <nate> since wherever possible I prefer to use copy/paste rather than drag/drop to move files. Far too easy to accidentally do horrid things to files when dragging and dropping
[01:13] <micX> coravel, the package system rocks!
[01:13] <sanxiyn> nate: Really?
[01:13] <nate> yes
[01:13] <nate> If I could I would avoid using the mouse for many things
[01:13] <coravel> i heard good things too about it
[01:13] <nate> it cause far too much OOS
[01:13] <sanxiyn> Oh, I prefer drag-and-drop is much much better than copy-and-paste.
[01:13] <coravel> it's just the habits you know
[01:13] <sanxiyn> s/is//
[01:13] <coravel> what the hell, i'm downloading :)
[01:13] <nate> the more keyboard shortcuts, the better really
[01:14] <nate> and GNOME is getting better in that regard, I think
[01:15] <nate> coravel: despite my griping here I am for the most part liking Ubuntu
[01:15] <nate> heck, I'm using Fedora 1 at the moment, which has to be worse
[01:15] <subterrific> nate: i'll second that
[01:16] <coravel> well, to be honest, i really liked it when i saw it's only 1 CD, that's the way it should be, only the necessary ones, not a bloat
[01:16] <coravel> and i really hate KDE, so it's good it's out of it :)
[01:16] <nate> mmm
[01:16] <nate> also the desktop design is nice and clean
[01:16] <subterrific> fedora core 1 made my P4 2.6ghz w/ HT feel like a P2
[01:17] <nate> I'm not sure how much of that is GNOME 2.8 and how much is Ubuntu, but I love having a 'show desktop' icon and the trash on the panel
[01:17] <subterrific> it was very stable though, had over 100 days of uptime
[01:17] <coravel> i learned long ago that i should stay away from mandrake, redhat, fedora whatever, they are all bloated 
[01:17] <nate> hmm
[01:18] <nate> aha
[01:19] <nate> another way to create a symlink is to move, then alt-release an icon
[01:19] <coravel> is there a complete package list somewhere on the web?
[01:19] <monkeyc-unb> mandrake is beyond bloated.. its in a new realm of bloat
[01:19] <nate> then one could copy/paste the new symlink. That's almost as good, I think, as what I can do in Windows Explorer.
[01:20] <sanxiyn> nate: I think GNOME copied Windows, and I think it's bad.
[01:20] <micX> nate, show desktop was there in previous gnomes, I think?
[01:20] <nate> or even simpler, move/alt-release
[01:20] <coravel> mandrake was very nice when it was version 6.1, long time ago :) my ever first distro
[01:20] <sanxiyn> nate: move=drag/copy=ctrl+drag/link=alt+drag is exactly Windows way, and IMO it's wrong...
[01:20] <nate> micx: yes, probably, but it's not on the panel as default in Fedora
[01:20] <nate> how does Mac OSX do it, I wonder?
[01:20] <nate> something similar, I thought
[01:20] <micX> nate, option drag, I think.
[01:20] <subterrific> sanxiyn: do you have any logical reasoning behind that or do you just think its wrong because it is from Windows?
[01:21] <sanxiyn> subterrific: I prefer ROX way better. :-)
[01:21] <nate> come to think of it, one Windows idiom I would love to see die is having file-open dialogs 
[01:21] <sanxiyn> subterrific: No, I don't hate it because it's from Windows. no.
[01:21] <monkeyc-unb> oh god yes
[01:21] <nate> I would like my file-open dialogs to be a real file manager window
[01:21] <subterrific> nate: Mac does it the same way, but with the respective mac keyboard keys
[01:21] <monkeyc-unb> that would be nice nate
[01:21] <subterrific> sanxiyn: and what is the ROX way?
[01:22] <micX> wtf is ROX?
[01:22] <sanxiyn> subterrific: You just drag, without any modification key, and drop.
[01:22] <coravel> guys, thanks for the ideas, the download will take time, i think i should go back and play a little more fallout 2 :) see ya after the install!
[01:22] <sanxiyn> subterrific: And it asks when you drop. copy/move/link/cancel.
[01:22] <subterrific> sanxiyn: that seems slow
[01:23] <subterrific> asking for user input on the screen is always slower than letting the user press a key
[01:23] <monkeyc-unb> i prefer the windows way to be honest but perhaps thats because i work with windows for a living
[01:23] <subterrific> thats why keyboard shortcuts are called shortcuts
[01:23] <monkeyc-unb> linux is for my pleasure :)
[01:23] <subterrific> monkeyc-unb: the windows way is actually the mac way
[01:24] <monkeyc-unb> yeah i assumed that subterrific
[01:24] <sanxiyn> subterrific: Well, it's on ROX filer, and ROX makes very good uses of drag and drop in other areas too :-)
[01:24] <sanxiyn> subterrific: Like file saving by drag and drop.
[01:24] <subterrific> i like how windows added the idea of copy & pasting files though
[01:24] <monkeyc-unb> though i cant remember my old mac behaviours.. too long ago for my addled mind
[01:24] <subterrific> apple ended up borrowing that idea from microsoft
[01:25] <sanxiyn> http://rox.sf.net/
[01:25] <monkeyc-unb> i use keyboard shortcuts a lot to be honest, its faster than a button in windows.
[01:25] <monkeyc-unb> mind you i also work heavily in the command line which is not normal for windows users :)
[01:26] <subterrific> drag and drop works for simple quick operations, but as soon as you need to navitage a large hierarchy, it fails
[01:27] <subterrific> which is why copy & paste for files makes so much sense
[01:27] <micX> what I despise about windows drag n drop, is when the icon you are dragging passes over some slow network drive on it's way, and the whole process pauses while windows inspects the network...
[01:27] <sanxiyn> subterrific: That's why I don't maintain large hierarchy anyway. :-)
[01:27] <subterrific> micX: hehe, thats awful
[01:27] <monkeyc-unb> micx that does suck
[01:28] <subterrific> sanxiyn: sometimes you don't have a choice, and then you're screwed with the ROX way
[01:28] <sanxiyn> micX: Hm, and Nautilus is any different?
[01:28] <micX> sanxiyn, I haven't experienced it on nautilus, but I haven't gone looking either.
[01:28] <subterrific> sanxiyn: yes, nautilus waits for you to open the window before it tries to scan the network drive
[01:29] <micX> I think it's a windows 'assumption' that you will be using the passed-over drive. very helpful of them.
[01:31] <monkeyc-unb> i did once read an explanation of that but cannot remember why micX
[01:32] <monkeyc-unb> you can prevent it happening from memory
[01:32] <subterrific> sanxiyn: i agree with not creating hierarchies, i think file systems should be search driven. i've felt that way for a very long time. one of my first coding projects when i was learning to code on a mac in 95 was to create a file browser that stored all files in one directory and presented a metadata based browsing interface
[01:32] <sanxiyn> subterrific: Wow, cool.
[01:32] <nate> Hmm
[01:33] <nate> on the whole, I think the addition of Spatial Mode is a small step forward
[01:33] <nate> but I still wish I could configure my file manager to be not quite as heavyweight as Browse Mode and not quite as lightweight as Spatial Mode
[01:33] <nate> like I would like the navigation bar to be just a bit thinner
[01:34] <nate> still, I can use it as it is, it's just a bit painful
[01:34] <sanxiyn> nate: Makes sense.
[01:36] <subterrific> it would be ideal if when you saved a file you didn't give it a file name, but instead typed some keywords or a short description
[01:36] <nate> brr
[01:36] <subterrific> and you could just use that to find all your files
[01:37] <nate> there are projects along that line, in both Windows and Linux
[01:37] <nate> WinFS and Storage
[01:37] <nate> so I guess it will become the future at some point
[01:37] <nate> but I do not like that idea at all
[01:37] <smeggy> damn gmail is nice
[01:37] <nate> I want my files to stay where they are put
[01:37] <smeggy> i'm a bitch to google now
[01:37] <smeggy> :(
[01:37] <sanxiyn> I do like Gmail's "archive" and "label" (instead of "folder").
[01:37] <subterrific> thats basically what i was trying to do in 95, but the problem then was dealing with file open dialogs in other applications
[01:38] <smeggy> Yeah.
[01:38] <nate> and when, not if, my system crashes, I want it to be very easy to copy my data, in pieces, to my new machine
[01:38] <micX> subterrific, some people do that now, you should see my CEO search for files on his powerbook. It hurts to watch...
[01:38] <nate> anything that requires a system-wide metadata database sounds like recreating the Windows Registry at the file system level
[01:39] <subterrific> micX: yeah, applications aren't designed to work that way yet
[01:39] <nate> I suppose I could live with a metadata layer as long as it was optional and didn't cause any data loss if it got deleted and recreated
[01:39] <micX> the self-organising computer. yuech.
[01:39] <smeggy> To more complicated computers become like that
[01:39] <smeggy> the more it scares me.
[01:39] <smeggy> I like my data how it is, thanks very much.
[01:39] <nate> I am very glad that Evolution stores my mail in text files
[01:39] <sanxiyn> nate: I want my MP3 file to be in "music", "artist X", "album Y", "year yyyy" folder at the same time.
[01:40] <nate> hmm
[01:40] <sanxiyn> Metadata, or "labeling" allows that.
[01:40] <nate> Oh, also Reiser of ReiserFS is pushing this vision too
[01:40] <nate> yes
[01:40] <nate> but I want one of those locations to be the 'real' one
[01:40] <subterrific> yeah, reiserfs4 is pretty amazing
[01:40] <sanxiyn> nate: Well, that's no problem. :-)
[01:41] <subterrific> BeFS was that way also, it was such a pleasure to work with
[01:41] <nate> so that when, not if, I have to transfer my files to a file system that does not understand that kind of metadata, it doesn't get destroyed
[01:41] <subterrific> which is why Apple hired the BeFS guy to recreate that layer on HFS+
[01:41] <nate> hmm
[01:41] <subterrific> which is what Spotlight is in "Tiger"
[01:41] <nate> ooh
[01:42] <nate> so does that mean Spotlight will be the first shipping implementation of such a system?
[01:42] <subterrific> no, BeOS did it
[01:42] <subterrific> and it was really amazing
[01:42] <smeggy> BeOS did basically everything first ;)
[01:42] <nate> hmm
[01:42] <nate> but it had no apps
[01:42] <subterrific> you could use the BeOS file browser as your email client gui
[01:42] <nate> so it was essentially one giant proof-of-concept system
[01:42] <sanxiyn> nate: It had some commercial apps.
[01:42] <smeggy> It had the apps that mattered ;)
[01:43] <nate> subterrific: okay, that's clever. ;)
[01:43] <subterrific> for example: you create a live query for emails, ordered by date
[01:43] <nate> thing is, it's easy to do such a thing on an isolated, stand-alone system that does not have to share data with other platforms
[01:43] <nate> and that's great, but it's not the world most of us live in
[01:44] <subterrific> and it would open a file browser window with all those emails in it, and when new files were created, they'd show up
[01:44] <nate> hmm
[01:44] <nate> if you could do such a thing and have it fully compatible with a standard filesystem, that'd be neat
[01:44] <nate> I suppose the concept wouldn't be too far removed from symlinks
[01:44] <lifeless> jdub: going to put paman in universe too ? (polypaudio manager)
[01:44] <lifeless> http://0pointer.de/lennart/projects/paman/
[01:45] <subterrific> nate: BeFS was, BeOS was basically POSIX compliant
[01:45] <nate> interesting
[01:45] <nate> so, if you were to copy your email folders to a floppy or CD-RW, what would you get?
[01:45] <subterrific> the one step Be never made, that i think made it far less useful was automatically generating metadata from file content.
[01:46] <nate> mmm
[01:46] <subterrific> not doing that i mean
[01:46] <subterrific> nate, well thats the thing, as soon as you copied your files to some other non-BeFS file system, you'd lose that metadata
[01:46] <nate> but you'd still have the original data?
[01:47] <nate> if there were a way of doing it, like say, a small .xml file in each virtual folder... hmm
[01:47] <subterrific> if they had added some sort of plugin based system that was able to automatically generate metadata from file contents, then it would have been far more useful.
[01:48] <subterrific> which is what reiserfs4 is trying to do...plugin based file system
[01:48] <nate> we seem to have rather a lot of file systems at the moment
[01:49] <topyli> ahh. got samba printing to work. not with cups though. good old bsd-style lpd rules!
[01:50] <nate> FAT/VFAT, ISO9660 with various flavours, ZIP/TAR/GZIP et al, ext2/ext3, NTFS4/5... and that's just Linux/Windows
[01:50] <subterrific> there is a gnome project along these lines also: http://www.gnome.org/projects/beagle/
[01:50] <nate> and at least they all have vaguely similar semantics: a hierarchy of folders
[01:51] <subterrific> right, there is no way of moving away from heirarchy any time soon
[01:51] <nate> how you'd create a non-hierarchical database file system and have it fully interoperable with all the various hierarchical systems that would be used to store, eg, backups on... hmm
[01:51] <subterrific> but you can augment it with better interfaces, like spotlight, and Beagle
[01:51] <nate> I guess there's two approaches. One, store the 'real' data in a hierarchy and add a metadata layer, stored in some kind of database
[01:51] <nate> or just wallop the whole lot into one big SQL database, which is what I hope Microsoft is not looking at doing
[01:52] <nate> what does Beagle do?
[01:52] <subterrific> "Beagle is an experimental tool for indexing and searching your data"
[01:53] <nate> hope it's better than XP's 'search' function, which was a step down from NT4's in many ways.
[01:53] <smeggy> WTF
[01:53] <smeggy> Firefox is telling me there are critical updates available.
[01:54] <mdz> it's exaggerating a bit :-)
[01:54] <smeggy> I didn't even know the damn thing had an autoupdate feature :P
[01:54] <nate> 1.0PR added it, I believe
[01:55] <nate> big yay to Ubuntu for including 1.0PR, by the way
[01:55] <subterrific> nate: http://nat.org/2004/september/beagle.png
[01:55] <smeggy> Wow
[01:55] <smeggy> Thats pretty cool.
[01:57] <nate> hmm
[01:57] <subterrific> this is neat also: http://nat.org/dashboard/
[01:57] <nate> so, what kind of data is it aware of?
[01:57] <Qo-noS> Beagle ain't it the Spotlight-like tool destained for inclusion into GNOME proper in 3.0 or later?
[01:57] <nate> all these examples seem to be based around IM conversations, and that's the one thing I don't use
[01:57] <subterrific> nate: potentially all data
[01:58] <nate> hmm
[01:58] <nate> but it has to be told somehow that, eg, saved IM conversations are IM conversations and not just text files
[01:59] <nate> otherwise, a simple grep would tell me this information. What's it adding that grep isn't?
[01:59] <nate> (well, a nice GUI, I guess... but I presume there's some deep magic under the hood as well?)
[01:59] <subterrific> right, for every custom file type some smart filter has to be written to extract relevant information
[01:59] <nate> that's what worries me
[01:59] <subterrific> much much faster than grep
[02:00] <nate> requiring smart filters is what has crippled Windows XP's search function
[02:00] <subterrific> look, simple analogy
[02:00] <nate> you can no longer search your entire hard drive for that file you know has the info you want
[02:00] <nate> you can only search 'known' file types
[02:00] <moyogo> doesn't it keep an index of things?
[02:00] <subterrific> imagine if you had to download every file on the internet with wget and then grep the file to do a web search
[02:00] <subterrific> thats what you're doing now
[02:00] <subterrific> beagle is google for your harddrive
[02:01] <subterrific> index searching vs content searching
[02:01] <subterrific> index is much much faster
[02:01] <nate> I seem to recall Microsoft Office 2000 shipping with an indexing engine
[02:01] <nate> and everyone turned it off because it chewed so much CPU and memory
[02:02] <subterrific> it doesn't have to be that way
[02:02] <nate> not sure why it didn't work. It seemed like a good idea.
[02:02] <subterrific> microsoft is notorious for ruining good ideas
[02:02] <nate> One thing I would love, would be for my web browser to save a decent-sized cache of my browsing
[02:02] <subterrific> i'm pretty sure they're going to find some way to ruin .NET/CLR
[02:02] <nate> and be able to search that before hitting Google
[02:03] <nate> combine that with something like Beagle and you could be onto a winner
[02:03] <subterrific> nate: beagle will do that
[02:03] <nate> (well, apart from that there's no way currently in Firefox to save your browse cache... but I'm sure a small extension could easily be written)
[02:04] <subterrific> its only a matter of beagle having code to know about your browser's cache file format
[02:04] <nate> mmm
[02:05] <subterrific> another thing beagle/dashboard could do would be to just index pages you visit
[02:05] <nate> that would be neat
[02:05] <micX> smeggy, you can reset firefox's critical updates if you want to.
[02:05] <subterrific> so you'd search and get urls, like a personalized google
[02:06] <nate> goodness Nat Friedman looks young
[02:09] <micX> feeling old, nate? :)
[02:10] <subterrific> the dashboord slide show from OSD is pretty funny
[02:11] <subterrific> "Private backend data: * Example: Dashboard matches porn in front of your boss"
[02:12] <nate> micX: yes
[02:12] <nate> I turned 33 two weeks ago
[02:12] <nate> hmm, Tomboy looks like an interesting app
[02:12] <micX> nate, oh well, scrapheap for you, I suppose :)
[02:13] <micX> tomboy. Is that a mono app?
[02:14] <nate> micX: pbbbffft :)
[02:14] <subterrific> micX: haha
[02:14] <nate> yes
[02:14] <nate> as is Beagle
[02:14] <nate> whole lotta .NET love from the Ximian crowd
[02:15] <micX> I think I compiled tomboy the other day, and it didn't want to play :(
[02:15] <nate> but mono is not default standard in Ubuntu yet, and I admit to a little patent queasiness about it myself
[02:16] <nate> I would like to think mono could not be yanked away, but I'm not convinced it's 100% patent-safe
[02:16] <micX> blam! is good.
[02:16] <subterrific> not even microsoft can yank open source :)
[02:16] <micX> it's a mono app rss reader.
[02:17] <micX> subterrific, they don't have to, they just make it expensive to use...
[02:17] <Qo-noS> anotherg great mono app would be F-spot, anyone using it for your pr0n collection yet? ;)
[02:18] <micX> Qo-noS, is that something like G-Spot :)
[02:18] <subterrific> the best part of mono imho is the CLR stuff, and that is an open standard
[02:18] <nate> subterrific: yes they can, if it's patent infringing. Witness what happened to MP3 support.
[02:18] <baietas_> vmware is asking me What is the location of the directory of C header files that match your running kernel?
[02:18] <baietas_> where are they in ubuntu ?
[02:18] <nate> even being an open published standard is no guarantee one can't be sued for patent infringement
[02:18] <subterrific> i mean i guess the .NET framework is nice, i've never used it, but CLR is much more interesting
[02:18] <nate> but I'd like to think CLR is okay
[02:18] <subterrific> and useful in the long run
[02:19] <Qo-noS> micX: g-spot? ain't that located ~3cm inside the holy "hole" =0)
[02:19] <micX> :)
[02:19] <subterrific> nate: mp3 support is still around, it is just "underground"
[02:19] <nate> subterrific: exactly. It's illegal.
[02:19] <nate> in some countries. Not in NZ, for instance, but in the USA.
[02:20] <baietas_> anybody got vmware working in ubuntu ?
[02:20] <subterrific> i think novell would put up a pretty good fight before mono becomes illegal
[02:21] <nate> yeah
[02:21] <nate> that does give me a bit of hope
[02:22] <nate> otoh, Novell have fluffed things badly in the past. And I speak as a Novell user.
[02:22] <nate> anyone else remember their fling with Wordperfect?
[02:22] <nate> and Quattro?
[02:22] <subterrific> yeah, i'd feel better if another company joined novell in supporting mono
[02:22] <subterrific> IBM maybe
[02:23] <nate> mind you, Netware 6 has large chunks of Java too
[02:23] <nate> so they're sort of hedging their bets
[02:23] <subterrific> .NET is what Java should have been...it irks me
[02:23] <nate> hmm
[02:24] <nate> I wonder how easy it is to port between .NET CLR and Java
[02:24] <smeggy> whats with all the java unlove :(
[02:24] <smeggy> java is making leaps and bounds too y'know
[02:24] <nate> I see Lucene, Beagle's indexer, is a .NET port from a Jakarta project
[02:25] <subterrific> smeggy: java is tied to java, thats its problem
[02:25] <nate> I think the big main thing with Java is that there's no functional up-to-date open source port
[02:25] <smeggy> subterrific, yeah.
[02:25] <nate> or if there is, there's not one that Red Hat see fit to ship, which must mean there's encumbrance problems
[02:25] <smeggy> But java itself is still quite a nice language
[02:25] <subterrific> i can write CLR code in 4 languages now and call between them
[02:26] <nate> I wonder if Parrot will ever become nonvapourware
[02:27] <subterrific> i wish
[02:27] <Kosai> Oh, Parrot works fine.  It's perl 6 that doesn't.
[02:27] <nate> Ubuntu seems to have embraced Python as its VM of choice so far
[02:28] <subterrific> Kosai: until i see python running on parrot it doesn't work
[02:28] <nate> now, if we could just get Perl, Python, Java, CLR all integrating, and then get UNO, XPCOM, CORBA/Bonobo, DCOP/KParts, DBUS and JavaBeans all talking...
[02:28] <smeggy> nates gone mad evidently
[02:28] <smeggy> lol
[02:28] <subterrific> oh, and it needs to run faster than CPython
[02:29] <subterrific> like IronPython...
[02:29] <monkeyc-unb> does anyone know of an RSS feed reader for evolution ?
[02:29] <nate> ... then we mount a GIANT LASER on the MOON...
[02:29] <smeggy> lol
[02:29] <subterrific> dude, lasers rule
[02:29] <subterrific> they are the future
[02:29] <smeggy> no dude
[02:29] <smeggy> haven't you seen star trek?
[02:30] <smeggy> lasers are gone man
[02:30] <smeggy> phasers are the future!
[02:30] <topyli> i want ONE MILLION DOLLARS or i'll destroy your city with my LASER
[02:30] <baietas_> how do i get the latest kernel-image? apt-get install kernel-image-2.6.8.1?
[02:30] <micX> no, warp drives are the go.
[02:30] <smeggy> and really tight catsuits...
[02:30] <Qo-noS> phasers? lasers? BOTH wrong. Sticks and stones will be the future :)
[02:30] <monkeyc-unb> naah sharks with frickin laser beams 
[02:30] <topyli> baietas_: linux-image
[02:31] <baietas_> thank you
[02:31] <Kosai> subterrific: Hm.  Weren't they pretty close?
[02:31] <subterrific> Kosai: no idea, i just know they failed to win the bet
[02:32] <baietas_> what is SMP?
[02:32] <daniels> baietas_: Symmetric Multi-Processing
[02:32] <subterrific> baietas_: symetric multiprocessing
[02:32] <subterrific> khsdakdfhkjsdfs
[02:32] <baietas_> for hyper threading or something?
[02:32] <subterrific> or multiple cpus
[02:32] <baietas_> k
[02:32] <baietas_> 10q
[02:33] <monkeyc-unb> or failing that can anyone reccomend a good RSS feed reader ?
[02:33] <Kosai> subterrific: Yeah.  I think it was for laziness reasons rather than technological ones.
[02:33] <Kosai> monkeyc-unb: I use sage inside Firefox.
[02:33] <monkeyc-unb> tried sage, just looking at the other options
[02:34] <nate> How do you find sage?
[02:34] <smeggy> Liferea is a good reader.
[02:34] <nate> I think I tried it and didn't like it much, but I can't remember
[02:34] <nate> I rather like the built-in LiveBookmark feature, but it's pretty minimal
[02:35] <subterrific> i used Straw RSS reader for a while
[02:35] <Kosai> I like sage.  Firefox 1.0PR has inbuilt RSS reading, but sage gives a nice summary of which of your feeds has changed since you last read it, etc.
[02:35] <subterrific> it works well
[02:35] <nate> hmm
[02:35] <baietas_> would apt-get install linux-kernel-2.6.8.1-3-686-smp upgrade my kernel and enable "hyper threading" ?
[02:35] <monkeyc-unb> Straw looks good but isnt in the universe..
[02:35] <subterrific> Straw is written in python also, so it gets points for that
[02:35] <monkeyc-unb> neither is lifearea
[02:36] <micX> baietas_, sounds like it might :)
[02:36] <smeggy> Yes baietas_.
[02:36] <baietas_> :)
[02:37] <smeggy> Did the same thing earlier today myself.
[02:38] <subterrific> http://www.sidhe.org/~dan/blog/archives/cat_piethon.html
[02:38] <Kosai> subterrific: Cool, thanks.
[02:42] <topyli> monkeyc-unb: i simply installed liferea from unstable.
[02:42] <monkeyc-unb> topyli, yes i think im going to have to do that
[02:43] <topyli> monkeyc-unb: of course, installing stuff from there might break our systems one day :)
[02:54] <Nefarous> Can anyone help me try and explain my very high load average, even while my system is rather idle? ( load average: 2.18, 2.14, 1.31 )
[02:55] <superted> looked at top ?
[02:55] <Nefarous> both top and uptime
[02:55] <subterrific> run top and hit shift-P
[02:56] <Nefarous> as in sort by cpu usage ... yes ... it's 96% idle ...
[02:56] <subterrific> Nefarous: does the system feel really slow?
[02:56] <Nefarous> sometimes ...
[02:56] <subterrific> i had a similar issue but my machine started feeling really really really slow
[02:56] <subterrific> like top would take 5 minutes to run
[02:57] <Nefarous> no, not experiencing that
[02:57] <subterrific> and it'd have negative numbers for cpu usage
[02:57] <bob2> thom: did you end up packaging the centrino wirelessdrivers?
[02:57] <Nefarous> At first I thought maybe top was just wrong, but then uptime shows the same ... very bizarre
[02:58] <subterrific> booting with  acpi=off nolapic noapic fixed the issues i was having
[02:58] <Nefarous> You know, that's a good idea ... it's an older system, and I don't think it supports acpi, just apm ...
[02:59] <andrey_> It seems to me that the ubuntu kernel has no APM support
[02:59] <subterrific> Nefarous: my system is new with P4 /w HT
[02:59] <bob2> andrey_: modprobe apm doesn't work?
[02:59] <andrey_> No, it doesn't.
[02:59] <Nefarous> I just modprobed it, it worked.
[03:00] <bob2> andrey_: "doesn't"?
[03:00] <bob2> it doesn't exist? prints an error? sets your machine on fire?
[03:00] <andrey_> :)
[03:00] <Nefarous> commodore:/home/wardj# modprobe apm
[03:00] <Nefarous> commodore:/home/wardj# lsmod|grep apm
[03:00] <Nefarous> apm                    19948  0
[03:01] <andrey_> The battery monitoring thing doesn't work and the laptop doesn't shut down.
[03:01] <Nefarous> I'm going to play with the acpi settings and reboot ... cheers
[03:01] <bob2> andrey_: does your hardware do APM?
[03:02] <andrey_> Yes it does.
[03:03] <thom> bob2: eh? they're in kernel
[03:04] <bob2> thom: oh
[03:04] <bob2> even better
[03:07] <thom> b and g versions
[03:08] <thom> bob2: one more reason to get an X40 ;-P
[03:16] <Forsa`> hello i am intersted in mirroring, with a 50MbiT connection, who can i talk to, to get help with setting it up ?
[03:16] <bob2> thom: haha
[03:17] <micX> think I found out why ubuntu is laggy on this system:
[03:17] <bob2> thom: daniels getting his on the two days of my life I'll be at his house, the bastard
[03:17] <micX>  Timing buffer-cache reads:   432 MB in  2.01 seconds = 214.85 MB/sec Timing buffered disk reads:    2 MB in  4.60 seconds = 444.80 kB/sec
[03:17] <bob2> don't trust hdparm
[03:18] <micX> bob2, ok, what should I trust? It's agreeing with me though :)
[03:18] <bob2> bonnie++.
[03:19] <bob2> unless this is a zip drive or something.
[03:19] <micX> nope dma 100 ide drive.
[03:20] <micX> E: Couldn't find package bonnie
[03:21] <bob2> 23:18 < bob2> bonnie++.
[03:22] <micX> bob2, I know, that's what I typed, but no joy.
[03:22] <Forsa`> hello i am intersted in mirroring, with a 50MbiT connection, who can i talk to, to get help with setting it up ?
[03:22] <bob2> bonnie++ - Hard drive bottleneck testing benchmark suite.
[03:22] <bob2> Forsa`: wiki.ubuntulinuxx.org/Archive?
[03:23] <micX> bob2, not in the standard apt sources.
[03:23] <Forsa`> i need tech help with setting the mirror up, and i am looking for some one to help me with it
[03:24] <bob2> micX: it's in universe
[03:24] <micX> bob2, universe?
[03:25] <micX> bob2, never mind, I see it.
[03:25] <thom> Forsa`: just rsync into a directory, and then set apache up to serve that directory
[03:27] <nikmul> hello
[03:28] <nikmul> I was wondering if ssh is unenabled on ubuntu on default?
[03:32] <bob2> the daemon is not
[03:33] <ralf> hi all
[03:35] <ralf> fabbione: ciao
[03:37] <ralf> ho Qo-noS
[03:37] <ralf> hi Qo-noS
[03:37] <bob2> you're using ubuntu and not Debian, anyway?
[03:38] <Qo-noS> ralf: hiya :)
[03:40] <ralf> i'm using debian
[03:41] <Qo-noS> think quite a few here are running both Debian and Ubuntu ;)
[03:42] <micX> bob2, what does it all mean?
[03:42] <micX> bob2, ubuntu,480M,5029,36,13001,20,14461,17,13341,63,37979,21,139.0,0,16,210,44,+++++,+++,25369,46,240,46,+++++,+++,845,49
[03:45] <TheCan> hi i'm new to ubuntu...why cant i select "swap" as partition type?
[03:45] <TheCan> (during installation)
[03:46] <subterrific> you can
[03:46] <TheCan> in 4.1 ?
[03:46] <subterrific> as far as i know, you've always been able to
[03:46] <TheCan> then i propably have been doing something wrong :/
[03:47] <subterrific> yeah, spend a little more time looking at the options
[03:47] <subterrific> and take that blind fold off
[03:47] <TheCan> next time then :>
[03:49] <dommi> is ingres in universe?
[03:49] <dommi> damn Im lazy, Ill just go check
[03:57] <Forsa`> i need tech help with setting the mirror up, and i am looking for some one to help me with it, 
[03:57] <Forsa`> i need abit help with rsync, 
[04:00] <bob2> Forsa`: you haven't used rsync before?
[04:01] <TheCan> subterrific, i found the option, well the german translation of the installer sucks a bit :/
[04:01] <Forsa`> nope i did not.
[04:02] <bob2> Forsa`: ask for help on the ubuntu-users list
[04:02] <Forsa`> ok thanks
[04:02] <Forsa`> hmm i where can i find it ?
[04:02] <phr0stbyte> Ubuntu is up and fully configured!!!!
[04:03] <dommi> congrats phr0stbyte
[04:03] <phr0stbyte> domni: thanx
[04:04] <bob2> Forsa`: http://lists.ubuntu.com/
[04:04] <phr0stbyte> domni: I have one more thing, but I know thats not going to happen any time too soon
[04:05] <phr0stbyte> Any1 have a Wacom drawing tablet functioning in Ubuntu?
[04:07] <phr0stbyte> smeggy: hey there!
[04:09] <will> hi hi ppl
[04:10] <will> does anyone know how to install java on ubuntu
[04:10] <dommi> I need a good adobe illustrator clone for linux
[04:11] <phr0stbyte> will: # Java. apt-get install j2sdk to get the sun stuff. Kind of slow,
[04:11] <phr0stbyte> # but if you use Java, you're already used to slow. :p
[04:11] <phr0stbyte> # run ln -s /usr/lib/j2sdk1.4.2/jre/plugin/i386/ns610-gcc32/libjavaplugin_oji.so /usr/lib/mozilla-firefox/plugins/libjavaplugin_oji.so 
[04:11] <phr0stbyte> # to get java working in the browser.
[04:11] <subterrific> dommi: inkscape
[04:11] <dommi> danke
[04:12] <subterrific> not as feature full as illustrator, but it does a decent job with SVG
[04:13] <codebreaker> doko: sorry fr msg
[04:14] <codebreaker> somebody seen doko the last few days?
[04:14] <subterrific> dommi: sodipodi might be good to look at also
[04:14] <subterrific> http://www.mywebstuff.com/06_projects/index.html
[04:15] <Treenaks> is it a known bug that ssh:// connections (connect to server, ssh) are saved as sftp:// sessions (which don't work)
[04:15] <Treenaks> ?
[04:15] <subterrific> ssh:// means sftp://
[04:15] <subterrific> you can't transfer files over ssh...
[04:16] <Kosai> Why would sftp:// not work?
[04:16] <Treenaks> subterrific: if I replace sftp:// by ssh:// the links on my desktop suddenly work, and I can still transfer files..
[04:16] <Treenaks> Kosai: sftp:// gives me an error..
[04:16] <will> phr0stbyte: it says e: couldn't find package j2sdk
[04:18] <subterrific> Treenaks: sftp:// works fine for me. in fact, if you use the Connect to Server... GUI and select SSH, it uses sftp://
[04:18] <phr0stbyte> will: add these sources to your /etc/apt/sources.list
[04:18] <phr0stbyte> http://www.arslinux.com/~jorge/sources.list
[04:18] <Treenaks> subterrific: yes, that's the strange thing..
[04:18] <Treenaks> subterrific: I can connect to server, everything works fine
[04:18] <Treenaks> subterrific: then I log out, log back in, click the connection link that's on my desktop
[04:18] <Treenaks> subterrific: then it errors on me
[04:18] <subterrific> what's the error?
[04:18] <Treenaks> subterrific: replacing sftp:// by ssh:// using gconf-editor makes the link work again
[04:19] <Treenaks> I clicked it away and I can't quite logout now (uploading pictures to my website using nautilus..)
[04:19] <subterrific> report it as a bug
[04:20] <subterrific> sftp:// is pretty buggy anyway
[04:20] <will> so that file tells apt-g to look for software??
[04:20] <Treenaks> it's on the list of Things To Fix for Hoary afaik
[04:25] <XtremeCooL> how to reinstall grub ? cause after i reinstall my windows my boot loader gone
[04:25] <TheCan> man grub-install ?
[04:27] <XtremeCooL> TheCan just type man grub-install enough?
[04:27] <TheCan> lol no
[04:27] <will> how do i use apt-get once i have modified it?
[04:27] <TheCan> read the manpage for grub-install it's explained there
[04:27] <XtremeCooL> it difficult ? i new to linux
[04:28] <TheCan> just type man grub-install
[04:29] <XtremeCooL> i know it will explain ? easy for newbiez ? cause i nebwoez
[04:29] <ralf> or if you have kde, open konqueror and go to man:grub-install
[04:30] <XtremeCooL> i cant go in linux now , i only can access windows
[04:30] <XtremeCooL> i using rescue
[04:31] <LinuxJones> Can you save windows positions for certain applications like Gnome Terminal ?
[04:32] <Treenaks> LinuxJones: you can choose "Save settings" when you log out..
[04:33] <LinuxJones> Treenaks,  that will remember window geometry and such ?
[04:33] <zenwhen> wont that just make whatever apps you ahve open at the time of doing so be open the next time oyu log into gnome?
[04:33] <zenwhen> have*
[04:33] <zenwhen> you*
[04:33] <Treenaks> zenwhen: yes and in the same positions as well
[04:33] <Treenaks> at least, that works for me
[04:34] <LinuxJones> Treenaks,  cool thanks :)
[04:34] <zenwhen> hm
[04:35] <will> XtremeCooL: how do i use apt-get now i have the new sources.list file
[04:36] <defendguin> hey i need to load the apm module when i boot. where can i take care of this?
[04:37] <LinuxJones> will, you first have to apt-get update to refresh the new repository that you have added
[04:37] <robertj> hey all, any ppc users here?
[04:37] <will> LinuxJones: done that
[04:38] <defendguin> hmm modprobe.conf i think
[04:38] <LinuxJones> will, now you can install whatever you want by doing apt-get install <packagename>
[04:38] <Treenaks> defendguin: /etc/modules, but you really want ACPI
[04:38] <will> LinuxJones: where is the list of the packages i have updated?
[04:39] <Treenaks> defendguin: (most PCs from the last 7 years have ACPI support)
[04:39] <defendguin> Treenaks, my laptop doesnt have acpi i dont think
[04:39] <Treenaks> defendguin: especially laptops have ACPI
[04:39] <LinuxJones> will, what are you trying to install ?
[04:39] <Treenaks> mine is 4 years old and it has ACPI
[04:40] <defendguin> hold on let me get you the message dmseg
[04:40] <defendguin> ACPI disabled because your bios is from 1999 and too old
[04:40] <defendguin> You can enable it with acpi=force
[04:40] <will> LinuxJones: java
[04:40] <defendguin> Local APIC disabled by BIOS -- reenabling.
[04:40] <defendguin> Could not enable APIC!
[04:40] <Treenaks> defendguin: APIC != ACPI
[04:41] <defendguin> whoops
[04:41] <Treenaks> defendguin: try dmesg | grep ACPI
[04:41] <LinuxJones> will, you can apt-cache search java from console, even better is using synaptic to search for it
[04:42] <will> LinuxJones: i got it installing now, but where do i find  the list of what packages are availabue with regards to my sources.list?
[04:44] <defendguin> Treenaks, is there anyway i can send you a txt file of the messages?
[04:44] <LinuxJones> will, oh you can see all of the files available to apt by running synaptic and selecting all right under search history
[04:44] <Treenaks> defendguin: is it much?
[04:44] <defendguin> yes
[04:44] <defendguin> cant paste it here
[04:44] <Treenaks> defendguin: does it say it's disabled stuff?
[04:44] <Treenaks> defendguin: paste only the last 2 lines?
[04:45] <will> ah so synaptic and apt-get are linked then?
[04:45] <psi> someone once posted a link to a 'Human' xmms skin. does anyone know where I can find it?
[04:45] <Treenaks> will: they use the same package list
[04:45] <LinuxJones> will, yes synaptic is a graphical front end for apt
[04:46] <defendguin> Treenaks, the last 50 lines or so are all some error messages
[04:46] <defendguin> ACPI disabled because your bios is from 1999 and too old
[04:46] <defendguin> ACPI: IRQ9 SCI: Edge set to Level Trigger.
[04:46] <defendguin> ACPI: Subsystem revision 20040816
[04:46] <defendguin> ACPI: Interpreter disabled.
[04:46] <Treenaks> defendguin: aha!
[04:46] <Treenaks> defendguin: upgrade your bios :)
[04:46] <Treenaks> defendguin: or, add acpi=force on the kernel command line
[04:46] <linux_mafia> psi, http://anka.org/henrik/humanxmms
[04:47] <will> so say if i download a .deb file how do i install that? do i enter it to apt-get?
[04:47] <defendguin> Treenaks, i looked around for a bios didnt see one on the dell site
[04:47] <longsleep> i am not able to set the preffered text editor through the gui .. where do i set this manually?
[04:47] <Treenaks> defendguin: add acpi=force to the kernel ocmmand line then
[04:47] <defendguin> in the menu.list file?
[04:47] <psi> linux_mafia: thanks
[04:47] <linux_mafia> will, sudo dpkg -i <package>
[04:47] <Treenaks> defendguin: yes, just add it to one of the commented lines (the one specifying kernel options)
[04:48] <Treenaks> defendguin: DON'T uncomment the line, just add to it
[04:48] <defendguin> k
[04:48] <linux_mafia> psi, its a bit nasty though, no offense to the author if they here
[04:48] <LinuxJones> longsleep, preferred applications will not allow you to select another editor ?
[04:48] <Treenaks> defendguin: the "# kopt=" line, jsut add acpi=off to the end of that line
[04:48] <Treenaks> defendguin: then run update-grub
[04:49] <will> does that work for most packages using dpkg?
[04:49] <psi> linux_mafia: it seems okay to me
[04:49] <linux_mafia> will, well yes, unless they have dependancies
[04:49] <linux_mafia> psi, each to their own ;)
[04:49] <will> can you install redhat .rpm's?
[04:50] <longsleep> LinuxJones, right .. i can set it but next time i reload the tab its reset
[04:50] <LinuxJones> will,  yes you need to install alien but then you may run into dependency problems
[04:50] <linux_mafia> will, you can use an app called alien which will convert rpm to deb, dosent always work though
[04:50] <defendguin> Treenaks, you mean acpi=force
[04:50] <longsleep> LinuxJones, it allways falls back to kwrite ..
[04:50] <LinuxJones> longsleep, let me try
[04:51] <linux_mafia> will, although i have used alien many times with no probs, just wouldnt alien anything important to system stability
[04:51] <Treenaks> defendguin: uh, of course
[04:51] <will> so what about things like wine? how do i install that one?
[04:52] <LinuxJones> longsleep, mine is the same it must be a bug
[04:52] <defendguin> Treenaks, you dont know where i could find a new bios for dell laptops?
[04:52] <longsleep> LinuxJones, ah ok :) .. so it is possible to set this without this app?
[04:53] <Treenaks> defendguin: ask dell
[04:53] <linux_mafia> defendguin, what model
[04:53] <longsleep> LinuxJones, do you file a bug report or should i do that?
[04:53] <defendguin> linux_mafia, its a cpi-a series
[04:54] <defendguin> which is a dell latitude
[04:55] <LinuxJones> longsleep, I have some work to do right now, would you do it ?
[04:55] <longsleep> LinuxJones, ok doing it
[04:55] <LinuxJones> longsleep, :D
[05:00] <linux_mafia> defendguin, what version bios you have currently?
[05:00] <defendguin> hmmmm i think i found a bios that was released in 2001 2 years after mine was released
[05:01] <defendguin> http://support.dell.com/support/downloads/type.aspx?c=us&cs=19&l=en&s=dhs&SystemID=LAT_PNT_MOB_CPI_A&category=0&os=BIOSA&osl=en&deviceid=262&devlib=1
[05:01] <linux_mafia> defendguin, a15 is the most current for that model
[05:01] <defendguin> linux_mafia, how can i tell for sure
[05:01] <defendguin> its very possible that the bios has never been updated on this system
[05:02] <linux_mafia> defendguin, it shows the bios version on boot
[05:03] <defendguin> yeah i realize that but i dont feel like rebooting just this second
[05:03] <defendguin> in any case i am almost positive i have the original bios
[05:04] <defendguin> and it appears as though they have had many updates since then
[05:04] <dommi> anyone have a simple python script that I could use to test on my webserver?
[05:05] <defendguin> not sure how to install it though as i have no floppy drive :(
[05:07] <jordi> does anyone have a ubuntu apt line handy?
[05:07] <defendguin> ahh i guess i can do it on a CD
[05:08] <LinuxJones> defendguin, could you burn it to a cdrom ?
[05:09] <Kosai> jordi: deb http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu warty main restricted universe
[05:09] <jordi> Kosai: thx
[05:15] <defendguin> LinuxJones, yes i found an already made iso
[05:15] <LinuxJones> defendguin, great
[05:17] <defendguin> im going to take out the acpi=force line from my menu.list file in hopes this will be the fix
[05:17] <linux_mafia> hey what the, i just realised i don't have hal-device-manager anymore, does everyone else here still have it?
[05:18] <joem> linux_mafia, it is a seperate package now
[05:18] <linux_mafia> sweet
[05:18] <linux_mafia> figured it would be something like that
[05:19] <defendguin> brb
[05:19] <Nonphasis> there is something wrong w/ ubuntu kernel/scheduling...
[05:20] <Nonphasis> sound crackling while copying
[05:20] <Nonphasis> i thought 2.6 kernels should have solved it
[05:21] <giorsat> hi. first time I try ubuntu. great. anybody can teach me please how to configure a wireless prism2usb wlan-ng card in it?. the graphical tool doesn't work but the card is recognized and possibly working if configured. don't find config files..:(
[05:21] <zakili> hi to all.
[05:21] <Treenaks> giorsat: just plug it in and start the network configuration tool from the menu
[05:21] <Treenaks> zakili: hi
[05:21] <zakili> r u all ununtu users :)
[05:22] <zakili> i install my ubuntu yesterday ..
[05:22] <giorsat> already tried. it finds eth0 but not wlan0. so I dont' know what to do
[05:22] <Nonphasis> and mouse pointer is jerky too
[05:22] <zakili> so i just wonna see community
[05:23] <Treenaks> giorsat: it's called eth0
[05:23] <Treenaks> giorsat: the "wlan" names are outdated
[05:23] <Treenaks> giorsat: check the output of dmesg
[05:23] <zakili> type sudo dmesg|grep wireless  
[05:23] <zakili> and see if kernel load module
[05:24] <Treenaks> zakili: sudo is not required for dmesg
[05:25] <giorsat> this is the output. tha card is found but I don't know the name and where to configure ip address(it uses wrongly dhcp). (apart from /etc/wlan/config files already done)usb 1-2: new full speed USB device using address 4
[05:25] <giorsat> prism2usb_init: prism2_usb.o: 0.2.1-pre21 Loaded
[05:25] <giorsat> prism2usb_init: dev_info is: prism2_usb
[05:25] <giorsat> usbcore: registered new driver prism2_usb
[05:26] <defendguin> woo hoo
[05:26] <defendguin> well at least it works now with acpi
[05:27] <zakili> how to enable suspend on sony vaio notebook?
[05:28] <zakili> are here some laptop users?
[05:28] <defendguin> yeah
[05:29] <zakili> so what is dmesg | grep wireless output?
[05:30] <defendguin> nothing
[05:30] <Phr0stByte> I cant get beep-media-player to play audio CD - can any1 help? (I get other audio on the system)
[05:32] <zakili> is someone use suspend mode on laptop?
[05:33] <zakili> how to configure acpi to enable this options?
[05:33] <Treenaks> zakili: wait for Hoary, that'll support it better
[05:34] <zakili> thanks.
[05:35] <zakili> is there some forum with ubuntu community?
[05:36] <Treenaks> you can join the mailing list
[05:36] <DimSum> Lol @ Mailing Lists
[05:36] <Treenaks> DimSum: I personally like mailing lists a lot better than forums
[05:37] <zakili> i sow it. thanks
[05:37] <Phr0stByte> sound that is...
[05:38] <DimSum> Treenaks: Why?
[05:39] <Atticus> hello everyone, i was just wondering if i should install a new nvidia driver package or use the ubuntu default?
[05:40] <Treenaks> DimSum: most forums I've seen are populated with 15-year old "I'm better than you" will-never-have-a-girlfriend nerds
[05:40] <DimSum> "most".
[05:40] <Treenaks> DimSum: 90%
[05:40] <George> I take offense to that!
[05:40] <George> :P
[05:40] <DimSum> I think you'll find that with proper moderation, any forum can be worthwhile
[05:40] <DimSum> Less moderation, and more administration, actually
[05:40] <Atticus> Almost every MMORPG forum is like that Treenaks
[05:41] <DimSum> That's because every goddamn RPG user is an idiot
[05:41] <Atticus> lol i take offense to that :P
[05:41] <DimSum> RPGs are what 13 year olds play because their parents won't let them "blow things up"
[05:41] <Atticus> SimSum, i think a better outlet for that anger would be an FPS game?
[05:41] <DimSum> Exactly
[05:42] <DimSum> Only decent RPG I've ever seen is City of Heroes, which is absolutely incredible
[05:42] <Atticus> DimSum, yes CoH is awesome
[05:42] <DimSum> =)
[05:42] <DimSum> Liked the sound of Lineage II, as well
[05:42] <DimSum> But it's practically the same, just without the superheroness...
[05:42] <Atticus> Im looking forward to Vanguarg Live
[05:42] <DimSum> Never heard of it :\
[05:42] <Atticus> Oops Vanguard*
[05:43] <Atticus> Its an mmorpg based on the unreal 3 technology
[05:43] <DimSum> Oh
[05:43] <DimSum> Not a fan of the new engines
[05:43] <DimSum> I'm waiting for Quake 4
[05:43] <Atticus> Basically meaning it will be beautiful
[05:43] <Atticus> Unreal 3 engine wont be out till 2006 
[05:43] <DimSum> I just know that Raven aren't gonna ruin Quake 4 with darkness like ID did with Doom 3
[05:44] <DimSum> Doom 3 = Quake 3 + Ubertools + complete darkness
[05:44] <Atticus> DimSum, have you ever seen a fully lit doom 3 room... it looks like shit, thats why they made it all dark :D
[05:44] <Atticus> To hide their flaws
[05:44] <DimSum> Exactly lol
[05:44] <DimSum> I made a mod for Doom 3, called VariLight
[05:44] <jovian> hi all new to ubuntu so forgive the dumb question but how do I mount a different hard drive
[05:44] <Atticus> DimSum, is that a flashlight mod?
[05:44] <DimSum> Which strapped lights onto the majority of the guns in Doom 3; makes it much more playable
[05:44] <DimSum> Yeah, Atticus
[05:44] <jovian> new to gnome as well :)
[05:44] <Atticus> DimSum, i think i downlaoded that!
[05:44] <DimSum> It was featured in some german gaming magazine, lol
[05:45] <DimSum> Atticus: Haha :D
[05:45] <Atticus> DimSum, either that one or someone elses
[05:45] <DimSum> Yeah, there's like... three
[05:45] <DimSum> Duct Tape, Hello Kitty, and VariLight
[05:45] <DimSum> VariLight was based on Duct Tape, as was Hello Kitty
[05:45] <Atticus> sweet, do you mod for any other games?
[05:46] <Atticus> I'm mainly into mapping
[05:46] <DimSum> Well, I did bits and pieces with Jedi Knight 2
[05:47] <DimSum> Never really done much mapping, to be honest; found it too difficult, lol
[05:47] <Atticus> DimSum, yea mapping takes alot of patience and understand of the mapping tool, but once you figure that out it is alot of fun.
[05:47] <DimSum> Yeah
[05:47] <DimSum> I was actually going to create a sequel to ROTT
[05:48] <DimSum> You remember ROTT?
[05:48] <Atticus> nope
[05:48] <DimSum> Was a Doom 1-style game written by Apogee
[05:48] <jovian> hi all new to ubuntu so forgive the dumb question but how do I mount a different hard drive
[05:48] <DimSum> Ahhh, http://www.3drealms.com/rott/
[05:48] <DimSum> It was awesome
[05:48] <Atticus> cool ill check it out
[05:48] <DimSum> And if any game deserves a sequel, it's ROTT
[05:49] <DimSum> As soon as the Quake 3 engine goes OSS, I'm going to do it :)
[05:49] <Atticus> awesome
[05:49] <Treenaks> DimSum: ROTT was great
[05:49] <DimSum> Treenaks, hell yeah
[05:49] <DimSum> Beat Doom with a really large stick
[05:49] <Atticus> ill have to search for a download of it
[05:49] <Treenaks> I mean... flying body parts..
[05:50] <DimSum> You can get it off their site, Atticus
[05:50] <DimSum> In the downloads section =)
[05:50] <DimSum> Treenaks: Gibbing :D
[05:50] <Treenaks> DimSum: Ludicrous Gibs :)
[05:50] <DimSum> If/when I do write the sequel, it's going to be perfect to the original
[05:50] <Atticus> Dimsum, awesome
[05:50] <DimSum> It WILL be ROTT, just with a new graphics engine
[05:51] <DimSum> I'll even have the 90 degree wall limitation in it :D
[05:51] <Treenaks> DimSum: 8)
[05:51] <DimSum> Fuck Carmack and his "Doom 1 Remake"; this will illustrate to him just exactly what a re-make should look like, lol
[05:51] <Atticus> On the pc im on now, doom 1 is about the only game i could run lol
[05:51] <DimSum> Atticus, what specs? :|
[05:51] <Atticus> 500mhz 384mb ram geforce 4 mx 420
[05:52] <Atticus> my other pc is 3.2ghz 1gb ram radeon 9800xt
[05:52] <DimSum> You could play Quake 1 and Quake 2
[05:52] <DimSum> Easily
[05:52] <DimSum> Hell, you could play Quake 3
[05:52] <Atticus> haha i know i was just being sarcastic
[05:52] <DimSum> You'd only get 60fps, but still... ;P
[05:52] <Atticus> This thing is night and day with my good pc though
[05:52] <DimSum> I get like 400 fps on Quake 3
[05:52] <Atticus> im just using this for ubuntu
[05:52] <DimSum> with everything on max
[05:53] <DimSum> [ Computer Stats ]  [ OS: Windows XP Professional, Service Pack 2 (5.1 - 2600) ]  [ Uptime: 20h 42m 21s ]  [ CPU: 4-Intel Pentium 4, 2399MHz, 512KB (0% Load) ]  [ Memory: Usage: 484/1023MB (47.31%) [|||||||||||||||]  ]  [ GFX: NVIDIA Quadro FX 2000 ]  [ Resolution: 1600x1200 32bit 85Hz ] 
[05:53] <Atticus> DimSum, is there some better nvidia drivers i can download for ubuntu
[05:53] <DimSum> Nope, Linux + Graphics == no-go
[05:53] <DimSum> Just don't even attempt it
[05:53] <DimSum> lol
[05:53] <Atticus> lol k
[05:54] <Atticus> yea i kinda figured that out when my pc was running screen saves at 2 fps
[05:54] <DimSum> rofl
[05:54] <DimSum> I'm a Windows user anyway, I'm just hanging out here because I love the Ubuntu look and feel
[05:54] <DimSum> I ported their theme, Human, to XP ;P
[05:54] <Atticus> dimsum, yea me too..
[05:54] <Atticus> DimSum, ive always used windows just installed this yesterday and i really like it
[05:54] <DimSum> Yeah
[05:54] <DimSum> Linux is unusable as a main OS, though... just something to play with, really
[05:55] <DimSum> Atticus, check this: http://www.gfxoasis.com/board/index.php?showtopic=10933
[05:55] <Atticus> DimSum, i think a normal internet surfer, office user could get alot out of this OS
[05:55] <Atticus> For gamers, no way
[05:55] <DimSum> Hmmm, only if they didn't encounter any problems with it in the course of their work
[05:55] <Kamion> a good chunk of our purpose in existence is to make Linux usable as ordinary people's main operating system
[05:56] <DimSum> Kamion: Until you can get rid of random errors, then it's just not going to happen
[05:56] <DimSum> Windows and OS X has Linux beat hands-down in that respect
[05:56] <DimSum> Windows more than OS X, as well.
[05:56] <Kamion> dude, that's laughable coming from Windows :-)
[05:56] <Atticus> lol
[05:57] <DimSum> Obviously you've never used Windows properly, then.
[05:57] <Atticus> Windows costs money :(
[05:57] <DimSum> I use all five major platforms on a daily basis, and I have never had a single issue with Windows since Windows ME, oooh... 4 years ago now.
[05:57] <Atticus> haha
[05:57] <DimSum> Atticus: No it doesn't, lol
[05:57] <Kamion> perhaps; I stopped using proprietary operating systems many years ago
[05:57] <Kamion> I do have to support my parents using it, though, and it's pain
[05:57] <Atticus> DimSum, technically yes... but of course we know ways around this lol
[05:57] <Kamion> I'd much rather support my parents using Ubuntu.
[05:58] <DimSum> Kamion: What would you tell them when, for no reason, their networking stops working?
[05:58] <Atticus> Im glad ubuntu uses gnome
[05:58] <Kamion> same as I tell them when it randomly stops working in Windows
[05:58] <Kamion> "I'll come up and fix it"
[05:58] <jkg> DimSum: have you had problems with your networking randomly stopping working under Ubuntu?
[05:58] <DimSum> Atticus: I've never paid for a single piece of MS software in my life, but considering that I work for them, it's not really a good argument
[05:58] <DimSum> jkg: Yes
[05:58] <jkg> 'cos I haven't, as yet.
[05:58] <jkg> whereas I have under Windows, many a time :)
[05:59] <Atticus> DimSum, neither have i.. other than what came on my new pc
[05:59] <DimSum> jkg: Had to edit the network conf files to get it to work again, since the Network Settings applet didn't actually work.
[05:59] <Atticus> i have office 2003 also heh
[05:59] <jkg> oh, fair enough.
[05:59] <DimSum> It's just things LIKE that...
[05:59] <DimSum> The major problems I've had with *n*x in the past has been with XFree86
[05:59] <DimSum> Never had any issues like that in Solaris, of course, since they use XSun
[05:59] <Atticus> Kamion: what is the lowest end computer that ubuntu has run stabaly on?
[05:59] <jkg> I was actually just thinking how Ubuntu is probably the first linux distro I've seen (and admittedly I'm a debian weenie through and through) that I might be willing to give to my parents.
[06:00] <DimSum> jkg: Fedora isn't bad, either, but it's still LINUX
[06:00] <DimSum> You just don't have random issues like that in Windows
[06:00] <Kamion> Atticus: don't actually know for i386; people have run it on blue-and-white G3s, which are at the very bottom end of the supported powerpc spectrum
[06:00] <jkg> I have lots of random problems in Windows.
[06:00] <DimSum> jkg: Then you might want to consider that you're having hardware issues
[06:01] <DimSum> Either that, or you're running a 9x-kernel version of Windows
[06:01] <Atticus> Kamion, Ubuntu runs as smooth as it does on my 3.2ghz 1gb ram box as this 500mhz box, i commend you for that!
[06:01] <DimSum> If you're running 2K, XP, or 2k3, you won't have any problems if your hardware isn't damaged
[06:01] <jkg> no, XP. and no, my hardware runs fine under Linux :P
[06:01] <Qo-noS> jkg: not forgetting the freezes one experiences with SP2 upgrades, klez, sexy melissa, sobig, code red, etc ;)
[06:01] <DimSum> The first time I had XP crash/fail on me was last night actually, and that was because one of my hard drives was failing
[06:02] <Kosai> Atticus: Yeah, my desktop is 500MHz.  No complaints here either.
[06:02] <DimSum> Qo-noS: Sorry, you get viruses?
[06:02] <jkg> given that microsoft publish errata every month I'm not sure how you can claim XP never has any problems.
[06:02] <DimSum> Qo-noS: Are you an idiot, then? Because you have to be to catch viruses.
[06:02] <Kosai> DimSum: "Only idiots look at jpegs", right?
[06:02] <DimSum> jkg: Keep up to date with patches and you won't have any issues.
[06:02] <jkg> I mean what's this whole JPEG thing about?
[06:02] <Qo-noS> DimSum: most windows users get them...only thing is whetehr they know it or they don't ;)
[06:02] <Atticus> If you take care of your XP system, meaning no spyware adware viruses... then you shouldnt ever have a problem with it if you know how to correctly use a pc.
[06:02] <Kamion> DimSum: please stop treating other people here with quite so much disrespect
[06:02] <jkg> DimSum: what because the patches fix issues that don't exist until the patch is released, or something/
[06:02] <jkg> ?
[06:03] <DimSum> Kamion: Sorry
[06:03] <DimSum> jkg: No, it's that nobody KNOWS about them until the patch is released
[06:03] <DimSum> That's the benefit of closed-source software
[06:03] <jkg> oh, I'm sorry
[06:03] <DimSum> People can't just leaf through the code and find new ways of rooting you
[06:03] <jkg> I hadn't realised you were trolling, I thought you just misunderstood. mea culpa.
[06:03] <Kosai> DimSum: That.. doesn't sound like a benefit to me.
[06:03] <DimSum> Incidentally, the JPEG flaw was patched in SP2
[06:03] <Qo-noS> DimSum: the poison pics code is already in the open...expect probs ;)
[06:04] <DimSum> Qo-noS: It's already been patched.
[06:04] <DimSum> If you didn't upgrade to SP2 when it was released, on August 8th, then it's your own fault
[06:04] <Kosai> DimSum: Which many people are refusing to install because of serious networking brokenness.
[06:04] <Atticus> Is there any program similar to Gaim for windows
[06:04] <Atticus> i am in love with it
[06:04] <DimSum> Serious networking brokenness? Haven't had any issues with it, to be honest.
[06:04] <jkg> is gaim not available for windows?
[06:04] <DimSum> Had quite a few networking issues, which I have since determined was related to my router
[06:04] <Qo-noS> DimSun: patched? oh expect patches for the patch...isn't it standard Windows policy to have to repatch patches and then re-repatch them again LOL
[06:04] <jkg> I tend to use psi, under windows and linux, though.
[06:04] <NewComer> Atticus: yeah, Gaim for Windows :)
[06:04] <Atticus> jkg: i think its for gnome only
[06:04] <DimSum> Setting my MTU lower in the router conf fixed everything
[06:05] <DimSum> Qo-noS: Nope
[06:05] <Atticus> newcomer, really thats awesome
[06:05] <DimSum> Qo-noS: Never actually seen that happen, to be honest.
[06:05] <NewComer> Atticus: there's also trillain
[06:05] <Qo-noS> DimSum: you obviously living on a differnt planet :P
[06:05] <NewComer> trillian
[06:05] <DimSum> What happens is, they have to release support patches for people who didn't patch the first time around
[06:05] <Atticus> NewComer: ive used trillian but it did not appeal to me
[06:05] <cyphos> does anyone know what packages I need to get the kernel source?
[06:05] <DimSum> So that after they get infected, they have to release not only a patch to guard against infection, but one to remove the infection itself
[06:05] <NewComer> Atticus: then go for Gaim
[06:06] <Atticus> ok
[06:06] <DimSum> If people just stfu'd and patched when MS released them, there wouldn't be any problems with security
[06:06] <Qo-noS> DimSum: *sigh* think you are in the wrong channel dude...no one believes you or cares abpout what you say ;)
[06:06] <DimSum> Qo-noS: That's because you're fanboys, so... you're not going to believe me
[06:06] <DimSum> Because you're already set in your opinions
[06:06] <jkg> DimSum: I'm really not sure why you're here. if Windows is perfection personified, and nothing else is worth considering...
[06:07] <DimSum> jkg: As I've said earlier, I'm here because I happen to think that Ubuntu is the best distro of a barely tolerable bunch, and I like the UI
[06:07] <jkg> I just wouldn't claim either was even close to perfect.
[06:07] <DimSum> jkg, just out of interest, what version of Windows do you run at the moment?
[06:07] <Qo-noS> DimSum: yeah goto #windows or whatever...like I say, you are in the wrong channel ;)
[06:07] <jkg> XP.
[06:07] <DimSum> jkg: Specifics...
[06:07] <DimSum> Pro? Home? MCE? SP0? SP1? SP2?
[06:07] <jkg> XP Pro, but surely that shouldn't matter.
[06:08] <jkg> with SP2, obviously.
[06:08] <DimSum> Had any problems recently?
[06:08] <DimSum> cyphos: Linux-devel
[06:08] <DimSum> I think, lemme check
[06:08] <DimSum> Might be linux-source
[06:08] <cyphos> DimSum: thanx buddy :)
[06:08] <Kamion> linux-source-2.6.8.1
[06:08] <DimSum> That's the one
[06:08] <cyphos> *happy dance*
[06:09] <DimSum> and linux-headers
[06:09] <DimSum> as well
[06:09] <DimSum> I think
[06:09] <Kamion> cyphos: out of interest, what do you need the self-built kernel for? we'd like the stock kernel to suit as many people as possible, unless they actually have to patch the source
[06:09] <Kamion> DimSum: nope
[06:09] <DimSum> Kamion: Really? Ah
[06:09] <Kamion> linux-headers is there for if you need to build third-party drivers
[06:09] <DimSum> Yes, that's what I was doing ;P
[06:09] <DimSum> Was building Orinoco drivers
[06:09] <DimSum> To support monitor mode
[06:09] <Kamion> Aren't they in the stock kernel?
[06:09] <Kamion> ah
[06:09] <DimSum> ;P
[06:10] <DimSum> Only reason I'm running Ubuntu is to capture packets, lol
[06:10] <DimSum> Good ol' airsnort
[06:10] <jkg> oh, yeah, if I want to build a 3rd party module (the acx100 driver, FWIW) I should only need the linux-headers package, right?
[06:10] <Kamion> jkg: yes
[06:10] <Kamion> jkg: we ship acx100, though ...
[06:10] <jkg> oh!
[06:10] <jkg> I'd just assumed you wouldn't :)
[06:10] <DimSum> Haha
[06:10] <DimSum> Leet.
[06:11] <Kamion> $ dpkg -c /mirror/ubuntu/pool/main/l/linux-source-2.6.8.1/linux-image-2.6.8.1-3-386_2.6.8.1-10_i386.deb | grep acx
[06:11] <Kamion> drwxr-xr-x root/root         0 2004-09-30 16:05:42 ./lib/modules/2.6.8.1-3-386/kernel/drivers/net/wireless/acx/
[06:11] <Kamion> -rw-r--r-- root/root    171403 2004-09-30 16:05:42 ./lib/modules/2.6.8.1-3-386/kernel/drivers/net/wireless/acx/acx_pci.ko
[06:11] <jkg> coolness.
[06:11] <Kamion> jkg: it may not be in the discover tables, since Debian don't ship it (and I suspect it only works on i386 anyway ...); let me know 'lspci' and 'lspci -n' output and I'll arrange for it to be autodetected
[06:12] <Kamion> it is available in the installer environment, though.
[06:12] <jkg> ah, it seems to be detected but there's an error uploading the firmware
[06:12] <Kamion> jkg: what error?
[06:13] <jkg> ERROR: no directory for firmware file specified, ABORTING. Make sure to set module parameter 'firmware_dir'! (specified as absolute path!)
[06:13] <jkg> acx100_reset_dev: Failed to upload firmware to the ACX100
[06:13] <jkg> (in dmesg)
[06:13] <Kamion> oh, the acx driver is annoying like that
[06:13] <DimSum> Anyone want a GMail account?
[06:13] <Kamion> it doesn't use the standard request_firmware() kernel interface, for some reason; probably one of the reasons it isn't in the standard upstream kernel yet
[06:14] <Kamion> you need to do 'modprobe acx_pci firmware_dir=/wherever/you/put/the/kernel', and probably a bunch of other options; it's not a very high-quality driver yet.
[06:15] <Kamion> I have an acx100 card, and always meant to fix it up ...
[06:16] <jkg> is there no config file I can prod to set the firmware_dir variable?
[06:17] <Atticus> hmm, i seem to be having a problem getting the nes emulator i just downloaded to run
[06:17] <Kamion> jkg: the acx100 driver source comes with a script to do it; scripts/start_net, I believe
[06:17] <Atticus> FCE ultra
[06:19] <Kamion> jkg: you could create /etc/modprobe.d/acx_pci and put 'options acx_pci firmware_dir=/blah' in it, though
[06:19] <Kamion> (I think)
[06:19] <jaso1> hi room! I'm afraid to say I'm a linux newbie. I installed Ubuntu last night and so far have been very impressed with it. Problem is that I can't see any of my drives on my raid controller. I've been looking on google but have seen a fair amount of conflicting information. Could anybody on here point me in the right direction for some information on setting it up on Ubuntu? cheers.
[06:19] <jkg> ah, cool, thanks.
[06:19] <jkg> just trying the start_net script first.
[06:20] <Kamion> jaso1: can you send me the output of 'cut -f1,2 /proc/bus/pci/devices'? Sorry, you might have to transcribe it.
[06:20] <jaso1> just  a sec
[06:20] <jaso1> Kamion, should I IM it or send on here?
[06:20] <Kamion> (press alt-f2 to get to a shell, alt-f1 to get back to the UI)
[06:20] <Kamion> jaso1: /msg is fine
[06:21] <jaso1> 0000    10de01e0
[06:21] <jaso1> 0001    10de01eb
[06:21] <jaso1> 0002    10de01ee
[06:21] <jaso1> 0003    10de01ed
[06:21] <jaso1> 0004    10de01ec
[06:21] <jaso1> 0005    10de01ef
[06:21] <jaso1> 0008    10de0060
[06:21] <jaso1> 0009    10de0064
[06:21] <jaso1> 0010    10de0067
[06:21] <Kamion> hm, I meant private /msg
[06:21] <jaso1> 0011    10de0067
[06:21] <jaso1> 0012    10de0068
[06:21] <jaso1> 0030    10de006a
[06:21] <jaso1> 0040    10de006c
[06:21] <jaso1> 0048    10de0065
[06:21] <jaso1> 00f0    10de01e8
[06:21] <jaso1> 0158    10ec8169
[06:21] <jaso1> 0160    12838212
[06:21] <jaso1> 0170    104c8024
[06:21] <jaso1> 0200    10de0311
[06:21] <jaso1> sorry!
[06:21] <jaso1> new to irv
[06:21] <jaso1> new to IRC as well!
[06:22] <Kamion>         12838212        ide     siimage IT/ITE8212 Dual channel ATA RAID controller (PCI version seems to be IT8212, embedded seems to be ITE8212)
[06:22] <Kamion> well, that ought to be supported ...
[06:23] <jaso1> it's detected in the device manager GUI but none of the drives work
[06:23] <Kamion> oh, you've gone through the installer already?
[06:23] <jaso1> yeah....i have a standard drive that I installed to
[06:24] <jaso1> my controller is the ITE8212 integrated 
[06:25] <Kamion> there should be an underlying ATA controller as well, shouldn't there?
[06:26] <jaso1> I have a standard ATA controller, a raid controller and a SATA controller. I'm not using the SATA one
[06:26] <Kamion> aha, 10de0065 is NForce2 IDE
[06:26] <jaso1> that's the one
[06:27] <Kamion> is the amd74xx module loaded?
[06:27] <Kamion> I may be missing the point, though
[06:27] <jkg> woot, I have a working wlan0 interface. thanks for your help, Kamion :)
[06:28] <jaso1> how can I find out?
[06:28] <Kamion> jkg: cool
[06:28] <Kamion> jaso1: look in the output of 'lsmod' in a terminal
[06:29] <jaso1> yes it's there
[06:31] <Kamion> jaso1: hm, I'm kind of lost, I'm afraid; you could mail ubuntu-users to see if anyone else there has the same kind of controller
[06:32] <jaso1> ok....thanks for your time
[06:34] <jl> hiya. anyone else experiencing the default X cursor "x" placed dead center of the screen which won't go away until you drag an open window over it?
[06:34] <Kosai> jl: Yes.  Turn off the software cursor in X.
[06:35] <Kosai> (Option "SWCursor" "Off", IIRC.  See ubuntu-users.)
[06:35] <jl> ok... xf86config file change right?
[06:35] <jl> i just subscribed to that list. haven't found that one
[06:35] <jl> thanks
[06:36] <Kosai> jl: Right.
[06:37] <jl> ty
[06:37] <Kosai> It might be HWCursor off, either.  'fraid I can't remember.
[06:37] <jl> i am looking.
[06:37] <jl> if someone can dig up that post, i would appreciate it.
[06:37] <jl> a link i mean
[06:41] <jl> NM   i think i got it. Option "SWCursor" "off" under device section for the video card
[06:41] <jl> bbl.  thanks guys
[06:47] <will> hi what is the path on a standard install of ubuntu for 'sendmail'
[06:47] <joem> will, which sendmail
[06:48] <will> jsut the normal sendmail program
[06:49] <joem> :(
[06:49] <joem> which is a command
[06:49] <joem> type "which sendmail"
[06:51] <bunbury> Hello I am having trouble getting a USB palm pilot recognised. Nothing shows up in /dev when I connect it. Any help appreciated.
[06:51] <Kamion> will: /usr/sbin/sendmail
[06:51] <HcE> bunbury: modprobe mass-storage
[06:51] <HcE> ah, sory
[06:51] <HcE> thought it was a thumbdrive
[06:51] <will> thanks!
[06:51] <Kosai> bunbury: modprobe visor, perhaps.
[06:52] <bunbury> FATAL: Module mass_storage not found.
[06:52] <bunbury> What next?
[06:52] <bunbury> I ran that as root
[06:52] <Kosai> bunbury: Try modprobe visor, and then tell us if 'dmesg' has anything related to your Palm at the bottom.
[06:53] <will> how do i enter that into thunderbird mail? it says its an invalid server!
[06:54] <bunbury> yes there is a reference to USB serial support being registered for Palm OS
[06:54] <bunbury> That was for Kosai
[06:55] <Kosai> bunbury: Great.  Then you're all set.
[06:55] <Kosai> It should tell you which /dev/ttyS* device has been registered, and you can feed that to your sync program.
[06:57] <housetier> is there a livecd somewhere?
[06:57] <bunbury> Kosai: doesn't seem to I am afraid
[06:58] <Kosai> Oh.  Hm.  Well, try /dev/ttyS0, then /dev/ttyS1.
[06:59] <bunbury> Kosai: are they for USB connections?
[06:59] <RuffianSoldier> USB Key???
[07:00] <Kosai> bunbury: Traditionally they're the serial ports, but the "USB serial support" is bridging between your USB crable and the serial device.
[07:00] <RuffianSoldier> Universal Serial Bus!
[07:00] <RuffianSoldier> SUB!
[07:00] <RuffianSoldier> USB!
[07:02] <Mitario> lo everyone
[07:02] <RuffianSoldier> HI
[07:02] <RuffianSoldier> MIT
[07:02] <RuffianSoldier> Oven Mit
[07:03] <Mitario> eh, hi :)
[07:05] <RuffianSoldier> I am also known as q2
[07:05] <bunbury> Kosai: Tried ttys0-3. No joy. Under Mandrake, /dev/usb is created when I plug in the Pilot and I use /dev/usb/tts/0. None of this seems to happen in Ubuntu, although as we have seen, the Pilot seems to be registered OK. 
[07:05] <bunbury> Does anyone have any further clues, please?
[07:06] <RuffianSoldier> Windows emulator?
[07:10] <RuffianSoldier> Would a windows emulator work for a USB Key?????
[07:11] <cyphos> where can I get mono packages?
[07:12] <RuffianSoldier> apt-cache search mono
[07:12] <RuffianSoldier> apt-get install mono?
[07:13] <RuffianSoldier> What is mono>
[07:13] <cyphos> no repository contains mono
[07:13] <cyphos> http://www.mono-project.com
[07:13] <cyphos> the start of a revolution ;) hehe
[07:15] <RuffianSoldier> never used such a thing
[07:15] <plovs> cyphos, deb http://www.getsweaaa.com/~tseng/ubuntu/debs ./
[07:17] <cyphos> plovs: you're the greatest ;)
[07:17] <plovs> cyphos, i get that all the time :)
[07:18] <cyphos> however, I'm very new to debian... how do I install these packages?
[07:18] <bunbury> Kosai: I ran dmesg again and this time there was a reference to the port I needed. Sync now works. Thank you very much for your help
[07:19] <plovs> cyphos, add the line i wrote to your /etc/apt/sources.list
[07:19] <Kosai> bunbury: Oh!  I'm glad to hear that.  You're welcome.
[07:19] <cyphos> plovs: hmm, I tried adding it by Synaptic but no go
[07:20] <plovs> cyphos, just add it by hand
[07:22] <cyphos> plovs: okay did that, then started Synoptic add got the following error: Malformed line 19 in source list /etc/apt/sources.list (dist)
[07:22] <RuffianSoldier> uhh0
[07:22] <RuffianSoldier> that not good
[07:23] <RuffianSoldier> if Packal ever gets here he can help you with tha
[07:23] <RuffianSoldier> he help me yesterday
[07:25] <plovs> cyphos, what did you add (and how) ?
[07:25] <cyphos> plovs: I just put the following line in /etc/apt/sources.list:
[07:25] <cyphos> deb http://www.getsweaaa.com/~tseng/ubuntu/debs/
[07:26] <plovs> cyphos, add " ./" to the end of it (mind the space)
[07:27] <cyphos> Malformed line 20 in source list /etc/apt/sources.list (dist)
[07:27] <cyphos> :(
[07:27] <RuffianSoldier> cyphos: still lookin for mono? well its on that link http://www.getsweaaa.com/~tseng/ubuntu/debs/
[07:28] <plovs> cyphos, the line should be: "deb http://www.getsweaaa.com/~tseng/ubuntu/debs ./" 
[07:28] <cyphos> RuffianSoldier: yeah, plovs pointed that out to me... however I don't know how to install it
[07:29] <housetier> cyphos, what does line 20 look like exactly?
[07:29] <RuffianSoldier> dpkg -i (where the package is: ~/mono?)
[07:29] <RuffianSoldier> if you had KPackage it would be easy as pie
[07:31] <cyphos> okay, works now :)
[07:31] <plovs> cyphos, good!
[07:31] <dablitz> can anyone sugguest a good dvd burning prog
[07:31] <cyphos> plovs: I didn't mind the space :P
[07:32] <plovs> cyphos, the devil is in the details
[07:32] <cyphos> haha
[07:32] <RuffianSoldier> lol
[07:33] <RuffianSoldier> lol
[07:33] <RuffianSoldier> lol
[07:34] <cyphos> err, I'm missing libicu28!
[07:35] <RuffianSoldier> darn
[07:35] <RuffianSoldier> do your apt-gets work cyphos
[07:36] <cyphos> RuffianSoldier: I'm a newbie to debian (I come from the gentoo world). I've heard of apt-get, but don't know what it really is :S
[07:36] <cyphos> but I got it now, I just added the universe repository
[07:36] <paws> anyone know how to get the ubuntu installer to use an already existing partition?
[07:37] <RuffianSoldier> aaah, i was going to try Gentoo if Ubuntu would not work good
[07:37] <RuffianSoldier> but it works great
[07:37] <cyphos> cool
[07:37] <cyphos> I like Ubuntu
[07:37] <cyphos> I think I'll stick with it
[07:37] <RuffianSoldier> ya
[07:37] <RuffianSoldier> same
[07:37] <paws> i'm using it in virtual PC for a few days now, it rocks
[07:37] <cyphos> I just have a lot of learning to do yet ;)
[07:38] <paws> i want to move it to the real HD, but i dont know how to tell the installer to use my gentoo partition
[07:38] <RuffianSoldier> i came from Libranet (Basicaly the same thing since it Debian also) and i will go back to that when LN 3 comes out
[07:38] <plovs> cyphos, apt-get is easy, once you get it, a little like emerge but faster :)
[07:39] <cyphos> plovs: sounds good :)
[07:39] <sabdfl> paws: start the installation as usual
[07:39] <sabdfl> be very careful when you get to the partitioning question
[07:39] <dablitz> cyphos what is the universe repository?
[07:39] <sabdfl> one of the options will give you a details partitioning setup
[07:39] <cyphos> dablitz: the debian unstable packages, unsupported by Ubuntu
[07:40] <q2> I am RuffianSoldier
[07:40] <q2> q2 means im on my Linux box
[07:40] <dablitz> so how do I install that
[07:40] <paws> sabdfl: right...its easy to nuke the rest of the partitions
[07:40] <plovs> q2, so that's why we have so many people in this channel
[07:40] <cyphos> dablitz: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/support/documentation/howto/helpcenterhowto.2004-09-30.5359349801
[07:41] <dablitz> thanks
[07:42] <q2> plovz, huh?
[07:43] <cyphos> dablitz: n/p, have fun :)
[07:46] <cyphos> plovs: any idea of where to get mod_mono?
[07:47] <plovs> cyphos, maybe ask tseng, he is the mono-man
[07:47] <housetier> ha I am almost done with downloading the ubuntu live cd
[07:47] <Sanne> housetier: heh, me too :)
[07:47] <q2> Cyphos - open up a console and type: sudo apt-get install mono
[07:47] <q2> and mono will be installed
[07:48] <cyphos> q2: thanx, but I have mono installed now... but there are mono addons that I need :)
[07:48] <Phr0stByte> has anyone successfuly installed transcode onto their Ubuntu system?
[07:50] <q2> type: sudo apt-cache search mono          cyphos, then look at the  list, and if you want something installed, type: sudo apt-get install monowhateveritisinthelist
[07:51] <Kosai> q2: Warty doesn't ship with mono.
[07:51] <moyogo> you don't need sudo for apt-cache
[07:51] <q2> i know
[07:51] <q2> i know
[07:51] <q2> heheheheeh
[07:51] <Se7h> and you must have joliet extensions enabled on your system
[07:51] <Se7h> o.0
[07:52] <Se7h> what do i do about this ?
[07:52] <cyphos> qt: thanks!
[07:52] <q2> np
[07:53] <moyogo> Phr0stByte: what's transcode?
[07:53] <cyphos> but unforunately, xsp or mod_mono isn't contained in any of the repositories
[07:53] <Phr0stByte> util to encode raw video/audio streams
[07:53] <q2> aaah
[07:54] <Phr0stByte> moyogo: util to encode raw video/audio streams
[07:54] <moyogo> Phr0stByte: looks interesting... but it doesn't seem to have ubuntu packages
[07:54] <Phr0stByte> moyogo: dosnt look like it
[07:55] <cyphos> how can I install a package without a dependency?
[07:55] <Phr0stByte> moyogo: Ubunto multimedia is a little lacking still
[07:55] <dablitz> can someone sugguest a good gui dvd burnning app. I have found a lot on freashmeat, but looking for something working well with ubuntu
[07:56] <cyphos> dablitz: totem
[07:56] <cyphos> or sorry, you said burning
[07:56] <cyphos> dunno
[07:56] <plovs> Phr0stByte, http://wiki.ubuntulinux.org/FrequentlyAskedQuestions (add marillat's repository)
[07:57] <moyogo> cyphos: you can try installing by force, dpkg --force-depends
[07:57] <moyogo> cyphos: or look at dpkg --force-help
[07:57] <Phr0stByte> dablitz: whats wrong with Nautilus?
[07:57] <plovs> cyphos, usually forcing is a good way to hose your system though, so be carefull
[07:58] <dablitz> nothing, but looking for dvd authoring, from my digital camera
[07:58] <cyphos> I want to install gecko-sharp (libgecko-cil) without mozilla, cuz I already have firefox - any ideas?
[07:59] <plovs> cyphos, sudo apt-get install libgecko-cil
[08:00] <Phr0stByte> plovs: that liks has nothing about transcode
[08:00] <octalc0de> ubuntu u_u
[08:00] <octalc0de> i can't seem to find the kernel sources on the install disk, am i not looking hard enough
[08:01] <dablitz> i was looking at k3d, but requires kde dependencies
[08:01] <neighborlee> has anyone else seen ext3 errors ( saying it can't find ext3 partition on a given device) during boot ??
[08:01] <plovs> Phr0stByte, add: "deb ftp://ftp.nerim.net/debian-marillat/ unstable main" to your sources
[08:01] <cyphos> plovs: but it depends on mozilla :(
[08:01] <topyli> dablitz: if you don't want the dependencies, try xcdroast
[08:02] <Phr0stByte> neighborlee: in general yes - but not in Ubuntu
[08:02] <neighborlee> oh btw..do NOT update firebird through its own updater..it totally fries itself ;(
[08:02] <neighborlee> Phr0stByte, odd..well i'm seeing here in ubuntu ..I seem to have the issue with just some installers...shrug
[08:03] <dablitz> i will give it  shot thanks
[08:03] <plovs> cyphos, well, maybe you should install it then
[08:03] <neighborlee> Phr0stByte, if anything its just taking longer to boot as I get this delay then the error..oddly enough Iknow i'm using reiserfs so I dont get why the system thinks otherwise ;-)
[08:03] <plovs> neighborlee, i've seen the same...
[08:03] <cyphos> plovs: but I know that from gentoo, you can use firefox instead of mozilla for the dependency
[08:03] <q2> I like how Ubuntu came standard with Firefox
[08:04] <plovs> cyphos, because in gentoo you build from scratch here you use other people's packages
[08:04] <octalc0de> i like how ubuntu a) doesn't boot up well on a clean install (pauses for 20 minutes on something about SCSI devices) b) DOESN'T HAVE THE KERNEL SOURCES ON THE DISK
[08:04] <Phr0stByte> plovs: I have that source - but where are the dependencies?
[08:04] <neighborlee> plovs; hmm ok
[08:04] <Phr0stByte> plovs: Like libframe....
[08:04] <cyphos> plovs: oh yes, I keep forgetting that I'm using binary packages
[08:05] <plovs> Phr0stByte, in universe
[08:05] <q2> heeel ya
[08:05] <q2> sup jigga
[08:05] <Se7h> is umodpack available for ubuntu ?
[08:06] <Phr0stByte> plovs: No - it is not there
[08:07] <Phr0stByte> (libframe)
[08:07] <plovs> Phr0stByte, i can in stall transcode
[08:08] <plovs> Phr0stByte, install
[08:08] <Phr0stByte> plovs: It doesnt ask for dependencies?
[08:09] <plovs> Phr0stByte, try apt-get install -s transcode , it will give a list of the dependencies
[08:11] <Phr0stByte> plovs: The following packages have unmet dependencies:
[08:11] <Phr0stByte>   transcode: Depends: libavifile-0.7c102 (>= 1:0.7.38.20030710-1.1) but it is not installable
[08:11] <Phr0stByte>              Depends: libjasper-1.701-1 (>= 1.701.0) but it is not installable
[08:11] <Phr0stByte>              Depends: libquicktime1 (>= 0.9.3) but it is not going to be installed
[08:11] <Phr0stByte> E: Broken packages
[08:13] <plovs> Phr0stByte, the same here, sorry, let me see
[08:13] <TheMonoTone> atheros wifi cards are supported correct?
[08:13] <TheMonoTone> is there a list for what wifi cards are supported somewhere
[08:13] <octalc0de> GRARGARGARGAGR WHY ARE THERE NO KERNEL SOURCES ON THE DISK
[08:13] <Phr0stByte> plovs: brb
[08:14] <Phr0stByte> octalc0de: when you release your own distro, you can make sure the huge source package is on the CD
[08:15] <fred87> what's ubuntu's attitude to KDE?
[08:15] <octalc0de> phrostbyte: oh no! 25 MEGABYTES
[08:15] <octalc0de> where OPENOFFICE IS ON THE CD
[08:15] <octalc0de> oh no oh no oh no
[08:15] <Phr0stByte> octalc0de: Its a minimalistic install
[08:16] <TheMonoTone> or better yet, whats the module for madwifi
[08:16] <Phr0stByte> octalc0de: durring the install, you could have downloaded oo
[08:16] <akra> anyone know how to talk fstab into allowing normal users read only access to an ntfs partition?
[08:16] <fred87> akra, add umask mount options
[08:17] <fred87> akra, umask=022
[08:17] <akra> to the fstab options?
[08:17] <fred87> yep
[08:17] <akra> thanks :)
[08:17] <fred87> no prob
[08:18] <akra> I take it that the ntfs driver is still ro ?
[08:18] <fred87> unless you use captive-ntfs
[08:18] <fred87> the native driver is still ro, apart from rw as long as you don't change the size of the file
[08:18] <fred87> captive-ntfs uses wine and LUFS/FUSE to use the native windows NTFS driver in linux
[08:19] <plovs> Phr0stByte, you can get libquicktime1 and libjasper from debian
[08:19] <akra> might play one day. I only need ro anyway :)
[08:20] <fred87> can someone who's not running anything other than gnome tell me how much RAM ubuntu is taking up?
[08:20] <TheMonoTone> anyone? about the wireless deal?
[08:20] <fred87> i've been poking around a bit and possible interested in maintaining a gamecube port, andgamecube has very limited ram
[08:21] <TheMonoTone> fred87: X alone usually takes up a good amount
[08:22] <cyphos> is there a place where I can find more debian repositories?
[08:22] <TheMonoTone> google?
[08:22] <fred87> i'm a slackware user, but afaik the only distro currently working on gamecube is debian, and i'd like a bit more variety :/
[08:22] <q2> well im out
[08:22] <q2> peace all
[08:22] <vrln> cyphos: unofficial ones can be found in apt-get.org
[08:23] <fred87> oh btw anyone feel like trying a kde/qt based iptables script generator?
[08:24] <octalc0de> ok, so where can i get the ubuntu kernel package anyway
[08:24] <octalc0de> (sources)
[08:24] <George> yoyo fred87 
[08:24] <fred87> george, that a yep?
[08:24] <George> fred87: no, that's a "hi" :)
[08:24] <fred87> oh hi :)
[08:25] <cyphos> vrln: thanx
[08:25] <Kamion> octalc0de: the kernel headers are on the CD
[08:25] <cyphos> does anyone know where I can get automake1.9?
[08:25] <Kamion> octalc0de: (at least on current daily builds; they weren't in the preview release due to an oversight)
[08:26] <Kamion> octalc0de: we're actually getting kind of close to CD size limits so we have to be careful
[08:26] <octalc0de> kamion: oh, okay
[08:27] <fred87> does ubuntu actually have a policy towards KDE?
[08:28] <octalc0de> kamion: i should be able to compile linux-wlan with those, right? linux-wlan-ng wants "configured kernel source code" :/
[08:29] <octalc0de> or, where can i find a '.config' to drop into a kernel tree I get off anywhere else?
[08:30] <Phr0stByte> plovs: got it
[08:30] <Kinnison> Hi
[08:31] <George> fred87: ask daniels :)
[08:31] <dablitz> here is a dumb question, how do i set the date and time on my system
[08:31] <fred87> dablitz, "man date"
[08:31] <Kamion> octalc0de: (a) hmm, linux-wlan-ng seems odd, the config is in /boot but it might take some fiddling
[08:31] <Kamion> octalc0de: (b) I thought we already shipped everything you might need from linux-wlan-ng in our stock kernels?
[08:31] <plovs> Phr0stByte, great
[08:32] <neighborlee> anyone think I should file bugzilla then on this ext3 at boot issue ?
[08:32] <octalc0de> couldn't modprobe prism2_usb, but I installed linux-restricted-modules and it seems to work now
[08:32] <akra> dablitz: computer -> System Configuration -> Time and Date
[08:32] <neighborlee> i'm just a bit concerned why it think i've got ext3 when its clear fstat is only showing reiser ;-)
[08:32] <octalc0de> I still don't have the configuration tools, though :/
[08:32] <neighborlee> fstab LOL
[08:32] <octalc0de> "/etc/init.d/wlan" "/usr/bin/wlanctl-ng" and the like
[08:32] <octalc0de> I can probably compile those without a kernel tree though.
[08:33] <Phr0stByte> I wish this Wacon drawing tablet would magicaly start working....
[08:33] <Kamion> octalc0de: you may also be able to find them in universe
[08:33] <octalc0de> kamion: universe?
[08:33] <Kamion> prism2_usb isn't in restricted, so the above is odd ...
[08:33] <Kamion> octalc0de: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/ubuntu/components
[08:33] <fred87> hmm i really like the palmOS program that makes your computer think your palm touch screen is a wacom tablet
[08:33] <neighborlee> Phr0stByte, hmm that I know is supported by linux..assuming the kernel has support for it ;-)
[08:34] <neighborlee> Phr0stByte, at least 'most' of them anyway
[08:34] <octalc0de> kamion: or I could've been a bonehead and forgot to test it before I installed it, heh
[08:34] <Kamion> heh
[08:34] <Treenaks> Are people working on the firefox security upgrade?
[08:34] <Phr0stByte> neighborlee: it is not enable by default in 2.6
[08:35] <Phr0stByte> neighborlee: I have yet to meet someone that has one working
[08:35] <octalc0de> kamion: I don't have a network connection yet. The computer that's running ubuntu has no connectivity because it's missing the wlan configuration tools
[08:35] <neighborlee> Kamion, Any idea about this ext3 boot issue ?..i checked bugzilla and found nothing which is odd and may just be that no one yet has filed one ?
[08:35] <neighborlee> Phr0stByte, hmm yeah no surpise about kenrel but surprised about it not working for anyone yet....hmm sigh
[08:35] <neighborlee> Phr0stByte, hmm faik there is even a option for it in gimp ;-)
[08:36] <Phr0stByte> neighborlee: The driver is just atrosious
[08:36] <octalc0de> ls
[08:36] <Phr0stByte> neighborlee: yep
[08:36] <neighborlee> wish I had one i'd test it ;-)argh..and I really need one bad ;-))
[08:36] <neighborlee> someday soon!
[08:37] <Hrdwr_BoB> it's also atrocious
[08:37] <octalc0de> i'll be around later
[08:42] <defendguin> when i boot up my ubuntu box i get 2 error messages both involve module loading.  it tries to load shpchp and pciehp does anyone else have this problem?
[08:43] <plovs> defendguin, same here
[08:43] <defendguin> has this bug been reported?
[08:43] <Kinnison> defendguin: Yes; they're the hotpluggable-pci drivers; unfortunately it's hard to know if it's safe or not to load them
[08:44] <Kinnison> if you want to get rid of the warnings; create a file in /etc/hotplug/blacklist.d containing the two module names
[08:44] <defendguin> heh
[08:45] <defendguin> are we losing any functionality because they cant load those modules?  and if i did that i wouldnt know when it has been fixed
[08:46] <Kinnison> You're only losing functionality if you believe you have hot-pluggable PCI hardware which isn't being supported
[08:46] <Kinnison> Are you working on a high-end server system?
[08:46] <defendguin> no on a laptop
[08:46] <defendguin> i dont think i have any pci that i can access
[08:46] <Kinnison> Then it'll not hurt things to blacklist them
[08:47] <Kinnison> I have them blacklisted on my laptop :-)
[08:47] <defendguin> k
[08:47] <defendguin> so its possible to hot plug somehting like a network card while the machine is running and have it be recognized and work?
[08:48] <defendguin> assuming those modules work
[08:48] <Kinnison> On such hardware; I believe so; yes
[08:49] <lonewolff> evening all
[08:50] <TheMonoTone> where can I find a list of networking cards supported
[08:50] <TheMonoTone> and the modules related to those cards
[08:50] <TheMonoTone> namely the wireless kind
[08:51] <lonewolff> TheMonoTone: are you looking to get a new card or get one working youa lready have?
[08:52] <ForsaKEn`> hello, im back on ubuntu :), but this time the installation did not find my screen resolution, and put me on 640x480, 60HZ, i got LG FLATRON 795FT Plus
[08:53] <Hrdwr_BoB> what video chipset
[08:54] <ForsaKEn`> nvidia nforce2
[08:54] <ForsaKEn`> and my video card is radeon 9600XT 256MB
[08:54] <TheMonoTone> trying to get one working that I already have
[08:54] <Hrdwr_BoB> what is the output of sudo xresprobe ati
[08:54] <TheMonoTone> I think its based on atheros a/b/g chip
[08:54] <TheMonoTone> lemme check the lspci output
[08:55] <ForsaKEn`> sudo: xresprobe: command not found
[08:55] <ForsaKEn`> Section "Screen"
[08:55] <ForsaKEn`>         Identifier      "Default Screen"        Device          "ATI Technologies, Inc. Radeon 9600 XT (RV350 AR)"        Monitor         "Generic Monitor"
[08:55] <TheMonoTone> Atheros Communications, Inc. AR5212 802.11abg NIC (rev 01)
[08:56] <TheMonoTone> thats the card I have, I do modprobe ath_pci
[08:56] <TheMonoTone> and it loads up fine
[08:56] <TheMonoTone> but no /dev/ath0 exists
[08:56] <Kinnison> 'ifconfig ath0'
[08:56] <Kinnison> does that show up?
[08:56] <TheMonoTone> yeah sure does
[08:57] <defendguin> is the madwifi module in the kernel now?
[08:57] <Kinnison> that's the device then
[08:57] <TheMonoTone> lsmod | grep madwifi gets me nothing
[08:58] <TheMonoTone> is it named something different
[09:00] <Kinnison> TheMonoTone: You just said it was called 'ath_pci'
[09:00] <TheMonoTone> yeah thats the device driver
[09:00] <TheMonoTone> he said is madwifi module loaded
[09:01] <TheMonoTone> sweet it works now!
[09:01] <TheMonoTone> ok, nm
[09:01] <TheMonoTone> thanks :-)
[09:02] <defendguin> im trying to find a decently supported linux wireless card thats isnt expensive :(
[09:02] <Kinnison> defendguin: 802.11b or 802.11g ?
[09:03] <fred87> at76c503 cards are generally ok
[09:03] <TheMonoTone> this atheros card seems decent
[09:03] <TheMonoTone> its built in to the laptop though
[09:03] <TheMonoTone> so I can't say much
[09:03] <Kinnison> It's prism54 based and seems pretty good
[09:03] <topyli> wee! i finished supertux. \o/
[09:04] <defendguin> Kinnison, i would think g since i want to be able to get access anywhere its available
[09:04] <Kinnison> defendguin: the WG511 is a good choice then
[09:04] <Kinnison> defendguin: I have two and they're excellent
[09:04] <defendguin> WG511T?
[09:04] <Kinnison> No, not the T variant
[09:04] <defendguin> :(
[09:05] <defendguin> i saw a netgear at bestbuy doesnt look liek they have anything that is supported
[09:05] <defendguin> they had the wg511t and ma521 neither looked good
[09:06] <defendguin> they also had a dlink card but i didnt get the number on that one
[09:10] <defendguin> looks like the dlink only worked with ndis
[09:11] <Se7h> can anyone give me the "options" for the fstab to mount a ntfs partition?
[09:11] <Se7h> losed mine
[09:11] <dablitz> there are 3 dependencies i need to insatll k3b. how would I go about to get these dependencies
[09:11] <dablitz> they do not seem to be part of ubuntu
[09:12] <dablitz> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
[09:12] <dablitz>   k3b: Depends: k3blibs (>= 0.11.12) but it is not going to be installed
[09:12] <dablitz>        Depends: libqt3-mt (>= 3:3.1.2) but it is not installable
[09:12] <dablitz>        Depends: libvorbis0 (>= 1.0rc3-1) but it is not installable
[09:13] <defendguin> apt-get install k3b
[09:13] <Zindar> dablitz, I just tried it NOW and it works for me
[09:14] <dablitz> ok thaks
[09:14] <defendguin> lol
[09:14] <Zindar> the only kde program I actually like
[09:14] <defendguin> yeah
[09:14] <defendguin> Zindar, i agree 100%
[09:14] <defendguin> someone should make a GTK port
[09:15] <defendguin> or at lest make something with as many nice features and poiibly a better UI
[09:15] <Zindar> well.... nautilus-burner should be ok for most people... right click to burn a image is ok
[09:15] <Zindar> burning in rhytmbox would solve my last use for k3b
[09:16] <defendguin> what about making DVDs?
[09:16] <defendguin> nautilus cant do that
[09:16] <Zindar> never done that :)
[09:16] <joem> nautilus can do data dvds
[09:16] <defendguin> k3b just has too many features
[09:17] <defendguin> yeah but i do a lot of video DVDs
[09:17] <RuffianSoldier> Is kernal 2.6 eviL????????
[09:17] <Se7h> can anyone give me the "options" for the fstab to mount a ntfs partition? :|
[09:17] <subterrific> RuffianSoldier: no
[09:18] <RuffianSoldier> ok
[09:18] <RuffianSoldier> good
[09:18] <subterrific> hah
[09:18] <RuffianSoldier> I WANT KERNAL 10.8
[09:18] <subterrific> it's actually a ton better
[09:18] <RuffianSoldier> ;-)
[09:18] <pr0c> Se7h, options to accomplish what?
[09:19] <dablitz> i am still haveing issues with those three dependencies. apt-get install k3b did not owrk for me, advices?
[09:19] <darkling> I've just found an "interesting" issue with the partitioning bit of the installer...
[09:20] <pr0c> Se7h, here is an example... /dev/hdb1      /mnt/myntfs       ntfs    defaults,user,ro         0      0
[09:20] <darkling> If you use LVM, and have an existing LVM set-up,
[09:20] <darkling> when you select an LV to make it your /usr (say), 
[09:21] <darkling> it selects an entirely different LV for you to make your changes to.
[09:21] <subterrific> UGH, i've been trying to figure out why my sound was crapping out after i launched a new program....when the hell did ubuntu start enabling esd by default w/ sound events
[09:21] <pr0c> Se7h, keep in mind that in 2.6.x kernel you can only read and do limited writing to NTFS, in 2.4.x and older kernels you'll @^#! up your ntfs partition writing to it
[09:21] <subterrific> esd is such crap....breaks everything
[09:21] <Se7h> pr0c yeah i know ;)
[09:21] <subterrific> that's probably why i couldn't get flash to play audio earlier and why it was crashing firefox
[09:22] <ionrock> does anyone else get gzip errors when doing apt-get update from the universe archives?
[09:22] <Se7h> You do not have the permissions necessary to view the contents of "win1".
[09:22] <ionrock> gzip: stdin: not in gzip format
[09:22] <ionrock> Err http://archive.ubuntu.com warty/restricted Packages
[09:22] <ionrock>   Sub-process gzip returned an error code (1)
[09:23] <ionrock> that is the error I get pretty consistantly
[09:23] <pr0c> Se7h, try mounting it as a user?
[09:23] <Se7h> no can do
[09:23] <Se7h> only root...
[09:24] <pr0c> you mean you don't want that to be available or you didn't set it that way on accident?
[09:24] <Se7h> uh?
[09:25] <giorsat> hi everybody. how to enable or disable a service on ubuntu? no graphical tool ?
[09:25] <pr0c> in my example, the user has permission to mount the ntfs drive and subsequently read from it
[09:27] <Se7h> seth@devil ~/.loki $ mount -t auto /dev/hda1 /mnt/win1
[09:27] <Se7h> mount: only root can do that
[09:27] <Se7h> guess not
[09:27] <pr0c> Se7h, if you add that line to fstab then all you do is type .. mount /mnt/NameYouPicked
[09:27] <pr0c> and then upon boot that will automatically happen
[09:28] <pr0c> btw, when i say that line, i'm referrin to the line i put here not mount -t....
[09:29] <defendguin> Kinnison, what brands of cards have that chipset?
[09:29] <mxpxpod> what happened to the hal device manager icon in the applications and computer menus?
[09:29] <Kinnison> defendguin: Not sure other than the Netgear WG511
[09:29] <subterrific> mxpxpod: it became a seperate package
[09:29] <Kinnison> defendguin: check www.prism54.org I guess
[09:29] <defendguin> :)
[09:29] <mxpxpod> subterrific: aha, ok
[09:30] <defendguin> mxpxpod, like ubuntu?
[09:30] <mxpxpod> defendguin: of course :)
[09:33] <defendguin> Kinnison, can you snort with these cards?
[09:33] <Kinnison> defendguin: I once got kismet going with one
[09:33] <Kinnison> defendguin: but I'm far too 'white-hat' to know about that sort of thing
[09:34] <defendguin> lol
[09:34] <defendguin> my school has a wirless network going in the business building and i dont like their policy of only allowing access to teachers and staff
[09:36] <Kinnison> Mmmm
[09:36] <ForsaKen`> i got the monitor: LG FLATRON 795FT Plus, and the ubuntu did not find it, i tryed to google the right lines that i need to add to the X conf, and i couldnt find it
[09:36] <defendguin> hmmm aparently if it works with kismet it will work with airsnort
[09:39] <jmhodges> hey, i can't seem to figure out how to add http://www.burtonini.com/debian/unstable/ to my repo list through synaptic correctly.  I've done with other repo's but synaptic is tacking on extra bits to the url that breaks it
[09:39] <defendguin> Kinnison, you have prism2 card?
[09:40] <Kinnison> defendguin: Nup; prism54 and ipw2100
[09:40] <defendguin> hmmm it recomends prism2
[09:40] <defendguin> ACX100, ADMTek, Atheros, Cisco, Prism2, Orinoco, 
[09:40] <defendguin>       WSP100, Drone, wtapfile, pcapfile, wrt54g
[09:45] <ForsaKen`> i got the monitor: LG FLATRON 795FT Plus, and the ubuntu did not find it, i tryed to google the right lines that i need to add to the X conf, and i couldnt find it
[09:48] <defendguin> mxpxpod, cubbies gonna get the WC?
[09:48] <mxpxpod> defendguin: sadly, I doubt it :(
[09:48] <encKe> Downloaded this distro couple days ago.......loving it
[09:49] <encKe> nice work
[09:50] <longsleep> my kde entries in the gnome menu lack the icons .. is there a way to fix that?
[09:50] <mxpxpod> longsleep: don't use kde ;)
[09:51] <giorsat> please, anybody can tell me how to configure a netgear ma111 wireless card? it uses prism2usb module the driver belongs to wlan-ng
[09:51] <longsleep> mxpxpod, right .. but i need one app
[09:51] <longsleep> mxpxpod, but still i wonder why the icons are not shown
[09:51] <burner_> giorsat, load the module... run iwconfig
[09:51] <mxpxpod> longsleep: no clue
[09:52] <akra> can't seem to find "traceroute"... is not included in a standard install ?
[09:52] <Kosai> akra: It's in /usr/sbin.
[09:52] <Kosai> (Which might not be in your path, if your path is broken.)
[09:52] <giorsat> iwconfig is not supported by wlan-ng driver all configuration is done under /etc/wlan configuration files...
[09:52] <akra> not in my /usr/sbin
[09:52] <burner_> akra, there's traceroute6
[09:53] <akra> traceroute6 fails to resolve the hostname
[09:53] <longsleep> btw .. if you are talking about wlan .. my wlan link quality shows 100% all the time .. does that work for someone else?
[09:54] <burner_> akra, i get the same thing :\
[09:54] <akra> burner_: *phew* it's not just me!
[09:54] <burner_> akra, you could always apt-get install it
[09:54] <burner_> it's in universe i assume
[09:55] <Kosai> No, it's in main.
[09:55] <Kosai> Sorry, akra.  Yes, you need apt-get install traceroute.
[09:55] <akra> found it :)
[09:55] <burner_> anyone else have issues with USB drives?
[09:55] <burner_> i get no icon my desktop
[09:55] <burner_> in fact, i'm not sure how to mount it... trying ot mount /dev/sda1 does nothing
[09:55] <akra> obviously no one other than me uses it nowadays :)
[09:56] <giorsat> how can I enable or disable startup services on ubuntu? I don't find a graphical tool. please I need to enable wlan service on boot
[09:57] <longsleep> giorsat, vi /etc/network/interfaces
[09:58] <burner_> awww.. someone's gotta know about usb drives?  anyone?
[09:58] <cyphos> where can I get ncurses-devel?
[09:59] <burner_> cyphos, apt-get install libncurses5-dev
[09:59] <longsleep> cyphos, "apt-cache search ncurses" helps a lot
[09:59] <burner_> i'm not sure if it's in main.... or universe
[09:59] <akra> burner_: my usb disk automounts fine. sorry
[10:00] <burner_> "apt-cache search ncurses | grep ncurses" works better ;)
[10:00] <burner_> akra, what is the device?
[10:00] <burner_> and did you have it in when you installed ubuntu initially?
[10:00] <akra> burner_: it's a lexar jumpdrive
[10:00] <burner_> maybe mine just didn't get picked up since I installed it later
[10:00] <burner_> i have the same thing1!!!!!
[10:00] <fred87> burner_, modprobe usb-storage; mount /dev/sda1 /mnt/somewhere
[10:00] <burner_> 128 meg jumpdrive secure
[10:00] <akra> no - I plugged it in after I had got X working :)
[10:01] <akra> this is a 1GB one - doesn't say secure on it
[10:01] <burner_> fred87, know how to get it to auto-mount?
[10:01] <smeggy> All you should need to do is plug it in.
[10:01] <fred87> nope
[10:01] <burner_> mount: special device /dev/sda1 does not exist
[10:01] <fred87> i personally use subfs
[10:02] <fred87> (but i'm not an ubuntu user)
[10:02] <fred87> or debian for that matter
[10:02] <akra> burner_: I take it that your drive doesn't appear in computer->disks either ?
[10:02] <burner_> no?  oh well... I appreciate the attempt... that mount /dev/sda1 used to work for me in my straight debian install
[10:02] <burner_> but i haven't been able to get it to work in ubuntu
[10:02] <burner_> akra, nope
[10:03] <akra> well, it's consistent at least!
[10:03] <burner_> as a side note... i have a fat32 partition mounted to /files and it doesn't show up in computer -> disks either
[10:03] <burner_> :\
[10:03] <akra> how odd. my ntfs partition is showing up fine in /c
[10:03] <burner_> akra, can you do a "cat /etc/fstab | grep sda1" for me?
[10:04] <akra> doesn't exist
[10:04] <burner_> my partition works if i browse to /files... it's mounted and all... but doesn't show up under "computer"
[10:04] <burner_> how does it work if it's not in fstab?
[10:04] <burner_> i'm so lost
[10:04] <akra> closest is: "/dev/sda        /media/usb0     auto    rw,user,noauto  0       0"
[10:04] <smeggy> burner_, fstab is only for things that automount, essentially.
[10:04] <burner_> and that's where your data is for your drive when you plug it in?
[10:05] <burner_> hrm
[10:05] <akra> nope - its in sda1
[10:05] <burner_> :)  mounting /dev/sda worked!!
[10:05] <akra> well..  /media/sda1
[10:05] <akra> burner_: cool
[10:05] <smeggy> Well done :)
[10:06] <burner_> the whole reason I went to ubuntu was for gnome 2.8's auto picking up adn mounting usb drives though :\
[10:06] <burner_> so i guess that's next steap
[10:06] <burner_> step even
[10:07] <burner_> akra, i assume you didn't edit your /etc/fstab by hand?
[10:07] <akra> only to add my ntfs line :)
[10:07] <smeggy> if sda1 doesn't work/exist, couldn't you just symlink it sda.. hrm
[10:08] <burner_> i could
[10:08] <burner_> but as long as I can mount /dev/sda, who cares
[10:08] <plovs> to have dutch spell-check in gaim, what do I install, aspell?
[10:08] <smeggy> no.
[10:08] <smeggy> But then maybe gnome would pick it up...
[10:08] <burner_> awww
[10:08] <burner_> well... i really have no idea how gnome works in terms of it's hal/dbus stuff, but it's worth a shot :)
[10:09] <burner_> w00t :)
[10:09] <burner_> i mounted /mnt/sda after putting in the fstab line... and i get an icon on the desktop that says 'usb0' now
[10:09] <plovs> burner_, sda is the whole device, i made /dev/sda1 with fdisk, then it automounts
[10:10] <smeggy> Sweet :)
[10:10] <burner_> you mean i have to repartition my usb drive?
[10:10] <plovs> burner_, yes :(
[10:10] <burner_> I partitioned it with windows initially.... :\
[10:10] <burner_> maybe that's why
[10:10] <burner_> it should still work in windows after doing so right?
[10:10] <plovs> burner_, so did I that was not the way to do it
[10:10] <smeggy> Depends what FS.
[10:10] <plovs> burner_, yes it works ok in windows
[10:11] <burner_> well.. i'll make it fat32 for maximum compatibility
[10:11] <plovs> burner_, if you use vfat
[10:11] <burner_> of course
[10:11] <burner_> hrm... ubuntu doesn't include gparted right?
[10:12] <plovs> burner_, no
[10:12] <burner_> it should ;)
[10:13] <plovs> burner_, in time it will
[10:13] <defendguin> anyone here use a lot of refurbised pc parts?
[10:13] <defendguin> refurbished
[10:13] <cliff> refurbished ?
[10:13] <burner_> i do
[10:14] <defendguin> have any problems?
[10:14] <burner_> not really
[10:14] <burner_> bad ram one time
[10:14] <burner_> but that's it
[10:14] <burner_> plovs: thanks for the help btw
[10:15] <burner_> i'm trying a repartition now
[10:15] <plovs> burner_, np
[10:16] <defendguin> Kinnison, does it take any effort to get the wg511 working in linux or is it recognized right away?
[10:17] <Kinnison> defendguin: the prism54 driver is present; you have to download firmware I think
[10:18] <defendguin> Kinnison, what firmware?
[10:18] <Kinnison> defendguin: The firmware for the prism54 cards. Check out www.prism54.org it's all on there
[10:18] <defendguin> ok
[10:18] <defendguin> thanks again
[10:21] <akra> Is there any way to get gaim to display all my contacts, including the ones currently offline?
[10:21] <akra> doh! found it...
[10:21] <defendguin> lol
[10:21] <burner_> ;)
[10:21] <burner_> just about to tell you
[10:21] <akra> I expected it to be in preferences :(
[10:21] <defendguin> yeah i was wondering how you could have missed that
[10:23] <burner_> me too
[10:23] <burner_> stupid buddies menu
[10:23] <akra> I was right clicking on the "notification icon" to get to prefs... didn't notice the menu in the buddy list :)
[10:23] <julia> hi
[10:24] <ForsaKen`> i have just installed ubuntu, but it did not find my monitor, my monitor is LG FLATRON 795FT Plus, i tryed to google for a driver, didnt work
[10:24] <burner_> your monitor?
[10:24] <burner_> wtf you need monitor drivers for?
[10:25] <ForsaKen`> i am on 640x480 resolution with 60HZ and i cant change it
[10:25] <julia> If I wanted to run Kopote (KDE based IM client) is it possible in unbuntu?
[10:25] <burner_> u sure that's monitor and not video card?
[10:25] <burner_> julia, you could... but what's wrong with gaim?
[10:26] <julia> burner_: I just liked kopote better
[10:26] <ForsaKen`> it found my video card, 
[10:26] <julia> just personal preference
[10:26] <burner_> if you run kopete it'll be slow... qt libs have to load
[10:26] <julia> burner_: would I just add a generic debian source ?
[10:26] <burner_> ForsaKen`, what happens if you set the XF86Config-4 file to use a higher resolution?
[10:26] <burner_> julia, try just adding universe
[10:26] <ForsaKen`> doesnt respons
[10:26] <topyli> well, kopete is there, apt-gettable
[10:26] <julia> burner_: did that
[10:26] <ForsaKen`> i need to change the:
[10:26] <julia> it didn't find it
[10:26] <burner_> it's there
[10:27] <burner_> it is there
[10:27] <ForsaKen`>  HorizSync       28-33
[10:27] <ForsaKen`>         VertRefresh     43-72
[10:27] <burner_> do an update julia
[10:27] <akra> julia: did you "reload"
[10:27] <julia> I didn't reload
[10:27] <burner_> :)
[10:27] <julia> I just did apt-get update
[10:27] <topyli> same thing
[10:27] <burner_> yeah... that should do it
[10:27] <burner_> u did apt-get update as root?
[10:27] <ForsaKen`> and the: Modeline        "1152x768@100" 83.91 1280 1312 1624 1656 800 816 824 841
[10:27] <burner_> er... sudo?
[10:27] <julia> as root
[10:27] <julia> su - 
[10:27] <burner_> hrm...
[10:27] <ForsaKen`> i have set it to 1152x768@100.. but it doesnt work
[10:27] <burner_> works here
[10:27] <julia> weird
[10:28] <burner_> ForsaKen`, no screens found?
[10:28] <burner_> or what's the error?
[10:28] <ForsaKen`> nope
[10:28] <julia> burner_: do you mind if I paste my sources.list in a /msg ?
[10:28] <julia> see if I did something wrong there?
[10:28] <jmhodges> hey, i have ntpd installed and running, but the Time and Date under System Configuration claims that it isnt able to synchronize the clock using ntp.  Now, the time is already correct with my running ntpd, but having a gui option that doesnt work when it seems it should is inconsistent IMHO
[10:28] <topyli> julia: paste it in #flood
[10:29] <topyli> so we can all see
[10:29] <burner_> julia, flood works
[10:30] <julia> it's in flood
[10:30] <jmhodges> do i just have something stupid in my config?
[10:30] <julia> just for reference, I'm an experienced linux user (since 1993) just new to debian
[10:31] <burner_> debian rules :)
[10:35] <julia> I go back to before real distro's but was a mandrake and gentoo junkie, but ubuntu has caught my fancy
[10:35] <plovs> julia, apt-cache search kopete
[10:35] <burner_> ubuntu is supposed to make my life easy...
[10:36] <julia> plovs: it was a spelling error
[10:36] <burner_> but this usb thing is pissin me off ;)
[10:36] <julia> usb thing?
[10:36] <burner_> although, ubuntu picked up my widescreen, my centrino, and processor scaling
[10:36] <plovs> julia, ok
[10:36] <burner_> oh... my usb drive doesn't auto-mount and put an icon on the desktop when i plug it in like it should
[10:36] <julia> burner_: kernel issue?
[10:36] <plovs> burner_, usb doesn't work if it is not partitioned, it's a bug
[10:37] <burner_> i'm not sure what it is
[10:37] <neighborlee> I updated something but i'm not sure what...is anyone else seeing firefox no longer work ..i'm gettting when I run ./firefox < this weird gecko dialog box:: Title="&mainWindow.title;"..................^ < any idea ?LOL
[10:37] <burner_> it wasn't in my fstab even 
[10:37] <burner_> could be just the partition thing
[10:37] <plovs> burner_, can you mount it by hand?
[10:37] <burner_> i can
[10:37] <burner_> maybe after a reboot things will work
[10:37] <burner_> right now... it says it's busy and i can't unmount it
[10:37] <neighborlee> this happened right after I tried to update firefox with the built in updater..whatever happened seems to have affected all installs now...lol
[10:37] <burner_> not sure how that happened
[10:38] <plovs> burner_, then unmount, use fdisk to make a partition, pull it out, put it back in, make vfat partition, out again, in again and it will/should work
[10:39] <julia> burner_: can you explain this checkinstall thing?
[10:40] <riley> hey
[10:40] <Phr0stByte> what?
[10:40] <topyli> checkinstall is very fashionable. easiest way to make debs or rpms
[10:40] <julia> oh, and I noticed inside Xnest I can't properly login to a solaris machine, I get a login box, I put in my username and password and it looks like it's starting and then I'm back to a login 
[10:40] <burner_> julia, ./configure; make; checkinstall
[10:40] <burner_> that's about it
[10:40] <burner_> it'll prompt you for what type of package to make
[10:41] <julia> burner_: that's pretty cool
[10:41] <burner_> i haven't used it with much debian stuff, but it makes .debs
[10:41] <topyli> http://checkinstall.izto.org/
[10:41] <burner_> i used it for slackballs before and it worked well
[10:41] <julia> wonder if it will do solaris packages
[10:41] <topyli> no
[10:41] <julia> that would be too convient ;-)
[10:41] <julia> I got monodevelop and mono to work on solaris 10
[10:42] <julia> and a lot of people wanted it
[10:42] <burner_> solaris... ew
[10:42] <burner_> heh
[10:42] <riley> is this the right place to ask about an installation problem?
[10:42] <julia> burner_: some of us are old school ;-)
[10:42] <topyli> is solaris 10 free already?
[10:43] <burner_> is 1999 old school? ;)
[10:43] <julia> topyli: it's in beta as far as I know
[10:43] <julia> burner_: Sun is alot older than 1999
[10:43] <topyli> non-free, non-ready :)
[10:43] <burner_> i know... jus playin ;)
[10:43] <julia> topyli: solaris is closed source unix
[10:44] <burner_> hrm... no qtparted... no gparted... no partitionmorpher...  ubuntu needs something
[10:44] <julia> but still runs great on a ultra sparc
[10:44] <topyli> yeah. there's just lots of talk about them freeing it. dunno
[10:45] <julia> I kind of doubt it
[10:45] <julia> but what do I kow
[10:45] <topyli> burner_: there's parted proper :)
[10:45] <topyli> julia: free solaris, free java, talk is cheap
[10:46] <burner_> rrrrrrrrrright.... i think i'll pass on using that ;)
[10:46] <topyli> =)
[10:46] <burner_> anyone know anything about the ubuntu live cd?
[10:47] <burner_> i know alex was working on it and i hear it's release ready
[10:47] <greg_> Hello; I installed Ubuntu today. Sound seems to work fine. I can rip a CD in Sound Juicer, and I can play a CD in Totem. But I get no sound out of CD Player, even though it acts like it's playing. Any ideas?
[10:47] <burner_> greg_, cd volume turned up?  
[10:47] <topyli> audio cable from cd drive to sound card?
[10:47] <burner_> or what topyli said
[10:48] <julia> burner_: I was going to ask about a live CD that would be great
[10:48] <julia> burner_: hopefully something that allows for a usb key for saving files
[10:48] <greg_> Yes on volume; I'll check audio cable, though. It worked in Windows Xp, but I guess it might not require an audio cable. Thanks.
[10:48] <burner_> julia, if you need one in the meantime... there's always kanotix... it's kde based, but still good
[10:48] <burner_> (comes with qtparted ;)
[10:48] <topyli> windows doesn't need the cable. neither does xmms (or totem, apparently)
[10:49] <greg_> topyli: Ok. That makes sense. Thanks!
[10:49] <Hmmmmm_> try gnoppix
[10:49] <Hmmmmm_> its based on ubuntu
[10:49] <burner_> on ubuntu?
[10:49] <burner_> or debian?
[10:49] <dommi> gnoppix is based on debian
[10:50] <julia> ok, in checkinstall what is 'Group'?
[10:50] <dommi> _not_ ubuntu
[10:50] <topyli> gnoppix is based on knoppix is based on debian :)
[10:50] <Hmmmmm_> dommi, latest release is baed on ubuntu
[10:50] <Hmmmmm_> check out linuxbeta.com
[10:50] <topyli> oh
[10:50] <Hmmmmm_> or distrowatch.com
[10:50] <Hmmmmm_> for details
[10:50] <plovs> i readsomewhere that the gnoppix guy works for/with ubuntu now, but that might be a rumour
[10:50] <topyli> Hmmmmm_: VERY cool
[10:51] <Hmmmmm_> very cool indeed
[10:51] <Mais> anyone know why export CC=/usr/bin/gcc-3.3.4 will export only to /usr/bin/gcc-3.3
[10:51] <dommi> http://wiki.ubuntulinux.org/WartyWarthog_2fLiveCD
[10:51] <julia> cool, I have a xsp .deb now
[10:51] <julia> that's too cool
[10:52] <Mais> =\
[10:53] <burner_> right on.. thanks for the news Hmmmmm_
[10:54] <topyli> julia: i have to ask. what the hell is xsp? :)
[10:55] <julia> topyli: ASP.NET container for linux
[10:55] <topyli> oh. found something. it's like asp.
[10:55] <julia> based on mono
[10:55] <Hmmmmm_> burner_, peasureis mine
[10:55] <julia> ASP.NET NOT ASP
[10:55] <julia> BIG difference
[10:56] <topyli> oh. the web is lying to me. someone is simplifying :)
[10:57] <julia> sorry, I give talks on this
[10:57] <julia> and get picky about details
[10:57] <julia> anyway
[10:57] <julia> I promised to bake apple pies today
[10:57] <topyli> hmm. they say "a similar idea to ASP or PHP or JSP..."
[10:58] <dommi> those poor apples
[10:58] <dommi> they didnt hurt anyone
[10:58] <julia> topyli: I use all of the above, and I see ASP.NET as closest to JSP and servlets than to ASP or PHP
[10:58] <julia> the whole .NET thing is the big deal
[10:58] <topyli> dommi: but they now have a chance to a lot of good
[10:59] <dommi> you never hear anyone baking cow pie :confused:
[10:59] <topyli> julia: sure. i guess you get mad when people confuse C# and .NET :)
[10:59] <julia> topyli: yes, muchly, but that is mostly a marketing blunder
[11:00] <topyli> again
[11:02] <julia> topyli: I'm also the one that gave my Sociology teacher grief for thinking that all geometry was Euclidian
[11:04] <topyli> ah. that darn picky one there over there at the back =)
[11:05] <topyli> although simplifying stuff carelessly does tend to have implications we don't want
[11:06] <jmhodges> ok, hmm.. is there something out there that integrates neatly with nautilus that can quickly let me convert say.. flac files into ogg?
[11:06] <topyli> jmhodges: a script will integrate nicely I guess
[11:06] <Hmmmmm_> jmhodges, try sox
[11:06] <Hmmmmm_> it rocks
[11:07] <Hmmmmm_> u can write a script for nautilusi guess
[11:07] <Mais> any chance of a 64bit nividia-glx package anytime soon?
[11:07] <jmhodges> well, ok, ill write a script
[11:08] <topyli> i found a script on the net to convert between wav, mp3, ogg. no flac though.
[11:08] <Hmmmmm_> jmhodges, hav u ever tried sox?
[11:08] <Mithrandir> topyli: please don't reencode mp3s as ogg or the other way around -- it'll sound like crap.
[11:08] <Hmmmmm_> its the most amazing software
[11:08] <topyli> that works in nautilus. search for -- ta-daa! "Naudilus" :)
[11:08] <jmhodges> Hmmmmm_: no i havent.  i was hoping to find something that was Ubuntu standard but c'est la vie.
[11:08] <topyli> Mithrandir: I know
[11:08] <Hmmmmm_> unfortunately doesnt support mp3
[11:09] <crimsun> topyli: you do realize that ogg123 is perfectly capable of playing ogg flacs and normal flacs, don't you?
[11:09] <jmhodges> i wonder if there are some decnt python modules out there for converting
[11:09] <jmhodges> bah, i suppose i coud just tie some disparate converters together
[11:09] <topyli> crimsun: sure. but my portable cd is not. so I make mp3 cds from my oggs :(
[11:10] <crimsun> topyli: that's not really an issue. just decode your {ogg} flacs using ogg123 and pipe them to lame
[11:10] <crimsun> or simply use flac
[11:10] <crimsun> etc.
[11:10] <topyli> it's what i do.
[11:10] <jmhodges> i could have sworn that fraun<mumble> only pushed for payment from hardware using their tech
[11:11] <crimsun> now what's going to be interesting is how the FLAC 1.1.0 -> 1.1.1 transition occurs in Debian sid
[11:11] <crimsun> there's a nice soname bump, and everything looks hairy
[11:11] <topyli> crimsun: i believe you're mistaken. it wasn't me who was asking for help :)
[11:11] <crimsun> topyli: i know.
[11:12] <riley> would any of you know why my ethernet card is showing up as lo instead of eth0?  and does it matter?
[11:12] <jmhodges> crimsun: whats going on in the FLAC version bump that's causing hairyness?
[11:12] <topyli> crimsun: it was a nautilus question
[11:12] <crimsun> jmhodges: .4 vs .6 for libflac4, and everything builds against the -dev
[11:13] <jmhodges> agh, gotcha
[11:13] <crimsun> topyli: right. unfortunately i don't know the slightest about nautilus. ;)
[11:13] <crimsun> riley: your nic is lo? how can that be?
[11:13] <topyli> heh. me neither, except that it does eat scripts :)
[11:14] <jmhodges> ah, hmm.. GNOME help mentions a File->Scripts menu but no such thing exists for me
[11:14] <riley> crimsun: i don't know how it's happening, but when i configure lo with ifconfig, pinging 192.168.0.2 (another comp on the network) works, and when i leave it as it was, it doesn't
[11:15] <topyli> jmhodges: the menu entry is not there as long as ~/.gnome2/nautilus-scripts is empty
[11:15] <crimsun> riley: ip -4 addr show dev eth0
[11:15] <jmhodges> ...
[11:15] <jmhodges> oy, ok thats a pain. 
[11:15] <riley> ok i'll try that
[11:15] <riley> what is lo supposed to be?
[11:16] <crimsun> riley: loopback
[11:16] <riley> oh ok
[11:16] <jmhodges> ah.. hm.. odd didnt work.. 
[11:16] <jmhodges> bah, no matter
[11:19] <topyli> jmhodges: basically you can move all the scripts from ~/bin to ~/.gnome2/nautilus-scripts :)
[11:19] <jmhodges> natch :)
[11:19] <topyli> copy rather
[11:19] <topyli> :)
[11:19] <plovs> jmhodges, just do not put to many scripts there it will make nautilus slow
[11:19] <burner> plovs: just wanted to say thank you again... i rebooted my machine... plugged in my usb drive and it came up
[11:19] <burner> just needed a partition change
[11:19] <jmhodges> plovs: k, will remember that
[11:20] <plovs> burner, with the partitions?
[11:20] <burner> yep
[11:20] <burner> the label is usb0, which is kinda weird... but it works
[11:20] <burner> so i won't complain
[11:20] <jmhodges> all i really want is a better version of Naudilus (http://g-scripts.sourceforge.net/nautilus-scripts/Multimedia/Naudilus)
[11:20] <plovs> burner, you do not need to reboot (i did that also) you can just pull out the usb-key :)
[11:20] <burner> plovs: i tried that ;)
[11:21] <burner> it wouldn't let me umount it for some reason
[11:21] <jmhodges> i suppose my glade and pygtk skills are going to get tested here :)
[11:21] <burner> so rather than debug and figure it out... a reboot was easier ;)
[11:21] <plovs> burner, glad it works
[11:21] <burner> me too :) thanks
[11:21] <plovs> jmhodges, nice script!
[11:21] <jmhodges> plovs: yeah, it was a nice find :).. too bad it doesnt handle flac hehe
[11:22] <plovs> jmhodges, well, it's just bash if you need it you can add it
[11:22] <jmhodges> plovs: right
[11:23] <jmhodges> the real problem is making it use zenity instaed of gdialog.. or maybe i could..
[11:23] <dablitz> hello, I am trying to mount my second drive with difficulty. it is an ntfs winxp drive, can someone help
[11:23] <akra> dablitz: what's problem?
[11:23] <jmhodges> wait a minute.. how does one go about adding a nautilus script to the context menu of a certain filetype?
[11:24] <burner> sudo mount -t ntfs /dev/hda# /mnt/point
[11:24] <fridge> will it cause major havoc to use a normal debian unstable repository with ubuntu?
[11:24] <dablitz> well for some reason I cannot seem to mount /dev/hdb
[11:24] <dablitz> thanks
[11:24] <sivang> dablitz : what seems to be the trouble, what have you tried?
[11:24] <sivang> dablitz : try doing this:
[11:24] <dablitz> ok
[11:24] <joem> jmhodges, zenity is a snap
[11:25] <sivang> dablitz : sudo nano /etc/fstab
[11:25] <jmhodges> joem: yeah, looks like it.. plus it has a gdialog legacy wrapper so i suppose i dont need to hack the script that much :)
[11:25] <plovs> jmhodges, it will work anyway, but converting is not hard
[11:25] <topyli> fridge: i have it commented out and only use it occationally to get something. i wouldn't have it there all the time
[11:25] <dablitz> it is not there
[11:25] <joem> I started writing a convert/burn to audio cd script last night
[11:25] <joem> was pretty simple, and looks real neat with zenity
[11:25] <plovs> jmhodges, in Applications-Help is a good help-file for zenity
[11:26] <fridge> topyli, ahh OK.
[11:26] <joem> yea that help file is great
[11:26] <dablitz> sivang
[11:26] <jmhodges> plovs: awesome
[11:26] <dablitz> xp drive not in fstab
[11:26] <sivang> dablitz : ofcourse
[11:26] <fridge> it's just that my internet connection has a quota
[11:26] <joem> zenity -? for a quick reference is good as well
[11:26] <sivang> dablitz : add a new line, which will look something like this
[11:26] <fridge> and if I use a local repository, it doesn't get counted towards that
[11:27] <jmhodges> plovs: poking through the help, not seeing the Zenity file off the bat.. any clue on where to look in here?
[11:27] <sivang> dablitz : /dev/hdX (x being the device number of the drive) /mnt/windows    ntfs     noauto,user,ro,umask=022
[11:27] <jmhodges> n/m found it
[11:27] <plovs> jmhodges, desktop
[11:27] <sivang> dablitz : after that, you need to sudo mkdir /mnt/windows
[11:27] <jmhodges> yeah, thanks
[11:28] <dablitz> done that
[11:29] <jmhodges> damn, lame can't convert from flac it seems
[11:29] <dablitz> reboot?
[11:29] <dablitz> or sudo mount /dev/hdb /mnt/windows
[11:29] <sivang> dablitz : no way ;)
[11:29] <sivang> dablitz : logout the user, and login again. then go to "Disk" menu 
[11:29] <topyli> jmhodges: you may need a wav temp file :(
[11:30] <jmhodges> :(
[11:30] <dablitz> ya
[11:30] <dablitz> ok
[11:30] <jmhodges> no way.. i know there has to be something in my universe that can convert flac to mp3
[11:30] <fred87> flac -> wav -> mp3
[11:31] <jmhodges> really? damn.. ok
[11:31] <topyli> can't it be just a pipe? perhaps not.
[11:31] <akra> how do I tell linux that the bios clock is in local time, not utc ?
[11:33] <jmhodges> hm..
[11:35] <topyli> akra: man tzsetup: "The  Debian  GNU/Linux  system gains its knowledge of this setting from the file /etc/default/rcS"
[11:35] <akra> thanks :)
[11:36] <topyli> akra: yeah, rtfm ;)
[11:36] <akra> easy once you know the command :)
[11:37] <topyli> akra: of course, apropos will tell you that one =)
[11:37] <topyli> apropos timezone
[11:37] <akra> true :)
[11:38] <akra> looking back - I see that I misspelt timezone :( ... always the way...
[11:39] <Kinnison> hihi keyb
[11:39] <Keyb> heyhey
[11:42] <akra> hmm.. sudo tzsetup -g doesn't give me the question about gmt
[11:43] <akra> maybe I'll just edit /etc/default/rcS directly...
[11:44] <dies_irae> Hi, I just tried installing Ubuntu on a laptop but when it finishes and boots into the system the message "hub 1-0:1.0: over-current change on port 2" is echoed constantly. I can't complete the setup process, and I couldn't find much to deal with it on google, nor in the faq or wiki. From some messages on google I think it may have to deal with usb. Any suggestions?
[11:47] <Hmmmmm_> dies_irae, hav u checked ur media for md5sums?
[11:47] <TheCan> hi. What is the standard root pw for ubuntu? i just installed it but my xconfig is faulty and i'd like to change it
[11:48] <Qua> it is USB. disconnect everything, try again. if it doesn't help, disable USB altogether by passing kernel "nousb" on boot-up (in grub command line)
[11:48] <TheCan> ah ok got it
[11:49] <dies_irae> Ah, ok I didn't know the kernel command. I have no devices hooked up. I will try that, thanks.
[11:50] <me4x4_> hi
[11:51] <me4x4_> do u have a german channel?
[11:51] <Qua> dies_irae: that doesn't look very good anyway, you might not be able to use USB. what kernel do you have?
[11:51] <DaMouse404> hey all
[11:52] <Qua> dies_irae: googling for the problem found number of reports, but no clear answer.. usually people have a specific problem with a flash disk or scanner, not hub itself
[11:52] <Qua> dies_irae: apart from kernel, what motherboard do you have?
[11:53] <HockeyFan22> hello
[11:53] <HockeyFan22> im having trouble installing
[11:53] <Dashiva> hey anyone know the status on the forums yet?
[11:55] <dies_irae> Hi, sorry, I'm still fooling around with this. I can edit the kernel line in grub and add "nousb", but it doesn't seem to save, even though I did "savedefault"
[11:55] <dies_irae> Er, wait, "savedefault" is probably aline in the grub script, sorry. But still, either it didn't load or it didn't work.
[11:55] <HockeyFan22> it is unable to mount the cdrom
[11:55] <Qua> dies_irae: you don't need to save it, just use it.
[11:55] <dies_irae> It's an old Compaq Armada 100S, so I really don't know what the motherboard is.
[11:55] <dies_irae> I'll try booting again and see what happens.
[11:56] <Qua> oops, very old hardware
[11:56] <HockeyFan22> when installing mandrake, i have to add the lines noapic , and nodma and then it works
[11:56] <Qua> how comes it even *has* usb
[11:56] <HockeyFan22> but this doesnt work on ubuntu
[11:56] <dies_irae> Haha, good question. It's no concern if it doesn't work.
[11:56] <dies_irae> They start popping up after uhci-hcd loads.
[11:57] <Qua> yea, remove that somehow... what about "nohotplug"?
[11:57] <dies_irae> I'll try that.
[11:57] <Qua> i hate this auto-config... its nice if it works, pain otherwise
[11:57] <HockeyFan22> can anyone help me?
[11:58] <Qua> well HockeyFan22 the prob is i don't know ubuntu kernel flags... i would assume they are the same, bu nousb that is said to work with slackware and redhat kernels (google) does nothing here.... lemme see kernel doc themselves
[11:58] <HockeyFan22> o thanx
[11:59] <Qua> and please tell us what the problem is
[11:59] <dies_irae> Bah, same thing. Right after uhci-hcd.
[11:59] <Qua> "not works" is not a description
[11:59] <Qua> well you need to prevent it from loading in the first place
[11:59] <dies_irae> Yeah. :/