Se7hhoe do i enable SMB support ?12:00
plovsSe7h: install samba12:00
topylidjuuss: naah. are you saying you've encountered a good system?12:00
djuussi like apt4rpm, but it hase like 2% of the packages in the repos compared to deb apt12:00
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|trey|Fedora and Ubuntu are currently tied for my fav distro on the desktop... Debian has been my primary choice for a server for about 2 years...12:00
plovsdjuuss: did you like it or was it *good enough*12:00
djuusstopyli: i've encountered yoper on an amd64 box12:00
topylii bet it's linux. it must suck just a bit :)12:01
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djuussplovs: its better then nothing12:01
|trey|topyli: blah... thats borderline flame bait  :)12:01
plovsdjuuss: right, but it's not etter then debian12:01
imkais discover1 as good as kudzu?12:01
Se7hplovs just that?12:01
djuusstopyli: yes, 1)yoper is suse based and has rpms 2)rpms->small apt repo12:02
|trey|imka: imo its better.. but its at least as good12:02
topylidon't take the bait, i'm joking of course :)12:02
djuussbut its true12:02
plovsSe7h: and in computer>system config> netfig configure workgroup12:02
djuusssmall apt repo is what keeps me from sticking to yoper12:02
plovsi tried yoper, it sure was *fast*12:03
|trey|djuuss: yoper is a custom LFS distro, how is it based on SUSE?12:03
imkagood. i dont have much stuff. cdrom+burner dvdrom, via onboard sound, realtek netcard, pctv tvcard12:03
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djuusswell at least the xwindow thing12:03
plovsimka: should all work12:03
|trey|imka: everything should be detected... even resolution etc is detected  :)12:03
imkaplovs i think so too.12:03
imkabrb. gotta massage my gf :)12:04
djuussyoper is good cuz its faster then <insert whatever> and installs in under 10 minutes with kde and OOo and the works12:04
|trey|djuuss: X, X Window System - these are exceptable, I cringe whenever I see "xwindow" or "xwindows"12:04
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|trey|djuuss: honestly haven't used it, it was a big craze when it first came out, but it never appealed to me  :/12:05
djuuss|trey|: then cringe, i'm not gonna write "X Window System" if xwindow ays it12:05
Se7hplovs ok, its working...now, how do gain permission to access the win network ?12:05
Se7hin fstab for ie12:05
|trey|djuuss: too hard to just state "X"?12:05
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plovsSe7h: what kind of network, AD or just a windows-box?12:06
djuuss|trey|: i'm beeing forced to be a mathematician against my will. X is a give input 12:06
Se7hyeah, just winbox12:06
plovsSe7h: just make an open  share12:06
djuussI can't type "X" without giving a range where X can exist :P12:06
rileyhow would i run a command when the system starts in ubuntu?  i think this has something to do with rc files, but i don't know what to edit12:07
djuusssomeone told me that bout half an hour ago12:07
|trey|riley: update-rc.d  <-- type that12:07
|trey|djuuss: thats when gnome starts, not the system.12:07
Se7hplovs: You do not have the permissions necessary to view the contents of "Windows Network: sinner".12:07
riley|trey| and djuuss: thanks, i'll try those12:08
djuuss|trey|: ive got a feeling thats what he meant :P12:08
plovsSe7h: are you on a "secure" network?12:08
djuuss|trey|: cuz its just what i asked and this is what i was looking for12:08
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Se7hrealy dont know12:08
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|trey|riley: update-rc.d is the boot process... what djuuss said is just what runs when gnome starts (also possible via just "save session" when you log out...12:08
Se7hbut think not12:08
plovsSe7h: inside a firewall with no other users?12:09
Se7hits just the user permissions to access network folders..12:09
|trey|djuuss: he stated "rc" and "system starts"... this would lead me to believe he means boot process  ;)12:09
plovsSe7h: rightclick permissions just make it accessible to all12:09
|trey|Question: how would you edit ACL's from Nautilus?12:10
djuusshe stated rc as in "someone mentioned rc but i dont know wtf he was on about"12:10
djuussi referred to login in to gnome as "boot"12:10
plovs|trey|: by putting open terminal here in scripts :)12:10
|trey|plovs: grrrr *cries*12:11
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djuussi'm browsing in epiphany right now!!!!12:11
|trey|djuuss: I'm sorry12:11
Se7hplovs cant...the user hasn't the permission to change it12:12
djuussdont be12:12
djuussgonna go to *bed*12:12
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djuussi'm off for rome in 5 hours12:13
plovsSe7h: switch to administrator12:13
djuusstaking my yoper laptop with me12:13
Se7hur not helping that way12:13
Se7hwhat is the path to network ?12:13
=== |trey| wonders why sometimes sudo -s doesn't ask password... wonders how to configure that so its more predictable?
=== djuuss create a root account
plovs|trey|: after you gave password, you have ?15 minutes12:14
riley|trey|: so would i create a sh file, place it in init.d, and use update-rc.d?  i googled it but all of the links are confusing...12:14
=== djuuss and there is that idd..
|trey|plovs: is it possible to configure that someplace?12:14
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|trey|riley: man update-rc.d  ... it should give an interface to just turn things on and off at boot if I gave ya the right command  :)12:15
plovs|trey|: man sudo says change it in /etc/sudoers12:15
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plovsSe7h: what path to what network???12:15
|trey|plovs: heh, I coulda guessed that... I still haven't actually looked at that file  :(12:15
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Se7hplovs in my case: smb://homenet12:15
plovs|trey|: i like it fine as it is12:16
riley|trey|: ok thanks12:16
|trey|plovs: heh... I just like things being predictable... would rather it just be for that session or something...12:16
|trey|riley: you're welcome  :)12:16
plovsSe7h: you can put a mount in /et/fstab with passwords etc12:16
|trey|riley: to add stuff that isn't already there though, yeah, just create a sh script for it... Debian only utilizes rc2 by default though...12:17
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plovs|trey|: man sudo/sudoers :) it's too long for me to read...12:17
riley|trey|: ok12:18
|trey|plovs: heh... but its so much easier if you read it and tell me the answer  8)12:18
djuuss*offtopic* is there a way to extract all sayings from fortune?12:18
plovsSe7h: i don't use windows share that often (haven't for months) sorry12:18
|trey|djuuss: umm, yeah, its in a file... damned if I know where though... dpkg -L fortune12:18
sivangHas someone tried installing to a 32m low mem machines?12:19
plovs|trey|: hm, maybe ask djuuss, he sound like a nice guy ...12:19
djuusssivang: yes, and failed miserably12:19
MyKq3when i m trying 2 aptget update i get lots of errors like "Err http://archive.ubuntu.com warty/main Sources12:19
MyKq3  Connection failed12:19
MyKq3" like what should i do ...should i change the mirror address? 12:19
|trey|plovs: but your not?  :'(12:19
djuussplovs: ask me what12:19
plovssivang: gnome will work rather slow, maybe not worth it12:19
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plovsdjuuss: if you are willing to read the man-pages for sudo and fix |trey|'s problem :)12:20
|trey|sivang: X itself can take that much memory at times  :/12:20
djuussi'd be willing to read the bible if it'd help me save |trey|!12:20
djuussbut whats his problem?:P12:20
plovssivang: linux will work just fine, but not graphical12:20
tsengdefendguin: whats up with your debs12:20
plovsdjuuss: he doesn't like reading man-pages12:21
sivangdjuuss : it's intended to be a router machine. However I havn't got past d-i. it enters an endless loop of "Enterting lowmem moade"12:21
|trey|djuuss: read man sudo and sudoers and tell me if there is a way to make it ask only once per session  :)12:21
sivangand both NICs don't work although recognized.12:21
djuuss|trey|: easy! make a root account, allow it to login thru graphical thingy and log in there.. once per session! :D12:21
sivang|trey| : you can set up expirey time for it12:21
|trey|sivang: #debian-boot <-- see if they are any the wiser  :)12:21
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djuusssivang: there are router-livecd's for that12:22
plovssivang: don't use ubuntu, use debian 12:22
|trey|sivang: I'm aware of that, just would rather it be more predictable... :)12:22
djuuss|trey|:unless thats not what your after12:22
|trey|djuuss: not at all  :(12:22
tsengdefendguin: they seem to be corrupt12:22
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psiis anyone else experiencing lots of firefox crashes? they seem to be related to links that open in a new window12:22
sivang|trey| : However I never wanted it to last more then 10 miutes ;-)12:23
plovspsi: no12:23
|trey|psi: firefox crashes here when I try to open a new java window  :/12:23
|trey|sivang: :)12:23
psinot java related here12:23
djuussyou can sudo -K every time after you sudo whatever12:23
defendguintseng, hmmm not sure12:23
djuussto have it ask for the password every time you sudo12:24
|trey|sivang: in #debian-boot, pay peticular notice to anything joeyh says, he's the d-i dev  :)12:24
psiit crashes *every* time i open some links12:24
djuusswhich makes it more predictable12:24
|trey|psi: to open in a new window, its javascript related at least  ;)12:24
|trey|psi: right click > open in new tab  :)12:24
cybrjackle|lappywhen you build kernels the "debian way" is it simply using: kernel_image ; kernel_headers ; kernel_source ??12:24
|trey|see if that does the same thing.12:24
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|trey|cybrjackle|lappy: umm... make-kpkg kernel_image maybe  :/12:25
tbwtrey: not necessarily... <a target="_blank"> will open stuff in new windows with no javascript involved12:25
|trey|haven't done it that way in a while though  :/12:25
cybrjackle|lappyright, but what about headers or source12:25
djuuss|trey|: fiddle about with something obscure called "timestamps"12:25
cybrjackle|lappyi know the kernel_image, but want to build the rest too12:25
djuussi'm going to bed12:25
|trey|tbw: oh, my mistake then  :/12:25
|trey|djuuss: night12:26
djuusstis 00:26 over here12:26
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djuusshave to be on the bus to rome on 06:0012:26
|trey|3:26 pm12:26
plovs1:26 also off to bed12:26
Python2121hey guys i have a question, i have a dell d600 laptop12:26
djuussrome beeing about 1100 miles from here12:26
psi|trey|: hm, yes. this particular link seemed to use javascript:anewwindow()12:26
cybrjackle|lappyoh and modules12:26
cybrjackle|lappymodules_install maybe?12:26
=== imka is burning the iso
=== djuuss is off for bed, "Later all!"
Python2121and for some reason when i try to boot into gnome it wont work, but when i have my usb audigy nx plugged in, it boots into gnome, and the sound card doesn't work12:27
|trey|psi: ahh... I hate those... can't even open in new tab  :(12:27
psino, i noticed that >_<12:27
Python2121anyone have any ideas?12:27
|trey|Novells site has lots of em...  :(12:27
imkais there anything i should pay special attention to during install? ive installed several distros already12:27
psi|trey|: regular mozilla handles it fine12:27
|trey|Python2121: I have pleanty, prolly not related to your prob though12:28
|trey|psi: weird12:28
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Python2121all i get is that esound failed to load once i type my user and password into gdm12:28
Python2121and go to failsafe terminal and type in gnome-session12:28
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|trey|Python2121: try 'apt-get install libesd-alsa0' and restart X12:29
Python2121ok thanks12:29
Python2121lemme boot into it12:29
nothing23newb question, autoconfig didn't set my video correctly, and now gdm loops when I try to drop to a shell, is there a way during boot to not load gdm12:30
=== |trey| ponders why esd is even starting :/
|trey|nothing23: update-rc.d -- turn off gdm there...12:31
nothing23yeah, I can't get to a shell though, when it boots it goes straight to gdm12:31
nothing23i am used to just having linux load to a shell and doing startx12:31
|trey|nothing23: boot with 'failsafe' and do it...12:32
nothing23great, thanks!12:32
|trey|nothing23: thats a grub option, not param though... 12:32
nothing23oh yeah, btw, this is PPC12:32
|trey|failing that... init=1 (I think)12:33
|trey|nothing23: that should be irrelivant to what I am saying  ;)12:33
|trey|nothing23: I thought yaboot was the PPC bootloader for linux though?12:33
nothing23aight, well the only thing is it uses yabooy instead of grub12:34
nothing23can I pass options in yaboot the same way as grub?12:34
|trey|Never used it... blah... you know how to boot to a diff runlevel? boot to rl1  :)12:34
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tsengdoes anyone know if gnome-vfs is built with howl support?12:35
nothing23not sure, will poke around goodle, and hopefully not be back :)12:35
|trey|nothing23: ahh, but we're a good bunch  :)12:35
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Python2121ok so i did the apt-get install alsa0 thingy12:36
Python2121and now im in gnome but it only works when i boot gnome from failsafe terminal12:37
Python2121any ideas?12:38
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|trey|Python2121: why did you even have the sound server start with gnome? 12:40
Python2121i dont know12:40
|trey|esd is unneeded... apps use gstreamer12:40
Python2121how do i disable esd12:40
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|trey|Python2121: Computer > Desk. Pref. > Sound12:40
|trey|Python2121: you sure you didn't turn it on?12:41
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Python2121yeah this is a brand new install12:41
SalemI can't seem to install ubuntu on my old IBM Thinkpad12:41
Python2121but enable sound server startup is checked12:41
Salemdies on the base install12:41
|trey|Python2121: bah, then forget that... guess it is supposed to be working...12:41
Python2121should i turn it off though?12:41
Salemit says:12:41
Salempython depends on python2.312:42
|trey|Python2121: never had issues after I installed libesd-alsa0  :/12:42
Salembut python2.3 is not configured12:42
jlSalem, how old is old?12:42
Salemwell, it's got a celeron 400Mhz12:42
jlSalem, my thinkpad t22 works great12:42
|trey|Salem: dpkg-reconfigure python2.312:42
Python2121maybe i shoudl restart12:42
Salemand 4Gigs of space12:42
nothing23well, you can send kernel parameters with 'append=' but both failsafe and init=1 aren't working, are there any keystrokes to drop out of gdm?12:42
Salem|trey|, I'll try that12:42
|trey|nothing23: ctrl alt f112:43
tsengjdub: ping12:43
jlwell.... make sure the bios is totally up to date forst. it helps in my linux experience with ibm laptops12:43
Salemsays: python2.3 is not fully instaled12:43
tsengjdub: the howl package doesnt seem to install nifd12:43
SalemI don't think it's a BIOS problem12:43
|trey|Salem: apt-get install --reinstall python2.312:44
Salemlooks like a dependency problem12:44
Salemapt-get: not found12:44
randomnickHi, I have a question for you guys. I'm from Portugal and I would like to know in what way could I contribute in translations and such issues...12:44
SalemMakes sense, as the base-install failed12:44
imkalets install ubuntu :)12:45
|trey|randomnick: doesn't appear any devs are active right now  :(12:45
SalemWell... I guess I'll try it again when ubuntu's a bit more mature12:46
Salemthis seems like a boneheaded error12:46
|trey|Salem: its pleanty capable today, with good media...12:46
SalemI saw the screenshots, I like the premise12:46
|trey|Salem: 3 installs here... all ok..12:47
Salem:( I don't get it12:47
SalemAre you using 4.312:47
|trey|X? yeah12:47
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pyramidi wonder what the AirForce is doing getting involved with antimatter for mass destruction weapons.12:48
SalemSeeing as how I can't even make it past a base install, I'll file a bug report and move on to another distro12:49
SalemLooks like my streak of unsuccessful debian installs is unbroken12:49
SalemDebian hates me for some reason12:49
pyramidseems to me that antimatter is a very volatile substance to stockpile for achieving mass destruction12:49
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nothing23aight, I used a gentoo boot cd to get access to the filesystem, what files in /etc to I need to edit to not load gdm12:53
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LinuxJonesnothing23, remove the link in /etc/rc2.d that points to gdm12:55
nothing23cool, thanks LinuxJones 12:55
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LinuxJonesnothing23, ;)12:55
jgeorgesonif there are two services in a given runlevel with the same start priority, how is it determined which starts first?12:55
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mwilsonjgeorgeson: I belive it's lexicographical.12:57
jgeorgesonmwilson, hm, i have a laptop that typically only has a pcmcia nic, and i have some stunnel tunnels setup. when i booted, there were no tunnels, and no log errors, so I assumed that stunnel4 started before pcmcia12:58
mwilsonDepends on what starts the NIC up, I suppose.  Most cardbus NICs are controlled by hotplug, not pcmcia-cs.12:59
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jgeorgesonmwilson, hotplug still comes before stunnel4 lexicographically, though12:59
pyramidi can't imagine why the AirForce wants to achieve mass destruction with antimatter.12:59
mwilsonI wouldn't know if Ubuntu's broken that as well, though.  I just know how Debian does it.01:00
pyramidwell i suppose it is because non-believers are in charge of everything and they don't respect the sanctity of life.01:01
mwilsonjgeorgeson: Doesn't mean that the NIC comes up when hotplug loads, either, only that hotplug controls the loading of it.01:01
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mwilsonjgeorgeson: the networking initscript is what would matter, I suppose.01:01
mwilsoni.e. hotplug is going to control support for the NIC, but that doesn't mean the interface is up or down.01:02
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jgeorgesonwell, whatever the reason, stunnel4 wasn't running when the laptop finished booting, but my interface was up and running, and /var/log/daemon.log had no stunnel errors to explain why it wasn't up01:03
mwilsonLike I said, don't take what I say for gospel about how Ubuntu does things... I've installed it a grand total of once, just to see if it was worth bothering with, and now I'm hanging out.01:03
jgeorgesonmwilson, yeah, i was just looking for general pointers01:04
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Se7hi changed the workgroup01:04
jsubl2mwilson, so what do you think of ubuntu so far01:04
Se7hbut it remains the same01:04
Se7hdoes it need a logout ?01:04
pyramidi can't understand all this preoccupation with antimatter...it takes so much energy to create so little of it.01:04
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Serenity^ok. I actually took down my superbly tuned arch install to play with this ubuntu thing, I'll reserve comment till a few days useage01:05
mwilsonjsubl2: Don't see the point, myself... I find many of Gnome 2.8's design decisions highly annoying, and there's really no other reason to bother with it.01:05
Serenity^xfce4 :)01:05
jsubl2mwilson, yeah i can see that  if you are not a gnome fan01:06
pyramidmwilson, are you referring to the two rows of menus that waste valuable desktop real estate.01:06
mwilsonGnome's hypocrisy gets annoying, and 2.8 throws it in your face.01:06
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joemmwilson, whats that?01:07
pyramidmwilson, i have to admit i don't know what to do myself with the extra taskbar or whatever it is...the one at the bottom is enough.01:08
mwilsonAs a technical achievement, it's fine, but it's not something I'd ever give to a user.01:08
diemanso, like, how many users do you deal with?01:08
tsengholy crap, its mwilson 01:08
mwilsonmore than a few, less than a lot01:08
tsengthe ghost of christmas cranky01:08
jsubl2tseng, exactly what i thought01:09
ceftseng: tsk tsk01:09
diemanok, as long as its more than you plus one. :)01:09
diemanfie would be fine01:09
pyramidmwilson, but anyway it does seem quite usable.01:09
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diemanthats all you really need to know if its decent enough or not.01:09
tsengjsubl2: youre familiar with his work also?01:09
jsubl2tseng, yes01:09
mwilsontseng: I have opinions.  There's something wrong with that?  I didn't offer them here, they were solicited.01:10
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cefI deal with a lot of users.. they're all dumb, particularly as a collective01:10
tsengmwilson: openbox is in universe btw01:10
mwilsontseng: So?01:11
tsengjust thought you might like to know01:11
tsengi cant stand metacity.01:11
mwilsonIf I want openbox, I know how to build it myself.01:11
mwilsonUbuntu isn't something I'll use, so it's not like I have any great reason to replace metacity.01:12
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cefmwilson: one thing that tends to get swept under the carpet is the number of bugs that've been fixed, both in ubuntu and back in debian.. that at least is a worthy goal01:13
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mwilsoncef: I find amazing the things Gnome 2.8 wants to let users do.01:14
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jsubl2mwilson, for example01:15
cefmwilson: but I'm interested in the reasoning.. the 'why's.. specifics do help, not every last thing though01:15
mwilsoncef: Especially in light of their supposed Joe Sixpack target audience.01:15
cefmwilson: you mean the whole sudo instead of root approach?01:15
jdubmwilson: note that the target audience is "everyone".01:15
jdubcef: sounds like he's talking about gnome, not ubuntu.01:16
cefheya jdub01:16
mwilsoncef: No, not at all.  I have no problem with Joe Sixpack not knowing the root password for his own box.01:16
pyramidmwilson, does gnome let you turn the extra taskbar off.01:16
tsengyay jdub returns.01:16
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pyramidmwilson, and get it off your display01:16
cefjdub: so where are you? have you hit victoria yet?01:16
mwilsoncef: All he's going to do with it is be destructive.01:16
jdubcef: flying down this afternoon01:16
jgeorgesonpyramid, what is it you can't turn off?01:16
cefjdub: cool.. want to speak first, or later?01:17
pyramidjgeorgeson, well this gnome seems to have two taskbars....and that really takes up a lot of valuable desktop real estate.01:17
tsengpyramid: move the stuff you want to the top and remove one then01:17
joemright click delete panel?01:17
mwilsoncef: Things like allowing users to decide whether desktops get shared or not.  Users don't get to decide whether boxen export things.01:17
Caprijdub: I've sent you a mail about the translation work. Did you get it?01:17
pyramidjgeorgeson, is there any way to keep the one on the bottom but eliminate the other that seems to only show what programs are running.01:17
jdubcef: whichever gives me enough time for talk+questions :)01:17
jdubCapri: yes, thanks01:18
jgeorgesonpyramid, you should just be able to righ-click and select Delete this panel01:18
cefjdub: heh.. ok.. well of course if the other speaker is late, that throws it out the window.. but I'll see what I can do01:18
pyramidjgeorgeson, ok they refer to it officially as a panel01:18
pyramidjgeorgeson, so i could just delete it.01:18
jgeorgesonyou can move applets and launchers between panels01:18
jgeorgesonpyramid, yes01:18
mwilsoncef: Then you have their stated "What, not How" paradigm, and yet Joe Sixpack is handed HAL Device Manager.01:18
jdubmwilson: that's not a gnome app.01:19
pyramidjgeorgeson, i don't see any need to have it showing me what programs are running..i could get that info with top01:19
joemhal device manager is not installed by default as of latest hal release01:19
jdubmwilson: it's provided (by ubuntu) as a handy tool.01:19
joemit is a seperate package01:19
pyramidbut the only thing is that there are the 4window desktop buttons on the panel..can i move them to the bottom panel..before i delete the other one.01:20
jdubpyramid: middle drag it away01:20
jgeorgesonpyramid, yeah, right-click on whatever applet you want to move, and it should have a menu entry to move01:21
jdubor you can re-add it01:21
pyramidjdub, middle drag doesn't seem to do anything here.01:21
joemyou have to unlock the applet first01:21
cefmwilson: btw: I see all this as valuable input.. wether ubuntu is wrong or not.. I'm not sure.. but I must admit sometimes it's hard to accept that you've made a wrong decision, and even harder to fix it01:21
jgeorgesonpyramid, ome applets are locked, so you might have to unlock them to get them in the right arranement (again, just right-click)01:21
mwilsoncef: Gnomies are never wrong.  Just ask them.01:21
jdubmwilson: raise some gnome issues, and i'll give you answers.01:22
cefmwilson: but as I suspected, it's more the way ubuntu itself works, not gnome per se,01:22
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mwilsonYou're going to tell me that desktop sharing is an Ubuntu issue, not a Gnome one?01:22
jdubnup, vino is now included in the gnome desktop release01:22
allyballyhi i am a debian user, considering moving to ubuntu - can anyone tell me whether Ubuntu is using X.org yet or if not, when they (if ever) will move over to it. TIA01:23
jduballybally: not yet, next release.01:23
jduballybally: see the faq for more01:23
mwilsonUsers don't get to make those sorts of calls.01:23
joemsysadmins can decide to disable it or not01:23
jgeorgesonallybally, next release should use x.org01:23
joemaverage desktop users should be able to share if they want01:23
jdubmwilson: you'll have to describe what you mean.01:24
LinuxJonesmwilson, what are you talking about ?01:24
pyramidhey what do you know...the windows moved to the bottom panel.01:24
cefmwilson: not per se, but it's global setting afaik is enabled by default in ubuntu.,.. not sure if that's the upstream default01:24
pyramidnow i can delete that extra panel01:24
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mwilsonIt seems rather simple... Joe Sixpack doesn't get to decide what a machine exports.01:24
allyballyjdub: thanks, i see from the website that ubuntu is not the final release yet. Is the first proper release of Ubuntu due to be some time this month?01:24
joemmwilson, why not?01:24
jdubmwilson: it's disabled by default, and the user has full control via the configuration dialogue.01:24
jgeorgesonmwilson, he does when it's his personal machine01:24
joemwho decides it then,,01:25
pyramidyes it is finally gone...that nuisance...01:25
Mithrandirallybally: yes.01:25
jduballybally: 20th this month01:25
mwilsonYes, the *user* has control, not the admin.01:25
allyballyis the current preview release of ubuntu fully upgradeable to the final release via apt-get?01:25
nasdaq4088*** Now talking in #ubuntu01:25
nasdaq4088*** Topic is 'FAQ: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/support/documentation/faq/ | Wiki: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/ | Lists: http://lists.ubuntu.com/ | Bugs: http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/ | Just Works: http://spamusement.com/view.php?id=81'01:25
nasdaq4088*** Set by Se7h on Sat Oct 02 08:28:2101:25
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nasdaq4088<vertical98> I modified modules to hopefully install the 3c515 module so I can finish the install01:25
nasdaq4088<LinuxJones> hi everyone01:25
jdubmwilson: the admin also has full control via gconf.01:25
nasdaq4088<nasdaq4088> hi01:25
nasdaq4088<mwh_> LinuxJones: hi there01:25
nasdaq4088*** zenwhen has quit IRC (Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer))01:25
nasdaq4088<neighborlee> hey guys..where is 'gmake'...its not listed even at debians site but I  need it for one of my projects..???01:25
nasdaq4088<akra> anyone else using thunderbird on ubuntu ?01:25
pyramidi am going to reboot the computer and make sure that extra panel is gone forever.01:25
nasdaq4088<Kamion> neighborlee: that's what non-GNU/Linux people call 'make'01:25
nasdaq4088<Kamion> gmake == GNU make on systems where there's a different proprietary make01:25
nasdaq4088<neighborlee> ohhhhhhh01:25
mwilsonNow, if there's a way to stop him, other than iptables, then that's different.01:25
jdubmwilson: those settings can be locked down so the user can't change them.01:25
nasdaq4088sorry i'm just trying something in irc01:25
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LinuxJonesnasdaq4088, spammer :D01:26
jdubmwilson: no, it can all be done at the gnome level.01:26
Mithrandirallybally: http://wiki.ubuntulinux.org/WartyWarthog_2fReleaseSchedule and http://wiki.ubuntulinux.org/WartyWarthog_2fReleaseSchedule might be of interest to you.01:26
cefmwilson: I'm guessing that you'd probably like to see something where there are security zones that users can be given access to only a selected subset of superuser tools, ie: the ones that make sense, for larger rollouts (eg: corporate desktops)?01:26
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jgeorgesonif the command `smbclient -L machine` works, why would browsing the same machine in nautilus via smb://machine tell me i don't have permission?01:27
allyballyis the current preview release of ubuntu fully upgradeable to the final release via apt-get?01:27
mwilsoncef: Not superuser tools, no.  Users don't get those sorts of things.01:27
Mithrandirallybally: yes01:27
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jduballybally: yes, that's also answered in the faq. :)01:27
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Mithrandirallybally: and to hoary, and to grumpy and perky.01:27
mwilsonallybally: Even *I've* read the FAQ.01:27
allyballymany thanks jdub etc, I must read the FAQ closer. I have read it (a bit) honest!01:28
mwilsonAlthough apparently I missed something, if this sort of thing is addressed.01:28
jdubmwilson: so where's the problem with vino?01:28
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jdub(apart from pulling 100% cpu on an X server without DAMAGE.)01:28
cefargh.. I gotta go.. I really should be at work.. *grin*01:29
mwilsonI don't know where the problem is with it, that's the point.  Users don't get to make calls about what a machine exports.  I can't make it any plainer than that.  What's next, giving them control of NFS exports?  That's silly, but just as valid.01:29
meekjDoes anyone know the file in Ubuntu to define what modules are loaded at boot?01:29
jdubmwilson: it's fully configurable by the user and the admin. it can be completely locked down.01:30
jdubmeekj: some in /etc/modules, but most are autodetected01:30
cefjdub: cya tonight01:30
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jgeorgesonanyone know what's up with rhythmbox not showing titles for mp3 streams?01:31
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meekjWell, the installer loaded asus_acpi on my Dell. And this make the system freeze at times.01:31
mwilsonAnyway, I didn't volunteer my opinions, I was asked.01:31
Mithrandirmeekj: add it to /etc/hotplug/blacklist, then01:32
meekjAt the top of /etc/modules is says to not mod by hand.01:32
LinuxJonesmwilson, thanks for those btw01:32
meekjok, thanks.01:32
jdubmwilson: sure, and they're being answered. some of the things you don't like might not be correct.01:32
allyballyi'm getting a new AMD64 Athlon. Should I use the AMD64 version of Ubuntu or should I just use a 32bit version? I ask because I have heard that a few programs don't yet work on the 64-bit version.01:32
Mithrandirallybally: oh, which ones?01:32
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allyballyMithrandir: i read in a magazine, but it was referring to Suse and RH distros, just wondered if it affected ubuntu01:33
psrHi, I've been checking out Ubuntu, great work!  I have a couple of problems with it though.  First is that the "Configure" menu option in synaptic doesn't seem to work, and stops dpkg-reconfigure from working.  Is this a known bug?01:33
Mithrandirallybally: I think we have everything working fine -- the amd64 version runs fine on my home desktop, at least.01:34
Mithrandirallybally: and if you find amd64 bugs, I really want to fix them. :)01:34
mwilsonI wish I could remember where that dialog box mistake was, I'll have to look for it again.01:35
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allyballycheers Mithrandir, I've just clicked to download the 64bit version! - Are you the person to report these issues to then?01:35
mwilsonI wanted to tell someone, and forgot to write it down.01:35
Mithrandirallybally: use bugzilla, but yes, I'm working on amd64.01:35
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allyballyMithrandir: cool ;) 01:35
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allyballyMithrandir: I know this is an odd question, but can you name any other non-live (ie full) distros that are Debian based?01:36
mwilsonIt was one of those things where the text says "press OK", but there isn't an OK, only an Accept.01:36
mwilsonallybally: Xandros.01:36
Mithrandirallybally: skolelinux, xandros, libranet, lindows?01:37
allyballyhmm, don't like Xandros - anyone else have any feelings for it?01:37
stevedallybally: UserLinux01:37
Mithrandirallybally: also, some speciality distros, like gibraltar are debian based.01:37
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allyballyI am really wanting to get my distro choice just right for my new system, and I've only heard great things about ubuntu, but would anyone make any reccomendations over these other distros over Ubuntu?01:38
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pyramidhey what do you know...i rebooted and the extra gnome panel is gone forever...that nuisance...there was no place to put it without interfering in many applications...but it is gone now.01:39
pyramidhmm ..strange my text is not showing up fully01:40
jgeorgesonpyramid, i've never understood having two panels like that either01:40
pyramidwell that time it did.01:40
pyramidjgeorgeson, yes i know...there was no place you could put it without interfering with many many applications01:40
Mithrandirallybally: I think you ask that question in the wron channel. ;)01:40
Mithrandirwrong, even.01:41
pyramidbut it is gone now...and i salvages the 4 windows buttons on the bottom taskbar.01:41
smoI still prefer debian proper for servers .. I think that's about as unbiased as you're gonna find in here   lol01:41
WW_allybally: Don't overanalyze... there is no perfect distro.  Give /home its own partition, pick a distro (ubuntu seems pretty good), and go for it.01:41
jgeorgesonallybally, ubuntu and userlinux are the only debian-based, non-live-cd, distros which are packaged around gnome. the rest are kde01:41
WW_jgeorgeson: I wouldn't say Libranet is packaged around kde.01:42
pyramidjgeorgeson, well i have real problems with kde here...krita is not finished and konq3.3 isn't worth a flip on the internet.01:42
jgeorgesonWW_, does the defalut install give you a gnome desktop?01:42
smoI'm not sure Progeny is either  (altho I don't recall wether it gives any DE any real bias)01:42
jgeorgesonsmo, is progeny still putting out a distro?01:42
jdubthe latest progeny betas ship gnome01:43
WW_jgeorgeson: The default is IceWM with nautilus for desktop icons.01:43
tsengjdub: see my ? about howl?01:43
jdubtseng: nup01:43
jgeorgesonWW_, neat, thanks for the correction01:43
pyramidjgeorgeson, i like kde..but it doesn't work for me since i put in 3.301:43
tsengjdub: it doesnt appear to install nifd01:43
smojgeorgeson: There's alphas of a progeny debian 2 .. it's more a testbed for their componentised linux tho, rather than a targetted distro01:43
LinuxJonesProgeny ported Anaconda Installer but I haven't tried it01:43
pyramidjgeorgeson, so i am happy with gnome as a backup01:44
jdubtseng: yeah, i skipped some of the bong bits01:44
jgeorgesonprogeny is based on stable, yes?01:44
psrMy other problem is that the default settings for the X configuration aren't great for my graphics card.01:44
jdubtseng: i'll include them later if there's some requirement01:44
jdubtseng: atm, other tools do a better job01:44
jdubjgeorgeson: sarge01:44
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tsengjdub: people are telling me it needs to be running for this epittance, so i installed it01:44
jgeorgesoncool, well, i'm out01:45
pyramidgnome seems to work for me ...for what i have checked anyway...but i wish gtoaster had a verify option.01:45
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psrI use an old s3 virge, which doesn't have the bandwidth for High resolutions at high colour depths in XFree86.  Theres a thread about the problem here: http://www.mail-archive.com/xfree86@xfree86.org/msg11195.html01:45
jdubtseng: it should only require mdnsresponder, unless it only works over local link addresses (which would also be entirely bong)01:45
tsenghm ok01:45
tsengi will try w/o01:46
tsengseems to be still working.01:46
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jdubyeah, mdnsresponder is the important bit01:47
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tsengi blame latexer.01:47
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burneranyone know how if there are plans for a bootsplash?01:51
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mwilsonGods, you can only hope not.01:51
jdubburner: nup, for hoary, we'll have an entirely user-space graphical boot system.01:51
psrHmmm, k, I only came on here because the website said I should before posting to bugzilla.01:51
ForsaKen`i got ubuntu.. great dist.. i have installed kde (i used apt-get install kde-core), did all the upgrade, dist-upgrade, now i want to install a theme, and in ubuntus kde, i just cant01:51
mwilsonSomeone define for me what "user-space graphical boot" means...01:52
ForsaKen`btw ubuntus kde is 3.2.3, and there is kde 3.301:52
burnerjdub, know if it'll be upgradeable to that from warty?01:52
jdubburner: of course. :-)01:52
ForsaKen`the place in control center, where i supost to be able to switch themes, is just isnt there01:52
=== burner wants a graphical boot system... go back to #debian mwilson ;)
jdubmwilson: part of bootsplash is done in-kernel. our graphical boot display won't be done in the kernel at all.01:53
mwilsonburner: Why?  I've never understood it.  Do you sit there and pound the reset button so you can watch the boot?01:54
jdubmwilson: it's a small amount of work to have a welcoming boot process.01:54
burnerno... i have a laptop... i take it everywhere with me... there's no hibernate in linux yet (stable) so I reboot often01:54
burnerjdub, no kernel stuff?!?!?!?01:55
jdubburner: that's not the reason why it's useful, though.01:55
jdubburner: no. entirely user space.01:55
mwilsonIt's not "useful" at all.  It's just eye-candy, then?01:55
jdubmwilson: it makes the machine less confronting.01:56
burnerhow is it entirely userspace?01:56
burnerjdub, know if dhcp will be backgrounded in the new boot process in hoary?01:56
jdubburner: it's not run in the kernel at all, it's just normal software.01:56
burnerno, i get that01:56
jdubburner: i don't think we'll change the actual boot process substantially01:56
burneri've just never heard of an entirely userspace bootsplash01:57
ForsaKen`i got ubuntu.. great dist.. i have installed kde (i used apt-get install kde-core), did all the upgrade, dist-upgrade, now i want to install a theme, and in ubuntus kde, i just cant. the place in control center, where i supost to be able to switch themes, is just isnt there01:57
jdubburner: that's what rhgb is on fedora.01:57
jdubForsaKen`: don't know; KDE isn't supported01:57
burner:\  dhcp hangs forever for me since I only use wireless and the ipw2100 modules needs to be reloaded after totally booted :\01:57
mwilsonX isn't running, obviously, so doesn't that require FB or something similar?01:57
jdubForsaKen`: you might be able to ask on the list01:57
mwilsonSince it's not in kernel-space?01:58
jdubmwilson: we may use X or FB (rhgb uses X)01:58
burnerForsaKen`, you just got kde-core... get kde301:58
ForsaKen`ok thanks01:58
jdubburner: why does the module need to be reloaded?01:58
mwilsonMaybe I'm an idiot, but how do you run X if you don't have a kernel yet?01:58
ForsaKen`hmm thats it, there is only kde-core package, all the athere are just small support things01:59
jdubmwilson: you *do* have a kernel.01:59
burnergot me... i've alwyas had to do it with ipw210001:59
ForsaKen`kdeartwork - themes, styles and more from the official KDE release01:59
burnerrmmod ipw2100; modprobe ipw2100; dhclient eth1 <--always my first command after X loads01:59
ForsaKen`ill download this :)01:59
mwilsonSo you're talking about switching at init time, not at kernel time.01:59
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psrCan any of you even see what I'm typing?01:59
jdubForsaKen`: install 'kde'01:59
ForsaKen`love ubuntu :DDDDDDDd01:59
sean_psr , I can see you02:00
WW_Anybody using Evolution Mail? Does Help->Contents or Help->Quick Reference give you anything?  Nothing happens when I try these here.02:00
ForsaKen`k thanks :)02:00
sean_WW , works for me02:00
burnerWW_, doesn't work for me either02:00
jdubWW_: can you file a bug?02:00
jdubWW_: i reproduced it here02:00
sean_I just updated from the repositories in the last 30 minutes02:00
LinuxJonespsr, we can see you !!02:01
sean_It might already be fixed02:01
ForsaKen`btw if there is some one from israel, or from around here, i have opned a ubuntu 100MBiT mirror in israel: http://ubuntu.sam-hosting.co.il fell free to use :D02:01
sean_Whats the deal with using the universe repository02:01
jdubsean_: it's unsupported, but available for use02:01
WW_jdub: Can and will.  Just wanted to see if I was missing something obvious.02:01
jdubsean_: it's debian main, built for ubuntu02:01
sean_will ubuntu prefer its own repositores, or if you pick apply all upgrades if world has a more recent version will it automatically use it02:01
sean_thanks jdub02:02
psrsean_ and LinuxJones, thanks.  I just wanted confirmation that my two problems are bugs I should file in bugzilla.02:02
jdubsean_: universe is an ubuntu repository02:02
=== burner does an upgrade and will test evolution
sean_jdub: I know its a ubuntu repository, I just wondered how nice it played with ubuntu main and what the preferences where by default02:02
jdubsean_: nothing's duplicated between main and universe02:03
LinuxJonespsr, have you upgraded you system recently ?02:03
jdubsean_: so it should, in general, just work02:03
psrNo, unfortunately I can't connect that machine to the internet.  Its a clean install off an ISO I downloaded on Saturday.02:03
LinuxJonespsr, what kind of problem are you having ?02:04
sean_anyone want to help out an irc newbie?02:04
psrLinuxJones: One is that the "configure" option in Synaptic doesn't  do anything, and stops dpkg-reconfigure from doing anything.02:05
sean_im using xchat , what does someones name in yellow mean on the left?02:05
burnersean_, highlighted.. means they said your name02:05
jdubsean_: probably that they've mentioned your name02:05
jdubnot highlighted02:05
jdubsean_: highlighted02:05
tsengjdub: i guess howl in gnome-vfs has to wait for hoary?02:05
sean_just set up ubuntu in the last hour02:06
burnerForsaKen`, you an avid kde user?02:06
LinuxJonespsr, give me a sec to check02:06
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sean_easiest install every02:06
sean_event found my atheros based wifi card02:06
LinuxJonespsr, I have to isntall gnome-perl02:06
pyramidburner, you mean you set up ubuntu in less than one hour.02:06
sean_its a pity there is no nice gui to configure wifi connections (wep key etc.)02:06
ForsaKen`avid kde user ?02:06
psrLinuxJones: The other is that the XF86Config thats generated for my PCI GFX card doesn't work. (And it didn't seem to detect my AGP GeForce at all)02:06
burnerpyramid, ?02:06
ForsaKen`i just dont really like gnome02:07
pyramidburner, did you say you set up ubuntu in less than one hour.02:07
burnerForsaKen`, i'm curious if you know anything about kde and making usb drives appear on the desktop when you plug em in ;)02:07
burnerkinda like how gnome does02:07
WayOutWestsame here but i like ubuntu as a whole and is making me like gnome more02:07
burnerpyramid, maybe?  02:07
psrLinuxJones: You have to install gnome-perl to make synaptic work properly?02:07
LinuxJonespsr, have you installed the nvidia driver ?02:07
burnerpyramid, i bet it was more like 20 minutes02:07
pyramidburner, that is incredible.02:07
LinuxJonespsr, yes to configure it said that I needed it to run02:08
burnerit's not gentoo ;)02:08
ForsaKen`click on your sesktop > create new > device > ..02:08
pyramidburner, i have been working on gentoo for about 8 months and it still is not set up02:08
burnerForsaKen`, i know about that... not what i was thinking ideally02:08
burnerpyramid, doesn't surprise me ;)02:09
WayOutWesthas anyone done a dual boot with XP?02:09
pyramidburner, that is what gets me...gentoo never seems to be finished.02:09
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burnerWayOutWest, of course02:09
psrLinuxJones: No, I tried to switch to nv by doing a dpkg-reconfigure, but it didn't work.02:09
pyramidburner, everyday you are having to recompile new libraries or whatever and then having to recompile all the programs.02:10
burnerpyramid, so install ubuntu or kanotix 02:10
psrLinuxJones: Probably because I selected the wrong modules or something, but isn't the point meant to be that everything just works?02:10
pyramidburner, well when i get another machine i am going to try ubuntu...but this one is heavily loaded with gentoo.02:10
LinuxJonespsr,  >>http://wiki.ubuntulinux.org/FrequentlyAskedQuestions02:10
LinuxJonespsr,  see #102:10
burnereh, to each their own... i'll never use gentoo again... wasted too many hours of my life02:11
LinuxJonespsr,  configure seems to be working jsut fine for me in Synaptic02:11
pyramidburner, i agree...gentoo is a real time-killer.02:11
WayOutWestburner, is it difficult, i tried one with Fedora Core 2 which, after searching after install, i found to have known problems with XP. so Ubuntu has none of these?02:11
ForsaKen`i installed gentoo, the 1st thing i did after the pc booted to the linux, was rm -rf *02:11
ForsaKen`the couldnt even make a NORMAL INSTALL PROGRAM ?!02:11
burnerWayOutWest, none i've seen02:12
pyramidForsaKen`, i can fully understand that.02:12
ForsaKen`i have to sit with 3 pages and do like 23214234 commands02:12
burnerheh, you learn a lil bit though02:12
WayOutWestburner, thanks i might try it sometime.02:12
burneri would never known what swapon command did'02:12
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pyramidburner, yes that is why so many people on slashdot call gentoo the GURU linux02:12
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pyramidburner, and i suppose they really do have a witch doctor for a developer.02:12
ForsaKen`and apt-get works much better then em-some-thing i dont remember the name02:13
sean_how is ubuntu so fast! I was running gnome 2.6 on debian until yesterday, and I'm running 8 apps at onece without any sign of swapping02:13
burnertheir old lead dev quit... daniel robbins02:13
pyramidburner, yes i heard that..i wonder where he went.02:13
tsengwould you people get over gentoo in here already02:13
nasdaq4088is ubuntu faster than other os on the market?02:13
ForsaKen`lol :+)02:14
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pyramidtseng, we are comparing install times of gentoo vs ubuntu...ie 8 months vs 20 minutes.02:14
burnernasdaq4088, yes!  ;)   jk02:14
meekjHow can a prevent a module from loading at boot?02:14
psrLinuxJones: Yes, I read the FAQ :-)  My problem isn't that the nvidia card wasn't set up correctly (It would have been nice if it had been though).  My problem is that having decided to use the Virge, the installer left me with an XF86Config file that doesn't suit the card.  Its a known problem with the XFree86 Virge driver, and the work around is to use a lower resolution and colour depth.02:15
tsengpyramid: i hear you spreading fud about gentoo a few times a day, among all your other useless rambling. could you try sticking to the topic?02:15
burnermeekj, take it out of /etc/modules02:15
burnermeekj, and if it's loaded by hotplug... add it to the hotplug blacklist02:15
pyramidtseng, why do you call it FUD....these are simple facts and we should be allowed to compare things with ubuntu in a ubuntu channel.02:15
tseng8 months?02:16
meekjhum, it says at the top of the file /etc/modules to not mess with it by hand.02:16
tsengthis is not a fact, that is crap02:16
nasdaq4088the security features of ubuntu02:16
LinuxJonespsr, the vesa driver will not work with that card, I am not familiar with the Virge card is it real old ?02:16
nasdaq4088how good is it?02:16
pyramidtseng, yes tseng i have been installing gentoo for 8 months and it still is not finished.02:16
=== burner agrees
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tsengpyramid: then you are doing something wrong.02:16
psrLinuxJones: see http://www.mail-archive.com/xfree86@xfree86.org/msg11195.html02:16
pyramidtseng, and he said he installed ubuntu in 20 minutes.02:16
tsengme too02:17
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tsengi can install gentoo in ~1 hour02:17
burnermeekj, i'm not sure how to do it if not to do it from hand?02:17
pyramidtseng, well i don't know what i am doing wrong..i am just trying to keep up with the witch doctor over there.02:17
psrLinuxJones: Yeah, its pretty old.  I use it to drive a second monitor in a xinerama layout.02:17
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=== burner can install gentoo in about an hour as well ;)
pyramidburner, how can you install gentoo in one hour when the packages change every day02:18
meekjburner: I'm sorry, /etc/modules can be edited. But the module I want to stop loading is not listed there.02:18
LinuxJonespsr, would be better to put the GForce card in there :)02:18
burnerpyramid, to get an up and running system only takes about an hours02:18
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psrLinuxJones: For windows it needs to be set as the the main graphics card in the BIOS for dual head to work.  Thats presumably why the installer didn't see the GeForce.02:18
burnerall systems change... debian/ubuntu/rh/fc/suse/etc02:18
pyramidburner, well i am not sure what you mean by up and running when the packages need changing every day.02:18
LinuxJonespsr, ahh02:19
burnerthey dont' "need" it02:19
jdubguys, take the off-topic stuff elsewhere pleases02:19
psrLinuxJones: It would be best of all to copy my XF86Config accross from my Debian install :-), but that doesn't help the next guy.02:19
burnerthe evolution upgrade doesn't help02:19
LinuxJonespsr, worry about yourself first :D02:20
jdubpsr: the 24bit thing is a known problem02:20
burner(evolution-2.0:8307): Bonobo-WARNING **: Error: 'Unable to find the help files in either /usr/share/gnome/help/evolution-2.0/ or /usr/share/gnome/help/.  Please check your installation'02:20
pyramidburner, yes i know...i just installed evolution2.0 and then two days later evolution2.01 came out02:20
jensenswhats the ubuntu equivalent to debians modconf?02:20
jensensor: how to load modules persistent02:20
meekjjensens: Yeah! Thats what I want to know.02:21
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jdubjensens: add them to /etc/modules02:21
atomskwow...nice job with ubuntu guys02:21
jensensjdub: theres no magic behind it like in debiansm odutils02:21
=== ForsaKen` is now known as ForsaKen
jdubjensens: well, that's a whole different matter :)02:22
meekjI have a module that loads that is not in /etc/modules.02:22
=== jensens in fact likes modutils
=== ForsaKen is now known as ForsaKen`
jdubstuff in /etc/modules will always load, that's your configuration file02:22
burnermeekj, prolly loaded by hotplug02:22
burnercheck out the hotplug blacklist02:22
jdubthen there's module-init-tools, hotplug, etc.02:22
meekjburner: I don't it is, asus_acpi02:22
psrjdub , LinuxJones : right, thanks.  I realise its not something many people are going to come across, but when you do its painful on the eyes :-)  Are there plans to handle Dual head systems better in the installer?02:23
jdubmost of the stuff loaded will be from hotplug, some of it is loaded from other init scripts,02:23
burneru sure?02:23
jensensjdub: well, to load evdev module (for my synaptics touchpad) i just place it in /etc/modules ?02:23
jdubpsr: not for the first release02:23
jdubjensens: yes02:23
jensensjdub: thx!02:23
ForsaKen`if i want to put some thing as an alias, but i dont want to use alias, command evry time that i reboot my pc02:23
ForsaKen`is there a file that saves all the aliases ?02:23
jensensForsaKen`: put it in ~/.bashrc02:24
jdubForsaKen`: as in, shell aliases?02:24
LinuxJonespsi, I am not sure, Configure in Synaptic works jsut fine for me BTW.02:24
ForsaKen`yes as is shell alias02:24
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psrjdub: Fair enough, I can see that its a minority issue.  Ubunutu otherwise seems to rock really very hard.  Keep up the good workl and thanks! :-)  02:24
WW_I could swear that I chose to NOT participate in the "popularity contest" when I installed ubuntu, but now I see that in my last dist-upgrade, it is installed and has been upgraded.  Can I just remove the package?02:25
psrLinuxJones: Thanks very much for your help! :-)02:25
LinuxJonespsi, ;)02:25
ForsaKen`to put all the command? like alias format="rm -rf *.*"02:26
ForsaKen`or only format="rm -rf *.*02:26
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ForsaKen`i dont really use an alias like that lol =] 02:26
jensensForsaKen`: the whole line.02:26
jensensForsaKen`: to make it active /for testing/ just do source ~/.bashrc 02:27
sean_anyone here any good with wifi? Cant seem to figure out how to get ubuntu to remember my wep key02:27
mwilsonPresumably it does things the same way Debian does, in the interfaces file?02:28
justdavewere there known problems with the 10/3 daily cd build for powerpc?02:29
RuffianSoldierwhats a good windows emulator (one that you install windows through and use windows through)\02:34
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allyballyRuffianSoldier: not an emulator, but a virtual machine, VMWare allows you to run windows within Linux02:35
allyballyit works v. well.02:35
RuffianSoldierthats the one i wanted02:35
tardmacanyone here "upgrade" from debian testing to ubuntu?02:35
allyballytardmac: i'm thinking about doing it. Dunno if I have the balls though!02:36
tardmaci'm thinking about it too02:36
tardmacbut it's my laptop02:36
tardmacthat I dual boot02:36
allyballyit would be hell to start from scratch on my laptop, as it has no cd rom02:36
tardmacI guess I can try02:36
RuffianSoldierallybally - Can i apt-get VMWare?02:36
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allyballyheh, they are looking for people to post up on the web site (the main one) what your success was on migrating02:37
tardmaci might as well try it :D02:37
allyballyRuffianSoldier: I don't think so, its a commerical piece of software - www.vmware.com02:37
tardmacI'll back up my data first though02:37
allyballytardmac: as long as everything is in /home you should be good to go. I've been reading a few external sources and they say there are probs with reiser just now but ext3 is fully stable02:38
pyramidand anyway why do people say that package upgrades are not necessary when the authors of the programs themselves think that they are.02:39
tardmaci'm ext3 on my linux partition02:39
tardmacunfortunately it's all one partition02:39
tardmacI can try :)02:39
xLobeznox<xLobeznox>   gstreamer0.8-cdparanoia libmusicbrainz4 sound-juicer <-- this I have installed by dependencies with sound-juicer in gnome02:40
xLobeznox<xLobeznox> but, I cant rip in mp3, what does this program uses for mp3 rip? 02:40
xLobeznox<xLobeznox> please02:40
pyramidit seems to be a constant probem and very pervasive.02:40
allyballyhmm, if you have any free space on the drive (enough for /home), id think about creating a new part for it. You could squeze your / part with qtparted or pqmagic or something like it02:40
RuffianSoldierWhich VMWare product is it?02:42
allyballyI used (I think) WS (for WorkStation)02:42
Hrdwr_BoBxLobeznox: you need the mp3 libraries02:44
Hrdwr_BoBthey are ... encumbered02:44
xLobeznoxI use debian sarge, not ubuntu02:44
xLobeznoxbut, what libraries they are ?02:44
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WW_Could someone help me getting Evolution Mail set up to send mail?02:50
RuffianSoldieri guess02:50
sean_WW_ sure 02:50
RuffianSoldieryou have to put in your SMTP address02:50
RuffianSoldierWW_, SMTP02:51
pyramidWW_ what version of evolution do you have.02:51
pyramidit keeps changing every few days.02:51
WW_pyramid: 2.0 (the latest from ubuntu)02:51
pyramidWW_, well ok what is your question...2.01 seems to work here and should not be much different02:52
sean_WW_ what error are you getting?02:52
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pyramidWW_ what setting are you trying to set02:52
WW_Right... it is
pyramidWW_ ok it should be easy to set up...do you know your pop3 and smtp server names.02:53
sean_WW_ can you send or recieve right now , or neither?02:53
jdeRuffianSoldier, can't you use posftfix?02:54
WW_I'm not sure how to configure the "Sending Mail" options.  My office computer (running RHEL3 and Evolution 1.4) uses sendmail.02:54
pyramidWW_ if not you will have to call your ISP and get some data.02:54
WW_Sorry... can't keep up!02:54
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pyramidwell who is your ISP02:54
jdeRuffianSoldier, posftfix as your mta.02:54
RuffianSoldierjde, MTA?02:55
jdeMail Transfer Agent02:55
sean_WW_ your mail address is someone@somewhere.com , whats the somewhere.com bit?02:55
RuffianSoldierjde: how is this relevent to me?02:55
WW_sean_: That would be colgate.edu02:55
sean_RuffianSoldier : MTA = Mail Transfer Agent , usually a SMTP server (part of most mail server packages)02:55
jdeYou asked ww_ what his smtp server was.02:56
jdeforget it.02:56
sean_use mailmx.colgate.edu as the mail server02:56
pyramidjde, he needs to input some information...to set it up.02:56
jdeUbuntu comes with postfix as opposed to sendmail.02:56
WW_I found a reference on the school's web page to smtp.colgate.edu, so presumably I should be using that.02:57
pyramidWW_ ok do you have a user account at your school.02:57
WW_pyramid: Yes.02:57
sean_WW_ i just lookup up the domain and it returned mailmx.colgate.edu, smtp is probably the same machine, try smtp first though02:57
pyramidWW_ ok then...yes type that for your smtp entry...and what is their pop3 server02:58
WW_I can read the email fine.  It is an Exchange 2003 server, but I am using the IMAP interface for receiving email.02:58
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jdetry smtp.colgate.edu02:58
ndowenshow do u download and install packages from deb-src?02:58
sean_WW_ try sending a mail now , you can send to me if you want , sean@odonnell.nu02:58
pyramidWW_ ok evolution handles IMAP also.02:58
sean_just make sure SERVER TYPE is smtp , and HOST is smtp.colgate.edu02:59
WW_sean_: I've tried that before, but I'm trying it again now...02:59
sean_WW_ if that does not work , try checking the 'Server requires authentication' box and filling in your username at the bottom03:18
jdeTry that.03:18
pyramidWW_, sometimes username is not enough..sometimes it is username@somewhere.something...but you need to check with your ISP03:18
sean_WW_ you can also try the username with and without the domain , and try the various different types of authentication03:18
sean_WW_ also if it gives an error message let me know what it is03:18
RuffianSoldierMy friend hosts my account, and my user name is the same as my Email adress, and my STMP and my POP3 are the same= mail.mysticalnexus.com03:18
WW_jde, pyramid, sean_: Still playing with smtp... I'll try those suggestions next.03:18
jdeI just googled for it. SHould be mail.colgate.edu03:18
sean_WW_ I've run a few mail severs so we should be able to figure it out03:18
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jdeWW_ should be mail.colgate.edu03:18
Phr0stByteI love Ubuntu!!!03:18
=== Phr0stByte hugs his computer...
WW_jde_: smtp.colgate.edu failed: timed out. I'll try mail.colgate.edu.03:18
jdeGroup hug!03:18
=== jde hugs his ubuntu cd.
=== RuffianSoldier hugs his Ubuntu Box!
jdeRuffianSoldier, I 0wn your box!03:18
Phr0stByteWe sounf like a bunch of Gnome developers....03:18
sean_WW_ just telneted to mail.colgate.edu on port 25, its definately a working smtp server03:18
jdeRuffianSoldier, kidding kidding.03:18
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mwilsonHere's a question that bothered me... why doesn't Ubuntu see shared printers by default, since it uses CUPS (brrr)?03:18
jdeYeah, cups sucks.03:18
=== WW_ agrees with mwilson (unless there is some serious security issue)
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mwilsonI agree, but that doesn't change the fact that it doesn't see shared printers, which is supposedly one of CUPS' "big deals".  I wondered why that decision had been made.03:18
jdemwilson, you can put that on ubuntus feature request or something.03:18
pyramidjde, cups works ok here...not perfect but very usable.03:18
pyramidjde, what doesn't work for you.03:18
mwilsonjde: Not me, I'm just hanging out watching.  It's not like I'll ever use it, it just struck me as odd.03:18
jdepyramid, works fine on ubuntu sept I've had to jump through hoops on other distros.03:18
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jdeUsually just settle for apsfilter.03:18
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pyramidjde, well i haven't had too much problem with it except for the cups drivers...but when i use the gimp-print driver with cups i don't have much problems.03:18
mwilsonUgh, I gave up on apsfilter.03:18
mwilsonIf ifhp can't do it, it's not worth doing.03:18
LinuxJonesNight all sleepy Time !!03:18
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jayeolahi chaps03:18
pyramidjayeola, chaps huh...where are you from03:18
jdeWW_, did mail.colgate.edu work?03:18
jayeolalondon. installing ubuntu but i'm stuck at the partition stage03:18
pyramidjayeola, oh no wonder that is common language there...hello to you also03:18
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jayeolai'd like to boot with win98/ubuntu/blag(fedora)03:18
jayeolais any one dual booting here?03:18
soleblazehaving some problems installing ubuntu..I get get the error:03:18
jayeolaand where u from pyramid ?03:18
soleblazeSend-Mail: warning fork: Address family not supported by protocol03:18
soleblazeover and over03:18
soleblazeanyone know what i'm missing?03:18
pyramidjayeola, well i don't have dual boot.so i can't help much on that but i am from Texico pardner.03:18
WW_jde_: No... not yet, anyway.  What's the most likely Authentication Type?  (I know, that's really a question for the sysadmins at Colgate...)03:18
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pyramidjayeola, it used to be called Texas before it was overrun by starving Mexicans crossing the border.03:18
jayeolatexico, is that texas? are u a tex-mex, or should that be mex-tex?03:18
WW_jde_: I can send mail from my office computer (running Redhat, and Evolution 1.4 using sendmail).  Is there a file that I could check on that computer that would have the information that I need?03:18
jayeolaheh pyramid u seen that movie "blowfish"....03:19
pyramidjayeola, well i eat a bowl of chili every now and then but i don't think i am tex-mex..but i really don't know.03:19
jayeolaso no dual booters here then....03:19
pyramidjayeola, the area has changed a lot over the last 20 years.03:19
jayeolaspeaking spanish...03:20
pyramidjayeola, no what was blowfish about?03:20
sean_WW_ if you go into tools accounts on that machine , you can check the send mail settings there03:20
sean_doh , but you said it was using sendmail didnt you.....03:20
pyramidjayeola, no i don't speak any spanish...and i can't speak to all these people here.03:20
jayeolaa comedy with steve martin and eddie murphy03:20
WW_sean_: Right, that computer uses sendmail.03:21
RuffianSoldierWW_ - Any luCK?03:21
pyramidjayeola, i never could understand Mexican..the only thing i understand about Mexico is that they slaughtered all kinds of people at the Alamo.03:21
sean_WW_ dont know enough about sendmail to know how to extract the servername03:21
lotharioyeah, poor Davy Crockett03:21
pyramidjayeola, people like Jim Bowie, Davie Crockett, etc03:21
WW_sean_: Would there be a configuration file somewhere?03:22
lotharioHe took one for the team03:22
sean_WW_ this is probably going to be one for the colgate admins unfortunately03:22
jdeI could never understand American ... only thing I understand about American is that they took land from natives.03:22
nasdaq4088i can asure you many more mexicans than americans were slaughtered03:22
sean_yip , but I've heard its a monster03:22
sean_let me do a quick google03:22
pyramidjayeola, but they have taken over Texas so now i call it Texico....every TV station is in Spanish only.03:22
nasdaq4088did you know that 1/3 america belonged to the mexicans.03:22
jdubofftopic stuff elsewhere please03:22
lothariothat's why they wear sheeeet kickers03:23
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jdeWhat are sheet kickers?03:24
lothariocowboy boots03:24
tsengdrop it03:24
=== jayeola nods
pyramidtseng, you seem to get very upset when people discuss what is important to them...why not give them their freedom.03:25
pyramidtseng, did someone take your freedom away from you.03:25
tsengpyramid: i get very upset beacuse you seem to be at the center of a half dozen off topic discussions in the last two days03:25
tsengyou are so far off base that its ridiculous.03:26
tsenggentoo, ancient romans, mexico03:26
pyramidtseng, i did not even mention cowboy boots but i am saying let them talk about what is important to them....03:26
lotharioDavy Crockett never fed a troll!! look where it got him03:26
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sean_WW_ the sendmail config file is going to be called something.mc03:26
jdeAll right lets just keep this channel for tech related stuff guys.03:26
=== jayeola nods
sean_most likely config.mc in /etc/sendmail03:27
WW_pyramid: I came here to learn about using ubuntu.  All this extraneous chatter is interfering with my ability to do so.  I believe you are free to start your own channel, say #alamo or #americanhistory101.03:27
mwilsonHm, no one knows about the printing thing.03:27
sean_if you type "find / -name '*.mc' -print | less" that will give you a list of all such files 03:27
nasdaq4088lol WW_03:27
whiprushyay, doom3 works in ubuntu!03:28
sean_WW_ at the end of the file there will be a MAILER entry, that should contain the smtp server details and settings03:28
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pyramidWW_ well you know...i told you to call your ISP for some data...i think this is the best advice to save you a lot of time...but if you censor all those people just because they don't talk about exactly what you want to hear...you will never broaden your mind.03:29
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WW_pyramid: Yes, that was excellent advice, and I am grateful.03:32
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pyramidWW_ the reason you need to contact your isp is that there are several variables...and you could waste a lot of time just trying permutations of them...it is better to see what mail servers and user accounts your isp wants you to use and also if authentication is necessary03:33
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WW_pyramid: Right.03:34
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jayeolaany one tried a palm hand held thing yet?03:36
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tsengjayeola: yes.03:36
tsengworks fine03:36
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jayeolaoh yeah?03:37
jayeolawhat app?03:37
jdeGeez, politics always kills a room.03:37
tsengcomputer - desktop prefs - palm03:37
jayeolahard to get going? i tried with fedora but it never got past the sync03:37
tsengyou need to know what the device node is03:38
mwilsonI never found gnome-pilot worth the powder it'd take to blow it to hell... I always used coldsync.03:38
zenwhenDOOM 3 LINUX BINARIES ARE OUT: http://zerowing.idsoftware.com/linux/doom/03:38
jayeolathat's that my kernel docs said03:39
mwilsonGods, who cares about D3?03:39
cleedude. that game was cool.03:39
mwilsonIt's not as much of a snooze as some of the others, but it's still a snooze.03:39
cleeit's too bad that the Linux version performs so amazingly shittily.03:39
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mwilsonThe last decent FPS was D2.03:41
lothariois it okay to talk about games here?03:41
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jdeIt is related to GNU/Linux isn't it?03:42
pyramidlothario, yes ...of course if that is on your mind and maybe people may even learn something about what games work well and not on ubuntu03:42
HrdwrBoBzenwhen: I know ! :D :D03:43
zenwhenIm rather excited.03:44
HrdwrBoBI played it in winex03:44
nasdaq4088i'm getting rome total war in 1 months time03:44
zenwhenMy 6800 arrives tomorrow.03:44
HrdwrBoBbut it was slow++03:44
HrdwrBoBI have a 570003:44
HrdwrBoBnot the best03:44
zenwhenWhat luck.03:44
HrdwrBoBbut certainly capable03:44
zenwhenI have one too03:45
HrdwrBoBI couldn't justify more.. because I had to buy two :)03:45
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TheMonoTonethere's no bug on bugzilla but libphp4-jpgraph dependencies are broken03:54
TheMonoToneshould I put that on there?03:54
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dukekuis anyone else having problems with main/source updating?03:56
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dukekuis anyone else having problems with main/source updating?03:57
dukekuwrong window, was trying to hit up arrow in my term /o\03:57
dukekuFailed to fetch http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/warty/main/source/Sources.gz  Sub-process gzip returned an error code (1)03:58
jayeolahave u uncommented these sources?03:58
dukekuthey were working fine a day or so ago /o\03:59
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jayeolain /etc/apt/sources.blah?03:59
dukekusources.list :03:59
dukekuaaaaagh keyboard is ass03:59
jayeolableh - need some sleep. night chaps!03:59
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pyramidjayeola, night pardner.04:02
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spoonyGok, let me just say, i installed ubuntu as a goof b/c i saw it all over slashdot...04:02
spoonyGthis was THE fastest and easiest linux installs i've ever done.04:02
jayeolabuenos nochas amigo04:02
spoonyGi am most impressed04:02
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pyramidspoonyG, several people are reporting that...one person said he installed it in 20 minutes.04:03
spoonyGpyramid, yep that sounds about right04:03
HrdwrBoBspoonyG: that's the intention :)04:03
HrdwrBoBglad to hear it's working04:03
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=== Se7h SIC
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msassakhi... has anyone else had problems opening nautilus and other applications without using sudo?04:12
HrdwrBoBhow so?04:12
msassakwell, if i run nautilus from the command line, it just sits there, but if i run "sudo nautilus" it opens04:13
HrdwrBoBthat's because nautlius is already running04:14
HrdwrBoBas your user04:14
HrdwrBoBtype nautilus .04:14
HrdwrBoBand it will open cwd04:14
msassakno, it doesn't04:14
HrdwrBoBwhat about gnome-open .04:15
joemrunning nautilus would still open a new window regardless04:15
msassak"Error showing url: There is no default action associated with this location."04:15
msassakyeah, that's what i thought04:15
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joemmsassak, is there a nautilus process being run by your user that might need to be killed?04:15
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msassaki've killed all of them but they restart... let me go change that04:17
msassakapparently "File->Open" fails on every Gnome-ified application as well04:17
HrdwrBoBsounds like stuff is broken04:18
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HrdwrBoBwhat does apt-get -f install say04:18
msassakno problems... "0 upgraded", etc.04:19
msassakkilling nautilus permanently and starting it again doesn't help either :(04:19
HrdwrBoBsounds like it's up the shizzle04:20
msassakheh... is that a technical term?04:20
HrdwrBoBproblem with the gnome libraries somehow04:20
HrdwrBoBhighly technical04:20
HrdwrBoBoften used by ubuntu developers04:20
HrdwrBoBwell, at least one04:20
msassaklol... i will use that in the bug report04:20
msassakfwiw, when i run it with sudo, it spits out messages related to the mime-types of the files in the directory it's opening, so it's at least getting to that part of the code04:21
HrdwrBoBlong shot - try removing all .gnome* things in your home directory04:22
msassakor i should say, it's *not* getting there when run normally04:22
HrdwrBoBpossibly a local config issue04:22
HrdwrBoBor create another user04:22
HrdwrBoBbut that will be a PITA because of all the groups etc04:22
msassakawww cripe... i was hoping to avoid that... 04:22
msassakanother user might be worth a shot04:22
msassakdoes ubuntu package xnest?04:22
HrdwrBoBI'm not sure, it will be in universe at least04:23
msassakjust a second04:23
HrdwrBoBtry renaming your home directory04:23
danbotanybody here use the AMD64 version of Ubuntu?04:31
tardmacdanbot: i would if I'd be able to get my wireless working04:31
danbotI just got an AMD64 and MSI K8T Neo last tuesday so I am just checking out my options for Linux AMD64 sulution04:32
t35t0rdanbot: #ubuntu-amd6404:33
t35t0rnot many people there yet04:33
t35t0ris that nforce3?04:33
danbotno its a VIA04:33
WW_Minor nuisance: when I run gedit in one workspace, and then run gedit in another workspace, it pulls the first instance of gedit into the second workspace.  Can configure this so that it starts a new instance of gedit?04:33
t35t0rohh yes you said k8t04:33
danbotVIA K8T80004:33
WW_s/Can conf/Can I conf/04:34
HrdwrBoBWW_: I don't think you can , but even if you can that sounds like a bug04:34
WW_HrdwrBoB: Ah, I figured someone would tell me it was a feature, and I should learn to love it :-)04:34
HrdwrBoBwelcome to ubuntu :)04:35
WW_HrdwrBoB: I'll file it in bugzilla and see what happens.04:36
steveoddanbot: i have the K8T Master, i tried the 64bit, but the lack of some programs made me switch to the 32bit04:36
HrdwrBoBubuntu: now with 300% less retards04:36
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pyramidi am not sure what went wrong with kde3.3 but bloggsie also reports serious problems with konq...at his place the web site took 52seconds to come in whereas the same website with firefox took only 10seconds...so there is something very wrong with kde3.304:37
HrdwrBoBquite likely04:37
HrdwrBoBunfortunately kde is not technically supported right now04:37
HrdwrBoByou'll really have to wait for hoary for KDE04:38
pyramidwell something went wrong with kde..but maybe later it will be fixed.04:38
HrdwrBoBwell after warty is released, hoary will begin development, and KDE should move into SupportedSeed04:39
pyramidhey this is great there is now a blender channel04:40
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pyramidit has 42 people in it already04:40
neighborleeyea its been  growing steadily04:41
pyramidwell kde had k3d...so now gnome has blender which i think is very fair.04:41
neighborleehmm i'm not familiar with k3d04:42
neighborleeyou mean kpovmodeler ?04:42
pyramidneighborlee, well it is a nice program..and pretty good docs too online...but i printed an 800page manual on blender and it seems just as powerful04:43
neighborleeyea blender is amazing once you get into all aspects04:43
pyramidneighborlee, no i mean k3d...you can get the package from gentoo's website or elsewhere...but you know kde really has some serious problems since they went to 3.3...it may take awhile to get it running again.04:44
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pyramidneighborlee, now i did hear there was a hack coming out of the aKademy for Konq3.3 but it has not made it into the packages yet.04:45
pyramidneighborlee, it is just that something went very very wrong.04:45
mfeifhi guys. Can someone help me out with playing video in ubuntu? (I'm not a newbie, but I'm stuck)04:45
neighborleeits even better with version 2.34 especially now that we can do uvunwrapping with arbitrary surfaces ;-)04:45
CoolChEEzEanyone direct me toward a way to use the ati drivers (proprietary) on ubuntu04:45
CoolChEEzEnm i found it 04:46
neighborleepyramid, hmm actually Idont follow kde stuff much ;(04:46
neighborleepyramid, konq is better but I still find it undesireable04:46
neighborleeCoolChEEzE, heh04:46
pyramidneighborlee, well they are working on krita to have something comparable to the gimp2..but it is not ready yet either...so gnome has some advantages at this time.04:46
neighborleemfeif, sure where are you stuck04:47
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CoolChEEzEneighborlee, i didnt look hard enough ;)04:47
neighborleepyramid, hmmm somehow to me that just seems silly04:47
ubuntu-nubieecrimsun, you out there?04:47
crimsunubuntu-nubiee: yes.04:47
pyramidneighborlee, well it is nice to have two competing gui's..choice never hurts.04:47
mfeifI'm on a laptop, that I used to run debian/unstable on; it has a PCI radeon card for vid. I had video working great before the switch to ubuntu; now totem plays the audio but the video is blank for all mimetypes04:47
ubuntu-nubieei don't know if you remember, i was having network problems yesterday.04:48
neighborleepyramid, gimp2 is the answer to PS so dividing commmunity on YAGDP seems silly to me ;-)) ( yet another graphics design program) < lol04:48
crimsunubuntu-nubiee: yep04:48
ubuntu-nubieejust wanted to let you know i put the nic in a new pci slot and it's just fine. 04:48
crimsunubuntu-nubiee: all right, good to hear(read) :)04:48
ubuntu-nubieeman, gotta hate that.  wasted a good hours!04:48
neighborleepyramid, choice is good yes04:48
ubuntu-nubieeanyway, wanted to say thanks again for the help yesterday04:48
mfeifneighborlee: I noticed that the XF4 config uses ati driver rather than radeon, but that shouldn't matter, right?04:48
pyramidneighborlee, it is not about dividing..it is about expanding people's freedom and choices.04:48
neighborleemfeif, hmm sounds like your missing plugger04:49
mfeifneighborlee: I installed gxine and that sorta works, but not so hot. Formerly, I had totem working great04:49
mfeifwhat's that?04:49
neighborleemfeif, is this just on websites ?04:49
pyramidneighborlee, you see I am not God and i dont have the right to take away what God has given them.04:49
mfeifnot on sites; on files either local to the HD or over samba04:49
crimsunubuntu-nubiee: no sweat :)04:49
neighborleemfeif, hmm not having ati i've really no idea i'm very sorry ;(04:49
mfeifrunning totem from commandline produces no error output04:49
=== neighborlee has geforce4TI4200
mfeifdoes ubuntu not have codec support or something? I understand that you don't have the same hardware, but I don't even know if ubuntu is supposed to play video well out-of-the-box04:50
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neighborleemfeif, hmm that is odd..I guess it depends on what kind of codec is needed by what your trying to play04:50
mfeifdo you know if totem is using libxine or gstreamer underneath? (I tried several kinds of video; mpeg1,2,4, avi, wmv, etc. no dice all around04:51
HrdwrBoBmfeif: have you installed totem-xine04:51
neighborleemfeif, well depends what your playing..sofar my website stuff is working flawlessly but i've not tried other stuff yet not having the need yet04:51
neighborleemfeif, totem-xine is preferable thoug which you can install via synaptic04:51
HrdwrBoBtotem-xine is recommended04:51
mfeifso the stock totem is gstreamer based?04:51
neighborleemfeif, under your 'computer > system ' menu04:51
neighborleeHrdwrBoB, oops sorry ;=-)04:52
neighborleeoh well great minds I guess LOL04:52
HrdwrBoBwell it's not really magic :)04:52
HrdwrBoBbetter two people help than noen04:52
mfeifmy old unstable install was totem-xine. thanks; I know about synaptic04:52
mfeifyes, great minds who help; that's good04:52
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mfeifanyone know about power management under ubuntu?04:53
msassakHrdwrBoB: so deleting .gconf .gconfd .gnome .gnome2 .gnome2_private .nautilus and .metacity got it to stop04:54
neighborleemfeif, works fine04:55
neighborleemfeif, power management I mean...laptop wize I dunno I'm referring to desktop...04:55
mfeifneighborlee: cool. I haven't been able to suspend, but that's been tricky on debian/unstable, too04:55
mfeifso far I'm way impressed by ubuntu; have been a long-time debian fan, but it's been brutal making it into a decent desktop.04:56
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RuffianSoldierwhats the theme folder for IceWM?04:57
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RuffianSoldierwhats the theme folder for IceWM?04:58
crimsunRuffianSoldier: system-wide? /usr/share/icewm/themes/04:58
crimsunper-user, more than likely ~/.icewm/themes/04:58
RuffianSoldierits not that04:59
crimsuncheck the faq on www.icewm.org :)04:59
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mfeifHrdwrBoB, neighborlee ... thanks a bunch05:01
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CoolChEEzEanyone had issues with the binary ati drivers here ?05:07
HrdwrBoBwhat sort of issues?05:07
CoolChEEzEive got em installed05:07
CoolChEEzEbut i have no accel05:08
CoolChEEzEany time i try anything gl05:08
RuffianSoldierHow do i loggin as root in the GDM?????05:08
CoolChEEzEmachine just hangs05:08
CoolChEEzEeven glxinfo05:08
HrdwrBoBRuffianSoldier: by defaulkt, ubuntu uses sudo05:08
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HrdwrBoBso you login as your user05:08
HrdwrBoBthen you run 'sudo program'05:08
HrdwrBoBto run the program as root05:08
HrdwrBoBit will ask you for your password05:08
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RuffianSoldieri want to move a folder into the /usr/share/icewm/themes but it says im not aloud05:09
crimsunmoin fabbione 05:09
HrdwrBoBRuffianSoldier: run sudo cp files /usr/share/icewm/themes05:09
RuffianSoldierwhat is sudo cp filese>05:09
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bob2RuffianSoldier: do you know how to use cp?05:10
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pyramidboy there are a lot of code-theft issues flying around these days...it has made front page news today at www.newsforge.com05:13
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HrdwrBoBRuffianSoldier:  did you get that copied or not05:14
RuffianSoldierwhat do you mean?05:14
RuffianSoldiergetwhat copied?05:14
bob2HrdwrBoB: he doesn't know how to use cp.05:14
HrdwrBoBthe icewm theme you wanted installewd05:14
CoolChEEzEis there a gdesklets package ?05:15
HrdwrBoBok, probably easiest to run a terminal, and run sudo nautilus05:15
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RuffianSoldieri dont like nautilus05:15
RuffianSoldieri like konqueror05:15
aitrusis there a sound configurator in ubuntu?05:15
bob2CoolChEEzE: it's in universe.05:16
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HrdwrBoBsudo konqueror05:16
bob2aitrus: it should be automatically setup for you05:16
CoolChEEzEbob2, tnx05:16
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aitrusbob2: it didn't detect my ich6 onboard audio05:16
CoolChEEzEif i could only get me ati issue worked out.... ubuntu would be my new home :)05:16
RuffianSoldierneither mine05:16
bob2aitrus: does linux support it?05:16
aitrusbob2: intel says that alsa 1.0.5 and above supports it05:17
bob2CoolChEEzE: the Free drivers don't work at all?05:17
pyramidi sure am glad i am not programming anymore with all these code-theft issues flying around05:17
crimsunaitrus: do you have a dell laptop by any chance?05:17
CoolChEEzEbob2, yeah they work but i want hw accel05:17
CoolChEEzE2d is great05:17
aitruscrimsun: nope05:17
bob2aitrus: hrm, that's what ubuntu has...05:18
bob2aitrus: if no one else has reported it, it'd be great if you could file a bug.05:18
crimsunaitrus: ok, could you give me the relevant lspci -v line?05:18
aitrusbob2: i'm wondering if there is a patch that i need to apply to the kernel05:18
bob2aitrus: well, ubuntu has the version intel says you need...if you have to apply a patch, then it's a bug in the ubuntu kernel :)05:19
aitruscrimsun: private message it to you?05:19
RuffianSoldierme no have sound......05:19
RuffianSoldierme have onboard card05:19
aitrusbob2: i mean i wonder if i have to apply an intel-supplied patch to it05:19
RuffianSoldierbut meno have soudn05:19
crimsunaitrus: sure05:19
=== CoolChEEzE is pleased his intel wireless works :) nice work fellas...excellent laptop support btw
bob2RuffianSoldier: what card do you have?05:19
crimsunaitrus: lspci -v|grep Multimedia05:20
aitrus        Subsystem: Intel Corp.: Unknown device e40005:20
aitrus        Flags: bus master, fast devsel, latency 0, IRQ 1605:20
aitrus        Memory at febf8000 (64-bit, non-prefetchable)05:20
aitrus        Capabilities: [50]  Power Management version 205:20
aitrus        Capabilities: [60]  Message Signalled Interrupts: 64bit+ Queue=0/0 Enable-05:20
aitrus        Capabilities: [70]  #10 [0091] 05:20
aitrusi am so sorrt05:20
pyramidhmnm...grace is an interesting program but the fonts sure are small05:20
pyramidit is hard to read the menus05:20
aitruscrimsun: hmm.. interesting... there is just a "hub audio controller" and no "multimedia" device...05:21
RuffianSoldierbob2, i have onboard05:21
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bob2RuffianSoldier: you need to be a lot more specific...05:27
bob2RuffianSoldier: try asking on the ubuntu-users list, and include the output of "dmesg" and "lspci -v"05:27
RuffianSoldieri have no clue what those re05:28
pyramidwhat on earth is a gtk-qt-theme-engine..i thought those widgets competed with each other05:28
RuffianSoldierall i know is that my sound worked when i was using Libranet05:28
HrdwrBoBjust run them in a terminal05:28
HrdwrBoBand paste the output into an email05:28
bob2pyramid: you could just look at the package description...05:28
mr_tHey all, before I go getting super worried has anyone else got odd chkrootkit output?05:33
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mr_tOn 2 different Ubuntu installs, I get a whole bunch of hidden processes when gnome is running.05:33
bob2it has lots of known false-positives.05:33
pyramidbob2, sorry i did not get back with you but i had a strange power outage...it killed everything...but anyway you cannot read package descriptions ...they never give enough info.05:33
HrdwrBoBpyramid: that's a stupid reason not to read them.05:33
mr_tThanks for the link, I'll follow it from there....05:33
pyramidHrdwr_BoB, i try to read them..but they never give any relevant info...it seems you have to install them to see what they really do05:33
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ficusplanetHow would I edit the boot arguments so that acpi is off?  Do I edit grub.conf?  If so, where is that?05:34
bob2pyramid: erm, sure you can read them.  if they don't explain what the package does, it's a bug that you should file.05:35
ficusplanetDo I have to run a command after running it?05:35
crimsunficusplanet: yes, ``update-grub''05:35
pyramidbob2, well it says that gtk-qt-theme engine is a gtk-qt-theme-engine...great description05:35
RuffianSoldieri got Mac OS X working on my x8605:36
pyramidbob2, the description seems a bit tautological to me05:36
HrdwrBoBtoo me it seems self evident - it's a GTK theme egine that looks like QT05:37
bob2yeah, seems pretty clear...05:37
HrdwrBoBbut file a bug that says the description should say that05:37
HrdwrBoBif it's not obvious for you05:37
bob2if you think it's unclear, please file a bug with suggested wording05:37
pyramidHrdwr_BoB, well i would say your definition is a bit more satisfactory if in fact that is what it is.05:38
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pyramidbob2, i don't have the foggiest idea how to file bugs...i tried to file one many years ago with bugzilla at mozilla and i never could figure out how to do it..so i don't05:41
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bob2pyramid: you login.  you click "Enter a new bug report" and fill in the boxes.05:47
pyramidbob2, what i saw was an endless matrix of empty boxes...forget it05:47
bob2pyramid: it's really not that hard.05:47
bob2easy than whining on IRC, even.05:47
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Tux_RoxI have a small Ubuntu issue I can't seem to resolve. I don't get GDM loading after the system boots. I have to run startx. If I try to configure GDM, I'm told there is no such user. If I add gdm as I user I am required to give a home directory. Any advise?05:47
bob2Tux_Rox: is it a new install or an upgrade from Debian?05:47
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Tux_Roxbob2: New install, but with cavets. I have Windows and Fedora on the system. I chose to not install a bootloader, then modified FC's Grub to boot. 05:47
FX|LaptopAnyone give me a hand again. :) I know that kde isn't really supported, but I'm trying to burn an iso with k3b and the setup won't take my root password. Any ideas?05:47
pyramidbob2, i am not whining bob..i just don't care to subject myself to that kind of crap...forget it..it is not important to me...i can live with a few bugs.05:47
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bob2Tux_Rox: that shouldn't affect it.  did you modify gdm's config file or anything?05:47
HrdwrBoBpyramid: filing bugs on packages helps everyone05:47
bob2FX|Laptop: have you set a root password?05:47
aitrusFX|Laptop: i had that same issue... i just ran k3bsetup as root using sudo05:47
Tux_Roxbob2: I was going to, but without a gdm user, I'm not too sure what to change the default user to.05:47
bob2Tux_Rox: you don't need a gdm user.05:47
bob2Tux_Rox: just installing gdm will set everything up for you.05:47
FX|LaptopYea I set root's password, but I'll try that running k3b as sudo once and see what happens.05:47
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HrdwrBoBFX|Laptop: using sudo is recommended05:47
Tux_Roxok, nice to know. GDM is installed though. What in the init or X start up scripts should I modify to make GDM come up at boot? 05:48
HrdwrBoBTux_Rox: if gdm is installed and you're at a console, sudo /etc/init.d/gdm start should start GDM05:48
HrdwrBoBwhat happens if you do that?05:48
Tux_RoxHrdwrBoB, Have not tried. Once Synaptic gets done updating the system I'll try. THX!05:48
pyramidHrdwr_BoB, i try to help in other ways that i can understand somewhat...that bug stuff is far beyond me...05:49
HrdwrBoBtux:cool, if there's an error, then there's a problem with gdm, if it works, it might just be that's it's not loading gdm on boot for some reason05:49
Tux_RoxHrdwrBoB, Didn't dawn on me that GDM is a service. You'd think that RHCE diploma on my wall would count for something!!! ;-)05:50
aitrusTux_Rox: it's a service in RedHat as well...05:50
Tux_Roxaitrus, EXACTLY! Doh!05:51
HrdwrBoBperhaps redhat need to examine their curriculum :)05:51
HrdwrBoBI'll have a chat to a mate who's a redhat trainer05:51
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Tux_RoxWell, it has been 3 years since I took it and my last job was Windows XP Desktop goodness.... if you could call it that. Now that I'm in an Itanium lab, It's mostly Linux and HP-UX, thank God!!!!05:52
jewdancan someone help me remove old versions of glib?05:52
HrdwrBoBjewdan: if you've upgraded using apt or dpkg etc they should be reomved05:53
HrdwrBoBwhat exactly is the problem?05:53
Tux_RoxSo should I go for the Popularity Contest? Sounds like a cool idea.05:53
HrdwrBoBTux_Rox: ah, excellent :)05:53
jewdan*** 'glib-config --version' returned 1.2.9, but GLIB (1.2.10)05:53
jewdan*** was found! If glib-config was correct, then it is best05:53
jewdan*** to remove the old version of GLIB.05:53
Tux_RoxHrdwrBoB, Heaven on Earth!!!!05:53
HrdwrBoBhm, that's odd, what does dpkg --list|grep glib return05:54
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jewdanii  dbus-glib-1    0.22-1ubuntu1  simple interprocess messaging system (GLib-b05:55
jewdanii  libdb1-compat  2.1.3-7        The Berkeley database routines [glibc 2.0/2.05:55
jewdanii  libglib1.2     1.2.10-9       The GLib library of C routines05:55
jewdanii  libglib2.0-0   2.4.6-0ubuntu1 The GLib library of C routines05:55
jewdanii  libglib2.0-dat 2.4.6-0ubuntu1 Common files for GLib library05:55
defendguingood evening05:55
HrdwrBoByou should probably install libglib1.2-dev or libglib2.0-dev05:55
jewdanuh, how do i do that? (newbie obviously)05:56
HrdwrBoByou can use synaptic05:56
HrdwrBoBor you can run sudo apt-get install libglib1.2-dev05:56
HrdwrBoBsynaptic is probably an easier way05:57
aitrusdoes the "find toolbar" in firefox work for anyone?  mine doesn't actually go to the next instance of a word.  i have to highlight the words instead and scroll05:57
WW_aitrus: What version do you have?05:58
aitrusWW_: 0.99_1.0PR.1-005:59
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aitrusWW_: (the latest Ubunutu package)05:59
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WW_aitrus: Try this: under Edit->Preferences, select Advanced, and in the Accessibility section, check "Use Find As You Type"06:02
burneror just use "/"06:02
aitrusthat works06:03
CoolChEEzEanything special on configuring the g-desklets package... normal things seem not to work for me06:03
CoolChEEzEwell i dunno why06:04
CoolChEEzEthats why i asked06:04
bob2CoolChEEzE: run it and start up the applets06:05
CoolChEEzEbob2, yeah.. i tried that06:05
bob2CoolChEEzE: and?06:05
bob2aitrus: f3 goes to the next match for me06:05
CoolChEEzEcannot add display06:05
CoolChEEzEthe file does not exist06:05
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bob2that's the error you get?06:05
CoolChEEzEbob2, yeah06:05
bob2CoolChEEzE: from nautilus or gdesklets?06:06
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CoolChEEzE'the display could not be added because the file does not exist'06:06
bob2how about if you do it manually?06:07
elmayagdesklets name.display06:07
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CoolChEEzEbob2, that is manually06:07
CoolChEEzEfrom the console06:07
bob2CoolChEEzE: sure you're giving the correct path?06:09
bob2(have you used gdesklets on other distros?)06:09
CoolChEEzEbob2, no06:09
CoolChEEzEi just read the man page... and a how206:09
CoolChEEzEi was a gkrellm kinda guy06:09
CoolChEEzEwanted to try out gdesklets06:09
CoolChEEzEim fairly new to gnome as well... i been a E user for like 5 years06:10
CoolChEEzE^^ or more06:10
jewdanhow do i use synaptic to install libraries i have in tar form? can i?06:11
bob2jewdan: no06:11
jewdanok. thanks06:11
bob2jewdan: what libraries are you after?06:11
CoolChEEzEbob2, nm .. i got it... im a fool06:11
jewdanbob2, glib06:12
HrdwrBoBjewdan: is this a new install of a system?06:13
bob2jewdan: glib is in Ubuntu,06:13
bob2CoolChEEzE: ah, cool06:13
jewdannot the latest version. im installing something else that needs it06:13
HrdwrBoBok hangon, better idea, jewdan what do you want to install that needs glib06:13
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bob2jewdan: what are you installing?06:14
fabbionemorning guys06:15
jewdanwell, the eventual goal is to get g3torrent working but it requires other stuff. i needed to get wxpython which needs this stuff i think06:15
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bob2wxpython is in ubuntu already06:15
bob2you don't need to build that.06:15
jewdanit said i dont have it06:15
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bob2have you told synaptic to use universe?06:16
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HrdwrBoBok time for ubuntu on this box, back later06:16
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aitrusi think i read a thread about his somewhere else... but... is there a way to make nautilus not open a new window every freaking time??06:17
Tux_RoxOK, Resolved GDM. On to the next issue..... Project Utopia..... /proc/scsi/scsi sees the MediaBay 7 in 4, and when I plug in a usb flash drive, it shows up as well, but not in Naultilus. Anyone know why that might be?06:18
jewdandoes this refer to x86?06:18
jewdan*** X libraries or include files not found. Check 'config.log' for06:18
jewdan*** more details.06:18
bob2google for "disable spatial nautilus", first hit is the answer06:18
bob2jewdan: what are yuo building now?06:18
jewdanexcept i just noticed there is 1.2.1006:19
adaptbob2, its now in the computer -> desktop prefs -> file managment06:19
pyramidaitrus, yes that is the worst design i have ever seen...it splatters windows all over the desktop when you just go 7levels deep....i don't know why they ever went to a spatial mode06:20
adaptbehavior tab06:20
bob2adapt: oh, I didn't know there was a visible option, thanks.06:20
jalili just installed ubuntu and i like it a lot but i cant seem to get the my cdrom to work.    can anyone point me to a place where  i can get help?06:20
bob2jewdan: why are you building gtk+?  it's in Ubuntu already.06:20
pyramidaitrus, but anyway it is easy to turn it off06:20
aitruspyramid: yeah, and it seems that "less configurable through the menus" is their direction06:21
jewdanok. i have a g3torrent.py file. how do i install it?06:21
asdf_46Has anyone had sucess in using the lockdown stuff in gnome?06:21
pyramidaitrus, well i will tell you what i was told...go to file preferences and click the 3rd box06:21
crimsunjewdan: you can simply run it if you wish.06:21
jewdanhow? i cant06:21
adaptjewdan, `./g3torrent.py`06:21
crimsunjewdan: /usr/bin/env python g3torrent.py06:21
jewdanif this works im going to have to shoot myself06:21
jewdanTraceback (most recent call last):06:23
jewdan  File "g3torrent.py", line 19, in ?06:23
jewdan    import wx06:23
jewdanImportError: No module named wx06:23
jewdanthis is why i started to build all that stuff06:23
aitruspyramid: hmm... i liked that tight layout though... man, decisions decisions...06:23
pyramidaitrus, go to desktop preferences, file management, behavior and the browse in windows box06:23
bob2jewdan: no, you need to install wxwindows06:24
pyramidaitrus, no that spatial mode is absolutely worthless...try builing something like glom where you directories are many layers deep and you need to view things...windows are splattered everywhere06:24
jewdanjust google it?06:24
bob2jewdan: libwxgtk2.4-python - wxWindows Cross-platform C++ GUI toolkit (wxPython binding)06:24
defendguinjdub, you around?06:25
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pyramidaitrus, anyway try those settings i gave you...it seems to have worked for me.06:27
jewdanbob2, can you explain what you mean?06:27
aitruspyramid: yeah, that disables the multi-windows stuff... but i'm not sure i like the browser-window layout06:27
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bob2jewdan: install that package06:28
pyramidaitrus, well it solved my problem anyway.06:28
bob2defendguin: he'll be around later.06:28
jewdando i have to download it or is it already somewhere?06:28
defendguinits ok06:28
defendguinwe were having a bit of a spam situation in #gnome on irc.gimp.net and we needed an op06:29
bob2jewdan: install it with synaptic or aptitutde or whatever you normally use06:29
defendguinthey have it under control now i hope06:29
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ionrockhello, does anyone have any good documents for creating a initrd.img for a kernel I just compiled for ubuntu? I am trying to get apm or acpi support06:31
Treenaksboth are in the default kernel06:31
Treenaksso you don't need to compile06:31
bob2if you're building your own kernel, it's generally easiest to just not use initrd at all.06:31
ionrockif that is the case then how do I enable them or configure them?06:32
ionrockI saw apmd but it says it is not compiled in the kernel06:32
Treenaksionrock: it's a module..06:32
Treenaksionrock: everything's a module, and loaded automagically06:32
bob2if not, load it manuallly, "modprobe apm".06:33
Treenaksand "echo apm >> /etc/modules" (that's 2 ">" signs!)06:33
ionrockTreenaks, so I guess my question then is how can I get my battery applet to work correctly ;)06:33
Treenaksionrock: how old is your laptop?06:34
ionrockpretty old, it is from 2000 I think06:34
ionrocka dell inspiron 500006:34
Treenaksyou should pass "acpi=force" on the kernel command line06:34
ionrockI was able to get it "hibernate" with win2k 06:34
ionrockI would do that in grub right?06:35
Treenaksyou can do that by adding that at the end of the "# kopt=" line in /boot/grub/menu.lst06:35
Treenaksionrock: dmesg | grep too\ old should tell you if acpi is disabled06:35
Treenaksionrock: after editing menu.lst, run update-grub and reboot06:35
asdf_46I am supprised it doesn't just work, On the 5100 it is like magic. The batt applet anyway.06:36
Treenaksasdf_46: it just works, but ACPI disables itself on old hardware, because there is a lot of old hardware with ACPI bugs06:37
asdf_46Treenaks, is that why descent support is always lagging, buggy hardware that is?06:37
bob2does any hardware actually implement ACPI properly?06:37
Tux_RoxSo, volume control applet does not see an audio device. It seems that all the drivers are loaded, so I'm stumped......06:38
Treenaksasdf_46: current hardware is mostly OK06:38
Treenaksbob2: my laptop doesn't have any errors in its acpi tables, and everything works fine (ACPI 1.0 though)06:38
pyramidionrock, well win2k costs a small fortune so why complain because you don't get as much with free software....at least you get some things06:38
asdf_46but I do miss the viruses...06:39
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ionrockoh, i just meant that it worked... and I have seen more than enough proof that it works well with linux so I was just making it clear that it was possible "physically"06:40
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=== ionrock can't always handle the software side of life ;)
bob2Treenaks: suspend even?06:40
ionrockTreenaks, won't update-grub though rewrite my grub file? 06:41
pyramidionrock, well anything is possible if you want to dig for it...but your time may cost you more than paying someone else like MS to do it for you...anyway...since this stuff is all free people should stop complaining06:41
asdf_46Wasn't there a place you could fill out a survey of how ubutu works.06:41
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ionrockpyramid, I totally agree... no complaints here. I like the fonts way better anyways than on win2k06:41
pyramidionrock, yes that is the spirit...just let go of earthly things...so what if you don't have a zillion features like MS...who cares ...who uses them...and why pay for what you don't need.06:42
defendguindo you have to do anything after turning on dma? or it will just use dma from there on out?06:43
crimsunvia hdparm? it's immediat.06:44
defendguingood deal06:44
danielspyramid: please continue this conversation in #offtopic06:45
jewdani still can install a .deb file06:46
ionrockthis may be a bit dumb, but when adding the acpi=force to the kernel options in my menu.lst, what is the format with regard to spaces and things06:46
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ionrockI already have root=/dev/hda1 ro 06:47
SuperL4gtseng: I hosed my main Gentoo install today, with depclean. :/06:48
florinhow can I found gnome-mime-types-files for configuration06:48
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Tux_RoxNeed a hang with udev and also audio. neither are working.... :-(06:49
Tux_RoxNeed a hand with udev and also audio. neither are working.... :-(06:50
aitrusionrock: ...ro quiet splash acpi=force06:50
bob2Tux_Rox: how is udev "not working"?06:50
WW_jewdan: Did you mean to say that you _can't_ install a .deb file?06:51
jewdanyeah my bad06:52
LeeColletonwhat is the recommended method for burning iso-9660 cd images with ubuntu?06:52
ionrockaitrus,  thanks06:52
Tux_Roxbob2: not sure that it is udev, hal or d-bus, but I have a 7 in 4 Media card reader and a USB disk, and neither are showing up in Nautilus when pluged in, yet I see them in /proc/scsi/scsi.......06:52
pyramiddaniels, he has a few problems and i am telling him who cares if this stuff is mostly crap and doesn't work..he did not pay for it anyway06:52
bob2jewdan: synaptic didn't work?06:52
jewdani dont know how to get the file in that program06:52
WW_jewdan: Do you have the universe component enabled?  (More basic: do you know what the universe component is?)06:53
defendguinhey do you think we could fix it so when i plug in my flash drive instead of bing called sda1 it could be called "flash"06:53
danielspyramid: your conversation on 'let go of earthly things' et al is very much off-topic for #ubuntu.  also, politeness when dealing with others is appreciated.06:53
jewdanww: no :(06:53
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pyramiddaniels, i am being polite...i did not degrade him...i am enlightening him to make use of whatever crap he can find for free as best as he can instead of complaining that it doesn't work as well as MS software06:54
WW_jewdan: First, here's a quick read: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/ubuntu/components/document_view06:54
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jewdanok, thanks for your help. going to bed for now.06:55
jewdanill continue work in the morning06:56
ionrockpyramid, just to be clear, I wasn't complaining. I have found that with a little effort linux has offered many more features that I can use. Ubuntu has done a great job at making it easy to configure and use while keeping the power of debian that I like. For this reason I would not call ubuntu crap or any other distro I have tried06:57
RuffianSoldierMine Linux is ien funterbox ist is so fun to use!06:58
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Anesgot a question for you guys. i have to use expert mode on the installer to disable the extra IDE kernel modules, else it hangs06:58
Anesis there any way to disable the non-generic IDE modules in simple mode?06:59
florinanHi, How can I found gnome-mime-types in order to configure ?06:59
RuffianSoldierIDE has been replaced with HNE, it looks likefirewire, but for the inside of your case06:59
Anesit's an IDE system.07:00
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WW_LeeColleton: nautilus worked for me.  Right-click, select "Write to Disc"07:02
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bob2jewdan: libwxgtk2.4-python, install it.07:03
SuperL4gCan you run concurrent apt-get's?07:04
SuperL4gor is that bad, just like it is with Gentoo's emerge? :)07:04
Anesok, i'll ask again. i'm trying to install, and would prefer the simple 'linux' install to the 'expert' kernel07:05
Anesbut one of the extra IDE modules that get loaded makes my system hang after detection.07:05
Anesso is there some option to pass to the 'linux' kernel to ignore the extra IDE modules?07:05
LeeColletonWW_: My firewire cdrom will crash nautilus and 'cdrecord -scanbus' doesn't show it.  This is weird because it worked with the debian version of cdrecord07:07
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WW_LeeColleton: Ah, well for help with that, keep poking the experts.  And file a bug report!07:09
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WW_LeeColleton: Well then, keep poking yourself until it works  :-)07:15
SuperLagIs there a way to pass your essid/wep info to your wireless interface before it starts, so you don't have to do it manually every time?07:15
bob2you can set it in /etc/network/interfaces07:16
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WW_SuperLag: See also question 5: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/FrequentlyAskedQuestions07:18
SuperLagWW_: _excellent_, thank you07:21
SuperLagWW_: are you one of the Ubuntu devs?07:22
WW_SuperLag: Not even close!07:23
neuro_"Need to get 97.1MB/394MB of archives. After unpacking 1218MB will be used."07:24
neuro_Wheeee! :)07:24
calcneuro_: hi :)07:25
WW_SuperLag: I've just been hanging out here while I work out the bugs in my new ubuntu system. 07:25
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neuro_calc: i'm not *that* neuro, in case you're wondering07:25
calcah ok07:25
neuro_ryan blagged that nick before I did, even though I think we've both been using the same online moniker for about the same length of time (~ 10 years)07:26
neuro_and he got quite snotty about my using neuro_ i must say!07:26
SuperLaghas IRC been around for that long?07:26
=== SuperLag has only been using IRC for 4 - 5 years...
neuro_SuperLag: being online and calling yourself "neuro" doesn't necessarily equate to irc :)07:26
calcSuperLag: for about 15-16 years now07:27
neuro_i.e. email, talkers, shell accounts, etc07:27
calci used irc for ~ 10 years now07:27
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neuro_talkers were more fun :)07:27
TheMonoToneI wish bugzilla were a little easier and quicker to report bugs to...07:31
TheMonoToneseems like I have to go through loops07:31
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neuro_mmm, debbugs07:33
WW_TheMonoTone: File a bug about it :-)07:34
WW_TheMonoTone: (seriously!)07:34
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ionrockI tried booting with acpi=force and I think there is an error loading the acpi module07:38
ionrockI did dmesg | grep acpi and I get a few linesthat don't make a lot of sense and then I get two lines that mention an unknown symbol. any ideas where to start tracking down the issue?07:39
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stratkingok folks, any willing to help me out w/ another wireless problem?07:45
stratkingi had an orinoco gold card that for whatever reason ubuntu wasn't detecting07:45
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stratkingso i tried it in knoppix and it still didn't work07:45
stratkingi then borrowed my friends netgear ma401 which has worked w/ most distros we've tried07:46
stratkingi threw it in the machine and the link light turns on which the orinoco never did07:46
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stratkingbut still nothing, iwconfig doesn't show anything and cardinfo comes up w/ unsupported card07:46
stratkingi figured what the hell and booted knoppix and cardinfo detected the card just fine and it automatically connected me to my network07:47
stratkinganyone have any idea what might be going on?07:47
mwilsonOther than Ubunto isn't Knoppix?07:49
SuperLagmwilson: pfft :)07:49
SuperLagmwilson: you lurker, you :)07:49
SuperLagstratking: what card is it?07:49
SuperLagmwilson: how goes it?07:49
stratkingyeah, i was just testing it to make sure it wasn't the card or something07:49
stratkingits the netgear ma40107:50
mwilsonSuperLag: <shrug> Just watching.07:50
ionrockI think I got the acpi issue for anyone that had helped... let you know in one sec07:51
smeggyAnyone know how I can connect to the X server in ubuntu remotely?07:52
HrdwrBoBsmeggy: you have to change the gdm options07:52
HrdwrBoBto allow remote connection07:52
smeggyI have installed OpenSSH, but when I try and connect It tells me "X: User not authorized to run X server, aborting."07:52
smeggygdm didnt think of that07:52
smeggyhow? :D07:53
HrdwrBoBhangon, what exactly are you trying to do?07:54
mwilsonHint... he's NOT trying to get a remote chooser.07:54
smeggyI want to run a remote X session from my Mac OSX box...07:55
smeggyI've done it before with other distros...07:55
smeggyI usually just do "ssh -l user host -X"07:55
smeggythen startx07:55
HrdwrBoBssh -X enables X forwarding, startx starts the X server itself07:56
HrdwrBoBif you're connected via ssh and X forwarding is enabled, you should be able to simply run applications from there07:56
smeggyBut I get "X: User not authorized to run the X server, aborting."07:56
mwilsonI think he means he connects to a remote and enables forwarding, then starts the local X server.07:57
HrdwrBoBsmeggy: try 'gnome-session'07:57
smeggyI'm running an xserver locally, the remote box is ubuntu..07:57
mwilsonThen why would you use startx?07:57
smeggySame thing..07:57
smeggyI pasted it in the wrong order07:57
HrdwrBoBstartx tries to start an X server - you're already running one locally, you don't need to use startx to start one on the ubuntu box07:57
smeggyI mean I startx on the local box...07:58
smeggyI was asking the question elsewhere before.07:58
smeggySorry :)07:58
mwilsonsmeggy: Then you ARE doing what I described, so why did you disagree?07:58
smeggySorry, it's been a long day..07:58
smeggyHeres what I'm doing: starting local x server, establishing ssh connection to remote ubuntu box, attempting to run an X app. I get ""X: User not authorized to run the X server, aborting.""07:59
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HrdwrBoBsmeggy: even something like 'xterm'07:59
smeggyYes HrdwrBoB07:59
Lotmrhow would I re-run the x config tool08:00
mwilsonSounds more like forwarding is off.08:00
Lotmri messed up my x in a attempt for dual montiors08:00
smeggyForwarding is on in /etc/ssh/sshd_config08:00
HrdwrBoBLotmr: dpkg-reconfigure xfree860-xserver08:00
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HrdwrBoBLotmr: dpkg-reconfigure xfree86-xserver08:00
Lotmrokay thanks08:00
fabbionedpkg-reconfigure xserver-xfree8608:00
HrdwrBoByeah.. what he said08:01
HrdwrBoBno, wrt reconfig X08:01
HrdwrBoBsmeggy: running xterm should not start X08:01
Lotmrcommand not found08:01
Lotmror so it says08:01
HrdwrBoBLotmr: you will have to prefix that with 'sudo'08:02
HrdwrBoBso it runs as root08:02
RuffianSoldierhas anyone used a USB Compactflash card reader in linux?????08:02
smeggyThe local box is Mac OSX..08:02
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HrdwrBoBRuffianSoldier: yes08:02
Lotmri missed an r08:02
mwilsonI suppose Ubunto could be so messed up that launching an X client would try to start a local X server.  RedHat used to do that once upon a time.08:02
HrdwrBoBmwilson: it's not08:02
RuffianSoldierHrdwrBoB, im not tlaking about a pocket USB drive, i mean a reader that you put your CompactFlash card08:03
HrdwrBoBRuffianSoldier: I know exactly what you are talking about.08:03
RuffianSoldierHrdwrBoB, is it a hard task to get working???08:03
HrdwrBoBand yes, I have08:03
HrdwrBoBno, it's trivual08:03
RuffianSoldierHow tribial08:03
HrdwrBoBjsut FYI, a pocket USB drive and a CF reader work in exactly the same way08:04
RuffianSoldierthen i have hope08:04
calci'm going to give the amd64 netinstall iso a try, maybe the kernel change last week fixed the problem for me08:04
Lotmrim still getting a no screen error08:05
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Lotmrtrying to start x08:05
HrdwrBoBLotmr: past the output of X in #flood08:06
HrdwrBoBalso, paste08:06
RuffianSoldierhow small is damn small linux?08:07
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bestadvocate_about 50 megs08:09
bestadvocate_and i believe it all loads directly into ram08:09
bestadvocate_am i offline?08:10
neuro_if you are, then we must all be connected to your LAN :)08:11
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Lotmrafter  i fiddled with xconf a bit more i got xback working08:11
Lotmris there easy way to setup 2 montiors on linux08:12
Lotmra tool of somesort08:12
HrdwrBoBLotmr: unfortunately not yet08:12
HrdwrBoBbut I can help you08:12
HrdwrBoBI've done it several ways08:12
Lotmrwell crapshait08:12
bestadvocate_:]  im getting my connection in odd waves08:12
Lotmrlemme switch back to the other comp now that i got x back up08:12
DarkniteI am having a hard time getting remote computers to connect to my ubuntu box's printers08:13
Darkniteany ideas08:13
Darknitebtw I am using cups on them08:13
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mwilsonDefine "hard time".08:13
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Lotmrok back08:13
Lotmrso where do i start08:14
Darknitemwilson, can not get it to work08:14
bestadvocate_say i was trying to get libdvdcss on this system, do you have to get another debian server to get a dvd player from apt-get?08:14
mwilson<shrug> Does Ubuntu broadcast its printers?  I know it doesn't accept broadcasts.08:14
HrdwrBoBbestadvocate_: http://hpisi.nerim.net/ your legality may vary08:14
HrdwrBoBuse debian testing as the source08:14
LotmrHrdwrBoB quick note08:15
Lotmrat this time my other monitor is wiggin out08:15
Lotmrso i turned off the screen08:15
mwilsonDarknite: So you didn't look?08:15
Lotmrbecause what its doing not cant be healthy08:15
Darkniteno I looked at the conf file and it looks like it broadcasts08:16
HrdwrBoBLotmr: how so?08:16
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Lotmrjust the frequecy08:16
Lotmrits flashing red and orage08:16
Lotmrwith splotches of diffrent colors in it08:16
mwilsonDebian's CUPS package doesn't broadcast, so I imagine Ubuntu's doesn't either.08:16
Lotmrand when it flashes lines appear08:17
HrdwrBoBok, what video ard(s) ar eyou using08:17
Lotmra GeForce 4 420008:17
Lotmrwith a dvi adapter for 1 mon08:17
HrdwrBoBare you using the nvidia binary drivers from restricted?08:17
Lotmrer...i would assume no08:17
Darknitedoes ubuntu have a firewall enabled by default08:17
Lotmr30 min ago this wasnt installed on here08:18
Lotmrthis is my XP machine08:18
t35t0riptables is the firewall08:18
HrdwrBoBDarknite: no, it's not required, because there are no open ports08:18
bestadvocate_thands HrdwrBoB, legality seems to be a less important issue now that ive stoped stealing windows copies :] 08:18
t35t0riptables --flush08:18
Lotmri installed linux to develop in Mono08:18
HrdwrBoBbestadvocate_:  :)08:18
Lotmri have a true debian webserver though08:18
Lotmrso Hrdwr where do i start?08:19
mwilsonDarknite: Well, that answers your question about whether or not it broadcasts.08:19
HrdwrBoBLotmr: ok, start synaptic and grab nvidia-glx08:19
HrdwrBoBfrom restricted08:19
HrdwrBoByou'll also need linux-restricted-modules08:19
Lotmrhow do i start synaptic08:19
Lotmri usually use command line08:19
Darknitehow can i make it accept print requests08:19
Lotmrapt-get install x08:19
HrdwrBoBoh, well then edit /etc/apt/sources.list08:20
HrdwrBoBmake sure restricted is in there08:20
HrdwrBoBand apt-get the packages08:20
mwilsonDarknite: Alter the configuration, restart the daemon.08:20
Lotmryeah unstable is in there08:20
Darknitestill can not seem to get it to work or atleast the port is not showing up when i nmap the box08:21
mwilsonDarknite: Yes, I believe he said that.08:21
Lotmrok glx is installing08:21
Darknitedid I miss something I did not hear anyone say anything but tell me that iptables was not enabled08:22
LotmrE: Couldn't find package linux-restricted-modules08:22
bestadvocate_distrowatch posted a good article on how to go through this process, this is the first system i ever go my Nvidia's to work on thanks to it,08:22
mwilsonDarknite: He told you there were no open ports.  Thus, CUPS is not listening.08:22
Darknitethere just got the port to show up08:23
HrdwrBoBLotmr: I think you'll need linux-restricted-modules-
HrdwrBoBapt-cache should show you what's available08:23
Lotmr-E: Couldn't find package linux-restricted-modules-
=== |trey| thinks firestarter should be installed by default... if all ports will be closed by default, users should be able to open them easily, thats one fairly easy tool to grasp :)
mwilsonHow would firestarter open anything?  If you want an open port, run a daemon on it.08:24
HrdwrBoBLotmr: give me a second08:24
mwilsonIt's not that iptables is doing all this restricting, there simply are no listeners.08:25
|trey|mwilson: afaik, by default, all incoming requests are denied... sorry if this is wrong?08:25
bestadvocate_right about here: http://www.osnews.com/story.php?news_id=8407&page=408:25
ionrockI have to say that ubuntu's default theme is is really nice. I haven't even thought about changing it. kudos to ubuntu and back to more important technical disscussion ;)08:25
Lotmrhey hrdwr you mean linux-restricted-modules- - Non-free Linux modules on 38608:25
|trey|mwilson: ahh, my mistake then08:26
HrdwrBoBthat's correct08:26
HrdwrBoBI just fount it :)08:26
|trey|blah, firestarter is still a nice tool for a desktop distro to include though  :)08:26
Lotmrok hrdwr are yiu on here often?08:26
Lotmri gotta go to sleep or else school will be hell for me tomorrow08:26
mwilsonfirestarter is serious overkill for Joe Sixpack.08:27
Lotmrim going to let this download overnight08:27
Lotmrmeet you here tomorrow 4:30 PST08:27
HrdwrBoBGMT what08:27
HrdwrBoBI don't know all the timezones on earth, give it to me in GMT :)08:27
HrdwrBoBI am in GMT-1008:27
mwilsonHell, even firehol is overkill for Joe Sixpack.08:27
HrdwrBoBit's currently 4:27pm08:27
|trey|mwilson: hmmm, I thought it was about as basic as it could be while still being useful... 08:28
RuffianSoldierits 2:27 where i live08:28
HrdwrBoB|trey|: apart from being entirely pointless08:28
|trey|Fedora's Firewall tool for instance is kinda useless imo...08:28
|trey|HrdwrBoB: ?08:28
HrdwrBoBall a firewall tool will do is confuse people and stop them from doing things they want to08:28
mwilsonThat goes along with Fedora being kinda useless.08:28
RuffianSoldierITs 11:28 Pacific time right now HrdwrBoB08:28
|trey|mwilson: never tried firehol?08:28
HrdwrBoBif you want a firewall tool, install one08:28
HrdwrBoBLotmr: ok, it's highly likely I will be here :)08:29
|trey|mwilson: bah... its hardly different from Ubuntu  :/08:29
HrdwrBoBRuffianSoldier: thank you08:29
mwilson|trey|: Uh, *I* was the one who mentioned firehol, so obviously I've "tried" it.08:29
Lotmroh well08:29
Lotmrokay cya hrdwr08:29
mwilson|trey|: I'm not running Ubuntu, either.08:29
HrdwrBoBhardly different?08:29
HrdwrBoBhave you ever used fedora?08:30
|trey|mwilson: bad wording... meant "never tried firehol, whats it like" hence the question mark... sorry...08:30
mwilsonHe said it, not me.08:30
pyramidmwilson, what are you running?08:30
pyramidmwilson, if you are not running ubuntu.08:30
|trey|HrdwrBoB: yes I have used it... FC3 is also GNOME 2.8, also kernel 2.6.8... whats so different?08:31
HrdwrBoBthe entire design and philosphy?08:31
|trey|Other then visually, and package handling, they are not different...08:31
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HrdwrBoB.. and the aqueducts08:32
|trey|HrdwrBoB: huh?08:32
|trey|Todd_MA_1975: don't use IRC as root08:32
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|trey|mwilson: you should check out Ubuntu... quite fast... and very logical (albeit kinda bloated compared to how your system probably is)08:34
pyramidi can't get over how all this stuff is such pure garbage...full of bugs...no wonder it is free.08:34
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mwilson|trey|: Did I say I hadn't "checked it out"?  And please don't make determinations about my own systems.08:35
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pyramidno one in their right mind would pay one dime for this kind of garbage08:35
|trey|mwilson: I know you use OpenBox etc... much smaller then GNOME  :/08:35
pyramidno wonder everyone wants MS08:36
|trey|pyramid: many people would... let me remind you you are using a beta software... its not even released yet.08:36
HrdwrBoBpyramid: take your trolling garbage elsewhere08:36
SuperLagpyramid: wow.  such an exceptionally bold troll08:37
SuperLagbe gone08:37
mwilsonMan, I've had him on ignore all day... what am I missing?08:37
pyramidHrdwr_BoB, i will be glad to leave..you demons deserve your own fate.08:37
Se7hopenbox ?08:37
HrdwrBoBnow leave us to be demons08:37
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mwilsonSe7h: A window manager.08:37
|trey|mwilson: nothing, he thinks beta products should be perfect or something...08:37
Se7hbut...is it good?08:37
mwilsonDefine "good".08:38
|trey|Se7h: ever used Flux/blackbox? kinda simular...08:38
mwilsonActually, quite dissimilar, other than that they all manage windows.08:38
|trey|mwilson: eh... nitpickiness is lame... for all intensive purposes, to look at each, most couldn't tell the difference...08:39
aj(intents and purposes)08:40
mwilson|trey|: Most couldn't tell the difference between metacity and blackbox, either.  Does that make them the same?08:40
|trey|Actually, I think OpenBox started using GTK? if thats true, it might be vastly different today... last I used it though, I had to look for differences...08:40
mwilsonUh, no, openbox has never used any toolkit.08:40
neuro_ooh, ubuntu just made a lovely login noise at me08:40
neuro_(first time i've installed it on a machine with sound :)08:40
|trey|mwilson: my bad then, coulda sworn someone said it was going to gtk  :/08:41
mwilson<sigh> I did not start this discussion, I am no longer participating in this discussion.08:41
|trey|mwilson: all you had to say was '|trey|: shut up, thanks'... I am pretty good at following instuction  :)08:42
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smeggy|trey|, dance! :D08:42
Se7hneuro_ lolol08:42
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Se7hubuntu rokx08:42
|trey|smeggy: already was  :o08:42
|trey|well, kinda  :/08:43
mwilsonBy the time I got done peeling all the annoyances out of Ubuntu, there'd be no point in using it.  It's like the people I've seen in here today asking how to install KDE on it.  If that's what you want, why are you using it in the first place...08:45
smeggyUbuntu is perfect for me :)08:45
HrdwrBoBthis is somewhat tru08:45
HrdwrBoBat least until hoary08:45
HrdwrBoBwhen KDE moves into supported08:45
mwilsonThat's too bad... so what makes it different will die out.08:46
|trey|HrdwrBoB: Answer me this, why would you want a distro that is filled with leading people from GNOME working on KDE?08:46
mwilsonConsidering KDE's market share, I'm surprised.08:47
|trey|Makes no sense... would be like Kalyxo working on GNOME  :/08:47
HrdwrBoB|trey|: answer me this, why would you not want to support the other major desktop environment08:47
HrdwrBoBI didn't say working on08:47
HrdwrBoBI said supported08:47
smeggyWhich has a larger user base KDE or GNOME?08:47
|trey|HrdwrBoB: Because choice confuses morons08:47
Se7hhmm, i im reading something here about iDesk being good for openbox for ie08:47
Se7hgiving the desktop some icons08:47
HrdwrBoB|trey|: they don't get a choice unless they specifically install kde08:47
HrdwrBoBand reconfigure things to use it08:47
|trey|Then whats the point even including it?08:48
mwilsonI thought one of the reasons for Ubuntu's existence was as a Gnome mouthpiece?08:48
|trey|I say stick to what you do best, users of Ubuntu shouldn't be wanting KDE, its a GNOME distro...08:48
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mwilsonGods know Gnome could certainly use one.08:48
smeggyWhich has a larger user base KDE or GNOME? Anyone know?08:48
HrdwrBoBsmeggy: afaik, GNOME08:48
|trey|smeggy: in corporations, GNOME, at home, KDE08:49
HrdwrBoBKDE is... dwindling08:49
mwilsonKDE does.08:49
Todd_MA_1975Question:  I noticed that ndiswrapper just got added into the package tree.  From a new install will I be able to install this ndiswrapper (let it figure out the kernel source/headers dependencies)?  Then just be able to do a ndiswrapper -i xxxxxxx.inf, modprobe ndiswrapper, etc...?08:49
smeggyInteresting... I would have guessed different, HrdwrBoB..08:49
_ranman_Why would you follow who has a larger user base?08:49
mwilsonLook at what the distributions are doing.08:49
HrdwrBoBGNOME makes a lot more sense than KDE now08:49
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|trey|mwilson: corporations aren't using KDE though...08:49
smeggyI'm not following, I'm just wondering.08:49
_ranman_Seems gnome to me is more for the office..08:49
HrdwrBoBnot really08:49
mwilson|trey|: Corporations aren't significantly using Linux, either.08:49
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|trey|mwilson: true also..08:50
_ranman_I find that mutimedia, works better in KDE..08:50
HrdwrBoBI use gnome everywhere, but sysadmins != users08:50
smeggyI'm pretty DE agnostic really.08:50
hazmatlets try it another way, what do the majority of the major distros ship with08:50
_ranman_It is more a matter of opinion, and choice..08:50
smeggyI'm equally at home in either.  Though I prefer Gnome/GTKs look.08:50
|trey|GNOME has better support today though, this is the primary reasoning it being more popular in corporations...08:50
mwilsonhazmat: KDE08:50
hazmatmandrake, lindows, suse, connectiva -> kde08:50
HrdwrBoB|trey|: it's also a lot more logical08:50
HrdwrBoBand wholistic08:50
|trey|mwilson: umm... Mandrake is the only distro you can consider as major that ships KDE...08:51
smeggySuse is pretty major...08:51
hazmatis redhat the only major distro that ships gnome?08:51
hazmater. as default08:51
|trey|HrdwrBoB: That is debateable, but lets not start a flame war  :)08:51
mwilsonGnome spent too much time on technical excellence and got passed by the touchy-feely morons.  Maybe they can get that back, maybe they can't.08:51
|trey|smeggy: SUSE is as good as dead, Novell Linux Desktop uses GNOME...08:51
smeggyI guess..08:52
|trey|s/uses/defaults to/08:52
mwilsonhang out in user fora... all the questions are KDE-this, and KDE-that.08:52
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mwilsonSo Ubuntu giving up its major point-of-difference seems like a bad idea.08:53
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hazmatthe ubuntu user mailing list has an insane amount of traffic08:54
mwilsonhazmat: It's new, the clueless are still swarming over it.08:54
|trey|mwilson: that I agree... wouldn't feel right if KDE were shipped in Ubuntu's main  :/08:54
=== |trey| even thinks Fedora ought to include KDE only in "Extras" :/
opi^work|trey|: but users are the one who should select what's good for them08:55
opi^work|trey|: you dislike KDE? fine. Others don't.08:55
mwilsonopi^work: Not hardly.08:55
Todd_MA_1975Can anybody help with ndiswrapper questions?08:55
|trey|opi^work: but a user that wants KDE shouldn't even be considering Ubuntu08:56
hazmatopi^work, agreed08:56
|trey|opi^work: no actually, its my prefered DE...08:56
opi^workbut we should provide that option08:56
|trey|I wouldn't want to install it on Ubuntu though08:56
hazmatthey appeal to different people.. playing desktop wars isn't productive.. 08:56
opi^workhazmat: true08:56
mwilsonUsers don't get to make decisions like that.08:56
|trey|Ubuntu is a GNOME distro, losing that means losing Ubuntu's image imo08:56
opi^workI don't fight about distros, I kinda dislike bitching on others :)08:57
deFryskexept for mandrake ?08:57
_ranman_trey, what is the meaning of Ubunu?08:57
opi^workUbuntu's GNOME distro? Fine :)08:57
cybernoutso how do i manually install deb packages?08:57
deFryskdpkg -i08:57
opi^work_ranman_: good point :D08:58
HrdwrBoBcybernout: you can use dpkg -i, however you shouldn't need to08:58
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cybernoutyou mean all packages are there?08:58
HrdwrBoBlots are installed by default08:59
HrdwrBoBonce the system is installed08:59
HrdwrBoByou can run the synaptic package manager to install new packages08:59
cybernoutok, :)08:59
_ranman_Just don't ask for KDE... haha08:59
mwilsonDoes Ubuntu ship aptitude as well, or just synaptic?08:59
|trey|_ranman_: "a person is a person through other people" this describes a community, the communities Ubuntu is a part of is Debian and GNOME.08:59
|trey|mwilson: both09:00
opi^workit's time for mug of coffee09:00
opi^workand some work :/09:00
mwilsonWow... that's too bad.09:00
neuro_it's always time for a mug of coffee09:00
|trey|mwilson: how come?09:00
opi^workneuro_: or two ;)09:00
_ranman_haha.. trey, took awhile to come up with a good answer..09:00
|trey|_ranman_: wanted to quote the site  :/09:00
mwilsonaptitude being broken, especially compared to synaptic09:01
|trey|mwilson: at no point does it ever make you use aptitude though..09:01
mwilsonUsers'll love that the first time they mix the two.09:01
opi^workI just stick with apt-get ;)09:01
|trey|its just that tasksel depends it, thus so does the installer...09:01
cybernouthow do i install the flashplug-in?09:01
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mwilson|trey|: synaptic is certainly nothing special, but aptitude has fundamental problems.09:02
|trey|cybernout: add 'deb http://ftp.debian.org/debian sid contrib non-free' to your sources.list and type "apt-get update && apt-get install flashplugin-nonfree'09:02
HrdwrBoB.. or not09:03
|trey|mwilson: so far, I am not liking synaptic at all... its kinda illogical imo... still sticking to tried and true apt-get...09:03
HrdwrBoBinstall that09:03
|trey|HrdwrBoB: umm, care to point him at the repo containing that? cuz uhh, its not in Ubuntu...09:04
HrdwrBoBcrap, wrong machine09:04
_ranman_How is synaptic illogical for large installs?09:04
HrdwrBoBmy mistake09:04
|trey|(you're getting it from marralats site)09:04
HrdwrBoByeah I was on a different machine09:04
|trey|_ranman_: If I can't figure out how to upgrade all packages within 5 mins, its illogical...09:04
joemmark all upgrades is pretty straight forward09:05
|trey|joem: not so much  :/09:05
_ranman_ic... maybe he wants to download all in 5 minutes...09:05
joemwhat is confusing about that phrase09:06
_ranman_Get off of AOL..09:06
joemit has the words upgrade all09:06
|trey|joem: like I said, I was sat there for 5 mins before I was able to upgrade packages...09:06
|trey|apt-get update && apt-get upgrade is logical09:06
|trey|_ranman_: /whois |trey| 09:06
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=== joem hugs his common sense
_ranman_usually I like to inspect what I am upgrading.. 09:07
neuro_apt-get -u upgrade then :)09:07
|trey|neuro_: surely you mean apt-get -s upgrade?09:08
|trey|as in simulate?09:08
AfCIs http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/releases/warty/preview/live-i386.iso the LiveCD? If so, is that the one to download, or is there a newer one, etc? Sorry if it's FAQ, but the FAQ doesn't link to a download...09:08
|trey|AfC: I would guess so...09:08
|trey|AfC: I would ask mdz if I was you, he is working on it... he said there was a new one going out today I think... not sure if thats it...09:09
mwilsonHm, are there actually images later than the 15-Sep ones?09:10
jedithere are the dailies09:11
_ranman_Does it matter if there is a newer CD? 09:11
jedinah, just apt-get dist-upgrade09:11
mwilsonNo, someone asked me and I didn't know.09:11
_ranman_That is what I thought...09:12
mwilsonThe original image was enough for me to fiddle with.09:12
|trey|mwilson: apparently there are nightly builds... also, each new install gets the newest packages anyways...09:12
mwilson|trey|: Hardly.  I installed off the 15-Sep ISO today, and therefore, got what was on the 15-Sep image.09:13
|trey|mwilson: on the ReleaseSchedule from wiki: Sounder = new builds09:13
HrdwrBoBsounder was the pre-release testers09:13
HrdwrBoBthere are currently nightly builds09:13
|trey|mwilson: bah... gaim then was 0.82.1, you will note you now have 1.0.0, firefox got upgraded, and menu got tweaked... these are obvious changes I have noted during fresh installs...09:14
AfCI know about the dailies, but they seem to be for the regular install-to-disk pre-release builds. Just wanted to see if someone would suggest which  livecd would be best to download09:14
|trey|mwilson: I installed first the day it was announced, and have installed 2 times since...09:14
HrdwrBoBAfC: the liveCDs are built by hand09:14
HrdwrBoBand I think that's the latest one09:14
jediAfC: sorry, dailies thing was addressed to mwilson 09:14
mwilson|trey|: Uh, no, how would I have anything later than what was on the image, or aren't you listening?09:14
|trey|HrdwrBoB: the ReleaseSchedule notes there are more coming  :/09:14
|trey|mwilson: umm... k, well I don't install from the CD  :/09:15
AfCHrdwrBoB: [yeah - I've built a LiveCD before - was working with Morphix that go - I know how hard and finicky it can be] 09:15
|trey|Never do  :/09:15
AfCjedi: np09:15
HrdwrBoB|trey|: hm, possibly, in any case, a sounder CD is essentially a daily that is picked for some testing09:15
cybernoutoh, i seem to be able to install flashplayer plugin by just clicking09:15
|trey|I don't recall there being anything I did to change that though...09:15
cybernoutthe plugin for firefox on the website09:15
mwilson|trey|: Ubuntu isn't something I'm going to use, there was no reason to update the box.09:15
|trey|HrdwrBoB: look at the ReleaseSchedule, then come back and argue if I am wrong.09:15
cybernoutnow thats easy09:15
|trey|mwilson: umm, ok... why are you still here then?09:16
mwilson|trey|: To see what's going on.09:16
mwilson|trey|: You advocate digging a hole and covering yourself up?09:16
|trey|mwilson: planet.ubuntulinux.org is more enlightening  :/09:16
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|trey|mwilson: personal attacks are not welcome, thankyou for taking the time to come up with one though...09:17
AfC|trey|: any idea where/when I might find mdz?09:18
mwilson|trey|: Really.  Describe this "personal attack" please... take your time.  I'll wait.09:18
|trey|He's here fairly often, he will come back eventually...09:18
_ranman_trey:but attacks against KDE are welcome though?09:18
HrdwrBoBstep a) stfu09:19
mwilson|trey|: Unless being quite up-front in saying that Ubuntu isn't for me is a personal attack...09:19
HrdwrBoBsteb c) profit09:19
|trey|mwilson: put downs of any kind that do not explicitly prove me wrong....09:19
HrdwrBoBmoving along09:19
=== mwilson looks unsuccessfully for the put-down
|trey|mwilson: I'll help:  "<mwilson> |trey|: You advocate digging a hole and covering yourself up?"09:20
mwilsonI'm interested in how that's a put-down.09:20
|trey|You are eluding to the fact you don't think I deserve to be living, irrelivant to anything of relivence09:21
_ranman_mwilson: He has a thing about holes..09:21
_ranman_haha, trey really does not like holes..09:21
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|trey|_ranman_: shut up, thanks09:22
cybernoutwhats the topic?09:22
_ranman_Trey: I think that you misunderstood..09:22
mwilson|trey|: I am?  I think it's much more likely that I was using a metaphor similar to the classic one of sticking your head in the sand and hoping the world goes away.09:22
jedicybernout: /topic :)09:22
_ranman_I think that was a referal to gettin yourself in trouble..09:22
mwilson|trey|: But you go ahead and enjoy your insecurity.09:22
cybernoutstrange world...09:22
mwilson(btw... THAT was a put-down)09:23
jediit's getting warm in here09:23
|trey|mwilson: I don't understand how that is simular but ok... my remidy: /ignore09:23
cybernoutwhy dont you freeciv / doom eachother...09:23
Walhehe nice call cybernout09:24
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t35t0rut2k4 each other09:24
|trey|ugh @ people not knowing when to stfu09:25
mwilsonI don't own any of those... they're all snoozes.09:25
=== neuro_ backs away from the scrap in progress and heads off to work :)
mwilsonThe last decent FPS was D2.09:25
SuperLagwhat package contains maildirmake?09:26
cybernoutor a game of chess...:P09:26
mwilsonHm, dailies have evocrap 2.0109:27
mwilson2.0.1, rather09:27
mwilsonI was surprised that Ubuntu makes the decision to not use Epiphany in favor of Firefox, but doesn't replace Evolution with Thunderbird.09:28
=== |trey| still thinks people not intending to use Ubuntu should gtfo...
cybernoutevolution is different09:29
mwilsonYou were ignoring me.09:29
cybernoutits more mature and stable09:29
=== SuperLag slaps himself in the forehead
cybernoutbut you can install whatever you like09:29
|trey|cybernout: debateable, certainly a slightly cleaner interface though  :)09:29
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mwilsoncybernout: Well, it's not the usable vs unusable thing that Firefox vs Epiphany is, but I can't imagine why anyone would use Evolution if Thunderbird would suit.09:30
cybernoutdoes any of you use an bttv card?09:30
mwilsonI despise them both equally, it just surprised me.09:30
cybernouti am trying to do scantv, but it fails 09:31
cybernoutvbi: open failed [/dev/vbi] 09:31
cybernoutopen /dev/vbi: No such file or directory09:31
cybernoutat this point09:31
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_ranman_evo 2.0 == exchange..09:31
cybernoutany clue's? to what could case the problem?09:31
mwilsoncybernout: Welcome to the fun of a dynamic /dev09:31
mwilsonOh, does Ubuntu incorporate the exchange connector?  Didn't know that.09:32
Se7hdoes anyone use gdesklets?09:32
cybernoutmwilson : explain please..09:32
|trey|Se7h: yes09:33
_ranman_Not on ubuntu..09:33
mwilsoncybernout: Ubuntu uses udev.09:33
|trey|<Se7h> does anyone use gdesklets?09:33
_ranman_I had a libtop dep problem.. So no gdesklets for me..09:33
=== bdale_tablet stumbles over the need to manually install linux-restricted-modules-<ver> after upgrading to a fresher kernel. sigh.
_ranman_Maybe I just fucked up..09:33
Se7hmost like09:34
Se7h|trey| the "yes?" was for _ranman_09:34
|trey|eh, he's on ignore too  :/09:34
_ranman_So I can say bad things about trey, and he will not see?09:34
_ranman_That is unfair..09:35
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mwilsoncybernout: So you're an unwilling participant in the "my /dev is emptier than yours" contest.09:35
cybernoutwell, no go ahead09:35
mwilsoncybernout: Now you get to figure out what random incantation to udev/hotplug is necessary to get it to create the device nodes you need.09:36
_ranman_What is really funny is that I got ignored over a hole..09:36
cybernouti just installed it an hour ago09:36
smeggyhmm.. i thought warty was frozen?09:36
smeggywhats with all these updates appearing O.o09:36
|trey|smeggy: not yet09:36
smeggynot yet?09:37
cybernouti came from knoppix ( with /dev/ filled )09:37
Se7hgdesklets uses xml09:37
Se7hgkrellm is more simple09:37
mwilsoncybernout: My junk box has a bttv card in it... Ubuntu knew it was there but I didn't have any reason to try playing with it to see if it'd loaded support for it.09:37
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cybernoutok, well xawtv works, but i need to manually insert all the frueq09:38
|trey|smeggy: October 6 is total freeze...09:38
|trey|so tomorrow  :)09:38
|trey|Uhh, 18th even09:39
mwilsonI need to take that card out of there... it was for the PVR I never found a reason to build.09:39
|trey|Or 20th... although its under Oct 18th  :/09:39
cybernoutbut i could always import the list from debian, the test i am running is to see if ubuntu is usefull for first time users09:39
|trey|Says "FullFreeze"  :/09:40
|trey|Right now, all we're seeing is bug fixes etc...09:40
cybernoutwhat kind of installer is used by ubuntu? 09:40
|trey|Se7h: gdesklets looks nicer though  :)09:41
mwilsoncybernout: It should be, as long as you have someone competent set it up for them... same as any other distribution.09:41
|trey|cybernout: d-i09:41
mwilsoncybernout: It looks like d-i.09:41
|trey|cybernout: look at the screenshots linked to on the site... it shows every screen you will see..09:41
mwilsoncybernout: So it has all of d-i's warts, like hardware detect that you can't disable.09:41
Se7h|trey| its looks is costomizeble09:41
smeggythanks |trey|09:41
smeggyit'd be nice if updates to things like firefox could still be provided after the freeze heh09:42
|trey|Se7h: to an extent, sure... I like the looks of the sysinfo gdesklet... I forget its name though... almost fullscreen here...09:42
mwilsonFirefox changes THAT often?09:42
mwilsonI don't use it, I don't pay attention to it.09:42
cybernoutyes very often ( for security reasons right? )09:43
smeggysecurity amongst other things09:43
cybernoutbug fixes etc09:43
=== |trey| can't wait till hoary starts getting populated with packages...
mwilsonSomehow I doubt it's all that often.09:43
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=== |trey| thinks Xorg ought to go in there asap 8)
=== smeggy can't wait till he can point his repos to hoary instead and enjoy the uptodate goodness that is a dev branch ;)
mwilsonOh, yes, after all it's vitally important to switch out one X implementation for another that's almost exactly the same.09:44
cybernouthmm, armagetron ( the game ) has no sound...09:44
smeggyYes! :D09:44
smeggyI just like the feeling that being up to date gives ;)09:45
cybernouti will have to make my own noise..:P09:45
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|trey|smeggy: I just hate the feeling not being up to date brings... apt-get has spoiled me...09:45
|trey|cybernout: good luck with that  :)09:45
|trey|record it so you can laugh later  :)09:45
smeggySame |trey|.. (damnit can't you get rid of the first |, its hard to type :P)09:45
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|trey|smeggy: nope... most other combo's are taken  :(09:46
smeggybah :P09:46
|trey|smeggy: besides thats all you have to type usually, so its not so bad...09:46
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cybernoutall in all ubuntu is nice, really, but it can use some improvement ( dont all distro's? )09:47
|trey|cybernout: can't*09:47
HrdwrBoBcybernout: this is why the developers haven't stopped working on it :)09:47
mwilsoncybernout: File bugs, then.09:47
HrdwrBoBanyway, bbl09:47
|trey|cybernout: true enough... its in a beta stage right now though...09:47
smeggyI think it really needs forums! :P09:47
cybernoutthen its rather good..if its an beta09:48
|trey|smeggy: its getting them  :)09:48
smeggyI know.09:48
smeggyBut I'm impatient :P09:48
|trey|cybernout: what did you think "Preview Release" meant?  ;)09:48
didar_realhey people I have a question about shipit09:48
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cybernoutright now i am developing for knoppix..thats also alway's beta..:P09:48
smeggywho are the devs in here anyway? other than jdub..?09:48
didar_realcould someone help me?09:48
mwilsonKnoppix has developers?09:49
smeggyJust ask your question didar_real and if someone can help they will..09:49
mwilsonOr people that'll admit to being developers for it?09:49
didar_realI went to shipit.ubuntulinux.org and put in my Address09:49
didar_real...for the CDs to be shipped09:49
mwilsonIsn't that like admitting you're a Gentoo developer?09:49
didar_realHow do I come to know of the status?09:49
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|trey|cybernout: Ubuntu has a pretty good level of entry for Maintainers also... you may want to think about helping out  :)09:50
smeggyGentoo is hilarious.09:50
|trey|didar_real: the day Ubuntu is released, they will ship.09:50
smeggyIts the most loved and hated distro in the free software world.09:50
|trey|smeggy: its really not though09:50
didar_realohhhh, ok09:50
smeggyIts not?09:50
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cybernoutfor an fast desktop use yoper09:51
|trey|smeggy: the people that talk about loving it are just bored waiting on something to compile... and those that hate it got sick of waiting for things to compile...09:51
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smeggylol |trey|09:51
|trey|cybernout: thats blasphemy!09:51
cybernoutreally ?09:51
didar_realWow, this place seems to be like a school yard09:51
smeggyubuntu is the fastest linux desktop I've had the pleasure of using/.09:51
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smeggydidar_real, what do you mean?09:52
|trey|cybernout: most distro's contain the same types of speed tweaks yoper uses...09:52
didar_realNo offence menat just a jibe :D09:52
madduckMithrandir: found another bug in mailman. :)09:52
cybernoutany way, thnx for the chat, i have to go to work09:52
didar_realeveryone is one-upping their fav distros'09:52
cybernoutbye and much luck with ubuntu..09:52
smeggyIs it just me, or does QT "feel" faster than GTK+?09:52
didar_realjust the way "we09:52
|trey|didar_real: this is #ubuntu, any other distro simply shouldn't be brought up  ;)09:53
cybernout-linux=kernel - the rest is eye candy..:)09:53
didar_realkids" 09:53
didar_realwell, in the heat of the moment "Viva la RedHat 9"09:53
|trey|smeggy: its not just you... however you shouldn't notice it so much in Ubuntu... they utilize some arguments to speed up startup etc...09:53
=== didar_real ducks for cover
=== cybernout waving across the waves
smeggyI see.09:54
|trey|didar_real: so you like using dead distro's?09:54
didar_realnope I just like ruffling other people a lil bit ;)09:54
calci like slackware 2 better ;)09:54
didar_realI use Woody now09:55
|trey|didar_real: I actually like Fedora... perhaps more then Ubuntu, but RH9 is long dead  :/09:55
|trey|FC1 is as good as dead09:55
|trey|didar_real: Woody will be dead soon too...09:55
didar_realWell, I found simple goof-ups in RH909:55
=== calc had fc3t2 on his laptop until a few hours ago
didar_real...init scripts09:55
WalFC2 is winding down now 209:55
|trey|calc: grr @ you... it won't complete intalling packages here  :(09:55
didar_realTried FC1, was good but preferred Debian09:56
=== smeggy had slackware 10 on this here boxen until a few days ago
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|trey|Wal: nah, it still has 6 months left to live  :)09:56
calc|trey|: i was using the amd64 version, maybe i386 is broken?09:56
smeggyand Fedora Legacy will support it after that ;)09:56
|trey|calc: don't know, wouldn't make much sense, but see no other reason...09:56
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didar_realIts nice to have choices and toys to mess with!09:56
|trey|smeggy: Fedora Legacy is basically "Hey look, if you can't figure out how to burn a CD, just use this and shut up, thanks"09:57
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didar_realBTW, I've been a RH bigot for 5 years09:57
calci'm going to test a netinstall of ubuntu to see if it works now09:57
|trey|calc: if you find one, let me know  :)09:57
smeggyI haven't seriously used RH since 7.something09:57
jediit was downhill from there09:58
|trey|I started with 7.3, used every version other then 9...09:58
didar_realRH after 7.3 just went "whacko"09:58
smeggyI went too shiny after 7.309:58
smeggyI didnt go shiny09:58
smeggyas much as Id like to be shiny..09:58
|trey|didar_real: blah... Bluecurve is only recently being realized on other distro's...09:58
didar_realand empty underneath09:58
=== jedi polishes smeggy's scalp
smeggyhey! :`(09:59
smeggyi think my hair is receding09:59
smeggydont make me sad09:59
|trey|didar_real: blah... I'm liking it more and more with every release  :/09:59
jedismeggy: woops, sorry ;)09:59
|trey|Auto Configuration of LVM2 volumes is great imo09:59
|trey|and the amount it hides from the user is great for a desktop based distro...10:00
didar_realWell, when you have a Pentium 166 w/ 32Mb RAM you look for...10:00
|trey|Users get scared when they read some of the stuff the system is doing during boot... I've seen it.10:00
didar_real...the simple things in life10:00
|trey|didar_real: ahh... yeah, I would get a sledge hammer to that box, and make my way to Fry's...10:00
didar_realhey! get away from my box >:-|10:01
|trey|Worst box in this house is a 633  :/10:01
didar_realIts got sentimental value10:01
|trey|didar_real: put it up on your wall or something then... it should be retired from use!10:01
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didar_realnah, it will make a great router/firewall10:02
SuperLagwhy doe configuring an e-mail server have to be such a bitch10:02
didar_realwhich e-mail server would that be?10:02
mwilsonSuperLag: It isn't, particularly... you just have to know what you're doing.10:02
|trey|eh, my router alone is a 233  :/10:03
=== stevedeo [~steve@static24-72-64-205.regina.accesscomm.ca] has joined #ubuntu
|trey|Thats about the minimum I would contemplate if I was setting up a box to do the same thing...10:03
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didar_realWell, I can watch video w/o sound with mplayer compiled from source with optimisations to warp 9 on this baby ;)10:04
|trey|P1 > P2 was pretty noticeable imo10:04
lypiehugely so10:04
lypieppro was the big one10:04
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lypienothing compares arch change wise10:04
lypieapart from the athlon and x64 :)10:04
lypie(yer sure p4 and ia64 were impressive in the lab, but look at the costs...)10:05
|trey|lypie: I want to use an Opteron machine... AMD64 didn't impress though  :/10:05
didar_realhow does P w/ HT compare with AMD64?10:05
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lypiedidar_real: for what?10:06
didar_realthats Pentium with HT10:06
calcdidar_real: amd64 is about 30% faster from what i recall in 64bit mode over a 32bit p4 w/ht10:06
HrdwrBoBis it normal for ubuntu disk resizer to be 0% until it's fnished10:06
|trey|didar_real: aboutt he same I'd say.. most software still doesn't really utilize the extra 32bits of data  :/10:06
calci sold my p4/ht after getting athlon6410:06
HrdwrBoB|trey| the main boinus is in the kernel10:06
didar_realoh the usual...surfing, chatting, word-processing, compiling, video processing...etc, etc10:06
lypiesuper fast memcpy's10:06
HrdwrBoBbut it's significant10:06
lypieso make sure u have a properly optimised kernel :)10:07
lypiei guess that gcc doesn't make good use of it anyways10:07
lypieits not really known for good optimisation...10:07
|trey|HrdwrBoB: I was using Debian's ia64 or whatever kernel ....10:07
lypiein any case. most applications use int and presume 32bit :)10:07
Se7hsorry to desturb10:07
calclypie: the extra regs are where most of the performance come from10:07
Se7hi mean10:07
lypiecalc: yup10:08
Se7hat the repository comes also with a "data"10:08
mwilsonWhat *is* the big deal you have with gdesklets?10:08
lypiecalc: means a 10-15% decrease in binary size10:08
Se7hgdesklets is running10:08
didar_realso you are saying I shoud go for p4/ht or AMD64? I'm confused! :(10:08
lypiecalc: iow, massive improvement in code cache utilisation10:08
Se7hi dont know what to do now10:08
HrdwrBoBdidar_real amd6410:08
lypiedidar_real: athlon10:08
HrdwrBoBget a PCIe board10:08
HrdwrBoBwith a 939 socket10:08
=== lypie would just go for an high end athlon atm
calcdidar_real: amd64, p4 are slower and use a hell of a lot more power10:09
|trey|Se7h: apt-get install gdesklets-data ... run it from menu once ... then run scripts in /usr/share/gdesklets/D[tab] 10:09
calcdidar_real: see the recent tech report article linked by anandtech/slashdot/etc10:09
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|trey|I forget what that word is, but thats what I typed I think10:09
lypiethey'll have a new motherboard for the 64 arch's within 6 months and then your investment will be worthless10:09
lypiejust buy a freakishly cheap athlon10:09
didar_realyeah I did read that10:09
lypieor better. get two :P10:09
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=== calc has three athlon64's :)
=== lypie slapscalc :P
_ranman_Se7h: gdesklets are like that... Karamba is better.. Go to the folder that the gdesklets data was installed into, and Go to Display, then find which one that you want go into the folder and click on the display.10:09
lypies/sc/s c/10:09
didar_reallypie: od point10:10
Mithrandirhi calc10:10
didar_reallypie: good point10:10
calcone of them is just a cpu laying on the floor though, need to get a box to put it in10:10
calcMithrandir: hi10:10
lypiedidar_real: :P10:10
|trey|Se7h: actually, I think its /usr/lib/gdesklets ... something like that... dpkg -L gdesklets-data... where most of it went...10:10
mwilsonKaramba requires KDE, which kind of defeats the purpose.10:10
lypiemwilson: gnome sucks anyways. use kde :) :P10:10
calcMithrandir: i'm testing out the ubuntu MSI change on my laptop to see how it goes10:10
=== lypie is in gnome at the moment and thinks its kinda cute so he should shut up
calcgnome is better :)10:10
mwilsonlypie: Why would I use either one?10:10
didar_realTWM RULEZ!!!!!10:10
|trey|calc: shut it10:10
_ranman_haha, I forgot that mwilson and trey are the local KDE bouncers..10:10
lypiemwilson: i'm a console user so :P10:11
calcbut i don't know since i maintain kde :)10:11
=== omlet [mariusz@arbuz.info] has joined #ubuntu
lypiecalc: :P10:11
mwilsonHow am I a "KDE bouncer"?10:11
|trey|calc: a kde maintainer should not say gnome is better in public [angryface] 10:11
Se7h|trey| yeah, the data file i have it10:11
calc|trey|: heh10:11
=== lypie is an ex kde devel..
=== calc is going to gnome summit on friday :)
_ranman_bounce anyone that speaks of KDE..10:11
Se7hok i see the gdesklets files10:11
didar_realooooh that was a major boo-boo10:11
Se7hbut now, how do i run them '10:11
lypie|trey|: kde user then? :)10:11
|trey|Se7h: go there and start typing ./something/thescript10:12
_ranman_Se7h dounble click on a .desklets file..10:12
jblacktrey: leaving asside the argument of whether kde or gnome is "better", its a flaw to not recognize the features of the other one in some misguided attempt for loyalty.10:12
calcit looks like the MSI fix fixed my laptop, so i will try to find out why the redhat kernel works fine with MSI10:12
|trey|lypie: I switch off between XFCE4, GNOME, KDE, and fluxbox  :/10:12
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lypie|trey|: all nice :) though i don't really like xfce4 in fact10:12
didar_realIceWM works for me10:13
lypiejblack: nod10:13
=== lypie can't stand icewm
|trey|lypie: fast GTK environment... with right click application menu  :)10:13
calcmdz: awake?10:13
didar_realI just fire up X for FreeCIV anyway10:13
lypie|trey|: yer seen it. just a bit too basic for me10:13
mwilsonjblack: They have different focuses... Gnome is about technical excellence, KDE is about moron-appeal.10:13
lypiemwilson: obviously you have no clue :)10:13
jblackmwilson: Oh, I disagree. 10:13
|trey|lypie: eh... its actually very feature rich...10:13
mwilsonjblack: Sadly, there are many more morons than people who care about technical excellence.10:13
lypiegnome is about companies (moron appeal)10:13
didar_reallypie: just apply a bikini-cald babe as the wallpaper and see..10:13
_ranman_oops, who got mwilson talking about kde again...10:13
lypiemwilson: ever coded for either?10:13
jblackThere's some good reasons that I'm using KDE rather than gnome.10:13
|trey|mwilson: bugger off back to #debian (still on ignore, don't talk back, I won't see it)10:14
=== lypie follows the crowd and ignores the troll :)
Se7hi got it10:14
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Se7hi had to run with..10:14
lypiedidar_real: lol btw10:14
mwilson<sigh> Yes, stating an opinion is certainly a troll.10:14
lypiemwilson: when you have no clue. yes10:14
calcerm if i select LVM on a drive that already has a partition reserved for lvm will it use it correctly?10:15
lypiemwilson: your the one drawn in by the blathering idiots at ximian10:15
jblackmwilson: For me, there are two pivotal issues. 1) arts lets me specify the bitrate for my sound card, which is important because without the right bitrate, no sound from my docking station.10:15
lypiemwilson: i'm the kde coder thats read 20% of gnomes cvs10:15
|trey|lypie: wtg @ ignoring him  [angryface] 10:15
=== calc prays that d-i doesn't eat his drive
didar_realmwilson: Thats what is "the new world order"10:15
lypie|trey|: how do i ignore in xchat ?10:15
jblackThe other is that KDE has pretty good support for dualhead support. As far as I know, gnome hasn't gotten there yet.10:15
_ranman_uhoh, now lypie is speaking agains Gnome.. War ensues...10:15
|trey|calc: I guess thats the idea...10:15
lypie|trey|: i get this wierd shit message :)10:15
mwilsonlypie: Oh, then Gnome *didn't* screw things up for their 2.0 release by insisting on technical changes at the expense of their users?  My mistake... I guess all the publicity they got about that was all in my mind.10:15
|trey|lypie: /ignore him all10:15
lypieah :)10:15
_ranman_lypie, trey is using Gaim..10:15
lypiethanks |trey| :)10:15
didar_realbattlestations everyone10:16
lypieis gaim a good irc prog?10:16
|trey|calc: it should find the volumes and use them correctly at least  :)10:16
Treenaksmwilson: which you could turn off if you wanted...10:16
Wallypie no way10:16
=== Hrdwr_BoB is now known as kim_
|trey|lypie: its adequate, sure... depends how much of an IRC junkie you are  :)10:16
=== lypie ponder installing gaim-vv
Treenaksmwilson: and which are way easier for new users10:16
lypie|trey|: i'm a irssi user usually :P10:16
mwilsonTreenaks: How could you turn off what didn't exist, according to lypie?10:16
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=== calc hopes this LVM configuration thing uses real MB not that pansy ass ieee MB
Wal|trey|, well said 10:17
Treenaksmwilson: don't complain, or don't use gnome.. it's easy10:17
lypiewhy am i seeing mwilson still?10:17
Treenakslypie: /ignore nick all10:17
lypiexchat seriously sucks10:17
lypieTreenaks: i did :|10:17
mwilsonTreenaks: Not complaining, it's a simple statement of fact.10:17
lypie mwilson added to ignore list.10:17
didar_realgotta go ...was nice chatting with you all10:17
lypiebut it didn't work...10:17
Treenaksmwilson: it sounds like complaining to me10:17
afreakmwilson, whiner10:17
jblackmwilson: Something doesn't become a fact just because you say its a fact. ;)10:17
_ranman_Treenaks, mwilson == Gnome, && lypie == KDE..10:17
|trey|lypie: but how much of its features do you use? if you only use basic commands, and don't utilize scripts... gaim's irc will function just fine... and it has the added bonus of adding IRC users to your contact list...10:18
Waldoesnt have any scripting fectures10:18
mwilson_ranman_: Excuse me?10:18
lypie_ranman_: i know the facts he reads the publicists :)10:18
calccool it does use real MB which really makes it confusing for newbies which see the regular partition program which uses the ieee bullshit10:18
Walnext well have emacs and vi users at each other in here10:18
lypie|trey|: i don't script at all. just need multiple windows and good completion10:18
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lypieEMACS SUCKS10:18
_ranman_haha, Can't people just learn that choices are good...10:18
calcso my 7.5gb /home shows as 8.0 GB in the partition manager :)10:18
jblackwal: Nah. Everybody that matters uses vim. :) 10:18
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lypie_ranman_: not when people start spouting fud sorry :)10:18
|trey|lypie: gaim is ok at those things...10:18
mwilson<sigh> The only people that're promoting one over the other are the rest of you.10:19
lypie|trey|: whats the completion like?10:19
jblackmwilson: I think that most everybody thinks theres plenty of room for both.10:19
|trey|lypie: less annoying then XChat... although I prefer XChat overall  :)10:19
jblackand more, besides. 10:19
lypie|trey|: when i type blah with the options blah|u blah|blah do i get blah|blah if i tab 3 times?10:19
=== lypie nods
lypiei just hate fud10:19
lypieespecially stuff thats complete crap :)10:20
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mwilsonlypie: And when there's actually some here, you can go right ahead and hate it.10:20
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lypie"mwilson> jblack: They have different focuses... Gnome is about technical excellence, KDE is about moron-appeal."10:21
lypie^ complete crap :)10:21
lypiego talk to the gnome devels sometime10:21
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mwilsonOh, so Gnome *isn't* about excellence?10:21
jblacklypie: Gah! Don't associate me with that line! 10:21
lypiebut so is kde 10:21
lypiejblack: sorry10:22
mwilsonI'm sure those devs will be happy to hear THAT.10:22
lypiei put the mwilson at the start10:22
|trey|GNOME is about a dumbed down interface... hiding things from users so they don't waste time... KDE can be overwhelming, but only for those that are a little retarded...10:22
jblacklypie: Grin. :) 10:22
lypiemwilson: dimwit. i chat to most of the gnome devels10:22
=== xcasex grins
Walone uses qt and the other uses gtk - there are awesome apps in both camps i reckon10:22
lypieWal: yup :)10:22
mwilsonlypie: You're the one who said it, not me.  So, apparently it's not complete crap, then?10:22
_ranman_What?!? Gnome is not about excellence? Their shit does stink? OMG!!!!10:22
lypieand gnome 2.8 has some majorly nice stuff :)10:22
lypiemwilson: i was just being annoying while u seem to actually believe yourself :P10:23
|trey|Wal: indeed... gtk2-engines-qt-gkt creates a pretty good marriage of the two also...10:23
jblacklypie: What's the neat stuff that 2.8 has? 10:23
lypiejblack: well its fast :P10:23
Walim gnome user and k3b for me as cdr program is awesome10:23
jblacklypie: Yeah. That I noticed. 10:23
lypiejblack: and i love the new nautilus style actaully10:23
lypiejblack: they really cleaned it up10:23
mwilsonlypie: So I shouldn't believe myself when I say that Gnome is about excellence, then?10:23
lypiejblack: i'm an amiga user10:23
|trey|Usually, when I use Debian... I use KDE + mostly GTK apps, and the simular theme...10:23
xcasexwal, depends, i prefer nautilus cdburner myself :D10:23
lypiejblack: i love the spatial thing :P10:23
mwilsonlypie: You really have an odd way of looking at things.10:23
azeemlypie: that's not new in 2.8 though, spatial nautilus was introduced in 2.610:23
|trey|(usually Plastik)10:24
jblacklypie: 2.8 did seem awfully pretty to me.10:24
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Waldoes anyone know what version FC3 is going to use?10:24
xcasexmwilson, are'nt you discussing fringe semantics now ?10:24
lypiejblack: yup :)10:24
lypiexcasex: thanks for saying this10:24
lypiegaim is funky :)10:24
|trey|mwilson: why are you discussing KDE vs GNOME in a channel who's distro doesn't even include KDE? fucking moronic if you ask me.10:24
mwilsonxcasex: Apparently saying that Gnome strives for technical excellence is spreading FUD.10:24
|trey|Go to #Xandros or something  :/10:24
lypiemwilson: idiot10:25
jblacklypie: Be nice if it had some of the pretties that kde had. Somehow, I've gotten addicted to bouncing icons, and the growing icons in the task bar that kde has.10:25
=== calc likes kde's technical excellence in that they refused to even make 'make clean' work in the past ;)
lypiejblack: hehe10:25
=== calc shuts up now
xcasexmwilson, i think it's the explicit exclusion of usability in your argument that is making peoples pants twist :D10:25
lypiecalc: the code...10:25
mwilson|trey|: I've yet to promote one vs the other... so far, y'all are doing all that.10:25
LeeColletonis the ubuntu gaim going to support gaim-encryption?10:25
HrdwrBoBnow that you are all over that 10:25
azeemcalc: as long as they support building in a builddir != srcdir, you can just rm -rf it ;)10:25
lypieHrdwrBoB: :P10:25
|trey|calc: at least your points are valid... he is just spurting bullshit.10:25
=== lypie nods
Walxcasex, more to the point, the one step cd cloning is awesome10:25
HrdwrBoBcan someone who's used ubuntu partition resizing talk to me10:26
lypiethough honestly. make clean is a bitch to get working :P10:26
xcasexWal, ah you10:26
mwilsonAh, now Gnome's excellence is bullshit.10:26
lypieyou should just use srcdir != buildir :P10:26
azeem|trey|: it always takes at least two people to discuss something :)10:26
jblackYou're all wrong! Everything stinks for twm. We all need to go back to the basics. 10:26
xcasexWal, ah you're that sort of user, i burn the occasional cd :)10:26
=== lypie wishes that xchat would actually work
calcazeem: i had to do that, since make clean didn't work, and in the past != didn't work either, much fun10:26
mwilsonWhy is it that everyone else comes up with the nonsense?10:26
xcasexmwilson, did you forget to take your ritalin this morning?10:26
daKirschi have a question: are there missing symlinks on the ubuntu ftp? i had to change a line in the 'current' warty-i368.jigdo in order to get it work. i changed the mirror to http://archive.ubuntulinux.org/ubuntu/pool10:26
Walxcasex, im not that bad :lol:10:26
|trey|azeem: not when mwilson is around... he will respond to anything directed at him... and never shut up about it...10:26
xcasexwal, hehee ;)10:27
HrdwrBoBdaKirsch if there is, file a bugreport :)10:27
mwilsonxcasex: Apparently excellence is a bad thing, if you belive everyone here.10:27
lypiemwilson: you smell of poo10:27
|trey|azeem: ~3 years of seeing this dude @ work in #debian  :/10:27
|trey|lypie: no personal attacks, thanks10:27
jblackCut out filesystem browsers and bouncing icons, and nautilus and kde-wallet, and mozilla and everything. Lets just go back to text files and twm. We'll save gobs on memory, right mwilson? 10:27
xcasexmwilson, *grin* 10:27
daKirschnever did this before :> it's not that hard, is it?10:27
lypie|trey|: i wanted to prove your point right10:27
lypie|trey|: wanted to see him defend his smell :P10:27
mwilsonjblack: Funny, haven't promoted that idea at all.10:27
azeemjblack: ion, not twm10:27
Walxcasex, more using it copying my mates fedora cds in the last week10:27
|trey|lypie: eh, no need  :/10:28
HrdwrBoBdaKirsch no, it's pretty easy, if you get it wrong people will just redirect it to the right person etc10:28
xcasexWal, oh, well if you have nautilus running it's just a rightclick away :)10:28
jblackmwilson: No, but why haven't you? 10:28
HrdwrBoBposting a bug to the wrong person or area is not perfect but it's better than none at all10:28
mwilsonjblack: Why would I, when I don't agree with it?10:28
daKirschok thanks. i'll give it a try10:28
Walxcasex, lol ;)10:28
jblackYou don't? What would you agree with, then? \10:28
HrdwrBoB"posting bugs helps everyone"10:28
HrdwrBoBquote, unquote10:28
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=== jblack waves to jamesh
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mwilsonjblack: Hm?10:30
lypanovla la la10:30
jblackmwilson: If you don't agree with that, what would you agree with? 10:30
lypanovjblack: disagreement :)10:31
jblackThat there's several skilled teams all working very hard to ease desktop management? 10:31
jameshhi jblack 10:31
lypanovneato. gaim has cute icons :P10:31
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xcasexlypanov, and a nasty listview ;_;10:32
mwilsonjblack: When did I say I didn't agree with that?  Or did?  In this conversation, I've had people label me as a Gnome-hater, a Gnome-lover, a KDE-hater, and a KDE-lover, and the only thing I did was make a statement about the goals of the respective projects.  Personally, I don't use either one.10:32
lypanovxcasex: its all cute :P10:32
jblackmwilson: I'm not asking if you disagree. I'm asking if you agree. :) 10:33
xcasexlypanov, no, proteus is cute, gaim's just nasty ;)10:33
xcasexmwilson, jblack  kiss and make up :)10:33
lypanovmwilson: you insulted me (in)directly via your unneeded comment on gnome vs kde's technical excellence. and now you continue to argue your points by confusing all but yourself. give it a rest k?10:33
jblackxcasex: What for? I don't think we're fighting. 10:33
mwilsonjblack: I do believe that KDE will do things to suit the users, at the expense of technical merit, while Gnome will do the reverse.  That's opinion, and people are free to disagree with it.  It's not FUD, it's merely opinion.10:33
lypanovxcasex: proteus? :P gtk2 also?10:33
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HrdwrBoBanyone who wants to talk about KDE10:34
xcasexlypanov, hehe, hehehe, no *cough* osx *cough*10:34
HrdwrBoBcan go to #kde10:34
lypanovxcasex: dang it :P10:34
HrdwrBoBor #ubuntukde10:34
HrdwrBoBor #ihatekde10:34
HrdwrBoBplease yourself10:34
xcasexjblack, darn, i wanted to see a little raunchyness :(10:34
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lypanovpoor xcasex10:34
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xcasexlypanov, you have no idea ;_;10:35
lypanovi like gaim :)10:35
lypanovits all cute :)10:35
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calcseb128: hi10:35
seb128hey calc 10:36
|trey|Someone remind me later to bitch at HrdwrBoB about BitchX10:37
lypanov|trey|: thx for suggestion i really like this :)10:37
|trey|The part messages are annoying  [angryface] 10:37
|trey|lypanov: what I recommend?10:37
lypanov|trey|: gaim i think :P10:38
lypanovany fast console's for gnome?10:38
|trey|lypanov: ohh... hmm, the devs are really friendly too  :)10:38
|trey|lypanov: no10:38
lypanovarse :(10:38
|trey|lypanov: they are all about as slow as gnome-terminal-emulator10:38
lypanovits soooo sllloowwwww10:39
|trey|with on a side note, really really needs a new name, thats a pain to type10:39
lypanovas everything starts with gnome-10:39
|trey|should be gnome-console though  :/10:39
|trey|much easier to type  :/10:39
lypanovwell its gnome-terminal here rather than gnome-terminal-emulator in fact10:39
lypanovanyways. konsole is much faster10:40
lypanovbut its kinda ugly compared to gnome-terminal :|10:40
jblackThere's some sort of edge case in gnome-terminal. 10:40
lypanovbut then gnome-terminal is freaking buggy10:40
lypanovi keep on getting a full blue screen :|10:40
jblackAffects nobody but me. I can't get a gnome terminal to run more than 20 minutes before I crash it.10:40
subterrificthere is Terminal from xfce or whatever10:40
lypanovjblack: it affects me too don't worry10:40
subterrificlooks almost exactly like gnome-term10:40
jblackoh, really? 10:40
lypanovsubterrific: fast?10:40
subterrificdunno, never tried it10:41
lypanovjblack: yeah. crashed it 3 times yesterday10:41
lypanovjblack: its awful10:41
|trey|subterrific: that just runs x-terminal-emulator with a little wrapper that appears to do nothing at all...10:41
subterrifici'm fine with gnome-term, i've got nice fast machines10:41
kremlynjust run aterm.10:41
lypanovjblack: erm. not crashes in fact10:41
lypanovjblack: infinite loops10:41
jblacklypanov: Do you tend to switch windows rapidly with both the keyboard and mouse at the same time? 10:41
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|trey|kremlyn: bah... anything resembling motif in any way just isn't used on my box.10:41
|trey|Its like a rule or something...10:41
subterrific|trey|: are you sure? i saw screenshots and it has tabbed terms and a huge preferences window10:41
lypanovjblack: i use alt-n all the time but use alt-tab to switch windows10:42
lypanovjblack: i run screen and irssi and zsh10:42
|trey|subterrific: very... at least from 4.0.x10:42
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lypanovjblack: and it keeps going blue so i'm forced to press ctrl-l10:42
|trey|maybe they actually wrote a terminal for 4.2.x, doubt it though...10:42
calcbtw ubuntu works with only /boot outside lvm10:42
calci just installed it to see10:42
lypanovcalc: nice10:42
lypanovcalc: i was thinking of setting my home machine up with lvm10:43
lypanovcalc: how on earth do i setup lvm? :P10:43
calcit warns you that / must be outside of lvm but works anyway10:43
|trey|calc: /boot can't go in an LVM2 volume, everyone knows that  :)10:43
lypanovcalc: (from within the installer or?)10:43
hazmatdoes totem/gstreamer actually work for anyone?10:43
lypanovhazmat: it plays nothing here10:43
hazmatits been entirely useless here10:43
lypanovhazmat: no video's work at least10:43
calclypanov: its easy, just create a /boot partition and a lvm partition then add groups and volumes10:43
|trey|calc: grub can't recognize LVM2 volumes afaik10:43
lypanovhazmat: try gst-register10:43
_ranman_totem, is completely useless10:43
jblackI've never gotten totem to work. I've bene using xine instead10:43
lypanovhazmat: that made the sound work10:43
lypanovdoes xine work well these days?10:43
opi^workgxine/mplayer :)10:43
lypanovit used to crash all the time :(10:44
calc|trey|: yes i know /boot has to be outside it says all of / needs to be outside but doesn't have to be10:44
opi^worklydickaw: quite nice10:44
jblacklypanov: Its been working reliably for me on ubuntu. 10:44
lypanovoh. whats the apt.sources line for mplayer?10:44
hazmatxine and mplayer worked well last i tried with gentoo..10:44
opi^worklydickaw: try gxine, you'll have GTK face :)10:44
|trey|_ranman_: totem-gstreamer kinda is... apt-get install totem-xine + ffmpeg and w32codecs from marillat...10:44
lypanovopi^work: k i'll give it a go :)10:44
|trey|calc: look at how Fedora did it  ;)10:44
lypanov|trey|: whats the marillat line?10:44
calclypanov: d-i makes it fairly simple to setup, i set it up first under fedora fc3t2 then tried it in d-i10:44
_ranman_??? I thought that I was ignored?10:44
calc|trey|: yea fedora sticks / in lvm10:44
opi^worklydickaw: it's a .fr host with .deb that has all win32 codecs ;p10:45
|trey|_ranman_: took you off when mwilson was getting enough attention for his ignore status to be annoying...10:45
lypanovopi^work: yeah. whats the url though? :P10:45
opi^workbut I prefer to fetch stuff from mplyaerhq and compile it10:45
calc|trey|: point being the text in d-i probably could use updating since / works inside a lvm and it states it will not10:45
_ranman_ic.. haha10:45
opi^worklydickaw: d'oh, try google with mplayer debian ;P10:45
|trey|calc: #debian-boot would be a better place to say that  :)10:45
calcyea :)10:45
lypanovdoes firefox have "g blah" (opera) or "gg:blah" (konqi)?10:46
opi^workURL shortcuts?10:46
opi^workdunno :)10:46
|trey|lypanov: not in its base form, no... it has a google search thingy in the toolbar though...10:46
opi^workbut it has google input box :P10:46
jameshlypanov: you can set up any keywords you want to.10:46
lypanovoh. it works :)10:46
|trey|There is an extension that allows for g:blahsomething though10:47
lypanovthe google search thingy is tiny though :(10:47
Treenakslypanov: doesn't matter, you can type all you want in it10:47
jameshlypanov: go to a website, and right click on an entry field and choose "Add a keyword for this search"10:47
lypanovdeb ftp://ftp.nerim.net/debian-marillat unstable main10:47
lypanovthis one ^10:47
jameshlypanov: if you set the keyword to "foo", you can type "foo search terms" and it will do the search.10:47
|trey|lypanov: you looking for a yes or no?10:47
opi^worklypanov: apt-get.org would get you there ;)10:48
lypanovjamesh: *sweeeeeeeeeeeeet*10:48
SuperLaglypanov: why would it, when it has a Google search window right there??10:48
lypanov|trey|: yer :P10:48
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lypanovSuperLag: 1) way too small, 2) how the heck do i get there easily?10:48
|trey|lypanov: then yes... he is a debian developer, so his packages are safe...10:48
lypanovf7 is sweet10:48
Treenakslypanov: F6, <tab> :)10:48
lypanovthx Treenaks :)10:49
|trey|add them, and type apt-get install totem-xine ffmpeg w32codecs10:49
subterrificthats what i was talking about10:49
Treenakslypanov: F6 highlights your URL bar10:49
lypanovTreenaks: yer. same in konqi :)10:49
subterrificthats a term app for Xfce10:49
lypanovTreenaks: copied from ie i guess :P10:49
Treenakslypanov: and IE6 even :)10:49
Treenaksbut most people don't know about it10:49
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stevedeoAnyone in here managed to get MonoDevelop running from tseng's packages?10:49
lypanovTreenaks: i do :$ thats the worst part :$10:49
lypanovTreenaks: just didn't try it yet :$10:49
opi^workTreenaks: people mostny don't use keyboard ;(10:49
tortoise__is there a gnome version of kde's fish?10:49
lypanovtortoise__: i wondered the same10:50
|trey|tortoise__: yes10:50
opi^workwhat's fish? :)10:50
lypanovopi^work: kio slave that allows you to ssh somewhere and look at the dir content in your file manager :)10:50
|trey|right click panel >> add to panel >> fish10:50
tortoise__not that fish!10:50
subterrificlypanov: http://www.os-cillation.com/article.php?sid=4010:50
opi^worklydickaw: nice10:50
|trey|There is also a fish you can have swim around your screen... I forget what you type for that though...10:50
joemfile-connect to server in nautilus10:50
opi^worklypanov: nice, haven't use it ;)10:51
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lypanov|trey|: read my line, fish: is something different :P10:51
|trey|something like: free the fishes name10:51
_ranman_lypanov nautilus does this?10:51
lypanov_ranman_: i only know that konqi does this10:51
lypanov_ranman_: i wonder how to do it with nautilus10:51
|trey|lypanov: ahh... my bad... umm... tsclient isn't what you want? allows ssh etc...10:51
lypanovjoem: ah :)10:52
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_ranman_if you are using ubuntu, then go to computer:/// and the connect to server is under file..10:52
_ranman_lypanov ^10:52
joemits under file in any nautilus window10:52
=== |trey| sucks @ nautilus
lypanovdoesn't work here  :(10:53
_ranman_It is not there, when you are in home directory..10:53
=== |trey| still remembers the ~2 mins of wait times to even have the thing show up :/
_ranman_hold on, I will check my home..10:54
|trey|_ranman_: it is here...10:54
joemevery nautilus window has a file menu10:54
lypanovit just does nothing10:54
lypanov|trey|: is that what you mean?10:54
_ranman_joem, but the connect to server is not always there..10:54
_ranman_It is a ghost..10:54
=== |trey| just uses tsclient or regular ssh :/
joemis here10:54
hazmatlypanov, the suggestion from #dev was to install totem-xine10:54
hazmatlypanov, its not in base because of patent/licensing issues10:55
|trey|hazmat: wtf, the devs made there own channel?  [angryface] 10:55
_ranman_lyponov, it worked for me.. But you must view the tree on the left... Used SSH10:56
mkyc-ubuntuit makes sense they would have their own channel - when doing development you dont want to deal with the clutter of a support channel all the time10:56
lypanov_ranman_: i've got a window here saying "creating properies window... you can stop this by pressing cancel"10:56
mkyc-ubuntuthey probably work in both channels10:56
lypanov_ranman_: its sure as hell not connecting to my server :/10:56
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tortoise___ranman_ nor mine10:57
joemor the clutter of everybodys petty arguments..10:57
|trey|mkyc-ubuntu: imo, such things shouldn't even be on IRC... but if it must be, others lacking technical knowhow should at least have input...10:57
mkyc-ubuntuthat too10:57
lypanovand now nautilus crashed10:57
lypanovand again10:57
=== lypanov grr's
|trey|We use the system after all...10:57
_ranman_creating properties ??? That is not what I got,,,, I got the password dialog...10:57
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lypanov_ranman_: it never appears here :(10:57
_ranman_hmmm, maybe because I am in Taiwan..10:57
tortoise__lypanov: mine did that first time but worked the second 10:58
|trey|lypanov: just for shits and giggles... dpkg -l sshd10:58
|trey|I think thats the package name..10:58
|trey|its not installed by default10:58
lypanov|trey|: i'm ssh'ing to a different server :P10:58
|trey|I wasn't even close [scar] 10:58
mkyc-ubuntuyes |trey| and when its released they will ask for help not when they are developing it. IRC is a good place for communicaition for people doing that sort of work but its not somewhere you want non devs, if you want to help out theyre always looking for developers so why not volunteer :)10:58
fabbione|trey|: anyway you shouldn't be woried about a #dev channel10:59
fabbionewe all sit on both chans10:59
|trey|mkyc-ubuntu: because I suck @ code  :/10:59
lypanovjust as long as you don't go the way of gentoo :)10:59
mkyc-ubuntui think that sort of makes my point |trey| :)10:59
|trey|mkyc-ubuntu: so because I can't code, I can't make suggestions?10:59
mkyc-ubuntusure you can11:00
mkyc-ubuntuin here11:00
mkyc-ubuntuor via the many other avenues that exist in the website or wiki11:00
fabbione|trey|: the #dev chan is free and open11:00
crimsunand there's bugzilla, too, or the mailing lists11:00
mkyc-ubuntuthere you go, jump on in11:00
|trey|fabbione: its not #ubuntu-dev or #dev, so y'all appear to want it to be hard to find  :/11:01
fabbione|trey|: everybody can join, but the topic is development and not help/support. Everybody with that clear idea in mind is more than welcome to join11:01
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lonewolffmorning all11:01
fabbione|trey|: it's not a secret channel11:01
fabbioneor nothing11:01
lonewolffi wonder if anyone can help me, i seem to have lost the ability to open things by double clicking on them in gnome11:01
|trey|fabbione: in devel channels, I am fairly quiet... just like to take part in discussions that interest me  :)11:02
tortoise__how do i install media codec for rhythmbox, it cant even play mp311:02
joemtortoise__, gstreamer-mad11:02
mkyc-ubuntupersonally as a non programmer i cant think of anything more boring to me than a #dev channell11:02
|trey|tortoise__: what joem said is mp3... apt-get.org -> search for "w32codecs" to get the rest...11:02
mkyc-ubuntuwell with the exception of budget meetings :)11:02
aesmkyc-ubuntu: risk assessments.11:03
tortoise__joem,|trey|: thanks11:03
_ranman_haha, aes is right on the money..11:03
|trey|mkyc-ubuntu: desktop oriented devel channels can be quite interesting... also, they are the truely knowledgable, so you learn a lot...11:03
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mkyc-ubuntuaes : ERP project meetings11:03
|trey|regular channels are boring sometimes... helping morons gets old  :/11:04
aesmkyc-ubuntu: ok, so a few things are more boring then :)11:04
mkyc-ubuntuaes yeah seems so11:04
_ranman_mkyc-ubuntu: risk assesments is clearly the winner..11:04
mkyc-ubuntuyeah i agree on that - risk assessments suck11:04
=== mkyc-ubuntu ponders if the statement helping morons is reflective of an attitude not neccesarily conducive to user support :)
mkyc-ubuntui have used the term myself today already :)11:05
_ranman_Stripping a whole billing system down to tiny hardware components coming up with Time to Failure reports is the worst sort of torture..11:05
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|trey|mkyc-ubuntu: actually, its a good attitude... if you assume they know too much, it will bite you in the butt more often then not..11:06
mkyc-ubuntulol so true11:06
|trey|mkyc-ubuntu: 2 years of tech support  :)11:06
mkyc-ubuntu_ranman_, whats worse is doing that only to be told the budget doesnt exist to implement the required safeguards11:06
mkyc-ubuntu|trey|, 10 years here.. i am truly insane now11:07
|trey|mkyc-ubuntu: umm, ouch... hah, thats half my life time  :)11:07
mkyc-ubuntuscary isnt it11:07
_ranman_No, I am in Taiwan, I do not have to worry about safeguards, or security.. haha11:07
|trey|very  :(11:07
|trey|I was in elementary school I think, if that  :(11:07
mkyc-ubuntunow i feel very very old11:07
mkyc-ubuntuhell im only 3511:07
lypanovwhat does "blah blah have been kept back" mean?11:07
|trey|mkyc-ubuntu: haha, I'm sorry  :)11:07
|trey|I'm almost half your age though  :)11:08
opi^workim only 24 and I feel very very old ;)11:08
_ranman_ic... Trey is young.. Understand why sensitive.. 11:08
lypanovopi^work: snap11:08
opi^workcomuters sucks life out of you :)11:08
|trey|lypanov: means it will change the database in some way... usually a new package is required etc...11:08
_ranman_I am 34, and the average coworker is 21...11:08
Se7hquestion: where is the system log ?11:08
mkyc-ubuntufunnily enough i just started with a new company where my staff are all my age, makes a change to kiddies :)11:08
|trey|lypanov: sometimes it means there is a major change in the configuration also...11:09
=== mkyc-ubuntu points out that at 35 a kiddie is anyone under 30 :P
|trey|Se7h: /var/log11:09
_ranman_haha, you are lucky..............................11:09
|trey|Se7h: umm, no idea where the pretty gnome interface for it is though  :/11:09
mkyc-ubuntucomputers dont suck life out its the people who use computers who do it :)11:09
_ranman_gnome-logview, If that is the latest name for it.11:10
|trey|mkyc-ubuntu: agreed11:10
opi^worki prefer tail -F /file11:10
opi^workThere's a nice toy that works as stdio and its transparent :)11:10
opi^workso you can watch your logs while you work11:10
opi^workI can't recall name, I'll as my sysadmin, when he'll be back11:11
|trey|_ranman_: I was being sarcastic... whenever I say things like "pretty" in relation to software, I am being sarcastic  :)11:11
|trey|Enless I am talking about KDE, but that shouldn't happen much here  :)11:11
_ranman_I did not say it was pretty... Just the name... ;)11:11
|trey|_ranman_: I did though  ;)11:11
|trey|and its not the name  8)11:12
_ranman_I never use it.. I agree with opi, that tail -f is sufficient..11:12
|trey|_ranman_: psst, case is important  :/11:12
|trey|umm, or not  :/11:13
opi^work|trey|: everyones knows that it's -F ;D11:13
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calcsyslog output should be standardized and in xml format so logviewers can parse them better and add pretty colors :)11:13
opi^workcalc: xmlsucks.com11:13
|trey|opi^work: would appear to be both... I should try reading more man pages...11:13
crimsunxml is great11:13
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_ranman_hmmm, I use -f...11:14
|trey|calc: things like logs shouldn't need pretty colors 11:14
|trey|_ranman_: its the same thing... man tail11:14
=== calc was being mostly sarcastic ;)
opi^workand logs should be READABLE with less11:15
opi^worktail and cat11:15
opi^workXML need parser11:15
|trey|cat is not useful for logs...11:15
_ranman_ic... -F is also --retry ..11:15
opi^workso if parser will fail, you're doomed ;-)11:15
|trey|_ranman_: both are --retry   :)11:15
opi^work|trey|: it's just an example ;-)11:16
_ranman_no -f is no retry, just --follow..11:16
_ranman_opi started a new discussion..11:16
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opi^worksorry, I shouldn't form topics ;)11:16
_ranman_At least it is not about KDE..11:16
|trey|opi^work: its quite alright @ this time of day  :)11:16
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=== |trey| coughs
|trey|LoneTech: need help?11:18
calchell if log files were in XML there would never be any problems to log anymore since XML solves everything ;)11:18
opi^workcalc: it even do my dishes11:19
LoneTechnot really. I just noticed a detail in the wiki I was wondering about..11:19
opi^workcalc: take dog on walk11:19
_ranman_XML solved my marriage problems..11:19
hazmathow does debian deal with a package if you've changed aa package's existing configuration? for example some files under /etc11:19
jblackcalc: If logs were in xml, and all the problems were solved, then we wouldn't need logs any more.11:19
opi^workhazmat: asks11:19
|trey|ugh @ ubuntu not supporting gstreamer-mad too  [angryface] 11:19
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opi^workhazmat: do you want to keep old, install new, see diffs11:19
_ranman_hazmat:It will ask if you wish to replace or keep the new config..11:20
calcjblack: so lets just get rid of logging! :)11:20
hazmatcool, thanks11:20
LoneTechthe warty "supported seed" page calls setserial old. It's a rather essential tool on my laptop, as the IR port must be disabled with setserial for the FIR module to load. If there isn't a replacement for setserial I'd like to see it remain.11:20
crimsun|trey|: true, but one can get by with universe ;)11:20
|trey|damnit... why can Debian keep mp3 support, but no one else dare? Debian has a reputation of being the most anal distro around about such topics11:20
jblackcalc: Yeah! Why not! Nobody reads 'em anyways. :)11:20
opi^workcalc: yeah, let's log to /dev/null11:20
opi^workor, better /dev/audio11:20
opi^workyou could dance to hackers ;)11:20
jblackHeh. "My computer sounds sweet!"11:20
_ranman_jblack needs to get out more..11:21
|trey|crimsun: I suppose, but Ubuntu will now share Fedora's bad wrap on the subject... yay11:21
calc|trey|: Debian takes the stand that since everything is covered by patents, only get rid of things that are being actively enforced11:21
jblackranman: Working at home is a very solitary thing.11:21
calcand mp3 playback is not actively enforced11:21
calcmp3 encoding is and thus lame is not in debian11:21
_ranman_haha, ic..11:22
jblackranman: But its worth it. 11:22
lypanovgnome2 is all soo cuuteeee11:22
lypanov|trey|: what were the 3 pkgs i needed to install?11:22
lypanovtotem-xine crashes on me :(11:22
lypanovmplayer won't go full screen when i press f :(11:23
|trey|calc: makes sense, but still annoying from a user perspective... oh well, if they get EVERYTHING that users install from the non-free realm (java flash all codecs etc) then it will appease us  :)11:23
|trey|lypanov: totem-xine ffmpeg w32codecs11:23
calcaiui valgrind is heavily covered by patents but fedora includes it (from what i remember)11:24
|trey|realsm *into universe11:24
calcand now java is patented so we need to rip all of that out11:24
nateyow, 54 MB of updates since yesterday11:24
LoneTecherm, reacting differently to repeated presses of a button is patented too.11:24
natedoes that sound right?11:24
jblack(re: ubuntu) : 05:24 < kernel_panic> not trying to blab so much but  i installed it in vmware and i11:24
jblack                      have to say it was fast as hell even in there11:25
|trey|calc: Fedora is starting to get more and more java packages... all compiled with gcj... wonder if that includes a useful (read works with browsers) jre?11:25
|trey|LoneTech: wtf?11:26
natehmm, where's kaffe at these days?11:26
_ranman_trey: that is old news... 11:26
|trey|_ranman_: blah... read the question part.11:26
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|trey|ugh, second user using a kde irc client I have seen  [pissedoffface] 11:27
|trey|[confusedface] 11:28
LoneTechI guess those tags are replaced with pictures in some client?11:28
|trey|_ranman_: ps, I don't recall them including any java packages in FC2, so its still a new thing...11:28
|trey|LoneTech: what tags?11:29
LoneTechthose you output: pissedoffface, confusedface.  within [ and ] 11:29
mjrIIRC there's a gcj(gci?)-browser-plugin but it didn't do any bytecode verifying last I checked so not that useful. (Might've changed, I dunno)11:29
|trey|LoneTech: mine? umm, no, hence the discriptive nature... >:-\ isn't peticularly enlightening to me  :/11:29
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=== |trey| thinks its funny that he might be teaching a class he recently took (linux admin) in the near future... granted he already knew what was taught, but still funny...
|trey|(got a 97% in the class, 3 points dropped cuz of attendance...11:32
_ranman_trey: my comment before was in regards to the clicking...11:32
|trey|_ranman_: oh... blah11:32
Iorekhey all...anybody know how to install some win codecs?11:32
|trey|Iorek: go to apt-get.org... search for w32codecs... get it from the source that states "marillat"11:33
lypanovIorek: apt-get install win32codecs11:33
lypanov"deb ftp://ftp.nerim.net/debian-marillat unstable main"11:33
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|trey|lypanov: w32codecs*11:33
lypanovoops yer11:33
lypanovi installed the right one at least :P11:34
Iorektrey, lypanov, thanks ;)11:34
lypanovnot nice :(11:34
|trey|Iorek: lazy bastard  ;)11:34
lypanovThe program 'totem' received an X Window System error.11:34
lypanovThis probably reflects a bug in the program.11:34
lypanovThe error was 'BadAlloc (insufficient resources for operation)'.11:34
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lypanovtotem crashes :(11:34
lypanovmplayer doesn't work :(11:34
_ranman_That is what totem, is supposed to do right?11:35
|trey|lypanov: mplayer-nogui?11:35
Iorektrey I'm LEARNING :P11:35
nateWhen does Warty go gold?11:35
|trey|nate: late October (28th I think)11:35
IorekOctober 20th11:35
nateguess we're going to give it a pretty good shakedown then11:35
Ioreksaid 20th on distrowatch, I think. Could be 28th :)11:35
|trey|Iorek: no, thats when final freeze occures... released almost a week later (anyone that wants to explain that please try)11:35
nateI wonder if I would be insane to consider running it on my primary home machine then11:35
LoneTechI have yet to see gstreamer work properly :(11:35
nateoh wait I already am11:36
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|trey|LoneTech: haven't used Rhythmbox?11:36
lypanovLoneTech: tried the gst-register line?11:36
=== lypanov wonders why it doesn't call gst-register in configure stage of apt-get install...
Iorekmarillat.free.fr could not be found. Grumble11:36
|trey|LoneTech: wait, you were the poor sole who installed after gstreamer0.8-mad was moved to universe huh?11:37
lypanovIorek: use mine then. that works :)11:37
Iorekhehe okay11:37
|trey|Iorek: use what lypanov said.11:37
Iorekhehe okay (bis) :P11:37
|trey|His repo gets moved a lot.11:37
crimsundon't use that, use the nerim.net mirror11:37
|trey|deb ftp://ftp.nerim.net/debian-marillat unstable main11:37
LoneTechactually, the one machine that I have currently running ubuntu isn't powerful enough for me to try it again right now.11:37
|trey|crimsun: its not a mirror, its the new home  ;)11:37
|trey|idgi, thats what I said?11:38
|trey|Still not a mirror though, if the old site doesn't exist, its not being mirrored  :)11:38
LoneTechI shouldn't be using ubuntu on that box, but haven't bothered tuning it since.11:38
=== |trey| likes arguing, forgive him, he knows not what he do
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|trey|LoneTech: bah, I usually have sid installed on this box... Ubuntu is comparible with Sarge atm11:39
|trey|Which probably means nothing, but trust me, you're not being very risky...11:39
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crimsunubuntu is a step off the risk path of Sid11:40
LoneTechit's just too slow11:41
|trey|crimsun: I disagree, the packages have been worked on for longer then those in sarge in most cases11:41
IorekI like yeling to other people that I'm using UBUNTU on my PC....11:41
lypanovxv is fucked here11:41
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lypanovfinally i found out whats wrong with xine :)11:41
|trey|crimsun: if you have more then one ubuntu install, try dist-upgrading to sarge... most packages are upgraded11:41
jblackiorek: Yeah, the guys in Dalnet #Linux are getting tired of me. 11:42
lypanov-vo x11 -zoom works :>11:42
LoneTechI run Sid normally, but this ubuntu installed a gnome setup. not the best thing for a MediaGX 266MHz with 61MB RAM.11:42
jblacky y y y y . 11:42
=== |trey| tried it, got a broken box...
|trey|hence his first reinstall  :)11:42
Iorekjblack: *grin* I do it in real life :P11:42
LoneTechlypanov: aren't those mplayer switches?11:42
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Iorekthere, codecs. I can watch porn again11:43
IorekI mean11:43
IorekUkranian movies11:43
|trey|lypanov: 'f' is handy... full screen zoom  :011:43
Iorekhighly cultural11:43
crimsun|trey|: thanks but no thanks, i tend to dislike reinstalling. Even if it is only 8 minutes. ;)11:43
lypanov|trey|: i'm a year long mplayer user :P11:43
lypanov|trey|: mplayer rox :>11:43
|trey|crimsun: well, just take my word for it then  :)11:43
lypanov|trey|: i also used it on windows. the port is awesome11:43
LoneTechmplayer -vo x11 is much like xine -V xshm. haven't tried xine over networked X11 though.11:44
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|trey|lypanov: thats the funny thing whenever I install windows... most of their components get switched out with my usual apps  :)11:44
LoneTechI prefer the design of xine-lib personally11:45
|trey|LoneTech: ehh... its useless if it doesn't play nice with your codecs though...11:45
|trey| I prefer whichever I need to play least with...11:45
Iorekumm, is there a way t opoint totem to these codecs or do I have to install xine? :)11:45
|trey|Whichever one plays a .mpg first is the winner each time I reinstall  :)11:45
lypanovIorek: install totem-xine11:46
Iorekokay :)11:46
lypanov|trey|: yup :) mplayer just kicks ass :>11:46
LoneTechmpg? all of them should do that fine without extra codecs11:46
natewhy is my Synaptic downloading mozilla-firefox-0.99+1.0PR.1-0ubuntu1 again?11:46
lypanov|trey|: the arrow keys are sooooooo useful11:46
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nateaccording to aptitude, that's the version I already have installed11:46
|trey|lypanov: the devs suck though... hence why I don't really care whats used...11:46
crimsunnate: you sure?11:46
nateno, not sure11:46
crimsunnate: note PR.111:46
natepossibly aptitude is reporting what's in the repository, not what's on my machine?11:47
|trey|nate: no11:47
natewhat's the Debian way of doing an rpm -q package?11:47
|trey|nate: its a new version, just go with it11:47
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LoneTechdpkg -l package?11:47
crimsunnate: again, note the PR.111:47
Ioreklypanov: hmh. Weird error message here. Says another package refers to totem-xine but it can't find the package itseff11:47
olojoHi there, I just installed Ubuntu and want to check the "synchronize clock.." setting in "Time and date settings". An error "NTP Support not running" appears, is installing ntp-simple through synaptic the "right thing(tm)" to do? the package ntp is already installed.11:48
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|trey|Iorek: add "universe" to the end of your first deb line in sources.list that looks like a website11:48
nateright, so I was doing an 'aptitude show' which was showing the repository version not the local one11:49
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|trey|nate: yes11:49
_ranman_olojo:ntp is not running.. 11:49
nateOh right, of course, that's Firefox 0.10.111:49
_ranman_olojo: start the daemon...11:49
olojo_ranman_: where's it to be found? neither ntp nor ntpd at least.11:50
crimsunntp-server ?11:51
ik5pvx/etc/init.d/ntp-server start11:51
Iorekgreat, that worked. Well, one works, the other one just gives sound...11:51
|trey|olojo: ntp-server needs to be installed, check that... /etc/init.d/ntp-server start11:51
_ranman_hmmm, I do not run it.. check /etc/init.d or /etc/xinet.d/11:52
jblackOh. Life just got better. http://www.uglypeople.com11:52
_ranman_hmmm forget the /etc/xinet.d/ hah11:52
olojontp-server shouldn't be needed, should it? 11:52
|trey|olojo: yes11:52
crimsunolojo: for most people it's not necessary11:52
|trey|else we wouldn't have told you to start it11:52
|trey|crimsun: it is if you want ntp to work  :/11:52
LoneTechthe ntp server is the program that keeps your clock in sync. if you only want one-shot syncs, ntpdate can do that.11:53
|trey|crimsun: no synchronization occurs if that server is not started11:53
lypanovhow do i disable a service?11:53
olojoLoneTech: thanks, exactly the answer i neede.11:53
lypanove.g, i don't need raid or lvm stuff. but its starting on bootup11:53
lypanovhow to disable?11:53
|trey|lypanov: /etc/init.d/something stop11:53
micX54mb to upgrade. ubuntu is nearly as bad as unstable at the moment :)11:53
lypanov|trey|: forever :)11:54
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crimsun|trey|: interesting, it's not installed here.11:54
|trey|lypanov: update-rc.d11:54
|trey|crimsun: then install it  ;)11:54
sanitariohi, anyone got problems logging in to gnome after upgrading today? 11:54
crimsun|trey|: no need. we provide a stratum 211:54
|trey|crimsun: I think, during boot, ntpdate is ran11:54
crimsunit is.11:54
micXsanitario, dunno, just upgrading...11:54
|trey|crimsun: wtf is a stratum 2?11:55
nateanyone getting 'kernel: disabling IRQ #10' errors?11:55
crimsuntier 2 time server11:55
sanitarioI can login using gdm, but gnome won't start11:55
|trey|crimsun: someone should put a timeout on that though... doesn't ever work for me  :/11:55
|trey|crimsun: ohhh... still not enlightened  :(11:55
_ranman_sanitario: I upgraded this morning (7 hours ago).. Gnome was all screwed up.. Firefox died.. My wife left me...11:55
micXsanitario, thanks for the tip, I will refrain from logging out :)11:55
|trey|_ranman_: umm, ouch... bad day then?11:55
_ranman_oops, forget the wife statement..11:56
olojoi suppose i need to fill in a NTP-server in some config somewhere? i installed ntp-server but the service won't start (FAIL)11:56
|trey|_ranman_: wishful thinking?11:56
sanitariomicX: yes, try to do that11:56
crimsun|trey|: http://www.eecis.udel.edu/~mills/ntp.html11:56
topylii don't think |trey| was referring to the wife but gnome :)11:56
micXolojo, are you trying to be a time server?11:56
|trey|topyli: you think wrong...11:56
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_ranman_topyli: It was a really bad upgrade...11:57
olojomicX: no, trying to start an server to automatically keep my clock in sync.11:57
|trey|micX: thats not what ntp-server does, despite its name11:57
topyliwifes come ang go, but gnome should work11:57
micXolojo, well, I don't think u need ntp-server then...11:57
_ranman_Yes, gnome is more reliable than sex with the wife... sigh...11:57
|trey|topyli: blah... I can reinstall gnome... my penis yells at me if it doesn't get action on a regular basis11:58
|trey|Certainly no using GNOME when it wants action  :/11:58
micXolojo, it's in /etc/default/ntp-servers I think11:58
|trey|olojo: if you 'dpkg-reconfigure debconf' and have it ask you 'low' priority messages... it would have asked you to enter a ntp server to sync with  :/11:59
|trey|Ubuntu sets this to "high" if I recall... kinda annoying when you're used to being in control...12:00
|trey|Might even be critical...12:00
micXolojo, well, it is on my debian box, not in ubuntu though... (looking)12:01
|trey|_ranman_: I'm sorry to hear that btw... the joys of being 20  :)12:01
|trey|micX: it will be the same place..12:01
=== smeggy nods in agreement with |trey|
micXolojo, it's in /etc/default/ntpdate12:01
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|trey|micX: wrong file though, I can't be held responsible for that  ;)12:02
olojotrey: i had medium for sarge, will change it. ntpdate is already configured ok.12:03
olojoactually, ntp-server seem to only wrap around ntpd, whose config is in /etc/ntp.conf . oh well12:04
|trey|olojo: low basically asks you everything the maintainer has set as a question...12:05
=== lypanov is now known as lyp|lunch
|trey|olojo: yes, ntp-server is a wrapper for ntpd, I think that is the location I set things at (logically, I always look for somethingiwanttochange.conf)12:06
Iorekah, btw, is there a giFT frontend for gnome?12:07
Iorekthat works on Ubuntu?12:07
|trey|Iorek: yes... in universe even perhaps... giftoxic12:07
olojotrey, micx: now i have both ntpdate running on each bootup and ntpd running as a service. gnome "Time and date settings" seem to not find it anyways (same error on checking checkbox), but whattaheck ;)12:07
|trey|giFT hates me though, so I never saw it work  :/12:07
olojothanks for the help12:07
Iorektrey got it working in suse and apollon, but took me some time12:08
|trey|Iorek: mostly attempted with apollon also... tried giftoxic, saw same errors, removed...12:08
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|trey|Interface is very gnome-esc12:08
|trey|ie kinda useless, but allows you to do what you want when it works  :/12:09
=== |trey| isn't a huge fan of the HIG :/
=== |trey| thinks it goes about recommending everything he likes in apps not be used...
|trey|For instance, it states apps shouldn't use tabs... grrrrrrr12:10
|trey|although it would seem thats been pretty much ignored, thank god12:10
micXolojo, np. glad to help...:)12:11
Iorektrey hear hear12:11
Iorekno fasttrack plugin12:11
JisaoJust finished installing Ubuntu.  Nice. Is there a way to put a graphic image to the boot screen?12:13
Iorekit's somewhere in Ubuntu artwork12:14
Iorekthey provide a nice splash screen, plus insstructions12:14
Jisaook.  I saw that package unpack.  Will have to find my way around it.12:14
_ranman_Ubuntu has the grub patch?12:14
Iorekno no, hold on12:14
_ranman_patch for the graphical boot...12:14
_ranman_other than just color..12:14
=== nate likes his text-mode boot sequence just fine, thank you
Iorek"Grub Logo background"12:15
JisaoIt installed in 65 minutes, including the time I used to figure out the partitioner so I would not destroy anything on hda (I installed on hdb)12:15
natea computer that hides its boot process from me is one that could be plotting my imminent demise12:15
Ioreknate: F2 ;)12:16
Jisaoit's fine with me, other than being to fast on the 3 - 2 - 1.12:16
JisaoAnyway, got to go, work awaits.  But I wanted to check the #ubuntu channel before I left.  Tx12:18
_ranman_where is trey? Seems late for the western world...12:18
|trey|_ranman_: Arizona12:19
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|trey|And yes... its 3:20 am12:19
_ranman_hmmm, ic said the blind man...12:19
_ranman_You do not sleep?12:19
natesleep is for the zzzs12:19
|trey|I do... just kinda nocturnal  :)12:19
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hypatiaAny epiphany users about?12:20
_ranman_ic.. oh well I remember when I was your age, I only slept 1 hour a night..12:20
|trey|hypatia: use firefox or feel my wrath12:20
hypatiaI want to ask about adding javascript bookmarklets so that they actually pop up, rather than open over the top of the current page12:20
|trey|_ranman_: oh, I get pleanty of sleep... just rarely at normal hours  :)12:20
hypatia|trey|: hack on it so that it stops crashing all the time, or feel my wrath12:20
smeggyhey hypatia12:21
smeggyi cant help you12:21
smeggybut i wanna know something12:21
smeggyand this isnt being a pain im serious12:21
|trey|hypatia: try the new upload  :/12:21
smeggywhy do you choose to use it over firefox?12:21
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|trey|smeggy: apparently because firefox keeps crashing  :/12:21
hypatiasmeggy: because firefox crashes all the time12:21
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smeggy!! meh12:21
smeggylies ;)12:21
hypatiasmeggy: because it has the location bar hiding interface12:21
natefirefox crashes?12:22
|trey|hypatia: I would rather reopen firefox then install epiphany though  :/12:22
Iorekhmmmh...hotplugging my usb-stick still doesn't work12:22
=== nate hasn't managed to make it do that so far
hypatiaand because epiphany saves the current session if it crashes (which it does, but less frequently than firefox)12:22
|trey|I hate the concept of installing 2 browsers to use one  :/12:22
hypatiaI just lost 40 tabs, so I'm a bit fed up with firefox.12:22
=== smeggy installs epiphany to see whats changed since he last used it
nate40? yow12:22
_ranman_trey, a billion windoze users can't be wrong..12:22
micXfirefox crashes frequently ? ? ?12:22
hypatiaAlso, firefox regularly gets into a state where the keybindings (Ctrl+Q, Ctrl+W) stop working12:23
smeggyi gotta say one thing12:23
smeggyunfortunately firefox seems best on windows12:23
smeggythan any other platform heh12:23
|trey|_ranman_: huh? the fact that they are using winblows discredits their opinion to start with...12:23
natesay hmm12:23
nateI like it on Linux12:23
hypatiaAlso, it sometimes looses the ability to paste into textboxes, and the find-as-you-type thing sometimes activates at random while I'm typing in *a text box*12:23
hypatiaSo, firefox is not kind to me.12:23
=== micX 's firefox uptime is better than most windows boxes
nateyes, the default theme looks XP-ish, but I don't mind. It's pretty.12:24
|trey|hypatia: still doesn't make you install another browser to use it  [shrug] 12:24
hypatiamicX: yes, it crashes after three or four hours of use for me.12:24
_ranman_hmmm, my firefox died after last upgrade....12:24
|trey|nate: there is an industrial theme for firefox... I use that...12:24
_ranman_have to use galeon...12:24
natecan't say I've had the same problems with it12:24
hypatia|trey|: I'm not trying to convince everyone else, I'm trying to justify something that seems incredible to everyone here.12:24
hypatia|trey|: and now I'll stop12:24
|trey|hypatia: good job12:24
|trey|hypatia: try #gnome... they appear to like epiphany  :)12:24
micXhypatia, weird. must be having 40 tabs or something. I have a sid box upstairs that has about a dozen tabs for a month.12:25
|trey|hypatia: every gnome based distro replaces epiphany... there is a reason for that  :)12:25
hypatia|trey|: ok, well, since you guys are so keen to have me using firefox...12:26
hypatia1. how do I get it to stay up>12:26
LoneTechI much prefer Galeon personally.12:26
hypatia2. how do I get it to remember the session when it crashes? (there's one extension for it, but it also crashes firefox)12:26
_ranman_I rather dislike Galeon after they started the recoding for GTK 212:26
IorekUbuntu is already 60th on Distrowatch...in two months it'll have replaced Mandrake as the most popular distro!12:26
Iorekmaybe :P12:26
hypatia3. what do I do when it stops responding to keybindings?12:26
|trey|hypatia: umm... mines been running for *checks uptime* 4 days12:26
nate60th, hmm?12:26
micXhypatia, I read some spam about that. quick delivery too.12:26
LoneTechthough recently it seems to have problems with unicode conversions and finding itself12:26
natewhat did it start at?12:26
hypatia4. what do I do when it doesn't let me copy out of it12:27
hypatia5. what do I do when it doesn't let me copy into it?12:27
Ioreknate nowhere. But couple of days after the release it was 100th12:27
LoneTech_ranman_: it took a while before the core features returned. still missing some of the session handling, or I just haven't found it.12:27
Iorekbeen on the rise every day12:27
_ranman_hypatia is having major problems with firefox... Sounds like no memory...12:27
hypatiaHmmm, looks like in some cases javascript bookmarklets actually mork in epiphany, so maybe the question is moot12:28
hypatia_ranman_: are you talking neural or hardware? hardware I have 512MB12:28
_ranman_haha, maybe both... 12:28
nateAfter applying the latest updates from Synaptic, I'm being prompted for my video card12:28
_ranman_I seem to have problems similar with X becomes too bogged..12:28
nateheck if I know what it is, it's an onboard flavour-of-the-week12:28
natetime to see if Device Manager works12:29
micXnate, I'm at 96% upgrade...12:29
nateoh good it is a Trident12:29
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smeggynate, cat /etc/X11/XF86Config and see what the original one said if that doesnt work.12:29
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LoneTechthat's the one via epia has, isn't it?12:30
sanitariohuh, a reboot fixed gnome. 12:30
nateit suggested Trident but I wasn't sure why it wanted my confirmation12:30
Ioreksanitario: it becomes more like Windows!12:30
sanitarioIorek, sadly12:30
Iorekwell, actually, no amount of reboots ever fixed windows...12:31
=== nate is still a little skittish about .debs, not quite knowing if they work the same way as .rpms
smeggyIorek, untrue, reboot with a Linux distro of your choice CD1 in your optical drive ;)12:31
micXnate, heh I have that trident screen up now. we must have similar boxen...12:31
opi^worknate: better12:31
sanitarioIorek, too true ... 12:31
opi^worknate: they can resolve deps12:31
opi^worknate: watch for config files12:32
Ioreksmeggy I always love the look on people's faces when I boot their borked winbox with Mandrake Move...12:32
opi^worknate: there's dist-upgrde 12:32
smeggyIorek, nice one lol12:32
|trey|Iorek: a deb in simplest description: preinst script... tar.gz file... postinst script... pre checks deps... tar.gz is the app + patches usually, post is config12:32
natemodern .rpm systems can resolve dependencies now, with yum12:32
natebut that's fairly recent12:32
micXnate, are you doing anything different at boot with acpi ?12:33
nateit's the 'installing a .deb causes it to possibly wait for user input with configuration questions' thing that I find unexpected12:33
|trey|nate: they could with urpmi, up2date, yast-packagemanager, red carpet etc for a while...12:33
nateoh right, Red Carpet, I'd forgotten about that12:33
opi^worknate: debs can configure before being installed12:33
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opi^worknate: imagine, it's oftpd12:34
opi^worknate: when you apt-get it it will ask for12:34
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opi^worknate: port, user, and workdir12:34
deFrysknate, yum originates from yellow dog linux , and is not the only rpm installer/updater wich resolves deps12:34
|trey|nate: thats debconfs doing... its configures packages so its at least usable in YOUR environment...12:34
Iorekand then I have to explain that PC does NOT equal WIN95...no, I don't care how much you know about PCs...or claim to know...YES it is possible to run a PC without windows...NO sir, your pc is actually the grey box, not the screen...12:34
opi^worknate: same goes with SMTP12:34
|trey|nate: asking is better then guessing imo12:34
natedeFrysk: yeah, I've been mostly a Red Hat person so yum was the first autoresolving rpm updater I saw12:35
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natethough I did have a brief fling with apt12:35
micXResolved address "xml::/etc/gconf/gconf.xml.defaults" to a writable configuration source at position 012:35
natebut Synaptic wasn't terribly pleasant to use with Fedora12:35
micXuseful info. thanks apt :)12:35
natesomething about RPMs being scattered around lots of different repositories made it ugly to use. Ubuntu's seems a lot more friendly.12:36
IorekI rather like Yast....I just don't like the KDE flavour that much12:36
=== micX used apt4rpm on mandrake. convinced me to go debian.
smeggywell obviously.. it.. uh resolved that address.. to a writable configuration source at position 0!12:36
smeggyvery useful! :P12:36
LoneTechI prefer aptitude personally.12:36
nateWe've started using SuSE at work (we're a Novell shop) so I may make yast's acquaintance a bit more12:36
|trey|LoneTech: aptitude = apt-get for people that hate themselves12:37
IorekSuse's the one that enabled me to switch12:37
Ioreklearned a lot12:37
sanitarioso noone uses synaptic? 12:37
natewhich is recommended to use, aptitude or apt-get?12:37
smeggyI do.12:37
nateI use Synaptic myself12:37
Ioreksanitario: it's apt-get, isn't it? ;)12:37
|trey|sanitario: nah... makes life harder  :/12:37
micXnate, are you doing anything different at boot with acpi ? (repeat Q)12:37
micXapt-get here.12:37
LoneTechit's the orphan feature and new/obsolete listings I like.12:37
LoneTechand that it's so much faster than dselect12:38
natemicX: why are you asking me? oh, is that about the IRQ error I mentioned way back?12:38
|trey|Iorek: no... synaptic, gnome-apt, kpackage (the deb version), apt-get etc all are frontends for dpkg-deb12:38
micXyesterday, or so. we both have similar hw12:38
Iorektrey ah, didn't know that :)12:38
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Iorekby the way, in Ubuntu the "history" plugin in Gaim does absolutely nothing12:39
|trey|missed out aptitude and dselect... but yeah, you get the idea  :)12:39
natewhat's gnome-apt like?12:39
sanitarioIorek, well, yes? 12:39
|trey|Iorek: umm, yeah it does, turn on logging...12:39
sanitariosort of. 12:39
sanitario|trey|, harder, in what way? 12:39
nateis there a way to apply .debs silently? I assume there is, as that would be an essential feature for admining a server, and Debian seems to be used for that a lot.12:40
Iorektrey I check "history", but no new submeny of "plugins" appears so I can't check logging :)12:40
|trey|sanitario: as in I have to play with a ui, or stop it from bringing along suggests and recommends all the time12:40
|trey|apt-get + apt-cache = just easier in every way.12:40
LoneTechnate: you can tweak the priority of questions to ask for debconf, and have it use different interfaces. I believe one uses email. Not so sure about the config file replacements though12:41
LoneTechI haven't looked into non-interactive updates much12:41
sanitario|trey|, ah, I can see your point about the gui, but I really think it's nice for first-time users12:41
sanitarioat least it seems to be12:41
natebut no way to do it completely automagically for a remote server?12:41
_ranman_trey: I have to agree with you for when you have a full system already installed...12:41
LoneTechyou *can*, but that means assuming answers to those questions.12:41
natewell, sure12:41
micXnate, google use an upgrade system based on apt and remote automatic upgrading.12:42
LoneTechI'm not sure how though.12:42
|trey|sanitario: they were my biggest hurdles when I started using debian...12:42
nateI would have assumed that it would leave config settings exactly unchanged12:42
|trey|When I discovered apt-get, I became addicted12:42
nateif upgrading12:42
LoneTechit's fairly easy to clone debconf replies and package selections12:42
micXnate, there was atalk at LCA in Adelaide about it.12:42
|trey|If that tool didn't exist, I would never consider Debian12:42
natethat's why I was very suprised when I got prompted when upgrading12:42
natesince that's not a thing RPM ever does12:42
sanitario|trey|, same here. apt-get + apt-cache + auto-apt is pure love12:43
vrlnwhat's auto-apt?12:43
LoneTechnate: yes, ordinarily. but debconf will ask *new* questions, and if a config file was altered locally and between package versions, that needs to be resolved.12:43
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nateIs that because Debian allows you to do a complete seamless upgrade, whereas RPM systems usually have break-points between major releases?12:43
LoneTechwhen I compared them at first RPM had no concept of a config file; it quietly overwrote anything I had changed. I expect that is no longer the case.12:43
Iorekthat'll teach me to click "History" 25 times in one second :P12:43
|trey|sanitario: auto-apt hates me... I just use the us mirror and the berkeley mirror... never slower then 500kb/s12:44
|trey|umm, ignore that...12:44
|trey|vrln: auto-apt installs packages that provide something you try to do...12:44
LoneTechnate: pretty much, I guess12:44
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nateLoneTech: depends how the RPM is written. I think the current best practice is to create a '.rpmnew' file with new settings if the old one exists12:44
|trey|so if you type lsof, but its not installed, auto-apt will install it12:44
LoneTechright. that's what debian does if you answer to keep your old config.12:44
vrlnnice to know, I'll check it out :) thanks12:45
LoneTechwrites a .dpkg-new version12:45
natebut since I've never really trusted RPM to upgrade from one major Red Hat / Fedora release to another, I've always done complete system erases and rebuilds, which is kind of a pain12:45
LoneTechcertainly is.12:45
|trey|vrln: also, apt-file is also nice... searches database for something that provides a file you might need...12:45
|trey|vrln: very useful when compiling things12:46
sanitariovrln, be sure to check out auto-apt search <file>12:46
sanitario|trey|, you can do that with auto-apt also12:46
LoneTechbut coming from debian, I was really surprised when Xandros, a debian-based distro, expected people to do this "install the new version by booting the CD" routine12:46
|trey|sanitario: ahh... k... didn't know that  :)12:46
nateHow many Debian spinoffs have there been so far?12:46
Ioreka lot12:46
natefor some reason Ubuntu is the first that's caught my eye12:47
|trey|nate: last I counted... 3412:47
IorekXandros is Debian12:47
nateyeah, and UserLinux12:47
jblackProgeny. :) 12:47
LoneTechdebian.org has a list of a few iirc12:47
|trey|about 15 of which are actually Knoppix spinoffs, but ok...12:47
lyp|lunchubuntu is my reason to switch back to linux from windows12:47
nateOh right, Knoppix, I have played with that. Debian without noticing.12:47
lyp|lunchso it must be pretty impressive :P12:47
=== lyp|lunch is now known as lypanov
natenot that installing packages comes into it on Knoppix12:47
Iorektrey does the whole "minimised windows flashes" work with you in Gaim? :)12:47
micXcensornet, knoppix, etc. etc.12:48
|trey|jblack: blah... sure Ian works there, but I don't like Progeny... trying to make my sources.list huge doesn't sit well with me  :/12:48
nateI think Ubuntu is going to bring a whole bunch of people to Debian12:48
|trey|nate: hopefully...12:48
nateI have been somewhat pissed-off with Red Hat since RHL split into Enterprise Linux and Fedora12:48
|trey|nate: that attitude is kinda moronic..12:48
|trey|if you didn't pay for rhl, you use fedora... if you did you use rhel... not that hard to figure out...12:49
natebut the problem is they are now no longer the same product12:49
natethere is no guarantee that by playing with Fedora you have any idea what's in RHEL12:49
|trey|How is that a problem?12:49
Iorektried to install Fedora....FC1, one year ago. distro's have improved a LOT since then12:49
nateso, hence, no real reason to use a Red Hat-like distro at home12:49
natewhich was my main reason for 'sticking with the market leader'12:50
|trey|nate: umm, thats just not true... FC 3 == RHEL4 + value added stuff (application server etc)12:50
LoneTechmuch like mozilla-netscape, openoffice-staroffice and such pairings..12:50
natethat's nice, but I don't really care any longer12:50
nateI don't feel I have any 'brand loyalty' to Fedora unless it's a good home distro12:51
|trey|LoneTech: not really, they are fair closer then either of those examples...12:51
Iorekthe whole red hat thing didn't bother me...I just don't like Fedora's look n feel12:51
|trey|nate: which it is.12:51
nateUbuntu feels better for me12:51
nateFedora 3 may be okay12:51
Iorekit'll still have the hat12:51
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|trey|nate: your argument is not valid at all... although the fact that people like you exist is proof that they went about it wrong...12:52
IorekI don't want to click a hat or a lizard12:52
IorekI want to click a FOOT12:52
nateThey also lost me at Fedora 212:52
micXredhat's ok. I just dont want to run it.12:52
LoneTechnot a K?12:52
|trey|Iorek: then change the icon theme12:52
natethe reason I didn't upgrade is that when it came out, it was not compatible with the nVidia binary drivers12:52
Ioreknah, I replaced the K in Suse with a penguin :)12:52
Iorektrey I did ;)12:52
nateand when asked about it they said 'meh, we don't care'12:52
nateso, well, shrug12:52
LoneTechoddly, mom got confused by that point. She didn't know how to start things, never ocurred to her to try the same place as windows12:52
natemind you, I'm not sure if Ubuntu is either...12:53
nateif it isn't I may end up not putting it on my main box12:53
|trey|nate: their attitude is such that if people are THAT confused, perhaps they will think they now HAVE to pay, and will, they make money, oh well...12:53
natesure, if it works for them that's great. I wish them well.12:53
|trey|nate: but they have always stated that RHEL will be a slimmed down version of Fedora with value added features...12:53
natethey've stated, I believe, that RHEL will be 'based on' Fedora technology in some vaguely unspecified manner12:54
|trey|ie xfce4 won't be included12:54
vrlnand 5 years of security support iirc12:54
IorekMS Linux12:55
IorekI'd try it12:55
LoneTechnah, but Digital Research.. oh wait, I did that already.12:55
|trey|nate: umm, their customizations will remain, their config tools will remain, everything will remain, except they won't include all packages, and they will include things like java, realplayer (instead of helix), application server, directory server, things like this... plus you get support...12:55
nateI guess I just feel that if the Linux I use at home isn't going to be *identical* to the Linux I use at work, I'd rather have a home Linux that is customised for the home.12:55
LoneTechany other non-proud Network Desktop 1.0 owners here?12:56
Iorek? :)12:56
Iorekno :)12:56
|trey|nate: umm, fedora is customized for the home...12:56
LoneTechhave any of you even heard of Wabi then?12:56
nateNot really.12:56
nateIt doesn't have any multimedia stuff12:56
Mithrandirnate: we ship the nvidia drivers, though.12:57
|trey|nate: it actually does, check out Red Hat Desktop sometime  :/12:57
nateWhat is Red Hat Desktop?12:57
Iorekinstalling mp3 support is rather easy too12:57
nateoh, RHEL Desktop?12:57
nateer, RHEL Workstation or whatever?12:57
|trey|nate: no, redhat desktop12:57
natewhat is that?12:58
|trey|not rhel ws12:58
|trey|its a desktop product that has support12:58
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nateokay, now I'm officially confused12:58
natethis is yet another fork of Red Hat?12:58
natea non RHEL, non Fedora third distro?12:58
LoneTechdidn't the undrop desktop or something other weird?12:58
LoneTechit seems they are being confusing.12:59
|trey|nate: rhel as - application server, rhel ws - corporate desktop, rhel es - enterprise server, rh desktop - home desktop12:59
|trey|then Fedora, free download open developement12:59
natewhen did RH Desktop come out?12:59
|trey|last year12:59
LoneTechah, and naturally "Desktop" is under the "Enterprise Linux" category.01:00
nateHow is Desktop related to Fedora and RHEL?01:00
natesame as RHEL?01:00
nateor different upgrade schedule, or what?01:00
|trey|LoneTech: yes, but its not part of its name... because then it would be confused with RHEL WS  :)01:00
natethis is what I mean. The product's fracturing into multiple confusing incompatible things.01:00
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|trey|nate: its supported, it has media codecs etc... you pay for it.01:01
nateLike Apple in the mid-90s01:01
natewhat's the price?01:01
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|trey|nate: I'm not confused... I read the site, and what the devels have to say on the matter....01:01
|trey|same as RHL01:01
|trey|< $10001:01
nateso, what's the difference between Desktop and WS?01:02
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micXerm. isn't this the ubuntu channel? Why are we discussing redhat interminably?01:03
smeggywe're nerds01:03
smeggywe could talk about Iranian Jerds if the mood struck us01:03
Iorekthat's an answer to EVERYTHING01:03
|trey|nate: umm, one is meant for home use, the other is meant as a client01:03
Iorekyeah, Iranian flavour of Linux...01:04
Iorekit probably exists01:04
|trey|micX: bring something else up... redhat is the current subject... and I'm not tired enough to attempt sleep.01:04
Iorekhow do you install a downloaded deb package? :P01:04
natelooking at this I don't see the difference between RHEL WS and Desktop01:04
|trey|micX: most normal people are asleep, no harm no foul01:04
micXdpkg -i package01:05
Iorekasleep? at 1 pm?01:05
|trey|nate: I just told you... you don't listen do you?01:05
IorekmicX: thanks :)01:05
|trey|Iorek: try 4  ;)01:05
micXIorek, you're welcome :)01:05
nate|trey|: Yes, you told me one is 'meant' for something... 'meant' doesn't mean anything to me.01:05
LoneTechnate: they didn't include the "enterprise" kernel package and less phone support. huge difference, isn't it?01:06
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|trey|LoneTech: actually, all the kernels are the same (according to the kernel hackers)01:06
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nateLess support is the only thing I can see on the comparison chart.01:06
|trey|nate: ...01:07
nateSo, hmm. For some reason I was under the impression that the boxed set had vanished.01:07
|trey|Thats really the only difference... other then what I said  :/01:07
LoneTechtrey: sure, but the official comparison list claims the "Desktop" edition doesn't support SMP or >4GB memory. that would be the old "enterprise" kernel config iirc.01:07
|trey|nate: Fedora has no box set... you have to pay for a box set  :/01:07
|trey|funk that noice01:07
Iorektrey and in your case, that's am, I presume? ;)01:07
|trey|Iorek: I already said that01:08
nateI guess 'Desktop' is sort of like Mandrake Official maybe?01:08
Iorektrey I missed it :P01:08
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=== |trey| would never buy something that is being given away enless his job depended on it, and it was someone elses money...
|trey|nate: no01:08
|trey|nate: forget mandrake... comparisons confuse people01:09
nateIt's a very confusing product line, I think.01:09
natenot easily understood at a glance01:09
nateI would have expected maybe two server variants, one workstation01:09
|trey|nate: not at all, you have just been brainwashed by the fud about it, and don't understand how corporations buy software...01:10
nateand maybe a 'Home' edition with extra glitz, such as bundled games01:10
nateWell, they did kind of fud themselves, really.01:10
|trey|nate: thats EXACTLY what they did do.. 01:10
|trey|AS and ES = server, WS = workstation... desktop = home edition01:10
nateBut 'Desktop' is a very coy kind of name. It doesn't position itself as either 'home' or 'work'. It sort of suggests a little of both, and neither.01:11
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nateat least in this comparison chart01:11
micXthe fudmeisters at redhat have played into Ubunu's hands...01:11
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|trey|micX: fudmeisters in the press*01:11
Iorekguifications works. History still doesn't. Ah well :)01:11
|trey|Iorek: TURN ON LOGGING!!!01:11
|trey|history won't work if it has nothing to print at the top of the screen01:12
Iorektrey TOLD ja, I can't :)01:12
|trey|Iorek: I don't recall, why can't you?01:12
Iorektrey normally when you heck the history plugin, a new submenu of "Plugins" appears, right?01:12
Iorekand there you can turn on logging01:12
Iorekor maybe it doesn't01:13
|trey|Iorek: blah... you're not listening... tools >> preferences >> logging >> log all instante messages01:13
|trey|then try again01:13
Iorekhey, they moved the log-preferences! :P01:13
|trey|it will work01:13
|trey|as if by magic01:13
Iorektrey you are right, I am wrong, and I humbly apologise :P01:14
|trey|Iorek: I play with GAIM more then any other program...01:14
|trey|I'm a teenager, and a lot of hot chicks bug me  8)01:14
Iorektrey in that case, there's another thing that doesn't work ;)01:14
|trey|Iorek: whats that?01:15
Iorekthe "minimised windows flash when you have a new message" thing01:15
=== |trey| thinks free should look harder
Iorekputting numbers in front of them works just fine01:15
micXchannel score: Ubuntu:217 Debian:730 redhat:74 gentoo:863 fedora:31901:15
|trey|Iorek: hmm, haven't played with that... use queing here...01:16
|trey|micX: damn, Debian is getting more and more packed all the time.01:16
Iorekmaybe it's a gnome thing, I haven't seen ANY windows flash :)01:16
|trey|nate: tell me you're kidding.01:16
|trey|nate: and I don't recommend you try it.01:16
|trey|almost certainly way over your head01:17
nateLast time I tried it it didn't compile01:17
Iorekstart installing01:17
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nate|trey| pbbbbfffft01:17
|trey|Iorek: stfu, don't tell morons to install gentoo01:17
|trey|nate: no offense01:17
nate|trey| Actually, that was pretty offensive.01:17
jblackI agree with nate. That was just plain rude01:18
IorekI always got stuck at the grub config01:18
micXnate, gentoo is ok, if you have a week or so spare :)01:18
=== |trey| had a gentoo box for about a week... got sick of waiting for updates to finish :/
nateIt seems like it should be more fun than it turned out to be01:18
|trey|jblack: I'll get over it  :/01:18
LoneTechI find grub easy, but maybe that's because I've messed with PCs since dos 2 and have actually modified grub a few times.01:18
nateOne day I may try it again01:18
Iorekone day I'll fly away...01:19
|trey|ps, it was meant to be  :/01:19
nateright, I've had about enough of that01:19
nateI think it's time I rebooted to see what the update fairy brought me01:19
natebye all01:19
micXnate, I sorta gave up on it. every time I wanted to update the machine would be grinding for hours. Be good on cable internet with a fast box, I guess.01:19
|trey|Gentoo isn't peticularly friendly to a 950 Duron  :/01:19
LoneTecheh? reboot, why?01:20
Iorekhaven't tried that much yet...year ago I knew next to nothing and couldn't get Fedore Core 1 installed/configged. Pretty obvious I couldn't get Debian to work either...:)01:20
|trey|LoneTech: my thoughts exactly  :/01:20
Iorekor Gentoo01:20
Iorekor Arch01:20
|trey|Iorek: Anaconda was my first installer for a linux distro... never had an issue with it...01:21
|trey|Mandrakes installer was pita though01:21
Iorektrey installing wasn't a problem, but installing soft was. COnfiguring the samba server was impossible for me atm01:21
|trey|Probably the most annoying installer I have witnessed.01:21
micXIorek, good to have a spare 'play' box for that stuff...01:21
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lypanovits a shame that mdk is the only distro i know that digs my laptop01:22
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lypanovwith ubuntu for example i had to add the modeline manually :(01:22
lypanovthis kinda sucks imo01:22
IorekmicX: I know, and I didn't ;) But I knew hoc to create and delete partitions01:22
|trey|lypanov: I hate that distro... for a userfriendly distro, it sure hates the fuck outta me  :/01:22
lypanov|trey|: nod01:22
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LoneTechI would have been really surprised if ubuntu had set up X right on my laptop, but I was only mildly surprised that it left me with a config that couldn't have worked anywhere.01:23
IorekI don't like it either...for some reason, when I wanted to install soft that was on the CDs, it kept spitting them out again01:23
Iorek"This is not the CD you just installed me with, fuckhead. Give me the right one"01:23
|trey|Iorek: urpmi  :/01:24
|trey|Ubuntu is the first distro in 2 years that I installed from a CD  :/01:24
Iorektrey didn't work :) Oh, and up2date in Fedora is another exercise in futility01:24
|trey|that actually worked nicely in FC1... after I converted some yum and apt repo's to its format  :/01:25
|trey|FC2 no such luck though, but yum is also improving, so whatever  :/01:25
Iorek'xactly. the normal repo sucks minotaur genitalia01:26
|trey|Most of the aesthetic changes to yum were cuz I kept saying up2date's appearence looked cleaner  :)01:26
|trey|Iorek: its the most popular distro dude... and they don't redirect to other mirrors... Debian servers would be just as bad if it didn't redirect...01:27
Iorekbut they do :)01:27
|trey|ftp.debian.org and ftp.us.debian.org etc redirect  :)01:27
Iorekwhich is the whole shish kebab01:27
|trey|Quite nice... although sometimes they get the redirecting HORRIBLY wrong  :(01:28
|trey|Iorek: I cringe when I see download speeds lower then 400kb/s  :(01:28
|trey|spoiled I tell you  :)01:28
IorekUbuntu is still small so I guess that's not a problem...01:28
Iorekquite :P01:28
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Iorekokay, food01:28
Iorekand socks01:29
Ioreksocks would be nice too01:29
|trey|haha @ stupid bitches  "you can't love her, you can't, because I love you"  *slap*01:29
|trey|"but I let you inside me, you can't love her"01:29
|trey|ne ways what were we talking about?01:29
|trey| I think its time for sleep here too  :(01:30
Ioreknight :)01:31
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lonewolffhi, is there a ubuntu php4-mysql package?01:39
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micXlonewolff, yep: php4-mysql - MySQL module for php401:40
lonewolffit doesent seem to be on the default ubuntu mirrors tho01:41
lonewolffi tried sudo apt-get install php4-mysql01:41
micXlonewolff, apt-cache search <searchstring> is your friend01:41
micXlonewolff, maybe it's in universe.01:42
lonewolffuniverse? sorry im new to apt01:43
micXyea. you have to uncomment it, in /etc/apt/sources.list01:43
lonewolffoh ok 01:43
lonewolffill do that now01:43
micXthen apt-get update01:43
micXlonewolff, it's def, in universe: Filename: pool/universe/p/php4/php4-mysql_4.3.8-3ubuntu6_i386.deb01:44
lonewolffok thanx01:44
lonewolffim just updating my apt now after uncommenting universe01:44
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imkai got a few problems02:00
joemask away02:00
imkai can't play my audio/video files02:00
imkai got mp3's in /home02:00
imkaand when i doubleclick the file it opens totem and tells me that "can not open resource for writing"02:01
imkai have sound working in tvtime02:01
imka(tv watching app)02:01
joemis this totem-gstreamer?02:01
imkait tells me the same in rhythmbox02:02
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joeminstall gstreamer-mad from universe02:03
imkait's installed02:04
seb128run gstreamer-properties02:04
seb128select the esdsink for audio02:04
seb128and try again ?02:05
imkaas root or as user?02:06
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imkano succes02:08
imkasame error02:08
seb128what does it says ?02:08
seb128esd is running ?02:08
seb128try the alsa/oss sinks and click on test02:09
imkacan not open resource for writing02:09
imka/dev/dsp: no such device02:09
seb128what's your soundcard ?02:10
imkai have sound in tvtime02:10
seb128ls /dev/dsp*02:10
imka/dev/dsp  /dev/dsp102:11
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seb128with "osssink device=/dev/dsp1" as audiosink in gstreamer-properties02:12
seb128does it work ?02:12
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imkano it doesnt02:13
imkawhat source?02:13
imkai'm installing all gstreamer plugins now02:15
seb128that's not a gstreamer problem02:15
seb128not a plugin problem at least02:15
seb128<imka> /dev/dsp: no such device02:15
seb128apparently you have a soundcard config problem02:16
imkawhat can i do?02:17
seb128do you have several soundcards ?02:18
seb128lsmod | grep snd ?02:18
imkasnd_via82xx            26660  102:19
imkasnd_ac97_codec         59268  1 snd_via82xx02:19
imkasnd_mpu401_uart         7296  1 snd_via82xx02:19
imkasnd_rawmidi            23232  1 snd_mpu401_uart02:19
imkasnd_seq_device          7944  1 snd_rawmidi02:19
imkasnd_bt87x              13640  102:19
imkasnd_pcm_oss            48168  002:19
imkasnd_mixer_oss          16640  3 snd_pcm_oss02:19
imkasnd_pcm                85540  3 snd_via82xx,snd_bt87x,snd_pcm_oss02:19
imkasnd_timer              23172  1 snd_pcm02:19
imkasnd                    50660  10 snd_via82xx,snd_ac97_codec,snd_mpu401_uart,snd_rawmidi,snd_seq_device,snd_bt87x,snd_pcm_oss,snd_mixer_oss,snd_pcm,snd_timer02:19
imkasnd_page_alloc         11144  3 snd_via82xx,snd_bt87x,snd_pcm02:19
imkasoundcore               9824  4 snd,bttv02:19
imkagameport                4736  2 snd_via82xx,analog02:19
imkai have a tvcard if that matters02:19
imkasorry for flooding02:20
petemci just put an aic7xxx pci scsi adapter in my ubuntu box and it segfaults on boot02:20
jblackanybody have an ubuntu torrent ? 02:21
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housetierjblack, http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily/current/02:22
HcEjblack: http://wiki.ubuntulinux.org/Archive02:23
seb128imka: "cat /dev/random > /dev/dsp1" makes some sound ?02:23
imkaseb128 no02:25
imkaseb128 it has finally brought out some ugly crashing sound02:25
imkabrrr that was loud :)02:26
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seb128imka: ok, and using "osssink device=/dev/dsp1" doesn't work .02:26
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=== imka got sound
imkathanks seb12802:28
imkawarty is a bit warty but i love it02:30
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imkaseb128 do you think it matters if i leave all the gstreamer plugins installed? i don't feel like going through them and see what i need/don't need02:33
seb128no problem to keep them02:34
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imkawhat is gstreamer anyways?02:34
imkawhat apps use it?02:35
mjrit's a multimedia framework02:35
patientfoxim curious is there any talk of ubuntu going to x.org?02:35
mjrsome music players do, at least02:35
jktotem uses it, and a lot of other gnome stuff02:35
patientfoxi see that warty uses xf86 4.3.002:35
micXpatientfox, next release.02:35
micXpatientfox, it's in the wiki02:35
mjrjk, is totem/gstreamer stable and usable for video playback nowadays?02:35
imkai think i'm gonna remove it. i prefer xmms and mplayer02:35
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jkmjr: totem's never worked  for me...i always use mplayer02:36
mjrtotem-xine works quite fine, but gstreamer has seemed a bit unfinished when it comes to video playback02:36
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opi^workre |trey| :)02:40
=== |trey| is sleeping, just trying to fix things in his sleep :)
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|trey|How do you make Xchat not do its wierd alignment thing?02:41
|trey|I can't find the option02:41
opi^work|trey|: hmm, could you describe wierd aligment?02:41
|trey|The line it puts on the screen, I want that gone... 02:42
tbwtrey: preferences, text box, uncheck "indent nicks"02:43
|trey|tbw: thanks... I'm blind  :)02:43
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|trey|brb, getting rid of white boxes  :/02:43
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|trey|ahh, much better  :)02:45
|trey|k, night time for me  :)02:45
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HcEwrong windows ;)02:53
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Squad`nLeedahevening all.02:56
imkaafternoon here02:56
imkawill there be an official ubuntu forum?02:56
Squad`nLeedahhas anyone had any trouble with the install process halting on 81% and 'Detecting CD-ROM' with 'Linux Generic IDE' underneath it?02:57
Squad`nLeedahboots off the CD ok, but halts there02:58
dutchI installed Ubuntu Friday, from the CD, no problems02:59
azeemSquad`nLeedah: I heard about problems when burning CDs with DMA enabled or so, perhaps you could google for that03:00
azeemSquad`nLeedah: dunno if that is your issue, though03:00
Kamionit's more about booting the CD with DMA enabled as far as I know; recent daily CD builds disable DMA on CDs by default03:00
Squad`nLeedahso its a latest build i need?03:01
Squad`nLeedahor is there a boot parameter to disable DMA03:02
KamionSquad`nLeedah: certainly worth a try, if you're currently installing from the preview or similar03:02
Squad`nLeedahcheers guys03:04
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lothariomy system has usb1.1 - I've had no luck mounting usb stick, could this be the problem?03:10
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lothariomy cpu jumps to 99% when I plug in usb stick and dmesg returns repeatd I/O errors03:11
Safari_Alguys, what should I install for a java runtime environment & moz plugin on ubuntu?03:14
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topyliI have Blackdown 1.4. This is in my sources.list: deb http://jopa.studentenweb.org/debian/ ./03:21
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Safari_Altopyli, thanks03:23
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imkahow do i edit the gnome menu? stupid question i know but i'm not used to it03:26
topyliimka: go to applications:/// in nautilus and edit away. you can also add, remove and edit the menu entries directly by right clicking them.03:28
Safari_Altopyli, is menu editing really enabled in warty?03:29
Safari_Althat's a first 03:29
topyliSafari_Al: sure. why not?03:29
topyliit's not redhat :)03:30
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Safari_Alhowdy partner03:32
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freethinkdoes ubuntu come with support for smbfs in the kernel by default? how do i check this?03:35
spivfreethink: it's built as a module, yes.03:36
spivfreethink: as "modprobe smbfs" will demonstrate ;)03:37
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xTinaHm. Anyone have an idea what's up with bugzilla? I tried to create an account the day the preview was released but never got an email. I subsequently tried two or three more times, it always told me that the account already existed, so I requested the password to be emailed to me. None of the mails arrived. Now (yesterday) I got the email with the password change request of September 29, which of course has expired in the meantime :(03:40
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|trey|justdave: ping03:44
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|trey|xTina: when justdave gets back, talk to him about it, he deals with that stuff  :)03:44
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xTina|trey|: ok, thanks :)03:45
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mpjunghmm... ubuntu looks quite nice (just installed it a few seconds ago)03:57
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mpjungFor some reason my graphic card is working at 60 Hz (yuk!), I couldn't choose my keyboard layout during the setup and the sudo root access doesn't work.03:58
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mpjung(If I had root access I could easily fix those problems)03:59
mpjungSince I got also a debian install on my harddisk it's no big thing to change the password, but is there anything known about such problems, yet04:00
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|trey|mpjung: define 'doesn't work'... typing user password?04:09
mpjungi'm online using ubuntu right now04:10
mpjungso logging in as normal user was no problem04:10
|trey|mpjung: I can see that... but what about 'sudo -s' is bad?04:10
|trey|sudo -s YOUR password...04:10
|trey|not one line though...04:10
|trey|sudo -s04:10
|trey|YOUR password04:10
|trey|like that  :)04:11
mpjungokie... I thought it would ask for the root password ^_^04:11
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mpjungok... now downloading the nvidia stuff in the hope that it'll get rid of those nasty 60hz04:12
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justBE_dot_comhello :)04:13
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mpjunghow can I change the keyboard layout04:15
justBE_dot_comdoes anyone know, why ubuntu doesn't detect any of my 2 cd-drives and therefore fails to install? :\ already tried disabling one of the both... no success...04:15
mpjungI'm used to DVORAK and would like to set it as the whole system04:15
seb128mpjung: computer menu -> desktop -> keyboard04:15
jblackpjusbe_dot_com: Wild guess here, but did you forget to set the master/slave jumper? 04:16
mpjungseb128, that doesn't affect the consoles.04:16
jblackIf the bios can't find the drive, then ...04:16
justBE_dot_comjblack.. nah.. works perfectly under windows, fedora, etc04:16
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justBE_dot_comthe drive works.. just ubuntu doesn't detect them04:16
seb128mpjung: dpkg-reconfigure console-data04:16
|trey|justBE_dot_com: that, for me, would be the definition for "not working"...04:17
|trey|justBE_dot_com: you know the module needed?04:17
justBE_dot_comno, not really :\ they are both ide cd-rws, attached to the primary ide port04:17
justBE_dot_comon a intel 875 board...04:17
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|trey|justBE_dot_com: weird... should be ide-cd  :/04:18
justBE_dot_comstrange thing is... with debian sarge it works fine...04:18
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|trey|justBE_dot_com: file a bug noting that perhaps...04:19
justBE_dot_comi'll give it another try.. just to make sure... is there anything I should load/check before loading ide-cd by hand?04:19
|trey|modprobe ide-cd just to make sure04:19
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justBE_dot_comokidoki.. will try04:19
justBE_dot_comthanks for now :)04:19
|trey|justBE_dot_com: if you note it works with sarge, at least the devs have something to work with... just would need to look at recent changes then  :)04:20
mpjungseb128, okie. so its the same as in debian... =)04:20
seb128the distro is debian based04:20
justBE_dot_comyep... will put it in the bug description in case it really doesn't work...04:21
mpjungseb128, I know, but I thought those things were made somewhat more userfriendly... dont worry right now I quite like it to have a up to date desktop... gnome 2.8 rocks. ?=04:21
seb128mpjung: users don't use the consoel04:22
seb128console even04:22
mpjungIm not a pure user... I mainly use the system for developing :)04:22
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mpjungbut well... I just *like* the extra suggar of a decent desktop.04:22
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seb128mpjung: I mean such options are not the priority area to get "user friendly" tools04:23
mpjungHmm... damn ubuntu is lacking the -plain- dvorak layout... only the localized layouts are available.04:23
mpjungseb128, true.04:23
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mpjunghmm... where can I get the dvorak keyboard layout from?04:25
[Bas] really cool, doom3 installed and runs seamless on ubuntu here. need a new videocard though ;)04:25
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looksauswhat's the easiest way to burn an audio cd in ubuntu?04:34
looksaus(I have a number of 44.1 KHz stereo .wav files ready04:34
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mpjungok... lets hope it works... brb (hopefully)04:36
ranmanlooksaus: install k3b04:37
looksausranman, and a Gnome solution?04:38
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mpjunghmm... now with the right layout, the correct x server... just great. :)04:39
ranmanYou might try xcdroast...04:39
ranmanBut it looks like from the website that k3b is the endorsed, even  though it is a kde app...04:39
looksausranman, synaptic doesn't seem to find it...04:40
looksausah, have to enable universe...04:40
SuperLagany Courier gurus in the house? :(04:41
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ranmanhold on, I am looking..04:41
ranmanI just switched from deb unstable... not sure of total packages yet..04:42
opi^workSuperLag: use Posftfix/Exim & teapop ;)04:42
SuperLagwhat is teapop?04:42
SuperLagI've got the Postfix part working.  I can send fine.04:42
opi^workPOP3 server04:42
ranmanlooksaus: eroaster..04:42
SuperLagI think it's procmail courier where I'm getting hung up04:42
opi^workSuperLag: you need both SMTP and POP/IMAP server ;)04:42
SuperLagI want IMAP04:43
opi^workso I can't help you :(04:43
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ranmanSuperLag, there are many really nice tutorials for Postfix and Courier.. Look google, and add both words..04:44
ranmanSuperLag: What are you having trouble with in Courior? I use courier, and do not remember having to do too much..04:45
SuperLagranman: yeah, I've been using them.  So what happens when you do, and it STILL doesn't work? :)04:45
SuperLagranman: I'm not receiving any mail.04:45
SuperLagI can send just fine.04:45
ranmanThat is Postfix problem...04:46
ranmanAre you checking out the mail log?04:46
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looksausranman, thx04:46
SuperLagOct  5 09:45:51 localhost master[23467] : fatal: master_spawn: exec /usr/lib/postfix/smtpd: No such file or directory04:46
SuperLagOct  5 09:46:25 localhost master[23482] : fatal: master_spawn: exec /usr/lib/postfix/pickup: No such file or directory04:47
SuperLagthat's in mail.err04:47
ranmanYou set up the maildirs correctly? with Postfix setup for that?04:47
SuperLagI believe so, yes.04:47
ranmanLookSaus: no prob..04:47
looksausgone, thx everyone04:47
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ranmancheck the permissions.. If you ran the command as root, your user process does not have permission to write..04:48
ranmantail -F your /var/log/messages and send yourself mail from Yahoo, or MSN... That is what those accounts are good for, to debug mailserver setup..04:49
ranmancheck the mydomain, and relay settings for Postfix, those are a pain if you do not set correctly..04:50
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pdamocis there an assimilation strategy of ubuntu?04:53
ranmanresistence is futile...04:53
pdamocok ok... but the strategy? roadmap ... stuff like that04:54
ranmanDo not know the roadmap, check the wiki.. This is mainly users ...04:55
pdamocmany install stuff and become users BUT with propper strategy users can be turned into developers04:55
ranmanDevelopers poke their heads in once in awhile..04:55
pdamocwiki is almost empty04:55
ranmanYeah, give them time.. They are still new.. 04:56
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pdamocnew? I thought the next version will be 4.104:56
Kamion4.10 is a representation of the date04:57
Kamionshort for 2004.1004:57
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ranmanAre you looking to  become a developer?04:57
Kamionbut without the "Windows 2004" factor04:57
pdamocwell... I'm not even an user :)04:57
pdamocbut... maybe04:57
ranmanAre you at least a debian user?04:57
pdamocforced by Adobe Corp. (Photoshop)04:58
suzan_i've got a little question: i have win xp on my machine and now i want to install ubuntu besides it04:58
ranmanhmmm, one of the walking dead... No wonder you were speaking of assimulation... haha04:58
suzan_this is possible, isn't it?04:58
ranmansuzan_: do you have any extra partitions open?04:58
suzan_in the moment my disk is one partition04:59
suzan_does ubuntu the partitioning with the installation?04:59
pdamocI think Ubuntu could use an assimilation strategy :) something like "Chose your destiny!"05:00
ranmanok, then pull out that illegal copy of partition image (does anyone buy this?), sqeeze it down, and then run the install cd and turn the rest into ubuntu..05:00
ranmanmake sure that you defrag first...05:00
ranmanthat is sqeeze windows down..05:00
ranmannot too much, it likes to complain about low disk space..05:01
suzan_oh, i need to do the partitioning by myself?05:01
ranmanIt is safer that way...05:01
ranmanmake sure that you defrag.. <---- on windows cannot say this enough..05:02
suzan_hm... the computer ist brandnew05:02
ranmanDoes it come with the Windows install CDs?05:03
suzan_it's installed on the computer but i have the cd's, too05:03
Kamionsuzan_: Ubuntu doesn't yet have an NTFS resize tool in the installer, so you'll indeed probably want to use Partition Magic or similar.05:04
Kamion(we'll have something along those lines in the next release, since a hacky implementation got added to Debian's installer recently)05:04
suzan_ok, i see. so i take my copy.. ehm... my partitin magic05:04
eddknoppix will do the trick, too, it has qtparted...05:04
ranmanNTFS write ability is still unstable with linux.. I would not trust the tools to do that yet...05:04
ranmanedd: be very careful with the NTFS partitions.. You can lose data.. Since it is windows it might not be a bad thing...05:05
pdamocloosing data is always a bad thing05:06
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ranmansee that is how long ago I used windows.. I forgot the name of the software...05:06
pdamocsuzan_: do you have important documents on your computer or just Windows?05:07
ranmanPartition Magic will resize the partition quite nicely and "safely"....05:07
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ranmanoh yeah... Do not forget to defrag..05:07
ranmanDid I mention that before?05:07
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TdC_VgAi installed a module using module-assistant auto-install module05:13
RuffianSoldierWe scary-izzle, we scizarizzle05:13
TdC_VgAhow would i go about removing that module?05:14
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ranmanuse synaptic, or aptitude... or dpkg -r packagename...05:15
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TdC_VgAthat'll remove the module that was compiled too?05:16
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Caprihi, can anyone use VMWare with Ubuntu host?05:16
ranmanYes, module-assistant made a deb package and asked you if you want to install it..05:16
CapriI always get a /usr/local/lib/vmware/bin/vmware: relocation error: /usr/lib/gdk-pixbuf/loaders/libpixbufloader-xpm.so: undefined symbol: g_try_malloc05:17
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ranmanjust type module-assistant -> view list -> view installed binaries to see what the package name was..05:17
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TdC_VgAfound it in synaptics =)05:18
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TdC_VgAnow to reinstall it with the newest drivers..05:20
TdC_VgAand MAYBE then my evil WiFi card (read Broadcom will work)05:20
TdC_VgAonce that's working my laptop will be totally happy... except for the overly sensitive mouse, but eh I can live with that for now05:20
ranmanbroadcom? I have to use ndiswrapper for mine..05:21
petemci dont think theres any other way05:21
TdC_VgAranman: same i installed the module, but it didnt seem to be happy heh05:21
TdC_VgAsignal is listed as 100/100 with the radio off... and all in all it doesnt do anything i get the wlan0 adapter to show up, but i cant get a DHCP from my router05:21
ranmanYou might be able to fix the mouse with desktop mouse settings...05:22
TdC_VgAtried them, no such luck unfortunatly =(05:22
ranmanThe kernel does not like the license of the ndiswrapper...05:22
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TdC_VgAjust jumpy 05:22
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ranmanball mouse?05:22
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ranmanic.. I hate my touchpad.. Are you using the xfree touchpad driver?05:23
TdC_VgAwhatever came with ubuntu.. i thought it was using synaptics (i know it's installed), but it may not be using it05:24
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TdC_VgAheard synaptics can fix the jumpyness.. so maybe thats the problem.. wonder how i enable that heh05:24
ranmanwell the synaptic driver for xfree..05:24
pII-350can somebody help me with ubuntu.. I have a problem after the first reboot :o(05:24
jblackpII: I can try. What's up? 05:25
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ranman Driver        "synaptics"05:26
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pII-350after I installed it there was gdm then i logged in.. gnome was up but my mouse didnt work (old serial 3-button) ok.. not so bad but not so good as with my kanotix or knoppix :o) then I reboot my system the first time and it hang up with two module somethings *sigh*05:28
opipII-350: change your /etc/X11/XFree86-405:29
opireplace mouse device from /dev/input/* or /dev/psaux to /dev/ttySx where x is your serial 05:29
pII-350yes.. i think my x config wil work after some tests..05:29
opiI hope they compiled kernel with serial mouse support :P05:30
pII-350but my second problem has nothing to do with that.. I think perhaps it could be some redunant drivers belonging to installation?05:30
opican't tell05:30
opisee what's in modules05:31
opimaybe disable some unused stuff/services05:31
pII-350But I am a newbie.. where can I look if something in the boot sequence doesnt work?05:31
opifirst run sudo modconf from shell05:32
ranmanCheck /var/log/messages 05:32
opiand do what ranman says :)05:32
pII-350okay.. but how can i get to the shell if it doesent boot up? ;o)05:33
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jblackDoes rescue mode work for you? 05:33
jblackthere should be a grub option for "rescue"05:33
opidose Ubuntu support init selection at boot?05:33
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opihe could boot at init 1/205:33
opiwithout networking and stuff05:34
jblackwhich is the equivilant of "linux single" 05:34
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opiyes, that what I was asking for, jblack ;)05:34
ranmanpII: what is your bootloader?05:34
Kamionopi: runlevel 2 is the default05:35
ranmanopi: all bootloaders let you override the boot options..05:35
pII-350hmm.. grub I think.. the standard when I install Ubuntu! I didnt use expert mode, only changes I did were partitioning05:35
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pII-350or should I wait until the release?!05:37
pII-350are there too many bugs in the install perhaps?05:37
ranmanin grub push e on one of the boot options, and this will edit the selection, put a 1 after it, and then after editing just push b, and this will put you into rescue mode..05:37
pII-350and then look for modconf and into /var/log/messages?05:38
ranmanmodconf will help you choose what modules to load at startup, it will not tell you what happened.. /var/log/messages will tell you what happened..05:39
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TdC_VgAi can see the networks listed.. so the driver must be working..05:40
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TdC_VgAi've configured my card.. so it looks right under iwconfig.05:40
q2I am RuffianSoldier05:40
ranmanI hate to tell you "the words", but if you are using a serial mouse, then maybe it is time to pull out the credit card..05:40
TdC_VgAbut... when i do a dhclient wlan0, it just tries and tries and nothing happens...05:40
q2serial mouse............ HAHAHHHAHAHAHAHA!05:41
ranmantdc: iwconfig wlan0 ------> Is the essid set? -------> is the wep key set if neccessary?05:41
TdC_VgAranman: yes and yes.. and both should be correct05:42
TdC_VgAiwconfig key restricted xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx i think05:42
TdC_VgAyou dont need to put the key in like this do you? XX:XX:XX:XX:XX?05:42
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ranmantdc: iwconfig eth0 ap 00:60:1D:01:23:4505:44
ranmanThat is from the example..05:44
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ranmanThe place where I use my card does not use wep...05:45
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arleHi, there05:45
TdC_VgAlemme turn off wep and see if it'll work05:45
TdC_VgAgotta drop off.. back in a few05:46
ranmanwhat does iwlist wlan0 scanning tell you?05:46
arleMy Ubuntu haven't recognized my sound card... :-/05:46
ranmanThat will tell you if wep is needed..05:46
TdC_VgAiwlist wlan0 scan shows my access point05:46
ranmanarle, what is your soundcard?05:46
TdC_VgAit is.. i know its turned on on my router05:46
arleI've searched the users mailing list archive: no luck05:47
arleranman: give me a sec, I'll check it out05:47
ranmanubuntu mailing list archive is like nothing...05:47
ranmanMaybe you should check the Debian Archive..05:47
arleranman:thanks, you're right05:48
arleI am subscribed to debian-spanish-mail list05:48
arlebut I prefer to ask here, 1st05:48
arleLook, I'm ashamed but my WindowsXP can't tell me what kinda card do I have05:49
arleI think it's an Intel05:49
arleKnoppix had recognized it once05:49
arlePerhaps I am missing a module05:50
ranmanmaybe you need to boot that knoppix cd and find out..05:50
arleBut I can't find the great Debian tool modconf05:50
arleYeah, I guess, so :-)05:50
ranmanapt-get install modconf05:50
arleno way.... 05:51
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ranmanYou are not in linux now?05:51
arleI have enabled the universe repository05:51
arlewell, I'm in linux05:51
arlebut it's not the Ubuntu box :05:51
ranmanThat will tell you what your card is..05:52
q2Hello MacPlusG3, i have a G3, its a white one though, its still coool05:52
q2aah, heleft05:52
ranmanuntil you know what your card is, you can just try each, one at a time until success..05:52
q2i thought it sayed, joined05:52
arleWell... I can try booting into my Ubuntu installation and then, re-login into this channel05:52
arleI'll be right back05:53
ranmanruffian, are you here to heckle and be a pain in the ***?05:53
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q2ranman, im always here05:53
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q2Becuase i have Ubuntu05:53
ranmanYou make it sound like a disease..05:54
escoim having some issues installing the nvidia drivers on my amd6405:55
q2that is wierd, usually its ATI problems05:55
ranmanamd and nvidia are not friends..05:55
q2ill keep taht in mind05:55
ranmanThe driver is built for intel..05:55
q2but ATI has Linux problems05:55
ranmanIf you read the nvidia site, they tell you about all the cool intel feature that they have put into their driver...05:56
q2Intel is lame05:56
escois there any way to use apt-get to get the nvidia drives setup, or should i just build a new kernel from scratch w/o rivafb so i can use the amd64 drives right from their site05:56
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q2esco, is that possible?05:57
escois what possible?05:57
ranmanI was not aware that they had amd driver... nvidia is available through apt...05:58
escobut it doesnt work through apt right now for amd6405:58
escowiki says so and i cant get it to work05:58
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ranmando an "apt-cache search nvidia"05:59
esconvidia-kernel-source doesnt come up when i apt-cache search06:00
escoand ive already done an apt-get update06:00
bob2esco: http://wiki.ubuntulinux.org/BinaryDriverHowto06:00
escobob2, you obviously didnt read anything06:01
ranmanhmmm, maybe I still have residule debian unstable packages listed.. I commented them out...06:01
escoi have amd6406:01
escothat page, at the bottom, says "Note for AMD64-bit users: sudo apt-get install nvidia-glx will NOT work. You will recieve an error that it has become outdated or moved."06:01
diemanyay, the ubuntu lists are on gmane06:01
escothats why im here06:01
bob2esco: thank you for politeness, kthx06:01
bob2esco: install them from source then,. which doesn't ever require recompiling the kernel06:02
escoexcept it does06:02
escobecause the default ubuntu kernel has rivafb compiled in06:02
escoand that conflicts with the nvidia drivers06:02
escoand the installer wont run06:02
bob2not as a module?06:02
goatboythe rivafb warning can usually be ignored.06:02
escoill try it again06:03
escoi went though all that last week06:03
ranmanmaybe you should just get your sources from nvidia straight and try that way..06:03
crimsunit's not compiled in06:03
ranmanThen you will not have the package dependency..06:03
bob2crimsun: that's what I thought06:03
crimsunall you have to do is blacklist it06:03
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escok, ill try it06:04
tortoise__silly question but how do you edit the menues in gnome??06:04
bob2tortoise__: go to applications:/// in nautilus06:05
ranmanmanually type in the location.. "start-here:" there you will find applications, and anything you change there will reflect in your menu..06:05
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ranmanalso what bob2 says.. his is faster...06:05
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q2hello ploum06:07
tortoise__bob2,raman:what about the computer menu?06:08
ploumDon't say hello every time I connect, my connection is very buggy so it disconnect/reconnect all the time ;-)06:08
bob2tortoise__: you can't edit it at the moment.06:08
ploumI've a critical comment06:09
ploumThe website must really be improved : http://www.ubuntulinux.org/06:09
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ploumIt doesn't feel "pro" at all IMHO06:09
bob2ploum: if you have constructive suggestions, I'm sure they'd be appreciaqted on the ubuntu-users list06:11
ranmanploum, they are always looking for users to help out.. Thanks for voluteering..06:11
ranmantortoise: computer menu?06:13
ranmansorry for the late reply tortoise.. smoking...06:13
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ranmanon the menubar?06:13
ranmanI do not think that can be edited..06:13
ranmanGnome menus and editing has always been a pain for me...06:14
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Sirius_Blacki think i have asked this before but can anyone confirm that to do basic ububtu install i must chose 'custom'06:19
spivSirius_Black: Sounds right.06:19
Sirius_Blacktnx cheers :-)06:20
LinuxJoneshi guys06:20
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willhi anyone know what the yenta socket is?06:23
fscwill: pcmcia stuff i believe06:23
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bob2it is indeed.06:23
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LinuxJoneswill, >> http://www.linuxquestions.org/questions/archive/25/2003/11/2/11374906:24
fsclove that site06:24
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LinuxJonesfsc, ya there are alot of nice people on LQ.org06:25
fscmy realtek 8180 chipset wireless thread is like 90 pages long now06:25
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fscprobably longer actually..haven't checked it in a while06:26
LinuxJonesfsc, wow06:26
LinuxJonesfsc, that must have been some question :)06:26
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escook, module is installed thankfully, but now i have another problem06:26
escoim having issues w/ libGL.so.106:27
fscthe 8180 chipset is a common chipset for wireless cards...and there's been problems...they actually released binary (private part) drivers for 2.4.x, but never got around to 2.6.x  that I know of...I've been in XP for months now though06:27
escoglxinfo/glxgears cant find the library06:27
ranmanwhat is the problem with that? I hope that it has nothing to do with your wireless..06:27
escoive checked the symbolic links and ran ldconfig, any thoughts06:27
ranmanhmm, ic..06:27
ranmando you actually see a libGL.so.1?06:28
fscranman: the problem was that the drivers that realtek released would only work on kernels under 2.4.22 and they didn't work on some distros and such, but I ended up using ndsiwrapper eventually