| === lamont notes that sound no longer works on his vaio. grumble | ||
| lamont | otoh, it now powers off when it shutsdown. :-) | 12:01 |
|---|---|---|
| mdz | it's very encouraging to see that an increasing fraction of #ubuntu and ubuntu-users seems to be non-ubuntu-specific user support | 12:07 |
| Kamion | mdz: I don't seem to have got your mail about ubuntu-meta | 12:12 |
| Kamion | sorry | 12:13 |
| Kamion | (un?)fortunately I am being asked to go to bed now; I hope it can wait until tomorrow | 12:14 |
| thom | NetworkManager ate my network | 12:15 |
| thom | (and lets not mention the fact i'm running a cvs version of dbus, either) | 12:16 |
| lamont | mdz: so which snd modules did I not want loaded? | 12:18 |
| mdz | lamont: eh? | 12:18 |
| lamont | upgraded my vaio today. ENOSOUND. | 12:19 |
| mdz | Kamion: weird; I'll upload it someplace instead | 12:20 |
| mdz | Kamion: http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~mdz/temp/ubuntu-meta_0.1.tar.gz | 12:20 |
| mdz | if anyone else would like to take a look as well, I'd appreciate it | 12:20 |
| azeem | lamont: perhaps the mixers are muted? | 12:20 |
| azeem | happens for me all the time, although on unstable | 12:21 |
| mdz | lamont: sounds like you want them loaded, rather than wanting them not loaded | 12:21 |
| lamont | was thinking oss vs alsa crap again. | 12:22 |
| lamont | otoh, this is that wonderful realtek stack... | 12:23 |
| lamont | but my network does work (RTL8139 | 12:23 |
| mdz | the oss vs. alsa crap was solved long ago by getting rid of discover | 12:26 |
| mdz | Mithrandir: if you're going to fix nvidia, please fix that awful bit where you need to update the nvidia version number by hand in debian/rules with every upload | 12:29 |
| === pooh_ [~pooh@80.179.82.182.forward.012.net.il] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| mdz | that bites everyone | 12:29 |
| pooh_ | strange. does a manual edit of /etc/fstab supposed to trigger a complete crash of gnome? | 12:29 |
| === ..[topic/#ubuntu-devel:mdz] : Ubuntu development -- general discussion on #ubuntu | 13 RC bugs to go | ||
| lamont | boo hiss | 12:33 |
| sivang | sure I added something to /media , but a crash? | 12:33 |
| mdz | sivang: yes that's a feature, the "crash feature" | 12:34 |
| sivang | mdz : :-)) | 12:35 |
| sivang | mdz : maybe adding it under /mnt would be better? | 12:36 |
| mdz | sivang: subdirectories under /mnt are evil | 12:36 |
| mdz | /media is the right place for random storage devices, if that's what it is | 12:36 |
| sivang | mdz : why? /mnt is the good'o no? | 12:37 |
| sivang | mdz : oh, it's a vfat part. | 12:37 |
| === myk [~myk@sclab-25-433.sclab.clarkson.edu] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| mdz | sivang: then it doesn't belong under /media, just create a directory for it someplace | 12:37 |
| mdz | sivang: /mnt is meant for having things mounted on it. if you make subdirectories under it, they are masked when you mount something on /mnt | 12:37 |
| sivang | mdz : but it shouldn't crash whenever I edit the file right? | 12:38 |
| mdz | sivang: it should never crash, ever | 12:38 |
| sivang | mdz : :-) | 12:39 |
| sivang | mdz : i'll look for it on the bts | 12:39 |
| sivang | mdz : if I put hd parts on /mnt, I get to click them on file manager and they automount. I like that. | 12:41 |
| sivang | hmmm, trying another upgrade: debconf: apt-extracttemplates faild: Bad file descriptor. | 12:42 |
| sivang | it just hung up after fetching. | 12:42 |
| === r4bb1t [~myk@sclab-25-433.sclab.clarkson.edu] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| r4bb1t | does anyone know offhand if acpi and apm can be on at the same time and play nice? | 12:43 |
| r4bb1t | my side question is: how does ubuntu suspend? using ACPI or APM? | 12:44 |
| thom | it doesn't, in general | 12:44 |
| lamont | 2.6.8.1-2 has sound, doesn't power off. 2.6.8.1-3 has no sound, powers off.... hrm... | 12:44 |
| thom | we can't safely turn it on globally | 12:44 |
| thom | since many, many laptops do all kinda loopy things when you suspend them | 12:44 |
| === sivang [~pooh@80.179.82.182.forward.012.net.il] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| sivang | can't start gnome back... | 12:47 |
| === lamont needs to find a map of the UK online somewhere... | ||
| thom | lamont: http://www.ukguide.org/ukmap.html ? | 12:49 |
| thom | what detail do you need? | 12:49 |
| lamont | thom: awesome. | 12:49 |
| lamont | hrm.. she needs to find some rivers too... | 12:50 |
| doko | rivers, in uk? | 12:50 |
| lamont | yeah, they exist. | 12:50 |
| lamont | the camm for example.. | 12:50 |
| === lamont ponders why rebooting into -2 and back into -3 fixed sound... | ||
| === sivang [~pooh@80.179.82.182.forward.012.net.il] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| sivang | no luck :( | 12:51 |
| sivang | where can I see logs to find out what's bugging my gnome? | 12:52 |
| thom | lamont: well, http://www.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/oswebsite/getamap/ has a vicious click through license, but is pretty cool | 12:52 |
| thom | sivang: .xsession-errors | 12:52 |
| thom | ? | 12:52 |
| seb128 | sivang: what's happening ? | 12:52 |
| sivang | seb128,thom : it all started with a very innocent personal touch to fstab, | 12:53 |
| sivang | seb128,thom : then an upgrade in text mode, now gnome gets stuck with the 2 pannels and nothing more. | 12:54 |
| seb128 | what's the change in fstab ? | 12:54 |
| sivang | seb128 : I added a vfat part to it, first it pointed at /media (it used to work that way) no on /mnt | 12:55 |
| sivang | looking at xsession-erros: | 12:55 |
| sivang | gnome_execute_async_with_env_fds: returning -1 | 12:55 |
| sivang | killing it and retuning to gdm, trying to relogin doesn't help. | 12:56 |
| seb128 | dpkg -l gnome-panel ? | 12:58 |
| sivang | seb128 : what's the best way to see what happend on the last upgrade? | 12:59 |
| seb128 | no | 12:59 |
| sivang | seb128 : I wasn't near the machine, it might have upgraded the kernel | 01:00 |
| seb128 | dpkg -l gnome-panel ? | 01:00 |
| sivang | seb128 : wouldn't I have to reboot in this case? | 01:00 |
| seb128 | I don't think so | 01:00 |
| sivang | seb128 : it's there, sec. (on irssi) | 01:00 |
| sivang | 2.8.0.1-0ubuntu | 01:01 |
| seb128 | ii ? | 01:01 |
| sivang | yes | 01:01 |
| seb128 | hum | 01:01 |
| seb128 | gnome_execute_async_with_env_fds <- I think it's trying to start something missing | 01:01 |
| sivang | seb128 : i'll do a cold reboot, and try again? | 01:01 |
| seb128 | ok | 01:01 |
| sivang | c'ya in a sec. | 01:01 |
| === sivang [~pooh@80.179.82.182.forward.012.net.il] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| sivang | hmm | 01:04 |
| sivang | it worked :) | 01:04 |
| sivang | strange. I got used to debian not having to ever reboot | 01:04 |
| seb128 | yeah, that's weird | 01:05 |
| seb128 | perhaps a hal issue ... | 01:05 |
| sivang | maybe. there have been a couple of them. | 01:05 |
| sivang | :) | 01:05 |
| === myk [~myk@sclab-25-433.sclab.clarkson.edu] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| mdz | jdub: ping? | 01:11 |
| jdub | pong | 01:12 |
| sivang | mdz : what would be your oppinion about a python http bug-buddy to bugzilla hack for Hoary? | 01:12 |
| mdz | jdub: do you have the original presentation file for those 1-2-3 slides? | 01:13 |
| mdz | sivang: for hoary, we'll be transitioning away from bugzilla | 01:13 |
| jdub | mdz: yeah, will send you the bits | 01:13 |
| jdub | it's updated too | 01:13 |
| mdz | jdub: awesome | 01:13 |
| mdz | jdub: a friend of mine is doing a presentation this evening for a LUG and asked for slides | 01:13 |
| sivang | mdz : to what? | 01:13 |
| jdub | mdz: i'll send you jane's too | 01:14 |
| mdz | jdub: I have jane's, unless you've changed it since she sent it out | 01:14 |
| jdub | oh, nup | 01:14 |
| thom | sivang: magic | 01:14 |
| thom | sivang: or malone, even :-) | 01:14 |
| sivang | thom : is there a place to read about those? | 01:17 |
| thom | sivang: i rather suspect not, currently | 01:17 |
| thom | sorry | 01:17 |
| sivang | ok | 01:18 |
| thom | i believe there is already an xml-rpc client for it tho | 01:19 |
| sivang | nice, anyway I'm headed to bed. Night everybody | 01:21 |
| thom | ciao | 01:22 |
| mdz | jdub: I saw your bug closure for vim-gnome, but no upload | 02:01 |
| === lamont [~lamont@mix.mmjgroup.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| jdub | i thought you fixed it a while back - i don't have an icon here | 02:02 |
| jdub | s/icon/item/ | 02:02 |
| jdub | oh, puce -> panel is dead | 02:03 |
| tseng | hiya | 02:03 |
| jdub | mdz: fixing/uploading now | 02:04 |
| mdz | jdub: I thought I had, too, but I didn't | 02:06 |
| tseng | jdub: anything more you need from me to get mono in? | 02:10 |
| jdub | tseng: just a confirm from mdz :) | 02:11 |
| tseng | i updated tomboy and monodevelop | 02:11 |
| mdz | jdub: mm? | 02:11 |
| mdz | I thought we already exchanged email on that. new versions now or something? | 02:11 |
| tseng | we did, it was approved | 02:12 |
| tseng | whats the next step? | 02:12 |
| === tseng sits on the outside and looks in | ||
| === lamont curses at xteddy rubymagick qvwm prestimel pixelize pike7.6-image mgp libepplet0 libautotrace3 idesk icewm-experimental icewm guikachu2rcp guikachu epplets enlightenment endeavour2 dvdauthor chameleon autotrace animal0 ale | ||
| lamont | on the bright side, they're all in universe. | 02:34 |
| lamont | on the dark side, they all Depend: libtiff3g on powerpc, and are therefore not installable. | 02:34 |
| lamont | fabbione: daniels: you around? | 02:41 |
| lamont | /etc/init.d/xfree86-common: line 11: /lib/lsb/init-functions: No such file or directory | 02:41 |
| === justdave [~justdave@24.247.63.44.gha.mi.chartermi.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| justdave | hmm... wonder if the keys for mouse emulation on ppc should be different... | 03:50 |
| justdave | F12 appears to be 'right-click' | 03:51 |
| justdave | it's also my eject key, and now I can't eject | 03:51 |
| justdave | because typical Apple hardware has no eject button on the actual cd drawer | 03:51 |
| justdave | I can eject okay by right-clicking on the CD in nautilus and picking eject, but that leaves the drawer open, and it's one of those ones that feels like you're going to break it if you push the drawer hard enough to make it shut | 03:52 |
| tseng | hmm, did pitti's utopia packages go away? | 04:05 |
| npmccallum | tseng: I believe they are in the archive nw | 04:08 |
| tseng | npmccallum: the archive looks to be ubuntu4, his sources are ubuntu5 | 04:08 |
| === tseng shrugs | ||
| tseng | unless its pending or something. | 04:09 |
| daniels | thom: pong | 04:48 |
| daniels | lamont: pong | 04:48 |
| daniels | lamont: i don't think you can do depth moves | 04:49 |
| daniels | thom: but I'm running out the door now, and won't be back for a couple of hours. give me a call if you need me. | 04:52 |
| daniels | thom: oh, you just want bleeeeeeeding edge dbus, I see. i'll sort that out tonight. | 04:53 |
| mdz | there seem to be a lot of successful builds from universe where the packages aren't in the archive yet | 05:42 |
| mdz | 20041008-0208 | 05:42 |
| mdz | s/universe/multiverse/ | 05:43 |
| mdz | the buildds are BST, right? that was hours ago | 05:43 |
| === lamont will check | ||
| mdz | why does lsb depend on 'make'? | 05:56 |
| lamont | mdz: probably for the same reason that it Depends: on cron, libc6-dev, lpr, m4, mawk, passwd, procps, etc... | 06:02 |
| lamont | they | 06:02 |
| lamont | they're part of the spec? | 06:02 |
| mdz | ok, let me rephrase | 06:05 |
| mdz | why does LSB require make and libc6-dev? | 06:05 |
| lamont | daemon.log:Oct 8 02:10:05 buildd-mail: mythtv must be manually dinstall-ed -- delayed | 06:07 |
| lamont | mdz: nfc | 06:07 |
| mdz | lamont: ah, right | 06:07 |
| mdz | I keep forgetting about that bit, in the midst of all the delicious automation we have otherwise :-) | 06:07 |
| fabbione | morning guys | 06:21 |
| fabbione | hmmm | 06:22 |
| fabbione | thuderbird crashed on me | 06:22 |
| === hazmat [~hazmat@c-24-15-10-12.client.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| mdz | morning | 08:11 |
| fabbione | hey mdz | 08:12 |
| fabbione | and it is done according to: | 08:13 |
| fabbione | ops | 08:13 |
| fabbione | lamont: 2151 pending upload? | 08:16 |
| lamont | no - I fat fingered something | 08:16 |
| fabbione | (also please take ownership of the bug so i we know someone is working on it) | 08:16 |
| fabbione | ahah ok | 08:16 |
| lamont | fabbione: that would be the same firefox bug as the pending upload | 08:17 |
| lamont | (back doesn't quite do it...) | 08:17 |
| lamont | you have to re-enter everything. :-(* | 08:17 |
| fabbione | mdz: 2158 are you on it? | 08:17 |
| fabbione | lamont: it's not only on firefox.. it's on all browsers and justdave claims to be ok, but it was different before | 08:18 |
| justdave | I'm not ok, I get it too | 08:21 |
| fabbione | justdave: well, why did you close the bug than? | 08:21 |
| justdave | which bug? | 08:21 |
| justdave | unless I'm confused about what you're talking about, there's still an open bug on it | 08:21 |
| mdz | fabbione: I will not be able to deal with it until tomorrow; it is yours if you want it | 08:22 |
| fabbione | justdave: the one that was open by a girl i think and where i added info | 08:22 |
| fabbione | mdz: ok i take it. Can you send me the usual stuff if you have any? | 08:22 |
| justdave | 2108? | 08:22 |
| mdz | fabbione: I'll look | 08:22 |
| fabbione | mdz: the patch is one line | 08:22 |
| justdave | looks open to me still | 08:22 |
| justdave | 2109 also (which has comments from you) | 08:23 |
| fabbione | justdave: 2109 | 08:23 |
| justdave | I think the two are related | 08:23 |
| fabbione | hmm | 08:23 |
| fabbione | ok.. i must have misread the bug number | 08:23 |
| fabbione | there was one invalidated.. i am sure | 08:24 |
| fabbione | or you are cheating behind the lines :PP | 08:24 |
| justdave | I have yet to find anyone who knows enough about DOM and caching to tell me why it's broken | 08:24 |
| fabbione | jdub: you will have to take the last 2 bugs you opened | 08:32 |
| fabbione | jdub: i don't have a synaptic thing to even check what you are talkign about | 08:32 |
| fabbione | also.. the synaptics driver is not shipped by xfree86 | 08:32 |
| jdub | fabbione: assign to daniel :) | 08:35 |
| jdub | hrm | 08:35 |
| jdub | so, if i do a dpkg-reconfigure when xfree86 is already configured | 08:35 |
| jdub | it doesnt' change the file | 08:36 |
| jdub | oh | 08:36 |
| fabbione | jdub: that's because you modified the config file manually | 08:36 |
| jdub | yeah | 08:37 |
| jdub | just found that bit in the file | 08:37 |
| mdz | fabbione: did you receive the email? | 08:38 |
| fabbione | mdz: yes | 08:39 |
| fabbione | thanks | 08:39 |
| === lamont sleeps | ||
| === pitti [~martin@195.227.105.180] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| pitti | Morning | 08:48 |
| mdz | morning | 09:26 |
| fabbione | mdz: i updated the office stuff to reflect my office movement situation | 09:32 |
| === doko [doko@dsl-084-057-004-119.arcor-ip.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| === pitti [~martin@195.227.105.180] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| pitti | jdub: just tried the new gdm; isn't it a little bothering to hear the same lengthy sound two times in short succession? | 09:50 |
| jdub | pitti: yes | 09:51 |
| pitti | jdub: so will the login sound be disabled then? | 09:51 |
| jdub | pitti: depending on whether or not the event sounds stay enabled | 09:51 |
| jdub | pitti: the sound may change | 09:51 |
| pitti | jdub: personally I'd prefer a short, short confirmation sound when gdm finished, but that's a matter of taste... | 09:52 |
| jdub | that's what it would be if the event sounds stay enabled | 09:52 |
| === elmo_ [~james@host217-37-231-28.in-addr.btopenworld.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| === carlos [~carlos@69.Red-80-33-181.pooles.rima-tde.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| === seb128 [~seb128@ANancy-111-1-27-191.w81-51.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| seb128 | morning | 10:14 |
| pitti | Hi seb128! | 10:19 |
| seb128 | hello pitti | 10:19 |
| Kamion | mdz: hmm, please make ubuntu-meta/update sort the package lists it spits out :) it's pretty much impossible to compare them to anything as it is | 10:22 |
| Kamion | mdz: looks like the right idea, but the actual packages will need testing; I'm slightly concerned that we're going to be making all our users regression-test germinate :-) | 10:24 |
| Kamion | mdz: please also blacklist hfsplus hfsutils libhfsp0 from amd64 and i386; and you might want to consider blacklisting the kernel | 10:25 |
| Kamion | mdz: oh, and grub and yaboot | 10:25 |
| === sivang [~pooh@80.179.82.182.forward.012.net.il] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| sivang | morning all | 11:07 |
| === carlos [~carlos@69.Red-80-33-181.pooles.rima-tde.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| === |trey| [~trey@ip68-230-75-109.ph.ph.cox.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| === martink [~martin@pD9EB26DE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| thom | daniels: it's already done :-) | 11:25 |
| === sivang [~pooh@80.179.82.182.forward.012.net.il] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
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| === ggi [~ggi@ggi.base.supporter.pdpc] has left #ubuntu-devel ["Leaving"] | ||
| sivang | Might Herbert Xu be here? | 12:00 |
| elmo_ | I don't think he IRCs | 12:00 |
| sivang | k | 12:01 |
| fabbione | hey elmo_ | 12:21 |
| fabbione | elmo_: do you think can i make the last X upload using my canonical.com address? ;) | 12:21 |
| elmo_ | how do you mean? *@canonical.com is whitelisted.. if you mean your key, blah | 12:22 |
| fabbione | elmo_: the latter ;) | 12:22 |
| === seb128 [~seb128@ANancy-111-1-27-191.w81-51.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| daniels | thom: rad | 12:39 |
| === Kamion falls over | ||
| Kamion | my scary kernel-wedge hack for firmware pretty much worked first time | 12:41 |
| Kamion | nic-firmware-2.6.8.1-3-amd64-generic-di_0.14ubuntu10_amd64.udeb | 12:41 |
| Mithrandir | you're doing firmware-for-di-hacking? | 12:41 |
| Kamion | yup | 12:41 |
| Mithrandir | _scary_ | 12:41 |
| Mithrandir | Kamion: do you have anything to do with the rc-bug-list? | 12:43 |
| Mithrandir | from bugscan | 12:43 |
| Kamion | which one? | 12:43 |
| Kamion | oh | 12:43 |
| Kamion | yes | 12:43 |
| Mithrandir | could you add an explanation to what the colors mean? And, it would be nice to have some icons for people like me who are red-green color-blind. | 12:44 |
| Kamion | bloody hell, it's jumped a lot | 12:44 |
| Kamion | there's already an explanation there | 12:44 |
| Kamion | The red line graphs all bugs with release-critical severities; the green line graphs the number of bugs that are actually a concern for the next release (excluding ignored bugs, bugs on packages not in testing, and bugs whose tags indicate that they don't apply to testing). | 12:44 |
| Mithrandir | oh, not the graph, the list. | 12:44 |
| Kamion | as to icons, tell me how to do it in gnuplot :) | 12:44 |
| Kamion | oh | 12:44 |
| Kamion | the colours are just visual additions to the existing letters | 12:44 |
| Mithrandir | ok | 12:45 |
| daniels | Kamion: remind me to buy you a beer some day | 12:46 |
| Mithrandir | daniels: we'll get kamion really drunk during next meeting. :) | 12:47 |
| Kamion | Mithrandir: I'll try to remember to add some descriptions of the colours at some point | 12:47 |
| Mithrandir | Kamion: thanks. | 12:47 |
| Kamion | haven't really bugscan-hacked for a little while, there's a bug with all-numeric package names that needs to be fixed first | 12:47 |
| elmo_ | use R, it's fun for stats pr0n graphcs | 12:47 |
| fabbione | hmmmm | 01:00 |
| fabbione | bt in gdb | 01:00 |
| fabbione | in which order does it show the trace? | 01:00 |
| fabbione | 0 is the last function called and NN the first one traced? | 01:00 |
| fabbione | or viceversa? ala strace? | 01:00 |
| Mithrandir | first is deepest in the call stack | 01:01 |
| Mithrandir | iirc. | 01:02 |
| fabbione | so NN is the last called | 01:02 |
| fabbione | https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1842 | 01:03 |
| fabbione | Mithrandir: comment 8 | 01:03 |
| Mithrandir | you see that #30 is main :P | 01:03 |
| fabbione | Mithrandir: yes, but X is not that "main" | 01:03 |
| fabbione | it does a lot to recover from a crash | 01:03 |
| Mithrandir | seems to be the X server's main function. | 01:04 |
| fabbione | it would make sence | 01:04 |
| fabbione | but i am not sure about the raise() at 0 | 01:05 |
| fabbione | that's like kill <proc> <sig> | 01:05 |
| fabbione | anyway.. food time :-)) | 01:05 |
| Mithrandir | that's the result of it getting a signal in #7 | 01:05 |
| fabbione | ok | 01:05 |
| Mithrandir | and #5 probably has a line abort() | 01:05 |
| Mithrandir | or, ddxGiveUp, has one. | 01:05 |
| fabbione | good point | 01:06 |
| sivang | john levin here? | 01:16 |
| elmo_ | huh? I thought our debootstrap had a .buildd variant? | 01:30 |
| Mithrandir | elmo_: I don't think it's shipped. | 01:31 |
| Mithrandir | elmo_: want a copy, or do you have it? | 01:32 |
| elmo_ | no, it's cool, don't need it as it turned out | 01:44 |
| elmo_ | might be nice to ship it tho someday | 01:45 |
| Mithrandir | I just got it from lamont, but I agree it would be useful to ship it | 01:50 |
| lamont | --variant=buildd | 01:51 |
| lamont | in the current debootstrap | 01:51 |
| elmo_ | lamont: "no such file: warty.buildd" | 01:51 |
| elmo_ | ... | 01:51 |
| === lamont runs off again | ||
| lamont | le huh. will check when I get back | 01:51 |
| lamont | apt-get source has it.. :-( | 01:51 |
| Mithrandir | lamont: yeah, but currently we don't even ship the file. :P | 01:51 |
| Mithrandir | doko: any progress with AVM? | 01:54 |
| === seb128_ [~seb128@ANancy-111-1-27-114.w81-51.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| === pitti [~martin@195.227.105.180] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| Kamion | lamont: would've been a good idea to add it to Makefile ;) | 02:16 |
| Kamion | lamont: I'll fix | 02:18 |
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| lamont | Kamion: I could swear I did that. | 02:47 |
| lamont | sigh. | 02:48 |
| lamont | kids to school (last was a fire call..), bbiah | 02:53 |
| === Kamion [~cjwatson@host81-153-126-219.range81-153.btcentralplus.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| lamont | moo | 03:47 |
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| pitti | jdub: may I upload #2165? Trivial, but... protocol... | 03:56 |
| Kamion | quick review of http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~cjwatson/kernel-wedge.diff, please? | 04:07 |
| Kamion | copy-firmware is basically just clone-and-hack of copy-modules | 04:07 |
| Kamion | and then there's a bunch of other gunk for putting the *-firmware-di packages together | 04:08 |
| Kamion | seems to work with linux-kernel-di-amd64-2.6 and my new linux-kernel-restricted-di-2.6 | 04:08 |
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| Kamion | hm, although something's still wrong, never mind for the moment | 04:09 |
| seb128 | mdz, jdub: ok to upload the patch in #1643 ? | 04:31 |
| pitti | fabbione: got a minute? | 04:31 |
| pitti | Kamion: I just had a friend of me installing Ubuntu. He was bitten by #993 (no grub menu to select windows) | 04:36 |
| pitti | Kamion: will this be settled by release? Would you oppose to raising it to major? | 04:36 |
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| ggi | I'm noticing some odd phenomena. Playing music in Rhythmbox results in quite noticeable hisses and pops on some tracks. Playing things in Muine sounds absolutely fine, but only sometimes. It seems to be playing fine now (I just killed esd), but often it plays fine when esd is running, then hisses and pops after I run ogg123, which in turn has noticeable popping in the output. | 04:47 |
| ggi | Any ideas of what's to blame here? My natural reaction was to blame esd, but that can't explain the ogg123 thing. | 04:50 |
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| ggi | Would anyone care if I put up an ogg file with noticeable pops/clicks when played with Rhythmbox somewhere? | 05:09 |
| ggi | Except the copyright holders, obviously. | 05:09 |
| === lamont is happy to introduce http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/byDate/today.html (where today is london time, and only changes if there are new log files for that day...) | ||
| Mithrandir | lamont: RSS feed, pretty please? | 05:11 |
| lamont | Mithrandir: uh, how? | 05:11 |
| === lamont has never done rss... | ||
| Mithrandir | write a perl script using XML::RSS or something? | 05:12 |
| lamont | tsk tsk. | 05:12 |
| lamont | s/perl/python/ | 05:12 |
| Mithrandir | I've only done it in perl, I guess there are python modules to do the same thing. | 05:12 |
| === lamont has no clue where to start... maybe one of your scripts? | ||
| Mithrandir | hmm, you have a cron job pushing over the new data, right? | 05:15 |
| Mithrandir | that is, the new logs. | 05:15 |
| Mithrandir | or rather, how is today.html built? | 05:16 |
| Kamion | pitti: I was planning to do it before release anyway | 05:18 |
| Kamion | pitti: I'm not convinced it's major, since people can just hit Escape | 05:18 |
| pitti | Kamion: my friend was just confused, he did not catch the one-line message which said to press Esc | 05:21 |
| pitti | Kamion: but if it's fixed by the release, I don't really care about the severity :-) | 05:21 |
| pitti | Kamion: another thing: my friend selected English language, but German keyboard in the installer | 05:22 |
| pitti | Kamion: however, the installed system had an English keyboard and POSIX locale | 05:22 |
| pitti | Kamion: shall I submit that as a bug , or do you know about it? | 05:22 |
| Kamion | console or X? | 05:22 |
| pitti | X | 05:22 |
| pitti | I didn't check console | 05:22 |
| pitti | I advised him to switch in Gnome | 05:22 |
| Kamion | do so; if it's just X then it's an X bug | 05:22 |
| pitti | (the keyboard) | 05:23 |
| pitti | okay, I do | 05:23 |
| pitti | standard locale was POSIX | 05:23 |
| Kamion | POSIX locale is the expected result of selecting English at the moment, I think | 05:23 |
| pitti | but he actually needs en_US | 05:23 |
| Kamion | {language,country}chooser are odd | 05:23 |
| Kamion | needs? | 05:23 |
| pitti | because otherwise you cannot enter umlaute otherwise | 05:23 |
| Kamion | ah | 05:23 |
| Kamion | I'd rather not attempt to fix that for warty | 05:23 |
| Kamion | it's subtle and quick to anger | 05:23 |
| pitti | I had him call dpkg-reconfigure locale and set en_US.UTF-8 | 05:23 |
| pitti | Kamion: no, this shouldn't be fixed for warty, but the keyboard selection should work | 05:24 |
| Kamion | sure | 05:24 |
| pitti | I try under console, brb | 05:24 |
| lamont | Mithrandir: the cronjob that pulls the log files processes the output of rsync, actually.. :-) | 05:24 |
| Mithrandir | lamont: so there's no way to say "please give me the log files for $DATE"? | 05:25 |
| lamont | ~lamont/bin/mirrorLogs.py | 05:25 |
| pitti | Kamion: it works correctly at the consoles | 05:25 |
| pitti | Kamion: so, an X configuration bug | 05:25 |
| lamont | only in that it actually builds yyyymmdd.html, and symlinks today.html to it. | 05:25 |
| pitti | Kamion: shall I bother fabbione with that? | 05:25 |
| lamont | what I added today is the symlink to today.thml | 05:25 |
| pitti | Kamion: or is it an installer bug? | 05:25 |
| lamont | Mithrandir: see http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/byDate/ | 05:26 |
| Kamion | pitti: -> fabbione | 05:26 |
| pitti | Kamion: okay, I'll file a bug | 05:26 |
| Kamion | pitti: my job ends when X starts :) | 05:26 |
| pitti | ;-) | 05:26 |
| Kamion | hm, bugger | 05:26 |
| Mithrandir | lamont: yeah.. I could possibly build something off that. it's on rookery, right? | 05:27 |
| lamont | yeahg | 05:27 |
| Kamion | does anyone care if nic-restricted-firmware.udeb doesn't depend on kernel-image or firmware-modules? | 05:27 |
| pitti | Kamion: BTW, his USB key crashes hal, so I also got sth to do now :-) | 05:27 |
| === Kamion figures that if I can live without those dependencies then nobody else is going to care ... | ||
| lamont | Kamion: sounds reasonable, I think. | 05:29 |
| lamont | are udeb's even used anywhere other than d-i? | 05:29 |
| Mithrandir | lamont: no | 05:29 |
| lamont | Mithrandir: btw, would be interested in seeing the RSS feed when you get it happy... | 05:30 |
| Mithrandir | lamont: I'll give it a shot when I've banged my head through a wall with the amd64 nvidia drivers. :) | 05:30 |
| Kamion | in that case http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~cjwatson/kernel-wedge.diff should really be reviewable now | 05:31 |
| Mithrandir | Kamion: I seriously dislike ( while read foo; ... ) < file, but that might just be me. | 05:33 |
| Mithrandir | I'd rather have rewritten that part in awk or python or something. | 05:34 |
| Kamion | Mithrandir: copy-firmware is a cloned-and-hacked copy of copy-modules. I explicitly avoided changing too much stuff because I wanted to keep the diff against copy-modules small. | 05:34 |
| Kamion | I'm slightly uncomfortable with the clone-and-hack in the first place, but it was less risky that way. | 05:35 |
| === Mithrandir blinks over the triple nested subshells and piping between those. | ||
| Mithrandir | Kamion: why not rather use cp -a than two tar processes? | 05:37 |
| Mithrandir | oh, yeah, I see. | 05:37 |
| Keybuk | cpio -p | 05:38 |
| Keybuk | Mithrandir: I dislike ( ) < foo too ... exec 3<&0 <file is better | 05:39 |
| Kamion | 16:34 < Kamion> Mithrandir: copy-firmware is a cloned-and-hacked copy of copy-modules. I explicitly avoided changing too much stuff because I wanted to keep the diff against copy-modules small. | 05:39 |
| thom | NetworkManager appears unkeen on hidden networks | 05:40 |
| Mithrandir | we're shipping the isl3890 firmware now? | 05:40 |
| Mithrandir | that's cool :) | 05:40 |
| Keybuk | thom: yeah, it was written to ignore them; wasn't it? | 05:40 |
| Kamion | if you want to review copy-firmware then please review the diff against copy-modules :) | 05:40 |
| Mithrandir | Kamion: it looks fairly good to me, but I have just read the diff and I don't know kernel-wedge too well. | 05:41 |
| Kamion | http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~cjwatson/copy-firmware.diff | 05:41 |
| thom | Keybuk: unkeen to the point of exploding | 05:41 |
| Keybuk | heh | 05:41 |
| Mithrandir | what's a hidden network? | 05:42 |
| daniels | thom: how's NM coming along? | 05:42 |
| daniels | Mithrandir: wireless network that doesn't beacon | 05:43 |
| Kamion | OK, I'm going to upload kernel-wedge on the basis that an upload of that is fairly harmless by itself, and see about the four client packages | 05:46 |
| thom | daniels: well, i have something that seems to more or less work, kinda | 05:48 |
| thom | it needs a lot more time | 05:48 |
| daniels | thomrad | 05:49 |
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| daniels | npmccallum: hey dude | 06:04 |
| npmccallum | daniels: hey, whats up? | 06:10 |
| Kamion | mdz: let me know if you're happy for me to add firmware udebs to the InstallerSeed and upload them | 06:18 |
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| mdz | Kamion: separate firmware udebs? | 06:52 |
| mdz | Kamion: or add the firmware to the appropriate existing udebs? | 06:52 |
| Kamion | mdz: separate | 06:53 |
| Kamion | it's excessively fiddly to have them mixed in with the existing udebs | 06:53 |
| mdz | as long as they're guaranteed to be synchronized | 06:55 |
| mdz | because that's the point of shipping it together with the kernel | 06:55 |
| Kamion | same source package as linux-kernel-di-* | 06:55 |
| mdz | fine with me, then | 06:55 |
| Kamion | except for the restricted one | 06:56 |
| Kamion | which, AFAICT, needs to be separate | 06:56 |
| Kamion | the rest of them are as guaranteed to be synchronized as you can get | 06:56 |
| Kamion | (I'm correct that we're disallowing main source from building restricted binaries, right?) | 06:57 |
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| mdz | Kamion: it seems logical to have such a restriction | 07:15 |
| elmo_ | yes | 07:20 |
| |trey| | restricted modules package name is....? | 07:20 |
| mdz | |trey|: apt-cache search restricted modules | 07:21 |
| |trey| | mdz: restcted is removed... I don't need them, but I don't recall the name :( | 07:21 |
| Kamion | linux-restricted-modules-* | 07:22 |
| thom | mdz: ok to upload firefox? 1:0.9.3-6 ; plain debian with our branding patches | 07:22 |
| mdz | thom: replied to your email | 07:22 |
| thom | ah, so you did | 07:22 |
| thom | i should set strict threads on my inbox | 07:22 |
| fabbione | hmmmm | 07:25 |
| fabbione | thunderbird keeps crashing on me | 07:26 |
| fabbione | just leaving it open | 07:26 |
| === thom sticks his fingers in his ears and whistles | ||
| thom | mdz: replied | 07:26 |
| seb128 | mdz: ok to upload the patch in #1643 ? | 07:32 |
| mdz | seb128: is this a functional issue or a cosmetic/display issue? | 07:34 |
| seb128 | functional. For the moment the default workgroup for samba in nautilus is WORKGROUP | 07:35 |
| seb128 | if you want to change that the only way is to edit the gconf key directly (no UI) | 07:35 |
| seb128 | with the patch it uses the workgroup in smb.conf if the file exists | 07:35 |
| thom | mdz: i was thinking about this earlier | 07:35 |
| thom | using an epoch is cleaner | 07:36 |
| mdz | seb128: I see | 07:36 |
| mdz | thom: epoch make baby jesus cry :-( | 07:36 |
| thom | but i suspect it's going to cause much pain later on when we want to remerge from debian | 07:36 |
| seb128 | yeah, the epoch is bad | 07:36 |
| thom | the monstrosity is also going to make baby jesus cry, but probably not so much | 07:36 |
| elmo_ | for a temporary reversion, I tend to agree we should use a fugly but non-epoch-ful version | 07:36 |
| mdz | the concatenated version seems less evil because the existing version is already a concatenated monstrosity | 07:36 |
| thom | yeah | 07:36 |
| mdz | wtf is 0.99 anyway? was there ever such a version? | 07:37 |
| thom | we're going to have to munge all the language packs, either which way | 07:37 |
| elmo_ | let's face it - mozilla-firefox makes baby jesus cry. version numbers don't even need to enter into it | 07:37 |
| thom | mdz: 1.0PR sorts higher than 1.0 | 07:37 |
| mdz | thom: how many/which language packs will we get with 0.9.3? | 07:37 |
| Kamion | epoch would break dependencies later => bad | 07:37 |
| Kamion | (in ways we can't fix) | 07:38 |
| thom | mdz: ~11 | 07:38 |
| mdz | thom: sold | 07:39 |
| mdz | shall we stage this someplace? | 07:39 |
| mdz | or just go for warty? | 07:39 |
| thom | i'll stage it, but it'll have to wait for tomorrow morning now :/ | 07:39 |
| Kamion | ~11 as in use the ~ thing? | 07:39 |
| thom | Kamion: as in about | 07:39 |
| Kamion | ah, sorry | 07:40 |
| Kamion | panicked for a second :) | 07:40 |
| mdz | hehe | 07:40 |
| mdz | Kamion: you know, we probably *could* get away with that :-) | 07:40 |
| thom | Kamion: *g* | 07:40 |
| thom | mdz: aaaaaiee | 07:40 |
| mdz | our apt and dpkg both have support for it, our version would still compare positively to woody | 07:40 |
| mdz | but let's not, hmm? :-) | 07:40 |
| thom | mdz: agree 100000000% | 07:41 |
| thom | anyway, i need to go catch up with friends for dinner | 07:41 |
| mdz | thom: if it's a matter of doing builds and setting up a repository, I can do it if you need to go | 07:41 |
| elmo_ | katie will slap you down if you try | 07:41 |
| Kamion | mdz: run awaaaaaaaaaaay | 07:41 |
| |trey| | mdz: Ubuntu shouldn't compare to Woody, should compare to Sarge... | 07:42 |
| thom | mdz: ok, will send you the current diff for firefox | 07:42 |
| Kamion | won't woody's apt fall over if you try to do that? | 07:42 |
| Kamion | |trey|: we don't and can't support upgrades from sarge. | 07:42 |
| mdz | |trey|: the only officially supported upgrade path to warty is from woody | 07:43 |
| Kamion | |trey|: since sarge is not yet released, and will release after us | 07:43 |
| mdz | sarge is newer | 07:43 |
| elmo_ | Kamion: no | 07:43 |
| pitti | mdz: shall I ask elmo to sync libsasl2 (#1899), or did you already take care of this? | 07:43 |
| thom | mdz: sent | 07:43 |
| |trey| | Kamion: I have a Sarge CD... Sarge was supposed to be released on the 12th... its pretty close... | 07:43 |
| mdz | pitti: please do | 07:43 |
| elmo_ | using ~ is in fact entirely feasible, just untested and would require some emergency katie surgery | 07:43 |
| Kamion | |trey|: I am one of Sarge's release managers; if you want more authority I can find the other one | 07:44 |
| mdz | it is entirely feasible, the only problem is that it would be a pointless risk | 07:44 |
| |trey| | Kamion: ha, imma shut up now :) | 07:44 |
| mdz | I don't think the tools choke on '~' or anything in woody, they just don't use the magic | 07:44 |
| pitti | elmo_: Can you please sync cyrus-sasl2 from Debian? See #1899, mdz approved it. | 07:45 |
| mdz | justdave: could you hit #1379 one more time? | 07:46 |
| thom | mdz: (grab firefox 0.9.3 orig from debian) | 07:46 |
| elmo_ | pitti: it's not on the mirror we use yet - please mail me | 07:47 |
| pitti | elmo_: okay, I do | 07:47 |
| thom | *gone*, good night folks | 07:48 |
| seb128 | mdz: so, the smb/gnome-vfs patch, do we want it in ? | 07:48 |
| seb128 | good evening thom | 07:48 |
| mdz | seb128: right, sorry. I've read it and it seems fairly safe. Assuming that both you and James are confident in it for Warty, it's OK with me | 07:49 |
| seb128 | ok, thanks | 07:50 |
| mdz | Kamion: so about ubuntu-meta... | 07:51 |
| Kamion | did you see my comments this morning? | 07:51 |
| mdz | yes | 07:51 |
| mdz | I've made it sort the output | 07:51 |
| mdz | the exceptions are going to suck a bit | 07:51 |
| mdz | so I'm thinking about lowering my expectations | 07:51 |
| mdz | maybe we should just do this by hand for Warty | 07:51 |
| Kamion | sorry about the arch-specific blacklists | 07:51 |
| Kamion | don't have a wiki syntax for those yet | 07:52 |
| mdz | well, if there were a way I could authoritatively test it, that'd be fine | 07:52 |
| mdz | is there already a list someplace of what this thing should spit out? | 07:52 |
| Kamion | for ubuntu-base, compare to debootstrap | 07:52 |
| mdz | ok | 07:52 |
| elmo_ | kamion: hmm, has germinated changed much recently? | 07:53 |
| Kamion | for ubuntu-desktop, take two fresh warty debootstraps, and do 'apt-get install ubuntu-desktop' in one and 'aptitude install ~tubuntu-desktop' in the other | 07:53 |
| Kamion | 2004-09-22 23:38:50 GMT Colin Watson <colin.watson@canonical.com> patch-5 | 07:53 |
| Kamion | elmo_: that's the last code change | 07:53 |
| Kamion | hm, and that was cosmetic | 07:53 |
| Kamion | so no | 07:53 |
| elmo_ | ok, mine's still doing screwy things with ored deps | 07:53 |
| elmo_ | not sure what version I'm on tho, meh | 07:54 |
| Kamion | tla tree-version? | 07:54 |
| elmo_ | colin.watson@canonical.com--2004/germinate--mainline--0 | 07:54 |
| Kamion | hm, is there something that gives the patch number? | 07:54 |
| elmo_ | looks like I was on -3 | 07:55 |
| mdz | Kamion: but we already know that aptitude install ~tubuntu-desktop is buggy :-) | 07:55 |
| Kamion | mdz: how so? | 07:55 |
| Kamion | elmo_: -4 changes the wiki URL, -5 is cosmetic, so ... | 07:55 |
| mdz | Kamion: is it not still doing that gs-esp weirdness? | 07:55 |
| Kamion | mdz: oh, is that aptitude's fault? I think I missed the resolution of that | 07:55 |
| mdz | Kamion: I think it was aptitude and germinate having different ideas about resolving deps | 07:56 |
| mdz | Kamion: and germinate seeming more reasonable in this case | 07:56 |
| Kamion | well, compare against aptitude and check the differences by hand | 07:56 |
| mdz | Kamion: perhaps ubuntu-meta should just use debootstrap to work out the package list? | 07:57 |
| mdz | (for base) | 07:57 |
| mdz | that seems a bit more fragile when doing updates, though | 07:58 |
| elmo_ | kamion: okay, well, is it pulling in dialog for you because of alsa-utils for you? | 07:58 |
| elmo_ | it is for me, and should be pulling in whiptail instead | 07:58 |
| Kamion | elmo_: not here | 08:00 |
| elmo_ | neat | 08:00 |
| Kamion | warty/i386? | 08:00 |
| elmo_ | yeah | 08:00 |
| Kamion | oh, dialog's in universe, so I won't be seeing it | 08:00 |
| elmo_ | well, I dunno which one is doing it to be fair, lemme try and reduce it to a given Packages/Sources | 08:00 |
| Kamion | hmm | 08:00 |
| Kamion | so you cat all the Packages and Sources together, is that right? | 08:00 |
| elmo_ | all the components, for each arch yeah | 08:01 |
| Kamion | lftp rocks far too hard | 08:02 |
| Kamion | lftp archive.ubuntulinux.org:/ubuntu/dists/warty> zcat main/binary-i386/Packages.gz > main-Packages | 08:02 |
| mdz | yes it does | 08:02 |
| Kamion | that just Should Not Work in an FTP client :) | 08:02 |
| |trey| | Out of curiosity, who do I praise about the Human icons? | 08:05 |
| Kamion | elmo_: OK, can reproduce after concatenating all the files | 08:11 |
| Kamion | elmo_: dialog is the first alternative, though ... | 08:12 |
| elmo_ | well.. sure.. but it's pulling in whiptail for something else :) | 08:12 |
| Kamion | elmo_: and whiptail isn't explicitly seeded, it gets pulled in by other stuff | 08:12 |
| Kamion | if it were explicitly seeded it'd probably make the right decision | 08:13 |
| elmo_ | ok | 08:13 |
| Kamion | the only fix I can think of would be to defer all alternated-dependency resolution to a subsequent pass | 08:13 |
| elmo_ | yeah | 08:13 |
| Kamion | and pick some arbitrary minimal set | 08:13 |
| elmo_ | well, I'm easy with either .. for now, I can just hax0r the seed lists | 08:14 |
| elmo_ | (err, either meaning, the other possiblity being to fix the packages) | 08:14 |
| elmo_ | which is obviously no longer an optioin | 08:14 |
| elmo_ | esp. X | 08:14 |
| Kamion | at the moment it just arbitrarily picks the first alternative if it's not already satisfied (which might either be by a seed or by whatever the processing order happens to be | 08:15 |
| Kamion | ) | 08:16 |
| Kamion | you could also use a hint | 08:16 |
| Kamion | i.e. 'base whiptail' or whatever | 08:16 |
| elmo_ | am I meant to have any hints? I don't | 08:17 |
| Kamion | not unless you wanted them | 08:17 |
| Kamion | they're local seed overrides | 08:17 |
| elmo_ | that worked, thanks | 08:18 |
| elmo_ | kamion: hmm,e xcept for the gcc-3.2 chain of doom | 08:27 |
| mdz | any preferences for the firefox version number? | 08:27 |
| mdz | 0.99+1.0PR.1+really0.9.3? | 08:27 |
| mdz | 0.99+1.0PR.1+reverted0.9.3? | 08:28 |
| Kamion | yarrr, suppose I should spend a day on germinate hacking sometime then | 08:28 |
| Kamion | is it urgent (i.e. pre-warty)? | 08:28 |
| elmo_ | kamion: no, doesn't matter, you just reminded me of it by talking about germinate | 08:28 |
| Kamion | ah, ok, good | 08:28 |
| mdz | Kamion: any exceptions or such in desktop that I need to worry about? | 09:00 |
| mdz | I've fixed up ubuntu-meta to check itself against debootstrap | 09:00 |
| Kamion | mdz: don't think so | 09:01 |
| mdz | Kamion: new version at http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~mdz/temp/ubuntu-meta_0.1.tar.gz | 09:01 |
| Kamion | will look later, about to get dragged out | 09:01 |
| Kamion | mdz: BTW, acx driver seems to load its firmware successfully with my new udeb | 09:01 |
| mdz | Kamion: nice! can I test ipw2200 for you? | 09:02 |
| Kamion | mdz: lots of encouraging noises in the syslog, although it doesn't actually *work* for reasons undetermined | 09:02 |
| Kamion | mdz: are you happy to hack up an image yourself or do you want me to do it? I can give you an image later tonight | 09:03 |
| mdz | Kamion: ah, I didn't realize you had a system with an ipw2200 to test | 09:03 |
| mdz | Kamion: I can wait | 09:03 |
| mdz | I would like to get ubuntu-meta in ASAP though | 09:04 |
| Kamion | I don't, but I can do the image nevertheless | 09:04 |
| mdz | Kamion: oh, I thought your second comment was about ipw2200, but I guess you still meant acx | 09:04 |
| Kamion | ah, yes, right | 09:05 |
| Kamion | well, bunch of .old files in that package which I assume you'll remove | 09:05 |
| mdz | heh, just realized that a ton of people are going to remove ubuntu-desktop | 09:05 |
| mdz | because everyone uses totem-xine instead of totem-gstreamer | 09:05 |
| Kamion | looking | 09:05 |
| mdz | that's like the FAQ of all FAQs on #ubuntu | 09:06 |
| Kamion | mdz: looks reasonable to me, although I haven't checked the package lists; the proof of whether it works is likely to be in users' reactions | 09:07 |
| Kamion | mdz: I'm scared of making the installer use it though; would rather have it stay with the task for now | 09:08 |
| mdz | Kamion: oh, I completely agree | 09:08 |
| mdz | its only real purpose is to propagate additions to the seed lists | 09:08 |
| Kamion | mdz: would it be possible also to check that everything in ubuntu-desktop has a Task: ubuntu-desktop line? | 09:08 |
| mdz | I'm going to do the following test: | 09:08 |
| mdz | debootstrap a fresh warty | 09:08 |
| mdz | install ubuntu-base and make sure no deps are unsatisfied | 09:08 |
| |trey| | Kamion: can't you make it depend one or the other (many packages do this) | 09:08 |
| mdz | aptitude install ~tubuntu-desktop | 09:08 |
| mdz | check that no deps are unsatisfied | 09:08 |
| mdz | I'll check the Task: headers too | 09:09 |
| Kamion | |trey|: don't understand what "it" refers to there | 09:09 |
| |trey| | it = ubuntu-desktop | 09:09 |
| Kamion | |trey|: -> mdz :-) | 09:09 |
| mdz | that sort of misses the point | 09:09 |
| Kamion | |trey|: I'm just looking over his package before upload | 09:09 |
| |trey| | Kamion: I knew that :) | 09:09 |
| mdz | the idea is to have it pull in everything in the standard desktop set | 09:10 |
| |trey| | mdz: people need pr0n though, either figure out how we get pr0n via -gstreamer, or let us use -xine cuz it works :) | 09:10 |
| mdz | eventually, totem-gstreamer will work as well as totem-xine or better (we hope), and then we can tell everyone to just install ubuntu-desktop and get back what we think is best as of that day | 09:10 |
| mdz | I don't even find totem-xine to work particularly well | 09:11 |
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| mdz | in terms of playing video streams found on the internet, mplayer is still king | 09:11 |
| mdz | for all its awfulness | 09:11 |
| |trey| | mdz: if -gstreamer is listed first, it will be installed be default... but it makes sure people don't remove ubuntu-desktop, which will allow for easier management of packages for you all :) | 09:11 |
| mdz | if people deviate from the desktop configuration, we respect their choice | 09:11 |
| mdz | but it's all or nothing | 09:12 |
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| |trey| | mdz: "heh, just realized that a ton of people are going to remove ubuntu-desktop ; because everyone uses totem-xine instead of totem-gstreamer" <-- just trying to make this not happen in a sensible way... | 09:13 |
| === Kamion heads off; back around 11 | ||
| mdz | Kamion: thanks | 09:13 |
| mdz | |trey|: people _should_ remove desktop if they choose totem-xine over totem-gstreamer | 09:14 |
| mdz | that's not even a supported package | 09:14 |
| |trey| | mdz: good point... but that isn't really respecting choice.. it makes their choice cause problems | 09:15 |
| mdz | it doesn't cause problems | 09:16 |
| |trey| | if you change package sets via ubuntu-desktop, it would over time, and if thats not the plan, the package would appear useless? | 09:17 |
| mdz | that's an exaggeration | 09:17 |
| |trey| | (for instance, replacing fam with gamin could be done by a conflict and depends in ubuntu-desktop, if you did this, they wouldn't get the change) | 09:17 |
| mdz | as was my "everyone" | 09:17 |
| mdz | the idea is not to force things on people, it's to provide a way for them to keep up if they want to | 09:18 |
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| |trey| | mdz: ok... I just think there should maybe be choices allowed within the package... not everyone has the same exact tastes etc, but would still follow the general set... | 09:19 |
| mdz | noted | 09:19 |
| |trey| | :) | 09:20 |
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| mdz | lamont: ping? | 09:20 |
| lamont | mdz: yo | 09:52 |
| lamont | but about to go to lunch... | 09:53 |
| lamont | window obscured and all that... :-( | 09:53 |
| mdz | lamont: I need a firefox built on all warty architectures | 09:53 |
| mdz | lamont: http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~mdz/firefox/ | 09:53 |
| lamont | sigh. | 09:53 |
| mdz | should keep the machines busy while you're at lunch :-) | 09:54 |
| lamont | yeah | 09:54 |
| lamont | but not uploaded, yes? | 09:54 |
| mdz | correct | 09:54 |
| lamont | building. will advise when I get back | 09:56 |
| mdz | thanks | 09:56 |
| |trey| | lamont = build master or whatever? (forget correct term) | 10:02 |
| Keybuk | you're too young to know the correct term for lamont :p | 10:05 |
| hazmat | is inotify in the ubuntu kernels? | 10:05 |
| |trey| | GNU is older then me I think :( | 10:06 |
| hazmat | i wanted to do some beagle development, and inotify in the kernel is a prereq at the moment | 10:06 |
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| Keybuk | hazmat: inotify is just a *wee* bit under development | 10:06 |
| |trey| | I think announcement was Febuary? So by a month 8) | 10:06 |
| Keybuk | heh, that makes you older than daniels, I think | 10:07 |
| hazmat | Keybuk, good point, but so's the linux kernel ;-) | 10:08 |
| |trey| | I wasted too much time during high school... could have been learning languages, instead was getting high :/ | 10:08 |
| Keybuk | hazmat: heh, last time I played with that it needed a version of inotify rml hadn't actually released yet | 10:09 |
| hazmat | Keybuk, fun quote. "The _reality_ is that there is _no_ point in time where you and Linus allow for stabilization of the main tree prior to release. The release criteria has devolved to a point where we call it done when the stack of pancakes gets too high. | 10:09 |
| hazmat | -- Jeff Garzik " | 10:09 |
| Keybuk | yeah I saw that :) | 10:09 |
| hazmat | i'll see if i can get this patch to apply to the ubuntu kernel http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/people/rml/inotify/v2.6/0.13/ | 10:10 |
| Keybuk | there's a few rather major security issues on the todo list for it, aren't there? | 10:10 |
| Keybuk | plus there's no way to make udev make the device node when it needs to yet | 10:11 |
| hazmat | Keybuk, i'm fuzzy on the impl details, i've been following along from the perspective of wanting to work on beagle/dashboard, but my understanding if your using udev then its not an issue.. if your not the dev node needs to be managed by hand... re security.. dunno. i would hope it checks access against the watched | 10:17 |
| |trey| | Wierd question, I filed a bug report enhancement pertaining to the menu, it doesn't appear to be in the db anymore, why would that be? | 10:18 |
| mako | mdz: you around? | 10:29 |
| mdz | mako: yep | 10:30 |
| mako | mdz: i just saw your message to ubuntu-announce about the livecd | 10:34 |
| mako | send tuesday or wahtever | 10:34 |
| mdz | yes? | 10:34 |
| mako | i haven't been checking -announce daily for moderator requests | 10:34 |
| mako | so it didn't go out | 10:34 |
| mako | two things | 10:34 |
| mako | apparently, neither has jeff | 10:34 |
| mako | so two things | 10:34 |
| mdz | whoa | 10:35 |
| mako | (1) should i sent it off on its way now? | 10:35 |
| mdz | fabbione: I just upgraded xserver-xfree86 on amd64 and it asked me the driver question and the keyboard question | 10:35 |
| mdz | mako: I was wondering why there were so few downloads of it | 10:35 |
| mdz | yes, it should go out now | 10:35 |
| mako | (2) since it's probabl just you, me, jeff, and mark that will be using that list, it's best to just poke me or cd me | 10:35 |
| mdz | I don't remember getting a message telling me it was moderated | 10:35 |
| mako | mdz: i will write have procmail redirect those requests into my main canonical box | 10:36 |
| mako | mdz: maybe a filter caught it.. | 10:36 |
| mako | everything on that list is going to be moderated | 10:36 |
| mako | including my own posts.. | 10:36 |
| mako | until we get something like key-based auth | 10:36 |
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| sivang | can anybody explain how to enable colors for c code in vim? | 10:37 |
| mako | mdz: sent now | 10:37 |
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| mako | mdz: in the future, don't hesitate to poke me | 10:38 |
| mdz | mako: I would have if I had realized it didn't go out :-) | 10:38 |
| mdz | in fact I would have approved it myself | 10:38 |
| mdz | justdave: ping? | 10:39 |
| justdave | mdz pong | 10:39 |
| mdz | sivang: -> #ubuntu | 10:39 |
| mdz | justdave: can you follow up on #1379? | 10:39 |
| justdave | done | 10:40 |
| mdz | thanks | 10:42 |
| mdz | fabbione: never mind, false alarm | 10:43 |
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| seb128 | justdave: any news for the upstream status ? It would really help to sort the bug list | 11:10 |
| justdave | seb128: I'll try to get in tonight. It should be pretty quick to throw in | 11:57 |
| seb128 | thanks | 11:57 |
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