[12:00] <lamont>          <default>splash/ubuntu-splash.png</default>
[12:02] <lamont> which is the nekid ppl, so it's just as well that it's b0rke
[12:05] <mdz> jdub: what's the status of the gold artwork packages for the CD?
[12:05] <jdub> mdz: uploaded
[12:05] <jdub> being tested atm
[12:07] <lamont> jdub: it's clearly showing gnome-splash.png
[12:07] <lamont> any chance that it just doesn't like the symlink?
[12:08] <jdub> that'd be livecd specific
[12:13] <alextreme> i'm sure it is. annoying issue, especially as it did work in earlier builds
[12:14] <lamont> jdub: what should we be using in place of the globe shot for bootsplash?
[12:15] <jdub> sabdfl/jane/i chose circle of friends background last week
[12:15] <jdub> sabdfl: your call on changing that one :)
[12:15] <lamont> currently have http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~lamont/background.png
[12:18] <sabdfl> ok guys, which image should we use for livecd boot splash?
[12:18] <sabdfl> my vote is the new gdm login (Human)
[12:18] <sabdfl> without the login
[12:19] <lamont> url?
[12:19] <sabdfl> would look good with the orange / yello progress bar
[12:19] <alextreme> indeed, would be a nice choice
[12:19] <lamont> alextreme: is that also 15-index?
[12:19] <alextreme> no, thats the 16bit 1024x768 jpg
[12:20] <alextreme> ubuntulinux.org had it on the frontpage last time i checked
[12:20] <lamont> alextreme: I mean that we need
[12:20] <lamont> the package currently has a very small .png
[12:21] <alextreme> which one? the gfxboot theme?
[12:23] <sabdfl> i have the image, can convert it
[12:23] <lamont> morphix-wathog-background
[12:23] <sabdfl> save as 1024x768 png?
[12:24] <sabdfl> anything special in the save?
[12:24] <chrisa> Can the d-i version on the ubuntu discs install the base system without requiring the user use the partitioner (ie: I mount / to /target manually) ?
[12:24] <alextreme> lamont: afaik that isn't even used
[12:24] <jdub> sabdfl: mmm, bright :)
[12:24] <lamont> alextreme: then where does it get that image?
[12:25] <sabdfl> want me to tone it down a shade?
[12:25] <alextreme> lamont: from ubuntu-artwork
[12:25] <alextreme> lamont: and the miniroot gets it from the bootsplash udeb package
[12:26] <lamont> alextreme: ah, cool.
[12:27] <sabdfl> alextreme: it needs the ubuntu log layered over the top
[12:27] <sabdfl> will send you a version directly, or should it go to lamont?
[12:27] <sabdfl> just save as png, or do i need to do something special?
[12:27] <lamont> just need to know where to put it...
[12:28] <alextreme> sabdfl: bootsplash only uses jpg afaik
[12:28] <alextreme> and indeed, lamont has more use of it
[12:29] <Kamion> chrisa: not sure, in theory it might be possible to mount /target etc. by hand but I've never tried it
[12:30] <Kamion> chrisa: feel free to try it, but you may run into a few issues
[12:31] <chrisa> Kamion: I just recall d-i having a way to skip the partitioner, however I can't recall how
[12:31] <Kamion> chrisa: d-i might have had that a long time ago, but not recently
[12:31] <Kamion> chrisa: you'll have to hack something to persuade main-menu to stop trying to run the partitioner due to udeb dependencies
[12:31] <lamont> file background.png 
[12:31] <lamont> background.png: JPEG image data, JFIF standard 1.01
[12:31] <lamont> you tell me....
[12:32] <Kamion> chrisa: is running the partitioner actively harmful?
[12:32] <chrisa> Kamion: What seems to be a bug in parted is keeping it from seeing partitions on my main drive
[12:32] <mjg59> Kamion: Bleah, I utterly failed to be organised enough to sort out getting that laptop off you today
[12:32] <Kamion> can you run the partitioner and do nothing in it?
[12:32] <mjg59> When's good for you?
[12:32] <chrisa> fdisk can see the partitions, booting to debian and trying parted there has the same trouble
[12:33] <Kamion> mjg59: I'm still up, about to go out briefly anyway, if you're still up then I can come over
[12:33] <chrisa> Kamion: It will then complain no root is specified
[12:33] <Kamion> chrisa: true, that just occurred to me too
[12:33] <Kamion> I'd attempt to hack /var/lib/dpkg/status but this is an expert option :)
[12:33] <alextreme> lamont: i guess that kind of .png would work too :)
[12:33] <mjg59> Kamion: Ok, I guess that works - are you driving? If not, it seems a bit far to go out of your way
[12:34] <Kamion> driving, yes
[12:34] <Kamion> about to go see if Tesco's still open
[12:35] <mjg59> Ah, ok :)
[12:36] <mjg59> If that's not a problem, then that'd be cool
[12:36] <mjg59> I'm at 6 Petworth Street
[12:36] <mjg59> Don't suppose you have a spare piece of cat 5, too? :)
[12:36] <Kamion> think so, yes
[12:36] <Kamion> shortish
[12:37] <Kamion> I forgot to do the install, do you need a CD?
[12:37] <mjg59> Urgh. yes, if possible - I lent mine to someone and haven't got it back
[12:37] <doko> mdz, jdub: mvo just pointed out to me, that two ISDN related packages would be really nice to have on the CD ... pppdcapiplugin and isdnactivecards. I know, very late.
[12:38] <sabdfl> so png or jpg?
[12:38] <lamont> jpg
[12:38] <Mitario> yay! is it tomorrow already?
[12:38] <Mitario> :p
[12:38] <sabdfl> lamont: png would be better quality, can it handle either?
[12:38] <jdub> doko: i don't want to change anything like that at this stage, even additions to the cd
[12:38] <lamont> sabdfl: really no idea
[12:40] <lamont> as it sits, the old globe-centered thing was 28KB of jpg
[12:40] <lamont> in a file named background.png
[12:40] <sabdfl> nice
[12:40] <lamont> I could sure try png first
[12:40] <sabdfl> will send you both
[12:40] <lamont> k
[12:42] <mvo_> jdub: I certainly understand that. the problem for people using isdn is, that they won't be able to connect to the internet without those two packages. but I'm also very nervous about a change like this
[12:42] <lamont> sabdfl: if you sent them, I didn't see them...
[12:43] <sabdfl> just coming up now
[12:43] <jdub> mvo_: wish we'd known earlier, there are a bunch of things like that on the cd
[12:43] <lamont> ok
[12:43] <mvo_> jdub: ok
[12:43] <lamont> and liveCD is pretty much ENOSPC....
[12:43] <lamont> really really at risk to add anything else
[12:44] <lamont> alextreme: mdz poke you about sound?
[12:44] <Kamion> at some point we have to declare "out of time"
[12:44] <sabdfl> lamont: should be there now
[12:44] <lamont> email?
[12:45] <alextreme> lamont: about alsa probing?
[12:45] <sabdfl> mvo_: do those packages affect anything in the install?
[12:45] <lamont> I think so
[12:45] <sabdfl> can't touch the installer
[12:46] <Kamion> those two packages are not in warty currently
[12:46] <mvo_> yes, they are universe
[12:47] <alextreme> lamont: didn't you get my jabber msg last night? I uploaded a new version of morphix-base-conf with reversed loading, but wasn't sure if it worked
[12:47] <sabdfl> lamont: they arrive?
[12:47] <sabdfl> 100kb jpg, 280kb png
[12:48] <lamont> sabdfl: can you toss them somewhere wget'able/scp able
[12:48] <Kamion> mvo_: as I understand it, elmo is currently travelling, which means we'd need to push the CD builds *way* back in order to add new packages from universe.
[12:48] <Kamion> (since they need to be moved into a different component)
[12:49] <sabdfl> lamont: scp chinstrap.warthogs.hbd.com:~mark/livecdsplash.* .
[12:49] <sabdfl> elmo's here
[12:49] <Kamion> ah
[12:50] <mvo_> Kamion: ok
[12:50] <lamont> greylisting delayed the mail on fiordland
[12:50] <lamont> prettiful
[12:50] <doko> jdub: trying to set my background: the application "gnome-background-properties" did unexpectedly terminate.
[12:54] <seb128> doko: 
[12:54] <seb128>  ubuntu-artwork (0.2.14-1) warty; urgency=low
[12:54] <seb128>  .
[12:54] <seb128>    * Avoid tweaking idiotic background crasher with wallpapers.xml
[12:54] <seb128> doko: you probably want this
[12:55] <jdub> yeah, it gives you the love
[12:55] <doko> find it on chinstrap as well?
[12:55] <jdub> yeah
[12:56] <lamont> jdub: another ubuntu-artwork??? sigh
[12:56] <jdub> heh
[12:56] <chrisa> 'idiotic background crasher' ?
[12:56] <lamont> source uploaded?
[12:56] <jdub> the wallpaper xml tweaked a bug in the background capplet code
[12:56] <jdub> making it crash
[12:56] <jdub> lamont: yeah
[12:56] <lamont> but less than 26 minutes ago,eh?
[12:57] <jdub> yeah
[01:01] <mdz> lamont: ETA for ubuntu-artwork 0.2.14-1?
[01:02] <lamont> build starts in about 2 minutes, in archive at :33
[01:02] <lamont> although elmo could slamdunk cron.daily anytime after about :10 and it should be there..
[01:03] <azeem> mako: thanks
[01:07] <mdz> elmo: slamdunk?
[01:07] <lamont> the truly impatient will find the .deb at http://people.u.o/~lamont/ubuntu-artwork_0.2.14-1_all.deb
[01:07] <lamont> elmo was driving across england earlier, has he arrived?
[01:08] <Kamion> apparently
[01:09] <lamont> dupload done, should be accepted in 30 se
[01:09] <lamont> c
[01:09] <lamont> then it could be slamdunked
[01:09] <mdz> lamont: <sabdfl> elmo's here
[01:10] <lamont> ah, well. the
[01:10] <lamont> n
[01:15] <sabdfl> lamont: should be done in about 3 minutes
[01:16] <lamont> alextreme: /tmp/modules-rev.pcimap No such file
[01:17] <lamont> alextreme: that's with 0.5-18 morphix-base-conf
[01:18] <sabdfl> lamont, Kamion: artwork should be visible now
[01:18] <alextreme> lamont: doh, yet another shameless bug. wait a sec
[01:19] <lamont> "carrousel begins..."
[01:21] <alextreme> lamont: available for now on m.org/incoming, will be synced soon. literally a one-char fix
[01:22] <lamont> -19?
[01:22] <alextreme> yup
[01:22] <mdz> Kamion: that countrychooser weirdness didn't happen to me before
[01:22] <mdz> this is on a recent daily
[01:23] <jdub> sabdfl: i'm going to leave pretty descriptions for the calendar packages up to you
[01:23] <jdub> sabdfl: need a one-liner and one-paragrapher for ubuntu-calendar
[01:24] <jdub> sabdfl: and something generic we can use for ubuntu-calendar-<month>
[01:24] <Kamion> mdz: fairly certain nothing's changed there though ...
[01:24] <Kamion> mdz: oh, there was the "/etc/environmment" fix, I guess
[01:25] <Kamion> that fixed a different bug
[01:25] <Kamion> but in any case I don't see that it would have affected this
[01:29] <mdz> Kamion,jdub,sabdfl: is this the one?
[01:30] <Kamion> mdz: depends whether you think the en_US thing's a showstopper
[01:30] <mdz> Kamion: depends on whether it happens with the new CD build :-)
[01:30] <Kamion> my question is more why it didn't happen before
[01:31] <mdz> I am clueless on that point
[01:31] <mdz> I didn't even notice it when I tested the CD
[01:31] <mdz> because I didn't run perl from the command line until now
[01:32] <Kamion> I don't think it'll break anything, just generate warnings
[01:32] <Kamion> en_US is lucky to be close enough to C for most things that you tend not to notice locale problems
[01:32] <Kamion> I don't even know why LANGUAGE is set at all, to be honest
[01:33] <mdz> neither do I
[01:33] <mdz> I don't think it was previously
[01:33] <Kamion> if it turns out to be a showstopper I'm half-inclined to delete it, but the possible consequences are numerous and hard to test
[01:33] <Kamion> at least in base-config
[01:33] <mdz> maybe gdm mangles it
[01:33] <Kamion> it could be that base-config used to mangle it
[01:33] <Kamion> it has been set for a long time
[01:34] <Kamion> anyway, I'm going over to mjg59's, back soon
[01:39] <sabdfl> mdz: let's tread very carefully at this point ;-)
[01:39] <mdz> sabdfl: hmm?
[01:39] <sabdfl> changes on the night of release
[01:39] <sabdfl> what's this new one about?
[01:40] <sabdfl> i haven't seen it
[01:41] <mdz> I don't suggest that we change it even if it is an installer bug
[01:41] <mdz> I just ended up with some broken stuff in /etc/environment for locale settings
[01:42] <sabdfl> consequence?
[01:42] <mdz> the worst of it is ~5 lines of spew from perl every time it's invoked
[01:42] <mdz> which means ~50 lines of spew from an apt run
[01:42] <sabdfl> every apt run?
[01:42] <sabdfl> for all users?
[01:42] <mdz> perl: warning: Setting locale failed.
[01:42] <mdz> perl: warning: Please check that your locale settings:
[01:42] <mdz>         LANGUAGE = "en_GB:en_US:en",
[01:42] <mdz>         LC_ALL = (unset),
[01:42] <mdz>         LC_COLLATE = "C",
[01:42] <mdz>         LANG = "en_US.UTF-8"
[01:42] <mdz>     are supported and installed on your system.
[01:42] <mdz> perl: warning: Falling back to the standard locale ("C").
[01:42] <mdz> only ones where a maintainer script uses perl
[01:42] <mdz> which is, well, most of them
[01:42] <mdz> I'm not going to panic unless it's still this way after a fresh install
[01:43] <sabdfl> if it is, let's delay release long enough to have a good nights sleep on it
[01:43] <jdub> mdz: seems like it is
[01:43] <jdub> fresh install from last night
[01:43] <jdub> might be wrong
[01:44] <mdz> see, this is what happens when I take the weekend off :-P
[01:44] <jdub> can do another install
[01:44] <mdz> jdub: what's in yours?
[01:44] <mdz> LANG="en_US"
[01:44] <mdz> LANGUAGE="en_GB:en_US:en"
[01:44] <jdub> jdub@ubuntu:~ $ cat /etc/environment LANGUAGE="en_AU:en_GB:en_US:en"
[01:44] <jdub> LANG=en_AU
[01:46] <mdz> shit
[01:46] <chrisa> It'll be amazing if this ubuntu system boots
[01:47] <jdub> mdz: not getting any spew
[01:47] <sabdfl> chrisa: any interesting mods?
[01:47] <mdz> jdub: perhaps because you have en_AU
[01:47] <mdz> jdub: while I do not have en_GB
[01:47] <mdz> jdub: what's in /etc/locale.gen?
[01:47] <jdub> aha
[01:48] <jdub> jdub@ubuntu:~ $ cat /etc/locale.gen
[01:48] <jdub> en_AU ISO-8859-1
[01:49] <mdz> I think this is probably caused by the fix for #2195
[01:49] <lamont> sabdfl: btw, 16-bit colors, /me converted
[01:50] <lamont> jdub: would me running in 16-bit space explain the gnome-splash picking the wrong one?
[01:51] <mjg59> It's so crap it can't even scale 640x480 to 1024x768 without making a huge mess
[01:51] <lamont> that's not the C3 pos, is it?
[01:51] <mjg59> Yeah
[01:52] <lamont> sigh
[01:52] <jdub> lamont: no
[01:52] <mjg59> If I can get ACPI working on this, we are obviously destined to win
[01:52] <lamont> jdub: well, hope springs eternal and all that.. :-(
[01:52] <mjg59> Ooh, it's got a nipples install
[01:53] <chrisa> sabdfl: Just a bunch of hacks so I could get around the partitioner
[01:54] <lamont> new and improved builds running (home and DC), with hopefully correct art, and maybe even sound
[01:55] <sabdfl> mjg59: think of it as a challenge more than a gift :-)
[01:55] <sabdfl> lamont: to jpg, or png?
[01:57] <lamont> 1024x768, 16-bit jpeg only
[01:57] <Kamion> mdz: the safest fix I can think of is to prepend LANG to LANGUAGE
[01:57] <Mitario> i love hacky mockup coding
[01:57] <sabdfl> ok, how's it look?
[01:57] <mjg59> That's interesting
[01:58] <lamont> looked good on the machine where I changed it.  We'll see what the laptop says.
[01:58] <mjg59> I hadn't previously noticed that the craptop had two sets of volume keys
[01:58] <Kamion> mjg59: realised I forgot to set a useful password for you, but I assume you booted recovery and got on with life
[01:58] <lamont> btw, when I'm scrounging surplus stores looking for a G3 or later, what kind of price should I be expecting?
[01:59] <mjg59> Kamion: Yeah, sorted
[02:00] <Kamion> mdz: I have LANG=en_US and LANGUAGE=en_GB:en_US:en, but perl doesn't warn
[02:01] <Kamion> install not finished yet
[02:01] <Kamion> mdz: I note that you have LANG=en_US.UTF-8
[02:02] <Kamion> mdz: did you definitely generate that locale?
[02:03] <sabdfl> lamont: can you put the converted image up somewhere?
[02:04] <Kamion> when did I say that? :)
[02:05] <lamont> p.u.o/~lamont/bootsplash-1024x768.jpg
[02:05] <mdz> Kamion: yeah, I just noticed the same thing
[02:05] <mdz> it's a false alarm
[02:05] <mdz> I copied in a shell init file that set en_US.UTF-8
[02:05] <mdz> Kamion: phew
[02:06] <sabdfl> :-)
[02:06] <Kamion> it's so rare to be able to put something down to mdz pilot error that I just didn't think of it at first :-)
[02:06] <mdz> Kamion: I assume the candidate is /current/ now?
[02:06] <sabdfl> mdz: you and your utf-8
[02:07] <Kamion> mdz: yes
[02:07] <mdz> ok, downloading it
[02:07] <mdz> will test all around
[02:07] <sabdfl> ok, so release schedule tomorrow
[02:07] <Kamion> note to world, actually going to bed this release
[02:07] <Kamion> (I know it's not traditional)
[02:08] <mdz> well, we missed 0000 UTC. what's our second choice? :-)
[02:08] <lamont> Kamion: always a first time, eh>?
[02:08] <sabdfl> Kamion: please do, take a friend :-)
[02:08] <sabdfl> mdz, what's the earliest we can do tomorrow?
[02:08] <mdz> lamont: live CD status?
[02:08] <mdz> do we have a live CD release candidate?
[02:09] <lamont> eta 8 minutes to a testing image
[02:11] <lamont> at some point, well need to push the liveCD RC to little etc., which is beyond my scope...
[02:11] <Kamion> mdz: if I'm crashed, '/srv/cdimage.no-name-yet.com/bin/cron.daily' should be sufficient to build a CD, no need for DATE_SUFFIX hacking like before.
[02:11] <mdz> Kamion: ok, I'll likely stay up until you're awake
[02:12] <Kamion> mdz: feel free to phone me if need be, it may wake me up :)
[02:12] <alextreme> lamont: i have access to little, if Kamion is busy
[02:12] <lamont> so does mdz, etc.
[02:12] <Kamion> I'd like to be quite careful about where the live CD RC goes on little
[02:13] <Kamion> a little extra scripting work may be required
[02:13] <Kamion> (although hopefully not)
[02:14] <mjg59> sabdfl: He's gone away again, thankfully...
[02:14] <alextreme> i'll leave it to you then
[02:14] <Kamion> sabdfl: are we calling the images in releases.ubuntu.com "warty-final-install-i386.iso", or what?
[02:14] <Kamion> mjg59: I love you too
[02:14] <lamont> http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~lamont/testing/LiveCD/20041020-01/warty-live-i386-20041020-01.iso
[02:14] <sabdfl> Kamion: or warty-release?
[02:14] <Kamion> sabdfl: fine by me
[02:14] <sabdfl> mdz?
[02:14] <mjg59> Kamion: If that were true, you wouldn't have given me this laptop
[02:14] <mdz> final is fine with me
[02:15] <mdz> as is release
[02:15] <mdz> I'm easy
[02:15] <sabdfl> release then
[02:15] <elmo_> warty-easy-install-i386.iso
[02:15] <sabdfl> got to :-)
[02:15] <mjg59> warty-yes-yes-yes-oh-yes-i386.iso
[02:15] <lamont> 642.4MB
[02:15] <Kamion> elmo_: warty's not easy, she just has negotiable virtue
[02:15] <sabdfl> mjg59: alas, those bits got censored
[02:16] <mdz> so shall we test the candidates, then sleep on it and release in the morning?
[02:16] <sabdfl> night all, see you in the morning
[02:16] <mdz> or go out while you guys sleep? :-P
[02:16] <lamont> hehe
[02:16] <sabdfl> you test now, we'll test in the morning
[02:16] <mdz> ok
[02:16] <lamont> I like the release before they wake up idea...
[02:16] <Kamion> definitely not allowed to release warty while I'm asleep :)
[02:17] <sabdfl> Kamion: do you ever?
[02:17] <Kamion> (if nothing else, publish-release is still a bit on the untested side)
[02:17] <sabdfl> one eye open
[02:17] <jdub> wget http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~jdub/ubuntu-calendar_4.10_all.deb http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~jdub/ubuntu-calendar-october_4.10_all.deb
[02:17] <jdub> sabdfl: you wear a borg headset too? :)
[02:17] <sabdfl> jdub: resistance is... fun, really
[02:18] <Kamion> elmo_: will you have a chance to process jigit? mdz approved it for Supported
[02:18] <mdz> I'd liek to nail down a time now
[02:18] <mdz> so that I can arrange to be awake
[02:19] <sabdfl> 1200 UTC has a nice ring to it
[02:19] <sabdfl> mirrors should be synced if they are doing it every 6 hours
[02:19] <elmo_> Kamion: hmmm, process it how?
[02:19] <sabdfl> erm, sorry
[02:19] <mdz> elmo_: NEW, I presume
[02:20] <sabdfl> what UTC is 8am LA time?
[02:20] <elmo_> jigit_1.14-1_source.changes
[02:20] <elmo_> REJECT
[02:20] <elmo_> Rejected: Unknown distribution `unstable'.
[02:20] <Kamion> elmo_: bugger
[02:20] <mdz> sabdfl: 8+7=15
[02:20] <sabdfl> ok
[02:20] <mdz> I can do 1200 UTC as well; it just means taking an early sleep
[02:20] <sabdfl> work for you?
[02:21] <mdz> yep
[02:21] <sabdfl> ok, 15:00 UTC
[02:21] <sabdfl> mdz: can you keep a phone handy? only elmo, kamion or me will call
[02:21] <sabdfl> just in case
[02:21] <Kamion> elmo_: 1.14-1ubuntu1 uploaded
[02:21] <mdz> certainly
[02:22] <sabdfl> otherwise, see you around 1400 UTC to get ready
[02:22] <Mithrandir> sleep tight
[02:22] <mjg59> Mm. Monkeypop.
[02:22] <sabdfl> night all, for good this time
[02:22] <sabdfl> well, for a few hours good
[02:22] <lamont> this time with the correct artwork
[02:23] <jdub> sabdfl: were you going to call?
[02:23] <lamont> that's a bug I'm gonna have to hurt
[02:23] <sabdfl> jdub: calendar worked first time
[02:23] <elmo_> SKIP (too new)
[02:23] <elmo_> Rejected: jigit_1.14-1ubuntu1.dsc refers to jigit_1.14.orig.tar.gz, but I can't find it in the queue or in the pool.
[02:23] <sabdfl> jdub: yes, was tkaing the phone to bed
[02:23] <Kamion> I suck
[02:23] <jdub> kinky
[02:23] <sabdfl> don't even think about it
[02:23] <sabdfl> pants ON!
[02:23] <Kamion> or dpkg-genchanges sucks, not sure which
[02:23] <elmo_> it doesn't think 1ubuntu1 == 1
[02:23] <elmo_> which is fair enough, kind of
[02:24] <azeem> only if ubuntu != 0 :)
[02:24] <mdz> lamont: URL for live CD candidate?
[02:24] <Kamion> except that it's already in the uploadqueue
[02:24] <lamont> mdz: give me 25 minutes
[02:25] <lamont> &*_%+^*( udeb fetcher doesn't fetch the newest version of a package if multiple versions exist.
[02:25] <lamont> hence bad artwork
[02:25] <mdz> lamont: 8 minutes, 25 minutes...we'll be here all night!
[02:25] <mdz> :-)
[02:25] <elmo_> Kamion: just upload the orig.tar.gz? 
[02:25] <elmo_> or I can forcibly reject it, if you want
[02:25] <lamont> mdz: saved you the time to download and burn it before you screamed, at least...
[02:25] <Kamion> elmo_: it's not in the .changes ...
[02:26] <Kamion> does that matter
[02:26] <Kamion> ?
[02:26] <mdz> Kamion: I can upload it if you want to sleep
[02:26] <doogie> elmo works on ubuntu, or elmo is commenting on a ubuntu upload into debian?
[02:26] <elmo_> kamion: katie's Special and can  handle that
[02:26] <Kamion> mdz: it's ok, doing other things
[02:26] <Kamion> elmo_: uploaded, I think
[02:29] <mdz> Kamion: accepted
[02:29] <Kamion> elmo_: thanks
[02:31] <seb128> time to sleep, 'night
[02:41] <mdz> night, seb
[02:41] <mjg59> Wow
[02:42] <mjg59> This laptop is fucked :)
[02:43] <Kamion> mjg59: good, isn't it?
[02:45] <Kamion> ok, now I'm stumbling around the room walking into things, this is bad
[02:45] <Kamion> goodnight
[02:45] <Kamion> (muscles sore from karate yesterday, it's not all tiredness :-))
[02:45] <lamont> maybe even jujutsu tomorrow night
[02:49] <lamont> mdz: http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~lamont/testing/LiveCD/20041020-01/warty-live-i386-20041020-01.iso
[02:50] <lamont> will try to bail after an hour or so, but dunno what'll happen.
[02:51] <mdz> amd64 and powerpc installs successful
[02:51] <chrisa> lamont: Did you do the mplayer build/upload?
[02:52] <lamont> chrisa: i386, or elsewhere?
[02:52] <lamont> chrisa: OTOH, before the upload, it was FTBFS
[02:52] <chrisa> i386
[02:53] <lamont> something to worry about after I get back.
[02:53] <lamont> chrisa: my only change was to add xmms-dev to the build-deps, so that it would quit bitching about not finding libxmms.so.1
[02:53] <lamont> anyway, back in a bit.
[02:54] <mdz> lamont: downloading now
[02:54] <chrisa> lamont: I'm going to see what happens when I build it locally
[02:55] <lamont> chrisa: thanks
[02:55] <lamont> patches welcome.
[02:55] <lamont> probably for tonight only, if mdz forgives us.
[02:55] <lamont> gone.
[02:58] <chrisa> lamont: It works when I build / install the package myself (just an fyi)
[02:59] <mdz> yeah, breaks for me too
[03:00] <chrisa> mplayer's error says it's related to not being built for the correct cpu type, my guess would be the CFLAGS are a bit too specific for a i386 package
[03:00] <mdz> looks like it's built for p4
[03:01] <chrisa> I'm running on an athlon xp
[03:02] <mdz> lamont: live CD is fucked
[03:02] <mdz> never mind, booted it in the USB drive, that never works
[03:02] <mdz> chrisa: likewise
[03:02] <mdz> CPUflags:  MMX: 1 MMX2: 1 3DNow: 0 3DNow2: 0 SSE: 1 SSE2: 0
[03:02] <mdz> Compiled for x86 CPU with extensions: MMX MMX2 SSE SSE2
[03:03] <mdz> it's probably trying to use SSE2
[03:07] <jdub> mdz: what's our policy for universe fixes and syncs going to be post-final?
[03:09] <mdz> jdub: for stuff which doesn't build or work, I think we can be fairly liberal
[03:10] <mdz> for stuff which does build and work, i think our policy should be fairly similar to main
[03:10] <mdz> jdub: have you tested the candidates?
[03:11] <jdub> can't download until off-peak :|
[03:11] <jdub> uploaded calendar packages
[03:14] <mdz> jdub: presumably those are NEW?
[03:14] <mdz> elmo just went to sleep
[03:14] <jdub> yeah
[03:25] <mjg59> I've tracked this machine down
[03:25] <mjg59> It's an ECS G320
[03:37] <mdz> the progress meter on the live CD is...weird
[03:38] <mdz> the grub one
[03:38] <mdz> the bootsplash looks nice, though
[03:38] <sladen> hmmm
[03:39] <mdz> jdub: gnome splash on the live CD seems to be the default gnome one
[03:39] <jdub> yeah
[03:40] <mdz> that's expected?
[03:40] <jdub> well, known
[03:40] <jdub> can you do this:
[03:41] <jdub> grep -A 4 splash_image /etc/gconf/schemas/gnome-session.schemas
[03:41] <jdub> i don't think lamont answered that earlier
[03:42] <mdz> Oct 19 14:56:40 <jdub>  what does 'grep -A 3 splash_image /etc/gconf/schemas/gnome-session.schemas' say on the livecd?
[03:42] <mdz> Oct 19 15:00:38 <lamont>                 <default>splash/ubuntu-splash.png</default>
[03:42] <mdz> Oct 19 15:02:20 <lamont>        which is the nekid ppl, so it's just as well that it's b0rke
[03:43] <mdz> I checked it in the running system, and it's the same
[03:43] <jdub> see, that oughta work :)
[03:43] <mdz> the file is present, a symlink to ubuntu-logo-508x340.png
[03:43] <jdub> unless there's some gconf b0rk on the cd
[03:44] <jdub> mdz: type this:gconftool-2 --get /apps/gnome-session/options/splash_image
[03:44] <mdz> should gconftool-2 -g /apps/gnome-session/options/splash_image show somethinG?
[03:44] <mdz> just tried that, it comes up blank
[03:44] <mdz> gconftool-2 -g /schemas/... gives the value, though
[03:44] <jdub> there's our problem
[03:46] <mdz> great. how do we fix it?
[03:46] <jdub> dunno
[03:46] <jdub> will probably have to boot the livecd to nut it out
[03:46] <jdub> how about
[03:46] <jdub> ls /tmp/gconf-* ?
[03:46] <jdub> ls /tmp/gconfd-* ?
[03:46] <jdub> sorry
[03:47] <mdz> jdub: /tmp/gconfd-warty contains one subdir, 'lock'
[03:47] <mdz> which itself contains one regular file, 'ior'
[03:48] <jdub> rwx user only, etc?
[03:48] <mdz> which has 609 bytes of text data in it
[03:48] <mdz> correct
[03:48] <jdub> hrm
[03:50] <mdz> warty@ubuntu:~/.gconf/apps/gnome-session/options $ cat ~/.gconf/apps/gnome-session/options/%gconf.xml
[03:50] <mdz> <?xml version="1.0"?>

[03:50] <mdz>         <entry name="splash_image" mtime="1098236337" type="string">
[03:50] <mdz>                 <stringvalue></stringvalue>
[03:50] <mdz>         </entry>

[03:51] <mdz> hmm, no .xsession-errors
[03:51] <jdub> ahr
[03:52] <mdz> ah, it goes to the console
[03:52] <mdz> hmm, interesting
[03:52] <mdz> ** (gnome-session:4487): WARNING **: Failed to load image from '/usr/share/pixmaps/': Image file '/usr/share/pixmaps' contains no data
[03:52] <mdz> related?
[03:53] <jdub> yeah
[03:53] <jdub> that's the root for the splash
[03:53] <jdub> so it's got a zero length string, and tried to load it
[03:53] <jdub> (which i~ s kinda bong)
[03:54] <jdub> but the big issue is gconf not correctly pulling from the schemas
[03:54] <jdub> $ grep -v ^# /etc/gconf/2/path
[03:54] <jamesh> jdub: possibly because the user gconf database sets it to an empty string?
[03:54] <jamesh> (based on what mdz pasted)
[03:55] <jdub> jamesh: that's why gnome-session is borked, but we're trying to work out why the user database is borked
[03:55] <jdub> the gnome-session thing is a result of that
[03:56] <jamesh> does this user gconf database get unpacked from the live CD?
[03:57] <jdub> strongly doubt it
[03:57] <jamesh> okay.
[03:57] <jdub> it's made in the overlay
[03:58] <jamesh> yeah.  the mtime is from about 15 minutes ago.
[04:11] <daniels> um, are there screenshots of the new Human anywhere? i'm having serious trouble getting my laptop online
[04:12] <jdub> hrm, don't think so
[04:12] <jdub> not the final one
[04:12] <tseng> daniels: i can get you one in a few minutes
[04:12] <tseng> doing my daily update
[04:13] <daniels> cheers
[04:13] <mdz> jdub: bingo
[04:13] <mdz> ./rc.m/S06setsplash:# Sets the gnome splash screen using gconftool-2 for the user
[04:13] <mdz> ./rc.m/S06setsplash:    su -c 'gconftool-2 --type=string --set /apps/gnome-session/options/splash_image  "$FILE"' - $USER
[04:14] <mdz> #!/bin/sh
[04:14] <mdz> # Sets the gnome splash screen using gconftool-2 for the user
[04:14] <mdz> # $USER comes from our include.sh
[04:14] <mdz> . /morphix/include.sh
[04:14] <mdz> FILE="/usr/share/pixmaps/splash/ubuntu-splash.png"
[04:14] <mdz> if [ -e "$FILE" ] ; then
[04:14] <mdz>         su -c 'gconftool-2 --type=string --set /apps/gnome-session/options/splash_image  "$FILE"' - $USER
[04:14] <mdz> fi
[04:14] <mdz> I think it needs an s@/usr/share/pixmaps/@@
[04:15] <jdub> that should work
[04:15] <jdub> that's really crack though
[04:16] <mdz> the fact that it's messing with gconf at boot as part of the morphix stuff seems key
[04:16] <jamesh> it should be in the defaults gconf database
[04:16] <jamesh> if it is meant to be a default
[04:16] <mdz> jamesh: it is
[04:16] <mdz> this is morphix crack
[04:17] <jdub> that is serious crack
[04:17] <tseng> daniels: the gtk/metacity looks the same
[04:17] <jdub> what if you kill that?
[04:17] <tseng> daniels: what am i looking for?
[04:17] <daniels> tseng: i dunno.  i think i have the problem solved anyway tho -- thanks :)
[04:17] <tseng> nps
[04:17] <mdz> jdub: I don't know how to do that
[04:17] <mdz> I guess I could mount the base module and burn a new CD
[04:18] <mdz> I'll try a failsafe boot
[04:24] <daniels> can someone with access to kernel sources please tell me if the string '#define AC97_GPIO_LINE2_OH      0x0400  /* Off Hook Line2 */' appears in include/sound/ac97_codec.h?
[04:25] <kylem> daniels, kyle@anduril:~/repos/parisc-linux/include/sound% grep "#define AC97_GPIO_LINE2_OH      0x0400" ac97_codec.h 
[04:25] <kylem> #define AC97_GPIO_LINE2_OH      0x0400  /* Off Hook Line2 */
[04:25] <daniels> awesome
[04:29] <mdz> jdub: confirmed
[04:30] <mdz> jdub: if I check early (before that script runs), gconftool-2 gives the correct value
[04:30] <jdub> that is so much bong :)
[04:30] <mdz> hmm
[04:30] <mdz> it's correct after that script runs, too
[04:31] <mdz> ah, no it isn't
[04:31] <mdz> it's correct as root
[04:32] <mdz> yep
[04:32] <mdz> after that script runs, ~warty/.gconf has the empty value
[04:32] <mdz> so we should just kill it
[04:32] <mdz> lamont: back?
[04:32] <jdub> rock
[04:39] <daniels> lifeless: oh man
[04:39] <daniels> lifeless: xorg will make your hoverbook happier
[04:39] <daniels> and less hovery.
[04:40] <tseng> DynamicClocks in da house
[04:40] <daniels> option dynamicclocks will make the gpu core not run flat-tack all the time.  that's about 70% less hovery!
[04:40] <daniels> tseng: in da hizzle
[04:40] <tseng> <3
[04:40] <tseng> i am xorg's bitch
[04:51] <Mitario> damn, had a loooooong night of hacking, going to bed, cya all tomorrow
[04:51] <Mitario> good luck with the release!
[04:59] <fabbione> morning guys
[05:06] <fabbione> argh
[05:06] <fabbione> 2.6.9 is out
[05:07] <doogie> will ubuntu include that?
[05:07] <fabbione> hey doogie 
[05:07] <kylem> 2.6.9 is out, and 300 patches have gone in since. fun.
[05:07] <fabbione> ubuntu yes.. warty no :P
[05:08] <tseng> ya 2.6.9-bk3 already, wtf
[05:08] <fabbione> hmm probably a bogus release
[05:09] <fabbione> i unsubbed from lkml a while ago
[05:09] <tseng> i read lkml.org
[05:09] <doogie> no, just lots of patches sitting in mm that weren't slated for 2.6.9
[05:09] <tseng> when i need something.
[05:09] <doogie> I've been subscribed for a few weeks
[05:09] <kylem> some people had interesting compiler errors with 2.6.9 on x86.
[05:09] <fabbione> doogie: i unsubbed just for lack of time to read it properly
[05:10] <doogie> been running Ingo Molnar's voluntary-preempt patches(U1-U6)
[05:10] <doogie> fabbione: don't read debian lists.
[05:10] <jdub> tseng: 
[05:10] <fabbione> doogie: i dont :-)
[05:10] <jdub>   libgtksourceview-cil: Depends: libgtksourceview-common (>= 1.0.1-3) but 1.0.1-2 is to be installed
[05:10] <lifeless> daniels: wow.
[05:10] <lifeless> I'm keen already :(
[05:10] <fabbione> doogie: i only read debian-x :P
[05:10] <lifeless> :)
[05:10] <lifeless> bah. fingers broken
[05:10] <tseng> jdub: =/
[05:10] <jdub> tseng: tberman mentioned it
[05:10] <tseng> jdub: i mustve edited that and forgotten about it
[05:11] <jdub> do you know what the depends was for?
[05:11] <jdub> i can do a quick upload
[05:11] <tseng> seemed to be nothing in particular
[05:11] <tseng> everything built against -2
[05:11] <jdub> mmm, this is a runtime depends though
[05:11] <tseng> perhaps look at the changelog for -3 ?
[05:11] <jdub> mmm
[05:12] <tseng> runtime?
[05:12] <jdub> depends rather than build-depends
[05:12] <tseng> is it hardcoded, or from dh_netlibs
[05:12] <tseng> yeah i understand, just begging the question or something
[05:12] <jdub> Depends: ${net:Depends}, libgtksourceview-common (>= 1.0.1-3)
[05:13] <tseng> whats the -3 changelog?
[05:13] <tseng> or better.. can I get the changelog quickly w/o grabbing the source?
[05:13] <jdub> packages.qa.debian.org?
[05:13] <tseng> cheers.
[05:14] <jdub> gtksourceview (1.0.1-3) unstable; urgency=low
[05:14] <jdub>   * Language specification files backported from CVS.
[05:14] <jdub>     - Updated: ada.lang, perl.lang
[05:14] <jdub>     - New: css.lang, fortran.lang, haskell.lang, javascript.lang, lua.lang,
[05:14] <jdub>       pascal.lang, ruby.lang, texinfo.lang and vbnet.lang
[05:14] <jdub>     (closes: #255668)
[05:14] <jdub>   * Documentation now symlinked under /usr/share/doc/libgtk2.0-doc.
[05:14] <jdub>     (closes: #261119)
[05:14] <jdub> 
[05:14] <jdub> doesn't seem runtime-critical to me
[05:14] <tseng> nope..
[05:14] <jdub> just happy-happy-we-have lang files
[05:15] <jdub> ok, i'll do a quick upload
[05:15] <tseng> you rock.
[05:19] <tberman> tseng: why is MD not in universe?
[05:19] <tseng> oh noes
[05:19] <tberman> jdub sent me
[05:19] <tberman> blame him
[05:19] <tseng> tberman: its being worked on
[05:19] <tseng> as we speak
[05:19] <tberman> awesome :)
[05:19] <tberman> anything i can do to help
[05:20] <tseng> well just some circular build deps holding up
[05:20] <tberman> oh?
[05:20] <tseng> yes monodoc + gtk-sharp pkgs
[05:21] <tberman> ah :)
[05:21] <tberman> yeah, i know that one well :)
[05:21] <tberman> im hoping to find a day or two to solve that one
[05:21] <tberman> but there is little upstream (and i mean miguel) traction.
[05:21] <tseng> hah he closed my bug
[05:21] <tseng> wontfix or so
[05:22] <tseng> (mono vs pure nptl)
[05:22] <tberman> about splitting it?
[05:22] <tberman> oh
[05:22] <tberman> yeah, that was him being a dick
[05:22] <tberman> thats being worked on though
[05:22] <tseng> oh good
[05:22] <tseng> the other minor problem jdub just hit was something small i overlooked
[05:22] <tseng> i never really intended my stuff to go into ubuntu
[05:23] <mdz> lamont: ping
[05:23] <tberman> tseng: that thing about gtksourceview-common being too old?
[05:23] <tseng> yeah
[05:23] <tberman> nod, i saw that earlier today
[05:23] <tseng> i guess you caught it actually :)
[05:23] <tseng> ya.
[05:23] <tberman> trying to install MD on my bosses box :)
[05:23] <tseng> well its getting close
[05:24] <tseng> that and monodoc vs gtk-sharp and things will hopefully be on their way
[05:24] <jdub> tseng: never intended? bah :)
[05:24] <tseng> unless warty/universe is going to freeze up
[05:24] <tseng> jdub: i did it for myself really
[05:24] <jdub> that's how everything is done ;)
[05:25] <tseng> ill know better next time.
[05:29] <jdub> tseng, tberman: uploaded.
[05:30] <tseng> yay
[05:30] <tberman> jdub: you rock
[05:30] <tberman> id love to be able to email my boss tmw and say 'refresh synaptic and search for monodevelop'
[05:31] <tseng> well the build host still needs kicked on monodoc
[05:32] <tseng> lamont i think is going to look at that if he gets a few minutes
[05:32] <tberman> tseng: cant you just split gtk-sharp-docs into its own package?
[05:32] <tberman> tseng: actually, you dont really need to
[05:32] <tseng> hm i suppose
[05:32] <tberman> tseng: monodoc the tarball ships with gtk# docs
[05:32] <jdub> it still wouldn't build, though
[05:32] <tberman> tseng: and gtk# doesn't make docs on its own
[05:32] <tseng> jdub: oh?
[05:33] <jdub> (splitting a docs package out, the entire source won't build so you won't get any binary packages)
[05:33] <tberman> you dont need to split it out though
[05:34] <tberman> it doesnt get built by default
[05:35] <tberman> docs/ isnt even in subdirs
[05:49] <fabbione> mdz: are the images that Kamion published the same as the daily ones?
[05:49] <fabbione> they should be... but you may never know :)
[06:01] <mdz> fabbione: yes
[06:08] <lamont> moo
[06:08] <lamont> tseng: checking
[06:09] <lamont> mdz/jdub: so what do I change where?
[06:09] <lamont> btw, sound works for me on the latest LiveCD
[06:09] <mdz> lamont: S06setsplash should disappear
[06:10] <lamont> mdz: why do I not find that surprising at all.. :-(
[06:14] <lamont>  This version is specific for Warty the Warthog, and contains
[06:14] <lamont>  an init script for setting the Gnome splashscreen using gconftool
[06:15] <lamont> I guess that can go from control too,eh?
[06:16] <mdz> bye-bye
[06:16] <jdub> mdz: sleep time?
[06:16] <mdz> jdub: no, to setsplash
[06:17] <tseng> it is sleep time for me
[06:17] <jdub> ahr
[06:17] <tseng> ahr
[06:18] <tseng> g'night
[06:18] <lamont> tseng: before you go..
[06:18] <tseng> yessir?
[06:18] <lamont> what's wrong with monodoc?
[06:19] <tseng> ya
[06:19] <tseng> it wants gtk-sharp
[06:19] <tseng> and gtk-sharp wants monodoc
[06:19] <tseng> so you'll likely have to install one from me
[06:19] <lamont> on which architecture?
[06:19] <tseng> any afaik
[06:20] <lamont> i386 thinks they're current, I believe.
[06:21] <tseng> elmo_: Couldn't find package libgtk-cil
[06:21] <tseng> apt-get failed.
[06:21] <tseng> sorry, irssi complete there
[06:23] <lamont> tseng: that's with apt-get install what?
[06:23] <tseng> thats from the build log..
[06:24] <tseng> of monodoc.
[06:24] <lamont> oh. you're looking at the build logs.
[06:24] <lamont> um, well...
[06:24] <lamont> monodoc's is missing
[06:24] <lamont> libgtk-cil is installable on i386
[06:25] <lamont> and pulls in 46 other packages
[06:25] <tseng> 46?
[06:25] <lamont> above and beyond a build-essential chroot, that is.
[06:25] <lamont> normal system it'd be lots less.
[06:25] <tseng> oh
[06:26] <tseng> yeah its only a couple here
[06:26] <lamont> debconf is one of the 46, for example.
[06:26] <tseng> so, has monodoc failed to build since this log?
[06:26] <tberman> tseng: why does gtk-sharp want monodoc?
[06:27] <lamont> libgtk-cil is installable on powerpc as well.
[06:27] <tberman> tseng: i still dont understand that.
[06:27] <tseng> tberman: ask the debian packagers I guess
[06:27] <lamont> tseng: monodoc has successfully built since that log.
[06:27] <tberman> tseng: fuck the debian packagers
[06:27] <tseng> lamont: ahhh, wonderful
[06:27] <tberman> tseng: they are fucking useless.
[06:27] <tberman> tseng: gtk-sharp doesnt need monodoc.
[06:27] <tseng> tberman: well i mostly followed their shit
[06:27] <tberman> tseng: the monodoc tarball installs gtk-sharp docs for you
[06:27] <lamont> tseng: problem is that I do the bootstrapping in the magical distribution of "warty.lj", which never logs.
[06:27] <tseng> tberman: ok
[06:28] <tseng> tberman: hey, since you know mono, and you arent lame, maybe you can help me do things right next time
[06:28] <tseng> lamont: ah, sorry for the runaround then
[06:28] <lamont> I should really push the logs from the last round of bootstrapping, but I'm counting on that infrastructure really being there soon...
[06:28] <tseng> lamont: i only know what shows up in the log
[06:28] <tberman> tseng: you seem to do most things pretty damn well :)
[06:29] <tseng> thats why im famous!
[06:29] <tberman> tseng: and yes, im willing to help
[06:29] <lamont> tseng: to make matters even more fun, arch: all-only packages aren't even in ~lamont/buildLogs/Lists/* unless they're out of date
[06:29] <tseng> hm
[06:29] <lamont> but that's understandable if you dig deep enough..  But it's pretty smelly there.
[06:30] <tseng> once you guys are done hauling ass to get warty out, mayhap I can learn your processes better and be less of a burden
[06:31] <lamont> tseng: my sequence is to see what's in the archive, then (when it's not there), go look for buildd status (buildLogs/Lists/warty.all.${ARCH}), then worry about what's in the log
[06:31] <lamont> tseng: the whole current buildLogs infrastructure is a hack thrown together to eliminate the old process.  That was "ask lamont", and very annoying all around.
[06:31] <lamont> because I'm not here 24x7
[06:31] <tseng> heh.
[06:31] <daniels> tseng: not a burden at all -- thanks for the mono packages :)
[06:32] <tseng> nps
[06:32] <lamont> tseng: and getting the team to leave me alone leaves room to check on other packages.  No real issue at all.
[06:32] <jdub> tseng: we're working on making the infrastructure/process easier to handle too ;)
[06:32] <lamont> jdub: certainly.
[06:32] <tseng> rad.
[06:32] <jdub> so we'll meet in the middle soon enough ;)
[06:32] <lamont> do not confuse the current buildLogs mess with anything that we think is good.
[06:33] <mdz> lamont: new live CD image?
[06:33] <lamont> 18+23=41
[06:33] <tseng> so if muine is listed in Lists/warty.all.i386
[06:33] <lamont> +copy time
[06:33] <tseng> its completed?
[06:33] <lamont> well, if it's listed there and marked 'Installed', then yes
[06:33] <tseng> ah.
[06:34] <lamont> if it's not there, and it's arch: all (only), then that's normal, and means it's there.
[06:34] <mdz> lamont: 41 minutes from now, or :41?
[06:34] <lamont> if it's not there, and has arch-specific components, then we excluded it from that architecture for some reason.
[06:34] <lamont> started at :18, takes ~23 min to build, == :41
[06:34] <lamont> then I have to copy it over to rookery
[06:35] <lamont> home edition takes about 32 minutes
[06:35] <lamont> :-(
[06:35] <lamont> but it rsync's to the machine with the burner at ~60 Mbits/sec
[06:35] <mdz> has anyone else received random and unexpected messages from syslog on logged-in terminals?
[06:35] <lamont> no
[06:35] <daniels> mdz: ... no
[06:35] <mdz> has happened to be several times in warty
[06:36] <mdz> on my laptop
[06:36] <mdz> Message from syslogd@localhost at Tue Oct 19 21:35:06 2004 ...
[06:36] <mdz> localhost kernel: sr0: scsi3-mmc drive: 62x/62x writer dvd-ram cd/rw xa/form2 cdda tray
[06:36] <mdz> not a very important message
[06:36] <kylem> daniels, if this breaks my sid install, i'll install ubuntu. ;-)
[06:36] <lamont> btw, fun fire training tonight... stuck a cadet in a trunk, and burried another firefighter in a car's remains.  fun extrication
[06:37] <kylem> daniels, hopefully i pinned everything properly, so that won't happen. :)
[06:37] <kylem> mdz, 8)
[06:38] <jdub> kylem: 'not in time'
[06:38] <daniels> mdz: actually, I can't, because I didn't manage to get that off thom's PowerBook because it got stolen, and you have the original :P
[06:38] <kylem> jdub, fair enough, just means i need to burn them, that's in the budget though. :)
[06:39] <lamont> mdz: 20041020-05
[06:40] <lamont> and....
[06:40] <lamont> go
[06:40] <mdz> lamont: URL?
[06:41] <lamont> sigh.
[06:41] <lamont> http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~lamont/testing/LiveCD/20041020-05/warty-live-i386-20041020-05.iso
[06:41] <lamont> ETOOLONG
[06:42] <tseng> ENOSLEEP
[06:42] <tseng> bye.
[06:42] <lamont> night tseng
[06:42] <tseng> cya
[06:46] <mdz> ETA 40 minutes
[06:46] <lamont> eta 5+burntime
[06:47] <lamont> of course, you're testing the real one.. :-)
[06:47] <lamont> this should fix the gnome splash, I gather?
[06:47] <lamont> oh - sound muted.. where/how do we fix that, I wonder?
[06:48] <fabbione> lamont: is that the last LiveCD to test?
[06:48] <lamont> fabbione: well, unless we rip a new one for the muted audio, it's the last one, I hope... Certainly the latest
[06:48] <mdz> lamont: yes, that should fix the gnome splash
[06:48] <mdz> lamont: what about the funny grub progress meter?
[06:49] <lamont> mdz: I've decided it looks cute.
[06:49] <fabbione> lamont: downloading now
[06:50] <lamont> mdz: I think that if the white line came in further, we'd have full width.  NFC about the blue stuff though
[06:50] <fabbione> mdz: iso and netinstall from daily on i386 are GO
[06:50] <fabbione> getting the LiveCD now
[06:50] <mdz> lamont: but you do see the same thing?
[06:50] <mdz> fabbione: thanks
[06:51] <lamont> mdz: effectively appears as 3 bars (the 3'rd one being all brown and therefore invisible), and bar 2 having a fatter blue center than bar 1
[06:51] <fabbione> ETA for Live 50 minutes + burning
[06:51] <mdz> lamont: you have the same muting problem?
[06:51] <lamont> ues
[06:51] <lamont> yes
[06:51] <mdz> lamont: yes, that's the same thing I se in the progress meter
[06:51] <lamont> but once unmuted, sound is there
[06:51] <mdz> lamont: I assumed it wasn't getting unmuted due to my sound devices being detected in the wrong order
[06:52] <lamont> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/jdub-grub.jpg
[06:52] <lamont> that's what the screen looks like for me.
[06:53] <lamont> where did your set audio to 70% script wind up?
[06:53] <mdz> lamont: /etc/init.d/alsa-base start
[06:54] <lamont> and I imagine that runs at some point...
[06:54] <mdz> lamont: it does in the installed system
[06:54] <mdz> morphix doesn't exactly use the stock boot process
[06:54] <mdz> lamont: try running it and see if it works
[06:54] <lamont> actually, will run it post boot this next go round
[06:54] <lamont> jinx
[06:54] <mdz> and if so, arrange for morphix to run it
[06:54] <lamont> right
[06:54] <lamont> S06setsound :-)
[06:55] <lamont> setvolume, even
[06:56] <lamont> mdz: the other thing someone pointed out today was that the liveCD notices swap partitions and uses them. This could be detrimental to suspend-to-swap...
[06:56] <mdz> lamont: same for crash dumps and the like
[06:56] <mdz> as far as I'm concerned, swap partitions are fair game
[06:57] <lamont> yeah - everyone else seems to think they are... :)
[06:57] <fabbione> well not that i had anything in there.
[06:57] <fabbione> it was just a thought
[06:58] <lamont> from the personal bitch-fest side of things... if you exit your session with multiple firefox windows open (one process though), then the next login will launch N separate firefox processes, N-1 of which bitch about profiles
[07:00] <lamont> fixating
[07:00] <mdz> this download is taking forever
[07:00] <mdz> everyone stop apt-getting for a while, we're trying to download CD images over here :-P
[07:00] <lamont> oh, hrm.mplayer.
[07:01] <__daniel> goooood morning!
[07:01] <mdz> mplayer-custom isn't supposed to be autobuilt
[07:01] <mdz> that's for custom builds
[07:02] <kylem> er?
[07:03] <lamont> GOOD SPLASH
[07:03] <mdz> lamont: there's a 'marillat' flag in debian/rules to do what you want for autobuilding
[07:04] <mdz> but probably we just want to fix it to build a regular i386 binary with runtime CPU detection
[07:04] <mdz> that'd be best
[07:04] <lamont> mdz: oh. we built it for the buildd hardware, didn't we...
[07:04] <mdz> lamont: correct
[07:04] <daniels> the hwole mplayer packaging is total bong
[07:05] <kylem> heh, that explains a lot. :)
[07:05] <lamont> mdz: /etc/init.d/alsa start
[07:05] <mdz> lamont: /etc/init.d/alsa-base start
[07:06] <lamont> ain't got one of those.
[07:07] <lamont> alsa             alsa-autoconfig  
[07:07] <lamont> is what we have
[07:09] <lamont> hrm.. alt-f2 during boot might be a bit too bright..
[07:09] <lamont> btw, running /etc/init.d/alsa start says 'restoring mixer settings'...  is that right>?
[07:10] <lamont> and alsa-base delivers /etc/init.d/alsa...
[07:11] <__daniel> lamont, yes, for me too
[07:12] <mdz> lamont: you're right, it's alsa
[07:12] <lamont> mdz: permission to fix mplayer tomorrow when I'm awake?
[07:12] <mdz> lamont: anyway, does it work?
[07:12] <lamont> yep
[07:13] <lamont> so, back to the top of the hill we go.
[07:13] <mdz> lamont: mplayer is a non-issue until after the release
[07:14] <mdz> lamont: so running that script did not unmute it for you?
[07:14] <mdz> or it did?
[07:15] <lamont> running the script unmuts
[07:15] <lamont> cups, dbus, hal, adduser.  after cups before the rest work for alsa?
[07:18] <mdz> lamont: alsa can run anytime after hardware detection, I assume
[07:18] <mdz> which I think happens before any of that
[07:19] <lamont> I dropped it in where S06setsplash lived.
[07:19] <lamont> anything else to put in this round?
[07:22] <mdz> lamont: nothing to be done about the grub meter?
[07:22] <mdz> can't we just make it a solid color?
[07:22] <lamont> but it's my easter egg. :-)
[07:23] <lamont> yeah, yeah, doesn't fit. lying.
[07:23] <lamont> cheating.
[07:34] <lamont> mdz: verbose mode is too low-contrast/bright... thinking it may want to be the default background, instead of the shiny-bright one.
[07:35] <mdz> lamont: a black background would be nice for verbose mode
[07:35] <mdz> but this is not a warty kind of item unless it's completely trivial
[07:35] <lamont> extremely trivial...
[07:35] <lamont> deliver a black jpg instead of the same jpg twice
[07:38] <lamont> mdz: want to keep the logo in dark grey?
[07:38] <lamont> no.verbose == black.
[07:38] <lamont> OK
[07:45] <lamont> mdz: I rather expect that it's using the color indexs in some interestnig way that I don't understand...
[07:45] <lamont> I could certainly try swapping back in the morphix grub screen arrows and see what that does...
[07:46] <sivang> lamont : got now iso ?
[07:46] <mdz> lamont: just let me know when to start downloading again
[07:46] <mdz> I am running out of time before I need to sleep
[07:47] <sivang> now=mew
[07:47] <sivang> mew=new
[07:47] <fabbione> lamont: burning the live now
[07:48] <sivang> lamont : the one on #ubuntu's topic is the correct one?
[07:50] <lamont> sivang: no
[07:51] <lamont> http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~lamont/testing/LiveCD
[07:51] <lamont> go to the newest 2004* directory and that's the current one
[07:52] <sivang> you didn't symlink from /current?
[07:53] <sivang> rsync runs there at least? :) (given my iso only differs on the artwork)
[07:58] <lamont> rsync is useless
[07:58] <lamont> 650MB turns into ~630MB
[07:58] <sivang> ok
[07:58] <lamont> well, that might not be so true anymore, but generally the compressed blobs just trash everything
[07:59] <doogie> got a bittorrent for the isos?  I am willing to setup an rsync+bittorrent seeder, if needed
[08:00] <lamont> doogie: no bt for the iterim livecds
[08:00] <doogie> that's fine.  but for the final?
[08:00] <lamont> will definitely have one
[08:00] <daniels> there will be a torrent for the final, just like all our other isos.
[08:01] <doogie> timeframe?
[08:01] <daniels> when it's done
[08:01] <doogie> :|
[08:07] <fabbione> lamont: the but menus has all kind of options on the LiveCD
[08:07] <fabbione> lamont: too bad that it still shows morphix here and there
[08:08] <mdz> doogie: 1500 UTC tomorrow
[08:08] <mdz> lamont: there are -06 and -07 directories, but no iso in -07
[08:08] <mdz> lamont: should I be downloading -06 or waiting for -07?
[08:09] <lamont> 07 isn't there
[08:09] <lamont> I was too slow uploading -06.. :-(
[08:09] <lamont> 07 will be a while
[08:10] <mdz> lamont: what's going to be in -07?
[08:10] <lamont> your ^*&)^+ grub screen
[08:12] <mdz> lamont: if that isn't trivial, skip it
[08:12] <mdz> it's cosmetic
[08:12] <lamont> yeah, but it's not really hard.
[08:13] <fab-live> lamont: it looks ok here
[08:13] <lamont> mdz: and verbose background==black
[08:13] <fab-live> sound is not muted
[08:13] <fab-live> let me test on the laptop too
[08:23] <amu> g'morning *
[08:23] <fabbione> lamont: LiveCd is good on lappy too. including sound
[08:23] <fabbione> hey amu!
[08:24] <bob2> mjg59: did you see the post about ibm-acpi on lkml?
[08:28] <lamont> mdz: so would you like a pair of blue bars, or a blue one and a black one. :(
[08:31] <amu> lamont: 20-06 is the latest one ? 
[08:31] <lamont> amu: for about the next 23 minutes or so...
[08:32] <lamont> mdz: only change between 06 and 07 will be the verbose bootsplash
[08:35] <amu> lamont: all right, i'll take 06 and test it on 4 different maschines. ( i810 ) included.   
[08:35] <lamont> amu: cool
[08:37] <amu> lamont: some of my users reported, on a i810 X is not as it should :(  
[08:38] <fabbione> lamont: i never saw this double bars
[08:38] <fabbione> lamont: where are they supposed to be located?
[08:38] <lamont> during grub, if you don't hit any keys - you get 5 seconds to see them.
[08:38] <lamont> it's the countdown bar for the autoboot
[08:39] <lamont> heh
[08:40] <lamont> mdz: mplayer isn't on the livecd. :-)
[08:40] <fabbione> lamont: ah ok
[08:40] <lamont> fabbione: you know, while your monitor is syncing
[08:40] <mdz> lamont: er, of course it isn't?
[08:40] <lamont> mdz: sorry - was tongue-in-cheek complaint
[08:41] <lamont> it's getting late, you see....
[08:41] <mdz> lamont: download ready?
[08:41] <lamont> :54++
[08:44] <lamont> mdz: btw, 2482 has a proposed patch
[08:55] <mdz> ok, I need to get to bed
[08:55] <mdz> send a followup to ubuntu-devel with the live CD status
[08:55] <lamont> image pushing now
[08:55] <mdz> night
[08:55] <lamont> will send email
[08:55] <lamont> fabbione: wanna process check -07?
[08:55] <__daniel> good night mdz
[08:56] <lamont> fabbione: things to check on -07 are (1) boots, (2) if you hit alt-f2 (and kill the bootsplash), do you get a black background, or does the splash remain there to be annoying
[08:57] <fabbione> lamont: sure....s test case.
[08:57] <fabbione> url?
[08:57] <lamont> http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~lamont/testing/LiveCD/20041020-07/warty-live-i386-20041020-07.iso
[08:57] <fabbione> mdz: night
[08:58] <fabbione> lamont: downloading now
[08:58] <lamont> fabbione: eta?  need to sleep soon..
[08:58] <fabbione> lamont: 1 hour download+burning
[08:58] <fabbione> lamont: brb
[08:58] <lamont> right.  that means I'll send the email to ubuntu-devel@ and you can followup to it, eh?
[08:59] <fabbione> lamont: yes.. can you stay around only a few minutes more?
[08:59] <lamont> certainly - it'll take at least that long to compose the email
[08:59] <fabbione> ok
[08:59] <lamont> besides, I want to boot the home edition before I sleep
[08:59] <fabbione> great
[09:01] <sivang> home edition?
[09:02] <sivang> xp ??? ;)
[09:02] <fabbione> sivang: yes...
[09:02] <fabbione> and there is also Xp and server edition ;)
[09:02] <lamont> sivang: built at my house
[09:03] <lamont> the data center version is canonical, of course.
[09:03] <sivang> lamont : oh you made builts from in your house? But you can teach people to use the restart and then choose it from grub
[09:04] <lamont> sivang: I don't have bandwidth to be transferring huge iso's about..  this way was easier...
[09:04] <lamont> although it does require careful cloning of changes, but that's not so bad.
[09:04] <sivang> lamont : isee
[09:04] <sivang> lamont : well, anyways I'm also downloading it now
[09:05] <lamont> cool.
[09:05] <lamont> sivang: hence the "process check" on my CD builds.
[09:06] <lamont> my download time, even if I yank all the stops out is >6-7 hours.
[09:06] <sivang> lamont : boy. well, my current ETA = 1:30
[09:06] <sivang> I hope that helps
[09:06] <lamont> sivang: if I don't pull the stops out, I get to fetch it at <40kbits/sec.
[09:06] <amu> sivang: hh:mm ? 
[09:06] <sivang> amu : hh:mm
[09:06] <lamont> == just short of 48 hours.
[09:07] <sivang> lamont : yes. What's the maximum throughput of your cloude at home?
[09:07] <lamont> in the house, 100Mbits for the most part
[09:07] <lamont> to the house? ~300kbits/sec, but anything over 56kbps counts towards a monthly quota
[09:07] <bob2> lamont: well post-warty and post-sleep , could I bug you for a bit to help me bootstrap ghc6 on ppc?
[09:08] <lamont> bob2: np
[09:08] <bob2> cool, thanks.
[09:09] <sivang> lamont : I've got 750Kbits. No monthly quota, however that comes back at me in the form of very and I mean, very bad service...:-)
[09:09] <lamont> bob2: here's the trick: deb http://snapshot.debian.net/archive/2004/06/28/debian unstable main
[09:10] <lamont> bob2: I've declared the end of bootstrapping already, or I'd toss it in.
[09:10] <bob2> lamont: build it in an ubuntu chroot using some dependencies from snapshot, then rebuild with the new ubuntu package?
[09:11] <lamont> bob2: add that deb line to sources.list, build in the warty chroot.  use those debs + warty only to build it again
[09:11] <lamont> remember to apt-get clean in the middle, of course
[09:11] <bob2> lamont: right, makes sense.
[09:11] <bob2> heh, right
[09:11] <lamont> much easier to bootstrap warty than it is to bootstrap a completely new architecture...
[09:12] <bob2> heh, I bet.
[09:12] <bob2> can something I build go into universe at some point, or at least let you easily rebuild it on the buildd's?
[09:12] <lamont> new architecture requires that you actually understand what you're doing... 
[09:13] <lamont> if you have a clean archive, or can point me at one (and the right order of things to build to break the circular dep-wait-chain-of-dispair), then it's easy to get the builds done.
[09:14] <lamont> but binaries in the archive all come from the buildds
[09:14] <bob2> ah, fair enough
[09:14] <lamont> although I must admit that sometimes the man behind the curtain helps the buildds out a bit..
[09:15] <lamont> since it's build A, use A to build B, throw away A, upload B
[09:15] <lamont> where A and B are the same package, etc.
[09:15] <bob2> ah
[09:15] <lamont> and the buildd's not so good at throwing things away....
[09:17] <ik5pvx> howdy
[09:18] <fabbione> lamont: argh!!! one of my friends that installed ubuntu reported that mplayer in multiverse can't play WOAD! If you want we can send you the movie as test case.
[09:18] <ik5pvx> yeah, we need more pr0n-capable codecs :)
[09:19] <lamont> fabbione: known borkage
[09:19] <fabbione> lamont: do you want WOAD to test?
[09:20] <lamont> fabbione: the error yesterday was that mplayer wasn't installed in the archive (FTBFS).  Now it's just built for P4
[09:20] <lamont> nah - know what the problem is...
[09:20] <lamont> if you're running on the buildd, it works
[09:21] <lamont> that is, intel Xeon
[09:22] <fabbione> got it
[09:22] <ik5pvx> ok, I go back to work, keep on the nice work, it's good to have everything in a single place instead of relying on external archives
[09:23] <lamont> fabbione: there's a build target in the makefile to make the detection runtime instead of build time.
[09:23] <fabbione> yes i remember that
[09:24] <lamont> not an issue with the datacenter edition
[09:24] <fabbione> ETA 40 minutes here
[09:24] <fabbione> someone is sucking my bw
[09:37] <lamont> fabbione: eta still about 25 minutes, yes?
[09:37] <fabbione> 29
[09:42] <bob2> fabbione: how much bandwidth do you have now?
[09:43] <fabbione> bob2: 2Mb but half of it is used by something else
[09:43] <bob2> ah, ok
[09:43] <bob2> it's weird hwo different countries have different dsl speed's
[09:43] <bob2> I'd have assumed it was some fundamental thing about the coper or something
[09:44] <jamesh> bob2: Telstra's hardware seems to be limited at 1.5Mb
[09:44] <fabbione> bob2: adsl is a standard
[09:44] <fabbione> bob2: it's your ISP that makes the difference
[09:44] <jamesh> the equipment iiNet is installing will allow higher speeds
[09:44] <bob2> jamesh: yeah, I hear agile is planning to put their own 8mbit's dlsams in
[09:44] <jdub> amifascisttelcoornot.com
[09:44] <fabbione> (and the distance between your router and the first central)
[09:45] <bob2> fabbione: hm, like here, it's always 256/64, 512/128 or 1.5/256, but in the US you can get 640 or 768 downstream.
[09:45] <bob2> regardless of ISP
[09:45] <jamesh> bob2: I know you can get symetric 2Mb in the CBD in perth
[09:45] <fabbione> bob2: US sucks...
[09:46] <fabbione> bob2: i can get 8Mb/1Mb adsl here in 10 minutes
[09:46] <bob2> fabbione: bastard :)
[09:46] <fabbione> bob2: it's enough i go to the web page and do 2/3 clicks
[09:47] <bob2> fabbione: for $50/month more I can go to 1.5, but it takes until the next billing period
[09:47] <fabbione> bob2: how much do you have and do you pay now?
[09:48] <bob2> fabbione: 512/128, $au100/month
[09:48] <bob2> that's the upper end of prices, tho
[09:48] <lamont> fabbione: when you boot, watch the S.. script invocations go by, and see if it bitches about S06alsa...
[09:49] <fabbione> bob2: how much is the $au compared to Eu or Usd?
[09:49] <fabbione> lamont: i will
[09:50] <bob2> fabbione: hm...maybe $73
[09:50] <jamesh> bob2: iiNet is about half that.
[09:50] <fabbione> bob2: that's hell of a lot of money
[09:50] <bob2> jamesh: for 512/128 no bandwidth caps?
[09:51] <fabbione> i pay less than that for 2Mb/512 + static ip
[09:51] <bob2> jamesh: with a static ip?
[09:51] <bob2> perversely, dsl is cheaper in WA, too
[09:52] <jamesh> bob2: it doesn't have a static IP.
[09:52] <bob2> ah
[09:52] <jamesh> bob2: it is for 12GB a month, and they limit the bandwidth for the rest of the month if you go over.
[09:52] <fabbione> here is 100% unlimited
[09:52] <fabbione> you only pay the connection/bw
[09:52] <fabbione> that's it
[09:52] <jamesh> bob2: it is $70/month for unlimited
[09:53] <bob2> hm, best I found here was tpg for $80
[09:53] <lamont> maintenence deferrred to friday AM
[09:55] <fabbione> ciao enrico 
[09:55] <enrico> fabbione: ciao!
[10:09] <fabbione> lamont: 2 minutes to complete the dw
[10:09] <sabdfl> morning all
[10:09] <lamont> morning mark
[10:09] <lamont> about to followup to mdz's mail on CD images
[10:12] <fabbione> lamont: burning now
[10:12] <fabbione> hey Mark
[10:14] <sivang> 30m to complete download...
[10:14] <sivang> enrico  : morning
[10:15] <lamont> be the first on your block
[10:15] <enrico> sivang: morning!
[10:19] <lamont> fabbione: what speed CD's you using?
[10:19] <fabbione> Starting to write CD/DVD at speed 10 in real TAO mode for single session.
[10:19] <elmo_> jdub: please seed-ize the calendar stuff
[10:19] <fabbione> these are RW
[10:19] <sivang> morning pitti 
[10:20] <pitti> Hi sivang
[10:20] <fabbione> lamont: finalizing now
[10:20] <pitti> Just finished reinstalling my workstation with current ISO
[10:20] <pitti> Thumbs up! :-)
[10:21] <sivang> pitti : you mean , with the warty *release* :)
[10:22] <pitti> sivang: it isn't out yet !?
[10:22] <pitti> sivang: I mean today's daily, but it should be very close (if not equal) to the release
[10:22] <sivang> pitti : that's what I meant :)
[10:23] <lamont> sivang: yeah, but you still can't call it "release" until it _is_
[10:23] <sivang> lamont : true
[10:24] <fabbione> lamont: 1) 07 boots 2) the blu bars are there 3) while booting swithing to f2 and back removes the bootsplash and let me see all the boot messages 
[10:24] <fabbione> 4) there is still the message S06 can't find alsa
[10:24] <lamont> fabbione: but does sound work?
[10:24] <fabbione> it was from line 6 in morphix<something>
[10:24] <fabbione> checking in a sec
[10:24] <lamont> yeah
[10:26] <fabbione> lamont: i can see that all the modules are loaded and the mixer reports the correct card. I don't have any speakers to check 100%
[10:26] <fabbione> and the mixer is NOT muted
[10:26] <lamont> ok
[10:27] <lamont> and gnome splash was the right one, yes?
[10:27] <fabbione> hmm i didn't check that
[10:27] <fabbione> hold on
[10:29] <thom> lamont: cheap pcmcia wifi card
[10:30] <thom> what would you recommend?
[10:30] <lamont> aironet cards are nice, but 802.11b only
[10:30] <lamont> and not particularly cheap
[10:30] <lamont> netgear seems to be pretty good
[10:30] <lamont> dunno.  all mine are aironet, atm
[10:30] <fabbione> lamont: no people.. looks ok
[10:31] <fabbione> aironet rocks
[10:31] <lamont> fabbione: and it's the ubuntu logo screen, not the gnome 2.8 footprint screen
[10:31] <fabbione> i need to go and get the basestation one of the next days
[10:31] <thom> thanks.
[10:31] <lamont> last call before bedtime
[10:31] <fabbione> lamont: the gnome splash screen i am talking about
[10:31] <fabbione> the one that shows all the nice icons while gnome starts
[10:32] <lamont> right
[10:32] <lamont> ok then.
[10:32] <lamont> night
[10:32] <fabbione> desktop background is ok too
[10:32] <fabbione> g-night
[10:32] <lamont> probably nack in about 3-4 hours. :(
[10:35] <sivang> 20 minutes to go...
[10:35] <sivang> (downloading)
[10:48] <Kamion> have people been testing 20041020, or 20041020.1?
[10:49] <Kamion> I forgot to turn off the cron job
[10:50] <Kamion> for now I've just set the current symlink to point to 20041020
[10:52] <sivang> Kamion : Will download after I finish downlodig the live one
[10:53] <fabbione> 534108 -rw-r--r--  1 root root 548175872 Oct 20 01:35 warty-install-i386.iso
[10:53] <fabbione> Kamion: i tested this one. both cd and netinstall
[10:53] <fabbione> both are go
[10:54] <fabbione> do you want me resync and test the others?
[10:54] <pitti> Kamion: I tested this as well, thumb up
[10:56] <pitti> Hi mvo_!
[10:56] <jdub> elmo: ahr
[10:58] <mvo_> hi pitti, hi everyone
[11:01] <Kamion> fabbione: that looks like the right one, leave it
[11:01] <Kamion> the existence of a later image was unintentional
[11:02] <sabdfl> Kamion: what are rsync locations for both final and live cd?
[11:02] <fabbione> Kamion: ok
[11:03] <Kamion> sabdfl: releases.ubuntu.com::releases/warty/
[11:03] <Kamion> sabdfl: not there yet
[11:03] <sivang> Kamion : use the "current" symlink , rsync should work?
[11:03] <Kamion> sivang: yes
[11:03] <sabdfl> Kamion: thanks
[11:03] <sivang> Kamion : current = daily that is
[11:03] <Kamion> sivang: yes
[11:03] <sabdfl> "current" isn't in releases though, is it?
[11:03] <sivang> Kamion : k, thanks
[11:03] <sabdfl> that's cdimage?
[11:04] <Kamion> sabdfl: if people want to grab it early, cdimage.ubuntu.com::cdimage/daily/20041020/
[11:04] <sabdfl> Kamion: ah, that's what i was really looking for :-)
[11:04] <sabdfl> thanks
[11:04] <Kamion> sabdfl: live CD is http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~lamont/testing/LiveCD/20041020-07/warty-live-i386-20041020-07.iso; not much point in rsyncing that
[11:04] <sabdfl> oh, true
[11:05] <fabbione> at which time do we release today?
[11:05] <fabbione> 14:00 UTC?
[11:05] <Kamion> sabdfl: (if we do have to change from 20041020, rsyncing the differences will be cheap)
[11:06] <sabdfl> fabbione: 15:00 UTC
[11:06] <fabbione> roger
[11:06] <fabbione> i have the time to upload X.org
[11:06] <fabbione> just kidding ;)
[11:10] <sivang> Kamion : has the syntax for rsync changed? I sed to just rsync://[path]  without using double semicolons to seperate server and path.
[11:10] <sivang> Kamion : it won't work the old way now
[11:11] <amu> -06 looks nice 
[11:12] <justdave> installed on the ibook without a hitch.  haven't noticed any problems.
[11:13] <justdave> installing on the G4 now
[11:13] <Kamion> sivang: either should work; but don't ask me, ask the rsync man page :)
[11:13] <amu> -07: 24.58K/s  ETA 4:06:37
[11:18] <justdave> G4 install done, no problems there either except for the boot issue we already knew about. (bug 1379)
[11:19] <justdave> had to reboot 3 or 4 times to get into stage 2 of the install
[11:19] <justdave> but it eventually worked
[11:20] <sivang> new daily : 1:30m to finish
[11:20] <jdub> hrm
[11:20] <jdub> so
[11:20] <jdub> i'm at debsign
[11:20] <jdub> debsig
[11:23] <sivang> jdub : that is going to be like the preview release? :)
[11:23] <jdub> (beer.)
[11:23] <sivang> jdub : and the lcd so everybody there see what's going on here at release time? :)
[11:24] <justdave> hmm, interesting.  installed the smp kernel and rebooted, and now the usb keyboard doesn't work.
[11:24] <sivang> justdave : your on HT Machine?
[11:24] <justdave> mouse (which is plugged into the keyboard) works fine
[11:25] <justdave> sivang, the dual g4, yeah
[11:25] <sivang> justdave : ah, I thought you were on i686 HT machine so I thought of testing that myself here, but could be ppc specific ?
[11:27] <justdave> just rebooted again, this time the keyboard works.
[11:28] <justdave> hopefully just a fluke.  (I have had that happen with this keyboard before, on other machines, too)
[11:31] <sivang> lamont : here?
[11:31] <sivang> hmm, live cd doesn't boot for me on the dell
[11:32] <sivang> jdub : looking at the lug's activities makes me wanna live in sydney :)
[11:32] <jdub> yeah
[11:32] <jdub> SLUG rocks
[11:33] <sivang> jdub : man, I must pay a decent visit to au someday , and on the checklist be there.
[11:34] <tuo2> jdub: doh
[11:34] <bob2> debsig is slug distilled.
[11:34] <tuo2> I wish I was at debsig
[11:34] <jdub> bob2: yeah, the poo floats to the top
[11:35] <bob2> jdub: aren't you at debsig now?
[11:35] <jdub> am right now
[11:35] <bob2> haha
[11:35] <sivang> preparing for release?
[11:35] <bob2> sounds like the talk was very interesting then ;-)
[11:35] <jdub> kinda eating dinner and drinking beer
[11:35] <jdub> and matthew palmer is doing a talk about maintaining debian packages in arch
[11:36] <jdub> we haven't even implanted a chip yet
[11:37] <bob2> hahaha
[11:37] <bob2> the best part of debsig is the food and beer
[11:39] <thom> and the more beer
[11:39] <thom> don't forget that
[11:45] <bob2> ah yes
[11:45] <mjg59> Mm. Beer.
[11:46] <tuo2> I also wish I was at debsig
[11:47] <tuo2> but cold + rain + day off work for being sick = no beer for jordan
[11:48] <tuo2> jdub: is d there?
[11:49] <jdub> d?
[11:51] <thom> mjg59: it is australian beer, sadly
[11:51] <tuo2> jdub: matth.
[11:51] <thom> "beer", rather
[11:52] <jdub> yes
[11:53] <Kamion> bit early
[11:55] <sabdfl> bob2: what's the right way to change an arch-tag to a an external file id?
[11:56] <bob2> thom: yeah, it's refrigerated and everything!
[11:57] <thom> Kamion: sun over yard arm at 15:01 UTC? ;-)
[11:57] <bob2> sabdfl: you can't, sadly.  you have to remove the tagline, add an explicit and take the add/delete.
[11:57] <Kamion> thom: ayup
[11:57] <sabdfl> bob2: thanks. standard for all launchpad development is NOT to use arch-tag, 'k?
[11:58] <bob2> sabdfl: ah, ok, I'll bear that in mind.
[11:58] <sabdfl> tnx
[12:01] <jdub> heh
[12:02] <jdub> bob2: *cough* ;)
[12:02] <thom> sabdfl: any plans for the evening, seeing as elmo is around as well?
[12:03] <jdub> thom: pipka sends hugs
[12:03] <thom> jdub: send them back threefold!
[12:03] <jdub> i'm not sure she'll survive
[12:03] <jdub> but i'll take the risk
[12:03] <bob2> jdub: haha
[12:03] <bob2> jdub: I was, as always, impartial
[12:03] <sabdfl> thom: hrmrmrmmm... how about a small release celebration?
[12:03] <jdub> malibu and cokes all around!
[12:04] <thom> sabdfl: this seems like a reasonable move :-)
[12:04] <sabdfl> like 8 hours sleep to celebrate? <duck>
[12:04] <thom> rofl
[12:04] <sabdfl> ok, come around this evening, we'll find a place to celebrate
[12:04] <thom> 80, more like (g(
[12:05] <jdub> getting to know significant others again
[12:05] <sabdfl> happy to host some london debian guys as well if you want to put out an announcement
[12:05] <jdub> the joy of getting to know each other all over again after every release
[12:05] <sabdfl> like, anything up to 20 would be fine for beers and dinner
[12:05] <sivang> sabdfl : you're in england now?
[12:05] <sabdfl> don't push it and suggest refrigeration though, this is london, not sidney
[12:05] <bob2> hahaha
[12:06] <thom> sabdfl: rock, will talk to folks. thanks! :-)
[12:06] <thom> sabdfl: heh :-)
[12:06] <sabdfl> sivang: yes
[12:07] <Kamion> I'll stay up in Cambridge I think, what jdub said about significant other :)
[12:08] <Kamion> amd64 success, i386+German+jfs-/ success
[12:08] <mjg59> Haha
[12:08] <sivang> is there a release time that had been set up (UTC) ?
[12:08] <Kamion> (oh, +archive-copier/copy=false
[12:08] <Kamion> )
[12:08] <sabdfl> Kamion: thom is going to drink all of your beer :-)
[12:08] <mjg59> You manage to release on the one night that I'm already double booked
[12:08] <Kamion> sabdfl: I'll be drinking my own, no worries :)
[12:09] <pitti> ppc/G4/German success
[12:09] <jdub> hey amu
[12:09] <amu> remoins
[12:10] <amu> huhu jdub 
[12:10] <tuo2> beer+= refridgeration;
[12:12] <sivang> i386/dell(livecd)/failure
[12:13] <Kamion> sivang: details?
[12:15] <sivang> Kamion : trying to boot "Ubuntu" target get ne at "initrd (cd)/boot/miniroot.gz"
[12:16] <sivang> Kamion : and then that's it, it loops back to the text mode grub menu, positioned at the "Ubuntu" target again
[12:16] <sivang> this would leep as long as I try, no other target I tried would help.
[12:16] <sivang> leep=loop
[12:18] <sabdfl> mjg59: bring your friends
[12:20] <sabdfl> Kamion: was the outcome of your merge discussion with mdz a decision to merge hard now then small updates?
[12:21] <jdub> sabdfl: did you mail about the artwork decision?
[12:22] <sabdfl> jdub: nope, wanted the packages in first. they all set? pkg descriptions etc?
[12:22] <jdub> sabdfl: they're all uploaded and done
[12:23] <mjg59> sabdfl: Awkward. It involves a large set of undergraduates, and it's going to be hard enough to get them across Cambridge.
[12:23] <sabdfl> 'k
[12:24] <sabdfl> mjg59: large set of sober undergraduates?
[12:25] <mjg59> With luck, not when we're done with them
[12:25] <pitti> sabdfl: the new artwork on today's CD is nice; gdm screen is better than the preview one
[12:25] <jdub> bright and happy!
[12:26] <sabdfl> sunny!
[12:35] <thom> sabdfl: if i tell people to be at or around south ken at 19:30 or so, does that work for you?
[12:36] <sabdfl> thom: perfect
[12:39] <sabdfl> is the transcript of monday's comunity meeting available online?
[12:40] <thom> i can make logs available if they're not in the usual place
[12:40] <thom> i think mako was planning to write up
[12:42] <thom> hey Sledge 
[12:44] <Sledge> hey thom
[12:44] <Sledge> anyone seen kinnison about?
[12:45] <sabdfl> thom, if there's a usual place that's available online, just give me the url please
[12:45] <sabdfl> i think mako will include a summary in Traffic
[12:46] <sabdfl> thom: otherwise, yes, please publish it and let me have the url so i can include it in my mail
[12:50] <Kamion> sabdfl: yes, that's what I took out of it
[12:51] <Kamion> Sledge: he's in my front room; can I deliver a message?
[12:51] <sabdfl> Kamion: thanks
[12:51] <Sledge> Kamion: cool, yes
[12:52] <sivang> ah network went down again
[12:52] <sivang> :(
[12:52] <sivang> back now
[12:53] <thom> sabdfl: http://people.ubuntu.com/~thom/ubuntu-artwork-meeting.log
[12:54] <sabdfl> thom: thanks muchly
[01:03] <sladen> anyone know why the  ubuntu  text on the GDM login is black rather than corporate dark blue?
[01:06] <daniels> jdub: would malibu and coke all round be a release punishment?
[01:07] <daniels> jdub: 'what do you mean, no mad phat startup for warty?!? i sentence you to malibu and coke.'
[01:10] <aes> I haven't had malibu and coke
[01:10] <aes> but tia maria and coke is nice
[01:10] <aes> so I can conceivable see it making sense
[01:11] <thom> but, ewww, malibu
[01:12] <sabdfl> sladen: i authorised a bit of rule-breaking there
[01:12] <sladen> sabdfl: *nod*
[01:13] <tuo2> mmm... tia maria.
[01:16] <pitti> sjoerd: here?
[01:16] <sjoerd> pitti: yes, but not for long
[01:17] <pitti> sjoerd: I currently don't like the g-v-m approach of calling mount/pmount/umount/pumount
[01:17] <pitti> sjoerd: I would rather like to have g-v-m use the gnome-vfs functions
[01:17] <pitti> sjoerd: this way only gvfs needs to be patched for pmoutn
[01:17] <sjoerd> pitti: agreed
[01:17] <pitti> sjoerd: and I could leave g-v-m alone
[01:17] <pitti> sjoerd: would you adopt this?
[01:17] <pitti> sjoerd: it should even adopted upstream, I guess
[01:18] <sjoerd> pitti: if it doesn't have regressions wrt our current way, ofcourse
[01:18] <pitti> sjoerd: then I will prepare a patch, test it in Ubuntu and send it to you
[01:19] <sjoerd> pitti: cool
[01:19] <sjoerd> pitti: send it to pkg-utopia-devel so that's actually used :)
[01:19] <pitti> sjoerd: oh, nice idea
[01:19] <sjoerd> later
[01:19] <pitti> sjoerd: have fun!
[01:25] <pitti> thom: BTW, still remember the hal-pumount-after-ripping-out problem?
[01:25] <__daniel> hai mvo_
[01:25] <pitti> thom: we still have this ugly pmount patch which drops uid verification
[01:25] <pitti> thom: I'd like to get rid of that
[01:26] <thom> pitti: still not sure how
[01:27] <thom> pitti: i'd love to get rid of it, also
[01:27] <pitti> thom: the problem was that g-v-m can't determine the device path for a removed hal id, right?
[01:27] <pitti> thom: because hal already delted the db entry
[01:27] <thom> correct
[01:27] <thom> yep
[01:27] <thom> so g-v-m would have to keep a cache of what it's mounted, and the hal id
[01:27] <pitti> thom: I discussed that with sjoerd, hal should not be changed to remember the data after removal
[01:28] <pitti> thom: yes; g-v-m currently manages a list of mounted devices (or, rather hal ids)
[01:28] <pitti> thom: this could be changed into a mapping hal id -> device
[01:28] <pitti> thom: and we were done
[01:28] <thom> right, that sounds good
[01:28] <pitti> thom: I recently had to introduce this moutn list to keep track of mounts
[01:29] <pitti> thom: so we can as well do it completely right
[01:29] <pitti> thom: the only problem is that this won't work any more if the user rips out a device after he logged out
[01:29] <pitti> thom: my favourite solution would still be to have the kernel automatically unmount a device lazily, but that's more difficult to push upstream
[01:31] <thom> pitti: yeah, that would be the best solution, but as you say, it's tricky to get in
[01:32] <thom> but yes, your approach with g-v-m sounds good to me
[01:32] <jamesh> pitti: until we have inotify, many devices won't lazy unmount anyway ...
[01:32] <pitti> thom: I don't really see a reason why it should _not_ be done in the kernel
[01:32] <pitti> thom: do you?
[01:32] <pitti> jamesh: why not?
[01:32] <pitti> jamesh: this works fine currently
[01:32] <thom> pitti: I can't think of one
[01:33] <jamesh> pitti: if there is a trash dir, Nautilus will have a dnotify watch on the drive even if no windows are open.
[01:33] <pitti> jamesh: but still umount -l should work?
[01:33] <jamesh> pitti: no.
[01:34] <jamesh> a lazy unmount will wait til all open files are closed
[01:34] <jamesh> and the dnotify watch is an open file
[01:34] <pitti> jamesh: huh? why not? I've never seen a lazy unmount fail
[01:34] <jamesh> pitti: by not work, I mean the unmount won't complete
[01:35] <pitti> jamesh: well, the /proc/mounts entry should be gone in all cases, but of course the device is still accessed
[01:35] <jamesh> the "umount -l" call will return, but the kernel won't actually unmount the device til all open files are closed
[01:35] <pitti> jamesh: I think I just misunderstood you
[01:35] <pitti> yes, right
[01:36] <jamesh> it isn't safe to remove the drive til the unmount has really completed, right?
[01:36] <pitti> right
[01:36] <pitti> umount -l just prevents opening new files on it
[01:36] <pitti> so new processes don't see the mount any more
[01:36] <pitti> but existing file descriptors remain vallid
[01:36] <pitti> valid
[01:36] <jamesh> but fam/nautilus will still have an open file handle
[01:37] <jamesh> since they were watching the .Trash-username directory on that volume
[01:37] <pitti> for the .Trash?
[01:37] <jamesh> yeah.
[01:37] <pitti> ah,y es
[01:37] <pitti> but still some thingy should unmount -l the device after a removal
[01:38] <pitti> this does not solve the data corruption, but keeps the mtab clean
[01:38] <pitti> that's our actual problem
[01:38] <pitti> (for now)
[01:38] <jamesh> with inotify, you don't actually have to open a file descriptor on the volume
[01:38] <pitti> oh, that sounds promising
[01:38] <jamesh> so watching for changes on the volume doesn't prevent the volume from being unmounted
[01:38] <pitti> so inotify is kernel based, and dnotify is userspace?
[01:38] <jamesh> both are kernel interfaces
[01:39] <pitti> ah, but dnotify requires to open a file
[01:39] <pitti> ?
[01:39] <jamesh> yeah.
[01:39] <pitti> "i" like inode?
[01:39] <jamesh> with dnotify, you open the directory and run a special fcntl() on it.  Then the kernel sends a SIGIO signal whenever any of the directories you are watching change
[01:40] <pitti> ah, and it is required to keep the dir open?
[01:40] <jamesh> with inotify, you open a device (/dev/inotify, I think), send some ioctl()'s to say what you want to watch, then read events from the device
[01:40] <pitti> sounds much nicer
[01:40] <pitti> thanks for the explanation!
[01:40] <jamesh> yes.  dnotify requires you to keep open all the directories you want to watch
[01:41] <pitti> jamesh: do you now whether 2.6.9 already has it?
[01:41] <jamesh> so the file descriptor limit is also the maximum number of directories you can watch with dnotify.
[01:41] <mjg59> pitti: 2.6.9 doesn't have it
[01:42] <__daniel> jamesh, i guess you'll have some other file descriptors around, already :-)
[01:42] <pitti> but it is planned for the near future?
[01:42] <mjg59> 2.6.10 stands a good chance
[01:42] <jamesh> pitti: http://tech9.net/rml/log/2004092201.html <- some details on inotify from Rob Love.
[01:42] <pitti> ah, this guy again :-)
[01:44] <jamesh> pitti: the other nice thing is that Gamin (Daniel Veillard's FAM replacement) already supports inotify.
[01:45] <jamesh> pitti: since it is ABI compatible with FAM, it should be trivial to switch over.
[01:45] <pitti> nice
[01:45] <pitti> I already heard jdub talk about gamin
[01:45] <thom> (gamin's in universe already)
[01:45] <pitti> readymade bed, as it seems :-)
[01:45] <bob2> novell is funding some very interesting devlopement
[01:46] <thom> bob2: gamin is RHAT, but yes :-)
[01:46] <bob2> oh
[01:46] <jamesh> Rumor is that the "d" in "dnotify" does not stand for "directory" but for "suck." -- rml
[01:46] <bob2> well, they're doing nice interlocking stuff then :)
[02:24] <fabbione> daniels: ping
[02:24] <giard> just curious, has there been any talk of adding adm8211 (and a couple other of the wireless chipsets) to the ubuntu kernel to up the out-of-the-boxness for laptop users?
[02:24] <daniels> fabbione: pong
[02:25] <fabbione> daniels: who develop the savage driver?
[02:25] <daniels> fabbione: thomas winischofer
[02:25] <fabbione> daniels: is it done within X.org or outside?
[02:25] <daniels> it's done within xorg now, iir
[02:25] <fabbione> daniels: mind to check?
[02:25] <daniels> google for 'twini savage' tho
[02:25] <fabbione> daniels: *sighs*
[02:25] <daniels> fabbione: sure, when I've stopped saturating my line with fd.o CVS ;)
[02:26] <daniels> fabbione: ?
[02:26] <fabbione> daniels: i am portforwarding patches...
[02:26] <fabbione> i am at a level that i edit the patches directly without even reading the code
[02:26] <fabbione> i only need to know which is the lastest version of that driver :-)
[02:27] <daniels> heh :) yeah, editing patches by hand is crack
[02:27] <fabbione> brb
[02:38] <T-Bone> hi
[02:39] <thom> hey
[02:41] <T-Bone> Kamion: ping?
[02:41] <sabdfl> lamont: still up?
[02:41] <sabdfl> amu: around?
[02:42] <Kamion> T-Bone: yep?
[02:42] <T-Bone> Kamion: i'm willing to setup some box for you, let's see what you need? ;)
[02:43] <Kamion> can we do it tomorrow? :)
[02:43] <Kamion> today's warty release day
[02:43] <T-Bone> sure ;)
[02:43] <T-Bone> ah yes, of course
[02:43] <T-Bone> just let me know if remote (network + netconsole) access to an IA64 server 2way is ok?
[02:44] <T-Bone> it'll be setup with debian sarge, unless you want something else, and you'll be free to screw it anyway you like
[02:44] <T-Bone> :)
[02:44] <Kamion> that sounds fine
[02:44] <Kamion> thanks :-)
[02:44] <T-Bone> Kamion: ok, i'll prepare that and we'll polish the setup tomorrow ;)
[02:49] <fabbione> T-Bone: i might need access too :(
[02:49] <fabbione> but not until warty is built there
[02:49] <T-Bone> fabbione: ok we'll check that out tomorrow
[02:49] <fabbione> T-Bone: take the time you need.
[02:50] <fabbione> I have no rush atm
[02:50] <T-Bone> ok
[02:50] <fabbione> we are talking about X ;)
[02:50] <fabbione> so there is time
[02:50] <T-Bone> i'll try to fix the stage1 package trouble in the meantime, and get the second stage builder up and running
[02:50] <T-Bone> lol
[03:00] <amu> sabdfl: yap
[03:00] <sabdfl> have some livecd feedback
[03:00] <sabdfl> no desktop image at all, just the X stipple
[03:00] <sabdfl> gnome panel starts ok
[03:00] <sabdfl> but nautilus seems to be stuck
[03:01] <amu> I guess a slower laptop ? right ? 
[03:01] <lamont> well, sort of
[03:01] <amu> lamont: wb 
[03:05] <amu> sabdfl: could you say somewhat more about the system?
[03:09] <lamont> sabdfl: how much RAM in that system?
[03:11] <seb128> any message by running "nautilus" from a gnome-terminal ?
[03:13] <pitti> jamesh: do you know any reason why gnome-vfs allows to unmount a device, but not to mount it?
[03:14] <pitti> jamesh: I want to modify g-v-m to use the gvfs interface, instead of being patched for pmount
[03:14] <Kamion> anyone here running an Ubuntu cdimage mirror?
[03:14] <fabbione> daniels: did you see my message before about the hotel?
[03:17] <daniels> fabbione: yeah
[03:18] <lamont> mdz awake?
[03:28] <sabdfl> amu, lamont, about 512MB
[03:29] <sabdfl> the draft announcement text is at http://wiki.ubuntulinux.org/WartyWarthog_2fFinalReleaseAnnouncement
[03:29] <sabdfl> please cast an eye over it for obvious issues
[03:29] <sabdfl> it will go out in plaintext so ignore the wiki formatting glitches
[03:29] <amu> sabdfl: cpu ? 
[03:31] <amu> testing now 07 
[03:31] <sabdfl> amu: recent, it's a new toshiba test laptop, morphix was working fine
[03:33] <sabdfl> Kamion: will need that list of url's in about 10
[03:33] <Kamion> sabdfl: see #canonical
[03:34] <amu> sabdfl: those toshiba satellite's ?
[03:35] <T-Bone> Kamion: ok the box is ready, awaiting for your details tomorrow ;) I'm gonna stop bugging you till then ;)
[03:40] <pitti> enrico: thanks a lot for signing my key :-)
[03:42] <enrico> pitti: no problem... sorry for being so so late
[03:42] <enrico> pitti: (I finally got weasel's new script to work)
[03:42] <pitti> enrico: there's a fancy script for such things?
[03:42] <pitti> enrico: nice
[03:43] <enrico> pitti: check pgp-tools.alioth.debian.org
[03:43] <pitti> enrico: great, thanks
[03:43] <enrico> pitti: there's a couple of gotchas for getting it to work, though
[03:44] <sabdfl> amu: yes, think so
[03:46] <lamont> who was it that was getting 20 minut download times?
[03:48] <amu> sabdfl: cool, TOSHIBA is hard to support it. My friends one, will not boot a liveCD doent matter if it knoppix,gnoppix,morphix, it fails all time. "HP" should be the choose *ducks*  
[03:49] <pitti> seb128: do you happen to know why $PATH exports in .bashrc are simply ignored in gnome terminal / xterm?
[03:49] <sabdfl> amu: previous warty live cd's worked fine
[03:49] <sabdfl> well, at least the desktop image showed
[03:50] <amu> sabdfl: what happen ( output ) if he/she start it from a term ?   
[03:50] <seb128> pitti: they are not here ..
[03:51] <pitti> seb128: hmm, I'm lost with this. My .bashrc contains "export PATH=/home/martin/bin:$PATH"
[03:51] <pitti> seb128: but still, after "source ~/.bashrc" the PATH is unmodified
[03:51] <pitti> seb128: this does not happen on text consoles or e. g. fvwm, so I thought this was a gnome bug^feature
[03:52] <pitti> seb128: there are some relevant posts on u-users, too
[03:52] <seb128> weird
[03:52] <seb128> I'll have a look
[03:52] <pitti> so at least I'm not the only one
[03:52] <seb128> but here I've an "export PATH=$PATH:/usr/games" in ~/.bashrc
[03:53] <seb128> and the PATH is right in my gnome-terminals
[03:53] <pitti> seb128: hum, /usr/games is already in by default
[03:53] <seb128> pitti: let me test on my fresh install
[03:53] <pitti> seb128: can you try to add /home/seb/bin?
[03:53] <pitti> seb128: this box is a fresh install from this morning
[03:54] <sabdfl> amu: it just sits and does nothing at the terminal
[03:54] <pitti> seb128: maybe it somehow filters out paths to private home dirs
[03:54] <seb128> pitti: works
[03:54] <pitti> seb128: not here; this drives me crazy...
[03:54] <pitti> seb128: thanks anyway for testing
[03:55] <seb128> pitti: it works on my main box, just trying on my test box
[03:55] <seb128> 1 sec
[03:55] <seb128> works fine
[03:55] <seb128> that's an ~1h fresh install
[03:55] <pitti> just tried that on my ~1.5 hour freshly installed iBook, same result :-(
[03:56] <seb128> I've just added a "export PATH=$PATH:/tmp" on the bottom of ~/.bashrc
[03:57] <pitti> seb128: nice idea; it indeed works if I add it at the _bottom_ (it was the very first line before)
[03:57] <seb128> ok
[03:57] <seb128> some something in the file overwrite it
[03:57] <pitti> I just saw that I source /etc/profile if I'm under X
[03:57] <pitti> because it is not read by default for some strange reason
[03:57] <pitti> ;-)
[03:58] <seb128> ok, that's it so :p
[03:58] <pitti> sorry
[03:58] <pitti> for bothering you
[03:58] <seb128> np
[03:59] <amu> lamont: you run a changelog ? 
[04:02] <lamont> sabdfl: btw, liveCD didn't get any of LiveSeed either: doesn't fit
[04:02] <lamont> amu: Guess I should really start one, eh?
[04:03] <lamont> last night's changelog is found in #ubuntu-devel :-(
[04:04] <amu> sabdfl: strace could be your friend 
[04:04] <amu> lamont: yes, please start a changelog 
[04:05] <Kamion> amu: do you run the source.rfc822.org mirror?
[04:07] <amu> Kamion: nope, lolo run it, but we have a closed relationship
[04:08] <Kamion> how much notice does he need to grab release CD images?
[04:09] <amu> the cron runs once a day, if something goes wrong, a phonecall
[04:10] <amu> or icq :)
[04:10] <Kamion> we're going to be publishing images at some point soon (hour or two), it would be nice if at least one mirror could start grabbing them when they're published and have them available by the time the announcement goes out
[04:10] <Kamion> sorry for the short notice
[04:11] <lamont> any bandwidth-possessing folks who can get < 30 minute liveCD download?
[04:11] <lamont> < 45?
[04:11] <Kamion> not a hope :(
[04:12] <thom> http://noraisin.net/~jan/generators/ubuntu/ubuntu-release.php ; thanks to thaytan and jaq
[04:13] <tseng> hah, Sleazy Salamander
[04:13] <tseng> sleazy/main
[04:13] <amu> Kamion: no prob, you can point to him, he really like it, if the server has something to do. letme know asap 
[04:13] <Kinnison> "Pseudosquamate Prude"
[04:13] <Kinnison> that rocks
[04:13] <amu> lamont: now 2:30 :(  
[04:13] <thom> and they happily got it right for 1 2 and 3
[04:14] <Kamion> though not 4
[04:17] <elmo_> init.d pretty == ugly on serial
[04:17] <elmo_> like, ueber ugly
[04:18] <Riddell> lamont: probably could
[04:20] <lamont> Riddell: http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~lamont/testing/LiveCD/20041020-14/warty-live-i386-20041020-14.iso
[04:20] <lamont> for extra credit, do you happen to have a wireless card that requires non-free firmware?
[04:20] <Kamion> elmo_: doesn't /lib/lsb/init-functions know how to deal with $TERM?
[04:20] <Kinnison> but it'll take me > 1h20 to download that :-(
[04:20] <amu> lamont: yap 
[04:21] <Riddell> lamont: I have a cisco wavelan
[04:21] <Riddell> lamont: presumably you want me to burn and test once downloaded?
[04:21] <elmo_> [ ok ] pping periodic command scheduler...
[04:21] <elmo_> [ ok ] pping internet superserver...
[04:21] <elmo_> Kamion: guess not :)
[04:21] <Kamion> hoorah
[04:21] <lamont> things I need to know and when: (1) ASAP, does 20041020-14 boot, or did it process-b0rk
[04:22] <lamont> (2) does the firmware work in it?
[04:22] <Kinnison> ETA 1:38:00
[04:22] <amu> Kamion: lolo said no prob, you're welcome to make some traffic
[04:22] <amu> brb
[04:23] <lamont> Riddell: yes, burn and boot
[04:23] <lamont> best download time I could manage would be around 6 hours.
[04:24] <Riddell> will have to restart download on the CD burning machine in that case, it was already 1/3rd downloaded
[04:25] <lamont> k
[04:29] <lamont> amu: http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~lamont/testing/LiveCD/changelog
[04:30] <mako> T-Bone: yeah
[04:35] <Kinnison> heh
[04:35] <Kamion> must make sure we import the partman-time warning about that for hoary
[04:39] <mdz> morning
[04:39] <mako> mdz: greetings
[04:40] <seb128> hello mdz 
[04:40] <Kamion> mdz: happy to publish as final so mirrors can get at it?
[04:41] <mdz> Kamion: install CD, yes
[04:41] <mdz> what's the live CD situation?
[04:41] <jamesh> pitti: still around?
[04:41] <Kamion> apparently we publish "something" today and release for real on Monday
[04:41] <pitti> jamesh: yes
[04:41] <Kamion> live-CD-wise
[04:42] <Kamion> powerpc in archive-copier
[04:42] <jamesh> pitti: about your gnome-vfs/g-v-m question, gnome-vfs can be used to mount a drive, provided that there is an entry in /etc/fstab with the "user" option.
[04:42] <jamesh> pitti: it doesn't have a way to represent an unmounted volume without an entry in /etc/fstab
[04:42] <pitti> jamesh: which I don't have...
[04:43] <pitti> jamesh: I already tried with ..._get_connected_drives()
[04:43] <pitti> jamesh: but it doesn't work
[04:43] <pitti> jamesh: I think for this to work, gvfs needs to be compiled with hal support
[04:43] <jamesh> pitti: in gnome-vfs, a GnomeVFSDrive _is_ an entry in the fstab file
[04:44] <mdz> lamont: how did the testing go on the live CD?
[04:44] <pitti> jamesh: I would construct a GnomeVFSDrive structure manually, but the interesting parts are private
[04:44] <pitti> jamesh: actually I just need a public interface to gnome_vfs_volume_mount
[04:44] <pitti> jamesh: so no chance?
[04:44] <lamont> mdz: fabbione had booted it before I went to bed, and seemd good to him.
[04:44] <jamesh> pitti: probably not.
[04:44] <lamont> having said that...
[04:44] <lamont> it doesn't have the firmware in it
[04:44] <pitti> jamesh: I find it a bad design to patch both gvfs and g-v-m to use pmount
[04:45] <lamont> and I f*&& the alsa startup link
[04:45] <jamesh> pitti: however, there isn't as much reason to prefer gnome_vfs_volume_mount() over directly calling pmount
[04:45] <pitti> jamesh: but thanks! I guess we have to live with that for a while...
[04:45] <pitti> jamesh: oh, there was
[04:45] <lamont> so some sound (at least) will still be muted - got reports that it was working now, so didn't think about that until this AM either.
[04:45] <jamesh> pitti: none of the issues with dnotify that affect umount() apply here
[04:45] <pitti> jamesh: we could leave g-v-m alone and sync it to Debian
[04:45] <lamont> 20041020-14 has firmware, still no alsa fix
[04:45] <pitti> jamesh: and g-v-m would be mount program agnostic
[04:46] <sivang> lamont : have you had good reports for booting the live cd on dell inspirons?
[04:46] <lamont> and that's being grabbed by Riddell for process check
[04:46] <lamont> sivang: only your "no good" report
[04:46] <sivang> lamont : ok, then maybe it's something wrong with the download :(
[04:46] <lamont> I've had some images that were unhappy, where reburning helped.
[04:46] <jamesh> pitti: I don't know whether it is recommended to enable HAL support in gnome-vfs yet.
[04:46] <lamont> (and btw, if the CD-R says 8X, you shouldn't burn at 32x :-( )
[04:47] <pitti> jamesh: me neither, I think I just leave it as it is by now
[04:47] <amu> lamont: thx 
[04:47] <pitti> jamesh: was the counterpart to gnome_vfs_volume_unmount just forgotten, isn't it there on purpose?
[04:48] <pitti> jamesh: s/,/, or/
[04:48] <jamesh> pitti: a GnomeVFSVolume is a mounted volume
[04:48] <jamesh> pitti: so it is already mounted :)
[04:48] <jamesh> a GnomeVFSDrive represents something that can be mounted, so there is a gnome_vfs_drive_mount()
[04:49] <jamesh> ideally, we should be getting a GnomeVFSDrive for USB sticks, etc
[04:49] <pitti> by now I already needa GVFsDrive to mount a GVFSDrive, which is kind of pointless for my needs :-)
[04:49] <mdz> mako: do we have a release announcement prepared?
[04:50] <pitti> jamesh: okay, thanks anyway!
[04:51] <lamont> mdz: scrollback about 85 minutes in #c
[04:51] <thom> mdz: http://wiki.ubuntulinux.org/WartyWarthog_2fFinalReleaseAnnouncement
[04:51] <mdz> lamont: what's wrong with the alsa stuff?
[04:52] <mdz> thanks
[04:52] <lamont>  morphix/rc.m/../init.d/alsa != /etc/init.d/alsa
[04:52] <lamont> brain fart
[04:52] <lamont> and reported as good, so I didn't notice it
[04:52] <mdz> that weird indentation is unintentional, right?
[04:53] <lamont> the extra space?
[04:53] <mako> mdz: should be
[04:53] <lamont> was gonna type a leading slash...
[04:53] <pitti> I've got to go, guys; happy release party!
[04:53] <mako> mdz: i'd like to work on that a little bit when you're done with it
[04:53] <mdz> lamont: no, in the release announcement
[04:53] <mako> mdz: yeah, i'm sure
[04:53] <mdz> mako: I'm only looking; feel free
[04:54] <lamont> yeah - indentation is kinda funny
[04:54] <mako> i think the first line/paragraph is a little engimatic for a message with very wide distribution
[04:54] <sabdfl> mdz: which weird indentation? the wiki rendering is strange, check the plaintext rendering
[04:54] <lamont> and the penultimate word should be 'in', not 'at'.
[04:55] <mdz> yes, it's written with plaintext formatting
[04:55] <sivang> mako : it basically sums it up isn't it?
[04:55] <sabdfl> mdz: livecd situation is... flaky, bad bugs on test laptops here, but still go for rc afaics
[04:55] <mdz> lamont: is the fix for the alsa thing trivial?
[04:55] <Riddell> lamont: it didn't boot for me
[04:55] <Riddell> lamont: don't know if that's due to a bad burn or not
[04:56] <lamont> mdz: trivial
[04:56] <mdz> lamont: building a new image with that?
[04:56] <Riddell> lamont: it gets as far as "Linux-bzImage setup=xxx size=xxx" and that's all it does
[04:56] <lamont> mdz: home edition just built, testing.
[04:56] <lamont> then dc edition
[04:56] <mdz> Riddell: sounds like a burn problem
[04:56] <sabdfl> mako: are you editing the release announcement?
[04:57] <sabdfl> mdz: are you happy with the release announcement?
[04:57] <mdz> sabdfl: can you give me a quick diff vs. the RC announcement?
[04:57] <mdz> it looks mostly the same
[04:57] <sabdfl> elmo_: you too?
[04:57] <mako> sabdfl: yeah, i am
[04:57] <sabdfl> mdz: not easily
[04:57] <mdz> sabdfl: I would s/FAST/fast/
[04:58] <elmo_> one sec
[04:58] <Kamion> ok, powerpc's far enough into second stage that I think I'm happy with it, will publish over the next few minutes
[04:59] <sabdfl> mako: it's telling me that you are still editing
[04:59] <elmo_> yeah, looks ok to me
[04:59] <elmo_> but agree with de-capitalization of mdz's
[05:00] <sabdfl> mako: please don't make any substantial changes at this stage
[05:00] <mako> sabdfl: right, i'm just doing small th ings
[05:01] <mako> sabdfl: but... in the first bullet.. there's more space devoted to non-free drivers than to the freeness of the distribution. it sounds kind of wishywashy.. i'd like to rewrite that
[05:04] <mdz> sabdfl: will we have some means to test a representative of the batch of pressed CDs before they go out?
[05:05] <mdz> it would be rather awful if they had some sort of defect
[05:05] <sabdfl> mdz: good point. silbs? ^^
[05:05] <Kamion> sabdfl: I can come down to London and collect one of each to test
[05:06] <sabdfl> Kamion: figure we can fedex a few to cambridge from Holland
[05:07] <sabdfl> Kamion: ready to go?
[05:08] <sabdfl> elmo_: ready to go?
[05:08] <sabdfl> mdz: ready to go?
[05:08] <sabdfl> mako: ready to go?
[05:08] <mdz> ready
[05:08] <elmo_> ready
[05:08] <mdz> install CD only, right?
[05:08] <sabdfl> yes
[05:08] <sabdfl> mako: ?
[05:09] <mako> one thing
[05:09] <mako> sabdfl: did you change any links?
[05:09] <Kamion> sabdfl: brief delay on publishing here, one sec
[05:09] <mako> sabdfl: in the announcement text?
[05:09] <sabdfl> mako: no
[05:09] <Kamion> going as fast as I can
[05:09] <mako> i will quickly test the links then while Kamion is waiting
[05:09] <sabdfl> 'k
[05:10] <mako> they all work
[05:11] <elmo_> err
[05:11] <elmo_> you guys know release.u.c is still showing RC, right? ;)
[05:11] <mako> oh wait
[05:11] <mako> the download page is inaccurate
[05:11] <Kamion> elmo_: 16:09 < Kamion> sabdfl: brief delay on publishing here, one sec
[05:11] <mako> "Download Ubuntu 4.10 "The Warty Warthog" Release Candidate"
[05:11] <Kamion> I'm working on it, stuff's running
[05:11] <mako> probably shouldn't say RC
[05:12] <Kamion> but I was delayed due to my development laptop being engaged in testing the release image :P
[05:12] <mako> either
[05:12] <mako> who is going to do this before we all collide on this 
[05:12] <sabdfl> i've edited the page
[05:13] <sabdfl> thom: could you nudge apache so it refreshes it's cache?
[05:13] <elmo_> does it need de-cached?
[05:13] <sabdfl> for the web site?
[05:13] <elmo_> nudged
[05:13] <mako> ok. but release.u.c should be fixed
[05:13] <elmo_> mako: kamion's working on that
[05:13] <elmo_> see above
[05:13] <mako> right right
[05:14] <Kamion> what live CD should be in there?
[05:14] <mdz> Kamion: I think none yet
[05:14] <sabdfl> ctrl x again
[05:14] <lamont> I'm most comfortable with 20041020-07
[05:14] <Kamion> I currently have 20041020-07
[05:14] <sabdfl> ok
[05:14] <sabdfl> mdz: we definitely need a candidate there
[05:14] <lamont> but would like to drop 20041020-16 in once it gets downloaded and booted at least once
[05:15] <sabdfl> as long as it's -test- or -release-candidate-
[05:15] <Kamion> sabdfl: -rc-
[05:15] <Kamion> can do -rc2- etc. as needed
[05:15] <lamont> yeah - definitely not release yet.
[05:15] <mdz> the only live CD I've personally tested is -05
[05:15] <Kamion> gah, md5sum on ISOs SO SLOW
[05:15] <sabdfl> 'k
[05:15] <lamont> Kamion: md5sum.txt is in my directories now
[05:16] <lamont> -16 won't be there until about :32, btw
[05:16] <lamont> sound happier now though
[05:17] <sabdfl> Kamion?
[05:17] <Kamion> sanity-checking
[05:17] <sabdfl> in this crowd?
[05:18] <Kamion> elmo_: might've been an idea to change Description: in dists/warty/Release
[05:18] <elmo_> DOH
[05:18] <elmo_> can I do that now?
[05:19] <elmo_> will take 5 mins
[05:19] <elmo_> we so need a friging release check list
[05:19] <Kamion> won't affect CDs anyway, too late to rebuild them
[05:19] <mdz> perhaps best to leave the archive in sync with the CDs
[05:19] <sabdfl> elmo_: was just typing one on the wiki for hoary :-)
[05:20] <Kamion> syncing to mirnyy now
[05:20] <elmo_> aww, dude, it sucks
[05:20] <elmo_> it's not even "Release candidate", it's "Preview!
[05:20] <elmo_> s/!/"/
[05:20] <Kamion> elmo_: sorry, only noticed it when I glanced at the .jigdo :(
[05:20] <elmo_> Kamion: not your fault, my respons
[05:21] <Kamion> I don't think it matters if the CD's Description: is different
[05:21] <Kamion> releases.u.c synced, PLEASE SANITY-CHECK
[05:21] <elmo_> mdz: also, shall I untouchable it
[05:21] <elmo_> mdz: or are you still planning to change universe post-release?
[05:21] <mdz> I don't see Description: in the Release files that apt downloaded?
[05:22] <Kamion> mdz: dists/warty/Release, not dists/warty/main/binary-i386/Release ...
[05:22] <mdz> elmo_: I think we'll probably mess with universe post-release, but it would be very nice to have the safeguard for main+restricted
[05:22] <mdz> elmo_: if it's not possible to do them separately, let's untouchable the whole thing for now; it's reversible, right?
[05:22] <elmo_> ok I'll untouchable it, and figure out how to de-untouchable universe later
[05:22] <lamont> mdz: I'd just as soon freeze universe as well
[05:23] <mdz> lamont: is mplayer still completely borked?
[05:23] <lamont> "warty's out, see hoary"
[05:23] <lamont> not if you're on a Xeon :-(
[05:23] <mdz> mplayer is basically the entire use case for multiverse
[05:23] <mdz> and it doesn't work
[05:23] <lamont> right
[05:23] <Kamion> would appreciate somebody making sure that the .torrents work
[05:23] <lamont> would be nice to bounce on multiverse for a few days
[05:23] <elmo_> oh!
[05:23] <elmo_> I need to restart our torrent clients
[05:24] <sivang> I guess now wouldn't be to report trouble with installing using Adaptec SCSI 7899 adapter..:)
[05:24] <mdz> sabdfl, lamont: silbs pointed out in email that celestia is still referenced in the UI despite having been removed. can we get henrik or whomever to fix that?
[05:24] <lamont> mdz: he was on that distro
[05:24] <thom> checking the torrent stuff
[05:24] <mdz> yes, but I didn't see a reply and have no idea what timezone he is in
[05:25] <lamont> has .uk addr, but..
[05:25] <thom> mdz: he's in oxford
[05:25] <thom> so UTC+1
[05:25] <sabdfl> should i prepare a /. port so long?
[05:25] <sabdfl> post
[05:25] <sivang> Kamion : try download from release. ?
[05:26] <mdz> sabdfl: yes
[05:26] <mdz> unless you want to leave it to someone else
[05:26] <Kamion> sivang: sure, .torrents might not work yet though
[05:26] <mdz> would be nice to have one without typos, spelling errors, etc.
[05:26] <sabdfl> sorry, disconnected for a while
[05:27] <sabdfl> mdz: yes, live cd needs tweaks to that ui
[05:27] <sabdfl> silbs can sync with henrik
[05:27] <sabdfl> the Release description, mdz, happy to go out with that as is?
[05:27] <mdz> sabdfl: I'm happy to call it a wart
[05:27] <sabdfl> fine
[05:27] <mdz> unless you want to delay for another round of CD testing
[05:27] <sabdfl> kamion, elmo_, mako, can we go?
[05:28] <mdz> does any tool actually display that description?
[05:28] <mdz> I thought it was more or less unused anyway
[05:28] <elmo_> can someone verrify the otrrents are working first?
[05:28] <sabdfl> need a firm go from each of you
[05:28] <mdz> elmo_: thom is on it
[05:28] <thom> the seeders are still processing the new isos
[05:29] <sabdfl> thom: eta?
[05:29] <elmo_> my two victim clients seem happier now
[05:30] <lamont> Kamion: were'd the liveCD iso get put?  or waiting for -16?
[05:30] <Kamion> lamont: on releases.u.c, warty-rc-live-i386.iso
[05:30] <sabdfl> i'm happy for the announcement to go out without the rc live cd in place if you want to hold for -16
[05:30] <lamont> oh. not cdimage.u.c
[05:30] <Kamion> | error(s): [16:30:27]  rejected by tracker - Requested download is not authorized for use with this tracker.                                                                                                     |
[05:30] <mdz> Kamion: which torrent?
[05:30] <Kamion> lamont: it's there too somewhere, can't remember where now
[05:31] <Kamion> mdz: http://releases.ubuntu.com/warty/warty-release-install-i386.iso.torrent
[05:31] <mako> sabdfl: yes
[05:31] <lamont> no torrent for livecd rc that I see...
[05:31] <mdz> [08:31:17]  Problem connecting to tracker - HTTP Error 503: Service Unavailable
[05:31] <Kamion> I'll do that now
[05:33] <thom> uh
[05:33] <mdz> now getting rejected
[05:33] <Kamion> should be a live torrent now
[05:33] <thom> mdz: tell you why, has the releases.u.c script changed on mirnny?
[05:33] <lamont> [09:33:45]  rejected by tracker - Requested download is not authori
[05:33] <mdz> thom: there's a releases.u.c script on mirnny?
[05:34] <thom> or rather, Kamion needs to trigger auckland as well as mirnny
[05:34] <Kamion> er, I do
[05:34] <thom> for releases
[05:34] <Kamion> trigger () {
[05:34] <Kamion>         ssh -i "$SECRET/auckland" archvsync@"$1" sleep 1
[05:34] <Kamion> }
[05:34] <Kamion> trigger auckland
[05:34] <Kamion> trigger mirnyy.ubuntu.com
[05:34] <thom> well, there are only rc-install in the appropriate directory
[05:34] <Kamion> which?
[05:35] <thom>  /srv/ftp.root/releases/warty on auckland
[05:35] <thom> triggered manually, checking
[05:35] <Kamion> I'm triggering it as best I know how
[05:35] <Kamion> if I need to do something else you need to tell me what :)
[05:35] <thom> releasessync
[05:35] <Kamion> that user?
[05:36] <thom> sorry. archvsync user, script is called releasessync
[05:36] <sivang> tonnret not authorizing me to downlod
[05:36] <Kamion> thom: I don't have any control over the script that's run, it's command-limited
[05:36] <thom> Kamion: ah
[05:36] <thom> that'd do it
[05:36] <Kamion> thom: make the default archvsync on auckland call releasessync
[05:37] <thom> archvsync or cdsync?
[05:37] <thom> uh, cdimagesync i guess
[05:38] <thom> yeah
[05:38] <lamont> sigh.  2 new RC bugs
[05:38] <lamont> neither of which is obviously NOTWARTY
[05:39] <mako> sabdfl: where are you sending the announcement?
[05:39] <elmo_> Cur: nan bits/sec
[05:39] <sabdfl> mako: i will just send to ubuntu-users and -devel as soon as we go
[05:39] <thom> still rsync
[05:39] <thom> ing
[05:39] <elmo_> phear our bw.  or our 32 bit counters.  one of the two
[05:39] <mako> sabdfl: ok, want me to resend to -announce?
[05:40] <lamont> elmo_: LOL
[05:40] <sabdfl> also, am going to ask everyone to post to slashdot
[05:40] <mako> sabdfl: that's really the correct place
[05:40] <sabdfl> mako: good point. can i do that one too?
[05:40] <mako> sabdfl: yeah, it's moderated but i think i can find it my heart to approve the message :)
[05:40] <sabdfl> mako: would you handle the external communities?
[05:40] <sabdfl> mako: you gem
[05:40] <mako> sabdfl: yeah.. i'll send it down the line to places i know of
[05:40] <mako> can coordinate with people on IRC
[05:41] <Riddell> lamont: live CD mostly works in failsafe mode for me, I suspect burn problems
[05:41] <lamont> good
[05:41] <mdz> elmo_: how high can we burst now (bandwidth, not counters :-P)
[05:41] <Kamion> amu: can you ping lolo to kick off a mirror of releases.ubuntu.com, pleasE?
[05:41] <Kamion> er, "please"
[05:41] <mdz> gig?
[05:41] <elmo_> mdz: yeah, gig
[05:42] <mdz> not that we'll have any clue how much we're actually using :-)
[05:42] <mdz> I always meant to write a cricket module which polled the local interface counters
[05:42] <T-Bone> hehe
[05:42] <mdz> rather than using SNMP
[05:42] <thom> dear god our disk io sucks
[05:42] <mdz> I think they're larger now
[05:42] <Kamion> thom: even just copying ISOs around on little is tedious
[05:43] <mdz> we should be able to count up to about 109mbit/sec with 32-bit counters and 5-minute polling, I think
[05:43] <fabbione> Kamion: do you know who had the insane idea to add the -live cd to the daily build?
[05:43] <mdz> elmo_: it would be a good idea to set up a second cricket target with faster polling
[05:43] <mdz> 1 minute would let us count up to ~500mbit
[05:43] <Kamion> fabbione: me, it was a temporary hack to make the publish-release script not hate me
[05:44] <sabdfl> mdz: hosting provider has external counters
[05:44] <fabbione> Kamion: ok :(
[05:44] <mdz> sabdfl: ah
[05:44] <mdz> sabdfl: do they publish pretty graphs for us?
[05:44] <Kamion> fabbione: sorry if it caused problems; I suggest you just mirror warty-install-* and MD5SUMS
[05:44] <lamont> 20041020-16 is available for those who want sound to work
[05:44] <sabdfl> passwd protected, yes
[05:44] <fabbione> Kamion: no need to be sorry.. it was just killing my pr0n download :PPP
[05:44] <sabdfl> those who can, haul on -16 so we can decide if it's rc material sooner rather than later
[05:45] <mdz> lamont: downloading
[05:45] <elmo_> no, we will, iptraf works
[05:45] <elmo_> I've got it running on snares
[05:45] <Kamion> fabbione: I've removed it from there now
[05:45] <elmo_> GRR
[05:45] <fabbione> Kamion: thanks mate
[05:45] <elmo_> so the wrong time to unplug the switch
[05:45] <elmo_> sabdfl: dude, they're on crack
[05:45] <Kamion> :-)
[05:45] <sabdfl> lamont: is it in the same location as previous? people.u.c?
[05:45] <lamont> sabdfl: yeah
[05:45] <elmo_> they're the counters that reckoned we were doing half of what we were actually doing
[05:46] <lamont> http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~lamont/testing/LiveCD is the root
[05:46] <fabbione> lamont: is the same one as this morning?
[05:46] <lamont> current is the rc bits, not the latest
[05:46] <lamont> fabbione: that one is less than 5 minutes old
[05:46] <fabbione> lamont: ok. downloading now
[05:47] <lamont> the RC on releases.u.c is from 0750 BST this AM
[05:48] <fabbione> lamont: specific checks to do? audio was working on me this morning both laptop & workstation
[05:48] <mdz> elmo_: if those are the counters they use for billing, that's a FEATURE
[05:48] <sabdfl> mdz: agreed :-)
[05:49] <thom> ok, we should be good for torrent love
[05:50] <elmo_> see, linux reckons we're doing 200Mb/s right now
[05:50] <mdz> i386 torrent works for me
[05:50] <sabdfl> torrents, GO
[05:50] <Kamion> live torrent doesn't work
[05:50] <mdz> yeah, trying that, nothing yet
[05:51] <lamont> "connecting to peers"
[05:51] <mdz> likewise
[05:51] <sabdfl> 'k
[05:51] <mdz> thom: live cd torrent?
[05:51] <lamont> are we short a seed?
[05:51] <sabdfl> torrents, STOP
[05:51] <elmo_> AVANTE.. AVANTE... ARRET... ARRET..
[05:51] <T-Bone> hehe
[05:52] <thom> live cd torrent looks fine
[05:52] <thom> working for me
[05:52] <Kamion> ah, it's working now
[05:52] <Kamion> sabdfl: I'm signed off
[05:52] <mdz> working for me now as well
[05:53] <mdz> testing amd64 and powerpc torrents
[05:53] <fabbione> lamont: ETA 55minutes for LiveCD
[05:53] <amu> Kamion: ^k
[05:53] <Kamion> amu: thanks
[05:53] <mdz> nothing yet
[05:53] <mdz> lamont: ETA 26 minutes for -16
[05:54] <mdz> lamont: assuming there isn't a -17 yet
[05:54] <lamont> nothing here for live torrent
[05:54] <mdz> ok
[05:54] <lamont> mdz: no -17 planned
[05:54] <mdz> all torrents working for me
[05:54] <sabdfl> all torrents go
[05:54] <Kamion> amd64 and powerpc torrents work for me
[05:54] <sabdfl> Kamion: all iso's go?
[05:54] <Kamion> yes
[05:54] <mdz> I'm signed off
[05:54] <amu> lamont: -7 is well done, guess for most people it will work well
[05:54] <sabdfl> elmo_?
[05:54] <thom> grah, my uber cheap pair of ide software raid 1 server kicks the tar out of auckland for bt image checking
[05:54] <sabdfl> mako?
[05:54] <elmo_> sabdfl: standing by with the fire extinguisher
[05:54] <elmo_> (i.e. AVANTE!)  err, or go
[05:55] <mdz> Kamion: did you verify the md5sums of the published images against what I posted to ubuntu-devel for paranoia's sake? :-)
[05:55] <Kamion> mdz: I verified them against the daily; let me check
[05:55] <elmo_> thom: dude, your ide SW RAID 1 isn't doing 60Mb/s of other stuff :P
[05:55] <amu> lamont: my usb-stick mounts not automatic *duck* 
[05:55] <mako> sabdfl: yes
[05:55] <lamont> amu: is it when you boot an installed warty?
[05:55] <amu> lamont: livecd 
[05:56] <Kamion> mdz: check
[05:56] <lamont> amu: yes.  But does the usb stick automount if you're running the non-live warty?
[05:56] <amu> lamont: yes
[05:58] <sabdfl> RELEASE ANNOUNCEMENT: Ubuntu 4.10 "The Warty Warthog Release" is DONE!
[05:58] <sabdfl> Read the full announcement at http://wiki.ubuntulinux.org/WartyWarthog_2fFinalReleaseAnnouncement?action=raw
[05:58] <sabdfl> and well done mdz
[05:59] <Sledge> *applause*
[05:59] <tseng> so
[05:59] <tseng> is warty/universe closed for business?
[05:59] <T-Bone> cla clap clap
[05:59] <elmo_> WOO WOO SUMMON THE POLICE
[05:59] <T-Bone> lol
[05:59] <thom> elmo_: you've forgotten the second line of that
[06:01] <Mitario> congrats you guys!
[06:01] <sabdfl> tseng: yes, security updates only, hoary will be open shortly and we're looking for volunteers to steer the universe component
[06:01] <tseng> sabdfl: ok, cheers
[06:01] <thom> sabdfl: can we bounty a BT server that DOESN'T SUCK for hoary? :-)
[06:02] <lamont> mdz: gonna change /topic in #ubuntu as well?
[06:03] <tseng> sabdfl: id like to help make mono a first class citizen this time around
[06:03] <mdz> 256 people in #ubuntu!
[06:03] <sabdfl> tseng: that's awesome!
[06:03] <sabdfl> mdz: and climbing :-)
[06:04] <tseng> you've got a ways to go to beat the Big 2
[06:04] <tseng> #gentoo and #debian both > 800 :)
[06:04] <carlos> tseng: we are new, let us more time...
[06:04] <carlos> :-D
[06:05] <tseng> heh.
[06:05] <mdz> tseng: give us time; we only just released 5 minutes ago :-)
[06:05] <Kamion> with the current population of #ubuntu I can still just about follow it sometimes
[06:06] <Kamion> wouldn't want it to be #debian-sized, I'd collapse under the weight :)
[06:07] <elmo_> #ubuntu size channels and up are just utter time sinks
[06:12] <sabdfl> Kamion: well done on the installer
[06:13] <Kamion> ta
[06:15] <fabbione> mdz: did Joey put the DSA out purpose 1 hour after our release?
[06:16] <fabbione> out + on
[06:16] <mdz> fabbione: maybe :-)
[06:16] <fabbione> mdz: ok.. i have the packages ready...
[06:16] <fabbione> should we wait tomorrow?
[06:19] <mdz> fabbione: I think so, yes
[06:22] <mdz> thom: is it possible to clean up the torrent status page without resetting the statistics?
[06:22] <mako> mdz: how many people in #redhat
[06:23] <mako> i can't figure out how to count that in irssi
[06:23] <amu> Kamion: sorry can't reach lolo now. I try it in 15min. calls ;)    
[06:23] <mdz> mako: /who #redhat
[06:23] <mdz> mako: I count 48? #fedora might be a better comparison
[06:24] <thom> mdz: nope
[06:25] <mdz> thom: at least the latest stuff sorts nicely to the bottom
[06:25] <thom> by happy accident, yeah
[06:25] <thom> :-)
[06:28] <thom> oh, joy and rapture
[06:28] <thom> that mozilla bug looks joyous
[06:35] <sabdfl> erk
[06:36] <sabdfl> try Applications -> About Ubuntu
[06:36] <sabdfl> should be the on-disk thing
[06:38] <fabbione> mdz: ok let's look at it tomorrow
[06:38] <fabbione> brb
[06:40] <mdz> thom,elmo_: downloads from releases.u.c are timing out
[06:40] <sivang> congrets for the release!
[06:42] <elmo_> I've upped the number of children
[06:42] <elmo_> is it better now?
[06:42] <fabbione> lamont: burning live now
[06:43] <lamont> fabbione: thanks
[06:43] <amu> brb
[06:45] <fabbione> lamont: after that.. a fast test and i am off
[06:45] <fabbione> it's the 3rd day in a raw 5am -> 7pm
[06:45] <fabbione> s/raw/row
[06:46] <mdz> lamont: I have -16 booted now
[06:46] <mdz> looks the same as the last one to me
[06:46] <mdz> (my sound devices are still detected in the wrong order)
[06:46] <mdz> otherwise, fine
[06:47] <thom> just hit lwn
[06:47] <fabbione> elmo_: what is the status for warty-security?
[06:47] <elmo_> oh, right
[06:48] <fabbione> elmo_: i have a <whatever_name_we_want_for_our_sec_annoounce> to do
[06:48] <fabbione> elmo_: i guess target is warty-security. is there anything else that i need to do other than upload the usual way?
[06:49] <elmo_> fabbione: don't upload it just yet, unless it's public
[06:49] <fabbione> it is alread
[06:49] <fabbione> DSA was out 20 minutes ago
[06:49] <elmo_> well, don't upload it anyway
[06:49] <fabbione> i am not to :-)
[06:49] <elmo_> ok
[06:49] <fabbione> that's why i am asking ;)
[06:49] <elmo_> I'm working on it
[06:49] <fabbione> sure
[06:50] <elmo_> [mdz: ]  did we get a final say on who's going to be doing/approving these uploads?
[06:50] <mdz> elmo_: I'll approve them
[06:50] <lamont> mdz et al: do we want our mplayer source to always build a runtime-detected CPU?
[06:50] <elmo_> mdz: just  you?
[06:50] <mdz> elmo_: just me for now, I don't want this to hold anything up
[06:50] <elmo_> ok
[06:51] <elmo_> it's not holding anything up, I just need to know
[06:51] <lamont> that is, if joe user downloads source and says dpkg-buildpackage, I think he's stuck with getting the same build as we get unless he changes something.
[06:52] <mdz> lamont: yes we do
[06:52] <mdz> the same gcc flags we normally build with, and enabling the hand-optimized stuff at runtime
[06:54] <mdz> elmo_: regarding the timeouts, my download seemed to get going as soon as you did that
[06:54] <fabbione> elmo_, mdz: ok.. i will wait for you two to decide.
[06:54] <mdz> elmo_: starts immediately on further attempts as well
[06:54] <mdz> so, yes, seems to have helped
[06:56] <elmo_> yeah, sorry, I forgot to fix it's apache like we fixed aucklands
[06:57] <thom> elmo_: was that mirnyy?
[06:57] <lamont> test build running, then I'll see how it runs on my athlon
[06:57] <lamont> k7 anyway
[06:57] <lamont> must run for a bit
[06:57] <fabbione> lamont: booting now
[06:58] <elmo_> thom: yeah
[06:58] <thom> d'oh
[06:58] <elmo_> lamont: please don't do any more universe uploads
[06:58] <lamont> fabbione: and note which background you get.
[06:58] <thom> wonder why no-one complained about it on RC
[06:58] <elmo_> until I have a chance to do per-component suite mapping
[06:58] <lamont> elmo_: no uploads planned until mdz forces me to.
[06:58] <elmo_> ok
[06:59] <lamont> jdub awake yet?
[06:59] <elmo_> I know how to wake him up..
[06:59] <elmo_> jdub: QUICK, sabdfl snuck the nekkid people back in while you were sleeping!
[06:59] <doogie> ooh, magic powers
[06:59] <sabdfl> muahaha
[06:59] <thom> hehehe
[06:59] <doogie> *back in*?
[07:00] <mdz> doogie: cf. ubuntu-users archives
[07:00] <fabbione> ROTFL at LKML-announce
[07:00] <thom> oh, the one pager problem is because the images for the bullet points are on the net. thought jdub had that in had (he told me about the problem)
[07:01] <sabdfl> fabbione: link?
[07:01] <live_from_dk> sabdfl: i got it via email
[07:01] <live_from_dk> just a sec
[07:01] <live_from_dk> lamont: background seems ok to me
[07:01] <live_from_dk> as this morning
[07:01] <doogie> I'm actually *on* l-k.  what announce?
[07:02] <fabbione> doogie: To: linux-kernel-announce@vger
[07:02] <fabbione> Subject: Oh yeah
[07:02] <fabbione> GOD IS A PIG!
[07:02] <fabbione> (don't tell me this gets through hehe)
[07:02] <fabbione> -
[07:02] <fabbione> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel-announce" in
[07:02] <fabbione> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
[07:02] <fabbione> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
[07:02] <doogie> I can guess the address.  more interested in the content.
[07:02] <doogie> oh, waste of irc bw
[07:02] <fabbione> sabdfl: people are on full crack :-)
[07:03] <live_from_dk> lamont: sound is ok here
[07:03] <live_from_dk> lamont: anything else you want me to test?
[07:04] <thom> sabdfl: hrm, /. claims that the newest article is available to subscribers
[07:04] <thom> sabdfl: is it us? :-)
[07:05] <elmo_> people subscribe to slashdot?
[07:06] <thom> that'd be a no
[07:06] <sabdfl> thom: dunno
[07:06] <thom> elmo_: apparently so
[07:06] <sabdfl> how do i find out?
[07:06] <sabdfl> i'd a subscriber
[07:06] <sabdfl> m
[07:06] <thom> sabdfl: log in, and it'll say "the next article is blah blah blah
[07:06] <thom> "
[07:06] <thom> and you should be able to see it
[07:07] <thom> (guessing, i've never subbed to /.)
[07:08] <sabdfl> don't see it
[07:08] <thom> yeah, it's already posted
[07:08] <thom> and it's not us
[07:09] <live_from_dk> lamont: i am off for today..
[07:09] <fabbione> cya tomorrow guys
[07:09] <thom> ciao
[07:09] <fabbione> ciao :-)
[07:10] <fabbione> have fun in Uk
[07:10] <fabbione> and drink a beer for me too
[07:10] <thom> only "a"
[07:10] <fabbione> thom: yeah...
[07:10] <T-Bone> that's mean ;)
[07:10] <fabbione> a (couple of liters of) beer ;)
[07:10] <elmo_> 245Mb/s
[07:10] <thom> heh
[07:10] <T-Bone> hehe
[07:11] <T-Bone> elmo_: nice ;)
[07:11] <sabdfl> it says pending on my sub to /.
[07:11] <thom> mirnyy's up to 120 concurrent requests
[07:11] <doogie> is the iso released?
[07:11] <mdz> yes
[07:11] <doogie> got a bt?
[07:12] <mdz> yes
[07:12] <elmo_> mirnyy's doing the vast bulk of that too
[07:12] <elmo_> like 90%
[07:12] <doogie> I can attach a 350kB/s(all I am willing to give to it) client
[07:13] <doogie> I don't see a torrent link on the site
[07:13] <thom> doogie: http://releases.ubuntu.com/4.10/warty-release-install-i386.iso.torrent
[07:14] <doogie> done
[07:14] <thom> my personal server is sustaining 1.3MB/s on torrent uploads 
[07:14] <thom> doogie: ta
[07:16] <mdz> doogie: the download page links to the directory, which has .torrents in it
[07:16] <thom> mako: sample text?
[07:16] <doogie> mdz: still, it'd be nice to advertise it
[07:16] <doogie> I'm going to stop the wget after a bit, and let bt do the rest
[07:17] <amu> re
[07:18] <mako> thom: here what i put:
[07:18] <mdz> elmo_: 245? nice
[07:18] <mako> Ubuntu 4.10 Released
[07:18] <mdz> relatively little torrent activity
<a href="http://www.ubuntulinux.org">Ubuntu</a> has just <a href="http://lwn.net/Articles/107267/">announced the release of Ubuntu 4.10</a>. For those that missed the preview, Ubuntu is the new Debian-based release backed by Mark Shuttleworth and put together by a number of folks from Debian, GNOME, and other communities. They are also still offering to ship CDs to interested folks free of charge.</p>
[07:19] <mako> change as you feel is necessary
[07:19] <mdz> people are still downloading old CD images
[07:19] <mako> highlight you think is important and let the editors sort it
[07:19] <mako> mdz: huh?
[07:19] <mdz> mako: according to the torrent tracker
[07:20] <mako> mdz: probably people just left them on
[07:20] <doogie> ok, got 100M, starting bt
[07:20] <mdz> mako: the 'downloading' column indicates there are still incomplete downloads in progress
[07:21] <mako> mdz: seems possible/reasonable
[07:22] <mako> people probably left them on
[07:23] <mdz> where's the slashdot love?
[07:23] <mako> more better different submissions to /. :)
[07:24] <elmo_> if we don't get /. this time, it's officialy a conspiracy
[07:24] <thom> heh
[07:25] <mako> i understanding not posting a an RC
[07:25] <mako> for a new distro
[07:25] <mako> but this is the real deal baby
[07:25] <mako> THEY HAVE NO EXCUSES
[07:25] <mdz> agreed :-)
[07:26] <sabdfl> i wonder if the 4.10 won't throw them off?
[07:26] <sabdfl> "jjust a point release"
[07:26] <mdz> sabdfl: the release announcement is fairly explicit
[07:26] <mdz> The warm-hearted Warthogs of the Warty Team are proud to present the very first release of Ubuntu!
[07:27] <sabdfl> jeez, the rc was much more explici
[07:27] <sabdfl> t
[07:30] <mako> sabdfl: but it was an RC
[07:30] <mako> sabdfl: and if they read it, they knew we had a release coming the next week :)
[07:31] <amu> sounds difficult submitt something on /. .... years ago it was much more easier. 
[07:37] <Kamion> elmo_: joeyh was looking for you, did he manage to get in touch?
[07:38] <elmo_> yep
[07:38] <Kamion> good
[07:40] <elmo_> wow, mirnyy doing a lot out of cache
[07:41] <sabdfl> woot! accepted on /.
[07:41] <elmo_> judging by the hd lights anyway
[07:41] <thom> 242 concurrent requests on mirnyy
[07:42] <carlos> slashdot effect, here we goo!!!!!
[07:42] <Mitario> wait for #ubuntu to flow over ;)
[07:42] <mako> wait. it's on /.?
[07:43] <mako> i'm not seeing it
[07:43] <carlos> me neither...
[07:43] <sabdfl> my submission has switched from "pending" to "accepted"
[07:44] <mako> it's not on the front page
[07:44] <mdz> not yet
[07:44] <mako> shit sandwdich burning :)
[07:46] <mjg59> It's on the front page now
[07:47] <Mitario> not here ?
[07:47] <mako> not for me
[07:47] <thom> it's in the linux section, not hit the front page for me
[07:48] <Mitario> ah
[07:48] <mdz> conspiracy
[07:48] <mjg59> Ah - I have all sections switched on
[07:49] <Mitario> do we have a cool buritto like bot that can show me when <nick> was last seen? :)
[07:49] <carlos> who wants to be the first post?
[07:49] <carlos> X-)
[07:49] <carlos> Mitario: /msg nickserv help
[07:51] <mdz> it's not even on the front page yet, and already has wildly inaccurate comments
[07:51] <thom> uh, might want to change the screenshot on the www. site
[07:52] <mako> or just remove them
[07:52] <mdz> at least the "controversial" artwork is getting some press :-)
[07:53] <elmo_> FRONT PAGE US YOU #%"^"
[07:55] <carlos> dudes, who wants to know about NEC when we have the ubuntu release?
[07:55] <carlos> :-D
[07:57] <silbs> carlos: they heard you. Front page
[07:58] <carlos> silbs: :-D
[07:58] <mdz> perhaps a few hundred more submissions would help
[07:58] <mdz> I don't see it
[07:58] <carlos> me neither...
[07:58] <silbs> wait, no I don't either. And colin's comment disappeared. Perhaps it's the champagne...
[07:59] <amu> klick on the Slashdot Linux link on the left, there is it 
[08:00] <mdz> colin's comment is there
[08:00] <carlos> silbs: Colin's and Scott's posts are only visible if you select the answer to the first comment
[08:01] <silbs> my bad. I must have been on linux not front page.
[08:03] <amu> http://lwn.net/Articles/107267/ 
[08:05] <mako> perhaps if more people submit it, it will be promoted to the front
[08:05] <mako> edd said he would get someting for oreilly
[08:05] <mako> i'll email a few more folks i know
[08:32] <mxpxpod> question: if gcc 3.3 is the default, why does libgtkmm-2.4-dev install gcc-3.4?
[08:33] <__daniel> oh: http://www.infodrom.org/~joey/log/?200410201843
[08:33] <mdz> mxpxpod: it doesn't
[08:34] <mxpxpod> mdz: it does on ppc
[08:34] <Kamion> it's entirely possible and reasonable for a package to want a non-default gcc
[08:35] <Kamion> are you sure you don't mean gcc-3.4-base, though?
[08:35] <mdz> it would be rather odd for it to depend on gcc at all
[08:35] <Kamion> indeed
[08:35] <Kamion> in any case, libgtkmm-2.4-dev is in universe ...
[08:36] <mxpxpod> when I do apt-get install libgtkmm-2.4-dev, it installs cpp-3.4, g++-3.4, and gcc-3.4
[08:37] <Kamion> it's likely to be easier to find out what depends on it using a package management frontend a little more sophisticated than apt-get
[08:37] <mdz> seems to be specific to powerpc
[08:37] <Kamion> dselect would tell you; I assume aptitude will too
[08:38] <mdz> it's due to libstdc++6-dev Depends: g++-3.4
[08:38] <mxpxpod> oh, nice
[08:38] <mdz> and something in that chain depends on libstdc++-dev, which is provided by libstdc++6-dev
[08:38] <Kamion> still, universe :)
[08:38] <mdz> yep
[08:38] <Kamion> I'm guessing 3.4 will become the default by hoary, if not that then by grumpy
[08:38] <mxpxpod> c++ stuff is universe?
[08:39] <Kamion> no, but libgtkmm-2.4-dev is
[08:39] <Kamion> there's libstdc++5-dev
[08:39] <__daniel> unfortunately libxml++-2.*-dev isnt :-(
[08:41] <mxpxpod> Kamion: so, is it a problem with libgtkmm-2.4-dev depending on libstdc++6-dev?
[08:41] <mdz> no, it doesn't
[08:41] <mdz> something else does
[08:41] <mdz> it looks like a problem of some package depending on a pure virtual package with no concrete alternative
[08:41] <mxpxpod> hmm
[08:41] <doogie> I've sent 800MB thru bt
[08:41] <mdz> apt happens to choose libstdc++6-dev rather than 5-dev
[08:42] <mdz> which is perfectly legitimate
[08:42] <mdz> doogie: 4.4GB here
[08:42] <doogie> seeding now, of course
[08:44] <mxpxpod> mdz: ok, I installed libstdc++5-dev and removed all the 3.4 stuff and libstdc++6, and libgtkmm-2.4-dev works fine
[08:45] <sabdfl> guys i think i screwed up the /. submission by selecting Linux as the section
[08:45] <sabdfl> i've emailed timothy (who accepted the story) and asked him to consider it for the main page
[08:45] <mdz> ah
[08:45] <mdz> sabdfl: add this to the release checklist? :-)
[08:46] <sabdfl> mdz: yup :-)
[08:46] <sabdfl> thought i was being helpful by Alex tells me he did the same thing for Plone 2.0 and it also went into a section
[08:47] <silbs> Release checklist: 1. No naked people. 2. Slashdot main page or nothing at all.
[08:49] <mdz> Kamion: enjoy
[08:49] <carlos> X-)
[08:58] <mdz> "I had never tried Debian before because the packages were too slow"?
[09:15] <vorlon> mdz: gentoo user? :)
[09:19] <mxpxpod> I've asked this before, but why does ubuntu use pbbuttonsd instead of pmud?
[09:34] <lucas_> sbody familiar with X and mouse problems ? I have a regression regarding my touchpad, which worked out of the box with debian unstable and doesn't work (I can't use it to "click", I have to use the buttons) with ubuntu
[09:39] <doogie> 1.6g
[09:40] <vorlon> lucas_: installed the synaptic driver?  I think I noticed that this wasn't installed for me by default by Ubuntu.
[09:40] <__daniel> mxpxpod, i didnt even hear of both before
[09:41] <lucas_> vorlon: I didn't need it
[09:41] <lucas_> actually, I just tested with an old knoppix, and it still doesn't work. Maybe my touchpad is broken ...
[09:44] <mxpxpod> __daniel: the problem I have is that I let gnome do volume up/down, mute, and brightness up/down, but when pbbuttonsd does them, it messes with gnome
[09:44] <chrisa> mxpxpod: Probably because pbbuttonsd works a hell of a lot better
[09:44] <mxpxpod> __daniel: and I don't know of a way to tell pbbuttonsd to leave those things alone
[09:44] <chrisa> Especially with things like gtkbbuttonsd
[09:44] <__daniel> mxpxpod, oh :-(
[09:47] <mxpxpod> chrisa: bah, gtkpbbuttons's themes suck
[09:47] <sabdfl> response from /. is that they can't sanely switch a story from the linux to main sections, but i'm sure there will be more coverage in due course! they said they've been accused of bias towards us already because of all the coverage :-)
[09:47] <chrisa> mxpxpod: Then don't use it. Either way, I have the same laptop as you and everything works flawlessly with pbbuttonsd
[09:47] <mako> fair enough i suppose
[09:48] <mako> i'm sure /. is accused of a lot of things :)
[09:49] <__daniel> bye... see you later
[09:50] <mxpxpod> chrisa: is there a way to get pbbuttonsd to step the volume up more than one on a volume up/down keypress?
[09:56] <lamont_r> moo
[09:57] <doogie> /. always was insane
[09:57] <lucas_> does ubuntu do sthing out of ordinary with the mouse ? for example, use something like gpm ? my touchpad doesn't work with ubuntu, while it worked with debian. I'd like to try something before reinstalling debian just to check if my touchpad is actually broken ...
[09:59] <amu> wb lamont
[09:59] <lamont_r> hi amu
[09:59] <mdz> lucas_: -> #ubuntu
[10:00] <mdz> vorlon: the synaptics driver has been installed by default in ubuntu for some time
[10:00] <lamont_r> damn college kids taking all the bandwidth... :-)
[10:01] <vorlon> mdz: ok, I suppose the fact that I installed the preview has something to do with it. :)
[10:01] <azeem> congrats, dudes
[10:03] <mdz> vorlon: I think that even predates preview
[10:04] <mdz> yep
[10:04] <mdz> vorlon: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/WartyWarthog_2fDesktopSeed?action=recall&date=1092046589
[10:05] <amu> lamont_r: tested it on a ibm r40, Dell Optiplex GX270, Noname maschine with nvi, noname with ati and a virtual pc ...    
[10:06] <lamont_r> -17?
[10:06] <lamont_r> er, 16?
[10:06] <vorlon> mdz: ok, we'll chalk it up to delirium then.
[10:06] <amu> 7  
[10:06] <lamont_r> ok
[10:10] <amu> a common problem was, the Xfree detection, Dell with nv it works, Dell with intel 82865 only 640*480, Dell with nv OK, IBM R40 with Radeon M7 7500 ( vesa ) noname with X800 pro ( vesa )  virtual pc S3 ( vesa ), sound works, all have problems with my usb stick, device is detected but not mounted, bootsplash still need a please hold the line and press ESC for detailed bootmessages 
[10:12] <amu> desktop itself need some icons like Mail,Browser and a link to the FAQ .... homedir needs some dirs like Documents/Picture/Music ....  
[10:13] <lamont_r> amu: I think the desktop and homedir are consistant with what's on the installed system, hence won't change
[10:13] <lamont_r> seb128: jdub: or am I smoking crack?
[10:13] <mdz> amu: the focus right now is on stability and functionality
[10:13] <mdz> amu: we are not adding any new features to the live CD for Warty
[10:14] <lamont_r> and it's not RC, like mdz said.
[10:14] <doogie> 2g
[10:14] <lamont_r> mdz: would better X detection be considered enhancement or RC, I wonder?
[10:14] <lamont_r> since it's throwaway work for hoary, I expect
[10:14] <mdz> lamont_r: bug, but not RC
[10:15] <lamont_r> ok.
[10:15] <mdz> the live CD seems to fall back to vesa pretty reliably
[10:15] <amu> mdz: x autodetection is a small problem, vesa works, not good as it should  
[10:15] <mdz> I don't particularly care if it's accelerated or not
[10:15] <lamont_r> amu: could you file a bug (sev=normal) wrt autodetection?
[10:15] <amu> ^k
[10:15] <mdz> please don't
[10:15] <mdz> this will all be obsoleted when we unify the hardware detection
[10:15] <lamont_r> ok
[10:16] <amu> k
[10:16] <lamont_r> mdz: was thinking of steming the flow of user bug reports by having one there already.
[10:16] <lamont_r> but then, users don't read.
[10:17] <amu> test with many hardware today, the cd itself is functional, should i dl the latest for a final test ?  
[10:17] <lamont_r> still need to generate one more with WinFOSS 0.4
[10:17] <lamont_r> which is downloading now to my laptop, while I kill time at the coffee shop downloading the release i386 iso
[10:18] <lamont_r> jdub prolly not awake yet, eh?
[10:19] <amu> lamont_r: got too much problems building on amd64 in the chroot, i'm moving now to i386 pure, which is also faster ;) 
[10:19] <lamont_r> amu: no surprise there
[10:20] <amu> exefile on the computer, that look strange ;)
[10:20] <lamont_r> yeah
[10:28] <lucas_> arg my touchpad is not broken. This is good news for me and bad news for the ubuntu devel who will help me debug this ;-)
[10:30] <amu> touchpad on the ibm R40 is also not working *ducks* 
[10:30] <lucas_> amu: can you define not working ?
[10:30] <lucas_> not working at all ?
[10:30] <lucas_> or you just can't click ?
[10:30] <amu> my does not move 
[10:30] <amu> my=mouse 
[10:30] <lamont_r> mdz: I don't think there's really anything else to put in it...
[10:30] <lucas_> ok
[10:31] <amu> lucas_: .... -7 live-CD 
[10:33] <amu> 33 matches for winfoss :)  
[10:35] <lamont_r> amu: www.theopencd.net
[10:40] <amu> got it, nice idea
[10:49] <amu> dammed, gpg should be global accepted ;) 
[11:00] <lamont_r> wow - someone quit hogging bandwidth. :-)
[11:03] <amu> lamont_r: wondershaper is your best friend   
[11:04] <lamont_r> amu: sharing coffee shop's bandwidth with the rest of the patrons... No control over shaping
[11:05] <lamont_r> interesting that either I'm on the tail end of the torrent, or something... 76Kdown, 10Kup
[11:05] <TMIegel> hi
[11:05] <TMIegel> i can't boot the LiveCD with my USB-CDRom
[11:06] <TMIegel> have tried all the boot-options in the menu, but it can't find the morphix-filesystem afterwards
[11:12] <amu> TMIegel: boot in general works ? which point system stops booting ?   
[11:12] <nictuku> Hi! How can I tell if it's ok for you guys if I register a ubuntu.* domain for a community.
[11:15] <Ng> is it at all possible to get a newer gksudo into Ubuntu?
[11:15] <Ng> unless I'm being dumb the currently included version can't pass arguments to the command it executes
[11:15] <Ng> but the newer versions in debian do seem to offer that
[11:16] <TMIegel> amu: booting works, i get to the menu, then then it loads some scsi-modules but then it can'T access the cdrom
[11:16] <lamont_r> Ng: debian versions should sync into hoary when it opens
[11:16] <lamont_r> But warty is, well, like, _done_.
[11:16] <amu> TMIegel: did you tried with bootparameter noscsi ? 
[11:16] <TMIegel> it tries /dev/hd?[1-9] [0-9] 
[11:16] <gma> I work for a company that is keen to convert quite a few of our standard PC users from win2k to Linux. we were just about to deploy UserLinux, but after two days with a Ubuntu box our IT people were sold on it. we'll be deploying the first boxes shortly, and are very impressed by what you've put together. so thanks very much.
[11:17] <Ng> lamont_r: ok. what's the policy for updates to released versions? security only?
[11:17] <TMIegel> no, i will
[11:17] <lamont_r> Ng: that's on the wiki, but basically security or critical data corruption type issues
[11:17] <amu> TMIegel: ok
[11:17] <lamont_r> we get paid to do them for main/restricted, universe is merely subject to those policies for community uploads.
[11:18] <lamont_r> or something like that
[11:18] <Ng> lamont_r: great, thanks :)
[11:18] <TMIegel> amu: no, doesn't work either. i have also tried usbboot=on
[11:19] <nictuku> I dont mean to bother, but has my question about domain registration got in? this epic client is strange. hehe
[11:19] <amu> TMIegel: what happen, if you boot with noscsi ? 
[11:20] <TMIegel> amu: then it doesn't load the scsi modules, but same problem. it only detects the harddisk, but not the usb-cdrom
[11:20] <lamont_r> nictuku: second
[11:22] <amu> TMIegel: you usb-cdrom use the default usb-modules ? usb-uhci and usb-starage ?  
[11:22] <TMIegel> amu: after enabling dma for hda it gives: "Warning: unable to find base module!"
[11:22] <lamont_r> nictuku: biggest issue is that the folks who would know the answer to that question are predominantly in .uk, where it's 2220 on a release night...
[11:22] <nictuku> hehe.
[11:23] <amu> TMIegel: ah, try "nodma" 
[11:23] <TMIegel> amu: i think so. the gentoo-minimal-install-cd 2004.2 works finde
[11:23] <amu> TMIegel: probably a bug .....  
[11:24] <amu> TMIegel: together noscsi nodma 
[11:26] <TMIegel> amu: no, no go. same warning (and it doesn't detect hda then...)
[11:27] <amu> lamont_r: pls note, bug: booting with usb-cdrom 
[11:28] <amu> lamont_r: probably same with firewire   
[11:28] <lamont_r> probably
[11:28] <nictuku> do you personally believe it's ok to register that, lamont?
[11:29] <amu> I've a idea how to fix it, but how i can test ... missing hardware 
[11:29] <nictuku> thanks :)
[11:29] <lamont_r> amu: same issue here
[11:29] <amu> TMIegel: you're fine for a personal betatest ? 
[11:29] <lamont_r> nictuku: I really dunno what the opinion would/should be, hence I'll limit myself to pointing in the direction of a definitive answer.
[11:30] <TMIegel> amu: sure
[11:32] <nictuku> That is very fine lamont, I thank you for that. Sorry if I sounded unpolite. 
[11:33] <TMIegel> ok, knoppix (latest) works fine: after enabling dma for hda it states "Accessing KNOPPIX CDROM at /dev/scd0 ..."
[11:34] <amu> TMIegel: I guess the order ( loading the usb modules ) is important/wrong on the liveCD 
[11:35] <TMIegel> i have startet dl'ing the install cd and give that a try...
[11:35] <lamont_r> nictuku: not at all.  I just _need_ to not be giving anything like a definitive answer, or even opinion on that topic.
[11:36] <nictuku> I understand. I shall wait! =] 
[11:37] <amu> TMIegel: ^k, letme know if it works there  
[11:37] <lamont_r> amu: I have a USB cdrom, but I don't think the laptopwill boot from USB...
[11:37] <amu> lamont_r: and your desktop ? 
[11:39] <lamont_r> almost certain it has the same issue.
[11:39] <lamont_r> OTOH, there might be another machine that would...
[11:39] <amu> lamont_r: newer bioses, detect the usb-device only if it's plugged in. After you plugged in intu a slot, you see the option on your bios. Without a connected device no option  
[11:39] <lamont_r> right
[11:40] <nictuku> where can I find ubuntu's logo usage policy? couldn't find in the wiki.
[11:42] <nictuku> hhmm /legal
[11:42] <amu> http://www.pro-linux.de/news/2004/7409.html 
[11:43] <mdz> nictuku: I believe jdub was writing it up
[11:44] <Ng> is it bad form (or even possible) to mark bugs as duplicates in bugzilla? should I leave a comment saying it's a duplicate? email the assignee? :)
[11:44] <Ng> I suppose that question really is "does anyone mind if I triage some bugs?" :)
[11:49] <TMIegel> amu: i'll go to bed know, i will try the install cd tomorrow, will you be here then?
[11:53] <TMIegel> i will see, god night everyone...
[11:54] <__daniel> bye TMIegel
[11:54] <__daniel> TMIegel, schlaf gut :-)
[11:54] <amu> TMIegel: yap