[12:14] <elmo> err, warty has SW RAID support in the installer, right ?
[12:14] <lamont> mjg59: any thoughts on #3213?
[12:17] <mjg59> With ACPI, there's no way to call DPMS code
[12:18] <mjg59> Why there's a garbled screen, I'm not sure
[12:19] <mjg59> Do we know if this is using the framebuffer?
[12:22] <jdub> elmo: yes
[12:23] <elmo> not RAID 1 root, apparently
[12:23] <elmo> oh well
[12:32] <amu> n8 
[12:34] <thom> mdz: yeah, i'm gonna land one avec patches tomorrow morning
[12:39] <carlos> jdub: is there any reason because the ubuntu-calendar-november package does not exists in hoary?
[12:44] <mjg59> Hoary is a pr0n-free zone in order to prevent the developers from becoming distracted
[12:44] <mjg59> They only get their pr0n fix when it's ready for release
[12:45] <bob2> all they have for distractions now is frozen-bubble and mao
[12:45] <mjg59> NO MAO
[12:48] <carlos> :-P
[12:48] <pasc> I've managed to escape so far
[12:49] <thom> pasc: heh, you shall soon learn the full power of the dark side
[12:49] <pasc> heh
[12:50] <pasc> I had bob2 and lifeless at my place yesterday, and _still_ managed to avoid it ;-)
[12:57] <jdub> carlos: hrm, thought elmo was going to push it there too
[12:57] <carlos> jdub: thanks
[01:12] <lamont> mjg59: the bug is the sum total of what I know about it.  (Actually, I fear it's the superset... :-)
[01:23] <mdz> mako: ping?
[01:37] <jdub> oh poo
[01:37] <jdub> hrm
[01:37] <jdub> how can we get u-c and u-c-monthly packages into hoary, given that they already exist in the archive?
[01:50] <jdub> mjg59: http://bugme.osdl.org/show_bug.cgi?id=3670
[01:50] <jdub> thom: http://primates.ximian.com/~glesage/stuff/firefox/ -> 1.02 update
[01:54] <mjg59> jdub: Yeah, I've been playing with that
[01:54] <mjg59> The video_post stuff seems to work pretty well
[01:55] <mjg59> At the weekend, I'll build up test kernels
[02:00] <jdub> garrett's theme works in 0.9.3, too
[02:00] <jdub> handy
[02:00] <mjg59> As is, I'm doing suspend and resume on the X40 with no kernel arguments now
[02:01] <bob2> wow
[02:02] <mjg59> We just reinit the video from userspace after resume
[02:02] <mjg59> I'm feeling pretty good about S3 support, once we manage to figure out what the complete failure on some hardware is
[02:05] <bob2> how's suspend looking on the craptop?
[02:05] <jdub> mjg59: "yeah, this one is reaaaallly buggy"
[02:05] <mjg59> bob2: Suspend is just peachy
[02:05] <mjg59> Resume, now that's a different matter
[02:06] <bob2> hah, right
[02:06] <mjg59> I've no fucking clue. The thing just never executes any of the wakeup code.
[02:06] <mjg59> Which makes debugging a complete arse
[02:06] <mjg59> It's only 500 pages or so...
[02:06] <bob2> can windows wake it up?
[02:06] <mjg59> Yeah
[02:06] <mjg59> Works fine with XP
[02:07] <mjg59> I'm wondering about trying to write my own trivial ACPI implementation and then comparing that
[02:09] <mjg59> Hmm. We ought to be able to bodge screen blanking for the console together with x86 emulation.
[02:10] <mjg59> There's a routine at a known location in VBE compliant VGA Bioses
[02:10] <mjg59> More fun for me at the weekend
[02:23] <mojo_> morning
[02:23] <mojo_> morning
[02:42] <mojo_> hey
[02:43] <mojo_> has AsliSolaritaire game in GNOME supported SVG yet?
[02:43] <mojo_> I decide to work on a SVG version
[02:46] <mako> mdz: hey there
[02:47] <mako> mdz: i'm still working on the summary of the kickoff meeting.. i'm almost done.. it's SO LONG
[02:47] <mdz> mako: you're telling me
[02:47] <mako> mdz: i've been working on it for 2.5 hours :)
[02:48] <mdz> mako: I sent you my notes, right?
[02:48] <mako> mdz: yeah
[02:48] <mdz> mako: I polished those notes into the HoaryGoals page
[02:49] <mako> oh, ok
[02:49] <mako> i will link to those
[02:49] <mako> the summary will have a paragraph for most these
[02:49] <mako> a lot of it can be integrated straight into the goals page
[02:51] <mdz> mako: hmm, I was working on a hoary status update, sounds like we have some overlap
[02:51] <mdz> mako: you can stick to the events of the meeting, and I'll flesh things out in the status update\
[02:51] <mdz> if it's easier
[02:52] <mako> what do you mean by events of the meeting?
[02:53] <mako> as in, don
[02:53] <mako> do you mean, "dont' flesh out out the feature goals so much"?
[02:53] <mako> because that's what i'm doing onw
[02:53] <mdz> more or less, yeah
[02:53] <mdz> but if you've already done it, great
[02:54] <mako> mdz: well.. i've done probably half
[02:54] <mako> i've done more than half the log
[02:54] <mako> mdz: i'll just continue. should be less than an hour
[02:54] <mdz> I haven't written that bit of the status update yet
[02:54] <mdz> so, more power to you
[02:55] <mako> mdz: yeah, it will be useful to you and i was doing it anyway :)
[02:55] <mako> i can throw what i have somewhere if you want
[02:55] <mdz> how I'm hoping it will work is that I've created subpages for the feature goals which need more fleshing out, and the people responsible will create them
[02:55] <mdz> nah, I'm on my way out
[02:56] <mako> ok, sounds good
[03:01] <jdub> mdz: don't want to do bug tree?
[03:07] <mojo_> where is mplayer in upstream??? has lamont uploaded it yet?
[03:29] <lamont> mojo_: ??
[03:30] <lamont> "in upstream"??
[03:33] <mako> mdz: heh.. at about 3.5 hours into the meeting, thing really start to degenerate :)
[03:33] <mako> mdz: as in, your list is about as useful as the log itself :)
[03:43] <mojo_> lamont: I can;t find any mplayer package!
[03:44] <lamont> mojo_: it's in multiverse as of hoary
[03:48] <mojo_> thx
[03:50] <lamont> although it appears to be ftbfs on amd64.
[03:50] <mojo_> lamont: synaptic crash immediately while loading data from multiverse
[03:50] <lamont> interesting
[03:51] <mojo_> lamont: bug sumitted
[03:52] <mojo_> lamont: apt-get works well with multiverse but...y xmms is dep for mplayer????
[03:58] <chrisa> mojo: yes, --with-xmms iirc
[04:12] <mako> does anyone want to read the hoary kickoff meeting summary and do me a huge favor in the process?
[04:12] <lamont> mako: where?
[04:13] <mako> lamont: i need someone to fix obvious grammar errors in the second half
[04:13] <mako> i've been looking at it for almost 4 hours and my eyes are just too crossed to catch anything :)
[04:13] <lamont> ok
[04:14] <mako> lamont: http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~mako/
[04:14] <mako> lamont: just edit the file when you find errors and send me the changed version
[04:14] <mako> and thanks :)
[04:16] <lamont> .rst?
[04:17] <mako> lamont: it's a text file
[04:17] <mako> lamont: restructured text you don't need to know RST it edit it
[04:17] <mako> rst is the source
[04:18] <lamont> so I should make edits in .rst. ok
[04:18] <mako> yeah
[04:25] <mako> lamont: i'm stepping out to buy a book
[04:25] <mako> lamont: just email me
[04:25] <mako> lamont: and thank you so much
[04:26] <lamont> mako: OK.
[04:47] <lamont> mako: sent
[05:12] <fabbione> morning guys
[05:12] <fabbione> night lamont
[05:13] <bob2> didn't daniels just go to bed?
[05:15] <fabbione> bob2: well it's 5am here
[05:15] <fabbione> it's not like i am babysitting him
[05:15] <fabbione> he can go to bed when he wants :-)
[05:16] <bob2> heh, I just assumed he'd been hackign with you :)
[05:16] <fabbione> no
[05:16] <lifeless> last message from daniels is 07:20
[05:16] <lifeless> which is some time ago
[05:16] <fabbione> during the night i have this insane habit to try to sleep
[05:16] <lifeless> really ?
[05:17] <fabbione> and i don't even succeed
[05:26] <dasenjo> Hi .. how are you ?
[05:26] <dasenjo> Im almost a newbie .. but I want to contribute with ubuntu .. 
[05:26] <bob2> dasenjo: do you know how to maintain debian packages?
[05:27] <dasenjo> bob2, a little .. 
[05:27] <dasenjo> bob2, really I dont feel I can mantain XFree or the kernel ... but a web aplicattion or a perl scipt collection .. 
[05:31] <dasenjo> bye.
[05:49] <mojo_> I've just made the Xig DexTop CDE 3.0 work with Ubuntu, sweet!
[05:49] <bob2> hehehe cde.
[05:50] <mojo_> bob2: I still use CDE, Maya6 and Ubuntu for 3D works, GNOME still leak lots of my resources
[05:55] <chrisa> CDE still makes my eyes bleed
[06:02] <mojo_> bob2: can u pls check for me wethere there is any msg 'FATAL: udev' in your demsg??
[06:02] <mojo_> chrisa: can u pls check for me wethere there is any msg 'FATAL: udev' in your demsg??
[06:02] <chrisa> I don't run ubuntu
[06:02] <bob2> hah
[06:02] <bob2> mojo_: none
[06:03] <mojo_> bob2: try 'FATAL'
[06:03] <bob2> nada
[06:03] <mojo_> bob2: thx, so this is not initscript bug
[06:04] <mojo_> bob2: I got a msg after init process bootup, FATAL: udev is alreay mounted in /dev/
[06:04] <bob2> odd
[06:04] <mojo_> bob2: and FATAL: can't find bla blah kernel/hw_char thing
[06:05] <bob2> nothing matching FATAL in my dmesg
[06:05] <mojo_> bob2: some msg can't be caught by dmesg, I try to find someway to catch it
[06:06] <bob2> there used to be /var/log/bootlog
[06:06] <bob2> but I can't actually find it in ubuntu
[06:07] <mojo_> same here
[06:14] <mako> lamont: thank you so much for your help
[07:56] <pitti> Morning!
[08:09] <fabbione> mdz: ping
[08:09] <fabbione> hey pitti
[08:20] <pitti> Hi fabbione!
[08:25] <fabbione> hehe
[08:42] <daniels> pitti: morning
[08:42] <pitti> Hi daniels
[09:02] <sivang> morning all
[09:27] <Mithrandir> 'morning
[09:30] <pitti> Hi mvo_ !
[09:30] <mvo_> hi pitti 
[09:30] <mvo_> good morning :)
[09:37] <fabbione> hey Miss Vogt :P
[09:39] <mvo_> good morning fabbione :)
[09:50] <sivang> morninig pitti !
[09:50] <pitti> Hi sivang 
[09:51] <seb128> hello guys
[09:51] <jamesh> mvo_: were you trying to find me yesterday?
[09:52] <mvo_> jamesh: yes, I wanted to ask stuff about libglade and toolbars
[09:52] <jamesh> mvo_: bug 157215?
[09:52] <sivang> bonjour seb128 
[09:52] <mvo_> jamesh: did I reported it? then yes :)
[09:53] <seb128> 'jour sivang :)
[09:53] <seb128> jamesh: hey. So transparent applets will work now ! What was missing exactly before ?
[09:55] <jamesh> seb128: I just changed libpanel-applet to handle background changes in an idle handler (instead of in the PropertyBag set_prop handler), and a valid background pixmap was being passed to the applet every time
[09:55] <seb128> jamesh: ok, cool. You rock :)
[09:55] <jamesh> whereas before it would sometimes say "I don't like this pixmap ID, so will use the default background"
[09:56] <seb128> ok
[09:56] <seb128> this will be nice for the GNOME 2.10 screenshots :)
[10:14] <jamesh> seb128: it seems that my libpanel-applet change doesn't fix the problem, but does significantly reduce how often it occurs
[10:15] <seb128> that mean that sometimes you get a transparent background and sometimes not ?
[10:15] <seb128> with the same code ?
[10:18] <jamesh> occasionally the background pixmap ID the panel passes to the applets seems to be invalid
[10:19] <jamesh> (most likely because the panel has already deleted it and changed to something else)
[10:19] <daniels> seb128: btw, the metacity-weird-spinning-cursor-with-xterm thing is reproducible here
[10:19] <jamesh> in those cases, you end up with the applet will go back to the default background
[10:19] <daniels> seb128: and metacity doesn't start at all per default, i need to start it from a terminal
[10:19] <daniels> seb128: does the version of metacity we ship have a built-in compositing manager?
[10:20] <seb128> jamesh: hum ok
[10:21] <seb128> daniels: yes, metacity has a composite manager
[10:21] <daniels> seb128: phat
[10:21] <seb128> daniels: but the package is built without it
[10:21] <seb128> Not building compositing manager by default now, must enable explicitly to get it. And it doesn't work, so don't bother unless you want to hack on it...
[10:21] <seb128> Building without compositing manager
[10:22] <daniels> ah, ok
[10:22] <daniels> well, when it becomes useful, you'll probably want to start building it
[10:22] <daniels> for the meantime, I'll just make up an xcompmgr package
[10:22] <seb128> ok
[10:22] <daniels> i'm interested in getting seriously wide testing on composite and seeing whether or not it's worth enabling per default (i.e. slow/buggy?)
[10:23] <seb128> BTW you're the first to report a problem about metacity not starting with the session
[10:23] <seb128> that's weird
[10:23] <daniels> yeah, you're telling me ;)
[10:23] <thom> seb128: he probably just doesn't know how to run X properly
[10:24] <seb128> thom: I think so yeah
[10:24] <daniels> thom: maybe it died in the arse under the load of ten thousand NetworkManager dialogs
[10:24] <seb128> thom: what about the firefox-dev package ? Lot of work ?
[10:25] <daniels> thom: (btw, the firefox back/forward button hackery involved hacking gdk)
[10:27] <jamesh> what sort of hackey?
[10:28] <daniels> jamesh: just getting it to understand back and forward key sequences and dealing with history thusly (i.e. same way as horizontal scrolling)
[10:28] <daniels> (on that note, if vertical scrolling is the z-axis, what's horizontal scrolling? the  axis? the  axis?)
[10:28] <thom> seb128: shouldn't be too bad
[10:30] <jamesh> thom: has anyone considered asking for permission to use the official firefox branding?
[10:31] <thom> jamesh: not that i'm aware of
[10:37] <trukulo> fabbione, i've got here uniform of rogue, if you want it...
[10:39] <fabbione> ahhaa
[10:39] <daniels> i don't think anyone wants to see fabbione in that ...
[10:39] <fabbione> trukulo: daniels will run away screaming
[10:39] <fabbione> that's not good ;)
[10:39] <azeem> LWN claims Ubuntu 4.10 supports the Pegasos-II, did somebody verify that in the meantime?
[10:40] <trukulo> fabbione, daniels : are you going to Mataro ?
[10:40] <trukulo> because i will go
[10:40] <daniels> trukulo: both of us will be there, yah
[10:40] <trukulo> i will be very pleased to see both of you dressed as rogue and jean grey
[10:40] <trukulo> lol
[10:41] <azeem> mako: Ubuntu traffic #9 has http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~mako/ubuntu-traffic/u20041022_09.html as URL, but it says 'Ubuntu Traffic #9 For 2004/10/2' in the title (10/2 vs. 10/22)
[10:41] <trukulo> i'm not *@canonical , but i've talked with javier linares and i will go one day to talk with you
[10:41] <ChrisH> Is it okay if I just edit the Wiki page HardwareSupportMachinesLaptops? I have a Toshiba Tecra 8100 and could provide some updates.
[10:42] <fabbione> trukulo: you will recongnize us...
[10:42] <trukulo> fabbione, if i don't, i'll ask for you
[10:42] <fabbione> we will be the ones with black eyes and most injuries
[10:42] <trukulo> and kamion and jdub, i think i've found jdub's pants
[10:43] <trukulo> lol
[10:43] <fabbione> after users will try to hunt us down
[10:43] <trukulo> don't worry, at least it's better than a cake in the face
[10:44] <trukulo> so seriously, i wanna go to met you, if you have time perhaps you can explain me what are you going to do in mataro
[10:44] <seb128> ChrisH: yes, feel free to make changes on the wiki
[10:44] <ChrisH> seb128: ok
[10:45] <fabbione> trukulo: we will be probably fixing bugs on X.org & Co.
[10:46] <trukulo> fabbione, will you have time for a coffe?
[10:46] <Mithrandir> trukulo: nope, just beer.
[10:47] <trukulo> Mithrandir, umm, i think i can sacrifice and have a beer too
[10:47] <Mithrandir> :)
[10:47] <daniels> iced tea is good also
[10:47] <daniels> trukulo: bugsquashing, handwaving about future plans
[10:47] <daniels> hacking like crazy :)
[10:48] <trukulo> well, i'm not a programmer, but perhaps you need a bad BOFH there
[10:49] <lilo> hmmmm....I mostly stopped by because I noticed you folks were having a conference on in the beginning of December....I wanted to make sure you let us know if you needed anything
[10:49] <Mithrandir> lilo: jdub or mdz, I'd guess.
[10:49] <lilo> kay
[10:50] <lilo> also, as behind as we are on processing them, you may want to file a group contact form if you haven't already....would they be the people to talk to about that as well?
[10:50] <lilo> (it'd be whoever would be considered "official contacts")
[10:50] <fabbione> trukulo: we will find the time for everybody hopefully
[10:51] <fabbione> trukulo: i don't make any kind of promises but i will be there for sure
[10:51] <fabbione> and yes..
[10:51] <fabbione> BEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEER!
[10:51] <fabbione> a lot :-)
[10:51] <lilo> hehe
[10:51] <trukulo> fabbione, lol, yes, i know that it's very difficult to talk with everybody
[10:51] <trukulo> i'll kidnape you, don't worry
[10:51] <Mithrandir> lilo: I guess so, yes.
[10:51] <lilo> kay...thanks!
[10:54] <daniels> lilo: jdub is the best point man in terms of setting up a group contact for ubuntu
[10:55] <lilo> daniels: kay, sounds good
[10:55] <daniels> lilo: as for the conference, we should be fine in terms of infrastructure, but thanks
[10:55] <lilo> daniels: mostly I just want to make sure that if you need anything on the fly, you know to check with us
[10:55] <lilo> daniels: higher user limits on some NAT IP, etc.
[10:55] <daniels> yeah
[10:55] <daniels> yeah, if we need higher per-IP limits, I'll ask again
[10:56] <daniels> (ran into that problem in August)
[10:56] <lilo> yeah, we do need to keep those pretty limited normally due to kiddie problems, the limits in turn can create issues
[10:57] <lilo> I'll try to get hold of jdub about the group contact thing
[10:57] <lilo> I've been noticing you guys a lot lately, you've been very busy, I wanted to touch base :)
[10:57] <fabbione> lilo: don't worry too much... we might as well keep the conference on oftc
[10:58] <lilo> fabbione: eek 8)
[10:58] <fabbione> lilo: wouldn't be easier for you guys if we setup a local server and link from that one?
[10:59] <fabbione> atleast all the conference people will not die on netsplits
[10:59] <lilo> fabbione: well, we can do that if you guys want to
[11:00] <lilo> fabbione: happy to set something up
[11:00] <fabbione> lilo: we can take a look to it after we will know the available infrastructure setup down there
[11:00] <daniels> lilo: last time we had an internal IRC server because we had a staggeringly reliable connection, but if you're happy to have us set up a leaf, we might do that
[11:00] <lilo> sounds good
[11:00] <fabbione> lilo: perhaps you can prepare a server config "freenode" approved for such task
[11:00] <fabbione> so that we need to minimize intrusion in the netwoek
[11:01] <daniels> just as long as it's not going to be taken down by someone doing OPERWALL, umode -o, or whatever
[11:01] <fabbione> s/need/can
[11:01] <lilo> well, usually we just request an account and set the thing up as a normal server
[11:02] <lilo> then it gets routing configuration updates along with everybody else
[11:02] <fabbione> lilo: well.. isn't better than someone really experienced provides us a tested configuration?
[11:03] <daniels> unfortunately on an internal LAN, we'd be uncomfortable about the security issues of providing accounts
[11:03] <lilo> well, maybe we can work something out that will do the job
[11:04] <Mithrandir> daniels: we could put it on a separate host which is only allowed to speak irc through the net.
[11:04] <Mithrandir> what would the system requirements for such a system be?
[11:04] <daniels> Mithrandir: p100
[11:04] <fabbione> lilo: the problem is if we are behind NAT
[11:04] <fabbione> lilo: we might not have control over the firewall 
[11:04] <daniels> lilo: if you guys are comfortable with it, I'm quite comfortable administering dancer
[11:05] <daniels> lilo: but this is all hypothetical, so we'll cross that bridge if/when we come to it
[11:05] <lilo> daniels: should be doable
[11:05] <Mithrandir> I can bring spare HW, and I can set up a VPN of some sort home to.
[11:05] <daniels> lilo: phat
[11:06] <Mithrandir> s/to//
[11:19] <fabbione> seb128: if i was starting from 1 Jan 2004.. there is lifeless that prefers to jump back to year 1004 ;)
[11:20] <daniels> heh, someone just pointed out http://www.google.com/search?q=ubuntu+debian to me
[11:20] <seb128> fabbione: ah ah :)
[11:25] <daniels> mdz: please import #251386
[11:38] <seb128> pitti: here ?
[11:38] <pitti> seb128: yes
[11:38] <seb128> you've seen the changes in the groupes/privileges stuff in gst ?
[11:39] <seb128> I don't really like the new system, you can't make manual tweaking for stuff not listed ... and you don't have the details on the list items neither
[11:41] <pitti> seb128: hmm, actually I think the new design is slightly better
[11:41] <seb128> pitti: BTW I don't have  #3230 here, the "gksudo users-admin" menu entry still works fine ... you sure you didn't make typo error in your password or something ?
[11:41] <pitti> seb128: at least it was easy to add our plugdev/scanner groups
[11:41] <pitti> yes, I tried it maybe ten times :-)
[11:41] <pitti> BTW, it still worked yesterday
[11:41] <pitti> but now, after a reboot, it doesn't any more
[11:41] <seb128> weird weird weird
[11:41] <pitti> did you reboot?
[11:41] <seb128> yes
[11:41] <pitti> odd
[11:42] <seb128> my computer is down when I sleep
[11:42] <pitti> mine too
[11:42] <seb128> and I've slept this night :)
[11:42] <pitti> the authentication system got even more complicated
[11:42] <pitti> and I currently don't know how to set default privileges for newly created users only in the users-conf script
[11:42] <seb128> gksudo works with other stuff on your box ?
[11:43] <pitti> but I can't test this as long as I'm bothered with this su stuff
[11:43] <pitti> btw, I also tried at the console with "sudo users-admin"
[11:43] <pitti> preauthenticated, i. e. without password
[11:43] <pitti> same problem
[11:44] <seb128> no problem with sudo here
[11:44] <seb128> I've just tried
[11:44] <pitti> The odd thing is that it worked yesterday
[11:44] <pitti> but not after today's dist-upgrade...
[11:45] <seb128>   dictionaries-common libexif-dev libexif10 libraptor1 libruby1.8 lvm2
[11:45] <seb128>   mysql-common ruby1.8 synaptic
[11:45] <seb128> nothing that could be problematic in this imho
[11:45] <seb128> still ok after the dist-upgrade ...
[11:46] <seb128> you have changed your PATH or something ?
[11:46] <pitti> seb128: I have 1.1.0-0ubuntu1
[11:46] <pitti> not really
[11:46] <seb128> ii  gnome-system-t 1.1.0-0ubuntu1 Cross-platform configuration utilities for G
[11:46] <pitti> seb128: whereis users-admin is correct
[11:46] <pitti> seb128: I also tried in the built source
[11:47] <pitti> seb128: I try to log out and back in
[11:47] <|trey|> Permission to put the Java source I use in Wiki commented out? (plus explaination)
[11:48] <trukulo> |trey|, denied (lol)
[11:48] <|trey|> trukulo, what? why  :(
[11:48] <trukulo> it's a joke
[11:48] <|trey|> 8)
[11:48] <pitti> seb128: still same problem...
[11:48] <trukulo> it's a wiki, do it, that's what a wiki is for
[11:49] <seb128> pitti: dunno what could be wrong ....
[11:49] <pitti> seb128: I dig into this.
[11:49] <|trey|> (deb http://jrfonseca.dyndns.org/debian/ ./ - the source...)
[11:49] <seb128> pitti: ok, let me know if you find something
[11:50] <seb128> pitti: does "sudo su -c /usr/bin/time-admin" works ?
[11:51] <daniels> lamont: fwiw, coreutils is ftbfs on my buildd here
[11:51] <pitti> seb128: I think I know what's wrong
[11:51] <seb128> oh ?
[11:51] <pitti> seb128: I modified users-conf and this thing somehow does not like my debugging statements
[11:51] <pitti> seb128: so, my fault :-)
[11:51] <seb128> ok
[12:04] <Mitario> hi all
[12:04] <seb128> morning Mitario 
[12:22] <|trey|> https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/GuideToHoary Changes to Hoary sources.list ok?
[12:24] <ChrisH> mjg59: I have two Toshiba notebooks. Do you need help in testing/debugging? The Tecra seems to have some trouble still (sound, power management etc.).
[12:24] <mjg59> ChrisH: That would be good
[12:24] <mjg59> ChrisH: I'll be building test packages at the weekend, if you're interested?
[12:24] <ChrisH> mjg59: Sure.
[12:24] <|trey|> Note entirely sure if I should be telling them HOW to do it?  :o
[12:25] <|trey|> not*
[12:25] <mjg59> ChrisH: I'll be looking at power management first, since that's the biggest issue
[12:26] <ChrisH> mjg59: Right. Not being able to suspend/hiberate is a problem. :) That used to work when I had Debian on it.
[12:28] <ChrisH> mjg59: I don't know if that's related. But during boot I get messages like "modprobe: FATAL: Error inserting pciehp" and "...shpchp"... :Operation not permitted
[12:28] <mjg59> ChrisH: Yeah, that's unrelated
[12:28] <fabbione> Mithrandir: any eta for 3032?
[12:28] <fabbione> Mithrandir: if so.. would you mind to take care of 2872 too?
[12:28] <mjg59> ChrisH: It's likely that under Debian you were using APM rather than acpi - if you add apm to the end of /etc/modules and boot with acpi=off things might work better
[12:29] <ChrisH> mjg59: Ah. I'll try.
[12:29] <ChrisH> mjg59: btw, the boot phase is delayed during ntp sync when there is no network connection. perhaps this could be improved.
[12:29] <mjg59> ChrisH: Yeah, that ought to be better in Hoary
[12:31] <Mithrandir> fabbione: yes, I'll take 2872 as well.
[12:32] <fabbione> Mithrandir: thanks
[12:32] <fabbione> Mithrandir: btw... just finished to build x.org debs for amd64 :-)
[12:32] <Mithrandir> fabbione: woo :)
[12:32] <fabbione> next one is ppc
[12:33] <sid77> yeah
[12:33] <sid77> waiting that :)
[12:33] <mjg59> fabbione: When do we get the sweet, sweet crack?
[12:33] <fabbione> mjg59: pretty soon
[12:34] <daniels> soon enough, young jedi
[12:34] <daniels> you must be patient to fully appreciate the way of the x
[12:34] <daniels> padawan
[12:34] <Kamion> ObiWan
[12:34] <daniels> Kamion: in use, apparently
[12:34] <Kamion> ah
[12:34] <ObiOne> or ObiLan
[12:34] <ObiOne> ;)
[12:35] <mjg59> Craaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaack............
[12:36] <fabbione> hey elmo
[12:37] <fabbione> elmo: can i get access to a i386 hoary chroot at the dc?
[12:37] <elmo> hey fabbione
[12:37] <daniels> mjg59: you love the pipe
[12:37] <elmo> fabbione: haven't you got i386/hoary locally?
[12:37] <daniels> elmo: yes, and also DSL
[12:37] <fabbione> elmo: yes i do, but i will be more happy to spare 150MB of uploads for X.org during the next days
[12:38] <fabbione> elmo: since we might have to release one behind another for testing
[12:38] <fabbione> like on roockery or so
[12:38] <fabbione> before hitting the archive
[12:38] <fabbione> one upload from here would take me ages
[12:38] <fabbione> more than a remote build
[12:40] <Kamion> elmo: did you see my question yesterday about "Task: ubuntu-desktop" fields for hoary?
[12:41] <elmo> fabbione: meh, ok, building
[12:41] <elmo> kamion: yes, but as I was leaving, one sec
[12:42] <fabbione> elmo: after the first build i will need your help on ppc and amd64 to build xorg-synaptic-drivers, because it requires xorg installed in the chroot
[12:43] <mjg59> ZORG
[12:44] <elmo> kamion: fixed
[12:44] <daniels> mjg59: BORG
[12:44] <elmo> fabbione: meh, k
[12:44] <daniels> (to which the logical next step is, of course ...)
[12:44] <fabbione> elmo: no rush.. it's going to be either later today
[12:44] <mjg59> Joerg?
[12:44] <fabbione> or tomorrow
[12:44] <daniels> mjg59: no, BONG
[12:44] <Kamion> elmo: ta
[12:44] <Kamion> should be able to build Hoary CDs now
[12:45] <Kamion> actually I'm installing with one now to see how the installer works, but it doesn't have any of Desktop on it
[12:45] <daniels> mjg59: JRG is two steps
[12:46] <mvo_> elmo: is it possible to get changelog like http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/ for ubuntu? that would be uebercool
[12:46] <elmo> Kamion: is RAID1 root on the d-i TODO list?
[12:46] <Kamion> elmo: should just work with the d-i sync?
[12:46] <elmo> Kamion: oh, well, that means installing hoary :)
[12:46] <elmo> but if it's going to be in hoary, excellent
[12:47] <Kamion>     - raid1 works for root (or /boot) with raid1, of course does not with
[12:47] <Kamion>       raid0. Remove the big scarey warning, though we really need a new one
[12:47] <Kamion>       about raid0 and some other raid levels.
[12:47] <Kamion> might force lilo rather than grub
[12:47] <elmo> kamion: is it worth test installing hoary while I'm here?  I have an amd64 I'm installing anyway
[12:47] <Kamion> well, I'll do a daily build once auckland picks up your Packages changes
[12:47] <elmo> mvo_: that's the one with full changelog, right?
[12:48] <Mithrandir> elmo: it would be nice to have the new syslinux tested.
[12:48] <mvo_> elmo: yes. so that aptitude and synaptic can get them
[12:48] <Kamion> elmo: don't spend too much effort on it, though, it's exceedingly rough and I'm betting myself large sums of money that base-config will be broken
[12:49] <mvo_> elmo: it's not urgent of course (not at all)
[12:50] <elmo> mvo_: well, reasonably happy to do - but you could set it up yourself too, if you wanted - there's a full mirror on rookery, tho it's not auto-syncing yet
[12:53] <Kamion> Keybuk: would it be possible to make your merge tool handle permissions?
[12:53] <elmo> Kamion: mirror's are  syncing now, fwiw
[12:54] <Keybuk> Kamion: not easily
[12:54] <Keybuk> they're pretty hard to spot too
[12:56] <Kamion> even for new files?
[12:56] <Kamion> it broke grub-installer :)
[12:57] <Kamion> elmo: ok, turns out I have to wait for grub-installer to autobuild anyway
[01:04] <elmo> fabbione: macaroni
[01:06] <fabbione> elmo: thanks!
[01:08] <fabbione> elmo: can I get ccache in the chroot please?
[01:08] <fabbione> and rman
[01:08] <fabbione> that should make it
[01:11] <sivang> any doc people around?
[01:19] <thom> dpkg-deb: building package `mozilla-firefox-dev' in `../mozilla-firefox-dev_0.99+1.0RC1-3_amd64.deb'.
[01:20] <seb128> cool :)
[01:22] <Mithrandir> thom: does it still crash if you type more than two characters into the search field?
[01:23] <daniels> Mithrandir: wfm on i386
[01:23] <Mithrandir> daniels: crashes for me on amd64 :)
[01:23] <elmo> fabbione: done
[01:24] <Mithrandir> daniels: but works most of the time on amd64
[01:24] <daniels> hm
[01:24] <Mithrandir> uhm
[01:24] <Mithrandir> i386
[01:24] <fabbione> elmo: thanks
[01:24] <thom> Mithrandir: no, i've still never seen that crash on i386 or amd64
[01:27] <daniels> ah, bong.  gcc-3.3 completes a full (slow) spin around the buildd, only to be followed immediately by gcc-3.4.
[01:27] <Mithrandir> nothing like remote-healing system just by logging into them.
[01:32] <|trey|> I changed what I could find... but don't see any more  :(
[01:33] <mvo_> |trey|: apparently the synaptic repository is difficult to use for a lot of people
[01:34] <|trey|> mvo_, Not enough people read the Synaptic howto I guess... but it works...
[01:34] <mvo_> |trey|: I know that it works :)
[01:37] <thom> um, rock.
[01:37] <thom> usr/bin/ldd: line 1:   915 Segmentation fault      LD_TRACE_LOADED_OBJECTS=1 LD_WARN= LD_BIND_NOW= LD_LIBRARY_VERSION=$verify_out LD_VERBOSE= ${RTLD} "$file"
[01:37] <thom> dpkg-shlibdeps: failure: ldd on `debian/mozilla-firefox/usr/lib/mozilla-firefox/libsmime3.so' gave error exit status 1
[01:37] <|trey|> mvo_, hmm, I'm just now reading it... based more on preview... more organized now... (unsupported and supported getting 2 entries, not one...
[01:37] <|trey|> mvo_, how do you upload pics to the repo?
[01:37] <|trey|> s/repo/wiki/
[01:38] <|trey|> Just use html?
[01:39] <mvo_> |trey|: haven't tried that yet
[01:39] <|trey|> I really don't think Cox (my ISP would like the traffic :o)
[01:40] <mvo_> sure :)
[01:40] <mvo_> it is possible and should be pretty easy actually
[01:41] <|trey|> mvo_, I don't see it  :(  even looking at what they did, its not clear  :(
[01:43] <mvo_> |trey|: there is a small "add new item" over the header of the page and below the [contents] [view]  tabs
[01:44] <|trey|> https://www.ubuntulinux.org/ubuntu/components/ Should contain Multiverse too, incomplete, I can't edit it though  :(
[01:46] <carlos> latest cpufreq configuration file is broken in hoary
[01:46] <carlos> -pm_type=pmu #(acpi, apm or pmu)
[01:46] <carlos> +pm_type=acpi #(acpi, apm or pmu)
[01:46] <mvo_> |trey|: this one is a "locked" page, I can't edit it too. 
[01:46] <carlos> under PPC
[01:47] <mvo_> |trey|: do you want to file a bug about it?
[01:51] <|trey|> mvo_, wiki is a different site to main, bugzilla has its own, nothing for wiki, thats ok?
[01:52] <mvo_> |trey|: I think ther their is "other website"
[01:56] <thom> I HATE firefox
[01:58] <daniels> thom: firefox doesn't require you to have sprints on the wrong side of the world
[01:58] <|trey|> thom, haha, at least the RC fixed Java  8)
[01:58] <thom> |trey|: it doesn't even build on amd64, so that's the least of my worries
[01:59] <|trey|> thom, indeed, ouch  :(
[01:59] <trukulo> jdub, r u there?
[01:59] <jdub> yes
[02:00] <trukulo> i've got a mascot? for ubuntu
[02:00] <trukulo> http://www.benaim.org/leones%20imagenes/leon%20corbata.gif
[02:00] <jdub> heh
[02:00] <trukulo> you know, the animal and those things
[02:01] <trukulo> or if you want something more technological
[02:02] <trukulo> http://mercurio.homeip.net/blog/wp-content/leon_trek.jpg
[02:03] <thom> daniels: neither does X. you're on the right side of the world now
[02:04] <daniels> thom: you say that, but you also allege that this side of the world requires me to by pan^Wtrousers in december.  what's up with that?
[02:10] <thom> GAR
[02:10] <thom> GAR GAR GAR GAR GAR GAR GAR
[02:10] <daniels> so, like, mono
[02:11] <thom> HATE
[02:11] <daniels> right now I can't do a mono-aware dbus, something about main
[02:11] <thom> FASCIST PIGS
[02:11] <daniels> thom: here, you merge the (totally parallel-developed) modular/monolithic libX11, I'll take Firefox
[02:12] <thom> hey, lets use autoconf. i hear that has good cross platform love. AND THEN LETS IGNORE IT UTTERLY FOR one library
[02:14] <daniels> thom: oh dear.  which library?
[02:15] <thom> the security (smime, ssl etc) libraries
[02:15] <mvo_> a arch question: how can I "undo" a init-tree. I did it in the wrong dir and how it always complains
[02:15] <fabbione> dpkg-deb: building package `xserver-xorg' in `../xserver-xorg_6.8.1-0.2_powerpc.deb'.
[02:15] <thom> so they build that lot with CC=gcc; rather than CC=gcc-3.4
[02:15] <robtaylor> fabbione: cool :)
[02:16] <thom> fabbione: can i have some amd64 test love? :-)
[02:16] <daniels> thom: oh man
[02:16] <daniels> thom: that's wack
[02:16] <fabbione> thom: you will test it for me
[02:16] <daniels> thom: it's already building fine on amd64
[02:16] <daniels> thom: you should've used your admin supahpowahs to watch for ~fabbione:*.deb on yellow
[02:16] <fabbione> we finished amd64 like 2 hours ago...
[02:16] <fabbione> there is nothing on yellow anymore :-)
[02:17] <thom> fabbione: give me debs then! ;-)
[02:17] <daniels> *waves hand* there are no xorg amd64 debs
[02:17] <daniels> thom: when firefox is fixed
[02:17] <fabbione> thom: within today or tomorrow morning
[02:17] <thom> daniels: screw you, hippy
[02:17] <daniels> thom: wouldn't want to distract you from anything, y'know, important, with our toys :)
[02:17] <daniels> thom: i respect the fact you have an important package
[02:17] <daniels> thom: you were right
[02:18] <thom> gimme debs or I'll misdirect you to G-A-Y rather than fabric
[02:18] <fabbione> thom: there are no debs
[02:18] <fabbione> i removed all of them from the buildd
[02:18] <fabbione> and there is a reason for it
[02:19] <daniels> thom: fabio is the evil buildmaster
[02:19] <fabbione> otherwise we would have done the first drop today
[02:19] <daniels> thom: i don't even have an account on yellow
[02:19] <daniels> thom: i just watch this here buildd
[02:19] <daniels> and do patchwork
[02:20] <thom> bah :-)
[02:21] <daniels> fabio just wandered out (workraved) muttering something about 'ccache' and 'bitching'
[02:47] <Mithrandir> lamont: poke?
[02:55] <fabbione> 2 round on ppc = success
[02:55] <fabbione> now..
[02:55] <pitti> fabbione: congrats!
[02:55] <fabbione> all the archs all alligned
[02:56] <fabbione> we need to strip the orig.tar.gz and rebuild
[02:58] <sid77> YEAH
[03:06] <mjg59> ZORG
[03:07] <daniels> BONG
[03:07] <Mithrandir> mjg59: you maintain the pile that is nstx
[03:07] <thom> hah. firefox has succumbed to my will
[03:07] <jdub> FIGHT THE GOOD FIGHT THOM!
[03:07] <Mithrandir> mjg59: can you tell me why I'm  utterly unable to get it to do what I want?
[03:08] <thom> it now not only buils but doesn't segfault, either
[03:08] <daniels> mjg59: mith and I are trying to convince bind9 to act as a forwarder to nstx
[03:08] <jdub> daniels: rock! write a recipe!
[03:08] <daniels> mjg59: so bind listens on *:53, forwards nstx.* to localhost:5353
[03:08] <Mithrandir> jdub: we need to get it working first.
[03:08] <daniels> jdub: working on it
[03:09] <jdub> Mithrandir: excuses!
[03:09] <mjg59> daniels: Rock
[03:09] <mjg59> Mithrandir: Because it's a steaming pile of shit?
[03:10] <Mithrandir> daniels: have you gotten it working?
[03:11] <daniels> mjg59: ... any ideas? :)
[03:11] <daniels> Mithrandir: no
[03:11] <daniels> i wouldn't be harassing mjg59 if I hadj
[03:11] <daniels> works if I specify 131.252.208.81 as the nameserver, but breaks badly using anything else
[03:12] <jdub> fabbione: dude?
[03:12] <Mithrandir> I can't get it working, no matter what I specify as the NS.
[03:12] <jdub> fabbione: wanna help out with an ubuntu-it mailing list? :-)
[03:13] <fabbione> jdub: ?
[03:13] <fabbione> no
[03:13] <jdub> hrm
[03:13] <jdub> that wasn't the wild excitement i was expecting
[03:13] <fabbione> the guy that asked the mailing list already asked me
[03:13] <Mithrandir> jdub: try enrico?
[03:13] <enrico> Mithrandir: yes?
[03:13] <Mithrandir> enrico: ^^
[03:13] <fabbione> jdub: i am not interested in being the only maintainer (or 2) following an entire mailing list.
[03:13] <enrico> I'm busy in the docteam meeting now
[03:14] <enrico> How can I help you later?
[03:14] <jdub> fabbione: but... but... where is your national pride?
[03:14] <Mithrandir> enrico: jdub wants somebody on the ubuntu-it list -- talk to him. :)
[03:14] <fabbione> jdub: enotime really...
[03:16] <thom> seb128: what's the magic to make epiphany build with firefox?
[03:16] <seb128> thom: DEB_CONFIGURE_EXTRA_FLAGS := --with-mozilla=firefox
[03:16] <seb128> in debian/rules
[03:16] <mjg59> daniels: And you've hacked nstx to bind to a port other than 53?
[03:16] <Mithrandir> mjg59: yes.
[03:17] <Mithrandir>         type forward;
[03:17] <Mithrandir>         forwarders {
[03:17] <Mithrandir>         127.0.0.1 port 5353;
[03:17] <Mithrandir>         };
[03:17] <jdub> Mithrandir: and you've hacked it to bind only on a particular interface? :)
[03:17] <Mithrandir> jdub: nope
[03:17] <jdub> enrico, fabbione: you guys! holy cow!
[03:17] <daniels> mjg59: 5353, as it were
[03:18] <Mithrandir> mjg59: that should really be a confiuration item
[03:18] <mjg59> Mithrandir: Yes, yes it should
[03:18] <thom> ephy is building
[03:18] <mjg59> File a wishlist bug :)
[03:18] <thom> and it looks to be using firefox
[03:21] <thom> seb128: right, i'll fix up the branding and upload
[03:22] <jdub> thom: rocking! rocking!
[03:22] <seb128> thom: upload epiphany ?
[03:23] <seb128> or firefox-dev
[03:23] <seb128> or both ?
[03:25] <daniels> hm
[03:25] <daniels> has anyone here got nstx working with external nameservers?
[03:25] <daniels> mine works just great with the same machine as the name server, but is total arse with externals
[03:26] <thom> seb128: firefox
[03:27] <seb128> ok
[03:27] <seb128> I'll upload epiphany when mozilla-firefox-dev will be here :)
[03:27] <thom> rock on
[03:28] <thom> once this is done, i'll hit up the industrial theme
[03:28] <jdub> the new one is surprisingly good
[03:28] <thom> has it fixed the FAYT dialog?
[03:29] <jdub> forget all your troubles?
[03:29] <thom> find as you type
[03:29] <jdub> hrm, dialog?
[03:29] <thom> hit / and firefox should pop up a box at the bottom of the browser pane
[03:30] <thom> (assuming you're running hoary and have a 1.0 firefox)
[03:30] <jdub> oh right
[03:30] <jdub> on warty box atm
[03:30] <jdub> sec
[03:30] <thom> oh well
[03:30] <thom> downloading now to try
[03:31] <thom> that'd be a big 'no'
[03:33] <jdub> thom: whoa
[03:33] <jdub> thom: yeah, no.
[03:35] <thom> http://people.ubuntu.com/~thom/industrial-disaster.png :/
[03:36] <jdub> mm, got same thing here
[03:36] <jdub> BONG-O!
[03:38] <thom> it also breaks the "save as" dialog
[03:43] <thom> i think we'll pass for the time being
[03:46] <jdub> oh man
[03:46] <jdub> uuughh
[03:46] <jdub> i meant to type 'dict trousers'
[03:46] <jdub> instead, i typed 'apt-cache show trousers'
[03:47] <bob2> pants!
[03:47] <daniels> jdub: yeah
[03:47] <daniels> i thought the huge mistake was that you meant to type 'trousers' in the first place
[03:48] <thom> trousers: (n) what american-wannabes call pants
[03:50] <daniels> watch yourself.
[03:50] <lamont_r> morning
[03:51] <Mithrandir> lamont_r: nstx is being mean to me.
[03:51] <Mithrandir> lamont_r: and I suspect bind9 is acting up as well
[03:52] <lamont_r> Mithrandir: maybe they just don't like you??? :-)
[03:53] <lamont_r> what sort of "acting up"?
[03:58] <Mithrandir> seems like it doesn't want to forward packets to nstx, or I'm just dumb.
[03:58] <mjg59> nstx hates everyone
[03:58] <mjg59> Mithrandir: It'd probably be a good idea to throw some code in to check whether packets ever get received, though
[03:59] <Mithrandir> ok, what I have is roughly this:  nstx.err.no is the nstx zone, it is running on vawad, 129.241.93.49.  I'm using another host as my DNS server (129.241.7.7, but that shouldn't matter)
[03:59] <Mithrandir>  dig -t ns +norecurse nstx.err.no @129.241.93.49
[04:00] <Mithrandir> that will show you that err.no has a glue record for nstx set up
[04:01] <Mithrandir> sudo tcpdump -i eth1 -n host 129.241.7.7 and port 53 <-- this doesn't give me _any_ packets.
[04:01] <Mithrandir> which I find weird.
[04:02] <Mithrandir> I guess I have a wart somewhere in my setup, but I'm unable to find it.
[04:11] <daniels> elmo: ping
[04:16] <elmo> daniels: what?
[04:17] <daniels> elmo: would it be possible to get xorg-driver-synaptics built against xorg tonight or tomorrow?
[04:17] <elmo> daniels: I've no idea - would it?
[04:18] <fabbione> elmo: we are preparing the first X.org drop
[04:18] <fabbione> but we need to build xorg-synaptic with xorg
[04:18] <fabbione> that means getting a hoary chroot (amd64/ppc) updated with X.org
[04:18] <fabbione> i386 is already there
[04:19] <fabbione> let say in 2 hours from now, everything should be in place
[04:19] <fabbione> probably earlier than that
[04:20] <elmo> well give me a shout when you're ready
[04:21] <fabbione> elmo: i am uploading the "dfsg" sanitized tree now
[04:21] <fabbione> the one i had around this afternoon was the wrong one
[04:21] <fabbione> but ccache is populated everywhere
[04:21] <daniels> elmo: cheers, was just checking if you would be able to do it
[04:21] <fabbione> so it won't take too long
[04:21] <fabbione> elmo: btw... you rock!
[04:28] <nowlin> is it possible to add asus to the laptop list http://www.ubuntulinux.org/community/teams/laptop ??
[04:29] <nowlin> it dosnt load the asus_acpi and the speedstep-centrino on startup
[04:33] <pitti> sivang: my server's back!
[04:36] <mvo_> pitti: good to hear
[04:37] <pitti> mvo_: I got a standard woody system and have to recover my old stuff though
[04:37] <mvo_> ohhh
[04:38] <pitti> mvo_: it's still on the second (raid) disc, though :-)
[04:38] <pitti> mvo_: just, the installed kernel does not support RAID and stuff...
[04:46] <mdz> morning
[04:46] <pitti> mvo_: NOOO! These guys messed up the IDE wiring...
[04:46] <pitti> Hi mdz!
[04:47] <fabbione> hey mdz
[04:47] <fabbione> mdz: see topic
[04:47] <daniels> morning mdz
[04:47] <mdz> what's this about ubuntu-meta?
[04:47] <fabbione> mdz: and please could you tell me what is the right way to modify ubuntu-meta?
[04:48] <mdz> fabbione: just run ./update in the source tree
[04:48] <fabbione> mdz: i am kicking X.org on the buildd for preview and i need a modified version of ubuntu-meta for people to get a proper update
[04:48] <daniels> mdz: needs an update for s/xfree86/xorg/
[04:48] <fabbione> mdz: ok.. but if i want to dd or change a package
[04:48] <mvo_> pitti: :(
[04:48] <fabbione> mdz: do i need to go trough germinate?
[04:48] <mdz> fabbione: update just syncs with the seeds
[04:49] <mdz> fabbione: if you just want to change it by hand, just edit the files
[04:49] <daniels> mdz: so this needs to be changed on the wiki?
[04:49] <daniels> 56 packages built, 746 left
[04:49] <daniels> cd build && !mv
[04:49] <daniels> er
[04:49] <fabbione> mdz: as i wrote in my email we will have to upload a bunch of packages in sequence
[04:50] <fabbione> mdz: right now i am preparing an external repo for testing
[04:50] <fabbione> and if somebody overlap ubuntu-meta with mine.. the upgrade is going to be less nice
[04:50] <mdz> ok
[04:50] <mdz> just version it like an NMU
[04:50] <fabbione> so if possible for one or two days can we avoid to upload ubuntu-meta?
[04:51] <mdz> sure
[04:51] <fabbione> i already builded it on 3 archs
[04:51] <sivang> pitti : yeye!!!!
[04:51] <sivang> pitti : long live piware.de
[04:51] <thom> pitti: < infinity> thom : Has Martin Pitt been checking in all his apache1.3 changes to CVS?
[04:51] <pitti> thom: I did not touch any CVS
[04:51] <sivang> who is infinity ?
[04:52] <pitti> thom: I draw the changes from upstream CVS, but I did nothing with any Debian cvs
[04:52] <thom> pitti: yeah. can you bug mith to give you ssh access and commit them, please? :-)
[04:52] <daniels> sivang: Adam Conrad, php4/apache2 co-maintainer
[04:52] <sivang> daniels : thanks
[04:52] <thom> Mithrandir: ^
[04:53] <pitti> thom: hmm, fabbione wanted to upload 1.3.33 soon anyway; the changes are contained there
[04:55] <daniels> mdz: did you get my debzilla request before?
[04:56] <mdz> daniels: no
[04:56] <fabbione> yup
[04:56] <fabbione> guys i will prepare 1.3.33 tomorrow afternoon
[04:56] <mdz> daniels: done
[04:56] <daniels> mdz: thankyou
[04:56] <daniels> mdz: (is pinging you on irc the best way to get this done, or should I be doing something else?)
[04:57] <mdz> daniels: debzilla is basically a big hack which runs under my uid, so yeah
[04:57] <daniels> mdz: ill
[04:57] <mdz> it's a trivial command to import a bug, but it has to run as me, presently
[04:57] <daniels> right
[05:00] <fabbione>  dpkg-genchanges -B
[05:00] <fabbione> dpkg-genchanges: arch-specific upload - not including arch-independent packages
[05:00] <fabbione> dpkg-genchanges: binary-only upload - not including any source code
[05:00] <fabbione> dpkg-buildpackage: binary only upload (no source included)
[05:00] <fabbione> real    16m59.893s
[05:00] <fabbione> user    9m15.854s
[05:00] <fabbione> sys     3m3.155s
[05:00] <fabbione> (hoary-chroot)fabbione@yellow ~/xorg-6.8.1 $ 
[05:00] <pitti> fabbione: what, the whole xbuild is done in 17 minutes?
[05:00] <pitti> fabbione: boy, that's fast!
[05:01] <daniels> (granted, it's not building binary-all, and I suspect it may have been ccached, but still)
[05:01] <pitti> sivang: they fixed the IDE wiring now :-)
[05:02] <sivang> pitti : yey. seems like we're getting close to mail
[05:02] <pitti> sivang: now I must not mess up anything 
[05:03] <sivang> pitti  : you won't. btw, have you tried to check grub's manual for the same remote config needs you have?
[05:03] <pitti> sivang: I did
[05:03] <sivang> pitti : and?
[05:05] <pitti> sivang: but I will stick to lilo for now, I know it better
[05:05] <sivang> pitti : ok, whatever brings the server back to life :)
[05:07] <elmo> fabbione: wait till I setup concordia
[05:08] <elmo> tho that kind of relies on the KVM not being entirely FCUKED ahem
[05:09] <fabbione> elmo: concordia? what's that?
[05:09] <thom> sometimes
[05:10] <elmo> fabbione: the new amd64 port box
[05:10] <fabbione> elmo: is it faster?
[05:10] <elmo> yep
[05:11] <mako> mdz: http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~mako/hoary_kickoff-20041025-summary.html
[05:11] <mdz> does firefox use the GNOME mime system, or something else?
[05:11] <mako> mdz: ergh.. wrong title
[05:12] <fabbione> dpkg-deb: building package `xlibmesa3' in `../xlibmesa3_6.8.1-0.2_i386.deb'.
[05:12] <fabbione> touch stampdir/binary-arch
[05:12] <fabbione>  dpkg-genchanges -b
[05:12] <fabbione> dpkg-genchanges: binary-only upload - not including any source code
[05:12] <fabbione> dpkg-buildpackage: binary only upload (no source included)
[05:12] <fabbione> real    30m7.048s
[05:12] <fabbione> user    13m56.844s
[05:12] <fabbione> sys     6m45.783s
[05:12] <fabbione> (hoary-chroot)fabbione@macaroni:~/xorg-6.8.1 $ 
[05:12] <fabbione> damn..
[05:12] <fabbione> it's only my 2 severs that are fucking slow?
[05:13] <fabbione> daniels: stop leeching pr0n from them
[05:14] <daniels> heh
[05:17] <mdz> ARGH
[05:17] <mdz> I just followed up to one of those random hoary-changes emails without noticing
[05:17] <fabbione> touch stampdir/binary-arch
[05:17] <fabbione>  dpkg-genchanges -B
[05:17] <fabbione> dpkg-genchanges: arch-specific upload - not including arch-independent packages
[05:17] <fabbione> dpkg-genchanges: binary-only upload - not including any source code
[05:17] <fabbione> dpkg-buildpackage: binary only upload (no source included)
[05:17] <fabbione> real    35m20.553s
[05:17] <fabbione> user    18m7.915s
[05:17] <fabbione> sys     6m18.721s
[05:17] <fabbione> YEAH
[05:18] <fabbione> and ppc is there
[05:18] <mako> azeem: thanks for the traffic bug
[05:18] <fabbione> time to take a snapshot
[05:22] <mdz> mako: thanks
[05:23] <mdz> mako: where can I link to the transcript?
[05:24] <mako> mdz: it's in the same directory
[05:24] <mako> mdz: or should be
[05:24] <mdz> mako: thanks
[05:24] <mdz> all 420k of it
[05:26] <mako> mdz: in the future, i'd appreciate it if you had <4h meetings. i'm sure you would too :)
[05:26] <mako> mdz: i'm sending out UT today so i'm not going to post it by itself
[05:27] <mdz> mako: I'll announce the summary with my update
[05:27] <mako> mdz: awesome
[05:27] <mdz> mako: my wrists are in agreement about the meeting duration, believe me
[05:27] <mdz> but the agenda for that one had been accumulating for 6 months
[05:28] <sivang> mdz : you mena the last CC / TB meeting?
[05:28] <daniels> mercifully it was a week or so before daylight savings, so it started at 2am, not 4am
[05:29] <mdz> sivang: no, the kickoff meeting
[05:29] <sivang> ah
[05:29] <fabbione> elmo: are you still around?
[05:29] <elmo> yes
[05:30] <fabbione> cool
[05:30] <elmo> I'm currently stamping a green network cable to death
[05:31] <fabbione> ehehe
[05:31] <thom> elmo: elbow drop it off the top of emperor
[05:31] <daniels> i want videos of that.
[05:39] <lamont_r> mdz around yet?
[05:39] <mdz> lamont_r: yes
[05:40] <lamont_r> mdz: I don't suppose apt has a config option to override the path to sources.list, eh?
[05:40] <mdz> lamont_r: of course it does
[05:40] <lamont_r> kewl
[05:41] <lamont_r> Dir::Etc::SourceList=foo?
[05:47] <pitti> sivang: server is back
[05:48] <pitti> sivang: it bootet from the degraded RAID, but I certainly have to reboot just one more time later
[05:48] <mdz> jdub: ping?
[05:50] <daniels> mdz: went to sleep an hour ago
[05:57] <thom> daniels: shame you didn't notice i'd already uploaded php4
[05:57] <thom> :P
[05:57] <daniels> thom: OH YOU SUCKER
[05:58] <thom> like, three days ago
[05:58] <daniels> thom: when did you do that?
[05:58] <daniels> oh
[05:58] <daniels> thanks for closing bug #3000 :P
[05:58] <thom> didn't see it
[05:58] <daniels> oh well
[06:06] <daniels> thanks for the work, in that case :0
[06:06] <daniels> :), even
[06:13] <mvo_> http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~mvo/changelogs
[06:13] <elmo> Kamion: ?
[06:15] <fabbione> (one way ticket)
[06:15] <fabbione> thom: you got the debs
[06:15] <fabbione> CYA!
[06:16] <thom> OMFG people are FICK.
[06:16] <daniels> thom: ...
[06:17] <thom> ..."ask if we can modify httpd.conf" THAT'S WHAT CONF.D IS FOR CRETIN
[06:17] <daniels> thom: what? who said that?
[06:17] <azeem> FICK?
[06:18] <azeem> thom: did you shout, or was that some cool acronym I didn't know about?
[06:18] <thom> azeem: a stupid person saying thick
[06:18] <thom> works best in a northern british access
[06:18] <thom> uh, accent
[06:18] <daniels> thom: you already said 'stupid' ;)
[06:19] <thom> daniels: it's in the backuppc changelog
[06:19] <azeem> thom: it's 'fuck' in german, so I wondered
[06:19] <daniels> thom: oh dear
[06:19] <azeem> or at least roughly
[06:19] <daniels> wow, gdb is big
[06:19] <thom> azeem: heh
[06:20] <daniels> thom: i would have to say the most under-utilised feature of apache/a2's configuration handling has been sites-*
[06:20] <daniels> thom: mods-* seems to have worked well, but most people seem to have ignored the host stuff
[06:20] <thom> daniels: to some extent
[06:21] <mdz> pitti: here?
[06:21] <daniels> thom: even worse, the backuppc stuff was for a *module*
[06:21] <pitti> mdz: yes
[06:21] <daniels> thom: i.e. mods-* and a2enmod
[06:21] <daniels> thom: which to some extent?
[06:21] <mdz> pitti: do you know what happened with aptitude's su->sudo changes being lost?
[06:21] <pitti> mdz: currently repairing my remote server
[06:21] <mdz> pitti: was it a problem with the automated process or the manual process?
[06:21] <thom> daniels: yeah
[06:21] <pitti> mdz: I just repaired it today
[06:21] <pitti> mdz: I can't really say
[06:22] <pitti> mdz: I used the merged diff as basis and I thought I got every diff from there
[06:22] <mdz> I'm sure Keybuk would like to know about it if it was dropped by his tools
[06:22] <pitti> mdz: missing these changes would have been not easy, it touches a hell of a lot of files
[06:22] <pitti> mdz: nevertheless it might be possible that I missed it 
[06:23] <daniels> thom: which part of it was 'to some extent'?
[06:23] <thom> daniels: oh, some people seem to use sites-*, but it's not really visible to us because packages in general don't
[06:23] <daniels> right, point
[06:23] <daniels> i suppose also it's not really a general use thing
[06:24] <daniels> i suspect my plans for vhost-base were aiming to a vastly wider audience than it was ever going to get
[06:24] <thom> yeah
[06:24] <daniels> ho hum
[06:25] <mdz> pitti: hmm, the changes seem to be present in the 0.2.15.8-1ubuntu1 in ~scott/merged/
[06:25] <pitti> mdz: then I probably just forgot about them
[06:26] <pitti> mdz: ah, now I remember. The merged package was a mess
[06:26] <pitti> mdz: so I took the Debian package and applied the Warty changes
[06:26] <pitti> mdz: btw, the old patches did not work any more anyway
[06:27] <mdz> pitti: ah, ok
[06:27] <pitti> mdz: I rewrote the sudo support today, now it's working perfectly again
[06:27] <mdz> pitti: we should probably add a config variable for the gain-root program
[06:27] <mdz> so it can go upstream
[06:27] <pitti> mdz: I can add that
[06:29] <mdz> elmo: are we supposed to get mail from katie about warty-security uploads?
[06:29] <elmo> mdz: no
[06:29] <elmo> mail is sent at unchecked -> queue/accepted time; obviously that's not an option
[06:30] <mdz> elmo: I mean in the same way that we do in Debian
[06:30] <mdz> an Accepted mail goes out for the sourceful upload
[06:30] <elmo> to the maintainer - the trick on security.d.o is that ALL mail is overriden to team@s.d.o
[06:30] <lupus_> someone from europe here?
[06:31] <mdz> can we do the same for warty?
[06:31] <fabbione> lupus_: yes
[06:31] <lupus_> can someone conform that winter time is not autoset ?
[06:31] <thom> fabbione: shouldn't you be out getting drunk
[06:31] <elmo> dude, it's not a separate archive, if I add GlobalOverrideEmail, you'll get ALL the accepted mail, including hoary etc. :P
[06:31] <fabbione> lupus_: it was here
[06:31] <thom> lupus_: it autoset fine for me
[06:31] <pitti> lupus_: works fine for me
[06:31] <elmo> I can TODO doing a per-suite GlobalOverride, if you like
[06:31] <mdz> elmo: oh, you meant _ALL_ mail
[06:31] <fabbione> thom: waiting for my gf to finish her phone call
[06:31] <thom> ah
[06:31] <mdz> elmo: yeah, we need to know when something is uploaded to that queue
[06:32] <fabbione> that means something between tomorrow and forever
[06:32] <thom> heh
[06:32] <thom> pour alcohol on the phone
[06:32] <fabbione> no way
[06:32] <fabbione> that will take down my adsl
[06:33] <thom> heh
[06:33] <lupus_> how can I see in which package a certain package is
[06:33] <daniels> dpkg -S
[06:33] <lupus_> I mean file :)
[06:33] <azeem> daniels: that only works for files ;)
[06:34] <fabbione> lupus_: these questions are more appropriate for #ubuntu
[06:34] <fabbione> this is a developer channels
[06:34] <fabbione> to discuss development
[06:34] <lupus_> yes fabbione  I know sorry :)
[06:36] <daniels> the phone is, apparently, unoccupied at the present moment
[06:36] <lupus_> run :p
[06:36] <thom> you guyys suck, make my X smaller
[06:37] <elmo> thom: that would be a world-tour marathon, not a sprint
[06:37] <daniels> thom: dude, 5-13, London weather is pissy
[06:37] <daniels> thom: at least it doesn't fall over every time you upgrade it
[06:37] <thom> daniels: it was a bracing 12C today
[06:38] <thom> and sunny and nice
[06:38] <daniels> thom: it was colder in cph, and I was out for a jog in my singlet and shorts
[06:38] <daniels> it was lovely
[06:38] <daniels> you're just weak.  you should try maintaining a Real Package like X, because apparently that toughens you up.
[06:39] <daniels> anyway, it's time for food in this lovely city.  'nacht'
[06:39] <thom> no thanks, i'm not maintaining anything that you've massacred again :-)
[06:39] <thom> night
[06:39] <daniels> and it's OK, I didn't really mean it.  except the bit about Firefox dying horribly every time you upgrade it.
[06:39] <daniels> fix that.  yesterday.
[06:39] <azeem> "our fellow Ubuntista" <- is that the official denotation?
[06:39] <lupus_> k maybe a dumb idea
[06:39] <lupus_> but what about screenshots of the apps in aptitude
[06:40] <azeem> apps in aptitude?
[06:40] <azeem> you mean tetris?
[06:40] <thom> YM synaptic
[06:40] <lupus_> idd synaptic
[06:40] <thom> and, that would be fairly not trivial to do
[06:40] <azeem> ah, minesweeper it is
[06:40] <daniels> s/massacred/improved/
[06:41] <daniels> not my fault you can't appreciate DBS
[06:41] <lupus_> sorry I'm mixing names :s
[06:41] <thom> i appreciate dbs and cdbs equally
[06:44] <seb128> cdbs
[06:44] <seb128> cdbs rocks :)
[06:44] <thom> it rocks as much as DBS, yes
[06:47] <azeem> cdbs2 is written in shell as well, so it should rock twice as much!
[06:47] <seb128> :)
[06:48] <thom> rocking twice as much as nothing is, let me think, still nothing! ;-)
[06:49] <azeem> depends on your numerical accuracy :)
[06:50] <azeem> at least some bits are rocking during the execution, so it *will* be > 0, q.e.d.
[06:52] <jbailey> Oh lovely, It's not serious cdbs flamage.  /me fades away again.
[06:53] <thom> merely a pet whine 
[06:53] <jbailey> thom: Aside from applying rm -rf to the source tree and providing documentation, is there anything I can do to make it better for you?
[06:54] <thom> jbailey: i dislike the concept more than the implementation, tbh
[06:55] <azeem> thom: yeah, code resuse sucks
[06:55] <azeem> eh, reuse
[06:55] <jbailey> thom: Fair enough.  Given that people seem to like it (and so you're probably stuck with it), if it can be made easier for you, lemme know. =)
[06:56] <thom> jbailey: my main problem is trying to debug other people packages with it
[06:56] <thom> so a nice way to find out exactly what is happening (or documenting such a thing if it exists) would probably make me much happier
[06:58] <jbailey> thom: What type of information would be most helpful - the stages that it's passing through?  I've added a couple debug modes to cdbsv2 that do an 'set -x' in cdbs so you can see each command as it's executed.
[06:59] <thom> seeing each command would be great
[06:59] <seb128> jbailey: what's really missing in cdbs1 is a multi-build :p
[06:59] <jbailey> Yes, dear.
[07:00] <seb128> that and a complete descriptions of the variables available and the build steps
[07:00] <jbailey> Yeah, that's a bit suboptimal.  I do have that in the new stuff, though.
[07:00] <jbailey> 'debian/rules help' will be your friend. =)
[07:00] <seb128> ie: you want to move some file after the binary install and before the dh_strip, no easy to find what to add
[07:01] <seb128> yeah, I was speaking about the v1
[07:01] <jbailey> Yar, you're evil.
[07:01] <seb128> I'm sure the new one will rock even more :)
[07:01] <jbailey> food time.
[07:01] <seb128> have a good lunch :)
[07:32] <thom> well, Xorg hasn't broken yet
[07:33] <sjoerd> pitti: did you have time for pmount stuff, or still swamped in other work ? :)
[07:34] <pitti> sjoerd: I already implemented the --async/-a option
[07:34] <sjoerd> nice
[07:34] <pitti> sjoerd: the -t option (force file system) is implemented, but not yet tested
[07:34] <pitti> sjoerd: I had to repair my server today
[07:34] <pitti> sjoerd: for -t I restructured the code, now it looks really better
[07:35] <pitti> sjoerd: the last problem is the uid checking
[07:35] <pitti> sjoerd: now the uid checking works well for VFAT, hfs, iso9660, udf, etc.
[07:35] <pitti> sjoerd: but it does not work for file systems which don't support uid/gid options
[07:35] <pitti> sjoerd: because pmount then cannot tell which user mounted it
[07:36] <pitti> sjoerd: by now all users are allowed to pumount such devices if they are mounted in /media
[07:36] <pitti> sjoerd: there's no trivial solution
[07:36] <pitti> sjoerd: or do you have an idea how to accomplish this without an additional state file?
[07:37] <sjoerd> not offhand no
[07:41] <pitti> sjoerd: anyway, since that is no real regression, I will test the -t stuff now and release it
[07:41] <sjoerd> cool
[07:41] <pitti> sjoerd: but before, I just HAVE to try out X.org, sorry :-)
[07:42] <sjoerd> haha
[07:45] <Mitario> hmm, are there x.org packages for ubuntu already available? I tought I heard something like it
[07:51] <daniels> good lord, I think I just ate an entire cow
[07:52] <daniels> I am *so* *full*.  and definitely not coming back online tonight.  'night all.
[07:52] <daniels> thom: ill!
[07:52] <daniels> Mitario: not for general consumption yet as there are still no doubt many very bad bugs to work through, but look for an announcement from fabbione and I very, very soon :)
[07:52] <daniels> bah.
[07:53] <sjoerd> hehe
[07:54] <pitti> daniels: night!
[07:54] <pitti> daniels: happy digesting! :-)
[07:55] <amu> oo xorg
[07:57] <amu> daniels: you need some feedback for ppc-port ? 
[07:58] <daniels> amu: always
[07:59] <pitti> sjoerd: -t support works fine :-)
[07:59] <sjoerd> pitti: woohoo :)
[07:59] <pitti> sjoerd: anything else you'd like to see?
[07:59] <sjoerd> pitti: not executable for everyone in the debian package :)
[08:00] <pitti> sjoerd: the packaging already supports that
[08:00] <pitti> sjoerd: it's a mere variable change in the postinst
[08:00] <sjoerd> i know/saw
[08:00] <pitti> sjoerd: but which group to use?
[08:00] <pitti> sjoerd: I didn't find time yet to ask on d-devel
[08:00] <sjoerd> dunno.. you were going to send a mail remember ;)
[08:00] <sjoerd> ah
[08:00] <pitti> I'll do
[08:01] <pitti> sjoerd: BTW, are you interested in doing a source code audit?
[08:01] <pitti> sjoerd: mdz digged though a very early version, but almost everything changed since then
[08:02] <sjoerd> pitti: if you have the source available, i can probably find some time to dig through it
[08:02] <pitti> sjoerd: I'll upload it to Hoary and sid soon
[08:02] <sjoerd> k
[08:03] <sjoerd> i'm packaging hal 0.4.1, do you have stuff pending for it ?
[08:03] <pitti> not really
[08:03] <pitti> I read the announcement though
[08:03] <pitti> sjoerd: BTW, any plans to put it into Sarge?
[08:03] <pitti> sjoerd: it has run fine for some weeks now
[08:04] <sjoerd> same here
[08:04] <sjoerd> i'm planning to upload this package to sid 
[08:04] <pitti> nice 
[08:04] <pitti> brb (hopefully)
[08:07] <pitti> fabbione, daniels: congrats! Neither the upgrade, nor the restart showed any flaw!
[08:07] <pitti> fabbione, daniels: YOU ROCK!!!
[08:08] <sjoerd> would be interesting to know if xorg works on a albook, never got my selfcompiled version working..
[08:09] <sjoerd> pitti: #279395 is pending for hal currently, which i would like to have fixed..
[08:09] <sjoerd> stupid vendors.. ging different devices the same usb id's
[08:15] <Mitario> back
[08:16] <Mitario> daniels, ok, thanks, i'll look forward to the announcement :)
[08:36] <seb128> elmo: any way to get a sync for libgda2 1.1.99 (experimental) and libgnomedb 1.1.99 (experimental too) ?
[08:48] <elmo> seb128: done
[08:48] <mbb> bugzilla question - 'Assign To:' defaults to amu@tr.debian.net - should I leave that alone, change to debzilla, or ??
[08:51] <seb128> elmo: thanks
[08:52] <seb128> mbb: leave it
[08:52] <seb128> mbb: the assign to is set according to the component you have selected
[09:01] <Kamion> elmo: yes? (sorry for delay)
[09:07] <elmo> Kamion: not to worry :)
[09:07] <elmo> was going to ask about the netboot stuff, but I just reported a bug instead
[09:10] <flax07> hi there - there seems to be a known problem with install on dell c600 - to do with DMA on cdrom - can anyone advise if there is a way around to install?
[09:12] <Kamion> elmo: mmkay, ta
[09:27] <seb128> oh, a guy mailed the ubuntu-fr list with a problem with a G3 today
[09:27] <seb128> he get this on the boot with warty:
[09:27] <seb128> pivot_root: No such file or dirctory
[09:27] <seb128> /sbin/init: 429: cannot open dev/console:
[09:27] <seb128> kernel panic: attempted to kill init!
[09:27] <seb128> 
[09:27] <seb128> is that known ?
[09:29] <mjg59> lamont: As long as it's not a beige one, yeah
[09:31] <Kamion> lamont: what mjg59 said; if it's a blue-and-white or later you should be fine
[09:31] <Kamion> (modulo picky hardware detection nonsense)
[09:32] <lamont> guess it's blue.. looked more green/teal to me.
[09:32] <Kamion> seb128: that means that the initrd failed to figure out where the root filesystem is; he should file a bug on probably initrd-tools with as much information about the modules he needs to make his disks go and the filesystem he's using as possible
[09:32] <mjg59> lamont: That's what I think, but...
[09:32] <Kamion> lamont: there were various coloured models post-B&W
[09:32] <seb128> Kamion: ok, thanks
[09:32] <mjg59> Kamion: Not G3s, though
[09:32] <Kamion> lamont: sounds like newworld to me, anyway
[09:32] <Kamion> mjg59: you sure?
[09:32] <mjg59> Kamion: There were other colours in the iMac range - I don't think the G3 changed
[09:32] <Kamion> some iMac G3s were green, saith google
[09:33] <mjg59> Kamion: In Mac-speak, G3 usually means the non-iMac G3
[09:33] <mjg59> (yes, this is crack)
[09:34] <lamont> hrm.  aqua, lets call it.
[09:35] <Kamion> mjg59: yeah, I know, but (a) lamont didn't specify iMac and (b) I have no reason to believe he's deeply steeped in Mac terminology :)
[09:35] <mjg59> Are the ZORG packages available for general testing, or still just internal?
[09:35] <thom> you could just specify !beige
[09:35] <mjg59> thom: That's what I did
[09:36] <mjg59> Aww, man
[09:36] <thom> ah, so you did
[09:36] <mjg59> Half an hour to download Hoary packages
[09:36] <elmo> all your bandwidth...
[09:36] <thom> X crack is still interneal only
[09:36] <lamont> Kamion: make that "lamont is known to be very shallow in his mac terminology", and you're closer to correct.
[09:37] <mjg59> Would be an hour if I hadn't upgraded the ADSL
[09:37] <mjg59> Yay ADSL
[09:38] <mjg59> Do we have 2.6.9 yet?
[09:38] <Kamion> no
[09:38] <mjg59> Bugger
[09:38] <mjg59> That's going to make life harder
[09:38] <Kamion> dunno what the plans are there, mdz's probably in sufficiently close contact with herbert to know
[09:38] <mdz> which particular bit of life?
[09:38] <Kamion> (lo, speak of the devil and he shall appear)
[09:38] <mjg59> mdz: I want to produce test kernels for power management. 2.6.9 is the most realistic starting point.
[09:39] <mjg59> (Alternatively, I backport all the 2.6.9 PM stuff to 2.6.8...)
[09:39] <thom> Kamion: ah, that explains the walking up walls
[09:40] <mjg59> Are there any Warty kernel patches that are /required/ ?
[09:41] <Kamion> mdz: replied to #2432, btw
[09:41] <mdz> mjg59: required in order for the rest of warty to be happy?
[09:42] <mdz> if so, nothing that will cause horrible breakage
[09:44] <seb128> Kamion: the guy who has the G3 problem says that somebody else fixed the issue by building the kernel with "CMD64{3|6|8|9} chipset support" 
[09:44] <mjg59> mdz: Yeah. Ok, that makes life easier. I can just drop 2.6.9 in with the Warty config, then.
[09:44] <Kamion> seb128: reports from somebody else are rarely reliable here, since there are a number of ways that symptom can occur
[09:45] <Kamion> seb128: he can certainly try it though
[09:45] <lamont> mdz: was planning to bootstrap sbcl sometime soon, but working on component isolation first.
[09:45] <seb128> Kamion: ok
[09:47] <mdz> lamont: ok, please follow up to the list so they know that the request is pending, rather than ignored
[09:52] <lamont> mdz: replied
[09:52] <mdz> thanks
[09:56] <amu> hmm, xorg doesnt work on my ppc :(
[09:56] <thom> AAAARGH, FIREFOX YOU SUCK
[09:57] <pitti> amu: on my iBook it runs fine
[09:58] <amu> pitti: i tried with ati,vesa,fb 
[09:58] <pitti> amu: it autodetected ati for me (Radeon 9200)
[09:59] <amu> pitti: did your run changes after the reconfigure ? 
[09:59] <lamont> shotgun, even
[09:59] <pitti> amu: "run changes"? Whatever, I just upgraded the packages and restarted gdm.
[09:59] <Mithrandir> thom: still playing with firefox?
[09:59] <thom> Mithrandir: yes
[10:00] <thom> Mithrandir: ldd segfaults :/
[10:00] <Mithrandir> thom: _ew_
[10:00] <Mithrandir> how does it manage to do that?
[10:01] <Mithrandir> that requires _skillz_.
[10:02] <Kamion> holy shit, base-config/hoary didn't totally break
[10:02] <Kamion> although Desktop is uninstallable, predictably
[10:02] <Mitario> seb128, here?
[10:02] <Kamion> uh, just a mild query
[10:03] <Kamion> why the HELL does http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~cjwatson/testing/warty_probs.html have ANYTHING in it?
[10:03] <thom> Mithrandir: scary huh
[10:04] <thom> Mithrandir: ldd on /usr/lib/mozilla-firefox/libsmime3.so
[10:04] <thom> the same version is fine here
[10:04] <mjg59> What's the name of the package used for building kernel debs?
[10:05] <mjg59> As in, the source for the actual debs, not kernel-package
[10:05] <lamont> elmo about?
[10:05] <Kamion> mjg59: linux-source-2.6.8.1
[10:05] <thom> linux-image-2.6.8.1
[10:06] <mjg59> thom: linux-image doesn't seem to exist?
[10:06] <Kamion> elmo: can you pull librasqal0 and librasqal0-dev into hoary, please?
[10:06] <Kamion> mjg59: no, it's definitely linux-source-2.6.8.1
[10:07] <mjg59> Oh, no, it's part of linux-source
[10:07] <mjg59> Kamion: Thanks
[10:07] <thom> sorry, too used to just trusting apt-get source ;-)
[10:07] <Kamion> we don't do the "one source package for each architecture" thing
[10:07] <thom> Mithrandir: and the build looks the same, so goddess knows
[10:07] <mjg59> Hurrah for having a cable modem to download stuff with when I'm swamping the ADSL
[10:09] <Kamion> libgnomevfs2-common and libwvstreams3-base need to switch dependencies from libfam to libgamin
[10:09] <Kamion> that's the other reason Desktop is uninstallable at the moment
[10:10] <thom> Mithrandir: can you grab the firefox source from hoary and see if it builds for you if you have a moment?
[10:10] <Mithrandir> thom: sure, any particular platform?
[10:11] <seb128> Kamion: ok, I'll fix libgnomevfs2-common
[10:11] <Kamion> ta
[10:12] <thom> Mithrandir: just amd64
[10:12] <thom> Mithrandir: other two built fine
[10:13] <thom> and i have amd64 binaries from that source locally, so i dunno what's going on
[10:14] <thom> hrm, crested got the segfault on rc1-3, and king on rc1-3ubuntu1, so it's not the machine. ber
[10:15] <Mithrandir> freshening chroot
[10:17] <Mithrandir> thom: what's the estimated build time?
[10:20] <thom> 30 minutes or so
[10:20] <Mithrandir> ok
[10:29] <mdz> Kamion: rest up and get well
[10:37] <sjoerd> pitti: hmm if the user is running the right locale it can ofcourse..
[10:37] <pitti> sjoerd: I did not yet know that VFAT and NTFS always use Unicode
[10:37] <pitti> sjoerd: but that's actually nice :-)
[10:38] <sjoerd> pitti: do they, the guy i'm talking to says that he needs to specify iocharset=utf8
[10:38] <pitti> sjoerd: from mount(8): Character set to use for converting between 8 bit characters and 16 bit Unicode characters. The default is iso88591.  Long filenames are stored on disk  in  Unicode format.
[10:39] <pitti> sjoerd: so this means that the default is wrong for him
[10:39] <sjoerd> oh but their converted to latin..
[10:40] <pitti> sjoerd: great, I just wanted to try that out and how hal 'D's again...
[10:40] <sjoerd> hehe
[10:41] <pitti> sjoerd: hmm, I use de_DE.UTF-8 as locale, and umlauts work fine as filenames... How can I test that?
[10:41] <carlos> seb128: new metacity does "funny" things when executing a OO presentation with full screen option
[10:42] <carlos> seb128: the panel is there always althought it's hide partially by the presentation
[10:43] <sjoerd> pitti: also in long filenames ?
[10:43] <pitti> sjoerd: right, I forgot
[10:43] <sjoerd> pitti: and you can try to write with iocharset=utf-8 and then remount with default iocharset
[10:43] <thom> carlos: looks fine here
[10:43] <seb128> carlos: are you sure that's the new metacity ? no problem here
[10:44] <carlos> seb128: I think it's metacity, because it handles that, right?
[10:44] <carlos> hmm
[10:44] <carlos> let me recheck it...
[10:46] <carlos> seb128: ok, the problem seems to be the initial focus
[10:46] <carlos> seb128: the panel has the main focus until I click over the presentation
[10:47] <carlos> then, the panel is hiden
[10:47] <seb128> ok, so that's an openoffice.org problem
[10:48] <seb128> with the new focus stealing preventient mode in metacity the apps need to update their timestamp
[10:50] <Mithrandir> argh, I broke my power plug.  Again.
[10:51] <carlos> seb128: do you want a bug report ?
[10:52] <thom> Mithrandir: d'oh :(
[10:52] <thom> how did firefuck go?
[10:52] <seb128> carlos: no time for openoffice sorry, find somebody else. I've a lot to do with GNOME without starting with openoffice ...
[10:53] <carlos> seb128: I'm asking about a bug report in bugzilla :-)
[10:53] <carlos> no to fix it now
[10:54] <seb128> carlos: yes, but not assigned to me
[10:54] <Mithrandir> thom: /usr/bin/ldd: line 1: 24504 Segmentation fault      LD_TRACE_LOADED_OBJECTS=1 LD_WARN= LD_BIND_NOW= LD_LIBRARY_VERSION=$verify_out LD_VERBOSE= ${RTLD} "$file"
[10:54] <Mithrandir> dpkg-shlibdeps: failure: ldd on `debian/mozilla-firefox/usr/lib/mozilla-firefox/libsmime3.so' gave error exit status 1
[10:54] <carlos> seb128: don't worry, I use always the default value unless someone tells me other thing
[10:54] <thom> huh
[10:55] <Mithrandir> I can't get it to sigsegv by hand, though
[10:56] <thom> so wtf is dh_shlibdeps up to then?
[10:56] <Mithrandir> it just calls dpkg-shlibdeps, isn't it?
[10:56] <thom> yep
[10:57] <Mithrandir> well, calling that by hand doesn't fail
[11:00] <mdz> Mithrandir: repeatable?
[11:01] <thom> mdz: the buildds are doing the same
[11:01] <Mithrandir> mdz: the buildds and my hoary chroot makes it fall over.
[11:01] <Mithrandir> might be a chroot issue -- I can test when I get home.
[11:01] <thom> it built fine for me
[11:01] <Mithrandir> (my home box is powered off)
[11:01] <thom> but i'm just freshening a chroot to try it
[11:01] <mdz> so it blows up when building with dpkg-buildpackage, but not when you run dh_shlibdeps by hand?
[11:02] <Mithrandir> correct
[11:02] <mdz> fascinating
[11:02] <lifeless> spock!
[11:05] <mjg59> Hrngh.
[11:05] <mdz> Keybuk: around?
[11:05] <mdz> mjg59: kernel?
[11:06] <Keybuk> mdz: yup, briefly
[11:07] <mdz> Keybuk: wanted to talk with you about ongoing merges for hoary, and how we should manage them
[11:08] <Keybuk> didn't we talk about that on Tuesday?
[11:08] <elmo> Kamion: done
[11:08] <elmo> lamont: am now
[11:09] <mjg59> mdz: Yeah
[11:11] <Keybuk> mdz: will be back in an hour or so
[11:11] <mdz> Keybuk: we didn't get into specifics, did we?
[11:11] <thom> mdz: hardware database meeting? (we could just do it in LA whilst i'm there)
[11:12] <mdz> Keybuk: you said you would work on it.  are there no unresolved questions?
[11:12] <Keybuk> yeah, I'm cooking up a script that takes the "what needs merging" output, does the 3-way diff on it, and files a bug to say it needs checking and uploading
[11:12] <Keybuk> none that I know of
[11:12] <mdz> thom: when's that?
[11:12] <thom> mdz: 11-23
[11:12] <thom> of nov
[11:12] <mdz> I'm going to be away during some piece of that, but not all
[11:13] <mdz> Keybuk: what will you do with packages where a bug is already filed?
[11:13] <thom> well, i'm in vegas from the 12th to the 17th actually
[11:13] <mdz> ah, that's better then
[11:13] <Keybuk> mdz: your debzilla stuff looked like it allows you to add a comment to a bug ... I was going to do that and add a "dude, you're SO SLOW" type comment to it
[11:14] <mdz> Keybuk: what it doesn't have is a useful query interface to find a bug
[11:14] <mdz> except by alias
[11:14] <mdz> though, come to think of it, that's probably exactly what you want anyway
[11:14] <Keybuk> *nods*
[11:14] <mdz> alias merge-<source package> or such
[11:15] <mdz> with a nice database constraint to prevent any accidents
[11:15] <mdz> Keybuk: ok, I think we're sorted, then, thanks
[11:15] <Keybuk> kewl
[11:27] <mjg59> I am disappointed that Hoary has not provided me with huge amounts of crack
[11:28] <thom> oh, just wait :-)
[11:30] <seb128> thooooooooom
[11:30] <seb128> thom: you broke the typeahead in my epiphany :p
[11:31] <lamont> elmo: just deployed the ogre-model sources.lists hack on the buildds.  it should be happy, but please feel free to squawk/beat me if you see anything amiss.
[11:31] <seb128> thom: need to build firebox with the "typeaheadfind" in the mozconfig
[11:31] <thom> no way dude
[11:31] <thom> that breaks type ahead find on firefox
[11:31] <seb128> ok, so switching back to mozilla
[11:32] <thom> d'oh :/
[11:32] <seb128> I can't use a browser without a typeahead
[11:32] <elmo> lamont: neato
[11:32] <seb128> and I probably not alone
[11:32] <seb128> +'m
[11:32] <thom> seb128: indeed
[11:32] <thom> i got a metric fuckload of bugs when it broke on firefox
[11:33] <seb128> thom: why enabling "typeaheadfind" breaks the typeahead in firefox ?
[11:33] <thom> because mozilla sucks
[11:33] <thom> seb128: they moved from the typeaheadfind extension to FAYT, and if you enable typeaheadfind, it breaks FAYT, but doesn't work itself
[11:34] <lamont> elmo: what that means, oh archive god, is that all of the unknown section packages that aren't really main will FTBFS now.
[11:36] <mdz> mjg59: crack should be inbound quite soon
[11:37] <lamont> mdz: and that means that sbcl is now ready to bootstrap... but first a short break while I panic and go get the kids...
[11:37] <mdz> lamont: cool
[11:38] <mdz> do we have any means to test whether build-depends are satisfiable in main, other than trying to build everything?
[11:42] <mjg59> Argh.
[11:43] <mjg59> If I do EXPORT_SYMBOL() on something, why would I get undefined reference in... oh, christ, I'm an idiot
[11:44] <elmo> fuck's sake, how do I unbind C-l in xchat?
[11:44] <elmo> lamont: blah, sucks
[11:44] <chrisa> damn
[11:44] <chrisa> I pressed C-l out of curiosity
[11:46] <cenerentola> hi there
[11:46] <mjg59> It links!
[11:46] <cenerentola> got a big problme
[11:47] <mjg59> What's the hoary-updates list?
[11:48] <cenerentola> i did an update&&upgrade under warty...
[11:48] <mdz> elmo: probably the same way you change other keybindings in xchat: modify the hardcoded values in the source
[11:48] <mdz> but who presses C-i anyway?
[11:48] <thom> mjg59: hoary-changes@lists.ubuntu.com
[11:48] <cenerentola> and when the shell appeared... it started printing things like "dpkg could not...
[11:48] <cenerentola> "
[11:48] <cenerentola> and gnome collapsed
[11:49] <mjg59> thom: Ta
[11:49] <thom> GAR, stupid firefox just built ok in a chroot for me
[11:50] <mjg59> Ooh, update-manager exists
[11:50] <jdub> mdz: pong
[11:50] <jdub> morning all!
[11:50] <seb128> hello jdub 
[11:51] <jdub> yo seb128 
[11:51] <mdz> jdub: I still need for you to update the hoary goals page with the status of your bounty candidates
[11:51] <pitti> Hi jdub!
[11:51] <jdub> mdz: ok
[11:51] <mdz> some of those are "will be done as a bounty, have someone lined up" and others are "bounty, need to find someone", and we need to differentiate them
[11:51] <seb128> jdub: I've uploaded epiphany/firefox, but I'll probably upload epiphany/mozilla again soon so hurry up if you want to test the firefox one :)
[11:52] <jdub> seb128: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=154034
[11:52] <jdub> woo :)
[11:52] <jdub> seb128: oh? it's not good?
[11:52] <mjg59> The craptop makes nasty noises when I log out
[11:53] <seb128> jdub: no typeahead at all ... 
[11:53] <mdz> cenerentola: /topic
[11:53] <cenerentola> mdz: so?
[11:53] <mdz> cenerentola: #ubuntu is the place for support
[11:53] <seb128> jdub: need "typeaheadfind" in firefox, which breaks firefox according to thom ... and using a browser without a typeahead is a pain
[11:53] <cenerentola> they can't help me
[11:53] <seb128> jdub: so I guess I'll switch back time to find a solution
[11:54] <jdub> seb128: i think that's fairly reasonable as a development branch bug
[11:54] <jdub> seb128: if we work around bugs all the time, no one will want to fix them :)
[11:54] <mjg59> update-manager looks really, really lovely
[11:54] <mjg59> Is there a notification applet for it yet?
[11:54] <mdz> mjg59: upgrade-notifier
[11:54] <mdz> they aren't quite integrated with each other, yet
[11:55] <seb128> jdub: so we need to fix it NOW :)
[11:55] <cenerentola> mdz: i cant get you... have got a broken OS... i need all it up & running and all u can say its: not the right place?
[11:55] <seb128> jdub: I didn't notice I use the typeahead that much before
[11:55] <cenerentola> i wouldnt ask here if id not this big big big problem
[11:55] <seb128> but without it, arrrg
[11:55] <pitti> mdz: the shadow vulnerability just appeared on full-disclosure
[11:55] <jdub> seb128: ... welcome to hoary. :-)
[11:56] <seb128> ah ah
[11:56] <pitti> mdz: so I could upload now
[11:56] <mdz> pitti: go ahead
[11:56] <cenerentola> mdz: and remember that YOUR update&&upgrade broke iot
[11:56] <cenerentola> ...it
[11:57] <mdz> cenerentola: I sympathise with your predicament, but the fact that you couldn't get help elsewhere is not a reason to bring your problem to a place where it is off-topic
[11:57] <seb128> jdub: BTW cool for #154034 :)
[11:57] <mdz> cenerentola: believe me, if upgrading warty was the cause, there would be a large number of users with the same problem
[11:58] <mjg59> Oh, rocking
[11:58] <mjg59> Someone's ported the i830 framebuffer driver to 2.6
[11:59] <jdub> mdz: i would like a new glibc. can we have one? i promise to feed him and keep him warm.
[11:59] <mdz> jdub: have you talked to gotom about it?
[12:00] <mdz> leaping ahead of Debian on glibc smells faintly of crack
[12:00] <Mitario> mjg59, they will get integrated this week I reckon :)
[12:00] <thom> mdz: only faintly? you must be getting acclimatised
[12:00] <mdz> thom: it's faint after it's wafted its way up from down under