sabdflnight guys12:09
sivangnight sabdfl12:11
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sivangjdub : are we using scrollkeepr for yelp in hoary? any plans to use gnome-doc-utils ?12:16
jdubsivang: gnome-doc-utils doesn't replace scrollkeeper12:16
Mithrandirjdub: can we either get rid of scrollkeeper or get it to run faster?  it's _dog_ slow.12:19
jdubMithrandir: everyone wants to get rid of it :)12:19
jdubMithrandir: it'll happen at some stage12:19
Mithrandirjdub: well, we're at the front and doing crazy things, so I think we should do it. :)12:20
jdubit's not on our feature goal list :)12:20
Mithrandirthat's easily fixed ;)12:20
tim1i already proposed it in the wiki, but just in case: http://linux.thestreet.dk/12:21
tim1debinstaller written in python12:21
tim1i didn't fully test it but i think ubuntu needs sth. like that12:22
Mithrandiroh, debinstaller, should be a synaptic module, I think.12:24
tim1because all basic tasks should be available in a simple straight-forward gui12:24
Mithrandiryou shouldn't go around downloading random .debs, though.12:25
tim1yeah it doesn't have to be this specific implementation but their should be sth that pops up when clicking on and .deb saying what you can/should .. do/not do12:26
tim1a synaptic module would be better, i agree with that12:26
tim1hm so you don't think one should install a .deb outside apt/synaptic at all12:28
tim1speaking for the average user12:28
MithrandirI'm not sure we want people to do that, no.12:28
Mithrandir(I'm talking about what I think, this isn't the views of canonical or anything, though I'm a developer)12:28
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tim1mh ok12:30
tim1just my proposal12:30
sivangjdub : doc team is interested in bringing some worked docs to be available under yelp for hoary, scrollkeeper is our freind ? :)12:31
jdubsivang: see how the gnome documents are structured, ie. omf files, build layout, etc.12:36
jdubsivang: i imagine you guys are working on the gnome-user-guide a bit?12:36
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sivangjdub : that document yes, and I would also like to have docs that we agree on, to be available under yelp. the FAQ is already being done in DocBook..12:40
sivangjdub : this is already material which is adopted from the main documentation section on the website, and wiki.12:49
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tim1good night everybody12:53
jdubelmo: around?12:56
jdubthere is TOTAL RADNESS stuck in NEW12:59
pittijdub: what in particular?01:01
pittijdub: inotify? :-)01:01
jdubheh, i'm totally not going to be uploading kernels, dude ;)01:01
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pittijdub: but if we are at it, now that gamin is in hoary, it still uses dnotify, right?01:04
pittijdub: or do we already have a patched kernel for inotify?01:04
jdubstill uses dnotify01:05
jdubinotify is on the list for hoary kernels01:05
jdubthe only update so far has been a bugfix01:05
jdubKeybuk: ^01:06
wasabiwhere is ubuntu NEW at?01:06
wasabiwell that works.01:06
pittigood night, guys!01:07
jdubnight pitti 01:07
wasabioh that's slick.01:07
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Keybukjdub: fonts are a little *HUGE* ? :p01:08
wasabiThat's a neat idea01:08
jdubthey ought to be big, but not stupidly so01:08
jdubif you think they're buggily big, sshot it for me :)01:09
wasabiI guess it uses it's own package list?01:09
jdubwasabi: see /usr/share/gnome-app-install/01:09
wasabiSince I don't see any X-Ubuntu-Package: in the .desktop files. ;001:09
jdubthose .desktop files will be generated/pulled from the real ones later01:09
wasabiThere they are.01:09
jdubfor now, it's just some exampls01:09
wasabiYeah. That's about the coolest thing I've seen in awhile. 01:10
jdubKeybuk: you reckon they're buggily big?01:10
wasabiCool because it's usable by my mom.01:10
Keybukjdub: yeah01:10
jdubKeybuk: the other option is bold, slightly larger, and an explanation of the category01:10
jdubbut categories are stupid to explain01:10
Keybuklooks silly compared to the little fonts when you open the category01:11
Keybukoh, they're big to make the icons big? :p01:11
jdubok, i will wait for more feedback on that one ;)01:11
KeybukThe grafical user interface (xlib) does not support your chosen language environment01:11
wasabiMakes me wonder what kind of server stuff Ubuntu is going to go for.01:11
Keybukheh *boom*01:11
Keybukwasabi: "server stuff" ?01:11
jdubKeybuk: isn't that bong... so annoying01:11
wasabiWeither you'll be able to add/remove appache from that proggram... like you can do in OS X Server and Windows.01:11
wasabiFOr instance.01:11
wasabi(since all those servers are gui managed)01:12
jdubwasabi: there will be some stuff like that01:12
jdubwasabi: for instance, "LAMP Web Development"01:12
jdubthere will also be developer-oriented selections01:13
wasabiSomeday i'll figure out how to format that right.01:14
jdubwasabi: seen the libuser proposal on u-d?01:14
wasabihaven't signed up yet01:15
Mithrandirjdub: has anybody ITP-ed libuser?01:15
jdubwasabi: i'm actively thinking about these problems - glad you are too :)01:15
jdubMithrandir: no, but considering it.01:15
wasabijdub, centralized auth systems are my speciality right now. :001:15
Mithrandirjdub: me too.. basically hanging on available time.01:15
wasabiI'm tired of editing pam and nss.01:15
wasabiand creating kerberos keys. *scream*01:15
jdubMithrandir: do you think it would be acceptable in debian by default?01:16
Mithrandirjdub: not for sarge, possibly for etch.01:16
jdubMithrandir: (i think you'd be more up to maintaining it than i, btw)01:16
wasabijdub, what month was it in?01:16
jdubMithrandir: (although i could do the legwork, and you could send patches :)01:16
Mithrandirjdub: what's the upstream URL?  I only have your repo for it.01:16
jdubwasabi: last, maybe?01:16
wasabihmm. no search on the archives.01:16
jdubMithrandir: in src.rpms...01:16
Mithrandirwith new rpm being non-free and all.. phun!01:17
Mithrandir(it uses some non-free lib, iirc?01:17
wasabiThat one?01:17
KeybukMithrandir: the lib might be free01:17
wasabiOh Rock.01:17
Keybuknobody Debianish really bothered to check that thoroughly01:17
jdubwasabi: yeah, message above01:17
wasabiYeah that's exactly what im thinking about.01:18
MithrandirKeybuk: ok, I just remember that joeyh orphaned rpm because of it.01:18
wasabithat wiki thing has a walk through explaining what I think of hte process.01:18
wasabino UI mockups... those will come later.01:18
jdubwasabi: mmm, i think the infrastructure is more important for the moment anyway01:19
wasabiThe infrastructure is already done really.01:19
jdubMithrandir: want to co-maintain libuser?01:19
wasabiIt's just a matter of glueing it all together.01:19
jdubwasabi: we talked about this -> "it's the integration, stupid" :-)01:19
Mithrandirjdub: sure; you ITP it or I?01:19
jdubMithrandir: i can01:19
Mithrandirjdub: go ahead, then.01:19
wasabiTHat's what I mean jdub. We have to combine all these disparet services: Kerberos, LDAP, DNS, NSS, PAM, together into one entity. GIve it one name.01:20
wasabiAnd then it needs to work, with no fuss.01:21
Mithrandirwhere in the stack does libuser really fit in?01:22
wasabiMight be interested in the Lorikeet project.01:22
wasabiIt's an effort by a number of the Samba guys to integrate all those things into one package.01:23
wasabiClean them all up so they work perfectly together: openldap, heimdal, samba.01:23
jdubwasabi: oh?01:23
jdubwhich samba guys?01:23
wasabiabartlet told me about it01:23
wasabithink vorlon is working on it too, not sure.01:23
jdubhrm, i think i've read this01:24
wasabiIt's less a single project and more an effort to smooth all the bumbs from all the respective services so they integrate seamlessly01:25
wasabiThey've altered Heimdal to store keys in LDAP, for instance.01:25
Mithrandirjdub: drop me an URL when you have an arch archive with libuser up and I'll tag off you?01:25
jdubmmm, and now there's the password sync module in openldap, which makes life easier01:25
jdubMithrandir: heh, ok01:25
wasabiWell the end mission is to have no passwords in LDAP, to have one source: kerberos.01:26
wasabibut yeah, the password sync module is a good start. ;001:26
wasabiSo, my client gui idea is geared towards being dirt simple: in the best case it would only ask you for a user name and password.01:28
sivangjdub : so is user-conf from the gst backend going to be dropped altogether in favor of libuser and fedora's userconfig ?01:33
sivangjdub : sorry, this includes the gui also ofcourse.01:34
wasabihmm. does libuser have any docs yet?01:37
Mithrandirwasabi: there's a docs/ directory in the tarball, at least.01:38
Mithrandir: tfheen@yiwaz ../libuser-0.52.5/docs/sgml > ls -l libuser.sgml 01:38
Mithrandir-rw-r--r--  1 tfheen tfheen 8629 2004-09-28 22:48 libuser.sgml01:38
Mithrandira little bit about motivation and so on.01:38
sivangjdub : I have started some work with garanacho about adding the default privilieges groups , so it might be of interest to me :)01:40
jdubsivang: no decision so far01:43
jdubmdz: aorund?01:46
robertjwasabi: Whoever did OS X's directory stuff knew their stuff01:47
wasabirobertj, amen.01:47
robertjExcept for the quota business01:47
wasabirobertj, have you used it?01:47
wasabiEven their ACL system (NT based) is awesome.01:47
robertjIm an admin at a mostly mac school01:47
wasabiSo very well thought out.01:47
wasabi(in tiger)01:47
robertjwasabi: haven't looked at it01:48
wasabiBeats the pants off of POSIX ACLs and then some.01:48
robertjI installed tiger, checked to see if webdav workers with Nove's NetStorage yet (no), checked whether to see secure dav worked (no), and that was it.01:48
wasabiReally though, their directory stuff is just a combination of LDAP and Kerberos, hooked together with a great UI.01:48
wasabiJust like Windows.01:48
robertjwasabi: yeah. Made me very happy01:48
wasabiI think they're even using OPenLDAP as a base aren't they? I don't know that.01:48
robertjThey do use OpenLDAP with a custom schema01:49
jdubit would be nice if we had something like netinfo01:49
wasabinetinfo is deprecated no?01:49
Mithrandirjdub: netinfo is eeeeevil01:49
robertjnetinfo is just a directory service plugin now01:49
robertjand it is evil01:49
wasabiYeah. Replaced with OpenDirectory01:49
wasabinetinfo is just a front end API now.01:49
jdubhow do they do disconnected clients? ldap proxy?01:49
wasabiThat's how I read it anyways. ;)01:49
robertjjdub: they dont01:49
robertjOlD is just a frontend as well01:50
wasabijdub, probably don't. MS doesn't.01:50
wasabiANd MS has never needed to.01:50
wasabiBut, it would be neat. ;)01:50
jdubyou *can* do disconnected clients with windows01:50
robertjOpenldap, dotfiles nad netinfo all plug into the directory services architecture to actually do auth01:50
wasabino domain clients.01:50
wasabiYou mean disconnected file shares.01:50
Mithrandirjdub: I think we need something like planet, but for calendars.  Preferably with two-way synchronization.01:50
jdubno, authentication01:50
robertjjdub: that01:50
robertjer that's just cacheing01:50
jdubMithrandir: yes, have been looking at it, oddly enough :)01:51
jdubrobertj: exactly01:51
robertjpull your hard drive and put it in another machine and have it auth the machine account01:51
jdubi was under the impression that netinfo did it01:51
robertjThat will be offline directory services ;)01:51
robertjjdub: I never saw netinfo used as anything but a dotfile replacement01:51
Mithrandirjdub: gotten anywhere yet?  I've just thought about it for a week or so, after I saw schoolbell hit unstable.01:51
robertjit's badly documented, poorly understood, and has a bad rep01:51
jdubMithrandir: turns out the schooltool guys have written a fairly nice ical lib, which they're considering separating out01:52
mjg59The good news so far is that it looks like we can get away with including suspend to disk in hoary without any trouble01:52
Mithrandirjdub: ooh, that'd be great.01:52
jdubrobertj: you could flick a switch to make it auth against other services01:52
jdubmjg59: yay!01:52
Mithrandirmjg59: yay!01:52
robertjjdub: on 10.2?01:52
jdubrobertj: believe so01:52
=== Mithrandir chalks down a few beers for mjg59
Mithrandirmjg59: coming to BCN?01:52
robertjI dont think it had any gui utils for doing such01:52
mjg59Mithrandir: Doubt it - too much work to do01:52
jdubthe server did01:52
Mithrandirmjg59: shame :/01:52
robertjon Mac you take your life into yoru own hands when you stray from the gui01:52
mjg59Mithrandir: I'll be in Australia, with luc01:52
jdubmjg59: oh, when to when?01:53
robertjnot doing stuff through the gui causes things to get ugly01:53
Mithrandirmjg59: oh well, I guess that'll be fun. :)01:53
mjg59jdub: Oh, next year :)01:53
jdubmjg59: for lca?01:53
jdubwe'll all be there01:53
mjg59Still waiting to hear back about papers01:53
Kamionmjg59: which reminds me; are you planning to sign up to join the Ubuntu maintainer list?01:53
mjg59Kamion: Hrngh.01:53
mjg59Kamion: That implies a level of committment I can't current offer :)01:54
jdubKamion: tbm will take away his hair.01:54
Kamionah well, worth a try :)01:54
mjg59Kamion: For the moment I'd rather try to coordinate some stuff and make patches someone else's problem01:54
robertjlike the thing that is currently souring my day is how quotas mysteriously dissapear and quotacheck crashes01:54
Kamionjdub: to replenish his own diminishing supply?01:54
wasabiwe have no need for anything netinfo like01:55
wasabisince we have NSS01:55
mjg59Why is acpid suddenly packaged as a native package?01:55
mjg59jdub: Oh, and why does polypaudio-x11 have no binaries in it?01:55
jdubmjg59: on?01:56
robertjOS X's flexible directory architecture is completely defeated by our EITS here01:56
robertjthey run eDirectory, which is fine, except they _will_not_ add numeric uids01:56
sivangrobertj : EITS ?(this one I am not familiar with)01:57
mjg59jdub: Hoary01:57
robertjenterprise information technology services01:57
jdubdoubt it has anything to do with the xorg upload01:58
jdubbut might01:58
jdubi'll see, needs some love anyway01:58
Kamionis polypaudio in universe or something? I don't see it on my mirror?01:58
jdubKamion: universe01:58
mjg59Kamion: yeah01:58
jdubKamion: not committing to it yet :)01:58
mjg59jdub: It desperately needs an esd-style Let go of the sound device after this much inactivity option01:58
mjg59It's got an option to spawn on demand, but that only works for polypaudio clients, not legacy esd ones01:59
jdubha ha ha ha ha01:59
mjg59Suspend to RAM still looks a bit dodgy02:05
mjg59Which is a pain02:05
jdubhow can we make booting with suspend-to-disk 'just work'?02:06
mjg59Add a kernel that supports it. Add resume= to the default kernel options. Add support scripts.02:08
mjg59We probably need a few patches for some bits of hardware, but that's something that'll come up in testing02:09
jdubresume is fairly safe? :)02:11
=== jdub got the impression it wasn't
jdubbut i guess you can mkswap early on in boot02:12
jduband stuff02:12
mjg59The resume process redoes the swap signature even if resume fails02:13
mjg59The only issue is if someone boots with noresume 02:13
jdubah, right02:13
mjg59Which is DANGEROUS and BAD and they SOULDN'T BE DOING IT02:14
mjg59But yeah, it works with the craptop02:14
mjg59So it ought to work anywhere02:14
mjg59(Now that I've fixed the couple of obvious bugs)02:15
KamionI must try it with the craptop's older brother02:15
mjg59http://store.myaopen.com/proso2000.html - coooooooooooooooool02:16
mjg59Kamion: Which one is that? Your old Sony?02:16
Kamion"default kernel options" is a bit of an interesting concept BTW; we can change {grub,lilo,yaboot}-installer, but how does it work on upgrades?02:17
Kamionno, another Averatec box but rather more powerful02:17
Kamioncoooooooooooooooool> I think you misspelled "freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeak"02:18
mjg59Kamion: Oh, I know the one02:18
mjg59This isn't an averatec - it's even cheaper02:18
Kamionoh, so it is02:18
Kamionright, I meant "another Via box" I think02:18
mjg59Kamion: Re: upgrades - in theory, grub can add it itself in the postinst02:19
mjg59On the other hand, you probably don't want to do that in general02:20
Kamionyeah, semantics get a bit hairy though 'cos you're fiddling with a config file02:20
mjg59There's no real way we can autodetect which partition to resume off02:20
mjg59Swap hasn't been mounted at that point02:20
mjg59I guess it /could/ do something like RAID autostart and look for anything with the right header, but that's going to be pain02:21
jdubmjg59: i *almost* got my hands on a voyager.02:21
jdubbut i stupidly installed linux on it, and the customer wanted to keep it02:22
jdubfucking sweet machine,though02:22
robertjis disk manager an ubuntu specific tool>?02:24
jdubno, it's a gnome-system-tool02:24
robertjIt would be really great if the hal device manager ganked those tabs02:25
jdubhal device manager is really just a hal inspector02:26
jdubwe shouldn't have put it in the menu :)02:26
mjg59But seriously, guys - we need more x86 laptop testing before I try to get this stuff pushed into Hoary02:27
jdub(my fault)02:27
jdubmjg59: dude, hoary is the devel branch for testing! 02:27
robertjyeah, I used to thhink that kind of thing was needed, but I believe it's really kinda useless02:27
mjg59jdub: Yeah, but I'm not going to convince Herbert to do anything with this stuff unless I've seen it work on a decent number of machines02:27
mjg59And you need someone to do you production-ready 2.6.9 images, because isn't going to be good enough02:28
mjg59And I am *not* going to sort that shit out on PPC and amd6402:28
KamionHerbert's doing that, isn't he?02:28
Kamionis he still on contract?02:28
jdubhe is02:29
mjg59Kamion: As far as I know02:29
jdubdunno if he's doing that htough02:29
mjg59Kamion: My point was more that this stuff isn't going into, and I'm not doing you proper 2.6.9 images :)02:29
jdubmjg59: did you dump patches in bugzilla for herbert?02:29
mjg59jdub: I dumped the kernel one, yeah02:29
mjg59jdub: My current patch isn't his ideal solution, though. Someone ought to follow up to the swsusp bug and ask him whether he's happy with that or whether I should forward port his modular swsusp one02:30
robertjI'm eager to try out Ubuntu on my laptop, but the only cds I have now don't play well with my laptops' drive :(02:32
sladenokay, how do you do tables in whatever 'reStructuredText(tm)' is?02:34
sladen|| Would be nice if it just || Worked ||02:35
sivangsladen : hahah02:38
sivangsladen : was my point on the markup doc discussion..:)02:39
Kamionsladen: http://docutils.sourceforge.net/docs/user/rst/quickref.html#tables02:39
Kamionwww.zwiki.org links to help on editing which links to restructuredtext stuff02:40
mjg59sladen: If you pick moinformat or whatever, the || notation works02:40
mjg59Oh, it's hard for people to do certain types of editting on this wiki02:40
mjg59Why are all wikis more crack-addled than Euginia?02:41
sladenbeen reading that quicklist, but can't find what [Nice Cleartext link to http://ob.fus.cated.org/]  is02:44
sladenmjg59: T-shirt please.  ''I should not have to use Emacs picture-mode to edit you %$#@! wiki tables''02:47
robertjsladen: if only there was a markup language with a regular syntax that everyone knew!02:48
sivangrobertj : html ? :)02:49
mjg59I think we should invent a new one02:49
sivangstop this dudes, you're killing me :)02:49
mjg59I haven't researched any of the existing ones, but I once heard someone say that they were crap02:49
jdubmoinmoin's is nice02:50
jdubmoinmoin is nice02:50
KeybukI use Textile on my blog, it's quite nice ...02:52
KeybukMithrandir uses a Wiki-like syntax on his I think02:52
sivangmoinmoin is nice :)02:52
robertjthere needs to be some way to cooerce people into reporting comptability results ;)02:52
Keybukmy complaint about WikiSyntax is it's '''bold''' not just *bold*02:52
Keybuk/italic/ _underline_ etc.02:52
mjg59My problem with WikiSyntax is that if you try to use English it tries to interpret it as something closer to txt02:53
mjg59Ah! Capital letters! MINE MINE MINE02:53
robertjTher really needs to be a way to convert between wiki and prolog02:55
mjg59There really needs to be a way to convert between wiki and MY ARSE.02:55
mjg59I hate wikis02:59
robertjI love the concept02:59
robertjI dislike the execution02:59
robertjhopefully there will be some yummy firefox plugins03:00
bob2they're documented on the MakeWikisNotSuck page, iirc03:00
mjg59We're going to make wikis not suck by fixing them in firefox?03:01
robertjis the wiki a zwiki?03:02
mdzjdub: here now for a bit03:09
jdubmdz: mailed you03:09
mdzjdub: UML?03:09
robertjaww DTML is disabled03:20
mdzin our zwiki?03:20
robertjI think so03:20
bob2yeah, we need more markup formats03:21
robertj<dtml-var ZopeTime> didn't evaluate in a reStructuredText format03:21
Keybukchristing fuck, tla is slow03:22
=== sivang is now known as sivang_ZZzzZzzZz
=== sivang_ZZzzZzzZz is now known as sivang_sleep
jdubmdz: thanks for reply - great :)03:25
lamont_rKeybuk: you sure you're not just asking it to do a metric boatload of stuff?03:25
jdubKeybuk: not using baz yet?03:25
sivang_sleepthis wiki discussion is all too fun, however night everybody!03:25
jdub$ cat ~/bin/tla03:25
jdubfiglet -f small "USE BAZ, DICKHEAD"03:25
Keybuklamont_r: oh, I *am* making it do lots ... deliberately :p03:25
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jdubmjg59: how do you make suspend suspend without pressing the suspend button?03:43
=== lamont_r dinners
Keybukjdub: echo 3 > /proc/acpi/sleep03:54
sladenjdub: grab his latest packages and  sudo /etc/acpi/suspend.sh03:54
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Keybukman, I hate benchmarks04:20
Keybukthey take too long :p04:20
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sladenkeybuk: just fake them!  Quicker *and* more reliable...05:15
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bob2anyone know the deal with pppoe dsl and ubuntu?06:16
bob2ie, do you need just "ppp" or do you need "pppoe" from universe, too?06:16
wasabi_i think you just run that.06:16
bob2on a default install?06:17
wasabi_I hope so anyways. I installed ubuntu on a co-workers PC today and told her to go home and run that06:17
wasabi_Seems so.06:17
wasabi_It pops up and tries to detect PPPoE.06:17
wasabi_I couldn't run it all the way through since I wasn't at the premisis with the actual pppoe06:17
wasabi_but it look like it was working.06:17
wasabi_so where can I order a boxed copy of ubuntu? :)06:20
bob2send me some cash and I'll box some cds for you ;)06:20
=== lamont_r tries to decide if it's OK to just change OO.o to use libneon24 instead of libneon23, or if he should wait the 3 days it takes to build...
chrisaWeren't warty cds supposed to be shipped per the order form on the site?06:22
bob2early ones were06:22
lamont_rchrisa: any day now06:22
bob2you can login and see the status of your order06:22
lamont_rchrisa: the issue is that it takes time to burn that many CD's and package and ship them.  And that couldn't start until the release was out...06:23
chrisalamont_r: indeed06:23
fabbionemorning guys06:32
lamont_rfabbione: still Xsprinting?06:39
fabbionelamont_r: yes06:39
fabbionelast day06:39
lamont_rfabbione: does 2153 fit on daniels's list for the sprint, or must I bribe him with candy?06:40
fabbionelamont_r: we will have to ask daniels06:41
fabbioneor jdub 06:41
fabbioneto reproduce it with xorg06:41
fabbionei don't have any synaptics device here to even test it06:41
fabbioneps it's 6:40 am and my best guess is that daniels is still having hard sex with his pillow06:41
lamont_rme neither.  but the nice man who's letting me sleep on his sofa does.06:41
lamont_rhe's even willing to test.06:42
fabbionewell if he can test with X.org that would be nice06:42
fabbionethere is a detailed readme for the setup...06:42
fabbionelet me find it06:42
fabbionezless /usr/share/doc/xorg-driver-synaptics/README.gz06:43
fabbioneit explains how to enable the shmconfig in xorg.conf06:43
lamont_rcan one just install xorg, or is it best to just go to hoary?06:46
fabbionei think you need an extra package to install xorg in warty06:46
fabbionebut definetely i suggest a dist-upgrade06:46
fabbionepulling all the libs manually is a pain06:46
lamont_rhe's upgrading now06:47
fabbionelamont_r: nice06:49
fabbionelamont_r: i am stocked with the sparc port06:51
fabbionegcc doesn't build correctly06:51
lamont_rfabbione: test failures?06:51
fabbionea lot of them06:52
fabbionei don't think it is good to ignore them06:52
mdzmorning, fabio06:53
fabbioneExecuting on host: /build/sparcbuildd/gcc-3.3-3.3.5/build/gcc/g++ -shared-libgcc -B/build/sparcbuildd/gcc-3.3-3.3.5/build/gcc/ -nostdinc++ -L/build/06:53
fabbionesparcbuildd/gcc-3.3-3.3.5/build/sparc-linux/libstdc++-v3/src -L/build/sparcbuildd/gcc-3.3-3.3.5/build/sparc-linux/libstdc++-v3/src/.libs -B/usr/spar06:53
fabbionec-linux/bin/ -B/usr/sparc-linux/lib/ -isystem /usr/sparc-linux/include -g -ffunction-sections -fdata-sections -fmessage-length=0 -DDEBUG_ASSERT -DLO06:53
fabbioneCALEDIR="/build/sparcbuildd/gcc-3.3-3.3.5/build/sparc-linux/libstdc++-v3/po/share/locale" -nostdinc++ -I/build/sparcbuildd/gcc-3.3-3.3.5/build/sparc06:53
fabbione-linux/libstdc++-v3/include/sparc-linux -I/build/sparcbuildd/gcc-3.3-3.3.5/build/sparc-linux/libstdc++-v3/include -I/build/sparcbuildd/gcc-3.3-3.3.506:53
fabbioneckward -I/build/sparcbuildd/gcc-3.3-3.3.5/src/libstdc++-v3/testsuite /build/sparcbuildd/gcc-3.3-3.3.5/src/libstdc++-v3/testsuite/17_intro/header_cer06:53
fabbionerno.cc   -g -O2 -DDEBUG_ASSERT  -L/build/sparcbuildd/gcc-3.3-3.3.5/build/sparc-linux/./libstdc++-v3/testsuite -lv3test -lm   -o ./header_cerrno.exe 06:53
fabbione   (timeout = 450)06:53
fabbionecompiler exited with status -106:53
fabbioneoutput is:06:53
lamont_rfabbione: talk about spam....06:53
fabbionespawn failed06:53
fabbionehey mdz06:53
lamont_rfabbione: oh - that06:54
fabbioneplenty of them06:54
fabbioneall the way trough06:54
lamont_rfabbione: fix the perms on /dev/pts /dev/ptmx06:54
fabbionelamont_r: ah06:54
fabbionels -las ptmx 06:55
fabbione0 crw-rw-rw-  1 root tty 5, 2 Sep 18 15:18 ptmx06:55
fabbionethere are no pts/*06:55
mdzfabbione: are you using static /dev or udev?06:56
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fabbionemdz: static. it's in a chroot06:56
mdzwith static /dev you need to mount devpts06:56
lamont_rmdz: thanks - I knew it was somethign like that06:56
lamont_rfabbione: that's probably the issue06:57
lamont_relmo can probably tell you what we had to do to fix the build daemons06:57
fabbionelamont_r: if it is only question of mounting and changing the permissions.. that's easy06:58
lamont_ryeah - I can't remember what it was, but it was a trivial fix that we finally found - I might be able to find it in my email archive06:59
fabbionebecause it's like.. hmmmm a week that i am fighting with it?07:00
lamont_rfabbione: if it helps, elmo and I bounced against it for a couple months or so...07:00
fabbioneso i am not completely dumb, if that's what you are saying ;)07:01
fabbionewith udev they fails 100 times faster07:04
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fabbionelamont_r: can you check in the buildd /dev if it has been fixed with static entries or dynamic?07:14
fabbionekinda: what is the best solution?07:15
lamont_rfabbione: has /dev/pts mounted in the chroot07:15
fabbionelamont_r: thanks07:16
fabbionelamont_r: do you suggest having /proc in the chroot?07:17
fabbioneor do it on a case by case base?07:18
lamont_rfabbione: certainly have /proc mounted in the chroot - things fail otherwise07:18
lamont_r(procps being the notable example...)07:18
lamont_rhaving said all that, I need to get /dev/pts in hoary and the other chroots on all the buildd's...07:19
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lamont_rfabbione: let me know (email preferrably) if that fixes the gcc build issue - I'm not 100% sure that's it.08:37
=== lamont_r will be off tomorrow
fabbionelamont_r: i did try to run mkcheck and they were passing fine08:37
lamont_ronline off-and-on fri afternoon-sunday evening08:37
lamont_rfabbione: sigh08:37
fabbionei am fixing the chroots now08:37
lamont_rok.  time to fix all the buildd's then08:37
fabbioneand i will re-sbuild gcc as first08:38
fabbionelamont_r: just wait that i complete the tests08:38
fabbionewhat i did was to run udev and chmod stuff here and there08:38
fabbionei need to test the pts solution08:38
fabbioneit was just a quick and dirty hack08:38
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ironwolfdaniels: 2153 is fixed.  SHMConfig works with synaptics and synclient and tap touching. many thanks.09:32
fabbioneironwolf: he did nothing :-)09:33
fabbionejust sitting on his chair to keep is bottom warm :P09:33
fabbioneMithrandir: you around?09:33
Mithrandirfor a little bit09:34
fabbioneMithrandir: 3291?09:35
ironwolfwell I'm glad it works. :)09:36
Mithrandirfabbione: I've seen it, but a lot of people seems to have problems with them.. considering waiting until Debian releases a new version as well.09:37
danielsfabbione: do you want the patch I'm doing a final diff on, or not? :P09:37
danielsironwolf: no worries dude :) glad to hear it's all good09:38
fabbioneMithrandir: ah ok.. thanks09:38
fabbioneMithrandir: i saw the debian package coming in.. but i didn't check the bts yet09:38
fabbionedaniels: yes... speed up kid :P09:39
Mithrandirfabbione: oh, we can certainly package what comes from upstream, most of the people complaining were tnt2 and mx440 users.09:39
fabbioneMithrandir: no.. let's wait09:39
fabbionei saw 2 versions from upstream09:39
Mithrandirit's snowing! :))09:39
fabbionein a raw09:39
fabbioneso perhaps the last on fixes the breakage09:40
fabbionebut we can certainly wait a few more days09:40
fabbioneMithrandir: cool09:40
fabbionenot here... yet...09:40
ironwolfdaniels: now to get the battery monitor thingy working....09:41
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danielsmjg59: when you wake up -- do you agree that not switching back to the previous VT on exit is sane behaviour for -novtswitch?10:03
danielsmjg59: to me, -novtswitch implies 'bugger off, I'll deal with the switching, keep your grubby hands off it'10:03
bob2hm, should gpg be setuid these days?10:04
mdzbob2: nope10:05
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mvo_hey mdz 10:06
mvo_still awake ;) ?10:07
bob2hrm, it's whinging about using insecure memory tho10:07
mdzmvo_: yes, I need to fix that shortly10:07
mdzbob2: are you not running an Ubuntu kernel?10:07
mvo_bob2: AFAIK gpg does no longer need to be suid because the 2.6.9 contains a api to get small secure memory10:07
mdzmvo_: Ubuntu has the same patch10:08
bob2mdz: hoary default10:08
mvo_mdz: must be pretty late in your part of the world already :)10:08
mvo_mdz: ah, cool!10:08
bob2mvo_: hm, I thought it was using capabilities or something10:08
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mdzbob2: hmm, I use gpg about a billion times per day, and don't get that warning10:09
mdz(and it isn't setuid)10:09
bob2I only just noticed it today10:09
mdzbob2: strace it?10:09
bob2ah, good idea10:09
mdzbob2: are you really really sure you're running the right kernel?10:09
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mdzhow odd10:11
mdzI don't think I've actually tried it on powerpc, but it would be very strange if it were broken there10:11
bob2yeah, I'm sure it wasn't saying it before10:11
bob2does the patch require me to be in a magic group or something (grasping at straws)?10:11
mdzbob2: aha10:11
danielsbob2: works on my x40 ;)10:11
mdzbob2: the patch touches include/asm-<arch>/resource.h10:12
=== bob2 radiates hate at daniels
mdzbob2: for pretty much every arch except powerpc10:12
bob2mdz: hah10:12
mdzbob2: please file a bug, component 'linux'10:12
daniels-rw-r--r--  1 daniels daniels 247M 2004-11-12 10:09 013_novtswitch.diff10:12
bob2mdz: sure10:12
danielsmaybe I should try that diff again10:12
mdzdaniels: yeah, maybe10:12
bob2mdz: thanks!10:12
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danielsmdz: it's single-handedly larger than all of xfree86's debian/patches, believe it or not ;)10:14
Micksaheh, do a patch on xfree86 that replaces it with xorg10:16
mdzdaniels: it's nearly as big as all of xfree8610:16
pittiKamion: Hi!10:16
pittiKamion: What do you think is better? Implementing the language packs as tasks or metapackages?10:17
danielsmdz: you tend to get patches that big when you diff full source X source trees against directories that don't exist :P10:17
=== daniels stares at a patch in the fd.o Bugzilla.
danielsguys, 1989 called, it said something about a UNIFIED CONTEXT DIFF10:17
pittiKamion: I thought a bit over it, and tasks almost seems a bit more elegant to me10:17
mdzpitti: the only thing about tasks is that it's much less straightforward to propagate changes10:18
mdzto installed system10:18
pittimdz: right10:18
pittimdz: you mean if we get a completely new software that also has language packs?10:18
pittithat's true10:18
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pittiNight mdz10:30
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trukulofabbione, jdub: r u awake?10:33
fabbionetrukulo: yes?10:34
trukulo:) ok, i wanna talk about matar10:35
trukulocome to #ubuntu-offtopic or private?10:35
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pittiMorning seb128!10:45
seb128hello !10:46
pittielmo: do we have a warty dchroot somewhere that I can use?10:46
mvo_hi seb128, hi pitti 10:46
pittielmo: no, a hoary one. Sorry10:46
pittiHi mvo_!10:47
trukulohi seb10:48
fabbionepitti: ping10:51
pittifabbione: pong. Hi, howdy?10:52
fabbionepitti: hey..10:52
fabbionepitti: 280233 and 28087110:52
fabbione(from debian)10:52
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ddaamjg59: hey10:53
ddaat42p kernel testing update10:54
ddaaUsing debs fresh from your page.10:54
ddaa1. suspend-to-ram: okay10:54
ddaa2. suspend-to-disk: mostly okay10:54
bob2how fast does to-ram eat your battery?10:54
ddaamostly: on wakeup, i get this message (copied from dmesg):10:56
ddaaeth1: Coming out of suspend...10:56
ddaaipw2200: failed to send TX_POWER command [5 times] 10:56
ddaaipw2200: Unable to initialize device after 5 attempts.10:56
bob2does it work fine if you rmmod before suspend, then modprobe afterwards?10:57
ddaaTo get the wireless to work again, I have to "rmmod ipw2200; modprobe ipw2200".10:57
bob2ah, right10:57
ddaaExternal video seems to work. I guess the external video resolution configuration is an X issue now.10:58
pittifabbione: odd thing. Do you know of similar reports about the sid version?10:58
fabbionepitti: no10:58
pittifabbione: I did not test apache in an UML, though10:58
ddaamjg59: and, finally, the suspend-to-disk key is inneffective, I have to run the hibernate script by hand.10:59
fabbionepitti: note that both of them are in UML env10:59
fabbionepitti: i don't think it breaks in normal env10:59
pittifabbione: I never noticed that, too10:59
ddaabob2: last time I checked, it was similar to daniels report, 10% per 8 hours.10:59
pittifabbione: I have a test apache running on my ancient p60 server and it works fine :-)10:59
bob2ddaa: oh, awesome11:00
pittifabbione: however, Joey's and my patches could be compared11:00
ddaabob2: or something of that order. I have not tested with that new kernel though.11:00
fabbionepitti: aren't they the same?11:00
fabbioneor better..11:00
fabbionethey should be the same11:00
pittifabbione: not at all11:01
ddaabob2: yeah, awesome. It's very close to fully functional, and it beats the crap out of desktop in computing power.11:01
fabbionepitti: uh?11:01
fabbionepitti: oh right.. you patched 1.3.3311:01
fabbioneor .3111:01
pittifabbione: the second report is about apache-ssl11:01
pittifabbione: http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/main/a/apache-ssl/apache-ssl_1.3.26.1+1.48-0woody3/changelog11:01
fabbionesame patch to both of them?11:01
pittifabbione: these are completely different CANs11:01
pittifabbione: I have to look11:02
fabbionepitti: ok11:02
=== pitti scratches his head
pittifabbione: I fixed -0940 in 1.3.3111:03
pittifabbione: Matt fixed -0492 in 1.3.26-0woody511:03
pittifabbione: Joey fixed 0839, 0840, 0843 in -ssl11:04
pittifabbione: the latter ones are already fixed in 1.3.3111:04
pittifabbione: but it might be that -0940 is still missing in woody (but I notified Joey...)11:04
fabbioneit sounds like a big mess to me11:05
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pittisjoerd: Hi!11:27
pittisjoerd: here?11:27
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mjg59ddaa: Yeah, the suspend to disk key requires ibm-acpi12:11
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sjoerdpitti: i am now12:28
sjoerdpitti: morning :)12:28
pittiHi! Back from lunch...12:37
ChrisHHey... does anyone happen to know how far the hotel will be from the tecnocampus?12:37
pittisjoerd: I still have the problem that I must integrate the --async switch of pmount into the GUI12:38
pittisjoerd: but AFAIK upstream has its own idea for this problem, right?12:38
pittisjoerd: AFAIK they automatically mount async if the size is bigger than a treshold12:39
pittisjoerd: how do you do this in Debian?12:39
pittisjoerd: it should be configurable, preferably in the g-v-m dialog12:39
jdubhey hey hey!12:39
pittiHey jdub12:40
rburtonyo yo jdub12:47
rburtonjdub: i'll do a new deb of AppInstall with the gksudo changes now if you want12:47
ChrisHWell... I'll figure it out somehow. :)12:47
jdubrburton: ok :)12:48
=== Kamion attempts to regenerate the .jigdo files for warty
Kamionthis has been made a touch more painful by the fact that four packages from the CDs have moved to pool/universe/ since warty was released :)12:50
rburtonjdub: gksu isn't passing pipes to child processes -- i can't do gksu synaptic and pipe into it12:51
rburtongksudu even12:51
jduboh yeah12:52
mvo_I could add a option to read the selections from a file?12:52
rburtonfixing gksu(do) would be better12:52
mvo_oh, certainly :)12:52
jdubmaking them not kill tty and stuff would be nice too12:52
=== Kamion decides to just temporarily fudge the mirror; pretend you didn't see anything
mvo_rburton: is your deb available somewhere public?12:53
rburtonmvo_: burtonini.com/debian/unstable12:54
rburton /debian has APT lines12:54
seb128rburton: just ping kov to get gksu(do) fixed :)12:54
rburtonah, kov wrote it. fab12:54
seb128yeah, and usually he's pretty fast to deal with bugs reported12:55
mvo_and ask him to return 1 as exitcode if the password is wrong  :)12:55
=== mvo_ added a patch to the debian bts
jdubelmo: ping12:58
jdubrburton: i uploaded the other one too12:58
jdubbut it hasn't got past NEW12:58
rburtonjdub: cool12:58
mvo_rburton: it looks great! 12:59
jdubit's fricken amazingly brill12:59
mvo_you may want to add "--hide-main-window" when calling synaptic :)12:59
rburtonmvo_: my synaptic doesn't support it yet iirc01:00
rburton(on sid here)01:00
mvo_do you use the warty version?01:00
mvo_oh, on sid. sure :)01:00
=== mvo_ needs to make a new release :/
jdubrburton: you could check the version ;)01:00
rburtonmvo_: hm, according to strings my synaptic does have it. sweeeet01:00
rburtonmvo_: what version did it appear in?01:02
mvo_I think in 0.5501:02
mvo_don't add a version check :)01:02
rburtonno, for the Depends:01:02
=== mvo_ checks
jdubelmo just let it in01:04
rburtongo elmo01:05
jdubseb128: the evo launcher is in gnome-panel?!01:05
=== rburton braces himself for bug reports
jdubseb128: couldn't we patch ours in to do the right version things?01:05
jdubseb128: in the evo package itself?01:05
seb128jdub: the panel default layout is01:05
seb128jdub: the panel config includes some .desktop01:05
jdubthat one :)01:06
jdubgotcha :)01:06
seb128ok :)01:06
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pittiHi sivan!01:23
sivangHey Pitti!01:23
robtayloramu: ping?01:26
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=== Kamion beats jigdo-lite
Kamionit doesn't present the "choose a mirror" option unless you have "Debian:" or "Non-US:" in the jigdo's [Parts]  section01:30
Kamionso we can't do Ubuntu:01:30
danielsmjg59: ping01:52
danielsmjg59: please email libv@skynet.be the lspci -vvv output for the video hw on the craptop, ccing myself (d.s@c.c)01:52
KamionSuccessfully created `warty-release-install-i386.iso'01:52
mjg59daniels: Ok, just booting it02:13
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mjg59daniels: Just the video hardware?02:15
danielsmjg59: yah02:15
danielsKamion: cool :)02:16
danielscheers dude02:19
=== hornsleep is now known as hornbeck
daniels'Elitegroup Computer Systems'02:20
danielsthat instils so much confidence it hurts02:20
ddaamjg59: is there a particular reason why ibm-acpi is not included in your kernel/modules packages?02:22
mjg59ddaa: Because I didn't add the patch :)02:26
mjg59daniels: ECS have a long and proud tradition of producing shit02:26
ddaa:) When do you expect to have the time to add it?02:26
mjg59ddaa: Possibly over the weekend02:26
danielsmjg59: they've been around for more than like four weeks?02:26
mjg59daniels: Yeah02:26
danielsoh dear.02:27
ddaaAlso, it seems that there is an issue with hotplug. My usb drive was not automounted. I will give you more data as soon as I can come around testing that properly.02:27
Kamionwhat were they selling then, Spectrums?02:27
chrisaECS, PCChips, PCWave02:28
chrisaSame difference, all utter crap02:28
chrisaBeen around years, custom build shops love them because they can sell cheap, integrated barebones systems02:28
danielschrisa: you forgot 'shit', apparently02:28
chrisadaniels: Figured it was implied02:29
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stratusdaniels, did you read my mail?02:45
danielsyeah, haven't had time to fix it though02:46
danielsthat was literally a three-minute job02:46
danielsif that02:46
stratusdaniels, np ;)02:48
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stratusdaniels, i haven't looked too deep but xcompmgr seems to be ok, transset was in that state.02:49
danielsyeah, xcompmgr seems to work for most people02:49
stratusdaniels, and i've tested my transset here to make fun of some co-workers, it's ok too.02:50
stratuswfm (slowly, of course)02:51
jdubnoice'n'fast with nvidia ;)02:51
stratusdaniels, i've a i845g at my desktop can i speed up it anyway?02:52
danielsi'm not entirely sure if i845g accelerates anything beyond rectangle fills :P02:52
stratushaha, i checked the logs and i think that the rectangle fills are "accelerated". :(02:53
jdubdaniels: http://www.gnome.org/~jdub/blog/110026697902:54
danielsif you want solid, reasonably reliable video output, get an i8xx02:54
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danielsif you want anything resembling 'fast', or 'featureful', get ati02:55
stratusdaniels, i'm not a gamer but i want to use composite and damage in the near feature.02:55
Mithrandirdaniels: .. and if you are on amd64, don't get ATI. :)02:56
jdubstuff this 'hardware support list' business02:56
jdublet's write a hardware buyer's guide for ubuntu02:57
stratusis it serious?02:57
pittielmo: here?03:00
danielsjdub: bring your gloves to mataro, we'll sort ati vs nvidia out properly ;)03:00
danielsMithrandir: 3d is for weenies03:00
danielsMithrandir: but r2xx works just fine anyway03:00
danielsMithrandir: so kwitcherbitchin03:00
stratusdaniels, can you add a micro computer to the 'hardware buyer's guide' ? http://davidguy.brinkster.net/computer/001.html03:01
=== Mithrandir ponders grabbing a dvd recorder on his way home.
=== jdub doesn't like nvidia
Mithrandirjdub: I don't like nvidia, but nobody else seems to care about 3d on amd64, so..03:02
stratusjdub, what video card are you using? ati?03:02
jdubstratus: nvidia on my desktop/test machine, used to be ati. i855 on my laptop03:03
seb128jdub: do we have an official "minimum hardware requirement" somewhere ?03:03
stratusjdub, hmm and composite works well with your nvidia at desktop? btw, what nvidia?03:03
jdubi forget03:03
stratusseb128, hi i'm the guy that's crashing evolution! :)03:04
jdub0000:03:00.0 VGA compatible controller: nVidia Corporation: Unknown device 0343 (rev a1)03:04
jdubcomposite works nicely03:04
stratusjdub, :)03:04
seb128stratus: oh ok, it doesn't crash in gdb so ?03:04
stratusi'll test at home, i was talking about my i845g at work.03:04
stratusseb128, it freezes with that gdb output that i've attached to the bug report.03:05
seb128this one is not while hitting "[", right ?03:05
stratusno, no03:05
seb128]  I mean03:06
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stratusseb128, i'm talking about #363403:06
mwh_hi, im wondering if one can use oss in ubuntu? my sndcard doesnt seem to work with alsa03:06
seb128stratus: oups, sorry, there is a second bug about a crash03:06
stratusseb128, np03:06
seb128stratus: I don't have this problem neither03:06
danielsjdub: WOAH03:07
stratusseb128, hmm...03:07
danielsjdub: pia has blingmouth now?03:07
jdubdaniels: hard core.03:07
seb128stratus: you're on i386 right ?03:07
stratusseb128, yes i'm.03:07
seb128stratus: ok, I'll follow upstream with the backtrace03:07
stratusseb128, thanks hope that helps the guys there.03:08
danielsjdub: ill03:08
stratusseb128, let me know if you need more debugging.03:08
seb128stratus: ok, thanks03:08
danielsjdub: but why is it not gold?03:08
danielsoh man03:08
danielsa tooth in the shape of a $03:08
danielsthat would be so phat03:08
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Mitarioello everyone03:14
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sjoerdpitti: async mount is a property in hal's database03:19
sjoerdpitti: so our pmount hal wrapper to be will pass it to pmount03:20
pittisjoerd: is there an easy way of changing the default property setting by g-v-m=03:20
sjoerdpitti: no should there ?03:21
sjoerdpitti: i guess, that's where the persistent hal db props stuff comes into play..03:21
pittisjoerd: well, it could be nice if users can easily configure this03:21
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sjoerdpitti: currently i want to actually go back to the upstream g-v-m ui, so it's translated nicely (as far as it's translated in gnome cvs)03:22
pittisjoerd: you mean without the two new options (Mount static drives on session start, Mount removable drives when hot-plugged)?03:23
pittisjoerd: I already forgot again the difference between the second and the third option03:24
pittisjoerd: it's too confusing, this must go away03:24
sjoerdpitti: only the first is patched into it03:24
fabbionepitti, sjoerd: i have a dbus/hal question03:24
sjoerdpitti: you will be able to configure in a hal fdi if you really want too03:24
fabbionedo you have to minutes to dedicate to me?03:25
sjoerdpitti: i've sent a patch to gnome's utopia list for that some time ago..03:25
pittifabbione: who? 03:25
sjoerdpitti: so the gui is default again03:25
fabbioneboth of you03:25
sjoerdfabbione: fire away03:25
pittisure, for my part03:25
fabbioneok let's put in this way03:25
=== pitti waits eagerly
fabbione /dev/input/myvolatilekeyb0 is a symlink to /dev/input/event003:26
fabbionenow if i unplug my keyboard and plug it back03:26
fabbionethat might get associated to dunno.. eventX03:26
=== silbs [~sbsm0084@host217-37-231-28.in-addr.btopenworld.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel
pittiHi silbs03:26
fabbioneis thare anything that hal and dbus can do to restore the link to the proper event device?03:27
fabbionei can see dbus/hal can see the event happening03:27
pittiwhat is setting the symlink in the first place?03:27
fabbioneright now me manually03:27
fabbionei am just asking03:27
fabbioneto understand if i need to write my own little daemon03:27
sjoerdthat's a dbus/kernel issue mostly03:27
fabbioneor i can use dbus/hal03:27
sjoerdargh, udev/kernel03:27
pittiAFAICS it should work to write a hal callout03:28
sjoerdpitti: not with hal running as non-root03:28
pittiif hal can tell the devices apart?03:28
pittisjoerd: right, you need a suid-root wrapper hten03:28
fabbioneit needs to run as root...03:28
sjoerdand having hal muck around in /dev/ is fugly, that's udev space imho03:28
fabbioneor similar03:28
pittifabbione: hal is actually not meant to _change_ anything in the system03:28
sjoerdyou could probably make a udev script to do that03:28
pittiif udev can tell the devices apart, I'd prefer an udev rule03:29
pittisjoerd: but does udev actually know which eventX belongs to which physical device?03:29
pittifabbione: as long as there is a sysfs attribute that differs your keyboard from all the other stuff, it's easy03:30
sjoerdpitti: no but udev knows which eventX entry is gonna create.. though03:30
pittifabbione: the rule can specify "%s{sysfs_attribute_name}" to match a particular device03:30
fabbionebut that means that if i change keyboard type03:31
sjoerdfabbione: what's the important one btw which eventX it is or the symlink to the right eventX03:31
fabbionei need to update that entry?03:31
fabbionesjoerd: once i know what eventX is.. recrating the symlink is easy03:31
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sjoerdfabbione: i ment, you don't need your keyboard to be event0 specifically ?03:33
fabbionesjoerd: not at all03:33
fabbionemy keyboard is the "symlink"03:33
fabbioneso i don't want to change it everytime i unplug or plug it03:33
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fabbionei just want the symlink updated to the proper eventX03:34
sjoerdthen it's just a way to have udev recognize what is your keyboard03:34
fabbionei guess i will have to look into it03:35
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mirakwhat is the difference between doing sudo and su -c ?03:37
ddaaauthentication is handled differently03:40
ddaasudo is more convenient and more flexible03:40
mirakoups sorry, wrong channel03:41
mirakbut thanks for the answer03:41
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ddaamjg59: I'm zeroing on the "usb drive won't automont" problem.03:43
ddaaIt works okay after a reboot, a ram-wakeup or a disk-wakeup.03:43
pittisjoerd: is it just me, or did the g-v-m reaction to USB drive plugs slooooow in the last time also for you?03:43
pittisjoerd: mounting is quite fast, but then it needs about 10 to 15 seconds to show nautilus windows03:44
ddaaBut, it won't work after "ifdown eth1; rmmod ipw2200; modprobe ipw2200; ifup eth1" even if that's the only thing done after a reboot,03:44
ddaaIf you want, I can try to figure out what's the precise command that's breaking.03:44
sjoerdpitti: i only have camera's to test with, so i don't really know03:45
sjoerdpitti: it used to be the wait on sysfs props03:45
sjoerdbut it's a long time ago since i last profiled is03:45
pittisjoerd: ah, I see the new property "volume.policy.mount_option.sync"03:46
pittisjoerd: this should be read out by the pmount hal wrapper, right03:46
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sjoerdin storage-policy.fdi it's configured03:48
pittisjoerd: okay, then we need to change g-v-m to pass the hal UUID instead of (or in addition to) the device name03:52
sjoerdyeah, uhm, maybe both, need to play with it a little03:57
sjoerddepends how/if pmount searches fstab :)03:58
pittisjoerd: btw, what do you think about tarball.mk of cdbs? I like it a lot04:03
sjoerdhrm for my fixed disk ``fix'', gvm should search fstab already... seems that it needs to be worked out a little04:04
=== sjoerd doesn't know what it is
pittisjoerd: it keeps the package dir clean, it prevents you from accidentially changing source files and you can use dbs-edit-patch04:04
pittisjoerd: it means that the original source tarball is kept as it is04:04
pittisjoerd: so, in hal-0.4.1/, you only have hal-0.4.1.tar.gz and debian/04:04
pittisjoerd: and the actual building is done in debian/build-tree/hal-0.4.1/04:04
pittisjoerd: just like dbs04:05
sjoerdso if you do apt-get source you get a tarball in it...04:05
pittisjoerd: right04:05
pittisjoerd: I like it and I wanted to ask you whether you know it and consider packaging hal with it04:05
sjoerddon't like that part of it04:06
sjoerdbut if the pro's are outweighing it04:06
pittithe nice thing is, you can mess around in the build-tree, try changes04:06
pittiand if you have found a solution, just wipe the build-tree and start to package it properly04:07
pittiand dbs has a nice script dbs-edit-patch which can be used with cdbs+tarball too04:07
sjoerdthat sounds like how i use svn-buildpackage 04:07
pittisjoerd: well, it probably needs a tryout04:07
Mitariomvo_, here?04:16
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sivangseb128 : was yelp bug fixed?04:23
seb128the only one on yelp ? :)04:24
sivangseb128 : could you send me again the nunber? I can't find on the b.u.c..04:24
seb128if you provide some details04:24
seb128we are several bug on yelp04:24
seb128so which one ?04:24
seb128sivang: [Bug 3557]  yelp seems unable to display some documents <- this one ?04:26
seb128(grrr people who ping you with no details on what they want, don't answer when you ask for details and run away)04:27
sivangseb128 : no , sorry! Yes, well mine was a duplicate of that, but I included the stdout output..04:28
seb128sivang: I don't have the same output04:30
seb128sivang: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=15794304:30
mvo_Mitario: yep04:31
sivangsivang : Were you referring to the db2html.xml import / missing error?04:33
sivangseb128 : Were you referring to the db2html.xml import / missing error?04:33
seb128sivang: yes04:34
sivangseb128 : hmm, when I test it now, I see the some of the development docs are viewable, but most of the user stuff is not..I am able to reproduce this stdout error every time..04:35
seb128sivang: what do you call "user stuff" ?04:35
seb128sivang: in fact the bugzilla.gnome bug is from jhbuild04:36
sivangseb128 : almost everything under 'Desktop'04:36
sivangseb128 : and 'Applications'04:41
mirakI just realised that the ati drivers where removed because they depends of Xfree8604:41
seb128sivang: I get this in the console:04:42
seb128(yelp:6896): Yelp-CRITICAL **: get_doc_type: assertion `mime_type != NULL' failed04:42
mirakcan this drivers work with xorg ? or is it just a dependcies problem ?04:43
sivangseb128 : hmm..mine's a bit different, (yelp:7520): GLib-GObject-CRITICAL **: g_object_unref: assertion `G_IS_OBJECT (object)' failed04:44
lamont_rseb128: apparently upgrading to hoary breaks the evo-launcher in the panel?04:46
Mitariomvo_, thanks for the apt upload :)04:46
Mitariomvo_, any word from gustav?04:46
Mitario(or whats his name again)04:46
ChrisHlamont_r: Even worse... there does not seem to be a working exchange plugin for the new version of evolution. :)04:46
sivanglamont_r : yes, I'm having this also...04:46
sivangBunch of other things also broke..hoary is progressing faster then sid I gues..04:47
seb128lamont_r: should be fixed with gnome-panel 2.9.1-0ubuntu204:48
mvo_Mitario: not yet04:49
seb128sivang: I've this one too but before getting an error while trying to view a doc04:49
mvo_Mitario: I'm still waiting ...04:49
sivangseb128 : ok, maybe I should talk with shaunm about this..04:49
Mitariomvo_, ok :)04:49
seb128sivang: good idea :)04:50
=== Mitario going home
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Mitariohi all :)05:20
mvo_hi Mitario 05:21
Mitariohmm, just tested gnome-app-install, works nice :)05:31
mvo_and looks nice!05:40
mvo_rburton did a great job 05:40
Mitarioindeed :)05:41
seb128it doesn't work fine here05:43
seb128but it looks nice :)05:43
Mitariowell header fonts could be a bit smaller, but i think it looks and works great! :D05:44
seb128it complains about my locales05:45
seb128and about not being root05:45
=== lamont_r wanders off for a bit
Astharothi mdz 06:24
seb128hello mdz 06:24
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mdzI think procmail just ate all of my mail overnight06:28
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makostratus: jeu tjere07:09
stratusmako, what? :|07:09
makowait.. hey there!07:09
makosorry.. fingers were off a row07:09
stratusmako, np. heh07:09
ChrisHDoes anyone know about the status of the exchange-backend for the new evolution in Hoary?07:09
mdzseb128 or jdub probably would07:18
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=== lamont_r heads to the conference. later
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mdzdaniels: if I could get copies of your maildir archives for the past 13 hours, that would be fabulous07:43
danielswhat's the find recipe for ctime in the last 13h?07:45
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mdz-ctime -13h07:47
mdzmaybe not07:47
mdzI think it can only do days07:47
mdzoh, you can do fractional days I believe07:47
mdzdaniels: give me the past 24h, and I'll filter from there07:48
danielsdaniel@tycho:~/Maildir% find ubuntu-users/ -ctime 0.607:48
danielsfind: invalid argument `0.6' to `-ctime'07:48
danielsah, right07:48
danielsdo you want hoary-changes and warty-bugs?07:49
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Matt|is firefox 1 coming in hoary?08:34
ChrisHProbably... as the release date will be 4/2005.08:35
Matt|in the devel tree?08:38
thomMatt|: there's an RC in the devel tree08:39
Matt|thom, hi08:39
Matt|thom, yeah it's rc1 isn't it?08:39
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tim1current version in hoary is called 0.99+RC1-4ubuntu108:40
Matt|thom, do you know if ff1 is gonna be in the tree sometime soon08:40
Matt|i'm hoping it will fix that flash problem :(08:41
thomMatt|: dude. it'll be in the tree before release08:41
danielsMatt|: it doesn't, the problem in this case is flash itself08:41
Matt|daniels, are you sure?08:41
danielstry export XLIB_SKIP_ARGB_VISUALS=1, then running firefox from a terminal08:41
danielsyes, xorg with composite exposes extra visuals and flash doesn't deal with that08:41
danielsbecause it sucks08:41
Matt|daniels, it was the same with the xfree packages08:42
danielsoh, right08:42
Matt|daniels, and i don't think i have composite08:42
danielswell, in that case, my trick won't solve it, and neither will ff108:42
Matt|daniels, :(08:42
Matt|so you guys all have the same problem?08:42
Matt|my gentoo box is fine08:43
danielswhich problem is that?08:43
Matt|<daniels> Matt|: it doesn't, the problem in this case is flash itself08:43
danielsi made an assumption08:43
daniels(you have no idea how many times that argb problem has been reported lately)08:44
Matt|oh ok08:44
Matt|bug 330208:44
Matt|is my problem08:44
Matt|but its not assigned08:44
danielsmy private mail can largely be summaried as 'composite is slow', 'FLASH DOESNT WORK HELP' and 'composite is slow'08:44
Matt|can you add them to your spam filter08:45
Matt|i'm chuffed with xorg btw08:45
danielsunfortunately mdz is right08:45
danielswe can't even begin to debug it without the source08:45
danielsthe problem could be in firefox, glibc, flash, interactions thereof ...08:45
danielsheh, i still at least make an *attempt* to answer all my mail :P08:46
Matt|is there no way to look at the builds on other distros?08:46
danielsprivate email gets answered unless I can't answer it on the spot so I flag it for follow-up and it disappears among the other 500 messages to have befallen the same fate08:46
Matt|i suppose it is guesswork :(08:46
danielspure guesswork, since they're all so wildly different08:46
danielsand the build environments (which versions of gcc, e.g.) are so totally different08:46
Matt|it's really irritating08:46
danielsyeah -- this is a no-source, no-debug problem08:46
Matt|yeah guess so08:46
Matt|daniels, but you can see why I hoped it might be fixed in ff108:47
Matt|a guy in #ubuntu installed firefox using the mozilla installer and couldn't reproduce the problem08:47
Matt|i guess i'll do that08:47
danielsthe official builds of mozilla are built with different compilers, different patches, different options, etc08:48
danielsso unfortunately even that doesn't narrow it down to a version-to-version difference08:48
Matt|how annoying08:49
Matt|oh well08:49
Matt|life goes on08:49
Matt|great work on xorg btw08:50
Matt|it was such an easy update08:50
danielscheers :) credit shared with fabbione08:51
Matt|i bet it was a couple of hardcore weeks huh?08:51
danielswe were both individually working on it before that, so it's been a while of xorg packages08:52
Matt|he came to visit you in the US?08:52
danielsnah, I live in .au, and I'm visiting him in .dk08:53
Matt|oh i c08:53
Matt|i must have you confused with someone else08:54
Matt|i thought you lived in california08:54
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danielsno, not I.  although when X confcalls start at 3am and team meetings at 4am, it's enough to make me wish I was ;)08:58
Matt|whereabouts in australia do you live?08:59
Matt|*grins* i've installed firefox from mozilla.org and it has the same problem. Must be something really weird09:03
danielsMatt|: in Melbourne (east coast)09:03
Matt|ah nice09:03
amusomeone interessed in testing the hoarylive with new the xorg ?09:06
amumdz: ..uploading   09:07
mdzamu: you still can't build CDs at the data center?  what is blocking that?09:08
amumdz: right i can't, elmo didnt accepted to build in the chroot   09:10
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Mitariore everyone09:10
mdzamu, elmo: this needs to be resolved.  I thought that the last time we talked about this, the solution was to provide the root-ish bits via a cron job, and allow the rest to be built unprivileged in a chroot, or something like that09:11
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wasabiuser model linux.09:13
tim1anybody else not being able to change the wallpaper anymore ?09:13
tim1using hoary with newest packages09:13
mdztim1: yes, see bugzilla09:14
amumdz: or building them with a login by request ....09:15
wasabiwhy not user mode linux? It's pretty slick for that kind of stuff. ;)09:15
tim1ah, ok, search on wallpaper didn't return anything, now background does ..09:16
mdzwasabi: we've considered it, but it is by no means the simplest solution09:16
wasabiI thought it just ran as a program.09:16
wasabiFew commands to set up a clean fake file system, few commands to boot it with a custom script as init.09:16
mdzI have used UML a great deal09:17
mdzand for something which needs to be reliably automated, it is unfortunately not very suitable09:18
mdzI've written a tool which provides a certain level of automation via communication with a daemon which runs inside UML, but it it turned out to be extremely difficult to make it robust09:18
wasabiheh i was just reading about it.09:19
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mdzI have a whole pile of ideas about how we could use UML for some Ubuntu projects09:19
wasabiI've always fancied the idea of using it for automated builds and such.09:20
mdzbut it's mostly automation, so we need some infrastructure for that first09:20
mdztest builds, test installs, functional testing, etc.09:20
LifesizeKenDollquestion - what could I do to help Ubuntu? I'm a reasonably competent programmer in quite a few languages09:21
mdzLifesizeKenDoll: take a look at /wiki/HoaryGoals and /community/bounties/09:22
mdzif you see a project that appeals to you, let me know09:22
LifesizeKenDollcan't find /community/bounties/09:23
mdzor if you have an idea of your own09:23
LifesizeKenDollwhoops - I was going to ubuntu.org09:23
zulsetting up a fs for uml under debian is realiativly easy09:27
rcaskey100k in bounties for 0409:28
ChrisHMark should set up bounties for getting rid of SCO and Microsoft, too. ;)09:29
LifesizeKenDollthat'd be funny more than anything09:31
=== RubenV thinks the bounties page is a bit vague
RubenVthis is a nice bounties page :)09:31
LifesizeKenDollI like that bounty page09:31
mdzRubenV: can you be a bit more specific about what you think is lacking?09:31
mdzI'm going to be editing it some more today anyway09:32
RubenVspecific tasks and/or goals09:32
RubenVmore like the gnome system09:32
RubenVbut my opinion shouldn't be given too much value09:32
RubenVi don't have the skills to fix a bounty anyway :p09:33
mdzRubenV: apart from the python work, they are all quite specific09:33
RubenVaha, i see the page has been updated :)09:34
RubenVtime for me to m09:34
RubenVlearn decent C09:34
mdzI only added to it; I didn't modify the existing items09:34
wasabiso, any of you have any suggestions about what scripts I should use to run my own apt repository locally? with an incoming queue?09:34
amumdz: 3h ETA09:35
mirakI was toying with shfs mount and managed to autmount location with autofs09:36
ChrisHwasabi: apt-ftparchive?09:36
wasabiChris, what and where is that?09:37
mirakit would be nice to be able to be able to have an automount behavior that can be setted up by users09:37
mirakI am not sure it's possible to put automount suid09:37
ChrisHwasabi: comes with Warty... see the man page. It helps you create all the meta files you need to get a working repository09:37
wasabiChris will it read from an incoming queue and put .debs in teh right place?09:38
wasabiI want something easy to use. =/09:38
ChrisHwasabi: No, it just takes the packages from where they actually are.09:39
ChrisHwasabi: There was another program that might do what you want. What was the name...09:39
wasabiyeah i want an incoming queue. This is going to be for my company's office.09:39
wasabiDevelopers would like to upload programs, etc etc.09:39
ChrisHwasabi: you could try mini-dinstall although I find it ugly09:40
wasabii think i've tried it previously, and also found it ugly.09:40
wasabidoes archive.ul.org use the scripts from debina.org? katie and the bunch?09:41
ChrisHThat's what I would like to know, too. :)09:41
ChrisHI haven't met anyone in Debian who was able to install katie. So I wrote my own set of scripts for mentors.debian.net.09:42
wasabithat's about where I am. I need the same functionality, but i'd like it apt-gettable.09:42
wasabiapt-get install coolaptthingy, edit a config file, and go with it09:42
ChrisHRebuilding the meta files is rather easy. The scare part is checking if the package is valid (PGP key, linda, lintian, mandatory entries in the control file).09:43
ChrisHDo you have such a large number of packages that you really need different directories and the full checking?09:45
wasabiNo. But it sounds fun.09:45
wasabiI just want it to be managable without sshing in and running stuff.09:45
ChrisHOh, it is. :) Took a team of three people two months until it worked with all the packages we tried to upload. ;)09:45
wasabiI need it to be usable by people other than me.09:45
ChrisHThen just let the people upload the files (copy them somewhere) and run apt-ftparchive. Not much security checking but it works automatically.09:46
ChrisHNow I remember! "apt-move" could be worth a look, too.09:46
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ZlinxEDoes this channel support gnoppix?09:50
mdzwasabi: Ubuntu uses katie09:50
mdzisn't there a #gnoppix on this server?09:51
mdzamu would know if there is an official channel09:52
ZlinxEno there isnt09:52
amu#gnoppix it is 09:55
ZlinxEits empty09:56
amuthe other possibility is on ircnet, some guys moved to there once a time :) 09:56
mdzdaniels: what's the story with the "locale not supported by Xlib" stuff?09:57
mdzelmo: around?10:02
ChrisHmdz: katie? Hmmm. Looks like I will still need to learn Python, too.10:04
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mdzChrisH: that's a good idea anyway, especially in an Ubuntu context10:05
LifesizeKenDollwhat is katie?10:05
ChrisHmdz: Whatever language you choose - it's the wrong one. And Perl has actually been fun for years.10:05
ChrisHLifesizeKenDoll: The program that handles package uploads to the archive.10:06
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ChrisHmdz: Is Python more suited for scripting in Ubuntu? Or why was it chosen? (Besides that Mark seems to like it personally.) Large parts of Debian have been using Perl.10:08
mdzChrisH: my point is that we do new development in Python wherever feasible10:08
mdzI'm not arguing your preferences, but that is where we are standardizing10:08
mdzChrisH: take a little time to learn the basics, and see if you still have the same question :-)10:09
ChrisHmdz: I'm just curious what the advantages of Pythons are. That'll perhaps simplify it to switch for me. :)10:09
mdzit's a very nice language10:09
mdzyou'll find it very simple to learn10:10
mdzI used to feel the same way; "perl gives me everything I need, why would I learn python?"10:10
ChrisHJust took a closer look at katie. And besides that I'm not used to the syntax it looks quite readable.10:11
mdzI no longer write perl programs except one-liners on the command line10:11
LifesizeKenDollI heart Python10:11
ChrisHThere are a couple of questions I need to answer for myself. Like... is there equally as good support in terms of loadable modules as in Perl. Looking at search.cpan.org is really overwhelming.10:11
ChrisHBut there's still time until December 5th. :)10:12
LifesizeKenDollwhat happens then?10:12
mdzChrisH: loadable modules meaning extensions written in C?  or pure python modules?10:12
ChrisHI better leave my Perl t-shirt at home. :)10:13
mdzin both cases, the answer is "yes, and in many ways nicer than in Perl" :-)10:13
ChrisHmdz: Hmm. Both.10:13
ChrisHmdz: Argh. I knew you were going to say that. :)10:13
ChrisHmdz: Is there a similar agreement on repository systems? In the Doc Team we have been discussing whether to use Subversion or Arch. Well... Subversion runs well so far for the new FAQ. And that topic /really/ seems to be religious.10:14
mdzperl:                     char *handle= SvPV(ST(i),len);10:15
mdzpython:    PyObject *Obj = PyString_FromString(Str);10:15
mdzChrisH: yes, we are converging on arch10:15
mdzChrisH: we freely admit that arch isn't yet as usable as it needs to be, but that is changing10:17
ChrisHmdz: I read an interview on /. from the arch author and just thought "yeah, bash everything else allright". Didn't really make me want to try it out yet.10:18
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mdzChrisH: an idea cannot be held responsible for those who believe in it :-)10:25
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ChrisHmdz: Sounds a little esoteric. :)10:26
mirakwould this be possible to unlike ubuntu desktop from xserver ?10:27
mirakbecause I must keep xfree86 instead of xorg in hoary10:27
Mithrandiroh, why?10:27
mirakhowever unbuntu desktopn absolutely want xorg10:27
mirakbecause ATI drivers10:28
mirakI don't know if this drivers can work with xorg, but the deps prevent me to use this drivers10:28
mirakso either I tweak the deps10:28
mirakor I put back xfree8610:28
Matt|mirak, your card is not working with xorg?10:29
mirakI don't know yet10:29
Mithrandirwe'll fix that before hoary releases, I hope, so we have fully-working ati binary drivers.10:29
mirakall I know is that the ati deb packege depends on xfree10:29
Matt|mirak, maybe with xorg you won't need the ati binary drivers for your card to work10:30
mirakmaybe adding the deps on xorg would be enough10:30
mirakmy card work10:30
mirakwithout the drivers10:30
mirakbut there is no hardware accelaration for 3D10:30
Matt|mirak, are you sure?10:31
Matt|there is on mine10:31
mdzmirak: just remove ubuntu-desktop if it doesn't match what you want10:31
mdzit's only there for convenient upgrades10:31
Matt|can i ask a support question in here? I've had no luck in #ubuntu10:32
mirakmdz: yes. but having the deps fixed on the ati driver package would be nice also10:32
mdzmirak: the dependencies on the ati driver package are correct10:33
mdzthe driver does not work with the X.org server, I don't think10:33
Matt|mirak, i think the reason for those deps is that xorg includes opensource drivers for most ati cards. give it a try10:33
mirakmdz: I have it works with 6.7 but not 6.8 or something like this10:33
mirakMatt|: well I am already trying it then10:34
mirakMatt|: mmm I have not restarted X10:34
mirakI will see if it's ok10:34
sivang_awaymdz : Hi10:36
=== sivang_away is now known as sivang
mdzsivang: hi?10:37
ChrisHmdz: Okay, now you got me. I'll stay awake tonight and learn Python. :)10:42
mdzChrisH: the tutorial on the python site is good, diveintopython may be even better (I haven't read the latter, but hear good things)10:42
sivangmdz : I was wondering about gnome-system-tools, I am working with garanacho on extending the perl backend and the frontend to allow for our default group priviliges, will it be obsoleted by fedora's UserConfig tool ? :)10:43
sivangmdz : diveintopython is very good indeed.10:44
danielsmdz: i don't know.  been having a look at it but it's hairy.10:44
mdzsivang: hasn't Martin Pitt already done that?10:44
mdzdaniels: is there a bug open in bugzilla yet?10:44
sivangmdz : he had a patch for the frontend that made it on warty, however the patch was dropped with the new gst in hoary10:45
sivangmdz : the new way to solve this is more general, and will (hopefully) be in upstream and support even other distros.10:46
danielsmdz: yah10:47
mdzsivang: ok10:49
mdzsivang: if you want to rewrite the backend in python at the same time, that would be ideal ;-)10:49
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sivangmdz : will this keep gst in ubuntu? I will talk garancho into it then....:)10:51
mdzkeep? we are not removing it10:51
ChrisHsivang: Come over for a beer. We'll learn Python together.10:55
sivangChrisH : Sure, no prob. Wait up, I will use my teleporter :)10:57
ChrisHmdz: btw, thanks for replying to my "mirror problem" on -devel. We managed to get it installed. I've been mirroring the whole archive since yesterday.10:57
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sivangmdz : ok, so when userconfig will be introduced, it will be offered as another tool to do the job?10:58
ChrisHmdz: If we will really exceed the traffic limit we'll just shape it down.10:58
miraksivang: what is userconfig ?10:58
jdubsivang: no decision has been made on any of that stuff so far, and currently only libuser has been raised.10:58
mdzChrisH: glad to hear it10:58
mdzsivang: as jdub says10:58
ChrisHmdz: Colin didn't reply yet to add the mirror. But I'll be patient.10:59
mdzChrisH: Colin?  or James?10:59
ChrisHmdz: Err.10:59
mdzChrisH: did you add it to the wiki already?10:59
ChrisHmdz: James. :)10:59
ChrisHmdz: I don't seem to have edit access on the mirrors page.11:00
mdzChrisH: the wiki page is editable by anyone11:00
ChrisHmdz: I thought about https://www.ubuntulinux.org/download/11:01
ChrisHmdz: As that's the page where people will probably try to get the CD from.11:02
sivangChrisH : don't we have write access there already?11:02
ChrisHsivang: Looks like that area is restricted to Canonical :(11:03
mdzChrisH: it is restricted to website managers, not Canonical11:07
mdzChrisH: add your mirror to /wiki/Archive as a first step11:08
ChrisHmdz: Yes, Sir! :)11:08
mdzChrisH: the mirrors on /download/ are CD image mirrors (only)11:09
mdzthe wiki Archive page is the only list of package archive mirrors that we have at the moment11:09
mdzit should probably be cleaned up and moved someplace more official11:09
mdzor rather, linked11:09
ChrisHmdz: source.rfc822.org is a full mirror and also mentioned on the download page.11:09
mdzChrisH: the URL on that page is only a CD image mirror11:10
ChrisHmdz: so would be http://ubuntu-mirror.workaround.org/4.10/11:10
mdznone of the URLs on /download/ point to packages11:10
mdzChrisH: excellent, then it can be added to both sections on the Archive page11:11
ChrisHmdz: I'm on it.11:11
mdzChrisH: I'm not sure if there are any established criteria for adding CD image mirrors to the download page, so I'm leaving it to the website people to edit it.  If you send me an email reminder, I'll pass on your request to the appropriate people11:12
ChrisHmdz: Sure. Thanks. Let's see how much the line will burn. :)11:13
wasabiheh. mini-dinstall looks like it doesn't accept "warty" distribution name.11:21
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ChrisHwasabi: Did you try "apt-move"?11:33
wasabiI got mini-dinstall working11:34
wasabiLooks fine. I just won't look at the code.11:34
wasabiDoesn't do pools though.11:34
wasabidoesn't have an interface of any sort for removing packages from the archive either it looks like.11:34

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