[12:26] <jdub> what was the command to sleep if you can't use your sleep button?
[12:27] <azeem> echo 3 > /proc/acpi/sleep or similar
[12:28] <jdub> ah, /etc/acpi/sleep.sh
[12:29] <jdub> nah, that doesn't work
[12:29] <jdub> now rmmod button is in D state
[12:29] <jdub> gar
[12:29] <azeem> don't you love it when hardware just works[tm] ? :)
[01:04] <lamont> Mithrandir: perl's love of terse punctuation and uninitialized variables means that it does unexpected things unless you really dig into the language.
[01:05] <lamont> I genenerally find that I have to use perl just often enough to have a learning curve every time.
[01:05] <lamont> BradB: every other use in that file is setting variables that are not set.
[01:22] <azeem> heh
[01:31] <azeem> ugh
[01:43] <lamont> jdub about?
[02:00] <magnon> ew. Xorg just went unkillable @ 100% cpu and wouldn't let me get rid of it without rebooting.
[02:01] <mako> the ubuntu talk at GLUEV just went *really* well
[02:01] <magnon> mako: feeds?
[02:01] <mako> people *literally* fought over the last cds :)
[02:01] <magnon> :D
[02:01] <mako> they nearly tore one of them in half!
[02:01] <mako> the box, not the cd :)
[02:02] <mako> and i did something you're never supposed to do
[02:02] <mako> during the question time, i did an ubuntu install onto a compuer i'd never used before
[02:02] <mako> just someone who anted to install ubuntu
[02:03] <mako> and it worked prefectly :)
[02:03] <magnon> let me guess, it got seamlessly installed
[02:03] <magnon> :)
[02:03] <mako> i thought that doing something untested in fromt of 600 peopple is guarentted to make it breka :)
[02:03] <mako> wow.. that was mangled
[02:04] <jdub> lamont: pong
[02:04] <magnon> mako: are there video feeds?
[02:04] <mako> magnon: there will be.. i don't know if they are yet
[02:04] <magnon> ok
[02:04] <mako> i have pretty extensive notes and slides online though
[02:06] <magnon> mako: where?
[02:06] <azeem> tonight, two guys from the BSP here gave a talk about d-i and they decided to try out LVM for the first time...
[02:06] <mako> azeem: where they as lucky as me?
[02:07] <azeem> they used the whole partition and then failed to install lilo
[02:07] <jdub> mako: i heard GULEV was rad
[02:07] <mako> jdub: it's really really cool
[02:07] <lamont> jdub: feeling kind enough to add ia64 to bugzilla's list of architectures?
[02:07] <mako> there were only 3 non-spanish talks
[02:07] <lamont> or is that a 'discuss this more first' thing?
[02:07] <jdub> lamont: hrm
[02:08] <lamont> jdub: exactly
[02:08] <lamont> so they're all 'Other' right now.
[02:08] <mako> jdub: it's totally the kind of conference we want to be at
[02:09] <mako> the only thing i have to complain about is the headache i get from all  the tequila :)
[02:10] <lamont> mako: after 4 you're supposed to be unconcious....
[02:10] <lamont> s/nc/nsc/
[02:10] <mako> lamont: didn't work that way last night 
[02:10] <mako> lamont: might have beeter if it had
[02:11] <mako> last talk now.. rms is talking now :)
[02:12] <jdub> did you bring vegetables?
[02:12] <mako> jdub: i think its prudent to forget them. he likes us remember? :)
[02:13] <azeem> that was before multiverse
[02:13] <mako> azeem: richard doesn't know about multiverse :)
[02:13] <jdub> mako: i only bring him up just to tear him down
[02:14] <mako> jdub: that man is very depressed.
[02:14] <mako> you would feel sorry for him but he is VERY annoying about it
[02:14] <mako> azeem: but we also allow GFDL documentation
[02:15] <lamont> even with multiverse, we're simply allowing end users to run whatever they feel they need on their machine... dammit, it's more freedom for the end user.
[02:15] <mako> azeem: that ought to get on his good side
[02:15] <jdub> lamont: um, i'm not sure i know how.
[02:15] <lamont> and the main/restricted universe/multiverse split helps make it clear what you're doing...
[02:15] <jdub> how on earth did i get lumped with bugzilla maintenance, anyway?
[02:15] <mako> richared ends up supporting distributions that are unknowingly distribuint free software
[02:15] <thom> jdub: no-one else wanted it?
[02:16] <jdub> thom: stfu!
[02:16] <lamont> jdub: have to edit the list of platforms in the localconfig file, then run checksetup.pl to copy it to the database
[02:16] <azeem> lamont: hey, I'm not judging you, just pointing out his possible line of reasoning
[02:16] <lamont> azeem: yeah
[02:16] <jdub> lamont: seriously? i can't do that
[02:16] <lamont> no shell access there?
[02:16] <lamont> oh thom bot... :-)
[02:16] <jdub> HA HA HA
[02:16] <mako> rather than supporting distributions that make it clear when you are using non-free and letting people make adult decisions.. and making freedom the default
[02:17] <thom> mail me
[02:17] <thom> i'm going to bed now
[02:17] <lamont> jdub: you wanna mail him, or want I should just cc you on the mail...
[02:17] <lamont> ?
[02:19] <mako> dude, the main organizer for this conference had a baby LAST WEEK
[02:19] <mako> that guy is A SUPERMAN
[02:20] <lamont> mako: or was it his wife?
[02:20] <mako> well, his wife gave birth i suppose
[02:21] <mako> lamont: that's my best guess at least
[02:21] <mako> i didn't ask
[02:21] <mako> :)
[02:21] <lamont> heh
[02:22] <mako> probably a pretty safe assumption :)
[02:23] <lamont> Mithrandir: you still around?
[02:24] <lamont> ncc -Ml -ansi -s  -o elksemu elks.o elks_sys.o elks_signal.o minix.o
[02:24] <lamont> WARNING: Native a.out generation not included, sorry
[02:24] <lamont> ...
[02:24] <lamont> strip: /build/buildd/linux86-0.16.14/debian/tmp/lib/elksemu: File format not recognized
[02:24] <lamont> that'd be linux86 on amd64.
[02:24] <lamont> which amusingly enough is #260647.  sihg
[02:25] <mako> my back is hurting and my mail is synced.. i'm off unless the wireless gets fixed
[02:25] <magnon>  /me goes to sleep as well
[02:25] <lamont> oh. that reminds me.  how many access points should I bring?
[02:25] <magnon> night
[02:25] <lamont> to mataro
[02:25] <mako> lamont: lots :)
[02:25] <lamont> mako: only have 3...
[02:25] <mako> lamont: one HUGE one? :)
[02:26] <lamont> btw, anyone in EU have a netgear box with a US adapter that wants to trade me for my EU adapter?
[02:26] <lamont> will have at least one 1W beast
[02:27] <lamont> bbl
[02:28] <azeem> did somebody point out 'Multiverse' to Erich Schubert? java-package is in there
[02:35] <thom> and the custom install target, for that matter
[02:36] <bob2> haha
[02:51] <KeyserSoze> hey fellas is there a netinstall for amd64?
[03:21] <mjg59> ARGH NO NO NO
[03:22] <mjg59> If anyone ever suggests putting swsusp2 in the Ubuntu kernel, kill them
[03:23] <thom> rofl
[03:25] <Mithrandir> lamont: pong?
[03:26] <lamont> Mithrandir: trying to remember what the amd64 error I was going to poke you with was...
[03:26] <mjg59> thom: Seriously, people keep suggesting it
[03:27] <lamont> Mithrandir: ah, was linux86, but the bug is already in debbugs
[03:27] <Mithrandir> lamont: yes, I've seen it.  I need to be more drunk than sober, but less drunk that I'm now to tackle it.
[03:28] <elmo> looks like our amd64 boxes are happy smp now, btw - which is nice
[03:29] <Mithrandir> elmo: yay, that is good.  Any real change that happended to them?
[03:29] <mjg59> Any sign of a kernel maintainer yet?
[03:29] <elmo> Mithrandir: reinstalled as real amd64, and using (self-compiled) warty kernel source
[04:00] <KeyserSoze> anyone that can tell my why the enlightenment package says "not available" on hoary amd64
[04:21] <jdub> elmo: how big is a mirror of warty main?
[04:21] <jdub> elmo: also, can someone mirror warty-security on its own?
[04:23] <elmo> jdub: err, I _think_ main is about 6Gb for one distro
[04:23] <elmo> you can only mirror one distro with a script like debmirror
[04:24] <lamont> ugly but mostly works.
[04:24] <lamont> KeyserSoze: d-w libfnlib-dev
[04:25] <lamont> which is d-w libtool1.4, which won't be fixed.
[04:25] <lamont> so...  create a patch for fnlib that moves it to libtool instead of libtool1.4, and I'll upload it, and we'll quite possibly be enlightened...
[04:26] <jdub> elmo: one distro meaning 'warty' or 'hoary'?
[04:27] <elmo> jdub: yeah
[04:27] <elmo> pool/main == 13Gb, which matches my memory of warty being 6Gb last time I had a local mirror of it
[04:27] <lamont> warty main+source fits on a dvd
[04:27] <jdub> cool
[04:27] <lamont> with room to spare.
[04:28] <elmo> jdub: yeah, bear in mind that 6Gb is for 3 arches +source
[04:28] <lamont> er, warty i386/main + source fits on a dvd - thanks elmo
[04:28] <jdub> nice
[04:28] <jdub> it's pretty small
[04:28] <lamont> jdub: dvd has i386+source main/restricted, bits of universe/multiverse, and theopencd
[04:30] <jdub> heh
[04:30] <jdub> and the livecd tacked on? ;)
[04:30] <lamont> elmo: btw, libtool1.4 can move to universe.
[04:30] <lamont> 'k thanks bye
[04:30] <lamont> yeah
[04:30] <lamont> oh. no livecd
[04:30] <jdub> that'd be cool
[04:30] <lamont> didn't want to make it dual boot you see...
[04:30] <jdub> ;)
[04:30] <lamont> and I had to shave stuff to fit on the dvd as it was
[04:30] <lamont> was very sad.
[04:30] <lamont> 4.7GB == 4700000 bytes
[04:30] <jdub> no good having a stubbly dvd
[04:30] <lamont> which truely sucks
[04:31] <elmo> jdub: gnome-user-share in a seed or should it be in universe?
[04:31] <jdub> elmo: universe until it's proposed and accepted
[04:32] <jdub> thanks
[04:43] <lamont> elmo: actually, if libtool1.4 isn't seeded, then it'll automagically move to universe, yes?
[04:44] <elmo> if you ignore the muppet behind the curtain, yeah
[05:01] <lamont> KeyserSoze: actually, fnlib no longer b-d's libtool1.4...
[05:02] <lamont> which is to say that enlightenment may be there in about 45 minutes
[05:02] <lamont> elmo: lol
[05:05] <lamont> elmo: shame we don't allow previously uncompiled universe packages to enter warty as I free up build-deps. :-(
[05:06] <jdub> hrm
[05:06] <jdub> dh_python does not love me
[05:06] <elmo> lamont: you can upload to warty-updates if you want
[05:06] <lamont> elmo: I'd have to care
[05:06] <lamont> jdub: did you remember to b-d: python?
[05:06] <elmo> that propagation shit is fucking satanic
[05:06] <jdub> lamont: yeah
[05:06] <lamont> elmo: yeah
[05:07] <elmo> there's a screenshot of it in action next to "WHEN DWIM GOES WRONG" entry in a dictionary somewhere
[05:07] <jdub> (well, it's a depend of a depend, and i'm doing the build locally)
[05:07] <lamont> I type in the w-b command, see it say 'propogating', and then get the reject mail shortly thereafter...
[05:07] <lamont> elmo: lol
[05:09] <elmo> jdub: hmm, is something actually going to happen about the chunk of seed proposals at some stage?
[05:09] <jdub> i was hoping to do an initial pass at them next week
[05:09] <jdub> to cut it down before the conference
[05:10] <elmo> ok, cool - I wasn't sure if I was meant to be more activiely fighting for my proposals
[05:10] <elmo> tho I think I need to redo most of them
[05:10] <jdub> fight when i say something stupid :)
[05:10] <lamont> jdub: how do I get firefox to show me text/plain in a simple window?
[05:10] <jdub> lamont: it normally does
[05:10] <elmo> jdub: always, dude ;-)
[05:10] <jdub> perhaps the server is giving you a funny mime type
[05:10] <lamont> jdub: mine asks me whether to save it to disk or display it with less
[05:11] <jdub> elmo: so then you should also back me up when baby jesus is crying :-)
[05:11] <jdub> lamont: bong
[05:13] <lamont> jdub: bugs.debian.org/283174, click on the byacc.diff attachement (which says text/plain), and that's where I go.
[05:15] <jdub> because it's a DIFF file
[05:15] <jdub> weird
[05:22] <lamont> jdub: like I said.  annoying
[05:24] <elmo> how the heck do we not ship with python-elisp
[05:29] <jdub> elmo: you around for a bit to process some NEWage?
[05:30] <elmo> jdub: yeah, only half an hour or so tho
[05:39] <elmo> will people laugh at me if I propose lavaps?
[05:40] <elmo> or does anyone know something else to do what it does well, i.e. get a visual representation of process CPU & memory usage which makes it super easy to find the problem process(es)
[05:43] <jdub> elmo: flumotion in NEW :)
[05:47] <elmo> done
[05:48] <jdub> thanks
[05:58] <elmo> does synaptic have deborphan style functionality?
[06:00] <lamont> elmo: ISTR being told it did
[06:00] <lamont> hrm.. byacc NMU'ed.
[06:08] <GotD0t> does anybody know why 3D accelerated games crash my X in hoary?
[06:12] <lamont> so how do I allow gpg to plock?
[06:14] <GotD0t> lamont: i couldn't get it to lock when it was installed through apt-get... i had to remove it and compile it from source then lock it
[06:15] <lamont> GotD0t: it is intentionally not setuid-root from install, because there's a better way to do the same thing... I just can't remember how...
[06:15] <lamont> ENOPITTI
[06:15] <lamont> :-)
[06:16] <GotD0t> lamont: i know... you're supposed to be able to do chmod u+s but i still got the insecure memory warning
[06:19] <KeyserSoze> anyone that can tell me why the enlightenment package isn't available?
[06:19] <KeyserSoze> in hoary
[06:19] <KeyserSoze> dunno about i386 but it doesn't work in amd64
[06:19] <KeyserSoze> Package enlightenment is not available,
[06:21] <KeyserSoze> I see
[06:21] <lamont> KeyserSoze: let me check again
[06:22] <KeyserSoze> there is no amd64 package for it
[06:22] <KeyserSoze> thats why
[06:22] <lamont> although this is really a #ubuntu question...
[06:22] <KeyserSoze> I know
[06:22] <KeyserSoze> but I've been asking there for a while
[06:22] <KeyserSoze> the reason is that there is no amd64 in the pool/universe/e/enlightenment dir
[06:23] <KeyserSoze> just i386,ia64 and powerpc
[06:24] <GotD0t> lamont: where would i find log files that might tell me why X crashed after running a 3d Accelerated game?
[06:26] <KeyserSoze> in /var/log/Xorg.0.log
[06:26] <KeyserSoze> or in your home dir .xsession-errors
[06:29] <lamont> KeyserSoze: )&%*%^&*(^*(_ wanna-build propogation
[06:29] <lamont> that, and the fact that fnlib hasn't changed since warty froze
[06:30] <KeyserSoze> yeah I just tried to apt-get source and saw that fnlib was missing too
[06:31] <lamont> KeyserSoze: yeah - pb was that what I did earlier caused fnlib to build for _WARTY_ not hoary (and get rejected, etc.)
[06:31] <KeyserSoze> ok
[06:32] <lamont> upload for hoary just happened, will be in the archive in 30 minutes, and enlightenment should hit just over an hour from now
[06:32] <KeyserSoze> configure: error: C++ preprocessor "/lib/cpp" fails sanity check
[06:32] <KeyserSoze> trying to compile fnlib
[06:32] <KeyserSoze> ohh well
[06:32] <KeyserSoze> I'll wait
[06:34] <lamont> KeyserSoze: that was bulding fnlib or enlightenment?
[06:34] <KeyserSoze> fnlin
[06:34] <KeyserSoze> fnlib
[06:34] <lamont> because, mind you, I don't _know_ that enlightenment will build... just know that fnlib does
[06:35] <KeyserSoze> ok
[06:35] <KeyserSoze> weird why I got that error
[06:35] <lamont> dpkg-buildpackage?
[06:36] <KeyserSoze> apt-get -b source
[06:36] <KeyserSoze> same thing really just that it applies the diff for me
[06:36] <lamont> right
[06:37] <lamont> KeyserSoze: this is just sbuild building in a hoary chroot
[06:38] <KeyserSoze> this is on a newly installed amd64 hoary
[06:40] <KeyserSoze> no wonder
[06:40] <KeyserSoze> I didn't have g++ installed
[06:40] <lamont> KeyserSoze: fwiw, I missed the window by about 20 seconds, hence the 30 minute wait. :-(
[06:40] <KeyserSoze> just built fnlib
[06:41] <KeyserSoze> let me try enlight
[06:44] <KeyserSoze> wth is /usr/bin/ld: cannot find -lXtst
[06:44] <KeyserSoze> whats -lXtst?
[06:44] <KeyserSoze> Xtest?
[06:46] <KeyserSoze> wtf?
[06:46] <KeyserSoze> its there
[06:46] <KeyserSoze>  /usr/X11R6/lib/libXtst.so.6
[06:50] <lamont> and is there -L/usr/X11R6/lib in the command line?
[06:51] <KeyserSoze> configure:14115: cc -o conftest -g -Wall -O2   -L/usr/lib  -lImlib conftest.c -lXxf86vm  -L/usr/X11R6/lib -lXtst
[06:51] <KeyserSoze>  /usr/bin/ld: cannot find -lXxf86vm
[06:51] <lamont> well, that'd mean that the -L needs to come before that one, too. :-)
[06:52] <KeyserSoze> this is all busted
[06:52] <lamont> xorg broke up all the xlibs, and this causes some amount of pain for packages...
[06:52] <KeyserSoze> how are you getting this to build without manual changes
[06:52] <lamont> haven't yet.
[06:52] <KeyserSoze> hehe
[06:53] <lamont> all I did was coax the buildd into building fnlib/hoary/amd64
[06:53] <lamont> and in about 10 minutes, that'll show up in the repository, and free everything that's d-w libfnlib-dev, to build or fail as it sees fit...
[07:09] <lamont> KeyserSoze: yep.  ftbfs
[07:09] <lamont> patches welcome
[07:10] <KeyserSoze> hehe
[07:10] <KeyserSoze> I'm too lazy ;)
[07:20] <lamont> KeyserSoze: then I guess we'll both have to wait for someone who cares.
[07:22] <KeyserSoze> its a simple change if you want to make it
[07:22] <KeyserSoze> to the "configure"
[07:22] <lamont> night all
[07:22] <lamont> really?
[07:22] <KeyserSoze> yeah
[07:22] <KeyserSoze> I just compiled enlight
[07:23] <lamont> so unpack it, save that directory, make the change, say 'diff -ur old new' and send me that output...
[07:23] <lamont> then I can credit you with the patch. :-)
[07:23] <KeyserSoze> line 13316
[07:23] <KeyserSoze> LDFLAGS="$LDFLAGS -L$prefix/lib  -L$prefix/X11R6/lib"
[07:23] <lamont> by adding the last token, I expect.
[07:24] <KeyserSoze> yeah
[07:24] <lamont> seriously - send me an email.  I'm going to go crawl into bed, and universe stuff falls through the cracks when I do that.
[07:24] <lamont> lamont@canonical.com
[07:24] <KeyserSoze> but I'm too lazy to make a diff and stuff ;)
[07:25] <lamont> even that much and I'll eventually deal with it.
[07:25] <lamont> but it certainly is backburner.
[07:25] <lamont> and I'm off to bed.  night all.
[07:25] <KeyserSoze> ok
[07:25] <KeyserSoze> night
[09:37] <fabbione> morning guys
[09:39] <smurfix> Should this line in various /etc/init.d/* files be considered a bug?
[09:40] <smurfix>         log_success_msg "Usage: /etc/init.d/apache2 start|stop|restart|reload|force-reload"
[09:40] <smurfix> (occurs with and without redir to stderr)
[09:40] <smurfix> IMHO that should be turned back to "echo".
[09:50] <smurfix> Hmmm, everybody asleep at this time...
[09:54] <ironwolf> smurfix: not everyone.
[09:58] <smurfix> Everyone who'd disagree, then.
[11:21] <Kamion> er, overnight, I mean
[11:22] <mdz> a replacement for "proceed until you get to the partitioning step and swich VCS"?
[11:22] <Kamion> yes
[11:23] <Kamion> basically one udeb that checks a debconf question and does 'anna-install rescue-mode' if set, and another udeb that runs just before the partitioner, mounts and invokes a shell, and then reboots
[11:23] <Kamion> very very simple
[11:23] <fabbione> that sounds cool
[11:24] <fabbione> mdz: udebs are in the kernel :-)
[11:24] <fabbione> and i am off 
[11:24] <mdz> fabbione: great
[11:24] <fabbione> have a nice we
[11:24] <mdz> built for all architectures?
[11:24] <fabbione> mdz: yes, including sparc
[11:24] <fabbione> :)
[11:24] <mdz> sweet
[11:24] <fabbione> we will need a special setup to build sparc kernels on the buildd
[11:25] <fabbione> but that's not ubuntu problem
[11:25] <fabbione> it's a buildd setup issue
[11:25] <fabbione> http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main/l/linux-source-2.6.8.1/
[11:25] <fabbione> ^^mdz enjoy :-)
[11:25] <Kamion> might have rescue-check do db_set debconf/priority critical or display some helpful message or something; we do actually need to go through language/country/keyboard selection and hardware detection anyway
[11:26] <mdz> sounds useful
[11:29] <mdz> linux-source-2.6.8.1 produces _even more_ binary packages than before
[11:32] <Kamion> one miiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiillion binaries
[11:35] <Kamion> at some point remind me to jump up and down on benh's head until he makes power3 and power4 go away
[11:36] <smurfix> In diesem Schritt kompiere ich auf einen Kunden. Von dort wird auf einen anderen Dienst kopiert und der dann wieder auf alle Kunden.
[11:37] <smurfix> *sigh*
[11:37] <smurfix> I'll be turning that off now.
[11:37] <Kamion> hm, I am missing too much vocabulary to be able to translate that
[11:38] <Kamion> Schritt and kompieren, for a start
[11:38] <azeem> kompieren was a typo
[11:38] <azeem> kopieren
[11:38] <smurfix> It's a comment in a slightly convoluted test script. azeem: I noticed. Kamion: Schritt=step
[11:40] <smurfix> azeem: It's not exactly a typo -- with dasher, one doesn't type. ;-)
[11:41] <azeem> ah
[12:13] <elmo> woah
[12:13] <elmo> a build log somehow managed to infect the title bar of my screen process
[12:13] <elmo> that's scary wrong
[12:19] <daniels> to be fair, screen's title handling is pretty horrendous
[12:20] <elmo> err, I meant status line actually, meh
[12:20] <elmo> [I made that mistake in my head, corrected it, and still typed it wrong] 
[12:20] <daniels> status line?!?
[12:21] <daniels> that's pretty impressive
[12:30] <elmo> sigh, ia64 kernel images are 88Mb a shot
[12:36] <zopy> Hi
[12:37] <zopy> is it plan to add Gartoon icon by default or you want to make your own ?
[12:37] <zopy> http://zeus.qballcow.nl/icons.php
[12:40] <azeem> zopy: the problem with such iconsets is that only a few icons would like that, all the others are regular
[12:40] <azeem> which looks bad
[12:40] <zopy> arf
[12:41] <RubenV> jakub and the rest are doing great work
[12:43] <azeem> RubenV: ack
[12:53] <_rene_>  /gw 13
[12:53] <_rene_> grmbl
[01:08] <jdub> fabbione: there?
[01:19] <fabbione> yeah now
[01:21] <fabbione> jdub: ?
[01:36] <jdub> fabbione: so i need the debootstrap from hoary;
[01:36] <jdub> fabbione: where was the patch?
[01:37] <fabbione> jdub: same place where the debs are
[01:37] <fabbione> i am not sure 100% you can bootstrap.. the base debs should be there already
[01:37] <jdub> fabbione: oh, your debs?
[01:38] <fabbione> jdub: in the middle of my debs there is a .diff :-)
[01:38] <fabbione> debootstrap.diff
[01:39] <fabbione> remember that you need to find a way to make the _all.deb available to your debootstrap
[01:39] <fabbione> it's not extremely simple yet
[01:39] <jdub> how do you mean?
[01:39] <fabbione> that in the sparc dir there are only the _sparc.deb
[01:40] <jdub> oh, so _all has to come from archive.ubuntu.com or wherever?
[01:40] <fabbione> you need to make the _all.deb available to debootstrap somehow
[01:40] <fabbione> jdub: yes... and that makes it complex
[01:40] <jdub> oh, i have to rebuild debootstrap on sparc?
[01:40] <fabbione> no
[01:40] <fabbione> debootstrap is arch _all
[01:40] <fabbione> you just need that patch to /usr/lib/debootstrap/scripts/hoary
[01:40] <jdub> http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main/d/debootstrap/
[01:41] <jdub> ?
[01:41] <fabbione> yes
[01:42] <fabbione> + debootstrap is very anal in checking the pool/dists tree
[01:44] <Kamion> debootstrap isn't arch all
[01:44] <Kamion> it's got pkgdetails.c
[01:46] <fabbione> true
[01:46] <fabbione> jdub: well just wait.. it's better
[01:46] <fabbione> atm it is just pure crack to mix the archive properly and make debootstrap happy
[01:47] <Kamion> so can I start running germinate against your archive + archive.ubuntu.com to generate debootstrap/sparc?
[01:47] <fabbione> Kamion: i would wait a bit still
[01:48] <fabbione> but if you want you are welcome to start
[01:48] <fabbione> it's not a complete main yet
[01:48] <Kamion> if it's got all of base it should work fine
[01:48] <fabbione> Kamion: i think it does...
[01:48] <Kamion> yeah, I only need base for debootstrap though
[01:48] <Kamion> where's the archive?
[01:48] <fabbione> people/~fabbione/sparc
[01:49] <fabbione> Kamion: the debootstrap.diff is almost mandary
[01:49] <fabbione> mandatory
[01:49] <fabbione> it works around 2 things atm
[01:49] <fabbione> ltrace is not for sparc
[01:49] <Kamion> yuh-huh, but I refuse to maintain that manually :)
[01:49] <fabbione> -> moved to the different $archs
[01:49] <Kamion> I can generate all this stuff automatically; I've been doing so for amd64/i386/powerpc for six months
[01:49] <fabbione> oh sure
[01:50] <Kamion> that's what required-base.py does
[01:50] <fabbione> it was just to show you how it should look after germinate output
[01:50] <fabbione> lvm2 and strace are FTBFS on sparc atm
[01:50] <fabbione> and libreadline5 is required to install a bunch of base
[01:50] <Kamion> that sounds like a bug, we got rid of it from hoary
[01:50] <fabbione> lvm2 needs to deal with a big 32/64 api/abi problem
[01:51] <Kamion> after a bunch of syncs from Debian
[01:51] <fabbione> Kamion: probably it will disappear after i finish to rebuild ubuntu on ubuntu
[01:51] <Kamion> should do
[01:51] <fabbione> but if i did build libreadline5 it means that it was in main at some point
[01:51] <Kamion> yes, it was
[01:52] <fabbione> well.. than some of my pkgs have used it
[01:52] <fabbione> and probably still are
[01:52] <Kamion> the build-deps should be tighter now
[01:52] <Kamion> we had to change them for sarge
[01:52] <fabbione> ok
[01:52] <fabbione> i will be back in 20 minutes
[01:52] <fabbione> gf is calling
[01:52] <fabbione> :(
[01:53] <Mithrandir> poor fabbione :)
[02:20] <jdub> fabbione: so you reckon i should wait a bit for hot ubuntu-on-sparc action?
[02:21] <fabbione> jdub: if you like to mess around no.. just do it
[02:21] <fabbione> but it's not trivial without mixing things around
[02:22] <fabbione> anyway.. i need to go and done some works in the house
[02:22] <jdub> might leave it a bit
[02:22] <jdub> :)
[02:23] <fabbione> yeah.. once they will enter the archive it will be very easy
[02:49] <daniels> Kamion: seeya there
[04:12] <Matt|> the version of evolution in hoary is beyond a joke - It's totally unusable. is there any chance of reverting to an older version?
[04:13] <azeem> Matt|: uhm, hoary is the development branch, right?
[04:13] <Matt|> yes
[04:14] <Matt|> but this version of evolution cannot be tested - it crashes so randomly that no profit is had by using it
[04:14] <Matt|> and i assume the problems are all upstream
[04:15] <lemsx1> Matt|, you are right about that... 2.1 is very unstable
[04:15] <carlos> Matt|: it works here
[04:15] <lemsx1> Matt|, and all upstream
[04:15] <carlos> 2.1.0
[04:15] <lemsx1> carlos, you don't use imap to access your mail right?
[04:16] <carlos> no, pops
[04:16] <Matt|> carlos, you don't get random crashing?
[04:16] <lemsx1> carlos, that's part of why it works for you... but does it crash at all?
[04:16] <Matt|> i use pop only and it's always crashing when I open messages and click on windows and all sorts
[04:17] <carlos> no, I got 0 crashes
[04:18] <carlos> and I'm using it since long ago
[04:19] <Matt|> well i don't know why mine is crashing then
[04:19] <Matt|> but i've seen all the problems in bugzilla
[04:20] <Matt|> and they all say "UPST"
[04:20] <Matt|> 3928 is a classic
[04:21] <Matt|> 3839, 3310, 3634
[04:23] <Matt|> i don't think this app should even be in the devel branch it's too rubbish
[04:23] <azeem> Matt|: evo is an important part of the desktop, so there is no use in just dodging problems
[04:24] <Matt|> but they are upstream problems. Could a previous version of evo not be used?
[04:25] <tseng> you are in the devel branch
[04:25] <tseng> it tracks devel versions of key components
[04:25] <tseng> it would suck to be at the end of hoarys 6 month cycle and just start adding this stuff
[04:25] <tseng> thats now how it works.
[04:25] <Matt|> you are right
[04:25] <tseng> if you want stable versions, see warty.
[04:26] <tseng> if you want to test the latest, keep tracking bugzilla :)
[04:26] <Matt|> tseng, i don't have the expertise to understand the complete randomness with which evolution crashes upon clicking on various parts of the window
[04:26] <Matt|> but i take your point
[04:27] <tseng> also, remember that evolution used to be developed by Ximian internally
[04:27] <tseng> they are still adjusting to the gnome proper way of things
[04:27] <tseng> like.. always stable devel branches :)
[04:28] <Matt|> yeah guess so
[04:28] <Matt|> they should have kept it separate ;)
[04:28] <tseng> no, it will be better someday
[04:28] <tseng> for everyone.
[04:28] <Matt|> here's hoping
[04:28] <tseng> :P
[04:29] <Matt|> if they integrate it too much into gnome they'll have to call it outlook express tho
[04:29] <tseng> not true
[04:30] <Matt|> well obviously not literally
[04:30] <tseng> it has a seperate backend for data storage that apps are integrating with
[04:30] <tseng> mostly not directly with the evolution client
[04:31] <Matt|> tseng, do you use #ubuntu?
[04:31] <Matt|> i want to ask you some questions about evolution but they are not really appropriate for this chan
[04:31] <tseng> sure.
[05:01] <elmo> cool
[05:02] <Matt|> does anyone know if anything is happening on bug 2711?
[05:05] <Nafallo> hi all! any drawbacks by mixing debian woody and ubuntu warty? I don't want my server without security updates.
[05:05] <Kamion> Ubuntu warty has security updates
[05:06] <Kamion> it also entirely supersedes woody by about two years; I wouldn't recommend mixing the two
[05:06] <Nafallo> Kamion: so do woody. that's why I run both of them on my current server :-).
[05:06] <azeem> you'd have to violate APT a lot to actually get those two to mix, I bet
[05:06] <Kamion> you probably *can*, but there's little point, since nearly every package in woody will be replaced by much newer versions in warty
[05:06] <Nafallo> azeem: in what way? :-)
[05:07] <azeem> what Kamion said
[05:07] <Nafallo> Kamion: nope, I couldn't find the jabber server for example :-/.
[05:07] <elmo> it's in universe
[05:08] <Nafallo> elmo: and that repo hasn't got security updates :-).
[05:09] <Kamion> well, it would depend on whether woody's jabber actually works with woody ...
[05:09] <Kamion> er, with warty
[05:09] <Nafallo> Kamion: it does :-)
[05:09] <Nafallo> Kamion: everything I got currently running does :-).
[05:09] <Kamion> then that should be ok
[05:10] <Nafallo> oki. I'll run mixed system a while longer then :-).
[05:15] <GotD0t> have there been any reports of nano not closing when it should?
[05:17] <eruin> new udev = camera broken ;o
[05:36] <eruin> what info would I need to submit for a bug report on my (supported by gphoto2) camera suddenly not working after the last udev upgrade?
[05:37] <eruin> not even familiar with which packages are involved in this sort of thing
[05:40] <azeem> eruin: is the camera displayed by hal-device-manager?
[05:41] <eruin> azeem: yep
[05:41] <eruin> via tech. vt82x -> dx4330 -> usb ptp interface
[05:42] <azeem> best info in that case would be the kernel log, probably
[05:42] <azeem> and perhaps gnome-volume-manager output if you start it from the console (if there is any)
[05:43] <eruin> kill it and restart in console?
[05:44] <azeem> worth a try I guess
[05:44] <eruin> kernel log hasnt got anything since last boot though
[05:44] <azeem> and /var/log/messages
[05:44] <azeem> ?
[05:45] <eruin> Nov 27 17:41:31 localhost usb.agent[4900] :      libgphoto2: loaded successfully
[05:46] <Matt|> kernel panic when booting after last hoary upgrade
[05:47] <Matt|> i think it is just a grub error
[05:52] <azeem> eruin: anything about USB and devices?
[05:52] <eruin> azeem: gnome-volume-manager had some interesting output
[05:52] <eruin> I'll get a pastebin
[05:52] <eruin> http://pastebin.com/123940
[05:53] <eruin> the errors output when pressing import
[05:54] <azeem> looks informative for a bug report, possibly with some more HAL/udev /var/log/messages log output
[05:54] <azeem> pitti is the guy who knows about this, but he's not around
[05:55] <eruin> I'll keep the info saved in a text file for now
[05:56] <eruin> what's pittis timezone?
[05:56] <eruin> the only relevant thing I can find in var/log/messages is that libgphoto was loaded successfully though
[05:57] <sjoerd> eruin: GMT+1 or GMT+2
[05:57] <eruin> oh, same as me
[05:57] <azeem> well, it's weekend :(
[05:57] <azeem> eh, :(
[05:57] <eruin> hehe yeah
[05:57] <azeem> eh, :)
[05:57] <sjoerd> eruin: what's going wrong ? gthumb doesn't pop up ?
[05:58] <eruin> gthumb pops up, but hal screams about no property info.capabilites on the device after gphoto pops us
[05:58] <eruin> up*
[05:58] <eruin> well thanks for help gathering info azeem :)
[05:58] <sjoerd> that's normal, the endpoints don't have capabilities
[05:58] <azeem> eruin: sjoerd is the guy as well
[05:58] <sjoerd> eruin: but if gthumb pops up what's wrong ? 
[05:59] <eruin> it says there are no images ont he device
[05:59] <eruin> and "no cameras found" is in the left pane
[05:59] <eruin> err scratch that
[06:00] <eruin> gthumb says cannot import pictures - no cameras found
[06:00] <sjoerd> ah
[06:00] <eruin> it did however work fine just a few days ago ;)
[06:01] <sjoerd> check in /proc/bus/usb what the permissions for the camera endpoints are ?
[06:03] <sjoerd> there should be some of root.plugdev or root.camera
[06:03] <eruin> if hal-device-manager lists the camera as the first device on controller #4, that means /proc/usb/004/001 ?
[06:03] <eruin> 007 in there was modified recently
[06:04] <eruin> and says root.plugdev
[06:04] <eruin> -rw-rw----
[06:04] <eruin> yeah thats definately it
[06:05] <eruin> should I try changing those?
[06:05] <sjoerd> no that's the way it should be
[06:05] <eruin> crap ;)
[06:05] <smurfix> Hmm. Do this:
[06:06] <smurfix> strace gphoto2 -n 2>&1 | grep EPERM
[06:06] <eruin> done
[06:06] <smurfix> that should display the usb device it has a permission problem with
[06:07] <sjoerd> eruin: oh and check your in the plugdev group (just to be sure)
[06:07] <smurfix> assuming that's the problem, that is
[06:07] <eruin> I'm not
[06:07] <smurfix> ah
[06:07] <smurfix> you should be
[06:07] <azeem> eruin: how did you install ubuntu?
[06:07] <eruin> minimal warty -> sources to hoary -> hoary
[06:08] <azeem> warty final?
[06:08] <azeem> when was plugdev introduced?
[06:09] <sjoerd> dunno
[06:09] <sjoerd> eruin: is your user on the system the user which was made during install or did you add it later
[06:09] <Nafallo> warty final
[06:09] <eruin> azeem: yeah, the cds canonical shipped
[06:09] <lamont> moo
[06:09] <Nafallo> atleast my system has it ;-)
[06:09] <eruin> sjoerd: made during install
[06:09] <azeem> eruin: what groups are you in?
[06:09] <eruin> only thing I've done to it manually is adding it to the src group
[06:09] <eruin> eruin adm dialout cdrom floppy audio src
[06:10] <Nafallo> odd
[06:10] <eruin> I'll logout/login and see if adding myself to plugdev solved it
[06:11] <eruin> brb
[06:11] <Nafallo>  video plugdev lpadmin scanner <-- those are also added on warty final :-).
[06:13] <eruin> yup, adding to plugdev did the trick ;)
[06:13] <azeem> 18:09 < Nafallo>  video plugdev lpadmin scanner <-- those are also added on warty final :-).
[06:14] <eruin> hmmm
[06:14] <eruin> well, I ordered the cds about two months ago
[06:15] <eruin> version 4.10 is all they state
[06:15] <Nafallo> eruin: I'm running 4.10 (warty) amd64, and those got added when base-config set my account up :-).
[06:16] <eruin> that's odd
[06:16] <Nafallo> hmm, I'll check my girlfriends puter. she's running i386, and not a laptop either...
[06:18] <Nafallo> she got those groups to.
[06:18] <eruin> meh!
[06:18] <eruin> what could I have done to get them removed?
[06:19] <eruin> and why did the camera suddenly stop working now as opposed to a couple of days ago? :)
[06:19] <Nafallo> eruin: don't look at me. I haven't touched them ;-P
[06:20] <eruin> I'll test a fresh install on another partition tomorrow
[06:41] <lamont> make[1] : Entering directory `/build/buildd/syck-0.42'
[06:41] <lamont> /usr/local/bin/bash ./config.status --recheck
[06:41] <lamont> make[1] : /usr/local/bin/bash: Command not found
[06:41] <lamont> hehe
[08:05] <daniels> ssssssssssvvvvvvvvvvvveeeeeeeeeeeeeeennnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn!
[08:08] <daniels> elmo: could you please install l-r-m b-d's (rpm, sed, sharutils, bzip2, module-init-tools, linux-headers-2.6.8.1-3-*) on davis?
[08:10] <elmo> done
[08:11] <daniels> thanks
[08:11] <daniels> could you please take l-r-m-2.6.8.1 out of it's p-a-s or n-f-u, also?
[08:13] <elmo> it'll build?
[08:13] <elmo> err, never mind
[08:13] <daniels> it will with 2.6.8.1.4-1, yes
[08:13] <daniels> amd64 gains madwifi, powerpc gains madwifi, ia64 gains nvidia (and nvidia/fglrx/madwifi all get new versions)
[08:15] <elmo> it's not p-a-s'ed, it's n-f-u... when the source hits jackass, I'll force g-b
[08:16] <elmo> [I think buildds infect people with acronymitis... hmm.] 
[08:18] <Nafallo> hmm, kewl encryption ;-)
[08:19] <daniels> cheers
[08:19] <daniels> s/it
[08:19] <daniels> s/it's/its/
[08:37] <daniels> elmo: you're running pychecker on katie??
[08:39] <elmo> I always run pychecker
[08:39] <elmo> katie's not exactly pychecker clean, but I run it
[08:40] <daniels> ahr
[08:40] <daniels> heh :)
[08:48] <Ferry> hi anyone else having probs with samba support in nautilus with hoary. It sees the machines but i cant connect the password window never pops up
[08:48] <Ferry> sorry wrong chan
[09:26] <sivang> anybody has an idea of the D-LINK DWL-650 will be good enough for mataro? considering it has 100m limit inside buildings..
[09:26] <sivang> ?
[09:57] <sjoerd> pitti: morning 
[09:57] <pitti> Hi sjoerd
[09:57] <sjoerd> hal 0.4.1-2 uploaded :) (yeah, finally)
[10:02] <pitti> sjoerd: by now I just saw a reject message
[10:02] <sjoerd> ?
[10:02] <pitti> sjoerd: but I did not yet came to the debian folder in my crowded mailbox
[10:03] <pitti> sjoerd: ah, here it is
[10:04] <pitti> sjoerd: congrats!
[10:04] <pitti> sjoerd: I will package it for Ubuntu at Monday
[10:04] <sjoerd> cool
[10:04] <pitti> sjoerd: I put udev 0.046 into Ubuntu yesterday, works great
[10:06] <sjoerd> nice.. >= 0.046-2 is also working nicely here
[10:06] <jdub> Md doesn't sound too happy about not getting our patches straight away
[10:07] <pitti> jdub: what do you mean?
[10:07] <sjoerd> in his blog you mean ?
[10:08] <jdub> yeah
[10:08] <pitti> jdub: I synced the udev package yesterday, it has everything we patched (but the LSB'ified init script)
[10:08] <pitti> sjoerd: can you please look at #283216?
[10:08] <sjoerd> that's a ubuntu or a debian but ?
[10:08] <sjoerd> uh bug
[10:08] <pitti> sjoerd: if you took something similar to the Ubuntu storage policy, this should be fixed with the new hal
[10:09] <pitti> sjoerd: Debian
[10:09] <sjoerd> oh diggers but
[10:09] <sjoerd> (i asked him to put that in the bts)
[10:10] <sjoerd> i talked about that to davidz, but apparently it's an fhs violation
[10:10] <sjoerd> bah i'm blinkd
[10:10] <sjoerd> and i can't type
[10:10] <pitti> sjoerd: ??? I'm confused
[10:11] <sjoerd> pitti: ignore what i said, i was looking at the wrong bug :)
[10:11] <sjoerd> 283216 should be indeed fixed now
[10:17] <pitti> night, guys
[10:18] <winkle> Is there a diff between debian and ubuntu dh-make?
[10:20] <winkle> i'm guessing no
[10:20] <daniels> doubt it
[10:50] <daniels> elmo: linux-headers-2.6.8.1-3-power{3,4,pc}{,-smp}
[10:50] <daniels> elmo: (davis, pls)
[11:57] <elmo> done
[11:59] <daniels> include/asm/setup.h:8:28: asm-m68k/setup.h: No such file or directory
[11:59] <daniels> WHAT