[01:33] <wasabi> huh. i wonder if making xserver kick off dpkg-reconfigure on itself when it fails to start is a good idea.
[01:33] <wasabi> heh.
[01:33] <wasabi> !!! HACK !!!
[02:20] <bob2> how annoying
[02:20] <bob2> my laptop will only associate with my AP for about 20 seconds
[02:20] <bob2> then it drops
[02:55] <yann_> hello :)
[02:55] <yann_> any webmaster of ubuntulinux.org, or a way to contact one of theme? didn't get any answer to my mails :/
[02:56] <yann_> we're creating a french support site for ubuntu, including a forum, would be nice if there could be a link in http://www.ubuntulinux.org/community/forums/
[03:14] <bob2> who did you email?
[03:15] <yann_> info & webmaster @ ubuntulinux.org
[03:20] <bob2> when?
[03:20] <yann_> the first about a month ago, the second about 2 weeks ago
[03:21] <yann_> both were about a french site about ubuntu
[03:23] <yann_> 12/13/2004 07:33 PM
[03:23] <yann_> from etheeten@gmail.com
[03:23] <yann_> if that could help you :|
[03:23] <yann_> that was to trademarks@ubuntulinux.org
[03:25] <yann_> the first mail is from 11/30/2004 01:54 AM , to info@ubuntulinux.org, from yann@mandragor.org
[03:25] <yann_> does that help? :|
[03:34] <yann_> well, do you think I should try to mail again? :/
[04:52] <bob2> hm, no cds yet
[04:53] <bob2> mako: if the cds claimed to have shipped on nov 8th, but aren't here yet, is it time to start wondering?
[04:56] <calc> wow that is a while
[04:57] <calc> i got mine back at thanksgiving
[05:31] <bob2> daniels: my X laptop gets very unhappy when I start a second X server
[06:34] <wasabi> I still haven't gotten mine either.
[06:34] <wasabi> CD's that is.
[06:36] <bob2> have you checked shipit.ubuntu.com?
[06:41] <kergan> how long does it take on average
[06:42] <bob2> depends on when you order
[06:42] <bob2> they go out in bunches
[06:42] <kergan> i orderd them aroung turkey day
[06:42] <kergan> and not it finaly told me thay sent them on the 6th of this month
[06:44] <bob2> should be there very soon then
[06:47] <kylem> bob2, i've the same problem. (same ship date too)
[06:47] <kergan> 2 weeks
[06:47] <kergan> really
[06:47] <kergan> wow thats fast specaly since its the x-mas malling seasion
[07:00] <calc> they are shipped from switzerland i think
[07:00] <calc> so probably takes a while
[07:00] <fabbione> morning
[07:00] <calc> fabbione: hi
[07:08] <doko> morning all
[07:10] <fabbione> hey doko
[07:10] <fabbione> doko: we need a 64bit gcc for ppc
[07:13] <doko> fabbione: see on chinstrap:~doko/gcc/
[07:14] <fabbione> sw33t
[07:14] <fabbione> why isn't uploaded?
[07:16] <doko> it's C only, we don't a 64bit glibc, no priority, ...
[07:16] <fabbione> doko: we need the gcc for the 64bit kernel :-)
[07:16] <fabbione> the rest can wait
[07:17] <fabbione> doko: we will need a very minimal amount of packages in 64 bit
[07:17] <calc> just buy an x86-64 ;)
[07:18] <fabbione> like gcc, libc, ncurses and something like sparc-utils
[07:18] <calc> does ubuntu work on g5's already?
[07:18] <fabbione> calc: our buildd are g5
[07:18] <calc> cool
[07:18] <fabbione> but they are running UP/32bit
[07:18] <calc> oh
[07:18] <fabbione> because of kernel limitations
[07:18] <calc> that kinda sucks, wasting half of the system then
[07:19] <calc> is it numa like amd64?
[07:19] <fabbione> that's why we need gcc 64bit & so on...
[07:19] <fabbione> no idea...
[07:19] <fabbione> i am not into ppc at all
[07:19] <calc> oh ok
[07:19] <fabbione> i just need to prepare the kernel for elmo to test at the datacenter :)
[07:20] <doko> 32bit apps on ppc are usually faster.
[07:20] <fabbione> doko: it is like sparc
[07:20] <calc> 32bit is usually faster in general except when you have a braindead arch like x86
[07:20] <fabbione> 64bit kernel, 32 bit userland
[07:20] <fabbione> and only a few userland packages in 64bit
[07:20] <fabbione> like pgsql and stuff like that
[07:20] <calc> a 32bit x86-64 would be interesting
[07:21] <calc> i wonder if it would be even faster (if its even possible to force it into such a mode)
[07:24] <fabbione> installing on 9600bps serial console is the pain
[07:26] <wasabi> dont suppose anybody who knows much about preseeding base-config is awake
[07:31] <fabbione> wasabi: just ask
[07:32] <wasabi> Well.... trying to find the right preseeding values to get hoary's base-config to skip everything.
[07:32] <wasabi> Tried everything I can and it's still asking for username, passwor,d and showing the welcome and timezone screens
[07:33] <fabbione> wasabi: preseeding isn't always enough
[07:33] <fabbione> you need to workaround some debconf priorities as well
[07:33] <wasabi> Hmmm.
[07:33] <wasabi> Well, not sure how to adjust the priorities of base-config, which is started automatically.
[07:34] <fabbione> you need to edit the scripts
[07:34] <wasabi> the base-config scripts?
[07:34] <fabbione> yes
[07:34] <wasabi> nuh.
[07:34] <wasabi> buh.
[07:34] <wasabi> that's not easy. =/
[07:37] <fabbione> i never said it was :)
[07:37] <wasabi> I was just hoping.
[07:37] <wasabi> It should be easier.
[07:39] <wasabi> So, there a howto? ;0
[07:40] <fabbione> just read the code? ;)
[07:40] <wasabi> =(
[07:56] <pitti> Morning
[08:10] <fabbione> hey pitti
[09:11] <pitti> Hi mvo
[09:12] <mvo> hi pitti 
[09:28] <sid77> hi
[09:43] <pitti> Hi seb128 
[09:44] <Treenaks> "seb128 broke my gnome" ?
[09:44] <seb128> morning
[09:44] <seb128> (mataro server)
[09:44] <seb128> Treenaks: hum ?
[09:44] <Treenaks> seb128: why did I have to rm ~/.gnome2/session to make my panel work again? :)
[09:45] <seb128> "seb128 broke your panel"
[09:45] <Treenaks> seb128: and nautilus.. I couldn't right-click on the desktop either
[09:45] <seb128> Treenaks: killall gnome-vfs-daemon nautilus gnome-panel trashapplet
[09:45] <seb128> nothing to do with the session
[09:45] <seb128> that's a gnome-vfs-daemon bug
[09:45] <Treenaks> seb128: removing the session fixed it for me
[09:46] <seb128> no
[09:46] <seb128> restarting fixed it
[09:46] <seb128> no ?
[09:46] <seb128> the bug doesn't happen every time
[09:46] <Treenaks> seb128: no, I tried to log in 3 times -- each time the panel "hung".. removing the session file -> it worked again
[09:47] <Treenaks> seb128: so that was a coincidence?
[09:47] <seb128> yep
[09:47] <seb128> you have kept the session ?
[09:48] <Treenaks> I moved it aside instead of rm'ing it, so yes
[09:48] <Treenaks> not that I used it for anything but starting gaim.. but hey
[09:48] <seb128> you can retry to put it again and see if it bugs
[09:49] <Treenaks> tonight, when I'm with the machine again :)
[09:49] <seb128> ok
[09:49] <seb128> if the session is broken open a bug with it :)
[09:51] <seb128> brrr
[09:51] <seb128> -9C according to my weather
[09:51] <seb128> at least now it feels like december :)
[09:55] <Treenaks> 8)
[10:19] <pitti> daniels: ping
[10:20] <pitti> Kamion: already awake?
[10:25] <pitti> Keybuk: here?
[10:26] <seb128> pitti: apparently you are the only one working here :p
[10:26] <fabbione> pitti: daniels is in vac...
[10:26] <pitti> yes, I remembered about daniels as soon as I hit enter :-/
[10:27] <pitti> I need a native English speaker to review an USN text
[10:27] <mvo> pitti: how can I train pmount to not sync mount certain volumes in warty? i.e. external HDs
[10:28] <pitti> mvo: upgrade to hal/pmount/gvm of Hoary :-)
[10:28] <pitti> mvo: seriously, this is not trivial in Warty
[10:28] <pitti> mvo: the easiest solution is probably to add an fstab entry
[10:28] <mvo> pitti: aye, thanks#
[10:29] <pitti> gosh, all channels are so quiet today - it almost feels like it was christmas, or so...
[10:30] <ogra> heh
[10:30] <seb128_> I can make some noise if you want :p
[10:30] <mvo> lalalalala
[10:30] <ogra> lololo
[10:30] <mvo> let's sing a christmas song
[10:30] <mvo> ;)
[10:30] <ogra> hehe
[10:31] <pitti>  Frhliche Weihnacht berall 
[10:31] <Treenaks> *shudder*
[10:31] <ogra> lalalalalala la lala
[10:31] <mvo> Treenaks: come on, now a dutch one !
[10:31] <ogra> yay
[10:31] <pitti> 
[10:32] <seb128_>  lalala
[10:38] <wasabi> *bathes
[10:54] <seb128> hum
[10:54] <seb128> and now
[10:54] <seb128> /usr/bin/env: python: No such file or directory
[10:54] <seb128> (running dput)
[10:55] <pitti> seb128: if it gives you a better feeling, my python XML support is gone, too
[10:55] <seb128> :(
[10:55] <pitti> Mithrandir: ping
[11:09] <fabbione> doko: did you realize that you uploaded gcc3.4 as native package?
[11:09] <fabbione> no
[11:09] <fabbione> nevermind
[11:09] <fabbione> i am on crack
[11:10] <Kamion> pitti: yo
[11:10] <fabbione> Kamion: i did bootstrap the sparc :-)
[11:11] <Kamion> cool
[11:11] <fabbione> plenty of problems, but nothing unfixable
[11:11] <fabbione> for some reasons d-i installed a -smp kernel (=kabuum)
[11:11] <Kamion> that's easy to sort out
[11:11] <fabbione> and it didn't find silo-installer or couldn't install silo for some reasons
[11:12] <fabbione> and it did add restricted to sources.list
[11:12] <fabbione> that's another kabuum
[11:12] <fabbione> probably 2 of them are related
[11:12] <Kamion> not really interested in kludging the restricted thing for sparc only; fix your archive :)
[11:13] <fabbione> Kamion: well... there is nothing restricted for sparc...
[11:13] <Kamion> for the rest, can you send me /var/log/debian-installer/syslog from the installed system?
[11:13] <fabbione> but yeah...
[11:13] <fabbione> i will fix my archive
[11:13] <Kamion> sure, but d-i doesn't get to know that
[11:13] <fabbione> sure i can
[11:13] <Kamion> the silo thing is weird
[11:14] <fabbione> it might be something wrong on the archive... i didn't spend too much time on it
[11:14] <Kamion> oh, *crap*, silo-installer is RETARDED
[11:14] <Kamion> ok, that's silo-installer brokenness which needs to be fixed
[11:14] <fabbione> Kamion: oh.. ok
[11:15] <Kamion> unfortunately it means a string change
[11:16] <fabbione> Kamion: hmmm
[11:16] <Kamion> it might be easier to kludge it by unexcluding silo from debootstrap for now
[11:17] <fabbione> Kamion: no rush....
[11:17] <fabbione> it is more important to get the correct kernel
[11:17] <fabbione> at least in the beginning
[11:17] <Kamion> fabbione: what does the 'ncpus probed' line in /proc/cpuinfo look like?
[11:18] <fabbione> ncpus probed    : 1
[11:18] <fabbione> this is with 2.6.8 from debian
[11:18] <Kamion> fabbione: hm, is linux-sparc64 in your archive?
[11:18] <Kamion> it's in restricted ... :)
[11:19] <fabbione> Kamion: the most important thing is that i need to figure why the console hangs at the end of the boot process
[11:19] <fabbione> isn't that from linux-meta?
[11:19] <Kamion> actually it might not be in restricted, haven't checked
[11:19] <Kamion> yes
[11:19] <mako> bob2: yeah, it may be a problem.. i am making a list of probably borked cds
[11:19] <mako> bob2: shipments that is.. i'll be contacting the companya bout them
[11:19] <fabbione> linux-sparc64_2.6.9-4_sparc.deb
[11:19] <mako> bob2: i have a half a dozen now
[11:20] <fabbione> Kamion: i get this in main
[11:20] <Kamion> hm
[11:20] <Kamion> /var/log/debian-installer/syslog definitely needed to debug
[11:20] <fabbione> i did send you the mail....
[11:20] <fabbione> did you get it?
[11:20] <Kamion> haven't read mail yet this morning
[11:20] <fabbione> ah ok
[11:20] <fabbione> take your time
[11:21] <fabbione> i need to go and cut my hairs
[11:21] <fabbione> + the buildd is catching up
[11:21] <fabbione> all that lsb-* is crap on console :-)
[11:21] <fabbione> it looks really really really hugly
[11:21] <seb128> doko: here ?
[11:22] <wasabi> waaaah
[11:23] <Kamion> wasabi: you know that the username/password stuff is in shadow not base-config, right?
[11:23] <wasabi> i can't even get the welcoem screen to go away.
[11:24] <wasabi> but no, i didn't.
[11:24] <Kamion> # Avoid the introductory message.
[11:24] <Kamion> base-config     base-config/intro       note
[11:24] <Kamion> does that not work?
[11:24] <wasabi> i have that, and no.
[11:25] <wasabi> # Skip the two initial welcome screens.
[11:25] <wasabi> base-config     base-config/title       title
[11:25] <wasabi> base-config     base-config/intro       note
[11:25] <wasabi> base-config     base-config/login       note
[11:25] <wasabi> i've got those.
[11:25] <wasabi> s/two/three
[11:25] <wasabi> heh
[11:25] <wasabi> s/two// =/
[11:25] <Kamion> title isn't a question anyway
[11:25] <wasabi> yeah i just saw it in debconf-get-selections and figured i'd give it a try
[11:26] <Kamion> would probably be easiest to figure out how to get base-config's debconf priority to critical
[11:27] <wasabi> so the passwd stuff is shadow now, not passwd?
[11:27] <wasabi> the manual says passwd.
[11:27] <Kamion> might require adding a base-config/priority template for preseeding; I was ordered to stop Ubuntu copying debconf/priority from the first stage
[11:27] <wasabi> or something does, or i wouldn't have done it.
[11:27] <Kamion> passwd is from the shadow source package; sure, passwd
[11:28] <wasabi> i dont know enough about templates and stuff yet.
[11:28] <wasabi> im just a user trying to deploy ubuntu today
[11:28] <Kamion> I'm at least partially talking to myself ... :)
[11:29] <wasabi> if i can get this working, fai is going to die an ugly death
[11:29] <wasabi> because i like this much better.
[11:29] <Kamion> ok, how about I add base-config/priority for you now in 2.60ubuntu4
[11:29] <wasabi> for obvious reasons.
[11:29] <wasabi> sounds good!
[11:30] <wasabi> Yeah I like the idea of having a seperate setting for base-config
[11:30] <wasabi> could be useful in certain circumstances.
[11:32] <ajmitch_> morning
[11:39] <Kamion> jdub: can I add silo to base for sparc?
[11:42] <wasabi> Kamion: are you making that change now or later? just wondering so I can stop paying attention tonight.
[11:43] <Kamion> fabbione: aha, you and ia64 share a bug, found it and am fixing now
[11:43] <Kamion> wasabi: right after this fix for Fabio
[11:43] <wasabi> you dont' have to worry about it
[11:43] <Kamion> I think it's important though
[11:43] <wasabi> oh okay. ;)
[11:44] <Kamion> lamont: tomorrow's CD should fix the ia64 kernel brokenness
[11:44] <Kamion> (in d-i)
[11:57] <Kamion> wasabi: uploaded. when you see base-config_2.60ubuntu4_all.deb in the archive, try 'base-config base-config/priority select critical'
[11:57] <wasabi> super. You rock.
[11:57] <wasabi> thank you drive thru
[11:58] <Kamion> untested though :)
[11:59] <wasabi> fun
[11:59] <mvo> Kamion: is the hoary i386-cdimage of today safe to use? 
[11:59] <Kamion> mvo: no idea, probably not
[12:00] <Kamion> mvo: it includes python2.4-minimal and so needs a debootstrap update, which I'm doing now
[12:01] <mvo> is there a date that you can recommend :) ?
[12:01] <Kamion> 20041220 would be my first guess but I haven't tried it
[12:01] <mvo> ah, thanks
[12:01] <mvo> I'll give it a try then. I need a current cd to test upgrading from it 
[12:32] <fabbione> Kamion: cool.. what was the bug?
[12:33] <fabbione> whoops :-)
[12:33] <fabbione> i can see from the changes ;)
[12:55] <pitti> fabbione: is there a ppc or i386 dchroot somewhere with kernel build-deps?
[12:56] <fabbione> yup
[12:56] <fabbione> ppc davis
[12:57] <pitti> cool, thanks
[12:57] <pitti> fabbione: i386 somewhere?
[12:57] <fabbione> i386.. hmm probably macaroni
[12:57] <fabbione> otherwise send me the diff and i will build it for you
[12:58] <pitti> fabbione: I don't need a full build to start with; I will probably trim down the .config for my host and test there
[12:59] <pitti> fabbione: I would like to start with the PaX kernel
[12:59] <fabbione> pitti: ah i see
[12:59] <fabbione> good luck :-)
[12:59] <pitti> fabbione: thanks!
[12:59] <pitti> fabbione: btw, SSP really rocks
[12:59] <fabbione> pitti: eheheh
[12:59] <fabbione> you are a security bitch
[12:59] <pitti> fabbione: basically, with SSP you can forget about buffer overflow USNs
[01:00] <fabbione> yeah i was there for you taking notes man
[01:00] <pitti> I know
[01:00] <fabbione> "Why don't we chroot X?"
[01:00] <pitti> but now I saw it in action
[01:00] <pitti> and digged through the theory
[01:02] <pitti> fabbione: it seems that I don't have access to macaroni
[01:02] <fabbione> pitti: you need to talk with elmo
[01:02] <pitti> fabbione: anyway, let's start with ppc then
[01:02] <pitti> fabbione: I do when he returns
[01:02] <fabbione> otherwise send me the stuff i will build here
[01:13] <Kamion> stupid pile of shit deliberately throws away all errors generated about the .changes
[01:15] <wasabi> Kamion: priority looks good... somehow I can't find the choice to get past the tiemzone. Asking for the Eastern, Central, etc.
[01:15] <wasabi> base-config     tzconfig/choose_contry_zone/US  select  Central
[01:15] <Kamion> you've misspelled country there
[01:16] <wasabi> HAHA
[01:16] <wasabi> ohh geeze
[01:17] <wasabi> heh. im at work now... been doing server upgrades all night
[01:17] <wasabi> I've been awake 24 hours. Forgive me.
[01:17] <Kamion> np :)
[01:18] <sid77> hi
[01:25] <fabbione> the kernel package is insane
[01:25] <fabbione> i am not sure i want to redo it from scratch
[01:36] <pitti> seb128: you broke the panel again!!!
[01:36] <pitti> seb128: I get bombarded with neverending error dialogs
[01:36] <pitti> seb128: :-)
[01:36] <seb128> arf
[01:47] <AndyFitz> okay this is silly.  and I have no idea how to resolve the problem.  gnome doesnt load and all that is shown is the panel position ( left blank ) and the desktops background colour ( not image )
[01:47] <Treenaks> AndyFitz: apparently logging in a few times fixes it
[01:47] <AndyFitz> I thought it was gconfd  because even on new user accounts it happens
[01:47] <Treenaks> no then it's gnome-vfs-daemon
[01:48] <AndyFitz> sorry ill move this to #ubuntu
[01:48] <Treenaks> AndyFitz: no, just poke seb128 :)
[01:48] <seb128> killall gnome-vfs-daemon nautilus gnome-panel trashapplet
[01:49] <AndyFitz> I've gone as far as to create new user acounts and also to completely reinstall gnome entirely
[01:49] <AndyFitz> seb128: it must be gnome-session  
[01:49] <AndyFitz> because I can load xfce4 fine 
[01:50] <usual> AndyFitz, hey
[01:50] <AndyFitz> and from there 'sometimes'  I can loat gnome-panel  
[01:50] <AndyFitz> hiya usual
[01:50] <usual> AndyFitz, havn't seen ya in a while on gaim.
[01:50] <usual> doh I got a new screenname, maybe thats why
[01:51] <AndyFitz> usual, I've been online on jabber icq irc aol msn etc etc 
[01:51] <usual> AndyFitz, yea, I forgot I changed my screenname
[01:51] <usual> AndyFitz, hows it goin
[01:51] <AndyFitz> good but something broke my gnome :P
[01:51] <usual> what happens?
[01:52] <AndyFitz> see above
[01:52] <usual> ahh
[01:52] <usual> AndyFitz, are your panels there but blank?
[01:53] <AndyFitz> yep
[01:53] <AndyFitz> but only sometimes
[01:54] <AndyFitz> I think if I've uses sudo recently they seem to work   although I'm not sure
[01:54] <usual> AndyFitz, it happened to me too yesterday and the day before, but it seems fine now
[01:54] <AndyFitz> uses = used 
[01:54] <usual> AndyFitz, I nuked the .hastodowithgnomedir's and it seemed to have helped
[01:55] <AndyFitz> I already tried nuking them
[01:55] <AndyFitz> the problem came back
[01:55] <usual> :(
[01:55] <AndyFitz> it was fixed for one login 
[01:56] <usual> AndyFitz, hows the icon set coming btw
[01:56] <usual> looks good
[01:57] <AndyFitz> usual, thanks I'm reworking them to suit  brisgeek.com/etiquette/
[01:58] <usual> AndyFitz, full set for gnome?
[01:58] <AndyFitz> andy.fitzsimon.com.au/etiquette-icons.tar.gz  is there but very incomplete
[01:59] <usual> AndyFitz, I came across your site for it the other day on gnome-look.org, I like it all but the metacity theme
[01:59] <AndyFitz> usual:  theres over 2,000 icons in whats considered a full set for gnome :-/  and I keep changing styles / xml rules 
[01:59] <usual> ah
[02:00] <AndyFitz> the metacity theme I have in the gimp screenshot ? 
[02:00] <AndyFitz> its also here http://andy.fitzsimon.com.au/icons.png 
[02:01] <haggai> pitti: pong :)
[02:01] <AndyFitz> the hover state for the buttons shows their type
[02:01] <usual> yea, it looks alot better in thie shot
[02:02] <usual> AndyFitz, can't wait to give them a try
[02:02] <usual> nice trashcan
[02:02] <AndyFitz> roberTO did that for the milk gtk theme  I really like it yeah but was going to make my own pixmap based gtk theme first before considering what metacity to use
[02:03] <usual> k
[02:04] <AndyFitz> usual, download and check them out now ,  I'm currently using them at 16x16 on my gnome-panel, they were designed to scale below my other stuff
[02:04] <usual> AndyFitz, are they avilible somewhere
[02:04] <AndyFitz> andy.fitzsimon.com.au/etiquette-icons.tar.gz
[02:05] <AndyFitz> should work
[02:05] <fabbione> bob2: the BenH patch doesn't even compile
[02:05] <usual> got em
[02:05] <fabbione> arch/ppc/platforms/pmac_cache.S: Assembler messages:
[02:05] <fabbione> arch/ppc/platforms/pmac_cache.S:49: Error: Unrecognized opcode: `dssall'
[02:05] <fabbione> arch/ppc/platforms/pmac_cache.S:167: Error: Unrecognized opcode: `dssall'
[02:05] <fabbione> bum
[02:06] <AndyFitz> the default size is 48x48 like normal pixmap icons.   lila, gartoon and the industrial gnome-vfs icons  are all 92x92 I think
[02:06] <Kamion> that's odd, it compiled fine for me
[02:06] <usual> AndyFitz, wierd, I put them in the icon folder, it shows the icon in the theme app, but no icons changed
[02:06] <robtaylor> hey, is hoary working enough now that its worth upgrading to?
[02:07] <usual> robtaylor, I use it daily with little trouble
[02:07] <robtaylor> usual: cool, upgrade it is then ;)
[02:07] <fabbione> Kamion: i am using -7.diff on davis...
[02:07] <AndyFitz> usual: that happens sometimes with gnome-themes-manager ,  next login they will work
[02:07] <usual> ok
[02:07] <usual> brb
[02:08] <Kamion> fabbione: which flavour is failing?
[02:08] <fabbione> power3
[02:08] <fabbione> at least...
[02:08] <Kamion> DSSALL is used in other places in arch/ppc/
[02:08] <fabbione> this is the first one that gets to build
[02:09] <fabbione> yes i know.. but they don't get compiled on power3 apparently
[02:09] <Kamion> best ask benh I suspect
[02:09] <mvo> ping doko
[02:10] <fabbione> yeah.. they don't get compiled
[02:10] <fabbione> probably is just an ifdef somewhere
[02:11] <Kamion> elmo_away: please sync groff 1.18.1.1-5 from Debian
[02:13] <pitti> Kamion: sorry for the groff upload; I worked through a modem yesterday and didn't bother to check sid again
[02:13] <Kamion> np
[02:13] <fabbione> Kamion: can you confirm that the patch is used only by power4 ?
[02:14] <Kamion> fabbione: deny
[02:14] <Kamion> power4 != G4
[02:14] <fabbione> (for what is my understanding of ppc arch anyway)
[02:15] <Kamion> I don't know if it should be used only by the powerpc flavours; it contains a number of other updates beyond just sleep so I'd be wary of making that assumption
[02:15] <fabbione> Kamion: how can i identify that via CONFIG_* in the kernel?
[02:15] <Kamion> don't try, ask benh to fix it :)
[02:15] <fabbione> Kamion: the other changes are more generic
[02:15] <Kamion> I know
[02:15] <fabbione> and they compile (therefor they can be shipped) on all the other arches
[02:15] <fabbione> ;)
[02:16] <pitti> so it compiles, it ... ?
[02:16] <Kamion> CONFIG_6xx is the kernel used on most powerpc systems, including G4 laptops
[02:17] <Kamion> G5 systems are CONFIG_POWER4
[02:17] <Kamion> I would imagine we'll see PowerBook G5 systems in a year or two
[02:20] <fabbione> hopefully in one year or two all this extra patching won't be required 
[02:23] <fabbione> it looks like that only power3 doesn't have that DSSALL
[02:26] <Kamion> fabbione: where's DSSALL defined?
[02:26] <fabbione> Kamion: ENOCLUE
[02:26] <fabbione> it looks like something in binutils
[02:26] <fabbione> grep doesn't return anything useful
[02:27] <srbaker> anyone know of squeak packages for ubuntu?
[02:27] <srbaker> or, even squeak for debian that i could recompile?
[02:27] <Treenaks> squeak?
[02:27] <Treenaks> Simira: same one, or cooler one? :P)
[02:27] <Simira> squeak, Treenaks 
[02:27] <srbaker> smalltalk environment
[02:28] <Simira> Treenaks: cooler, of course. The old one isn't in sale anymore
[02:29] <srbaker> grrrr.
[02:29] <srbaker> need /etc/apt/sources.list.d
[02:29] <Treenaks> srbaker: submit a patch
[02:29] <srbaker> Treenaks, i intend to as soon as i move
[02:29] <srbaker> it's on my tomboy list :P
[02:30] <srbaker> speaking of which, i need hoary packages for f-spot and tomboy.
[02:30] <srbaker> anyone know?
[02:30] <mvo> srbaker: there is a patch in the bts for /etc/apt/sources.list.d. we'll get it eventually :)
[02:34] <srbaker> okay.  so now the only thing i need to increase my productivity is moisturizing cream that doesn't make my hands feel greasy
[02:36] <mvo> srbaker: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=66325
[02:36] <srbaker> cool
[03:09] <robtaylor> carlos: had time to look at accessd yet??
[03:10] <robtaylor> pitti: would you like to take a look?
[03:10] <pitti> robtaylor: I'm in a bit of a hurry right now
[03:11] <pitti> robtaylor: but in general I'd like to look at it
[03:11] <Kamion> Keybuk: signkey uses "$name's" in a couple of places, which in Perl is the same as $name::s
[03:11] <Kamion> Keybuk: care to fix that to ${name}'s?
[03:11] <pitti> robtaylor: is there a tarball/pdf/whatever to look at?
[03:11] <robtaylor> pitti: no rush, but when you're not busy let me know and i'll take you through it
[03:11] <pitti> robtaylor: a guided tour? That'll be nice! :-)
[03:12] <Kamion> Keybuk: (or $name\'s)
[03:12] <robtaylor> pitti: http://sourcecontrol.net/~rtaylor/ has accessd and dbus packages with extra python bindings
[03:13] <robtaylor> s/accessd/my accessd arch repo mirror/
[03:13] <srbaker> how do i completely disable OSS?
[03:15] <pitti> Hi trulux
[03:15] <pitti> trulux: I tried your ssp packages. Rock!
[03:15] <pitti> trulux: it is really cool
[03:15] <pitti> trulux: to actually put it into Hoary, I'd like to see two things:
[03:16] <pitti> trulux: 1) rename the packages to *-ssp
[03:16] <pitti> trulux: 2) modify the gcc-ssp-3.4 wrapper program to include the necessary settings (-lssp and -fstack-protector)
[03:17] <pitti> trulux: otherwise I played around with it a little, looks nice
[03:17] <lamont> Kamion: you around?
[03:17] <trulux> hey pitti
[03:17] <lamont> seb128: around?
[03:18] <seb128> lamont: yep
[03:18] <trulux> pitti, why the name change? nothing is different (in usability terms)
[03:18] <Kamion> what's this total python b0rkage?
[03:18] <Kamion> /bin/sh: /usr/bin/mklibs: /usr/bin/python: bad interpreter: No such file or directory
[03:18] <trulux> the warpper is (almost) ready
[03:18] <jdahlin> what's up with archive.u.c?
[03:18] <trulux> just needs packaging
[03:19] <pitti> trulux: because we already have such a source and binary package? (and, btw, a newer one)
[03:19] <trulux> pitti, i can send you the patches
[03:19] <trulux> in order to get the stuff without pain in newerr versions
[03:19] <Kamion> trulux: we can't just drop something straight into hoary without seeing how it works elsewhere first
[03:19] <trulux> what do you think?
[03:19] <Kamion> a separate package for the meantime is extremely useful.
[03:20] <Kamion> otherwise you're asking a great deal of faith from us
[03:20] <pitti> trulux: and it would be cool to integrate -lssp and -fstack-protector into the wrapper, so that these do not need to be specified explicitly
[03:20] <trulux> pitti, that could be done in an easy way
[03:20] <pitti> trulux: the plan is to have completely separate packages for a while
[03:21] <pitti> trulux: and when they prove good and we are reasonable sure to 1) not break anything and 2) we have a chance of sustainable support, then we can talk about putting them into main
[03:22] <pitti> trulux: oh: and gcc-ssp packages should depend on libssp-dev
[03:22] <trulux> pitti, yes
[03:22] <pitti> trulux: thanks! see you later
[03:23] <trulux> pitti, i will send you the patches
[03:23] <trulux> Kamion, anyway, i did the stuff in the way i thought it's the best
[03:23] <trulux> and non-enabled by default is the best way
[03:26] <trulux> i must go too
[03:30] <srbaker> is it possible to comppletely disable OSS?
[03:35] <yann__> hi
[03:36] <Treenaks> yann__: if you find them, tell me how you did it :)
[03:37] <Treenaks> yann__: I might need it for the Dutch site :)
[03:37] <yann__> didn't they answer to your emails either ? 
[03:37] <yann__> Treenaks  > let's see your website :)
[03:38] <Treenaks> yann__: www.ubuntulinux.nl and www.ubuntu-linux.nl (run by the same guy, need to be integrated)
[03:39] <tim1> hello
[03:39] <tim1> is this the right channel to discuss rosetta ?
[03:39] <sivang> tim1: theres a rosetta chaneel :)
[03:39] <sivang> tim1: join #rosetta
[03:42] <mako> Kamion, elmo_away: so theoretically, there is a community council meetining today, right?
[03:42] <mako> Kamion: apparently, it will be just me and you
[03:42] <sivang> mako: also wondered about that :)
[03:42] <mako> elmo seems away and sabdfl as well
[03:43] <mako> well, there a couple country teams on the agenda
[03:43] <mako> and one more i suspect if sivang has anything to do with it
[03:43] <sivang> mako : yes :)
[03:43] <lamont> elmo is away
[03:43] <mako> lamont: do you know about sabdfl?
[03:44] <mako> smurfix: you around?
[03:44] <Treenaks> well, at least I'm here :)
[03:44] <lamont> no clue, but wouldn't surprise me, given his 'take some down time' comments at the conf
[03:44] <mako> i'm trying to decide if we have can go ahead with the meeting
[03:44] <mako> lamont: do you know elmo's story
[03:45] <mako> lamont: basically, will he be back in 1.25h?
[03:46] <lamont> doko!!
[03:47] <yann__> Treenaks  > www.ubuntu-fr.org
[03:47] <yann__> :)
[03:47] <lamont> mako: dunno.  ISTR him saying something about a week of holiday right after the conf
[03:47] <mako> hmm.. ok
[03:48] <mako> well.. i can call mark and see if he's gonna be around at all this week
[03:48] <mako> otherwise, this stuff will be put off until at least after new years
[03:49] <mako> Kamion: it may be our chance to ram through otherwise controverisal proposal
[03:49] <sivang> mako: I reckon most people need some time off after the conference, we could probably manage with only some brief discussions for country teams and others..
[03:50] <yann__> Treenaks > how many mails did you sent? is it worth trying again? :)
[03:50] <Treenaks> yann__: none yet, because the merging isn't done yet
[03:51] <yann__> we've got a forum that's already open, the site is comnig soon... but still can't get in touch with ubuntu's team
[03:51] <sivang> enrico: hi!
[03:52] <enrico> sivang: hi!
[04:00] <Kamion> mako: hmm. does two out of four count as a majority?
[04:00] <smurfix> mako: yep, just came home
[04:01] <haggai> is Jane still on holiday?
[04:01] <Kamion> mako: elmo said he'd be away from tomorrow, which I took to mean that he'd be here today
[04:02] <mako> well, mark will l come
[04:02] <mako> i just talked to him on the phone
[04:02] <Kamion> ah, ok
[04:08] <Keybuk> hmm, hal is working today.  yesterday it refused to play, today I get an "IAUDIO" window popping up.  strange thing, I think my camera actually kills it
[04:12] <smurfix> mako: 
[04:15] <mako> smurfix: want to prepare a short thing about country teams goals and such to present at the meeting
[04:15] <mako> smurfix: i'm going to prepare a short summary from the nm bof
[04:16] <smurfix> mako: I'll be at the meeting
[04:16] <mako> smurfix: awesome.. i'll put an introduction on the agneda
[04:16] <sivang> mako: are you going to discuss the NM process on the CC meeting?
[04:17] <zul> when is the meeting?
[04:17] <smurfix> OK, I'll say a few words about country team stuff then
[04:17] <smurfix> zul: 1600 UTC
[04:17] <yann__> \o/
[04:17] <zul> smurfix: k thanks
[04:18] <lamont> haggai: my understanding is that Jane is still on holiday.  she is checking email occasionally, apparently
[04:19] <Treenaks> how long do these meetings take, usually?
[04:21] <sivang> Treenaks: hmm, that depends :)
[04:21] <Treenaks> minutes, hours, days, weeks
[04:21] <sivang> Treenaks: there have been ones that took more then 2 hours :)
[04:21] <Treenaks> sivang: I've heard of 5-minute ones
[04:22] <sivang> Treenaks: there have beem, well, TB meetings tend to take much much longer.
[04:22] <Kamion> shortest has been 15 minutes IIRC
[04:22] <Treenaks> my boss won't like a >1hr one (closing down the building, setting the alarm and stuff :))
[04:23] <zul> Treenaks: tell your boss to be patient :)
[04:23] <Treenaks> zul: 8)
[04:24] <mako> sivang: i'd like to 
[04:26] <haggai> lamont: thanks :)
[04:26] <mako> are there any NM's for the meeting that need CC approval
[04:26] <mako> haggai: did we approve you yet?
[04:26] <mako> or do we need to?
[04:27] <haggai> mako: yup, I'm all done
[04:27] <mako> good
[04:27] <Treenaks> mako: NMs or "ubuntites"? 
[04:27] <mako> there were a handful of people that raised their hand at the NM meeting
[04:27] <mako> Treenaks: sorry, "UBUNTITES"
[04:27] <Treenaks> mako: I was one of those :)
[04:27] <mako> we can add you to the list
[04:27] <Treenaks> OK, great
[04:28] <mako> Treenaks: actually, go add yourself :)
[04:28] <mako> CommunityCouncilAgenda
[04:28] <Treenaks> mako: hm, need to hack together a wiki page on myself then :)
[04:28] <Treenaks> probably
[04:28] <sivang> mako: development maintainers needs be approved by technical contribs right?
[04:33] <Kamion> sivang: by the tech board
[04:33] <sivang> Kamion: ah ok :)
[04:35] <ChrisH> mako: Did you find a chance to review the NM draft?
[04:35] <mako> ChrisH: sure.. it will have to be super quick
[04:38] <smurfix> mako: next time write "smurf" instead of misspelling my name please ;-)
[04:39] <sivang> mako: could you reminde me what being an UBUNTITES mean? :)
[04:41] <mako> i spelled it right once and then mispelled it when i lost my change, i swear :)
[04:41] <lamont> fabbione: you around?
[04:41] <mako> sivang: basically you can vote and such but not upload packages
[04:41] <mako> sivang: i think you should put yourself down for that
[04:41] <mako> people with visible contributions to the community who want to be enfranchised
[04:41] <sivang> mako: ok, I'll go list my name there - already have a page :)
[04:42] <sivang> mako: but there is not "new ubuntites" page :)
[04:43] <Treenaks> sivang: 1 second
[04:43] <mako> well, make one, it's a wiki after all :)
[04:43] <sivang> ok, let's rock it on! (as jdub says )
[04:43] <Treenaks> there's an entry on the agenda page now
[04:43] <Treenaks> sivang: edit now :)
[04:44] <sivang> Treenaks: done:)
[04:44] <sivang> mako: what about doc maintainership? is it the same like being a ubuntites?
[04:47] <mako> sivang: yes
[04:47] <mako> Kamion: i want that patch
[04:48] <Kamion> currently it's too horrible for words and hardcodes my key ... :)
[04:49] <Treenaks> Kamion: package it up when you fix that :)
[04:49] <Kamion> (well, keyid, anyway)
[04:52] <smurfix> Kamion: So use $ENV{SIGN_KEYID} and complain if that's not set ;-)
[04:59] <mojo> can some ppl here confirm this bug for me: (not sure my mistake or bug)
[05:00] <mojo> I have a error msg in synaptic each time I update
[05:00] <mojo> [Invalid UTF-8]  Could not parse file '/usr/share/applications/ooo645calc.desktop':
[05:00] <mojo>   desktop entry contain line 'Comment[ca] =Fulla de c\xc3| lcul d'OpenOffice.org' which is not UTF-8
[05:00] <Mithrandir> mojo: it's a known issue
[05:00] <yann__> wow, if this is a place to report bugs, i got a bug in gthumb (warty) :)
[05:00] <Mithrandir> yann__: bugzilla.ubuntu.com
[05:00] <yann__> Mithrandir > i know, i know :|
[05:01] <yann__> ok i'll try.
[05:01] <mojo> thx for the info, at least I know it's not my mistake
[05:56] <fabbione> lamont: now
[06:19] <fabbione> Kamion: the ibook thingy can compile only on 6xx
[06:19] <fabbione> so powerpc kernels
[06:20] <Kamion> ok
[06:23] <sivang> smurfix: ping
[06:23] <pitti> fabbione: will the next kernel build system include an animated colorful cartoon strip to make it more interesting?
[06:26] <smurfix> sivang: 
[06:28] <sivang> smurfix: that in jap or chineese?
[06:28] <sivang> :)
[06:29] <sivang> smurfix: anyway, we still don't have an ubuntu-il mailing list :)
[06:30] <smurfix> sivang: That's "pong".
[06:30] <sivang> smurfix: also, do we already have anything for making derived distros wrt to locality?
[06:30] <sivang> smurfix: in what lang? :)
[06:31] <smurfix> sivang: Chinese of course.
[06:31] <smurfix> sivang: I dunno wo's responsible for the mailing lists, I just know it's not me ;-)
[06:31] <smurfix> who's
[06:32] <smurfix> sivang: easily making derived distros is on the agends for post-hoary.
[06:34] <Kamion> sigh, need to add python-minimal to debootstrap as well as python2.4-minimal now ...
[06:35] <tseng> has anyone noticed problems with the security update login package in warty?
[06:35] <tseng> google and gmane say no
[06:35] <pitti> tseng: no, what do you mean?
[06:36] <pitti> Hi elmo
[06:36] <tseng> booting it gives me a big dump of cant execute /sbin/agetty
[06:36] <pitti> elmo: Mark asked me to rename debstriptranslations to pkgstriptranslations
[06:36] <tseng> then it respawns to fast, and init gives up completely
[06:37] <pitti> elmo: I guess that means that debstriptranslations will be removed and I upload a new package pktstriptranslations?
[06:37] <pitti> tseng: This is not a login problem
[06:37] <elmo> pitti: just upload the new package for now
[06:37] <pitti> tseng: this rather sounds like the udev race condition
[06:37] <elmo> preferably soon, as I'm on holiday from tomorrow on
[06:37] <tseng> pitti: oh =/
[06:38] <pitti> elmo: okay, I'll do
[06:38] <pitti> tseng: sometimes the text consoles just say byebye
[06:38] <pitti> tseng: BTW, we did not make a security update of 'login'. What do you mean in particular?
[06:39] <bob2> fabbione: hrm, ok
[06:39] <tseng> well i did a clean install of warty, then dist-upgrade from security, universe, and main
[06:39] <tseng> and it grabbed a new login
[06:39] <Kamion> elmo: could you sync groff 1.18.1.1-5 from Debian please?
[06:40] <tseng> pitti: sorry its a bit hard to report better, as its not finishing init
[06:42] <elmo> Kamion: done
[06:43] <Kamion> thanks
[06:50] <Kamion> fabbione: the silo-installer/silo thing is fixed in d-i svn
[06:50] <pitti> elmo: I uploaded pkgstriptranslations.
[07:03] <tseng> pitti: i found my bug.. inittab is all wrong
[07:03] <pitti> tseng: ugh, did you modify it or is it wrong by default?
[07:04] <tseng> i didnt modify it, not sure how it got this way
[07:05] <tseng> will one from hoary do?
[07:07] <pitti> tseng: what's wrong with the inittab?
[07:07] <tseng> its calling /sbin/agetty
[07:07] <tseng> and /sbin/rc
[07:07] <tseng> which dont even exist
[07:09] <tseng> i think someone copied over it
[07:10] <pitti> tseng: I doubt that inittab says agetty by default
[07:10] <pitti> tseng: this would have breaked on each and every installation
[07:10] <tseng> yeah someone was f'ing with it
[07:11] <tseng> i appologize
[07:12] <pitti> tseng: no worries :-)
[07:12] <pitti> tseng: were you able to restore it?
[07:13] <pitti> tseng: I can send you the default version if necessary
[07:13] <tseng> yes, but im totally baffled as to who wouldve copied another distros inittab over this one
[07:13] <tseng> heh, i have one here now that i know what is up
[07:13] <elmo> Kamion: I'm beginning to think grub and scrubbing disks REALLY don't agree
[07:14] <Kamion> elmo: hmm?
[07:14] <elmo> I just got that stupid grub failure when reinstalling  a DL380
[07:15] <elmo> then again, lilo doesn't work either.  meh.
[07:15] <Kamion> scrubbing disks?
[07:15] <elmo> today sucks.
[07:15] <elmo> kamion: when you first create a RAID array and it syncs thems
[07:15] <Kamion> it would probably be good for me to learn something about RAID, wouldn't it?
[07:16] <elmo> yeah, I'm getting exactly the same error as on the Dell's
[07:16] <elmo> in that bug-from-hell
[07:17] <Kamion> is that the HPT370 one?
[07:17] <elmo> nah
[07:17] <elmo> one sec
[07:19] <Kamion> locales suck
[07:20] <elmo> hmm, I closed the bug.  go me.
[07:20] <jdub> it's your birthday.
[07:20] <maswan> elmo: did you see my note about bittorrent tracker?
[07:21] <elmo> maswan: the port thing?
[07:21] <maswan> elmo: yeah
[07:22] <elmo> maswan: yeah, thanks
[07:22] <elmo> Kamion: 2211
[07:24] <Kamion> elmo: same failure mode as at the start of that bug?
[07:24] <elmo> right
[07:24] <elmo> gar, and it's going take eons to scrub half a fricking terabyte
[07:25] <Kamion> can you arrange to add the debug command to grub-installer's grub invocation?
[07:25] <Kamion> or even run the grub commands by hand in the grub shell
[07:26] <elmo> dump (hd0,0)/boot/grub/stage1 /tmp/grbdfsbdfsgaz is failing
[07:26] <elmo> with "file not found"
[07:26] <lamont> anyone need anything before I run?
[07:27] <lamont> oh. elmo's here. cool
[07:27] <elmo> Kamion: there's some strace's in p.u.c/~james that mdz and I looked at before, there's very little difference between working and broken; I'll try and get some more tho
[07:30] <Kamion> grub straces are depressingly uninformative sometimes :(
[07:31] <Kamion> as mdz said in the bug, it looks like working-strace was when booted from the hard disk?
[07:32] <elmo> right
[07:39] <tseng> yay for pax!
[07:40] <Kamion> elmo: I'm kind of way out of ideas :-(
[07:40] <pitti> tseng: it fends off the buffer overflow exploit as well as SSP
[07:41] <tseng> pitti: im very familiar with pax
[07:42] <pitti> tseng: what do you think, is either one (ssp/pax) already enough or should we strive to get both?
[07:42] <tseng> pitti: well, both is ideal
[07:42] <tseng> because pax has 0 protection against ret2libc
[07:43] <tseng> well, not 0, just adds security-by-obscurity
[07:43] <pitti> tseng: I will put a PaX enabled kernel into universe when I finished the porting to 2.6.9
[07:43] <tseng> oh wow
[07:43] <elmo> Kamion: no prob - can you remind me the equivalent of grub-installer for lilo tho?  I need at least one bootloader on this thing :)
[07:43] <pitti> tseng: do you happen to know somebody who already did that
[07:43] <tseng> pitti: yes
[07:43] <pitti> tseng: s//?/
[07:43] <tseng> the author
[07:43] <pitti> tseng: on the hp there is only a patch for 2.6.7
[07:43] <tseng> yes
[07:43] <Kamion> elmo: lilo-installer
[07:44] <fabbione> elmo: lilo-installer?
[07:44] <fabbione> argh ;)
[07:44] <Kamion> anna should install it by default
[07:44] <pitti> tseng: the rejections are not bad, but cause a bit of work
[07:45] <elmo> hmm, no lilo in the base system atm
[07:45] <elmo> I guess the "Install lilo" step is spassing out real early
[07:45] <Kamion> elmo: doesn't need to be, lilo-installer will apt-install it as needed
[07:45] <elmo> oh
[07:45] <Kamion> if it's used
[07:46] <elmo> eh, sorry, to be stupid, but you're saying I should be able to just run 'lilo-installer' from shell?
[07:46] <Kamion> no - are you in the d-i environment?
[07:47] <elmo> yes
[07:47] <Kamion> back up to the main menu and select the menu item to install lilo
[07:47] <fabbione> elmo: *cough*sparc*cough* are you having some fun at the dc?
[07:47] <elmo> I tried that
[07:47] <Kamion> you can try udpkg --configure lilo-installer too
[07:47] <elmo> it just says an error occured, and there's nothing helpful on the log tailing screen
[07:47] <elmo> what file is that thing tailing?
[07:47] <Kamion> tty3 tails /var/log/messages, tty4 tails /var/log/syslog
[07:49] <jdub> /bin/sh: /usr/bin/apt-listchanges: /usr/bin/python: bad interpreter: No such file or directory
[07:49] <jdub> 
[07:49] <elmo> sweeet
[07:49] <Kamion> fixed in new python-defaults
[07:49] <Kamion> or install python-minimal
[07:49] <elmo> Kamion: ok, so it's just saying lilo-installer exited with status 1, meh
[07:50] <Kamion> elmo: stick 'set -x' at the top of the postinst
[07:50] <jdub> Kamion: probably getting that in this upgrade
[07:50] <elmo> LOL
[07:50] <elmo> it's looking for part156378345346
[07:50] <Kamion> welcome to d-i debugging
[07:50] <Kamion> wow
[07:50] <elmo> (or so)
[07:51] <elmo> Kamion: do the final releases have "Unofficial" in the README.diskdefines ?
[07:51] <Kamion> can you see what bootfs_devfs and bootfs are being set to?
[07:52] <elmo> this'd be so much easier if we had wireless in here and I could do this without the to-fro
[07:52] <jdub> Errors were encountered while processing:
[07:52] <jdub>  linda
[07:52] <jdub> E: Sub-process /usr/bin/dpkg returned an error code (1)
[07:52] <jdub> heh
[07:52] <Kamion> elmo: no
[07:53] <Kamion> that'd be linda wanting python ...
[07:53] <elmo> ah, okay, maybe I should start from the beginning and burn a fresh CD then
[07:53] <Kamion> well, I dunno what'd have been fixed, but I suppose it can't hurt to try ...
[07:53] <Kamion> elmo: where's the line with Unofficial?
[07:54] <elmo> DISKNAME says "Unofficial binary-i386" in it at the end
[07:54] <elmo> fabbione: :(
[07:54] <Kamion> #define DISKNAME  Ubuntu 4.10 "Warty Warthog" - Preview i386 Binary-1
[07:55] <elmo> this is just a CD which I had lieing around, it could date back to like, June.. 
[07:55] <fabbione> elmo: good luck.. 
[07:55] <Kamion> I can't even remember when I removed Unofficial; certainly before the preview, but I'm not sure when
[07:56] <elmo> ok, trashing and burning fresh from releases.u.c
[07:56] <fabbione> pitti: ping?
[07:57] <Kamion> Automatically selecting en_GB.UTF-8 locale in addition to en_GB.
[07:57] <Kamion> that text look OK?
[07:58] <jon1012> hi :)
[07:59] <Kamion> any suggestions for how to record that /etc/locale.gen has been migrated to UTF-8? if the user later removes the UTF-8 locales, that choice should be respected
[08:09] <jon1012> someone when the mono-assemblies-arch and mono-assemblies-base 1.04-1 will be available ?
[08:09] <jon1012> (one the hoary repositories)
[08:10] <jon1012> beucause impossible to use any mono package until then :/
[08:10] <jon1012> (especially monodevelop)
[08:11] <tseng> mono apps work for me.
[08:12] <jon1012> mmh... when have you updated the packages for the last time ? :/
[08:12] <jon1012> try to update or reinstall monodevelop and you will see :(
[08:12] <jon1012> everything is broken because these two package are not here
[08:13] <jon1012> mmh they are here but in version 1.0.2-1 while mono-jit asks for 1.0.4-1
[08:13] <jon1012> :/
[08:13] <tseng> from archive.ubuntu.com?
[08:13] <jon1012> yes
[08:13] <tseng> no such problem here.
[08:14] <jon1012> ?
[08:14] <jon1012> I update my apt-get each day to see if there is a fix...
[08:15] <jon1012> but didn't see it :(
[08:15] <jon1012> (in hoary)
[08:21] <elmo> fabbione: please shout when you're done with davis
[08:23] <Simira> anyone else got some tips for how to mount my digital camera?
[08:24] <Treenaks> Simira: what kind of cam is it
[08:24] <Simira> Canon powershot
[08:30] <elmo> Kamion: doh, same error with fresh CD, meh
[08:34] <mooch> open wifi aps make baby jesus happy
[08:35] <Simira> Treenaks: : you had a suggestion, or you just wanted to know about my new cam?
[08:35] <Treenaks> Simira: canon powershot?
[08:36] <Treenaks> Simira: open gthumb, file -> import photos
[08:36] <Treenaks> Simira: it'll be detected automagically
[08:36] <ogra> Simira: doent it getmounted automatically ?
[08:36] <ogra> +s
[08:36] <Treenaks> ogra: powershots use PTP.. they're not mass-storage :(
[08:36] <Simira> hum
[08:36] <Simira> *tries*
[08:36] <ogra> Treenaks: bah....
[08:37] <Simira> I like the cam, though
[08:37] <ogra> Treenaks: i love my ole olympus
[08:37] <Treenaks> Simira: which one? the A85?
[08:37] <Treenaks> ogra: Good Ole'ympus ;)
[08:37] <Simira> no, only an A400. A little bit better than the old one.
[08:37] <ogra> *g*
[08:37] <Treenaks> Simira: you've seen mine right? that's a A75
[08:37] <ogra> Simira: was yours insured ?
[08:38] <Simira> yes, it was
[08:38] <ogra> wow, lucky girl;)
[08:39] <Simira> well, not the cam, but my travel insurance covered it
[08:40] <Treenaks> ogra: mine is ;)
[08:40] <Treenaks> I'm doing 100M/day on it 8)
[08:40] <ogra> probably there should be a place to upload for all the ppl that can not pay for the traffic.....
[08:41] <ogra> Treenaks: looks similar for mine
[08:41] <Simira> it won't detect my camera :-/
[08:42] <ogra> but there were loads of ppl taking pictures.....
[08:42] <Simira> bob2 hasn't put up his, and Tollef. And Mako. Among others
[08:42] <Treenaks> bob2 should :)
[08:42] <amu> is there a way the xorg config could be done by xorg itself? without a user input, or i've to run the old mkxf86config?
[08:42] <Treenaks> Simira: I've seen tollef's pics..
[08:42] <Treenaks> Simira: or at least some of those
[08:43] <Simira> yep
[08:43] <Treenaks> amu: dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg ?
[08:43] <Simira> hm
[08:43] <Simira> *grumble*
[08:43] <mako> Simira: i won't until i get home
[08:43] <ogra> Simira: yep....he has made a really beutiful one of me in the bar
[08:43] <Simira> :) hehe
[08:43] <ogra> +a
[08:43] <Treenaks> amu: otherwise: "dexconf"
[08:43] <Simira> hm... but I still can't get my camera on Ubuntu... hrmf
[08:44] <Treenaks> Simira: it's not detected by gthumb?
[08:44] <Treenaks> Simira: it should be in "play" mode, otherwise it won't be detected
[08:44] <Treenaks> (if it's like mine)
[08:45] <amu> Treenaks: it works also if there's no debconf data? need it for the livecd
[08:45] <Simira> hm, ok
[08:46] <Simira> yay
[08:46] <Simira> it worked
[08:46] <ogra> hmm, yesterday i saw daniels saying that the detection stuff is done by xorg itself.....probably he changed something
[08:46] <Simira> mako: you're still stuck in Spain???
[08:46] <mako> Simira: stuck is perhaps not the best term
[08:46] <Simira> ah, Daniels also took a lot of picks
[08:46] <mako> Simira: i'm in valencia staying with jordi
[08:46] <ogra> heh
[08:47] <amu> ogra: good question, daniels is away
[08:47] <Simira> mako: so, holiday-vacationing, eh?
[08:47] <ogra> amu: i heard he is on holiday now....
[08:50] <pitti> tseng: guess what? the whole grsecurity patch applies cleanly against the patched Ubuntu kernel source :-)
[08:50] <tseng> pitti: wonderful, i had a feeling it would
[08:50] <tseng> im using it in a pretty big patchset myself
[08:50] <pitti> tseng: the back of my head always reminded me about long-winded discussions in Debian about the non-applicability to Debian kernels...
[08:52] <pitti> fabbione: around and have a minute?
[09:02] <pitti> tseng: oops, there are two rejections
[09:06] <wasabi_> yay!
[09:06] <wasabi_> got my cd's just now
[09:06] <wasabi_> wow this are slick
[09:11] <fabbione> re
[09:11] <fabbione> elmo: ANYTIME!
[09:12] <fabbione> elmo: next time don't wait for me... just kick me out :-)
[09:12] <fabbione> pitti: yeah
[09:12] <elmo> fabbione: don't worry there's no rush, I'm probably only half way through
[09:13] <fabbione> elmo: it's 100% your :-)
[09:13] <fabbione> i was only doing a test compilation
[09:13] <fabbione> nothing really too seriuos... just the ibookg4sleep1337patch
[09:13] <fabbione> in the worst case i will tell ppc users to blame GTK
[09:13] <elmo> lol
[09:13] <ogra> heh
[09:14] <fabbione> pitti: PONG!
[09:14] <fabbione> pitti: DING DONG DANG!
[09:21] <pitti> fabbione: sorry, still at the phone
[09:21] <fabbione> Description:
[09:21] <fabbione> Remote exploit for IPSwitch WS_FTP version 5.03 that binds a shell to port 4444.
[09:21] <fabbione> CUTE!
[09:55] <ajmitch_> morning
[10:03] <pitti> fabbione: back
[10:04] <ajmitch_> pitti: thanks for doing those libssp packages :)
[10:04] <pitti> fabbione: is there an easy way to provide a hacked kernel image (with new deb names) without duplicating the linux-source source package?
[10:04] <fabbione> pitti: yo
[10:04] <pitti> ajmitch_: no problem, easy package
[10:05] <fabbione> pitti: build-dep on linux-source-2.6.9
[10:05] <ajmitch_> pitti: what will be harder is if we try & get selinux in, and enabled by default
[10:05] <fabbione> pitti: the one that gives you the tar.bz2 in /usr/src
[10:05] <fabbione> pitti: but i don't recall if it has patches or not.. you will have to check on that
[10:06] <pitti> fabbione: basically I want to use all the Ubuntu patches, add one, change the configuration and the deb names
[10:06] <fabbione> in case... you have linux-patches something
[10:06] <fabbione> pitti: yup... i got that
[10:06] <fabbione> pitti: you still need the same build-deps
[10:06] <pitti> fabbione: okay, I will play around with that
[10:07] <pitti> fabbione: basically I would need a binary package that ships the source's dpatches
[10:07] <fabbione> no.. you just need to ship your patch
[10:07] <fabbione> all the others are in the source or -linux-patch
[10:07] <trulux> hi there
[10:07] <trulux> pitti, woo woo!
[10:07] <trulux> :)
[10:08] <pitti> hi trulux 
[10:08] <pitti> fabbione: ah, cool
[10:08] <ajmitch_> hi trulux 
[10:08] <fabbione> check all the pkgs.. there is everything you need
[10:08] <fabbione> the only thing i am not sure we ship are the config
[10:09] <fabbione> in that case i will provide them for you.. no big deal for that
[10:09] <trulux> hey ajmitch_
[10:09] <trulux> ajmitch_, i think we cantry to write a little schedule for the SELinux work
[10:10] <pitti> fabbione: I need to change the config anyway; patching yours would be nice, but just copy&change is fine by now
[10:10] <ajmitch_> trulux: sure
[10:11] <fabbione> pitti: ok.. i will tell you some little secrets about configs tomorrow.. i am watching a movie now ;)
[10:11] <pitti> fabbione: oh, then I won't disturb you further
[10:12] <pitti> fabbione: enjoy! :-)
[10:12] <fabbione> pitti: thanks man
[10:12] <fabbione> have a good night
[10:12] <pitti> night!
[10:12] <ogra> fabbione: have fun :)
[10:12] <seb128> 'n
[10:12] <seb128> oups
[10:12] <seb128> 'night
[10:27] <trulux> ajmitch_, fine
[10:27] <trulux> ajmitch_, why not start a page named SELinux on Debian at the hardened debian wiki
[10:27] <trulux> ?
[10:28] <ajmitch_> go ahead :)
[10:29] <trulux> heh
[10:29] <trulux> let me start a draft
[10:29] <pitti> trulux: btw, I'm currently at porting the grsecurity patch to the Ubuntu kernel
[10:29] <trulux> pitti, did you noticed that 2.0.3 is for 2.6.9??
[10:29] <trulux> it's a spender's test patch
[10:29] <pitti> trulux: yup, that's the one I use
[10:30] <trulux> ok
[10:30] <ajmitch_> I don't think that grsecurity & selinux will work in the same kernel at all :)
[10:30] <ajmitch_> you'd need to choose between them
[10:30] <pitti> ajmitch_: not at the same time
[10:30] <trulux> pitti, don't use it by now
[10:30] <pitti> ajmitch_: but at least I like grsecurity much more than SELinux, so I'm happy :-)
[10:30] <trulux> ajmitch_, err, it depends on how the hooks are used and implemented
[10:31] <trulux> ajmitch_, we are strange guys here ... don't get sad by this, grsec is much more usable :(
[10:31] <trulux> but does a diff thing anyway
[10:32] <ajmitch_> iirc grsec may even patch out the LSM hooks from the kernel
[10:33] <pitti> ajmitch_: in theory you _could_ have two chained MAC systems, though :-)
[10:33] <pitti> ajmitch_: and grsec does not use LSM
[10:34] <ajmitch_> only if you were brave and/or stupid :)
[10:34] <ajmitch_> I know that
[10:34] <ajmitch_> but I mean that grsec explicitly disables the functionality that selinux uses
[10:34] <pitti> ajmitch_: I don't know whether it would work, and I don't really care
[10:34] <pitti> ajmitch_: actually I mostly care for PaX
[10:34] <ajmitch_> it doesn't help that the grsec dev is rather disagreeable ;)
[10:34] <pitti> ajmitch_: but since grsecurity applies reasonably well to our kernel, why not take the full patch :-)
[10:35] <ajmitch_> selinux is already enabled in upstream debian kernels, packages are in sid
[10:35] <pitti> ajmitch_: the default Ubuntu kernel is also compiled with SELInux (but not enabled)
[10:36] <pitti> ajmitch_: same as in Sid
[10:36] <ajmitch_> as long as you're just wanting to have another kernel :)
[10:36] <pitti> ajmitch_: right now this is not intended to replace our default kernel anyway :-)
[10:36] <pitti> ajmitch_: right now it will become an additional kernel in universe, for people wanting PaX
[10:37] <ajmitch_> iirc gentoo people had PaX & selinux working together
[10:37] <pitti> ajmitch_: yes, this should be entirely possible
[10:38] <trulux> pitti, i have the selinux hooks for pax
[10:38] <trulux> will be inside my backport
[10:38] <trulux> which stills is in really panic-state
[10:39] <trulux> (that one which means nothing even compiles without brainfucking and so on)
[10:53] <wasabi_> So I suspose my next step is going to be building a kerberos 5 .udeb.
[10:53] <wasabi_> And d-i piece.
[11:03] <trulux> pitti, btw, what about the gcc patches?
[11:04] <pitti> trulux: will look at them; right now I still have your packages installed
[11:04] <trulux> ok, fine
[11:32] <gilligan_> hi
[11:33] <elmo> can someone do me a favour and try logging into the website?
[11:33] <trulux> elmo, hey
[11:33] <pitti> elmo: yes
[11:33] <trulux> elmo, did you noticed my enhyancement report to the bugzilla?
[11:34] <elmo> trulux: the binutils thing?
[11:34] <elmo> pitti: yes, it works or yes, you can try? :)
[11:34] <pitti> elmo: works for me
[11:34] <trulux> pitti, we need to have elmo including my PT_PAX_FLAGS stuff inside binutils for having good PaX support
[11:34] <pitti> elmo: now both
[11:34] <trulux> (soft mode)
[11:34] <elmo> pitti: excellent
[11:34] <trulux> elmo, yes
[11:34] <elmo> pitti: for your next trick, can you try rosetta?
[11:34] <pitti> elmo: sure
[11:35] <gilligan_> have there been any sound related changes to hoary recently ? just did a apt-get upgrade and have a completely sound-free system running now hehe.. ( sorry to bug the dev channel but the general channel is mostly clueless.. )
[11:35] <pitti> elmo: "You are logged in"
[11:35] <pitti> elmo: works
[11:35] <elmo> pitti: sweet, thanks
[11:35] <pitti> trulux: hmm, right now I use the legacy ELF header marking
[11:36] <pitti> trulux: this is way less intrusive
[11:36] <gilligan_> i get silence from whatever player i try - no error messages tho.. and nothing seems to be muted according to alsamixer
[11:36] <elmo> trulux: sorry, I won't have a chance to look at that till after Christmas - I'm busy in the data centre right now, and on holiday after that
[11:36] <pitti> gilligan_: is esd still running
[11:36] <pitti> gilligan_: ?
[11:36] <pitti> gilligan_: and check in gstreamer-properties that esd is used
[11:36] <gilligan_> esd running
[11:37] <gilligan_> .. /usr/bin/esd -nobeeps
[11:37] <pitti> gilligan_: check whether your mixer now has a "DRC" setting which is low
[11:38] <gilligan_> pitti: DRC seems to be off
[11:38] <gilligan_> and DRC Range = 0
[11:38] <pitti> gilligan_: can you enable it? This DRC thingy bite me a while ago
[11:39] <gilligan_> hum.wonder how ;)
[11:39] <trulux> elmo, data center?
[11:39] <gilligan_> esd is set to input & output in gstreamer preferences btw
[11:39] <elmo> trulux: working on our machines
[11:40] <trulux> elmo, we are looking for someone to support us giving a development machine
[11:40] <trulux> sponsoring
[11:40] <trulux> because we are running on a bit bad-organized network, without a main development center
[11:41] <ogra> elmo there are a lot ppl on #ubuntu, ust trying rosetta
[11:41] <gilligan_> elmo: ah.. DRC was it..
[11:41] <pitti> gilligan_: works now?
[11:41] <gilligan_> elmo: now i get super-crappy sound but i guess i just have to play around with the mixer a bit
[11:41] <gilligan_> elmo: thanks
[11:42] <elmo> ogra: when I rebooted it?  sweet :(
[11:42] <ogra> hmm... some are a little upset....
[11:42] <pitti> gilligan_: I had this crappy and silent sound, too; for me it helped to set DRC to about 75%
[11:42] <ogra> saving while rebooting.....hm
[11:43] <gilligan_> pitti: "DRC" or "DRC Range" ? my "DRC" is still off .. "DRC Range" is set to 75
[11:43] <pitti> gilligan_: don't know exactly
[11:53] <ironwolf> did apt get borked in hoary?  I keep getting "W: GPG error: http://archive.ubuntu.com hoary Release: Unknown error executing gpgv" everytime I do apt-get update.  normal channel doesn't have help to offer.  Any idea where to look for the error text?
[11:55] <ajmitch_> trulux: so what will you try & push? grsec or selinux?
[11:55] <trulux> grsec as soft option
[11:55] <trulux> selinux for the big guys ;D
[11:55] <ajmitch_> soft option?
[11:56] <pitti> ironwolf: ping mvo tomorrow; he recently introduced signature verification in apt
[11:56] <trulux> yes, the easiest to deploy one
[11:57] <ajmitch_> do you find selinux hard to deploy?
[11:58] <trulux> ajmitch_, not until we get it in the right way
[11:59] <trulux> it's a MAC system with TE and so on, it's more difficult to deployt than simple grsec
[11:59] <pitti> ajmitch_: one big problem is that selinux requires a bunch of patched base packages, which grsec doesn't
[12:00] <ajmitch_> pitti: as long as you don't have to maintain the patches it's ok :)
[12:00] <ajmitch_> especially if the patches get merged upstream