=== froud [~sean@ndn-165-135-148.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-doc [07:38] morning! [07:51] African greetings [08:30] froud: morning, i have a spare minute and am looking at the menu-stuff, where are the menu items defined? [08:31] you told yesterday, but my registers gor reset over night [08:33] froud: never mind got it [09:22] Will sounder still be used in the future? === froud adds About Ubuntu to User Guide [09:47] froud: sorry no idea, better ask on #ubuntu-devel [09:47] you ok with the menus now? [09:54] froud: yeah, works quite nice [09:55] Good, Hope to save loads of time at Hoary and on translations [09:58] plovs, seems sounder will be used, but it is called Array [09:58] So I will update === jiyuu0 [~jiyuu0@218.111.208.176] has joined #ubuntu-doc [10:17] how can i see with svn what changes have been made svn log does not show changed files [10:19] plovs, try svn log --verbose trunk [10:20] plovs, this is why I want a mail list [10:20] for commit [10:20] we can impliment post-commit template to send messages [10:22] plovs, do you use the cli? [10:22] if you want GUI try http://esvn.umputun.com/ [10:23] froud: i use cli atm [10:23] just wondered if there is a command like svn log with more output [10:24] :-) --verbose [10:24] If you want a deb for esvn lok here http://packages.qa.debian.org/e/esvn.html [10:27] verbose does the trick [10:28] :-) good [10:28] now you can wade through my sea of patches [10:28] :-) [10:37] yes, now this is nice [10:38] Yes, di dyou know you can also switch between revisions [10:39] you can also switch between revisions in the branches (we donthave any yet) and the trunk [10:40] when i finish this doc, then we should open a branch for hoary-faqguide [10:40] You can also merge between branches and trunk. Its cool for when you want to branch but dont want trunk to move to far away from your branch. [10:42] sure, shouldn't we be working on hoary in the trunk? [10:42] I mean warty is gone [10:43] I would only do a branch in the use case where I need to make intrusive changes to the current version that could hamper other people in the trunk [10:44] but perhaps you have a reason [10:44] well, this is the warty version, i have not updated anything to hoary yet, but we should release hoary [10:45] so we might update this as well [10:45] Yes, the problem is that we did not do XML for warty, so what we are doing is Hoary [10:45] no, i would like to keep this for jiyuu0 so we can give him an updated html version of changes [10:45] you want to tag [10:46] i do? (i am a complete versioning noob, but eager to learn) [10:46] tag is a version release preserved forever [10:46] branches eventually merge back to trnk [10:47] trunk [10:47] BTW we do not commit HTML PDF etc to the repos [10:47] so then yes, i would like to end up with one hoary faqguide, as up-to-date as possible, one warty ... etc [10:48] no, we should export PDF html [10:48] and just keep the xml [10:48] that's what the makefile is for [10:48] i suppose [10:48] No HTMl and PDF are good [10:48] presentational formats just nver reside in the src [10:49] we generate them from the src [10:49] The nice part is that Yelp reads the src [10:50] Let me know when you want to tag and I will make a tag for the faqguide [10:51] if you want to browse [10:51] the repos [10:51] svn list http://69.155.172.150/faq --recursive --verbose [10:52] what we should do is having a seperate brach for hoary, but all the updates to the warty changes should go to hoary as well, but the hoary changes should not go to the warty version [10:52] yes we can make a branch [10:52] people can still checkout the branch [10:52] but do i have to manually edit both versions? [10:53] you merge between them [10:53] cool, this svn stuff [10:53] I suggest you read this book as a reference [10:53] http://svnbook.red-bean.com/ [10:54] before trying any of the stuff we are talking about [10:54] It gives example uses cases [10:55] that will make it easier for you to understand the relationship between tags, branches and trunk [10:55] and how to manage them [10:57] i'll try it, asap [10:58] Ok just remember your revision mumber so we can role back if there are problems [11:01] ok, but first i need to finish this version, then we need the makfiles, then we can think about branching [11:01] The makefiles are done [11:02] or is there more to add [11:03] take a look at trunk/Makefile === skyrider [~skyrider@195.128.178.150] has joined #ubuntu-doc [11:04] it would be nice to be able to make seperate things (html,pdf) for seperate docs (user/quick/faq) with commands: make faq_html etc [11:05] at present we only have html. [11:05] you can do make faq [11:05] and it will build just the FAQ Guide [11:05] same with User Guide do make ug [11:05] and Quick Guide make ug [11:05] or you can build all in one operation make all [11:06] Gotta go out for a minute [11:06] ok, trying :-) [11:16] back [11:18] I/O warning : failed to load external entity "common/menus/login-screen-setup.xml" [11:18] I/O warning : failed to load external entity "common/menus/users-groups.xml" [11:18] I/O warning : failed to load external entity "common/menus/users-groups.xml" [11:18] I/O warning : failed to load external entity "common/menus/login-screen-setup.xml [11:19] plovs, you need to commit these files [11:21] ok, just a sec [11:22] froud: my svn thinks i did already [11:22] because my commit didn't go it clashed with sometething you did i suppose [11:23] ah no, sorry svn add it was, brb [11:24] ok, added === abelli [~abelli@84.222.38.217] has joined #ubuntu-doc [11:27] faqguide/faq2.xml:50: element listitem: validity error : Element listitem content does not follow the DTD, [11:28] looking ... [11:29] plovs, why [11:29] ---Makefile(revision282) [11:29] +++Makefile(workingcopy) [11:29] @@-100,7+100,7@@ [11:29] @echo"BuildingtheUbuntuFAQ..." [11:29] mkdir-p$(FAQBASE) [11:29] [11:29] -xsltproc--xinclude--stringparambase.dir$(FAQBASE)$(HTMLXSL)faqguide/faq2.xml [11:29] +xsltproc--xinclude--stringparambase.dir$(FAQBASE)$(HTMLXSL)userguide/usersguide.xml [11:30] why change the faq target to use userguide [11:30] it should build the faq not the userguide [11:30] i changed it the other way around [11:30] ok cool I see now [11:30] i can't find the error faqguide/faq2.xml:50: element listitem: validity error [11:30] validating now... [11:32] ok the first problem is in UserAdministration..xml [11:32] the html looks quite nice, but i think jiyuu0 original looks (partly) better [11:33] line 50 , should be &login-screen-setup; [11:33] ah, yes, and i have several of those (again) [11:33] menuchoice is not a child of listitem [11:33] it's just that validating takes so horribly long [11:34] your catalogs must be out of date [11:34] why dontyou get an XML editor like Oxygen [11:34] http://www.inwords.co.za/products.html [11:35] you can get a free demo to try it [11:35] trust me its good :-) [11:37] buon giorno [11:37] looking... [11:37] abelli: hi! [11:40] froud: java? [11:41] Heh, Heh, yes :-) [11:41] But big bonus on the editing side [11:41] and validation etc [11:42] still, 50$ ... i have to think about that [11:42] but i'm downloading the demo [11:42] Sure you will love it. I preffer it to XML Spy and its a whole lot cheaper [11:43] The support group is also good [11:43] and it helps that I was the original author of the user manual ;_) [11:44] i mostly use vim [11:44] for just about everything [11:44] tried it, OOxygen wins hands down :-0 [11:45] Inline context completion etc [11:45] easy valdations [11:46] who removes all the empty lines all the time, the validator? [11:46] No Pretty-Print [11:47] When your indentation is all wacked just press the pretty print button [11:47] makes things easier to see [11:48] well try it and see [11:51] downloading java [12:03] looks nice [12:04] Try editing on eyour files [12:04] you will see the inline context completion [12:05] works on elements, attributes and their values [12:05] Also the project panel on th eleft is a time save [12:05] You also have XSLT debug [12:06] XML Tree Editor [12:06] and you can inspect th eobject models [12:06] try insert one of our entities [12:06] do &ubuntu- [12:06] you will see the list of entities defined in global.ent [12:06] much shorter :-) [12:21] plovs, wicked stuff hey :-) [01:06] geeze dudes - writing about Demand Driven Supply Networks is caving my head in [01:21] Hmm, interesting how Yelp uses the GNOME icons for admonitions. I like them much better than the docbook ones. Anyone mind if I replace them with those from GNOME? [01:21] froud: i am seriously in favour === froud scratches around. Knows he has a set somewhere. But where? [01:25] Ok found them and they are now in SVN. Much better :-) [01:25] i'll update and rebuild the faqguide [01:26] cool the new images will be used automatically [01:27] now all we need is ChrisH to work his magic on that nasty CSS [01:29] and then we have one doc finished and a nice base for the other two [01:29] Hmm, but I still see many empty sections. Was it like this in the last release? [01:30] plovs, do you think we should enable toc generation on the chapter levels [01:30] opps my mistake [01:30] we already did [01:31] looking good plovs [01:34] yep, looks nice, now we only need to change the arrows and the home icon, i think [01:36] many empty sections? only tipsandtricks is not yet done, the rest should be finished??? [01:36] is my repo not the same as yours? [01:38] froud: could you take a look in yelp, with arrow down you can go over the whole tree [01:38] froud: everything but tipsandtricks should be there [01:41] yes. it's just tips and tricks, well a large part thereof [01:42] pit yelp does such a poor job of alignment [01:42] pity [01:42] yeah, look rather bad [01:43] looks [01:43] I have not had time to test it in 2.9.3 [01:43] I think that is what ships with Hoary, right? [01:45] yes [01:45] Hmm, perhaps we should test it? [01:45] sivang has it installed for sure, when he comes on line we should ask [01:46] k === abelli [~abelli@84.222.38.217] has joined #ubuntu-doc [02:26] morning all [02:26] boker [02:26] froud: G'morning :) [02:26] sivang: hi [02:26] Hey ChrisH ! [02:27] sivang, you run Yelp 2.9.3? [02:28] froud: I upgraded last night, and it says 2.9.3 [02:28] Can you test the faqguide for plovs [02:29] froud: ofcourse :) after some breakfast :) [02:29] we would like to know how the text and numbers align. In the current version it is poor. === plovs [~plovs@195.13.248.84] has joined #ubuntu-doc [02:29] yes b'fast is more important [02:30] plovs: hi! I will test for you in a 30 minutes or so :) [02:42] sivang: hi! super thanks === froud digs into a bowl of chocolate fudge brownie ice cream === froud point people to Norman Walsh's latest commentary about Docbook 5.0 http://norman.walsh.name/2005/01/03/DocBook-05 === plovs wonders how warm it is in sa, as eating icecream in januari sounds funny [02:47] 30 deg [02:52] mako, RelaxNG here we come, at last :-) === plovs_ [~plovs@62.84.21.44] has joined #ubuntu-doc [02:57] ok, got the link === plovs [~plovs@62.84.21.44] has joined #ubuntu-doc [03:23] froud: would it be a good idea to put some validationrules in the make-file? [03:24] if yes, these?xmllint --noout --xinclude --postvalid [03:29] plovs, well you can, but technically you should have a valid and tested source before doing make [03:30] froud: where to put it then, i would like an easy way from cli to check my files, without remembering xmllint command line options [03:32] when does enrico,usually join ? [03:33] plovs, write a shell script that takes an arguement? [03:33] also do remember the shortcut do history [03:33] !### [03:35] abelli: enrico said he would be online late tonight [03:36] froud: i know, but it would be nice to have it in a central place, so everybody who adds stuff can easily validate [03:37] i'll put a test in if it's no good i'll remove it [03:37] plovs, just create a script like xmllint --noout --xinclude --postvalid $1 [03:38] froud: done that already [03:39] i was just thinking, you told me to validate, if you hadn't i would not even have thought of it. so what about the next guy? [03:40] sure [03:41] btw, i\m more or less finished, some things need to be added still, but mostly its done [03:41] hey you wiped my entities from this morning? [03:41] i hope not??? [03:41] yes there gona [03:41] i am not the entity wiping kinda guy [03:41] no worries will bring them back in sec [03:42] plovs: thank you [03:44] plovs, :-) SVN you gotta love it. Just trust it an it will love you. === froud puts back his ents from r277 [03:45] how? [03:45] nice plovs you're on a role today [03:46] wanted to wrap it up, and work was slow today [03:46] [03:46] [03:46] [03:46] opps [03:46] svn cat global.ent -r 277 [03:46] shows the patch [03:47] since it was only three lines, just copy them and create a new patch [03:48] I could also just reapply the whole patch [03:48] but that would be overkill [03:48] and I would have to make sure I dont break something in later patches [03:48] svn is quite nice i must say [03:48] better than cvs [03:49] although I have been playing with arch and its growing on me by the day :-) [03:49] we will be moving to arch [03:49] i have been told [03:49] but cant do file level patches :-) [03:49] all: sorry but are the images in this page http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/UbuntuArtwork meant to be shown? [03:50] abelli: yes [03:50] at least if nobody changed them, to something else\ [03:51] froud: we will use some spinoff of arch, but for now well keep subversion [03:51] plovs: can you restore that page.. [03:51] perhaps, we'll see [03:51] well "could you please, kindly, restore that page?" [03:52] abelli: no i am in the server room, on cli, sorry [03:52] personally I like to be able to do file patches, not just directy level patches [03:52] abelli: i see no pictures, and the wiki does not work from elinks [03:52] froud: my ol' good, lovable, friend... could you please do it? [03:52] :) [03:53] abelli, I am not a employee :-) [03:53] plovs: but they are meant to work right? [03:53] I have no access, otherwise I would [03:53] well you can edit it.. [03:53] its public. [03:54] abelli: yes, but the wiki is kind of crummy atm, afaik, ask again tonight, i'll forget it for sure [03:54] plovs , froud : thank you [03:55] ok, time to go and get some diner, cu later [03:56] abelli, really I cant help. I can edit, but what does that help I cannot check if the images are there or not. [03:56] plovs, by [03:56] bye [03:56] plovs: dinner? === skyrider [~skyrider@195.128.178.150] has joined #ubuntu-doc === skyrider [~skyrider@195.128.178.150] has joined #ubuntu-doc === jiyuu0 [~jiyuu0@219.95.210.83] has joined #ubuntu-doc === skyrider [~skyrider@195.128.178.150] has joined #ubuntu-doc === froud add trunk/validate.sh to make validation easier for some people === mako_ [mako@micha.hampshire.edu] has joined #ubuntu-doc === [froud] [~sean@ndn-165-135-148.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-doc === enrico_ [~enrico@218-164-121-69.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc [06:26] what about enrico? === ChrisH [~chaas@gw.workaround.org] has joined #ubuntu-doc [06:37] anyone around? [06:38] yes, sir [06:39] <[froud] > limping [06:44] hello ChrisH [06:44] I will be taking the svn server down for about 30 minutes this evening [06:44] I will post to the mailing list with exact times [06:44] got a new router, that will make it alittle more stable [06:44] <[froud] > k [06:47] abelli: :) Hi [06:47] hornbeck: sure === maskie [~maskie@196-30-110-70.uudial.uunet.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-doc === froud [~sean@ndn-165-135-148.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-doc [09:03] hi guys [10:54] faqguide is ported! === sid77 [~sid77@ppp-51-139.30-151.libero.it] has joined #ubuntu-doc [11:20] hi [11:25] hornbeck: when will svn go down?