[09:53] <mdz> sladen: we're using create_compressed_fs, which is actually advfs installed with a different name
[09:53] <fabbione> morning guys
[09:54] <fabbione> lamont: still around?
[09:54] <mdz> fabbione: morning
[09:54] <fabbione> hey mdz
[09:55] <jdub> hey, who sang that song, "it'll all be better if we slept together"?
[09:55] <fabbione> jdub: you are begging us to say you mom (part 2)
[09:55] <jdub> :-)
[09:55] <fabbione> sorry.. couldn't resist
[09:56] <mdz> the name of my new band is Jeff's Mum
[09:56] <mdz> perl: I HATE YOU
[09:56] <jdub> dude, you so want to *be* my mum
[09:57] <fabbione> who is the owner of this boglot?
[09:57] <fabbione> ~logbot@
[09:57] <fabbione> i don't mind it.. just curious
[09:59] <jdub> 19:58 < Greves> i may have to try this so-called "ubuntu"
[09:59] <jdub> we're lying, it's actually called "smillysloffilyploff"
[10:05] <fabbione> bah time to start sandpapering another room
[10:05] <fabbione> later fellas
[10:08] <Mithrandir> fabbione: have fun
[10:13] <Keybuk> Kamion: #5517, want to look?
[10:36] <thom> mornin
[10:37] <Keybuk> hey dude
[10:46] <mdz> Kamion: around?
[10:47] <mdz> after all my wrangling, it's starting to look like the initrd doesn't have the new cdebconf
[10:50] <mdz> $1 says I need to specify your magic flag to use the daily d-i build
[10:53] <mdz> ah, found it, DI_TYPE
[10:54] <amu> moin 
[10:55] <mdz> LAMONT
[10:55] <mdz> http://king.warthogs.hbd.com/%7Ebuildd/livecd/livecd-current.cloop:
[10:55] <mdz> 09:53:50 ERROR 404: Not Found.
[10:57] <thom> mdz: there's a livecd.cloop which is a symlink to 20050115/livecd.cloop
[10:57] <mdz> thom: can you make it point to something which actually exists?
[10:58] <mdz> fuckit, i'll try swapping in a new initrd on my iso
[11:00] <thom> mdz: livecd-current.cloop should work now
[11:00] <thom> as should livecd.cloop
[11:02] <mdz> thanks
[11:09] <elmo> mdz: dude, tell me you're not still up?
[11:09] <mdz> oh, but I am
[11:09] <mdz> and I can almost taste it
[11:16] <elmo> do we use cfq by default in our kernels?
[11:17] <mdz> /boot/config-2.6.10-2-k7:CONFIG_IOSCHED_CFQ=y
[11:18] <elmo> yeah, but IIRC AS is the default
[11:19] <elmo> I'd check, but well, I don't have any non-custom kernels handy ;)
[11:19] <elmo> Using anticipatory io scheduler <-- from mine
[11:19] <mdz> ROCK ON
[11:19] <mdz> X autoconfiguration in the live CD
[11:20] <jdub> sweet!
[11:20] <thom> woot
[11:20] <Kamion> mdz: morning
[11:20] <mdz> Kamion: just in time
[11:20] <Kamion> mdz: did you tweak CONF.sh? I was reading the backlog thinking "shit, forgot to change that over so that he wouldn't have to know
[11:21] <Kamion> mdz: that main->universe symlink stuff was in order that warty CD builds remain possible
[11:21] <Kamion> if somebody trimmed the broken symlinks, they broke that again :)
[11:21] <thom> elmo: yeah, anticipatory is the default
[11:21] <elmo> Kamion: I think you'll have to only use --copy-links for pool
[11:21] <Kamion> elmo: ah, ok
[11:21] <jdub> mdz: how scary is the livecd image-building foo?
[11:21] <Kamion> I saw the anonftpsync change, will review/commit
[11:21] <elmo> Kamion: k, sorry for using your account like that
[11:22] <Kamion> not a problem
[11:22] <mdz> jdub: there's the d-i building bit, the live image building bit, and the CD image building bit
[11:22] <thom> elmo: and yeah, we probably ought to default to CFQ IMO
[11:22] <jdub> mdz: yeah, the live image
[11:22] <Kamion> how come it needed my account in particular? was there stuff non-group-writable?
[11:22] <Kamion> 'cos if so that's a bug I'd like to fix, so mdz can do this stuff
[11:22] <elmo> Kamion: I dunno, matt asked me to sort it, and I'm not in the group - i didn't want to use sudo in case I left broken permissions around
[11:23] <mdz> jdub: shouldn't be particularly scary, but then, no one has seen it except lamont ;-)
[11:23] <Kamion> ok, no problem, I was away and he needed to get stuff done
[11:23] <jdub> mdz: ... ah.
[11:24] <Kamion> mdz: I've set DI_TYPE to daily-installer, next daily build will use the new d-i build
[11:24] <mdz> Kamion: once casper 0.14 builds, a new set of CDs would be great
[11:24] <Kamion> mdz: I rsynced a full live CD last night, and tried to rsync a new one today; it is not rsyncing usefully
[11:25] <mdz> Kamion: yeah, lamont discovered this as well
[11:25] <mdz> it's worth some investigation to find out why; intuitively it seems like we should be winning
[11:26] <opi> morning
[11:26] <mdz> jdub: it was rad, I just booted up this hoary live CD straight into GNOME, and the desktop looks newer than the one on my workstation ;-)
[11:26] <mdz> fresh crack
[11:27] <jdub> mdz: SASS
[11:28] <mvo_> when I booted it and did a apt-get update, some seconds later update-notifier showed some updates :) funny 
[11:28] <jdub> mvo_: last night, mine showed 156 updates ;)
[11:28] <jdub> COW is going to *love* that ;)
[11:29] <mvo_> hehe :)
[11:29] <Riddell> any ideas why my upload of kdelibs to warty-security hasn't built over night?
[11:29] <mdz> thom: I saw something strange with readahead
[11:29] <mdz> on powerpc and/or amd64, it was segfaulting
[11:30] <mdz> and on _shutdown_
[11:30] <mdz> no idea how
[11:32] <mdz> since it doesn't even seem to run at shutdown
[11:33] <Kamion> mdz: apt 0.5.27.2's fine for sarge, isn't it?
[11:33] <Kamion> er, </offtopic>
[11:34] <mdz> Kamion: yeah, that was absolutely its intended target
[11:34] <jdub> mdz: readahead does the sort-readahead-file-by-disk-order on shutdown, doesn't it?
[11:34] <mdz> jdub: the 'stop' section in /etc/init.d/readahead is empty
[11:34] <mdz> and it doesn't have a link in rc/06] .d, either
[11:35] <mdz> so clearly I'm insane
[11:35] <mdz> maybe it segfaulted at boot
[11:35] <Kamion> mdz: the changelog message in 0.5.27.2 is not backed up by any actual diff to the source though
[11:35] <Kamion> I see the stuff in 0.5.27.1, but I don't see the diff for this setlocale() stuff
[11:35] <mdz> really? hmm
[11:35] <mdz> the setlocale() stuff was icing
[11:35] <mdz> the 0.5.27.1 bits are what is needed for sarge
[11:35] <Kamion> the diff is like a single page, it's very clear
[11:35] <Kamion> ok
[11:35] <mdz> weird
[11:35] <Kamion> go arch!
[11:36] <mdz> a single page? the translation updates are missing as well?
[11:36] <Kamion> yes
[11:36] <mdz> wtf
[11:36] <thom> mdz: there's K76fileordering
[11:36] <Kamion> it has MaxArgs and MaxArgsBytes changes, configure/configure.in versioning, changelog, and nothing else
[11:36] <thom> which does the sort on shutdown
[11:37] <thom> it ought to move to the same init script
[11:37] <thom> but... :-)
[11:37] <Kamion> mdz: approved 0.5.27.2, if you could leave a fix for these issues 'til after the next dinstall I'd appreciate it
[11:37] <thom> mdz: so both readahead *and* fileordering were segfaulting?
[11:39] <mdz> thom: just checked to confirm
[11:39] <mdz> K76fileordering segfaults
[11:39] <mdz> S39readahead does not
[11:39] <mdz> this was powerpc just now
[11:39] <thom> right, hrm
[11:40] <thom> my amd64 is still in a box, does it happen there too?
[11:40] <mdz> will check
[11:40] <thom> thanks
[11:42] <mdz> no problem on amd64
[11:44] <thom> right, it could be the funky inode code. could you possibly file a bug and i'll talk to daniel silverstone (since it's his code) on monday
[11:44] <mdz> Kamion: so, I think I'm going to crash, but a new set of CDs based on daily-installer and containing casper-udeb 0.14 would be great
[11:45] <mdz> thom: how much of the faster-boot experimentation ended up making it into hoary?
[11:45] <thom> we don't have caching of /dev nor the faster gdm artwork yet
[11:46] <thom> most everything bar that should be in
[11:46] <elmo> gdm's artwork is slow?
[11:46] <Kamion> mdz: ok, will build in twenty minutes or so when casper 0.14 shows up
[11:46] <thom> elmo: resizing it is, yes
[11:46] <mdz> I'll queue an rsync for +1 hour or so
[11:46] <elmo> boggle
[11:47] <thom> elmo: (it's a png, not svg, so gdm has to do some hard work)
[11:47] <Kamion> mdz: ok
[11:48] <mdz> thom: I've added an entry to the HoaryGoals page for it; please create a wiki page to record which bits went in, and also the future stuff that we could do
[11:48] <mdz> so we can brag about it in the release notes, etc.
[11:49] <jdub> elmo: seems gdk-pixbuf is crap at scaling images
[11:49] <thom> mdz: sure
[11:49] <jdub> thom: turns out an svg version of current gdm glow is 'hard'
[11:49] <Kamion> elmo: could you update germinate on jackass? I added support for per-arch seed entries, would like to start using them soonish
[11:49] <jdub> thom: it's not just one gradient ;)
[11:49] <thom> jdub: ah.
[11:49] <jdub> thom: so we'll probably have something new and special
[11:50] <mdz> thanks
[11:50] <mdz> night all
[11:50] <thom> so we're racing to gdm, and then sitting around and twiddling our thumbs for an image to load :-)
[11:50] <jdub> not elmo special, proper special
[11:50] <mvo_> night mdz
[11:50] <thom> night dude
[11:52] <jdub>    * Enable X autoconfiguration(!)
[11:52] <jdub> :-)
[11:54] <amu> n8 mdz 
[11:55] <Kamion> elmo: will anastacia (or whichever one it is) be able to deal with germinate giving different answers for main-ness/universe-ness on different architectures?
[11:55] <Kamion> (doesn't really matter if it can't and I guess overrides probably don't get to be per-arch like that, would just be interesting)
[11:57] <jdub> elmo: ping
[12:01] <daniels> mdz: g'night
[12:02] <Kamion> also, either elilo needs to be removed from i386 or efibootmgr needs to be built on i386, one or the other
[12:03] <Kamion> I think probably the latter given that elilo explicitly claims that it's useful on some i386 systems
[12:04] <Kamion> hm, do Intel x86_64 systems use EFI?
[12:04] <Kamion> and/or elilo ...
[12:08] <elmo> Kamion: nope, it almagates all the architectures, so if you're in main for one, you're in for all
[12:08] <Kamion> fair enough
[12:09] <sladen> Kamion: I don't believe so---remember those machines are still coming up as 16-bit 286's
[12:09] <Kamion> still, it will help out (a) CD images and (b) debootstrap, and you'll need to understand the new syntax
[12:09] <elmo> btw, the gdm image stuff couldn't you just resize permanently?  most people don't change res often?  combined with a mini-rainbow of common sizes being generated by cron after install or something?
[12:09] <Kamion> sladen: so are i386en and apparently they can use EFI
[12:09] <elmo> Kamion: ok, will do when I get to the DC..
[12:10] <Kamion> sladen: it's a matter of boot firmware rather than 64-bitness AIUI
[12:10] <elmo> Kamion: I don't think they do use EFI no
[12:10] <elmo> HP DL3x0's G4's are em64_t, but AFAIK they have a normal bios, I'll ask taggart
[12:10] <Kamion> hm, ok
[12:10] <azeem> is there an eaysy way to get laptop-mode not to mount partitions with noatime?
[12:11] <azeem> eh, in warty
[12:11] <Kamion> http://adare.warthogs.hbd.com/%7Ebuildd/livecd/livecd-current.cloop:
[12:11] <Kamion> 11:11:01 ERROR 404: Not Found.
[12:11] <Kamion> can someone fix that?
[12:11] <Kamion> amd64 and i386 were fine
[12:11] <elmo> how would it be fixed?
[12:12] <Kamion> livecd-current.cloop-1024:65536 exists ...
[12:12] <thom> Kamion: doing so now
[12:12] <elmo> azeem: you actually have a use for atime?  on a laptop?
[12:12] <elmo> thom: by manually adding the CD ?
[12:12] <elmo> err, link?
[12:12] <azeem> elmo: it breaks mutt
[12:12] <elmo> if so, please be sure to tell lamont so he can actually fix it
[12:12] <elmo> azeem: boggle
[12:12] <thom> elmo: yes
[12:12] <thom> and yes
[12:13] <Kamion> I think the -4096:4096 build failed and that was what was supposed to be linked to the plain name
[12:13] <thom> Kamion: done
[12:13] <Kamion> judging from terranova
[12:13] <Kamion> thom: thanks
[12:13] <thom> same happened on amd64, fwiw
[12:15] <bob2> azeem: how does it break mutt?
[12:16] <azeem> bob2: mutt sometimes thinks there's new mail in mailboxes all the time 
[12:16] <azeem> aha
[12:16] <azeem> "If you use mutt and experience this, you must disable the noatime remounting in the control script by setting DO_REMOUNT_NOATIME=0."
[12:17] <azeem> control script == /usr/sbin/laptop-mode
[12:17] <azeem> took me a while to figure that out :)
[12:18] <thom> it sources /etc/default/laptop-mode, no?
[12:19] <Kamion> mdz: new live CD up, seems sane
[12:20] <sladen> thom: I think the laptop-mode in Hoary/Debian is out of date;  there's new ones I've seen that have about 20 options in the config file
[12:20] <thom> sladen: quite likely
[12:20] <azeem> there are options in the Debian one, yes
[12:21] <sladen> Kamion: just Googling, I've found one press release mentioning plans to produce an amd64/efi system
[12:21] <azeem> thom: yeah, that works as well, thanks
[12:21] <thom> np
[12:22] <sladen> Kamion: but I suspect you can ignore it until that actually happens
[12:33] <doko> kamion: can we close #1232?
[12:49] <Kamion> doko: just looking at the last couple of entries
[12:55] <jdub> sladen: "coloured prompt!"
[12:55] <jdub> sladen: "no, what do you want from the boot process?"
[12:55] <jdub> sladen: "optimised packages!"
[12:56] <sladen> jdub: "use flags!"
[12:56] <Kamion> do users want a boot process that can be inserted nasally?
[12:56] <jdub> right into the main vein
[12:58] <sladen> we need a focus group.  This is like extracting water from a stone
[12:59] <jdub> Kamion: have you done mini.iso installs?
[01:01] <Kamion> jdub: which mini.iso?
[01:02] <jdub> Kamion: warty's
[01:02] <Kamion> jdub: no, *which* mini.iso? netboot, monolithic, ...?
[01:03] <Kamion> mini.iso is just a way of putting the bits together, it doesn't specify which bits
[01:03] <Kamion> people have done netboot installs, I haven't done one with final warty and I know there were a couple of bugs
[01:04] <Kamion> I did a hoary netboot install yesterday, was basically ok
[01:05] <jdub> Kamion: oh, netboot i guess, couldn't see any others
[01:06] <Kamion> probably depends on the arch
[01:06] <jdub> yeah, some dude did a warty install and it was incomplete
[01:06] <jdub> i386
[01:06] <Kamion> hm, how so?
[01:06] <Kamion> I can give it a try later ...
[01:06] <jdub> didn't have ubuntu-desktop
[01:06] <jdub> and a bunch of other stuff
[01:06] <Kamion> boggle
[01:06] <Kamion> that's a function of the archive not the boot method
[01:06] <jdub> he may have done something wacky
[01:07] <Kamion> was he trying to use the CD as a "mirror"?
[01:07] <jdub> no
[01:07] <jdub> full net install
[01:07] <Kamion> ok
[01:07] <jdub> it was greves on #ubuntu if you want to ask for more details
[01:07] <Kamion> I'll check it out next opportunity, then
[01:07] <Kamion> I have to go in twenty minutes unfortunately, maybe later
[01:07] <Kamion> thanks for passing that on
[01:09] <sladen> one thing that was strange with the net-install is that it only offered 'Great Britain' as a mirror option.  Eventually figured that was because that's where the Canonical machines are.  Is it worth adding an automatic skip in the case of only one choice?
[01:15] <Kamion> sladen: theoretically, but I'd rather add more mirrors
[01:21] <two-face> Hi.
[01:22] <jdub> elmo, lamont: ping
[01:22] <jdub> oh, hi elmo 
[01:22] <elmo> ?
[01:22] <jdub> elmo: so Riddell did a warty-security upload - do you still have to confirm it?
[01:23] <jdub> elmo: are security build logs ever published?
[01:23] <elmo> jdub: warty-security is setup to require confirmation from the security team yes
[01:23] <elmo> and no
[01:23] <jdub> cool, ta
[01:23] <elmo> (security team meaning pitti)
[01:23] <jdub> oh right
[01:23] <elmo> kdelibs got built fine, it's just sitting in queue/accepted
[01:24] <jdub> great
[01:24] <jdub> just answering Riddell's mail on u-d
[01:24] <Riddell> elmo: why are the logs not published?
[01:24] <elmo> I've no idea how we want to handle warty-security, i.e. whether or not we require confirmation
[01:24] <elmo> Riddell: because security uploads are often embargoed
[01:24] <jdub> heh
[01:24] <Riddell> what does embargoed mean?
[01:24] <elmo> err, handle warty-security +"for universe"
[01:24] <jdub> Riddell: answering your mail atm, with that precise phrase in it :)
[01:25] <elmo> Riddell: not to be released until a certain agreed date
[01:27] <Riddell> elmo: ah, that makes sense
[01:28] <Riddell> hmm, if I'm an approved ubuntu person does that mean I get on planet.ubuntu :)
[01:30] <jdub> Riddell: planet ubuntu will actually be for members soon, not just developers :)
[01:39] <Riddell> is the website team aware of just how heavily ubuntulinux.org uses text-shadow?  it gets quite annoying after a bit
[01:39] <jdub> Riddell: whereabouts?
[01:41] <elmo> Kamion: so, what's going to change when I update  germinate?
[01:42] <Kamion> elmo: with the current seeds, nothing
[01:42] <Kamion> elmo: well, depends what your current version is I guess ;)
[01:43] <Kamion> elmo: once seeds get updated, there'll be stuff like "elilo [ia64] ", so elilo will only be considered part of the base seed if you're germinating for ia64
[01:44] <Kamion> it won't be actively excluded on other architectures though - i.e. if something on i386 depends on elilo it'll still be included
[01:44] <Kamion> just not seeded
[01:44] <elmo> ok, so that won't matter to me
[01:44] <elmo> hmm, which doesn't really help does it?
[01:45] <Kamion> elmo: it helps with the CD images and my auto-debootstrap-updater - the only reason I want you to update is that the syntax for arch-specific seeds would be invalid in old germinate, I think
[01:45] <elmo> presumably the point of that was to not pull things in that can't be dep-satisfied? 
[01:45] <elmo> ok
[01:45] <Kamion> no, the point is not to have to pull stuff into base on one arch just because it's base in another
[01:45] <Kamion> or similar
[01:45] <Kamion> it doesn't matter for main/universe-ness, it matters for which bit of main/universe it's in
[01:46] <Kamion> which bit of main, I mean
[01:46] <elmo> ok
[01:46] <Riddell> jdub: all the headers http://muse.19inch.net/~jr/tmp/ubuntu-text-shadow.png  it would be fine if it was toned down a bit
[01:46] <elmo> I thought it might be trying to address oo.o on ia64 for example
[01:46] <Kamion> up to now I've had a system of overrides in debootstrap to cope, but that's a bit informal and really ought to die
[01:47] <elmo> ok, I'm up to colin.watson@canonical.com--2004/germinate--mainline--0--patch-29
[01:47] <Kamion> elmo: lamont mentioned that, but I'm not convinced that'll work; otoh we might be able to take it out of desktop on ia64, I think, which might help
[01:47] <Kamion> it'll still be a build failure then but wouldn't block livefs builds
[01:47] <Kamion> elmo: that's currnt
[01:47] <Kamion> +e
[01:48] <elmo> kamion: it won't work
[01:48] <elmo> the archive can't do per-arch components for a given binary package
[01:48] <elmo> hmm, anasatacia got very upset
[01:49] <Kamion> elmo: like I say, I don't care whether it's still in main or not
[01:49] <jdub> Riddell: holy crap
[01:49] <elmo> Kamion: yes, but to solve oo.o, you'd have to
[01:49] <Kamion> elmo: if it's still in main that's fine, but we could make ubuntu-desktop stop depending on it
[01:49] <jdub> Riddell: i guess gecko doesn't implement that
[01:50] <elmo> well sure, but we'd still have uninstallable packages in main, which sucks
[01:50] <Kamion> elmo: don't see why? if it's not depended-upon it won't be included
[01:50] <jdub> Riddell: that looks completely crap - can you file a bug?
[01:50] <Kamion> oh, yeah, it's not a full solution, but it would stop being a live-CD blocker
[01:50] <elmo> sure
[01:50] <Kamion> what broke anastacia?
[01:50] <elmo> anyway, this doesn't seem to have worked too well, linux-source is getting no love for !i386.. checking
[01:50] <Kamion> huh, odd
[01:51] <fabbione> uh?
[01:51] <Kamion> the last change really ought to be a no-op with current seeds
[01:51] <elmo> kamion: I was quite out of date
[01:52] <elmo> I jumped 15 odd patches
[01:53] <Kamion> hm, the multi-component/multi-dist stuff would be the prime candidate for something going wrong
[01:53] <Kamion> it was all fine for me on cdimage though
[01:54] <Kamion> elmo: anyway unfortunately I really have to go, late already; if it's a blocker feel free to revert and I'll sort it out later
[01:54] <elmo> do you care if Desktop goes screwy?
[01:54] <elmo> other than it's not a blocker
[01:55] <Kamion> yeah, kinda
[01:55] <Kamion> cdimage cares anyway
[01:55] <Kamion> if you could mail me the germinate invocation you're using that would be goodd
[01:55] <elmo> cares before you get back? :)
[01:55] <Kamion> mmm, probably not
[01:56] <Kamion> I'll be away most of the afternoon/early-evening though
[01:56] <elmo> ok then, i'll leave it, i'm not even sure how I'd revert.. I'll poke at it and mail you details including how to reproduce
[01:56] <Kamion> baz update <whatever-revision-you-were-last-at>
[01:56] <elmo> yeah the problem is the last part
[01:56] <Kamion> oh, don't have the output from the update around any more?
[01:57] <elmo> oh, yeah I do, blah.. too tired
[01:57] <elmo> or rather, I have a backup copy of the entire dir, I'll revert to that for now
[01:57] <Kamion> anyhow ... gone
[02:15] <Riddell> jdub: what is the difference between a developer and a maintainer?
[02:15] <jdub> Riddell: developer covers committers, maintainers, etc.
[02:15] <jdub> Riddell: so it's just a more general term
[02:15] <Riddell> jdub: you said planet would be for "maintainers not just developers"
[02:16] <jdub> Riddell: members not just developers
[02:17] <Riddell> jdub: so who's allowed on the planet at the moment (not because I want on it, I'm trying to understand the terminology)
[02:18] <jdub> Riddell: atm, it's an unupdatable blob ;)
[02:18] <jdub> Riddell: i'm fixing things up atm, so that when it will be maintained from an arch branch
[02:18] <jdub> at which point, it will be for any member
[02:19] <Riddell> ok, richt
[02:19] <jdub> i'll put your blog on straight away :)
[02:19] <jdub> do you have an ubuntu or tech category?
[02:20] <jdub> elmo: btw, could you send the index.html.tmpl from the planet install? i didn't realise you just sent the config last time :-)
[02:20] <sladen> jdub: you need to put a flowchart diagram up that goes   member -> committer -> maintainer   or something
[02:20] <jdub> yeah
[02:20] <Riddell> jdub: http://www.kdedevelopers.org/blog/feed/57
[02:21] <jdub> hrm
[02:21] <elmo> jdub: I thought I tarred up config-ubuntu for oyu.. but ok
[02:21] <jdub> drupal does such poo rss ;)
[02:21] <jdub> at least it has dates now
[02:21] <jdub> elmo: hrm, wait a sec
[02:22] <jdub> i'll check personal mail
[02:22] <jdub> nup
[02:22] <elmo> jdub: sent
[02:22] <jdub> thanks
[02:22] <jdub> now to deplone it
[02:24] <elmo> doko: I just passed you a pyopengl b-d bug
[02:24] <elmo> doko: do  you know off hand whath appened to python2.3-dictdlib?  dict-moby-thesaurus still b-d's on it
[02:25] <doko> python2.3-dictdlib is nowpython2.4-dictdlib, will update dict-moby-thesaurus
[02:25] <elmo> doko: ah, well it must have FTBFS
[02:26] <elmo> 'cos python2.4-dictdlib doesn't exist yet in the archive :)
[02:26] <elmo> could you chase that down too?
[02:26] <doko> pyopengl b-d, I should pass that on to daniels, see http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/pkgreport.cgi?pkg=xvfb
[02:27] <doko> elmo: ok, btw, what any news about the powerpc64 chroot on davis?
[02:28] <Riddell> jdub: should I turn up at at the next technical board meeting and ask to be made a maintainer so I can work on kde packages in main (and does haggai need to do the same)?
[02:28] <elmo> doko: err, what would I build it with?  I thought you were just asking if I would do it, not for me to do it
[02:28] <jdub> Riddell: haggai has been approved already
[02:28] <elmo> doko: can you make the pyopengl bug say 'blocks on <n>' (whatever <n> is for our BTS)
[02:28] <doko> elmo: will do
[02:28] <jdub> Riddell: you should put your name on the maintainer proposals page, and CC and TB agenda
[02:29] <elmo> doko: [ppc64]  will a powerpc chroot do to start with?
[02:29] <Riddell> jdub: ok. why the CC agenda?
[02:29] <doko> elmo: chroot: yes, then install the things I wrote you in an email.
[02:29] <elmo> Riddell: CC and TB approve maintainers
[02:29] <elmo> doko: I don't seem to be getting email from you
[02:30] <elmo> doko: where/when/to-who did you send it, and what's the message  ID?
[02:30] <jdub> Riddell: gotta get the love from everyone ;)
[02:31] <Riddell> elmo, jdub: so CC approves members, TB approves committers and both CC and TB approve maintainers?
[02:31] <Riddell> sladen: the flow is fairly obvious, it's the details that arn't clear
[02:32] <ogra> Riddell, wasnt there a propsal from mark that you get both stati in one step to speed up the MOTU process
[02:32] <ogra> Riddell, thats how i understood it at least
[02:32] <jdub> Riddell: the bar for being a universe maintainer is quite a bit lower than for being a main maintainer
[02:32] <doko> elmo: sent again. you did get my email about the mailman sync from unstable?
[02:33] <jdub> Riddell: haggai was approved quickly because he's an experienced debian maintainer, and has a saucy and convincing british accent
[02:33] <ogra> hehe
[02:35] <jdub> ogra: do you have a blog?
[02:35] <ogra> yup
[02:35] <jdub> ogra: with an ubuntu or tech category in it?
[02:35] <ogra> nope, do i need one ?
[02:35] <jdub> not necessarily
[02:35] <jdub> your call which you'd prefer
[02:36] <jdub> would you like to be aggregated on planet.ubuntu?
[02:36] <jdub> if so, rss url please :)
[02:36] <ogra> since all i blog will mostly be ubuntu related i dont think i need a category: http://www.grawert.net/weblog.cgi/index.rss
[02:36] <ogra> :)
[02:37] <jdub> cool
[02:37] <ogra> thanks
[02:38] <ogra> jdub: btw, remember our graveman discussion about setting the g-v-m burner key in postinst.... ?
[02:39] <jdub> yeah
[02:39] <jdub> the one where i cried and begged you not to? ;)
[02:39] <ogra> jdub: if i leave nautilus in there, but want to burn with graveman, how do i avoid nautilus from popping up if a cd is inserted ?
[02:40] <jdub> ogra: you can't, the best thing is to change the setting
[02:40] <ogra> except by setting/unsetting the key dynamically if the app is started
[02:40] <jdub> ogra: in future, g-v-m will have a list box of choices instead of command lines
[02:40] <ogra> yup, thats what i thought...
[02:40] <ogra> ah, thats nicer :)
[02:41] <jdub> in which case you'll be able to provide a choice for it in the package, and the user can choose it
[02:41] <jdub> elmo: haven't got your mail yet...
[02:45] <elmo> oh GAR
[02:46] <elmo> jdub: really sent - sorry, sending mail to canonical.com from within the DC, is, err interesting
[02:46] <jdub> heh
[03:10] <fabbione> hey seb128
[03:15] <sivang> hi seb128_ 
[03:15] <seb128_> hello
[03:16] <fabbione> hmmmmmm
[03:16] <fabbione> we have an ioctl problem with the new emu10k1 driver
[03:17] <fabbione> now.. how many applications do we need to update?
[03:17] <fabbione> all the mixers segfaults doing some very specific operations
[03:20] <fabbione> cool
[03:20] <fabbione> now i have the THX tuned again!
[03:20] <elmo> fabbione: hmm - I thought you added the pb sleep patch?
[03:20] <fabbione> pb?
[03:21] <fabbione> powerbook?
[03:21] <elmo> yeah
[03:21] <fabbione> it's no go on 2.6.10
[03:21] <fabbione> i am waiting for benh to port it
[03:21] <fabbione> and i will add it
[03:21] <elmo> oh, meh, ok
[03:21] <fabbione> i did try to merge it myself but it was no go
[03:21] <elmo> it's in the source package which confused me
[03:21] <elmo> the source source package, I mean
[03:21] <fabbione> too many bits have been merged upstream and others need to be reviewed
[03:21] <fabbione> yeah my fault
[03:22] <fabbione> i forgot to take it away
[03:22] <fabbione> but it's not applied
[03:22] <elmo> yeah, ok, no prob
[03:22] <fabbione> it works on 2.6.9
[03:22] <elmo> yep, using it on there now.. I'll go back to that +security patches
[03:23] <fabbione> elmo: if it is only for your laptop and it is not multiuser, you only need the igmp patch
[03:23] <fabbione> that was the only remote DoS
[03:23] <fabbione> otherwise skip the others
[03:23] <fabbione> i doubt you give accounts to people on your laptop
[03:24] <fabbione> iirc that one made it in 2.6.9 before we switched to 2.6.10
[03:27] <fabbione> note for my self: stop playing around servers powerswitched when passing new cables
[03:27] <fabbione> (machines can casually turn off)
[03:29] <JakubS> :-)
[03:31] <JakubS> jdub: i'm the guy who filed debian bug against mdnsresponder's license
[03:31] <JakubS> why you install copy of BSD instead of APSL-2 ?
[03:31] <lamont> Kamion: you around?
[03:32] <JakubS> into /usr/share/doc/mdnresponder/copyright?
[03:32] <jdub> JakubS: it's a bug
[03:32] <jdub> JakubS: just needs to be clarified
[03:32] <jdub> JakubS: the library interface is BSD (thus the confusion)
[03:32] <JakubS> ah ok, i just wanted your comment on that 
[03:33] <JakubS> library sure is but daemon not
[03:33] <jdub> that's right
[03:33] <jdub> i'm aware of the problem :)
[03:36] <lamont> fabbione: so is -8 still the current one, I wonder?
[03:36] <fabbione> lamont: he left sometime ago
[03:36] <fabbione> lamont: yes :-)
[03:37] <fabbione> i am not working today
[03:37] <lamont> woot!  I finally have the current kernel source in  my mirror!!! :-)
[03:37] <fabbione> i need to unmelt my brain
[03:37] <fabbione> AHAH
[03:37] <crimsun> ogra: if you'd like and have the time, please consider triggering a simple rebuild of 'nicotine' against python2.4 (all that's needed is a recompile).
[03:37] <lamont> fabbione: you;re the one who wants me to work on it...
[03:38] <jdub> riowr!
[03:38] <fabbione> lamont: i would like to get the kernel at "state of the art" on 6 arches :-)
[03:38] <fabbione> lamont: that would be an achievement
[03:38] <Riddell> haggai: awa wi ye sassenach
[03:38] <lamont> I will work on it this weekend.  which happens to include mondyua
[03:39] <lamont> which is fortunate, since today is 'fix the frozen pipes and figure out what else got ruined' day
[03:42] <lamont> thom?
[03:56] <doko> fabbione: lrm again. adding the avm isdn modules including the firmware will increase the size of each l-r-m binary on ix86 by a factor of 4, ending up at 6mb. upload it as is, or split it in it's own binaries lrm-avm-2.6.xx ?
[04:01] <Treenaks> ogra: not dput?
[04:01] <ogra> Treenaks: are there advantages ? 
[04:02] <Treenaks> ogra: it's a shorter name ;)
[04:02] <ogra> heh
[04:02] <ogra> ok
[04:02] <lamont> Setting up fontconfig (2.2.3-2ubuntu1) ...
[04:02] <lamont> /usr/sbin/laptop-detect: line 14: dmidecode: command not found
[04:02] <lamont> grumble
[04:02] <Treenaks> yay for non-x86!
[04:02] <Treenaks> (I guess)_
[04:02] <lamont> yeah
[04:04] <fabbione> doko: dude.. until everything is in the same source it's ok
[04:05] <fabbione> doko: it doesn't really matter how many binaries will spit out, but again you need to discuss this with mdz since he expect max 2 sources with kernel stuff.. kernel and lrm
[04:06] <Treenaks> grrgghgggrrrrrrh...
[04:06] <Treenaks> fabbione: (not your uber-patched 2.6.10)
[04:08] <fabbione> ARGH!
[04:08] <fabbione> xine-libs are borked!
[04:10] <doko> fabbione: he delegated the decision to you/us :)
[04:11] <doko> doko: so I propose to put it in the same module until somebody cries about the size.
[04:12] <fabbione> doko: so go ahead and decide.. for me any solution is the same
[04:13] <doko> fabbione: ok
[04:18] <ogra> crimsun: uploaded... lets see if i did it right ;)
[04:18] <crimsun> ogra: many thanks
[04:18] <ogra> thanks for pointing me at it ;)
[04:19] <crimsun> np :)
[04:20] <robertj> has anyone in here running hoary done a dist-upgrade to find that only 640x480 & 800x600 were still working on their i810 hardware?
[04:20] <robertj> and also, that there was no menu text on the panels or right-click menus?
[04:24] <robertj> It's been noted a few times on the forums
[04:27] <sladen> robertj: 1024x768 still works.  but I've seen the  no-panels  bug many times
[04:27] <sladen> robertj: it's a race that needs tracking down.  Workaround:    pkill -u $USER
[04:27] <sladen> and log back in
[04:28] <robertj> sladen: there are napenls
[04:28] <robertj> they are void of text
[04:28] <robertj> I've got the gnome foot and the sound icon up top but no menu text
[04:28] <robertj> at the bottom I have lal my launcher icons and stuff, but no text on the task list
[04:28] <sladen> is this funny-crashed-xserver type thing
[04:28] <robertj> if I click the foot I get all the images in a little micro-menu with no text, is that what you have seen?
[04:29] <sladen> nope.  not seen that one.  As though all the text is suddenly zero-width?
[04:30] <robertj> and once it was just very very tiny
[04:30] <robertj> like a little line going across the screen, with several pages taking up only a few hundred pixels
[04:34] <robertj> sladen: getting Bad V_BIOS checksum
[04:34] <robertj> should that worry me?
[04:34] <trukulo> Mithrandir, r u there?
[04:36] <fabbione> daniels: ping
[04:37] <trukulo> fabbione, have you seen your video?
[04:37] <fabbione> trukulo: no. i was waiting to know if it was all up
[04:38] <trukulo> small one is all up
[04:38] <trukulo> well, small ones, i mean
[04:38] <fabbione> nah i was waiting for the big one
[04:39] <trukulo> ok
[04:39] <ogra> why is gnome-btdownload still excluded from universe ?
[04:40] <trukulo> ogra, i have package for 20050112 graveman
[04:40] <trukulo> if you want sources..
[04:40] <ogra> oh, there is a new upstream ?
[04:40] <trukulo> more than one
[04:40] <trukulo> 3 i think
[04:40] <trukulo> with new dependencies
[04:41] <trukulo> build time too
[04:41] <trukulo> http://mercurio.homeip.net/debian/
[04:41] <trukulo> there you have mine , if you want to look at it
[04:42] <fabbione> i wonder why you two don't share a common arch repo
[04:42] <fabbione> and create an ubuntu and a debian branch
[04:42] <fabbione> keeping the common stuff
[04:42] <fabbione> in "common"
[04:42] <trukulo> because i'm very bad doing this
[04:43] <trukulo> i don't understand well things related to package development, yet
[04:43] <ogra> fabbione:  because i dont want to _develop_ graveman.... if there will be a debian package it will go into universe anyway....
[04:44] <ogra> and it seems trukulo plans to get his included into sid if i understood it correctly....
[04:44] <fabbione> ok
[04:44] <fabbione> but i would still share the efford with a simple RCS
[04:45] <fabbione> and you would both benefits in learning :-)
[04:45] <trukulo> ogra, i want to, i have to speak with a friend that is debian delevoper
[04:45] <ogra> fabbione: i'm setting up bazaar anyway....
[04:45] <trukulo> perhaps he can be my "bitch-uploader"
[04:45] <fabbione> ogra: baz is fine :-)
[04:45] <fabbione> baz is based on the arch protocol
[04:46] <ogra> trukulo: nah, come on.....get a dev yourself....you are already on your way....
[04:46] <ogra> fabbione: i know ;) i had a lot of cigarettes with jblack in mataro ....
[04:47] <trukulo> ogra, time problem here :)
[04:47] <ogra> trukulo: universe urgently needs new maintainers ....
[04:47] <sivang> ogra: the reason for using those is that they are cheaper right? ;-)
[04:47] <trukulo> i have my own enterprise, and not very much time
[04:48] <ogra> sivang: those ?
[04:48] <trukulo> so being a developer it's not on my plains
[04:48] <trulux> woo
[04:48] <trulux> mdz: ping
[04:50] <sivang> ogra: woops, I though jblack was the cigarettes's filling.
[04:50] <ogra> heh
[04:50] <ogra> sivang: lol, jblack is james blackwell from the arch team ;)
[04:51] <sivang> ogra: hhm, I hope he doesn't read this somehwere :)
[04:52] <trukulo> Mithrandir, you awake? tell what video to upload next
[04:53] <jdub> trukulo: i listened to the video of me yesterday - obviously i need help with spanish humour, badopi dudes were not laughing loud enough :-)
[04:55] <trukulo> lol
[04:55] <trukulo> if you want to take classes, tell me
[04:55] <trukulo> you know what happens?
[04:55] <trukulo> they don't understand very well english
[04:55] <trukulo> so they need to do a lot of work listening, and that is no good for humor
[04:56] <jdub> yeah
[04:56] <trukulo> anyway, yes, you need to improve your humor
[04:56] <trukulo> heheheh
[04:56] <jdub> i hope they watch the video again and realise how FUNNY it was :-)
[04:57] <trukulo> you need to be very ugly to be funny
[04:57] <trukulo> as mako
[04:57] <trukulo> xD
[04:57] <jdub> heh
[04:57] <fabbione> jdub: what time is it in .au?
[04:57] <fabbione> or better.. where daniels lives
[04:58] <jdub> 0300
[04:58] <fabbione> jdub: isn't time to wake him up and tell him that xine-lib is borked?
[05:01] <fabbione> daf: nevermind... i always forget that i tend to put all the logs > /dev/null on my sensible systems
[05:01] <fabbione> ops
[05:01] <fabbione> ECHAN
[05:23] <elmo> okay, the buildds are going down for a while - shout now if this is particularly inconvenient for you
[05:23] <elmo> (while ==> hours)
[05:25] <fabbione> go for me
[05:26] <sladen> robertj: mention  Bad V_BIOS  to daniels (I'd assume vesa-bios or something without lookingit up
[05:27] <robertj> sladen: using a custom xorg.conf got me going again
[05:27] <robertj> menus still lack text though
[05:28] <robertj> maybe somewhere pango is barfing?
[05:28] <sladen> robertj: what did you have to change in the xorg.conf?
[05:28] <Riddell> I'm getting a "/usr/bin/ld: cannot find -lXinerama" compile error because there is a libXinerama.so.1 but no libXinerama.so  Any ideas how to get round that?
[05:28] <robertj> sladen: not sure, I just created a real basic xorg.conf and got it going
[05:29] <crimsun> Riddell: is libxinerama-dev installed?
[05:30] <fabbione> Riddell: as crimsun sais...
[05:30] <Riddell> crimsun: you are a genius
[05:30] <crimsun> nah, I've just been bitten by it before
[05:30] <crimsun> .so symlinks are in -dev packages
[05:37] <Riddell> if I have a package from CVS how should I version it?  cvs20050115-ubuntu1  or cvs20050115-1ubuntu1 ?
[05:41] <fabbione> Riddell: i suggest <oldversion>+cvs<date>-0ubuntu1
[05:41] <fabbione> or something like that
[05:44] <trukulo> or better : package-cvs<date>-randomnumber-willfuckyoursystemifyoudontwatchit-ubuntu1
[05:47] <mako> trukulo: I HEARD THAT
[05:47] <mako> trukulo: be carefully buddy.. i know where you live :)
[05:54] <trukulo> mako, You talking to me? You talking to me? You talking to me? Then who the hell else are you talking to? You talking to me? Well, I'm the only one here.
[06:05] <Treenaks> trukulo: could you seed fabio_big or jeff_big? :) (you were the seed right?)
[06:08] <fabbione> ahah i found the perfect weapon to give to our users to kill all the bugs themselves
[06:08] <fabbione> http://twerked.com/~splice/pics/p_debates.jpg
[06:08] <bob2> hahaha
[06:09] <bob2> html files with .jpg extenions are wrong and against nature
[06:09] <trukulo> sure
[06:11] <Treenaks> bob2: as long as the MIME type is OK...
[06:11] <Treenaks> bob2: IE won't understand though :)
[06:13] <lupus_> nice :)
[06:13] <trukulo> Treenaks, fabio uploading
[06:13] <fabbione> trukulo: uploading what?
[06:13] <Treenaks> fabbione: video from mataro
[06:13] <fabbione> ah ok
[06:13] <trukulo> big one
[06:13] <fabbione> ok
[06:13] <trukulo> mirak, fabio big uploading
[06:14] <trukulo> ups
[06:14] <trukulo> Mithrandir, i mean
[06:14] <Treenaks> trukulo: I can't see a seed on fabio_big ?
[06:14] <Mithrandir> trukulo: great
[06:14] <trukulo> Treenaks, i'm doing right now
[06:15] <trukulo> Mithrandir, can you confirm seed of fabio?
[06:15] <Mithrandir> Treenaks: I'm seeing it
[06:15] <Mithrandir> yeah
[06:15] <Treenaks> hmmm
[06:16] <Treenaks> oh hey it works now
[06:16] <trukulo> :)
[06:21] <seb128> is there a problem with the archive ?
[06:22] <amu> 3 problems with the livecd, ipw2200 is not detected, X with my nvidia and after login out, and relogin with gdm, gdm ask for a user + pass       
[06:22] <seb128> nm
[07:00] <mdz> amu: tried the new live CDs? :-)
[07:00] <jdub> mdz: how's the rsyncability?
[07:00] <mdz> jdub: crap
[07:00] <jdub> bummer
[07:00] <amu> mdz: yep ;) 
[07:01] <amu> mdz: *dammed* you sleep less than me 
[07:01] <mdz> amu: did X come up for you?
[07:01] <jdub> sleep is for the week
[07:01] <bob2> haha
[07:01] <amu> mdz: no, driver was correct, nv, resolution was also fine, i changed it to vesa and it runs  
[07:02] <mdz> amu: oh, does your card not work with nv?
[07:02] <mdz> amu: the login/logout thing is apparently a feature in gdm, but maybe we can change it...jdub, seb128?
[07:02] <amu> mdz: no, with 1600*1080 only nvidia works D 
[07:03] <mdz> amu: is there some way to detect it so that we can choose vesa for that card instead of nv?
[07:03] <jdub> mdz: missed the context
[07:03] <mdz> amu: have you talked to daniels?
[07:03] <mdz> jdub: gdm autologin only autologins when it first starts up
[07:04] <jdub> oh right
[07:04] <mdz> jdub: if you log out, it leaves you at a login prompt
[07:04] <mdz> I assume this is by design
[07:04] <mdz> to prevent endless looping and that sort of thing
[07:04] <jdub> yeah, totally
[07:04] <jdub> can we just turn off logging out? :)
[07:04] <amu> mdz: nv it works with smaller ex 1400*9xx resolutions, but Xorg  detects full 1600*1080 
[07:04] <mdz> dunno, can we?
[07:04] <jdub> i assume gdm with autologin if you ctrl-alt-backspace
[07:04] <jdub> we might be able to
[07:04] <mdz> at least remove it from the menu anyway
[07:05] <mdz> though
[07:05] <jdub> so the logout box will only have restart and shutdown
[07:05] <mdz> I sort of like the idea of being able ot test drive gdm
[07:05] <amu> mdz: nope i guess he's still sleeping idle for 6h 
[07:05] <mdz> if they want to
[07:05] <jdub> mdz: true
[07:05] <jdub> mdz: maybe add to the livecd gdm artwork "login with ..."
[07:05] <mdz> jdub: or pre-fill it
[07:05] <mdz> with the autologin username
[07:05] <jdub> don't think we can do that
[07:06] <jdub> without code changes, at least
[07:06] <mdz> yeah, but easy ones
[07:06] <jdub> hrm
[07:06] <jdub> i think there's a 'remember last user' option
[07:06] <mdz> jdub: in 'expert' mode, maybe it would disable autologin entirely
[07:06] <mdz> and only seed the username
[07:06] <mdz> so the user could select their session or whatever
[07:06] <jdub> mmm
[07:07] <jdub> not that there are very useful alternative sessions ;)
[07:08] <mdz> no...
[07:08] <amu> jdub: isnt it possible to define a default user with no login? ex. with kdm you can define such a thing *ducks* 
[07:08] <jdub> #DisplayLastLogin=false
[07:08] <mdz> amu: that's autologin, which is what we already do
[07:08] <jdub> we can turn that on, at least
[07:08] <jdub> mdz: i think he means default user but without actually doing the login (ie. seeding it)
[07:09] <mdz> oh, so the same thing I suggested
[07:09] <amu> jdub: ack
[07:09] <mdz> only cheeky ;-)
[07:09] <jdub> heg
[07:09] <amu> bleh 
[07:15] <amu> hal-device-manager" has quit unexpectedly.
[07:18] <elmo> Riddell: ?
[07:19] <Riddell> elmo: hi
[07:19] <elmo> Riddell: your amarok upload is really broken in some way, it completely killed the archive scripts
[07:19] <elmo> Riddell: unfortunately I have to run right now.. I've moved it out of the way, but could you not reupload it and hold off on anymore uploads till I have a chance to figure out why?
[07:20] <elmo> [Offhand, I think the version number you used is illegal, but I'm surprised it caused that much chaos if that's all that's wrong] 
[07:21] <chrisa> That's quite a feat
[07:21] <jdub> armed and dangerous
[07:21] <Riddell> 1.2_beta3-ubuntu1  the underscore should be a dash?
[07:24] <bob2> it should be nothing
[07:24] <bob2> assuming the upstream version is 1.2beta3
[07:26] <bob2> http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-controlfields.html#s-f-Version
[07:26] <Riddell> bob2: previous versions were 1.2-beta2  but then debuild complains that the version format it wrong so I changed it to an underscore
[07:26] <Riddell> I'm so naieve
[07:26] <bob2> wow
[07:26] <bob2> who packaged it originally?
[07:28] <Riddell> bob2: amu 
[07:28] <jdub> *bob2 backpedals*
[07:29] <bob2> amu: your version numbering wais crackful :-)
[07:29] <amu> bob2: letme check :-() 
[07:32] <amu> bob2: uptream version is 1.2-beta2+cvs20041228
[07:32] <amu> my version was 1.2-beta2+cvs20041228-1ubuntu1 
[07:36] <amu> bob2: please explain me what's wrong with my version numbering, execpt to package a cvs version   
[07:38] <mdz>           The <upstream_version> may contain only alphanumerics[1]  and the
[07:38] <mdz>           characters `.'  `+' `-' `:' (full stop, plus, hyphen, colon) and
[07:38] <mdz>           should start with a digit.
[07:38] <mdz> [1]   Alphanumerics are `A-Za-z0-9' only.
[07:38] <mdz> amu: ^^
[07:42] <T-Bone> hi
[07:43] <bob2> amu: it's ok but confusing to have multiple -'s
[07:50] <amu> bob2: err not :) "characC[C[C[C[C[C[Cters . + - : (full stop, plus, hyphen, colon) and should start with a digit" 
[07:51] <bob2> oh, and not starting with a number
[08:01] <bob2>  * Starting Postfix Mail Transport Agent...
[08:01] <bob2> eval: invalid option -- c
[08:01] <bob2> postfix/postfix-script: warning: unable to create missing queue directories
[08:01] <bob2>  *stfix/postfix-script: fatal: Postfix integrity check failed!           [fail] 
[08:02] <bob2> invoke-rc.d: initscript postfix, action "start" failed.
[08:08] <ogra> elmo ?
[08:19] <T-Bone> Kamion: ping?
[08:50] <Riddell> does anyone have an amd64 machine we could use to test a compile on?
[08:52] <amu> Riddell: me  
[08:52] <Riddell> amu: you do?  well how about testing that libtunepimp change on it?
[08:53] <amu> Riddell: hold on i'll add you an account 
[08:56] <mxpxpod> what's up with the gpg signatures?
[08:57] <mxpxpod> on the archives
[09:04] <doko_> mdz: hmm, fabbione didn't want to add an "artifical" version number, did talk with him about it.
[09:06] <fabbione> doko_: ????
[09:06] <T-Bone> fabbione: i'm debugging ia64 linux atm, fyi
[09:06] <fabbione> T-Bone: cool
[09:06] <T-Bone> s/linux/ubuntu/
[09:06] <fabbione> yeah
[09:07] <fabbione> my bitching put you on the right direction :-)
[09:07] <T-Bone> ran through some very nice issues, the first one being that the kernel package aren't on the daily hoary iso
[09:07] <fabbione> DOH
[09:07] <T-Bone> indeed
[09:08] <T-Bone> and that's the least of the pains
[09:08] <mdz> fabbione: linux-restricted-modules-2.6.10.1
[09:08] <fabbione> ah yeah.. 
[09:08] <doko_> fabbione: we did talk about adding the avm drivers as an uuencoded tarball, or upload them with a new lrm source, with an 2.6.10.1 version number. IIRC you wanted to have them uuencoded
[09:08] <T-Bone> i'm up to the point where i can boot the box standalone, but now i'm running into some issues i've already met on my ppc box, namely hotplug screwing up
[09:08] <fabbione> i suggested..
[09:09] <fabbione> T-Bone: interesting...
[09:09] <T-Bone> fabbione: which led me to curse the default kernel configuration for not having builtin support for USB keyboards
[09:09] <fabbione> doko_: don't get me wrong.. but i only suggested..
[09:09] <doko_> fabbione: ok, another upload ...
[09:10] <fabbione> for the reason that changing number might require other packages too change to
[09:10] <fabbione> T-Bone: that bounce back to you for not giving me a kernel config :-)
[09:10] <fabbione> doko_: go ahead.. * is fine for me :-)
[09:11] <T-Bone> fabbione: yeah, but unfortunately that's a common problem: had the same on my ppc box
[09:11] <T-Bone> i ended up completely disabling hardware auto detection and hardcoding mandatory modules through /etc/modules
[09:11] <fabbione> T-Bone: i am pretty sure we have usb keyboard support for PPC
[09:11] <T-Bone> that's exactly what i'm doing on ia64 now
[09:12] <T-Bone> fabbione: on warty, usb was support was a module
[09:12] <T-Bone> hence you didn't get a keyboard control until _after_ hotplug did its job. And when it didn't... you were screwd (as i am on ia64 ;)
[09:12] <fabbione> # USB Input Devices
[09:12] <fabbione> CONFIG_USB_HID=m
[09:12] <fabbione> CONFIG_USB_HIDINPUT=y
[09:12] <fabbione> CONFIG_USB_HIDDEV=y
[09:12] <fabbione> # USB HID Boot Protocol drivers
[09:12] <fabbione> CONFIG_USB_KBD=m
[09:12] <fabbione> CONFIG_USB_MOUSE=m
[09:13] <fabbione> it's there
[09:13] <T-Bone> fabbione: 'm'
[09:13] <fabbione> do you need it 'y'?
[09:13] <T-Bone> until the module gets loaded, you don't have a keyboard
[09:13] <T-Bone> fabbione: i do when hotplug screws: you can't interract with the init process until _after_ hotplug loads the module
[09:13] <fabbione> tough luck
[09:14] <fabbione> :P
[09:14] <T-Bone> it's the 5th time i'm booting on the cd, mounting the fs (rescue udeb doesn't seem to work btw) and editing a few files to get the box to boot
[09:14] <fabbione> sec.. i am on the phone
[09:14] <T-Bone> i'm in known country since i ran through the same havock on ppc
[09:17] <T-Bone> YAY! Box booted!
[09:18] <T-Bone> damn. that was a struggle
[09:18] <T-Bone> oh, while i'm at it: i gave warty a try on my 64bit g5 box. can't boot any power4 kernel
[09:21] <fabbione> re
[09:22] <fabbione> T-Bone: now.. upgrade the box... get linux-source-2.6.10 (-8)
[09:22] <fabbione> update the config in a decent way
[09:22] <fabbione> and send them back to me asap
[09:22] <T-Bone> fabbione: heheh, hold on buddy
[09:22] <T-Bone> the box is not in good shape
[09:22] <fabbione> you don't need to compile
[09:22] <fabbione> it's enough you send me the config
[09:22] <T-Bone> i had several failures with base install and had to tweak a lot the install process
[09:23] <T-Bone> ok
[09:23] <fabbione> i can do test builds for you
[09:23] <fabbione> and send you the logs back
[09:23] <T-Bone> fabbione: btw, the elilo package doesn't look good to me
[09:23] <T-Bone> it installs EFI cruft in /EFI/debian
[09:23] <fabbione> T-Bone: eheh this isn't my port dude :-)
[09:23] <T-Bone> lol
[09:23] <fabbione> somebody with ia64 needs to debug and fix
[09:23] <fabbione> i only have access to a remote machine where i can compile
[09:24] <fabbione> no console access, no root access
[09:24] <fabbione> so that's all i can offer
[09:24] <T-Bone> sure, but i don't have an overwhelming knowledge of all packages, nor all ia64-specific packages
[09:24] <fabbione> T-Bone: that's something we can coordinate in here
[09:24] <fabbione> also most of the basic ia64 stuff is simply dragged from debian
[09:24] <fabbione> s/basic/specific
[09:25] <T-Bone> i'll ask Bdale about elilo next time i see him online
[09:25] <fabbione> so it mostlikely needs love
[09:25] <T-Bone> yeah i figured that out
[09:26] <fabbione> and i am back to watch movies :-)
[09:28] <T-Bone> lol
[09:35] <T-Bone> fabbione: see what we're discussing with jbailey on #d-kernel. That might actually be the Right Thing to do, and thus keep kernel config consistent with Debian
[09:36] <fabbione> T-Bone: these configs are debian based but they are not the same and can't be
[09:36] <fabbione> we have different hardware support, more drivers
[09:36] <fabbione> etc.
[09:36] <T-Bone> good point
[09:36] <T-Bone> anyway please look at what was said on #d-k
[09:46] <daniels> Kamion: someone raised an interesting point -- is it worth having separate desktop and server install CDs?
[09:46] <daniels> Kamion: e.g. ooo out, a2/php4/postgres in
[09:46] <daniels> Kamion: since data centres in romania often have terrible bandwidth
[09:48] <lamont> bob2: what did you do to postfix??
[09:48] <T-Bone> lamont: i did go past the anna problem you told me about, but ran into quite a lot of issues
[09:49] <bob2> lamont: I have no idea
[09:49] <bob2> lamont: just sudo invoke-rc.d postfix stop
[09:50] <lamont> T-Bone: what was the anna issue?
[09:50] <T-Bone> lamont: no clue, wasn't hit. I used the expert mode and carefully selected the modules i needed, for i do not trust hw detection on anything else than x86
[09:50] <T-Bone> lamont: hw autodetect did fail shamelessly on my ppc box
[09:50] <bob2> lamont: is it fixable?
[09:51] <lamont> bob2: will have to check
[09:51] <lamont> mdz about?
[09:52] <bob2> hrm, maybe my filesystem is fux0red
[09:52] <T-Bone> lamont: i took a few notes about what went wrong, guess i'll mail kamion and you. d-i needs some changes afaict
[09:52] <T-Bone> oh
[09:53] <T-Bone> and daily ia64 isos need linux-images
[09:53] <T-Bone> ;)
[09:58] <lamont> those should be there, I thought...
[09:59] <lifeless> daniels: datacentre, romania, two words I didn't expect to hear in the same breath.
[10:00] <T-Bone> lamont: tried today's iso, weren't. Got the nice 'no installable kernels were found' fatal error
[10:03] <lamont> T-Bone: awesome.
[10:03] <lamont> that's a kamion thing
[10:03] <T-Bone> lamont: what?
[10:04] <lamont> T-Bone: getting kernels on the cd
[10:05] <T-Bone> ah ok
[10:05] <T-Bone> i'll send you a brief report of the couple of hours i spent on my zx2000 trying to get the damn thing to boot (which i eventually did after quite a lot of pain)
[10:06] <T-Bone> :)
[10:06] <lamont> actually, that's pretty much anyone... we just need to add them to the right seed....  mdz/jdub OK with that?
[10:07] <T-Bone> lamont: there's another problem with libunwind7: tho it's on the cd, for a reason i can't figure out, it doesn't get (properly?) installed and thus screws a few dependancies later on. Installing it by hand solves the issue
[10:09] <doko> T-Bone: which libunwind7 version do you try to install?
[10:09] <lamont> that should just be a debootstrap change
[10:09] <lamont> doko: today's daily-build install
[10:12] <T-Bone> i'm starving
[10:12] <T-Bone> bbl
[10:14] <daniels> mdz: when I do l-r-m/l-m for warty, does that go to -security, or -updates?
[10:16] <mdz> lamont: here
[10:16] <mdz> daniels: when you do a security update for it, that's -security.  when you fix a critical dataloss bug, that's -updates
[10:16] <lamont> looks like we may need to add the ia64 kernels to the seeds?
[10:16] <lamont> mdz^^
[10:17] <mdz> lamont: sounds likely
[10:17] <lamont> and mono...
[10:17] <lamont> did we decide to pull that from main until it can build itself?  and do we want to upload the 1.0.4 abomination?
[10:17] <mdz> I thought we decided that mono wasn't ready for horay
[10:17] <mdz> hoary
[10:17] <lamont> 1.0.4 in universe, then?  or not even that until it can build itself?
[10:18] <daniels> mdz: and when l-i changes and makes l-r-m uninstallable, that's ...
[10:18] <daniels> mdz: the only change is to get it back in step with a -security update
[10:19] <daniels> mdz: (since the latest update took it to .8.1-4)
[10:23] <mdz> daniels: X autoconfig fails on my amd64
[10:23] <mdz> it ends up with UseFBDev "true"; "false" works
[10:23] <mdz> the vga16 fb module is loaded, because we came from d-i (live CD)
[10:23] <mdz> daniels: er
[10:24] <mdz> daniels: kernel security updates should include a new l-r-m if the ABI changes
[10:24] <mdz> fabbione, pitti: ?
[10:24] <mdz> s/should/MUST/
[10:24] <daniels> mdz: errr ... wack
[10:24] <mdz> lamont: universe, sure
[10:24] <daniels> mdz: ok, so that (l-r-m)'s -security, then?
[10:25] <amu> daniels: X autoconfig fails on my amd64, changing from autodetected nv to vesa, works  
[10:25] <mdz> daniels: yes, it would be, if in fact pitti/fabbione did not update it
[10:25] <daniels> good god
[10:25] <lamont> ok.  once I see the source back in universe, I'll deal with the upload.
[10:26] <daniels> mdz: currently, if we have a usable framebuffer, and it's not offb/vesa, we attempt to use it
[10:26] <amu> daniels: +i386 ... ppc with ati on testqueue :)  
[10:26] <daniels> mdz: ok
[10:26] <mdz> daniels: maybe vga16 should be added to that list of exclusions?
[10:26] <mdz> dunno what the problem is
[10:26] <mdz> can get you a log
[10:26] <daniels> mdz: fixing the usefbdev mess will be a total shit, but i'll have a look at it
[10:26] <daniels> mdz: /proc/fb would be useful
[10:26] <daniels> amu: heh
[10:26] <mdz> ok, next boot
[10:27] <daniels> i'm very much tempted to whitelist UseFBDev, the same way I've whitelisted HorizSync/VertRefresh
[10:27] <daniels> iirc the only one that really needs it is nv/powerpc
[10:28] <amu> daniels: i think pitti has those combination
[10:31] <daniels> amu: yeah, a few dyo
[10:31] <daniels> the nv driver is complete crap, it does about the rough equivalent of drooling on the keyboard and hoping it'll work
[10:32] <daniels> needs all the assistance it can get to program modes
[10:33] <amu> daniels: unfortunately, i guess 30-35% of all new laptops/desktops comes with nvidia, i have too much trouble before with nv and gnoppix  
[10:35] <daniels> amu: mercifully, most i386 laptops are i8xx, which we can do fine now
[10:36] <tritium> Is useradd or adduser preferred?
[10:38] <Treenaks> adduser I think
[10:38] <Treenaks> useradd is more "low-level"
[10:39] <mdz> Kamion: hmm, current powerpc live CD doesn't boot for me
[10:39] <mdz> and is suspiciously small
[10:39] <tritium> Treenaks, thanks.
[10:39] <amu> daniels: proc/fb 0 VGA16 VGA ( it's a GeForce FX Go 5200 )
[10:40] <mdz> daniels: ^^ that's what mine looked like, too
[10:45] <mdz> lamont: amd64 cloop image contains the wrong kernel modules
[10:45] <mdz> lamont: needs to be updated to 2.6.10-2
[10:46] <mdz> Kamion: re-burning fixed it, nm
[10:46] <mdz> though it is strange that it is smaller than i386
[10:54] <mdz> powerpc live CD++
[10:54] <amu> mdz: a ugly workaround for this nv problem is booting with linux debian-installer/framebuffer=false
[10:55] <mdz> daniels, amu: this was going to become a problem with usplash anyway, so may as well fix it now
[11:00] <fabbione> mdz: ?
[11:00] <T-Bone> fabbione: is that fabbione@c.c ?
[11:00] <fabbione> yea
[11:00] <T-Bone> k
 fabbione, pitti: ?
[11:07] <mdz> fabbione: did you guys upload linux 2.6.8.1-4 without updating linux-restricted-modules?
[11:07] <fabbione> mdz: no idea.. it's herbert/pitti that do warty
[11:08] <fabbione> was -4 the one that changed the ABI?
[11:08] <mdz> yes
[11:09] <fabbione> i remember i was in CC because i was doing hoary and you, pitti and herbert were discussing the problem
[11:09] <fabbione> but i didn't check if l-r-m was upload after that
[11:12] <mdz> I just finished (finally) converting my mythtv box to ubuntu
[11:12] <mdz> total 6 in the house now :-)
[11:13] <fabbione> mdz: still one less than me :-)
[11:13] <fabbione> i am up to 7 ubuntu and one debian
[11:13] <fabbione> :P
[11:13] <fabbione> and when i will be back from my honeymoon i will need to clean that up too :-)
[11:17] <mdz> fabbione: I could put ubuntu on the zaurus to catch up
[11:18] <fabbione> yeah but i run the only l33t hoary sparc in the world :-)
[11:21] <fabbione> spaaaarc.... elmo are you around?
[11:37] <mdz> fabbione: Jan 15 10:21:33 <elmo>  Riddell: unfortunately I have to run right now
[11:37] <mdz> (4 hours ago)
[11:38] <fabbione> mdz: ok thanks :-)