[12:00] <tseng> its breaking my pbuilder
[12:00] <mvo> tseng: a not purged update-notifier maybe? it looks like debris in /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/99update-notifier ?
[12:01] <tseng> mvo: will look. it shouldve never had update-notifer, its a chroot
[12:01] <tseng> no X
[12:01] <mvo> tseng: I know :) it looks looks like this config-file :)
[12:02] <dholbach> tseng: you cleared unneeded stuff in /etc/pbuilder/apt.conf.d/ ?
[12:03] <tseng> dholbach: hm its in there in fact
[12:03] <tseng> dholbach: good call!
[12:03] <mdz> jdub: update on #6582?
[12:03] <dholbach> tseng: ran into it too :-)
[12:03] <tseng> dholbach: I better note that on the wiki
[12:03] <dholbach> tseng: yeah... good thinking
[12:03] <tseng> its very vexxing
[12:08] <dholbach> i guess i'm off for tonight... good night
[12:08] <tseng> bye again dholbach 
[12:08] <dholbach> bye tseng 
[12:09] <sivang> hey all
[12:09] <jdub> mdz: no traction from upstream, so two choices: go with oss by default, or revert to esound.
[12:20] <mdz> jdub: ok, I know pitti encounters this bug, so perhaps he can have a look
[12:20] <mdz> daniels: ping?
[12:26] <mdz> zul: are you guys planning another kernel upload before preview, or no?
[12:28] <seb128> mdz: 
 zul: should fixes the issues with the current version, are you going to update it ? :)
 seb128: of course its on my todo list for this weekend
[12:28] <seb128> mdz: that's speaking about the inotify update
[12:29] <zul> mdz: yeah there is a couple of bug fixes including inotify update
[12:29] <seb128> oh zul is here
[12:29] <seb128> :)
[12:29] <zul> im around
[12:29] <seb128> yeah, I've seen that :)
[12:30] <T-Bone> so am i (but not for long) :)
[12:30] <seb128> BTW mdk has just rolled back to dnotify for 10.2
[12:30] <zul> mdz: the bugs i seen for some keyboard problems, with ps/2 keyboards locking up on some chipsets there is a patch in ac serries that prevents it from loking up
[12:31] <seb128> I'm curious to know if they will switch again :)
[12:31] <zul> mdz: http://www.dragoninc.on.ca/mail-archives/linux-kernel/2004-07/5260.html
[12:32] <zul> plus the 3ware proc_name stuff
[12:36] <tseng> bye zul 
[12:36] <tseng> seb128: w/o looking in the source.. whats "openbox fixes" mean
[12:38] <seb128> tseng: read the bugzilla for it :p
[12:38] <mdz> zul: that patch looks very sketchy :-)  but if it works...
[12:38] <seb128> tseng: basically need to add a session management option to start openbox
[12:38] <tseng> oh there is the bug number
[12:38] <tseng> im dumb
[12:38] <jdub> seb128: in gnome-panel i now have "Home Folder" and "Desktop Folder|Desktop" - you seeing this?
[12:39] <seb128> jdub: nop
[12:39] <zul> mdz: it was included in fc2
[12:39] <seb128> jdub: weird "...|" is a comment for translators usually
[12:39] <seb128> jdub: what locale is that ?
[12:39] <tseng> it sounds like a bong .po file
[12:39] <seb128> yep
[12:39] <tseng> similar happened to me in muine cvs recently
[12:40] <zul> damn it...i hate inotify sometimes
[12:40] <tseng> zul: sometimes?
[12:40] <seb128> :)
[12:40] <jdub> en_AU.UTF-8
[12:40] <zul> ok...most times
[12:40] <seb128> jdub: is that a real locale ? :p
[12:40] <seb128> no .po for that, hum
[12:41] <seb128> :p
[12:41] <Riddell> I seem to be able to edit the ubuntu website
[12:41] <Riddell> I don't think I should be able to
[12:41] <jdub> people.ubuntu.com/~jdub/screenshots/odd-places-menu.png
[12:42] <seb128> jdub: en_AU is using any langpack ?
[12:42] <jdub> the en langpack
[12:42] <jdub> i'll check if there's a translation
[12:43] <seb128> thanks
[12:43] <Riddell> http://muse.19inch.net/~jr/tmp/ubuntu-edit.png
[12:43] <seb128> I don't have that in "C" locale here
[12:43] <seb128> urg
[12:43] <seb128> that's ugly
[12:43] <seb128> what browser is that ?
[12:43] <jdub> no language
[12:43] <tseng> konqueror, the worst usability kludge ever
[12:44] <seb128> utch
[12:44] <Riddell> should I be able to edit the ubuntu website?
[12:44] <jdub> seb128: is 'utch' french for 'ouch'? :)
[12:44] <seb128> correct ;)
[12:45] <seb128> or a variant, you can use both :)
[12:45] <seb128> BTW the spinner is ugly on this screenshot, and the icons bigs/weirds 
[12:46] <jdub> Uploading via ftp clearlooks_0.4-0ubuntu1_source.changes: done.
[12:46] <jdub> Successfully uploaded packages.
[12:46] <tseng> seb128: to each his own
[12:46] <tseng> jdub: rock.
[12:46] <seb128> gnome-panel/panel-menu-items.c:                         Q_("Desktop Folder|Desktop")
[12:46] <jdub> seb128: is "Desktop Folder" our change?
[12:46] <seb128> nop
[12:46] <seb128> that's a comment for translators
[12:46] <jdub> oh
[12:47] <seb128> and from the upstream source
[12:47] <jdub> thought it was other way around, my bong
[12:47] <seb128> Q(..|...) is comment|string
[12:47] <seb128> I don't understand why that's bong on your system :)
[12:47] <jdub> cl 0.4 has animated progress bars :)
[12:48] <seb128> cool
[12:49] <seb128> grumpf
[12:49] <kent> clear looks is a nice engine. :)
[12:49] <Riddell> should I be able to edit the ubuntu website?
[12:49] <jdub> not really
[12:50] <sivang> Riddell: you can edit some areas of it with your wiki loging
[12:51] <sivang> Riddell: login, even
[12:51] <sivang> Riddell: I for instance, add news items , sidebar announcments, faqs etc
[12:51] <Riddell> sivang: like security notices?
[12:52] <sivang> Riddell: that I am not sure. You would have to ask mdz/pitti how they do it , or about anybody else who deals with security
[12:52] <elmo> jdub: package name changed?
[12:52] <sivang> Riddell: (e.g., not sure if the USNs are part of the doc team allowed content editing sections)
[12:52] <seb128> #. Translators: Desktop is
[12:52] <seb128> #. * Folder" (this is not the
[12:52] <seb128> #. * not keep "Desktop Folder|"
[12:52] <seb128> #: ../gnome-panel/panel-menu-bar.c:622
[12:52] <seb128> msgid "Desktop Folder|Desktop"
[12:52] <seb128> msgstr "Desktop Folder|Desktop"
[12:52] <seb128> in the en_GB.po
[12:52] <mdz> Riddell: only security personnel can modify the security notices
[12:52] <seb128> bah, translators don't read the comments :p
[12:52] <Riddell> mdz: I seem to be able to modify them
[12:53] <mdz> Riddell: URL?
[12:53] <Riddell> http://www.ubuntulinux.org/support/documentation/usn/usn-1-1 for example
[12:54] <Riddell> mdz: http://muse.19inch.net/~jr/tmp/ubuntu-edit1.png
[12:54] <mdz> Riddell: what happens if you click the edit tab?
[12:55] <Riddell> mdz: then I can edit and save
[12:55] <mdz> how unfortunate
[12:55] <mdz> I fucking hate plone
[12:55] <Keybuk> how much do you hate it?  On a scale of 1 to Arch?
[12:55] <mdz> sqrt(arch)
[12:55] <zul> lol
[12:57] <aj> Keybuk: woah, *ouch* dude!
[12:58] <seb128> jdub: I get the issue too with the french locale without the language pack with the deb :p
[12:59] <zul> mdz: do you have a representative for the kernel team for the meeting next friday?
[12:59] <mdz> zul: lamont will presumably attend, but any and all are welcome
[12:59] <zul> mdz: k cool
[01:00] <zul> better be :)
[01:00] <seb128> jdub: 
[01:00] <seb128> en_GB.po
[01:00] <seb128> et.po
[01:00] <seb128> fr.po
[01:00] <seb128> mk.po
[01:01] <seb128> jdub: these are the bugged po file ... are you sure you are not using "en_GB" ? :)
[01:02] <Nafallo> would someone here have the time to implement lookup for SRV-records in gaim's jabbercode post-hoary? should I sign a bug about it?
[01:03] <jdub> seb128: ah, it must be falling back through it; yeah
[01:03] <jdub> $ cat /etc/environment
[01:03] <jdub> LANGUAGE="en_AU:en_US:en_GB:en"
[01:03] <mdz> Nafallo: it isn't generally useful to file bugs asking for features unless they are trivial
[01:03] <seb128> hi Liblit 
[01:03] <seb128> jdub: k, that's it :)
[01:03] <Liblit> Howdy.
[01:04] <jdub> cool :)
[01:04] <jdub> you Liblit 
[01:04] <Liblit> No specific questions at the moment.  Just being neighborly.
[01:04] <seb128> jdub: I'll bug translators
[01:04] <seb128> Liblit: k
[01:04] <Liblit> jdub: me Liblit.  You jdub.  Where Tarzan?
[01:04] <seb128> :)
[01:05] <Nafallo> mdz: oki. upstream just asked for a patch for it on my RFE. I haven't got the skills though. maybe I could try and someone could review it? :-)
[01:05] <jdub> heh
[01:05] <seb128> Liblit: calling mdz Tarzan ? :p
[01:05] <jdub> we have a jane, too ;)
[01:06] <mdz> Nafallo: sure, ask on #ubuntu-motu
[01:06] <mdz> Nafallo: we simply can't accept feature requests for all of the features that the world would like to see in open source software :-)
[01:09] <Nafallo> mdz: I know. just had to try first. the situation is so... awfully dumb. all servers supports SRV but I have yet to see a client that does. and that's for a thing being in the XMPP Core RFC.
[01:11] <seb128> lamont: around ?
[01:11] <lamont> yo
[01:12] <seb128> do you have an idea on the gtk-doc issue ?
[01:13] <seb128> works fine in an hoary pbuilder here
[01:13] <seb128> apt-get source gtk-doc
[01:13] <lamont> I haven't bothered to track down which package is Depend'ing openjade, but the solution is to either fix gtk-doc to not Conflict: openjade (whatever that takes), or to change whatever Depends: openjade to accept something else
[01:13] <seb128> and debuild
[01:13] <seb128> that works in a pbuilder
[01:14] <seb128> the buildd gets the Recommends or what ?
[01:14] <seb128> k
[01:14] <lamont> pbuilder picks Depends differently than sbuild
[01:14] <seb128> apt-get source gtk-doc
[01:14] <seb128> Package openjade is not installed, so not removed
[01:14] <seb128> The following NEW packages will be installed:
[01:14] <seb128>   cdbs debconf-utils debhelper docbook docbook-dsssl docbook-xml docbook-xsl file gettext html2text intltool-debian jade
[01:14] <seb128>   libmagic1 libosp4 libostyle1 libsp1 libxml2 libxml2-utils libxslt1.1 po-debconf sgml-base sgml-data xml-core xsltproc
[01:14] <seb128> 0 upgraded, 24 newly installed, 0 to remove and 69 not upgraded.
[01:14] <seb128> 
[01:14] <seb128> does that in a pbuilder
[01:15] <seb128> a Depends is a Depends
[01:15] <seb128> there is different way to pick them ?
[01:15] <lamont> yeah, but | lists are handled differently
[01:15] <seb128> k
[01:15] <Keybuk> hrm, dangerous; half a bottle of red wine seems to have vanished
[01:16] <lamont> (our) sbuild takes the first installable one, [debian's sbuild takes the first one, period] , and pbuilder takes the last one
[01:17] <seb128> and xorg crash, nice :p
[01:17] <seb128> docbook-dsssl
[01:17] <seb128> Depends: openjade | jade
[01:17] <seb128> 
[01:17] <seb128> I guess that's it
[01:18] <lamont> The following NEW packages will be installed:
[01:18] <lamont>   cdbs debconf debconf-i18n debconf-utils debhelper docbook docbook-dsssl
[01:18] <lamont>   docbook-xml docbook-xsl file gettext gettext-base html2text intltool-debian
[01:18] <lamont>   jade liblocale-gettext-perl libmagic1 libosp4 libostyle1 libsp1
[01:18] <lamont>   libtext-charwidth-perl libtext-iconv-perl libtext-wrapi18n-perl libxml2
[01:18] <lamont>   libxml2-utils libxslt1.1 openjade po-debconf sgml-base sgml-data xml-core
[01:18] <lamont>   xsltproc
[01:18] <lamont> could be
[01:18] <seb128> "  * [debian/control]  Added Build-Conflicts-Indep: openjade to ensure that jade
[01:18] <seb128>     rather than openjade is detected (the runtime dependency is on jade, not
[01:18] <seb128>     openjade). (Closes: #247542)
[01:18] <seb128> "
[01:19] <seb128> for J.H.M in the changelog
[01:19] <seb128> I tend to blame sbuild here :p
[01:19] <lamont> one could re-order the tests?
[01:19] <lamont> Kamion: you about?
[01:21] <lamont> build-conflicts are just vile things....
[01:22] <lamont> so the simple fix would be to fix the Depends order for docbook-dsssl :0)
[01:22] <seb128> bah
[01:22] <seb128> and an another package will require the other order
[01:22] <sivang> seb128: since that upgrade I told you about, my system never got back to itself , did you have anybody else report the same?
[01:22] <seb128> and we are screwed :p
[01:22] <seb128> the fix is to fix sbuild
[01:23] <seb128> jade | openjade is correct, apt-get source handles it fine
[01:23] <sivang> seb128: redrawing a window takes ~2secs second
[01:23] <seb128> no
[01:23] <lamont> seb128: somehow, I fear you are correct.
[01:23] <seb128> :)
[01:26] <sivang> seb128: I have antoher ubuntu hoary, on another hd, which works fine. you have any idea what to check?
[01:27] <seb128> try to install something different from gnome
[01:27] <seb128> ie: wmaker
[01:27] <seb128> or perhaps that's due to the xorg driver
[01:28] <lamont> seb128: jade | openjade is what I suggested changing it to. :-)
[01:29] <sivang> seb128: I would suspect the xorg driver , maybe I should try install xfree86 ?
[01:29] <daniels> mdz: pong
[01:29] <seb128> lamont: yeah, but the order should not matter :)
[01:29] <seb128> sivang: what video card and what driver do you use ?
[01:29] <lamont> seb128: true.  But then, | lists are evil and shouldn't be there anyway
[01:30] <lamont> that's what virtual packages are for
[01:30] <lupusBE> daniels, do you need any other info about my bug? otherwise I can go to bed :)
[01:30] <lamont> seb128: btw, feel free to beat on daniels about gossip_0.8-1ubuntu2
[01:30] <seb128> lamont: even with virtual package you may want to set a preference
[01:30] <lamont> checking for XScreenSaverRegister in -lXss... yes
[01:30] <lamont> configure: error: Couldn't find XScreenSaver extension.
[01:30] <lamont> m
[01:30] <lamont> I just love that...
[01:30] <seb128> I've already looked on gossip and pinged daniel
[01:31] <seb128> I don't understand what's wrong
[01:31] <lamont> seb128: actually, the policy? on virtual packages is that you Depend: real | virtual, with real being the highest priority alternative
[01:31] <seb128> it used to work fine and has not changed, and the config.log doesn't show anything special
[01:31] <seb128> lamont: right
[01:31] <lamont> it says it found it in -lXss, and then immediately says it couldn't find it.... sounds like a configure script issue to me.....
[01:31] <lamont> but really nfc
[01:31] <sivang> seb128: using xorg 6.8.2-2, nvidia Geforce2
[01:32] <seb128> yeah, I've tried to track it a bit but doesn't seems obvious
[01:32] <lamont> where oh where is Kamion when I need him to do perl hacking for me???
[01:33] <seb128> lamont: jade/openjade doesn't provide anything ... what do you suggest, changing the | order ?
[01:33] <seb128> (ugly hack)
[01:33] <lamont> the immediate fix is to change the order.  The longer term fix is for me (er, Kamion?) to fix sbuild....
[01:33] <seb128> k
[01:33] <lamont> in debian, the only fix is to change the order, fwiw
[01:34] <sivang> seb128: 32M vid ram
[01:34] <seb128> lamont: it builds fine in debian ...
[01:34] <seb128> sivang: dunno, do you have the composite ?
[01:34] <lamont> ah, cool.  it's Kamion's hack for layer'ed building. :-)
[01:34] <sivang> seb128: what is composite? ;-)
[01:35] <seb128> lamont: ups, no
[01:36] <seb128> lamont: it's a "all" package, so no buildd used in debian for it
[01:36] <seb128> sivang: transparancy stuff 
[01:37] <sivang> seb128: where do I check it? xorg.conf?
[01:37] <seb128> nm
[01:37] <seb128> if you don't know about it you have not played with that
[01:37] <lamont> seb128: doh. right
[01:37] <daniels> lupusBE: which bug was that, sorry?  i have a lot ...
[01:38] <sivang> seb128: ah ok
[01:39] <lupusBE> daniels, https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=7123
[01:40] <mdz> lamont: it's not obvious to me how to fix #7109.  can you take care of it?
[01:40] <lamont> mdz: is that emacs?
[01:40] <mdz> lamont: yes
[01:40] <daniels> lupusBE: ah, -dev.  i don't know
[01:41] <lamont> the choices are a well placed 'touch', or add autocrap to the Build-Depends... (which is what I did for zsh when it had a similar problem...) thoughts?
[01:41] <lupusBE> yeah some problem with the linking :)
[01:43] <mdz> lamont: touch
[01:44] <lamont> ok.  the touch in zsh was lost deep in the bowels of something and I got tired of looking... This one should be trivial
[01:44] <lamont> mdz: wanna do some perl hacking for me while I fix emacs?
[01:44] <mdz> lamont: pardon?
[01:45] <mdz> oh god not sbuild
[01:45] <lamont> sbuild needs a little more love in it's build-dep selection algorithm.
[01:45] <elmo> eh, why do you want to fix sbuild?
[01:45] <lamont> which is on the edges of what I understand
[01:45] <mdz> lamont: apt-get build-dep <package>
[01:45] <daniels> elmo: any luck with dvi?
[01:45] <lupusBE> going to bed :) hf daniels ;)
[01:45] <lamont> mdz: understood
[01:45] <lamont> elmo: gtk-doc is ftbfs
[01:45] <lamont> and I have to agree that apt-get build-dep would do the right thing
[01:46] <elmo> daniels: given up - I'm just using a 2nd laptop as a terminal to the dead powerbook
[01:46] <lamont> mdz: although apt-get will randomize which virtual package gets selected, no?
[01:46] <mdz> not that I am at all advocating that change at this time
[01:46] <daniels> elmo: dude, that bites
[01:46] <elmo> lamont: lemme get this straight it b-d's on a | b and conflicts with b?
[01:46] <mdz> lamont: for pure virtual, it will abort and yell at you
[01:46] <daniels> elmo: maybe your video hardware is totally shot?
[01:46] <mdz> lamont: for a | b, it tries a, and sort of vaguely attempts to fall back to b
[01:46] <lamont> elmo: it build-deps docbook-dsssl, which build-depends openjade | jade.  gtk-doc build-conflcts openjade
[01:47] <mdz> elmo: have gtk-doc build-dep docbook-dsssl and jade
[01:47] <lamont> the last great hackery on this code was by Kamion (thank you Kamion) to have it find the first package in the list that was installable (ogre modle)
[01:47] <elmo> daniels: could well be, it'll need to be RMAed when I get to back to the UK in any event
[01:47] <lamont> mdz: I like that idea...
[01:48] <mdz> er, s/elmo/lamont/
[01:48] <elmo> lamont: err, second  build-dep == dep?
[01:48] <lamont> Build-Depends: cdbs, debhelper (>= 4.1.0), docbook-dsssl, xsltproc, jade (>= 1.2.1-35), libxml2-utils, docbook-xml, docbook-xsl
[01:48] <lamont> Build-Conflicts-Indep: openjade
[01:48] <lamont> sadly, so did the maintainer
[01:48] <lamont> elmo: yes
[01:48] <mdz> lamont: right, so put jade ahead of docbook-dsssl ;-)
[01:49] <lamont> lol. /me tries
[01:49] <mdz> are there actually valid use cases for build
[01:49] <mdz> build-conflicts?
[01:49] <lamont> yeah.  build-conflicts/.
[01:50] <jba> guys why is it so damn hard to find a hoary download link on the ubuntulinux.org website?
[01:50] <jba> i mean it's here in the topic, but I'm damned if i can find it on the website
[01:50] <lamont> WOOOHOOO!!!
[01:50] <lamont> seb128: I'm gonna upload a new gtk-doc, if that's OK with you...
[01:50] <daniels> jba: because it's a development version -- it's not there for the masses
[01:51] <jdub> jba: think of the children!
[01:51] <seb128> lamont: np, go for it :)
[01:51] <jba> daniels: i can appreciate that, but it is there, somewhere. It just pains me every time i need to go searching for it
[01:51] <lamont> seb128/mdz: and we'll make sure that bob (lunchpad) handles the use case
[01:51] <seb128> k
[01:51] <jba> someone suggested I try array 6 last night cause i was having grub issues
[01:51] <lamont> seb128: done
[01:51] <jba> can someone sned a linky to array 6 please ?
[01:52] <jba> or will a daily suffice?
[01:52] <lamont> seb128: and that was _MUCH_ easier than perl hacking. :-)
[01:52] <jba> please sir, i want some more
[01:52] <jdub> cdimage.ubuntu.com
[01:52] <tseng> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/releases/hoary/array-6/
[01:52] <tseng> that is posted many places.
[01:52] <jba> tah fellas
[01:53] <lamont> right.   emacs21
[01:53] <jba> jdub: have you noticed that bit torrnet ports have been throttled in australian networks lately?
[01:53] <jba> these days it's quicker to direct dl, than to torrent
[01:54] <jdub> hrm, i don't tend to see that here
[01:54] <seb128> lamont: yeah, nice way to get that solved :)
[01:54] <jba> jdub: i'm on optusnet, it may just be specific to them
[01:54] <lamont> seb128: not the most informative changelog entry, I admit.
[01:54] <seb128> he he
[01:54] <lamont> but moving the docbook-dsssl link after jade fixes things
[01:55] <lamont> worst of it is that I understand why...
[01:57] <lamont> mdz: what command did you use to (1) unpack and (2) pack the emacs21 upload?
[02:01] <zul> ok new test kernel with new inotify is being built now
[02:01] <jdub> woo
[02:01] <jdub> 2.6.10 or 11?
[02:01] <zul> hopefully it will work
[02:02] <zul> 2.6.11 didnt apply cleanly so i had to much around it
[02:03] <zul> s/much/muck/g
[02:05] <jdub> ahr
[02:13] <mdz> lamont: dpkg-source and dpkg-source
[02:13] <mdz> well, dpkg-buildpackage in the latter case, but indirectly dpkg-source
[02:13] <lamont> mdz: ok.
[02:13] <mdz> it was probably on a tmpfs, if you're wondering why you get a different order than I did
[02:13] <lamont> of course, the other solution is to vi emacs21*.diff.gz :-)
[02:14] <lamont> mdz: missed a step on that one...
[02:15] <lamont> (1) try something, which means saying _something_ in changelog.  (1b) iterate.  (2) fix changelog to something proper.  (3) upload.
[02:15] <lamont> and realized that at 3.5
[02:15] <lamont>  clean: debian-sync
[02:15] <lamont> +       touch debian/autofiles.diff
[02:15] <lamont>         ${checkdir}
[02:16] <lamont>   * Fix ftbfs by touching autofiles.diff in clean target.  Closes: #7109
[02:16] <lamont> that any better than gtk-doc???
[02:18] <lamont> er, um... hrm...
[02:18] <lamont> about those uploads...
[02:18] <lamont> was I supposed to get permission first?
[02:18] <lamont> DOH!
[02:19] <lamont> where is the debian amd64 archive?
[02:20] <azeem> on alioth, AFAIK
[02:20] <lamont> azeem: somewhere on/under alioth, yes... was after the actual URL...
[02:21] <azeem> http://alioth.debian.org/projects/debian-amd64/
[02:22] <lamont> thanks
[02:23] <mdz> lamont: FTBFS have implicit approval
[02:24] <lamont> lol
[02:26] <mdz> I am so far beyond valium's reach
[02:26] <daniels> mdz: smack is your friend
[02:26] <zul> or crank
[02:28] <daniels> mdz: so I'm going to roll the i810 driver back to 6.8.2, because HEAD is just broken to shit
[02:33] <mdz> daniels: are you planning to try to squeeze in a xorg upload for preview?
[02:34] <daniels> mdz: i810 needs to go
[02:34] <mdz> daniels: when will you be ready?  I'd like to review the changes with you
[02:34] <daniels> mdz: i'll try for asap
[02:34] <daniels> mdz: probably not before you go to sleep tonight though
[02:35] <mdz> I will be here tomorrow
[02:35] <mdz> and sunday
[02:35] <mdz> the repo man has all night, every night
[02:38] <daniels> indeed he does
[02:38] <daniels> i'll bounce you a link and changelog in /msg when it's done
[02:38] <jba> okay guys will check in if i get it working
[02:41] <jdub> daniels: i810 is the source of the slowness bugs?
[02:42] <daniels> jdub: nope, no idea what's up with that (works for me on i810 and radeon, and people have reported it with tdfx and nvidia also)
[02:42] <jdub> hrm
[02:42] <daniels> jdub: but mode validation on crts has been busted for a while (so desktop people can't use it, not even if they put in sync ranges), and I don't have time to fix it; apparently some laptop stuff is now rooted too
[02:42] <jdub> i don't think i'm getting it here
[02:42] <daniels> the two things we lose are: a) DRI around suspend/resume, b) support for widescreen panels
[02:43] <daniels> jdub: i pulled i810 from HEAD a while back.  it is, imo, terminally broken.
[02:43] <daniels> jdub: the features we get are DRI around suspend/resume (previously after you suspended, that's it; we need kernel support we don't have for that anyway), and support for widescreen panels without needing nasty hacks
[02:44] <daniels> jdub: unfortunately, alanh doesn't believe in death by a thousand cuts, so his massive Tungsten code drop broke mode validation on CRTs (it will reject any mode above 800x600 @ 53Hz), and apparently you now need esoteric sync ranges for some laptop panels where you didn't before
[02:45] <daniels> i don't have time to fix either of those issues before release (not that I have i8xx desktop hardware), and I don't think those two features (one of which we don't get anyway) are worth it for breaking a whole swathe of Intel hardware
[02:52] <Keybuk> why does g-v-m always segfault on upgrade?
[02:53] <jdub> weird, that never happened to me until very recently
[02:57] <zul> it happens alot
[02:57] <zul> i get the same thing
[02:59] <stuNNed> so if i run 'nv' driver instead of 'nvidia' i won't have the slownessness?
[03:00] <stuNNed> daniels: thanks for the info
[03:04] <daniels> Keybuk: either dbus semantics have changed under us, or we've regressed a patch
[03:05] <Keybuk> it's a recentish thing
[03:10] <fgx> sorry
[03:10] <fgx> mdz, im sorry
[03:13] <Keybuk> is it me or is python2.4-psycopg broken?
[03:14] <Keybuk> no, it's me
[03:16] <daniels> does anyone have the topic in /lastlog?
[03:17] <stuNNed> Topic for #ubuntu-devel: Ubuntu Development | #ubuntu for support and general discussion | #ubuntu-love for
[03:17] <stuNNed>           getting involved | http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/DeveloperResources |
[03:17] <stuNNed>           http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/HoaryGoals | If your system hangs at login on Hoary, upgrade to kernel
[03:17] <stuNNed>           2.6.10-24 | http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/kubuntu/daily-live/current/
[03:17] <stuNNed> sorry
[03:18] <daniels> stuNNed: thanks a lot
[03:18] <stuNNed> daniels: you're welcome
[03:22] <mdz> what was fgx apologizing for?
[03:23] <mdz> oh, clobbering the topic I suppose
[03:53] <lamont> ghc6 takes 3 &*()& hours to build??? sigh
[03:58] <marcin_ant> hi
[03:58] <marcin_ant> I would like to ask what is a status of gnome-bluetooth package?
[03:59] <lamont> looks to be in the archive on all architectures...
[03:59] <lamont> http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/g/gnome-bluetooth
[03:59] <marcin_ant> I got this on my system but it doesn't work with nautilus.... is this package broken?
[04:00] <lamont> nfc
[04:00] <lamont> and that really sounds like a #ubuntu question
[04:00] <marcin_ant> hmm maybe
[04:01] <lamont> marcin_ant: this would be the channel to discuss your patch that fixes the problem you're seeing
[04:01] <marcin_ant> ok - but now I don't know if it's problem with my desktop or with package
[04:02] <marcin_ant> anyway I'll try again on #ubuntu
[04:02] <lamont> which is why you discuss that in #ubuntu
[04:05] <marcin_ant> ok ok
[05:40] <jba> success, finally
[05:41] <jba> i got array 6 to boot off my second drive, but only after setting up grub to install on the MBR of the first disk
[05:41] <jba> I'm too annoyed to try and chain loaded at this stage, and am gonna leave it as is
[05:41] <jba> but how come I can't tell the weather applet that I'm in sydney?
[05:41] <jba> shit updates galore
[05:42] <jba> okay will wait for the updates to install before proceeding 
[06:47] <mdz> stupid X.org
[06:47] <mdz> I moved xorg.conf away to try to reproduce #6286
[06:47] <mdz> but the silly thing just works anyway
[06:49] <zul> heh
[06:50] <zul> inotify is so much fun
[06:52] <mdz> lamont: night
[06:52] <zul> night lamont
[06:52] <mdz> no rest for the wicked
[06:52] <zul> yeah i just cant sleep just yet
[06:54] <zul> im going to get 2.6.11 cleaned up this weekend hopefully as well
[06:54] <mdz> 95 bugs to go
[06:54] <zul> rc bugs?
[06:56] <mdz> 95 more in the list of bugs to review tonight
[06:56] <zul> ouch
[07:07] <zul> night..
[07:07] <zul> kernel is compiling i can go to bed now :)
[07:11] <Amaranth> 95 bugs in what?
[07:15] <Amaranth> ack
[07:15] <Amaranth> ubuntu bugzilla crashed firefox
[07:53] <pitti> Morning
[07:53] <pitti> mdz: still here?
[07:57] <da_bon_bon> how do i help in translation of ubuntu to hindi language ?
[07:58] <pitti> da_bon_bon: in the near future you can use Rosetta for this
[07:59] <pitti> da_bon_bon: https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/
[08:00] <da_bon_bon> whats rosetta ?
[08:28] <pitti> jdub: ping
[08:38] <Micksa> anyone care to recommend an app for watching network bandwidth over snmp?
[08:38] <Micksa> something that draws pretty graphs?
[08:39] <Micksa> with varying averaging windows maybe
[08:59] <pitti> Hi dholbach 
[08:59] <dholbach> hi pitti!
[08:59] <dholbach> hi everyone
[10:19] <herzi> Treenaks: ping
[10:20] <Treenaks> herzi: pong
[10:21] <herzi> Treenaks: did you take a look at the packages?
[10:22] <Treenaks> herzi: which ones?
[10:22] <herzi> the hula ones
[10:22] <Treenaks> uh, not yet
[10:22] <Treenaks> (hm: "applications" is white when I click it, "Places" and "System" are black.. CleanLooks or whatever the new theme is called)
[10:25] <Treenaks> herzi: Only -2  I guess?
[10:27] <herzi> yes, i already have -3 but that won\t get uploaded until monday
[10:31] <dholbach> herzi: did you read my query?
[10:46] <dholbach> morning sabdfl 
[10:47] <sabdfl> hi daniel
[10:49] <dholbach> sabdfl: you know if there are any plans for rss-feeds in malone? i think it'd be easier for people (debian and us) to track bugs and patches with them
[10:50] <dholbach> sabdfl: i, for example, track new upstream releases with them and think they're much nicer than a bunch of emails :-)
[10:51] <sabdfl> daniels: what determines the look of the pointer? specifically the please-wait-i'm-working one? it was much nicer in warty, and i'd like that back!
[10:51] <sabdfl> dholbach: plans, not code yet, for rss
[10:52] <Treenaks> sabdfl: the mouse pointer is a theme thing, afaik
[10:52] <sabdfl> dholbach: also, an email interface for malone, which will let you avoid the web in favour of pure email working
[10:52] <sabdfl> even when X is first starting?
[10:52] <Treenaks> sabdfl: and the default was changed a few months ago, no reason given
[10:52] <sabdfl> hmm... clearlooks rocks
[10:52] <sabdfl> (speaking of themes)
[10:53] <dholbach> sabdfl: oh ok... cool, the redland stuff seems worth investigating there, i'll ask bradb if he turns up
[11:11] <Micksa> anyone here ever used xvfb-run? :)
[11:15] <dholbach> Micksa: just in a build-script, once
[11:21] <Micksa> I'm trying to get a "virtual X session" going with xvfb and vnc.
[11:21] <Micksa> not much luck yet.
[11:22] <dholbach> Micksa: sorry, can't help you there... just know it was called by the script since xvfb-run was broken in that X version, but is fixed now
[11:23] <Micksa> oh what the fuck
[11:23] <Micksa> it just started magically working :)
[11:23] <Micksa> I think it's an xauth-related issue
[11:23] <Micksa> which means I have to figure out how xauth et al work :)
[11:23] <Micksa> shit.
[11:24] <dholbach> Micksa: hope someone turns up who can help you there
[11:33] <Micksa> bingo
[11:33] <Micksa> it creates is on Xauthority file
[11:33] <Micksa> and doesn't tell anyone about it
[11:45] <dholbach> hellas mvo
[11:45] <mvo> hi dholbach
[11:52] <abelli> sabdfl: ping
[12:02] <sabdfl> abelli: pong
[12:02] <sabdfl> dholbach: redland?
[12:03] <dholbach> sabdfl: libraries to generate rdf-stuff, they even have python bindings
[12:03] <abelli> have you got 10 mins for me, id like to ask for a advice
[12:03] <sabdfl> ah, cool
[12:04] <sabdfl> go ahead
[12:16] <trukulo> ogra, are you awake ?
[12:16] <ogra> yup
[12:16] <dholbach> hi seb128 
[12:17] <seb128> morning
[12:17] <trukulo> ogra, have you tried graveman packages? any problem?
[12:17] <trukulo> morning everybody
[12:19] <ogra> trukulo: havent had time to build them yet....if there are probs, i'll fix them and let you know.....(i'm working hard on hwdb-client to get it ready before preview)
[12:20] <trukulo> ok ogra
[12:21] <trukulo> good luck with hwdb
[12:21] <ogra> thanks :)
[12:43] <trukulo> daniels, r u awake?
[12:47] <Micksa> http://knobbits.org/ws.png
[12:47] <Micksa> dammit dammit dammit :)
[12:57] <abelli> Kqikxs on #ubuntu is a spambot
[01:26] <psy> hi
[01:26] <abelli> ciao
[01:32] <abelli> Djyuf on #ubuntu is a spambot
[01:32] <abelli> :)
[01:34] <psy> is there anyway i can help with the graphical installer?
[01:37] <ogra> psy: you would need pygtk in the installer image....which would involve a lot of other stuff...but thats not the main prob with the intaller....
[01:38] <ogra> psy: you need a graphical driver that works on all systems we support ....
[01:41] <psy> with the right scripting you could run through a series of drivers until you find one that works, running back to the old installer when everything else failes
[01:41] <ogra> psy: i think the way to go is plain C and gtk but first there has to be a graphical (framebuffer or tinyX etc...) environment that works right everywhere....
[01:42] <sivang> ogra: that's probably it :) Howdy btw?
[01:42] <ogra> psy: thats the plan, but still, you need soething that works and doesnt suck.....there will be more decisions after release, since its a goal for hoary+1
[01:42] <ogra> hi sivang 
[01:44] <sivang> ogra: I thought you like the canvas and it's subclasses? ;-)
[01:44] <ogra> heh, only if they do what i want.....
[01:44] <psy> CanvasRichText... something java?
[01:44] <ogra> or if i can explain why they dont....
[01:45] <ogra> psy: pygtk.....gnomecanvas
[01:45] <psy> :)
[01:46] <ogra> i use it as a transparent textinput field......as long as text is in there, everything is fine....if its empty, the cursor is glued to the right border....
[01:46] <psy> :p
[01:46] <ogra> which is kind of weird (execpt for sivang who starts wirting at this side)
[01:48] <sivang> ogra: hehe , well, and not even in most of the cases :)
[01:48] <ogra> heh
[01:54] <psy> ogra: when you choose high-level language and libs that run on different lowlevel-drivers without having to change its source you can divide the project in two parts, one for the hardware-support and one for the software-support (release-info, packages, install-types etc...)
[01:55] <psy> when good and clear decisions are made about the medium between the two you get fast and good results.
[01:57] <psy> or am i talking rubbish/
[01:57] <psy> ?
[01:57] <ogra> psy: and exactly the decision about the lowlevel drivers is missin
[01:57] <ogra> g
[01:58] <ogra> writing the gtk stuff will be a quick thing (its just themeing the content in another way)
[01:59] <psy> is there a list of options? or isn't there?
[01:59] <ogra> options ?
[01:59] <sivang> ogra: I also recall discussoins about some redesign over cdebconf to allow the asynchronous way of asking and "answering" install questions, has this already been done?
[02:00] <psy> ogra: which drivers are still in the race ;)
[02:00] <ogra> sivang, dunno, but i doubt there was time for it
[02:01] <ogra> psy: i think all of them since the decision was postponed....
[02:01] <ogra> psy: it will be discussed after hoary....
[02:01] <ogra> s/be/get
[02:02] <psy> ok
[02:03] <ogra> sivang: how is your printmanager stuff evolving ?
[02:06] <sivang> ogra: actually done and working :) pitti has to fix another bug in g-c-m which related to the way it communicates with the cups server, and we're set :)
[02:06] <ogra> yay
[02:07] <sivang> ogra: (by working , I mean that all of the frontend stuff I had trobule are solved, but pitti must close that upstream bug before the functionality is complete)
[02:07] <ogra> he will do, i'm sure :)
[02:08] <sivang> ogra: actually, he may have already :) I need to check
[02:10] <jdub> mdz: around?
[02:18] <ogra> jdub, any idea what happend to the march calendar ?
[02:27] <trukulo> daniels, are you online?
[02:43] <jdub> ogra: it was uploaded
[02:43] <jdub> ogra: some people clearly have it...
[02:44] <jdub> $ apt-cache show ubuntu-calendar-march | grep ^Filename
[02:44] <jdub> Filename: pool/main/u/ubuntu-calendar-march/ubuntu-calendar-march_5.03_all.deb
[02:44] <trukulo> jdub, can we have pics of mila jovovic on bakground by default?
[02:44] <trukulo> it's a superb feature
[02:44] <trukulo> lol
[02:45] <trukulo> better if she is nude
[02:45] <jdub> i think we'd have to pay her more htan the current models
[02:45] <trukulo> fucking is included in price?
[02:45] <jdub> now now
[02:45] <trukulo> xD
[02:47] <ogra> jdub: hmm, didnt get updated automatically here.....installing it now....
[02:50] <froud> who here other than mvo is working on update-manager?
[02:51] <dholbach> froud: shall i tell him something from you?
[02:51] <froud> no I am writing the docs and need a query chat
[02:52] <dholbach> ah ok
[02:52] <froud> dholbach: when does mvo normally come on
[02:52] <dholbach> froud: it's weekend, so i dunno
[02:52] <froud> OK, thanks
[02:53] <dholbach> froud: maybe he drops in tonight
[02:53] <dholbach> *shrug*
[02:53] <abelli> froud: he was around this morning
[02:55] <froud> what nick does Michiel go by
[02:56] <dholbach> mitario
[02:56] <froud> Hmm also not here
[02:57] <dholbach> de rien :-)
[03:19] <mg__> hi, does anyone here use an ibm t40?
[03:20] <jdub> lamont: ping
[03:20] <jdub> lamont: not that you should be around at this time :)
[03:21] <abelli> jdub: ping
[03:21] <abelli> jdub: i need to advertise canonical in some mails
[03:21] <abelli> can you help me
[03:22] <abelli> ?
[03:23] <ogra> jamesh: ping....
[03:23] <jdub> abelli: ?
[03:24] <abelli> jdub: i need to speak about canonical, 
[03:24] <abelli> can you give me an "how-things-work-here" lesson please?
[03:24] <Keybuk> yay, we passed Mandrake on the 3-month list today
[03:24] <dholbach> Keybuk: 3-month list? what's that?
[03:25] <Keybuk> dholbach: www.distrowatch.com
[03:25] <abelli> jdub: people here in italy are not well informed in differences between debian and ubuntu, what you are doing.. etc.
[03:25] <abelli> jdub: so we want && we should, as Italian Community to clarify how things are, or at least try to.
[03:25] <dholbach> Keybuk: we rock! :-)
[03:26] <abelli> ogra: yrs?... weeks maybe
[03:26] <abelli> ;)
[03:26] <Keybuk> ogra: it'll be interesting when an Ubuntu derivative (such as Kubuntu) passes Ubuntu itself
[03:26] <abelli> and why not days.. april is not far
[03:26] <ogra> abelli: pessimist
[03:27] <ogra> Keybuk: or guadalinux :)
[03:27] <abelli> ogra, Keybuk: or maybe when ubuntu will pass ubuntu-+1
[03:27] <ogra> do they distinguish between releases ?
[03:28] <abelli> itll be a fight with itself
[03:28] <Keybuk> no, just distributions
[03:29] <Keybuk> so hoary will increase the popularity with any luck
[03:29] <ogra> heh, so we'll keep #1 for a while....
[03:29] <jdub> abelli: perhaps you should do a direct translation of the website and ask fabio to check it with jane.
[03:29] <abelli> jdub: we are almost finished
[03:29] <jdub> abelli: please get fabio to check it with jane.
[03:29] <abelli> ok
[03:29] <abelli> thank you
[03:30] <jdub> abelli: you have to be very careful to not appear to be speaking for canonical.
[03:30] <ogra> jdub: do you know anybody i could ask about a pygtk canvas prob ? there seem to be a lot of missing functions or i'm just to blind...
[03:30] <jdub> ogra: jamesh, jdahlin, #pygtk on gimpnet...
[03:31] <abelli> abelli: obviously.
[03:31] <ogra> ah, gimpnet, thanks...i was looking around here
[03:32] <abelli> jdub: yeah, it's clear.
[03:34] <abelli> jdub: but as Italian LoCo I am supposed to inform, gently  make ppl respect the Code of Conduct, and so on right?
[03:34] <jdub> sure
[03:34] <abelli> ok
[03:35] <abelli> thank you
[03:36] <psy>  /me slaps copyright
[03:36] <psy> :p
[03:37] <psy> damn hard to come up with an original project-name
[03:37] <psy> :P
[03:38] <jdub> seb128: around?
[03:38] <seb128> jdub: yep
[03:38] <jdub> yo
[03:38] <seb128> hey :)
[03:40] <mg__> anybody use a t40 series laptop?
[03:42] <abelli> jordi: sup
[03:43] <jordi> hullo
[03:44] <seb128> oh, lazy boy here
[03:44] <seb128> jordi: evo 2.0.4 ? :)
[03:45] <jordi> seb128: I'm waiting for Margarita's patches.
[03:45] <jdub> hordi!
[03:45] <seb128> ahah
[03:45] <jordi> jdub jdub jdub 
[03:46] <jordi> EVERYONE WATCH jdubTV
[03:46] <jdub> ahr, it is not on atm
[03:46] <jdub> but i want to turn it on
[03:46] <jdub> to show my world domination map
[03:46] <jordi> ooh
[03:47] <zul> arrghhh...
[03:47] <zul> fs/read_write.c: In function `vfs_read':
[03:47] <zul> fs/read_write.c:234: error: `inode' undeclared (first use in this function)
[03:47] <zul> fs/read_write.c:234: error: (Each undeclared identifier is reported only once
[03:47] <zul> fs/read_write.c:234: error: for each function it appears in.)
[03:47] <zul> fs/read_write.c: In function `vfs_write':
[03:47] <zul> fs/read_write.c:280: error: `inode' undeclared (first use in this function)
[03:47] <zul> sorry..
[03:47] <zul> must spread the pain around
[03:50] <daniels> sabdfl: it's a gnome/gtk thing -- jdub is on top of it (comes down to a freakish hack vs  correct-but-hard-and-waiting-for-upstrea-anyway type decision)
[03:50] <seb128> daniels: about what ?
[03:51] <jdub> yeah, what am i humping now?
[03:51] <daniels> seb128: 09:51 < sabdfl> daniels: what determines the look of the pointer? specifically the please-wait-i'm-working one? it was much
[03:51] <daniels>           nicer in warty, and i'd like that back!
[03:51] <jdub> oh right
[03:51] <jdub> hrm, not very hard, just pointless ;)
[03:51] <Treenaks> pointer-less? :P
[03:51] <jdub> if upstream don't pull their fingers out, i'll have to do it in ubuntu-artwor
[03:53] <jdub> yo drbyte 
[03:53] <abelli> is someone here having problems with spambot in #ubuntu?
[03:55] <drbyte> hey jdub 
[03:55] <jdub> jdubtv! -> http://node.waugh.id.au:8800/
[03:55] <jdub> behind my head, you can see the World Domination Map
[03:55] <jdub> :-)
[03:57] <drbyte> haha. i should take a gander
[03:57] <drbyte> traffic is almost free now... 2am time
[03:59] <sabdfl> jdub: open with (in hoary)?
[04:00] <jdub> totem, xine, mplayer...
[04:02] <jdub> bit of nick cave for 02:00 :)
[04:04] <jdub> http://www.kryogenix.org/days/2005/02/01/lugradioBastards
[04:04] <jdub> haha
[04:05] <ogra> grrr, why is there no equivalent to gnome_canvas_rich_text_get_buffer in pygtk.....
[04:06] <drbyte> i see the smile jdub 
[04:06] <drbyte> and the eyeball
[04:19] <sivang> anybody know if we have a precompiled nvidia support for kernel 2.6.11 ?
[04:19] <sivang> seems missing from the archive
[04:22] <ogra> sivang, we dont have a official 2.6.11 yet afaik this is a bittkeeper snapshot to play with....
[04:23] <lamont> jdub: sup?
[04:23] <jdub> lamont: nm, but thanks :)
[04:23] <sivang> ogra: eh I see, oh well, I thought it would solve the very poor GFX redraw and X perforamnce I got here
[04:26] <lamont> ok
[04:27] <seb128> jdub: any objection to a glibmm/gtkmm update (GNOME bindings) ?
[04:28] <mg__> anybody use a an ibm t4x?
[04:31] <jdub> seb128: not at all
[04:31] <seb128> cool
[04:32] <dholbach> see you later
[04:51] <zul> sivang; 2.6.11 is experimental just right now we have to clean it up a bit
[04:52] <sivang> zul: ah ok
[04:52] <sivang> zul: cool
[04:58] <lamont> seb128: you're going to, um, howl at gnumeric...
[04:58] <lamont> creating gdaif.la
[04:58] <lamont> /bin/sed: can't read /usr/lib/libhowl.la: No such file or directory
[04:58] <lamont> everywhere
[04:58] <seb128> how nice
[04:59] <lamont> yeah, isn't it, though. :-(
[04:59] <seb128> I'll fix it
[04:59] <sivang> seb128: there seems to be a light improvement with the redraw performance, any fixed to pango or gtk?
[04:59] <seb128> no, you are the only one to have an issue here
[05:00] <lamont> we need a libtool option that says 'no matter what, ignore _this_ library' :-)
[05:00] <sivang> seb128: oh :-(
[05:00] <sivang> seb128: well, it appears that it comes and goes. oh well.
[05:01] <ogra> sivang: did you try the hibernate function ? if yes, and it failed, it might be that you are working without swap....which coul solw down your system a lot
[05:02] <ogra> could slow down... even....
[05:03] <sivang> ogra: already checked that, I have swap working 
[05:03] <jdub> lamont: -Wl,--as-needed would help here massively :)
[05:05] <lamont> jdub: would it be hiding a bug, or helping?
[05:06] <jdub> lamont: it would mean packages far up the stack wouldn't be unnecessarily depending on stuff way down the stack
[05:06] <jdub> lamont: so in this case, pre-emptively helping
[05:06] <jdub> lamont: it would also help library transitions (cf. gnutls)
[05:07] <jdub> lamont: see my mail about it to u-d
[05:08] <seb128> lamont: it would fix issues by not trying to build against not needed stuff
[05:08] <jdub> meanwhile, bedtime for me
[05:08] <seb128> 'night jdub 
[05:09] <lamont> night jdub 
[05:09] <zul> night jdub
[05:09] <lamont> ye
[05:13] <Kamion> lamont: yo
[05:13] <Kamion> you were looking for me?
[05:13] <lamont> sup?
[05:13] <lamont> well, if you're really bored, I have a small perl project for you...
[05:13] <Kamion> ah, maybe Monday then
[05:14] <lamont> yeah - no big deal either way
[05:14] <Kamion> only here for a few hours, and allocated most of that to Debian :)
[05:14] <lamont> np
[05:17] <lamont> hrm.. updated gnome, X, kernel, etc... gues I should reboot, eh?
[05:18] <lamont> from the 'decidedly evil crontab entries' department: 
[05:18] <lamont> @reboot /sbin/ifconfig eth0 mtu 1496
[05:18] <mdz> jdub: pong
[05:18] <seb128> you are rude here
[05:18] <seb128> half ?
[05:19] <ogra> http://developer.gnome.org/doc/API/2.0/libgnomecanvas/GnomeCanvasRichText.html
[05:19] <ogra> grrrr
[05:19] <lamont> seb128: that means "at least 2 that he really wanted"
[05:19] <seb128> lamont: yeah, seems so :p
[05:20] <ogra> seb128:  want to use a transparent input field on a canvas.....but there is no function to get the data out of it, since they decided not to implement  gnome_canvas_rich_text_get_buffer
[05:21] <sivang> ogra: btw, why do you need it to be transparent?
[05:21] <ogra> seb128: i was trying to use get_property('text') or get_property('user-data') but these are empty.... so no way
[05:21] <ogra> sivang: because it looks ugly otherwise
[05:22] <Kamion> svenl: fixed your choose-mirror breakage now I think; thanks for the report
[05:22] <Kamion> mdz: you were looking for me last night?
[05:23] <mdz> Kamion: I don't remember why...probably something about a bug, or bugs in general
[05:23] <mdz> last night I was reviewing high-severity bugs for Hoary
[05:23] <svenl> Kamion: ok.
[05:24] <Kamion> mdz: I noticed that from my inbox :-)
[05:24] <ogra> seb128, even perl has this function: http://gtk2-perl.sourceforge.net/doc/pod/Gnome2/Canvas/RichText.html
[05:24] <ogra> seb128, but anyway, sorry for being rude ...
[05:25] <seb128> ogra: no pb
[05:25] <seb128> ogra: feel free to switch to perl if you think that will help you :)
[05:26] <ogra> seb128: hwdb-client is nearly done, i dont feel i will rewrite the whole ui :-P
[05:26] <seb128> :)
[05:26] <lamont> jdub: sounds like somthing to turn on in hoary+1 (--as-needed)
[05:35] <Kamion> so is there any half-decent speech recognition software in main/universe/whatever?
[05:35] <Kamion> there's sphinx2, but I'm not entirely sure how to integrate it into general terminal use or what-have-you
[05:42] <stackpopper> I was wondering are there any successful boots with array6 on imac g5's?
[05:43] <Kamion> dunno about Array 6, though I'm pretty sure we've had successful installs with earlier milestone releases
[05:43] <stackpopper> so the issue is fixed?
[05:44] <stackpopper> Your next release is due in May right?
[05:45] <stackpopper> I'd like to help resolve the issue before then
[05:45] <Kamion> which issue?
[05:45] <Kamion> release is mid-April
[05:45] <stackpopper> well ubuntu not booting on imac g5's
[05:45] <Kamion> you mean Ubuntu 4.10, or a Hoary test CD?
[05:46] <stackpopper> both
[05:46] <Kamion> there have certainly been kernel fixes since 4.10 which have been reported to fix problems on certain G5 models, but testing is always appreciated
[05:46] <Kamion> since it seems to depend on the exact model
[05:46] <stackpopper> :/
[05:47] <stackpopper> k thanks
[05:48] <mdz> Riddell: here?
[05:48] <mdz> Riddell: I see you uploaded amarok, but didn't correct the dependency issue that I mailed kubuntu-devel about...did my message not get through?
[05:50] <Riddell> mdz: yes it did, that upload was just a new version, I need to think about the dependency issues but that's after I solve the sudo issue which is today's challenge
[05:51] <zenwhy> is it just me
[05:51] <zenwhy> or is the array 6 installer broken
[05:51] <mdz> neither
[05:51] <zenwhy> it copied the packages to the disk
[05:51] <zenwhy> and stopped
[05:52] <mdz> zenwhy: for future reference, we test the Array images before releasing them, so it is safe to assume that it worked for us
[05:52] <zenwhy> I had my mind set on doing this all week
[05:52] <zenwhy> Well, it isnt working over here
[05:52] <mdz> stopped with what on the screen?
[05:52] <zenwhy> I mean, do i have a reason to lie about it
[05:52] <zenwhy> the blue background with the grey line at the bottom
[05:53] <mdz> check tty3 (control+alt+f3) and see if there is anything on the screen
[05:53] <zenwhy> it just stopped after it copied the remaining packages to the disk
[05:53] <mdz> if you are able to work at the command line, you can press control+alt+f2 and get a shell
[05:53] <zenwhy> it stopped with reiserfs progs for some odd reason
[05:54] <mdz> most problems like this are the result of bad media; I suggest burning a new copy at a lower speed
[05:54] <zenwhy> oh
[05:54] <zenwhy> fun
[05:54] <mdz> Riddell: so you expect to have a sudo solution for preview?
[05:54] <ogra> zenwhy: which speed did you use ?
[05:54] <zenwhy> the speed my media is rated at
[05:54] <zenwhy> which was 16x
[05:55] <zenwhy> ill try again I suppose
[05:55] <ogra> zenwhy: the suggestion is not faster then 8x but 4x is safe
[05:55] <ogra> so better try 4x
[05:55] <Riddell> mdz: yes, working on it now, stuck on why a user can kill su but not sudo
[05:57] <opi> Riddell, maybe sudo starts with +s
[05:57] <opi> Riddell, so it's not user process anymore
[05:58] <Riddell> opi: sure, but so does su and you can kill that
[05:58] <buga> opi: it's not a good reason, /bin/su is also a setuid binary
[06:01] <mdz> ogra: are you (MOTU) reviewing the list of uninstallable packages in universe?  the last time I looked, there were several packages which just needed to be rebuilt (shared library transitions)
[06:01] <mdz> Riddell: why do you need to kill it?
[06:02] <Riddell> mdz: seems kdesu like to start su/sudo to see if it needs a password, then kill it then pop up the password dialogue if needed then start su/sudo for real
[06:02] <tseng> mdz: we're most focused on the python transition
[06:04] <ogra> mdz: its a while ago that i had a look there....(you mean the list Kamion generates ?)
[06:04] <jani> mdz, you mean the -lX stuff?
[06:04] <Riddell> also it does a kill -0 just to check that it's still alive before passing password
[06:05] <ogra> jani: -lX is nearly solved .....
[06:05] <mdz> ogra: if he generates one for universe, yes, that would be the one
[06:05] <mdz> http://people.ubuntu.com/~cjwatson/testing/hoary_probs.html is only main
[06:05] <Kamion> as I have said before, I merely mirror that list, I don't (any more) generate it
[06:05] <Kamion> I set up the initial scripts for it, but they run on jackass and I don't have an account there
[06:06] <Kamion> I think I set them up before universe existed :)
[06:06] <ogra> Kamion: would it be possible to adjust it for universe ?
[06:06] <mdz> ogra: see above
[06:06] <mdz> sounds like it is elmo territory now
[06:06] <Kamion> it is
[06:07] <ogra> hmm, i see, so we'll have to wait until he gts back.....
[06:07] <ogra> gets even
[06:07] <mdz> he has been checking in periodically while he is away
[06:08] <ogra> yup...i saw him several times
[06:08] <Kamion> it should just be a matter of catting the Packages and Sources files for all the required components together
[06:08] <mdz> wow, so many sites reprint stories from distrowatch
[06:09] <robertj> speaking of which, Ubuntu passed Mandrake to obtain the top spot on the 3 month list sometime last night
[06:09] <Riddell> mdz: examples?
[06:09] <ogra> robertj: we will keep that the next years ;)
[06:10] <zul> ogra: you optimist
[06:10] <ogra> :-D
[06:10] <zul> its lunch time already?
[06:10] <robertj> really, Mandrake probably still outnumbers ubuntu users by quite a bit but they aren't the distrowatch visiting sort
[06:10] <robertj> so I doubt it means much
[06:11] <mdz> Riddell: tod-os.com, usalug.org, lots
[06:11] <mdz> just from watching the access logs related to the kubuntu announcement
[06:12] <mdz> many of them are reprints or direct translations of the distrowatch story
[06:12] <robertj> is nautilus cd burning currently b0rk on hoary?
[06:12] <mdz> no
[06:13] <sivang> mdz: we have a reference for that ever here on the major linux portals :-) kubuntu has created much interest here
[06:13] <Riddell> mdz: do you have any thoughts on handling publicity for kubuntu, like when we should get a website and announce proper?
[06:14] <mdz> Riddell: sounds like something to raise at Tuesday's CC meeting
[06:17] <opi> kubuntu.org is taken
[06:17] <opi> kubuntulinux.org it's not
[06:18] <zenlol> reburned the array six iso
[06:18] <zenlol> im giving it another go
[06:18] <Riddell> opi: kubuntu.org has been taken since someone at canonical said "oh god they really are going to call it kubuntu arn't they, we'd better buy that domain name"
[06:18] <Riddell> mdz: good plan, /me adds to agenda
[06:19] <opi> Riddell, ok :)
[06:20] <Kamion> (the name Kubuntu was first suggested before we even went public, from what I remember)
[06:20] <mdz> right, kubuntu.org isn't so much taken, as reserved for Kubuntu :-)
[06:20] <mdz> Kamion: oxford
[06:20] <Kamion> I thought Jeff mentioned it before that
[06:20] <Kamion> but ok, that was before the preview anyhow
[06:20] <opi> I prefer Ubuntu/KDE :-)
[06:21] <opi> but Riddell and guys should pick it up
[06:21] <robertj> Ubuntu/KDE sounds like one might reasonably expect it to release at the sime time as Ubuntu
[06:22] <zenlol> I am glad kubuntu exits, so as to keep the regular ubuntu to one disk.
[06:22] <mdz> enrico: is there a plan to fix the categorization in Yelp, to get the ubuntu-docs items to the front?
[06:22] <zenlol> exists*
[06:22] <Riddell> opi: I was overruled on the name
[06:22] <robertj> I kinda had this delusion that the lack of a Kubuntu might force Debian to actually make a release :(
[06:23] <jordi> meh
[06:23] <jordi> no mvo here
[06:23] <robertj> how often do yall end up doing slash & burn reinstalls?
[06:24] <zenlol> i am doing one now
[06:24] <zenlol> at least i hope i am
[06:24] <Kamion> all the time, but I'm a special case ;)
[06:24] <opi> robertj, I just killed Debian box to turn it into Ubuntu 
[06:24] <Kamion> for my real systems as opposed to test ones, never
[06:24] <zenlol> well
[06:24] <robertj> I've resisted doing one on principle on my main desktop but things seem to get more and more broke, although they are better han they were
[06:24] <zenlol> i guess i wont be installing array six
[06:24] <opi> robertj, but if something is stable, it's just sits there
[06:24] <robertj> My array stuff seems ok for the most part
[06:24] <zenlol> it stops installing on my system after it copies the packages to the disk
[06:25] <Kamion> zenlol: it's not *entirely* impossible that that's an archive-copier bug, but it seems unlikely
[06:25] <zenlol> media should be ruled out at this point as i burned at 4x
[06:25] <zenlol> and the iso was good
[06:25] <Kamion> zenlol: 'ps x' on tty2; what's it going?
[06:25] <Kamion> doing?
[06:25] <zenlol> ps x?
[06:25] <Kamion> type that
[06:26] <zenlol> what information are you wanting
[06:26] <Kamion> there should be a .postinst running somewhere
[06:27] <zenlol> theres just a huge list of stuff there
[06:27] <zenlol> theres a lot of stuff
[06:27] <zenlol> but that isnt one of them
[06:27] <Kamion> what're the last few lines?
[06:27] <zenlol> we;;
[06:27] <zenlol> ps aux | grep post shows it running
[06:27] <zenlol> but nothing it happening at all
[06:28] <zenlol> is*
[06:28] <Kamion> just the last few lines of 'ps x' please
[06:28] <Kamion> process names
[06:28] <zenlol> im not on that computer
[06:28] <zenlol> ill have to type it all out
[06:28] <Kamion> the last three or four process names should not be hard work to type
[06:29] <enrico> mdz: not from the docteam: we tried, but we didn't figure out much on how to do it
[06:29] <Kamion> I don't care about the PID,Uid,VmSize,Stat columns
[06:29] <zenlol> well then i dont have what you need because these arent process names. Ill just home i can fix it somehow on my own
[06:29] <Kamion> eh?
[06:29] <zenlol> i think its dying trying ti mount an ntfs drive
[06:29] <zenlol> that i didnt tell it to mount
[06:29] <Kamion> 'busybox ps x' on a real system shows me:
[06:29] <Kamion>  7441 cjwatson   1360 S   pterm -fn -misc-fixed-medium-r-semicondensed--13-120-
[06:30] <Kamion>  7442 cjwatson   2008 S   -bash
[06:30] <Kamion>  7461 cjwatson    740 R   ps x
[06:30] <Kamion> so like the bits from 'pterm' on
[06:30] <Kamion> ok, the installer does go around mounting all filesystems it can find at some stages
[06:30] <zenlol> it dies trying to mount an ntfs drive
[06:30] <Kamion> you could put 'exit 0' on the second line of /bin/os-prober as a workaround
[06:31] <Kamion> that sounds like a kernel issue then
[06:31] <zenlol> oh
[06:31] <zenlol> yeah thats what its doing
[06:31] <zenlol> kernel issue?
[06:31] <zenlol> thats odd
[06:31] <lamont> elmo?
[06:31] <zenlol> my hardware couldnt be more standard
[06:32] <zenlol> so i can kill the os prober
[06:32] <zenlol> and get past this?
[06:32] <zenlol> what do i need to do to dso that. Ive never had an installation issue with ubuntu before this.
[06:33] <Kamion> it seems unlikely that it is a hardware issue; I imagine there's a bug in the NTFS driver
[06:33] <Kamion> nano /bin/os-prober
[06:33] <Kamion> at some point after 'retrieving installer modules', e.g. while installing the base system
[06:34] <Kamion> this will cause e.g. Windows not to appear in your grub configuration, but you can't have everything ...
[06:34] <Kamion> I have never heard of an issue like this before though
[06:34] <zenlol> oh
[06:34] <zenlol> well i know for a fact that its not a hardware issue
[06:34] <krix> hi
[06:35] <zenlol> i suppose i will just wait then
[06:35] <Kamion> wait for what?
[06:35] <krix> hm. i don't know it is a right question on this chan :) but i installed ubuntu array6 on an amd64 system. I upgraded it and installed kernel-2.6.11-1
[06:35] <zenlol> to use array 6. I dont have the luxury up updating.
[06:35] <krix> now i want to install nvidia driver from nvidia.com and then i got compile errors.
[06:35] <zenlol> My system is broken due to backports.
[06:36] <Kamion> zenlol: please file a bug, component 'linux'
[06:36] <zenlol> and I am on dialup.
[06:36] <zenlol> This clean install was going to get me back on the right path. :/
[06:36] <krix> and i got this error: http://paste.msunix.org/view.php?id=1912
[06:36] <krix> please somebody look that
[06:37] <krix> i don't know it is a bug in 2.6.11-1 package or a bug in me :)
[06:37] <lamont> wow.  42 seconds from 'Starting ubuntu' to a prompt in gdm.
[06:37] <Kamion> krix: looks like the nvidia guys need to update their module, to me
[06:38] <krix> Kamion, hm i don't know, i installed this module at Fedora Core 3
[06:38] <zul> 2.6.11.1 was like released yesterday so nvidia probably hasnt caught up
[06:38] <krix> without those problems.
[06:38] <krix> s/module/nvidia-driver/
[06:38] <crimsun> RE: Nvidia: http://sh.nu/t/67mgw
[06:39] <ogra> Kamion: i thought the 2.6.11 packjage was only a bitkeeper snapshot currently
[06:39] <ogra> -j
[06:39] <krix> no
[06:39] <zul> there isnt a 2.6.11.1 package yet
[06:39] <robertj> Do you guys think it would be worth the trouble to have an Ubuntu.ics that listed arrays, freeze dates, and releases?
[06:39] <krix> zui: then what i installed ?
[06:39] <krix> :)
[06:39] <zenlol> ill install array 4 and upgrade to array six from the disk
[06:39] <zul> did you install it throught apt?
[06:39] <krix> ii  linux-image-2. 2.6.11-0.2     Linux kernel image for version 2.6.11 on AMD
[06:39] <krix> ^^
[06:39] <krix> yes
[06:39] <zenlol> and use my own kernel configuration
[06:39] <ogra> zul: there is one in universe afaik....
[06:39] <zenlol> ill be sure to file a bug though
[06:40] <Kamion> yeah, that's an unofficial package that we have for the purposes of experimentation
[06:40] <krix> Filename: pool/universe/l/linux-source-2.6.11/linux-image-2.6.11-1-amd64-k8_2.6.11-0.2_amd64.deb
[06:40] <Kamion> Hoary'll be releasing with 2.6.10, I believe
[06:40] <krix> so it comes from universe
[06:40] <ogra> zul: which fabbione built for playing with 
[06:40] <zul> krix: its experimental and its based on a bitkeeper snapshot
[06:40] <crimsun> krix: that's not 2.6.11.1
[06:40] <krix> no? :)
[06:40] <zul> and what crimsun said
[06:41] <crimsun> krix: look at the build date via ,,uname -a''
[06:41] <krix> krics@ubuntu:~$ uname -a
[06:41] <krix> Linux ubuntu 2.6.11-1-amd64-k8 #1 Fri Feb 11 14:45:56 UTC 2005 x86_64 GNU/Linux
[06:41] <krix> hm
[06:41] <krix> that is intresting yep. on Feb11 there wasn't 2.6.11 released :)
[06:41] <krix> so. then i will switch back to 2.6.10 :)
[06:42] <krix> thanks for your time and sorry for false reporting.
[06:43] <krix> now go to reboot. bye :)
[06:43] <zul> i should fix that when i get a chance
[06:43] <ogra> or suppress the package anyhow.....
[06:44] <Riddell> mdz: what's the issue with libmad?  is it mp3 can go on the servers but not on the CD?
[06:44] <zul> ogra: yeah
[06:44] <ogra> there are may ppl upgrading to 2.6.11 if they see it i guess.....
[06:45] <mdz> robertj: yes, a calendar would be great
[06:45] <zenlol> i really cant understand why not having mp3 capability at install time is such an issue for some people. enabling universe will be easier than ever with hoary, and installing mp3 capable players and backends is simple.
[06:46] <robertj> mdz: would that be too much of a burden to assign to someone who already had web access ;)
[06:46] <mdz> robertj: web access?
[06:46] <mdz> the release schedule is maintained in the wiki
[06:46] <ogra> zenlol: google for mp3 license fee
[06:47] <robertj> oh, so stick it on as an attachment?
[06:47] <ogra> zenlol: and probably: price
[06:47] <mdz> robertj: yes, that seems simplest
[06:48] <zenlol> ogra
[06:49] <zenlol> my statement was against including it
[06:49] <ogra> zenlol: lol, sorry i missed "not having" in your sentence
[06:49] <zenlol> all that would be gained from paying the mp3 licensing fees would be the placation of lazy users
[06:49] <sivang> seb128: ping
[06:51] <zenlol> a "preview release" is coming soon correct?
[06:51] <sivang> zenlol: yes
[06:51] <zenlol> cool
[06:51] <zenlol> I will upgrade to that from array 4 when it comes then
[06:52] <zenlol> being on dialup and having to use my friends for my downloads is a hassle
[06:52] <sivang> zenlol: where are you in?
[06:52] <zenlol> \I plan to stay current and be active in the filing of bug reports in a couple months when I am no longer saddled with this horrible internet connection.
[06:53] <zenlol> I am in kentucky, USA. Most of my state has availbale broadband but I am in a very rural earea. five miles to the east and west of me people have broadband.
[06:53] <zenlol> I am part of the last mile effort.
[06:53] <zenlol> lol
[06:53] <sivang> zenlol: oh nice :)
[06:53] <zenlol> area*
[06:57] <zenwhen> greetings from hoary
[06:59] <sivang> ogra: would you like to test a a binary pkg?
[06:59] <sivang> ogra: (the g-c-m stuff)
[06:59] <ogra> sivang: got amd64 for me ?
[06:59] <ogra> oh, i have no printer around atm....sorry
[07:00] <seb128> sivang: pong
[07:05] <lamont> if ! killall -0 xsane && killall -0 ptal-mlcd; then
[07:05] <lamont>         /etc/init.d/hpoj stop
[07:05] <lamont>         /etc/init.d/hpoj start
[07:05] <lamont> fi
[07:05] <lamont> probably a bit too gross for 6771, eh?
[07:05] <sivang> ogra: ah no :-( only source, but I will have seb upload it now and you can get it from the archive already :)
[07:05] <sivang> seb128: done with #2251, can you upload/review?
[07:06] <seb128> sivang: tomorrow, I'll go for dinner in a few min
[07:06] <lamont> daniels: around?
[07:07] <sivang> seb128: ok, thanks
[07:07] <seb128> np
[07:09] <zenwhen> o
[07:10] <[m0rph] > which package contains the file "usr/X11R6/include/X11/extensions/scrnsaver.h"? (debian had it in xlibs-dev)
[07:10] <Kamion> [m0rph] : http://higgs.djpig.de/ubuntu/www/
[07:10] <Kamion> libxss-dev
[07:11] <[m0rph] > Kamion: thx
[07:11] <Loevborg> Kamion, are there plans to do an official version of that service?
[07:13] <Ryaan> http://www.otomotivshow.com/
[07:18] <Kamion> Loevborg: see the top News item on that page
[07:18] <zul> there inotify finally building at last
[07:19] <Loevborg> Kamion, thanks.
[07:26] <tseng> zul: rock
[07:26] <Keiven> http://www.tcpsecurity.com/
[07:30] <zul> tseng: ill test it on my pc first and once im sure its not going to break anything ill put it up at the usualy place for you to test if you want
[07:30] <tseng> ok
[07:30] <tseng> im at the conference all
[07:30] <tseng> day, i wont be mucking with my kernel
[07:30] <zul> ok
[07:30] <tseng> before my talk at least.
[07:30] <tseng> heh
[07:30] <zul> well its going to take a while for the thing to build
[07:32] <sivang> ogra: you can get the source pkgs here: http://muse.19inch.net/~sivan/g-c-m/
[07:32] <sivang> ogra: (as well as i386 bin ones)
[07:33] <ogra> sivang: ok, i'll look at them if i solved my pygtk issue with hwdb.....
[07:34] <sivang> ogra:  lemme know if it breaks anything :)
[07:34] <ogra> yup
[07:34] <sivang> but I'm away from now and probably for the weekedn
[07:34] <sivang> laterz all
[07:35] <ogra> sivang: i'll follow up to your bug if thats ok
[07:36] <sivang> ogra: make sure cupsys is installed , becuase if it's not, nothing special will happen :)
[07:36] <sivang> ogra: I'll see you later.
[07:36] <ogra> sivang, yup (btw... cupsys is installed by default)
[07:37] <Treenaks> something "special" ? :)
[07:38] <ogra> Treenaks: ?? special ??
[07:38] <Treenaks> oh nothing special
[07:38] <Treenaks> wait
[07:38] <Treenaks> special, too
[07:39] <ogra> Treenaks: yeah, if cupsys is installed someting special will happen
[07:39] <Treenaks> ogra: I just read it wrong.. 
[07:40] <ogra> Treenaks: dunno what though (beside that it will show an additional checkbox) but probably sivang comes around and does your dishes or something ;)
[07:52] <pitti> Hi
[07:53] <zenwhen> wow
[07:53] <zenwhen> my scroll wheel goes back and forward in firefox
[07:53] <zenwhen> and the back and forward buttons scroll
[07:54] <zenwhen> i may just go back to warty and stay there for a long time lol
[08:04] <psy> hi
[08:06] <pitti> mdz: here?
[08:06] <pitti> Hi psy
[08:07] <lamont> hrm... really need to make /home shared across multiple machines in the house...
[08:07] <psy> lamont: samba?
[08:07] <lamont> prolly
[08:07] <Treenaks> ubuntu/win32 ? :P
[08:07] <lamont> Treenaks: no winblows boxen  here
[08:08] <lamont> although I've been instructed to install it on one machine
[08:08] <lamont> damn windoze-only school software
[08:08] <Treenaks> lamont: doesn't wine work?
[08:08] <lamont> shfs?
[08:08] <lamont> Treenaks: non trivial code
[08:08] <Treenaks> lamont: ugh
[08:08] <lamont> is ok.  the box will be dmz'ed to hell and gone, with nearly 0 internet connectivity
[08:08] <psy> lamont: secure host file system.
[08:09] <psy> does not work with windows, but hey :p
[08:10] <Nafallo> cygwin+shfs?
[08:11] <Nafallo> aha, kernel module...
[08:12] <mdz> pitti: yes
[08:15] <ogra> mdz: thanks for the followup :)
[08:16] <lamont> psy: package name or what module?
[08:17] <pitti> mdz: Hi! didn't catch you this morning, is there any news about langpack/ship?
[08:17] <mdz> pitti: apart from what we agreed yesterday?
[08:18] <pitti> mdz: yesterday we decided only about the live CD AFAIK
[08:18] <psy> lamont: shfs-utils
[08:18] <mdz> pitti: no, I said to go ahead with ship as well
[08:18] <psy> or shfs-source, haven't installed it on ubuntu yet. :p
[08:18] <pitti> mdz: oh, I thought we don't have enough space for all 10 packages, so that we need further discussion
[08:18] <pitti> mdz: but I'm happy to seed them
[08:18] <mdz> oh, we don't?
[08:19] <mdz> I thought it was only 30M or so
[08:19] <pitti> mdz: should fit even on the ppc, though
[08:19] <pitti> yes
[08:19] <mdz> there is enough space, then
[08:19] <pitti> mdz: btw, when is germinate updated with the new seeds?
[08:19] <mdz> pitti: daily, I think.  check with Kamion
[08:19] <pitti> mdz: we threw lesstif1 out of the seeds over a week ago, but it's still in main
[08:19] <mdz> pitti: that's probably due to sparc
[08:19] <Kamion> 0 0 * * *               update-germinate
[08:19] <pitti> ok, I'll ask him
[08:20] <Kamion> that output is just informational, but I can make it happen more often if you like
[08:20] <mdz> pitti: did you check whether it shows up in germinate?
[08:20] <pitti> Kamion: hm, any idea why lesstif1 is still there?
[08:20] <Kamion> pitti: look at rdepends/
[08:20] <mdz> pitti: if it shows up in germinate, rdepends/ will tell why
[08:20] <pitti> mdz: I checked p.u.c./~cjwatson/germinate-hoary-output (or so)
[08:20] <Kamion> 2 * * * *               update-germinate
[08:20] <mdz> pitti: if it isn't in germinate, it's probably sparc
[08:20] <Kamion> there, should be a bit more useful
[08:21] <pitti> mdz, Kamion: also, I checked with madision
[08:21] <pitti>   lesstif1 | 1:0.93.94-11ubuntu2 |         hoary | amd64, i386, ia64, powerpc, sparc
[08:21] <mdz> pitti: when you checked germinate-output/hoary, did you see lesstif1 or no?
[08:21] <pitti> mdz: I saw it
[08:22] <Kamion> it's not there for me
[08:22] <mdz> http://people.ubuntu.com/~cjwatson/germinate-output/hoary/rdepends/lesstif1-1/
[08:22] <Kamion> mdz: that's for lesstif2
[08:22] <mdz> lesstif1 is in extra, so it should be able to move to universe fine
[08:22] <pitti> hmm
[08:22] <Kamion> they come from the same source package
[08:22] <pitti> lesstif-dev                               | lesstif1-1                      | Generated by lesstif1-1
[08:22] <mdz> Kamion: lesstif1 is built by lesstif1-1
[08:23] <Kamion> pitti: I do not see that in all
[08:23] <pitti> Kamion: yes, but I thought we can throw some binaries of a source package to universe?
[08:23] <Kamion> pitti: don't bother looking in *extra
[08:23] <Kamion> pitti: yes
[08:23] <pitti> oh, I did
[08:23] <mdz> http://people.ubuntu.com/~james/paste/sync.txt
[08:23] <pitti> oh, indeed
[08:23] <mdz> it's not james' list
[08:23] <mdz> but that may be due to sparc
[08:23] <pitti> Kamion: but why does madison lie?
[08:24] <Kamion> pitti: it does not lie
[08:24] <mdz> pitti: madison does not lie; it is in main
[08:24] <Kamion> pitti: demotion to universe is manual, not automatic
[08:24] <lamont> Kamion: muppomatic :-)
[08:25] <mdz> pitti: I think we need for elmo to exclude sparc from his germinate runs until it is fixed
[08:25] <mdz> there will be other packages like this
[08:25] <pitti> mdz: it would be great to throw this out, lesstif1 is a PITA
[08:27] <dd> www.otomotivshow.com
[08:29] <ogra> gah, spambots
[08:30] <zenwhen> everything works in hoary but my mouse wheel
[08:30] <zenwhen> lol
[08:30] <zenwhen> and theres no reason it shouldnt be because my xconfig is the same as I have used in every distro i have ever used
[08:30] <zenwhen> and it worked in warty
[08:34] <mdz> zenwhen: I suggest letting the system generate your X configuration rather than copying it; then your scroll wheel is likely to work
[08:37] <pitti> Kamion: if I put some language-pack-foo stuff in Ship, do I need to remove them from Supported?
[08:38] <Kamion> pitti: you don't have to, but I generally do; being in ship implies supported already
[08:39] <mdz> yes, it's redundant to have them in both places
[08:39] <pitti> Kamion: I know, but it might be easier to change
[08:39] <pitti> okay, I remove it
[08:40] <pitti> mdz: btw, l-support-en is already in ship
[08:41] <mdz> pitti: yes, I realize
[08:41] <mdz> likewise for live
[08:57] <Kamion> mdz: ok to remove the installer question about whether you want to update from the network?
[08:58] <Kamion> mdz: just always answering 'yes' works fine now due to the rearrangements for #6390, although if the network is not available then it leaves the network entries commented out
[09:03] <krix> hello again.
[09:04] <ogra> pitti: do you want me to include a question about language settings in hwdb-client ?
[09:06] <krix> in ubuntu array6 version at 2.6.10-4 version of kernel. It did not contains the SB Live 24! Bit driver. This driver is snd-card-ca0106 any support for this in the future updates of 2.6.10 kernels about this problem ? 
[09:06] <krix> sorry if i'm speaking lame things or stupidity :) i'm new for ubuntu and new for this community too.
[09:09] <Kamion> are NFS mounts with a Hoary client incredibly slow for anyone else?
[09:09] <ogra> nope
[09:09] <Kamion> maybe it's my server
[09:09] <ogra> (hoary server and client)
[09:10] <Kamion> pretty sure it used to be fine with a Warty client
[09:11] <ogra> but i have set mount options like rsize and wsize to 8192
[09:11] <ogra> maybe that affects the speed a bit
[09:11] <krix> So anyone to  my soundcard support question? :)
[09:13] <Kamion> krix: I don't see the string 'ca0106' anywhere in the kernel source we have
[09:14] <krix> mhm
[09:14] <krix> http://www.alsa-project.org/alsa-doc/doc-php/template.php?company=Creative+Labs&card=Sound+Blaster+Live+24bit.&chip=SB0310%2C+P17&module=ca0106
[09:14] <krix> i think this is in alsa-sources
[09:16] <ogra> krix: isnt that a usb device ?
[09:16] <krix> no
[09:16] <krix> ogra, it is an integrated SB Live 24! bit soundcard. 
[09:16] <krix> Which is stays at my MSi K8N SLI Platinum Motherboard :)
[09:16] <krix> lspci identify him as SB Audigy LS
[09:17] <krix> btw google and others things say that i need snd-ca0106 module for this card.
[09:17] <krix> http://www.alsa-project.org/alsa-doc/index.php?vendor=vendor-Creative_Labs#matrix
[09:17] <krix> you can see on here.
[09:18] <krix> ogra, Kamion : and the kernel package which is in universe tree (2.6.11-1) contains this module.
[09:18] <Kamion> ok, presumably it got merged upstream; it's really too late for us to switch to a new upstream kernel for hoary though
[09:19] <Kamion> krix: please file a bug, component 'linux', asking for that driver to be merged; I don't know if it will be merged, but if you don't file a bug, it probably won't. :-)
[09:19] <krix> ah :)
[09:20] <krix> hm i hope :)
[09:26] <abelli> did smurfix show up today?
[09:27] <zul> it just never ends
[09:28] <abelli> zul: hu?
[09:28] <zul> im just talking to myself kind of
[09:28] <abelli> ahh.. ok
[09:28] <abelli> ;)
[09:31] <krix> Kamion, https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=7220 filled
[09:32] <zul> krix: thanks
[09:32] <krix> i hope isn't a bad bugreport :) I'm not a bugreporting expert :)
[09:32] <krix> zul, i thanks :)
[09:37] <Kamion> I did ask for component 'linux'
[09:40] <krix> ooo
[09:40] <krix> so i ask, what "component 'linux' " means? :)
[09:40] <krix> the Package ??
[09:41] <krix> I found only one place where i can specify linux :) And that was the OS :)
[09:41] <krix> sorry, i'm not a bugzilla using expert
[09:41] <krix> i can correct out if you say what to correct.
[09:43] <ogra> krix: the package should be linux
[09:46] <krix> oh. 
[09:47] <krix> corrected out. Sorry for this.
[09:47] <ogra> :)
[09:49] <dd> www.otomotivshow.com
[09:50] <Treenaks> again?
[09:50] <krix> heh. 
[09:59] <krix> now bye
[10:03] <mdz> Kamion: absolutely
[10:06] <Kamion> mdz: done
[10:07] <mdz> great
[10:09] <Kamion> mdz: I think I know why people are missing linux-restricted-modules a lot in install reports; it'll require a base-installer change, possibly best a merge of a new version from Debian
[10:09] <Kamion> but I'm only here very briefly and need to go again, I'll look at it on Monday
[10:42] <abelli> good night everyone
[11:22] <zenwhen> is himem enabled in ubuntu smp kernels
[11:22] <zenwhen> ?
[11:24] <mdz> zenwhen: yes
[11:24] <mdz> it's enabled in everything except the -386 flavour, I believe
[11:24] <zenwhen> cool
[11:26] <zenwhen> Ive decided to start using the official kernels, and stop mixing in non ubuntu packages
[11:26] <zenwhen> my last install is thoroughly hosed
[11:26] <zenwhen> lol
[11:31] <zenrox> thank god for using a seprate partion for /home right
[11:32] <zenwhen> yes
[11:32] <zenwhen> but i hack so many things to my liking outside of home
[11:33] <zenrox> make back up in the /home for that
[11:33] <zenwhen> that I am still kind of bummed
[11:33] <zenwhen> my poor beautiful install ;_;
[11:33] <zenrox> so you just have to copy and paste