[12:23] <psy__> T-None: ?
[12:24] <T-None> psy__: what? I'm not there for long
[12:26] <jdub> http://live.gnome.org/ProjectUtopia_2fPowerManagement_2fScreenshots
[12:26] <jdub> yay team
[12:27] <tseng> the second shot down is a little "heavy"
[12:28] <jdub> yeah
[12:28] <jdub> davidz :)
[12:31] <psy__> T-None: why the nick-change?
[12:31] <psy__> jdub: :)
[12:33] <thierry> I'd like to help, do you have any easy to fix bugs for me?
[12:35] <psy__> thierry: you silly... if anyone knows on fore-hand a bug is easy to fix... wouldn't it been done already?
[12:35] <thierry> :) yeah but some too busy people sometimes get to harder task to I tough maybe someone could point me some easy ones...
[12:45] <seb128> mdz, jdub: is that ok to update gksu to the new version ? The new version is basically the merge of the differents patches with some changes that fix the sound issue 
[12:45] <seb128> it's in debian for a week
[12:46] <jdub> if you've checked it and are happy with it, sure :)
[12:46] <seb128> yep, I have
[12:47] <seb128> k, thanks ;)
[12:52] <thierry> seb128, I want fix Ubuntu bug 3176 but I don't know where to add the code, any Idea?
[12:52] <seb128> I think you have already asked a bunch of time here and on the gnome IRC today, nop, sorry
[12:53] <thierry> k... It's really easy to fix but I just don't know where
[12:53] <seb128> look on a default bookmark and grep for it in the mozilla-firefox sources
[12:53] <seb128> (just an idea)
[12:54] <thierry> seb128, already tried but I didn't work... can you give me example of the use of grep for like bob bookmark
[12:55] <jdub> seb128: just testing gnome#169347 ;)
[12:55] <ajmitch> afternoon all
[12:55] <jdub> thierry: grep -irl bookmark *
[12:56] <jdub> man grep is pretty handy :)
[12:56] <thierry> jdub, I know but it's hard to find exactly what you want in it
[12:56] <seb128> jdub: nice, quick patch on this one :)
[12:57] <seb128> thierry: grep "www\.oneurl" 
[12:57] <seb128> thierry: the URL is probably not in a lot of places
[12:58] <thierry> seb128, great idea! thanks
[12:59] <seb128> np
[01:03] <thierry> seb128, I did grep "http://www.mozilla.org/support/firefox/" but it stands there like if was waiting something... I know search can be long but it's been about 5 minutes and still nothing
[01:04] <seb128> hum
[01:04] <seb128> k, I'm downloading the sources
[01:04] <thierry> seb128, that's what happen about 4 time on 5 when I grep something
[01:04] <seb128> firefox sources not small
[01:04] <thierry> k
[01:04] <seb128> are not small even
[01:05] <seb128> it's going to take some minutes to download
[01:06] <thierry> k
[01:07] <psy__> nn
[01:08] <seb128> jdub: working on #7239 ? 
[01:09] <jdub> seb128: looking at it ;)
[01:09] <seb128> cool, thanks :)
[01:17] <thierry> seb128: about 10 minutes and still nothing...
[01:17] <thierry> just waiting...
[01:17] <seb128> you ?
[01:17] <seb128> hum
[01:17] <seb128> if you don't give a second argument to grep you can wait forever :p
[01:18] <thierry> seb128, and what is supposed to be the second argument?
[01:18] <seb128> man grep
[01:18] <seb128> where grep should search 
[01:19] <thierry> ho ok!
[01:21] <seb128> thierry: I think than you are looking for profile/defaults/bookmarks.html in the sources
[01:22] <thierry> seb128: sort of but in the top of this file there's this :
[01:22] <thierry> <!-- This is an automatically generated file.
[01:22] <thierry> It will be read and overwritten.
[01:22] <thierry> Do Not Edit! -->
[01:22] <thierry> seb128, so I don't think this it...
[01:23] <seb128> that's probably true once installed
[01:23] <seb128> but I'm not sure in the source package
[01:23] <seb128> you can try to build a package with it changed
[01:24] <zul> jdub: ping
[01:24] <jdub> zul: pong
[01:25] <zul> jdub: did tseng talk to you?
[01:25] <thierry> seb128, ok I'll try
[01:25] <mdz> seb128: gksu is OK by me
[01:25] <seb128> mdz: k, thanks
[01:27] <zul> jdub: inotify 0.20  homer kernel: inotify enabled!
[01:27] <zul> Mar  6 08:37:27 homer kernel: inotify device minor=63
[01:29] <tseng> everything works but gamin polling /media still
[01:29] <tseng> i think ill have to post to the mailing list about that
[01:29] <jdub> rockin'!
thank you...thank you very much</elvis>
[01:31] <srbaker> anyone here have any luck with eclipse with gcj4 ?
[01:34] <thierry> seb128, Ok I've made the changes, now how do I build this firefox from source without broking my current firefox installation?
[01:36] <mdz> jdub: so it looks like we may have been bailed out as far as inotify for hoary
[01:36] <mdz> jdub: but what about polypaudio?
[01:37] <jdub> mdz: no traction from upstream, i think we should bail out
[01:37] <jdub> mdz: no huge loss, esound still works
[01:37] <jdub> and i've fixed an annoying bug in esound
[01:38] <seb128> after breaking it first :p
[01:38] <seb128> *g* :)
[01:38] <jdub> it's no fun otherwise :)
[01:38] <jdub> seb128: dude, what did you have for breakfast this morning?
[01:39] <mdz> FREEDOM JUICE
[01:39] <dholbach> :-)
[01:39] <mdz> jdub: what are the blockers, apart from it apparently being total shit on ppc?
[01:39] <seb128> jdub: that's sunday, just some good sleep :p
[01:40] <jdub> mdz: esound protocol sample caching issues
[01:40] <jdub> mdz: (login/out sounds, unreliable sound effects)
[01:41] <jdub> mdz: /tmp/.esd not killed when daemon exits
[01:41] <mdz> I haven't seen any problems with sound effects, and the last time we discussed the login/out problem it sounded like it was fixable
[01:41] <jdub> it's fixable unreliably atm
[01:41] <jdub> you're probably not noticing that sound effects only happen intermittently :)
[01:42] <jdub> general cpu usage issues, but probably fixable by changing frame periods, etc.
[01:43] <jdub> also verbose logging (seb128's favourite)
[01:43] <seb128> robtaylor has a lag between image and sound in totem too
[01:43] <HrdwrBoB> yeah running esound with movies can result in enourmous lag
[01:43] <HrdwrBoB> gets to be several seconds by the end of a 1.5hr movie
[01:43] <jdub> seb128: that's fixable, but i wouldn't regard it as a regression (esound is worse) ;-)
[01:44] <tseng> actually ive noticed some lag with muine
[01:44] <seb128> yeah :)
[01:44] <crimsun> it does seem to be notoriously unreliable across many ubuntu hoary installs; some people have to wrangle to get sounds to work
[01:44] <crimsun> others have it work by default
[01:44] <jdub> there's also something really weird going on between upgrades and sessions
[01:44] <jdub> crimsun: yeah
[01:44] <jdub> i do not get that one at all
[01:45] <crimsun> neither do I, but it's a significant problem for people dist-upgrading from warty
[01:45] <jdub> significant in that we can't determine why it works sometimes and doesn't other timgs ;)
[01:45] <crimsun> true
[01:56] <mdz> daniels: thanks for the update to the doc team
[01:58] <daniels> mdz: no worries.  i'll be unreachable for most of today, but public transport is a double-edged sword: it takes a bit longer, but I can work on it.  so I'll be hacking on the Debconfiscation, 'cause I think I have a pretty good idea of how to fix it for upgrades.
[01:58] <zul> mdz: i just sent an update on inotify to the kernel mailing list
[01:59] <mdz> daniels: I think we need to release preview with what we have now; there isn't time to test debconfiscation changes
[01:59] <mdz> zul: kernel-team@?
[01:59] <daniels> mdz: *nod*, those were my thoughts also
[01:59] <zul> mdz: yep
[01:59] <daniels> mdz: allows me a bit more time for testing all the possible scenarios also
[02:00] <mdz> daniels: and to triage the oodles of bug reports we'll get from preview
[02:00] <jdub> seb128: i'm tempted to link libesd.so.0 to libesd.so.1 -> your call?
[02:00] <mdz> thom: around?
[02:00] <daniels> mdz: yeah
[02:00] <seb128> jdub: urg
[02:01] <mdz> haggai: I am very excited that oo.o2 can open files with spaces in the pathname :-)
[02:01] <seb128> jdub: why libesd.so.1 ?
[02:01] <jdub> seb128: stupid proprietary software (flash)
[02:02] <daniels> mdz: ok, i'll likely be gone for the next ... realistically about 7h
[02:02] <daniels> mdz: with any luck, this should be the last of the paperwork
[02:02] <mdz> daniels: can you send me an approximate calendar for you for this week?
[02:02] <mdz> daniels: do you have an estimated date for broadband yet?
[02:02] <seb128> jdub: that's really ugly ... but there is a new esound with a soname change around ?
[02:02] <daniels> mdz: mind if I do that when I get back?  just about to run out the door to catch the last bus for the next hour now
[02:03] <daniels> mdz: when I move in + about a week or two; i'll have a better idea after today.  even while I'm on dialup, I'll be walking distance from 100MBit though, so I can burst as much as I need
[02:03] <mdz> daniels: ok, please
[02:03] <daniels> mdz: i've got my phone with me if needed
[02:03] <dholbach> seb128: i have glibmm and gnome-vfsmm ready on http://ubuntu.gplan.info/mm
[02:04] <seb128> dholbach: nice
[02:04] <jdub> seb128: strings ~/.mozilla/plugins/libflashplayer.so | grep esd
[02:04] <seb128> "No such file"
[02:04] <seb128> flash sucks :p
[02:04] <jdub> heh
[02:04] <mdz> jordi: did you realize that you have sold your soul?
[02:04] <dholbach> seb128: i'll need glibmm-2.6.0 for gtkmm-2.6.0 and gtkmm-2.6.0 for the other ones
[02:04] <jdub> $ strings ~/.mozilla/plugins/libflashplayer.so | grep libesd
[02:04] <jdub> libesd.so
[02:04] <jdub> libesd.so.1
[02:04] <jdub> it's bizarre
[02:05] <seb128> $ strings /usr/lib/mozilla-firefox/plugins/libflashplayer.so | grep esd
[02:05] <seb128> libesd.so.1
[02:05] <seb128> right :)
[02:05] <jdub> sucks so much you installed it system wide!
[02:05] <jdub> :-)
[02:05] <seb128> :p
[02:05] <seb128> remember, I'm french :)
[02:09] <zul> heh..french :)
[02:10] <Burgundavia> mdz: updates to doc team?
[02:10] <mdz> Burgundavia: x.org summary for the release notes
[02:10] <Burgundavia> mdz: ah
[02:10] <lupusBE> bleh c'est une language tres difficile pour moi :)
[02:15] <seb128> he he
[02:16] <mroth> crimsun: what should I do with the kern.log, open a new bug with it in bugzilla, or is there something else to check first?
[02:18] <crimsun> mroth: you need to compare it with output from booting the machine with the usb device plugged in
[02:20] <mroth> alright, i'll boot it again for sake of consistency, bbiaf with results
[02:27] <mroth> crimsun: hrm, interestingly enough, it appears the freeze is prior to kernel logging begins, since kern.log isnt touched from the boots where it freezes
[02:28] <crimsun> mroth: zul suggested it very well could be an irq conflict
[02:29] <mroth> wouldnt that happen independantly of the software then?  since the problem is linux specific
[02:33] <zul> is this a new install?
[02:34] <mroth> no, its been on hoary for the past 3-4 months at least
[02:35] <zul> latop/desktop?
[02:35] <mroth> desktop
[02:36] <zul> have you tried with booting pci=noacpi and the like?
[02:36] <mroth> yeah, sometimes that fixes it, but I tend to not do that since I'd rather unplug the thing before boot and still have ACPI
[02:37] <mroth> since it works fine if you plug it in post-boot
[02:37] <zul> well open up a bug and will have a look at it closer
[02:38] <mroth> kernel-package?
[02:38] <zul> linux
[02:47] <mroth> entered as bug #7258
[02:47] <zul> thanks
[02:48] <mroth> should I set target to 5.04 to indicate this is experienced in hoary?
[02:48] <zul> sure..can you include your demsg as well thanks
[02:49] <mroth> sure.. how would I obtain dmesg from an unsuccessful boot?  I assume you want one from a bad boot, not a successful one without the reader
[02:49] <zul> you can check your kern.log i believe
[02:49] <mdz> mroth: the target milestone field is used for us to catalogue which bugs need to be fixed in which stage of the release
[02:49] <mdz> mroth: please leave it untouched
[02:49] <mroth> mdz: I thought that might be what it was for, which is why I asked, heh
[02:50] <mroth> (left untouched)
[02:51] <mroth> zul: kern.log isnt being written for the bad boots, i think its freezing prior to kernel logging to disk being init'd
[02:52] <zul> hmm ok 
[02:52] <mroth> hmm.. i could probably turn off quiet mode and just take a digicam pic of the screen?
[02:54] <zul> bbl
[02:56] <mroth> is there a kernel arg for verbose logging to screen?  going to see how much info i can nab
[03:01] <zul> mroth: you could try removing quiet from your grub when you first boot
[03:01] <mroth> yeah, removing quiet doesnt seem to be quite as verbose as what normally gets put in kern.log though
[03:17] <ogra> night
[03:48] <zul> later
[03:58] <mdz> ogra: you rock
[04:01] <dholbach> mdz: he's to bed already
[04:01] <dholbach> mdz: but i'll tell him, he'll be pleased to hear :-)
[04:11] <mdz> dholbach: thanks
[04:11] <dholbach> mdz: de rien
[04:12] <mdz> dholbach: do you live near ogra?
[04:12] <mdz> I suppose not, if you're awake
[04:14] <dholbach> mdz: it's 150km to him :-)
[04:14] <dholbach> and i'm just mad to be still awake
[04:15] <mdz> apparently
[04:15] <dholbach> hehe :-)
[04:15] <dholbach> i wanted to finish the libg*mm updates
[04:15] <mjg59> I've managed to make nstx solid. Go me.
[04:16] <HrdwrBoB> daniels wanted nstx to use cnames because telstra blocked the TXT records
[04:16] <mjg59> Haha
[04:20] <dholbach> well i'm off to bed now... good night
[04:23] <mdz> dholbach: night
[06:30] <Benoni> jdub, mdz ... either of you fellows around?
[06:32] <Benoni> OK, I'll throw this out to the general crowd then.
[06:32] <Benoni> I'm working on a change to the build processes for an Ubuntu package.
[06:33] <ajmitch> what changes?
[06:33] <Benoni> Starting with "*.orig.tar.gz" and "*.diff.gz", how should I organize things so as to make it as easy as possible to build a new "*.diff.gz" file after I've made my changes?
[06:34] <Benoni> ajmitch, this is some experimental work with bug-hunting feedback instrumenation.
[06:35] <ajmitch> add a new version in the changelog, when you build the package a new .diff.gz will be built
[06:35] <ajmitch> if you wish to go that way
[06:35] <Benoni> I've been chatting with jdub, seb128, mdz, and Luis Villa about it in e-mail.
[06:36] <Benoni> ajmitch, what I don't understand is how the diff is built later.  There's the tree I've modified, but where does it look for the pristine reference tree?
[06:36] <crimsun> orig.tar.gz
[06:36] <Benoni> Oh, I see.  So the diff-building tool looks for the pristine sources right in the gzip'd tarball.  Cool.
[06:36] <Benoni> That's easy enough.
[06:37] <Benoni> Thanks, crimsun.
[06:40] <jdub> yo Benoni 
[06:41] <Benoni> Hey, jdub!
[06:41] <Benoni> As you can see, your colleagues are keeping my questions nice and answered.
[06:42] <jdub> :-)
[06:42] <Benoni> Quck status update:
[06:43] <Benoni> I've got reasonable ".deb" packages being built for my instrumentor and the various supporting tools.
[06:43] <Benoni> The instrumenting compiler seems to be working just fine, no changes required at all.
[06:44] <Benoni> Now I'm looking at what it takes to CBI'ify a sample application.  Rhythmbox is my chosen test subject.
[06:44] <Benoni> I expect I'll end up with a couple of "dh_*" helper commands that one tosses into the "debian/rules" file in appropriate places.
[06:44] <Benoni> That should cover most of what's needed beyond just switching compilers.
[06:45] <jdub> hrm, what kind of stuff?
[06:45] <Benoni> As I noted in an earlier e-mail message, there are a few assorted other things to do, e.g.:
[06:45] <Benoni> install an extra GConf spec file
[06:46] <Benoni> move actual binaries out of /usr/bin and replace them with wrapper scripts that call the real binaries stored elsewhere
[06:46] <jdub> a new schema file per package?
[06:46] <Benoni> Yeah.
[06:46] <Benoni> "GConf spec file" should have been "GConf schema file"
[06:46] <jdub> we could do those on the buildd
[06:46] <Benoni> What's "the buildd"?
[06:47] <jdub> the machines that build everything :-)
[06:47] <Benoni> Ah.
[06:47] <Benoni> So I guess my question for you is how should I codify the changes that are required when building a CBI-instrumented package?
[06:48] <Benoni> I was assuming it would be codified as changes to "debian/rules" and perhaps a few extra files also under "debian".
[06:48] <Benoni> But perhaps that's not the most useful form.
[06:48] <jdub> doing it in one package and documenting your changes is good
[06:49] <Benoni> OK.
[06:49] <jdub> so if we decide to do it for a large selection of packages, we can fiddle with the buildd
[06:50] <Benoni> To whatever extent I can, I'll try to encapsulate the changes in scripts that figure things out by themselves.
[06:50] <Benoni> For the most part, those scripts already exist and are used when building instrumened RPMs.
[06:55] <Benoni> Ack, late-night high-priority support request from a colleague in an inconvenient time zone.  I'll have to pick this discussion up later.
[07:12] <whiprush> man, those web design entries are awesome.
[07:39] <fabbione> hey
[07:45] <crimsun> wb fabbione!
[07:45] <fabbione> hey crimsun 
[07:45] <crimsun> things going well?
[07:46] <fabbione> crimsun: well first day at work after honeymoon... you decide :)
[07:46] <opi> fabbione: sounds nasty :)
[07:46] <crimsun> :-)
[07:46] <opi> fabbione: one hint: don't read mails or/and see what's on voicemail :P
[07:47] <fabbione> opi: ahha
[08:12] <fabbione> hey pitti
[08:12] <pitti> Morning
[08:13] <pitti> Hi fabbione, welcome back!!!
[08:13] <fabbione> thanks dude
[08:13] <pitti> fabbione: did you have a nice honeymoon?
[08:14] <fabbione> yeah it was cool
[08:14] <pitti> or, rather, warm? :-)
[08:14] <fabbione> heheh that too :-)
[08:15] <daniels> fabio!
[08:15] <fabbione> hey kid!
[08:15] <daniels> ciao bella!  how was your honeymoon?
[08:15] <fabbione> it was great fun
[08:16] <fabbione> i am gonna put pics online later today
[08:16] <fabbione> me with galapagos penguins :-)
[08:16] <daniels> heheh
[08:16] <daniels> fantastic!
[08:16] <daniels> i gotta go help mum with food now, back a bit later
[08:16] <fabbione> sure later
[08:24] <Micksa> why would gnome-panel and nautilus segv on startup, from a clean account?
[08:24] <Micksa> in hoary
[08:25] <Benoni> In a "debian/control" file, can one use backslashes to break up long Build-Depends lists over several lines?
[08:27] <elmo> no
[08:27] <fabbione> Benoni: nope.. it has to be on one line
[08:27] <fabbione> hey elmo!
[08:27] <Micksa> I think my problem might be due to missing packages but I wouldn't know which ones I need
[08:27] <elmo> hey fabbione - have a good time?
[08:27] <fabbione> elmo: i need to send you a pic that you must put on galapagos in the dc :-)
[08:27] <Micksa> besides "gnome-panel" :)
[08:27] <fabbione> elmo: oh yeah.. it was great
[08:28] <Benoni> OK fabbione, thanks for the info.  Too bad it wasn't what I was hoping to hear.  ;-)
[08:28] <fabbione> np
[08:38] <dholbach> good morning
[08:40] <T-None> hey fabbione! Welcome back aboard! :)
[08:41] <fabbione> ok
[08:44] <abelli> fabbione: ciao.
[08:44] <fabbione> ciao
[08:59] <daniels> can you guys please grab http://people.ubuntu.com/~daniels/pcibustype.c, compile it (with -DDEBUG if you want), and point it at your video card, and let me know if it works out pci/agp/pcie correctly?
[09:00] <daniels> to find out your video card's PCI ID, run lspci -X | grep 'VGA compatible controller' | cut -f1 -d' '
[09:00] <daniels> e.g. sudo ./pcibustype $(lspci -X | grep 'VGA Compatible controller' | cut -f1 -d' ')
[09:00] <fabbione> daniels: remind me in a few minutes :-)
[09:00] <daniels> er, sorry
[09:00] <daniels> e.g. sudo ./pcibustype $(lspci -X | grep 'VGA compatible controller' | cut -f1 -d' ')
[09:00] <daniels> fabbione: sure :)
[09:00] <pitti> daniels: 
[09:01] <pitti> $ ./a.out PCI:1:0:0
[09:01] <pitti> failed reading from offset %
[09:01] <pitti> couldn't read capability
[09:01] <daniels> pitti: sweet!
[09:01] <daniels> that's on powerpc, yeah?
[09:01] <pitti> daniels: no, i386
[09:01] <daniels> really?
[09:01] <jdub> $ sudo ./pcibustype PCI:0:2:0 pci
[09:01] <crimsun> fails here, too. i686.
[09:01] <daniels> pitti: could you please build with -DDEBUG and /msg me the output?
[09:02] <jdub> run it with sudo
[09:02] <daniels> er yeah, sudo is important :)
[09:02] <jdub> $ ./pcibustype PCI:0:2:0
[09:02] <jdub> failed reading from offset %
[09:02] <jdub> couldn't read capability
[09:02] <pitti> daniels: oops, forgot sudo
[09:02] <jdub> :-)
[09:02] <daniels> only root can read the PCI caps
[09:02] <pitti> daniels: on i386: "agp"
[09:02] <daniels> pitti: is that right? :)
[09:02] <pitti> daniels: yes, that's right
[09:02] <crimsun> for me: "agp". That is correct.
[09:02] <daniels> pitti: for bonus points, could you please try on powerpc?
[09:02] <pitti> daniels: on my iBook G4: "pci" (without sudo)
[09:03] <daniels> pitti: hmm.  is it an agp card, d'you know?
[09:03] <pitti> daniels: with sudo: "agp" too
[09:03] <jdub> pci on my laptop, agp on my desktop
[09:03] <pitti> daniels: err, "pci", too
[09:03] <daniels> pitti: ah right
[09:03] <daniels> er, hm
[09:03] <pitti> daniels: actually this should be agp, too...
[09:03] <daniels> pitti: if you run sudo lspci -v -v -v, is it listed as having AGP in the capabilities section?
[09:03] <pitti> daniels: but I'm not sure
[09:03] <pitti> okay
[09:03] <daniels> turns out that the one in my laptop is PCI as well; may be something to do with an integrated bridge?  who knows
[09:04] <pitti> daniels: Capabilities: [58]  AGP version 2.0
[09:04] <daniels> d'oh
[09:04] <pitti> daniels: DEBUG then?
[09:04] <jordi> mdz: hmm? because of evolution? :)
[09:04] <daniels> could you please build with -DDEBUG and send me the full output in /msg?
[09:04] <daniels> yeah
[09:04] <jordi> mdz: I'm worried, yes. :)
[09:05] <jdub> daniels: all fine here, my laptop doesn't seem to have agp
[09:06] <fabbione> daniels:
[09:06] <fabbione>    * Use "Dev Phys" and USB device IDs in xorg.conf, instead of relying on the
[09:06] <fabbione>      hotplug handlers to set up /dev/multiuser.
[09:06] <fabbione> this is wrong :-)
[09:06] <daniels> fabbione: bah
[09:06] <daniels> fabbione: hotplug never cauthg PS/2, for one
[09:07] <fabbione> it does
[09:07] <fabbione> it takes longer due to the nature of the bus
[09:07] <daniels> hmm.  well, on my system and on gus's too, we just never got it
[09:07] <daniels> even after sleeping for 10 seconds
[09:07] <fabbione> it was working here
[09:07] <daniels> so we were losing a lot of input ... that was just my quick fix
[09:07] <daniels> hm.  well if we can fix it that would be great, but that was just what I had to do to get it working for both of us
[09:07] <daniels> jdub: cool
[09:07] <fabbione> the reason why you should not use Dev Phys in xorg.conf is because you bind 2 config files even more
[09:07] <fabbione> if the admin wants to move a keyboard from one hub to another
[09:08] <fabbione> it needs to change config in 2 places
[09:08] <fabbione> and restart all of X
[09:08] <fabbione> for all the 4 heads
[09:08] <fabbione> with the other solution is one change and one kill -USR2
[09:11] <fabbione> that was the all reason of updating the evdev patch to allow path to /dev
[09:19] <daniels> well, we have multiseat-configurator now
[09:19] <daniels> so theoretically you update multiseat.conf and re-run m-c
[09:19] <fabbione> did you update the code in hotplug to kill the proper server?
[09:20] <daniels> but yeah ... if we can get the hotplug stuff fixed (lots of devices just weren't registering for me -- i missed one usb mouse and one ps/2; gus was missing the ps/2 and two usb, iirc), i'm happy to keep using that :)
[09:20] <daniels> nope
[09:20] <fabbione> on my test install with 0.4 only the ps2 was NOT detected
[09:20] <fabbione> but i figured that there was something else wrong
[09:20] <fabbione> and it wasn't a multiseat error
[09:21] <fabbione> i think the entry in /proc/bus/input/devices is created only after the first ps2 bytes are received on the bus
[09:21] <daniels> oh
[09:21] <daniels> that's shit
[09:21] <fabbione> becuase strangely enough it was always the last entry in that list
[09:21] <fabbione> but had no time to dig more into it
[09:21] <fabbione> galapagos were waiting for me :-)
[09:23] <daniels> heh, yeah :) fair enough, too
[09:24] <daniels> fabbione: pcibustype.c at least solves the 'which card is AGP?' problem
[09:24] <daniels> stupid VGA routing :\
[09:24] <fabbione> what problem is that?
[09:25] <daniels> you HAVE to bring up the primary card (i.e. the one taking VGA interrupts) last
[09:25] <daniels> else your machine will hang solid
[09:26] <fabbione> uh?
[09:26] <daniels> i wasn't seeing this problem because the agp card in my machine was listed last in lspci
[09:26] <fabbione> i always init AGP as first in my setup
[09:26] <fabbione> and it works fine
[09:26] <daniels> so if you look in multiseat-configurator, we make sure the agp card comes last, since that's generally the primary
[09:26] <daniels> weird -- could be a revision-specific thing with gus's setup?
[09:26] <fabbione> weird
[09:26] <daniels> but it was definitely hanging until we did that
[09:26] <fabbione> hmmm
[09:26] <daniels> which was a 'what the hell, trying this can't hurt' thing at 5am
[09:27] <fabbione> now.. i remember the old multiseat setup from that was doing that
[09:27] <fabbione> init the agp as last
[09:27] <daniels> yeah
[09:27] <fabbione> but i never had that problem with our setup
[09:30] <daniels> might be a motherboard thing
[09:30] <daniels> or even a bios rev thing
[09:30] <fabbione> yup
[09:31] <daniels> vga routing is a tricky beast
[09:31] <daniels> there are lots of good things about vga.  and so, so many bad things.
[09:35] <pitti> Hi mvo
[09:35] <mvo> hi pitti 
[09:36] <froud> mvo
[09:36] <froud> do you read your memoserv
[09:36] <daniels> pitti: it's OK thanks, I can throw a PCI card in my amd64 here
[09:36] <pitti> daniels: ok
[09:36] <daniels> thanks for the testing though
[09:36] <pitti> you're welcome
[09:37] <dholbach> hellas mvo 
[09:38] <froud> mvo: I have a draft of the update-manager manual ready, but no access to svn, so can't get it to you. Also have questions.
[09:38] <mvo> hi froud, hi dholbach, morning all
[09:39] <mvo> froud: I don't read my memos, didn't knew that I have any :)
[09:39] <froud> :-)
[09:39] <froud> ok'
[09:39] <froud> how can I get this stuff over to you
[09:40] <mvo> froud: just send it via mail to me, that's savest
[09:40] <mvo> froud: I'll try to talk to mithario about your account again
[09:58] <daniels> lamont: ping
[10:05] <pitti> Morning carlos
[10:06] <carlos> pitti: morning
[10:08] <fabbione> ola carlos
[10:08] <carlos> fabbione: hey!
[10:08] <carlos> fabbione: welcome
[10:09] <carlos> fabbione: how was your trip?
[10:09] <fabbione> it was great
[10:09] <fabbione> lot of fun
[10:09] <carlos> cool
[10:10] <mvo> fabbione: hey! welcome back!
[10:10] <fabbione> hey mvo!
[10:14] <carlos_> fabbione: dude, jordi does not remembered that he was your AM!!
[10:15] <fabbione> ehhehe
[10:15] <daniels> ah, back when fabio was a little nm :)
[10:18] <fabbione> that's because, as any good padowa, i overtook his place of jedimaster
[10:20] <carlos> (jordi) that's bullshit dude :)
[10:21] <carlos> jordi is without network atm
[10:29] <mvo> ping doko
[10:39] <Kamion> hey fabbione, welcome back
[10:39] <abelli> Kamion: is there any netinst in ubuntu?
[10:39] <Kamion> abelli: no
[10:40] <abelli> Kamion: thx
[10:40] <fabbione> hey Kamion! thanks
[10:40] <fabbione> Kamion: how is the overall situation?
[10:41] <Kamion> with regard to what? :)
[10:41] <fabbione> everything? :)
[10:42] <Kamion> looking pretty good for hoary preview
[10:42] <fabbione> cool
[10:43] <fabbione> ok mails are done.. time to start upgrading some machines
[10:43] <Kamion> if you mean personally, all well :) still deep in wedding planning, we have a meeting with caterers today
[10:43] <fabbione> 17K mails -> trash
[10:43] <fabbione> Kamion: thanks god i am over it
[10:43] <abelli> ehehe
[10:43] <fabbione> Kamion: but you are going to have a lot of fun with planning
[10:45] <Kamion> yeah, I know :)
[10:46] <dholbach> hi dredg 
[10:47] <dholbach> what do i do wrong, when i get    dbus_bindings.DBusException: Connection ":1.7" is not allowed to add more match rules (increase limits in configuration file if required)    when i start hal-device-manager?
[10:49] <mvo> dholbach: you have it too?
[10:49] <mvo> I got a bug assigned about that problem
[10:49] <mvo> dholbach: don't touch your system, I want to know what it is!
[10:49] <Treenaks> h-d-m DOES set a lot of match ruls..
[10:49] <Treenaks> +e
[10:50] <dholbach> mvo: i'll set up some black tea, when will you be here?
[10:50] <dholbach> mvo: :-)
[10:52] <doko> pong: mvo
[10:53] <mvo> doko: you have mail :)
[11:04] <fabbione> hey seb!
[11:05] <daniels> yo seb
[11:05] <seb128> morning
[11:05] <pitti> Hi seb128 
[11:06] <mirak> why does ubuntu ppc on macintosh tries to install quik boot loader instead of Yaboot ?
[11:06] <mirak> how can I change this default
[11:06] <seb128> hi fabbione daniels pitti :)
[11:13] <Kamion> mirak: what kind of Mac?
[11:19] <dholbach> hai seb128 
[11:20] <Kamion> mirak: also what does 'archdetect' say if you run it on tty2?
[11:20] <dholbach> seb128: gtkmm and gnomeuimm are up, at http://ubuntu.gplan.info/mm/, libglademm has to wait for gtkmm
[11:24] <jdub> pitti: ?
[11:24] <pitti> jdub: still debugging the assertion failure on ppc
[11:24] <jdub> pitti: golly.
[11:24] <pitti> jdub: it tries to play a 682 byte block with 16 Bit/stereo
[11:25] <pitti> jdub: which has a frame size of 4 bytes, and 682 % 4 != 0
[11:25] <pitti> jdub: I think it forgets to update the block size on mono->stereo remixing
[11:25] <pitti> jdub: because the original mono sample is 682 bytes, too
[11:25] <pitti> jdub: or that is not #bytes, but #frames
[11:26] <pitti> jdub: but the source code is so spaghetti-like, it is hard to grok it
[11:29] <abelli> cat vmlinuz > /dev/audio
[11:31] <jdub> pitti: the kind of code that would appeal to a kernel hacker? :)
[11:31] <pitti> jdub: no, totally different :-)
[11:31] <jdub> heh
[11:31] <pitti> jdub: lots of void*, lots of asynchronous code
[11:31] <pitti> jdub: event-based
[11:32] <jdub> aha
[11:32] <pitti> jdub: and, of course, without useful comments :-(
[11:32] <daniels> everyone loves void pointers
[11:32] <pitti> yeah, they are so easy to debug
[11:34] <jdub> ;-)
[11:34] <jdub> pitti: lennart would love your feedback, he's been really response (at least until he went to egypt)
[11:34] <jdub> responsive
[11:35] <pitti> jdub: does he know about this bug already?
[11:35] <jdub> pitti: yes, but hasn't been around much at all
[11:35] <jdub> pitti: he came back from egypt, mailed once, but radio silence since then
[11:36] <pitti> :-(
[11:36] <jdub> pitti: have you looked at polyp svn?
[11:36] <pitti> fears our bashing :-)
[11:36] <pitti> jdub: no, just the current package
[11:36] <mvo> daniels: can you please have a quick look over #7188 (dbus) and tell me if my proposed solution sounds about right
[11:36] <Keybuk> meh :-/  so it wasn't just laptop I was using last time
[11:36] <Keybuk> something about my home network and Mark's NAT are not friends
[11:36] <ajmitch> pitti: seen the pax breakage on bugtraq?
[11:37] <jdub> Keybuk: you're in his mac list?
[11:37] <daniels> jdub: he doesn't have one
[11:37] <daniels> Keybuk: pic seems to ditch ssh keepalives, among others
[11:37] <daniels> er, pix
[11:38] <daniels> mvo: sounds fine to me, feel free to upload
[11:38] <mvo> daniels: thanks
[11:38] <pitti> jdub: just looked at the svn, last commit is 2 months ago
[11:39] <Keybuk> jdub: no, last time going directly through his pix rather than through hagrid solved it
[11:40] <pitti> ajmitch: yes, I saw it
[11:41] <pitti> ajmitch: I have to update my -hardened kernel
[11:41] <pitti> ajmitch: but I still have high-priority stuff to do before this
[11:41] <ajmitch> yes, that's why I was asking ,not that I've used them :)
[11:41] <pitti> ajmitch: however, was a pretty big shock :-(
[11:41] <ajmitch> yeah, I was surprised
[11:51] <pitti> coool
[11:51] <lifeless> __keybuk: tell mark to do the reconfiguration I've prepped
[11:51] <lifeless> __keybuk: it may help
[11:51] <pitti> I was so often asked about a web-based package info interface for Ubuntu...
[11:51] <lifeless> the ssh keepalive thing will be the pix's short session lifetime counter
[11:51] <lifeless> (the first thing I do to any pix is ratchet that way up
[11:52] <daniels> my first step usually involves setting fire to it
[11:52] <__keybuk> lifeless: *shrug* going directly to the pix works fine (as now)
[11:54] <robtaylor_> jdub: there?
[11:54] <jdub> yeah
[11:55] <robtaylor_> jdub: ah, cool. backlog telle me you were chatting with seb about the polypaudio lag issue..
[11:55] <mirak> Kamion: a mac G3, so not an oldworld
[11:55] <robtaylor_> jdub: i get a second of lag atm =)
[11:56] <mirak> Kamion: archdetect command not found
[11:56] <mirak> Kamion: that's a debian I switched to ubuntu
[11:56] <robtaylor_> jdub: i was chatting with the gstreamer guys and they pointed at esdsink not haveing delay reporting as a possible reason..
[11:57] <robtaylor_> jdub: that might also explain the varying lags you've seen
[11:57] <jdub> robtaylor_: yeah, that affects everything though
[11:57] <Kamion> mirak: archdetect> I mean while the installer is still running
[11:57] <jdub> robtaylor_: but both esound and polypaudio lag with other tools (xine)
[11:57] <mirak> Kamion: I don't know, I didn't installed ubuntu
[11:57] <mirak> I upgraded from debian
[11:57] <robtaylor_> jdub: so so we know what conetxt the lags are appearing?
[11:57] <Kamion> mirak: oh, what exactly are you talking about then?
[11:58] <mirak> on debian it was using yaboot
[11:58] <Kamion> 10:06 < mirak> why does ubuntu ppc on macintosh tries to install quik boot loader instead of Yaboot ?
[11:58] <robtaylor_> i've only tested with mpegs locally .
[11:58] <mirak> I also have debian on an oldworld and it runs quik
[11:58] <Kamion> while doing what?
[11:58] <mirak> Kamion: a dist-upgrade
[11:58] <mirak> upgrade of the kernel image
[11:58] <jdub> robtaylor_: polyp improves on esound, but it's not perfect yet
[11:58] <Kamion> *that's* the information I was looking for
[11:58] <mirak> Kamion: I though it was obvious :)
[11:58] <Kamion> no, it was not
[11:59] <Kamion> ok, I'll have a look at it
[11:59] <robtaylor_> jdub: well its does improve in a number of ways, but a second lag on playing video is something terrible
[11:59] <jdub> robtaylor_: you'll get worse out of esound
[11:59] <lunitik> jdub: I still think at the least, we need a tool like Red Hat's s-c-sound or whatever... too many people have sound issues! 
[11:59] <robtaylor_> jdub: i'm not here as a user dude =)
[11:59] <jdub> seb128: (yikes - woooosh!)
[11:59] <seb128> :)
[12:00] <robtaylor_> jdub: what i want to know is if there enough known to attack the problem
[12:01] <jdub> robtaylor_: sure, but you'd be wanting to speak to the gstreamer guys and lennart for polyp
[12:01] <jdub> robtaylor_: another option is fixing the gst-polyp src/sink
[12:01] <jdub> (possibly more useful than fixing esdsink)
[12:02] <robtaylor_> jdub: might do that.. i have to learn about the sync stuff anyway for my rtp plugin =)
[12:03] <jdub> (you know, it would be a kinda neat hack to use rtp for network audio)
[12:03] <robtaylor_> jdub: i know, that was the otehr thing iw as going to chatr you about..
[12:03] <Mithrandir> jdub: seems flumotion doesn't have any amd64 love; gst falls over and dies.
[12:03] <jdub> Mithrandir: ooh, really?
[12:03] <sivang> Hello everybody
[12:03] <jdub> Mithrandir: doing something simple?
[12:03] <pitti> Hi sivang
[12:04] <sivang> hey pitti  :)
[12:04] <Mithrandir> jdub: starting the director, a worker and the admin interface.
[12:04] <robtaylor_> jdub: i've been thinking for a while that it would be neat to use jackd with the jackd-asyn sink, and use rtp for remote stuff ( again going to a locally running jackd with jackd-asyn at the end)
[12:04] <seb128> jdub: about g-a-i/desktop files ?
[12:05] <jdub> Date: Mon,  7 Mar 2005 04:56:46 -0500 (EST)
[12:05] <jdub> ^ gnome-games on f-r-l
[12:05] <jdub> Date: Mon,  7 Mar 2005 11:24:52 +0100
[12:05] <robtaylor_> jdub: and pro guys can stick run the security hole, but it wound't necessarily be needed for normal users ;)
[12:05] <jdub> ^ gnome-games on hoary-changes
[12:05] <haggai> Mithrandir: any idea about #6762?  The crash is in pango
[12:05] <jdub> ;-)
[12:05] <jdub> seb128: been working on it today
[12:05] <haggai> Mithrandir: could it perhaps be fixed already?  I remember you doing something to pango
[12:06] <jdub> Mithrandir: so you're not actually running a flow?
[12:07] <Mithrandir> jdub: before I even get to that.
[12:07] <Mithrandir> jdub: seems like the video test source is crashing, actually.
[12:07] <Mithrandir> haggai: oopadmin/spadmin probably isn't wrapped in my glorious pango hack
[12:08] <haggai> Mithrandir: ah right
[12:08] <Mithrandir> haggai: that's my first guess at least.
[12:08] <haggai> Mithrandir: sounds like a good guess
[12:09] <Mithrandir> haggai: you want me to look at it post-preview?
[12:10] <haggai> Mithrandir: yes please if you could, I don't have a machine here.  How complicated is your pango hack?  An alternative would be to disable the gtk frontend for padmin, would be a simple envvar export in the script
[12:11] <Mithrandir> haggai: it's a LD_PRELOAD
[12:12] <haggai> Mithrandir: ah so similar effort
[12:12] <sivang> gtk-gnutella is still b0rked right?
[12:13] <sivang> (I just checked and I see it's missing the binary)
[12:13] <crimsun> sivang: yes, I'm building & signing a new upload
[12:13] <sivang> crimsun: yay!
[12:14] <sivang> crimsun: what was the problem preventing clean build of the binary?
[12:15] <crimsun> sivang: gtk-gnutella source included its own progress bar cell renderer which conflicts with GTK+-2.6's
[12:15] <sivang> crimsun: ah, figures.
[12:15] <crimsun> sivang: I took the opportunity to also grab a fix for a possible NULL pointer deref
[12:15] <sivang> crimsun: superb!
[12:20] <dholbach> seb128: got the message on gtkmm and gnomeuimm? don't want to bother you... just make sure :-)
[12:21] <ogra> fabbione is back !!
[12:21] <ogra> morning everybody
[12:21] <trukulo> hi oliver
[12:21] <seb128> dholbach: nop
[12:21] <fabbione> ogra: no you are only dreaming
 seb128: gtkmm and gnomeuimm are up, at http://ubuntu.gplan.info/mm/, libglademm has to wait for gtkmm
[12:22] <seb128> dholbach: where ?
[12:22] <seb128> dholbach: k, thanks
[12:22] <ogra> heh, dreaming of fabbione 
[12:22] <trukulo> fabbione, what about your wedding?
[12:22] <fabbione> trukulo: what about it?
[12:22] <trukulo> fabbione, are you a married man now?
[12:22] <fabbione> it was cool and cold :-)
[12:22] <trukulo> lol
[12:22] <fabbione> getting married in a snow storm wasn't 100% fun
[12:22] <Mithrandir> fabbione: where were you?
[12:23] <trukulo> fabbione, you should be nude to be 100% fun
[12:23] <ogra> but something you can tell your  kids about
[12:23] <fabbione> Mithrandir: copenhagen
[12:23] <trukulo> ogra, i see graveman 0.3.8 from sid is in hoary, good work
[12:24] <Mithrandir> fabbione: on the honeymoon? :)
[12:24] <fabbione> http://www.fabbione.net/wedding/IMG_0854.html
[12:24] <ogra> trukulo: i have added a cdrdao dependency.... 
[12:24] <fabbione> Mithrandir: ecuador and galapagos
[12:24] <ogra> trukulo: else, thanks for the good upstream work ;)
[12:24] <Mithrandir> fabbione: oooh, sounds nice. :)
[12:24] <trukulo> ogra, good point, i'll tell otavio
[12:24] <fabbione> Mithrandir: it was :-)
[12:24] <fabbione> Mithrandir: galapagos > *
[12:25] <Mithrandir> fabbione: got loads of pics?
[12:25] <sivang> fabbione ! Welcome Back :)
[12:25] <fabbione> Mithrandir: 2Gb of digital + 10 x 36 films + 2 x 28(?) underwater pics
[12:25] <Riddell> elmo: could you look at the kdebase compile when you have time?
[12:25] <trukulo> fabbione, you seem a funny penguin dreesed like that
[12:25] <Mithrandir> fabbione: nicey. :)
[12:25] <trukulo> it's kinda geek, heh
[12:25] <fabbione> trukulo: i looked like one.. yeah :-)
[12:26] <fabbione> Mithrandir: i am trying to complete the sync of my mirrors before putting them online.. something hanged badly a while ago
[12:28] <trukulo> fabbione, then, now you are back with us again... i have a weird question for you
[12:28] <fabbione> i am back
[12:28] <fabbione> from this morning
[12:28] <fabbione> but for weird questions.. hmmm 
[12:28] <fabbione> gimme 2 minutes :-)
[12:28] <trukulo> can you blow yourself?
[12:28] <fabbione> mother nature is calling
[12:28] <trukulo> ups, that's not for you
[12:29] <trukulo> i'll wait
[12:29] <trukulo> :)
[12:29] <fabbione> no i can't blow myself :-)
[12:29] <trukulo> fabbione, you've tried then...
[12:30] <Kamion> Riddell: elmo won't be around most of today
[12:30] <Riddell> Kamion: humph
[12:33] <fabbione> trukulo: ehhee
[12:33] <fabbione> ok so what's the weird question?
[12:33] <trukulo> well, i have an ati igp 320m
[12:33] <fabbione> -> daniels
[12:33] <trukulo> good answer
[12:34] <sivang> fabbione: you have turtule photos? ;-)
[12:34] <fabbione> sivang: hey.. yes
[12:34] <trukulo> fabbione, but you was X dev
[12:34] <fabbione> both land and sea turtles
[12:34] <fabbione> trukulo: i am out of X since we met in Mataro...
[12:34] <trukulo> it's a question about dri enabled in livecd, and not in hoary installed
[12:35] <trukulo> uf, lot of time then, ok, ask daniels
[12:35] <fabbione> trukulo: that could depend on dri modules loaded properly or not
[12:35] <trukulo> fabbione, i assure you i've read a LOT
[12:35] <fabbione> be sure that the kernel modules are loaded properly
[12:35] <trukulo> and have proper modules loaded
[12:35] <trukulo> drm, ati_igp, agpgart,radeon and dependant modules
[12:36] <daniels> trukulo: i don't think dri works on the 320
[12:36] <trukulo> strange is, glxinfo say DRI=yes in livecd, and not in hoary installed
[12:36] <daniels> really?  that is weird
[12:36] <daniels> not installing fglrx or nvidia or anything else strange?
[12:36] <fabbione> check the diff between lsmod and xorg.conf in both livecd and installed version
[12:36] <trukulo> daniels, in livecd i swear you it said to me : yes
[12:36] <trukulo> i'm aware about 3d problem with 320m
[12:36] <trukulo> no, livecd as is
[12:37] <trukulo> fabbione, same one
[12:37] <trukulo> and i use same xorg.conf than in livecd
[12:37] <fabbione> kernel version is the same?
[12:37] <trukulo> i'm completely lost
[12:37] <trukulo> fabbione, no, kernel is different
[12:37] <fabbione> well you got your answer :-)
[12:37] <trukulo> 2.4.9 in livecd, and 2.4.10-k7 in installed
[12:37] <trukulo> yes, but why? modules are the same, isn't it?
[12:37] <fabbione> no
[12:38] <fabbione> try a more recent livecd
[12:38] <trukulo> and igp320m it's not supossed to have 3D
[12:38] <fabbione> 2.6.9 is obsoleted
[12:38] <trukulo> fabbione, 2.6.9 works
[12:38] <trukulo> in fact, it's 2.4.10-4-k7 that doesn't work
[12:38] <trukulo> i said, it's very weird
[12:39] <trukulo> could be dri enabled different in 2.4.9 than in 2.4.10 ?
[12:39] <fabbione> yes
[12:39] <fabbione> they are
[12:39] <trukulo> then that's it
[12:39] <trukulo> in 2.4.9 glxinfo reports dri enabled, and with 2.4.10 not
[12:40] <fabbione> archives hates me
[12:40] <trukulo> fabbione, i understand that poor archives
[12:41] <trukulo> well, doesn't matter, just wanna know what's that
[12:41] <trukulo> see you in 10 mins
[12:44] <HiddenWolf> woohoo, 2.10 packages! :)
[12:45] <daniels> trukthat's really weird ... 
[12:49] <abelli> sladen: uml, or vserver?
[01:03] <lunitik> Wasn't there one once upon a time?
[01:03] <Kamion> sepArator :-0
[01:03] <Kamion> :-)
[01:04] <lunitik> Would make it so much easier to visually organize my panels  :(
[01:04] <lunitik> Kamion: gah... thats why I don't major in English  :P
[01:10] <pitti> jdub: ping
[01:10] <jdub> pong
[01:10] <pitti> jdub: still no luck with polypaudio
[01:10] <pitti> jdub: do you think it would hurt us much to default to oss sink, at least on ppc?
[01:11] <jdub> pitti: mdz and i were talking about reverting to esound for hoary, which i'm happy with
[01:11] <jdub> pitti: if you're not getting any love with that change, that's the last nail in the coffin
[01:11] <pitti> jdub: it works fine with oss
[01:11] <jdub> yeah
[01:11] <jdub> i know
[01:12] <jdub> but cumulatively, we're better off reverting
[01:12] <pitti> jdub: I'm just not sure whether it makes sense for me to spend hours and hours on it
[01:12] <jdub> stop now :-)
[01:12] <jdub> before we lose you in the spaghetti :)
[01:12] <pitti> I still have one trace, I think I give myself another half an hour
[01:12] <pitti> okay=
[01:12] <jdub> heh
[01:12] <pitti> okay?
[01:12] <jdub> sure
[01:13] <sivang> spaghetti ? somebody said spaghetti? boy, /me is hungry
[01:13] <pitti> sivang: go eat some asynchronous polypaudio code :-)
[01:13] <jdub> whoa, language pack a-go-go
[01:14] <Keybuk> heeeere's johnny!
[01:15] <sivang> pitti:  :)))
[01:19] <Burgundavia> jdub: might this fun with polypaudio be the reason that muine is currently borked on my machine?
[01:21] <dholbach> bbl
[01:21] <jdub> Burgundavia: depends on your configuration and what the b0rkage is
[01:23] <Burgundavia> jdub: hmm. Well muine starts but simply doesn't play and rhythmbox throws up an error about alsa device is use, and I assume those are connected. I just did a search of bugzilla, but didn't see anything
[01:23] <jdub> run gstreamer-properties, see what gstreamer is configured to use
[01:24] <Burgundavia> alsa
[01:24] <Burgundavia> hmm, changed to esd and it worked
[01:25] <Burgundavia> got that for Oss and Alsa - Failed to construct test pipeline for 'OSS - Open Sound System
[01:27] <jdub> esd is the correct configuration if you're using polypaudio
[01:27] <jdub> (and it is the default)
[01:27] <Burgundavia> ah
[01:27] <Burgundavia> I had some issues with that several months ago, and that is why it was changed
[01:28] <Burgundavia> however, I am a little confused. Is there an easy place I can start reading about Alsa/Esd/etc. and where all the pieces fit?
[01:32] <jdub> hrm, don't think so
[01:32] <Goshawk> is there someone interested to try a alpha package of an "usermode splash" booting process?
[01:33] <Burgundavia> jdub: right I shall dig. Thanks for the quick help
[01:33] <jdub> i can give you a quick run down
[01:33] <jdub> alsa is the kernel interface to the sound hardware
[01:33] <jdub> libasound is the alsa user level libraries, used to access the kernel interface
[01:34] <jdub> esd is a userspace daemon run as the user that mixes audio, does sample caching, and network audio
[01:34] <Treenaks> it's mostly used for the mixing and sample-caching parts though
[01:34] <jdub> gstreamer is a multimedia framework that includes sinks (output plugins) for alsa, esd, etc.
[01:35] <jdub> polypaudio is a less neanderthal replacement for esd (but early stage)
[01:35] <jdub> oss is the old kernel audio interface
[01:36] <jdub> anything else you missed?
[01:36] <robtaylor_> jdub: remind me again why we decided alsa dmix as a bad idea? ;)
[01:36] <Burgundavia> so apps talk to gst --> esd/polpy --> alsa/oss ?
[01:36] <ogra> or gst -->  alsa/oss
[01:36] <jdub> robtaylor_: because it's unreliable, doesn't handle network audio, is a pita to configure, etc.
[01:37] <jdub> Burgundavia: by default in warty, apps that use gstreamer talk to esd -> oss
[01:37] <jdub> Burgundavia: in hoary, we were hoping for that to be polyp -> alsa
[01:37] <robtaylor_> jdub: heh, well i think its back to it on my system rather than suffer esound again =)
[01:38] <ogra> Burgundavia: but without a mixing component like esd ppaudio between gst and alsa/oss you are only able to play one sound at a time
[01:38] <jdub> unless your audio hardware support multiple writers
[01:38] <jdub> (which is not the case on any of my new hardware)
[01:39] <ogra> Burgundavia: thats why you get the error in RB if esd/ppaudio is running in the background 
[01:39] <jdub> (and the primary reason why i didn't give a crap about any of this when i had an sb live)
[01:39] <robtaylor_> jdub: seems ok on centrino chipset =)
[01:40] <jdub> the 810 audio chip doesn't support multiple writers
[01:40] <jdub> that's why you're using dmix
[01:41] <Burgundavia> I see why they say audio on linux is a mess
[01:42] <HiddenWolf> Burgundavia: more things than just audio are a mess. One of the disadvantages of not having strict corporate control.
[01:42] <robtaylor_> jdub: ah, misread above text =)
[01:43] <jdub> don't assume windows is much better
[01:44] <Burgundavia> so the perfect world is gst with ppaudio and alsa?
[01:44] <Burgundavia> is that doable in hoary+1?
[01:44] <HiddenWolf> jdub: windows is smoother to work on, linux is safer/more reliable 
[01:44] <dredg> all bets are off when it comes to i8xx, be that sound or video :)
[01:45] <crimsun_> Burgundavia, ideally we wouldn't need anything like esound, polypaudio, or their ilk
[01:45] <jdub> HiddenWolf: i'm referring to your audio comment.
[01:45] <crimsun_> Burgundavia, it'd be nice if alsa-lib's dmix were fully up to snuff, but unfortunately that's not the case
[01:46] <HiddenWolf> jdub: never had a windows machine give out on me soundwise
[01:46] <jdub> HiddenWolf: that has nothing to do with available audio interfaces and "mess"
[01:46] <ogra> how does macos solve that ?
[01:47] <pitti> jdub: I think I'm close to the problem now :-)
[01:48] <ogra> pitti: i have added a question about language settings to hwdb-client.....
[01:48] <ogra> pitti: it currently reads:  Is the system language setting ok ?
[01:49] <ogra> pitti: any better suggestions for a question would be very welcome
[01:49] <pitti> ogra: <bitch>It should read "Ist die Spracheinstellung korrekt?</bitch> :-)
[01:49] <ogra> grrr....
[01:49] <ogra> :)
[01:49] <pitti> ogra: maybe s/system/default/ or s/system//
[01:50] <ogra> hmm, the default ? 
[01:50] <pitti> ogra: you can change it in gdm
[01:51] <ogra> dont i have to select one on installation ?
[01:51] <pitti> ogra: right
[01:51] <pitti> ogra: you select a default
[01:51] <pitti> ogra: maybe just drop "system"
[01:51] <ogra> hmm, ok
[01:51] <pitti> any other opinions?
[01:51] <ogra> i'll do it this way
[01:53] <crimsun_> I vote for "correct" instead of "ok"
[01:53] <ogra> yeah, sounds better :)
[01:53] <pitti> YAHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
[01:53] <pitti> jdub: got it
[01:54] <jdub> :-)
[01:54] <Burgundavia> jdub: for the unwise: http://gnomedesktop.org/node/feed
[01:54] <Burgundavia> jdub: try that http://www.linux-mag.com/2004-12/sound_01.html
[01:54] <Burgundavia> how is this mess? http://www.linux-mag.com/2004-12/img2/sound_01.gif
[01:55] <pitti> jdub: stupid bug: pa queried the block duration in ns from ALSA and used this time (682 ns) as buffer size
[01:55] <pitti> jdub: AARRGH
[01:55] <jdub> Burgundavia: good one
[01:55] <jdub> Burgundavia: it's much simpler on real distributions
[01:55] <crimsun_> pitti, eek!
[01:55] <jdub> Burgundavia: you have one line to traverse
[01:56] <Burgundavia> jdub: ?
[01:56] <jdub> that graph is meaningless on normal systems
[01:57] <Burgundavia> ah
[01:58] <fabbione> humpf
[01:59] <fabbione> jetlag is hitting me :-)
[02:00] <Treenaks> pitti: crack!
[02:00] <jdub> pitti: that's pretty remarkable
[02:00] <jdub> pitti: why does it only manifest on ppc?
[02:01] <pitti> jdub: pure coincidence, AFAICS
[02:01] <jdub> cunning :)
[02:02] <pitti> jdub: I'm testing the patch with several use cases now, and later on my i386
[02:02] <pitti> jdub: it's only an one-line patch
[02:03] <jdub> heh
[02:03] <jdub> congrats, and thanks :)
[02:03] <pitti> you're welcome :-)
[02:07] <ogra> haha, Linux's sound architecture is multi-layered and complex.....
[02:07] <ogra> ....sure, if i display it this way.....
[02:08] <Treenaks> ogra: Linux sound architecture is like an onion!

[02:08] <ogra> Treenaks: does that look like an onion to you ? http://www.linux-mag.com/2004-12/img2/sound_01.gif
[02:08] <ogra> *g*
[02:08] <Treenaks> ogra: *fires up gimp*
[02:10] <ogra> s/inst/isnt
[02:10] <tseng> cool @ redesign winners
[02:10] <tseng> i especially like the Download Ubuntu thing here:
[02:10] <tseng> http://people.ubuntu.com/~jdub/2005/webcomp/brad-griffith.png
[02:11] <jdub> tseng: yeah
[02:12] <Treenaks> tseng: it looks very mozilla.orgish
[02:12] <jdub> pitti: hmm, that should have a nice impact in general, really
[02:12] <tseng> Treenaks: in a good way
[02:12] <pitti> jdub: I'm just _really_ puzzled that this only occurred on ppc
[02:12] <pitti> jdub: it's probably sound chip dependent, not arch-dependent
[02:13] <lamont> fabbione: word to the wise - before uploading any gnome packages for sparc, make sure they don't reference libhowl, or life gets painful...
[02:13] <lamont> daniels: ack
[02:13] <seb128> jdub: a guy on #gnome would like to get this fix to clearlook: http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1156793&group_id=129376&atid=714612
[02:13] <pitti> lamont: Hi
[02:13] <pitti> lamont: the stripped tarballs are fine now
[02:13] <pitti> lamont: can you please move all tarballs but today's to old-translations/ and update the directory *.txt files?
[02:14] <daniels> lamont: yo ... l-r-m 2.6.11? :)
[02:14] <jdub> seb128: i'm sure upstream will fix that quickly
[02:14] <jdub> seb128: i'll remind them
[02:14] <seb128> k
[02:16] <lamont> daniels: ??
[02:16] <fabbione> hey lamont 
[02:16] <trukulo> hey, one question... on topic : upgrade to kernel 2.6.10-24
[02:17] <trukulo> shouldn't be : 2.6.10-4
[02:17] <trukulo> ?
[02:17] <fabbione> -24?.....
[02:17] <lamont> morning fabbione  - sorry about the mailing list thing...
[02:17] <fabbione> lamont: no problem..
[02:17] <fabbione> already placed the filters around
[02:17] <fabbione> hmm that's why it was looking weird...
[02:17] <lamont> -23 had a bad inotify patch... :-(
[02:17] <daniels> lamont: is it planned?
[02:17] <Kamion> trukulo: 2.6.10-24 is the package version, 2.6.10-4 is the kernel version with module ABI
[02:17] <Kamion> trukulo: try not to confuse the two
[02:17] <lamont> daniels: fabbione is doing 2.6.11....
[02:18] <trukulo> Kamion, ok, thanks
[02:18] <fabbione> as soon as i get my local mirror synced again
[02:18] <fabbione> just to be able to download the sources...
[02:18] <Kamion> trukulo: the topic's good the way it is
[02:18] <lamont> trukulo: and 2.6.10-4_2.6.10-23 was bad, 2.6.10-4_2.6.10-24 was good...
[02:18] <fabbione> but yeah.. i can get .11 out tomorrow or something
[02:18] <fabbione> i need to resync with 2.6.10 first
[02:19] <lamont> fabbione: arch repository for 2.6.10 debian tree is in rookery:~lamont/Archives/kernel-team@ubuntu.com--2005/kernel-debian--mainline--2.6.10
[02:19] <trukulo> ok, ok , i understand now , thanks for info
[02:19] <fabbione> lamont: ok thanks :-)
[02:20] <lamont> fabbione: s/arch/baz/ btws
[02:21] <fabbione> yeah
[02:21] <lamont> fabbione: and fwiw, the sparc buildd died shortly after you left. :-(
[02:21] <lamont> s/died/went non-responsive/
[02:21] <fabbione> lamont: yup.. i read the mail and started it again
[02:22] <fabbione> lamont: for some reason the machine just went back to OBP
[02:22] <fabbione> no idea why
[02:22] <lamont> OBP?
[02:22] <fabbione> Open Boot Prom
[02:25] <daniels> ah cool
[02:26] <lamont> ah, 'k.
[02:30] <fabbione> later guys
[02:30] <fabbione> i need to sleep a bit to get over the jetlag
[02:31] <jordi> fabbione: dude?
[02:31] <jordi> damn
[02:33] <daniels> thom: that won't get you very far
[02:34] <zul> heylo
[02:34] <tseng> hi zul 
[02:34] <zul> hi tseng 
[02:38] <sivang> seb128: do you know where on fd.o there's the manual for the .desktop file spec?
[02:38] <amu> pitti: could you please review dbus-qt for a move into main 
[02:39] <carlos> amu: is KDE moving into main for Hoary?
[02:39] <amu> carlos: yep
[02:40] <ogra> sivang: look in software for something like xdg
[02:40] <sivang> ogra: eh I thought they were in the specs, and googled but nothing :)
[02:41] <trukulo> ogra, you there?
[02:41] <sivang> ogra: nah, not there
[02:41] <trukulo> ogra, why do you added cdrdao as a depend?
[02:41] <trukulo> i'm looking changelog, and cdrdao is included in cvs, not in 0.3.8 , i'm i wrong?
[02:42] <jordi> thom: that is going to crush me if you do it again
[02:42] <ogra> trukulo: it is used by 0.3.8
[02:42] <trukulo> ogra, http://savannah.nongnu.org/cgi-bin/viewcvs/graveman/graveman/current/ChangeLog?rev=1.42&content-type=text/vnd.viewcvs-markup
[02:42] <trukulo> read it, it's used (changelog said) in 0.3.8 cvs, not released
[02:43] <trukulo> otavio and i are using 0.3.8 released
[02:43] <ogra> sivang: http://specs.freedesktop.org/wiki/Standards/desktop-entry-spec
[02:43] <trukulo> cvs version will ber 0.4
[02:43] <sivang> ogra: thanks, how did you search ? 
[02:43] <amu> elmo: please could you sync libassuan-dev from debian into universe
[02:43] <jdub> buildds are working overtime tonight! :)
[02:43] <ogra> trukulo: so your version has no reference to cdrdao in its settings ?
[02:43] <trukulo> ogra, so, as i know, 0.3.8 we use doesn't use cdrdao
[02:44] <trukulo> it shouldn't, but i'm not sure as it's made by otavio, not me
[02:44] <ogra> mine has
[02:44] <trukulo> could be, i'll ask otavio when i see him
[02:45] <ogra> trukulo: havent had the time to try it out extensively, but was assuming it would be used if the settings have such an option
[02:45] <trukulo> ogra, not sure, anyway, that depend would be ok for next version
[02:46] <ogra> yeah for preventive dependencys
[02:46] <trukulo> :) yeah
[02:47] <seb128> sivang: http://standards.freedesktop.org/desktop-entry-spec/
[02:49] <sivang> seb128: thanks again :-) 
[02:52] <ogra> sivang: what are you working on `
[02:52] <ogra> ?
[02:54] <sivang> ogra: trying to see how oowriter is executed, as per #6202
[03:03] <ogra> sivang: das i thought you were bored enough to go for this one : https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/UniversePackageWithoutDesktopFile
[03:03] <ogra> s/das/sad
[03:04] <ogra> *g*
[03:05] <sivang> ogra: hrm, one question, how did you form this list? :-)
[03:05] <ogra> i didnt...it suddenly appeared out of nowhere.....
[03:05] <sivang> I think that it's either done using a script, or some madman :)
[03:06] <ogra> ...but it would be nice to have a conversion script from the debian menu entrys
[03:06] <sivang> from menu entirs to desktop files , hmmm
[03:06] <sivang> interesting bit
[03:06] <HiddenWolf> sivang: you'd better hope it's a script. :)
[03:06] <sivang> HiddenWolf: yeah, I nearly fainted to the length
[03:07] <sivang> ogra: well, the guy who wrote the script can just as easy write a conversion script I think :)
[03:07] <ogra> i think half of this list doesnt need an entry....
[03:07] <ogra> sivang: true....
[03:07] <sivang> ogra: or else we can create a script to read this wiki page, and create desktop files for each pkg there :)
[03:07] <ogra> heh
[03:08] <HiddenWolf> I see gnome 2.10 entering hoary, but it's not done yet, right?
[03:08] <rburton> HiddenWolf: releasing tomorrow morning
[03:08] <pitti> daniels: you were too fast with replying to #7138 :-)
[03:08] <pitti> daniels: I wanted to include both outputs since they differ
[03:08] <rburton> HiddenWolf: so i expect seb128 would have it all done by then
[03:08] <jdub> HiddenWolf: hoary gets packages as they're uploaded to gnome ftp
[03:09] <jdub> there's only one last thing to optimise out
[03:09] <jdub> but he's french
[03:09] <jdub> and we like him
[03:09] <jdub> so we keep him around :-)
[03:10] <rburton> seb128 is needed so we've got a free tomboy logo
[03:10] <ogra> jdub: move him to .au :)
[03:10] <HiddenWolf> jdub: does gnome usually ship with ~1050 open bugs?
[03:10] <jdub> rburton: good point
[03:10] <jdub> HiddenWolf: huh?
[03:10] <HiddenWolf> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/reports/gnome-210-report.html
[03:11] <rburton> HiddenWolf: are you suggesting that software is generally released without any bugs?
[03:12] <HiddenWolf> rburton: just suprized at the amount and impact of them, really
[03:12] <jdub> dude, those are only the bugs that are *reported*
[03:12] <rburton> i just did my bit and removed the SJ bug from that list
[03:12] <Treenaks> jdub: why not do a 2.10.1 "bugfixes only, please" release then? :)
[03:12] <HiddenWolf> jdub: I figured that.
[03:12] <zul> only ~1050? wow...windows must have less
[03:12] <rburton> Treenaks: gnome does exactly that
[03:12] <Treenaks> HiddenWolf: also, lots of those are NEW and UNVERIFIED etc.
[03:13] <Treenaks> HiddenWolf: I guess
[03:13] <jdub> Treenaks: we've done that for every release i can remember
[03:13] <jdub> oh
[03:13] <jdub> except 1.4.1
[03:13] <jdub> that's a funny one
[03:13] <Treenaks> jdub: that one's ancient, too.
[03:13] <jdub> though we ended up officially releasing it at one point, as a tribute
[03:14] <HiddenWolf> Will that bug be fixed that prevents the mouse theme from showing?
[03:15] <jdub> HiddenWolf: no such bug exists
[03:15] <tseng> are you talking about a bug where the cursor theme is missing?
[03:15] <jdub> currently, there is no cursor theme on the disk
[03:15] <tseng> HiddenWolf: if you get the ximian-artwork tarball you can throw it in ~/.iconts
[03:15] <tseng> icons
[03:15] <HiddenWolf> jdub: the ubuntu themed cursors got replaced with the ugly industrial ones, i thought that was a bug.
[03:16] <tseng> uhm
[03:16] <jdub> HiddenWolf: entirely the wrong way around :)
[03:16] <tseng> industrial got replaced with X defaults
[03:16] <pitti> lamont: ping
[03:16] <jdub> HiddenWolf: the industrial ones were dropped on the floor in a major reshuffle upstream
[03:16] <HiddenWolf> jdub: doh, sorry :S
[03:17] <jdub> HiddenWolf: it's best to ask questions before making statements like these.
[03:18] <tseng> or look around bugzilla :P
[03:20] <HiddenWolf> :$
[03:24] <HiddenWolf> jdub: will the theme be back?
[03:29] <jdub> yes
[03:31] <seb128> jdub: grrr, this guy on #gnome-debian ...
[03:31] <jdub> yeah
[03:34] <thom> seb128: hostinggeek (aka Gmail, shimen) ? there's a reason he's banned here
[03:35] <seb128> I start to understand why :p
[03:35] <ogra> argh, he is in gnome-debian now ?
[03:35] <Treenaks> thom: he wants to come to ubuntu down under
[03:35] <ogra> AAAHH
[03:35] <Treenaks> or so he said this morning
[03:35] <sivang> ARGH
[03:35] <thom> oh sweet baby jesus
[03:35] <ogra> seb128: currently we have hom as pet in ubuntu-motu
[03:35] <ogra> him even
[03:35] <thom> i've had him on ignore for a long, long time
[03:35] <tseng> some pet
[03:36] <tseng> he keeps biting me in the ankles
[03:36] <sivang> tseng: heheh
[03:36] <bob2> it'll be cool
[03:36] <zul> tseng: its a love bite :)
[03:36] <ogra> hehe
[03:36] <bob2> someone will snap and beat him up
[03:36] <jdub> he thinks you will
[03:36] <bob2> s/someone/everyone/, I guess
[03:37] <tseng> jdub: kicked off a thread on gamin-list about /media/* and inotify
[03:37] <jdub> tseng: was just about to mention :)
[03:37] <jdub> tseng: the problem is that there's a lot of duplicated functionality between dnotify and inotify
[03:38] <jdub> tseng: and the problem with *that* is that it's not completely duplicated :)
[03:38] <tseng> I figured as much
[03:38] <jdub> needs a bit of refactoring
[03:38] <tseng> but he just posted with no small confidence that it was solved
[03:38] <jdub> oh, DV replied?
[03:38] <tseng> I figure if i point it out, he'll test and quickly solve the issue
[03:38] <tseng> no, his most recent post
[03:38] <tseng> http://mail.gnome.org/archives/gamin-list/2005-March/msg00000.html
[03:39] <jdub> he's only testing against dnotify
[03:41] <tseng> makes sense
[03:41] <tseng> ill bbiab, might even poke at the code if its obvious
[03:42] <jdub> tseng: do you have a blog?
[03:42] <tseng> planning on it soon
[03:42] <jdub> cool
[03:42] <tseng> dholbach wants to track motu daily routine
[03:43] <tseng> which is a nice idea
[03:44] <pitti> amu: which package shall I review again?
[03:44] <pitti> amu: (sorry for the lag, lots of stuff to do...)
[03:46] <amu> pitti: no prob, dbus-1-qt, it's needed as a builddepends for kdebase, which blocks atm everything  
[03:46] <pitti> amu: but it's already in main??
[03:46] <pitti> amu: dbus-qt-1, at least
[03:47] <amu> Filename: pool/universe/d/dbus/dbus-qt-1-dev_0.23-1ubuntu6_powerpc.deb
[03:48] <amu> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/k/kdebase/4:3.4.0-0pre1ubuntu1/kdebase_4:3.4.0-0pre1ubuntu1_20050307-1408-i386-failed
[03:49] <ogra> amu: tried kubuntu, nice piece, congrats :)
[03:50] <sivang> jdub: can I take the Ubuntu logo , just translate the letters of the name and put on the .IL wiki ? who can permit that?
[03:50] <sivang> jdub: (into hebrew , ofcourse)
[03:50] <jdub> mail info@ubuntu.com
[03:51] <sivang> jdub: ok, thanks/.
[03:55] <bob2> so
[03:56] <bob2> something that sucks is having some key get stuck during resume
[03:56] <bob2> so it's impossible to unlock xscreensaver, as the password box gets filled with a thousand chars
[03:56] <ogra> ouch
[03:57] <bob2> I blame mjg59 in some way
[03:58] <mjg59> Gah. Not my fault.
[03:58] <ogra> hmm, does anyone remember a bug where the keyboard doesnt work right in X, you switch to a console where everything works but is uppercase ? i'm just expiriencing that.....
[03:59] <ogra> it gets lowerscase after one login/logout cycle and X is fine again
[03:59] <bob2> mjg59: have you ever seen it happen?
[04:00] <mjg59> Yeah.
[04:00] <mjg59> The 8042 driver needs to reset more state on resume
[04:00] <bob2> ah
[04:04] <mvo> is archive.ubuntu.com a bit slow right now?
[04:04] <dholbach> mvo: yes... for me too
[04:05] <mvo> wb dholbach !
[04:05] <dholbach> mvo: merci beaucoup
[04:06] <mvo> dholbach: excellent your french :)
[04:06] <dholbach> hehe... seb128 would laugh about it ;-)
[04:07] <seb128> ah ah :p
[04:08] <seb128> and we have no op on #gnome-debian ...
[04:09] <Kamion> ogra: if you type your username in all-caps, getty assumes you're on an ancient terminal where lowercase didn't work properly and forces everything to uppercase
[04:09] <ogra> Kamion: i dont type caps...but they get displayed....
[04:09] <pitti> Kamion: ah, thanks. I already thought there was a bug with shift lock in the kernel
[04:09] <Kamion> well, something evidently threw some capital letters at that tty
[04:09] <ogra> Kamion: i remember seeing this one with 2.0 and 2.2 kernels as well
[04:10] <ogra> where it occured even via ssh
[04:10] <Kamion> the code's been there for eons; I don't remember exactly where it lives
[04:11] <ogra> yeah, i thought it was solved long ago.... i'll have a look after preview if i find the ancient bugfix...
[04:14] <ogra> Kamion: oh, and btw, its on all ttys and even the issue text and login are capitalised
[04:14] <lamont> ogra: that code has been standard-unix for as long as I can remember...
[04:14] <lamont> ogra: it forces _everything_ into uppercase
[04:14] <zul> hey lamont
[04:14] <lamont> morning zul
[04:14] <ogra> ah....
[04:16] <Treenaks> lamont: but: how do you get out of that mode?
[04:16] <lamont> Treenaks: start a new tty
[04:16] <ogra> Treenaks: login/logout
[04:17] <lamont> or fail to login 3 times
[04:17] <Treenaks> lamont: urgh.. that sounds windowsish
[04:17] <ogra> what worries me is that it seems connected to a berakage in X
[04:17] <lamont> it's a fall back mode in case you're stuck in the 1970's.
[04:17] <ogra> breakage even
[04:17] <lamont> ogra: b0rkage :-)
[04:18] <ogra> since i only discovered it through a not working keyboard in X ....
[04:18] <ogra> lamont, heh
[04:18] <Mithrandir> thom: is jackass broken?
[04:18] <thom> Mithrandir: ...
[04:18] <Mithrandir> thom: http://archive.ubuntu.com just sits there
[04:18] <Kamion> jackass != archive.u.c
[04:18] <thom> that's not jackass
[04:18] <Mithrandir> oh, sorry
[04:19] <Mithrandir> archive.u.c, then :P
[04:20] <lamont>     /* Handle names with upper case and no lower case. */
[04:20] <lamont>     if ((cp->capslock = caps_lock(logname))) {
[04:20] <lamont>         for (bp = logname; *bp; bp++)
[04:20] <lamont>             if (isupper(*bp))
[04:20] <lamont>                 *bp = tolower(*bp);             /* map name to lower case */
[04:20] <lamont>     }
[04:20] <lamont> you mean that code?
[04:20] <Mithrandir> thom: thanks
[04:21] <thom> sure
[04:22] <ogra> lamont: ah, ok, that shows why i can log in....but it doesnt show why the uppercase mode was triggered...
[04:22] <lamont> ogra: yeah.  not sure whether to blame getty or tty driver for that...
[04:23] <sivang_livecd> bah, locale settings is pretty weird I had to wait for about 20 locales to be generated, and after choosing hebrew as the language (which was alos nicely detected by the keyboard selector) I had a default desktop with hebrew only input 
[04:23] <lamont> (that code was from getty, fwiw)
[04:23] <ogra> lamont: thanks :)
[04:23] <sivang_livecd> eh well, need to open a bug report
[04:28] <pitti> thom: do you have an ETA for ffox 1.0.1? and moz 1.7.6?
[04:29] <thom> i'm gonna get 1.0.1 finished after lunch, then start on 1.7.6
[04:30] <pitti> oh, cool
[04:30] <pitti> thom: so you don't wait for Debian?
[04:30] <pitti> thom: Eric said that he will package 1.0.1 soon, too
[04:30] <thom> 1.0.1 is in debian
[04:30] <pitti> oh, even better
[04:30] <thom> i don't really want to use it, but i will do to get the security bugs nailed
[04:34] <Kamion> mdz: the place where you've put the copying of debian-installer/keymap is pretty dodgy, and won't work when we move to debconf-copydb
[04:34] <Kamion> mdz: (in casper)
[04:34] <Mithrandir> Kamion: is initrd as of yesterday broken wrt choose-mirror and countryprefix?
[04:34] <Kamion> mdz: it happens to work because the confmodule from before the pivot is still running, but couldn't the copy happen before chroot/pivot?
[04:35] <Kamion> Mithrandir: hm, possibly :( I'll check
[04:35] <Mithrandir> it seems to try to download http://${countryprefix}archive.ubuntu.com(null)/ubuntu, which doesn work. :P
[04:35] <Kamion> that's supposed to have been SUBSTed
[04:35] <Mithrandir> it's what it outputs on tty4
[04:36] <Mithrandir> (or tty3, not sure)
[04:36] <Kamion> Mithrandir: I think I fixed that on Saturday; check the choose-mirror version in that initrd
[04:36] <Mithrandir> 1.06ubuntu5
[04:36] <Kamion> 1.06ubuntu6 was the fix
[04:37] <Mithrandir> ok
[04:37] <Mithrandir> I'll download a new initrd, then
[04:37] <pitti> elmo: can I please have dchroot warty access on concordia and davis?
[04:43] <Goshawk> is there someone that has 1 minute to try this script? http://81.113.230.186/kalatlug/Projects/usplash/test-script.sh
[04:43] <Mithrandir> Kamion: same problem
[04:43] <Mithrandir> Kamion: is there a workaround?
[04:43] <Goshawk> just one minute... -(you need hoary + xorg)
[04:44] <pitti> Goshawk: I did, shall I /msg you the output? or mail?
[04:44] <Goshawk> for me is the same
[04:44] <Goshawk> thanks
[04:45] <Goshawk> ok thanks
[04:45] <Goshawk> i've found the problem
[04:45] <Goshawk> thanks a lot!
[04:45] <bluefoxicy> http://rafb.net/paste/results/HXV38h96.html
[04:45] <bluefoxicy> Is this known
[04:45] <pitti> Goshawk: shall I try again?
[04:45] <Goshawk> pitti, thanks to you a usplash bug is solved
[04:46] <pitti> Goshawk: I'm honored, and I didn't even do anything :-)
[04:46] <Goshawk> ^__^
[04:46] <ogra> Goshawk: interested in output from a amd64 widescreen laptop ?
[04:46] <Goshawk> yep
[04:46] <fabbione> seb128: you around?
[04:47] <seb128> yep
[04:47] <fabbione> seb128: did you fix the build-dep order for libhowl being dropped?
[04:47] <seb128> order ?
[04:47] <fabbione> well sparc buildd is bitching a lot about it
[04:47] <seb128> yeah
[04:47] <Kamion> Mithrandir: I just noticed the same thing. Please don't ask me for workarounds when I have no idea what the problem is yet. :)
[04:48] <seb128> fabbione: lamont knows about it
[04:48] <bluefoxicy> libgnome2-common installation is still hanging in apt
[04:48] <fabbione> seb128
[04:48] <fabbione> seb128: he told me something about it
[04:48] <fabbione> but i would like to hear from our gtk/gnome guru
[04:49] <Goshawk> ogra, thanks also to you
[04:49] <Goshawk> ^__^
[04:49] <seb128> I've uploaded gnome-vfs2, libgnome, libbonoboui, libgnomeui, ... in the right order with space to build between them
[04:49] <seb128> fabbione: kicking again has worked fine on i386/ppc/amd64/ia64, dunno about sparc
[04:49] <fabbione> seb128: yes, but sparc was lagging way behind for other reasons
[04:49] <fabbione> so what is the correct thing to do?
[04:50] <mdz> Kamion: yes, I could move it to before the pivot
[04:50] <fabbione> seb128: sparc buildd died 18 days ago :-)
[04:50] <pitti> Morning mdz
[04:50] <seb128> fabbione: find the /usr/lib/*.la with a mention to howl
[04:50] <Goshawk> ogra, pitti the problem was that the case value was too short for big values more that 1024x768, thanks 
[04:50] <fabbione> so it knowns nothing about it
[04:50] <fabbione> hey mdz :-)
[04:50] <mdz> fabbione: hey!
[04:50] <mdz> fabbione: how was your trip?
[04:51] <Kamion> bet this'll be fast
[04:51] <fabbione> seb128: ok... if i find something with it.. what should i do?
[04:51] <fabbione> mdz: cool!
[04:51] <fabbione> mdz: it is seriously worth all the money
[04:51] <ogra> mdz: hi, thanks for the nightly flowers :-D
[04:51] <fabbione> galapagos > *
[04:51] <mdz> I have wanted to go there
[04:51] <fabbione> mdz: after i will put the pics online, you will go there
[04:51] <pitti> mdz: at least we now can see how it looks like, from Fabio's photos :-)
[04:51] <seb128> fabbione: the order for the libs is: gnome-vfs2 libgnome libbonoboui libgnomeui 
[04:52] <seb128> fabbione: you should build them in this order with the new version of the previous one to kick howl out of the .la files
[04:52] <fabbione> seb128: hold on...
[04:52] <seb128> fabbione: if there is an issue with a package already built we can reupload or you can do a binary NMU ...
[04:52] <bluefoxicy> stat64("/usr/share/locale/en/LC_MESSAGES/dpkg.mo", 0xbffff698) = -1 ENOENT (No such file or directory)
[04:53] <theine> Hey seb128, thanks for applying the openbox patch
[04:53] <pitti> bluefoxicy: that's normal
[04:53] <seb128> theine: np :)
[04:53] <pitti> bluefoxicy: you have to install a language pack
[04:53] <fabbione> so those are the only 4 packages affected by that problem?
[04:53] <bluefoxicy> pitti:  i'm stracing dpkg to find out why it's hanging on gnome2-common and gnome2-vfs
[04:53] <seb128> fabbione: no, but after that kicking should be enough
[04:53] <fabbione> seb128: argh....
[04:53] <pitti> bluefoxicy: erm, is that the reason for the hang???
[04:53] <bluefoxicy> pitti:  apparently the only thing it's doing is repetedly iterating through all locales looking for dpkg.mo; nothing else is happening at all
[04:54] <seb128> fabbione: that's a real mess, thanks to libtool ...
[04:54] <bluefoxicy> however I'm guessing on faith that maybe the other processes forked and aren't straced?
[04:54] <lamont> seb128: the build-deps not getting updated mean that buildd's running through the whole lot at once hit b0rkage
[04:54] <pitti> bluefoxicy: it does these iterations for every string to be translated
[04:54] <seb128> lamont: that's bad
[04:54] <fabbione> seb128: couldn't you build-conflict or something?
[04:54] <pitti> bluefoxicy: after preview I will probably upload a new libc which caches result
[04:54] <pitti> bluefoxicy: s
[04:54] <bluefoxicy>  strace dpkg --configure -a 2>&1 | grep -v "locale"
[04:55] <seb128> fabbione, lamont: we could libgnomevfs2-dev conflicts on libhowl-dev ?
[04:55] <bluefoxicy> ok it's doing a brk() every few seconds, must be something else.
[04:55] <fabbione> seb128: if that's enough, i don't see why not
[04:55] <seb128> fabbione: the current libgnomevfs2-dev .la file has a mention to howl on sparc ?
[04:56] <lamont> that'd fix the libgnomevfs2-dev build, but maybe not others?
[04:56] <bluefoxicy> pitti:  I just can't see acpid or gnome2-common flicking the disk light once every 10-15 seconds (I have mldonkey running, that's probably the disk access), and taking >5 minutes to install, maybe I'm just impatient?
[04:57] <fabbione> dpkg -c libgnomevfs2-dev_2.9.91-0ubuntu1_sparc.deb | grep howl | wc -l
[04:57] <fabbione> 0
[04:57] <fabbione> seb128: ^^
[04:57] <pitti> bluefoxicy: hmm, no idea
[04:57] <seb128> fabbione: no, "grep howl  /usr/lib/libgnomevfs-2.la"
[04:58] <fabbione> ah hold on
[04:58] <bluefoxicy> (every time I run dpkg --configure -a it switches which is first, gnome2-common or libgnomevfs2-common)
[04:58] <seb128> grep howl /usr/lib/*.la
[04:58] <seb128> to have an idea on what you want to rebuild
[04:58] <jdub> ogra: ping
[04:58] <ogra> jdub: pong
[04:58] <fabbione> Binary file libgnomevfs-2.a matches
[04:58] <fabbione> libgnomevfs-2.la:dependency_libs=
[04:59] <fabbione> seb128: so yes.. it doess
[04:59] <tseng> is there an email/post somewhere explaining why all the howl stuff is being removed?
[04:59] <jdub> ogra: did you have a new xss patch?
[04:59] <ogra> only the one you already have, i wanted to work on that during preview
[04:59] <seb128> fabbione: 2.9.92-0ubuntu1 ?
[05:00] <jdub> ok
[05:00] <fabbione> seb128: that's the last one i have..
[05:00] <jdub> thanks
[05:00] <Goshawk> fabbione, sei italiano?
[05:00] <fabbione> seb128: as i wrote before the buildd died 18 days ago
[05:00] <doko> mvo: could you validate the missing 'noauth' in peers/ppp0
[05:00] <ogra> jdub: tell me if you need it earlier
[05:00] <fabbione> Goshawk: yes i am italian
[05:00] <seb128> fabbione: you have started the buildd again now, 2.9.92-0ubuntu1 build is ok ?
[05:00] <mvo> doko: no, works for me :(
[05:01] <fabbione> seb128: it's in the queue
[05:01] <seb128> start by it
[05:01] <fabbione> seb128: i can build it manually if you want me
[05:01] <fabbione> seb128: there are tons of other packages before it
[05:01] <seb128> that's the first to change
[05:01] <seb128> once you have change it other one will ftbfs if they are not built in the right order
[05:01] <jdub> ogra: would be nice to have it for preview, but that's ok
[05:01] <seb128> ups
[05:02] <seb128> once you have changed it, the other ones will ftbfs if they are not built in the right order
[05:02] <ogra> jdub: lets see how hwdb-client comes along, probably i can send you a last minute patch....
[05:02] <jdub> ogra: hwdb-client is waaaaay more important :)
[05:02] <ogra> sure :)
[05:02] <fabbione> seb128: ok thanks
[05:02] <jdub> waaaaay like curds and wheeeeeey
[05:03] <seb128> np
[05:03] <fabbione> AHHHHHH
[05:03] <fabbione> i know why the sparcbuildd died!
[05:03] <pitti> fabbione: you didn't give him enough food for two weeks? :-)
[05:03] <zul> bwahaha
[05:04] <fabbione> pitti: ahaha 
[05:04] <fabbione> ssh sparctamagochi -l buildd
[05:04] <fabbione> ops
[05:04] <fabbione> ;)
[05:05] <mdz> fabbione: sparc has a LOT of catching up to do
[05:05] <fabbione> mdz: i know!
[05:05] <fabbione> i am working on it
[05:05] <fabbione> it died and i just understood wht
[05:06] <fabbione> why
[05:06] <fabbione> i forgot to set in the OBP: do not die if the serial machine connected on the other side does not responde = true
[05:06] <pitti> lamont: here?
[05:07] <bluefoxicy> it's still setting up libgnomevfs2-common
[05:07] <bluefoxicy> so yeah, I think it's broken.
[05:07] <bluefoxicy> it set up a few other packages.
[05:08] <fabbione> seb128: i am going to build 2.10 directly.. 2.9.92 is already out of my cache/mirror
[05:08] <lamont> pitti: yes
[05:08] <seb128> k
[05:08] <seb128> start by gnome-vfs2
[05:08] <seb128> libgnome
[05:08] <bluefoxicy> this is on x86 btw, I'm on an amd64 box but running a 32 bit system for some odd reason (I was using xen)
[05:08] <seb128> libbonoboui
[05:08] <seb128> libgnome
[05:08] <seb128> and be sure to have the new libgnomevfs2-dev with howl in the .la 
[05:08] <wasabi_> isn't howl being removed?
[05:09] <seb128> s/with/without/
[05:09] <wasabi_> k
[05:13] <pitti> anybody out there who ever built perl?
[05:14] <pitti> infinity: 
[05:14] <pitti> autosplit_lib_modules(@ARGV)' lib/*.pm
[05:14] <pitti> Errno architecture (i386-linux-thread-multi-2.6.8.1) does not match executable architecture (i386-linux-thread-multi-2.6.10-4-k7) at /usr/lib/perl/5.8/Errno.pm line 11.
[05:14] <pitti> Compilation failed in require at lib/File/Path.pm line 166.
[05:14] <pitti> infinity: any idea?
[05:15] <pitti> infinity: this even happens in a clean pbuilder
[05:15] <infinity> No left over files from a previous build?
[05:15] <infinity> Dirty source package, maybe?
[05:15] <infinity> Otherwise, I'm as lost as you.  That's a new one.
[05:16] <infinity> Time to get your grep on, I guess.
[05:17] <pitti> infinity: okay, thanks
[05:17] <pitti> infinity: yes, fresh source package
[05:17] <infinity> Tahnking people for not being helpful is a novel approach. :)
[05:18] <pitti> infinity: first, I directly applied my patch
[05:18] <thom> infinity: he's just added you to the list of people to bully into doing security work
[05:18] <mdz> pitti: did you do the patch/unpatch dance?
[05:18] <pitti> infinity: then I even added it to debian/patches and patches-applied (strange build system9
[05:18] <pitti> mdz: oh, that's new?
[05:18] <pitti> mdz: as I said, strange build system...
[05:18] <pitti> HAH
[05:18] <mdz> pitti: the last time I built perl, you had to do "debian/rules unpatch patch" to get everything into the right state
[05:19] <mdz> after adding a patch
[05:19] <pitti> mdz: now I tried to build the pristine source package from Debian
[05:19] <pitti> mdz: still the same bug
[05:19] <mdz> ick
[05:19] <pitti> mdz: I tried this on warty and hoary, on two computers
[05:19] <mdz> the kernel version number should NOT be in that string
[05:21] <mdz> hmm
[05:21] <mdz> mizar:[/tmp]  perl -MConfig -e 'print "$Config{'archname'}-$Config{'osvers'}\n";'
[05:21] <mdz> i386-linux-thread-multi-2.6.8.1
[05:21] <mdz> pitti: where do you get i386-linux-thread-multi-2.6.10-4-k7?
[05:22] <mdz> is that from Errno.pm in the build tree?
[05:23] <pitti> mdz: it's not even in the source package
[05:23] <pitti> just Errno.t
[05:24] <pitti> ah
[05:24] <pitti> ./ext/Errno/Errno_pm.PL
[05:25] <pitti> use Config;
[05:25] <pitti> use strict;
[05:25] <pitti> "\$Config{'archname'}-\$Config{'osvers'}" eq
[05:25] <pitti> "$Config{'archname'}-$Config{'osvers'}" or
[05:25] <pitti>         die "Errno architecture ($Config{'archname'}-$Config{'osvers'}) does not match executable architecture (\$Config{'archname'}-\$Config{'osvers'})";
[05:25] <dholbach> seb128: have glibmm2.6.1 ready on http://ubuntu.gplan.info/mm
[05:26] <lamont> mdz: any plans to burn new livecd rootfs images in the next hour or so?
[05:26] <pitti> What the hell should this do?
[05:26] <seb128> dholbach: k, thanks
[05:26] <dholbach> seb128: cool
[05:27] <tseng> jdub: see that post? inotify backend doesnt support poll atm
[05:27] <jdub> yeah
[05:28] <tseng> jdub: the code in gam_dnotify.c for poll is obvious
[05:28] <tseng> i wonder if copying it over helps
[05:28] <mdz> lamont: none
[05:28] <mdz> pitti: that's very weird
[05:30] <pitti> mdz: hmm, I can just toss it at the hoary buildd and see what happens there, but actually this is not really a satisfying solution...
[05:30] <mdz> pitti: was bod able to help you?
[05:30] <pitti> mdz: he did not reply, he's probably asleep
[05:31] <tseng> hm right.. poll isnt called in functions that have counterparts in gam_inotify
[05:31] <pitti> mdz: last message from 6 hours ago
[05:31] <pitti> mdz: I think I defer this until tomorrow
[05:31] <tseng> jdub: would it be smart to maybe disable inotify backend for gamin?
[05:31] <tseng> or leave it since we have it off in the kernel
[05:31] <tseng> and we wont be getting beagle this time around
[05:32] <infinity> pitti : If it's still bugging you tomorrow and I;m around, delegate it my way.
[05:32] <mdz> tseng: .since it seems to fall back gracefully, I think we should leave it enabled
[05:32] <pitti> infinity: okay, I'll do :-) Sleep well
[05:32] <mdz> it's possible that we'll enable inotify after preview, if the testing continues to go well
[05:32] <fabbione> hmmmm
[05:32] <fabbione> after a dist-upgrade my machine is turtle slow
[05:33] <tseng> mdz: well, my point is that that will cause what looks to the user like a regression in gamin
[05:33] <mdz> tseng: how so?
[05:33] <tseng> mdz: are you familiar with the bug where automounted devices arent shown in drivemount-applet or nautilus on mount?
[05:34] <tseng> it was solved by switching /media/* to use polling in gamin
[05:34] <tseng> which isnt supported by the inotify backend.
[05:34] <jdub> mdz: the "gamin doesn't fully implement inotify" bug is still relevant
[05:35] <mdz> so either we do something about that, or just stick with dnotify
[05:35] <tseng> right.
[05:35] <pitti> *sigh* dnotify sucks...
[05:35] <jdub> tseng: daniel is DV on #gnome-hackers (gimpnet)
[05:35] <tseng> ok
[05:35] <jdub> tseng: dunno where john hangs out, but would be very useful to get in touch with him
[05:36] <jdub> tseng: doing anything for hoary will be hacky
[05:36] <tseng> yes
[05:36] <jdub> but post-hoary, it needs refactoring so less stuff is dumped into the backends
[05:37] <dholbach> i'm off... see you later
[05:37] <jdub> later dholbach 
[05:37] <dholbach> bye jdub 
[05:37] <tseng> yep as I just posted with the current status of the server backends, its beyond my skills to produce a patch
[05:38] <tseng> if no one else is interested, its definately post-hoary.. but leaves the question of what to do with inotify
[05:39] <jdub> tseng: current decision is to keep it in, but off by default
[05:39] <tseng> which is workable
[05:39] <jdub> it means rml will not mate with me
[05:39] <jdub> but there's always next year's season
[05:39] <tseng> because of this "issue" i'd have to suggest it stays off after preview
[05:40] <tseng> its not major or anything, but its a user visible regression
[05:43] <jdub> yeah
[05:47] <fabbione> seb128: ok i confirm that gnome-vfs2 2.10 does not have the howl stuff now (sparc)
[05:47] <fabbione> seb128: the rest will just build in the right order
[05:47] <seb128> cool
[05:47] <fabbione> seb128: or i will kick it back when needed
[05:48] <seb128> if it's not in the right order it'll ftbfs
[05:48] <seb128> need to kick
[05:49] <pitti> seb128: you rock
[05:50] <pitti> seb128: (and you are killing the buildds :-) )
[05:50] <seb128> thanks :)
[05:50] <seb128> (he he)
[05:56] <Goshawk> mdz, can i talk with you in private
[05:56] <Goshawk> ?
[05:57] <mdz> Goshawk: about what?
[05:57] <Goshawk> usplash
[05:57] <mdz> usplash discussion is on-topic for this channel; I'd prefer to have the conversation here
[05:57] <Goshawk> ok
[05:58] <Goshawk> how do you say USplash has been officially deferred to the
[05:58] <Goshawk> next release (Ubuntu 5.10, due in October). if there is nothing about that?
[05:58] <Goshawk> i worked with sladen
[05:58] <mdz> I announced this in the release update, for which I provided a URL
[05:58] <mdz> and it is also noted on HoaryGoals
[05:58] <Goshawk> and there is not much more than a Proof of concept tarball
[05:58] <mdz> and sladen and I discussed it at FeatureFReeze
[05:59] <Goshawk> yes... but there is nothing....
[05:59] <mdz> I don't understand your point
[06:00] <Goshawk> there is not "any" source code of that, only the work that i've done (tht you readed on the forum)
[06:00] <mdz> the fact that it hasn't been developed yet is the reason why it won't be part of the Hoary release
[06:00] <Goshawk> but... there is a but
[06:01] <Goshawk> there is an "alpha" for developers about a "usermode splash" i need the sladen agree to call it "usplash"
[06:01] <mdz> I am having difficulty understanding you
[06:02] <mdz> it sounds like you are saying that you have developed an implementation, and would like to call it usplash
[06:02] <Goshawk> yep...
[06:02] <mdz> were you aware of the Ubuntu project when you chose this name?
[06:02] <Goshawk> the thing that is developed works at 100% on my pc
[06:03] <Goshawk> it started on December.. in that period i was waiting the ubuntu sources of usplash from sladen, and when he said that nothing was deleped i started devloping this idea
[06:03] <Goshawk> but now  it works away from the main idea
[06:03] <Goshawk> all the stuff is made by a single utility
[06:04] <mdz> where can I download it?
[06:04] <Goshawk> http://81.113.230.186/kalatlug/phpwiki/index.php/UsplashHowDoesItWork
[06:04] <Goshawk> but wait
[06:04] <Goshawk> i've solved a bug just now
[06:04] <Goshawk> and i'm compilig the alpha2
[06:04] <Goshawk> if you want i can make a video of my boot process
[06:05] <Goshawk> in that page is written how it works
[06:05] <mdz> there is no source code there
[06:05] <Goshawk> and as you could say.. it differs from the main idea
[06:05] <Goshawk> there is the svn for sources
[06:05] <Goshawk> the server is linked at that page
[06:05] <Goshawk> svn co http://81.113.230.186/svn/bootsplash/v2
[06:06] <Goshawk> the svn is already updated
[06:06] <Goshawk> mdz, the best news is that
[06:06] <mdz> pitti: perl builds fine for me on Hoary (no chroot, no pbuilder)
[06:06] <Goshawk> i treat fd0 as a file
[06:06] <pitti> mdz: *sigh*
[06:06] <pitti> mdz: thanks for trying, though
[06:06] <mdz> version 5.8.4-6
[06:06] <Goshawk> not a mmaped memory (as the usplash proof of concept treats)
[06:06] <mdz> fd0?  you mean fb0?
[06:07] <Goshawk> yep,, excuse me
[06:07] <pitti> mdz: I tried -7 from incoming and -6ubuntu1 (with an extracted security patch)
[06:07] <Keybuk> heh, aww; I was hoping for boot symphony on 3.5" floppy
[06:07] <Goshawk> and.. there is a problem in the URL, it is : svn co http://81.113.230.186/svn/bootsplash/
[06:07] <Goshawk> without the v2
[06:09] <Goshawk> mdz, it will be not ready to work on hoary but we can develop it
[06:10] <mdz> Goshawk: yes, this looks very interesting.  I am confused about what you were asking me originally, however
[06:10] <mdz> are you proposing that we use your work as the basis for the usplash feature in Ubuntu?
[06:11] <Goshawk> yes.. mainly that
[06:11] <mdz> ok, that was a very strange way of asking :-)
[06:13] <sabdfl> seb128: you superstar. wonderful to see 2.10 coming in. thank you!
[06:13] <mdz> Goshawk: could you send a message to the ubuntu-devel mailing list about this?
[06:13] <kent> Goshawk, have you made a new version of it? I have some issues with the one i tried last time. It sort of works, but the graphics is strange.. its like it cant use that resolution or something. Its very hard for me to explain,  I can sort of see a scrambled picture of the logo when it boots.. 
[06:13] <seb128> sabdfl: thanks :)
[06:13] <pitti> sabdfl: good to have 128 Sebs to do uploads :-)
[06:14] <Goshawk> mdz, yep
[06:14] <koke> seb128: just one comment, look at the intltool-update.in file in the gnome 2.10 tarballs
[06:14] <mdz> Goshawk: I won't have much time to look at this due to the Hoary release, but I would like to start a discussion about it for Hoary+1
[06:14] <koke> I've just looked at ftp.gnome.org's tarballs and they are "clean"
[06:14] <Goshawk> kent, yep.. a lot of "ubuntu" lines in black an white
[06:15] <sabdfl> breezy!
[06:15] <seb128> koke: ?
[06:15] <Goshawk> mdz, me too... the problem was about that msg taht you are reading
[06:15] <seb128> koke: what do you call "clean" ?
[06:15] <koke> ok
[06:15] <seb128> ?
[06:15] <seb128> waht are you trying to say ?
[06:16] <seb128> you are not clear
[06:16] <koke> I've tested control-center and intltool-update looks for xgettext at /usr/bin
[06:16] <mdz> Goshawk: "something is moving in the underground" was not a very clear way to say "I have been working on an alternative implementation of usplash" :-)
[06:16] <koke> whith, in example, apt-get source gnome-desktop in hoary
[06:16] <Goshawk> mdz, since for  "something is moving underground" is not for hoary.. but usplash code 
[06:16] <koke> I get an intltool-update looking for gettext in /opt/gnome2
[06:16] <koke> nautilus-sendto in /mnt/data/gnome
[06:16] <koke> ...
[06:16] <mdz> Goshawk: and the last message on that forum says "Unless you install a new kernel, or have to move, or there's a power outage, or you install new hardware, or..."
[06:17] <mdz> Goshawk: so you can understand my confusion, I think :-)
[06:17] <Goshawk> yep.. i'm confused as you ^__^
[06:17] <Goshawk> thanks for all mdz 
[06:17] <Mithrandir> mdz: what will be the procedure for uploads after preview is out?
[06:17] <seb128> koke: 
[06:17] <seb128> $ grep "/opt" gnome-desktop-2.10.0/intltool-update.in
[06:17] <seb128> $
[06:18] <Goshawk> gonna open a ubuntu-devel topic
[06:18] <koke> mm ok
[06:18] <trulux> heya
[06:18] <koke> koke@ababol ~/Devel/ubuntu/gnome-desktop-2.10.0 $ grep xgettext intltool-update.in | head -1
[06:18] <koke>     my $XGETTEXT = $ENV{"XGETTEXT"} || "/gnome/usr/bin/xgettext";
[06:18] <mdz> Goshawk: great, thanks
[06:19] <koke> my memory failed :D
[06:19] <mdz> Mithrandir: we'll reopen for general bugfixing initially, basically FeatureFreeze process
[06:19] <Mithrandir> mdz: ok
[06:21] <seb128> koke: http://ftp.gnome.org/pub/GNOME/sources/gnome-desktop/2.10/gnome-desktop-2.10.0.tar.bz2
[06:21] <seb128> koke:     my $XGETTEXT = $ENV{"XGETTEXT"} || "/gnome/usr/bin/xgettext";
[06:21] <seb128> koke: how is the upstream tarball "clean" ?
[06:22] <koke> ok, I haven't seen them all.
[06:22] <koke> I've randomly chosen the bad from ubuntu and the good from gnome :(
[06:22] <seb128> you are trying to say than packages have issue ? or do you have issues with upstream tarballs ?
[06:23] <koke> nop, it seems the problem is at upstream
[06:23] <seb128> k
[06:25] <Kamion> Mithrandir: ok, I think I just suck, I was trying to SUBST into Default:, which debconf-devel(7) explicitly says won't work
[06:26] <mdz> elmo: are you around?  when do you head home?
[06:28] <elmo> mdz: in about 4.5 hours
[06:29] <mdz> elmo: can you do some germinate/archive resync before then?
[06:48] <elmo> mdz: updated sync.txt - did I miss approval for any on that list?
[06:49] <mdz> elmo: dbus-qt-1-dev
[06:49] <elmo> ok, done too
[06:50] <mdz> it is possible that KDE 3.4 will require a few more
[06:50] <mdz> I'm trying to get a list from #kubuntu-devel now
[06:50] <jordi> mdz: moo
[06:50] <mdz> jordi: baaa
[06:52] <elmo> Kamion: sdf got demoted - if you care; sdf-doc is still seeded tho...
[06:52] <lamont> fabbione: you around?
[06:54] <mdz> pitti: did you and daniels resolve the german keymap issue?
[06:54] <pitti> mdz: not yet, I just sent him some debug output
[06:54] <mdz> it would be nice to be able to fix that for preview
[06:54] <elmo> pitti: done
[06:54] <pitti> elmo: thanks
[06:54] <pitti> mdz: indeed, it's pretty ugly for the live CD
[06:55] <Kamion> elmo: not especially :)
[06:55] <mdz> elmo: what's pulling in hevea?  it's not in Kamion's germinate output
[06:55] <mdz> sparc?
[06:55] <Kamion> we could unseed sdf-doc
[06:56] <elmo> mdz: yapps2 b-d
[06:56] <elmo> can't see how that could be sparc
[06:56] <lamont> fabbione: has your buildd tried gmime2.1 yet?
[06:57] <elmo> hevea                                             | hevea                           | yapps2 (Build-Depend)                           
[06:57] <elmo> yapps2                                            | yapps2                          | keymapper (Build-Depend)                     
[06:57] <mdz> but the rdepends tree ends there
[06:57] <mdz> hmm, incomplete rdepends from germinate then
[06:58] <mdz> elmo: hevea can be promoted
[06:58] <Kamion> it doesn't follow back through reverse build-deps, I'm not entirely sure why
[06:58] <Kamion> it would be useful if it did
[06:58] <mdz> we already have the crazy ocaml stuff in main
[06:59] <elmo> mdz: I put my 'ALL' in the same dir, FWIW
[06:59] <mdz> thanks
[06:59] <elmo> and promoted hevea
[06:59] <Mithrandir> Kamion: oh, that sucks.
[06:59] <Kamion> Mithrandir: (I'm fixing it)
[07:00] <Kamion> just attempting to test
[07:00] <elmo> promoting libkipi source as obvious
[07:00] <elmo> IMO libkipi0-dev would be too - i.e. we already have libkipi
[07:00] <mdz> pitti: do you have a moment to review t1utils?  it seems to be another part of the hpoj build-depends mess
[07:00] <mdz> elmo: agreed
[07:00] <pitti> mdz: yes, I'll do that
[07:01] <elmo> done, updated sync.txt
[07:03] <mdz> elmo: python2.4-dictdlib is fine
[07:03] <pitti> mdz: looks fine to me (and, in fact, useful :-) )
[07:03] <mdz> elmo: and t1utils (thanks, pitti)
[07:04] <pitti> mdz: btw, do you think we can keep polypaudio for Hoary?
[07:04] <mdz> pitti: it is working well for me, but jdub seems to feel that we should revert to esound
[07:05] <pitti> mdz: hmm, a pity, I spent over 4 hours to get it fixed :-/
[07:05] <Kamion> didn't jdub say that before it got fixed?
[07:05] <pitti> yes
[07:05] <pitti> but I don't know his opinion now
[07:06] <pitti> it's now working fine both on my i386 and my ppc
[07:06] <ogra> i think there was no clear statement after the fix from him
[07:09] <elmo> mdz: both done
[07:14] <mdz> Kamion: he was saying that as recently as yesterday
[07:14] <mdz> pitti: can you review sqlite3 for kubuntu?
[07:16] <mdz> elmo: if scribus doesn't depend on sqlite3, it can go in as well
[07:16] <mdz> doesn't look like it does
[07:17] <mdz> seb128: wow, lots of good stuff for totem
[07:17] <tseng> has seb set a record yet for most consecutive uploads?
[07:18] <seb128> mdz: yep
[07:19] <lamont> mdz: looking for input on #6232 (installing postfix won't add an alias for root to an existing /etc/aliases)
[07:19] <seb128> mdz: this one is impressive too: http://ftp.gnome.org/pub/GNOME/sources/gst-plugins/0.8/gst-plugins-0.8.8.news
[07:19] <elmo> mdz: done
[07:20] <trukulo> ogra, you there?
[07:20] <ogra> yup
[07:21] <trukulo> nothing, i was going to tell you about uploading clearworks engine gtk2 to hoary... but it's uploaded  :)
[07:21] <trukulo> forget it
[07:24] <elmo> pitti: DUDE
[07:24] <elmo> why are you rebuilding stuff that's in freaking universe?
[07:24] <Mithrandir> lamont: possibly on initial install, not on upgrades.
[07:25] <lamont> Mithrandir: right
[07:26] <Mithrandir> lamont: the right solution is of course to have an /etc/aliases.d directory which is used to generate /var/lib/aliases.db which is used by different mailers.
[07:26] <Mithrandir> and stuff in /etc/aliases.d be conffiles)
[07:26] <Mithrandir> s/\)//
[07:27] <lamont> it's a file with a fixed format, and a long history...
[07:27] <Mithrandir> lamont: seriously, how would you else do it?
[07:27] <mxpxpod> does gnome-volume-control not work for anyone else on ppc?
[07:27] <Mithrandir> lamont: how do you handle the case of an user changing from exim4 to postfix and having removed the root alias from /etc/aliases?
[07:28] <mxpxpod> wait, nevermind... it's now working
[07:28] <lamont> Mithrandir: well, the issue is that root shouldn't go to it's own mailbox, since no sane individual actually runs an MUA as root....
[07:28] <lamont> that and postfix delivers root mail as nobody
[07:28] <mvo> ping Mithrandir 
[07:28] <Mithrandir> mvo: no need to ping me when I'm active in the channel :)
[07:29] <mvo> Mithrandir: sorry, it was this stupid xchat completion
[07:29] <mvo> Mitario: ping
[07:29] <Mithrandir> lamont: imagine /root/.forward or using procmail to do Stuff to root's mail.
[07:29] <mvo> Mithrandir: see :) it just _always_ get's the nicks wrong :)
[07:29] <Kamion> mdz: it only got fixed this morning though :)
[07:30] <Mithrandir> mvo: it's allowed to actually _read_ what you're typing. :)
[07:30] <lamont> Mithrandir: right.  and postfix will happy toss root's mail to procmail. with an euid=ruid=nobody
[07:31] <Mithrandir> that can be fine to do.
[07:32] <Mithrandir> lamont: if you modify files in /etc you might very easily be overwriting local changes.  That's bad.
[07:32] <lamont> ah, so you're saying that if ~root/.forward exists, then it shouldn't create the alias either?
[07:33] <Mithrandir> I'm just saying that's a possible use case and there's no real way to do what you want to do without using a directory which is aggregated.
[07:33] <Mithrandir> no matter whether it's ugly or not
[07:33] <mvo> Mithrandir: heh :) sometimes I type faster than I think (well, actually most of the time ;)
[07:36] <trukulo> ogra, new graveman doesn't discover devices
[07:36] <ogra> hmm, it does here
[07:37] <trukulo> ogra, it doesn't if device is mounted
[07:37] <trukulo> if not, works well
[07:37] <ogra> oh
[07:37] <trukulo> interesting
[07:37] <trukulo> problems with hal, it seems
[07:37] <ogra> trukulo, do you know if he switched to hal
[07:38] <trukulo> i don't think so , because in debian we don't use it
[07:38] <ogra> i suggested that to him and he said hw would try....
[07:39] <ogra> trukulo: how does n-c-b work then in debian ? afaik it uses hal the same way
[07:39] <trukulo> ogra, if it's installed yes
[07:39] <mdz> seb128: wow, that's great too
[07:39] <trukulo> but you can use gnome without hal
[07:39] <mdz> the gstreamer and totem guys have been busy
[07:40] <ogra> trukulo: i mustadmint that i didnt try the detection with a mountd disc....
[07:40] <trukulo> ogra, i did unconsciently, you know
[07:40] <trukulo> and i see the problem
[07:42] <Kamion> Mithrandir: ok, choose-mirror 1.06ubuntu7 really fixes it
[07:43] <Mithrandir> Kamion: cool, thanks.  We worked around it, though.
[07:44] <Kamion> Mithrandir: I'm guessing preseeding mirror/http/mirror and mirror/http/directory would have worked around it
[07:44] <Mithrandir> possibly, yes
[07:45] <trukulo> fabbione, are you there? how can i upgrade from linux-2.6.10-X to last version?
[07:45] <trukulo> i mean, 2.6.10-25
[07:46] <fabbione> trukulo: the same way you did up till now :-)
[07:47] <mdz> Kamion: are you feeling pretty confident about the base-installer kernel stuff now?
[07:47] <pitti> elmo: I'm back, what's wrong?
[07:47] <trukulo> fabbione, aptitude dist-upgrade ?
[07:47] <elmo> pitti: muine is in your list of "things with which to make mirrors regret having ever heard of Ubuntu" and it's not in main
[07:48] <Treenaks> elmo: it's huge, uploaded often and universe?
[07:48] <pitti> elmo: you mean in http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/unstripped-hoary-main.txt ? It's not there
[07:48] <trukulo> fabbione, forget it, i'll read on google
[07:48] <jdub> finally, the gst-plugins and totem releases we've been waiting for!
[07:48] <jdub> hooray for upstream!
[07:49] <jdub> hooray for seb!
[07:49] <jdub> but mostly hooray for seb ;)
[07:49] <elmo> pitti: lamont pointed me at http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/hoary-main-gettext.txt 
[07:49] <ogra> yay+
[07:49] <mdz> elmo: kubuntu is going to need at least one new package in main (not in Ubuntu at all yet)
[07:50] <pitti> elmo: ah, for this one; hmm, no idea how it got there...
[07:50] <mdz> pitti: sqlite3 seems fairly sane; do you agree?
[07:51] <pitti> mdz: was at dinner, just returned. I take a look now
[07:51] <mdz> pitti: thanks
[07:51] <elmo> pitti: tomboy too
[07:51] <pitti> elmo: I will update the list ASAP
[07:52] <elmo> pitti: in the mean time, I've installed the build-depends in both i386 and amd64 chroots on concordia
[07:52] <pitti> elmo: cool, thanks
[07:53] <pitti> elmo: including pkgstriptranslations?
[07:53] <elmo> mdz: need as in need before I fly or ?
[07:53] <pitti> elmo: I can install this locally if necessary
[07:53] <dholbach> seb128: uploaded libglademm2.4 (http://ubuntu.gplan.info/mm)
[07:53] <seb128> dholbach: k
[07:54] <mxpxpod> fabbione: ping
[07:54] <mdz> elmo: if at all possible
[07:54] <elmo> pitti: installed
[07:54] <fabbione> mxpxpod: pong
[07:54] <mxpxpod> fabbione: back from the honeymoon?
[07:54] <pitti> elmo: can you please enable it in /etc/pkgstriptranslations.conf?
[07:55] <elmo> uh
[07:55] <elmo> what's that do?
[07:55] <fabbione> mxpxpod: yes :-(
[07:55] <pitti> elmo: if you don't want to do this, then I install pkgstriptranslations in my $HOME/Bin
[07:55] <mxpxpod> fabbione: how was it?
[07:56] <pitti> elmo: it was decided to disable it by default, so that users don't mess up their builds if they accidentially install it
[07:56] <pitti> elmo: I think $HOME/bin is actually a good idea, then other folks can still use the dchroots for their purposes
[07:56] <fabbione> mxpxpod: great, thanks
[07:57] <tseng> wb fabbione
[07:57] <mxpxpod> fabbione: how long will it be until we get 2.6.11 into universe (not the -rc's)
[07:58] <fabbione> mxpxpod: a few days.. i need to catch up on a lot of things and .11 is not high priority
[07:58] <mxpxpod> fabbione: that's cool... just wanted an eta
[07:58] <fabbione> but i will try my best :-)
[07:58] <mxpxpod> I'd like to try out .11 asap because of the ppc changes
[07:58] <pitti> mdz: sqlite3 is thumbs up (debs and packaging)
[07:58] <mxpxpod> fabbione: awesome... btw, congrats on the marriage
[07:58] <fabbione> mxpxpod: most of the ppc changes have been backported to .10 afaics
[07:58] <mdz> pitti: thanks
[07:58] <fabbione> mxpxpod: eheh thanks
[07:59] <mxpxpod> fabbione: yeah, I've tried the 2.6.10 changes (and the 2.6.10 ubuntu kernel) and it freezes
[07:59] <fabbione> mxpxpod: did you report the problem?
[07:59] <mxpxpod> fabbione: nah, didn't have a connection at the time
[08:00] <fabbione> well.. now you do :-)
[08:00] <fabbione> please report it in details
[08:00] <mxpxpod> fabbione: I have to get back to work in a minute
[08:00] <mxpxpod> fabbione: I'll do it after work
[08:00] <fabbione> ok
[08:00] <mxpxpod> fabbione: what do you mean by, "in details"
[08:00] <fabbione> with all possible details
[08:00] <fabbione> dmesg
[08:00] <fabbione> logs
[08:01] <mxpxpod> I don't know many details except that it froze on wakeup
[08:01] <amu> elmo: now it's urgent, please sync libassuan-dev asap
[08:01] <fabbione> is it reproducible?
[08:01] <fabbione> or it happened only once...
[08:01] <fabbione> and so on...
[08:01] <mxpxpod> fabbione: yeah, it did it twice
[08:01] <elmo> amu: source pkg names for sync requests, pls
[08:01] <mxpxpod> fabbione: ok, will do
[08:01] <Kamion> mdz: can I upload to fix that mdadm fail message?
[08:02] <mx|gone> fabbione: time to get back to work :)
[08:02] <Kamion> mdz: I've tested my base-installer changes of today and I'm pretty sure they're right
[08:02] <mdz> Kamion: yes
[08:02] <amu> elmo: libassuan
[08:04] <elmo> [Updating]  libassuan (0.6.8-1 [ubuntu]  < 0.6.9-2 [debian] )
[08:04] <elmo> this is presumably going to main if it's needed for kubuntu ... ?
[08:04] <elmo> if so, new upstream version okay, mdz?
[08:04] <mdz> it's in universe presently
[08:05] <mdz> so yes, fine
[08:05] <mdz> elmo: this is one of the packages which will need to move into main when 3.4 is uploaded, as I understand it
[08:06] <Kamion> elmo: please move GNOME to universe, kthxbye
[08:06] <elmo> Kamion: done
[08:06] <trukulo> Kamion, heh
[08:06] <Kamion> that'll be my contribution to tonight's mirror hit
[08:07] <amu> Kamion: hehe
[08:14] <Kamion> tseng: record> I think doko's probably still out in front with one of his zope or python upload extravaganzas
[08:14] <tseng> heh, i forgot about those
[08:15] <Kamion> the last of those was 26 consecutive
[08:16] <Kamion> seb's managed more consecutive uploads than this before, though :)
[08:17] <Kamion>      48 From: Matthias Klose <m@klose.in-berlin.de>
[08:18] <Kamion> after some auto-merges from Scott and another few entries by doko, seb's next with 18
[08:19] <Kamion> at least in the hoary cycle
[08:19] <Keybuk> heh, I win :p
[08:22] <thom> Keybuk: you've not *done* any of those uploads, though
[08:23] <Mithrandir> doko?
[08:23] <Keybuk> right food time
[08:23] <Keybuk> l8r 
[08:25] <doko> Mithrandir: I'm working on automating these ...
[08:26] <Mithrandir> doko: ia32-libs on ia64 needs to provide libgcc1 for ia32-libs-openoffice.org, but the latter has a versioned dependency.  Any thoughts?
[08:28] <crimsun_> elmo, has my email address been added to the white-list for uploads, and has my GPG key been added to the keyring?
[08:29] <tseng> are we going to pick up the memory optimization patches after preview?
[08:29] <tseng> for gnome that is
[08:29] <doko> Mithrandir: hmm, not really ... maybe I'll build a cross compiler for hoary+1, just building the 32 bit libgcc1 ...
[08:31] <Mithrandir> doko: I'm hoping to have some multiarch stuff in hoary+1 which should be enough for that.
[08:32] <dholbach> elmo: could you please sync gtranslator from sid, if you find the time?
[08:37] <doko> mdz: ok to upload gsfonts to fix #3138 (bold Nimbus Roman font isn't displayed)
[08:37] <doko> ?
[08:37] <mdz> doko: ooh, yes please
[08:39] <sabdfl> doko: lovely!
[08:41] <doko> long search, small fix
[08:41] <thom> mdz: ok to upload firefox 1.0.1? (security fixes, etc)
[08:41] <dholbach> thom: yes! go! go! go! :-)
[08:41] <pitti> thom: ++
[08:41] <mdz> thom: hmmm
[08:41] <mdz> I'm not sure that's wise for preview
[08:42] <pitti> pleeeeease :-)
[08:42] <pitti> 1.0.1-1ubuntu2reverted-to-1.0.0 ... :-)
[08:42] <dholbach> hehe
[08:42] <mdz> it's certainly fine for final, I'm just unsure about preview
[08:43] <mdz> we have only two days to sort out any issues
[08:43] <mdz> thom: what's your risk assessment?
[08:43] <Mithrandir> doko: do you have any good ideas on how to solve the problem for ia64 for hoary?
[08:44] <Mithrandir> I have one idea, which is to have ia32-libs generate an lib32gcc1 package.. but that's _ugly_
[08:44] <mdz> thom: can you mail me a debdiff?
[08:44] <thom> mdz: the debdiff is *big*
[08:44] <mdz> thom: if your response is "omfg no, it's 50 megs"...
[08:45] <mdz> then that's an indication that maybe we should be cautious with it :-)
[08:45] <thom> mdz: because a tonne of patches have gone from me cherry picking to upstream
[08:45] <thom> oh, real debdiff sorry
[08:45] <thom> hang on
[08:47] <pitti> mdz: okay for you to upload a lesstif1-1 security fix? I'm asking because the fix for CAN-2004-0914 is very big
[08:47] <pitti> mdz: however, it is well tested from Warty and X.org
[08:48] <mdz> pitti: how severe is the vulnerability?
[08:49] <pitti> mdz: the usual thing, buffer overflow with malicious xpm files; no server applications using it, though (-> no priv escalation)
[08:49] <doko> mithrandir: let me build a cross compiler, and see, how the cross compiled libgcc 1 is looking
[08:50] <elmo> lesstif just got demoted
[08:50] <Mithrandir> doko: ok
[08:50] <elmo> I think
[08:50] <pitti> elmo: lesstif1 (thaaaaaaanks!!!), but not lesstif2
[08:50] <mdz> I was just about to say
[08:50] <mdz> what is it doing in main?
[08:50] <thom> sweet mother of god. debdiff is trying to extract 2 firefox sourcetrees into /tmp
[08:50] <mdz> so yes, go ahead
[08:50] <pitti> mdz: the fixes affect lesstif2, too
[08:51] <pitti> mdz: I don't understand why we put lesstif1 into main for warty, too; now it's causing me headaches :-/
[08:52] <lamont> mdz: I'll plan on uploading 6232 after the preview, unless you want it before
[08:52] <amu> pitti: could i delay kdegraphics (xpdf) a bit? is it urgent? is tomorrow fine for you?   
[08:53] <elmo> vim??
[08:53] <pitti> amu: depends on whether mdz wants it for the preview
[08:53] <haggai> amu: I can look at it
[08:53] <elmo> (that's why we have lesstif apparently)
[08:53] <elmo> that and xpdf
[08:54] <mdz> pitti, amu: what is the question?
[08:54] <pitti> elmo: vim does not need lesstif1, neither does xpdf (that uses lesstif2)
[08:54] <mdz> elmo: hmm, so when we move to gpdf, we can get rid of it
[08:54] <mdz> pitti: he was talking about lesstif2
[08:55] <mdz> it would be nice to demote lesstif2 to universe too :-)
[08:55] <pitti> right :-)
[08:55] <pitti> still, why vim?
[08:56] <mdz> vim-lesstif
[08:56] <mdz> for the ugliest editor possible
[08:56] <pitti> ah, build dependency
[08:56] <elmo> vim-will-build-frontend-for-food
[08:56] <pitti> D'oh
[08:57] <thom> mdz:  416 files changed, 5298 insertions(+), 3016 deletions(-)
[08:58] <bluefoxicy> uh
[08:58] <pitti> mdz: I'm sure that we can drop vim-lesstif for hoary+1 :-)
[08:58] <lamont> fabbione: around?
[08:58] <fabbione> lamont: yes
[08:58] <ajmitch> dholbach: ghost train?
[08:58] <lamont> is the sparc wanna-build --list=all output wgetable somewhere?
[08:58] <pitti> bluefoxicy: what's wrong with the Ubuntu version?
[08:58] <lamont> hrm.. I suppose I could just login and check,.....
[08:58] <sivang> pitti: there are patches to make cupsys and g-c-l use dbus and listen for printer hotplug events, what do you think about including them to make new printers automatically appear (_local_ ones) when plugged into the computer?
[08:59] <fabbione> lamont: no, but i can make it so in a sec :-)
[08:59] <bluefoxicy> pitti:  in Gentoo, vim comes with something that makes everything colorful
[08:59] <mdz> thom: gzip+mail?
[08:59] <pitti> bluefoxicy: Ubuntu has that, too
[08:59] <bluefoxicy> like if you edit a .c file, comments are dark blue, if statements and variable types are green, etc.
[08:59] <pitti> bluefoxicy: :syntax enable
[08:59] <thom> mdz: yup, doing so now
[08:59] <dholbach> ajmitch: because of "<mdz> it would be nice to demote lesstif2 to universe too :-)"
[08:59] <bluefoxicy> pitti:  Oh, it's in there but not on by default
[08:59] <fabbione> lamont: do you need it constantly updated?
[09:00] <ajmitch> dholbach: ok, I must be missing some reference or something :)
[09:00] <lamont> nah
[09:00] <fabbione> ok
[09:00] <lamont> actually just want to know if gmime2.1 built
[09:00] <bluefoxicy> pitti:  thanks, added it to my .exrc
[09:00] <fabbione> lamont: bbl.. dinner is ready
[09:01] <pitti> mdz: lesstif successfully built, tested and ready to upload. now or after preview?
[09:01] <lamont> bah. mono
[09:02] <lamont> now I'm going to have to actually _figure_out_ what changed and such. :-(
[09:02] <tseng> whats up lamont 
[09:02] <mdz> pitti: if you test xpdf first, yes
[09:02] <pitti> mdz: already tested :-)
[09:02] <mdz> ok
[09:03] <trukulo> one question: warty is iso-code-based and hoary utf8, isn't it?
[09:03] <thom> mdz: the docshell changes are the fix for the window injection vuln and that's the biggest change
[09:03] <Kamion> that's simplistic. You can use UTF-8 in Warty.
[09:04] <Kamion> Warty's default for most languages is non-UTF-8, and Hoary's default is UTF-8.
[09:05] <lamont> tseng: was looking at a bug that involved sparc and gmime2.1 (but not a gmime2.1 bug)
[09:05] <lamont> gmime2.1 is currently ftbfs on hoary/sparc because mono-utils is missing.
[09:05] <tseng> ah
[09:05] <lamont> so I get to go really look at what's going on.
[09:05] <mdz> window injection doesn't scare me much
[09:05] <lamont> so much for the trivial 'doesn't apply to hoary' check
[09:05] <mdz> firefox churn before preview scares me more :-)
[09:05] <thom> heh, fair enough
[09:06] <thom> i'll hold it and mozilla till thursday then 
[09:06] <lamont> mdz: you're only saying that because of the firefox/warty cluster.
[09:07] <trukulo> Kamion, yes, i ask 'by default'
[09:08] <trukulo> will be any script that automatically change iso codes from warty to hoary when it's released?
[09:08] <trukulo> i mean, not having to do by hand 'sudo dpkg-reconfigure locales'
[09:10] <mdz> lamont: fool me once, shame on you...
[09:11] <lamont> mds: "fool me 27 times....."
[09:11] <mdz> md "rigid and boring" z
[09:12] <thom> mdz: *giggle* at zsh advocacy in the bash completion thread
[09:12] <T-Bone> lamont: heh, you betcha :)
[09:12] <mdz> thom: do you think it's doable to have auto-torrent-love starting with preview?
[09:12] <trukulo> and does tty* can use utf8 ?
[09:13] <mdz> thom: how badly does it screw downloaders when the tracker gets restarted?
[09:13] <thom> mdz: hardly at all, they just reconnect
[09:14] <thom> mdz: i'm gonna take a hammer to it tomorrow and make sure it works
[09:14] <mdz> great, thanks
[09:15] <mdz> I expect that we'll be asking a lot of users to download the dailies following preview to test fixes; it'd be good to have torrents for them
[09:16] <thom> sure
[09:18] <LBM> ipw2200 module is quite outdated
[09:18] <LBM> lot's of fixes
[09:18] <LBM> ubuntu version is 0.19, latest release is 1.0.1
[09:18] <zul> yes we know
[09:18] <LBM> any plans about bumping the version?
[09:19] <zul> yes after hoary is released
[09:19] <LBM> :/
[09:19] <LBM> well, okay
[09:20] <mdz> LBM: 0.19 was current at the time our freeze began
[09:20] <LBM> mdz: when did you freeze?
[09:20] <mdz> LBM: early January
[09:20] <mdz> 0.19 released December 20th
[09:20] <LBM> mdz: i see, a shame
[09:21] <LBM> lot's of resume related bugs fixed, right now
[09:21] <mdz> 0.19 works pretty well for me, though it does occasionally get confused and log errors
[09:21] <LBM> right now it's quite sensitive
[09:21] <mdz> it's up to the kernel team whether they feel it would be safe to update it before the hoary release
[09:22] <mdz> though we definitely won't be changing it for the preview release
[09:22] <LBM> would be great
[09:22] <T-Bone> i suppose we could have a look, but it will require testing
[09:22] <T-Bone> *thorough* testing, that is
[09:23] <LBM> i'm ready to help you out
[09:23] <T-Bone> that's good news
[09:23] <LBM> hand me some debs ;9
[09:23] <T-Bone> heh. As mdz pointed out, you'll have to wait post preview freeze
[09:23] <T-Bone> that is, nothing before next week
[09:23] <LBM> sounds great
[09:24] <LBM> and netapplet, any plans on that one?
[09:25] <mdz> netapplet was a target for Hoary, but it just isn't ready
[09:25] <mdz> post-Hoary we'll probably go for NetworkManager
[09:25] <mdz> meanwhile, netapplet is available in universe
[09:27] <LBM> i noticed that, yes
[09:35] <fabbione> lamont: http://www.fabbione.net/sparc-list
[09:36] <thom> lamont: what was the fix?
[09:36] <lamont> -Files: /usr/share/doc/libxslt1-dev/html/*.html
[09:36] <lamont> -Files: /usr/share/doc/libxslt1-dev/EXSLT/*.html
[09:36] <lamont> -Files: /usr/share/doc/libxslt1-dev/EXSLT/html/*.html
[09:36] <lamont> -Files: /usr/share/doc/libxslt1-dev/tutorial*/*.html
[09:36] <lamont> + /usr/share/doc/libxslt1-dev/html/*.html
[09:36] <lamont> + /usr/share/doc/libxslt1-dev/EXSLT/*.html
[09:37] <lamont> + /usr/share/doc/libxslt1-dev/EXSLT/html/*.html
[09:37] <lamont> + /usr/share/doc/libxslt1-dev/tutorial*/*.html
[09:37] <lamont> which is to say, fix the input data instead of the actual segv-causing-source
[09:39] <thom> meh
[09:43] <sivang> hey mvo 
[09:43] <mvo> hey sivang 
[09:44] <dholbach> wb mvo
[09:55] <lamont> thom: exactly
[10:10] <sladen> abrelli: depends what for, Xen, UML, vserver have an overlapping feature set in someways, but shine in certain circumstances
[10:12] <zul> later off to shovel snow whoope..
[10:21] <seb128> pitti: around ?
[10:21] <pitti> seb128: yes
[10:21] <seb128> could you kick new language-packs ?
[10:22] <pitti> seb128: I can, when is your upload rave finished=
[10:22] <pitti> s/=/?/
[10:23] <seb128> should be fine for today, that's why I'm asking
[10:23] <pitti> seb128: I mean, the packages must be finished building
[10:23] <seb128> I would like to take screenshot for the 2.10 french announce
[10:23] <seb128> and I need working translations :p
[10:23] <pitti> seb128: okay, this will certainly require some domain overrides
[10:23] <pitti> seb128: and some packages produce more than one domain, I have to pick there
[10:23] <pitti> seb128: are there still unbuilt packages?
[10:23] <seb128> what do you call "domain" ?
[10:24] <pitti> seb128: translation domain
[10:24] <seb128> apt-get wants to downgrade  gnome-system-monitor gpdf libglademm-2.4-1 libgtop2-5 libgtop2-dev
[10:24] <pitti> seb128: /usr/share/locale/<lang>/LC_MESSAGES/<domain>.mo
[10:24] <seb128> do I guess these ones for today, but that's good enough
[10:24] <seb128> oh, k
[10:24] <seb128> like gtk ? :)
[10:24] <pitti> seb128: yes, gtk is the most prominent example
[10:25] <seb128> so you just drop one of the domains ?
[10:25] <pitti> ye
[10:25] <pitti> s
[10:25] <seb128> urg
[10:25] <pitti> seb128: sorry :-(
[10:25] <seb128> bah, probably not a big deal, but still ugly :)
[10:25] <pitti> seb128: but I'm barely awake enough to kick new langpacks, I can't rewrite the scripts today any more
[10:25] <seb128> apps have one domain so that's mostly fine
[10:26] <seb128> pitti: don't bother, update them tomorrow, take some sleep now if you want
[10:26] <seb128> I can take the screenshots tomorrow
[10:27] <pitti> seb128: I start now, but will probably finish tomorrow
[10:27] <seb128> k, thanks
[10:29] <ogra> seb128: lots of nice traffic on hoary changes today, thanks.... :)
[10:29] <seb128> thank you :)
[10:30] <elmo> iz gnome build bot
[10:30] <ogra> yay
[10:30] <sivang> seb128: screenshots?
[10:30] <sivang> seb128: ah, just read the backlog :)
[10:30] <seb128> sivang: of what ?
[10:30] <seb128> k
[10:30] <pitti> seb128: people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/translations/20050307   -> lots of stuff :-)
[10:30] <ogra> sivang: nah, its rather a daemon
[10:30] <sivang> ogra: what?
[10:31] <seb128> pitti: yeah, pretty nice packaging day :)
[10:31] <ogra> sivang,  gnome build bot :)
[10:31] <sivang> ogra: ah hehe
[10:31] <ajmitch> seb128: you make our internet connections hurt today :)
[10:32] <ogra> sivang, you know, it runs in the background and suddenly throws a hell of a lot of packages at you
[10:32] <seb128> ajmitch: ah ah
[10:32] <ogra> sivang, and its really mature (v128 already)
[10:33] <sivang> seb128: btw, finished 2.10 ?
[10:33] <seb128> nop
[10:33] <sivang> seb128: ah ok, but was a bug bunch today :)
[10:33] <sivang> s/bug/big/
[10:34] <seb128> yeah
[10:34] <seb128> tomorrow probably all the ximian stuff
[10:35] <Amaranth> ximian stuff?
[10:35] <sivang> seb128: all I can say, thank you for turning apt into my cvs frontend :)
[10:36] <seb128> ;)
[10:43] <jordi> tomorrow daf will take us to belfast
[10:43] <jordi> OH YEAH
[10:43] <jordi> Picadilly line, all the way to the Catholic area.
[10:44] <haggai> lamont: mdz says I can ask you to add a dep-wait for me.  Amarok needs to dep-wait on kdebase 4:3.4.0-0pre1ubuntu2
[10:45] <pitti> mdz: the perl failure is new to 5.8.4-7, bod experienced it, too
[10:45] <Riddell> jordi: what are you doing in belfast?
[10:45] <jordi> Riddell: I'm in London with the Rosetta dudes. But we'll take the tube to Belfast tomorrow.
[10:46] <Riddell> jordi: tube to belfast eh?  that must be a new line on the underground
[10:46] <jordi> Riddell: yeah dude! it's so great
[10:47] <jordi> the other end takes you to Manchester, but I have no more time for Manchester (or liverpool)
[10:47] <Riddell> jordi: but what's the crack in Belfast?  Going to add Ulster Scots?
[10:48] <jordi> Riddell: there's lots of police there
[10:48] <Riddell> jordi: well just don't take a black taxi, they're dodgey as anything
[10:49] <Amaranth> wow
[10:49] <Amaranth> i read about the new release of gstreamer plugins _after_ i already had them
[10:54] <mdke> mplayer is in universe/multiverse now right? it is better to use the ubuntu version than the marillat ones?
[10:54] <tseng> ubuntu is synced from marillat iirc
[10:55] <trukulo> mdke, depend if you want things like w32codecs or dvdcss
[10:55] <mdke> just mplayer pls
[10:55] <trukulo> tseng, with support for w32codecs too ?
[10:55] <mdke> i'm trying to make some sense of the restricted formats wiki
[10:55] <tseng> well, mplayer supports w32codecs as soon as you add them
[10:55] <tseng> they just arent in ubuntu
[10:55] <trukulo> ah, ok
[10:56] <tseng> xine can use them also
[10:56] <mdke> tseng, so mplayer-*-ubuntu* will work with w32codecs?
[10:56] <trukulo> so you can add it from marillat repository
[10:56] <mdke> its not necessary to have mplayer-*-woody from marillat?
[10:56] <HrdwrBoB> mdke: yes, the w32codecs just plonk windows files in s directory which mplayer reads
[10:56] <HrdwrBoB> there's no actual libraries or anything
[10:57] <mdke> HrdwrBoB, ok thanks.
[10:57] <mdke> one more thing
[10:57] <mdke> is it better to use the ubuntu mplayer build or the marillat/woody one?
[10:57] <HrdwrBoB> not sure tbh
[10:57] <HrdwrBoB> if you're using the marillat repository anyway
[10:58] <lamont> haggai: note that pre1ubuntu1 was ftbfs...
[10:58] <HrdwrBoB> put them both in
[10:58] <HrdwrBoB> and just get whatever comes in first :)
[10:58] <haggai> lamont: I just uploaded 2
[10:58] <lamont> and amarok is currently building a place or 2 - I'll have to d-w it after it finishes failing...
[10:58] <lamont> but will do so
[10:58] <HrdwrBoB> (bear in mind that the defaults for marillat are somewhat braindead and default to using 'x11' rather than xv or sdl
[10:58] <haggai> lamont: thanks
[10:58] <mdke> HrdwrBoB, hmm
[10:58] <lamont> right now, I need to be not here... back in about 90 min or so
[11:00] <mdke> anyone else have an opinion on the mplayer-marillat / mplayer-ubuntu build difference?
[11:01] <tseng> we've gave you several I believe
[11:01] <tseng> *given
[11:02] <mdke> erm
[11:03] <tseng> btw, this isnt a support channel. this question would be better asked on #ubuntu in the future please
[11:03] <mdke> i'm not asking for support
[11:03] <mdke> but i hear and obey
[11:04] <psy_> hi
[11:05] <pitti> seb128: d'oh, many packages don't have a pot file 
[11:08] <seb128> pitti: do you need it ?
[11:08] <pitti> seb128: I use it as a heuristic to find out the translation domain
[11:08] <pitti> seb128: now I have to alter my scripts
[11:09] <seb128> bah, do that tomorrow
[11:09] <seb128> I don't want to bother you
[11:09] <pitti> seb128: I have to do that anyway
[11:16] <dholbach> i'm off to bed
[11:16] <dholbach> good night everyone
[11:17] <pitti> night dholbach 
[11:17] <dholbach> bye pitti
[11:26] <pitti> lamont: is it possible that some buildds still have the old pkgstriptranslations? I still have some broken tarballs without mo files
[11:26] <pitti> mvo: night
[11:26] <mvo> pitti: good night
[11:28] <jbailey> T-Bone: ping?
[11:33] <lamont> pitti: adare had 8
[11:33] <lamont> fixed
[11:33] <pitti> lamont: ah, that explains it, thanks
[11:34] <lamont> lesstif1-1 doesn't like you, but I assume you know that (ubuntu1.2, that is)
[11:34] <seb128> lamont: any build issue with 2.10 packages ?
[11:35] <lamont> seb128: the only logfiles I currently have in =buildd/main are from a package of pitti's/
[11:35] <T-Bone> jbailey: pong
[11:35] <T-Bone> jbailey: sorry, was watching some Anime again :)
[11:36] <jbailey> T-Bone: Lol, what?  You're not just sitting around waiting for me to talk to you?  For shame! ;)
[11:36] <T-Bone> jbailey: damn you ;)
[11:36] <seb128> lamont: nice :)
[11:36] <T-Bone> jbailey: otoh I'm improving my anime knowledge database for you :)
[11:36] <lamont> so popcon.ubuntu.com is the real location, yes?
[11:37] <enrico> Hello.  Is #ubuntu-meeting free next thursday from 17.00 to 18.00 UTC?
[11:37] <lamont> thom: you around?
[11:38] <pitti> seb128: still here?
[11:40] <seb128> pitti: yep probably 2 hours before sleeping
[11:41] <pitti> seb128: do you still have a gnome-themes build tree? can you please check that the translation domain is indeed "gnome-themes"?
[11:41] <pitti> seb128: that's one of the packages with a broken translation tarball
[11:42] <seb128> pitti: gnome-themes.mo
[11:43] <pitti> seb128: thanks
[11:43] <seb128> np
[11:43] <seb128> hum
[11:44] <seb128> do we have a build chain change ?
[11:44] <ogra> enrico: MOTU uses it monthly on thursdays at this time but the next MOTU meeting is on march 31, so i would assume yes....
[11:44] <seb128> wnck has jus dropped a list of internal symboles with no reason
[11:44] <enrico> ogra: ok.  Then the Docteam 0WNZ it
[11:44] <seb128> no code change with the previous upload
[11:44] <enrico> if it's busy, then we take the room in the front
[11:44] <ogra> heh
[11:45] <seb128> lamont: ?
[11:45] <ogra> enrico: i just thought we could have a testcase for the new hula-server package thats about to enter universe :) 
[11:46] <enrico> hula-server?
[11:46] <ogra> yup, herzi packaged it 
[11:46] <enrico> ogra: does it have something to do with those large rings one spins around their body?
[11:47] <thom> lamont: sortakinda
[11:47] <lamont> seb128: buildd auto upgrades every night
[11:47] <ogra> enrico: lol, probably.... i didnt choose the name... http://www.hula-project.org/Hula_Server
[11:47] <lamont> but it shouldn't drop things unless someone turned on --as-needed or something silly like that...
[11:48] <enrico> ogra: I like the description!
[11:48] <lamont> thom: popcon.ubuntu.com, with it's 5 submissions, is the real location?
[11:48] <thom> real location, need to fix the server
[11:48] <thom> prolly tomorrow
[11:49] <ogra> enrico: yep and you can test it soon :)
[11:49] <pitti> seb128: same for libgnome?
[11:50] <enrico> ogra: I'm curious.  However it seems a bit too featureful to be easy to use: I hope I'm wrong, though
[11:50] <seb128> pitti: libgnome-2.0.mo
[11:50] <lamont> thom: other question - is MYHOST_ID still used?
[11:51] <thom> uh, yeah
[11:51] <seb128> pitti: libgnome-2.0.mo
[11:51] <seb128> ups
[11:51] <pitti> seb128: oh, thanks. that would have been wrong :-)
[11:51] <thom> lamont: i have mail from them too, have been ignoring it for lack of time
[11:51] <lamont> thom: /etc/popularity-contest.conf isn't even used in popcon-upload.py....
[11:52] <lamont> ah, mine just showed up w/in the last hour
[11:52] <ogra> enrico: i didnt try it myself, i'm just happy to have a packge in from a marketing perspective ;) its very fameous
[11:52] <enrico> ogra: cool!
[11:52] <thom> lamont: no, the hostid is used by popcon itself
[11:52] <lamont> thom: so which one of us wants to (a) fix all the debian references in ubuntu's popcon, and (2) answer their mail?
[11:52] <lamont> thom: oh.  ok
[11:53] <pitti> seb128: okay, no problems any more with today's stripped tarballs
[11:53] <seb128> cool
[11:53] <lamont> and the destination host for popcon-upload.py is kinda hardcoded right now too, I note.
[11:53] <thierry> it would be great if there was something in the developper wiki to explain how to make patch...
[11:54] <pitti> seb128: if everything is built, then I can trigger an update
[11:54] <thom> lamont: bounce me your mail or file a bug and i'll do both
[11:54] <seb128> pitti: go go go :)
[11:54] <lamont> thom: coolness
[11:54] <seb128> Removed: _wnck_activate
[11:54] <seb128> Removed: _wnck_activate_workspace
[11:54] <seb128> Removed: _wnck_application_add_window
[11:54] <seb128> Removed: _wnck_application_create
[11:54] <seb128> Removed: _wnck_application_destroy
[11:54] <seb128> etc
[11:54] <lamont> bounced
[11:54] <seb128> same package
[11:54] <thom> yes, hardcoded since i are teh lazy
[11:54] <seb128> built one week ago and now
[11:55] <thom> anyway, bbl
[11:55] <lamont> thom: np
[11:55] <seb128> anybody has an idea on what could change that ?
[11:55] <seb128> that's a diff of the nm -D listing on the lib
[11:55] <lamont> thom: I'll go ahead and reply quickly to them to tell them that I've filed a bug for us to fix our debian references..
[11:55] <thom> k
[11:58] <lamont> thom: #7288 has the email body in it, just for giggles.
[11:59] <thom> lamont: k, cc me on your reply?
[11:59] <lamont> certainly
[11:59] <lamont> thom.may@ubuntu.com, yes?
[11:59] <thom> just thom