mdzit asks the question OK as expected when RECONFIGURE=true12:00
mdzKamion: if you can verify that it doesn't cause any other weirdness for you, that'd be appreciated12:01
mdzI'll prepare a casper upload12:01
danielsif that fixes it, I'll incorporate that into -5, head back to bed for an hour, and will incorporate that into -512:02
danielsand upload -5 more or less as originally planed12:03
danielsor planne12:03
danielsor planned.12:03
mdzdaniels: please post debdiffs from -2->-3 and -3->-412:03
danielsmdz: for the source?12:04
Kamionmdz: CD nearly written, will do12:04
mdzdaniels: yeah, debdiff foo.dsc bar.dsc12:04
mdzKamion: I just hand-edited it in the ramdisk12:04
Kamionthat was my plan also12:04
mdzthere's enough time between casper unpack and 20xconfig to get in there and do the job :-)12:04
KamionI meant the base live CD :)12:04
Kamionoh, don't worry, I do this sort of shit all the time for d-i ...12:05
=== Kamion does an unedited boot for control purposes
mdzcasper upload standing by12:07
danielsmdz: p.u.c/~daniels/xorg/; just noticed another micro-regression12:09
mdzI'm getting a revert-to-6.8.2-2 kind of feeling12:09
Kamionwhat regression?12:09
danielsKamion: the mkfontdir manpage fell out12:10
Kamionoh, can so live without that12:10
Kamionscrew that :)12:10
danielsi'd rather stick with -4 plus the nasty hack12:10
mdzthere are 2 other places where RECONFIGURE has an effect, more untested code12:10
Kamionmdz: reverting to -2 breaks Greek installs again, plus something like five or six other languages; I'd really rather not12:11
danielsmdz: the onnly other spot is making it back the old xorg.conf up and write a new one when it's non-zero, which is desired behaviour anyway12:12
danielsbetween that and the i810 changes, which make life far more pleasant for lots and lots of people, I'd really rather not revert to -212:12
mdzKamion: what fixed Greek installs?12:13
danielsmdz: moving mkfontscale from xbase-clients to xutils12:13
mdzoh, that12:13
Kamionreverting that is highly undesirable for Replaces reasons anyway12:13
danielsmdz: mkfontdir uses mkfontscale exclusively; the former is in xutils, the latter in in xbase-clients, and xutils can't depend on xbase-clients because that defeats the entire purpose of xutils12:13
KamionReplaces ping-pong is no fun :)12:14
mdzdaniels: I know, I filed the bug ;-P12:14
danielsit's been broken ever since xbase-clients and xutils were split12:14
=== zul [~chuck@CPE0006258ec6c2-CM000a73655d0e.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel
mdzzul: hi12:14
zulhey mdz 12:14
mdzzul: I wanted to ask your opinion about CONFIG_MEGARAID_NEWGEN12:14
mdzI just had a friend test on a Dell PE2850, and the CONFIG_MEGARAID_LEGACY doesn't work, while the NEWGEN one does12:14
Kamiondaniels: have Debian fixed that one? I'd be amazed if they hadn't had to - unifont depends on xutils in Debian just the same as it does in Ubuntu12:15
mdzunfortunately they seem to be mutually exclusive12:15
danielsKamion: nope12:15
danielsKamion: i'll report a bug in debbugs12:15
zuli think CONFIG_MEGARAID_LEGACY is backwards compatible but ill check on that12:15
danielsKamion: but afaict, it's still ther ein unstable12:15
Kamiondaniels: how do Greek installs in Debian work, then?12:15
Kamiondaniels: they *do* work I'm pretty sure, they've been autotested12:15
danielsKamion: well, it's still in xbase-clients in unstable12:16
mdzif MEGARAID_NEWGEN=n12:16
mdzconfig MEGARAID_LEGACY12:16
danielsKamion: i dunno how it works, but apparently it does12:16
Kamionand Arabic, Bulgarian, Chinese, Farsi, Hebrew, Japanese, Korean12:16
mdzKamion: clear to upload new casper?12:16
danielsKamion: *shrug*, maybe it gets installed by some lucky accident along the way12:17
Kamionmdz: sec12:17
mdzI don't guess there's any hurry until :3312:17
zulmdz: megaraid_newgen doesnt recognize the older controllers12:17
KamionI've done the control, not the real test yet12:17
mdzzul: ouch12:17
mdzI wonder why they're mutually exclusive, then12:17
mdzthe only reason I could think of was that they would be loaded for the same PCI IDs12:17
zulheh...ill go check12:18
Kamionmdz: seems to work fine12:20
Kamionmdz: (although it worked here before that patch, too)12:21
mdzuploaded casper 0.5412:21
danielsok, i'm going back to bed until 0030, but still pingable on my mobile12:22
mdzKamion: bug #299811 -> didn't you correct me recently that bare conditionals didn't interfere with set -e?12:22
mdzdaniels: ok, thanks12:23
Keybuktest -f /not-exist12:25
Keybukwill fail12:25
=== ggi [~ggi@ggi.base.supporter.pdpc] has joined #ubuntu-devel
Keybukso will [ -f /not-exist ]  && ...12:26
zulmdz: as far as i can tel megaraid_newgen works with megaraid_mm which is a management module the provides ioctly and sysfs support raid controllers12:26
zulthe legacy ones uses proc support i think12:26
Keybuk(the [ will exit 1, so the && bit doesn't run ... the result of the pipe is 1, so set -e causes the script to fail)12:26
mdzzul: LEGACY gets us megaraid.ko, NEWGEN gets us megaraid_mbox.ko (driver which seems to support more cadrs) and megaraid_mm.ko (management module)12:27
Keybuk[ ! -e file ]  || mv $file /var/log/setuid12:27
Keybukwould work (the || will eat the 1)12:27
zulmdz: i could be wrong ;)12:28
Kamionmdz: you were talking about ||12:28
mdzKamion: ah, ok12:28
Kamionbash(1) says that 'false && true' or whatever does not trigger 'set -e'12:29
Kamionthis appears to be true in bash and dash, but I have a recollection that it may not be true in all shells12:29
KamionAFAIK false || ... is safe everywhere12:29
=== Amaranth [~travis@amaranth.user] has joined #ubuntu-devel
KeybukBlinn says "false && true" will break set -e12:30
MithrandirKeybuk: naturally, false && $whatever is false so it breaks set -e12:31
KamionKeybuk: I can't find any shell in which that actually happens though12:32
KeybukKamion: zsh12:32
KamionI tried zsh12:32
Keybukdescent scott% false && true12:32
Keybukzsh: exit 112:32
Kamionyes, but it does not trip set -e12:32
Keybukscott@descent:~$ false && true12:32
Keybukscott@descent:~$ echo $?12:32
Kamionexit 1 from a pipeline doesn't trip set -e by itself12:32
Keybukyeah, most shells tend to make that one work12:33
Kamionan && or || guard appears to be sufficient to avoid that in any shell I've tried12:33
Keybukit's not portable though12:33
Kamionno, I can believe that12:33
Kamionjust wondering where the submitter of #299811 managed to find a shell where it broke12:33
zulmdz: according to the changelog fabio disabled to avoid regressions12:33
mdzzul: :-(12:33
Kamion$ zsh -c 'set -e; false && true; echo hello'12:34
Keybukbusybox ?12:34
zulof course that was in 2.6.9 i dont know if it has gotten any better 12:34
mdzzul: I read that as "try to avoid regressions by using the old driver rather than the new"12:34
mdzoverall, though, this is a regression from 2.4 (which had megaraid and megaraid2, at least one of which would work on these boxes)12:35
Keybuknope, busybox on my wrt seems ok12:35
Keybukhe probably tried very hard :p12:35
zulmdz: ah i see12:35
mdzzul: looks like probably NEWGEN was introduced in 2.6.912:35
zulmdz: https://www.redhat.com/archives/taroon-list/2004-November/msg00145.html12:36
mdzzul: what a mess12:36
zulmdz: yep 12:36
mdza bug report about this should arrive soon, but it sounds like we can't do much for Hoary12:37
zulshould look at 2.6.11 if its any better12:37
amumdz: you still need me atm? Or is it 6h laters also possible? 12:39
Kamionis all the kubuntu stuff in the archive now, including binaries?12:41
=== Kamion notes lack of autopurging of old Kubuntu CDs, and fixes
zulmdz: megaraid supports only a limited number of controllers megaraid_mbox supports a whole whack of controllers (including dell perc, lsi, intel raid controllers, fsc and acer raid controllers)12:42
amuKamion: nope, need another upload of kdebase12:42
infinitymdz : DO you have a clever way to mass-reassign all bugs relating to a source package to a specific bugzilla user?... Searching by components is painful. ;)12:43
RiddellKamion: why do you ask?12:44
KamionRiddell: was wondering if you guys were ready for preview-release CD builds to happen12:44
amuRiddell: i guess a possible build will fail atm12:45
RiddellKamion: not yet, is it different from the nightly builds?12:45
KamionRiddell: releases are always blessed nightly builds (even if those "nightly" builds happen to be triggered manually)12:45
KamionRiddell: but we often trigger stuff by hand coming up to a release, to speed things up12:46
KamionRiddell: lamont, mdz, and I can trigger installer initrd / live filesystem rebuilds; mdz, daniels, and I can trigger CD image builds12:47
robertjKamion: if there is a really, really sucky bug in Gnome upstream, what are the chances of getting it fixed by an Ubuntu staffer and applied before hoary ;)12:49
Kamionrobertj: we're still making GNOME changes; you'd have to talk to seb128 or jdub though, I know very little about the specifics12:50
Kamion"really, really sucky" is often relative :-)12:50
robertjKamion: the connect to server dialog is b0rk out of the box for sftp12:50
seb128works here12:51
robertjseb128: Its broken on the LiveCD and I had a rawhide user come up with the same result12:51
KamionI found that if I didn't have an appropriate key in an ssh-agent, the initial connect failed12:51
seb128you mean the dialog displayed when you click to validate ?12:52
robertjKamion: we decided that was probably it12:52
Kamionbut it then works thereafter12:52
robertjseb: when you connect it whines about not having an appropriate handler12:52
KamionI'm not quite in a position to come up with specifics right now12:52
robertjI think the real problem is it's an unknown host12:52
danielsmdz: (save yourself the expense of a call; i'm up now)12:52
seb128robertj: and it works after that12:52
robertjyes, after that it will ask you for your password and work happily12:53
seb128the dialog issue is already in bugzilla12:53
seb128that's quite of ugly but not a big issue12:53
robertjany chance of it getting fixed?12:53
robertjI think this one is over my head12:54
seb128if you send a patch sure12:54
seb128if you don't send a patch and don't get fixed in a new upstream tarball not sure12:54
KamionKeybuk: do you know of a portable way to make shell aliases be expanded?12:55
seb128depending of the other bugs to fix before12:55
KeybukKamion: nope, because shell aliases aren't portable shell12:55
robertjseb128: is this something that bounty money could be used for to make the world go round?12:56
KamionI thought all Kornish shells implemented them interactively at least12:56
seb128that's something that somebody bothered by the issue can fix quite quickly12:56
seb128ie: every bug fix is not bounty material12:57
KeybukKamion: no idea, my shell-fu ends where portable scripting ends -- unless it's zsh weirdness :p01:00
KamionKeybuk: I think this is hard because I'm trying to implement a very weak kind of exception raising in shell ;)01:01
KamionI want something that prints an error and returns out of the current function, basically01:01
Keybukset aliases -- zsh01:01
Keybukset expand_aliases -- bash01:01
Kamionyeah, I bet busybox doesn't have that01:02
Keybukuse variables01:02
Keybukportable shell expands spaces in variables01:02
=== robertj reboots and will be back in a bit
KamionKeybuk: can't expand a variable to 'foo; return' though01:05
=== zul [~chuck@CPE0006258ec6c2-CM000a73655d0e.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel
Kamioncan I?01:05
Kamionno, I can't01:06
Kamionit's really to avoid having to do || { warn foo; return; } or whatever the syntax is all over the place01:07
Keybukyou can with some trickery01:08
Keybukmsg="foo" $throw01:08
Keybukor something01:08
Keybukmsg="foo" eval $throw01:08
Keybukyou may have to do01:08
infinityKamion : What's wrong with _exception() { echo $1; return 1; } ?01:09
jbaileyinfinity: It only returns you out of the subfunction.01:10
infinityOh, duh.01:10
KamionKeybuk: nice trick01:11
infinityjbailey : Of course, s/return/exit/ solves that.01:11
Kamioninfinity: exit is what I'm doing, but it's too big a hammer01:12
Kamionand I need to save state between calls to the function, so I can't use a subshell01:12
infinityKamion : I need to read better.  You wanted to only return from a function, not the script.  Check.  I'll shut up and go back to work. :)01:12
=== Clint [clint@adsl-69-233-179-235.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel
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=== jimmer_ [~jimmer@pool-68-161-51-182.ny325.east.verizon.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel
jimmer_hello all!01:15
=== amu [amu@] has joined #ubuntu-devel
jimmer_anybody here interested in hearing some stuff about my experiences with hoary 5.04?01:16
Kamionjimmer_: in this channel, we're most interested in hearing stuff that comes with patches :-)01:17
mdzinfinity: do a search, then "change several bugs at once"01:17
Kamionbugzilla's best for bug reports, or ubuntu-users@lists.ubuntu.com for general reports01:17
quaruptIs there a Project Manager for Ubuntu?01:18
jimmer_Kamion, well, that can be fixed... it's just that I don;t know if I want to be an actual part of the Ubuntu effort...01:18
mdzKamion: ready for new CD builds?01:18
Kamionquarupt: what do you mean?01:18
Kamionmdz: checking01:18
mdzKamion: casper-udeb 0.54 is in the archive01:19
quaruptWell most Open Source projects have one person who Organizes things like meeting releases and such?01:19
mdzquarupt: why do you ask?01:19
Kamionright, you could have meant either a program (project management application) or a person :-)01:19
=== mvo -> bed
quaruptJust wondering...01:19
mdzmvo: night01:19
mvonight all01:20
schweebwho  would be in charge of initrdds?  I'm wondering if there's any technical reason that devfs is used still rather than udev, or if it's just not been gotten around to01:20
Kamionschweeb: me; and we do not use devfs any more, we use udev01:20
Kamionif you mean the installer initrd, that is01:20
quaruptdevfs is more stable and more documented01:20
=== mdz gapes at quarupt
Kamionmdz: new live CDs building01:21
Kamionquarupt: the two-headed developer known as mdz and jdub handles that function. :-)01:22
quaruptwell i dun like udev since it works entirely in userspace01:22
Kamionfortunately one head is awake on Pacific time, and the other on Australian time, which is uncommonly useful01:22
Keybuksince when is jdub on Australian time ?!01:22
Kamionwell, theoretically01:23
schweebkamion: no the kernel initrd... generated by mkinitrd when you install a kernel01:23
quaruptudev will not automatically load a driver if a /dev node is opened01:23
quarupt   when it is not present like devfs will do01:23
Kamionschweeb: ah, that would be jbailey01:23
Kamionschweeb: I believe we're switching to hotplug/udev in initramfs post-hoary01:23
mdzschweeb: it's a sensitive component and it hasn't been migrated yet01:23
Kamionquarupt: nevertheless, we have good reasons to switch to udev throughout the entire system and fix the few problems that result01:24
quaruptWhatever works01:24
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mdznot the least of which is that devfs is deprecated upstream01:24
Kamionone being that devfs is liable to be removed from the kernel any time soon01:24
Keybukquarupt: actually, that's one of the biggest udev/devfs myths known to mankind01:25
quaruptIt should be around until .1201:25
Keybukdevfs had nothing to do with the automatic module loading01:25
Keybukit just happened to massively-populate /dev01:25
Kamionquarupt: so, hoary+101:25
Keybukso the device node tended to exist when you tried to open it01:25
Kamionquarupt: might as well get it out of the way now01:25
Keybukyou can do exactly the same with udev by making the device-nodes exist before time01:25
danielsmdz: fwiw, I've just dug up my xresprobe 0.5 branch and dragged back the test support for it, so I can fake various fun situations (DDC failing, DDC from a specific EDID file, a laptop probe from a specific log file), so I can test this sort of thing better in the future01:25
mdzKeybuk: no, devfs actually has its own madness in that department01:25
quaruptudev isnt for loading kernel modules anyways01:26
Keybukmdz: well, yes, as it had its weird filesystem -- but the kernel will load modules when any device node is opened01:26
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mdzKeybuk: with devfs, it loads modules even if the device node doesn't exist01:26
quaruptmdz, didnt i just say that?01:26
mdzquarupt: no?01:27
jimmer_for those of us that don't have a clue what the whole devfs/udev fussis about... like me... http://www.kernel.org/pub/linux/utils/kernel/hotplug/udev-FAQ01:27
Kamionhe did01:27
Kamion00:23 < quarupt> udev will not automatically load a driver if a /dev node is opened01:27
Kamion00:23 < quarupt>    when it is not present like devfs will do01:27
Keybukthe answer these days is that if you don't have the module loaded, clearly there's something wrong preventing the hardware from being detected, so loading the module when you try and open the device is going to fail anyway01:27
Kamionbut really, this argument is so six months ago ;)01:27
quaruptlol true dat01:28
mdzdaily-live rsyncing01:29
quaruptHotplug works fine 99% of the time in Hoary anyways01:29
quaruptCan't say that about many other distro's not out of the box anyways01:30
Keybukmeh; so you can't Replace a directory with a non-directory01:31
Keybukhow do we handle that on the backwards equivalent01:31
Kamionwe still have several regressions from discover to fix01:31
schweebmdz: ah, thanks... ran in to problems with Xen and devfs on my systems... mostly cause I didn't compile devfs in, and it took me a few to diagnose the problem, heh01:31
quaruptDo any of you guys actually code for a living?01:32
zuluh yes01:32
Kamionmost of the people talking with you at the moment do01:32
mdzstand back, we're professionals01:32
quaruptThe most coding I get to do at my job is writing some lame vb script to change something in the AD or system policy01:32
quaruptI hate my job01:33
quaruptIf we could just run at least our web server on linux id be happy01:33
quaruptThis is so off topic01:34
=== schweeb changes channels to #it-angst
quaruptSo are we getting close to a release or what?01:35
Kamionquarupt: dude; "are we nearly there yet" doesn't go over well in this channel; just letting you know :)01:35
Keybukmeh, I'm so just going to ignore this01:36
quaruptWell Hoary seems pretty stable01:36
schweebquarupt: just sit back and enjoy the ride01:36
Kamionquarupt: the release schedule is on the wiki01:36
Keybuk"can't install banana because it would mean if you'd done this the other way round I'd've broken because you would've replaced a directory with a non-directory ..."01:36
mdzquarupt: the release date for Hoary was set 6 months ago01:36
mdzand we are on track to meet our target01:36
quaruptI wanna deploy Ubuntu at my work on some workstations but he wont let me install anything that is "Beta, Testing, Unstable"01:36
mdzquarupt: how about "Ubuntu 4.10", our officially supported stable release, then01:37
quaruptBecause Warty is nothing compared to Hoary01:37
=== thoreauputic [~debianarc@wolax7-173.dialup.optusnet.com.au] has joined #ubuntu-devel
mdzit's "released"01:37
mdzit's "supported"01:37
jimmer_quarupt, just install and change /etc/motd and /etc/issue01:37
mdzit's "stable"01:37
mdzit gets "security updates"01:37
quaruptSo Hoary is Stable right now too, just not officially01:38
mdzit "works"01:38
mdzquarupt: the people you are addressing have a much better idea of Hoary's stability01:38
mdzbecause they are the people who are stabilizing it01:38
quaruptI have had it running for like a month staright running my web server myy ftp and and ssh with over 40 connections a day01:38
quaruptand it takes it like a man01:38
mdzthanks for testing it01:39
crimsunquarupt: seriously, we're straying into off-topic...01:39
quaruptIm sure they do have a better Idea, Im not complaining Im just trying to say I think its looking awesome01:39
quaruptOkay sorry again01:39
=== wasabi_ [~wasabi@] has joined #ubuntu-devel
quaruptwell non-developers cants say much that is on "topic"01:40
=== jimmer_ [~jimmer@pool-68-161-51-182.ny325.east.verizon.net] has left #ubuntu-devel ["Leaving"]
mdzthat isn't true01:40
quaruptIm just another annoying line in someones scroll back buffer trying to catch up on what they missed, when they were sleeping01:41
Kamioncertainly people who aren't yet Ubuntu developers can, and do; it's just that this is not a general chat channel, it's a development channel, and thus development-oriented conversation is appreciated :-)01:41
mdzthat's how you're behaving right now, yes.  but you could easily be helping us to test this milestone we're preparing01:41
Kamioncdimage.ubuntu.com/daily/current/, cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/current/; burn, test, report01:42
mdzhttp://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily/current/ and http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/current/01:42
QuaruptedI allready use almost 80% of my 4gigs of ram running all sorts of servers and desktop applications01:42
infinityquarupt : For web servers, there's very little change between warty and hoary, except a few bugs fixed here and there, and a couple incremented features.  With the snail's pace at which server software evolves, combined with a 6-month release schedule, I can't see how upgrading to hoary buys you anything esxcept for missing security updates.01:42
infinityQuarupted : On the other hand, I'll never turn down someone's offer to beta test things. :)01:42
QuaruptedI love Beta testing01:43
QuaruptedI was there with Potato, Sarge, and now SID01:43
Quaruptedso you want me to burn that image try to install it and report?01:43
Kamionthat's certainly what I've been spending the last few hours on01:43
Kamionbut we can only cover so many cases ourselves01:44
QuaruptedI dont have any free Partitions, but i do have a VMware ready to go01:44
QuaruptedDo you guys have allot of people testing your AMD64 live cd?01:45
QuaruptedI can do that01:45
Kamionit does get testing, but I'm sure rather less than i38601:46
mdzamd64-live successful01:46
mdzQuarupted: yes, please do01:46
Quaruptedim on it01:46
mdzQuarupted: burn and test as many of those images as you are able01:46
QuaruptedI can only test live ones now, untill i do some resizing on mp Partition table01:47
Quarupted666.0 Megs for the AMD64 Live now thats an Omen01:47
=== thoreauputic_ [~debianarc@wolax7-096.dialup.optusnet.com.au] has joined #ubuntu-devel
Kamionit's perilously close to being oversized is what it is01:49
Kamionin fact it's precisely on the mark01:49
Quaruptedyup at 500k its gunna take like 8 Minutes01:49
Kamionmdz: anything we can take out of that? the next live cloop build will probably overflow it, given partimage breakage01:50
KeybukUnpacking banana (from banana_1.0_all.deb) ...01:53
KeybukReplaced by files in installed package banana-icecream ...01:53
Kamionmdz: in fact I'm pretty sure we've overflowed the 74min disk limit, judging from what cdrecord is telling me01:53
KamionKeybuk: nice01:53
Keybuklet's try this with one of pitti's PACKAGES OF DOOM01:55
mdzpowerpc-live: success01:57
mdzKamion: the amd64 cloop suffers from size creep01:57
mdzwe can reset it, at the expense of rsyncability01:57
Kamionmdz: yeah, I know01:57
Kamionbut we reset it quite recently01:57
Kamionand the WinFOSS stuff has made its size jump right up01:58
mdzyeah, then we upgraded X01:58
mdzthe only thing we could realistically remove from the cloop would be language packs01:58
Kamionlet's ask lamont to reset it tomorrow then01:58
mdzKamion: mail pitti to consider trimming language packs in the morning01:58
KamionI question whether we can release with it over the limit01:58
KamionI suppose we could make it an erratum01:59
Kamion(Array 7, I mean)01:59
mdzKamion: amd64 install dumped me to the menu at time zone configuration02:02
KeybukUnpacking language-pack-cy (from language-pack-cy_20050310_all.deb) ...02:03
KeybukSelecting previously deselected package language-pack-cy-base.02:03
KeybukUnpacking language-pack-cy-base (from language-pack-cy-base_20050310_all.deb) ...02:03
KeybukReplaced by files in installed package language-pack-cy ...02:03
KeybukSetting up language-pack-cy (20050310) ...02:03
KeybukSetting up language-pack-cy-base (20050310) ...02:03
Kamionmdz: version of tzsetup-udeb?02:03
KamionKeybuk: rock02:03
mdzKamion: 2.62ubuntu1202:04
mdzafter a successful base-install02:04
mdztzsetup-udeb succeeded but requested to be left unconfigured02:04
mdzis this the rtc issue?02:05
Kamionno, shouldn't be02:06
Kamionplease send me /var/log/syslog02:06
mdzpowerpc-install made it to archive-copier02:07
Kamionyou might need to put 'set -x' at the top of tzsetup-udeb.postinst and rerun to make it meaningful02:07
mdzKamion: emailed02:07
mdzKamion: shall I retry from the menu, then?02:08
mdz(with set -x)02:08
Kamionmdz: please02:08
mdzMar 17 01:09:10 main-menu[4300] : (process:13447): RET=10 tzconfig/gmt doesn't exist02:10
mdzKamion: mailed you the full log (take 3)02:11
Keybukmeh, it breaks with more than one file02:13
mdzKamion: tzconfig/gmt is in debconf's db in the chroot, but not in cdebconf's in the initrd02:13
Kamionbleh, ok, wonder how that worked for me02:13
mdzwonder how it worked for me on i38602:14
mdzI mean powerpc02:14
mdzoh, it didn't02:15
mdzit dropped me back to the menu after archive-copier02:15
mdzI thought tzsetup-udeb came first, for some reason02:15
mdzI propose that if it worked for you, you had different software on your CD02:15
Kamionthat's so weird, I had 3/3 working02:15
Kamionand rsync says nothing02:15
Kamionnone of my installs were on a system where Ubuntu was the only OS on the CD02:16
KamionI mean on the hard disk02:16
Kamionthat is the case that fails02:16
=== Kamion hunts down the scratch box
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Kamionlooks like an install CD delay, then :(02:17
mdzno d-i build necessary, though, right?02:18
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Kamionmdz: this is all down to the GMT-suppression thing being a nasty hack, of course :( it should just lower the priority ...02:21
Quaruptedmdz, im about to boot into the AMD64 live, what kinda things should I test once im in?02:21
danielshm, only in pool/main/m, and still got xorg to go02:21
danielsQuarupted: well, X will only start in 1024x768, so hope to hell that works on yoru stup02:22
danielsyour setup, even02:22
Quaruptedit should02:22
Quaruptedi run 1280x1024 now02:22
QuaruptedActually nvm, the Image didnt even burn to a disk02:23
KeybukUnpacking language-pack-cy-base (from language-pack-cy-base_20050310_all.deb) ...02:23
KeybukReplaced by files in installed package language-pack-cy ...02:23
Keybuksnarf is keeping existing `./usr/share/locale-langpack/cy/LC_MESSAGES/gok.mo'02:23
Keybuksnarf is keeping existing `./usr/share/locale-langpack/cy/LC_MESSAGES/messages.mo'02:23
Keybukyayy, fixed that bug02:23
mdzQuarupheiz; http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/QAtesting02:23
mdzKeybuk: 164595?02:24
Keybukmdz: indeed02:24
mdzKeybuk: how afraid do we need to be about putting that fix into hoary?02:24
Quaruptedwell i wont be able to test it if i cant get the Image to burn02:24
Keybukthe fix is getting smaller and smaller02:24
Keybukso I'm actually pretty confident that it's safe02:24
KamionQuarupted: as I said above, if you only have 650MB disks then it won't burn02:25
mdzKamion: if you want to build it without the winfoss on it, I've no problem with that02:25
mdzas a quick and unintrusive fix02:25
Kamionjust temporarily for array 7?02:25
mdzthe winfoss on the amd64 CD is much less interesting than on i38602:25
mdzKamion: yeah02:26
mdzor even permanently, if we could better use the space02:26
mdzthough I imagine we'd trim it rather than remove it entirely02:26
=== Quarupt [~quar@c-67-183-254-78.client.comcast.net] has joined #Ubuntu-devel
KamionQuarupt: 01:25 < Kamion> Quarupted: as I said above, if you only have 650MB disks then it won't burn02:26
Quaruptthere 700MB02:27
Kamionmdz: ok, removed, rebuilding02:27
KamionI'm not going to make :33 I'm afraid02:29
QuaruptI think its gunna burn alright this time02:29
mdzKamion: I can kick cron.daily if necessary02:29
Kamionneed to test first02:29
mdzfeel free to send a udeb my way if you need confirmation02:30
Kamion-               db_fset tzconfig/gmt seen true02:30
Kamion+               target_debconf sh -c '02:30
Kamion+                       . /usr/share/debconf/confmodule02:30
Kamion+                       db_fset tzconfig/gmt seen true'02:30
Kamionthat's the diff to tzsetup-udeb.postinst02:30
elmomdz: I am here, btw02:31
=== mdz hides
mdzKamion: would target_debconf_communicate or similar be a less ugly way of accomplishing the same thing?02:33
Kamionmdz: yes; but that code will go away soon anyway02:34
Kamionas previously mentioned it's a buggy approach02:34
Kamionthully has a bug open on it, wrong expert-mode behaviour02:34
mdzon a related note, /me adds "cdebconf-copydb" to the list for breezy02:34
Kamionhell yeah. sadly it needs a total rewrite of cdebconf's rfc822db02:35
mdzanything else to add to the "gross hacks that should go away" BOF while I'm there?02:35
Kamionthe linux-{386,686,k6,k7,powerpc,whateverthehellelse} grep in base-installer02:36
mdzI think we ought to specify this stuff in Sydney to ensure that we allocate development time for it02:37
daniels[FC4T1]  To add insult to injury, opening Firefox greeted us with: "There ought to be release notes for Fedora Core 3.90 here, but there aren't. In the meantime, we bring you this ASCII art hat."02:37
mdzotherwise we'll be forever implementing new features and not fixing the old ones :-P02:37
Kamionmdz: yeah02:37
elmomdz: but but but fixing things isn't sexy02:38
Kamionoh, FFS02:39
Kamionit's so much faster to hit the reset button than it is to wait for the System menu to get its act together and actually appear on the live CD02:39
jbaileyevms-udeb has a binary that depends on ncurses, but I don't see an ncurses udeb.  Where should that be provided from?02:39
Kamionjbailey: ncurses, I imagine ...02:39
elmoyeah, can we like, prio-RT whatever is the gnome menu bar process?02:40
elmoit's so lame that it's always swapped out and takes so long to come up02:40
Kamiondoes it *really* want to have its own UI, though? I think not02:40
mdzevms-udeb is an idea that never actually materialized02:40
wasabi_evms's interface is pretty decent on it's own. I was thinking of plugging that into it02:41
wasabi_and just jumpting to it from the partitioner02:41
mdzelmo: mlockall()02:41
Kamionshould be integrated into partman02:41
wasabi_I mean, if you want ENTERPRISE volume management... =)02:41
wasabi_Kamion, partman should show the /dev/evms device certainly, but I really think the evms gui can alter them fine02:41
mdzit would be feasible to do the things that partman can do with lvm, with evms02:41
jbaileyah, a'ight.  I'll stop trying to get it to work and figure out why it broke then. =)02:41
mdzbut if you want to do the additional stuff EVMS can do, I think that's madness02:41
Kamionno, we have enough bugs about back-and-forth in the installer breaking stuff without having another totally unintegrated UI in there02:42
mdzjbailey: it's never even been in the same room as working02:42
KamionI'm fine with using the evms logic and stuff, but it needs to plug into partman02:42
wasabi_one of these days i'll put it together. ;002:42
wasabi_the evms logic is HUGE heh.02:42
Kamionanyway, I cannot discuss this now02:42
Kamionthat tzsetup-udeb fix was wrong and I need to fix it02:42
Riddelldoes ubuntu have a menu entry for running the file manager as root?02:43
jbaileymdz: 'kay thanks.02:43
zulmdz: speak of the devil there is an update to megaraid_mmbox02:45
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QuaruptThe live CD hung up at loading isofs02:46
QuaruptMust not like my Hardware02:47
Keybukmdz: ok, so what's the plan for this patch?02:47
Keybukhave done some pretty rigorous tests, and works fine02:48
mdzKeybuk: cry about the fact that we can't possible test it enough :-(02:48
QuaruptSo sorry I couldnt Test it, but i don't think it likes my hardware02:48
mdzQuarupt: it's a live CD, it likes all hardware02:49
Quaruptwell it wouldnt load isofs tried 3 times wait 5 minutes each time02:50
Keybukmdz: heh, but do you want it uploaded or not?02:51
mdzKeybuk: why the hell not?  we're DOOMED02:51
mdzKeybuk: (read: after array 7)02:51
Keybukwouldn't before give us more testing?02:52
mdzQuarupt: that module has nothing to do with your hardware; I strongly suspect the problem is with your media02:52
danielswow, I had no idea how bad the stat() damage from the new langpack stuff was02:52
mdzKeybuk: we're literally preparing it right now02:52
=== Kamion idly murders Keybuk
danielswithout strace, starting totem takes under a second on my amd6402:52
jbaileydaniels: It's pretty brutal.02:53
Quaruptdaniels, didnt i mention i tried 3 different copies?02:53
danielsit takes a bit over 15 seconds with strace, because gnome-terminal just can't handle the staggering amount of crap being spewed to the terminal02:53
danielsQuarupt: not to me, no02:53
Kamionmdz: uploaded. don't look at the code02:53
mdzKamion: cue elmo?02:53
elmocron.daily runing02:55
Kamionelmo: buildds could probably squeeze in before the next cron.daily, if so ...02:55
elmoKamion: buildds pre-dep on cron.daily02:55
Kamionyeah, I mean if cron.daily mysteriously went off now ;)02:55
Kamionassuming it's through cron.unchecked anyway02:56
Kamionor whatever it's called02:56
mjg59Suspend to disk and suspend to RAM work perfectly on robot101's obscenely crap craptop03:02
Kamionoh, crap, tzsetup-udeb.prebaseconfig has the same problem03:02
=== mdz high-fives mjg59
=== Kamion goes off to cry
mdzKamion: showstopper?03:03
=== daniels consoles Kamion.
Kamionyes, prebaseconfig crashes03:03
danielsKamion: i feel your pain03:03
mjg59robot is upset that he had to go and buy an X40 and it turned out that his laptop worked anyway03:05
mjg59Totally rad laptop results in decreased life expectency and depression03:05
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=== Robot101 needs to do some computationally intensive stuff and see if it crashes :P
danielsmdz: ok, confirmed that xserver-xorg 6.8.2-5 works fine for a) complete DDC failure (asks and respects the mode question), b) upgrade (leaves your config alone), c) ddc (writes the right thing out), and d) laptop (writes the right thing out)03:06
mdzdaniels: sounds good (after array 7)03:07
danielsmdz: (yeah)03:07
mdzKamion: are you sure you don't want to sleep and do this tomorrow?03:07
Kamionmdz: does the timezone setup thing in casper/pre.d actually do any good whatsoever?03:07
Kamionyes, sure03:07
danielsKamion: if there's anything I can usefully do, let me know03:07
mdzI'm not fussed if array 7 is delayed by a day03:07
Kamionbecause it does fuck-all good in d-i right now, and I want to delete it03:07
mdzwe might as well put in xorg 6.8.2-5 and Keybuk's new dpkg03:08
mdzand I can undo the casper damage03:08
mdzKamion: I have no idea03:08
mdzKamion: I haven't tested preseeding a time zone on the live CD, and if it doesn't work for final, I'm not going to cry over it03:08
Kamionok, let's leave it until tomorrow :( sorry about this, my fault03:08
mdzKamion: no worries, thanks for staying up03:09
mdzdaniels, Keybuk: fire when ready03:09
danielsKamion: eh, xorg was tanked as well03:09
=== ..[topic/#ubuntu-devel:Kamion] : Ubuntu Development | #ubuntu for support and general discussion | #ubuntu-love for getting involved | http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/DeveloperResources | http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/HoaryGoals | Kubuntu on #kubuntu-devel | Hoary preview release: http://releases.ubuntu.com/hoary/ | Array CD 7 2005-03-17; please test uploads to main carefully | Release Candidate: March 30th
danielsmdz: you might as well kick that horror show hack out of casper, then03:10
mdzdaniels: <mdz> and I can undo the casper damage03:10
danielsmdz: right03:10
danielsshould I cram dbus and dbus-mono in as well?  or since they're for universe shit anyway, probably worth waiting until after just to be totally sure03:10
KamionI'd wait03:11
Kamionif it isn't too much hassle to do so03:11
daniels(not to demean universe; just using 'shit' as any random grouping of stuff)03:11
danielsKamion: yeah03:11
danielsKamion: not at all03:11
KamionI'm going to stay up a bit more to get these fixes tested properly, then crash03:11
mdzKamion: oh, if you're going to do that, then I'll build some candidates later03:12
mdz(assuming you upload it)03:12
Kamionmdz: thanks, that'd be good03:14
Kamionshall I disable the daily cron jobs?03:14
danielsok, 6.8.2-5 is up03:15
KamionUbuntu daily/daily-live CD build cron jobs disabled, build 'em manually if you want 'em03:25
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sladenwith the amd64 cloop;  can somebody just SCP it across to an i386 machine, partimage -e it and scp it back again.  Hackery, but it'd solve the problem and not loose the rsync status03:38
Kamion(or run the i386 version with ia32-libs)03:39
Robot101wow, the fan actually works too03:46
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zenwhenwhen clean installing hoary, should optical drives beusing dma by default? Mine weren't.03:49
mjg59robot101's laptop is now entirely love03:49
mdzmjg59: just how oddball a laptop is it?03:49
mdzzenwhen: no03:49
zenwhenoh ok03:49
mdzzenwhen: #367203:49
zenwhenMy oddball 266Mhz 4010CDS runs GREAT with hoary.03:50
zenwhenIn all its dual scan lcd glory.03:50
Kamionmdz: ok, base-config 2.62ubuntu14 should actually work; tested in as many faked-up configurations as I could think of03:51
mdzKamion: ok, cheers03:51
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mjg59mdz: It's some ancient FIC thing with a Celeron 36603:53
mjg59So probably circa 200003:53
mdzI should get out my old toshiba and see how it fares with Hoary03:53
mdzI've been slack on i386 install testing anyway because I don't want to clobber my laptop03:54
zultoshiba with a a flakey keyboard?03:54
mjg59Only issue is that the contrast is strange on resume, but it does the same on apm03:55
mjg59I'm a touch amazed, really03:55
Kamionhm, s-t-d seems to hang on the Averatec03:55
mjg59The avaratec is almost as bad as the craptop03:55
Kamionyeah, via throughout03:56
mjg59Can you edit /etc/default/acpi-support and switch off dpms, then try s-t-d again?03:56
mjg59You ought to get more output that way03:56
=== Keybuk watches the Dr Who trailer for the gazillionth time
Kamionmjg59: that time it suspended, but didn't resume; just came back up normally04:00
mjg59Kamion: Is this a clean Hoary install? Or an upgrade?04:00
Kamionmjg59: does it care if my resume partition is mistakenly type 0x83 rather than 0x82?04:00
Kamionmjg59: clean hoary, and has RESUME= in mkinitrd.conf before you ask04:00
mjg59Hrm. Possibly.04:00
mjg59I'd be a bit surprised, though.04:00
mjg59Possibly that path ought to have more debugging in it...04:00
mjg59Can you try it with 0x82 and see if it makes a difference? (I'd be surprised, but...)04:01
Kamionsure, one sec04:02
Kamionmjg59: changing the type did it04:06
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Kamionmjg59: and it appears to be able to s-t-r, but not resume04:09
Quaruptthe entire first episode of Dr.Who is on Limewire04:09
Kamionwhich I guess isn't saying much04:10
zullater all04:13
mdzKamion: what do you think we should do about the en_US/en_GB issue?04:17
danielsshit, I forgot to eat04:20
mjg59Kamion: It worked with a different type? Excellent04:21
mjg59What's the failure mode on resume from RAM? It just boots instead?04:21
mdzinfinity: are you able to test live or install CDs?04:23
Robot101/./me i04:33
=== Robot101 whistles innocently
KeybukQuarupt: is incomplete pre-edit version, which rumour has it the BBC leaked deliberately to gain publicity04:35
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adamhI'm thinking of switching over to Ubuntu from Debian. One of the benefits I think I'd get is that I wouldn't have to jhbuild all of GNOME just to hack at Epiphany. Am I right? Are there any GNOME hackers here who switched to Ubuntu? :)04:38
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adamhNo more need for jhbuild?04:39
jdubadamh: quite a few; it's heaps easier tracking the package releases on the development branch, and building just what you need04:40
adamhjdub: Development branch? <-- hoary?04:41
mdzcurrently, yes04:42
adamhWell, if it works for jdub it's good enough for me! Here we go... goodbye Debian :)04:43
adamh(The irony here is that I'm going through the trouble of reinstalling my OS just because I'm too lazy to do a kernel recompile)04:43
lamontKamion/mdz: reset of amd64 cloop?04:50
Kamionlamont: not yet please, array 7 not yet done04:51
Kamionmjg59: just boots instead04:51
lamontKamion: just say when.04:51
Kamionmdz: I have a plan for that one; intending to make localechooser's fallback for English just 'en', so you get LANGUAGE=en_GB:en for British English and en_US:en for American English, etc.04:51
Kamionmdz: the downside is that en_(other than GB|US) won't get either of en_GB and en_US, which in practice means they'll get American translations rather than British ones, which will probably irritate some people04:52
Kamionmdz: but for the time being I think that's tolerable04:52
mdzKamion: I think that's the best we'll do for hoary04:53
mdzI'm not even sure what we should do long-term04:53
Kamionmaybe store a list of which countries prefer which variants of English04:53
mdzit seems like the correct solution would involve identifying the locale of the untranslated strings04:53
Kamionso en_ZA => en_GB:en, say04:53
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Kamion(warning: may not be true)04:53
Kamionen_ZA:en_GB:en, rather04:53
YomicWhat version of Python is in Hoary?04:53
mdzYomic: 2.4.1a004:54
KamionYomic: http://higgs.djpig.de/ubuntu/www/04:54
Kamionlamont: tomorrow sometime04:55
Kamionlamont: would running the i386 partimage binary, as sladen suggested, be feasible?04:55
lamontKamion: as a manual action, yes.04:56
Kamionwhy not automatic?04:57
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mdzxorg bulit on i386 and amd6404:58
elmoand ppc04:58
mdzonce those are accepted, we'll roll new livefs builds and install CD builds05:00
infinitymdz : No burner currently.05:01
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mdzelmo: when can I expect X to reach mirnyy?05:09
Quaruptif the Acrhive Manger wont open a rar, and either will ark, Ark says unrar isnt in my PATH?05:11
Quaruptoops wrong chan05:11
elmomdz: should be there now05:14
mdzelmo: hmm, anonftpsync on little doesn't bring it in05:15
mrothzulcss@gmail.com is "zul" on here, right?05:18
YomicTo update to hoary, all I have to do is change all the 'warty's to 'hoary's then 'apt-get dist-upgrade' ?05:18
mdzmroth: yes05:18
mdzYomic: HoaryUpgradeNotes in the wiki05:18
Yomicin the repositories*05:18
YomicOkay, thanks.05:18
mrothmdz: seen him around lately05:19
mdzmroth: he was here earlier, but is gone for the night05:19
elmooh for christ's sake05:19
mrothmdz: righteo, thanks05:19
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elmomdz: sorry - I skillfully broke the main archive while setting up the test one; it's syncing now, I'll shout when it's done05:20
mdzelmo: I'm glad you didn't go to sleep :-)05:20
elmomdz: should be good05:23
mdzsyncing little05:23
mdzelmo: should be clear for livefs builds as well?05:25
mdzI don't know where they point05:25
elmorockhopper's in sync too05:25
elmoso yeah05:25
elmoerr, auckland, blah05:26
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YomicIn the update to hoary I recieved two 404 errors:05:40
YomicFailed to fetch http://ubuntu-bp.sourceforge.net/ubuntu/dists/hoary-backports/main/binary-i386/Packages.gz  404 Not Found05:40
YomicFailed to fetch http://ubuntu-bp.sourceforge.net/ubuntu/dists/hoary-backports/universe/binary-i386/Packages.gz  404 Not Found05:40
lamontKamion: hrm.. I was thinking of moving the 2GB fsimage over to an i386 box, running it there, and then pushing it back...  I suppose we could just run the 32-bit i386 binary given the right motivation...05:41
lamontelmo: livecd rootfs build points at jackass... 05:41
=== elmo runs aways screaming
elmolamont: because of the md5 mismatch crap or just 'cos?05:43
lamontbecause all the other chroots  on the buildd's do too.05:44
lamontand _that's_ because of the timing issue on the mirror push vs w-b freeing up packages05:44
elmoyeah, I know why buildds do it, just not sure why live rootfs would need to, but meh, doesn't matter05:45
lamontthe truthful answer is that the same script built the chroot for the livecd fs build...05:47
lamontand ISTR we had reasons for not wanting the buildd machines hitting a.u.c.  if it should change, it's not a big deal05:48
QuaruptIf I make a script for upgrading to hoary, could you guys put in in the sources or maybe somewhere on the page?05:50
Quaruptjust something that changes all the instances of Warty to Hoary in the sources list, and runs apt-get update and apt-get dist-upgrade05:52
tsengsomething like that should be handled by a competent admin really05:52
tsengor at least someone who has read over the doc once or twice and is comfortable watching it05:52
tsengsome things shouldnt be scripted, imo05:52
wasabiI want an Ubuntu business card.06:00
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Keybukfabbione: removing that ipmi patch seemed to fix my laptop06:26
fabbioneKeybuk: seems or it fixes?06:27
Keybukwell, it's behaving normally now06:27
Keybukwhich I guess counts as "fixed" :)06:27
fabbioneok thanks06:27
fabbionethis one right?06:31
fabbionecan you give me a short descr of the problem? so i can include it in the changelog..06:32
KeybukMissed interrupts causing HP laptops to not correctly set the initial number of fans after boot06:35
Keybukcool, thanks :p06:41
fabbioneno problem06:43
Keybukright, time to crash I think06:48
Keybukor at least veg for a few hours, and try to push my body clock round to real hours a bit06:48
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=== infinity watches what he hopes is his last php4 build of the week (month?)
infinityNot holding my breath, mind you.07:26
danielsPah, php4's a doddle. ;)07:26
infinityTrying to fix every (real) bug I know of in one upload is always a curious challenge. :)07:27
infinity... and bound to fail.07:28
danielsWell, it fixes every bug you know of, and introduces three tha tyou don't.07:28
infinityGenerally that's the issue, yes. :)07:28
infinityThough I tend to catch several new bugs on the way too, so I think I still end up ahead.07:28
danielsI'm working on fixing bugs I don't know about at the moment.07:29
infinityAlways the worst part. :)07:29
infinityEspecially since you spent all that time creating those bugs in the first place, only to go remove them later.07:29
infinityNo one appreciates the effort that goes into writing buggy software anymore.07:30
=== infinity digs back into his.
infinityOh, actually, looks like it's home-time.07:30
infinitydaniels : You around tomorrow morning?... I may need a mess of stuff sponsored at some point.07:31
danielsmdz: i'm just about to head out; i'll be back at about 1400 UTC.  i'll theoretically be reachable on my mobile, but it would be good if it could wait.  i'll be a good 2h from connectivity even if urgent stuff pops up.07:31
danielsinfinity: yeah, SMS/call if I'm not awake07:31
infinitydaniels : Will do.07:31
=== infinity kisses Monash's fair network goodbye for the day.
=== lamont sleeps
mdzarray 7 candidate is up, please test07:32
infinitydaniels : Oh, that reminds me.07:32
danielsmdz: 20050317?07:32
infinitydaniels : Bring me installer/live CDs to test on my shitty old laptop when you hook me up with the hard drive.  <bat lashes>07:32
mdzdaniels: daily/2005031707:33
infinity(No burner until we unbox the amd64 beast)07:33
mdzdaily/current and daily-live/current07:33
infinitydaniels : Danke.07:33
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dholbachgoooood morning07:35
infinitymdz : You're welcome to reassign anything even vaguely httpd (libapache*, apache{,2} php, etc) to me, unless thom really objects.  I'm digging through every seriously-irritiating rc-ish bug I can think of in the whole apache dependency chain right now.07:36
dilingerand loving every minute of it, no doubt07:36
infinityThe worst offender being a completely broken php4, of course.07:36
infinitydilinger : I pretend to enjoy apache2.  The rest drive me near suicide, but that's nothing new. ;)07:37
mdzdaniels: don't go anywhere07:38
mdzI just did a live CD test and X configuration failed07:38
danielsdefine 'failed'07:39
danielsi.e. what machine is it on, what method is it expected to use, how did it get configured, logs, configuration07:39
mdzdaniels: it's the BusID bug from ilke 3 months ago, returned07:39
=== daniels frowns.
Quaruptwhat directory did ya guys stick the kernel headers in?07:40
mdzQuarupt: support questions in #ubuntu07:40
QuaruptNo one knows there07:41
danielsmdz: if you could re-run with DEBUG_XORG_PACKAGE="developer", that would be much appreciated07:41
mdzQuarupt: then wait; this is not a support channel (not even a second-tier one)07:41
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danielsmdz: if [ "$1" = "reconfigure" ]  || [ -n "$DEBCONF_RECONFIGURE" ] ; then07:41
danielsthis is not triggering, from xserver-xorg.config.in07:41
QuaruptJust tell me where the stupid header files arre its a devel question07:42
mdzQuarupt: I will not explain again07:42
QuaruptIm asking here because there not in the default location07:42
Quaruptmdz i dun care about your power trip, this is a dev channel im asking dev questions07:43
mdzQuarupt: there are developers here who are trying to work, and you are being a nuisance07:43
mdzI am asking you to take your questions to a more appropriate forum07:43
QuaruptPlease dont speak to me anymore07:43
QuaruptThe headers are not in /usr/src  thats the default, so where are they?07:44
infinityQuarupt : 'apt-cache search kernel headers', and kindly stop being so abrassive.07:45
dholbachQuarupt: stop being impolite and use apt-file, dpkg -c, locate, find or whatever to find out - since you're asking developer questions, you should know07:45
Quaruptno i mean on my machine im not looking for new headers07:46
Quaruptscrew this ill ask in Debian-dev07:46
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mrothI bet they'll love him there.07:47
infinityI don't see him there.07:47
mdzdaniels: we cannot continue with these 4-hour test cycles07:48
mrothHe's probably asking in xchat-dev how to join a new channel first.07:48
danielsmdz: four-hour test cycles?07:48
mdzdaniels: where you upload a new xorg, we wait for it to build, build CDs, I download them, and test them07:48
danielsmdz: if you can get the dpkg-reconfigure thing run with DEBUG_XORG_PACKAGE="developer", or get xserver-xorg.config run with sh -x (i.e. change its shebang), I can tell you exactly where the problem lies07:49
mdzI'll have your debug output in a moment\07:50
danielsmdz: either $1 isn't "reconfigure", DEBCONF_RECONFIGURE isn't set, XORG_FORCE_PROBE is set to some value other than "yes", or db_reset is not doing its thing07:50
mdz$1 is never "reconfigure" in postinst07:50
danielsthis is config, not postinst07:51
mdzXORG_FORCE_PROBE is not set07:51
danielsconfig has code to run db_reset on every xserver-xorg template if -n "$RECONFIGURE"07:51
danielsand, in turn, RECONFIGURE=true if $1 = reconfigure or -n $DEBCONF_RECONFIGURE07:51
mdzxserver-xorg postinst warning: overwriting possibly-customised configuration07:52
mdz   file; backup in /etc/X11/xorg.conf.20050317065007:52
mdzdexconf: error: cannot generate configuration file;07:52
mdzxserver-xorg/config/display/default_depth not set.  Aborting.  Reconfigure the07:52
mdzX server with "dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg" to correct this problem.07:52
mdzxserver-xorg postinst warning: error while preparing new Xorg X server07:52
mdz   configuration file in /etc/X11/xorg.conf.dpkg-new; not attempting to07:52
mdz   update existing configuration07:52
sabdflmorning all07:52
mdzI typo'd the variable name, so I don't have the debug output, but that's stderr07:52
mdzdaniels: I jumped the gun in blaming the BusID thing; it's just not updating the configuration file _at all_07:53
mdzso it's the one generated on the buildd07:53
mdzboth the busid and everything else07:53
fabbionemorning mdz07:53
=== daniels stares at default_depth.
fabbionehey sabdfl 07:53
danielssabdfl: g'morning07:53
fabbionesabdfl: having fun?07:53
danielsmdz: sh -x'ing postinst is onw the interesting bit07:54
danielsactually, no it's not07:54
mdzdaniels: yes, I'm booting the live CD again, and trying to edit the script during the 10-second window, again07:54
mdzstand by07:55
dholbachgood morning fabbione, sabdfl 07:55
mdzI refuse to believe that this is specific to the live CD07:55
mdzdid you test dpkg-reconfigure on these packages?07:55
danielsmdz: humour me -- edit xserver-xorg.postinst.in, look for if [ "$RET" = "false" ] ; then\ndb_set xserver-xorg/config/display/default_depth $DISPLAY_DEPTH\nfi07:55
danielsmdz: change $DISPLAY_DEPTH to $DEFAULT_DEPTH07:55
mdzand build new X packages and new CD images again?07:56
mdznot tonight07:56
danielsmdz: yes.  tested dpkg-reconfigure and a fresh install with all of a) forced ddc failing, b) forced ddc succeeding, and c) forced laptop succeeding on amd64 and i386; tested upgrades with my standard configuration07:56
danielsmdz: so I assume there's no way you could edit it before it gets invoked07:56
mdzxserver-xorg.postinst.in is not a part of the installed package, afaik07:57
mdzdaniels: I cannot spend more time on this07:58
mdzwe are going to need to revert, as I said in the first place07:58
mdzwe just blew 5 hours because of this07:59
mdzand the day after the milestone was due is no time to be debugging the scripts07:59
danielsmdz: as I said, it works fine here08:00
mdzit breaks the live CD completely, trust me08:01
danielsmy current bet is on extreme weirdness with the live CD's cdebconf, et al08:01
mdzthe live CD's cdebconf worked spectacularly with 6.8.2-208:01
danielsyes, and is now broken with it08:01
danielswe'll revert back to 6.8.2-2 for array 7, as much as I think that a bad idea08:02
danielsand I'll keep chasing up this cdebconf stuff08:02
fabbionehold on....08:02
fabbionecan't we just do in such a way that X detect that it is a liveCD08:03
fabbioneand take appropriate action to explude that kind of code that is "delicate"?08:03
fabbioneinstead of bouncing -2 -5 no -3.1?08:03
fabbioneexplude -> exclude08:03
danielsfabbione: i'm pretty sure that I know how to work around the cdebconf breakage, but I'm not too keen on a four-hour cycle, unless ...08:03
danielsmdz: is there any chance I can convince you to unpack the iso, make a one-line change, and test that?08:04
danielsmdz: if so:08:05
daniels06:55 < daniels> mdz: humour me -- edit xserver-xorg.postinst.in, look for if [ "$RET" = "false" ] ; then\ndb_set                  xserver-xorg/config/display/default_depth $DISPLAY_DEPTH\nfi08:05
daniels06:55 < daniels> mdz: change $DISPLAY_DEPTH to $DEFAULT_DEPTH08:05
danielsif not, I'll revert the debconf code to -2 and we'll ship with that08:05
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fabbionei had the feeling i was melting.. it's over 5C08:07
mdzdaniels: we need to roll back08:09
danielsmdz: ok.  if you can do that testing anyway, it would help me hugely.08:09
mdzwe have a milestone to release and this code isn't ready; I'm not going to go through another round of tweaking it08:09
danielseven if it's academic at this point, we need to do this at some stage, so anything you can do towards that end would be a huge help.08:10
mdzI need for you to be able to do this testing without me08:12
danielsi am wget'ing the live cd now08:12
mdzI cannot be xorg debug proxy on top of the other things I need to do08:12
danielsunfortunately this takes a fairly long time, even on dsl08:12
danielswhich is why i'm not doing it myself08:12
fabbionedaniels: i am going to test with you08:12
fabbionemdz: don't worry.. i will test with daniels08:13
danielsfabbione: basically, if you have the live CD, just make that change mentioned above to xserver-xorg.postinst before dpkg-reconfigure gets invoked and it should work08:13
fabbionedaniels: first i need to see if it is broken here08:13
mdzdaniels: you should be able to use a hoary preview live CD and swap in X08:13
mdzsince you have locally-built packages08:14
mdzfabbione: it'll be broken unless you have an ati card on 0:5:0 or whatever the buildd has08:14
fabbionemdz: ok.. than i can test :-)08:14
fabbioneas soon as archive allows me to rsync08:14
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fabbionedaniels: i have issues to rsync from archive. too many lusers connected08:18
fabbionedaniels: let's revert as mdz suggested and i will test with you later.08:18
fabbionedaniels: does it sound a good plan?08:18
fabbionedaniels: of course only the bits the break08:19
danielsfabbione: yeah, I'm just in the middle of uploading now08:19
fabbionedaniels: not the entire thingy, since i can see from the changelog that some important stuff went in -408:19
danielsi've just kicked xserver-xorg.{config,postinst}.in back to what -2 was08:19
fabbionesounds good08:19
danielsmd5sums match and all08:19
mdzdaniels, fabbione: emailed casper log showing DEBUG_XORG_PACKAGE=developer output08:22
fabbionemdz: perfect. thanks08:22
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danielsmdz: yeah, it's what i thought08:24
fabbioneok.. rsycing now...08:26
fabbioneah damn...08:26
fabbionesparc was just uploading Xorg -508:27
fabbionethat means another build in a few hours08:27
danielsyeah, and lots of mirror pain08:27
danielsgiven the rapid sequence of -4, -5, -5.1, and then -6 to come reaosnably soon as this code needs testing08:27
mdzwe gambled, and we lost.  now we need to play it safe.08:28
danielshence -5.108:28
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dholbachmorning d3vic3 08:39
=== fabbione sighs....
fabbioneah there it is.. liveCD08:43
stockholmfabbione: when do you get up nowadays?! (c:08:43
fabbionestockholm: 6am usually...08:43
stockholmfabbione: but no children yet? that is why we get up so early.08:44
fabbionenope.. no mini-fabbione around ....08:44
d3vic3morning dholbach 08:44
fabbionehey d3v1c308:44
d3vic3hey fabbione 08:45
danielsfabbione: right, so you'll need to unpack the live CD and cloop as explained in LiveCDCustomizationHowto and then make that change to /var/lib/dpkg/info/xserver-xorg.postinst within the cloop, then rebuild it all08:45
danielsfabbione: you need a fair bit of disk space and a LOT of ram (or a lot of swap)08:45
stockholmfabbione: i am going to riccione on saturday, playing beach volleyball!08:45
fabbionedaniels: ok don't worry....08:45
fabbionedaniels: can you just only send me the change again via email?08:45
fabbionedaniels: it will take a little while before i will get there08:46
danielsfabbione: sure08:46
danielsfabbione: that's fine08:46
fabbionestockholm: riccione? in march?08:46
fabbioneare you on somekind of crack?08:46
fabbionedaniels: i have ram and disk space... so that's not an issue08:48
danielsfabbione: awesome ... email sent08:49
stockholmfabbione: there are allmost 20C now!08:50
stockholmwhile here we had 20cm snow over night.08:50
danielsfabbione: ok, i've gotta go now, already an hour late for dinner with gf's parents and i'm too exhausted to think any more anyway08:52
danielsfabbione: i'll be back a bit after 1400 utc, have mobile on me if urgent08:52
fabbionestockholm: ehhee08:53
fabbionedaniels: ok don't worry.08:54
fabbionedaniels: i will sms you if there are problems08:54
Hannes_whoo, -12C08:56
Hannes_and snowung08:56
Hannes_and 10-25cm of snow08:57
stockholmHannes_: where is that?08:57
Hannes_Pori, finland08:58
stockholmis that north of wasa?08:59
Hannes_south of08:59
Hannes_on the coast09:00
stockholmok, not *that* far away.09:00
Hannes_in the middle of vasa and bo (turku)09:01
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medwards_Is it appropriate to ask here about the LiveCD construction system?09:48
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dholbachhey mvo 09:56
fabbionemedwards_: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/LiveCDCustomizationHowTo09:57
mvohi dholbach, morning all09:57
fabbionehey mvo09:57
amuhey mvo 09:57
fabbioneamu: i get an error starting up kdm09:57
amufabbione: apt-get install kubuntu-default-settings09:58
fabbioneamu: "Cannot open theme file /usr/share/apps/kdm/themes/kubuntu"09:58
fabbioneamu: it should probably installed automatically or as Depends:09:59
fabbioneit's anybody working on it?09:59
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mvohi fabbione, hi amu09:59
mvoarray-7 is not out yet? can I help with testing candidate?10:00
amufabbione: yep, dependswas added 10:00
fabbionemvo: liveCD is borked and we are fixing it10:00
fabbioneit's a problem with X10:00
fabbionemuch much better :-)10:01
fabbioneamu: it looks good10:01
mvofabbione: install is ok? should I test? or is it already blessed?10:02
fabbionemvo: please test the install10:02
fabbionemore test is always good10:02
=== mvo is rsyncing
ccfabbione: ohh no. i'm relying on the livecd :P though i'm using a much older snapshot and it seems to work10:04
TerminXhow can I disable being forced to go through the entire Xorg configuration 3 times whenever the packages are upgraded?  I'm getting real tired of hitting escape10:06
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fabbionesorry jane, do you have one of my emails in which i did this calculation before?10:13
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svenlKamion, mdz: i have a question for you with regard the powerpc kernels.10:26
svenlRight now, they ship a .coff kernel, which is between 1 and 2 MB big, multiplied by the 6 powerpc flavours.10:27
svenlDebian removes this file.10:27
Treenakswhat is it used for?10:28
svenli believe that with the initrd-kernel concept, it is not only not usefull on any ubuntu supported hardware, but additionally it will not even work, not having the initrd.10:28
svenlTreenaks: it was for pre-yaboot/quik booting of oldworld powerpc through the serial console OF prompt.10:28
svenlTreenaks: i doubt it has ever been used in the last 3-6 years, and the mkvmlinuz support allows to generate the .coff from the vmlinux kernel and include the initrd.10:29
Treenakssvenl: which nobody does nowadays, because of yaboot/quik10:29
svenlTreenaks: exact.10:29
svenlTreenaks: fabbione feels uneasy removing it though, this near the hoary release.10:29
svenlTreenaks: but it would save around 10MB on the powerpc iso, so ...10:30
svenlwhich is why i ask Kamion or mdz about it, Kamion as powerpc porter or whatever, and mdz because he mentioned the powerpc iso space limit.10:33
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psy_does anyone know how you should use gettext in combination with libglade?10:36
dholbachpsy_: the guys in #gtk+ on irc.gnome.org probaly know more about it10:38
dholbachde rien :-)10:39
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pittiHi guys11:00
dholbachhi pitti11:00
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dholbachhi seb128 11:02
pittiHi seb128 11:03
pittiseb128: I know what's wrong with g-vfs, I found the bug :-)11:03
pittiseb128: (wrt adding harddisk partitions to fstab)11:03
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seb128pitti: oh, cool11:04
seb128pitti: what is it ?11:04
thominfinity: oddly, i have no objection :-)11:04
pittiseb128: initially user_visible is 1, but then gvfs calls a hal_modify_drive (or so) function which sets it to 011:05
fabbionehi pitti11:05
fabbionehey seb11:05
fabbionemorning thom11:05
pittiseb128: invalid drives work because there is no hal drive11:05
thommorning folks11:05
pittiseb128: but valid partitions can't be seen by hal, so the policy sets it to invisible11:05
pittiseb128: I'm fixing hal for this and also fix gvfs to fix the crash when updating fstab11:05
pittiHi fabbione, how are you11:05
fabbionepitti: busy :-)11:06
seb128pitti: k, thanks11:06
pittifabbione: surprise :-)11:09
fabbionepitti: do you have anything for me today?11:09
pittifabbione: I worked offline until now (modem), I did not read mail yet; but not right now11:10
pittifabbione: you prepare a new kernel?11:10
fabbioneyeah working on it.. but it won't be uploaded before Array7 is out11:10
dholbachsee you later11:11
fabbioneogra: hey dude11:12
pittiHi ogra11:12
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ograseb128, pog11:18
ograpong even11:18
seb128should I ping you about the xscreensavers issues ? 11:19
ograi'll start with them today again..11:19
seb128a sec, I've one 11:20
=== ogra looks
ograhmm, wondering how i can reproduce that for testing.....11:23
jordimvo: have you talked to jdub and whoever else needs to decide about nano?11:23
ograseb128, thanks :)11:24
mvojordi: not yet, everyone is busy with array-711:24
jordimvo: that is so minor :P11:24
seb128ogra: np :p11:24
seb128hey jordi 11:24
jordihi seb11:24
seb128jordi: not too desapointed by the maintainer upload for your almost new package ? :)11:25
mvojordi: compared to get magnificent nano editor :P11:25
jordiseb128: so happy :)11:25
jordiseb128: now I wonder if the suid root -> sgid mail fix I introduced in evo will persist when he ploads 2.211:26
pittifabbione: just finished security review, no new kernel stuff today11:26
seb128jordi: ah ah11:26
fabbionepitti: thanks11:26
pittihey, postgresql 8 in experimental11:26
pittithanks elmo/Kinnison11:27
seb128do we have an upload freeze for the new array ?11:28
seb128or that's ok to upload ?11:28
fabbioneseb128: freeze i think11:29
fabbioneit also depends what you need to upload11:29
seb128I don't need anything11:30
seb128there is some new versions for GNOME stuff, no hurry11:30
seb128(ie: glade2)11:30
fabbioneprobably better to wait after Array711:31
fabbioneno problem11:31
=== fabbione starts to cook some food
jordimvo: there are further fixes in CVS.11:32
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mvoping jdub 11:35
mvojordi: let's see if jdub is around11:35
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jintyhoi doko__11:41
sivangjinty: hoi :)11:42
jintyhey sivang11:42
jintylooks quiet in here11:42
sivangjinty: I guess everybody are busy or soemthing11:43
fabbionehey jinty 11:43
ograjinty, nah11:43
jintyhola all11:43
jintyso there is life11:44
doko__jinty: schoolbell in the works ... ;)11:44
jintygreat, thanks, just had a mail on the list asking which repository to use11:45
jintynow I can reply11:46
Simiramornin fabbione11:53
Simirafabbione: how is the temperature in DN nowadays?11:54
mvoKamion: "Looking for keymap to install:\nNONE" after the reboot to stage2 in the installer shouldn't be NONE, right?11:54
fabbionehi Simira 11:54
fabbioneSimira: it's 2 days that is around 6/7 C11:55
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fabbioneKamion: are you around?12:11
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Kamionfabbione: please do go ahead and remove vmlinux.coff; I can think of no reason to keep it12:14
fabbioneKamion: can you please build livecd with xorg 6.8.2-5.1?12:14
Kamionmvo: yeah, I don't know what that is, sorry12:14
fabbioneKamion: we need it for Array 712:15
fabbione6.8.2-5 was borked12:15
Kamionyeah, just a sec12:15
fabbioneKamion: ok. i can remove the coff thingy.... i have no issue with that other than breaking something :)12:15
KamionI only just woke up12:15
fabbioneKamion: sure. let me know when i can rsync for testing12:15
pittidaniels: why is it -5.1 and not -6, BTW?12:15
Simirafabbione: how wonderful!12:15
amuKamion: please also a kubuntu run :)12:15
Kamionfabbione: svenl's right there, it's an old thing for oldworld12:16
pittidaniels: the fractions are generally security updates12:16
fabbionepitti: because he has -6 ready somewhere else12:16
Kamionand unuseful12:16
fabbioneKamion: ok. i am just a bit conservative at this point in time12:16
KamionUbuntu live CDs kicked12:16
fabbioneKamion: wonderfull12:16
Kamionfabbione: I think the space saving would indeed be very useful12:16
Kamionamu: after I'm done with Ubuntu, sure12:16
=== Kamion will kick install CDs too now
fabbioneKamion: done12:17
fabbionesvenl: ^^12:17
=== fabbione -> food.. brb
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mvoKamion: I have a "X failed to start" in my test-install of the current cdimage. I guess that's a known issue already (because of the b0rked X)?12:37
fabbionemvo: mostlikely yes12:37
Kamionmvo: I guess ...12:38
Kamionit's all rebuilding at the moment12:38
mvoshout when it's ready :)12:40
svenlfabbione: ok, thanks.12:42
svenlfabbione: need to investigate the gigabit ethernet issue now, will keep you informed, and fix the hotplug thingy.12:42
fabbionesvenl: i would also like to understand what a user is supposed to do with the mkvinitrd thing12:43
fabbioneok.. we ship the files.. and ?12:43
fabbioneis it something that happens automatically or does the user have to build his own thing12:43
svenlfabbione: decide he would like to install ubuntu on a prep box, even if you don't support it officially ? 12:43
Kamionfabbione: it goes in a kernel-package postinst hook12:44
fabbioneKamion: yes.. i got that and i can see it12:44
svenlfabbione: so you can ship yaboot-less one file netboot images for powerpc, especiall for ibm-rs6k, whose firmware is buggy and can netboot only one file, thus no yaboot and separate kernel and initrd.12:44
svenlKamion: the mkvmlinuz in hoary (12) does not have the postinst hook magic though, and maybe it is better so.12:45
Kamionsvenl: yeah, we aren't going to change that now I think, it can wait until post-hoary12:45
svenlKamion: definitively.12:45
fabbionesvenl: ok, so basically we ship these extra files as helper, but we don't use them directly (yet)12:45
svenlKamion: especially as ubuntu has no official support for non-yaboot powerpc.12:45
svenlfabbione: exact.12:45
fabbionesvenl: how big are they?12:45
svenlfabbione: we could build netboot chrp and prep images though.12:46
fabbionewe killed the 1~2Mb coff thingy....12:46
Kamionthe extra files are tiny AFAIK12:46
svenlfabbione: a couple of .o files, let me check.12:46
svenl328k uncompressed for debian
fabbionelast 2 questions... is the tool to create such image aware of the .o location?12:46
svenlso maybe 100K, don't kno.12:46
svenlfabbione: you can pass it by -d option (which is done in debian-installer), but it will also locate it from the kernel path.12:47
fabbionesince i move them to linux-<whatever> instead of kernel-12:47
svenlfabbione: read the manpage, it is rather complete.12:47
svenlfabbione: i can provide a patch for that, or you could.12:47
Kamionit hardcodes kernel-image-*12:47
Kamionwe'll have to fix that12:47
svenlKamion: easy to fix though.12:47
fabbioneKamion: ok. what package is?12:47
fabbionesvenl: ok. last question.. can you give me a detailed entry for the changelog? :-)12:48
svenl    # try a default location, then use the current directory12:48
svenl    if objdir=/usr/lib/kernel-image-$release; test -d $objdir; then12:48
svenlthis one, at line 135 or thereabout needs changing, nothing more.12:48
svenljust for mkvmlinuz support ? 12:49
fabbionesvenl: yes please12:49
svenlyes, the above line is the only one needing change.12:49
fabbioneyes.. in which package?12:49
svenlits a shell script.12:50
fabbionesvenl: i want the changelog entry for the kernel package :-)12:50
svenlwill you make it version 12.1 or something such as to not introduce version skew with debian later when you sync ? 12:50
fabbionesvenl 12ubuntu112:50
fabbionewe have a standard version scheme12:50
pittiogra: yay, fixed the fstab bug12:52
fabbioneKamion: are you ok if i upload it now?12:54
fabbione(not the kernel...12:54
seb128pitti: you rock :)12:54
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pittiseb128: you too :-)12:55
svenlfabbione: ok, cool.12:56
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svenlfabbione: i would go ahead, nothing really uses it anyway, so ...12:56
fabbionesvenl: that is not the issue. we are building CD12:56
fabbionefor Array 712:56
fabbionei know nothing uses it12:57
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svenlKamion: does ubuntu's base-installer already not have the mkvmlinuz call ? 12:57
fabbionebut each package that goes in now, might delay testing12:57
fabbionelet's just wait12:57
fabbioneit is more wise12:57
svenlfabbione: yep, it is not needed anyway right now.12:58
ograpitti, WOOT01:03
=== ogra applauds pitti
seb128keep some applauds for this afternoon, he's going to squash the libgnomecups bug :p01:09
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Kamionfabbione: mkvmlinuz> sure, it's not on the CD01:13
Kamionsvenl: not for any subarches I care about, and mkvmlinuz is not on the CD, so01:13
fabbionehow is it going with the CD's?01:13
Kamioninstall CDs building, live cloops are done01:14
Kamionhowever I'm now in the pub so all is much better :)01:14
dholbachKamion: what time is at your place? 13:14? :-)01:14
Kamiondholbach: 12:1401:14
dholbachKamion: oh yes... i see :-)01:14
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KamionI generally work with Kinnison on Thursdays, and he wanted to attend his meeting from the pub :)01:15
dholbachgerman craftsmen say "Kein Bier vor vier!" (no beer before 16:00) - but i won't stop you ;-)01:15
pittisjoerd: here?01:16
thomKamion: pub within wifi distance of your house?01:16
Treenaksdholbach: in dutch it's "Bier uur" (sounds/looks like "Vier uur") ;)01:16
pittidholbach: and what about the "Elferzug"? :-)01:16
Kamionthom: nope, pub with free wifi01:16
thomah, even better01:16
Kamiondholbach: here we talk about the sun being over the yard-arm (i.e. after 12:00)01:16
dholbachKamion: sounds much better to me :-)01:17
pitti#u-devel - where you can learn invaluable cultural facts :-)01:17
dholbachpitti: quite luckily i live far away enough from cologne to NOT know what the elferzug thinks about it :-)01:17
Kamionaha, and the bandwidth is better here than at home, too01:19
pittiKamion: btw, yesterday I tested the PowerPC DVD, it does not boot at all. does it work for you?01:19
svenlKamion: IBM pseries and netbooting ? 01:19
Kamionpitti: never tried it01:20
Robot101pub with wireless, I wonder... :)01:20
Kamionsvenl: no idea; mkvmlinuz is in the archive though, so theoretically doable01:21
svenlKamion: like said, netboot pulled it in.01:21
seb128mvo: there is a bug open about improving gksu dialog: #7385. I don't know if you are interested by it, feel free to Cc you and comment if you are :)01:22
Kamionsvenl: right01:23
cchas kernel-team mail just dropped like crazy, or are there no kernel bugs?01:23
Treenakscc: the kernel is officialy Bug Free01:23
svenlKamion: not that important, since you are not pulling in mkvmlinuz 13.01:23
ccTreenaks: or is bugzilla broken :)01:23
fabbionethe kernel does NOT have bugs01:23
fabbioneit's all fault of your buggy hardware01:24
Kamioncc: kernel-bugs@ now01:24
trukulofabbione, 2.6.10 ?01:24
Kamionpitti: I'll give the DVD a go when I get a chance, but it'll take a while ...01:24
ccKamion: oh, didn't realise. someone should've posted to kernel-team. i will now :P01:24
fabbioneKamion: is install completed?01:24
KamionI do have a DVD reader in this laptop, just not a burner01:24
mvoseb128: thanks, I'll have a look01:24
Kamionfabbione: yeah, just done01:24
=== fabbione rsync
pittiKamion: i386 dvd works fine btw (just tested the live part so far)01:25
seb128mvo: thank you01:25
fabbionemvo: can you test too please?01:25
Kamiondaily 20050317.101:25
Kamionpitti: cool. wonder what broke with powerpc01:25
Kamionpitti: thanks for testing that though01:25
pittiis it just me, or do other people also get apt-get authentication errors?01:26
mvofabbione: rsyning now01:26
thomelmo: can you sync lsof 4.74.dfsg.2-1 (in incoming currently)01:26
Kamionpitti: there's still a low but worrying frequency of those01:26
pittiKamion: for ppc, after pressing "c" for CD-ROM boot, I just get a small error message and are immediately thrown back to OF01:26
thomelmo: (yes, please blow away the ubuntu changes)01:26
dholbachfabbione: if you have the time, could you maybe have a look at   http://ubuntu.gplan.info/fuse  - the new version changed slightly and i'm not sure if it needs additional changes01:27
fabbionedholbach: sorry.. not today. please remind me tomorrow01:28
dholbachfabbione: alright... will do and prepare python-fuse for now01:29
fabbioneguys can you please hold the uploads? we are trying to get Array7 out...01:30
Kamionpitti: oh, powerpc didn't build in the last run01:30
pittiKamion: I have an older version (dholbach: which one?)01:31
Kamionpitti: 20050312 looks nominally OK01:32
pittidholbach: which version did you send me?01:32
danielshas anyone tested xorg 6.8.2-5.1 with the cds?01:32
Kamiondaniels: they're still building01:32
pittiKamion: for downloading the DVD I tunneled IP-over-snailmail :-)01:32
danielsKamion: ok01:33
fabbionedaniels: i did it locally01:33
fabbionedaniels: upgrading the livefs from 5 to 5.101:34
pittiKamion: I have 2005030801:34
fabbioneand i did send you the sms :-)01:34
danielsok, i'll hang around until the new cds are built, and i can rsync and test the live cd01:34
danielsyeah, just want to be sure01:34
fabbioneso do i01:34
fabbioneupgrading isn't the same01:34
danielslast time i went to sleep before something was finished i got woken up a couple of hours later and didn't end up getting back to sleep01:34
mvoinstall-cd is here01:34
=== mvo burns
danielswell, we'll find out01:35
KamionI'm rsyncing, but I won't be able to actually test for a couple of hours01:35
fabbioneKamion: is the live up?01:36
Kamionfabbione: yes, just01:37
Kamiondaily-live 20050317.301:37
fabbioneis current linked to it?01:37
fabbioneah there it is01:38
fabbionecome down baby01:38
=== fabbione sucks from a fat pipe
danielsfor some reason , I'm getting a whopping 14kB/sec, so I haven't actually finished 0317.2 yet.  sigh.01:40
kokemmm, my inotify is not working, how can I force the menu to re-read the applications thir without killing the panel??01:43
kokeif it's possible :)01:43
Mithrandirwhy not just kill the panel?01:45
kokeIIRC some KDE apps in the systray behave strange after killing it. And maybe the update-notifier01:46
mvokoke: update-notifier should be fixed (it should just restart when the panel was killed)01:47
mvokoke: please file a bug if not :)01:47
kokemvo: OK, I'll try01:47
=== fabbione burns the live
kokemvo: it's ok. only disappeared kmail and akregator :)01:49
mvokoke: thanks :)01:51
=== pitti works offline for a bit, cu later
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dholbachelmo: thanks for getting new libgdamm1.3 through 01:54
mvoelmo: thanks for the nessus sync!01:54
fabbioneelmo: thanks for your bank account code.. let the packages for the others :-)01:55
=== mvo chuckles
MithrandirKamion: is there some way to make ssh grab its password from a pipe/fd?01:58
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KamionMithrandir: SSH_ASKPASS?02:00
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MithrandirKamion: that's not for passwords, just for passphrases, it seems?02:01
Mithrandir(and I can't put a public key there, since it's an ssh-accessible public svn repo)02:02
KamionMithrandir: you sure? ssh calls the read_passphrase() function when replying to a password prompt02:05
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MithrandirSSH_ASKPASS=ssh-askpass ssh root@
MithrandirSSH_ASKPASS=ssh-askpass ssh root@
Mithrandir(sorry for the double)02:05
Kamionoh, no, it turns off the RP_USE_ASKPASS flag in that code path02:05
Kamionoh well02:05
pittiseb128: bah, jody changed very much in the new libgnomecups, it's not a simple bugfix02:06
MithrandirI should whack the hula people to provide a secret key one can use anonymously for accessing the svn02:06
Kamiondunno if you can do it with a keyboard-interactive device02:07
pittiseb128: what is jody's nick? "jody"?02:07
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jdubpitti: yes02:09
seb128pitti: right02:09
pittihmm, he's not online02:09
pittiI looked in #gnome02:09
seb128/whois 02:09
seb128--- [jody]  idle 08:09:57, signon: Thu Mar  3 00:02:1802:09
seb128you can probably drop a message in query02:09
seb128jdub: hey !02:09
seb128jdub: https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=7279, do we want this entry in the menu ?02:10
jdubseb128: no, in fact i was just about to ping you about a few of those02:11
jdubseb128: cd database, database properties, multimedia systems -> should be killed02:11
jdubi had trouble killing stuff from the prefs menus, but perhaps recent changes in gnome-menus has helped02:12
seb128jdub: BTW have you seen the panel update ? :)02:13
jdubyes, saw your upload :-)02:13
seb128jdub: what trouble ? adding a NoDisplay=true is not enough ?02:14
seb128we can also drop the entries02:14
jdubseb128: wanted to do it in gnome-menus rather than individual packages02:14
sivangpitti: I seem to have a problme with cdbs-edit-patch, I think it's not applying one of the patches I have on d/p 02:15
pittisivang: it does not apply patches which come lexicographically _after_ the patch you are editing02:15
pittisivang: this is an important feature, not a bug02:15
jdubanyway, i should go back to bed :-)02:15
=== fabbione goes live
sivangpitti: I wasn't suggesting this was a bug, would you care to explain the rationale?02:16
dokois there an easy way to determine, if a user is running a KDE or a Gnome environment?02:16
seb128jdub: I'll mask "cd database, database properties, multimedia systems" for the moment02:16
jdubdoko: not in a particularly sane way, no02:16
Treenaksdoko: you shouldn't need to02:16
Simirajdub: ping02:16
Simirajdub: mewants ubuntu-no mailing list!02:17
pittisivang: because the patches that come after the one you are editing are also applied later; so the edited patch must not depend on changes from later patches02:17
TreenaksSimira: how about a "no-ubuntu" mailing list!02:17
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jdubSimira: requests via email please02:17
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SimiraTreenaks: ha ha... would that really be a good idea?02:18
dokosane or not doesn't matter ;) just want to call the correct email client from OOo evolution or kmail ...02:18
I-RockKamion: LiveCD is go here02:18
=== Mithrandir sniffs over Simira not being happy with his @ubuntu.no lists.
Simirajdub: I have done that... two weeks ago02:18
I-Rockgoing to test on the other 2 boxes02:18
sivangpitti: ah right! 02:18
sivangpitti: nice :)02:18
jdubdoko: there's no appropriate way to detect02:18
jdubSimira: i don't have an email from you02:18
=== jdub has to go back to bed, or will continue to be a zombie for the rest of the week ;)
sivangnot good being a zombie02:19
Simirajdub: I even sent it on Valentines day!!!02:19
=== Mithrandir wonders what a zombie jdub would act like, considering his usualy craziness. :)
danielsjdub: yeah02:19
=== Simira feels unloved by jdub
sivangSimira: don't take it personally, he loves only seb12802:20
mvoKamion: I just booted the live-cd and I still don't have a german keyboard on the console (X is fine though)02:20
Simirasivang: but... but... I'm nice! And I want my mailing list!02:21
TreenaksSimira: just mail him about it then :)02:21
mvopitti: "still" means, got that yesterday too02:21
=== Mithrandir hugs Simira
=== Simira doesn't feel any warm arms around her
mvoKamion: otherwise it looks fine02:22
fabbionemvo: did the install work?02:23
Kamionmvo: ok, I'll have to try that out later; probably not an Array 7 blocker, but could you file a bug please?02:23
mvofabbione: stage1 finished, stage2 is running right now02:23
danielsfabbione: is live any good?02:24
mvoKamion: sure, not a big issue, I'll file a bug (install seems to have the same problem in stage2)02:24
Kamionhm, interesting breakage though02:25
mvodaniels: just worked fine for my test (X came up with correct keyboard and stuff)02:25
fabbionedaniels: read above "I-Rock"02:25
Kamionfabbione: what architecture was that?02:25
fabbioneKamion: i38602:25
fabbionethat's the only one i have here02:25
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fabbioneLiveCD is go on 2/3 boxes02:26
danielsthanks guys, goodnight02:26
fabbionegnight daniels02:27
dholbachbye daniels 02:27
zulnight daniels02:27
mvonight daniels 02:29
pittiseb128: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=17067302:30
pittiseb128: this is too much for me; maybe we should rather downgrade to libgnomecups 0.1.4 for now02:31
seb128pitti: utch, want to epoch for that ?02:32
seb128on several packages ?02:32
zulsomeone was looking for me?02:32
pittiseb128: hmm, rather not epoch. maybe 0.2+really0.1.4 or so :-)02:32
pittiseb128: this could require a g-c-m downgrade as well, since g-c-m 0.3 depends on libgnomecups 0.202:33
seb128that kind of suck02:33
pittilet's see what jody says before02:33
seb128I'll let some days to upstream to reply on that before going in this way02:33
pittiseb128: indeed, that was what I wanted to propose :-)02:33
pittiseb128: downgrading is safe and can be done quickly02:34
seb128thanks pitti02:34
=== pitti goes to university to get actual bandwidth
pittiseb128: np; but no applause today :-(02:34
thomman, redhat's bugzilla is so sweet02:34
seb128how ?02:34
thomit's fast, doesn't make my eyes hurt, the interlinking stuff is nice, search is actually useful...02:38
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Treenaksthom: especially the last part is nice02:40
amuseb128: I found your brother "Riddell, he broke my KDE-panel"02:41
seb128thom: how, is there a difference in the search ?02:41
seb128amu: bah, that's normal for KDE, isn't it ? :p02:41
Treenaksamu: that sounds like a t-shirt quote: "Ridell broke my KDE panel"02:41
thomseb128: dunno, but it's the only bugzilla i've found that finds stuff that i'm actually looking for :/02:41
seb128you search for words02:41
amuseb128: no it isnt such easy ;)  02:41
seb128perhaps people put useful bugs in it ? :p02:41
thomthat's also possible02:42
seb128ie: nice description with the right words to find stuff :)02:42
thomseb128: you mean all the bugs i file shouldn't have "iz gtk boog" as the description?!?02:42
amuTreenaks: hehe, those cafepress? 02:43
Treenaksamu: ask Keybuk :) he has a "seb128" one02:43
amuTreenaks: yep saw them, we can order them for all and give them away in .au? 02:45
Treenaksamu: you could, but I'm not going there :(02:45
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amuTreenaks: you stay so close to me, we could arrange a meeting, and we celebrate the panel day02:48
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dholbachhellas jani 02:50
fabbioneKamion: ok. 3/3 livecd is GO02:51
janihi dholbach02:51
amufabbione: did you test with my QA doc? :) 02:53
fabbioneamu: ehm... what QA doc?02:53
Kamionfabbione: cool, thanks02:55
lamontpitti been around?02:55
fabbioneKamion: no problem. please hold the images for mdz to approve02:55
Kamionhe's normally happy for me to do Array releases by myself02:56
fabbioneKamion: i think he will test them too02:56
Kamionwell, we'll see how my testing goes, back home now02:56
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Robot101lamont: missed him by about 20 mins02:59
=== pitti [~pitti@] has joined #ubuntu-devel
thomthat's impressive timing03:00
janiwas it decided that evince replaces xpdf as default?03:02
Kamionmdz was unhappy about making that change at this stage03:02
fabbioneamu: just to fill that page, it would take me more time than writing AI 03:02
Treenaksjani: is it fully featured then?03:03
janiIt was just my impression at the Friday meeting03:03
janibut see it's still in desktop03:03
janibut Kamion explained it so ok03:03
janianyone here with toolchain building experience?03:05
=== mvo thinks that some kind of progress thing for scrollkeeper would be nice. it takes _ages_
Treenaksmvo: yes! and for ldconfig too03:06
Treenaks(ldconfig takes AGES on my P3-600 laptop)03:07
mvoTreenaks: my test-machine is a p2-400 :p03:07
pittimvo: IMHO it should rather be done with nice 19 in the background03:08
Treenakspitti: that breaks when you shutdown immediately after upgrade on a slow machine03:09
mvoand it seems to try getting stuff from the net :/03:09
Treenaks(and yes, people will do that)03:09
mvoKamion: install-cd is fine here (except the console keymap problem). X comes up, sound looks good and X-keymap is fine too03:11
pittiTreenaks: hmm, right03:14
pittiTreenaks: however, I assume it's always the same result after desktop installation? Maybe there can be some sort of pre-caching (not for Hoary, of course)03:15
Kamionpitti: also don't think it's a good idea to do it in the background because that's exactly the time when people are most likely to try to use the machine and review its responsiveness03:20
pittiKamion: hmm, yeah03:20
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pittiKamion: btw, do your USB devices (WLAN, flash drive, etc.) work after resuming from sleep?03:23
KamionI believe that's known-broken on powerpc at the moment03:24
Kamionbenh has said it's non-trivial03:24
pittiKamion: if it happens for other folks as well, then I'd like to upload my workaround03:24
ograpitti, great news, so we can close all these hal bugs ? :)03:25
pittiKamion: #7619 contains my workaround and it works fine for me for about a week now03:25
pittiogra: erm, not all of them, I think03:25
pittiogra: I just fixed the "drives in /etc/fstab" don't appear" one03:25
ograoh, i thought the eternal restartting of gnome-vfs-daemon too....03:26
pittiogra: oh, that one too, yes03:26
Kamionpitti: the suggestion in comment #2 seems reasonable, yeah03:26
pittiogra: but I don't know whether this actually fixes something03:26
ograso this should match more then 50% of them03:26
Kamionthe "resume script only" one03:26
Kamionpitti: I haven't tried it myself I'm afraid03:27
ograpitti, i think the "my CD player starts over and over again" one at least :)03:27
pittiKamion: indeed, that's what I'm using for a week now03:27
pittiogra: hmm, I doubt that it's this one; it has not anything to do with g-vfs-daemon03:27
pittiogra: that's a g-v-m issue03:27
ogradoesnt it trigger g-v-m ?03:27
pittino, hal triggers g-v-m03:28
pittig-vfs-daemon is just responsible for the computer/places/menu magic03:28
thomplease make it so i can leave a cd in the drive. KTHXBYE03:28
dholbachoh yes: http://tseng.ath.cx/log/?p=9 :-)03:29
sivangthom: why would? I enjoy knowing what there is in the cdrw before writing onto it :-))03:29
thomsivang: you enjoy being reminded every 5 minutes? 03:30
pittithom: EWORKSFORME03:30
pittithom: I need a full hal/gvm debugging output 03:30
sivangthom: not actually, hence the :-)) 03:30
pittithom: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingRemovableDevices03:30
sivangthom: I should haev used <sarcasm></sarcasm> probably03:31
thompitti: i'm trying to find a cd that won't annoy me by stealing focus03:31
pittithom: turn down the volume :-)03:31
seb128there is not focus stealing03:31
pittimental focus, I assume03:31
seb128stop the FUD thom :p03:31
sivangpitti: LOL03:32
thomseb128: cd player steals focus03:33
thomseb128: just tested it :P03:33
=== pitti fetches his "don't blame me for GTK bugs" shirt
thompitti: i'm not blaming you for that :-)03:34
pittisure :-)03:34
smurfixAnother X update, three more rounds of pointlessly debconf-answering every X question in existence. Shouldn't that be fixed by now?03:34
Kamionwe had to revert03:34
pittithom: however, I'm very interested in the debug outputs, otherwise I can't do anything about it03:34
smurfixKamion: Ouch.03:34
Kamionsmurfix: live CD breakage was more important03:34
=== smurfix reluctantly agrees with that prioritization
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sjoerdpitti: pong03:35
thompitti: yup, running now03:36
pittisjoerd: http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/764103:36
thomseb128: want a bug filed or will you just fix it?03:36
pittisjoerd: this fix should interest Debian as well03:36
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=== thom puts money on it not happening this time
seb128thom: put it in bugzilla please03:38
sjoerdpitti: k, i'll take a look at all the ubuntu stuff for the next package anyway..03:41
thomis it just me or is bugzilla hating the world currently03:49
seb128pitti: jody seems to be interested by #6520, let me know if you have an idea on it :)03:50
pittiseb128: didn't deal with it yet, I have to catch up on security03:52
thomseb128: https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=779303:53
pittiI slacked with security updates for two days now...03:53
seb128thom: thanks03:53
thomseb128: enjoy ;-)03:53
Burgundaviajdub: there is a related bug filed by me about naming it03:54
thompitti, ogra: just updated #600203:55
Burgundaviajdub: nev mind, for some reason xchat hadn't been rolling with the new changes03:55
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Mitariohello everyone03:56
ograthom, thanks, the log data looks ok to me...04:00
pittiHi Mitario 04:00
pittiogra, thom: this looks as if your CD-ROM module was unloaded after some time...04:01
ograpitti, callout.c:318: Invoking /etc/hal/device.d/40-hal-hotplug-map.hal04:01
ogra14:51:59.037 [I]  callout.c:330: Child pid 14002 for 40-hal-hotplug-map.hal04:01
ogra14:51:59.038 [I]  callout.c:173: Child pid 14002 terminated04:01
ograwhat about this, seems to occur more then once04:02
pitti14:51:56.619 [I]  linux/block_class_device.c:931: Removing volume for no_partitions device /dev/hdc04:02
pittithis one is the interesting stuff04:02
Mitariomvo, ping04:02
pittiit occurs about 15 minutes after the CD was inserted04:02
mvohey Mitario 04:02
Mitariomvo, hi :-)04:02
mvohi :)04:02
Mitariomvo, any updates on update-manager?04:03
fabbioneKamion: i need to go to the bank.04:03
fabbioneKamion: i will be back in one hour or so i think04:03
fabbionecan you tell mdz when he wakes up?04:03
Kamionok, all looking good here04:03
KamionI have a meeting at 404:03
Kamion(one hour)04:03
mvoMitario: no, no feedback from cvsmaster. and I tried the import too but it looks like it does not accept my ssh-key04:03
fabbionewe should be back more or less at the same time04:03
Mitariomvo, do you get an error?04:04
=== fabbione &
=== pitti tests crack-of-the-day ppc live cd
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mvoMitario: no04:08
Kamionthe evolution splash screen that says that this version is not yet stable is still there04:08
KamionI thought that was supposed to have gone away with 2.2?04:08
mvoMitario: I get prompted for a login password04:08
Mitariomvo, ah04:08
mvoMitario: so it looks like my key is not yet accepted04:09
Mitariohmm weird, have you contacted the cvsmaster?04:10
mvoMitario: not yet, was busy with other stuff 04:12
Mitariomvo, ok04:12
mvoMitario: will try later04:13
Mitariomvo, ok :)04:14
torkelKamion: I think there was a patch for it on evolution-patches that got accepted, so it will probably be resolved in the next release04:17
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pitti17.3 live CD for ppc rocks04:19
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lamontmdz: awake yet?04:24
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Nafallopowernowd is screwed again here. I take a look at it.04:30
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KinnisonHi guys. Any word on when the jimmac cursor theme will be back?04:33
tsengits back04:34
KinnisonIt is?04:34
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tsengits just missing the file to make it default.04:34
tsengtry gcursor04:34
=== Kinnison installs
Kinnisonhmm, mine still look duff04:35
=== Kinnison will restart X
ograKinnison, logout is enough04:36
Nafallohmm, I'll restart and see if things are solved.04:37
Kinnisonogra: didn't seem to do the trick04:37
Kinnisonmy cursor in GDM at least still looks cack04:38
ograyeah, gcursor only applys to your session04:38
Burgundaviacan I ask for some advice on: https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=745504:38
Kinnisonogra: aah; can I make it the default theme overall?04:38
ograKinnison, blame jdub.... industrial engine has a packaging bug04:38
Kinnisonogra: *pout*04:39
ograbut it is known and will get solved...gcursor is only a workaround04:39
=== Kinnison tries logging in again
=== Burgundavia pats Kinnison on the head
KinnisonAaah yes; logged in it looks okay. Thanks ever so much guys04:40
KinnisonBurgundavia: I might be a developer; but I'm still a picky user too :-)04:40
BurgundaviaKinnison: that is good. The day you stop being a picky user, that is the day I find a new distro04:41
ograKinnison, oh ? i thought youre a poet04:41
Kinnisonogra: whatever gave you that idea?04:41
KinnisonBurgundavia: meep04:41
sivangKinnison:   :-)04:41
KinnisonBurgundavia: pile the stress on why don't you?04:41
=== Kinnison sobs
BurgundaviaKinnison: I meant that generally for all devs04:42
Kinnisonsivang: and that demonstrates that pterm has reverted :-(04:42
Kinnisonsivang: My right-to-left support is broken :-(04:42
ograKinnison, your jabberwocky recitation in mataro ;)04:42
sivangKinnison: oh oops, sorry 04:42
Kinnisonsivang: Not your fault04:42
Burgundaviadid anyone look at my bug or not?04:42
=== Kinnison glares at the pterm maintainer (who is across the table from me right now)
sivangKinnison: I said "Hi Daniel"04:42
sivangKinnison: where are you in?04:42
lamontsivang: I bet Kamion's flat04:43
Kinnisonlamont: Well; Kamion's back room04:43
Kinnisonlamont: of a three story house.04:43
lamontthere's 3 floors there?04:43
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lamontbasement, or am I truly that clueless some days?04:44
Kinnisonlamont: ground + two floors upwards04:44
lamontwell, ground + more is what I remember - kinda assumed total of 2. :-)04:44
=== Kinnison grins
=== lamont learns something new every day
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=== lamont fetches a set of cd images, goes to get ready to fetch them.
Kinnisontime for me to go04:46
sivangKinnison: nice, so you have like a miniconf there :)04:46
Kinnisonc'y'all later04:46
Kinnisonsivang: every thursday pretty much04:46
ograKinnison, ciao04:46
sivangKinnison: woo cool04:47
=== sivang is amazed to find out his net connection is virtually unusable for uploading/downloading files.
sivangRiddell: are you having download problems from muse ?04:57
sivangRiddell: I'm getting rideculeous downstream..04:57
Riddellsivang: my screen session on muse it running fine04:58
sivangRiddell: argh, then it's my ISP's fault. I can't even use the screen session itneractively04:58
pittiseb128: can you please review http://muse.19inch.net/~sivan/g-c-m/sivan-gcm-crack.diff ?05:01
pittiseb128: the code looks fine to me, but now the patch was bloated by update-po05:01
ograhuh ?05:03
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Nafallothom: ping?05:04
thomi needed to swear about my favourite subject05:04
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Nafallothom: am I correct if I say powernowd's init-script was changed for ubuntu12?05:05
thomno; the cpufreq detection script was changed05:05
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Nafallothom: hmm. I try to debug why powernow-k8 doesn't get modprobed.05:06
thomNafallo: sudo sh -x /usr/share/doc/cpufreq-detect.sh and attach the output to the bug05:06
sivangthom !05:06
jordisilly question. Is the new array CDs available already, or not yet?05:07
seb128pitti: k05:07
jordiand if so, is today's daily safe?05:07
mvojordi: no release yet, but some of us tested the dailes and they are mostly fine05:09
Nafallothom: done05:10
jordimvo: today's?05:10
mvojordi: yes05:10
jordihttp://cdimage.ubuntulinux.org/daily-live/current/ <--- ie, this05:10
mvojordi: yes :)05:10
jordiok :)05:10
Kamionlamont: you wouldn't have noticed the third unless you were paying attention - this house makes good use of what others would consider roof space05:12
Kamionlamont: although it's somewhat taller than your average two-storey house05:12
Kamionjordi: today's daily will likely be array 7, tests are good so far05:13
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thomNafallo: so just running /usr/share/doc/cpufreq-detect.sh returns powernow-k8?05:14
jordiKamion: great05:15
Nafallothom: I can see nothing wrong with the detection-script. Seems to find me.05:17
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Nafallothom: nope.05:18
Nafallothom: We're a laptop\ powernow-k805:18
Nafallothom: the init-script tries to load "We're a laptop" then? ;-)05:19
thomaaargh, i knew i should fix that05:21
MithrandirKamion: could the amd64 scsi-modules-udeb include the i2o drivers as well?05:24
KamionMithrandir: erm, guess so, can't check now though05:25
Nafallothom: works when I edited /usr/sbin/laptop-detect not to echo :-).05:25
MithrandirKamion: should I rather file a bug, just?05:25
KamionMithrandir: yeah, might as well05:25
Mithrandirthanks. :)05:26
mdzlamont: here05:27
mdzKamion: how is it going?05:27
pittiMorning mdz05:27
zulhey mdz 05:27
HiddenWolfUgh. lots of issues with gamin right now. :S05:27
mdzmorning folks05:27
Nafallothom: no problem. bug assigned instead of NEEDINFO :-).05:27
ogramorning mdz05:29
Nafallomdz: morning :-)05:30
sivangmorning mdz05:31
=== Clint [clint@adsl-69-233-179-235.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel
mvomorning mdz 05:32
Mithrandirargh, why can't I file a bug on scsi-modules-udeb?05:32
pittimdz:  nice to see the new dpkg with fixed Replaces: :-)05:32
mdzpitti: yes, hopefully we will find some time to test it before release ;-)05:32
pittimdz: I'll do ASAP05:32
pittimdz: and we can drop the Pre-Depends again and instead introduce the circular dependency05:33
pittimdz: if my local tests work, I upload update packages for broader testing :-)05:33
mdzMithrandir: because my bugzilla component-o-matic is a quick hack and doesn't look at the d-i Packages files05:34
Mithrandirmdz: ok, I just filed it against debian-installer.05:35
Mithrandirhopefully it won't drown there. :)05:35
mdzI must have just missed Kamion05:37
mdzseb128: are you here?05:38
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seb128mdz: yep05:40
mdzseb128: can you help Jeff with #6172?05:43
mdzseb128: (the cursor fix)05:44
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Nafallothom: nice fix on 7771! :-D05:46
fabbionemdz: good morning05:47
mdzfabbione: morning, how is array 7?05:47
fabbionemdz: ready to go.05:47
pittigooooood on ppc05:47
thommjg59: i think we need to run ifrename during resume05:47
mdzfabbione: Kamion is satisfied with it?05:47
pittimdz: keyboard works great now on live CD :-)05:47
fabbionewe were waiting for you to release but Kamion had to go out for an hour or so05:47
mdzI am rsyncing now05:47
mdzpitti: great!05:47
mdzok, since he is out anyway I will do a quick test05:47
fabbionemdz: we are go for i386 both live and install05:47
seb128mdz: does he need some help, or is that a "can you see with him to get that fixed now" ? :)05:47
fabbionemdz: Kamion did his round of tests and reported no problems05:48
mdzseb128: both; it is a non-trivial fix because it uses alternatives and the packaging needs to un-break the alternative05:48
fabbionemdz: there is only one bug on console keymaps, but we consider it a non stopper05:48
seb128mdz: k, will have a look05:48
fabbionemdz: so everything looks good for A705:48
mdzfabbione: regression from preview?05:48
fabbionemdz: the console keymap is not correct after the selection, but X gets it right05:49
mdzseb128: currently the alternative points to a nonexistent file and so has reverted to manual mode, due to an upgrade issue some time ago05:49
fabbioneit is exactly the opposite problem we had with warty05:49
fabbioneKamion was sure to have fixed it, but apparently it wasn't05:50
mdzseb128: what I believe we need to do is have gtk2-engines-industrial notice this and switch the alternative back to auto05:50
fabbioneand it did show up only on .de keyboards05:50
mdzseb128: then it should switch itself to the highest priority one as it should be05:50
seb128mdz: ok05:50
mdzseb128: we talked about it some in this channel; I can paste you from my log if it would be helpful05:51
seb128yes please05:51
pittifabbione: darn, I didn't test this when I tested the live CD; shall I try this?05:51
fabbionepitti: if you can..05:51
seb128and I've not played with the alternatives out of the normal bits before05:51
pittifabbione: sure, rebooting now into live CD05:51
=== jon1012 [~jon@AMontsouris-151-1-15-69.w82-123.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #ubuntu-devel
mvothe keymap issue is reported as #779005:54
mvo(just FYI)05:54
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fabbionethanks mvo05:55
mdzmvo: how is the upgrade work going?05:58
mdzmvo: also I just remembered yesterday that we have not dealt with libgnome2-perl05:58
mvomdz: pretty good. I added a comment to #7419 how the removal of ubuntu-desktop can be worked around, I added a debdiff for #7743 (fontconfig upgrade). I can upload after the array-7 release :)06:00
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mvomdz: about the libgnome2-perl, I can add that as a dependency and upload (I need to look into a synaptic bug anyway). I didn't until now because I wasn't sure if we shouldn't just add libgnome2-perl to the desktop seed06:01
pittimdz, fabbione, mvo: .de console keyboard on ppc/live works fine for me; the only regression is that the Apple key does not work like a AltGt06:01
pittibut all the other keys are correct06:02
mdzamd64-live looks good06:02
pittihowever, I did discover an ugliness06:02
mdzmvo: I am not sure either06:02
mdzmvo: probably the desktop seed, since it should be possible to remove it without removing synaptic06:03
pittiwhen using the "Check keyboard layout" without having used the "type a few keys" selector first, you get an error06:03
pittirelatively easy recovery, though06:03
pittismurfix: ^06:03
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mvomdz: nod06:03
smurfixpitti: Is the correct keyboard name displayed in the first line?06:04
pittismurfix: before the bug, it's "Deutsch"; after checking the keyboard, it's "de-latin1-nodeadkeys"06:04
pittismurfix: this is ugly as well, btw :-)06:04
mdzmvo: I am very worried that that frontend has not received sufficient testing, though06:04
mvomdz: what frontend? gnome-debconf? 06:05
mdzmvo: yes.  how many people are using it?06:05
mvomdz: it's around for a long time in debian, I use it for all my work. I don't think it will be a problem. but I agree, we should switch to it fast 06:06
mvomdz: I can upload a synaptic with that dependency today if you want (I don't think that I can change seeds, can I?)06:06
=== pitti never saw gnome debconf
pittimvo: you can06:06
mvopitti: oh, nice06:06
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mvomdz: I would be interessted in your opinion in #7419 (no rush, when you have time)06:07
smurfixGah. pitti: that doesn't happen on i38606:07
jordimvo: ok, mailed david telling him current CVS seems quite sane (unless you state the contrary), and asking about what's left for 1.3.606:07
pittismurfix: and on your pb?06:07
bluefoxicySimply:  Should Ubuntu require a very very fast multi-gigahertz CPU to stay out of the 100%+ range of CPU usage?06:07
ograpitti, its ugly, but better then terminal for users06:07
mvojordi: thanks!06:07
mdzpowerpc-live looks good06:08
mdzmvo: ok, let's switch to it immediately after array 706:08
smurfixpitti: I do not *have* a powerbook at the moment, though I can grab one tomorrow.06:08
mvomdz: ok06:08
bluefoxicy  PID USER      PR  NI  VIRT  RES  SHR S PU %MEM    TIME+  COMMAND06:08
bluefoxicy26252 bluefox   25   0  6264 4984  856 R 40.9  0.6   6:46.17 gam_server06:08
bluefoxicy 7675 bluefox   25   0 19452 8888 6384 R 40.5  1.1  72:20.71 gnome-settings-06:08
pittismurfix: oh, what happened to yours?06:08
mdzmvo: I had forgotten about it for a while; we should have done it before array 7 :-/06:08
jordimvo: now you get your release dudes to think about this change :)06:08
bluefoxicyerr, only wanted the last 2 lines06:08
pittimvo: ubuntu-devel@lists.ubuntu.com/seeds--hoary--006:08
jordimvo: in any case, the latest test deb should get some publicity so people test it.06:08
bluefoxicyBut this is pretty continuous, should these two be using 100% CPU together most of the time while I'm not doing anything in particular?06:08
smurfixSomebody thought my backpack would make a nice addition to his collection. Unfortunately he didn't ask me first.06:08
mdzjordi: hmmm?06:09
bluefoxicy(mlnet and X have the other 10%, and rhythmbox)06:09
=== metallikop is now known as kop|gone
pittismurfix: bah, what a nice guy06:09
mdzsmurfix: no laptop in it, I hope06:09
bluefoxicythey've been holding 100% CPU usage for a day or so now06:09
fabbionebluefoxicy: please stop joining the chan and pasting stuff like this. use #ubuntu for support06:09
bluefoxicyfabbione:  #ubuntu for bugs?06:09
smurfixmdz: Sure there was.  :-(  :-(06:09
fabbionebluefoxicy: if it is a bug you use bugzilla.u.c06:09
mdzsmurfix: oh no! :-(06:09
bluefoxicyfabbione:  does it count if nobody actually ever responds to anything I ask that seems to be a technical issue in #ubuntu?06:10
fabbionebluefoxicy: not all developers are here at the same time06:10
bluefoxicythough they do respond to "How do I ..." questions readily.06:10
bluefoxicyfabbione:  well I wanna make sure this isn't normal :o06:10
smurfixmdz: My thought exactly.06:10
fabbionebluefoxicy: open the bug. if it is not a bug, you will be notified by the maintainer06:11
bluefoxicyfabbione:  and I already tried the bugzilla; firefox sat there for 5 minutes and d idn't download a single byte of bugzilla.ubuntu.com06:11
lamontbluefoxicy: this is the channel to discuss your patch to fix the problem.06:11
bluefoxicylamont:  oh, sorry nota  programmer?06:12
mvomdz: jordi is working with upstream to get a nano with utf-8 support06:12
=== bluefoxicy goes back to writing a C++ program that he needs done by 5 today
mdzmvo: ah, this does not sound like a hoary change :-)06:12
=== bluefoxicy [~bluefox@pcp484971pcs.whtmrs01.md.comcast.net] has left #ubuntu-devel ["That's]
mvomdz: yes, I don't have a good feeling about it. OTOH we'll ship with a broken $EDITOR by default (that can't handle e.g. umlauts)06:13
mdzmvo: better than risking an editor which has bugs with ascii :-)06:13
jordi(with a UTF-8 locale)06:13
mdznano is the only editor available in the installer06:13
=== kop|gone is now known as metallikop
mdzI don't think there is time to test it sufficiently06:14
jordimdz: this mostly affects nano, not nano-udeb.06:14
mdzjordi: oh?06:14
mdzdo we even ship nano?06:14
jordibut I agree this is quite late.06:14
jordimdz: I guess.06:14
jordiwhat's you're easy to use text editor if not? vi?06:14
mdzhmm, apparently we do06:14
jordiyour even06:15
smurfixpitti: Can you grab d-i and build a powerpc-netboot ISO for me?06:15
fabbionesmurfix: is that mkvmlinuz thingy?06:16
dokomdz: we are missing a lot of myspell-<lang> and openoffice.org-hyphenation-<lang> packages for important languages like af, zu and da (well, maybe da is not important). ok to add these packages?06:16
smurfixfabbione: No, I need to debug a few keyboard selector snags06:16
fabbionesmurfix: ah ok06:16
mdzdoko: ->pitti06:17
sivangpitti: we have a problem with users-admin, another one :-(06:17
mdzdoko: those packages should be dependencies of the language-support-* packages06:17
pittidoko: fine for me06:17
smurfix(or anybody else who's got a ppc box)06:17
jordipitti: umh.06:17
pittidoko: "missing" -> not in the archive, or not in main?06:17
dokonot in the archives06:17
pittiin sid?06:17
sivangpitti: John Richard Jose noted it on the mailing list, when you read it, let me know what you think. the fix doesn't seem small06:17
jordipitti: someone just downloaded today's daily and he says the translations appear to be incomplete or from stone age06:18
jordiie, the GNOME panel menus are not translated at all06:18
jordinot even "Places", etc.06:18
pittijordi: hmm, works fine for me06:18
pittijordi: which language?06:18
jordiAre the mo files those coming from the tarballs?06:18
pittijordi: yes06:18
jordignome-panel is 18:18 < josep> 2.10.0-0ubuntu506:18
jordipitti: weird.06:19
pittijordi: are the mo files correct?06:19
jordichecking with msgunfmt06:20
pittidoko: I have no problems with new locale packages, they are usually uncritical06:20
pittidoko: as soon as they are in hoary, I can add them to the support packages06:20
seb128jordi: you should kick the GNOME ca translators :p06:20
jordiseb128: I'M NOT KICKING MYSELF DUDE :P06:21
seb128you should DUDE06:21
jordiseb128: besides we were finished translating a week early06:21
mdzi386-live is good06:21
seb128BTW have you strace -e open it to see what translation file is used ?06:21
seb128gnome-session-remove gnome-panel06:22
jordiseb128: the guy testing tells me the mo files are old :(06:22
seb128strace -e open gnome-panel06:22
pittijordi: version of language-pack-ca-base?06:22
jordipitti: in a second06:22
jordiseb128: it's either your fault or thom's fault.06:23
seb128WTF ?06:23
pittiIZ GTK BUG06:23
seb128iz pitti beeing lame again06:23
seb128after breaking gnome-cups-manager 06:23
=== seb128 hides
pittijordi: no, seriously, I need to know whether the mo files are outdated, or it's pickign the wrong mo file06:24
jordipitti: uh, not installed06:24
jordithis is live cd06:24
seb128we have ca translations on the liveCD now ?06:24
pittijordi: I added the package two days ago06:24
jordipitti: hopefully he downloaded the correct iso06:24
pitti~/ubuntu/seeds-hoary$ grep ca live06:24
pitti * language-pack-ca [powerpc ia64] 06:24
pittijordi: not for live i38606:25
pittijordi: ENOSPACE06:25
jordi17:10 < jordi> http://cdimage.ubuntulinux.org/daily-live/current/ <--- ie, this06:25
jordipitti: oh06:25
seb128buy a decent machine06:25
seb128ie: PPC06:25
pittijordi: there is a huge bulk of WinFOSS crap which takes space :-/06:25
jordipitti: meh06:25
pittijordi: sorry :-(06:25
jordiok, he's going to love this :D06:25
pittijordi: however, -install has it06:25
jordipitti: I will suggest that ca replaces de at some point06:25
seb128bah, nobody uses de, that's an ugly language06:26
seb128just drop it06:26
pittijordi: squash bug #1, then we don't need WinFOSS any more :-)06:26
pittiseb128: almost as ugly as fr :-)06:26
seb128der/die/das, WTF is that :p06:26
seb128you always pick the wrong one :)06:27
jordipitti: oh, I remember. Firefox and stuff for windows06:27
jordipitti: hmm, #1 is pretty long term.06:27
jordiI can't wait that much.06:27
pittijordi: not for hoary at least :-)06:27
smurfixUmm, so can somebody please build a ppc netinst ISO for me (please add strace while you're at it)? I would like to avoid downloading the whole CD06:27
ograseb128, its to confuse the french, we especially invented it for that :-P06:27
mdzamd64-install good06:28
Kamionmdz: back now06:28
fabbionemdz: they are all good...06:28
fabbionewe rock!06:28
jordiso after he installs the package via apt-get, what's an intelligent way of restarting the session without rebooting?06:28
Kamionwas about to do amd64/powerpc live tests if we care06:28
mdzKamion: 4/5 successful, powerpc install in stage 206:28
pittimdz: I now up, down, sidegraded langpacks in every possible order, works fine now06:28
Kamionbut I've tried everything else06:28
mdzKamion: (that's amd64-live, powerpc-live, amd64-install, i386-live and powerpc-install)06:28
pittinew dpkg rocks06:28
pittiKeybuk rocks :-)06:28
mdzpitti: great, thank Keybuk06:28
Kamionlet me run upstairs and try amd64-live briefly, won't bother with powerpc-live06:28
jordipitti: so what did you actually add?06:29
jordithe ca langpack to the base seed?06:29
pittijordi: no, to ship06:29
jordiie, everyone will get it installed, or how does that work?06:29
mdzpitti: do we have space for it on the live CD?06:29
jordipitti: please elaborate :)06:29
mirakjordi: salut06:29
jordihi mirak 06:30
pittijordi: the installer will try to install l-pack-$YOURLANG06:30
jordipitti: nod06:30
mirakjordi: do you know jordi ?06:30
pittijordi: if it's on the CD, you have it and it will always be installed for ca users06:30
pittijordi: so not everybody gets every langpack :-)06:30
jordi     1. To incline or bend, as the head or top; to make a motion06:30
jordi        of assent, of salutation, or of drowsiness with; as, to06:30
mirakjordi was a young singer child06:30
mirakin france06:30
sivangmirak: a baby!06:30
mirakthe songs were crap of course06:30
sivangmirak: "_06:30
jordimirak: hmm. no.06:31
sivangmirak: a baby doing pop music :)06:31
jordiBut I know a miriad of other jordis :)06:31
miraknot pop music06:31
mirakcrap musi06:31
jordipitti: ok :)06:31
mirakcrap with a crap techno beat06:31
sivangmirak: yes.06:31
pittimdz: I filled them up pretty well, up to 630 MB06:31
pittimdz: I reserved some space for Xh, though06:31
mdzpitti: but it would make jordi so happy :-)06:32
mirakje m'appelle Jordi, j'ai 5 ans et je suis petit06:32
pittimdz: i386 is at 636 mb06:32
pittimdz: if you are fine with using the spare space, I'll add it immediately :-)06:32
mdzpitti: how much space?06:32
=== pitti would love to make jordi happy
jordimdz: yeah. :)06:32
pittimdz: 24 MB left06:32
mdz7M installed06:32
pittimdz: langpack will take about 4 MB deb06:32
mdzso ~2-3M clooped06:32
jordiI mean, I'm trying to promote this live cd around here so people stop using the Catix crap, which is knoppix/kde based.06:32
mdzplus the locales, so yeah, maybe 406:33
mdzpitti: let's do it06:33
jordibut it's difficult with such crappy translations inclided :)06:33
mdzjordi: we don't have enough space for mozilla/openoffice translations, though06:33
pittimdz: Installed-Size: 727206:33
mdzonly the base language pack06:33
jordimdz: GNOME would be good06:33
jordifor a live cd06:33
mdzjordi: gnome is included06:33
=== pitti adds ca to all live CDs
=== mvo -> dinner
mdzpitti: kubuntu too? ;-)06:34
pittihmm, shall I?06:34
jordimdz: is it?06:34
=== pitti never looked at Kubuntu CD sizes
jordimdz: you mean now, or it was already?06:34
jordibecause the GNOME translations included seem to be very, very outdated.06:34
mdzjordi: gnome is part of the base language pack, which pitti is adding now06:34
jordioh, so now.06:35
pittijordi: in fact they are not outdated, but not present06:35
jordithat's great guys :)06:35
pittijordi: we strip translations from debs06:35
jordipitti: some of them are included06:35
mdzpitti: I think the kubuntu team will need more supportability reviews for main06:35
pittijordi: yeah, the still unstripped pacakges06:35
jordidon't tell me how. But you get bits and pieces in catalan.06:35
mdzpitti: will you be available for some time tonight?06:35
pittimdz: I don't see kubuntu seeds06:35
pittimdz: I'm still at the Uni, they will throw me out in about an hour06:35
pittimdz: (still no network but modem at home)06:35
Kamionamd64-live's good06:36
pittimdz: but I can work though ssh tonight06:36
seb128thom: WTF06:36
Kamionpitti: several binaries from kdepim in particular need reviews urgently in order to be able to build the live CD again06:36
Kamionmdz: good to go?06:36
mdzKamion: my powerpc install is almost finished06:36
pittiKamion: okay, will do ASAP06:36
pittimdz: btw, we don't strip kde-i18n, and the KDE translatiosn are not in the langpacks06:37
seb128thom: #7791 #7792 #7793 .. is that enough for you focus bug ? or do you want some extra dups ? :p06:37
pittimdz: so Kubuntu will get the translations for the non-kde/gnoome packages, but with much redundancy (all gnome translations, too)06:37
mdzpitti: hmm, ok06:37
mdzKamion: we might as well wait the 3 minutes to be sure it succeeds06:38
mdzKamion: unless you need to go06:38
KamionI was away earlier at a meeting with our wedding caterers; nothing on now, until I go to the pub this evening :)06:38
pittijordi: committed, the next live CD will contain l-p-ca :-)06:39
jordimdz: just to clear the nano thing, it's a no-no, right? It appears to be stable as 1.2 here, but it's development.06:39
jordipitti: yay. :)06:39
mdzmvo: can you check whether it is possible to disable the aptitude "RECOMMENDED BUT NOT INSTALLED" warning non-intrusively?06:39
Riddellpitti: non encryption ones need to move into main https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/KubuntuPackagesForMain06:39
mdzmvo: it confuses many people06:39
mdzjordi: if it doesn't affect nano-udeb, then it's a possibility06:39
pittiRiddell: ugh, we need all these packages?06:40
jordimdz: that needs to be tested. The best way to test it is to test nano-tiny, which is exactly the same.06:40
KamionI can't see how it would not affect nano-udeb06:40
Riddellpitti: all four of them06:40
Kamionsame source package and all that06:40
mdzKamion: but jordi told me so! :-(06:40
Riddellpitti: and eventually probably the rest too but not for today06:40
Kamionjordi: can you try building the debian-installer package with your nano-udeb in build/localudebs/?06:40
pittiRiddell: what about the encryption ones?06:40
pittiah, ok06:40
Kamionmdz: depends what you mean by "affect" :-)06:40
jordiKamion: I don't have a local setup here to build a d-i right now.06:40
Riddellpitti: we're removing encryption from kdepim for today to try and get this preview release out06:40
=== fabbione -> dinner
jordiand tomorrow is vacation.06:41
=== jordi installs nano-tiny 1.3.5
Kamionjordi: ok, can you mail me details of where I can find a source package, so I can test that stuff still builds?06:41
pittiRiddell: what about lipstik and gpgsm? is it also needed for the preview release?06:41
jordiKamion: yes.06:41
jordiKamion: build-depends changed, libncursesw5-dev added, but -tiny/-udeb still builds with slang06:42
Riddellpitti: no to gpgsm, lipstik would be nice (so we can track down kubuntu screenshots)06:42
mdzelmo: available for some seed syncage?06:42
pittiRiddell: okay, I start with the non-encryption ones now06:42
jordiKamion: it doesn't affect nano udeb in the sense that it's going to suck for utf-8 still06:45
mvomdz: I'll have a look into aptitude, I'm pretty confident that it's not too hard06:45
Kamionjordi: ok06:46
Kamionjordi: fair enough06:46
thomseb128: bleah, i dunno06:47
thomseb128: i blame bugzilla06:47
jordiKamion: who knows if I could improve that too06:47
mdzpitti: actually the kubuntu situation was much simpler than I thought; most of the new packages were simply new binaries of existing source that we had in main06:49
mdzpitti: so we don't need any more review06:49
pittimdz: just finished OpenSLP security update, I will now look at the debs nevertheless :-)06:50
mdzpitti: the only new source was a theme :-)06:50
pittiah, ok06:50
=== herzi [~herzi@d022031.adsl.hansenet.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel
pittimdz: indeed; shouldn't that be handled through germinate automatically?06:52
Riddellpitti: feel free to move onto the encryption packages in that case :)06:52
seb128thom: you blame bugzilla, but "CD player viciously steals focus" for #7792 and "gnome-cd viciously steals focus." for #7793 :)06:53
seb128thom: perhaps you should rather blame firefox :)06:53
mdzogra: shouldn't hwdb-client depend on hal?06:54
ograhmm, good idea...06:54
ograi'll add it 06:54
mdzpitti: germinate only tells us which packages are in the list, not whether or not they are from new source06:54
pittiRiddell, mdz: libktnef1 * libkcal2a * akregator * networkstatus debs are fine06:54
pittimdz: I meant, shouldn't the debs be automatically propagated to main?06:55
thomseb128: naw, bugzilla didn't respond *at all* the first couple of times i submitted it06:55
seb128bugzilla did apparently, firefox didn't :p06:55
Kamionpitti: no06:55
Kamionpitti: germinate says "please put this in main"; it doesn't automatically move the binaries into main06:56
pittiah, ok06:56
Kamionpitti: hence mdz's periodic "seed syncage" conversations with elmo06:56
pittimakes sense06:57
mdzKamion: STRUCTURE should be identical in ubuntu and kubuntu, right?06:57
Kamionmdz: yes06:58
jordiKamion: people.debian.org/~jordi/nano has i386 binaries and source. If you find it's good enough, I can push David to release 1.3.6 or do a cleaned up version without a messy changelog.06:58
mdzKamion: it looks like they were added separately, so they have different file IDs and this creates a conflict06:59
mdzKamion: OK to remove the kubuntu one and merge the ubuntu one instead?06:59
=== apokryphos [~apokrypho@] has joined #ubuntu-devel
Kamionmdz: preliminary announcement text in http://riva.ucam.org/~cjwatson/tmp/array-cd-706:59
Kamionmdz: good point, yes06:59
KamionI just did 'baz add' everywhere and forgot about the peculiarities06:59
=== Alessio [~Alessio@host239-111.pool8252.interbusiness.it] has joined #ubuntu-devel
Kamionmdz: have you finished your tests?07:00
mdzKamion: ah, yes, sorry.  powerpc-install is good07:00
Kamionmdz: ok, will publish then if no objections07:00
mdzarray 7 looks great07:01
mdzthanks Kamion, fabbione, daniels07:01
=== ogra applauds
=== ..[topic/#ubuntu-devel:Kamion] : Ubuntu Development | #ubuntu for support and general discussion | #ubuntu-love for getting involved | http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/DeveloperResources | http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/HoaryGoals | Kubuntu on #kubuntu-devel | Hoary preview release: http://releases.ubuntu.com/hoary/ | Release Candidate: March 30th
mdzKamion: I just merged ubuntu->kubuntu seeds again; since apparently I botched the installer stuff the last time, please take a look at it if you have a chance07:04
mdzit looked entirely sane to me, though07:04
Kamionmdz: I just checked with diff, as long as they're the same it should be fine07:04
=== tritium [~rimbert@12-202-90-180.client.insightBB.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel
Burgundaviaseb128: ping07:06
Kamionmdz: looks fine07:06
lamontmdz: thoughts on the other window when you have time07:06
lamontrobtaylor: any news on that bind patch and your issue?07:06
mdzlamont: saw it, will get there.  lots of more pressing issues right now07:07
lamontjust wasn't sure if it was off the edge of the screen or something07:07
seb128Burgundavia: pong ?07:09
Burgundaviaseb128: regarding bug7455, the xchat one07:09
lamontKamion: guess this means I can upload my e2fsprogs fix then?07:09
Burgundaviaseb128: I think we are not understanding each other07:09
Kamionlamont: yep07:09
=== dholbach [~daniel@td9091c17.pool.terralink.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel
Kamionback to normal feature freeze status now07:10
Kamionthanks for people's patience while the CDs got done07:10
seb128Burgundavia: why ?07:10
Burgundaviaseb128: I just reopened that bug, as it is one, IMHO07:11
kentseb128, hello. Its me who reported the bug with gthumb. I can try with cvs version of it and see if it fixes my problem, but could you be so kind to tell me the line for cvs to download gthumb? I cant find any information on the sourceforge-page about how to get it via cvs. I have used cvs once or twise before, but I cant figure out how to fetch gthumb from cvs though. :(07:11
seb128kent: I'll do a package and put it online if you want ... do you have a i386 ?07:11
seb128Burgundavia: first the screen doesn't come every time, that's an option07:12
seb128Burgundavia: second that's a property window (user, server, etc) so it follows the HIG07:12
kentseb128, yes. i386.07:13
seb128Burgundavia: and you don't provide any good argument out of the fact that you prefer it the other way, which doesn't make a bug07:13
seb128Burgundavia: the argument of the same software is not good, open gedit's properties and look on the button07:14
seb128or epiphany07:15
=== r0ver [~rallende@] has joined #ubuntu-devel
seb128or whatever other GNOME app07:15
lamontPre-Depends: ${mount:Depends}07:15
lamontthat just says 'make mount pre-depend on everything that it should Depend: on'?07:15
Burgundaviaseb128: Common workflow is when the right most button is the one to make it go away. However, in this case we have 2 buttons to "make it go away". However, 95% of the time, the user wants to chat, and thus needs the connect button. The difference between this property windows and those others is that this is shown *before* the app is launched, and thus going away needs to make the app launch07:16
seb128Burgundavia: that's your usecase07:16
Burgundaviaseb128: yes07:16
seb128Burgundavia: I only open this dialog to make change and close it then07:16
Burgundaviaseb128: but the dialog comes up before launching the rest of xchat, no?07:16
seb128opening it every time you run xchat is no sense07:16
seb128usually people auto-login07:17
seb128that's a box to check07:17
BurgundaviaI see the box07:17
Kamionlamont: only if you've a mount:Depends substvar07:18
BurgundaviaWhat I am saying is this is special properties windows, that usually appears before the app, and thus needs to be treated differently07:18
seb128lamont: any idea of why gst-plugins0.8 doesn't promote the require Build-Depends to main to build ?07:18
Kamionlamont: dpkg-dev doesn't create one by default, but your debian/rules might07:18
thomseb128: is there a reliable way to check wheteher a user has a gnome deskopt running?07:18
lamontKamion: I didn't see it create one...07:18
seb128thom: not afaik07:18
seb128thom: ugly stuff like looking for gnome-panel running ? :p07:19
ograthom, ps ax|grep gnome-session ?07:19
seb128Burgundavia: there is no "special properties windows"07:19
thomogra: no07:19
thomogra: it can be x-session-manager, too07:19
ograah, just tried...07:19
thom(my laptop is x-s-m and my desktop is g-s)07:19
seb128thom: gnome-panel ?07:20
pittiRiddell: the packaging of openct really has some bugs...07:20
thomyeah, panel might be my best bet07:20
lamontseb128: it's not automatic, you see...07:20
lamontthe correct process is: get approval, update the seeds, get elmo to promote it, then upload.07:20
lamontor something like that.07:20
ograseb128, gnmoe-smproxy ?07:20
lamontotherwise you get the looping-annoy-lamont byDate/today.html07:21
seb128lamont: mdz said that the depends are automatically promoted IIRC07:21
lamontseb128: in the report, that's true07:21
dholbachthom: you get an indicator by using     ps ax | grep -E "(gnome-panel|gnome-sesion|..|..|..)" | wc -l       :-)07:21
seb128ie: no need to update a seed07:21
lamontand then the muppet does his magic behind the curtains, and it's there in the archive07:21
seb128oh, k07:21
lamontright - if it's only there because of build-deps, true07:21
seb128I don't care of the "behind the curtains"07:22
seb128as far as it work :)07:22
thomdholbach: useful in a script :P ;-)07:22
Riddellpitti: hmm, card terminal drivers, suspect we manage without that07:22
seb128the current issue is gst-plugins0.807:22
lamontright.  the gst-plugins0.8 package needs a little muppet-love before it'll build07:22
lamontand then it'll just happen07:22
ograthom, i would look for gnome-smproxy, it should get started by gnome-session07:23
Burgundaviaseb128: To me, the next logical thing should be the right most button. Most apps are laid out like that. Thus for most property windows, closing them is the next most logical thing to do. It is not for this case.07:23
lamontKamion: subst-vars has to be doing it - the only occurance of 'vars' in debian/rules is removing substvars...07:23
seb128Burgundavia: for me I open xchat, it autologins and I open only this window to do some changes then close it 07:23
seb128so the dialog is right07:24
Burgundaviaseb128: but the window opens by default and sits there until you do something07:24
seb128not my problem07:24
seb128argue with upstream, or jdub or whatever07:24
Burgundaviaseb128: ok07:24
Kamionlamont: that's not conclusive :)07:24
Kamionlamont: try grepping for mount:Depends07:24
Burgundaviaseb128: can we leave the bug open and I will open a bug upstream07:24
seb128I close the bug, I've enough with 450 in my list without keeping bugs that I'm not going to close07:24
Burgundaviaseb128: ok07:25
seb128that's not a bug07:25
lamontKamion: only the debian/control line07:25
=== Goshawk [~Goshawk@host109-109.pool8251.interbusiness.it] has joined #ubuntu-devel
seb128argue upstream but there is no interest to keep it open in bugzilla07:25
Kamionlamont: is this in uploaded util-linux? I'll have a look07:25
lamontmy specific quandry is that I'm trying to add a version to one of it's depends...07:25
=== mxpxpod [~bryan@wuw-ojr3gmca.dybb.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel
Kamionlamont: you're using dpkg-shlibdeps -pmount, etc.07:27
Kamionlamont: that causes dpkg-shlibdeps to write out a mount:Depends substvar rather than the default shlibs:Depends07:27
lamontah, way cool07:27
Kamionlamont: debian/shlibs.local would be the traditional way to override that07:28
pittiRiddell: opensc has several libraries in one deb, too07:28
lamontyou mean what it was doing, or what I want it to do?07:28
Kamionif something's already mentioned in shlibdeps, but you want a newer version07:28
Kamionwhat you want it to do07:28
=== maskie [~maskie@196-30-109-151.uudial.uunet.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-devel
lamontand do I need shlibs.local, or mount.local (because of the -pmount)?07:29
=== lamont reads manpages
Kamionlamont: shlibs.local; if you want it somewhere else, use -L07:30
Kamionfrex if you wanted it in just one package, that would be a sensible thing to do07:31
Riddellpitti: could you add these comments to that wiki page so we don't forget?07:32
pittimdz, Riddell: all packages from https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/KubuntuPackagesForMain but openct and opensc are go07:32
pittimdz, Riddell: openct and opensc work security-wise, but they ship multiple libs in one deb, which is against our packaging standards07:33
pittimdz, Riddell: but if we need them, I accept them, too07:33
pittimdz, Riddell: I add a comment to the wiki page07:34
Riddellpitti: thanks07:34
pittiRiddell: lipstik is also ookay, I add it07:34
Riddellamu, mdz: any thoughts?07:34
mdzRiddell: specifically?07:35
=== fgx [~fgx@host11-124.pool8254.interbusiness.it] has joined #ubuntu-devel
Riddellmdz: should we accept openct and opensc07:35
haggaiif we moved the libs to packages, would they get through NEW processing reasonably quickly?07:35
=== pitti added comments to https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/KubuntuPackagesForMain
mdzhaggai: assuming pitti approves, yes07:37
pittihaggai: if these are split to separate debs, they have my blessing07:37
mdzRiddell: what do we gain?07:37
pittimdz, Riddell: however, they deal with external hardware, thus if a bug destroys your smartcard, we will have a hard time 07:37
pittiwith debugging07:38
Riddellmdz: gpg support in kmail again07:38
fabbionehaggai: http://people.ubuntu.com/~fabbione/openoffice.org2_1.9.76-0ubuntu4_20050315-0125.bz2  07:38
pittidoes gpg depend on smartcards?07:38
RiddellI think leave them out today and we'll look at either removing the need of them from gpgsm or fixing them up07:38
fabbionehaggai: ^^^FTBFS on sparc07:38
mdzfabbione: ->universe shortly07:38
fabbionemdz: ok :-)07:38
pittiRiddell: sounds good07:38
pittiRiddell: if we can make it work without smartcards, that would rock07:39
pittiRiddell: so the smartcard stuff can stay in universe07:39
mdzpitti: what are your thoughts on supporting a gnupg CVS snapshot in addition to the current gnupg?07:39
Riddellpitti: ok, will make a note to investigate that07:39
pittimdz: since it's not setuid any more, we only have algorithmical vulns07:39
pittimdz: as a coincidence, we just have a pending gnupg vulnerability07:40
mdzpitti: yes, but likely not much sympathy from upstream07:40
pittimdz: isn't the cvs maintained properly?07:40
pittismurfix: what do you think about gnupg2 upstream support?07:40
pittimdz: we have the gnupg2 debian maintainer close to us :-)07:41
mdzpitti: I mean that upstream may not accept responsibility for problems it in since it is unreleased07:41
pittioh, right07:41
sivangpitti: is it you? :)07:41
pittisivang: smurfix07:41
sivangpitti: ah , close enough 07:41
smurfixsivang: ;-)07:42
mdzMithrandir: ping, re: utf8-migration-tool07:42
smurfixIt seems that lately (half year or so) upstream has mostly focused on gnupg1.407:42
sivangsmurfix: :-)07:42
smurfixI haven't done a review WRT 1.4 / 1.9 tagged / 1.9 CVS yet -- I should probably do that RSN07:43
pittismurfix: so gnupg2 is sort of dead upstream?07:43
jordipitti: shouldn't be07:43
pittiRiddell: is it possible to use kmail with gnupg instead of -2?07:44
smurfixAt the moment, I recommend to stick with 1.407:44
Riddellpitti: not sure, amu's been looking after that package.  I would imageine so07:44
smurfixpitti: yes07:44
smurfixgnupg 1.4 works rather well with gpg-agent07:45
pittiokay, then let's do that :-)07:45
smurfixyou just need a "use-agent" in its preferences07:45
smurfixCaveat: I don't know whether that is true for smartcard support. I already pinged Upstream about that.07:45
pittismurfix: oh, we want to try to decouple it from smartcard support anyway07:46
=== smurfix doesn't have a gpg smartcard, USB sticks work well enough for me
smurfixpitti: Sure, but if you need to switch background support programs depending on whether the user has a smartcard or not, that'd be uncool07:47
=== pitti does not like to support hardware-interaction programs
pittismurfix: we kept out the Nokia communication stuff for the same reason07:47
smurfixAnyway, I have to go and ubuntuize the neighbor's desktop box now, be back later07:48
mvoarray-7 is out? we can upload again :) ?07:49
Mithrandirmdz: pong?07:51
Mithrandirmdz: it's still missing the C handling, I can upload with that disabled if you want that.  Then it should upgrade cleanly from all locales but C (and give a message saying "sorry, nocando" for C)07:51
mdzMithrandir: release candidate is in 13 days and we haven't really tested this at all :-/07:52
fabbionejdub: ping?07:53
Mithrandirmdz: I know and it's my fault. :(07:53
mdzMithrandir: I'm not entirely confident about making it a part of the default hoary upgrade path07:53
mdzthe current version in Hoary doesn't seem to run for me07:54
mdzmizar:[~]  utf8migrationtool07:54
mdz[...] TypeError: category LC_ALL is not supported07:54
KamionMithrandir: release early, release often :)07:54
MithrandirKamion: I hate to release stuff I know is partially broken07:55
Kamionif it's an incremental improvement ...07:56
Mithrandirok, I'll upload what I have now and hack on the rest on the train tonight07:57
=== farruinn [~nathan@cpe-69-201-13-153.twcny.res.rr.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel
Mithrandirmdz: does that sound ok?  It's not as good as I hoped to, but it will at least allow some testing07:59
mdzmvo: still here?08:00
mvomdz: yes08:00
mdzmvo: both workarounds in #7419 sound fine to me; please go ahead08:00
mdzMithrandir: ok.  we need to make a decision in the next few days whether we will use it for Hoary08:00
mvomdz: thanks a lot!08:01
mdzmvo: maybe we should do both :-)08:01
mvomdz: hehe :) yeah!08:01
mdzmvo: we should talk in Mataro about how to handle these issues in the future08:02
mdzwe should make some effort to make the metapackages a better upgrade mechanism (or use something different)08:02
mdzperhaps for hoary+1 we can have a special upgrade tool which knows about the metapackages08:03
mdzor do this as part of enhancing update-manager for inter-release upgrades08:03
dholbachmvo: you were going to Mataro? :-)08:04
mdzs/mataro/sydney/ of course08:04
dholbachhihi, nevermind :-)08:04
mvomdz: sounds good. update-manager is about to be ready for dist-upgrade, I just don't dare to enable it for hoary08:04
dholbachmvo: you could add a note: "some packages are about to be removed; to adjust your needs, please run the package manager."08:06
mvomdz: this particular problem (gnomemeeting) was caused by libpt-plugins-v4l removed from the main component. if I enable universe the dist-upgrade works smooth08:06
mdzmvo: interesting08:06
mdzmvo: so if we put it back in main, that should work too?08:07
mvodholbach: I would rather avoid removing packages with the current update-managers UI. it's not really suited for that task 08:07
mvomdz: yes, I added a fake entry to the packages file and that was good too08:07
Mithrandirmdz: 0.2 uploaded08:07
dholbachmvo: i understood, that's why i pointed out you could have a message telling the user, update-manager was about to remove packages08:08
Mithrandirnow I need to pack08:08
mvoMithrandir: you travel? 08:08
Mithrandirmvo: going to dk to visit little sister and Fabio08:08
mvomvo: I guess  we need to be extra carefull when moving packages between components08:08
mvoMithrandir: oh, sounds like fun! 08:09
Mithrandirmvo: if you can test the 0.2 which hits the archive RSN for your rename troubles, I'd appreciate.08:09
mvoMithrandir: yes, sure. will do!08:09
Mithrandirmvo: I'm going to be around on irc and read mail, so just privmsg me or drop me a mail08:09
mvoMithrandir: thanks! I look forward for a utf-8 clean system :) 08:10
=== mvo -> doing some laundry, brb
pittimdz: I can't stay much longer here in the uni, and my stomach cries for some food, so I'd like to go home soon; is there anything urgent for me?08:14
mdzpitti: no, thanks for staying08:17
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mjg59Kamion: Ok, that's a fairly common failure mode with some hardware. It's not clear what's going on.08:33
mjg59thom: Urgh. Why?08:34
Kamionmjg59: which?08:34
mjg59Kamion: The Avaratec s-t-r thing08:35
mjg59thom: Can you add a guard to /etc/acpi/resume.sh that only runs vbetool vbestate if the state file exists?08:36
Kamionmjg59: right; I don't really understand how resume from s-t-r works, hardware-wise08:37
=== thoreauputic [~debianarc@wolax9-151.dialup.optusnet.com.au] has joined #ubuntu-devel
mjg59Kamion: In theory, the chipset is woken up, reads a memory address from a register, passes that to the CPU and execution continues from there08:41
mjg59Then the wakeup code does the job of restoring the registers and putting the CPU in protected mode08:41
=== zenrox [~zenrox@wbar7.sea-4-12-028-223.dsl-verizon.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel
medwards_The wiki entry for LiveCD remastering resembles the "Knoppix way" of starting from a CD image and hacking it.  I was kind of hoping for a reproducible LiveCD build system.08:42
Kamionlamont: is the live cloop build script you use public anywhere?08:43
medwards_Is that something I can do from the outside, or is everyone skilled in the art too busy with the Hoary release to coach?  (I would understand.)08:44
medwards_FWIW, I have built a customized installer around debootstrap previously, so I wouldn't need too much coaching.  :)08:45
=== farruinn [~nathan@cpe-69-201-13-153.twcny.res.rr.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel
Kamionmedwards_: it's basically debootstrap/ubuntu-base, install ubuntu-desktop, install ubuntu-live, build cloop from the result; I think there are a fair few fiddly details in there, though08:48
Kamionwhich is why I was wondering if lamont had put his script anywhere, since that's the piece that builds our official live cloops08:49
medwards_Kamion: how dependent is ubuntu-live on ubuntu-desktop?  I'm hoping to switch from HD-installed autobuilders to LiveCD, and would want to take out a lot of the desktop stuff and put in ecj, etc.08:51
mvomdz: I send you a patch for queueing in synaptic a while ago for review. do you want to go with that approach? then I'll upload a new synaptic tomorrow with it08:52
mdzI haven't had time to review it08:52
mvomdz: no problem, I just wanted to ask :)08:53
mdzit seems risky to change the language-support installation at this late stage08:53
mdzthe current behaviour is at least simple and predictable, and we can document its limitations08:53
mdzand perhaps tackle it properly for Breezy08:54
Kamionmedwards_: you probably wouldn't want to use ubuntu-live as is any more than you'd want to use ubuntu-desktop as is, then08:54
Kamionmdz: the current behaviour is a real problem when doing lots of installations at once; two parallel installations made my network unusable here08:54
Kamion(which is a problem with my CBQ rules, but still)08:54
KamionI think we should fix it if at all possible08:55
mdzKamion: I'm not convinced it's worth the risk of last-minute feature creep08:55
lamontKamion: it's not released08:56
lamontbut I think it's on chinstrap08:56
zulfyi there is a pretty good chance i wont be online tonight much08:56
medwards_Kamion: I'm happy to hack on ubuntu-live (it can't possibly be worse than starting from Knoppix); I'm really just wondering if there's a strategy for enabling server-oriented derivative LiveCDs.08:57
mdzzul: enjoy your evening08:57
Kamionif lamont is happy to release his script, I think that would be valuable08:57
zulmdz: thanks...must spend time with the wife ;)08:57
mdzmedwards_: for a server-oriented live CD, you probably want to build it yourself08:57
mdzmedwards_: for variations on ubuntu-live, the instructions in the wiki are quite reasonable08:58
medwards_Kamion: I've been tracking sid for my base system for over a year, so it's been a lifesaver for me to have a fully baked auto-install CD that I can regenerate with "make clean && make".08:59
medwards_Kamion: but since various bits of /etc are baked in, it's tied to certain things about the hardware (partition layout, SCSI vs. IDE, etc.)09:00
medwards_Rebasing it on a LiveCD of some kind would be a win.09:01
mdzI wonder how our TRLS compares to Linspire09:01
medwards_mdz: the instructions on the wiki are exactly what they should be; most people are remastering for appearance, maybe to add a few pet packages (Marillat's mplayer?)09:02
=== lamont is reminded that he has an appointment in town from 2-3 (-0700), will be heading off in about 25 minutes or so
Kamionoh, totally rad09:02
mdzmedwards_: right, but it sounds like you want more than that09:02
mdzthe process to build the CDs from scratch is fairly complex at the moment09:03
=== dholbach [~daniel@td9091c82.pool.terralink.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel
ograwb dholbach 09:03
mdzmjg59: my Satellite 2545XCDT comes back from STR09:04
mdzpcmcia ethernet and all09:04
medwards_mdz: if I can help simplify it (maybe merging in some code I have for following dependency chains associated with goal packages), it might be useful for you.09:04
mdzmedwards_: we have a pretty sophisticated system for that, called "germinate"09:05
mdzthere's some information in the wiki09:05
Kamiondamn, I meant to upload germinate to Hoary09:05
Kamionmight still be able to squeeze that in09:06
medwards_mdz: yes, I'm impressed; mine's a little different, since it aims at build-depends and tries to do it in overlay stages.09:06
Kamionmedwards_: colin.watson@canonical.com--2004/germinate--mainline--0 in arch09:06
Kamiondoes build-deps too :)09:06
Kamionbut I'd certainly be interested to look at other strategies for doing the same thing09:07
medwards_Kamion: excellent.  Stacking translucent overlays to make a buildd chroot could really help with the whole buildd-corruption thing.09:07
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medwards_How does mini-fo compare with unionfs in that respect?09:08
mjg59mdz: Excellent09:08
mdzmjg59: we'll have some pretty rich data coming in from hwdb-client in Hoary, should be a good starting point for a STR whitelist for hoary+1 to enable it out of the box where it works09:10
ogramjg59, yeah, we should talk about it once, to make sure i collect the right data for you ;)09:11
lamontmdz: it's called breezy :-)(09:11
Kamionmedwards_: we don't use mini-fo any more, we use device-mapper snapshotting09:11
lamontmini-fo bad.  very evil.09:11
Kamionmedwards_: the code's in the casper source package09:11
ogramjg59, currently the dmi data is already collected...but i imagine you might like other stuff too09:11
mjg59lspci would also be good09:12
medwards_The thing I like about unionfs in principle is that, since it operates above the filesystem level, one can stack, say, jffs2 on a USB stick on top of a squashfs.09:13
mjg59Kamion: Does d-i have any support for adding different boot options based on DMI data?09:13
ogramjg59, install hwdb-client and run hwdb-xml -d or hwdb-xml -a (all hal data)09:13
seb128kent: http://pkg-gnome.alioth.debian.org/gthumb_2.6.3cvs20050317-0ubuntu1_i386.deb if you want to try with this package09:13
medwards_Is there any way to get flash-friendly write balancing with device-mapper?09:13
=== tritium [~rimbert@12-202-90-180.client.insightBB.com] has left #ubuntu-devel ["Leaving"]
medwards_oh, by the way ... torrent for array-7?09:14
ogramjg59, should be the same as lspci....needs probably a filter since its everything09:14
mjg59ogra: Ok, cool09:15
Kamionmjg59: not that I know of right now, guess it wouldn't be hard09:15
Kamionmedwards_: damn, forgot09:15
mjg59Kamion: I've got a couple of machines here that it would be insanely useful for09:15
mdzmjg59: machines which will boot d-i with no options, but require options to work properly thereafter?09:16
mjg59mdz: Yeah09:16
mdzthe toshiba craptop took quite a long time to swsusp, but it got there09:16
mdzwill know shortly whether it wakes up09:17
Kamionmjg59: we have a dmidecode-udeb, could easily do shell scripting around that in the bootloader installers or something09:17
medwards_Should I expect array-7 to support ipw2100 properly?  The only LiveCD I've ever seen work on this Centrino was Kanotix, and I couldn't get my remaster to work.09:17
mjg59medwards_: Should work fine09:17
mjg59Kamion: Any chance for Hoary?09:17
Kamionmjg59: maybe, send me a spec :)09:17
medwards_Same "couldn't find ipw2100-fw-1.3" error I got with Warty.09:17
mdzboth STR and swsusp, very impressive09:18
=== ogra applauds mjg59
Kamionthom: could you do torrents for array-7 once they arrive on torrent.u.c? should be a few minutes from now09:18
medwards_(and with Knoppix 3.8)09:18
medwards_mjg59: thanks.09:18
mdzthom: we really do need to automate the remainder of that; we ought to be torrenting the dailies at this point09:18
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Kamionmdz: I think a prereq for that is on my list, will look tomorrow09:19
Kamionanyway I really have to run now, massively late09:19
pittiyay, my home network is back *happy happy joy joy*09:19
mjg59Kamion: Based on a regexp that matches either the manufacturer or model, we need to be able to add a command line option09:19
mjg59I'll flesh it out and mail you09:19
mdzthom: we'll need torrents for the kubuntu preview as well09:19
medwards_Kamion: thanks much.09:19
mdzlamont: terranova finished early building kubuntu livefs; please check09:19
mjg59fabbione: Ok, looks like we really could do with that patch that keybuk tried09:20
mjg59I've just nearly cooked a machine here09:20
medwards_mdz: swsusp with array-7?09:21
robtaylorlamont: no news on my issue, apart from that patch not fixing it.. guess i'm gonna have to go get my hands really dirty ;)09:21
mdzmedwards_: an installed system upgraded from woody to the equivalent of array-7, yes09:21
thommdz: as kamion says, we need to have the smaller pool09:21
thommjg59: #748009:22
=== mdz wonders idly about supporting hibernate on the live CD
thommdz: when is kubuntu preview?09:22
mdzas real functionality it'd be purely academic, but it could be useful for testing whether it works09:22
mdzthom: today or tomorrow09:22
thomah, k09:23
mdzdepending on how these CDs turn out09:23
mdzelmo: around?09:23
mdzanyone else have an account on terranova besides lamont and elmo?09:23
lamontmdz: you managed to collide with an archive update09:23
mdzah, ok09:23
mjg59thom: Interesting. I honestly don't see how that can happen.09:24
medwards_lamont: if you were thinking of releasing the live cloop build script, I'd like to play with it.  Maybe even try unionfs if I can get the module to build against the Ubuntu kernel (the miniroot changes from Knoppix 3.8 are pretty straightforward).09:24
mdzlamont: are the royal and king ones screwed, then?09:24
mdzlamont: if they are, please kill them and I'll restart09:24
lamontmdz: the Release and Packages files, as fetched, were not from the same archive run.09:24
mjg59thom: As far as I can tell, network modules really should be loaded and unloaded in the same order09:24
mdzlamont: we need kdepim 4:3.4.0-0ubuntu309:25
mjg59I guess that it's reasonable to record the mac/name mapping beforehand and set it up again afterwards, though09:25
lamontmdz: checking09:25
mjg59thom: Did you check gdm-signal?09:25
mdzthom: can you stick around tonight until we know whether kubuntu preview is happening?09:25
pittimdz: but where is the sense of putting hibernate on the live CDs and not on the install ones?09:25
lamontmdz: 0ubuntu3 is being used in all 3 builds now09:26
pittimdz: at least, I only ever saw "hibernate computer" on live CDs09:26
mdzpitti: we need the root filesystem in order to resume09:26
thommjg59: this is what i thought, but I don't see the harm in doing an ifrename just to make sure, since we have iftab anyway...09:26
dokook to uploade OOo1 now, or should I wait until after the Kubuntu preview?09:26
mjg59thom: Oh, we have iftab? If so, then yeah09:26
mdzmjg59: we write an iftab from d-i09:26
lamontmedwards_: gotta dot an i or two before I can release it.09:26
mjg59Sure. Just ifrename it on resume, then.09:26
thommdz: i need to go out but it'll be local (friends over from the states until monday, prolly won't see em otherwise); sms me if you need me?09:26
thommjg59: yeah09:27
kentseb128, installing that package right now. I will let you know soon if it works or not.09:27
thommjg59: not yet (gdm-signal)09:27
lamontbut as for what it does, it literally just does a debootstrap and a couple of apt-get's, then rsync's the result into an fsimage (rather than using loopfs for the install...), then compresses it.09:27
lamontand a couple other housekeeping things09:27
mdzthom: it's more likely than not that we'll need you; can someone else fill in?09:27
mjg59thom: Ok. It's kind of important for machines without acpi sleep keys09:27
mdzelmo isn't around09:27
mdzlamont: thanks09:27
=== azeem_ [~mbanck@ppp-62-245-163-216.mnet-online.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel
lamontmdz: 2 minutes until I must run for ~2 hours.09:27
mdzlamont: if builds are in progress with kdepim -0ubuntu3 I am happy09:28
thommjg59: nod09:28
lamontmdz: and not 100% trivial, but <machine>/~buildd/livecd/kubuntu/latest/*.out is the log file of the latest run09:28
medwards_lamont: OK.  Is the package selection in the apt-gets, or are there virtual packages containing the important dependencies?09:28
thommdz: unsure, but local means 5 minutes walk from my pc09:28
lamonts/latest/current/ for the last successful run09:29
medwards_lamont: and thanks very much!09:29
mdzthom: ok09:29
mdzthom: "out" :-)09:29
lamont        ubuntu)09:29
lamont            LIST="$LIST ubuntu-base ubuntu-desktop ubuntu-live"09:29
lamont    LIST="$LIST xresprobe laptop-detect"09:29
lamont    case $(dpkg --print-architecture) in09:29
lamont        amd64)          LIST="$LIST linux-amd64-generic";;09:29
lamont        i386)           LIST="$LIST linux-386";;09:29
thommdz: very close pub :-)09:29
medwards_(I presume ubuntu's debootstrap has the hoary base script.)09:29
thomvery close _irish_ pub, more importantly09:30
lamontand some diversions to get things in the way out of the wya09:30
lamontmedwards_: certainly09:30
medwards_lamont: excellent.  Thanks again.09:30
lamontit's basically ubuntu-meta*, xresprobe, laptop-detect, and kernel09:30
=== lamont back in about 2 hours.
lamontmdz: can be online in about 1:40 or so, if you sms me...09:31
lamontbut hopefully no need.09:31
mdzlamont-away: how can I check when the builds are done?09:32
lamont-awaywget machine/~buildd/livecd/kubuntu/latest and there should be more than one file in the list?09:33
lamont-awayif too long, and still just one file, wget that (.out), and see what went wrong.09:33
mdzok, thanks09:33
=== lamont-away checks on times
lamont-awayubuntu is about 35 minutes09:35
Seveasis anybody going to change the ubuntu website, so that it mentions 'breezy badger' as being the next release?09:35
=== buga-away is now known as buga
lamont-awaymdz: and the last (good) kubuntu build to 27 min09:35
=== lamont-away flees, late
medwards_OK, time to dissect array-7 and see what lives outside the cloop.  Is there a sources.list entry that will give me an archive snapshot as of array-7?09:38
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elmomdz: I am around btw09:42
mdzelmo: ok09:47
mdzlamont reappeared09:48
medwards_elmo: Is there a sources.list entry that will give me an archive snapshot as of array-7?  Or is there another way to see a frozen archive when experimenting with the LiveCD mastering process?09:48
thommdz: array 7 checking, should be on torrent in a few minutes09:48
tsengmedwards_: the freeze isnt enforced by software afaik09:48
tsengmedwards_: its a understanding followed by the developers to just not add things to main while the cds are in progress09:49
elmomedwards_: no, sorry09:49
mdzmedwards_: not apart from setting up a local mirror09:49
mdzmedwards_: (which is how we do the CD builds)09:49
mdzthe current archive is quite sane, though, and should remain so for the remainder of the release cycle09:50
medwards_tseng, elmo, mdz: thanks.  I'll go with the moving target, and if I have trouble, I'll mirror locally.09:51
mdzmedwards_: if you're doing more than one build, you definitely want at least a cache, and probably a local mirror, anyway09:51
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mdzmain for 1 architecture isn't all that large09:52
medwards_mdz: of course I'll cache; save us both bandwidth.  :)09:52
medwards_I'm getting about 8KB/s on the array-7 download; maybe I should just wait for the torrent?09:54
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Mithrandirelmo: could you please sync root-portal?09:56
dholbachMithrandir: yes!!! :-)09:56
elmo[NOT Updating - Modified]  root-portal_0.5.0-3ubuntu1 (vs 0.5.2-1)09:56
elmook to override?09:56
zullater 09:57
dholbachbye zul09:57
Mithrandirelmo: yes, ok to override09:58
dholbachMithrandir: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UniverseHowlRebuildTODO nearly sorted out :-)09:58
thomelmo: did you see my sync request for lsof?09:59
Mithrandirelmo: thanks.09:59
elmothom: yes, but the version you requested's now in limbo - I'll sync it when it hits a mirror10:00
thomthanks mate10:01
ograyeah, already 20 hwdb submissions :)10:02
dholbachogra: hang on... you'll have mine too in just a sec ;-)10:02
kentjdub, it seems to not crash with that version from CVS. I started gthumb a while ago and it has had the slideshow on for some time now and it has not crashed. Though i have it on random, but it has always crashed rather quickly, so i think its ok now.10:02
seb128kent: speaking about the new package ?10:03
seb128kent: or that's a different issue you are fixing with jdub ?10:03
=== Mithrandir wishes he could download bugs from bugzilla to work offline
ograMithrandir, dont you get mails from buzilla ?10:04
kentseb128, i meen the issue with gthumb and watchin slideshows. You posted a link to a debian package from CVS. I installed it and it seems to work now.10:05
dholbachMithrandir: RSS-ification!10:05
seb128kent: ok, because you spoke to jdub, so I prefer to ask :)10:05
Mithrandirogra: stuff which I haven't gotten originally.10:05
ograah, k10:05
Mithrandirogra: (I'm going to sit on a train and then a bus for a bunch of hours.  Would be nice if I could do useful stuff while doing that.)10:05
kentseb128, oh.. sorry, i wrote to the wrong person then. haha, i forgot it was you i should have spoken to. haha :) sorry10:05
seb128now I need to find the fix in the diff :/10:06
HiddenWolfDoes anyone know what can possibly cause that ever ...ok notice during startup/shutdon is on a newline?10:06
ograMithrandir, so pull down some bugs in advance10:06
HiddenWolfevery, even10:06
ograMithrandir (i.e. save th BZ page or wget it)10:06
Mithrandiryeah, that kinda works10:08
thommdz: bt torrenting away10:08
mdzthom: thanks10:08
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medwards_thom: bt link?10:10
medwards_(will seed in US)10:11
mdzmedwards_: http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/releases/hoary/array-7/10:12
dokomdz: ok to uploade OOo1 now, or should I wait until after the Kubuntu preview?10:14
Mithrandirdoko: the 2.6 avm stuff freezes a lot.10:14
mdzdoko: if you can wait one hour, that would be good10:14
Mithrandirdoko: like, twice a day.10:14
dokoMithrandir: does the card has it's own interrupt?10:15
Mithrandir 12:      64399          XT-PIC  fcdslsl10:16
Mithrandirlooks like it10:16
dokomdz: not sure, if I'm awake then. the packages are at chinstrap:~doko/uploads . would you mind uploading them?10:16
mdzdoko: ok10:16
mdzdoko: signed?10:17
Mithrandirdoko: it _might_ be something else; kinda hard to check when I don't have a console connected to the system.10:17
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dokoMithrandir: strange, I didn't havve these problems, after the card had it's own interupt.10:17
dokomdz: yes, signed. thanks10:17
Mithrandirdoko: but since I've had that kill the system with 2.4 as well, I'm suspecting the fcdslsl card10:17
Mithrandirdoko: hmm.10:17
dokomvo has another card (dsl2), maybe he can send it to you10:18
MithrandirI could possibly try with a better mobo with a real APIC instead of the XT-PIC shit.10:18
Mithrandirit's just annoying, it's not a problem per se, I just wondered if I was the only one seeing this.10:18
MithrandirI can spend a bit more time trying to see if I can reproduce it or get a backtrace.10:18
seb128kent: I'm uploading -0ubuntu2 with some fixes from the CVS version. Can you close the bugzilla bug if it fixes the crasher ?10:19
kentseb128, I have never closed a bug, but ok.. If it works, I will look on bugzilla about how to close the bug.10:22
thomwoah, code.google.com10:23
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Mithrandirthom: shiny10:24
ograthom, oh they grabbed that one too ? there is a free site offering code snippet search since two years...10:24
thomogra: no, go look10:24
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thomright, i'm -> pub; sms if/when you need me10:29
kentOn bugzille it is written that bugreports against universe should be posted to ubuntu-users, is that correct? should not ubuntu-devel be the right place?10:29
thomkent: the message is correct10:30
kentseb128, btw, I forgot,  did you say you will make a new package for me to try? I was in the middle of doing some things and I accidently shut down xchat :(10:31
seb128kent: I've uploaded a new one for hoary, just let me know if this one work10:32
seb128you will need to downgrade from the current cvs one10:33
kentseb128, ok. Will do. 10:34
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kentseb128, gthumb 2.6.3-1ubuntu1  ?10:36
seb128no, ubuntu210:37
seb128it's probably building atm10:37
kentseb128, ok. I should be going to bed soon. How long does it take for it to compile?10:38
seb128kent: there is no hurry you can try tomorrow10:38
seb128not long, should be in the archive in 20min10:38
kentseb128, I'l rather wait for it then. Becaus im going home to my parents tomorrow after school so I wont have the time then.10:39
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smurfixGrumble -- pitti's netboot image for powerpc didn't.10:47
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ograoh,  1111111111 is near !10:59
ogra(date +%s)10:59
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dholbachogra: do we need a  wiki/UniverseDate1111111111CleanupTODO  or something?11:01
jdubthe status is: 111109690611:01
=== jdub is abusing an old script ;)
ograin case you got gtk-perl installed:11:02
ogrause strict;11:02
ogrause Gtk2 -init;11:02
ogrause Glib qw(TRUE FALSE);11:02
ogramy $window = Gtk2::Window->new;11:02
ogra$window->signal_connect(delete_event => sub { Gtk2->main_quit; });11:02
ogramy $label = Gtk2::Label->new('' . time());11:02
ogramy $font = Gtk2::Pango::FontDescription->from_string("Sans Bold 48");11:02
ograGlib::Timeout->add(250, sub { $label->set_text('' . time()); TRUE; });11:03
=== mvo runs
smurfixdholbach: Count me out, 111* is in the middle of the night here11:03
=== mvo kicks ogra
=== ogra hides
seb128WTF is that11:03
=== dholbach backs ogra up :-)
smurfixogra: This is Ubuntu. Use Python.  ;-)11:03
=== jdub is happy, gets to do distro stuff today
ograsmurfix, :) i will for 2222222222 11:04
seb128jdub: desktop files for g-a-i ?11:04
dholbachogra: have it running :-)11:04
jdubseb128: aye!11:05
dholbachsmurfix: should be middle of the night here too :-)11:06
mvoseb128: can I upload gnomemeeting without the libpt-plugins-v4l dependency? it breaks updates from warty (#7419)11:06
seb128mvo: sure11:07
ograsmurfix, btw, who should convert all the p*rl stuff if everybody only wants to touch py ?11:08
seb128ogra: no need to read perl code to write py one :)11:08
maswanmmmm.. perl. :)11:09
medwards_maswan: crunchy perl goodness.11:09
maswanmedwards_: exactly. :)11:11
smurfixogra: 2222222222 is >2^31. We'll have to do quite a bit of work if we don't want anything to break with *that*.11:11
kentseb128, this is the moment of truth..  im trying the slideshow now with the new version. Hopefully it will work.. 11:12
kentseb128, it seems to work for me with that version from the archive. Should I set it to fixed in bugzilla? There is no "closed" option, just the "reslove bug, changing resolution to [fixed] "11:19
kentseb128, I wrote in the wrong channel first, haha :)11:19
seb128fixed is fine, thanks11:19
seb128I've replied in the other one :p11:19
medwards_lamont: just posted an (untested) fix for 4504 (cupsys upgrade failures).  Does anyone know how to reproduce it?11:21
medwards_(fix should probably be applied in debian package also; haven't picked a bug to attach it to)11:22
mdzjdub: cursor theme fix?11:39
jdubmdz: i've got the ubuntu-artwork end; you reassigned the previous package repair side to seb, didn't you?11:41
mdzjdub: uploaded?11:41
mdzI didn't see it go up11:41
mdzis seb128 going to have time to do that tonight?11:42
jdubi have an icon drop to go up with it;11:42
mdzI asked him to help you with it11:42
jdubhowever, despite my earlier elation, i have to prepare for a meeting this afternoon11:42
jdubif seb can't do the other end tonight his time, i'll do it tonight my time11:43
seb128mdz: when you say tonight, that's now (it's midnight here) or tomorrow ?11:43
mdzseb128: now11:44
seb128k, I'll have a look and will get back to the other stuff after11:44
jdubseb128: gtk2-engines-industrial just needs to kill off the alternative that wasn't killed off properly during upgrade11:45
mdzand some testing11:45
jdubi'll upload u-a this afternoon, post-meeting11:45
seb128you fix this one ?11:46
seb128I just need to remove the broken alternative in gtk2-engines-industrial ?11:46
jdubu-a is ok, just needs some updates and an upload11:46
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=== buga is now known as buga-away
mdkehi guys. I just got an email from a guy who says this "I'm preparing an article for Newsforge about OpenOffice.org version 2.0's increased use of Java and how third-party redistributors are approaching the change." He wants a statement from ubuntu. Who can I forward this misdirected mail to?11:49
medwards_ Does Java on Ubuntu get much testing?  It looks like java-package is from multiverse and kaffe and ecj are from universe.11:50
mdkei just wanna know who has authority to answer this email11:50
mdkethe answer is pretty obviously not me11:50
ogramedwards_, which shouldnt make it less tested then main apps ;)11:51
mdkehi ogra11:51
ograhi mdke 11:51
medwards_ogra: actually, I was writing that question before mdke came in.11:51
mdkeheh coincidence11:51
ograthere is a JavaIntegration wiki page, jabiley leads the java team afaik11:52
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ograoops, jbailey indeed11:52
medwards_I'm really excited about java-in-main, especially since my day job is java-intensive and it's going to be up to me to convert them to free JDK.11:52
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mdkeogra, you have any recommendations? shall i just forward it to ubuntu-devel?11:53
jbaileyogra: Heya!11:53
medwards_The pretext is support for ARM and MIPS(el) embedded targets.11:53
ogramdke, jep, that would be the right place i guess11:53
mdkeogra, ok11:53
mdkehi jbailey perhaps you could advise me too11:53
jbaileymedwards_: It's getting better.  ecj and gij are going to go into main for Breesy.  We're trying to get a bunch of the packages in shape in prep for that.11:54
jbaileyJerryHaltom has been doing amazing work on that front.11:54
jbaileymedwards_: Have you looked much at free java stuff yet?11:55
jbaileymdke: Oy, a statement from Ubuntu?11:56
mdkemust be a journalist11:56
jbaileymdke: Probably the best bet for that would be Chris Halls.  He knows OOo the best.11:56
mdkehe'll follow the dev list i guess?11:57
jbaileyhaggai: *poke* =)11:57
mdkeactually i'll ccopy him in11:57
jbaileyLet's see if he's around. =)11:57
ogramdke, yep, and he is very busy currently,, thats why i didnt point you dirctly towards him11:57
mdkei bet you're all pretty busy :)11:58
ograthree weeks to go :)11:58
mvoless than two for the preview ...11:58
mdkeyou'll get there11:58
medwards_jbailey: yes, I've been tracking java-in-main with much interest.11:59
jbaileymedwards_: Cool.  If you're interested in helping out, many of us (for both Debian and Ubuntu) are in #ubuntu-java11:59
medwards_jbailey: OK, I'll show up there as soon as my immediate crisis (building a LiveCD with working JDK/ANT) is over.12:00
medwards_jbailey: I'm trying to reduce my autobuilders to a LiveCD so that I can do scorched-earth rebuilds of the Apache suite with alternate JDKs.12:02
lamontmdz: 4504 - still trying to actually reproduce it here..12:03
jbaileymedwards_: autobuilders?12:03
jbaileymedwards_: Do you run the gump tests?12:03
mdzlamont: it's not going to be easy to reproduce; we just need to cripple that broken code12:03
haggaijbailey: hey leave me to idle on this channel in peace :)12:03
jbaileyhaggai: Yes, dear.12:03
medwards_lamont: candidate fix in bugzilla.12:03
mdzlamont: it should never abort the postinst12:03
=== haggai reads scrollback
lamontmedwards_: yeah, reading it now12:04
lamontmdz: right... I'll get something uploaded today.  gonna try to reproduce it again though, too...12:04
medwards_jbailey: actually, autobuilders for day job (steaming-pile-of-java network management app)12:04

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