=== sm [~simon@lsanca1-ar5-4-60-052-182.lsanca1.dsl-verizon.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc [12:54] hi [12:54] howdy pardner [12:55] sm, your call if you wanna try and test the zopeedit thing [12:55] if you're busy, np [12:55] oh I forgot.. thanks [12:55] seriously np [12:55] yes, can you try right now on ubuntu wiki TestPage [12:55] it works on testpage last time i checked [12:55] but not on other [12:55] s [12:56] ok.. any page where it doesnt work.. show me [12:56] ok hang on === trickie [~trickie@203-166-242-109.dyn.iinet.net.au] has joined #ubuntu-doc [12:57] hmm [12:57] just worked on MatthewEast [12:58] lol [12:58] dammit [12:58] just worked on ItalianDocumentation [12:58] drat :) [12:58] well [12:59] its good news [12:59] :) [12:59] you've put a curse on me tho [12:59] worked on DocumentationArea [01:00] yay.. let me see [01:00] i've reverted em [01:00] could it be related to the amount of time spent on editing? these have been very brief of course [01:01] its definitely working now [01:01] tried also on GettingUbuntu [01:01] shouldn't be [01:01] ubuntu has squid caching things, but it's been reliable for me [01:02] DocumentationArea's purpose now is the starting point for user docs, am I right [01:02] hmm [01:02] sm, I haven't changed it [01:02] but yeah i guess so [01:03] i've started some testing pages for exploring a cleaner structure pursuant to that thread on the list that you and Mary were commenting on [01:04] https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/IdeasForNewFrontPageStructure [01:07] good stuff [01:07] hmm [01:07] feeeeeedback [01:08] I think renaming DocumentationArea to UserDocumentation would be a good step [01:08] would you write it on that page pls? also any further categories of documentation that might be good subcategories for that page [01:08] that is a good idea i think [01:09] got the structured text articles down into double figures today ;) [01:09] nothing better than watching james bond on tv and converting wiki pages to moinmoin [01:09] I wrote it on the list already [01:09] sm, thanks :) [01:09] I could just do it, that would be clear eh :) [01:09] i don't mind doing it [01:10] this is a wiki.. it's just waiting for someone to feel strongly enough :) [01:10] I should do it and take the heat :) [01:10] oh the rename [01:10] yeah its not a problem [01:11] aren't you the wikimaster anyhow? [01:11] I'm one of the volunteers with admin access.. but no special authority over anything [01:11] hmm [01:11] changing.. done [01:11] what is NewFrontPage? [01:12] at least I try not exercise any === mdke looks [01:12] i never saw that page before [01:12] wikimaster.. WikiMaster.. MasterOfWiki.. hmm, hmm.. [01:13] damn i can't believe i didn't see that page [01:13] I 've seen it [01:13] can't remember if it's really the old page [01:13] I think it is [01:14] its better than the current one :p [01:14] it's the old new old front page [01:14] lol [01:14] that happens sometimes :) [01:14] hmm [01:14] whoa [01:14] I like those compact layouts.. the simple one was nice [01:14] SimpleFrontPage? [01:15] its a bit "html" [01:15] a bit last summer [01:15] more efficient for a reader [01:15] yeah i agree [01:15] but not as simple to edit.. not sure how to do it in moin actually [01:15] not sure it can be done [01:15] there's tables.. I expect so [01:15] html is a pain in the ass to edit except with zopeedit ;) [01:16] yeah.. in special cases it can be worth it I think [01:16] since the alternative is a less useful page [01:16] but it is a good idea in principle, because then things can be split off into subpages [01:16] a FrontPage with 5 or 6 links would be the way forward i think. DOCS, WIKI, TEAMS, COMMUNITY, POLICY etc [01:17] you had to amend links to rename that doc did you? [01:18] i thought they go automatically [01:19] they usually do.. and did this time [01:19] but I was fooled for a bit due to caching [01:19] had to shift reload [01:19] hmm [01:20] saw you deep in the polish and portugese docs ;) [01:20] that was zwiki [01:20] no way? [01:20] cool [01:20] way :) [01:20] oh yeah [01:20] you would have had to be really fast [01:20] well you still get the credit [01:21] we've been keeping the FrontPage mostly free of subtopics.. I think I'll reparent that latest bunch away [01:21] sure [01:21] i'm doing that fairly often [01:21] cool [01:21] my favourite is parenting userpages [01:21] :( [01:22] just putting them at top level.. I'm sure there's a better place [01:22] how do you do that? [01:23] drat this cache [01:23] yeah [01:24] I switch to full mode in the zwiki skin (plone skin works too); open each immediate child in a new tab; click reparent button at bottom of each [01:24] so reparent without any content in the box? [01:24] right, puts them at the top [01:24] do you get the one where you log in and it gives you "page not found" and refers you to related links [01:24] love it [01:25] yeah, that sucks === sm looks at that === hypatia [~mary@adsl-66-203.swiftdsl.com.au] has joined #ubuntu-doc [01:25] i filed a bug today actually on that, because it was annoying me so much [01:25] hi hypatia [01:26] hi [01:26] pleased to meet you [01:26] <- matt [01:28] YAY [01:28] feedback on the wiki structure page [01:28] what a star [01:36] mdke: can you point me that login bug ? I have search fatigue [01:36] oh was it on WikiWishlist ? [01:37] no hang on [01:37] sm 7839 [01:39] thanks === hypatia = mary [01:40] I post to the lists occasionally :) [01:41] hi :) [01:41] hi mary! [01:41] <- simon [01:42] this is a great moment [01:42] 3 great minds [01:42] in the same place [01:46] *coughs* [02:00] <-- bed [02:00] bye all === mdke [~matt@mdke.user] has left #ubuntu-doc ["Leaving"] [02:01] can't solve it right now.. night all === sm [~simon@lsanca1-ar5-4-60-052-182.lsanca1.dsl-verizon.net] has left #ubuntu-doc [] === maskie [~maskie@196-30-109-180.uudial.uunet.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-doc === Burgundavia [~Burgundav@S0106000000cc07fc.gv.shawcable.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc === cc [~cc@byte.fedora] has joined #ubuntu-doc === trickie_ [~trickie@203-166-242-109.dyn.iinet.net.au] has joined #ubuntu-doc === froud-away is now known as froud === froud grinds his teeth a customer asked to write an app in VB. [07:55] How to develop and build VB apps on Linux. I am darned if I am gonna work on Windoze just for this. [08:04] uh right [08:04] break out the bats [08:21] Burgundavia: hello [08:22] Hmmm, musing over KBasic [08:22] http://www.kbasic.de [08:22] Do you know anything about it [08:25] Burgundavia: did you get to the screen capt of BitTorrent [08:27] nope [08:27] will get one now [08:30] Burgundavia: thanks === froud is like totally confused by the kbasic web site [08:31] penguins and kongi everywhere, but no nix download [08:32] ah I get it [08:32] he only has a preview ready for windows [08:33] that website is ouch [08:34] but a cool idea [08:34] I remember running into the line limit on an apple ] [ with basic [08:34] 64k lines I think [08:34] me and a friend [08:35] Burgundavia: thanks for that patch [08:36] totally forgot about it [08:36] I should do some looking at the release notes and quickguide tomorrow [08:36] hapens, I have made a review and marked status complete [08:37] What about User or Admin Guide [08:38] yeah the web site in eeihna [08:38] hey call more time, howzit maskie [08:39] maskie: you got any idea how to write VB6 on Linux [08:39] you can do VB.Net on *nix, but VB6? [08:40] as an aside, ms just announced that is not supported VB6 anymore [08:40] Yeah, but that is the spec I have [08:41] bsides I dont think VB6 will dies that fast [08:41] too many programmers [08:41] I don't think so either [08:41] This is a case of ms trying to push something that most people don't want [08:41] big surprise [08:41] yeah normally works that way [08:42] http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story2&u=/infoworld/20050311/tc_infoworld/57636 [08:43] Oh well let's hope they will piss off enough ms vb devs so they move to Linux :-) [08:43] For the really adventurous, try XBasic, a BASIC compiler that runs under both Windows and Linux [08:43] from http://www.computerbooksonline.com/program/vb6dchap.htm [08:43] http://sourceforge.net/projects/vb4linux/ [08:44] that is what I grabbed in about 3 secs [08:46] yes I saw xbasic [08:47] I doubt any of them are actually useful [08:47] from vb4linux "So far, there are currently 3 developers for the VB4Linux project. We'll probably begin in about a week or so... Still looking for more developers!" [08:48] ouch [08:50] there seems to be a commercial app called REALBasic that seems to do what you need, on the outset [08:50] only $400 USD [08:50] I'll take 3 [08:50] and one for the dog [08:50] Yes, and I want it open [08:50] :-( [08:51] seems like a simple thing [08:51] can you convince the client to use python or something else? [08:52] No he is a ms preacher ;-) [08:52] it's ms or nothing [08:52] he wants the source [08:52] so why does it need to run on linux? [08:53] wait a sec [08:53] he does not [08:53] he needs it on windows [08:53] he wants the source and he wants ms? [08:53] yes, but he pays handsomely for the src === froud has to do these types of jobs to fund FOSS development [08:54] can you sell him on the wonders of Ironpython and .Net then? [08:54] the ironpython dev is a microsoftie [08:54] He he, he wants it VB because it will integrate in a much bigger system [08:55] well, looks like someone gets to use xp then [08:55] you know ERP system [08:55] nope [08:55] no his system is an ERP === froud smiles at his inbox, six modules for ICDL released as free [08:57] now that's the kinda projects I want more of :-) [08:57] what is ICDL? [08:58] Today I must find a way to automate porting this stuff to Docbook [08:58] International Computer Drivers License [08:58] The Shuttleworth Foundation is releasing it as a free and open project under CC-BY-SA 2.0 [08:59] very cool [08:59] ah, wouldn't be nice to have that kind of money [08:59] move worlds with it [08:59] froud: a CC-By-SA ICDL ? [08:59] He he they have a plan [08:59] cc: yes [08:59] froud: where is it ? [08:59] froud: "The Synaptic package manager also now includes support to upgrade your Ubuntu Distribution." from the release notes [09:00] what does this mean exactly? [09:00] is this update warty-->hoary? [09:00] cc: not yet released I have to d osome spade work over the netx few months [09:00] Burgundavia: yes [09:00] Burgundavia: works well too [09:00] froud: spade work? [09:00] i.e. you're writing it ? [09:01] cc: no it is already written, I need to port it to docbook, setup the web and do the repos stuff etc [09:01] froud: oh, is there a chance i can take a gander at it ? [09:01] cc: when it is released it will be free for all to gander [09:01] froud: what is status of the release notes? Can I change to wording of that sentence to make a little clearer? [09:02] Burgundavia: sure [09:02] froud: ok [09:02] cc: you have an interest in ICDL? [09:02] froud: so it isn't now, ok, thanks [09:03] froud: yes, i made a similar proposal before (not to canonical, but linux-aus) [09:03] cc: the icdl has written their materials and with tsf will release it free [09:03] cc: this is great news [09:03] froud: but they're not OSS based [09:03] the ICDL materials are windoze based [09:04] cc: no but they are comming over [09:04] cc: this is ICDL using OOo [09:04] froud: oh, that is really interesting and good to note [09:04] rocking. [09:04] i had interet to base it off stuf fi did before [09:04] good news here in Africa [09:04] at http://training.bytebot.net [09:05] he he lol you have that bookmarked too [09:05] no, thats at the top of my head [09:05] thats my work :P [09:05] what's your work? [09:05] the stuff at training.bytebot.net [09:06] the OOo and Linux stuff. old but mine [09:06] really [09:06] cool dude [09:06] you may be interested then in the LearnLinux project [09:06] http://learnlinux.tsf.org.za [09:07] the doc-team will hopefully be creating an Ubuntu version of it [09:07] the src is already in svn in my branch [09:07] ah, nice [09:07] you game to devel an ubuntu version [09:07] definitely [09:07] which is why i thought of icdl a while ago [09:08] do you have a working copy of the repos [09:08] froud: I got a couple of errors with the release notes [09:08] no [09:08] Entity 'distro-rev' not defined [09:08] Burgundavia: he he hold [09:08] ? [09:09] it also said that it can't parse global.ent [09:09] no document is valid [09:09] ok [09:09] did you svn up from the trunk lately [09:09] we moved release notes [09:09] now in releasenotes/ [09:09] yep, synced this morning [09:10] nothing come by but our stuff since [09:10] Hmm do you have releasenotes/ [09:10] cc: learnlinux stuff is in my branch [09:11] yep [09:11] cc: do you have a working copy of branches/ [09:11] Burgundavia: try again [09:11] it validates on my system [09:11] froud: no, but if you point me to instructions, i'll co it now [09:11] and trickie has not reported an problem [09:12] cc: so you have used svn before [09:12] yes === cc is more a cvs man though [09:12] cc: best thing is to do svn co https://docteam.ubuntu.com/repos [09:12] that will give you tags/ branches/ trunk/ and vendor/ [09:13] after Hoary I will merge my branch into trunk/ [09:13] aww crap [09:13] Burgundavia: why [09:13] after 756, it won't even load [09:13] /home/rasputin/Ubuntu%20Documentation%20Team/trunk/releasenotes/release-notes.xml:11: parser error : StartTag: invalid element name [09:13] <<<<<<< .mine [09:14] dude it loads here [09:14] from HEAD [09:15] you have a patch conflicting [09:15] perhaps you did a commit before doing svn up [09:15] it's only bken in your WC [09:15] ya, I regrabbed from svn and it works now [09:16] cc: there is over 1400 pages in LearnLinux [09:16] cc: we will need to co-ordinate our effort very well in order to do it [09:17] froud: hmm, sure [09:17] cc: any ideas are welcome [09:17] cc: we dont have to keep it as it is [09:17] cc: the result will be the will of the community [09:18] cc: we will however give credit to the original team [09:18] cc: and add credit of those who contribute [09:19] cc: so structure changes as well as content changes are welcome [09:20] cc: btw there is no desktop stuff in there [09:20] froud: how big is the check out ? [09:20] cc: its all cli [09:20] repos/trunk/images is getting largeish [09:21] cc: yes, but once you have it the rest is easy [09:21] froud: how large is the initial co ? [09:21] no idea [09:24] cc in my wc it is 94.5 MB but that includes management files which take a lot of space. yours should be less [09:26] froud: thanks. makes me feel better ;-) [09:26] cc: scary stuff? [09:26] froud: no, bandwidth is an issue [09:26] i'd prefer to do it from 2am onwards when traffic is free if its really large [09:26] cc: where are you co.za [09:26] froud: australia [09:27] never had bandwidth problems while in au [09:27] bigpond cable is awesome [09:27] we have download quotas/caps [09:27] optus cable is what i'm on [09:27] yes [09:27] i get 12gb/month [09:27] I had that problem a few times [09:27] and thats not enough when tracking unstable releases [09:27] luck you we get 3gb [09:28] well, yeah, 3gb last time. they recently upgraded us [09:28] so what do you do when you are not working on FOSS [09:28] froud: not much, i'm a foss person [09:30] paid to work by who? [09:32] go on you can say [09:32] we wont hold it against you === froud taps the table [09:36] cc: nice smile [09:36] froud: hah [09:36] sorry, was awol for a bit [09:36] be back later, definitely [09:37] ok [09:38] strange how when the hard questions come people always must go === froud goes off to do some work [09:40] froud: i am unemployed, completely. i get paid by no one. i occasionally do contractual gigs here and there [09:40] froud: and i'm mainly involved in the fedora project; would love to get paid OSS work, definitely === vladivid [~vladivid@95.sort-lestranzit.ur.ru] has joined #ubuntu-doc === vladivid [~vladivid@95.sort-lestranzit.ur.ru] has left #ubuntu-doc [] === enrico [~enrico@enrico.developer.debian] has joined #ubuntu-doc === mdke [~matt@81-178-89-149.dsl.pipex.com] has joined #ubuntu-doc [11:10] tu-it-dev [11:11] good morning [11:11] salut [11:12] hi [11:15] enrico, i've subscribed to the wiki, how does that script work? === enrico checks [11:20] I use it on a Maildir-format mailbox (one file per mail) [11:20] You cd inside the Maildir and run the script: it prints a line per message, with some stats [11:21] Then save the output, and run wsaggregate on it [11:28] enrico, ah i c [11:28] enrico, it won't work on an mbox [11:28] ? [11:28] Uhm, probably not [11:28] ho capito === cc [~cc@byte.fedora] has joined #ubuntu-doc === matt_ [~matt@81-178-89-149.dsl.pipex.com] has joined #ubuntu-doc === matt_ is now known as mdke [01:08] ping mako === froud [~froud@ndn-165-131-237.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-doc === mdke [~matt@mdke.user] has left #ubuntu-doc ["Leaving"] === mdke [~matt@mdke.user] has joined #ubuntu-doc === jsgotangco [DaWorm@info1-65.info.com.ph] has joined #ubuntu-doc [04:23] greets === froud looks at amu and Qerub for 1st draft review of document "Using K Network Configuration." Source can be obtain @ https://docteam.ubuntu.com/repos/branches/froud/kubuntu/knetwork-conf For easy reading see http://www.inwords.co.za/kubuntu/knetwork-conf/knetwork-conf.html. Patches and input to sean@inwords.co.za or to ubuntu-doc@lists.ubuntu.com === froud looking for docteam contributors [04:24] jsgotangco: hello [04:27] how to start in the docteam? [04:30] jsgotangco: what do you want to do, wiki or Docbook? [04:30] Starting point for all is http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/DocumentationTeam [04:32] well i have been doing wiki work for sometime [04:34] Do you want to continue or are you looking to learn somethng new [04:34] well i want to go further [04:34] something new too [04:34] :D [04:34] ok, do you know docbook [04:35] it's not a problem if you don't [04:35] i have no idea [04:35] Ok best thing is to see if you can get through this http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/DocteamStepByStepRepository [04:36] Follow the instructions if you have questions, shout and I will help [04:36] It's easier than it sounds [04:37] ok ill check it out [04:37] cool, once you have a feel we will get you started on something [04:37] are you using GNOME or KDE [04:38] im on gnome [04:38] OK running HOARY [04:38] yeah [04:38] Cool dude [04:39] OK you will also want to subscribe to mailing lists [04:39] http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/ForTheHasty [04:39] user-list [04:39] http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-doc [04:39] commit-list [04:39] http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-doc-commits [04:40] oh cool Ill subscribe then [04:40] btw [04:40] i got confirmation for ubuntudownunder [04:41] Cool [04:41] Tools you need to install [04:41] Docbook [04:41] Docbook XSL [04:41] xmllint [04:41] sudo apt-get insstall docbook [04:41]