[12:01] <herve> but python-soya is arch: i386
[12:01] <herve> so why the hell buildd is building it for all...
[12:02] <ogra> ah, d3vic3 has changed it to i386...during the pythin transition....
[12:02] <herve> easy fix ;-)
[12:02] <ogra> so its ok...
[12:02] <ogra> lets just rip it off...
[12:04] <herve> such a change is ok for you?
[12:04] <ogra> what should i do about it ? rewrite soya ?
[12:04] <herve> if it's a "all" package
[12:05] <herve> why restricting it to i386?
[12:05] <ogra> but it cant build on all
[12:05] <ogra> in fact it never has according to the build logs
[12:06] <ogra> at least from 0.6.1 to 1.0.5 it hasnt...so its pointless to have it as all
[12:07] <crimsun> dang!
[12:07] <herve> Debian has it in all
[12:07] <crimsun> I just dput a package that's in main :<
[12:07] <ogra> i'll put it on cant build with a comment...
[12:08] <ogra> crimsun, dont worry, it will silently disappear
[12:08] <crimsun> ogra: will you need to bump the revision to upload it?
[12:09] <ogra> crimsun, yup... if one version has been uploaded thats the way to go....(another would be to beg elmo to wipe it from the queue)
[12:10] <crimsun> ogra: ok, http://sh.nu/~crimsun/ubuntu-motu/  has the version that I accidentally dput
[12:10] <crimsun> ogra: that fixes FTBFS on ia64
[12:10] <herve> ogra, http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/s/soya/0.9.1-2ubuntu1/soya_0.9.1-2ubuntu1_20050301-0548-amd64-failed
[12:10] <herve> I don't know what to think of all those weird build failures
[12:11] <schweeb> guys, does grub work on amd64?
[12:12] <crimsun> I certainly hope it does, or ogra wouldn't be online ;)
[12:12] <ogra> schweeb, sure
[12:12] <schweeb> ok, heh
[12:12] <ogra> crimsun, i'd take lilo ;)
[12:12] <crimsun> hehe
[12:12] <schweeb> h8 lilo
[12:13] <herve> grub... I read hurd :-)
[12:13] <schweeb> hah
[12:13] <schweeb> hurd, how useful
[12:14] <ogra> crimsun, do you bump the version number ? then i'll upload
[12:14] <crimsun> ogra: ok, I'll do that.
[12:17] <herve> I guess that weekend will be kind of a marathon for fixing the universe
[12:17] <herve> hopefully monday is a day off here
[12:17] <crimsun> herve: pretty much
[12:18] <herve> welcome tritium!
[12:18] <herve> erm...
[12:18] <herve> nevermind :-)
[12:18] <herve> it's sign I need to sleep :-)
[12:18] <herve> good night all
[12:19] <crimsun> night herve
[12:20] <crimsun> ogra: uploaded.
[12:20] <ogra> great
[12:20] <crimsun> thanks! :)
[12:21] <ogra> crimsun, i assume you tested it extensively....
[12:24] <crimsun> it runs, yes. Installs and uninstalls and upgrades cleanly.
[12:25] <crimsun> the real fix is for IA64, and it's pulled from Debian Sid's 0.8.9-3
[12:26] <ogra> ok
[12:28] <ogra> uploaded
[12:28] <crimsun> thanks :)
[12:32] <crimsun> back in a bit
[12:54] <tritium> hello
[01:02] <goedson> ogra: gnomebaker entered Debian. This means I may remove it from UniverseNewPackages, right?
[01:05] <ogra> goedson, hmm, ok
[01:08] <tritium> yikes
[01:08] <tritium> hda: status error: status=0x58 { DriveReady SeekComplete DataRequest }
[01:08] <tritium> ide: failed opcode was: unknown
[01:08] <tritium> hda: drive not ready for command
[01:08] <tritium> my hard drive is giving me fits
[01:08] <ogra> that looks quite bad
[01:09] <tritium> yeah, I agree.  I'm backing up everything right now before I have a disaster on my hands
[01:09] <ogra> good plan
[01:10] <tritium> this will be the second drive in 5 months with this laptop.  Maybe it's time to look at a new one.
[01:10] <tritium> ogra, you have an amd64 laptop?
[01:11] <ogra> yup
[01:11] <tritium> May I ask the make and model?
[01:11] <ogra> acer aspire 1520
[01:11] <tritium> Thanks.  You happy with it?
[01:11] <ogra> but i wouldnt recommend it if you are after a good keyboard or a good case
[01:12] <tritium> I see.
[01:13] <ogra> oh, and the builtin wireless only works with win drivers, but ndiswrapper doesnt support them yet (using a pcmcia card currently)
[01:13] <tritium> one of the remaining quirks, I guess?
[01:14] <ogra> but it was the cheapest amd64 machine i could get (80GB HDD, 512MB widescreen 15,4", nvidia 64MB)
[01:14] <tritium> nice
[01:14] <ogra> DVD/CD writer...
[01:14] <ogra> 1250
[01:14] <tritium> Cool.
[01:15] <tritium> there don't appear to me many more AMD64isms anymore.  Is that fairly safe to say?
[01:16] <ogra> yop, if you can live without java and flash plugin :)
[01:16] <tritium> yeah, no problem :)
[01:18] <tritium> cool, thanks for the info.  I might compare against powerbooks.  I think I'm done with Dell, for sure.
[01:19] <ogra> they told me today that you can get a powerbook g5 for a similar price now
[01:19] <trulux|working> hey tritium
[01:19] <tritium> hi trulux|working :)
[01:19] <tritium> g5?  really?  wow
[01:20] <ogra> tritium, ask zyga in -devel he told me...
[01:20] <tritium> ogra, cool.  Thanks.
[01:20] <trulux|working> tritium: https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/SELinux <- 75% completed :)
[01:20] <tritium> trulux|working, nice :)
[01:28] <tseng> ogra: !!!
[01:28] <ogra> tseng
[01:28] <tseng> ogra: key is signed!
[01:28] <ogra> whatsup ?
[01:28] <ogra> YAY YAY YAY
[01:28] <tseng> YAY
[01:28] <crimsun> hooray!
[01:28] <ogra> \O/
[01:29] <ajmitch_> tseng: good work
[01:29] <tritium> tseng, :)
[01:38] <tseng> heh I tried
[01:38] <tseng> i guess he's too busy with his beard
[01:38] <crimsun> darned beards.
[01:39] <ogra> hehe
[01:39] <crimsun> you need to post on planet about it.
[01:39] <crimsun> :p
[01:39] <tseng> "manoj is my hero, even if he is nuts"
[01:45] <crimsun> ugh, #u is madness
[01:45] <tritium> what's going on?
[01:46] <tseng> you know what ill just mail mako again anyway
[01:46] <tseng> with the CoC
[01:46] <ogra> crimsun, because bluefoxicy is there ?
[01:47] <tseng> hah "big indian"
[01:47] <crimsun> ogra: just generally :)
[01:48] <ogra> heh
[01:52] <tritium> ogra, now that I'm investigating G5s, I'm wondering why there's no 64-bit powerpc stuff
[01:53] <crimsun> tritium: it's in debian, dunno about the design decision to not include it
[01:53] <tritium> crimsun, oh, okay.  Thanks.
[01:54] <ogra> tritium, we have a g5 kernel....but no explicit system...
[01:54] <tritium> I see
[01:58] <tseng> ogra: i just do gpg --sign CoC.txt, right?
[01:59] <ogra> yop
[02:00] <tseng> yay
[02:01] <ogra> tseng, the other 3 signs were not sufficient ?
[02:01] <tseng> they arent very strong if you follow them
[02:02] <ogra> ah, i see
[02:02] <tseng> so i waited for manoj, who is a gpg diety
[02:38] <mdz> tritium: ppc64 requires some toolchain work which we didn't have time for for Hoary
[02:38] <mdz> and there hasn't been a clear demand
[02:52] <tritium> mdz, oh, thanks for the info :)
[03:12] <crimsun> whew, good thing I didn't start on clanlib
[03:12] <crimsun> I suggest we also remove the packages we fix from "The list"
[03:27] <crimsun> ok, lincity definitely builds on [i386] 
[03:27] <crimsun> must have been buildd screwage, judging from http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/l/lincity/1.12.1-1/lincity_1.12.1-1_20050324-0454-i386-failed
[03:30] <lamont> crimsun: time's about right
[03:30] <lamont> everything before 20050324-1857 or so
[03:30] <lamont> is at least somewhat suspect
[03:30] <crimsun> ah ok.
[03:30] <crimsun> thanks for the clarification.
[03:30] <lamont> and even after that, if you see bitchiness about /dev/null permissions, check if it's marked 'needs-build' or 'failed' in buildLogs/Test/Lists/hoary-test.all.$arch
[03:30] <lamont> if failed, poke lamont
[03:31] <crimsun> ok.
[04:44] <crimsun> wb tritium
[04:44] <tritium> thanks :)
[04:48] <tritium> I noticed that dholbach signed my krecipes package :)
[04:49] <crimsun> congrats! :)
[04:49] <tritium> Thanks!
[07:12] <crimsun> pike7.* make me want to bash my forehead against a brick wall
[07:12] <tritium> ?
[07:13] <crimsun> the only one that has successfully built on all 4 arches is 7.6, but 7.6 is too new for the two apps I'm trying to fix
[07:13] <crimsun> both 7.2 and 7.4 are broken on at least one arch
[07:13] <crimsun> (FTBFS, that is)
[07:13] <tritium> ah
[07:14] <crimsun> so now I get to try and unbreak 7.2 and 7.4 so I can unbreak the two packages I _originally_ intended to fix.
[07:14] <crimsun> heh, gonna be a long morning
[07:15] <tritium> nice work, crimsun
[07:15] <crimsun> not yet ;)
[07:15] <tritium> Well, I admire the effort already
[07:15] <crimsun> so do I, though my stomach doesn't.  Hmm, food time.
[08:39] <crimsun> hi daniel
[08:42] <robitaille> Hi there.   Oliver sort of convinced me the other day that I should visit you guys on this channel
[08:42] <crimsun> yes, welcome
[08:43] <crimsun> now we have three daniels
[08:43] <robitaille> to see what the motu team is up to
[08:43] <tritium> Hi Daniel :)
[08:43] <crimsun> /wiki/MOTU is a good place to start
[08:44] <crimsun> basically we're nearly finished with the Python 2.4 transition and are delving madly through the DoesntBuild list, prioritised by PriorityList
[08:44] <crimsun> trying to get as much of universe building on all 4 arches as possible
[08:44] <crimsun> oh, and we have 1 1/2 weeks to do that ;)
[08:44] <robitaille> you can't never have too many Daniels on a project
[08:45] <robitaille> And one of these days I'm going to learn python.  THere is too many people around trying to convince me to do so, and it was one of the reason to get into Ubuntu in the first place for me last fall
[08:46] <crimsun> yeah, ubuntu is big on gnome and python
[09:13] <tritium> have a good morning, crimsun.
[09:44] <dholbach> goooood morning! how are you all?
[09:44] <Burgundavia> salut
[09:45] <dholbach> hey Burgundavia :-)
[10:08] <schweeb> dholbach: morning sucks :)
[10:09] <dholbach> schweeb: oh don't complain :-)
[10:10] <dholbach> schweeb: i only slept 5h30m because somebody thought it was early enough to phone me :-)
[10:10] <schweeb> heh
[10:10] <schweeb> I should be sleeping myself
[10:11] <schweeb> but I'm all hopped up on mountain dew
[10:13] <dholbach> :-)
[10:15] <schweeb> it is rather interesting being awake for all the drunk people who come home and randomly IM you :)
[10:25] <dholbach> hahaha :-)
[10:30] <prettylove> hi, kaloz
[10:33] <prettylove> hi riddell
[11:20] <schweeb> why is irssi-text in the Pri-List... isn't that in main?
[11:44] <dholbach> schweeb: hmm, tick it off or mark it as "main's job"
[11:46] <schweeb> looks like crimsun may have done something to it... dunno what or why
[11:48] <schweeb> which, if he actually went through and fixed that and the other packages under "done", he should probably remove the build-failed links to them
[11:50] <schweeb> argh, I better go to bed
[11:50] <schweeb> it's nearly 6am here
[11:50] <schweeb> night
[11:52] <dholbach> good night
[11:52] <dholbach> probably it's my fault
[11:52] <dholbach> maintaining those lists is a horror
[11:52] <dholbach> so i maybe overlooked it
[12:02] <herve> morning!
[12:03] <dholbach> hey herve
[12:03] <dholbach> herve: how are you today?
[12:03] <herve> slept well, much better!
[12:03] <herve> ready to start the motu marathon!
[12:03] <dholbach> gooooooood :-)
[12:03] <dholbach> oh... even better ;-)
[12:08] <herve> not really actually
[12:08] <herve> breakfast first!
[12:31] <herve> lamont, ping
[12:32] <herve> hi Amaranth
[12:32] <Amaranth> hi
[12:35] <herve> doko, ping
[01:26] <ogra> morning....
[01:26] <ogra> darn, i missed robitaille
[01:26] <dholbach> hey ogra
[01:26] <herve> morning ogra
[01:26] <herve> how was that hacking night?
[01:27] <ogra> tired...
[01:27] <herve> I didn't mean the consequences :-)
[01:31] <ogra> herve, no, but the night too, i didnt really find my starting point...
[01:33] <herve> I must admit I lost motivation yesterday night
[02:07] <HiddenWolf> Ugh. I'm so damn pissed off. :P
[02:07] <ogra> by what ?
[02:08] <HiddenWolf> Ordered two sticks of ram a month ago to upgrade my current pc
[02:08] <HiddenWolf> Did the math, figured I could afford a new rig, and ordered the new pc.
[02:08] <HiddenWolf> Now my mother calls, they just delivered all the last components. But I still haven't recieved the ram.
[02:08] <HiddenWolf> Ordered it at a diffent shop.
[02:08] <ogra> gah
[02:09] <HiddenWolf> Now I check at the shop who got the rest of the components, and they also sell that ram, and have it in stock.
[02:09] <HiddenWolf> Now I want to cancel the order and order it at the shop that actually has the stuff, but they won't awnser the phone. Guess they are in church or something.
[02:11] <ogra> yeah, its easter...
[02:11] <HiddenWolf> No, tomorrow is easter. :P
[02:12] <ogra> yeah, but....
[02:12] <HiddenWolf> So, now I have to cancel the order on tuesday, order it in the other shop, payment due wednesday, and if i"m lucky, I'll have it friday.
[02:12] <ogra> (in germany we already have a public holiday on friday....)
[02:12] <herve> in Alsace too
[02:13] <HiddenWolf> ogra, yeah. I didn't think about it yesterday either. I was in the train, and my public transport pass wasn't valid. Only on working days. Had to pay a fine.
[02:13] <ogra> so many ppl dont work on saturday...
[02:13] <ogra> gah
[02:13] <HiddenWolf> Now for me it is a working day. :P
[02:13] <HiddenWolf> The employee didn't agree
[02:14] <ogra> hmm..
[02:14] <ogra> so you have to convince the conductor :)
[02:15] <ogra> (guessing for him it was a working day too, the chances arent to bad ;) )
[02:18] <doko> herve: pong
[02:18] <herve> hi doko
[02:18] <herve> I suggest we just drop zopectl and zope-zshell
[02:19] <doko> why zope-zshell?
[02:21] <herve> unmaintaned
[02:21] <herve> and written by the time of zope 2.6
[02:21] <herve> it patches the roots of Zope
[02:22] <herve> I doubt it would still work with all the changes in zope 2.7
[02:24] <dholbach> herve: sip4-qt3 uploaded
[02:24] <herve> muhahaha!
[02:33] <doko> herve: did you test it?
[02:33] <herve> not yet
[02:33] <herve> I'm finishing with the python transition in itself
[02:46] <herve> sometimes I don't understand how DDs choose their dependencies
[03:01] <HiddenWolf> Yes. managed to cancel that damned order. :P
[03:02] <ogra> congrats
[03:03] <HiddenWolf> And I'm not paying the other shop until I see the order is ready to be shipped. :P
[03:04] <ogra> damned, do they only implement what they like ??
[03:05] <herve> it's free software ;-)
[03:05] <ogra> half of the stuff i can do in gtk-perl is missing in pygtk, thats annoying
[03:05] <HiddenWolf> ogra: did you only get that notion just now?
[03:06] <HiddenWolf> gnome imho doesn't listen very well / at all
[03:06] <ogra> nope, but at the moment i have to fix a bug in hwdb-client that would require only one line if not half of the functions were not missing
[03:07] <HiddenWolf> write the function, and propose a patch to pygtk to add the function there?
[03:08] <ogra> gah, then i'll rather find a workaround, i dont have the time to fix pygtk currently.... i simply rely on the fact they call it a stable implementation and wouldnt expect that functions available in ALL other bindings are missing there...
[03:09] <ogra> thats just ill
[03:09] <herve> ogra, have you check if it was implemented in CVS?
[03:10] <ogra> herve, i already asked them in #pygtk.... they told me gnomecanvas will be obsolete once so they wont iplement the missing bits, GRRR
[03:10] <herve> and gnome has been stabilized for just a few days...
[03:12] <herve> ho good...
[03:12] <herve> a configure script asking a question
[03:12] <herve> nice to script in debian/rules :-)
[03:13] <ogra> herve, gnomecanvas is a _very_ old implementation, it is not related to that new release
[03:13] <herve> so they make it right?
[03:13] <ogra> but simply everything described here is missing: http://developer.gnome.org/doc/API/2.0/libgnomecanvas/GnomeCanvasRichText.html#gnome-canvas-rich-text-get-buffer
[03:14] <ogra> (and not planned to get implemented)
[03:15] <herve> and what superseded it?
[03:17] <ogra> the waiting on a stable cairo implementation (which still might take more then 6 months)
[03:18] <ogra> i'm just upset by the ignorance....
[03:18] <herve> than, even :-)
[03:19] <herve> sounds like 6 months is worth binding gnomecanvas in python
[03:19] <ogra> might be, but i have to match a release date with my SW so i wont look into it now :)
[03:20] <HiddenWolf> Hm. So in six months time, gnome might start on a 3.0, using cairo?
[03:20] <ogra> HiddenWolf, that was just a gues, it might tae 3 months it migth take 2 years
[03:21] <ogra> its simply that a very ancient functionallity is missing _now_ and i need it _now_
[03:24] <dholbach> bbl
[03:27] <HiddenWolf> Sorry ogra, but that's how it works. Little incentive not to do what you don't want to, and an easy excuse to avoid doing it. (you can get to the source, add it yourself -kind of idea)
[03:31] <herve_> I *hate* those random crashes
[03:31] <herve_> dholbach left?
[03:32] <Amaranth> so we have until the 30th to get things done?
[03:32] <Amaranth> was reading the hoary release schedule, a bit confused
[03:33] <herve> hoary universe will be kinda frozen afterwards
[03:33] <herve> it will make things difficult to fix packages
[03:34] <Amaranth> you mean it'd be froze from the 30th until breezy starts, right?
[03:35] <herve> nope, frozen like warty is
[03:35] <herve> only security updates, rougly
[03:35] <herve> (roughly)
[03:36] <ogra> herve, yes, he had a short night....
[03:36] <ogra> (dholbach)
[03:37] <herve> ok, the nap he programmed :-)
[03:37] <ogra> :)
[03:37] <herve> have you guys checked luminocity?
[03:38] <ogra> nope
[03:38] <herve> ogra, I think it's related to what you talked about
[03:38] <herve> cairo, no?
[03:38] <ogra> ah, yeah, that one from seths blog...
[03:38] <herve> looks like it
[03:39] <ogra> sure, i've seen it and look forward to program with it...but that doesnt help me now :-/
[03:40] <herve> sure
[03:46] <Treenaks> does anyone know how I change the font in Wine from something-serif to something-sans-serif?
[03:48] <herve> I'm tempted to answer windows' control panel :-)
[03:53] <Treenaks> herve: *whack*
[03:53] <Treenaks> herve: I don't have windows, only some windows app running in wine
[03:53] <Treenaks> (I almost wrote "whine")(
[04:31] <herve> hey, a euro!
[04:31] <herve> wash your clothes and earn $$$
[04:57] <Treenaks>  Get rich fast!!
[05:09] <lamont> herve: mornign
[05:27] <herve> lamont, hi
[05:27] <herve> we uploaded a new version of poker3d
[05:28] <herve> but it never appeared in the archives
[05:28] <herve> though it successfully compiled on all archs
[05:28] <lamont> when was the upload?
[05:29] <lamont> buildLogs/Lists/hoary.all.amd64:universe/games/poker3d_0.2.12-1ubuntu1: Dep-Wait by buildd+king [optional:uncompiled] 
[05:29] <lamont> on all 4 architectures.
[05:29] <herve> two days ago
[05:29] <lamont>   Dependencies: libxml2-python2.3
[05:29] <lamont> so you fixed that build-dep, and you need it kicked>?
[05:30] <lamont> where did it successfully compile?  hoary-test?
[05:31] <herve> I don't really know those procedures
[05:31] <herve> but if you say it needs a kick, let's go!
[05:31] <lamont> ok. lets back up.
 though it successfully compiled on all archs - where did you get this information?>
[05:32] <lamont> and, was the upload 2 days ago doing the python2.4 transition?
[05:32] <herve> erm, I was think of another (problematic package)
[05:32] <herve> so poker3d was upload but never built
[05:32] <herve> (uploaded)
[05:33] <herve> yes, I am still working on that python2.4 transition
[05:39] <herve> my second concern is about sip-qt3
[05:39] <herve> this one was successfully built
[05:40] <herve> but no news in the archives
[05:42] <lamont> sip-qt3 is marked 'uploaded', which means it almost certainly contains files not found in the overrides file.  --> elmo love
[05:42] <herve> because of new binary packages?
[05:43] <lamont> for future...  if the package is marked as 'Dep-Wait' in buildLogs/Lists, and you upload a version that removes the build-depends: for the package it's blocked by, you must poke me.
[05:43] <lamont> new binary packages require NEW processing by elmo
[05:43] <herve> got it
[05:44] <herve> and what do you need to do for poker3d
[05:44] <herve> update some file?
[05:49] <lamont> I tell wanna-build to pretend that libxml2-python2.3 is available.
[05:50] <lamont> which I have now done.
[05:51] <herve> thank you
[05:59] <herve> hey jani!
[05:59] <jani>  hey herve
[06:20] <siretart> hi folks!
[06:21] <siretart> is there some known problem with the ia64 buildd?
[06:22] <jani> what do you mean?
[06:22] <jani> I know fewer packages build on ia64 since there are fewer users
[06:22] <jani> and testers/developers
[06:23] <herve> I think he wonders if the ia64 buildd itself has bugs
[06:23] <siretart> I'm trying to fix some packages from UniverseDoesNotBuild, and the packages in question have build failiures on ia64
[06:23] <siretart> e.g. here: http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/p/pidentd/3.0.16-7/pidentd_3.0.16-7_20050324-1300-ia64-failed
[06:24] <herve> good one :-)
[06:25] <jani> that one look like apt-get failed not the build itself
[06:25] <siretart> From the logs I would suspect that authentication should be taken out for sbuild
[06:25] <jani> WARNING: The following packages cannot be authenticated!
[06:26] <jani> I wonder why is that? Isn't that pulling from the ubuntu archives?
[06:27] <siretart> thats basically what I'm asking :)
[06:28] <herve> siretart, my diagnosis is... ask lamont :-)
[06:28] <siretart> herve: :)
[06:28] <schweeb> ugh
[06:29] <schweeb> I think I should go back to bed
[06:29] <herve> what time is it at yours?
[06:31] <schweeb> 12:30p
[06:31] <lamont> note that said build log is from before 20050324-1857
[06:31] <schweeb> went to bed about 6:30a
[06:31] <herve> schweeb, yes you're missing something :-)
[06:32] <lamont> jani: that was cluster #1
[06:32] <herve> it was found problematic,
[06:32] <herve> ?
[06:33] <jani> lamont, I don't know what cluster #1  means :)
[06:34] <lamont> jani: that's ok.
[06:34] <jani> nothing to do with pink floyd I assume
[06:34] <lamont> s/cluster/disaster/
[06:34] <lamont> no
[06:34] <lamont> is fire service term
[06:34] <lamont> means royal mess
[06:34] <jani> aha
[06:34] <jani> british or american English?
[06:36] <herve> royal mess... so it's british? ;-)
[06:37] <lamont> jani:" american
[06:37] <lamont> fire serivce, military, etc.
[06:37] <jani> ok thanks :)_
[06:39] <lamont> http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=cluster
[06:39] <lamont> is actually a contraction of a longer, less polite term
[06:46] <siretart> re
[06:47] <siretart> I'm looking at http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/p/pike7.2/7.2.580-3/pike7.2_7.2.580-3_20050324-0910-powerpc-given-back and try to imagine what the problem could be
[06:47] <lamont> janc: and thursday, I was numbering them.  I didn't like thursday very much.
[06:47] <lamont> 20050324-0910
[06:48] <herve> still before 18:57 :-)
[06:48] <lamont> cluster #2: ross, et al.
[06:48] <siretart> err, I'm sorry, I must have missed whats up with that date?
[06:49] <lamont> from sometime late 0323 until 1857 on the 24th, there were a collection of issues iwth the buildd's
[06:49] <lamont> 1857 was the point at which the last of them was declared dead, and I gave everything back
[06:49] <lamont> well, most everything
[06:49] <siretart> ah.. I see.
[06:50] <lamont> the lingering annoyance is anything that is currently marked 'failed' in hoary-test.all.*, and complains about /dev/null: permission denied.
[06:50] <lamont> the proposed fix for the root cause of that one is a bit too invasive to do right before the release... so I get to babysit regularly and cleanup after it when it happens..
[06:51] <herve> yes, that reminds me of a chroot error
[06:51] <lamont> but if y'all would be nice and avoid uploading too many packages that build-depend udev, hal, dbus, or such while I'm sleeping, I'd appreciate it.
[06:51] <herve> but I forgot what's wrong
[06:51] <lamont> ross was victimized by a kernel bug, the fix was to roll forward to a new kernel
[06:52] <siretart> oh, sounds ugly..
[06:53] <siretart> ok, then I'll grab other packages..
[06:53] <lamont> siretart: just start with buildLogs/Test/byDate/today.html is a good start - pick from that and you're fine
[06:53] <lamont> likewise ..../byDate/20050325.html is a good one too.
[06:54] <siretart> ah, that makes it easier.. thanks lamont1
[06:55] <lamont> alternatively, search for 'Failed' in buildLogs/Test/Lists/hoary-test.report.$arch
[06:56] <lamont> those are regressions, that need to either be fixed, or (hopefully) dropped from the archive
[06:56] <lamont> that is, best case is fixed
[06:56] <lamont> worst case is left in the archive unbuildable
[06:58] <siretart> the buildLogs are created by dak, I assume?
[06:58] <lamont> uh... small piece of python that salts them away
[06:58] <lamont> and generates that report for hoary test.
[06:59] <lamont> basically, 'report' only contains packages which are marked 'Installed' in hoary, but marked !Installed in hoary-test
[06:59] <siretart> ah. thanks for explanation
[06:59] <lamont> and undoubtedly contains some false positives, e.g. /dev/null: permission denied
[07:00] <herve> welcome back Daniel!
[07:00] <dholbach> hey herv
[07:00] <lamont> morning dholbach
[07:00] <dholbach> hey lamont :-)
[07:00] <siretart> hi Daniel
[07:00] <lamont> well, it's (a) still morning here, and (b) always morning on the internet.  except at bedtime.
[07:00] <dholbach> hehe
[07:01] <siretart> :)
[07:01] <dholbach> hey reinhard, how are you all? how's the overall atmosphere? :-)
[07:02] <herve> quite calm
[07:02] <herve> I'm trying to poke elmo about poker3d
[07:02] <herve> and lamont checked sip-qt3
[07:03] <dholbach> oh cool
[07:03] <lamont> s/checked/glanced at/
[07:03] <herve> or the other way round?
[07:03] <lamont> I didn't verify my assertion
[07:03] <lamont> herve: the other way around.
[07:03] <herve> you took a look :-)
[07:03] <lamont> sip-qt3 almost certainly needs elmo
[07:03] <lamont> poker3d should build now
[07:03] <dholbach> well... as soon as i finshed the crack list, i try to make the atmosphere a bit more cheery :-)
[07:04] <herve> ok, that's the evidence I haven't taken coffee for the day :)-
[07:04] <siretart> dholbach: quite fine, I have a good feeling for thursday, so I'm spending some time for universe :)
[07:04] <dholbach> siretart: exam on thursday?
[07:04] <siretart> dholbach: yeah
[07:04] <lamont> old-logs/daemon-20050326-1720.log.gz:Mar 24 20:45:01 buildd-mail: sip-qt3 must be manually dinstall-ed -- delayed
[07:04] <lamont> assertion  verified
[07:05] <schweeb> education is overrated :)
[07:05] <siretart> schweeb: :)
[07:05] <herve> lamont, thanks
[07:05] <siretart> but its quite intersting stuff: operating and distributed systems..
[07:06] <dholbach> oh nice
[07:06] <dholbach> when on thursday?
[07:06] <schweeb> sounds like a senior level class
[07:06] <lamont> hrm... bug in the report generator... /me studies
[07:07] <siretart> 10:10, weird time, but its colloquial..
[07:07] <dholbach> siretart: i'll have my fingers crossed
[07:07] <siretart> thanks! :)
[07:07] <dholbach> :-)
[07:09] <lamont> ok.  5 minutes until clean report
[07:09] <siretart> hm. the scm build problem is known to the debian bts: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=245810
[07:09] <lamont> (new hoary-test.report.$arch will only list packages which are marked 'Installed' in hoary
[07:09] <lamont> hrm.. and Uploaded.
[07:13] <herve> argh. poker3d fails on ia64!
[07:13] <siretart> well, since I don't have a ia64 or alpha to test steve langasaks patch, I'd suggest removing scm :(
[07:15] <herve> ho, not so easily?
[07:16] <lamont> herve: note that ia64 is not a release critical architecture
[07:16] <siretart> oh. then never mind
[07:17] <lamont> universe/libs/libgdiplus_1.0.4-1: Failed
[07:17] <lamont> universe/games/kq_0.98+cvs.20031006-5: Failed
[07:17] <lamont> universe/games/pinball_0.3.1-3: Failed
[07:17] <lamont> universe/devel/gprolog_1.2.18-12: Failed
[07:17] <lamont> universe/devel/rscheme_0.7.3.3.b20-1: Failed
[07:17] <lamont> unknown/swt-motif_3.0-4: Failed
[07:17] <lamont> #       Failed:        16
[07:18] <lamont> hrm... missing several
[07:18] <lamont> fenris, gal2, gmime2, kdebindings, libmrproject, libxcb, mico, nvidia-settings, stax, yehia
[07:24] <siretart> is there a convinient meta package for xorg devel headers?
[07:24] <siretart> a common problem seems to be that some header file have moved to other packages..
[07:25] <herve> siretart, that's the point
[07:25] <schweeb> if you're looking for scrnsaver.h, it's in libxss-dev
[07:25] <herve> xfree dev packages have been split out
[07:25] <herve> use dpkg -S or apt-file search to find out :-)
[07:26] <herve> lamont, I need to poke elmo too for a upload that should have not been made?
[07:26] <ogra> herve, ?
[07:27] <herve> I made uploaded sip4-qt3 4.2
[07:27] <herve> but our current qt/kde packages depends << 4.2
[07:27] <lamont> herve: well, it's like this... after cron.hourly runs, it's pretty much too late
[07:27] <ogra> what was wrong with that one ?
[07:27] <ogra> ah
[07:27] <lamont> now, if we're talking sip-qt3, and no binaries have entered the archive, then you have a bit more luck.
[07:28] <lamont> but in any case, once you upload it, the options are basically: upload a yet-newer version to undo what you did
[07:28] <herve> no it's sip4-qt3, another upstream branch
[07:28] <ogra> herve, fix it, bump the ubuntu version number....and reupload i guess
[07:28] <lamont> oh, and cron.hourly runs every 5 minutes...
[07:28] <herve> argh!
[07:28] <herve> ogra, it's 4.2 against 4.1
[07:29] <ogra> herve, then you will need to make it 4.2-ubuntu1 ?
[07:29] <herve> any 4.2 will conflicts with qt/kde python bindings
[07:30] <siretart> kq fixed.. taking next one..
[07:30] <ogra> oh, so this never should have been uploaded since it cant build ?
[07:31] <herve> it can
[07:31] <herve> but could prevent other from building
[07:31] <herve> stupid me!
[07:31] <ogra> hmm
[07:33] <herve> who care about kde anyway? :-)
[07:33] <tseng> right.
[07:33] <herve> just kidding...
[07:33] <tritium> Hi dholbach
[07:33] <herve> hi tritium
[07:33] <tritium> hi herve :)
[07:34] <ogra> herve, dont say that to loud, you'll never know if Riddell is watching
[07:34] <tritium> hi ogra
[07:34] <ogra> hi tritium
[07:34] <herve> it was too good DD made the transition job for me...
[07:35] <herve> but on a newer and incompatible upstream release :-/
[07:45] <siretart> next package fixed: pinball..
[07:45] <ogra> woah, thats speed....
[07:46] <siretart> well, those 2 package just needed more build depends,
[07:46] <tritium> How are we going about fixing package that won't build on architectures we don't have?
[07:47] <ogra> try to find out the problem and ask someont who owns the arch to testbuild
[07:47] <tritium> ok
[07:48] <tritium> and we're starting from the top of the prioritized list?
[07:48] <ogra> yup
[07:48] <tritium> cool
[07:55] <siretart> thats weird: http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/Lists/hoary-test.all.i386 says that rscheme is failing, but it is building fine in my hoary chroot
[07:55] <siretart> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/r/rscheme/0.7.3.3.b20-1/rscheme_0.7.3.3.b20-1_20050322-0658-i386-failed failing with an unmotivated segfault. hardware problem? I dont know..
[07:56] <herve> before 24th at 18:07 :-)
[07:56] <siretart> ;)
[08:10] <lamont> bad times didn't really get going until the 23rd though...
[08:10] <lamont> discount (1) anything ross did before 24 mar 18:57, and (2) anything that bitches about /dev/null permissions
[08:10] <siretart> ok
[08:11] <herve> (I finally remember how I fixed that error!)
[08:13] <ogra> oh, i missed its DST night tonight.....
[08:14] <siretart> swt-motif also seems to have builddep problem, I'm on it..
[08:14] <siretart> ogra: oh, thanks for the reminder :)
[08:15] <ogra> siretart, in any case your ubuntu would have reminded you ;)
[08:15] <siretart> ogra: hehe :)
[08:16] <schweeb> motif? /me vomits
[08:16] <ogra> schweeb, its like antique furniture :)
[08:17] <schweeb> I'd much rather claw out my eyes than look at THAT furniture :)
[08:17] <ogra> (in fact with a sexy concrete look, but well...)
[08:18] <siretart> motif.. that always reminds me to that acroread4 stuff...
[08:22] <siretart> well, package building again..
[08:23] <schweeb> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/d/dietlibc/0.27-7/
[08:23] <schweeb> is there any reason why dietlibc isn't build on amd64?
[08:23] <schweeb> isn't even attempted...
[08:24] <schweeb> (one of my buddies noticed it wasn't in the archive for amd64)
[08:25] <dholbach> schweeb: doesnt build there, i tried it to solve a couple of issue
[08:26] <schweeb> 14:21 < schweeb> it's quite possible it doesn't build
[08:26] <schweeb> 14:21 < schweeb> lemme check
[08:26] <schweeb> 14:21 < Beirdo> built fine for me
[08:26] <schweeb> 14:21 < Beirdo> in about 20s
[08:26] <dholbach> erm
[08:26] <schweeb> *shrug*
[08:26] <dholbach> hm
[08:26] <tritium> Hi dholbach!  Thanks for signing krecipes :)
[08:26] <dholbach> hey tritium
[08:26] <dholbach> de rien :-)
[08:27] <schweeb> dholbach: I don't see /any/ buildlogs for it on amd64, any version
[08:28] <siretart> schweeb: is dietlibc an arch: any package at all?
[08:28] <dholbach> schweeb: Architecture: arm i386
[08:28] <dholbach> schweeb: for Package: dietlibc
[08:28] <schweeb> ahh
[08:30] <schweeb> should it be built for amd64?  I don't know much about multiarch support... my buddy says vservers needs it
[08:31] <dholbach> schweeb: twoftpd-run, runit-run, socklog-run, bincimap-run need it via runit
[08:31] <dholbach> i'm not sure either... maybe lamont knows :-)
[08:31] <schweeb> hahha
[08:32] <siretart> schweeb: vserver needs dietlibc?
[08:33] <schweeb> probably somewhere through the deps
[08:33] <schweeb> this comes second hand, so I'm not 100% sure the situation
[08:35] <schweeb> it's built for ia64 and ppc though, so I'm imagining it should be built for amd64 ;)
[08:35] <lamont> %dietlibc: alpha amd64 arm hppa i386 ia64 mips mipsel powerpc sparc s390    # ANAIS
[08:35] <lamont> it should be building on amd64
[08:35] <dholbach> ok... so changing it in debian/control and uploading should suffice
[08:36] <siretart> whats this: http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/o/openmosix/1:0.3.4-7/openmosix_1:0.3.4-7_20050324-0633-i386-failed - including files from /usr/include/linux directly?! waah?!
[08:37] <schweeb> hehe
[08:41] <siretart> hmm.. thinking later bout it, going to get something to eat.. bbl
[08:41] <lamont> dholbach: if there are no logs, we may need to have elmo resync-PaS
[08:42] <lamont> and, of course, there's no guarantee it actually builds...
[08:42] <dholbach> no build logs for amd64 ever
[08:43] <lamont> yep.
[08:43] <lamont> needs elmo love
[08:43] <dholbach> i don't understand... won't it (after a change of debian/control) just be in elmo's "NEW queue"?
[08:43] <lamont> it's in PaS
[08:43] <lamont> that is, quinn-diff has been specifically told to ignore dietlibc on amd64
[08:44] <dholbach> i see
[08:44] <dholbach> hrm
[08:44] <schweeb> PaS ?
[08:44] <lamont> you'll note that it's not in buildLogs/Lists/hoary.all.amd64
[08:44] <lamont> Packages-arch-specific
[08:44] <schweeb> ahh
[08:45] <lamont> for various reasons, the architectures that attempt a build are controlled outside of the packages source.
[08:45] <schweeb> well, considering amd64 isn't a supported arch in debian yet, that's understandable (it's still unsupported, right?)
[08:45] <dholbach> thanks lamont
[08:46] <lamont> righ
[08:46] <lamont> t
[09:36] <koke> hi all!!
[09:36] <herve> hi koke !
[09:36] <dholbach> hey koke
[09:36] <koke> how are you?
[09:36] <herve> fine, thanks
[09:36] <dholbach> fine... all kinds of crack around me, but still fine
[09:39] <schweeb> I've seen the term 'crack' thrown around here more than anywhere else, ever ;)
[09:39] <koke> :D
[09:39] <dholbach> schweeb: it will all get better with SneezySnail or something
[09:39] <koke> I've received a mail from a DD asking me if I wanted to maintain the evolution-sharp package in debian too
[09:40] <koke> tseng: do you want it??
[09:40] <koke> you are the mono guy :P
[09:40] <dholbach> koke: oh nice... i just saw some apt-get.org-repo having it too
[09:40] <schweeb> dholbach: haha
[09:40] <tseng> i am the mono lead, i dont need every package directly :)
[09:40] <dholbach> schweeb: ;-)
[09:40] <schweeb> is that actually a proposed name?
[09:40] <tseng> go for it if you want to work with him, koke
[09:40] <koke> tseng: I only packaged it to compile beagle
[09:41] <koke> but I'm not maintainig it and know not very much of mono
[09:41] <herve> SneezyNose?
[09:41] <herve> ha no, I misread :-)
[09:42] <tseng> koke: so, you dont want it? or what.
[09:42] <tseng> we can make it owned by Mono Team for ubuntu, or something
[09:42] <tseng> and you can mail relevant stuff to your DD
[09:42] <koke> tseng: it would be better
[09:42] <dholbach> yeah... please someone give us   qa.ubuntu.com   and  packages.ubuntu.com
[09:42] <koke> I don't mind to maintain it
[09:42] <dholbach> PLEASE
[09:42] <tseng> thats still means you and me.
[09:43] <koke> but it's very possible I'll forget it :)
[09:43] <tseng> dholbach: dude, didint i give you packages?
[09:43] <dholbach> tseng: what are you talking about?
[09:43] <tseng> dholbach: http://higgs.djpig.de/ubuntu/www/
[09:43] <dholbach> yeah... that's a start :-)
[09:44] <tseng> has worked well for me so far
[09:45] <herve> well, going forth and back between this and lamont's logs is not handy
[09:45] <lamont> tseng: you could add links to the logs for him....
[09:45] <tseng> email the owner?
[09:45] <tseng> yes.
[09:45] <lamont> at least to the directory - that's highly predictable
[09:45] <tseng> its not mine, but im sure the guy running the site would accomodate that
[09:46] <tseng> yeah the directory should be fine
[09:47] <tseng> I will mail him, dudes
[09:48] <dholbach> woohoo
[09:48] <tseng> anyone have a burning need for CC'age?
[09:48] <lamont> tseng: and remember with and without /Test
[09:48] <tseng> lamont: /Test?
[09:48] <lamont> tseng: you could lend some authentecity by cc'ing me... no burning need, but you're welcome
[09:48] <lamont> to
[09:49] <lamont> buildLogs/Test/f/foo/1.1/
[09:49] <lamont> is the rebuild
[09:49] <dholbach> and we want to be able to make notes according to teams and tag packages as In<Bla>Transition - thanks for being so kind ;-p
[09:50] <tseng> dholbach: that sounds like a deeper architectural change that deserves its own thread
[09:51] <dholbach> yes... i am aware of that :-)
[09:51] <koke> tseng: that looks just great :D
[09:51] <tseng> i have no idea how deeply in tune this guy is to this webapp
[09:51] <tseng> yeah I posted that link in #u-d before, I didnt know so many people missed it
[09:51] <tseng> ill blog it when we're done ehre
[09:51] <tseng> *here.
[09:51] <herve> and make links with malone, obviously :-)
[09:52] <tseng> is malone powered up yet?
[09:52] <ogra> we are supposed to use it
[09:52] <ogra> (but not the users)
[09:53] <tseng> lamont: sorry, /Test is when you "kick" an existing source to rebuild?
[09:53] <lamont> no
[09:54] <lamont> there is the hoary distribution, and the hoary-test distribution.  hoary-test is currently doing a complete rebuild of hoary, to verify that things actually build against the current archive.
[09:54] <lamont> those failures (regressions) are top of my list.
[09:54] <lamont> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/Lists/hoary-test.report.$arch
[09:54] <tseng> ah-ha
[09:54] <tseng> thanks for clarifying
[09:55] <dholbach> tseng: that's what http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UniverseDoesNotBuild and http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UniversePriorityList is all about :-)
[09:55] <tseng> oh.
[09:56] <dholbach> :-)
[09:56] <siretart> re
[09:56] <dholbach> wb siretart
[09:59] <koke> have to go
[09:59] <koke> see you soon :)
[09:59] <siretart> cu koke
[10:01] <tseng> lamont, dholbach sent
[10:02] <dholbach> tseng: ROCK! :-)
[10:06] <tseng> heh.
[10:23] <herve> I'm trying to sort why gcompris ftbfs
[10:23] <herve> the only differences I found with a working compilation on Sid are:
[10:23] <dholbach> herve: removed it from meta-gnome2 ;-)
[10:23] <herve> 1. Hoary Makefile don't have "-Wl,--export-dynamic"
[10:23] <herve> still motu business ;-)
[10:24] <herve> 2. Sid had mawk, Hoary gawk
[10:24] <herve> 3. Python 2.4 instead of 2.3
[10:24] <herve> I can't find the relationship :-(
[10:25] <hsprang> hy all :)
[10:26] <herve> hi!
[10:26] <dholbach> hey hsprang
[10:32] <ogra> there is a menu editor on motunewpackages...and the link of the name points to a totally empty wiki page....weird...
[10:32] <herve> syntax error?
[10:32] <herve> in the url
[10:33] <hsprang> ogra: this is amaranth
[10:33] <ogra> nope
[10:33] <ogra> hmm, then he probably should put his nick on the wiki page...a empty page is somewhat pointless...
[10:33] <herve> he is, check the /whois :-)
[10:34] <hsprang> i remember telling him which packages he need to pu online for reviewing for the menueditor
[10:35] <herve> I remember HostingGeek asking for a screenshot to enter ubuntu :-)
[10:35] <ogra> hmm, the package is funny
[10:36] <ogra> there is a orig.tar.gz.....
[10:36] <ogra> but no diff.gz....
[10:36] <ogra> but a ubuntu1.tar.gz
[10:36] <ogra> and a .dsc ....
[10:36] <dholbach> ho... this repo has zakmccracken
[10:36] <hsprang> hmm, doesn't sound like he did it how i told him...
[10:36] <ogra> half native.....
[10:36] <dholbach> not sure if that's something for even multiverse
[10:37] <ogra> half non native...
[10:37] <hsprang> or better: misunderstood me
[10:37] <dholbach> sounds like repository "warez" or something :-)
[10:37] <hsprang> yes, i remember we wasn't wuite sure which it was
[10:37] <herve> dholbach, not sure
[10:38] <dholbach> zakmccracken rocked
[10:38] <siretart> definitly!
[10:38] <herve> it could have been one of these games free'd for scumm
[10:38] <herve> but I can't find a proof
[10:38] <hsprang> when i looked at it there was nothing like that, we just talked about the editor...
[10:39] <dholbach> HO, it even has vmware
[10:39] <dholbach> maybe this repo even works with   porn-get  ;-)
[10:40] <schweeb> hah
[10:41] <dholbach> yeah: http://www.fbriere.net/debian/dists/unstable/scummvm/src/ :-)
[10:41] <herve> okay
[10:41] <herve> lucasart games are obviously not been freed :-)
[10:42] <siretart> woooh, nice repo :)
[10:42] <herve> haaa... maniac mansion...
[10:42] <herve> quite all lucasart adventures games actually
[10:42] <dholbach> LOLLL
[10:42] <dholbach> look at this *scroll*
[10:42] <dholbach> --- indiana-jones-last-crusade-ega-1.orig/debian/copyright
[10:42] <dholbach> +++ indiana-jones-last-crusade-ega-1/debian/copyright
[10:42] <dholbach> @@ -0,0 +1,10 @@
[10:42] <dholbach> +This package was debianized by Frederic Briere <fbriere@fbriere.net> on
[10:42] <dholbach> +Sun, 13 Jun 2004 01:37:02 -0400.
[10:42] <dholbach> +
[10:42] <dholbach> +It was downloaded from somewhere on the Net.
[10:42] <dholbach> +
[10:42] <dholbach> +Upstream Author: LucasArts Entertainment Company
[10:42] <dholbach> +
[10:42] <dholbach> +Copyright:
[10:42] <dholbach> +
[10:42] <dholbach> +Yes.
[10:43] <dholbach> hahaha
[10:43] <siretart> LOL
[10:43] <schweeb> hahahahahaha
[10:43] <ogra> heh
[10:43] <dholbach> we should definitely NOT have that synced
[10:43] <tritium> amazing
[10:43] <herve> for he had to fill in the dh_make blanks :-)
[10:43] <hsprang> ogra: what do you think - as i got it, menueditor is a native package, as everyting it needs to build is in the original tar.gz
[10:43] <tseng> dholbach: oh jeez
[10:43] <hsprang> ogra: only, this tar.gz could be used to build from source for freebsd, too
[10:43] <tseng> dholbach: elmo said that he did check out copyright on stuff
[10:43] <herve> and a psx emulator with a bios ;-)
[10:43] <tseng> before adding
[10:44] <tseng> *why* we are adding so much junk in the first place..
[10:44] <tseng> boggle.
[10:44] <ogra> hsprang, but thats pretty weird...there is a lot of cruft in the repo...
[10:44] <ogra> hsprang, if only the tgz is needed....
[10:45] <ogra> hmm, and a source.changes would have been nice...
[10:46] <hsprang> ogra: argh, no, sorry, i'm a bit confused, you need only the tar.gz and the dsc AFAIK
[10:46] <ogra> hsprang, sure
[10:47] <herve> Amaranth said his application is far from being ready anyway
[10:49] <ogra> hsprang, i dont like native packages (as nobody here does), ignore my ranting ;)
[10:50] <tritium> ogra, why do we dislike native packages?  What if there's no debian package yet?
[10:51] <dholbach> native packages are a pain... ogra uploaded a 5mb one for me
[10:51] <tritium> and for me too
[10:51] <ogra> tritium, then make one, just not a native one :) its nice for other maintainers to separate the code and the packaging
[10:51] <tritium> well, a 5 MB package, not a native one
[10:51] <siretart> I updated MotoTodo with my prepared package. I'm quite tired and getting some rest. gn8 folks!
[10:51] <tritium> ogra, oh, gotcha
[10:52] <dholbach> tritium: a native 5 mb one
[10:52] <ogra> tritium, if you make small changes to a 5M native package you cant upload only the changes, its 5M every time
[10:52] <dholbach> siretart: good night
[10:52] <ogra> and thats just silly
[10:52] <ogra> night siretart
[10:52] <dholbach> and no .diff.gz to read
[10:53] <ogra> yup
[10:53] <tritium> dholbach, okay.  I meant the one that ogra had to upload for me was not a native one.
[10:53] <tritium> It was that tipa one
[10:53] <dholbach> ah alright
[10:53] <herve> I also prefer versionning upstream and debian work in separate archives
[10:53] <ogra> tritium, nope, it wasnt
[10:53] <tritium> tipa was a pita
[10:53] <ogra> heh
[10:53] <dholbach> lol
[10:54] <tritium> I'm with the program now ;)
[10:55] <herve> with a "should" or "must"? ;-)
[10:55] <ogra> must !!
[10:55] <ogra> :)
[10:55] <herve> "or you'll burn in hell!"
[10:55] <herve> :-)
[10:55] <ogra> yeah
[10:55] <tritium> My grecipes upstream already has a debian/ directory, and it's a mess.  It's not an official debian package.
[10:55] <ogra> tritium, split it :)
[10:55] <dholbach> tritium: that's apain too
[10:56] <tritium> ogra, what do you mean by split?
[10:56] <ogra> make a orig.tar.gz with the source and a separate diff.gz with the debian dir...
[10:57] <tritium> from upstream's package?
[10:57] <ogra> so all your changes will always go into the diff.gz
[10:57] <tritium> okay,
[10:57] <ogra> theny convice upstream to take your package instead of his :)
[10:57] <ogra> -y
[10:58] <tritium> cool
[10:58] <tritium> I'll try that
[10:58] <ogra> and soon your uploads only take some bytes in the future and the maintenance is fun :)
[10:58] <tritium> yay
[10:59] <herve> and tell me about cvs/svn/tla-buildpackage
[10:59] <herve> s/me/them
[10:59] <ogra> yeah, thats a pita too
[10:59] <ogra> CVS leftovers in a package are just ugly
[11:00] <herve> hu?
[11:00] <herve> I didn't mean that :-)
[11:00] <dholbach> if people just used  cvs export ...; make dist
[11:00] <ogra> herve, never had a package that did this ?
[11:01] <herve> ogra, mine, I left .arch-ids before I knew tla a bit more :-)
[11:01] <ogra> herve, sorry, i know you didnt mean that...
[11:01] <herve> you get nervous when reading the word "cvs"? ;-)
[11:01] <ogra> but mostly thats the result if ppl dont know about xxx-buildpackage ;)
[11:02] <herve> hmm...
[11:02] <herve> I think I remember a package which cleaned CVS dirs in debian/rules
[11:03] <schweeb> setting DH_EXCLUDE_FILES = CVS or something like that
[11:04] <ogra> herve, what do you gain with that ? the CVS mess is still in the orig.tar.gz....
[11:05] <ogra> its just cleaner at buildtime
[11:05] <herve> ogra, don't blame me, I just saw that as a motu :-)
[11:06] <ogra> :)
[11:06] <ogra> i dont blame you
[11:18] <schweeb> okay, gonna eat some food, then make myself useful and fix somethin
[11:20] <jani> shouldn't we have a no lintian warnings policy on NEW packages made specifically for ubuntu?
[11:21] <dholbach> sounds good
[11:21] <dholbach> apart from the 0ubuntu1-crap :-)
[11:21] <jani> it's different from when syncing sid or getting from another 3rd party repo
[11:21] <jani> sure apart from NMU and things like that
[11:22] <schweeb> remind me again what nmu stands for
[11:22] <tseng> non maintainer upload
[11:22] <dholbach> non maintainer upload
[11:22] <tseng> wee
[11:22] <dholbach> debian politics :-)
[11:23] <schweeb> ahh, gotcha
[11:23] <schweeb> yea, debian... politics... imagine that
[11:23] <schweeb> love debian, but I have mixed emotions about half of the community
[11:23] <Burgundavia> no, there is no polics in debian
[11:23] <tseng> half?
[11:24] <Burgundavia> it is all love and joy
[11:24] <schweeb> there is a good half of the community...  some of them are working on ubuntu now, even
[11:25] <hsprang> ogra: i'm back und read the above (incompletely) - but, if you think it's better not to have the debian things in the same distribution file, then you should tell amaranth
[11:26] <hsprang> ogra: development is early and he can easily change i guess...
[11:27] <jani> both gnomebaker and krecipes seem to be specifically packed for ubuntu
[11:27] <jani> and both have warnings
[11:27] <jani> that's why I asked
[11:27] <ogra> hsprang, i'll do
[11:28] <ogra> jani, the last gnomebaker package has no warnings
[11:28] <schweeb> I made sure gsf-sharp didn't have any (except for netlibs) :)
[11:28] <jani> oh great then I reviewed that last week
[11:28] <herve> jani, it depends of the type of warning
[11:28] <ogra> (i checked and uploaded it yesterday)
[11:28] <hsprang> does it make sense for me to change that in FAI, too? it's a native package in debian already, the same it is in ubuntu
[11:29] <jani> cool, it is still in the wiki :)
[11:29] <herve> hd
[11:29] <herve> hsprang, is it a real native debian package
[11:29] <ogra> jani, ntil it passed elmo
[11:29] <herve> in the sense of "made in Debian"
[11:29] <herve> ?
[11:30] <hsprang> made in debian for debian from start - it's intended to install debian
[11:30] <jani> I see so hoary-changes gets it after elmo, ok.
[11:30] <ogra> hsprang, its way easier to maintain
[11:30] <hsprang> only it "learnt" to install solaris and ubuntu, too in the meantime
[11:31] <ogra> jani,  all NEW packages get amual review by elmo, so if he has questions its nice to still have he review comments on the wikipage
[11:31] <ogra> manual avan
[11:31] <ogra> even
[11:31] <jani> ogra, ok thanks
[11:31] <hsprang> i'll see if and how i can do that
[11:31] <jani> I have am just reviewing krecipes
[11:32] <jani> has two warnings as well (shlib related)
[11:32] <ogra> hsprang, if you have totouch it anyway to get your changes in, its probably the best
[11:32] <ogra> jani, uhh, shlibs isnt nice...
[11:32] <jani> weird warnings I am not sure how serious they are
[11:33] <dholbach> jani: which ones?
[11:33] <hsprang> yes, i worked out the current solution with dholbach and we might not be completely sure how to do it
[11:33] <jani> a moment so I copy paste them
[11:33] <ogra> jani, NEW packages shouldnt have any warnings
[11:33] <dholbach> ogra: some of those shlibs warnings are pointless... at least that's what seb128 and i agreed on
[11:34] <dholbach> ogra: when they're no lintian ones
[11:34] <jani>  krecipes: non-dev-pkg-with-shlib-symlink usr/lib/libkrecipesexporters.so.0.0.0 usr/lib/libkrecipesexporters.so
[11:34] <jani> and a similar one for another .so
[11:34] <dholbach> do you have a debian/package.shlibs ?
[11:34] <ogra> dholbach, i wont approve NEW packages with warnings, its up to you if you do
[11:34] <jani> we shopuld see if they cause problems at runtime as well
[11:35] <dholbach> this is krecipes???
[11:35] <jani> yes
[11:35] <dholbach> erm... why didnt i get those warnings?
[11:35] <jani> since while testing it it entered a loop
[11:35] <jani> dholbach, I don't know
[11:35] <jani> weird indeed
[11:35] <dholbach> ogra: i meant a different one... not lintian-related
[11:36] <jani> I am now installing kde 3.4 see if it crashes with that too
[11:36] <ogra> dholbach, _any_ warning
[11:36] <jani> ogra, some warnings are false positives though even lintian doc admit it
[11:36] <ogra> dholbach, except NMU
[11:36] <jani> we just have to make sure which
[11:37] <hsprang> ogra: but it'll take some time, i'll be busy working the next week, and atm i am fighting with system freezes and wireless issues with crappy notebook and wlan hardware...
[11:37] <ogra> jani, as i said i wont approve them
[11:37] <jani> even if false positives ;) ?
[11:37] <ogra> jani, but the requirement is three MOTUs for NEW packages not one ogra ;)
[11:37] <jani> really lintian docs say they cannot be sure they nail them all correctly
[11:38] <jani> still we should get 3 happily agreeing motus :)
[11:38] <jani> not voting
[11:38] <ogra> jani, i have discussed hours with elmo about capital letters in descriptions or furmulations he didnt like, thus i wont accept _any_ warnings anymore...
[11:38] <dholbach> ogra:
[11:39] <dholbach> i was talking about warnings as STUPID as these:
[11:39] <dholbach> dpkg-parsechangelog: warning: no utmp entry available and LOGNAME not defined; using uid of process (0)
[11:39] <dholbach> debian: warning: no utmp entry available and LOGNAME not defined; using uid of process (0)
[11:39] <jani> yes those capital letters and articles are boring
[11:39] <jani> but could be correceted with a script across the universe
[11:39] <ogra> jani, its one letter to change...
[11:39] <ogra> dholbach, why does it touch utmp at all ?
[11:40] <dholbach> ogra: please build any package
[11:40] <jani> ogra I agree with you on the warings I mentioned even if they are boring
[11:40] <schweeb> I only ever get errors like that when I use pbuilder...
[11:40] <dholbach> schweeb: yes, exactly
[11:40] <jani> but still you cannot say kDE or dVD ;)
[11:40] <jani> that's why I propes an override file for gnomebaker
[11:40] <jani> proposed
[11:40] <ogra> jani, then you should use another formulation
[11:41] <ogra> and not tart the sentence with KDE
[11:41] <schweeb> dholbach: those are more problems with pbuilder's functionality than packaging problems afaict
[11:41] <ogra> +s
[11:41] <dholbach> schweeb: that's what i'm talking about
[11:41] <dholbach> schweeb: i got a shlibs warning that was as silly as those
[11:41] <dholbach> schweeb: and that was all i talked about
[11:41] <schweeb> ah
[11:42] <jani> ogra, do you think using override files are too much for such cases
[11:42] <jani> ?
[11:42] <ogra> dholbach, thats why i use debuild-pbuilder after using pbulider
[11:42] <ogra> jani, if i simply can change it by rearranging a sentence, yes
[11:42] <jani> hmm, I gotta start using pbuilder myself
[11:43] <jani> how did he did it for gnomebaker after all?
[11:43] <jani> it was CD writer ap for GNOME or something
[11:44] <jani> for the shlib warnings in krecipes the verbose msg says:
[11:44] <jani> N:   Shared libraries are supposed to place such symbolic links in their
[11:44] <jani> N:   respective `-dev' packages, so it is a bug to include it with the main
[11:44] <jani> N:   library package.
[11:44] <jani> but in the next paragraph:
[11:44] <jani>  However, if this is a small package which includes the runtime and the
[11:44] <jani> N:   development libraries, this is not a bug
[11:45] <jani> so even these warnings are not set in stone
[11:45] <dholbach> jani: i'll proofread the package again
[11:45] <ogra> jani, did you see my comments on gnomebaker ?
[11:45] <jani> ogra,yup
[11:46] <jani> in the wiki I mean
[11:46] <ogra> jani, yesterday it built absolutely clean...so i uploaded it
[11:46] <ogra> yup
[11:46] <jani> ok I just asked how did he rephrase the description to avoid capital
[11:46] <jani> I'll look on his site
[11:47] <jani> except there's no link
[11:47] <jani> ogra, but I'm also btw for no warnings in NEW, this is what I proposed when I started this 'thread' :)
[11:48] <ogra> jani, Description:
[11:48] <ogra>  gnomebaker - application for CD/DVD creation in the GNOME desktop
[11:49] <jani> aha, thanks, sounds a bit forced though :)
[11:49] <ogra> jani, its pointless to discuss it now, but a goodtask for the next MOTU meeting i guess, i'll put it on the agenda
[11:49] <herve> I checked the developers reference for hints
[11:49] <herve> the first synopsis you gave would be ok
[11:50] <herve> but the DR is not normative
[11:50] <jani> good idea, let the debian oldtimers set a policy so we don't spend too much time on it in the future
[11:51] <dholbach> :-)
[11:51] <jani> also wrt sealing universe when hoary releases it was not just  technical reasons IIRC
[11:52] <herve> it's not like we're starting from zero
[11:52] <jani> but mdz said something about it possibly being risky?
[11:53] <jani> I though how about uni being open only for NEW packages not fixes or updates to existing ones
[11:53] <jani> so nothing can regress
[11:53] <herve> I can't find that "no capital letter at first" rule in the debian policy
[11:53] <jani> but people ca still get new apps without adding 3rd party repos
[11:54] <schweeb> that's actually a relatively decent idea
[11:54] <jani> there are mant pack which won't make it in hoary
[11:55] <jani> s/mant/many/
[11:55] <jani> dholbach,ogra what do you think?
[11:56] <dholbach> jani: to be honest, NEW packages are not my primary concern atm
[11:56] <dholbach> but i'll help to review each and every new one
[11:56] <jani> fair enough :)
[11:56] <herve> I wonder when lintian got that silly rule
[11:56] <herve> s/when/where
[11:56] <jani> herve it is in thepolicy manual but I am not sure which chapter
[11:57] <jani> the one that describes the control file
[11:57] <jani> if you run lintian -i it migh ttell you :)
[11:58] <ogra> jani, i'm very worried about the quality of our packages...(since apt-get.org goes in)
[11:58] <ogra> herve, we are not debian
[11:59] <ogra> herve, and we could always patch this warning out of the lintian package
[11:59] <ogra> (which we probably should do for breezy)
[11:59] <herve> yes
[11:59] <herve> I just wondered how lintian could impose such a thing
[12:00] <ogra> ask the lintian devs
[12:00] <herve> hehe
[12:00] <ogra> :)
[12:00] <herve> a "zero warning" rule should calm down that apt-get.org thing ;-)