| === Burgundavia [~Burgundav@S0106000393d5b468.du.shawcable.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
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| === dannemare [~konversat@0x5358aaae.abnxx12.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| dannemare | Can anybody tell me why the wiki was rolled back to April 1st, and whether stuff added after April 1st to today can be restored (I assume there's a nightly backup or something)? | 02:58 |
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| === jsgotangco [~jsg@202.57.71.235] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| === Liz [~Liz@fixed-203-87-27-63.nsw.chariot.net.au] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| === Liz [~Liz@fixed-203-87-27-63.nsw.chariot.net.au] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| jsgotangco | hmmm the xml is messed up | 03:25 |
| Liz | mornin jsgotangco | 03:26 |
| Liz | mornin all | 03:26 |
| jsgotangco | hi Liz! | 03:37 |
| jsgotangco | Liz: u familiar with po files? | 03:37 |
| Liz | no, no idea at all about po files | 03:38 |
| jsgotangco | ok i was checking the xml from svn and one of them is pretty messed up and had to fix it | 03:38 |
| Liz | ill have to check that out in a bit | 03:40 |
| Liz | sigh..it seems i dont have time for a lot of things at late | 03:40 |
| Liz | brb | 03:40 |
| jsgotangco | *grin* okie dokie | 03:40 |
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| === froud-away is now known as froud | ||
| froud | African Greetings | 08:21 |
| Burgundavia | salut | 08:21 |
| froud | Burgundavia: morn | 08:21 |
| Burgundavia | I have been doing a lot of helping on #ubuntu | 08:22 |
| froud | So I see | 08:22 |
| Burgundavia | realized where our docs need to be taken up to snuff | 08:22 |
| froud | great | 08:22 |
| froud | sure | 08:22 |
| froud | how's your shell scripting | 08:22 |
| Burgundavia | not great I must say | 08:22 |
| froud | I have sent a mail to the list | 08:22 |
| froud | added two scripts to svn | 08:22 |
| froud | make-pot and make-po | 08:23 |
| Burgundavia | ok | 08:23 |
| froud | make pot works my side | 08:23 |
| froud | make po fails | 08:23 |
| froud | I cant find out why | 08:23 |
| froud | can you test make-pot | 08:23 |
| Burgundavia | yep | 08:23 |
| froud | can you debug make-po | 08:23 |
| Burgundavia | np | 08:23 |
| Burgundavia | I can try | 08:23 |
| jsgotangco | froud: the patch is for about-ubuntu-tl.xml | 08:23 |
| jsgotangco | not it | 08:23 |
| froud | jsgotangco: AH | 08:24 |
| froud | Thanks | 08:24 |
| jsgotangco | my working copy is now valid and well-formed | 08:24 |
| Burgundavia | http://images.linspire.com/quickstartfive-0/QuickStart5.0-online5.pdf | 08:25 |
| Burgundavia | take a check at that | 08:25 |
| Burgundavia | very markety-driven, but some nice stuff | 08:25 |
| jsgotangco | ohhh | 08:26 |
| froud | Burgundavia: yes, we need this in our USer Guide | 08:26 |
| jsgotangco | ya linspire has some pretty good marketing indeed | 08:26 |
| froud | jsgotangco: when you make patches try keep the same filename only add a .diff | 08:27 |
| jsgotangco | ahh | 08:27 |
| froud | it was my fault for not checking | 08:27 |
| froud | but I just woke up | 08:27 |
| jsgotangco | hehe thats what i guessed *grin* | 08:27 |
| Burgundavia | ok, so I don't need to do anything? | 08:28 |
| froud | Burgundavia: no the scripts are still need testing and debug | 08:29 |
| Burgundavia | ok | 08:29 |
| Burgundavia | will do | 08:29 |
| froud | Burgundavia: svn up and look at them in trunk | 08:29 |
| Burgundavia | I will | 08:29 |
| froud | Thanks | 08:29 |
| jsgotangco | oh nice scripts | 08:33 |
| froud | jsgotangco: glad you like them | 08:34 |
| froud | jsgotangco: if you are good with shell you can test make-pot | 08:34 |
| jsgotangco | yes i tried them out just now | 08:34 |
| froud | jsgotangco: I have problems with make-po | 08:34 |
| froud | well guys coffee is finsihed and the day starts. Must go | 08:35 |
| froud | c ya later | 08:35 |
| jsgotangco | cya | 08:35 |
| === froud is now known as froud-away | ||
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| jsgotangco | urrrkk my OOo2 fonts are screwed | 09:02 |
| Burgundavia | I installed mscore fonts. I am regretting it | 09:02 |
| Burgundavia | it borked my system fonts | 09:02 |
| jsgotangco | hmm | 09:02 |
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| enrico | hello! | 09:23 |
| Burgundavia | salut | 09:23 |
| enrico | I'm online again for a bit. Any urgent things for Hoary release? | 09:23 |
| Burgundavia | check out froud make-po and make-pot scripts | 09:24 |
| === Kinnison [~dsilvers@haddenham.pepperfish.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| Kinnison | Morning | 09:25 |
| Burgundavia | salut Kinnison, long time no talk | 09:26 |
| === Kinnison nods | ||
| Kinnison | Been busy | 09:26 |
| === Kinnison has 2Mbit ADSL now :-) | ||
| === Kinnison bounces | ||
| Burgundavia | cool | 09:27 |
| === Kinnison tests it by refreshing his ubuntu mirror | ||
| Burgundavia | spent 12 hours building a new machine for my brother and setting up XP on it | 09:27 |
| Burgundavia | I have almost converted him | 09:27 |
| Kinnison | Heh | 09:28 |
| Burgundavia | 2 hours looking for a license key | 09:28 |
| Burgundavia | 2 hours installing, removing and reinstalling SP2 | 09:28 |
| Burgundavia | and when I left we hadn't set up most of his apps | 09:29 |
| enrico | Burgundavia: anything urgent? | 09:29 |
| jsgotangco | hi | 09:29 |
| Burgundavia | enrico: froud asked me to check out those 2 shell scripts | 09:29 |
| Burgundavia | enrico: more translating work | 09:29 |
| enrico | Do I understand that translation work is not urgent for Hoary, but will go out in language packs later? | 09:37 |
| Burgundavia | no idea | 09:37 |
| Burgundavia | not in on that | 09:37 |
| enrico | AFAIUnderstand, but I can be wrong, the current packages are not too bad (excluding translations) and I wouldn't like to break stuff by uploading radically different (and less tested) things with translation updates if it's not needed, considering that we're 2 days to release and I'm seldom online | 09:37 |
| Burgundavia | ok | 09:38 |
| Burgundavia | I haven't done much with the doc team recently | 09:38 |
| Burgundavia | expect to start next weekend | 09:38 |
| enrico | ok, thanks | 09:39 |
| Kinnison | Burgundavia: as soon as hoary's out the door? :-) | 09:43 |
| Burgundavia | yeppers | 09:43 |
| Kinnison | sneaky :-) | 09:45 |
| Burgundavia | sneaky? | 09:45 |
| Burgundavia | I don't have any experience with po files | 09:45 |
| Burgundavia | so I think I would get in the way | 09:45 |
| === Kinnison grins | ||
| enrico | Kinnison: are translations supposed to get out in two days or later with language packs? | 09:46 |
| enrico | Kinnison: and BTW, what's a language pack? | 09:46 |
| Kinnison | enrico: not a clue (on both counts) | 09:48 |
| === Kinnison isn't an Ubuntu team member | ||
| enrico | ok | 09:49 |
| jsgotangco | i think the translated xml files should be tested thoroughly because i've patched one today which was malformed | 09:55 |
| jsgotangco | probably a po conversion thing | 09:55 |
| jsgotangco | bye bye | 12:20 |
| mdke | hi all | 12:41 |
| mdke | can anything be done about the wiki? | 12:42 |
| Kinnison | how do you mean? | 12:42 |
| mdke | hi Kinnison | 12:42 |
| mdke | well that business about it being reverted back to a few days ago | 12:43 |
| mdke | i would say about 10 pages have been lost | 12:43 |
| mdke | and 200 changes ;) | 12:43 |
| Kinnison | Oh right | 12:43 |
| Kinnison | dunno about that :-) | 12:43 |
| mdke | enrico: Do I understand that translation work is not urgent for Hoary, but will go out in language packs later? | 12:50 |
| mdke | there is a difficult question to resolve about whether the translations are to be packaged from our sources or from rosetta | 12:51 |
| enrico | mdke: I don't have it clear either | 12:53 |
| enrico | I'll try to package what we have now (wonder how I'll find the time) | 12:53 |
| enrico | then we'll all see and learn :) | 12:53 |
| === froud-away is now known as froud | ||
| mdke | enrico, ok :) | 12:55 |
| mdke | enrico, the problem is that we started doing translations and committing them in svn | 12:55 |
| mdke | and rosetta suddely came up at the end of last week | 12:56 |
| mdke | with a million crappy bugs | 12:56 |
| froud | African Greetings | 12:56 |
| mdke | hi froud | 12:57 |
| mdke | :)) | 12:57 |
| froud | Hi | 12:57 |
| froud | enrico: di dyou get my message | 12:57 |
| enrico | hi !! | 12:57 |
| enrico | froud: just got it | 12:57 |
| enrico | and read it | 12:57 |
| froud | OK | 12:57 |
| froud | we tagged in tags/ | 12:57 |
| froud | ubuntu-doc0.4 | 12:57 |
| froud | few updates made to the en docs | 12:58 |
| froud | since tagging | 12:58 |
| froud | i18n stuff roles in | 12:58 |
| enrico | froud: someone told me that the .po shouldn't be installed, but the resulting xmls should | 12:58 |
| froud | true | 12:58 |
| froud | the po are internal | 12:58 |
| mdke | yeh | 12:58 |
| mdke | but i am slightly concerned that if they get translated in rosetta too, they will be packaged there as well, and clash with ours | 12:59 |
| froud | I am holding on making heavy process env changes | 12:59 |
| froud | claude is working with us on that | 12:59 |
| froud | we just use the po files to create xml | 01:00 |
| froud | as the system now stands it will package in the same way as before | 01:00 |
| froud | this excludes lang for now | 01:00 |
| froud | we can opt to make packages for langs | 01:01 |
| froud | or not | 01:01 |
| enrico | I'm trying to finish one work, then I'll get to the ubuntu-docs | 01:01 |
| froud | sure | 01:01 |
| froud | I have scripted the pot creating process | 01:01 |
| froud | see make-pot | 01:01 |
| froud | I am trying to script the po2xml process | 01:02 |
| froud | broken script is in svn see make-po | 01:02 |
| froud | claude and I worked out solution to transform all langs | 01:02 |
| froud | have not implimented yet | 01:03 |
| froud | waiting post hoary | 01:03 |
| froud | needs svn restructure | 01:03 |
| mdke | someone should have a word with the rosetta people tho and work out the relationship between the two things | 01:03 |
| mdke | imo | 01:03 |
| froud | we give them pot | 01:03 |
| froud | they give po into rosetta and to us | 01:03 |
| froud | we transform po to xml | 01:04 |
| froud | we transform lang-xml to lang-html | 01:04 |
| froud | the package can either happen here or thier | 01:04 |
| mdke | but imo it should not happen in both | 01:04 |
| mdke | also because things get translated twice | 01:04 |
| froud | if we have pot and po then we can update pot and po so saving translation time | 01:05 |
| froud | e.g | 01:05 |
| froud | we edit releasenotes | 01:05 |
| froud | we msmerge to pot | 01:05 |
| froud | we merge the changes in pot to the po files | 01:05 |
| froud | translators get po file 90% translated and work only on the changes | 01:06 |
| mdke | yeah | 01:06 |
| mdke | then imo it is wise to remove the (2 copies of) release notes from rosetta | 01:06 |
| froud | we can seak to daff about automation between us and rosetta | 01:06 |
| mdke | ok | 01:06 |
| enrico | sure, that's how it works | 01:06 |
| mdke | that's all i'm saying | 01:07 |
| froud | we have the following interactions | 01:07 |
| mdke | i'm the docs are going to be translated in our tree, they shouldn't go to rosetta too, it is counterproductive | 01:07 |
| froud | we need to give pot and any changes | 01:07 |
| === dannemare [~konversat@0x5358aaae.abnxx12.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| mdke | hi dannemare | 01:07 |
| froud | we need to give po changes | 01:07 |
| froud | how do translators make xml and packages | 01:09 |
| mdke | froud, i don't follow you. You are suggesting getting people to translate doc team docs both in and outside of rosetta? | 01:09 |
| froud | mdke: no it is collaborative | 01:09 |
| froud | we send pot | 01:09 |
| froud | they send po from rosetta | 01:09 |
| mdke | ok so just inside | 01:09 |
| mdke | phew | 01:09 |
| froud | thing is after the first translation | 01:10 |
| froud | we must care that they dont need to translate over and again | 01:10 |
| mdke | quite | 01:10 |
| froud | so me manage merges | 01:10 |
| froud | and push the diff into rosetta | 01:10 |
| mdke | well good luck | 01:10 |
| froud | when they finish the translation of the diff they send us back the po | 01:11 |
| froud | the po also still resides in rosetta | 01:11 |
| mdke | ideally i suppose it would be best to have an earlier freeze of documents | 01:11 |
| froud | but since the primary lang is en it makes sense for us to drive | 01:11 |
| mdke | so that no further changes are made | 01:11 |
| froud | yes this is the idea, but coordination is still rough | 01:12 |
| mdke | yeah | 01:12 |
| mdke | and it is crazy that there are two copies of releasenotes and aboutubuntu in rosetta | 01:12 |
| mdke | not sure why that happened | 01:12 |
| mdke | anyway | 01:12 |
| froud | I cant control what happens there | 01:13 |
| mdke | what is the distinction you're making between .pot and .po files? | 01:13 |
| froud | To me it must be a black box to us | 01:13 |
| froud | pot is the template | 01:13 |
| froud | translators make copies of the pot and save as po | 01:13 |
| froud | each translates to a different lang | 01:13 |
| mdke | so just for clarity's sake? | 01:13 |
| mdke | there is nothing actually different about the file format? | 01:14 |
| froud | no really | 01:14 |
| mdke | ok | 01:14 |
| froud | enrico: do we package or do they | 01:14 |
| mdke | lol | 01:14 |
| enrico | I guess we do | 01:15 |
| enrico | .debs always have inside their translations | 01:15 |
| enrico | then (special for Ubuntu) they'll automatically extract the translated stuff and make "language packs" out of that | 01:15 |
| froud | enrico: and how do the documents get into the user desktop | 01:15 |
| enrico | but the translations are in the packages | 01:15 |
| froud | ok for now I have files together in the same dir | 01:16 |
| froud | so all aboutubuntu is in aboutubuntu/ | 01:16 |
| froud | ls | 01:16 |
| froud | about-ubuntu-ca.po about-ubuntu-fr.xml about-ubuntu.pot about-ubuntu-tl.po about-ubuntu-xh.xml | 01:16 |
| froud | about-ubuntu-ca.xml about-ubuntu-it.po about-ubuntu-pt.po about-ubuntu-tl.xml about-ubuntu.xml | 01:16 |
| froud | about-ubuntu-fr.po about-ubuntu-it.xml about-ubuntu-pt.xml about-ubuntu-xh.po | 01:16 |
| froud | for the entities to work they must be packaged in the same way we did the en docs | 01:17 |
| froud | soon we will have global-lang.net for each lang | 01:17 |
| mdke | german is being done in rosetta | 01:17 |
| mdke | twice | 01:18 |
| froud | and things like menus will also be translated | 01:18 |
| mdke | because of the duplicates | 01:18 |
| froud | mdke: I cant help them there | 01:18 |
| froud | mdke: all I can do is manage our domain | 01:18 |
| mdke | yeah i know | 01:18 |
| === enrico has still a couple of bugs to fix | ||
| enrico | I'll be active in an hour or so | 01:19 |
| mdke | we will not get the po files until someone speaks to daff about it tho i think | 01:19 |
| froud | I tought claude was speaking to them | 01:19 |
| froud | Somebody at Rosetta needs a wc of our svn | 01:20 |
| mdke | bah | 01:20 |
| froud | then they can patch and get our updates to pots and pos | 01:20 |
| mdke | didn't they speak to us before thinking of inserting our documents into rosetta? | 01:20 |
| mdke | i'll email | 01:20 |
| froud | is there an IRC channel | 01:20 |
| froud | enrico: is there an IRC channel | 01:20 |
| enrico | for what? | 01:21 |
| mdke | #canonical? :p | 01:21 |
| froud | i18n | 01:21 |
| enrico | #ubuntu-dev, I'd say | 01:21 |
| mdke | el | 01:21 |
| froud | what is daff's nick | 01:21 |
| enrico | daf | 01:23 |
| mdke | yeah | 01:23 |
| froud | no daff there | 01:23 |
| enrico | "daf" | 01:24 |
| mdke | * [daf] (daf@muse.19inch.net): Dafydd | 01:24 |
| mdke | * [daf] irc.freenode.net :http://freenode.net/ | 01:24 |
| mdke | * [daf] is away (teithio) | 01:24 |
| mdke | * [daf] is an identified user | 01:24 |
| mdke | * [daf] idle 00:37:31, signon: Tue Mar 29 10:23:56 | 01:24 |
| mdke | * [daf] End of WHOIS list. | 01:24 |
| mdke | might be him | 01:24 |
| enrico | That's it | 01:24 |
| mdke | not on any channel | 01:24 |
| froud | who else to speak to | 01:25 |
| mdke | sabfdl | 01:25 |
| mdke | ? | 01:25 |
| enrico | no | 01:25 |
| enrico | seb128 is another one | 01:25 |
| mdke | he intervenes on the rosetta list from time to time | 01:25 |
| === froud does not touch sabfdl unless he has to | ||
| mdke | heh | 01:25 |
| mdke | i would just go for daf | 01:25 |
| mdke | i'm gonna email just in case | 01:26 |
| === seb128 [~seb128@ANancy-151-1-30-154.w83-196.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| seb128 | hi | 01:28 |
| mdke | ciao | 01:28 |
| froud | seb128: hi | 01:28 |
| froud | seb128: we need to discuss interaction | 01:29 |
| froud | between us and rosetta | 01:29 |
| froud | can you help | 01:29 |
| seb128 | not really | 01:29 |
| froud | is it only daff who can help | 01:29 |
| seb128 | you probably want to speak with carlos/pitti for that | 01:29 |
| mdke | have emailed daf | 01:29 |
| mdke | asked him to get in touch with you, froud | 01:30 |
| mdke | or enrico | 01:30 |
| froud | mdke: thank | 01:30 |
| === pitti [~martin@box79162.elkhouse.de] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| froud | seb128: ok thanks | 01:30 |
| pitti | Hi everybody | 01:30 |
| froud | hi | 01:30 |
| seb128 | hey pitti :) | 01:30 |
| mdke | hi pitti | 01:30 |
| froud | pitti we need to discuss interaction between docteam and rosetta | 01:31 |
| froud | can you help | 01:31 |
| pitti | hmm, I'm not really a Rosetta dude, but what's the particular question? | 01:31 |
| pitti | I ping carlos | 01:31 |
| froud | pitti: hang with me while I explain this | 01:31 |
| mdke | i'm going for a shower | 01:32 |
| froud | we write docs in en | 01:32 |
| froud | we make pot files | 01:32 |
| froud | we send pot to i18n teams | 01:32 |
| froud | we get back po file | 01:32 |
| froud | we make xml-lang from po files | 01:32 |
| pitti | sounds great | 01:32 |
| froud | xml-en pot po and xml-lang are in svn | 01:32 |
| froud | when we make changes in en we merge through to pot and po files | 01:33 |
| froud | and cycle starts again | 01:33 |
| froud | we need somebody in Rosetta who has wc of our svn | 01:33 |
| froud | this way they can manage to addition/update of any pot/po files in rosetta | 01:34 |
| froud | and patch back to us | 01:34 |
| pitti | wc = write capability? | 01:34 |
| froud | how can we get this kind of process | 01:34 |
| froud | pitti: working copy of svn | 01:34 |
| pitti | ah | 01:34 |
| froud | we can give commit account | 01:34 |
| froud | + | 01:35 |
| froud | we need to arrange packaging | 01:35 |
| froud | lang packs | 01:35 |
| pitti | hmm, so at least Rosetta should automatically import your svn | 01:35 |
| froud | not all | 01:35 |
| froud | only changes | 01:35 |
| froud | and xml is not required in rosetta | 01:36 |
| pitti | lang packs> you mean, add the per-language docs as dependencies of language-support-LANG? | 01:36 |
| froud | here is a ls of the aboutubuntu dir in svn | 01:36 |
| froud | ls | 01:36 |
| froud | about-ubuntu-ca.po about-ubuntu-fr.xml about-ubuntu.pot about-ubuntu-tl.po about-ubuntu-xh.xml | 01:36 |
| froud | about-ubuntu-ca.xml about-ubuntu-it.po about-ubuntu-pt.po about-ubuntu-tl.xml about-ubuntu.xml | 01:36 |
| froud | about-ubuntu-fr.po about-ubuntu-it.xml about-ubuntu-pt.xml about-ubuntu-xh.po | 01:36 |
| froud | Yes I french use needs to see about-ubuntu-fr.xml | 01:37 |
| === dannemare [~konversat@0x5358aaae.abnxx12.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk] has left #ubuntu-doc ["Konversation] | ||
| froud | s/I/a/ | 01:37 |
| pitti | oh, you mean the xml files are not packaged in a deb right now? | 01:37 |
| seb128 | speaking about than, somebody has planned to fix the package for hoary ? | 01:38 |
| froud | s/use/user | 01:38 |
| froud | seb128: maybe enrico | 01:38 |
| pitti | froud: right now langpack-o-matic can't put anything else than po files into language packs | 01:38 |
| seb128 | froud: no, not enrico | 01:38 |
| seb128 | I've spoken with him this morning | 01:38 |
| seb128 | he's away until the 8th and we want that before the 6th | 01:39 |
| enrico | seb128: I can try to do something this a'noon | 01:39 |
| froud | pitti: any requirements we need to adhere to in order to provide support to this | 01:39 |
| enrico | although I can't guarantee how it turns out | 01:39 |
| pitti | froud: the xml files are not shipped at all right now? | 01:39 |
| seb128 | enrico: I'll do it tomorrow if nobody else do it, let me know | 01:39 |
| froud | You need just HTML | 01:39 |
| seb128 | pitti: no, the package is b0rked atm | 01:39 |
| seb128 | there is some random po in the wrong directory which doesn't work | 01:40 |
| pitti | seb128: yeah, but in principle there is a package for these? | 01:40 |
| seb128 | ubuntu-doc | 01:40 |
| froud | ubuntu-doc has all the files | 01:40 |
| froud | no HTML though | 01:40 |
| seb128 | there is no need of html files, is it ? | 01:41 |
| seb128 | the xml files are enough | 01:41 |
| froud | if under yelp yes | 01:41 |
| froud | in not no | 01:41 |
| seb128 | yelp use xml files | 01:41 |
| froud | About Ubuntu is HTML | 01:41 |
| froud | Not Under Yelp | 01:41 |
| seb128 | oh, the start-page for firefox you mean | 01:42 |
| froud | Release NOtes is xml under yelp | 01:42 |
| froud | Anything GNOME is Yelp | 01:42 |
| seb128 | right | 01:42 |
| froud | Anything Generic is not | 01:42 |
| seb128 | speaking about "about-ubuntu" | 01:42 |
| seb128 | the main page has no title | 01:42 |
| seb128 | is that know ? | 01:42 |
| seb128 | ie: the line is empty for the index | 01:42 |
| froud | Hmm aboutubuntu is loading in yelp | 01:43 |
| froud | seb128: yes known problem | 01:43 |
| seb128 | k | 01:43 |
| seb128 | yep, about-ubuntu is an xml file for yelp | 01:43 |
| froud | new version of yelp dont know what to do when image in title | 01:44 |
| froud | OK, so anyting loading under Yelp needs only XML | 01:44 |
| froud | but we get away from th epoint | 01:44 |
| froud | how to get language specific files to show | 01:44 |
| froud | if I am using Xhosa I want about ubuntu is Xhosa | 01:45 |
| seb128 | /usr/share/gnome/help/about-ubuntu/nn/about-ubuntu.xml | 01:45 |
| seb128 | where nn is the locale to use | 01:45 |
| seb128 | just copy the translation for nn here | 01:45 |
| froud | this will break our system at present | 01:45 |
| froud | we currently have no support for the nn | 01:45 |
| seb128 | but that's the way it works | 01:46 |
| froud | post hoary we will | 01:46 |
| seb128 | we can workaround that for hoary | 01:46 |
| pitti | uh, that sounds a bit scary, as if we could not properly integrate this by hoary | 01:46 |
| seb128 | ie: change the package to copy them to right place | 01:46 |
| seb128 | pitti: we can just hack debian/rules for hoary | 01:46 |
| pitti | yeah | 01:46 |
| froud | seb128: providing that all files remain in the same folder as the en document it will work | 01:46 |
| froud | ls | 01:46 |
| froud | about-ubuntu-ca.po about-ubuntu-fr.xml about-ubuntu.pot about-ubuntu-tl.po about-ubuntu-xh.xml | 01:46 |
| froud | about-ubuntu-ca.xml about-ubuntu-it.po about-ubuntu-pt.po about-ubuntu-tl.xml about-ubuntu.xml | 01:46 |
| froud | about-ubuntu-fr.po about-ubuntu-it.xml about-ubuntu-pt.xml about-ubuntu-xh.po | 01:46 |
| froud | seb128: I must go fetch my son from school | 01:47 |
| froud | brb | 01:47 |
| seb128 | later | 01:47 |
| pitti | so ubuntu-doc must just be tweaked to put the files into the right place? | 01:47 |
| seb128 | that's my view of the issue | 01:47 |
| froud | pitti: no ubuntu-doc puts them in the righ place | 01:47 |
| seb128 | yelp will look to /usr/share/gnome/help/about-ubuntu/nn/about-ubuntu.xml afaik | 01:47 |
| froud | but it is not according to the convention of nn | 01:48 |
| pitti | hmm, I can't find ubuntu-doc in the archive | 01:48 |
| seb128 | plural | 01:48 |
| pitti | ah, sorry | 01:48 |
| pitti | froud: AFAICS there are no per-language debs | 01:48 |
| seb128 | no, there is not | 01:49 |
| pitti | froud: so there's no point in integrating this with langpacks | 01:49 |
| mdke | but it should be noted that there is a german translation going on in rosetta. If you decide to package it with ubuntu-docs, we need to get hold of that | 01:50 |
| seb128 | pitti: I don't know, but we could ship /usr/share/gnome/help/about-ubuntu/nn/about-ubuntu.xml with language-pack-nn | 01:51 |
| pitti | seb128: yeah, but this requires major design changes in langpack-o-matic :-/ | 01:51 |
| seb128 | k | 01:51 |
| pitti | sb should have told me earlier | 01:51 |
| seb128 | so let's just hack ubuntu-docs for hoary | 01:51 |
| pitti | seb128, froud: can we just ship all translations in one deb for hoary? | 01:51 |
| pitti | how big are they? | 01:51 |
| seb128 | 7,7K 2005-03-26 22:45 about-ubuntu.xml | 01:52 |
| seb128 | 178K 2005-03-25 06:06 quickguide.xml | 01:52 |
| seb128 | 29K 2005-03-19 00:02 release-notes.xml | 01:52 |
| seb128 | Package: ubuntu-docs | 01:53 |
| seb128 | Size: 278202 | 01:53 |
| seb128 | atm | 01:53 |
| mdke | plus the languages | 01:53 |
| pitti | so, 270 KB times #translations? | 01:53 |
| seb128 | yeah | 01:53 |
| seb128 | right | 01:53 |
| pitti | that doesn't sound too bad | 01:54 |
| pitti | for hoary | 01:54 |
| mdke | ok | 01:54 |
| mdke | how can we get hold of the german translation in rosetta and make an xml? | 01:54 |
| pitti | mdke: you can download the po files | 01:54 |
| mdke | right | 01:54 |
| pitti | mdke: please talk with carlos, he can make provisions that it can be done automatically | 01:55 |
| mdke | i've emailed daf and i can talk to the german users | 01:55 |
| mdke | is carlos here? | 01:55 |
| pitti | mdke: I pinged him and invited him | 01:55 |
| mdke | right | 01:55 |
| pitti | no response so far, he's away ATM | 01:55 |
| mdke | k | 01:55 |
| mdke | when do you need em for packaging? | 01:55 |
| seb128 | today | 01:56 |
| mdke | shit | 01:56 |
| mdke | ok i'll chase up an italian one too | 01:56 |
| seb128 | $ ls aboutubuntu/*.xml | 01:56 |
| seb128 | aboutubuntu/about-ubuntu-ca.xml aboutubuntu/about-ubuntu-tl.xml | 01:56 |
| seb128 | aboutubuntu/about-ubuntu-fr.xml aboutubuntu/about-ubuntu-xh.xml | 01:56 |
| seb128 | aboutubuntu/about-ubuntu-it.xml aboutubuntu/about-ubuntu.xml | 01:56 |
| seb128 | aboutubuntu/about-ubuntu-pt.xml | 01:56 |
| seb128 | 01:56 | |
| seb128 | the SVN has that atm | 01:56 |
| mdke | yeah not releasenotes tho | 01:56 |
| seb128 | the about-ubuntu is the visible part | 01:57 |
| seb128 | ie: the panel entry "About Ubuntu" | 01:57 |
| mdke | so will you be packaging releasenotes with it or just aboutubuntu? | 01:58 |
| mdke | seb128, ^ | 01:59 |
| froud | seb128: do we need omf files for the language specific docs | 02:01 |
| seb128 | I don't know | 02:01 |
| seb128 | I just know than copying the xml translation to /usr/share/gnome/help/about-ubuntu/nn/about-ubuntu.xml works | 02:01 |
| froud | as I understand to get the en doc to show in yelp we must register it with scrollkeeper | 02:02 |
| froud | not sure if we need the same for nn | 02:02 |
| froud | Ok have a meeting. Somebody post to the list what is being done and who is doing what, please :-) | 02:03 |
| froud | we have no reports lately | 02:03 |
| === seb128 [~seb128@ANancy-151-1-30-154.w83-196.abo.wanadoo.fr] has left #ubuntu-doc ["I] | ||
| === seb128 [~seb128@ANancy-151-1-30-154.w83-196.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| seb128 | you can try to copy the xml file to nn/about-ubuntu.xml | 02:05 |
| mdke | i am emailing carlos to ask about the german docs, so am i just asking for about-ubuntu or both? | 02:06 |
| seb128 | whatever you want | 02:06 |
| mdke | :( | 02:06 |
| seb128 | ? | 02:06 |
| mdke | if you tell me what you are packaging i will ask for them | 02:07 |
| seb128 | we are packaging what is available when we do the package | 02:08 |
| mdke | ok | 02:08 |
| seb128 | but we don't force you to do anything | 02:08 |
| seb128 | you do whatever you want | 02:08 |
| mdke | whoa | 02:08 |
| mdke | i'm just trying to help | 02:08 |
| seb128 | so what's the problem ? | 02:08 |
| mdke | i wasn't sure what you were gonna package | 02:08 |
| seb128 | all the files are to translate | 02:08 |
| seb128 | we use what is translated | 02:09 |
| mdke | ok ty | 02:09 |
| seb128 | np | 02:10 |
| pitti | carlos is back | 02:10 |
| pitti | darn, now froud is away *sigh* | 02:10 |
| === carlos [~carlos@69.Red-80-33-181.pooles.rima-tde.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| carlos | hi | 02:11 |
| pitti | Hi carlos | 02:11 |
| seb128 | ah ah, carlos doing translation on a non-working day | 02:11 |
| seb128 | I knew it :p | 02:11 |
| carlos | pitti: tell me | 02:11 |
| seb128 | hey carlos :) | 02:11 |
| pitti | fround has some quesitons wrt rosetta integration of ubuntu-docs | 02:11 |
| pitti | carlos: unfortunately fround is away now | 02:11 |
| pitti | carlos: oh, you have holiday today? sorry for disturbing | 02:11 |
| carlos | seb128: well, I'm not working, just come back from the airport, and saw the martin's ping :-P | 02:11 |
| seb128 | what do you do to the airport ? | 02:12 |
| mdke | hi carlos | 02:12 |
| carlos | pitti: don't worry | 02:12 |
| carlos | I'm taking an eye in Rosetta today | 02:12 |
| carlos | because Daf is traveling | 02:12 |
| carlos | seb128: daf left Valencia | 02:12 |
| carlos | mdke: hi | 02:12 |
| mdke | carlos, i just sent you an email :) | 02:12 |
| seb128 | carlos: oh, k | 02:12 |
| carlos | mdke: ok | 02:13 |
| mdke | the discussion concerns packaging of the docteam documents and translations | 02:14 |
| mdke | pitti and seb128 have offered to package them separately for hoary | 02:14 |
| pitti | erm, separately for breezy, that is | 02:14 |
| mdke | ?? | 02:14 |
| mdke | mdke when do you need em for packaging? | 02:14 |
| mdke | seb128 today | 02:14 |
| carlos | package what separately? | 02:14 |
| carlos | every translation in a different package? | 02:15 |
| mdke | i don't know | 02:15 |
| pitti | yeah | 02:15 |
| pitti | carlos: at least that was what I understood | 02:15 |
| pitti | carlos: then we can integrate that into language-support-* | 02:15 |
| carlos | If you are going to use .po files as the way to translate documentation, I think you should create a package with the english sources that creates the .pot file with a rule and another rule to get the .po file and create the translated docbook file | 02:16 |
| mdke | i'm gonna leave you guys to it | 02:16 |
| mdke | seems like i haven't understood what's going on | 02:16 |
| mdke | as long as you know some translations are in rosetta, some are in docteam svn | 02:17 |
| carlos | mdke: the point is that or you use Rosetta or you use svn | 02:18 |
| carlos | if you are going to use .po files | 02:18 |
| carlos | Rosetta should be mandatory | 02:18 |
| carlos | you don't need to translate with rosetta if you don't want | 02:18 |
| carlos | but you should get and submit the translations with rosetta | 02:18 |
| mdke | brb | 02:18 |
| carlos | if you choose a mis model, you will get out of sync easily | 02:18 |
| mdke | phone | 02:18 |
| carlos | as this is not urgent, could we talk about it tomorrow? | 02:19 |
| carlos | I'm on holidays today | 02:20 |
| carlos | and need to recharge my batteries | 02:21 |
| === carlos goes to have lunch | ||
| mdke | carlos, whatever you prefer. But seb128 said he wanted the documents today | 02:25 |
| mdke | and the mixed system was not intentional | 02:25 |
| mdke | it occured because we were submitting translations to svn, and then they suddenly appeared in rosetta too | 02:26 |
| mdke | it is fine to work out a system using only rosetta for breezy, but I think we should try and get as many translations into hoary as possible | 02:26 |
| mdke | ok i'm off too now | 02:26 |
| === froud-away is now known as froud | ||
| froud | carlos: | 02:31 |
| froud | carlos: when you get back ping me I will explain | 02:31 |
| pitti | froud: seems you two have a talent for missing each other... | 02:49 |
| froud | pitti: he's at lunch and still tuned so there is hope yet :-) | 02:50 |
| === froud [~froud@ndn-165-146-40.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| === enrico is here | ||
| enrico | sooo | 03:04 |
| enrico | what is that generates the translated xml files? | 03:05 |
| mdke | froud does it with po2xml i think | 03:05 |
| mdke | but i think he is making a script | 03:05 |
| froud | enrico: po2xml but my script make-po does not work :-( | 03:05 |
| froud | enrico: but the make-pot works well | 03:06 |
| enrico | let's debug that | 03:06 |
| froud | enrico: perhaps you can look at it | 03:06 |
| froud | you have more skill with shell script than I | 03:06 |
| froud | the general idea of the process is encapuslated by the code | 03:06 |
| froud | but consider this | 03:06 |
| enrico | bash arrays... cool! | 03:06 |
| enrico | never used that | 03:06 |
| froud | we get po | 03:07 |
| froud | you dont have too use the array if you dont want | 03:07 |
| froud | you can just use a pain for loop if you wish | 03:07 |
| froud | look at make-pot | 03:08 |
| froud | then model make-po on it | 03:08 |
| enrico | what package is po2xml in? | 03:08 |
| froud | KDESDK | 03:08 |
| enrico | ok :) | 03:08 |
| froud | which po2xml | 03:09 |
| froud | /opt/kde3/bin/po2xml | 03:09 |
| enrico | poxml | 03:09 |
| enrico | apt-get install poxml | 03:09 |
| enrico | it's in there | 03:09 |
| froud | no that is gnome isnt it | 03:09 |
| froud | we use xml2pot and po2xml from kdesdk | 03:10 |
| froud | the gnome one is problematic | 03:10 |
| froud | a few of us tried it and it gave problems | 03:10 |
| enrico | oh :( | 03:10 |
| froud | also they are not compaible :-( | 03:10 |
| froud | enrico: the idea is that the creating and maintenance of POT and PO should be automatic | 03:11 |
| froud | as simple as saying make pot or make po | 03:11 |
| enrico | sure | 03:11 |
| froud | the scripts should look in any folder defined in modules=" " | 03:11 |
| enrico | apt-cache show poxml | 03:11 |
| mdke | froud, have got de docs | 03:12 |
| enrico | "This package is part of the KDE Software Development Kit." | 03:12 |
| mdke | :) | 03:12 |
| enrico | good, it's the right one | 03:12 |
| froud | enrico: yes | 03:12 |
| froud | mdke: great | 03:12 |
| froud | for testing I have limited the modules on which the scripts run | 03:13 |
| froud | once we are happy we can traverse the entire structure | 03:13 |
| froud | I am writing another script to do the menus | 03:13 |
| froud | seems that parser.cpp in xml2pot does not touch <menuchoice> elements | 03:14 |
| froud | this makes sense in context of large docs | 03:14 |
| froud | but is not good in our context | 03:14 |
| froud | as our menus are expanded from entities | 03:14 |
| froud | for processing we will also add a new entity to our DocType Decl | 03:15 |
| froud | we will have a global.ent and a global-nn.ent | 03:15 |
| froud | where nn = lang code | 03:15 |
| froud | stuff like conventions, legal notice and copyright | 03:16 |
| froud | translated once | 03:16 |
| froud | and the lang docs will pickup the correct version of these files from the global-nn.ent | 03:16 |
| mdke | froud, sent | 03:17 |
| froud | hope you understand all this | 03:17 |
| froud | mdke: thanks | 03:17 |
| === mdke sighs with relief and concentrates on his exam | ||
| froud | mdke: you stress too much dude ;-) | 03:18 |
| === mdke pops pills | ||
| mdke | its because I care | 03:18 |
| froud | trust the community, the power is there | 03:18 |
| mdke | people have put effort into the translations | 03:18 |
| froud | the force is tring with Ubuntu | 03:18 |
| mdke | heh | 03:18 |
| froud | strong | 03:18 |
| mdke | ok see you later | 03:19 |
| froud | ok | 03:19 |
| enrico | froud: how come you want to diff and patch the translated xml file instead of just overwriting it? | 03:19 |
| mdke | oh btw froud the german file may need testing as it was done with whatever old version of the .pot was uploaded to rosetta | 03:19 |
| froud | script is run on working copy | 03:20 |
| mdke | (enrico, can you moderate my mail to the list with the attachments pls) | 03:20 |
| enrico | mdke: Mary is doing moderation atm | 03:20 |
| mdke | damn | 03:20 |
| enrico | mdke: although I can do it | 03:20 |
| enrico | as well | 03:20 |
| mdke | will send them individually if you like | 03:20 |
| enrico | I just need to dig for the passwords | 03:20 |
| froud | we only want to commit diff | 03:21 |
| enrico | wait | 03:21 |
| enrico | commit diff? | 03:21 |
| enrico | why commit at all? | 03:21 |
| mdke | enrico, don't worry will send them separately | 03:21 |
| froud | must commit at some point. Not the diff file | 03:21 |
| enrico | I mean, one commits the original, the translated po-s and the rest is generated by the makefile | 03:21 |
| enrico | mdke: I'm moderating it in | 03:22 |
| froud | yes, but no saying how the structure of the new xml file is | 03:22 |
| enrico | so tell me if you intend to send them separated | 03:22 |
| froud | to patch in working copy first is safer, no? | 03:22 |
| mdke | enrico, too late i cancelled it | 03:22 |
| enrico | what's the problem with the xml file's structure? | 03:22 |
| enrico | mdke: ok | 03:22 |
| froud | the .new xml is created from th epo2xml right | 03:23 |
| froud | you have no way to see if it was good | 03:23 |
| froud | if you think it not needed, just cp the file | 03:24 |
| froud | or output directly over the existing file | 03:24 |
| froud | then ther eis no need for .new | 03:24 |
| froud | and diff process | 03:24 |
| enrico | but you do a patch with the untranslated one | 03:25 |
| froud | the .new file should be a translated file | 03:25 |
| froud | basically you want po2xml en-doc.xml nn-doc.po > nn-doc.xml | 03:26 |
| froud | got to fetch my daughters brb. | 03:27 |
| === froud is now known as froud-away | ||
| enrico | froud: committed fixed script | 03:27 |
| froud-away | does it work for you | 03:27 |
| froud-away | I will test it when I get back | 03:27 |
| enrico | works for me | 03:28 |
| enrico | ok, see you later | 03:28 |
| === claude [~Claude@157.26.3.165] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| claude | seb128: the quickguide in French is quite ready | 03:32 |
| seb128 | can you get it for the SVN ? | 03:32 |
| claude | maybe tonight ?? | 03:32 |
| seb128 | when you feel that's ready | 03:32 |
| seb128 | I'm quite busy, I've not read all the mails about it | 03:32 |
| claude | cmmh, can you wait until tonight before packaging ? | 03:33 |
| claude | it would be great that quickguide-fr being into Hoary at release time | 03:33 |
| seb128 | I'll package it tomorrow if enrico has not do that before | 03:33 |
| claude | k | 03:34 |
| enrico | seb128: I'm trying to figure out how it works | 03:34 |
| enrico | we don't have translated OMF files, either :( | 03:34 |
| === claude knows what it 'll do tonight :) | ||
| seb128 | enrico: are OMF useful ? | 03:34 |
| enrico | How do we get those? | 03:34 |
| seb128 | I don't have know what does the OMF files do | 03:34 |
| enrico | seb128: if you want to find the thing in yelp, yes | 03:34 |
| seb128 | s/have/even/ | 03:34 |
| seb128 | oh | 03:34 |
| seb128 | right | 03:35 |
| enrico | they're metadata used to register the documentation in scrollkeeper | 03:35 |
| seb128 | copying the xml to the right place works to open from the menu though | 03:35 |
| seb128 | no need of the OMF files | 03:35 |
| enrico | ok, good | 03:35 |
| enrico | very good | 03:35 |
| enrico | so, what's the right place? | 03:35 |
| seb128 | and I guess that people will use the "About Ubuntu" from the menu | 03:35 |
| seb128 | /usr/share/gnome/help/about-ubuntu/nn/about-ubuntu.xml | 03:36 |
| seb128 | for the "nn" translation | 03:36 |
| seb128 | and some for the other documents | 03:36 |
| seb128 | C/file.xml for english, nn/file.xml for the translations | 03:36 |
| claude | the problem may be common files | 03:37 |
| seb128 | like ? | 03:38 |
| claude | do they need to be duplicated for each translation ? | 03:38 |
| claude | like images (not translated for now | 03:38 |
| seb128 | yep | 03:38 |
| enrico | claude: yes, I'm doing quite a symlink farm | 03:43 |
| claude | ok, good | 03:43 |
| claude | some files will need symlinks other won't... | 03:43 |
| claude | will probably chnage over time | 03:44 |
| claude | for now, files in common are not translated | 03:44 |
| claude | but they should be | 03:44 |
| claude | if i understand, translated files from ubuntu-docs won't be in lang-packs, right ? | 03:45 |
| === froud-away is now known as froud | ||
| enrico | claude: no idea | 03:46 |
| froud | hi | 03:46 |
| enrico | froud: hi | 03:46 |
| enrico | froud: check the new script | 03:46 |
| froud | I will | 03:47 |
| enrico | note that the new Tagalog translations create a broken xml file | 03:47 |
| enrico | .tl | 03:47 |
| claude | should check the po file with msgfmt | 03:47 |
| froud | enrico: huh | 03:47 |
| claude | msgfmt -vc file.po | 03:47 |
| froud | yes | 03:47 |
| froud | yes | 03:47 |
| froud | enrico: it was not in my script | 03:47 |
| enrico | what does that do? | 03:48 |
| froud | checks the integrity of the po | 03:48 |
| claude | but that's not alwas sufficient | 03:48 |
| froud | sometimes they get wacked | 03:48 |
| claude | i had some problems with quickguide-fr that i needed to fix by hand | 03:49 |
| claude | msgfmt will not check that xml tags inside msgstrings are correct | 03:49 |
| froud | enrico: do we still need the PATH=${PATH}:/opt/kde3/bin/ | 03:50 |
| enrico | froud: no, it's not needed when the poxml file is installed | 03:50 |
| enrico | seb128: please checkout and build the package | 03:52 |
| froud | enrico: but now it will update all nn files even if they did not need updating | 03:52 |
| seb128 | enrico: k | 03:53 |
| froud | enrico: hence we have commits that are not needed | 03:53 |
| froud | enrico: did somebody to the de translation yet | 03:53 |
| froud | I sill dont have it in my mail | 03:54 |
| froud | seb128: should wait until we have the de | 03:54 |
| enrico | froud: not really, because if the contents of a file didn't change, then svn doesn't see the file as modified | 03:54 |
| enrico | seb128: try installing the package. I have the document in what seems to be the right place, but my italian yelp shows the document in english | 03:55 |
| froud | svn status still shows M | 03:56 |
| seb128 | how do you open it ? | 03:56 |
| froud | enrico: better not to copy over | 03:56 |
| enrico | seb128: yelp, then I follow the menus | 03:56 |
| froud | better to copy over only if changes | 03:56 |
| enrico | seb128: how do you open it? | 03:56 |
| seb128 | panel, about ubuntu | 03:57 |
| enrico | froud: here it shows M only for the ones that changed (that is, only Tagalog) | 03:57 |
| enrico | seb128: I don't run Hoary: what does that link? | 03:57 |
| froud | opens yelp about-ubuntu.xml | 03:57 |
| seb128 | yelp ghelp:about-ubuntu | 03:57 |
| froud | Looks in gnome scrollkeeper extensions | 03:58 |
| froud | for about-ubuntu | 03:58 |
| enrico | it's in English here | 03:58 |
| seb128 | here too | 03:58 |
| enrico | maybe I did something wrong with the packaging | 03:58 |
| froud | which is registere in scrollkeeper using omf | 03:58 |
| enrico | please tell me | 03:58 |
| seb128 | no no | 03:58 |
| seb128 | /usr/share/gnome/help/about-ubuntu/ca/about-ubuntu-ca.xml | 03:58 |
| seb128 | /usr/share/gnome/help/about-ubuntu/fr | 03:58 |
| seb128 | /usr/share/gnome/help/about-ubuntu/fr/about-ubuntu-fr.xml | 03:58 |
| seb128 | 03:58 | |
| seb128 | that's wrong | 03:58 |
| seb128 | nn/about-ubuntu.xml | 03:58 |
| seb128 | no "-nn" for the name | 03:59 |
| seb128 | that | 03:59 |
| seb128 | ups | 03:59 |
| froud | seb128: I can tell you that wont work | 03:59 |
| enrico | aaaah! Ok | 03:59 |
| seb128 | froud: works for me ... | 03:59 |
| froud | the file opens | 03:59 |
| enrico | let's see now... | 04:00 |
| seb128 | enrico: sudo cp /usr/share/gnome/help/about-ubuntu/it/about-ubuntu-it.xml /usr/share/gnome/help/about-ubuntu/it/about-ubuntu.xml | 04:00 |
| seb128 | should work | 04:00 |
| froud | how doe sit resilv ethe | 04:00 |
| froud | <!ENTITY % xinclude SYSTEM "../libs/xinclude.mod"> | 04:00 |
| froud | %xinclude; | 04:00 |
| froud | <!ENTITY % globalent SYSTEM "../libs/global.ent"> | 04:00 |
| froud | %globalent; | 04:00 |
| seb128 | I don't even what that is | 04:00 |
| seb128 | I just know that copying the translation xml to the right place works | 04:00 |
| claude | froud: these files have to be duplicated or symlinked | 04:01 |
| froud | seb128: do you see values for Benvinguts a Ubuntu Linux &distro-rev;: Versi &distro-version; | 04:01 |
| enrico | seb128: nicely Ttalian now | 04:01 |
| enrico | committing... | 04:01 |
| seb128 | froud: right, that works fine | 04:01 |
| enrico | committed | 04:02 |
| enrico | try that out (note the package version has changed) | 04:02 |
| froud | enrico: svn I cleaned make-po | 04:03 |
| froud | enrico: we need to handle invalid po files | 04:04 |
| froud | enrico: when you have the nn docs in nn/ do all the entities expand correctly | 04:05 |
| seb128 | enrico: great, works fine :) | 04:05 |
| enrico | froud: I don't konw about the entities | 04:08 |
| enrico | however, it's easy for you to check out | 04:08 |
| enrico | froud: as root, do dpkg-reconfigure locales and add a locale of your choice | 04:08 |
| enrico | froud: then, do: LANG=<locale of your choice> yelp ghelp:about-ubuntu | 04:08 |
| enrico | If we're all happy, I intend to upload this | 04:09 |
| enrico | so, in case I won't be online in the next days, at least something goes in | 04:09 |
| enrico | And if something happens (like new translations come it), someone else can update the things if I'm offline | 04:09 |
| claude | quickguide-fr will come tonight | 04:10 |
| enrico | uploaded. Better than before, hopefully will get even better | 04:16 |
| mdke | releasenotes-it coming tonight as well | 04:18 |
| enrico | wow! | 04:18 |
| mdke | claude, can't believe you've done quickguide, that is an immense achievement | 04:19 |
| claude | i didn't translate myself, work from ubuntu-fr | 04:19 |
| mdke | hmm | 04:19 |
| mdke | cool | 04:19 |
| claude | great guys :) | 04:19 |
| mdke | how did you distribute the work? | 04:19 |
| claude | nothing special, i merged different files by sdiff | 04:20 |
| claude | but i hope rosetta will help us for this | 04:20 |
| mdke | cool, so different people worked on different sections? | 04:20 |
| claude | yes | 04:20 |
| mdke | great | 04:20 |
| mdke | bien | 04:21 |
| claude | :) | 04:21 |
| froud | enrico: sorry reporter on the telephone | 04:26 |
| froud | enrico if you see the entities then it must work | 04:26 |
| froud | in about ubuntu you should see the revision number and the words Hoary Hedgehog in the first heading | 04:27 |
| enrico | they work! | 04:30 |
| enrico | froud: they work! | 04:30 |
| mdke | :)) | 04:30 |
| froud | cool | 04:30 |
| froud | ok now about make-po | 04:31 |
| froud | seems to work well | 04:31 |
| froud | but | 04:31 |
| froud | it would be better to overwrite only in cases where the file needs updating | 04:31 |
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| froud | also we should cleanup the unused files | 04:32 |
| froud | Hmm german entities dont validate | 04:32 |
| enrico | oh, yes. the cleanup is easy | 04:33 |
| mdke | damn | 04:33 |
| froud | I will have to incorporate German ents | 04:34 |
| mdke | do you want me to ping the translator? | 04:35 |
| mdke | (s) | 04:35 |
| froud | no | 04:35 |
| froud | no need | 04:35 |
| mdke | k | 04:35 |
| froud | enrico: we need to add a method to test for lang="nn" in make-po | 04:49 |
| froud | for example a german book should have <book lang="de"> | 04:50 |
| froud | for example a french book should have <book lang="fr"> | 04:50 |
| froud | etc | 04:50 |
| froud | we will also have to script for german docs some conditions | 04:50 |
| enrico | froud: then you want to switch to perl (or python) and spend a bit more time on it | 04:51 |
| froud | enrico: looks like we may need to but I dont perl or python | 04:52 |
| froud | I will try it with shell | 04:52 |
| froud | and sed | 04:52 |
| froud | it is mostly replacing entities like ä with the charcater number | 04:53 |
| froud | unicode number | 04:53 |
| froud | and I will do the testing for the lang | 04:53 |
| froud | Hmm this will be a cool script when it is done | 04:53 |
| froud | enrico: will you change so we only copy over files that have modifications | 04:54 |
| enrico | why not doing it with XSLT? | 04:54 |
| enrico | froud: is that needed now? | 04:54 |
| enrico | I'm back on doing something else | 04:54 |
| froud | not immediately | 04:54 |
| froud | I will check it | 04:54 |
| enrico | ok | 04:54 |
| enrico | ping me | 04:54 |
| froud | and see what I can do | 04:54 |
| froud | ok | 04:54 |
| enrico | if you don't see that coming | 04:54 |
| froud | perhaps I can do the replacements with xslt | 04:55 |
| froud | enrico: btw both those scripts are my first attempt at writing shell scripts | 04:55 |
| froud | not bad even if I say so myself | 04:55 |
| froud | Other scripts I have written have not been that comples | 04:56 |
| froud | complex | 04:56 |
| froud | lets see if carlos is there | 04:56 |
| froud | carlos: oing | 04:56 |
| enrico | froud: first attempo? not bad , not bad at all!! | 05:06 |
| claude | bbl | 05:32 |
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| carlos | froud: pong | 05:57 |
| froud | carlos: hi | 05:58 |
| froud | we finally meet' | 05:58 |
| carlos | but I'm a bit busy, so perhaps I will take sometime to answer | 05:58 |
| froud | hectic day | 05:58 |
| froud | we need to find a way to interact with Rosetta team | 05:58 |
| froud | can you help | 05:58 |
| froud | we = Ubuntu Doc Team | 05:58 |
| froud | perhaps we can automate or semi automate a process between the teams | 05:59 |
| froud | our process is as follows | 05:59 |
| froud | 1. we write doc.xml in en | 05:59 |
| froud | 2. we create doc.pot | 06:00 |
| froud | 3 we send doc.pot to i18n | 06:00 |
| froud | 4 we get back doc-nn.po | 06:00 |
| carlos | The new procedure should be: | 06:00 |
| carlos | 1. you write doc.xml in en | 06:00 |
| carlos | 2. you create doc.pot | 06:00 |
| froud | 5 we create doc-nn.xml | 06:00 |
| carlos | 3. you upload the .pot into Rosetta directly (not yet possible, will try to manage it this week) | 06:01 |
| carlos | 4. Translators update the translations using Rosetta | 06:01 |
| carlos | 5.- You get all translations from Rosetta | 06:01 |
| carlos | 6. you create doc-nn.xml from Rosetta's .po files | 06:01 |
| froud | great | 06:02 |
| froud | ok | 06:02 |
| froud | now | 06:02 |
| carlos | for that, I need an Ubuntu doc team created in launchpad | 06:02 |
| froud | when we make updates in doc.xml we merge changes into doc.po | 06:02 |
| carlos | with all people that should be able to upload .pot files into Rosetta as a member | 06:02 |
| froud | Ok | 06:02 |
| carlos | I can create the team | 06:02 |
| froud | Ok | 06:03 |
| carlos | but you should decide who is able to be a member | 06:03 |
| froud | i c | 06:03 |
| froud | can we not just script this | 06:03 |
| froud | I mean if we have an update it will automatically upload | 06:04 |
| carlos | yeah, is another option | 06:04 |
| froud | ok hold with me on this | 06:04 |
| carlos | something what we have atm with application translation | 06:04 |
| froud | when we make a changes in doc.xml | 06:05 |
| froud | we update our pot | 06:05 |
| froud | somehow it gets to rosetta | 06:05 |
| froud | but this is not good | 06:05 |
| froud | cause the required will may only be 1% | 06:05 |
| froud | and yet translators get all english in the pot | 06:06 |
| froud | once we have a po is it not better to merge changes into the po and send that | 06:06 |
| carlos | don't understand you.. | 06:06 |
| carlos | why is not good? | 06:06 |
| carlos | if you upload a new .pot file | 06:07 |
| froud | On first time we send pot. Good | 06:07 |
| carlos | a translator will get the merge for free by Rosetta | 06:07 |
| froud | on second time send updated pot | 06:07 |
| froud | OK | 06:07 |
| mdke | it might be cool to find a way to inform translators of an updated pot | 06:07 |
| carlos | the strings that were not changed will be still there with any translation they had already | 06:07 |
| froud | so we get back a PO and the translator only need focus on doing the changes :-) | 06:07 |
| carlos | and the new ones will appear as untranslated | 06:07 |
| === froud does not know how rosetta works | ||
| carlos | froud: well, the statistics tell you if there are new translations to do | 06:08 |
| mdke | oh | 06:08 |
| froud | Ok so we fire only pot files | 06:08 |
| mdke | cool | 06:08 |
| carlos | and in the future I suppose we could add a kind of email notification or so | 06:08 |
| froud | how do we get them back | 06:08 |
| mdke | manually | 06:09 |
| mdke | would be doable | 06:09 |
| === froud is loking for fire and forget here | ||
| mdke | if you can't find a way to automate it, I am happy to volunteer for that job | 06:09 |
| mdke | just lemme know | 06:09 |
| froud | mdke: you should be added to the group in rosetta | 06:10 |
| froud | as with claude and enrico | 06:10 |
| mdke | ok | 06:10 |
| carlos | atm, manually | 06:10 |
| froud | carlos explain how to autoupload | 06:10 |
| carlos | (to get the translations back) | 06:10 |
| carlos | the autoupload: | 06:10 |
| froud | carlos: ok | 06:10 |
| mdke | afk | 06:11 |
| carlos | the easier way is create a debian source package that has the pot and po files | 06:11 |
| carlos | and upload it into hoary | 06:11 |
| carlos | that's all | 06:11 |
| carlos | Rosetta will handle it as a normal software upload | 06:11 |
| carlos | like pmount, gnome, etc... | 06:12 |
| froud | OK and the other way | 06:12 |
| carlos | the other option is to setup an alternative way to do the import from a url location you tell me and using a set of files I will define for you | 06:12 |
| carlos | but I'm not happy with this way | 06:13 |
| froud | all of our stuff is in svn under https | 06:13 |
| carlos | because only for two packages, having another importing running is a waste of resources | 06:13 |
| froud | carlos we have only two docs at the moment | 06:13 |
| carlos | also it's a bit risky because autoimporting things from nontrusted machines... | 06:13 |
| froud | but we will have many more | 06:13 |
| froud | canonical machine | 06:14 |
| carlos | froud: the svn integration at the moment, is imposible | 06:14 |
| froud | https://docteam.ubuntu.com/repos/trunk | 06:14 |
| carlos | froud: perhaps later, but not *now* | 06:14 |
| froud | Ok so we will make packages | 06:14 |
| carlos | froud: I need a tarball like the one you gave me last week | 06:14 |
| froud | like what Thom gave you | 06:15 |
| carlos | you == ubuntu doc team :-) | 06:15 |
| froud | ok enrico will explain | 06:15 |
| froud | OK, so in order to upload we must finish all docs | 06:15 |
| carlos | froud: does anyone from the Ubuntu doc team have access to people.ubuntu.com? | 06:15 |
| froud | may be enrico | 06:16 |
| froud | otherwise mako helps us | 06:16 |
| froud | why? | 06:16 |
| carlos | froud: because there is another way to integrate the .pot files without using Ubuntu's archive | 06:20 |
| carlos | but implies direct access to that machine | 06:20 |
| froud | I see, explain | 06:20 |
| carlos | nothing to explain, you need a shell account to do it :-) | 06:21 |
| carlos | that's all | 06:21 |
| carlos | froud: I need to check something with Mark and Daf | 06:21 |
| froud | I understand | 06:21 |
| carlos | can we talk about this tomorrow? | 06:21 |
| froud | yes | 06:21 |
| carlos | perhaps we could avoid the shell account | 06:21 |
| froud | ok | 06:21 |
| carlos | but need to check before with them | 06:21 |
| froud | we need to take into consideration that we have mutiple books | 06:22 |
| carlos | oh, another option is use a shell script that I did some months ago to do the web submit | 06:22 |
| froud | send the script to sean@inwords.co.za | 06:22 |
| carlos | so you do the upload but with that script (using curl) | 06:22 |
| carlos | froud: the script does not works as it's at the moment, it's just a submit request over https | 06:23 |
| carlos | and the url changed a bit since I did it | 06:23 |
| froud | OK, but I dont want just anyone to run that | 06:23 |
| carlos | well, you need your launchpad's user+password | 06:23 |
| froud | Ok so we need to make a package for each document | 06:23 |
| carlos | so you should be allowed to do that from a web browser | 06:23 |
| carlos | the script does not lets you do antyhing you are not allowed to do from firefox | 06:24 |
| froud | ok | 06:24 |
| froud | and the package must contain all docs or each package must contain a doc | 06:25 |
| carlos | for the script you only need the .pot file and the url where it should be submitted | 06:26 |
| carlos | for the other way I was explaining you | 06:26 |
| carlos | a package can hold more than one .pot file | 06:26 |
| froud | the script sounds perfect | 06:26 |
| carlos | the package must be the ubuntu source package that will hold the documentation | 06:26 |
| carlos | anything else? I need to leave in 5 minutes | 06:27 |
| froud | carlos the script sounds good cause we can have many pot files in the large documents | 06:27 |
| carlos | hmm | 06:27 |
| froud | for example when we use mutiple files to assemble a document | 06:27 |
| carlos | the first upload cannot be done over the web | 06:27 |
| froud | each file holds a chapter | 06:28 |
| carlos | only updates | 06:28 |
| mdke | anyway we have plenty of time to work this out right? | 06:28 |
| mdke | we're talking post hoary? | 06:28 |
| carlos | oh, sure | 06:28 |
| froud | OK cool | 06:28 |
| carlos | I suppose some of you will come to .au, right? | 06:28 |
| mdke | rosetta will be fixed by then | 06:28 |
| froud | mdke: yeah but I must to structure and ensure that this stuff is factored in | 06:28 |
| mdke | carlos, none of us are coming | 06:28 |
| carlos | we could talk about this there | 06:28 |
| carlos | none? | 06:29 |
| carlos | hmmm | 06:29 |
| carlos | ok | 06:29 |
| mdke | maybe enrico | 06:29 |
| froud | Ok carlos thanks fo ryour time. c ya | 06:29 |
| carlos | then, if you could send to rosetta@ubuntu.com a small document about all the requirements you have and what you miss in Rosetta, we could look into it on .au | 06:30 |
| mdke | heh | 06:30 |
| carlos | that way we know exactly your needs and take them into account while preparing the changes/additions for bendy | 06:30 |
| mdke | whats bendy? | 06:31 |
| froud | ok | 06:31 |
| carlos | hmm, wrong name? | 06:31 |
| carlos | hoary + 1 | 06:31 |
| mdke | o i c | 06:31 |
| mdke | cool | 06:31 |
| carlos | ok, wrong name | 06:32 |
| carlos | breezy | 06:32 |
| carlos | :-P | 06:33 |
| carlos | ok, see you later! | 06:33 |
| mdke | it'll be ok | 06:34 |
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| jjesse | l | 08:24 |
| mdke | l | 08:26 |
| jjesse | grin typo :) | 08:32 |
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| froud | mdke: we have two untranslated messages in de | 09:19 |
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| mdke | froud, lol | 09:59 |
| mdke | froud, Rosetta said it was 106% complete | 09:59 |
| froud | mdke: | 09:59 |
| froud | msgfmt: releasenotes/release-notes-de.po: warning: PO file header fuzzy | 09:59 |
| froud | warning: older versions of msgfmt will give an error on this | 09:59 |
| froud | 125 translated messages, 2 untranslated messages. | 09:59 |
| mdke | weird | 09:59 |
| mdke | lemme look | 09:59 |
| mdke | damn yeah | 10:00 |
| mdke | i'll look into it | 10:00 |
| froud | thanks | 10:01 |
| mdke | seems to be a problem | 10:03 |
| froud | Burgundavia: we have sorted make-po | 10:03 |
| mdke | froud, rosetta made 3 bad tokens | 10:04 |
| mdke | inserting weird slashes and stuff | 10:05 |
| froud | yes | 10:05 |
| mdke | lemme check the rest and i'll re-email | 10:05 |
| mdke | shit | 10:05 |
| froud | mdke: do svn up first I just did a bunch of stuff | 10:05 |
| mdke | froud, to the po? | 10:05 |
| froud | sometimes was needed in the po | 10:06 |
| froud | but do svn up and you will have waht I fixed | 10:06 |
| mdke | ok | 10:06 |
| mdke | seems that rosetta doesn't handle our <tags> and stuff | 10:06 |
| froud | mdke: we also have a problem with the header | 10:06 |
| mdke | *sighs* | 10:06 |
| froud | I have a bout three forms | 10:07 |
| === mdke slaps Rosetta | ||
| froud | mdke: checkout the de header it is what we want ideally | 10:07 |
| mdke | right | 10:08 |
| mdke | so the other headers were bad too? | 10:08 |
| froud | not completely | 10:08 |
| froud | just the de header was the best | 10:08 |
| mdke | the headers are defined by the editing program I guess | 10:08 |
| froud | perhaps cause it was created using KBabel :-) | 10:08 |
| mdke | nah rosetta | 10:09 |
| === mdke winces | ||
| froud | yes unless the autor did it in the src | 10:09 |
| froud | without an editor | 10:09 |
| mdke | i'm editing it using poedit so better recheck the header after | 10:09 |
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| froud | it is not a major problem but would be nice to have consistant | 10:10 |
| froud | hello claude | 10:10 |
| claude | hi all | 10:10 |
| mdke | froud, how did you clean up the release-notes-de.po? | 10:10 |
| mdke | those translations were present in the po i emailed you | 10:10 |
| claude | just finished the quickguide-fr !! | 10:10 |
| === mdke bows to claude | ||
| froud | mdke: :-) | 10:11 |
| claude | froud: i send it just to you | 10:11 |
| froud | by hand | 10:11 |
| froud | wow claude | 10:11 |
| froud | that is soo cool | 10:11 |
| mdke | froud, i have a copy of the one I downloaded from rosetta, so I'll restore and email | 10:11 |
| froud | why the one in svn is no good? | 10:11 |
| mdke | the two missing messages were present in the one i downloaded, i'll copy them into the one from svn | 10:12 |
| froud | claude: did you see the make-pot and make-po scripts | 10:12 |
| froud | ok | 10:12 |
| froud | Hmm I did not edit out any messages | 10:12 |
| mdke | froud, maybe my bad | 10:13 |
| mdke | maybe they have edited it since I downloaded | 10:13 |
| mdke | yeah that must be it | 10:13 |
| mdke | or rosetta has been improved or something | 10:13 |
| mdke | god knows | 10:13 |
| froud | yeah this is why we need email to the list to say it has changed | 10:13 |
| mdke | i mean the system | 10:13 |
| claude | froud: had no time til now :-P | 10:13 |
| froud | without this we will not keep track | 10:13 |
| froud | claude: so this was you in slow motion :-) I would love to see you in normal mode | 10:14 |
| claude | lol | 10:14 |
| froud | claude: who did you mail to me or the list? | 10:14 |
| claude | froud: to you because i think it's too big for mailing on a list | 10:15 |
| froud | claude: btw enrico sorted out that the translation will get into the users desktops | 10:15 |
| froud | ok has not arrived yet | 10:15 |
| mdke | froud, so you edited all the <ulink url...> stuff by hand? | 10:15 |
| froud | mdke: yes the gnome one | 10:16 |
| claude | i read your fruitful discussion today | 10:16 |
| froud | ok right | 10:16 |
| mdke | froud, there are more | 10:16 |
| froud | seems we will lick this i18n thing oneday | 10:16 |
| froud | mdke: could be | 10:16 |
| mdke | yeah | 10:16 |
| mdke | i see some | 10:16 |
| mdke | damn | 10:16 |
| mdke | another thing to blame on rosetta :) | 10:17 |
| mdke | unless... | 10:17 |
| mdke | you didn't run any scripts on it did you? | 10:17 |
| froud | claude: do know if the menus are defined in a single place | 10:18 |
| froud | mdke: no why? | 10:18 |
| mdke | froud, there are lots of slashes inserted in some of the messages | 10:18 |
| claude | froud: don't undestrand what you mean | 10:18 |
| froud | I wonder if there is a single file defining all desktop menus so I can create the xmls from that | 10:20 |
| froud | I would need to do it for gnome and kde | 10:20 |
| mdke | froud, ok we need to check the xml for this. I've left some of the slashes in as they look intentional | 10:21 |
| froud | I would not know. It's up to you | 10:21 |
| froud | \ is used normally to escape | 10:21 |
| mdke | np | 10:21 |
| froud | for example \& | 10:21 |
| froud | means treat & as literal | 10:22 |
| mdke | seems to appear where there are " | 10:22 |
| mdke | for example in the ulink bits, there are \\\ in the german bit, and \ in the english bit | 10:22 |
| mdke | anyway i've taken those out | 10:22 |
| mdke | sent | 10:23 |
| mdke | if you build an xml and commit, i'll check | 10:24 |
| froud | ok | 10:24 |
| mdke | ping me when done | 10:25 |
| mdke | no rush | 10:25 |
| claude | froud: are you talking about common/menus/*.xml ? | 10:26 |
| froud | yes I can build those files from changes in the menu | 10:27 |
| claude | the problem is that i'm still in Warty | 10:28 |
| claude | not sure about the menu names in Hoary | 10:29 |
| claude | :( | 10:29 |
| froud | claude: Hmm why dont you update | 10:35 |
| claude | i will, i will... | 10:35 |
| claude | but i don't like to be beta-tester, normally | 10:36 |
| claude | but for the sake of the Docteam ... :) | 10:36 |
| froud | mdke: all better | 10:37 |
| froud | msgfmt: aboutubuntu/about-ubuntu-de.po: warning: PO file header fuzzy | 10:37 |
| froud | warning: older versions of msgfmt will give an error on this | 10:37 |
| froud | 24 translated messages. | 10:37 |
| mdke | what the hell is dis? | 10:38 |
| froud | mdke: svn up | 10:38 |
| mdke | is that message bad? | 10:38 |
| claude | you just need to strip the word fuzzy in the file | 10:38 |
| froud | no its not | 10:38 |
| claude | it means that the file has been generated automatically | 10:38 |
| mdke | right | 10:38 |
| froud | claude: quick guide fr is now in svn | 10:39 |
| claude | i saw | 10:39 |
| claude | great ! | 10:39 |
| claude | i think it's too late for files in common | 10:39 |
| froud | yeah | 10:39 |
| froud | btw to make the xml all you need to do is make po | 10:40 |
| mdke | ok the slashes are not a problem | 10:40 |
| mdke | good | 10:40 |
| froud | and it will find all po files and create xml files if there are differences | 10:40 |
| mdke | have checked the xml and everything is cool for release-notes-de | 10:40 |
| froud | mdke: thanks sude | 10:40 |
| claude | i'm sorry that our files couldn't be in language packs | 10:40 |
| froud | s/s/d | 10:40 |
| froud | Oh well | 10:41 |
| === jalrnc [~joao@ip68-0-220-224.ri.ri.cox.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| === jalrnc [~joao@ip68-0-220-224.ri.ri.cox.net] has left #ubuntu-doc [] | ||
| claude | that means that we won't be able to make update before Hoary+1 | 10:41 |
| claude | i think | 10:41 |
| mdke | now for getting translated screenshots into hoary | 10:41 |
| froud | Yes | 10:41 |
| froud | Ha ha ha | 10:41 |
| mdke | *coughs* j/k | 10:41 |
| froud | Hey I must go. Thanks for your help | 10:43 |
| mdke | k | 10:43 |
| claude | bye | 10:43 |
| froud | enough for night, no? | 10:43 |
| mdke | bye froud | 10:44 |
| mdke | italian releasenotes will be with you v soon | 10:44 |
| froud | get them in the morning ;-) | 10:44 |
| mdke | yep | 10:44 |
| mdke | np | 10:44 |
| === froud is now known as froud-away | ||
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