[12:26] <cybrjackle> libpt locked my amd64 box on new install and reboot upgrade, now dpkg appears to be messed up
[12:59] <digale-tambien> why can't I delete /var/lib/gdm/:0.Xservers ? please help
[01:00] <digale-tambien> obviusly ?m trying to delete it with sudo :)
[01:00] <digale-tambien> root@kin:~# rm /var/lib/gdm/:0.Xservers
[01:00] <digale-tambien> rm: no se puede efectuar `lstat' sobre /var/lib/gdm/:0.Xservers: Permiso denegado
[01:07] <dhonn> ubuntu's mozilla uses debians default start page instead of ubuntus
[01:08] <Flonne> Declare it a security risk. :)
[01:09] <seb128> dhonn: ubuntu ships firefox
[01:10] <koke> a simple question, hoary's main is already frozen forever?
[01:10] <koke> (expect for security updates)
[01:10] <koke> except
[01:10] <koke> I just discovered a bug on update-notifier's translation to spanish
[01:10] <koke> a bit late I guess ;)
[01:11] <robitaille> dhonn,   ubuntu's mozilla (not firefox) contains some references to Debian; see Bug #1949
[01:11] <digale-tambien> koke estoy teniendo un problemilla, como root no puedo borrar este archivo: rm /var/lib/gdm/:0.Xservers, y cuano instalo gdm necesita borrarlo y no puede
[01:11] <digale-tambien> hay algo raro ahi
[01:12] <Mithrandir> digale-tambien: english please
[01:12] <digale-tambien> Mithrandir I said it in englush and you didn't help me.
[01:12] <digale-tambien> here's an opinion of my problem:
[01:12] <digale-tambien> dcraven digale-tambien, okay that's just whacked.
[01:13] <RastaMahata> "koke, im having a bit of a problem, as root i cant delete this file: rm /ver/lib/gdm/:0.Xservers, and when I install gdm it needs to delete it and it cant"
[01:13] <digale-tambien> thanks rasta
[01:13] <RastaMahata> no problem
[01:13] <digale-tambien> =) that's it. :/
[01:14] <koke> digale-tambien: since there are more english speakers than spanish in the channel is just more porbable you'll get an answer by writing in english
[01:14] <digale-tambien> ok
[01:14] <digale-tambien> so... bugzilla?
[01:14] <digale-tambien> security update?
[01:14] <digale-tambien> re-install it?
[01:14] <digale-tambien> is yo tb :)
[01:15] <digale-tambien> RastaMahata me too :)
[01:15] <RastaMahata> anyway, I was just here to say that I'm unable to see devices in "computer:///" mounted on /media, when mounted from fstab. I hope you fix this :)
[01:18] <zenwhen> RastaMahata, you may need to provide more information about your system in an actual bug report on the bugzilla site.
[01:19] <zenwhen> This isnt a common issue.
[01:19] <RastaMahata> really? ok, I'll look in the bugzilla site. Thanks zendog 
[01:19] <RastaMahata> zenwhen*
[01:19] <RastaMahata> (damn tab key)
[01:19] <zenwhen> no prblem sir
[01:19] <jdub> morning all
[01:20] <zenwhen> mornin
[01:20] <ogra> morning jdub 
[01:20] <zenwhen> How are you doing jdub 
[01:20] <jdub> i feel like a car crash ;)
[01:20] <zenwhen> as do I, but thats because I am sick and all nyquiled up
[01:20] <azeem_> that reminds me of an U2 song
[01:21] <Mithrandir> jdub: I asked seb128, but not you -- do you know of any plans on a "location" kind of applet?
[01:21] <Mithrandir> or "places"
[01:21] <seb128_> Mithrandir: pkgconfig 0.16 breaks a whole bunch of GNOME stuffs :/
[01:21] <Mithrandir> seb128_: uhm, like what?
[01:21] <digale-tambien> there are so many bugzilla pages about it, and the final release of hoary it wasn't fixed, cool...
[01:21] <digale-tambien> =)
[01:21] <digale-tambien> I've made, at january, a bugzilla page about it, nad it wasn't fixed
[01:21] <digale-tambien> ;)
[01:22] <seb128_> Mithrandir: configure.in:131: error: possibly undefined macro: dnl
[01:22] <seb128_> ross: its pkgconfig 0.16
[01:22] <seb128_> seb128: ah ah
[01:22] <seb128_> ross: you can't put dnl inside the stuff to check there
[01:22] <seb128_> ross: gtk does this:
[01:22] <seb128_> ross: PKG_CHECK_MODULES(BASE_DEPENDENCIES,
[01:22] <seb128_>   [glib-2.0 >= glib_required_version dnl
[01:22] <seb128_>    atk >= atk_required_version dnl
[01:22] <seb128_>    pango >= pango_required_version] )
[01:22] <seb128_> ross: there is too much quoting, dnl doesn't get expanded with 0.16
[01:22] <Mithrandir> blah, ok.
[01:22] <Mithrandir> I should fix that, then
[01:23] <seb128_> several gnome people using debian are complaining than the CVS doesn't build now
[01:23] <Mithrandir> does too. :P
[01:23] <seb128_> you should probably not let this version going to sarge
[01:23] <Mithrandir> oh, gnome cvs, you mean
[01:23] <Mithrandir> I guess so.
[01:23] <seb128_> yeah, the GNOME package just ./configure && make
[01:23] <seb128_> packages even
[01:25] <jdub> seb128_: ha ha, hordi's blog :)
[01:25] <seb128_> yeah, nice one :p
[01:26] <jdub> Mithrandir: location/places applet? what kinds of locations/places?
[01:26] <jdub> Mithrandir: like wifi?
[01:26] <Mithrandir> jdub: "home", "work", "wireless at parent's"
[01:26] <jdub> or network profiles?
[01:26] <jdub> yeah
[01:26] <jdub> okay
[01:26] <Mithrandir> jdub: yes, except it's not just network
[01:26] <jdub> so you can try netapplet now
[01:26] <jdub> but it's pretty yucky
[01:26] <jdub> we didn't ship it by default for hoary
[01:26] <Mithrandir> but say I want to have another background if I'm at the university than at home
[01:26] <seb128> jdub: no, he wants the whole config
[01:26] <jdub> for breezy, i think we're going to be looking pretty hard at NetworkManager
[01:27] <digale-tambien> WTF! when I restarted my pc, gdm blocked the /var/lib/gdm direcotry, I can't do: ls as root, I can't delete nothing at that direcotry, how can I unlock it?
[01:27] <jdub> which will let you do things beyond network
[01:27] <digale-tambien> please help, I'm using hoary...
[01:27] <Mithrandir> seb128: that's just because it used to do improper quoting, I think.
[01:27] <seb128> Mithrandir: look at the example I give
[01:28] <seb128> what is wrong with it ?
[01:28] <Mithrandir> seb128: I don't know m4. :P
[01:28] <seb128> Mithrandir: the fact is, that it breaks a whole bunch of stuff
[01:28] <Mithrandir> but to me, it looks like you're quoting dnl
[01:28] <jdub> heh, archive.ubuntu.com seems a little slow ;)
[01:28] <seb128> and I don't get a reason to break, that used to work
[01:28] <seb128> jdub: when do we open breezy ?
[01:28] <jdub> seb128: dunno :)
[01:28] <seb128> jdub: people need the crack :)
[01:29] <digale-tambien> I'm going to cry, gdm blocked that direcoty, and now I cant reinstalll gdm by this, 'cause gdm reinstallation needs to delete the files at /var/lib/gdm, and it cant :( jdub help me please
[01:29] <Mithrandir> seb128: worked by accident, I guess.
[01:29] <digale-tambien> how can I unlock it? I don't want to reinstall hoary :/
[01:29] <Mithrandir> seb128: what happens if you just remove the dnl from there?
[01:29] <seb128> Mithrandir: but works for ages, that's quite rude to break now
[01:29] <lamont-away> moo
[01:29] <Mithrandir> seb128: the upstream version was ancient.
[01:29] <seb128> Mithrandir: that works, but your force a lot of people to fix stuff
[01:30] <jdub> digale-tambien: that question would be more appropriate in #ubuntu
[01:30] <Mithrandir> seb128: sorry about that, if you can provide me with a pkg.m4 which fixes it, I can look at it.
[01:30] <digale-tambien> :( when I do,as root, rm -rf /var/lib/gdm I get Permission Denied
[01:30] <lamont> hrm... 3.4GB... /me needs more to put on this...
[01:30] <digale-tambien> jdub, sorry, I know, but there I dint get support about it.
[01:30] <seb128> Mithrandir: k, I'll have a look tomorrow, that's time to sleep for now
[01:31] <seb128> thanks
[01:31] <jdub> digale-tambien: please try again; it is not appropriate here
[01:31] <Mithrandir> seb128: sure.
[01:31] <digale-tambien> jdub mm Im bored of this, nobody wants to help me about it...
[01:33] <Mithrandir> jdub: so nm might have all the crack I want?
[01:33] <RastaMahata> zenwhen, The problem I was talking about gets fixed when I do this: "sudo /etc/init.d/dbus-1 restart"
[01:33] <RastaMahata> just so people know :)
[01:33] <RastaMahata> or it gets fixed soon! :D Good luck!
[01:34] <zenwhen> do you have to run this command on each boot?
[01:34] <RastaMahata> I dont know that yet, I was going to reboot after I purge some old config files...
[01:34] <jdub> Mithrandir: it provides the platform for your crack, yeah ;-)
[01:34] <Mithrandir> jdub: yay. :)
[01:34] <Burgundavia> digale-tambien, #ubuntu is for help
[01:35] <digale-tambien> Burgundavia I know, there NOBODY helped me, thanks to remember me that.
[01:35] <RastaMahata> zenwhen, ill reboot, come back here and hope I dont need to do this again
[01:38] <digale-tambien> wtf, I don't wanna use debian :'(
[01:38] <Mithrandir> hm, boo looks interesting
[01:38] <maswan> Mithrandir: debian bo?
[01:39] <digale-tambien> I like ubuntu, but its support... and I don't know why happens
[01:39] <Mithrandir> maswan: http://boo.codehaus.org/
[01:39] <maswan> Mithrandir: you guys going to base the next ubuntu release on bo? :)
[01:39] <Mithrandir> maswan: :P
[01:39] <AstralJava> digale-tambien: Okay to msg you? We could try and work this out and not bother #u-devel...
[01:40] <digale-tambien> yep, please :)
[01:42] <ogra> maswan, nope, rex
[01:43] <maswan> ogra: rex is the one before?
[01:43] <ogra> yop
[01:44] <maswan> I might have skipped bo for this new and fancy hamm, but I was aware of it
[01:45] <maswan> nope, 1.3, started with bo, might even have cds from cheapbyte around to prove it. :)
[01:46] <jordi> a few months later hamm was released
[01:46] <jordi> hmm, I seem to assume now that all Debian releases have taken 2 or 3 years
[01:46] <ogra> heh
[01:46] <jordi> at that time, we even had a release cycle :)
[01:47] <maswan> the scary thing is that Gimp seems to have gotten a release cycle
[01:47] <ogra> yeah
[01:47] <jordi> heh, yes
[01:48] <jordi> Flonne: that's quite some time ago already :)
[01:48] <maswan> I remember the Gimp 1.2(?) release topic: "Gimp - We make Debian's release cycle seem fast."
[01:48] <SuperQ> hehe
[01:49] <jordi> heh
[01:49] <SuperQ> Flonne: I was just talking about a Potato box I have to upgrade soon
[01:49] <jordi> 1.2 took a while yeah
[01:49] <jordi> SuperQ: I've given up on upgrading my potato box...
[01:49] <SuperQ> jordi: well.. yea.. 
[01:49] <jordi> basically because it's a 80386 :)
[01:49] <SuperQ> jordi: it's getting "upgraded" to CentOS
[01:50] <SuperQ> it's also geting all 900GB of disk replaced with a Fibre San
[01:50] <ajmitch> hey jordi 
[01:50] <jordi> ajmitch: hi andrew
[01:50] <maswan> I remember speed-installing.. hmm.. probably slink, from floppies, me and another guy, one sitting ready to eject the floppy, the other ready to press enter. :)
[01:51] <SuperQ> maswan: haha.. I think I did that back in the day with Bo
[01:51] <jordi> ok, I know Ubuntu has had it since day one, but I'm pretty excited about Debian getting GNOME 2.10 rigt now
[01:51] <jordi> this is so old news in Ubuntu...
[01:51] <SuperQ> Bo was a huge step up from Slackware 96
[01:52] <maswan> SuperQ: I used slackware around 96-97, before seeing The Light. :)
[01:52] <SuperQ> aye
[01:52] <SuperQ> me too
[01:52] <maswan> SuperQ: for me it wasn't so bad, as a learning experience, since you had to do everytihng by hand
[01:53] <jordi> you learned quite a lot with debian 1.3 anyway
[01:53] <jordi> I remember when I first got my soundcard working.
[01:53] <jordi> it was like a fscking miracle
[01:53] <pvh> I just mentioned this a minute ago in #ubuntu, but it's probably better suited to here.
[01:53] <jordi> and, well, PCI cards.
[01:53] <jordi> we are spoiled.
[01:53] <maswan> I was thinking of bootup process, having real _packages_, etc.
[01:53] <ajmitch> jordi: going to UDU?
[01:53] <pvh> In the past couple weeks I've lost the ability to launch programs from gnome panel.
[01:54] <jordi> ajmitch: no way :(
[01:54] <ajmitch> ah :(
[01:54] <jordi> I can't take that week off at work, it's way too busy these days :/
[01:54] <pvh> It tells me that it can't fork because it's out of memory.
[01:54] <jordi> ajmitch: I was invited :|
[01:54] <pvh> But I have no such problem when running from the command line.
[01:54] <ajmitch> yeah, it would have been good to see you there
[01:54] <jordi> one of my dreams is going to .au, missing this opportunity hurts.
[01:54] <SuperQ> jordi: hehe.. you know.. I never had much trouble getting my SB-16 working
[01:55] <jordi> SuperQ: which version of Debian?
[01:55] <maswan> jordi: I feel kind of sorry for dumping a sarge/testing thingie on my sister, a couple of months before the warty release even. :)
[01:55] <SuperQ> I had my SB-16 working with Slack
[01:55] <SuperQ> jordi: I started with Slack in 94-95
[01:55] <jordi> SuperQ: nod
[01:55] <jordi> SuperQ: I can't remember what I found so tricky...
[01:55] <SuperQ> jordi: dabbled with RedHat 4.x for alpha 
[01:56] <jordi> I guess ISApnp wasn't on  the kernel even
[01:56] <SuperQ> jordi: and finaly switched to Bo back in the day
[01:56] <jordi> nod
[01:56] <jordi> 1.3 or 1.3.1?
[01:56] <SuperQ> I don't remember
[01:56] <jordi> I think my bo cd was 1.3.1
[01:56] <jordi> I have it around somewhere
[01:56] <maswan> jordi: so was mine
[01:56] <jordi> I love these conversations :)
[01:57] <maswan> I seem to remember trying out rh-something (4?) and it lasting all of 45 minutes before I started rm -rf:ing /etc and so on out of pure frustration :)
[01:57] <jordi> I remember the libc5->libc6 ugrade script. IIRC it was called "update.sh" and it was scary.
[01:57] <maswan> I didn't really become involved in stuff until 99:ish though
[01:58] <jordi> maswan: as in DD?
[01:58] <SuperQ> the first incarnation of my main server (nerp.net) was RH (4? 5?) on a Jensen (DECpc 150) alpha architecture
[01:58] <jordi> me neither
[01:58] <SuperQ> man was that box cool
[01:58] <SuperQ> 64 bit!
[01:58] <SuperQ> back in 1997
[01:58] <maswan> jordi: No, as a more clueful guy and starting around messing with acc.umu.se stuff, including the ftp mirror
[01:58] <Flonne> I remember having that fail...
[01:58] <jordi> maswan: *nod*
[01:59] <jordi> I guess I started doing stuff late 98 and applied for DD in 99
[01:59] <maswan> hmm.. we did have a computer association in high school before that though, and the fall of 97 or so I installed debian on machines with too small harddrives, think it was 386s with 20 megs
[01:59] <maswan> I remember watching star extract the base and rm:ing "unnecessary" files so everything would fit. :)
[02:00] <jordi> hehe
[02:00] <maswan> and getting it wrong, rm:ing the file currently being extracted, making star die horribly and you had to do it all over again. :)
[02:00] <jordi> I think I installed in December 1997
[02:00] <jordi> maybe November.
[02:01] <maswan> we had a server though, a sparcstation LX with 64 megs of ram. ;)
[02:01] <maswan> I didn't become a DD until last month. :)
[02:01] <jdub> 64! holy crap, that's huuuuuuge
[02:01] <maswan> jdub: exactly. :)
[02:01] <jordi> jdub: hey dude!
[02:02] <SuperQ> lol
[02:02] <maswan> it was much faster to telnet to it and run all the commands there, than doing them locally. :)
[02:02] <jdub> once upon a time, 64MB RAM seemed limitless
[02:02] <jordi> Tags added: wontfix
[02:02] <SuperQ> now I work on machines where 64GB ram is not so big
[02:02] <jordi> we still get bugs about gnome modules losing functionality
[02:02] <jdub> jordi: heh
[02:02] <jordi> maswan: hehe
[02:02] <Flonne> 64 MB is still plenty. You just need to know how to manage it.
[02:02] <maswan> heh. I also remember one of my first thingies I did at ACC, filling up a memory board with 48 1-meg 30-pin memory modules. :)
[02:02] <ajmitch> I feel young now, around you people ;)
[02:03] <Flonne> Heck, 8 is still enough for ome of my systems. :)
[02:04] <SuperQ> % free -k
[02:04] <SuperQ>              total       used       free     shared    buffers     cached
[02:04] <SuperQ> Mem:     510707296  312700704  198006592          0        144  216268096
[02:04] <SuperQ> -/+ buffers/cache:   96432464  414274832
[02:04] <SuperQ> hahahahahahah
[02:04] <maswan> I think that was ftp.acc.umu.se back then, waaay back in 98. :)
[02:04] <jordi> jdub: when is the wedding?
[02:04] <jordi> time flies.
[02:04] <maswan> then we upgraded it to a dual supersparc at 50MHz and took on ftp.gnome.org. :)
[02:05] <jordi> maswan: cool
[02:05] <jordi> kids, this was the beginning of the Swedish Conspiracy.
[02:05] <maswan> jordi: we've always had more bandwidth than server for that, today we ran out of server too. :)
[02:06] <jordi> heh
[02:06] <maswan> there is no swedish conspiracy
[02:06] <maswan> of course, we seemed to hit bandwidth limits at about the same time, but that's juts an incentive for the networking guys to improve it. :)
[02:07] <jordi> anyway, bediime here.
[02:07] <dhonn> Is it possible to get the nvidia 1.0-6111 drivers in the repository, every version after that crashes with some LCD displays
[02:07] <maswan> ah, indeed it is
[02:07] <jordi> congrats all for the Hoary release, I still had not done that :)
[02:07] <maswan> 'night jordi
[02:08] <maswan> I wonder how big that bandwidth spike would have gone if we had had enough server and bandwidth to meet demand. :)
[02:12] <jdub> jordi: 17th
[02:12] <mdke> hi dudes. Is anyone else getting the gnome splash screen remaining on their desktop? Does anyone know how to resolve this problem?
[02:13] <Burgundavia> jdub, what do you think about double clicking on cd/dvd icons on the desktop opening cdplayer/totem?
[02:20] <dhonn> hey in gnome do you think some tools in Application->System Tools belong in System->Admistration?
[02:21] <mdke> dhonn, maybe one of them
[02:21] <ogra> dhonn, if we would think that we would have done it
[02:22] <mdke> heh
[02:22] <dhonn> of course
[02:22] <mdke> add/remove programs maybe
[02:22] <dhonn> its like applets vs applications too
[02:24] <RastaMahata> zenwhen, nope, after a reboot i dont get to see my mounts in computer:///
[02:24] <RastaMahata> sorry for the delay
[02:25] <dhonn> it can get kind of confusing really
[02:25] <RastaMahata> so everytime i get into X, i need to "sudo /etc/init.d/dbus-1 restart"
[02:25] <dhonn> configuration editor can go
[02:26] <ogra> dhonn, thats a tool to adjust your personal desktop settings, why should it be in the system menu ?
[02:27] <mpt> dhonn: those two menus could be merged, really
[02:27] <dhonn> its seams like a system related task, i mean its not normal to to use that editor
[02:27] <mdke> gconf should be abolished full stop ;)
[02:27] <dhonn> its like regedit
[02:28] <mdke> but its in the right place in the menu
[02:28] <ogra> dhonn, did you ever use regedit ?
[02:28] <dhonn> yea i had to type it in Run
[02:28] <ogra> dhonn, and did you use gconf-editor ?
[02:29] <dhonn> yea
[02:29] <mpt> Actually, now that I look at it, a large chunk of the "System Tools" should just be Nautilus menu items
[02:29] <ogra> i dont think these are comparable at all
[02:29] <mpt> "File Browser" should be replaced by an item in Nautilus's View menu
[02:29] <mpt> Floppy Formatter replaced by an item in Nautilus's File menu
[02:30] <mpt> Run as different user, ditto
[02:30] <ogra> mpt, file browser is already in the context menu
[02:30] <dhonn> mpt, they should be integrated
[02:30] <mpt> ogra: Which isn't convenient if you already have the folder open :-)
[02:30] <mpt> and if you don't have its parent open (which is, alas, more likely in Ubuntu than in other Gnome distributions)
[02:31] <ogra> mpt, its just in the apps menu because there was a huge user request for a browsr like option to start nautilus
[02:31] <zul> hey
[02:31] <mpt> ogra: If browse mode was remembered for individual folders, like icons and list modes are, that wouldn't be necessary. Nautilus would just remember what you used last time.
[02:33] <mpt> ... and "New Login" belongs in the same menu as Log Out
[02:33] <ogra> mpt, i dont like or use browser mode... but i understand the demand that was there... and i think using two different menus for different targets is ok...
[02:34] <dhonn> Nautilus -> View -> Browser Mode?
[02:34] <ogra> the "new login" should be in the logout splash or a screensaver option....shouldnt be in any manu, but these options are not there yet
[02:34] <mpt> ogra: I'd use browser mode more often if I could open a folder, see "oh, this is a folder with lots of subfolders in it, it'd be more convenient to browse it", and just choose View > as Browser.
[02:34] <mpt> dhonn: right
[02:35] <ogra> mpt, understood...and it would be a cool option indeed...
[02:36] <mpt> Well, if you're willing+able to implement it, stick your patch on http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=170546 :-)
[02:38] <ogra> mpt, lets see, i also want to add cursor theme selection to the mouse or theme properties, enhance the screensaver and have to care for hwdb before breezy.... but probably if some time is left :)
[02:39] <ogra> nautilus is intersting code :)
[02:39] <dhonn> how do you guys just jump right in?
[02:40] <ogra> dhonn, look for annoyances and try to get them out of the way is my biggest motivation ;)
[02:40] <zul> dhonn: you just do :)
[02:42] <dhonn> i contributed 2-3 lines of code to this release
[02:42] <dhonn> lol
[02:42] <zul> dhonn: or you could start small and work you way up to be the next ogra 
[02:42] <ogra> dhonn, good start :)
[02:42] <zul> or you start to break stuff like i do
[02:43] <ogra> oh, breaking stuff is essential !
[02:43] <zul> especially kernel related
[02:43] <dhonn> i play with the code alot
[02:43] <mpt> ogra: enhance the screensaver how?
[02:44] <ogra> mpt, lets see, i'll have to talk to jdub in UdU, who will clearify some stuff with keithp afaik....
[02:44] <dhonn> Heres an Idea i thought of this morning: I wanted to make an opengl enhanced live background
[02:44] <schweeb> zul: sometimes breaking stuff is the only way to properly fix it :)
[02:45] <jdub> ogra: you're coming?
[02:45] <ogra> mpt, a "login as new user" option in the lock window for example
[02:45] <ogra> jdub, YEAH :-D
[02:45] <zul> schweeb: or to get people's attention
[02:45] <jdub> ogra: rock! i didn't think you were
[02:45] <ogra> jdub, waiting since 19 years to see your country :)
[02:46] <tseng> hi
[02:46] <mpt> ogra: Oh, right ... Yeah, there's lots about that window that needs changing :-)
[02:46] <zul> hey tseng how is it going?
[02:46] <ajmitch> ogra: bah, I've seen enough of .au already ;)
[02:46] <tseng> zul: good thanks
[02:46] <jdub> ogra: rad :-)
[02:46] <ogra> mpt, ah, come on, i already changed a lot :)
[02:46] <jdub> ogra: staying for longer than UDU?
[02:47] <ogra> jdub, i fly with the other germans (dholbach etc) some days earlier....
[02:47] <ajmitch> ogra: I hope you have a good time 
[02:47] <mpt> ogra: You did? Were you the one who got rid of the "APPROVED" crack?
[02:47] <ajmitch> plenty to see in sydney, I heard
[02:47] <jdub> ogra: rad
[02:48] <ogra> mpt, i was the one who introduced it ;) and got rid of it, yes :)
[02:48] <ogra> jdub, yeah
[02:49] <mpt> ogra: Good good ... Now get rid of the time display (or add the current weather alongside it), and get rid of the thermometer, and make the password field look like a real text field, and we'll be fine :-)
[02:50] <mdke> there isn't a local initscript in debian/ubuntu is there?
[02:50] <jdub> mpt: dude, chill out
[02:50] <mpt> hmmm?
[02:50] <mpt> I'm getting ahead of myself again, aren't I
[02:50] <mpt> sorry
[02:50] <jdub> just be grateful for what ogra's done
[02:51] <mpt> I am
[02:51] <schweeb> if you're so interested in changing things, learning to program and doing it yourself is a good start :)
[02:51] <ogra> mpt, i already bugged jdub for fade in and out code.... :) i think he fears the featureitis ;) 
[02:51] <ajmitch> ogra: fade-to-grey?
[02:51] <mpt> schweeb: Yeah, I've never heard that argument before, thanks ;-)
[02:52] <jdub> http://www.whiprush.org/2005/04/ubuntu_release__1.html
[02:52] <ogra> ajmitch, i thought about black....until alpha belnding works right in xorg :)
[02:52] <jdub> ^ whiprush has some cool photos of hoary upgrades and happy users
[02:52] <ajmitch> ok
[02:52] <mpt> ogra: Hmmm, fade in and fade out? I'd never thought of that, but that's a cool idea
[02:52] <Burgundavia> jdub, did you see my question?
[02:52] <schweeb> jdub: heh, I was there when he wrote that
[02:53] <jdub> Burgundavia: no
[02:53] <ajmitch> jdub: good photos
[02:53] <schweeb> jdub: locally we're gettina  pretty good group of people using Ubuntu
[02:53] <Burgundavia> jdub, wondered if it was a good idea for double clicking on the desktop icon of music cds/dvds should launch totem/gnome cd player instead of nautilus
[02:54] <schweeb> too bad I can't make it to the release party that's right now @_@ (vehicle's in the shop)
[02:54] <ogra> mpt, the nice thing is that he code is already there for the fading of the screensaver itself.... is just a matter of including  the right header and some lines of code... but lets wait how the gnoem screensaver project goes on
[02:54] <mpt> Burgundavia: Or you could just remove the distinction between the two
[02:55] <Burgundavia> mpt, I am thinking more dbclick to launch what ever is default for that type of media
[02:55] <mpt> hmm, do DVDs contain files which it is useful to manage? I have no idea
[02:55] <Burgundavia> some do
[02:56] <Burgundavia> "enhanced" cds and dvds do
[02:56] <jdub> Burgundavia: possibly, yeah - would be an interesting challenge handling mimetypes/g-v-m configuration, etc.
[02:56] <Burgundavia> but they should be easy to catch
[02:56] <jdub> Burgundavia: i think that's about the only reason why it doesn't do it already
[02:56] <jdub> schweeb: man, whiprush's users have nothing on my users
[02:56] <schweeb> lol
[02:56] <jdub> http://perkypants.org/misc/happy-users-are-productive-users.jpg
[02:56] <siimo> im waiting for the next devel repository ;)
[02:57] <jdub> http://perkypants.org/misc/holy-usability-batman.jpg
[02:57] <mpt> Burgundavia: Or maybe put a "Play" button in Nautilus's toolbar for CD/DVD windows
[02:57] <Burgundavia> jdub, I feel sorry for the old man
[02:57] <schweeb> jdub: rofl
[02:57] <Burgundavia> mpt, too much crap
[02:57] <Burgundavia> mpt, featuritis ala konq
[02:57] <jdub> schweeb: even the pope can get ubuntu installed on a dell ;)
[02:57] <schweeb> haha
[02:57] <Burgundavia> just do what I want, do make me do it
[02:58] <schweeb> jdub: h8 my Dell 8200
[02:58] <jdub> Burgundavia: jump on #gnome-hackers and ask alex/campd about it, they ought to be able to tell you what's in the way
[02:58] <Burgundavia> jdub, thanks
[02:58] <cjb> jdub: Was that before or after dying?  :)
[02:58] <jdub> Burgundavia: hrm, actually, mailing nautilus-list would probably be better
[02:58] <schweeb> hopefully I get something that I can get suspend working on soon
[02:58] <Burgundavia> jdub, ok
[02:59] <schweeb> jdub: I hear most of you guys use X40's
[02:59] <jdub> schweeb: ahem
[02:59] <schweeb> heh, are you an exception?
[02:59] <mpt> Burgundavia: We're coming from different directions, I guess. If the CD player is just a file manager window, rather than being an entirely separate UI, that looks to me like less featuritis, not more
[02:59] <Burgundavia> mpt, true
[02:59] <cjb> X40s are about as good as it gets, though there's the wireless minipci snafu.
[02:59] <Burgundavia> mpt, I was looking at a quickhack to get it working
[03:00] <Burgundavia> mpt, then you discuss the longterm changes in ui
[03:00] <lamont> smurfix: you around?
[03:00] <schweeb> cjb: what snafu would that be?
[03:00] <jdub> mpt: dude, that is so nautilus 1.x and completely shite.
[03:00] <mpt> Burgundavia: ain't that always the way :-)
[03:00] <Burgundavia> mpt, sometimes sadly yes
[03:00] <mpt> jdub: shite in what way?
[03:00] <jdub> schweeb: there is a danegrously cult-like X40 "fan base" within canonical
[03:00] <schweeb> cjb: I've heard the Intel 2200 card you can get in it works great
[03:00] <mpt> jdub: I don't mean every single folder window should have View as Music ... now *that* was crack
[03:01] <jdub> mpt: it was a failure -> file managers are great at managing files. end of story.
[03:01] <schweeb> jdub: are you included?  I'm looking at X41's and Fujitsu P7k's right now
[03:01] <cjb> schweeb: Oh, it does.  Just don't try to replace it, or to buy the laptop without one and then add it later.
[03:01] <jdub> schweeb: no, my laptop is 7.5 times better than the X40.
[03:01] <schweeb> cjb: some kind of proprietary minipci?
[03:01] <schweeb> jdub: :) which laptop is that, then
[03:01] <jdub> schweeb: the X300 of course ;)
[03:01] <schweeb> oh oh
[03:01] <schweeb> haha
[03:01] <ogra> heh
[03:02] <schweeb> I just saw whip's X40 today... pretty nice
[03:02] <cjb> schweeb: There's a BIOS lock; it only boots if the minipci card is one in its database.  And the database is tiny -- it doesn't even cover all the IBM cards.
[03:02] <cjb> jdub: X300 represent!
[03:02] <schweeb> cjb: o_O DAMN. that's pretty gay.
[03:03] <cjb> (Now, if only I can work out how to get the ACPI even slightly working.)
[03:03] <jdub> time to deliver a hoary mirror and ISO selection to a local installfest
[03:03] <schweeb> er s/gay/not cool/
[03:03] <jdub> schweeb: yeah, thank you
[03:03] <jdub> inappropriate
[03:03] <cjb> schweeb: http://www.srcf.ucam.org/~mjg59/thinkpad/ .
[03:03] <jdub> www.angrydpl.com
[03:04] <jdub> speaking of angry, HI mjg59!
[03:04] <schweeb> jdub: yea, we're pretty brutal witih each other at times... most of the time it should be called #notlinux
[03:05] <schweeb> jdub: haha, that site rules
[03:05] <cjb> jdub: He's still out partying, I think.
[03:05] <lamont> another ubuntu convert today
[03:06] <cjb> We left him shouting at the manager in the restaurant Mark took everyone to.  It wasn't pretty.
[03:06] <lamont> RH, SUSE, etc didn't even detect the disc controller.  I watched him do the install :-)
[03:06] <ogra> lamont, only one ? 
[03:06] <lamont> well, one very vocal one with his coworkers...
[03:06] <ogra> :)
[03:06] <lamont> and someone else who's taking it home to play with (wife is south african....)
[03:08] <mdke> i am interested in the decision to make update-notifier difficult to stop. was there a discussion on this that I can read up on?
[03:10] <schweeb> cjb: at least there's code (which although dangerous) makes you able to use other cards... at least there's a possibility for the uninformed to have a working minipci card... thanks for warning me though :)
[03:12] <schweeb> maybe I'll get the p7k after all
[03:13] <mdke> lol
[03:13] <lamont> hrm... live i386 boot disk that supports ppc netinst... that sounds sick enough to do.
[03:16] <ogra> night all
[03:21] <tritium> schweeb, you're having trouble with your Dell 8200 not suspending?
[03:21] <schweeb> tritium: it'll suspend, but not resume... blank screen on bootup... I've had it working before, just not on Ubuntu
[03:22] <tritium> schweeb, I got my Dell C840 working after disable POST_VIDEO, and using NvAGP rather than agpgary (which requires blacklisting intel_agp).  You might try that.
[03:22] <cjb> schweeb: Can you ssh in?  (ie. is it just the video card not resuming?)
[03:22] <tritium> s/agpgary/agpgart
[03:23] <cjb> 'cause one thing to do is lspci -v -v -v both before suspending and after, which tells you the PCI state, and you can setpci back to the before after suspending to get the display back (and bind a function key to it or something, assuming you can't hook it to the lid open event.)
[03:23] <schweeb> cjb: I believe I could... it's been a while since I tried
[03:23] <schweeb> tritium: I'll have to try that sometime again soon
[03:24] <tritium> schweeb, cool - good luck.  Let me know.  I'm sure I'll see you around :)
[03:24] <schweeb> of course
[03:24] <tritium> :)
[03:25] <cjb> But, yeah, not having the display hardware wake up is really common 'cause it's usually handled by the Windows display driver code, and not in ACPI at all.
[03:28] <dhonn> does ubuntu use prelink?  applications start faster
[03:31] <crimsun> dhonn: afaik, no prelinking but -O1
[03:33] <jdub> dhonn: we don't, and don't want to -> read the archives for discussion about it and a link to a document by ulrich drepper that describes why we don't
[03:33] <jdub> crimsun: "linker hash table optimisation"
[03:33] <crimsun> jdub: right
[03:33] <lamont> crimsun: some things are ld -O1, but not by default
[03:33] <crimsun> gotcha
[03:34] <dhonn> i come from the rh world lol
[03:34] <jdub> lamont: --as-needed and -Wl,-O1 by default for breezy? :)
[03:34] <jdub> -Wl,--as-needed
[03:35] <dhonn> thanks
[03:36] <lamont> jdub: prove to me it doesn't break things, and we'll talk
[03:36] <lamont> jdub: that is, get jbailey and doko to add that to their testing before breezy opens
[03:36] <jdub> rad
[03:36] <jdub> and also commentary from keybuk
[04:04] <Duluu> thanks for Hoary
[04:04] <Duluu> what optimization option do you use? any suggestions?
[04:05] <schweeb> wow, that question gets asked more and more often
[04:05] <schweeb> Duluu: check the mailing lists... I'm pretty sure it's discussed in detail on there
[04:05] <sladen> Duluu: analyzling the problem
[04:13] <Duluu> in devel list I can't find discussion about compiler optimizations
[04:14] <Duluu> please give me some advice on it
[04:18] <dhonn> I noticed that the kernel config file shows its optimized for size.  does that help the kernel in terms of speed?
[04:20] <cjb> dhonn: My advice, FWIW, is to stop worrying about compiler optimisations.  :)  They're often a, uh, chimera.
[04:20] <Duluu> i mean not only kernel, but other applications. optimizations like -march=pentium4 -O2 or something else
[04:21] <jdub_> d'oh
[04:21] <dhonn> just wondering.  
[04:44] <sladen> dhonn: yes, it makes the kernel run 0.000001% faster because more of the code stays in cache
[04:46] <sladen> -march=ricer -OALLOYWHEELS -fgo-faster-strips
[04:47] <schweeb> lol
[04:47] <schweeb> the wonderful things Gentoo has done to the linux community :)
[04:48] <daniels> mooch: abcde is utterly, utterly, amazing fantastic.  thankyou.
[04:49] <daniels> s/amazing/&ly/
[04:49] <tseng> mooch: its better than good, its great.
[04:49] <sladen> s/$/\!\!\!/g
[04:50] <tseng> sound-juicer cant make flac + mp3 in one pass
[04:50] <tseng> or normalize afaik
[04:50] <tseng> abcde can do *anything*
[04:51] <tseng> it does my laundry
[04:51] <SuperQ> haha
[04:51] <SuperQ> is there any good one that runs as a daemon
[04:51] <SuperQ> is/are
[04:52] <tseng> any encoder/ripper frontends?
[04:52] <SuperQ> yea
[04:53] <SuperQ> something I can just attach to a drive for a dedicated rip/encode machine
[04:53] <tseng> im at a loss as to why they would be a daemon
[04:53] <SuperQ> well, maybe at worse a screen session
[04:53] <tseng> but i guess you could wrap abcde in a clever cron
[04:54] <jdub_> tseng: g-v-m script on audio cd insert ;)
[04:54] <tseng> ive had gnome-volume-manager open rxvt with 
[04:54] <tseng> yeah dude
[04:54] <tseng> he beat me.
[04:54] <jdub_> haha
[04:54] <jdub_> sitting on my wavelength!
[04:54] <jdub_> hrm
[04:55] <tseng> irssi in screen on your linode, dude.
[04:55] <jdubFest> i run it on the server at home
[04:55] <jdubFest> but i managed to reset my wrt and not put crucial settings back in... port 22 forwards, for instance ;)
[04:55] <tseng> mines on a linode, so it runs 50% "cooler"
[04:56] <jdubFest> heh
[04:56] <tseng> caker let me test a new host running xen btw
[04:56] <jdubFest> oh, rad
[04:56] <jdubFest> nice?
[04:56] <tseng> it rocks.
[04:56] <tseng> boots in a few seconds
[04:56] <SuperQ> I'm trying to avoid X based solutions
[04:56] <tseng> X?
[04:57] <SuperQ> right now, I use a Xvnc server with blackbox/grip
[04:57] <tseng> oh that thing still
[04:57] <SuperQ> it works great for the most part
[04:57] <SuperQ> i just wrote a little startup script to load the vncserver, and start grip up
[04:57] <SuperQ> grip auto-rips on insert, and auto-ejects on complete
[04:58] <SuperQ> does all the cddb taging, and even has a post-rip script to poke the slimserver to re-scan 
[05:01] <daniels> abcde has fantastic handling of cddb and multi-artist compliations, in particular
[05:02] <tseng> i like encoding multiple formats at once
[05:04] <SuperQ> that'd be handy
[05:04] <SuperQ> I am doing all FLAC these days
[05:04] <tseng> i do flac and mp3
[05:04] <tseng> as ipod doesnt take flac.
[05:04] <SuperQ> yea
[05:05] <SuperQ> I recode my FLACs to ogg 64k to store on my cell phone
[05:05] <tseng> ew
[05:06] <SuperQ> well.. i've only got a gig of storage
[05:07] <SuperQ> and it's usualy for bus riding, so there is a lot of outside noise
[05:07] <SuperQ> for my home stereo, it's all FLAC to SPIDF to my stereo
[05:17] <diego> poor synaptic...so ignored now :P
[05:18] <blueyed> Would it be possible to automatically install aspell packages for the installed locale(s) during installation?
[05:55] <lamont> heh... maswan's mirror isn't so slammed any more.
[06:00] <calc> not bad nearly 4000 downloads via bt
[06:03] <Pizbit> lamont: Grabbing extra packages is also faster than dialup now too!:)
[06:08] <calc> hmm actually its roughly 14000 downloads
[06:08] <calc> i misread the bt page
[06:08] <WebWiz> oi all
[06:10] <WebWiz> When will package updates for the "next" ubuntu after warty start?
[06:10] <lamont> Pizbit: yeah
[06:10] <Pizbit> WebWiz: What's the hurry?:)
[06:10] <lamont> WebWiz: breezy should open within a week or 3, I expect
[06:10] <WebWiz> all breezy... cool
[06:10] <lamont> then there will be the normal chaos as we deal with all the merges that creates.
[06:10] <WebWiz> all = ahh
[06:11] <daniels> WebWiz: most of the developers are taking the weekend off and investigating this 'sleep' concept
[06:11] <WebWiz> yeah i hear ya
[06:11] <WebWiz> they all did an amazing job
[06:11] <lamont> daniels: "you can sleep when you're dead".
[06:11] <daniels> lamont: got about 7h last night; luxury!
[06:11] <lamont> daniels: yeah.
[06:11] <WebWiz> so sources.list will need "breezy" at some point to start getting the latest updates
[06:12] <schweeb> WebWiz: only if you want to run the development branch
[06:12] <lamont> daniels: I had fun today - went to "help" someone install an amd64 box that FC3 and suse hadn't seen any disks in (new scsi controller, etc).
[06:12] <WebWiz> exactly
[06:12] <WebWiz> which i will be contributing to the next one, so yeah
[06:12] <lamont> so I let him do the install while I watched.
[06:12] <lamont> he has been assimilated
[06:13] <WebWiz> is there a reason why they chose to make a new dev branch every release? instead of making the dev branch always called a certain name? like (mandrake cooker)
[06:14] <lamont> or debian sid?
[06:14] <WebWiz> right
[06:14] <lamont> I think it's because the dev branch is largely "debian sid", cleaned up.
[06:14] <lamont> and you have to name it sometime...
[06:15] <WebWiz> does universe work the same way?
[06:15] <WebWiz> a 'new' universe is created for dev branch 
[06:15] <lamont> hoary will get cloned into breezy, and then uploads happen to breezy.  (and syncs of debian/whatever sources)
[06:16] <lamont> hrm... DVD doesn't boot in a CD ROM. :-(
[06:16] <WebWiz> cool thanks :)
[06:20] <soopurman> how can i get a /dev/sd? node for the firewire harddrive i just connected, so i can mount it ?
[06:21] <schweeb> soopurman: this is probably a #ubuntu question
[06:22] <schweeb> I'll hint that you'll probably wanna check dmesg, it usually tells you what device it registered itself as
[06:23] <soopurman> thanks
[06:23] <soopurman> sorry to bother
[06:23] <schweeb> and it should probably automount in GNOME on Ubuntu
[06:24] <soopurman> see, thing is it *did*  and then i did a manual "sudo umount /mnt/point" (to format the raw partition) and now when i unplug and then plug it back in, it doesnt auto-mount any more
[06:24] <soopurman> even if it didnt auto mount, i at least just need the block device under /dev
[06:25] <daniels> lamont: heh
[06:25] <schweeb> udev handles device nodes... you probably screwed up the partition or something
[06:26] <schweeb> it should under most circumstances see the partitions and create the proper nodes for it
[06:28] <lamont> milli: you around?
[06:30] <milli> ya
[06:31] <milli> lamont: ya
[07:18] <bluefoxicy> damn.  All records of whichever wiki held candidates for universe for hoary are gone?
[07:18] <crimsun> package candidates or maintainer candidates?
[07:19] <bluefoxicy> crimsun:  I noticed I can install gnomebaker now
[07:19] <bluefoxicy> I just wanna know what else made it
[07:19] <bluefoxicy> as I couldn't about a month ago
[07:20] <bluefoxicy> the wikipage it was on used to be in the topic either here or in #ubuntu so I popped in here
[07:20] <bluefoxicy> but it's time that I sleep, so goodnight.
[07:43] <Burgundavia> can I get some feedback on a brochure I am working on?
[07:43] <Burgundavia> http://img106.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img106&image=ubuntubrochure4uz.png
[07:46] <robitaille> Burgundavia,  not sure I like the font of the "about: ubuntu" at the top...it seems a bit squezzed on my screen
[07:46] <Burgundavia> ok
[07:46] <Burgundavia> I was playing in inkscape
[07:47] <SuperLag> tseng: ping
[07:48] <Burgundavia> robitaille, what do you think of it generally?
[07:49] <robitaille> Burgundavia,  it's nice
[07:50] <robitaille> Burgundavia,   very sunny colours :)
[07:50] <Burgundavia> it is advertising
[07:55] <Burgundavia> robitaille, any other things you would suggest?
[07:58] <robitaille> Burgundavia,  I would move the "Hoary Hedgehog" line a little bit to the left to see the corner of the "square"
[07:58] <Burgundavia> hmm
[07:58] <Burgundavia> I actually split the rect at the corners
[07:58] <Burgundavia> and then moved them
[07:59] <robitaille> Burgundavia,  I don't know...just personal preference really.  It's a pretty minor since it looks pretty good
[08:00] <Burgundavia> ok
[08:00] <Burgundavia> little things make the difference between good and great
[08:15] <toresbe> Burgundavia: sort of nice, but the fonts are way too squished
[08:15] <toresbe> uh, s/sort of//
[08:16] <Burgundavia> ok
[08:16] <Burgundavia> changed that
[08:16] <toresbe> great 
[08:17] <toresbe> Can I have the source? I'd love to play around with inkscape now that I have a box snappy enough for graphics (woo!)
[08:18] <Burgundavia> I plan to dual license under CC by SA 2.0 and GFDL
[08:18] <Burgundavia> it will be part of the doc team stuff
[08:18] <toresbe> hah, now I know what non-nerds feel like in front of nerds
[08:18] <toresbe> I'm a license noob, what did you just say? :)
[08:19] <Burgundavia> rofl
[08:19] <Burgundavia> GFDL is the Gnu Free Documentation License
[08:19] <Burgundavia> is not really that great
[08:19] <Burgundavia> CC by SA 2.0 is the Creative Commons Share Alike Attribution License 2.0
[08:19] <Burgundavia> the both say the same thing at the end of hte day
[08:20] <Burgundavia> you can use this, as long as you release under the same license as you got it
[08:20] <Burgundavia> ala GPL
[08:22] <toresbe> ah, okay
[08:22] <Burgundavia> toresbe, msg me your email
[08:25] <Lathiat> maswan: mm at 22:00 i think it might have topped you out again :)
[08:26] <toresbe> crimsun: ping
[09:29] <Burgundavia> any #ubuntu chan ops here?
[09:39] <mooch> daniels, tseng: heh, thanks, man... ;)
[09:39] <mooch> s/man/men/
[09:49] <dholbach> morning
[09:53] <Lathiat> afternoon
[09:54] <jdub> morning dholbach 
[09:54] <jdub> dholbach: read whiprush's blog :)
[09:54] <ajmitch> hi dholbach :)
[09:55] <dholbach> jdub: hey! its not on our planet, is it?
[09:55] <jdub> no, whiprush is not a member yet
[09:55] <dholbach> i think he is?
[09:55] <dholbach> hrm, but not sure
[09:56] <dholbach> so where IS his blog?
[09:56] <ajmitch> heh, nice blog post
[09:56] <ajmitch> www.whiprush.org
[09:56] <dholbach> thanks :-)
[09:57] <dholbach> HAHHHAHA
[09:58] <ajmitch> dholbach: you didn't quite get to 400, right? :)
[09:58] <dholbach> 300
[09:58] <ajmitch> impressive
[09:58] <dholbach> "i'm no dholbach" ... wish i could say that sometimes
[09:58] <dholbach> and somebody else would finish my thesis ;-)
[09:58] <jdub> ha ha :)
[10:00] <dholbach> but this is really funny, thanks jdub for telling me :-)
[10:01] <jdub> thousands of kilometres away, people are still singing your praises ;)
[10:03] <dholbach> jdub: the lot at marks house is STILL on the loose?
[10:03] <jdub> heh, i hope not ;)
[10:04] <dholbach> what really amazed me are the mails to the apt-get.org maintainers - i ONLY got positive reactions and some are thrilled to hear about joining the MOTU forces
[10:04] <jdub> awesome
[10:04] <dholbach> although i didnt send off the mail to joeyh yet :-)
[10:05] <jdub> i'm sure they're thrilled at the opportunity to contribute to something officially
[10:05] <dholbach> yes... exactly
[10:05] <jdub> IN THE TEAM!
[10:10] <mooch> jdub: how was the party yesterday?
[10:10] <jdub> mooch: i'm in sydney :)
[10:10] <mooch> jdub: so? no party there? ;)
[10:10] <jdub> we had an installfest today
[10:10] <jdub> but no party 
[10:11] <jdub> way too tired :)
[10:11] <dholbach> whiprush: tell metallikop and the others "thanks" from me - it was really funny :-)
[10:11] <mooch> jdub: i was thinking about getting a domain for my musical career, and thought about jesusdub.something, but then i remembered your nickname and sounds way too similar...
[10:12] <mooch> jdub: i went yesterday to celebrate that the university in Helsinki is lending the conference center for debconf for free, and went to a dance party... which turned out to be a gothic party
[10:12] <mooch> puah!
[10:12] <dholbach> a pity pitti isnt here... i'm sure our security man could hack my dad's hacked server back :-/
[10:57] <pitti> Hi
[11:00] <dholbach> hey pitti
[11:45] <sivang> good morning post hoary ubutntu development channel :-)
[11:45] <dholbach> hey sivang  :-)
[11:45] <sivang> dholbach: hi daniel, what's up? still rushing work?
[11:46] <dholbach> no... was just about to go to the flea market :-)
[11:46] <dholbach> sivang: how are you?
[11:48] <sivang> dholbach: pretty good, you?
[11:49] <dholbach> sivang: fine thanks :-)
[11:49] <dholbach> sivang: i guess murphy needs her walk, so i'm out for now
[11:49] <dholbach> see you later!
[11:49] <sivang> dholbach: laters
[11:57] <toresbe> crap! the fleemarket!
[11:57] <toresbe> Shit! I forgot about that! crap!
[12:12] <jdub> yo
[12:12] <jdub> anyone here use ndiswrapper?
[12:12] <daniels> not any more
[12:13] <jdub> do you have the card?
[12:13] <daniels> sure do
[12:13] <daniels> (unfortunately)
[12:13] <jdub> when was the last time you tried it?
[12:13] <daniels> about two months ago?  the card turned out to be horrifically shit and bascially stopped anything associating to the network when I used it
[12:13] <jdub> heh
[12:13] <daniels> so I stopped using it, and now my desktop just routes via my laptop
[12:13] <jdub> can you give it a whirl again?
[12:14] <daniels> sure.  it's an acx111 (free drivers are just as bad as ndiswrapper).
[12:14] <jdub> styx is trying some assmonkey linksys card
[12:14] <jdub> and it's not working
[12:14] <jdub> can't set essid
[12:14] <daniels> but if it doesn't associate, I dunno whether that's hardware being fucked or ... ah, hold on
[12:14] <Lathiat> a mate of mine has an acx111, didn't want to work so well.
[12:14] <daniels> try sudo iwconfig wlan0 key off
[12:14] <daniels> then setting the essid
[12:15] <daniels> sometimes, you need to set either 'key off' or a nickname before it will let you associate
[12:15] <daniels> don't forget ifconfig foo0 up, too
[12:15] <jdub> hrm
[12:15] <jdub> wlan0     IEEE 802.11g  ESSID:off/any  Nickname:"pants"
[12:15] <jdub> ^ ncan never get essid out of off/any
[12:17] <jdub> nup
[12:17] <jdub> no love at all
[12:20] <daniels> not with key off, or key open?
[12:20] <daniels> and is the interface up?
[12:20] <jdub> no, can't set that at all
[12:20] <daniels> can't set key off?
[12:21] <jdub> $ sudo iwconfig wlan0 key off
[12:21] <jdub> Error for wireless request "Set Encode" (8B2A) :
[12:21] <jdub>     SET failed on device wlan0 ; Invalid argument.
[12:21] <jdub> 
[12:21] <jdub> interface is up
[12:21] <daniels> bongtasmic
[12:21] <jdub> that's exactly what i was thinking!
[12:22] <jdub> assmonkeycard!
[12:22] <daniels> no idea, sorry; let me throw the pci card in
[12:22] <jdub> oh, don't bother then
[12:22] <jdub> someone else will have a cardbus thingy to try
[12:22] <daniels> ahr
[12:23] <jdub> i'm basically worried that we h0rked ndiswrapper
[12:23] <jdub> 'cos i'm SURE i had this card working on my laptop
[12:23] <jdub> doesn't work on mine or styx's
[12:27] <kent> I compiled a -xine version of rhythmbox (to be able to play radiostations with realaudio) and when i was done, the deb-packet is recogniced as older than the one in the ubuntu-archives, even though they seem to have the same version-number. What can I do to change that? I downloaded the source with apt-get source and built it with dpkg-buildpackage
[12:29] <Burgundavia> not being a packager, you might try a conflict in the debian control
[12:30] <jordi> kent: edit debian/changelog and bump the version number in the first line.
[12:33] <jsgotangco> jdub u there?
[12:33] <jdub> yo
[12:33] <jsgotangco> ill pm you instead
[12:33] <jdub> ok!
[12:37] <kent> jordi, thanks. I saw that one my self a minute ago :)  Now the only problem is that it seems to not want to play mp3's, but I think i can manage that one my self. It compiles against xine now and atleast I can listen to radiostations. The swedish national radio-stations use realaudio, and rhythmbox with gstreamer cant handle that :(
[12:37] <jordi> kent: np
[12:37] <daniels> specific 0.23 alpha out; has gnome 2.10, gcc3.3 and kerberos.  http://www.specifix.com/blogs/index.php?blog=5&m=20050408
[12:38] <jdub> ARGH!
[12:38] <jdub> AAAAARGH!
[12:38] <jordi>   * debian/patches/04_bookmarks_menu.patch:
[12:38] <jordi>     - removed the bookmarks menu entry.
[12:38] <jdub> I'M HAVING A CONARY!
[12:38] <jordi> hmm, this patch is going our package
[12:38] <jordi> err, wrong channel
[12:40] <Burgundavia> I never understood the purpose of listing all your updates apps in one big list
[12:49] <kent> jordi, strange. It seems that when i did as you said, dpkg-buildpackage fails when applying patches. Is that expected?
[12:52] <jordi> hmm. it shouldn't
[12:52] <azeem_> CDBS tries to apply stuff again because it doesn't keep track I guess
[12:54] <kent> jordi, To be sure its not my fault, i downloaded the source agin and will only do change changelog in debian/ and add the option to compile against xine in rules.
[12:54] <jordi> nod
[12:58] <kent> yes box! It compiles. 
[01:08] <kent> jordi, rhythmbox with xine is buggy, :(  I could not import mp3s without making it crash :( I guess i understand why there aren't a rhythmbox-xine package in the archives ;)
[01:09] <tseng> or because gstreamer works well enough for audio, and is freely distributable
[01:09] <tseng> or at least the core is.
[01:11] <kent> tseng, but it cant play realaudio radiostations-  If only there was an easy way to get a plugin for that for gstreamer :(
[01:11] <tseng> the only thing i know that plays realaudio is .. realaudio
[01:11] <tseng> and w32codecs
[01:11] <tseng> gst is supposed to support those someday, alledgedly
[01:12] <kent> tseng, well, since totem-xine can play the radiostation with realaudio, my guess was that rhythmbox with xine (and the w32codecs) would also be able to do so. 
[01:13] <tseng> quite possibly.
[01:14] <kent> but if gstreamer was able to do it, i would rather use it. But it seems not doable right now. :(
[01:15] <Burgundavia> tseng, you see this note about mono and debian?
[01:15] <tseng> Burgundavia: which
[01:16] <Burgundavia> tseng, http://www.meebey.net/jaws/index.php?gadget=Blog&action=SingleView&id=19
[01:16] <tseng> Burgundavia: yes ive been talking to him on irc
[01:17] <Burgundavia> tseng, figured as much
[01:17] <tseng> Burgundavia: i sent him a bunch of un /usr/share/dotnet bindings
[01:17] <tseng> for review also.
[01:19] <tseng> Burgundavia: actually, if you look at the MonoDebianPlan, i sent him a package for most of the stuff still on the list
[01:19] <tseng> gtk# 1+2, monodoc, gecko, gtksourceview#
[01:27] <jdub> tseng: rock!
[01:28] <tseng> jdub: breezy will rock the mono.
[01:29] <jdub> so you reckon 1.1.x will be doable when breezy opens?
[01:29] <jsgotangco> whoo
[01:29] <tseng> jdub: if we want to take the first batch of testing stuff
[01:29] <jdub> let's do it
[01:29] <jdub> breezy is going to be so broken anyway during merge ;)
[01:29] <tseng> sure why not
[01:30] <tseng> cant be worse than it is now
[01:30] <thoreauputic> are you guys aware that  http://www.ubuntulinux.org/support/documentation/faq has an empty FAQ now? Just thought I's mention...
[01:30] <jdub> may as well blaze fun trails ;)
[01:30] <thoreauputic> *I'd
[01:30] <jsgotangco> hmm
[01:30] <Lathiat> maswan: interesting, ftp mirrors have gone right up again?
[01:30] <jsgotangco> let me check that maybe it still has a recyled page
[01:31] <jsgotangco> but it probably is so old
[01:31] <lesshaste> I agree with thoreauputic by the way :)
[01:33] <jsgotangco> whoa its empty
[01:33] <jsgotangco> i though it was wiki
[01:33] <lesshaste> yep.
[01:33] <thoreauputic> jsgotangco: Some people might think no one ever asks questions ;-)
[01:34] <Pizbit> thoreauputic: We can but hope!
[01:34] <thoreauputic> heheh :)
[01:34] <jsgotangco> heh
[01:34] <jsgotangco> i wonder who has access to site
[01:35] <jsgotangco> the /support/marketplace/ also gives a 404
[01:35] <jsgotangco> community front page has old css
[01:58] <kent> Goshawk, If i remember correct, your the one who did usplash, the thing that might get into next ubuntu? I tried the new deb packets on your page.. and it actually works. Very nice!
[01:59] <Goshawk> kent, what you have tried it very old
[01:59] <Goshawk> we have already implemented the configuration file in xml
[01:59] <Goshawk> ^__^
[01:59] <Goshawk> you can change everything (image, colors, progressbars and so on)
[01:59] <kent> Goshawk, well, there is a 0.1 in your homepage right? I tried that one. I get graphics, and a statusbar. Thats all I need :)
[01:59] <trukulo> daniels, you there? just want to inform that ati igp 320m has 3d acceleration now, perhaps problem was related to readahead not installed, don't know for sure
[01:59] <Goshawk> but we need ubuntu developers consensus to relase the 0.1 version that is ready
[02:00] <Goshawk> kent, you tried the 0.1preview
[02:00] <trukulo> but in last hoary upgrade (yesterday) suddenly 3d start to work here
[02:00] <Goshawk> kent, thanks ^__^
[02:00] <kent> Goshawk, yes.. thats the one. Id there a deb package for a newer version? 
[02:01] <Goshawk> kent, i hope people in ubuntu will give consensus to use "usplash" term because my usplash works different as it is described in the wiki page of ubuntu
[02:01] <Goshawk> kent, no there is not a package, we can't relase it until i have ubuntu consensus
[02:02] <Goshawk> kent, ah! there is also a splash on the shutdown process :-)
[02:02] <kent> Goshawk, ok.  I hope they will use it. Or something else that works as well. I have no issues with it. :) Well, a way to configure themes would be nice :)
[02:03] <trukulo> Goshawk, i'd like to try it
[02:03] <kent> Goshawk, realy? working in the preview or the  0.1?
[02:03] <Goshawk> yes.. for the preview there was no problem, after the preview ubuntu developers said stop, and i stopped
[02:04] <Goshawk> trukulo, you can try the 0.1preview at http://wiki.nanofreesoft.org/index.php/UsplashHowDoesItWork
[02:04] <trukulo> Goshawk, thanks
[02:07] <kent> Goshawk, though I had one problem with the version before this. If i removed it with dpkg then it seemed not to remove all files and bring me back to default pre-usplash (after remove i still got the graphics on boot). The version before didn't work, i got some scrambled graphics.. And since i could not remove it completly it was a bit frustrating. I have not tried to remove it now, but since it works and looks nice, i
[02:07] <kent>  dont want to remove it.
[02:08] <Goshawk> :-) 
[02:08] <Goshawk> kent, good philosophy
[02:31] <trukulo> hi baby
[02:31] <mdke> hi
[02:31] <mdke> oh sorry
[02:36] <maswan> Lathiat: yes. I removed the redirect in the belief that it was a one-time spike that was over last night. I was wrong.
[02:37] <Lathiat> maswan: haha
[02:38] <ogra> OMG....
[02:38] <ogra> morining
[02:39] <trukulo> morning ogra
[02:39] <dholbach> hey ogra 
[02:39] <ogra> hwdb gets bombed with submissions.....
[02:39] <Pizbit> ogra: How many so far?
[02:39] <ogra> 7100
[02:40] <ogra> but the normal daily rate the last 10 days was around 500
[02:40] <ogra> currently there are already 860 for today....
[02:40] <maswan> I'm getting rather good at spelling "graceful" blind these days. :)
[02:41] <ogra> so i assume we end up around 1500/day
[02:41] <ogra> dholbach, i see you  :-P
[02:42] <dholbach> hm? me?
[02:42] <dholbach> must be ... err... my neighbour :-)
[02:42] <ogra> dholbach, yop.... digging in the db
[02:42] <ogra> hehe
[02:43] <ogra> dholbach, oh, and you just pointed me to another broken record, thanks :)
[02:44] <kent> ogra, does the hwdb-system has any way of notice if its a duplicate of an already reported system? Like, i reported a day (or two..) before final Hoary. Would it be marked as a duplicate if i reported again today?
[02:45] <Lathiat> kent: the second time you open the client it just gives you a link to your submission
[02:45] <ogra> kent, it uses md5sums as record names, so just submit again, if you submit the same thing it will be overwritten, if it is new, its new ;)
[02:46] <ogra> kent, you have to dlete ~/.hwdb to make a new submission, else you get pointed to your record
[02:46] <sladen> ...and assuming the spec of the machine hasn't changed in the meantime
[02:46] <kent> Lathiat, ogra, i just ran the client.  It works,  i get the last submission :) great!
[02:47] <ogra> :)
[02:51] <maswan> we have served about 5TB of ubuntu the last 24 hours now. :)
[02:51] <dholbach> WOW
[02:51] <mdke> cool
[02:51] <maswan> probably about 6 since the release then
[02:52] <AstralJava> maswan: That's awesome.
[02:53] <maswan> I think us.releases have a similar track record, they pushed their gigE up to 800-something Mbit/s
[02:53] <sladen> maswan: 5TB/day is about 550 Megabit
[02:53] <Treenaks> Whatever happens, there needs to be an easy way to say "I want to mount these partitions on boot" in breezy
[02:54] <sladen> so, that's a couple of Gbit of Ubuntu...  5% of LINX...
[02:54] <ogra> Treenaks, write a gui to do so :-P
[02:54] <Robot101> did they stop throttling the release server now? :)
[02:54] <kent> maswan, is that data from ubuntus official archive or some mirror? It would be nice to see some statistic about this release compared to warty. (Some people are using hoary from pre-final so its probably hard to see.. but some ~data would be cool.
[02:54] <AstralJava> Is there gonna be a new installer for Breezy?
[02:54] <Treenaks> I'm getting the first hoary users in #ubuntu-nl, and they're breaking their systems with sudo -s and running kate from there
[02:54] <Treenaks> ogra: oh I might
[02:54] <Treenaks> ogra: HAL-based :)
[02:54] <maswan> kent: that's se.releases.ubuntu.com, which is a mirror
[02:54] <maswan> kent: but that one is also part of the releases.ubuntu.com RR dns name
[02:54] <kent> maswan, swedish mirror? :)
[02:55] <ogra> Treenaks, yeah, cool
[02:55] <maswan> kent: It's listed on the download page as "Europe" :)
[02:57] <jdub> maswan: can you differentiate between kubuntu and ubuntu?
[02:59] <dholbach> jdub: can we get such a world map for ubuntu, herzi already has http://blaubeermuffin.de/deutschlandkarte/ - we !need! that for LoCo stuff :-)
[02:59] <maswan> jdub: not until the xferstats stuff has run, and it hasn't yet
[02:59] <jdub> dudes
[02:59] <jdub> holy crap
[02:59] <Lathiat> jdub: at?
[02:59] <jdub> 515 people on #ubuntu
[02:59] <daniels> 22:59 -!- Irssi: #ubuntu: Total of 516 nicks [1 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 515 normal] 
[02:59] <Lathiat> whats it usually at?
[03:00] <dholbach> were 565 yesterday
[03:00] <jdub> maybe 250
[03:00] <jdub> but i haven't really been watching since last release
[03:00] <Lathiat> nuts
[03:00] <jdub> so it may have been steadily rising
[03:00] <jdub> usually around 300ish i think
[03:00] <daniels> it was around 300 ~48-72h ago, IIRC
[03:00] <jdub> dholbach: yes, oddly enough, that was why i originally did the gnome one
[03:01] <jdub> dholbach: easier to do with the gnome wiki ;)
[03:01] <apokryphos> Nah, it was usually in the higher 300s
[03:01] <dholbach> yes! yes! yes!!! give us maps!
[03:01] <AstralJava> jdub: It has been ca. 400 during the last two months I've occasionally stopped by.
[03:01] <Lathiat> 179, 209, 88, 291, 302, 268, 258, 260, 290, 274
[03:01] <daniels> dholbach: do you !need! it, or need! it?
[03:01] <Lathiat> so, high 200s looking
[03:01] <dholbach> daniels: need! to be exact ;-)
[03:01] <Lathiat> march 31st = 436
[03:02] <Lathiat> 394 on march 27th
[03:02] <jdub> dholbach: hrm
[03:02] <Lathiat> 356 on march 4
[03:02] <jdub> dholbach: actually, now i've figured out how to get the source
[03:02] <jdub> dholbach: i can do it now
[03:02] <dholbach> jdub: that would completely rock!
[03:03] <dholbach> jdub: we then need it on ubuntu-users@ and #ubuntu, to make sure we harvest everyone and know where we are ... people-wise :-)
[03:03] <jdub> dholbach: yeah :)
[03:03] <jdub> dholbach: and sounder, to get the loco teams to do it ;)
[03:04] <dholbach> jdub: you can imagine the pain of having !2! people on a release party?
[03:04] <dholbach> i know there are more happy ubuntu users around me
[03:04] <mdke> lol
[03:04] <jdub> heh
[03:04] <kent> its more people on #ubuntu than #fedora. Atleast everytime i have been on #fedora during the last months.
[03:05] <jdub> kent: yeah, i just joined/parted to check ;)
[03:05] <dholbach> jdub: i need to know where i can give my MOTU recruitment talks :-)
[03:06] <ogra> dholbach, in #ubuntu-motu-recruitement, the little room with the single table and the lamp ;)
[03:06] <dholbach> ogra: nah... that's boring :-)
[03:06] <ogra> :)
[03:06] <maswan> dholbach: so, flashing lights and interesting small pills instead? ;)
[03:07] <ogra> maswan, we call this Techno Party
[03:07] <dholbach> maswan: that doesn't sound like a "talk"ing atmosphere :-)
[03:07] <maswan> dholbach: you got to break down their resistance first. ;)
[03:07] <dholbach> maswan: but you're right, i should point out MOTU was about fun in the first place :_)
[03:07] <mdke> wine and dine em
[03:07] <ajmitch_> why would they want to resist? :)
[03:07] <maswan> dholbach: then rebuild them as good motus the next day. :)
[03:08] <ogra> maswan, first he has to process the queue
[03:08] <dholbach> maswan: jdub already agreed with me on MOTU boot camps around the globe :-)
[03:08] <maswan> dholbach: hehe. good work. :)
[03:08] <dholbach> yeah, rock! :-)
[03:09] <herzi> i'm sure dholbach would make a good drill instructor
[03:09] <herzi> ;)
[03:09] <ogra> yeah :) the best teacher we have around
[03:09] <dholbach> herzi: fabbione would need to train me a bit :-)
[03:09] <ogra> lol
[03:09] <dholbach> herzi: he's good at larting people
[03:09] <jdub> dholbach: 
[03:09] <jdub> dholbach: dude
[03:09] <jdub> https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/UbuntuWorldWide
[03:10] <jdub> pop your details on there
[03:10] <jdub> i'll start uploading images :)
[03:10] <ogra> YEAH
[03:11] <Pizbit> Hrm, anyone else have a mouse that's incredibly sluggish at times?
[03:12] <maswan> Hmm.. This is the first reason I've had to do anything with the wiki. Unless someone else feels like taking mine/se.releases' coordinates. ;)
[03:16] <dholbach> editing the wiki is hell, i hope the people will soon have ubuntu CDs :-)
[03:16] <Treenaks> the wiki is SLOW
[03:16] <dholbach> it's more a bandwidth issue
[03:17] <maswan> I think part of it is that www.ubuntulinux.org is hit for the icons in the directory listings for all releases/etc downloads on the primary mirrors
[03:18] <jdub> so moin image markup doesn't seem to work in zwiki
[03:19] <Treenaks> it looks quite ugly, yes
[03:24] <jdub> hrm
[03:24] <jdub> that didn't work either
[03:25] <jdub> ah ha ha
[03:25] <jdub> oops
[03:26] <Lathiat> whatd you break jdub :)
[03:26] <jdub> i just didn't use the right url
[03:26] <jdub> there we go
[03:26] <Lathiat> so i hear where going to have videos on 3d spinning cubes :)
[03:26] <jdub> lovely
[03:27] <Treenaks> jdub: now again, but with markers :P
[03:27] <Lathiat> haha
[03:28] <zenwhen> hey zenrox 
[03:28] <jdub> it was uploaded before yours were added
[03:32] <dholbach> jdub: put me on the map! :-)
[03:32] <jdub> doing an update now
[03:32] <dholbach> woohoo!
[03:33] <dholbach> :-)
[03:33] <tseng> yay, im a floating head
[03:33] <jdub> grr, comments appear in the src
[03:33] <daniels> ahr, sorry
[03:34] <jsgotangco> ooohhh nice stuff jdub
[03:34] <jdub> daniels: it was bound to happen
[03:35] <imka> hi
[03:35] <dholbach> hey imka 
[03:35] <imka> i can't make it into bugzilla. when i try to accept the certificate, firefox crashes
[03:36] <dilinger> daniels: oh yea, had a quick question for you.  in xfree86-common's postinst in hoary's xorg, there's a bit that removes the init script if it exists (since the socket stuff is handled by xorg-common now).  however, it doesn't seem to get removed if there are symlinks; instead, it requests usage of '-f' for update-rc.d remove.  was this intentional, or was the -f just forgotten?
[03:36] <jdub> daniels: sorted :)
[03:37] <daniels> jdub: i've already fixed it, you muppet
[03:37] <jdub> oh
[03:37] <jdub> you are the muppet!
[03:37] <dilinger> s/if there are symlinks/if there's an init script/
[03:37] <jordi> muppet muppet muppet
[03:37] <daniels> dilinger: forgotten
[03:37] <imka> any ideas why firefox crashes when i try to accept the cerificate trying to access bugzilla?
[03:38] <dilinger> daniels: ok.  want me to file a bug?
[03:38] <daniels> dilinger: yeah, sure
[03:38] <tseng> jeez im the first guy in the W hemisphere
[03:39] <jdub> daniels: haha
[03:39] <tseng> map me!
[03:41] <jdub> daniels: ok, so how do you delete a comment?
[03:41] <dholbach> jdub: just edit the "source"
[03:41] <daniels> jdub: i already have
[03:41] <jdub> oh
[03:41] <jdub> daniels: i added it again
[03:41] <daniels> except you broke it :P
[03:41] <jdub> dholbach: i guess that makes sense
[03:41] <jdub> (STUPID!)
[03:42] <dholbach> jdub: don't beat yourself up:-)
[03:42] <tseng> the next guy that edits it, fix my name please
[03:42] <tseng> no space
[03:42] <imka> i can't access bugzilla. could someone help me? firefox crashes when i try to accept the certificate
[03:42] <maswan> damn.
[03:42] <maswan> I broke it. :)
[03:42] <jdub> tseng: done
[03:43] <jdub> nope
[03:43] <jsgotangco> nice map everyoneis invited?
[03:43] <jdub> someone else was editing
[03:43] <dholbach> that editing conflicts drain all the love
[03:43] <tseng> jsgotangco: i think its meant for "members", motus and canonical folks
[03:43] <jdub> it's for everyone
[03:43] <jsgotangco> understood
[03:43] <tseng> its easy to pitch in and become a member :)
[03:44] <Lathiat> just throw insults around at people, its contributing :)
[03:44] <tseng> yeah dude
[03:44] <tseng> lets vote on HG
[03:44] <jsgotangco> ok you suck *grin*
[03:44] <tseng> jsgotangco: < jdub> it's for everyone
[03:44] <tseng> add away.
[03:46] <jdub> maswan: i'll run the script again now
[03:46] <maswan> jdub: thanks
[03:47] <maswan> I'm used to this format for coordinates:
[03:47] <maswan> mw.mw LOC 63 48 37.000 N 20 20 17.000 E 50.00m 1m 30m 10m
[03:48] <tsume_> have the other version for the next development branch been started yet?
[03:48] <jdub> nup
[03:48] <dholbach> tsume_: nope
[03:49] <tsume_> dholbach: when should it be expexted to start?
[03:49] <tsume_> *expected
[03:49] <dholbach> 2 weeks or something
[03:49] <dholbach> dunno myself
[03:49] <Robot101> is there an intro to how the livecd is put together on the wiki?
[03:49] <dholbach> Robot101: yes
[03:50] <Robot101> and does the livecd have debs on it? I foolishly gave someone my release candidate install CD and then came home, so I don't have anything to rsync up
[03:50] <dholbach> searching for "live cd" should be fine
[03:50] <Robot101> my ADSL is choking on the torrent :)
[03:50] <tseng> sweet, i own the whole US
[03:50] <jdub> tseng: which city are you in?
[03:50] <tseng> West Chester
[03:50] <jdub> NY?
[03:50] <Robot101> is the wiki slow, or me, or both? :)
[03:50] <tseng> closest major city is Philly
[03:50] <tseng> PA
[03:50] <jdub> ahar
[03:51] <jdub> 23:50 < SuperQ> OMG WTF LOL
[03:51] <jdub> daniels: ^ one for you
[03:51] <tseng> WTFBBQ
[03:51] <Lathiat> omgwtfbbq lol hai2u asl
[03:51] <Lathiat> !!!111eleventy-one111 :)
[03:51] <Robot101> kthxbye
[03:52] <Lathiat> Robot101: nono, its kthxbai :)
[03:52] <Robot101> no its not
[03:52] <Robot101> see mjg59
[03:52] <maswan> heh. proof-by-mjg59
[03:52] <Robot101> see mjg59's DPL nomination e-mail :P
[03:53] <Lathiat> haha
[03:53] <Lathiat> i'll have to go read
[03:53] <Lathiat> someone got a url?
[03:53] <jdub> www.angrydpl.com
[03:53] <Pizbit> heh
[03:53] <Lathiat> i saw that
[03:53] <ogra_> geeez hwdb just got it 1000st submission in one day....(the average was 500)
[03:53] <daniels> crazy :)
[03:54] <jdub> ogra_: nice!
[03:54] <ogra_> i'll be running out of diskspace soon..... already 1,5GB of data
[03:55] <maswan> ogra_: your small computer about to run out of hardware? :)
[03:55] <Robot101> jdub: that's not his nomination e-mail
[03:55] <jdub> Robot101: IT'S GOOD ENOUGH
[03:55] <Robot101> Lathiat: lists.debian.org/debian-vote last month or so
[03:55] <ogra_> maswan, i have 9G for user data on this server....4,5 are donated to hwdb currently.... but at this rate it will be full next weekend
[03:56] <Robot101> jdub: possibly counterproductive to the actual campaign though
[03:56] <Lathiat> website is crawling :\
[03:56] <Lathiat> didn't we get the bandwidth issue fixed yet?
[03:56] <Lathiat> or is the server just choking?
[03:57] <ogra_> maswan, but its still impressive that a dual pII233 and 128MB stays responsive like that under this heavy load....
[03:57] <jdub> hrm
[03:57] <jdub> do i stay up until 0500 to pick up thom
[03:57] <jdub> or go to sleep and play alarm roulette?
[03:58] <daniels> stay up
[03:58] <daniels> go downstairs and grab a Sprite Recharge or four
[03:58] <daniels> are you picking him up, or is he rocking around?
[03:58] <jdub> i have two in the fridge
[03:58] <jdub> well, he thinks he's rocking around
[03:58] <sladen> Robot101: you could always update it.  it's a wiki-by-ftp
[03:58] <jdub> but i am going to meet him at the airport
[03:58] <Lathiat> you guys meeting up for some patying?
[03:58] <jdub> i wasn't going to be in sydney
[03:59] <jdub> thom's coming over a week early
[03:59] <jdub> get some sydney weather to heal him up
[03:59] <jdub> after ELMO THREW A SERVER AT HIM
[03:59] <maswan> go elmo!
[03:59] <ogra_> heh
[03:59] <Lathiat> haha what did he do :)
[03:59] <jdub> *HULK SMASH SQUISH*
[04:00] <sladen> ''I this week on WWF Worldwide, Elmo...''
[04:00] <jdub> we have someone from calcutta on the map already
[04:00] <Lathiat> d
[04:00] <maswan> ah. the log resolver thingie asn't finished yet. that's why we don't have detailed statistics yet
[04:00] <ogra_> argh....its rising....: http://hwdb.ubuntu.com/nullswap.html
[04:01] <Lathiat> i really think we should move to swapfiles
[04:01] <Lathiat> and have it automatically create one
[04:01] <ogra_> Lathiat, doesnt work with hibernate
[04:01] <Lathiat> does with swsusp2 :)
[04:01] <Lathiat> go the file writer!
[04:01] <Lathiat> also works on swap in files too
[04:01] <sladen> swsusp2 is a pile of !^%"
[04:01] <Lathiat> sladen: why do you say that?
[04:01] <ogra_> Lathiat, swsusp2 is *ouch*
[04:01] <Lathiat> works fine here, far better than swsusp at any rate.
[04:01] <Lathiat> any rate i care about anyway
[04:02] <dholbach> bbl
[04:02] <jdub> you're not running an ubuntu kernel?
[04:02] <jdub> HERESY!
[04:02] <Lathiat> everyone says taht but no ones ratified it to me yet :)
[04:02] <Lathiat> jdub: i don't use it now anyway
[04:02] <sladen> however, swapfiles should work with early-userspace
[04:02] <Lathiat> i jut suspend to ram 
[04:02] <Lathiat> *just
[04:02] <Lathiat> i used to run it on my old 266 laptop
[04:02] <Lathiat> best thing ever
[04:02] <daniels> yeah
[04:02] <ogra_> jdub, good choice :)
[04:02] <ogra_> jdub, and you always know who to blame *g*
[04:03] <Lathiat> i tried making my own kernel to play with new inotify 
[04:03] <Lathiat> and it was just too much pain :)
[04:03] <jdub> 0.22 is out now
[04:03] <jdub> and gamin patches
[04:03] <Lathiat> im waiting for new breezy devel kernels :)
[04:03] <jdub> hopefully they'll go into breezy soon enough
[04:03] <Lathiat> ok thats definately a bug
[04:03] <Lathiat> the login form on the site asks for your eamil
[04:03] <Lathiat> *email
[04:03] <sladen> when are the breezy queues opening?
[04:04] <Lathiat> but it really wants the number you get in the email
[04:04] <jdub> soonish
[04:04] <ogra_> jdub, do you have an idea if we will have pythin-cairo in time for breezy ?
[04:04] <jdub> when elmo stops throwing servers at people
[04:04] <jdub> ogra_: hrm.
[04:04] <ogra_> s/i/o
[04:04] <Lathiat> jdub: what did he do :)
[04:04] <jdub> ogra_: you're so the eyecandy hornbag. :)
[04:04] <maswan> Lathiat: the email worked well too, at least for me
[04:04] <ogra_> lol
[04:04] <Lathiat> maswan: not for me
[04:05] <Lathiat> not the first login at least
[04:08] <elmo> jdub: dude, it was a rack door - I don't do things in half measures
[04:08] <jdub> elmo: didn't want to risk the overendowed ipods?
[04:09] <maswan> elmo: hey, did you get the bandwidth stuff fixed? at least we got another surge today. :)
[04:09] <Lathiat> oh duh, righ tthere
[04:09] <jdub> Lathiat: log in
[04:09] <jdub> Lathiat: or just add a comment
[04:09] <Robot101> sladen: how's the usplash coming?
[04:09] <Lathiat> jdub: yeh did, just missed the edit button :)
[04:09] <elmo> maswan: no :( still fighting with our ISP about it
[04:09] <maswan> elmo: :/
[04:09] <maswan> Oh, well. At least it seems less traffic than yesterday.
[04:09] <tseng> elmo: can you look into adding me to keyring if you havent already?
[04:10] <ogra> elmo, we'll need to talk next week about moving hwdb to a server with a HUGE disk, 1.6 G in 11 days.... and the submission rate rises fast :)
[04:10] <elmo> tseng: are you Brandon?
[04:10] <tseng> elmo: yes.
[04:11] <elmo> ogra: eh, compressed?
[04:11] <ogra> elmo, nope, unpacked....(transfer is bz2 compressed though)
[04:12] <elmo> ogra: ok
[04:12] <elmo> tseng: ok, will do - can you mail a reminder to keyring@ubuntu.com?
[04:12] <tseng> elmo: sure
[04:14] <bluefoxicy> tseng:  ndiswrapper doesn't go on amd64 does it
[04:14] <tseng> bluefoxicy: i doubt it, but i really have no idea.
[04:14] <bluefoxicy> (I have an amd64 laptop with a broadcom built in wireless)
[04:15] <tseng> is it minipci?
[04:15] <bluefoxicy> um, what?
[04:15] <Lathiat> bluefoxicy: does it appear on lspci
[04:15] <daniels> bluefoxicy: newer versions of ndiswrapper work on amd64
[04:15] <bluefoxicy> tseng:  I checked a bunch of laptops in the store, they all show broadcoms btw
[04:15] <sladen> Robot101: well, I wrote some better vesa mode detection code yesterday.  It might get used.
[04:15] <bluefoxicy> i'll check lspci when the ubuntu install finishes
[04:15] <bluefoxicy> but i believe it does.
[04:15] <bluefoxicy> dand:  nice to know
[04:16] <tseng> minipci cards are cheap and easy to replace
[04:16] <sladen> unless they have the wrong PCI ID...
[04:16] <tseng> i paid $40 for my intel
[04:16] <bluefoxicy> disturbing though, the Internet reports that according to thousands of users, most laptops these days are using broadcom cards
[04:16] <sladen> *cough*IBM*cough*HP*cough
[04:16] <Lathiat> my ipw200 is nice
[04:16] <Lathiat> ipw2200
[04:16] <Lathiat> driver almost works well
[04:16] <bluefoxicy> tseng:  it's probably sodered into the board though
[04:16] <tseng> not if its minipci...
[04:16] <Lathiat> bluefoxicy: nah, highly doubtful.
[04:17] <tseng> it goes in alot like a DIMM
[04:17] <Lathiat> the driver for ipw2200 sometimes needs reloading
[04:17] <tseng> latches down into its slot
[04:17] <trukulo> daniels, just report that ati igp has now 3d capabilities
[04:17] <zenwhen> the solution to all Linux wireless woes is the Orinoco Gold Classic
[04:17] <Lathiat> and xset dpms force off occasionally crashes the module
[04:17] <bluefoxicy> tseng:  cool.
[04:17] <Lathiat> but its otherwise good
[04:17] <daniels> trukulo: awesome :) good to hear
[04:17] <sladen> bluefoxicy: yup, Broadcom brought out an all-in-one chip.  Much cheaper than the 3-piece Orinoco chipset.  All the OEM switched, virtually overnight
[04:17] <bluefoxicy> tseng:  I know the nics that come on mobos are PCI though, but they're chips soldered onto the board.
[04:17] <trukulo> daniels, if you want any info, tell me
[04:17] <bluefoxicy> and graphics cards that are on-board tend to be the same wap
[04:17] <bluefoxicy> way
[04:18] <Lathiat> bluefoxicy: yeh but wireless cards are more often than not minipci
[04:18] <bluefoxicy> tseng:  but I've never seen a minipci card
[04:18] <bluefoxicy> so it's a moot point
[04:18] <Lathiat> bluefoxicy: in fact, i've never seen a wireless card that was soldered on
[04:18] <bluefoxicy> I can't replace something I can't find in the store.
[04:18] <Lathiat> bluefoxicy: sure you can, you can buy minipci wireless cards
[04:18] <Lathiat> driverloader does amd64
[04:18] <Lathiat> but its commercial
[04:18] <Lathiat> bluefoxicy: most minipci cards you can get to by unscrewing a panel on the bottom of your laptop
[04:19] <daniels> trukulo: sure, thanks
[04:19] <bluefoxicy> yeah
[04:19] <bluefoxicy> I noticed said panel
[04:19] <bluefoxicy> never opened it.
[04:19] <Lathiat> bluefoxicy: there will most likely also be ram under one of them
[04:19] <bluefoxicy> "no user servicable parts inside" says the cover.
[04:19] <Lathiat> i have 3
[04:19] <bluefoxicy> I know, the ram is user servicible
[04:19] <Lathiat> one for minipci, one for ram and one for my bluetooth card
[04:19] <Lathiat> actually i lie
[04:20] <Lathiat> bluetooth is in the same panel as my wireless
 is it legal to give yourself below minimum wage?
[04:20] <crimsun> toresbe: pong
[04:20] <bluefoxicy> Lathiat:  well, there needs to be a driver.
[04:20] <bluefoxicy> gimme a second.
[04:21] <Lathiat> bluefoxicy: apparently you need a 64bit version of the ndis driver
[04:21] <Lathiat> so says some mailing lists
[04:21] <Lathiat> no idea on the validity of that
[04:21] <bluefoxicy> http://linux-bcom4301.sourceforge.net/
[04:21] <bluefoxicy> Lathiat:  I know, but I have one.
[04:21] <Lathiat> bluefoxicy: in that case, ndiswrapper > v1 works apparently
[04:21] <bluefoxicy> or at least I think I do
[04:21] <bluefoxicy> win64 I think I have. . .
[04:22] <toresbe> crimsun: well that was well-timed
[04:22] <toresbe> crimsun: I just came in the door 
[04:22] <toresbe> crimsun: anyway
[04:22] <toresbe> crimsun: I was wondering about the Universe
[04:23] <bluefoxicy> Lathiat:  well I just installed 32 bit ubuntu on my amd64 laptop, is there an ndiswrapper package
[04:23] <toresbe> uh, a package in the universe
[04:23] <bluefoxicy> I know there's a utils package, but I haven't seen a driver
[04:23] <crimsun> toresbe: ok, which?
[04:23] <toresbe> crimsun: mplayer
[04:23] <toresbe> crimsun: the standard vo is wrong
[04:23] <Lathiat> ndiswrapper-source: 0.12+1.0rc2-1 0 500 http://au.archive.ubuntu.com hoary/universe Packages
[04:23] <crimsun> toresbe: they're in multiverse iirc
[04:23] <Lathiat> ndiswrapper-source - Source for the ndiswrapper linux kernel module
[04:23] <toresbe> crimsun: really? Oh.
[04:23] <ogra> toresbe, where does it point to ?
[04:24] <ogra> toresbe, the default vo that is
[04:24] <Lathiat> time for me to attempt to grok dbus
[04:24] <crimsun> the default should probably be x11 if it isn't
[04:24] <ogra> yep
[04:24] <crimsun> (since not all drivers have adequate xv)
[04:25] <ogra> yep again :)
[04:25] <crimsun> if it's not, please file a bug in malone :)
[04:25] <ogra> :)
[04:26] <Lathiat> my poor dsl connection, mirroring main is a bit hard on it :)
[04:26] <Lathiat> let alone universe.. hah
[04:28] <daniels> jdub: you don't know if thom's still planning on coming down on thursday, do you?
[04:29] <jdub> to melbourne? no ide
[04:29] <jdub> a
[04:29] <toresbe> ogra: x11
[04:30] <ogra> toresbe, perfect
[04:30] <toresbe> crimsun: it should be "xv,x11"
[04:30] <daniels> jdub: ahr
[04:30] <toresbe> so that it fall backs to x11 if xv fail
[04:30] <toresbe> s
[04:30] <daniels> er
[04:30] <daniels> imo the default should be xv
[04:30] <daniels> if your driver doesn't support xv, then xv initialisation will fail 
[04:30] <daniels> and it will fall back to xorg
[04:31] <crimsun> toresbe: file a bug in malone to change it to xv,x11
[04:31] <daniels> if it silently fails and stuff goes wrong, then file a bug on xserver-xorg and make it my problem ;)
[04:31] <toresbe> heh
[04:31] <crimsun> toresbe: and we'll change it when Breezy opens
[04:31] <Lathiat> daniels: can i do that with upstream bugs to get them fixed faster? :)
[04:32] <Lathiat> daniels: do you know if theres a bug open about the colordepth issues on nv? i couldn't see one
[04:32] <daniels> Lathiat: if they're in the radeon or i810 drivers, yes; i don't hack on the rest of them (barely have any time to hack on the first two, either)
[04:32] <daniels> Lathiat: which colourdepth issues?
[04:32] <daniels> (i.e, no)
[04:32] <Lathiat> daniels: on nv, things like gradiets look like total ass (at least on my graphics card, i've seen other reports)
[04:32] <Lathiat> it claims its in 24bit
[04:32] <Lathiat> looks like its in 16 or something
[04:32] <Lathiat> its all lined
[04:32] <ogra> Lathiat, flatpanel ?
[04:32] <Lathiat> ogra: ya
[04:33] <ogra> switch to 16bit
[04:33] <daniels> could just be a 6-bit panel
[04:33] <Lathiat> daniels: what does that mean?
[04:33] <Lathiat> it works in the binary drivers fine
[04:33] <daniels> ogra: should 16-bit be the default for nv on laptops?
[04:33] <Lathiat> so .. dunno what the difference is
[04:33] <ogra> daniels, i think so
[04:33] <daniels> Lathiat: well, some panels have 6 bits of colour information per channel
[04:33] <ogra> most of them have 16bit panels
[04:33] <Lathiat> and it defaulted to 24 here
[04:33] <daniels> Lathiat: but they can dither to 16.2M, which is *almost* 8 bit per channel
[04:33] <daniels> only that dithering looks like total arse
[04:33] <daniels> ogra: ok, will put that one in -- thanks
[04:33] <Lathiat> shoudl i try setting it to 16?
[04:34] <ogra> Lathiat, yes :)
[04:34] <Lathiat> grr
[04:34] <Lathiat> you can't startx from an xterm, not authorized
[04:34] <Lathiat> thats stupid
[04:34] <daniels> eer
[04:34] <daniels> startx -- :1
[04:34] <ogra> or xnest
[04:34] <Pizbit> Or gdmflexiserver
[04:34] <astharot> ciao
[04:34] <ogra> yup
[04:35] <mjg59> daniels: No, the X wrapper doesn't work from an xterm if it's set to console authentication
[04:35] <daniels> or just sudo Xorg :1 vt8 -ac
[04:35] <daniels> mjg59: oh yeah, good point
[04:35] <Pizbit> Applications -> System Tools -> New Login :)
[04:36] <bluefoxicy> when does breezy open
[04:37] <Lathiat> aha!
[04:37] <Lathiat> looks sweet now
[04:37] <Lathiat> daniels: startx -- :1 is what i was doing
[04:37] <Lathiat> daniels: so i should file a bug against xserver-xorg that it shoudl put 16bit colour in?
[04:37] <daniels> Lathiat: you can if you want, but I've already done it
[04:38] <Lathiat> oh and having an nvidia binary server going, opening an nv one, then switching back to the binary one makes my lcd go randomly spangy coloured fading in and out :)
[04:38] <Lathiat> daniels: oh, just then?
[04:38] <daniels> yeah, I'm not surprised that nvidia and nv don't play happily together
[04:38] <Lathiat> vbe posting with the binary drivers is fun too, does the same thing :)
[04:38] <daniels> Lathiat: yeah
[04:38] <Lathiat> daniels: sweet.
[04:38] <Lathiat> thats been annoying me for a long time
[04:39] <Lathiat> maybe my video overlays will work now
[04:39] <Lathiat> huzaah, they do
[04:39] <Lathiat> ogra, daniels: thanks :)
[04:39] <Lathiat> wish i'd mentioned this the other day before release :)
[04:40] <Pizbit> Lathiat: Well, it's not like many people will be doing that.
[04:40] <Lathiat> Pizbit: doing what, using the nv driver on an lcd? :)
[04:41] <Pizbit> Having an nvidia sever and nv at the same time
[04:41] <Lathiat> oh no, thats not the problem
[04:41] <Lathiat> the problem is having the nv driver look like ass on lcds by default
[04:42] <crimsun> nv looks pretty good at 1280x1024 on a dell 1901fp
[04:42] <Lathiat> crimsun: at 24bit?
[04:42] <crimsun> Lathiat: yep
[04:42] <Lathiat> on my inspiron 8600 laptop, needs to be on 16 bit otherwise it looks crap
[04:42] <ogra> acer aspire 1520 needs 16bit too
[04:43] <zyga> hello
[04:43] <zyga> what's the thing with bug listing on apt-get install
[04:44] <Lathiat> sigh, this bug in libbonoboui si still pissing me off
[04:44] <Lathiat> i need better bonoboui hacking foo
[04:44] <jdub> zyga: apt-listbugs
[04:44] <zyga> jdub: apt-get can exploit the fact that it's installed?
[04:45] <jdub> yes
[04:45] <zyga> :)
[04:45] <jsgotangco> goodnite everyone
[04:45] <sladen> talking of replacing broken chip.  I've just managed to break the ethernet port on my laptop.  Greeeeeeeat
[04:45] <jdub> night jsgotangco 
[04:45] <jsgotangco> jdub: still going further eh
[04:45] <jdub> nah, should be getting to bed really
[04:46] <Lathiat> daniels: don't suppose if you knwo if the nv driver can do dual head or at least mirror?
[04:46] <jdub> gotta be up in 3 hours or so ;)
[04:46] <jsgotangco> ok night
[04:46] <jsgotangco> hehe
[04:47] <daniels> Lathiat: no idea, sorry
[04:47] <daniels> jdub: nah man, alarm roulette never works
[04:47] <Lathiat> daniels: doesn't seem to be any docs :\
[04:48] <Lathiat> dan	is there more docs in the source tree than /usr/share/docs ?
[04:48] <daniels> not really, other than the source
[04:48] <daniels> the nv driver is woefully documented
[04:49] <ogra> jdub, let daniels call you to wake you up
[04:49] <jdub> ha ha
[04:49] <Lathiat> daniels: like pretty much verything else? :)
[04:49] <Lathiat> jdub: i'll call you and whinge about some bug you haven't fixed yet :)
[04:50] <jdub> very different to the warty calendars
[04:51] <jdub> you guys will have to wait for elmo to let it out of NEW ;)
[04:51] <daniels> ogra: arsed if I'm going to be awake at 4
[04:51] <ogra> heh
[04:52] <Lathiat> :)
[04:52] <Lathiat> jdub: hoary-updates ?
[04:52] <jdub> yep
[04:52] <jdub> *not* warty-updates
[04:52] <jdub> warty gets no calendar love
[04:52] <jdub> not anymore
[04:52] <jdub> END OF LOVE
[04:53] <sladen> ah, I was expecting it to get pushed into both queues 
[04:53] <jdub> not anymore
[04:54] <sladen> could it be stuck in a separate 'calendar' archivea
[04:54] <jdub> no
[04:54] <jdub> no love for warty anymore
[04:54] <jdub> end of love
[04:54] <Lathiat> poor warty, unloved.
[04:54] <Pizbit> Poor warty.
[04:54] <Pizbit> Mean jdub :)
[04:54] <sladen> deb .../warty main restricted universe pr0n
[04:55] <Lathiat> mm flexmdns smokes a bit of crack
[05:12] <mdke> is the website ok?
[05:12] <mdke> i can't load the pages
[05:20] <srbaker> anyone know where i can look at a web interface for arch?
[05:21] <srbaker> ahh, viewarch
[05:34] <bluefoxicy> I  think I found a problem in hoary
[05:34] <bluefoxicy> when i close my laptop lid
[05:34] <bluefoxicy> after reopening it there's a flashing _ thing, cursor
[05:35] <cjb> You can try "HWCursor off" in Xorg.conf.
[05:35] <bluefoxicy> if I hit alt+F7 to switch back to X I can enter my password to unlock it; but that's counterintuitive.
[05:35] <bluefoxicy> cjb:  me messing with xorg.conf is counterintuitive, but what section should i put that in regardless
[05:36] <cjb> Ubuntu can often not do everything obvious.  In this case, it's likely that your laptop's lid-open code is usually run by the Windows graphics driver.
[05:36] <cjb> (And we don't know how your laptop's Windows graphics driver works.)
[05:37] <bluefoxicy> well, regardless.  I'll submit a hardwareprofile thing from device manager, and maybe file a bug later
[05:37] <cjb> Anyway. Option "HWCursor" "off" in the Device section.
[05:37] <bluefoxicy> k
[05:40] <Kamion> (I think it's *un*intuitive, not counterintuitive - counterintuitive suggests to me that you have to do something that intuition says should have the opposite effect)
[05:41] <Pizbit> Or non-intuitive:)
[05:41] <Pizbit> Or randomenglishprefix-intuitice-maybearanomdenglishsuffixehere
[05:41] <Pizbit> With intuitive *
[05:58] <bluefoxicy> Kamion:  pressing buttons :)  intuition says if I open my laptop lid, it'll still be on my graphical desktop, or suggesting how to get there (i.e. "please enter your password")
[05:58] <bluefoxicy> I kinda sat there and stared, waiting for ubuntu to switch it back over
[05:58] <bluefoxicy> before figuring out I had to do something
[05:59] <Kamion> (I wasn't arguing with your comment about what should be done, merely with the choice of word)
[06:01] <bluefoxicy> I know :)
[06:01] <bluefoxicy> but that was where my choice of words came from :p
[06:08] <HiddenWolf> Kamion, when is the big meeting where Breezy's goals will be set out?
[06:11] <dholbach> HiddenWolf: wiki/UbuntuDownUnder
[06:11] <HiddenWolf> dholbach, meanie, that isn't clickable! :P
[06:11] <dholbach> HiddenWolf: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDownUnder
[06:12] <ogra> hehe
[06:12] <HiddenWolf> dholbach, that was a joke. :P
[06:18] <dilinger> haha.  the camel link from james henstridge's blog is great.
[07:13] <ogra> is somebody aware that ubuntu.com and ubuntulinux.org arent reachable ?
[07:13] <tseng> havent there been isp issues all day?
[07:13] <elmo> ogra: they're back
[07:14] <dholbach> hey elmo
[07:14] <ogra> yeah
[07:14] <ogra> response...
[07:14] <elmo> tseng: isp issues were to do with limiting, they've haven't dropped us off the net until now
[07:14] <elmo> hey dholbach 
[07:14] <dholbach> elmo: i wrote all those guys and they were all positively impressed
[07:15] <elmo> dholbach: cool
[07:16] <dholbach> elmo: although i didnt write joeyh yet... *blush*
[07:17] <Treenaks> ogra: we'll switch to redhat
[07:17] <ogra> lol
[07:17] <ogra> then i'll leave :)
[07:17] <Treenaks> ogra: rubuntu..
[07:17] <ogra> heh
[07:17] <tseng> roobios
[07:18] <Treenaks> tseng: not "rooibos"? :)
[07:18] <tseng> maybe
[07:18] <zenwhen> if all these debian guys come over then wouldnt the need for an upstream go away?
[07:18] <dholbach> there'll be a new distribution with name .... erm ... Quit'zla ... which is ... ancient Maya ... for ... Cocoa or something
[07:18] <tseng> i meant the african "tea"
[07:18] <dhonn> debuntu
[07:18] <Treenaks> tseng: rooibos :)
[07:18] <tseng> k
[07:18] <Treenaks> tseng: ("red bush")
[07:18] <Treenaks> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rooibos
[07:18] <tseng> it has a clever "os" at the end
[07:18] <tseng> i dont like to drink it in any case
[07:18] <Treenaks> we should suggest this to sabdfl 8)
[07:20] <dhonn> what do you guys think about the name mandriva lol
[07:21] <ogra> heh
[07:21] <tseng> i already made my comment on planet
[07:21] <tseng> sortof.
[07:21] <Treenaks> dhonn: sounds like a monkey
[07:21] <tseng> like a klamaraffe
[07:22] <dhonn> lol. half man half diva
[07:22] <fgx> how do i verify what's my system charset?
[07:22] <dhonn> minus the r
[07:22] <bluefoxicy> what does anyone think of more complex menus
[07:22] <bluefoxicy> for grub I mean
[07:22] <Treenaks> bluefoxicy: more complex? as in submenus and sub-submenus?
[07:22] <ogra> fgx, you type: locale
[07:23] <bluefoxicy> Treenaks:  yes, as in a submenu for rescue kernels and a submenu for memtest
[07:23] <dhonn> drop down lists of kernels?
[07:23] <Treenaks> bluefoxicy: it's not as if it's a really long list anyway...
[07:23] <bluefoxicy> it's not hard.  'configfile' as the command for a menu entry does it
[07:23] <bluefoxicy> Treenaks:  yeah, but the list now is like Kernel-1,Kernel-1(rescue),Kernel-2,Kernel-2(rescue),memtest
[07:24] <bluefoxicy> if you have more than 1 kernel it's visibly ugly :)
[07:24] <Treenaks> bluefoxicy: maybe sort order could be changed... but not a submenu
[07:24] <ogra> bluefoxicy, where i the piont if you only have one kernel installed ?
[07:24] <bluefoxicy> ogra:  no point
[07:24] <tseng> for most poeople it doesnt even show a menu
[07:24] <dhonn> i use hiddenmenu
[07:24] <bluefoxicy> tseng:  Unless you hit escape
[07:24] <ogra> yup
[07:24] <tseng> at which point
[07:24] <bluefoxicy> I know, I'm just saying
[07:24] <Lathiat> bluefoxicy: and if a kernel upgrade breaks, then you don't have one to fall back on :)
[07:24] <tseng> who cares?
[07:25] <bluefoxicy> Thought it'd make a nice update-grub config option, but I guess nobody cares :)
[07:26] <fgx> ogra, thx. it says en_US. is the utf-8 one? (im running hoary)
[07:26] <ogra>  does it say en_US.UTF-8 or only en_US ?
[07:27] <dholbach> i'm off - have a nice evening
[07:27] <fgx> ogra, only en_US. strange. i think it should be en_US.UTF-8 in hoary
[07:28] <ogra> hmm, i never tried a en_ locale here....only C and de_ ....but my de_DE says UTF-8
[07:29] <fgx> ogra, locale -a says en_US.UTF-8 available. now i switch. oh now i see im in the wrong channel. apologize
[07:29] <ogra> fgx, would have been my job to point that out ;) dont aplogize :)
[07:31] <ogra> hmm, i think i should pull a local copy of the css for hwdb....seems slashdotted again....
[07:35] <bob2> archive.u.c still seems unreachable for me
[07:36] <ogra> bob2, slashdot.....
[07:36] <bob2> like, completely unreachable
[07:37] <Lathiat> yeh it is
[07:37] <zenrox> we got /.ed
[07:37] <zenwhen> is anything going to be done to support this new userload or are we going to hope they "go away"?
[07:38] <Lathiat> zenwhen: it will calm down as the release hype gets over
[07:38] <ogra> zenwhen, we'll hunt them until they're gone, yes
[07:38] <Lathiat> zenwh	unfortunatey due to an error with ubuntus ISP, they have a large bottleneck on the traffic
[07:38] <ogra> :-P
[07:38] <Lathiat> which has yet to be sorted
[07:39] <zenwhen> I think it would be a shame to lose so many users because there just wasnt an infrastructure in place to handle them
[07:39] <zenwhen> I think there will be a lot of "ubuntu's repos are unstable" people floating around after this. 
[07:39] <ogra> zenwhen, it will get fixed....
[07:40] <zenwhen> Well it just seems that afterthe kubuntu announcement something would have gotten done to prepare for this. Its really none of my business and I have no solution but it seems like these two opportunities have been marred by the lack of extra bandwidth for these eager slashdotters.
[07:41] <Lathiat> zenwhen: unfortunately there is nothign they can do about it
[07:42] <Lathiat> (they are waiting at the hands of their ISP)
[07:43] <Lathiat> so mark tells me anway
[07:44] <bob2> zenwhen: dude, there's a billion mirrors they can use
[07:45] <zenwhen> Are these mirrors linked in an easy to reach spot?
[07:45] <Lathiat> bob2: the argument is still valid as synaptic does not use them or offe ran option for them
[07:45] <bob2> zenwhen: yes
[07:45] <bob2> wiki.ubuntu.com/Archive
[07:45] <zenwhen> if they arent available as a link on the front page or as an option in synaptic, people will not use them
[07:46] <zenwhen> and everyone will suffer
[07:46] <Lathiat> that could possible be an item for breezy
[07:46] <bob2> no, not everyone
[07:46] <Lathiat> to put mirror support in synaptic
[07:46] <Lathiat> "Pick a country..."
[07:46] <bob2> just the people who don't know to use the mirror
[07:46] <Lathiat> the installer sets the archives to my country
[07:46] <Lathiat> but synaptic blows them away back to archive.ubuntu.com when you change them
[07:47] <Lathiat> maswan: heh i see your ftp cluster is a little happier again now you put the redirect back :)
[07:48] <Lathiat> i'd hate to put my hands anywhere near the disks of that thing :)
[07:48] <zyga> hmm
[07:49] <zenwhen> bob2, the site you linked is currently down along with the main repos. Where do you suggest the users get this information? I was simply pointing to an issue. You have every right to ignore it or pretend it doesnt exist.
[07:49] <bob2> ok, thanks!
[07:50] <Lathiat> hopefully the main site is down for the 15 minute window the isp needed to reconfigure them to have an extra 500mbit/s or so of bandwidth :)
[07:54] <maswan> Lathiat: yeah, not as much load today as yesterdya, but still a bit more than the ~70M/s that the ftp cluster coudl deliver
[07:57] <elmo> zenwhen: it's been down twice, for approx 20 mins each time.  down in the sense of, it broke at the tier-1 ISP level.  that's not something that could have been anticipated or "prepared for".  everything we can possibly do about it, is already being done
[07:57] <zenwhen> oh alright
[07:58] <maswan> elmo: you could throw more of your load over this way. ;)
[07:58] <elmo> it's not being /. or otherwise overloading - it's BREAKING.
[07:58] <maswan> ok
[07:58] <dhonn> i have an odd problem with the volume control.  Aparently my volume settings are not saved after a reboot
[07:58] <maswan> just figured it might be load-triggered breaking, but you
[07:59] <maswan> 'd know much better. :)
[07:59] <maswan> (the one thing I haven't gotten used to on this keyboard, hitting ' without hitting enter)
[08:04] <bluefoxicy> did I miss something
[08:15] <Kamion> mdz: could you have a look at colin.watson@canonical.com--2005/debzilla--fv3--0?
[08:16] <Kamion> mdz: it copes with some changes I made today (though I haven't activated those changes yet, and this patch should work both before and after activation)
[08:16] <srbaker> anyone know the place that shows the current status of eclipse packages?
[08:16] <srbaker> i lost the link i had
[08:17] <Kamion> mdz: I'm assuming that your bugzilla.submit() is happy being fed UTF-8 data
[08:17] <Kamion> mdz: ... oh, except that my link to chinstrap is dead, so you can't see any mirrors of that archive. I'll mirror it later and let you know.
[08:23] <mdke> is it likely that the website will be back to normal speed anytime soon?
[08:24] <Kamion> 18:58 < elmo> it's not being /. or otherwise overloading - it's BREAKING.
[08:24] <mdke> oh
[08:24] <bluefoxicy> oy, ok, the ubuntulinux forums seem to be down, #ubuntu is no help, anyone have an hp pavilion zv5000 series laptop?
[08:24] <crimsun> (no)
[08:24] <ogra> mdke, that was about the backbone afaik...not the servers
[08:24] <mdke> Kamion, i thought maybe its on the same bandwidth as one of the mirrors or something
[08:24] <bluefoxicy> usb reportedly works with ohci-hcd, but I can't get 1.1 to work, 2.0 seems to with ehci-hcd
[08:28] <spacey> the repositories seem down too
[08:28] <spacey> at least i cant install some packages atm because it can't feth the packages
[08:28] <Lathiat> spacey: use a mirror
[08:28] <Lathiat> like se.archive or something
[08:28] <spacey> i'll try
[08:29] <spacey> using nl. now i think
[08:29] <bob2> (season to taste if you're more in the loop)
[08:30] <spacey> Lathiat, seems to work, tnx
[08:56] <dhonn> interpreted c would be cool, with jit compliation
[08:57] <bob2> and oh-so-wrong
[08:58] <dhonn> lol
[09:00] <dhonn> i am not familiar with python, its an interpreted lanugage right
[09:00] <bob2> yes
[09:00] <maswan> dhonn: clif?
[09:00] <dhonn> im an idoit, c is my languange
[09:01] <dhonn> what's clif
[09:01] <maswan> Description: C language interpreter
[09:01] <maswan> bbiab, laundry
[09:01] <dhonn> ill get it
[09:02] <dhonn> i dont know if I should be learning c# or something else
[09:04] <ups> hi guys, i'm writing a gui for mounting/unmounting hdd partitions (using pygtk). the necessary info is fetched from hal/dbus. however, is there some way other than executing the mount/umount commands to do the actual task?
[09:05] <ups> (i'm new to python as well as hal)
[09:05] <desrt> ups; have you looked at pmount/pumount?
[09:05] <ups> if that matters...
[09:05] <ogra> ups, ubuntu uses pmount for userland mounting
[09:06] <desrt> and pmount-hal, too
[09:06] <ups> no...
[09:06] <ups> i'll look into it now, thanks
[09:06] <desrt> you say pmount-hal [hal UDI] 
[09:06] <desrt> and it mounts it for you
[09:06] <ups> ah sounds nice
[09:08] <ups> desrt: any links to docs i should look at?
[09:08] <desrt> ups; manpage
[09:08] <ups> i'm looking at pmount man page atm
[09:08] <ups> ok :)
[09:49] <edd> bluefoxicy: yeah, it's a common problem due to cut and  pasting of bad code
[09:50] <bluefoxicy> edd:  I figured it was application code, not OS code.  Dunno if it can be fixed in gnome though
[09:51] <edd> bluefoxicy: No, it's application code. There's only a small number of apps that get it right. (gnome-obex-server among them, of course ;)
[09:51] <ogra> heh
[09:52] <ogra> gaim should have survived too....
[09:52] <bluefoxicy> gaim closed itself cleanly.
[09:52] <ogra> (according t some changelog in the past)
[09:52] <edd> my gaim icon is currently 1 pixel thick, annoyingly
[09:52] <bluefoxicy> damnit 
[09:52] <bluefoxicy> http://words.haddons.net/archives/000041.html zv5405US
[09:52] <bluefoxicy> I have one of these.
[09:52] <ogra> at least if you kill the panel (which killst the notification area)
[09:53] <bluefoxicy> I can't make nvidia work, and I can't make usb 1.1 work (2.0 works apparently) meaning I can't use USB 1.1 devices (mass storage)
[09:53] <bluefoxicy> even on 2.6.11 hrm.
[09:56] <bluefoxicy> plus I need to compile a 2.6.10-5 ndiswrapper later for wifi
[09:56] <bluefoxicy> why am I talking about this here
[09:56] <srbaker> has anyone here successfully built a subversion package with javahl bindings?
[09:58] <kagou> hi
[09:58] <kagou> what's the soft who create the file /etc/modules ?
[10:02] <kent> kagou, that question would look good in #ubuntu  :)
[10:03] <kagou> humm i'm comming from #ubuntu-fr ;)
[10:03] <kagou> i'm trying to help new user upgrading from warty
[10:04] <kagou> sound don't work after upgrade, the /etc/modules have been manually modified, so my question is how to re-generate a "clean" /etc/modules like a clean installation with hoary
[10:05] <kent> kagou, the thing is this is channel for the ubuntu-developers. I think its good to keep this as a channel for that, and an open channel which people can join and *listen* or perhaps talk, when they actually have relevant things to talk about. 
[10:06] <kagou> ok kent
[10:06] <Mithrandir> kagou: /etc/modules is created by the installer, but as kent says, #ubuntu please.
[10:06] <kent> kagou, but, what is manually modified? the user should know what he/she changed and not. given the brand of card, it should be easy to change the module.
[10:06] <kagou> re ok Mithrandir 
[10:07] <Lathiat> kagou: i have no idea how to create a clean one, but a standard one for me has ide-cd, ide-disk, ide-generic, lp, mousedev, psmouse, sr_mod, and yes, in future please see #ubuntu :)
[10:34] <elmo> Kamion: ?
[10:56] <tseng> jdub: ping
[11:11] <Mithrandir> jdub: how often is your worldmap updated?
[11:14] <ogra> Mithrandir, i think he wanted to pick up thom...will be at the airport...
[11:14] <Mithrandir> bah, silly person.
[11:14] <ogra> hmm, he will need a bigger map...
[11:14] <ogra> i'm not readable anymore
[11:14] <Mithrandir> yeah, we should have an ultra-large one.
[11:15] <ogra> yop....
[11:15] <Mithrandir> or zoomed in on Europe, the US and other places with high densities.
[11:15] <ogra> will get very fast very full
[11:16] <maswan> or a neat mouse-over magnifier that zooms in on the areas you find interesting at the moment? :)
[11:16] <Mithrandir> SVG! :)
[11:16] <ogra> yeah
[11:17] <Treenaks> and a "I want to see everyone within X km", so you can organise parties
[11:17] <Mithrandir> Treenaks: those scripts are already written.
[11:18] <Treenaks> Mithrandir: ok, but not SVG-map-based
[11:18] <Mithrandir> Treenaks: coordinate-based. :P
[11:18] <Treenaks> Mithrandir: so all we need is glue ;)
[11:18] <Mithrandir> Treenaks: Edward Betts wrote them for Debian; I think they're unlicensed ATM, so I'd like to get the licensed to be free.
[11:18] <ogra> Treenaks, thats easy with a mapserver....
[11:18] <Mithrandir> Treenaks: nah, just use the source list.
[11:18] <Treenaks> Mithrandir: yes.. with dynamic svg + javascript magic
[11:19] <SuperQ> this is awsome, we're having an installfest tomorow.  I borrowed a CD duplicator.  I am cloning a burn of 5.04 amd64, 5 disks at a time, time to copy: 70 seconds
[11:19] <ogra> cool
[11:19] <Mithrandir> SuperQ: yay.  And double-yay for amd64.
[11:19] <ogra> thats what i meant :-P
[11:19] <SuperQ> Mithrandir: i'm making 5 copies of everything, and 10 copies of x86
[11:19] <SuperQ> just for starters
[11:19] <Mithrandir> what kind of symbol should a czar have? ;)
[11:20] <Mithrandir> (like, a king has a crown..)
[11:21] <Treenaks> Mithrandir: sceptre?
[11:21] <Mithrandir> Treenaks: possibly.
[11:36] <Mithrandir> ogra: you're coming to UDU too?
[11:37] <ogra> YEAH !
[11:37] <ogra> you too ? 
[11:37] <ogra> and simira ?
[11:37] <Mithrandir> ogra: I'm coming, Simira's not; she didn't get funding.
[11:37] <Mithrandir> ogra: but she's hoping to go to the next conference.
[11:37] <ogra> sad :(
[11:37] <Mithrandir> and she's coming to debconf in the summer
[11:39] <Mithrandir> yeah, but it'll vary who comes.  That's ok too.
[11:39] <ogra> yop
[11:40] <ogra> but i would have expected she would get funding...
[11:40] <tseng> where is debconf?
[11:40] <Mithrandir> tseng: outside helsinki, .fi
[11:41] <tseng> ugh
[11:41] <Mithrandir> ogra: it's a long trip, costing a lot
[11:41] <tseng> when is the us ubuntu conf :(
[11:41] <ogra> yeah, thats true
[11:41] <Mithrandir> tseng: not, I hope.  I'm hoping a bit for Canada or so next.
[11:42] <Mithrandir> tseng: did you ask for funding for UDU?
[11:42] <ogra> Mithrandir, i'm guessing .br or .za
[11:42] <tseng> Mithrandir: yes.
[11:43] <tseng> Mithrandir: never heard anything, i am on the other side of the world so..
[11:48] <ogra> Mithrandir, youre on the map now :)
[11:49] <Mithrandir> ogra: .za would be awesome, I've never been to Africa.
[11:49] <Mithrandir> (nor have I been to NA)
[11:49] <Mithrandir> tseng: :(
[11:49] <ogra> me neither, but a teenage friend of mine lives there...
[11:49] <Mithrandir> tseng: you should at least have heard back.
[11:49] <ogra> yeah, thats not nice
[11:50] <Mithrandir> it's actually in the right place too
[11:51] <tseng> what place?
[11:51] <tseng> i thought i put it on UbuntuDownUnderAttendees, but sponsor requests are removed now.
[11:51] <Mithrandir> tseng: the map stuff.
[11:51] <tseng> oh.
[11:52] <Mithrandir> tseng: shame; you're in the US?
[11:52] <tseng> i dont know any of these people showing up on the US now
[11:52] <tseng> yeah.
[11:52] <Mithrandir> we should lobby for you coming to the next one, then
[11:53] <Mithrandir> it's only 'till August, so not that long.
[11:53] <Mithrandir> (or early Sept)
[11:53] <tseng> hm, neat
[11:53] <tseng> we could have an openbox BOF
[11:53] <tseng> or metacity-haters-club
[11:53] <Mithrandir> you too use openbox?
[11:53] <Mithrandir> yay openbox
[11:53] <tseng> yep.
[11:54] <tseng> i used to take my openbox 2.x straight up
[11:54] <Mithrandir> (it does emacs-style keybindings, that's something which metacity would have to grow for me to switch)
[11:54] <tseng> well actually
[11:54] <tseng> openbox2 had a tool called epist that grabs keychains
[11:54] <tseng> i used that with metacity for a time
[11:55] <tseng> it would be nice if someone split it out
[11:55] <Mithrandir> that could work, but you'd lose the gnome integration (clickety-clicky dialogs), so it's not a big win over going openbox3
[11:55] <Mithrandir> IMHO
[11:56] <tseng> what clickety dialogs?
[11:56] <tseng> there are none for proper keybinding
[11:56] <tseng> just binding a simple command to a keychain is a major PITA
[11:56] <tseng> involves setting not 1 but 2 gconf keys by hand
[11:57] <Mithrandir> uhm, you can't do it all with metacity, can you?
[11:57] <Mithrandir> (without epist)
[11:57] <tseng> you can
[11:57] <Mithrandir> oh, ok.
[11:57] <tseng> in gconf :(
[11:57] <tseng> first you make a binding for commandX
[11:57] <tseng> and then define commandX in a seperate key
[11:57] <tseng> its awful
[11:58] <tseng> in openbox i can write it in xml in a few seconds
[11:58] <tseng> vi > gconf-editor
[11:58] <Mithrandir> heh