[12:12] <mvirkkil> Isn't lintian in hoary?
[12:13] <dholbach> mvirkkil: it is
[12:14] <mvirkkil> odd stuff happening..
[12:14] <dholbach> mvirkkil: why that?
[12:16] <mvirkkil> dholbach: It seems I had accidentally removed my entire package cache.
[12:16] <dholbach> argl
[12:16] <mvirkkil> cd foo
[12:16] <mvirkkil> wrong window
[12:16] <elmo> seb128: (done for !glib)
[12:17] <seb128> elmo: thanks
[12:17] <dholbach> i'm going to get my stuff together... have a nice time *wave*
[12:17] <ogra> ciao dholbach 
[12:17] <dholbach> bye ogra 
[12:18] <mvo> mvirkkil: your status cache? with the information what you have installed?
[12:18] <ogra> dholbach, will we see you tomorrow ? 
[12:18] <seb128> 'night guys
[12:18] <dholbach> ogra: can't really tell
[12:18] <dholbach> bye seb128 
[12:18] <ogra> night seb128 
[12:18] <mvirkkil> mvo: : Luckily no. Only the cache of what is available.
[12:18] <dholbach> seb128: see you in ffm, right?
[12:18] <mvo> night seb128 
[12:18] <dholbach> seb128: frankfurt (main) :-)
[12:18] <mvirkkil> mvo: apt-get update fixed it
[12:18] <seb128> dholbach: when ?
[12:18] <ogra> dholbach, so if not, have a nice time, see you in ffm
[12:19] <mvo> mvirkkil: heh, happens all the time to me :)
[12:19] <dholbach> seb128: april, 16th before 23:55?
[12:19] <seb128> pfiou
[12:19] <seb128> you were speaking about tomorrow :p
[12:19] <dholbach> seb128: when does your flight go?
[12:19] <seb128> 16th 
[12:19] <seb128> but since you were speaking about tomorrow ...
[12:20] <mvirkkil> What does it mean when lintian says: internal error: internal error: syntax error in @packages array: b 
[12:20] <ogra> heh
[12:20] <seb128> nm, all is right :)
[12:20] <dholbach> so you'll be in frankfurt when?
[12:20] <seb128> 16th evening
[12:20] <seb128> NOT tomorrow :p
[12:20] <ogra> lol
[12:20] <mvirkkil> I built it with dpkg-deb --build
[12:20] <dholbach> ah ok... so we'll be able to have a beer :-)
[12:20] <seb128> right
[12:20] <seb128> I should be here around 20 IIRC
[12:32] <zul> hey
[12:47] <dholbach> now really... *wave*
[12:50] <desrt> so only security changes are made to hoary, right?
[12:50] <Burgundavia> desrt, correct
[12:50] <desrt> what if there's a significant crasher bug?
[12:53] <ogra> desrt, that too (if its really significant)
[12:53] <ogra> but i guess we would have already heard about it
[12:53] <Burgundavia> the problem with any change is that of reversions
[12:54] <desrt> i have an evo crasher :)
[12:54] <ogra> i dont
[12:54] <ogra> and i havent heard of any 
[12:54] <desrt> i get 100% repeatability
[12:54] <desrt> https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=9693
[12:54] <ogra> desrt, then file it in bugzilla please
[12:54] <ogra> ah
[12:57] <mdke> the presence of the word "Windows" in the subject line, and "microsoft" in the sender...
[12:57] <mdke> you're wondering why its crashing?
[12:58] <mike_douglas> hah
[12:58] <desrt> if evolution crashes by forwarding an email send by outlook, we're in trouble :)
[12:58] <mdke> lol
[12:58] <desrt> that's a fairly common use case :P
[12:59] <desrt> is anyone able to reproduce it?
[01:00] <zyga> hey
[01:01] <robertj> splashy is the usplash implementation that is being blessed for hoary right?
[01:01] <robertj> err breezy
[01:02] <ogra> robertj, not yet
[01:02] <sladen> robertj: if it's blessed, that will be after the conference
[01:02] <robertj> ahh
[01:04] <mike_douglas> desrt: reproducable
[01:04] <mike_douglas> s/reproducable/reproducible
[01:10] <robertj> ooh, splashy works fine
[01:31] <Burgundavia> ahh
[01:31] <Burgundavia> emails
[01:34] <desrt> ok
[01:35] <desrt> i have a patch for the crasher
[01:35] <desrt> and it's 100% non-regression causing :)
[01:36] <desrt> since the only case that it makes a change to the problem is when the program would crash anyway :)
[01:44] <cartel_> hi all
[01:44] <cartel_> who knows about building linux-image?
[01:44] <cartel_> specifically how to unpatch ubuntu source tree, apply a top level patch and then repatch?
[01:45] <cartel_> im having troubles with linux-source-2.6.10, wont unapply patches
[01:45] <cartel_> and also applying patches to vanilla source doesnt work
[01:45] <cartel_> so i am kind of stuck
[01:50] <Speedy2> cartel_:  Why don't you just grab a stock vanilla Linux kernel?
[01:50] <Speedy2> Which patches are you trying to apply?
[01:50] <cartel_> Speedy2: linux-patch-ubuntu
[01:50] <Speedy2> cartel_: What does that actually give you?
[01:50] <cartel_> Speedy2: linux-image
[01:50] <Speedy2> Which is?
[01:50] <cartel_> ubuntu kernel
[01:50] <Speedy2> Ok
[01:50] <Speedy2> Why not just make your own kernel?
[01:51] <Speedy2> Why do you want to apply the Ubuntu patches?
[01:51] <cartel_> i am trying to make xen-linux-images for the community
[01:51] <cartel_> so it behaves the same
[01:51] <Speedy2> Ah
[01:51] <Speedy2> Does the linux-patch-ubuntu not give you information on patching?
[01:51] <schweeb> you're doing linux-patch-ubuntu?
[01:51] <ogra> cartel_, i think fabio already has done that locally...
[01:51] <schweeb> read the docs included in linux-patch-ubuntu
[01:51] <ogra> (xen)
[01:51] <Speedy2> Usually, in the Linux kernel tree, there is a text file that gives you the syntax for how to patch
[01:52] <schweeb> they specifically tell you what you patch against.....
[01:52] <cartel_> usually in the debian kernel tree it works
[01:52] <cartel_> i dont see why so many deltas everywhere and workarounds
[01:52] <tsume_> is breezy being worked on currently, or not yet?
[01:53] <cartel_> schweeb: the only doc that comes with linux-patch-ubuntu is the changelog
[01:53] <ogra> tsume_, its importing packages and building them currently....
[01:54] <cartel_> fabbione: are you there?
[01:54] <schweeb> cartel_: actually, it's in the package description....
[01:54] <tsume_> ogra: mmmm. I can't wait ;)
[01:54] <cartel_> oh god
[01:54] <schweeb> "They should be applied to a pristine Linux 2.6.10 kernel"
[01:54] <cartel_>  This package includes the patches used to produce the prepackaged
[01:54] <cartel_>  linux-source-2.6.10 package.  They should be applied to a pristine
[01:54] <cartel_>  Linux 2.6.10 kernel.  Note that these patches do NOT apply
[01:54] <cartel_>  against a pristine Linux 2.6.10 kernel but only against
[01:54] <cartel_>  linux-source-2.6.10_2.6.10.orig.tar.gz from the Ubuntu archive.
[01:54] <cartel_> b.ambigious
[01:55] <tsume_> ogra: are there any plans for a graphical installation like suse or redhat, do you kno?
[01:55] <schweeb> tsume_: eventually, probably
[01:56] <cartel_> so trying to patch against linux-source-2.6.10 is impossible because it diverged too far from the vanillas
[01:56] <ogra> tsume_, there are plans, but nobody can tell exactly what will happen before the conference is done where all these things will be discussed
[01:56] <tsume_> schweeb: I'm going to introduce windows people to ubuntu, a graphical installer would be nice
[01:56] <cartel_> so i should give up
[01:56] <cartel_> and leave it to the professionals
[01:56] <cartel_> ''
[01:56] <tsume_> schweeb: never say user friendly doesn't matter
[01:56] <schweeb> tsume_: you realize Windows' installer isn't graphical, right? (or at least win2k... haven't done XP in a while)
[01:56] <tsume_> schweeb: a graphical installer is important
[01:56] <Speedy2> schweeb: The initial installer is not
[01:56] <schweeb> I still don't see your point
[01:57] <cartel_> apt-get source should always get vanilla sources and a diff
[01:57] <schweeb> something isn't un-userfriendly just because it's not graphical
[01:57] <ogra> cartel_, come back if fabionne is araound again (UTC+2 office hours)
[01:57] <tsume_> schweeb: the windows 2k installer is graphical
[01:57] <Speedy2> schweeb: But Linux and Windows behave differently.  Windows does not install hundreds of packages out of the gate
[01:57] <tsume_> schweeb: it takes time and research to realise user interface matters
[01:58] <schweeb> the textual installer I see every time I install win2k (almost daily) says differently...
[01:58] <cartel_> tsume_: the win2k installer is not graphical
[01:58] <Speedy2> schweeb: That's just to get the core installed, the next step is graphical.
[01:58] <schweeb> same type of blue background/text foreground as win2k...
[01:58] <weazle> but the bottom line is: it must be that simple that a monkey can use it
[01:58] <cartel_> tsume_: partitionaing et al is done in textmode
[01:58] <tsume_> schweeb: yes, but it switches to graphical later
[01:59] <tsume_> cartel_: heh
[01:59] <schweeb> I haven't seen a single valid reason for a graphical installer yet.
[01:59] <tsume_> cartel_: presentation counts
[01:59] <tsume_> schweeb: people buy eye candy ;)
[01:59] <Speedy2> schweeb: If you do a custom installation and want to select packages, a mouse interface is much nicer.
[01:59] <zul> not neccesarily
[02:00] <tsume_> schweeb: eye candy is a way of life
[02:00] <Burgundavia> Speedy2, there is no reason you should be adding package during the installer
[02:00] <schweeb> 97% of people don't do the custom installation
[02:00] <zul> i find it easier and faster with a text interface
[02:00] <tsume_> Speedy2: arrow and spacebar ;)
[02:00] <schweeb> a graphical installer adds extra overhead
[02:00] <Speedy2> Burgundavia: Not adding, I mean selecting what you want period
[02:00] <tsume_> schweeb: well it should be optional
[02:00] <Burgundavia> Speedy2, that would be changing
[02:00] <Speedy2> Burgundavia: I don't need a hundred different programs installed that I will never use
[02:00] <Burgundavia> Speedy2, that is what good defaults are for
[02:01] <Burgundavia> Speedy2, or you roll a kicstart script
[02:01] <schweeb> Speedy2: use the server install
[02:01] <schweeb> or kickstart, like Burgundavia said
[02:01] <Speedy2> I'm not complaining about not being able to do it, I'm simply stating that having a GUI *can* make it easier.
[02:01] <schweeb> essentially, very very few people will use the custom install
[02:02] <Burgundavia> Speedy2, and I am saying that is not what the the installer is for
[02:02] <cartel_> heh
[02:02] <Speedy2> schweeb: I don't agree.
[02:02] <schweeb> and the few that actually WILL use the custom install are more than capable of using their keyboard to do the work
[02:02] <Speedy2> Burgundavia: Many Linux distros let you do a "custom" install where you tell it what packages you want or don't want it to install, from the start.
[02:02] <Burgundavia> Speedy2, bad usablity
[02:02] <schweeb> Speedy2: that's the anti-ubuntu
[02:02] <Burgundavia> Speedy2, get the install done
[02:03] <Burgundavia> then deal with the excess packages
[02:03] <Speedy2> Why?
[02:03] <Speedy2> Why not do it right from the start?>
[02:03] <Burgundavia> because you add complication where there doesn't need to be any
[02:03] <Speedy2> schweeb: Yeah, it might be anti-ubuntu, but not all people who want to use ubuntu are new to Linux.
[02:03] <Speedy2> (or UNIX)
[02:03] <schweeb> the whole point of Ubuntu is to QUICKLY and with very FEW QUESTIONS get you a FULLY functional desktop
[02:03] <Speedy2> Burgundavia: Well, it sounds like we just have to agree to disagree.
[02:04] <Speedy2> schweeb: Yes, but for those people who want more control, and know what they're doing, there should be no reason to exclude them.
[02:04] <Speedy2> After all, I'm not suggesting it's manditory.
[02:04] <schweeb> Speedy2: so those people can use kickstart scripts
[02:04] <toresbe> Speedy2: I disagree.
[02:04] <schweeb> or deal with the custom installer
[02:04] <schweeb> or type "server" to isntall the minimal server installer
[02:05] <schweeb> or... roll their own CD
[02:05] <Speedy2> Well, the point is that you want to be able to select packages and not be forced to make your own distro.
[02:05] <Speedy2> If that's the case, then I think there are other alternatives.
[02:05] <schweeb> okay
[02:05] <Burgundavia> Speedy2, you can, it is called synaptic
[02:05] <schweeb> you want to select your packages?
[02:05] <schweeb> have you been listening?  use the "server" install
[02:06] <schweeb> it's minimal
[02:06] <Speedy2> schweeb:  I was saying that being able to select your packages, at install time, could benefit from having a GUI, that was really the point.
[02:06] <schweeb> then install whatever you want
[02:06] <Speedy2> Notice..."could"
[02:08] <schweeb> the best option there would be to do a default install, then remove what they don't want using synaptic afterwards to remove what they don't want then
[02:09] <schweeb> I see no problem with this... the whole deb archive from the CD is copied to the HD anyways, I believe, so you're not really saving any space
[02:09] <Speedy2> That's pretty interesting.
[02:09] <schweeb> and in the long run, you've actually saved yourself some time
[02:09] <Speedy2> Is that so one can install packages w/o hitting the repository?
[02:09] <schweeb> yep
[02:10] <Speedy2> (err repositories)
[02:10] <Nigelenki> https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/RWXMappings and https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/RWXMappingsAMD64
[02:10] <schweeb> you save time by being able to have a fully functional desktop, so you can multitask while you're grooming your packages using Synaptic
[02:20] <cartel_> damn fabbione didnt put his work on people.u.o
[02:20] <cartel_> heh
[02:34] <Amaranth> oy, breezy-changes is flooding me :)
[02:35] <Amaranth> if i didn't have gmail filtering it into it's own label i'd be freaking
[02:36] <schweeb> it tends to do that
[02:36] <schweeb> which is why I use gmane :)
[02:39] <Amaranth> heh
[02:39] <toresbe> we've started a breezy?
[02:40] <toresbe> neeewat
[02:40] <toresbe> neeeat*
[02:40] <toresbe> now I can be even more cutting-edge and stupid!
[02:40] <Amaranth> new libgda will uninstall all GTK# things, neat :)
[02:41] <Amaranth> and gnomedb and glade :)
[02:56] <Speedy2> Does the Ubuntu / Kubuntu install CD have a module for the LSI Logic Fusion MPT (U320) SCSI card?
[02:56] <Speedy2> (my card wasn't detected when I tried to use the Kubuntu Live CD)
[02:58] <mdz> Speedy2: the mptscsih module should handle it
[02:58] <mdz> Speedy2: if it isn't loaded automatically, try modprobing it manually.  if that works, file a bug
[02:59] <Speedy2> Ok.  How do I file a bug (I'll try it right now)
[02:59] <Speedy2> Err, that is I'll try the modprobe and if it works, file the bug
[03:00] <Speedy2> Got it, duh
[03:00] <Speedy2> http://www.ubuntulinux.org/support/bugs
[03:02] <Speedy2> Thanks brb
[03:07] <mdz> infinity: ping?
[03:11] <Speedy2> mdz: Ok, the mptscsih module is not present on the Live CD.
[03:12] <mdz> really?
[03:12] <mdz> on what architecture?
[03:13] <Speedy2> i386
[03:13] <Speedy2> Kubtunu-live CD
[03:13] <Speedy2> I am burning the Kubuntu installer and I'll see if it's there
[03:14] <mdz> they have identical kernels
[03:14] <Speedy2> modprobe mptscsih failed
[03:14] <Speedy2> mdz: Including the set of modules?
[03:14] <Speedy2> mdz: I checked /lib/module/2.6.10-5/kernel/drivers/scsi , no "mptscsih"
[03:14] <Riddell> Speedy2: sudo modprobe mptscsih ?
[03:14] <Riddell> it's in /lib/modules/2.6.10-5-386/kernel/drivers/message/fusion/mptscsih.ko
[03:14] <Speedy2> Riddell: I was at a root shell
[03:14] <Speedy2> woah
[03:14] <Speedy2> ok
[03:14] <Speedy2> hrm
[03:15] <Speedy2> Riddell: Is this on your installed setup?
[03:15] <Riddell> yes
[03:15] <Speedy2> Can you DCC me that file?  I'll try the Live CD again and check the "message" folder (but I don't recall seeing that)
[03:16] <Riddell> http://muse.19inch.net/~jr/tmp/mptscsih.ko
[03:16] <Speedy2> Riddell: Thanks.  Is there anything else in the "fusion" folder?
[03:17] <mdz> potpal:[~/cd/ubuntu]  ls -l /mnt/lib/modules/2.6.10-5-386/kernel/drivers/message/fusion/mpt*
[03:17] <mdz> -rw-r--r--  1 root root 49293 2005-04-05 06:40 /mnt/lib/modules/2.6.10-5-386/kernel/drivers/message/fusion/mptbase.ko
[03:17] <mdz> -rw-r--r--  1 root root 28285 2005-04-05 06:40 /mnt/lib/modules/2.6.10-5-386/kernel/drivers/message/fusion/mptctl.ko
[03:17] <mdz> -rw-r--r--  1 root root 18018 2005-04-05 06:40 /mnt/lib/modules/2.6.10-5-386/kernel/drivers/message/fusion/mptlan.ko
[03:17] <Speedy2> mdz: I noticed that the "sg" module was not loaded also
[03:17] <mdz> -rw-r--r--  1 root root 40706 2005-04-05 06:40 /mnt/lib/modules/2.6.10-5-386/kernel/drivers/message/fusion/mptscsih.ko
[03:17] <mdz> that's from the Ubuntu live CD
[03:17] <Speedy2> So it's in the message folder
[03:17] <mdz> which also has exactly the same kernel
[03:17] <Speedy2> Ok, I missed that, my mistake.
[03:17] <mdz> just try modprobe, please
[03:17] <Speedy2> mdz: I did try modprobe
[03:17] <mdz> can you paste the output from modprobe?
[03:17] <Speedy2> I typed "modprobe mptscsih" and it said "No such module"
[03:17] <Speedy2> mdz: I'd have to reboot and try again
[03:18] <mdz> it did not say "No such module"
[03:18] <Speedy2> Maybe moduel not found?
[03:18] <Speedy2> module not found
[03:18] <mdz> if the module doesn't exist, it says "FATAL: Module <blah> not found"
[03:18] <mdz> perhaps it said "No such device"
[03:18] <Speedy2> No
[03:18] <mdz> which means that it found the module fine, but it doesn't support your hardware
[03:18] <Speedy2> No, it didn't try to load
[03:18] <Speedy2> I have a 21320U card in here, made by LSI
[03:19] <Speedy2> Let me re-burn the Live CD and see exactly what it says
[03:19] <Speedy2> Or do you want me to try it on the installer CD?
[03:20] <mdz> I can almost guarantee that the module is there
[03:20] <mdz> on the live CD
[03:20] <Speedy2> mdz: I have no reason to lie about modprobe saying it couldn't find the module.
[03:21] <Speedy2> mdz: But, I'll try again.  Do you want me to try the Live CD or Installer?
[03:21] <mdz> in a moment, I'll have a Kubuntu live CD image
[03:21] <Speedy2> Ok
[03:21] <mdz> and I will look inside and verify that the module is there
[03:21] <Speedy2> Ok
[03:21] <mdz> if I were a betting man, I'd bet that it's there ;-)
[03:21] <mdz> but I will check
[03:21] <Speedy2> mdz: I didn't check the "message" folder
[03:22] <Speedy2> I only spelunked into /lib/module/<kernel_ver>/kernel/drivers/scsi
[03:22] <mdz> you said you used modprobe
[03:22] <Speedy2> I did
[03:22] <Speedy2> modprobe sg worked
[03:22] <Speedy2> modprobe mptscsih did not
[03:22] <mdz> that may be so
[03:22] <mdz> but it is not because the module isn't there
[03:22] <mdz> so I would like to find out why
[03:22] <Speedy2> Umm, it should have given me some hardware failure error
[03:23] <Speedy2> If it couldn't load the module, right?
[03:23] <Speedy2> Assuming it found the module
[03:23] <mdz> there's no need to hypothesize if you can test it
[03:23] <mdz> I'd rather do that than guess
[03:23] <Speedy2> I did test it.  Would you like me to test it again?
[03:23] <mdz> yes, please
[03:23] <Speedy2> Ok.  Is there a way to capture the output and save it?
[03:24] <Speedy2> I do have an IDE HDD that it mounts and sees
[03:24] <Speedy2> Does the Live image support USB pen drives? I've got one of those too.
[03:25] <toresbe> sue
[03:25] <mdz> dijkstra:[~]  find /mnt/lib/modules -name '*mptscsih*'
[03:25] <mdz> /mnt/lib/modules/2.6.10-5-386/kernel/drivers/message/fusion/mptscsih.ko
[03:25] <toresbe> sure*
[03:25] <mdz> the module is there, as expected
[03:25] <mdz> filename:       /mnt/lib/modules/2.6.10-5-386/kernel/drivers/message/fusion/mptscsih.ko
[03:25] <mdz> author:         LSI Logic Corporation
[03:25] <mdz> description:    Fusion MPT SCSI Host driver
[03:26] <jdub> GOOOD MORNING FREEDOM LOVERS
[03:26] <Speedy2> mdz: Ok, it's there, but I still believe that modprobe was not finding it.  The Live CD installer comes up, says detecting devices, then says it can't find my CD-ROM
[03:27] <Speedy2> mdz: I then did ALT+F2 (or CTL+ALT+F2) got to the busybox shell and typed "modprobe mptscsih"
[03:27] <shaya> wondering why breezy is using libc6 from debian experimental, breaks the mono 1.1 debs that are being made
[03:27] <Speedy2> mdz: I'm re-burning the Live image and I'll try again
[03:27] <shaya> /usr/bin/cli: relocation error: /usr/bin/cli: symbol __libc_stack_end, version GLIBC_PRIVATE not defined in file ld-linux.so.2 with link time reference
[03:28] <Speedy2> mdz: If I were at the vanilla prompt, should modprobe mptscsih load it, without me having to go into that directory?
[03:33] <mdz> Speedy2: ok, now that you explain what you did, we're talking about two different things
[03:33] <mdz> you're talking about the bootstrap environment, and I'm talking about the live environment
[03:33] <Speedy2> mdz: Ok.  I can't get to the live environment because it can't find my CD-ROM
[03:33] <mdz> shaya: it isn't. it's using glibc 2.3.5
[03:33] <Speedy2> CD-ROM is attached to MPT
[03:34] <mdz> mptscsih for the bootstrap environment is in the scsi-extra-modules udeb
[03:34] <infinity> mdz : pong.
[03:34] <Speedy2> Umm, where is that located again?
[03:34] <shaya> mdz: well, better Q is, i thought ubuntu was supposed to be forked off of unstable, it's not?
[03:35] <mdz> Speedy2: it _ought_ to be pulled in by default.  if you can see the module in /lib/modules, then it is being installed for you
[03:35] <mdz> if it isn't, then it's a bug
[03:35] <Speedy2> mdz: Ok.  What do you want me to do to test it?
[03:35] <mdz> Speedy2: boot the live CD, go up to the point where you get the error, alt+f2, look in /lib/modules for the module
[03:36] <infinity> shaya : libc6 2.3.5 is a breezy release goal.  With 6-month time-based releases, breaking things as early as possible in an effort to fix them in time is a Good Thing. :)
[03:37] <daniels> infinity: hello sunshine
[03:37] <mdz> shaya: Ubuntu is based on Debian unstable, yes.  but it also contains things which are not in Debian unstable.  That's sort of the point.
[03:37] <infinity> daniels : Mornin' pun'kin.
[03:37] <shaya> ok
[03:37] <shaya> just wondering
[03:38] <ajmitch_> shaya: mono problem is a known issue with upstream, afaik
[03:38] <shaya> ah, so even a recompile wont fix it?
[03:39] <Speedy2> mdz: Ok.  Give me a minute, I'll return
[03:39] <ajmitch_> from what I heard, it's an issue with mono using libc symbols that should have been private but weren't quite - I don't know if a recompile would fix it or not 
[03:39] <mdz> Speedy2: thanks
[03:39] <Speedy2> mdz: NP, I'd like to help if I can.
[03:40] <Speedy2> brb
[03:40] <mdz> infinity: did we go over merge-o-matic?
[03:41] <infinity> mdz : Define "go over"... It's been explaind to me, and I've availed myself of its services, yes. :)
[03:42] <mdz> infinity: ok, just wanted to be sure you were familiar with it, so you could dive in on the merge bugs
[03:43] <infinity> thom : I'm curious about that myself, since I have two packages (php4 and php4-universe) that are derived from php4 in sid.
[03:43] <infinity> thom : WOuld be nice to get m-o-m to work its magic on both, rather than just one.
[03:43] <thom> i need to rename mozilla-firefox to firefox, to comply with MoFo's licensing requirements
[03:43] <thom> infinity: yeah
[03:43] <daniels> thom: wonder if it can sensibly merge xfree86 typo fixes to xorg
[03:43] <infinity> <laugh
[03:43] <infinity> That'd be a big debdiff.
[03:43] <thom> daniels: *giggle*
[03:44] <infinity> mdz : Yeah, let 'em rip.
[03:44] <mdz> infinity: they're all in bugzilla now
[03:44] <mdz> 269 of them
[03:44] <infinity> Neat.
[03:45] <mdz> many are trivial
[03:45] <mdz> many are not ;-)
[03:45] <infinity> Seach criteria?
[03:47] <mdz> infinity: summary "require merging"
[03:48] <shaya> hmm, that was funky.  accidently cat'd a jpg, and it changed my terminal's $ to  :)
[03:53] <Speedy2> mdz: No luck.
[03:54] <Speedy2> mdz: find /lib -name 'mpt*'
[03:54] <Speedy2> mdz: returned the command prompt
[03:54] <mdz> Speedy2: please file a bug, package 'cdrom-detect'
[03:54] <Speedy2> mdz: Ok.
[04:04] <infinity> thom : I assume it'sokay to continue calling the Mozilla Suite "mozilla", but we need to remove the 'mozilla' from firefox and thunderbird?
[04:05] <thom> yep
[04:06] <thom> firefox is ready to upload, gonna do t-bird this arvo
[04:06] <schweeb> mozilla's starting to act pretty quirky lately, it's worrisome :-/
[04:06] <infinity> In the course of your firefox maintenance, have you ever considered convincing the Debian maintainer to switch to a patch system? :)
[04:07] <schweeb> lock window patch?
[04:08] <thom> infinity: i have tried, yes. he said they used to use one but didn't like it 
[04:08] <ogra> schweeb, my screensaver patch
[04:08] <mdz> infinity: http://tinyurl.com/4yeft
[04:08] <infinity> thom : <boggle>
[04:08] <thom> infinity: yes
[04:08] <thom> he went on to say that the patches are kept in a private cvs repo
[04:08] <infinity> thom : Doesn't have to be some fancy tarball-in-tarball system.. Even something like what we use in the php4 source is nice.
[04:09] <thom> infinity: yup
[04:09] <schweeb> ogra: what'd it do?
[04:10] <thom> infinity: i'm going start keeping my ubuntu patches in something like the php4 system
[04:10] <schweeb> was it that patch that gave xss a gtk popup?
[04:10] <ogra> schweeb, see http://people.ubuntu.com/~scott/ongoing-merge/xscreensaver/
[04:10] <ogra> schweeb, gtk popup ?
[04:10] <infinity> Hrm.  Installing openoffice = teh suck.
[04:11] <schweeb> ogra: I remember seeing an unlock dialogue that had gtk widgets for OK and such
[04:11] <schweeb> can't remember where
[04:11] <ogra> schweeb, not mine... (lock your screen to see it)
[04:12] <schweeb> oh oh
[04:12] <schweeb> you're the one who made the pretty Ubuntu dialogue?
[04:12] <schweeb> it's nice
[04:12] <schweeb> :)
[04:12] <ogra> yep... but our mom doesnt like it
[04:13] <jdub> schweeb: that was a hideous sun/ximian patch
[04:13] <schweeb> lol
[04:14] <ogra> hey jdub 
[04:14] <schweeb> hideous does describe sun pretty well :)
[04:14] <ogra> jdub, does it make any sense to merge it in again ?
[04:14] <schweeb> mmm, CDE
[04:15] <ogra> schweeb, yeah eyecandy for concrete lovers
[04:17] <Speedy2> mdz: Can you send me the MPT modules?  If I modprobe them, do I need to modprobe anything else so the Live CD will see my CD-ROM?
[04:19] <jdub> ogra: yeah man, it's teh radness! ;-)
[04:19] <jdub> ogra: everyone will miss it ;)
[04:19] <mdz> Speedy2: Riddell already gave it to you
[04:19] <mdz> Speedy2: <Riddell> http://muse.19inch.net/~jr/tmp/mptscsih.ko
[04:19] <ogra> jdub, yep, but we want something new, dont we ?
[04:19] <Speedy2> mdz: Just the one, but there are more
[04:19] <Speedy2> mdz: That is, there are a few modules that the MPT subsystem needs, right?
[04:20] <Speedy2> mpt: Change your nick :)
[04:20] <ogra> lol
[04:20] <Speedy2> mpt: mp_t
[04:20] <mdz> Speedy2: http://dijkstra.csh.rit.edu/~mdz/temp/fusion.tar.gz
[04:20] <Speedy2> mdz: Thanks a lot!
[04:20] <Speedy2> RIT? I had friends that went there
[04:22] <mdz> thom: bored?  MOM awaits! ;-)
[04:23] <thom> mdz: *g*
[04:23] <thom> mdz: i'm doing rather a bit of damage to this por internet cafe with firefox uplaod and breezy seed downlaod, i think they might cry if i do anything else
[04:24] <mdz> thom: I think the breezy seed download is bottlenecked on baz :-P
[04:24] <mdz> thom: firefox upload -> merge result?
[04:25] <daniels> thom: i think you should grab xorg sources
[04:25] <daniels> thom: just for a laugh
[04:25] <Speedy2> heheheh
[04:25] <thom> mdz: no, firefox oad -> rename; i saw the merge bug just after the orig started uploading
[04:25] <ogra> *grin*
[04:26] <thom> :(
[04:29] <daniels> thom: oh yeah, you totally need to upgrade ooo
[04:29] <jdub> ogra: later on, yeah
[04:29] <ogra> ah, ok
[04:30] <thom> heh
[04:30] <jdub> thom: dude, don't worry about the suit
[04:30] <jdub> thom: do not pass bondi junction, do not deposit $200 ;)
[04:30] <jdub> thom: i have it already, and DAMN DO I LOOK GOOD
[04:30] <jdub> EVERYBODY, COME AND SEE HOW GOOD I LOOL!
[04:30] <thom> jdub: fair enough; who did you get to do it?
[04:30] <jdub> LOOK!
[04:31] <thom> hahah
[04:31] <jdub> ;-)
[04:31] <jdub> we so need to have a mandatory screening
[04:32] <schweeb> jdub: i love scotch, scotchy scotch scotch
[04:32] <HrdwrBoB> down in my belly
[04:32] <jdub> deep into my belly
[04:32] <jdub> see
[04:32] <jdub> you guys konw the score!
[04:32] <schweeb> that movie rocks
[04:32] <HrdwrBoB> I ate a big, red, candle :/
[04:32] <jdub> :-)
[04:32] <thom> i drank a lava lamp. it wasn't lava
[04:33] <jdub> schweeb: i watched it 5 times in three days this week :-)
[04:33] <schweeb> especially when the retarded guy pulls out the grenade, and killed the guy with the triton :)
[04:33] <schweeb> <3 jdub
[04:33] <HrdwrBoB> ... and I killed a guy with a trident
[04:33] <schweeb> yea
[04:33] <schweeb> trident, that's what I meant
[04:33] <infinity> Is it okay to admit I have no freakin' clue what you guys are on about?
[04:33] <schweeb> infinity: Anchorman
[04:33] <thom> infinity: you will do; you *WILL* do
[04:34] <ogra> daniels, its no _that_ bad http://www.grawert.net/mataro/img100.jpeg
[04:35] <schweeb> looks like that suit hasn't been worn for a while, eh jdub... pants are a bit short looks like
[04:35] <schweeb> oh nm
[04:35] <schweeb> optical illusion
[04:36] <schweeb> are they perkypants though?
[04:36] <jdub> ALWAYS
[04:38] <Amaranth> mpt: What was that?
[04:41] <schweeb> ogra: you in any of these pics?
[04:41] <ogra> i took them...
[04:42] <schweeb> heh, most people will get someone to take a picture or 2 of them on their camera :)
[04:42] <ajmitch_> that reminds me, I need a decent memory card for my camera before I leave
[04:42] <schweeb> only people I really recognize are jdub and mako, heh
[04:42] <schweeb> oh, and there's elmo
[04:42] <ogra> schweeb, tollef took a nice one of me: http://err.no/pictures/2004-12-Mataro/slides/dsc00354.html
[04:43] <infinity> There are no nice pictures of me, that's why I'm always on the other end of the lens. :)
[04:43] <schweeb> every picture that gets taken of me, I'm usually pretty drunk
[04:44] <schweeb> visibly so
[04:46] <mako> i looked twisted in http://err.no/pictures/2004-12-Mataro/slides/dsc00372.html
[04:47] <schweeb> http://www.schweeb.org/~chris/pic2/Picture%20010.jpg <--- me, with the bud light :)
[04:47] <zul> isnt that what they always say?
[04:49] <bluefoxicy> infinity:  bored?
[04:51] <jdub> I DON'T KNOW WHAT WE'RE YELLING ABOUT!
[04:51] <lifeless> STUFF
[04:52] <infinity> bluefoxicy : There's nothing boring about patch merging, why it's so fun, I've been doing it all week!

[04:53] <bluefoxicy> heh
[04:53] <bluefoxicy> infinity:  I only do work when I'm bored :)
[04:53] <bluefoxicy> hence why I refuse to join any open source development team
[04:53] <bluefoxicy> speaking of development
[04:53] <bluefoxicy> anyone know of anything that'll let me RAD out a GTK+ app?
[04:54] <thom> LOUD NOISES
[04:54] <bluefoxicy> think Visual Basic, but with GTK+2 and C
[04:54] <thom> infinity: *giggle*
[04:55] <schweeb> thom: I DONT KNOW WHAT WE'RE YELLING ABOUT
[04:55] <tsume_> bluefoxicy: Glade
[04:56] <bluefoxicy> tsume_:  glade doesn't exactly do it :)
[04:56] <schweeb> bluefoxicy: glade, and eventually stetic
[04:56] <schweeb> that's the closest you'll get
[04:56] <tsume_> bluefoxicy: sure it does ;)
[04:56] <bluefoxicy> yeah, it's the closest, just doesn't let me double-click a button and edit its code for a given event
[04:56] <tsume_> I use wxWidgets with C++ though :)
[04:56] <bluefoxicy> i.e. GUI programming from a non-gui programmer's point of view
[04:56] <bluefoxicy> but with glade
[04:57] <bluefoxicy> I would like to be able to make the same kinds of things as the users and groups program
[04:57] <tsume_> a person can simply add the method/function to the needed even
[04:57] <tsume_> +t
[04:57] <tsume_> bluefoxicy: I really recommend wxWidgets, it uses the more popular toolkits on each platform
[04:58] <bluefoxicy> but I can't find the control and settings used for a list of check boxes, i.e. user properties -> user privileges
[04:58] <bluefoxicy> tsume_:  I want to do some linux-only programming
[04:59] <tsume_> bluefoxicy: okay, but you can do that as well
[04:59] <bluefoxicy> particulary, I might step up and code up the Ubuntu Security Center thing if nobody else is going to do it
[04:59] <bluefoxicy> but I can't do GUI programming
[04:59] <bluefoxicy> however
[04:59] <bluefoxicy> if I did code that
[04:59] <bluefoxicy> I'd come out with at least some method of being able to do that by the end, right?
[05:00] <bluefoxicy> so I'd learn something
[05:00] <bluefoxicy> hence it's highly worth my time
[05:00] <tsume_> bluefoxicy: the API for wxWidgets is _very_ easy
[05:00] <bluefoxicy> but I must sleep, work at 9am tomorrow
[05:00] <schweeb> use glade
[05:00] <schweeb> or wxWidgets
[05:00] <schweeb> those are about as simple as GUI programming gets...
[05:01] <tsume_> bluefoxicy: you can use many langs with wxwidgets, but knowing people like you. You might want to learn Python and wxPython(wxwidgets)
[05:01] <blueyed> Does anybody have a good visual diff/merge/directory comparison tool to recommend? The closest to Beyond Compare (on win32) I've found is xxdiff.. :/
[05:01] <bluefoxicy> tsume_, schweeb:  Well, I've got work at intermittent times.  If you wanna help I'll take a crack at it; I'll get you my availability some time tomorrow afternoon if so
[05:01] <bluefoxicy> tsume_: no way.  C is the best language for me :)
[05:01] <tsume_> bluefoxicy: you said you program for a hobby though, when you have time
[05:02] <bluefoxicy> tsume_:  I rarely find use for object orientation (though objective-c is better than C++ for that).  Not interested in python right now because I have no use for it and would like to solve an actual problem as well as learn something ;)
[05:02] <tsume_> bluefoxicy: well, do you create web scripts?
[05:02] <bluefoxicy> this problem I feel is better solved in C due to its simplicity
[05:02] <bluefoxicy> I don't do much web scripting.
[05:02] <tsume_> bluefoxicy: what about user scripts?
[05:02] <bluefoxicy> I may write a content managment system later though
[05:02] <ogra> AAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
[05:02] <bluefoxicy> user scripts I do, in bash
[05:02] <ogra>  + Enable locking by default after some time.
[05:03] <ogra> thats evil
[05:03] <tsume_> bluefoxicy: python is really for you :)
[05:03] <bluefoxicy> I've written stuff in like, bash with xdialog :)
[05:03] <tsume_> bluefoxicy: its written all over your personallity
[05:03] <bluefoxicy> tsume_:  maybe, but I really really like the C programming language
[05:03] <tsume_> bluefoxicy: you can write in C and make a linkage to python, it will be perfect practice for interfacing
[05:04] <bluefoxicy> I find it easiest to solve problems using it, aside from quick shellscript stuff done in bash :)
[05:04] <tsume_> bluefoxicy: also you can embed python in your C apps ;)
[05:04] <tsume_> bluefoxicy: Blender does
[05:04] <bluefoxicy> tsume_:  I'd rather learn some gui coding in C
[05:04] <bluefoxicy> I'll learn python at some point, it's on my todo list
[05:05] <bluefoxicy> since it seems to be a popular language
[05:05] <tsume_> bluefoxicy: you should really be using an OO based language for GUIs, it makes it a better experience.
[05:05] <thom> how on earth is breezy changes still checking out? GAR
[05:05] <bluefoxicy> no thanks
[05:05] <tsume_> bluefoxicy: C is the most popular, then C++, then Python
[05:05] <bluefoxicy> tsume_:  C is also useful for OO btw :)
[05:05] <bluefoxicy> structures are objects ;)
[05:05] <tsume_> bluefoxicy: I know
[05:05] <tsume_> bluefoxicy: pointers to functions :P
[05:05] <bluefoxicy> no
[05:06] <bluefoxicy> I rarely see a need for full-blown OOP
[05:06] <tsume_> bluefoxicy: hehe.
[05:06] <bluefoxicy> normally I see things where one object is being managed at a time, rather than a whole lot of them; or where an object is being passed along a codepath anyway
[05:07] <bluefoxicy> adding full OOP like in C++ or ObjC normally involves something like passing the same object (now a class) down the same codepath, except that now that codepath calls member functions for the class type of the object
[05:07] <bluefoxicy> which is pretty much moving the same code around
[05:07] <bluefoxicy> but following the same flow
[05:07] <bluefoxicy> so I rarely find OOP useful
[05:08] <schweeb> things like inheritance and such are awesome :)
[05:08] <bluefoxicy> OOP is useful if you do the same thing to the same type of object in multiple places regularly
[05:08] <bluefoxicy> if you normally call a member from one place in the code, then it's not really useful.
[05:09] <bluefoxicy> anyway I need sleep
[05:09] <tsume_> bluefoxicy: OOP makes it more than that
[05:11] <tsume_> bluefoxicy: method overloading is great, passing objects, STL, and many other features
[05:11] <ogra> jdub,  xss 4.21-1  + Includes a button to launch gdmflexiserver
[05:11] <ogra> seen that ?
[05:12] <schweeb> is that so you can run essentially do user-switching?
[05:12] <zul> later
[05:12] <schweeb> s/run //
[05:12] <ogra> yep
[05:16] <bluefoxicy> tsume_: objective-c is much better than c++
[05:18] <Amaranth> both suck compared to Python ;)
[05:19] <thom> um. zsh: 25266 segmentation fault (core dumped)  baz commit -s 'rename mozilla-firefox to firefox'
[05:19] <thom> *sigh*
[05:22] <robitaille> maybe a sign from the computer gods that firefox doesn't want to be renamed?
[05:24] <thom> robitaille: heh, entirely possible
[05:26] <robitaille> thom,  maybe it's time to patch "about:mozilla" to something like "you shall not remove Mozilla"
[05:28] <robitaille> which reminds me, maybe firefox needs more branding with a "about:ubuntu" page
[05:28] <thom> elmo: please sync powermgmt-base from unstable, the unstable version merely merges our changes
[05:29] <tsume_> bluefoxicy: ObjC has a high overhead
[05:50] <infinity> Also, a pain.
[05:50] <infinity> Oh well.  I blame jbailey.
[05:50] <infinity> Wouldn't need a new kernel if he hadn't dropped linuxthreads on PPC.
[06:06] <fabbione> morning
[06:06] <schweeb> morning
[06:07] <schweeb> fabbione: gonna try to set up some SPARC buildds this weekend :)
[06:08] <fabbione> schweeb: ok.. i will be around during most of the weekend... 
[06:08] <fabbione> but did you ever done that?
[06:08] <schweeb> k, cool
[06:08] <schweeb> no, I've never set up sbuild or anything
[06:08] <fabbione> good luck
[06:08] <schweeb> I've never even installed anything on a SPARC
[06:08] <schweeb> lol
[06:09] <aj> "I love how the packages that are newer than sid number exactly 1337."
[06:12] <jbailey> infinity: Sucks to be you? =)
[06:13] <infinity> jbailey : Yes, yes it does.
[06:13] <infinity> jbailey : And I'm still not done hating you. :P
[06:14] <jbailey> What's BootX, BTW?
[06:15] <schweeb> fabbione: how difficult are buildds to set up?  I mean, I could try to do something else with the boxes, but I can't think of anything else useful to do with them... and I know you were wantin SPARCs for buildin
[06:15] <fabbione> schweeb: what kind of sparcs do you have?
[06:16] <schweeb> whatever whiprush has got layin around
[06:16] <schweeb> a blade 2200 I think
[06:16] <schweeb> some others
[06:16] <fabbione> schweeb: yeah ok.. are they sparc64 or sparc?
[06:16] <jsgotangco> we're doing sparc?
[06:16] <fabbione> schweeb: if you can install them and give me access, i can setup the rest
[06:17] <fabbione> jsgotangco: since a while, but it is not released yet.. and it will be 100% unofficial
[06:17] <schweeb> alright, that's pretty much what I figured the best way would be
[06:17] <jsgotangco> ahhh
[06:17] <schweeb> although I would be interested in learning to do a buildd
[06:17] <fabbione> schweeb: than i suggest 2 things..
[06:18] <fabbione> if you have more than one sparc, setup one for me (possibly the fastest)
[06:18] <fabbione> and play with the other
[06:18] <fabbione> because setting up a buildd isn't always trivial
[06:18] <dholbach> morning
[06:18] <fabbione> but you can look at mine while you do that
[06:18] <fabbione> hey dholbach 
[06:18] <schweeb> should we put Sarge/Sid on them, or is there a pretty simple way to do Ubuntu (installer CD, etc..)?
[06:18] <dholbach> hey fabbione 
[06:18] <ajmitch_> morning dholbach 
[06:18] <dholbach> hey schweeb
[06:18] <dholbach> hey ajmitch_ 
[06:18] <schweeb> sup dholbach 
[06:18] <dholbach> so many nice people here :-)
[06:19] <fabbione> schweeb: you can try netinstalling them from sparc.u.c using hoary
[06:19] <jsgotangco> hi
[06:19] <fabbione> schweeb: but i don't guarantee it works
[06:19] <schweeb> k
[06:19] <fabbione> schweeb: otherwise go for sarge
[06:19] <schweeb> I'll see what I can do
[06:19] <ajmitch_> dholbach: just your regular fanclub ;)
[06:19] <infinity> jbailey : Think "loadlin.exe" for MacOS.
[06:19] <fabbione> unfortunatly 2 of the most important packages didn't make it in time
[06:19] <dholbach> we really need some nice dial-up tool for breezy, else i wouldnt have to install windoze on my sister's box today
[06:19] <schweeb> fabbione: whiprush seems to think you have to do some tftp boot love to get linux on the blade 2200
[06:19] <dholbach> *sigh deeply*
[06:19] <infinity> jbailey : For Macs where the firmware is so hideously broken that one needs to keep MacOS around as a glorified bootloader.
[06:19] <dholbach> ajmitch_: :-)
[06:20] <jbailey> infinity: Oy. =)
[06:20] <schweeb> fabbione: so I'll see
[06:20] <jsgotangco> lunch bbl
[06:22] <dholbach> hey pitti
[06:22] <fabbione> morning pitti
[06:22] <pitti> Good morning
[06:22] <pitti> *yawn*
[06:24] <jbailey> Anywho.  I can always tell that it's bed time when fabbione says "Good morning".. g'night all. ;)
[06:24] <dholbach> sleep tight, jbailey 
[06:25] <fabbione> night jbailey 
[06:25] <pitti> night jbailey 
[06:25] <fabbione> (And somebody still claims italians are useless :))
[06:25] <pitti> jbailey: although I'm way earlier than usual today :-)
[06:25] <schweeb> fabbione: Italians have good food, and good gangsters :)
[06:26] <infinity> jbailey : 'Night, yo.
[06:28] <jsgotangco> acckk
[06:29] <jsgotangco> italians have lots of popes too
[06:29] <cartel_> morning fabbione :)
[06:29] <fabbione> hi cartel_ 
[06:29] <fabbione> brb
[06:30] <cartel_> lol
[06:30] <cartel_> run from the cartel
[06:34] <fabbione> re
[06:34] <fabbione> cartel_: you can keep the conversation public, it's not a secret
[06:38] <Treenaks> fabbione: you must like pain :P
[06:38] <dholbach> fabbione: herve already did last night, and he said, he was fine
[06:38] <Treenaks> at LEAST
[06:38] <jsgotangco> ohhh room assignments
[06:39] <fabbione> nah it's just that i am working on breezy kernel
[06:39] <fabbione> and i am a bit scared of the new ToolChain
[06:39] <fabbione> but i will test on it anyway
[06:39] <fabbione> so better sooner than later
[06:39] <ajmitch_> dholbach: maybe you could do an upgrade of your box from .au?
[06:40] <Treenaks> jsgotangco: look for your room, mate 8)
[06:40] <dholbach> ajmitch_: i'll do it in .au, yes, although it's my sister's laptop
[06:40] <dholbach> wonder if i should break it for her :-)
[06:40] <ajmitch_> might as well
[06:41] <ajmitch_> plenty of people around to help unbreak it :)
[06:41] <dholbach> hope they unbreak the silly wireless thingie :-)
[06:41] <Treenaks> dholbach: broadcom annoyance?
[06:41] <ajmitch_> jsgotangco: aha, I missed that column on the spreadsheet :)
[06:41] <jsgotangco> aha
[06:41] <jsgotangco> hehe
[06:42] <dholbach> Treenaks: Network controller: Lucent Microelectronics: Unknown device ab30
[06:43] <stuNNed> ajmitch_: with madwifi?
[06:43] <Treenaks> dholbach: scary
[06:44] <dholbach> Treenaks: yes :-)
[06:44] <ajmitch_> stuNNed: yeah, seems to work ok
[07:33] <pitti> daniels: here?
[07:47] <dholbach> bye
[07:47] <ajmitch> bye dholbach 
[07:47] <dholbach> see you, ajmitch :-)
[08:13] <fabbione> i guess doko is on an airplane.. right?
[08:13] <fabbione> jbailey: please ping me when you wake up
[08:15] <infinity> fabbione : He went to bed less than 2 hours ago, you could be waiting awhile for that ping.
[08:15] <fabbione> infinity: i am not in a hurry :)
[08:16] <fabbione> infinity: i just saw a bunch of very scary messages building glibc on sparc
[08:16] <infinity> Colour me surprised.
[08:17] <fabbione> make[3] : *** No rule to make target `/build/sparcbuildd/glibc-2.3.5/build-tree/sparc-libc/sig
[08:17] <fabbione> nal/tst-signal.out', needed by `tests'.
[08:17] <fabbione> tons of these
[08:29] <infinity> Oh, that's normal.
[08:29] <infinity> Check a build log for another arch.
[08:29] <infinity> I remember freaking out when I first saw a mess of those while patching some bug or other.
[08:38] <fabbione> yay.. glibc doesn't build on sparc
[08:38] <schweeb> fabbione: haha, sounds like fun
[08:39] <fabbione> schweeb: it's a missing include
[08:39] <fabbione> go figure
[08:39] <schweeb> hehe
[08:40] <Treenaks> fabbione: and it worked before, with the older gcc?
[08:41] <fabbione> it's not a gcc problem
[08:41] <fabbione> glibc is forced to build with 3.3
[08:48] <ficusplanet> jdub, have you seen this: http://people.warp.es/~isaac/blog/index.php/ubuntu-and-msn-logos-18 ?
[08:50] <schweeb> ficusplanet: pretty anyone who's been paying attention to IRC or u-devel mail list has seen them
[08:50] <schweeb> *pretty much
[08:53] <ficusplanet> Oh, I never noticed it come up on ubuntu-devel.  Sorry about that.
[08:53] <schweeb> not a problem
[08:53] <schweeb> heh
[09:04] <Treenaks> schweeb: or the different planets..
[09:23] <theine> Is there a patch for the newest i pw2100 driver (1.1.0) available that allows the module to be build properly against the ubuntu kernel sources?
[09:43] <fabbione> theine: i answered already to you on #ubuntu
[10:03] <ajmitch> morning seb
[10:04] <jsgotangco> editing documents can be boring
[10:04] <jsgotangco> doh
[10:10] <desrt> seb128; poke
[10:11] <seb128> hi
[10:11] <desrt> the bug only affects you if you have 'forward as attachment' on
[10:11] <desrt> (which is default)
[10:13] <Amaranth> too much stuff
[10:20] <spo0nman> can i get a link to breezy goals?
[10:21] <desrt> use the wiki :P
[10:22] <desrt> i think there's seriously a page called BreezyGoals that links to the page you want
[10:22] <spo0nman> desrt: (:
[10:22] <desrt> http://udu.wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDownUnder/BreezyGoals
[10:22] <desrt> bewm
[10:24] <spo0nman> desrt: in the idea poll there is something said about faster boot and a link to an acticle by a IBM guy... i would like to work on that. how to find out who else is working in order to collaborate... or who to let know...
[10:32] <koke> hi all
[10:33] <fabbione> humpf
[10:34] <fabbione> i hate init scripts that start 736437 daemons at once
[10:35] <pitti> fabbione: I told you ten thousand times to not exaggerate so much
[10:36] <fabbione> pitti: nfs-utils :/
[10:36] <fabbione> you know i am paranoid
[10:36] <fabbione> that thing starts 4 daemons but spits out only one [OK]  like
[10:36] <fabbione> line
[10:37] <fabbione> it doesn't catch if one of the other daemons fail
[10:37] <fabbione> so either we add 3 more lines at boot
[10:37] <pitti> fabbione: I agree on that matter :-)
[10:37] <fabbione> or if something fails we will never see it
[10:37] <pitti> yeah, that sucks
[10:38] <fabbione> clutter or not clutter? 
[10:38] <fabbione> pitti: enlight me
[10:38] <Zomb> .o( the unclutter tool rules )
[10:38] <fabbione> pitti: yeah..
[10:38] <fabbione> it is more important to get the output in case of errors
[10:38] <pitti> fabbione: at least a failed daemon should cry out loud and make the script fail
[10:39] <astharot> ciao
[10:39] <pitti> yeah
[10:39] <fabbione> the entire script no.. just that daemon
[10:39] <pitti> Hi astharot, how are you doing?
[10:39] <fabbione> there is very little point in killing everything
[10:39] <pitti> fabbione: depends on whether the daemons depend on each other
[10:39] <astharot> how am I doing?
[10:39] <fabbione> since they can all run indipendently and in parallel
[10:39] <pitti> astharot: how are you, I meant
[10:40] <astharot> pitti: oh, I'm fine thanks :P and you?
[10:40] <pitti> fabbione: ah, ok. then it's even better to show four [OK]  lines IMHO
[10:40] <pitti> astharot: same :-)
[10:40] <astharot> pitti: I just sat to my office desktop :)
[10:45] <zyga> hello
[10:45] <superted> Is Coling Watson around?
[10:45] <superted> Colin*
[10:45] <zyga> I want to add automatic creation od /dev/cdrom
[10:45] <zyga> am I right to look in /dev/MAKEDEV?
[10:46] <pitti> no
[10:46] <fabbione> pitti: yeah
[10:47] <fabbione> superted: not yet
[10:47] <pitti> zyga: that should be created automatically, isn't it?
[10:47] <zyga> pitti: it's not
[10:47] <superted> fabbione: ok, thanks
[10:47] <zyga> pitti: (hey - it's a bug ;-)
[10:48] <zyga> pitti: I've created one by hand but after reboot it was gone
[10:48] <pitti> zyga: please file one, assign to me
[10:48] <zyga> the cd drive is /dev/hdc and ... w8
[10:48] <zyga> pitti: ok
[10:48] <seb128> elmo: gnome-keyring gtranslator startup-notification gnome-spell planner gtk-doc gtksourceview dia   syncs please
[10:48] <superted> does anyone know if this http://people.ubuntu.com/~cjwatson/installer-po/ is the place where the updated .po files resides?
[10:48] <zyga> pitti: if you tell me how I can help and test :)
[10:49] <pitti> zyga: /etc/udev/cd-aliases.rules
[10:50] <pitti> zyga: I'm at the phone ATM
[10:50] <fabbione> pitti: since you know udev.. #9688 ?
[10:50] <zyga> pitti: https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=5732 
[10:50] <zyga> pitti: I think this is realated
[10:50] <zyga> pitti: I'll look into it - thanks
[10:50] <fabbione> pitti: i will be glad to exchange it with one of yours
[10:52] <pitti> fabbione: sure, I take it
[10:53] <pitti> zyga: #5732 this rather looks like it's an installer bug
[10:54] <zyga> pitti: did you read the whole report?
[10:55] <pitti> zyga: no, just skimmed it
[10:55] <zyga> pitti: look at the end
[10:55] <spo0nman> grep this
[10:55] <pitti> zyga: if it is your problem, just add your comments there
[10:55] <zyga> pitti: I'm still checking
[10:56] <spo0nman> i ran sleep.sh on a HP lappie and it wont come out of it. its like its in qa comma or something.... its not doing anything i held the power button for like 5 minutes and still nothing....
[10:56] <zyga> spo0nman: remove the battery ;]  
[10:56] <spo0nman> is there anyway to get it out of sleep? i can pull the battery out... i need a screwdriver to get there or something
[10:57] <spo0nman> zyga: :( batter under screws... its company lappie i cant remove the stickers on the screws.
[10:57] <spo0nman> however it the network lights are still blinking. does hoary run ssh by default?
[10:57] <zyga> spo0nman: if you install openssh yes
[10:58] <zyga> spo0nman: can you get in remotely?
[10:58] <spo0nman> zyga: its a default ... i was doing a update while playing with acpi when this happened.
[10:58] <zyga> spo0nman: it will probably discharge after some time
[10:59] <spo0nman> so far my brightest idea has beem let the battery dry itself
[10:59] <zyga> spo0nman: don't you have any hardware reset button?
[10:59] <spo0nman> zyga: yeah! nothing i kept it pressed for like an hour
[10:59] <zyga> spo0nman: that's a software button :>
[10:59] <spo0nman> i just ran sleep.sh in /etc/acpid/
[10:59] <spo0nman> X-( /me blames HP
[11:00] <zyga> never try acpi without a screwdriver ;-)
[11:02] <maswan> well, the battery has finite capacity, just leave it running over night?
[11:02] <zyga> spo0nman: did you try alt+ctrl+del?
[11:02] <spo0nman> zyga: X-(
[11:03] <zyga> spo0nman: if it seems to berunning maybe video card just went crazy
[11:03] <maswan> spo0nman: did you try closing and opening the lid?
[11:03] <maswan> ctrl+alt-f1 ?
[11:03] <spo0nman> zyga: ok i pulled out the battery... screw the RULES
[11:04] <spo0nman> lesson learned : never try acpi without a screwdriver.
[11:04] <zyga> spo0nman: check the log file later will you/
[11:04] <spo0nman> zyga: yeah! will post on the -delel list.
[11:09] <spo0nman> zyga: /var/log/acpid ?
[11:12] <zyga> spo0nman: not sure really... try syslog and such too
[11:15] <fabbione> zyga, spo0nman: can you please move this conversation to #ubuntu?
[11:16] <fabbione> this channel is more like: hey i found this bug and this is the patch to fix it
[11:16] <zyga> fabbione: sure
[11:16] <fabbione> thanks
[11:24] <pitti> daniels: ?
[11:28] <spo0nman> bob2: ONE BUG FOR BOTH LAPPIES OR SEPRATE?
[11:28] <spo0nman> sorry CAPS on by mistake....
[11:28] <jsgotangco> acckk what the gmail is dead
[11:28] <spo0nman> and wrong channel.
[11:31] <pitti> screen -r
[11:31] <pitti> hmm, EFOCUS
[11:33] <jordi> heh, EEVERYTHING lately here
[11:38] <seb128> elmo: ping ?
[11:41] <GheRivero> res
[11:45] <elmo> seb128: yah
[11:45] <Mithrandir> pitti: would you have any problems with me putting an rc of irssi into breezy, security-wise?  The current version doesn't handle per-channel encodings and I really, really, really, _really_ want that.
[11:46] <pitti> Mithrandir: no, at this time I don't care about breakage in breezy
[11:46] <pitti> Mithrandir: however, breezy shuold get a released version by two months, is this possible?
[11:46] <Mithrandir> pitti: well, it might very well stay around for the release too, given that irssi hasn't seen a new upstream version in two-three years.
[11:46] <elmo> seb128: all ok to override, I assume?
[11:46] <pitti> Mithrandir: uh
[11:46] <pitti> Mithrandir: is it supported upstream at all?
[11:47] <Mithrandir> pitti: it sees the occasional svn commit, like every second week or so, so upstream is alive.
[11:47] <Mithrandir> pitti: I guess they just don't have any release engineers aboard.
[11:48] <pitti> Mithrandir: okay
[11:48] <pitti> Mithrandir: so that sounds as if it wouldn't really matter if a released or a svn snapshot breaks...
[11:49] <seb128> elmo: right
[11:49] <fabbione> hey elmo
[11:50] <elmo> seb128: ok, done
[11:50] <Mithrandir> pitti: so it's ok with you?
[11:50] <elmo> hey fabbione 
[11:50] <seb128> thanks
[11:50] <Mithrandir> pitti: I'm talking about a release candidate, even though it's old, not just a random snapshot.
[11:51] <fabbione> elmo: do we have any ETA for ports.u.c? (and yes i know you are very busy ;))
[11:53] <pitti> Mithrandir: yeah, it's fine with me
[11:53] <elmo> fabbione: if at all possible, I'll do it today, but there's some "must-do-before-going-to-.au" stuff I really have to get done in the DC first
[11:54] <fabbione> elmo: sure i understand and it would be great if you can manage :)
[11:54] <fabbione> elmo: if there is anything i can help with.. please ping
[11:56] <elmo> fabbione: sure, thanks
[12:12] <cartman> glibc is updated to 2.3.5 for breezy but binutils is still at 2.15
[12:12] <cartman> is this safe?
[12:30] <seb128> elmo: somebody is working on the issue with packages moved from universe to main for breezy ? 
[12:30] <seb128> elmo: ie, stuff which are hoary/universe, breezy/main and returns a file not found now on hoary 
[12:45] <fabbione> mjg59: ping?
[12:46] <mjg59> fabbione: Hi
[12:46] <fabbione> mjg59: want some crack to test?
[12:46] <mjg59> fabbione: Sounds good - 2.6.12?
[12:46] <fabbione> mjg59: rc2
[12:46] <fabbione> 686 is fine?
[12:47] <fabbione> or do you need other flavours?
[12:47] <mjg59> 686 is good
[12:47] <fabbione> o
[12:47] <fabbione> k
[12:48] <mjg59> If you give me a download spot, I'll grab it - but I can't promise much testing (I'm catching a plane this evening)
[12:48] <mjg59> fabbione: Source packages would be lovely
[12:48] <fabbione> mjg59: image is on the way.. sources are not final yet
[12:48] <fabbione> but the changes i have in my TODO do not imply any internal change. only other external drivers
[12:49] <mjg59> fabbione: Ah, ok
[12:49] <fabbione> i will stick up a .diff.gz anyway
[12:49] <mjg59> fabbione: Cool, thanks - against stock 2.6.12-rc2?
[12:49] <fabbione> mjg59: there is also the orig there
[12:49] <fabbione> but yes.. it's .11 + stock rc2 patch
[12:53] <elmo> seb128: oh
[12:54] <elmo> seb128: examples?
  W: Failed to fetch http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/g/gcc-4.0/gcc-4.0_4.0-0pre6ubuntu7_amd64.deb
[12:54] <mjg59> fabbione: Ah, thank you
[12:54] <seb128> that's s/universe/main now
[12:54] <seb128> or evince
[12:54] <fabbione> mjg59: still scping
[12:54] <elmo> the evince seems entirely bogus
[12:55] <seb128> why ?
[12:55] <pitti> mvo: mind if I take #9340 from you? (gimp-print merge)
[12:55] <elmo> seb128: it's in main in the packages and pool?
[12:55] <mvo> pitti: not at all
[12:55] <seb128> elmo: evince is hoary/universe, breezy/main
[12:55] <elmo>     evince | 0.1.9-0ubuntu1 |         hoary | source, amd64, i386, ia64, powerpc
[12:55] <elmo> grr
[12:56] <seb128> a guy mailed about it 2 days ago
[12:57] <elmo> I think someone teri'd this post-release
[12:58] <seb128> seems than all the package moved from universe to main are broken for hoary
[12:59] <elmo> seb128: hardly all
[12:59] <seb128> elmo: do you see what is wrong ? why have they been removed from universe ?
[12:59] <elmo> I'll fix it
[12:59] <seb128> k, I don't know if we have moved a lot of stuff
[01:00] <seb128> thanks
[01:03] <jbailey> fabbione: ping. =)
[01:03] <seb128> hey jbailey 
[01:03] <fabbione> hey jbailey
[01:03] <jbailey> Heya sb
[01:03] <fabbione> jbailey: people.u.c/~fabbione/
[01:04] <fabbione> jbailey: there is the FTBFS glibc log for you
[01:04] <fabbione> jbailey: 1 thing more over the real failure are all the error messages from the missing tests?
[01:05] <jbailey> glibc_2.3.5-0ubuntu1_20050415-0627.bz2  
[01:05] <jbailey> ?
[01:05] <fabbione> yeps
[01:05] <fabbione> it fails almost at the end
[01:05] <jbailey> At that size it failed near the beginning...
[01:06] <fabbione> jbailey: at 11MB?
[01:06] <fabbione> it's almost at the end
[01:06] <fabbione> it's a bz2 for a reason :)
[01:06] <fabbione> sorry 14Mb
[01:07] <jbailey> 14Mb down to 251k?
[01:08] <fabbione> yeps
[01:08] <fabbione> dude.. it's a log :)
[01:08] <elmo> seb128: hang on - is evince meant to be in main?
[01:08] <jbailey> Wow. 
[01:08] <seb128> elmo: right, that's the default pdf/ps viewer for breezt
[01:08] <seb128> breezy even
[01:08] <fabbione> jbailey: my sparc can compress more :)
[01:08] <fabbione> ehhe
[01:09] <seb128> elmo: mdz has already remplaced gnome-gv/xpdf by evince for ubuntu-desktop IIRC
[01:09] <jbailey> /build/sparcbuildd/glibc-2.3.5/debian/include/asm/traps.h:9:31: asm-sparc64/traps.h: No such file or directory
[01:09] <jbailey> That's the triggering error.  Everything else is from that.
[01:10] <fabbione> jbailey: yes.. i could see that.. but i was hoping in you shedding some light on why :)
[01:10] <jbailey> fabbione: It's just simply missing from l-k-h, I'm guessing.
[01:10] <fabbione> jbailey: also go up a bit and you will see that all the tests aren't executed
[01:11] <fabbione> jbailey: ah ok..
[01:11] <elmo> seb128: okay, all fixed
[01:11] <jbailey> fabbione: The tests are never built because libc.so isn't built.
[01:11] <fabbione> i did build ubuntu2 btw.. and it was ok
[01:11] <elmo> (well, on ftp-master anyway)
[01:11] <seb128> elmo: thanks!
[01:11] <seb128> what was wrong (just curious) ?
[01:12] <fabbione> jbailey: ok.. can you fix l-k-h or do you want me to?
[01:12] <fabbione> jbailey: i guess that the procedure is fix l-k-h and try to rebuild glibc
[01:12] <elmo> seb128: I have a script to fix this up, but it was only looking at warty, not hoary+warty
[01:13] <jbailey> fabbione: Right.  There are two things I suspect I should do.  1) Pull this file in from real kernel headers.  It's obvious been marked as a kernel-only header in error.  2) Double check the testsuite for lkh.  I suspect that it only runs the 32bit tests on any given arch.
[01:13] <seb128> elmo: k
[01:14] <fabbione> jbailey: ok, than i suggest that you can look at l-k-h in the chroot i created for you
[01:14] <fabbione> and i will build glibc that has the whole ccache
[01:14] <fabbione> so it will be faster
[01:14] <jbailey> fabbione: Faster, good. =)
[01:14] <fabbione> jbailey: exactly
[01:18] <fabbione> mjg59: 12rc2 suspend/resume on compaq armada M700 looks good. one annoying thing is that wireless pcmcia doesn't restore the ESSID
[01:18] <mjg59> fabbione: Bleah.
[01:19] <fabbione> but i guess that's userland
[01:19] <fabbione> so
[01:20] <jbailey> fabbione: Do you have a kernel source handy?  If yes, can you toss asm-sparc64/traps.h into the chroot for me?
[01:20] <fabbione> jbailey: sure.. just a sec
[01:20] <fabbione> jbailey: what version specifically?
[01:21] <jbailey> fabbione: Doesn't matter, it won't have changed that much through the 2.6 series, probably.
[01:21] <jbailey> fabbione: I'm working from 2.6.11.2
[01:21] <fabbione> ok
[01:21] <jbailey> fabbione: This won't go as a patch to upstream, I'll just ask that he include the header so the next version won't have the mismatch.
[01:22] <fabbione> hmmm
[01:22] <fabbione> there is no traps.h
[01:23] <jbailey> Err..
[01:24] <fabbione> jbailey: i am looking at 2.6.12rc2 and there is no traps.h in include/asm-sparc64/
[01:25] <fabbione> i did copy the kernel source in your chroot home dir..
[01:26] <jbailey> fabbione: Tx
[01:27] <fabbione> jbailey: i can see sparc32 has it
[01:27] <fabbione> but traps.h is not mentioned at all in arch/sparc64/
[01:33] <jbailey> fabbione: Is this build still sitting in a chroot somewhere?
[01:35] <desrt> pain
[01:35] <jbailey> fabbione: In my lkh, traps.h doesn't refer to asm-sparc64 at all...
[01:35] <jbailey> fabbione: Also, gcc isn't running with -m64, so it shouldn't be declaring __arch64__.  I think there are deeper issues here.
[01:37] <fabbione> jbailey: nope.. it has been flushed..
[01:37] <fabbione> jbailey: i can rebuild for you.. it's no problem.
[01:38] <ross> mjg59: my new t40p won't suspend in hoary
[01:38] <ross> mjg59: should i just file a bug?
[01:39] <cartman>   tr_TR.UTF-8...LC_MONETARY: value of field `int_curr_symbol' does not correspond to a valid name in ISO 4217
[01:39] <cartman> ah glibc looks borked on breezy
[01:40] <mjg59> ross: Yeah
[01:40] <mjg59> ross: You've enabled ACPI_SLEEP?
[01:40] <jbailey> cartman: Please file that in bugzilla.  Locales ought to be all working just as well as they were in Hoary.
[01:40] <cartman> jbailey: I will just after dist-upgrade finishes :)
[01:40] <ross> mjg59: i just installed hoary and wanted it to work
[01:40] <ross> ok why is backspace deleting words
[01:41] <mjg59> ross: Edit /etc/default/acpi-support
[01:42] <ross> mjg59: from the comments i should add ipw2100 too i guess
[01:43] <mjg59> ross: No, that should be handled automatically
[01:44] <lupusBE> since breezy I get a lot of errors compiling
[01:44] <lupusBE> user_group.c:285: warning: pointer targets in passing argument 1 of strlen differ in signedness
[01:44] <lupusBE> user_group.c:285: warning: pointer targets in passing argument 1 of __builtin_strcmp differ in signedness
[01:44] <lupusBE> and with xml too
[01:44] <Treenaks> lupusBE: fix your code ;)
[01:45] <lupusBE> Treenaks, almost all projects suffer from this :s
[01:45] <Amaranth> those are just warnings
[01:45] <Treenaks> Amaranth: still..
[01:45] <Treenaks> signednedd problems should be fixed
[01:45] <Treenaks> signedness, too
[01:45] <Amaranth> sure, but it doesn't stop things from working
[01:45] <Treenaks> Amaranth: on some archs it does
[01:45] <Amaranth> they've always done that, this is just the first time gcc has complained
[01:46] <lupusBE> gdl won't build because of it I think
[01:46] <Amaranth> nah, that can't be why it won't build
[01:46] <Amaranth> because those are warnings
[01:46] <Amaranth> unless ld is failing later because of it
[01:47] <lupusBE> gdl-dock-layout.c:1371: warning: pointer targets in assignment differ in signedness
[01:47] <lupusBE> make[2] : *** [gdl-dock-layout.lo]  Error 1
[01:47] <Treenaks> what are the flags? some way to make warnings fatal?
[01:47] <mjg59> lupusBE: Either it's building with -Werror, or there's another error further up that's killing the build
[01:47] <Treenaks> yes..
[01:47] <Treenaks> -Werror!
[01:49] <jbailey> err, not no-warn...
[01:49] <Treenaks> -pedantic ? :P
[01:49] <seb128> I hope you don't mean "jbailey will bug seb128 with every single build warning" ? :)
[01:50] <jbailey> -Wno-unused.
[01:50] <jbailey> Treenaks: pednatic doesn't increase portability.  Missing declarations does.
[01:50] <Treenaks> jbailey: true
[01:50] <jbailey> +Fixing
[01:50] <jbailey> seb128: Nah, I'll send them upstream, probably with patches.
[01:50] <ross> mjg59: it appears that shutting the lid doesn't cause a sleep. is that the default, or can i make it happen?
[01:51] <Treenaks> jbailey: why no-unused?
[01:51] <jbailey> seb128: But I would love to get to where we could generally expect the gnome stuff to build without warnings and enable that as a nice tester to help keep non-primary arch's in decent shape.
[01:51] <mjg59> ross: That's the default - you can make it happen by fiddling with what /etc/acpi/events/lid calls
[01:51] <mjg59> But fn+f4 should sleep it
[01:51] <seb128> jbailey: a GNOME guys is sending patches to fix all the build warning with gcc4 atm
[01:51] <jbailey> Treenaks: Because it's not a portability increasing warning, it's a code cleanliness warning.
[01:51] <Treenaks> jbailey: which is good too.. usually
[01:52] <seb128> jbailey: hurry up if you want to do that too, within 2 weeks he'll have probably reviewed the whole desktop 
[01:52] <lupusBE> cc1: warnings being treated as errors
[01:52] <Treenaks> lupusBE: ah: it's using -Werror
[01:53] <ross> mjg59: would you accept a feature request to add sleep-on-lid?
[01:53] <jbailey> seb128: If I do it before, it'll possibly be just duplicating work.
[01:53] <jbailey> And it's not like I have spare time before UDU.
[01:54] <elmo> who uploaded memtest86+ ?
[01:54] <seb128> jbailey: should be fine so, look at http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=300667 by example :)
[01:54] <fabbione> elmo: i did
[01:55] <elmo> fabbione: why upload it as an ubuntu?  the only remaining diff is the changelog?
[01:56] <fabbione> elmo: right..
[01:57] <fabbione> i didn't really plug my brain, but i though that we also wanted to keep track of our previous changelog
[01:57] <seb128> elmo: gal2.4 gtkhtml3.6 syncs please
[01:58] <Ben2004uk> "Trainee Software test Analyst" <---- good position for a someone wanting to go into software developement???
[01:58] <jbailey> seb128: I hope this guy knows what he's doing - some of the casts look a bit odd.
[01:58] <elmo> seb128: done
[01:58] <seb128> elmo: thanks
[01:59] <seb128> jbailey: I think so, he does a lot of QA for GNOME
[01:59] <jbailey> seb128: 'kay.
[01:59] <seb128> jbailey: ie it run valgrind on everything :)
[01:59] <pitti> elmo: pmount and squid sync, please
[01:59] <fabbione> 99% of the merges are due to init scripts
[02:00] <pitti> fabbione: really? for me it's about 20% only
[02:00] <jbailey> seb128: It's more the shifts between guchar* and char*.  They look inconsistant, and I'm guessing that if they were meant to be used interchangably, there wouldn't need to be a cast.
[02:00] <elmo> pitti: (I'm assuming you mean to override)
[02:00] <pitti> elmo: yes
[02:00] <elmo> pitti: done
[02:00] <pitti> thanks
[02:00] <Mithrandir> elmo: the ia32-libs in Debian is built with Debian binary .debs, is it ok to sync that or would you prefer I uploaded one with stuff from Ubuntu?
[02:02] <elmo> Mithrandir: ia32-libs needs to die in the screaming fires of hell
[02:02] <elmo> or something
[02:02] <ross> mjg59: does hoary try and detect laptops and turn on ACPI_SLEEP as required?  or does everyone have to turn it on if they need it
[02:02] <Mithrandir> elmo: multiarch.
[02:02] <seb128> jbailey: they have discussed that on IRC IIRC, probably changed for a good reason
[02:02] <elmo> Mithrandir: given we're trying to use gcc-4 consistently, I think we should probably upload something built with our binaries?
[02:03] <Mithrandir> elmo: ok, sure.  I'll just hold it off until we've rebuilt a bunch of stuff then.
[02:03] <elmo> besides, I thought it "built" at build-time nowA?
[02:04] <Mithrandir> elmo: no, but it's possible to do that if you're on the right arch.  The source needs to be prepared on ia32, but the package wants to build on ia64/amd64.
[02:04] <elmo> by "built", I mean dpkg -x'ed and mv'ed around
[02:05] <Mithrandir> yes, that's right, but the binary debs are in the package already.
[02:05] <Mithrandir> they're just extracted and shaken
[02:05] <fabbione> we need to get rid of that lsb-base init madness
[02:06] <fabbione> no wonder things do not work and we don't get proper input from the user
[02:06] <pitti> fabbione: no, Debian needs to accept it eventually
[02:06] <elmo> mithrandir: wouldn't it make more sense to apt-get them?  you can assume the buildd has access to a full mirror, I think
[02:06] <fabbione> elmo: isn't a prerequisite that buildd might not need net access?
[02:06] <pitti> fabbione: we will need this stuff anyway for things like usplash
[02:06] <Mithrandir> elmo: for Debian, the build wants to get the packages from sarge and not sid.  It sounds error-prone to me.
[02:06] <Mithrandir> fabbione: mirror access != net access
[02:06] <ogra> fabbione, what about a /var/log/init.log ?
[02:07] <pitti> fabbione: an abstraction for boot messages is a good idea IMHO (okay, the implementation may be broken, but that's another story)
[02:07] <Mithrandir> fabbione: Debian seemed mostly happy about accepting it if we made it configurable.
[02:07] <fabbione> ogra: could be an idea given that init scripts are sane. and they are not
[02:07] <ogra> hmm
[02:07] <fabbione> Mithrandir: the issue is not configurable or not.. here the issue is how intrusive it is in the init scripts
[02:08] <fabbione> we are losing a lot of information at boot time
[02:08] <fabbione> including errors
[02:08] <pitti> fabbione: indeed, they should be logged somewhere
[02:09] <fabbione> pitti: they can't be .. that's the problem.. the errors are generated by the init script.. and we are changing them to add lsb
[02:09] <fabbione> and in some cases of error handling lsb simply fails
[02:09] <pitti> fabbione: yeah, right, we must restore the logging
[02:09] <pitti> fabbione: but that should not mean to drop lsb completely
[02:10] <pitti> we need an abstraction for customizations
[02:10] <pitti> like usplash, or boot logging, or whatever
[02:10] <pitti> in fact, boot logging should be easier, not harder, with a proper LSB init script implementation
[02:16] <mvo> elmo: can you please sync heartbeat from debian? they took our changes
[02:17] <pitti> fabbione: bah, udev merge is a real pain...
[02:17] <fabbione> pitti: want to take a look at hotplug? :
[02:17] <fabbione> :P
[02:17] <cartman> ok locales bug reported
[02:17] <cartman> https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=9743
[02:17] <seb128> daniels: around ?
[02:18] <pitti> dudes, it's a bit early to report upgrading bugs in breezy, isn't it?
[02:18] <elmo> mvo: done
[02:18] <mvo> thanks
[02:19] <Amaranth> what is hoary-changes for?
[02:20] <Amaranth> err, the repository
[02:20] <Amaranth> and it's called hoary-updates :)
[02:20] <ogra> Amaranth, calendar and the like....
[02:21] <Amaranth> ah, it's for the porn :)
[02:21] <zyga> mvo: thanks for the explanation :)
[02:21] <pitti> Amaranth: for truly critical,but non-security releated updates
[02:21] <mvo> zyga: your welcome :)
[02:21] <Amaranth> i'm on breezy and need to make packages for hoary
[02:23] <ogra> Amaranth, what for ? hoary is stable...
[02:23] <Amaranth> mozilla firefox locale updates were critical but non-security related?
[02:24] <Amaranth> ogra: Sure, but gnome-menus has a bug that's fixed in CVS that I need for my menu editor to work.
[02:24] <Amaranth> And I need to package PyXDG CVS to fix another bug.
[02:24] <ogra> Amaranth, so do it in breezy
[02:24] <Amaranth> ogra: Then hoary uses don't get to use my editor.
[02:24] <Amaranth> err, users
[02:24] <Amaranth> and GNOME 2.12 will have an editor so what's the point?
[02:26] <Kamion> chroot shouldn't be hard
[02:26] <Amaranth> yeah, that's why i was thinking pbuilder
[02:26] <Amaranth> i had it setup already when i was using hoary, it should still work
[02:29] <zyga> which package generates sources.list?
[02:29] <zyga> I've .. once again .. found that contained incorrect entries 
[02:29] <zyga> it had *.ubuntu.com instead of *.ubuntulinux.org
[02:30] <Kamion> that's correct
[02:30] <zyga> Kamion: if failed to sync, also the domain does not belong to us, right?
[02:31] <Kamion> *.ubuntu.com is generally preferred; the only reason *.ubuntulinux.org exists at all was that we couldn't get *.ubuntu.org
[02:31] <Kamion> zyga: no, it probably just means you caught it in the middle of mirroring, try again
[02:31] <zyga> Kamion: will do, thanks
[02:36] <zyga> mvo: would you accept a patch that adds .cvsignore to various dirs?
[02:37] <mvo> elmo: please sync eunuchs from debian, they took our changes too. btw, is it ok to ask for single package syncs? or do you prefer them in batches?
[02:37] <mvo> zyga: yes
[02:37] <pitti> fabbione: do you enable USB block devices again in 2.6.12?
[02:38] <elmo> mvo: single is fine
[02:38] <elmo> mvo: done
[02:38] <mvo> thanks
[02:49] <dilinger> pitti: you mean the ub driver, in lieu of usb-storage?
[02:50] <pitti> yes
[02:51] <Treenaks> does it work with my mixed USB CD writer/CF reader yet? :)
[02:51] <zul> hola
[02:52] <pitti> Zu zul
[02:52] <pitti> Hi zul, even
[02:52] <zul> heh how is it going pitti 
[02:53] <pitti> merge rave...
[02:53] <zul> fun fun
[02:57] <fabbione> pitti: no
[02:57] <pitti> ok
[02:59] <Mithrandir> pitti: what did you do about the ooo overflow?
[02:59] <pitti> Mithrandir: it's patched, and I tested it, but the new package fails for me (also includes new Xhosa translations)
[02:59] <pitti> Mithrandir: I have to talk with doko, but he's travelling ATM
[03:00] <Mithrandir> pitti: ok, once we have the ia32 package in, I'd love to get the amd64 package in too.
[03:00] <pitti> Mithrandir: okay, I ping you
[03:00] <Mithrandir> cool
[03:00] <pitti> Mithrandir: both should be fixed in a commmon USN
[03:08] <mjg59> ross: At the moment, everyone needs to twiddle it
[03:12] <Kamion> elmo: sync usb-discover 1.03 from incoming, please?
[03:17] <Kamion> so evil
[03:17] <Mithrandir> heh
[03:17] <Mithrandir> UTF-8 is teh evil, I say. *hides*
[03:17] <Treenaks> Mithrandir: what are you? Japanese? :)
[03:18] <Kamion> Mithrandir: hm? the problem wouldn't have arisen in the first place if everyone used UTF-8 :P
[03:18] <Mithrandir> Treenaks: you know, we have three letters more than the ASCII world.
[03:18] <Kamion> this was a classic "ISO-8859-2 accidentally treated as ISO-8859-1" problem
[03:18] <Mithrandir> Kamion: it might not have arised if pigs could fly either.
[03:18] <Treenaks> Mithrandir: about the same here in .nl
[03:18] <Mithrandir> Treenaks: you have actual extra letters, not just accented ones?
[03:19] <Kamion> Mithrandir: ij ligature?
[03:19] <Mithrandir> Kamion: I don't know dutch. :)
[03:19] <elmo> Kamion: done
[03:19] <Treenaks> Mithrandir: well, no.. we can usually live without the one we have () by ubstituting it with "ij"
[03:19] <Kamion> elmo: thanks
[03:20] <Mithrandir> Treenaks: substituting  with ae kinda works,  can't really be done, so it's done with oe,  is aa, so that's ok-ish.
[03:20] <Mithrandir> Treenaks: we're using them in every second or third word, though
[03:21] <Treenaks> Mithrandir: same with "", but as most keyboards are US anyway, and we've used "ij" since the typewriter was invented (even though some of those had  keys), "ij" is 'good enough'
[03:22] <Treenaks> though it breaks most capitalization stuff (IJsselmeer, not Ijsselmeer ;))
[03:26] <zyga> mvo: ping
[03:30] <mvo> zyga: pong
[03:30] <zyga> mvo: I'm trying to make .desktop.in files correct by using prefix instead of hardcoded path; still @prefix@ does not get expanded
[03:30] <zyga> mvo: also g-s-p.desktop was not included in Makefile.am (fixed)
[03:31] <mvo> zyga: uh, thanks
[03:31] <zyga> any insigth on how to get @prefix@ into .desktop.in files?
[03:40] <jbailey> zyga: Using autoconf?
[03:40] <zyga> jbailey: yes
[03:40] <zul> why not sed?
[03:40] <jbailey> zul: Probably because he's set the prefix with autoconf. =)
[03:40] <zul> that could be it
[03:41] <mvirkkil> molliukko: Kato Mikko. Moro ;-)
[03:41] <zyga> jbailey: Exec=gksudo @prefix@/gnome-software-properties
[03:41] <zyga> this does not work
[03:41] <jbailey> zyga: Make sure you're building it in AC_OUTPUT in your configure.ac
[03:41] <zyga> checking
[03:42] <zyga> jbailey: actually u-m has configure.in (that's okay?)
[03:42] <zyga> jbailey: It's not built in AC_OUTPUT
[03:43] <jbailey> Sure.  configure.{in,ac} are fine.  You usually want to make sure that you've updated to autoconf 2.5x at least, though.
[03:43] <jbailey> Older versions work, but most people will assume you're using the newer stuff.
[03:43] <zyga> 2.53
[03:43] <jbailey> zyga: How is the file being build from the .in now?
[03:43] <zyga> jbailey: it's not, the in builds one of the makefiles
[03:43] <zyga> jbailey: that in turn builds all desktop files
[03:44] <jbailey> zyga: Hmm..  You can either choose to sed it in the Makefile, or have configure AC_OUTPUT it.
[03:44] <zyga> www.suxx.pl/update-manager/update-manager--zk/
[03:44] <zyga> (I really dislike autotools :P)
[03:44] <jbailey> If you have configure so it, you can all of the AC_SUBSTs done for free on it.
[03:45] <jbailey> Otherwise the generated file has to depend on config.log or something like that to get incremental builds to work righ.t
[03:45] <zyga> jbailey: I'll try to make it working, thanks
[03:46] <jbailey> 'k. =)
[03:46] <zyga> jbailey: It works :>
[03:47] <jbailey> zyga: Cool. =)
[03:47] <zyga> now I need to choose right prefix
[03:47] <zyga> I want /usr/bin
[03:47] <zyga> and @prefix expands to /usr in my case
[03:48] <zyga> thats execprefix?
[03:51] <zyga> bindir
[03:52] <zyga> hmm :/
[03:52] <zyga> strange bindir got expanded to ${exec_prefix}
[03:54] <zul> huh? debconf has a gui wizard thingy?
[03:55] <Zomb> how much does a complete hoary mirror (i386 plus amd64) need on disk space? less than 25GiB?
[03:56] <Mithrandir> Zomb: no source?
[03:57] <Zomb> not yet
[03:57] <Zomb> I expect something in the regions of Sid, right?
[03:57] <Mithrandir> Zomb: warty + hoary amd64, i386, powerpc, source is around 50GB
[03:57] <Mithrandir> so 25GB should be enough
[03:59] <elmo> YOWSER
[03:59] <Zomb> ok, thanks. I will try to get the permission to create a mirror on our university (DFN, Germany)
[03:59] <elmo> gnome is so not happy if your clock gets reset to 1904
[03:59] <Treenaks> elmo: metacity breaks right?
[03:59] <elmo> Treenaks: _everything_ breaks
[03:59] <Treenaks> (because it works with timestamps)
[03:59] <elmo> you can't even login with the fail safe session
[04:00] <Mithrandir> "you live in the wrong century.  go away."
[04:00] <zyga> please update to 2005 ;-)
[04:00] <elmo> Mithrandir: I wouldn't mind so much if the error messages said that
[04:00] <elmo> instead you get crap like "blah blah -3 blah blah"
[04:02] <Mithrandir> hm, the gnome panel should really do mosx-style panel magnification
[04:02] <Mithrandir> so if you point at an applet, it'll be zoomed
[04:03] <elmo> has anyone else got a powerbook running hoary?
[04:03] <Treenaks> Mithrandir: like KDE does too
[04:03] <jbailey> zyga: Did you solve evrything you needed?
[04:03] <Mithrandir> elmo: Kamion probably?
[04:03] <zyga> jbailey: no
[04:03] <Mithrandir> Treenaks: they do for the systray too?
[04:03] <elmo> Mithrandir: probably..
[04:03] <zyga> jbailey: I don't understand why bindir expands to ${exec_prefix}/bin
[04:03] <Treenaks> Mithrandir: no idea
[04:03] <zyga> (or why ${exec_prefix} does not expand)
[04:03] <zyga> I'm reading configure (no .in) right now
[04:04] <Mithrandir> zyga: because bindir by default is \${exec_prefix}
[04:04] <zyga> # Installation directory options.
[04:04] <zyga> # These are left unexpanded so users can "make install exec_prefix=/foo"
[04:04] <zyga> # and all the variables that are supposed to be based on exec_prefix
[04:04] <jbailey> zyga: Because you can override exec_prefix at build time.  It's expecting to do the substitutions in a shell script.
[04:04] <zyga> jbailey: so the bottom line?
[04:05] <jbailey> zyga: If you want to preserve that flexibility, you might be stuck with sed'ing it in the Makefile.
[04:06] <zyga> jbailey: build time == substituting stuff like @prefix
[04:06] <zyga> jbailey: it's all python
[04:07] <jbailey> I'd need to be starting at the going to make anything other than general recommendations.
[04:07] <zyga> I'm getting the impression that autotools are not helping here :>
[04:11] <jbailey> zyga: right.  You're now looking for substitutions beyond what are usually provided.
[04:11] <jbailey> zyga: So you need make to expand the variables out completely.
[04:11] <jbailey> zyga: That to me spells sed love.
[04:12] <zyga> I'm going to do it in a lame and easy way
[04:12] <zyga> @prefi@/bin is just as good for me
[04:13] <jbailey> And trust that the people using your software generally aren't advanced autotools users? =)
[04:13] <zyga> jbailey: well @prefix@/bin is far better than /usr/bin/ don't you think?
[04:14] <zyga> (that was there before)
[04:14] <zyga> jbailey: since I'm not even novice auto* developer that's okay ;-)
[04:15] <zyga> jbailey: er... 
[04:15] <zyga> it's broken again
[04:16] <zyga> while @prefix@ is expanded special .desktop notation used by i18n is not 
[04:16] <zyga> so it's even more broken this time
[04:19] <jbailey> zyga: Right. =)
[04:20] <zyga> ok I'm not qualified to fix this --- reverting changes
[04:21] <jbailey> zyga: What bug are you trying to fix?
[04:21] <zyga> jbailey: update-manager
[04:22] <zyga> it has lots of absolute paths
[04:24] <mvo> zyga: sorry for not helping you with it, I'm busy with other sutff right now. I'll have a look later (hopefully)
[04:25] <zyga> mvo: I understand - you have more than one program to think about :-)
[04:26] <mvo> zyga: yes :)
[04:28] <seb128> elmo: gtkspell sync please
[04:32] <elmo> seb128: done
[04:33] <Keybuk> pitti: there's no particular reason to remove the alias on mom bugs, she'll do it herself if they're resolved
[04:35] <mdz> elmo: ?
[04:36] <ogra> Keybuk, can i send your mom to upstream devs that added new features which break all my patches to beat them with a stick ? or do i need to open a ferature request bug for that ?
[04:36] <ogra> -r
[04:36] <mdz> elmo: we had that problem back with warty/hoary and I thought you fixed it
[04:37] <seb128> elmo: thanks
[04:37] <seb128> hey mdz 
[04:37] <elmo> mdz: I did
[04:38] <elmo> mdz: the script had a hardcoded 'warty' and I was only checking for 'hoary's when creating breezy
[04:38] <elmo> mdz: it's all good now
[04:38] <mdz> ah
[04:38] <seb128> mdz: bugzilla ignores my UNCONFIRMED to upstream changes without saying anything :/
[04:38] <elmo> (tho "fixed" is definitely needing scare quotes)
[04:38] <mdz> seb128: I saw in #canonical; I can't fix it, but maybe kiko can
[04:39] <|QuaD-> :)/join #canonical
[04:39] <seb128> mdz: k
[04:39] <seb128> mdz: kiko said he needs the patches
[04:41] <pitti> Keybuk: ah, I thought you did that manually, so I wanted to help you :-)
[04:41] <pitti> Keybuk: okay, then I can skip that in the future
[04:41] <pitti> Hi mdz 
[04:41] <mdz> morning
[04:41] <mdz> seb128: I will send him everything
[04:41] <Keybuk> pitti: nah, mom explicitly checks whether the merge-XXX alias is on a resolved bug, and if so, removes it
[04:42] <seb128> mdz: thanks
[04:42] <mdz> Keybuk: did you extend bugzilla.py for that?  I should merge your changes
[04:43] <Keybuk> yeah, I did a bunch of stuff to find aliases I think
[04:44] <Keybuk> there's a clear_alias function I added, at least
[04:49] <mdz> Kamion: that debbugs.py encoding crash is stalling debzilla; if it's not something obvious, let me know so that I can arrange for it to press on
[04:50] <seb128> elmo: orbit2 sync please
[04:51] <elmo> seb128: ugh
[04:51] <elmo>  [dpkg-source output:]  dpkg-source: error: file orbit2_2.12.1.orig.tar.gz has size 970445 instead of expected 961277
[04:51] <Kamion> mdz: ok, looking - I may only be able to fix that particular file for now, though
[04:52] <elmo> seb128: i.e. debian and ubuntu orig.tar.gz mismatch
[04:52] <Kamion> mdz: (I have a shouting child ten feet to my left, kind of impairs concentration)
[04:52] <seb128> elmo: hum, it that conflicting and need to be fixed now ? or can we cancel it ?
[04:53] <elmo> seb128: we can't override it, we'll have to either, upload same version as <foo>ubuntu<n> built with our orig.tar.gz, or upload debian's .tar.gz as a different version number :(
[04:54] <seb128> elmo: can we wait on the new version ? there is a new upstream, debian should have it soon
[04:54] <elmo> seb128: sure, if you want
[04:54] <seb128> k, let's do that
[04:54] <seb128> thanks
[04:56] <fabbione> re
[05:14] <mdz> thom: portmap mangles its /etc/default file on upgrades from hoary->breezy
[05:14] <fabbione> jbailey: any good news for me?
[05:15] <fabbione> mdz: ?
[05:15] <fabbione> i did that merge..
[05:15] <mdz> fabbione: thom wrote the postinst code though
[05:15] <mdz> I assume you just carried it over
[05:15] <fabbione> mdz: i had to change that too
[05:15] <mdz> oh
[05:15] <fabbione> the merge was messy
[05:15] <mdz> fabbione: on my system, I run an NFS server, so I had #ARGS...
[05:15] <fabbione> because of ARGS/OPTIONS and addition of debconf
[05:15] <mdz> it changed it to ARGS=
[05:16] <fabbione> mdz: hmmmm weird!
[05:16] <mdz> i.e., changed it to listen only on localhost
[05:16] <fabbione> i did test the upgrade locally
[05:16] <fabbione> commenting ARGS means listening to all ports
[05:16] <fabbione> ohhhh did you have more than localhost?
[05:17] <mdz> I have: ARGS="-i 127.0.0.1"
[05:17] <mdz> it changed it to: #ARGS="-i 127.0.0.1"
[05:17] <mdz> and then I got a conffile prompt from dpkg
[05:17] <fabbione> from what version did you upgrade?
[05:18] <jbailey> fabbione: Yes, found my thinko.  Shows up on ppc64 too.
[05:18] <mdz> Preparing to replace portmap 5-7ubuntu3 (using .../portmap_5-10ubuntu1_i386.deb) ...
[05:18] <fabbione> mdz: ok.. than the problem is the entire debconf management and the fact that the file is marked as conffile
[05:18] <mdz> elmo: my botched kubuntu-meta upload was rejected; I re-uploaded it with the proper target distribution and that one hasn't been accepted; do I need to bump the version?
[05:19] <fabbione> too messy :/
[05:19] <mdz> fabbione: two releases later and fam is still causing us pain :-(
[05:19] <Kamion> mdz: ok, I've fixed up that bug, but I don't really know how it got that way in the first place, so it's possible it will happen again
[05:19] <elmo> mdz: I don't see the second upload anywhere?
[05:19] <fabbione> mdz: ok.. i am going to do something drastic than...
[05:19] <mdz> -rw-rw----  1 mdz mdz 221 2005-04-15 08:01 ../kubuntu-meta_0.41_source.upload
[05:20] <fabbione> mdz: we will need to allign the stuff with Debian
[05:20] <mdz> f75081f315a37d8880aac94966dbd54f  ../kubuntu-meta_0.41_source.changes
[05:20] <mdz> Kamion: thanks
[05:20] <mdz> Kamion: I'll let you know, since debzilla mails me every 15 minutes when it happens
[05:20] <Kamion> mdz: I do at least know how to fix it up now
[05:21] <Kamion> sorry, hadn't realised it was blocking so much, I thought it was a one-time thing
[05:21] <elmo> mdz: sure, but it's not on jackass
[05:21] <elmo> did you send it to debian? :)
[05:23] <mdz> elmo: no...I'll reupload, I supposemizar:[/tmp/kubuntu-meta-0.41]  cat ../kubuntu-meta_0.41_source.upload
[05:23] <mdz> Successfully uploaded ../kubuntu-meta_0.41.dsc to upload.ubuntu.com.
[05:23] <mdz> Successfully uploaded ../kubuntu-meta_0.41.tar.gz to upload.ubuntu.com.
[05:23] <mdz> Successfully uploaded ../kubuntu-meta_0.41_source.changes to upload.ubuntu.com.
[05:24] <mdz> uploaded again, this time with FEELING
[05:25] <elmo> mdz: that worked
[05:26] <elmo> mdz: ah, ok, so here's what happened - you reuploaded before the first one had been rejected from queue/unchecked
[05:26] <mdz> ah.  I saw it complain in REPORT and assumed it was safe then
[05:27] <giskard> hi, there is a *-universe channel?
[05:27] <mdz> giskard: #ubuntu-motu
[05:27] <elmo> that was SKIP, which is entirely obsolete and pre-dates poppy.. I'll drop it down
[05:28] <giskard> mdz thanks
[05:34] <mdz> can anyone think of a reason why we shouldn't un-break that moronic module-init-tools damage where modprobe.conf supersedes modprobe.d?
[05:34] <mdz> it's constantly screwing people over
[05:36] <fabbione> mdz: i found at least 3 reasons why portmap screwed...
[05:36] <fabbione> fixing them right now...
[05:36] <zyga> is there any artwork # ?
[05:46] <GheRivero> res
[05:51] <daniels> seb128: wassup
[05:51] <guru3> is this like the smartest ubuntu ppl here? cause i have a really tough error :/
[05:53] <seb128> daniels: your new dbus doesn't build with the current pyrex, I've a patch from fedora for pyrex ... do you want me to upload it ? 
[05:53] <seb128> daniels: gcc4 build issue
[05:53] <daniels> seb128: 0.32??
[05:54] <seb128> daniels: yep
[05:54] <daniels> please don't upload 0.32
[05:54] <seb128> daniels: I don't, I'm speaking about pyrex
[05:54] <daniels> unless you want to rename the dbus-1 package to dbus, but keep the init script as dbus-1
[05:54] <daniels> oh, cool
[05:54] <daniels> yeah, uploading for pyrex would be great, thanks
[05:55] <seb128> daniels: I want 0.32 for gnomevfs's upstream, they are working to merge FC4 changes for hal 0.5 to gnomevfs
[05:55] <guru3> hmm, i guess i should just spit out the problem: the compileall.py script segfaults in the middle of dpkg :<
[05:55] <seb128> daniels: and since the guy use breezy, he was looking for dbus 0.32/hal 0.5 debs for that .. pitti pointed them to me :)
[05:55] <mdz> Keybuk: please stop filing merge bugs for universe packages
[05:56] <seb128> daniels: k
[05:56] <Keybuk> mdz: I can't
[05:56] <Keybuk> you'll have to wait
[05:56] <Keybuk> and be patient :)
[05:56] <mdz> ??
[05:57] <mdz> Keybuk: why can't you?
[05:57] <Keybuk> cause I can't get onto rookery to update the code right now
[05:59] <fabbione> jeeeee this postinst is SICK
[05:59] <Keybuk> Mark's network abhors ssh connections
[05:59] <Keybuk> at least, from my house
[06:00] <Keybuk> I'm mid-sync so when my ssh keys arrive, will be able to
[06:04] <fabbione> mdz: portmap will take a while.. postinst is totally insane
[06:10] <elmo> ouch hoary source + powerpc is 21Gb
[06:18] <daniels> seb128: heh.  i need to catch up for pitti when we're in the same $tz; when do you guys fly out of europe?
[06:19] <seb128> daniels: we flight from .de tomorrow evening UTC
[06:20] <mdz> a good rule of thumb: if you don't know how to modify sources.list, you probably shouldn't be running breezy right now
[06:25] <seb128> you say that for me ? :p
[06:25] <mdz> seb128: no, just reading ubuntu-users
[06:26] <Mithrandir> mdz: but it's NEW and SHINY crack!!oneone.
[06:26] <seb128> people don't abuse the list with bugs todays ? We don't do enough changes apparently :p
[06:27] <mdz> Mithrandir: yeah, everyone is like "I heard breezy has this and that feature, where are they?"
[06:27] <mdz> where is the splash screen?
[06:28] <Mithrandir> mdz: it'll FLY!
[06:28] <jnc> the racing stripes?
[06:28] <Mithrandir> mdz: yeah, we've just been hiding all those features in another repo while we were developing hoary.
[06:28] <Mithrandir> or something
[06:28] <Simira> mdz: yes, where is it? And when can I download the release candidate?
[06:28] <Mithrandir> Simira: in about five months.
[06:28] <Mithrandir> :)
[06:29] <ogra> did i hear breezy-backports ?
[06:29] <Simira> Mithrandir: hey, you go shopping, don't interfere with my conversations!
[06:29] <\sh> morning ogra
[06:30] <ogra> heh
[06:30] <fabbione> HUMPF
[06:31] <Simira> fabbione: always tell someone where you are going
[06:31] <fabbione> ok problem:
[06:31] <fabbione> package foo uses debconf to handle a conffile
[06:31] <Simira> fabbione: don't forget your wedding anniversary
[06:31] <fabbione> at the same time the maintainer marked the file as such
[06:32] <fabbione> creating a royal mess with dpkg
[06:32] <fabbione> because one tends to modify the other rants that has been modified
[06:32] <fabbione> killing debconf seems like a good idea
[06:32] <fabbione> keeping debconf means implementing a lot of logic behind
[06:32] <mdz> pitti fixed a number of such problems in hoary, iirc
[06:33] <ogra> why does it modify it anyway  ? if it was modified, dont touch it...else, overwrite it...
[06:33] <fabbione> because the template has a meaning that doesn't match what postinst is supposed to do properly
[06:33] <fabbione> ogra: it was a mistake from the original maintainer :(
[06:33] <ogra> hmm
[06:33] <fabbione> it's like a loop that needs to be broken
[06:34] <mdz> Mithrandir: how much work would oo.o2-amd64 be?
[06:34] <Mithrandir> mdz: not too much, but it's not stable ATM, AIUI.
[06:34] <fabbione> so anybody wants to suggest the solution?
[06:35] <elmo> *whine*
[06:35] <elmo> I thouht oo.o2 was meant to be all singing all 64-bit dancing?
[06:36] <mdz> elmo: it is meant to be, but in the event that it does not actually become so, we need a fallback
[06:39] <Mithrandir> elmo: yeah, supposed to be, but Not There Yet, or so it seems.
[06:45] <astharot> ciao
[06:52] <fabbione> mdz: when you wrote the portmap patch for -i, did you make it so that it can resolve hostnames?
[07:14] <elmo> udu wiki's going down for a reboot
[07:25] <Simira> fabbione: already in .au?
[07:25] <Simira> :p
[07:25] <ogra> heh
[07:25] <eruin> anyone here used the rhythbox branch olemke@core-dump.info--2005 ?
[07:28] <trulux> wokka wokka
[07:28] <trulux> some toolchain work:
[07:29] <trulux> http://pearls.tuxedo-es.org/toolchain/textrel_hoary_20050415.log
[07:29] <trulux> http://pearls.tuxedo-es.org/toolchain/rwx_mappings_hoary_20050415.log
[07:30] <fabbione> Simira: eheh no
[07:30] <fabbione> mdz: http://people.ubuntu.com/~fabbione/portmap_5-10ubuntu2_i386.deb
[07:30] <fabbione> mdz: mind to test it on your machine?
[07:30] <fabbione> it seems to work fine here
[07:30] <aj> hockey!
[07:31] <mvo> aj: yeah!
[07:33] <ogra> aj, let mvo teach you at UdU ;)
[07:33] <aj> ogra: i've looked at the schedule... when?? :)
[07:33] <fabbione> aj: at night :)
[07:33] <Mithrandir> between the mao sessions.
[07:33] <ogra> heh, true, sice we all have to hold four BOFs this time
[07:33] <fabbione> ogra: are you coming to UdD?
[07:33] <aj> fabbione: but... but... the drinking...?
[07:33] <fabbione> aj: that too :P
[07:34] <Mithrandir> aj: between drinking, mao and drinking.
[07:34] <ogra> fabbione, i wouldnt let you smoke alone dude ;)
[07:34] <fabbione> ogra: aha rocking!
[07:34] <ogra> yeah
[07:35] <fabbione> heck it's breezy.. if i can't break it hard... who else can
[07:35] <ogra> fabbione, go go go !!
[07:37] <fabbione> done
[07:38] <ogra> :)
[07:38] <ogra> lets see if my NFS still works after UdU :)
[07:38] <fabbione> ogra: ehehhe
[07:39] <fabbione> i think it's time to play with AOE and GFS
[07:39] <fabbione> i didn't work the last 3 days for nothing :)
[07:41] <fabbione> it's almost dinner time :)
[07:42] <trulux> fabbione: same here, but now I'm back to work, I'm still not a Jedi in Knights of the Old Republic (Kotor) :)
[07:48] <fabbione> jbailey: glibc passed that point...
[07:48] <fabbione> jbailey: still building tho
[07:58] <jbailey> fabbione: Nice!
[07:59] <fabbione> yeps
[08:00] <jbailey> fabbione: We just need to inflict NPTL love on you after. =)
[08:00] <fabbione> if everything goes ok, i can open the gates for sparc :)
[08:00] <jbailey> Cool.
[08:00] <fabbione> jbailey: let me finish to compile these glibc
[08:00] <jbailey> I wonder how lamont's doing?
[08:00] <fabbione> jbailey: he is stocked at gcc-4 :(
[08:01] <fabbione> and doko is on the air
[08:01] <fabbione> jbailey: once i start building breezy, you can freely use the chroot to build the new glibc
[08:02] <fabbione> HMMMM
[08:02] <fabbione> something is changed...
[08:02] <fabbione> jbailey: do you know if the new libc6 respects the ipv6 RFC
[08:03] <fabbione> ?
[08:03] <fabbione> it appears that all the new connections (ssh at least) start first in ipv4
[08:03] <fabbione> according to RFC it should always attempt ipv6 first and fallback to ipv4
[08:05] <jbailey> Hmm, I thought it did.  I know that ipv6 generally works right for me.
[08:06] <fabbione> it is 99.9% the new libc6
[08:06] <fabbione> i will need to try after a reboot
[08:06] <fabbione> but same ssh version on 2 different machines hoary/breezy
[08:06] <fabbione> hoary works as expected
[08:06] <fabbione> breezy no
[08:06] <jbailey> Joy.
[08:06] <jbailey> ;)
[08:07] <jbailey> Best bet is to stuff that into bugzilla, my friend.  I'm not setup to troubleshoot that right at the moment ( have a completely differnet set of windows open )
[08:07] <fabbione> jbailey: the change is easy to isolate if it is what i think'
[08:07] <fabbione> jbailey: i am :)
[08:07] <fabbione> jbailey: i did it once already
[08:07] <fabbione> they might have reverted the changes to the resolver
[08:08] <fabbione> in that case it is enough to reorder it
[08:22] <fabbione> Kamion: ping?
[08:27] <jcole> hey dudes
[08:28] <jcole> how can i do a net install of ubuntu (minimal disk size)
[08:34] <jcole> for debian, we currently use the business card iso and insert a preseed file into it
[08:35] <jcole> ubuntu is pretty much seeded already, i'm just looking for a minimally configured ubuntu where i can insert preseed info such as proxy and packages to install... just like we do with debian
[08:41] <jcole> should i just remaster the install cd?
[08:42] <jcole> the silence ;) makes me think that net install of ubuntu is not possible (yet)
[08:44] <mdke> jcole, i don't think there is a minimal install cd
[08:44] <mdke> you can do a minimal installation from the normal cd
[08:46] <jcole> mdke: ya, we provide install isos for the employees here for different distros (suse,rh/fedora,debian,etc)... we try to make these install isos as small ass possible (sometimes to even fit on a floppy) and net install the rest
[08:46] <mdke> jcole, i saw a doc that might help you
[08:46] <mdke> jcole, hang on
[08:47] <jcole> mdke: cool
[08:47] <mdke> i have to turn on my laptop to get the email tho so i'll be a minute
[08:50] <mdke> jcole, http://marc.herbert.free.fr/linux/win2linstall.html <-- might not be exactly what you want but it might help, and it has a section on Ubuntu
[09:17] <hawke_> Is there a page, similar to Debian's packages.qa.debian.org that describes why newer versions of stuff isn't in Ubuntu?
[09:18] <jvw> hawke_: ubuntu doesn't have testing, and afaik no automated propagation from any repository... so there aren't such reasons except 'nobody has done so (yet)' ?
[09:19] <hawke_> jvw: Ah, I thought universe was automatically importing from Debian.  Thanks
[09:19] <ogra> hawke_, there is not much to describe, we pull the newes SW from debian at the begin of each development process...this gets updated util freeze....afterwards there are only bugfixes until release....then it starts all over again...
[09:19] <ogra> s/newes/newest
[09:26] <\sh> guys, kdebindings is not in the trees, but http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/k/kdebindings/4:3.4.0-0ubuntu1/kdebindings_4:3.4.0-0ubuntu1_20050329-1309-i386-successful
[09:26] <\sh> for hoary
[09:27] <\sh> how was it..who ate it? ,-)
[09:27] <\sh> because it's on the mirrors: http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/k/kdebindings/
[09:30] <ogra> \sh,  apt-cache showsrc kdebindings
[09:31] <ogra> Binary: libkjsembed-dev, libsmokekde-dev, libkjsembed1, libsmokeqt-dev, kjscmd, libsmokekde1, python-dcop, libsmokeqt1
[09:31] <ogra> its all there
[09:31] <\sh> argl
[09:31] <\sh> yeah
[09:32] <\sh> ogra: ok...red card for amu and myself ;)
[09:33] <ogra> \sh, nooo, only a bit for getting the hint from a gnome guy probably ;)
[09:33] <\sh> ogra: I love u too :)
[09:33] <ogra> heh
[09:33] <\sh> ogra: prost :)
[09:41] <Mithrandir> hm
[09:42] <ogra> ?
[09:43] <Mithrandir> #-motu :)
[09:43] <Mithrandir> since it's a universe package
[10:12] <dilinger> thom: ping
[11:48] <Mitario> hi everyone
[11:58] <tseng> hm sounds like inotify gamin beagle might all work for breezy
[11:58] <tseng> rock on.
[11:59] <mjc> tseng, be nice, I'm fighting with mono on amd64 currently =P
[11:59] <mjc> er, it would be nice
[11:59] <tseng> are you familiar with svn
[11:59] <mjc> yep
[12:00] <tseng> dpkg-buildpkg?
[12:00] <tseng> http://pkg-mono.alioth.debian.org/
[12:00] <mjc> seen that
[12:00] <tseng> 1.1 testing stuff is up there
[12:00] <tseng> you can try grabbing it and building if youd like.
[12:00] <mjc> been failing