[12:15] <thom> Robot101: just *after* lca
[12:15] <thom> dilinger: still awake?
[12:17] <dilinger> yea
[12:17] <dilinger> thom: modperl2?
[12:18] <thom> yeah; although off topic for here really :-) you're on #d-d on oftc, right?
[12:18] <dilinger> yep
[01:34] <astharot> guys
[01:34] <astharot> but where's pitti?
[01:42] <pitti> Morning
[01:43] <ogra> hi pitti
[01:44] <amu> moin 2
[01:46] <ogra> pitti, amu, where do i find the room schedule for the hotel ?
[01:46] <ogra> hmm
[01:51] <dholbach> hey
[01:55] <zyga> pitti: morning :-)
[01:55] <pitti> Hey zyga 
[01:56] <zyga> just curious, do you live in .au?
[01:57] <pitti> zyga: right now, yes :-)
[02:06] <pitti> yay
[02:06] <dholbach> hey pitti 
[02:06] <pitti> ppc sleep with DRI
[02:06] <mjg59> pitti: Yeah, I'm speaking to benh about it
[02:07] <zyga> darn you guys
[02:07] <pitti> mjg59: I tried the "AGPMode" "4" option
[02:07] <zyga> you're just mocking us, poor i386 people ;-)
[02:07] <astharot> oll
[02:07] <schweeb> "poor i386 people"?
[02:07] <schweeb> I'm pretty happy with the x86 platform
[02:07] <dholbach> hey schweeb 
[02:08] <schweeb> hiya
[02:08] <mjg59> zyga: Hey, sleep with DRI works fine on a lot of x86
[02:08] <astharot> yesterday at a linux meeting
[02:08] <astharot> I saw ubuntu installed on an iBook :P
[02:08] <astharot> the guy told me that something misses :P
[02:09] <pitti> astharot: apart from the crappy softmodem, everything works for me now
[02:09] <infinity> dilinger : Yes.
[02:09] <astharot> pitti: airport too?
[02:09] <pitti> oh, VGA out doesn't
[02:09] <zyga> pitti: ibook?
[02:09] <pitti> astharot: no, airport doesn't work, but I don't have an airport card; I use an USB WLAN adapter
[02:09] <astharot> oh ok
[02:12] <zul> hola
[02:16] <pitti> Hey zul
[02:16] <pitti> daniels: ping
[02:16] <zul> hey pitti how is it going?
[02:16] <pitti> fine, enjoying my Sydney holiday
[02:16] <zul> cool
[02:17] <zyga> pitti: grab me a pack of farscape dvds ;-)
[02:17] <dholbach> hellas zul
[02:18] <zul> hey dholbach 
[02:20] <Keybuk> Kamion: ping?
[02:22] <AndyFitz> quiet here as well
[02:23] <ogra> dholbach, how is the wlan behaving ?
[02:23] <pitti> schlooow
[02:23] <seb128> schnell
[02:25] <Kamion> Keybuk: yeah?
[02:25] <Keybuk> Kamion: what happened to the poster thing?
[02:27] <Kamion> Keybuk: oh, it's in my room, drat
[02:27] <Kamion> Keybuk: will fetch it at lunchtime
[02:29] <Keybuk> ok, fair enough -- today seems a good day to get people to sign it
[02:32] <Kamion> yep
[02:35] <infinity> Keybuk : Hey, is MOM smart enough to track package renames (like mozilla-firefox -> firefox) and one-to-many source package relations (php4 in Debian -> php4/php4-universe in Ubuntu)?
[02:35] <infinity> Keybuk : Assuming one informs it of said renames, of course (ie: Is there a package relation override or something?)
[02:38] <dholbach> ogra: slow
[02:38] <ogra> dholbach, but not glowing anymore ?
[02:40] <mike_douglas> I heard that %post runs after the base install but before the desktop install. Is there a way to get it to run after everything is finished installing?
[02:41] <Keybuk> infinity: no, it explicitly cannot handle that
[02:41] <Keybuk> neither can lorraine (the sync script)
[02:41] <Keybuk> so we've just blacklisted mozilla-firefox
[02:41] <Keybuk> (otherwise we'd stupidly sync it over-top of our firefox packages)
[02:43] <Kamion> mike_douglas: no - preseed base-config/late_command instead
[02:46] <infinity> Keybuk : Dang.  Oh well. :)
[02:48] <ogra> is mdz around ?
[02:54] <dholbach> ogra: no... have a longer usb cable now
[02:55] <dholbach> ogra: but my OOo is broken *grrrrr* have to paint my slides by hand or something
[02:55] <pitti> "Use latex-beamer, Luke"
[02:55] <pitti> (SCNR)
[02:56] <bluefoxicy> pitti:  latex offers better protection than rubber
[03:03] <zyga> bluefoxicy: hi
[03:04] <bluefoxicy> hi
[03:04] <zyga> bluefoxicy: any progress?
[03:05] <bluefoxicy> nope, been busy with work
[03:05] <squinn> From a Gentoo user, thanks.
[03:05] <squinn> I'm coming back to Ubuntu and I'm glad you guys make such an awesome distribution.
[03:05] <tsume> has anyone made a patch for wget yet?
[03:05] <zyga> bluefoxicy: I plan on writing proof of concept code tommorow
[03:05] <squinn> And the best April Fools' bootsplash I've ever seen. :)
[03:06] <bluefoxicy> zyga:  any stats on used vs allocated and (allocated-used)/allocated == %wasted
[03:06] <bluefoxicy> in typical long (4-5 hour) runs of i.e. firefox, thunderbird?
[03:06] <zyga> bluefoxicy: and sorry for saying, malloc code is really big ;>
[03:06] <bluefoxicy> I know
[03:06] <bluefoxicy> :)
[03:06] <zyga> bluefoxicy: not yet unfortunatly
[03:07] <zyga> bluefoxicy: I still do not quite understand what fails in my example stats gather code
[03:07] <zyga> bluefoxicy: I plan to write trivial allocator that uses memory better (in a worst case scenaro) than malloc does currently
[03:07] <dholbach> bye guys
[03:08] <zyga> (worst case for malloc ;-)
[03:08] <bluefoxicy> yeah
[03:08] <bluefoxicy> i'm working that way
[03:08] <infinity> tsume : What sort of patch?
[03:08] <zyga> bluefoxicy: would you like to have a look at my code
[03:08] <tsume_> infinity: oh, well I guess its fixed already
[03:08] <bluefoxicy> nah
[03:08] <bluefoxicy> i code on my own
[03:08] <zyga> bluefoxicy: I still have no clue why it works on test programs and fails on stuff like ls
[03:09] <tsume_> infinity: I seen the version for wget. I usually use curl because its better.
[03:10] <tsume_> and for the reason I like how the haxx.se site talks about the GPL :P
[03:10] <tsume_> infinity: http://marc.theaimsgroup.com/?l=bugtraq&m=110269474112384
[03:10] <tsume_> infinity: I also dislike wget because it suffers from ignorant developers ;)
[03:11] <zyga> tsume_: ignorant developers?
[03:11] <daniels> pitti: pong
[03:12] <tsume_> zyga: from the developer's mouth
[03:12] <tsume_> zyga: he admits he doesn't update the code
[03:12] <tsume_> zyga: wget really should be taken out if the dev is going to half way abandon the project
[03:12] <tsume_> zyga: curl power ;)
[03:13] <tsume_> I don't want it in base(and usually don't) when there are ignorant developers involved
[03:14] <pitti> daniels: uh, just going now... dbus really rocks now, just needs to not restart hal if upgrading from 0.23...
[03:14] <Kamion> wget> first look at its reverse-depends
[03:14] <zyga> tsume_: wget has brand recognition
[03:14] <daniels> pitti: mmm
[03:14] <zyga> tsume_: I'm a developer and I've never heard of curl :>
[03:14] <daniels> i'm on holiday this week :)
[03:14] <tsume_> Kamion: ignoring depends, and symlinking wget to curl
[03:14] <zyga> tsume_: is it possible to have a wget wrapper around curl if it's technically superrior?
[03:14] <tsume_> zyga: I first heard of curl by libwww
[03:14] <Kamion> tsume_: ignoring depends gets you into PAIN; you should create a dummy package instead if you want to go that way
[03:14] <tsume_> hmmm
[03:14] <tsume_> zyga: very good question
[03:15] <tsume_> zyga: I don't see the harm of wrapping the program sn libwget libs(if any) to curl
[03:15] <zyga> tsume_: :-)
[03:15] <tsume_> Kamion: good thinking. I'll create a dummy package
[03:15] <zyga> tsume_: now you see the real world issue ;-)
[03:15] <pitti> bye
[03:15] <pitti> bye
[03:16] <tsume_> zyga: I'm a security mon :) I can't stand a program when I _know_ theres bad/unmaintained code.
[03:16] <zyga> tsume_: I'm a lazy person, I use it until it breaks
[03:16] <zyga> ;-)
[03:17] <tsume_> zyga: hehe. even a car? :P
[03:17] <zyga> tsume_: nah, I don't use those
[03:17] <tsume_> zyga: I bet you drive a plymoth reliant ;)(nerd car)
[03:17] <zyga> tsume_: they are using obsolete technology, I'm still waiting for cold fusion
[03:19] <Kamion> 02:19 < CIA-2> debian-installer: cjwatson * r26922 packages/cdebconf/ (debian/changelog src/cdebconf.conf-dist.in):
[03:19] <Kamion> 02:19 < CIA-2> debian-installer: Add config instances for the standard debconf databases in /target, so that
[03:19] <Kamion> 02:19 < CIA-2> debian-installer: we can do 'debconf-copydb -p foo/bar configdb target_configdb' once the base
[03:19] <infinity> tsume_ : Well, the worst of those bugs is the non-cleansing of chars output to the terminal.
[03:19] <Kamion> 02:19 < CIA-2> debian-installer: system is installed.
[03:19] <Kamion> mdz-lca: ^-- cdebconf 0.76 will have that
[03:20] <infinity> tsume_ : Given that someone who can SEE they're downloading .bashrc should expect it to break, I don't much care that it lets you do that, but if you can hide that from the user, then two two together are bad.
[03:20] <Kamion> infinity: I was never convinced that was a bug in the first place
[03:20] <infinity> tsume_ : Patching that one bug shouldn't be that painful.
[03:20] <infinity> Kamion : Which?  The control chars bug?
[03:20] <Kamion> infinity: yeah
[03:20] <mdz-lca> Kamion: yay!
[03:21] <infinity> Kamion : Not a bug as in "can't reproduce it", or "you don't think it should cleanse terminal output"?
[03:21] <Kamion> infinity: the latter
[03:21] <Kamion> infinity: well, that's too strong
[03:21] <infinity> I dunno.  Allowing an HTTP response to overwrite your terminal and hide what it it you're downloading is a bit iffy.
[03:21] <infinity> s/it it/it is/
[03:21] <Kamion> infinity: but "you shouldn't download a random file from the net to stdout unless you have some clue what it is"
[03:22] <Kamion> it really always felt like a "don't do that, then"
[03:22] <infinity> Oh, is it just when using -O?
[03:22] <infinity> From reading the bug, I assumed it was HTTP responses being able to cleverly overwrite the status line (by delivering goofy filenames, for instance)
[03:23] <Kamion> ah, perhaps I misunderstood
[03:23] <infinity> If it's just when writing to stdout, then I'm with you on the DDTT.
[03:23] <Kamion> I agree that that would be a bug
[03:23] <Kamion> #261755 looks like HTTP responses, certainly
[03:24] <infinity> Of course, with all these expoilts in HTTP clients, I'm always left wondering "where the heck are people browsing and downloading from that they have to worry about malicious web servers?", but.... Whatever. :)
[03:25] <infinity> Kamion : Kay, and bad HTTp responses being able to overwrite status lines, combined with the fact that you can wget pretty much any file (that you don't already have) spells trouble.
[03:26] <infinity> Kamion : I read your wget user agent banner, determine that as a Debian/Ubuntu user, you probably don't have a .profile (for instance), send you a .profile, but update your screen so you think you're downloading foo.tar.gz.
[03:30] <Kamion> infinity: mm, fair enough, yeah
[03:33] <jalrnc> hello, is anyone experiencing problems with the ubuntu wiki? I'm not able to save pages after editing... preview works fine though.
[03:34] <infinity> Also, is anyone working on the evolution mess?
[03:34] <infinity> We have evolution-data-server 1.2.2 in main (which needs to be rebuilt to pull in proper deps, looks like) and evolution-data-server1.2 1.2.2 in universe which should most likely be dropped completely.
[03:34] <infinity> At least, that's what I got out of 5 minutes of looking into it.
[03:35] <tseng> its an unexpected sync from sid
[03:35] <tseng> it will be fixed when seb returns, I imagine
[03:36] <tsume_> question, can the OSS community trust Novell?
[03:37] <tseng> "the oss community" is a group of informed individuals, decide for yourself
[03:37] <tseng> but thats way OT
[03:37] <tsume_> tseng: its on topic, its a question to ask if anyone can trust Novell taking over linux and open source projects
[03:38] <tseng> no, its not
[03:38] <tseng> and i have yet to see novell "take" over linux or any oss projects
[03:38] <infinity> tsume_ : This is a development channel, not a philosophy channel.
[03:38] <tseng> I have seen them open source their own code
[03:38] <tsume_> tseng: they took over suse... :(
[03:38] <tseng> suse still operates largely as it has in the past
[03:38] <tsume_> tseng: yes, but because they were the ones behind netware.. it scares me
[03:38] <tseng> anyway, go do your homework
[03:39] <tseng> I dont want to argue with misinformation
[03:55] <robertj> btw, speaking of netware, does Linux support 64 bit uids?
[03:56] <Lathiat> yeh in recent kernels iirc
[04:45] <tsume_> curl is _so_ much nicer than wget
[04:45] <tsume_> even the downloading status us more specific
[04:48] <Kosai> Except for having to redirect the output.
[04:48] <tsume_> Kosai: someone gave me the idea to wrap wget
[04:48] <tsume_> Kosai: redirecting is no big deal;
[04:49] <tsume_> Kosai: if you wish to add an easier user functionality.. you can simply make a very small patch
[04:49] <tsume_> I'm sure it would take only about 20 to 50 lines ;) maybe less
[04:49] <tsume_> Kosai: curl is well maintained, wget is not.
[04:50] <tsume_> libcurl is great, though I didn't know about curl until libwww died :)
[04:50] <tsume_> which was a long time ago.
[04:50] <Kosai> is wget actively abandoned?  'cause, well, tar(1) isn't well-maintained either.  :)
[04:51] <tsume_> Kosai: don't fix software which is fine already ;)
[04:51] <tsume_> wget is flawed in all ways, the guy doesn't keep the HTTP client part of the program secure
[04:52] <tsume_> s/all/many/
[04:52] <tsume_> it tells me he doesn't know what hes doing.
[04:52] <tsume_> neither does the Dickey fellow, ncurses is a mess.
[04:53] <tsume_> it was very disturbing the changes made between 5.2 and 5.4
[05:07] <zul> night
[05:30] <bluefoxicy> my allocator is almost done, it's 488 lines so far
[05:30] <bluefoxicy> i'll probably log a thousand
[05:30] <bluefoxicy> if that
[06:08] <fabbione> morning
[06:27] <fabbione> elmo: thanks for the NEW and sync love :)
[06:28] <Lathiat> has the fontconfig problem been fixed?
[06:29] <daniels> yes
[06:29] <fabbione> elmo: can you please give me a sparc pulse if you can? thanks
[06:29] <Lathiat> cool
[06:29] <fabbione> hey daniels
[06:30] <daniels> hey fabbione, sup?
[06:30] <fabbione> daniels: packaging the rh cluster suite
[06:30] <fabbione> daniels: nothing extremely exciting :)
[06:30] <elmo>  fabbione done
[06:30] <daniels> fabbione: WHOOHOO
[06:31] <fabbione> elmo: thanks a lot
[06:34] <daniels> 3
[06:35] <Lathiat> 6
[08:22] <mdz-lca> daniels: LOOK UP
[08:23] <daniels> mdz-lca: I AM
[08:23] <daniels> i even made ludicrous hand gestures in your direction
[08:27] <fabbione> hey mdz-lca 
[08:29] <jsgotangco> hmm nice ubuntu review on linuxjournal
[08:30] <fabbione> jsgotangco: url?
[08:30] <jsgotangco> http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/8253
[08:31] <jsgotangco>  <quote>"I anticipate that Ubuntu will become the mainstream Linux distribution globally. As the saying goes, though, only time will tell. However, if you do your due diligence on the company, the sponsor, the spirit of innovation and success of the Ubuntu people, you probably will come to the same conclusion."
[08:34] <jsgotangco> "Ubuntu's sponsor, Canonical Ltd., has the necessary funding and a history of succeeding quickly and efficiently."
[08:36] <HrdwrBoB> haha history
[08:38] <jsgotangco> history doh...
[08:39] <jsgotangco> can't equate Thawte success with Ubuntu
[08:42] <mdz-lca> fabbione: hey
[08:42] <fabbione> mdz-lca:  rhcluster_0.20050419-0ubuntu1_i386.deb <- the real take over :P
[08:43] <fabbione> mdz-lca: how is going on the other side of the world?
[08:43] <dieman> yikes
[08:45] <mdz-lca> fabbione: what is rhcluster?
[08:45] <mdz-lca> fabbione: it's ok; I'm a bit light-headed from being upside down
[08:45] <fabbione> mdz-lca: http://sources.redhat.com/cluster/
[08:45] <fabbione> mdz-lca: ehhee
[08:45] <dieman> now you just have to include gfs somewhere :)
[08:46] <fabbione> mdz-lca: is it difficult to walk on the bare hands?
[08:46] <dieman> oh, does that include gfs stuff? :)
[08:46] <fabbione> dieman: it's already in the kernel
[08:46] <dieman> (looking at the website)
[08:46] <dieman> rock
[08:46] <fabbione> dieman: yes
[08:46] <dieman> now there 0 excuses to run redhat. :)
[08:46] <dieman> are, rather.
[08:46] <fabbione> dieman: they applied happily a few patches i did send back
[08:46] <dieman> rock.
[08:47] <fabbione> now they started to be more silence to my patches...
[08:47] <dieman> (redhat is not evil, but its fun to poke fun.)
[08:47] <fabbione> probably they realized how crappy is some of their stuff :)
[08:47] <dieman> well.
[08:47] <dieman> uh.
[08:47] <dieman> gfs came from down the hall.
[08:47] <dieman> so like, when you get a ton of grad students in a room, in a basement...
[08:47] <fabbione> or they don't like that i post them as @ubuntu.com :P
[08:48] <dieman> allthough, i guess gfs has been rewritten a bit since it was housed in our building :)
[08:48] <dieman> or so im told
[08:48] <fabbione> dieman: ehehe
[08:48] <dieman> it *is* funny that they came back to a decent license full circle
[08:49] <cartman> lamont: had a chance to look  at https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=9892 ?
[08:51] <fabbione> cartman: make sense...
[08:51] <cartman> fabbione: yup, unless you compile rtc support as non-module
[08:52] <fabbione> cartman: nah.. we can fix that :)
[08:52] <dieman> at least the i915 stuff seems to work with its rtc now
[08:52] <cartman> yeah I know just change S<foo> level :)
[08:52] <dieman> i think
[08:52] <dieman> warty didn't like them.
[08:52] <cartman> is there an ubuntu amd64 channel?
[08:52] <fabbione> breezy is going to rock very hard
[08:52] <dieman> i'm pretty sure hoary was happy with it.
[08:53] <dieman> I need to setup fai for hoary now that its out
[08:53] <dieman> and im uh, deploying it sort of.
[08:53] <cartman> breezy is something like a biiiig step :)
[08:53] <dieman> (i've been dist-upgrading machines)
[08:54] <dieman> only 35 ubuntu machines so far.
[08:55] <dieman> 267 woody machines, but 109 of those are lab machines, those will get converted this summer.
[08:55] <dieman> anyhow, this is probally better fodder for the users channel.
[08:56] <cartman> uhm using a 40-pin ide cable for my hard disk is not a good idea it seems
[08:56] <cartman> now that I saw http://www.mail-archive.com/linux-kernel%40vger.kernel.org/msg72852.html
[08:56] <cartman> :)
[08:57] <dieman> heh
[08:57] <dieman> i've seen that happen with scsi
[08:58] <cartman> dieman: well mobo box had one ide cable and I have 3 ide devices
[08:58] <dieman> when someone crimps a LVD cable inside a case
[08:58] <dieman> heh
[08:58] <cartman> LVD cable?
[08:58] <cartman> whats that
[08:58] <dieman> took me *45* minutes to convince the dell guy to send me a new one
[08:58] <cartman> haha :)
[08:58] <dieman> scsi, 50 pin HD I think.
[08:58] <dieman> much more metal than a ide cable
[08:58] <dieman> you can shake the things and they recoil a little like springs.
[08:58] <cartman> well tech guy say come and we will give you one more cable :)
[08:59] <dieman> he made me read off every bios entry
[08:59] <cartman> dieman: lol
[08:59] <dieman> thank god we have warranty parts direct now, we just order them online :)
[08:59] <dieman> thats the incident that made me sign work up for it
[08:59] <fabbione> elmo: are you still around?
[08:59] <cartman> brb checking mobo manual
[09:00] <cartman> hum 80-conductor ide cable means 80-pin?
[09:01] <fabbione> yeps
[09:01] <fabbione> no
[09:01] <cartman> errr
[09:01] <fabbione> 40 pins with 80 cables
[09:01] <fabbione> it's the weirdness about ide :)
[09:02] <cartman> yeah because it says 40-1 pin primary ide
[09:02] <cartman> and 80-conductor
[09:02] <cartman> Sata is way easier :)
[09:02] <cartman> and way expensive
[09:05] <cartman> http://www.pcconnection.com/ProductDetail?sku=196894&SourceID=k22350
[09:05] <dieman> whowa, xen is going to be part of the kernel?
[09:05] <cartman> seems to be that
[09:05] <cartman> dieman: yeah
[09:05] <dieman> cartman: i finally broke down and bought a sata controller
[09:06] <dieman> and i acquired a drive.
[09:06] <cartman> dieman: Sata drivers are not cheap :/
[09:06] <dieman> i'm pretty happy with the drive
[09:06] <dieman> so far
[09:06] <cartman> well you should be :)
[09:06] <dieman> more disk space just means more to back up
[09:07] <infinity> My drive was 5 dollars cheaper than the PATA equivalent, sometimes I've seen a 10 dollar premium, but I've never noticed a huge disparity.
[09:07] <thom> sata was far cheaper for me
[09:08] <dieman> "Pratt said the Xen team is working with InfiniBand vendors to ensure that InfiniBand channels can be extended into guest operating systems running over Xen in an efficient yet fully protected manner."
[09:08] <dieman> that is *creepy*
[09:08] <dieman> wait for the virtual inifiband channels, too.
[09:08] <dieman> (or just guessing)
[09:08] <cartman> well ide drives are far more cheaper than sata
[09:17] <elmo> fabbione: ?
[09:18] <fabbione> elmo: i think there is something wrong with the Packages generation. for some reasons on sparc/breezy diff isn't there....
[09:19] <fabbione> elmo: but there is the binary for it...
[09:46] <sivang> Morning folks!
[09:51] <sivang> Hmm, a sleepy sunday morning I guess
[09:53] <cartman> its wednesday
[10:00] <sivang> cartman: hrm, need to sync my time server..
[10:01] <cartman> sivang: yeah ;)
[10:07] <fabbione> hey pitti
[10:07] <pitti> Hi guys
[10:25] <\sh> hey ogra
[10:29] <ogra> \sh, have you read heise today ???
[10:29] <ogra> :-D
[10:29] <\sh> hp laptop with ubuntu?
[10:29] <\sh> check my linux.blogweb.de I was writing it yesterday :)
[10:30] <ogra> \sh, i cant, the line is to slow....
[10:30] <\sh> but give me a hint where i can find grubconf...I accepted a bug, and the package is not there
[10:30] <\sh> ogra: but it's nice
[10:30] <ogra> gah, that crap should get dropped...
[10:30] <\sh> ok...then its dropped ;) it's not in the package tree I searched everything
[10:31] <\sh> i will write this
[10:31] <\sh> ogra: and the katholic chearch has a new pope ;)
[10:33] <ogra> yep, i heard it.... but it doesnt even come near the HP news :)
[10:33] <dholbach> hey
[10:33] <ogra> hey
[10:33] <\sh> ogra: hehe...well, the pope is a german guy...but u r right, ubuntu on hp (smiling at my laptop here ;)) is a nice news :)
[10:37] <Diablo-D3> hey all
[10:37] <Diablo-D3> I'm trying to get a straight answer out of someone
[10:38] <Diablo-D3> does breezy work?
[10:38] <fabbione> Diablo-D3: it is highly unstable atm
[10:38] <thom> if you need to ask, you don't want to run it
[10:38] <fabbione> if you love your system to work, stay on hoary
[10:39] <Diablo-D3> I'm not on hoary to begin with, fabbione 
[10:39] <Diablo-D3> I'm on debian sid
[10:39] <Diablo-D3> and I want to convert to ubuntu
[10:39] <Burgundavia> breezy is mostly debian sid right now, with a few hoary patches rolled in
[10:39] <fabbione> Diablo-D3: than switch to hoary
[10:39] <Diablo-D3> ahh, so to breezy it is
[10:40] <Diablo-D3> er, or not?
[10:40] <cartman> Burgundavia: whoa sid will switch to gcc 4.0 too?
[10:40] <fabbione> Diablo-D3: stay with hoary
[10:40] <cartman> Diablo-D3: install hoary
[10:40] <fabbione> breezy development started a week or so ago
[10:40] <fabbione> and it is too immature if you need a usable system
[10:40] <Diablo-D3> hoary it is
[10:40] <Burgundavia> I would saty with hoary, as development is just beginning
[10:40] <Kamion> cartman: not yet; it certainly will eventually
[10:40] <cartman> Kamion: I see so breezy > sid ;)
[10:40] <Diablo-D3> now lets see how fubar I can make my machine
[10:41] <cartman> Diablo-D3: hoary is pretty stable
[10:41] <Diablo-D3> cartman: stable is boring =(
[10:41] <cartman> yeah install breezy then :P
[10:41] <Diablo-D3> mwhah
[10:41] <cartman> joys of finding new bugs ;)
[10:42] <Diablo-D3> I'll try hoary first
[10:42] <Diablo-D3> then upgrade from there
[10:42] <Diablo-D3> I just don't know what to do with all my kde apps
[10:43] <Diablo-D3> like, where does kubuntu stand in all of this?
[10:43] <Kamion> cartman: varies
[10:43] <Kamion> cartman: nothing is simple in this world
[10:43] <ogra> mdz, ping
[10:43] <cartman> Kamion: true
[10:43] <Kamion> we have not yet synced everything from sid
[10:44] <cartman> Kamion: but g++ abi transition is a big gain for me
[10:44] <Diablo-D3> hrm
[10:44] <Diablo-D3> yes yes, its slashdot, but I wonder if ubuntu is the death of debian
[10:47] <HrdwrBoB> no
[10:47] <HrdwrBoB> ubuntu is the life of debian
[10:48] <HrdwrBoB> actually.. given the results of the recent DPL election
[10:48] <Diablo-D3> well, almost everyone I know is switching to ubuntu
[10:48] <HrdwrBoB> you might be right
[10:48] <ogra> Diablo-D3, if anything is the death of debian its debian itself....
[10:48] <Diablo-D3> ogra: touche
[10:48] <HrdwrBoB> yeah
[10:48] <Kamion> cartman: ... which we haven't done yet
[10:49] <Diablo-D3> now only if ubuntu can be the death of all other distros
[10:49] <cartman> Kamion: yes and I am not sure if sid will
[10:49] <Kamion> please folks, #ubuntu-devel is not a "bash debian" channel
[10:49] <Kamion> cartman: it will in time
[10:49] <Diablo-D3> is ubuntu picking up gcc4?
[10:49] <cartman> Kamion: well unless time <= 6 months its not better for me
[10:49] <pitti> breezy is compiled with gcc4
[10:49] <cartman> but not g++4 yet :/
[10:50] <Diablo-D3> hrm
[10:50] <Diablo-D3> about my earlier question, where does kubuntu stand in the whole switching to ubuntu thing?
[10:50] <Diablo-D3> I mean, is it an addon, or a seperate distro?
[10:50] <Burgundavia> kubuntu is kde + ubuntu
[10:50] <cartman> Diablo-D3: Ubuntu+KDE-Gnome == Kubuntu
[10:50] <Burgundavia> not a true deriv
[10:51] <Diablo-D3> cartman: so I can't have kde and gnome installed at the same time?
[10:51] <cartman> you can
[10:51] <Kamion> Diablo-D3: sounds like a #ubuntu or #kubuntu thing :)
[10:51] <Diablo-D3> I just add ubuntu and kubuntu sources then?
[10:51] <cartman> yeah go ask Riddell ;)
[10:51] <Diablo-D3> Kamion: #ubuntu is hell
[10:51] <Diablo-D3> its worse than #debian or #gentoo
[10:51] <maswan> Diablo-D3: bringing it all in here will make this hell though.
[10:51] <Diablo-D3> I had to leave because it was taking my dialup out
[10:51] <Kamion> Diablo-D3: I'm trying to keep this channel in a condition where I can actually read all the scrollback
[10:52] <Diablo-D3> Kamion: hah
[10:52] <Diablo-D3> Kamion: yeah, slow channels rock ;)
[10:52] <Kamion> that means asking people to take support stuff elsewhere; sorry and all that
[10:53] <Diablo-D3> I am sad, though, to leave debian
[10:53] <Diablo-D3> this is what I've been running for the past 5 years
[10:53] <dholbach> so who of you will be in sydney at what day?
[10:54] <Kamion> Diablo-D3: you can do both. :-)
[10:54] <Kamion> (I do ...)
[10:54] <Diablo-D3> yeah, but if what I'm being told is true, debian is dead
[10:54] <Diablo-D3> everyone is jumping ship for ubuntu
[10:55] <Kamion> I beg to differ, but this is not the place
[10:55] <ogra> Diablo-D3, if debian is really dead, where does ubuntu come from ?
[10:55] <dholbach> it's not a question for #ubuntu-devel
[10:55] <pitti> please move this elsewhere...
[10:55] <ogra> yeah, thats rather #ubuntu-offtopic
[10:55] <Diablo-D3> where else is there?
[10:55] <Kamion> and I think you'll find that MOTU work would rise rather totally insanely if Debian stopped existing; we are not even a little bit ready for that.
[10:55] <ogra> yp
[10:55] <ogra> yep even
[10:56] <dholbach> see you later
[10:56] <pitti> Diablo-D3: #ubuntu ?
[10:58] <Diablo-D3> mwhaha
[10:59] <\sh> well, in the end: ian is jealous that's the reason why he wrote this article. end of story
[11:00] <Robot101> sigh
[11:00] <Diablo-D3> meh screw it
[11:01] <Diablo-D3> we need a small #ubuntu related channel, though
[11:01] <Diablo-D3> one that isnt uberbusy like #ubuntu
[11:01] <Diablo-D3> but one where #ubuntu-devel regulars hang out
[11:01] <Robot101> #ubuntu-chat ?
[11:01] <Robot101> #ubuntu-users
[11:02] <\sh> #ubuntu-pr0n
[11:02] <\sh> ;)
[11:03] <\sh> if you want to have a good support, ask your actual irc-supporter, if it's ok to have a query with him..
[11:03] <\sh> or :) lets change to something really nice...jabber-multiuser-chat :)
[11:03] <Diablo-D3> I hate jabber
[11:03] <Diablo-D3> jesus holy christ
[11:03] <Diablo-D3> Need to get 267MB of archives.
[11:03] <Robot101> all *still* off topic
[11:04] <Diablo-D3> and thats _not_ including half a billion held back packages
[11:04] <\sh> Robot101: no :) I need to make a remark, that the jabberd2 package is horrible to maintain if you have more then 1 session manager...I want to change it
[11:04] <Robot101> (bah)
[11:04] <Diablo-D3> Robot101: wrong button?
[11:05] <Robot101> garbage collecting irssi query windows, pressed up once instead of twice, giving me /window close instead of /window 22
[11:05] <Robot101> anyway, off topic. :P
[11:06] <Kamion> Diablo-D3: no, I'm not interested in joining a channel designed to facilitate noise, thanks ...
[11:07] <Diablo-D3> Kamion: so all ubuntu discussion is noise?
[11:07] <Kamion> you're asking for #ubuntu-devel people to join a channel that's not about Ubuntu development, but only works when Ubuntu developers are there
[11:08] <Kamion> this seems a bit ambitious
[11:08] <Diablo-D3> well, I'm not sure what else to do
[11:10] <Diablo-D3> and I'm hoping this doesn't manage to explode
[11:16] <Diablo-D3> small question
[11:17] <Diablo-D3> what gcc does hoary use?
[11:17] <elmo> fabbione: still here?  diff is the switch to diffutils probably
[11:17] <elmo> I removed the diff source recently and it took out the binary for some non-release arches
[11:17] <Treenaks> Diablo-D3: 3.3.5 I think
[11:17] <Kamion> Diablo-D3:        gcc |  4:3.3.5-1 |    hoary/main | amd64, i386, powerpc
[11:18] <fabbione> elmo: yes i am here
[11:18] <Diablo-D3> cool
[11:18] <fabbione> elmo: ok so i can replace diff with diffutils in breezy.build script?
[11:18] <fabbione> elmo: that's how i noticed :)
[11:19] <fabbione> elmo: even if the chroot is still not bootstrappable on sparc.. it complains about gcc-3.3
[11:19] <Kamion> fabbione: erm; you mean the debootstrap script? no, the binary is still diff
[11:19] <fabbione> Kamion: ah ok
[11:19] <elmo> fabbione: only source changed
[11:19] <Kamion> I'll update debootstrap now
[11:19] <fabbione> roger :)
[11:19] <Kamion> (for gcc)
[11:22] <Kamion> eek, this is totally broken
[11:25] <Kamion> fabbione: it looks like you just haven't built diffutils, to me
[11:25] <fabbione> Kamion: hmmmmmm
[11:25] <fabbione> i will look into that
[11:25] <fabbione> thanks
[11:25] <Kamion> perl-modules                          | perl                            | ntp                                   | Brendan O'Dea <bod@debian.org>                                            |         2178044 |           10716
[11:26] <Kamion> somebody want to stop ntp depending on perl-modules, or decide what else we should put in base? perl and perl-modules shouldn't be in base
[11:26] <Mithrandir> why does ntp depend on perl-modules?
[11:28] <Kamion> +  * Depend on perl-modules (for ntptrace). Closes:#276672.
[11:29] <Mithrandir> getopt
[11:29] <Kamion> we could just switch to ntp-simple
[11:30] <Mithrandir> I think we could just demote it to a recommends
[11:38] <Kamion> Mithrandir: we'll take ntp out of base; will do that later
[11:38] <Mithrandir> mhm
[11:48] <astharot> ciao
[12:07] <GheRivero> res
[12:11] <fabbione> hmmmm
[12:11] <fabbione> diffutils is still marked as universe for sparc... that explains why
[12:12] <stazz> Should I file a bugreport if I'm requesting for a feature?
[12:12] <fabbione> stazz: yes, enanchement
[12:13] <stazz> fabbione: to bugzilla or somewhere else?
[12:13] <fabbione> stazz: on what package?
[12:13] <stazz> fabbione: regarding the installer
[12:13] <fabbione> stazz: bugzilla
[12:14] <stazz> might there be some guidelines on how to write a proper bug?
[12:15] <ogra> mdz, ping
[12:19] <thom> fabbione: enhancement ;-)
[12:19] <\sh> we need a "todo journal list" on the wiki or launchpad ;)
[12:20] <cartel_> guys im gonna be testing nomachine enterprise on ubuntu soon
[12:20] <cartel_> ubuntu/kubuntu
[12:20] <cartel_> live fire environment
[12:21] <cartel_> its going in to one of our clients
[12:21] <Burgundavia> cartel_, is that GPL or OSI-compat?
[12:21] <cartel_> this is the commercial product
[12:21] <cartel_> im using the freenx now
[12:21] <cartel_> :)
[12:21] <cartel_> on kubuntu
[12:22] <cartel_> but, we want to deploy nomachine enterprise
[12:22] <cartel_> so far i have seen issues with multiple sessions 
[12:22] <cartel_> is ubuntu not tested for multiple logins?
[12:22] <Burgundavia> I assume so
[12:22] <Burgundavia> if you see a bug, file it
[12:22] <Treenaks> cartel_: issues? like what?
[12:22] <cartel_> thats the idea
[12:23] <cartel_> Treenaks: deadlocks
[12:23] <Treenaks> cartel_: weird
[12:23] <Treenaks> cartel_: afaik multiseat works.. so multi-login using XDMCP should work as well
[12:23] <cartel_> Treenaks: essentially from sshing in and running startx
[12:23] <cartel_> nomachine of course
[12:24] <Treenaks> what is nomachine?
[12:24] <cartel_> www.nomachine.com
[12:24] <cartel_> s/nomachine/nx
[12:24] <Treenaks> uh... so what's wrong with LTSP?
[12:24] <cartel_> it doesnt work over internet links
[12:24] <Treenaks> cartel_: yes it does
[12:24] <cartel_> ok
[12:24] <Treenaks> cartel_: if you know how ;)
[12:25] <cartel_> i have done ltsp deployments man
[12:25] <cartel_> it sux for kde
[12:25] <Treenaks> yes, but KDE sucks anyway
[12:25] <cartel_> no it dont :)
[12:25] <Treenaks> </holy war>
[12:25] <cartel_> youve never used nomachine
[12:25] <Treenaks> cartel_: true
[12:25] <cartel_> hehe
[12:26] <cartel_> its heaven
[12:26] <cartel_> i use it at work, its so rich
[12:26] <cartel_> seamlessly stream mp3s from work hehe
[12:27] <cartel_> anyway when i see a bug ill file it i guess
[12:28] <Treenaks> cartel_: I don't like non-free software, and avoid it whenever possible, sorry
[12:30] <fabbione> thom: ehhehehehe
[12:32] <ogra> ciao
[01:15] <zyga> hello
[01:16] <zyga> eh I'm getting constant problems with eject 
[01:33] <zyga> putting a broken cd into the drive makes it impossible to eject it without root access
[01:33] <Burgundavia> I noticed that as well
[01:33] <zyga> and eject barfs about wrong arguments
[01:34] <Treenaks> zyga: pressing the button will not work?
[01:34] <zyga> nautilus show 'no cd in drive' icon
[01:34] <Burgundavia> haven't seen that
[01:34] <zyga> Treenaks: no
[01:34] <zyga> Treenaks: the drive is locked
[01:34] <Treenaks> don't break your CDs then :P
[01:35] <zyga> Treenaks: I guess something (whatever mounts them, gnome-volume-manager or sth) breaks sometime later after locking the drive
[01:35] <zyga> Treenaks: gnome-cd-burner broke them :P
[01:35] <zyga> Treenaks: my dad created a dozen CD
[01:35] <Burgundavia> this has happened to me with commericial cds as well
[01:35] <zyga> almost none of them work :-/
[01:35] <zyga> I don't blame the program yet
[01:35] <Burgundavia> i do
[01:35] <zyga> but each time it showed 'success'
[01:36] <zyga> it should have shown 'error' I guess
[01:36] <zyga> anyway there are still few issues pending 
[01:36] <Burgundavia> if the program reports succes when it didn't do it correctly, that would be a bug
[01:36] <zyga> like no /dev/cdrom (pitti will fix that later)
[01:36] <Burgundavia> however, even if it do that correctly, but your system is breaking on it, that would also be a bug
[01:37] <zyga> Burgundavia: I agree
[01:37] <zyga> especially that user cannot eject anything without root access
[01:37] <zyga> I've made eject suid on my dad's box but that was scary
[01:37] <zyga> kernel barfs about deprecated SCSI api 
[01:38] <zyga> (why the hell eject is doing scsi on /dev/hdc i don't know)
[01:38] <zyga> I've checked eject sources and they seem old
[01:38] <zyga> like ... ready for your brand new 2.2 kernel
[01:39] <zyga> (my dad has his box mainly to listen and burn music and it's been avery dissapointing experience)
[01:44] <fabbione> zyga: are you using ide-scsi?
[01:45] <zyga> fabbione: no
[01:45] <zyga> fabbione: or... I don't know (w8
[01:45] <zyga> fabbione: does ubuntu use ide-scsi?
[01:45] <zyga> (my dad's box is a fresh hoary install)
[01:45] <zyga> fabbione: no ide-scsi in lsmod
[01:48] <fabbione> zyga: eject works fine here (as user) on /dev/hdc
[01:48] <fabbione> and it doesn't use SCSI
[01:48] <fabbione> or is that a scsi device?
[01:48] <fabbione> and the system believes it is /dev/hdc?
[01:49] <zyga> fabbione: no it's a regular cd-rw+dvd combo
[01:50] <zyga> fabbione: after brief reading of eject's source code I can only say
[01:50] <zyga> fabbione: that it tries everything it can
[01:50] <zyga> fabbione: so after eject-cd fails (and the error message is shown: wrong argument)
[01:50] <zyga> fabbione: eject tries eject-scsi-cd
[01:50] <zyga> and that works if ivoked by super-user
[01:51] <fabbione> zyga: is your father account the only one on that machine?
[01:51] <fabbione> or did you install with your and created your daddy account?
[01:51] <zyga> fabbione: no there are few others
[01:51] <zyga> fabbione: he's got all relevant permissions
[01:51] <fabbione> zyga: can i see /etc/groups ?
[01:51] <zyga> fabbione: sure
[01:52] <fabbione> please either put it on the web
[01:52] <fabbione> or pastebin
[01:53] <fabbione> zyga: what was not clear between put it on the web or pastebin?
[01:54] <fabbione> zyga: STOP!
[01:54] <fabbione> i don't want it in private message!
[01:54] <zyga> (sorry for flodding ;)
[01:54] <zyga> fabbione: ejecting as the first created user fails as well BTW
[01:54] <zyga> fabbione: I saw that after I pasted it, sorry
[01:54] <zyga> I can still put in on the web if you'd like
[01:54] <fabbione> yes becasue it got lost
[01:54] <fabbione> i don't keep history
[01:55] <zyga> I'm sorry, wait a second please
[01:56] <zyga> http://www.suxx.pl/pierdoly/group
[01:57] <fabbione> who was the first created user?
[01:57] <zyga> zyga
[01:58] <fabbione> zyga: ls -las /dev/hdc
[01:59] <zyga> 0 brw-rw----  1 root cdrom 22, 0 2005-04-20 13:04 /dev/hdc
[01:59] <fabbione> is that the cdrom right?
[01:59] <zyga> yes it is
[01:59] <fabbione> did you logout and login after changing all these group things?
[02:00] <zyga> fabbione: yes they were changed long time ago
[02:01] <fabbione> hmmmm
[02:01] <jbailey> elmo: Please sync cdbs 0.4.28-1 from Debian it has all the Ubuntu changes now.
[02:02] <Burgundavia> fabbione, I can provide a probably more useful report. I have been having a similar issue, where the only way to eject a cd was with the eject command. These, however, were commercial cds
[02:02] <zyga> fabbione: I plan to do some more tests with fprintf rigged eject
[02:02] <Burgundavia> fabbione, and this is a default install of hoary final
[02:02] <fabbione> Burgundavia: there was no code change in the cdrom stuff for ages
[02:02] <fabbione> we would have noticed this problem way earlier
[02:02] <fabbione> also because note that when you install hoary from cdrom
[02:03] <fabbione> at phase 1 the cdrom is ejected automatically
[02:03] <Burgundavia> fabbione, only about 1 in 5-10 cds that I noticed it
[02:03] <zyga> fabbione: please note that this happens on somewhat broken cd
[02:03] <fabbione> HMMMMMM
[02:03] <zyga> fabbione: (not the drive)
[02:03] <zyga> fabbione: (the disks)
[02:03] <Burgundavia> I have also experienced instablity on gnome-cd, but I cannot remeber whether or not they are connected
[02:03] <fabbione> yes i get that
[02:03] <zyga> Burgundavia: do you have /dev/cdrom ?
[02:03] <Burgundavia> s/on/with
[02:04] <fabbione> zyga: stick in a cdrom
[02:04] <zyga> fabbione: broken or working one?
[02:04] <fabbione> before an eject, try to lsof | grep cdrom
[02:04] <Burgundavia> fabbione, check
[02:04] <fabbione> broken
[02:04] <fabbione> if the working one is working.. i can't really use the info :)
[02:04] <Burgundavia> fabbione, I will do some more testing in the next few days and file a bug report about it
[02:05] <zyga> fabbione: please note: these are audio cds
[02:05] <fabbione> Burgundavia: what you need to check if one of the various HAL/hotplug/whatever userland tool keeps a lock or an open file on the cdrom
[02:05] <fabbione> zyga: the kernel doesn't really care of what kind of cd's they are
[02:06] <Burgundavia> fabbione, I suspect that it is the instablity in gnome-cd
[02:06] <Burgundavia> sometimes it crashes ont he last track (all commercial cds)
[02:06] <Burgundavia> and that is what probably locks it
[02:06] <fabbione> if the disk is NOT good, generally the kernel spends time attempting to reread the info
[02:06] <fabbione> and that is NORMAL
[02:06] <fabbione> but userland shouldn't lock it
[02:06] <zyga> fabbione: okay
[02:07] <fabbione> if the lock is in the kernel, than i know what to look for
[02:07] <zyga> fabbione: broken cd that appears to be blank cd (it's not)
[02:07] <fabbione> but i have bad disks too
[02:07] <zyga> fabbione: trying to mount it yeilds nothing
[02:07] <fabbione> and i can still ejec them as user
[02:07] <zyga> fabbione: ejecting fails with 'wrong argument'
[02:07] <fabbione> tho i don't use gnome-cd
[02:07] <zyga> fabbione: lsof | grep cdrom is empty
[02:07] <zyga> fabbione: lsof | grep hdc shows nautilus
[02:07] <fabbione> zyga: try lsof |grep hdc
[02:07] <fabbione> zyga: kill that nautilus session?
[02:07] <fabbione> and see if it ejects?
[02:08] <zyga> fabbione: ok
[02:08] <zyga> fabbione: yeap, it ejects allright
[02:08] <zyga> fabbione: I'll try again with different cd
[02:08] <fabbione> ok file a bug on nautilus :)
[02:08] <zyga> fabbione: one that is being interpreted as not blank
[02:08] <fabbione> there are no kernel bugs.. only borken hardware and userland
[02:09] <Treenaks> fabbione: could it be a GTK bug?
[02:09] <fabbione> Treenaks: with nautilus? YES!
[02:09] <fabbione> :P
[02:09] <Treenaks> :P
[02:09] <XandriX> jdub, u there ?
[02:10] <Amaranth> jdub is on his honeymoon or something, the slacker
[02:10] <fabbione> Amaranth: LCA
[02:10] <Amaranth> that's even worse :P
[02:10] <fabbione> no no
[02:11] <fabbione> he is having his honeymoon at LCA :)
[02:11] <Amaranth> hey, i'm not lagging so bad now, it didn't take 4 minutes for use to say those two lines to each other
[02:11] <Amaranth> s/use/us/
[02:11] <zyga> fabbione: should I file a bug for ubuntu or directly on gnome?
[02:11] <fabbione> Amaranth: with all respect, this does not mean we will ever have an intimate dinner with candle light
[02:12] <fabbione> zyga: start with ubuntu please.
[02:12] <Amaranth> fabbione: That sounds so wrong.
[02:13] <fabbione> Amaranth: do you really want to have a dinner (with candel light) with me????
[02:13] <zyga> fabbione: thanks
[02:13] <fabbione> are you insane? :P
[02:13] <fabbione> zyga: no problem
[02:14] <Amaranth> fabbione: Err, where did that come from?
[02:14] <fabbione> zyga: please also attach the log of this irc conversation before i will have to push back the bug to nautilus
 hey, i'm not lagging so bad now, it didn't take 4 minutes for us to say those two lines to each other
[02:14] <fabbione> Amaranth: and my reply was:
 Amaranth: with all respect, this does not mean we will ever have an
[02:14] <fabbione>            intimate dinner with candle light
[02:15] <fabbione> meaning that even if we write together.. we are not going to have dinner together :)
[02:16] <fabbione> later
[02:18] <simira> hmm
[02:18] <simira> anyone knows if Mithrandir went to sleep?
[02:25] <zyga> done, #9954
[02:31] <zyga> okay lame question: how to save backlog in irssi? 
[02:32] <Kosai> zyga: Read the manual for /lastlog.
[02:32] <zul> hey
[02:33] <zyga> Kosai: many thanks :-)
[02:38] <lesshaste> is it correct that there is no standard net install for ubuntu?
[02:39] <daniels> no.
[02:40] <lesshaste> hmm... could you point me to some docs pleasE?
[02:40] <lesshaste> they are completely ignorant of this at #ubuntu :)
[02:43] <lesshaste> "<Fab_> lesshaste: well, it seems that ubuntu doesnt provide a netinstall :( id like one too"
[02:45] <Burgundavia> I just looked on th wiki, didn't see one in a quick search
[02:45] <Burgundavia> you may want to dig deeper
[02:45] <lesshaste> I didn't see on either. daniels suggests there is one.. hoping he/she will reply :)
[02:45] <Burgundavia> he
[02:46] <lesshaste> s/on/one
[03:01] <jbailey> elmo: Please sync aspell-sl
[03:08] <lesshaste> so no one knows about ubuntu net install?
[03:08] <lesshaste> by that I mean whether it exists or not :)
[03:08] <azeem> ask on the lists?
[03:08] <lesshaste> ok... shame to IRC :)
[03:08] <aj> jbailey: are you at lca, or coming to UDU?
[03:09] <jbailey> aj: Coming to UDU.  I'm still in Toronto.
[03:09] <jbailey> aj: I leave in about 30 hours.
[03:09] <aj> jbailey: cool, we can catch up monday/tuesday hopefully :)
[03:10] <jbailey> aj: That sounds lovely!
[03:10] <cartman> jbailey: hmm no glibc upload today?
[03:11] <jbailey> cartman: Today's not over. =)
[03:11] <jbailey> (Today has barely begun from this timezone)
[03:12] <jbailey> cartman: Canada/Eastern.
[03:13] <cartman> can't find Canada lol :)
[03:15] <jbailey> cartman: Second largest couple in the world or so?  =)
[03:15] <jbailey> country.
[03:15] <cartman> kde clock applet needs some lovin'
[03:15] <cartman> guess I found a new way to seduce myself
[03:18] <jbailey> elmo: Please sync autofs
[03:23] <dholbach> hey
[03:29] <cartman> btw will binutils 2.16 will be imported after UDU?
[03:33] <KayJ> hi
[03:33] <KayJ> i need gparted as qtparted doesnt want to resize my ext3 partition
[03:34] <KayJ> is gparted included in gnoppix?
[03:34] <dholbach> i can only talk for ubuntu
[03:34] <KayJ> is it included on the ubuntu livecd then?
[03:34] <dholbach> and unfortunately gparted is not in main, so it won't be on the CD nor on the DVD
[03:34] <KayJ> damn
[03:42] <lamont> hrm... FTBFS with gcc-4.0... guess those should probably go against debian, eh?
[03:42] <dholbach> good night everyone
[03:44] <lamont> mdz: you around?
[04:00] <ogra> http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/8253
[04:03] <fabbione> ogra: hey
[04:03] <fabbione> ogra: is doko there?
[04:04] <ogra> fabbione, already in bed i think... he left 1/2h ago....
[04:04] <fabbione> ah ok
[04:04] <fabbione> tell him that gcc-4 sucks
[04:04] <ogra> fabbione, shall i tell him details ?
[04:04] <ogra> :)
[04:04] <fabbione> sure..
[04:04] <jbailey> ogra: Sure.  Tell him it sucks alot ;)
[04:04] <fabbione> "more than a porn star"
[04:04] <zul> lol
[04:04] <ogra> whoo
[04:05] <ogra> thats much
[04:05] <d3vic3> lol 
[04:05] <fabbione> no
[04:05] <jbailey> The upgrade is as hairy as Ron Jeremy?
[04:05] <fabbione> it's the hoover of the pornostars
[04:05] <ogra> geez
[04:05] <d3vic3> ahahahahaha 
[04:06] <fabbione> Ron Jeremy.. sounds familiar....
[04:06] <fabbione> isn't that actor that is like tall 3 feet and half?
[04:06] <fabbione> or around there :)
[04:06] <jbailey> And long.
[04:06] <ogra> heh
[04:06] <jbailey> And knows as 'the hedgehog'
[04:06] <fabbione> yeah well.. him
[04:06] <fabbione> jbailey: ahah yeah!
[04:06] <fabbione> i remember him..
[04:08] <ogra> hmm
[04:09] <ogra> he might be hoary nowadays....
[04:18] <SlackShrike> hi
[04:21] <SlackShrike> I would like to know as it is the process of creation of live-CD of the Ubuntu.  I would like to make one live equal to that vocs they make.  How it is this process?  Where I find documentation?
[04:22] <Burgundavia> don't know off hand, but the wiki has the info I believe
[04:32] <SlackShrike> It does not have nothing esplicando the process of creation in the WIKI
[04:32] <Burgundavia> read the -devel mail archives
[04:32] <Burgundavia> somebody mentioned it recently
[04:34] <SlackShrike> thanks
[04:35] <SlackShrike> i will see
[04:37] <ups> SlackShrike, there is a page on live cd in the wiki
[04:39] <ups> SlackShrike, http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/LiveCDCustomizationHowTo
[04:40] <tsume_> ups: is there a SetupCDCustomisationHowto?
[04:41] <ups> tsume_, don't know
[04:42] <amanpreet> How can i set my language as a default language while making live CD based on ubuntu.
[04:42] <amanpreet> can somebody pls help me??
[04:42] <SlackShrike> ups:  this link teaches to personalize live.  I want To create an equal o ubuntu-live
[04:43] <SlackShrike> I did not find nothing that taught to create the o live hoary
[04:45] <amanpreet> SlackShrike, can you pls paste the same link again for me?
[04:45] <ups> SlackShrike, sorry i dont know anything about o live :/
[04:45] <SlackShrike> ups: ok, thanks
[04:46] <SlackShrike> amanpreet : I don't understand
[04:46] <SlackShrike> amanpreet: this http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/LiveCDCustomizationHowTo ?
[04:47] <amanpreet> SlackShrike, thats what i want, thanks a lot
[05:01] <SlackShrike> Thanks
[05:15] <metallikop> fabbione: ping
[05:15] <fabbione> pong
[05:15] <metallikop> Do you have any docs out there for Ubuntu Sparc?
[05:15] <Burgundavia> fabbione, is mpt in the #canonical channel?
[05:15] <zyga> why did ubuntu-calendar-april disspear from breezy?
[05:16] <metallikop> zyga: was wondering the same thing too
[05:16] <fabbione> metallikop: nope... what kind of documentation are you looking for?
[05:16] <fabbione> Burgundavia: dude.. /whois mpt
[05:16] <fabbione> Burgundavia: it's not like i keep track of who enters/exits channels all the time :)
[05:16] <metallikop> some sort of howto, tftp, net booting, etc.
[05:16] <zyga> dissapear even :>
[05:16] <Burgundavia> fabbione, matthew thomas. launchpad usablity guy
[05:16] <Burgundavia> fabbione, I just do see him here or in #launchpad
[05:17] <fabbione> Burgundavia: yes.. i know who he is.. a /whois mpt will tell you if he is connected and where
[05:17] <metallikop> have you talked to schweeb at all about his problems he had with the sparc build?
[05:17] <Burgundavia> fabbione, thanks
[05:17] <fabbione> metallikop: yes we did talk a bit about it.
[05:17] <fabbione> metallikop: there are several reasons why you can get that error
[05:18] <fabbione> metallikop: and only a combination of tests can reveal exaclty what it is
[05:18] <metallikop> I figured as much
[05:18] <fabbione> metallikop: like changing silo/kernel combinations
[05:18] <metallikop> I'm going to attempt to install it on a Blade 100 today.
[05:18] <fabbione> metallikop: good luck :)
[05:18] <metallikop> I'm sure I'll need it
[05:18] <fabbione> metallikop: generally the same doc as for debian should do
[05:18] <metallikop> K.
[05:18] <fabbione> metallikop: ubuntu is not that different in that respect on sparc
[05:19] <metallikop> indeed.
[05:19] <fabbione> i know the installer works fine here
[05:19] <fabbione> so once you can manage to boot.. you are done
[05:19] <fabbione> i can't test X here.. so the autoconfiguration might not work
[05:19] <metallikop> what are you running on?
[05:19] <fabbione> netra t1
[05:19] <fabbione> headless
[05:20] <fabbione> brb
[05:25] <Kamion> Burgundavia: it's very late in NZ - I doubt he's still awake
[05:25] <GheRivero> res
[05:28] <Burgundavia> Kamion, hmm, his website just went down
[06:02] <jbailey> elmo: Please sync analog
[06:23] <jbailey> food, pickup tickets from travel agent, etc. time.  bbiab.
[06:28] <SavvyPlayer> Does anyone know offhand how epiphany finds and loads libgtkembedmoz.so?
[06:28] <SavvyPlayer> I am having problems launching epiphany and yelp
[06:28] <Burgundavia> prolly looks on the lib path
[06:29] <SavvyPlayer> I exported an LD_LIBRARY_PATH var with /usr/lib/mozilla
[06:30] <SavvyPlayer> the /usr/lib/mozilla/TestGtkEmbed app runs fine
[06:31] <Kamion> plugins are generally loaded by explicit path rather than LD_LIBRARY_PATH; you'd have to recompile to move them
[06:33] <SavvyPlayer> without LD_LIBRARY_PATH, I get this:
[06:33] <SavvyPlayer> epiphany: error while loading shared libraries: libgtkembedmoz.so: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
[06:33] <SavvyPlayer> is there a standard way to debug something like this?
[06:34] <Kamion> oh, it must just do dlopen("libgtkembedmoz.so") with no absolute path
[06:34] <Kamion> LD_LIBRARY_PATH wouldn't be checked otherwise ...
[06:40] <SavvyPlayer> all of the packages came from the hoary repository, although I do sometimes sync up with sid and breezy
[06:43] <tritium> So the CC meeting never got rescheduled?
[06:45] <Kamion> the entire CC is at a conference right now; kinda tricky
[07:29] <trulux> tseng: there?
[07:32] <ska-fan> Are the cds from shipit.u.c shipping yet?
[07:32] <Burgundavia> ska-fan, you will be informed when yours are ready to ship
[07:32] <Burgundavia> please stop bugging the devs
[07:32] <cartman> my warty cds never arrived :)
[07:32] <Burgundavia> did they cost you anything?
[07:33] <cartman> nah eventually I got broadband
[07:33] <wasabi_> Heh. I'd pay for the cd's if given a chance. ;)
[07:34] <ska-fan> The website should make clear then that the cds maybe don't ship at all.
[07:52] <spo0nman> .join #linux-india
[07:52] <spo0nman> sorry.
[08:37] <abelli> ciao
[09:15] <eddyp> how can I submit a bug against ubuntu?
[09:16] <zul> bugzilla.ubuntulinux.org
[09:16] <eddyp> k, thanks
[09:20] <orangehaw> anyone in here (fabbione?) who could provide me with the 2.6.12 rc2 kernel so i could test my soundcard (Intel Corp. 82801FB/FBM/FR/FW/FRW (ICH6 Family) High Definition Audio Controller) on Ubuntu hoary. I'm on 2.6.10-5-696-smp now and would like to get sound working ;)
[09:21] <orangehaw> 2.6.10-5-686-smp of course, not 2.6.10-5-696-smp LOL
[09:24] <Treenaks> orangehaw: isn't the kernel in breezy?
[09:24] <orangehaw> i haven't looked into that yet
[09:24] <orangehaw> i'll have a look
[09:26] <zul> Treenaks: its still 2.6.10
[09:26] <Treenaks> zul: isn't a newer kernel available?
[09:26] <orangehaw> what is expected in breezy
[09:26] <zul> not yet
[09:26] <zul> 2.6.12ish
[09:27] <zul> orangehaw: if you send an email to zulcss@gmail.com i can throw one up for you
[09:27] <orangehaw> thanks man
[09:27] <zul> with the version you need
[09:27] <orangehaw> will do
[09:27] <orangehaw> in a minute
[09:28] <zul> i send you a link to it tomorrow probably
[09:36] <orangehaw> zul: you've got mail
[09:40] <zul> i do? :)
[10:30] <anna> Anybody can point me to details about the HP contract for Ubuntu?
[10:33] <\sh> for this u have to ask hp or canonical i think
[10:34] <anna> I thought I do exactly that, asking Canonical people here
[10:34] <anna> And congrats on it btw :)
[10:35] <\sh> i don't think so, that many canonical people are this channel :) no sales people ;)
[10:38] <anna> Developers are the real sales people, try sell Linux if it's not good :p
[10:39] <anna> Anyway, you have taken my hope away
[10:39] <anna> Now I have to live in despair and never get to know more :)
[10:39] <anna> Bye
[10:43] <Kosai> anna: Have you seen http://www.heise.de/english/newsticker/news/58780 ?
[10:45] <anna> yes, i did, but I want to see the source press release
[10:46] <jcole> i'm hacking the ubuntu install cd so it's smaller... but, when i remove some .deb files from the cd i get the error "this is not an ubuntu cd"... any suggestions?
[10:48] <\sh> anna: i couldn't get any information from the hp homepage....
[10:49] <robertj_> hehe, I had just come to ask if anyone knew why Ubuntu would not be preinstalled by HP but would come on a CD and FreeDOS would be installed by default ;)
[11:02] <Kamion> jcole: sounds like you lost the .disk directory on the CD by mistake
[11:05] <jcole> Kamion: .disk file? do i have to rebuild this file or something?
[11:10] <ogra> mornin
[11:12] <Kamion> jcole: the original CD has a .disk directory (not file); it sounds like you forgot to copy it to your new image
[11:12] <Kamion> you don't need to rebuild it
[11:31] <jcole> Kamion: oh ok, mkisofs must have excluded it
[11:31] <jcole> Kamion: thanks, i'll try again
[11:49] <mxpxpod> will there be an announcement when breezy is ready to start testing?
[11:49] <tseng> it is ready
[11:49] <tseng> if you are a massochist
[11:49] <schweeb> breezy is open already, you can upgrade and test at will
[11:49] <tseng> or just hate evolution.
[11:50] <schweeb> but I haven't yet upgraded to breezy :)
[11:50] <zyga> btw when will libgda2-common, gcj and ndiswrapper-utils be updateable?
[11:51] <seb128> tseng, that's a troll other people package time or what ?
[11:51] <eddyp> why the hell do I need an account to submit a bug ?!?!?!?
[11:51] <\sh> schweeb: use kmail ;)
[11:51] <tseng> seb128: uh, breezy has broken evo
[11:51] <tseng> seb128: mom broke it.
[11:51] <tseng> seb128: it was a joke
[11:51] <seb128> tseng, very funny :p
[11:51] <tseng> yep :P
[11:52] <eddyp> i don't fucking want an account 
[11:52] <tseng> chill out dude.
[11:52] <tseng> you need an account for every bugzilla
[11:52] <zyga> eddyp: shouting will not help
[11:52] <tseng> fact of life
[11:52] <mxpxpod> thom: ping
[11:53] <zyga> eddyp: in space no-one can hear your scream ;-)
[11:53] <zyga> or so they say
[11:53] <eddyp> I know, but this registering stuff is making me nuts
[11:53] <eddyp> why don't u guys use BTS? is it not available?
[11:53] <bob2> you mean debbugs?
[11:53] <zyga> eddyp: windows user say the same thing
[11:53] <tseng> we're working on a new system similar to BTS
[11:54] <tseng> it will use the same account as the ubuntu wiki
[11:54] <bob2> bugzilla has better project management stuff, sorry
[11:54] <eddyp> debian bts I mean
[11:54] <bob2> yes, that's called debbugs.
[11:55] <eddyp> so can I send a mail or something instead of registering?
[11:55] <tseng> i think reportbug will eventually work with it
[11:55] <eddyp> bob2: oh, ok, didn't knew that
[11:55] <eddyp> tseng: that would be of no use
[11:55] <eddyp> in my case
[11:56] <eddyp> the live cd didn't boot, so, no reportbug
[11:56] <eddyp> that is my problem
[11:56] <eddyp> the bug I wanted to report
[11:56] <tseng> just an observation, but youve been complaining about this for several minutes
[11:56] <tseng> it takes less than a minute to register
[11:57] <eddyp> tseng: i HATE registering in order to help _others_ ..... well also myself, but is doable without
[11:57] <eddyp> :)
[11:57] <bob2> sorry, this is how bugzilla works
[11:58] <bob2> yes, it's annoying, but whinging will not make it magically get fixed
[11:58] <eddyp> :))
[11:58] <eddyp> bob2: so, will it be some kind of gateway to bugzilla?
[11:58] <eddyp> or a new different sistem
[11:58] <eddyp> ?