| ogra | heh | 12:02 |
|---|---|---|
| === lamont goes to take his wife out for her birthday | ||
| ogra | lamont, have fun | 12:02 |
| tseng | cya lamont. | 12:02 |
| tseng | i going to break the buildd's while youre away | 12:02 |
| === luis_ is now known as lu|away | ||
| === kop|gone is now known as metallikop | ||
| dholbach | brb | 12:21 |
| mdz | fabbione: what is wrong with hotplug? | 12:23 |
| === dholbach [~daniel@td9091d86.pool.terralink.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| ogra | dholbach, badger badger badger badger badger badger badger ! | 12:25 |
| dholbach | re | 12:25 |
| dholbach | YES! :-) | 12:25 |
| Nafallo | lol | 12:25 |
| ogra | *g* | 12:25 |
| dholbach | now a breezy pbuilder and i can upload some fixes soon | 12:25 |
| dholbach | CONGRATULATIONS, tseng! | 12:27 |
| tseng | yay | 12:27 |
| ogra | hooray ! | 12:29 |
| ogra | ! | 12:29 |
| ogra | !! | 12:29 |
| === zul [~chuck@CPE0006258ec6c2-CM000a73655d0e.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
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| mdz | mako: awake? | 12:37 |
| tseng | mdz: my pictures are up if you missed them | 12:38 |
| tseng | tseng.ath.cx/photos | 12:38 |
| toresbe | hmm | 12:38 |
| mdz | tseng: I see it now, thanks | 12:38 |
| tseng | rock on. | 12:39 |
| toresbe | is there any safeguard against replacing the GDM sccreen with a keygrabber | 12:39 |
| tseng | toresbe: erm, users cant normally overwrite gdm for starters | 12:39 |
| tseng | if they can, you have bigger problems | 12:39 |
| toresbe | nono | 12:40 |
| tseng | than protecting against a keygrabber | 12:40 |
| toresbe | logging on as a normal user in perhaps safemode then presenting a fake GDM screen | 12:40 |
| tseng | uh | 12:40 |
| tseng | safemode? | 12:40 |
| === bluefoxicy [~bluefox@pcp0012067827pcs.whtmrs01.md.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| toresbe | xterm failsafe or whatever it's called | 12:40 |
| === cyberix [~cyberix@hki2-6-3-fb.hoasnet.inet.fi] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| toresbe | perkele, cyberix :P | 12:41 |
| cyberix | :-) | 12:41 |
| tseng | if you walked away from your pc, and someone else was on your account, they could theoretically make a mockup of gdm to steal your password | 12:41 |
| Nafallo | toresbe: you're still screwed if they get as far as to place it on the system IMO. | 12:41 |
| mdz | toresbe: the best defense is probably the fact that when the "real" gdm starts up, there is a noticeable video mode switch :-) | 12:41 |
| toresbe | mdz: can be faked | 12:41 |
| tseng | they bypassed a good bit of commonsense to get there | 12:41 |
| toresbe | nono | 12:42 |
| toresbe | Authenticated User B wants A's sudo rights | 12:42 |
| mdz | toresbe: you misunderstand | 12:42 |
| mdz | toresbe: fake gdm steals the password, then it needs to hand off to the "real" gdm | 12:42 |
| toresbe | B logs on and makes a program that looks like GDM. | 12:42 |
| toresbe | mdz: not really | 12:42 |
| mdz | after an incorrect password, real gdm just prompts again, while with the fake gdm there would be an unexpected mode change | 12:42 |
| tseng | if you are doing trusted things on system 1 with untrusted user B with local access | 12:43 |
| tseng | you are unwise. | 12:43 |
| toresbe | the program remaps backspace to something else and maps ctrl-alt-(x) to a quick XRandR call to switch the resolution | 12:43 |
| toresbe | the program runs an su user -c gnome-session or whatever. | 12:44 |
| cyberix | An university is a good example environment. | 12:44 |
| tseng | why would you trust a university pc to begin with | 12:44 |
| mdz | toresbe: a trojan which doesn't cover its tracks by allowing the user to log in the second time is easily discovered | 12:44 |
| tseng | you dont, for exactly this reason | 12:44 |
| toresbe | mdz: what do you mean? | 12:44 |
| toresbe | tseng: Windows has ctrl-alt-del | 12:45 |
| tseng | toresbe: because you only enter one password into windows during a normal session.. | 12:45 |
| mdz | and the X server has control+alt+backspace | 12:45 |
| toresbe | mdz: that can be unmapped | 12:45 |
| mdz | but like any SAK-ish solution, it only works if every user uses it | 12:45 |
| mdz | toresbe: not by an unprivileged user | 12:45 |
| tseng | there are just alot of problems with your use case | 12:45 |
| toresbe | mdz: sure | 12:45 |
| mdz | toresbe: try it | 12:45 |
| toresbe | mdz: I've done it | 12:46 |
| zul | tseng: your photos need descriptions | 12:46 |
| tseng | zul: leave comments | 12:46 |
| mdz | toresbe: show me | 12:46 |
| tseng | for luis.. BUH. | 12:46 |
| toresbe | mdz: paying the ticket? :P | 12:46 |
| toresbe | mdz: ISTR it anyway | 12:46 |
| toresbe | mdz: Right now I've got no ctrl-alt-f* | 12:46 |
| toresbe | and I don't wanna kill me X | 12:46 |
| mdz | toresbe: that is not the same thing | 12:46 |
| cyberix | Windows has a screen where you can't login before you press ctrl + alt + delete. But this is not irght because the user should understand she must secure the machine even, if the login mode is already open. | 12:47 |
| mdz | you don't need to; just show me the command sequence you use to disable it | 12:47 |
| zul | tseng: good pictures though | 12:47 |
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| dholbach | zul: especially all the plugs ;-) | 12:48 |
| zul | yeah | 12:48 |
| cyberix | Anyway ctrl + alt + backspace takes more time than the Windows thingie. So normal users will be likely to not do so. | 12:48 |
| zul | dholbach: you plug fetish | 12:48 |
| dholbach | zul: ME? i didnt take those pictures! :-) | 12:49 |
| zul | hehe | 12:49 |
| cyberix | I'd like to see a Windows user who presses ctrl + alt + delete before logging in, even when the computer is showing the login(g) mode while he sits by it. | 12:50 |
| cyberix | How can we do better. | 12:50 |
| cyberix | Atleast we can teach the user that he isn't doing it because he can't type in his login and password before pressing such combination. | 12:51 |
| cyberix | Maybe letting him type in his login and password, but showing a big red sign and not letting him in, if he didn't press the securing combination.C | 12:52 |
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| darwinist | UbUnTu rocks | 01:12 |
| HrdwrBoB | indeed | 01:12 |
| ydelaware | ubuntu rock | 01:13 |
| ydelaware | is that a new kind of music? | 01:13 |
| === womble [~mpalmer@newkevlar.wgong.baileyroberts.com.au] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| mdke | candy | 01:14 |
| clee | so, is upgrading from warty to breezy supposed to work? | 01:17 |
| mdke | *grins* | 01:18 |
| infinity | clee : You mean right now, or by the time we release? | 01:18 |
| mdke | give it a try! | 01:18 |
| Nafallo | clee: that would be a question for #ubuntu, but no. you should upgrade to hoary first. | 01:18 |
| clee | Nafallo: fair enough | 01:18 |
| dholbach | good night everyone | 01:18 |
| Nafallo | dholbach: nightie :-) | 01:19 |
| ogra | night dholbach | 01:19 |
| clee | so, then, a more devel-related topic. anybody here looked at launchd? | 01:19 |
| dholbach | bye ogra, Nafallo | 01:19 |
| ogra | night all | 01:19 |
| Nafallo | ogra: nightie. see you tomorrow :-). | 01:20 |
| Nafallo | ogra: ehm, later today :-P. | 01:20 |
| mdke | nite | 01:20 |
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| ajmitch_ | hi | 01:24 |
| === dilinger waves | ||
| === AndyFitz [~andy@220-245-97-227-qld-pppoe.tpgi.com.au] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| infinity | Hey Andy. | 01:25 |
| AndyFitz | g'day infinity | 01:30 |
| AndyFitz | how goes being back home ? | 01:31 |
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| infinity | Sick. :/ | 01:32 |
| infinity | Not sure if it was the long week in Sydney, or coming home to a drier climate, or just bad luck. | 01:32 |
| AndyFitz | bugger mate. you shouldnt have spent those late nights in kings cross | 01:32 |
| mako | mdz: yeah yeah, i'm around | 01:34 |
| AndyFitz | evening mako | 01:35 |
| mdz | mako: was wondering if you'd thought about when to hold the next CC meeting | 01:36 |
| clee | heya, mako | 01:36 |
| mako | mdz: do you ahve one planned for next tuesday? | 01:37 |
| mako | mdz: i'd like to get back on a every-other week schedule not conflicting with the TB | 01:37 |
| mako | if either of us is willing to do two weeks in a row, we can do that | 01:38 |
| mdz | mako: according to the old alternating schedule, TB would have been this week, and CC next | 01:38 |
| mako | mdz: you ok waiting two weeks or holding one sooner? | 01:39 |
| mako | i'd love to take next tuesday | 01:39 |
| mdz | mako: that's fine with me | 01:39 |
| mako | rad | 01:41 |
| mdke | you have a loooot of member candidates to get through ;) | 01:42 |
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| Nafallo | hehe, 21 :-) | 01:45 |
| mdke | the member candidate criteria needs to be spelled out a little... | 01:47 |
| dilinger | mako: what'cha up to? | 01:48 |
| mako | dilinger: not too much | 01:52 |
| mako | dilinger: i talked to greg.. he said to plan something for sunday. but i would like to hang out before | 01:53 |
| mako | Clint: with you too | 01:53 |
| Clint | not tonight | 01:53 |
| dilinger | mako: well, i'm heading up north for the weekend to pick stuff up.. | 01:53 |
| mako | dilinger: ah, ok | 01:55 |
| mako | Clint: that's fine | 01:55 |
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| jba | hey guys | 03:18 |
| jba | don't know how to say this, so gonna come straight out with it. Appologies in advance if it upsets anyone | 03:19 |
| jba | I'm looking at coming into the job market in sept/oct this year, and wanted to know what the odds of working for canonical would belike | 03:19 |
| jba | and who to speak to about it | 03:19 |
| jba | cool, tseng got me on the right track. thanks guys | 03:22 |
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| tseng | anyone here with an amd64 and breezy? | 03:34 |
| jdub | tomboy: Depends: libgnome-cil (>= 1.0) but it is not going to be installed | 03:35 |
| jdub | tseng: hrm ;) | 03:35 |
| tseng | jdub: libgnomedb rebuild | 03:35 |
| jba | hey jdub, congrats on wedding | 03:35 |
| tseng | jdub: i mailed seb to pretty please do it tommorow | 03:36 |
| jba | am a bit dissapointed I didn't get to meet you at udu, but my timing seemed a little off | 03:36 |
| jdub | thanks jba | 03:37 |
| jdub | tseng: ahr | 03:37 |
| tseng | jba: i met him, you didnt miss much | 03:37 |
| tseng | :P | 03:38 |
| jdub | ha ha | 03:38 |
| jba | tseng, hehe | 03:38 |
| jba | actually so far the only oss hacker I've met in real life that I knew from online world is james henstridge | 03:38 |
| jba | and that's cause i went to the wrong BOF | 03:38 |
| jba | was still interesting | 03:38 |
| jba | maybe it's better that way ?? ;) | 03:39 |
| tseng | jdub: so the word is, within the next few months we will have a non-xattr fallback for beagle | 03:41 |
| tseng | jdub: so it doesnt smoke crack on nfs and tmpfs | 03:41 |
| tseng | jdub: im still not sure what the effect would be if we put beagle in -desktop and it wound up on a livecd | 03:41 |
| tseng | jdub: http://lists.debian.org/debian-wnpp/2005/04/msg00550.html btw | 03:43 |
| |QuaD- | tseng: i noticed all of mono is in the repos, how come we can't install it yet? whats missing | 03:57 |
| tseng | |QuaD-: cant install what? | 03:57 |
| tseng | gtk-sharp is broken, libgnomedb needs built with new libgda, then maybe gtk-sharp built again | 03:57 |
| tseng | do you have an amd64 by chance? | 03:58 |
| |QuaD- | oh | 03:58 |
| toresbe | a lot of Ubuntu devs going to debconf? | 03:58 |
| |QuaD- | nope, not yet, in june i am building a dual opteron | 03:58 |
| tseng | then could you please just be patient and let me sort things out | 03:58 |
| |QuaD- | tseng: hahah, yeah, i was just curious :) | 03:59 |
| === jba thinks of request to ask of tseng, just to tick him off ;) | ||
| jdub | tseng: elite! | 04:04 |
| tseng | jdub: BUT WAIT, THERES MORE | 04:05 |
| jdub | tseng: i wonder if they're going to use ._blah like apple did for tiger? :) | 04:05 |
| tseng | jdub: http://www.go-mono.com/archive/1.1.7/ < beagle x3 | 04:05 |
| jdub | tseng: september... gar. | 04:06 |
| tseng | it doesnt matter, we can track it same as gnome | 04:06 |
| jdub | whoa | 04:06 |
| tseng | yes? | 04:06 |
| jdub | if we get it approved as a feature goal and are allowed to track it | 04:07 |
| tseng | my spec was approved | 04:07 |
| tseng | which involved moving the whole stack to main | 04:07 |
| Lathiat | wow, the new i/o layer sounds sweet | 04:07 |
| ajmitch_ | lots of new crack in main | 04:07 |
| jdub | tseng: but doesn't necessarily cover post-UVF updates | 04:08 |
| tseng | when is uvh | 04:08 |
| jabra | I am wondering what the differnce for packages build for ubuntu compared to those built for debian | 04:08 |
| tseng | august? | 04:08 |
| tseng | jabra: the version string? | 04:08 |
| jabra | that it? | 04:08 |
| tseng | yes | 04:09 |
| jdub | http://udu.wiki.ubuntu.com/ReleaseCycle | 04:09 |
| jba | tseng, actually using multiverse/mallirat and tring to install gstreamer0.8-lame i had issues with dependencies on libc | 04:09 |
| tseng | and we stab people who dont put patches in debian/ and use diff.gz | 04:09 |
| jba | synaptic said it deped on a version of libc that wasn't any of repos at all | 04:09 |
| tseng | jba: whats that have to do with anything? its assumed you dont have binary compatibility between dists guaranteed | 04:10 |
| tseng | or it should be | 04:10 |
| tseng | gstreamer-lame would be nice to have in multiverse | 04:10 |
| tseng | do we get jail time for that? | 04:11 |
| jba | tseng, yeah i assumed that the gstreamer08-lame that was referenced by the haory mp3 howto on the wiki would be installable as the howto said | 04:11 |
| jba | but it wasn't | 04:11 |
| jba | i'll find the howto | 04:11 |
| tseng | I dont much care, its a wiki | 04:11 |
| tseng | the interested party (you) is meant to maintain it | 04:11 |
| jba | tseng, not bitching, just syaing that there is a little diff | 04:12 |
| jba | in response to jabra | 04:12 |
| tseng | the question was about packaging, not binary compatibility | 04:12 |
| tseng | pulling things built against debian and expecting them to work is silly | 04:13 |
| jabra | I am asking in #debian-devel too | 04:14 |
| jabra | it is the issue of building one deb | 04:14 |
| tseng | um | 04:14 |
| jabra | and I am wondering if I build it for ubuntu if that could be accepted into debian | 04:15 |
| jabra | rather than having to make changes | 04:15 |
| tseng | youd have to change the changelog | 04:15 |
| jabra | and making a different deb | 04:15 |
| jabra | ok | 04:15 |
| jabra | other than that? | 04:15 |
| tseng | youd have to test building it on both | 04:15 |
| tseng | naturally | 04:15 |
| Lathiat | hmm, g-v-m has borked, bugger | 04:15 |
| jabra | right | 04:16 |
| tseng | I do this for f-spot | 04:17 |
| Nafallo | tseng: you want me to test more tonight? :-) | 04:18 |
| tseng | Nafallo: no nice work | 04:19 |
| tseng | thanks alot | 04:19 |
| Nafallo | tseng: I will implement a real testing environment after I get some sleep :-). | 04:21 |
| tseng | ok rock on | 04:21 |
| tseng | *hopefully* the rest will wrap up tommorow | 04:21 |
| tseng | ill fix mono now before sleep | 04:21 |
| Nafallo | goodnight people :-) | 04:21 |
| tseng | bye | 04:21 |
| Nafallo | bye | 04:21 |
| Lathiat | ooh, tomboy stopped crashing, woo | 04:22 |
| tseng | it did. | 04:27 |
| Burgundavia | jdub, did you see this? http://steelgryphon.com/blog/?p=46 | 04:28 |
| tseng | dude he totally stole my boogs | 04:29 |
| tseng | or i stole his. | 04:29 |
| jdub | Burgundavia: please make sure thom sees it :) | 04:31 |
| === dilinger looks at openafs and considers patchbombing hartmans and upstream | ||
| Burgundavia | jdub, saw it on planet.moz, I imagine he will see it | 04:32 |
| Burgundavia | jdub, thom@ ? | 04:33 |
| bluefoxicy | tseng: got any zar-like utils that are GPL and work on FAT/NTFS/ext23/xfs? | 04:33 |
| jdub | thom@ubuntu.com - thanks :) | 04:33 |
| tseng | bluefoxicy: i have a pillow like tool, i think im going to sleep on it. | 04:33 |
| bluefoxicy | tseng: need something I can point at a drive that's been mkfs'd and get the files back | 04:33 |
| bluefoxicy | dammit. Everything I'm finding (even the cool shit on the Helix livecd) is closed source | 04:34 |
| Lathiat | bluefoxicy: what file system? | 04:34 |
| Burgundavia | jdub, done | 04:34 |
| bluefoxicy | Lathiat: ? Target or what does what support? | 04:35 |
| Lathiat | reiserfs is good for gettin data back when you do stupid shit like that, i learn that the other day. :) | 04:35 |
| bluefoxicy | Lathiat: I'm just wondering about GPL recovery utils. Have you tried Helix' windows programs? | 04:35 |
| Lathiat | blno i mean, what filesytem di dyou screw up | 04:35 |
| bluefoxicy | Lathiat: I dunno, once in a while a customer comes in missing files :D | 04:35 |
| Lathiat | if you lose data on reiser, you can run a reiserfsck --rebuild-tree -S and it finds all the files it can and relinks them, but you dont really want to do it on a filesystem you want to keep. :) | 04:36 |
| Lathiat | cus it may eat your other data, and probably will. :) | 04:36 |
| bluefoxicy | heh | 04:36 |
| bluefoxicy | mainly after fat and ntfs | 04:36 |
| bluefoxicy | though a wide, wide range is good always. | 04:36 |
| Lathiat | i recommend a backup solution. :) | 04:37 |
| bluefoxicy | it's too late when people come into a best buy asking for data recovery due to windows eating itself :S | 04:37 |
| bluefoxicy | http://z-a-recovery.com/ <-- these fools can do it, and there's another tool that comes on Helix that can do it with FAT/NTFS/EXT2/EXT3/ReiserFS | 04:38 |
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| Lathiat | woo, avahi is shaping up | 04:56 |
| Lathiat | jdub: :) | 04:56 |
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| jsgotangco | hello | 05:41 |
| dilinger | here's some mako poetry | 05:43 |
| dilinger | http://www.acm.rpi.edu/~dilinger/sloth/pics/2005_udu/IMG_0266.JPG | 05:43 |
| jsgotangco | hehehehe i saw that | 05:44 |
| dilinger | (i wouldn't waste your time on the rest of the pics, i suck at taking pictures) | 05:44 |
| cc | is there a way to capture the installation? like pass an option so that a Hoary install can be sent to a vnc listner? | 05:44 |
| jsgotangco | i like the "we create a synergistic system" piece | 05:45 |
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| jsgotangco | dude you took pics of your hotel bathroom heh | 05:49 |
| jsgotangco | ok got it thanks | 05:50 |
| dilinger | i was all giddy | 05:50 |
| bob2 | haha | 05:50 |
| dilinger | it took so long to get access to the damned room.. :P | 05:50 |
| jsgotangco | tell me about it i got my room after lunch | 05:50 |
| bob2 | spiv: those magnets were the best idea, ever | 05:50 |
| dilinger | jsgotangco: so did i. and i got faked out w/ the wrong room/card before lunch.. | 05:50 |
| spiv | bob2: Thanks :) | 05:52 |
| spiv | bob2: I'll try to remember to bring them to the next conf too. | 05:52 |
| dilinger | http://www.acm.rpi.edu/~dilinger/sloth/pics/2005_udu/IMG_0318.JPG | 05:56 |
| dilinger | that was a good one. you don't see that in the US | 05:56 |
| HrdwrBoB | dilinger: they're all over the place here | 05:57 |
| dilinger | if someone tried to do that in the US, people would get up in arms about encouraging drug use or something equally as stupid | 05:58 |
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| jsgotangco | AndyFitz, hey | 06:00 |
| dilinger | http://www.acm.rpi.edu/~dilinger/sloth/pics/2005_udu/IMG_0289.JPG | 06:00 |
| dilinger | and that is a great name | 06:00 |
| AndyFitz | g;day jsgotangco | 06:01 |
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| ajmitch_ | afternoon andy | 06:02 |
| ajmitch_ | heh, the pants sign | 06:02 |
| AndyFitz | afternoon ajmitch. | 06:07 |
| bluefoxicy | So before I sleep, this one's not for the bugzilla right? | 06:11 |
| bluefoxicy | After much googling i discover that there are no tools similar to PC Inspector File recovery or Zero Assumption Recovery (wow, descriptive name) that fall under GPL | 06:12 |
| mako | dilinger: oh man. i love magnetic poetry | 06:12 |
| bluefoxicy | so someone should make one, so I need to find people interested and I need to find docs about FAT, NTFS, and EXT2/3 to start with | 06:13 |
| jsgotangco | heh | 06:13 |
| jsgotangco | mako, hi | 06:13 |
| bluefoxicy | basically my options are find docs and write code myself, aren't they? | 06:13 |
| bluefoxicy | 'cause there's no bugzilla for programs that don't exist | 06:13 |
| mako | "mission a r y" thing was brillance | 06:15 |
| jsgotangco | i guess you can't separate sex with the office then thats why it had that word | 06:16 |
| jsgotangco | brb lunch | 06:17 |
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| jsgotangco | man my opera house pic suck | 06:21 |
| mako | jsgotangco: dude, you give me ANY set of magnetic poetry and i guarentee i can make a dirty poem out of it :) | 06:21 |
| jsgotangco | haha | 06:23 |
| crimsun | I thought that's the whole purpose of alphabet magnets | 06:24 |
| AndyFitz | I'm sure the makers are well aware of that | 06:24 |
| AndyFitz | hehe where else would the fun be | 06:24 |
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| tseng | dholbach: ! | 06:54 |
| dholbach | hey | 06:54 |
| tseng | up for testing? | 06:55 |
| Burgundavia | If I want to get a font into Ubuntu/Debian, what licence must it be under? | 06:55 |
| Lathiat | tseng: im up for testing | 06:55 |
| tseng | Lathiat: do you have an amd64? | 06:55 |
| Lathiat | oh, no | 06:56 |
| Lathiat | i could boot a qemu runnign x86-64 but | 06:56 |
| Lathiat | and i have access to an opteron | 06:56 |
| Lathiat | so i could | 06:56 |
| Lathiat | testing what? | 06:56 |
| tseng | a build | 06:56 |
| Lathiat | of? | 06:56 |
| tseng | of mono | 06:56 |
| dholbach | tseng: did you get a pbuilder set up? | 06:56 |
| calc | Burgundavia: email debian-devel or debian-legal to ask wrt debian | 06:56 |
| tseng | dholbach: on x86 I do | 06:56 |
| === calc bbl | ||
| dholbach | tseng: for breezy? | 06:57 |
| tseng | yes | 06:57 |
| dholbach | hrm | 06:57 |
| tseng | i upgraded a hoary one | 06:57 |
| Burgundavia | I am about to start talks regarding a new font for inuktitut and I am wondering what the minimum is | 06:57 |
| tseng | anyway, im getting tired of testing amd64 stuff right on the buildd | 06:57 |
| dholbach | mine tries to set up {gcc,g++,cpp}-4.0 and dies with problems in there | 06:57 |
| dholbach | if i get the pbuilder working, i, i'm happy to test-build it here | 06:58 |
| tseng | well, there is a bit of logic that sets different confflags for amd | 06:58 |
| tseng | it worked before, now it doesnt | 06:58 |
| tseng | only difference is a bit of whitespace | 06:58 |
| tseng | a tab at the end of a line | 06:58 |
| Lathiat | is this in autoconf? whitespace in autoconf fucks everything | 06:59 |
| tseng | its make | 06:59 |
| Lathiat | ah | 06:59 |
| tseng | debian/rules | 06:59 |
| tseng | dholbach: basically, get the latest mono source in breezy, remove the whitespace in ifeq statement in rules, and see if it ftbfs still | 07:03 |
| dholbach | when i get the pbuilder working, yes | 07:03 |
| tseng | ok | 07:04 |
| tseng | thanks | 07:04 |
| === hunger_ [~hunger@p54A667E1.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| dholbach | tseng: ok... starting all over, trying to set up a hoary one first | 07:14 |
| tseng | ok | 07:14 |
| tseng | then --override-configs update to breezy | 07:15 |
| === Z3K3 [~z3k3@static-209-91-186-89.vianet.ca] has left #ubuntu-devel ["Leaving"] | ||
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| dholbach | mako: ping | 07:33 |
| === Burgundavia [~corey@24.68.129.104] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
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| mako | dholbach: hey dude | 07:36 |
| mako | whats up | 07:36 |
| dholbach | when is the next CC meeting? :-) | 07:36 |
| mako | dholbach: tuesday | 07:36 |
| mako | dholbach: not sure of the time | 07:36 |
| dholbach | tritium just needs CC approval for MOTUness | 07:36 |
| === mako nods | ||
| dholbach | and there are a lot of other guys who want to join the member crew :-) | 07:37 |
| tritium | thanks for remembering, dholbach :) | 07:37 |
| mako | i know | 07:37 |
| mako | it's gonna be a long meeting | 07:37 |
| mako | mdz and i talked about it today | 07:37 |
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| === dholbach nods | ||
| mako | tuesday is the day | 07:37 |
| mako | i'll figure out the time and announce i tomorrow | 07:38 |
| dholbach | i can give you the list of guys, i absolutely vouch for... member-wise | 07:38 |
| dholbach | (if that helps) | 07:38 |
| infinity | dholbach : Ooo, oo, vouch for me! | 07:38 |
| tseng | me next, me next | 07:38 |
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| dholbach | hrm, pbuilder is fine now | 07:41 |
| dholbach | but 'debuild -S' keeps hanging at fakeroot debian/rules clean | 07:41 |
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| === dholbach wonders, what's going wrong | ||
| === Burgundavia [~corey@24.68.129.104] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| === Burgundavia [~corey@24.68.129.104] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| === lamont sleeps | ||
| fabbione | morning | 07:44 |
| tseng | hi fabbione. | 07:45 |
| dholbach | hey fabbione | 07:45 |
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| === Burgundavia [~corey@24.68.129.104] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| jsgotangco | hmmm | 07:47 |
| === Burgundavia [~corey@24.68.129.104] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| Amaranth | d'oh | 07:48 |
| Amaranth | breezy gets mono 1.1.6 and 1.1.7 comes out | 07:48 |
| tseng | breezy doesnt have anything yet, everyone chill out | 07:48 |
| Amaranth | heh | 07:48 |
| Amaranth | well, breezy got it from sid | 07:48 |
| tseng | uh | 07:49 |
| tseng | not at all | 07:49 |
| Amaranth | oh, those are still in experimental for debian? | 07:49 |
| tseng | some are | 07:49 |
| tseng | some are in ~ | 07:49 |
| dholbach | Amaranth: don't tell the MONO MASTER what he has done ;-) | 07:50 |
| tseng | ive decided to start posting status on the blog to avoid repeated questioning | 07:50 |
| jsgotangco | hey dholbach | 07:50 |
| jsgotangco | hey tseng | 07:50 |
| tseng | about "zomg mono is built why isnt app XYZ here yet" | 07:50 |
| dholbach | jsgotangco: jerome, how are you? | 07:50 |
| tseng | jsgotangco: sup dude? | 07:50 |
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| Amaranth | tseng: heh, you must get that a lot :) | 07:50 |
| tseng | Amaranth: only in 3 or 4 channels | 07:51 |
| Amaranth | i'm happy with 1.1.6, i don't plan on using beagle | 07:51 |
| Amaranth | btw, thank you | 07:51 |
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| jsgotangco | dholbach, tseng, I just came from lunch at KFC, its nice to eat junk food after our weeklong stint with real food | 07:51 |
| tseng | jsgotangco: hah, yes! | 07:51 |
| dholbach | ;-) | 07:51 |
| tseng | jsgotangco: ive had burritos 3 days in a row now | 07:51 |
| tseng | to make up | 07:51 |
| jsgotangco | haha i wont eat salad for a while | 07:51 |
| tseng | that green leafy stuff was bogus | 07:51 |
| dholbach | :-) | 07:52 |
| tseng | i wouldnt go so far as to call it salad | 07:52 |
| jsgotangco | i reckon we could have been more productive if we had pizza at least | 07:52 |
| tseng | we had pizza at work today, i ate too much | 07:52 |
| aj | the salt and pepper calamari at the place next to UDU was yummy | 07:52 |
| tseng | hm the cafe on the corner? | 07:52 |
| aj | the pub right next door, i think | 07:52 |
| tseng | i got a strange burger from there, it was on flat bread | 07:52 |
| jsgotangco | i got some good stuff from the cafe at the center of the park | 07:53 |
| tseng | hm they were always busy when i went by | 07:53 |
| === ajmitch_ never went there, sadly | ||
| dholbach | did anyone run into "fakeroot debian/rules clean" hanging (when using debuild), after an upgrade to breezy? | 07:54 |
| ajmitch_ | nope | 07:55 |
| === jsgotangco will upgrade to breezy in a few days after finishing kubuntu docs | ||
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| crimsun | Kamion: just a heads-up, with debootstrap_0.2.45ubuntu33 (built on Hoary) and pbuilder_0.127 (installed on Hoary), a Breezy pbuilder can't be created yet on amd64 | 08:06 |
| crimsun | Kamion: it loops trying to configure cpp > cpp-4.0 > gcc > gcc-4.0,cpp-4.0 ; g++ > gcc ... | 08:09 |
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| Burgundavia | for legal stuff, is mako the best person to ask? | 08:19 |
| dholbach | elmo could help you as well | 08:19 |
| Burgundavia | ok | 08:20 |
| Burgundavia | where does elmo live? | 08:20 |
| Burgundavia | he likely to be awake right now? | 08:20 |
| dholbach | but there are lots of opinions in here, just go ahead and ask the question :-) | 08:20 |
| jba | nemo ? | 08:20 |
| Burgundavia | I want to get an inuktitut font into main | 08:20 |
| Burgundavia | to be distributed as part of ubuntu | 08:21 |
| Burgundavia | as part of the larger project involving translation | 08:21 |
| Burgundavia | what are the legal requirements of said font | 08:21 |
| Burgundavia | s/legal/licencing | 08:21 |
| dholbach | does it have a license? | 08:21 |
| dholbach | (distributed with it) | 08:21 |
| Burgundavia | negatory | 08:22 |
| Burgundavia | currently freely downloadable | 08:22 |
| Burgundavia | but unknown on redistribution | 08:22 |
| Burgundavia | before I ask, I want to know what I should be asking for | 08:22 |
| dholbach | couldn't you propose any of the licenses of other font-packages in main to upstream? | 08:23 |
| Burgundavia | sure | 08:23 |
| tseng | look at bistream vera maybe | 08:23 |
| tseng | http://www.gnome.org/fonts/#Final_Bitstream_Vera_Fonts | 08:23 |
| Burgundavia | cool; | 08:24 |
| Burgundavia | ok | 08:24 |
| Burgundavia | thanks | 08:24 |
| tseng | that might not be the most open | 08:25 |
| tseng | but its distributed by everyone these days | 08:25 |
| Burgundavia | I am looking for minimum level right now | 08:25 |
| Burgundavia | as I am expecting the maker (a gov) not to understand our requirement | 08:25 |
| Burgundavia | thanks | 08:30 |
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| === mvo [~egon@ip181.135.1511I-CUD12K-01.ish.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
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| dholbac1 | GRR, my box just cracked and 'rebooted' | 08:36 |
| dholbac1 | mvo: good morning | 08:36 |
| mvo | hey dholbac1 | 08:37 |
| === dholbac1 is now known as dholbach | ||
| mvo | morning all | 08:37 |
| mvirkkil | morning | 08:38 |
| Kamion | crimsun: ok, doesn't really surprise me though, breezy only became debootstrappable *at all* a day or two ago | 08:41 |
| Kamion | Burgundavia: both the Debian and Ubuntu web sites have pages on their licensing policies | 08:41 |
| Burgundavia | Kamion, cheers, thanks | 08:42 |
| Kamion | http://www.debian.org/social_contract#guidelines | 08:42 |
| Kamion | if you meet that, you'll satisfy Ubuntu requirements too | 08:43 |
| Burgundavia | ok | 08:43 |
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| Burgundavia | by the DFSG, is the gnome font licence for bitstream vera really free? | 08:50 |
| mjg59 | Yes | 08:51 |
| mjg59 | There's no DFSG requirement for something to be distributable on its own | 08:51 |
| Burgundavia | ah | 08:51 |
| Burgundavia | ok | 08:51 |
| mjg59 | (This was needed to make the Artistic license free) | 08:51 |
| Burgundavia | as I reread, I see it now | 08:51 |
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| === JaneW [~JaneW@wbs-146-141-174.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| jsgotangco | JaneW: hello | 09:07 |
| JaneW | hi jsg | 09:07 |
| JaneW | (forgive the contraction - you have a long nick) | 09:08 |
| jsgotangco | i don't mind | 09:08 |
| Mithrandir | JaneW: tabcompletion is nice, though | 09:08 |
| jsg | i own jsg as well anyway | 09:08 |
| jsg | :) | 09:09 |
| === JaneW smiles at jsgotangco | ||
| jsg | how have you been | 09:09 |
| JaneW | (I like to be contrary) | 09:09 |
| JaneW | Mithrandir: I don;t seem to have tab completion (using x-chat) | 09:09 |
| === jani [~jani@iv.ro] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| JaneW | jsg: well thanks, finally waking up again, I have been in a daze since UDU | 09:10 |
| Burgundavia | JaneW, what are you using? xchat as always had so for me | 09:10 |
| === JaneW tries again ... Mithrandir | ||
| JaneW | ok, it works when you know how ;) | 09:11 |
| jsg | I've just recovered...i don't understand myself I've always been sleeping a lot lately i guess i've been pretty busy | 09:11 |
| Burgundavia | indeed | 09:11 |
| JaneW | jsg: I cant get enough sleep, and I am having the WEIRDEST dreams | 09:11 |
| jsg | hmm | 09:11 |
| jsg | Mentos mutants perhaps? | 09:12 |
| === jvw_ is now known as jvw | ||
| Simira | hehe | 09:14 |
| JaneW | jsg: don;t joke I actaully brought a handful back - for the kids, but they are scaring me ;) | 09:14 |
| JaneW | scaring/scarring whatever both work | 09:15 |
| jsg | *grin* | 09:15 |
| infinity | Oh, no wonder I'm feeling a bit flat/sick this week. | 09:17 |
| infinity | Mentos whitdrawal. It all makes sense. | 09:17 |
| infinity | s/whit/with/ | 09:17 |
| jsg | i feel the same way | 09:18 |
| Lathiat | heh | 09:18 |
| === JaneW tosses one in the general direction of Melborne | ||
| mjg59 | Last night I dreamt I was a wireless router | 09:19 |
| infinity | I've been incredibly unproductive since getting back... Which just means working twice as long (or twice as smart!) next week. Oh well. | 09:19 |
| mjg59 | I feel better this morning | 09:19 |
| infinity | JaneW : I'm trying to kick the habit, thanks. I think it's for the best. One morning at UDU, I think I had 3 or 4 bowls to myself in the space of 2 BoFs. | 09:20 |
| JaneW | infinity: aaarrrgh! | 09:20 |
| mdz | mako: I didn't realize ututo-e was based on gentoo | 09:20 |
| Amaranth | 3 or 4 bowls of Mentos? Either we're talking about different things or your breath was mighty fresh. | 09:21 |
| jsg | i wasn't able to get a decent photo of the opera house | 09:21 |
| jsg | we had a crappy tour guide | 09:21 |
| JaneW | jsg: it didn't help that the windows were tinted | 09:23 |
| mjg59 | Amaranth: There were fruit-flavoured ones as well | 09:23 |
| JaneW | jsg: we weren't going to get to see it at all - until I begged that they do a detour on the way to the movie... | 09:23 |
| infinity | Amaranth : Mentos fruit flavour. | 09:24 |
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| jsg | if we were two weeks in sydney, we're all doomed with the mentos, redbull and pepsi max | 09:26 |
| mjg59 | I'm now entirely unused to the idea of having to make my own food | 09:26 |
| mjg59 | I keep expecting there to be trays of it around the place | 09:26 |
| jsg | lol | 09:26 |
| Amaranth | red bull is killer | 09:27 |
| jsg | Amaranth: yeah, the can had this warning not to take more than 2 cans a day | 09:27 |
| Amaranth | it's even worse mixed with beer or liquor | 09:27 |
| JaneW | btw cvd arranged that red bull | 09:27 |
| Amaranth | heh, i used to drink a 6-pack a day | 09:27 |
| dholbach | aaargh | 09:28 |
| jsg | when you pour redbull in a glass it looks so much like beer | 09:28 |
| Amaranth | couldn't see straight if drank too fast | 09:28 |
| Amaranth | everything started wobbling | 09:28 |
| mjg59 | It was banned in France | 09:29 |
| mjg59 | No idea if that's still the case | 09:29 |
| dholbach | redbull is evil stuff... jellygums resolved in weird chemicals | 09:30 |
| === Simira regrets missing UDU | ||
| Simira | JaneW: so, how did you manage to get yourself into this mess? | 09:32 |
| dholbach | are there any pictures up yet? i know of galleries of jblack and tseng | 09:32 |
| Simira | dholbach: Mithrandir's are up... let's see | 09:33 |
| jsg | i haven't checked tseng's gallery yet | 09:33 |
| dholbach | where where where? :-) | 09:33 |
| Simira | http://www.err.no/pictures/2005-04-30/ | 09:33 |
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| Simira | and http://www.err.no/pictures/2005-05-03/ | 09:34 |
| jsg | oooo | 09:34 |
| mdz | Simira: oh god, what an awful picture of me | 09:35 |
| === Amaranth looks | ||
| Lathiat | haha | 09:35 |
| Simira | mdz: Yes, I made that comment too when I saw it ;p | 09:35 |
| Simira | I mean - awful, like in a Ubuntu way. | 09:36 |
| jsg | hehee | 09:36 |
| mdz | it's like I'm blinking, talking and swallowing all at the same time | 09:37 |
| Lathiat | heh crazy photos of daniels as usual | 09:37 |
| jsg | pia looks pissed | 09:37 |
| Simira | all in all - Ubuntu crowd pics. :p | 09:37 |
| dholbach | wow there are pictures of jdub where he looks kind of normal, cool :-) | 09:37 |
| Lathiat | i met a few really cool pics | 09:38 |
| Lathiat | dhhahaha yeh | 09:38 |
| Simira | huh? Where? | 09:38 |
| Lathiat | pics? oh man | 09:38 |
| Simira | gotta take them away! | 09:38 |
| Lathiat | my brain need to be rpeplaced | 09:38 |
| Lathiat | *met a few really cool people | 09:38 |
| Simira | Lathiat: yes. You're a community person? What do you do in Ubuntu? | 09:38 |
| Treenaks | any people here who know upstream HAL a bit? | 09:39 |
| Lathiat | Simira: im not a community person | 09:39 |
| Lathiat | i dont really do anythign for ubuntu at the moment | 09:39 |
| Lathiat | apart from convince lots of people ot use it. :) | 09:39 |
| Lathiat | ive done bits and peices for gome in the past and am working on network service discovery stuff at the moment (mdns-sd/rendezvous) | 09:40 |
| Simira | Lathiat: Ok. Gnome/Debian stuff? | 09:41 |
| dholbach | Treenaks: pitti and ogra will | 09:41 |
| Simira | Lathiat: hangaround, eh? Almost like me ;p | 09:41 |
| Lathiat | heh | 09:41 |
| Treenaks | dholbach: ok, and I guess they're not up yet :) | 09:41 |
| Simira | Lathiat: you're from .au? | 09:41 |
| Amaranth | http://www.err.no/pictures/2005-04-30/medium/dsc00770.jpg <--who is that? | 09:41 |
| Lathiat | Simira: yep, perth | 09:42 |
| Lathiat | Amaranth: anthony towns (aj) | 09:42 |
| Treenaks | Amaranth: going by the hackergotchi, I'd say AJ | 09:42 |
| === Lathiat nods at Treenaks | ||
| === Amaranth giggles | ||
| JaneW | Simira: I don;t know... | 09:42 |
| Treenaks | hackergotchis are useful! | 09:42 |
| Treenaks | (though I didn't recognise jdub the first time around ;)) | 09:43 |
| === JaneW is still trying to get pictures up... resorting to webshots now | ||
| Lathiat | robert loves hackrgotchi looks very different to hi | 09:43 |
| Lathiat | m, at least i think so | 09:43 |
| Amaranth | yeah, jdub looks nothing like his hackergotchi | 09:43 |
| jsg | its becausehe doesn't have any hair back then | 09:44 |
| JaneW | beanbag! :) | 09:44 |
| Simira | JaneW: poor you ;) What do you do in the distroteam? Anything fun,or just holding back the guys by their ears? | 09:44 |
| jsg | she's the slave driver | 09:44 |
| Simira | :D Sounds good | 09:44 |
| JaneW | Simira: I like the ears idea... | 09:45 |
| chmj | hey, don't give her ideas | 09:45 |
| JaneW | where were the balloons | 09:45 |
| jsg | chmj: hehe | 09:45 |
| JaneW | chmj: why cos yours are closest? | 09:46 |
| Simira | JaneW: I know they might need it sometimes. I was in Matar.... | 09:46 |
| Simira | JaneW: where are you located? UK? | 09:47 |
| chmj | JaneW: yes | 09:48 |
| === Micksa_ is now known as Micksa | ||
| mdz | I've been spoiled by the UDU wiki; I no longer have patience for www.ubuntu.com/wiki | 09:53 |
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| dholbach | WikiTransition! now! :-) | 09:54 |
| Mithrandir | JaneW: the balloons were from LCA. | 09:56 |
| Mithrandir | JaneW: we used them to send glasses of wine around. Mucho fun. | 09:56 |
| bob2 | and to help colin | 09:57 |
| Mithrandir | yeah. His hair was heavy. | 09:57 |
| JaneW | Mithrandir, cool | 09:57 |
| Mithrandir | almost as heavy as a wine glass, iirc. | 09:57 |
| JaneW | Simira: no, Cape Town, SA | 09:58 |
| bob2 | haha | 09:58 |
| JaneW | can I put a link to those pics on the wiki? | 09:58 |
| dholbach | JaneW: which wiki? the canonical internal one? | 09:58 |
| JaneW | mdz: I also preferred the UDU wiki | 09:59 |
| JaneW | dholbach: yes, the photos - pretty page | 09:59 |
| jsg | *groan* | 09:59 |
| === dholbach wants to have access as well :-) | ||
| === Simira too | ||
| === jsg too wants to see pretty pics | ||
| Mithrandir | just put the links to the galleries somewhere on either one of the public ones. | 10:00 |
| Simira | #ubuntu-devel is fine with me :) | 10:01 |
| bob2 | hah | 10:02 |
| Simira | talking of wiki... have/can/will you fix the ubuntu.no-wiki for me, Mithrandir? | 10:02 |
| Simira | bob2: nice pic of you by Tollef :) | 10:02 |
| Mithrandir | Simira: sure; this evening? | 10:02 |
| Simira | Mithrandir: mmokey, then | 10:03 |
| Simira | oops | 10:03 |
| === Simira pushed a lot of buttons, and got a lot of emails | ||
| bob2 | Simira: hah, it's terrible | 10:04 |
| bob2 | Simira: make tollef take the "make everyone look ugly" filter off his camera before he goes away next time | 10:05 |
| JaneW | hehe | 10:05 |
| Mithrandir | bob2: http://err.no/pictures/2005-04-30/slides/dsc00800.html is nice, though | 10:05 |
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| Mithrandir | bob2: helix liked it too. ;) | 10:06 |
| Simira | bob2: I don't think it's his camera... It might have something to do with those people... I don't know for sure | 10:06 |
| bob2 | Simira: BAH | 10:06 |
| Simira | ;p | 10:06 |
| jsg | nice shot | 10:06 |
| bob2 | Mithrandir: you were lucky to take a photo during the five seconds I was smiling all week | 10:06 |
| Simira | bob2: I'll take the pictures nect time :) | 10:07 |
| bob2 | Simira: yay | 10:07 |
| mjg59 | bob2: I'm almost feeling well again! | 10:07 |
| Mithrandir | mjg59: you whipped yourself with a few cat5 cables to get rid of the wireless feeling? | 10:07 |
| Simira | Mithrandir!!! | 10:07 |
| Simira | Wash your thoughts! | 10:07 |
| Mithrandir | Simira: I'm considering getting a digital SLR. | 10:07 |
| Mithrandir | Simira: hey, he said he did dream of being a wlan router | 10:08 |
| Simira | Mithrandir: yes, and nothing of cable whipping. What do you need an SLR for? | 10:08 |
| bob2 | mjg59: yay! | 10:08 |
| Robot101 | mjg59: wahey, to the pub-mobile! :) | 10:09 |
| Mithrandir | Simira: well, whipping oneself with cables should rid one of the wireless feeling, at least. | 10:09 |
| Mithrandir | Simira: SLR? Take pictures, of course. | 10:09 |
| mjg59 | Robot101: Not until you've finished your PROJECT | 10:09 |
| Robot101 | mjg59: HNNRGGGHHHHH | 10:09 |
| mjg59 | Haha | 10:09 |
| bob2 | Simira: it's not about "need", it's about "shiny" | 10:09 |
| JaneW | those photos are really good | 10:09 |
| Simira | bob2: he's got me | 10:09 |
| Robot101 | mjg59: I made it almost work yesterday, all I need to do now is add another 8 or 9 syscalls and then write the other half of it, which should be easy | 10:09 |
| Simira | JaneW: hey, where are yours? | 10:10 |
| Robot101 | mjg59: it's tempting to write it in perl, but I think my supervisor would... kill me :D | 10:10 |
| mjg59 | Robot101: Excellent, you'll be finished by Sunday and we can go to the pub! | 10:10 |
| Lathiat | Robot101: what project is this? | 10:10 |
| bob2 | Simira: exactly | 10:10 |
| Simira | Mithrandir: you have a digicam | 10:10 |
| Mithrandir | Simira: yes, a compact one. It sucks in little light and such. | 10:10 |
| Robot101 | mjg59: oh, no. then I have to write the dissertation, which is what I get the marks for. | 10:10 |
| Robot101 | mjg59: rowenio suggests I stop coding and just lie in the dissertation | 10:11 |
| infinity | Mithrandir : Get a 20D, so I'll have one more person to consider stealing from at the next conference. | 10:11 |
| Simira | Mithrandir: that's because you got a lousy cam :p Besides, you wouldn't bring a SLR anywhere, either | 10:11 |
| Robot101 | Lathiat: filesystem modification monitoring crack - ned.ucam.org/~robot101/proposal.pdf | 10:11 |
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| === infinity looks sadly at his now obsolete 300D. | ||
| Mithrandir | Simira: I would. | 10:11 |
| JaneW | Simira: still trying to upload them, but they are awful compared to those... old useless camera, old useless operator | 10:11 |
| Simira | JaneW: aww | 10:11 |
| === calc [~ccheney@ip70-185-4-246.ma.dl.cox.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| Mithrandir | infinity: I'm more of a nikon person. | 10:12 |
| Simira | JaneW: I'd need a pic of you. Tollef got Claire(right spelled?) but no Jane. | 10:12 |
| JaneW | nod *grin* | 10:12 |
| jsg | i only have one group photo the one from jblack | 10:12 |
| Simira | Mithrandir: well, if you want that for your birthday, you have to put some more money on my account. | 10:13 |
| Mithrandir | Simira: I didn't say I wanted you to buy me one, I said I considered getting one. :) | 10:13 |
| Mithrandir | Simira: and besides, if I took pictures of all the gals, I figured you'd be jealous or something. ;) | 10:13 |
| === Mithrandir hides | ||
| Simira | Mithrandir: bah. You just want to use the money yourself, instead of giving them to me. | 10:14 |
| jsg | i haven't seen any pics of adi | 10:14 |
| Simira | Mithrandir: you mean I should have a reason to? | 10:14 |
| Mithrandir | Simira: nah, just teasing you | 10:14 |
| JaneW | jsg: I dodn;t get one either | 10:15 |
| JaneW | didn't | 10:15 |
| Simira | Mithrandir: shouldn't you work on your assignment now? | 10:15 |
| jsg | :( | 10:15 |
| Mithrandir | Simira: I should | 10:15 |
| === Simira considers if she should eat some chocolate | ||
| infinity | Mithrandir : I was more of a Pentax person until I got the 300D. The value at the time was hard to pass up. | 10:16 |
| Treenaks | I'm getting the 350D | 10:17 |
| Mithrandir | the 300D is dirt cheap, though | 10:17 |
| Treenaks | Mithrandir: because the 350D has succeeded it | 10:18 |
| infinity | I got it for 700 USD almost a year and a half ago now. | 10:18 |
| infinity | It was a pretty decent value at the time, given the price of everything else. | 10:18 |
| Treenaks | also, the 300D is crippled, the 350D isn't (or less) | 10:18 |
| Mithrandir | I'm just a bit wary of buying Nikon ATM due to their _silly_ policy wrt documentation of the RAW format. | 10:19 |
| infinity | Adobe's been trying to push manufacturers toward an open RAW format, but I dunno how well they're doing with that. | 10:20 |
| infinity | I think they're just sick of adding new formats to their RAW plugin every three days. | 10:20 |
| Treenaks | infinity: understandable, really | 10:20 |
| Mithrandir | there's no reason for it to be proprietary in any way, as long as the manufacturers can extend it in well-defined ways. | 10:20 |
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| ogra | mornin | 10:39 |
| jsg | ogra: mornin' to you1 | 10:39 |
| dholbach | hey ogra! | 10:39 |
| Mithrandir | hi ogra | 10:41 |
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| lifeless | debian/rules question | 11:01 |
| lifeless | I need to add -Wno-pointer-sign to CFLAGS but only for gcc-4.0 builds | 11:01 |
| Lathiat | pff, fix your software not to need it. :) | 11:02 |
| lifeless | Lathiat: nice. now the real answer please. | 11:02 |
| === martink [~martin@pD9EB2A04.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| lifeless | Lathiat: I'm not fixing 68K LOC with mixed pointer types tomorrow | 11:02 |
| Mithrandir | ifeq $(,$(shell gcc --version | grep 4\\.0))\nCFLAGS += -Wno-pointer-sign\nendif | 11:03 |
| Mithrandir | I'd guess. | 11:03 |
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| lifeless | Mithrandir: thanks! | 11:04 |
| === lifeless shall see | ||
| Mithrandir | lifeless: or build-dep on gcc (>= 4.0) and add it unconditionally. | 11:05 |
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| lifeless | Mithrandir: I'm so not breaking backports.org | 11:05 |
| Mithrandir | lifeless: fair enough | 11:06 |
| lifeless | ;) | 11:06 |
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| ogra | badger badger badger badger badger badger badger http://www.grawert.net/udu-gallery/img049.jpeg | 11:30 |
| ogra | http://www.grawert.net/udu-gallery/ | 11:30 |
| jdub | heh | 11:31 |
| Lathiat | haha wtf was that | 11:31 |
| ogra | the breezy dance.... | 11:32 |
| === ogra wants a new cam ... | ||
| jdub | http://www.grawert.net/udu-gallery/img045.jpeg.html | 11:32 |
| Lathiat | i so missed out | 11:32 |
| Mithrandir | hm, what's the easiest to get a patch showing all the differences between two branches in baz? | 11:33 |
| Mithrandir | hm, baz delta, it seems. | 11:35 |
| === Lathiat notes that down | ||
| Lathiat | :) | 11:35 |
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| === astharot- is now known as astharot | ||
| ogra | sightseeing with tainted windows at night :) http://www.grawert.net/udu-gallery/img046.jpeg | 11:37 |
| ogra | s/tainted/tinted | 11:37 |
| astharot | ciao | 11:37 |
| Mithrandir | ogra: why are your thumbnails so thumby? (That is, so small?) | 11:39 |
| ogra | to small ? | 11:39 |
| === ogra blames gthumb | ||
| Lathiat | they see fine sized to me... | 11:39 |
| Mithrandir | on the overview page, they are tiny | 11:39 |
| Mithrandir | like, 100x80px or so | 11:39 |
| Mithrandir | (ok, 120x90 then) | 11:40 |
| ogra | heh, yep.... | 11:40 |
| ogra | think of the poor aussies that want to view them.... | 11:40 |
| ogra | its bandwidth friendly.... | 11:41 |
| === Mithrandir sighs. | ||
| Mithrandir | I have 50k lines of patches for multiarch stuff | 11:41 |
| ogra | uff | 11:41 |
| dholbach | after hours of hard work: http://www.grawert.net/udu-gallery/img046.jpeg | 11:42 |
| Lathiat | dholbach: more hour sof hard work? | 11:44 |
| ogra | dholbach, sightseeing with imagination of the outside due to lack of sight .... ;) | 11:45 |
| dholbach | ogra: yeah... exactly... i just tried hard to remember how it looked in daylight :-) | 11:45 |
| ogra | heh | 11:45 |
| JaneW | FWIW here are my pics http://community.webshots.com/scripts/editPhotos.fcgi?action=viewall&albumID=338849189 | 11:46 |
| dholbach | hrm | 11:47 |
| dholbach | "You do not appear to be the owner of this album. Make sure you are logged in." | 11:47 |
| jsg | yeah | 11:47 |
| jsg | brb | 11:47 |
| JaneW | erk, but I made it public... | 11:47 |
| jdub | Mithrandir: 50k! hfsnw! | 11:48 |
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| astharot | ciao enrico | 11:48 |
| JaneW | http://community.webshots.com/album/338849189afiQFQ?824 <- that should work | 11:49 |
| === doko [~doko___@dsl-082-082-201-054.arcor-ip.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| enrico | hi | 11:49 |
| dholbach | yeah... better :-) | 11:50 |
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| jsg | top posting :( | 11:52 |
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| JaneW | jsg: ? | 11:57 |
| JaneW | orga: I love the difference between your before and after conference pictures . you can see how TIRED we all got | 11:57 |
| ogra | jsg, whats wrong there.... people are still polite | 11:57 |
| ogra | JaneW, yeah :) | 11:58 |
| jsg | what's so weird about key signing JaneW :) | 11:58 |
| JaneW | jsg: from an outdside perspective it *looks* very weird, of course by next conference/developer sumit or whatevere I am sure I'll be right in there ;) | 11:59 |
| jsg | heh | 11:59 |
| === Kamion [~cjwatson@host81-153-126-219.range81-153.btcentralplus.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| ogra | JaneW, so we can finally trust you then ? ;) | 11:59 |
| JaneW | ogra: yes ;) | 12:00 |
| jsg | haha | 12:00 |
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| jsg | ogra, i meant the top posting thread has gone quite OT but then you're right if people are still polite its not an issue | 12:03 |
| ogra | jsg, yeah, i love this community, in other lists i read this would have turned into a flamewar days ago :) | 12:04 |
| ogra | the sad thing is that you cant come to a conclusion in such threads.... | 12:05 |
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| seb128 | hi carlos | 12:08 |
| carlos | morning | 12:08 |
| seb128 | tseng: libgnomedb2-4 is built with libgda2-3 | 12:09 |
| tseng | hm I only see -3 | 12:10 |
| Lathiat | Does synaptic have the ability to ask it to do a package update from the command line? | 12:13 |
| tseng | seb128: yep i dont have libgnomedb2-4 on breezy | 12:14 |
| seb128 | hum | 12:15 |
| seb128 | it probably ftbfs | 12:15 |
| === seb128 looks on the build logs | ||
| Lathiat | whats fs stand for? | 12:15 |
| tseng | fails to build from source. | 12:16 |
| thom | fail to build from source | 12:16 |
| tseng | thom! | 12:16 |
| thom | hola | 12:16 |
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| jsg | tseng, you got some pics from UDU? | 12:16 |
| tseng | jsg: tseng.ath.cx/photos | 12:16 |
| jsg | thanks | 12:16 |
| JaneW | jsg: are there more, I have seen ogra's and tollef's so far... | 12:17 |
| ogra | JaneW, jblack http://gallery.linuxguru.net/UbuntuDownUnder-4-2005 | 12:18 |
| jsg | i have some few i will upload them later | 12:18 |
| JaneW | ta | 12:19 |
| thom | tseng: your flights back were ok? | 12:19 |
| tseng | thom: "ok" yes :) | 12:20 |
| bob2 | tseng: nice stylesheet | 12:21 |
| thom | i love the MAGIC whiteboard | 12:21 |
| tseng | bob2: its jimmac's script | 12:21 |
| bob2 | ah | 12:21 |
| bob2 | the thumbnails seem a bit stretched | 12:21 |
| tseng | possibly | 12:23 |
| tseng | seb128: maybe it just needs kicked again? | 12:25 |
| jsg | ogra, whats the url of your gallery? | 12:25 |
| ogra | http://www.grawert.net/udu-gallery/ | 12:25 |
| bob2 | jsg: grawert.net/udu-gallery/ | 12:25 |
| seb128 | tseng: I've uploaded a package sync on Debian 10 min ago | 12:26 |
| tseng | yay | 12:26 |
| seb128 | tseng: if it doesn't build that's because libgda2-3 is universe and should probably be main, I'll ping elmo if that ftbfs again | 12:26 |
| Mithrandir | hmm, why does baz delta -n --diffs include all the diffs three times or so? | 12:27 |
| tseng | seb128: great sorry to be a bother | 12:28 |
| seb128 | np | 12:29 |
| thom | i need to upload my photos; most are from jdub's wedding though | 12:29 |
| thom | by the way, has anyone played with picasa? (google's photo app) - it looks and feels very much like a polished fsport | 12:29 |
| thom | f-spot, even | 12:29 |
| Lathiat | and i thought f-spot was polished | 12:31 |
| jsg | i always compared f-spot with picassa | 12:32 |
| lifeless | fabbione: baz 1.4 should build with gcc-4.0 in ~ 45 minutes - 3 commits have to make check. | 12:35 |
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| lifeless | fabbione: to get 1.3.2 building, you can backport (should be trivial) or not fix it ;) | 12:35 |
| dholbach | JaneW: this isnt me: http://community.webshots.com/photo/338849189/338861060HQDuQx# - or i looked odd the other day and don't remember :-) | 12:35 |
| ogra | its tseng i guess | 12:36 |
| tseng | yes. | 12:36 |
| tseng | and andy | 12:36 |
| tseng | where is the index for that? | 12:36 |
| tseng | oh. | 12:36 |
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| JaneW | dholbach: yes sorry I think I got one or 2 names confussed, I'll go fix.. | 12:38 |
| bob2 | uh-oh | 12:38 |
| dholbach | JaneW: dont worry :-) | 12:38 |
| bob2 | man that site is slow | 12:38 |
| ogra | the site is ok... the banners are slow.... | 12:38 |
| JaneW | bob2: if I could get into people.ubuntu.com I would have put them there... | 12:39 |
| bob2 | hm | 12:40 |
| dholbach | yeah p.u.c for everyone! | 12:40 |
| tseng | "bob2 cheers up" | 12:40 |
| bob2 | oh, your password is encrypted with a key you don't have? | 12:40 |
| tseng | dholbach: yeah! | 12:40 |
| dholbach | <name>@ubuntu.com for everyone! | 12:40 |
| bob2 | tseng: never. | 12:40 |
| dholbach | :-) | 12:40 |
| jsg | i love you bob2 | 12:40 |
| jsg | hehe | 12:40 |
| JaneW | dholbach: do you know who that is? | 12:40 |
| dholbach | JaneW: i think it's tseng | 12:41 |
| Mithrandir | looks like AndyFitz and tseng | 12:41 |
| tseng | < ogra> its tseng i guess | 12:41 |
| tseng | < tseng> yes. | 12:41 |
| tseng | < tseng> and andy | 12:41 |
| ajmitch_ | such a shame I'm not in any of those :) | 12:41 |
| tseng | ajmitch_: you share a silver moment with luis | 12:41 |
| AndyFitz | janeW thats me on the left and tseng on the right | 12:42 |
| ajmitch_ | yeah, that one is funny | 12:42 |
| JaneW | ajmitch: I avoided names I wasn;t sure of | 12:42 |
| JaneW | and even them I got some wrong | 12:42 |
| JaneW | so sorry ;) | 12:42 |
| JaneW | ok, thanks | 12:42 |
| tseng | http://tseng.ath.cx/photos/index.php?galerie=udu&snimek=54 wee | 12:42 |
| jsg | you can just name them the way jblack did: some ubuntu hackers hehehe | 12:42 |
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| jsg | ok im out see you guys later | 12:44 |
| ajmitch_ | bye jsg | 12:44 |
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| JaneW | better now? | 12:45 |
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| JaneW | ajmitch: which pic are you in? | 12:45 |
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| JaneW | oic got it | 12:45 |
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| ajmitch_ | JaneW: none of yours except the group shot | 12:46 |
| ajmitch_ | hi chmj | 12:46 |
| chmj | hi ajmitch_ | 12:46 |
| JaneW | ajmithc: don't feel bad, no one took photos of me either ;) | 12:47 |
| bob2 | so | 12:47 |
| bob2 | can I plug a ata-100 drive into a ata-33 controller using a 40 pin cable? | 12:47 |
| bob2 | and have it work at ata-33. | 12:47 |
| Lathiat | yeh | 12:47 |
| ogra | ajmitch_, http://www.grawert.net/udu-gallery/img027.jpeg.html | 12:48 |
| Lathiat | they only use ata-100 if you have an 80pin cable (even on an ata100 bus) | 12:48 |
| bob2 | is this a "it might work, but watch those backups" or a "'tis fine, ata falls back" thing? | 12:48 |
| ajmitch_ | ogra: thanks :) | 12:48 |
| Lathiat | nah its fin | 12:48 |
| Lathiat | *fine | 12:48 |
| Lathiat | its designed to work like that. :) | 12:48 |
| bob2 | Lathiat: excellent, thanks | 12:49 |
| bob2 | jesus christ it's hard to get into this hp | 12:49 |
| AndyFitz | janeW : http://bytebot.net/shots/dsc03162.jpg colin charles took this | 12:49 |
| bob2 | this machine apparently consumed all the metal they wanted to use in their shitty plastic printers | 12:50 |
| === ajmitch_ sees some mao photos | ||
| Lathiat | bob2: heh | 12:51 |
| Lathiat | old hardware is fun | 12:51 |
| Lathiat | you end up dropping it to open it, then realise it was really much easier to get it open | 12:51 |
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| bob2 | I'm kinda worried it will topple and destroy my x40 | 12:52 |
| bob2 | it must weight 20 kilos | 12:52 |
| JaneW | AndyFitz,: oh yes, that was when I was evangelising that guy in the elevator! | 12:52 |
| AndyFitz | good work. 10 points | 12:53 |
| mjg59 | bob2: Silly. The X40 has an aura of magic protection. | 12:53 |
| JaneW | AndyFitz: thanks - I didn;t realise I had an audience though ;) | 12:53 |
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| AndyFitz | JaneW, its been posted on his blog and on planet.linuxaustralia http://www.bytebot.net/blog/archives/2005/05/02/ole-ole-ole-ubuntu-boleh | 12:57 |
| Lathiat | tseng: qemu 0.7.0 has support to run x86-64, might be usefull? | 12:59 |
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| Nafallo | morning all | 01:00 |
| bob2 | jesus this hp likes to beep a lot during boot | 01:01 |
| bob2 | beep for missing case | 01:01 |
| bob2 | beep for missing keyboard | 01:01 |
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| bob2 | beep because it's a thursday | 01:01 |
| === Lathiat grins at bob2 | ||
| Nafallo | hehe | 01:02 |
| bob2 | "buffer i/o error on device hdc" | 01:02 |
| bob2 | that sounds bad | 01:02 |
| Nafallo | bob2: it didn't beep for that? | 01:03 |
| bob2 | Nafallo: a beep is an unfair description | 01:03 |
| bob2 | it was more like a rising crescendo of beeps | 01:03 |
| bob2 | a symphony of annoyingness | 01:03 |
| bob2 | an aria of irritation | 01:03 |
| Nafallo | *s* that's why I haven't that cable plugged in ;-) | 01:04 |
| bob2 | oh, it has a flashing red DANGER DANGER WILL ROBINSON led on the front, too | 01:04 |
| bob2 | hp kayak: the server for people who can't read textual errors | 01:05 |
| Nafallo | lol | 01:05 |
| === nullaresnata [~henriquem@cb-217-129-175-184.netvisao.pt] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| bob2 | wow, it even booted ok | 01:14 |
| bob2 | and let me format the disk and everything | 01:14 |
| seb128 | elmo_: around? libgnomedb ftbfs because libgda2-3 is not-installable ... is that because that's an universe package? Any way to move it to main? | 01:15 |
| === herzi [~herzi@c180213.adsl.hansenet.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
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| robtaylor_ | anyone know anything about the status of using LVM for root? | 01:35 |
| robtaylor_ | (partition) | 01:36 |
| ajmitch_ | works fine for me since at least mid-way through the hoary cycle | 01:36 |
| ajmitch_ | the warty installer didn't support lvm2, but hoary does | 01:37 |
| robtaylor_ | ooh | 01:37 |
| === Kamion doesn't remember the change that added lvm2 support | ||
| Kamion | could've been a sync from Debian I guess - I thought warty supported lvm2 though | 01:37 |
| Kamion | but anyway, LVM for root is usually more a matter of careful bootloader configuration than anything else | 01:38 |
| ajmitch_ | ah yes, I do have a separate small /boot, iirc | 01:38 |
| cc | AndyFitz, JaneW : of course, it was on planet fedora. that makes it all hte more fun :) | 01:41 |
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| JaneW | hi cc | 01:43 |
| cc | hey, hey JaneW | 01:43 |
| JaneW | cc: thanks for including me in your - post on every web page on the web campaign ;) | 01:48 |
| JaneW | cc: btw do any more specs need editting? | 01:48 |
| JaneW | I am pretty busy but could still help out | 01:48 |
| JaneW | or editing even | 01:49 |
| JaneW | of course spelling/typing is not my personal strong point, but I can spot other's errors... | 01:49 |
| dholbach | ok... i'm out... see you later | 01:52 |
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| robtaylor_ | Kamion: ah, that makes sense | 01:53 |
| JaneW | who moderates the ubuntu-devel mailing list? | 01:55 |
| Simira | Isn't that Jeff? Waugh, I mean | 01:56 |
| Mithrandir | yeah, jdub does that | 02:01 |
| === SlackShrike [~Robinho@201009103089.user.veloxzone.com.br] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| cc | JaneW: do i have more that need editing, no. but i'd gladly look at more i'm sure | 02:05 |
| === nullaresnata [~henriquem@cb-217-129-175-184.netvisao.pt] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| JaneW | ok thankis, cos I sent a msg earlier and it's been detained... | 02:12 |
| JaneW | says I am not subscribed... | 02:12 |
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| === JaneW is still feeling slightly anxious after migrating to Ubuntu... like I don;t have everything taken care of and buttoned down, and like I am not completely in control | ||
| JaneW | was there a 'psychological effects of a w32 to Ubuntu migration' BOF? | 02:15 |
| Mithrandir | JaneW: no, since most people have migrated from Debian or similar to Ubuntu. ;) | 02:17 |
| Simira | :D | 02:17 |
| Zomb | I think you should care more about upgrade path from Woody, btw. | 02:17 |
| Mithrandir | Zomb: bugs and patches accepted. :) | 02:19 |
| ogra | Zomb, whats wrong with the upgradepath from woody ? | 02:19 |
| JaneW | Mithrandir,: I gather that is easier and less like flinging yourself off a clifff then? | 02:20 |
| Zomb | it failes on some places, I remember 3-5 file overwrite problems and the lilo bug from Sid | 02:20 |
| === ogra grins about a redhat mail.... they want to build a hardware database.... | ||
| Mithrandir | JaneW: I think so, yes. | 02:21 |
| Mithrandir | JaneW: what's scary ATM? | 02:21 |
| ogra | Zomb, after following the upgrde notes ? | 02:21 |
| ogra | Zomb, remember, we only support woody->warty | 02:21 |
| Zomb | there only notes for woody-warty | 02:21 |
| ogra | Zomb, yep | 02:22 |
| Zomb | that sucks | 02:22 |
| ogra | Zomb, because you shouldnt do woody->hoary... do woody->warty->hoary if you want a sane upgrade | 02:22 |
| Zomb | as said, that sucks. You expect people to install gigabytes of data just to reinstall it again. | 02:23 |
| === tseng|work [~ccc27a01@sls-eb20p9.dca2.superb.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| ogra | Zomb, woody is simply to old for a direct woody->hoary upgrade, to many changes | 02:25 |
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| Zomb | maybe. I don't remember the details but every time I have hit a file overwrite error it was clear: this one can have been fixed easily. Woody->Sarge upgrades are also supported (less or more). | 02:27 |
| Kamion | Zomb: we went through a fair bit of effort for both woody->warty and warty->hoary; but you start hitting diminishing returns after a point | 02:27 |
| cc | JaneW: if it helps, i've held of my migration as well. i'm still being a little cautious | 02:27 |
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| JaneW | cc: thanks ! now you tell me | 02:32 |
| ogra | yeah kickoff, thanks JaneW | 02:32 |
| JaneW | ogra: I sent that hours ago - was stuck in the moderator queue, but I managed to bypass now ;) | 02:35 |
| ogra | ah :) | 02:35 |
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| lamont | moo | 02:38 |
| ogra | morning lamont | 02:39 |
| JaneW | mooning | 02:39 |
| Simira | JaneW: What did you use before Ubuntu? | 02:41 |
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| tseng|work | hey does anyone know an rss feed for ubuntu-security? | 02:43 |
| tseng|work | the gmane one seems broken | 02:44 |
| mvirkkil | jdub: Does planetplanet use plain pickle for caching? | 02:49 |
| tseng|work | hi lamont | 02:50 |
| dilinger | good morning all | 02:51 |
| lamont | morning dilinger | 02:51 |
| lamont | kids->school | 02:54 |
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| JaneW | Simira: windows (XP most recently) | 02:57 |
| JaneW | Simira: did you see my pics? I am in there... | 02:58 |
| Simira | JaneW: ok. No, I didn't see your pics. Where? | 02:58 |
| Simira | JaneW: I still use XP, on my desktop computer | 02:58 |
| Simira | (don't tell anyone) | 02:58 |
| tseng|work | :'( | 02:59 |
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| Simira | ah | 03:02 |
| Simira | JaneW: are you working with Charles? | 03:02 |
| JaneW | http://community.webshots.com/album/338849189afiQFQ | 03:02 |
| Simira | hey, chmj and Charles are the same! | 03:02 |
| JaneW | Simira: yes I am, though I have been working from home this week | 03:02 |
| chmj | O.o | 03:03 |
| Simira | JaneW: I found it | 03:03 |
| Simira | ok | 03:03 |
| JaneW | Simira: yes he changed from d3vic3 at UDU | 03:03 |
| Simira | chmj: you probably don't remember me. We barely met in MAtaro | 03:03 |
| chmj | Simira: yeah, I don't | 03:03 |
| Simira | JaneW: I'm looking forward to meet you on the next conf | 03:03 |
| JaneW | Simira: ditto | 03:04 |
| ogra | ubuntu women power :) | 03:04 |
| JaneW | Simira: you also in Norway? | 03:04 |
| JaneW | Simira: I hope your real name isn't Jane though ;) | 03:04 |
| Simira | JaneW: yes, I'm kind of Tollef's fianc, and my name is Karianne :) | 03:04 |
| JaneW | else if it is, we'll have to make it a policy to only hire females with the name Jane | 03:04 |
| Simira | hehe | 03:04 |
| ogra | Simira, kind of ??? | 03:05 |
| === JaneW was also wondering | ||
| JaneW | nice name ;) | 03:05 |
| Simira | ogra: oh, it's just a way of speaking | 03:05 |
| ogra | heh | 03:05 |
| === svenl [~luther@AStrasbourg-251-1-55-62.w82-126.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| Simira | JaneW: yes, please just call me Simira irl if you can't pronounce it ;p | 03:05 |
| Mithrandir | she wore her ring this morning at least, so unless there's somehting she hasn't told me.. :P | 03:05 |
| ogra | lol | 03:06 |
| JaneW | I think Karianne is easier to say IMHO | 03:06 |
| Simira | JaneW: I'm one of those not-getting-paid to work on Ubuntu. I'm the head of LoCo and Translation team in Norway. :-) | 03:06 |
| JaneW | cool | 03:06 |
| Simira | JaneW: Ok, some have problems with it. It's almost like Marianne, though. | 03:06 |
| JaneW | pronounced carry anne right? | 03:07 |
| Simira | yes | 03:07 |
| JaneW | k | 03:07 |
| Simira | JaneW: I'm primarily a XP user (daily), but my web/file/mailserver are hoary and my laptop is dualbooting with breezy/xp | 03:07 |
| Simira | which reminds me I have to find a decent windows pgp client | 03:07 |
| === JaneW still has an XP partition to escape to if it all gets too much ;) | ||
| Simira | JaneW: nothing to be ashamed of. I still turn to XP when I get stuck in Ubuntu and want things done nice and easy. ;p | 03:08 |
| Simira | rather than getting help from Tollef :p | 03:08 |
| Lathiat | i must be lucky or something | 03:08 |
| Simira | Lathiat: what have you done? Or haven't? | 03:09 |
| cc | Mithrandir: hey, any leads to your masters project on multiarch stuff and how its being correctly implemented? | 03:09 |
| Lathiat | (i have never needed windows for anything of late) | 03:09 |
| Simira | cc: ah, I saw your mail, yes. Nice :) | 03:10 |
| Mithrandir | cc: http://err.no/debian/amd64-multiarch-3 is the latest proposal with some links; http://err.no/ntnu/thesis/report-multiarch/doc/report.pdf is the current state of my thesis | 03:10 |
| cc | Simira: this being the sounder one? | 03:10 |
| cc | Mithrandir: thanks, a lot | 03:10 |
| Simira | cc: yup | 03:10 |
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| Lathiat | i see a use for having x86 and x86-64 co-instaleld | 03:11 |
| Lathiat | btu why would you want more co-installed? | 03:12 |
| Simira | JaneW: But you have a pgp key, right? | 03:12 |
| Mithrandir | Lathiat: some architectures support more, and you might want to have linux and netbsd, x86-64 and i386 at the same time, for instance. | 03:12 |
| Simira | gpg, even | 03:12 |
| Lathiat | linux and netbsd? | 03:12 |
| mjg59 | Lathiat: Imagine ppc64, ppc and x86 | 03:12 |
| Mithrandir | Lathiat: or you might want ia64, i386 and x86_64 once ia64 gets the ability to run x86_64, which I think it will | 03:13 |
| Lathiat | mjg59: but i dont get why you would want x86 stuff installed on a ppc machine? | 03:13 |
| mjg59 | Lathiat: Because it's not available for ppc? | 03:13 |
| Mithrandir | or sparc64, sparc32 for both linux and sunos | 03:13 |
| === Lathiat is confused | ||
| Lathiat | why do i need x86 libraries on a ppc machine that can't exuecute them, why do i want sunos stuff installed and why do i want netbsd stuf finstalled? | 03:13 |
| mjg59 | Lathiat: qemu lets you run x86 linux stuff on ppc quite happily | 03:13 |
| mjg59 | And there's lots of x86 linux stuff that you can't get for ppc | 03:14 |
| Lathiat | mjg59: right, but doesnt that then handle the libraries too? | 03:14 |
| bob2 | like valgrind | 03:14 |
| mjg59 | Lathiat: The libraries need to be on your filesystem somewhere | 03:14 |
| svenl | Kamion: i did a build of the chrp kernel using mkvmlinuz on a installed ubuntu/hoary image and getting the hoary install CD initrd.gz. | 03:14 |
| Mithrandir | Lathiat: not all people like Linux; mjg59 is working on Debian NetBSD for instance, where an idea is to just port the base stuff and use the emulation layer for everything else. | 03:14 |
| Lathiat | mjg59: so qemu does emulate the 32bitness for the 32 libraries and uses 64bit libraries? | 03:14 |
| mjg59 | Lathiat: ? Uh, no. | 03:14 |
| svenl | Kamion: but it tells me that it is not finding the kernel modules, due to version difference, which seems strange. | 03:15 |
| Lathiat | mjg59: when why do you need 32bit libraries installed? | 03:15 |
| Lathiat | sorry, im not getting something here, and i cant figure out what it is. :) | 03:15 |
| svenl | Kamion: /proc/version has 2.6.10-5. | 03:15 |
| JaneW | Simira: no I don't | 03:15 |
| mjg59 | Lathiat: qemu lets you run x86 binaries on ppc. This requires x86 libraries. | 03:15 |
| Lathiat | mjg59: oh right, duh | 03:15 |
| Lathiat | how did i miss that | 03:15 |
| === Lathiat smacks his head on the desk | ||
| Simira | JaneW: It's not so weird when you get used to it :) | 03:15 |
| Simira | Mithrandir: how did you avoid all those cameras? | 03:16 |
| Mithrandir | Simira: no idea. | 03:16 |
| Mithrandir | I probably vibe out. | 03:16 |
| Lathiat | mjg59: thanks. :) | 03:16 |
| Mithrandir | uhm, vibed out | 03:16 |
| bob2 | Simira: he beat potential photographers! | 03:17 |
| Simira | bob2: he wouldn't | 03:17 |
| Mithrandir | bob2: I beat photographers who flashed me in the eye. | 03:17 |
| svenl | Kamion: mmm, ubuntu-installer got confused by the rc3 dvd i had in the player :) | 03:18 |
| Kamion | svenl: could you give me the exact error message rather than a paraphrase of it? I don't know this process off by heart. | 03:19 |
| svenl | Kamion: well, i was french localized :) | 03:19 |
| svenl | Kamion: i guess i used the cdrom initrd, which caused that. | 03:20 |
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| svenl | Mmm, gigabit ethernet is not yet working. | 03:21 |
| seb128 | elmo_: around? | 03:23 |
| === AndyFitz [~andy@220-245-97-227-qld-pppoe.tpgi.com.au] has left #ubuntu-devel [] | ||
| cc | svenl: really? i thought i saw benh pass the patch on to akpm/linus already | 03:26 |
| svenl | cc: hoary has only 2.6.10, and the backport in ubuntu was broken. | 03:26 |
| cc | svenl: ah yes, of course. | 03:27 |
| === cc keeps on forgetting about stable kernel releases | ||
| svenl | cc: you are in the ubuntu boat too then ? | 03:27 |
| === banta [~banta@cpe.atm0-0-0-1801039.0x50a0a1c2.boanxx4.customer.tele.dk] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| Lathiat | whats scott remnants irc nick? | 03:28 |
| tseng|work | keybuk | 03:28 |
| thom | keybuk | 03:28 |
| Lathiat | ah | 03:28 |
| cc | svenl: well, not quite, no. lets just say its something i'm finding really interesting at the moment, and i do plan on loading up and using at some stage soon | 03:28 |
| Kamion | svenl: what mkvmlinuz command did you use, so that I can try it out and track it down myself? | 03:29 |
| === nullaresnata [~henriquem@cb-217-129-175-184.netvisao.pt] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| === JaneW needs to go | ||
| JaneW | bbl | 03:29 |
| Simira | bye, Kane | 03:29 |
| Simira | uhm | 03:29 |
| === JaneW [~JaneW@wbs-146-141-174.telkomadsl.co.za] has left #ubuntu-devel ["Leaving"] | ||
| Simira | Jane | 03:29 |
| Simira | 0_o | 03:29 |
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| Kamion | +shadow (1:4.0.3-31sarge3ubuntu1) breezy; urgency=low | 03:34 |
| Kamion | these version numbers are getting SILLY | 03:34 |
| Lathiat | you havent seen the ubuntu backports ones then | 03:36 |
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| ogra | argh.... | 03:36 |
| ogra | he said IT | 03:36 |
| Lathiat | it? | 03:36 |
| ogra | the bad B word | 03:36 |
| Lathiat | oh, that | 03:36 |
| Kamion | Lathiat: I restrict myself to non-totally-broken distributions | 03:37 |
| Lathiat | Kamion: you mean sources | 03:37 |
| Kamion | backports are effectively a distribution | 03:37 |
| Lathiat | i guess | 03:37 |
| Kamion | albeit an overlay one | 03:37 |
| Kamion | certainly to the extent that those using them take on responsibility for supporting themselves | 03:38 |
| Lathiat | hrm new powernowds thread detection is borked | 03:38 |
| thom | Lathiat: howso? | 03:40 |
| Lathiat | thom: comes up on my cpu as 0 | 03:40 |
| Lathiat | so it fails to start without -c | 03:40 |
| Lathiat | as threads < ncpus | 03:40 |
| Lathiat | trying to figure out why atm | 03:40 |
| svenl | Kamion: mkvmlinuz -o /path/to/file -i /path/to/initrd.gz -a chrp -z -v | 03:42 |
| Lathiat | also, returning an uninitialized num if (edx & 0x8000000) isnt true probably isnt good either | 03:42 |
| svenl | Kamion: hoary doesn't call mkvmlinuz or install it though, since it is assuming yaboot worked, which i didn't quite do in time. | 03:42 |
| svenl | Kamion: and the page telling about the OF variables doesn't seem to handle the OF aliases as debian's nobootloader did. | 03:43 |
| thom | Lathiat: can you file a bug, please | 03:44 |
| Lathiat | thom: ya, trying to see if i can figure it out first | 03:44 |
| Kamion | svenl: indeed, I didn't attempt to reimplement that part in yaboot-installer | 03:45 |
| svenl | Kamion: please do in the future, typing /pci/ide@.../disk@0,0:0 is a lot more complicated than just hd:0 :) | 03:45 |
| Lathiat | anyone here with a p4 with hyperthreading? | 03:45 |
| Kamion | svenl: enhancement bug please? | 03:45 |
| svenl | Mmm, actually, i should be able to boot it using yaboto directly here, will try that. | 03:45 |
| svenl | Kamion: i should file a bug you mean ? | 03:46 |
| svenl | will do. | 03:46 |
| Kamion | I was just trying to get it done at all; since it wasn't something that was on my official list of things to do, I had to cut some corners | 03:46 |
| Kamion | svenl: yes, please | 03:46 |
| Lathiat | if so, can they grab http://bur.st/~lathiat/threading.c and paste me the output? | 03:46 |
| svenl | against yaboot-installer. | 03:46 |
| Kamion | yes | 03:46 |
| svenl | Kamion: do you need a patch or something ? Or can you handle from nobootloader ? | 03:46 |
| Kamion | svenl: the nobootloader code looks reasonably straightforward | 03:47 |
| Kamion | so I can probably handle it | 03:47 |
| svenl | I can just copy the code from nobootloader into the bug report for documentation purpose. | 03:48 |
| svenl | Kamion: if i had installed as expert, i would have had to chose nobootloader instead of yaboot-installer ? | 03:48 |
| svenl | Kamion: in that case, maybe we should modify nobootloader to do the mkvmlinuz call thingy ? | 03:49 |
| Kamion | I don't like mkvmlinuz; I'd much rather have a sane bootloader :) | 03:51 |
| Kamion | (well, sane-ish) | 03:51 |
| Kamion | I'm tempted to switch Pegasos to grub2 | 03:52 |
| svenl | Kamion: mkvmlinuz is sane. | 03:52 |
| Kamion | not by comparison. :) | 03:52 |
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| svenl | Kamion: it is real kernel code, and is the default on real ppc hardware for netbooting. | 03:52 |
| Kamion | it's 2005, damnit, bootloaders should be able to assemble stuff | 03:52 |
| svenl | real ppc hardware meaning IBM stuff i guess :) | 03:53 |
| === chuck_ is now known as zul | ||
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| svenl | Kamion: for netbooting, it bears no comparison to the way yaboot works. you have only to put a single file in your tftp served dir, and boot it. | 03:53 |
| Kamion | I'm happy to make it work but I don't think it should be the installation default | 03:54 |
| Kamion | if it's at all possible to have any other solution | 03:54 |
| svenl | Kamion: well, nobootloader is not the default. | 03:54 |
| svenl | yaboot-installer is. | 03:54 |
| Kamion | true | 03:54 |
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| svenl | so it would only be a fallback for expert mode or whatever. | 03:54 |
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| svenl | but it would sound strange to fall back to expert mode, chose nobootloader, have it tell you to boot boot/vmlinuz-2.6.10-5-powerpc or whatever, and this kernel not being present :) | 03:55 |
| balor | I'm getting some strange agpgart errors with today's Breezy "[drm:drm_fill_in_dev] *ERROR* Cannot initialize the agpgart module.". Thus I can't get DRI working. | 03:56 |
| Kamion | seems reasonable for it to make sure that file exists, yes | 03:56 |
| svenl | Kamion: will fill another bug report about this. | 03:57 |
| Kamion | I have an incredibly large number of breezy goals though - if anyone else can do it, I'm happy to help | 03:57 |
| balor | I'm running an Intel 865G with the latest BIOS patches. Can anyone speculate as to why it can't ceate the dev entries? | 03:57 |
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| thom | balor: support questions in #ubuntu, please | 03:58 |
| === nullaresnata [~henriquem@cb-217-129-175-184.netvisao.pt] has left #ubuntu-devel ["sa."] | ||
| svenl | Kamion: well. I may do it, but filling a bug report makes sure it doesn't get forgotten. | 03:59 |
| balor | thom: It's not really a support question. I think there's a bug in the module loading. | 03:59 |
| Kamion | svenl: yeah, absolutely | 03:59 |
| balor | thom: But I'll try there anyway...sorry | 03:59 |
| Lathiat | anyone here with a pentium-m cpu? | 04:00 |
| Kamion | svenl: this cycle is probably going to be me realising that I can't write all the code myself any more, that's all :( | 04:00 |
| tseng|work | Lathiat: yes? | 04:00 |
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| Lathiat | tseng|work: can you compile/run/paste results of http://bur.st/~lathiat/threading.c | 04:00 |
| Lathiat | tseng|work: need to run as root | 04:00 |
| tseng|work | its at home | 04:00 |
| Lathiat | actually, you dont | 04:00 |
| Lathiat | tseng|work: oh, ok | 04:01 |
| svenl | Kamion: hehe. | 04:01 |
| Kamion | svenl: mkvmlinuz worked fine for me when I added '-r 2.6.10-5-powerpc' to the arguments | 04:02 |
| Kamion | (I was running it in a chroot so the default was bound to fail anyway) | 04:02 |
| svenl | Kamion: anyway, we should have an OF with yaboot/grub2 support and nvram editing from linux well before breezy anyway. | 04:02 |
| svenl | Kamion: ok. | 04:02 |
| Kamion | svenl: using -k /path/to/kernel works too | 04:02 |
| Kamion | nvram editing> woohoo# | 04:02 |
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| svenl | Kamion: i think you should do -k /path/to/kernel instead of -r. | 04:03 |
| svenl | That was what Jens said anyway. | 04:03 |
| svenl | Kamion: nobootloader does get called after the kernel has been installed, so we would need to dpkg-reconfigure linux-image, or call mkvmlinuz by hand, right ? | 04:05 |
| svenl | Arg. | 04:07 |
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| svenl | ubuntu/hoary's X doesn't respect me chosing french language but us keyboard, and it probably did chose macintosh and not pc105 too. | 04:08 |
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| Kamion | svenl: calling mkvmlinuz by hand would seem straightforward/reasonable enough | 04:11 |
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| svenl | Kamion: indeed. | 04:18 |
| svenl | Kamion: you need only to call it the same way kernel-package's postinst call it. | 04:19 |
| svenl | Kamion: i wonder how the mkvmlinuz debconf question would be called though, maybe nobootloader could preseed it to mkvmlinuz. | 04:20 |
| Kamion | it shouldn't be running at a priority high enough to be seen anyway | 04:22 |
| Kamion | if it is, we'll have to clobber it in Ubuntu | 04:22 |
| Kamion | one way or another | 04:22 |
| svenl | Kamion: it is running in priority medium i think, but you will see it in expert mode i guess. | 04:24 |
| svenl | Kamion: the thing is that it should default to yaboot on pegasos once the firmware is released, but if you chose nobootloader over yaboot-installer, you want it to default to mkvmlinuz and not yaboot. | 04:25 |
| Kamion | it's not rocket science to tweak :) | 04:26 |
| svenl | Mmm, trying to boot yaboot directly gets me : | 04:27 |
| svenl | Amiga partition table corrupted at block 0 | 04:27 |
| Lathiat | thom: bug filed, with possible patch | 04:27 |
| svenl | block type is not partition but 00000000 | 04:27 |
| thom | k, thanks | 04:27 |
| svenl | I wonder if this is our OF or yaboot, let me check ... | 04:27 |
| svenl | It is yaboot. | 04:29 |
| === svenl wonders why. | ||
| svenl | This used to work :/ | 04:29 |
| Lathiat | thom: the patch cant hurt at the worst, and seems to fix all situations of return values I've seen | 04:30 |
| doko | chmj: pan is already fixed and uploaded | 04:30 |
| chmj | doko: so i have noticed | 04:31 |
| bluefoxicy | ok | 04:36 |
| bluefoxicy | why the HELL don't +, =, -, and _ work in synaptic?! | 04:36 |
| === bluefoxicy is right-clicking one of like 19 packages at a time to remove residual configs. | ||
| Lathiat | bluefoxicy: eh? | 04:38 |
| ogra | bluefoxicy, synaptic can do multiple select .... | 04:40 |
| === bluefoxicy selects all, right click. . . mark for installation? | ||
| bluefoxicy | no. | 04:40 |
| bluefoxicy | oh geeze if it selects one that's marked it'll grey the option x.x | 04:41 |
| bluefoxicy | ogra: I still have to use this annoying pointing device. | 04:41 |
| ogra | bluefoxicy, its a gui tool.... use aptitude if you dont like mice | 04:41 |
| bluefoxicy | ogra: press ctrl+t :) | 04:42 |
| doko | elmo_: please import perl from unstable, the security patches are applied in the Debian version | 04:47 |
| doko | elmo_: please import libunwind from experimental | 04:48 |
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| jani | seb128 ping | 05:07 |
| seb128 | pong | 05:07 |
| jani | seb128, evince does not built, in case you missed it :) | 05:07 |
| jani | missing poppler-glib something | 05:07 |
| seb128 | thanks but there is a lot to do, I'll do a second pass on ftbfs soon | 05:08 |
| jani | ok :) | 05:08 |
| seb128 | bah, not an evince bug | 05:08 |
| Lathiat | heh | 05:08 |
| seb128 | jani: archive issue | 05:09 |
| jani | build infrastructure you mean? | 05:09 |
| seb128 | jani: it'll be solved when the appropriate package are moved to main | 05:09 |
| jani | ok thanks | 05:09 |
| seb128 | jani: no, 'archive', like archive.ubuntu.com | 05:09 |
| seb128 | evince is main and the new poppler part universe (that's by default) | 05:10 |
| seb128 | need to be moved to main | 05:10 |
| jani | got it | 05:10 |
| seb128 | there is some similar issues, that will be solved soon, but not by me | 05:10 |
| seb128 | you just have to wait, sorry for the delay | 05:10 |
| jani | np | 05:11 |
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| Burgundavia | where should I file synaptic bugs? ours or some upstream? | 05:25 |
| Lathiat | bugzilla.ubuntu.com | 05:27 |
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| === hunger_ hates ubuntu's start/stop scripts. Their output is rather erratic... | ||
| === hunger_ is now known as hunger | ||
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| hunger | powernowd is NOT started, but the start/stop script thinks that is OK:-( | 05:57 |
| Kamion | elmo_: could you arrange for restricted/debian-installer/* to show up in dists/*/Release, please? | 05:57 |
| Kamion | elmo_: it looks like ziyi has main rather hardcoded when looking for */debian-installer sections at the moment | 05:57 |
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| Simira | pancakes! | 06:08 |
| mjg59 | hunger: Why is it not started? | 06:13 |
| hunger | mjg59: Dunno... worked till today. | 06:13 |
| thom | hunger: are you on breezy, and did you update recently? | 06:14 |
| hunger | mjg59: But I figured out why this sucky mix oy lsb/debian style start/stop script won't work. | 06:14 |
| hunger | thom: I did and I updated today. | 06:14 |
| thom | you're probably seeing 10446 | 06:15 |
| hunger | thom: Looks like bug10446 is biting me:-) | 06:15 |
| hunger | thom: Yeah, just saw you had that reported. | 06:16 |
| hunger | thom: Does /etc/init.d/powernowd start claim that it works for you? | 06:16 |
| wasabi | anybody familiar with programming against synaptic (such as how update-manager does) | 06:16 |
| hunger | thom: Aka. do you get an [ ok ] ? | 06:17 |
| Lathiat | hunger: http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=10446 | 06:17 |
| thom | hunger: the only box i have atm (laptop's in for servicing) doesn't support powernow (old amd64) | 06:17 |
| Lathiat | hunger: (known bug) | 06:17 |
| Lathiat | thom: what cpu is your laptop? | 06:18 |
| Lathiat | it only sems to show up on pentium-m | 06:18 |
| Lathiat | altho some other cpus get -ve values | 06:18 |
| Lathiat | which are not handled either | 06:18 |
| thom | Lathiat: p-m (but like i say, it's at ibm) | 06:19 |
| === Lathiat nods | ||
| thom | Lathiat: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=306896 | 06:20 |
| hunger | Lathiat: P4. | 06:20 |
| hunger | Lathiat: Have a look at #10457 as well: the [ ok ] issue (incl. patch). | 06:21 |
| Lathiat | thom: righto | 06:22 |
| zyga | wasabi: what do you want to do? | 06:22 |
| wasabi | zyga, append a new source in a somewhat safe manner. Only if the same source doesnt' already exist, etc. | 06:22 |
| wasabi | And then invoke synaptic to a) update the sources and b) install some packages | 06:22 |
| zyga | wasabi: if you want to do that in python it's not that complicated and you could just use update manager's source | 06:23 |
| Lathiat | heh intel not following their own spec, theres a surprise. | 06:23 |
| === hunger is away. | ||
| wasabi | good idea. | 06:23 |
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| zyga | wasabi: by install do you mean - gui allowing people to choose stuff? | 06:23 |
| wasabi | no. | 06:23 |
| wasabi | I am implementing a test file hanlder for .apt files | 06:23 |
| zyga | wasabi: automated? | 06:23 |
| wasabi | Yes. | 06:23 |
| wasabi | The file, when double clicked, will add some sources then install some packages. | 06:24 |
| zyga | wasabi: then update manager already has everything you need | 06:24 |
| wasabi | super | 06:24 |
| zyga | wasabi: take a look at current source, I may help you if you're lost or don't want to read everything | 06:24 |
| zyga | wasabi: one moment | 06:24 |
| wasabi | im in it now | 06:24 |
| wasabi | I hope for this to make it somewhat easy for third partities to distribute packages targetting debian-based distros to end users. | 06:25 |
| zyga | wasabi: aptsources.py.in is interesting for you | 06:25 |
| zyga | wasabi: oh great, different approach to autopackage :) | 06:25 |
| wasabi | Basically just provide a link to SuperCoolProgram.apt on their web site, and have it offer to install it. | 06:26 |
| wasabi | Yeah. | 06:26 |
| wasabi | Just WAY SIMPLIER | 06:26 |
| thom | hunger: that's a broken patch, and anyway the way it works currently is by design. also, please use diff -u when submitting patches | 06:26 |
| Burgundavia | and a huge security nightmare | 06:26 |
| Burgundavia | wasabi, there is some discussion is making installing easier | 06:26 |
| wasabi | No more a security nightmare than every other OS ever. | 06:26 |
| Burgundavia | see the UDU wiki | 06:26 |
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| Burgundavia | wasabi, we need to be better than the others, not the same | 06:26 |
| wasabi | There really is no other possible means to the end really. | 06:27 |
| wasabi | Users want to install software from the internet. That's it. | 06:27 |
| zyga | wasabi: and update-manager.in | 06:27 |
| wasabi | Either we let them, or we don't. | 06:27 |
| zyga | wasabi: of course you don't need 80% of it | 06:27 |
| wasabi | The only way to make it "secure" is to wrap it in SELinux or something similar. | 06:28 |
| wasabi | Or try to do what MS wanted to do, sign everything with a central authority. | 06:28 |
| wasabi | which obviously isn't going to work. | 06:28 |
| zyga | wasabi: if the installer gets root and asks internally for every permission then selinux is not going to help, trusted sources are but that's a different story | 06:28 |
| wasabi | exactly. | 06:28 |
| wasabi | I hope to have the .apt file contain a number of sections in traditional dpkg tag file format. Each section has a Distro and/or Arch section, Binary-Archives, source-archives, then a list of packages to install. | 06:29 |
| wasabi | And probably a public key too for apt-secure. | 06:29 |
| wasabi | Thing just runs thru it, adds the sources, adds the keys, and tells synaptic to go for it. | 06:29 |
| zyga | wasabi: okay if you need anything else make sure irssi will hilight your line for me, I'm reading a book a few meters away | 06:30 |
| wasabi | ok. thanks. ;0 | 06:30 |
| wasabi | I see, that's pretty easy. | 06:31 |
| zyga | wasabi: re... I just had a cool idea | 06:38 |
| zyga | wasabi: instead of doing extra meta packages why not do something compleatly different | 06:38 |
| wasabi | extra meta packages? | 06:38 |
| zyga | wasabi: .pakackage in mind (autopackage) | 06:39 |
| wasabi | Oh. It's not a meta pacakge. | 06:39 |
| wasabi | At all. | 06:39 |
| zyga | wasabi: I know ;-) | 06:39 |
| zyga | wasabi: anyway just listen for a moment | 06:39 |
| wasabi | k | 06:39 |
| zyga | two possible scenarios - open source stuff and close source stuff | 06:39 |
| wasabi | ok. | 06:39 |
| zyga | oss first | 06:40 |
| zyga | let's say I want to get latest and gratest gaim | 06:40 |
| wasabi | ok. | 06:40 |
| zyga | greatest even | 06:40 |
| zyga | (assuming .desktop compatible environment) | 06:40 |
| wasabi | ok. | 06:40 |
| zyga | I click 'start-or-something' -> internet -> gaim | 06:41 |
| zyga | it's there already even though it's not installed | 06:41 |
| wasabi | I get it, that's neat, I like the idea. | 06:41 |
| wasabi | But I think it's seperate to this idea. ;) | 06:41 |
| zyga | a little | 06:41 |
| zyga | it becomes complicated more for close source stuff | 06:42 |
| wasabi | The idea is to make apt decentralized. | 06:42 |
| wasabi | Right now it isn't, mostly because people aren't proficcient at using it. | 06:42 |
| wasabi | And they shouldn't be. | 06:42 |
| zyga | because you still need the package installer and .desktop file that will ivoke it somehow | 06:42 |
| wasabi | Yup. | 06:42 |
| wasabi | I think a button on a web page | 06:42 |
| wasabi | "Install Software Now!" | 06:42 |
| wasabi | Is pretty rad. | 06:42 |
| zyga | but imagine .desktop and .png files as only two things needed for custom app installation :-) | 06:43 |
| Burgundavia | the advantage of a centralized system is that you can say "here is all the games on offer" | 06:43 |
| Burgundavia | your system cannot do that | 06:43 |
| wasabi | For open source software, like, gaim could publish CVS snapshots On Ever Checkin, if they wanted to. | 06:43 |
| wasabi | Burgundavia, my system isn't designed to. | 06:43 |
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| zyga | run = install-magic http://www.vendor.com/your-game-or-something | 06:43 |
| wasabi | The use case of "my system" is pretty damned simple. | 06:44 |
| Burgundavia | wasabi, have you read www.ubuntu.com/wiki/WinningTheDesktop ? | 06:44 |
| wasabi | It's just about making it easy for users to install stuff using apt without editing text files. | 06:44 |
| zyga | Burgundavia: the problem is non free stuff as 99% games are are not going to be in any repository | 06:45 |
| Burgundavia | wasabi, see http://udu.wiki.ubuntu.com/PackageManagementRoadmap | 06:46 |
| === zyga wonders if anyone bough doom3 for linux | ||
| Burgundavia | and http://udu.wiki.ubuntu.com/FindingPackages | 06:46 |
| zyga | how did they manage the installer and such? | 06:46 |
| wasabi | mime-type of packages should be used: find a application to work with that mime type and install it (see also FindingPackages). | 06:46 |
| wasabi | That is potentially awesome. | 06:46 |
| Burgundavia | I have a copied windows install | 06:46 |
| zyga | Burgundavia: so you need a windows box to install it first? | 06:46 |
| Burgundavia | zyga, I don't think so | 06:47 |
| jnc | hey um... is Breezy usable? | 06:47 |
| jnc | i understand it might break now and then | 06:47 |
| Burgundavia | I have a pirate version that a friend copied to me | 06:47 |
| zyga | jnc: hey, that depends but generally yes :-) | 06:47 |
| Burgundavia | I noticed it installs the linux binaries along with, so I can run it | 06:47 |
| zyga | jnc: and that answers both questions really :-) | 06:47 |
| jnc | okay. so like you don't forsee any changes that would totally fubar the system and render apt unworkable? | 06:47 |
| Burgundavia | jnc, no | 06:47 |
| jnc | a'right. | 06:48 |
| Burgundavia | jnc, I see not having X work | 06:48 |
| jnc | thanks | 06:48 |
| zyga | jnc: hoary once broke network stuff for an hour | 06:48 |
| jnc | X not working is not the end of the world | 06:48 |
| zyga | jnc: but it's usable IMHO :-) | 06:48 |
| jnc | that'd be like using Microsoft or the old Apple OSes | 06:48 |
| jnc | !@#t happens. | 06:48 |
| zyga | jnc: windows has virtual terminals that help when X crashes, cool.. | 06:49 |
| zyga | ;-) | 06:49 |
| jnc | zyga: what, you never ran win32s on top of DOS to virtualize two copies of doom I running at the same time ? | 06:49 |
| jnc | tsk tsk | 06:49 |
| === jnc ;) | ||
| zyga | jnc: doom doesn't run on sparc - sorry | 06:50 |
| jnc | touche! | 06:50 |
| zyga | ah but I'm silly | 06:50 |
| zyga | doom3 does not ;-) | 06:50 |
| jnc | going from Hoary -> breezy, are there any special procautions when making the switch (have there been changes not covered by dpkg?) | 06:52 |
| zyga | jnc: some things don't work - if you need one of them - wait | 06:53 |
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| Burgundavia | does anyone have a list of stuff still borked? | 06:53 |
| jnc | i dig it. | 06:54 |
| zyga | Burgundavia: gcj, ooo (or ooo2, cannot remember ATM) | 06:54 |
| zyga | Burgundavia: gcj needs g++ 4.0 which AFAIK it will not get untill abi change | 06:54 |
| wasabi | Okay here's another question. | 06:55 |
| wasabi | I am looking for something that identifies the distro. | 06:55 |
| wasabi | in an apt based system. | 06:55 |
| wasabi | the word "hoary" for instance. | 06:55 |
| Lathiat | wasabi: /etc/lsb-release | 06:55 |
| wasabi | or "sid". | 06:55 |
| Lathiat | well, on ubuntu | 06:55 |
| wasabi | Ahh hah! | 06:55 |
| Lathiat | debian has /etc/debian_verson | 06:55 |
| Lathiat | debian has /etc/debian_version | 06:55 |
| Lathiat | debian doesnt have lsb-release tho | 06:55 |
| wasabi | Hmm. | 06:55 |
| wasabi | I can mandate lsb-release. | 06:55 |
| Burgundavia | /etc/issue | 06:56 |
| wasabi | Since *I* use ubuntu. :0 | 06:56 |
| zyga | standards - so many to choose from ;-) | 06:56 |
| Lathiat | actually ubuntu has /etc/debian_version | 06:56 |
| Lathiat | assumedly for compatibilty | 06:56 |
| Lathiat | (but it says the debian version) | 06:56 |
| wasabi | Okay the two words Ubuntu and hoary. What would they be called. The distro and the ? | 06:56 |
| Kamion | don't look at /etc/lsb-release | 06:56 |
| jnc | release name | 06:56 |
| zyga | wasabi: release name? | 06:56 |
| Kamion | use the lsb_release command | 06:56 |
| Lathiat | release name | 06:56 |
| jnc | zyga: bwahaha. | 06:57 |
| wasabi | Oooh. | 06:57 |
| Kamion | wasabi: formally "suite" | 06:57 |
| Lathiat | Kamion: ahh, didnt know about that | 06:57 |
| wasabi | I like tha tcommand | 06:57 |
| Kamion | though that's basically internal archive terminology | 06:57 |
| Kamion | release name or release codename would be usual | 06:57 |
| zyga | Kamion: N/A | 06:57 |
| wasabi | Kamion, did you hear what I was working on? If you knew the context you might have an idea. | 06:57 |
| Lathiat | zyga: lsb_release -a | 06:57 |
| Kamion | zyga: so read --help | 06:57 |
| Kamion | wasabi: I heard, I don't want to be involved | 06:58 |
| wasabi | =) | 06:58 |
| Kamion | wasabi: I've argued against it in the past; I consider I've said my piece | 06:58 |
| wasabi | What would you argue for? | 06:58 |
| wasabi | Or are you one of those "i don't carers" | 06:58 |
| Kamion | "I consider I've said my piece" | 06:58 |
| === zyga is enlightened | ||
| Kamion | I'm not having the same argument every week | 06:58 |
| Kamion | however we specced out a less bad solution at UDU | 06:59 |
| ogra | http://udu.wiki.ubuntu.com/FindingPackages | 06:59 |
| wasabi | Hmm. That doesn't really cover the same use cases. | 07:00 |
| wasabi | Oh I see it does. | 07:00 |
| wasabi | goal 2! | 07:00 |
| Kamion | right, FindingPackages is much better than teaching people that a web browser is a good thing to use to install software | 07:00 |
| wasabi | I don't see the difference. | 07:01 |
| wasabi | from the page | 07:01 |
| wasabi | file with some meta-information needs to be provided by launchpad when the user clicks on a "Install" button with his web browser. | 07:01 |
| Kamion | that slipped by me; I would have argued against that if I'd heard it | 07:01 |
| wasabi | Well I think the main idea is that users should be able to install stuff *we* haven't vetted. | 07:02 |
| Kamion | as long as the means is *not* a web browser | 07:02 |
| wasabi | How do they find the people without that? | 07:02 |
| Burgundavia | Kamion, I think goal 2 is within a web browser | 07:02 |
| wasabi | That's the only means of decentralized navigation we have. | 07:02 |
| Kamion | Burgundavia: yeah, I think goal 2 is misdesigned | 07:02 |
| wasabi | Maybe we should use gopher! | 07:02 |
| Burgundavia | Kamion, there is another goal for gnome-app-install | 07:02 |
| Burgundavia | Kamion, I happen to agree with you there | 07:02 |
| Lathiat | perhasp some sort signing | 07:02 |
| wasabi | The idea of gnome-app-install is good... but how do the apps get into it! | 07:02 |
| Lathiat | so that you guys have a database and a name and it tells them who the package being installed is from | 07:03 |
| Burgundavia | wasabi, they get drawn out of launchpad | 07:03 |
| wasabi | Burgundavia, and launchpad is what? | 07:03 |
| Kamion | sigh, I said I wouldn't get drawn into this again. gone. | 07:03 |
| Burgundavia | wasabi, canonicals new web based do everything thing | 07:03 |
| wasabi | Kamion, nobody would argue it over and over again if a solution for this most obvious usecase was presented. ;) | 07:03 |
| Burgundavia | there is one coming | 07:03 |
| Kamion | wasabi: I have many other problems to solve | 07:03 |
| wasabi | That's fine. | 07:03 |
| Burgundavia | gnome-app-install, being driven off of launchpad | 07:03 |
| wasabi | Burgundavia, and I can add my own stuff to launchpad? | 07:04 |
| wasabi | As an ISV. | 07:04 |
| thom | Kamion: world hunger, jetlag? ;-) | 07:04 |
| zyga | wasabi: I'm interested in the answer as well :-) | 07:04 |
| Burgundavia | wasabi, ask sabdfl/mdz | 07:05 |
| === zyga was living under a rock lately and almost never heard of launchpad | ||
| wasabi | Well, I'm actually almost done with what I'm working on, so I'm going to give it a go. | 07:05 |
| wasabi | Since it's *so simple* | 07:05 |
| === zyga thinks that pseudo-dir in menu that enables people to install common apps would be way better than gnome-app-installer though | ||
| Kamion | thom: :-) | 07:07 |
| Kamion | more like "kbd-chooser is broken and nobody noticed for two months) | 07:07 |
| Kamion | " | 07:07 |
| thom | Kamion: huh. | 07:08 |
| zyga | any .desktop and .menu (or whatever it's called) gurus here? | 07:08 |
| Kamion | wasabi: sorry to snap; debugging broken stuff makes me cranky. :) | 07:09 |
| wasabi | that's ok. | 07:10 |
| wasabi | i didn't take it that way | 07:10 |
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| wasabi | Wish there was a suitable API to check if a source existed in sources.list | 07:12 |
| wasabi | counting for odd spacing, etc. | 07:12 |
| zyga | wasabi: linear find will do | 07:13 |
| === jbailey [~jbailey@dhcp802-2-37.dsl.ucc-net.ca] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| zyga | jbailey: hello | 07:14 |
| jbailey | zyga: Hello! | 07:15 |
| jbailey | (and everyone else too) | 07:15 |
| wasabi | hi | 07:15 |
| === gabi_ [~gabi@p549DEF95.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| jbailey | Jerry! | 07:16 |
| Kamion | morning jbailey | 07:16 |
| jbailey | Colin! | 07:16 |
| jbailey | It's a party. =) | 07:16 |
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| wasabi | zyga, the thing is if there is a line: deb http://site/dir suite dist1 dist2, and what needs to be added is only dist2. | 07:19 |
| wasabi | It will add a second line for dist2, even though it is already included | 07:19 |
| jbailey | doko: Around? | 07:19 |
| doko | jbailey: yes | 07:20 |
| jbailey | doko: Did the testsuite finish fine? | 07:20 |
| doko | doko: yes, although I didn't test the 64bit binaries, running on a i386 machine | 07:23 |
| jbailey | doko: I didn't touch any of the libraries at all, I just removed the lkh headers. I'll do a quick compare between the two to make sure, though. | 07:24 |
| jbailey | Assuming that's all good, I'll upload. | 07:24 |
| jbailey | Thanks for testing that. =) | 07:24 |
| jbailey | I do wonder if the whole amd64-libs package should just go away and we should setup biarch i386 stuff the same was sparc and s390 are done. | 07:25 |
| jbailey | (and presumably ppc64 will be done, too) | 07:25 |
| doko | nice, preparing the gcc upload orgy | 07:29 |
| === sm [~simon@lsanca1-ar5-4-60-051-162.lsanca1.dsl-verizon.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| zyga | wasabi: re | 07:31 |
| zyga | wasabi: hmm? | 07:32 |
| jbailey | doko: Do you want the ppc64 glibc for that too? | 07:33 |
| === gabi_ [~gabi@p549DEF95.dip.t-dialin.net] has left #ubuntu-devel ["Leaving"] | ||
| Kamion | wasabi: isn't that in libapt_pkg? | 07:37 |
| Kamion | libapt-pkg, sorry | 07:37 |
| Kamion | it certainly knows how to parse the file | 07:38 |
| Kamion | and that's exposed through python-apt (GetPkgSourceList) | 07:39 |
| doko | jbailey: can't really hurt ... so you do a glibc upload as well? | 07:41 |
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| === Kamion goes to help out with election stuff | ||
| Kamion | probably not around for the rest of the evening | 07:48 |
| thom | Kamion: hope it goes well | 07:55 |
| doko | thom: is he getting married? ;-) | 07:55 |
| thom | doko: no, he's doing general elections stuffs | 07:56 |
| === tseng|work [~ccc27a01@sls-eb20p9.dca2.superb.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
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| === jbailey [~jbailey@dhcp802-2-37.dsl.ucc-net.ca] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| azeem_ | this r0ml guy Ian is so fascinated about has blogged on installing Ubuntu: http://r0ml.net/blog/2005/04/20/new-laptop | 08:08 |
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| Lathiat | huzaah | 08:11 |
| Lathiat | his resolution only worked cus i got that bug fixed for those dell screens. :) | 08:11 |
| Lathiat | glad i did that before hoary released :) | 08:11 |
| Burgundavia | now he is going to tell his friends how great Ubuntu is | 08:11 |
| === seb128 [~seb128@ANancy-151-1-4-99.w83-194.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| === Yvonne [~help@cn-sdm-cr02-0229.dial.kabelfoon.nl] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| Lathiat | i wish i could email him and point out that turning off the tapping feature is as easy as commenting out one line in xorg.conf (well, thats not exactly easy, but fairly trivial) | 08:12 |
| Lathiat | except he has no contact details on his page | 08:12 |
| === Lathiat mumbles something about people misinforming people, notably the kind who dont know what they are talking about | ||
| Burgundavia | right | 08:12 |
| Burgundavia | he shouldn't have to comment out that line | 08:13 |
| Lathiat | yeh but it beats him trying to recompile his kernel | 08:14 |
| Burgundavia | what I am saying is that there should be a gui for it | 08:14 |
| azeem_ | Lathiat: http://r0ml.blogs.com/about.html | 08:16 |
| thom | Burgundavia: daniels has some ideas as to how that should work | 08:19 |
| Lathiat | azeem_: cool | 08:19 |
| mjg59 | Burgundavia: It's not actually easy to do | 08:19 |
| Burgundavia | thom, cool. did you get the url I sent you? | 08:19 |
| thom | yes, thanks | 08:19 |
| Burgundavia | cheers | 08:20 |
| mjg59 | There's all sorts of nasty security issues | 08:20 |
| Burgundavia | oh? | 08:21 |
| mjg59 | Well, if you want to control the pad directly | 08:21 |
| mjg59 | Otherwise it's something that needs to hack xorg.conf and then restart X | 08:21 |
| Burgundavia | hmm | 08:21 |
| thom | (daniel wants to move the thing into an X config extension) | 08:22 |
| === MasterYoda [~mnicholso@207.111.174.1] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| MasterYoda | do ubuntu and debian actively work together? | 08:27 |
| Burgundavia | yes | 08:28 |
| mdz | morning | 08:29 |
| MasterYoda | what do they do together? | 08:29 |
| MasterYoda | will ubuntu's xorg go into debian? are the packages compatiable? | 08:29 |
| MasterYoda | do they work to keep the packages compatiable? | 08:29 |
| mdz | MasterYoda: yes, it is likely that Debian will adopt Ubuntu's xorg packages when they are ready to upgrade | 08:33 |
| MasterYoda | what about gnome 10? | 08:34 |
| MasterYoda | gnome 2.10.... | 08:34 |
| mdz | gnome 2.10 is already in Debian experimental | 08:34 |
| ogra | morning | 08:35 |
| thom | mdz: hey, morning | 08:36 |
| MasterYoda | mdz: well yeah, but it's not the same as ubuntu's right? | 08:37 |
| mdz | thom: feeling better? | 08:40 |
| thom | mdz: much, thank you. i can walk again ;-) | 08:41 |
| dholbach | thom: what did you do? | 08:41 |
| mdz | MasterYoda: why would you say that? | 08:41 |
| MasterYoda | mdz: cause gnome on ubuntu looks different than on debian | 08:42 |
| mdz | MasterYoda: Debian has GNOME 2.8 in unstable (which is probably what you are running) and GNOME 2.10 in experimental | 08:42 |
| thom | dholbach: major sinus headaches | 08:42 |
| MasterYoda | mdz: right... | 08:42 |
| dholbach | thom: oh :-(((( | 08:42 |
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| MasterYoda | mdz: but the packages are not the same... | 08:44 |
| MasterYoda | nevermind | 08:44 |
| thom | dholbach: gone now, so it's all good | 08:44 |
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| seb128 | elmo_: around now? :) | 08:54 |
| elmo_ | seb128: kind of - I was planning on coming back later unless it's urgent? | 08:56 |
| elmo_ | [I've just done the gda thing, if it was that] | 08:56 |
| === jbailey stands in line for the "when elmo's back" queue. | ||
| jnc | hey.... | 08:57 |
| jnc | no openoffice.org-evolution | 08:57 |
| jnc | what's gives? | 08:57 |
| seb128 | elmo_: doing the same for poppler new binaries would rock but there is no hurry, thanks :) | 08:57 |
| seb128 | jnc: I don't understand the question | 08:57 |
| jnc | it's missing from amd64 | 08:57 |
| jnc | there's builds for powerpc and i386, but not amd64 | 08:58 |
| jnc | seb128: the question might be, what prevents openoffice.org-evolution from being built for amd64 target arch? | 08:59 |
| jnc | http://packages.ubuntu.com/breezy/gnome/openoffice.org-evolution | 08:59 |
| seb128 | jnc: no idea | 09:01 |
| jnc | okay going from those files (dsc, tarball, diffball) what would i do to try building a package here | 09:02 |
| jnc | debmaker or something? i don't build dpkgs all that often | 09:02 |
| seb128 | ask Mithrandir, he probably knows | 09:02 |
| jnc | Mithrandir: hail! how to attempt building 'openoffice.org-evolution' on amd64? | 09:03 |
| seb128 | lamont: around? | 09:03 |
| jnc | it looks like no one attempted amd64 | 09:04 |
| seb128 | there is an openoffice.org-amd64 | 09:04 |
| === MasterYoda [~mnicholso@207.111.174.1] has left #ubuntu-devel [] | ||
| jnc | hmm | 09:05 |
| jnc | i don't see it | 09:05 |
| Mithrandir | jnc: not, since it's an universe package, iirc | 09:17 |
| wasabi | an apt archive needs a place to put an image | 09:18 |
| Amaranth | what? | 09:18 |
| wasabi | http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/hoary/image.png or something similar. | 09:19 |
| wasabi | pondering third party repositories. | 09:19 |
| Amaranth | what use is that? | 09:19 |
| wasabi | Would be interesting to install third party software from apt, and have the repository show up in synaptic in a way that made it obvious what it was. | 09:20 |
| wasabi | Like, if commercial software distributors made their own apt repositories. | 09:20 |
| Amaranth | wasabi: I don't see commercial software makers setting up apt repositories any time soon | 09:21 |
| wasabi | Well let's fix that. | 09:21 |
| Amaranth | They'd probably move to autopackage before they'd do that. | 09:21 |
| Amaranth | Which imho is a better option, or at least will be. | 09:21 |
| wasabi | disagreed. | 09:21 |
| Amaranth | Why not? | 09:22 |
| wasabi | So complicated. | 09:22 |
| Amaranth | err | 09:22 |
| Amaranth | double clicking a file is complicated? | 09:22 |
| wasabi | the implementation behind it is. | 09:22 |
| Amaranth | but it's a lot simpler for users (double click vs editting sources.list) | 09:23 |
| wasabi | That's why im working on a very simple program to double click and edit sources.list. ;) | 09:24 |
| wasabi | I think I'm nearly done at 98 lines. | 09:24 |
| Amaranth | it edits sources.list automatically, gets the package, and then restores sources.list to it's original state? | 09:24 |
| wasabi | No need to restore it. | 09:25 |
| === rubenv [~lambda1@kotnet-148.kulnet.kuleuven.be] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| Amaranth | this has a GUI? | 09:26 |
| wasabi | No... we already have GUIs | 09:26 |
| Amaranth | not as good as the one for autopackage :) | 09:27 |
| wasabi | Synaptic can be (and should be made better) for other reasons. | 09:27 |
| Amaranth | *shrug* | 09:28 |
| Amaranth | You're fighting an uphill battle though. Once autopackage gets rpm and dpkg integration it'll be that much better than your tool. | 09:28 |
| Amaranth | Because rpms for 4 different distros and 1-3 debs won't be needed anymore. | 09:29 |
| Mithrandir | Amaranth: that's reinventing the wheel; if you want something like that, use LSB packages. | 09:29 |
| mdz | let's not have the autopackage argument (again) here; we've been over it in depth on the mailing list | 09:29 |
| Amaranth | LSB only does so much | 09:30 |
| mdz | wasabi: you should talk to mvo about the repository icon idea | 09:30 |
| === maskie [~maskie@196-30-109-99.uudial.uunet.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| jnc | Mithrandir: it's in the list of things to look into adding to the supported Ubuntu mix | 09:34 |
| jnc | not that it matters | 09:34 |
| Mithrandir | jnc: I'll veto it for amd64, since it would mean doing lots of more ia32-libs-style packaging. | 09:35 |
| Mithrandir | it's not really scalable to do that in the long run. | 09:36 |
| === loogaroo_ [sockd@h195202157016.moe.cm.kabsi.at] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| mako | mdz: ututo-e is theoretically bsd/gentoo based + some stuff from suse | 09:38 |
| wasabi | mdz, i will be, mostly im in Code Mode right now. ;0 | 09:47 |
| lamont | seb128: was hiding from you... whats up? | 09:49 |
| Mithrandir | azeem_: hi, any thoughts on getting a CVS snapshot of multisync with the gnokii support into breezy? | 09:50 |
| dholbach | lamont: some rebuilds i guess :-) | 09:50 |
| lamont | dholbach: sounds about right... | 09:50 |
| seb128 | lamont: please kick gnomedb planner builds | 09:50 |
| dholbach | yes! planner! :-) | 09:50 |
| seb128 | lamont: libgda2-3 has been moved from universe to main by elmo, now they should build | 09:50 |
| lamont | and gnumeric, of course./ | 09:51 |
| lamont | given back | 09:51 |
| azeem_ | Mithrandir: I'd prefer to kick the devs to release a new version, but they seem to be focused on opensync | 09:51 |
| Mithrandir | azeem_: what's opensync? :) | 09:51 |
| azeem_ | the fd.o replacement | 09:51 |
| seb128 | lamont: cool, thanks | 09:53 |
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| === `anthony [~anthony@220-253-45-35.VIC.netspace.net.au] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| Mithrandir | azeem_: what's the current state of that? | 09:54 |
| azeem_ | I am not sure, I think it is not on level with multisync yet, but catching up fast | 09:55 |
| Mithrandir | azeem_: do you think it's breezy material? | 09:55 |
| azeem_ | I wouldn't count on it | 09:56 |
| Mithrandir | hm, ok. | 09:56 |
| mdz | `anthony: what up, dawg | 10:01 |
| jnc | Mithrandir: are you looking for native compilation before incl. Ooo? | 10:02 |
| jbailey | Ugh. dpkg-divert and Replaces: don't seem to interact well. | 10:02 |
| Mithrandir | jnc: ooo2 is rumored to be vaguely 64-bit clean. I might find time to help out with that so we can get rid of the whole ia32-libs mess | 10:03 |
| === nullaresnata [~henriquem@cb-217-129-175-184.netvisao.pt] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| jnc | Mithrandir: that's what i'd like to see also | 10:04 |
| Burgundavia | anybody get through to b.g.o ? | 10:04 |
| jnc | bugs.gentoo.org ? | 10:05 |
| jnc | i'm a dev. what do you need | 10:05 |
| jnc | (gentoo dev) | 10:05 |
| Burgundavia | gnome | 10:05 |
| Burgundavia | ok, thats odd | 10:05 |
| Burgundavia | now I got through | 10:05 |
| === Burgundavia determines that it was user error | ||
| === jbailey gives up and goes for lunch. | ||
| Burgundavia | seb128, ping | 10:10 |
| seb128 | pong? | 10:11 |
| Burgundavia | seb128, I am digging throught b.g.o, looking for a similar bug, before I file dup. Regarding the copy dialog, when you already have a file at the dest. An option for showing the timestamp on each file | 10:12 |
| seb128 | what is a timestamp? | 10:12 |
| seb128 | why doing this? | 10:12 |
| Burgundavia | basically, say "file1" in folder1 was last editing yesterday. "file1" in folder2 was editing today. Do you want overwrite? | 10:13 |
| Treenaks | seb128: who are you and what did you do to seb128? ;) | 10:13 |
| seb128 | Treenaks: asking for an user, not for me | 10:14 |
| seb128 | Treenaks: "timestamp" doesn't really speak to lusers | 10:14 |
| seb128 | Burgundavia: that's clutter for nothing imho | 10:14 |
| Burgundavia | seb128, timestamp saying when each file was last edited is clutter? | 10:15 |
| seb128 | yep | 10:15 |
| === Burgundavia wonders about seb128 and his sanity | ||
| seb128 | if I copy a file over an another one that's on purpose | 10:15 |
| Burgundavia | what if I don't know? | 10:15 |
| Treenaks | seb128: how about it being in the "more info" arrow-opener | 10:15 |
| === `anthony [~anthony@220.253.111.129] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| seb128 | Burgundavia: why not the size of the file rather? | 10:15 |
| dholbach | lamont: could it be the buildlogs are on another place or something? | 10:15 |
| Burgundavia | date is often a better indicator than size | 10:16 |
| seb128 | dholbach: about? | 10:16 |
| Treenaks | seb128: sometimes you know you worked on a file yesterday or "last week" | 10:16 |
| dholbach | seb128: i tried some links on http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/byDate/today.html | 10:16 |
| Treenaks | seb128: but not how large it is | 10:16 |
| Burgundavia | and sometimes files shrink | 10:16 |
| Treenaks | seb128: saves you from opening both files and comparing | 10:16 |
| seb128 | because you work this way | 10:16 |
| seb128 | I know rather on the file properties than the date | 10:17 |
| lamont | dholbach: works for me.... | 10:17 |
| seb128 | BTW feel free to open a bug upstream | 10:17 |
| dholbach | lamont: hrm, now it works for me too | 10:17 |
| Burgundavia | seb128, I was wondering if a bug already existed | 10:17 |
| seb128 | maybe | 10:17 |
| seb128 | look on the closed bug too | 10:17 |
| seb128 | maybe that's closed :) | 10:17 |
| Burgundavia | i doubt it | 10:17 |
| seb128 | why? | 10:18 |
| seb128 | I would close it I think :p | 10:18 |
| Burgundavia | because it is useful | 10:18 |
| seb128 | that clutters the UI | 10:18 |
| Burgundavia | here is my use case: I have 2 presentations, one on a disk and one on a harddrive. If i just copy over, I have no idea which is newer | 10:18 |
| Burgundavia | unless I actually look at each | 10:18 |
| seb128 | yeah, I understand the usecase | 10:19 |
| seb128 | but that's not that common imho | 10:19 |
| seb128 | ie: you don't want that displayed all the time | 10:20 |
| Burgundavia | this would only come up when a conflict occurs | 10:20 |
| Burgundavia | only in the "conflict while copying" dialog | 10:20 |
| seb128 | http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=47893 | 10:21 |
| Burgundavia | open since 2001!!! | 10:22 |
| lamont | jbailey: you around? | 10:22 |
| Burgundavia | seb128, I might even have to learn how to code to fix it myself | 10:23 |
| seb128 | coding is easy | 10:23 |
| seb128 | coming with a good UI for that is what need the work | 10:24 |
| Burgundavia | ok | 10:24 |
| Burgundavia | I will do some hacking right now on that | 10:24 |
| seb128 | tseng: gnomedb fixed | 10:27 |
| === lamont is reminded of just how much he _HATES_ things like cdbs | ||
| dholbach | lamont: he went out for lunch | 10:28 |
| === dholbach is quite fond of cdbs :-) | ||
| === lamont is weaving through a maze of cdbs trying to figure out why it's deciding to not build anything | ||
| lamont | debian/rules build | 10:30 |
| lamont | make: Nothing to be done for `build'. | 10:30 |
| lamont | /usr/bin/fakeroot debian/rules binary | 10:30 |
| lamont | make: Nothing to be done for `binary'. | 10:30 |
| dholbach | which package is it? | 10:30 |
| lamont | e2tools, after you remove the build-dep on type-handling evilness | 10:31 |
| seb128 | lamont: you don't like "just work" things ? :) | 10:31 |
| lamont | seb128: not when they don't work, and debian/rules is all of 15 lines | 10:31 |
| crb | mako: ping | 10:31 |
| lamont | seb128: I like "just work" things just fine... It's "just doesn't work" that I don't like | 10:32 |
| seb128 | doesn't happen a lot with cdbs which is nice | 10:32 |
| seb128 | dunno what you have do to break it this way | 10:32 |
| lamont | s/nice/why I'm cdbs illiterate/ | 10:33 |
| dholbach | lamont: maybe because of this: | 10:33 |
| dholbach | edd: e2tools source: no-architecture-field | 10:33 |
| dholbach | wasabi: e2tools source: build-depends-without-arch-dep | 10:33 |
| lamont | dholbach: doh | 10:33 |
| === lamont finishes ripping type-handling out | ||
| lamont | edd? | 10:34 |
| dholbach | oops E : became edd: and W : became wasabi: | 10:34 |
| lamont | from lintian? | 10:34 |
| dholbach | yes, after pasting | 10:34 |
| dholbach | L: | 10:34 |
| dholbach | hrm | 10:34 |
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| lamont | dholbach: auto-nick-completion is evil, you know... | 10:35 |
| === Evaso [~balmus@ppp-71-217.24-151.libero.it] has left #ubuntu-devel ["Client] | ||
| dholbach | seems to be... | 10:35 |
| lamont | fixed e2tools uploaded, and the other byDate polluters promotion needs requested | 10:37 |
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| wasabi | Hmm. gksudo is weird. It's putting '''s around my arguments. | 10:43 |
| wasabi | i wonder how you work with that from a .desktop file | 10:44 |
| === nullaresnata [~henriquem@cb-217-129-175-184.netvisao.pt] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| jbailey | lamont: I'm here now. | 10:59 |
| lamont | jbailey: is ok. | 10:59 |
| lamont | we figured it out... | 11:00 |
| jbailey | lamont: Get my hopes up and throw my love away then. See if I care. ;) | 11:00 |
| jbailey | lamont: While I've got you here, can you give-back lvm2? | 11:01 |
| jbailey | retry, it rather. | 11:01 |
| wasabi | gksudo is putting '''s around all my args. =( | 11:02 |
| === wasabi beats it | ||
| lamont | done | 11:02 |
| jbailey | lamont: jbailey^^ ? | 11:02 |
| lamont | jbailey: yes | 11:03 |
| jbailey | lamont: Thanks. =) | 11:03 |
| jnc | oh geeze | 11:05 |
| jnc | printing not working in breezy | 11:05 |
| jnc | silly me | 11:05 |
| === lamont tells printing to take a number. :-) | ||
| jnc | well... | 11:06 |
| jnc | should i try downgrading | 11:06 |
| Burgundavia | how do I center text in glade? | 11:06 |
| jnc | or wait a day or two | 11:06 |
| thom | or just don't run breezy if you need everything to work | 11:07 |
| jnc | well, not everything works anyways | 11:08 |
| opi | at least you can whine then :-) | 11:08 |
| Burgundavia | seb128, http://img161.echo.cx/img161/6384/filecopydialogtest5yx.png | 11:08 |
| jnc | opi: *sigh* | 11:08 |
| opi | you can not whine with Breezy :) | 11:08 |
| jnc | amd64 hoary has a lot of... trouble patches | 11:08 |
| jnc | like meteorite holes | 11:08 |
| thom | i've had no problems with hoary/amd64 | 11:09 |
| jnc | hmm.. no printing from openoffice | 11:09 |
| jnc | no openoffice.org-evolution | 11:09 |
| opi | jnc: I know, I know. But what can yo do except for helping with Breezy | 11:09 |
| jnc | opi: eh. i'd sure like to start | 11:09 |
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| jnc | it's like, whining and downgrading doesn't do much to help you guys | 11:11 |
| jnc | having breezy and not understanding OOo doesn't do much for y'all either :/ | 11:11 |
| seb128 | Burgundavia: that's quite ugly but that gives the idea :) | 11:12 |
| Burgundavia | seb128, there are some serious spacing and text issues | 11:13 |
| === koke [~koke@adsl229-164.unizar.es] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| Burgundavia | seb128, is there a default arrow icon in gtk? | 11:14 |
| seb128 | yep | 11:15 |
| Burgundavia | hmm | 11:15 |
| Mithrandir | jnc: printing to a file then running lp on that afterwards work fine for me. The other printing bug is known, I just haven't gotten around to fixing it. | 11:15 |
| Burgundavia | I didn't find it | 11:15 |
| Burgundavia | I just did | 11:16 |
| Burgundavia | but it won't let me select it | 11:16 |
| JanC | hm, someone (a linux newbie) tried to use FAT32 partition as /home when he was installing hoary | 11:16 |
| Mithrandir | JanC: that breaks horribly. | 11:16 |
| JanC | resulting in the installer not being able to create a user directory etc. | 11:17 |
| === GheRivero [~ghe@81.172.92.56] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| JanC | can't the installer detect something like that ? | 11:17 |
| Mithrandir | JanC: known issue; too late to fix. A bug has been filed already and it'll be fixed for breezy. | 11:17 |
| JanC | ah, okay | 11:17 |
| Mithrandir | so for now the fix is "don't do that, then" | 11:17 |
| lamont | jbailey: lvm2 will build better once libdevmapper1.01 is in main. :-( (requested) | 11:18 |
| JanC | that's what I said ;-) | 11:18 |
| jbailey | lamont: Oh, I hadn't noticed that. I saw it failing to build because of missing libraries, and then noticed that devmapper was FTBFS, so I fixed that. | 11:19 |
| lamont | jbailey: np | 11:19 |
| lamont | gcj: Depends: g++ (>= 4:4.0-0) but 4:3.3.5-4 is to be installed | 11:19 |
| === lamont nudges doko | ||
| jbailey | lamont: Probably asleep, since he was sick. | 11:20 |
| jbailey | lamont: I confirmed the upload a couple hours ago for him of amd64-libs, though, which makes gcc actually buildable again. | 11:20 |
| jbailey | His plan I think was to upload gcc and check on it in the morning. | 11:20 |
| Burgundavia | seb128, I committed the screenshot to the bug | 11:20 |
| lamont | jbailey: yeah - I talked with him about the time amd64-libs made it into the archive | 11:20 |
| seb128 | Burgundavia: k | 11:20 |
| doko | half asleep, will be fixed, when we make g++-4.0 the default | 11:20 |
| jbailey | doko: That's about 2 weeks out, yes? | 11:21 |
| lamont | doko: and then db4.2, libtool, and several others will be buildable. | 11:21 |
| doko | jbailey: heh, no, next week ... | 11:22 |
| doko | lamont: db4.2 needs to be rebuilt anyway, because it builds a C++ library. I think, we should stop the automatic sync from unstable, until we rebuilt all our C++ libs | 11:23 |
| Burgundavia | seb128, sorry, you just spammed with 4 emails from the one bug | 11:24 |
| === nullaresnata [~henriquem@cb-217-129-175-184.netvisao.pt] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| === `anthony [~anthony@220-253-48-47.VIC.netspace.net.au] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
| jnc | oh man | 11:44 |
| jnc | printing != working for me... != cool | 11:44 |
| jnc | where do i start to fix it? | 11:44 |
| jnc | it looks like the locale is confusing perl | 11:44 |
| jnc | on some kind of back-end to cups | 11:44 |
| jnc | the alternative is to downgrade but i'm not exactly sure how one goes about doing that | 11:45 |
| seb128 | ? | 11:54 |
| mako | crb: hey ddue | 11:54 |
| wasabi | gksudo is giving me headaches. | 11:59 |
| === Loevborg [~loevborg@d34-2.dip.isp-service.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel | ||
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