/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2005/05/20/#kubuntu-devel.txt

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dokomorning08:11
dokoamu, haggai, Riddell: will you recompile KDE using -fvisibility?08:18
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hungerAny chance of finding somebody willing to rebuild and upload a kdebase?08:58
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Jd101will kubuntu get update to kde 3.4.x bug fix releases?09:42
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Jd101anybody knows if kubuntu will get kde 3.4.x bug fix releases? ( kde 3.4.1 , kde 3.4.2 ...)09:44
RiddellJd101: should do yes09:51
Riddelldoko: we probably should yes?09:52
Jd101Riddell: thank you. I was hoping so. since they will be bug fixes and not new features.09:52
Jd101Riddell: in #kde ,  someone said kde 3.4.1 will branch before the end on this month. imo, kde 3.4.0 was released by kde.org too hastily so I would be happy for a kde 3.4.1 bug fix relase09:56
amumoin10:07
amuRiddell: 3.4.1 has such a option ? ( -fvisibility=hidden )   10:08
Riddellamu: I think so10:14
amuas i understood, the deb are bit smaller, and only those, which use a lot of inline funktions ... right? 10:16
Riddelland faster to load10:23
amurocks, now i can get it faster crashed *meducks* 10:25
JReis there a kat package for kubuntu?10:43
RiddellJRe: nope10:44
Riddellbut I think they have a debian package, you could see if it compiles10:44
JReRiddell: yeah10:45
JReRiddell: it's  an unofficial package btw10:50
Riddellsee if you can improve it with your new elite packaging skills :)10:52
Riddellhttp://www.tuxmagazine.com/node/1000130 "The Kubuntu Distribution"10:52
amuRiddell: cool11:24
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=== hunger sighs.
hungerLooks like I have to rebuild kdebase myself:-(12:16
KaiL_you want support for new dbus/hal?12:18
=== hunger nods.
hungerKaiL_: Basically I want a up to date breezy. I do not care about dbus/hal specifically.12:19
KaiL_maybe Riddell  is already woring on it?12:20
KaiL_+k12:20
hungerKaiL_: He wanted to wait for the gcc transition and/or kde 3.4.1.12:21
KaiL_I love breezy - updates every few hours :)12:21
hungerKaiL_: So do I:-)12:21
KaiL_bah12:21
KaiL_he waits to much12:21
hungerKaiL_: But that does not help if they are blocked by sensible maintainers that do not want to waste their precious time on updatejunkies like us.12:22
KaiL_apt-cache rdepends dbus-1 ...long list...12:22
KaiL_maybe there's more than just a recompile needed12:33
hungerKaiL_: Somebody started to rebuild kdebase yesterday... Too bad he is not around to report his findings.12:44
JReallee: Wow i have made a package using the cdbs patch utilities it's impressive!01:04
JReA kat package for kubuntu is comming ;) !01:05
KaiL_kat uploaded?01:05
JReyes01:05
JRe0.5.101:05
JReit works man i need to edit a manpage :( the copryght :(01:05
JReit works BUT01:06
JReallee: automatic control management is very good too ;)01:06
hungerJRe: Where is the kat deb? Can I test it?01:12
JRehunger: Kat is a file indexer for Kde01:13
JRehunger: i polish the package and give it to you!01:13
JRehunger: take a look here http://www.kde-apps.org/content/show.php?content=2213501:13
hungerJRe: I know what it is, that is why I am asking where I can get it:-)01:14
JRehunger: you want that i put a test version just right now are you prefere waiting to the copyright file to be written?01:16
hungerJRe: I am just volunteering to test whenever you are ready.01:17
JRehunger: okay i will notify you in few hours ;)01:18
hungerJRe: I'll use whatever you think worth testing.01:18
dokoamu, Riddell, haggai: please no new qt-x11-free upload until Monday01:44
Riddelldoko: ok01:45
=== amu tries the 3.3.4 one
dokoamu: I have the 3.3 already converted ... *slap*01:49
amudoko: do you have a buildlog? 01:57
dokonot yet02:00
dokoamu: something wrong?02:01
amudoko: nope, just interessting02:11
dokouploading packages to chinstrap:~doko/cxxbin/02:12
KaiL_Riddell: now it's going to get even more funny with breezy02:13
RiddellKaiL_: what is?02:14
KaiL_apt-get now wants to remove kdebase-kio-plugins and everything depending on it02:14
amuKaiL_: wait for the new qtlibs :) that's real fun *eg* 02:28
hungeramu: You bastards are breaking my box. ;-)02:29
hungeramu: Man, this is the fun of using a development distri!02:29
=== hunger likes it.
KaiL_that's why I have my K6-202:30
KaiL_at least one box, which doesn't break ;)02:30
hungerFun and excitement whenever upgrading something, the challenge of comming up with excuses whenever your boss needs you to do something:-)02:31
hungerKaiL_: I can always roll back the upgrades... no need to have a old box sit around.02:32
KaiL_hunger: year, apt-get install package/hoary is always a good way to get something back to work02:33
KaiL_but one think I know:02:33
KaiL_one day, maybe with the breezy release, this box will finally get a reinstall - here's to much debian leftover02:33
KaiL_afaik it's potato -> woody -> sarge -> hoary -> breezy02:37
KaiL_...so maybe a reinstall won't be the worst idea02:37
hungerKaiL_: I do snapshots before upgrading... so I can examine the changes and back them out manually.02:41
hungerKaiL_: If everything breaks I can tar up the old state and copy that over the new one;-)02:42
KaiL_also a way02:42
hungerKaiL_: That screws up the dpkg db though:-( I tend to forget to snapshot /var;-)02:43
JRehttp://jr.falleri.free.fr/fichiers/kubuntu/kat/02:45
JRefor those who wants to test02:46
KaiL_what a timing - I just cleaned out the old one ;)02:46
JRe;)02:47
hungerWhy do all the kde apps need such an annoying intro-screen nowadays?02:49
hungerJRe: Help does not work for me... is that missing in the original?02:50
=== KaiL_ hates splash screens, could you disable that? :)
JReyeah02:51
=== KaiL_ let's it import every possible information from /home/KaiL *g*
JReso what do you thinks about the package?02:53
JRekail seems to not appreciate at all ;)02:54
hungerLooks good to me.02:56
hungerJRe: You might want to add a help page saying that no help is available.02:56
hungerJRe: otherwise you might get bugreports about that:-)02:57
JRe;)02:57
Riddellanyone got quark, photoshop or illustrator and want to design the kubuntu CDs?02:57
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KaiLhmm02:59
KaiLneeds a little bit to much RAM, if you ask me02:59
=== hunger does not see kat handle pdfs...
hungerRiddell: I do not use proprietary SW in non-business settings.03:02
KaiLhunger: it read the meta infos from pdfs03:02
hungerKaiL: I want the text, not the meta info...03:03
hungerKaiL: Nobody ever puts anything useful into the meta fields anyway:-)03:03
hungerJRe: Looks like you did good work.03:04
KaiLthe app isn't really ready, but the package looks ok for me03:05
JRehunger: thanx ;)03:07
hungerJRe: The deb works for me, the list of files seems to be OK, 03:08
JRethe diffstat is quite good, also ;) 03:08
JReno unneeded file03:08
JRehunger: okay i have contacted the usptream so that the patches will be included in the nex kat release03:13
amuRiddell: tackat? 03:14
hungerWell, kat needs some more work...03:15
hungerJRe: But that is neither your fault nor unexpected;-)03:15
JRehunger: yeah but i think it's a good project!03:16
hungerJRe: Still crashes a bit often... but that is normal for a KDE app:-(03:19
JRehunger: yeah you're right :)03:20
JRei hope that one day gmail will support khtml!03:21
amu$ gmail03:26
amubash: gmail: command not found03:26
=== hunger twiddles, waiting for kat.
=== amu looks for tango?!? the spotlight blubb
JReamu: ???03:28
amuerr tenor 03:32
Riddellsssh amu, tango is a top secret project03:35
hungerRiddell: sssh? A secret ssh?03:36
hungerRiddell: Super Secure SHell?03:37
Riddellhunger: more super secret than that03:37
amutopsec ? :) On LinuxPlanet, Kurt Pfeifle explains details about Tenor 03:37
JRe:)03:38
Riddellno no tenor isn't top secret at all03:38
Riddelltango is super secret03:38
Riddellwhich is why it's daft of this lady to have put it in her biography http://2005.guadec.org/schedule/speakers.html03:38
amuRiddell: :) ups 03:39
JRewaa tango project seems great03:42
JRe;)03:42
Riddellhmm, no03:43
Riddellit's the ximian half of novell being silly03:43
JRe!03:44
=== hunger saw Scotts presentation at fosdem.
=== hunger sighs... kat tried to index /proc.
Riddellhunger: that means we must have been in the same room03:51
JRehunger: try /usr/share/doc03:53
JRehunger: the kat upstream wonders if the kat package will be in the universe?03:54
Riddellshould be, just needs me and a couple of others to review it03:55
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JReokay i reply this to him03:55
JReRiddell: should make an author section in KubuntuPackagingGuide to thanks the debian guide author, allee, cdbs tutorial author, ...03:59
JRe???03:59
RiddellJRe: if you wish03:59
JReRiddell: okay03:59
alleeJRe: How about poke cdbs tut authors a bit too ;)  They flame KDE, so I guess a little (ironic) note with a smiley can't hurt ;)04:31
amuJRe: cool stuff that KubuntuPackagingGuide04:36
JReallee: yeah they have flamed KDE but they have take it out from the new version04:47
JReallee: but i will add a funny note, you're right04:47
JReamu: thanks :)04:47
alleeJRe: really? it still was there yesterday.  checking ...04:48
datoJRe: "take it out" what, and from were?04:48
JRedato: https://perso.duckcorp.org/duck/cdbs-doc/cdbs-doc.xhtml => no more kde flame04:49
datoah, right. the tutorial. nvm, then.04:49
JReallee: he does not update the wiki anymore04:51
hungerRiddell: I had kat index / :-)04:52
alleeJRe: right, I've seen the note.  But because was _this_ the page I read 'long' ago.  I didn't look for another version.  The flame version is also #4 in google.04:53
JRehunger: you have indexed /proc?04:53
JReallee: okay i have made a joke on him :)04:53
allee;)   I hope they don't get it wrong.  They did a create job!04:54
alleeJRe: and you too04:55
JReallee: thanks :)04:55
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hungerHow do you update the DB?05:03
JReRiddell: are the kubuntu policies exactly the same than debian ones?05:05
JRehunger: i don't have any idea 05:05
hungerJRe: I guess it does not yet work.05:05
JRehunger: the package or the program?05:06
hungerJRe: The program.05:06
hungerJRe: As said earlier: The package seems fine to me.05:06
hungerJRe: It is version 0.5.1 after all, so such things are to be expected.05:06
JRehunger: yeah i see it when i compile there was typical error of a 0.5.1 version ;)05:08
JRehunger: even some text are written bad, like tat instead of Stats05:09
JRehunger: but it's under active development!05:09
hungerJRe: It can only get better;-)05:13
JRehunger: yeah and moreover this kind of application will be a serious advantage for kde05:13
hungerJRe: Dunno... Something like tonor (or however it was called) is.05:15
JRewaouw amarok 1.3 overview on planetkde ;)05:15
JRehunger: what is dunno?05:20
hungerJRe: Whether kat is such a huge step forward.05:21
hungerJRe: It and its kind are basically a overhyped grep ;-)05:21
JRehunger: yeah grep under amphetamine :)05:23
hungerJRe: well, grep has current data at all times... which I do not see with i.e. kat.05:24
JRehunger: sure! i am also a great fan of command-line05:25
hungerJRe: This has nothing to do with commandline.05:25
JRehunger: grep is powerfull with cat and for05:26
JRehunger: no?05:26
hungerJRe: Generating an index implies the need to keep that current or the value of the information stored therein is going to dimish over time.05:26
JRehunger: okay i see what you mean05:27
JRehunger: yeah you're right grep is always up-to-date05:27
hungerJRe: So there needs to be a way to keep the index up to date... if that has to happen manually then the whole system is meaningless.05:27
hungerJRe: My parents will never ever figure out how to update some index or see the need to do so... they will just complain that Linux sucks, because it can not find their documents.05:28
JRehunger: yeah for sure it would be meaningless to do a half an hour update before each search ;)05:28
hungerWell, I am positive that some solution will be found...05:30
JRehunger: i hope too05:30
hungerPreferably some system wide indexing daemon (implies security issues)... otherwise lots of users will waste resources reindexing the same data all the time.05:31
JRehunger: because in few months, my parents will have kubuntu on the computer ;)05:31
JRehunger: basicly, it's the central point of such an application, no?05:32
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opiOi guys05:32
JRelo05:32
opiis that a known bug:05:32
opiUnpacking replacement kdelibs-data ...05:32
opidpkg: error processing /var/cache/apt/archives/kdelibs-data_4%3a3.4.0-0ubuntu3.1_all.deb (--unpack):05:32
opi trying to overwrite `/usr/share/icons/default.kde', which is also in package knetworkconf05:32
opiErrors were encountered while processing:05:32
opi /var/cache/apt/archives/kdelibs-data_4%3a3.4.0-0ubuntu3.1_all.deb05:32
opiE: Sub-process /usr/bin/dpkg returned an error code (1)05:32
opiafter fetching security updates05:32
hungerJRe: Not in kat... or so it seems, guessing based on the use of sqllite.05:32
JRehunger: yeah i had to install libsqlite3-dev05:33
Riddelldoko: can I upload a new kdebase or will that get in the way of c++ transition?05:34
hungerRiddell: Fixing the hal/dbus issue?05:34
JReopi yeah i had this bug too05:34
dokoRiddell: thats ok05:34
opiRiddell: should I fill this?05:34
Riddellhunger: yes05:34
JReopi: solution: remove knetworkconf05:35
JReopi: install kdelibs405:35
opiJRe: nah05:35
JReopi: reinstall knetworkconf05:35
Riddellopi: that's known, waiting on mdz to approve the new knetworkconf05:35
opiJRe: dpkg --force-all will do the trick05:35
hungerRiddell: Great! Thanks for rebuilding this.05:35
opiRiddell: OK, I just wanted to notice you05:35
JReopi: yeah it's an other option :) :)05:35
uniq--force-overwrite is enought force all is generally bad :)05:36
uniq+,05:36
hungerJRe: thinking about it: A global indexing service is not enough: You can not have the user's data in a central DB.05:38
hungerJRe: So you need a system DB plus user DBs... and indexing daemons to keep those updated.05:38
JRehunger: yeah i would probably be the best!05:39
hungerJRe: ... might be worse considering replacing man then, that keeps an extra index for "man -k" IIRC.05:39
=== hunger shivers, thinking about dozends of indexing daemons running...
JRehunger: it would take a lot of cpu05:40
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nanomadjust a quik questio...05:41
hungerJRe: Think of a university server... those have to handle 50 terminals and more.05:41
nanomadkubuntu broken now=05:41
nanomad?05:41
hungernanomad: On breezy?05:41
nanomadyes05:41
hungernanomad: yes, Riddle has new debs, but does not know whether he should upload them yet.05:42
JRehunger: i have always had many respects for this kind of servers;)05:42
nanomadhunger, hope he will upload them soon...05:43
nanomadRiddell, can u give me those debs...'cause i need konqueror...and the IO slaves...05:43
uniqnanomad: deb http://dev.kubuntu.org.uk/~jr/kubuntu/breezy/ ./05:44
nanomadthx05:44
nanomadwhy dont add it in topic?05:47
Riddelland uploaded to breezy, should appear in a couple of hours05:47
nanomadhope that...05:47
nanomadthx for repos....just d/l05:48
nanomadall working...except for apt-listbugs...05:52
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hungerFinally managed to log in again!06:25
JReokay bye evrybody!06:26
hungerRiddell: Kontact broke during the upgrade: Kmail plugin is not found.06:28
hungerRiddell: Sorry, false alarm: I had to deinstall kmail.06:29
uniqkdebase-kio-plugins is missing on dev.kubuntu.org.uk.. fyi. it's kdebase too, right? 06:30
hungerIs "icon for hotplug hds" supposed to work now?06:30
uniqkonq wont install without kdebase-kio-plugins.. 06:31
uniqnevermind me.. duh.06:34
uniqapt-get update is generally a good idea.06:34
hungerThe "icon on desktop on usbstick plugin" is supposed to work in ubuntu.06:39
KaiLideas for both of you: first look, then let apt-get uninstall stuff ;)06:40
KaiL...or better don't, if it's kmail and konq06:40
hungerKaiL: Apt always does the looking for me!06:41
KaiLhunger: and so uninstalled konqueror and kmail? :)06:41
hungerKaiL: Apt did that to me;-)06:42
hungerKaiL: I did not have trouble with konqi.06:42
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KaiLexcept it got uninstalled due to the dbus update? ;)06:43
hungerKaiL: Yeap:-)06:43
KaiLoh, there's new kdebase? :)06:44
hungerKaiL: Yeap, but I installed that manually from Riddels site.06:44
hungerKaiL: So the usual apt-magic did not apply... hence the kmail trouble I had.06:45
KaiLaah!06:45
amuRiddell: qt3.3.4 build fine now, execpt some brocken automerge depends  06:46
=== KaiL updates then
amuKaiL, hunger do you want the new qt-lib? 06:49
hungeramu: I wouldn't mind...06:49
KaiLI guess it will break everythink, which doesn't run away fast enough? ;)06:50
hungerkubuntu-desktop still depends on the old dbus...06:50
amunope, builded that kde still works :) 06:50
=== KaiL watches this dbus update fun...
uniqhmm.. where is libdbus-qt-1-dev supposed to be? 06:51
KaiLhal needs a cleaned config file..06:52
hungerKaiL: It works is gnome...06:55
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KaiLmaybe I'd played to much in that file before06:55
KaiLgar06:55
KaiLhmm, I don't see hard disks any more in media:/ - bug or feature? :)06:56
amumisconfiguration ;)06:58
KaiLhere or in the default?06:58
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amuat your sys ... installed a brand new sys yesterday, it just works06:58
hungerDamn... turned of device icons on my desktop. No wonder nothing turned up.06:59
KaiLamu: with the new hal?06:59
KaiLugh, also no icon for my usbstick :(06:59
hungerkonqi fails to open the device now:-(07:01
KaiLhunger: you onl get an icon for the floppy in media:/?07:01
Riddellhttp://muse.19inch.net/~jr/tmp/kubuntu-sleeve.pdf07:01
KaiLand same on the desktop?07:01
hungerKaiL: Yes.07:01
KaiLthen that's not only me :(07:01
hungerKaiL: The dir is even mounted in media.07:02
KaiLRiddell: do you have your own packages running?07:02
amuKaiL: old one, breezy & hoary07:02
uniqriddell: where did you get libdbus-qt-1-dev from? to build kdebase.. 07:02
hungerKaiL: konqi is just unable to read it.07:02
KaiLlibdbus-qt-1-dev - simple interprocess messaging system (Qt interface)07:02
Riddelluniq: from breezy07:02
KaiLpool/universe/d/dbus/libdbus-qt-1-dev_0.33-0ubuntu1_i386.deb07:03
uniqok.. so my apt-cache and packages.ubuntu.com is br0ken.07:03
KaiLRiddell: nice image!07:03
KaiLp.u.c is to slow for breezy ;)07:04
KaiLRiddell: nice that you recompiled it, but: it doesn't work :)07:04
amuRiddell: sweet 07:05
hungerI can view my usbstick in konqui in /media/sda1, but not in media:/sda1 :-(07:07
RiddellKaiL: ah well, I'll take a closer look at it once the g++ stuff is done, thanks for the report07:07
KaiL:)07:07
KaiLshould I file a bug? just to point asking people to..07:08
amuplease file a bug07:10
hungerKaiL: A bug about what?07:10
KaiLhunger: empty media:/07:10
hungerKaiL: Good!07:10
hungerKaiL: I was just going to report that;-)07:10
KaiLdamn07:10
hungerWhich package should I report "wierd audio cd eject behaviour in kde" against?07:11
KaiLuhm?07:11
amueject ? 07:12
KaiLwired in which way?07:12
KaiLwierd..07:12
hungerI insert a CD, icon appears, I click on it and do "eject". CD is ejected, icon stays forever.07:12
amuxorg .. or loadkeys ;) 07:12
KaiLoh, funny07:12
amukdebase-kio-plugins07:12
KaiLhunger: do you get a second one with a second cd?07:12
hungerKaiL: Just searching for another CD:-)07:13
KaiLhunger: mail for cc in bug?07:13
hungerKaiL: tobias at aquazul dot com07:13
hungerKaiL: Next CD replaces the icon.07:14
KaiLseams to have worked07:14
hungerKaiL: Doesent work with data CDs though...07:14
hungerStrange... works now.07:15
KaiLdta CDs also don't work really good07:17
hungerKaiL: All will be well in kde 3.4.1 (I hope).07:17
=== KaiL too
KaiLamu: now you, let's break the other half :)07:18
=== hunger agrees with KaiL
hungerSo far the hard part was broken dependencies on dbus:-)07:18
KaiLbetter 1 week with a deadly broken media:/ than without konqueror and kmail07:19
amuKaiL: probably some hours later, first i'll install it here, than on Riddell's maschine, if everything works fine you get it. 07:19
KaiLfirst break your own - good idea :)07:20
hungerKaiL: My konqui behaves a bit different from yours.07:22
amuKaiL: sure :)   07:24
KaiLhunger: interesting, I had what you described with a cdrom here07:25
hungeramu: As a developer you should not risk your own system! Who will provide you with fixes when your system gets broken? :-)07:27
=== hunger grins.
amu... it will not break *g*07:45
hungeramu: I think that qualifies for "famous last words".07:47
KaiLfeature request (category: "you don't have? you damn bastards!" ;): system  restore..07:48
hungerKaiL: You do not know tar? ;-)07:50
=== KaiL does, that ***censored*** didn't
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