[12:04] <mkde> hi burgs
[12:22] <Burgundavia> salut
[03:10] <jsgotangco> hellp
[03:10] <jsgotangco> wait
[03:10] <jsgotangco> that didnt go right
[03:10] <jsgotangco> hello
[05:21] <mpt> That Winton guy is cool
[05:29] <mpt> jdub: ping
[06:46] <Burgundavia> salut mpt 
[06:51] <jsgotangco> Burgundavia, salut
[06:53] <Burgundavia> salut jsgotangco 
[06:53] <mpt> afternoon
[06:53] <Burgundavia> how goes life for all?
[06:53] <mpt> That jdub is a busy fellow
[06:53] <jsgotangco> oh im thinking of taking up french classes
[06:54] <jsgotangco> its a toss up between french and german
[06:57] <Burgundavia> hmm, french is more widely spoken in the world
[06:57] <Burgundavia> and I have heard german is a bitch to learn
[06:58] <jsgotangco> hmmm i think german is more on delivery..it has a lot of english root words
[06:58] <jsgotangco> for french, yeah i can go to quebec or in some african country and still speak it
[06:58] <Burgundavia> quebecois is french, but don't tell the french that
[06:58] <Burgundavia> and the french they speak in africa has got a crazy accent
[06:59] <jsgotangco> heh
[06:59] <jsgotangco> is your french good?
[07:03] <Burgundavia> not anymore
[07:03] <Burgundavia> used to be almost fluent
[07:05] <Burgundavia> I stopped using it just before i got the point where I would always remember it, and I haven't used it since
[07:06] <Burgundavia> if I moved to a french speaking area/country, I would pick it up quickly
[07:11] <jsgotangco> yeah sounds logical to do that
[07:38] <jsgotangco> brb
[07:46] <froud> African Greetings
[07:47] <Burgundavia> salut froud 
[07:48] <froud> Burgundavia: got your pgp key stuff sorted yet?
[07:48] <Burgundavia> not yet, not heard back from elmo
[07:48] <Burgundavia> I will ping him tomorrow
[07:50] <froud> life is slow
[07:51] <froud> Burgundavia: enrico committed deb packaging for computer dictionary
[07:52] <froud> at http://computerdictionary.tsf.org.za/dictionary/packages/computerdictionary_1.0-1_all.deb
[07:53] <froud> I am gonna use it to generate glossary on generic install guide
[07:54] <froud> let people see how it works, if they like then then we can use it as a build dependancy on the docs that have glossary
[07:55] <froud> makes life a bit easier when we have a glossary, no need to explain certain things
[07:56] <froud> if user does not understand, they will click to the glossary
[07:57] <Burgundavia> installs cleanly
[07:57] <froud> yes
[07:58] <froud> I committed a patch to svn that makes our xsl custom layer aware of it
[08:00] <froud> if you wrap words like this
Set your <glossterm linkend="NetAddr">network address</glossterm>.

[08:00] <froud> opps
Set your <glossterm linkend="NetAddr">network address</glossterm>.

[08:00] <froud> ooop
[08:01] <froud> <glossterm linkend="N-id-number-of-term">network address</glossterm>
[08:02] <froud> when terms are marked this way you will get an automatically generate glossary
[08:02] <froud> when
[08:02] <froud> <glossary role="auto">
[08:02] <froud>         <glossentry>
[08:02] <froud>             <glossterm>Dummy</glossterm>
[08:02] <froud>             <glossdef>
[08:02] <froud>                 <para>Now you see me, next you won't.</para>
[08:02] <froud>             </glossdef>
[08:02] <froud>         </glossentry>
[08:02] <froud>     </glossary>
[08:02] <froud> is placed at the end of a docment
[08:03] <froud> Since the dictionary will be installed in the same place for everyone, it will be easy for a person to reference it
[08:04] <froud> if the dictionary is not installed then the glossary will generate, but will be empty
[08:04] <froud> Burgundavia: what do you think?
[08:04] <Burgundavia> very cool
[08:05] <Burgundavia> how do we change stuff in the glossary? work with upstream?
[08:05] <froud> There is much redundancy in the glossary database
[08:05] <froud> I will give accounts to those who wish to commit
[08:05] <froud> you up to it?
[08:05] <froud> for example the term DHCP is full ofduplicates
[08:05] <Burgundavia> sure, I could tweak. I dislike writing huge docs
[08:06] <froud> this doc is a fork from the LDP Linux Dictionary
[08:06] <froud> OK send me a username and password by email
[08:06] <Burgundavia> can do
[08:09] <froud> did you send it?
[08:10] <Burgundavia> done now
[08:12] <froud> Burgundavia: OK in pwd do svn://computerdictionary.tsf.org.za/terms/trunk terms
[08:13] <froud> Burgundavia: OK in pwd do svn://computerdictionary.tsf.org.za/terms/trunk terms --username ??? --password ????
[08:13] <froud> just incase you forgot
[08:14] <froud> Burgundavia: As I said, you will find that there is much duplication in the database, we are working to reduce this
[08:15] <froud> Burgundavia: this will normalize the database, so that it is easier to work with
[08:15] <froud> Burgundavia: you will find that we xref to biblio
[08:16] <froud> This enables you to copy from network or book sources and give credits
[08:16] <froud> I plan to add support for the bibliograpghy to generic install guide soon
[08:17] <froud> So unless you write it yourself, you must make a bibliographic entry
[08:18] <froud> Burgundavia: project mailing lists dont work at present
[08:18] <froud> we're working on that one:-)
[08:20] <froud> is it checking out for you?
[08:20] <Burgundavia> yep, checked out
[08:20] <Burgundavia> I will dig around
[08:21] <froud> OK
[08:22] <froud> I just did a commit of glosterm markup example on generic instalguide
[08:23] <froud> Once we have this working, I will aim to add support for inter-document linking and cross referencing
[08:23] <jsgotangco> hi
[08:23] <froud> morn jsgotangco 
[08:24] <jsgotangco> froud, hey hows it going how was the weekend
[08:24] <Burgundavia> salut again
[08:24] <froud> hectic, Linux World starts on tuesday
[08:24] <froud> so been getting the booth ready
[08:24] <jsgotangco> whoa inwords booth?
[08:24] <froud> as usual I forgot a ton of things and must scramble at last minute
[08:24] <froud> yes
[08:25] <jsgotangco> awsome i am in a client at the moment we're about to do some oracle stuff for the next 2 months
[08:25] <jsgotangco> that means i have a job for 2 months heh
[08:26] <froud> http://www.linuxworldexpo.co.za/
[08:26] <froud> Ok cool
[08:26] <froud> Oracle runs well on Linux
[08:26] <jsgotangco> it does heh
[08:26] <jsgotangco> i want to experiment though on this client
[08:26] <Burgundavia> their website sucks, to be honest
[08:26] <froud> Burgundavia: Africa dude
[08:27] <Burgundavia> websites suck in NA too
[08:27] <jsgotangco> heh
[08:27] <froud> but checkout the exhibitor list
[08:27] <Burgundavia> geography has little to do with how badly you build a website
[08:27] <froud> expo > exhibiting
[08:27] <jsgotangco> oh sabdfl is keynote (heh what else is new)
[08:28] <jsgotangco> hmm
[08:28] <froud> I think we have a good turnout fo rthe first ever in South Africa
[08:28] <jsgotangco> wim coekaerts of oracle
[08:28] <Burgundavia> you have to click through 3 levels to get to the vendor list
[08:28] <jsgotangco> not bad
[08:28] <froud> Yeah, usability is just great :-)
[08:29] <Burgundavia> lol
[08:29] <Burgundavia> I have filed about 25-35 bugs on synaptic
[08:29] <jsgotangco> give mvo a hard time heh
[08:29] <froud> did you see that I finally kicked SuSE off my laptop. Installed Kubuntu :-)
[08:29] <Burgundavia> mvo said he liked it
[08:29] <Burgundavia> no, congrats
[08:30] <Burgundavia> my brother is now running Ubuntu
[08:30] <froud> How's he finding it
[08:30] <Burgundavia> he likes it
[08:30] <froud> All I need to do now is find time to backup my workstation then install it
[08:30] <Burgundavia> " I just set the U File Manager up to connect to warbard.ca - very cool! FTP'ing to my webspace just like moving around my own files - hot damn"
[08:31] <froud> He he, then there is me who still does FTP by cli :-)
[08:32] <froud> jsgotangco: so with the new work, when will you get time for screen capts on kwick guide?
[08:33] <jsgotangco> hmmm i have to fix my box let me finish first with the text by this week
[08:33] <jsgotangco> ill think about the shots later
[08:33] <froud> OK ;-)
[08:33] <jsgotangco> i can still do docteam stuff anyway
[08:33] <froud> OK
[08:33] <froud> must do school run now, c ya all later
[08:33] <jsgotangco> bye bye
[10:19] <jsgotangco> wow that kubuntu guide is huge
[10:21] <Burgundavia> yes
[10:21] <Burgundavia> we need a better wiki, so that people do this crap on our servers, not their
[10:22] <jsgotangco> are you implying that if ubuntu gives proper resources, more people would jump into using ubuntu resources rather than using their own solutions
[10:23] <Burgundavia> yes
[10:23] <Burgundavia> observe the gentoo wiki
[10:24] <jsgotangco> mediawiki
[10:24] <jsgotangco> its nice though
[10:24] <Burgundavia> mediawiki is the best wiki engine, bar none
[10:24] <jsgotangco> i like the howto index
[10:24] <Burgundavia> I hate that we are not even considering it
[10:25] <Kinnison> Burgundavia: it suffers from being a PHP program I believe
[10:25] <Burgundavia> Kinnison, I know that
[10:25] <Burgundavia> but one of the largest websites in the world runs it
[10:26] <jsgotangco> brick wall atm dude
[10:26] <Burgundavia> I know
[10:26] <Burgundavia> media supports css and a lot of really html stuff
[10:28] <Burgundavia> it basically throws the old "wikis look like crap" to the wind
[10:28] <Kinnison> Aye, but it suffers in the same way as plone... All mediawiki based sites look just like wikipedia
[10:29] <Burgundavia> right http://www.hula-project.com/Hula_Server
[10:29] <Burgundavia> you can hack the css
[10:31] <Kinnison> and that looks worse
[10:31] <Burgundavia> however, I have no idea how a zwiki-->mediawiki transition would look like
[10:32] <Burgundavia> Kinnison, the point is, you don't have to make it look mediawiki
[10:32] <Kinnison> Burgundavia: true
[10:32] <Kinnison> Burgundavia: just like you *can* run a plone site which doesn't look like plone
[10:32] <Kinnison> unfortunately very very few people do
[10:32] <Burgundavia> most people don
[10:33] <jsgotangco> why bother if it works unless you really want an identity no?
[10:33] <Burgundavia> I don't really care what it looks like, I want to powerful syntax that is available
[10:33] <Kinnison> going back to proper moin will help a lot
[10:33] <Burgundavia> yes'
[10:34] <Burgundavia> but media is moin expanded
[10:34] <Burgundavia> full table syntax
[10:34] <Burgundavia> with all the support for the html table stuff
[10:34] <Burgundavia> and <div> stuff
[10:34] <Kinnison> moin's table support is pretty good
[10:34] <Kinnison> But anyway, it's fairly unlikely we'd move to mediawiki
[10:35] <Kinnison> so this is kinda a moot debate :-)
[10:35] <Burgundavia> yes
[10:35] <Burgundavia> I will grumble quitely, and watch people use other pages
[10:35] <jsgotangco> #ubuntu-rant
[10:35] <Burgundavia> lol
[10:38] <Burgundavia> how many offsite doc things have I seen now? 5? 6?
[11:02] <mpt> jdub: ping
[11:02] <Burgundavia> mpt, you haven't been able to get him yet?
[11:02] <mpt> no, he's a busy person
[11:02] <mpt> or, he's treating me with the distance I deserve
[11:02] <mpt> or both
[11:03] <Burgundavia> what do you need to talk with him about?
[11:03] <mpt> help
[11:03] <Burgundavia> ah
[11:03] <Burgundavia> I assume that was a statement, not a cry for some
[11:04] <mpt> yes, help as in the stuff you get when you choose "Help"
[11:06] <mdke> morning
[11:07] <Burgundavia> salut mdke 
[11:07] <Burgundavia> mpt, yes, my attempt at a joke at 2am
[11:09] <mdke> he promised two emails to the list :/
[11:09] <jsgotangco> hello
[11:10] <mdke> hi jsgotangco 
[11:10] <mdke> how's it going?
[11:10] <jsgotangco> not bad
[11:10] <jsgotangco> i went to the beach
[11:10] <mdke> cool
[11:10] <jsgotangco> i'd say
[11:12] <mdke> *grins*
[11:12] <mdke> i bet the beaches are nice where you are
[11:13] <jsgotangco> sure you get to choose which type of sand you like
[11:13] <jsgotangco> wow
[11:14] <mdke> you don't get to choose much if you go to the beach here
[11:14] <jsgotangco> i like sunny weather but my place is so humid at the moment
[11:14] <mdke> hmm
[11:14] <jsgotangco> mdke, its a direct rip, but nicely done
[11:14] <Burgundavia> we need to get the licence thing cleared up
[11:15] <Burgundavia> as the old userguide.org is gpl and GFDL
[11:15] <Burgundavia> the new on is GPL only
[11:15] <Burgundavia> and the kubuntu thing is GFDL
[11:15] <mdke> is that going to go into xml?
[11:15] <jsgotangco> hmmm
[11:15] <jsgotangco> what you think
[11:16] <mdke> no?
[11:16] <Burgundavia> I want it on our wiki first
[11:16] <Burgundavia> we can worry about docbook later
[11:16] <mdke> ok
[11:16] <jsgotangco> yeah stuff can be easily dumped into docbook
[11:17] <mdke> *laughs*
[11:17] <mdke> corey, your email "Re: Ubuntu Hoary Tv-out howto"
[11:17] <mdke> you've quoted an enormous piece of text and then written one line at the end
[11:18] <jsgotangco> heh he didnt top post
[11:18] <mdke> cutting quotes is cool too tho
[11:18] <Burgundavia> I don't see that on gmail, my bad
[11:19] <mpt> The irony is that cutting quotes is easier when a program puts the caret at the top than if it puts it at the bottom
[11:19] <jsgotangco> yeah i cut quotes but i prefer using plain text for email raither than the default html of most clients
[11:19] <mdke> oh of course
[11:19] <mdke> fucking gmail
[11:20] <mdke> for the italian list we made a listiquette wiki page
[11:20] <mdke> might translate it, it is pretty cool
[11:21] <jsgotangco> hope people read it, heh, they like ignoring that kind of stuff just like eula and gpl
[11:22] <mdke> so far not a huge amount of success actually
[11:22] <mdke> but the page is cool
[11:22] <mdke> people are still top posting and using html
[11:23] <jsgotangco> yeah html for email sucks its only used for bling
[11:24] <mdke> actually there is a sort of old english page
[11:24] <mdke> http://ubuntulinux.org/wiki/ListiQuette
[11:24] <jsgotangco> old english?
[11:24] <mdke> *laughs*
[11:25] <mdke> old, english
[11:25] <jsgotangco> ye olde ubuntu linux
[11:50] <jsgotangco> heh the directions for the way to Guadec is so visual
[11:50] <jsgotangco> heh
[11:51] <Burgundavia> say again? link?
[11:51] <jsgotangco> http://2005.guadec.org/travel/
[11:51] <jsgotangco> just looking around the site hehe
[11:52] <Burgundavia> oh I see
[11:53] <Burgundavia> http://2005.guadec.org/
[11:53] <Burgundavia> no canonical on the list
[11:55] <mpt> but sabdfl's speaking
[11:55] <Burgundavia> yes
[11:55] <Burgundavia> http://live.gnome.org/Stuttgart2005_2fFreeformSessions_2fDocs
[11:55] <Burgundavia> ok, check out that
[11:56] <jsgotangco> yelp maintainer
[11:56] <mdke> interesting
[11:58] <jsgotangco> reverse dns is not a bad idea
[11:59] <mdke>  K E Y N O T E - Mark Shuttleworth, Canonical, Ltd.
[12:00] <mdke> he is speaking too
[12:00] <mdke> Project Topaz, Planning for 3.0, Jeff Waugh
[12:01] <Burgundavia> "By night, he steals dreams from small children and sells their distilled energy to large multi-national corporations to fund his Free Software habit"
[12:02] <mdke> how young is Miguel de Icaza
[12:02] <mdke> crazy shit
[12:02] <Burgundavia> he wrote midnight commander at 19
[12:03] <Burgundavia> I think he is 25ish
[12:03] <Burgundavia> and quite wealthy
[12:03] <jsgotangco> jeezz i feel old
[12:03] <mdke> very wealthy i'm thinking
[12:03] <mdke> 23 here
[12:03] <jsgotangco> i hate you both
[12:03] <Burgundavia> froud is 37
[12:03] <mdke> but then again i've never founded gnome
[12:03] <jsgotangco> hah
[12:04] <mdke> this guy is a joke too, he looks about 15
[12:04] <mdke> http://www.nat.org/
[12:04] <Burgundavia> he is other wealthy one
[12:04] <Burgundavia> from ximian
[12:04] <mdke> yup
[12:05] <jsgotangco> its all about the opportunities available in your area
[12:05] <mdke> jsgotangco, these kids are geniuses
[12:05] <jsgotangco> yeah but without the right environment that's nothing
[12:06] <mdke> jsgotangco, i guess they needed a computer yeah
[12:06] <Burgundavia> shit, icaza is from mexico
[12:06] <Burgundavia> not exactly europe/Us or Canada
[12:06] <mdke> in my book they deserve every penny
[12:07] <jsgotangco> hey look mono-project.com is in mediawiki
[12:07] <mdke> hey they founded a great company through their computer abilities and sold it for a huge amount
[12:07] <Burgundavia> novell bought ximian for the people
[12:08] <Burgundavia> it bought suse to have a distro
[12:08] <Burgundavia> observe all the suse people leaving
[12:09] <jsgotangco> (its no different from reading an oracle magazine - good advertisting)
[12:17] <mdke> ok i'm off
[12:17] <mdke> back later
[12:36] <jsgotangco> well see you around
[12:36] <jsgotangco> bye bye
[01:10] <mdke> what happened to the #ubuntu bot project? anything?
[01:11] <Burgundavia> the runner died
[01:11] <Burgundavia> and I don't have the interest/technical skills to resurrect it
[02:16] <Burgundavia> lol, hbd.com uses php
[04:09] <mdke> hi there jiyuu0 
[04:09] <jiyuu0> mdke, hi
[04:09] <mdke> i noticed that marillat is still on ubuntuguide.org
[04:10] <mdke> its not mentioned on http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/RestrictedFormats anymore
[04:10] <jiyuu0> yub... just finished the add-on-cd
[04:10] <jiyuu0> and just came back from vacation
[04:10] <jiyuu0> now unpacking...
[04:10] <jiyuu0> just like step into house in less than 10 minutes ago
[04:10] <mdke> *grins*
[04:10] <mdke> have fun?
[04:11] <jiyuu0> yes... :)
[04:11] <mdke> good
[04:11] <jiyuu0> gotta run... brb :)
[04:11] <mdke> k
[04:11] <jiyuu0> need to unload stuff
[04:29] <mdke> mpt, good stuff
[04:30] <mdke> mpt, i think you should also include references to the current docteam book projects in your help page
[04:31] <mdke> or perhaps they can be incorporated into the userguide
[04:31] <mdke> (your categories i mean)
[06:47] <mdke> hi froud 
[06:47] <mdke> how was the conference?
[08:39] <jjesse> ?
[08:40] <mdke> hi jjesse 
[08:41] <jjesse> hi mdke
[08:41] <jjesse> hit the wrong windo :)
[08:41] <mdke> *grins*
[08:42] <jjesse> don't you hate that when that happens
[08:42] <mdke> yep
[08:42] <mdke> also typos in commands
[08:32] <Burgundavia> mpt, around?
[08:49] <jsgotangco> Burgundavia, have you seen monodoc?
[08:49] <Burgundavia> no
[08:50] <Burgundavia> installing now
[08:50] <jsgotangco> its nice it has a tree view and some navi tabs
[08:54] <Burgundavia> looks like any other 2 paned help out there
[08:55] <jsgotangco> it works for me
[08:57] <Burgundavia> yes, it works, but it is aimed at a very different audience to ours
[09:19] <Kinnison> Morning
[09:19] <Burgundavia> salut Kinnison 
[09:19] <Kinnison> salut salaud, ca va?
[09:20] <Burgundavia> bah
[09:20] <Kinnison> How's .ca then?
[09:21] <Burgundavia> not bad
[09:21] <Burgundavia> seems the muine guy doesn't like my bug reports
[09:21] <Burgundavia> he has rejected 2 as not a bug
[09:21] <Burgundavia> but mvo loves the 25+ I have filed on synaptic
[09:21] <Burgundavia> and my brother is now using Ubuntu
[09:22] <Kinnison> Heh, my dad has been talking with mvo about update-manager
[09:26] <Burgundavia> mpt, cool
[09:26] <Burgundavia> I have been thinking about it too
[09:26] <mpt> It's gonna need gtk trickery, though
[09:26] <Burgundavia> did you get my email?
[09:26] <mpt> about what?
[09:26] <Burgundavia> the gnome bug
[09:27] <mpt> what's muine?
[09:28] <Burgundavia> music player
[09:28] <Burgundavia> http://muine.gooeylinux.org/
[09:29] <jsgotangco> i heard muine is going in main
[09:30] <Burgundavia> jsgotangco, I doubt it
[09:30] <mpt> Instead of Rhythmbox?
[09:30] <Kinnison> rhythmbox is pants
[09:30] <Kinnison> utter pants
[09:30] <Kinnison> (IMHO)
[09:30] <jsgotangco> why not if mono is going in main anyway
[09:30] <jsgotangco> heh
[09:30] <mpt> Is that why the screenshot is of Muine playing a song called "Elegy for rhythmbox"?
[09:31] <jsgotangco> f-spot, blam, etc
[09:31] <mpt> holy crap that's a lot of dependencies
[09:31] <Burgundavia> rhythmbox is the default gnome music player
[09:32] <mpt> yeah, and Epiphany's the default browser
[09:32] <Burgundavia> rhythmbox is actually shipped by Ubuntu
[09:32] <mpt> 45.3 MB of extra space for a music player
[09:32] <mpt> rock
[09:33] <Burgundavia> you don't have mono installed?
[09:34] <Kinnison> mpt: dude, no mono?!
[09:34] <Kinnison> mpt: tomboy dude! tomboy!
[09:34] <Kinnison> stickywiki!
[09:34] <mpt> eh?
[09:34] <Kinnison> apt-cache show tomboy
[09:34] <Burgundavia> he will have mono soon enough
[09:34] <mpt> in about 5 minutes and 54 seconds
[09:34] <Kinnison> *so* much better than the stickynotes applet
[09:34] <Burgundavia> as breezy is shipping mono by default
[09:35] <mpt> Kinnison: Oh, I thought those were all dialectal obscenities
[09:35] <mpt> You were swearing at me for not having mono
[09:36] <jsgotangco> hahaha
[09:36] <Burgundavia> rofl
[09:36] <Burgundavia> lmao
[09:37] <Burgundavia> mono is the newest shit, straight from the heart of mormon country
[09:37] <mpt> hah
[09:38] <jsgotangco> tomboy is so nice i want to cry
[09:38] <Burgundavia> I really like tomboy, I have just never figured out how to make it work within my work flow
[09:38] <jsgotangco> the answer to that is alt+f11
[09:38] <jsgotangco> hehe
[09:39] <Burgundavia> I think I need to move to the bottom panel, so I use it
[09:40] <Burgundavia> I also like blam
[09:40] <Burgundavia> but I heard it is a mess internally
[09:40] <jsgotangco> eh?
[09:42] <Burgundavia> tseng says it is a mess of c and c#
[09:42] <mpt> I don't see any stickywiki in the repositories
[09:42] <mpt> therefore it doesn't exist
[09:42] <jsgotangco> no look for tomboy
[09:43] <Burgundavia> mpt, I like your attitude, I wish more people would follow it
[09:43] <Kinnison> mpt: stickywiki is just a way to describe tomboy :-)
[09:43] <Kinnison> mpt: It's a cross between stickynotes and a personal wiki
[09:43] <Burgundavia> then they wouldn't "enhance" their Ubuntu to the point of a bug repot
[09:43] <Burgundavia> mpt, can yer look at that bug report?
[09:44] <jsgotangco> try f-spot as well
[09:44] <jsgotangco> heh
[09:45] <mpt> Burgundavia: Well if we had packages that had obvious names, rather than names like "blam" and "tomboy" and "muine" (I mean, wtf, "muine"? it sounds like the name of a geriatric cat), then people would spend all day in the safe confines of universe crack and wouldn't feel the need to get crack elsewhere.
[09:45] <Burgundavia> mpt, we just need to advertise what they do better, with metadata
[09:46] <Burgundavia> so you can search for "music player" and get up muine, etc.
[09:46] <mpt> Using metadata to work around bad names is like wearing a name badge every day that says "Hi, my name is Fred, but you can call me muine"
[09:46] <mpt> Ok, I'm rambling
[09:46] <Burgundavia> names are catchy
[09:46] <Kinnison> perhaps, but then again, when there are N music players, you can't call them all 'music-player'
[09:46] <mpt> Import
[09:46] <Burgundavia> names are not a major issue
[09:46] <mpt> Import From: /home/mpt
[09:46] <mpt> how friendly
[09:47] <Burgundavia> mpt, that is being worked on
[09:48] <mpt> no progress feedback while importing
[09:48] <mpt> the app appears to hang
[09:48] <mpt> actually, no
[09:48] <Burgundavia> eventually, import should happen in the background
[09:48] <mpt> it does bring up a progress window, after about 20 seconds
[09:49] <Burgundavia> hmm, that is odd, probably trying to parse a huge dir
[09:52] <mpt> clicking "Edit Image" doesn't do anything except make the image shrink momentarily
[09:52] <mpt> is that yet-to-be-implemented?
[09:53] <Burgundavia> where is this edit image you speak of?
[09:53] <mpt> in the toolbar
[09:54] <Burgundavia> for muine?
[09:54] <mpt> no, f-spot
[09:55] <mpt> ohhh, you thought I was talking about muine the whole time
[09:55] <mpt> sorry
[09:55] <mpt> a big bass clef, how ... interesting
[09:56] <Burgundavia> ok
[09:56] <Burgundavia> f-spot is very new
[09:56] <Burgundavia> 0.0.13 I think, never used it
[09:57] <Burgundavia> cool, with muine you can drag an image to the bass clef on the interface and have that image for the album
[09:57] <mpt> What's the /dev/thingy for a CD drive?
[09:57] <Burgundavia> why?
[09:57] <mpt> I need to pmount it every time because of a bug
[09:57] <Kinnison> depends on your drive normally
[09:57] <Burgundavia> does f-spot not just see it?
[09:57] <mpt> No, I'm in Muine now
[09:58] <Burgundavia> muine only plays ripped stuff
[09:58] <Burgundavia> not internet radio
[09:58] <Burgundavia> no cds
[09:58] <mpt> oh, for goodness sake
[09:59] <mpt> I bet it doesn't even rip the songs it expects you to have ripped, does it
[09:59] <Burgundavia> no
[10:00] <Burgundavia> that is sound juicers job
[10:00] <mpt> haha
[10:00] <Burgundavia> muine is not very everybody
[10:00] <jsgotangco> hehehe
[10:00] <Burgundavia> but what it does, it does very well
[10:02] <mpt> Someone should get the programmers of Sound Juicer and Rhythmbox and Muine and CD Player and lock them in a room and not let them out until they have a single codebase
[10:03] <mpt> Give them as much pizza as they want
[10:03] <mpt> and pillows, so they can have pillowfights about which language to code in
[10:04] <Burgundavia> muine is c#, and thus will never get into gnome
[10:04] <Burgundavia> cd player is about to use the code base of sound juicer, but a different UI
[10:04] <Kinnison> give them all enough crack to smoke that they realise the right way is dbus love
[10:05] <Kinnison> A single unified UI onto dbus discoverable audio magic
[10:05] <jsgotangco> dbus yeahhh
[10:05] <Burgundavia> they should have interconnections, so if I am listening to a cd, I can click rip and it opens sj
[10:05] <mpt> That's still showing me a completely separate UI for the *same* tracks
[10:06] <Burgundavia> but ripping is different activity than listening
[10:06] <Burgundavia> if the UI
[10:06] <Burgundavia> s look similar, then it is not an issue
[10:06] <mpt> That's like having one word processor for doing writing, another word processor for mail merges, and another for printing
[10:06] <Burgundavia> not really
[10:06] <mpt> That's why menus were invented
[10:06] <Burgundavia> it is like having GIMP for editing
[10:06] <Burgundavia> and f-spot for viewing
[10:07] <Kinnison> mpt: No, it's like having a wordprocessor for writing letters, and a spreadsheet for doing spreadsheets
[10:07] <mpt> Kinnison: No, WP documents and spreadsheets are not just different file formats, they're different things
[10:07] <Burgundavia> they should interconnect, but show seperate but similar UI's for different tasks
[10:07] <mpt> Music is music
[10:08] <mpt> Now I understand why LSongs was developed
[10:08] <Kinnison> mpt: so I should start using OpenOffice to edit my python programs. After all they're both text
[10:09] <mpt> Kinnison: WP documents and programming code are different things too
[10:09] <mpt> of course it's a matter of definition
[10:09] <Kinnison> indeed. I prefer separated UIs for different tasks
[10:09] <Burgundavia> music should be treated equally, but we rip very rarely and listen often
[10:09] <Kinnison> even if they're fundamentally manipulating similar concepts
[10:09] <Burgundavia> thus the ripping functions should be moved to something else
[10:10] <Burgundavia> rb is basically itunes
[10:12] <mpt> But yeah, I would like to be able to double-click on a picture, have it open in a viewer, then click an "Edit" button and the toolbox appears
[10:12] <mpt> That would be nifty
[10:12] <Burgundavia> yes, that would be cool
[10:12] <Burgundavia> that is what a ripping app should do as well
[10:12] <Burgundavia> with a cd in
[10:12] <Burgundavia> have UI that pops up ony when you want to rip
[12:18] <jsgotangco> hello froud 
[12:30] <mkde> hi all
[12:31] <Burgundavia> salut
[12:31] <jsgotangco> hello
[12:31] <mkde> hows it going?
[12:33] <Burgundavia> we are discussing little people in computers
[12:33] <mkde> computer gnomes?
[12:34] <jsgotangco> bye bye
[12:35] <mkde> bye jsgotangco
[12:54] <mpt> mmm, gnomes
[02:35] <mkde> strange business this [fr]  stuff on the list
[02:48] <mkde> wb froud
[07:36] <froud> Hi dude
[07:37] <froud> well first day of th efirst ever LinuxWorld in CO.ZA is over and so are my feet
[07:38] <froud> busy, lots of action, could have been more visitors, but then most people are still at work
[07:38] <froud> As usual the TSF freedom toaster was hard pressed to keep up with demand and the queue to burn CD's was long
[07:39] <froud> sabdfl gave was sounded like a good speach http://www.itweb.co.za/sections/software/2005/0505171134.asp?A=LIN&S=Open%20Source&O=E&CiRestriction=
[07:40] <froud> An maddog took the time to wander through the booths meeting and chatting with everyone
[07:40] <froud> That dude is just like so cool, people everywhere liked him
[07:41] <froud> As for us we all just had fun and managed to pickup 16 unprotected wireless networks that gave the Linux User Group stands free Internet access for the day :-)
[07:42] <froud> Tomorrow, feet willing, we will report more
[07:43] <froud> somebody tell sabfl that he needs a hair cut, please :-)
[07:58] <k31th> alright guys 
[07:58] <k31th> hope to do some more work on the admin docs tonight 
[07:59] <k31th> sorry if i havent surfaced for a while 
[08:00] <mdke> hi there froud-away 
[10:00] <mdke> we enrico 
[10:03] <enrico> hi
[10:03] <mdke> how are you?
[12:05] <enrico> mdke: kind of tired
[12:05] <mdke> enrico, sorry to hear that
[12:05] <enrico> mdke: busy day
[12:05] <mdke> enrico, allora vatti curca
[12:06] <enrico> mdke: well, not a bad plan: I'll be in bed quite soon
[12:06] <mdke> *grins*
[12:06] <mdke> time for bed here too
[12:06] <mdke> how is your job?