[12:12] <ajmitch> ivoks: pong... :)
[12:12] <ajmitch> what was the app you were wanting to work on?
[12:14] <ivoks> ajmitch: never mind :)
[12:14] <ajmitch> pfft..
[12:14] <ajmitch> fine :)
[12:14] <ajmitch> tell me what it was so I can work on it ;)
[12:18] <ivoks> ajmitch: sec...
[12:19] <ivoks>  socketapi
[12:19] <ajmitch> aha
[12:25] <ivoks> cast from 'OHtmlElement*' to 'int' loses precision
[12:26] <ivoks> one more
[12:27] <ajmitch> fun times... socketapi builds, I just have to fix up the transition parts now :)
[12:27] <ivoks> builds?!
[12:27] <ajmitch> sure, I've got a few that need hacking
[12:38] <ajmitch> I did no such thing
[12:46] <ivoks_> ?
[12:46] <ajmitch> !
[12:46] <ivoks_> yeah, my inbox is full too :)
[12:46] <ajmitch> from what?
[12:47] <ivoks_> from doko :)
[12:47] <ajmitch> cxx transition stuff?
[12:47] <ivoks_> yeah
[12:47] <ivoks_> what's wrong with this?
[12:47] <ivoks_> libstrutilsxx 0.7 libstrutilsxx0.7c2
[12:47] <doko> make less mistakes, then it doesn't get full
[12:47] <ivoks_> yeah, i know...
[12:48] <ajmitch> hi doko :)
[12:48] <ivoks_> i'm still learning
[12:48] <doko> libstrutilsxx0.7, not libstrutilsxx0.7c2 IIRC
[12:48] <doko> hi ajmitch
[12:48] <ivoks_> ok
[12:48] <ivoks_> omg :) stoopid mistake
[12:49] <ivoks_> that happens when u do two packages in same time :)
[12:50] <ivoks_> doko: should this be ...-ubuntu2?
[12:51] <doko> yes
[12:54] <ivoks_> patch uploaded
[12:54] <ivoks_> that was pretty ASAP :)
[12:55] <ogra> ivoks_, sadly i'm too tired to upload it now...
[12:55] <Burgundavia> huh?
[12:55] <ajmitch> Burgundavia: just ignore it.. :)
[12:55] <ivoks_> ogra: :) but doko said ASAP... noooo.... :)
[12:55] <ivoks_> ogra: it's ok ;)
[12:56] <ogra> :)
[12:56] <ogra> doko is used to my lazyness.... and he knows how i hate c++
[12:56] <ivoks_> huh... that was a shock :)
[12:56] <ajmitch> haha
[12:56] <ajmitch> ogra, lazy?!
[12:56] <ajmitch> never
[12:58] <ogra> ajmitch, but i'm good at delegating ;-P
[12:59] <ajmitch> yep :)
[12:59] <ogra> especially if tseng supports me in it... and you are the target ;)
[12:59] <tseng> pushover.
[12:59] <ogra> heh
[01:02] <ivoks> ok... i will deal with this trivial long - int problems tomorrow
[01:02] <ivoks> bye all!
[01:02] <ogra> night ivoks
[01:03] <Burgundavia> ogra, joined the debian gis list
[01:50] <Mithrandir> tseng: hm, is beagle known to be FUBAR in breezy atm?
[01:50] <Burgundavia> seems to be for me
[01:51] <Mithrandir> it blows up with:
[01:51] <Mithrandir>      Assembly:   dbus-sharp    (assemblyref_index=4)
[01:51] <Mithrandir>      Version:    0.23.4.0
[01:51] <Mithrandir>      Public Key: 9eef2692033670f5
[01:51] <Mithrandir> The assembly was not found in the Global Assembly Cache, a path listed in the MONO_PATH environment variable, or in the location of the executing assembly (/usr/lib/beagle).
[01:51] <Mithrandir> for me
[01:51] <thom> yeah, dbus-cil definitely dead
[01:54] <ogra> Mithrandir, we'll have to wait for the next dbus build...
[01:59] <Mithrandir> ogra: where in the queue is that? :)
[01:59] <ogra> nowhere i guess... i think daniels has to enable it in the source first...
[01:59] <Mithrandir> ah, ok
[02:00] <thom> well, mono needs to move to main then you can do that, yes
[02:00] <Mithrandir> well, 'night
[02:00] <ogra> thom, it moved today (technically)
[02:00] <thom> ogra: nod
[02:26] <|QuaD-> Mithrandir: beagle cvs doesn't actually need dbus
[02:35] <tseng> Mithrandir: partly
[02:35] <tseng> Mithrandir: yes.
[02:35] <tseng> Mithrandir: i need libdbus-cil first
[02:37] <|QuaD-> tseng: why not just wait untile the non-dbus beagle is released?
[02:37] <tseng> |QuaD-: whichever comes first
[02:38] <tseng> i think i have some idea what i am doing by now :)
[02:38] <Lathiat> nah dude your stupid and know nothing. ;)
[02:39] <tseng> you caught me
[02:39] <|QuaD-> tseng: hah :)
[02:39] <Lathiat> :)
[02:40] <Lathiat> creeps getting mono/ikvm/md to work from svn is a pain in the ass.
[02:40] <tseng> i wouldnt recommend that
[02:41] <Lathiat> heh
[02:41] <tseng> hm is there anything cool i could use to play muine on my laptop through my speakers on desktop?
[02:41] <tseng> wirelessly
[02:42] <Lathiat> esd and set ESPEAKER ?
[02:42] <tseng> i guess i could get a decent bitrate stream with uh
[02:42] <Lathiat> or write a gst plugin to ship stuff over the network
[02:42] <tseng> icecast and acast
[02:42] <Lathiat> .. and keep sync
[02:42] <tseng> i never used esd over the network
[02:42] <tseng> is there a manpage on that
[02:42] <Lathiat> yeh iirc basically you do esd -tcp
[02:42] <Lathiat> and then set ESPEAKER to the ip
[02:42] <Lathiat> and start the program
[02:43] <tseng> k
[02:43] <Lathiat> man esd should say
[02:43] <Lathiat> altho i seem to remember taking alot of effort to find it last time
[02:45] <|QuaD-> does xen work yet?
[02:45] <|QuaD-> for ubuntu
[02:50] <tseng> Lathiat: oh man that actually works
[02:50] <tseng> pretty neat
[03:03] <prevod> http://www.xraymag.com/pdfs/xray_v3_n2.pdf
[03:03] <ajmitch> afternoon all
[03:04] <tseng> ajmitch: hi
[03:04] <tseng> he loves to talk
[03:04] <tseng> i guess.
[03:24] <jsgotangco> helo motu :)
[03:25] <crimsun> 'lo
[03:26] <ajmitch> hi
[03:30] <ajmitch> nasty, a lib that compiles with g++-4.0_4.0.0-5ubuntu1 but not -7ubuntu7
[03:31] <ajmitch> where is doko when you need him?
[04:44] <Lathiat> tseng: :)
[04:44] <tseng> Lathiat: ?
[04:44] <Lathiat> tseng: the esd thing from earlier
[04:45] <tseng> ah rock on
[05:01] <lamont> because it's main???
[05:05] <Burgundavia> lamont, dup
[05:05] <Burgundavia> 762
[05:06] <Burgundavia> I was only told that you can now, in fact, mark things as dups
[05:06] <Burgundavia> now marked as a dup
[05:07] <lamont> ah, coolnes
[05:07] <lamont> s
[05:07] <lamont> reject would tend to beg a comment....
[05:07] <Burgundavia> I didn't want to mark fixed, as it wasn't
[05:07] <Burgundavia> so I rejected them
[05:08] <Burgundavia> hmm, marking things as dups does not remove them from the view it seems
[05:29] <Burgundavia> can I have opinions on https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/malone/bugs/809
[05:29] <Burgundavia> as it is like to affect us the most
[05:30] <crimsun> hmm
[05:30] <crimsun> the idea is certainly interesting, but we really should just encourage people to join
[05:35] <jsgotangco> is it advisable to use malone now instaed of bugzilla?
[05:36] <Burgundavia> crimsun, not everybody can package
[05:36] <Burgundavia> jsgotangco, for universe, use malone
[05:36] <Burgundavia> jsgotangco, for main, use bugzilla
[05:37] <jsgotangco> ah
[05:37] <crimsun> MOTU is supposed to be a mentoring process, too
[05:47] <Burgundavia> yep, but there are people who honestly cannot package or have no interest in packaging
[05:47] <Burgundavia> but they do want something in Ubuntu
[05:47] <Burgundavia> like my father or my brother
[05:48] <crimsun> then they'll file bugs, and you'll assign them to yourself and maintain them, correct?
[05:48] <Burgundavia> they should have an outlet for these requests
[05:48] <Burgundavia> crimsun, bugs are a crude hammer for this sort of thing
[05:48] <Burgundavia> we should cloak the bug interface in an easy to use one
[05:48] <Burgundavia> they are still bugs inbehind
[05:48] <Burgundavia> but the user doesn't need to see that
[05:50] <crimsun> hmm, so to start with, the complement of the intersection of Sid+experimental & Breezy?
[05:50] <Burgundavia> no
[05:50] <crimsun> (on packages.u.c)
[05:51] <Burgundavia> I am looking to use the FindingPackages spec in another way
[06:30] <abarbaccia> hey all - so the other day my breezy install fell apart - whats up with that?!
[06:31] <Burgundavia> you run breezy
[06:31] <Burgundavia> welcome to life
[06:31] <abarbaccia> hahah - well, not anymore
[06:31] <abarbaccia> lol
[06:31] <janm> hi everyone
[06:31] <abarbaccia> had to go back to hoary - can't run it on my everyday computer if it breaks when i need to do work
[07:46] <Burgundavia> can request a package to be transitioned soon? scorched3d
[07:46] <Burgundavia> my brother needs to kick my ass ;)
[07:50] <jsgotangco> GAMES ARE NO FUN
[07:50] <jsgotangco> hehe
[07:50] <jsgotangco> :D
[07:51] <Burgundavia> oh right, I am running linux now, no games for me
[07:52] <jsgotangco> seriously though, there are some pretty good linux-only games out there
[11:34] <jsgotangco> brb
[12:25] <tseng> hi
[12:25] <\sh> moins
[12:25] <ivoks> hi
[12:25] <ivoks> time to fix some packages :(
[12:25] <\sh> haha...dokos work
[12:25] <ivoks> how can i test my source on amd64 or ia64 platforms?
[12:27] <tseng> ogra: wow thanks for fixing my dpu
[12:27] <tseng> ogra: dput
[12:29] <siretart> hi
[12:29] <siretart> ivoks: you could ask someone with an amd64 for doing a test build
[12:30] <ivoks> i know that :)
[12:31] <\sh> i could need a cofffee
[12:37] <siretart> assuming my key was not yet in the keyring, but my email is whitelisted. what would be the reaction of the archive scripts if I upload a package?
[12:37] <thom> no key, no uploady
[12:38] <ivoks> simple as that :)
[12:38] <siretart> no message like "your upload was rejected because you suck"?
[12:38] <tseng> siretart: your upload vanishes into outer space
[12:38] <siretart> ok. then I'm not added yet. thanks :)
[12:39] <tseng> gpg
[12:39] <Treenaks> ivoks: gpg keys
[12:39] <ivoks> it was a joke...
[12:39] <ivoks> ok :)
[12:39] <siretart> ok. will prepare more packages then and flood the archive with a whole bunch of uploads ;)
[12:39] <tseng> only packages signed by an approved key can be uploaded and moved to buildd queue
[12:39] <ivoks> my packages are signed
[12:39] <Treenaks> siretart: uh.. and make the mailserver suffer even more?
[12:39] <tseng> "approved key"
[12:39] <ivoks> but my sign is useless for now :)
[12:39] <siretart> tseng: :=)
[12:40] <tseng> time for work
[12:40] <tseng> bye
[12:40] <ivoks> bye
[12:40] <siretart> bye tseng
[12:40] <\sh> cu tseng
[12:40] <ivoks> hm... it's holyday in croatia :)
[12:41] <\sh> i just woke up because of people singing and praying on this damn graveyard next to my flat :(
[12:44] <Treenaks> \sh: play some loud metal
[12:44] <ivoks> trash metal :)
[12:44] <Treenaks> death metal
[12:44] <Treenaks> (would me more appropriate, it's a graveyard)
[12:44] <ivoks> play Him, they will stop praying and start laughing :)
[12:45] <\sh> i don't like death ;)
[12:45] <\sh> good handmade music ;)
[12:45] <\sh> rob halford
[12:45] <ivoks> brintey rulz! :)
[12:46] <ivoks> \sh: any results?
[12:47] <\sh> ivoks: sorry...wasn't lookin on the query...
[12:47] <ivoks> :)
[12:48] <ivoks> it's ok
[12:48] <\sh> ivoks: downloading :)
[12:48] <ivoks> k
[12:49] <\sh> argl.
[12:50] <\sh> Mithrandir: dpatch doxygen and xlibs-dev (thx)
[12:51] <Mithrandir> \sh: done.
[12:52] <\sh> thx
[12:53] <\sh> ivoks: i don't get your error :)
[12:53] <\sh> ivoks: but
[12:53] <\sh> c++ -o example main.o  -L../lib/libxclass -lxclass -L/usr/X11R6/lib -lXpm -lXext -lX11 -lXpm -lXext -lX11
[12:53] <\sh> /usr/bin/ld: cannot find -lxclass
[12:53] <ivoks> \sh: that's because you had error before..
[12:53] <ivoks> scroll up
[12:54] <ivoks> xclass lib didn't build
[12:54] <\sh> ah yes...scrolled
[12:57] <ivoks> anything?
[12:58] <\sh> moment
[12:58] <ivoks> don't fix it :)
[12:58] <ivoks> i would like to do that...
[01:10] <ivoks> Mithrandir: ping
[01:10] <Mithrandir> yes?
[01:10] <ivoks> is it possible to get chroot on some amd64 or ia64 for testing purposes?
[01:10] <Mithrandir> yes.
[01:11] <ivoks> so i don't ask people arround to test it for me..
[01:11] <ivoks> oh, great...
[01:11] <Mithrandir> signed mail (with a key either in the debian or ubuntu keyring or at least signed by one who is) to me (tfheen@err.no), cc to maswan@acc.umu.se, state wanted user name, include ssh key and ask for access to ravel.
[01:14] <ivoks> doh... :)
[01:14] <ivoks> i don't have signed key :(
[01:15] <ivoks> ok, evenutally that will come to
[01:15] <ivoks> thanx Mithrandir
[01:15] <\sh> ogra: ping
[01:15] <ogra> \sh, po
[01:15] <Mithrandir> ivoks: nothing personal, but I would really like to have something at least resembling a trust path to you. :)
[01:15] <ogra> n
[01:15] <ogra> g
[01:15] <Mithrandir> ivoks: you could ask maswan on #u-d, though.  He's the owner of the box so it's his call.
[01:15] <ivoks> Mithrandir: i agree with you ;0
[01:16] <ivoks> that's supposed to be ), not 0 :)
[01:16] <\sh> ogra: are u somewhere organized in a LUG?
[01:16] <ogra> nope
[01:17] <ivoks> so, what's the procedure to get key signed?
[01:17] <ivoks> i guess I have to be MOTU for that, right?
[01:17] <ogra> nope
[01:18] <ivoks> no?
[01:18] <ivoks> hm... ok :)
[01:18] <\sh> ogra: I'm thinking about a presentation for luusa
[01:18] <Treenaks> ivoks: keysigning is not motu-specific
[01:19] <Treenaks> ivoks: http://www.cryptnet.net/fdp/crypto/gpg-party.html
[01:19] <ivoks> ah...
[01:19] <\sh> ogra: http://www.luusa.org/
[01:19] <ivoks> i had my key signed, but i lost my hard disk and didn't have backup :(
[01:19] <ogra> where is sankt augustin ?
[01:19] <ivoks> so, this is my new key...
[01:20] <\sh> ogra: it's between cologne and bonn :)
[01:20] <\sh> next to troisdorf
[01:20] <ogra> ah, sounded bayrish :=)
[01:20] <\sh> ogra: yeah
[01:21] <\sh> ogra: so what do u think, about an Ubuntu presentation?
[01:21] <ogra> why not
[01:21] <Treenaks> ivoks: find someone to do keysigning stuff with
[01:22] <ivoks> will do
[01:22] <ogra> ivoks, look at www.biglumber.com, probably there is someone in your area wanting to sign you
[01:24] <\sh> ogra: ok...i want to have it in two parts...1. part => user perspective and 2. part => developer perspective...at least the work between debian and ubuntu..how the ubuntu work merges back to debian
[01:24] <\sh> and for the 2. part it would be nice to have u on board :)
[01:28] <ivoks> \sh: i hope you have spare time :)
[01:28] <\sh> ivoks: sparetime?
[01:29] <ogra> \sh, as long as it doenst collide with my schedule i'm fine with that
[01:29] <ivoks> free time
[01:29] <\sh> ivoks: free time?
[01:30] <\sh> ogra: we have to organize it :) i don't want to hold u up :)
[01:30] <\sh> ivoks: well, I have at least one weekend where I'm doing a completly brain reset
[01:31] <\sh> ivoks: brain reset == visiting an irish pub and drinking many guinness
[01:31] <ivoks> \sh: kilkenny is much better :)
[01:32] <ivoks> \sh: i tought you could check out one more source for me...
[01:32] <ivoks> :)
[01:32] <Zarquon> I thought I could change window managers @ Applications->System Tools->Configuration Editor : /desktop/gnome/applications/window_manager ? Did I miss something or do I too need guiness?
[01:38] <\sh> and I will produce now a nice coffee for me...
[01:39] <\sh> Fehl http://de.archive.ubuntu.com breezy/universe arkrpg 0.1.4b-6 (dsc)
[01:39] <\sh>   Konnte Datei arkrpg_0.1.4b-6.dsc nicht ffnen - open (2 Datei oder Verzeichnis nicht gefunden)
[01:40] <ivoks>  warning: cast from pointer to integer of different size
[01:41] <ivoks> should i fix that? :)
[01:41] <ivoks> it's only a warning :)
[01:41] <Treenaks> ivoks: warnings are the root of all evil!
[01:41] <ivoks> :)
[01:42] <ivoks> i will need help with this one
[01:42] <ivoks> it doesn't compile on amd64 and ia64
[01:42] <ivoks> it does on i386
[01:42] <ivoks> that warning is for:
[01:43] <ivoks> block = (INT32*)((INT32)res+ \  (INT32)number*(INT32)size);
[01:43] <ivoks> wihout that \
[01:44] <ivoks> typedef int INT32;
[01:48] <Treenaks> ivoks: ah! int != int32
[01:48] <ivoks> i don't like this :(
[01:48] <ivoks> there is too much WIN in this file :)
[01:48] <ivoks> it even has include <windows.h>
[01:48] <ivoks> time to eat something...
[02:34] <abelli> ciao
[02:36] <siretart> hi abelli
[02:37] <abelli> anyone here knows where i should report packaging problems of the ruby related packages?
[02:38] <siretart> has anyone a explanation why firefox on my amd64 is not able to login on the ubuntu wiki whereas on my i386 box is? somethings must be broken, but I dont see what (both hoary)
[02:38] <siretart> abelli: tell us here. whats the problem?
[02:39] <abelli> i encountered problems with ruby gems installing pimki this is what the mantainer of pimki told me after some debugging :
[02:39] <abelli> "14:38 < abelli> i encountered some probs installing pimki with gem ..
[02:39] <abelli> ahhh soory .. :)=
[02:39] <abelli> The only way I can think this might have happened is that you're on
[02:39] <abelli> some debian flavoured linux where the packagers crippled ruby by
[02:39] <abelli> some debian flavoured linux where the packagers crippled ruby by breaking the stdlib in very non standard ways"
[02:40] <abelli> ok .. sorry pasting problems ..
[02:41] <abelli> siretart: did you get an idea of what he wanted to mean?
[02:41] <abelli> or should i re-paste it .. in a better manner :)??
[02:41] <siretart> abelli: I'm sorry. but I'm also not that into ruby
[02:42] <siretart> abelli: try repasting it on pastebin oder paste.debian.net
[02:43] <abelli> shttp://paste.debian.net/515
[02:43] <siretart> shttp? ;)
[02:43] <abelli> siretart: well i need to go .. should i contact directly the mantainer or you can do it?
[02:43] <Treenaks> siretart: that's HTTP with STARTTLS ;)
[02:43] <abelli> ... just take of the s :)
[02:43] <siretart> :)
[02:44] <abelli> Treenaks: ciaooooooo
[02:44] <Treenaks> which WOULD be a cool option btw
[02:44] <Treenaks> hi abelli
[02:44] <Treenaks> abelli: and bye ;)
[02:44] <abelli> Treenaks: hey .. im supposed to give solutions ..
[02:44] <abelli> that's a cool solution.
[02:44] <siretart> abelli: I dont really understand the problem yet. Is this problem also in the debian packages?
[02:44] <abelli> siretart: is there a package of pimki?
[02:44] <abelli> i dont think so.
[02:44] <abelli> well at least not in hoary
[02:45] <abelli> but .. well .. id like gem to run on ubuntu
[02:45] <siretart> I don't even see pimki in breezy. whats pimki?
[02:45] <ogra> abelli, you should definately contact the debian devs that broke the packages apart, i know there is an argument going on between ruby upstream and the DDs
[02:45] <abelli> wiki+note_taker_with_some_neuro_thinks_in_it
[02:46] <abelli> ogra: i know it too :) i just wanted to let you go before me :)
[02:46] <ogra> (debian did something similar with mono in the past, but they now repackaged it)
[02:47] <siretart> I'm not quite sure, but http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=290705 seems to be relevant here
[02:48] <ivoks> hi again
[02:48] <siretart> wb ivoks
[02:48] <abelli> siretart: it's seem so.
[02:48] <abelli> well im off to univ .. have a great day everybody
[02:49] <ivoks> i'm a bit confused
[02:49] <siretart> abelli: have a nice day. cu
[02:49] <ivoks> can't someone d/w my key from keyserver and sign it locally?
[02:49] <Amaranth> ivoks: They don't know you're really you unless they meet you in person.
[02:49] <ivoks> ah, true :)
[02:49] <Amaranth> I've got the same problem.
[02:50] <ogra> just look at biglumber
[02:50] <ivoks> ogra: i did...
[02:50] <ogra> nothing ?
[02:50] <Amaranth> yeah, no one in sioux city
[02:50] <ivoks> one guy :)
[02:50] <ogra> great, mail him
[02:50] <ivoks> well, i'm not worying :)
[02:50] <Amaranth> i'd have to get someone to drive me 100mi away to omaha
[02:51] <ivoks> admin of pgp keryserver in croatia will personaly sign mine :)
[02:51] <ivoks> and there is jrodin...
[02:52] <Amaranth> i talked to the sioux city LUG about it and they seemed to think key signing was silly
[02:52] <ivoks> Amaranth: :(
[04:08] <ivoks> bye
[05:07] <tseng|work> ogra: GAR
[05:07] <ogra> ?
[05:07] <tseng|work> ogra: tcl stores integers as a C "int" type
[05:07] <ogra> tha do you do with tcl ?
[05:08] <ogra> waht even
[05:08] <ogra> ergh
[05:08] <tseng|work> not even unsigned
[05:08] <tseng|work> just int
[05:10] <tseng|work> i hope i dont need to start again and learn python
[05:10] <Mithrandir> tseng|work: do yourself a favour; don't learn tcl.
[05:10] <Mithrandir> tcl should die.
[05:11] <tseng|work> Mithrandir: i wish, the other coders here work with expect and php
[05:11] <tseng|work> those were my choices
[05:11] <Mithrandir> assembly?
[05:11] <tseng|work> now that im 95% done and tcl is overflowing integers
[05:11] <Mithrandir> mono? perl? shell? C? Objective C?  Java?
[05:11] <tseng|work> i can tell them why it needs to be python
[05:11] <\sh> php? as meant in #!/usr/bin/php or as webapps language?
[05:11] <tseng|work> \sh: the rest of the app is a php web app
[05:12] <tseng|work> this is like the shell backend
[05:12] <tseng|work> it does snmp polling and rrd data storage
[05:12] <tseng|work> and mysql
[05:12] <\sh> hmmm
[05:12] <tseng|work> the tcl bindings for all that is nice enough
[05:12] <\sh> tseng: what is it?
[05:12] <tseng|work> just..
[05:12] <tseng|work> i cant store the full snmp data
[05:12] <tseng|work> \sh: it graphs network traffic
[05:13] <tseng|work> with rrdtool
[05:13] <tseng|work> but it has a custom interface and polls 1000s of interfaces
[05:13] <\sh> i prefer cacti as full php solution http://www.cacti.net/
[05:13] <tseng|work> no
[05:14] <tseng|work> I tried that
[05:14] <\sh> but to have something professional, i'm using the old lycos solution, rrdtool+some perl applications
[05:14] <tseng|work> there is an existing solution it has to work like
[05:14] <tseng|work> the cacti navigation blows majorly for a network this size
[05:14] <ogra> Mithrandir, no python in your list ?
[05:15] <Mithrandir> ogra: he already had python mentioned
[05:15] <\sh> tseng: how large is the network?
[05:15] <ogra> ah
[05:15] <tseng|work> sh there are 848 hosts in the database
[05:15] <tseng|work> we are polling 200 atm
[05:15] <tseng|work> which comes to 8000+ interfaces
[05:15] <\sh> hmmm...
[05:15] <tseng|work> the single problem is the size of ifOutOctets/ifInOctets from the internet routers is larger than signed int
[05:16] <\sh> so tcl is bugging u or php or mysql? ,-)
[05:16] <tseng|work> all of it
[05:16] <tseng|work> the stuff php/mysql is doing for the frontend is fine
[05:17] <\sh> what? moment...if i'm right, boris released the lycos tool as gpl lic
[05:17] <\sh> we had no mysql..only a bug emc storage ;)
[05:18] <\sh> s/bug/big/
[05:19] <tseng|work> hm i think my network guy is lying about the counter not rolling over
[05:20] <tseng|work> my data is fine
[05:20] <\sh> tseng|work: if you want to have some fun with a real sysadmin geek, try out https://sourceforge.net/projects/zerod/
[05:20] <tseng|work> its only in cvs, the other annoyance here :P
[05:21] <\sh> we tried during my lycos times to clean the code but I gave up
[05:21] <\sh> it's working for services as well as on snmp pulls
[05:37] <Riddell> does breezy pbuilder work for anyone, it always gets stuck on g++ for me
[05:38] <tseng|work> it worked for me as of a few days ago
[05:41] <Riddell>  g++ depends on g++-4.0 (>= 4.0.0-7); however:
[05:41] <Riddell>   Package g++-4.0 is not installed.
[05:41] <Riddell> it's never worked for me
[05:43] <ogra> Riddell, yeasterday it worked here...
[05:44] <Riddell> it must just hate me
[05:45] <\sh> hmmm..
[05:45] <\sh> Riddell: trying to compile patched python-kde3 now...
[05:47] <\sh> Riddell: hmm
[05:47] <\sh> Riddell: python2.4-qt3-dev
[05:49] <\sh> grmpf
[05:49] <\sh> i should recompile python2.4-qt3
[05:53] <tseng|work> bbl
[05:53] <\sh> and if elmo would include the keys ;) i could even upload those packages ;)
[05:54] <siretart> :)
[05:55] <\sh> hmmm..my laptop is even getting hotter
[05:57] <DanielN> moin
[05:57] <siretart> hi DanielN
[06:02] <DanielN> hi siretart
[06:09] <ivoks> did you have fun at UDU?
[06:13] <ogra> ivoks, indeedc
[06:13] <ogra> -c
[06:13] <ogra> 12h working fun every day ;)
[06:14] <ivoks> hehe
[06:14] <ivoks> will there be more events like that?
[06:14] <ivoks> somewhere near europe? :)
[06:14] <siretart> ivoks: for hoary the meeting was in spain
[06:14] <ogra> the last one was in barcelona
[06:15] <ivoks> eh..
[06:15] <ivoks> then next one will be in america or africa...
[06:15] <ivoks> or even asia
[06:23] <ivoks> uh...
[06:23] <ivoks> ubuntu is great :)
[06:25] <\sh> africa would be cool :)
[06:26] <ivoks> yeah
[06:26] <ivoks> omg
[06:26] <ivoks> http://www.cafepress.com/ubuntushop.14580501
[06:26] <Riddell> launchpad meeting was in south afraica
[06:26] <ivoks> you can tell it's made in usa :)
[06:27] <Riddell> I heard a rumour the next ubuntu meeting might be in Germany
[06:27] <ivoks> yeah?!
[06:28] <ivoks> that would be great
[06:28] <ogra> bah
[06:29] <\sh> I think it will be hold on mars
[06:29] <\sh> the mars has the right ubuntu color ;)
[06:32] <ivoks> speeking of color
[06:33] <ivoks> i can't find any brown ubuntu t-shirts
[06:33] <DanielN> is debian/compat important ?
[06:34] <ivoks> well, yes
[06:35] <ivoks> or maybe not... :)
[06:35] <DanielN> ?!
[06:37] <ivoks> DanielN: sprichst du deutsch?
[06:37] <ivoks> DanielN: http://www.ngolde.de/cdbs.html#7
[06:37] <\sh> hmm...ivoks surprises me more and more ;)
[06:38] <ivoks> :)
[06:38] <ivoks> DanielN: look at first sentence
[06:39] <ivoks> Es ist wichtig :)
[06:39] <ivoks> so, i guess it
[06:39] <ivoks> it's important...
[06:40] <ivoks> \sh: i kenne deutsch, aber sehr wenig... :(
[06:40] <DanielN> ok .. then it is important ...
[06:40] <DanielN> but it contains simply a '4' in my case
[06:40] <ivoks> DanielN: it's allways 4 :)
[06:44] <DanielN> mhm .. ok
[06:44] <siretart> should be
[06:45] <siretart> DanielN: read the manpage debhelper(7), espc. the chapter about versions
[06:45] <siretart> DanielN: your comapt file tells the debhelper tools to use compatibility level 4
[06:45] <DanielN> aha
[06:45] <DanielN> ok .. thy
[06:45] <DanielN> +x
[06:49] <\sh> this is strange
[06:50] <\sh> my pbuilder env tells me that python2.4-qt3 is run-dep to libqt3c102-mt*
[06:50] <\sh> but my breezy chroot and pbuilder env on another machine is doing it right
[06:50] <\sh> everything is up2date at all
[06:51] <ivoks> are you sure?
[06:51] <ivoks> chroot is
[06:51] <ivoks> but i don't think that first one is...
[06:52] <DanielN> mhm .. im "verwirrt" .. with dh_make -e bl@bla -f ../bla.tar.gz there would be a .orig.tar.gz in parent .. but i'm doing changes to the makefile, so i need a diffrent .orig.tar.gz .. one is built with "dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot" .. but it contains the revision too, not good. is this cause in changelog version name is with revision extension ?
[06:52] <\sh> i'm not building in the chroot
[06:52] <\sh> DanielN: u need to make patches
[06:52] <\sh> so create a source dir with original source
[06:52] <DanielN> src/ ?
[06:52] <\sh> create another one with original.patched ;)
[06:52] <ivoks> \sh: python2.4-qt3 depends on libqt3c102-mt
[06:53] <\sh> ivoks: it's not there anymore in the sourcepackage...
[06:53] <\sh> after the last update
[06:53] <DanielN> \sh: mhm seems complicated to me with short explanation :)
[06:53] <\sh> DanielN: the other thing u can do is using dpatch
[06:53] <\sh> you go into the source dir (with the debian dir )
[06:53] <DanielN> yeah
[06:54] <ivoks> cd /put ; more beer
[06:54] <\sh> and dpatch-edit-patch 01_<your patchname>
[06:54] <ivoks> good one :)
[06:54] <ivoks> cd /pub
[06:54] <\sh> it creates a temp env for the source, u do your changes, ctrl+d and the patch is written
[06:54] <DanielN> cool
[06:54] <\sh> but better would be you do this
[06:54] <\sh> tar -xvzf <orig>.tar.gz
[06:55] <DanielN> the new one?
[06:55] <DanielN> with revision?
[06:55] <\sh> mv <origsource> <origsource>.patched
[06:55] <\sh> tar -xvzf <orig>.tar.gz
[06:55] <\sh> cd origsource.patched
[06:55] <ivoks> diff :)
[06:55] <\sh> make your patched
[06:55] <\sh> -d+s
[06:55] <\sh> cd ..
[06:55] <\sh> diff -ur <origsource> <origsource>.patched
[06:55] <\sh> u will see the diff
[06:56] <\sh> diff -ur <origsource> <origsource>.patched > <yourpatch>.diff
[06:56] <\sh> u have your normale /usr/bin/patch compatible diff file
[06:56] <ivoks> -Nur ?
[06:56] <\sh> -u == unified
[06:56] <DanielN> ok
[06:56] <DanielN> origsource is replaced with what?
[06:57] <\sh> ok..slowley
[06:57] <\sh> lets take an example
[06:57] <\sh> yoursource-0.14
[06:57] <\sh> the orig tar is
[06:57] <\sh> yoursource-0.14.tar.gz
[06:58] <\sh> ok..now
[06:58] <DanielN> the one built with dh_make?
[06:58] <ivoks> \sh: end user help didn't go well last time :)
[06:58] <\sh> no the upstream source
[06:58] <DanielN> the upstream one
[06:58] <DanielN> ah.. ok
[06:59] <\sh> now do this: mkdir patching ; cd patching ; tar -xvzf ../yoursource-0.14.tar.gz ; mv yoursource-0.14 yoursource-0.14.patched ; tar -xvzf ../yoursource-0.14.tar.gz
[06:59] <\sh> cd yoursource-0.14.patched
[06:59] <\sh> do your patching work
[06:59] <\sh> after this u do:
[06:59] <\sh> cd ..
[07:00] <\sh> diff -ur yoursource-0.14 yoursource-0.14.patched > yoursource_name_of_diff.diff
[07:00] <\sh> cd ..
[07:00] <\sh> now go into the sourcedir with the debian dir
[07:00] <\sh> mkdir -p debian/patches
[07:01] <DanielN> -p?
[07:01] <\sh> cp ../patching/yoursource_name_of_diff.diff debian/patches/
[07:01] <thom> creates all the directories required
[07:01] <\sh> -p == parent ;)
[07:01] <DanielN> ok
[07:02] <DanielN> and then i should rebuild it?
[07:02] <\sh> and then adjust your rules file to have a patch: target and unpatch target
[07:02] <\sh> there is an example i think in the debian new maintainers guide
[07:03] <DanielN> ah... k
[07:04] <DanielN> thats all?
[07:04] <\sh> if you adjusted your rules file to apply patches etc.
[07:04] <\sh> then you can rebuild it
[07:05] <DanielN> ok
[07:05] <DanielN> thanks very well! nice "workshop" :)
[07:05] <ivoks> :)
[07:06] <\sh> well it depends what you like more, dpatch magic or cdbs magic ;) for plain rules file i like dpatch and for cdbs there is this really nice simple-patchsys file, and this handles everything ;)
[07:08] <DanielN> aha..
[07:08] <ogra> \sh, please dont teach cdbs to newcomers
[07:08] <ogra> its required to understand the basics first... you miss that if you directly start with cdbs
[07:08] <\sh> ogra: hmmm...
[07:09] <DanielN> seems "einleuchtend" ogra
[07:09] <\sh> ogra: right....
[07:09] <\sh> ogra: well, depends I think :) I used cdbs first, and studied the magic behind it :)
[07:10] <jbailey> ogra: Ah, we haven't had the recurring cdbs argument in at least a week ;)
[07:10] <ogra> yeah, you have to renew it once a week ;)
[07:10] <\sh> there is really one point
[07:11] <\sh> and I'm missing really a QA for debian/rules...you can say: ok, no lintian and linda warnings, but if you have a look at debians source packages sometimes, it's scaring me
[07:12] <ivoks> \sh: agree
[07:12] <ivoks> i'm new in this packaging thing
[07:13] <ivoks> but there are rules that blows your mind...
[07:13] <ivoks> on one place, guy created a patch which creates config.sub and config.guess
[07:13] <ivoks> ok..
[07:13] <ivoks> and then copys that same files from /usr/share/misc
[07:14] <\sh> ivoks: this is not the problem..the problem was the "clean:" target where this happened
[07:14] <ivoks> ?
[07:15] <ogra> thats a really odd one, it calls ./configure in the clean target....
[07:15] <\sh> hihih
[07:15] <ivoks> :))
[07:16] <ogra> so you have to have all build deps installed to make a simple source package, which is mental ill....
[07:16] <\sh> ogra: but this is solvable
[07:16] <ogra> and indeed 3d indicates a lot of GL build-deps
[07:16] <ivoks> :)
[07:16] <ogra> absolutely...
[07:16] <ivoks> and that asks for X
[07:16] <ivoks> :)
[07:16] <ogra> sure
[07:17] <ivoks> so you have 340MB of build-deps
[07:17] <\sh> ogra: but what about thinks like rules for installing files for multiple bin packages
[07:17] <ivoks> for 5MB source :)
[07:17] <\sh> s/thinks/things/
[07:18] <\sh> lets see if i can reproduce this bug
[07:19] <ivoks> or... even better
[07:19] <ivoks> rollerblading :)
[07:19] <ivoks> bye :)
[07:19] <\sh> ivoks: grab the source of python2.4-qt3
[07:19] <\sh> and please check the debian/control
[07:20] <DanielN> \sh back again short.. from which dir must i build the package at the end? in the *.patched ?
[07:20] <\sh> no
[07:20] <\sh> the .patched dir is only for working
[07:20] <DanielN> ok
[07:20] <\sh> u make the diff between an upstream source dir and .patched dir
[07:20] <DanielN> yeah
[07:20] <\sh> then cp the patch to debian/patches
[07:20] <\sh> adjust rules
[07:20] <ivoks> when you are over with chnages in .patched dir
[07:20] <\sh> and build in sourcedir with debian/
[07:21] <\sh> or better in pbuilder env
[07:21] <ivoks> \sh: ok, i'm looking at control
[07:21] <DanielN> so i mustn't change anything in the sourcedir with debian/ (the .diff manages that?)
[07:21] <\sh> DanielN: u don't change anything in the sourcedir with debian
[07:22] <DanielN> ok .. clear now ..
[07:22] <DanielN> thanks :)
[07:22] <Riddell> ogra: if you're modifying dput to not include debian sites by default could you also put in a check to make sure the distribution isn't still set to a debian one, cos that can be embaracing
[07:22] <\sh> ivoks: please have a look for libqt3c102-mt
[07:22] <Riddell> libqt3c102-mt doesn't exist any more in breezy
[07:22] <ogra> Riddell, is that a part of dput ?
[07:22] <Riddell> ogra: no, but it should be
[07:22] <ivoks> \sh: ok libqt3c102-mt-mysql|libqt3c102-mt-odbc|libqt3c102-mt-psql
[07:23] <\sh> Riddell: yes :) but the new package of python-qt3 compiled by doko is depending on it
[07:23] <\sh> ivoks: wrong line,..this is suggest
[07:23] <\sh> i fixed it now
[07:23] <\sh> no really: Depends: line
[07:23] <ivoks> there is no
[07:23] <Riddell> it's a part of the katie stuff
[07:23] <ivoks> but
[07:24] <\sh> Riddell: and I dont see where the dep is..it's not in the source
[07:24] <\sh> katie stuff?
[07:24] <ivoks> \sh: new package should depend on  libqt3-mt
[07:24] <\sh> ivoks: yeah...
[07:24] <ivoks> and it does
[07:24] <ivoks> libqt3-mt-dev
[07:26] <\sh> ivoks: i checked everything there is nothing in the source debian/control but occurs only in the binary
[07:27] <ivoks> ok, could you rephrase this? :)
[07:29] <Riddell> \sh: which package depends on the bad qt?
[07:29] <\sh> Riddell: python2.4-qt3
[07:29] <ivoks> \sh: ? it depends on right qt
[07:30] <Riddell> \sh: it'll be brought in by shlibs
[07:30] <\sh> Riddell: I recompiled the package
[07:30] <\sh> with all c102 occurencies removed, correct suggests etc. I don't find any c102 lib anymore ;)
[07:31] <\sh> strange thing, that it went through the buildd
[07:31] <ivoks> ?!
[07:31] <\sh> ivoks: apt-cache show python2.4-qt3
[07:31] <ivoks> yeah, no c102 at all
[07:31] <ivoks> except changelog and Replaces/Conflicts
[07:32] <\sh> Replaces: python2.4-qt3c102
[07:32] <\sh> Depends: libc6 (>= 2.3.2.ds1-4), libfontconfig1 (>= 2.2.1), libgcc1 (>= 1:4.0-0pre6ubuntu4), libice6 | xlibs (>> 4.1.0), libpng12-0 (>= 1.2.8rel), libqt3c102-mt (>= 3:3.3.3), libsm6 | xlibs (>> 4.1.0), libstdc++5 (>= 1:3.3.4-1), libx11-6 | xlibs (>> 4.1.0), libxext6 | xlibs (>> 4.1.0), zlib1g (>= 1:1.2.1), python2.4, python2.4-sip4-qt3 (>= 4.2), python2.4-sip4-qt3 (<< 4.3)
[07:32] <\sh> this is the output
[07:32] <ivoks> no way man
[07:32] <ivoks> that's old source
[07:32] <\sh> no
[07:32] <Riddell> \sh: do you have libqt3c102-mt on your system?
[07:32] <ivoks> ups..
[07:32] <bddebian> Howdy
[07:32] <\sh> Riddell: no qt in the chroot
[07:32] <ivoks> i'm in wrong source :)
[07:33] <\sh> Riddell: it's coming directly from archive.ubuntu.com in the pbuilder
[07:33] <\sh> ivoks: the output was for the binary package
[07:33] <ivoks> well, didn't build it...
[07:33] <\sh> i updated my chroot and pbuilder now many times...no change
[07:33] <ivoks> sorry...
[07:34] <ivoks> all right, i have my PGP key signed
[07:34] <ivoks> by a person that administrates one of PGP servers
[07:34] <\sh> but if I compile python-qt3 by myself, the result is no run-dep on c102 anywhere
[07:34] <ivoks> is that good enough? :)
[07:35] <ogra> as long as you met him in person...
[07:35] <ogra> and showed your id card....
[07:35] <ivoks> ogra: he's my friend :)
[07:35] <ogra> so ?
[07:35] <ivoks> he saw my id card
[07:35] <ogra> oki
[07:36] <ivoks> when police busted us :)
[07:36] <ogra> heh
[07:36] <ivoks> does that count? :)
[07:36] <\sh> Riddell: i rechecked on ravel (thx to Mithrandir again) and the same result for amd64
[07:36] <ogra> yeah, you guys drive like crazy down there
[07:36] <ivoks> ogra: true
[07:36] <ogra> but the streets are tempting to do that ;)
[07:37] <ivoks> nothing makes me more angry than woman on 3 line road driving 40km/h
[07:37] <ivoks> :)
[07:38] <\sh> lemme chekc the buildlogs
[07:38] <ivoks> \sh: check rules :)
[07:38] <ivoks> funny stuff can be found there :)
[07:39] <\sh> no wonder
[07:39] <ivoks> \sh: what? :)
[07:39] <\sh> i386 failed
[07:40] <\sh> argl
[07:40] <ivoks> so... off i go
[07:41] <DanielN> \sh: hmm.. i can't find anything about the "patched" rule file in the maintainer guide :(
[07:43] <Riddell> \sh: ravel?
[07:43] <\sh> Riddell: amd64 machine
[07:43] <\sh> DanielN: ok...please have a look in the source of arkrpg
[07:43] <\sh> apt-get source arkrpg
[07:44] <\sh> there is a patch and unpatch target for debian/rules
[07:44] <\sh> do it like in this debian/rules file
[07:44] <Riddell> \sh: I'll upload a new python2.4-qt3 then with the Suggests fixed to not be c102 and hopefully it'll link against the right one this time
[07:44] <DanielN> ok thanks
[07:45] <\sh> Riddell: well, i would but u forget the fact, that siretat and i are not able right now to upload (elmos workplace ;))
[07:45] <\sh> Riddell: u need a diff?
[07:45] <Riddell> \sh: diff would be nice
[07:47] <\sh> Riddell: mail or should I dcc?
[07:47] <Riddell> I prefer web
[07:47] <Riddell> else e-mail
[07:47] <\sh> oh ok :)
[07:47] <\sh>  no problem :)
[07:49] <DanielN> \sh: you mean this part? :
[07:49] <DanielN> include /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/debhelper.mk
[07:49] <DanielN> # Including this file gets us a simple patch system.  You can just
[07:49] <DanielN> # drop patches in debian/patches, and they will be automatically
[07:49] <DanielN> # applied and unapplied.
[07:49] <DanielN> include /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/simple-patchsys.mk
[07:49] <DanielN> include /usr/share/cdbs/1/class/autotools.mk
[07:50] <\sh> DanielN: this is cdbs
[07:50] <DanielN> yeah
[07:50] <\sh> i mean a plain rule ,)
[07:50] <DanielN> but i don't see this plain rule
[07:50] <DanielN> maybe i'm blind or something ;)
[07:51] <\sh> ah wrong packages..I'm a bit confused
[07:51] <\sh> moemnt
[07:51] <DanielN> thought that ;)
[07:52] <\sh> aspseek is the right one ;) those packages r right now in my trans queue ;)
[07:52] <DanielN> ok i try this one ;>
[07:53] <\sh> Riddell: http://ubuntu.linux-server.org/index.php?path=python-qt3
[07:54] <\sh> debdiff output
[08:02] <Riddell> compiling pyqt, just to make sure
[08:03] <\sh> python2.4-sip4-qt3?
[08:04] <Riddell> whichever one you gave me the patch for :)
[08:05] <\sh> python-qt3 ;)
[08:05] <Riddell> what's the difference?
[08:05] <\sh> ok... this naming is really b0rked ;)
[08:05] <\sh> Riddell: hehe...sip4 is the basement of python-qt3
[08:06] <\sh> it gives te possibilty to create c++-python bindings at all
[08:06] <\sh> that's why I'm always confused with python2.4-sip4-qt3
[08:06] <Riddell> the description on python2.4-sip4-qt3 needs updating "Python2.3+Qt3 runtime"
[08:07] <\sh> Riddell: we should rename it...
[08:08] <\sh> because the implicit description is wrong
[08:09] <Riddell> that would mean getting out of sync with debian a bit too much I suspect
[08:09] <Riddell> python-qt3_3.14.1-2ubuntu2.dsc uploaded
[08:09] <\sh> Riddell: then debian has to move with us ;)
[08:10] <Riddell> Maintainer: Ricardo Javier Cardenes Medina, guys got a cool name whoever he is
[08:10] <\sh> well...if I make my pykde patches and some DD will take it for pykde in debian, we will be out of sync with upstream ;)
[08:11] <Riddell> python-qt3_3.14.1-2ubuntu2_source.changes ACCEPTED
[08:11] <\sh> but at least there is a real running pykde implementation
[08:11] <Riddell> that's always a good sign
[08:11] <Riddell> \sh: what's the status of pykde in debian?
[08:13] <\sh> Riddell: same as ours now...upstream 3.11.3
[08:13] <\sh> is official upstream
[08:13] <\sh> kdebindings has 3.11.4
[08:13] <\sh> ad
[08:13] <\sh> and I'm working with 20050316 snapshot
[08:14] <\sh> and this I will upload to breezy with some patches
[08:14] <\sh> upstream is informed, he's not updating his source
[08:14] <Riddell> strange that
[08:15] <\sh> Riddell: i will document the changes in README.debian ;) or README.ubuntu
[08:16] <\sh> Riddell: and we are far ahead of upstream
[08:16] <\sh> and u can try to get this package into upstream kde svn ;)
[08:16] <\sh> or at least the patches
[08:16] <Riddell> good idea
[08:17] <ajmitch> morning
[08:19] <\sh> hey ajmitch
[08:20] <ogra> hey ajmitch
[08:26] <bddebian> Heya ajmitch
[08:28] <ogra> ajmitch, would you mind making up with herve who takes the lead for MOTUPython ? there are some people interested in jioning the team... but they asked why the site is this empty... it would be nice to have at least a leader
[08:30] <ajmitch> sure
[08:31] <\sh> apropos team ;)
[08:31] <\sh> Riddell: do u mind, when I'm putting my name on MOTUKDE?
[08:32] <Riddell> \sh: please do
[08:33] <Amaranth> MOTUPython? what do they do? :)
[08:34] <ogra> Amaranth, ask the teamleader (if we have one) ;)
[08:35] <ogra> \sh, nope, forbidden
[08:35] <ogra> \sh, put it on MOTUGNOME
[08:35] <\sh> hahaha
[08:36] <DanielN> \sh: i've uploaded it now with patch .. so u can take a look at opportunity
[08:37] <\sh> DanielN: "when" ?
[08:37] <DanielN> yes
[08:38] <\sh> just now
[08:38] <ogra> lol
[08:39] <\sh> ogra: what with "lol" ;) u can review as well ;)
[08:39] <\sh> *lol*
[08:39] <ogra> \sh, i have other tasks assigned currently...
[08:40] <\sh> ogra: /me too...i need to clean my flat...but I'm waiting until it's a bit cooler
[08:40] <ogra> \sh, no, i mean distro wise...
[08:41] <\sh> hmmm
[08:41] <\sh> kdebase-dev depends on konqueror 4:3.4.0-0ubuntu21
[08:41] <\sh> is not going to be installed
[08:46] <\sh> hmmm...
[09:13] <\sh> Riddell: ping check buildlogs for python-qt3
[09:13] <\sh> python2.3/python2.4-dev missing ;)
[09:14] <\sh> libqt3-mt-dev missing
[09:15] <Riddell> "libqscintilla-dev: Depends: libqscintilla5c2 (= 1.5.1-1ubuntu1) but it is not installable"
[09:16] <\sh> hmmm....
[09:17] <\sh> doko uploaded them...
[09:18] <Riddell> libqscintilla-dev installs for me
[09:18] <\sh> its not in main
[09:18] <\sh> see u-toolchain
[09:18] <\sh> [21:16]  <Kamion> \sh: no, libqscintilla5c2 isn't in main
[09:18] <\sh> [21:17]  <Kamion> which is because python-qt3 and libqscintilla-dev are scheduled for demotion to universe
[09:18] <\sh> [21:17]  <Kamion> (nothing in main uses them at the moment)
[09:19] <Riddell> ah
[09:19] <Riddell> where did that conversation take place?
[09:20] <\sh> #ubuntu-toolchain
[09:20] <\sh> and the buildlog says it took the 2ubuntu2 version of python-qt3
[09:22] <Riddell> so we have to wait for universe demotion, bit of a pain
[09:22] <\sh> how long will it take?
[09:23] <\sh> ah elmo ;)
[09:25] <\sh> ok..will do something else..cleaning my flat
[10:28] <jbailey> chillywilly: Dan!
[10:28] <chillywilly> Jeff!
[10:29] <jbailey> ajmitch: Look what the cat dragged in... ;)
[10:30] <bddebian> chillywilly: WTF are you doing here?? :-)
[10:30] <chillywilly> I love Ubuntu?
[10:30] <chillywilly> :)
[10:30] <bddebian> Heh
[10:34] <\sh> dinner time....
[10:36] <jbailey> ogra: ping?
[10:37] <ogra> jbailey, pong
[10:38] <jbailey> ogra: Got a sec for an introduction?
[10:38] <ogra> sur
[10:38] <ogra> e
[10:38] <jbailey> ogra: chillywilly is someone I've known for a small eon.  A lunatic^Wbright lad I met through Hurd work.
[10:38] <jbailey> ogra: He expressed interest in motuship.
[10:39] <ogra> to build a hurd derivative ? :-P
[10:39] <jbailey> ogra: He's done python and c++ work with gnu enterprise.
[10:39] <ogra> great
[10:40] <ogra> hi chillywilly
[10:40] <ogra> :)
[10:40] <Mithrandir> jbailey: gnu enterprise as in gnue?  The big scary BPR-ishy thing?
[10:40] <jbailey> Mithrandir: Right, that's the one. =)
[10:40] <bddebian> BPR?
[10:41] <Mithrandir> business process reengineering.  Stuff like peoplesoft and SAP do.
[10:41] <ogra> chillywilly to become a MOTU you'll first have to become a member....
[10:42] <ogra> becoming a member starts with creating a wikipage for yourself
[10:42] <ogra> here is a example of a perfect one:
[10:42] <ogra> wiki.ubuntu.com/DanielRobitaille
[10:42] <bddebian> Mithrandir: No those are examples of ERP systems :-)
[10:43] <ogra> yours doesnt need to be this good, but you see scheme
[10:43] <Mithrandir> bddebian: blah, you're right.  I think gnue is that too.
[10:43] <bddebian> ;-)
[10:43] <Mithrandir> bddebian: as I said, big scary thing. :-)
[10:43] <ogra> next step to membership is to make a contribution of any kind
[10:43] <bddebian> Mithrandir: Nothing is scarier than SAP, that is true.. :-)
[10:44] <ogra> this could be a: howto wikipage, desktop background, a patch or anything else valuable for ubuntu you can imagine
[10:44] <ogra> you can even fix bugs ;)
[10:45] <ogra> after you made one or the other contribution, you put yourself on the CommunityCouncilAgenda
[10:45] <ogra> http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/CommunityCouncilAgenda
[10:45] <ogra> and attend the meeting....
[10:45] <ogra> the CC will approve you as a member then
[10:45] <ogra> thats step one....
[10:46] <ogra> step two is to help with packaging ....
[10:47] <ogra> you fix pakages for a transition or fix packages that have bugs in universe... find a MOTU to review your work and if its fine your stuff gets uploaded...
[10:47] <ogra> do that with some packages....
[10:47] <ogra> after that you set yourself on the TechnicalBoardAgenda
[10:47] <ogra> http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/TechnicalBoardAgenda
[10:48] <ogra> attend the meeting and the TB will ask MOTU for a judgement of your packaging skills... if MOTU says its ok, you get approved as MOTU and gain upload rights....
[10:49] <ogra> oh, and i forgot, you need a valid signed gpg key
[10:49] <bddebian> Sheesh, sounds like work.. :-)
[10:49] <ogra> (after CC approval you'll need to sign our code of conduct and send it to mako)
[10:50] <ogra> thats all
[10:50] <ogra> :=)
[10:50] <tseng|work> hi ogrea
[10:50] <tseng|work> ogra
[10:50] <kas11> sheesh...looking at that wiki page sure makes me feel inadequate ;)
[10:50] <ogra> if you are fast, you can make it in 4 weeks...
[10:50] <ogra> tseng|work, did i forget something ?
[10:51] <tseng|work> i dont think so
[10:51] <Mithrandir> the key should preferably be signed by another ubuntu or debian developer, but the only must requirement is "is in the strong set"
[10:51] <ogra> ah, and here is the CoC btw: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/community/conduct
[10:51] <ogra> we all are bound to it :)
[10:52] <ogra> other info is on wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU
[10:52] <bddebian> Ahh, now I see why jbailey is here.  He loves being bound and gagged...
[10:52] <ogra> hehe
[10:52] <tseng|work> he's from canada
[10:52] <tseng|work> they are into that stuff
[10:52] <bddebian> Aye :)
[10:53] <ogra> bondage ?
[10:53] <Nafallo> ey! you people start my porno-highlights :-P
[10:54] <ogra> hehe
[10:54] <bddebian> heh
[10:55] <chillywilly> thanks ogra, sounds like a lot of work ;)
[10:55] <jbailey> I walk away from the computer for *5* minutes, and the channel suddenly get good.. *sheesh*
[10:56] <tseng|work> ok guys back to work.
[10:56] <ogra> a probably intresting difference between ubuntu and debian is that we have no personalized packages, most of the stuff we do is teamwork even if some people have their favorites...(like tseng does mono, but ajmitch and myself tinker in this packages too)
[10:56] <chillywilly> don't ever walk away again, just stay by your computer night and day...when you start to stink the wife will let you know
[10:57] <chillywilly> ajmitch is also my buddy
[10:57] <ogra> she'll certainly bring a bucket of water ;)
[10:57] <dholbach> hellas
[10:57] <ogra> dholbach, meet chillywilly, our newest MOTU hopeful :)
[10:57] <dholbach> hey chillywilly, how's it going? :)
[10:57] <bddebian> hellas?
[10:57] <ogra> chillywilly, dholbach and me kind of lead the MOTU world :)
[10:57] <chillywilly> fine, thanks
[10:58] <bddebian> Hello dholbach
[10:58] <dholbach> chillywilly: so the guys were all nice to you? :)
[10:58] <tseng|work> eh its sort of personalized
[10:58] <dholbach> bddebian: that's what the greek say for "hello!" :)
[10:58] <chillywilly> yea
[10:58] <tseng|work> if someone wants to play with mono they better ask me
[10:58] <ogra> tseng|work, two are a team ;)
[10:58] <tseng|work> or be named ogra or ajmitch
[10:58] <bddebian> dholbach: Ah
[10:58] <dholbach> chillywilly: if you have any complaints, just tell me... ;)
[10:58] <bddebian> chillywilly: Oh and they aren't pricks like many of the d-d's
[10:59] <tseng|work> heh yep
[10:59] <tseng|work> im heading home
[10:59] <tseng|work> see you later
[10:59] <ogra> bye
[10:59] <dholbach> see you tseng
[10:59] <bddebian> Bye tseng
[10:59] <bddebian> Mithrandir: What was that for?
[10:59] <chillywilly> ajmitch: what about pnet, you are cheating on her with mono? shame on you ;)
[10:59] <Mithrandir> bddebian: I'm a DD and therefore a prick. :P
[11:00] <Mithrandir> ;-P
[11:00] <bddebian> Mithrandir: I didn't say ALL DD's :-)
[11:00] <chillywilly> um, ok
[11:00] <chillywilly> I really need to sleep for a few years...
[11:00] <Mithrandir> chillywilly: you should just learn packaging and then you can do that instead of sleeping.
[11:01] <ogra> yeah
[11:01] <dholbach> yeah... it's as relaxing...
[11:01] <bddebian> heh
[11:01] <chillywilly> sure
[11:01] <dholbach> ROCK!
[11:01] <kas11> sleep is a primary sign of poor work habits ;)
[11:02] <chillywilly> great, I am being called a slacker already ;)
[11:02] <bddebian> chillywilly: Damn, they must know you already.. ;-P
[11:02] <chillywilly> haha
[11:02] <Mithrandir> chillywilly: we're just trying to guide your steps.
[11:23] <MarioOs> hello
[11:24] <dholbach> hey MarioOs
[11:24] <dholbach> hey ivoks
[11:24] <MarioOs> hello ivoks
[11:25] <ivoks> hi dholbach MarioOs
[11:27] <MarioOs> is there anyone here who is interested in programming some apps
[11:27] <ivoks> :)
[11:27] <MarioOs> just you laugh
[11:27] <dholbach> nobody's laughing
[11:27] <dholbach> what are you planning todo?
[11:28] <ivoks> i'm tierd
[11:28] <MarioOs> no, I was talking to ivoks
[11:29] <MarioOs> Currently, I have in plan to create a Ubuntu central configuration utilitz
[11:29] <MarioOs> utility
[11:29] <chillywilly> ivoks: I am tired too
[11:29] <chillywilly> need a nap
[11:30] <MarioOs> then sleep
[11:31] <chillywilly> can't I am work :)
[11:31] <ivoks> hehe
[11:31] <ivoks> i went rollerblading
[11:31] <HWolf> MarioOs, you'll never get that in
[11:31] <MarioOs> why not
[11:32] <HWolf> afaik, ubuntu and gnome still stick to the filosophy of lots of specialised littel tools that are good at what they do.
[11:32] <HWolf> I've seen it mentioned that for instance a control panel like clustering of config utilities would be shot down.
[11:32] <chillywilly> I thought gconf was a centralized configuration tool
[11:33] <dholbach> MarioOs: configuration like what?
[11:33] <MarioOs> unique thingy
[11:33] <HWolf> for as far as you can call anything centralized in linux, perhaps
[11:33] <dholbach> what do you want configure with that GUI? i'm curious, i have no idea
[11:34] <MarioOs> complete system
[11:34] <ivoks> he has big ambitions :)
[11:34] <MarioOs> install, uninstall package, modem, adsl, everything
[11:34] <MarioOs> just you laugh, ivoks
[11:34] <\sh> MarioOs: u mean u want to develop a tool, which is a config frontend (gnome/kde/motif) to _all_ apps, service daemons, kernel bla ?
[11:34] <dholbach> ahhh
[11:34] <dholbach> that's an ambitious project
[11:34] <MarioOs> sure
[11:34] <MarioOs> but why not do it
[11:34] <MarioOs> it would be a great thing
[11:34] <\sh> something like webmin (+apps)?
[11:34] <MarioOs> nop
[11:35] <MarioOs> it would be a modular configuration utility
[11:35] <ivoks> webmin is modular
[11:35] <dholbach> like gnome-system-tools?
[11:35] <MarioOs> that is- it would have a central gui loading all the configuration modules that there is
[11:35] <\sh> kcontrol?
[11:35] <MarioOs> ok, this will be better
[11:35] <MarioOs> nop
[11:35] <MarioOs> that is bad
[11:35] <ogra> like drak conf
[11:35] <chillywilly> what's the thing that novell/miguel was developing called?
[11:36] <MarioOs> yast
[11:36] <chillywilly> gnome-system-tools
[11:36] <ogra> ARGH
[11:36] <\sh> rotfl
[11:36] <ivoks> yast?!
[11:36] <chillywilly> nevermind, someone already said it
[11:36] <\sh> novell == suse == yast *rotflbtc*
[11:36] <\sh> novell == ximian == redcarpet
[11:36] <\sh> the same
[11:37] <chillywilly> whoever it is
[11:37] <ivoks> i hate suse, just because of yast :)
[11:37] <chillywilly> I was thinking of gnome-system-tools
[11:37] <chillywilly> anywho, my brain is a little frazzled
[11:37] <MarioOs> I hate suse because keyboard isnt working
[11:37] <\sh> well, redhat tried it, they failed
[11:37] <ogra> chillywilly, we already have gnome-system-tools in the default install
[11:37] <chillywilly> I know
[11:37] <\sh> mandriva tried it, they failed
[11:37] <ogra> \sh, redcarpet is only SW management... afaik
[11:37] <dholbach> MarioOs: then don't upgrade to breezy atm - the keyboard is broken as well ;)
[11:38] <\sh> ogra: sure .)
[11:38] <\sh> :)
[11:38] <chillywilly> so, what's wrong with gnome-system-tools MarioOs ?
[11:38] <chillywilly> :P
[11:38] <HWolf> It's an inconsistent mess, if you ask me
[11:38] <dholbach> it could maybe be extended, re-worked, fixed
[11:38] <chillywilly> sounds like it won't work
[11:38] <dholbach> you get a blunt when you're tired, HWolf?
[11:38] <chillywilly> I don't like big monster apps either
[11:39] <\sh> it's impossible
[11:39] <chillywilly> maintenance nightmare
[11:39] <MarioOs> nothings impossible
[11:39] <dholbach> HWolf: that must make you even more sleepy ;)
[11:39] <\sh> how can u cover 100 or more system wide services in a modular or monolithic app?
[11:39] <ivoks> i have centralized config system!
[11:39] <chillywilly> debconf? ;)
[11:39] <ivoks> zsh, /etc, vim, cat and perl
[11:39] <ivoks> :)
[11:39] <HWolf> I've been using gnome full-time since september, and I still feel it's a scraped-together mess building something very good out of a mess.
[11:40] <\sh> every service needs at least one module with specialized config settings, in his own config language
[11:40] <ivoks> it's called ZEVICaP
[11:40] <chillywilly> everyhting should just use LDAP ;)
[11:40] <chillywilly> everything too
[11:40] <\sh> chillywilly: put xmlconfigs into ldap ;)
[11:40] <ivoks> chillywilly: have you used LDAP?
[11:40] <MarioOs> how you ask....every service will develop its own module when they see its a good utility...we just need to do the simple ordinary stuff...install, unistall, etc.
[11:41] <ivoks> that thing has tendency to crash sometimes
[11:41] <\sh> MarioOs: why should they do it? to have a additional point of exploit?
[11:41] <chillywilly> ivoks: yeppers
[11:41] <ajmitch> oh, chillywilly is here
[11:41] <chillywilly> hi ajmitch
[11:41] <ajmitch> hello
[11:41] <chillywilly> I am stalking you ;)
[11:41] <chillywilly> j
[11:41] <chillywilly> j/k
[11:41] <MarioOs> why do you think there will be another exploit
[11:42] <ivoks> uh
[11:42] <\sh> MarioOs: every additional module is a piece of software which can fail
[11:42] <MarioOs> yup
[11:42] <\sh> MarioOs: u need at least one coder to have this module in place
[11:42] <ivoks> MarioOs: cause people are people
[11:42] <ivoks> they make mistakes
[11:42] <MarioOs> yes, yes, I know
[11:43] <ajmitch> chillywilly: come to join the MOTUs?
[11:43] <dholbach> hey schweeb_1 :)
[11:43] <\sh> MarioOs: so, for what good reason a company like "sendmail inc." should provide a tool fuer a global ubuntu linux config system, if noone else is using it?
[11:43] <ivoks> MarioOs: my advice: don't do that... use your energy to something else
[11:43] <MarioOs> what should i do
[11:43] <ivoks> a/to/for
[11:44] <MarioOs> currently I am fixing a thunderbird bug
[11:44] <ivoks> MarioOs: C++ transition needs help :)
[11:44] <MarioOs> dont really like c++, I like C more
[11:44] <chillywilly> ajmitch: yea
[11:44] <ajmitch> chillywilly: good, get to work ;)
[11:44] <chillywilly> ajmitch: trying to be useful
[11:44] <chillywilly> I need a hobby ;)
[11:45] <\sh> MarioOs: compile is comile, bugzilla is bugzilla, debdiff is debdiff...no problem between c/c++
[11:45] <ajmitch> isn't that why you're married? :)
[11:45] <\sh> ajmitch: lol
[11:45] <ivoks> hehe
[11:45] <ivoks> dholbach: how do you feel these days? powerfull? :)
[11:45] <MarioOs> sh....I know theres no problem
[11:46] <ajmitch> ivoks: of course, he has the power!
[11:46] <ivoks> he's the man!
[11:46] <ivoks> he has power!
[11:46] <ivoks> he's he-man!
[11:46] <dholbach> ivoks: erm... it's a different story, when i face my thesis ;)
[11:46] <MarioOs> oh not, just dont do that ivoks
[11:46] <MarioOs> LOLOL
[11:46] <ajmitch> dholbach: you'll be glad to be finished your thesis
[11:47] <ivoks> dholbach: work on it!
[11:47] <MarioOs> ok, are you interested in working in anything else then
[11:47] <tseng> hi
[11:47] <ajmitch> chillywilly: got a spare box to run breezy on?
[11:47] <dholbach> yes... absolutely
[11:47] <ajmitch> hello tseng
[11:47] <ivoks> MarioOs: as we said, C++ transition needs help :/
[11:47] <chillywilly> ajmitch: I am actually brave/silly/stupid and running it here and at home
[11:47] <chillywilly> :-o
[11:47] <MarioOs> I understand ivoks
[11:47] <ajmitch> chillywilly: yes, you are :)
[11:49] <\sh> I could need some help to organize the The German Ubuntu Breezy Badger Release Party
[11:49] <dholbach> haha.... not yet, ivoks :)
[11:49] <ivoks> ah, wait... in EU it's different name for that...
[11:49] <ivoks> phD
[11:49] <dholbach> ivoks: it will be a diploma, no dr.
[11:50] <ivoks> only diploma? come on... you can do that with one eye, and 3 fingers
[11:50] <\sh> ivoks: dholbach needs to defend himself first, in front of the profs, then he gets his diploma :)
[11:50] <ivoks> \sh: i know :) same thing in croatia
[11:50] <ivoks> pice of cake
[11:50] <\sh> everywhere ;)
[11:51] <\sh> at least I was happy to break up with my studies
[11:51] <dholbach> ivoks: shall that make me feel encouraged? :)
[11:51] <ivoks> dholbach: think positive :)
[11:51] <dholbach> i do :)
[11:52] <ivoks> ogra: what else do i have to do so my PGP becomes valid?
[11:52] <ogra> upload it
[11:52] <ivoks> ogra: if you want, i can get it signed by XMMS, gentoo, etc... debian maintainer :)
[11:52] <ajmitch> ivoks: that would be good - any DD is a good person to sign
[11:52] <ivoks> ogra: it is uploaded
[11:53] <ogra> ivoks, one key from the strong connected set is enough
[11:53] <ivoks> ogra: well... check this out: http://pks.aaiedu.hr:11371/pks/lookup?op=vindex&search=0x6D3BAED1EA160D0B
[11:54] <ajmitch> dholbach: well done :)
[11:54] <dholbach> ivoks: is this *yours*?
[11:54] <ivoks> dholbach: no, that guy signed mine
[11:55] <ivoks> http://pks.aaiedu.hr:11371/pks/lookup?op=vindex&search=0x6C1277A9D3BDA225 - this is mine
[11:56] <dholbach> hm, you're not on here: http://www.cs.uu.nl/people/henkp/henkp/pgp/pathfinder/stats/D3BDA225.html
[11:57] <ivoks> well, i can't be everywhere :)
[11:58] <dholbach> yes :)
[11:58] <ivoks> http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?op=vindex&search=0xD3BDA225
[11:58] <ogra> when did you upload it ?
[11:58] <ivoks> key? about month ago...
[11:58] <MarioOs> ok
[11:58] <MarioOs> good night
[11:58] <ivoks> and it was signed today
[11:58] <ivoks> MarioOs: night
[11:59] <dholbach> ah ok... maybe that's why
[11:59] <dholbach> cs.uu.nl always takes some days
[11:59] <ivoks> could be..
[11:59] <ogra> yep
[12:00] <\sh> ah
[12:00] <\sh> wine
[12:00] <\sh> wine from ZA
[12:01] <\sh> western cape area
[12:01] <\sh> Shiraz
[12:01] <\sh> mjum
[12:01] <ajmitch> heh
[12:01] <dholbach> hmmm, shiraz