[12:02] <Nafallo> night all!
[12:02] <dholbach> have a nice day! *wave*
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[12:27] <opi> hi
[12:28] <LinuxJones> opi, hi
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[12:29] <opi> I just killed my laptop with Array1 ;)
[12:29] <opi> but I see that Kamion is away, so I'll write him e-mail instead of /query
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[12:32] <mkde> Amaranth, you here by any chance?
[12:32] <Amaranth> mkde: yeah
[12:33] <mkde> Amaranth, i was just thinking about the name for your menu editor
[12:33] <mkde> ;)
[12:33] <Amaranth> opi: colony 1
[12:33] <Amaranth> mkde: hehe, that's part of the fun
[12:33] <opi> Amaranth, right
[12:33] <mkde> Amaranth, ahh, just checking it was intentional
[12:33] <opi> Amaranth, it's almost 1AM so I'm dizzy ;)
[12:33] <Amaranth> mkde: I didn't know it was short for smegma at the time, but I'm sticking with it now.
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[12:34] <mkde> Amaranth, thats not what i mean
[12:34] <mkde> http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=smeg&r=f
[12:34] <Amaranth> yeah, i found all that out later
[12:34] <Amaranth> it's Simple Menu Editor for GNOME
[12:34] <mkde> i hadn't heard of smegma ;)
[12:34] <mkde> ouch
[12:34] <mkde> now i have
[12:35] <Amaranth> it's also a red dwarf thing, which is why i liked it
[12:35] <mkde> Amaranth, if it goes into breezy will you stick with the name?
[12:35] <Amaranth> i don't want the show but someone i know does and their nick is Smeggy, i thought he'd think it was funny
[12:35] <mkde> *grins*
[12:35] <Amaranth> unless you can think of a better name..
[12:35] <mkde> nono
[12:36] <mkde> just curious
[12:36] <Amaranth> for the package for breezy i can patch it to be called just 'Menu Editor'
[12:37] <mkde> all good
[12:37] <mkde> nice prog anyhow
[12:38] <Amaranth> it's even better on my machine :)
[12:38] <Amaranth> all the long waits when you do things are gone
[12:38] <mkde> cool
[12:38] <mkde> ok bed for me
[12:38] <mkde> keep up the top work
[12:38] <Amaranth> night
[12:39] <\sh> ok..also time to go to bed
[12:39] <\sh> cu tomorrow 
[12:39] <opi> OK, I'm going to install Slackware ;D
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[01:41] <thom> Mithrandir: i'm running the hoary security build currently and it's great; will try a rebuild of 1.0.4 in the morning
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[02:03] <Unfrgiven> elmo: ping?
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[02:04] <Unfrgiven> elmo: can we pull freemind from unstable into universe?
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[02:14] <lifeless> mjg59: ping
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[02:28] <daniels> KaiL_: well, this was just plain misleading, so I pulled it
[02:31] <lifeless> daniels: ah there you are
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[02:31] <AndyFitz> #ubuntu-love
[02:31] <lifeless> daniels: so the laptop screen isn't right
[02:31] <lifeless> X thinks its 1024x768
[02:31] <AndyFitz> opps no /join
[02:31] <lifeless> my pixels are WIDE
[02:32] <lifeless> daniels: where should I discuss this with you ?
[02:42] <daniels> lifeless: awesome
[02:43] <daniels> lifeless: your bios is probably shit.  i810, right?
[02:43] <lifeless> 0000:00:02.0 VGA compatible controller: Intel Corp. Mobile Graphics Controller (rev 03)
[02:44] <daniels> you WIN!
[02:44] <daniels> your prize is getting to hunt around for 855resolution or something that works for your laptop
=== tseng just packaged boo
[02:44] <tseng> if anyone is into that kind of thing
[02:45] <thom> boo? that scripting language thing?
[02:45] <tseng> yes.
[02:45] <lifeless> daniels: any chance to teach breezy to DTRT ?
[02:45] <daniels> lifeless: not at all
[02:45] <lifeless> :[
[02:46] <daniels> lifeless: needs either a) people to write proper video BIOSes, b) intel to stop being shit and stop demanding people set modes through the BIOS, and tell us how to program modes ourselves
[02:46] <lifeless> 915resolution apparently
[02:46] <daniels> or, preferably, both
[02:47] <lifeless> daniels: erkay.
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[02:48] <lifeless> daniels: is there some hook in the xorg.conf I can tell it to run the 915program
[02:48] <lifeless> rather than hacking gdms startup script ?
[02:48] <daniels> lifeless: nope
[02:49] <jdub> daniels: can we support running those proggies where necessary by default somehow?
[02:49] <lifeless> daniels: could we get something like that to make it less traumatic?
[02:50] <lifeless> daniels: so that its 'apt-get install 915resolution' + dpkg-reconfigure and tell it what I've got, rather than 'learn all this shit once off just for my laptop'
[02:50] <daniels> jdub: no, and I really don't want to
[02:51] <daniels> jdub: there's no sensible way to work out which one to run by default
[02:51] <daniels> jdub: get it wrong, and your video BIOS is fucked until we reboot
[02:51] <daniels> jdub: if we're stomping all across the video BIOS at reboot ...
[02:51] <tseng> thom: it runs on mono, naturally
[02:51] <thom> tseng: indeed
[02:52] <whiprush> evening gents.
[02:52] <tseng> hi whiprush
=== thom tips his hat to whiprush
[02:52] <whiprush> jdub: let's talk about a large, rectangular device that cools food and drinks.
[02:52] <lifeless> daniels: magic choice would be hard. but easy-to-do would be good and less hard.
[02:52] <thom> and goes to bed
[02:52] <daniels> whiprush: yo
[02:53] <thom> whiprush: can i put beer in it?
[02:53] <lifeless> Later thom
[02:53] <whiprush> heya daniels 
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[03:00] <tseng> bye thom 
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[03:06] <lifeless> daniels: thanks
[03:06] <lifeless> daniels: evil but works
[03:07] <lifeless> other bit of weirdness you may be able to shed light on..
[03:07] <lifeless> sleep the laptop
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[03:07] <lifeless> comes back ok, but the brightness is gone.
[03:07] <lifeless> fn-bright up or down, and it comes normal
[03:07] <daniels> lifeless: again, that's largely a video BIOS thing
[03:08] <lifeless> I was hoping you wouldn't say that
[03:08] <daniels> now you see why we really want to find out how to program modes for i8xx/i9xx
[03:09] <lifeless> what do those programs do .. oh right, they fudge the bios executable code
[03:11] <daniels> sure
[03:11] <daniels> so you need to figure how to stash the brightness away over a suspend
[03:41] <wasabi> Hmm. Interesting network/interfaces question.
[03:42] <wasabi> I see the mapping hotplug thing, which apparently ups eth0 when it's actually plugged in.
[03:42] <wasabi> Can that up eth0 AND eth0:1?
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[04:07] <daniels> tseng: ping
[04:07] <daniels> pitt(or you)
[04:07] <daniels> erk
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[04:19] <lifeless> daniels: the bios hack - will I need to do that after hibernate ?
[04:22] <daniels> probably, yeah
[04:23] <daniels> see, this is why you get an X40 :P
[04:23] <bob2> what chipset does the x1 have?
[04:24] <daniels> i915, but with a crap bios
[04:25] <bob2> bet it has working xvideo, tho ;p
[04:25] <lifeless> daniels: yeah yeah, heard it before
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[04:50] <fabbione> morning
[04:50] <crimsun> morning
[04:51] <jsgotangco> morning
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[05:00] <Amaranth> bah, i'm trying to find a package that won't install due to dependencies and you guys have gone and fixed all the ones i knew
[05:39] <wasabi> Anybody able to answer this multiverse question? I have a package, Eclipse, which I'd like to get uploaded so that I can get people using it, and start cleaning it up. At this point it has one dependency which is not buildable from source with distributable tools (lucene, a Java component).
[05:39] <wasabi> Classpath folks are working hard on getting this fixed.
[05:39] <wasabi> Is this acceptable for multiverse?
[05:40] <daniels> is it a buld-time or run-time dependency?
[05:40] <wasabi> Both.
[05:40] <wasabi> Java makes no distinction.
[05:40] <jdub> wasabi: probably best to mail ubuntu-devel
[05:41] <daniels> wasabi: it needs to be able to be built from source in a clean environment
[05:41] <wasabi> For multiverse?
[05:41] <wasabi> Somebody has pointed out eagle in multiverse which is a single binary wrapped in a deb package at build time, I haven't looked at it yet though. ;)
[05:41] <wasabi> I shall mail -devel
[05:42] <crimsun> I mentioned eagle, because I tweaked it for Hoary
=== lamont sleeps.  was a long day
[06:00] <fabbione> hey lamont 
[06:00] <fabbione> before you go...
[06:01] <lamont> sim?>
[06:01] <fabbione> did you update anything in the kernel for hppa?
[06:01] <lamont> hrm... checking
[06:01] <lamont> (no I didn't, will look to see if I can, and will.)
[06:02] <fabbione> lamont: ok.. it's no rush
[06:02] <fabbione> i am not going to upload kernel today
[06:02] <lamont> cvs host appears to be down.  I'll poke it again in the morning
[06:02] <fabbione> so a build from pre2 + a config update would be nice
[06:02] <fabbione> meh pre1.2
[06:03] <fabbione> well the latest
[06:03] <lamont> right
[06:03] <fabbione> good night :)
[06:22] <jsgotangco> brb lunch
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[07:46] <JanderClander> hi there
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[07:49] <jsgotangco> JaneW, hi
[07:50] <Burgundavia> JaneW, any movement on edubuntu?
[07:51] <JaneW> hi jsgotangco and Burgundavia, yes there should be very shortly
[07:51] <Burgundavia> JaneW, cool
=== JaneW will brb - school run
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[08:12] <pitti> Morning
[08:13] <bob2> hey pitti 
[08:13] <fabbione> hey pitti
[08:13] <fabbione> pitti: are you subbed to kernel-team?
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[08:18] <pitti> fabbione: no, I don't
[08:21] <fabbione> pitti: mail forwarded.. already informed Herbert
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[09:19] <pitti> uh, ht on warty... :(
=== dilinger hopes he expressed his dislike for bugzilla sufficiently :)
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[09:40] <mjg59> lifeless: Hello?
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[09:49] <fabbione> probably hoary too
[09:49] <fabbione> pitti: the patch is the same
[09:50] <Amaranth> anyone know why gnome-panel stopped updating the menu recently?
[09:51] <Treenaks> Amaranth: have you tried killing/restarting it?
[09:51] <Amaranth> that's the only way to make it update
[09:51] <Treenaks> it's gnome 2.11, it SHOULD be broken :)
[09:52] <Amaranth> it's funny that the force quit applet doesn't make it close anymore
[09:52] <Amaranth> and that when you kill it normally it doesn't came back anymore
[09:52] <Amaranth> i'll bug upstream, i guess
[09:52] <Amaranth> i thought maybe it was X related
[09:52] <Amaranth> sucks working on a menu editor in these conditions :)
[09:53] <fabbione> infinity: do you want me to reassign 11122 to your or thom?
[09:53] <fabbione> that's all other than kernel related :)
[09:54] <hunger> Why are the kdebase/kdegraphics debs not available in the archives yet? People claim they were successfully build yesterday afternoon.
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[09:55] <Amaranth> kdebase_4:3.4.1-0ubuntu0pre3_20050526-1433-i386-successful.gz    26-May-2005 14:51
[09:55] <Amaranth> they should be there real soon
[09:55] <hunger> Amaranth: The rest is there since yesterday evening.
[09:56] <hunger> Amaranth: And those should depend on kdebase.
[09:58] <\sh> ok..included patch from http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=304407 nice...
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[10:37] <pitti> Hey seb128 
[10:38] <pitti> seb128: do you know whether evince could support gzipped and bzip2'ed files?
[10:38] <seb128> it does
[10:38] <seb128> .ps.gz which is a mimetype
[10:38] <pitti> evince /usr/share/doc/udev/udev-OLS2003.pdf.gz
[10:39] <seb128> the bugs about other stuff has been closed saying we should first define new mimetype if we need stuff like .pdf.gz
[10:39] <pitti> Unable to open document
[10:39] <seb128> yeah, that's not a correct mimetype
[10:39] <pitti> Unhandled MIME type: 'application/x-gzip'
[10:39] <seb128> right, gzip is not suited for evince
[10:39] <seb128> ps.gz is by example
[10:39] <seb128> I'm thinking about the issue
[10:40] <seb128> just fought for a good hour to get a xorg starting again
[10:40] <pitti> ok, thanks, but it's not really urgent
[10:40] <seb128> I had to upgrade after some partial upgrades which b0rked it
[10:40] <seb128> now my xkb is b0rked
[10:40] <seb128> way to start a day :/
[10:40] <pitti> seb128: my box was completely wrecked yesterday, I reinstalled hoary and upgraded to some breezy pacakges that I need :-(
=== seb128 kicks daniels
[10:41] <daniels> seb128: i'm not fixing it until you fix my panel :P
[10:41] <seb128> stop splitting xorg and fix the xkb dude, people can't work with that
[10:41] <daniels> seb128: i've said the workaround in here about a bajillion times
[10:41] <pitti> hey, xorg split is nice
[10:41] <daniels> and when I tried the workaround on both of my machines, it worked fine
[10:42] <daniels> don't really know what else I can do
[10:42] <pitti> seb128: <daniels> pitti: try putting symlinks to /usr/X11R6/bin/xkbcomp and /usr/X11R6/bin/setxkbmap in /usr/bin
[10:42] <seb128> daniels: it doesn't work
[10:42] <seb128> already did
[10:42] <seb128> doesn't work for dholbach neither
[10:42] <daniels> seb128: and /usr/lib/X11/xkb is a symlink to /etc/X11/xkb?
[10:42] <seb128> too
[10:42] <seb128> all you said yesterday
[10:42] <daniels> try also putting the symlinks to those apps in /usr/bin/X11
[10:42] <seb128> and some other stuff like xrdb than g-s-d wants
[10:42] <daniels> then send me the Xorg.0.log if it's really still broken after all that
[10:43] <seb128> k
[10:43] <daniels> gotta go make dinner now
[10:43] <jsgotangco> ahhh sounds good
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[10:50] <seb128> pitti:  http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=305081
[10:52] <pitti> seb128: ah, thanks
[10:52] <seb128> pitti: what do we want? .pdf.gz? any need for .bz2 formats?
[10:52] <seb128> .ps.gz are application/x-gzpostscript
[10:52] <pitti> seb128: why not the full range, the libraries should make that easy
[10:53] <pitti> ah, so a complementary mime type is missing for pdf
[10:55] <seb128> pitti: that's the issue, making evince opening 'application/x-gzip' is wrong
[10:55] <seb128> since it's not an archive handler
[10:55] <pitti> right
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[11:15] <seb128> grrr
[11:15] <seb128> no way to get that ***** xkb working
[11:15] <seb128> pitti: does that work for you?
[11:16] <daniels> if all else fails, try linking everything in /usr/X11R6/bin into /usr/bin/X11
[11:16] <pitti> seb128: I could't try since my box was trashed and I can't dist-upgrade now without removing the world
[11:16] <koke> !
[11:16] <koke> hi all!
[11:17] <seb128> daniels: way to go :p
[11:17] <daniels> sigh
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[11:20] <seb128> daniels: still the same with a "sudo cp /usr/X11R6/bin/* /usr/bin/X11"
[11:22] <daniels> ok
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=== Nafallo hi all!
[11:23] <mdke> i was just looking at http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/LaptopTesting . I have a laptop where some of the hotkeys do not show up under xev. Where should I be reporting this? in that section of the wiki? ubuntu bugzilla? xorg bugzilla?
[11:26] <Kamion> hunger: kdebase is in the NEW queue
[11:26] <hunger> Kamion: Thanks for the info!
[11:26] <Kamion> because kdebase-doc-html is new
[11:26] <jsgotangco> mdke, there's a table made by mjg59 in the wiki as well that should like with that wiki page
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[11:27] <mdke> jsgotangco, yes, but i was wondering whether my problem applies, given that the keys don't even show up with xev
[11:27] <jsgotangco> ahh
[11:30] <seb128> daniels: any other idea for the xkb?
[11:33] <siretart> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
[11:33] <siretart>   xlibmesa-glu-dev: Depends: xlibmesa-gl-dev but it is not going to be installed or libgl-dev
[11:33] <siretart> any ideas whats going wrong?
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=== pitti pats daniels
[11:34] <seb128> k
[11:34] <seb128> I'm going to break my box today I think
[11:35] <seb128> at least I'll try to fix that
[11:35] <seb128> if that doesn't work I'll use pitti's way, hoary with selected upgrades :)
[11:36] <pitti> seb128: my way involved a partition break, PAM breakage, xorg conf breakage - believe me, it wasn't a nice experience
[11:36] <Nafallo> breezy with selected downgrades works to ;-)
[11:36] <daniels> seb128: nope
[11:36] <pitti> seb128: (the partition break just was a PEBCAK while I worked in single user mode, forgot to unmount)
[11:36] <seb128> pitti: I guess so, byt the xkb b0rkage is enough to break my productivity
[11:36] <daniels> seb128: nothing I can do without your Xorg.0.log
[11:36] <daniels> siretart: libglu-dev-xorg
[11:36] <Riddell> Kamion: where can you find out the reason for a package being in the NEW queue?
[11:37] <seb128> daniels: my homedir on chinstrap has it
[11:37] <Kamion> Riddell: you should've got mail ...
[11:38] <Kamion> oh, no, the buildd will have it
[11:38] <siretart> daniels: ah, thanks. that'll do
[11:38] <Kamion> Riddell: you ask elmo or me ;-)
[11:38] <siretart> daniels: is there somewhere a summary about changes build dependencies from xfree to xorg? most of obvious, but this one rather not
[11:39] <daniels> siretart: http://people.ubuntu.com/~daniels/xlibs-static-dev.txt, plus that
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[11:40] <siretart> daniels: thanks!
[11:44] <seb128> daniels: so, anything from my Xorg.0.log? :)
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[12:06] <nanomad> hi all!
[12:06] <nanomad> anyone else has openoffice.org broken?
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[12:21] <daniels> gar
[12:21] <daniels> seb128: i'm not the vim maintainer
[12:21] <seb128> daniels: you did this upload
[12:21] <seb128> who break something fix it :)
[12:22] <daniels> heh
[12:22] <daniels> it only broke by being recompiled after the new X stuff
[12:22] <seb128> k, I reassign that to me 
[12:22] <seb128> you "just" fix my xkb issue :p
[12:22] <daniels> hah
[12:23] <seb128> have you looked on my log?
[12:23] <daniels> yeah, didn't see anything obvious
[12:23] <seb128> :(
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[12:24] <pitti> seb128: what exactly boke for you? the Control key?
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[12:25] <seb128> pitti: yep, like everybody else I guess
[12:25] <seb128> ctrl-C opens new windows by example :p
[12:26] <daniels> it hates your non-US keyboards
[12:26] <Burgundavia> anybody known that python scripts in X-chat are borked right now in Breezy? should I bother filing a bug about it?
[12:26] <seb128> that's known 
[12:26] <Burgundavia> ok, just checking
[12:26] <seb128> fill a bug if you want
[12:26] <Burgundavia> nah, if you know, why file?
[12:27] <Burgundavia> why waste your time seb128 , I already do that well enough
[12:27] <seb128> no reason right
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[12:42] <jsgotangco> bye bye happy weekend :)
[12:42] <tseng> bye
[12:42] <ogra> ciao jsgotangco 
[12:42] <Amaranth> it's 6am friday morning here :)
[12:42] <Amaranth> byte jsgotangco 
[12:42] <Amaranth> err
[12:42] <jsgotangco> heh
[12:42] <jsgotangco> ogra, hmmm..bugzilla..is it possible?
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[12:42] <ogra> jsgotangco, hmm ?
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[12:43] <jsgotangco> oh just filed something in bugzilla for hwdb-client just check it out when you're free
[12:43] <ogra> did you assign it to me ?
[12:43] <jsgotangco> yeah
[12:43] <ogra> great, thanks
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[12:56] <doko> elmo: please sync java-gcj-compat from experimental
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[01:32] <fabbione> elmo: you around?
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[01:39] <trulux> pitti: heya!
[01:39] <pitti> Hi trulux
[01:40] <trulux> pitti: what's up?
[01:40] <pitti> trulux: just finished today's security updates
[01:41] <trulux> pitti: great, so, we can do some cool work now, right? ;)
[01:41] <trulux> pitti: I had a look over the vsec stuff and it's scary that rc5 doesn't complain here. did you tested there?
[01:41] <pitti> trulux: did you find out the spinlock issue?
[01:42] <pitti> trulux: I already said, I tested against linux-headers-2.6.12-1
[01:42] <trulux> pitti: yup, that was merged sometime out-of.git.scope though (there's no bloob with the info about such a diff)
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[01:43] <trulux> pitti: I will do the same here right now. just a thing, did you fixed that spinlock issues and it compiled well again? (the rest is done, including ipv6 dead symbols stuff)
[01:43] <trulux> be sure to have your copy sync'ed with the cvs trunk
[01:44] <trulux> pitti: http://www.tuxedo-es.org/blog/archives/5-Some-2.6.12-rc5-API-changes-for-the-shake.html
[01:44] <trulux> pitti: http://lwn.net/Articles/100749/
[01:44] <trulux> pitti: http://pearls.tuxedo-es.org/patches/vsecurity/vsec-0.3-20050526-2.6.12-rc5-fixes.patch
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[01:49] <jbailey> Kamion: ping?
[01:49] <Kamion> jbailey: pong
[01:50] <jbailey> Kamion: Just read your code review strategies email, and thinking about the FormalTestPlans spec.
[01:50] <Kamion> I guess it's somewhat related
[01:51] <Kamion> in that they're both under a QA umbrella
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[01:51] <jbailey> Kamion: Right.  I'm wondering if it's worth asking scott for a flag on HCT that also includes a "review requested before upload" mode.
[01:52] <jbailey> Kamion: I like the idea of making code reviews possible, but I think it would be interesting to maybe be able to say "I'd be happier with a code review", and eventually (as we get a bigger community) requiring one for certain packages.
[01:52] <jbailey> (toolchain, kernel, boot stuff and the like)
[01:53] <jbailey> Or if a debdiff within the same version exceeds a certain size or whatnot.
[01:54] <jbailey> Double custodianship on all changes was a big push we were starting to move to in my last job (Financial industry) and it might be worth something to be able to have an auditable signed-off-by like the kernel has.  (future, obviously)
[01:54] <Kamion> jbailey: once we have the committer/maintainer distinction, that sort of thing will be useful, yeah
[01:55] <Kamion> although for smaller/less-important packages, it would be too heavyweight
[01:55] <Kamion> so as you say, a flag
[01:55] <pitti> trulux: I got a tarball from your cvs tree
[01:55] <jbailey> Right.  For smaller packages I can see it eventually, but there would have to be a decent reviewer committee who enjoyed doing that sort of work where you could generally expect a change reviewed very very quickly. =)
=== Kamion nods
[01:56] <ajmitch> hello pitti, trulux 
[01:57] <trulux> hey ajmitch 
[01:57] <Kamion> jbailey: feel like posting that to the list? a lot of us seem to have been kicking around thoughts about this sort of thing; I was talking about it in my review call with mdz last night, and he asked me to post in order that we could archive the discussion and maybe actually implement it :-)
[01:57] <trulux> aj: how're you doing today?
=== trulux may start doing hapkido soon
[01:57] <ajmitch> trulux: been ill in bed for most of the day, haven't done any ubuntu work ;)
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[01:57] <trulux> ajmitch: oh, I hope you to get better. I was also a bit sick yesterday
[01:57] <jbailey> Kamion: Will do - I wanted to make sure I didn't drag it away from the ideas you had if they didn't match.
[01:58] <aj> trulux: i'm fine, thanks ;)
[01:58] <ajmitch> heh
[01:58] <trulux> ajmitch: a great shitload of work and caffeine this week, I had a royal headache and some other diseases
[01:59] <trulux> aj: well, ajmitch/aj/aj* finally :)
[01:59] <ajmitch> trulux: I added a few notes to wiki.ubuntulinux.org/SELinux
[01:59] <Kamion> jbailey: it's more future-ish than the sorts of things I was thinking about (in that it requires HCT), but it'll be useful in the longer run ...
[01:59] <ajmitch> about other things that may need done
[02:00] <jbailey> Kamion: Yup, and I would love to scribble notes into the FormalTestPlans spec eventually to show any sort of review process.
[02:00] <jbailey> Kamion: With moz and the kernel already doing code review, I can see the whole Free Software movement actually starting to adopt Software Engineering best practices.  It's kindof amazing.
[02:01] <trulux> ajmitch: yup I added a diagram
[02:01] <trulux> ajmitch: http://pearls.tuxedo-es.org/selinux/diagrams/selinux-binary-policies-1.png
[02:01] <trulux> ajmitch: that's the way I thought we should go
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[02:04] <ajmitch> trulux: I think the relabelling may be needed at boot time in some cases
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[02:08] <Amaranth> anyone have all their menus and entries disappear lately?
[02:08] <eruin_> nope
=== Amaranth beats things
[02:09] <trulux> ajmitch: yes, me too. I can work a few things out today, though I would like to have done the UI stuff
[02:09] <trulux> ajmitch: (now that we have the packages ready except the policies)
=== ajmitch has started working on UI parts
[02:13] <trulux> ajmitch: how much do you have done? (I could help)
[02:13] <trulux> ajmitch: though I'm stuck with the applet
[02:13] <trulux> brb, phone
[02:14] <ajmitch> trulux: I really don't think an applet is necessary - why would you need to have selinux config sitting on the panel?
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[02:15] <mpt> ajmitch, trulux: #ubuntu-hardened :-)
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[02:16] <trulux> ajmitch: it's a nice thing to be able to keep it simple, and an applet does the job pretty well, among that it won't take longer than 20min to finish the UI part (I have done the rest, and I can implement any function from libselinux if needed)
[02:16] <trulux> mpt: ok :)
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[02:32] <pitti> trulux: I don't really have time ATM, could you please try to make it work with the current linux-headers-2.6.12-1?
[02:32] <trulux> pitti: I will do, don't worry
[02:32] <trulux> pitti: just doing a few things for mpt 
[02:32] <trulux> :)
[02:38] <Kamion> doko: should 1.0.28-2build1 have been -2ubuntu1? it seems to have source changes
[02:39] <doko> Kamion: no, it should be synced from experimental again. same source, but the OOo2 build fails without it.
[02:39] <Kamion> (I meant to say java-gcj-compat there, sorry)
[02:39] <Kamion> ok
[02:40] <seb128> grrrrrrrr
[02:41] <seb128> I just closed a 10min running evolution build while trying to opening a new tab
=== seb128 kicks daniels 
=== Treenaks hands seb128 some spiked boots
[02:42] <ogra> seb128, do you inderstand now why i dont like tabs ;)
[02:43] <seb128> sure cahos all the time is better ...
=== ogra thinks its time for revenge for everybody who made fun of him about not using tabs :P
[02:43] <ogra> (in udu that is)
[02:44] <Mithrandir> tabs?  what's that?
[02:44] <Mithrandir> :-)
[02:44] <ogra> seb128, but alt-tab works here :)
[02:45] <Mithrandir> seb128: use screen.
[02:45] <seb128> that's an option
[02:45] <seb128> but that should not prevent daniels to fix xkb stuff :)
[02:54] <Burgundavia> seb128, I had a crazy idea. Can we ship ross' notification icon by default?
[02:54] <seb128> I've no objection
[02:55] <Burgundavia> does it require another package? I cannot remember
[02:56] <seb128> I don't think so
[02:56] <seb128> rock
[02:56] <seb128> https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=10942
[02:56] <seb128> somebody has found the xkb issue and has a patch :)
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[03:00] <tepsipakki> hmm, .hidden files seem to work only on user home, this is a regression
[03:00] <Mithrandir> seb128: yay!
[03:00] <Mithrandir> seb128: now we just need to poke daniels into fixing it.
[03:01] <seb128> yep
[03:02] <seb128> tepsipakki: with nautilus? works fine here
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[03:03] <tepsipakki> seb128: yes, with nautilus.. not here ;)
[03:04] <tepsipakki> duh, pkill nautilus solved it
[03:05] <Burgundavia> seb128, how agressive are the gnome people about closing old bugs?
[03:06] <seb128> depending
[03:06] <seb128> a 1-2 months NEEDINFO bug is closed usually
[03:06] <Burgundavia> ok
[03:06] <tepsipakki> burgundavia: not very, just had a look at the list for rhythmbox ;)
[03:06] <Burgundavia> that was my thought
[03:06] <Burgundavia> as I wander through bugzilla
[03:06] <Burgundavia> I see a lot of very old crasher bugs
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[03:10] <seb128> Burgundavia: upstream?
[03:11] <seb128> Burgundavia: bug that could be useful are kept
[03:11] <seb128> usually NEEDINFO are closed
[03:11] <Burgundavia> ok
[03:11] <seb128> when they have doubt on a crash they put a comment to know if that happens with the current version
[03:11] <seb128> and if the guy doesn't reply they closed
[03:11] <seb128> oh, a note
[03:11] <seb128> you should put a comment when you close duplicates
[03:12] <Burgundavia> on the dup?
[03:12] <seb128> http://developer.gnome.org/projects/bugsquad/triage/stock-responses.html
[03:12] <seb128> use that
[03:13] <Burgundavia> ah, cheers, thanks
[03:13] <seb128> np
[03:13] <seb128> I've planned to do a such page or something for ubuntu
[03:14] <Burgundavia> want me to put that on the wiki?
[03:14] <seb128> that's much easier for triage
[03:14] <seb128> yes please
[03:14] <Burgundavia> shall do so now
[03:14] <seb128> need to figure a standard reply for UPSTREAM too
[03:14] <Burgundavia> ok
[03:14] <Burgundavia> BugResponses ?
[03:15] <ogra> sounds good
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[03:17] <seb128> yep
[03:21] <Burgundavia> https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/BugResponses
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[03:25] <Burgundavia> any thoughts on this? http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=36945
[03:27] <seb128> we turn this feature
[03:27] <Burgundavia> off?
[03:27] <seb128> because that's weird to get the whole screen fading just to enter a password
[03:28] <Burgundavia> ok, figured, I just didn't know the answer
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=== ogra sees ltsp hitting -changes....
[03:34] <ogra> mdz, ping 
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[03:56] <Burgundavia> seb128, having fun with evo bugs?'
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[03:57] <seb128> Burgundavia: that's quite borring, but I do a bug review during the sync/update to 2.11 versions for every package
[03:57] <seb128> ~90 bugs for it
[04:00] <Burgundavia> ugh
[04:00] <Burgundavia> can I help?
[04:00] <seb128> not really, I'm almost done with them now
[04:00] <seb128> thanks
[04:01] <Burgundavia> ok
[04:01] <Burgundavia> if you need hlep with clearing out bugs, I usually have free time to give a hand
[04:02] <seb128> there is a lot of NEW/UNCONFIRMED bugs, feel free to reply on them or forward upstream :)
[04:02] <Burgundavia> ok
[04:03] <seb128> thanks
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[04:05] <carsten> Hi. My update of binutils (on 5.04) makes compiling impossible. Is this a know issue with the new package?
[04:06] <carsten> This breakages was confirmed to me in IRC
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[04:06] <pitti> carsten: I know and I prepared an update
[04:06] <pitti> carsten: sorry, I screwed binutils
[04:06] <carsten> ah, ok :-)
[04:07] <Tsingi> I hope this is OT, I'm having a problem linking on a new install...
[04:07] <pitti> carsten: http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/binutils_2.15-5ubuntu2.2_i386.deb
[04:07] <pitti> Tsingi: ^
[04:07] <Tsingi>   /usr/lib/gcc-lib/i486-linux/3.3.5/../../../crt1.o: file not recognized: File format not recognized
[04:07] <pitti> yes, that's the same
[04:07] <pitti> Tsingi: <pitti> carsten: I know and I prepared an update
[04:08] <carsten> pitti: ETA on the server?
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[04:08] <Tsingi> ahh, you know what it is?? fantatsic!
[04:08] <pitti> carsten: < 1 hour, but let me test everything first
[04:08] <carsten> k
[04:08] <pitti> carsten: I tested my local debs
[04:08] <Tsingi> I should wait?
[04:08] <pitti> carsten: but I want to test the buildd output 
[04:08] <pitti> Tsingi: yes, grab http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/binutils_2.15-5ubuntu2.2_i386.deb or just wait a bit
[04:08] <pitti> Tsingi: (^ that's for hoary)
[04:08] <Tsingi> ok, I can wait, or test for you if you like
[04:09] <Tsingi> I installed 5.04 yesterday
[04:09] <pitti> Tsingi: that regression comes from this morning's security update
[04:09] <pitti> it's so secure, it refuses to build any code that has at least one hole
[04:09] <pitti> seriously, sorry guys
[04:09] <Tsingi> lol!
[04:10] <Tsingi> well, I discovered it compiling nethack.  Then checked some of my projects (nethack is of course more important:)
[04:10] <carsten> pitti: it doesn't even compile hello world here :-)
[04:10] <Kamion> Tsingi: amen
[04:10] <carsten> pitti: I dpkg'ed you deb and will test. Will let you know if everything links+runs here
[04:11] <Tsingi> Kamion: 2 ascensions, 15 years:)
[04:11] <Kamion> heh
[04:11] <siretart> pitti: I tried 5ubuntu2.2, it 'works for me'
[04:11] <pitti> siretart: yes, test suite is identical
[04:11] <pitti> thanks for testing
[04:13] <Tsingi> pitti: I forget how to do this manually, apt-get -i?
[04:13] <carsten> pitti: survey/.libs/libsurvey.a: could not read symbols: Archive has no index; run ranlib to add one
[04:13] <pitti> Tsingi: sudo dpkg -i foo.deb
[04:13] <Tsingi> k
[04:13] <carsten> but that might be another reason. /me cheack
[04:13] <pitti> carsten: does that work with http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main/b/binutils/binutils_2.15-5ubuntu2_i386.deb ?
[04:14] <carsten> pitti: another lib links
[04:14] <carsten> ...
[04:14] <carsten> pitti: I will test something else. If that also won't work I will test that ^^^^deb
[04:14] <Tsingi> pitti: looking good
[04:14] <elmo> pitti: grr, dude WTH are you doing?
[04:15] <pitti> elmo: sorry, fixing ...
[04:15] <pitti> elmo: upstream's patches seem to be broken...
[04:15] <elmo> uh, which one?
[04:15] <pitti> elmo: I tested some binutils programs, but didn't look at the test suiete
[04:15] <elmo> the one I applied in Debian?
[04:16] <pitti> elmo: no, that one is fine
[04:16] <carsten> pitti: what was the problem with the old binutils? Was it worth the fuzz? ;-)
[04:17] <Tsingi> pitti: another error, heh, but I think i forgot to install curses, so you're clear:)
[04:18] <pitti> elmo: http://sources.redhat.com/ml/binutils/2005-05/msg00429.html or http://sources.redhat.com/ml/binutils/2005-05/msg00699.html
[04:18] <pitti> elmo: I applied yours and these two since they were supposed to fix additional NULL pointers, etc
[04:19] <pitti> elmo: now I reverted those and just used the one you applied, too
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[04:19] <elmo> pitti: I'd bet on the former, rather than the latter
[04:19] <elmo> FWIW
[04:20] <carsten> pitti: works (compiles+links+runs+doesn't crash)
[04:20] <pitti> carsten: thanks for checking
[04:20] <carsten> de rien
[04:21] <pitti> carsten: the problem: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/support/documentation/usn/usn-136-1
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[04:37] <pitti> carsten, Tsingi: new debs are in the archive
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[04:43] <Nafallo> hmm, wasn't screem synced yesterday?
[04:44] <seb128> no
[04:45] <seb128> 0.14 doesn't build with gnome-menus 2.11
[04:45] <Nafallo> ahh :-/.
[04:46] <mooch> if x.org fscked in breezy?
[04:46] <Nafallo> last package before I can switch to new dbus ;-)
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[04:48] <mooch> right now i get that it cannot find the "fixed" font
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[04:51] <ogra> doko, i know we already talked about it, but i forgot and now have a user request, will we have wxWindows/wxPython 2.5 in breezy ? pythoncard and boa-constructor seem to need it and boa is needed by Edubuntu
[04:52] <pitti> brb
[04:52] <doko> ogra: we will have 2.6, currently talking with upstrem/debian
[04:52] <ogra> great, thanks :)
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[04:55] <Burgundavia> yay, non-ugly wxwidgets!!!
[04:56] <ogra> but probably a lot broken apps that arent ported in time...
[04:57] <Burgundavia> is 2.5/6 parallel installable?
[04:57] <Burgundavia> s/is/are
[04:57] <ogra> you mean 2.4/2.6
[04:59] <Burgundavia> ya
[04:59] <jbailey> In generally different versions of kernels are parallel installable, but Ubuntu doesn't support pre-2.6
[04:59] <martink> mooch, some X fonts have moved from /usr/lib/... to /usr/share/.... Update your xorg.conf
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[05:00] <ogra> jbailey, we talk about wxWindows, wxPython :)
[05:00] <jbailey> Whups, /me crawls back into his hole.
[05:01] <jbailey> mooch: Data!
[05:01] <zul> tut tut jbailey :)
[05:02] <jnc> gahhhhh
=== jnc grumbles something about "openoffice.org broke again!?!!?! on amd64. grr"
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[05:04] <mooch> jbailey: Jeff!
[05:05] <cartman> the evil X.org bug has a patch now! see http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=10942
[05:06] <jnc> Mithrandir: they broke OOo on amd64 again :(
[05:07] <mooch> ups! no ubuntu-calendar-april/may ?
[05:07] <Burgundavia> mooch, april exists on hoary, but not breezy
[05:10] <jnc> oooh
[05:10] <jnc> cartman: very good
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[05:11] <chris__> Hi
[05:11] <jnc> cartman: i keep hitting "ctrl-x" thinking i'm going to cut text and instead in Evolution it sends the email message
[05:11] <jnc> i'm absolutely traumatized by that bug
[05:11] <trygvebw> hello chris__
[05:11] <cartman> jnc: me too
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[05:13] <jasmuz> Hello all
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[05:14] <jnc> cartman: then i try to say something cool and collected about "hey, ignore that previous message i'm havving softwa"   
[05:14] <jnc> after which i hit ctrl+x  ...
[05:14] <chris__> I found an nasty bug in Gnome 2.10 :\
[05:14] <cartman> jnc: hope daniels looks at it
[05:14] <trygvebw> chris__, oh?
[05:14] <jnc> then i send a third message "i'll give you a call.  sorry about the problems"
[05:15] <chris__> trygvebw, The "Sticky Note" Applet (i dont know how its named in Englisch) is fucked up! In Warty and the "old" Gnome, the Notes were pinned to the Desktop
[05:15] <chris__> in Hoary and the newest Gnome, the Notes are everytime in front of all Windows
[05:15] <chris__> and this sucks!
[05:16] <jasmuz> People i have this problem, can anybody help ? http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=36596
[05:16] <Treenaks> #ubuntu for user support please
[05:16] <trygvebw> Treenaks, nobody knew his answer there...
[05:16] <trygvebw> *the
[05:16] <chris__> i think its a bug... or not?
[05:16] <trygvebw> chris__, it's a feature, afaik :)
[05:17] <jasmuz> Treenaks, i was sent from there to here
[05:17] <chris__> trygvebw, but i hate this feature ;p i want to de-activate it ...
[05:17] <trygvebw> chris__, check in sticky settings
[05:18] <chris__> i cant set up things like this...
[05:18] <jnc> chris__: you can check on the gnome website and see screenshots of the sticky app
[05:18] <jasmuz> Anyways thanks for the help
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[05:19] <jnc> chris__: ask around in #ubuntu if other people have the same condition
[05:19] <chris__> okay
[05:19] <chris__> :)
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[05:21] <chris__> jnc, hmm i am Moderator of an German Ubuntu-Forum :D
[05:21] <chris__> There is an big thread about this.. and 10 or more People have the same Problem
[05:21] <ogra> chris__, bugnumber ?
[05:21] <chris__> i don't know if its postet already...
[05:22] <chris__> i dont know how the "name" is of the Applet (i am German :\)
[05:22] <jnc> chris__: if it's not posted already,  file a bug report include screenshots and config files
[05:22] <ogra> so how should we fix it ? nobody here reads forums
[05:22] <chris__> here its named "Klebezettel" :D
[05:22] <jnc> if you got a bug # then we can always rename it in the future
[05:22] <chris__> :)
[05:22] <chris__> where i shoud post it?
[05:23] <ogra> jnc, i see nothing wrong with the name :)
[05:23] <ogra> chris__, bugzilla.ubuntu.com and please advise your readers to post bugs to make them visible for us ;)
[05:23] <chris__> okay :)
=== ogra curses xscreensaver
[05:25] <ogra> chris__, whats wrong with "klebezettel" do you have a better suggestion ? (i think you cant call it post-it's because the name is trademarked) 
[05:25] <chris__> i dont unterstand..?
[05:26] <ogra> i thought you were complaiuning about the translation too :)
[05:26] <chris__> O_o
[05:26] <chris__> i found this on the Gnome-Website:
[05:26] <chris__> "And sticky notes now stay on top other windows, so you can't lose them. To hide the notes, simply use the applet's right-click menu."
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[05:27] <ogra> chris__, then its obviously a feature :) file a bug at bugzilla.gnome.org
[05:27] <chris__> okay... :)
[05:27] <chris__> thank you :p
[05:27] <ogra> since its their decision
[05:28] <ogra> youre welcome
[05:28] <seb128> don't fill it
[05:28] <ogra> seb128, why ?
[05:28] <seb128> there is already a bug and some dups
[05:28] <seb128> upstreams don't need dups
[05:28] <ogra> oh, ok...
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[05:29] <ogra> seb128, btw, shouldnt we drop this applet, since we'll ship tomboy ?
[05:29] <seb128> the applets work :p
[05:30] <ogra> tomboy too :P
[05:30] <chris__> :P
[05:30] <ogra> seb128, its just redunant...
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[05:30] <seb128> anyway I don't think we should drop gnome-applets parts
[05:30] <Burgundavia> seb128, but any bug triager loves dups. They validate their existence!
[05:30] <seb128> just way to piss upstreams
[05:30] <ogra> oki
[05:31] <seb128> and for my part I use sticky not rather than tomboy
[05:31] <seb128> I should try tomboy again
[05:31] <ogra> yeah
[05:31] <ogra> its quite good since it left the notification area
[05:31] <ogra> and has a new icon ;)
[05:32] <seb128> can you change the fonts now?
[05:32] <ogra> yep, in the settings
[05:32] <ogra> ARGH !
=== ogra kicks and beats xscreensaver
[05:32] <ogra> darn thing
=== Treenaks puts ogra and jwz in one room together
[05:33] <chris__> Tomboy is god? ;P
[05:33] <ogra> Treenaks, nah, its not jwz's fault....
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[05:34] <ogra> Treenaks, either some build system changes that it cant cope with or the xorg change....
[05:34] <Treenaks> ogra: oh..
=== Treenaks puts ogra and daniels together in one room
[05:34] <ogra> (i'm trying to compile the hoary version currently.... so our "colonial master" can make the next colony)
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=== Unfrgive1 is now known as Unfrgiven
[05:36] <Unfrgiven> elmo: ping
[05:38] <elmo> Unfrgiven: ?
[05:39] <Unfrgiven> elmo: can we pull the package freemind from unstable to universe?
[05:40] <doko> elmo: could we move OOo2 back to universe for a while, so that's buildable again?
[05:40] <Kamion> ogra: haha
[05:41] <ogra> :)
[05:41] <Kamion> doko: er ... desktop kinda depends on it
[05:41] <elmo> doko: what's the state of bringin in NEW packages - safe to do yet?
[05:41] <Kamion> d'oh, I broke debconf passthrough progress
=== Kamion fixes
[05:42] <Tsingi> what would a pair of snow boots for 8 zorkmids be?
[05:42] <Tsingi> heh, hey Kamion
[05:42] <Kamion> ECHAN :)
[05:42] <Echylo> 8 zorkmids?
[05:42] <Tsingi> oops, mis-chan:)
[05:42] <Tsingi> sorry
[05:42] <Kamion> but elven/kicking
[05:42] <Treenaks> Tsingi: fumbling
[05:42] <Echylo> sandals?
[05:42] <Tsingi> not cursed
[05:42] <Kamion> Treenaks: too cheap
[05:43] <Treenaks> Kamion: they're /always/ fumbling for me :)
[05:43] <Tsingi> ok, prolly, sorry for the OT:)
[05:44] <jeroen_> Will there be a ubuntu-calendar-may package? (Yes, this should be in #ubuntu, but they don't know the answer, and you are the people making packages)
[05:45] <elmo> Unfrgiven: atm NEW packages are frozen
[05:45] <Kamion> jeroen_: jdub normally does those
[05:45] <elmo> Unfrgiven: but once that's released new packages from Debian main/contrib will be auto-pulled in
[05:45] <Kamion> don't think anyone else will know. :-)
[05:46] <jeroen_> Kamion, well, I was just wondering.. I mean, it's the 27th.. not much of May left, huh?
=== mdz [~mdz@ca-studio-bsr1o-251.vnnyca.adelphia.net]  has joined #ubuntu-devel
[05:46] <Unfrgiven> elmo: hmmm so are you saying ALL main/contrib packages or just the ones we've already selected?
[05:46] <elmo> all of them, except the ones we explictly blacklist
[05:46] <Treenaks> jeroen_: jdub is in some weird Australian timezone.. ask him when he's awake :)
[05:47] <mdz> ogra: pong
[05:47] <ogra> Unfrgiven, i.e. the ones we already changed
[05:47] <Unfrgiven> elmo: ok. do we have a page listing the blacklist?
[05:47] <jeroen_> Australia is +7, right? Then he'll be asleep
[05:47] <ogra> mdz, we should talk about edubuntu once you have time :) i saw you already dd ltsp packages
[05:47] <ogra> did even
[05:47] <Unfrgiven> its 1:45am here in Sydney right now
[05:47] <mdz> ogra: the current ltsp packages are a non-working prototype, but I have made some progress
[05:48] <ogra> mdz, bsed on the src.rpms they provide ?
[05:48] <ogra> based...
[05:48] <ogra> or totally new ones ?
[05:48] <pitti> seb128: btw, my xorg control key breakage is back, so I can try to fix it with daniel's method...
[05:48] <mdz> ogra: src.rpms?
[05:48] <pitti> Hey mdz
[05:48] <mdz> ogra: this is something new
[05:48] <ogra> mdz, ltsp.org has source rpm packages
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[05:49] <mdz> ogra: ThinClientIntegration should explain
[05:49] <mdz> pitti: morning
[05:49] <ogra> mdz, i would also like to get rid of NIS .... and introduce LDAP/kerberos...
[05:49] <fabbione> morning mdz
=== ogra reads up
[05:49] <mdz> ogra: in what context?
[05:50] <mdz> usually LTSP does not use any distributed authentication
[05:50] <Unfrgiven> alright all im going to head off, good night
[05:50] <ogra> mdz, edubuntu uses NIS 
[05:50] <mdz> ogra: it does, why?
[05:50] <ogra> mdz, at least in the spec
[05:50] <seb128> pitti: https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=10942 has a comment about what causes the bug and a patch
[05:50] <ogra> mdz, no idea, i'll ask james/colin
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[05:52] <Burgundavia> ogra, Netscape DS is should be released this month as GPL. Shall we annoy RH and have it in Ubuntu before they ship it in RH?
[05:52] <Treenaks> ROFL
[05:53] <ogra> Burgundavia, package it ;) its a great project for a upcoming MOTU
[05:54] <Burgundavia> ogra, I can barely do games right now. I am not touching a server app
=== ogra remembers thats the same sentence that led to hula packages .... 
[05:54] <Burgundavia> but I am also waiting for tseng and his happy IntroDeveloperDocs
[05:58] <torkel> ogra: are you using afs in edubuntu? or do you have any plans doing so?
[05:59] <ogra> torkel, we have several option here... the latest nfs would be my choice, since we have it already ... tanks to jbailey
[05:59] <Mithrandir> jnc: I guess I'll have to fix that, then.
[06:00] <ogra> options even
[06:01] <torkel> ogra: you mentioned ldap/kerberos and in that context afs is a good choice
[06:02] <ogra> torkel, i'm just determining the options and the best choices we have without generating extra work...i'll look deeper into afs
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[06:07] <dholbach> hey
[06:07] <dholbach> seb128: did you try the xorg patch already?
[06:08] <ogra> dholbach, the one that reverts to a working version ? :)
[06:08] <seb128> dholbach: no
[06:09] <dholbach> hmm... either I was too dumb to apply the patch correctly or it breaks X even more :(
[06:09] <seb128> :(
[06:10] <dholbach> i wasnt able to type a single thing at gdm - everytime a silly popup appeared for ever keystroke
[06:12] <dholbach> ok... i'll give it another try
[06:12] <dholbach> *wave*
[06:15] <Micksa> okay, someone explain the need for ssh's HashKnownHosts to me
[06:17] <Kamion> Micksa: slows down attackers who've got into your system from immediately getting into the other systems you ssh into regularly
[06:17] <KaiL|Sheep> Micksa: to find modified systems
[06:17] <Kamion> (yes, it's just one vector of attack, and there are others such)
[06:17] <Micksa> well then they should hash bash_history too
[06:17] <Kamion> "they"
[06:18] <Micksa> theo :)
[06:18] <Kamion> theo != bash maintainer
[06:18] <Kamion> anyway I believe there's a patch somewhere to implement configurable exclusion from .bash_history
[06:18] <Micksa> I'm trying to be funny
[06:18] <Micksa> work with me here
[06:18] <Kamion> ah, no, don't need a patch
[06:18] <Kamion> set $HISTIGNORE
[06:18] <fabbione> elmo: can you please start syncing partman-auto-lvm from debian? i saw it in the debian archive, but never automagically imported...
[06:19] <Micksa> the thing that worries me about HashKnownHosts is
[06:19] <Micksa> what if a key becomes bad?
[06:19] <Kamion> so if you're paranoid, HISTIGNORE=ssh
[06:19] <Micksa> for valid reasons
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[06:19] <Kamion> Micksa: see the changelog, which I wrote carefully :-)
[06:19] <Kamion> ssh-keygen has new options for managing known_hosts
[06:19] <Kamion>       files, which understand hashing.
[06:19] <elmo> doko: ping about NEW
[06:20] <Micksa> oh, this is your doing? :)
[06:20] <doko> elmo: pong
[06:20] <Kamion> I made that release of the openssh package, yes; I'm not upstream
[06:20] <Kamion> and I decided it was worth trying out HashKnownHosts as default
[06:20] <Micksa> okay
[06:21] <elmo> doko: what's the state of bringin in NEW packages - safe to do yet?
[06:21] <Kamion> I don't think it merits a security update or anything, but it does seem to be a worthwhile tightening-up
[06:21] <Kamion> we'll see how it goes
[06:22] <Micksa> meh, I'm too tired
[06:22] <Kamion> rather unfortunately the -R option is missing from ssh-keygen --help, but it's in the man page
[06:22] <doko> elmo: the only thing we can do it to review for build-deps on C++ libraries.
[06:22] <doko> s/it/is/
[06:22] <Micksa> why does my hoary box want to download 343M of packages? I thought it was "released"
[06:22] <Micksa> pardon my ignorance
[06:23] <elmo> doko: how do you mean?
[06:23] <daniels> Micksa: 'updates'
[06:23] <daniels> Micksa: security and otherwise
[06:23] <Kamion> security updates - or you accidentally switched to breezy :-)
[06:23] <Micksa> oh never mind. I last updated this box ages ago :)
=== Micksa shuts up
[06:24] <trulux> argh, mpt: I'm wiki'ng the sec. center stuff
[06:24] <doko> elmo: I think you can only decide it on a case by case basis. If the new package build-deps on a not-yet-converted cxxlibs package, then it has to stay out. how many are in NEW at the moment?
[06:24] <trulux> anyone here is able to see encrypted wmv streams in mplayer?
[06:25] <cartman> only those with jedi eyes
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[06:26] <trulux> cartman: hah, I'm still getting annoyed with it
[06:26] <trulux> weird that I need to process this scholl shit wmv things
[06:26] <trulux> s/scholl/school/
[06:26] <Micksa> does apt-proxy still suck?
[06:26] <cartman> trulux: well 1) #ubuntu for help 2) Search google for "wmv drm broken japanese"
[06:27] <cartman> some japanese guy broke the drm but you need windows
[06:27] <cartman> to de-drm
[06:27] <elmo> doko: if a library's not yet converted, what's the harm in bringing in another app compiled against it?
[06:27] <Micksa> I feel inclined to look for someone that's set up squid to act as a comparable archive cache
[06:27] <doko> elmo: mixing new and old C++ ABI
[06:27] <trulux> cartman: wine would work right? I have NFC on Windows apps. to do the job
[06:27] <trulux> cartman: and I have no bitching windows here
[06:27] <elmo> doko: OK, but it's a temporary thing which will be fixed, because we'll know we need to recompile it by the dep on the unconverted library
[06:28] <cartman> trulux: well you need to run wmp9 afaik
[06:28] <elmo> (well, or we would, if we'd used a non-completely-fucking-insane naming scheme)
[06:28] <trulux> cartman: OK, thanks
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[06:28] <elmo> doko: basically, does it make the transition any harder?  if the answer's no, I want to do it.  I don't care if the built binary might be broken, it's a NEW package anyway, as long as we'll fix it eventually
[06:29] <doko> elmo: ok, there could be some apps linking static libs, which we would miss, but anyway
[06:29] <Kamion> (ah, sorry, HISTIGNORE='ssh*')
[06:29] <trulux> cartman: http://home.wanadoo.nl/lc.staak/freeme.htm <- hope to not need to port this to our beautiful, holy and legal lands
[06:30] <trulux> cartman: 'cos of points 1 and 2 of my work terms: 1) porn in wmv format 2) other stuf fin wmv format
[06:30] <doko> elmo: ok, besides this corner case, the answer is no
[06:30] <elmo> doko: static linking?  we're screwed there, regardless of NEWness, aren't we?
[06:31] <elmo> iff the package only ever static links to C++ libs
[06:31] <cartman> ha :)
[06:31] <trulux> seems that I will to port this shit
[06:31] <doko> elmo: true, but we will detect it, iff the library is provided as .a _and_ .so
[06:31] <trulux> woaha shiiit man! WTF
=== trulux relax set to ON
[06:33] <elmo> doko: ok
[06:33] <doko> elmo: so how likely is that case?
[06:33] <elmo> doko: err, I don't know.  I think not very, and I don't think there's anything we can realisitically do about it
[06:33] <doko> elmo: ok, then open the gates :-)
[06:33] <elmo> as long as we don't change the -dev name, in any event
[06:34] <doko> it would be nice to have a build-dep to detect C++ code ...
[06:36] <elmo> which we can't do without changing build-essential, and we really want to do that in conjunction with Debian
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[06:36] <dholbach> :(
[06:37] <ogra> dholbach, just buy another keyboard that works...
[06:38] <dholbach> ogra: you know, it's quite hard for me to stick to the CoC atm :)
[06:38] <dholbach> hrm
[06:38] <ogra> i can imagine that.... daniels is probing us all hard
[06:40] <Kamion> elmo: reping, libdebian-installer sync request
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[06:45] <elmo> Kamion: done
[06:45] <elmo> fabbione: done
[06:46] <fabbione> elmo: thanks
[06:47] <g14> http://lwn.net/Articles/135685/ Has the kernel ELF vunlerability mentioned here been updated? I don't see any kernel updates
[06:48] <siretart> elmo: please sync pinfo from unstable, overriding ubuntu changes (they are included)
[06:48] <Burgundavia> g14, http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/ubuntu-cve/fixed.html CVE's in Ubuntu
[06:49] <Kamion> ta
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[06:52] <g14> Burgundavia: Thanks, it's been fixed. I wasn't sure
[06:52] <Burgundavia> g14, np
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[07:35] <zul> meh...excelent...linux-image-2.6.12-1-686-dbg
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=== ogra hugs seb128 for fixing his favorite editor
[08:02] <seb128> np :p
[08:02] <ogra> but libxt will get dropped from main iirc...
[08:06] <Kamion> ogra: er?
[08:06] <Kamion> that seems a bit unlikely seeing as how half the world depends on it
[08:06] <ogra> Kamion, dainels disabled it explicitly...
[08:07] <ogra> err....sorry i mddled it with lesstif
[08:07] <ogra> muddled even
[08:07] <Kamion> very muddled :)
[08:07] <ogra> its simply to hot for my brain to work right today 
=== mdke nods
[08:08] <Kamion> I know the feeling
[08:08] <mdke> i'll second that
=== ogra gets some iced orange juice
[08:10] <mdke> how can it be 29 degrees in england in may
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[08:10] <mdke> the world is going crazy
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[08:12] <ogra> yeah
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[08:18] <\sh> mdke: here it was max. 35 degree
[08:18] <\sh> i was melting
[08:19] <ogra> here too
[08:19] <Simira> lovely
=== Simira looks out at the rain
[08:20] <Simira> some sun would be nice now
[08:20] <Kamion> night all
[08:20] <Simira> night Kamion 
[08:20] <Kamion> have a good weekend
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[08:24] <\sh> Simira: come to germany :)
[08:24] <\sh> night Kamion 
[08:25] <ogra> Kamion, xscreensaver built btw.... ppc not done yet...
[08:26] <ogra> oh, correction, just done
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[09:05] <stockholm> hi!
[09:05] <stockholm> any edubuntu people arround?
[09:05] <tseng|work> see ogra.
[09:05] <stockholm> http://wiki.debian.net/?DebianEduAtDebconf5
[09:06] <stockholm> tseng|work: was that for me?
[09:06] <tseng|work> es
[09:06] <tseng|work> *yes, you are the only person here
[09:06] <stockholm> tseng|work: i am just coming, i cant know. (c:
[09:06] <ogra> stockholm, heya
[09:06] <stockholm> orga: hi!
[09:07] <tseng|work> that doesnt look very similar to our system
[09:08] <stockholm> ogra: what do you work on?
[09:08] <ogra> stockholm, http://udu.wiki.ubuntu.com/Edubuntu
[09:08] <stockholm> ogra: yes, i know the page
=== stockholm checks if there is anything new
[09:08] <ogra> stockholm, i just got Edubuntu assigned, i'm currently reading up on all the stuff....
[09:08] <tseng|work> we just packaged ltsp for a start
[09:09] <tseng|work> you can get in on the ground floor
[09:09] <stockholm> ogra: do you know that we are cooperating? (c:
[09:09] <ogra> stockholm, i was hoping so...
=== ogra has the responsibility for edubuntu since two days.... 
[09:10] <ogra> so i'm curretly looking at the different projects that are there
[09:10] <stockholm> ogra: cool.
[09:10] <stockholm> ogra: i am a debian-edu developer
[09:10] <ogra> stockholm, yes, i grokked that ;)
[09:10] <ogra> stockholm, will you be in bergen ?
[09:11] <stockholm> ogra: we can take this to query and contiune in german
[09:11] <stockholm> no
[09:11] <ogra> :(
[09:11] <stockholm> my wife booked a short term vacation then
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[09:57] <dholbach> tritium: hey michael
[09:57] <tritium> hi dholbach :)
[10:03] <\sh> hey dholbach 
[10:04] <dholbach> hey \sh 
[10:06] <\sh> hmm..i think it's ok when I'm drinking red wine while it's hot *hicks* ;)
[10:07] <dholbach> *snigger*
[10:09] <\sh> the shiraz from yesterday..ZA western cape area
[10:16] <tritium> dholbach, I'll see you next week.
[10:16] <dholbach> tritium: have a nice weekend michael :)
[10:17] <tritium> you too!  bye!
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[10:24] <ogra> grrr
[10:25] <tseng|work> ogra ?
[10:25] <ogra> they killed my netblock, my server isnt reachable....
[10:25] <tseng|work> ugh
[10:26] <ogra> not the fun i like on fridays at 10:30 pm....
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[10:27] <tseng|work> yeah its 4:30 here
[10:27] <tseng|work> i *need* to get out of work
[10:27] <mdke> pm i hope
[10:28] <tseng|work> yes
[10:28] <mdke> ;)
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[10:37] <\sh> ogra: u called them?
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[11:01] <ogra> \sh, nope
[11:02] <ogra> \sh, no need to
[11:02] <ogra> \sh, i guess it was a broken UPS
[11:03] <ogra> \sh, 10 IP's above and below mine were gone, now everything runs again.... i could shoot them, they broke my uptime statistics
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[11:05] <\sh> shit
[11:08] <\sh> and I'm playing with wine and elsterformular
[11:08] <\sh> i need to make my taxes
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[11:53] <dholbach> *wave*
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[11:58] <tseng> hi dh
[11:58] <tseng> er.