=== lsuactiafner [~noirrac@tpc-ip-nas-1-p234.telkom-ipnet.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-motu [12:06] Quick question for you guys, do most of you use cdbs for packaging or just do it with debhelper? [12:06] we do cdbs for new packages where it makes sense [12:07] What qualified 'makes sense'? I haven't actually used cdbs so I'm not sure when you'd use it [12:07] well cdbs is about inheritance [12:07] once you override every function to do something nonstandard.. [12:07] was it worth it? [12:08] ah, ok [12:09] So for packages where you are just tossing files down rather than compiling anything, am I beter off with debhelper or cdbs? This is mainly what I was pondering for java stuff. [12:09] youd have to talk to wasabi about java stuff [12:09] I havent the slightest. [12:09] is there a reason he isnt in here? [12:11] i'd suggest looking at the source of a similar package. [12:12] yeah, I'm still trying to figure out how it all works :) [12:33] \sh: ping? [12:34] morning all [12:34] hi [12:34] \sh went to sleep [12:34] tseng: bummer... looks like i missed him by like an hour... === lsuactiafner [~noirrac@tpc-ip-nas-1-p234.telkom-ipnet.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-motu === SquishyWaffle [~GTaylor@130-127-67-44.lehotsky.clemson.edu] has left #ubuntu-motu ["Kopete] === terrex [~terrex@84-122-69-8.onocable.ono.com] has joined #ubuntu-motu === allee [~ach@allee.exgal.mpe.mpg.de] has joined #ubuntu-motu === HostingGeek [~HG@200.48.233.220.exetel.com.au] has joined #ubuntu-motu === HostingGeek complains about mono deps dipite the topic [03:58] Look you are going to get more complaints if you have that in the topic [03:58] you know this genration === chesty_ [~chesty@unconcerned.org] has joined #ubuntu-motu [04:16] hello all === |QuaD- [~QuaD@pcp0011386062pcs.ebrnsw01.nj.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-motu === jaldhar [~jaldhar@pcp09354467pcs.jersyc01.nj.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-motu === CircuitRider [~chatzilla@adsl-68-21-244-251.dsl.bcvloh.ameritech.net] has joined #ubuntu-motu === tritium [~tritium@12-208-96-155.client.insightBB.com] has joined #ubuntu-motu === robitaille [~robitaill@d154-5-117-228.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #ubuntu-motu === |QuaD-_ [~QuaD@pcp0011386062pcs.ebrnsw01.nj.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-motu === [Chameleon] [~Paul@000f660c9c52.click-network.com] has joined #ubuntu-motu === tritium [~tritium@12-208-96-155.client.insightBB.com] has left #ubuntu-motu ["Leaving"] === Seveas [~seveas@seveas.demon.nl] has joined #ubuntu-motu === doko [~doko___@dsl-082-082-206-179.arcor-ip.net] has joined #ubuntu-motu === Burgundavia [~corey@S0106000000cc07fc.gv.shawcable.net] has joined #ubuntu-motu === DanielN [~KodiaK@162.23.4.126] has joined #ubuntu-motu [08:48] argh [08:48] can't understand that === |QuaD- [~QuaD@pcp0011386062pcs.ebrnsw01.nj.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-motu [08:54] DanielN: cant understand what? [09:02] Unfrgiven: my orig.tar.gz size is bigger, than noted in the md5sum... [09:03] so why dont you redownload the md5sum and the tarball just to make sure? [09:07] i am just sure [09:08] got error, if i want to install ith with apt-get source === dooglus [~dooglus@rincevent.net] has joined #ubuntu-motu [09:14] DanielN: im sorry, i dont follow === jsgotangco [~jsg@202.57.71.235] has joined #ubuntu-motu === dooglus [~dooglus@rincevent.net] has joined #ubuntu-motu [09:30] Unfrgiven: i made a package myself.. and now, debian/control contains a wrong .orig.tar size entrie [09:31] Unfrgiven: and this ends up in an error msg, if you want to get source via apt [09:32] <\sh> size entry in control? [09:33] <\sh> good morning btw [09:33] argh [09:33] good morning [09:33] its in the Source file i mean [09:33] Sources [09:33] argh2 [09:36] and in the .dsc file too [09:36] 30418 .. but orig.tar.gz is 30420 big [09:36] <\sh> DanielN: redo the dsc and all [09:37] <\sh> remove .diff.gz, .dsc [09:37] <\sh> enter the debianized source [09:37] <\sh> and debuild -S [09:37] \sh: i can try it... [09:37] <\sh> hmmm [09:37] <\sh> i have another problem [09:42] argh [09:42] i found the fscking error [09:42] i created a new .orig.tar.gz and didn't upload it... so that's why there's an md5sum mismatch error [09:43] <\sh> then u need to make a source upload [09:44] yeah [09:44] but i don't know, how this works [09:45] cause it happens always an not source upload, when im packaging :) [09:45] <\sh> debuild -S -sa [09:56] \sh: thanks alot [09:57] <\sh> u're welcome [10:02] <\sh> wuahahahaha [10:02] <\sh> i don't believe it [10:02] <\sh> kdolphin is using my picture of a debian sarge box, which I found in someones onlineshop...now there is a japanese announcement of debian sarge with a german sarge box *rotfl* [10:03] lol [10:03] hehe [10:03] <\sh> http://www.kdolphin.org/?p=14 === spacey [~spacey@145.33.170.11] has joined #ubuntu-motu === Gervystar [~gervystar@62.94.208.119] has joined #ubuntu-motu === hsprang [~henning@d009062.adsl.hansenet.de] has joined #ubuntu-motu === [Chameleon] [~Paul@000f660c9c52.click-network.com] has joined #ubuntu-motu [10:26] morning [10:27] <\sh> hey siretart === GheRivero [~ghe@hiscpdprx01.upsa.es] has joined #ubuntu-motu [10:38] re === Amaranth goes to bed [11:13] gn8 Amaranth === ofr [~ofrommel@ns.ntm-gmbh.de] has joined #ubuntu-motu [11:33] hello [12:00] <\sh> hi ofr [12:01] \sh: what packages did you upload that I was working on? [12:02] <\sh> ajmitch: moment...i will tell u just now [12:02] I saw libcommoncpp2 [12:02] which was already uploaded, but did need resynced again [12:02] <\sh> ajmitch: libcommoncpp2 has a new debian package, i synced it and uploaded [12:03] <\sh> waiting for the archives [12:03] <\sh> libccscript [12:03] <\sh> i uploaded [12:03] <\sh> and compiled..see bugzilla [12:03] <\sh> libccrtp also new packages, w8 for build (depends on libcommoncpp2) [12:03] <\sh> and i think libccaudio [12:03] <\sh> also uploaded but not compiled right now [12:04] I didn't get any new mail from bugzilla [12:04] <\sh> http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=11542 [12:04] <\sh> http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=11542 [12:04] <\sh> http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=11099 [12:04] <\sh> http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=11540 [12:05] <\sh> some of them they didn't have a bugzilla entry until yesterday [12:06] I don't know if it was really necessary to rename libcommoncpp2-1.3 [12:06] <\sh> ajmitch: debian did it as well [12:06] since there was never any binary in ubuntu built against the old api [12:06] <\sh> and kamion wanted this rename [12:06] s/api/abi/ [12:06] ok.. [12:07] I guedss just to keep everything in line with debian [12:07] <\sh> we had a discussion yesterday on #u-d [12:07] <\sh> ajmitch: i had to adjust debian/control c/r lines [12:08] obviously :) === trulux [~lorenzo@67.Red-80-25-56.pooles.rima-tde.net] has joined #ubuntu-motu === koke [~koke@155.210.13.152] has joined #ubuntu-motu === ogra [~ogra@p5089F104.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #ubuntu-motu === spacey [~spacey@flits101-191.flits.rug.nl] has joined #ubuntu-motu === susus [~sz@p5089F104.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #ubuntu-motu === terrex [~terrex@84-122-69-8.onocable.ono.com] has joined #ubuntu-motu === chlunde [chlunde@ritchie.ping.uio.no] has joined #ubuntu-motu === doko [~doko___@dsl-084-059-046-215.arcor-ip.net] has joined #ubuntu-motu [01:31] <\sh> doko: can u check universe/libs/libccaudio_1.1.2-1ubuntu1: Not-For-Us [optional:out-of-date] === ivoks [~ivoks@lns01-0701.dsl.iskon.hr] has joined #ubuntu-motu [01:34] hi [01:37] <\sh> hey ivoks === terrex [~terrex@84-122-69-8.onocable.ono.com] has joined #ubuntu-motu [01:40] sorry, i'm not too much help these days.. [01:40] i didn't sleep last few nights... i have so many things to do on faculty [01:42] well... just camed to say hi === Danten [~danten@h197n10c1o1049.bredband.skanova.com] has joined #ubuntu-motu [01:42] back to drawing board [01:43] bye === koke [~koke@155.210.13.152] has joined #ubuntu-motu === ofr [~ofrommel@ns.ntm-gmbh.de] has joined #ubuntu-motu [01:57] hi [02:00] \sh: hi === jamessan|work [~jamessan@c-24-218-220-129.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-motu [02:06] <\sh> hi Unfrgiven [02:06] how r u [02:07] ive tried doing gmetadom [02:07] but its dependant on findlib [02:07] and findlib doesnt currently build :( [02:07] <\sh> Unfrgiven: yeah I know..waiting for ocaml to build correctly [02:07] \sh: damn ocaml :P [02:08] <\sh> ofr: u r the one from telepolis? [02:08] <\sh> Unfrgiven: lemme check...doko uploaded it again the last time [02:09] sh: yeah. i havent written anything for tp in a long time, though [02:09] sh: so who are you? :) [02:11] <\sh> ofr: well, an old fart, who dealt with harald m. a long time ago :) [02:17] sh: what are you working on in ubuntu= [02:17] ? [02:21] hi [02:23] tseng: gday === trulux [~lorenzo@67.Red-80-25-56.pooles.rima-tde.net] has joined #ubuntu-motu [02:26] <\sh> ofr: motu :) [02:26] <\sh> ofr: kde stuff [02:26] yeah, what packages? [02:26] i see [02:26] <\sh> ofr: well depends...python-kde3 ;) [02:26] <\sh> ofr: sometimes things i [02:27] <\sh> I'm using every day...some server software like jabberd2 etc. [02:28] http://azure.humbug.org.au/~aj/blog/2005/06/07?seemore=y#2005-06-07-ubuntu [02:29] absolutely worth a look :) [02:29] Unfrgiven: hi. [02:29] tseng: how goes it [02:30] fine thanks [02:32] ogra: very interesting indeed [02:32] i followed tha instructions on pbuilder [02:33] <\sh> that reminds me to write a follow up article on pbuilder for our next release backporters section :) [02:34] how do i manage to create packages that are correctly tagged ubuntuX? [02:35] ofr: dch ? [02:35] oh yhea [02:35] did not find it [02:35] which package is it in? [02:36] devscripts [02:36] thanks [02:36] installed it myself a minute ago.. (gaim-rhythmbox on the way) [02:36] ofr: apt-cache search dch [02:36] <\sh> apt-file search /usr/bin/dch ;) [02:37] dpkg -S dch :) [02:39] <\sh> jesus...libbonobomm1.3-9c2_1.3.8-2.2ubuntu1_*.deb reached the archives..i can work [02:47] is there anyway that firefox will display the contents of the gz file on lamonts buildlogs? or do i have to download and view it manually?!?! [02:49] Unfrgiven: curl http://something | zless :) [02:49] Unfrgiven, hwdb.ubuntu.com/buildlogs [02:49] Unfrgiven, but thats only for the recent builds [02:50] and my server is darn slow [02:50] ogra: still no "final" server? [02:50] for hwdb [02:51] Treenaks: thanks. [02:51] Treenaks, simply no time... my boss is laoding me with other "non hwdb" work currently ;) [02:51] curl is cool :) [02:53] Unfrgiven: it'll display the .gz, but I think they are .bz2's now? [02:53] sladen: curl yadda | bzless :P [02:57] sladen: i thought that firefox is able to handle compressed output? and the files im looking at are definately .gz [02:57] Unfrgiven: content-transer-encoding vs content-type I think [02:57] Unfrgiven: it's something in the headers of .gz files vs mod_gzipped content [02:58] Treenaks: ah right.... curl | zless did not work :( [02:59] Treenaks: zless is the one with the problem... curl | gzip -d works fine [03:01] Unfrgiven: weird [03:01] Unfrgiven: well.. curl http://blah | gzip -dc | less should work then :) [03:01] Unfrgiven: or use lesspipe [03:02] Treenaks: thats a lot more effort :P [03:02] Treenaks: wierd... zless is showing the same output as less [03:06] anyways goodnight all.... === [Chameleon] [~Paul@000f660c9c52.click-network.com] has joined #ubuntu-motu === mgalvin [~mgalvin@host-66-202-95-170.spr.choiceone.net] has joined #ubuntu-motu === tseng reads up on making livecds === mitsuhiko [~mitsuhiko@80.122.201.98] has joined #ubuntu-motu [03:44] i wonder how i can lookup static ips [03:44] per host [03:49] what do you mean? [03:50] i want to make livecds for servers that have static ips [03:50] tseng: rarp [03:50] they all have exactly the same software (ethereal) === bradb [~bradb@MTL-ppp-147026.qc.sympatico.ca] has joined #ubuntu-motu [03:50] but different hostnames/static ips [03:50] right now im thinking they can dhcp [03:50] tseng: dhcp would work -- if the server works right [03:50] and then lookup a static ip from mysql [03:50] but at that point, i still need a unique identifier persistant [03:51] so i might as well save all the info in a config file [03:51] on the harddisk [03:51] so i can just mount the disk on startup and copy the network file to /etc [03:52] in tmpfs [03:58] how do I add an attachment on malone? [03:58] ask really really nicely === astharot [~gerardo@aad4f5265aedae46.session.tor] has joined #ubuntu-motu === blueyed [~daniel@i528C3C33.versanet.de] has joined #ubuntu-motu === ozamosi [~ozamosi@80.252.171.204] has joined #ubuntu-motu === lamont__ [~lamont@15.238.5.47] has joined #ubuntu-motu [04:59] time to go home :) === ofr [~ofrommel@ns.ntm-gmbh.de] has joined #ubuntu-motu === tritium [~tritium@ee213-dhcp-3.ecn.purdue.edu] has joined #ubuntu-motu === terrex [~terrex@84-122-69-8.onocable.ono.com] has joined #ubuntu-motu === StoneTable [~stone@c-67-184-135-68.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-motu === herzi [~herzi@d023121.adsl.hansenet.de] has joined #ubuntu-motu === GheRivero [~ghe@hiscpdprx01.upsa.es] has joined #ubuntu-motu === MagnusR [~magru@as1-1-7.t.lk.bonet.se] has joined #ubuntu-motu [05:55] <\sh> doko: ping [05:56] <\sh> doko: please include universe/libs/libbonobouimm1.3_1.3.7-3.1ubuntu1: Not-For-Us [optional:out-of-date] [06:00] \sh: include where? [06:01] <\sh> doko: this lib is blocked...to compile and to install === plugwash [plugwash@p10link.net] has joined #ubuntu-motu [06:11] libbonobouimm1.3 dep-wait libbonobomm1.3-9c2, so it should build again, when libbonobomm1.3-9c2 is in the archive [06:12] <\sh> argl. [06:13] <\sh> doko: it was uploaded yesterday [06:14] <\sh> doko: and it's on the servers: http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/libb/libbonobomm1.3/ [06:36] woah, tyvis is really hard stuff.... [06:47] doko, could it be that you missed libclutils0 ? (Clifton Lab's Utilities. These are C++ utility classes ....) [06:47] in the package are the .a and the .so files, but they seem broken.... tyvis depends on it... [06:48] ogra: maybe, time to fix it ;) [06:48] grrr [06:49] after this transition i dont want any C++ sourcecode nearer the 5m to me.... [06:49] never ever ! [06:49] <\sh> ogra: hahahha [06:50] heh, what about a C++ t-shirt ... [06:50] or a tatoo ... [06:50] grr [06:50] <\sh> ogra: didn't u want my trolltech shirt? ,-) === DanielN_ [~kodiak@80-218-243-68.dclient.hispeed.ch] has joined #ubuntu-motu [06:51] there is so awesome language stuff you can program in.... why did people choose this crap ? === |QuaD-_ [~QuaD@pcp0011386062pcs.ebrnsw01.nj.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-motu === jamessan|work prepares a bag of C code to send to ogra [06:52] yay [06:52] orga, sadly many school use c++, people get used to it ;( [06:52] mgalvin, i even heard about desktop environments using it.... ;) [06:53] I actually never touched C++ in college. C, Java, and Scheme [06:53] oh, and MIPS asm [06:53] i just need to rant a bit, because this transition stuff is no fun at all for me [06:54] thats another great thing about c, it never brakes compat :) [06:56] hi all [06:56] \sh: thanks for your hint with the source upload, works :) [06:58] <\sh> ok... [06:58] <\sh> libccrtp is done..thx to mvo [06:58] <\sh> bugreport to debian is on its way [06:59] <\sh> DanielN_: u r welcome:) [06:59] <\sh> ogra: come on...u have to do some things for it ,) [07:01] \sh: but another question: in the orig.tar is debian_stuff, in the source tree i deleted it. if i build the package there's an error who says to me that debian_stuff won't be deleted (and that's correct) [07:01] \sh, i know.... but currently i have the feeling to only waste my time with it.... i have a gazillion important things to do.... if i had _any_ success with at least one package it would be ok... but only finding broken packages my stuff depends on is no fun [07:02] <\sh> ogra: it's ok...I will take over your packages when I'm finished with mine ;) there r also some stoppers...findlib (ocaml dep) and some others who r depending on gmetadom (ocaml ;)) [07:04] \sh, i dont want someone to help, i just want some success here.... [07:08] <\sh> ogra: we need to finish this all [07:10] \sh, at least two of my packages wont build before X is fixed... we simply cant finish it [07:10] another one depends on a package that was not on the list at all, which i'm fixing currently.... [07:11] <\sh> and I think, i will brew some coffee right now, have a nice shower, and lay down for 1 hour === lsuactiafner [~noirrac@tpc-ip-nas-1-p234.telkom-ipnet.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-motu [07:12] <\sh> and when I'm waking up, I will sit in front of this laptop with a redhat fedora ;) [07:14] <\sh> and listening to strange music [07:15] ooh...why === \sh is playing "Lonely" by Akon on German Top100 Single Charts [07:15] <\sh> it's strange really === Nafallo [~nafallo@nafallo.user] has joined #ubuntu-motu === thoreauputic [~prospero@wolax6-201.dialup.optusnet.com.au] has joined #ubuntu-motu [07:40] could someone with some more C++ insight have a look at warped.... \sh, doko ? [07:44] <\sh> sure [07:44] <\sh> name? [07:44] warped [07:45] <\sh> trans? [07:45] <\sh> ogra: c2 ? [07:46] oh, but i just see it also has to wait until libclutils has built.... [07:46] yep, looks like another missed one [07:48] <\sh> why is it not on the list? [07:49] i guess doko just looked for dependencys..... neother libclutils nor libwarped have any c++ deps [07:49] neither even [07:49] but they provide c++ functions [07:49] <\sh> ok [07:49] and are written in c++ === Danten [~danten@h197n10c1o1049.bredband.skanova.com] has joined #ubuntu-motu [08:06] \sh, clutils is ready.... should hit the archive soon [08:09] <\sh> clutils/20031216-6ubuntu1/ ? [08:09] yep [08:09] it just finished compiling... === Seveas [~seveas@seveas.demon.nl] has joined #ubuntu-motu [08:37] <\sh> woooot [08:37] <\sh> who changed p.u.c [08:37] <\sh> ? [08:38] jdub. [08:38] <\sh> I love him :) [08:38] <\sh> it looks fantastic === ogra doesnt read planet anymore on thewebsite since there are the rss feeded screensavers..... its much cooler to read planet this way *g* [08:44] hah [08:44] s/feeded/fed [08:46] especially while working on the new lock screen *g* [08:46] <\sh> ogra: yes..but sometimes I want to see the faces...well hackergotchies ;) [08:46] ogra: "new"? [08:46] im excited. [08:47] it will somehow look like this: http://www.grawert.net/xss_mockup.png [08:47] oh wow [08:47] but with more jdub [08:47] if i ever convince this shitty code to accept xpm [08:48] other user is what [08:48] user switching? [08:48] jwz re-implemented xpm.h in the screensaver itself :( [08:48] yep [08:48] hm [08:48] you already have it.... [08:48] I do? [08:48] just with the old ugly lock screen [08:49] if you have 4.21-..... [08:49] my breezy lock screen has no buttons [08:49] updated today [08:49] hmm, funny [08:49] mine has the button.... [08:50] is that the real xpm? [08:50] oh maybe i need to restart X [08:50] nope [08:50] just the screensaver.... [08:51] hmm, and we should include rss-glx in the default screensaver install.... [08:51] yes [08:52] and it should read mjg59's blog [08:52] by default [08:52] "christing fuckmuppets" [08:54] heh [08:54] rss-glx are neat 3D screensavers (rss = really slick screensavers) [08:54] the rss reading ones are in the default install :) [08:55] hm oh [08:55] well my box at work has an i810 chip [08:55] they are probably useless [08:55] rss-glx is already the newest version. [08:55] and i adjusted them to point to planet by default ;) so make mjg59 join planet ;) [08:56] jdub probably wont let him [08:56] they wont let him on planet gnome [08:56] heh [08:56] why ? [08:56] tseng: make it a default in blam then ;-) [08:56] because his blogs are very offensive [08:56] oh, good idea [08:57] whats the name of an rss screensaver [08:57] tseng: FontGlidesomething... [08:57] tseng: phosphor can use it? [08:58] Treenaks: hm? [08:58] less /usr/share/doc/rss-glx/README.xscreensaver [08:58] tseng: the phosphor screensaver [08:58] ogra: there is a separate package? what's ljlatest for then? :) [08:59] oh THAT rss [08:59] dunno, never heard of it ? [08:59] stupid acronym overloading [08:59] hehe [09:00] <\sh> hmmm....nice [09:00] ogra: ljlatest returns the last X entries from an rss file, and stuff like phosphor, noseguy etc. can read from that [09:00] s/X/n [09:00] <\sh> sebastian bergmann released his book "Software Development with PHP5" as opensource [09:00] ogra: so you can have noseguy walking around spewing the latest livejournal crap [09:00] Treenaks, thats already built in in the latest xscreensaver, no need for an extra program [09:00] Treenaks, exactly what it does now ;) [09:00] ogra: ljlatest used to be included as a separate program in the xscreensaver package [09:01] Treenaks, its included and on by default, pointing to planet.ubuntu.com === sivang [~sivang@box79162.elkhouse.de] has joined #ubuntu-motu [09:01] ogra: not working for noseguy here, he only tells me my load average [09:02] wow that was so cool it crashed my box [09:03] Treenaks, seems noseguy doesnt use the internal rss parser ... [09:03] ogra: oh wait... [09:03] ogra: if I remove ~/.xscreensaver and killall xscreensaver [09:03] then start xscreensaver-demo and let it start the daemon [09:03] ah, old setting :) [09:03] it works [09:05] Treenaks, try FlipText, thats the nicest one imho [09:05] Xlib: extension "XFree86-DRI" missing on display ":0.0". [09:05] ogra: I have an ati and breezy... [09:06] poke daniels :) to make an l-r-m package [09:06] hmm [09:06] ogra: I'll wait for 2.6.12-final before I do that [09:06] where is mjg59's blog? [09:07] Nafallo, its on planet.debian.org [09:11] hehe [09:11] found it ;-) === littlepaul [~littlepau@p5084DD1B.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #ubuntu-motu === Treenaks whips his thumbnailer [09:13] the pictures might be huge, but I want thumbnails. GO [09:13] <\sh> Treenaks: gallery2 ;) [09:13] \sh: no, my own home-built perl thingy :) [09:14] but it's almost choking on my new 8mpix photos from my EOS 350D :) [09:14] <\sh> Treenaks: why not imagemagick with a oneliner? [09:14] \sh: it IS imagemagick, from perl [09:14] <\sh> s/perl// ;) [09:14] \sh: the perl is pretty clean: http://foodfight.org/download/photo/ [09:15] <\sh> oh cgi... [09:15] \sh: oui [09:16] \sh: I think it's even mod_perl-able [09:16] \sh: (Apache::Registry etc.) [09:18] \sh: basically, I just put my pics in a dir, and I'm done (except for waiting for thumbnailing) === terrex [~terrex@84-122-69-8.onocable.ono.com] has joined #ubuntu-motu === dholbach [foobar@td9091aa0.pool.terralink.de] has joined #ubuntu-motu [09:25] hi [09:25] hi DanielN_ [09:25] <\sh> hey dholbach [09:25] hi dholbach :-) [09:25] hey :) [09:25] so we're really 66 people in here? [09:25] ROCK :) [09:26] and 159 in -devel ;-) [09:26] we rock so hard :) [09:26] hi dholbach [09:26] dholbach: hi [09:26] hi [09:27] i feel so welcome in here :) === Nafallo shouldn't have thrown away universe and multiverse... *sigh* [09:27] dholbach: and they told us not to make the channel [09:27] haha :))) [09:28] MOTUNewPackages is A BIT full as well [09:28] i kind of want to freeze it [09:28] until we have a policy for making itps [09:29] or working with the itp filler [09:29] <\sh> ogra: should i try and fix warp? [09:29] filer? [09:29] we maybe don't want ITPs [09:29] we want something. [09:29] yeah... kind of an announcement [09:29] oh i dont want itps in ubuntu [09:29] i want to make sure we file it in debian [09:29] not in debian as well - they will nail you on those packages [09:29] :) [09:29] so our package doesnt get overwriten [09:29] i think i don't want to own packages [09:29] tseng: then we need to have somebody sponsoring those packages into debian. [09:29] "own" [09:30] Mithrandir: thats not a big problem for me, but I dont know about all this other stuff [09:30] Mithrandir: i'm not sure about the administrativa, but do we want an RFP maybe? [09:30] Mithrandir: that we are already sponsoring for someone else [09:30] into ubuntu [09:31] \sh, yes, thats why i asked ;) [09:31] <\sh> I think we shouldn't sponsor any uploads..if they want to upload a package, they should become a motu [09:31] i dont want to add a package in ubuntu and get a different package added to debian [09:31] dholbach: I think we should ask on -devel how it should be handled. it would be very nice if we could extend the wnpp mechanism to "packaged-in-ubuntu" or something. [09:31] \sh: you're misunderstanding. You need somebody to sponsor the package into debian. A DD. [09:31] Mithrandir: yeah kind of an announcement to make it easier [09:31] <\sh> Mithrandir: yes...ajmitch can do [09:31] or more recently, have someone file an ITP, me work with that person to fix up the package [09:31] and a 3rd person upload a totally crap package w/o talking to either of us [09:31] \sh: he will kill us for 426767964 packages in 468794269426 new revisions :) [09:32] Mithrandir: is there a policy about ^ ? [09:32] \sh: that's way too much for a single person. sponsoring is a lot of work. [09:32] <\sh> dholbach: hmmm..I don't want to go the DD way [09:32] \sh: collaboration on packages is the easiest way [09:32] \sh: the only way in my eyes [09:33] <\sh> Mithrandir: it works like this: we're reviewing the packages, and we decide if it's ok or not..ajmitch + other DDs in the Ubuntu Project will have the last word [09:33] tseng: about not respecting ITPs? It's considered a bit rude and it usually ends with "sure, you take it" from one of the packagers. It's seldom malicious. [09:33] Mithrandir: well the package that was uploaded is wrong. [09:33] tseng: well, then bugs must be filed; that's kinda irrelevant, really. :-) [09:33] \sh: any DD uploading something to Debian is signing the source with his own key and thereby taking responsibility for the upload. [09:34] eh as long as he hands it over I guess [09:34] is RicardoMarkiewicz here? [09:34] i already got the first guy to fix his package [09:34] tseng: it's usually an issue of missing or mis-communication. === lsuactiafner [~noirrac@tpc-ip-nas-1-p234.telkom-ipnet.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-motu [09:35] yes i need to publish this mono packaging policy and then start beating people over the head with it [09:35] people are still reading old docs. === terrex [~terrex@84-122-69-8.onocable.ono.com] has joined #ubuntu-motu [09:36] does anybody know RicardoMarkiewicz ircnick? [09:36] <\sh> Mithrandir: right...so what is the best way...filing ITP and w8? [09:36] \sh: filing ITP means "i will maintain this package in debian until i die" :) [09:37] <\sh> and if kde app is not running on noscreen s390 mode, it's rejected? [09:37] dude, m68k [09:37] <\sh> hmmm [09:37] its the wave of the future. [09:37] I thought all that changed with etch? [09:37] dholbach i'm sure people can stop maintaining packages in debian can't they [09:38] plugwash: you can orphan is [09:38] *it [09:38] <\sh> I would say: lets start filing ITPs with "He Man " [09:38] then someone has to pick it up or I think its removed. [09:38] isn't debian walking the "support 4 most popular arches" road now? [09:38] \sh: there hasn't been a large-scale effort similar to what we're doing here before, so we need to establish a sane and reasonable set of policies. [09:38] <\sh> Mithrandir: yes...malone if debian wants or not [09:39] <\sh> and now i have to go to mako and tell him my anti-debian mood ,-) [09:39] \sh: eh you keep going for launchpad stuff as the solution [09:39] \sh: malone is irrelevant in this context. I'm talking about what we need to do in relation to debian. [09:39] launchpad just doesnt work at this point [09:39] \sh: if people start filing ITPs, they need to follow through and maintain the packages in Debian too. [09:39] plugwash: yeah... i was merely kidding, but ITP doesn't mean "i will have a look at the source code" - the text really talks of "owning" [09:39] and since it's a administrative device of debian, i'm not sure, if we want to use it "on the fly" [09:39] <\sh> Mithrandir: if you think about a roleaccount, it doesn't matter who of us will touch the package, we will be one person towards debian [09:40] that doesnt fit in the model \sh [09:40] \sh: that's so not how Debian works. [09:40] one person owns one package [09:40] <\sh> bah...it's all to difficult [09:40] teams are a new concept. [09:41] there are x, mono, gnome teams, but its still not really what you are saying [09:41] <\sh> tseng: so gentoo style [09:41] gentoo style is shithouse [09:42] <\sh> tseng: i mean "herds" when it's working [09:42] \sh: i managed the gentoo desktop project for some months, if you recall [09:42] <\sh> tseng: yepp [09:42] herds dont give accountability at all [09:42] for a lot of packages, a team approach doesn't make sense. [09:42] mail-handling team, for instance? [09:43] entire teams disappear, and no one new is joining, its a very loose structure [09:43] <\sh> Mithrandir:why not? [09:43] maintaining mutt, gnus, exim4, postfix, mailman and everything else which touches mail. [09:43] and leaves one person, or no one at all holding a big bag [09:43] (yes, and gnu hello) [09:43] yeah some teams seem related but arent like that [09:43] no one uses 4 mtas [09:44] gnome or mono makes sense, its a stack [09:44] \sh: which team would maintain chrpath? pkg-config? sash? fortune-mod-bofh-excuses? [09:44] you need to coordinate. [09:44] smeg 0.7.4 is universe but i just released 0.7.5, how do i get it in? [09:44] (those are a few of my packages in Debian, fwiw) [09:44] put it on MOTUNewPackages again? [09:44] Mithrandir: MOTU ;-) [09:44] Amaranth: no [09:44] or can i just find a sponsor this time and go [09:44] Amaranth: just prepare a new source package and give to whoever sponsored it [09:44] ajmitch: ping? [09:44] Nafallo: for some, sure. For some, absolutely not. pkg-config is apparently trivial, but not. [09:45] or we could end up with a zillion teams. python-based-webapps team for instance (where pyblosxom would fit). [09:45] thats where gentoo is [09:45] a bunch of loose teams that make no sense [09:46] debian has a few sensible teams [09:46] Amaranth: MOTUToReview [09:46] I think trying to say "team for everything" might be trying to fit a large amount of square pegs in a different amount of round holes. :-) [09:46] and 1000 disconnected maintainers [09:46] the gentoo way [09:46] tseng: sure, debian's model isn't perfect either, but trying to come up with The Single Solution is either nontrivial or not possible. === tseng gives zul a square peg [09:47] wohoo.. [09:47] dholbach: Put it up there? I've already gone through MOTUNewPackages to get 0.7.4 in [09:47] yeah, and we'd have a norwegian team for maintaining the norwegian spellchecking dictionaries. I guess that team would have a single member. :P [09:47] Mithrandir: all i want is a way to proactively push changes to debian [09:47] <\sh> Amaranth: u r no motu? [09:47] not that many DD's watch ~scott [09:47] \sh: nope, no signed key [09:47] Amaranth: unless you're a motu, you have to get stuff reviewed [09:48] tseng: ok, lets lean back and look at the different problems? [09:48] Amaranth: for a new revision it's just one review [09:48] Mithrandir: yep [09:48] Mithrandir: baah, you might soon convert me to norwegian anyway ;-) [09:48] the major problem case for me is this: [09:48] tseng: one is making sure bugs we fix are fixed in debian as well. [09:48] dholbach: I thought my sponsor was the one that had to review it for a new revision. [09:48] I package something, say Beagle [09:48]