[02:14] <allee> Riddell: ping?  knemo and network notifications (knemo)
[02:14] <Riddell> allee: hmm?
[02:15] <allee> I wonder if there are any plans about (network) notifications already
[02:15] <allee> ?
[02:16] <allee> in udu is a page about a general eventnotifier, but kde(pim) has already networkstatus and finally there's knemo ...
[02:17] <Riddell> knemo is too hard to set up
[02:17] <allee> any plans about the route kubuntu will go for breezy
[02:17] <Riddell> what is networkstatus?
[02:17] <allee> easier setup is on of the TODO things for knemo
[02:17] <Riddell> ivman can monitor HAL for changes in network and pop up friendly messages
[02:18] <allee> kded module.   see KDE services
[02:18] <allee> AFAIR on ivman homepage author is not sure if ivman or dbus/hal is the way to the future
[02:19] <Riddell> why wouldn't it be?
[02:19] <allee> Btw.  networkstatus does (passiv) popups already
[02:20] <allee> "<Riddell> why wouldn't it be?".   Maybe I recall wrong.
[02:20] <allee> nevertheless knemo does much more than just show an icon on net connections ...
[02:21] <Riddell> my kded has Network Status Daemon running but I've never seen any popups
[02:21] <Riddell> what else does knemo do?
[02:21] <allee> that's the reason why I think about replacing knemo polling with 'a app' informs knemo about network changes.  Knemo stays passive until more info or monitoring is required
[02:22] <allee> Riddell: tooltip with network infos.  Monitor traffic.  custom action for interfaces (e.g. ifup/down)
[02:23] <allee> Riddell: knemo does almost everything the littel network icons in windows systray can do
[02:23] <Riddell> I would like knemo in there but it needs to set itself up
[02:23] <allee> as I said it's on my TODO ;)
[02:24] <allee> If knemo gets if existance/up/down info form an external tool.  Setup can be made almost automatic ...
[02:25] <Riddell> hal :)
[02:25] <allee> except the decision: to show an icon for an iface or not.  this has to be decided and written to an config file
[02:25] <Riddell> why?  if it's up show it, else don't
[02:25] <Riddell> and don't show loopback
[02:27] <allee> hal is 'low' level.   Maybe a 'dispatcher' like ivman or merge knemo and networkstatus.  I'm not sure yet 
[02:27] <allee> window does _not_ show icon per default
[02:27] <allee> as I said one has to decide ;)
[02:29] <allee> I'll have another more deeper look at ivman ...
[02:29] <allee> btw. is kay designed to be feed by ivman   (I've to talk with JRe about it.  Some design decision I don't understand)
[02:31] <Riddell> it's not designed for ivman no, but if we use it it'll be with ivman
[02:32] <allee> will ubuntu  go with ivman too?
[02:32] <Riddell> no, they'll still with gnome-volume-manager
[02:32] <allee> wait I'll search the udu page ...
[02:45] <allee> it's late, can't find it :(
[02:45] <allee> thx for the infos Riddell.   I'll check ivman doc and code to see what needs adaption in knemo
[03:01] <allee> mhmm, no pkg for ivman yet?
[03:03] <Riddell> I havn't uploaded it yet, will probably do so tomorrow
[03:03] <Riddell> http://dev.kubuntu.org.uk/~jr/kubuntu/ivman/
[03:27] <allee> thx
[09:51] <\sh> hey jre
[09:51] <JRe> hey!
[09:51] <JRe> \sh: no response for the thread about gpl/apache license :(
[09:52] <\sh> JRe: nobody is interessted
[09:53] <JRe> \sh: may be we should ask that on debian-devel or legal
[09:54] <\sh> i don't want to have debian involved...that would produce too much of hot air ;)
[09:55] <JRe> \sh: yeah that's what i think too ;) ;)
[11:39] <allee> JRe: ping?
[11:40] <JRe> allee: pong!
[11:40] <allee> JRe: hi
[11:40] <JRe> allee: elo!
[11:40] <allee> JRe: I looked at kay and I wonder why you choose the action as single xml file.  My ..
[11:40] <allee> concern is how to other pkg register
[11:41] <allee> JRe: e.g. digikam gets installed.  Is there an easy way to regist to e.g., DATACD
[11:41] <JRe> allee: maybe it would be better to make several actions file ?
[11:42] <JRe> allee: in several directories ?
[11:42] <allee> JRe: my first idea was a apps/kay/action.d/<app>.xml
[11:43] <JRe> allee: yeah! good idea!
[11:44] <JRe> allee: and in the <app>.xml the displayed categories are configurable
[11:45] <allee> JRe: can there be even new categories?  e.g. AUDIOINPUT?
[11:45] <JRe> sure!
[11:45] <allee> JRe: great!
[11:47] <allee> brb
[11:47] <JRe> okay C U!
[11:52] <allee> JRe: for kay TODO:  check in executeable exists. either do not display the action or pop up error msg
[11:53] <JRe> allee: yeah! good idea ;)
[11:54] <allee> JRe: if you go with action.d/  it may be nice to watch for changes so if an app registers an action it's immediately available
[11:54] <JRe> allee: yeah sure
[11:54] <allee> JRe: how do you 'restart' kay during development.  Kill/start kded?
[11:55] <JRe> allee: restarting kded yes 
[11:56] <JRe> allee: you really told be a bunch of great feature to add ;) i will add all of that in the TODO for the 0.4 version
[11:57] <allee> KDEDmodules lack infrastucture (load/unload/help/config ;)
[11:58] <Riddell> actually you can load and unload them from kcontrol
[11:58] <Riddell> "KDE Components"
[11:58] <Riddell> or systemsettings
[11:58] <allee> mhmm, a method to add a new action with the popup would be nice too.  If favorite app is not there add it is one click away
[11:59] <allee> Riddell: stop/start I know  but unload/load mhmm only tried in 3.3 days. checking ...
[12:00] <Riddell> ah you mean if new services are added
[12:00] <JRe> allee: you mean adding an action directly from the action dialog ?
[12:01] <allee> Riddell: no.  I mean during development testing one needs to (re)load the kdedmodule
[12:02] <JRe> Riddell: you con stop and start but it's the same version loaded
[12:02] <allee> some apps didn't like if one kills kded under their feet (at least in 3.3 days)
[12:03] <allee> but missing load/unload is no big deal.  That in 'service manager' is now way to access help or configure the service is MUCH more bad from usage point of view
[12:06] <allee> JRe: yes.  E.g. yesterday I added my usbstick triggered started kay and digikam was not there.  Would be nice to be able to add the (favorite) app now. 
[12:06] <JRe> allee: once again, you're right ;)
[12:08] <allee> First time usage experience is usualy the best input  (after some usage one tends to focus on special personal wishes ;)
[12:10] <\sh> Riddell: what about your cxx bugs in malone?
[12:11] <JRe> allee: right! i'll try to put all these features in kay 0.4.0: application hook, standard apps checker, quick add
[12:13] <Riddell> \sh: what about them?
[12:13] <allee> JRe: 0.3.2 is already a huge step in the right direction!  Congrats
[12:13] <JRe> allee: thanks ;)
[12:16] <allee> JRe: btw you may add it to kde-apps (mentioning developed for kubuntu but usable also on other general dists ;)
[12:18] <\sh> Riddell: is it for later? i'm trying to clean malone a bit...but malone doesn't like me..it's not unusable
[12:19] <Riddell> \sh: it's for debian's sake
[12:19] <\sh> Riddell: aha :)
[12:20] <Riddell> \sh: if you can work out how to say that it's fixed in ubuntu and not debian that would be nifty
[12:21] <\sh> Riddell: well...file a bug in debian, say "fixed" in malone...;)
[12:21] <\sh> i can't even change the status and go back to the bug commenting page
[12:22] <\sh> it's not usable...as i said *grmpf*
[12:24] <JRe> allee: yes you're right! i wait for sourceforge to accept my project and as soon as it's done i'll put a link to kde-apps
[12:28] <allee> JRe: My favorite is KDE svn extragear or playground for some time.  Better translation, better peer review ;)
[12:30] <JRe> allee: yeah i should move to that place, but only if people from kde found my little app interesting. Moreover i have also to send some patches in order that they trust me
[12:32] <allee> JRe: really?  It will be used in kubuntu, won't it? I guess asking on kde-extragear / helio should be enough
[12:32] <allee> lunch
[12:33] <Riddell> JRe: do you have an SVN account?
[12:33] <JRe> Riddell: nop
[12:33] <Riddell> that would be the problem then
[12:36] <JRe> ???
[12:37] <Riddell> hard to put it in KDE's SVN without an account
[12:37] <JRe> Riddell:yeah i have to contribute to KDE a lot in order to have an account ;) ;) ;)
[01:41] <amu> Riddell: http://websvn.kde.org/trunk/kdenonbeta/kdedebian/livecd/ 
[01:41] <amu> that's a early version of the liveCD installer in python with qt bindings 
[01:43] <Riddell> amu: looks pretty inactive
[01:43] <allee> JRe: No, not a lot.  Btw. you have already KDE code to contribute (btw, much more than I did).   Just ask yourself are you commited to work on kay.  Then ping heliocasto on #kde-devel
[01:44] <amu> Riddell: it works for the old style liveCD's .. it was an initial checkin by carsten, phil has meanwhile newer versions  
[01:46] <amu> asked phil for a newer version, after i get it, i'll update it.
[01:47] <Riddell> who is phil?
[01:48] <amu> the installer is diffent than my idea, my plan is CD is installable with just a boot option 
[01:50] <amu> Philip Stadermann
[01:51] <Riddell> don't know him
[01:56] <\sh> riddell: breezy, installed kubuntu-desktop...no kde as login session in kdm/gdm
[01:57] <Riddell> \sh: what do you have?
[01:57] <\sh> Riddell: gnome, failsafe
[01:59] <Riddell> that's not good
[01:59] <Riddell> it's working for me
[02:00] <\sh> i made an update of hoary...
[02:00] <Riddell> me too
[02:00] <\sh> where r the session files normally stored, that kdm/xdm/gdm knows about the available sessions?
[02:00] <Riddell> did you keep your old kdmrc or use the new one?
[02:00] <allee> \sh so did I 2 days ago. gnome was default but kde was there
[02:01] <Riddell> /usr/share/xsessions/
[02:01] <\sh> only gnome.desktop inside
[02:02] <\sh> ah
[02:02] <\sh> ksmserver was not installed during kubuntu-desktop install
[02:02] <\sh> and kpersonalizer also not
[02:03] <Riddell> does it need kpersonalizer?
[02:04] <\sh> ksmserver suggest kpersonalizer..but kde.desktop for the xsession is in ksmserver
[02:04] <\sh> ok...changing clients...moment
[02:05] <\sh> back
[02:06] <\sh> ok...but in the end...adjusting fontpath, and installing ksmserver, and breezy looks fine even with kde
[02:06] <Riddell> \sh: which widget theme does it use?
[02:07] <Riddell> kwin depends on ksmserver
[02:07] <\sh> plastik (for me)
[02:07] <\sh> but this was default for kubuntu kde-3.4.1 packages
[02:07] <Riddell> nope, it suggests it
[02:08] <\sh> put it as dependency in kubuntu-desktop-meta
[02:12] <Riddell> hmm, lipstik has stopped working altogether
[02:15] <Riddell> \sh: tried systemsettings?
[02:15] <\sh> hmmm
[02:16] <\sh> kcontrol -> SysAdm -> Date & Time -> Admin Mode ==> No kdesu box nothing
[02:18] <Riddell> \sh: works for me
[02:18] <Riddell> \sh: do you have a password required for sudo?
[02:18] <\sh> yes...
[02:18] <Riddell> \sh: do you have kdesu installed?
[02:19] <\sh> hmmm
[02:19] <\sh> apt-cache search kdesu brings nothing
[02:20] <Riddell> part of kdebase-bin
[02:21] <\sh> is installed
[02:21] <\sh> kdesu -c synaptic is working 
[04:08] <jdong> I assume here's where I find Kubuntu developers?
[04:08] <Riddell> jdong: certainly is
[04:11] <jdong> k, good to know, lol
[04:14] <Riddell> jdong: doing a backport of amarok?  anything else?
[04:19] <jdong> Riddell: one of my devs is doing k3b and amarok
[04:20] <Riddell> jdong: give us a poke when they're in backports non-staging and I'll put a note on the website and mailing lists
[04:25] <jdong> ok, sure
[05:02] <JRe> allee: who was alleHol ?
[05:03] <allee> JRe: alleeHol is me on my breezy host.
[05:03] <JRe> allee: ;)
[05:04] <allee> JRe: I'm leaving soon and want to catch the logs
[05:04] <JRe> allee: there is a way to start a deamon which log irc ?
[05:04] <Riddell> screen is your friend
[05:05] <allee> Riddell: screen is no good with konversation ;) 
[05:06] <Riddell> then either irssi is your friend or NX is
[05:08] <JRe> \sh: dircproxy seems to be what i need ;)
[05:09] <\sh> JRe: u can take logs with it, and it's a nice backend for irssi, xchat and konversation :)
[05:09] <\sh> i have it on my rootie running :)
[05:09] <allee> thx for the tips.   I'm not sure if I ever find the time to scan the weekend discussion.  For now it's just a try.
[05:09] <\sh> allee: but fabbione is logging all the stuff
[05:10] <\sh> people.ubuntu.com/~fabbione/
[05:10] <JRe> \sh: wow magic ;) !
[05:12] <Riddell> elmo: I uploaded a wrong version of ivman to NEW, could you delete it so I can upload the good one
[05:12] <allee> \sh: only *ubuntu* nevertheless good to know
[05:13] <Riddell> allee: kubuntu is in there
[05:13] <Riddell> you were expecting the whole of IRC?
[05:14] <\sh> lol
[05:14] <\sh> for that u should ask all irc admins ;)
[05:14] <allee> Riddell: eh eh,  Of course ;)
[05:15] <allee> have a nice time.  I'll join (as allee) whenever I've time over the weekend.  Bye
[05:16] <JRe> hehe i learn in the logs that usins @cdbs@ is not a good idea ;)
[05:36] <JRe> wow ubuntu wiki is far better now !
[06:13] <Riddell> uniq: the package for kio-locate needs a clean rule that works
[06:27] <Riddell> \sh: could you review katapult
[06:56] <Riddell> uniq: ipodslave reviewed
[06:57] <Riddell> changing package name to kio-ipod may or may not be a good idea, upstream is ipodslave so I expect that's fine
[07:11] <motaboy> Hi all!
[07:56] <elmo> Riddell: presumably kde-i18n source is obsolete and can be removed and shouldn't be synced?
[09:23] <Riddell> elmo: yes
[09:24] <elmo> k, done
[11:59] <gtaylor> You guys would probably get a kick out of this: http://clemsonlinux.org/~gtaylor/gallery/albums/Misc/dscf0551.sized.jpg
[11:59] <gtaylor> And the CDs look nice Riddell