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[12:03] <ogra> motu meeting starts now in #ubuntu-meeting
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[12:16] <lamont> elmo: libgcc2 (hppa) needs to be promoted to main (essential package)
[12:17] <tseng> how's life lamont?
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[12:24] <lamont> hectic, as usual
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[12:29] <Amaranth> yay, new X
[12:30] <lamont> Amaranth: -31 or -32?
[12:30] <Amaranth> -32
[12:31] <chrissturm> this one has the xkb problems fixed
[12:31] <Amaranth> whew
[12:31] <Amaranth> maybe gdm will start in this one too :)
[12:32] <lamont> tomorrow I will have a machine to burn a few cycles on breezy/hppa.  Of course, setting it up will be later in the week. :-(
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[12:33] <Amaranth> damnit
[12:33] <Amaranth> still broken
[12:33] <chrissturm> what does it say?
[12:33] <Amaranth> it just dies
[12:33] <Amaranth> startx works, starting gdm doesn't
[12:34] <chrissturm> /etc/X11/X points to /usr/bin/X11/Xorg ?
[12:34] <Amaranth> yes
[12:35] <Amaranth> sudo /etc/init.d/gdm start looks like it's going to work, X starts and everything, but then it just dies with no info and drops back to a tty
[12:35] <Amaranth> if i try to run anything that uses X it segfaults or has some other error
[12:36] <chrissturm> i386?
[12:36] <Amaranth> gnome-session, xterm, blobwars...
[12:36] <Amaranth> yeah
[12:36] <Amaranth> i guess i should fire up gdb
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[12:38] <Amaranth> gdb is nothing but 0x00000000, doesn't that mean the stack is corrupt?
[12:38] <syndicate> should the version number in debian/changelog be the package revision or the <source-version>-ubuntuN?
[12:38] <Amaranth> i think this RAM i got is dodgy
=== Amaranth goes to memtest
[12:39] <syndicate> I'm building a package for ubuntu and I thought I was doing it right, but dpkg-source -x is bitching about a .tar extension from the .dsc file
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[12:55] <Nafallo> yay! xorg works again :-)
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[01:06] <lamont> later all
[01:09] <thom> mdz: it does /what/?
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[01:13] <mdz> Jun 18 23:20:04 <mdz>   Jun 18 03:10:17 localhost NetworkManager: <information>^IActivation (eth0) failure scheduled...
[01:13] <mdz> Jun 18 23:20:04 <mdz>   Jun 18 03:10:17 localhost NetworkManager: <information>^IActivation (eth0) Stage 3 (IP Configure Start) complete.
[01:13] <mdz> Jun 18 23:20:04 <mdz>   Jun 18 03:10:17 localhost NetworkManager: <information>^IActivation (eth0) failed.
[01:13] <mdz> Jun 18 23:20:23 <mdz>   that sort of thing, repeated a few hundred times per second
[01:13] <mdz> thom: ^^^
[01:14] <lifeless> wooooeeee
[01:15] <thom> mdz: woah.
[01:15] <thom> mdz: i've never seen that before
[01:16] <thom> is this on your T4x?
[01:17] <mdz> thom: T42, yep
[01:17] <ogra> thom, i have that too, but only in 10 second intervals
[01:17] <mdz> I got a 3G syslog and 3G daemon.log from it
[01:17] <thom> mdz: CRACK
[01:18] <mdz> eth0 is the wired interface, too
[01:18] <thom> does it have a wire in it?
[01:18] <mdz> yep
[01:18] <mdz> with link, and a dhcp server, and all the other amenities
[01:18] <thom> that's damn strange
[01:18] <mdz> ifupdown loves it
[01:19] <thom> i'll see if i can replicate on my X in the morning; if not, i'll have to work out how to debug it ;-)
[01:19] <thom> ogra: same symptoms, or is this still your wireless card that doesn't show up as such
[01:19] <ogra> thom, nope, thats my lan card
[01:19] <ogra> (unconnected
[01:20] <ogra> Jun 21 01:15:40 localhost kernel: [11497.323302]  r8169: eth0: PHY reset until link up
[01:21] <thom> ok, i'll look in the morning
[01:26] <Kamion> mdz: ubuntu-devel rescue thread> *laugh*, snap
[01:27] <mdz> you beat me
[01:27] <mdz> Kamion: think we should add rescue to the live CD as well?  it's awfully tiny
[01:28] <Kamion> I thought I already had, but evidently not
[01:28] <Kamion> let me just check whether it pulls in scary dependencies
[01:28] <Kamion> but I think we probably should, yes
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[01:30] <Kamion> it pulls in ext2-modules-*, jfs-modules-*, lvm2-udeb, mdadm-udeb
[01:30] <Kamion> not a lot
[01:32] <Kamion> mdz: added
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[01:34] <mdz> Kamion: thanks
[01:35] <Kamion> mdz: FYI, colin.watson@canonical.com--2005/installer--dists--0 is starting to become useful, although it isn't there yet
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[01:56] <wasabi_> Hmm. If you have two Internet connections on windows, it chooses the fastest, somehow.
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[02:21] <grover> well windows knows each connection's link speed, could that be how?
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[02:35] <schweeb> wasabi_: routing metrics and such
[02:35] <schweeb> probably tests for latency
[02:35] <wasabi_> yeah. i noticed it when I plugged this laptop in, which was on wifi
[02:35] <wasabi_> soon as I plugged the ethernet in, the connection switched to it.
[02:36] <schweeb> oh, I'd bet they just weigh wired over wireless
[02:36] <wasabi_> nope, because i got the bright idea to try 50mb wifi and 10  mbit ethernet
[02:37] <wasabi_> it might be raw connection speed.
[02:37] <wasabi_> like grover suggested. ;)
[02:37] <wasabi_> me->home
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[02:52] <jdub> mdz: ping
[02:52] <mdz> jdub: pong
[02:52] <jdub> morning
[02:53] <jdub> so, i would like to see the devel releases of cairo, gtk and pango in breezy
[02:53] <jdub> there is a chance that they will not be appropriate for release, but upstream are pushing very hard for it
[02:54] <tseng> jdub: hm does seb have it somewhere?
[02:54] <jdub> i figure this should be one of the things we ought to be comfortable backing out closer to release
[02:54] <jdub> tseng: seb has it in a repo on people
[02:54] <tseng> coolness
[02:55] <jdub> however, we don't have a sane way of doing so at the moment, other than fake current-version-new-version versions and forky-ugly epochs
[02:55] <jdub> mdz: what do you suggest? :)
[02:55] <mdz> jdub: I'm not comfortable backing out libraries closer to release
[02:56] <mdz> backing things out in general is not well-supported by our packaging system
[02:56] <jdub> yeah
[02:56] <mdz> they can be packaged external to breezy and brought in if they're going to make it, perhaps
[02:56] <mdz> and people who use that repository can clean up their own mess
[02:56] <jdub> ok, that
[02:56] <jdub> ok, that's what seb's doing atm
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[02:58] <jbailey> jdub: heyhey!
[02:58] <jdub> morning
[02:58] <jbailey> jdub: Feeling brave && have a spare moment?
[03:00] <jdub> oh man, more X
[03:00] <jdub> jbailey: yeah, maybe ;)
[03:00] <jdub> not settled yet, so you may as well unsettle me ;)
[03:00] <jbailey> I might have it so that you don't need to include ide-generic and ide-core in the /etc/mkinitramfs/modules anymore. =)
[03:00] <jdub> woo
[03:01] <jbailey> I'm just doing a quick test here, but if you could do a boot test with it, that would be lovely.
[03:01] <jdub> jbailey: hey, could we have something funky like if you hold down shift at bootup, you get the initramfs prompt?
[03:01] <tseng> jdub: dude, no problems in a few days since i turned off laptop-mode
[03:02] <jdub> tseng: hrm
[03:02] <jbailey> jdub: No, not easily.  If you're holding the key down before the driver is loaded, there won't be a key press event.
[03:02] <tseng> jdub: it must make the dells go all wacky
[03:02] <jdub> tseng: i'm going to re-enable it and see what happens
[03:02] <jbailey> jdub: What I have right now is that if you add 'break' to the kernel command line, it drops you in.
[03:02] <jdub> not that i'm ever off AC at the moment because X is b0rk
[03:02] <jdub> ha ha
[03:03] <jbailey> Thinking of it, I prefer that anyway so that if the bootloader is locked down, you can't break out into the initramfs.
[03:03] <jdub> yeah, true
=== jdub wonders if mdz's xkb changes will fix his keyboard
[03:04] <jbailey> my keyboard is working right again with compose key and ability to switch terminals as of today's update.
[03:05] <jdub> mdz: do the ltsp packages work on hoary?
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[03:11] <whiprush> jdub: fridge me!
[03:11] <tseng> whiprush: BURRR
[03:11] <Amaranth> this sucks
[03:12] <Amaranth> bad ram, X apps seem to hit it
[03:12] <Amaranth> every X app segfaults, X starts fine, cli apps are fine
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[03:38] <mdz> jdub: hmm, hadn't thought about it
[03:38] <mdz> jdub: you'd need a breezy debootstrap script
[03:39] <mdz> the client has to be breezy
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[03:55] <lifeless> mdz: how do I go about getting baz 1.4.2 into breezy ?
[03:55] <mdz> lifeless: upload it?
[03:56] <lifeless> mdz: I didn't think I was on the uploaders keyrging
[03:58] <mdz> lifeless: any number of folks here should be willing to sponsor an upload, but I think we should get at least one or two of your team through the Ubuntu maintainer process
[03:59] <lifeless> mdz: I presume scott is already ?
[03:59] <mdz> hmm, I think so
[04:00] <lifeless> mdz: presuming its on the wiki, I'll start on it myself.
[04:00] <lifeless> does DD status infer automatic Ubuntu status ? (I'm guessing no)
[04:01] <mdz> lifeless: not automatically, but it's a strong endorsement
[04:01] <lifeless> well, I'm 9th in the queue now ;)
[04:01] <lifeless> another 6 months or so and I'll either get rejected or accepted.
[04:01] <mdz> lifeless: verified, Keybuk is in the maintainer keyring
[04:01] <lifeless> cool, thanks
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[05:19] <jdub> jbailey: upping to your new initramfs-tools now :)
[05:21] <robitaille> mako,  have you seen the 3 posts today on the ubuntu-users mailing list about people receiving bad Hoary's CDs?  
[05:25] <mako> robitaille: no.. thanks for pointing it out to me.. 
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[05:54] <schweeb> mako: poke
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[06:12] <fabbione> morning
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[06:19] <mako> schweeb: hello
[06:19] <schweeb> mako: did we ever figure out whether I was all good on my CoC
[06:20] <mako> schweeb: i have a signed coc from you and you're marked.. i think the issue was that your key was unsigned
[06:20] <mako> schweeb: that's fine for membershipo
[06:20] <mako> schweeb: not good enough for maintainership
[06:20] <fabbione> hey mako
[06:20] <schweeb> mako: whip's key should be fine for that, shouldn't it? his is signed by yours, and mine is signed by his
[06:21] <mako> schweeb: ok.. let me reimport your key and check
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[08:32] <mdz> jdub: a menu editor is happening upstream, right?
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[08:33] <Amaranth> mdz: GNOME has one, I have one, someone else has one
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[08:39] <brodmann> does anyone have planeshift installed?
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[08:41] <fabbione> daniels: ping?
[08:42] <fabbione> daniels: x11proto-randr-dev: /usr/include/X11/extensions/randr.h
[08:42] <fabbione> daniels: libxrandr-dev: /usr/X11R6/include/X11/extensions/Xrandr.h
[08:43] <fabbione> aren't they supposed to land in the same dir?
[08:43] <fabbione> (breaks qt-xfree XRandR build check)
[08:44] <jdub> mdz: nothing has been proposed for inclusion with gnome itself thus far
[08:46] <Amaranth> jdub: markmc didn't put up gmenu-simple-editor for inclusion?
[08:46] <jdub> not thus far
[08:52] <Burgundavia> mdz, who is working on wireless stuff?
[08:53] <mdz> Burgundavia: http://udu.wiki.ubuntu.com/WirelessNetworkManagement
[08:53] <mdz> and http://udu.wiki.ubuntu.com/NetworkMagic
[08:54] <thom> morning!
[08:55] <drbyte> ok, this is just embarassing. i bought a new laptop hard disk, and don't have fedora core 4 cd's lying around for x86. looks like Ubuntu Hoary wins this time !
[08:55] <bob2> it was only a matter of time.
[08:55] <drbyte> bob2: yes, yes, that it was
[08:56] <mdz> "embarrassing"?  that's an odd way to describe it
[08:56] <mdz> especialy in the Ubuntu development channel
[08:56] <mdz> s/ly/lly/
[08:56] <drbyte> mdz: hi mdz :)
[08:56] <Burgundavia> mdz, did you have any thoughts on http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=43147
=== drbyte used to be known as cc... maybe now you
[08:56] <drbyte> 'd remember
[08:56] <Burgundavia> they are asking for a unstable version of the software
[08:57] <mdz> drbyte: hehe
[08:57] <mdz> Burgundavia: kernel-team@lists or #ubuntu-kernel
[08:57] <mdz> but I doubt the kernel team will want to integrate pre-release versions of the driver unless there is a specific reason
[08:57] <mdz> (i.e., not "it's newer")
[08:57] <thom> Burgundavia: when 28 is released, they can have it; till then, suggest patience
[08:58] <thom> mdz: this is libiw rather than kernel driver
[08:58] <Burgundavia> thom, ok, just trying to bridge the forums<-->developers communication gap
[08:58] <mdz> thom: shame on me for taking the post at face value :-P
[08:58] <thom> mdz: *g*
[08:58] <jdub> itym chasm thx hand
[08:59] <Burgundavia> thom, do you think that will make UVF?
[08:59] <thom> Burgundavia: i think for things like that unless there's a _really_ good reason then we're gonna stick with released software
[08:59] <thom> Burgundavia: meh, no clue
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[09:00] <mdz> night all
[09:00] <thom> night dude
[09:01] <fabbione> night mdz
[09:03] <fabbione> thom: hey.. you are up early
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=== fabbione fixes qt-free FTBFS
[09:04] <Treenaks> \o/
[09:05] <fabbione> infinity: you around?
[09:06] <thom> fabbione: yes; going to go watch some more rugby on the tv in a minute :-) damned kiwis and their silly TZ
[09:06] <fabbione> ehhehe
[09:06] <jdub> gar gar GAR GAR GAR!
[09:07] <jdub> i still can't type in X
[09:07] <jdub> though it worked very momentarily at one point
[09:07] <fabbione> oh CRAP
[09:07] <fabbione> we need a new version of udev before i can upload 2.6.12 final
[09:07] <jdub> daniels: ping
=== fabbione puts away the kernel for half day
[09:10] <fabbione> infinity: ping?
[09:10] <jdub> mdz: in your xkb investigations, did you see anything like this:
[09:10] <jdub> The XKEYBOARD keymap compiler (xkbcomp) reports:
[09:10] <jdub> > Warning:          Multiple interpretations of "NoSymbol+AnyOfOrNone(all)"
[09:10] <jdub> 
[09:10] <jdub> expected keysym, got XF86_Switch_VT_1: line 51 of pc/pc
[09:10] <jdub> expected keysym, got XF86_Switch_VT_2: line 55 of pc/pc
[09:10] <jdub> 
[09:11] <jdub> ?
[09:12] <jdub> $ dpkg -S /usr/lib/X11/xkb/README
[09:12] <jdub> dpkg: /usr/lib/X11/xkb/README not found.
[09:12] <jdub> $ dpkg -S /usr/lib/X11/xkb/compat/complete
[09:12] <jdub> dpkg: /usr/lib/X11/xkb/compat/complete not found.
[09:12] <jdub> boh
[09:14] <torkel> dpkg -S /etc/X11/xkb/README
[09:14] <torkel> xlibs: /etc/X11/xkb/README
[09:14] <jdub> ahr
[09:17] <jdub> hrm, and the symlinks seem correct
[09:17] <jdub> this is very annoying
=== jdub disables xkb :-)
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[10:04] <Kamion> fabbione: Md seemed actively non-keen on debian-release yesterday to upload the current upstream udev
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[10:06] <fabbione> Kamion: we might be safe actually..
[10:06] <fabbione> a lot of reports were coming from people using 0.30
[10:06] <fabbione> some people were ok with 0.56 (that we have)
[10:06] <fabbione> i need to dig it more
[10:07] <fabbione> Kamion: i am afraid ppc won't get unionfs
[10:07] <fabbione> Kamion: it's a gcc ICE with 3.3/3.4/4.0
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[10:26] <Keybuk> . o O { I swear I only upgraded Xorg yesterday }
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[10:37] <fabbione> there... libggi FTBFS fixed...
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[10:54] <pitti> Good morning
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[10:56] <fabbione> hey pitti
[10:59] <seb128> hello pitti fabbione 
[10:59] <fabbione> hey Seb
[10:59] <pitti> Moin seb128 
[11:01] <mvo> hey pitti, seb128, fabbione :)
[11:02] <pitti> hi mvo
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[11:03] <jsgotangco> sabdfl, hi
[11:04] <HiddenWolf> pitti, try 145^2
[11:04] <pitti> Moin sabdfl
[11:04] <fabbione> hey sabdfl 
[11:04] <pitti> HiddenWolf: no, it should be (145+146)/2
[11:05] <pitti> HiddenWolf: well, ok, it's symmetric
[11:05] <Treenaks> pitti: ((145+156)/2) - x (where x = people who said "hi all"
[11:05] <mvo> hey sabdfl 
[11:06] <doko> pitti: OOo2 build-deps?
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[11:25] <jdthood> pitti: ping
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[11:28] <jdthood> Just wondering what plans are for syncing the alsa packages with Debian.
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[11:30] <jdthood> Also, how do y'all feel about alsa-tools?  FYI We recently imported Mikael Magnusson's experimental alsa-tools into the pkg-alsa svn archive at alioth.  Is this something that Ubuntu users want?
[11:31] <pitti> Hi jdthood 
[11:31] <Lathiat> So, pmount doesn't think my usb hdd is removable, how can find out why
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[11:31] <pitti> jdthood: oh, is some package out of date? I did some merges recently
[11:31] <trygvebw> hm
[11:31] <trygvebw> anyone know what's happened to the wiki?
[11:32] <pitti> Lathiat: you don't use 2.6.12 final by change?
[11:32] <pitti> chance, even?
[11:32] <Lathiat> pitti: yeh i do
[11:32] <Treenaks> trygvebw: it was upgraded?
[11:32] <pitti> Lathiat: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=314985
[11:32] <jdthood> pitti: We've released ALSA 1.0.9
[11:32] <jsgotangco> the wiki just died
[11:32] <jsgotangco> yaahhh
[11:32] <trygvebw> Treenaks: to MoinMoin, yes, but it's dead now
[11:32] <jsgotangco> and i was doing stuff on it
[11:32] <jsgotangco> grr
[11:32] <pitti> Lathiat: that's actually a libsysfs bug, I'll fix it soon
[11:32] <jsgotangco> we now get an internal server error
[11:32] <Lathiat> pitti: ok cool
[11:32] <Lathiat> pitti: just making sure its a knownj problem
[11:33] <pitti> jdthood: we synced alsa-lib, and actually I also merged alsa-driver, but it seems that there was a problem
[11:33] <jsgotangco> trygvebw, wiki still dead on your side?
[11:34] <jdthood> pitti: /etc/init.d/alsa changed again, but the goal is to reduce the diff with Ubuntu
[11:34] <trygvebw> jsgotangco: ill check
[11:34] <pitti> jdthood: I noticed that you left the lsb* stuff commented, thanks for that
[11:34] <trygvebw> yep
[11:34] <trygvebw> shows the moin error page
[11:35] <jsgotangco> that's great i was in the middle of a huge wiki page updateon project status :(
[11:35] <jdthood> pitti: It's there for your benefit and for our own if it is decided that Debian will implement the lsb functions.
[11:35] <pitti> jdthood: btw, in postgresql-common's init script, I use the lsb* functions if available, otherwise I use the standard Debian method; this allows me to have the same packages for Ubuntu and Debian
[11:35] <trygvebw> jsgotangco: :/
[11:36] <jdthood> pitti: That's something I have considered.  However, I really hate scripts written for multiple distros.  On the other hand, Debian and Ubuntu are cousins, so....
[11:36] <pitti> jdthood: really odd, I *know* I merged alsa-driver, now I can't find it in the archive...
=== pitti investigates
[11:37] <jdthood> Warning: the new alsa-lib triggers a bug in esd.  The bug is reportedly fixed in the latest esound upstream release; however the Debian esound maintainer is being very silent.
[11:38] <pitti> jdthood: I know, that's why we kicked esd for now and use gstreamer->alsa directly
[11:38] <pitti> jdthood: I worked a bit on polypaudio, maybe we'll replace esd entirely
[11:39] <jdthood> pitti: Are you currently using gstreamer to combine audio streams?
[11:40] <pitti> jdthood: no, that's done by dmix
[11:42] <jdthood> pitti: How is dmix working for you?
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[11:43] <jdthood> pitti: dmix doesn't work on my system; I simply get no sound out.  Judging from the ALSA BTS I'd say that dmix isn't fully mature yet.
[11:43] <pitti> jdthood: pretty fine, and I didn't hear any complaints by now
[11:43] <pitti> jdthood: right, that's why I'd rather like to stabilize polypaudio
[11:43] <jdthood> pitti: alsa-lib 1.0.9 engages dmix by default for certain drivers and not for others.  Are you following that?
[11:44] <pitti> jdthood: yes, but since it seems to work for the majority of people, it's a huge improvement over sarge/hoary
[11:45] <pitti> jdthood: for those which it doesn't work for, it is no regression (since one stream should always work)
[11:45] <jdthood> pitti: For me (cs46xx), engaging dmix totally mutes all sound.
[11:45] <pitti> uh
[11:46] <jdthood> However, dmix isn't engaged by default for cs46xx (I infer from the fact that without a .asoundrc I do get sound).
[11:46] <jdthood> pitti: Another thought.  The 1.0.9b-2 release of alsa-driver adds control files for reportbug.  Ubuntu will probably want to modify these.
[11:46] <pitti> jdthood: silly me, I prepared the upload, but didn't actualyl upload it (my net was down at that moment)
[11:47] <jdthood> pitti: You might want to sync with 1.0.9b-2 first then.  :)
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[11:47] <pitti> well, I upload this one now
[11:47] <pitti> and merge the new version, yes
[11:47] <jdthood> pitti: So, any comments about alsa-tools?
[11:47] <pitti> I didn't take a look at it yet
[11:48] <jdthood> Is there any clamour for this package?
[11:48] <pitti> hm, p.d.o/alsa-tools doesn't exist???
[11:48] <jdthood> jordi and I need to look the package over.  I am sorta wondering how high on our list of priorities this should be.
[11:49] <jdthood> pitti: alsa-tools is in svn but we haven't released it yet.
[11:49] <pitti> ah, ok
[11:49] <pitti> what is it about?
[11:50] <jdthood> Description: collection of tools for ALSA:   ac3dec - A free AC-3 stream decoder, as10k1 - An assembler for the EMU10K1 (EMU10K2) DSP chip, sbiload - OPL2/3 FM instrument loader for the ALSA sequencer, us428control - Controller utility for Tascam US-X2Y
[11:51] <pitti> ah
[11:51] <pitti> jdthood: would something like Ubuntu's "set-default-soundcard" fit in there? Ubuntu currently ships it in alsa-base
[11:51] <pitti> jdthood: it is meant and used as a backend for gnome-audio-properties and possibly other UI frontends, but can be used on its own, of course
[11:52] <pitti> jdthood: the tools sound nice, it is at least something we would want in universe, I guess
[11:52] <doko> pitti: OOo2 build-deps?
[11:52] <jdthood> pitti: alsa-tools generates 7 binary packages in all.  All of the "tools" seem to be hardware-specific.
[11:53] <pitti> doko: ECONTEXT ?
[11:53] <doko> universe->main
[11:53] <jdthood> pitti: I don't think that there is anything in there like set-default-soundcard.
[11:53] <pitti> jdthood: hm, I think it's better suited in -base
[11:54] <pitti> jdthood: it's easy to do in ubuntu since we have python-minimal as required package
[11:54] <Kamion> alsa-base isn't in Debian's base system so that doesn't make much difference
[11:54] <pitti> doko: can you please put the necessary packages on https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/UbuntuMainInclusionQueue ?
[11:55] <pitti> Kamion: I know, but in Debian we would require a dependency to python (the full suite)
[11:55] <Kamion> yeah, but that's already in standard
[11:55] <jdthood> pitti: We'd like to have s-d-s in Debian, but for the reason you just mentioned we'd be reluctant to include it in alsa-base.  I am thinking of adding it to alsa-debian-utils, but am open to suggestions.
[11:55] <jdthood> (i.e. to a new package called 'alsa-debian-utils')
[11:55] <Kamion> any default Debian installation will already have it
[11:55] <pitti> jdthood: I don't know whether we will have p-m in Debian eventually (would be nice for many other purposes, too)
[11:58] <trygvebw> wiki is re up
[11:58] <doko> pitti: they are there
[11:58] <pitti> ok
[11:58] <seb128> ogra: no code change for almost 2 years, doesn't seems to be a very active project no
[11:59] <jordi> jdthood: also, I expect to have python-minimal soonish after the c++ transition
[11:59] <jordi> doko might tell us if he has ideas about this
[11:59] <ogra> seb128, sad... i think we had something like that on the goals page
[11:59] <pitti> that would bre great
[11:59] <ogra> seb128, and i could need a easy backup tool for edubuntu
[11:59] <jordi> but hopefully in not too much time we'll be able to shit s-d-s in -base
[12:00] <ogra> seb128, do you know about alternatives ?
[12:00] <seb128> nop
[12:00] <ogra> :/
[12:00] <ogra> seb128, ta
[12:00] <seb128> np
[12:00] <jordi> who's going to attend the Edubuntu meeting next month?
[12:00] <ogra> jordi, me
[12:00] <jsgotangco> awesome
[12:00] <jdthood> How small is python-minimal?
[12:00] <jordi> ogra: my boss asked me if I had plans for that WE
[12:01] <jdthood> Will anyone with a stipped-down installation be annoyed if alsa-base drags in python-minimal?
[12:01] <ogra> jordi, so do you have plans ? want t come ?
[12:01] <ogra> to even
[12:01] <jordi> jdthood: 2M installed
[12:02] <jordi> ogra: I'll probably be there yeah
[12:02] <ogra> yay, great
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[12:02] <elmo> jdthood: python-minimal is (virtually, if not in reality) Essential: yes in Ubuntu
[12:02] <ogra> jordi, subscribe to edubuntu-devel if you like (very low traffic)
[12:03] <daniels> jdub: pong
[12:04] <daniels> fabbione: not necessarily, they're two different components, but I'll be moving libxrandr-dev next week
[12:04] <jordi> ogra: k
[12:05] <daniels> mdz: i'll do the best I can.  think I have a good idea of where it is now, but my video BIOS is so catastrophically screwed that I can't even start X -- the BIOS tries to execute totally invalid code.
[12:06] <daniels> mdz: itmt, sudo chvt 1
[12:06] <fabbione> daniels: no problem. i fixed the qt-x11-free check to search for the 2 includes in different directories
[12:06] <daniels> thanks
[12:06] <jdthood> jordi, pitti: set-default-soundcard actually shouldn't be in alsa-base since it is a utility for setting up the .asoundrc file, which is a libasound2 thing.
[12:07] <pitti> hm, right
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[12:07] <jordi> point
[12:08] <jordi> jdthood: that might give us an excuse to move aserver to another binary package :)
[12:08] <jdthood> Currently alsa-base Depends on alsa-utils which Depends on libasound2 so the point isn't very strong, but it is something we should think about.
[12:08] <jdthood> libasound2, on the other hand, doesn't Depend on alsa-base.
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[12:09] <jordi> back later, break time
[12:09] <Kamion> binaries shouldn't be in libasound2 though, unless they're versioned (ugh)
[12:09] <jdthood> jordi: We could annoy the ftpmasters with another attempt to split libasound2.  :)
[12:10] <pitti> "alsa-base - ALSA driver configuration files" - that doesn't seem too bad for putting set-default-soundcard into...
[12:10] <jordi> jdthood: our last attempt was a different one tho :)
[12:10] <jordi> -rw-r--r--  1 jordi jordi 21524 2004-12-01 18:52 libasound2-data_1.0.7-1_all.deb
[12:10] <jordi> this was evil :)
[12:10] <jdthood> Kamion: Right.
[12:11] <jdthood> jordi: In theory we need to create libasound2-runtime for aserver and libasound2-utils for s-d-s.
[12:12] <jdthood> The former being Arch: any and the latter being Arch: all.
[12:12] <pitti> bah
[12:12] <jdthood> snippety-snip!
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[12:15] <jdthood> In practice it would be better to create one new package, libasound2-utils, with aserver and s-d-s in it and Depending on python or python-minimal.
[12:16] <pitti> jdthood: btw, the idea of p-minimal was to be a required package, thus you don't need to depend on it.
[12:16] <jdthood> Oh
[12:17] <pitti> jdthood: I merged the new alsa-driver, that was pretty easy. thanks for adopting so much :-)
[12:17] <jdthood> pitti: The diff is smaller now?
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[12:18] <daniels> Kamion: uhm, so I think the thing to do with xterm might be for me to put up modular sources for you
[12:18] <daniels> Kamion: since my video BIOS is just utterly screwed
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[12:21] <pitti> jdthood: yep, the mixer saving default change went away, now it's only set-default-soundcard and the LSB init script
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[12:21] <jdthood> Given that alsa-base already Depends indirectly on libasound2 and is Arch: all, I think it's reasonable to leave s-d-s there if python-minimal is to become required.  If python-minimal isn't to become required then I'd prefer to add libasound2-utils so that people can have alsa-base without python.
[12:22] <jdthood> I guess we'll wait a while to see what happens with p-m in Debian.
[12:22] <Kamion> daniels: ok, I could probably deal with that
[12:22] <Kamion> daniels: is it just a "test, tweak, test, upload" matter?
[12:23] <pitti> elmo: please merge exim4, php4-pgsql, libapache2-mod-auth-pgsql, prelink
[12:23] <fabbione> elmo: do you happen to know how did request libgtk2-perl sync from experimental?
[12:23] <elmo> fabbione: the breezy-changes archive, should tell you?
[12:23] <daniels> Kamion: yeah
[12:24] <elmo> pitti: josie doesn't see anything newer for php4-phsql
[12:24] <elmo> doing the others
[12:24] <elmo> pgsql too
[12:24] <pitti> elmo: thanks; I already asked for that yesterday, maybe you already did it?
[12:26] <fabbione> seb128: is there any reason why we need libgtk2-perl from experimental?
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[12:27] <seb128> fabbione: why not?
[12:27] <seb128> fabbione: that's the version that matches the current GNOME API basically
[12:27] <fabbione> seb128: because it's FTBFS :)
[12:27] <fabbione> elmo: can you please sync  libglib-perl from experimental (Build-Dep for libgtk2-perl)
[12:27] <elmo> pitti: AFAICT, I synced it to match Debian, 09/06
[12:27] <elmo> + on your request
[12:28] <pitti> ah, thanks
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[12:30] <elmo> fabbione: done
[12:30] <\sh> hmm...anyone has a pointer to the actual frozenapps list  from aconrad? the link http://lucifer.0c3.net/~adconrad/frozenapps.txt doesn't work anymore ;)
[12:30] <fabbione> elmo: thanks.
[12:30] <fabbione> jamesh: ask doko.
[12:30] <fabbione> ops
[12:30] <fabbione> \sh
=== terrex bye
[12:32] <\sh> hehee
[12:32] <ogra> \sh, or ask mr conrad :)
=== \sh needs a list of all nicks -> real names *sigh*
[12:33] <ogra> \sh, he is a bit infinitive sometimes 
[12:33] <\sh> yeah;)
[12:33] <infinity> \sh : Oh, crap.  I blew up lucifer's power supply today, hence the URL being nonfunctional.
[12:34] <infinity> fabbione : Really late pong, see above.
[12:35] <fabbione> infinity: no problem.. the auto anti dep-waiter did its job
[12:35] <fabbione> infinity: but if you want to have fun, ghc6 is still FTBFS :)
[12:35] <\sh> hmmm...that's why I hate xchat...konversation puts the realnames (if they are there), next to the nicks...but xchat doesn't do it by default *grmpf*
[12:35] <fabbione> infinity: forcing the build-dep brings you one step forward
[12:35] <fabbione> infinity: but it fails a lot later with some complains about lvalue (all arches)
[12:36] <seb128> \sh: where?
[12:36] <infinity> fabbione : Ahh, that can probably be fixed easily enough.
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[12:37] <\sh> seb128, konversation is doing a whois from time to time and if you have your realname provided in your whois information, it puts it in the channeluserlist next to the nick...
[12:37] <fabbione> infinity: exactly.. but i don't know how
[12:38] <seb128> \sh: right click on the nickname with xchat and go on the first line
[12:38] <seb128> \sh: you have the realname here
[12:38] <\sh> seb128, yeah...but this is one click too many for me :)
[12:38] <infinity> fabbione : I probably do.  Can you pester me about it tomorrow (say, in 12-16 hours) after I get lucifer back up?
[12:38] <fabbione> infinity: sure
[12:38] <martink> \sh: or, if you are scanning the whole users list, 152 too many ;-)
=== \sh is a bloody lazy bastard sometimes and information at your fingertips should be default ;)
[12:39] <seb128> \sh: you want to use the real name instead of the nicknames?
[12:39] <infinity> seb128 : It's handy for reverse mapping.  In this case, he couldn't remember who "Adam Conrad" was, for instance.
[12:39] <infinity> (I don't blame him I always forget who that guy is too...)
[12:39] <fabbione> infinity: i am trying to solve a few tons of FTBFS and merging problems atm.. i need to wait Md to upload a new upstream version of udev before i can actually think to upload 2.6.12 :(
[12:39] <infinity> s/him/him,/
[12:40] <daniels> infinity: dunno, but there are photos of him all over the web
[12:40] <\sh> infinity, right...
[12:40] <infinity> daniels : I'm trying to remedy that.
[12:40] <\sh> jdub needs to adjust the feed 
[12:40] <infinity> \sh : I assume you've figured it out by now. :)
[12:41] <\sh> infinity, yeah ;) big yellow note: INFINITY == ADAM CONRAD => master of frozenapps ,-> 
[12:43] <infinity> \sh : Is the missing text file slowing you down in any way right now?
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[12:44] <\sh> infinty: i wanted to clean up the cxx list today, to have a good overview whats missing and what not...(clean up the wiki page as well), but if you have some infos about the dep-waits i don't need the list at all..send it to me via query or mail or IM :)
[12:44] <infinity> Oh, look. A backup of my homedir.  How handy.
[12:44] <infinity> \sh : http://jerm.0c3.net/~adconrad/frozenapps.txt
[12:44] <\sh> infinity, wow thx 
=== infinity makes a mental note to put his ~ in revision control soon.
[12:45] <infinity> I think the last few weeks have finally tipped me over the edge to joeyh's way of thinking.
[12:45] <infinity> Which scares me.
[12:45] <daniels> \sh: INFINITY == ADAM CONRAD => THE GUY WHO FIXES XORG WHEN DANIEL'S NOT AROUND
[12:45] <infinity> daniels : Dear god, no.
[12:45] <\sh> daniels, no..thats ogra ;-)
[12:45] <Kamion> ~ in revision control is the One True Way and you know it
[12:45] <infinity> Kamion : How long have you been doing it?
[12:46] <Kamion> infinity: about three years
[12:46] <infinity> Wow.  So, since daniels was, like, 12.
[12:46] <Kamion> :-)
=== daniels kicks infinity.
[12:46] <chmj> heheh 
[12:46] <ogra> heh
[12:47] <daniels> infinity: don't take it out on me, just because you're decrepit
[12:47] <\sh> daniels, and what about my pictures? I'm a pretty nice 34 year old guy, so best age to marry ;)
[12:48] <daniels> heh
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[12:52] <thom> mmm, i need to finish ramming all my ~s into version control
[12:52] <daniels> do any of you guys have a machine with DOS and a floppy handy?
[12:52] <pitti> Kamion: you do automatic daily commits for your ~ then?
[12:52] <daniels> i need to run this stupid DOS utility that wants to write an image to a disk
[12:52] <pitti> daniels: I have a DOS boot disk here
[12:53] <daniels> pitti: any chance I could convince you to grab an IBM utility, write the update to a disk, and then take a disk image?
[12:53] <daniels> i think I'm going to have to partition my iAudio and just write the image out raw
[12:53] <Kamion> pitti: hell no
[12:53] <daniels> ugh
[12:53] <infinity> daniels : That's what vmware is for.
[12:53] <Kamion> pitti: (I just do dotfiles, ~/bin, and random other stuff as it takes my fancy)
[12:54] <daniels> infinity: yeah, that's a great idea.  let me just fire up X ...
[12:54] <Kamion> pitti: the importance for me is easy synchronisation across machines, so automatic daily commits would get very confusing
[12:54] <pitti> Kamion: I have an automatic incremental network backup for my ~, with a conffile that skips certain directories; that works very well, so how is bazaar-~ better?
[12:54] <pitti> Kamion: ah, ok
[12:54] <Kamion> pitti: again, it's not backup I care about, it's synchronisation
[12:54] <Kamion> and it's not bazaar because I value my sanity :-)
[12:54] <pitti> Kamion: right, that's a different use case then
[12:55] <Kamion> well, there's some backup as a happy side effect, but it's not really the core purpose
[12:56] <Kamion> for now, svn is a better model for home directories, I think; I suppose bzr may be there one day
[12:56] <pitti> Kamion: btw, I use bzr now for pmount, it works pretty well (although I still miss "push" and "merge", but I can live without that for the moment)
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[01:12] <pitti> daniels: what do you mean with "take disk image"?
[01:12] <pitti> daniels: will that mess up my hd?
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[01:14] <daniels> pitti: it's OK, I got someone else to do it, but thanks :)
[01:14] <infinity> pitti : dd if=/dev/fd0 of=fordaniels.bin
[01:14] <daniels> right
[01:14] <pitti> ah, that's easy
[01:15] <pitti> daniels: I was scared by "write update to the disk", I thought you meant my hd :-)
[01:16] <daniels> heh :)
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[01:16] <hunger> fabbione: You are working on the 2.6.12 kernel debs, aren't you?
[01:17] <fabbione> hunger: yes
[01:18] <hunger> fabbione: Are you patching the sources or are you using the vanilla kernel?
[01:18] <fabbione> hunger: vanilla + a few patches
[01:19] <hunger> fabbione: I found a patch that is supposed to give me a working TPM module (testing it right now) and was wondering whether you would consider adding that.
[01:19] <hunger> fabbione: If it works that is;-)
[01:19] <fabbione> hunger: file an enanchement bug on bugzilla please. Package linux
[01:19] <hunger> fabbione: OK, will do. If the patch really works;-)
[01:22] <elmo> how do people deal with el-lamo VCS that leave crap in the working tree?  (.svn/{arch}), grep's --exclude isn't working for me, or I'm being particularly spethial
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[01:23] <pitti> elmo: I have a script ~/bin/arch-debuild which tars up {arch} and similar dirs, calls debuild, and untars them again
[01:23] <elmo> boggle
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[01:24] <pitti> elmo: yes, it's crude, but WFM
[01:27] <Kamion> er ... isn't it easier to use dpkg-buildpackage's built-in support for excluding that stuff?
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[01:28] <Keybuk> it can only do it for the diff
[01:28] <Keybuk> doesn't work for natives
[01:28] <Kamion> Keybuk: not true, use -I
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[01:28] <Kamion> I know it works 'cos I use it all the time
[01:29] <Keybuk> so doesn't ;)
[01:29] <Kamion> the entire installer is native
[01:29] <Kamion> and most of us upload it out of revision-controlled trees
[01:29] <Keybuk> ah, to dpkg-buildpackage not dpkg-source ?
[01:29] <Kamion> oh, sorry, yeah, dpkg-source, foo
[01:29] <Keybuk> yeah
[01:29] <Keybuk> sorry, I'll put my brain in gear :p
[01:30] <Kamion> but dpkg-buildpackage passes those args through to dpkg-source
[01:30] <Keybuk> it does
[01:30] <pitti> ah, neat
[01:30] <Keybuk> and dpkg-source to tar
[01:30] <Kamion> elmo: I have a wcgrep script I borrowed from the subversion upstream repository and modified
[01:31] <Kamion> elmo: http://svn.collab.net/repos/svn/trunk/contrib/client-side/wcgrep
[01:31] <Keybuk> (whereas it handles -i itself, but only for the diff)
[01:31] <Kamion> elmo: I made the fairly obvious modifications to deal with {arch}
[01:32] <Kamion> -find $pathargs -regex ${WCGREP_IGNORE:-'.*~$\|.*/\.svn\(/\|$\)'} -prune -o \
[01:32] <Kamion> +find $pathargs -regex ${WCGREP_IGNORE:-'.*~$\|.*/\(\.svn\|\{arch\}\)\(/\|$\)'} -prune -o \
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[01:54] <fabbione> seb128: ping?
[01:55] <seb128> pong
[01:55] <fabbione> seb128: any idea what package has the G_PARAM_PRIVATE definition?
[01:55] <fabbione> (http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/libg/libglib-perl/1:1.091-1/)
[01:56] <doko> ogra: 10975 ping
[01:57] <lifeless> fabbione: its gobject isn't it ?
[01:57] <fabbione> lifeless: no idea.. i am pretty sure the failure is a missing b-d
[01:58] <ogra> doko, ?
[01:58] <doko> ogra: b.u.c, the patch is missing from the PR, nothing is uploaded. hope you didn't clean your disk in the meantime
[01:58] <lifeless> fabbione:  /usr/include/glib-2.0/gobject/gparam.h 
[01:58] <fabbione> lifeless: thanks
[01:59] <ogra> doko, i wanst even aware that is mine... i thought \sh grabbed my leftovers... let me have a look
[02:00] <fabbione> lifeless: are you sure??
[02:00] <fabbione> # grep G_PARAM_PRIVATE /usr/include/glib-2.0/gobject/gparam.h
[02:00] <fabbione> root@gordian:/usr/include # 
[02:00] <lifeless> grep G_PARAM /usr/include/glib-2.0/gobject/gparam.h 
[02:00] <lifeless> #ifndef __G_PARAM_H__
[02:00] <lifeless> #define __G_PARAM_H__
[02:00] <lifeless> #define G_PARAM_SPEC(pspec)             (G_TYPE_CHECK_INSTANCE_CAST ((pspec), G_TYPE_PARAM, GParamSpec))
[02:00] <lifeless> ...
[02:00] <\sh> doko, no :)
[02:00] <\sh> aeh
[02:00] <fabbione> lifeless: there is no PRIVATE 
[02:00] <\sh> ogra: no
[02:00] <lifeless> oh
[02:00] <lifeless> bah
[02:00] <lifeless> ,,,
[02:00] <ogra> \sh, ok
[02:00] <lifeless>   G_PARAM_PRIVATE             = 1 << 5
[02:00] <lifeless> #define G_PARAM_READWRITE       (G_PARAM_READABLE | G_PARAM_WRITABLE)
[02:00] <lifeless> #define G_PARAM_MASK            (0x000000ff)
[02:00] <lifeless> #define G_PARAM_USER_SHIFT      (8)
[02:01] <lifeless> same file
[02:01] <fabbione> lifeless: is that hoary??
[02:01] <seb128> fabbione: the question is not what file should ship it, but why the current version doesn't
[02:01] <lifeless> yes
[02:01] <fabbione> lifeless: i need for breezy
[02:01] <lifeless> fabbione: ah, I'm guessing an API change
[02:01] <lifeless> fabbione: not a new package
[02:01] <fabbione> seb128: or that too.. i assumed that the include was splitted or something
[02:01] <seb128> fabbione: http://mail.gnome.org/archives/gtk-perl-list/2005-June/msg00052.html
[02:03] <fabbione> seb128: ok thanks. can you please take a look if it has been re-added and if so upload a new glib2.0 version?
[02:03] <fabbione> seb128: that stuff is needed for the libglib-perl and libgtk2-perl :)
[02:03] <seb128> fabbione: I'll fix it in a few min
[02:03] <fabbione> seb128: i know you rock man
[02:03] <seb128> thanks :)
[02:04] <fabbione> on the othersise i need it to fix FTBFS from your sync :P
[02:04] <fabbione> s/sise/side
[02:06] <doko> Get:1 http://archive.ubuntu.com breezy/universe freefem 3.5.7-3 (dsc) [697B] 
[02:06] <doko> Get:2 http://archive.ubuntu.com breezy/universe freefem 3.5.7-3 (tar) [888kB] 
[02:06] <doko> Fetched 889kB in 3s (274kB/s)
[02:06] <doko> dpkg-source: error: unrecognised file suffix `.tar'
[02:06] <doko> Unpack command 'dpkg-source -x freefem_3.5.7-3.dsc' failed.
[02:06] <doko> E: Child process failed
[02:06] <doko> Keybuk: any fix/workaround?
[02:06] <Keybuk> unpack it yourself?
[02:07] <fabbione> seb128: do you have any pending upload for gksu ?
[02:07] <Keybuk> I have a fixed version, but no time to test it this week
[02:07] <Kamion> doko: make a non-broken source package next time :)
[02:08] <doko> Kamion: not my packages, so upload an .orig instead of the native tarball anyway?
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[02:09] <Kamion> I wouldn't invent an .orig
[02:09] <Kamion> probably best wait for the dpkg fix, or get the patch off Keybuk and test it
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[02:11] <Keybuk> was that deliberately native, or yet another example of a non-native with a missing .orig for that upload?
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[02:12] <doko> Keybuk: the former
[02:12] <Keybuk> why did it have a revision# then?
[02:13] <doko> Keybuk: don't know, last touched in Jan 2004
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[02:14] <Keybuk> I'm still not convinced that should be valid
[02:14] <Kamion>  doesn't sound valid to me
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[02:15] <Kamion> but dpkg-source needs to keep on supporting it - at best maybe refuse to build new source packages like that
[02:15] <seb128> fabbione: glib fixed package uploaded
[02:15] <Keybuk> yeah
[02:15] <fabbione> seb128: cool
[02:15] <doko> Kamion: so just wait for the fix
[02:15] <seb128> fabbione: I've built libglib-perl with it here, works fine now
[02:15] <Keybuk> the fix is in arch, just not uploaded
[02:16] <fabbione> seb128: perfect... i will ask infinity/elmo to kick back after glibc is propagated
[02:16] <fabbione> seb128: gksu is FTBFS.. do you plan an upload or can i do?
[02:16] <jbailey> fabbione: Eh?
[02:16] <seb128> fabbione: that's not glibc but glib :)
[02:16] <fabbione> meh yeah
[02:16] <fabbione> sorry
[02:16] <seb128> fabbione: that's mvo's
[02:16] <fabbione> seb128: ok thanks
[02:16] <fabbione> mvo: ping?
[02:17] <fabbione> jbailey-gcc: n0 ph34r :)
[02:17] <jbailey> My spidey sences were tingling.
[02:17] <jbailey> fabbione: Hmm, I wonder how to setup extra nick highlights in irssi.
[02:17] <mvo> fabbione: gksu? I think there is a open merge that I'll attack today
[02:17] <mvo> I can fix the FTBFS along the way
[02:17] <seb128> jbailey: hey :) What is the difference between cleanbuilddir:: and clean:: ? :)
[02:17] <jbailey> I'm trying the trick of running it in screen and checking it when I get tired of the talks.
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[02:17] <mvo> haha
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[02:18] <fabbione> mvo: ok thanks.
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[02:19] <{Seb}> hey all
[02:19] <{Seb}> i think i have asked this before but i've forgotten what the answer is
[02:19] <{Seb}> what is the best route to get realplayer, sun-j2re, w32codecs and libdvdcss onto breezy?
[02:20] <{Seb}> there are in the marillat repo
[02:20] <Lathiat> the problem is legality
[02:20] <{Seb}> they are in the backports hoary-extras repo
[02:20] <Lathiat> w32codecs is purely illegal
[02:20] <Lathiat> its codec files ripped out of stuff
[02:20] <Lathiat> opped in a package
[02:20] <Lathiat> libdvdcss2 is illegal is most devleoped countries
[02:20] <Lathiat> as for sun-j2re and realplayer, i haveno idea
[02:20] <{Seb}> right but what is the best way to install it
[02:20] <Lathiat> out of hoary-extras i guess
[02:20] <{Seb}> could i add the hoary-extras backports, install them and then remove it?
[02:20] <ogra> {Seb}, move to a country where its legal ?
[02:21] <{Seb}> is that better than marilliat
[02:21] <ogra> icland comes to mind...
[02:21] <fabbione> {Seb}: generally these questions should go to #ubuntu
[02:21] <{Seb}> ogra: i take it you don't like me :-(
[02:21] <Nafallo> sweden! :-)
[02:21] <ogra> Nafallo, and norway :)
[02:21] <{Seb}> fabbione: possibly true but i get flamed because i am using breezy
[02:21] <Kamion> ginac changelog "Apply patch from the BTS"> to do anything in particular? :-)
[02:21] <{Seb}> i got my 65 Ubuntu Hoary CDs today!
[02:21] <{Seb}> only had to wait two months!
[02:22] <Lathiat> mine havent even shipped and i ordered really early :(
[02:22] <{Seb}> http://www.evolutioncolt.com/~spayne/gallery/view_photo.php?set_albumName=ubuntucd&id=Overview2
[02:22] <{Seb}> Lathiat: so did i but they came today!
[02:22] <{Seb}> Lathiat: i don't remember the warty ones taking so long, must be the popularity of ubuntu
[02:22] <sivang> {Seb}: that's fast. I've waited nrealy 3 months to get mine hoary ones
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[02:23] <{Seb}> sivang: it could have about about 3 months. i think i order round about march/april time
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[02:24] <{Seb}> Lathiat: is it w32codecs or gstreamer0.8-plugins that provides MP3 support?
[02:24] <Lathiat> gstreamer0.8-mad
[02:24] <Lathiat> which is in universe
[02:24] <Lathiat> (and included in gstreamer0.8-plugins)
[02:24] <{Seb}> what does w32codecs provide then?
[02:24] <Lathiat> mostly video codecs
[02:25] <Lathiat> xvid, windows media, real audio
[02:25] <{Seb}> right
[02:25] <Nafallo> hmm, isn't this #ubuntu-questions?
[02:25] <{Seb}> right, i'll stop
[02:25] <{Seb}> sorry Nafallo
[02:25] <Nafallo> np
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[02:56] <{Seb}> i thought mono 1.1.8 was in breezy
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[02:59] <{Seb}> according to this, mono 1.1.8 was accepted http://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/breezy-changes/2005-June/006940.html
[03:00] <{Seb}> but when i got to packages.ubuntu.com or try and install mono with synaptic, it installs 1.1.7
[03:00] <Firetech> {Seb}: I also got my CDs today ;) I just got 6 CDs though (5 x86, 1 AMD64)
[03:00] <Nafallo> {Seb}: checked the buildlogs?
[03:00] <{Seb}> Firetech: we are the lucky ones!
[03:00] <Firetech> {Seb}: where do you live?
[03:00] <{Seb}> UK
[03:01] <Firetech> <-- Sweden
[03:01] <{Seb}> Nafallo: sorry but are buildlogs and where are they?
[03:01] <Lathiat> {Seb}: just cusit wasaccepted meanit didnt ftbfs
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[03:01] <thom> Lathiat: jeez your english is decaying rapidly :-)
[03:01] <Nafallo> {Seb}: they are linked from packages.u.c
[03:01] <Lathiat> my space bar is broken :(
[03:02] <Lathiat> and my ssh is laggy ;p
[03:02] <{Seb}> Nafallo: do you mean here 
[03:02] <{Seb}> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/m/mono/1.1.8-0pre3ubuntu2/
[03:02] <{Seb}> there is a file called: mono_1.1.8-0pre3ubuntu2_20050618-1244-i386-failed.gz 
[03:02] <Nafallo> yes
[03:03] <Nafallo> _failed_
[03:03] <Nafallo> :-)
[03:03] <{Seb}> what does that mean?
[03:03] <jordi> {Seb}: surprise, the build failed!
[03:03] <thom> it means it didn't compile
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[03:03] <{Seb}> jordi: i somehow guessed that
[03:04] <{Seb}> according to the file, it seems some file could not be found
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[03:36] <Simira> where's the Ubuntu logo that's supposed to be on the UbuntuArtwork wiki page?
[03:56] <Simira> noone knows?
[03:58] <Nafallo> Simira: lost in transition would be my guess.
[04:07] <Lathiat> can i get the hoary install cd not to install the packages from the cd?
[04:09] <tim__> anyone know if there are any more ubuntu offshoots in development currently (akin to kubuntu, just for different environments)
[04:09] <lu|away> edubuntu
[04:09] <lu|away> depending on how you count, the gnome liveCD is one
[04:09] <lu|away> ditto the new mono live CD
[04:10] <tseng> guadalinux
[04:10] <tseng> gnoppix.
[04:10] <ogra> gnoppix too
[04:10] <ogra> heh
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[04:11] <tim__> anyone know if there are any plans for an E17-ubuntu? or where I could go to pitch that idea....its just so awesomely fast and beautiful
[04:12] <tim__> I saw it mentioned it an interview w/ shuttleworth but I wasn't sure if that was just "maybe sometime" or if people were actually thinking about it seriuosly enough to work on it
[04:12] <chrissturm> tim: will it be stable in the near future?
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[04:12] <tim__> chrissturm, its stable right now :)
[04:12] <tim__> still in development...but probably the most stable environment I've ever used
[04:12] <chrissturm> stable == stable release
[04:13] <ogra> tim__, e17 ? stable ?
[04:13] <tim__> lol, ummmm nobody knows.....my guess is 3 or 4 months
[04:13] <chrissturm> tim: like 3 years ago :)
[04:14] <ogra> tim__, they develop e17 since 4 (!) years
[04:14] <Kamion> Lathiat: what do you mean?
[04:14] <ogra> chrissturm, 3 ??
[04:14] <tim__> lol yea its been a while
[04:14] <tim__> but so worth the wait
[04:14] <chrissturm> ogra: its going to be ready in 3 months for 3 years now :)
[04:14] <Lathiat> Kamion: like, i want to boot off the cd,but install the packages froma network archive (because the end of th ecdis buggered and the install wont ifnish)
[04:14] <Lathiat> and my network card wont pxe boot
[04:14] <Kamion> tim__: IIRC somebody asked "could this happen" and Mark said "sure [if somebody does the work] "
[04:15] <Kamion> Lathiat: does the base system install OK?
[04:15] <tim__> It was something like Marc saying "theres a lot of opportunity for more offshoots of ubuntu just like kubuntu did....I believe there was even talk of an e17-ubuntu"
[04:15] <chrissturm> they should release a roadmap to a stable release. that would probably motivate people to work on integrating it
[04:15] <Lathiat> Kamion: buggers up installing the kernel iomage (bad cde errors)
[04:16] <ogra> tim__, not at all... breaking with all common developments just to reinvent the wheel is just silly... but we will indeed include packages for e17 if someone does
[04:16] <Lathiat> i know you can do it in d-i as th enetboot install does it,i just cant convince the cd booted install to do it. :)
[04:16] <Kamion> Lathiat: ok, easiest way's probably to run in expert mode, and when it asks for extra installer modules tell it to install choose-mirror
[04:16] <Lathiat> Kamion: ahhhhhhh :)
[04:16] <Kamion> but hmm
[04:16] <Lathiat> Kamion: thanks
[04:16] <ogra> tim__, if someone does build these packages.... in a MOTU friendly way
[04:16] <Kamion> that won't entirely work, because base-installer.postinst checks for /cdrom first
[04:17] <Lathiat> is breezy going to support a netinst cd?
[04:17] <Kamion> Lathiat: 'nano /var/lib/dpkg/info/base-installer.postinst' and clobber the bit that looks for /cdrom/.disk/base_installable in the manner of your choice. :-)
[04:17] <jdub> ogra: hey, so, is there a place to list universe packages that are blocked from syncing due to merges?
[04:17] <ogra> tim__, and you are absolutely free to make a derivate with e17 :) it is very appreciated if you do
[04:17] <Kamion> Lathiat: breezy supports it, they just haven't been built - it's an "if Kamion gets time" kind of thing
[04:17] <ogra> jdub, MOM and bugzilla ?
[04:17] <Lathiat> Kamion: ok :)
[04:17] <tim__> ogra, I wouldn't know where to start :( but it would definitely be a fun project to embark on
[04:18] <Lathiat> Kamion: have fun with that getting time thing
[04:18] <jdub> Kamion: is there an installer module for checking passwords with cracklib?
[04:18] <ogra> tim__, in the wiki there s a very nice guide how to modify liveCDs
[04:18] <jdub> ogra: for universe packages?
[04:18] <chrissturm> tim: you could build e17 packages and join #ubuntu-motu
[04:19] <ogra> tim__, as well in the wiki you can find wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU 
[04:19] <ogra> jdub, err... hmm... nope...
[04:19] <tim__> i'll check it out
[04:19] <Kamion> jdub: nope
[04:19] <jdub> ogra: have a look at kismet :|
[04:19] <jdub> ogra: maybe we should generate a list and check, or file bugs in malone?
[04:19] <Kamion> jdub: wouldn't it just be a matter of putting the right PAM configuration in place before passwd.config runs?
[04:19] <Kamion> hmm, although passwd.config might well bypass PAM
[04:20] <ogra> jdub, yep, malone would be good
[04:20] <tim__> hrm maybe I'll slap it on the "universe candidates" page
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[04:20] <jdub> Kamion: would the ui do the right thing?
[04:20] <Kamion> jdub: dunno
[04:20] <Kamion> jdub: wouldn't be hard to fix if it broke
[04:21] <Nafallo> jdub: kismet is only over a year old from debian and ftbfs in the cxx transition. is there anything to complain about? :-)
[04:22] <ogra> Nafallo, yes, we havent recompiled it yet
=== Lathiat smirks
[04:23] <Lathiat> "Choose a mirror of theubuntu archive"
[04:23] <Lathiat> "You shouldnever see this question'."
[04:23] <Lathiat> "Ubuntu version to install:"
[04:23] <Lathiat> warty/hoary/grumpy/perky
[04:23] <Lathiat> hmm :)
[04:23] <ogra> Lathiat, what do you do there ?
[04:23] <Nafallo> ogra: I tried to do that with the version in debian and it's the same builderror.
[04:23] <Lathiat> ogra: well i selected hoary :)
[04:24] <Kamion> Lathiat: fixed in breezy I think
[04:24] <Lathiat> Kamion: :))
[04:24] <Lathiat> whats perky?
[04:24] <Kamion> former name for breezy+1
[04:24] <Lathiat> ah ok
[04:24] <Lathiat> whyd 
[04:24] <Nafallo> the version after grumpy? :-)
[04:24] <Lathiat> whats it now?
[04:24] <Kamion> unnamed
[04:24] <Lathiat> nah grumpy is something different
[04:24] <Lathiat> Kamion: ah, whynotperky?
[04:25] <Kamion> Lathiat: grumpy used to be what breezy is now
[04:25] <Kamion> it has *since* become something different
[04:25] <Nafallo> Lathiat: _now_ yes. grumpy was breezy before :-)
[04:25] <tseng> he got grumpier
[04:25] <Kamion> Lathiat: the name hasn't been settled yet, that's all
[04:25] <Kamion> may still be perky, we'll see
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[04:26] <Lathiat> ah ok :)
[04:26] <tseng> elmo: are you holding mono 1.1.8 in some way?
[04:27] <Lathiat> sigh its still installing off the cd
[04:27] <Lathiat> tseng: its build failed 
[04:27] <Kamion> you could use the netboot mini.iso
[04:27] <Kamion> that would probably be easier
[04:27] <tseng> elmo: 1.1.8-0pre3ubuntu1 has to go to archive before ubuntu2 can build
[04:27] <tseng> Lathiat: i dont think you understand
[04:27] <Lathiat> tseng: ok i'll shutup then :)
[04:27] <Kamion> Lathiat: http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/hoary/main/installer-i386/current/images/netboot/mini.iso
[04:28] <Lathiat> thanks Kamion 
[04:28] <Lathiat> i didnt know it existed
[04:28] <Lathiat> hiding in the archives :)
[04:28] <Kamion> netinst would be base-system-only, which is slightly different
[04:28] <elmo> tseng: uh, say what?
[04:28] <Kamion> I should publish the netboot image better
[04:28] <elmo> tseng: you can only have one version in the archive at a time
[04:29] <elmo> tseng: and the buildds will only build the latest source version
[04:29] <tseng> elmo: well. ubuntu1 needed to build and go to archive for ubuntu2 to build properly, its a bootstrap
[04:29] <tseng> elmo: so I need to start over?
[04:29] <tseng> nothing ever entered the archive, it has new binaries
[04:30] <Kamion> perhaps manual bootstrapping by a buildd maintainer would be better than trying to upload non-working stuff
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[04:30] <Kamion> after all that's how everything else that needs bootstrapping is done
[04:30] <elmo> tseng: ubuntu1 got built and then rejected because ubuntu2 had been uploaded
[04:30] <tseng> I expected it to be working in short order, I guess i misunderstood
[04:31] <elmo> I'm struggling to see how you can have something that can be buildable one debian revision, and then not the next, but if that's the case, you'll need to coordainte very closely with laminity, to make sure it goes through smoothly
[04:31] <elmo> s/debian/ubuntu/
[04:31] <tseng> its buildable the second time, but it is depwait or so
[04:32] <tseng> ill find a laminity later.
[04:32] <Kamion> tseng: if you build-depend on yourself you should coordinate with the buildd maintainers
[04:32] <tseng> thanks
[04:32] <Kamion> always :)
[04:32] <tseng> Kamion: will do
[04:32] <tseng> Kamion: the debian maintainer bootstraps with a binary upload, i wasnt sure what to do
[04:33] <elmo> tseng: that's such an insanely unscalable solution
[04:33] <elmo> esp. for debian and it's 11 arches
[04:33] <elmo> not that mono supports many of them
[04:35] <Kamion> tseng: that's why you need a buildd maintainer, since they can do binary uploads (after making sure they're buildable within the archive etc.)
[04:37] <tseng> no problem.
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[04:42] <tim__> what is involved in making a package for ubuntu out of source...is there a tutorial anywhere someone can point me to?
[04:46] <pitti> tim__: http://www.nl.debian.org/doc/maint-guide/ is not bad for a start
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[04:49] <tim__> thx pitti 
[04:51] <jdub> http://www.gnome.org/~martink/2005/stuff/Screenshot-nautilus-hierarchical.png
[04:51] <jdub> HELLO!
[04:51] <tseng> I DONT GET IT
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[04:53] <jdub> macos classic style tree view
[04:53] <tseng> well, i get that
[04:53] <tseng> i guess id have to use it
[04:53] <tseng> to grok why everyone is excited
=== Lathiat grumbles
[04:54] <Lathiat> ubuntu has been 'testing' my security repository for 2 minutes now (and failing)
[04:54] <Lathiat> why doesnt it fail quicker?
[04:54] <Lathiat> i mean, if it hasnt connected after a minute, it really isnt going to get anywhere
[04:54] <tseng> probably a high apt timeout
[04:54] <chrissturm> what i would love is a popup that shows the parent hierarchy to appear when i drag something to a folder
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[04:57] <ogra> tim__, btw, join #ubuntu-motu ;)
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[05:00] <Keybuk> jdub: I want it
[05:03] <martink> maybe I should upload the breezy package too...
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[05:03] <jdthood> pitti: http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~scott/patches/alsa-driver/alsa-driver_1.0.9b-2ubuntu1_packaging.patch: diff -pruN alsa-driver_1.0.9b-1/debian/NOTES alsa-driver_1.0.9b-2ubuntu1/debian/NOTES
[05:04] <jdthood> This is a diff between 1.0.9b-1 and 1.0.9b-2ubuntu1.  Shouldn't it be a diff between 1.0.9b-2 and 1.0.9b-2ubuntu1?
[05:05] <pitti> jdthood: sure, the patch is out of date since I merged based on -2, but MOM merged based on -1
[05:05] <jdthood> pitti: So the patch will be back in sync later?
[05:05] <pitti> jdthood: yes, should
[05:05] <jdthood> k
[05:06] <pitti> jdthood: http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/alsa-driver_1.0.9b-2ubuntu1.debdiff
[05:07] <jdthood> (I'm checking to see if there's anything else I should sync.)
[05:07] <pitti> jdthood: right now there is only s-d-s and the LSB init
[05:10] <Lathiat> sudo vulnerability? *ouch*
[05:10] <pitti> Lathiat: hehe :-) well, it's not the end of the world, but pretty serious
[05:10] <Lathiat> its still ouch :)
[05:11] <Lathiat> pitti: what specific situation is needed?
[05:11] <Lathiat> pitti: or urlto details?
[05:11] <sivang> pitti: do you have an advisory already?
[05:11] <sivang> pitti: re this specific issue?
[05:11] <pitti> sivang: it's fixed in warty and hoary, yes
[05:11] <Lathiat> hm doenst seem to be in hoarys security archives yet
[05:12] <pitti> Lathiat: it should, I released it
[05:12] <Nafallo> Lathiat: I've updated my server with it :-)
[05:12] <pitti> Lathiat: http://www.securityfocus.com/archive/1/402741
[05:12] <Lathiat> whats the versionofthe security update?
[05:13] <Lathiat> my ubuntu sec notices always land in somefolder andinever find it again :)
=== Lathiat digs
[05:13] <pitti> Lathiat: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/support/documentation/usn/usn-142-1
[05:13] <elmo> can someone do me a favour and try torrenting?
[05:14] <elmo> anything from torrent.ubuntu.com I mean
[05:14] <elmo> and make sure your DNS has updated to point at .43
[05:14] <Lathiat> Host torrnet.ubuntu.com not found: 3(NXDOMAIN)
[05:14] <Lathiat> doh
[05:14] <tseng> elmo: 143 is wrong?
[05:14] <Lathiat> torrent.ubuntu.com has address 82.211.81.143
[05:14] <elmo> tseng: no .143 is right
[05:15] <tseng> ok
[05:15] <Lathiat> pitti: hrm interesting, my hoary box doesnt see the update
[05:15] <Lathiat> what does it mean when apt says 'Ign' ?
[05:15] <Nafallo> Ignored
[05:16] <elmo> oh, blah
[05:16] <Lathiat> Nafallo: right, so why do i get ignored?
[05:17] <elmo> might work better now
[05:17] <Nafallo> Lathiat: dunno.
[05:18] <tseng> elmo: grabbing the dvd
[05:19] <tseng> elmo: found a bunch of peers and happily chugs along
[05:19] <elmo> tseng: sweet, thanks
[05:20] <tseng> nps
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[05:44] <mpt> According to PCWorld, Ubuntu 5.04 is the 26th best product of 2005
[05:45] <squinn> mpt, lemme grab the issue from the downstairs bathroom
[05:45] <squinn> i saw firefox as 1 and tiger as like #3
[05:45] <mpt> Yeah, we've got a way to go yet :-)
[05:52] <squinn> gmail and flickr made it too, mpt 
[05:52] <squinn> props to you devels..i just went 20 minutes without a significant problem in breezy
[05:52] <squinn> after installing xfonts-base [my fault to an extent] 
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[06:01] <jdthood> pitti, mdz: alsa-utils 1.0.9a-2 changelog: Reverse the order of dialog/whiptail dependency to prefer whiptail
[06:02] <jdthood> Is this something we should do in Debian?
[06:02] <pitti> no idea about that change...
[06:02] <pitti> Hi mdz 
[06:02] <elmo> it's a workaround to make germinate prefer whiptail
[06:02] <elmo> Debian should have whatever you think is better for users first
[06:03] <elmo> we think that's whiptail, YMMV
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[06:03] <mvo> hey mdz
[06:04] <lamont> Kamion: what do you think of uploading the latest debootstrap (with the g++-4.0 fixes) to hoary-updates?
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=== Lathiat grumbles at incorrect md5sumson security
[06:05] <pitti> Hi lamont
[06:05] <wasabi_> Hmmm.
[06:05] <lamont> Lathiat: it's a feature... should be better in a minute or so, each time it b0rks.
[06:05] <wasabi_> MS's support does rock.
[06:05] <lamont> morning pitti
[06:05] <wasabi_> I mean, it's pricey, but it rocks.
[06:05] <Lathiat> lamont: ah ok, what causes that?
[06:05] <wasabi_> Is Ubuntu offering professional support yet?
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[06:06] <ogra> wasabi_, sure
[06:06] <ogra> wasabi_, look at ubuntu.com, there is also a pricelist afaik
[06:06] <wasabi_> ahh
[06:06] <tseng> eh?
[06:07] <tseng> oh
[06:07] <wasabi_> How does one actually GET this support? email based? Phone based?
[06:07] <wasabi_> Oh I see there it is.
[06:07] <ogra> tseng, http://www.ubuntulinux.org/support/supportoptions/paidsupport/
[06:08] <Lathiat> whats an 'incident
[06:08] <Lathiat> '
[06:08] <wasabi_> Ya'll should have an incident pricing for server.
[06:08] <Lathiat> wasabi_: it does
[06:08] <wasabi_> That's how we do it with MS. Works out pretty well. We're compitent, so we only use it when we have a really messed up problem.
[06:08] <wasabi_> It says NA.
[06:08] <Lathiat> oh
[06:08] <Lathiat> i see
[06:08] <Lathiat> but a package ;p
[06:08] <Lathiat> *buy
[06:08] <wasabi_> $$$ and reaccuring. ;)
[06:09] <wasabi_> MS does 250 per incident, and we're fairly happy with that anyways.
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[06:12] <lamont> Lathiat: every 30 minutes, the Release, Release.gpg, and Packages/Sources files are updated.  If you're unfortunate enough to grab files during the middle of this transition, you get a mixed set.  And the md5sums and/or signatures are different
[06:13] <lamont> re-fetching cures the problem, unless you wait 30 minutes...
[06:13] <Lathiat> hrm, i try refetching about 5 times and it still doesnt go :)
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[06:14] <lamont> Lathiat: then either the mirror fetched at a bad point, or (if you're not hitting the mirror), then you should  squawk
[06:14] <Lathiat> hoary security packages.gz still hasan md5sum error, im hitting archive.u.c
=== lamont is introduced to the "goldilocks security model"
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[06:14] <lamont> mvo: btw, could we get apt to quit lying about bz2 files?
[06:15] <mvo> lamont: lying in what way exactly?
[06:15] <lamont> claiming it's downloading Packages.gz when it's actually fetching Packages.bz2
[06:15] <lamont> that is, the messages to the user don't exactly match...
[06:15] <mvo> oh, yes
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=== lamont hands mvo a penalty card
[06:16] <mvo> "failure to play" 
=== mvo runs
[06:18] <mvo> lamont: runing "apt-get update" it tells me that it downloads "Packages" files (without a extension)
[06:18] <Kamion> Lathiat: the repository testing delay's a known bug, there's been some progress towards fixing it
[06:19] <Kamion> lamont: hmm, those are fixes for breezy, right?
=== Lathiat screams "fucking patents"
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[06:19] <pitti> Lathiat: just read about it :-(
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[06:27] <lamont> Kamion: yeah...  fixes to /usr/lib/debootstrap/scripts/breezy{,.buildd}
[06:28] <Kamion> lamont: those scripts didn't exist in hoary though
[06:28] <lamont> Kamion: point.  but they should, dammit. :-)
[06:28] <Kamion> I think part of the reason I'm reluctant is that once I start offering that in hoary-updates, I have to keep it updated
[06:29] <Kamion> it'll be easier once I sort out debootstrap 0.3
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[06:34] <maswan> lamont: so, are we in the lead with sparc yet? ;)
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=== lamont glares at maswan
[06:39] <lamont> hppa's little gcc-4.0 regression hasn't helped things either...
=== lamont wonders if seb128 did his gtk+2.0 upload yet
[06:39] <seb128> lamont: nop
[06:39] <lamont> np.  I may just kick the tires here sometime
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[06:47] <mgalvin> are you guys aware that the shipped live cds and some of the install cds do not work, there is a -users thread on this but it doesn't seem to be get much attention
[06:48] <mgalvin> I just wanted to make sure you guys know
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[06:49] <lamont> Kamion: so how can I tell ssh_config "use a proxy command for this host, but only if this other command (run locally) returns true :-)
[06:49] <lamont> that is, I want to autodetect when I'm on that specific network, and not proxycommand things when I don't need to
[06:49] <lamont> hrm.. prolly ECHAN
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=== mvo goes to play some hockey now
[06:53] <Kamion> lamont: I know of no way to do that, short of dummy proxycommands
[06:54] <Kamion> or an ssh alias that swaps in and out different versions of .ssh/config, or an ssh alias that provides -o ProxyCommand options as needed
[06:54] <Kamion> the last is probably least evil
[06:54] <lamont> yeah
[07:00] <maswan> lamont: sorry? unfortunately, we don't have any fast hppas here, so we can't help in that regard.
[07:00] <maswan> lamont: nor any leet gcc hackers
[07:02] <lamont> maswan: np.  sparc pulled ahead a couple of days ago
[07:02] <lamont> and last night i finally started releasing g++ apps on hppa
[07:02] <maswan> Jun 21 16:08:37 buildd: breezy: total 731 packages to build.
[07:02] <maswan> all I know is that. :)
[07:03] <maswan> Hmm.. I wonder if 4500's are supported..
=== Kamion -> dinner
[07:03] <lamont> people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Lists/breezy.all.$ARCH
[07:03] <maswan> but then, this seems almost done.
[07:03] <bob2> mdz: that bzr bug seems ubuntu-specific, but it's fixed in sid now anyway
[07:04] <lamont> hppa's local buildd thinks it's down to just the blacklisted c++ apps, hence the need to free them.
[07:04] <lamont> and then there's all the ftbfs issues...
[07:04] <mdz> bob2: bzr bug?
[07:04] <maswan> lamont: ah, thanks
=== Duck_work is now known as Duck_zic
[07:05] <bob2> mdz: the one you filed yesterday
[07:05] <lamont> maswan: that's the _REAL_ w-b data dump (every 20 min).  Sadly, hppa/sparc can't actually update that, so it's purely 'Needs-Build' and 'Installed
[07:06] <mdz> bob2: oh, the one I filed in Debian
[07:06] <bob2> mdz: er, wrong channel, right :)
[07:06] <mdz> bob2: it's not Ubuntu-specific, but nobody would notice it in Debian
[07:06] <bob2> or maybe right channel
[07:06] <mdz> because a) the package maintainer uploads the binaries, and b) python happens to depend on python2.3
[07:07] <mdz> (until Debian moves to 2.4, which I imagine will happen now that sarge is out)
[07:07] <maswan> lamont: Well, building stuff is neat, anyway. :)
[07:07] <jordi> ogra: so who else will be around next week?
[07:08] <bob2> ah, indeed
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[07:10] <mdz> bob2: the maintainer dissed my bug
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[07:13] <ogra> jordi, Petter Reinholdtsen and Knut Yrvin from skolelinux, a handfull of people from the shuttleworthfoundation, someone from extremadura and some other spanish distro, i have the exact list not available currently
[07:13] <mdz> bob2: oh, he dissed it and then fixed it
[07:13] <mdz> bob2: or rather, you fixed it
[07:13] <bob2> mdz: I'm the fixer, he's the disser
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[07:15] <mdz> bob2: indeed
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[07:19] <jordi> ogra: cool
[07:19] <jordi> ogra: so not too many people anyway
[07:19] <ogra> nope :)
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[07:19] <brodmann> hi
[07:19] <brodmann> i'm trying to extract a .run file, but everytime it extracts to the folder, when it's finished, it deletes that tmp folder
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[07:26] <lsuactiafner> i need a program to take a text file and to intelligently search for expressions/strings that occur most often
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[07:27] <lsuactiafner> ideas?
[07:27] <lamont> mdz: hppa needs to have libgcc2 seeded in main (essential package and all that) - what's the approval process for that again??
=== lamont hangs his head in shame
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[07:27] <brodmann> i'm trying to extract a .run file, but everytime it extracts to the folder, when it's finished, it deletes that tmp folder
[07:27] <tseng> lsuactiafner: grep | sort for starters
[07:27] <lsuactiafner> tseng : done that already
[07:28] <mdke> grep?
[07:28] <mdke> try #ubuntu tho
[07:28] <sanpera> can anyone tell me why the firefox package in hoary isn't built with xprint support?
[07:28] <tseng> lsuactiafner: man grep
[07:28] <lsuactiafner> wrote a java program also to check stuff out.. but thing is i need a PC to create the expressions itself to check for reoccurance
[07:29] <lamont> lsuactiafner: still a #ubuntu question, not #ubuntu-devel
[07:29] <mdz> lamont: seeded?  or just resynced with germinate?
[07:29] <lsuactiafner> see, i use bannerfilter on the proxy, but the filter list is hand-made and not as effective, need to analyze a squid log to generate possible candidates thats most effective to block
[07:29] <lamont> mdz: reseeded
[07:29] <lamont> resynced
[07:29] <lamont> gah
[07:29] <mdz> :-)
[07:29] <lamont> mdz: which is to say, "it's muppet magic, leave him alone"??
[07:29] <mdz> doesn't show up in anastacia; did this just happen today?
[07:29] <lsuactiafner> lamont: more a developers question than a ubuntu question, before i try code something in java need to know if the program exists
[07:30] <lamont> mdz: ah. hrm.
[07:30] <lamont> second
[07:30] <mdz> lamont: I think hppa might be special
[07:30] <mdz> lamont: in which case this is elmo material
[07:30] <lamont> mdz: it shows up as soon as gcc-4.0>= -8ubuntu3 is in the archive.
[07:31] <lamont> except that hppa uploaded that to the real archive after -9ubuntu1 source was uploaded
[07:31] <lamont> and -9ubuntu2 is ftbfs on hppa
=== lamont ponders.
[07:33] <lamont> -8ubuntu3 is in the archive for hppa
[07:33] <elmo> I don't think we germinate for hppa
[07:33] <elmo> if it's main complete, we can do
[07:34] <lamont> arts is ICE, so it's certainly nowhere close to main-complete.  But it should debootstrap
[07:34] <lamont> well, modulo at least libgcc2
[07:34] <elmo> germinating a non-main complete architecture introduces PAIN
=== lamont will create time to work on the ICE then
[07:34] <doko> mdz: we do not want to support the python-dbg package in main?
[07:34] <elmo> if you need just the one lib, we should just promote it and wave our hands vigourously pretending it didn't happen
[07:35] <mdz> doko: of course we do
[07:35] <mdz> doko: that's why I seeded it and promoted it
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[07:35] <lamont> elmo: I'm pretty sure it's just the one lib - we could just seed it for now - it's only built on hppa, and if it's ever built on any other architecture, it'll immediately be essential
[07:36] <doko> mdz: ouch ;) just looked at the wiki changes
[07:36] <lamont> elmo: as an alternatively even more evil approach - there are signed hoary .changes/.debs on p.u.c that could be used to populate hoary/hppa....  Then we'd be main complete. :)
=== lamont ducks hand covers
[07:36] <lamont> s/h//
[07:37] <lamont> (no, that wasn't a serious suggestion)
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[07:38] <lamont> elmo: likewise, breezy-autotest is gonna be FTBFS-city, just like hppa,and (to a lesser degree, since it has leftovers from hoary), sparc
[07:39] <fabbione> lamont: well i can't efford a breezy-autotest on sparc.. even i miss only 700 pkgs to build and 750 to give-back for dep-wait
=== lamont has ~800 build failures due to g{cc,++}-4.x, xorg-splitting, and dpkg-dev
[07:39] <lamont> fabbione: I wasn't suggesting that you should
[07:40] <fabbione> lamont: i did fix quite a bunch of FTBFS in main today
[07:40] <lamont> merely, the archive is currently in _MUCH_ worse shape than it appears, since there are >500 FTBFS packages
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[07:40] <fabbione> hppa/sparc will suffer for mono
[07:40] <elmo> Kamion: can you change the torrent trigger to trigger magellanic rather than orcadas?
[07:40] <mdz> doko: in general, binary-only promotions don't need review unless they are weird or introduce new dependencies
[07:41] <fabbione> lamont: but fixing universe for xorg split is going to be fast with breezy-autotest, given that bugs will be received by the MOTU's
[07:41] <lamont> fabbione: sparc is less-bad-off, since anything unchanged from hoary that is now FTBFS, is still in the archive for you.
[07:41] <lamont> right
[07:41] <lamont> logs@buildd.u.c would also help, since the sparc/hppa logs would be a big clue that there is problems
[07:41] <fabbione> lamont: there is really not much left from hoary in the archive....
=== Amaranth [amaranth@ip68-229-189-61.om.om.cox.net]  has joined #ubuntu-devel
[07:42] <fabbione> that too :)
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[07:46] <mdz> fabbione: ready for .12 as default?
[07:47] <fabbione> mdz: almost.. i need to upload final tomorrow
[07:47] <fabbione> mdz: we will have 3 regressions with final
[07:47] <fabbione> mdz: and i had to investigate one today.. that's why i didn't upload
[07:47] <mdz> bugs are ok, we need testing
[07:47] <mdz> especially for initramfs
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[07:48] <mdz> if we are going to switch for breezy, and we should, then we need to get people using initramfs very soon
[07:48] <fabbione> mdz: a) ipw2100 is still borked, b) 2 scsi drivers are broken upstream (but there is a patch) c) boot will be considerably slower (udev problem)
[07:48] <mdz> fabbione: ipw2100 is the thom thing?
[07:48] <fabbione> #c is the main issue atm
[07:48] <fabbione> mdz: yes 
[07:49] <fabbione> basically we need a newer version of udev
[07:49] <mdz> slower boot should not be a blocking issue for .12 as default
[07:49] <fabbione> that is incompatible with older kernels
[07:49] <fabbione> mdz: slow to a certain degree of taking a long while to boot :)
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[07:49] <mdz> fabbione: I have no such problems here
[07:50] <fabbione> mdz: the change has been introduced between rc6 and final
[07:50] <fabbione> mdz: you cannot have that problem unless you compiled your own kernel
[07:50] <mdz> fabbione: how much slower is it?
[07:50] <mdz> it would have to be like a factor of 4 in order to be a blocker
[07:50] <Amaranth> do ubuntu kernels have the bad ram patch?
[07:50] <fabbione> mdz: it depends from system to system
[07:51] <fabbione> mdz: anyway tomorrow final will hit main
[07:51] <fabbione> mdz: with an ABI change
[07:51] <mdz> please increment the abi version this time
[07:51] <fabbione> but i was expecting it between rc6 and final
[07:51] <fabbione> mdz: yup.. it's in main
[07:51] <fabbione> mdz: see the changelog for the last upload: 
[07:51] <fabbione>   Changes by Fabio M. Di Nitto:
[07:51] <fabbione>   * Re-enable abi check again.
[07:52] <fabbione> or from the one i have in baz..
[07:52] <fabbione> the latter..
[07:52] <fabbione> well it was meant because of hitting main
[07:52] <mdz> ok
[07:52] <fabbione> mdz: for the ipw2100 problem.. i migth have a solution, but i will need a tester
[07:52] <fabbione> i don't have such hardware and i can't test it
[07:53] <fabbione> and changing it in the main kernel is an ABI change
[07:53] <fabbione> so i would like to do it once and get over it
[07:54] <mdz> abi changes are ok
[07:54] <mdz> this is our development branch
[07:55] <fabbione> mdz: yes, but they are very expensive for all of ys
[07:55] <fabbione> us
[07:55] <fabbione> anyway .. tomorrow is final day
[07:55] <fabbione> :)
[07:56] <fabbione> mdz: i am going to drop power3/power4 support after..
[07:56] <fabbione> given that ppc64 has been tested on at least 2 machines
[07:56] <maswan> no power3? :(
[07:56] <maswan> oh, well. there is always AIX. mmmm.. AIX..
[07:56] <fabbione> maswan: ppc64 supports power3
[07:56] <maswan> ah, ok. that way around.
[07:57] <mdz> fabbione: what is expensive about them?  if there is anything other than l-r-m which is expensive (and even that should be minor), we should fix it
[07:57] <fabbione> maswan: speaking of kernels.. i would love to get a 3.6 kernel on test7 if possible
[07:57] <maswan> wow. 3.6
[07:57] <maswan> openbsd kernel then?
[07:57] <maswan> or?
=== maswan ducks
[07:57] <fabbione> mdz: expensive is: elmo to NEW the packages, seed, l-r-m, d-i
[07:57] <pitti> Ubuntu - today you can get the packages of the future
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[07:58] <fabbione> maswan: well.. eheh i meant 2.6
[07:58] <maswan> fabbione: but sure, how about I do that together with an hostname/IP hcnage?
[07:58] <fabbione> maswan: you tell me what you prefer...
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[07:58] <fabbione> maswan: just gimme like 20 minutes notice that i will stop the buildd
[07:59] <maswan> fabbione: sure. how about now?
[07:59] <maswan> do we have a naming convention?
[07:59] <fabbione> maswan: hmm sure.. let me ssh
[07:59] <maswan> for ubuntu/buildds or something?
[07:59] <Amaranth> would it be possible to get the badram patch in ubuntu kernels? http://rick.vanrein.org/linux/badram/download.html
[07:59] <fabbione> maswan: use the name you want.. it's not an official ubuntu buildd
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[07:59] <Amaranth> the latest they have is 2.6.11 though
[08:00] <fabbione> sparc != official
[08:00] <maswan> samn. then we have to come up with something on our own. :)
[08:00] <maswan> s/s/d/
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[08:01] <Seveas> is Hibernate supposed to be stable?
[08:01] <maswan> ok. your choice: bubbles, blossom, or buttercup?
[08:01] <fabbione> maswan: call it wathever you prefer :)
[08:01] <fabbione> maswan: sparc.is.a.bitch.fabbione.net ? :P
[08:02] <maswan> bubbles then. :)
[08:02] <Amaranth> buttercup!
[08:02] <Amaranth> :D
[08:02] <maswan> ah, ok. :)
[08:02] <fabbione> maswan: almost done :)
[08:03] <maswan> fabbione: buttercup.acc.umu.se has address 130.239.18.171
[08:03] <maswan> let me know when you are ready
[08:03] <fabbione> maswan: ok. works for me :)
[08:03] <fabbione> maswan: i am still stopping the buildd (cleaning the chroot now)
[08:04] <maswan> fabbione: kernel-image-2.6.8-2-sparc64-smp acceptable?
[08:04] <fabbione> maswan: yes.
[08:04] <fabbione> it needs to be anything > 2.6.4
=== maswan nods
[08:04] <maswan> well, that's the one in sarge, so.. :)
[08:05] <fabbione> that's the same i am using on my buildd :)
[08:05] <ogra> hmm, sad, gnome-backup is still crap...
[08:05] <fabbione> modulo -smp
[08:06] <maswan> fabbione: just give me a nick hilight when you're done and I'll install, fiddle with hostnames/hosts and reboot.
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[08:07] <fabbione> maswan: you are green to go
[08:07] <fabbione> my adsl just died for 10 seconds while i was logging out
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[08:08] <maswan> fabbione: Ok.
[08:09] <fabbione> 21 076:13:29:16 ATM        Info       WAN 0 physical layer is down
[08:09] <fabbione> bah
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[08:20] <mdz> doko: I haven't seen a new oo.o2 with new build-deps; are you talking about something you have locally?
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[08:22] <maswan> fabbione: it is up now
[08:22] <fabbione> maswan: cool..
[08:23] <fabbione> maswan: perfect.. i am in.. outgoing emails work too
=== fabbione restarts the buildd
[08:27] <mdz> tseng: how goes the mono->main review?  is there anything else that is ready to move?
[08:27] <terrex> are there ubuntu kernels 2.6.12 debianized? and where?
[08:27] <maswan> fabbione: great
[08:27] <fabbione> terrex: breezy.. but i suggest you wait tomorrow
[08:27] <pitti> terrex: we have rc6 in universe so far
[08:27] <fabbione> maswan: we are overtaking hppa big times :)
[08:28] <fabbione> pitti: main but yes.. rc6
[08:28] <maswan> fabbione: yeah, I saw. poor gcc sufferers. :)
[08:29] <tseng> mdz: i could probably do a review of a few more things and push monodevelop + deps over
[08:29] <fabbione> maswan: actually we still have a big issue for main
[08:30] <fabbione> maswan: that's the kernel not linking properly due to the new toolchain, and worst is that i don't have a fix yet
[08:30] <tseng> mdz: im getting less ambitious about moving all the major apps for breezy
[08:30] <tseng> mdz: as specified
[08:30] <mdz> tseng: so far, I don't think we have any apps :-)
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[08:31] <tseng> mdz: we didnt move tomboy?
[08:31] <tseng> right now im thinking of tomboy, beagle, f-spot in main.. as things we dont have from some other app
[08:31] <ogra> tseng, monodevelop 
[08:32] <ogra> ?
[08:32] <tseng> yes.
[08:32] <fabbione> yay!
[08:32] <mdz> tseng: yes, but I don't think all of its deps are satisfied
[08:32] <fabbione> xorg -32 finally built :)
[08:32] <tseng> mdz: i can move.. evolution-sharp
[08:32] <tseng> mdz: gmime needs love
[08:32] <tseng> let me mail myself to review beagle deps + monodevelop tonight
[08:33] <tseng> mdz: one other question while you are on the subject. mono 1.2 and friends are targetted for Sept. release
[08:33] <fabbione> maswan: everything is working perfectly... thanks a lot
[08:33] <tseng> mdz: is it the TB that can approve tracking this past UVF?
[08:33] <fabbione> maswan: i guess i am off to have some dinner with my wife 
[08:33] <maswan> fabbione: enjoy!
[08:34] <fabbione> maswan: thanks a lot!
[08:34] <fabbione> maswan: where do you live in .se?
[08:34] <fabbione> maswan: perhaps we could meet somewhere in there for a beer.. given that i am 20 km from .se :)
[08:34] <maswan> fabbione: Ume
[08:34] <fabbione> maswan: how far is that from cph?
[08:34] <fabbione> (Malmo)
[08:34] <mdz> tseng: currently, release decisions aren't really handled by TB; I'd probably decide that
[08:35] <maswan> fabbione: hmm.. lets see, stockholm is 600 km away, then malm is another 600km or so, I think
[08:35] <maswan> fabbione: two 1-hour flights, typically
[08:35] <fabbione> maswan: argh...
[08:35] <mdz> tseng: september is quite late, though.  the preview release is out in september.
[08:35] <maswan> fabbione: yeah, .se stretches away quite a bit up north
[08:35] <fabbione> maswan: yeah i know :)
[08:35] <tseng> mdz: hm right
[08:35] <mdz> it's extremely unlikely that we would allow something like mono 1.2 close to preview, and definitely not after preview
[08:35] <fabbione> have been to Goteborg and stockholm 
[08:36] <tseng> mdz: we might get in a beta
[08:36] <tseng> mdz: we are tracking 1.1.x until freez
[08:36] <mdz> tseng: 1.1.x are development releases?
[08:36] <fabbione> oh well
[08:36] <tseng> yes, but 1.0 is effectively EOL
[08:36] <fabbione> cya later guys
[08:37] <mdz> doko: is zopeinterface appropriate for main?
[08:37] <mdz> fabbione: good evening
[08:37] <Amaranth> 1.1.x isn't 1.2 yet because of MWF
[08:37] <Amaranth> at least that's the impression i get
[08:37] <tseng> Amaranth: well mono winforms is a key feature
[08:37] <Amaranth> yeah
[08:37] <fabbione> mdz: thanks! (please don't upload x for the next hour ;))
[08:37] <Amaranth> but i mean the rest of it is basically stable
[08:37] <fabbione> mdz: it's building the debs right now :)
[08:37] <tseng> Amaranth: yeah im pretty happy with what we have atm
[08:39] <\sh> i'm stucked
[08:44] <elmo> hey, someone with mad sed skills
[08:44] <elmo> sed -ne '/LALA SOME SEPARATOR HERE LALA/,$p'
[08:44] <elmo> what's the inverse of that?
[08:45] <elmo> i.e stop printting stuff when you se e it
[08:47] <elmo> ah, nm, got it
[08:47] <elmo> (add -e '/FOO/q')
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[08:51] <mdz> elmo: if you want LALA..FOO, you can do /LAA/,/FOO/; if you want from the beginning to foo, then yeah, no -n and use /q
[08:53] <elmo> ah, duh, I see
[08:58] <\sh> ok...
[08:58] <ogra> elmo, could you sync ffmpeg please
[08:59] <\sh> hmm...looks like there is my solution for gnuradio in the CVS
[08:59] <elmo> ogra: changes ok to override?
[08:59] <\sh> so backporting from cvs
[08:59] <ogra> elmo, yeps, i'll merge them if necessary
[09:00] <elmo> ogra: um.. if you're asking for a sync, you're meant to know if a merge is necessary or not?
[09:00] <elmo> sync if changes are no longer needed, merge if they are
[09:00] <ogra> elmo, its a new upstream version...
[09:00] <elmo> not sync+merge
[09:00] <elmo> ogra: doesn't matter
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[09:01] <ogra> elmo, ok, i'm sure... changelog says * Sync with debian, no source change other than epoch to override others... as the only ubuntu entry
[09:01] <mdz> er, an epoch is significant
[09:02] <ogra> oh, damned, i have to reuse it, right ?
[09:02] <mdz> why doesn't it show up in MOM?
=== ogra looks
[09:02] <mdz> where is Keybuk, destroyer of worlds?
[09:02] <elmo> because the epoch makes it look newer than debian
[09:02] <elmo> so josie/lorraine don't see it as a merge candidate --> neither does MOM
[09:02] <daniels> mdz: busy breaking dpkg
[09:03] <mdz> ah
[09:03] <ogra> elmo, i'll pull the debian package myself and add the epoch then, thanks :)
[09:03] <elmo> ogra: so in fact, there's no way I can sync it
[09:03] <daniels> mdz: you got my mail about xorg?  it looks like some bits simply fell out
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[09:03] <ogra> elmo, understood, sorry for the noise
[09:03] <daniels> mdz: it was probably most of the xlibs-data symlinks; the XKeysymDB and XErrorDB ones should now be in libx11-6 at any rate, as it now ships that stuff
[09:03] <daniels> mdz: xkb-related symlinks should remain in xlibs-data, for the time being
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[09:04] <mdz> daniels: I got your [VAC]  mail, that's all
[09:06] <mdz> daniels: was there another one?
[09:06] <mdz> daniels: did you get my email about /usr/bin/X11?
[09:07] <daniels> mdz: yeah, and I replied to you about that
[09:08] <mdz> didn't arrive
[09:08] <mdz> daniels: the only email I have received from you since 17 Jun is [VAC] 
[09:09] <daniels> mdz: cock
[09:09] <daniels> mdz: my laptop isn't on the network now (and non-trivial to do so), so the executive summary is this
[09:10] <daniels> apps move from /usr/X11R6/bin to /usr/bin as they move into the modular tree
[09:11] <daniels> /usr/bin/X11 should be a symlinkt o /usr/bin as soon as nothing installs into it and the migration is complete, etc, etc
[09:11] <daniels> but until that happens, it's kind of hard to rely on /usr/bin/X11/foo, for any specific value of foo
[09:15] <mdz> daniels: /usr/bin/X11 used to be a symlink to /usr/X11R6/bin, right?
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[09:15] <mdz> but now it's a directory, and it contains symlinks to programs in /usr/X11R6/bin
[09:15] <mdz> which makes no sense to me
[09:15] <daniels> you're right, that makes no sense at all
[09:16] <daniels> if it's mine, it must have been some particularly bad crack
[09:16] <daniels> if not, I disclaim all responsibility
[09:16] <mdz>   * Make xserver-xorg Pre-Depend on x-common, since it ships a symlink in
[09:16] <mdz>     /usr/bin/X11 now.
[09:16] <mdz>  -- Daniel Stone <daniel.stone@ubuntu.com>  Wed, 25 May 2005 09:37:15 +1000
[09:16] <daniels> mdz: oh, right
[09:16] <mdz>   * Add /usr/bin/X11/Xorg -> /usr/X11R6/bin/Xorg symlink in xserver-xorg.
[09:17] <mdz> etc.
[09:17] <daniels> mdz: that was because that particular case was unfixable
[09:17] <mdz> Xorg and xauth are there
[09:17] <mdz> xauth has been fixed in ssh, I believe
[09:17] <daniels> mdz: due to kind of a lack of forward planning in October\
[09:17] <daniels> so yeah, Xorg can't budge, really
[09:17] <daniels> there's no sensible way to change the server configuration automatically\
[09:17] <daniels> but, er, yeah, long-term it's a symlink
[09:18] <daniels> anyway, gotta break out for dinner now
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[09:21] <daniels> in the meantime, if you guys need help on anything specific from me, I should generally be able to get back within 12h now
[09:21] <daniels> but obviously not during the weekend when I'm on the plane etc
[09:21] <mdz> daniels: are you SMS-able?
[09:22] <daniels> yes\
[09:22] <daniels> gone now for dinner
[09:22] <mdz> ok, bye
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[09:40] <ogra> :(
[09:41] <\sh> from one *censored* software to another
[09:41] <Burgundavia> why sad?
[09:42] <ogra> because ffmpeg only compiles with gcc-3.4
[09:42] <ogra> and i have to prepare a new package....
[09:42] <Burgundavia> ah
[09:49] <pitti> l
[09:50] <\sh> ogra, checked the cvs of ffmpeg?
[09:50] <seb128> sam is probably going to update that for Debian soon
[09:50] <ogra> \sh, i dont want to overtake debian wtr versioning
[09:50] <seb128> if you don't want to bother just wait
[09:51] <ogra> it works fine if compiled with gcc-3.4 and i have to add this damned epoch anyway, you cant autosync it....
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[09:52] <seb128> what epoch? where?
[09:53] <\sh> ogra, same here with gnuradio-core-2.5 ... the fixes are in cvs..and this i'm trying to compile
[09:53] <ogra> seb128, in our ffmpeg package
[09:53] <seb128> why?
[09:53] <seb128> don't put an epoch ubuntu specific
[09:53] <ogra> seb128, lamont added it in hoary, no idea why
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[09:53] <ogra> seb128, so i have to live with it *shrug*
[09:54] <\sh> hello mr. HSI customer ;)
[09:54] <ogra> hehe
[09:54] <lamont-away> ogra: I don't add epochs
[09:54] <lamont> upstream (whereever we sync'ed it from)may have added one??
[09:54] <ogra> ffmpeg (3:0.cvs20050121-1ubuntu1) hoary; urgency=low
[09:54] <ogra>   * Sync with debian, no source change other than epoch to override others...
[09:54] <ogra>  -- LaMont Jones <lamont@ubuntu.com>  Fri,  4 Feb 2005 18:04:28 -0700
[09:55] <lamont> hrm..
[09:55] <ogra> ffmpeg (0.cvs20050121-1) unstable; urgency=low
[09:55] <lamont> nfc
[09:55] <ogra> was the version before
[09:55] <lamont> then there's a 2:something in warty, or somewhere during hoary deve.l
[09:55] <seb128> we probably sync a ffmpeg 2: from marillat's archive
[09:55] <ogra> huh ? we sync from marillat ??
[09:55] <lamont> seb128: almost certainly the source of the issue
[09:56] <lamont> ogra: we did
[09:56] <seb128> we got mplayer from here
[09:56] <ogra> ouch
[09:56] <seb128> and some other stuff
[09:56] <lamont> Depends: doesn't allow architecture, does it...
[09:58] <ogra> anyway, i have no prob to touch the package twice in one release process and have it done for now to make the user happy... since we have no choice with this package anyway
[09:59] <\sh> ogra, take the chance and make it gcc-4 ready
[10:00] <ogra> \sh, i dont want to fiddle with this package... and i dont want to get ahead of debian....
[10:00] <ogra> \sh, so i will care about 4.0 if debian has a new version .... else we will at least have a workng package
[10:00] <\sh> ogra, get it ready and push the patches towards debian
[10:01] <\sh> for etch they have to do it anyway
[10:02] <ogra> \sh, fine for them, i'm no ffmpeg programmer and not interested in becoming one.... so i'll grab what i can get i just want to close this bug now...
[10:04] <ogra> \sh, and fixing it wont be trivial....
[10:05] <\sh> ogra, which version of ffmpeg?
[10:05] <\sh> 0.4.9?
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[10:06] <ogra> cvs20050313
[10:06] <\sh> i could help you :)
[10:07] <\sh> i have a surprise for you :)
[10:07] <\sh> jesus...gnuradio build ;) with g++4
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[10:09] <\sh> ogra, dcc is working for u?
[10:09] <ogra> dcc ? not very often :)
[10:09] <ogra> try it
[10:10] <\sh> kannst annehmen?
[10:10] <\sh> oder doch lieber mail?
[10:10] <ogra> hab scho
[10:10] <\sh> hihi
[10:10] <\sh> shit...english german
[10:10] <ogra> \sh, from where ? i dug through the debian bts.....
[10:10] <ogra> redhat ??
[10:11] <\sh> tschentoo
[10:11] <ogra> ah
[10:11] <ogra> heh
[10:11] <\sh> need more?
[10:12] <ogra> ergh.... the package compiles fine with 3.4 on amd64 and ppc... but not on i386, thats silly... let me try your patch
[10:13] <\sh> there is a a52, libdir and missing links patch as well
[10:13] <\sh> and a sed magic line
[10:13] <\sh> or i send u the whole ffmpeg gentoo dir
[10:14] <ogra> \sh, let me see if it compiles with 4.0 now...
[10:14] <\sh> well...i don't think so
[10:14] <ogra> \sh, i dont want to do this all again in 2 weeks...
[10:14] <\sh> or?
[10:14] <\sh> ffmpeg-0.4.9_pre1-r1.ebuild:            epatch ${FILESDIR}/0.4.8-gcc3.4-magicF2W.patch
[10:14] <ogra> thats why i wanted to go with the package as it is
[10:15] <\sh> don't tell them ;)
[10:15] <ogra> whom ?
[10:15] <\sh> gentoo ;) 
[10:15] <\sh> please check the following in your source: libavcodec/liba52/resample_mmx.c
[10:16] <\sh> if you find this line: static uint64_t __attribute__((used)) __attribute__((aligned(8))) magicF2W= 0x43c0000043c00000LL;
[10:16] <\sh> or if you have this line: static uint64_t __attribute__((aligned(8))) magicF2W= 0x43c0000043c00000LL;
[10:16] <ogra> \sh, i have to do all of this again if the debian package gets updated
[10:16] <\sh> the latter is old one, and has to be patched (more code like these)
[10:17] <\sh> well, normally, if this is as patch in gentoo, then upstream is informed and should patch their source
[10:17] <ogra> \sh, i hope the next debian version will have all patches
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[10:18] <ogra> \sh, but if not, i have to do all this again....
[10:19] <\sh> what should I do now with my nicely build gnuradio-core...it's even a replacement for old gnuradio-0.9 which isn't maintained anymore...
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[10:19] <\sh> and it's completly debian incompatible because newer then everything but g++-4 ready
[10:19] <ogra> \sh, make it a NEW package and take over maintenance ?
[10:19] <\sh> forget it
[10:20] <\sh> we have gnuradio 0.9
[10:20] <\sh> debian has gnuradio-core 2.5
[10:21] <\sh> 0.9 is not maintained anymore, gnuradio-core-2.5 is not building with g++-4 and with g++3.4 only with a lot of patches :( and latest CVS HEAD is smooth 
[10:21] <\sh> anyways I can't try it .. i don't have the hardware for it
[10:27] <mdz> tseng: if we're not going forward with beagle, we should remove it from the seeds (it's creating a lot of clutter in the anastacia output)
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[10:27] <tseng> mdz: its on my list for tonight (main reports for beagle)
[10:27] <mdz> tseng: oh, ok.  from your earlier message I thought we were going to back off on our goals
[10:27] <tseng> mdz: not for beagle
[10:27] <mdz> ok
[10:28] <tseng> mdz: i meant muine/blam more specifically
[10:28] <ogra> yes, blam looks bad
[10:28] <tseng> muine causes users confusion, and blam is just bad
[10:28] <ogra> tseng, user confusion ?
[10:28] <ogra> why that ?
[10:29] <tseng> yes, it does "intelligent" album discovery, and ignores partial albums
[10:29] <ogra> whoops
[10:29] <tseng> this doesnt work for people with inconsistant stolen music collections
[10:29] <ogra> yep, i can imagine
[10:29] <tseng> and they get confused/frustrated
[10:29] <\sh> tseng, well..amarok behaviour
[10:29] <jlj> why is blam bad?
[10:29] <tseng> jlj: it doesnt work on amd64, for starters
[10:30] <tseng> jlj: but i could make a long list.
[10:30] <ogra> jlj, because the author doesnt manage to stabilze it
[10:30] <Burgundavia> the beagle backend for it sucks
[10:30] <Burgundavia> it brings my machine to a halt after about 2 days
[10:30] <tseng> Burgundavia: are you filing bugs please
[10:30] <Burgundavia> there is already a bug for the blam issue
[10:30] <tseng> the beagle blam issue, or the blam blam issue :P
[10:31] <Burgundavia> the beagle blam issue
[10:31] <tseng> great
[10:31] <Burgundavia> the bug "Blam is total crack" doesn't exist yet
[10:31] <mdz> ogra: have you talked with Kamion about setting up Edubuntu CD builds?
[10:31] <tseng> i meant more "blam craps on amd64"
[10:31] <ogra> mdz, i wanted to start with a iso customization....
[10:31] <ogra> mdz, until i got everything running
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[10:32] <thom> i want blam blam bugs
[10:32] <melodie> hello everybody :)
[10:32] <thom> they sound much more exciting than usual bugs
[10:33] <mdz> ogra: hmm, ok
[10:33] <mdz> ogra: make sure you maintain seeds, though
[10:33] <ogra> mdz, i think we should wait with the real builds until after the summit... since we will decide the software collection there
[10:33] <Burgundavia> thom, is that where you get to shoot the reporter if they are being stupid?
[10:33] <tseng> Burgundavia: damn, file me some of those
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[10:34] <\sh> well, updating the build-deps to python2.4 thrills...even the python packages from gnuradio are building nicely now..
[10:36] <lamont> thom: stick to pebbles bugs. :-P
[10:36] <lamont> or would those be plebbles bugs?
[10:37] <melodie> do someone know if therer's any project around improving doc for ATAPI drives configuration ? 
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[10:38] <ogra>  ATAPI drives configuration ? 
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[10:38] <melodie> ogra: yes
[10:38] <ogra> setting jumpers ?
[10:38] <melodie> no, mostly all
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[10:38] <ogra> or wiring it right ? what do you configure on a ATAPI drive ?
[10:39] <melodie> ogra: the dma, but also diverse files maybe
[10:40] <melodie> ogra: the /usr/share/doc/ATAPI... comes from Debian and not adapted
[10:40] <melodie> I could not find much more on the wiki
[10:40] <melodie> that's why this question
[10:41] <ogra> melodie, for dma look at hdparm.... for most of the other possible adustmants too...
[10:41] <ogra> adjustments
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[10:42] <melodie> I looked for hdparm, in my case no change, no need of that
[10:42] <chrissturm> why is it that with pango 1.9 firefox doesnt render fonts, and epiphany still works?
[10:43] <melodie> and all the forums contain no answers about solutions for I/O errors
[10:43] <ogra> melodie, file a bug ?
[10:43] <melodie> not even the archives of the ml
[10:43] <melodie> or I go to the link for the wishes to ask improvment :)
[10:44] <ogra> whick link ?
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[10:44] <melodie> there's a link somewhere on the site, for writing suggestions and wishes :)
[10:44] <\sh> what about atapi and i/o errors.
[10:44] <\sh> ?
[10:45] <melodie> \sh: I can't grave datas anymore and could hardly before
[10:45] <melodie> I tested datas and audio
[10:45] <ogra> heh, ffmpes has a --with/without-gpl compile switch that moifys the code accordingly ... funny
[10:46] <melodie> could encode with one
[10:46] <ogra> ffmpeg even
[10:46] <melodie> could copy disk to disk with graveman
[10:46] <melodie> could burn an archive, but is corrupted
[10:47] <melodie> so couldn't transfer on the laptop
[10:47] <\sh> melodie, you're really sure, that your hardware is ok? but anyways...I think we're OT here...can we switch to #ubuntu ?
[10:47] <melodie> and found the save I/O errors on the laptop 
[10:47] <melodie> I just wanted to know if a new doc project was on... :)
[10:48] <melodie> I could have brought the precise results from divers tests
[10:48] <melodie> thanks anyhow :)
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[10:48] <mdke> thesaltydog, hiya
[10:49] <thesaltydog> ciao
[10:49] <\sh> melodie, well...if there is no doc project, start one :) 
[10:49] <ogra> yeah :)
[10:50] <ogra> melodie, or even better, talk to the docteam, i see mdke is around
[10:50] <mdke> i'm here!
[10:51] <melodie> \I agree :)
[10:51] <mdke> i don't have a lot of good news tho
[10:51] <melodie> can't lead a project, not enough knowledge
[10:51] <ogra> melodie, but you can join one ;)
[10:51] <melodie> hello mdke, you're the doc leader ?
[10:51] <mdke> melodie, nope
[10:52] <mdke> melodie, #ubuntu-doc
[10:52] <melodie> ok ;)
[10:52] <melodie> thanks
[10:52] <mdke> :)
[10:52] <melodie> good evening
[10:52] <melodie> bye till next :)
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[10:59] <\sh> ogra, i wrote to the deb maintainer of this package...
[10:59] <ogra> \sh, which one ? ffmpeg ?
[10:59] <\sh> gnuradio
[10:59] <ogra> \sh, ah
[11:00] <ogra> \sh, great :)
[11:00] <\sh> ogra, just because the changes are really nice...g++-4, python2.4 everything
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[11:00] <ogra> oh yes, he should definately have it for etch :)
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[11:01] <\sh> ogra, question is, should I upload it as replacement for the unmainted0.9
[11:02] <ogra> \sh, if the changes are necessary for us, sure...
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[11:06] <\sh> ogra, question  between us: do you know somebody here or somewhere who uses ubuntu + some piece of hardware to provide a radiostation?
[11:07] <ogra> a radiostation ?
[11:07] <Burgundavia> where I am most likely to find ross burtoni?
[11:07] <\sh> ogra, what do u think, gnuradio is ;)
[11:07] <ogra> \sh, you mean a stream....
[11:07] <ogra> \sh, i'm a bit slow today
[11:08] <\sh> http://www.gnu.org/software/gnuradio/doc/exploring-gnuradio.html
[11:08] <\sh> http://www.gnu.org/software/gnuradio/images/usrp1-small.jpg
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[11:11] <lu|away> Burgundavia: #gnome-hackers, irc.gnome.org, 'ross'
[11:13] <Burgundavia> ok
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[11:26] <Kamion> elmo: trigger change done
[11:27] <Burgundavia> tseng, have you seen beagle spawn dozens of mono processes?
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[11:46] <tseng> Burgundavia: no
[11:46] <Burgundavia> tseng, must be that blam issue
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