ajmitchpitti: which ones do you want updates on? patches are now in ssh, dpkg, manoj is updating pam to 0.79, reviewing the 50 debian patches that 0.76 carries :)12:01
pittiajmitch: hey, that sounds pretty good12:01
pittiajmitch: however, IIRC there were more (logcheck and so on)12:01
ajmitchso we'll probably use 0.79 synced from debian, since manoj will get it in there12:01
cartel_sorry all, i dont mean to be angry, it is early in the morning and ive been fighting with this all night12:02
cartel_and i dont understand why what works on debian doesnt work on ubuntu12:02
ogracartel_, because sarge released after hoary...12:03
ogracartel_, so the fix is in there, but not in hoary ....12:03
cartel_hoary is checkpointed against sid not sarge isnt it12:03
ajmitchpitti: sorry, logrotate should be built, just needs 1 change to the rules file to turn on the selinux support 12:03
cartel_or do you take sarge and try and merge in lots of stuff from sid (suicide)12:04
ogracartel_, nope12:04
ogracartel_, but sarge recieved bugfixes after hoary was released12:05
ajmitchcartel_: the split package was in experimental until 6th June, but had been in hoary. the bug was fixed on the 17th12:05
cartel_too much double handling if you ask me12:05
ogracartel_, the fix was discovered after hoary was released and already is in breezy, where is the double handling... 12:07
cartel_the double handling is in divergent branches12:08
cartel_since ubuntu is effectively a branch of sarge as you say12:08
cartel_much work wasted on people merging others patches12:09
ajmitchcartel_: the debian & ubuntu maintainer is the same person12:09
cartel_ian was right you make life difficult for yourselves12:09
ogracartel_, when did i say _that_ ?12:09
ogracartel_, you said that12:09
pittinight everybody12:09
mdzpitti: night12:10
seb128'night pitti 12:10
ajmitchnight pitti 12:10
ogracartel_, ubuntu is a snapshot of sid, gets constantly updated until we freeze to stabilize12:10
cartel_you're trying to take sid and stabilise it, not even 1000 dds can do that so how can ~50 ubuntu people do it12:10
tsengcartel_: can you please take it down a notch12:10
tsengcartel_: we aim to stabilize a very small portion of sid12:11
cartel_tseng: huh?12:11
tsengcartel_: "universe" is best effort12:11
ajmitchbecause ubuntu freezes, sid doesn't12:11
tsenghuh? we spend our lives on this stuff and you are coming of as very critical without much understanding12:11
tsengid just prefer you ask w/o the tone that you know we are doomed12:12
cartel_tseng: im saying you are making life difficult for yourselves12:12
tsengyou know12:12
tsengits largely automatic, actually12:12
cartel_until there is a bug12:12
tsengyes, non-critical bugs in released products dont get fixed12:13
tsengyou are right12:13
cartel_then you have to wait 6 months for it to get fixed in $(debian_version)+112:13
ogracartel_, we can do it with (actually less then 30 ppl) because we have a sensible software selection for main12:13
tsengcartel_: universe is unsupported12:13
ogracartel_, MOTU who cares for universe just starts to exist12:14
cartel_and everything outside of a tiny enduser focus is ignored12:14
ogracartel_, in hoary 10 ppl cared for 15000 universe packages...12:14
tseng$ apt-cache show ssh-krb5 | grep Section 12:14
tsengSection: universe/net12:14
ogracartel_, so there i admit that we might have lots of bugs left12:14
tsengthis is a community maintained package12:14
tsengif no one in debian or ubuntu fixes the bug within the 6 month cycle12:15
cartel_tseng we have gone far past ssh-krb512:15
tsengyou are quite right, it has to wait12:15
tsengim making it into an example12:15
ogracartel_, which should change with every additional MOTU12:15
tsengyou are free to care for that package12:15
cartel_i thought about becoming a motu12:15
ogracartel_, go ahead... 12:15
cartel_but then i realised its better for me to put my work into debian12:15
tsengwe are very nice when you dont put us on defense :)12:15
cartel_and have a trickle down12:15
cartel_im sorry guys12:16
ogracartel_, who says your work doesnt go into debian12:16
cartel_ive just been fighting this prob all night12:16
seb128cartel_: fixes go both ways all the time12:16
tsengwell, you didnt find it while we were working on hoary for 6 months12:16
cartel_trying to show my clients how good ubuntu is for a desktop12:16
tsengso we didnt have a chance to fix it12:16
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cartel_it just wont talk to their ads realm properly12:17
cartel_when their 6 woody/sarge boxes dont have issue12:17
seb128cartel_: send a bug if you want an issue fixed, that works like that for every distro12:17
cartel_perhaps you can understand this small frustration12:17
cartel_i dont mean to take it out on you all12:18
seb128bugs happens? right12:18
cartel_i genuinely love (k)ubuntu12:18
seb128point them so they can be fixed12:18
cartel_but when stuff doesnt work that is trivial in debian i get upset12:18
ajmitch10am now, and been up all night?12:18
seb128cartel_: Debian has bugs too ...12:18
cartel_ajmitch: i gave up at 11pm and im back at it at 8:3012:18
seb128cartel_: and if Debian fixes an issue it gets fixed for Ubuntu too12:19
cartel_ajmitch: thought a sleep on it would help12:19
ograseb128, that bug was fixed some weeks ago12:19
ograseb128, its just not fixed in hoary unoverse12:19
cartel_but that ssh-krb5 was just the straw on the camels back12:20
ajmitchcartel_: sleep usually does help12:20
cartel_i apologise for putting you all on defense12:20
cartel_you are all doing a great job12:20
cartel_commendable effort12:20
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cartel_i hope improvements to desktop experience gained through ubuntus work flow back to debian too12:21
Riddelllifeless: do you know why kexi is dep-wait on mysql-dev when it's build-dep is mysql12-dev?12:23
ogracartel_, sure... seb128 maintains them in both worlds....the only prob are the different release schedules and debians longer stabilizing time here.... so its likely to be outdated, since they support 11 arches and we only 3 and they have a way bigger main component12:23
lifelessRiddell: nope. You do know that I am not in the distro team ?12:23
tsenglifeless: i think he confused you with infinity :)12:24
lifelesstseng: could be ;)12:24
ograheh... hard to confuse these two12:24
lifelessRiddell: but ask me about version control foo ;012:24
cartel_now i am going to go and make a green tea to calm my nerve :)12:24
Riddellman, all these abstract IRC nicks12:25
Riddellinfinity: do you know why kexi is dep-wait on mysql-dev when it's build-dep is mysql12-dev?12:25
cartel_why did ubuntu opt for bugzilla over debian bts?12:27
cartel_when reportbug is so convenient?12:27
cartel_i know you are transitioning to malone12:27
cartel_once it reaches OnePointZero12:27
seb128cartel_: bugzilla is much better than the BTS imho12:28
cartel_but in the interim?12:28
cartel_you think?12:28
cartel_from maintainer perspective or user perspective?12:28
seb128cartel_: I use both a lot12:28
seb128you have not Cc: on a bug with the BTS12:29
cartel_that is trivial to implement12:29
seb128ou have no search, which makes search for a duplicate ... hum ... long12:29
cartel_but bts shows you bugs when you do a reportbug12:29
seb128a lot of users like to use a webform than the BTS has not12:29
cartel_you can see if there is a dupe before you file12:29
cartel_i hates the webform12:29
seb128people are not happy to use the command line ...12:30
cartel_who is this people?12:30
seb128and sending a bug to submit@b.d.o is not trivial12:30
ogracartel_, my mother12:30
seb128cartel_: anybody than you can put on front of a desktop and which is not a computer guy12:30
\shogra: greetings to your mother :)12:30
cartel_well bugzilla does not collect the information bts does like installed dependency versions12:30
cartel_at least not automatically12:31
cartel_which makes life as a maintainer more difficult12:31
seb128cartel_: not, but have a some bug-buddy hack for this12:31
mdzelmo: is us.archive permanently gone?12:31
hubwhate does a "c2" means in the package name ?12:32
ogranope g++412:32
hubbecause gcc4 reject what i'm building12:32
cartel_from the sounds of it i must be one of fthe few who prefer bts to bugzilla12:32
ajmitchchange in c++ ABI for g++ 3.4/4.012:32
hubyesh g++412:32
hubit is wxWin :-/12:32
seb128cartel_: just because of the mail command?12:32
ajmitchhub: is there a problem?12:33
ograhub we get 2.6 soon12:33
cartel_seb128: i expect reportbug to connect to bugzilla but it doesnt12:33
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cartel_seb128: i am debian since hamm :)12:33
hubajmitch: building the program I'm trying to package, yes12:33
seb128cartel_: you are not forced to like the BTS if you use Debian you know .. 12:34
ajmitchhub: aha :)12:34
cartel_seb128: but i am used to it12:34
hubajmitch: and I build in Breezy :-/12:34
ajmitchhub: broken/non-compliant source then?12:34
hubajmitch: as far as I know, it is not an error12:34
hubajmitch: but who knows12:34
\shhub: something was with wxwin12:35
hubwas ?12:36
hubso I should wait for wxWin2.6 ?12:36
\shand search for wxwindows2.412:37
\shit's already build for g++412:37
\shhttp://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/w/wxwindows2.4/ i think12:38
\shif this is it what you want12:38
hubsh: I have it12:39
hubii  libwxgtk2.4c2                               wxWindows Cross-platform C++ GUI toolkit (GTK+ runtime)12:39
hubI got an answer12:40
hubI have to fix the codef i'm building12:40
\shhub: helped?12:40
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hubtrying to rebuild12:41
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hubto see where the link error occurs12:41
\shhub: but this is what you wanted12:42
hubwhat ? the packages ? I had them already12:42
hubit is not a package problem. It is a gcc4 problem12:42
hubor source code12:42
hubwhichever is your point of view :-/12:43
hubI have to patch 12:43
\shah ok12:43
huband my machine is slow12:47
hubthanks I don't build on the laptop12:48
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\shhub: i do :)12:48
hubbut your laptop is probably faster than mine12:49
\shdunno :)12:50
karlhegIs there ro access to revision controlled Ubuntu versions of packages?12:50
hubsh: Powerbook G3/40012:50
karlhegI would like to suggest a few changes, and would prefer to submit them to the maintainer in patch format.12:51
karlhegI'm wondering if you keep a central repository?12:51
jdubkarlheg: other than the source package repositories, not yet. that will be changing pretty soon, though.12:53
karlhegbaz or tla, I hope?12:55
karlhegI've just begun to learn to use 'xtla', in GNU Emacs.  It's a very nicely done interface to 'tla'.  I don't know if it works with 'baz'; I've just begun learning about them.01:00
cartel_hmm, wikipage says winbind in ubuntu hoary is 3.0.14 but i dont have it01:04
cartel_i have 3.0.1001:04
cartel_oh, its in breezy01:05
cartel_crap i dont want to use breezy01:05
ogracartel_, recompile the package, apt-get {build-dep,source -b} is your friend01:07
cartel_ogra: thats what im doing ;)01:07
cartel_ogra: but once again it is a pain to not update hoary with bugfixes01:10
ogracartel_, debian does the same01:10
ograonly security and dataloss fixes01:11
cartel_ogra: i know01:11
cartel_ogra: it pisses me off actually01:11
cartel_ogra: at least in debian you can subscribe to proposed-updates01:12
azeemcartel_: not that proposed-update is any good01:12
azeemit's either crack or 'security and dataloss fixes'01:12
karlhegWow, xtla makes pcl-cvs look like a toy.01:12
cartel_something should be done01:13
cartel_create a bugfix team ;)01:13
ogracartel_, we actually think about a backports team... so you can use these from a controlled source01:14
azeemcartel_: "something" is called "6-month release cycle"01:14
cartel_azeem: 6 months with broken functionality not good01:15
cartel_azeem: sorry client that doesnt work. wait 6 months01:15
cartel_and it MAY work01:15
azeemcartel_: is that a package in main?01:15
cartel_azeem: its a package which is in main and has a component in universe01:15
cartel_azeem: which will get promoted to main for breezy01:16
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azeemcartel_: so it should work then :)01:16
cartel_azeem: but it doesnt :)01:16
azeemor else keep helping on it till it rocks01:16
cartel_azeem: because hoary froze before the bugfix was in01:16
ogracartel_, these are two different source packages01:16
cartel_ogra: no they arent01:17
ograopenssh-krb5 and openssh 01:17
azeemcartel_: I mean for breezy01:17
cartel_ogra: not talking about that any more01:17
cartel_ogra: on to samba :)01:17
cartel_azeem: fixed in breezy01:17
Burgundaviajdub, ping01:17
jdubBurgundavia: pong01:18
jdubyo azeem 01:18
jdubazeem: good summary :)01:18
Burgundaviajdub, there wasa 3.0 mockup on d-d, which a change menu. Do you have that link?01:19
azeemjdub: I tried to pass it by mako, but he was on a plane or something :-/01:19
ajmitchhey azeem 01:19
azeemhey andrew01:19
Burgundaviajdub, nev mind01:22
azeemjdub: so if you think there's errors or omissions, please let me know :)01:26
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hubgcc4 piss me off02:17
hubI can't package this software on breezy02:17
azeemjust Build-Depend on gcc-3.4 :)02:18
hubazeem: but the C++ it link against ?02:19
hubthat's why I have to rebuild it02:19
hubit got de-installed by the whole upgrade02:21
hubso I'm trying to make a clean packaging02:21
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bddebianAnyone home?04:02
=== cartel_ patches ActiveDirectoryWinbindHowto with his finding
bddebiancartel_: Do you know another mirror for Breezy?04:04
cartel_bddebian: nz.archive.ubuntu.org? 04:05
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cartel_should i tell users how to build/install samba from breezy for hoary in the wiki?04:06
cartel_or is that considered harmful?04:06
cartel_ogra? anyone?04:07
cartel_weird wiki syntax04:08
infinitycartel_ : Encouraging users to backport packages themselves is considered harmful, yes, because they lose security updates.04:17
cartel_infinity: well the wiki has broken info as it stands, reccomending them to install the package from breezy, but providing no instructions04:18
infinitycartel_ : And samba has had its fair share of security problems over the years.  Leaving users vulnerable is not nice.04:18
cartel_infinity: but they ARE vulnerable. we're still running 3.0.10 in hoary04:18
infinityVulnerable to...?04:19
cartel_bugs? ;)04:20
cartel_i thought there was another security issue between 3.0.10 and 3.0.14 but evidently not04:21
infinityIf there's a security vuln, we'll backport the patch to
cartel_interesting... ibm guys commiting to samba04:22
infinityBut if users have 3.0.14a installed, they won't get the update.04:22
infinityWhich sucks.04:22
cartel_infinity: ouch04:22
cartel_infinity: as it stands you cant auth to win2003 sp1 with versions <3.0.14a04:23
infinityIf you want to make that VERY clear in those directions, then fine.04:23
cartel_as you say it will cause more problems than it fixes04:23
infinityIf you can find me a patch to apply to 3.0.10 to fix the specific bug and none other, I may be able to push it unto hoary-updates.04:23
cartel_i will need to trawl through the svn history04:24
infinityBut telling users (many of whom dont' really think of the consequences) to install unsupported packages can be catastrophic.04:24
infinityThere have been many worms in the past that spread through vulnerable samba installations, so it's not just hand waving on my part.04:24
cartel_fair enough04:27
cartel_those poor users :p04:27
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bob2tseng: http://kirby.insanegenius.net/postfix.html05:17
cartel_kirby looking for dox on postfix?05:20
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hubokay, found a gcc4 bug05:23
Lathiatjoin  the club :)05:24
hubhugin chokes on an inlined virtual destructor05:25
hubputting it in the .cpp works :-/05:25
hubbut now the stupid debian packager believe this is a debian native05:32
bob2who's the person who packaged it?05:36
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hubbob2: me05:50
hubbob2: it si not an ubuntu package05:50
hubbob2: I was talking about the software, not the person :-)05:51
hubbut I probably messed up05:52
bob2do you know the difference between native and non-native?05:53
hubbut I probably messed up in creating the package05:54
hubbecause I did re-extract the tarball and did put my debian in it05:54
hubso he probably believes it came with05:55
bob2why did you do that?05:55
hubbecause I messed up with the previous tarball while attempting to fix the gcc4 problem05:55
hubI'll try a third time05:56
hubshould work this time06:06
hubnow I need to apply to be a MOTU06:19
zulyou might want to poeple in #ubuntu-motu06:24
hubI was reading the wiki06:30
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jsgotangcoJaneW, hi07:55
jsgotangcoooppss brb07:56
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pittiMorning folks08:35
JaneWmorning pitti08:38
pittiHey JaneW 08:38
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pittiHi dholbach 09:21
karlhegI'm looking at the udu.wiki and am wondering what does "BOF" stand for?  (dictd says "Birds of a Feather")09:22
mdkeit means brainstorming session09:22
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dholbachhey pitti09:24
mvomorning all09:24
dholbachhey mvo :)09:24
mvohey dholbach!09:24
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dholbachkarlheg: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BOFs :)09:26
jdubhi dholbach 09:30
dholbachjdub: hey jeff! how are you?09:31
jdubhow's your thesis going?09:31
jdubhaven't seen you around so much :)09:31
dholbachslowly evolving :)09:31
dholbachand if i find somebody who does my networking code^H^H^Herm ... gives me some input on ... 09:32
dholbachin 8 weeks it's over09:32
dholbachthe hardest thing for me is staying away from all of you guys09:34
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dholbachthe thesis itself is just fine ;)09:34
dholbachjdub: but the desktop team would better get going, as well as the bugsquad, maybe we could do another ubuntu-love day to recruit people for the teams :)09:37
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mdkeyeah that's a decent point09:39
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davydok, I might have to do something creative, what is the atheros driver? and does it ship in the Hoary installer?09:43
dholbachrock, we're in the german news (with the breezy bounties): http://www.heise.de/newsticker/meldung/6099609:45
martinkdavyd: linux-restricted-modules comes with madwifi, the driver for atheros wlan chips09:45
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davydmartink: which isn't in the installer?09:46
=== davyd suspects he is not going to get a painless install
martinkoh, the question was about the installer. Sorry. Don't know.09:46
=== davyd might try netbooting breezy
davydotherwise I might have to send a new kernel in my netboot image09:48
davydor try to boot off USB09:48
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davydok, perhaps breezy ships the same kernel09:51
davydalso, the hoary installer segfaults if you plug in a usb device09:56
Lathiatbreezy has a 2.6.12 kernel but not in theinstaller yet i think09:57
Lathiatwhy not install hoary and l-r-m post-install ?09:57
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dholbachhey seb128 09:59
seb128daniel :)))10:00
pittiHi seb128!10:00
seb128hey pitti 10:00
pittiseb128: I got the gdm error this morning, and I do have xterm installed10:00
davydLathiat: first I have to install hoary10:00
seb128pitti: I've just fixed that and the autologin10:01
seb128before IRCing10:01
davydI suppose I can install the first stage10:01
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=== davyd ponders a PCMCIA card
seb128pitti: that's not really an error, the upstream stuff tries to start Xclients, then xsm (which is this ugly stuff)10:01
seb128pitti: the Debian package has a change to that, I've zapped it when switching to cdbs, that's fixed now10:02
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Lathiatdavyd: why cant you just install?10:04
davydLathiat: I can do the first stage install10:05
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Lathiatdavyd: so why arent you?:)10:05
davydthen I might be able to use usb2 prism10:06
Lathiatdavyd: whats theproblem of just doing a whole hoary install?10:06
davydLathiat: no packages to do it with10:07
davydback to square one, I still need packages10:07
Lathiatwhy dont you just get the iso10:07
davydLathiat: no CD-Rom10:07
Lathiatbecause your going to download it all anyway10:07
Lathiatnow it makes sense10:07
Lathiatget the iso10:07
Lathiatmount loopback on your desktop10:07
davydLathiat: and USB devices crash it10:07
Lathiatand network install10:07
Lathiat(thats what i do)10:07
Lathiatoh, no network10:07
davydLathiat: no network drivers10:07
=== Lathiat laughs
Lathiatdavyd: are you going to have a windows partition?10:07
davydI'm not 100% an idiot10:07
davydLathiat: yes10:07
Lathiatdavyd: put the iso on your windows partition and use expert mode and load the iso loopback off your windows partition10:08
davydyou're suggesting I loopback mount that?10:08
Lathiat(the installer has a mode for it, its not even hacky)10:08
davydare you sure this is something you can do?10:10
Lathiati feel dirty, im using kde10:10
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seb128pitti: have you planned to review libmpc this week?10:11
pittiI can do that today if it's urgent10:12
hungerIs there a list of changes ubuntu did to vanilla gnome?10:12
seb128pitti: no hurry, we just can sync with Debian when this is ok10:15
seb128pitti: but sync next week is fine too :)10:15
pittihunger: cat debian/patches/* of all gnome packages :-)10:16
seb128or read the debian/changelog (if that's no a mvo's sync :p)10:17
hungerpitti: Thanks!10:17
seb128usually patches are listed by the changelog10:17
hungerkubuntu used to have a wiki page listing the mayor changes they wanted to do. I thought maybe there is something similar for gnome.10:18
seb128pitti: funny "g-v-m opens my trash" bug BTW :)10:18
Lathiatseb128: url?10:18
pittiseb128: indeed :)10:18
seb128hunger: we don't plan to make a lot of distro specific changes10:18
seb128Lathiat: just a bugzilla bug, trash:// being open due to an USB mouse moving and clicking when plugged10:19
hungerseb128: Gnome does almost feel nice in ubuntu... Damn, if you didn't do many changes then I might end up having to readjust my perception that gnome sucks;-)10:20
seb128ah ah10:20
davydPCMCIA for the win10:20
jdubhunger: there is a page of branding related changes that covers a few other things - search for branding in the wiki10:21
jdubhunger: but in general, it's very similar to stock gnome, with skin deep changes (theme, etc)10:21
hungerjdub: OK, thanks!10:22
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dsevillahi, anybody knows when linux-restricted-modules-2.6.12 are expected?10:29
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Lathiatdsevilla: when they arrive10:31
dsevillaLathiat, yeah, wow, I must have suspected it :)10:32
dholbach /query jdub10:35
dholbachnow you all know it :)10:35
makoazeem: i'm in your country now if it's not too late for me to look it over10:38
jsgotangcohey mako!10:38
makoi'm putting together my own talk(s) now but it's fine10:38
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seb128jdub, mako: did vuntz contact you about CD for the RMLL?10:43
jdubseb128: vuntz asked me, i directed him to mako/jane10:43
makoseb128: are you going to be at RMLL?10:44
jsgotangcohmm adi sent an email about the certification thing and posted it on the wiki..10:46
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Treenakshttp://www.ubuntulinux.org/support/documentation/faq/betaTesting is a bit outdated...11:13
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danielsAmaranth: awesome11:45
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guimhi all12:08
guimis there any people from the original company Canonical here?12:08
guimworking for the company, i wanted to mean12:09
Keybukplenty of us12:10
pittithe part that works on the distribution is here at least12:10
guimok, i have some question/suggestion i 'd like to report to some of you guys them,12:10
guimbut do you mind if i do so in private first?12:10
Lathiatdaniels: is it possible to deactivate a screen on the fly12:11
Lathiatdaniels: or at least stop the mouse wandering into it12:11
Keybukguim: we're a pretty public company, why not just speak here?12:11
guimno problem12:12
guimlet me present myself first then :12:12
guimi am a developer in the following opensrouce project www.claroline.net12:12
guimthis is a LMS (Learning Management System) in  PHP/Mysql12:13
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danielsLathiat: nope12:13
guimI don't know if some of you knows a bit about our project?12:13
Amaranthogra might12:14
Amaranthhe seems to be doing a lot of work on the edubuntu project12:14
guimthe thing is that i wonder if there could be an "arrangment" between our project and the ubuntu comunity 12:15
guimbut i have to tell that i am only starting with ubuntu, and for now, I don't much already about the organisation of the community12:16
ograguim, subscribe to edubuntu-devel (low traffic) and ask there ;)12:16
guimok thanks12:16
infinityguim : Speaking of your project...12:16
infinityguim : I don't suppose you guys would mind rewriting your code to not require register_globals?12:16
guimit is done12:17
guimfor next version12:17
infinityguim : Ah,, then can you update your docs? :)12:17
guimwell, not released yet12:17
infinityguim : Asking users to turn it on opens a pretyt big can of worms.12:17
guimbut it will be soon for an alpha 1.712:17
infinityguim : Right, cool.  Thanks.12:17
guimno problem12:17
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carlosfabbione, hi, will you have some time today to help me fixing my kernel issue?12:24
ogracarlos, he is on holiday (long weekend)12:25
carlosoh!, right12:25
carlostoo late...12:25
carlosogra, anyway, thanks12:26
Lathiatdoes breezy enable the thing like dmix for recording in alsa?12:26
pittiLathiat: I didn't check that12:28
pittiLathiat: so far it does enable dmix for playback12:28
pittididn't check dsnoo12:28
pittidsnoop, even12:28
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Lathiattats the one12:29
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upsthere is a bug report on "skype" in bugzilla - what can be done to that? skype isn't in the ubuntu repositories right?12:35
dholbachups: no it isn't - it's non-free12:35
Lathiatnope its not12:35
Lathiat(they provide ubuntu packages tho)12:36
upsso i should close the bug?12:36
Lathiat(which is probably why they are filing it here)12:36
Lathiatnot sure12:36
Lathiati assume12:36
Lathiatforwarding it upstream to be nice?12:36
upsdoes that mean that i should file a bug upstream too? or just make a comment?12:37
JanCLathiat : skype isn't nice to others (no open protocol), so why should we be nice to them?  ;-)12:42
Lathiatyou have to give them some credit12:42
tsengthey built a linux client12:43
Lathiatthey use dbus, they have good packages12:43
tsengwe should have more non-free linux clients12:43
Lathiatthey dont use 0.3x yet tho12:43
tsengnot chase away the people that give us some12:43
Lathiattseng: are you being sarcastic or serious?12:43
=== Lathiat nods
JanCI have no problem with them being non-free12:43
LathiatJanC: theres a good reason they dont use an open protocol12:44
JanCbut I care about open communication12:44
Lathiati just wish theyd interface with open protocols12:44
LathiatJanC: basically, because of the way it works12:44
Lathiatp2p, nat traversal etc12:44
Lathiatwhat they need is a sip gateway12:44
JanCor just open their protocol   :)12:45
Lathiatand their problem is they dont want to open it up becaause the network relies on people doing other peoples phone call traffic12:45
tsengJanC: they have a product to sell12:45
Lathiatand then they'll get clients that wont and then fuck the network12:45
Lathiat(from their point of view)12:45
tsengJanC: i go to work every day and write code I have no intentions of showing you. i need a paycheck like everyone else here12:46
JanCwell, they could provide a closed source lib maybe ?12:47
tsengeh, theyd need a very thorough API doc at that point12:48
tsengapi + sniffer -> easy reversal12:48
LathiatJanC: they have an api ;)12:48
tsengJanC: we should be supporting commercial ISV's bringing their products to linux as much as we can12:48
JanCtseng : I have no problem with commercial / closed source companies12:49
JanCbut I have a problem with closed protocols / file formats12:49
tsengwell the protocol is the key piece of skype12:49
tsenganyone can make a nice interface on top of SIP12:50
=== tseng > shower
upsbug #11785 is marked as Blocker, priority P1 - is it ok to change it to more like Normal, P2?12:54
=== ups is asking too many questions ;)
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`anthonyjust a heads-up - there's a critical bug in dbus-python, with a patch attached to https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1844. Any time a python app has more than one thread, dbus python will segfault. 01:46
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Nafallolivecds seems borked :-P01:52
doko`anthony: yes, that's https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=729201:53
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davydis the reason that there is no atheros driver for 2.6.12 the fact that it's actually uncompilable?01:53
davydor am I simply an idiot?01:54
davydalso, is there a reason there is no sk98lin driver in the 2.6.12 kernels?01:54
ogradavyd, i guess the atheros driver is in linux-restricted-modules..... which is nonexistent currently01:54
davydogra: right01:54
ogradavyd, so stay with 2.6.10 or wait....01:55
davydI was trying to compile the source, so far with no joy... it might be a gcc-4.0 hating-ism01:55
davydogra: at the moment, I have no supported network cards01:55
Lathiatdavyd: you need to compile with gcc-3.401:55
ogradavyd, the kernel doesnt compile with gcc-4.0 01:55
Lathiatdavyd: (cus the kernel is built with gcc-3.4 at the moment)01:55
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davydthe version of madwifi in the Ubuntu 2.6.10 is not so working01:55
davydLathiat: yep. realise this01:55
Lathiatyeh it sucks apparently01:55
davydI think madwifi might have been ignoring my request to use 3.401:56
davydI'll play with this some more in a bit01:56
Lathiatchange the symlink01:56
Lathiatthats what i do01:56
=== davyd smirks
Lathiattho nvidia suspend CC=01:56
Lathiatso i dontneedto atm01:56
davydI would have update-alternatives'd01:57
Lathiati swear my brain just fucks withw ords sometimes01:57
davydbut it seems there is to be no joy from that division01:57
Lathiatdavyd: no imean like, rm /usr/bin/gcc ; l n -s /usr/bin/gcc-3.4 /usr/bin/gcc ;)01:57
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davydLathiat: yeah, I could01:57
davydI'm currently building a 2.6.12 with the module I think I need for my wired network01:57
davydwe'll see how that goes01:57
Lathiatinteresting, sk98lin was in .1001:58
Lathiatand not in l-r-m01:58
davydthere is an skfp, which probes... but does nothing01:58
davydso I'm trying rebuilding with it in .1201:59
davydsince it didn't work in .1001:59
Lathiatbought the wrong laptop :)01:59
Lathiatyou should replace the atheros minipci with an intel :)01:59
davydI knew it couldn't be 100% painless01:59
Lathiatand ebay the atheros :)02:00
=== davyd smirks
davydperhaps replace it with my orinoco gold02:00
Lathiat(im serious :)02:00
Lathiatdavyd: thats minipci?02:00
Lathiatdavyd: cool, no g love tho02:00
Nafallort2500 works, a bit :-)02:00
`anthonydoko: cool - have added a note to that bug, too.02:00
davydyou can't buy a brand new, top of the range laptop and expect everything to be supported in released linux02:01
davydunless the vendor loves you02:01
davydor it's a boring machine :(02:01
Nafallothere is a major rewrite of the drivers for rt2x00 and it's included in the main kernel :-=02:01
Lathiati dunno, my dell worked pretty good02:01
Nafalloin ubuntu02:01
Lathiatit had been around for a wee while tho02:01
Lathiatbut it was pretty highly specced02:01
davydLathiat: yeah, most stuff on this thing just works02:01
davydjust no network cards02:01
davydwhich is strange02:01
Lathiatdavyd: but like, my wireless is centrino02:01
Lathiatand my ethernet is broadcom02:01
davydsince network cards are usually the most boring thing on the machine02:02
Lathiatwhich have been around for quitea while02:02
Lathiati wish this had gigE02:02
davydI was surprised not to have the Intel GigE chip02:02
Lathiatonly thing thats annoying02:02
davydit's interesting that only a few people use it02:02
Lathiatdavyd: most onboard stuff is yukon02:02
davydI wonder if it's expensive02:02
Lathiatmost motherboards with onboard gig have marvell yukons too02:02
davydworse comes to worse, I'll just have to ndiswrapper them02:02
Lathiatsome broadcom02:02
davydI should have set my kernel building on here02:04
davydoh well02:04
=== davyd has cold hands
Lathiathows the 10mbit xircom pcmcia? :)02:05
Lathiatdavyd: so was this davyd-funded or work-funded?02:05
davydI start a new job Monday02:06
davydthis will be davyd funded02:06
KeybukGAH!  Now I'm getting Cc'd on the mom "further changes have been made" comments02:06
davydbut I have established a payment plan with (old-)work to do it02:07
Lathiatdavyd: ooh what job?02:07
Lathiatdavyd: the gtk coding one?02:07
Lathiathm global keybd shortcuts dont work accross X screens02:07
Lathiatthats mildly annoying02:07
davydLathiat: yep02:08
davydwe'll see how that goes02:08
davydif I hate it, I'll go back to systems programing02:08
Keybukhmm, does bugzilla not let you change the reporter e-mail address?02:09
davydKeybuk: unlikely02:09
Keybukhow stupid02:10
davydit's not often that you need to change the reporter I would guess02:11
NafalloI'm locked out from launchpad :-(02:14
Nafalloseems it can't handle passwords generated with pwgen -cnys 72 :-(02:14
Mithrandiryou could consider passwords less than 72 characters long. :-P02:15
NafalloMithrandir: only when they are not supported ;-)02:16
NafalloI like those systems where you get warned that the password won't work while changing it ;-)02:16
HWolfNafallo, you are seriously able to remember such an insane password? :P02:16
NafalloHWolf: nope, but Firefox will :-)02:17
NafalloHWolf: and so will my .txt on the really small cf-card and the print-out from that .txt when I'm done with it :-).02:17
HWolfNafallo, sounds like very very dangerous behavior. :P02:18
HWolfWhat's the use of a password if you'll print it out, and carry it around.02:18
Nafallo_BUT_, it will get hard for people to bruteforce that one ;-)02:18
Nafalloonly locked me out from 3-4 sites yet ;-)02:18
HWolfYeah, but anyone who is smart, would just try to hack your firefox. :P02:19
NafalloI won't carry it around.02:19
NafalloI will follow Mithrandir's advice about bankvalves :-)02:19
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NafalloHWolf: hehe02:19
HWolfFor the record, I have no right to speak, I just gave my bank-pass and PIN to my mother. :)02:20
Nafallofirefox has less then 30 chars :-/02:20
HWolfNafallo, so what if your pc gets robbed of you? :P02:21
NafalloHWolf: yea, I have to teach the bios to ignore ESC or something :-/02:22
MithrandirNafallo: you can try to just cut down the password to 64 chars or other similar "magic" limits02:24
NafalloMithrandir: worked :-902:25
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NafalloMithrandir: thanx. you deserve another hug or something :-)02:26
Mithrandiryou can buy me beer when you get around02:26
Nafallohehe, if I find a way to have more money than 1,91SEK after the bills... :-P02:26
Nafalloi.e. current condition :-/02:27
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Nafallobugzilla supports 16 chars passwd :-P02:29
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dholbachsee you later03:13
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ddaaHey guys.04:10
ddaaIs there some sort of official bulgarian loco guy for ubuntu?04:10
ddaaI need help for making a good description of https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/products/bgoffice04:11
ddaahomepage: http://bgoffice.sourceforge.net/04:11
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JaneWI just got an e-mail saying 'Please integrate Speedtouch USB 330(and other models) support in the next release of Ubuntu.' Is that doable, or is that one of those proprietary driver ones..?04:19
kikohey uberhackers04:20
kikocountdown to bugday04:20
Nafallohi kiko :-)04:20
MithrandirJaneW: I think it's doable.  They have firmware, but the driver is free, afaik.04:20
seb128elmo: drivel sync please04:22
JaneWMithrandir: thanks04:25
ograMithrandir, isnt that already in ?04:25
Mithrandirogra: I don't know, but if not, it should be doable.04:26
ograsure, but i think its already contained04:26
Mithrandirseems like there's a driver there, but I couldn't see any firmware04:27
Mithrandirand the module has request_firmware in it04:27
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Lathiatseb128: yay drivel04:27
Lathiatseb128: 2.0 i assume?04:28
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nictukuhi. I'm stuck in a bug that is something like debian's #26659104:42
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martinhjI got an idea conserning network-admin: (1) I think it should update dhclient.conf to send the current hostname to DNS/DHCP (send host-name in dhclient.conf)04:47
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martinhjanybody here working with the gnome-system-tools package?04:53
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seb128Lathiat: whatever Debian has, that doesn't matter, why?04:54
seb128Lathiat: 2.0.1 atm04:54
Lathiatseb128: funk (we had 1.x before, 2.0 is a *big* improvement :)04:56
ogramartinhj, network-admin is likely to dissapear from our desktop since we got network-manager which will become the default for breezy04:57
martinhjogra: the one from redhat / suse rlove is working on?04:57
ogramartinhj, yep, but with some adjustments and modicfications to fit into ubuntu04:58
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martinhjlike support for the debian config files (networking/interfaces)?04:59
martinhjI like that in network-admin:-)04:59
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tsengit uses networking/interfaces05:01
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martinhjtseng: sorry, I ment /etc/network/interfaces-file05:03
martinhjthe ...-file05:03
pittiHi mdz05:09
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mdzpitti: morning05:20
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mdzjbailey-gcc: I think we should probably do a backport of https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=11730 to Hoary; it seems to have pretty broad impact and the fix is simple and isolated05:21
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jbailey-gccmdz: Okay.  It's close enough to when the Hoary snapshot was taken that if there's other patches that it depends on they'll likely be pretty small.05:26
mdzjbailey-gcc: will you prepare an update?05:27
mdzkiko: you are moving in on my territory, replying to months-old messages05:28
kikomdz, I'm sorry, I need to clear them out and I still have 450 unread :-(05:29
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mdzdoko: thanks for the oo.o2 update; what's the status of the 64-bit work?05:30
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mdzbddebian: hi05:35
mdzhas Kamion been around today?  he was having problems with his Internet connection05:36
mdzelmo: what's the word on backports?05:37
bddebianHello mdz05:37
lamont__mdz: how does hoary-backports differ from hoary-updates?05:39
mdzlamont__: different use case, different process05:39
mdzhoary-updates policy remains unchanged, but hoary-backports will be similar to what the backports team is already doing05:40
pittiHi lamont__ 05:40
lamont__mdz: ok05:40
lamont__mdz: fwiw, buildd's are just waiting for w-b to believe that the suite exists05:41
sabdflmdz: i see gmail is being translated. if its in po files they might want to consider rosetta05:41
mdzsabdfl: just the UI, or more than that?05:42
sabdflui only i think05:42
sabdflnot sure how they do the back end page generation, it may not involve po files05:42
sabdflbut if it does, rosetta would be perfect for them05:42
mdzsabdfl: I'll see if I can make contact with somebody05:43
mdzinteresting use case, translating web applications05:43
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jbailey-gccmdz: Yup.  (lagging for lunch)05:47
pittiGTK BUG!05:54
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pittiseb128: installing the control-center build deps fails currently... for you too?05:54
=== seb128 KICKS pitti
seb128pitti: which one?05:54
pitti  libgnome-desktop-dev: Depends: libgnomeui-dev (>= 2.6.0) but it is not installable05:54
pitti  libnautilus-extension-dev: Depends: libeel2-dev (>= 2.9.91) but it is not installable05:54
pitti                             Depends: libbonoboui2-dev (>= 2.5.4) but it is not installable05:54
seb128please find the broken one with some apt-get install :)05:55
seb128what arch are you using?05:55
pittiseb128: how can I debug that again?05:55
seb128apt-get install libbonoboui2-dev05:55
pitti  libbonoboui2-dev: Hngt ab: libesd0-dev soll aber nicht installiert werden05:56
pittiah, that rings a bell05:56
seb128so you screwed :)05:56
pittiseb128: just uploaded a new esound...05:56
pittiseb128: sorry to bother you, I owe you a beer05:56
ograpitti, _you_ create gtk bugs ?05:57
seb128np :)05:57
seb128fresh beer, aaaah05:57
pittiogra: sure, h4cking control-center now05:57
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seb128I want it NOW 05:57
pittiogra: I taught esound to reconnect to the sound device after changing alsa conf05:57
\shseb128: prost05:58
pittiogra: now I have to kick esd when doing that in g-sound-props05:58
=== pitti tries to pour beer through the wireless to seb128
ograi thought it should disappear anyway05:58
\shwell...u try I drink ;)05:58
ogra(not the beer though)05:58
pittiogra: I'd like to, but polypaudio still crashes too often05:58
seb128pitti: do you have a public pmount revision control?05:58
seb128pitti: a GNOME guy is asking on IRC05:59
pittiogra: so I want a working esound as a fallback05:59
ograah, ok05:59
pittiseb128: sure, http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/bzr/pmount/05:59
pittiseb128: it's bazaar-ng though05:59
pittiseb128: I recently converted from baz to test it05:59
pittithat's also mentioned in the upstream changelog06:00
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kikomdz, bradb asked for monday meeting on LPI for Malone, good day or bad day?06:01
mdzkiko: bad for me06:01
kikowhy don't you say so in the email then06:01
mdzbut I don't necessarily need to be there06:02
mdzkiko: I'll get there ;-)06:02
kikoif you don't go I won't either!06:02
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bddebianANyone here work on the Live CDs?06:09
bddebianHow do you folks do video driver detection for X ?06:10
mdzthe same way that the xserver-xorg package does it (discover1)06:10
bddebianAh, we don't have xorg.. :-(06:10
bddebianDo you know how knoppix does it?06:11
mdzxserver-xfree86 does the same thing06:11
bddebianOh, thanks06:11
bddebianmdz: Sorry to keep bugging you but does discover work in userland or Linux kernel drivers?06:13
mdzbddebian: apt-get source discover106:13
mdzit is a userland program06:13
bddebianAwesome, thanks06:13
bddebianMost likely we don't have it in GNU/Hurd.. ;-)06:14
mdzthe part of it that X uses just looks up strings in a text file06:14
mdzthat's all it does, really (look up Linux kernel modules and X drivers in a text file)06:15
bddebianSo then do you folks modify XF86COnfig-4?06:15
mdzno, we use X.org06:15
=== davyd twiddles his thumbs while he builds his second 2.6.12 for the night
bddebianOh yeah, sorry06:16
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Kamionyay, finally06:35
pittiKamion: you have network again?06:35
bddebianHello Kamion06:35
danielsKamion: yo06:35
Kamionpitti: yes, eventually06:35
bddebianAhh, /me just reliazed who Kamion is06:35
Kamiontoday was basically a dead loss though06:36
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pitti'lo smurfix06:38
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smurfixDamn power failures, even if only for 1/5th second or so :-/06:39
Lathiatthats what my ups with a 10 secondbattery is for :)06:39
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ddaaHey kamion06:40
ddaaKamion: some VCS questions...06:40
ddaaKamion: do you know where are the VCSes for bf-utf (boot-floopies fonts) and cdbs?06:41
thomcdbs is on alioth, afaik06:42
pittiGNUer: hey, what happened to your kernel? :-)06:42
ograsmurfix, time to get more UPSes in your house....06:42
GNUerpitti> lol06:43
GNUerpitti> I shifted to Hurd06:43
ddaathom: which svn/cvs repo?06:43
smurfixogra: No. Time to use the laptop more. ;-)06:43
ograheh :)06:43
thomddaa: http://alioth.debian.org/scm/?group_id=3001206:43
bddebianGNUer: Awesome ;-)06:44
mdzheh, lost Kamion again06:44
GNUerbddebian> :)06:44
davydso, if I sent you dudes a really creepy kernel patch, that I don't quite understand; what would you do with it?06:44
bddebianGNUer: So you gonna help us with L4? ;-)06:44
GNUerbddebian> I hope it's just a joke06:45
bddebianHey, what's just a joke?06:45
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GNUerbddebian> what you just said06:45
ddaathom: you are saying that cdbs = build-common, right?06:45
mdzKamion: welcome back06:45
thomddaa: yes06:46
bddebianGNUer: What, L4?06:46
GNUerbddebian> is it true that there are only a few devels working on Hurd?06:46
Kamionoh my god, my IRC client is horribly confused, one sec06:46
mdzKamion: will you be able to stay awhile? ;-)06:46
thomit being called the common debian build system06:46
bddebianGNUer: I suppose that depends on your definition06:46
Kamionit's displaying everything in one window, 1997-stylee06:46
ddaathom: it's not like the gforge page is of any help, but I already noticed build-common on svn.debian.org06:46
GNUerbddebian> definition of ?06:46
Kamionmdz: uh, maybe, gonna have to quit just now :-)06:46
bddebian"only a few"06:46
GNUerbddebian> compared to Linux?06:47
bddebianGNUer: There are very few working on L4 yes06:47
GNUerbddebian> otherwise why is its development so slow?06:47
bddebianGNUer: Yes, we have "few" compared to Linux06:47
GNUerbddebian> it's very sad06:47
bddebianYes it is06:47
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GNUerbddebian> and people are dubbing it as vaporware, bloatware, etc.06:47
Kamionthat's better06:47
Kamionddaa: if nobody said - cdbs has nothing to do with me, despite popular misconceptions06:48
GNUerbddebian> I'd love to see a competing kernel to Linux :(06:48
Kamionddaa: I doubt bf-utf is in version control at all06:48
ddaaKamion: http://packages.ubuntu.com/hoary/devel/cdbs06:48
ddaathat says "CDBS Hackers, Colin Walters, Jeff Bailey, Jonas Smedegaard, Chris Cheney and Stefan Gybas are responsible for this Debian package."06:48
bddebianGNUer: I don't think the Mach iteration would ever be.  If we could get L4 going, there might be a chance06:48
Kamionddaa: *Walters*, not Watson06:48
mdzKamion: so I've gotten to the interesting part of ubuntu-express06:48
ddaaho... right.06:48
GNUerbddebian> what's RMS saying about that?06:49
bddebianGNUer: Who cares. :-)06:49
GNUerbddebian> :)06:49
Kamionddaa: I'm extremely familiar with the confusion06:49
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thomit'd have been so much funnier had canonical hired walters06:51
mdzKamion: it's time to interface with grub-installer06:51
bddebianthom: Hehe06:51
Kamionok, so we're going to need to pull grub-installer.postinst apart at last then06:52
ddaaHere's James, and James. Daniel, and Daniel. Colin and Colin. And no, they do not all quite do the same thing, but almost :)06:52
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Mithrandirthom: we'd have some variety from the Janes at least. ;-)06:52
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Kamionmdz: sorry, this connection is just hopelessly flaky, I don't know what's wrong - it keeps randomly dropping out06:56
Kamionmdz: last thing I saw was:06:56
Kamion17:52 -!- dato_ [~adeodato@84-120-79-57.onocable.ono.com]  has joined #ubuntu-devel06:56
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mdzKamion: I've successfully ignored the partman stuff so far; did anything happen wrt upstream and merging partman-* into one?06:57
Kamionmdz: some people liked the idea, but Anton (the primary author) was really quite against it06:57
mdzKamion: was there a thread on -boot I can look at?06:58
Kamionthere was, I'll see if my connection lasts long enough to dig it out06:58
Kamionyou beat me to it06:59
mdzKamion: I don't find Anton's argument very convincing07:01
mdzmerging the existing components shouldn't make it harder to create new partman-* source packages if that's desirable07:01
Kamionnor did I - I'm belatedly replying now07:02
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\shwho can push octave2.1 again into the buildds? :)07:07
mdz\sh: infinity or lamont07:08
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\shok weekend...so we w8t :)07:09
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mahmoudhello...I'm recompiling the kernel to add support to the "perfctr" module...it builds and installs fine, but when it boots it complains about a missing "/lib/modules/2.6.10/modules.dep" although it's there...any idea?07:10
\shinitrd kernel?07:10
mahmoudhmm...what do you mean exactly?07:11
\shthe first the kernel is taking is the initrd with a modules directory....or are you compiling without initrd support?07:13
ogramahmoud, why do you recompile the whole kernel for one module ? 07:13
ogramahmoud, it should be possible to just compile this module if you have the linux-heasers package installed07:14
ogralinux-headers even07:14
mahmoud\sh, the logs did specify the correct module path, so i don't think that's the issue07:14
davydok, this silly07:14
davydone breezy machine has a working Tomboy07:14
davydone does not07:14
mahmoudogra, because the kernel has to be patched to support the module07:14
ogramahmoud, ah, ok... thats sad07:15
schweebdavyd: blame tseng07:15
davydschweeb: can do... it feels like it must be a missing dependancy07:15
davydit appears to be looking for dbus07:15
schweebhehe, most likely07:15
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schweebinstall libdbus-cil and libdbus-1-cil and see if that fixes it07:16
davydI have libdbus-1-cil07:16
davydneither machine has libdbus-cil07:16
mahmoudguys, if you can't help me , do you have any idea where I should ask?07:16
davydalso, why does restricted come up with MD5Sum mismatch?07:16
davydthat sounds... unpleasant07:17
schweebsome of the sources were messed up a couple weeks ago I guess07:17
\shmahmoud: take a vanilla kernel and compile it from hand07:18
mdzmahmoud: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/support/supportoptions/07:18
mahmoud\sh, I'm using debian kernel source packages, so do you mean i should try a kernel.org one instead?07:19
mdzmahmoud: if you're using debian kernel source packages, then a Debian support channel would be the place to ask07:19
mahmoudok, thanks07:21
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davydis the synaptics driver meant to do all of the scroll region jazz automatically?07:25
davydor do I need to turn that on?07:25
Lathiatiirc there are options for it07:25
Lathiatassuming your pad is actuallya synaptics07:25
Lathiatand not an alps07:26
Lathiattheres some tool for configuring it on the fly if you have shm config on 07:26
davydit appeared to load the synaptics driver07:26
Nafalloit does that automatically yes.07:26
Nafalloatleast wfm ;-)07:26
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davydI'll spend more time on that in a bit07:28
davydI wanted to get this machine suspending with the atheros driver07:28
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davydI think it is an Alps touchpad07:30
davydI see something in dmesg about it07:30
Lathiatahh,your options are limited then07:31
LathiatIs someone able to approve a non-member post by trs80@ucc.asn.au to ubuntu-users ?07:33
Lathiatjdub ?07:33
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=== Topic for #ubuntu-devel: Ubuntu Development | #ubuntu for support and general discussion | #ubuntu-love for getting involved | http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/DeveloperResources | Colony CD 1 released | don't use ppc64 kernels yet. wait for the next release kthxbye. | If you have unexpectedly lost editbugs privileges, talk to mdz/ogra/kiko
=== Topic (#ubuntu-devel): set by mdz at Wed Jun 22 22:34:08 2005
=== #ubuntu-devel [freenode-info] why register and identify? your IRC nick is how people know you. http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#nicksetup
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thierrymmmm.... can't even install the daily build of breezy...06:49
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Kamionthierry: that's unsurprising06:49
Kamiondaily builds are often uninstallable06:49
thierryis colony one possible to install?06:50
Kamionshould be, that's the point of it06:50
Kamionthierry: what went wrong with the daily build?06:50
thierryk thanks06:50
thierryKamion, well it didn't recognize any ethernet card and it didn't wanted to partition anything...06:50
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ograhey azeem 06:51
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ograazeem, did you pick up mako ? he didnt know if he would spend this week here or at your place....06:52
carstenhyesterday, he was at the linuxtag in karlsruhe/germany06:54
ogracarstenh, yes, i know....06:54
carstenhah, now i understand your question :)06:55
mdkeis anyone familiar with smeg? seems the version on the website for hoary is not compatible with hoary's python-xdg06:57
Lathiatiirc you needed a new xdg package too06:58
Lathiatask amaranth, he wrote it i think06:58
mdkeyes he did06:58
mdkebut he's not here06:58
Lathiatyeh iirc he had an xdg package 06:58
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mdkeok yeah i see it now06:59
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mdkethanks Lathiat 07:00
Kamionthierry: oh, the installer initrds haven't been byhanded, that explains that07:01
Kamionthierry: (don't worry if that made no sense)07:01
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bddebianKamion / sivang: We actually have a live-cd !! :-)07:33
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=== Kamion wonders if he can figure out how to do a d-i byhand
Kamionah, there are the instructions07:46
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Kamionogra: ?07:50
ograKamion, i just cant belive that there are things you have to look up about d-i07:51
Kamionogra: the archive side07:51
ograah, ok :)07:51
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Kamionelmo: I've byhanded debian-installer_20050317ubuntu{6,7} so that I can build working CDs with 2.6.12 (but not the dailies, and I haven't removed the old installer-* dirs because doing 'sudo -u katie rm -rf blah' scares me)07:56
Kamionelmo: I used the old d-i-images instructions, updated to breezy07:56
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mdzmvo: ping?10:00
bddebianmdz: Does discover use /proc ?10:00
mvomdz: pong10:02
mvomdz: just send you a mail 10:02
mdzmvo: I am having problems merging daf's archive as well, and wanted to see if you had the same trouble10:02
mdzbut I think daf and I just figured out that problem10:03
mvomdz: I merged apt--mvo--0 into apt--main--0 without problems10:03
mdzmvo: yes, that is very strange10:03
mvomdz: do you use the same version of baz than I do? 1.4.2?10:03
mdzmvo: yes10:04
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mdzlatest breezy10:04
mvoyes, same here10:04
mvoodd ...10:04
mvois your version of apt--main--0 patch-92 too? and apt--mvo--0 at patch-32?10:05
mdzmvo: your mirror only has patch-3010:05
mdzheh, both this problem and the one with daf were the result of outdated mirrors apparently :-)10:05
mvoI did a archive-mirror10:06
mvoand it tells me there is nothing to mirror (/me checks again)10:07
mdzI'll try again10:07
mvothere is a patch-32 dir on p.u.c:~/mvo/arch/ubuntu10:07
mvoall is very odd ...10:07
mdzmvo: works now10:08
mdzzsh: segmentation fault  baz merge apt--main--010:10
mdzlifeless: ^^10:11
hubdaniels: you blog software is over buggy10:13
danielshub: no, planet is crap10:13
danielshub: my articles all have the same publication date as they did to begin with10:14
danielshub: keybuk removed the pubDate checking on his branch because people kept screwing up their pubDates10:14
danielshub: notice how p.fd.o isn't affected10:14
hubthen it planet ubuntu that is crap ?10:15
Yann2daniel > I'm just coding a planet for ubuntu-fr10:15
Yann2might it interest you?10:15
danielshub: it's scott's branch of planet (which is used on p.d.o and p.u.c) which is broken10:16
Yann2it's based on dotclear ( a very well known french blog system) and magpie10:16
danielsYann2: not really.  i only really maintain one planet (p.fd.o), and that works fine.10:16
Yann2ok :)10:16
hubYann2: oh no10:16
hubYann2: pla.nit.ca has lot for fix because it i10:17
hubuse magpie10:17
Yann2magpie seems to work quite fine10:17
mdzmvo: works now10:17
hubYann2: magpie has issues with dotclear :-)10:17
Yann2really? :|10:17
Yann2can't be, I already saw a rss reader for dotclear using magpie10:18
Yann2seemed to work good10:18
Yann2well, I'll see ^^10:18
Yann2began this afternoon, should be ready tomorrow =)10:18
Yann2hub > wait wait wait you already did a planet with dotclear?10:19
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danielsKeybuk: fix planet, dude10:19
Keybukdaniels: fuck off10:19
=== daniels basks in the love.
hubYann2: no. my boss did a planet in PHP using magpie, and I use dotclear for my blog and that caused a lot of problems10:20
hubYann2: http://pla.nit.ca/10:20
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Yann2what kind of pbs?10:21
bddebianHello mehrfachstecker 10:21
mehrfachsteckerdoes anybody know what the format of the initrd is in hoary?10:21
Keybukdaniels: get Jeff to fix it10:21
mehrfachsteckerhi bddebian10:21
danielsKeybuk: i thought his branch was dead?10:22
Keybukdaniels: my branch is dead too10:23
danielsKeybuk: bonus10:24
littlepaulmehrfachstecker, it is cramfs http://ubuntuforums.org/archive/index.php/t-21104.html10:24
Keybukdaniels: I don't run a Planet, so have no use for the code10:24
mehrfachsteckerthank in advance10:25
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mdzmvo: why did your tree have a modified po/he.po?10:26
mdzmvo: it conflicts with the one in bubulle's tree10:26
danielsKeybuk: any idea if anyone else has taken up a branch?10:26
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mvomdz: I didn't modifiy that he.po file deliberately. please just undo it10:28
mvomdz: good to hear that it works now10:28
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mdzmvo: 0.6.38ubuntu1 uploaded10:28
=== StylusEater [~gnome@c-24-98-214-36.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel
StylusEaterwho can I talk to about helping with "XFCE-buntu??"10:30
mvomdz: cool! I'll merge with your trees now10:31
crimsunStylusEater: me.10:31
mdzmvo: I have merged your tree and daf's into mainline, and am working on merging bubulle's now10:31
StylusEatercrimsun: may I pm you?10:31
mdzStylusEater: it would be better to discuss it here; there are others who are involved and interested10:31
StylusEaterwell...where do we start? I don't want to interupt any prior discussions10:32
crimsunStylusEater: just speak what's on your mind presently10:32
StylusEaterwell...let me give you a brief synopsis of who I am first?10:33
tsengsure, you might want to make yourself a page on the wiki also10:33
StylusEatermy background isn't really programming...I've done a fair share of "web programming," some basic, and some perl and bash scripting...10:33
crimsunStylusEater: (it'd be more efficient to just add yourself to wiki/MOTUXfce)10:34
StylusEaterlemme go check10:34
tsengyep make a page of YourName, fill out your deails and make a link https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUXfce10:35
tsengthat will be very helpful to use if you want to pursue member/maintainership status later10:35
bddebianIt ain't helping me. ;-P10:36
ograis anything wrong with the archive scripts ? the source of libsigcx's ubuntu1 version is here, http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/libs/libsigcx/, according to the build logs it was built last week, but doesnt show up in the archive....10:36
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StylusEaterhttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/UserPreferences <-- Ok I went there and I don't see a "sign-up" page10:40
StylusEaterI also tried https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StyluEater and was unable to edit the page10:41
bddebianStylusEater: You have to create an account on Launchpad first10:41
StylusEaterI am looking for that link10:41
mdkethe account can be created at wiki.ubuntu.com10:41
bddebianIt can?10:41
StylusEatershould be able to10:41
mdkeclick login10:41
StylusEaterit's a "wiki"10:41
StylusEatermdke I did10:42
bddebianI was never able to without creating my lauchpad account first10:42
mdkeperhaps i'm wrong10:42
mdkeok StylusEater http://launchpad.ubuntu.com10:43
mdkewill report that as a bug10:43
bddebianmdke: Well most likely I am incorrect.  I don't know if I have been right yet here :-)10:43
mdkeno i think you're right bddebian 10:44
mdkejust looking now, there is a paragraph on how to sign up, but the dialogue is wrong10:44
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StylusEaterit's hard to find how to sign up10:44
StylusEaterthere isn't a "sign-up" link on the front page of the wiki10:44
tsengsigning up will get more obvious at some point10:45
tsengthere are plans to continue single sign on to other ubuntu services10:45
StylusEatertseng: please don't think I am criticizing just noting10:45
mdkethe wiki thing is a pretty bad hack10:46
mdketo reconcile the Ubuntu auth with the moin login dialogue10:46
tsengjust saying, it should greatly improve at some point10:46
Simirafor those interested: I will bring some Ubuntu t-shirts to Debconf. More information and price will be on the -user mailinglist as soon as I figured out the price10:46
crimsunStylusEater: please contact me via email (crimsun at fungus dot sh dot nu), I have family plans this afternoon and have to leave in a few minutes. Thanks for your interest.10:48
mdkeSimira, awesome :)10:49
mdkeSimira, do you ship them at all?10:49
StylusEatercrimsun: what would you like me to say?10:49
Simiramdke: it's coming... we've ordered 250 for a start. There will be a webshop in time...10:50
bddebianBah, why go to Debconf when there seems to be such tension with Debian? :-)10:50
SimiraI'll ship to Europe only, probably10:50
crimsunStylusEater: any ideas you have regarding it from the bottom up10:50
StylusEaterokie doke10:51
mdkeSimira, that's cool, i am in europe :D10:51
Simirabddebian: there are reasons for and against... I've been encouraged to ignore the conflict10:51
mdkei think that is the best approach10:51
mdkelove heals any wounds10:52
crimsunStylusEater: for instance, live cd only or install? what sort of infrastructure?10:52
bddebianAye, I was being somewhat fecisous10:52
bddebianwhoops, didn't spell that right10:52
=== Simira will pour lots of Ubuntu-love onto DebConf :D
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crimsunStylusEater: (do we go minimal or install most of ubuntu's base so that things like automounting removable devices works?)10:52
mdkewhere is this debconf?10:52
ogramdke, helsinki10:53
crimsunStylusEater: cya 'round.10:54
mdkeogra, ah nice10:54
=== daniels weeps.
danielsdear martin,10:55
danielsplease don't upload a new version of a library package that has an incompatible abi10:55
ograwhat did he break ?10:55
danielsespecially if I'm the one that gets to clean up after it10:55
bddebianSo is #ubuntu-love only active on "love days" ?10:56
=== ogra is confused....
tsengogra: dbus 0.3410:57
ograhow did debian Bug#315891 end up in my mailbox ?? strange things happen...10:57
ogratseng, ah10:57
=== tseng kicks his pbuilder
ogragah, why does the debian bugtracking system send BCC mails.... grr10:59
StylusEatercrimsun: tata for now11:02
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StylusEaterdohh...what was crimsun's e-mail addy again?11:18
bddebian crimsun at fungus dot sh dot nu I think 11:19
lifelessmdz: backtrace ?11:21
danielslifeless: go back to sleep.  freak.11:22
Simirasmurfix: ping11:23
smurfixSimira: 11:24
lifelessdaniels: touche11:24
StylusEatercool thx bddebian11:24
StylusEaterI haven't figured out how to "backtrace" in irssi yet11:24
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danielslifeless: real people aren't awake this early11:25
danielslifeless: only cyborgs.  and street sweepers.  and cyborg street sweepers.11:25
lifelessdaniels: which are you ?11:25
danielslifeless: jetlagged and still awake11:25
HrdwrBoBdaniels: and some people with Real Jobs11:26
lifelessHrdwrBoB: no such thing11:26
danielsHrdwrBoB: if you have time to be on IRC before you go to work, you have time to still be asleep11:26
HrdwrBoBdaniels: I'm making coffee11:27
danielsHrdwrBoB: i would still be awake if sydney wasn't so stupid11:27
StylusEaterok...so my page is up11:27
danielsturns out my flight from bangkok to melbourne went through sydney11:27
danielsso I'm there for an hour, sweet, get Krispy Kreme11:27
StylusEaterif y'all would like to read it:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StylusEater11:27
danielsbut no, that's on the outer side of immigration11:27
danielswhich I Must Not Pass for various reasons11:27
danielsso I don't have anything to sugar-rush on for hours11:27
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pittiinfinity: already up?11:29
danielsah, pitti!11:29
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danielspitti: please don't upload new versions of dbus which change the abi kthx11:30
pittidaniels: erm, 0.34 did?11:30
danielsi believe so, yes11:30
pittihrm, sorry...11:30
mdzlifeless: unreproducible11:30
pittidaniels: major changes?11:31
danielspitti: no worries.  don't think it's caused any actual damage, just surprised me when I saw it.11:31
danielspitti: nah, tiny little ABI tweaks.  they rarely make any worthwhile ABI breaks ;)11:32
pittiok, good to hear; I just merged the Debian version11:32
mdzlifeless: I've actually got everything merged now, which is good (for apt) but bad (for reproducing the baz crash)11:32
pittidaniels: I hope they won't do again by 1.0...11:32
danielspitti: they will11:32
mdzlifeless: I went looking for "baz missing --diffs".  is there something which actually exists which does what I want?11:37
mdkesmurfix, piiing11:37
smurfixmdke: ?11:37
mdkesmurfix, just to report, we have two bots on #ubuntu-it-meeting11:38
smurfixgah. I'll go check11:39
lifelessmdz: what do you want ?11:39
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ogramdke, ubuntu-it-meeting ? why dont you just use ubuntu-meeting ?11:39
ograhi dholbach 11:40
mdkeogra, i guess cos it might cause clashes11:40
mdke-fr has one too11:40
ograoh, really ? 11:40
mdkewe have been having lots of meeting recently so we just made a separate chan11:40
mdkealso the language of meeting isn't english, so it might annoy people who idle in that chan11:41
ogramdke, yes, sounds sane .... i was just wondering... :)11:43
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=== siretart updated https://wiki.ubuntu.com/REVU with all questions (and answers) I got today
siretartargl. sorry, wrong channel11:51
ograsiretart, probably not ;)11:52
mdzlifeless: I want approximately "show me the diffs for the patches in tree foo which are not in tree bar"11:55
mdzlifeless: though "show me the diff which would result from this merge" would also suffice11:55
pittimdz: merge - diff - undo?11:56
Mithrandirmdz: baz diff $anothertree or isn't that what you mean?11:56
mdzMithrandir: depends; what does that do?11:58
mdzpitti: yes, that is similar to the functionality I am looking for in a single command11:58
Mithrandirmdz: I _think_ it does exactly what you want.11:59
mdzMithrandir: I think it does the reverse of what I want, but I can make that work12:00
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mdzbaz diff <tree foo> from within tree bar gives me something which is sort of the reverse of what I want12:01
mdzbaz diff <tree bar> from tree foo blows up12:01
mdz    arch_valid_package_name (name, arch_maybe_archive, arch_req_package, 1)12:01
mdzbaz: uncaught exception: -1:(exiting on botched invariant)12:01
mdz  please report this as a bug to bazaar@lists.canonical.com12:01

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