lifelessmdz: hmm12:02
lifelessbaz diff $other-tree gives you the manner in which this tree has diverged from the last merge of the two12:03
lifelessso get bar, diff foo should work12:03
lifelesswhat exact command line are you using ?12:03
Mezmako: ping12:04
Mithrandirlifeless: I suspect he's doing baz diff /home/mdz/whatever.12:04
lifelessMithrandir: so do I ;012:05
mdzMithrandir: I was doing baz diff fully@qualified/branch--name12:14
mdzwhich works in one direction and blows up in the other12:14
lifelessmdz: --version on there ?12:14
lifelessmdz: mmmm, does baz missing fully@qualified/branch--name from there show the base-0 ?12:15
mdzmizar:[~/src/deb/mine/arch/apt/ubuntu]  baz diff michael.vogt@ubuntu.com--2005/apt--ubuntu--012:15
lifelessi.e. has it never been merged ?12:15
mdz^^ works12:15
mdzmizar:[~/src/deb/mine/arch/apt/ubuntu]  cd ../mvo-ubuntu mizar:[...eb/mine/arch/apt/mvo-ubuntu]  baz diff apt@packages.debian.org/apt--ubuntu--012:15
mdz^^ doesn't12:15
mdzlifeless: hmm, good question12:16
mdzI wonder whether mvo created his ubuntu branch based on main, rather than based on my ubuntu branch12:16
mdzbaz missing does show the base-012:16
lifelessif so, congrats, thats a bug12:16
lifelessok, nice find three.12:16
mdzin both cases12:16
lifelessenough info gathering12:17
lifelessthere are three different scenarios here12:17
lifelessthe actual content of the patches is usually not interesting : its the aggregate *without merges from you* that is interesting.12:17
mdzthe question I'm trying to answer in this instance is "what sort of stuff has he got in this branch?"12:17
lifelessthe way I would usually answer that is to merge his branch, and then run diff12:18
lifelessbecause that gets rid of noise created by merges from mutual peers even if he hasn't merged from yuu12:18
mdzyes, I've done that in the past12:18
MithrandirI think diff $branch should do the same thing as merge + diff.12:18
mdzand I would very much like to be able to do it a) in one step, b) without modifying my working directory (or even having one at all)12:18
lifelessif you want to see a plain rollup of his patches, you can do this in one step:12:19
mdzbaz diff <rev> <rev> would be eawesome12:19
lifelessbaz delta --diffs <rev> <rev>12:19
mdzbut that's not the same; that's just a straight "how is this different from that", isn't it?12:19
lifelessbaz diff is just a straight how is this different from that - with a hueristic on what to call 'this'12:20
mdz"dump all the diffs from the revisions in `baz missing <foo>`" is approximately the right semantic12:20
lifelessso - 12:20
mdzthis ties into my earlier craving for a way to do get-changeset && show-changeset --diffs in one step12:20
lifelessperhaps baz delta --diffs $(baz missing foo | head -n1) $(baz missing foo | tail -n 1)12:20
mdzthat sounds about right12:21
lifelessshow-changeset needs to take a revision and get it out for you - absolutely agree12:21
mdzI'm not sure whether I would prefer to have the diffs rolled up or separate12:21
mdzprobably rolled up most of the time12:21
lifeless'baz mdz foo' ;012:21
Mithrandirlifeless: no, that won't work in all cases, since you might have done a sync-tree from a tla user and so not have all your own (or somebody elses) patches.12:22
Mithrandirwhich is kinda funky.12:22
lifelessMithrandir: this is why merge is the right way12:23
Mithrandirlifeless: yup12:23
lifelessbut merge is different because it involves resolving conflicts etc12:23
Mithrandirlifeless: so I think diff $tree should be merge + diff the trees.12:23
lifelessdiff tree says 'how is my tree different to that tree'12:26
lifeless'diff' on its own says 'how is my tree different to what I checked out'12:27
lifelessI don't think adding merge to 'diff' is right from a UI or behavioural point of view12:27
lifelessmerge requires human intervention for starters12:28
lifelessthat said, there should be something fairly simple to do what you want12:28
lifelessmdz: so what about merge + diff, or get + diff frustrates ?12:29
lifelessi.e. what do I need to shave off to make it a reasonable answer ?12:29
mdzlifeless: merge+diff, for one, gives me conflicts12:34
lifelessthats what I mean by human intervention12:34
lifelessI guess the question I'm asking is :12:35
mdzboth merge+diff and get+diff require that I store some stuff on disk just for the purpose of asking the question, and then clean it up afterward12:35
lifeless'Do you want to see what they have put in their branch', or 'Do you want to see what you would be merging'12:35
mdzI want to be able to ask both of those questions12:35
lifelessfrom your working tree.12:36
mdzthe latter makes sense in a working tree12:36
mdzthe former seems like a reasonable question to ask without having a working tree12:36
mdzmako: around?12:36
carstenh I received a approval from google for my application ("Ubuntu Firewall Managing Tool"). do you already know who will be my mentor or whom i should contact?12:41
mdzcarstenh: we'll contact you via email soon12:42
mdzafter the weekend12:42
carstenhmdz: ok, thanks :)12:42
mdzcarstenh: congratulations and welcome :-)12:42
ogracarstenh, hey, you are in trier ?12:42
carstenhogra: yes12:42
dholbachcarstenh: HEY!12:42
carstenhogra: and you are from?12:43
dholbachi'm from trier!12:43
=== ogra grets from blankenheim....
ogragreets even12:43
dholbachwhere do you live there?12:43
dholbachthe world is SO small :)12:43
carstenhdholbach: martinskloster, i study at the university of applied science12:43
dholbachROCK cool :)12:43
carstenhyes, it is :)12:43
dholbachthis is funny :)12:43
carstenhogra: where is blankenheim?12:44
dholbach"in der eifel" :)12:44
ograbeginning of eifel... 12:44
carstenhah, not far away :)12:44
ograyeps :)12:44
ogracarstenh, nice to have you aboard :)12:44
pittinight guys12:45
ogranight pitti 12:45
carstenhogra: dholbach: were anyone of you at the ksp yesterday?12:46
ogracarstenh, which one ?12:47
carstenhlinuxtag, organized by weasel12:47
ogranope, i wasnt at linuxtag12:48
carstenhthis was my  my first lt this year :)12:49
=== ogra wasnt at _any_ linuxtag yet....
dholbachme neither12:49
ograi should probably have been there12:49
mdkequestion: is kubuntu and ubuntu intended to be installable on the same system with no issues?12:50
ogramdke, only space issues12:50
mdkeogra, so its worth filing bugs when they don't live happily as a family?12:51
ogramdke, yeps... they should play nicely together12:51
mdkein bugzilla?12:51
mdkekubuntu is handled in bugzilla too still?12:52
ogramdke, if you wanna file against a -desktop metapackage....12:52
mdkeyeah probably a good idea12:52
mdkei guess most of the issues are well known12:53
carstenhdoes kubuntu count as an extra debian derivat?12:53
carstenh(is was not on makos list)12:53
ogracarstenh, rather as a ubuntu derivative12:53
carstenhah, ok.12:53
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ogramdke, ?12:54
mdkei've heard lots of people report issues with their .ICEauthority file when running both kde and gnome, but a search in bugzilla for ICEauthority shows nothing12:54
ogramdke, but ts a known issue that kde changes permissions of that file12:55
ograi had such a case today in #ubuntu-de12:56
mdkeyeah well known12:56
mdkestrange that there is no bug open on it12:57
ograbut i guess you had to change quite essential bits in KDE to make it work right12:58
Seveasah, so that is it!12:58
SeveasDoes that cause gnome to freeze when trying to log in?12:58
mdkeyeah you can't log in12:58
ograSeveas, exactly12:59
SeveasI've seen a ZILLION cases of that on #ubuntu12:59
mdkeanswer is to delete the file12:59
SeveasNever knew what it was :)12:59
robitaillemdke: https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=2053  (maybe?)12:59
SeveasAnother thing to add to my FAQ database :)12:59
mdkerobitaille, saw that yeah but i think it is dated now, kde IS supported12:59
ograhmm, robitaille ....01:00
mdkethe bug was closed due to kde not being supported01:00
mdkemaybe it could be reopened, or a new bug filed01:00
robitailleyes, that old bug was pre-kubuntu01:00
ograrobitaille, wouldnt you like to take a central role in our upcoming bugday ? you are really the best bugzilla guy i know outside the main team :) 01:01
mdkeBurgundavia will be upset01:01
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robitailleogra:  when is it going to be?01:01
ograheh, they can share the load mdke :)01:01
ograrobitaille, we planned it for the 29th01:01
robitaillebut it is true I have done little bit less of bugzilla right when Burgundavia started doing more. Strange timing :)01:02
ograsmells like a bugzilla team :)01:02
robitailleogra:  but sure, I can help.  Not sure I would qualify it as a "central role" since most of that day I'll be at work, but I can help01:03
=== mdke holds his nose
ograrobitaille, think about it... i'll write a cross post announcement tomorrow ...01:03
mdkemdz, do you think it is worth reopening #2053? or opening a new bug? probably hundreds have that error01:06
=== Number17 [~blah@RH-LaurelN-CS5-131-75.njit.edu] has joined #ubuntu-devel
karlhegWhy doesn't highlight then middle-click to paste work right anymore?  I've used the X Window System since 1995, and it has always worked until recently.  Firefox highlight to emacs middle click is not doing what it should.  Any ideas?01:13
karlhegI wish that Firefox had the middle-click paste of a URL opens a tab and gets the page like it used to also.01:13
karlhegAnd it really ought to have the long-standard C-a, C-e, C-k bindings in text fields too.01:14
tsengsupport questions are in #ubuntu01:15
lsuactiafnerkarlheg : press shift while you paste01:15
tsengor even better, to firefox01:15
karlhegAh.  I have to press a key now?01:15
karlhegtseng, Sorry... I viewed it as a devel question since it used to Just Work but something has changed.01:16
mdkehighlight middle click works here01:16
mdkethis is def. a #ubuntu question imo01:16
tsengits a devel question if you want to talk about fixing a bug, basically01:16
tsengit not really a bug at all, it "works as designed"01:16
tsengand is not specific to ubuntu01:17
karlhegI can't get it to work unless I use C-c in Firefox, then middle-click in Emacs.01:17
karlhegAnnoying itch, but livable for now.01:17
lsuactiafnerhighlight middle also works here.01:18
sladenkarlheg: we disabled the middle-click paste in the main window.  It confused people who didn't expect.  You can enable it by typing 'about:config' in the browser URL bar and searching for 'middle'01:20
karlhegtseng, It's "broken as designed".  You are supposed to be able to highlight, then middle-click to paste anywhere and everywhere in X.01:20
karlhegIt's annoying enough to have to use CUA bindings everywhere, and then they insist I push C-c to get a pasteable copy.01:21
mdkekarlheg, two people have told you that it works for them01:21
ograkarlheg, Apache/2.1.3 (Ubuntu) Server at people.ubuntu.com Port 8001:22
ograkarlheg, just pasted as you described01:22
ogramark and middle click01:22
mdkethree people01:22
karlhegSo I guess if I really want to change that I have to develop a key-mapping library everything can use or something... so not every program has to implment re-bindable keymaps to support both traditional and CUA bindings.01:22
karlhegHuh.  Peerhaps it's an emacs setting then.01:23
karlhegI'll check that.01:23
ogramight be, i'm a vim user01:24
karlhegsladen, ! Thank you.  Is that a FAQ?  It really ought to be an option in the main configuration dialog.01:25
ajmitchperhaps it it an issue as to which clipboard selection is being used, too01:26
karlhegI just highlighted from xchat and pasted with middle click to emacs.  It's some kind of interaction between the URL location bar in Firefox and Emacs that's not right.01:28
karlhegPerhaps it's a Firefox setting or missed line in it's programming?  I don't know enough about X programming to know what the cause could be.  Enough said; no bug; I'll quit flooding.01:29
sladenkarlheg: if you know enough to miss it, you know enough to use about:config01:31
sladenkarlheg: you can paste in the URL bar with middle-click.  that works as expected.01:32
karlhegsladen, I've never heard of about:config until just now.01:32
karlhegBut the URL bar already has text in it.01:32
sladenkarlheg: it's the middle-pasteing in the middle a window that confuses people.  Especially when they use my thinkpad and can't tell what caused the page to "randomly" change01:32
sladenkarlheg: I agree, I use the feature all the time01:33
sladenprecisely because the URL bar has text in it01:33
karlhegsladen, We should wishlist that it ought to be a visible configuration option in the main preferences dialogs.01:33
sladenkarlheg: go for it01:33
karlhegWhere should I file that?  Firefox, or Ubuntu?01:34
ograFiretech, 01:34
ograerr firefox01:34
sladenkarlheg: Ubuntu (we turned it off from the default) IdeasPool on the wiki01:34
ograsladen, for a config option ?01:34
karlhegI suppose Firefox, unless the Ubuntu maintainer knows the internals well enough and can code it, otherwise, he'll just proxy the bug rep.  I may as well save him some work.01:34
sladenkarlheg/ogra: good point01:35
karlhegsladen, Off by default is Ok, it's that it's not in preferences.  Adding it to that will require coding.01:35
karlhegThere's a 'clipboard.autocopy' option that's set to 'true' by default.  No matter what it's setting, Firefox highlight in page does not middle-click paste in Emacs.01:36
karlhegAll of the other apps on my desktop work as I would expect, so it's something to do with how Firefox is programmed or configured.01:37
ograkarlheg, but since firefox highlight->middleclick paste works everywhere else i'd rather call it an emacs bug01:38
karlheg26-Jun-2005 23:19  27301:38
karlhegAh.  I can highlight/paste from Firefox to xchat.01:38
karlhegIt's something to do with how they interact.  I'll not file a bug until I understand X clipboard more.01:38
karlhegMaybe there's some reason it's supposed to work the way it does?01:39
=== karlheg adds another item to his reading stack...
=== jp [~jp@216-155-90-127.bk2-dsl.surnet.cl] has joined #ubuntu-devel
karlhegWow.  I just restarted Firefox, and now it works right.  I did not change the 'clipboard.autocopy' setting; I toggled it, but then back to default.01:44
karlhegI give up.01:44
karlhegYou win, Firefox.01:44
=== goedson [~goedson@BHE052247.res-com.wayinternet.com.br] has joined #ubuntu-devel
mdzmdke: if the problem still exists, yes01:54
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mdkemdz, thanks. I'm not an expert because I haven't tested it, but we get loads of people on the mailing lists and irc about that problem, which it seems isn't caused by k3b only, but kde in general01:56
mdzmdke: yes, I expect it affects most any KDE program run with root privileges and HOME still set to the user's home directory01:56
=== AndyFitz [~andy@220-245-97-227-qld-pppoe.tpgi.com.au] has joined #ubuntu-devel
ogramdz, this prob will exist eternally unless KDE fixes its handling of ICEAuthority01:57
ograAndyFitz !!01:57
mdzogra: we are arguably doing the wrong thing by running it with this environment, but it could be more robust, certainly01:57
jpI just restarted my pc, and there was a partition verification, now when I go to home/jp/x  there's not the most important stuff for me, I lost 500 mbs of pics and some videos cool im happy :)01:57
mdkemdz, so you think that bug or new bug?01:58
mdzmdke: might as well reuse the bug01:58
ograa evil hack would be to change the permissions before/during login...01:58
stuNNedcan i ask ques about applying a patch?01:58
jpI wanna cry 01:58
ograstuNNed, sure01:58
mdzogra: better would be to fix it so that the ownership is preserved01:58
ogramdz, yep01:58
stuNNedogra: so i can 'apt-get source package' in a dir, then tar zxvf original_package, cd01:59
ogramdz, but that would require a lot of KDE changes i guess01:59
stuNNed                 to that dir, apply a patch, then run 'dpkg-buildpackage' within that dir and01:59
stuNNed                 all is well and dandy?01:59
mdkejp, sorry to hear that, if you try #ubuntu they might be able to help you with data recovery01:59
stuNNeddang sorry lol01:59
=== stuNNed can't do nothing right :(
mdzogra: I wouldn't expect so, but I haven't looked01:59
jpthanks mdke ! i go to there now :)01:59
mdkemdz, actually I can't reopen that bug01:59
mdkeguess permissions01:59
ogramdz, i'm no KDE expert either, but thats the way i know KDE to work01:59
mdzmdke: have you read and understood the bug handling guidelines in HelpingWithBugs?02:00
stuNNedogra: sorry, my ques is i can 'apt-get source package' then 'tar zxvf orig_package', apply a patch, then from within that dir run dpkg-buildpackage and all is well and dandy?02:00
mdkemdz, no02:00
mdzmdke: if you would, I'd be delighted to give you editbugs02:00
mdkemdz, i will do so and let you know when I do02:01
ograstuNNed, something like that, yes... you can omit the tar step02:01
mdkein the meantime perhaps someone else can reopen #205302:01
AndyFitzg'day ogra02:02
ograstuNNed, apt-get source will unpack everything for you...02:02
mdke--> bed02:02
ograAndyFitz, we need to talk abuout icons :)02:02
ograAndyFitz, i'm supposed to package them :)02:02
stuNNedogra: trying the publish to calendar patch, see if it works against current Hoary evo, latest, the patch applied cleanly02:04
AndyFitzogra, excellent !!! :D02:04
ograstuNNed, see the PbuilderHowto on the wiki, if you can build it there, itsfine02:04
stuNNedok thanks, ogra 02:05
jpI want to die I lost the most important stuff for me, only for restart by power button, that never happened to me on windows xp, that's why I did it on linux, trsting on linux02:11
jpi'm just crying02:11
carstenhjp: which filesystem do you use02:12
jpcarstenh etx3 dood02:12
jpext3 sorry02:12
carstenhhmm, no undelete :(02:12
ograbut probably a lost&found02:12
jpwhat filesystem is the most secure?02:12
jpno ogra jp@shawn:/lost+found $ du -sh >> 48K     . >> jp@shawn:/lost+found 02:13
jpogra nope <- so what? ext3?02:13
carstenhjp: did you already fsck it?02:14
jpcarstenh yep, it's clean02:14
ograext2/3 ist the most reliable/mature ... 02:14
carstenhjp: all are more secure than reisser02:14
jpops :)02:14
ogracarstenh, s/s/ss ;)02:15
ogra(only for germans)02:15
carstenhogra: substitute ss with s02:15
jphuh im chilean02:15
ogracarstenh, yes, but he is very "reisserisch" about it :)02:15
ogra(i mean has reiser)02:15
carstenhogra: ah, ok. didn't get it the first time02:15
ograjp, that was a german joke, sorry, i can understand youre not in a joking mood...02:16
jpoh ok02:17
ograjp, this is a rather advanced task but you could try this one http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/Ext2fs-Undeletion.html02:23
=== goedson [~goedson@BHE052247.res-com.wayinternet.com.br] has joined #ubuntu-devel
Mezogra: ping02:24
ograMez, poooong02:25
MezJust as an FYI - I'm rebuilding the latest version of k3b for breezy02:25
Mez(or at leat it will be when it's finsihed building and being fixed etc02:25
ograMez, nice, coordinate with Riddell 02:25
MezAlready am ogra ;)02:25
Mezone of the conditions of my ubuntu membership was to keep you in the loop with the KDE stuff :P02:26
ogragreat :)02:26
Mezhence why I'm telling you :P02:26
Mez(plus i may need your help in a mo)02:26
MezI added libxi to the Build-Depends as it was moaning that ld -lXi wasnt working... 02:27
Mezlibxi-dev * 02:28
dholbachi'll call it the day02:28
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dholbachhave a nice evening02:28
tsengcya dholbach 02:28
ogranight dholbach 02:28
stuNNedogra: so i'm assuming with pbuilder i want to set up a chroot'd breezy?02:28
dholbachstuNNed: it does it for you02:29
MezstuNNed, that's what I ahev02:29
dholbachstuNNed: pbuilder is LOVE02:29
ograstuNNed, just follow the howto02:29
Mezlol :D yeah follow the howto02:29
MezIt's confusing as hell iof uyou're using 2 differnt base tgz's though02:29
=== Mez has nice sed commands linked up to change from one to another
=== stuNNed follows the howto :D
ograMez, why would you use two different base tgz's ?02:30
ograMez, we only compile for breezy02:30
Mezogra - one for breezy, one for backports ;)_02:30
=== Mez is also a backports developer
stuNNedogra: yeah cuz even though the patch to publish calendar applied cleanly to hoary evo it crashes, ack02:31
bob2___why would the upstream tarball differ?02:31
Mezogra - sdo we wnat the new HAL stuff in k3b or not ?02:31
tseng       --basetgz [basetgz-location] 02:31
tseng              Specifies the location of base.tgz02:31
Mezyeah tseng... I know02:31
Mezb ut I cant be arse dto type that everytime where i cna type02:31
ograMez, what does Riddell say ? 02:32
tsengso make an alias02:32
Mezor buildhaory02:32
Mezand it'll change the pbuilder02:32
Mezhe's AFK02:32
Mezwell... asleep02:32
Mezhe mentioned that it was there... didnt say whether to nable it02:32
ograMez, but you really should coordinate with him02:32
Meztseng... those are aliases :D02:32
Mezfair enoug h:D02:32
MezI'll ask him when he wakes up then02:32
ograMez, since he is the KDE guy here, i really cant give you a hint on using HAL in KDE...02:33
ograsince i dont know the status of HAL in KDE :)02:33
MezIf I remember what he said propelry... they're trying to shove it into 3.5 properly...02:34
Mezor makling improvements on it02:34
ograMez, you really want to talk to Riddell ... i know HAL support is planned...02:34
MezI was too busy laughing at how scared he loked02:34
=== Mez shoulda payed attention
Mezlol ... I swear he left bricks all over the stage :D02:35
Mezis ffmpeg a Restricted format?02:36
ogra(its in uni, not multiverse)02:37
MezFFMpeg decoder plugin (decodes wma and others):02:38
Mezthat would be restricted02:38
ograMez, yep, but its very broken currently, i'm in charge of it, but waiting on a new upstream release02:39
Mezfair enough02:39
MezI'll leave that option OFF :S02:39
MezHmm... riddell's replacement for KControl = sexy02:40
tsengoh man, planet stoner02:42
tsengthis is the worst flood ive ever seen02:42
Mezogra, cna you give me a slap when that's fixed then ?02:42
ograMez, sure02:42
Mezthen cna decide whether to rebuild k3b with it (though i doubt we will)02:43
ograMez, but i can only wait for a version that cmpiles at least with gcc-3.4 ...02:43
ograMez, the current prob with ffmpeg is, that it doesnt compile with any of the ubuntu provided compilers...02:44
Mezlol - why not ?02:44
ograMez, ask upstream :)02:45
MezI mena what comile errors? (or completely built for random compilers?)02:45
MezIs it like redhat brekaing the world?02:45
ograyep, something like that02:47
lsuactiafnerwhile on the topic of wmv.. 64bit ubuntu need a static 32bit binary for wmv files and a normal 64bit binary for other files02:47
Mezah I remember redhat breaking the world02:47
Mezthat was fun02:47
lsuactiafnermaybe not static since there are 32bit libs in 64bit ubuntu, but definatly a 32bit binary and yes i did mail the maintainer ect02:48
ograanyway, its 3am (nearly) and GF is moaning i should go to bed...02:49
Mezlol - lucky you ogra02:49
ograso night everybody...02:49
Mezmine noirmally moans around 1sam02:49
Mezshame she aint really ehre now...02:49
Mezaint here now really *02:49
Mezcould do with someone to cuddle up to02:50
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karlhegWhy does 'dpkg-source -x' tell me that the .tar file suffix is unrecognized?02:53
karlhegThere's a tar.gz and that's listed in the .dsc.02:53
Mezkarlheg, are you passing it the .dec file?02:53
karlhegdpkg-source -x hotplug-light_0.0-1.dsc02:54
karlhegdpkg-source: error: unrecognised file suffix `.tar'02:54
bob2so, look at the .dsc02:54
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bob2is it a native package with a non-native version?02:55
karlhegNative; and looking in there was the first thing I did when it did not work.02:55
bob2that version is non-native02:55
bob2so, fix the source so it's a .orig.tar.gz + .diff.gz02:56
stuNNedhmmm so with pbuilder now i can get evo from breezy, patch it, and build it?02:56
karlhegHuh.  There's no diff.gz listed in the .dsc, and not one on his DL site either.02:57
bob2yes, of course02:57
karlhegIt certainly is a non-native version number, I see that now that you point it out.02:57
bob2if you're packaging it, you make the .diff.gz yourself02:57
infinitybob2 : Erm, but '-x' should only warn, not error.  Making it impossible to UNPACK old broken native/non-native packages is wrong.02:57
bob2infinity: haven't people been complaining to scott all week a bout that?02:57
=== infinity summons keybuk.
karlheg\infty I agree.02:57
infinitykarlheg : Anyhow, there's nothing stopping you from unpacking it manually.02:58
karlhegThe voices in my head won't let me.  They say it's unclean and sinful.02:58
bob2but you do need to fix this02:58
=== karlheg is doing it despite their warnings...
bob2that package shouldn't be native02:59
infinityThe voices in your head are silly, then.  Since "dpkg-source -x" on a native package is identical to "tar -xzf foo.tar.gx"02:59
karlhegOk; will network with maintainer, md.03:00
Mezinfinity, keybuk is probably still drunk from LRL03:00
karlhegI wonder if this is hotplug-ng or a different thing... (haven't looked yet)03:00
karlhegWas there discussion wrt hotplug-ng, udev, initramfs, etc that was recorded where I can read it; anyone know off hand, or should I search?03:01
stuNNedi'm assuming i need to 'pbuilder login' to build breezy builds on hoary system?03:02
MezstuNNed, read the howto03:03
Mezhttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto *03:04
stuNNedyes but the example there says 'apt-get source bc' which grabs from hoary, is there way to 'apt-get source bc' from breezy?03:07
=== stuNNed is still reading
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lifelessstuNNed: if you have breezy src-deb lines, you can (IIRC) go apt-get source breezy/bc03:10
stuNNedlifeless: ah ok thanks03:11
stuNNeddoh thanks03:11
Mezany C++ coders here cna help me out a lil - fix this k3b probelm03:12
lifelessMez: whats the problem ?03:13
Mezcan i /query you lifeless?03:13
Mezthere may be a lot f files tuff03:13
Mez../../../../plugins/decoder/flac/k3bflacdecoder.cpp: In member function 'virtual QString K3bFLACDecoder::technicalInfo(const QString&) const':03:13
Mez../../../../plugins/decoder/flac/k3bflacdecoder.cpp:320: error: request for member 'get_field' in '((K3bFLACDecoder::Private*)((const K3bFLACDecoder*)this)->K3bFLACDecoder::d)->K3bFLACDecoder::Private::comments-> FLAC::Metadata::VorbisComment::get_vendor_string()', which is of non-class type 'const FLAC__byte*'03:13
Mezis how it's bombing out03:14
Burgundaviaogra, bugday03:15
Burgundaviaogra, I can make myself free the whole day if needed03:15
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lifelessMez: that probably means that someone changed the type of get_vendor_string()'s type03:17
Mezlifeless... it's a bit confusing03:17
Mezifdef FLAC_NEWER_THAN_1_1_103:17
Mez      return QString::fromUtf8((char*)d->comments->get_vendor_string());03:17
Mez      return QString::fromUtf8(d->comments->get_vendor_string().get_field());03:17
lifelesswell there you go03:17
lifelessyou probably have a flac that is newer than 1.1.103:18
lifelessbut that define isn't set03:18
MezI've no idea how to find that03:18
lifelesscheck configure ;003:19
Mezo ffs03:19
sladenflac -v03:19
sladenor `pwd` ...03:19
Mezyeah breezy uses 1.1.203:20
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Mezactually it looks like it is getting the newer version of flac... but.... not having it properly03:22
MezChanged the signature of FLAC::Metadata::VorbisComment::get_vendor_string() and FLAC::Metadata::VorbisComment::set_vendor_string() to use a UTF-8, NUL-terminated string const FLAC__byte * for the vendor string instead of FLAC::Metadata::VorbisComment::Entry.03:23
MezI thik the .get_field is an error03:23
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stuNNedhow to apply a .patch to a tar.gz file?03:52
bob2presumably you want to apply it to the source within, right?03:53
bob2and the .tar.gz is the .orig.tar.gz, right?03:54
bob2so include the changes in your .diff.gz03:54
bob2or use dpatch and put the patch in a seperate file in debian/patches/whater03:54
stuNNedok let me try03:55
stuNNedthe 1st method03:55
=== Mez can never remember how to use dpatch properly
Mezso i build one as if i'd just done it manually04:01
Mezthen extract the package and grab the changes from the change file in there04:01
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Lathiat"Rebuild for this weeks d-bus API"06:30
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fabbionehey pitti07:51
pittiinfinity: what's the status of the amd64 buildds?07:52
pittiinfinity: if that is still broken, any chance to do an exceptional binary upload for the amd64 ruby security update?07:52
fabbioneall the amd64 buildd are down?07:57
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pittifabbione: well, the ruby build killed two of them07:59
fabbioneso it was YOU killing the buildd!08:00
fabbionecrimsun: ping?08:06
crimsunfabbione: pong08:06
fabbionecrimsun: how safe is alsa 0.9.0+ that has been pushed to Linus for .13 inclusion?08:07
infinitypitti : Yeah, If we're going to do a by-hand build, I'd have to do it at home.  I don't feel the urge to kill yet another buildd.08:07
crimsunfabbione: 1.0.9+?08:07
fabbionemeh yeah08:07
fabbionethat one08:08
crimsunfabbione: do you have link to the log handy?08:08
fabbione  ftp://ftp.alsa-project.org/pub/kernel-patches/alsa-git-2005-06-22.patch.gz08:09
crimsunoh, that's safe08:09
crimsunthat includes the 1.0.9a (and 1.0.9b, which Thomas and Jordi already applied)08:10
pittiinfinity: depends on what the ETA for fixing that is...08:11
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infinitypitti : -ENOELMO08:11
pittiinfinity: since it is remote arbitrary code exection, I'd like to fix that ASAP08:11
pittiinfinity: can I build it on concordia? or will that kill concordia as well?08:12
infinityconcordia runs the same kernel as the buildds, so you could end up blowing it up too...08:12
fabbionepitti: concordia will die like all the others08:12
pittihm :-(08:12
infinityconcodia's chroots may also be a bit unclean.08:12
pittifabbione: it crashes during a debhelper call (dh_shlibdeps or so)08:12
infinityIf we're going to bypass the buildds (ugh), I'd rather have some control over the build environment.08:13
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fabbionepitti: i saw that.. the dmesg output is rather scary08:13
fabbione[ANNOUNCE]  ndevfs - a "nano" devfs08:14
=== fabbione sighs
fabbionenot another dynamic /dev implementation :/08:14
pittithe famous last words of the petunia bowl08:14
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pittiHey dholbach 08:17
dholbachhey pitti08:17
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=== dilinger attempts to not think about what fabio just pasted
infinitydilinger : THinking is bad for your health.08:27
fabbionedilinger: dude.. that's on LKML... and it already gave me headacke for being monday :P08:29
fabbionewho is part of the dbus team?08:31
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fabbionedaniels: dude?08:32
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fabbionedpkg-checkbuilddeps: Unmet build dependencies: libncurses5-dev libc6-dev-ppc6408:43
fabbionecan you please install the above on davis/breezy chroot?08:43
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fabbioneinfinity: well just queued the request :)08:46
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pittigerman guys: did you see the HP/Ubuntu article in the c't? :-)08:55
dholbachno, not yet08:56
pittiHi siretart 08:57
siretartinfinity: do you happen to have access to the universe uploaders keyring?08:58
siretartI'd like to import it to the uploaders keyring of http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/index.py08:59
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pittihi jordi09:23
dholbachhey jordi  :)09:25
hungerWhen will the new linux-restricted-modules for breezy become available?09:25
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pittiHi carlos09:25
pittihunger: before that we want the final version09:26
pitti(of 2.6.12)09:26
hungerpitti Arg... typing is broken today:-)09:26
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jordihi pitti, daniel09:27
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dholbachso who of you joins the review day? :)09:29
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hungerdholbach: review day?09:29
dholbachhey mvo 09:29
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dholbachhunger: yeah, we're trying to regain control on wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUToReview and wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUNewPackages09:30
mvohey dholbach, morning all!09:30
hungerdholbach: Ah, ok. So it is nothing I can help with.09:31
dholbachhunger: hope to see you there soon ;)09:31
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hungerdholbach: Nice of you to say so, but you do not want me there... I tend to break everything I touch:-(09:32
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dholbachhunger: that's a good start :)09:32
dholbachmorning sabdfl, morning ivoks :)09:32
sabdflhey guys09:32
pittiHi sabdfl09:33
dholbachhow is it going?09:33
hungerdholbach: ... and I am even too stupid to register properly on the ubuntu pages, so I guess I failed the MOTU intelligence test;-)09:33
dholbachhunger: if you keep on trying, ... :)09:34
dholbachjsgotangco: hey jerome! :)09:34
hungerdholbach: Well... I keep on thinking of switching to gentoo... as I have to build so much stuff on my own anyway:-(09:35
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pittidholbach: is today the mega-review day?09:35
dholbachhunger: erm? why is that?09:35
hungerdholbach: My laptop is too new for breezy:-(09:35
dholbachpitti: yeah, we desperately needed it09:35
hungerdholbach: Well, actually gentoo has way older packages, so that is not an option either... looks like I am stuck with you;-)09:36
dholbachhunger: you should get in touch with the guys fixing this kind of stuff and help them fix it09:36
jsgotangcodholbach, hey! how was your weekend?09:36
dholbachjsgotangco: busy :)09:36
hungerdholbach: Yeap... I probably should do that.09:37
dholbachjsgotangco: i took a break from thesis/learning for the REVIEW DAY! :)09:37
dholbachhunger: absolutely09:37
dholbachmorning doko09:37
dholbachjsgotangco: how are you?09:37
hungerdholbach: But there seems to be little interesst into exotic stuff like getting my TPM working (and the prerequisits are not even there in ubuntu yet).09:38
=== Amaranth tries to remember who is doing the laptop stuff
jsgotangcodholbach, not bad, actually my week started with a delivery of a new rack server at home for a client project for Oracle09:39
dholbachhunger: if nobody knows about the problems, it's unlikely to happen09:39
jsgotangcodholbach, strange thing is that Ubuntu runs perfectly on the system while RH AS 3.0 won't09:39
Amaranthisn't RH AS up to 4.0?09:39
=== dholbach hugs his Ubuntu... it behaves so well
jsgotangcoES rather09:40
jsgotangcoAmaranth, yeah, its already 4.0 but some Oracle applications still want 3.009:40
jsgotangcosometimes 2.109:40
jsgotangco(RapidStart for instance)09:40
hungerdholbach: I might end up making some noise about the TPM stuff once the 2.6.12 kernel is in breezy.09:40
dholbachdoes anybody else get "wrong password" in the wiki?09:40
jsgotangcoit would have been great if the RapidStart people in Thailand actually get the thing to run in Ubuntu09:41
Amaranthhunger: It's in.09:41
=== dholbach points at ivoks_reviewer - watch that dedication :)
hungerAmaranth: Yeap, but the restricted modules are still missing... which stops net from working on my laptop. No fun;-)09:44
Amaranthah, fun09:44
ivoks_reviewerdholbach: :))09:46
Lathiathunger: the restricted modules is nto the problem09:48
Lathiathunger: the problem is you have the wrong laptop ;p09:48
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dholbachi hope we won't end up in so big lists next time, but i'm confident with http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/index.py around09:48
hungerLathiat: It is not the laptop, that works fine. It's the OS!09:49
dholbachhey opi, it's review day - i just had a look at your acpitool09:49
opidholbach: bah! I need to fix two things at least09:49
opidholbach: remove hard deps (GCC and stuff)09:49
opidholbach: and.. add better description09:50
opidholbach: I was flooded with work lately :-(09:50
dholbachdon't worry09:50
danielsfabbione: er09:50
fabbionedaniels: if you can, would you be so kind to remove mono support in dbus for sparc?09:50
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danielsfabbione: yeah, will do09:51
fabbionedaniels: thanks a lot dude09:52
\sh_reviewtimewasabi: ping09:53
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maeHrm, does ubuntu plan to include NetworkManager into breezy?09:59
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dholbachhey bob210:00
bob2hey dholbach 10:01
bob2oh crap10:01
dholbachi wasnt going to complain10:01
maewhat about native eclipse.. does ubuntu plan to pick that up too? :)10:01
dholbachmae: udu.wiki.ubuntu.com/JavaRoadmap10:01
\sh_reviewtimewasabi: eclipse is broken :) the /etc/jvm.d/eclipse is missing...u don't install it anywhere ;)10:01
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dholbachmorning sbastien10:02
seb128hey dholbach :)10:02
pittiHey seb128 10:02
seb128hello pitti10:03
mdkecan you guys log into the wiki? I can't right now10:03
dholbachmdke: no, me neither10:04
dholbachmdke: i'm making notes - this feels so 1980 ;)10:04
\sh_reviewtimei can :)10:04
\sh_reviewtimei actually logged in10:04
mdkeok \sh_reviewtime gets to do all the work10:05
maeudu some sort of acronym?10:06
mdkemae, yes, see the frontpage of that wiki10:06
dholbachmae: ubuntu down under10:06
dholbachmae: which was the codename of the last conference - should be all on the wiki itself :)10:07
mdkeyes it is10:07
mdkeelmo, dholbach and I can't log into the wiki and are getting withdrawal symptoms, is there anything you can do?10:07
=== dholbach hugs mdke :)
maewell i've been messing around with network manager on fc4 and it looks pretty promising.. it works perfectly with wired connections but it gets messed up when i unplug the wire and it goes to the wireless connection :)10:08
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mdkedholbach, you're delirious10:08
bob2the best bit is how it oopses the ipw2100 driver10:08
dholbachmdke: and you're soooo funny :)10:09
maehehe well i'm running a broadcom chip through ndiswrapper and its screwing up.. pretty sure its NM and not ndiswrapper tho10:11
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fabbionecarlos: so.. i am looking at the initrd10:14
fabbioneboth the drivers are there...10:14
fabbionebut you say that none of them is loaded?10:15
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carlosfabbione, not sure with the final 2.6.12, previous one didn't load anyone10:18
carlosfabbione, at least, the verbose boot didn't show me anything about megaraid10:20
carlosfabbione, with my home made kernel that includes the new driver inside the kernel I get the old one loaded too so perhaps it's a problem of both drivers being in conflict10:20
fabbionecarlos: yes.. i think i found why10:20
fabbioneno the problem is that none of them is claiming directly the LSI Logic / Symbios Logic MegaRAID vendor ID10:21
fabbioneso basically both of them are probed or none10:21
carloshmm, the new driver documentation lists my card as supported10:23
carlosso they forgot to add the ID?10:23
fabbionecarlos: either they missed the ID or i did a wrong split.. but i am checking now10:24
fabbionethe next upload should have the proper fix10:24
fabbione-               PCI_ANY_ID, PCI_ANY_ID, 0, 0, 0},10:25
fabbionethis is from the old driver10:25
fabbionebut there is no equivalent in the new one apparently10:25
fabbioneso that's an easy fix :)10:26
fabbioneor should be10:26
fabbionecarlos: i will have a test kernel for you as soon as you wake up again10:26
carlosfabbione, cool. thank you10:27
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carlosfabbione, btw, my card is an Intel SRCS1610:27
fabbionecarlos: that's why i asked for lspci -n10:28
fabbionecarlos: the 1000:1960 match is only in the old driver10:28
fabbionecarlos: it's much easier to track ;)10:28
fabbioneas you can see from the normal lspci, it shows up as LSI10:28
carlosfabbione, yeah, it also says LSI when I boot the computer10:29
carlosso not sure if it's correct or not10:29
fabbionethe LSI is the vendor (1000)10:29
fabbionethe Symbios Logic MegaRAID (1960) shows an AMI Megaraid 3 chipset10:30
fabbioneIntel probably only assembled the overall10:30
fabbioneand sold it as its own card10:30
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carlosfabbione, ok10:30
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Kamionpitti: don't we already have the final 2.6.12?10:36
pittino :-(10:36
pittilinux-image-2.6.12-1-k7 | | http://archive.ubuntu.com breezy/main Packages10:36
pittilinux-source-2.6.12 | 2.6.12-2.1 | http://archive.ubuntu.com breezy/main Packages10:36
pittilinux-source-2.6.12 | 2.6.12-2.1 | http://archive.ubuntu.com breezy/main Sources10:36
fabbioneKamion: yes we do10:36
pittiKamion: the source, yes, but no debs10:36
fabbionecarlos: can you please add the last info for me ?10:36
fabbionecarlos: lspci -vvv10:36
fabbionecarlos: i need to see some subsystem info10:36
=== Amaranth could have sworn his k7 image was 2.6.12-2
Kamionlinux-image-2.6.12-2-k7 | 2.6.12-2.1 |        breezy | i38610:37
Kamionpitti: ^10:37
pittiargh, new ABI10:37
fabbionecarlos: nevermind :) i found it10:38
carlosfabbione, too late, I added it already :-P10:38
fabbione#define PCI_DEVICE_ID_INTEL_RAID_SRCS16                 0x196010:38
fabbione#define PCI_SUBSYS_ID_INTEL_RAID_SRCS16                 0x052310:38
mptseb128: Is "Go to font folder" Ubuntu-specific?10:39
maeanaconda sucks10:44
maeso does yum and up2date10:44
Amaranthmae: iow you hate everything that isn't debian?10:45
maewell, no, just based on my experience.10:45
bob2fabbione: 2.6.12 from breezy won't boot on hoary, right?10:46
maeyum by itself is a very elegant piece of software, it makes rpm *alot* nicer.. but the fact that rpm dependency information is traditionally stored only in the headers of the packages themselves, it is painfully slow. :( yum search takes at least 30 seconds10:47
fabbionebob2: you can't install 2.6.12 in hoary without a few other packages10:47
fabbionebob2: and please don't even suggest that to people10:48
bob2fabbione: oh, I won't, this is for me :)10:48
bob2I want 2.6.12 for the x40 IRDA love10:48
fabbionethe dependecies can't be satisfied without some stuff10:48
Amaranthbob2: Use breezy? :)10:48
fabbionebob2: well you know what to do than :)10:48
fabbionebob2: i think it can boot... let me know :P10:48
bob2thanks fabio :P10:49
maeAmaranth, I don't hate everything thats non-debian :) aside from those three qualities RH is a very polished distro, right down to the very cursor and icon themes.10:49
Amaranthugh, bluecurve10:49
maeand the nice graphical tools to configure servers10:49
bob2Amaranth: was planning to hold out until X stays working for 2 days in a row ;p10:50
Amaranthit's worked for weeks for me (more or less)10:50
ivoks_reviewermae: and you don't have to download whole Packages.gz just for one changed packag10:51
ivoks_reviewermae: one downloads only new headers of that package...10:52
maeivoks_reviewer, yes, and when you want to download that 1 package yum proceeds to download every header of every dependency and the depencies of those depencies and so on and so on if you want to install it :)10:53
maedebian you dl it up front, redhat just toys with you10:53
maei mean, i dont mind d/l'ing one packages.gz .. the dependency calculation is so much faster10:54
ograhappy review day everybody10:54
ivoks_reviewerwouldn't it be better if packages.gz would be devided per package?10:54
ivoks_reviewerogra: you too :)10:54
pittiHey ogra10:54
dholbachhey ogra :)10:54
bob2ivoks_reviewer: that would add more delays10:55
bob2unless you pipelined10:55
maeI'm on a satellite connection so "yum search" takes literally 1-2 minutes sometimes. because of the many connections it has to establish.  doing any yum operation is pure torture10:55
bob2ivoks_reviewer: a better solution would be storing diffs between Packages files on the server, so you only need to download the changes10:55
ivoks_reviewerbob2: even better10:55
ivoks_reviewerpitti: hi! i'm bit confused with CUPS in ubuntu, could you help me figure it out? :)10:56
maeivoks_reviewer, I am not trying to be a pundit, but I just tried out an rpm distro a few days ago and I got so mad..  I mean I don't even understand why RH still uses it, its awful10:57
ivoks_reviewerpitti: lpadmin group has every right to do with CUPS, right?10:57
ivoks_reviewerpitti: and lp doesn't have any rights... basicly, unused group?10:57
pittiivoks_reviewer: no, group lp has the privilege to access printer devices directly10:58
pittiivoks_reviewer: /dev/lp* and so on10:58
pittiivoks_reviewer: no user should be in that group10:58
ivoks_reviewerbut user, not in groups lp or lpadmin can print10:58
ivoks_reviewerbut can't delete it's print jobs10:58
pittibut only through cups10:58
pittiyes, I have a bug about that10:58
ivoks_revieweri submited it :)10:58
pittiah, ok :-)10:58
ivoks_reviewerok, so there is no way to create user that will be unable to print? :)10:59
pittiivoks_reviewer: that should be discussed10:59
pittiwe could introduce a group that has printing privileges11:00
ivoks_revieweri tought so, yes11:00
pittibut of course that will lock out all existing users out there11:00
ivoks_revieweri just suggested wrong group11:00
ivoks_reviewerpitti: true11:00
pittiivoks_reviewer: well, it's not so bad, lpadmin should be allowed to print anyway11:00
ivoks_reviewerbut having all users able to print... makes hard creating print server11:01
pittiivoks_reviewer: and on upgrade it will be necessary to put other users into the "printing" group if appropriate11:01
ivoks_reviewerthat would be easy11:01
ivoks_reviewercheck out who is in lpadmin11:01
ivoks_reviewerand add it to printing11:01
ivoks_reviewerthat would requiere changing users-admin tool, too11:02
mdkecan anyone else fix wiki login?11:02
makoMez, mdke: yes yes11:05
=== ogreview shakes his head about the repository thread .... people in #ubuntu are not average users ???
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ogreviewhey marilize :)11:07
mdkemako, is that a yes, you can fix it?11:07
ivoks_reviewermae: rpm has lots of disadvantages, true (sorry for late reply)11:08
maeivoks_reviewer, hehe np :)11:09
maehey what do most of you guys use for a development env.. i haven't been able to get used anything but vi.11:11
maebut vi doesn't have code-completion or any other of those nifty time-savers :)11:11
Lathiatyes it does, your just not using it properly :)11:12
maeLathiat, enlighten me?11:13
Lathiatim not sure of the secifics i dont use it much11:14
Lathiat<blah> stuff11:14
Lathiatcan complete function names, other words in the files, etc11:14
danielsmdz: ping11:14
fabbionecarlos: still awake?11:14
Kamionmae: ctrl-n, ctrl-p11:14
Kamionmae: assuming you're using vim, as you probably should be if you want a development editor11:15
makomdke: i think that was a nick completion error :)11:15
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Kamionoh, just my luck, fabbione's hammering concordia11:17
fabbioneKamion: i can stop immediatly11:17
Kamionnah, it's ok, I can cope with a bit of latency once I know why it's there11:18
fabbioneKamion: done.. all your11:18
danielsKamion: XORG BUILD O'CLOCK11:18
fabbioneno problem.. i was only doing a test build11:18
fabbionenothing important11:18
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=== pitti starts to sing "How many builds must an X.org package go down..."
=== iwj [~ian@xenophobe.extern.relativity.greenend.org.uk] has joined #ubuntu-devel
Kamionfabbione: all yours again11:20
iwjHello people.11:20
fabbioneKamion: danke11:20
Kamionmorning Ian11:20
danielspitti: about one for every day I'm away, AFAICT :P11:20
danielsiwj: good morning11:20
dholbachmorning iwj 11:20
pittiHello iwj, welcome 11:20
iwjJust popping in for half an hour at the moment, to say hello.11:21
lifelesswelcome iwj 11:21
mdkemako, ah k11:21
fabbionehey iwj 11:22
Kamionmjg59: new CD image for HP building now, should be ready within fifteen minutes or so11:22
fabbioneYAY for ABI changes!11:22
iwjWhat kind of hours does mdz keep ?11:23
pittiogreview: D'oh, what's the point in beagle if I only get exceptions, and the daemon immediately crashes if I start it manually? :-(11:23
dholbachpitti: enjoy brandnew software :)11:23
danielsiwj: late West Coast11:23
Kamioniwj: typically turns up around 4 or 5pm London time, and continues until well after I go to bed11:23
pittidholbach: yes, but... "FATAL: Could not set extended attributes on a file in your home directory."11:23
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danielsiwj: typically seems to sleep around 1000 UTC, wake up at about 1800 or thereabouts11:23
pittidholbach: that's just *stupid*11:23
dholbachpitti: ah yes... you have to change something to your filesystem's mount options :)11:24
seb128pitti: do you use user_xattr ?11:24
dholbachpitti: add user_xattr11:24
pittino, I don't use that stuff11:24
seb128you should11:24
ogreviewpitti, defaults,user_xattr11:24
pittithat thing is supposed to read my files, not mess up my ~...11:24
pittiyes, I read it on the wiki page11:24
seb128ah ah11:25
seb128just don't use beagle :)11:25
=== pitti reconsiders grep -r
pittiwell, I'll give it a try at some day11:25
TreenaksI've tried beagle... but I just don't seem to need it11:25
ogreviewTreenaks, hey, its hip to use it :)11:26
dholbachi reviewed kat (kde's equivalent) and after spitting out 20mbs of sqlite file it stopped dead :)11:26
=== iwj is now known as Diziet
dholbachfancy desktop search has still some child diseases it seems11:27
seb128beagle sucks atm imho11:27
Treenaksogreview: oh sure, it looks nice11:27
dholbachseb128: my french harry potter books arrived - i'll bug you with silly questions soon ;-)11:27
Treenaksogreview: but I just don't need it :)11:27
seb128dholbach: cool :)11:28
ogreviewTreenaks, nobody needs it, but you have to have it  ;)11:28
seb128people working on ffmpeg, Debian has a new snapshot of the CVS :p11:28
ograseb128, thanks11:28
\sh_reviewtimeseb128: u said the wrong word ;-)11:28
ograseb128, but i doubt it will compile11:28
=== ogra goes trying
Treenaksogra: it's mono. it eats too much memory. and my ~ layout is sane :)11:29
ograTreenaks, yes, but youre out of fashion then.... only using grep isnt zeitgeisty11:29
Treenaksogra: I don't really care :)11:30
=== ogra is always happy to use this word :)
Treenaksogra: weird German words :)11:30
ograTreenaks, its english :) thats why its so funny11:30
Treenaksogra: where do you think they stole it? :P11:31
carlosfabbione, hi11:33
ograinfinity, could you have a look at libsigcx ? it was uploaded last thursday, according to the build log it built, but the ubuntu1 binaries didnt get copied to the archive11:34
fabbionecarlos: yo dude.. http://people.ubuntu.com/~fabbione/ get initrd.img-2.6.12-2-686.new11:34
fabbionecarlos: replace the one in /boot created by the installer and let me know if that one work :)11:34
carlosfabbione, dude, we are in the same time zone. I was sleepy because I just woke up when you pinged me :-)11:34
carlosfabbione, ok11:34
fabbionecarlos: ehhehe thanks11:34
seb128elmo: gnome-terminal drivel sync please11:35
carlosfabbione, it boots now. Thanks!11:39
fabbionecarlos: cool.... now please don't upgrade the kernel for the next release if i don't tell you to do so11:40
fabbionethe driver is ok11:40
fabbioneit's the initrd creation that needs fix11:40
fabbionebasically when the initrd is created, it still sees the old module loaded for that controller11:40
fabbioneand it assumes that the module will be the same11:40
fabbionei need to add a one line hack in it11:41
fabbioneso that it will load both of them11:41
fabbionethere is no conflict.. it was simply not loaded at all11:41
infinityogra : Did it contain NEW binaries?11:41
carloshmm, it does not looks like it has an easy solution11:41
ograinfinity, nope its CXX transition stuff11:41
ograinfinity, and it holds up other packages :/11:41
carlosunless I create it without that module loaded11:42
dholbachogra: the   *c2  stuff is a new binary package11:42
infinityogra : If it's CXX transition stuff, then it must have had new binary packages.11:42
fabbionecarlos: nah i can just fix it.. don't worry.. 11:42
ograinfinity, dholbach err, yes, right11:42
dholbachogra: so it'll need manual review11:42
infinityogra : So, yeah.  It's waiting on someone to push it through the NEW queue.11:42
fabbionecarlos: i need to make an initrd-tools upload with that fix BEFORE the next kernel :)11:42
carlosfabbione, thank you for your time11:42
infinityKamion : ping.11:42
fabbionecarlos: no, thanks to you for helping hunting down the bug11:42
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carlosfabbione, btw, I have another one about the network card, in case you are bored and taskless :-)11:44
fabbionecarlos: is that a sk98lin?11:44
carlosbut I'm not sure it's a kernel problem (althought it came with 2.6.12)11:44
fabbione8139cp ?11:44
fabbioneknown upstream bug11:44
fabbionei read the thread this morning11:44
carlosIt works, but I need to turn on the network by hand11:45
carlosevery time11:45
carlosbecasue hotplug gets confused11:45
carlosis that the problem?11:45
fabbionecarlos: it's not just hotplug11:45
infinityKamion : libsigcx needs some NEW love for it's binaries, if you could be so kind.11:45
=== infinity -> leaving work.
carlosfabbione, will wait for the fix then, in the mean time, an 'ifup eth0' fixes it11:46
fabbionecarlos: according to the report, it cannot send traffic at all11:46
Kamioninfinity: OK, will do shortly, just catching up on activity reports11:46
carlosI can11:47
carlosfabbione, so perhaps is not the same problem...11:47
fabbionecarlos: hmmm .... i think i know what it is... 11:47
carlosfabbione, the problem I get here is that I see an error about being unable to map eth011:48
carlosand the network is not loaded, but an 'ifup eth0' fixes it11:48
fabbionecarlos: that's a grepmap issue i think.. it's not kernel related. i see tthat one too here with other cards11:48
fabbioneifup eth0 doesn't modprobe the driver11:48
fabbionethe driver is already loaded at that point11:48
carlosbut it came with 2.6.1211:49
carlos2.6.10 does not have that problem11:49
fabbionecarlos: it did come with breezy11:49
fabbionei could see that with 2.6.10 too11:49
carlosfabbione, breezy + 2.6.10 works11:49
fabbioneand iface configured via dhcp11:49
fabbioneif i switch to static ip it works fine11:49
fabbionebut i had really no time to look at that11:49
carloswell, I can wait, it's my home server so I don't reboot it too often11:50
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fabbionecarlos: ok.. 11:51
bob2hrm, is it possible to add to the pci ids a driver recognises at runtime?12:02
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Lathiatbob2: why on earth would you want to do that12:07
Mithrandiruhm, why on earth are the host entries in my ssh known_hosts file base64 encoded?12:08
MithrandirKamion: ^^12:08
danielsMithrandir: it's new and shiny.12:08
danielsyou can disable it if you like12:08
Mithrandirbase64 is old and crufty.12:08
KamionMithrandir: see the changelog and/or the NEWS file12:08
tsengMithrandir: 64 > 3212:08
Mithrandirit's terrible, I don't have base64grep.12:08
KamionMithrandir: use ssh-keygen to manage known_hosts12:08
KamionMithrandir: it has new options to do it12:08
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MithrandirKamion: that's such a wrong tool to do that. :-)12:09
KamionMithrandir: blame upstream :-)12:09
MithrandirKamion: blaming openssh upstream sounds like the right thing, yes.12:09
bob2Lathiat: because the x40 ir port is supported by the nsc-ircc driver, but the id wasn't added until 2.6.12-rc112:10
Mithrandirbob2: ah, that's right, but it's a trivial patch.12:10
Mithrandirbob2: or you could get my nsc-ircc which works, iirc.12:10
KamionMithrandir: but the exact location of the functionality is not all that relevant; in any case, the point was to slow down attacks that discover other hosts to attack by browsing through known_hosts12:10
bob2but it still requires a rebuild :)12:10
Mithrandirbob2: I have the module if you trust me.12:11
hungerDamn, the tpm fix I need did not make it into
KamionMithrandir: also, base64 is only the armouring; it's actually a SHA-1 hash12:13
MithrandirKamion: it sounds utterly unuseful, but I digress.12:13
KamionI disagree; I thought about it before enabling it (it's not the upstream default yet, although they want testing)12:14
ograseb128, no go for ffmpeg :(12:15
azeemSheesh, look at how Canonical is treating its employees:12:16
seb128what's wrong with this one?12:16
danielshe looks like mother teresa for some reason12:16
ograazeem, yes, we dont even can buy shoes :)12:16
MithrandirI wonder how many miles that water bottle has traveled.12:16
danielsogra: speak for yo'self12:17
Kamioninfinity: libsigcx NEWed12:17
ograseb128, the same.... it breaks with a ton of assembler errors on i386.... at least it builds unpatched on amd64 now ...12:17
ograso its a step further...12:17
ograbut only a small one12:17
mdkeanyone awake who can fix the wiki yet?12:18
ograKamion, thanks a lot , that held up a bunch of other packages12:18
ograseb128,  error: PIC register '%ebx' clobbered in 'asm'12:19
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Kamionfabbione: will you kill me if sparc stops being debootstrappable for a bit? I haven't quite worked out what to do with lib64gcc1's priority12:20
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fabbioneKamion: no problem at all12:22
fabbioneKamion: if you need access to the sparc to work out stuff, or need me to check something, just tell me ok?12:24
Kamionsure - I'm trying to juggle all the architectures at the moment though :)12:24
danielsKamion: by the way, I'm going to switch to the libdl-based loader tomorrow, so most architectures should be broken12:25
danielsKamion: and also split xserver-xorg up into one package per driver and remove xlibs-dev12:25
danielsKamion: but seriously.  if I do the xserver-xorg thing, and have xserver-xorg Recommend each driver package, will dist-upgrades bpull the Recommends in?12:26
KamionI think my trollmeter just went off12:26
danielsKamion: having xserver-xorg Depend on each driver seems to defeat the point a little.12:26
Kamiondaniels: no12:26
danielsKamion: (i'm serious about the xserver-xorg one-package-per-driver thing)12:26
danielsKamion: hm.  shit.12:26
Kamiondaniels: aptitude can be configured to do that, but apt-get won't12:26
Kamionwhy one package per driver? the facility to have third-party driver packages, sure, but it seems a little bit for-the-sake-of-it12:27
danielspreparing for what will happen when we drop the modular server into breezy12:27
danielswhereby every driver is built externally, for obvious reasons12:28
danielsalso makes driver fixes a *lot* easier12:28
Kamionthe only way to make upgrades work, that I can think of, is to make xserver-xorg a metapackage and move the actual server somewhere else12:28
danielsi was thinking of that, but there are lots of xserver-xorg | xserver-xfree86 depends I'd need to chnage12:29
=== fabbione food
danielsalthough xserver-xorg-core and xserver-xorg-driver-* sounds appealing12:29
daniels(later to become libxserver-dix and xserver-xorg-core)12:29
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HiddenWolfdaniels, should we keep our fingers crossed?12:48
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danielsi'm still working out exactly what's happened to xorg12:50
fabbionecarlos: is there any way i can get ssh access to your box?12:50
carlosfabbione, sure12:51
fabbionecarlos: cool12:51
carlosfabbione, you should have the login information in your mailbox12:57
fabbionecarlos: thanks12:57
carlosfabbione, do you need extra priviledges?12:58
fabbionenot sure yet12:58
fabbionecarlos: it doesn't like the passwd12:58
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carlosfabbione, that's because I'm so stupid that closed the user and admin dialog without saving the changes...12:59
=== carlos creates the account :-P
carlosfabbione, try again now.01:00
fabbionecarlos: much better :)01:01
fabbionecarlos: i need sudo mkinitrd privileges01:02
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danielsmdz: unless you have any objections, -33 will change autodetect_* behaviour01:05
danielsmdz: they'll all become temporary flags (i.e. need to be set every time before you run it), and dpkg-reconfigure will automatically set them all to true01:05
danielsmdz: actually, bugger that01:08
danielsmdz: nevermind me01:08
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mdkeare the changelogs for security updates available somewhere?01:22
Treenaksmdke: in the packages ?01:22
mdkeapart from that01:23
Lathiatand on changelogs.u.c, if you use update manager you can look at them when you update01:23
jordiJaneW: ping01:23
mdkeLathiat, ok thanks that's what I wanted01:23
mdkeLathiat, i can't find the security changelog for the kernel update on that site, do you know where it might be?01:27
mdkeLathiat, nm01:27
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opimorning sabdfl 01:28
pittimoin sabdfl 01:29
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mdkesabdfl, hi! are you able to resolve the wiki login being down?01:33
jbaileyKamion: No, ppc64 systems do not require libc6-ppc64 to work.  I tihnk for now it can safely be pulled in as a dependancy. 01:38
JaneWjordi: pong01:38
danielsmdz: heads-up: force_keyboard_detection is being renamed to autodetect_keyboard in -3301:39
Kamionjbailey: dependency of what?01:40
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jbaileyKamion: ANything that eventually needs it.  svenl suggested that procps might be happiest compiled as ppc64 for that arch (I haven't needed it yet, it's on my to-look-at- list)01:41
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fabbionecarlos: i have done for now. I will probably ssh back in if jbailey has a fix to test for it01:43
carlosfabbione, ok01:43
elmoKamion: pls try triggering archvsync@magellanic ?01:44
Kamionjbailey: strace maybe?01:44
carlosfabbione, will remove the admin permissions now, please ask for tehm again when you need them. I will leave the normal account until you finish.01:44
Kamionjbailey: (it depends on libc6-sparc64 on sparc)01:44
fabbionecarlos: that's perfect! thanks01:44
Kamionelmo: bash: /home/archvsync/torrent-sync: Permission denied01:45
elmoand once more, for muppets the world over?01:45
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jbaileyKamion: Right, might be useful there too.01:45
jbaileyKamion: But even so, I suspect it can be just pulled in as a dependancy of strace.01:45
fabbioneelmo: hey dude01:46
elmofabbione: hey, I fixed davis/breezy - sorry about that01:46
fabbioneelmo: no problem.. thanks :)01:46
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fabbionedpkg-checkbuilddeps: Unmet build dependencies: libc6-dev-ppc6401:47
fabbioneelmo... hmmmm01:47
fabbioneit still claims it's not there...01:47
sabdflmdke: not personally, but i'll ask about it if it's still an issue01:47
LathiatAnyone know if the python apt bindings can work on an external cache/archive set to that of the running system ?01:47
elmofabbione: err, whoops - that was && after the dist-upgrade which failed - fixed01:48
Kamionelmo: triggered, did it work?01:48
Kamionjbailey: sure, it would be - I was really just wondering whether it should/could be promoted to priority required/important01:49
fabbioneeeheh thanks elmo01:49
Kamionjbailey: (along with everything else pulled in by dependencies of base system stuff)01:49
elmoKamion: yeah, it's pulsing now01:49
jbaileyKamion: I don't know yet, sorry.01:50
sabdflmdke: seems to be working fine01:51
Kamionelmo: righto, automated01:51
elmoKamion: cheers, sorry about that01:51
jordidid JaneW reply before I lost my link?01:52
JaneWjordi: yes I said pong01:52
Kamionelmo: np01:53
jordiJaneW: sorry, power outage where my server is :)01:53
mdkesabdfl, neither myself nor dholbach could log in earlier. here I still can't login01:53
sabdflmdke: can you diagnose that with elmo please?01:53
mdkesabdfl, sure thing01:54
mdkeelmo, we can't login to the wiki01:54
mdkelaunchpad login is working fine01:54
elmomdke: when did you last try to login?01:56
mdkeright now01:56
mdkeelmo ^01:56
elmomdke: what IP are you coming from?01:57
mdkelemme look01:58
mdkeelmo ^01:58
mdkeso can others log in?01:59
mdkedholbach said earlier it was down for him too01:59
elmoI did without any problem, yes01:59
mdkewas working fine for me last night, this morning, it has not been working since I got up02:00
mdkealso jsgotangco said he couldn't login02:01
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elmomdke: what's your username for launchpad?02:07
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tsenginfinity: alive?02:08
elmoI'm sure there was something that would auto-decrypt https traffic given the relevant cert - does anyone remember what it is?02:09
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elmoaha, that looks like it, thanks tseng02:10
elmomdke: please try again now?02:10
jbailey"The only result can be that nobody gives a damn about ppc." - Ulrich Drepper.02:10
ograwow, the new gnome-power improved a lot :)02:11
mdkeelmo, works now!02:11
mdkeelmo, thanks a lot. what was up?02:11
jbaileyAnyone feel like showing up at his door with axes and torches with me?02:11
elmomdke: ok, cool.  the authserver had a code roll out that broke some wiki logins.  it's been rolled back until the developers can diagnose and fix02:11
pittijbailey: I'd rather club him with my ibook02:12
elmopitti: I wouldn't, they're a precious/rare commmodity these days :-P02:12
pittihm, right02:12
pittielmo: what about a wooden iBook imitate? :-)02:12
Mithrandirelmo: well, real laptops take hitting people just fine.02:12
jbaileypitti: I have  G5 here that I"m pretty certain would survive. =)02:12
mdkeelmo, ok thanks for sorting it02:13
jbaileybob2: Hey. =)02:13
tsengelmo: im hoping muine looks better to you today, unstable accepted it with a bit less splitting02:13
jbaileybob2: Oops, ECHAN. =)02:13
elmotseng: I'm not overly thrilled about the split in debian unstable, but I processed the ubuntu new one since it got in there02:15
tsengelmo: thanks.02:15
Kamionfabbione: what happened to sk98lin in nic-extra-modules?02:15
Kamionfabbione: or come to that at all02:16
fabbioneKamion: it's missing. we removed sk98lin to include skge, it's in the pending queue for the nic-* cleanup02:16
Kamionfabbione: oh, ok, please do that ASAP so that my primary d-i test machine works again :P02:17
fabbioneKamion: i am going to finish the cleanup tomorrow and upload the new kernel02:17
fabbioneKamion: we habe another abi change to deal with :)02:17
fabbionebrought to you by alsa 1.0.9 and ocfs02:17
Kamionand tomorrow daniels is going to rearrange xorg, so CDs are hosed for another week02:18
fabbionei could revert all the changes and upload 2.2 with only that fix02:18
fabbionebut it's kind of a pain02:19
fabbionedaniels: can you give me tomorrow before rearranging X?02:19
fabbioneKamion: if i upload tomorrow by 12:00 UTC, i think we can get the abi change in pretty fast...02:20
fabbioneKamion: specially if the kernel hit buildds with the latest ccache02:20
fabbioneactually.. much earlier than that02:20
danielsfabbione: -33 won't feature any rearrangements02:21
fabbioneKamion: ^^02:21
danielsi'm thinking I might separate my 'fixes for painful bugs' and 'break more shit out' uploads02:21
fabbioneis that ok for you?02:21
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Kamionfabbione: yes02:22
fabbioneok perfect... 02:22
ograKamion, what is the plan ith UbuntuExpress now ?02:22
ograwith even02:22
fabbionewe can prepare all the other stuff before hands02:22
Kamionogra: mdz's doing a framework02:22
fabbioneso it won't be too painful02:22
fabbionejbailey: do you think you can give the initrd-tools fix for that before tomorrow?02:22
ograKamion, yes i saw it, but what about the other guys that wanted to do it02:22
Kamionogra: as far as I know, we're going to implement the framework first and then have the other guys flesh it out02:23
Kamionogra: because having inexperienced people try to do the framework didn't work out well02:23
ograah, ok, i thought they already dropped it02:23
jbaileyfabbione: Define 'tomorrow' =)02:23
KamionI don't know, I've been buried in other things02:23
fabbionejbailey: within your working day02:23
ograKamion, me too, thats why i ask :)02:23
ograKamion, thanks for the info02:23
jbaileyfabbione: Yes, I have 8 items or so to do today, this will be one of them.02:23
fabbionejbailey: so that when i start tomorrow morning i can test it02:24
jbaileyfabbione: Yes, should be no problem.02:24
fabbionejbailey: perfect.. i count on that02:24
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Mithrandirjamesh: around?02:29
Kamionpitti: grep: usr/share/locale/af/LC_TIME/coreutils.mo: No such file or directory02:32
Kamionpitti: it's a dangling symlink. Is that a pkgstriptranslations bug?02:32
pitti/usr/share/locale/af/LC_TIME/coreutils.mo -> ../LC_MESSAGES/coreutils.mo02:32
pittiKamion: well, pkgstriptranslations of course strips away LC_MESSAGES/*.mo02:33
pittiI didn't think about symlinking from LC_* to LC_MESSAGES02:33
danielsso, I'm going to create a cute little race tonight or tomorrow in which /usr/bin/X11/Xorg and /usr/bin/X11/X will disappear02:37
danielsdist-upgrade and get the new xserver-common and xserver-xorg (6.8.2-33) when it arrives, then dist-upgrade again to get x-common 1.0102:37
danielsand life should be peachy02:37
pittiKamion: does such a symlink make sense in the first place?02:38
Kamionpitti: dunno, I haven't looked at the code02:38
KamionI suppose it could do02:38
pittiKamion: thanks for the hint, I'll look at it02:38
KamionI am totally mystified by #1178702:39
Kamionnetcfg has no code that can do that, as far as I can see, so something else must be munging /etc/network/interfaces02:40
danielsKamion: fwiw, with x-common 1.01, /usr/bin/X11 becomes a symlink to /usr/bin02:40
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dokoMithrandir: the multiarch-include patch for gcc doesn't honor -m32/-m64. if you use -m32 on amd64, /usr/include/x86_64 is in the include path, not /usr/include/i486-linux. that's not the way we want it.02:44
mdkedholbach, get your wiki hits now! 02:44
Mithrandirdoko: jbailey discovered that a bit ago, and yes, I'm aware of it but I haven't looked at it and fixed it.02:45
dholbachmdke: already did some changes :)02:45
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dholbachdid anybody else experience an inexplicable disturbance in the buildds' force?02:51
dholbachresulting in random segfaults?02:52
Kamionany particular architecture?02:53
dholbachglom's build didn't succeed and the nasm build looks strange too02:54
dholbachboth segfaulted at some stage02:54
Kamionpowerpc has been randomly SIGILLing for a long tim02:56
Kamionthough I'd thought the 64-bit kernel fixed that02:56
infinityKamion : We don't have new kernels on the buildds yet.  Heopfully, that's a "this week" thing.02:58
dholbachoh cool02:58
dholbachgood to know02:58
infinitydholbach : given back.02:58
dholbach*fingers crossed* ;)02:58
dholbachinfinity: thank you02:58
tsenginfinity: hey, could you maybe explain another buildd bugger?03:01
tsenginfinity: gtk-sharp2-unstable has lots of segfaults on x86 buildd, not not in my pbuilder03:01
infinitydholbach : glom succeeded, nasm failed in the same place, looks like ps2pdf is buggy.03:01
pittidholbach: btw, does glom run any better now with the current psql packages?03:02
infinitydholbach : I'm off to bed right now, can you check if ps2pdf currently has a bug open about SEGVs on PPC, and if not, open one?  (assign it to me, if you're feeling adventurous)03:02
infinitytseng : Want to bug me about it in ~9 hours? (or mail me... adconrad@u.c)03:03
tsenginfinity: hm sure03:03
infinitytseng : Danke.03:03
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danielsinfinity: night.  slacker.03:03
dholbachpitti: you have go through the same configuration "pain" but at least it's explained on glom's wiki03:05
pittidholbach: it should work out of the box over the unix socket03:06
dholbachinfinity: thanks a lot03:06
pittidholbach: can you please try to bug me about it from time to time?03:06
dholbachpitti: that's a libgda thing03:06
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pittielmo: quota sync, please03:10
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mptsabdfl: What do I need to do to get http://udu.wiki.ubuntu.com/MigratingToUbuntu approved?03:21
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mpthi AndyFitz03:23
AndyFitzg'day mpt03:23
tsengAndyFitz: bloody rippah03:23
AndyFitztseng, struth mate.  today was s-house.   how was yours ?03:24
Kamionmpt: erk, that's the first time I've ever seen that spec and it requires non-trivial installer work03:24
tsengAndyFitz: rockin03:24
mptKamion: I don't think Step 2 would be a BreezyGoal :-)03:25
mptStage 2, rather03:25
mptStage 1 at most03:25
Kamionmpt: ok, that's not mentioned03:25
Kamionit should be, for avoidance of panic among those with distro schedules :)03:25
Kamionp.s. what does "current OS" mean? it's often very hard to tell03:26
danielsmpt: i hope you're planning to implement #1303:26
Kamionfor dual-boot, sure, but triple-boot or more are common03:26
mptdaniels: haha03:26
Kamion(e.g. win95, winxp, linux)03:26
tsengthom: why does nm run its own nameserver?03:26
danielsmpt: seriously.03:27
silbsAndyFitz: ping03:27
Kamionthe language choice one is not possible without serious installer reengineering03:27
AndyFitzslibs: pong03:27
danielstseng: i assume because kicking all apps to re-read resolv.conf (*cough*FIREFOX*cough*) is a pain in the arse03:27
AndyFitzsilbs, pong03:27
Kamion(because the language is chosen before the disks are readable)03:27
Kamionalthough UbuntuExpress might help with that03:27
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mptdaniels: That would require learning to program03:27
danielsmpt: oh well03:28
mptI'm all about the Stage 103:28
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danielsi'm not about the stage 2, in this case03:28
hungerIs it really necessary for network-manager to install bind9?03:29
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thomtseng: work around the fact you can't reload libc's resolver sensibly, and tell apps that they need to do it too03:31
danielsmpt: if you're seriously proposing #13, you need to find someone to do it03:32
seb128daniels: same for the other points too :p03:32
Kamionreally those things ought to be separate specs03:34
thomhunger: for the moment, yes; see my answer to tseng03:34
danielsKamion: yet it must be approved yesterday03:35
hungerthom: resolveconf doesen't do it well enough?03:36
thomhunger: no.03:37
hungerthom: Damn:-)03:37
hungerthom: So resolvconf can go when installing nm?03:37
hungerthom: How about using some simpler thing as bind like dnsmasq?03:38
thomno, resolvconf is still useful03:43
thomhunger: and no, nm directly controls bind, so something else would need aditional code03:43
Lathiatit should bind to only by default tho :\03:44
Lathiatnot sure hwo to do that conditionally03:44
thomLathiat: the config does that03:45
Lathiatit does?03:45
Lathiatmine wasnt03:45
thomlisten-on  {; };03:45
Lathiatwell mine wasnt doing that03:45
Lathiatand i added that line myself03:45
thomto /var/lib/NetworkManager/NetworkManager-named.conf?03:46
thomthat's a generated file03:46
Lathiatno to named.conf.local03:46
Lathiator whateveritis03:46
thomthat's not used by NM's bind03:46
Lathiatso why was itlistening before03:46
Lathiatnm starts its own bind?03:46
Lathiatmaybe my system was starting a global bind too....03:47
thompossibly so03:47
Lathiatso why does NM use bind03:47
Lathiatand not just resolvconf ?03:47
bob223:43:59           thom |  hunger: and no, nm directly controls bind, so something else would need aditional code03:48
danielsLathiat: that was explained above03:48
Lathiatoh sorry *reads up*03:48
Lathiatah i see03:48
hungerIs there a reason for not listing the NM applet in the applet list? Or did I just miss it?03:49
Lathiatits not an applet03:50
Lathiatits a nofication icon03:50
Lathiat(that confused me too, bad name)03:50
hungerLathiat: nm-applet is no applet? Wow, nice!03:50
Lathiathunger: so you run nm-applet directly, heh03:50
hungerLathiat: So how do I get the notification icon?03:51
Lathiathunger: run nma--applet03:51
Lathiatnm-applet, rather03:51
hungerLathiat: There is no GUI way to do that?03:51
Lathiatalt+f2 nm-applet? :)03:52
Lathiati think th eidea is it shoudl be started by your session03:52
Lathiati added it to my session03:52
hungerLathiat: I thought this was supposed to be simpler than editing /etc/network/interfaces.03:52
tsengi added it to mine03:52
tsengi am thinking i should change it to respawn in the session03:52
tsengthe applet dies on dbus reload03:52
Lathiathunger: dude03:52
Lathiathunger: development03:52
Lathiathunger: think, default breezy install -> in by default03:52
hungerLathiat: Then add it;-)03:53
hungerLathiat: What about /etc/network/interfaces? Will that get replaced by NM?03:53
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Lathiatwell it doesnt exactly replace it03:54
hungerLathiat: Or will we have two places to configure the network now?03:54
Lathiatit handles mobile networking03:54
tsengnm uses interfaces as a "hint"03:54
Lathiatfor most people you probably wouldnt touch your interfaces file03:54
Lathiatothers would *shrug*03:54
hungerLathiat: That sucks... I'll never be able to figure out which config overwrites which!03:55
=== Lathiat blah
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daniels.win 3904:20
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tsengi try to keep it under 2004:20
TreenaksI start closing windows when I'm >2004:20
MithrandirI've given up that04:21
maswanthat's the reason why I run 3 clients04:21
tsengi merged some channels into the same window also04:21
tsenglow traffic04:21
maswanI end up not reading the ones >20, usually04:21
Mithrandirmaswan: M-a, dude, M-a :-)04:22
maswanMithrandir: yes, but some are boring channels that I don't want to see all the time.04:22
maswanMithrandir: especially work channels, when I'm supposed to be on vacation. ;)04:22
Mithrandirmaswan: ignore activity in them, then04:22
maswanMithrandir: well, I guess04:23
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terrexrepositories are too slowly for me today04:31
terrexterrex Is there any wikipage or anywhere see the agenda of the month for all teams?04:31
terrexterrex It's really nice to make an integration with evolution and make a "shared agenda" server, dont you think?04:31
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SleepyEyeHaving trouble getting hands-off network based installation working.  Apt configuration failing.  Can anyone offer pointers/help?04:38
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carstenhSleepyEye: only if you describe your problem :)04:42
carstenh.oO(is *-devel the right place for such questions?)04:42
SleepyEyeI dunno, is it?  Came here because archived transcripts pointed me here.04:43
ivoksmako: thanks :)04:44
mjg59Kamion: That CD is good04:44
SleepyEyecarstenh:  When Apt configuration happens I just get a failed message with "continue" highlighted.  Nothing other than fail indication on console 3 or 4 (don't recall which).04:46
SleepyEyecarstenh:  No indication of why apt configuration failed.04:47
makoivoks: no problem04:47
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carstenhSleepyEye: can you please put your /etc/apt/sources.list on a webserver or on paste.debian.net?04:47
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bddebianmjg59: Please don't take offense, but I am surprised to see you here.04:53
mjg59bddebian: Why?04:53
bddebianmjg59: I dunno, I just would have thought you would have been one of the Ubuntu "haters".04:54
SleepyEyecarstenh:  Ok, it's on paste.debian.net.  It's only one line because I'm using a local mirror of the archive.  I created the mirror using "debmirror".04:54
mjg59bddebian: Why?04:54
mjg59bddebian: (I've been here since before Warty was released)04:54
mdkebddebian, he is a central dev for Ubuntu04:54
dilingermjg59: "'cause you hate *everything*"04:55
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^rob^is there a list of all the accepted proposals for the Summer of Code for Ubuntu?04:55
bob2presumably people will be emailed about it04:56
carstenhSleepyEye: and the error apt gives you is?04:56
bddebianmjg59: Honestly I don't know.  I honestly don't mean it as an insult, I was just surprised.04:56
ograAndyFitz, pingeling04:56
danielsdilinger: he only hates our freedom04:56
bob2daniels: and our burger kings04:56
bddebianmdke: I'm glad, I was just surprised for some reason.04:56
AndyFitzogra, pongalong04:56
danielsbob2: no, stansted's burger kings.  or lack thereof.04:56
mjg59Damn them04:56
SleepyEyecarstenh:  Apt isn't giving me an error.  It's apt-setup during installation that's giving the error.04:57
danielsbob2: we don't have any burger kings, either, except in the international terminal of tulla.04:57
mdkewho needs burger king when you have pret a manger04:57
bob2sometimes you don't want a 10 quid sandwich04:57
bob2tho sometimes you do04:57
carstenhSleepyEye: ok, just skip apt-setup04:57
mjg59mdke: When you have a hangover and no sleep, you want grease04:57
mdkebob2, burger king is not cheap either ;)04:57
carstenhSleepyEye: apt-get update works?04:57
mjg59Not sandwiches hand-made by virgins with gold-plated knives04:58
mdkeyou can taste it tho04:58
^rob^burger king is just a Checkers wannabe04:58
SleepyEyecarstenh:  Yes, apt-get update works.  How do I skip apt-setup using a preseed installation (this is what I was hoping could be done)?04:58
bddebianThe best hangover food is greasy/spicy Mexican food!!04:59
carstenhSleepyEye: i try to avoid using the debian/ubuntu-installer and use debootstrap instead, sorry04:59
bddebianToo spicy.  That just makes ya burn the porcelin. :-)04:59
danielsmjg59: but they do make a wicked blt04:59
danielsmjg59: boots is a passable imitation04:59
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SleepyEyecarstenh:  I'd be willing to try debstrap if it will do what I need.  Can you point me at a web site or documentation?05:03
carstenhSleepyEye: do you want to install one computer or more (maybe automatically)?05:04
SleepyEyecarstenh:  Many machines via network05:04
SleepyEyecarstenh:  Oh, yes, automatic05:05
carstenhSleepyEye: i don't think debootstrap is the right tool for this job05:05
SleepyEyecarstenh:  Bummer.  The weird thing is if I us interactive install, it works.05:06
SleepyEyecarstenh:  I even used debconf-get-selections and copied the apt-setup preseed stuff it generated and the automated apt-setup failed in the same way.05:07
carstenhSleepyEye: i never used preseeding, maybe http://d-i.alioth.debian.org/manual/en.i386/apcs01.html helpd you. i'm sorry i can't.05:11
SleepyEyecarstenh:  Yep...been there, done that.  Thanks for tryin anyway.  I guess I'll just keep playing around with it and searching the web.  Maybe I'll get lucky and stumble across something.05:14
carstenhi hope so :)05:14
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^rob^if anyone is in the Southeast of the US, Checkers is the heart-clogging fast-food of choice for most fat people, the people who know fast food.05:16
danielseven worse than wendy's?05:17
^rob^daniels: by far05:17
^rob^you can get 2 1/2 lb burgers for $3.0005:17
^rob^with Bacon, Cheese, and Special Sauce05:17
Kamionmeh, too late to investigate SleepyEye's problem05:18
danielseh, that's not that big05:18
^rob^daniels: it is for $3.0005:18
ograthom/mjg59, could you guys have a look at gnome power ? it has gconf keys for calling acpi scripts now ...05:18
bob2Kamion: he/she's in #ubuntu now05:19
thomogra: if it can have arguments too, just have it call pmi05:19
KamionI've used /msg05:19
ograthom, that works with user rights ?05:19
ograthom, redhat uses some suid magic afaik05:20
thommeh, k05:20
thomi'll look later05:20
ogragreat, thanks05:20
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ograi'll have a handfull commandline options in the next version, to omit or modify stuff...05:21
ograthom, i doubt we'll see it before breezy05:21
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Riddellinfinity: do you know why kexi is dep-wait on libmysqlclient-dev when it build-deps on libmysqlclient12-dev05:28
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pittihello again05:40
\shhey pitti05:41
ograyo pitti 05:41
SloMohi... anybody here interested in xmms-musepack and bmp-musepack packages for breezy? they are currently in backports/extras and seem to work fine there05:42
solomarvSloMo, what do you mean by "interested in"?05:42
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bob2SloMo: are they in Debian?05:43
SloMoehm, is someone interested to get them into breezy? would be the first user of libmpcdec which currently is in breezy05:43
SloMobob2: no05:43
\shSloMo: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUNewPackages05:44
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Kamionyay, debootstrap successfully resolved a missing base system dependency05:54
Kamionboo, it exited 1 for no apparent reason (suspect that's the busybox sh bug reported in Debian)05:55
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ograhey mdz 06:36
mdzdaniels: I very nearly renamed it to autodetect_keyboard when I was messing with that code, but it seemed gratuitous, given that we can't actually autodetect anything06:37
danielsmdz: autoguess_keyboard?06:37
mdzdaniels: infer_keyboard? ;-)06:38
mvomorning mdz 06:41
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danielsmdz: unless you have any strong concerns with autodetect, i think it's best we leave it there for consistency06:42
ogramvo, will we have to live with the ugly fading in gksudo ? 06:42
mdzdaniels: I have no strong feelings about it06:42
mvoogra: don't know. it's a upstream thing. we can remove it again06:42
danielsmdz: word06:43
ogramvo, would be nice... but we'd have to discuss it in a bigger round i guess06:43
ogrameh, ffmpeg compiled....06:43
ograwith gcc-2.95 :(06:43
danielsguten nacht06:44
ograbddebian, its not really funny.... i have a bug open and cant compile it at all...only gcc-2.95 seems to work .... the fun stuff is, thi only happens on i38606:45
ogradaniels, schlaf gut06:45
mvodaniels: gute nach! (did you had german leasons at linuxtag?)06:45
bddebianogra: Oh, :-(06:45
ogramvo, +t ;)06:45
mdzdaniels: regarding those bugs I filed about the preseed-for-reconfiguration stuff, those were all filed after my changes (and therefore are still valid)06:48
pittidaniels: Gutte Nacht06:48
mdzdaniels: I think the culprit is all that weird-ass "auto_answer" stuff06:48
ogramdz, we still should talk about edubuntu live vs install CD, poor performance doesnt outweight the promotional benefits in my eyes, i'm not convinced yet :)06:48
ogramdz, indeed your word counts in the end :)06:48
bddebianogra: What fails?06:49
ivokswierd gksudo, really wierd :(06:49
ograbddebian, ffmpeg ? 06:49
bddebianogra: Whatever isn't compiling, yes06:50
ivoksgksudo in gnome doesn't read /etc/sudoers like it should :/06:50
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ograbddebian, assembler errors, gcc-4.0 is more strict about the code....06:51
ivoksogra: uberstrict would be better to say :)06:51
bddebianBut it won't build with gcc-3.4 either?06:51
elmopitti: nothing to sync06:51
ograbddebian, nope06:52
ograbddebian,  error: PIC register '%ebx' clobbered in 'asm'06:52
pittielmo: ah, sorry, it's still in incoming, I guess. I just read the closed bug report06:52
ograi knoe the error, i know the solution, but i dont know enough assembler to fix the code :(06:52
mvoivoks: gksudo is just a frontend to sudo. it execute it 06:53
ivoksmvo: but, gksudo -S /some/app works fine06:53
ivoksmvo: but if executed from menu, it asks for password06:53
ivoksmvo: despite NOPASSWD in sudoers06:53
ivoksthat's wierd06:53
mvoivoks: do you run breezy? or hoary?06:53
ivoksfirst I tought my .desktop was broken, but no...06:54
ivokssame think if you put xterm -e gksudo /some/app06:57
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thompitti: how's bzr working out for you with pmount?06:58
pittithom: many features are still missing (like branch, but that's supposed to work now in bzr head)06:59
pittithom: but for pmount's size it works quite well06:59
pittithom: I wouldn't entrust it my postgresql stuff yet, though06:59
mdzogra: you'll be in London this weekend, yes?06:59
ogramdz, yep06:59
mdzwe can talk about it then06:59
ogramdz, you come ?06:59
mdzogra: yes06:59
ograhooray :) really looking forward to it then :)07:00
fabbionehey mdz07:00
thompitti: right07:00
thomi was pondering it for acpi-support07:00
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thomwhich should be fine07:00
pittithom: I really need branch handling for postgres, but not for pmount, so testing it on pmount is fine for me07:01
pittithom: currently I emulate the "push" command with a small shell wrapper which calls rsync after commit07:01
thomok, i'll have a look and see how it goes07:01
pittiI hope that push and hooks will be integrated soon 07:01
danielsmdz: auto_answer is f**king crack07:03
mdzdaniels: yes, let's kill it07:03
mvoivoks: please file a bug and assign it to me (michael.vogt@ubuntu.com) with a description how it can be reproduced07:03
ivoksmvo: ok07:03
mvoivoks: thanks07:04
danielsmdz: not tonight I won't07:04
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bddebianogra: Are you using the source from Debian or is it in the archive?07:05
ograbddebian, from debian, there was a new version yesterday...07:06
bddebianOh :-(07:06
ograit fixes amd64 and ppc builds with gcc-4.0 (i had to patch the last source) but not the i386 prob07:07
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thomhrm, how come we have no bzr packageS?07:26
mdzthom: FTBFS last I checked07:26
mdznow it's failing in a different way07:27
mdzthom,bob2: http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/b/bzr/0.0.5-2/bzr_0.0.5-2_20050622-0954-i386-failed.gz07:27
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bob2missing build-dep on python2.3-dev07:28
ogra2.3 ?07:28
mdzogra: Debian07:29
tsengogra: looks like it uses both07:29
ograah, ok07:29
ogramdz, what about moving gnome-power to main ? any objections from your side ? (it has no universe dependencys)07:30
mdzogra: have you done an inclusion report for it?07:31
ogramdz, not yet07:31
ogradoing it now07:31
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ddaaHey, do you know where I can put a hook on Yann Dirson? Does he IRC?07:33
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thommdz: ah, k07:37
bddebianSo bzr needs to be updated to depend python 2.4 instead of 2.3?07:38
tsengbddebian: no07:38
thombddebian: no, it uses both07:38
bddebianSorry, I'm on a Winblows machine so the output is a little unreadable.. :-(07:38
=== bddebian just saw the comment above. Doh. :-(
=== RzR [~rzr@lav35-1-82-236-136-171.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel
RzRhow to add packages to ubuntu07:42
bddebianHello RzR07:42
RzRI mean submit new software07:42
bddebianRzR: Put it on the NewPackages wiki page07:43
mdzRzR: the best way is to talk to the MOTU team (they hang out on #ubuntu-motu)07:43
danielsor get it into debian first, and watch it filter through07:43
RzRi tried to put connect in debian .. but pple are to busy for it 07:43
danielswhich is probably the best option07:43
RzRsee http://rzr.online.fr/q/Proxy07:43
RzRbddebian: https://wiki.ubuntu.com//NewPackages ?07:47
bddebianRzR: Sorry, here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUNewPackages  I think07:48
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thommjg59: acpi-support is now in bzr; http://people.ubuntu.com/~thom/bzr/acpi-support/07:53
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radehello everyone, first, does anyone know why when i install the kernel source with synaptic, it just puts a tarball into /usr/src and doesn't even make a link to it in /lib/modules/? second, why i don't have irq_vectors.h in /include/asm in my kernal source directory? i don#t even have an asm directory, just asm-*08:06
danielsrade: a) this is more of an #ubuntu question, b) linux-headers-* will probably satisfy your concerns better08:07
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radedaniels: thanks, but i've already spent a while chatting in #ubuntu, and still no luck... i installed the headers as well, but they're not in my kernel source directory, but in linux-headers-*08:09
danielsit seems you're sort of missing the point about how linux-headers-* works08:10
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lamont__rdade: have you looked at /usr/share/doc/linux-source-2.6.10/README.gz08:14
lamont__linux-source includes the full source for a kernel, linux-headers is just what you need to build modules - see /lib/modules/*/build08:15
lamont__that is, if you're building a kernel, you want linux-source-<vers>, if you are building modules, you want linux-headers-<vers>08:17
lamont__but like daniels said, that's more of a #ubuntu issue (clarifying the existing situation), than #ubuntu-devel (which would be a place to discuss your proposed changes to fix a bug you've found)08:18
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madduckis martin pitt here?08:19
tsengmadduck: no.08:19
madduckmh, anyone else involved with ubuntu-cve?08:20
tsengNafallo, a bit08:20
madduckNafallo: ping?08:20
madduckwho is Nafallo ? real name, i mean...08:21
Nafallomadduck: pong :-)08:21
Nafallomadduck: Christian Bjlevik :-)08:21
madduckNafallo: so, debian security is up shitcreek without a paddle, and i just saw ubuntu-cve08:21
madduckthat should be pretty easy to amend to debian stable, right?08:21
Nafallomadduck: some of them sure could. for the moment my view is that only ubuntu's main has proper security-updates. but sure. you might aswell dig in and take those who are done :-).08:24
Nafalloeven for universe/multiverse08:24
madduckNafallo: for the moment, i only want an overview.08:24
madducki don't have any time, but noone else seems to be doing anything.08:24
madduckdo i have to start delegating.08:24
Kamionpitti said earlier today that he'd sent mail volunteering to help out08:25
madduckKamion: excellent.08:25
Nafallomadduck: it's probably best to find pitti. he's the one that often has an overview on things :-).08:27
madduckbut he's not coming back till tomorrow?08:27
=== madduck thinks that if pitti saved debian as an ubuntu person, that would rock!
Nafallodunno, I've just come back myself :-). but... there is always e-mail ;-).08:28
madduckmpitt@ubuntu.com ?08:28
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madduckand he *is* german, right?08:28
Nafalloyepp, german :-)08:28
radedoes anyone here know where hub.h is supposed to be? which package it's in?08:34
dholbachuse dlocate or apt-file08:36
dholbachor packages.ubuntu.com08:37
madduckNafallo: mh, don't tell everyone (outside this channel), but it seems that things are already under control.08:38
Nafallomadduck: oki :-). not even my girlfriend? ;-)08:39
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madduckNafallo: of course not. She's a spy, didn't you know?08:40
madduckwhen is the next tech board meeting?08:41
madduckah. Tuesday 28 June 2005 at 2000 UTC08:41
madduckshit. shit. shit. shit.08:41
madducki've been invited four times now, and four times *something* just came in between.08:41
madducknobody will ever forgive me.08:42
=== madduck cries.
=== madduck is going to unite Ubuntu and Debian. uh, in the long run. not alone...
bddebianHeh. Heya madduck08:42
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madduckhowdy. you are quoted in my book. :)08:43
dholbachmadduck: do you mean technical board or community council meeting?08:43
madducktech board08:43
mdkehe wants TB08:43
madducki am writing an apologetic email to pitti now.08:44
madduckor is there a tech board list?08:44
ogramadduck, you want to unite debian and ubuntu so your second name is sysyphus ? 08:44
mdkeyou can write to the -devel list and link to it on the Tech Board agenda maybe?08:44
madduckogra: rotfl.08:45
madduckmdke: it's not of everyone's concern really.08:45
bddebianmadduck: Yeah, you told me.  That's frightening. :-)08:45
madducki'll just tell pitti and let him do what he wants with it.08:45
madduckbddebian: and it's a good quote too. :)08:45
bddebianmadduck: When is the book going to be finished?08:45
madduckit's done. http://debiansystem.info08:46
madduckavailability: http://debiansystem.info/order08:46
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bddebianmadduck: Sweet, I'm ordering!!08:47
madduckCool. Watch out though since I don't know about shipping costs if you order in Europe.08:49
madduckI have inquiries going, so I'll update those pages. 08:49
madduckMaybe you want to subscribe to the RSS feed or mailinglist?08:49
bddebianNP, I don't mind paying08:49
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madducklet me know how much it totals, okay?08:50
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=== madduck is really proud of that book
bddebianmadduck: That link says Amazon has it but I don't see it on Amazon.. :-(08:52
madduckbecause you are on amazon.com, not amazon.de08:52
madduckamazon.com does not have it yet because they are fucking assholes.08:53
madduckso far, all american publishers are totally incapable of working with overseas publishers.08:53
bddebianI'll get it from bookzilla then08:54
mgalvinhi madduck, congrats on the book rolling out :), can't wait to grab a copy when it comes to the US, seems like i have to wait a bit though :(08:54
madduckbddebian: i can order it for you though if you are willing to go for an experiment, and you'd entrust your credit card number to me for this transaction.08:55
madduckmgalvin: yeah, and it SUCKS and i went around and kicked and screamed at everything i could find,.08:55
madduckmgalvin: bug your book store, send me a mail as if we hadn't met and ask impatiently, then i'll forward that to the publisher to make sure they know that demand exists.08:56
ograbddebian, oh, yes, post it right here :_P08:56
bddebian1234-56-... ;-P08:56
madduckogra: i would give my credit card to bddebian for such a transaction, btw.08:56
bddebianmadduck: Ack, bookzilla is in German08:56
mgalvinmadduck, i certainly will do08:57
ogramadduck, i wouldnt give it to anyone through the net...08:57
madduckthe publisher has a fucked up policy: 45 days of demand assessment. fuck them. we sold 1500 copies in three days!08:57
ogra(call me paranoid)08:57
dholbachbookzilla ROCKS08:57
madduckogra: sure, but i know bddebian, albeit virtually, for a while now, and there is encryption.08:57
bddebianmadduck: I'll send it signed once I get home maybe08:57
madduckbddebian: ecnrypted.08:57
ogramadduck, true, i forgot about gpg...08:58
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madduckogra: DOH!. :)08:58
bddebianHell Citibank probably already got the number out there somewhere anyway.. ;-)08:58
ogramadduck, like i forget that my car has a cludge, but i switch gears anyway ;)08:58
bddebiancludge?? Hahaha08:58
bddebianSorry, don't mean to laugh, that just seemed freudian08:59
ograbddebian, european cars have such things :)08:59
ograch ?08:59
ograi have to work on my vocabulary...09:00
bddebianYou work on your vocab, I'll work on getting a brain to try to help out.. :-)09:01
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=== Kamion -> karate
mxpxpodis there something for ubuntu that will allow users to plug in an ethernet cable and if there's a dhcp server around, it will "Just Work"?09:16
Nafallomxpxpod: network-manager09:16
Mithrandirmxpxpod: ifplugd?09:16
mxpxpodNafallo: does nm work?09:17
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Nafallomxpxpod: for me it does ;-)09:17
mxpxpodNafallo: breezy?09:17
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thommxpxpod: yes09:19
mxpxpodok, how stable is breezy?09:20
thomworks fine here09:20
mxpxpodthom: oh, I have a cool addition to pmi09:21
mxpxpodthom: I modified it to work with both pmud and pbbuttonsd09:22
thomnot particularly interesting, tbh, but sure, send the patch09:23
mxpxpodthat way people don't have to have pbbuttonsd installed since the newest versions seem to like to lock up09:23
thomin ubuntu we'll always have pbbuttonsd installed until hal can do the job, or unless lots of "pbbuttonsd locks up and eats my laptop" bugs get filed09:24
mxpxpodwell, here's the thing09:25
mxpxpodpbbuttons 0.6.6 (what's in ubuntu) doesn't work well with 2.6.12 and 0.6.10 locks up all the time09:25
mxpxpodthom: oh, also... pbbuttonsd and pmud need to start up before gdm starts09:27
thomi see precisely zero bugs to that effect09:29
mxpxpodbecause if pbbuttonsd isn't started up before gdm, you don't get the suspend menu item in the gnome logout menu09:29
mxpxpods/logout menu/logout dialog/09:30
Nafallomxpxpod: what thom means is that you should file a bug about it, not complain here :-).09:30
thomnot being psychic, if you're seeing crashes and hangs and don't tell anyone, we can't do much to fix it09:31
mxpxpodI need to upgrade to breezy one of these days as well so I can start testing some of the new stuff like gnome-power09:31
ograyes, bugzilla is underestimated in te user world :)09:31
ogramxpxpod, gnome-power is no fun yet... we need to integrate it more... but i'm happy about every bug i get ;)09:32
uniqin the installer - is there a keyboard shortcut to jump to the list of tasks? 09:32
Nafalloogra: baah, I already use malone for everything ;-)09:32
mxpxpodogra: I'm actually pretty excited about gnome-power09:32
mxpxpodNafallo: malone?09:32
Nafallomxpxpod: launchpad.ubuntu.com09:32
ogramxpxpod, it will rock if it is nicely playing with pmi :) and with dpms etc....09:33
ogramxpxpod, but that will still take its time :)09:33
mxpxpodogra: well, of course09:34
ograbut go ahead, be my guineapig *g*09:34
mxpxpodI'm kind of nervous to go to breezy since I have my laptop set up pretty much how I like it, but in order to file bugs against it...09:35
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mxpxpodthom: https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1219809:40
thommxpxpod: i don't care about that; i still see no bug about pbb crashing or hanging09:41
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mxpxpodthom: I'll install breezy this week and test it out, ok?09:41
mxpxpodno problem09:41
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elmowould it be completely crackful to suggest sudo is either essential: yes or depended on by something like base-files?09:49
siretartelmo: ah, good to see you here. I'd like to allow all uploaders for universe to upload to revu. could you give me a copy of the universe uploaders keyring?09:51
dholbach*advertise* http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/ :)09:52
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elmosiretart: people.ubuntu.com/~james/tmp/upload-keys.gpg09:58
siretartelmo: thank you very much :)09:59
ograseb128, any idea why evo always opens a second instance if i click a mailto link ?10:01
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Mezelmo ping10:05
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tsengmako: was that a happy hacking keyboard that you had plugged into your laptop?10:12
GheRiveroif a package is taken as it is from debian, who is the ubuntu "maintainer" for it?10:15
ograGheRivero, depends, if its universe then MOTU10:17
ograGheRivero, which means we have no personalized packages10:18
ograGheRivero, which package in main ?10:18
ograGheRivero, thats the main team... no special maintainer here10:19
GheRiverook, thanks, i will try10:19
ograGheRivero, you can look it up on breezy-changes, if nobody touched it, its the whole team, else poke the last uploader, he will at least know who works mainly on it10:20
ograGheRivero, is anythig broken in acl ?10:20
GheRiverono, nothing, i'm just working on nfsv4 support and there are a couple of patches that i will like to discuss to include them on breezy10:21
ograGheRivero, afaik nfsv4 is already brought in by jbailey 10:22
ograGheRivero, so you should talk to him10:22
=== jbailey scrolls back a bit.
jbaileyjbailey: I don't think I've done anything with nfsv4.  The only bits I've touched were initramfs related.10:23
ograjbailey, there is not much to scroll :)10:23
jbaileyWell, I was trying to pfind a package name. =)10:24
GheRiveroacl for the moment... a couple more in the following days...10:24
jbaileyHi Barry.10:24
seb128ogra: no10:25
ograseb128, thnks10:25
seb128ogra: it should open a composer window10:25
ograseb128, it does, but with a second instance of evo10:26
ograwhich is kinda odd with about 70000 mails :) (takes quite a while to start and close)10:27
seb128what have you configured with the preferred applications capplet?10:27
ograseb128, nothing iirc... let me look10:28
ograseb128, evo is selected in the top pulldown 10:28
ograso its default i guess10:29
seb128maybe restart evo10:29
seb128the detection of the running instance may be screwed somewhere10:29
ograyep, might be... as i said, takes a while to close :)10:30
Treenaksogra: does gnome-power handle smart batteries yet?10:31
ograTreenaks, gnome-power only handles what hal sees10:31
Treenaksogra: ok.. so no :)10:32
bddebianjbailey: Do you have a Hurd box at all?10:32
ograTreenaks, but hugsie told me he wants to introduce it10:32
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Treenaksogra: hug him for me ;)10:32
jbaileybddebian: My laptop might still have a Hurd partition on it.10:32
ograTreenaks, so it will go in eventually, but i dounbt it will be before breezy10:32
bddebianBah. :-)10:32
ograseb128, works now, thanks10:34
lamont__jbailey: that's a correctable affliction, you know... :-)10:36
Treenaksogra: should gnome-power-daemon display an icon or something?10:36
ograTreenaks, gnome-power-manager should run in your session, you can enable the trayicon in the settings10:37
Treenaksogra: coolness10:37
ogra(found in System->Settings)10:37
Treenaksogra: I ran it command-line ;)10:37
ograyep gnome-power is quite cool, but still needs some integration love :)10:38
jbaileylamont__: True.  The install on there has certainly decayed in the year or two since I've used it.10:38
jbaileyI think I showed it off to someone last in Oslo.10:38
thomogra: presumably the applet will be on by default?10:39
ograthom, i wanted to either write a little script that calls pmi query or add it through laptop mode to the user session if possible10:40
thomogra: see my comment on the main proposal10:40
seb128lamont__: around?10:41
ograthom, ah yes, you are right....10:41
lamont__seb128: yeah10:41
seb128lamont__: what would that take to get a debug archive? have you read pitti's spec about changes for such stuff?10:42
seb128lamont__: getting debug backtraces is like 50% of the bug triage action, tackling that would rock10:43
lamont__seb128: truthfully haven't read the spec yet... adding another suite to the pile is trivial from the buildd's perspective10:43
lifelessmorning all10:43
thomogra: i think a mittelweg is required; if you just have UPS/mouse/... then perhaps just do notifications for battery full, low etc10:43
bddebianHello lifeless10:44
ograthom, by default it only does notification, no icon is shown10:44
ograthom, probably the laptop-mode/pmi query could switch on the battery icon then :)10:44
=== doko [~doko___@dsl-084-059-070-029.arcor-ip.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel
thom(laptop-mode is the correct test)10:45
ograyeah... and the icon is switched on in gconf...10:45
ograeasy, hehe10:45
lamont__seb128: personally, I lean to just dropping them in the .changes file and having the archive scripts automatically drop them wherever (as in, probably not somewhere mirrored).  But then, that just reduces the work that Kinnison/I have to do in modifying the build process, and heaps it on elmo/launchpad and the archive instead.10:45
lamont__so I'm not sure it's really what we want to do from a practical standpoint10:46
ograthom, did you check the right click options ? i think we should disable them...10:46
sivangseb128: hi, any news about lp integration ?10:46
ograthom, since they double the logout dialog10:47
seb128sivang: jamesh has done a bunch of work (the python picker) and should have a look on how easy it would be to patch gtkuimanager10:47
sivangseb128: ok, so is it going to be only patching gtkui manager?10:48
seb128lamont__: k, so somebody would just have to modify dpkg/dh_strip to make a dbg listed by the .changes basically and then the other changes should be easy10:49
seb128sivang: other are not really used10:49
sivangseb128: eh I see, others are basically hand patching since are using glade/glade xml files right?10:50
seb128not only glade files, that's listed on the wiki10:51
seb128there is 5 methods, gtkuimanager is 110:51
seb128glade is 110:51
sivangseb128: ok10:51
lamont__seb128: iz pretty much what pitti proposes10:53
lamont__I think10:53
seb128lamont__: yeah, that's the idea of the spec10:53
seb128just making sure that's alright since nobody has commentend on the spec10:53
sivangseb128: so , there's need to also patch BonnoboUI and gtkItemFactory as per centerlized patching ?10:53
seb128patching 2-3 apps is faster10:54
=== hughsie [~hughsie@host81-153-4-192.range81-153.btcentralplus.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel
ograhey hughsie !!10:55
sivangseb128: ok cool, should I talk with jamesh for further work or just start patching the ones not under the catagory of uimanager?10:55
hughsieogra: hey!10:55
ogragreat, finally we meet 10:56
seb128sivang: let ping jamesh first10:56
hughsieogra: Sweet. Give me lots of lovely feedback10:56
ograhughsie, i already have a bug report for you.... in the schema file, there is an integer instead of int10:56
hughsieogra: fixed in cvs10:57
sivangseb128: ok, do you recall what is his timezone?10:57
hughsieor are you using cvs?10:57
ograah, ok... i took the 0.0.5 package this time10:57
hughsieogra: yes, sorry, a bug :-)10:57
ograhughsie, so that explains why the --no-actions doesnt work for me yet ? 10:58
hughsieyup: sorry!10:58
ogran problem :) 10:58
ograno even10:58
hughsieI'll do a 0.0.6 soon - theres a few other bugs for ppl with multiple batteries (that icouldn;t test)10:59
ograi expect to do more packages before breezy :) i just thought sticking with the release would be better for a sane version number10:59
hughsieand also I've renamed/reorgansied the fires a bit10:59
ograyep, i saw you dropped the icons dir10:59
hughsieogra: can you do 0.0.5 + cvs?10:59
hughsieand lots more:10:59
hughsienow all prefixed gpm- except the system stuff11:00
ograsure, but i can also wait for 0.0.6 i'm not in a hurry11:00
hughsieogra, how's this week?11:00
hughsielet me get some feedback on the latest changes in cvs, and I'll make a release11:00
ograhughsie, rather next, i'm preparing for a summit on the weekend.... and have to sort my flight to london etc....11:01
hughsieno problem. I'm a bit busy too, I'm moving house this weekend. Got any ubuntu (or general) comments?11:01
lamont__seb128: actually paying attention to the spec is on Kinnison's list for july11:01
ograhughsie, a lot excited users in here ;) Treenaks, mxpxpod to name two.... btw, do you have an ETA for smart battery support in HAL ? Treenaks would be very interested11:02
seb128lamont__: cool. Still I'm trying to push that so we can get it working soon11:02
hughsieogra, got a smart battery specification? HAL's very easy to hack on - it's just f you don;t have the hardware it's a bugger to test!11:03
=== lamont__ disappears in about 5 min for several hours
ograhughsie, i know how easy HAL is, i learned most of it with your acpi patches ;) 11:04
hughsieogra: don't trust my code, I'm a beginner!11:04
hughsieGetting better every day11:04
ograhughsie, my code (based on yours) was good enough to get accepted in our HAL by the reviewers ;)11:05
hughsieahh, i see :-)11:05
ograand its not easy to pass a review from pitti :)11:05
hughsiegot any comments about the code in g-p-m? 11:06
ogranope, not yet11:06
hughsieI've learnt glib/gtk/gnome in about 4 months and so I'm sure i do stupid things11:06
sivangogra, hughsie : I can also support that, it's hard to pass pitti's review on the 3rd time even :-)11:06
ograhughsie, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MainInclusionReportGnomePower11:06
hughsiethanks guys, apreciated11:06
ograhughsie, but we will ship it in october :)11:06
hughsieogra: then efforts must double11:07
ograhughsie, its pretty easy to integrate, since we already have the backend and several detection mechanisms... its perfect as it is already...11:08
hughsie(blasphemy mode) I use fedora, so is there anything (other than the new gconf stuff) that I can do to better suit ubuntu?11:08
=== mvo goes to bed now
ograhughsie, the messaging stuff should get sorted.... thats my main concern curently... how do you plan it for RH ?11:09
hughsiethe DBUS stuff, yes, that's on my todo11:09
ogramvo, a big big thank you for ffmpeg help 11:09
ograhughsie, great :)11:09
hughsiewhats the ubuntu take on the services issue.? DBUS daemon rather than init.d daemon11:09
ograwe have a session daemon running11:10
=== sivang is trying to catch yest a few last bits of development discussion before having to go to sleep...work tommorow..
ograhughsie, so everything should happen in the user session11:10
hughsieat the moment, yes.11:10
hughsiebut there's the debate about what happend at the gdm login screen11:10
ograbut we could even wave it in to dbus' startup script11:11
hughsiesure, that would be ace11:11
ogralike network-manager for example11:11
ograi have to look at the NM code but it should be easy to implement...11:12
hughsieSure, thanks.11:12
hughsieOkay, if you guys come up with any patches ideas etc, then please email me, or join the list:11:13
ograhughsie, ah, and i agree, the powermanagement stuff should get dropped from xscreensaver.... i think i'll add a button there to run your preferences11:13
=== ogra subscribes
hughsieogra: yes, agreed, but my screensaver timeout does nothing at the moment, other than setting a gconf value!11:14
hughsieI'm pretty receptive to new ideas and stuff, so I welcome patches!11:15
ograhughsie, ok, i'll look what i can do... unfortunately i havent the time before breezy to add gconf to xscreensaver which would be the best to do11:15
ogra(and is on my list since quite some time)11:16
Nafalloogra: breezy+1 ;-)11:16
hughsieNo problem, nice one11:16
ograand gdm integration love for the lock screen ... vuntz will do that for us in breezy+1 (hopefully)11:17
hughsieI need to get the DBUS interface sorted, i.e. so totem can tell g-p-m not to click in the screensaver when watching a video fullscreen.11:17
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=== darkling [~hugo@81-5-136-19.dsl.eclipse.net.uk] has joined #ubuntu-devel
hughsieand we can do a (I'mAboutToSuspend) warning for applications11:17
ogragreat !11:18
makotseng: yes11:18
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makotseng: it was a happy hacking lite2 USB11:19
makotseng: it has half-height arrow keys which was controversial but important11:19
makoand these days, usb works anywhere so it's all you really need11:19
makotseng: it's not cheap but i would recommend it highly.. i am traveling with mine now11:19
hughsieogra: gpm and lock? I hadn;t thought of that11:19
mxpxpodmako: what's that?11:20
=== sivang waves sadly good night to all, maybe see you tommorow or in the weekend.
ograhughsie, i hacked the lock screen for the last version... but jwz started to change the code, included his own xpm functions etc, so its a PITA to patch it again...11:21
ograhughsie, and i'm not after doing it a third time :) so a final solution should be found, gdm just seems right11:21
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hughsieogra: good for me.11:21
makomxpxpod: google for it.. it's a suprising small full-sized unix friendly keyboard11:22
hughsieI want to get the dbus api fleshed out this month, so make sure you pipe up!11:22
ograi will :)11:22
makomxpxpod: it's good for posture on laptops if the whole bending over thingg doesn't do it fo ryou11:22
hughsieogra: do you kow about the http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/g/gnome-power/gnome-power_0.0.5-1.diff.gz ?11:24
hughsieany of that belong upstreeam?11:24
mxpxpodogra: is gnome-power in ubuntu hooked up to pmi?11:25
ograhughsie, thats my package 11:25
ogramxpxpod, not yet11:25
hughsieogra: oops :-)#11:25
ogramxpxpod, we're working on that11:25
mxpxpodogra: oh, right11:25
ograhughsie, fresh from this afternoon :)11:25
hughsiesorry guys, what's pmi? is that the ubuntu power stuff?11:26
mxpxpodhughsie: power management interface11:26
=== ivoks [~ivoks@lns01-0713.dsl.iskon.hr] has joined #ubuntu-devel
hughsiegotcha, googled11:27
ograhughsie, as i mailer pmi suspend and pmi hibernate :)11:27
hughsieahh yes. cool.11:27
ograhughsie, as well as pmi query11:27
tsengmako: man yeah im really tempted11:27
ograwhich gives you the enabled capabilities11:27
tsengmako: what about no home/end/pgup/down?11:27
tsengmako: i think i might miss those11:27
hughsieogra: so does any of the debian bits belong upstream?11:29
ograhughsie, only the integer fix you already did11:29
mxpxpodogra: will gnome-power still need pbbuttonsd? or will it totally control powermanagement?11:29
mxpxpodalso, will it control cpu scaling?11:30
ograhughsie, and thanks for pointing me to it, i forgot to rip out the uuencoded icon i had added for the last cvs version :)11:30
hughsiemxpxpod: not cpu scaling, thats on the todo, but I want to get the battery stuff don first11:30
mxpxpodah, cool11:31
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mxpxpodalright, I'm going to go download breezy... I'll talk to you guys later tonight11:31
ogramxpxpod, cpu scaling is done by powernowd automatically, i doubt we'll change that11:31
Burgundaviaogra, did you need help with bugday?11:31
shayaogra: powernowd dies after hibernation11:31
ograshaya, on hoary ?11:31
shayait keeps machine in slow state always until stopped and restarted11:31
shayabreezy at least11:31
ograshaya, bug # ?11:32
ograBurgundavia, sorry, i was very busy with other stuff today11:32
Burgundaviaogra, np11:32
hughsieogra: gnome-power-manager.sgml is that a man page?11:33
ograBurgundavia, but indeed we need every helping hand, especially form people who know bugzilla as good as you do ;)11:33
Burgundaviaogra, ok11:33
ograhughsie, yep11:33
ograhughsie, but it needs an update11:33
shayabugzilla search isn't working11:33
shayabut I'm pretty sure I filed a bug11:33
ograhughsie, i'll mail you the next version if you want it11:33
shayahibernation also breaks vmware as ifconfig down's vmware virtual adapters on the host11:33
shayaso cant connect from host to vm11:34
hughsieogra: go for it, richard at hughsie.com11:34
hughsieI'll add it to the CVS11:34
=== henriquemaia [~henriquem@cb-217-129-170-110.netvisao.pt] has joined #ubuntu-devel
ograshaya, if you file bugs we'll likely solve it for breezy :)11:34
ograhughsie, ok...11:34
ograhughsie, let me build that new package next week with al new options... then i'll rewrite the manpage11:35
hughsieogra, no problem11:36
ddaaAnybody knows if dash has a public VCS?11:36
hughsieogra: I love patches!11:36
shayaI filed bugs11:36
ddaaDoes anyone think that dash has _no_ public VCS?11:36
ograddaa, VCS ? Video Connection System ?11:37
shayasearching mozilla bugzilla11:37
ddaaogra: version control system, dude...11:37
ograddaa, *g* 11:37
shayaogra: https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1168111:37
thomddaa: clue for you. on any debian system, /usr/share/doc/foo/copyright11:37
ddaathom: makes sense11:38
thomit'll tell you where to download from, and may very well give you enough detail to work it out11:38
shayaah, thom who closed my vmware bug!11:38
thomddaa: it appears to be in bk, fwiw11:38
thomshaya: whatever11:38
=== ogra has a pizzawiting that slowly cools down....
ograwaiting even...11:38
ddaathom: somebody put rcs details from some netbsd repo (that apparently does not work right)...11:39
thomddaa: i'm sure you can snag it out of netbsd's repo, yes11:39
ddaathom: well, since the idea is to get _upstream_, I'm not sure that using netbsd as an intermediate is a good idea...11:40
Kamionddaa: the netbsd repo is probably actually upstream11:40
Kamionddaa: well, upstream for ash11:40
Kamionddaa: Herbert forked ash to create dash11:40
ddaaKamion: this page suggest dash forked off ash a loooooong time ago http://gondor.apana.org.au/~herbert/dash/11:41
KamionI didn't realise it had forked so long ago; I was thinking of when it was renamed11:41
Kamionbut OK11:41
=== ddaa uses launchpad_prod superpowers to wipe rcs details for dash, and move it into the "unsupported" bucket.
hughsieanyone: how does ubuntu control it's hard disk spindown? using hdparm like fedora?11:44
thomhughsie: yes11:44
ddaathanks for the hint thom, but do not hope that will keep me quiet, I'm not going to install all the packages in main just to get to the details :)11:44
tsenghughsie: laptop-mode modifies hdparm values11:44
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hughsiethom, tseng: so if i wanted to modify the value to, say 2 minutes on ubuntu what would i type?11:45
thomddaa: by way of another clue, packages.ubuntu.com links to teh changelog for every *single* package11:45
tsenghughsie: er, man hdparm11:46
hughsietseng: same as fedora, thanks11:46
tsenghughsie: yep.11:46
hughsietseng: i wondered if you had a fancy script!11:46
ddaathom: I'm using p.u.c all the time, I did not realise that the changelog had useful information for me.11:46
Kamionit links to the copyright file too11:47
ddaaI see... I can find some hints there "apply patch from upstream bk".11:47
thomhughsie: sadly not configurable right now11:47
hughsiethom, okay, thanks11:47
thom(well, without hacking the stuff in /etc/acpi directly)11:47
tsengthom: make my cdrom use dma in boot, kthxbi11:48
thomddaa: uh, s/changelog/copyright/ sorry11:48
thomtseng: is your hdparm config right?11:48
tsengthom: yes11:49
tseng /dev/hdc {11:49
tseng         dma = on      11:49
tsengiirc the bug is cdrom modules get loaded after hdparm starts11:49
thomhm, no. that should be fine11:49
thomsince hdparm is also run by hotplug/udev11:50
tsengi think its fixed now11:51
tsengwhen did hotplug start running it?11:51
thomyonks ago11:51
tsenghm, silly me11:51
tsengive still been setting it by hand11:52
=== Nafallo adds himself to the list of silly people tseng started
ograthom, but why is the bug still open ?11:52
ogra(i didnt see a FIXED notice)11:52
tsengNafallo: i did no such thing11:52
thomjbailey and i had tag teamed it into working by Mon, 21 Mar 200511:53
thomogra: prolly cos we forgot to close the bug? ;-)11:53
Nafallotseng: well, I sign you up on it then ;-)11:53
bddebianjbailey actually did something?? Wow!11:53
=== bddebian runs away
makotseng: thoe keys are there11:53
makotseng: they are function keys though11:53
=== StylusEater [~gnome@c-24-98-214-36.hsd1.ga.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel
makotseng: it's super conveniently set up though11:54
tsengmako: ah, rock11:54
makotseng: same with the f-keys11:54
tsengmako: the one im looking at has blank keyfaces actually11:54
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Kamiontseng: you said "silly me" => list of one silly person11:54
tsengKamion: ah, lappend :)11:54
thomogra: 4356 is closed11:54
makotseng: control-alt-f1 is a bit tricky because it's 3 modifiers instead of two :)11:55
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makotseng: but nothing else really feels awkward ever11:55
tsengmako: i dont bind that combination to anything :D11:55
tsengKamion: im chronically dumb11:55
dholbachtseng: come one, you're not :)11:55
=== dholbach hugs tseng
tsengmako: back in the day i had every function key bound to some action with every modifier, pretty wack stuff11:55
ograthom, ahh, i looked at 3672... thats a duplicate11:56
makotseng: i still do.. ion311:56
tsengopenbox here11:56
=== ogra slaps himself for looking in evolution instead of bugzilla
thomogra: that's a totally different problem11:56
tsengi just use bindings alot less heavily now11:56
tsengi acutally run gnome-panel and such11:57
ograthom, huh ? why did mdz mark it as a duplicate for 4356 then ?11:57
thomogra: 3672 is "work out that my cdrom is dma capable, and turn it on for me", not "i added my cdrom to hdparm.conf and nothing happened"11:58
thomogra: 3672 isn't a dup of anything11:58
=== ogra finally looks in bugzilla
thomogra: go to bed :P11:58
ograheh, yes, i should....11:58
mdzogra: 4356 is "hdparm starts before all hardware detection has been done"11:58
mdzwhich is part of "hardware detection should happen earlier" (5204)11:59
ogramdz, yeps, i mixed them up....11:59
=== Nafallo subscribes to 3672 :-)
makoalright.. dinner time12:00

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