[12:01] <ogra> in gconf, yes, in the interface, nope
[12:01] <hughsie> thats what i was thinking.
[12:02] <hughsie> lets people choose a "gnome default" or have a "distr-wizzy" icon theme
[12:02] <ogra> yop
[12:02] <hughsie> also, I wanted to spilt up the g-p-p screen into an extra tab "advanced" - is that a good idea / bad idea?
[12:03] <herzi> seb128: ping
[12:03] <seb128> herzi: pong
[12:03] <herzi> seb128: any chance to get tag-writing enabled in ubuntu unstable's rhythmbox?
[12:03] <mitsuhiko> does anybody knows which PCI class represent which device?
[12:03] <mitsuhiko> i think PCI class 3 are graphic cards
[12:04] <ogra> hughsie, what do you want to put there ?
[12:04] <hughsie> "Battery is critical when" and the 4 checkboxes
[12:04] <hughsie> i'm sure other stuff will com up
[12:04] <seb128> herzi: I'll ping upstream, but according to teuf it doesn't work fine 
[12:04] <seb128> herzi: I don't want to create a bug flood on that
[12:05] <herzi> seb128: of course
[12:05] <herzi> i was just asking, because people in #rhythbox told me about a month ago that they are using it fine
[12:05] <ogra> hughsie, yes, why not, i see no problem with another tab
[12:05] <herzi> .oO(and someone will need to enable it by default to get the missing bits fixed)
[12:05] <seb128> herzi: really dependant of the kind of file you edit according to teuf
[12:06] <seb128> yeah
[12:06] <mitsuhiko> ok. I've found something: http://developer.apple.com/qa/hw/hw91.html
[12:06] <seb128> but before pushing on upstream I prefer to be sure than upstream will respond
[12:06] <hughsie> sweet, consider it done. I can only see more options coming for differnt things, and I don;t want to blind the average user when the defaults would do fine for most cases
[12:06] <herzi> seb128: okay, i'll file a bug and add you and teuf to the cc
[12:06] <herzi> then we can discuss it there, better than irc
[12:06] <seb128> thanks
[12:06] <seb128> upstream bug?
[12:07] <ogra> i think it also gives the options tab a better look, it appears quite full currently
[12:08] <hughsie> ogra: agreed.
[12:08] <herzi> seb128: ubuntu
[12:08] <seb128> maybe putting that upstream to discuss the default value for the configure option
[12:09] <herzi> okay
[12:09] <seb128> I would be happy to follow upstream on this
[12:09] <seb128> and both teuf and me are subscribed to the upstream bugzilla for it
[12:24] <hughsie> ogra: I have a new tab, and a few more options - double clicking on the default icon will be able to perform an action too - good/bad?
[12:25] <ogra> sounds good to me, did you look into the HIG ? what does it say about doubleclick on tray icons ?
[12:29] <hughsie> ogra: will check itnow
[12:30] <Burgundavia> hughsie, most applets are single click
[12:32] <ogra> Burgundavia, its a tray icon, no applet
[12:32] <Burgundavia> again, single click
[12:32] <hughsie> notification area icon, i guess that changes things
[12:33] <hughsie> okay, i admit i can't think of any icons in the tray i double click
[12:34] <ogra> i only have gaim here and thats not really representative for good HIG but uses single click
[12:35] <hughsie> okay, i'll add it, and see if i get shouted at.
[12:35] <ogra> yep :)
[12:35] <ogra> good plan
[12:35] <hughsie> i can always remove the option from g-p-p and keep it as a gconf
[12:35] <Burgundavia> beagle and blam also use signal click
[12:35] <ogra> right
[12:36] <Burgundavia> so does update-manager, AFAICR
[12:38] <hughsie> okay, i get the point, thanks :)
[12:51] <Kamion> hm, damnit, the firefox and evolution icons still haven't been restored to the default top panel
[12:51] <Kamion> and no mdz around to delegate upwards to ...
[12:59] <Riddell> Kamion: are you going to start building daily kubuntu CDs
[01:00] <hughsie> guys, I sleep. thanks for your help tonight
[01:00] <ogra> night hughsie 
[01:01] <ogra> hughsie, thanks for your app ;)
[01:01] <Kamion> Riddell: hm, yeah, I should get around to that
[01:03] <Kamion> Riddell: I can't remember whether I fixed everything so that it'll work, but I've made it start building at least. sorry I neglected it until now
[01:03] <Riddell> Kamion: what needed fixed?
[01:03] <Kamion> last I checked I think kubuntu-desktop was uninstallable
[01:04] <Kamion> but that's been sorted out
[01:04] <Riddell> should be fine now I hope
[01:04] <Riddell> worked fine for me and others who have tried
[01:41] <Kamion> AHA
[01:41] <Kamion> got the hal thing
[01:41] <Kamion> -    if [ -x /etc/init.d/dbus-1 ] ; then
[01:41] <Kamion> -      invoke-rc.d dbus-1 restart || true
[01:41] <Kamion> +    if [ -x /etc/init.d/dbus ] ; then
[01:41] <Kamion> +      invoke-rc.d dbus restart || true
[01:42] <jp> kewl 4 u
[01:43] <Kamion> too late for a Colony release tonight, though. Again.
[01:44] <jp> no1
[01:44] <jp> :P
[01:45] <jp> it's not too late
[01:45] <jp> ;)
[01:45] <jp> jajaj
[01:45] <Kamion> whatever
[02:25] <lifeless> Kamion: colony ?
[02:26] <Riddell> lifeless: I collection of badgers
[02:26] <lifeless> ahha
[02:27] <Kamion> lifeless: http://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2005-May/007591.html
[02:27] <Riddell> Kamion: I'm looking forward to a Kubuntu colony :)
[02:27] <Kamion> eek. I think that might have to be Colony >= 3 :)
[02:29] <jp> ?
[02:29] <whiprush> msg StoneTable around?
[02:29] <jp> please, kubuntu at #kubuntu-devel
[02:29] <jp> :)
[02:29] <whiprush> oops
[02:29] <lifeless> if I open(foo, O_CREAT|O_WRONLY, 0222) - can I write to it (i.e. does the mode affect later users only ?)
[02:30] <lifeless> dumbarse question I know
[02:30] <Kamion> jp: his question was quite welcome here
[02:30] <Kamion> and appropriate
[02:30] <jp> I don't know why mark shuttleworth talked and presented about 10x10 having kubuntu :)
[02:31] <jp> I think must think a little bit about kubuntu :)
[02:31] <lifeless> because we want 20x10 ;)
[02:31] <jp> nah
[02:31] <jp> :)
[02:31] <jp> I want 20x10 gnome ;)
[02:38] <lifeless> Kamion: ^^^
[02:41] <Kamion> ?
[02:41] <lifeless> if I open(foo, O_CREAT|O_WRONLY, 0222) - can I write to it (i.e. does the mode affect later users only ?)
[02:41] <lifeless> dumbarse question I know
[02:41] <Kamion> I imagine you can, but I'd have to try it
[02:42] <lifeless> ah, k.
[02:43] <Kamion> 0222 is write-only anyway - did you mean 0444?
[02:43] <Kamion> open("foo-test", O_WRONLY|O_CREAT, 0444) = -1 EACCES (Permission denied)
[02:45] <Kamion> oh, no, ignore that
[02:45] <Kamion> lifeless: works fine even with 0444
[02:45] <lifeless> Kamion: thank you for humouring my lame-arseness
[02:45] <lifeless> night
[02:46] <ogra> night all
[02:47] <mdke> night ogra
[04:40] <wasabi> So, how long does it usually take between buildd building a package and it showing up in the archive?
[04:40] <tseng> the master archive updates every 30 minutes iirc
[04:41] <wasabi> And what time zone is people.ubuntu.com in?
[04:41] <wasabi> [   ]  ecj-bootstrap_3.0.1-4ubuntu3_20050629-2109-i386-successful.gz    29-Jun-2005 21:13  6.8K  
[04:41] <tseng> wasabi: the main data center is in the UK
[04:41] <tseng> that sounds more like US centra
[04:41] <wasabi> Apache should localize these times. ;0
[04:41] <tseng> l
[04:42] <tseng> im in est and its 10:13
[04:42] <tseng> 10:41 rather
[04:42] <wasabi> I'm in CST.
[04:42] <daniels> it's 0342 in UTC right now
[04:42] <daniels> so I assume it built 6 hours ago, because all the data centre machines are currently UTC+1
[04:42] <tseng> yeah im lost
[04:42] <wasabi> *spins*
[04:42] <tseng> yep
[04:42] <wasabi> OKay, so it was built 6 hours ago.
[04:42] <wasabi> Why isn't it in the archive yet?
[04:43] <daniels> *shrug*
[04:43] <tseng> its not new is it?
[04:43] <daniels> might have binary packages which need to go through NEW
[04:43] <wasabi> oh hell.
[04:43] <wasabi> Yeah, it's NEW.
[04:43] <tseng> yep
[04:43] <wasabi> Forgot I added a new package to it.
[04:43] <tseng> consider yourself rocked by moderation
[04:43] <tseng> enter holding pattern
[04:43] <tseng> wasabi: it does, for NEW sources
[04:44] <mxpxpod> Kamion: ping
[04:44] <tseng> not so smart about NEW binaries
[04:44] <wasabi> Ahh well.
[04:44] <wasabi> How fast does NEW go these days? :)
[04:44] <tseng> depends on elmo's level of spite towards you/your package
[04:45] <tseng> his free time, i mean
[04:45] <lamont> tseng: *whap*
[04:45] <wasabi> Haha. So Never? :)
[04:45] <lamont> since elmo's not here to defend himself
[04:45] <tseng> wasabi: java?
[04:45] <tseng> wasabi: pretty close
[04:45] <wasabi> Yeah.
[04:45] <tseng> lamont: :)
[04:45] <tseng> lamont: cya.
[04:45] <wasabi> I have Eclipse 3.1 ready to upload.
[04:45] <wasabi> BUt it'll be stuck behind ecj-bootstrap anyways.
[04:47] <tseng> yeah dont upload anything else that will just fail
[04:47] <tseng> it would require manual kicking or more uploads
, if it has proper build-deps, it won't fail, it'll just enter dep-wait.
[05:05] <infinity> Also, katie mails the uploader on NEW source/binaries.  That's why you get a mail for NEW sources, but the buildd gets a mail for binaries.  A weird side-effect of source-only uploading.
[05:31] <lu|away> hrm
[05:32] <lu|away> is it possible to get dpkg -l to show package sizes?
[05:33] <lu|away> (or get a list of installed packages, sorted by size, some other way?)
[05:34] <jamesh> lu|away: "less /var/lib/dpkg/status"
[05:37] <lu|away> installed size in dpkg/status is K?
[05:38] <jamesh> I guess
[05:38] <jamesh> I have some Python code that extracts some info from the file that might be useful
[05:38] <jamesh> http://people.ubuntu.com/~jamesh/identify.py
[05:39] <lu|away> probably not worth it
[05:39] <lu|away> hrm
[05:39] <jamesh> "apt-get clean" ?
[05:40] <lu|away> no, sadly
[06:23] <Burgundavia> jdub, nautilus with that thunar-style interface, possible?
[06:26] <fabbione> morning
[06:43] <wasabi> Wow. Interesting cron bug.
[06:44] <wasabi> Thing checks in /etc/passwd for users before running per-user crontabs.
[06:56] <fabbione> maswan: buttercup is down again :(
[07:02] <Burgundavia> ogra, xscreensaver has reverted to pre ogra-love ugliness
[07:09] <Lathiat> Burgundavia: yeh it makes me want to cry
[07:25] <Burgundavia> related to the cursor breakage?
[07:30] <lamont> I: Configuring ubuntu-keyring...
[07:30] <lamont> W: Failure while configuring base packages.  This will be attempted 5 times.
[07:30] <lamont> bummer
[07:44] <fabbione> hey lamont 
[07:51] <lamont> hrm... that reminds me
[07:52] <fabbione> if you are not tired....
[07:52] <fabbione> i am not going to work on kernel today or tomorrow
[07:54] <lamont> I have a toolchain now, and sometime soonish (since I unthrottled it), my mirror will be current, and I can install said toolchain in the local archive and let the buildd have some fun
[07:54] <lamont> then the other buildd will get the toolchain tomorrow, and off to the races
[07:55] <fabbione> ehhe neat
[07:56] <lamont> gsyprf11 has a hoary chroot... (and a pretty broken breezy chroot - I need to build a fresh once I can debootstrap breezy/hppa)
[07:57] <lamont> 67 files to go on the mirror.
[07:59] <fabbione> lamont: is the hoary chroot updated ?
[08:00] <fabbione> lamont: the chroot isn't exactly ok
[08:00] <fabbione>  dchroot -c hoary
[08:00] <fabbione> Executing shell in 'hoary' chroot.
[08:00] <fabbione> crimsun: Authentication service cannot retrieve authentication info.
[08:00] <fabbione> meh
[08:00] <fabbione> s/crimsun/su
[08:03] <lamont> hrmpf... I'll have to pester ggg tomorrow and figure out what that means - tired enough tonight that it's a bad idea to muck about.
[08:03] <lamont> note that you do wind up in the chroot after that warning.
[08:05] <fabbione> yup
[08:05] <fabbione> i think elmo knows what the problem is
[08:05] <fabbione> we digged into it once
[08:05] <fabbione> lamont: can you wait a sec to install the b-d?
[08:06] <fabbione> lamont: please install ccache and distcc 
[08:06] <lamont> sure - just tell me what you need
[08:07] <fabbione> ( i will need to recheck the other 2/3 hostnames for distcc )
[08:07] <lamont> but be aware that the hppa/breezy archive is pretty empty atm
[08:07] <fabbione> yup.. i am unpacking it now
[08:07] <fabbione> i am in the hoary chroot... it's enough for me to do test build
[08:07] <fabbione> xmlto kernel-package gcc-3.4-hppa64 gcc-3.4
[08:07] <lamont> although with my chages, you _should_ be able to build it on a mostly-hoary world
[08:08] <fabbione> lamont: no problem for that.. i can relax the b-d for hppa while i am working
[08:08] <fabbione> s/working/building
[08:10] <lamont> installed... wanna check the versions, and maybe I can fix them if needed...
[08:11] <fabbione> no i am fine with what's there
[08:11] <lamont> cool
[08:11] <fabbione> perfect
[08:12] <fabbione> dpkg-checkbuilddeps: Unmet build dependencies: kernel-package (>= 9.001ubuntu1)
[08:12] <fabbione> it's the only one
[08:12] <fabbione> but it doesn't need to be there
[08:12] <fabbione> not in hoary
[08:13] <lamont> so I don't need to go fetch that from breezy?
[08:13] <fabbione> nope
[08:13] <fabbione> it's to workaround a gcc/glibc/dpkg -gnu- non-gnu crap
[08:13] <fabbione> that's not in hoary
[08:14] <lamont> ah, ok
[08:14] <lamont> dpkg-dev crapage you mean?
[08:14] <fabbione> and ppc64
[08:14] <lamont> or sparc crapage?
[08:14] <fabbione> nope.. dpkg-dev
[08:14] <fabbione> sparc is ok :)
[08:14] <lamont> notice how I made the gcc-3.4 be ppc-concious...
[08:15] <fabbione> yup i know
[08:15] <fabbione> i saw it
[08:16] <lamont> kernel-package wasn't a hard one to grab and drop in my hoary chroot though, so I didn't bother (that and I didn't know just how required it was...)
[08:17] <fabbione> nah that's ok.. the old one is fine
[08:18] <lamont> yeah - wasn't worth the time to find that out though... /me would like it if the build-deps were properly versioned to start with, for us backporting-to-hoary types....
[08:18] <lamont> so subversion is kinda bloated (debsize-wise, that is..)
[08:19] <fabbione> lamont: i don't want people to backport kernel tbh...
[08:19] <lamont> yeah, but ... :)
[08:19] <fabbione> lamont: a kernel backport requires also all the userland tool syncronzation...
[08:20] <fabbione> and mostoften people have no clue about it
[08:20] <lamont> very true
[08:20] <lamont> (avg over 5 minutes)
[08:21] <Lathiat> heh ive been sitting on about 1300 for the last 30 hours or so
[08:22] <Lathiat> managed to push it faster than i thought was possible
[08:28] <fabbione> SPARC KERNEL UNBUSTED!
[08:29] <lamont> fabbione: coolness!
[08:30] <fabbione> lamont: at least this is according to BenC. i need to test it ;)
[08:30] <fabbione> it looks like the error we get at build time are ghosts
[08:30] <fabbione> and the resulting kernel is still good
[08:31] <fabbione> so it was never busted
[08:34] <fabbione> Ben Collins is a machine...
[08:35] <lamont> if the kernel throws ghost failures, it's not a good kernel....
[08:35] <fabbione> apparently it's not the kernel ...
[08:35] <fabbione> scripts/mod/modpost.c
[08:35] <fabbione> is at fault.. it barfs on sparc64 elf
[08:35] <fabbione> and that one is linked with glibc
[08:35] <fabbione> that can explain why the problem shows up only on recent glibc
 AHA!
[08:50] <fabbione> ok he figured
[08:58] <lamont> checking for shared library run path origin... /bin/sh: ../buildlib/config.rpath: No such file or directory
[08:58] <lamont> done
[08:58] <lamont> building apt.  Bad apt.  /me looks at mvo
[08:58] <mvo> lamont: what did it this time?
[08:59] <mvo> it does not build? 
[08:59] <lamont> mvo: apt_0.6.39ubuntu4 should it be bitching about config.rpath not existing during configure?
[08:59] <mvo> how strange. what architecture?
[08:59] <lamont> it builds, but it's a wierd errpor
[08:59] <lamont> hppa
[08:59] <lamont> bootstrapping the world, so that's mostly hoary bits
[09:00] <mvo> I don't have a config.rpath here
[09:00] <lamont> same output
[09:01] <lamont> so it's consistent....  but could be an issue, no?
[09:01] <mvo> does it die from that error? or at some later point? is the buildlog available somewhere?
[09:01] <lamont> no death.. just crap in the log
[09:02] <lamont> see also people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/a/apt/0.6.39ubuntu4/apt_0.6.39ubuntu4_20050629-1740-i386-successful.gz 
[09:02] <lamont> it's not fatal, it just makes me wonder why it's there....
[09:08] <mvo> lamont: it's a autoconf macro thats there for ages I guess. a bit weird because the macros configure.in look all pretty standard (/me checks again)
[09:47] <\sh> hey JaneW how is london today? :)
[09:51] <JaneW> \sh - wet ;)
[09:52] <\sh> JaneW: hmm...wet? two choices: wet because of hot summer, to much of sweat or wet, like london rain ,-)
[09:52] <JaneW> \sh: sweat from over heated airport and wet from Londin rain ;)
[09:52] <\sh> hahaha...ok..this is london :)
[09:53] <lamont> daniels: you around?
[09:57] <\sh> JaneW: are u visiting germany after london? on sunday it's CSD time for cologne :) 
[10:01] <Simira> good morning JaneW :)
[10:02] <Simira> hm, she didn't like that
[10:04] <lamont> hi JaneW 
[10:05] <fabbione> hey JaneW 
[10:06] <fabbione> lamont: still awake? ;)
[10:06] <lamont> fabbione: yeah - iterating on xorg - I want to start that 4-hour build before I go to bed
[10:06] <lamont> but it's not looking good for that
[10:07] <lamont> Total 4 package(s) in state Building.
[10:07] <lamont> Total 16 package(s) in state Installed.
[10:07] <lamont> Total 6080 package(s) in state Needs-Build.
[10:07] <lamont> woot
[10:07] <lamont> .25% and climbing. :-)
[10:09] <fabbione> ahah
[10:09] <fabbione> A  patches/scripts-mod-modpost_deal-with-new-glibc.dpatch
[10:09] <fabbione> there!
[10:09] <fabbione> lamont: phear ;)
[10:13] <JaneW> hi lamont and fabbione wassup?
[10:13] <fabbione> JaneW: started digging in VolumeManager
[10:13] <lamont> JaneW: well, not sleeping yet, although I probably should be...
[10:13] <fabbione> i need to update the wiki tho
[10:13] <lamont> thought I'd say hi, since I hadn't in forever
[10:14] <JaneW> lamont: yeah I haven;t seen you around much... how's HP?
[10:14] <lamont> daniels: ../../src/lcFile.c:252: warning: implicit declaration of function `getresuid'
[10:14] <lamont> JaneW: well, busy somewhat
[10:15] <lamont> JaneW: I almost have my environment where I want it (couple things left), actually getting to do real work instead of administrivia, etc.
[10:17] <lamont> JaneW: hoping to create time to work on testing and such an ia64/breezy cd sometime soonish
[10:17] <JaneW> lamont: cool
[10:18] <JaneW> lamont: is your baby 13 yet?
[10:18] <lamont> she turns 13 on July 30.  the other turned 10 in May
[10:19] <lamont> depending, of course, on your definition of 'baby'
[10:20] <lamont> hrm.. must deal with that tomorrow
[10:21] <fabbione> Kamion: ping?
[10:22] <fabbione> Kamion: is there any function in partman* that given a devfs name will return me the device name?
[10:22] <fabbione> Kamion: eg: /dev/hda1 is a link to /dev/ide/foo/bar
[10:22] <fabbione> and given /dev/ide/foo/bar i need to get /dev/hda1 back?
[10:23] <Kamion> fabbione: mapdevfs, in di-utils-mapdevfs
[10:23] <Kamion> it's an external program
[10:23] <fabbione> do we install it by default, don't we?
[10:23] <Kamion> you can call it safely on any device regardless of naming format, as long as the device exists
[10:23] <Kamion> Depends: di-utils-mapdevfs
[10:23] <fabbione> ok cool thanks
[10:24] <fabbione> Kamion: i did quite a lot of progresses already in auto-lvm
[10:24] <fabbione> Kamion: but there is the problem that pvscan/vgcreate do not recognize the devfs name..
[10:24] <fabbione> so i need to map it back to get it right
[10:24] <Kamion> right, that happens
[10:24] <fabbione> yeah no big deal :)
[10:25] <elmo> hey, is 'going within 500 miles of devfs' on that "list of things we really should clean up - one day" spec?
[10:25] <Mithrandir> elmo: aka "uglyhacks"?
[10:25] <elmo> right, that was it
[10:29] <Kamion> elmo: yes, there's a "clean up devfs paths" item there
[10:33] <infinity> lamont : The whole situation will improve when the modularisation is complete.  Bootstrapping xorg right now is a bit unfun, though.
[10:33] <lamont> infinity: exactly
[10:34] <doko> wasabi: the last ant upload did break java/gcj :-(  bad idea to upload a new ant with a dependency on a ecj-bootstrap, which failed to build.
[10:34] <infinity> lamont : I'm working with him to make sure the pain is lessened as quickly as possible.
[10:34] <infinity> lamont : I have a vested interest in making sure we can boostrap xorg from a xcroched-earth scenario as easily as possible, and he has a vested interest in me buying him alcohol and not killing him in his sleep.  It's a good trade.
[10:35] <infinity> s/xcorched/scorched/ ... I wonder if that was freudian.
[10:35] <fabbione> Kamion: we need to consider to remove DEVFS support in the kernel soon. .13 won't have it upstream
[10:36] <infinity> fabbione : YAY!
[10:36] <lamont> infinity: right now, it's a matter of installing just the right stuff from hoary, and the right stuff from breezy to make life happier.
[10:36] <Kamion> fabbione: it's all blocking on jbailey, not me. :)
[10:37] <fabbione> Kamion: ok :)
[10:38] <fabbione> Kamion: i am going to ask jbailey nicely to do it before yesterday :P
[10:38] <fabbione> ;)
[10:41] <lamont> ok.  sbuild thinks it can handle xorg, now to see if the build-deps actually install without erros
[10:43] <fabbione> Kamion: i guess i just found the only corner case where mapdevfs doesn't work :P
[10:44] <Kamion> fabbione: ?
[10:44] <fabbione> Kamion:
[10:44] <fabbione> echo $path -> ok
[10:44] <Kamion> fabbione: it's easy to fix given examples, generally
[10:45] <fabbione> realpath="$(mapdevfs $path)"
[10:45] <fabbione> echo realpath -> empty
[10:45] <Kamion> you need to use mapdevfs $path || true unless you're certain $path exists
[10:45] <Kamion> what is $path?
[10:46] <fabbione> path is always set (got it from the a PARTITION_INFO)
[10:46] <fabbione> it's usually /dev/ide/host0/....
[10:46] <fabbione> that is mapped to /dev/hda1
[10:46] <fabbione> works from busybox
[10:49] <Kamion> fabbione: "works from busybox" - what do you mean?
[10:49] <lamont> infinity: and it helps to have the morgue nearby. :-(
[10:50] <fabbione> Kamion: the same 4 lines of above, they work fine if executed in the busybox shell
[10:50] <fabbione> i assume they use the same shell...
[10:50] <lamont> infinity: specifically, xorg -32 needs xcursor >=1.3-1ubuntu1; the current xcursor needs an xorg >-10 to be in the archive, and hoary gives you 1.1.3-1 and -10
[10:50] <Kamion> the shell should be irrelevant
[10:50] <Kamion> but your poor quoting might be relevant :P
[10:50] <Kamion> (mapdevfs is a C program)
[10:51] <Kamion> um - are you trying to run this from a normal system? do you have mapdevfs in $PATH? :-)
[10:51] <fabbione> Kamion: i did check and try different ones.. i will check again
[10:51] <Kamion> it won't be installed on normal systems
[10:52] <fabbione> Kamion: i am running it from inside d-i on a test box
[10:52] <Kamion> the binary is only shipped in a udeb
[10:52] <Kamion> fabbione: yes, but how are you managing to try any shell other than busybox inside d-i?
[10:53] <fabbione> Kamion: isn't d-i running inside busybox?
[10:54] <Kamion> d-i uses busybox for lots of stuff, yes
[10:55] <Kamion> one of us is very confused
[10:55] <Kamion> step back and tell me in exactly what environment mapdevfs is failing for you?
[10:55] <fabbione> ok
[10:56] <fabbione> i started installing the machine. so i have d-i "running" at partioning stage, where i can select "Guided partitioning" -> "Use free space as lvm"
[10:56] <fabbione> so i do select "Use free space as lvm"
[10:57] <fabbione> that option runs /lib/parman/automatic_partitioning/60vg_all_free/do_option
[10:57] <fabbione> i need to run mapdevfs inside do_option
[10:57] <fabbione> now.. i edit that file from the shell on f2
[10:58] <fabbione> and tested there that it wasn't failing
[10:58] <fabbione> but
[10:58] <fabbione> to add extra debug i added to do_option
[10:58] <fabbione> echo path $path >>/var/log/messages 2>&1 || true
[10:58] <fabbione> in a bunch of points
[10:58] <fabbione> and i can see that $path is ok
[10:59] <Kamion> ok, if I were you I'd add 'set -x' to do_option and run it from partman
[10:59] <fabbione> next step:
[10:59] <sivang> fabbione: Hey there, do we have a working 2.6.12 d-i image already?
[10:59] <Kamion> sivang: current daily builds
[10:59] <fabbione> realpath="$(mapdevfs "$path")"
[10:59] <sivang> Kamion: cool, with all of the ppc64 stuff in right?
[10:59] <fabbione> echo realpath $realpath >>/var/...
[10:59] <fabbione> and realpath is empty
[10:59] <Kamion> sivang: theoretically - untested
[10:59] <sivang> Kamion: that's where I come into the picutre :-)
[10:59] <fabbione> Kamion: i am running do_option within partman
[11:00] <Kamion> fabbione: can you mail me the current do_option, and a set -x dump?
[11:00] <fabbione> Kamion: not easily... the machine is without anything that can connect to the net atm..
[11:02] <Amaranth> timeless: This is where all the developers are actually at so you don't have to go by my guesses anymore. :)
[11:05] <lamont> Event.c:1134: warning: function declaration isn't a prototype
[11:05] <lamont> daniels: and hundreds more... grumble
[11:05] <lamont> but I suppose that's known
[11:05] <lamont> anyway, xorg build started, off to bed.
[11:06] <fabbione> night lamont
[11:09] <ivoks> ntp maintainer here? mdz?
[11:10] <Kamion> mdz is travelling, and wouldn't be around at this time of day anyway
[11:10] <ivoks> ok, thanx
[11:10] <ivoks> i'll write patch for ntp and send him
[11:11] <Kamion> bugzilla would be more appropriate
[11:11] <Kamion> last I checked mdz wasn't the ntp maintainer
[11:11] <Kamion> in fact he's mentioned precisely once in the ntp changelog
[11:12] <Kamion> besides, you should always send patches to bug tracking systems rather than individuals if at all possible, otherwise they have a habit of getting lost :)
[11:14] <ivoks> hehe ok
[11:15] <ivoks> we talked about ntp yestrday, so I tought he's maintainer
[11:15] <ivoks> my bad, should've check changelog
[11:27] <Kamion> fabbione: ok - and what happens if you run mapdevfs on that path from a shell on tty2?
[11:28] <fabbione> Kamion: it works
[11:30] <Kamion> erm, boggle
[11:31] <fabbione> interesting
[11:31] <fabbione> for some reasons mapdevfs fails in there
[11:31] <fabbione> i did try a:
[11:31] <fabbione> realpath="$(mapdevfs $path)" || realpath="test"
[11:32] <fabbione> and i got test...
[11:32] <Kamion> all that mapdevfs does is to look at the major and minor numbers of the device file you give it, and work out the traditional path corresponding to those
[11:32] <Kamion> strace it
[11:32] <Kamion> (you can get strace.deb and udpkg -i that)
[11:33] <Mithrandir> it might be a shell bug; doe realpath="$(true)" || realpath="test" give you test or ""?
[11:34] <fabbione> Kamion: ok
[11:34] <fabbione> but i still wonder why it works in the other parts of d-i
[11:36] <Kamion> Mithrandir: never had a problem there
[11:36] <Kamion> fabbione: let's put it this way ... it's unlikely to be mapdevfs breakage ;-)
[11:36] <fabbione> Kamion: oh i agree...
[11:37] <fabbione> i am not blaming mapdevfs
[11:37] <Kamion> unless the device in question has major and minor numbers that mapdevfs doesn't know about
[11:37] <fabbione> given that it works from busybox..
[11:37] <fabbione> i am sure there is something royally wrong in what i am doing...
[11:37] <fabbione> i just don't get what
[11:38] <fabbione> AH
[11:38] <fabbione> the device must exist for mapdevfs to work
[11:38] <fabbione> so THAT might be the problem
[11:43] <fabbione> Kamion: our code is too fast :P
[11:46] <fabbione> BINGO!
[11:46] <fabbione> Kamion: it's all due to a race condition
[11:47] <Kamion> you might have to run udevstart
[11:47] <fabbione> would that speed up?
[11:47] <Kamion> udevstart forces udev to create all the pending devices
[11:47] <fabbione> or can i just make a wait_device() ?
[11:47] <fabbione> ah ok
[11:47] <fabbione> perfect
[11:47] <Kamion> we use it in hardware detection already
[11:48] <Kamion> obviously wrap it in an existence guard
[11:48] <Kamion> if type udevstart >/dev/null 2>&1; then
[11:48] <Kamion>         udevstart
[11:48] <Kamion> fi
[11:48] <fabbione> ok
[11:48] <Kamion> then we can commit it to Debian too
[11:50] <fabbione> yup...
[11:53] <fabbione> Kamion: another question to speed up testing.. how can i preseed all the d-i answer from boot to partman (excluded) so i don't need to spend half of the time chaning mirror and accepting keyboard?
[11:54] <Kamion> http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/hoary/main/installer-i386/current/doc/manual/en/apcs01.html
[11:54] <fabbione> thanks
[11:54] <Kamion> preseed/locale, keymap, hostname, mirror should be sufficient
[11:54] <fabbione> yup
[12:04] <HiddenWolf> fabbione, isn't the kernel enough for you? ;)
[12:07] <fabbione> HiddenWolf: ehhe
[12:09] <fabbione> HiddenWolf: i will never ever be at the level of Kamion ;)
[12:09] <fabbione> he is the "d-i allmighty ;)"
[12:09] <Treenaks> fabbione: that's what you said about kernel addiction
[12:09] <Kamion> I've only been at it for a year and a half, dude :)
[12:10] <fabbione> Kamion: still > than my last hmmm .. 10 hours?=
[12:12] <Kamion> One of the many problems with moving house is that I can't find my big stash of DVD-RWs. Bah.
[12:14] <Kamion> Ah, here they are. Now I can *test more than one image at once*. Advanced technology.
[12:14] <fabbione> lol
[12:14] <fabbione> Treenaks: yeah yeah :)
[12:22] <Kamion> drat, breezy-install-powerpc.iso fails to get as far as the main menu
[12:23] <fabbione> Kamion: there are a few details that need to be updated for the preseed docs
[12:24] <Kamion> yeah, I have a recent bug about that
[12:24] <fabbione> ok
[12:24] <Kamion> suggestions welcome
[12:24] <fabbione> Kamion: do you rememebr the bug number?
[12:25] <Kamion> not offhand, sorry - searching for 'preseed' should find it
[12:25] <fabbione> ok
[12:28] <Kamion> eh?! it's hanging in /lib/debian-installer-startup.d/S35initrd-preseed
[12:28] <Kamion> that's straying into impossible territory
[12:28] <fabbione> i blame jbailey
[12:31] <Kamion> + [ -e /preseed.cfg ] 
[12:31] <Kamion> [hangs] 
[12:31] <Kamion> I blame the kernel :-P
[12:33] <fabbione> i really don't :)
[12:38] <Kamion> hmm, possibly an overly-scratched disk
[12:38] <Kamion> bizarre symptoms, though
[12:40] <Kamion> that's been fixed in 2.6.9 surely
[12:40] <fabbione> Kamion: i am not sure if it's syslinux the problem
[12:40] <Kamion> although my documentation of that may not have made it to our archive yet
[12:40] <fabbione> the string it's truncated after N chars
[12:41] <Kamion> what's N?
[12:41] <fabbione> didn't check yet...
[12:41] <Kamion> # Note that the kernel accepts a maximum of 8 command line options and
[12:41] <Kamion> # 8 environment options (including any options added by default for the
[12:41] <Kamion> # installer). If these numbers are exceeded, 2.4 kernels will drop any
[12:41] <Kamion> # excess options and 2.6 kernels will panic. With kernel 2.6.9 or newer,
[12:41] <Kamion> # you can use 32 command line options and 32 environment options.
[12:42] <fabbione> yes the kernel boots fine.. 
[12:42] <fabbione>        append vga=normal initrd=initrd.img-crack ramdisk_size=14972 root=/dev/rd/0 rw preseed/locale=en_US console-keymaps-at/keymap=Danish kbd-chooser/method="Danish" netcfg/choose_interface=eth0 netcfg/get_hostname=gundam preseed/url=http://192.168.1.1/pd --
[12:42] <fabbione> that's almost the limit
[12:42] <fabbione> now i need to understand why d-i doesn't like my preseed fine...
[12:42] <fabbione> s/fine/file
[12:42] <fabbione> hell this is fun
[12:43] <Kamion> if you're building your own initrd, you could put the preseed file in there and use preseed/file= instead
[12:43] <fabbione> who wants to maintain the kernel for a while?
[12:43] <Kamion> which would let you put the netcfg stuff in the preseed file instead of on the command line
[12:43] <fabbione> no i am using the standard initrd
[12:43] <fabbione> i am trying very hard not to diverge
[12:46] <fabbione> hi sabdfl 
[12:46] <sabdfl> hiya
[12:46] <Simira> morning sabdfl 
[12:47] <sabdfl> hey Simira, how's norway today?
[12:47] <fabbione> Kamion: can you show me a preseed file example?
[12:47] <sabdfl> Kamion: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=196697 doesn't seem to have a status, is the default 'open'?
[12:47] <fabbione> http://www.fabbione.net/pd <- is mine
[12:47] <Simira> sabdfl: nice and sunny. And stressful. We're moving to Oslo (50km) tomorrow.
[12:47] <fabbione> and d-i refuses to like it :)
[12:48] <sabdfl> Simira: what's prompting the move? big city bright lights?
[12:48] <Kamion> mozilla-firefox 196697 1055132296 open [Adam Heath <doogie@debian.org>]  wishlist
[12:48] <Kamion> seems to have a status
[12:48] <sabdfl> Kamion: what gives you that?
[12:48] <Simira> sabdfl: yup. And Tollef longing home ;p How about you? Are you going to DebConf?
[12:48] <Kamion> sabdfl: that's in index.db
[12:48] <Kamion> oh, I guess you're looking at the summary
[12:49] <Kamion> or not
[12:49] <sabdfl> Kamion: i'm using the debbugs.py which shells out to the Debbug.pm so a whole bunch of things could be going South :-)
[12:49] <sabdfl> let me just rsync up...
[12:49] <Kamion> any idea where it gets the status from? I forget
[12:50] <Kamion> laptop's doing test runs, don't have a debzilla checkout here
[12:52] <Kamion> hmm, debbugs.py effectively greps index.db
[12:52] <Kamion>         index_record = re.compile(r'^(?P<package>\S+) (?P<bugid>\d+) (?P<date>\d+) (?P<status>\w+) \[(?P<originator>.*)\]  (?P<severity>\w+) (?P<tags>.*)$')
[12:52] <Kamion> oh, hey, that regex assumes that there are some tags
[12:52] <sabdfl> hmm... debbugs.py.Database.load() seems to miss out on status
[12:54] <Kamion> sabdfl: the regex should be ... (?P<severity>\w+)(?: (?P<tags>.*))?$
[12:54] <Kamion> sabdfl: or something along those lines
[12:54] <sabdfl> Kamion: i'll try that, but i think that's orthogonal
[12:54] <Kamion> making [space <tags>]  optional
[12:56] <Kamion> >>> import re
[12:56] <Kamion> >>> index_record = re.compile(r'^(?P<package>\S+) (?P<bugid>\d+) (?P<date>\d+) (?P<status>\w+) \[(?P<originator>.*)\]  (?P<severity>\w+) (?P<tags>.*)$')
[12:56] <Kamion> >>> print index_record.match('mozilla-firefox 196697 1055132296 open [Adam Heath <doogie@debian.org>]  wishlist')
[12:56] <Kamion> None
[12:56] <Kamion> >>> index_record = re.compile(r'^(?P<package>\S+) (?P<bugid>\d+) (?P<date>\d+) (?P<status>\w+) \[(?P<originator>.*)\]  (?P<severity>\w+)(?: (?P<tags>.*))?$')
[12:56] <Kamion> >>> print index_record.match('mozilla-firefox 196697 1055132296 open [Adam Heath <doogie@debian.org>]  wishlist')
[12:56] <Kamion> <_sre.SRE_Match object at 0x2a9558cc68>
[12:56] <Kamion> apologies for flood - but it looks like the right fix to me
[12:57] <Kamion> surprised debzilla hasn't run into this all the time
[12:58] <sabdfl> maybe it's a Debbugs/pm version thing?
[12:58] <Kamion> very unlikely, that has nothing to do with the perl glue
[12:58] <Kamion> it fetches and reads index.db directly from python
[12:59] <Kamion> the perl glue is only used to parse .log files, which are way after working out the bug's status
[01:01] <fabbione> bah
[01:02] <Kamion> fabbione: will have a look at the preseed file in a sec
[01:02] <fabbione> done
[01:02] <fabbione> Kamion: i just found the error :)
[01:02] <fabbione> thanks a lot anyway
[01:02] <fabbione> but for sure you can tell me if i can preseed anna from it
[01:02] <Kamion> fabbione: hmm, looked ok to me
[01:03] <fabbione> yeah i just fixed it :)
[01:03] <Kamion> what needs to be preseeded in anna?
[01:03] <fabbione> to load partman-auto-lvm
[01:03] <fabbione> since it won't fit in the syslinux.cfg
[01:04] <Kamion> yes, 'd-i anna/choose_modules multiselect partman-auto-lvm'
[01:04] <fabbione> but i don't see any anna preseeding in the example
[01:04] <Kamion> works for netboot anyway, I'm not sure it's guaranteed for cdrom
[01:04] <fabbione> iam using only netboot
[01:05] <fabbione> for testing is way faster
[01:06] <Simira> how broken is Breezy now?
[01:08] <Simira> do I want to run an upgrade?
[01:08] <fabbione> Simira: if you feel lucky today :)
[01:08] <sabdfl> Kamion: think i've narrowed it down, see privmsg
[01:08] <Simira> fabbione: luckiest ever. We're preparing tomorrows moving, and it's my birthday tomorrow. Hm. Maybe I should wait until tomorrow, then? ;p
[01:09] <fabbione> Simira: good idea to wait after the movement if you don't want to spend the rest of day fixing your machine ;)
[01:11] <Simira> fabbione: ok,thanks. I can always boot in windows, anyway. 
[01:12] <fabbione> Kamion: YAYAYAYY the udevstart did it..
[01:12] <fabbione> Kamion: i got my first set of lvm partitions from preseeding and so on ;)(
[01:14] <Kamion> fabbione: well done
[01:14] <fabbione> Kamion: nah.. thanks to you..
[01:14] <Kamion> so I think my laptop's CD-ROM drive is hosed, or needs cleaning, or something :(
[01:14] <Kamion> which means no powerpc CD testing, unless somebody would like to volunteer
[01:14] <fabbione> Kamion: netboot?
[01:14] <Kamion> no, CD
[01:15] <sivang> Kamion: I'm going to do ppc64 in a LPAR testing sometime soon
[01:15] <Kamion> I mean, yes, I could netboot, but that isn't much good for CD image testing
[01:15] <Kamion> sivang: I was kind of thinking more "in the next hour" :)
[01:15] <sivang> Kamion: ah :-) Sorry, I wish I could .....
[01:15] <Kamion> though, cool
[01:16] <sivang> Kamion: I wonder if d-i would recognize the virtual disks, and virtual NIC I will set up for it
[01:17] <fabbione> sivang: mostlikely not if that's an iseries machine
[01:17] <fabbione> afaik an LPAR ppc64 needs iseries
[01:17] <fabbione> and we don't have udebs for it yet
[01:17] <fabbione> anyway food....
[01:29] <sivang> fabbione: bon appetite
[01:39] <fabbione> Kamion: we might need to add a template and i think i just found a corner case that might be problematic to handle...
[01:39] <fabbione> Kamion: a) we need "Erase entire disk and make it lvm"
[01:40] <fabbione> b) we might have a system with N harddisks.. should we consider them all for inclusion in the lvm of point a) ?
[01:40] <fabbione> the latter is a rare case but it might happen..
[01:41] <fabbione> jbailey: i was talking with Kamion before about killing devfs from the kernel...
[01:41] <fabbione> jbailey: any ETA for when you will be ready for it?
[01:42] <Kamion> fabbione: a) ideally yes, although I'm a little concerned about adding too much stuff to the partman main menu
[01:42] <Kamion> fabbione: b) let's not worry about it for now :-)
[01:43] <fabbione> Kamion: a) we need that option if we want to switch later as default. Otherwise i need to mangle the meaning of use free space as lvm to achive installation...
[01:43] <fabbione> and that won't be nice
[01:43] <fabbione> b) i agree :)
[01:43] <jbailey> fabbione: Oy.  I need to get myself an lvm system them... hmmm..
[01:44] <jbailey> Apparently the tetris music has words..  either that or one russian song sounds like another to my ears (also quite possible)
[01:46] <Kamion> fabbione: oh, sure, but it's trivial to add
[01:46] <Kamion> fabbione: it's autopartition $dev rather than autopartition $dev $id
[01:49] <fabbione> Kamion: didn't get there yet :)
[02:02] <sivang> jbailey: Jeff! Hi , 'sup ?
[02:03] <jbailey> Sivan!  Long time. =)
[02:08] <\sh> hmmm...anyone up to a really special question? how can I convert a HD with ext3 to xfs, without losing data? ,-) any possibility, or just even: reinstall and format with xfs?
[02:12] <Lathiat> \sh_away: you dont :P
[02:12] <Lathiat> \sh_away: depend show full it is ;)
[02:14] <fabbione> Kamion: i guess an error like: "10 p-a-l/text/vg_all_free doesn't exist" means that the template is not registerd....
[02:14] <fabbione> (i am trying to install p-a-l from preseeding instead than from the archive to make customization simpler)
[02:15] <Kamion> fabbione: yes
[02:16] <fabbione> and let me guess... this is the exact problem you were describing about templates registration :)
[02:16] <Kamion> ayup
[02:16] <fabbione> hmmm
[02:16] <Kamion> anna gets it right
[02:16] <fabbione> it's interesting.. because the udeb is downloaded before anna gets to run
[02:16] <fabbione> so the templates are there...
[02:18] <resmo> hi
[02:20] <resmo> is there any action to integrate php5 in breezy?
[02:31] <fabbione> Kamion: i think it would rather easy to patch anna to install a local deb :)
[02:31] <fabbione> Kamion: given that anna is capable of installing the templates properly
[02:32] <Kamion> probably better to make udpkg do it right, imho
[02:33] <Kamion> although actually that doesn't help you
[02:33] <Kamion> now that I remember, the problem is not anna vs. udpkg
[02:33] <Kamion> it's running something in tty1 (subprocess of the main running debconf instance) versus running it from a shell on tty2
[02:33] <sivang> Kamion: what does anna do?
[02:33] <HiddenWolf> who is the thunderbird maintainer?
[02:33] <Kamion> sivang: roughly, apt equivalent for d-i
[02:34] <fabbione> Kamion: it's interesting that templates.db isn't updated at all 
[02:34] <Kamion> fabbione: the problem is that there's no mechanism for something you run by hand on tty2 to communicate with the main running debconf instance on tty1 to tell it to load new templates
[02:34] <fabbione> Kamion: the template file it's simply not changed
[02:34] <Kamion> fabbione: it almost certainly is, but gets overwritten shortly afterwards when debconf on tty1 next saves
[02:34] <fabbione> oh hmm
[02:35] <Kamion> we need some kind of out-of-band communication, maybe a signal you send to debconf after fiddling with templates.db
[02:35] <fabbione> Kamion: no.. it's not modified at all
[02:35] <Kamion> udpkg calls debconf-loadtemplate when it sees a .templates file
[02:38] <fabbione> hmmm ok. you are right...
[02:38] <fabbione> using the example doesn't exactly help :)
[02:38] <fabbione> i keep forgetting how restricted is debconf on checking stuff around
[02:47] <rob^> is dvd+/- r support compiled into the breezy version of cdrecord?
[02:48] <rob^> from what I can tell it isnt
[02:49] <Lathiat> rob^: use growisofs
[02:50] <fabbione> Kamion: i have the solution :)))))
[02:50] <rob^> Lathiat, what package is that in? apt-cache search shows nothing
[02:50] <fabbione> Kamion: http://www.fabbione.net/pd <--- install it in tty1 if you can't from tty2 :)
[02:50] <Lathiat> dvd+rw-tools
[02:51] <rob^> ah ok thanks
[02:51] <Kamion> fabbione: yeah, that would do it
[02:51] <fabbione> Kamion: it works :)
[02:51] <fabbione> it can't work for everything.. but still better than nothing
[02:51] <Kamion> GRRR. I have absolutely no idea how to make this initrd work. It is breaking for no reason.
[02:51] <Kamion> and it's fine on i386, but broken on amd64 and powerpc
[02:52] <fabbione> Kamion: can you get a strace to see where/why it hangs?
[02:52] <Kamion> I've been trying, but no luck yet
[02:52] <jbailey> Kamion: I have ppc here, I can troubleshoot if you need.
[02:53] <Kamion> jbailey: if you can try cdimage/daily/current/breezy-install-powerpc.iso, that would be wonderful
[02:53] <Kamion> jbailey: I mean the d-i initrd, of course, not the initrd-tools one
[02:53] <Kamion> but at this level the skills required to debug it are likely to be rather similar :)
[02:53] <jbailey> Oh, I thought you meant initrd-tools. =)  Sure, lemme pull it down.  It'll take awhile to come down, my connection to the data centre sucks.
[02:55] <Kamion> it seems to be hanging in one of /lib/debian-installer-startup.d/S{30env,35initrd}-preseed
[02:57] <Kamion> hmm, /var/lib/cdebconf/*.dat are empty
[03:01] <fabbione> Riddell: ping?
[03:02] <Kamion> /usr/share/debconf/frontend is sitting waiting on a futex ...
[03:03] <fabbione> glibc bug?
[03:03] <Kamion> I can't quite tell what it's *really* trying to do yet
[03:03] <jbailey> fabbione: There are no glibc bugs, just applications that use functions they weren't meant to use.
[03:03] <fabbione> ehhehe
[03:07] <Riddell> fabbione: hi
[03:11] <fabbione> hi Riddell 
[03:11] <fabbione> Riddell: if you have a minute, could you try to build kdesdk in a clean breezy chroot?
[03:11] <fabbione> Riddell: it seems to be FTBFS on sparc because of missing b-d
[03:12] <fabbione> libxi-dev ;)
[03:12] <fabbione> but perhaps you want relook at it
[03:13] <Riddell> fabbione: quite possible, I'll do that now
[03:13] <Riddell> I wonder what other packages have been caught with that libxi-dev move
[03:14] <Kamion> damnit, the problem goes away when I strace it
[03:14] <Kamion> or possibly when I install the unreduced libc6 in order to be able to run strace
[03:15] <fabbione> Riddell: thanks :) 
[03:15] <fabbione> Riddell: probably quite a lot of packages....
[03:15] <fabbione> Kamion: since when d-i needs poxml from kdesdk to build? :P
[03:16] <fabbione> jbailey: told you it's a glibc bug :)
[03:16] <Kamion> fabbione: docs
[03:16] <fabbione> Kamion: 02_add_menu_entry.diff <- on roockery :)
[03:17] <fabbione> Kamion: yeah i could guess so...
[03:17] <Kamion> jbailey: any thoughts on how I could even start to debug this?
[03:18] <jbailey> Kamion: Can you reproduce in a chroot on the running system with the reduced glibc?
[03:18] <Kamion> hmm, ok, I'll try that
[03:23] <fabbione> jbailey: you will need to update klibc b-d to linux-headers-2.6.12-3
[03:23] <jbailey> fabbione: 'kay, thanks.  I'll try to fix the last couple things that keep it from using lkh directly.
[03:24] <fabbione> jbailey: yup.. i just noticed.. it's nothing urgent for me
[03:24] <jbailey> Kamion: If you can get this working, you can strace/gdb/etc from outside the chroot.
[03:25] <Kamion> I'm wondering if it might be a 2.6.12 thing.
[03:30] <fabbione> Kamion: i doubt.. otherwise it would effect i386 too
[03:30] <Kamion> depends
[03:32] <fabbione> Kamion: are you using the ppc64 kernel?
[03:32] <Kamion> fabbione: no
[03:32] <fabbione> so we have 32/64 bit + endianess.. iirc that ppc is != i386 endian
[03:35] <lamont> daniels: ping
[03:44] <maswan> fabbione: heh. good timing on offlining, I just rebooted buttercup
[03:45] <fabbione> maswan: thanks a lot
[03:45] <maswan> fabbione: aren't you supposed to be offline? ;)
[03:45] <fabbione> maswan: well yeah.. i decided to update the wiki and i saw my screen blinking :)
[03:47] <maswan> fabbione: :)
[03:47] <fabbione> maswan: thanks a lot dude :)
[03:47] <maswan> fabbione: sure. feel free to fix the kernel too. ;)
[03:48] <fabbione> maswan: ehhe
[03:51] <lamont> mvo: apt-preferences question for you... how do I tell apt that if version X of package foo exists in repository Y with a different md5sum than in repository Z, to ignore the one in Z completely. :-)
[03:52] <fabbione> CRACK
[03:52] <lamont> fabbione: LOL
[03:52] <mvo> thanks fabbione for pointing that out
[03:52] <lamont> Preparing to replace diff 2.8.1-7 (using .../archives/diff_2.8.1-7_hppa.deb) ...
[03:53] <mvo> lamont: so you have two debs with identical version but different md5sums :) ?
[03:54] <lamont> mvo: yeah.  it happens when you build everything for hoary, and then have to rebuild it from scratch for breezy because the archive doesn't exist.  But the same version is in both hoary and breezy
[03:59] <mvo> lamont: that's a tricky one. wouldn't pinning help you?
[04:00] <lamont> mvo: pinnings are as follows:
[04:01] <lamont> a=breezy == 1650 and 640 (yeah, well, autogenerated, and all that), o=Ubuntu == 630
[04:01] <lamont> wonder if it's the 1650 thing
[04:02] <lamont> hoary and breezy are in sources.list, since breezy's kinda sparse atm
[04:02] <lamont> not a big deal though
[04:03] <mvo> you always produce the most interessting use-cases for apt :)
[04:04] <lamont> always glad to do my part. :-)
[04:04] <mvo> I'm only glad that you don't use X that often (other then for xterms) otherwise would probably get quite a few interessting synaptic bugreport ;)
[04:04] <mdke> documentation meeting now in #ubuntu-meeting :D
[04:04] <lamont> mvo: what's synaptic? :0)
[04:05] <lamont> that's some gui thing, right?
[04:05] <lamont> iz gtk bug
[04:06] <mvo> heh :P
[04:12] <Mithrandir> elmo: could I please have xorg's build-deps in the breezy chroot on concordia?
[04:13] <dilinger> "This fix is also _officially_recommended_ by upstream"
[04:14] <dilinger> i love when people say that in relation to php fixes, as if that holds weight (because upstream is so wise!)
[04:16] <`anthony> just thought I'd check in here first (haven't been able to find anything similar in bugzilla) - when I put my laptop to sleep (to mem) and wake it up, the 'lo' device doesn't get ifupped automatically. 
[04:16] <`anthony> this makes any number of Bad Things happen.
[04:17] <lamont> `anthony: that's strange
[04:18] <`anthony> aha! I wonder. I have an if-up.d script that restarts certain flaky processes (e.g. kio_imap). On wakeup, that might be failing and exiting with non-zero status. Could that then make the network startup abort?
[04:18] <`anthony> just added an exit 0 to the end of that script, see if that makes it better.
[04:20] <lamont> non-zero exits would have that effect
[04:21] <`anthony> lamont: should it? 
[04:22] <lamont> `anthony: it's in the spec that non-zero exit causes ifup failure (for up, and pre-up in interfaces, that is...)
[04:22] <lamont> I expect if-up.d is the same wayh
[04:23] <elmo> GAR
[04:23] <davyd> so... who wants to start the unofficial Ubuntu/Alpha port?
[04:23] <zul> uh no one i think
[04:23] <davyd> http://webcam.ucc.asn.au/ <-- mmm, alpha
[04:24] <lamont> davyd: I know that the hppa port is being pushed by someone with a serious personal investment in hppa, just to please about 4 users worldwide. :)
[04:24] <zul> my...such a wide user base you have lamont ;)
[04:25] <lamont> zul: shaddup. :-)(
[04:25] <elmo> has no one really done a file overwrite checker thing yet?
[04:25] <Kamion> djpig did one for Debian I think
[04:25] <lamont> elmo: zgrep , Contents-i386.gz
[04:26] <Mithrandir> it should really be part of linda or something.
[04:26] <Mithrandir> or katie could refuse to accept binaries with just "buggy" as the reject message.
[04:26] <lamont> elmo: this would be a check that if the deb in question delivers the same file as another package, that it conflicts with it?
[04:27] <elmo> yes
[04:27] <Kamion> Mithrandir: "rejected: kthxbye"
[04:27] <elmo> there's a file overwrite in linux-sound-base ATM I keep running into and it's annoying me
[04:27] <elmo> it's such an obviously automateable check, you'd think
[04:27] <Kamion> I guess it's a question of, which .deb do you reject
[04:28] <zanaga> where should i file a bug about beagle package?
[04:28] <Kamion> hmm, well the new one ought to have a Replaces regardless, I suppose
[04:28] <zanaga> malone says, no such package..
[04:30] <Mithrandir> elmo: anyhow, thanks for fixing build-deps.
[04:30] <elmo> Mithrandir: np
[04:31] <lamont> zul: sometimes a small user base is good... hurts less when you have an archive event
[04:31] <maswan> davyd: what you need is people willing to put in lots of work (you?) and some machines. :)
[04:31] <davyd> maswan: we have the machines
[04:31] <davyd> http://webcam.ucc.asn.au/
[04:31] <davyd> 7 dual EV6 800MHz alphas
[04:32] <lamont> davyd: I'm happy to help a technically savy person come up to speed on bootstrapping the archive
[04:32] <maswan> davyd: Wow. Another university computer club. neat. :)
[04:32] <davyd> maswan: we're possibly the oldest one
[04:32] <Mithrandir> I wonder how long xorg takes to build.  I guess I'll find out.
[04:32] <davyd> maswan: we're older then the homebrew computer society by a year
[04:33] <lamont> Mithrandir: on concordia, with ccache, not all that long
[04:33] <lamont> ~30 min?
[04:33] <davyd> lamont: well, it's my immediate goal to get them all booting something
[04:33] <Mithrandir> lamont: that's not bad
[04:33] <maswan> davyd: lysator started in 72-73
[04:33] <lamont> xorg:                   00:35:53 (17 entries, sigma 00:10:24)
[04:33] <lamont> that's amd64
[04:33] <davyd> I got the big dual 750 on the floor to netboot the sarge installer this evening
[04:33] <davyd> then managed to break it trying to give it 2.6
[04:34] <davyd> lamont: what's the approximate requirement on disk space?
[04:34] <elmo> lamont: oh oh, lemme try that on hutte
[04:34] <lamont> hutte?
[04:34] <maswan> davyd: but neat, we're much younger (90ies). but we have some neat stuff to play with anyway. :)
[04:35] <maswan> davyd: no alphas, but lots of ppcs and sparcs. :)
[04:36] <davyd> these babies were donated by my new work
[04:36] <lamont> anyway, must really go get ready for work. back in 20-30 min
[04:38] <maswan> davyd: neat. no webpage of "this is our hardware"? :)
[04:38] <davyd> maswan: yeah, but it's dodgily out of date in parts
[04:38] <davyd> http://www.ucc.asn.au/machines/
[04:39] <davyd> we've recently received a heap of donations, and spent a heap of money
[04:39] <davyd> for example, our machine Manbo now has 11G of RAM in it
[04:41] <maswan> neat
[04:43] <maswan> davyd: http://www.acc.umu.se/technical/hosts/index.html.en
[04:43] <davyd> maswan: oh, you're ACC?
[04:43] <maswan> davyd: recent donations include a 10-cpu 7-gig E4500
[04:43] <maswan> davyd: yes
[04:43] <maswan> davyd: heard of us? :)
[04:43] <davyd> maswan: rocking
[04:43] <davyd> maswan: we want your bandwidth ;)
[04:43] <davyd> maswan: yeah, we just bought an E4k
[04:43] <maswan> davyd: we want your E6000 and floorspace. ;)
[04:44] <davyd> to get some more fast cpus for our E6k
[04:44] <maswan> heh
[04:44] <davyd> the E4k currently netboots Sarge
[04:44] <davyd> maswan: we're low on space
[04:44] <davyd> and available current
[04:44] <davyd> and available cooling
[04:44] <maswan> running a 2.6 kernel?
[04:44] <maswan> yes, of course
[04:44] <davyd> we're not sure what we're going to do with these alphas
[04:45] <davyd> we can fit them in the rack, but I don't think we can provide them all with power at the same time... yet
[04:45] <davyd> I should update the machines page at some point to include some of our new machines
[04:45] <davyd> also, the fact that someone blew up our Ultra 30 :(
[04:45] <maswan> davyd: ah, (partial) suckage.
[04:46] <maswan> :(
[04:46] <davyd> I did find an Ultra 60 though, that we might be able to have for free instead
[04:46] <davyd> we need more desk space
[04:47] <maswan> hmm.. acutally, we might have about as much floorspace. just never enough. and never enough cooling either. ;)
[04:47] <maswan> We also have a rack full of 4-gig drives that currently serve as $HOME for all users. :)
[04:48] <maswan> davyd: our terminal room: http://www.acc.umu.se/images/archive/20050419-Mek/index.html?view=100_1609.JPG
[04:49] <davyd> our home is currently 40G... but I don't think the entire LVM has been mapped yet
[04:49] <maswan> http://www.acc.umu.se/images/archive/20050308-Mek/index.html?view=100_1559.JPG
[04:49] <maswan> important admin aids :)
[04:49] <davyd> served off our opteron, martello
[04:49] <maswan> http://www.acc.umu.se/images/archive/20050302-Hjulafton/index.html?view=IMG_5116.JPG
[04:49] <maswan> the computer room
[04:50] <davyd> your racks have doors!
[04:50] <davyd> and you appear to have an Indigo2 on the flor
[04:50] <maswan> well, the SP frames have doors
[04:51] <Kamion> jbailey: I can't reproduce the problem under strace in a chroot either
[04:51] <Kamion> jbailey: although I can reproduce it in a chroot, at least sometimes
[04:51] <davyd> I think your machine room is bigger then ours
[04:51] <davyd> it seems that gallery has eaten the photos of our machine room again
[04:51] <maswan> davyd: probably, it is a bit bigger than that, we fit two more racks behind/left of the visible black SP frame door
[04:52] <davyd> we currently have two racks, and the E6k on one side
[04:52] <mdz> wasabi: looks like eclipse failed very early, applying a patch?
[04:52] <mdz> trying patch org.eclipse.jdt.core_ecj-options.patch at level 0...1...2...3...failure.
[04:52] <mdz> make: *** [patch-stamp]  Error 1
[04:52] <jbailey> Kamion: Is the program threaded?
[04:52] <wasabi_> I know, im looking at it.
[04:52] <wasabi_> Just got into work. uploaded it before I left. ;)
[04:52] <davyd> and on the other side is shelving and a desk
[04:52] <Kamion> jbailey: no
[04:53] <davyd> we could rip all that shelving out, but we just can't get enough air flow through the room
[04:53] <Kamion> jbailey: it links to libdl, libtextwrap, libc, libdebian-installer
[04:54] <davyd> maswan: aah, I see you want a drinks server
[04:55] <davyd> anyway, it's about time to sleep
[04:55] <davyd> work tomorrow
[04:55] <maswan> davyd: 'night. talk to you later
[04:55] <davyd> maswan: there needs to be some sort of world wide computer club convention
[04:55] <davyd> where we can spend a day dicksizing
[04:56] <davyd> anyway... g'nit
[04:56] <maswan> davyd: yes. we have one for the nordic computer clubs, yearly. perhaps you want to send a foreign delegation? :)
[04:56] <davyd> maswan: yeah, I've seen that
[04:56] <davyd> I think northern europe is a bit out of our way ;)
[04:57] <Mithrandir> maswan: I think that would be very welcome.  I know some efforts have been tried to get interest from Foreign Places, but without luck so far.
[04:57] <maswan> davyd: well, put a propeller at your silly little island and move it up here? ;)
[04:57] <davyd> It would rock though ;)
[04:57] <davyd> maswan: heh
[04:57] <davyd> I should get my EU passport
[04:57] <davyd> I've been thinking about moving to Europe for a while now
[04:58] <maswan> :)
[04:58] <davyd> damned pricey move though
[04:58] <maswan> Mithrandir: well, long-way travel for students suck, cost-way
[04:58] <davyd> anyway, sleep time
[04:58] <Mithrandir> maswan: we get it all refunded from our university, IIRC
[04:59] <Mithrandir> it just takes like two thirds of a year
[04:59] <maswan> Mithrandir: oh, neat. we don't. :)
[05:12] <mvo> elmo: please sync memtest86+ (override ok)
[05:12] <Mithrandir> daniels: around?
[05:13] <Mithrandir> daniels: would you mind if I fixed the pkg-config issues in xorg and did an upload?
[05:13] <daniels> Mithrandir: absolutely not
[05:13] <daniels> Mithrandir: define 'pkg-config issues in xorg'
[05:13] <Mithrandir> "putting the .pc files in the wrong place so stuff FTBFS"
[05:14] <Mithrandir> it's a two-line fix to debian/rules and a slight adjustment to four *-dev.install files.
[05:14] <daniels> is this /usr/X11R6/lib/pkgconfig vs /usr/lib/pkgconfig?
[05:14] <Mithrandir> yes
[05:16] <Mithrandir> pkg-config should not look in random sets of directories just because somebody thought /usr/X11R6 was a brilliant idea fifteen years (or so) ago. :-)
[05:16] <daniels> bah
[05:16] <daniels> i'm the only one that's allowed to have ideological purity
[05:16] <mdz> wasabi: ah, you fixed it :-)
[05:17] <Mithrandir> daniels: anyhow, would you mind me just fixing it?
[05:17] <wasabi_> yay me
[05:17] <wasabi_> "fix"
[05:17] <wasabi_> I just disabled the questionable patch.
[05:18] <wasabi_> I am curious why it worked for me, but not THAT curious. heh.
[05:19] <Kamion> mdz: please merge colin.watson@canonical.com--2005/debzilla--index-format--0
[05:20] <mdz> Kamion: safe to put it straight into production?
[05:20] <Kamion> should be, yes
[05:20] <Kamion> hmm
[05:20] <Kamion> one sec, just want to check what happens if <tags> is undefined
[05:22] <mdz> Kamion: hmm, was that causing lots of bugs to be invisible to debzilla?
[05:23] <Kamion> probably
[05:23] <Kamion> just noticed a problem, fixing
[05:23] <daniels> Mithrandir: feel free -- i'm not owrking until sunday
[05:24] <Mithrandir> daniels: hooray! ;-)
[05:25] <Kamion> mdz: ok, merge again please
[05:26] <wasabi_> man, I am an impatiant person.
[05:37] <Kamion> damn, jbailey left
[05:37] <mdz> Kamion: merged and deployed
[05:37] <Kamion> the cdebconf hang appears to be in confmodule->run(), which forks
[05:37] <Kamion> mdz: thanks
[05:38] <mdz> I will be somewhat displeased if suddenly 5000 new bugs appear in bugzilla :-)
[05:42] <Kamion> I'm fairly sure you wrote that code, not I ;-)
[05:42] <Kamion> although I may misremember
[05:43] <mdz> yes, it was me
[05:43] <mdz> I would expect to have noticed a long time ago
[05:43] <mdz> if we weren't importing RC bugs unless they had tags
[05:44] <Kamion> mdz: I figured either it was masked by something else, or most RC bugs in practice ended up having tags at some point
[05:44] <mdz> Kamion: the space is never there in the index unless there are tags?
[05:44] <Kamion> the latter hypothesis has probably been fairly reliable of late
[05:44] <Kamion> mdz: I don't believe so
[05:44] <mdz> Kamion: I consider it a bug to omit the field delimiter just because the field is null :-P
[05:44] <mdz> brb
[05:45] <wasabi_> SUCCESSFULY
[05:45] <wasabi_> yay
[05:46] <wasabi_> You may now apt-get install eclipse.
[05:46] <mdz> wasabi: doesn't it need to be built and uploaded first? ;-)
[05:46] <wasabi_> Well, it's built.
[05:46] <wasabi_> So it's probably uploaded. ;)
[05:47] <mdz> wow, short build
[05:47] <Kamion> mdz: it seems I was wrong
[05:47] <wasabi_> Yeah, I disabled the gcj native enhancements for the first upload.
[05:47] <Kamion> mdz: the space does seem to be there
[05:48] <Kamion> mdz: I was fooled by the way the example sabdfl happened to pick was exactly 80 characters long, so I didn't notice the trailing space
[06:22] <elmo> wasabi: dude?
[06:28] <elmo> wasabi: what's up with eclipse-efj, it seems only tyo have a 454 byte binary and minimumal docs?
[06:29] <\sh> wasabi: and there is a file missing for /etc/java-vm/ something...u put that into the package, but it will never be installed ;)
[06:31] <wasabi_> It's going to be more. ;0
[06:31] <wasabi_> elmo, it's going to eventually be a full binary, with a proper man page, etc.
[06:31] <wasabi_> I just wanted to get it "working".
[06:31] <wasabi_> Is that not acceptable?
[06:32] <wasabi_> it will be a command line code formatter. Something Fedora introduced in a set of patches to Eclipse.
[06:32] <seb128> wasabi_: somebody asked about "cdt", does the package have it?
[06:32] <wasabi_> No. I am working on it though.
[06:32] <seb128> cool, thanks
[06:32] <wasabi_> It's a seperate Eclipse development plugin.
[06:33] <seb128> any idea if that's a lot of work?
[06:33] <wasabi_> It will be some, yes.
[06:33] <seb128> k, keep the good work so :)
[06:33] <wasabi_> heh
[06:33] <seb128> thanks :)
[06:39] <wasabi_> Do we have a nice Ubuntu logo in a package anywhere? Just the plain logo. Icon form, but bigger than an icon
[06:40] <wasabi_> Ah there we go. One with the gdm theme.
[06:41] <Kamion> oh my GOD
[06:41] <Kamion> signal handlers are not meant to save databases
[06:41] <elmo> heh
[06:42] <Kamion> if this is why I've spent the entire day tediously stepping through d-i init code in a chroot, I'm going to hurt someone very badly
[06:44] <carstenh> jeff bailey's nick in irc is?
[06:44] <stratus> carstenh, jbailey
[06:44] <carstenh> stratus: thanks
[06:44] <stratus> np
[06:45] <carstenh> hmm, is he usually here?
[06:45] <ogra> carstenh, yep
[06:45] <carstenh> thanks ogra 
[06:48] <xTina> I'm not sure if this is the right place to ask, but are there any plans for implementing support for "--onpart" in kickstart files? Or is there way to achieve similar functionality with d-i preseeding using partman recipes? Or will I have to do something nasty to the installer to preserve existing partitioning and format just a few of them during a fully automated install?
[06:50] <Kamion> xTina: iirc partman-auto preseeding didn't let me implement that
[06:50] <ska-fan> Stephan Hermann?
[06:50] <xTina> Kamion: That's what I suspected after looking at partman :(
[06:51] <Kamion> oh, hi colinw, long time no see
[06:51] <\sh> ska-fan: yes
[06:51] <ska-fan> \sh: Ah, that's you. You know #postgresql, right?
[06:51] <\sh> ska-fan: no :)
[06:51] <colinw> Kamion: hello
[06:51] <ska-fan> \sh: Now you do :)
[06:52] <\sh> ska-fan: i just started to have a look on postgresql
[06:52] <\sh> ska-fan: and right now, I didn't have any crash for a long time now ;)
[06:52] <ska-fan> \sh: #postgresql is very helpful and friendly. And you can ask me about anything when I'm online :)
[06:52] <\sh> ska-fan: good to know :)
[06:52] <Kamion> xTina: yeah, just checked, it'd require partman-auto extensions; without that it would be nasty
[06:53] <xTina> Kamion: partman-auto extensions?
[06:58] <Kamion> xTina: ability to nominate a device
[07:02] <pitti> Hi guys
[07:05] <xTina> Kamion: Is there any easy way to get around this? I have a lab here that's dual-boot and I must not touch the partitioning. We've been using Fedora before, so I'm not really familiar with anything but ks. I was thinking on the line of getting my own udeb with just a shell script in there that depends on e2fsprogs-udeb ... but maybe there's an easier way?
[07:09] <Kamion> xTina: I think there'll have to be a bit of coding involved; you could create the partitions you need and mount them all under /target, bypassing partman entirely
[07:12] <carstenh> hi ex-mentor :)
[07:13] <pitti> Hi carstenh 
[07:14] <xTina> gotta run, thanks Kamion 
[07:17] <enTr> alien
[07:17] <enTr> help?---what is alien
[07:17] <pitti> elmo: ruby1.8 sync, please
[07:17] <enTr> how to install using alien
[07:17] <elmo> pitti: same question I asked yesterday?
[07:18] <enTr> how to use debian-alien to make installation?
[07:18] <enTr> somebody help please...
[07:19] <carstenh> enTr: alien converts rpm to deb
[07:19] <carstenh> enTr: i don't think you need this
[07:19] <enTr> i try but cannot
[07:19] <carstenh> enTr: converted rpms suck
[07:20] <enTr> but how to install vm ware that give me two type of installer 1. *.rpm 2.*.gz... 
[07:20] <carstenh> enTr: are you sure that you really want to install alien-converted rpms?
[07:20] <pitti> elmo: I didn't get your question any more
[07:20] <JanC> enTr : alien only converts .rpm --> .deb
[07:20] <enTr>  ic... 
[07:20] <carstenh> enTr: shrugs, i never used vm-ware
[07:20] <JanC> then you have to install it with dpkg -i
[07:21] <JanC> but like carstenh says: it might sometimes cause problems
[07:21] <elmo> pitti: will it kill my amd64 buildds?
[07:22] <JanC> because the program isn't compiled for Ubuntu
[07:22] <enTr> ic... actually i just install ubuntu into vmware and try to install the vm-tool there but something i didn't know how to use linux at all...
[07:22] <pitti> elmo: well, my 7ubuntu1 upload to breezy went fine
[07:22] <elmo> pitti: hum.  I wonder what ruby upload was killing them then
[07:22] <mdz> JanC: alien converts any-to-any
[07:22] <pitti> elmo: it was just the hoary build that caused trouble, warty worked as well
[07:22] <elmo> lamont/infinity?
[07:22] <elmo> ah, ok
[07:22] <carstenh> enTr: do you know man?
[07:22] <enTr> do you have any suggestion where i can find a list of linux command
[07:22] <carstenh> enTr: "man alien" tells you how to use it
[07:23] <enTr> please..
[07:23] <mdz> enTr: please use #ubuntu for support; this channel is for development-related discussion
[07:23] <enTr> ic thanks...
[07:35] <lamont> elmo: ping
[07:36] <elmo> lamont: ?
[07:47] <mdz> Kamion: how is BrandingForDerivatives going?
[07:48] <bddebian> Heya
[07:48] <hughsie> ogra: ping?
[07:53] <elmo> how long is it taking concordia?
[07:53] <ogra> hughsie, :)
[07:53] <hughsie> ogra, hello my friend
[07:53] <hughsie> ogra: http://article.gmane.org/gmane.comp.gnome.powermanager.devel/237
[07:53] <ogra> hughsie, nice screenshots :)
[07:53] <hughsie> you like?
[07:53] <ogra> yep
[07:53] <Mithrandir> elmo: half-hour-ish
[07:53] <elmo> ?! really?
[07:54] <Kamion> mdz: no progress since last status report on that page I'm afraid, I've been busy on other items
[07:54] <hughsie> ogra: then we can have my informative icons and theme the mains ones like davidz suggested
[07:54] <ogra> hughsie, i like the fact to have all info available without havig 485248 icons in the try :)
[07:54] <ogra> tray even
[07:54] <hughsie> one icon - max!
[07:54] <ogra> yep
[07:54] <hughsie> this is all theory atm
[07:54] <hughsie> the menu code from Andrei is a bit rough atm, but its coming on.
[07:54] <Mithrandir> elmo: .. without ccache, yes. :-)
[07:55] <hughsie> ogra: not too much information?
[07:55] <elmo> hum, I wonder what's wrong with hutte
[07:55] <azeem> the name
[07:55] <ogra> hughsie, no, why? as long as not everything is shown by default ... i'm fine with right clicking to see my UPS status
[07:55] <hughsie> left clicking
[07:56] <hughsie> right click brings up the usual menu
[07:56] <ogra> ah, ok
[07:56] <hughsie> plus i was thinking of using the new notification std for the notifications
[07:56] <ogra> so you dont bind a default action to the left click but a menu, thats nice...
[07:56] <hughsie> rather than using modal dialogues
[07:56] <ogra> yep... the tooltip sutt you mean ? 
[07:57] <ogra> stuff
[07:57] <ogra> hrm
[07:57] <hughsie> yup
[07:57] <hughsie> hrm?
[07:57] <ogra> yes... typos :)
[07:57] <LeaChim> what does this error message mean? - Value too large for defined data type - i'm trying to copy a 50M file
[07:57] <hughsie> ogra: okay, lets do some hacking :-)
[07:57] <LeaChim> surely ubuntu linux can handle 50 meg files
[07:58] <hughsie> ogra: I'm away for a few days. Phone is cut off today (for moving house)
[07:58] <ogra> hughsie, yay... i'll be fully available on monday again....
[07:58] <ogra> so how long do you think you'll be offline
[07:59] <hughsie> ogra: Monday I would think, unless I can get some some cafe somewhere or an unsecured access point!
[07:59] <hughsie> ogra: and then dial up for a couple of weeks
[07:59] <hughsie> NOT COOL
[07:59] <ogra> where do you move to ?
[08:00] <hughsie> ogra: not far, back to Guildford
[08:00] <ogra> (i heard BT takes its time...)
[08:00] <hughsie> ogra: triffic.
[08:01] <LeaChim> so, does anyone have any idea why ubuntu is having problems reading a mere 50 meg file?
[08:02] <ogra> hughsie, hey, you have a nice country, ijust arrived in london, the first time i'm in uk
[08:02] <hughsie> ogra: where in London? difffernt parts are better than others
[08:02] <hughsie> I'm in Rochester at the moment working for a cool company
[08:02] <ogra> south kensington 
[08:03] <hughsie> ogra: that is cool.
[08:03] <hughsie> ogra: my g/f lives in Richmond, so I know south ken quite well
[08:03] <ogra> yep, it appeard quite nice... i walked from the hotel to the office, to see a bit 
[08:04] <hughsie> ogra: just watch for pick-pockets
[08:04] <ogra> i'll do :)
[08:05] <hughsie> ogra: anytime you're in Surrey or Kent, give me a call.
[08:05] <ogra> i'll do :)
[08:05] <hughsie> ogra: my last day at work tmw.
[08:05] <hughsie> loving the thought
[08:05] <ogra> but this weekend i'm boung  tothe hotel here
[08:05] <ogra> bound even
[08:05] <hughsie> n/p, this weekend I'm moving!
[08:05] <ogra> :)
[08:15] <Kamion> jbailey: I *think* that hang is down to abysmal signal handler hygiene in cdebconf.
[08:23] <mdz> Kamion: like that awful gzip bug
[08:23] <Kamion> oh, yes, I vaguely remember that
[08:23] <Kamion> I've stuck a band-aid over just cdebconf's SIGCHLD handler, which at least cleans up the immediate problem as far as I can see
[08:24] <Kamion> but it'll need a total rework later
[08:26] <mdz> mako: what is the name of that firefox extension which lets you edit textareas using emacs?
[08:27] <pitti> ... and is there a counterpart for vim? :-)
[08:27] <tseng> pitti++
[08:27] <pitti> so far I do that with copy+paste, but that's error prone
[08:27] <wasabi_> Hmm. postinst questions. Package needs to create a directory in /usr/local on install. How should I do that in postinst?
[08:28] <wasabi_> should I test for $1 = configure or what?
[08:28] <wasabi_> And should that dir be removed on purge?
[08:28] <pitti> wasabi_: yes, and yes (with rmdir --no-fail-if-nonempty)
[08:29] <pitti> wasabi_: erm, --ignore-fail-on-non-empty
[08:29] <pitti> wasabi_: however, why not ship it in the package itself?
[08:29] <pitti> wasabi_: that seems much easier
[08:29] <wasabi_> Lintain says no
[08:29] <wasabi_> Should put it in a script.
[08:30] <pitti> wasabi_: hm, right
[08:30] <pitti> wasabi_: /usr/local might be mounted ro
[08:30] <pitti> wasabi_: yes, then the postinst/postrm makes sense, and postinst should ignore failures on the dir creation
[08:30] <mdz> pitti: it can work with any editor, I'm sure
[08:30] <wasabi_> Hmm. What if failure of the dir being created results in an unusable package?
[08:31] <pitti> wasabi_: it mustn't
[08:31] <wasabi_> Pssh.
[08:31] <pitti> wasabi_: you *must not* depend on anything in /usr/locale
[08:31] <pitti> erm, s/e$//
[08:31] <wasabi_> Would it be possible to fail postinst and put the package into a non-configured state?
[08:31] <pitti> wasabi_: no
[08:31] <pitti> wasabi_: /usr/local is taboo for packages
[08:31] <wasabi_> Oh heck.
[08:31] <wasabi_> I'll give you some context if it might hange things.
[08:31] <wasabi_> Eclipse.
[08:31] <pitti> wasabi_: it is fine to create a directory to indicate where the user can plugins to, etc.
[08:31] <pitti> wasabi_: everything you ship and depend on must be in /usr
[08:32] <wasabi_> /usr/share/eclipse/plugins is where the packaged Eclipse plugins are kept.
[08:32] <wasabi_> But Eclipse contains an auto install feature which allows you to browse for an install plugins at runtime.
[08:32] <wasabi_> It's very useful, most third party plugins are published that way.
[08:32] <wasabi_> So, I have added /usr/local/lib/eclipse/plugins as an alternative source. Eclipse however fails to start when the dir doesn't exist.
[08:32] <pitti> wasabi_: no chance to install them in your ~ alternatively, btw?
[08:32] <wasabi_> Yes, that *also*.
[08:32] <wasabi_> I wanted to make it easy for users to install system-wide plugins
[08:33] <wasabi_> From remote sources.
[08:33] <pitti> wasabi_: then you need to patch eclipse to not fail
[08:33] <pitti> wasabi_: well, or at least fail gracefully with explaining that the dir is missing
[08:33] <wasabi_> Hmm. I could do that in the startup wrapper.
[08:33] <pitti> wasabi_: the common case is that postinst will be able to install it
[08:40] <shaya> join #debian-devel
[08:40] <torkel> wasabi_: in the startup wrapper, why not create a link from /u/l/l/e/p/* to ~/.eclipse/plugins/ ? or is that too evil?
[08:40] <wasabi_> what?
[08:41] <wasabi_> That's not even reasonably acceptable.
[08:41] <torkel> k
[08:41] <wasabi_> Wait did I misunderstand?
[08:42] <torkel> wasabi_: it was probably me missunderstanding what you meant
[08:43] <Kamion> infinity: any chance you could kick off a d-i build once cdebconf 0.81ubuntu1 binaries reach the archive?
[08:43] <Kamion> infinity: if you don't know how to drive that yet, no worries, I'll do it when I get back - but I'm going out for the evening and it would be nice for the wheels to continue to turn :-)
[08:46] <shaya> anyone know if there's a restricted modules floating around somewhere for 2.6.12?
[08:46] <pitti> not yet
[08:50] <mako> mdz: mosez
[08:50] <mako> pitti: it works with vim
[08:50] <mako> mdz: mozex
[08:50] <mako> pitti: mozex lets you edit any text editor with an editor of your choicce
[08:51] <mako> pitti: sorry, any text AREA
[08:51] <mako> wikis are *so* painful without it
[08:51] <pitti> how is it called like?
[08:54] <ogra> http://mozex.mozdev.org/
[08:54] <pitti> danke
[08:59] <tseng> ive never managed to install that
[09:00] <tseng> i have the context menu, but i cant find the prefs panel
[09:01] <tseng> mako: can you get to the prefs in firefox?
[09:03] <Treenaks> tseng: in the extensions screen, there should be a button for that
[09:03] <tseng> Treenaks: you would think so
[09:04] <hunger> shaya: fabbione said he is waiting for a finalish linux kernel before the restricted modules are tackled.
[09:04] <ogra> its 2 years old and didnt get updated for quite some time
[09:05] <Treenaks> ogra: ah ,that would explain why it doesn't work anymore.. bitrot
[09:05] <ogra> install mozilla :P
[09:05] <Treenaks> ogra: make me :)
[09:05] <ogra> heh
[09:07] <tseng> so is there a file i can edit?
[09:07] <tseng> if you cant change the apps this thing is basically useless it seems
[09:12] <mdz> mako: doesn't work ("no 'textarea' command is set")
[09:15] <mdz> mako: do you not use firefox?
[09:16] <jp> epiphany rocks :)
[09:21] <mako> mdz: i do.. i think it's slightly broken in firefox
[09:21] <mako> mdz: i had to do about:config
[09:21] <mako> mdz: and then set the command that way
[09:22] <mako> mdz: PITA, but not as bad as textareas
[09:22] <mako> i found some documentation on how to do it
[09:26] <mdz> mako: I couldn't even find it in about:config
[09:26] <mdz> mako: no matches for mozex or textarea
[09:31] <mako> mdz: ergh.. i gotta run.. i'll find it tomorrow
[09:31] <mako> or later tonight i find net
[09:31] <pitti> mdz: I'm just doing a hoary->breezy dist-upgrade and collect some bugs. Shall I make them a dependency of a meta-bug again which is assigned to you? 
[09:32] <mdz> pitti: to me?? ;-)
[09:32] <mdz> a meta-bug sounds reasonable
[09:32] <pitti> mdz: yes, so that you see which bugs are still outstanding
[09:32] <pitti> mdz: I don't want to assign the actual bugs to you :-)
[09:32] <pitti> mdz: just like I did for warty->hoary
[09:33] <mdz> doesn't matter to me where the meta-bug is assigned, but sure
[09:33] <pitti> ok
[09:42] <ogra> tseng, point your browser to chrome://mozex/content/mozexPrefDialog.xul
[09:53] <ogra> Mithrandir, so you got infected too ?
[09:54] <HiddenWolf> Mithrandir, is that the third revision today? :P
[09:54] <Mithrandir> nah, just a fix for some pkg-config bug
[09:54] <Mithrandir> bah, has there been xorg uploads today already?  I probably need to rebuild then
[09:55] <seb128> elmo: libgt2-perl (experimental) and verbiste syncs please
[09:56] <seb128> elmo: libgtk2-perl
[09:58] <elmo> [Updating]  libgtk2-perl (1:1.090-1 [Ubuntu]  < 1:1.091-1 [Debian] )
[09:58] <elmo> ... ?
[09:59] <elmo> [ignoring the off-by-one error in my code] 
[09:59] <wasabi_> Anybody want to move some packages from multiverse to universe? :)
[09:59] <elmo> seb128: verbiste done anyway
[10:06] <seb128> elmo: thanks. What is the message about libgtk2-perl?
[10:07] <wasabi_> shell script's confuse me.
[10:08] <tseng> ogra: thanks
[10:08] <wasabi_> Okay so. A shell script. It does 4 things. One of those 4 things can fail. How does that command effect the exit code of the script itself?
[10:09] <danielki> the exit code of the script is the exit code of the last command executed
[10:09] <danielki> unless you explicitely write 'exit 0'
[10:09] <wasabi_> What about set -e?
[10:09] <tseng> oh man this is cool
[10:09] <danielki> ah you want it to abort
[10:10] <wasabi_> No. What I want to do is ignore errors for just 2 of the commands.
[10:10] <wasabi_> But abort on all the others. ;)
[10:10] <danielki> use command || exit 1
[10:11] <wasabi_> Hmm. I should be able to make these two commands || true maybe
[10:11] <danielki> the ones you want to ignore, yes
[10:11] <danielki> that should even work with set -e
[10:12] <elmo> seb128: version in ubuntu == version in debian experimental
[10:12] <seb128> elmo: 1.090 and 1.091 ?
[10:12] <seb128> oh, k
[10:12] <seb128> hum
[10:13] <seb128> elmo: http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main/libg/libgtk2-perl/ and http://ftp.debian.org/debian/pool/main/libg/libgtk2-perl/ have different versions
[10:15] <elmo> libgtk2-perl |  1:1.090-1 |        breezy | source
[10:15] <elmo> it just hasn't built ....
[10:15] <fabbione> elmo: yes it's FTBFS on a test case
[10:15] <fabbione> but seb128 sync request is right
[10:20] <elmo> oh, 1.091.  well it hadn't reached ftp.d.o at the time seb asked for it
[10:20] <elmo> I'll try again late
[10:21] <seb128> thanks
[10:21] <seb128> (http://ftp.debian.org/debian/pool/main/libg/libgtk2-perl/ has it)
[10:29] <elmo> oh, I know why
[10:29] <elmo> project is after debian
[10:29] <elmo> hum, maybe.  anyway.
[10:30] <wasabi_> Oh hey I could get added to planet.ubuntu.com couldn't i.
[10:31] <mae> shall i make a deb?
[10:32] <ogra> mae, yes, do it together with MOTU (see #ubuntu-motu) to get it properly reviewed
[10:36] <ogra> night all
[10:39] <mae> is GObject meant to deprecate gtkmm?
[10:39] <danielki> huh
[10:39] <danielki> no
[10:39] <sivang> mae: ?
[10:40] <danielki> mae: GTK+ has always been based on an OO design
[10:40] <sivang> mae: GObject is GLib's object's abstraction to allow to use objects in GNOME without actually needing an OO languiage
[10:40] <danielki> mae: gtkmm is about the language
[10:41] <sivang> mae, danielki : it's gtk bindings for C++ no ?
[10:42] <danielki> yes
[10:42] <danielki> erm
[10:42] <danielki> the other way around
[10:42] <danielki> C++ bindings for GTK+ :)
[10:42] <wasabi_> sivang is right
[10:42] <wasabi_> actually they both make sense
[10:42] <wasabi_> =
[10:42] <sivang> wasabi_: right :-)
[10:43] <sivang> wasabi_: how are you doing buddy by the way?
[10:43] <wasabi_> I am decent.
[10:45] <sivang> wasabi_: heheh , how's java stuff going?
[10:45] <wasabi_> apt-get install eclipse-sdk
[10:45] <sivang> wasabi_: err, I can't, have you gotten into this:
[10:45] <sivang> dpkg: error processing /var/cache/apt/archives/xlibs-data_6.8.2-32_all.deb (--unpack):
[10:45] <sivang>  trying to overwrite `/usr/X11R6/lib/X11/xkb', which is also in package libx11-6
[10:46] <Zomb> Ubuntu has 3.0? 3.1?
[10:46] <wasabi_> I just replaced it.
[10:46] <wasabi_> overwrite.
[10:46] <wasabi_> Then upgraded everything.
[10:46] <sivang> wasabi_: I give it apt-get -f , but it won't work
[10:46] <wasabi_> install the xlibs-data deb with --force-overwrite
[10:46] <wasabi_> then just upgrade libx11-6
[10:46] <sivang> wasabi_: k, thanks a lot
[10:48] <sivang> wasabi_: yay, easy as pie. 
[10:51] <mae> danielki, what I mean is, gtkmm is a wrapper over the c functions also using libsigc.. is GObject is meant to replace gtkmm, right? .. I know that gtk uses and object oriented design
[10:51] <mae> er gtkmm is a wrapper for the C functions providing C++ bindings, rather :)
[10:56] <danielki> mae: GObject is written in C
[10:57] <danielki> glibmm wraps it too
[10:57] <mae> ermm but i think GObject was new.. is it not replacing something else?:
[10:58] <danielki> it replaced GtkObject as a base class for everything
[10:58] <danielki> without being GUI related
[10:58] <danielki> i.e. it's kind of a design cleanup
[10:59] <danielki> (GtkObject still exists though, and derives from GObject)
[11:02] <danielki> mae: the main purpose of GtkObject nowadays is to implement container ownership
[11:04] <mae> i see :)
[11:10] <lamont> elmo about?
[11:14] <wasabi_> GObject is not new. And I don't know what you mean about "main purpose"
[11:14] <wasabi_> All of Gtk is built with GObject.
[11:15] <sivang> wasabi_ is right, AFAIK
[11:15] <wasabi_> gtkmm is just a wrapper around Gtk's GObjects (and probably extending into Gnome stuff too) in C++, so you can use real C++ classes
[11:15] <sivang> IMHO, right again
[11:15] <wasabi_> GObject itself is just really a small framework and some standards for writing structs so you can prentend to use objects in C.
[11:15] <sivang> (at least that's what I Know that gtkmm is)
[11:16] <wasabi_> s/small/big/
[11:16] <wasabi_> Heh. Eclipse ssureees has been building a long time.
[11:17] <danielki> wasabi: I was talking about the main purpose of GtkObject, to explain why it's actually there at all
[11:17] <danielki> instead of just deriving from GObject directly
[11:17] <wasabi_> depends what you were tlaking about
[11:18] <wasabi_> GObject the project or GObject the class.
[11:18] <danielki> the class
[11:18] <wasabi_> k.
[11:18] <wasabi_> didn't sound like that at first.
[11:18] <lamont> elmo: is glibc/hppa NEW or somethign?
[11:18] <sivang> has anyone seen jinty lately?
[11:19] <danielki> wasabi_: I sometimes forget that it's a separate project from glib :)
[11:19] <danielki> it's like gdk-pixbuf vs gdk
[11:25] <i_m_meen> hello
[11:25] <i_m_meen> just one question: apt-build is a dead project?
[11:30] <sivang> wasabi_: hmmm:
[11:30] <sivang> Setting up eclipse-platform (3.1-0ubuntu2) ...
[11:30] <sivang> touch: cannot touch `/usr/local/share/eclipse/.eclipseextension': No such file or directory
[11:30] <sivang> dpkg: error processing eclipse-platform (--configure):
[11:31] <sivang> wasabi_: and there are lots o' lots of errors..:-(
[11:31] <i_m_meen> WARNING: The following packages cannot be authenticated!
[11:31] <i_m_meen>   xfe
[11:31] <i_m_meen> E: There are problems and -y was used without --force-yes
[11:31] <i_m_meen> output from apt-build...
[11:31] <i_m_meen> but apt-build doesn't have a force yes option
[11:31] <i_m_meen> so what should i make of it?
[11:33] <i_m_meen> google doesn't help..
[11:33] <i_m_meen> the manual doesn't help...
[11:33] <wasabi_> that /usr/local problem is fixed in the next version! =)
[11:33] <wasabi_> What other errors?
[11:33] <sivang> wasabi_: ok, when are you uploading?
[11:34] <wasabi_> An hour ago. It's waiting to be built.
[11:35] <sivang> wasabi_: http://paste.uni.cc/7434
[11:36] <wasabi_> You could build it if you were feeling bored. heh.
[11:36] <wasabi_> Oh just that one problem.
[11:36] <sivang> wasabi_: everything else is caused by it?
[11:36] <wasabi_> rm /var/lib/dpkg/info/eclipse-platform.postinst; apt-get -f install
[11:36] <wasabi_> Yeah
[11:44] <mxpxpod> does anyone here use beagle on breezy on powerpc?
[11:47] <wasabi_> sivang, new version built.
[11:48] <sivang> wasabi_: cool, but will test it tommorow :-) it's bed time now