[12:01] <siretart> :)
[12:01] <siretart> hey, what's this: Failed to fetch http://de.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/breezy/main/binary-amd64/Packages.gz  MD5Sum mismatch
[12:01] <siretart> Failed to fetch http://de.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/breezy/universe/binary-amd64/Packages.gz  MD5Sum mismatch
[12:01] <tseng> broken mirror?
[12:02] <ivoks> run again
[12:02] <ivoks> maybe it's syncing
[12:02] <tseng> ivoks: eh
[12:02] <tseng> ivoks: wouldnt it update Packages.gz last?
[12:02] <siretart> hm. perhaps..
[12:02] <tseng> to avoid that
[12:02] <tseng> or at least, that would make sense
[12:03] <tseng> oh nevermind
[12:03] <tseng> that was packages.gz :P
[12:03] <siretart> tseng: that depends on the mirroring software. debmirror does this. rsync not
[12:03] <siretart> read: plain rsync not
[12:03] <tseng> yes
[12:05] <ivoks> doh..
[12:05] <ivoks> ivoks.blog.hr isn't working :(
[12:06] <tseng> whiprush on puc!!!!!!!ONE
[12:07] <tseng> siretart: https://bob.kdz13.net/test.txt is the backend code to that page
[12:07] <tseng> siretart: the rest you can see in view source, its < 100 lines i think
[12:07] <ivoks> lol tseng:
[12:07] <ivoks> Developers: Microsoft to Release AJAX Framework
[12:08] <tseng> thats such bollocks, i dont need a "framework"
[12:08] <tseng> look at how simple this code is
[12:08] <tseng> i guess its for all their wussie VB hackers
[12:08] <siretart> tseng: also available for pyhton? ;)
[12:08] <ogra> victoria bitter ?
[12:09] <tseng> ogra: :)
[12:09] <siretart> hrhr
[12:09] <ogra> ;)
[12:09] <tseng> siretart: it doesnt matter
[12:09] <tseng> siretart: i did it in php
[12:09] <tseng> siretart: look at the code
[12:09] <tseng> the javascript just does a GET on your backend page
[12:09] <tseng> and returns the results
[12:09] <tseng> it can be any page really
[12:09] <ivoks> time to leave you guys...
[12:09] <ivoks> till tomorrow
[12:09] <tseng> bye ivoks
[12:10] <siretart> gn8 folks!
[12:10] <tseng> siretart: i cant think of anything cool to do with REVU and ajax.
[12:10] <tseng> or, at least cool *and* useful
[12:10] <tseng> in my app at work i sort things by column if you click on the header
[12:10] <tseng> but we have not much stuff
[12:11] <siretart> I'll think about it. gn8
[12:11] <sistpoty> I'm going to bed as well... bye together
[12:11] <tseng> bye
[12:11] <tseng> siretart: hey one second
[12:11] <siretart> ja?
[12:11] <tseng> why do you say "together"
[12:11] <tseng> er, sistpoty
[12:11] <tseng> siretart: sleep :)
[12:11] <Burgundavia> I had a thought regarding revu
[12:11] <siretart> ah. ok - on my way:)
[12:11] <tseng> Burgundavia: tell me
[12:12] <sistpoty> weird... maybe i'm too tired too write good english
[12:12] <Burgundavia> is it useful to have seperate tables for things that received no reviews and things we have received only positive reviews?
[12:12] <tseng> no?
[12:12] <sistpoty> that was really sick "german english"
[12:12] <Burgundavia> ie, something that has just been uploaded and not been looked by anyone
[12:12] <tseng> they could be sorted that way
[12:12] <tseng> or colored
[12:12] <Burgundavia> is it useful?
[12:12] <tseng> they are already colored
[12:13] <tseng> its useful to quickly see
[12:13] <tseng> i dont see why it makes a difference if you split the table
[12:13] <Burgundavia> because I was thinking about the UI
[12:13] <Burgundavia> current my design was 4 tables
[12:13] <Burgundavia> 1 for unreview/only positive reviews and 1 for downchecks, with one of each for both new and updated packages
[12:14] <Burgundavia> the order would be:
[12:14] <Burgundavia> new packages: Un
[12:14] <Burgundavia> and Prob
[12:14] <Burgundavia> and then Changed
[12:14] <Burgundavia> un and prob
[12:14] <tseng> prob?
[12:14] <Burgundavia> problems
[12:15] <ajmitch> morning all
[12:15] <tseng> hi ajmitch
[12:15] <tseng> Burgundavia: hang on
[12:15] <tseng> what if it was views
[12:15] <tseng> not all on the page at once, but possible
[12:15] <tseng> the main page has just the first table that we see now
[12:15] <tseng> but with links across the top to adjust the query
[12:15] <tseng> in the ways you just specified
[12:15] <tseng> it would redraw the table acordingly
[12:16] <Burgundavia> the "current" current uploaders would be divided into 4 tables
[12:16] <tseng> no, it wouldnt
[12:16] <tseng> think about it this way
[12:16] <tseng> its one table
[12:16] <tseng> in the database
[12:16] <Burgundavia> yes
[12:16] <tseng> right now we view the entire thing as is
[12:16] <tseng> which is "correct"
[12:16] <tseng> you want custom views on it
[12:17] <Burgundavia> true
[12:17] <tseng> which we can do in real time
[12:17] <Burgundavia> ok
[12:17] <tseng> would that suit?
[12:17] <tseng> id love to start hacking on that
[12:17] <Burgundavia> let me draw you a mockup of what I imagined
[12:17] <tseng> ok
[12:17] <tseng> but i think it makes the page too heavy
[12:17] <tseng> ill draw mine too
[12:17] <tseng> and we can compromise
[12:17] <tseng> :D
[12:17] <ajmitch> so what do the different colours in revu mean now?
[12:18] <tseng> ajmitch: its based on review/no reviw it looks like
[12:18] <ogra> ajmitch, its written above
[12:18] <ajmitch> ah, NEW vs changes
[12:18] <ajmitch> ogra: that's assuming I read it :)
[12:18] <ogra> :)
[12:19] <ajmitch> herve was asking about a list of packages to merge?
[12:19] <ajmitch> I've got a list that I can generate daily here if you want
[12:20] <Burgundavia> http://img129.echo.cx/my.php?image=revumockup4yx.png
[12:21] <tseng> ok
[12:21] <tseng> do you have an issue with new/updated being reflected by color or sort order in the same table?
[12:21] <Burgundavia> not really
[12:22] <Burgundavia> I was actually designing icons for new and updated
[12:22] <Burgundavia> up arrow for new
[12:22] <tseng> here's what I am thinking
[12:22] <Burgundavia> and circle for updated
[12:22] <tseng>    <a>New</a>
[12:22] <tseng>    <a>Needs Work</a>
[12:22] <tseng>    <a>Ready for Upload</a>
[12:22] <tseng> 3 views
[12:22] <Burgundavia> ok
[12:22] <tseng> all on the main page
[12:22] <Burgundavia> yes
[12:22] <tseng> live updating with ajax
[12:22] <Burgundavia> that works
[12:22] <tseng> not on the screen at once
[12:23] <tseng> the main page has everything listed
[12:23] <tseng> and color coded
[12:23] <tseng> (i think)
[12:23] <tseng> who here has the database setup and is still awake?
[12:23] <tseng> and wants to hack with me
[12:24] <Burgundavia> and table should have the alternating colours
[12:24] <Burgundavia> that makes it easy to read
[12:24] <tseng> yes
[12:24] <tseng> definately
[12:24] <Burgundavia> all the way across, not like the current setup
[12:24] <tseng> Burgundavia: it should be sortable
[12:24] <tseng> by clicking column headers
[12:24] <Burgundavia> yes
[12:24] <Burgundavia> would that be 3 tables?
[12:24] <Burgundavia> each sortable?
[12:24] <Burgundavia> or one big?
[12:24] <tseng> well
[12:24] <tseng> do you understand what im saying?
[12:25] <tseng> there is on table on the page at a time
[12:25] <Burgundavia> one table?
[12:25] <tseng> as you click links the table is replaced
[12:25] <tseng> by the view you want
[12:25] <tseng> it might be easier if you think of it as 4 html pages
[12:25] <Burgundavia> so clicking on New hides Needs Work and Read?
[12:25] <tseng> yes
[12:25] <Burgundavia> gotcha
[12:25] <tseng> it totally replaces the div with new content
[12:26] <tseng> i wish this was php/mysql :(
[12:26] <tseng> or id already be done
[12:26] <Burgundavia> doing to do that with tabs?
[12:26] <tseng> yeah, its like tabs in a gtk app
[12:26] <Burgundavia> ok
[12:26] <tseng> sortof
[12:26] <Burgundavia> another thing
[12:26] <tseng> it will be regular hyperlinks
[12:26] <tseng> with javascript actions
[12:27] <Burgundavia> would be nice if instead of email addys, you saw the this
[12:27] <tseng> the this?
[12:27] <Burgundavia> Brandon Hale (tseng)
[12:27] <tseng> yep, sure
[12:27] <Burgundavia> blah@blah.org
[12:27] <Burgundavia> maybe leave off the email
[12:27] <Burgundavia> but make the name a mailto link?
[12:28] <tseng> the table needs a bit of padding too
[12:28] <Burgundavia> no
[12:28] <tseng> inside the td's
[12:28] <Burgundavia> scratch that
[12:28] <tseng> its bugging me
[12:28] <tseng> and wth is actions
[12:28] <Burgundavia> that should go away
[12:28] <Burgundavia> and make comments and advocates clearer
[12:28] <tseng> well
[12:29] <tseng> advocates is dumb
[12:29] <tseng> there is + and -
[12:29] <Burgundavia> I had another thought regarding how packages move through the system
[12:29] <tseng> right now i dont see a way to tell if there was a problem
[12:29] <Burgundavia> if a package ends up in needs work, and new upload should move it back into new
[12:29] <Burgundavia> you like?
[12:29] <tseng> SQL doesnt understand textual comments as positive or negative based on natural language :)
[12:29] <tseng> Burgundavia: no
[12:29] <tseng> hrm
[12:29] <tseng> sure
[12:30] <tseng> how will that work, programmatically
[12:30] <tseng> if there is an upload since the last comment?
[12:30] <Burgundavia> date stamps
[12:30] <tseng> sure
[12:30] <Burgundavia> if upload date stamp is newer than advocate downcheck datestamp
[12:30] <tseng> thats my other question
[12:30] <tseng> where is the downcheck
[12:30] <tseng> oh
[12:31] <tseng> advocating -> no
[12:31] <tseng> ?
[12:31] <Burgundavia> yes
[12:31] <Burgundavia> No and Yes should turn into an icon as well
[12:31] <tseng> can it be neutral?
[12:31] <tseng> just adding to the discussion?
[12:31] <Burgundavia> that is a comment
[12:31] <tseng> i see
[12:31] <tseng> ok
[12:31] <Burgundavia> No turns in X and Yes into a check
[12:32] <Burgundavia> I also have an idea for the package page
[12:32] <Burgundavia> across the top
[12:32] <Burgundavia> Icon for if new/updated
[12:32] <Burgundavia> package name, version # and uploader
[12:32] <Burgundavia> and the the upper right, the current status
[12:32] <tseng> um
[12:33] <tseng> what if we make a comment when there is an upload
[12:33] <Burgundavia> what do you mean?
[12:33] <tseng> i upload a package
[12:33] <tseng> it makes a comment on my page automatically
[12:33] <tseng> new package uploaded $datastamp
[12:34] <tseng> with the changelog even
[12:34] <tseng> you can even add an icon if you are really into that
[12:34] <Burgundavia> why clutter comments?
[12:34] <tseng> why add icons?
[12:34] <tseng> :)
[12:34] <Burgundavia> comments should be about the package, not that there is a new version
[12:35] <tseng> i dont consider it clutter to notify of a new package as part of the thread
[12:35] <Burgundavia> maybe a history section?
[12:35] <Burgundavia> showing new uploads
[12:35] <tseng> we can just look at the changelog for that
[12:35] <tseng> no one should be making uploads w/o updating it
[12:35] <Burgundavia> not a new upload
[12:35] <Burgundavia> but a new upload to REVU
[12:36] <tseng> eh?
[12:36] <tseng> im thinking about breezy changes
[12:36] <tseng> every time i upload something, it posts the relevant bits from changelog
[12:36] <Burgundavia> yes
[12:36] <tseng> its very useful
[12:36] <tseng> (imo)
[12:36] <Burgundavia> I am talking about the packages fixes that happen on REVU before it even hits the archives
[12:37] <tseng> whats the difference
[12:37] <Burgundavia> each of those "uploads" are the same version, no?
[12:37] <tseng> im thinking of this as like a bug tracker
[12:37] <tseng> for a private archive
[12:37] <Burgundavia> ok
[12:37] <tseng> we are probably approaching this from different backgrounds :)
[12:37] <Burgundavia> but the package version number is not going to change for say http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/details.py?upid=24
[12:38] <Burgundavia> when the uploader pushes the fixes, as it is has not yet hit the archive
[12:38] <tseng> hm i guess you got me
[12:38] <tseng> he doesnt update the revision in revu
[12:38] <tseng> its all 0ubuntu1
[12:38] <Burgundavia> yes
[12:38] <Burgundavia> so REVU needs to track that
[12:38] <Burgundavia> apt doesn't care
[12:38] <tseng> bwar
[12:39] <Burgundavia> all we need is to know that the uploader has pushed a new version into REVU for reviewing
[12:39] <Burgundavia> and the date stamp will give us that
[12:39] <tseng> we should not be printing:
[12:39] <tseng> tesseracttrainer_0.1.4-1_i386.changes1k
[12:39] <tseng> thats ass
[12:39] <tseng> it should just say changelog
[12:39] <tseng> and
[12:40] <tseng> hm
[12:40] <tseng> on packages that stuff is at the bottom, not the top
[12:40] <tseng> i guess it is the first class object in our case
[12:40] <tseng> im not sure we need the filesize on most of it either
[12:40] <tseng> at least not so prominately
[12:40] <Burgundavia> yes
[12:40] <tseng> i wish i had dreamweaver or something
[12:41] <tseng> i could mock up faster than vim
[12:41] <tseng> (is anyone logging this?)
[12:41] <tseng> i talk very fast
[12:41] <ajmitch> why shouldn't the person who uploads to REVU change the version?
[12:41] <ajmitch> sure
[12:41] <ajmitch> irssi is loggin it all
[12:41] <tseng> ajmitch: because when we upload to breezy
[12:41] <Burgundavia> I log as well
[12:41] <tseng> ajmitch: it shouldnt be 0ubuntu4
[12:41] <ajmitch> why not?
[12:41] <tseng> there was no 1-2-3 in the archive
[12:41] <ajmitch> so?
[12:41] <tseng> it just.. we dont do that :)
[12:42] <tseng> we could start, I dont mind
[12:42] <tseng> i would love to have revisions and changelogs in between for revu
[12:42] <tseng> and
[12:42] <ajmitch> it doesn't look clean, but there's nothing stopping it from happening :)
[12:42] <tseng> that enforces good habits for the real tree
[12:42] <Burgundavia> it would also mean that new changelog thing would not have to be developed for revu
[12:42] <tseng> well
[12:42] <ajmitch> when I was getting packages reviewed for debian I was asked to make changes & make the version -2 instead of -1
[12:43] <tseng> it would be nice to diff changelogs
[12:43] <tseng> and show the most recent upload
[12:43] <tseng> i still like showing uploads in comments
[12:43] <ajmitch> so 0.6.4-2 would get uploaded to debian without 0.6.4-1 being in the archive
[12:43] <tseng> i see it like a thread on bugzilla
[12:43] <Burgundavia> what about having an ajax thing for the changelog
[12:43] <tseng> "package foo uploaded fixes the bug, here is changelog"
[12:43] <tseng> Burgundavia: how do you mean?
[12:44] <Burgundavia> show the changelog in the page, but not open, that opens when clicked on
[12:44] <tseng> that could be just plain JS
[12:44] <tseng> put the changelog in an invisible div
[12:44] <tseng> and toggle visibility
[12:44] <tseng> sure
[12:44] <tseng> but um
[12:44] <tseng> you can just click it atm like all the other related files
[12:44] <tseng> not sure its a big add
[12:44] <Burgundavia> true
[12:45] <Burgundavia> ok, on the package page itself
[12:45] <tseng> yep im there
[12:45] <Burgundavia> we should seperate the linda/lintian stuff, the orig and the diff/dsc stuff into three distinct sections
[12:45] <tseng> yes
[12:45] <tseng> rows in a table
[12:46] <tseng> with a tiny row underneath each one with filesize in a small font
[12:46] <tseng> if we really need it
[12:46] <Burgundavia> and date stamp them all
[12:46] <tseng> gah i need dreamweaver so bad
[12:46] <Burgundavia> tried nvu?
[12:46] <tseng> no
[12:46] <tseng> is it in breezy?
[12:46] <Burgundavia> yes
[12:46] <tseng> i need to mockup as im thinking
[12:46] <tseng> coding it would be too slow
[12:46] <tseng> the way its written.. i really dont like
[12:47] <tseng> it has templates
[12:47] <tseng> and code seperate
[12:48] <Burgundavia> http://img127.echo.cx/my.php?image=revumockup25tg.png
[12:48] <Burgundavia> that is my top bar idea for the package pag
[12:48] <Burgundavia> e
[12:49] <tseng> thats good
[12:49] <tseng> but
[12:49] <tseng> whats the difference in icons
[12:49] <tseng> (and why icons)
[12:49] <Burgundavia> icons are easy and clear
[12:49] <Burgundavia> no thinking involved
[12:50] <Burgundavia> should be New/Updated
[12:50] <Burgundavia> showing whether or not the package is already in the archives
[12:50] <tseng> if its in the archive
[12:50] <tseng> we should drop it
[12:50] <tseng> i see no reason to maintain that data once 3 motus approve
[12:50] <Burgundavia> I thought REVU was also for non-MOTU's to upload changes to existing packages?
[12:50] <tseng> is it?
[12:50] <ajmitch> yes
[12:50] <tseng> thats bollocks
[12:51] <ajmitch> unless you wanted a separate review process just for those?
[12:51] <tseng> i wouldnt want them on the same page?
[12:51] <Burgundavia> why not?
[12:51] <ajmitch> since the only difference is whether they need 3 MOTU thumbs up
[12:51] <tseng> not to hurt anyones feelings, but i dont care if a 15 year old kid can run uupdate -u
[12:51] <Burgundavia> what about people like me
[12:51] <tseng> part of the new package process is assessing a *persons* skills
[12:52] <tseng> to join motu
[12:52] <Burgundavia> I plan on doing some work with existing packages
[12:52] <ajmitch> that's great, but we're talking about fixing bugs in packages, not just new upstream versions
[12:52] <Burgundavia> those changes will need to be reviewed somwhere
[12:52] <Burgundavia> I am not 15 year old kid
[12:52] <tseng> i guess they do
[12:52] <tseng> but its more of a once-off thing
[12:52] <tseng> revu is fine
[12:53] <Burgundavia> REVU will work great
[12:53] <ajmitch> like all the Cxx transition - we needed some way to review people's work
[12:53] <Burgundavia> as this will mean that people like me don't have to go find webspace
[12:53] <Burgundavia> that was the biggest thing that held me back
[12:53] <tseng> ah good point
[12:53] <ajmitch> yes, my debian sponsor didn;t like grabbing packages at 16K/sec from my box
[12:54] <ajmitch> getting source from mentors.debian.net was far more convenient for him
[12:54] <tseng> can we put that in a seperate page?
[12:54] <tseng> or something
[12:54] <tseng> i dunno
[12:54] <tseng> you said mark them with an icon
[12:54] <tseng> if they are NEW
[12:54] <ajmitch> especially as this will be hosted at a DC, with plenty of bandwidth
[12:54] <tseng> capitol NEW meaning not in the archive
[12:55] <tseng> ok so tell me one more time why we need Archived Uploads
[12:55] <tseng> hm i know
[12:55] <tseng> but lets make it another tab
[12:56] <Burgundavia> I have no idea
[12:56] <tseng> i dog
[12:56] <tseng> do!
[12:56] <tseng> so someone can have 2 packages uploaded
[12:56] <tseng> when they are doing their 3rd
[12:56] <tseng> we can be like, hey, here are the other 2
[12:56] <tseng> they look awesome
[12:56] <ajmitch> because the MOTUToReview pacge quickly filled up with out-of-date stuff
[12:56] <tseng> lets approve him to TB as a maintainer
[12:56] <tseng> so
[12:56] <tseng> now on the main page we have one table
[12:57] <tseng> everything that is not yet uploaded
[12:57] <tseng> then
[12:57] <ajmitch> archived uploads mainly applies to changes to existing packages, imho
[12:57] <tseng> we have links across the top, tabs if you will
[12:57] <tseng> New / Needs Work / Ready for Upload / Archived
[12:57] <Burgundavia> sounds good
[12:57] <tseng> will adjust the query
[12:57] <tseng> and redraw the table
[12:57] <Burgundavia> so we need 4 icons for the status
[12:57] <tseng> yes
[12:58] <tseng> ajmitch: thirded?
[12:58] <ajmitch> ?
[12:58] <tseng> seconded, thirded
[12:58] <tseng> you know.
[12:58] <ajmitch> right..
[12:58] <ajmitch> sure
[12:59] <tseng> Burgundavia: we can use the tabs off the wiki/homepage
[12:59] <tseng> and change the text
[12:59] <tseng> for the "tabs"
[12:59] <tseng> oh man
[12:59] <tseng> and put it into the header bar
[12:59] <tseng> it wont clutter the page at all up there
[12:59] <tseng> and be easy to use
[12:59] <tseng> Burgundavia: can you put that together?
[01:00] <tseng> we'll put out login link up there too
[01:00] <tseng> exactly as on the homepage
[01:03] <Burgundavia> put which together?
[01:03] <tseng> Burgundavia: buttons for the top of the page
[01:03] <Burgundavia> you talking html and css?
[01:03] <tseng> Burgundavia: in the header
[01:03] <tseng> like on the ubuntu homepage see
[01:03] <Burgundavia> ahh
[01:03] <tseng> for our different "tabs"
[01:04] <tseng> all 4 of the
[01:04] <tseng> m
[01:04] <Burgundavia> you want me to take the buttons from the ubuntu.com page and edit them for our purposes?
[01:04] <tseng> yes
[01:04] <Burgundavia> can do
[01:04] <tseng> i imagine someone has a blank
[01:05] <ajmitch> tseng: as an aside, how's monopod looking?
[01:05] <tseng> ajmitch: the package, or the app?
[01:05] <Burgundavia> they are done using js and dvis
[01:05] <tseng> ajmitch: i fixed your nested folder, it still needs a manpage
[01:06] <tseng> Burgundavia: oh!
[01:06] <ajmitch> 1337
[01:06] <tseng> perfect
[01:07] <tseng> ok so
[01:07] <tseng> i am really excited to just plow into this as you can tell
[01:08] <tseng> but i think it might be better long term if we put all our braindump into the wiki now
[01:08] <tseng> before continuing, yes?
[01:08] <Burgundavia> yes
[01:08] <Burgundavia> REVUDevelopment?
[01:08] <tseng> sure
[01:08] <tseng> making it
[01:09] <tseng> you beat me
[01:09] <Burgundavia> already did
[01:09] <tseng> i wanst logged in
[01:09] <tseng> :P
[01:09] <tseng> ok, be my guest
[01:10] <tseng> ill see what the ubuntu stylesheet does to the page in the meantime
[01:12] <tseng> yuck :P
[01:30] <Burgundavia> do you have any idea about archive icon?
[01:32] <tseng> a zip file?
[01:32] <tseng> "archive"
[01:32] <tseng> play on the word
[01:32] <robitaille> a filing cabinet?
[01:32] <Burgundavia> http://img124.echo.cx/my.php?image=revumockup39kt.png
[01:32] <Burgundavia> those are for new and updated
[01:33] <Burgundavia> and the button row is ready to upload and needs work
[01:33] <tseng> ok
[01:33] <tseng> most of those already exist in gnome icon theme
[01:33] <tseng> in high color
[01:33] <Burgundavia> I was having fun with inkscape
[01:33] <tseng> i usually just steal them :)
[01:33] <Burgundavia> I want to avoid words and have distinct shapes for each
[01:34] <tseng> im serious
[01:34] <Burgundavia> that is why I am designing them in black and white
[01:34] <Burgundavia> I will look for ideas
[01:34] <tseng> there is a hammer, a circle, an up, and a check
[01:34] <tseng> all nicely shaped
[01:34] <tseng> if you want to make the effort though, be my guest
[01:35] <Burgundavia> where is the gnome icon them kept?
[01:36] <tseng> http://jimmac.musichall.cz/icons.php
[01:36] <tseng> most of it can be access here
[01:36] <tseng> but i will give you the icons im talking about
[01:36] <tseng> given a few minutes
[01:37] <|QuaD-> hey, whats joe gasiorek's irc name?
[01:37] <tseng> http://jimmac.musichall.cz/wipicons/gtk-stock//stock_ok.png
[01:37] <tseng> http://jimmac.musichall.cz/wipicons/gtk-stock//stock_top.png
[01:37] <tseng> those come in various sizes
[01:38] <tseng> and i think without the - on top
[01:39] <tseng> http://jimmac.musichall.cz/wipicons/anjuta//app-icon.png
[01:39] <tseng> your hammer
[01:39] <Burgundavia> http://jimmac.musichall.cz/wipicons/gtk-stock//stock_add.png
[01:39] <Burgundavia> for archived
[01:39] <tseng> one more i am looking for is
[01:39] <tseng> refresh
[01:39] <tseng> from a browser
[01:39] <Burgundavia> http://jimmac.musichall.cz/wipicons/gtk-stock//stock_refresh-blue.png
[01:39] <Burgundavia> that one
[01:40] <tseng> yes
[01:40] <Burgundavia> for updated?
[01:40] <tseng> yes
[01:40] <Burgundavia> I will update the wiki page accordingly
[01:40] <tseng> just based on your mockup
[01:40] <tseng> we dont have to use these, they are jsut burned into my brain
[01:40] <tseng> you are noticing by now that im a very odd person
[01:41] <Burgundavia> they are bold and simple
[01:41] <tseng> the archive one
[01:41] <tseng> hang ong
[01:41] <tseng> thats the wrong size
[01:41] <tseng> and not as fitting
[01:43] <tseng> http://jimmac.musichall.cz/wipicons/gtk-stock//stock_add.png
[01:43] <tseng> there is the filing cabinet
[01:43] <tseng> http://jimmac.musichall.cz/wipicons/XD2//file-manager.png
[01:43] <tseng> and larger
[01:44] <tseng> oh i have a bit of an itch
[01:44] <tseng> what if someone uploads a package
[01:44] <tseng> and we have no intention of ever approving it for some reason
[01:44] <tseng> say its not legal to distribute or its totally crack buggy
[01:45] <tseng> we havent accounted for this yet
[01:45] <Burgundavia> we need a rejected status
[01:45] <tseng> yes
[01:45] <tseng> it doesnt need to have a view really
[01:46] <tseng> but the package page should be able to handle it if you stumble on it somehow
[01:47] <Burgundavia> http://jimmac.musichall.cz/wipicons/git//im-jabber-48.png
[01:47] <Burgundavia> for new?
[01:47] <Burgundavia> new as in not yet reviewed
[01:47] <tseng> sure why not
[01:48] <tseng> these dont need to be cast in stone at all
[01:49] <Burgundavia> no
[01:50] <tseng> the different "tabs" dont need to be ajax
[01:50] <tseng> they can do a GET back to the same page
[01:51] <tseng> ajax would be not bookmarkable
[01:51] <Burgundavia> I had an idea for the status
[01:51] <tseng> since the GET happens in javascript and not an actually href
[01:51] <tseng> yeah?
[01:52] <Burgundavia> we could use sections of a circle to show show many reviews it has received (successful that is)
[01:52] <tseng> yes!
[01:53] <Burgundavia> I was wondering if you upcheck and package and pitti downchecks it, what do we do then?
[01:53] <tseng> i was wondering that too
[01:53] <tseng> but
[01:53] <Burgundavia> do we carry forward your upcheck?
[01:53] <tseng> i think 3 upchecks makes it gold
[01:54] <tseng> someone reading the bug should not give another upcheck
[01:54] <tseng> until pitti's issue is resolved
[01:54] <tseng> thats a social issue
[01:54] <tseng> we dont need to have a technical solution, i think
[01:54] <Burgundavia> so the icon would change from circle to needs work
[01:54] <tseng> yes
[01:54] <Burgundavia> ok
[01:54] <tseng> hm
[01:54] <tseng> what if
[01:55] <tseng> it stays needs work until another upload
[01:55] <tseng> to remove the downcheck
[01:55] <tseng> then it can go back to a blank circle
[01:55] <Burgundavia> that was my thought all along
[01:55] <tseng> and start over
[01:55] <Burgundavia> no reviews and fully reviewed need to be different shapes
[01:56] <Burgundavia> here is my thought for status
[01:56] <Burgundavia> no reviews --> needs work/circles --> read to upload
[01:56] <Burgundavia> no reviews as an empty circle or something completely different?
[01:58] <ajmitch> bbl
[02:02] <Burgundavia> http://jimmac.musichall.cz/wipicons/XD2//favourites-48.png
[02:02] <Burgundavia> for ready to upload?
[02:03] <tseng> yes!
[02:03] <jamessan|laptop> heh
[02:03] <tseng> daniel wont be able to help himself
[02:13] <tseng> Burgundavia: hey man, its been great working with you
[02:13] <tseng> its my dinner time here
[02:13] <tseng> ill be back in an hour or so
[02:17] <Burgundavia> ok
[02:36] <ogra> what about http://www.grawert.net/revu_icons/
[02:37] <Burgundavia> sorry
[02:37] <Burgundavia> they need to be different shapes
[02:38] <Burgundavia> our mind works that way
[02:38] <Burgundavia> THAT IS WHY THIS IS HARD TO READ
[02:38] <Burgundavia> and this is not
[02:39] <ogra> i think they are all packages with differen stati
[02:39] <ogra> different even
[02:39] <ogra> anyway, just a proposal
[02:39] <Burgundavia> indeed
[02:39] <Burgundavia> take your icons and make them black and white
[02:40] <Burgundavia> and try and tell them apart
[02:40] <ogra> that is why they are colored ;)
[02:40] <Burgundavia> ok
[02:40] <Burgundavia> look at most of the icons on your desktop
[02:41] <Burgundavia> they are different shapes
[02:41] <ogra> heh, currently not *g*
[02:41] <Burgundavia> your panel then
[02:41] <ogra> (i'm just testing the new theme...all mimetypes are missing)
[02:41] <Burgundavia> FF is a good example
[02:42] <Burgundavia> the 5 icons all have very distinctive shapes
[02:42] <Burgundavia> anyway, dinner calls
[02:47] <ogra> night all
[03:19] <tseng> Burgundavia++
[03:22] <tseng> oh man
[03:22] <tseng> http://www.novell.com/products/groupwise/
[03:22] <tseng> this flash trailer is hilarious
[03:22] <tseng> it goes too fast to really read
[03:22] <tseng> but the "selling points" are loaded with humor too
[03:25] <|QuaD-> does monodevelop not work for anyone else?
[03:25] <tseng> it works for me, obviously
[03:25] <|QuaD-> tseng: i get an infinite loop everytime i try to compile
[03:25] <|QuaD-> i think infinite loop
[03:25] <tseng> i see.
[03:25] <|QuaD-> it just starts the compile, never finnishes
[03:25] <|QuaD-> i don't know how to explain it
[03:26] <tseng> works for me, and meebey, and probably dozens more
[03:26] <|QuaD-> it doesn't leave the "performing main compilation" stage
[03:26] <|QuaD-> hmm
[03:26] <tseng> so youll need to get it to a reproduceable test case
[03:26] <tseng> and file a bug upstream
[03:26] <|QuaD-> tseng: heh, for me it never works :)
[03:35] <|QuaD-> tseng: here is what the console says when it fails (project name is asd, just a plain hello world console app for c#)
[03:35] <|QuaD-> Generating makefiles for asd
[03:35] <|QuaD-> Reading /home/derek/Projects/asd/asd.pidb
[03:35] <tseng> sorry i dont know
[03:36] <|QuaD-> tseng: alright, i am going to google osme more, i am sure someone else had this problem too
[03:36] <tseng> as i said you need to file a bug upstream if you want to pursue it
[03:36] <|QuaD-> tseng: it may be something i fubarred
[03:36] <tseng> well
[03:37] <|QuaD-> (i don't knwo what i did, but maybe0
[03:37] <tseng> removing ~/.config/Monodevelop and creaint a clean project
[03:37] <tseng> would rule that out
[03:37] <|QuaD-> thats what i did :(
[03:37] <|QuaD-> ok
[03:39] <|QuaD-> tseng: my CodeCompletionData only has one pidb file in it, is that bad?
[03:41] <tseng> not a clue
[03:49] <|QuaD-> tseng: what references should be in all apps?
[03:49] <tseng> h?
[03:49] <tseng> hm
[03:50] <|QuaD-> like System, System.xml...
[03:50] <tseng> create a clean app
[03:50] <tseng> with the gnome template
[03:50] <tseng> build it
[03:50] <tseng> it should run a window with no widgets in it
[03:50] <|QuaD-> tseng: i did, i think that was my problem, i tried with a console app, it wasn't including system
[03:52] <|QuaD-> or anything else, for that matter
[03:52] <tseng> buh
[03:54] <|QuaD-> ...
[05:14] <Burgundavia> hmm, lwn's grumby editor uses Ubuntu
[05:14] <Burgundavia> pretty easy to see when Ubuntu is being used
[05:14] <Burgundavia> as it is brown
[05:14] <Lathiat> heh
[05:15] <Lathiat> yeh
[05:15] <Lathiat> woo just got my keyboard replaced
[05:15] <jamessan> really? I thought this channel had a Slackware bias.
[05:15] <ajmitch> heh
[05:15] <Lathiat> doesnt suck now and has a spacebar that works
[05:15] <Lathiat> jamessan: ;p
[05:15] <ajmitch> jamessan: nah, we're all rabid debian zealots
[05:15] <Burgundavia> umm, low clue article ahead --> http://www.juiceenewsdaily.com/0605/news/google_mozilla.html
[05:15] <Lathiat> soicanstop typinglike this
[05:15] <jamessan> I wonder if I've finally saved enough to get my new keyboard...
[05:16] <ajmitch> Lathiat: lucky you, discovered that my power adapter for the laptop is a little broken today :)
[05:16] <ajmitch> it hopefully still works without electrocuting me
[05:17] <Lathiat> 0~9~9~~OR
[05:17] <jamessan> sweet, I have
[05:18] <jamessan> hrm, looks like Lathiat is having other typing problems now
[05:18] <jamessan> :)
[05:18] <Lathiat> haha
[05:18] <bddebian> ajmitch: Just lick the wires.. ;-P
[05:19] <jamessan> bddebian: like a big 9V battery?
[05:19] <ajmitch> bddebian: you just want to get rid of me, don't you? ;)
[05:19] <bddebian> Nah
[05:20] <bddebian> I told you I'll try to take care of you :-)
[05:20] <ajmitch> heh
[05:20] <ajmitch> there's a fair chance it'll still work
[05:27] <bddebian> w00t
[05:27] <chillywilly> *thwap* *thwap* *thwap*
[05:27] <bddebian> Heya chillywilly
[05:27] <chillywilly> hiya
[05:42] <ajmitch> hello chillywilly
[06:13] <schweeb> hello MOTUs
[06:18] <ajmitch> hey schweeb
[06:19] <schweeb> did you subscribe yourself to my wiki page intentionally, ajmitch?
[06:19] <schweeb> or are you subscribed to all personal pages?
[06:19] <schweeb> I noticed a notify email was sent when I updated today
[06:26] <ajmitch> all wiki pages :)
[06:26] <ajmitch> it helps track all the MOTU & universe changes
[06:29] <schweeb> gotcha
[06:30] <ajmitch> I already get enough mail, so wiki subscription doesn't hurt as much
[06:33] <schweeb> heh
[06:33] <schweeb> speaking of getting enough mail
[06:34] <schweeb> Lotus Notes makes my cry
[06:34] <schweeb> especially since you can't just hook up any POP or IMAP client to it
[06:34] <schweeb> you need their client, which is horrid and doesn't work
[06:36] <ajmitch> I've heard that it's quite evil
[06:37] <schweeb> if you ever visit the states, or I happen to still be using Notes by the time the next Ubuntu con is on (hopefully I'm MOTU and available to go next time) I'll show it to you... you will weep
[06:41] <ajmitch> no thanks ;)
[06:43] <Burgundavia> I had to use a call management system at my old job
[06:43] <Burgundavia> it was a home brew thing
[06:43] <Burgundavia> worst web interface I think i have ever seen
[06:53] <schweeb> Burgundavia: well, Notes is better than our ticket/incident management system
[06:54] <schweeb> Peregrine ServiceCenter is utterly horrible
[06:54] <Burgundavia> I think sticks would have been better than our call management system
[06:56] <schweeb> hrm
[06:56] <schweeb> the newer versions of service center look bearable
[06:56] <Burgundavia> I hope the malone starts shaping up RSN
[07:19] <hondje> Hi smart guys.  Why can I run ethereal using sudo in a terminal without a problem, but using it from a menu using (I'm assuming) gksudo doesn't work, and requires a real root account?
[07:26] <Burgundavia> hondje, that is a better issue to be filed in a bug report or debugged in #ubuntu
[07:26] <hondje> okay, thanks :)
[08:51] <robitaille> \sh:  thanks for your jabber server.  I registered an account tonight.
[08:52] <\sh> robitaille: encountered some really nice pitfalls with the transports so I disabled the transports until I fix the transports upstream source
[08:52] <\sh> (icq, msn, aim)
[08:52] <\sh> coffee
[08:53] <robitaille> \sh:  not using any transports (yet).  So I'll be fine for now
[09:12] <\sh> robitaille: I was using them and the transports have problems with utf8 characters...and those transports bugging the session manager and router processes of the jabberd2 and then: crash..
[09:47] <DanielN_atw> how can i read out mysql blobs?
[10:23] <DanielN_atw> \sh, ping :)
[10:23] <highvoltage> DanielN_atw: everybody's sleeping :)
[10:26] <DanielN_atw> highvoltage, not \sh i think.. he's in the same timezone as me.. and here its 10:26 am
[10:26] <DanielN_atw> :)
[10:26] <highvoltage> where are you, south africa?
[10:26] <DanielN_atw> switzerland
[10:27] <highvoltage> ah.
[10:27] <DanielN_atw> :)
[10:29] <\sh> DanielN_atw: pong
[10:30] <DanielN_atw> \sh, sorry, i forgot to show up the techboard weeking on tuesday
[10:30] <\sh> DanielN_atw: yes...next time
[10:30] <DanielN_atw> but i had my "jahresabschlussprfungen" and so i forgot it ;>
[10:31] <DanielN_atw> i'll ping you later again.. have some probs with fixing libyehia ;>
[10:32] <DanielN_atw> but now it's smoking time
[01:36] <tseng> hi
[01:37] <\sh> moins tseng
[01:37] <tseng> i just made my monitor 75dpi
[01:37] <tseng> man
[01:37] <tseng> everyone is all like, go up
[01:37] <tseng> down is nice
[01:38] <tseng> much smaller fonts
[01:56] <Lathiat> tseng: heh i look at 96dpi which is really 129dpi so tahts probably about the same, it is nice
[01:56] <Lathiat> tseng: 1680x1050@15.4"
[01:56] <tseng> well
[01:56] <tseng> i dont entirely understand it
[01:56] <tseng> but i think if i fix my X config to be at 96dpi instead of 75dpi
[01:56] <tseng> i will get tiny fonts at "correct" dpi
[01:57] <Lathiat> i jus tset it in the gnome settings
[01:57] <tseng> before X thought it was 75dpi, and gnome drew 96dpi fonts
[01:57] <Lathiat> whatever that does
[01:57] <tseng> if they are both 96
[01:57] <tseng> i bet it would look nice
[01:57] <tseng> i need a ruler to do it
[01:57] <Lathiat> nvidia driver fixes up X's DPI for me
[01:57] <tseng> i cant find the dimensions for my monitor
[01:57] <Lathiat> autodetects the size etc
[01:57] <tseng> < ati
[01:57] <Lathiat> yeh this is a laptop lcd too
[01:57] <Lathiat> so
[03:58] <kiko> hey there
[03:58] <kiko> who can give a vino bug some love?
[04:14] <mgalvin> i just put a new version of cegui on my site for review, its version 0.3.0, just released today
[04:14] <mgalvin> i will be build ogre3d against this today
[04:16] <siretart> mgalvin: consider uploading to revu ;)
[04:17] <mgalvin> siretart, i just send you my key so you can add me as an uploader right?
[04:18] <siretart> nothing here yet..
[04:18] <siretart> whats your gpgid?
[04:18] <mgalvin> i meant, is that all i have to do?
[04:19] <siretart> yes
[04:19] <siretart> tell me your gnupg id your using for signing your uploads
[04:19] <siretart> you are using, even..
[04:19] <mgalvin> i just emailed it to you
[04:19] <mgalvin> its on it way
[04:19] <siretart> ok
[04:21] <siretart> mgalvin: I added you to the keyring.
[04:21] <siretart> mgalvin: please try to get your key signed by someone in the strong set
[04:22] <siretart> for revu your key is ok, but you'll need it for ubuntu anyway
[04:22] <mgalvin> ok, thnx, i will do
[04:29] <siretart> no problem. just upload now to revu as instructed on the wiki page
[04:37] <tseng> siretart: did you see our wiki page from yesterday?
[04:38] <tseng> siretart: burgandiva and i specced some improvements to the ui
[04:48] <siretart> tseng: not yet, looking
[04:48] <siretart> tseng: which wiki page?
[04:48] <tseng> REVUDevelopment
[04:48] <tseng> but
[04:49] <mgalvin> siretart, what did you set my revu password to? and can i change it once i log in?
[04:49] <tseng> i dont think its written in such a way that you know what we are talking about
[04:50] <siretart> tseng: sweeet! I love the icons! :) (sistpoty too *g*)
[04:50] <siretart> mgalvin: I didn't set it yet. will mail it to you encrypted after your first upload
[04:51] <mgalvin> siretart, ok
[04:52] <siretart> tseng: I took a glance at the backlog with your discussion, I think we have similar ideas
[04:54] <siretart> tseng: but, I don't think "updating" an upload is a good idea. sistpoty and me have been discussion abount "joining" or "merging" uploads. the details page would have then links to "related" packages, with possibility to display debdiffs between them
[04:54] <siretart> so no need for "updating" uploads
[04:58] <siretart> tseng: what do you think?
[05:03] <tseng> siretart: uh
[05:03] <tseng> siretart: debdiff++
[05:03] <tseng> as far as seperate pages
[05:03] <tseng> wtf?
[05:04] <siretart> btw, where did you get the sweet icons from?
[05:04] <tseng> gnome icon theme
[05:04] <tseng> and gtk stock
[05:04] <siretart> ah. :)
[05:04] <tseng> we need to have a way to view a users history too
[05:05] <tseng> so we can quickly see someones past uploads when they come to TB
[05:05] <siretart> what do you count as users history? only the uploads he did?
[05:05] <tseng> yes links to his uploads
[05:05] <tseng> its not important for current motus
[05:05] <tseng> but for new people
[05:05] <siretart> that would be possible with a new page, userinfo.py perhaps
[05:05] <siretart> all information needed should already be in the db..
[05:06] <tseng> yep
[05:06] <siretart> great idea with users history, btw
[05:07] <tseng> thanks
[06:08] <DanielN> ree
[06:10] <DanielN> wb \sh
[06:10] <DanielN> :)
[06:14] <\sh> *grmpf*
[06:14] <\sh> just finishing up my jabberd2
[06:14] <\sh> migrated the jabberd2 db from mysql to postgres
[06:15] <DanielN> nice :)
[06:15] <DanielN> why? what sucks on mysql?
[06:17] <ogra> mysql is for beginners ;)
[06:17] <DanielN> lol
[06:17] <\sh> DanielN: utf8 support etc. is in mysql very shiddy implemented...
[06:17] <DanielN> err
[06:17] <ogra> you cant do views (does it know joins now ?) date and time functions are nonstandard etc
[06:17] <\sh> ogra: innerjoins yes
[06:17] <DanielN> yeah
[06:18] <DanielN> hate these sql shit since i had my prfung in relational databses :/
[06:19] <ogra> mysql is easier in the beginning, but if you need advanced functionallity like oracle or other big DB engines offer, you will switc to postgres most likely...
[06:19] <mgalvin> i cannot build cegui 0.3.0 under a pbuilder for breezy b/c freeglut3-dev will not install b/c of libdevil-dev: Depends: libdevil1 (= 1.6.7-4) but it is not going to be installed
[06:19] <DanielN> yeah? but it's not really common for webspace hosters
[06:19] <DanielN> :/
[06:19] <mgalvin> should i just open a bug in malone?
[06:21] <ivoks> howdy folks! :)
[06:21] <DanielN> wuehh :)
[06:21] <ogra> hey ivoks
[06:21] <ivoks> feel free to comment :) ivoks.blog.hr :)
[06:22] <ivoks> DanielN: how is packaging going?
[06:22] <DanielN> phone
[06:23] <DanielN> ivoks, it's cool
[06:23] <DanielN> some problems with yehia atm
[06:24] <DanielN> see ya later
[06:25] <ivoks> ok, bye :)
[06:26] <\sh> ivoks: yes
[06:26] <ivoks> \sh: yes what? :)
[06:26] <\sh> ivoks: r u aggregated on the planet?
[06:26] <\sh> ivoks: jabber component
[06:26] <ivoks> \sh: nope
[06:27] <ivoks> \sh: yeah, we should do that!
[06:27] <ivoks> i almost buyed Jabber programming
[06:27] <\sh> ivoks: ping jdub :) and ogra for a nice hackergotchi ,-)
[06:27] <ivoks> ogra: seems to be here :)
[06:27] <ogra> ivoks, send me a picture, i can make a hackergotchi ...
[06:28] <ivoks> ok, will do that...
[06:28] <\sh> ogra: do the hackergotchi also for daniel robbitaile :)
[06:28] <ogra> he has one
[06:28] <ogra> he just needs to send it jdub
[06:29] <\sh> ogra: yeah, but not a nice one ;)
[06:29] <ogra> his choice... i make hackergohis for everyone who asks :)
[06:30] <Nafallo> ogra: good to know :-)
[06:30] <ogra> :)
[06:31] <Nafallo> much less security required :-P
[06:32] <Nafallo> and nicer people, that you might even have a chance to meet face-to-face :-)
[06:35] <\sh> "much less security required?"
[06:35] <Nafallo> \sh: yepp :-). the scene get's busted all over the globe atm ;-).
[06:35] <Nafallo> \sh: I wouldn't run into that with ubuntu I'm sure ;-)
[06:36] <ivoks> grr..
[06:36] <ivoks> evolution should have "n" for next message
[06:36] <ivoks> not . :)
[06:36] <ivoks> or both
[06:36] <Nafallo> ivoks: indeed
[06:36] <Nafallo> ivoks: "."?
[06:36] <ivoks> it easy to fix
[06:36] <ivoks> Nafallo: yes, pressing . goes to next unread
[06:37] <Nafallo> ivoks: not here.
[06:37] <Nafallo> ivoks: I have ]  :-/
[06:37] <ivoks> well, it should :)
[06:37] <ivoks> hm...
[06:37] <Nafallo> i.e. CTRL+ALT GR+9 :-P
[06:37] <ivoks> ?
[06:38] <Nafallo> ]  on swedish keyboard is that keycombo :-P
[06:38] <ivoks> haha
[06:38] <ivoks> i use US
[06:38] <Nafallo> more than a bit irritating ;-)
[06:38] <ivoks> i hate hr keymap
[06:38] <Nafallo> what I really would love is the tbird way ;-)
[06:39] <ivoks> with n?
(being at the end)<space)(next msg) :-)
[06:39] <ivoks> :)
[06:40] <JanC> it's not the thunderbird way, other apps have been doing that for ages
[06:41] <Nafallo> JanC: for me it's the tbird way of reading mail ;-)
[06:41] <Nafallo> JanC: before ubuntu I mostly used cli ;-)
[06:41] <ivoks> Nafallo: sudo vim /usr/share/evolution/2.4/ui/evolution-mail-message.xml
[06:41] <Nafallo> ivoks: baah :-P
[06:42] <ivoks> line 243
[06:42] <Nafallo> aha
[06:42] <ivoks> keybindings :)
[06:43] <Nafallo> there is no way I could do that just for the user I guess? :-)
[06:43] <ivoks> why?
[06:43] <ivoks> you can have multiple keybindings for same action
[06:43] <Nafallo> I don't like being outside of /home if I can avoid it :-)
[06:43] <ivoks> Nafallo: well, i guess it's possible
[06:43] <JanC> Nafallo : some cli programs do that too I think ?
[06:44] <JanC> like 'less'  :)
[06:44] <Nafallo> JanC: hehe, like less yes :-)
[06:44] <Nafallo> JanC: but that one doesn't switch to new message ;-)
[06:46] <Nafallo> ivoks: hmm, I'll stick to *Control*period ;-)
[06:46] <Nafallo> baah
[07:34] <\sh> i will lay down for 1 1/2 hour...
[07:34] <\sh> bbl
[07:46] <slomo> hi... how do i package something which is released only as tar.bz2 upstream? dpkg-source insists in creating a tar.gz
[07:48] <bddebian> Howdy
[07:51] <highvoltage> howdy
[08:33] <\sh> slomo: repackage
[08:44] <\sh> sh*****
[08:44] <\sh> i install now ejabberd
[08:47] <\sh> and for that i have to recompile ejabberd-0.9.1-1
[10:19] <mgalvin> siretart, ping
[10:22] <bradb> hey motu
[10:23] <tseng> hi.
[10:23] <bradb> usability survey: https://staging.ubuntu.com/products/malone/+bugs -- what do you guys thing of the changes that have so far been made on this page? (disclaimer: i suck at CSS, it'll need a bit of mpt love)
[10:24] <tseng> on the css note
[10:24] <tseng> its hard to quickly see the different between columns
[10:24] <tseng> and i like to alternate row colors slightly
[10:24] <tseng> the sidebar, much better
[10:25] <tseng> useful actions
[10:25] <bradb> tseng: what's more asthetically pleasing to you, that "sidebar" look, or the portlets we normally use?
[10:26] <siretart> mgalvin: pong
[10:26] <tseng> the sidebar
[10:26] <bradb> also: https://staging.ubuntu.com/distros/ubuntu/+bugs
[10:26] <tseng> holy crap, assign to me
[10:27] <tseng> uh
[10:27] <tseng> users are such tools
[10:27] <tseng> "Ubuntu mythtv New Critical High Matt Zimmerman"
[10:27] <tseng> MY BUG IS TEH CRITICALZ
[10:27] <bradb> warning: this is only staging, so make sure you do your fix on prod ;)
[10:28] <tseng> oh..
[10:28] <bradb> i believe the data is the same though
[10:28] <tseng> its time for me to go home really
[10:28] <bradb> ok
[10:28] <bradb> who else should i bug about the malone UI...
[10:29] <tseng> Burgundavia, ogra if they have time
[10:29] <bradb> Burgundavia!
[10:29] <ogra> :)
[10:29] <bradb> ogra!
[10:29] <ogra> thanks
[10:29] <tseng> bye.
[10:29] <bradb> later tseng
[10:29] <ogra> bradb, i'm about to leave for dinner with sabdfl, mdz, almo and JaneW
[10:29] <bradb> ok
[10:29] <ogra> heh, s/almo/elmo
[10:30] <bradb> Burgundavia's a usability nut. i'm sure he has something to say.
[10:30] <mgalvin> siretart, any chance of getting a password for revu, i wanted to reply to a comment?
[10:30] <mgalvin> i uploaded 4 packages
[10:31] <\sh> ok..ejabber + all migrations doine
[10:31] <ogra> bradb, absolutely and you can trust his judgement...
[10:31] <ogra> ...mostly :)
[10:31] <sistpoty> mgalvin: send a gpg-signed mail to siretart
[10:31] <sistpoty> mgalvin: with your password in it ;)
[10:31] <Burgundavia> right here
[10:31] <bradb> !
[10:32] <siretart> mgalvin: just a moment.. (wlan very unreliable here)
[10:32] <bradb> Burgundavia: https://staging.ubuntu.com/distros/ubuntu/+bugs (disclaimer 1: this is staging, not production. disclaimer 2: i suck at CSS; it needs some mpt love)
[10:32] <\sh> ogra: greetings to all :) and don't eat beef ;)
[10:32] <mgalvin> sistpoty, i sent him my info before, but he asked that I upload a package first
[10:32] <bradb> what do you think of the changes that have been made to that page as compared to the last time you saw it?
[10:32] <siretart> btw, there was a bug in the process_upload script, the nvidia-cg wasn't processed correctly. Will do manually
[10:32] <mgalvin> siretart, ok
[10:32] <Burgundavia> first thought: I worry about how it looks at 800x600
[10:32] <ogra> \sh, i'm to crazy already, uk beef wont harm me :)
[10:32] <Burgundavia> as it just wide enough on my screen to show all useful info
[10:32] <\sh> ogra: ehe :)
[10:33] <Burgundavia> I have 1280x1024
[10:33] <bradb> true
[10:33] <ogra> guys ! mae wants to build anjuta2 for us, please lend a hand :)
[10:33] <Burgundavia> bradb, this would be the page for any product?
[10:34] <Burgundavia> generally, vertical scrolling is far better than horizontal scrolling
[10:34] <bradb> it's the distro page. the upstream page is: https://staging.ubuntu.com/products/malone/+bugs (forgive me if my lp maintainer terminology sounds different to what terms you use to refer to these things)
[10:34] <Burgundavia> as we have a mouse wheel
[10:35] <Burgundavia> bradb, but say I was looking for bugs on, say, the Gimp, would it also display a page like this?
[10:35] <bradb> Burgundavia: when we add the sourcepackage-specific view, yes. that should be coming along in a few days.
[10:35] <Burgundavia> what about placing the side bar at the bottom, as a horizontal bar?
[10:35] <bradb> (er, merged into the codebase. might take longer to actually be rolled out)
[10:36] <Burgundavia> it also feels "crammed"
[10:36] <ogra> night all
[10:36] <Burgundavia> like I have to strain to look at the beginning of it
[10:36] <Burgundavia> the id column
[10:37] <bradb> at the bottom eh...interesting
[10:37] <siretart> mgalvin: you got mail
[10:37] <Burgundavia> the top right might be another good place
[10:37] <bradb> Burgundavia: why at the bottom and not at the top or where it's currently placed?
[10:37] <Burgundavia> just throwing ideas around
[10:38] <Burgundavia> I want the page to be no wider than the table
[10:38] <Burgundavia> you could have a status bar at the top
[10:38] <Burgundavia> showing the package being tracked and the number of bugs filed for it
[10:39] <Burgundavia> because at the top currently you have 3 places with the word "malone"
[10:40] <Burgundavia> to be honest, I could care less that I am using the malone bug tracker
[10:40] <bradb> heh, interesting point
[10:40] <Burgundavia> what i care about is that I am looking at bugs, and for what package
[10:42] <\sh> wow
[10:42] <\sh> done
[10:42] <bradb> anyone else, support or disagree with what Burgundavia said?
[10:51] <ups> bradb, on 800x600 the right-side bar overlaps the content; on the bug page i get a horiz scrollbar
[10:52] <bradb> ups: right. what would you expect to happen when you shrink your browser to 800 x 600?
[10:53] <ups> bradb, are you using ems for the layout?
[10:54] <ups> bradb, btw, i have an old monitor - i can only run 800x600 on it
[10:54] <Burgundavia> I had a thought just now
[10:54] <Burgundavia> what about making the options tabs
[10:54] <Burgundavia> and then use ajax for fast switching
[10:55] <Burgundavia> thoughts on that?
[10:55] <Burgundavia> not tabs in the browser, but tabs on the page
[10:55] <sivang> ajax?
[10:55] <bradb> ups: what's ems?
[10:55] <Burgundavia> asyncronous javascript and xml
[10:55] <JanC> ajax is a fancy buzzword for javascritp  :)
[10:55] <Burgundavia> gmail and google maps, basically
[10:56] <bradb> how well supported is that?
[10:56] <Burgundavia> quite
[10:56] <Burgundavia> any standards compliant browser can do it
[10:56] <Burgundavia> even IE can
[10:56] <ups> bradb, ems is a relative unit, it works like % - you specify relative dimensions as with %
[10:57] <Burgundavia> basically makes web apps more rich, more like standalone programs
[10:57] <JanC> there are some javascript libraries for this that fix all the browser quirks for you
[10:58] <Burgundavia> you should also use ajax for fast column sorting, but that is another matter
[10:58] <bradb> is ems different from ajax? i get the feeling it is.
[10:59] <sivang> oh it's like making a desktop application "alike" from a web page
[10:59] <JanC> ajax is javascript using http get to get data from the server
[11:00] <Burgundavia> means you avoid all that icky loading crap
[11:00] <JanC> and then dynamically changing the page with that data
[11:00] <ups> bradb, ems is just a unit like px, pt etc.
[11:00] <Burgundavia> without resorting to using java or flash
[11:00] <JanC> people have been doing this for years  :)
[11:00] <bradb> how is ajax different from xml-rpc?
[11:01] <Burgundavia> http://weblogs.java.net/blog/analogueboy/archive/2005/04/ajax_and_xmlrpc.html
[11:02] <Burgundavia> bradb, I have to run, as life calls, but I think I have given most of the my ideas already. PM me is want anything further
[11:02] <bradb> sounds good, thanks for the feedback and url
[11:07] <Burgundavia> bradb, further note, while I am on my way out, change total reported to all and have it the first link/tab
[11:07] <sh> lol
[11:08] <sh> irc via tkabber und einem irc transport
[11:08] <\sh> oops..and a irc transport ;)
[11:08] <bradb> Burgundavia: ok. i can't promise that we'll make all these changes, but i can promise that we're listening to what you're saying you want and taking those needs into consideration for the grand scheme of things with the UI.
[11:08] <Burgundavia> indeed
[11:08] <Burgundavia> I am not the only crazy UI person involved with Ubuntu
[11:09] <bradb> Burgundavia: besides mpt, who are the other usability geeks in the house?
[11:09] <Burgundavia> tseng is pretty good
[11:10] <ups> bradb, you should look at ems - it is a part of standard css, and it avoids hardcoding pixel-sizes into the web page
[11:10] <bradb> tseng has given good feedback thus far, to be sure
[11:10] <ups> bradb, and hence you won't have to worry about different resolutions
[11:10] <bradb> indeed
[11:11] <bradb> when i said i sucked at CSS, i meant it :P
[11:11] <ups> :)
[11:11] <ups> it is used a lot
[11:12] <bradb> luckily, i don't normally have to write any CSS. it's mpt who does that most often, so i'll discuss the issue with him and see what his recommendation is, ems, etc.
[11:12] <ups> sure, thx
[11:12] <ups> i'm sure he knows about it :)
[11:12] <bradb> yup
[11:13] <ups> can i /msg you with an example site?
[11:14] <bradb> sure, by all means
[11:21] <tseng> bradb: is this the first mpt is working on malone?
[11:22] <bradb> no. he's been working on Malone since December when he came to Montreal to work with kiko and me on spec'ing out the entire UI
[11:22] <siretart> bradb: Who can I contact with problems with launchpad/wiki? I changed my email adress in the launchpad, now I don't get any wiki page subscriptions anymore
[11:22] <siretart> bradb: wiki is telling me to set my email adress in preferences, but there is no field email :(
[11:22] <bradb> siretart: interesting, one sec, let me see if i can get someone for you.
[11:25] <siretart> in fact, I first merged 2 accounts and then changed the email adress
[11:25] <\sh> off to bed..cu tomorrow
[11:26] <siretart> gn8 \sh_away
[11:27] <bradb> siretart: ok, i've passed on that information, so we'll see what the cabal says
[11:28] <siretart> bradb: thanks a lot!
[11:28] <siretart> bradb: in general, what would the contact adress be with such issues? in case someone asks me
[11:29] <bradb> there's no launchpad users ML right now, unfortunately :/ if anything, you could file a bug in Launchpad and we'll see it
[11:29] <bradb> but i think a users list is on the way; i just updated a spec on the UdU wiki yesterday to make note of the need for it
[11:29] <bradb> i.e. http://udu.wiki.ubuntu.com/LaunchpadAndUbuntuCommunity
[11:29] <siretart> ah, ok
[11:30] <bradb> (er, a couple days ago, but anyway)
[11:33] <tseng> bradb: thats sort of a funny title
[11:34] <tseng> id say im a pretty prominent community member and i still dont have a handle on alot of what launchpad is doing
[11:34] <tseng> just an observation
[11:36] <bradb> indeed. i'd be confused too, if i didn't work on launchpad. i think the spec addresses that issue and points at it as one of the things that really needs to be addressed.
[11:36] <bradb> (in the "Webpage" section)