[12:06] <thierry> thanks it worked fine my patch is posted now
[12:15] <Mez> can someone tell me what wer the libglu changes?
[12:15] <Mez> lamont explained ewarlier but I forgot
[12:16] <tseng> so scroll up
[12:17] <Mez> It was a while back and I've rebooted a few times
[12:17] <Mez> pulling up logs and scanning is a pain in the ass
[12:17] <tseng> 08:15 < lamont> I'd probably just use libglu-dev-xorg. :-)
[12:17] <tseng> like this?
[12:20] <Mez> yeah 
[02:07] <tiglionabbit> hey guys, I have a user interface improvement to propose
[02:08] <tiglionabbit> in synaptic, remove that checkbox that determines whether disabled repositories are shown or not, and make it always true.  It just makes things more confusing for people
[04:50] <daniels> lamont: !!
[05:29] <davyd> daniels: where is xorg -35 ?
[05:32] <daniels> davyd: it's with the beer you bought me
[05:32] <daniels> hey, wait, you haven't bought me any beer ...
[05:33] <davyd> heh, you haven't made it work yet ;)
[05:36] <schweeb> feel free to send some beer my way too :)
[06:03] <rob^> does anyone know what the release after breezy will be called?
[06:05] <schweeb> don't think that's really decided upon until closer to the release of breezy
[06:05] <schweeb> there is going to be grumpy, which is going to be a highly unstable branch, I believe
[06:06] <tiglionabbit> Grumpy what?  Giraffe?
[06:06] <rob^> ah ok. thanks.
[06:06] <schweeb> groundhog
[06:06] <tiglionabbit> hehe
[06:09] <wasabi> So... when upgrading from one package version to another, how does dpkg handle it? Does it extract the new one on top of the old, or clean the old files out of the way first?
[08:29] <infinity> wasabi : policy has a description of how unpack works, but essentially, the new package is unpacked, then any old files that exist in A but not B are removed.  This leads to some rather interesting effects, if you're tying to do crazy things.
[08:30] <Saba_Z> whois Saba
[10:22] <dholbach> hi
[10:23] <Treenaks> hi dholbach 
[10:26] <dholbach> does anybody know why wxwidgets2.5 packages show up on http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/w/wxwidgets2.5/ but are not accessible via apt?
[10:28] <Treenaks> dholbach: when were they compiled?
[10:29] <dholbach> argl: 29-Mar-2005 - that's hoary
[10:29] <jsgotangco> dholbach!
[10:30] <dholbach> hey jerome!
[10:31] <jsgotangco> what are you doing this fine sunday morning on irc?
[10:31] <dholbach> i was asking if somebody knew the state of wxwidgets
[10:31] <dholbach> but i need to get back to some thesis hacking :)
[10:31] <dholbach> (and dog walking)
[10:31] <dholbach> how are you?
[10:31] <jsgotangco> ahh
[10:32] <jsgotangco> oh i finally got my laptop back and just finished rebuilding my system
[10:32] <dholbach> you have it all working?
[10:32] <jsgotangco> oh yeah good thing i made a backup last friday
[10:33] <jsgotangco> other than that, i'm with daughter watching this crazy kiddie vcd we bought yesterday
[10:33] <dholbach> hehe
[10:33] <dholbach> sounds like you're having fun
[10:34] <jsgotangco> its claymation
[10:34] <jsgotangco> and it also has a Penguin for a character
[10:34] <dholbach> *snigger* :)
[10:35] <jsgotangco> its called "Pingu"
[10:35] <jsgotangco> i even used it as my hostname heh
[10:35] <dholbach> :)
[10:37] <dholbach> *dog walking*
[10:39] <jsgotangco> i'll brb as well
[10:42] <tiglionabbit> I'm having a really weird problem with Totem
[10:57] <siretart> does anyone know what could be the problem why NMU's in Debian are not autosync'd?
[10:57] <tseng> nothing is being autosynced at this poing
[10:57] <tseng> point
[10:57] <siretart> tseng: the NMU was pre sarge, but has not shown up in breezy
[10:58] <tseng> is there an ubuntu version?
[10:58] <tseng> XubuntuY
[10:59] <siretart> no, there isnt
[10:59] <siretart> it's "wmaker"
[10:59] <siretart> breezy has 0.91.0-7, debian sarge has 0.91.0-7.2
[11:00] <daniels> tseng: hm, I thought mom was active
[11:00] <tseng> beats me
[11:00] <tseng> daniels: uvh was days ago, id imagine not
[11:00] <siretart> according to http://changelog.debian.net/wmaker, I think we should import the debian version
[11:00] <tseng> siretart: you need elmo, then
[11:00] <siretart> ok
[11:00] <tseng> and possibly freeze approval
[11:01] <daniels> tseng: er, good point.  but it would've been active before then ...
[11:01] <tseng> (thumbs up from mdz)
[11:01] <daniels> well, mdz or kamion
[11:03] <siretart> btw for bugfixing/merging, #12329 is about merges in package diveintopython, I had a look at it, no real changes necessary, package at http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/details.py?upid=97, if anyone cares to upload... ;)
[11:03] <siretart> and, ah, diveintopython is main
[11:03] <tiglionabbit> hey guys.  I have a very bizarre problem with totem, and I was wondering if any of you could help me sort it out
[11:04] <tiglionabbit> or at least help me understand why this happens
[11:07] <tiglionabbit> When I run totem, the video appears very bright and low quality.  Then, any media player I launch after that (gxine, xine-ui, mplayer, vlc) gets the same problem, until I kill my X session and log in again.  Firefox+mozilla-mplayer is not affected by this problem
[11:22] <sivang> hey all
[11:22] <siretart> hi sivang 
[11:22] <sivang> hey siretart , I eventually succeded setting up my pbuilder
[11:23] <siretart> sivang: cool! :)
[11:23] <sivang> siretart: now to roll on with the xorg transaction, should I just attemp to install apps and see if they breaks to the lib change?
[11:24] <siretart> sivang: I think this would be best.. ye
[11:24] <siretart> s
[11:24] <sivang> siretart: but a stupid question :-) how do I know which packages supposed to fail? 
[11:27] <siretart> sivang: I not sure, either. I would try with dctrl-grep searching for packages build depending on the old mesa packages and then checking lamont's buildlogs
[11:27] <tiglionabbit> can anyone figure out or explain to me what could be happening with totem?  Sorry to bother the devs with this..
[11:27] <siretart> sivang: but lets move to #ubuntu-motu
[11:31] <sivang> siretart: sure :-)
[11:44] <dholbach> siretart: you won't need freeze approval for a universe package
[11:45] <dholbach> hey tseng, daniels, sivang, siretart :)
[11:45] <siretart> huhu dholbach 
[11:45] <siretart> dholbach: perhaps you can help us out, do you know what should the build dependencies look like for opengl applications?
[11:46] <dholbach> siretart: what's the build error message?
[11:47] <siretart> dholbach: http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/b/bzflag/2.0.2.20050318ubuntu1/
[11:47] <siretart> as an example
[11:47] <siretart> it builds with build depending on libglu-dev-xorg, but this seems to me a bit too strict
[11:48] <siretart> looking at other packages "xlibmesa-gl-dev | libgl-dev, libglu-dev-xorg | libglu-dev" seems to be a safe bet
[11:48] <siretart> hi Mez 
[11:49] <Mez> hey siretart
[11:49] <siretart> Mez: I just tried frozen-bubble, it works without any rebuild
[11:49] <Mez> does it /
[11:49] <siretart> for me, in my breezy chroot
[11:49] <Mez> must have just been what would have been a deopwait then
[11:50] <dholbach> xlibmesa-gl-dev and xlibmesa-glu-dev are of different version and source packages - they conflict
[11:51] <dholbach> at least that's what i see on first glance
[11:51] <siretart> there seems to be quite a big confusion about these dependencies
[11:51] <dholbach> siretart: try removing the gl crack, wait for the build error message and add a new build-depends based on that (missing headers or linking error) ;-)
[11:52] <siretart> dholbach: I already uploaded sdlperl with only build depending on libglu-dev-xorg and no alternatives
[11:52] <siretart> hi Kamion 
[11:52] <dholbach> Mez: it was libsdl-perl - frozen-bubble didn't need a rebuild
[11:52] <siretart> dholbach: this works, but I'm not sure if thats not too strict
[11:53] <dholbach> i guess it depends on the package
[11:55] <vedran> anyone care to help a packaging newbie :)
[11:55] <dholbach> vedran: #ubuntu-motu is the place you want to be :)
[11:55] <ogra> hey vedran
[11:55] <vedran> ok tnx
[11:56] <dholbach> hey ogra 
[11:56] <ogra> hi dholbach 
[12:04] <mpt> tiglionabbit: thanks for the synaptic suggestion
[12:04] <mpt> siretart: does frozen-bubble have sound in Breezy?
[12:04] <tiglionabbit> oo yay, thanks for reading that.  I said that ages ago though
[12:04] <mpt> tiglionabbit: I'm slow.
[12:04] <siretart> mpt: for me, yes. I tried it half an hour ago
[12:05] <tiglionabbit> ages meaning 12 hours
[12:05] <mpt> siretart: Awesome, that's the killer reason for me to upgrade
[12:05] <tiglionabbit> anyway, can anyone help me understand why totem is screwing up my video players?
[12:06] <ogra> mpt LOL
[12:06] <tiglionabbit> frozen bubble has sound for me right now
[12:06] <HiddenWolf> mpt, LOL
[12:06] <siretart> mpt: I started it in a chroot, though!
[12:08] <tiglionabbit> would anyone like to hear about it?
[12:09] <dholbach> tiglionabbit: why don't you write it to the mailing list? nobody here seems to have an idea
[12:09] <tiglionabbit> I put something on the forums
[12:10] <tiglionabbit> which mailing list?
[12:10] <thom> anyone know how to make ant use gcj as the compiler?
[12:10] <dholbach> thom: wasabi or doko will know for sure
[12:10] <dholbach> tiglionabbit: ubuntu-users@lists.ubuntu.com
[12:10] <thom> dholbach: nod; but wrong time for wasabi and i've not seen doko yet today
[12:10] <dholbach> thom: jbailey maybe?
[12:11] <ogra> thom, he's around occasionally... 
[12:11] <ogra> (doko)
[12:12] <thom> ogra: he's also at debconf; when i say "haven't seen him", i mean it literally ;-)
[12:12] <dholbach> hehe
[12:12] <Kamion> siretart: morning
[12:12] <dholbach> Kamion: hi Colin
[12:12] <Kamion> hey
[12:13] <siretart> huhu
[12:21] <rubenv> say, euh, are the daily cd images for breezy broken?
[12:21] <rubenv> looks like only powerpc got generated
[12:23] <Kamion> entirely possible, I'll look
[12:23] <Kamion> it happens
[12:24] <ogra> thom, heh
[12:25] <Kamion> huh, it *looks* OK ...
[12:26] <Kamion> oh, I know, I think two CD builds collided
[12:26] <ogra> Kamion, vedran is working for us on the lightweight desktop side, he wants to make it possible to run a minimal ubuntu on pI 133/32MB, any chances for a lighweight installer that makes this possible ? 
[12:26] <Kamion> ogra: more details required
[12:26] <ogra> Kamion, up to vedran ;)
[12:26] <Kamion> ogra: may be able to do lowmem tweaks, sure
[12:26] <ogra> Kamion, i just wanted to get you two in connection....
[12:27] <ogra> vedran, ?
[12:27] <Kamion> 32MB isn't considered lowmem by Debian, but 2.4 is a bit lighter on memory consumption
[12:27] <Kamion> I think I tried to get 32MB working on Ubuntu a while back and failed
[12:27] <ogra> yes, but we dont ship 2.4
[12:27] <Kamion> but I didn't spend much time on it
[12:27] <Kamion> ogra: dude, I know that :)
[12:27] <ogra> heh
[12:27] <dholbach> :)
[12:29] <Kamion> rubenv: I've kicked off a new build, thanks for the note
[12:29] <Kamion> the live build before that spent overly long trying to fetch filesystem images
[12:30] <Kamion> I'm shunting it back half an hour in the crontab
[12:30] <rubenv> Kamion: great, thanks :-)
[12:30] <ivoks> ubuntu works on 40MB, but it's not possible to install it
[12:31] <Kamion> vedran: there are probably a few memory leaks in the installer that can be fixed to help with that
[12:31] <vedran> Kamion: ok what do you suggest?
[12:31] <Kamion> I spotted another one in cdebconf recently, I think
[12:31] <vedran> I'm now trying to acquire a 32 MB machine to test
[12:31] <Kamion> boot with mem=32M
[12:31] <Kamion> or something along those lines ...
[12:31] <vedran> ok...
[12:31] <Lathiat> yeh thats right
[12:31] <Lathiat> or use qemu or vmware
[12:32] <Kamion> waste of time for installer testing IMHO, if you have a spare machine
[12:32] <Kamion> if you don't have a spare machine, sure
[12:33] <Kamion> vedran: have a poke about in the lowmem source package
[12:33] <vedran> qemu might help us with memleaks, but i didn't work with it
[12:33] <Kamion> cdebconf can be run on the host system, so you can use valgrind
[12:34] <Lathiat> well, qemu is an easy way to test 32M
[12:34] <Lathiat> is my point
[12:34] <Kamion> there are only a few places in the installer where memory leaks matter, because there are only a few processes that run for long enough
[12:34] <Kamion> Lathiat: I find it too painfully slow to work with; YMMV of course
[12:34] <Lathiat> Kamion: right, i didnt find it overly painful
[12:34] <Lathiat> Kamion: vmware is good
[12:34] <Lathiat> Kamion: also qemu with the accelerator is nice
[12:34] <Kamion> yeah, not really an option when one is on powerpc though ;)
[12:35] <Lathiat> haha
[12:35] <Kamion> I used to use vmware but don't use it any more on principle
[12:35] <Kamion> I have enough real hardware that I don't need to ...
[12:35] <vedran> Kamion: but what about pcs with no cdrom? (like the laptop i own)
[12:35] <Kamion> vedran: netboot
[12:35] <Kamion> or smart boot manager
[12:36] <Kamion> or USB boot
[12:36] <vedran> i was thinking more in line of: gzipped image of partition
[12:36] <Kamion> ?
[12:36] <ogra> initrd ? 
[12:36] <vedran> with a first-time wizard
[12:36] <Kamion> that's UbuntuExpress
[12:36] <Kamion> but the live CD will not run on the kinds of hardware you're talking about
[12:37] <Kamion> it's not a memory win
[12:37] <vedran> yeah...
[12:37] <vedran> perhaps its easier to fix the livecd
[12:37] <Kamion> make GNOME run in 32MB? :-)
[12:37] <Kamion> not easy
[12:37] <vedran> ;)
[12:37] <ogra> Kamion, lightweight desktop is the target ;)
[12:37] <Kamion> ogra: please stop telling me things I already know :P
[12:37] <vedran> we put icewm instead of gnome
[12:37] <ogra> heh
[12:38] <vedran> that is the easy part
[12:38] <vedran> the hard part is unbreaking the system once installed ;)
[12:38] <Kamion> unbreaking?
[12:38] <vedran> well
[12:38] <Kamion> oh, undoing live CD customisations you mean?
[12:38] <vedran> yes
[12:38] <Kamion> s'easy, UbuntuExpress does that
[12:38] <Kamion> only a prototype as yet, but ...
[12:38] <ivoks> bye all
[12:39] <Kamion> I do think a traditional installer will be better for low-memory systems
[12:39] <Kamion> it's just fundamentally running less stuff
[12:39] <vedran> could we write a small shell script
[12:40] <vedran> that just unpacks the ubuntuexpress iso image
[12:40] <Kamion> since a live CD needs working space somewhere, it's either got to use memory, or it's got to use swap
[12:40] <vedran> onto hard disk partition?
[12:40] <Kamion> no
[12:40] <Kamion> not maintainably anyway
[12:40] <Lathiat> installing off a livecd is unclean anyway :)
[12:40] <ogra> Lathiat, its the future
[12:40] <Kamion> debootstrap is not the part that takes memory
[12:40] <Kamion> the peak of memory use in the installer is during partitioning
[12:41] <Kamion> (which suggests cdebconf improvements, since that's pretty UI-heavy)
[12:41] <vedran> Kamion: "not maintainably anyway" - why do you think?
[12:41] <Kamion> vedran: well, not in breezy timeframe
[12:41] <vedran> with Knoppix it works :)
[12:41] <vedran> the loopback file is just compressed image of hard disk
[12:41] <Kamion> remember you have to do partitioning too
[12:42] <Kamion> ah, so it works only on one type of computer ...
[12:42] <vedran> nope - you get all the knopix hardware detection and stuff
[12:42] <Kamion> consider powerpc
[12:42] <vedran> basically like running the cd from your hard disk
[12:42] <Kamion> the partition table layout is not even the same between different machines
[12:42] <vedran> the installer should include qtparted
[12:42] <Kamion> !
[12:42] <Kamion> talk about memory use!
[12:43] <vedran> ok then cfdisk :)
[12:43] <Kamion> how about just the traditional installer?
[12:43] <vedran> ok its definitely better
[12:43] <Lathiat> really?
[12:43] <vedran> but we need to hunt memleaks... which is the second most boring thing
[12:44] <Kamion> I quite enjoy that kind of thing
[12:44] <Kamion> just a matter of available time
[12:44] <Lathiat> cant be that big a peak
[12:44] <vedran> also: i once installed linux on a computer with nothing but floppy or serial port
[12:44] <vedran> no cdrom no network
[12:45] <vedran> s/or/and/
[12:45] <Lathiat> need ssh mdoe over slip :)
[12:45] <Lathiat> how do you start up that ssh mode?
[12:45] <vedran> no it was much easier
[12:45] <Kamion> mm, we have a problem at the moment because 2.6 is too fat to let us get enough stuff onto one floppy to know how to get more stuff off the next floppy
[12:45] <vedran> there was a zip file that you unpack in C:/LINUX under windows
[12:46] <vedran> and use loadlin.exe :)
[12:46] <Kamion> being worked on upstream with initramfs
[12:46] <Lathiat> heh
[12:46] <vedran> well obviously not applicable to ubuntu, 
[12:46] <vedran> but my proposed shell script would be easily portable to dos
[12:46] <Lathiat> well, it can be
[12:47] <vedran> Kamion: or to 2.4 kernel :)
[12:47] <Kamion> we don't intend to support 2.4
[12:47] <Kamion> we did consider it
[12:47] <vedran> Kamion: no just boostrap installer from 2.4 then switch to 2.6
[12:47] <dholbach> i'm away again... :/
[12:47] <vedran> but i'm having wet dreams now so please stop me ;)
[12:48] <Kamion> that would require supporting 2.4
[12:48] <Kamion> and brings in very complex hardware detection issues
[12:48] <Kamion> because devices have different modules, interface names, etc. in 2.4 vs. 2.6
[12:48] <vedran> you're right...
[12:50] <Kamion> vedran: (also, ubuntu-express is being written in python - to be maintainable, one would have to share code with it, and thus be in the same language)
[12:50] <Lathiat> whats the model ubuntu express works in
[12:51] <Lathiat> does it largely just copy the livecd contents to / ?
[12:51] <Kamion> yes, plus tweaks; see the wiki design doc
[12:51] <Lathiat> like i said, largely
[12:51] <Kamion> http://udu.wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuExpress
[12:51] <Lathiat> are we going to continue to have a normal installer?
[12:51] <Kamion> yes
[12:51] <ogra> yes
[12:51] <Lathiat> good :)
[12:52] <Kamion> http://udu.wiki.ubuntu.com/GraphicalInstaller
[12:52] <ogra> Lathiat, but probably not shipped anymore
[12:52] <ogra> i.e. only as iso download....
[12:52] <Kamion> not shipped in shipit, you mean
[12:52] <ogra> yep
[12:52] <Kamion> I still regard it as "shipped"
[12:52] <vedran> i've read some very convincing articles that all distros should switch to livecd
[12:52] <rubenv> Can I request a resync on trac (universe)? The current breezy version is highly broken, but appears to be fixed in debian.
[12:52] <vedran> as an installer
[12:52] <Kamion> vedran: it's not feasible for big deployments
[12:52] <rubenv> or should I send that to the mailing list?
[12:52] <ogra> rubenv, we have a bug about it
[12:53] <Kamion> those articles are just propaganda I'm afraid
[12:53] <rubenv> ogra: great, i'll check it out
[12:53] <ogra> rubenv, i'm waiting for elmo to finish his moving and show up again to request it...
[12:53] <ogra> rubenv, so just be patient :)
[12:53] <Kamion> I'm very unimpressed with articles that only consider one installation use case
[12:54] <vedran> Kamion: yeah but it's cool to "try before buy" (repartition hard disk)
[12:54] <rubenv> ogra: no problem, I have to deploy it tomorrow, but I could as well go with hoary
[12:54] <Kamion> vedran: that's one case - now try deploying 2000 desktops armed with a bunch of live CDs, and watch the guy who's doing automatic installations over netboot get the job done in a tenth of the time and go down the pub :)
[12:54] <Kamion> both are valuable
[12:54] <Lathiat> hrm, im not sure "Computer Activity Logger" is the best description of syslog
[12:55] <vedran> Kamion: knoppix has netboot with two clicks
[12:55] <ogra> rubenv, you deploy breezy ?
[12:55] <rubenv> ogra: on the development server
[12:55] <ogra> ah, ok
[12:55] <rubenv> no, I'm not completely braindead ;-)
[12:56] <ogra> heh.... 
[12:56] <Kamion> shipping a live CD's fine, using it by default even is fine, but the traditional installer won't go away
[12:56] <vedran> Kamion: i'm with you on that one... i once tried netboot deployment of knoppix
[12:57] <vedran> Kamion: 20 users lost their work because one cd was scratched :s
[12:57] <Kamion> ah yes, that's where it was, confmodule_communicate() doesn't bother freeing 'in'
[01:01] <Kamion> though I suppose that isn't a huge issue actually, oh well
[01:12] <sivang> has anyone seen jamesh online lately?
[01:13] <sivang> or, responsive for that matter :-)
[01:28] <Treenaks> sivang: he made blog posts
[01:29] <Nafallo> someone at debconf should film Mithrandir's speech :-)
[01:29] <bob2> yes!
[01:29] <dholbach> what is he going to talk about?
[01:29] <ogra> stream it.... where is fluendo nowadays ?
[01:30] <Nafallo> dholbach: multi-arch iirc :-)
[01:31] <dholbach> ah :)
[01:31] <davyd> is Matt Garrett around?
[01:31] <davyd> I want to share complaints about ACPI with him
[01:33] <davyd> good point
[01:35] <ogra> davyd, but if you urgently need to share your experience, just shout at the channel ;)
[01:35] <ogra> ...if that helps :)
[01:36] <Treenaks> davyd: why not shout at postmaster@acpi.info ?
[01:45] <dilinger> anyone know if fabbione's going to be around soon?
[01:59] <\sh> hmmm..is anybody working with vmware on breezy?
[02:00] <davyd> I need to buy a new license first
[02:00] <\sh> i have a trial one first..if it's not running with breezy right now, I will forget it
[02:01] <davyd> there is no reason it shouldn't work
[02:01] <davyd> the application starts for me, I just don't have a license
[02:01] <\sh> actually it is...compiling the modules for 2.6.12-3-i386
[02:02] <\sh> with gcc-3.4 works fine
[02:02] <davyd> yeah, the installer shell is quite useful
[02:02] <davyd> all kernel things have to be built with gcc-3.4
[02:02] <davyd> else they won't link into your running kernel
[02:03] <\sh> yeah...but vmware is not starting, says it's not configured properly
[02:03] <davyd> have you run the vmware-config perl script?
[02:03] <\sh> 5 times now
[02:03] <davyd> ok
[02:03] <davyd> do the modules load?
[02:04] <\sh> actually the drivers are loading and bridging failed
[02:04] <\sh> and I can't sudo anything anymore :(
[02:05] <\sh> and now I have to reboot again damn
[02:05] <\sh> brb
[02:14] <\sh> grmpf
[02:21] <\sh> ok...vmware is not working as expected :(
[02:22] <davyd> no?
[02:22] <Treenaks> \sh: try qemu ;0
[02:22] <Treenaks> ;)
[02:23] <\sh> treenaks: I know qemu is working
[02:24] <\sh> I just removed networking from the vmware-config stuff, and now it's starting
[02:24] <\sh> *wonder*
[02:27] <sivang> \sh: qemu has a new kernel module , so it's even faster now then in the past
[02:27] <\sh> sivang: yeah...but I want to know if vmware is working...so I can order a license for the office
[02:28] <sivang> \sh: I'm using it under hoary, works fine
[02:28] <davyd> sivang: it works nicely on hoary
[02:28] <davyd> err, \sh
[02:28] <sivang> :-)
[02:28] <davyd> \sh, it might be a 2.6.12 thing
[02:28] <davyd> in which case, there might be an update in the works
[02:29] <Lathiat> yeh its a 2.6.12 thing
[02:29] <Lathiat> theres an update somewhere
[02:29] <Lathiat> altho, the stock ones work for me
[02:29] <Lathiat> i just had it do soe weird shit once
[02:29] <Lathiat> rbeooted and worked ok
[02:29] <sivang> Lathiat: I'm acutally having problem with 2.6.12 wrt LVM
[02:30] <sivang> Lathiat: it can't find the lvm devices , for some reason
[02:30] <sivang> Lathiat: any idea?
[02:30] <Lathiat> haha that sucks
[02:30] <Lathiat> nope
[02:30] <sivang> Lathiat: so I revert each time to 2.6.10-5
[02:34] <Treenaks> what should "md5sum -v" do?
[02:34] <Treenaks> I have a package that doesn't build because my md5sum doesn't understand -v
[02:36] <rubenv> be verbose?
[02:41] <eruin> I think my 2.6.12 is having issues with hotplug/ipw2200
[02:41] <Lathiat> works for me
[02:41] <Lathiat> i heard some people had some issues tho
[02:41] <Lathiat> it was being worked on
[02:41] <Lathiat> have you updated recently?
[02:42] <eruin> staying current every day
[02:42] <eruin> my poor laptop just powers down at or rather just after hotplug gets started... havent gotten any further in debugging it
[02:42] <Treenaks> rubenv: yes, well, my md5sum doesn't understand it
[02:42] <Lathiat> ouch that sucks
[02:42] <eruin> yeah
[02:43] <eruin> good thing I had 2.6.10 around :)
[02:43] <Treenaks> "Hey you hotplugged a power button.. you must have pressed it"
[02:44] <eruin> got any info on the update?
[02:44] <Lathiat> nope
[02:47] <eruin> I wonder where the run dialog went to
[02:48] <Lathiat> eruin: alt+f2
[02:51] <eruin> aaaah
[02:51] <eruin> thanks ;)
[03:06] <\sh> ah...found an update
[03:11] <jsgotangco> salut
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[03:31] <cv> #fazlamesai Turkish Linux Team #fazlamesai Turkish Linux Team #fazlamesai Turkish Linux Team #fazlamesai Turkish Linux Team #fazlamesai Turkish Linux Team #fazlamesai Turkish Linux Team #fazlamesai Turkish Linux Team #fazlamesai Turkish Linux Team #fazlamesai Turkish Linux Team #fazlamesai Turkish Linux Team 
[03:31] <cv> #fazlamesai Turkish Linux Team #fazlamesai Turkish Linux Team #fazlamesai Turkish Linux Team #fazlamesai Turkish Linux Team #fazlamesai Turkish Linux Team #fazlamesai Turkish Linux Team #fazlamesai Turkish Linux Team #fazlamesai Turkish Linux Team #fazlamesai Turkish Linux Team #fazlamesai Turkish Linux Team 
[03:37] <\sh> vmware is running ... just found the solution
[03:43] <Lathiat> \sh: which was?
[03:45] <tvo> what's the use of fam in ubuntu? since apt wants to remove kde and gnome and all graphical apps before installing it?
[03:45] <\sh> Lathiat: http://knihovny.cvut.cz/ftp/pub/vmware/ there is vmware-any-any-update92
[03:45] <Lathiat> \sh: ah yes,
[03:45] <Lathiat> \sh: thats what i thought
[03:45] <\sh> Lathiat: this helped for the network driver
[03:46] <davyd> tvo: probably because fam conflicts with gamin
[03:46] <davyd> and gnome-vfs and such depend on gamin
[03:46] <davyd> just a guess
[03:46] <\sh> and strange thing is...windows xp runs faster then a native install
[03:46] <Lathiat> \sh: i found that
[03:47] <Lathiat> \sh: i think its to do with disk caching
[03:47] <tvo> davyd: yeah probably. for breezy, is gamin going to be used again?
[03:49] <\sh> lathiat: I have my virt hd now on an usb2.0 hd...incredible :) and even fullscreen with 1024x768 is working out of the box with the vmware tools
[03:49] <Lathiat> neat
[03:50] <tvo> nm same api
[03:50] <\sh> and now my upstream provider will kill me with the daily iso image download story ,-)
[03:50] <Lathiat> whats that?
[03:51] <bob2> rsync.
[03:51] <\sh> ubuntu daily iso snapshots :) download, try to install, writing bugzilla notes
[04:36] <HiddenWolf> who is in charge of irc / #ubuntu?
[04:38] <Simira> the community council, or something?
[04:41] <HiddenWolf> Simira, :(
[04:44] <Simira> HiddenWolf : which?
[04:44] <HiddenWolf> uboto
[04:45] <Simira> I think it's an official Ubuntu bot, why?
[04:45] <HiddenWolf> Because, quite frankly, I find it disrespectful to newbs to serve their run-of-the-mill awnser with a bot.
[04:46] <HiddenWolf> And I see it as the first step of the attitude that is now gripping #debian, and their RTFM-approach
[04:46] <Simira> hm
[04:47] <HiddenWolf> How much harder is it to write "please google for that" as opposed to "bot, tell $user of sudo"
[04:48] <LinuxJones> Can someone please pop into #ubuntu and deal with dabaR, he's being rude && annoying
[04:48] <HiddenWolf> If you piont them in the direction of a wiki, google, forum, mailing list, whatever, that is fine. But to not even acknowledge the person, and just have the awnser served by a bot, I'd say is distasteful
[04:53] <HiddenWolf> Simira, do I have a piont, or not?
[04:54] <jdub> HiddenWolf: we certainly haven't encouraged bots
[04:54] <jdub> oddly enough, the owner is an aussie
[04:54] <HiddenWolf> jdub, why is that odd? :)
[04:56] <jdub> 'cos i tend to know the aussies who get involved
[04:59] <HiddenWolf> ahuman01, right
[04:59] <HiddenWolf> jdub, ah, right
[04:59] <Lathiat> Bots however, are usefull
[04:59] <Lathiat> because they can provide good responses
[04:59] <HiddenWolf> Yeah, but at a cost.
[04:59] <Lathiat> rather than $random person spewing up something
[04:59] <Lathiat> and lots of people oftne go unanswered
[05:00] <Lathiat> being helped by a unpersonal repsonse by a bot
[05:00] <Lathiat> beats not being helped at all
[05:00] <HiddenWolf> True, but being pionted to a wiki by a person beats a bot any time
[05:00] <Lathiat> sure but that person has to keep a list of wiki links
[05:00] <Lathiat> where that can be kept in a bot database
[05:00] <Lathiat> i actually quite liked the #debian bots
[05:00] <Lathiat> i could even ask it questions myself
[05:01] <HiddenWolf> Lathiat, I have no problem with a newb asking a question of the bot. I have a problem with people serving newbs with botted anwsers, because it is unfriendly
[05:02] <Lathiat> i stopped joining #ubuntu cus three hours later im still there
[05:02] <Lathiat> HiddenWolf: I disagree, because I think its more likely to result in more people getting helped with better answers
[05:02] <Lathiat> you have a collectiction of knowledge, rather than 1 person
[05:03] <Lathiat> if we had enogh people to help everyone
[05:03] <Lathiat> who knew everything
[05:03] <Lathiat> sure, it would be more friendly to help them personally
[05:03] <Lathiat> but like, i dont have time to sit here looking up specific wiki urls all the time
[05:03] <Lathiat> i just remember what i can
[05:04] <HiddenWolf> While we're at it, why don't we have a bot send a /msg to every join in #ubuntu. "Hi, I'm the automated helping system, if your question goes unawnsered, maybe I can be of service"
[05:04] <jdub> 'cos that's even more annoying that a bot in channel :)
[05:06] <HiddenWolf> ofcourse it is
[05:06] <HiddenWolf> well, nm then.
[05:07] <jdub> i tend to think the only polite way of having a bot on the channel is to call it something really obvious
[05:07] <jdub> HelpBot
[05:07] <jdub> :-)
[05:07] <jdub> like
[05:08] <HiddenWolf> yeah, and make sure it's response is civil
[05:08] <Lathiat> yeh, that would help i guess
[05:08] <HiddenWolf> Not $user wants to you to know: $bla
[05:09] <HiddenWolf> if you can't tell, that debian bot always annoyed me.
[05:10] <HiddenWolf> and the day i'll see something like "dpkg /topic /topic /topic /topic /topic /topic *READ IT*READ IT* /topic /topic /topic /topic /topic /topic /topic *a shaaame it's a shaaame that Leon_ didn't read the* /topic /topic /topic /topic..." in #ubuntu, I'll switch distro
[05:11] <Lathiat> Thats nice
[05:12] <HiddenWolf> that's the dpkg bot in #debian, fyi
[05:12] <HiddenWolf> "* dpkg runs jeffro. over with a steamroller and shoves the corpse off the fire escape."
[05:12] <Lathiat> HiddenWolf: yes, you see, thats the dpkg lart command
[05:16] <HiddenWolf> if a bot could be a troll, that'd be it's role-model
[05:23] <ivoks> guys...
[05:23] <ivoks> problems in #ubuntu
[05:23] <HiddenWolf> Someone ban that guy
[05:25] <LinuxJones> argh jackk is a spammer
[05:25] <HiddenWolf> LinuxJones, powerful observation, that
[05:25] <wasabi> morning
[05:25] <LinuxJones> HiddenWolf, thank you for that
[05:29] <HiddenWolf> LinuxJones, my pleasure
[05:32] <eruin> fabbione, can I get info on the upcoming kernel update I keep hearing about?
[05:41] <eruin> scrool needs a ban in #ubuntu
[05:42] <eruin> and fast
[05:42] <eruin> and krall
[05:43] <fabbione> eruin: uh what do you mean?
[05:43] <fabbione> eruin: (about the kernel update)
[05:44] <eruin> someone told me an update is imminent, and I was wondering what exactly is going to get updated (ie if anything related to my complete inablility to boot with it atm)
[05:45] <eruin> I think mine might be related to hotplug or the ipw2200 module, though not at all certain
[06:38] <trulux> bonjour
[06:42] <Panzerboy> bonsoir :)
[07:01] <pitti> Hi folks
[07:02] <trulux> hey pitti 
[07:02] <trulux> pitti: howya!!?
[07:02] <pitti> trulux: had a nice long weekend in Prague, wonderful
[07:02] <trulux> pitti: I'm ready for the bounty thing, going to prepare the proposal
[07:03] <trulux> pitti: ah, Prague is a nice place.
[07:03] <trulux> I'm just abck from France
[07:03] <trulux> LSM 2005
[07:03] <pitti> trulux: cool; I'll be at debconf5 the next week, I should be online fairly often
[07:03] <trulux> what a nice event...
[07:03] <trulux> pitti: ah, where's it?
[07:03] <pitti> trulux: Helsinki
[07:04] <trulux> pitti: nice place
[07:04] <trulux> pitti: I didn't meet a lot of people at LSM 2005
[07:04] <trulux> ;(
[08:15] <mxpxpod> ok, for some reason, network-manager thinks my wlan-ng usb card is a wired connection... does anyone know why?
[08:25] <mxpxpod> thom: ping
[08:31] <monk> i think there may be a bug in kino
[08:33] <monk> when i launch it, I get the following errors:
[08:33] <monk> >>> Registering plugin /usr/lib/kino-gtk2/libkinoplus.so
[08:33] <monk> >>> Image Filter: DV Titler 0.1.1
[08:33] <monk> (kino:4260): GLib-GObject-CRITICAL **: g_object_set_qdata_full: assertion `quark > 0' failed
[08:33] <monk> (kino:4260): GLib-GObject-CRITICAL **: g_object_set_qdata_full: assertion `quark > 0' failed
[08:33] <monk> (kino:4260): GLib-GObject-CRITICAL **: g_object_set_qdata_full: assertion `quark > 0' failed
[08:33] <monk> (kino:4260): GLib-GObject-CRITICAL **: g_object_set_qdata_full: assertion `quark > 0' failed
[08:33] <monk> >>> Image Filter: Color Hold
[08:33] <monk> >>> Image Filter: Blur
[08:34] <monk> i think the problem is with either the kino-dvdtitler package or the kinoplus package...
[08:34] <monk> probably the former
[09:47] <siretart> infinity: ping
[11:52] <wasabi> This totem browser plugin is pissing me off
[11:53] <wasabi> Last thing I want when I click on an AVI link is for it to open in a new browser window full screen and play. I want it to open totem. =/