[12:03] <eruin> wasabi, actually, the plugin wouldnt be that bad if you could actually do something with it
[12:04] <eruin> like going fullscreen, saving the stream, etc
[12:04] <wasabi> it more often than not locks up the browser
[12:04] <wasabi> I just want totem to open.
[12:04] <eruin> that hasn't happened here yet
[12:05] <wasabi> No reason to do silly plugin stuff for a direct link
[12:05] <eruin> that's true
[12:05] <eruin> it's a lifesaver for my favourite webtv site though
[12:05] <eruin> I can finally view it properly in linux ;)
[12:50] <daniels> heh.  on a freshly-cleaned xorg tree:
[12:50] <daniels> daniels@brainfreeze:~/canonical/xorg/xorg-6.8.2/debian% find ./ -type f | wc -l
[12:50] <daniels> 817
[12:56] <eruin> thank you thank you and thank you for adding rbox with cdburning in breezy :)
[01:29] <syndicate> So is there an initiative or something for supporting Kerberos in all base packages?  As it stands now, most stuff is compiled without kerberos support (like ssh and mozilla)
[01:30] <daniels> i don't know of any organised movement, no
[01:30] <syndicate> It would be nice to have one
[01:45] <wasabi> syndicate, feel free to start one. ;)
[01:45] <wasabi> I'm all for that.
[01:49] <dilinger> syndicate: would pam_krb5 suffice?
[01:51] <wasabi> pam_krb5 misses the vast majority of hte point of kerberos.
[01:51] <wasabi> It's not about auth... it's about passwordless auth.
[01:52] <wasabi> pam_krb5 is just the door
[01:52] <dilinger> ah, so you're talking about gssapi
[01:52] <wasabi> Among other things.
[01:52] <dilinger> i'd like to see pam support credential passing
[01:52] <wasabi> Yeah.
[01:52] <dilinger> for krb5 and ssh keys
[01:53] <wasabi> But pam is sort of not really about that.
[01:53] <dilinger> i know, but it could be
[01:53] <wasabi> That's SASL.
[01:53] <wasabi> me->away
[01:55] <lamont> daniels: sup?
[01:58] <daniels> lamont: got the library packages down pat, now just need to battle f**king xcursorgen
[02:05] <lamont> woot
[02:08] <daniels> and I think the xserver-xorg split is currently OK, too
[02:08] <daniels> lamont: http://people.ubuntu.com/~daniels/xorg/changelog-35
[02:09] <daniels> need to go to the supermarket, though.  1009, haven't eaten, and I'm ravenous.
[02:09] <lamont> opuch
[02:09] <lamont> ouch, even
[02:10] <lamont> quite the changelog
[02:11] <daniels> yeah
[02:11] <daniels> it's pretty much the only version that's managed to balloon like that lately
[02:11] <daniels> i'd forgotten just how much that sucked
[02:11] <daniels> anyway, -> purchasing food
[02:20] <syndicate> well, how do you start an intiative, create a spec or something on the wiki
[02:20] <syndicate> I'd be happy to do so
[02:52] <Megacid> hello folks
[02:52] <Megacid> cjwatson is around sometimes ?
[02:53] <lamont> Megacid: frequently
[02:53] <Megacid> thks
[02:54] <Megacid> he is my guru
[03:00] <schweeb> Megacid: he goes by the nick Kamion on irc
[03:03] <Megacid> thks for the info :)
[03:45] <daniels> lamont: fwiw, -35 will also fix the tetex build loop
[03:47] <lamont> awesome
[03:47] <lamont> btw, how's lunch?
[03:51] <daniels> breakfast is good :) lunch is in the oven
[03:51] <bob2> more muphins?
[03:52] <daniels> bob2: muffins are PENDINGUPLOAD
[03:52] <daniels> bob2: nachos are in the oven
[03:52] <bob2> wtf
[03:52] <bob2> nachos are microwave food, dude
[03:53] <daniels> proper nachos are oven food
[03:53] <tseng> yeah
[03:54] <tseng> but oven is way too much work
[03:56] <daniels> no way dude
[03:56] <tseng> i drive down the road and let real mexicans cook it for me
[03:57] <tseng> that way it doesnt suffer from my extreme whiteness
[03:57] <tseng> or make me touch an oven
[03:59] <schweeb> tseng: you are truly worthless as a mexican
[03:59] <tseng> schweeb: so true.
[03:59] <schweeb> make me some nachos anyways.
[03:59] <jp> hi all
[03:59] <jp> :)
[04:00] <lamont> from the missing-depends department: /usr/include/php4/main/php_network.h:78:25: openssl/ssl.h: No such file or directory
[04:00] <tseng> schweeb: if you inventory all the food in my apartment, we have a multitude of drinks, and some assorted popsicles
[04:00] <tseng> schweeb: cooking is for suckers
[04:01] <schweeb> hah
[04:01] <schweeb> you are a sucker anyways
[04:01] <schweeb> grilling is good.
[04:02] <schweeb> no cleanup, and delicious food
[04:02] <jp> tseng wtf with you, i'm professional chef :)
[04:02] <tseng> grilling on the third floor doesnt work
[04:04] <bob2> you could do it in a griller
[04:05] <bob2> instead of on the 3rd floor
[04:05] <schweeb> you're a sucker for moving in on the third floor, tseng
[04:07] <tseng> ill get you later schweeb 
[04:08] <schweeb> :)
[04:16] <daniels> tseng: cooking is rad
[04:27] <jp> cool
[04:29] <schweeb> whoever mentioned nachos gets a cookie
[04:43] <thierry> hi, I'd like to help with ubuntu bug 8786 but I can't find the hal module in rosetta...
[04:43] <thierry> https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/rosetta
[04:48] <jp> servers are cool
[04:48] <jp> hahahahah
[04:48] <thierry> yeah
[05:02] <mpt> thierry: What language is that?
[05:05] <mpt> thierry: https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/distros/ubuntu/hoary/+sources/hal/+pots/review-hoary-hal-1/fr/+translate?offset=20
[05:06] <mpt> (I found hal by finding "hal" on https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/distros/ubuntu/hoary/+translations)
[05:35] <daniels> SHIT
[05:35] <daniels> ah, phew
[05:35] <daniels> my obscure scp-to-chinstrap-then-ftp upload method saved me
[06:22] <fabbione> daniels:
[06:22] <fabbione> pool/main/libx/libx11/libx11_6.2.1+cvs.20050711-1.dsc
[06:22] <fabbione> pool/main/libx/libx11/libx11_6.2.1+cvs.20050711-1.tar.gz
[06:22] <fabbione> native package?
[06:24] <daniels> oh, for fuck's sake
[06:24] <daniels> that's the second time I've done that today
[06:24] <daniels> (*ahem*)
[06:29] <daniels> isn't the new dpkg supposed to reject that?
[06:30] <fabbione> it would have fail on your box if there was something wrong?
[06:31] <daniels> well, it's not supposed to accept native version numbers with non-native packaging and vice-versa
[06:31] <fabbione> it unpacked here fine
[06:31] <fabbione> blame scott :)
[07:49] <daniels> the first set of figures has me paying $8k, on top of what I've already paid.  second set has me getting $2k back.  third set has me paying $200k.
[07:49] <daniels> er, $200, not $200k.
[07:50] <fabbione> daniels: these are peanuts :)
[07:50] <robitaille> personally I would take the 2nd option :)
[07:51] <infinity> daniels : Time for some creative math.
[07:51] <fabbione> hi infinity 
[07:52] <infinity> daniels : I get money back, but I can't file until Zofia's slack-ass ex-employer send us her pay summary, so I can claim her as a dependant.
[07:52] <infinity> fabbione : Morning.  Or afternoon.  Or whatever it is.
[07:53] <fabbione> Inconsistency detected by ld.so: rtld.c: 1075: dl_main: Assertion `_rtld_local._dl_rtld_map.l_libname' failed!
[07:53] <fabbione> does anybody have any idea of what that error message means?
[07:54] <fabbione> (amd64 breezy chroot)
[07:56] <infinity> Nope, but there's an open bug on glibc about that very message.
[07:57] <fabbione> ok
[07:58] <fabbione> this must be new... but i don't think it's glibc realted
[07:58] <fabbione> there hasn't been a glibc update for a while
[07:58] <fabbione> i think it's more gcc-3.4 related.. in any case it makes the kernel FTBFS
[07:58] <infinity> Has there been a new binutils recently?
[07:59] <infinity> I tend to blame all my deeply obscure toolchain bugs on binutils, until provne otherwise.
[07:59] <fabbione> no idea...
[08:00] <fabbione> can somebody kindly write an uppersend so that i can copy&paste ???
[08:00] <fabbione> my X keyboard is somehow fucked...
[08:00] <fabbione> daniels: we will have to look at it sometime soon
[08:02] <infinity> I'd have to know what an "uppersend" was before I could type one for you...
[08:03] <fabbione> the one you use in grep to match the first word
[08:03] <fabbione> the opposite of $
[08:03] <infinity> ^
[08:03] <fabbione> (in a regexp)
[08:03] <fabbione> thanks
[08:03] <HrdwrBoB> a caret?
[08:06] <daniels> fabbione: what's wrong with it?
[08:06] <fabbione> daniels: i have lost a bunch of chard
[08:07] <fabbione> chars
[08:07] <fabbione> backspace doesn't work in less
[08:07] <fabbione> i can't make the above char
[08:07] <fabbione> tilde
[08:07] <fabbione> if you can find a pic of a dk keyboard i can show you
[08:08] <fabbione> otherwise gimme the time to take a pic of mine
[08:08] <daniels> fabbione: are they accessed via alt-gr, or via shift?
[08:08] <fabbione> that too
[08:08] <fabbione> but not only
[08:08] <daniels> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:KeyboardLayout-Danish.png
[08:09] <fabbione> daniels: ok.. let's start from the backspace
[08:09] <fabbione> it works in xterm, but not less
[08:09] <fabbione> and in another case i can't remember
[08:10] <fabbione> the key immediatly on the left of backspace
[08:10] <fabbione> the 2 apostroph don't work
[08:10] <fabbione> pipe does
[08:10] <daniels> ' and ` ?
[08:10] <fabbione> ' <- this is on another key
[08:10] <fabbione> ` <- this one and the opposite
[08:10] <daniels> oh, so you actually have separate ` and  keys?
[08:10] <daniels> right
[08:11] <fabbione> right
[08:11] <fabbione> down to the tilde key
[08:11] <fabbione> none of the 3 symbols on it are available
[08:11] <daniels> if you start up xev, what output does it give you for typing with those?
[08:11] <Mithrandir> ^~  you mean?
[08:11] <daniels> yeah
[08:11] <fabbione> yup
[08:12] <daniels> why is  on a separate key?  is it a dead key?
[08:12] <fabbione> the rest of the keyboard seems ok
[08:12] <fabbione> daniels: i really have no clue if it's a dead or alive key
[08:12] <daniels> oh right, it is dead
[08:12] <daniels> fabbione: according to wikipedia, it's dead
[08:12] <fabbione> ok
[08:13] <daniels> so, you do u to get , f.e.
[08:13] <daniels> deadkeys are crack
[08:13] <daniels> compose keys are the way of the future
[08:13] <fabbione> well whatever :)
[08:13] <fabbione> can you try to fix it please?
[08:13] <fabbione> i don't mind at all to do testing
[08:14] <daniels> i'll do what i can, but lacking more information or a danish keyboard ...
[08:14] <daniels> would need to know what happens when you try typing with those into xev, for a start
[08:14] <fabbione> daniels: sure.. hold on
[08:14] <fabbione> daniels: any preferred way?
[08:15] <daniels> /msg?
[08:15] <fabbione> to grab the output of xev i mean
[08:15] <fabbione> sure
[08:58] <Speedy2> Are either HAL or hotplug involved in the creation of IDE devices in /dev ?
[09:08] <Treenaks> wb all :)
[09:28] <fabbione> hey elmo
[09:40] <fabbione> elmo: can you please dist-upgrade the following chroots? (concordia: breezy - breezy-i386 davis: breezy halley: breezy)
[09:40] <fabbione> elmo: i need to get in the latest kernel-wedge to fix some udeb creation stuff
[09:47] <elmo> fabbione: I can't do davis while you're building ...
[09:49] <fabbione> elmo: ops.. will stop immediatly
[09:49] <fabbione> elmo: done :)
[09:54] <elmo> concordia/halley done - davis running
[09:54] <fabbione> elmo: thanks :)
[09:58] <elmo> fabbione: davis done too
[09:58] <fabbione> elmo: rocking thanks
[09:59] <fabbione> does anybody have handy the if [ $1.. line to call some stuff only on first install and reconfigure, but not upgrades?
[10:01] <sivang> hey fabbione 
[10:02] <fabbione> hi sivang 
[10:08] <elmo> ogra: ?
[10:09] <Treenaks> elmo: did you see my mail re: cannot upload ?
[10:10] <elmo> Treenaks: not yet, I'm having trouble keeping up with my mail load without a server at home
[10:11] <Treenaks> elmo: np
[10:21] <daniels> fabbione: $1="configure" $2="", IIRC
[10:21] <fabbione> daniels: yeah i figured to test it runtime.. it's faster :)
[10:24] <Clint> elmo: you're missing madduck trolling
[10:26] <ogra> elmo, whats wron ?
[10:26] <ogra> g
[10:29] <Mithrandir> ogra: elmo's afk atm.
[10:29] <ogra> ah, ok
[11:02] <fabbione> bah... brown paper bag upload
[11:04] <fabbione> hey seb128
[11:04] <lifeless> seb128_: jdub suggested you might like to package 'barter' - a baz python nautilus plugin
[11:04] <seb128_> "plugin"?
[11:04] <seb128_> hi fabbione 
[11:05] <fabbione> seb128_: a very low priority task for you and only if you have time.. could you fix gnome-alsamixer in breezy?
[11:05] <fabbione> (it's in universe and gcc-4.0 FTBFS)
[11:05] <fabbione> (i think at least...)
[11:06] <seb128_> fabbione: builds fine on i386, I'll have a look
[11:06] <lifeless> seb128_: yes, it gives context menus in baz checkouts
[11:06] <lifeless> seb128_: think 'tortoise svn for baz on nautilus'
[11:06] <fabbione> seb128_: hm ok...
[11:06] <fabbione> seb128_: it fails here tho...
[11:07] <seb128_> lifeless: any webpage, pointer, ... ?
[11:08] <doko> good morning
[11:09] <fabbione> hi doko
[11:09] <ogra> seb128_, google for apotheke
[11:09] <lifeless> http://www.dur.ac.uk/j.r.c.geldart/projects/barter/
[11:09] <ogra> we already had this for cvs
[11:10] <seb128_> ogra: he's not speaking about apotheke
[11:10] <seb128_> lifeless: thanks
[11:10] <ogra> seb128_, but something similar....
[11:10] <lifeless> ogra: check that web site out, screen shots n all ;)
[11:10] <ogra> seb128_, apotheke was a cvs bonobo plugin afaik
[11:10] <seb128_> ogra: and I asked for a page/name, not easy to package something without these informations
[11:10] <seb128_> ogra: I don't care about apotheke :p
[11:11] <highvoltage> anyone have elmo's e-mail address?
[11:11] <ogra> seb128_, me neither :) i never did :)
[11:11] <seb128_> so why do you keep speaking of it? :p
[11:12] <ogra> seb128_, you sounded like you wanted to know about it *g*
[11:12] <seb128_> ogra: read the discussion again maybe?
[11:13] <ogra> seb128_, probably i had not enough coffee yet :)
[11:14] <ogra> hmm, but barter looks cool
[11:26] <dholbach> good morning
[11:26] <dholbach> could it be that   http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/s/streamtuner/0.99.99-5ubuntu1/streamtuner_0.99.99-5ubuntu1_20050711-0950-amd64-failed.gz  comes from a hiccuping buildd?
[12:20] <Mithrandir> is dpkg on utter crack for the time being?
[12:20] <Mithrandir> dpkg-source: error: unrecognised file suffix `-0.tar'
[12:20] <Mithrandir> internal error: error occured during execution of dpkg-source in /tmp/d8QniJ0EHx/source/nxcomp:
[12:20] <Mithrandir> internal error: could not unpack package to desired level: Ingen slik fil eller filkatalog
[12:20] <Mithrandir> (Ingen slik fil eller filkatalog = No such file or directory)
[12:21] <dholbach> hi Mithrandir 
[12:21] <Mithrandir> hiya daniel
[12:22] <rob^> Mithrandir, what package did you try to install?
[12:22] <dholbach> so you're moved now?
[12:22] <tseng> rob^: dpkg-source
[12:22] <daniels> Mithrandir: sounds like native packaging with a non-native version number
[12:22] <rob^> weard
[12:23] <Mithrandir> daniels: uhm, no?  But the upstream version is 1.4.0.2-31
[12:23] <Mithrandir> rob^: none, it's dpkg-source.
[12:23] <Mithrandir> dholbach: I'm in Finland now. :-)
[12:23] <daniels> Mithrandir: so what file is it trying to unpack?
[12:24] <rob^> yes
[12:24] <Mithrandir> daniels: libxcomp0_1.4.0.2-31-0_i386.deb or the -dev package.
[12:25] <dholbach> Mithrandir: hehe, but you moved already? how's life now? :)
[12:25] <Mithrandir> dholbach: yeah, moved to Oslo now.  It's icky living in boxes, but we're surviving.
[12:25] <daniels> Mithrandir: you're trying to dpkg-source a deb?
[12:25] <jsgotangco> bye everyone
[12:25] <jsgotangco> night time for me :)
[12:26] <Mithrandir> daniels: no, I'm running debuild. :-P
[12:26] <Mithrandir> dpkg-source -x /home/tfheen/external/nx/pkg-nx/nxcomp/nxcomp_1.4.0.2-31-0.dsc
[12:26] <Mithrandir> dpkg-source: error: unrecognised file suffix `-0.tar'
[12:26] <dholbach> Mithrandir: that's how life will be for me too in 6-7 weeks  :)
[12:27] <Lathiat> Mithrandir: i didnt realise that you where tfheen
[12:27] <Mithrandir> hm, yeah, native package.  That's wrong.
[12:27] <Lathiat> heh
[12:31] <fabbione> infinity: is there anybody working on the amd64 error i did past this morning?
[12:33] <dholbach> fabbione: problems installing packages on it?
[12:33] <dholbach> fabbione: (build-depends)
[12:33] <fabbione> dholbach: no, the ld.so assertion failure
[12:33] <fabbione> that brings to uninstallable pkgs too
[12:33] <fabbione> but that's a consequence
[12:33] <fabbione> not the root of the problem
[12:33] <dholbach> ah ok... then make it two
[12:48] <fabbione> daniels: what are you going to break today?
[12:48] <Treenaks> daniels: does it fix stuff? :)
[12:48] <daniels> fabbione: the WORLD.
[12:48] <daniels> Treenaks: yeah, and hopefully breaks more stuff too
[12:48] <Mirv> smurfix: i got two e-mails with subject:"Ubuntu Suomen keskustelualueet: SMF Database Error!" (ubuntu-fi forums).. do you think that's something to worry about?
[12:49] <Treenaks> daniels: uhm.. like?
[12:49] <daniels> Treenaks: lots of i810 goodness in there, now installs from scratch, more stuff modularised, no more build dependency loops, ...
[12:49] <daniels> Treenaks: http://people.ubuntu.com/~daniels/xorg/changelog-35
[12:49] <daniels> it's a biggie :)
[12:49] <Treenaks> ooooohhh
[12:49] <Treenaks> display driver separation goo
[12:49] <Lathiat> nice release name
[12:49] <Mirv> smurfix: ok, I get connection timeout too so something is wrong, yes..
[12:50] <Mirv> smurfix: and anyway, are there backups of the databases in case something goes wrong?
[12:50] <daniels> lathi	thanks
[12:51] <Lathiat> whats libice
[12:51] <Kamion> Mithrandir: upgrade dpkg-dev?
[12:51] <daniels> fwiw, the binary line is 2926 characters now
[12:51] <Lathiat> and the b-d line?
[12:52] <Lathiat> daniels: does this mean if i dist-upgrade from hoary it wont fuck up?
[12:52] <daniels> Lathiat: i hope so
[12:52] <daniels> Lathiat: b-d is actually shorter
[12:52] <Lathiat> neat
[12:52] <Lathiat> and more neatness
[12:52] <daniels> Lathiat: a mere 1151 characters
[12:52] <Lathiat> whough
[12:52] <Lathiat> wasnt it like 4000 before? ;p
[12:53] <Lathiat> also why no lbxproxy?
[12:53] <Treenaks> wb
[12:53] <daniels> Lathiat: because it's crap
[12:53] <Lathiat> daniels: howso?
[12:53] <daniels> Lathiat: nah, the xserver-xorg Depends line was about 4200 characters.  it's only around 3100 now.
[12:54] <daniels> Lathiat: less performant in almost every situation (both with latency and throughput) than ssh, and definitely far less than nx
[12:54] <Lathiat> righto
[01:00] <Mithrandir> Kamion: ii  dpkg-dev       1.13.10        Package building tools for Debian
[01:02] <Mithrandir> yay, now it complains about: dpkg-source: error: unrecognised file suffix `-0.diff'
[01:13] <fabbione> Kamion: https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=10189
[01:13] <fabbione> Kamion: i think there is something wrong with modprobing in d-i
[01:13] <fabbione> this bug is very similar to another one reported by Mithrandir 
[01:13] <fabbione> in both cases d-i doesn't probe what's in drivers/messages/*
[01:14] <fabbione> and both the drivers are hotplug "ok"
[01:14] <fabbione> specially this bug.. i did talk with the submitter..
[01:14] <Kamion> d-i isn't doing the probing, hotplug is
[01:14] <Kamion> depmod's called at the beginning of each hardware detection run
[01:14] <Kamion> so I'm generally puzzled
[01:14] <fabbione> Kamion: after the hotplug run.. do we give enough time to udev to create the devices?
[01:15] <Kamion> yes, hw-detect runs udevstart
[01:15] <fabbione> the submitter told me on irc.. that once he installs with some manual tricks.. the generated initrd is ok
[01:15] <fabbione> and contains the proper drivers that are loaded correctly
[01:15] <fabbione> or at least it boots fine once installed
[01:15] <fabbione> so the combination kernel <-> hotplug <-> udev seems fine
[01:15] <fabbione> i am quite puzzled too tbh
[01:16] <fabbione> but i can see from the generated modules.pcimap on an installed system.. that they are ok
[01:16] <fabbione> in terms that the pci ids are exported properly
[01:16] <Kamion> might be good to check modules.pcimap in the installer, right after the failure
[01:16] <Kamion> *not* just after boot or whatever
[01:17] <Mithrandir> Keybuk: could you please pull in tfheen@err.no--2005/dpkg--devel--1.13--patch-1 ?
[01:17] <fabbione> Kamion: right.. anything else do you think i can ask him?
[01:17] <fabbione> Kamion: we also have Mith with the same problem on his amd64 of death
[01:17] <fabbione> so we have 2 people that can actually testy
[01:20] <fabbione> Kamion: what priority is scsi-extra-modules ?
[01:22] <Kamion> standard
[01:22] <Kamion> both hoary and breezy
[01:23] <fabbione> so it gets pulled in automatically... or it should at least
[01:23] <Kamion> /var/log/syslog would be useful too
[01:25] <fabbione> hey mdz
[01:26] <maswan> fabbione: buttercup has gotten a powercycle now
[01:26] <fabbione> maswan: cool!
[01:26] <fabbione> thanks
[01:27] <mdz> morning
[01:27] <daniels> mdz: back home already?
[01:27] <mdz> at debconf
[01:28] <daniels> oh, right, i thought you were ircing from there
[01:29] <fabbione> mdz: do you have 686 kernel on your laptop?
[01:29] <mdz> daniels: I would be, but they filter outbound 6667
[01:29] <mdz> fabbione: yes
[01:30] <fabbione> mdz: i am preparing a fix for the tpm stuff.. mind to give it a test?
[01:30] <mdz> 2.6.12-3-686
[01:31] <fabbione> mdz: ok :)
[01:31] <mdz> fabbione: the bandwidth is not so good on this wireless network, but if I can get it I will test
[01:31] <daniels> mdz: sensible
[01:31] <fabbione> mdz: ok.. uploading now to people...
[01:33] <fabbione> mdz: linux-image-2.6.12-4-686_2.6.12-4.4_i386.deb <- on http://people.u.c/${tilde_thanks_to_fucked_dk_kbd_inX}fabbione/
[01:34] <Kamion> fabbione: (%7e works)
[01:35] <fabbione> Kamion: ehe ok :)
[01:37] <Treenaks> hibye sivang
[01:41] <Hieronymus> I think there's something wrong with the new OOo2 packages
[01:41] <Hieronymus> which just came in
[01:41] <Hieronymus> openoffice.org2-core: Depends: openoffice.org2-common (> 1.9.114) but 1.9.113-0ubuntu2 is installed
[01:42] <Lathiat> yeh theres issues
[01:45] <Hieronymus> forcing it gives dpkg issues
[01:48] <syndicate> gnome-panel depends on libwnck16, but I have a libwnck17, is something being updated (amd64) 
[01:48] <syndicate> i.e. ubuntu-desktop is broken
[01:49] <trulux> anyone knows why transcode is not installable in Ubuntu Hoary?
[01:50] <daniels> because marillat's repository doesn't work with hoary.  this is an #ubuntu question, and an faq.
[01:50] <ogra> trulux, why should it ? we dont ship it
[01:51] <trulux> daniels: sorry, just wondering
[01:51] <trulux> ogra: because most users back-up their DVDs
[01:51] <ogra> trulux, so complain at the guy who broke it ;)
[01:53] <trulux> ogra: who's him? :)
[01:53] <ogra> dunno, i dont use illegal software
[01:54] <ogra> and use growisofs for dvd backups
[01:55] <Lathiat> sif use transcode anyway
[01:55] <Lathiat> gstreamer is where its at
[01:56] <trulux> ogra: transcode illegal? I'm talking about private copies of DVDs I own, if someday I go out with my laptop, I won't take my DVDs box with all of them
[01:57] <trulux> ogra: I won't share my private copy with no one else, that's the point where it's wither legal or illegal
[01:57] <Lathiat> trulux: thats not legal everywhere
[01:57] <Lathiat> but transcode has other uses
[01:57] <trulux> well, knifes have many uses. I can cut my food with them or your head off
[01:57] <trulux> right?
[01:57] <trulux> ;)
[01:58] <Lathiat> however, alot of the code for various codecs is dodgy
[02:00] <trulux> you know, it's because such type of non sense excuses and reasons that some governments and concretely, certain commercial agencies, want to make private copies illegal
[02:00] <trulux> and personal privacy, and P2P networks, and a long etc
[02:00] <trulux> it's also because certain commercial agencies want to bring software patents to Europe...
[02:00] <trulux> "becase open source has other uses"
[02:01] <trulux> s/becase/because/
[02:01] <Hieronymus> well, use free software then
[02:02] <trulux> OK, better then: they argue "free software makes no benefit, it's viral and any one else can re-use your work with no warranty of copyright laws"
[02:03] <trulux> just read, even if it's a painful thing, Steve Ballmer's interviews
[02:03] <Lathiat> dude
[02:03] <Lathiat> way off topic
[02:03] <Lathiat> forge tit already
[02:03] <trulux> well, you started it, I'm just following up and trying to bring some sense to the conversation
[02:04] <trulux> no worries, if someone asks, I will try to prepare a transcode package for Hoary
[02:05] <Lathiat> trulux: ubp has one
[02:05] <trulux> Lathiat: ubp?
[02:05] <Lathiat> backports
[02:05] <Lathiat> in hoary-extras
[02:05] <trulux> ah
[02:05] <trulux> ok
[02:05] <Lathiat> their evil, but the extras arent so evil
[02:05] <trulux> thanks
[02:05] <trulux> ;)
[02:05] <Lathiat> now #ubuntu next time kthxbai
[02:05] <trulux> great then
[02:05] <trulux> sure, I apologize
[02:06] <Lathiat> nps
[02:07] <dholbach> syndicate: there'll be an updated package soon
[02:19] <whiprush> morning dholbach, thx for fixing streamtuner. 
[02:20] <dholbach> whiprush: hey! no problem - it's still "missing" on amd64, but that's a buildd problem
[02:39] <daniels> bah, xorg ftbfs on powerpc.  two outta three ain't bad.
[02:47] <dholbach> see you later
[02:49] <ogra> elmo, so what do you need additionally for squeak ?
[02:53] <jbailey_> Does anyone have a *simple* testcase that shows off the amd64 bug at program start time?
[02:54] <jbailey_> Reducing from python is a bit difficult...
[02:54] <Mithrandir> jbailey_: what amd64 bug?
[02:54] <jbailey_> Mithrandir: ld.so detects an inconsistancy when installing python2.4
[02:55] <jbailey_> Fabio said he saw it in the kernel build, but I can't reproduce it (I have a segfault with mv, but I think I'd rather chase one fault at a time)
[02:55] <Mithrandir> uh, uh.
[02:55] <Mithrandir> I'm not at home, so I can't really help you, I'm afraid.
[02:57] <seb128> elmo: glib2.0 (experimental) inkscape hardware-monitor meld  syncs please
[02:58] <jbailey_> Mithrandir: No worries.  It's motivation for me to get around to buying amd64 hardware, I guess. =(
[02:59] <jbailey_> Or I wonder if bochs does amd64 yet.  I know they were talking about adding it.
[02:59] <Mithrandir> jbailey_: I thought that was supported for years already?
[02:59] <Mithrandir> jbailey_: if you can do it in just a breezy chroot, ravel's always around
[03:00] <jbailey_> Is ravel that machine I was on before that had hardware errors of some sort?
[03:01] <jbailey_> Actually, there's a few machines I should try now that I have a better net connection overseas.
[03:01] <jbailey_> My previous provider use to just suck for connecting to some people.
[03:01] <Mithrandir> ravel is pre-production newisys equipment, so it dies once in a while, yes.
[03:07] <seb128> ajmitch: around?
[03:32] <thierry_> how can I make a change for a package to change the place it appears in the gnome menu?
[03:32] <thierry_> like for ubuntu bug 4069
[03:32] <mdke> edit the .desktop file in the package i believe
[03:32] <thierry_> k going to try this...
[03:33] <ogra> thierry_, copy the .desktop file for this app from /usr/share/applications to  ~/.local/share/applications/
[03:33] <ogra> and edit the Categories line
[03:33] <thierry_> ogra, it's not for me, it's for fixing a bug
[03:34] <ogra> thierry_, ah, ok, i thought for your desktop
[03:35] <ogra> thierry_, could you elaborate how that related to #4096 ? 
[03:36] <ogra> relates
[03:36] <Kinnison> Hi, is there an ETA on linux-restricted-modules-2.6.12 ?
[03:36] <ogra> Kinnison, poke daniels....
[03:37] <ogra> Kinnison, he seems to have been quite busy recently, regarding the last xorg changelog :)
[03:37] <thierry_> ogra, well ubuntu bug 4069 says that emacs should be in the programming folder of applications (in the gnome menu) so I wanted to make the changes and submit a patch
[03:38] <ogra> thierry_, you mean this 4096 ? https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=4096
[03:38] <ogra> for me it says "PHP mail() function does not work by default"
[03:38] <thierry_> ogra : not 4096! it's 4069 : https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=4069
[03:39] <Kinnison> ogra: ta
[03:39] <ogra> ah
[03:39] <ogra> sorry, my fault
[03:39] <thierry_> ogra : but do you think I should let it as Text Editor?
[03:39] <thom> also, oo2 is fucked. HTH hand
[03:40] <ogra> i think the decision once was not to have emacs and gvim in the manu at all
[03:40] <ogra> menu
[03:40] <ogra> but that might have changed over time....
[03:40] <thierry_> k...
[03:49] <thierry_> dpkg-buildpackage -uc -us -S doesn't work on the emacs21 package
[03:53] <ogra> thierry_, with fakeroot ? 
[03:54] <Kamion> thierry_: exact error
[04:05] <\sh> und ich hoffe nicht, dass der besitzer nicht der ist, dem auch das gentoo-forum.de gehoert
[04:07] <ogra> mdke, Lathiat its not worth the fuss :) 
[04:07] <ogra> totally out of context ;)
[04:07] <mdke> ;)
[04:08] <Lathiat> beh
[04:08] <Lathiat> i want to learn german
[04:08] <Lathiat> it se
[04:08] <Lathiat> ems like a cool langauge
[04:08] <Lathiat> all the other languages seem boring
[04:08] <ogra> "cool" is a good match *g*
[04:09] <ogra> cold woud even fit better
[04:09] <ogra> would
[04:09] <thierry_> Kamion, ogra : thierry@modemcable050:~/dev/ubun/emacs21-21.3+1$ dpkg-buildpackage -uc -us -S
[04:09] <thierry_> dpkg-buildpackage: source package is emacs21
[04:09] <thierry_> dpkg-buildpackage: source version is 21.3+1-8ubuntu8
[04:09] <thierry_> dpkg-buildpackage: source maintainer is thierry <thierryn@videotron.ca>
[04:09] <thierry_>  debian/rules clean
[04:09] <thierry_> debian/rules:15: /usr/share/dpatch/dpatch.make: Aucun fichier ou rpertoire de ce type
[04:09] <thierry_> make: *** Pas de rgle pour fabriquer la cible  /usr/share/dpatch/dpatch.make . Arrt.
[04:09] <thierry_> sorry for the french stuff...
[04:09] <Treenaks> thierry_: uh...
[04:10] <thierry_> yeah I know im flooding too sorry
[04:10] <Treenaks> thierry_: apt-get install dpatch
[04:10] <Treenaks> probably
[04:10] <thierry_> k going to try
[04:10] <Treenaks> if that means "FIle not found"
[04:10] <ogra> nope, build-depend on it :)
[04:10] <Treenaks> ogra: I had the same problem yesterday
[04:10] <Treenaks> ogra: I let pbuilder handle the build-deps
[04:11] <ogra> Treenaks, the clean solution is to build-depend on it... the quick solution is sudo apt-get install dpatch ;)
[04:11] <Treenaks> ogra: so dpatch wasn't installed when I tried to dpkg-buildpackage -S
[04:11] <Lathiat> if its doesnt b-d on it it will probably fail in the buildd anyway
[04:11] <ogra> yep
[04:11] <ogra> exactly
[04:11] <thierry_> Treenaks : yeah thanks it works
[04:12] <ogra> Treenaks, workaround vs. solution ;)
[04:12] <Treenaks> ogra: so yes, there was a build-depends, but I don't like installing 600.000 build-deps for lots of stuff when I have pbuilder
[04:12] <Treenaks> ogra: so dpatch was enough to build the diff/dsc
[04:12] <Treenaks> ogra: and pbuilder took care of the rest
[04:12] <ogra> Treenaks, dpatch is called from debian/rules above
[04:12] <Treenaks> ogra: yes, same with lirc
[04:13] <ogra> so it wouldnt work in a pbuilder without build-dependency
[04:13] <Treenaks> ogra: lirc build-depends on dpatch BUT I don't install build-deps: pbuilder installs them inside the chroot when building
[04:13] <ogra> Treenaks, yes
[04:13] <Treenaks> ogra: so I had to install dpatch OUTSIDE my chroot to be able to build the source package
[04:13] <Treenaks> ogra: which I then gave to pbuilder
[04:14] <Lathiat> but it should whinge if build-deps arent satisfied?
[04:14] <Lathiat> mine did
[04:14] <ogra> Treenaks, so dpatch is called from the clean target ? 
[04:14] <ogra> Treenaks, thats not nice
[04:14] <Treenaks> ogra: yes
[04:14] <Lathiat> ah
[04:14] <Treenaks> Lathiat: -S works always
[04:15] <Lathiat> right
[04:20] <smurfix> Does anybody know if/when elmo will show up again?
[04:20] <Treenaks> "When time permits" ?
[04:21] <smurfix> "Time is an illusion. Lunchtime doubly so."
[04:21] <Treenaks> smurfix: I wish
[04:39] <lamont> daniels: so I see -35, are we waiting for NEW love on the new packages?
[04:47] <CavalierBob> Hi all.
[04:48] <CavalierBob> Sorry to bother the dev list with this, but I'm seeing a MD5Sums mismatch on a package in Main for 2 days now. Can someone here look at it or should I file a bug?
[04:49] <Hieronymus> CavalierBob: not using us.archive.ubuntu.com are you?
[04:50] <CavalierBob> Hieronymus: As a matter of fact, I see I am...problem there?
[04:51] <lamont> CavalierBob: sounds like a mirror bug
[04:51] <lamont> rather than an ubuntu bug
[04:51] <CavalierBob> Right, I'll switch mirrors and give it a try again. Thanks!
[05:10] <sabdfl> jbailey: schnaaaake!
[05:11] <sabdfl> hey anibal, how do you get the .biz from .fi?
[05:11] <anibal> sabdfl, by using dircproxy
[05:12] <sabdfl> anibal: cute!
[05:12] <Lathiat> You can have your reverse dns at anything
[05:12] <Lathiat> my aussie dsl is penguins.squaa.org
[05:12] <jbailey> sabdfl: heyhey
[05:14] <seb128> elmo: glib2.0 (experimental) inkscape hardware-monitor meld anjuta syncs please
[05:28] <jbailey> hmm.
[05:28] <jbailey> Oh yeah, debuild clears the path.
[05:28] <jbailey> whups, ECHAN
[05:42] <pitti> Hi
[05:43] <ogra> oh, the finnish ubuntu security team is around :)
[05:43] <ogra> pitti, how is HEL ?
[05:45] <pitti> ogra: nice indeed; much hotter and greener than I expected
[05:46] <seb128> hey pitti 
[05:46] <pitti> Hi seb128, how are you
[05:47] <aio> is there a problm with libstdc++6_4.0-0pre6ubuntu7_i386?
[05:47] <seb128> pitti: a bit overloaded (new GNOME version this week, bug flood, and specs to move this week) but fine :)
[05:47] <aio> i keep getting an MD5Sum mismatch error on it.
[05:47] <crimsun> aio: use a different mirror.
[05:47] <Kamion> aio: if you're using us.archive.ubuntu.com, try a different mirror
[05:50] <zyga> hello
[05:50] <zyga> symphony os makers have released an interesting document about UI design
[05:51] <zyga> I thought that someone might be interested: http://homepage.mac.com/jasonspisak/Mezzo/Menu3.html
[05:59] <rob^> I'm getting this when trying to find and import my gpg key in Lauchpad: Key was claimed, sending email to :.At least one UID should be validated to get the key imported as yours.
[05:59] <rob^> any ideas?
[06:01] <Hieronymus> you need to be part of web of trust I think.
[06:02] <ogra> yes, your key should be on a keyserver and valid
[06:02] <rob^> which keyserver does it use?
[06:02] <ogra> rob^, ask in #launchpad ?
[06:03] <rob^> ok
[06:19] <sebest> hello, anyone knows the name of the package that contains the "notification area" applet?
[06:20] <Lathiat> sebest: gnome-applets i suspect
[06:20] <seb128> gnome-panel
[06:20] <Lathiat> ahah, yes
[06:20] <seb128> /usr/lib/gnome-panel/notification-area-applet
[06:21] <sebest> i'm trying to find why it doesn't handle panel transparency
[06:22] <Lathiat> sebest: part of thats probably due to the icons being xembedded
[06:23] <Lathiat> hrm, the patch for the window list should go in
[06:23] <sebest> lathiat, you mean embeded in the code?
[06:23] <Lathiat> and clearlooks needs som elove on its handles
[06:23] <Lathiat> sebest: nah like, when an application displays an icon
[06:23] <Lathiat> sebest: aiui, its an X windows from another application
[06:23] <Lathiat> so i dunno if you can fix that within notif applet or if its due to the implementation
[06:24] <sebest> ah, i see
[06:24] <Lathiat> feel free to poke..
[06:25] <sebest> oki, i'm :)
[06:44] <hughsie> ogra:ping
[06:44] <ogra> hughsie, pong.... soryy, havent packaged yet
[06:44] <hughsie> ogra: don;t bother, i have new things... :-)
[06:45] <hughsie> let me run these past you as an ubuntu'er
[06:45] <ogra> ok
[06:46] <hughsie> package "pmscripts" contains /usr/sbin/pm-shutdown pm-hibernate, pm-suspend. It's designed for distros to tweak to what they want.
[06:46] <hughsie> package powermanager contains simple dbus server that lets ordinary users execute just these scripts according to polict in /etc/dbus
[06:47] <hughsie> package gnome-power contains all the gui and configuarion, and the session daemon
[06:47] <ogra> so we have a backend server now ?
[06:47] <ogra> who listens for the dbus messages ?
[06:48] <hughsie> not really a server, it just lets normal users do things like echo "disk" > /sys/power/state
[06:48] <hughsie> in a safe way of course
[06:49] <ogra> how is this safe way designed ? how do you work around using suid ?
[06:49] <hughsie> ogra: how do I do a private chat in x-chat?
[06:49] <hughsie> using the permissions in dbus
[06:49] <hughsie> not suid.
[06:49] <hughsie> suid bad ;-)
[06:49] <mdke> is the website down?
[06:49] <mdke> i can't connect
[06:51] <mgalvin> mdke, which site?
[06:52] <mgalvin> i can hit ubuntu.com
[06:52] <mdke> hmm
[06:52] <mdke> i can't
[06:52] <mdke> weird
[06:52] <mdke> whats the ip address?
[06:52] <mgalvin> i do know there have been some dns issues in th uk...
[06:52] <mgalvin> over the past few days
[06:52] <lamont> Kamion/elmo: binutils-hppa64 universe->main please
[06:53] <mdke> ah
[06:53] <mgalvin> thats why i have had such bad speeds to site over there
[06:53] <mgalvin> coming from the us
[06:53] <mgalvin> anyway
[06:53] <mdke> okies
[06:53] <mgalvin> 82.211.81.130
[06:54] <mdke> i can't ping it
[06:55] <mgalvin> hmm, i can
[06:57] <lamont> Kamion/elmo: gcc-* kinda build-dep it for hppa
[07:01] <Kamion> lamont: leaving that to elmo, I don't know the policy on main stuff for hppa
[07:05] <lamont> Kamion: np.  one more thing for elmo's list. :)
[07:06] <lamont> some other stuff has moved (gcc-3.4-hppa64, I believe), but the scripts don't do it automatically
[07:08] <lamont> otoh, none of the gcc uploads for hppa have made hte archive, so that's a bad example
[07:09] <lamont> well, all the hppa-specific kernel packages are in main anyway...
[07:10] <lamont> but enough for now... /me ->work
[07:23] <mgalvin> hey guys, what installation types/methods will be supported in breezy (cdrom, smb, tftp, etc...)?
[07:27] <Kamion> mgalvin: no additional methods currently planned over hoary
[07:28] <mgalvin> Kamion, ok and what are the "Officially Supported" types now
[07:29] <Kamion> mgalvin: http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/hoary/main/installer-i386/current/doc/manual/en/ch02s02.html
[07:29] <mgalvin> need to know for docs
[07:29] <mgalvin> Kamion, thanks!
[07:29] <Kamion> you should already be referring to that manual
[07:46] <ogra> pitti_, ping
[07:46] <mdke> i still can't hit ubuntu.com
[07:54] <pitti_> Hi ogra
[07:55] <pitti_> Hi doko :-)
[07:56] <Mez> :'( you say hi to them but not me :'(
[07:57] <doko> hi pitti
[07:57] <Mez> :P
[07:57] <pitti_> Mez: ENOREALNAME
[07:58] <pitti_> ogra_: ping2
[07:58] <Mez> pitti_, huh?
[08:00] <carstenh> "ircname  : Mez" vs. "ircname  : Martin Pitt"
[08:03] <hughsie> pitti_ : can you join g-p-conspiracy plz
[08:13] <Mez> people IRL call me Mez...
[08:13] <Mez> so that's my name
[08:15] <carstenh> thats your nich, but not your realname
[08:16] <carstenh> nick
[08:17] <carstenh> it's not your nick that is wrong, it's the ircname-field. try /whois somenick
[08:46] <neiras> Hello - Is there a MOTU present? We're having a package problem
[08:48] <neiras> The Hoary package 'ruby1.8' is two days older than the stable ruby1.8 - it's actually a pre-release. Some ruby applications are requiring the stable edition and refusing to run.
[08:49] <srbaker_> yo
[08:49] <neiras> Seems like a pretty good candidate for a hoary update, since there were some important fixes to ruby in that time
[08:50] <crimsun> neiras: sorry, we MOTUs aren't in charge of that. It's a package in main.
[08:50] <neiras> okay. How should we proceed?
[08:51] <ogra> crimsun, ECHAN ? 
[08:51] <ogra> ;)
[08:51] <crimsun> ogra: I thought too, but he asked in here ;)
[08:51] <srbaker_> oh for fuck sakes
[08:51] <srbaker_> there's more energy wasted talking about which chan to talk in than sovling the fucking problem
[08:52] <crimsun> chill, srbaker_ 
[08:52] <JanC> srbaker_ : the MOTUs *can't* solve this
[08:52] <srbaker_> JanC: i know.
[08:53] <JanC> so don't yell at them, you might need them later  ;)
[08:53] <crimsun> keep in mind that quite a few of the developers are at DebConf, so resources are limited
[08:53] <neiras> So who can?
[08:53] <neiras> Should I be filing a bug on this or what
[08:53] <srbaker_> jbailey: is this soemthing you can deal with?  i know you're home :)
[08:54] <JanC> a bug report is always good
[08:54] <crimsun> neiras: the easiest resolution at this point would be to adjust the version check in whatever application
[08:54] <neiras> I can do that, but we need this working yesterday and a lot of people will be experiencing the issue shortly... It'd be good to have an official fix asap
[08:54] <jbailey> srbaker_: Is there a bugzilla entry filed for it with the exact text of an error message?  Nothing will get into Hoary now without a decent bug report and some information as to why the bug is important.
[08:55] <srbaker_> crimsun: the check isn't what depends on the new ruby.  it's the code that will break that depends on the new version
[08:55] <neiras> crimsun, the fixes were critical.
[08:55] <ogra> important == dataloss or big security hole
[08:55] <crimsun> then jeff has the correct resolution, which is to file a bug with the proper details
[08:55] <srbaker_> crimsun: they wouldn't have added a version check if it didn't require the new version
[08:55] <srbaker_> good
[09:26] <neiras> I've added https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=12613 if anyone is interested or knows who should see it.
[09:28] <Amaranth> neiras: That's sick.
[09:29] <Amaranth> neiras: ruby apps make you upgrade to a version released on an exact day?
[09:29] <neiras> Amaranth, 1.8.2 is stable - why is prerelease code being shipped in Hoary anyway?
[09:29] <Burgundavia> neiras, didn't make the code freeze
[09:29] <Burgundavia> I gues
[09:29] <neiras> Burgundavia, true, but that's what updates are for :/
[09:30] <Amaranth> no
[09:30] <Amaranth> hoary-updates is for crashers and/or very serious bugs
[09:31] <Amaranth> this might qualify, but i have a feeling it'll be like firefox
[09:31] <neiras> Amaranth, it's not like this is an everyday occurrence for Ruby apps. The fixes that went into Ruby in that timeframe were for serious bugs
[09:31] <Amaranth> in two days they fixed a bunch of serious bugs and released?
[09:31] <neiras> Apps that are checking this would otherwise be affected.
[09:31] <neiras> It was caught late.
[09:31] <Amaranth> if so, i don't think i want to trust ruby
[09:32] <neiras> That's up to you, but some people have to :)
[09:32] <Amaranth> if the bugs are as serious as you make it sound and were hard to find, they should have taken more than 2 days to get fixed and QA'ed
[09:32] <neiras> there's a time for purism, and a time for pragmatism
[09:32] <neiras> shoulda/coulda/wouldas aren't useful right now :)
[09:32] <Burgundavia> neiras, this post to the Ubuntu devel mailing list making your case
[09:33] <neiras> Burgundavia, shall do, thanks.
[09:55] <srbaker_> Amaranth: shipping pre-release software is stupid at best, and is certainly cause for an update
[09:58] <lamont> doko: you around?
[09:59] <doko> lamont: yes
[09:59] <doko> where does gcc fail? ;-)
[10:01] <fabbione> doko: any news about the gcc ICE's ?
[10:01] <fabbione> specially the one on ppc i am interested in
[10:01] <doko> fabbione: no, not yet. sorry. distracted with gcc-4.0 FTBS on alpha.
[10:02] <fabbione> doko: ok.... 
[10:02] <doko> and I use the time to pester goto, as long as he's here ;)
[10:04] <ogra> poor guy
[10:04] <ogra> :)
[10:06] <doko> lucky ogra until I don't have time for him
[10:07] <ogra> doko, be careful ;)
[10:25] <ogra> heh
[10:25] <ivoks> ;)
[10:26] <doko> well, better not, ubuntu is about humanity ...
[10:26] <fabbione> doko: ahaha
[10:27] <doko> just got a grappa from enrico, and it's thom's birthday
[10:27] <fabbione> ohi
[10:28] <fabbione> grappa is good, isn't it?
[10:28] <doko> sweeet
[10:28] <fabbione> ehehe
[10:28] <ogra> happy b-day thom !!
[10:28] <fabbione> i really wish i could have come
[10:30] <doko> ogra: I'll tell him
[10:31] <ogra> thanks
[10:39] <thesaltydog> ogra, ?
[10:39] <mdke> hey thesaltydog!
[10:40] <ogra> thesaltydog, ?
[10:41] <thesaltydog> here I am oliver. A m inute?
[10:42] <ogra> yep
[10:42] <thesaltydog> i have not yet installed breezy, but a friend told me there is a BUM mini-clone in it.. What is?
[10:43] <ogra> thesaltydog, its the service manager from gnome-system-tools
[10:43] <thesaltydog> are you including the whole GST?
[10:44] <ogra> we had it always in... only disabled the things that were not stable enough....its a part of gnome
[10:44] <thesaltydog> ogra, yes. So you "downgraded" the service tool..:-)
[10:46] <ogra> no, we just didnt compile it... it was always in the source but what you see now is a rewrite without the dangerous parts and a easier ui...
[10:46] <ogra> i admit it looks a bit like a dumbed down bum 
[10:46] <ogra> but its C
[10:46] <ogra> with the default gst perl backend ....
[10:46] <thesaltydog> I have rewritten Baobab in C. A couple of days it will be online.
[10:47] <ogra> great :)
[10:47] <ogra> looks really neat
[10:47] <thesaltydog> a couple of debian mainainers asked me to get BUM in debian main inclusion...
[10:47] <ogra> yay
[10:47] <ogra> thats great
[10:48] <ogra> you should definately do that 
[10:48] <thesaltydog> yes I will, even if I designed it for ubuntu..
[10:48] <ogra> and i guess you learned eough about packaging the last months to apply for maintainership yourself ;) 
[10:48] <thesaltydog> booooring
[10:49] <ogra> hehe
[10:49] <thesaltydog> once finished the C verison of Baobab, could I upload it in REVU?
[10:49] <ogra> sure
[10:49] <thesaltydog> I'll send you a memo, then.
[10:50] <ogra> yep :)
[10:50] <thesaltydog> thanks Oliver, bye.
[10:50] <ogra> bye :)
[11:16] <slomo> hi... i've created an updated faad2 package which now uses the original upstream source (which wasn't the case with the package currently in breezy). it's uploaded here http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/details.py?upid=88 now the question is what to do with the changed tarball as there is no new upstream version and the two would collide when uploaded
[11:18] <Kamion> slomo: there's no way to do that other than to invent a version for the changed upstream tarball that you're confident won't collide with any other upstream release
[11:19] <slomo> Kamion: maybe something like faad2-2.0.0.ubuntu.orig.tar.gz for the tarball?
[11:20] <Kamion> "ubuntu" implies that the changes to the upstream source originated with Ubuntu, which apparently isn't accurate here
[11:20] <Kamion> I'd go with something more like 2.0.0real
[11:20] <Kamion> what are the changes in the .orig.tar.gz currently in breezy versus what upstream released?
[11:21] <slomo> at least all the files created by autoreconf and a config.log
[11:23] <Kamion> 2.0.0clean would be an option too
[11:24] <slomo> ok, i'll take 2.0.0clean then :) thanks
[11:26] <slomo> the current version is 2.0.0-0.5... would the new one be 2.0.0clean-0ubuntu1?
[11:35] <slomo> Kamion?
[11:37] <Kamion> slomo: yes - but please co-ordinate with the Debian maintainer so that we don't get into a state where the Debian maintainer uploads 2.0.0clean as well and then we're unable to sync it because it's a different .orig.tar.gz
[11:37] <Kamion> (which would be a pain)
[11:37] <sabdfl> hy guys
[11:37] <Kamion> hi Mark
[11:37] <sabdfl> err... hey
[11:37] <slomo> Kamion: there is no debian maintainer... this package was imported from marillat's repository
[11:38] <ogra> hey sabdfl 
[11:39] <Kamion> slomo: oh, er, eek
[11:39] <Kamion> slomo: co-ordinate with Marillat then if you can :-)
[11:39] <Kamion> .orig.tar.gz desyncs are a nightmare
[11:39] <ogra> Kamion, do we actively import from there ? 
[11:39] <sabdfl> hiya ogra
[11:39] <ogra> i thought that was a one time thing
[11:39] <ajmitch> hi
[11:40] <sabdfl> ogra: sync before release too, i think
[11:40] <ogra> sabdfl, ah
[11:40] <ogra> sabdfl, looks bad for squeak, did elmo talk to you ? 
[11:41] <sabdfl> ogra: notyet, i'll ask him tomorrow
[11:41] <Kamion> ogra: there's support in katie for doing so; it's currently commented out so it looks like something elmo does periodically
[11:41] <Kamion> sabdfl: we should be doing that sometime around now for breezy I think, since upstream-version-freeze was end of last week
[11:41] <ogra> sabdfl, great... 
[11:41] <slomo> Kamion: i've rewritten the complete package because of this and added me as maintainer... i've written marillat before and his answer was to talk to ubuntu to solve this
[11:41] <Kamion> hoary was a rush and would ideally not be repeated :)
[11:42] <Kamion> slomo: ok, typical unhelpful response from him there
[11:43] <sabdfl> Kamion: ok, dholbach did it last time
[11:43] <sabdfl> he'd likely be happy to do it sooner this time
[11:43] <dholbach> erm
[11:43] <dholbach> what are you guys talking about? ;)
[11:43] <slomo> Kamion: so it's ok the way i did it?
[11:43] <sabdfl> you!
[11:43] <Kamion> dholbach: syncs from non-Debian sources
[11:43] <Kamion> slomo: probably about the best you're going to get
[11:44] <dholbach> Kamion: yeah, that was funny, especially the wiki-bit ;)
[11:44] <dholbach> i think i'll have the lists of packages-to-be-imported ready 2 weeks for release
[11:44] <slomo> kafeine: ok, fine... thanks for your help :)
[11:44] <dholbach> that should suffice, shouldnt it?
[11:44] <slomo> hum, i meant Kamion... sorry
[11:46] <ogra> dholbach, Kamion wants UVF for universe too....
[11:46] <Kamion> ogra: not just me, I checked that with mdz first
[11:46] <dholbach> i'm going to cry
[11:46] <ogra> dholbach, Kamion and mdz want UVF for universe too
[11:46] <ogra> :)
[11:47] <Kamion> obviously UVF would be applied to universe rather more leniently than to main
[11:47] <dholbach> i'll have time for this 6 weeks before release
[11:47] <ajmitch> Kamion: UVF being last week?
[11:47] <dholbach> and we have millions of new packages to get in
[11:47] <Kamion> ajmitch: right
[11:47] <ogra> ajmitch, yep
[11:47] <Kamion> remember guys, there will be more releases; there's always a newness/stability trade-off
[11:47] <dholbach> (MOTUNewPackages, REVU, UniverseCandidates, AptGetOrg, ...)
[11:48] <ajmitch> how will UVF affect new packages coming in?
[11:48] <dholbach> and we're lagging so much behind review wise
[11:48] <Kamion> of course entirely new packages don't have the same constraints, since they're clearly not liable to break stuff that people are already using
[11:48] <dholbach> ajmitch: they won't come in
[11:48] <Kamion> ajmitch: not clear exactly what the rules are for those, haven't talked to mdz
[11:48] <dholbach> Kamion: that's nice :)
[11:48] <Kamion> but I think the above is roughly sensible ...
[11:49] <dholbach> yeah
[11:49] <ajmitch> Kamion: sounds good
[11:49] <dholbach> ok, if we're able to get the new crack in shortly before release, i'm happy
[11:50] <ogra> dholbach, NEW is not very much... 
[11:50] <dholbach> because i already feel bad for not doing enough reviews and letting lots of people wait on their good work
[11:50] <dholbach> ogra: ?
[11:50] <ogra> dholbach, is all apt-get.org new ? 
[11:50] <ogra> i doubt it
[11:51] <dholbach> ogra: of course not, but think of all the new packages
[11:51] <dholbach> ogra: and the annoyed motu hopefuls
[11:51] <dholbach> ogra: the new packages would be their chance to get in (and rewarded for their work)
[11:51] <dholbach> but oh well... i think we don't have to discuss this
[11:52] <ogra> dholbach, sure, but we still have about 500 C++ packages to gain fame with....and idontknowhowmany broken x dependencys through the modularization
[11:52] <ajmitch> we've got > 20 new packages waiting for review on revu
[11:52] <dholbach> ogra: sure
[11:53] <Kamion> siretart: mm, there's probably some awkward slang2 stuff pending
[11:53] <dholbach> ajmitch: don't forget MOTUNewPackages and MOTUToReview
[11:53] <Kamion> not quite sure what to do about that as it affects the installer
[11:53] <ogra> ajmitch, thats nothing compared to the broken stuff
[11:53] <dholbach> ogra: i'll try to set up UniverseUnmetDeps in the next days - that'll be a start to sink our teeth in
[11:53] <ajmitch> ogra: so what's the current motu todo list that people really need done?
[11:54] <siretart> Kamion: uuh. sounds annoying. how difficult will be the transition? just a few build depends or porting work?
[11:54] <Kamion> siretart: bit of both
[11:54] <siretart> :/
[11:54] <ogra> ajmitch, C++ (still, sigh) ... xorg depending packages ....
[11:54] <Kamion> siretart: it's mostly done in Debian though
[11:54] <Kamion> I think just before UVF
[11:54] <dholbach> ajmitch: reviewing, MOM merging, fixing packages, malone/bugzilla :)
[11:54] <Kamion> at least all the installer-relevant stuff should be done
[11:54] <ajmitch> dholbach: fun
[11:54] <ogra> yes, what dholbach said