=== ealden [~ealden@219.90.94.70] has joined #ubuntu-doc === mgalvin [~mgalvin@cpe-69-205-46-35.nycap.res.rr.com] has joined #ubuntu-doc [02:49] hey guys [02:53] salut [02:53] nice patches [02:54] thnx === FLeiXiuS [~fleixius@pcp0010487351pcs.essex01.md.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc === rob^ [~rob@rob-ubuntu.student.supporter.pdpc] has joined #ubuntu-doc [03:27] mgalvin, I haven't filed that bug yet (I was tired, it was 2:30am) [03:28] I'm going to now [03:31] rob^, ok, i think cprov said it would be fixed in their next release [03:31] any ideas when that is? [03:32] nope, he just said that they were working on it [03:33] ok [03:36] how the heck do you get your password back for the wiki, it says to use Launchpad but that doesnt work [03:43] i think you can use the lost password feature and it should give it back to you [03:44] the wiki and lanuchpad use the same l/p [03:44] same db i think [03:44] yeah tried that, no good [03:46] hmm [03:47] you tried it from the wiki or from launchpad [03:48] the wiki tells yo to use launchpad, I can log into launchpad fine with the new password, just not the wiki [03:50] hmm, then i don't know, i did it a while ago and it had worked then... possibly another problem(possible regression) to discuss on #launchpad i guess [03:52] hmm === jsgotangco [~jgotangco@202.57.71.236] has joined #ubuntu-doc [04:20] jsgotangco! [04:25] hey jeffsch how are you? [04:26] ok, i guess. long time no talk eh? [04:26] jeffsch: i finally got to start on the styleguide on the international audience section [04:26] awesome! [04:27] what's up with the next meeting? is it still on? [04:27] of course [04:27] i'll update the agenda later [04:27] sorry i was quite busy with a client lately [04:28] (we're in the middle of an oracle implementation) [04:29] i won't be able to make it anyway. :( [04:29] time? [04:30] you think the 14:00UTC is a good time to make it permanent for regular meetings? [04:30] i can't make it the whole day... jury duty and then a class [04:31] whoa jury duty [04:31] :( [04:32] it's not so bad. [04:38] whats class are you taking? === jasoncohen [~jason@pcp0011382713pcs.ebrnsw01.nj.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc [04:40] jasoncohen: hello [04:40] hi [04:40] Burgundavia told me to come here. am i too late? [04:41] i assumed there was some discussion or a meeting going on [04:42] hmmm there is a meeting but its not today [04:42] when is it? [04:42] maybe i can help? [04:42] Burgundavia asked me to come here. I'm not sure why., and he appears to be idle now. Perhaps it's due to the wiki pages I've put up recently [04:43] on the 14th at 22:00UTC #ubuntu-meeting [04:43] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NewUserGuideMultimedia and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NewUserGuideAddingRepositories [04:43] im putting up a simple agenda later [04:43] oohhh [04:43] is there a problem? [04:44] none :) they are nice wiki pages [04:44] great [04:45] are you interested in joining the docteam? [04:45] i'm always open to suggestions. also, any idea how i could get a decent picture of totem. it just shows blue with all the screenshot programs i've used. i got it to work with xine. [04:45] have you tried imagemagick? [04:46] what kind of commitment does it entail? i like writing up wiki pages to help new users and would be willing to help- just don't want to commit to something that might be too time consuming [04:46] i have a few things going now- working on a project with mythtv and doing a legal research/investigative internship [04:47] well wiki gardening is one of things the team is working on [04:47] cleaning up wiki stuff, etc. [04:47] but not necessarily changing the content [04:47] no, i hadn't tried imagemagick [04:47] i actually was the one who added screenshots and some more description to the repositories howto [04:48] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AddingRepositoriesHowto [04:48] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TakingScreenshots [04:48] the desktop pic was from warty and had the wrong instructions for finding synaptic in the menu === robitaille [~daniel@d154-5-117-228.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc [04:48] robitaille: hello [04:49] jsgotangco, what else do you guys do? [04:49] jasoncohen: we write in DocBook XML [04:49] jsgotangco: hi. [04:49] we have our own repository where we maintain our source of ubuntu documents [04:50] cool [04:50] can someone explain to me what is this page about: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LocalSpellingWords [04:50] jasoncohen: our WIP stuff can be found here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocteamProjects [04:52] robitaille: weird page [04:52] oh...I think I have a guess: if you do a spell check, these must be the words that you add to the local directory. [04:52] hmmm but Robos is a guy [04:53] oh right [04:53] robitaille: i think it's for the wiki spellchecking feature [04:53] it's where the word list is kept, iirc [04:53] Well What will Windows wish with work working world would writing x86 years [04:53] haha [04:54] downloaded Hedgehog interested Manager official presented processor Production provided recent [04:54] hmmm... sounds like the kind of thing i would write :) === Skywind [~Skywind@218.104.86.222] has joined #ubuntu-doc [04:55] jeffsch: yes it is. I did a spell check on my wiki page, and added "university" to it just now. I guess there is no default dictionary, so users have to build one from scratch. [04:55] great. I can' [04:55] oops [04:55] jsgotangco, i'm on the phone. i'll be back soon [04:55] great, i can't wait until we get words like asdfjkl in there :) [04:55] hehe === Skywind [~Skywind@218.104.86.222] has left #ubuntu-doc [""] [04:56] would it be worth the effort to jumpstart that page and add a long series of words to it? [04:57] i wonder if someone could just paste in the wordlist that aspell uses [04:57] sounds fun but you might end up adminstering the dictionary itself [04:58] the thing I would afraid is how slow the spell check would become if that page contains thousand of entries [04:59] and all those words aren't even accurate to begin with [05:01] ok, i gotta run. c ya [05:02] ill brb as well === mpt [~mpt@203-167-186-120.dsl.clear.net.nz] has joined #ubuntu-doc === FLeiXiuS [~fleixius@pcp0010487351pcs.essex01.md.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc === robitaille [~daniel@d154-5-117-228.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc === Skywind [~Skywind@218.104.86.222] has joined #ubuntu-doc === FLeiXiuS [~fleixius@pcp0010487351pcs.essex01.md.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc === karlheg [~karlheg@host-250-237.resnet.pdx.edu] has joined #ubuntu-doc === rob^_ [~rob@rob-ubuntu.student.supporter.pdpc] has joined #ubuntu-doc === FLeiXiuS [~fleixius@pcp0010487351pcs.essex01.md.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc === karlheg [~karlheg@host-250-237.resnet.pdx.edu] has joined #ubuntu-doc === froud [~sean@ndn-165-142-120.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-doc [07:47] African Greetings === jsgotangco [~jgotangco@202.57.71.236] has joined #ubuntu-doc === jsgotangco [~jgotangco@202.57.71.236] has left #ubuntu-doc [] [08:06] later dudes, many meetings today :-) [08:06] cya === jsgotangco [~user@202.57.71.236] has joined #ubuntu-doc [08:10] hello [08:11] jsgotangco, I pointed jasoncohen at here [08:11] because I was concerned about duplication of effort [08:11] and mildly concerned about a few docs he had written [08:12] i didnt read the wiki pages in-depth btw [08:12] his new user adding repos advocated using the commandline [08:12] which we should frown upon [08:12] even if it harder for us [08:13] but but but ...I love the cli :) [08:13] right, my step-mother doesn't [08:13] now sod off === jsgotangco checks again [08:14] robitaille, you going to be at vlug tomorrow> [08:14] ? [08:14] Burgundavia: probably not. it seems my wife has plan something else for tomorrow night. But it's not set in stone yet. So I may be there...but probably unlikely [08:14] damn [08:15] it's my fault: I forgot to tell her that I had something else that night. [08:16] AddingRepositoriesHowto seems reasonable to me. It tackled synaptic first before going to cli [08:18] the NewUserGuideAddingRepositories page though is very cli oriented [08:23] jsgotangco: to complete an earlier discussion: http://moinmoin.wikiwikiweb.de/LocalSpellingWords [08:23] another proof that this type of spell check in a wiki doesn't really work that well... especially in a mostly German+English wiki [08:24] oh my god those are awesome haha [08:25] about any code create elementary [08:55] brb === karlheg [~karlheg@host-250-237.resnet.pdx.edu] has joined #ubuntu-doc === robitaille [~daniel@d154-5-117-228.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc === mpt [~mpt@203-167-186-120.dsl.clear.net.nz] has joined #ubuntu-doc === Burgundavia [~corey@S0106000000cc07fc.gv.shawcable.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc === mdke [~matt@81-178-112-178.dsl.pipex.com] has joined #ubuntu-doc === Kinnison [~dsilvers@haddenham.pepperfish.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc === sivang [~sivang@box79162.elkhouse.de] has joined #ubuntu-doc === jsgotangco [~jgotangco@202.57.71.235] has joined #ubuntu-doc === FLeiXiuS [~fleixius@pcp0010487351pcs.essex01.md.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc [10:41] mdke: ping? [10:44] hi [10:44] jsgotangco, sup dude [10:51] gtg [10:51] be back later [10:51] been talking in #gnome-hackers about docs [10:51] good discussion [10:51] jsgotangco, email if its urgent === enrico [~enrico@enrico.developer.debian] has joined #ubuntu-doc [11:02] morning Kinnison [11:03] hi burgey [11:03] how is my favourite gay englishman? [11:04] I haven't talked to you recently === Kinnison is fine thanks [11:04] busy as heck, but fine === Burgundavia is not-busy and unemployed [11:04] :-( [11:05] :-( [11:05] But you seem to have a new girlfriend [11:05] same one actually [11:05] Aaah [11:05] we have had some stormy times, but are back together again === Kinnison nods [11:06] read my XP rants, did you? [11:06] yeah [11:06] in good news, there will now be an Ubuntu machine at my parents house [11:07] my step-mother is going to switch this wed. [11:08] Excellent === Kinnison 's father is loving his Ubuntu box [11:08] with my brother jumped and my grandparents moving, that leaves only my father left [11:11] I have to sleep, talk to you again [11:19] Kinnison: :-) [11:19] hi sivang === jsgotangco [~jgotangco@202.57.71.235] has joined #ubuntu-doc [12:46] back === Seveas [~seveas@seveas.demon.nl] has joined #ubuntu-doc === jsgotangco [~jgotangco@202.57.71.235] has joined #ubuntu-doc === Njal [~neil@dsl-80-43-203-32.access.as9105.com] has joined #ubuntu-doc [01:44] lo [01:44] hi Njal [01:45] hows you? [01:45] good thanks, you? [01:46] not so good [01:46] Njal, how come? [01:46] my girlfriend and i have split up [01:47] ah sorry to hear that [01:47] And that on top of the heat and my bad digestive system has resulted in a inability to actually eat without being sick [01:48] oh dear [01:48] seen a doctor? [01:48] yeah there's nothing wrong with me apparently [01:50] anyway i came here to ask if it would be possible to not send any email's to my address for about 3 weeks? [01:50] Im going to be on holiday and wont have access to a PC [01:51] you can disable mail delivery from ubuntu lists using your account preferences [01:51] http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-doc [01:53] ah good coz i hate having to spend hours deleting email's it better to just disable email's and spend the time svn uping [01:54] agreed [02:01] ah done === rwabel [~rwabel@gw.ptr-80-238-131-184.customer.ch.netstream.com] has joined #ubuntu-doc === jjesse [~jjesse@mail.ftpb.com] has joined #ubuntu-doc [02:10] Um since im working on the gnome terminal bit of the userguide should i include trick's like how to use escape sequences etc? [02:12] ??? [02:12] quick question there is the k menu in kubuntu but in gnome is it called the footprint? or what is it called? [02:13] jjesse, there are three menus, one is applications, one is places, one is system [02:13] the applicattions menu, th place's menu or the system menu i suppose [02:13] ok thanks mdke and njal [02:15] working on the k menu portion in the kde userguide and wanted to compare things === mgalvin [~mgalvin@host-66-202-95-170.spr.choiceone.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc === gtaylor [~gtaylor@130-127-67-44.lehotsky.clemson.edu] has joined #ubuntu-doc === gtaylor [~gtaylor@130-127-67-44.lehotsky.clemson.edu] has left #ubuntu-doc ["Kopete] === mdke [~matt@mdke.user] has joined #ubuntu-doc [04:02] come back! [04:06] i can't seem to apply rob's patches [04:12] doh [04:16] i suck [04:16] why now mdke? [04:16] because I never learnt how patches work properly [04:17] grin me either to be honest [04:17] we should have a patch class :) [05:14] mdke: ping [05:15] yo jeffsch [05:15] here's how I did the patch: [05:15] jeff@cloud:~/ubuntu-doc/generic/faqguide/C $ ls -l [05:15] total 344 [05:15] -rw-r--r-- 1 jeff jeff 1290 2005-06-30 09:21 faqguide-C.omf [05:15] -rw-r--r-- 1 jeff jeff 321817 2005-07-10 17:22 faqguide.xml [05:15] -rw-r--r-- 1 jeff jeff 9128 2005-07-10 17:21 faqguide.xml.diff [05:15] -rw-r--r-- 1 jeff jeff 3825 2005-07-12 07:57 faqguide.xml.diff7 [05:15] drwxr-xr-x 3 jeff jeff 4096 2005-05-31 13:30 sample [05:16] jeff@cloud:~/ubuntu-doc/generic/faqguide/C $ patch et voila! [05:17] the magic part being "patch hmm [05:17] i wonder why it didn't work for me [05:17] that's what I did :) [05:17] what was the error? [05:17] jeffsch, anyhow thanks for doing it! [05:17] jeffsch, i can't remember i'm afraid [05:22] grin thanks for the class jeffsch === netjoined: irc.freenode.net -> kornbluth.freenode.net === uniq [charlie@213.184.199.55] has joined #ubuntu-doc [05:43] getting some momentum up on the userguide === froud [~sean@ndn-165-134-250.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-doc === froud [~sean@ndn-165-134-250.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-doc === Burgundavia [~corey@24.68.140.150] has joined #ubuntu-doc === gtaylor [~gtaylor@130-127-67-44.lehotsky.clemson.edu] has joined #ubuntu-doc === gtaylor [~gtaylor@130-127-67-44.lehotsky.clemson.edu] has left #ubuntu-doc ["Kopete] [08:47] hey froud [08:48] that business about having to follow the section structure even in xpointers is incredibly irritating :D [08:54] :-) [08:55] froud, is there no workaround? [08:55] bring in nodes individually :-) [08:56] that is what I did, but I want to bring in a sect2 as a sect1 [08:56] or create an xpath that will bring it in === froud [~sean@ndn-165-134-250.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-doc === Burgundavia [~corey@S0106000000cc07fc.gv.shawcable.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc [09:57] hi [09:57] hi [09:57] I've made some changes on the documentation section in the wiki. [09:57] k [09:57] I've talked with Matt [09:58] hi there rwabel [09:58] Matt? [09:58] yus [09:58] cool I dont do wiki, ah ther ehe is [09:58] ahh [09:58] :) [09:58] I've made changes now [09:58] looking [09:58] no documents are lost :-) I've rearranget some of them. let me know what u think [09:59] what changes have you made? [09:59] in the documentation section [09:59] i can't see any differences to UserDocumentation [09:59] structur [09:59] oh on the FrontPage? [09:59] right [10:00] is that not ok? [10:00] rwabel, its better not to edit the Frontpage, and make the amendments on the UserDocumentation page [10:00] ah ok [10:00] in my opinion it's already that part who needs get changed [10:00] which part? [10:00] mh where can I ask about that [10:01] about what? [10:01] well the problem is that the the documentation section, in my opinion, is already kinda badly [10:01] that's why I've changed. And I've put the links from UserDocumentation in different sections [10:01] rwabel, i agree, but you should work on the documentation section, rather than the FrontPage [10:02] rwabel, the FrontPage pointed clearly to the UserDocumentation page, to allow people to follow that link if they are looking for documentation [10:02] ok, I thought it would be ok. in the forum I've posted my idea about the FrontPage part [10:02] Ok, I'll undo it...but where can I ask about to make FrontPage changes [10:03] rwabel, you can ask us [10:03] :-) [10:03] we have had months of discussing the wiki structure on our list [10:04] and that was the final structure? [10:04] Yes [10:04] oh, ok what a pity :-( [10:04] because I think also other users don't like it's structure [10:05] I can remember when I came first there...honestly I've left after some seconds [10:05] rwabel, I agree that the structure of the wiki is bad, but this needs to be addressed not only on the Frontpage: this frontpage points to the documentation section, _that_ is what needs to be edited IMO [10:05] well I've only looked at the documentation section. [10:05] you have removed the link to the UserDocumentation page, which should be the basic starting point for documentation [10:06] no it should all be back again [10:06] i like the links you've made, but i think that they should be on the UserDocumentation page [10:06] what do you think? === gtaylor [~gtaylor@130-127-67-44.lehotsky.clemson.edu] has joined #ubuntu-doc [10:07] you mean my part * ["Newbie"] - New to Ubuntu & Linux [10:07] * ["Kubuntu"] - Here you can find all documentation concerning Kubuntu, Ubuntu with the KDE desktop! [10:07] * ["Installation"] - Installing, updating & maintaining Ubuntu [10:07] * HardwareDrivers - Howto's to get hardware and drivers to work [10:07] * ["Software"] - Howto's to get software to work [10:07] * [http://www.ubuntuguide.org/ Unoffical Ubtunuguide (might have some errors!)] [10:07] yes === gtaylor [~gtaylor@130-127-67-44.lehotsky.clemson.edu] has left #ubuntu-doc ["Kopete] [10:07] well why not...but all information would be in my part already [10:07] what users have a problem with is not the structure of the FrontPage, it is with the structure of the wiki in general [10:07] I mean: [10:08] # [10:08] Amongst a lot of other pages in the documentation section, you can find: [10:08] * [10:08] HowToGetHelp - this page lists all the various resources available to you, to find help with your Ubuntu system! Make sure you check this page if you have a problem! [10:08] * [10:08] GettingUbuntu - How to get a copy of Ubuntu [10:08] * [10:08] Accessibility - docs related to accessibility [10:08] * [10:08] HardwareSupport and SupportedArchitectures - Check if your hardware works with Ubuntu [10:08] * [10:08] FrequentlyAskedQuestions and [WWW] FAQ database [10:08] * [10:08] [WWW] Glossary [10:08] rwabel, i can see the page, you don't have to paste it [10:08] this stuff I've put in, what is in my opinion where it fits [10:09] basically users go to the wiki, and they see the link to UserDocumentation, they click on it, they find a mess. This is the real problem we have right now [10:09] I just think, that when someone new comes to the wiki. it would be great for him to see ah something for newusers, ah information about installation [10:09] if you insert your material into the UserDocumentation page, i think that will be a great improvement [10:09] i agree with you [10:09] we just disagree on where to put it [10:10] right :-) [10:10] I just could as you told me my parts in the UserDocumentation page. And it would already be a great improvement [10:10] I think so [10:10] then we can work on making the Frontpage more clearly point to UserDocumentation [10:11] ok [10:11] so that the UserDocumentation page provides a central point for all documentation related matters === froud [~sean@ndn-165-134-250.telkomadsl.co.za] has left #ubuntu-doc ["Konversation] [10:12] ok, give me some minutes and I'll present it...then we can look at the result again :-) [10:12] sure [10:13] i've added a sentence to make it clear that UserDocumentation is the central point for Documentation [10:13] how about the result now? [10:14] oh and we could also add the forum wiki delta on the UserDocumentation [10:14] hmm [10:14] you've removed all the other links! [10:14] right [10:14] they are all in undersections [10:15] all? [10:15] yes [10:15] that's not quite true [10:15] no? [10:15] which one is missing? [10:16] the external documents are missing for example [10:16] rwabel, don't you think it would be better for you to add links and preserve the existing ones? [10:16] fast change like this can be disconcerting for other people [10:16] external docuements should be there [10:17] they are under newbie [10:17] I agree, that it's a big change for people [10:17] === Debian-specific === [10:17] * [http://www.debian.org/doc/ Debian documentation index] [10:17] * [http://www.debian.org/doc/user-manuals Debian Documentation Project Users' Manuals] [10:17] * [http://www.togaware.com/linux/survivor/ GNU/Linux Desktop Survival Guide] [10:18] ? [10:18] ah i see them [10:18] for me the UserDocumentation was a mess. That's why I thought to have some categories would be great. [10:19] i like the structure you've given [10:19] Especially as the content grows and grow it would be overloaded [10:19] thanks [10:19] but couldn't the categories be on the UserDocumentation page as subheadings? [10:19] that way people can search one page, instead of having to check all the subpages [10:20] what do you think? [10:20] you mean instead of the 5 links I've made to have them all on the UserDocumentation site? [10:20] yes, with headings like == Hardware/Drivers == [10:20] what do you think? [10:20] wouldn't it get overloaded? [10:21] i don't think so [10:21] it has a number of advantages [10:21] I mean imagine having 20 howto's in software and 20 in hardware and then also the others getting bigger [10:21] 1. people can search for what they are looking for on one single page, rather than having to search multiple subpages [10:21] that's true [10:21] 2. it will be easier to convince people to add links for new documents in one page, rather than having to explain a complicated structure to everyone [10:22] i think it would be really cool [10:22] you are right, it's kinda the smarter way [10:22] okay let me do that [10:22] :)) [10:22] thanks for your work and energy [10:23] your welcome [10:28] done [10:29] that looks great [10:29] maybe we could write some text under each heading. would make it better. let me try [10:30] I will do some editing on it too later, but I won't change the structure, which I like [10:30] i think i would change the heading levels down one, e.g. change = to == and == to === [10:31] that way each main section will be divided by a line, but the subsections won't be [10:33] cool. I'll finish my part in about 10 or 15 minutes lately. Then it's time to watch some divx :-) I'll check your changes later [10:33] thanks for help [10:33] no problem [10:34] rwabel, are you subscribed to the docteam mailing list? [10:34] i will send an email out later and other people on the "wiki team" can discuss and help out [10:35] yes I've done that this afternoon [10:42] great [10:43] finished! :-) [10:43] cu [10:45] rwabel, great thanks, stay in touch! [10:45] we're always here [10:47] rwabel, i've made a change to the headings as I said above, let me know if you don't like it [10:47] oko [10:47] i'll just look at it [10:49] first didn't see the difference. but it looks good [10:50] ok cool [10:51] I think that was a good update. Next we need to import things from the forum wiki delta in the sections. is that ok? [10:52] rwabel, the things from the forum section should be imported first into the main section of the wiki as new pages, we can add links to such pages in UserDocumentation [10:54] which new page? on the FrontPage? [10:55] erm [10:56] for me it doesn't matter where to put software and hardware howto's, as long as there is a place :-) [10:56] if there is a useful howto that comes into the forum/wiki delta, the aim is to make a new page for it and make links to it in the Documentation page [10:56] do you follow me? [10:57] no really [10:57] if I've a howto [10:57] I'll put it in the forum/wiki delta [10:57] that's ok [10:57] and then? [10:57] then the howto is put into a page on the main wiki [10:58] and we make links to it in the documentation section [10:58] who put the howto in the page on the main wiki? and when? [10:58] where is that page in the main wiki? [10:58] rwabel, let me explain [10:58] let's use an example [10:59] rwabel, for example, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/forum/hardware/ndiswrapper [10:59] that page contains useful information from the forum [10:59] the main wiki contains a page about ndiswrapper [10:59] (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HowToSetUpNdiswrapper) [11:00] what we can do is to take the information from the first page and include it into the second page [11:00] rwabel, do you follow me? [11:00] yes [11:00] and how do I know that there is already such apage [11:01] the problem is that there is no list ? [11:01] you use the search facility [11:01] for example, I typed "ndiswrapper" into the search box [11:01] another example would be https://wiki.ubuntu.com/forum/hardware/lucent and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/WinModemLucent [11:02] in that example, I typed "lucent" into the search box [11:02]