[12:17] <wasabi__> So, is there some sort of easy way or command to remove a package and everything it depends on?
[12:18] <wasabi__> snip  a branch of the dependency tree
[12:19] <Riddell> daniels: most of KDE doesn't compile since libXrender.la was removed
[12:20] <wasabi__> X itself doesn't install currently. :0
[12:59] <mwh_> Hi, not perticularly a devel question, but I couldnt seem to get an answer on #ubuntu, i'm looking for a list of the HP-laptops which will be certified for Breezy, anyone know where I can get it, you see I want a new laptop and I want to make sure Ubuntu runs flawlessly on it
[01:00] <mwh_> ahh foundhttp://www.ubuntulinux.org/support/custom/hplaptops
[01:02] <daniels> Riddell: word
[01:02] <daniels> lamont-away: pong
[01:02] <daniels> Kamion: xkeyboard-config should be OK
[01:03] <Riddell> daniels: word?
[01:03] <TerminX> daniels: did you see bug 12690?
[01:06] <mrd`> Bah, none of those laptops have AMD chips.
[01:08] <tseng> how would you handle this scenario
[01:08] <tseng> a binary package has 2 sets of files, set A and set B
[01:08] <tseng> the next version splits it off into two binaries
[01:08] <tseng> upgrading causes the usual "this file belongs to some other package" bit
[01:09] <daniels> TerminX: yeah
[01:10] <daniels> tseng: Replaces: foo (<< 1.2.3-4)
[01:10] <TerminX> will you move the files to xserver-xorg-core?
[01:10] <tseng> daniels: on both new binaries?
[01:10] <tseng> daniels: or the NEW binary, if you catch how i mean
[01:11] <daniels> tseng: well, let's say foo contains everything, and you split foo into foo, bar, and baz
[01:12] <daniels> both bar and baz need Replaces: foo (<< 1.2.3-4)
[01:12] <tseng> ok
[01:12] <daniels> assuming they contain files that used to be present in foo
[01:12] <tseng> indeed
[01:13] <tseng> thanks
[01:13] <daniels> Kamion: when you NEW xkeyboard-config, could you please add it to the same seeds as xserver-xorg?
[01:15] <daniels> heh
[01:15] <daniels> had xserver--core.install.* files through an accident of sed
[01:15] <daniels> felt like arch
[01:16] <lifeless> see, its good for you
[01:18] <Riddell> daniels: so how do I get KDE stuff compiling again without libXrender.la?
[01:21] <tseng> Kamion: ping
[01:22] <daniels> Riddell: grep -r libXrender.la /usr/lib, recompile anything which still references it
[01:22] <daniels> if you want to improve the world by getting rid of that project's .la file too, be my guest
[01:23] <tseng> Kamion: looking for a thumbs-up to sync gmime2.1 from unstable
[01:27] <katoc> hi, have you modified a ubuntu install cd 
[01:27] <katoc> ?
[01:29] <Riddell> daniels: so once lower level libraries are recompiled they will no longer reference libXrender.la and KDE should start compiling again?
[01:29] <daniels> Riddell: right
[01:30] <Riddell> daniels: ok, thanks
[01:32] <pef> good night !
[01:32] <daniels> mrd`: xkb is interesting right now
[01:32] <daniels> mrd`: make sure you have xkeyboard-config installed
[01:33] <mrd`> I don't see an xkeyboard-config package.
[01:34] <chrissturm> daniels: is keyboard handling broken in x right now? i cant set my keyboard layout
[01:34] <daniels> 00:32 < daniels> mrd`: xkb is interesting right now
[01:34] <daniels> 00:32 < daniels> mrd`: make sure you have xkeyboard-config installed
[01:34] <daniels> mrd`: hmm, mustn't have actually made it through NEW yet
[01:35] <mrd`> daniels: Is there an ETA on that?
[01:41] <davyd> tseng: I got most of the useful part of mono built
[01:41] <tseng> congrats
[01:41] <davyd> but I can't build gtk-sharp-unstable
[01:41] <tseng> and?
[01:42] <davyd> well, that kinda blocks the tree to build muine or tomboy
[01:43] <tseng> yeah well
[01:43] <tseng> "I can't build" doesnt get you much
[01:43] <tseng> sorry.
[01:43] <davyd> yeah
[01:43] <tseng> could you be more specific?
[01:43] <davyd> I'm not entirely sure how to read errors from mcs
[01:44] <davyd> but it is complaining about GLib.Object.LookupGType being inaccessable
[01:44] <davyd> due to the wrong protection level
[01:44] <tseng> nice one.
[01:44] <tseng> i think you can safely blame upstream for that
[01:46] <davyd> you seem to have a package in breezy on amd64 for it
[01:46] <davyd> did you work around it?
[01:46] <tseng> no
[01:47] <davyd> the obvious question then, is, have I likely done something wrong?
[01:47] <tseng> no
[01:48] <davyd> but yet you have a package, and I don't?
[01:48] <bddebian> probably :-)
[01:49] <tseng> i didnt build it on hoary
[01:49] <ajmitch> morning
[01:49] <tseng> yay ajmitch 
[01:50] <davyd> tseng: it's just interesting that it would fail, given that it would appear to be a dependancy that I've already built
[01:50] <davyd> perhaps I should just go to breezy
[01:50] <davyd> I didn't see any other major destabilisations on the horizon
[01:50] <ajmitch> yay?
[01:50] <tseng> ill not tell you waht you should do, but i cant support backporting
[01:51] <tseng> esp on archs i dont have access to
[01:51] <davyd> tseng: sure
[01:51] <davyd> I was simply trying to gain access to your comprehensive experience on the subject
[01:51] <davyd> I'm sorry if it's pissing you off
[01:51] <tseng> i have no such thing :)
[01:52] <tseng> eh its not you at all, im bitter about mono backports
[01:52] <davyd> I figured it was easier to start on then a gcc 4.0 backport
[01:52] <tseng> maybe :)
[01:53] <davyd> perhaps I should move to breezy, I miss GNOME 2.11 features
[01:53] <davyd> it's amazing how patches fc4
[01:53] <davyd> I've been using it at work
[01:53] <davyd> and lots of random stuff that is only in breezy made it into fc4
[01:53] <tseng> another source of crabbiness might be the last week spent trying to write an expect script to interface with credit card validation machines
[01:54] <tseng> with incorrect documentation and request strings butchered by Outlook
[01:54] <davyd> I've been debugging stack eating bonobo applications
[01:54] <HrdwrBoB> the whole credit card network is garbage
[01:54] <tseng> word.
[01:54] <HrdwrBoB> cobbled together eith pieces of string
[01:54] <tseng> HrdwrBoB: dude, its totally shithouse
[01:54] <HrdwrBoB> I'm very glad I don't work with it anymore :)
[01:55] <tseng> "uh, we dont include the STX in the LRC, just the ETX"
[01:55] <tseng> because doing things logically is for the birds
[01:55] <davyd> hmm, linux-restricted-modules is missing from breezy still
[01:55] <tseng> davyd: sure is.
[01:56] <HrdwrBoB> "you can't connect higher than 9600 baud because our 1980s systems can't take more than that
[01:56] <bddebian> Heya ajmitch 
[02:07] <davyd> tseng: so why has linux-restricted-modules blocked?
[02:07] <davyd> things don't compile against 2.6.12?
[02:08] <tseng> davyd: because daniels is a lazy bum
[02:09] <davyd> tseng: I see
[02:09] <bddebian> doh
[02:10] <davyd> ooop, late for work
[02:10] <davyd> later
[02:28] <jp> who knows a bit about planet planet? I have an issue :/ with how order the parameters of <TMPL_VAR new_date> 
[02:30] <jp> :o at planet.py :$
[03:47] <lamont> Kamion: you around?
[04:13] <dieman> "an OQO-specific build of ubuntu linux  -- while officially unsupported by OQO -- is available and can be pre- loaded on this model 01 if the winning bidder so desires"
[04:13] <dieman> hahaha
[04:13] <dieman> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5219297710&ssPageName=ADME:B:SS:US:1
[04:13] <dieman> did you guys know about that? :)
[04:14] <daniels> yeah
[04:14] <dieman> cool
[04:15] <bob2> I hope firefox doesn't eat too much entropy deciding when to randomly segfault
[04:15] <bddebian> heh
[04:22] <Amaranth> would ubuntu-art be the place to request an icon for Smeg? :)
[04:36] <bob2> I wish people would say "cisco vpn" or "the pos thing MS calls a 'vpn'" when they propose gui tools
[04:36] <wasabi> What POS thing MS calls a VPN?
[04:36] <wasabi> I have to try to defend it.
[04:36] <dieman> hahah
[04:36] <calc> bob2: pptp?
[04:37] <dieman> the cisco 3k isn't all that bad
[04:37] <dieman> its not great
[04:37] <dieman> but it works
[04:37] <wasabi> Windows has L2TP support now.
[04:37] <wasabi> Has since 2k.
[04:37] <bob2> calc: yeah
[04:37] <dieman> plus, theres an open source vpn client, but its not perfect either
[04:37] <wasabi> THeir VPN client kicks ass.
[04:37] <wasabi> You plug the host IP in, and that's IT.
[04:37] <wasabi> it automatically detects the type, L2TP or PPTP, the auth mechs, etc.
[04:38] <calc> rdp is cool
[04:38] <calc> i can break w2k3 servers via the internet :)
[04:38] <wasabi> ssh is cool.
[04:38] <wasabi> i can break linux servers via the internet.
[04:39] <calc> but rdp is faster than X forwarding
[04:39] <wasabi> Faster than VNC too.
[04:39] <calc> i suppose you can use vnc to try to get it down to rdp levels
[04:39] <calc> vnc with super compression isn't supposed to be too bad
[04:39] <wasabi> RDP also supports end to end encryption
[04:40] <calc> can you use rdp with a linux host?
[04:40] <calc> instead of eg vnc?
[04:40] <wasabi> There are no servers that I know of.
[04:40] <calc> oh :\
[04:40] <wasabi> You definatly could though.
[04:40] <wasabi> Could just fix VNC though and stick encryption on top of it.
[04:40] <wasabi> I doubt it's that bad.
[04:40] <wasabi> I think RDP supports GSSAPI auth though
[04:40] <calc> that would be pretty cool then you could use it with winterms
[04:40] <wasabi> VNC should get SASL support.
[04:40] <wasabi> That would be bad ass.
[04:41] <calc> hmm i upgraded my brothers w2k3 server to sp1 and now its taking a while to boot back up :)
[04:41] <calc> i hope i didn't kill it
[04:41] <wasabi> It usually takes awhile.
[04:41] <wasabi> Since windows can't modify in use files, it actually installs a lot of stuff to another dir
[04:41] <wasabi> and moves it at boot.
[04:42] <calc> oh yea
[04:42] <calc> btw i found that tsclient causes major pain if it hangs
[04:42] <calc> or perhaps its rdesktop that does it
[04:42] <wasabi> yeah
[04:43] <wasabi> the whole stealing the cursor thing
[04:43] <calc> you have to go to console and kill it
[04:43] <wasabi> it's rdesktop
[04:43] <calc> because it steals all input in X
[04:43] <wasabi> yeah
[04:43] <wasabi> it's lame.
[04:43] <wasabi> on a slow network it's hell.
[04:43] <wasabi> you can alt-tab to another window, and have to wait a few seconds to be ablet ot ype in the other window.
[04:43] <wasabi> until the remote server says you can.
[04:57] <calc> daniels: we need r300/Xegl in breezy ;)
[05:00] <daniels> xegl, no.  r300, maybe.
[05:01] <calc> ok
[05:59] <wasabi> So what's up with X?
[06:00] <wasabi> xbase-clients now depends on xhost which isn't in the archive.
[06:00] <wasabi> Oh. TOpic. Hehe.
[06:08] <TerminX> I think the topic refers to different breakage
[06:09] <daniels> it relates to general X breakage
[06:10] <TerminX> has a new version of xbase-clients been uploaded?
[06:10] <TerminX> (or all the nonexistent packages it depends on)
[06:10] <daniels> the latter will get uploaded later today
[06:10] <TerminX> alrighty
[06:11] <fabbione> morning
[06:12] <schweeb> fabbione: mornin, got a question... it may be for you, or it may be for mjg59
[06:12] <wasabi> daniels, you're in AU right (trying to define today)
[06:12] <daniels> wasabi: yeah.  'some time in the next eight hours'
[06:12] <schweeb> fabbione: is support for suspending with SATA disks going to be a goal for release?
[06:13] <wasabi> heh. i busted up my work comp today doing an X upgrade.
[06:13] <fabbione> schweeb: there is no code yet for it
[06:13] <schweeb> I know there's a patch out there... I haven't yet had a chance to try it
[06:13] <wasabi> And apparently I had forgotten to turn apt cleaning off.
[06:13] <daniels> fabbione: but gentoo have this really cool patch
[06:13] <schweeb> may not do evreything you need
[06:13] <wasabi> Oh hey.
[06:13] <fabbione> schweeb: the patch out there is broken according to upstream
[06:13] <wasabi> Do we have a snapshot site for breezy? 
[06:13] <wasabi> LIke that cool Debian snapshot site.
[06:13] <daniels> sort of
[06:14] <schweeb> fabbione: k.  just curious.  kinda sucks using this x41 w/o suspend
[06:14] <daniels> morgue.ubuntu.com, although that's not terrifically useful if you can't run find across it
[06:14] <calc> so why doesn't suspend with sata just work?
[06:14] <TerminX> daniels: should I assume that since you marked my bug PENDINGUPLOAD that you'll be moving the files from xserver-xorg to xserver-xorg-core?
[06:14] <schweeb> daniels: I'm not that cavalier with kernel patches
[06:14] <daniels> because you need to kick the controller to consistent states
[06:14] <daniels> TerminX: yeah
[06:14] <TerminX> awesome
[06:14] <calc> ah
[06:14] <fabbione> calc: because it's not implemented
[06:14] <schweeb> the scsi stuff doesn't have power management hooks
[06:14] <calc> kind of like why suspend on my laptop doesn't work ;)
[06:14] <schweeb> or some such shyte
[06:14] <calc> it seems to leave my keyboard dead
[06:15] <wasabi> daniels, it's also not up to day at all
[06:15] <calc> supposedly suspend/resume with the new r300 driver works
[06:15] <calc> would be nice if i could get that working on my amd64 laptop
[06:16] <calc> maybe in 64bit mode my keyboard would work too :\
[06:16] <wasabi> suspend resume on my ppc is still flakely
[06:16] <wasabi> better than it was though. before the screen wouldn't even come back on.
[06:16] <fabbione> daniels:
[06:16] <fabbione> Setting up xlibs (6.8.2-41) ...
[06:16] <fabbione> dpkg: error processing xlibs (--configure):
[06:16] <fabbione>  subprocess post-installation script returned error exit status 1
[06:16] <wasabi> now it lcoks up doing something to eth1 (wireless)
[06:16] <schweeb> fabbione: did you just rm -rf /etc/X11/xkb ?
[06:16] <calc> wasabi: in 32bit i can use the reinit hack, but 64bit can use it due to real mode interrupts being needed
[06:16] <schweeb> if so mkdir /etc/X11/xkb
[06:17] <calc> wasabi: so my screen doesn't come back on in 64bit either :(
[06:17] <fabbione> schweeb: no, that's on a clean install...
[06:17] <fabbione> schweeb: and i can't work around it. it's on a buildd
[06:17] <schweeb> ahhh
[06:18] <schweeb> daniels: fabbione's failure is cause there is no /etc/X11/xkb afaict
[06:18] <schweeb> cause I ran into that earlier, when I removed
[06:18] <daniels> yeah
[06:18] <daniels> i've fixed that locally, just watching a test build run around
[06:20] <wasabi> Does a Conflict on previous version of a Depend work as I'd expect it to?
[06:20] <wasabi> ie, remove the old one, install this new other one, upgrade the old one.
[06:20] <wasabi> Moving a file from one package to another, etc.
[06:20] <daniels> i believe yes, but I don't think order is guaranteed
[06:20] <lifeless> I think you want Replaces:
[06:20] <wasabi> It doesn't replace.
[06:21] <daniels> won't be configured by the time you unpack, and may not be unpacked when you are
[06:21] <wasabi> It's just one file, out of a few hundred.
[06:21] <lifeless> ok
[06:21] <daniels> but if you just need it unpacked when you configure, sure
[06:21] <wasabi> It's just a file conflict.
[06:21] <wasabi> package b depends on package a. File in package b moved to a.
[06:21] <daniels> use replaces, in that case
[06:21] <wasabi> Replaces has no meaning other than to determine order?
[06:22] <wasabi> It's a big word. ;)
[06:22] <wasabi> I don't want it to convey the semantic meaning that hte package is actually a replacement.
[06:23] <daniels> sure
[06:23] <daniels> its specific meaning is 'files that used to be *here* are now over *here*'
[06:53] <wasabi> Setting up libgtk2.0-bin (2.6.8-1ubuntu2) ...
[06:53] <wasabi> Updating the IM modules list for GTK+-2.4.0.../usr/bin/gtk-query-immodules-2.0: error while loading shared libraries: libXi.so.6: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
[06:54] <daniels> cool
[06:54] <daniels> can you please run dpkg -L libxi6?
[06:54] <wasabi> It's not installed.
[06:54] <wasabi> It's just a missing dep.
[06:54] <daniels> oops
[06:54] <daniels> iz gtk boog :)
[06:54] <wasabi> mmm
[06:55] <wasabi> EVerynow and then I uninstall everything on my system back to ubuntu-minimal, and then install it all again.
[06:55] <wasabi> Just to make sure it works. :0
[06:56] <wasabi> Hmm. I suspect that would be a good buildd test.
[06:56] <wasabi> Install the package into a clean chroot and make sure it installs properly.
[07:12] <Lathiat> daniels: do i want to update xorg?
[07:12] <daniels> updating is ok
[07:13] <Lathiat> COOL
[07:13] <Lathiat> argh, caps
[07:25] <weirdcreep> hello
[07:31] <Lathiat> daniels: xlibs, rmdir /etc/X11/xkb directory not empty
[07:33] <daniels> Lathiat: known issue
[07:34] <Lathiat> dan	okie
[07:36] <Lathiat> daniels: what did it want to update in my config?
[07:38] <Lathiat> daniels: also on my laptop, it asks (with -phigh) if i want to attempt monitor autodetection and what resolutions i want, that didnt used to happen
[07:39] <Lathiat> (but has done if for a few releases)
[07:39] <daniels> Lathiat: update in what config?
[07:40] <daniels> Lathiat: hm, that sucks
[07:40] <Lathiat> daniels: in xorg.conf, but it doesnt matter i just regenned it myself
[07:40] <daniels> could you please send the output of debconf-show xserver-xorg?
[07:40] <daniels> hm
[07:40] <Lathiat> also it is detecting my vert/horiz differently
[07:40] <Lathiat> not that that matters i guess
[07:40] <Lathiat> seems to look sane
[07:41] <Lathiat> http://bur.st/~lathiat/xserver-debconf
[07:43] <daniels> i'll check it out in a bit
[07:43] <Lathiat> ok, im not caring, just letting you know
[07:43] <daniels> bonus
[07:43] <Lathiat> if you want anythign else just yell
[08:06] <weirdcreep> Ken Charles Barger, 47, accidentally shot himself to death in December in Newton, NC. Awakening to the sound of a ringing telephone beside his bed, he reached for the phone but grabbed instead a Smith & Wesson 38 Special, which discharged when he drew it to his ear.
[08:08] <fabbione> clearly offtopic...
[08:08] <fabbione> Kamion, elmo, mdz: can you please NEW system-config-cluster ?
[08:08] <lifeless> tho weird and creepy
[08:09] <fabbione> (gui interface to configure redhat-cluster-suite)
[08:12] <comadreja> is anyone trying to build gcl-2.6.6 ?
[08:18] <TheMuso> ==/c
[08:18] <TheMuso> arrgh
[08:25] <Treenaks> morning all
[08:36] <tsume> hmm
[08:37] <Burgundavia> daniels, he also showed up in #gnome-hackers
[08:37] <daniels> yeah, I saw
[08:37] <daniels> and #ubuntu
[08:37] <Burgundavia> oh joy
[08:39] <tsume> anyone remember the whoopi goldberg movie/commercial where she is shooting this guy with a shotgun repeatedly in the gut about 9 feet away. the guy is wearing bullet proof armor, then he smiles and say something like "bullet proof armor". She pulls out a gun and shoots him in the head, whoopi says.. "Smith and wessen" :)
[08:39] <tsume> I'm going to have to find that movie
[08:39] <tsume> whatever its called
[08:40] <pitti> Hi
[08:40] <Lathiat> pitti: yo, did the g-v-m update ftbfs?
[08:40] <pitti> Lathiat: *grump*, no?
[08:41] <Lathiat> well, i just havent seen an update
[08:41] <daniels> you won't, if you're on amd64
[08:41] <Lathiat> not on amd64
[08:42] <tsume> amd64 > intel
[08:42] <tsume> I'll never use Intel again
[08:42] <tsume> not after the crap they've pulled
[08:43] <tsume> I hope intel looses bigtime
[08:43] <tsume> at the lawsuit
[08:43] <tsume> I hope the EU raided all their offices, not just some
[08:44] <Treenaks> tsume: even the US ones?
[08:44] <tsume> Treenaks: no, just the EU
[08:44] <tsume> AMD launched a lawsuit in the US
[08:45] <Treenaks> tsume: no but do you hope it ;)
[08:45] <tsume> Intel fucked themselves since 6 years ago pulling this crap
[08:45] <tsume> this would mean alot
[08:46] <tsume> this would also clarify the things I've been hearding from friends about AMD sucking at being a windows server. They probably were running some app compiled byt he intel compiler
[08:46] <tsume> Not I'm never buying intel ever again because their monoplising crap ways
[08:46] <thom> this is massively offtopic
[08:46] <tsume> thom: actually I don't think so
[08:46] <Lathiat> tsume: Yes it is, so please take it elsewhere.
[08:46] <sivang> tsume: have you read the amusing slashdot comments?
[08:46] <tsume> thom: has to deal with ubuntu by the amd64 port ;)
[08:46] <pitti> Lathiat: hmm, odd bug: "  libgksuui1.0-dev: Depends: libgksuui1.0-0 (= 1.0.5-1ubuntu1) but it is not going to be installed
[08:46] <pitti> E: Broken packages
[08:46] <pitti> "
[08:47] <tsume> sivang: no.
[08:47] <thom> tsume: no.
[08:47] <sivang> tsume: this should go somewhere else
[08:47] <tsume> sivang: I don't read /.
[08:47] <tsume> I mean.. trolldot
[08:47] <sivang> tsume: either way, this should be continued in ubuntu-talk or something :-)
[08:47] <daniels> i'm with thom, this has wandered hugely offtopic
[08:47] <tsume> just out of curiosity, how much support does the amd64 port have?
[08:47] <daniels> it works just fine
[08:48] <tsume> daniels: then steer it on-topic, don't end the conversation
[08:48] <tsume> its rude
[08:48] <sivang> oh, and howdyall
[08:48] <daniels> tsume: how do you steer something like this on-topic? the reason off-topic conversations get ended is because cluttering a development channel with random chatter is rude also.
[08:48] <daniels> tsume: there is #ubuntu-offtopic for other random stuff, please use it
[08:48] <tsume> daniels: then you steer it on topic ;)
[08:48] <thom> tsume: no, rude is continuing to be off topic when you've been asked to stop
[08:49] <tsume> thom: btw, you guys ship those cds too late by the tiome I moved =] 
[08:49] <tsume> thom: I didn't want them 4 weeks after ordering the cds
[08:49] <daniels> you are entitled to a full refund
[08:49] <tsume> daniels: hah
[08:50] <tsume> daniels: well I kinda wanted them here in Alaska
[08:50] <tsume> daniels: they would have helped
[08:50] <sivang> daniels: hehe, be careful , someone might take you seriously :-)
[08:50] <tsume> sivang: heh.
[08:51] <tsume> sivang: Can I get a refund on the 40 dollars shipping them over here?
[08:51] <Amaranth> hey, a refund should be you paying canonical money :)
[08:51] <tsume> sivang: shipping from NL to US is expensive. I know
[08:51] <daniels> you want canonical to pay you money that they paid to send you stuff?
[08:51] <Lathiat> At least some unsuspecting stranger will get ubuntu love
[08:51] <tsume> heck
[08:51] <daniels> good plan.  anyway, this is also off-topic.
[08:51] <tsume> those 39 cds probably cost 80 dollars in US currency to ship
[08:52] <tsume> a 1 lb book from NL cost 48USD
[08:52] <Amaranth> why did you order 39 CDs?
[08:52] <tsume> to NL from US
[08:52] <thom> GUYS, PLEASE DON'T USE #u-devel FOR OFFTOPIC STUFF
[08:52] <Amaranth> sorry
[08:52] <tsume> Amaranth: I was going to give them to people
[08:52] <Burgundavia> tsume, please take this elsewhere
[08:52] <tsume> Burgundavia: who is in charge of the shipit then? :P
[08:52] <Treenaks> tsume: Take it elsewhere, please.
[08:53] <thom> tsume: shipit has nothing to do with ubuntu development
[08:53] <tsume> okay, but this has to deal with ubuntu and devrls. 
[08:53] <Amaranth> #ubuntu-shipit :)
[08:53] <thom> NO
[08:53] <tsume> users don't know squat.
[08:53] <Treenaks> tsume: Try reading FAQs
[08:53] <Amaranth> this is very much a user question though
[08:53] <thom> it has to do with Canonical sending CDs. it's a business function utterly unrelated to development or the developers
[08:54] <tsume> Amaranth: and who qualifies for answering such a question?
[08:54] <Treenaks> tsume: The answer to that question is in the shipit FAQ, linked from about 20 places on www.ubuntu.com and shipit.ubuntu.com
[08:54] <Amaranth> tsume: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/support/documentation/faq/shipit/
[08:54] <Amaranth> kthxbai
[08:55] <tsume> Amaranth: heh
[08:55] <Lathiat> daniels: would xlibmesa-dev -> libglu1-xorg-dev | libglu1-dev, xlibmesa-gl-dev | libgl-dev # be a good idea
[08:55] <Lathiat> daniels: or should i just leave it as xlibmesa-dev, apt-cache show xlibmesa-dev says its a transition package for packages without fixed deps, so i assume thats an appopriate fix
[08:57] <daniels> depends on whether it needs libgl or libglu, really
[08:57] <Lathiat> oh so it doesnt need both?
[08:58] <Lathiat> hrm
[08:58] <daniels> well, not if it doesn't *use* both ...
[08:58] <Treenaks> Lathiat: it might not need both, I guess
[08:58] <sivang> Lathiat: you're asking about out little package from yesterday ? :-)
[08:59] <tsume> daniels: you really shouldn't op in a conversation like so. it just adds gasoline
[08:59] <Lathiat> sivang: snes9x atm
[08:59] <Lathiat> well, it references some glu* functions
[08:59] <Treenaks> Lathiat: try it with either
[08:59] <Lathiat> so i assume it wants glu
[08:59] <Treenaks> Lathiat: check if it works.
[09:00] <daniels> Lathiat: just look for what it #includes
[09:02] <Lathiat> right, needs both
[09:03] <Lathiat> daniels: is libgl-xorg-dev likely to happen anytime soon
[09:04] <daniels> dunno
[09:04] <daniels> it sounds worthwhile, but hardly urgent
[09:04] <daniels> i'll ask gravity about it when I speak to him next
[09:05] <Lathiat> just wondering cus im about to change abunch of packages that could do with that change, but if its not on the horizon for now i wont worry about it
[09:05] <daniels> don't worry about it
[09:06] <infinity> Doing it for consistency's sake would be nice.
[09:06] <infinity> And if it was done very, very soon, could easily be dealt with for breezy.
[09:07] <tsume> hmm
[09:07] <tsume> out of curiousity, what are the usual time gaps between releases?
[09:07] <Amaranth> 6 months
[09:07] <daniels> infinity: *grunt*
[09:07] <Treenaks> tsume: PLEASE PLEASE read the website before asking such basic questions
[09:07] <Treenaks> tsume: all the answers you seek are there
[09:08] <infinity> daniels : If you do it soon, I'll even promise to fix all of main for you.
[09:08] <tsume> Treenaks: I could have thought of another way besides answering with the #debian way
[09:08] <infinity> (The MOTU guys have a backlog of GLU fixes to make anyway, so adding GL to the mix wouldn't hurt)
[09:08] <daniels> infinity: bone-arse
[09:08] <Treenaks> tsume: We like to keep the channel on-topic. This is not on-topic.
[09:08] <Lathiat> well, thats why i was asking about it now
[09:08] <Treenaks> tsume: So please ask in #ubuntu, or read the FAQ
[09:08] <Lathiat> cus im working on the glu stuff
[09:08] <pitti> infinity: do you have any idea about http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/g/gnome-volume-manager/1.3.2-0ubuntu3/gnome-volume-manager_1.3.2-0ubuntu3_20050713-1742-i386-failed.gz? I don't have a breezy at hand here
[09:08] <tsume> Treenaks: look, devels have to deal with the release stages, not the users.
[09:09] <Treenaks> tsume: That doesn't mean you shouldn't read
[09:09] <infinity> Ugh, katie is officially on crack.
[09:09] <tsume> Treenaks: and if I was reading and passed it up?
[09:09] <doko> daniels: daniels: is there a list of packages, that are split out of xbase-clients?
[09:09] <daniels> tsume: it's not a conversation that helps #ubuntu-devel.
[09:09] <infinity> Despite xorg -41 being installed for powerpc now, It's still trying to UNACCEPT the -37 binaries every half hour. :/
[09:09] <tsume> Treenaks: you going to shoot a kid for not reading the sign when it says wet paint, because that basically how you are acting right now
[09:09] <infinity> pitti : Looking.
[09:10] <tsume> daniels: don't look at me. I didn't answer with a cocky remark
[09:10] <Lathiat> pitti: hrm, that package installs here
[09:10] <Treenaks> tsume: is HostingGeek your brother?
[09:10] <pitti> Lathiat: it built fine for me, too
[09:10] <infinity> pitti : Looks like the same transient whackiness that happens on every GNOME library upload...
[09:10] <Lathiat> pitti: maybe the b-d needs some upgrading or something
[09:11] <pitti> Lathiat: shouldn't
[09:11] <infinity> pitti : I'll give 'em back for kicks, then spend some real energy on it when/if they fail again.
[09:11] <tsume> Treenaks: can't find the site. Don't know what you're talking about
[09:11] <Treenaks> tsume: www.ubuntu.com maybe?
[09:12] <Treenaks> tsume: on the front page, third bullet point.
[09:12] <thom> tsume: look. you're on the devel channel. we assume that people who want to talk here have some basic level of clue that means we can talk about stuff that's actually interesting without burning energy answering pointless questions
[09:12] <tsume> Treenaks: let me give you a lesson in proper responses. "tsume: Well yes 6 months. You must have overlooked the information on the website. For future reference, the information on release stages are located at><URL here?"
[09:13] <Lathiat> tsume: This is not a user help channel
[09:13] <tsume> thom: and how long could this conversation lasted if Treenaks had manners? 1 second from a response of "6 months"
[09:13] <Treenaks> tsume: welcome to /ignore-land
[09:13] <Lathiat> tsume: if you want a response like that, goto #ubuntu
[09:13] <Lathiat> tsume: also, someone said  6 months 10 minutes ago, now please, go away
[09:13] <pitti> infinity: thanks a lot
[09:14] <thom> tsume: we've asked you politely to restrict your conversation to on-topic subjects. please do so
[09:14] <tsume> Lathiat: I'm just enlightening some manners to someone who is really making other like me uncomfortable.
[09:15] <mdeboer> hello.
[09:15] <tsume> thom: yes, thank you I realise that. But I ask how is, "go read the website" on topic?
[09:15] <thom> tsume: because you should have enough clue to use the resources we provided and not waste people's time. *that's* basic politeness
[09:16] <tsume> thom: yes, I'm aware. As I also stated I overlooked the "6 months" context.
[09:16] <mdeboer> i'm trying to build a 2.6.12 kernel on hoary, using the linux-source-2.6.12-2.6.12 from breezy. i run into some problems, so i am looking for documentation... i am used to make-kpkg, but it seems dpkg-buildpackage is the current way to do it?
[09:17] <Lathiat> mdeboer: make-kpkg is for rolling your own kernels, the official kernel packages are built with the standard build system
[09:17] <mdeboer> Lathiat: but if i want to create a livecd with this kernel?
[09:18] <Lathiat> mdeboer: There is a thraed on the mailing list at the moment about putting a custom kernel on the livecd, that might be a good reference
[09:18] <mdeboer> i think i started that thread :-)
[09:19] <tsume> hehe :)
[09:19] <mdeboer> lack of documentation.... :-(
[09:19] <mdeboer> so, it's a bit trial and error, which is not really practical given the time it takes to compile a kernel.
[09:20] <Lathiat> mdeboer: you might be able to remove the clean target
[09:20] <Lathiat> mdeboer: speed up the trial and error a bit
[09:20] <mdeboer> yes, but even so... i get errors in the end, that seem to effect the whole build process
[09:21] <mdeboer> do you know if someone has been backporting the 2.6.12 kernel?
[09:23] <infinity> Lathiat : TO dpkg-buildpackage without cleaning, you just need "-nc" on the command line, no need to remove the target.
[09:23] <Lathiat> infinity: ah
[09:23] <Lathiat> infinity: neat
[09:23] <tsume> well thank you to who were appropriate in conversation, but I don't believe ubuntu is correct for my standard in user friendliness by the community standards. Japanese do not act inappropriately in context so I'll go back to Vine Linux where its stable, and there are community which knows how to speak appropriately.
[09:24] <Lathiat> tsume: Thanks, bye.
[09:27] <infinity> pitti : Head to #flood
[09:28] <pitti> infinity: thanks for checking, so we should prod daniels to fix xbase-clients?
[09:30] <jsgotangco> wow what was that about
[09:32] <jsgotangco> (vine linux is japanese btw)
[09:32] <Lathiat> just a passing troll
[09:34] <infinity> daniels : What's up with this?
[09:34] <infinity> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
[09:34] <infinity>   xbase-clients: Depends: xdpyinfo but it is not installable
[09:34] <infinity>                  Depends: xhost but it is not installable
[09:34] <infinity>                  Depends: xrandr but it is not installable
[09:34] <infinity>                  Depends: xsetmode but it is not installable
[09:34] <infinity>                  Depends: xsetpointer but it is not installable
[09:34] <infinity> E: Broken packages
[09:36] <infinity> pitti : WOuld it be helpful if I added Debug::pkgProblemResolver output to all build logs?... I do on my Debian buildds, but it's not enabled on the Ubuntu ones (currently)
[09:37] <infinity> I have to see if it would hideously break the (possibly fragile) regexps in the auto-dep-waiter, but for people who can actually read the output, it might be helpful.
[09:38] <pitti> infinity: for cases like that, in any case
[09:39] <pitti> s/in any case/yes, I'd love it/ :-)
[09:40] <robitaille> infinity:  someone filled that xbase problem on the bugzilla tonight: #12707 
[09:40] <pitti> Hi sabdfl 
[09:41] <sabdfl> hi guys
[09:44] <JaneW> fabbione:ping 
[09:54] <Lathiat> daniels: (sorry to be a hassle) -> libgl-dev | mesag-dev | xlibmesa-gl-dev, libglu-dev | libglu1-mesa-dev | xlibmesa-glu-dev
[09:55] <ogra> hey sabdfl 
[09:59] <daniels> doko: not yet, no
[10:01] <daniels> Lathiat: er, don't put libgl-dev first
[10:01] <daniels> just put xlibmesa-gl-dev | libgl-dev, libglu1-xorg-dev | libglu-dev
[10:01] <Lathiat> daniels: well, thats whats in there now, with that mesa stuff, is it fine just to replace the lot with..
[10:01] <Lathiat> daniels: what you just wrote
[10:01] <daniels> pure virtual packages being first leads to unhappy buildds
[10:01] <daniels> stick with what I wrote ;)
[10:01] <Lathiat> yeh thats what i was told
[10:02] <Lathiat> daniels: yeh well thats whats in the debian package, i didnt put that there :)
[10:02] <daniels> the maintainer is on crack
[10:02] <Lathiat> Martin Albert :)
[10:03] <comadreja> anyone has tried to build gcl ?
[10:04] <Lathiat> nope
[10:04] <comadreja> it gives lots of errors, I fixed the C ones, but still gives lisp errors
[10:04] <comadreja> even latest cvs sources
[10:04] <Lathiat> haha lisp errors
[10:04] <Lathiat> GOOD LUCK
[10:04] <comadreja> :D no kidding
[10:06] <Lathiat> bah
[10:06] <Lathiat> i hate things that dont build
[10:07] <Lathiat> haha i love g++
[10:07] <Lathiat> note: try removing the parenthesis around the type-id
[10:07] <daniels> infinity: if you can install xbase-clients from -36 or older in the chroots, I strongly recommend you do so
[10:07] <comadreja> hey daniels :)
[10:08] <comadreja> yesterday I upgraded and lost my keyboard mapping
[10:08] <comadreja> now I'm using xmodmap
[10:09] <Lathiat> Option.h:107: warning: 'class OptionDummy' has virtual functions but non-virtual destructor
[10:09] <Lathiat> can someone clue me in to what that actually means
[10:09] <Lathiat> code-wise
[10:09] <Lathiat> this package gets like 5 of those on every single sourcefile
[10:09] <Lathiat> does it matter?
[10:10] <pitti> Lathiat: this pretty much speaks for itself, doesn't it? just make the destructor virtual
[10:10] <Lathiat> pitti: right, but im wondering if its actually an issue
[10:10] <Lathiat> i.e. is it worth changing
[10:10] <pitti> Lathiat: I think so
[10:11] <Lathiat> hrm
[10:12] <Lathiat> they dont appear to actually have destructors
[10:12] <pitti> Lathiat: hm, I thought g++ would then automatically create a dummy one?
[10:12] <daniels> comadreja: yeah, sounds about right; make sure xkeyboard-config is installed
[10:12] <Lathiat> pitti: i guess
[10:12] <Lathiat> apparently not
[10:13] <Amaranth> all you have to do is install xkeyboard-config?
[10:13] <comadreja> trying
[10:14] <daniels> Amaranth: and make sure /etc/X11/xkb/xkbcomp is still a symlink to /usr/bin/xkbcomp, yeah
[10:14] <comadreja> no such package ?
[10:14] <Amaranth> hrm, synaptic doesn't know what xkeyboard-config is
[10:14] <Amaranth> yeah
[10:14] <daniels> maybe it's still in NEW
[10:14] <Amaranth> xkbd-config? :)
[10:14] <Amaranth> doh
[10:16] <comadreja> daniels : also xlibs fail to install properly
[10:17] <daniels> comadreja: yeah, known issue
[10:19] <Lathiat> whats the right command to gpg sign the CoC (like, AA output?)
[10:19] <Treenaks> Lathiat: it's on the page where you can download it in launchpad ;)
[10:19] <Treenaks> Lathiat: gpg --clearsign file
[10:20] <Lathiat> oh i wasnt looking at launchpad
[10:20] <Treenaks> Lathiat: it has a feature for signing CoCs
[10:21] <Lathiat> where abouts?
[10:21] <Treenaks> Lathiat: on your "personal info" page
[10:21] <Treenaks> Lathiat: (click on your name in the top right corner)
[10:21] <Lathiat> ah ok
[10:21] <Lathiat> so i have to login
[10:21] <Treenaks> yeah
[10:21] <Lathiat> thats cool
[10:22] <Lathiat> it could do with an upload button
[10:23] <Lathiat> rather than the paste thing
[10:23] <Treenaks> Lathiat: file bug ;)
[10:26] <daniels> Lathiat: 'none at all'
[10:26] <Lathiat> i must have uploaded this key to a crap keyserver
[10:26] <Treenaks> Lathiat: use subkeys.pgp.net .. that works for me
[10:27] <Lathiat> yeh, and now i play the waiting game
[10:29] <Lathiat> launchpad is pretty cool
[10:33] <mdke> keyservers don't take long to sync iirc
[10:36] <pitti> Hi shackan 
[10:36] <pitti> shackan: how's it going?
[10:44] <shackan> pitti!!!
[10:44] <shackan> hi!
[10:44] <shackan> I was trying to reach you on irc yesterday but couldn't find you
[10:45] <shackan> read the mail I wrote this morning ?
[10:45] <sivang> shackan: what was it about?
[10:45] <shackan> sivang, sorry ?
[10:45] <sivang> shackan: oops,
[10:45] <sivang> shackan: wrong window
[10:46] <Lathiat> hrm
[10:46] <Lathiat> how do i file a bug on launchpad
[10:47] <Lathiat> it doesnt appear in the package list
[10:47] <bob2> in launchpad
[10:47] <Lathiat> bob2: yeh but if i search source packages, launchpad doesnt exist
[10:47] <Lathiat> so not sure where i should go
[10:47] <bob2> it's not a source package
[10:47] <bob2> https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/malone/products/launchpad/
[10:47] <Lathiat> ah
[10:48] <Lathiat> ahhhh i see
[10:48] <Lathiat> that wasnt so obvious
[10:48] <daniels> no
[10:50] <Lathiat> (well, not that it wasnt a source package, but i just saw a 'file a bug' link and clicked that from the malone page)
[10:51] <Lathiat> wow this is looking rather swanky tho
[10:51] <Lathiat> bein gable to say bug exists upstream, in distro, in release, etc
[10:52] <Kamion> daniels: xkeyboard-config source NEWed, will add it to desktop as soon as the seeds aren't broken
[10:52] <Kamion> Riddell: please 'chmod -R g+w /home/warthogs/archives/ubuntu-devel\@lists.ubuntu.com/seeds/seeds--breezy/seeds--breezy--0/patch-75/++revision-lock' on chinstrap
[10:52] <daniels> Kamion: thanks dude
[10:53] <Kamion> Riddell: your umask is still broken; please add 'umask 002' to the top of chinstrap:~jriddell/.bashrc before making further seed commits
[10:53] <Kamion> lamont: yo
[10:54] <fabbione> Kamion: yo.. can you please NEW system-config-cluster ?
[10:55] <Kamion> tseng: [gmime2.1]  what's the new upstream release needed for?
[10:55] <fabbione> Kamion: btw.. pkging system-config-lvm.. we need a new upstream version that's not publically available yet
[10:55] <fabbione> Kamion: the old version is too buggy 
[10:55] <Kamion> tseng: and I assume you've checked all the mono stuff is sane in it
[10:56] <Kamion> fabbione: I'm still working my way through all the requests in scrollback, give me a sec
[10:56] <fabbione> Kamion: sure.. sorry :)
[10:56] <fabbione> take your time
[10:57] <Kamion> fabbione: source NEWed, will do binaries when they show up
[10:57] <fabbione> Kamion: only one bin _all.deb :)
[10:57] <fabbione> so that's fast and simple :)
[10:57] <fabbione> thanks a lot
[10:58] <fabbione> Amaranth: i had to make 100K of patches to make that thing to work 
[10:58] <fabbione> there are almost more patches than code
[10:58] <Amaranth> haha
[10:58] <Amaranth> I was starting down the same path for their service manager.
[10:58] <Amaranth> Did you have to patch out a bunch of weird RH gettext stuff?
[10:58] <fabbione> no...
[10:59] <fabbione> i didn't check (neither i can) the internazionalization stuff
[11:00] <fabbione> also because it's not even translated...
[11:05] <mdeboer> fabbione: can i ask you something about building the 2.6.12 kernel (breezy) on hoary?
[11:05] <mdeboer> (you are the maintainer, right?)
[11:05] <sivang> fabbione: more patch then code in python? :-)
[11:06] <fabbione> mdeboer: yes i am one of the maintainers. we don't support building .12 in hoary.
[11:06] <fabbione> sivang: almost :)
[11:06] <sivang> fabbione: hehe, I thought you were referring to the kernel
[11:06] <mdeboer> fabbione: i know it is not supported, but i'd like to try anyway.
[11:07] <Riddell> Kamion: done, sorry about that, why does my commit to the kubuntu seed alter the ubuntu seed?
[11:07] <mdeboer> fabbione: and i have the impression that the problem i have is not hoary-related
[11:07] <fabbione> mdeboer: yes i understand, but i don't have time to support a backport. sorry
[11:07] <Lathiat> fabbione: whats gfs like to actually use?
[11:07] <fabbione> mdeboer: try to reproduce it in a breezy environment. if it works on breezy.. it's a backport problem, otherwise you are welcome to file a bug
[11:08] <fabbione> Lathiat: it's pretty simple
[11:08] <Lathiat> is it solid?
[11:09] <fabbione> it seems to work...
[11:09] <mdeboer> fabbione: hm, ok. anyway, i'll just mention what happens. maybe you've seen it. i only want to build for 386. i get really far, but then it fails with: dpkg-genchanges: failure: cannot open upload file ../linux-headers-2.6.12-3-686_2.6.12-3.3custom1_i386.deb for reading: No such file or directory
[11:09] <fabbione> Lathiat: GFS is not a filesystem you would use on your desktop
[11:09] <Lathiat> fabbione: i know that :)
[11:09] <fabbione> and you need to really get to a certain hw level
[11:09] <fabbione> mdeboer: that's a backport problem related to the version you are using
[11:10] <mdeboer> fabionne: notice it complains about 686, when i explicitely say flavours := 386 
[11:10] <mdeboer> fabbione: ah.
[11:10] <fabbione> and to the fact that you need a specific control file if you only build one flavour
[11:10] <fabbione> again.. it's a backport problem :)
[11:11] <Lathiat> fabbione: too much management babble docs
[11:11] <fabbione> Lathiat: ?
[11:11] <mdeboer> fabbione: maybe it will be easier modifying the hoary 2.6.10 package to kernel 2.6.12 then backporting the breezy package...
[11:11] <Lathiat> fabbione: too much of the redhat stuff on it is largely management babble rather than usefull technical documentation :)
[11:12] <fabbione> Lathiat: it depends to what docs you are looking at
[11:12] <fabbione> i found both of them
[11:12] <Lathiat> fabbione: got a pointer for me?
[11:12] <fabbione> and the tech part is pretty well done
[11:12] <Lathiat> im just looking at their homepage for it atm
[11:12] <mdeboer> s/then/than/
[11:12] <fabbione> http://www.redhat.com/docs/manuals/csgfs/
[11:12] <Lathiat> ah, thanks
[11:12] <Amaranth> should i both filing xorg bugs right now?
[11:12] <Amaranth> err, bother
[11:12] <daniels> depends what for
[11:13] <daniels> if it's for any form of anything failing to install, not really
[11:13] <mdeboer> fabbione: will a dpkg-buildpackage in hoary 2.6.10 generate the modules udebs as well?
[11:13] <fabbione> mdeboer: i am not sure what you are doing the but error is that you are trying to build one flavour only without modifying all the files
[11:13] <Amaranth> ubuntu-desktop, x-window-system-core, and xorg-driver-synaptics depend on xserver-xorg
[11:13] <fabbione> + required to build only one
[11:13] <Amaranth> i'd rather not pull in all those useless drivers
[11:13] <fabbione> the build system is pretty similar
[11:14] <mdeboer> fabbione: 'all the files' == control, and... ?
[11:14] <fabbione> mdeboer: control.stub mostlikely
[11:14] <mdeboer> fabbione: i see. i followed the wiki package - which is actually warty based :-/
[11:14] <Amaranth> daniels: are the things xbase-clients needs sitting in NEW?
[11:15] <fabbione> brb
[11:15] <mdeboer> fabbione: so, i rip out all the other flavours from the control.stub, and generate control ?
[11:15] <Amaranth> mdeboer: tias :)
[11:16] <daniels> Amaranth: sitting in ~daniels, more like it
[11:16] <Amaranth> ah
[11:16] <daniels> Amaranth: i'll fix synaptics later on, but the others won't change for a little while yet
[11:17] <Kamion> Riddell: it didn't, you committed to the Ubuntu seed apparently by accident
[11:17] <Kamion> Riddell: although the commit contained no actual content, only a log
[11:17] <mdeboer> Amaranth: ?
[11:18] <Amaranth> mdeboer: try it and see
[11:19] <mdeboer> Amaranth: :-) i looked it up in the hackers dictionary, but it isn't there
[11:20] <Amaranth> daniels: you ported the exposity crack to metacity 2.9.0?
[11:21] <daniels> Amaranth: yeah, didn't even last thirty seconds on my laptop
[11:21] <Amaranth> haha
[11:21] <daniels> kept wanting to put my fist through the screen every time I hit alt-tab and just wanted to switch to the last frigging window I was using
[11:21] <Riddell> Kamion: yeah, pretty stupid of me
[11:21] <Kamion> Amaranth: ubuntu-desktop is going to continue depending on xserver-xorg, very likely
[11:21] <Amaranth> daniels: It needs to use F11 like expose does.
[11:22] <Amaranth> Kamion: That's understandable. I'd just rather not lose a driver. :)
[11:22] <daniels> Amaranth: yeah
[11:22] <daniels> Amaranth: the main advantage to having it all split out right now is that I can easily get people to roll back to specific driver revisions
[11:22] <daniels> instead of having to arse about trying to work out if the problem's driver or core
[11:22] <Amaranth> heh
[11:22] <Amaranth> can you build just one driver?
[11:23] <Lathiat> well, its all in one source package no?
[11:23] <\sh> Lathiat: yes
[11:23] <Amaranth> btw, is the exa stuff getting into 7.0?
[11:24] <Amaranth> i might poke the ati driver and try to port it, it sounds simple enough
[11:24] <seb128_> Amaranth: hi
[11:24] <Amaranth> hi?
[11:25] <seb128> you don't know what it means? :)
[11:25] <seb128> Amaranth: how is working smeg on breezy? Do you have user feedbacks on it?
[11:25] <Amaranth> some odd issues i can't figure out, yeah
[11:25] <Amaranth> and pyxdg has a bug that's fixed in CVS that's pretty crucial
[11:26] <Amaranth> the issues are one or two people with unexplainable problems that make absolutely no sense, so i'm calling PEBKAC :)
[11:26] <seb128> Amaranth: I want to propose it as the breezy menu editor
[11:26] <Amaranth> ooh
[11:26] <seb128> but it has to work fine for that
[11:26] <Amaranth> err, should
[11:27] <seb128> are you confident we will have a version working fine soon?
[11:27] <Amaranth> aside from the one or two issues it works fine now
[11:27] <Amaranth> but 0.8 is going to be the first version that's translatable
[11:28] <Amaranth> oh, and i'm switching to making it gnome only so i can use gnome-vfs and such
[11:28] <Lathiat> haha, gave up on kde?
[11:28] <Amaranth> if i really kick ass on it i could probably release it this time next week
[11:29] <Amaranth> yeah, i don't use KDE so i don't care much for it :P
[11:29] <Amaranth> besides, they can install gnome libs if they really want it
[11:29] <Lathiat> kde? whats that ;p
[11:30] <Lathiat> gah
[11:30] <Amaranth> or someone could rewrite the frontend to make a KDE version, it's only a glade file and about 600 lines of code
[11:30] <Lathiat> cthugha is shitting me
[11:30] <seb128> Keybuk: around?
[11:30] <Lathiat> glColorTableEXT is fscking well defined
[11:30] <seb128> Keybuk: do you remember what issue this patch is supposed to fix exactly?
[11:30] <seb128>    * debian/patches/14_dont_override_user_removals.patch:
[11:30] <seb128>      - Ensure we don't override user removals when we take system backgrounds
[11:30] <seb128>        by checking they don't have information about it already.
[11:31] <seb128> 
[11:31] <\sh> backing up home
[11:31] <seb128> Amaranth: oh, translation would be nice ... when is that landing ? :)
[11:31] <\sh> reinstallubuntu...
[11:31] <Amaranth> hopefully a week from now
[11:31] <\sh> i need a noob desaster recovery function
[11:32] <Amaranth> i'll make it before the feature freeze :)
[11:32] <Amaranth> pyxdg maintainer won't though, he is on vacation
[11:32] <Amaranth> so a CVS package of that will probably be needed
[11:33] <seb128> no pb with that
[11:33] <Amaranth> right now filenames with ' make pyxdg die horribly
[11:33] <seb128> we already have rb and other CVS sutff
[11:33] <seb128> I'll mail ubuntu-devel today
[11:33] <Amaranth> oh, i haven't looked at rhythmbox in so long i forgot about 0.9 :)
[11:34] <GNULinuxer> seb128: the cairo you uploaded to Debian breaks Pango support in Firefox
[11:34] <Amaranth> GNULinuxer: read the blog entry
[11:34] <seb128> GNULinuxer: I've not uploaded any cairo
[11:34] <GNULinuxer> Amaranth: I have read it
[11:34] <Amaranth> do what it tells you
[11:34] <seb128> GNULinuxer: read it again?
[11:34] <Riddell> Amaranth: hmm?
[11:35] <GNULinuxer> Amaranth: that's not the issue
[11:35] <Amaranth> Riddell: ?
[11:35] <GNULinuxer> seb128: no pango means no Indic support
[11:35] <seb128> hint "than firefox has some issues because gecko assumes than gtk uses pangoxft which is not true with cairo"
[11:35] <seb128> GNULinuxer: fix firefox, or switch to epiphany/galeon
[11:35] <Amaranth> do the mozilla folks know about it?
[11:35] <Amaranth> that should probably be something to be fixed in firefox 1.1
[11:35] <seb128> I guess so
[11:36] <GNULinuxer> seb128: yes ... and that implies that Indic support is broken in Firefox for now
[11:36] <seb128> GNULinuxer: and? I'm not maintaining firefox
[11:36] <seb128> GNULinuxer: that's a firefox issue
[11:36] <Riddell> Amaranth: what KDE support are you dropping?
[11:36] <GNULinuxer> seb128: who is the firefox contact?
[11:36] <seb128> GNULinuxer: http://packages.qa.debian.org/m/mozilla-firefox.html
[11:37] <Amaranth> Riddell: Making smeg depend on python2.4-gnome2.
[11:37] <Riddell> Amaranth: but you'll still be able to edit KDE's menu?
[11:38] <Amaranth> sure, all the backend code will still be there
[11:38] <Amaranth> someone should volunteer to right a KDE/Qt frontend :)
[11:38] <Amaranth> err, write
[11:38] <Amaranth> stupid typing at 4am
[11:39] <Riddell> Amaranth: doesn't seem like much has changed then, having to install python-gnome2 is not much worse than having to install python-gtk
[11:39] <Amaranth> ok then
[11:39] <Riddell> groovy, just checking :)
[11:40] <Amaranth> now i just need andy to help me make humility icons not look bad in smeg
[11:40] <Amaranth> oh, and all that pesky 'code' to write
[11:41] <\sh> back in a few minutes
[11:46] <Riddell> Amaranth: I'll ask around if anyone is interested.  it may be they're all perfectly happy with the current KDE menu editor
[11:47] <Amaranth> #kde-devel seems to hate mine
[11:48] <Riddell> Amaranth: hate as in "you're gnome, we're #kde-devel, we will be abusive" or hate as in sensible reasons?
[11:48] <Amaranth> no sensible reasons that i saw
[11:49] <Riddell> sounds like #kde-devel then
[11:49] <Amaranth> bah, stallman just ruined harry potter for me
[11:49] <Treenaks> Amaranth: how?
[11:49] <ogra> Amaranth, oh, he's around at your place ? 
[11:49] <Amaranth> no
[11:49] <Amaranth> his website has a spoiler
[11:50] <Treenaks> Amaranth: oh?
[11:50] <Amaranth> he did it on purpose
[11:50] <Amaranth> says to not buy the books then ruins the whole things by telling who the half blood prince is
[11:50] <seb128> daniels: around?
[11:50] <chrissturm> if harry potter was *really* free this wouldnt have been necessary :P
[11:51] <Amaranth> oh, that reminds me
[11:51] <Treenaks> Amaranth: Rumours like that have been going around for ages
[11:51] <Amaranth> if i get my hands on that book 0.8 will be at least a week late
[11:51] <Amaranth> smeg 0.8 i mean
[11:51] <Riddell> Amaranth: why does he say not to buy the books?
[11:51] <Amaranth> because of the whole thing in canada
[11:51] <Amaranth> someone sold the books to people
[11:51] <Amaranth> appearently they have an injuction against anyone reading the books before today
[11:52] <Treenaks> Amaranth: like that's going to work
[11:52] <Riddell> oh aye, that is crazy
[11:52] <Amaranth> exactly
[11:52] <Treenaks> Amaranth: the people who got it will have read it anyway
[11:53] <Amaranth> "Don't buy this evil book! Oh, and here is what happens so it's ruined for you anyway. Don't buy this evil book!" *smack*
[11:53] <seb128> daniels: you know about #12705 , right?
[11:54] <chrissturm> Amaranth, looks like he bought the book :)
[11:54] <daniels> seb128: yeah.  feature, not a bug. :)
[11:54] <pef> hi
[11:55] <seb128> daniels: how do I fix the builds so?
[11:55] <seb128> daniels: ie gnome-control-center ftbfs on that
[11:55] <daniels> seb128: grep libXrender.la /usr/lib/*.la, rebuild every lib which references it
[11:55] <seb128> GRRRRAAAAA
[11:55] <daniels> seb128: i know it's a crap solution, but having it there was breaking other builds in interesting ways ... sorry
[11:55] <seb128> thanks
[11:56] <seb128> $ grep libXrender.la /usr/lib/*.la | sed 's/:.*//' | wc -l
[11:56] <seb128> 15
[11:56] <daniels> :\
[11:56] <daniels> i don't actually like causing more work for you
[11:56] <daniels> ... often
[12:05] <seb128> k, let's rebuild what is required
[12:06] <ogra> daniels, does that mean we will have to rebuild _all_ stuff depending on libxrender1 or is it only temporary ?
[12:06] <ogra> ogra@honk:~/k12/bastel $ apt-cache rdepends libxrender1|wc -l
[12:06] <ogra> 359
[12:07] <ogra> there is a lot universe stuff in that list....
[12:09] <Lathiat> daniels: have you ever noticed that dialog that comes up when X fails to start (would you like to view a log, etc), stops your keyboard from working?)
[12:09] <Lathiat> daniels: (happens all the time here, and i have to use mjy power button to reboot)
[12:10] <Treenaks> Lathiat: yes! though Alt+SysRq+e works too
[12:10] <Treenaks> (or whichever one gives you a tErminal)
[12:10] <Lathiat> daniels: also
[12:10] <Lathiat> daniels: the new vertrefresh/horizsync im getting
[12:10] <Lathiat> daniels: wont let me run at 1680x1050
[12:11] <Lathiat> daniels: and its sitting on 1280x800 or something now
[12:11] <Lathiat> Treenaks: do you also get it printing out with bad fonts?
[12:11] <Lathiat> Treenaks: like, random crap characters instead of borders, and random crap on other bits
[12:11] <Amaranth> Lathiat: You're on the wrong console or something.
[12:11] <Treenaks> Lathiat: no
[12:12] <Lathiat> Treenaks: hm
[12:12] <Amaranth> I've gotten the random crap chars on everything but tty1
[12:12] <Lathiat> that said i have an issue with my fb sometimes
[12:12] <Kamion> pkgstriptranslations: inconsistent /CurrentlyBuilding file, Component: value is empty
[12:12] <Lathiat> like, in the hoary installer
[12:12] <Kamion> infinity: ^-- the above is happening on all d-i daily builds
[12:12] <Lathiat> the top two lines move down
[12:12] <Lathiat> the bottom two lines disappear
[12:12] <Lathiat> and the top two lines stay blue with lines along the side of each character bound
[12:12] <Kamion> try different vga= parameters
[12:13] <Lathiat> that often ends up in a black screen
[12:13] <Lathiat> i just turn framebuffer off to install
[12:13] <Lathiat> debian-installer/framebuffer=false
[12:13] <Kamion> that works too
[12:13] <Lathiat> Kamion: when specifying a vga mode in grub
[12:13] <Lathiat> Kamion: do i want 0x or no 0x
[12:13] <seb128> ogra: he didn't say depends
[12:13] <ogra> seb128, phew..
[12:13] <Kamion> Lathiat: I don't recall
[12:14] <Lathiat> hm
[12:14] <Kamion> Lathiat: I believe without 0x
[12:14] <Kamion> Lathiat: actually, looking at the code, either should work.
[12:15] <seb128> Kamion, mdz: is there any plan to get wxwidgets2.6?
[12:15] <ogra> Lathiat, vga=771 is 1280x600
[12:15] <ogra> err x800
[12:15] <seb128> Amaranth: should I update to python-xdg CVS now?
[12:15] <ogra> (at least on my lappie)
[12:15] <seb128> or wait for some changes?
[12:15] <Kamion> seb128: not that I'm aware of (but likewise I don't know of an explicit decision against it)
[12:15] <Amaranth> the changes are in
[12:15] <Lathiat> ogra: ooh, widescreen vga mode?
[12:15] <Lathiat> ogra: can you do 1680x1050? :)
[12:16] <ogra> Lathiat, yep
[12:16] <ogra> Lathiat, nope
[12:16] <Lathiat> aww
[12:16] <Lathiat> how come?
[12:16] <Amaranth> not sure what else changed, i know that fix is in Menu.py
[12:16] <ogra> Lathiat, my display cant do higher res...
[12:16] <Lathiat> ogra: oh i mean
[12:16] <Lathiat> ogra: do you know if theres a mode for that
[12:16] <Lathiat> (cus mine does)
[12:16] <ogra> Lathiat, no idea
[12:16] <Lathiat> cus ws modes arent mentioned in the linux docs
[12:16] <Lathiat> so i have no idea where to find them
[12:17] <seb128> Kamion, Amaranth: thanks
[12:17] <Lathiat> irc vlc needs sdl love too
[12:17] <Lathiat> oh no
[12:18] <Lathiat> it was dbus/hotplug/etc love
[12:18] <Amaranth> no, it needs hal love
[12:18] <Lathiat> yeh
[12:18] <Amaranth> pretty sure 0.8.2 fixes that
[12:21] <Lathiat> interesting...
[12:21] <Lathiat> 771 seems to be 1024x768 for me
[12:22] <Lathiat> maybe thats why the other modes blank my screen
[12:22] <Amaranth> i think it depends on your card
[12:22] <Lathiat> well, i have a nvidia
[12:22] <ogra> yes... 
[12:22] <Lathiat> ogra: yes what?
[12:22] <Lathiat> see the linux kernel docs say that 41B or something is 1024x768
[12:22] <Lathiat> err, 31B
[12:22] <ogra> depends on your card....
[12:22] <Lathiat> right
[12:22] <Lathiat> that sucks
[12:23] <ogra> i.e. on the bios...
[12:23] <Amaranth> yeah, debian sid has vlc 0.8.2
[12:23] <Lathiat> wonder if i can extra a list from the bios
[12:23] <Lathiat> daniels: is there a tool to dump the vesa table?
[12:23] <ogra> Lathiat, try vga=ask 
[12:23] <Lathiat> ogra: everytime ive tried that i jsut get crap mdoes
[12:23] <ogra> and reboot... it should offer a list... (which is not always correct)
[12:24] <Lathiat> also they tend to be numbers, rather than hex number, which dont seem to work with vga=
[12:24] <ogra> correct == you can very often have other modes too...
[12:30] <carlos> daniels, Breezy Xorg is a bit fucked, it's missing some packages. Are you aware of that?
[12:31] <tseng> Kamion: gmime2.1 in unstable builds the mono bindings (-cil), ours does not. beagle needs latest version (ours had ancient 0.6)
[12:34] <tseng> Kamion: and yes i built it and build beagle against. latest beagle is failing for unrelated reasons, will dig at that
[12:47] <Kamion> tseng: ok then, mail James Troup with the request, mentioning that I approved it
[12:48] <mdeboer> fabionne is still away?
[12:48] <seb128> do we have any firefox maintainer nowadays, or should I just go ahead to apply some patches?
[12:49] <jsgotangco> night all
[12:49] <fabbione> hey seb128 
[12:49] <carlospc> Hello, i've been testing Colony CD2 and i realise that partman doesn't recognise any partitions of my disk
[12:49] <seb128> hi fabbione 
[12:49] <Amaranth> whee, building wxwidgets2.6
[12:49] <siretart> Amaranth: I filed https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=12673 for aalib, but it is still unconfirmed :(
[12:50] <ogra> Amaranth, i guess wx 2.6 will come anyway (if not held up by UVF)
[12:50] <Amaranth> UVF?
[12:50] <carlospc> Having a look at https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1235 i guess that it's my problem
[12:50] <fabbione> seb128: -Wl,--as-needed seems to misbhave on sparc.. :/
[12:50] <ogra> upstream version freeze
[12:50] <fabbione> seb128: and basically 3/4 of gnome is FTBFS
[12:50] <fabbione> seb128: is there any easy way to remove that flag?
[12:50] <seb128> fabbione: what kind of error?
[12:50] <fabbione> seb128: so that i can test it?
[12:50] <seb128> fabbione: it works fine for Debian/sparc
[12:51] <seb128> fabbione: drop it from debian/rules
[12:51] <fabbione> seb128: the error is sort of weird and not gnome's fault afaict
[12:51] <fabbione>  /usr/lib/gcc/sparc-linux-gnu/4.0.1/../../../../lib/crt1.o:../sysdeps/sparc/sparc32/elf/start.S:60: multiple definition of `_PROCEDURE_LINKAGE_TABLE_'
[12:51] <fabbione>  /usr/bin/ld: Disabling relaxation: it will not work with multiple definitions
[12:51] <seb128> urg
[12:51] <fabbione> collect2: ld returned 1 exit status
[12:51] <fabbione> seb128: is Debian using gcc-4.0.1 ?
[12:51] <mdeboer> fabbione: just to let you know, with the modified control.stub, it works ok
[12:51] <seb128> fabbione: that's specified from debian/rules, just drop the line
[12:51] <fabbione> seb128: ok thanks.. 
[12:52] <seb128> fabbione: that would be a question for doko :p
[12:52] <fabbione> i will let you know if it works...
[12:52] <Amaranth> cool, wx2.6 can use gnome-print
[12:52] <mdeboer> fabbione: so i now have a 2.6.12 compiled for hoary. 
[12:52] <Amaranth> mdeboer: congrats
[12:52] <mdeboer> thnaks
[12:52] <Amaranth> mdeboer: others are dying to get that for various reasons
[12:52] <fabbione> if it does, can i give you a list of packages that will need to be reworked? i don't need them to be fixed right away... just to include the change in the next uploads...
[12:53] <fabbione> mdeboer: fine.. now you need to deal with the entire userland to make it working as it should...
[12:53] <Amaranth> hehe
[12:53] <mdeboer> fabbione: :-)
[12:53] <Amaranth> i know some things need fixed as far as inotify
[12:54] <Amaranth> you need a new initrd and related things
[12:54] <mdeboer> fabbione: i have been running (a vanilla) 2.6.12 for a while without any problems
[12:54] <Amaranth> well, see you in 20 hours when this compile finishes
[12:54] <fabbione> mdeboer: sure.. until it doesn't break there are never problems..
[12:55] <fabbione> you are not running .12 on N thousands different user boxes
[12:55] <fabbione> with millions of different HW configs
[12:57] <mdeboer> fabbione: i cannot think of anything obvious that might break from a .10->.12 kernel upgrade
[12:57] <ogra> Kamion, have a second ?
[12:57] <Kamion> ogra: maybe
[12:57] <fabbione> mdeboer: udev? ndiswrapper? ipw2100 and ipw2200 ?
[12:57] <fabbione> + other stuff
[12:57] <fabbione> but i will let you figure that out
[12:57] <ogra> if i add a new seed for edubuntu called server, all stuff in there needs to be in ship ?
[12:58] <ogra> or in suported ?
[12:58] <ogra> +p
[12:59] <ogra> and must edubuntu supported be identical with ubuntu ?
[12:59] <ogra> s/ubuntu/ubuntu supported
[01:00] <Kamion> ogra: what are the semantics of server?
[01:00] <seb128> daniels: 
[01:00] <seb128> # grep libXrender.la /usr/lib/*.la | sed 's/:.*//'
[01:00] <seb128> /usr/lib/libXft.la
[01:00] <Kamion> ogra: no, supported doesn't have to match
[01:00] <ogra> Kamion, great...
[01:00] <seb128> daniels: is that ok if I upload a libxft for that?
[01:00] <Kamion> ogra: the archive basically cats all the outputs together and considers the whole lot to be in main
[01:01] <daniels> seb128: sure
[01:01] <seb128> thanks
[01:01] <ogra> Kamion, server holds the list of server stuff i have to install with the edubuntu-server metapackage (ltp, moodle php, mysql etc)
[01:01] <daniels> sorry 'bout that
[01:01] <seb128> np, don't worry
[01:01] <ogra> s/ltp/ltsp
[01:01] <Kamion> ogra: will it fit on a CD?
[01:01] <ogra> Kamion, edubuntu is a DVD release ;)
[01:01] <Kamion> it is?
[01:01] <fabbione> wow
[01:02] <ogra> and hopefully a liveDVD release with Express installer :)
[01:02] <Riddell> ogra: all computers in schools have DVDs?
[01:02] <Kamion> anyway don't confuse the issue
[01:02] <ogra> Riddell, i'd like to have a iso image for download or to put it additionally on the DVD for separate burning, but word is to go with DVD
[01:03] <Kamion> so is the aim to be able to install edubuntu-server via some magic CD boot option?
[01:03] <ogra> Riddell, the amount of stuff will get to big at least with the second release...
[01:03] <Kamion> and should all the server stuff be copied to the hard disk during a regular Edubuntu install?
[01:03] <ogra> Kamion, something along this line
[01:04] <Kamion> ogra: you *sure* you want it all copied to the hard disk during a regular Edubuntu (non-server) install?
[01:04] <ogra> Kamion, i'd like either a question in the installer like "is this a standalone WS or a LTSP install" or a bootoption
[01:04] <Kamion> question's tricky, boot option is much easier
[01:04] <ogra> nope, only for the server install
[01:04] <Kamion> ok, in that case you should have server < supported, but not server < ship
[01:05] <ogra> ok, so the default will be the server install then... and the bootpotion stanalone gets you a WS install
[01:05] <ogra> oki
[01:05] <Treenaks> bootpotion?
[01:05] <ogra> Treenaks, installer bootoption
[01:05] <Treenaks> ogra: *phew*
[01:05] <Kamion> ogra: so edit the STRUCTURE file in the Edubuntu seed, add a line "server: minimal standard" (assuming server doesn't include desktop) and add "server" just after "standard" in the supported: line
[01:06] <Treenaks> though a bootpotion sounds like Dark Magic ;)
[01:06] <Kamion> Treenaks: boot options are really easy
[01:06] <Kamion> Treenaks: questions require actual code
[01:06] <Treenaks> Kamion: potion not option
[01:06] <Kamion> heh
[01:06] <ogra> Treenaks, the tricky biut her is to decide whats the default ;)
[01:07] <ogra> but since sabdfls word is classrom install, its the server i guess
[01:07] <Kamion> mdeboer: you'd be amazed what random apparently-totally-unrelated stuff broke in the installer because 2.6.12 was a bit more strict about some things
[01:07] <Treenaks> ogra: for edubuntu you mean?
[01:07] <ogra> yepo
[01:08] <Kamion> mdeboer: when we switched to 2.6.12, the installer just hung on amd64 and powerpc. It turned out to be a cdebconf signal handling bug, but it really wasn't obvious
[01:08] <Kamion> mdeboer: there are probably plenty of similar things outside the installer
[01:09] <fabbione> there are reasons why i seriously DISCOURAGE backports of the kernel
[01:15] <Keybuk> seb128: otherwise if the user "Remove"d a background from their list, it'd just come back again
[01:16] <comadreja> daniels : where did libXrender.la go ?
[01:16] <daniels> comadreja: taken out the back and shot
[01:16] <daniels> its body dumped in a ditch, violated and unloved
[01:17] <seb128> Keybuk: I don't get the bug without it, maybe it has been fixed since by upstream, thanks
[01:17] <Keybuk> perhaps
[01:18] <rubenv> I've just been checking out the build logs for linux-restricted-modules in breezy
[01:18] <rubenv> they appear to have been built succesful, but why are they not installable?
[01:18] <comadreja> daniels : really, gnome-terminal doesn't build
[01:18] <rubenv> is this because of the xorg split, or because of nvidia?
[01:18] <daniels> comadreja: i know -- our good man seb is taking care of it
[01:19] <comadreja> daniels : oh, thanks
[01:19] <rubenv> also, I can't find the packages for them, for some reason
[01:19] <rubenv> makes it quite hard to try to fix them
[01:19] <fabbione> seb128: i confirm that removing the relaxation work
[01:19] <fabbione> seb128: can i give you a list of packages to do when you upload the next versions?
[01:20] <ogra> rubenv, there is no l-r-m for breezy yet, for what did you look ?
[01:20] <fabbione> seb128: i really have no rush to get everything fixed by yesterday
[01:20] <rubenv> ogra: http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/l/linux-meta/2.6.12.3/
[01:20] <rubenv> oh, I get it wrong
[01:20] <rubenv> those are stub packages right?
[01:20] <rubenv> in the linux-meta source
[01:21] <seb128> fabbione: you want to drop the flag from every single GNOME package?
[01:21] <ogra> yep, they not ready yet....
[01:21] <seb128> fabbione: better to fix the buildchain than workarounding a pile of packages imho
[01:21] <fabbione> seb128: only on sparc.. yes
[01:21] <rubenv> oh, I'm sorry, I thought they were unbuildable for some reason
[01:21] <fabbione> seb128: yes.. but apparently the fix is unknown yet..
[01:22] <fabbione> seb128: but let's wait a bit.. what is your time schedule to get the latest gnome crack in?
[01:22] <rubenv> without them I can't upgrade my laptop to breezy and do day to day testing, so I figured if there was debugging to do
[01:22] <seb128> fabbione: still, I'm not happy to divert 30 packages from Debian only to workaround an issue instead of fixing it
[01:22] <rubenv> I'll just sit tight and keep updating my vmware breezy
[01:22] <fabbione> seb128: neither am i
[01:22] <seb128> fabbione: sep. 7th is GNOME 2.12.0
[01:23] <fabbione> seb128: ok thanks.. there should be enough time to get it right
[01:23] <seb128> np
[01:23] <fabbione> seb128: hmmm interesting.. it seems a bug introduced in 4.0.1
[01:23] <fabbione> because in Debian they are building with 4.0
[01:24] <fabbione> hmm no
[01:24] <seb128> can you try downgrading gcc on your box and note if that fixes the issue?
[01:24] <fabbione> so i am 
[01:24] <seb128> no what?
[01:24] <fabbione> gcc-4.0.1 did FTBFS on sparc (gnat-4.0)
[01:24] <fabbione> so i am building with the same gcc-4.0 as in debian
[01:25] <rubenv> 
[01:32] <ogra> seb128, https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/malone/bugs/1219
[01:32] <lifeless> win 11
[01:32] <ogra> lifeless, loose 10
[01:32] <ogra> lifeless, 1 left :)
[01:33] <lifeless> 99 bottles of beer on the wall, 99 bnottles of beer
[01:33] <ogra> hehe
[01:33] <fabbione> oh well guys
[01:33] <fabbione> time to start the weekend
[01:33] <fabbione> cya on monday
[01:33] <ogra> ciao fabbione 
[01:33] <fabbione> have fun
[01:34] <thom> http://www.andrewsavory.com/blog/archives/000785.html
[01:35] <seb128> ogra: what about it?
[01:35] <ogra> seb128, since it was in malone, a MOTU hopeful grabbed it... is the bug accepted by you ? so he can forward a patch....
[01:36] <comadreja> seb128 : that motu is me
[01:36] <comadreja> seb128 : I was working on it
[01:37] <jdub> thom: nice :)
[01:37] <seb128> I don't have any ownership on bugs
[01:37] <seb128> feel free to deal with upstreams
[01:37] <seb128> I give all the GNOME bugs, just pick one and fix it
[01:37] <seb128> send the patch upstream
[01:37] <seb128> and everybody is happy :)
[01:37] <seb128> hey jdub 
[01:37] <ogra> :)
[01:38] <ogra> nice: This is what linux should be like. This, my friends, is the future.
[01:38] <seb128> and I don't care about this bug
[01:38] <ogra> oki
[01:38] <seb128> is concern people using the command line
[01:38] <seb128> and copying emails from here
[01:38] <seb128> which is almost no user
[01:38] <seb128> and that's only a cosmetic label issues for these people
[01:39] <ogra> thats why i asked if its a accepted bug for you :) 
[01:40] <ogra> comadreja, look if there is a bug for it in gnomes bugzlla the... link it to the malone bug if there is one...else open one and submit your patch to that
[01:40] <seb128> it's one """bug"""
[01:40] <comadreja> ogra, ok, I'll do
[01:42] <daniels> thom: working X -> world peace, obviously
[01:42] <daniels> 'xresprobe flies to jerusalem for negotiations'
[01:42] <thom> rofl
[01:43] <pef> ogra: http://www.artlebedev.ru/portfolio/optimus/
[01:44] <Treenaks> pef: yes.. they should make that one for real, instead of just concept images
[01:44] <daniels> pef: oh my god
[01:45] <pef> Treenaks: are you ok to spend $200 for a keybaord :D
[01:45] <Treenaks> pef: if it's that one: yes
[01:45] <jdub> http://assorted-sinks.info/?p=29
[01:45] <jdub> blog spammers using ubuntu :-)
[01:45] <jdub> er, using the reference
[01:45] <jdub> that is
[01:45] <jdub> *cough*
[01:46] <daniels> sure, sure
[01:47] <ogra> pef, ping me again if they offer this for crappy acer laptops ;)
[01:47] <seb128> jdub: l10n-list? The french guys asked again ...
[01:54] <Keybuk> ok, rhythmbox is stupid, it won't go to the next track
[01:57] <mdeboer> Kamion: 
[01:58] <seb128> Keybuk: it's fixed with the version uploaded yesterday ... which FTBFS because of xorg changes
[01:58] <mdeboer> Kamion: the documentation of debian-installer says to build the udebs with linux-kernel-di-i386-2.6
[01:58] <Kamion> mdeboer: yeah, out of date
[01:58] <mdeboer> Kamion: ok, just confirming
[01:58] <Kamion> mdeboer: feel free to file a bug
[01:59] <mdeboer> Kamion: i don't understand how to tell the debian-installer build where to look for the udebs.
[02:00] <mdeboer> oh sorry, i see it now
[02:01] <Amaranth> omgwtfhax
[02:01] <Amaranth> stupid debian package has hardcoded python2.3 command
[02:01] <daniels> it's common
[02:02] <Amaranth> i've spent a long time waiting for this to compile just to have it fail on building the wxpython module
[02:09] <mdeboer> Kamion: FYI, the hoary debian installer builds correctly with by backported breezy kernel
[02:09] <Kamion> it won't actually work
[02:09] <Kamion> at least not on amd64 and powerpc
[02:09] <mdeboer> Kamion: and qemu boots the netboot mini.iso
[02:09] <mdeboer> Kamion: i am only interested in 386
[02:10] <Kamion> furthermore you'll probably need a new udev to get it to do correct hardware detection
[02:10] <Kamion> just as long as I never end up with users using your images and filing bugs assigned to me
[02:11] <mdeboer> Kamion: don't worry about that. 
[02:11] <mdeboer> Kamion: the purpose is a very limited use live cd, the experimental use of 2.6.12 will be advertised all over.
[02:12] <Kamion> ok, please tell users not to file bugs in the Ubuntu bugzilla
[02:12] <mdeboer> Kamion: maybe I should include both the original 2.6.10, and 2.6.12 
[02:12] <mdeboer> Kamion: i will
[02:12] <Amaranth> hmm
[02:12] <Amaranth> what can i do to not have to recompile all of this stuff yet still make a deb?
[02:13] <seb128> debuild binary
[02:13] <Amaranth> dpkg-buildpackage isn't the say to go
[02:13] <Amaranth> ah
[02:13] <seb128> it doesn't clean, just "make" again
[02:13] <Kamion> Amaranth: debuild's just a wrapper around dpkg-buildpackage
[02:14] <Amaranth> and now the nickname makes sense
[02:18] <jordi> http://www.advogato.org/person/Uraeus/diary.html?start=484
[02:18] <jordi> ahem
[02:23] <Amaranth> haha, saw that earlier
[02:23] <Amaranth> real classy
[02:23] <daniels> christian is a good man
[02:23] <daniels> whose opinion I value
[02:26] <highvoltage> FF?
[02:26] <ogra> firefox
[02:26] <ogra> we have he discussion why the version is 1.0.2 n hoary every 6 weeks...
[02:27] <Treenaks> ogra: the "Omg! We are teh vulnerables!!" one?
[02:27] <ogra> yes, yawn....
[02:27] <highvoltage> well, nothing stops anyone from downloading it at mozilla.org.
[02:27] <Treenaks> highvoltage: well, the nice packaging probably
[02:28] <highvoltage> i'll shutup about FF before we contaminate this channel too and then ogra hates me :)
[02:28] <\sh> ogra: filters are helping ,-) scoring as well 
[02:28] <ogra> hehe, i wont :)
[02:29] <highvoltage> ogra: will you be on-line this weekend? i got my internet connection sorted out.
[02:29] <ogra> highvoltage, times where i'm not online are rare :)
[02:29] <highvoltage> kewl.
[02:30] <ogra> highvoltage, we'll have to talk about your scripts and your setup for the skeleton user, i'd like to adopt that... 
[02:31] <ogra> highvoltage, and i was promised to get the source for the guadalinex admin tool this weekend
[02:32] <highvoltage> good stuff. we can do that this weekend. and then i can finally learn how to create .debs :)
[02:32] <ogra> yeah
[02:32] <ogra> you get a personal class :)
[02:32] <daniels> AWESOME
[02:32] <daniels> sudo apt-get dist-upgrade  308.85s 50.23s system -1% cpu -9:-43:-48.02 total
[02:33] <Treenaks> daniels: X works now?
[02:33] <daniels> go zsh, it's your birthday
[02:35] <ogra> Kamion, if i have a software in the server seed that has a alternative dependency (mysql|postgres) i have to include the SQL server i want, right ?
[02:35] <Kamion> germinate will pick one, if it's not the one you want then you need to specify
[02:35] <Kamion> are your seeds in arch yet somewhere that I can check them out?
[02:35] <mdeboer> Kamion: is it the debian-install that should create the whole pool and dists directories for the cdrom ?
[02:35] <Kamion> mdeboer: no that's debian-cd
[02:36] <ogra> Kamion, not yet, i suck with arch... can i mail you a tarball ?
[02:36] <Kamion> but don't bother with the source packages in the archive
[02:36] <Kamion> ogra: I'd really rather not
[02:36] <mdeboer> Kamion: what do you mean?
[02:36] <Kamion> ogra: it *has* to be in arch for various systems to work properly
[02:36] <ogra> hmm
[02:36] <Kamion> mdeboer: colin.watson@canonical.com--2005/debian-cd--ubuntu--0 in arch is what we actually use, with some wrapper scripts around that
[02:37] <Kamion> ogra: and it *has* to be branched from the breezy seeds, and you should set that up sooner not later
[02:37] <ogra> Kamion, i branched it, i'm working in seeds--breezy--0--patch-71
[02:37] <Kamion> because we need to be able to merge Ubuntu seed changes into Kubuntu and Edubuntu from time to time
[02:37] <ogra> (locally)
[02:37] <Kamion> did you actually baz branch?
[02:38] <mdeboer> Kamion: hmm, maybe i could just do a quick hack, putting the udebs in there, and modifying the packages...
[02:38] <ogra> Kamion, i did a checkout....
[02:38] <Kamion> mdeboer: the words "debian-cd" and "quick hack" don't go together
[02:38] <Kamion> ogra: then you didn't branch
[02:38] <daniels> Kamion: ... they don't?
[02:38] <Kamion> daniels: well, maybe apart from with "is a" in between
[02:38] <daniels> right
[02:38] <mdeboer> :-)
[02:38] <ogra> Kamion, as described on the seeds wikipage
[02:38] <Kamion> but doing quick hacks *with* debian-cd doesn't really happen
[02:39] <Kamion> ogra: the seeds wiki page doesn't really go into how to create custom seeds. You have to 'baz branch'. Want me to set up the infrastructure?
[02:39] <daniels> yeah, not half wrong
[02:39] <ogra> Kamion, yes please...
[02:39] <Kamion> ogra: is there an edubuntu development mailing list?
[02:39] <ogra> Kamion, yep
[02:39] <ogra> edubuntu-devel@
[02:40] <mdeboer> Kamion: but "with some wrapper scripts around that" doesn't really sound like something i could use either... 
[02:40] <Mez> edubuntu-devel@
[02:40] <Kamion> ogra: ok, I'll want you through it
[02:40] <Kamion> er, "walk"
[02:40] <Kamion> ogra: baz make-archive --signed sftp://chinstrap/home/warthogs/archives/edubuntu-devel@lists.ubuntu.com
[02:40] <ogra> Kamion, great , some people will kill me if my seeds are not up soon :)
[02:41] <Kamion> mdeboer: not trivially, no
[02:41] <ogra> Kamion, drops me a usage line
[02:41] <carlospc> mdeboer: have a look on http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Berita-Mr-K3/message/180 this page explain how to download debian-cd and some others stuff
[02:41] <Kamion> ogra: hang on, you've never actually logged into chinstrap. Do that first, and put 'umask 002' at the top of ~/.bashrc
[02:42] <mdeboer> carlospc: thanks
[02:42] <ogra> phew
[02:42] <ogra> ok
[02:42] <fabbione> mdeboer: are you going to take care of the bugs of that custom cd you are doing?
[02:43] <daniels> Kamion: what would you need umask 002 for when you're committing to seeds?
[02:43] <fabbione> mdeboer: or is it a one go shot to drop on the floor after?
[02:43] <Kamion> daniels: otherwise ++revision-lock ends up non-group-writable
[02:43] <mdeboer> fabbione: i mentioned to Kamion that it will have "experimental" warnings all over
[02:43] <carlospc> mdeboer: after you have download all, have a look on the cdimage/bin/ directory, there is a script called build-image-set, have a look to understand the process
[02:43] <daniels> Kamion: </sarcasm>
[02:43] <Kamion> ah
[02:43] <mdeboer> fabbione: and "don't file ubuntu bug reports"
[02:43] <Kamion> carlospc: it's still not simple to customise though
[02:43] <fabbione> mdeboer: no that's not enough to avoid people to use it and file bug reports on official packages.
[02:44] <fabbione> mdeboer: you need to change versions of the packages you are adding there from the official ones
[02:44] <Kamion> carlospc: and it's too much effort unless you're setting up automated daily builds
[02:44] <mdeboer> fabbione: i will include 2.6.10 and 2.6.12-rt-preempt, and make 2.6.10 the default.
[02:44] <fabbione> we need to be able to discern easily what's official and what's not
[02:44] <Mez> gb mirror is down
[02:44] <mdeboer> fabbione: and i will setup a mailinglist.
[02:44] <Mez> BACK UP AHAIN
[02:44] <Mez> damn caps
[02:44] <carlospc> Kamion: i'm agree with you, i've been customizing this scripts for some days...
[02:45] <mdeboer> fabbione: but we are talking limited use.
[02:45] <fabbione> mdeboer: no that's again not enough.. all each single package you modify there needs to have a custom version
[02:45] <fabbione> mdeboer: because if you change udev to work for .12, it will break .10
[02:45] <fabbione> or stuff like that
[02:45] <fabbione> so.. please use custom versions all over
[02:45] <seb128> can a buildd guy kick vte?
[02:45] <mdeboer> fabbione: sure. all will be properly versioned
[02:46] <mdeboer> fabionne: i wrote to ubuntu-devel what this livecd will be for.
[02:46] <Kamion> ogra: problems logging into chinstrap?
[02:46] <fabbione> mdeboer: yes i read that.. i am the same person that told you not to backport kernel...
[02:46] <mdeboer> fabionne: and as it is, it is not unlikely that i will stick with 2.6.10, even though it will give a wrong impression of linux for audio use...
[02:47] <mdeboer> fabbione: i know. guess i'm a bit stubborn.
[02:47] <fabbione> mdeboer: i don't care the amount of customizations you do. I care how you are doing them.
[02:47] <\sh> reinstalled hoary..now upgrade to breezy..*shiver*
[02:47] <fabbione> and that given that the kernel is not something you change easily, please add custom versions all over
[02:47] <fabbione> so that we can identify bug reports..
[02:48] <chrissturm> mdeboer, are you working on an audio distro?
[02:48] <fabbione> because even if you don't believe me, we will get them from people using your CD
[02:48] <mdeboer> fabbione: as long as i but something like 'icmc', or 'agnula' in the versions.
[02:48] <fabbione> because you have no idea on the audience and some user behavior
[02:49] <fabbione> mdeboer: i don't care.. it's enough it doesn't match anything that's in Ubuntu already
[02:49] <mdeboer> chrissturm: i am working on a livecd to be used during the icmc (computer music) conference.
[02:49] <fabbione> mdeboer: it can be 'ping' or 'pong' or 'audiobackport'
[02:50] <mdeboer> chrissturm: but it is not unlikely this will go into agnula
[02:50] <mdeboer> fabbione: many custom packages i use come from agnula, and are already correctly marked.
[02:50] <mdeboer> fabbione: thanks for your comments
[02:51] <chrissturm> mdeboer, does it contain additional debs that are not in ubuntu? is it possible to get those debs from somewhere?
[02:52] <mdeboer> chrissturm: see www.agnula.org
[02:52] <mdeboer> chrissturm: or join #agnula
[03:20] <Amaranth> grr
[03:20] <Amaranth> all that work to make wx2.6 build and vlc depends on wx2.4 in ./configure
[03:25] <JanC> Amaranth : lol  :-P
[03:25] <Amaranth> well no
[03:25] <Amaranth> it just does some weird crap with wx-config that i don't feel like messing with
[03:31] <seb128> daniels: 
[03:31] <seb128> Setting up xlibs (6.8.2-41) ...
[03:31] <seb128> dpkg: error processing xlibs (--configure):
[03:31] <seb128>  subprocess post-installation script returned error exit status 1
[03:31] <seb128> daniels: that breaks some of the GNOME builds too :p
[03:33] <daniels> seb	yah
[03:33] <daniels> seb128: -42 uploading now to fix this
[03:33] <seb128> cool
[03:33] <seb128> maybe I can fix GNOME stuff before the WE :p
[03:34] <Amaranth> is xbase-clients installable in -42?
[03:34] <daniels> Amaranth: not tonight
[03:34] <Amaranth> oh well
[03:35] <Amaranth> not like i need it anyway
[03:35] <daniels> just grab an older xbase-clients from the archive
[03:35] <Amaranth> yeah, i have -36 still
[03:35] <seb128> daniels: is current xorg known to be b0rked or works?
[03:35] <Amaranth> you need xkeyboard-config, then current xorg should work
[03:35] <seb128> daniels: I still have -33 installed here and don't intend to break my box 
[03:36] <Amaranth> well, -42 should work
[03:36] <daniels> seb128: everything but xbase-clients should work fine.  if xlibs won't install, run sudo rm -rf /etc/X11/xkb, install it, and hand-create the link to xkbcomp
[03:36] <daniels> seb128: and yeah, need xkeyboard-config
[03:36] <seb128> k, thanks
[03:36] <daniels> unfortuantely because I'm thpethul, I badly screwed the xbase-clients thing
[03:36] <daniels> it was meant to be a *lot* smoother
[03:36] <seb128> xbase-clients not working as some bad effect?
[03:36] <Kamion> it just won't upgrade
[03:36] <seb128> k
[03:37] <ogra> Kamion, i still get the usage message from baz with the above command
[03:37] <daniels> right
[03:37] <daniels> so if all the buildds had the old version installed in their chroots ... *cough*
[03:37] <lifeless> ogra: what command ?
[03:37] <ogra> (yes i added umask 022)
[03:37] <Kamion> ogra: yeah, sorry I braino'ed it, one sec
[03:37] <Kamion> ogra: umask 002, NOT 022
[03:37] <daniels> this is why I should never do rushed uploads
[03:37] <ogra> Kamion, yes 002, sorry typo
[03:37] <Kamion> ok
[03:38] <Amaranth> should xkeyboard-config be a part of xbase-clients?
[03:38] <Kamion> ogra: baz make-archive --signed edubuntu-devel@lists.ubuntu.com sftp://chinstrap/home/warthogs/archives/edubuntu-devel@lists.ubuntu.com
[03:38] <Kamion> lifeless: don't worry, my fault
[03:38] <daniels> Amaranth: errr ... no
[03:38] <daniels> Amaranth: arguably xlibs if anything, since that's where it used to be
[03:38] <Kamion> lifeless: (though actually it'd be nice if it auto-guessed the archive name, like make-archive --help sort of implies it will)
[03:38] <Amaranth> ah
[03:38] <daniels> but xlibs can't depend xkeyboard-config, because xk-c pre-depends xlibs
[03:39] <Amaranth> and xlibs is a dummy package
[03:39] <Amaranth> d'oh
[03:39] <daniels> (so the config files get removed if they haven't been customised)
[03:39] <daniels> it'll get added to the seeds
[03:39] <Amaranth> phew
[03:39] <ogra> Kamion, do you have a hosts file with chinstrap in it? :)
[03:39] <ogra> *g*
[03:39] <Kamion> ogra: no of course not, .ssh/config is my friend
[03:39] <ogra> ah
[03:39] <daniels> the point of modularisation is to make life easier for everyone, not to assume that default users don't want or need xkb maps by default so there's no point in providing it :P
[03:40] <Kamion> daniels: relying on the seeds is gross though, I want to come up with a better upgrade path at some point
[03:40] <daniels> night guys
[03:40] <daniels> Kamion: if you think of one, let me know
[03:40] <daniels> Kamion: but we're doing shit like directory-to-file conffile migration
[03:40] <Kamion> yeah, I know
[03:40] <Kamion> Host chinstrap
[03:40] <Kamion>         HostName chinstrap.ubuntu.com
[03:40] <Kamion> ogra: ^--
[03:40] <Amaranth> shit
[03:40] <Amaranth> debconf in GNOME mode steals focus!
[03:41] <daniels> Kamion: i need to play around with dpkg semantics to see if there's anything better I can do
[03:41] <Kamion> patches welcome, none of the debconf maintainers are GNOME experts AFAIK
[03:41] <ogra> Kamion, thanks... didnt know that one... i always used hosts
[03:41] <daniels> Kamion: itmt, I'm just recommending it from xserver-xorg (as of -42)
[03:42] <daniels> Kamion: so *hopefully* apt drags that in by default
[03:42] <Kamion> ogra: ok, now 'baz branch ubuntu-devel@lists.ubuntu.com/seeds--breezy--0 edubuntu-devel@lists.ubuntu.com/seeds--breezy--0'
[03:42] <Kamion> ogra: get the latter, and work there
[03:42] <Kamion> daniels: aptitude will, apt won't
[03:42] <Kamion> apt-get won't, rather
[03:42] <infinity> daniels : apt ignores recommends by default, thank god.
[03:42] <daniels> cock
[03:43] <infinity> daniels : All other frontends will select it by default.
[03:43] <daniels> infinity: both a bug and a feature at this point
[03:43] <infinity> (dselect, aptitude, synaptic..)
[03:43] <daniels> infinity: i assume getting a sensible versions of xbase-clients installed in the chroots is out of the question?
[03:43] <infinity> Define "sensible?
[03:43] <infinity> s/?/"/
[03:43] <daniels> -34 or something
[03:43] <lamont> daniels: and that would be wrong
[03:43] <daniels> sensible -> installable
[03:43] <infinity> Oh, "older".
[03:43] <daniels> lamont: well, yeah
[03:43] <daniels> lamont: but so is everything else about our buildds :P
[03:43] <Amaranth> daniels: /etc/X11/xkb should be a symlink to /usr/bin/xkbcomp?
[03:44] <infinity> Preseeding chroots only happens when something is so hideously broken we have a bootstrapping issue.
[03:44] <daniels> Amaranth: yeah
[03:44] <daniels> infinity: ok, sweet
[03:44] <infinity> Can we not kjust fix xbase-client for now?
[03:44] <daniels> infinity: we can, it just requires lots of time
[03:44] <Amaranth> err, wasn't /etc/X11/xkb a dir before? :)
[03:44] <daniels> Amaranth: oh, sorry
[03:44] <daniels> Amaranth: /etc/X11/xkb/xkbcomp should be a symlink to /usr/bin/xkbcomp
[03:45] <lamont> daniels: is xorg still building xbase-clients?
[03:45] <daniels> infinity: put it this way -- if I do all the libs and programs, and *nothing* goes wrong, I could maybe have it done by the end of Tuesday (busy all weekend)
[03:45] <infinity> daniels : Tuesday is fine for me.
[03:45] <daniels> lamont: yes.  which is why it's so screwed.  because it's sort of empty.  and uninstallable to boot.
[03:45] <infinity> daniels : It's not the end of the world if stuff is broken for a while, it's the end of the world if it's broken for weeks.
[03:45] <seb128> lamont: can you kick vte, it should build again with new xft
[03:45] <daniels> infinity: note the large number of conditionals
[03:46] <lamont> seb128: given
[03:46] <seb128> thanks
[03:46] <infinity> daniels : Will an ULIIT make things better or worse?
[03:46] <daniels> infinity: that you buy me? undoubtedly better.
[03:46] <infinity> Consider it done, then.
[03:46] <infinity> Immediately after xbase-clients works.
[03:46] <infinity> :)
[03:46] <seb128> daniels: is that ok if I upload xcursor for a rebuilt without Xrender.la ? 
[03:46] <daniels> anyway, now that I've figured out gcc4 generating broken code AGAIN is what's responsible for i810_drv making my video BIOS execute invalid code, I'm going to crash.
[03:47] <Amaranth> it owns /etc/X11/xkb/compiled
[03:47] <Amaranth> i thought xkeyboard-config was a part of xlibs before
[03:47] <daniels> seb128: upload anything you need to fix stuff, I'm going to be out of touch all weekend
[03:47] <seb128> k, thanks
[03:47] <daniels> Amaranth: it was, but xkbcomp was a part of xbase-clients, I think
[03:47] <daniels> infinity: make that 'on the friday night immediately after xbase-clients works'.
[03:48] <daniels> the mid-week tgi's thing isn't working out.
[03:48] <infinity> daniels : I'll get her number for you.
[03:49] <infinity> And her address, if you feel the urge to serenade her from her bedroom window.
[03:49] <\sh> jesus
[03:49] <\sh> I got it 
[03:49] <\sh> install xlibs-6.8.2-36, apt-pin it and start over with the upgrade...*phew*
[03:49] <\sh> no nightmare anymore
[03:52] <ogra> Kamion, wow, there has changed a lot since my first checkout on sunday...
[03:54] <Kamion> ogra: seeds do change relatively often, although the diff against patch-71 is not huge
[03:55] <ogra> Kamion, nope, not huge, but essential (keyboard config ... yaboot)
[04:00] <mdeboer> Kamion: would it make sense to file a bug on the lack of documentation of the LiveCD generation? (i don't ask this to nag, it's a honest question)
[04:02] <Kamion> ogra: yaboot in live is not particularly essential yet; I added it as a preparatory measure for ubuntu-express on powerpc
[04:02] <Kamion> mdeboer: I guess, I thought there was probably one already though - but it's not my responsibility
[04:02] <ogra> ah, ok, i thought the live bootprocess had changed
[04:03] <mdeboer> Kamion: if there is, i have not been able to find it...
[04:03] <Kamion> mdeboer: ok
[04:03] <mdeboer> Kamion: anyway, i have given up.
[04:04] <mdeboer> Kamion: i won't have the time to get the 2.6.12-rt-preempt kernel working with the livecd.
[04:14] <{Seb}> hi all
[04:15] <{Seb}> is the Xorg problem we talkeld about yesterday fixed?
[04:15] <{Seb}> i see Xorg is up to -41
[04:16] <mdke> who works on java in Ubuntu?
[04:16] <Treenaks> -42 even
[04:16] <{Seb}> the actual available packages are only -41 though
[04:18] <Lathiat> hrm, malone is broken, doh
[04:20] <ogra> Kamion, thanks a lot for all the help, i owe you a bottle single malt now :) the seeds are up now....
[04:20] <ogra> now on to the metapackages... :)
[04:22] <Amaranth> i think vlc just need a sync from debian and a recompile
[04:22] <Amaranth> since we have libwxgtk2.4c2
[04:23] <ogra> Amaranth, i think we want to get 2.6 in before breezy releases...
[04:23] <Amaranth> in that case vlc will need a couple patches
[04:24] <Kamion> ogra: let me set up mirroring first, that'll help you there
[04:24] <Amaranth> i think 2.6 is backword compatible so it should just be a fix in ./configure
[04:24] <ogra> Kamion, ok....
[04:24] <ogra> Kamion, anything special i have to regard with the metapackages ? 
[04:24] <Kamion> copy the structure off kubuntu-meta
[04:24] <Kamion> that should do basically the right things
[04:25] <Kamion>  * schooltol
[04:25] <Kamion> ogra: typo
[04:25] <ogra> oki, i was looking a ubuntu-meta...
[04:25] <ogra> ergh
[04:26] <Amaranth> hmm, backports forum moved out of 3rd party projects
[04:26] <Kamion> ubuntu-meta generates the minimal metapackage too which you don't want
[04:26] <Amaranth> damnit, they're always first
[04:26] <ogra> ok
[04:27] <ogra> fixed
[04:29] <ogra> Kamion, i need to add server to the seeds line in the update script ?
[04:30] <Amaranth> It's kinda funny, in making the backports project official you've basically replaced the devs with a machine. :)
[04:31] <Amaranth> Should give them more time for MOTU work, right ogra? :)
[04:31] <bddebian> Heya
[04:31] <ogra> Amaranth, thats mybig hope, that the backports team joins us
[04:32] <wasabi__> xbase-clients fix around?
[04:32] <Amaranth> wait for -42
[04:32] <Amaranth> wait
[04:32] <Amaranth> no
[04:32] <Amaranth> xbase-clients is going to take about a week
[04:33] <chrissturm> what is the last xbase-clients version that works?
[04:33] <slomo> ogra: well it works partially ;) at least i'm trying to join you
[04:33] <wasabi__> Oh. I need an old version of it then.
[04:33] <wasabi__> Where can I find such a thing?
[04:33] <ogra> slomo, yes, thats heard to ignore :) 
[04:33] <Amaranth> -36 is the latest
[04:33] <ogra> hard even
[04:33] <ogra> slomo, and a very good move ;)
[04:34] <ogra> slomo, i'm really happy to have you aboard.... but i'm a bit sad jdong doesnt want to...
[04:34] <wasabi__> Crud.
[04:34] <wasabi__> I need an old version of X then.
[04:35] <slomo> ogra: hmm... has he said why he doesn't want to?
[04:35] <ogra> nope
[04:35] <chrissturm> wasabi, i can email it to you
[04:36] <wasabi__> Can you post it someplace? I am stuck at a console at work heh.
[04:36] <chrissturm> ok
[04:36] <wasabi__> I'd appreciate that.
[04:37] <ogra> slomo, he just refused all attempts i made ...
[04:37] <ogra> with no reason given...
[04:37] <Amaranth> /usr/bin/ld: cannot find -ltheora_pic
[04:38] <Kamion> ogra: yes, and a suitable block in debian/control
[04:39] <ogra> yep
[04:39] <Amaranth> i have libtheora-dev, stupid vlc
[04:39] <Kamion> ogra: will all Edubuntu server admins want all those server packages?
[04:39] <Amaranth> *boggle*, it went passed that point this time
[04:39] <Kamion> ogra: (noting that the DVD installer will just install the task, not the metapackage)
[04:39] <ogra> Kamion, we build a single classrom release for ltsp currently...
[04:40] <ogra> so yes... i guess so... but with the additional option for a workstation install as well...
[04:40] <chrissturm> wasabi, http://i-understand.com/xbase-clients_6.8.2-36_i386.deb
[04:40] <Kamion> ogra: anyhow, you've got http://people.ubuntu.com/~cjwatson/germinate-output/edubuntu-breezy/ now
[04:40] <ogra> since we might have thick clients too...
[04:41] <Kamion> ogra: and http://people.ubuntu.com/~cjwatson/seeds/edubuntu-breezy/, which you'll need for edubuntu-meta/update
[04:41] <ogra> ok
[04:41] <Amaranth> chrissturm: ugly
[04:41] <ogra> the former is the CD build ?
[04:41] <Amaranth> chrissturm: pin it
[04:41] <Kamion> ogra: no the former is germinate output
[04:41] <Kamion> does it look like a CD build? :-)
[04:41] <ogra> which i thought is the base for the CDs ?
[04:42] <Kamion> yes, it is
[04:42] <ogra> ah, ok
[04:42] <Kamion> although the CD build runs germinate itself, it doesn't use that run
[04:42] <ogra> did you ever think about visualizing germinate trees as wllpapers ?
[04:42] <chrissturm> Amaranth, i dont need to pin it because all later versions of xbase-clients wont install anyway because of missing deps. or am i missing something?
[04:42] <Amaranth> Package: xbase-clients
[04:42] <Amaranth> Pin: version 6.8.2-36
[04:42] <Amaranth> Pin-Priority: 1001
[04:42] <Kamion> ogra: only when drunk
[04:42] <ogra> hehe
[04:42] <Amaranth> it won't even ask you to install later versions, iirc
[04:42] <Kamion> (because *I've* hacked on germinate ...)
[04:43] <ogra> would be cool to have one :)
[04:43] <Kamion> I value my sanity :)
[04:43] <Kamion> germinate hacking => non-trivial
[04:43] <ogra> i belive...
[04:44] <ogra> i'm wondering if i want all these arches...
[04:44] <Kamion> in what?
[04:44] <ogra> edubuntu
[04:44] <Kamion> you mean in the seeds?
[04:44] <ogra> architectures = ['i386', 'amd64', 'powerpc', 'ia64', 'sparc', 'hppa'] 
[04:44] <Kamion> if you leave the stuff there then it's easier for us to merge things
[04:44] <ogra> the update script
[04:44] <ogra> oki
[04:44] <Kamion> oh, please leave them there, it's simpler
[04:45] <ogra> i just doubt i'll find a hppa machine in a classroom.... :)
[04:45] <Kamion> you should always go for maximum portability in packages themselves, and then just release what you want
[04:45] <ogra> ut who knows where donations come from
[04:55] <Kamion> ogra: so, ready for a test CD build?
[04:55] <ogra> sure
[04:55] <ogra> Kamion, JaneW will hug you a lot for it ;)
[04:56] <JaneW> ogra: don't scare him away!
[04:56] <ogra> heh
[04:56] <Kamion> $ cron.edubuntu-daily
[04:56] <Kamion> running
[04:56] <Kamion> obviously no magic server customisation yet or anything, nor is it a DVD build
[04:57] <Amaranth> err, wait, it's just edubuntu
[04:57] <JaneW> thanks ogra :)
[04:57] <JaneW> Amaranth what do you mean *just* edubuntu ;)
[04:57] <JaneW> ok... group hug!
[04:57] <ogra> Kamion, nope, i'm still pondering how to make my config changes... i'm not really a friend of cfengine ....
[04:57] <ogra> yay
[04:58] <Amaranth> I HAVE A SHIELD!
[04:58] <Kamion> ogra: for stuff like server metapackage installation, just tell me what you want
[04:58] <Kamion> that lives in debian-cd
[04:58] <ogra> Kamion, how do you solve it ? 
[04:58] <Kamion> ogra: d-i preseeding
[04:59] <Amaranth> /usr/include/wx/menu.h:38: warning: inline function virtual wxMenuList::~wxMenuList() used but never defined
[04:59] <Kamion> Amaranth: because the compiler doesn't know it's not just a missing prototype; only the linker can know that it's totally missing
[04:59] <ogra> Kamion, ah... that works for all configs ? 
[05:00] <Kamion> hmm, I forgot to do the standard Edubuntu preseeding
[05:00] <Kamion> ogra: all configs? EPARSE?
[05:00] <Amaranth> and C++
[05:01] <Amaranth> great, gnome-terminal crashed and took my build with it
[05:01] <Lathiat> hahaha
[05:01] <Lathiat> i love that
[05:01] <Lathiat> use screen :)
[05:01] <Lathiat> I LOVE C#
[05:01] <ogra> Kamion, i need special configs for edubuntu
[05:01] <Amaranth> Python
[05:01] <Amaranth> C# is second
[05:01] <Kamion> ogra: what kind of configs?
[05:01] <ogra> Kamion, preinstalled ones
[05:01] <Kamion> ogra: what kind of configs?
[05:01] <Kamion> do you mean configuration files in /etc?
[05:01] <ogra> Kamion, for the different servers i run
[05:02] <JaneW> highvoltage: what happened to 'going home' ? ;)
[05:02] <highvoltage> JaneW: I just got home.
[05:02] <ogra> Kamion, samba should offer a open directory for sharing networkwide etc
[05:02] <Kamion> ogra: ok, none of that has anything to do with metapackage selection in the installer!
[05:02] <ogra> i'll have to have a preconfigure proxy...
[05:02] <highvoltage> JaneW: I'm never away from work though ;)
[05:02] <Kamion> ogra: totally different layer and not something I'd be involved in
[05:02] <JaneW> highvoltage, oic, so you can connect from home now? *impressed*
[05:02] <ogra> Kamion, thats why i was astonished you could do it with preseeding
[05:03] <Kamion> 15:58 < Kamion> ogra: for stuff like server metapackage installation, just tell me what you want
[05:03] <highvoltage> JaneW: yes, I got my connection sorted out yesterday *yay*
[05:03] <Kamion> metapackage installation, obviously installer territory
[05:03] <ogra> Kamion, yes...
[05:03] <JaneW> highvoltage, cool
[05:03] <jsgotangco> brrr cold
[05:04] <highvoltage> JaneW: http://www.wo.co.za/products.html - I got the package for 699
[05:04] <JaneW> jsgotangco, me too
[05:04] <ogra> Kamion, so what would you think about a config system similar to thealternatives system, i.e. having different configs in place for different tasks and setting the link to it for a usecase ?
[05:05] <JaneW> highvoltage, nice, so you don't need a telkom line at all?
[05:05] <Kamion> ogra: cfengine appears to be the standard for doing this sort of thing; beyond that I have no experience, sorry
[05:05] <highvoltage> nope, i _don't_ have a telkom line at all :)
[05:06] <ogra> Kamion, cfengine is crack... i want something better...
[05:06] <ogra> that interates nicely with upgrades etc
[05:06] <JaneW> highvoltage, why didn;t you get the R599 one? You gonna be there during o/h too?
[05:06] <ogra> integrates even
[05:06] <jsgotangco> wow is that cheap? (R400)
[05:06] <highvoltage> jsgotangco: yes.
[05:07] <highvoltage> very cheap. compared to telkom. very expensive, compared to anywhere else in the world.
[05:08] <Kamion> ogra: in that case, as I say, I have no experience.
[05:09] <ogra> yep
[05:09] <jhaltom> where's mkfontdir supposed to be these days?
[05:09] <ogra> Kamion, but you have experience in distro structures :)
[05:09] <Amaranth> wow, 9 year olds can be MSCEs
[05:10] <highvoltage> JaneW: i took the all day one, so that i can still upload/download while I'm at work at home.
[05:10] <lamont> HTH did pkgstriptranslations wind up in the d-i daily build chroots?
[05:10] <wasabi> heh. odd. mkfontdir is failing to run... and I can't even find it.
[05:10] <JaneW> highvoltage, ok, makes sense
[05:11] <highvoltage> Amaranth: MCSE's
[05:11] <JaneW> Amaranth: yes, a shame to wadste a life - so young
[05:11] <JaneW> waste even
[05:12] <highvoltage> I wanted to do a MCSE when I was 17. thank goodness i was saved in time.
[05:13] <jsgotangco> heh i did 2 MCP exams before though
[05:13] <jsgotangco> till i saw the light
[05:13] <jsgotangco> it came in handy though
[05:14] <highvoltage> my friends with mcse's and c#, .net, etc can't get jobs, but those with just a little linux/opensource skills get good jobs quite easily.
[05:14] <ogra> heh
[05:14] <bddebian> highvoltage: And what planet are you from? :-)
[05:14] <dredg> there are plenty of jobs out there. it's just that most of them are somewhat more specialist than they were in the 90's
[05:14] <highvoltage> bddebian: I currently live on a strange planet, called Earth. Don't worry, it's mostly harmless.
[05:15] <dredg> at least, that's what i've found in ireland anyway
[05:15] <JaneW> highvoltage, LOL!
[05:15] <jsgotangco> mostly harmless
[05:15] <jsgotangco> hehe
[05:15] <jsgotangco> thanks for all the fish
[05:15] <bddebian> dredg: Amen to that.  And usually the so-called "specialists" don't know jack about their "specialty" :-)
[05:15] <dredg> bddebian: i know
[05:15] <jsgotangco> well some people just brain dump on exams
[05:15] <bddebian> Of course I don't know jack about anything so... :-)
[05:16] <JaneW>  know jack
[05:16] <dredg> MCSE and friends are still useful from a HR POV
[05:16] <dredg> but once you get past that it's ok
[05:16] <bddebian> Aye.  "Looks good on the CV" ;-)
[05:16] <highvoltage> dredg: i don't think it's like that everywhere, hey.
[05:16] <wasabi> grrr. now X is missing "input driver named keyboard"
[05:17] <highvoltage> in south africa, the average toilet cleaner gets more that the average person who only has an MCSE (except for those MCSE that are actually toilet cleaners, of course)
[05:17] <dredg> highvoltage: of course it's not, just talking about here :)
[05:17] <JaneW> highvoltage: for instance it wouldn;t look good on a .doc CV sent to Canonical for instance!
[05:17] <ogra> wasabi, change to kbd in xorg.conf
[05:17] <highvoltage> JaneW: exactly!
[05:17] <JaneW> highvoltage, stop making me laugh!
[05:17] <highvoltage> JaneW: sorry
[05:17] <jsgotangco> plumbers earn big though
[05:17] <dredg> JaneW: any jobs going? :)
[05:18] <jsgotangco> (in some countries anyway)
[05:18] <JaneW> dredg: no sorry
[05:18] <dredg> google are taking too long with my application
[05:18] <Amaranth> wasabi: s/keyboard/kbd/ in xorg.conf
[05:18] <highvoltage> My grade 10 Afrikaans teacher threw me with a bible once because I made too much jokes in the class.
[05:18] <wasabi> Odd. I did. Same error.
[05:18] <highvoltage> she was real angry.
[05:18] <Amaranth> wasabi: Not possible.
[05:19] <ogra> wasabi, nd you need the matching drivers installed... tere is no dependency on them afaik
[05:19] <Amaranth> wasabi: Driver 'keyboard' changed to Driver 'kbd'?
[05:19] <wasabi> Well... I did. Maybe it's using a different config is all I can think of.
[05:19] <JaneW> highvoltage: you drove someone to throw a bible at you!? Hard core ;)
[05:19] <wasabi> Yup. In the keyboard device. It says kbd very clearly.
[05:19] <highvoltage> hehe
[05:19] <jsgotangco> wow throwing a bible..
[05:19] <Amaranth> oh yeah, and sudo apt-get install xserver-xorg-input-kbd xserver-xorg-input-mouse xserver-xorg-driver-*
[05:19] <ogra> wasabi, xserver-xorg-input-kbd
[05:19] <JaneW> 'Psycho Boy'
[05:19] <wasabi> Oh that's odd. X started alone works.
[05:20] <bddebian> You mean my MCSE, MS SQL, Windows, Office, etc experience isn't going to get me a job at Canonical? :-(
[05:20] <wasabi> gdm however doesn't.
[05:20] <Amaranth> o_O
[05:20] <Amaranth> bddebian: It might get you a job at ev1. :)
[05:20] <bddebian> Heh
[05:20] <dredg> Amaranth: LOL
[05:20] <highvoltage> brb
[05:20] <bddebian> MS is my life unfortunately
[05:21] <jsgotangco> MS for me is only for games now
[05:21] <Amaranth> same here jsgotangco 
[05:21] <jsgotangco> they seem to do good on that lately
[05:21] <Amaranth> i only play one game on windows, otherwise i'm all ubuntu
[05:21] <wasabi> could gdm be using a different config?
[05:21] <Amaranth> and i hear a WINE guy is working on support for this game, so woo
[05:21] <Amaranth> (continuum)
[05:22] <JaneW> I have to go now, I have some non-cycber activities planned for tonight.
[05:22] <jsgotangco> i did the cedega route for sometime but i just dropped it
[05:22] <jsgotangco> non-cyber activities
[05:22] <JaneW> ogra: lemme know how it goes 
[05:22] <wasabi> Buh. gdm reinstall doesn't configure itself right.
[05:22] <wasabi> missing /etc/X11/default-display-manager
[05:22] <ogra> JaneW, yep
[05:22] <JaneW> so long and thanks for all the seeds ;)
[05:22] <ogra> :)
[05:23] <JaneW> jsgotangco: i.e I will be interacting with *REAL* people shudder
[05:23] <ogra> wasabi, purge it before ? 
[05:23] <jsgotangco> lol
[05:28] <Amaranth> i give up on vlc
[05:28] <Amaranth> stupid X
[05:29] <davyd> so, the rule of thumb for breezy on amd64
[05:29] <davyd> don't reboot
[05:30] <ogra> davyd, 
[05:30] <ogra> ogra@honk:~ $ uname -a
[05:30] <ogra> Linux honk 2.6.12-1-amd64-k8 #1 Fri Jun 17 11:53:15 BST 2005 x86_64 GNU/Linux
[05:30] <ogra> ogra@honk:~ $ uptime
[05:30] <ogra>  17:29:27 up 1 day, 21:23,  5 users,  load average: 0.17, 0.21, 0.13
[05:30] <ogra> no problems here
[05:31] <davyd> ogra: some things appear to be uninstallable
[05:31] <davyd> which is a little concerning
[05:31] <ogra> davyd, new install or hoary upgrade ?
[05:32] <davyd> upgrade from a new hoary install
[05:32] <ogra> hmm, here too... but i never dist-upgrade in a development system... i only upgrade and pick the left over stuff manually
[05:38] <Nermal> ooooh.. davyd
[05:41] <davyd> so g77 is in main, but gfortran is in universe
[05:41] <davyd> that hardly seems fair now, does it
[05:42] <ogra> heh
[05:45] <davyd> what's the gcc flag to compile a 32-bit binary?
[05:45] <Kamion> -m32
[05:45] <davyd> cheers
[05:46] <Kamion> ogra: http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/daily/current/
[05:46] <jp> wtf is cheers?
[05:46] <Kamion> see a dictionary
[05:47] <ogra> heh
[05:48] <davyd> is it possible to link to a 32-bit .a file from a 64-bit binary?
[05:48] <Kamion> I doubt it ...
[05:48] <ogra> Kamion, that looks bad http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/daily/20050715/report.html
[05:48] <davyd> yeah
[05:48] <davyd> this is going to get messy, I may need to set up a chroot
[05:48] <wasabi_> oh man, everything on my machine is nicely crashing now.
[05:48] <wasabi_> epiphany too.
[05:48] <Kamion> ogra: hah, I'll have a look
[05:48] <davyd> because I have a lot of 32-bit libraries that I need to call into
[05:49] <ogra> Kamion, :( # amd64:895 # i386:925 # powerpc:768
[05:49] <davyd> I wonder how many of them I can rebuild for Opteron
[05:50] <siretart> help!
[05:50] <siretart> I'm trying to fix ghc6, which is uninstallable atm. it build depends on itself :/
[05:51] <siretart> how to proceed?
[05:51] <Kamion> ogra: haha, whoops, I screwed up debian-cd
[05:51] <ogra> oh, phew :)
[05:52] <Kamion> ogra: and for that matter I just noticed that I never adjusted Kubuntu for the base->minimal/standard split
[05:52] <Kamion> no wonder it's not been working
[05:52] <Kamion> but Riddell didn't nag me enough to notice, or apparently debug it himself ...
[05:52] <ogra> yay for edubuntu then :)
[05:52] <Kamion> "libc6 is missing" would have been enough of a hint :P
[05:52] <wasabi_> Question.
[05:53] <wasabi_> What is Ubuntu's stance on unique ways to bypass copyright?
[05:53] <wasabi_> For instance, program A doesn't allow distirbution by anybody really... is it acceptable to have a wiki article describing how to get it, and promoting that wiki article?
[05:53] <ogra> heh
[05:53] <Kamion> depends on your jurisdiction I think
[05:53] <wasabi_> I speak of Java.
[05:53] <davyd> anyone have an idea what libguide is?
[05:53] <Kamion> but consult a lawyer
[05:54] <wasabi_> Well, I ask from the point of view of the guys running the Wiki.
[05:54] <Kamion> I don't think Ubuntu/Canonical should be giving you legal advice here
[05:54] <wasabi_> It's Canonical's wiki.
[05:54] <Kamion> Heh, in that case Canonical probably ought to consult a lawyer. :-)
[05:54] <wasabi_> Take this current circumstance... Sun's Java. Bunch of guys, who are not realted to Canonical, package up Sun's JDK.
[05:54] <wasabi_> And distribute. Which is technically illegal to do.
[05:55] <jsgotangco> you mean backports
[05:55] <wasabi_> Yes.
[05:55] <wasabi_> Exactly.
[05:55] <wasabi_> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Java
[05:55] <jsgotangco> i've read the wiki entry
[05:55] <wasabi_> I'm just curious about that.
[05:55] <Kamion> I don't know who's liable for information published on a wiki.
[05:55] <wasabi_> Is there an official Canonical stance?
[05:55] <wasabi_> Personally I don't like it.
[05:55] <Kamion> One could argue that the wiki is basically just being a common carrier, but it might well depend on the judge ... the Wikimedia Foundation might know more.
[05:56] <jsgotangco> yeah we've discussed that during the docteam meeting as well regarding stuff in theUbuntu wiki
[05:56] <wasabi_> I don't want to promote it. There are other legal ways to get the software on your machine.
[05:56] <jsgotangco> we decided to raise it on CC
[05:56] <Kamion> I haven't heard of an official Canonical stance on this, largely because everybody runs away screaming
[05:56] <wasabi_> Hah.
[05:56] <Lathiat> so..
[05:56] <Kamion> we were very careful not to get into the issue when we released warty, but many of the people who got involved chose not to respect that decision
[05:56] <Lathiat> can we get libaa synced in yet
[05:56] <jsgotangco> the issue really is questionable content on official servers
[05:56] <Lathiat> aalib was transition to libaa
[05:56] <Kamion> if we deleted that stuff, it would just get added straight back again
[05:56] <Lathiat> and all the sdl stuff is broken till we get libaa and fix sdl
[05:57] <wasabi_> jsgotangco, well, I wouldn't say in some jurisidictions linking to questionable content is pretty much cut and dry
[05:57] <wasabi_> take that recent .au case.
[05:57] <Kamion> jsgotangco: the CC doesn't consist of lawyers, either
[05:57] <Riddell> Kamion: I havn't noticed the base->minimal/standard split before.  what needs to be adjusted?
[05:57] <Kamion> Riddell: it's done
[05:57] <wasabi_> But regardless, in this specific case, is it something we can come down on? The software is available legally.
[05:57] <wasabi_> It's just not available legally from backports.
[05:57] <wasabi_> Have to go to Sun's website to get it.
[05:58] <Kamion> Riddell: you didn't notice that the Kubuntu CDs didn't contain any of the base system?
[05:58] <Riddell> Kamion: well I noticed they didn't work at all
[05:58] <Kamion> right, but I need you guys to help me debug this sort of thing
[05:58] <Kamion> I cannot manage CD builds for three distributions by myself with no help
[05:59] <siretart> may I file a bug for ghc6 in bugzilla? I don't think that we MOTU's can handle this issue on our own :(
[05:59] <Kamion> so when they don't work, please try to find out why :-)
[05:59] <Riddell> Kamion: will do.  so tomorrow's should work in theory?
[06:00] <Kamion> Riddell: it'll have this particular bug fixed, but beyond that I don't know
[06:00] <Riddell> or maybe they won't if X still has issues
[06:00] <Kamion> Riddell: I've just kicked off a new build
[06:00] <Riddell> Kamion: cool, I'll give that a go then
[06:01] <Kamion> should be ~50mins
[06:06] <Riddell> Kamion: is the base split documented somewhere?  it's not on SeedManagement
[06:07] <ogra> Riddell, you could just compare the seeds
[06:08] <ogra> (guessing you have a locl branch without the split)
[06:08] <ogra> local even
[06:08] <Riddell> don't think I do
[06:08] <eruin> any plans to add something like this in ubuntu?  ( http://www.math.vt.edu/people/jbwillia/calendar.jpg ) - note the evolution tasks, which I gather is a fedora-specific patch
[06:10] <jsgotangco> good night!
[06:11] <Kamion> Riddell: http://udu.wiki.ubuntu.com/PackageSelection
[06:11] <Kamion> though I think that says base and standard, not minimal and standard
[06:15] <Kamion> Riddell: I've updated SeedManagement
[06:15] <Kamion> somewhat, anyway
[06:16] <Riddell> Kamion: thanks
[06:16] <Riddell> ogra: seen http://italc.sourceforge.net/home.php ?
[06:23] <comadreja> where's xmodmap now ?
[06:23] <dredg> xmodmap is so X 3.3 :)
[06:24] <comadreja> I had xmodmap until last upgrade to -41
[06:27] <cartman> anyone knows why latest X.org is not built for amd64? Same q. for xvinfo which xbase-clients depend on
[06:27] <eruin> gnome complained about xorg/gnome keyboard mismatch ;D
[06:41] <carstenh> jbailey: ping
[06:41] <seb128> lamont: please kick gnome-control-center too
[06:43] <davyd> how hard is it to build a 32bit library and shove it into /lib32 etc (as appropriate)
[06:43] <davyd> is there a nice howto for this?
[06:44] <Kamion> Riddell: new Kubuntu daily CD build up, contains libc6 now ;-)
[06:47] <herzi> the ubuntu installation freezes when creating the ext3 partition on a sata drive (always at the 5% step) with a sempron machine, any hints how i can find out why?
[06:54] <eruin> is xbase-clients going to be dropped?
[06:55] <cartman> eruin: why?
[06:55] <Kamion> no
[06:55] <eruin> just wondering ;)
[06:56] <eruin> this modularization stuff has my head in a horrible spin
[06:56] <cartman> eruin: it depends on xvinfo so its borked on amd64 now
[06:56] <cartman> in case you use amd64
[06:56] <Riddell> is there a way to subscribe to all pages in the wiki?
[06:56] <eruin> I was thinking more of its conflict with xkeyboard-config
[06:56] <eruin> no doubt daniels is working way too hard on fixing it
[06:57] <Kamion> eruin: modularisation means that individual packages can be fixed without everyone having to download an enormous 50MB blob
[06:57] <cartman> Riddell: use rss feed maybe
[06:57] <ivoks> i think daniels would appriciate some peace these days :)
[06:57] <eruin> yeah ;)
[06:57] <eruin> he's been in this x mess for well over a month now hasn't he?
[06:58] <cartman> no way without fixing amd64 :P
[06:58] <Kamion> actually, let's call that more like 200MB, since that's the mirror hit of xfree86
[06:58] <eruin> poor lad
[06:58] <ivoks> hard job
[06:58] <Kamion> cartman: it's not daniels' fault; the amd64 buildds are down
[06:58] <cartman> Kamion: oh why? :(
[06:58] <Kamion> cartman: uh, dunno, last I heard they just weren't responding to stimuli
[06:58] <cartman> Kamion: :(
[06:58] <Kamion> probably needs somebody to reboot them, but the relevant people are in Finland
[06:59] <cartman> :/
[06:59] <cartman> Debconf5 ?
[06:59] <Kamion> yes
[06:59] <cartman> I see :/
[06:59] <eruin> where are the buildds at?
[06:59] <Kamion> datacentre in London
[07:00] <eruin> I'm going there soon
[07:00] <eruin> I'll do it! :P
[07:00] <eruin> you didn't calculate in my amazing charms ;>
[07:00] <Kamion> "hi, I'd like to reboot some servers" "who are you?" "oh, just this guy"
[07:01] <eruin> haha
[07:01] <ivoks> "what guy?" "you know, the guy..."
[07:01] <ivoks> "piss of kid"
[07:01] <eruin> the reboot guy
[07:01] <cartman> the guy with the amd64
[07:01] <cartman> :P
[07:01] <eruin> I think they
[07:01] <eruin> 'd rather say something along the lines of sod off
[07:01] <ivoks> ah right, london :)
[07:01] <jbailey> carstenh: pong!
[07:01] <dilinger> "listen, this guy on IRC told me he needed a server rebooted.."
[07:02] <jbailey> dilinger: Sure, just give me the root password. =)
[07:02] <carstenh> jbailey: hi, did you find out who the mentor of GraphicalConfigTools is?
[07:02] <jbailey> carstenh: No, I'll ping Jane again.
[07:02] <herve> hey jbailey!
[07:02] <carstenh> jbailey: ok, thanks
[07:02] <jbailey> Heya Herv
[07:03] <jbailey> Gah, one of thes edays I need to figure out why opening a new windows in evo to send an email brings my system to its knees.
[07:05] <Amaranth> Solution: Don't use evolution.
[07:05] <Amaranth> *cough*
[07:06] <jbailey> Amaranth: I have to support it, so it's better if I use it.
[07:06] <eruin> http://www.math.vt.edu/people/jbwillia/calendar.jpg
[07:06] <eruin> anyone see that?
[07:06] <Amaranth> what is that?
[07:07] <eruin> is that a fedora-specific thing or hidden inside ubuntu?
[07:07] <eruin> the evolution tasks in the calendar
[07:07] <Amaranth> that's e-d-s
[07:07] <jbailey> eruin: The calendar?
[07:07] <jbailey> It works in Ubuntu
[07:07] <eruin> hmm
[07:07] <eruin> not by default?
[07:08] <ogra> eruin, sure...
[07:08] <eruin> hm
[07:08] <eruin> I wonder why my tasks dont show
[07:09] <Amaranth> you made a task in evolution for today?
[07:10] <eruin> ohhh
[07:12] <Amaranth> i was wowed when i first found that
[07:12] <Amaranth> until i realized i used tomboy to make a todo list instead of evolution
[07:12] <eruin> haah
[07:13] <eruin> the backend for that thing should really be more generic, so as to allow apps like tomboy to add/control it
[07:13] <eruin> evolution is a bit over-the-hill for most people
[07:13] <ogra> eruin, thats planned, thats exactly what e-d-s was written for
[07:14] <eruin> I obviously need to educate myself more
[07:14] <JanC> wasabi : I think in almost all countries you're safe if you remove "illegal" stuff from a wiki when you are asked to do so by the copyright holder
[07:14] <JanC> and sun would be really stupid to ask that in this case...
[07:15] <JanC> "stupid" being an euphemism
[07:16] <Kamion> Amaranth: so gtk_window_set_focus_on_map (window, FALSE) is the right way to avoid debconf's GNOME frontend stealing focus, isn't it?
[07:16] <davyd> oh man, packaging libraries for /lib32 is hard work
[07:18] <jbailey> carstenh: I've emailed her, since she's not online.
[07:18] <Amaranth> Kamion: Not sure.
[07:18] <carstenh> jbailey: thanks
[07:18] <Amaranth> Kamion: I thought it was a WM hint.
[07:20] <carstenh> jbailey: i just startet system-config-services in a fedora-chroot... should we support different configurations in different runlevels?
[07:21] <jbailey> Hmm, good question.
[07:22] <Amaranth> Kamion: #gnome-hackers says it should Just Work
[07:22] <Riddell> how do I rsync daily CDs?  can't find the URL
[07:22] <jbailey> carstenh: Y'know, that sounds like a royal pain in the butt to support.
[07:22] <jbailey> carstenh: I think we should probably just either start the firewall or not.
[07:23] <carstenh> jbailey: sure, services is the last thing to do, but we should talk about it earlier
[07:24] <Amaranth> system-config-services? hehe
[07:24] <Amaranth> i tried to port that once
[07:25] <Amaranth> do we even need it? we have the GNOME one and BUM
[07:25] <Kamion> Amaranth: http://mail.gnome.org/archives/desktop-devel-list/2004-December/msg00306.html implies I need to set_focus_on_map(), I think
[07:25] <lamont> seb128: kicked
[07:26] <Kamion> Riddell: rsync://cdimage.ubuntu.com/cdimage/kubuntu/daily/current/breezy-install-i386.iso
[07:26] <lamont> daniels: is -42 happy then, or is it still b0rked?
[07:26] <Amaranth> Kamion: yep, that's it
[07:27] <Riddell> Kamion: thanks
[07:27] <Amaranth> lamont: xbase-clients will take about a week, from the sound of it
[07:28] <Amaranth> if you pin it to 6.8.2-36 you should be ok though
[07:28] <lamont> Amaranth: my question was more whether I should expect to see -43 today or not... :)
[07:28] <Amaranth> ah
[07:28] <carstenh> Amaranth: currently two summer of code projects are planing to implement something like this...
[07:28] <Amaranth> daniels passed out a long time ago
[07:28] <comadreja> Amaranth : where can I get xbase-clients 6.8.2-36 ?
[07:29] <Amaranth> comadreja: apt pinning
[07:29] <comadreja> my x are screwed
[07:29] <Amaranth> man apt_preferences
[07:29] <comadreja> yep
[07:29] <Amaranth> what is wrong with your X?
[07:29] <comadreja> the keyboard
[07:29] <comadreja> I lost xmodmap, and the mapping doesn-t work anymore
[07:30] <comadreja> it was on xbase-clients, but it's not anymore
[07:30] <lamont> carstenh: implement what?
[07:30] <Amaranth> you symlinked /usr/bin/xkbcomp to /etc/X11/xkb/xkbcomp and installed xkeyboard-config?
[07:30] <carstenh> lamont: something like system-config-services for ubuntu
[07:30] <lamont> ah, ok
[07:30] <Amaranth> that can't be the only thing on your list
[07:31] <Amaranth> that should only take a week or so to port, you have to have something else
[07:31] <carstenh> Amaranth: no, it is only a part in both projects
[07:31] <comadreja> let me check
[07:32] <Kamion> bah, I need a new libgtk2-perl for this
[07:32] <comadreja> Amaranth : I have no /etc/X11/xkb/xkbcomp
[07:32] <Amaranth> comadreja: exactly
[07:33] <comadreja> neither /usr/bin/xkbcomp 
[07:33] <Amaranth> ...
[07:33] <Amaranth> wtf
[07:33] <comadreja> yes
[07:33] <Amaranth> you installed xkeyboard-config?
[07:33] <comadreja> yep
[07:33] <Amaranth> do you have apt-file?
[07:34] <comadreja> nopes
[07:34] <Amaranth> use apt-file to see what package supposedly has xkbcomp
[07:34] <Amaranth> get it, set it up, and search for xkbcomp
[07:34] <comadreja> ok
[07:38] <comadreja> Amaranth : xbase-clients
[07:38] <Amaranth> you have xbase-clients -36?
[07:39] <comadreja> nopes, i have -42
[07:39] <Amaranth> ...
[07:39] <Amaranth> i told you to pin -36
[07:39] <comadreja> too late :(
[07:39] <comadreja> I already had it
[07:39] <Amaranth> no, pinning -36 will make it downgrade
[07:40] <comadreja> Package: xbase-clients
[07:40] <comadreja> crispin: version 6.8.2-36
[07:40] <comadreja> Pin-Priority: 1001
[07:40] <comadreja> I've got that
[07:40] <Amaranth> yeah
[07:40] <comadreja> no downgrade, though
[07:40] <Amaranth> apt-get update and apt-get install xbase-clients
[07:40] <Amaranth> the 1001 should force it to downgrade
[07:40] <comadreja> Package xbase-clients is not available, but is referred to by another package.
[07:41] <Amaranth> i haven't done this in a _long_ time though
[07:41] <Amaranth> wtf
[07:41] <Amaranth> ok, let's install it manually
[07:41] <Amaranth> and _leave it at -36_
[07:41] <JanC> probably -36 isn't in the archive anymore...
[07:41] <comadreja> where can I download it ?
[07:41] <comadreja> that's it
[07:42] <Amaranth> damn
[07:42] <Amaranth> -36 is only in for amd64
[07:42] <Amaranth> since the amd64 buildds fell over
[07:42] <Amaranth> someone posted a link to it in here
[07:42] <Riddell> http://dev.kubuntu.org.uk/~jr/kubuntu/xbase-clients_6.8.2-32_i386.deb
[07:42] <Amaranth> they had a copy
[07:43] <Amaranth> woo, close enough
[07:43] <Amaranth> ok, install that and change the pin to that version
[07:43] <comadreja> conflict
[07:44] <comadreja>  xcursorgen conflicts with xbase-clients (<< 6.8.2-35)
[07:44] <Amaranth> ...
[07:44] <Amaranth> *sigh*
[07:44] <comadreja> I could force it...
[07:44] <Amaranth> no
[07:45] <Amaranth> http://i-understand.com/xbase-clients_6.8.2-36_i386.deb
[07:45] <comadreja> cool :)
[07:45] <Amaranth> fabbione's logs to the rescue!
[07:45] <Riddell> http://dev.kubuntu.org.uk/~jr/kubuntu/xbase-clients_6.8.2-36_i386.deb
[07:47] <comadreja> awesom
[07:47] <crimsun> Kamion: please sync wxwindows2.4 from Sid
[07:47] <comadreja> but the keyboard is still broken
[07:47] <comadreja> I made the link
[07:48] <Amaranth> kick back and wait for daniels to wake up, i guess
[07:48] <comadreja> but at least I have xmodmap
[07:48] <comadreja> yes, no problem with this :)
[07:48] <Amaranth> you installed xkeyboard-config?
[07:48] <ogra> comadreja, there is also a post on -devel with a handfull of links ;)
[07:48] <Amaranth> you might want to reinstall it
[07:48] <Amaranth> i seem to remember it conflicting with xbase-clients
[07:48] <lamont> ah, just on powerpc...
[07:48] <lamont> I bet it didn't finish building there yet or something,
[07:48] <Amaranth> yeah, powerpc accepted it and we were all happy
[07:49] <Amaranth> then it unaccepted and we cried
[07:49] <comadreja> ogra: thanks, I'll check it
[07:49] <Amaranth> then nothing built until -41, whee
[07:50] <Kamion> crimsun: I don't do syncs
[07:50] <Kamion> crimsun: if you want approval of a sync, ask for it :)
[07:50] <crimsun> Kamion: ah, only NEW?
[07:50] <lamont> crimsun: and only when it's trivial
[07:50] <Kamion> sort of general backup stuff
[07:50] <crimsun> sorry, not current with policy
[07:51] <Kamion> bah, why is wxwindows2.4 a native package anyway?
[07:51] <ogra> crimsun, what about 2.6 ? 
[07:51] <Kamion> ogra: Edubuntu CD builds updated; rather healthier now
[07:51] <crimsun> ogra: Debian maintainer is waiting for cvs to stabilise
[07:52] <ogra> Kamion, thanks a lot :)
[07:52] <chrissturm> hmm, is 2,6.1 not stable_
[07:52] <highvoltage> edubuntu CD builds? are they downloadable anywhere?
[07:52] <ogra> crimsun, i thought i heard seb128 mention its in now ...
[07:52] <Amaranth> it's in experimental
[07:52] <Amaranth> i built it today
[07:53] <ogra> highvoltage, yes but unlikely to work with the current X suituation
[07:53] <Kamion> crimsun: does it not need to be merged? there are Ubuntu changes
[07:53] <seth_k> does the -42 X fix the issues of yesterday?
[07:53] <ogra> highvoltage, i'll annouce ste start of the autobuilds in edubutu-devel soon
[07:53] <Amaranth> seth_k: stick with -36
[07:53] <ogra> s/ste/the/
[07:53] <Kamion> crimsun: in any case, the last Debian version is from before upstream version freeze, so you don't need approval - if it doesn't need a merge, talk to elmo when he's around, or send him mail
[07:53] <highvoltage> ogra: ok. cool.
[07:53] <seth_k> Amaranth: word
[07:53] <Amaranth> seth_k: it's going to be the only version to work for the next week or so
[07:54] <ogra> highvoltage, with the appropriate warnings :)
[07:54] <highvoltage> hehe, of course.
[07:54] <seth_k> Amaranth: thank you for the info, 36 it is
[07:54] <comadreja> I get this when trying to install xkeyboard-config
[07:54] <comadreja>  trying to overwrite `/etc/X11/xkb/compiled', which is also in package xbase-clients
[07:54] <Amaranth> exactly
[07:54] <Amaranth> force it
[07:54] <crimsun> Kamion: all right, thanks
[07:55] <highvoltage> ogra, do you have lots of bandwidth where you are, to download a ~680MB file?
[07:55] <ogra> highvoltage, i have a flatrate but only a 768k line
[07:55] <Kamion> lamont-away: UNACCEPTs> if elmo can't do it right now, get him to tell me what to do please ...
[07:55] <davyd> so... can I request that libgfortran be added to ia32 libs?
 only!?
[07:56] <lamont-away> Kamion: actually, looks like -42/ppc made it in finally, so they're really gone.
[07:56] <lamont-away> Kamion: and I think it's as simple/trivial as nuking the offending package from Accepted.  but that's just a guess.
[07:56] <lamont-away> anyway, --> office
[07:57] <ajf> anyone have a PPC deb of -36?
[07:57] <ajf> :D
[07:58] <Amaranth> we did about 5 minutes ago
[07:58] <comadreja> Amaranth : do I have to pin xlibs and xlibs-data too ?
[07:58] <Amaranth> see if you can find it on a mirror
[07:59] <Amaranth> xlibs is a dummy package
[08:00] <comadreja> xlibs-data ?
[08:00] <ogra> highvoltage, 1M is the common minimum here, i just live to far away from the next headend, so i pay 1M but only get 768k 
[08:00] <Amaranth> dunno about xlibs-data
[08:00] <Amaranth> i don't think you have to worry about anything other than xbase-clients
[08:01] <comadreja> trying...
[08:01] <comadreja> rmdir: `/etc/X11/xkb/geometry': Directory not empty
[08:01] <comadreja> dpkg: error processing xlibs (--configure):
[08:01] <Amaranth> you know, if something breaks the only option is reinstalling or waiting
[08:01] <Amaranth> since -36 isn't on the archives
[08:01] <comadreja> yes, now I've got it on the hd
[08:02] <Amaranth> sure, that one package
[08:02] <highvoltage> ogra: i just got a 128k connection, and I've got a faster connection than any of my friends.
[08:02] <Amaranth> no one has a mirror of the rest of the -36 packages
[08:02] <ogra> highvoltage, yep
[08:02] <Amaranth> so if you break something you're sol
[08:02] <comadreja> Amaranth : thanks a million for your help :)
[08:02] <ogra> highvoltage, its over here in germany, i think its only a matter of time for SA
[08:02] <jp> who knows what dbus-sharp version requires muine from cvs?
[08:03] <highvoltage> yes, that's what they say.
[08:03] <ogra> jp, tseng
[08:03] <jp> ogra ;) ok :)
[08:07] <ivoks> night
[08:08] <highvoltage> gnight
[08:13] <Kamion> Amaranth: morgue.ubuntu.com
[08:21] <comadreja> what's the position regarding the libXrender.la file ? should it be included or not ?
[08:24] <Riddell> comadreja: no, other .la files are yet to be updated to stop referencing libXrender.la though
[08:25] <comadreja> damn, another transition :)
[08:40] <seth_k> work, codeslaves, work
[09:11] <hughsie> mjg59: ping?
[09:12] <mjg59> hughsie: Hi
[09:12] <mjg59> Only here briefly
[09:12] <hughsie> cool, no problem.
[09:12] <hughsie> have you had a chance to speak to ogra?
[09:12] <mjg59> Not really - I'm at Debconf at the moment
[09:12] <hughsie> ahh, forgot, sorry
[09:12] <hughsie> going well?
[09:13] <mjg59> Pretty good, yup
[09:13] <Simira> ah
[09:13] <mjg59> I've just ported vbetool to use x86emu on non-x86 platforms
[09:13] <hughsie> and power stuff going on? :)
[09:13] <mjg59> So amd64 support ought to be improved now
[09:13] <hughsie> mjg59: cool
[09:14] <hughsie> mjg59, honestly, what you make of gnome power manager. be blunt
[09:15] <mjg59> hughsie: From the looks of it, it's coming together really well
[09:16] <davyd> just until I can recompile my dependancies for amd64
[09:16] <hughsie> mjg59, with the HAL backend?
[09:16] <mjg59> Yeah
[09:16] <hughsie> What about pmscripts? suitable for ubuntu?
[09:16] <mjg59> Not sure yet
[09:17] <mjg59> I honestly haven't had a chance to look - I've just moved house
[09:17] <hughsie> i'm guessing you could hack them around better than kI ever could
[09:17] <hughsie> mjg59, i know what you mean, me too a few weeks ago
[09:17] <hughsie> hell, on earth
[09:17] <mjg59> We'll probably just end up integrating the scripts we currently have
[09:18] <davyd> damned crack scripts
[09:18] <hughsie> mjg59, thats what i wanted really
[09:18] <hughsie> the distros to do what they wanted, and just use g-p-m as the front end
[09:18] <mjg59> Yeah
[09:18] <mjg59> Anyway, I need to head out now
[09:18] <hughsie> cool.
[09:18] <hughsie> mjg59, enyoy the conf.
[09:19] <mjg59> I'll be hacking on this in the next week or so, so look forward to bug reports :)
[09:19] <hughsie> mjg59, nice one!
[09:19] <mjg59> Bye
[09:19] <hughsie> i love patches
[09:19] <hughsie> bye
[09:20] <hughsie> davyd, you say that every day!
[09:20] <davyd> hughsie: I'm up a lot later then usual
[09:20] <davyd> been playing with building some software on amd64
[09:21] <hughsie> not got that luxury :-(
[09:21] <davyd> but it's too hard to recompile my libraries to 64-bit
[09:21] <davyd> and I don't have a good enough compiler
[09:21] <hughsie> i'll stick with my i386 old pc's
[09:21] <davyd> this is a new work PC they've given me
[09:21] <hughsie> davyd: yum install ? (joke!)
[09:22] <hughsie> davyd, with my new laptop, i figured 64 bit wasn;t worth the extra hassle
[09:22] <davyd> I have 64 bit versions of the maths library
[09:22] <davyd> but only a 32 bit version of the Intel Fortran compiler
[09:22] <hughsie> davyd, make much difference?
[09:22] <davyd> hughsie: apparently
[09:23] <davyd> gfortran is not fantastic
[09:23] <hughsie> lol, i could have guessed that!
[09:23] <davyd> at some point it's going to be my job to autotools up a whole lot of our random libraries
[09:23] <davyd> ideally make them less 70s UNIX
[09:24] <davyd> there are UNIX admins in my company who appear to have missed the 80s and 90s
[09:24] <davyd> programmers too
[09:24] <hughsie> lol, i do not envy you one little bit!
[09:25] <hughsie> autotools, ... hummmm... not that nice fuzzy feeling
[09:25] <davyd> I'm getting ok at it
[09:25] <davyd> I managed to rewrite the macros for the app I'm working on
[09:25] <hughsie> cool.
[09:25] <davyd> but it has too many hard coded paths for my liking
[09:28] <hughsie> on phone, sorry
[09:33] <hughsie> davyd, g2g, catch you later
[09:34] <davyd> later
[09:43] <Burgundavia> jdub, ping
[09:48] <jp> he's in japan
[09:52] <Burgundavia> ah
[09:52] <Burgundavia> bugger
[10:04] <aurax> hay can anyone have access to #ubuntu's bans ?
[10:04] <aurax> someone banned me ..
[10:04] <aurax> with no reason .
[10:06] <tritium> aurax, do you recall when/why?
[10:07] <aurax> week and a half ago
[10:07] <aurax> dunno why
[10:07] <aurax> i got d/c and when i get back i was banned
[10:07] <aurax> got*
[10:07] <tritium> aurax, yes, I see it now
[10:07] <thom> you may well have been bouncing
[10:07] <aurax> i got many ip's
[10:07] <aurax> <-dynami
[10:07] <aurax> c
[10:08] <tritium> aurax, let me talk to the person that banned you.  one moment
[10:08] <aurax> ok
[10:08] <aurax> thanks
[10:21] <tritium> aurax, I reviewed the irc logs at the time you were banned.  It is my opinion that the op who banned you had justification.
[10:22] <lamont> Kamion: you still around?
[10:26] <Riddell> Kamion: the kubuntu install CD says No Kernal Modules Were Found
[10:26] <Kamion> lamont: about to go shuffle from house to house again, but say it and I'll read scrollback
[10:26] <\sh> does anybody have a xutils 6.8.2-36 package with mkfontdir inside? 
[10:26] <ajf> \sh: ditto, heh :D
[10:27] <ajf> I <3 breezy
[10:27] <ajf> also, apt-file doesn't depend on curl, and it should
[10:27] <tseng> bugs go to bugzilla/malone please
[10:27] <Kamion> Riddell: hmm, I think we need to do some seed merging
[10:27] <Kamion> Riddell: I'll take a look in a bit
[10:28] <Riddell> \sh: http://dev.kubuntu.org.uk/~jr/tmp/xutils_6.8.2-34_i386.deb
[10:28] <\sh> riddell: i love u honey :)
[10:28] <Kamion> Riddell: yep, requires a merge of the 2.6.12-2 -> 2.6.12-3 installer seed change - I'll fix in a bit
[10:28] <Kamion> Riddell: thanks
[10:29] <Riddell> Kamion: if seed in kubuntu/edubuntu is always the same as in ubuntu could ./update not grab the current version from ubuntu?
[10:31] <\sh> *grm*  bbl
[10:37] <ajf> Riddell: you don't have one for powerpc, do you?
[10:38] <Riddell> ajf: one what?
[10:39] <Riddell> ajf: no xutils for powerpc I'm afraid