| === kbrooks [~kbrooks@d235-165-223.home1.cgocable.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
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| === mgalvin [~mgalvin@cpe-69-205-46-35.nycap.res.rr.com] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| === HrdwrBoB [~matt@bob.is.teh.admin.at.vicnet.net.au] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| === rwabel [~rwabel@gw.ptr-80-238-205-70.customer.ch.netstream.com] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| HrdwrBoB | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MplayerInstallHowto | 03:06 |
|---|---|---|
| HrdwrBoB | ugh that looks awful, I'm cleaning it up | 03:06 |
| HrdwrBoB | are we mentioning w32codecs on the wiki or not? | 03:23 |
| mgalvin | i would say not i think | 03:23 |
| HrdwrBoB | yeah that's what I though | 03:24 |
| mdke | i like that doc | 03:49 |
| mdke | what's up with it? | 03:49 |
| HrdwrBoB | mdke: it's fixed now | 03:50 |
| mdke | i'll check out your changes | 03:50 |
| HrdwrBoB | the content was fine, it just wasn't formatted very well | 03:50 |
| mdke | hmm | 03:51 |
| mdke | i preferred his sources.list to the AddingMultimediaRepositories one | 03:51 |
| mdke | backports isn't necessary for mplayer, which is in multiverse | 03:51 |
| HrdwrBoB | backports isn't in there | 03:52 |
| HrdwrBoB | or at least, it shouldn't be | 03:52 |
| HrdwrBoB | it just has hoary-extras | 03:52 |
| mdke | well that is a backports archive | 03:52 |
| mdke | mplayer is still in ubuntu multiverse | 03:52 |
| HrdwrBoB | true | 03:53 |
| mdke | i don't like the AddingMultimediaRepositories page | 03:53 |
| mdke | hoary-extras -- | 03:54 |
| HrdwrBoB | should probably link to AddingRepositoriesHowto | 03:54 |
| mdke | that's my opinion yeah | 03:54 |
| mdke | the ideal conf file IMHO is at ExampleConffiles | 03:55 |
| mdke | MplayerInstallHowto is the only page on the wiki that links to AddingMultimediaRepositories :) | 03:55 |
| HrdwrBoB | there | 04:02 |
| HrdwrBoB | changed the link and fixed up the formatting a bit more | 04:02 |
| Burgundavia | should we promote cedega? | 04:08 |
| HrdwrBoB | certainly not promote it | 04:08 |
| HrdwrBoB | but there's no reason not to tell people it exists | 04:09 |
| mdke | no idea about it | 04:09 |
| mdke | but people seem to use it and find it useful | 04:09 |
| mdke | -->bed | 04:10 |
| mdke | night | 04:10 |
| mdke | nice one on Mplayer HrdwrBoB | 04:10 |
| mdke | HrdwrBoB, nice to have you helping us. Add your name to WikiTeam? | 04:11 |
| === robitaille [~daniel@d154-5-117-228.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| mgalvin | s/Keeping your machine updated/Keeping Ubuntu Software Updated/ ? | 04:14 |
| mdke | i like machine | 04:15 |
| mgalvin | seems a little more noob friendl imho | 04:15 |
| mdke | i would say keeping your computer updated is more friendly | 04:15 |
| Burgundavia | Keeping Ubuntu updated ? | 04:15 |
| mdke | btw maybe you two could get together with rob^ and hack out that spec, resolve any confusion | 04:16 |
| Burgundavia | yes | 04:16 |
| mdke | prepare a spec with user audience too | 04:16 |
| mdke | like jeff did with the styleguide | 04:16 |
| mgalvin | my mom would understand better keeping software updated | 04:17 |
| mdke | also, if you cut out any power user stuff, let's cut and paste into the userguide if appropriate | 04:17 |
| Burgundavia | shall I add who I think the guide should be targeted at on the top of the page | 04:17 |
| Burgundavia | mdke, absolutely, that was the plan | 04:17 |
| mdke | Burgundavia, copy jeff's structure | 04:17 |
| Burgundavia | to reference sections of the user guide for further info | 04:17 |
| Burgundavia | mdke, the one in svn? | 04:17 |
| mdke | Burgundavia, on the wiki page | 04:18 |
| mdke | (the styleguide spec) | 04:18 |
| Burgundavia | where? | 04:18 |
| mdke | erm | 04:18 |
| Burgundavia | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StyleGuidePlan?highlight=%28styleguide%29 | 04:18 |
| mdke | StyleGuide i guess, not sure | 04:18 |
| mdke | yeah StyleGuide | 04:19 |
| Burgundavia | geez | 04:19 |
| Burgundavia | that is quite long | 04:19 |
| mdke | only the document plan section is what I was thinking of | 04:19 |
| mdke | 1-9 | 04:20 |
| Burgundavia | done | 04:22 |
| Burgundavia | I am wondering about playing games | 04:22 |
| Burgundavia | maybe we should promote some simple games and move cedega to the users guide | 04:23 |
| mdke | lincity | 04:24 |
| mdke | freeciv | 04:24 |
| mdke | supertux | 04:24 |
| mdke | :) | 04:24 |
| Burgundavia | ya | 04:24 |
| mdke | tuxracer | 04:24 |
| Burgundavia | so the only games that are in the faq guide must come out of an Ubuntu repo | 04:25 |
| Burgundavia | how does that sound for a principal? | 04:25 |
| Burgundavia | s/principal/principle | 04:25 |
| mdke | not sure | 04:25 |
| mdke | best get your heads together with mgalvin and rob^ | 04:26 |
| mdke | --> bed | 04:26 |
| Burgundavia | mgalvin is already here | 04:26 |
| Burgundavia | rob^, ping | 04:26 |
| mgalvin | i would say stick with stuff in the repos | 04:27 |
| Burgundavia | I like agreement | 04:30 |
| Burgundavia | this faq guide is going to rock | 04:30 |
| mgalvin | rock on :) | 04:31 |
| Burgundavia | tomorrow I will solicit opininion from the NUN people | 04:32 |
| robitaille | wow...the wiki Java page is really simpler now :) I'm about to replace my IBM Java plugins by Sun's. | 04:45 |
| Burgundavia | yes, the wiki is truly coming along | 04:45 |
| Burgundavia | a some point I am going to cleanup bittorrent | 04:45 |
| Burgundavia | as that doesn't promote our built-in bittorrent stuff | 04:45 |
| HrdwrBoB | mdke: ok :) | 04:47 |
| Burgundavia | robitaille, do you have comments on the FAQGuideReSpec | 04:47 |
| Burgundavia | HrdwrBoB, nice work with the mplayer page, btw | 04:47 |
| HrdwrBoB | cheers | 04:48 |
| robitaille | Burgundavia: haven't had time to look at it yet; I'll take a look within the hour (after I put the kids to bed) | 04:48 |
| Burgundavia | ok | 04:49 |
| mgalvin | Burgundavia: great it would be nice to hear their comments and suggestions (the NUN) | 04:49 |
| Burgundavia | yes | 04:49 |
| Burgundavia | as they are the ones that are going to be helping people when our docs fail | 04:50 |
| Burgundavia | HrdwrBoB, you want to do something else? | 04:50 |
| === jsgotangco [~jgotangco@202.57.71.236] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| jsgotangco | mgalvin: nice spec | 04:51 |
| Burgundavia | salut jsgotangco | 04:51 |
| jsgotangco | salug | 04:51 |
| HrdwrBoB | Burgundavia: yeah what needs going | 04:51 |
| HrdwrBoB | er doing | 04:51 |
| Burgundavia | HrdwrBoB, the FileCompression page should be reorg to be by file format | 04:52 |
| Burgundavia | in alphabetical order | 04:52 |
| Burgundavia | hmm, do it by extension or by name? | 04:52 |
| HrdwrBoB | is a table of contents recommended | 04:53 |
| HrdwrBoB | extension | 04:53 |
| Burgundavia | absolutely | 04:53 |
| HrdwrBoB | I've generally been putting them | 04:53 |
| HrdwrBoB | in | 04:53 |
| Burgundavia | make the title Firefox extensions (.xpi) | 04:53 |
| Burgundavia | of something | 04:53 |
| Burgundavia | I trust your judgement | 04:54 |
| HrdwrBoB | cool | 04:54 |
| robitaille | FAQGuideReSpec: should we promote ways of getting "live" help: IRC, mailing list? A "How to get help from the community" section? | 04:54 |
| Burgundavia | robitaille, good idea | 04:54 |
| Burgundavia | place at the end? | 04:55 |
| Burgundavia | 2nd item? | 04:55 |
| robitaille | near the top is probably better | 04:56 |
| Burgundavia | added at the end | 04:56 |
| robitaille | :) | 04:56 |
| Burgundavia | 2nd item after updating? | 04:56 |
| robitaille | sounds good. | 04:57 |
| Burgundavia | done | 04:57 |
| Burgundavia | robitaille, what do you think of "keeping your machine updated"? | 04:58 |
| Burgundavia | think it should be software or Ubuntu? | 04:58 |
| robitaille | Ubuntu. Sounds more friendly considering what Aunt Tilley knows | 04:59 |
| Burgundavia | your Ubuntu or just Ubuntu? | 04:59 |
| robitaille | your | 04:59 |
| mgalvin | jsgotangco: thnx, good job by Burgundavia too | 04:59 |
| Burgundavia | mgalvin, my crazy idea. I just need people to buy into it | 05:00 |
| Burgundavia | cause if nobody buys in, it is just a crazy idea | 05:00 |
| Burgundavia | I am debating 3D acceleration | 05:01 |
| Burgundavia | nah, I will keep it | 05:01 |
| robitaille | I think 3D should go....a bit too technical. | 05:01 |
| jsgotangco | 3D acceleration in Ubuntu? what for? | 05:01 |
| mgalvin | i think we need that | 05:01 |
| Burgundavia | ok, it will die | 05:01 |
| Burgundavia | hmm | 05:01 |
| robitaille | Something about Gaim? Remember jdub 10x10 talk and girls who like IM? | 05:01 |
| mgalvin | er, um well on second thought | 05:01 |
| jsgotangco | acceleration is usually a domain in games which is not our core compentency imo | 05:02 |
| Burgundavia | yes | 05:02 |
| robitaille | unless any of the game you are going to talk about need 3D acceleration? | 05:02 |
| mgalvin | it is to technical for our target audience | 05:02 |
| HrdwrBoB | someone who wants 3D has more technical ability | 05:02 |
| jsgotangco | robitaille: it would be quite a few, since you can count on your fingers native linux games that need acceleration | 05:03 |
| HrdwrBoB | ie: they will actively go and look for more help | 05:03 |
| Burgundavia | robitaille, we will just avoid it | 05:03 |
| mgalvin | possibly refer people to some other doc that discusses it so the brave noobs know where to look | 05:03 |
| robitaille | good. I never play games under Ubuntu :) | 05:03 |
| Burgundavia | in the playing games section we can mention it | 05:03 |
| HrdwrBoB | heh, I do | 05:03 |
| robitaille | and my 1997 graphic card doesn't do 3D anyway :) | 05:03 |
| Burgundavia | I need another term like "Surfing the internet" | 05:04 |
| robitaille | Travelling on the information superhighway? :) | 05:04 |
| Burgundavia | that encompasses email, the internet and gaim | 05:04 |
| mgalvin | Using the Internet | 05:05 |
| Burgundavia | but I changed the firefox section to be Surfing the Internet | 05:05 |
| Burgundavia | ok latest up | 05:08 |
| jsgotangco | brb i gotta start work | 05:08 |
| Burgundavia | rofl --> IIIEars gentoo is the reason bayer sells aspirin | 05:10 |
| Burgundavia | alright, the ReSpec has been spent to pass the parents test | 05:14 |
| Burgundavia | s/spent/sent | 05:14 |
| mgalvin | its gone | 05:15 |
| Burgundavia | huh? | 05:15 |
| Burgundavia | rob^, ping | 05:15 |
| Burgundavia | rob^, deleted it for some reason | 05:16 |
| mgalvin | its back, hmm | 05:16 |
| Burgundavia | I just reverted it | 05:16 |
| mgalvin | k | 05:16 |
| Burgundavia | that is what rob said --> Removing content as it is not applicable to the FAQ Guide yet | 05:16 |
| mgalvin | i saw that | 05:17 |
| === mgalvin scratches head | ||
| Burgundavia | no idea | 05:17 |
| Burgundavia | he sounded annoyed that he had not been consulted | 05:17 |
| Burgundavia | I thought I was pretty clear it was a work in progress | 05:17 |
| Burgundavia | ok, that i odd | 05:23 |
| Burgundavia | now it shows robert editing twice and me reverting twice | 05:24 |
| Burgundavia | which I haven't done | 05:24 |
| === Skywind [~Skywind@218.104.86.222] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| Burgundavia | rob^, please stop reverting the page. Lets talk | 05:30 |
| HrdwrBoB | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FileCompression | 05:35 |
| HrdwrBoB | that's a lot better, still needs a littel bit of fixing | 05:35 |
| Burgundavia | HrdwrBoB, cheers that looks great | 05:37 |
| Burgundavia | what about swapping archive and non-archive formats? | 05:37 |
| HrdwrBoB | I put nonarchive formats first because that way people might realise that it's not really an archive | 05:38 |
| HrdwrBoB | and odds are on entry they will see what they want in the contents, and click straight to there | 05:39 |
| Burgundavia | true | 05:40 |
| Burgundavia | minor other quibble with the commandline stuff | 05:41 |
| Burgundavia | I split it out to make it clear that it could be done by the gui | 05:41 |
| Burgundavia | you might want to do that again | 05:41 |
| HrdwrBoB | so make the command line usage under a next level header | 05:42 |
| Burgundavia | I would put the commandline is a seperate section | 05:42 |
| Burgundavia | so you would have 3 sections | 05:42 |
| Burgundavia | non-archive, archive and command line | 05:42 |
| HrdwrBoB | I'm not sure that would be more useful | 05:43 |
| HrdwrBoB | the tar/targz/tarbz2 sections on the archive format thing effectively become irrelevant | 05:44 |
| Burgundavia | not really | 05:44 |
| mgalvin | Burgundavia, we are still going to keep the faqguide profiled right | 05:44 |
| Burgundavia | just that we are trying to promote the gui and a quick glance at the looks like the commandline is the only solution | 05:44 |
| Burgundavia | mgalvin, absolutely | 05:45 |
| mgalvin | ok, just making sure | 05:45 |
| HrdwrBoB | Burgundavia: hm.. perhaps a screenshot of archive manager and a bit about it would be better | 05:45 |
| Burgundavia | might be, hmm | 05:45 |
| HrdwrBoB | in the basic archives section, and rename that to 'Package Manager' | 05:45 |
| Burgundavia | maybe just get rid of the command line stuff? | 05:46 |
| HrdwrBoB | well if the target audience is mum and dad | 05:46 |
| HrdwrBoB | then yeah, we should really lose it altogether | 05:46 |
| Burgundavia | most of the wiki is | 05:46 |
| Burgundavia | because if you know about the commandline, you probably know about man pages | 05:47 |
| HrdwrBoB | mmmm based on my experience in #ubuntu I'd say possibly not :) | 05:47 |
| Burgundavia | ok | 05:47 |
| HrdwrBoB | I'll strip out most of the command line stuff in the indiviual sections | 05:47 |
| HrdwrBoB | and put in a section on basic command like usage | 05:48 |
| HrdwrBoB | line | 05:48 |
| Burgundavia | ya, that is what I was thinking | 05:48 |
| HrdwrBoB | rather than full examples etc | 05:48 |
| Burgundavia | HrdwrBoB, what is your real name? | 06:07 |
| HrdwrBoB | MatthewParslow | 06:07 |
| Burgundavia | cheers | 06:07 |
| HrdwrBoB | that's who's been editing all the pages :) | 06:07 |
| Burgundavia | ya, just remembered that | 06:08 |
| Burgundavia | had a bit of a bad day | 06:08 |
| HrdwrBoB | I've added some screenshots to that page - they're not overly useful but I think they will make people feel good | 06:09 |
| Burgundavia | cool | 06:09 |
| Burgundavia | I just reworked GettingUbuntu | 06:09 |
| Burgundavia | you might want to take a quick peer | 06:09 |
| HrdwrBoB | If you have a 64 bit system, you need AMD64 install CD | 06:10 |
| HrdwrBoB | that's not strictly true, and in many cases a 32 bit system is easier :) | 06:10 |
| thechitowncubs | Hey everyone | 06:11 |
| Burgundavia | ok | 06:11 |
| Burgundavia | salut thechitowncubs | 06:11 |
| mgalvin | hi thechitowncubs | 06:11 |
| Burgundavia | mgalvin, mind if you respond to rob as well | 06:12 |
| Burgundavia | as you have been doing work | 06:12 |
| Burgundavia | HrdwrBoB, I really like the first screenshot | 06:13 |
| Burgundavia | that makes it easy | 06:13 |
| HrdwrBoB | yeah | 06:13 |
| Burgundavia | I wish gnome would move the special actions farther up the menu | 06:13 |
| mgalvin | Burgundavia, i do not mind, please feel free to respond | 06:16 |
| Burgundavia | mgalvin, no, I was asking if you would respond as well | 06:17 |
| thechitowncubs | what are tonights focus of labor? | 06:17 |
| Burgundavia | bittorrent needs rewrite | 06:17 |
| Burgundavia | to basically say that hoary and breezy just do it | 06:17 |
| Burgundavia | how to set it up in warty | 06:17 |
| Burgundavia | and advanced clients | 06:17 |
| thechitowncubs | I was just looking at that page :) | 06:18 |
| thechitowncubs | alright, i'll work on bt | 06:18 |
| Burgundavia | cheers | 06:18 |
| mgalvin | Burgundavia, i did | 06:19 |
| Burgundavia | mgalvin, thanks | 06:19 |
| mgalvin | np | 06:19 |
| mgalvin | did you see my response? | 06:19 |
| Burgundavia | the one where you started the thread? | 06:20 |
| mgalvin | no b/c he didn't reply to that one, i replyed to Sec: Unclassified Ubuntu FAQ Guide changes | 06:21 |
| Burgundavia | ok | 06:22 |
| Burgundavia | thechitowncubs, what is your wikiname? | 06:22 |
| mgalvin | ok, time for bed, g'night guys, see y'all tomorrow | 06:27 |
| mgalvin | zzzZZZzzzZZZzzz | 06:27 |
| Burgundavia | night | 06:27 |
| thechitowncubs | JohnLambrechts | 06:28 |
| Burgundavia | cheers | 06:28 |
| HrdwrBoB | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FileCompression | 06:30 |
| HrdwrBoB | There, that's better | 06:30 |
| Burgundavia | HrdwrBoB, that is great | 06:31 |
| HrdwrBoB | There needs to be a basic terminal how to page | 06:33 |
| HrdwrBoB | I've looked for one on several occasions, so I'm going to make one :) | 06:33 |
| Burgundavia | yes | 06:33 |
| Burgundavia | discuss histroy basically | 06:34 |
| Burgundavia | and ctrl-r searching | 06:34 |
| HrdwrBoB | I was thinking basic basics | 06:34 |
| HrdwrBoB | how to open a terminal | 06:34 |
| HrdwrBoB | getting around | 06:34 |
| Burgundavia | oh, that basic | 06:34 |
| HrdwrBoB | in many entries on wikis that are aimed at newbies | 06:34 |
| HrdwrBoB | it says "open a terminal" | 06:35 |
| HrdwrBoB | "run this in a termina" | 06:35 |
| HrdwrBoB | but nowhere does it say what that is | 06:35 |
| HrdwrBoB | or how to do it | 06:35 |
| Burgundavia | hopefully, not as many as a few days ago | 06:35 |
| HrdwrBoB | yeah | 06:35 |
| HrdwrBoB | but for now, there's still quite a lot | 06:35 |
| === Burgundavia 's personal goal goal is to kill all those references, if possible | ||
| HrdwrBoB | but even where it's presented as an alternative | 06:36 |
| HrdwrBoB | we want people to be able to learn about that if they want | 06:36 |
| HrdwrBoB | should I create it called Terminal or TerminalHowto or what | 06:36 |
| Burgundavia | TerminalHowto | 06:36 |
| rob^ | right, home from work finally | 06:48 |
| Burgundavia | cheers | 06:49 |
| rob^ | hmm, matts not here | 06:49 |
| Burgundavia | no he left about 20 minutes ago | 06:50 |
| rob^ | ok | 06:50 |
| Burgundavia | did you want to talk about the FAQGuideReSpec | 06:51 |
| rob^ | well I need to talk to matt about it really | 06:51 |
| rob^ | but regarding that | 06:51 |
| rob^ | you do realise it started as an exact copy of ubuntuguide.org, right? | 06:52 |
| Burgundavia | yes | 06:52 |
| Burgundavia | I was there in Mataro when the initial work was done | 06:52 |
| rob^ | hence, its not docbook friendly | 06:52 |
| Burgundavia | thats is fine | 06:53 |
| rob^ | and I dont apprciate you removing most of my changes to the spec either | 06:53 |
| Burgundavia | I gave a reason, and we (the various people in this channel) agree with them | 06:53 |
| Burgundavia | read the scrollback | 06:53 |
| Burgundavia | we had a long discussion about it | 06:53 |
| rob^ | yes, without the person who wrote it | 06:54 |
| Burgundavia | wrote what? | 06:54 |
| rob^ | you are basically telling me how to write it | 06:55 |
| Burgundavia | not really | 06:55 |
| rob^ | yes really | 06:55 |
| Burgundavia | I pulled the latest source out of the cvs | 06:55 |
| rob^ | and you dont contribute yourself | 06:55 |
| Burgundavia | and went, "where do we go with this" | 06:55 |
| Burgundavia | rob^, I just got my svn commit access back | 06:56 |
| rob^ | right, how many times do I have to say "this is going to be changed" | 06:56 |
| Burgundavia | rob^, I looked at the exisiting doc and I don't think it really works as an FAQ guide | 06:56 |
| thechitowncubs | we don't need fighting | 06:56 |
| rob^ | its in the comments of the faq guide, I have sent emails regarding it, we discussed it a little at the last meeting | 06:56 |
| Burgundavia | yes, I read those | 06:56 |
| rob^ | Burgundavia, right, thats why the comments are there | 06:57 |
| Burgundavia | then I spoke to matt | 06:57 |
| Burgundavia | and he and I chatted about a re spec | 06:57 |
| rob^ | we just havent done it *yet* | 06:57 |
| thechitowncubs | we need resolution not fighting | 06:57 |
| Burgundavia | and then I created the wiki page and we started hacking on it | 06:57 |
| Burgundavia | this is NOT just my idea | 06:57 |
| rob^ | right, then when I added a few changes, they were pretty much removed | 06:57 |
| rob^ | something like that need to be done with everyone involved | 06:58 |
| Burgundavia | it has been | 06:58 |
| rob^ | esp someone who has been working on it alot | 06:58 |
| rob^ | no, it hasnt. All I got was "hey, here is this thing we did" | 06:59 |
| Burgundavia | sorry you got that impression | 06:59 |
| Burgundavia | that was not intended | 06:59 |
| rob^ | when I added a few changes, they were dismissed | 06:59 |
| rob^ | your not even responsible for the guide at the moment | 07:00 |
| Burgundavia | matt and I hacked on it and then I posted something to the list, asking for ideas | 07:00 |
| Burgundavia | no, I am not | 07:00 |
| rob^ | right | 07:00 |
| Burgundavia | I was going to, but I didn't have commit access and thus declined | 07:00 |
| rob^ | I will talk about it with matt the next time I see him on here | 07:00 |
| rob^ | you dont need commit access to contribute | 07:00 |
| Burgundavia | please don't just blank the spec | 07:01 |
| rob^ | until I talk with him and we work out a compromise, I am going to disregard the spec | 07:01 |
| Burgundavia | please don't do that | 07:01 |
| Burgundavia | lets works this out | 07:01 |
| rob^ | I'm not happy about this whole thing to be honest | 07:01 |
| Burgundavia | what would you like to see? | 07:02 |
| Burgundavia | I am trying to present a consistent vision | 07:03 |
| rob^ | brb son hurt himself | 07:03 |
| Burgundavia | for our XP iso burning stuff, should we promote installation of random software? | 07:08 |
| rob^ | ok back | 07:12 |
| rob^ | well, was.. | 07:16 |
| rob^ | bbl | 07:16 |
| Burgundavia | rob^, we are going to need to resolve this dispute | 07:18 |
| rob^ | a little respect for others will go a long way | 07:20 |
| Burgundavia | I am sorry I offended you, it was not my intention | 07:20 |
| Burgundavia | matt and I happened to click on the topic and it snowballed | 07:20 |
| === robitaille [~daniel@d154-5-117-228.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| rob^ | yes, and I appreciate help | 07:21 |
| rob^ | but I dont like being told what to do | 07:21 |
| Burgundavia | I looked at the document as it stood and was worried about a consistent vision | 07:21 |
| thechitowncubs | can i ask what document you are talking about and i can give my unbiased point of view? | 07:22 |
| Burgundavia | sure | 07:22 |
| rob^ | yes, but had you have looked at it in a couple of days time, you would have probably not had the same impression | 07:22 |
| Burgundavia | FAQGuideReSpec | 07:22 |
| Burgundavia | on the wii | 07:22 |
| Burgundavia | rob^, then lets work within the spec that Matt and I generated | 07:22 |
| Burgundavia | and others worked on | 07:22 |
| rob^ | the reason that the FAQ guide is in the state its in is because I have a full time job I need to be at | 07:22 |
| Burgundavia | indeed | 07:23 |
| Burgundavia | I am interested in your overal vision | 07:24 |
| rob^ | my plan for the next few days was to compleatly restructure the FAQ Guide | 07:24 |
| Burgundavia | ok | 07:24 |
| rob^ | (its friday today) | 07:24 |
| Burgundavia | good timing | 07:24 |
| Burgundavia | now we can work together | 07:24 |
| rob^ | well, the thing is once I had done that, you wouldnt have said what you just did | 07:25 |
| Burgundavia | I am going to take that spec to the NewUsersNetwork to get their ideas at their meeting tomorrow | 07:25 |
| Burgundavia | I never had any intention of taking over | 07:25 |
| rob^ | I dont think nun needs to be involved until we have something we might consider releasing | 07:25 |
| Burgundavia | not really | 07:26 |
| Burgundavia | I am asking their opinions | 07:26 |
| rob^ | yes, but we need to have more then just a layout plan before asking for opinions | 07:26 |
| rob^ | thats not even finalised yet | 07:26 |
| rob^ | mainly due to this | 07:26 |
| Burgundavia | we have a spec | 07:26 |
| Burgundavia | that we are working on | 07:27 |
| Burgundavia | now is the perfect time to ask as many people as possible | 07:27 |
| rob^ | you do realise the FAQ Guide is more then just an faq guide for Ubuntu | 07:27 |
| Burgundavia | huh? | 07:27 |
| Burgundavia | can you elaborate? | 07:28 |
| rob^ | theres a kde profile in there and others | 07:28 |
| Burgundavia | yes | 07:28 |
| Burgundavia | the profile will remain | 07:28 |
| Burgundavia | I have no idea where that idea came from | 07:28 |
| rob^ | at this stage I can only see us having a Ubuntu version for Breezy | 07:28 |
| rob^ | there is still a lot of work to be done | 07:28 |
| Burgundavia | that is why we need a clear roadmap | 07:28 |
| Burgundavia | hence the spec | 07:29 |
| rob^ | yes, but the spec doesn't take into account the fact that the faq guide originated from ubuntuguide.org | 07:29 |
| rob^ | its like proposing a whole new document | 07:29 |
| Burgundavia | yes it is | 07:29 |
| Burgundavia | ubuntuguide is not useful as an FAQ guide | 07:30 |
| Burgundavia | to be honest | 07:30 |
| rob^ | right, but never the less thats where it came from | 07:30 |
| Burgundavia | I was there when we profiled the ubuntuguide and converted it into docbook | 07:30 |
| rob^ | I dont like it either, but I have and still am working to change that | 07:30 |
| Burgundavia | then why object to the spec? | 07:30 |
| rob^ | things like this spec are just adding more work | 07:30 |
| Burgundavia | no they are not | 07:31 |
| Burgundavia | they are provided a clear roadmap, so many people can work on it | 07:31 |
| rob^ | ok | 07:31 |
| rob^ | I need to have a bigger imput into it | 07:32 |
| rob^ | input ^ | 07:32 |
| Burgundavia | ok, go nuts | 07:32 |
| rob^ | simply | 07:32 |
| rob^ | as I have done most of the work to take it from ubuntuguide.org until now | 07:32 |
| rob^ | I was happy to go along with a "spec" | 07:32 |
| Burgundavia | yes, I recognize that | 07:32 |
| rob^ | until all my changes were pretty much removed from it | 07:33 |
| rob^ | the only changes I made were to align the spec with what the document acutally is | 07:33 |
| Burgundavia | we are promoting the Ubuntu best practices | 07:33 |
| Burgundavia | nautlius does ftp | 07:33 |
| Burgundavia | evo over tbird | 07:33 |
| rob^ | yes, but its not optimal | 07:33 |
| Burgundavia | editing gconf is not somethign that should in a faqguide | 07:34 |
| rob^ | I was the one who added nautlius and ftp to the doc | 07:34 |
| Burgundavia | cedega is going into the users guide | 07:34 |
| rob^ | as for gconf, that is why we have gTweakUI | 07:34 |
| Burgundavia | that is crack | 07:34 |
| Burgundavia | there is no need to bother new users with that stuff | 07:34 |
| rob^ | right, but a frequently asked question is "how do I play my windows games" | 07:34 |
| Burgundavia | for some | 07:34 |
| Burgundavia | the doc is bigger than #ubuntu | 07:35 |
| Burgundavia | I am shooting for Aunt Tillie and my step-mother | 07:35 |
| rob^ | for Ubuntu's target users | 07:35 |
| Burgundavia | who could care less about windows games | 07:35 |
| rob^ | most of which are migrating from windows | 07:35 |
| rob^ | want to play windows games | 07:35 |
| Burgundavia | a select few | 07:35 |
| rob^ | you are wrong | 07:35 |
| rob^ | many do | 07:35 |
| Burgundavia | cedega is also really not easy to setup | 07:36 |
| rob^ | its why a lot of people dont change or still dual boot | 07:36 |
| Burgundavia | needs its own guide | 07:36 |
| rob^ | maybe, but it still needs to be addressed in the faq | 07:36 |
| Burgundavia | there will be a line in the games section | 07:36 |
| rob^ | all thats there now is a link to a guide to install cedega | 07:36 |
| Burgundavia | pointing at the user guide | 07:36 |
| Burgundavia | which will go into windows games and ubuntu | 07:37 |
| rob^ | yes | 07:37 |
| === rob^ slaps head | ||
| rob^ | a link is fine | 07:37 |
| rob^ | thats whats there now | 07:37 |
| Burgundavia | no | 07:37 |
| Burgundavia | you have a section | 07:37 |
| Burgundavia | the spec is sections and subsections | 07:37 |
| rob^ | all the section was going to contain was a quick blurb and a link to a proper guide | 07:37 |
| Burgundavia | what appears on the left, not what appears on the right | 07:38 |
| rob^ | the faq needs to be short | 07:38 |
| Burgundavia | that can be done from the main games section | 07:38 |
| rob^ | and simple | 07:38 |
| Burgundavia | I agree | 07:38 |
| Burgundavia | that is why I removed some things that you added in | 07:38 |
| === rob^ points above | ||
| Burgundavia | they are not short or simple | 07:38 |
| rob^ | look, this is going no where. you wont even listen to me here let alone on the spec | 07:39 |
| Burgundavia | dude, gconf and gtweakui is a power user thing | 07:39 |
| rob^ | I'll discuss this further with matt | 07:39 |
| rob^ | cya | 07:39 |
| Burgundavia | rob^, what do you want to add back in? | 07:40 |
| Burgundavia | lets talk specifics | 07:40 |
| === venda [~sean@ndn-165-137-215.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| Burgundavia | salut venda | 07:41 |
| venda | morn | 07:42 |
| Burgundavia | rob^ and I are having a disagreement about the FAQGuideReSpec | 07:42 |
| venda | k | 07:42 |
| Burgundavia | wondered if you would take a look | 07:42 |
| venda | what's the disagree | 07:43 |
| Burgundavia | I don't really know | 07:43 |
| venda | so what am I looking for :-) | 07:43 |
| Burgundavia | matt galvin and I did some brainstorming | 07:43 |
| Burgundavia | we came up with this spec | 07:43 |
| Burgundavia | you have probably seen the mailing list stuff | 07:44 |
| Burgundavia | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FAQGuideReSpec | 07:44 |
| Burgundavia | rob did some editing, adding a few things from the existing faq guide | 07:44 |
| Burgundavia | I disagreed with some and removed them | 07:44 |
| Burgundavia | citing a reason in the diff | 07:45 |
| Burgundavia | then he blanked it | 07:45 |
| Burgundavia | so I am trying to figure out a common ground | 07:45 |
| venda | carry on just reading the spec | 07:46 |
| venda | I don't understand that outline. It reads like a User Manual, not a FAQ | 07:48 |
| venda | this I mean https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FAQGuideReSpec | 07:49 |
| Burgundavia | yes | 07:49 |
| Burgundavia | I imagined each page as less than one screen | 07:49 |
| venda | You want FAQ to be a User Manual | 07:49 |
| Burgundavia | no | 07:49 |
| Burgundavia | those are frequently asked questions | 07:50 |
| Burgundavia | How do I create a dvd? | 07:50 |
| Burgundavia | etc. | 07:50 |
| Burgundavia | the most common stumbling blocks | 07:50 |
| Burgundavia | notice I add printers but not scanners | 07:50 |
| venda | Um FAQ is Question and Answer | 07:51 |
| venda | You can have divs between sections | 07:51 |
| Burgundavia | it is | 07:51 |
| Burgundavia | add How do I in front of each subsection | 07:51 |
| venda | Hold I must open the FAQ | 07:52 |
| === jsgotangco [~jsg@202.57.71.236] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| Burgundavia | salut jsgotangco | 07:53 |
| jsgotangco | salut | 07:54 |
| venda | Burgundavia: you are proposing a very big change | 07:54 |
| Burgundavia | yes | 07:54 |
| venda | Burgundavia: rob^ has been hard at work for a few weeks now | 07:55 |
| Burgundavia | I just got commit access back, so I intend to do a lot of the writing, as well | 07:55 |
| jsgotangco | Burgundavia, got an email from mdz on PDATesting, we're set but we have a very conservative baseline target | 07:55 |
| Burgundavia | I realize that | 07:55 |
| Burgundavia | jsgotangco, ok | 07:55 |
| Burgundavia | so has mgalvin | 07:55 |
| jsgotangco | venda, hello | 07:55 |
| jsgotangco | wow thats nice | 07:55 |
| venda | Burgundavia: but rob^ has done the most | 07:55 |
| Burgundavia | yes | 07:55 |
| Burgundavia | he and I are trying to work out what the issues is | 07:56 |
| venda | mgalvin has done lots on user guide | 07:56 |
| Burgundavia | jsgotangco, what is nice? | 07:56 |
| venda | jsgotangco: hello | 07:56 |
| jsgotangco | Burgundavia, getting commit access again | 07:56 |
| Burgundavia | ah | 07:56 |
| Burgundavia | venda, I had always intended to do this to the faq gude, just I was lazy about getting my commit access back | 07:57 |
| jsgotangco | i was playing around with Picasa on an xp box and i'm just at awe at what it can do | 07:57 |
| venda | Burgundavia: I would not make any dramatic changes without buyin from rob^ . He is the defacto document owner at present | 07:57 |
| venda | Burgundavia: lazy yes | 07:57 |
| Burgundavia | yes | 07:58 |
| Burgundavia | I just wanted your opinion | 07:58 |
| venda | Burgundavia: lazy does not mean you can just decide to do it now | 07:58 |
| Burgundavia | well, I have done what I think the faq needs | 07:58 |
| venda | Burgundavia: I think there may be a middle ground | 07:58 |
| jsgotangco | just sort things out between the two of you and im sure there is an acceptable compromise for both | 07:59 |
| venda | Burgundavia: sure, but always need to consider other authors | 07:59 |
| Burgundavia | yes | 07:59 |
| Burgundavia | not everything on that page is mine | 07:59 |
| Burgundavia | there is considerable input for mgalvin and rob | 07:59 |
| venda | Burgundavia: just a sec I wont to show you something | 08:00 |
| Burgundavia | venda, I have to go, pm me with it | 08:07 |
| venda | Burgundavia: update to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FAQGuideReSpec | 08:08 |
| venda | The outline now is designed to encompass a much larger set of questions | 08:08 |
| Burgundavia | umm, what is the stuff you pasted? | 08:09 |
| Burgundavia | the original toc? | 08:09 |
| venda | end of page | 08:09 |
| venda | that is the current outline | 08:09 |
| Burgundavia | ah | 08:09 |
| Burgundavia | thought as much | 08:09 |
| venda | The categories are much broader in perspective | 08:09 |
| venda | It helps to see them side by side | 08:10 |
| Burgundavia | yes | 08:10 |
| venda | The titles are short | 08:10 |
| venda | Rapid Information Retrieval | 08:10 |
| Burgundavia | totally useless for your average desktop user, IMHO | 08:10 |
| Burgundavia | installing printer vs. Hardware | 08:10 |
| Burgundavia | umm.. | 08:11 |
| venda | when people search they look for keywords and categories | 08:11 |
| Burgundavia | anyway, I really have to go | 08:11 |
| venda | fine | 08:11 |
| Burgundavia | post to the list | 08:11 |
| Burgundavia | I am trying my new toc on my parents | 08:11 |
| Burgundavia | see what they think | 08:11 |
| venda | I think you should follow rob^ | 08:11 |
| venda | sorry | 08:12 |
| Burgundavia | to be honest, I am not going to blindly follow somebody | 08:12 |
| Burgundavia | I didn't see a whole document visiion | 08:12 |
| Burgundavia | so I provided one | 08:12 |
| venda | Burgundavia: he has done bulk of the work | 08:12 |
| venda | an dhe has a vision | 08:12 |
| Burgundavia | yes, but see above | 08:12 |
| venda | now you come in an dwant to turn that upside down | 08:13 |
| venda | I don't think it is helpful | 08:13 |
| Burgundavia | no | 08:13 |
| venda | not now | 08:13 |
| Burgundavia | I provided a vision | 08:13 |
| Burgundavia | I asked for his input | 08:13 |
| Burgundavia | and others | 08:13 |
| Burgundavia | and that was incorporated | 08:13 |
| venda | some weeks back when we asked for people to own docs | 08:13 |
| venda | that would have been a good time for discussion | 08:13 |
| Burgundavia | I considered our release cycle when I did this | 08:14 |
| venda | but rob^ has put in major work and nobody contested. Now to make a big change, like you are asking, no matter how good the idea. I s not right | 08:14 |
| Burgundavia | sep8 is when we stop writing | 08:14 |
| Burgundavia | venda, that is total crack | 08:14 |
| Burgundavia | and leads to bad docs | 08:15 |
| venda | Burgundavia: you have sat on the side for weeks | 08:15 |
| venda | and said nothing | 08:15 |
| venda | you have not done a commit in weeks | 08:15 |
| Burgundavia | if someone said to me that what I was writing was crack, then I would say ok | 08:15 |
| Burgundavia | provide me a better alternative | 08:15 |
| venda | he has been working hard | 08:15 |
| Burgundavia | that is what I have done | 08:15 |
| venda | changes are good, but not a revolution | 08:15 |
| Burgundavia | I saw no communicated vision | 08:16 |
| Burgundavia | we have a wiki for a reason | 08:16 |
| Burgundavia | if a spec had existed, I would have posted an email asking about certain changes | 08:16 |
| Burgundavia | ok, I am off | 08:17 |
| Burgundavia | will be back tomorrow for the NUN meeting | 08:17 |
| sivang | Burgundavia: what is the NUM meeting? | 08:58 |
| sivang | venda: 'sup Shawn ? | 08:58 |
| robitaille | sivang: NewUserNetwork Meeting: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NUNAgenda | 09:03 |
| sivang | robitaille: what is the NUM all about? helping new users? | 09:31 |
| robitaille | sivang: I'm not that familiar with their actitivities, but it seems it is a group of people that want to help new users | 09:34 |
| robitaille | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NewUsersNetworkGuidelines | 09:34 |
| rob^ | except some of them seem to think they are a group of people who tell docteam members what to do | 09:35 |
| robitaille | "The Aim of the Ubuntu New User Project is to try and help new Ubuntu Users get to grips with Ubuntu. Members of the New User Network will spend a lot of time on IRC, the forums and the mailinglists." | 09:35 |
| robitaille | I think the problem arose when they starting writing up wiki documents for new users; creating a duplication of effort. | 09:36 |
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| rob^ | is anyone here? | 12:02 |
| rob^ | aww come on! | 12:04 |
| rob^ | I could really use some docbook advice | 12:08 |
| rob^ | never mind | 12:08 |
| rob^ | I figured it out :) | 12:08 |
| mdke | venda, agree with you. | 12:37 |
| mdke | corey has done this a little bit disruptively | 12:37 |
| rob^ | yes | 01:01 |
| mdke | rob^, get together with those guys and have your input on the spec | 01:03 |
| rob^ | yeah I tried that | 01:03 |
| rob^ | corey basically ignored me | 01:04 |
| mdke | comments like this worry me a bit | 01:04 |
| mdke | <!-- Despite the so called "spec", this will be done differently. A proper spec will be done at a later date --> | 01:04 |
| mdke | any division needs to be ended quickly and resolved | 01:04 |
| rob^ | I know, but I dont want people editing it going off the spec that was done, as I have had no input into it | 01:05 |
| rob^ | and corey wont accept any from me either | 01:05 |
| rob^ | as it is the spec thats been done looks more like a userguide then a simple faq | 01:06 |
| rob^ | and it addresses nothing in the faq guide | 01:06 |
| mdke | i haven't looked at it | 01:06 |
| rob^ | its almost like saying "lets scrap all that and start again" | 01:06 |
| rob^ | and I dont agree with it | 01:06 |
| mdke | that is what he is saying maybe | 01:06 |
| mdke | listen, the important thing is to get this resolved | 01:06 |
| mdke | we can mediate and you can sort it out with corey. but the important thing is that you can discuss it with mgalvin | 01:07 |
| mdke | k? | 01:07 |
| rob^ | yes, I want to, but I'm not going to be told "this is how it is, like it or lump it" when I have done most of the work | 01:07 |
| rob^ | I plan on discussing this with matt when I see him on here next | 01:07 |
| rob^ | as I pointed out to corey today | 01:08 |
| mdke | good | 01:08 |
| mdke | it will be ok | 01:08 |
| === froud thinks pppl should follow lead of rob^ on this issue | ||
| rob^ | froud, I agree | 01:08 |
| mdke | corey has a tendency to be too "final" in his comments | 01:08 |
| mdke | mgalvin and rob are leads | 01:08 |
| froud | rob^ leads it, he has the most work | 01:09 |
| mdke | they should talk, if necessary with the input of others in the team. | 01:09 |
| mdke | but I agree, those who do the work, have the most say | 01:09 |
| froud | rob^: I think there is some merit in what is being proposed. I think it is up to you to decide how much of the proposal you will accept. | 01:09 |
| mdke | but the aim of us all here is to make the most useful document for all | 01:09 |
| rob^ | with my latest commit, it solves most of the problems corey is pointing out anyway | 01:09 |
| === froud nods | ||
| mdke | i also think there is merit in the proposal, but I believe in communication and I know that this problem can be resolved | 01:10 |
| rob^ | I would have done this 2 days ago, but I do have a job | 01:10 |
| rob^ | whist I'm happy to accept comments and critisims, theres a right way and wrong way to do it | 01:10 |
| rob^ | and corey compleatly overstepped the mark | 01:10 |
| froud | rob^: you lead it, but stay open to channels. You have the final say until release on this document. After release, it becomes anybodys game again. | 01:11 |
| rob^ | froud, agreed | 01:11 |
| mdke | as i said, corey has a tendency to be very "final" in his remarks | 01:12 |
| rob^ | froud, and I'm happy to accept help in the mean time, but it needs to help not hinder | 01:12 |
| mdke | don't take it personally | 01:12 |
| froud | rob^: you seem to have already made a compromise with your last patch. This is good, because it does indicate that you are willing to work with outhers | 01:12 |
| rob^ | froud, yes | 01:12 |
| rob^ | froud, its something I have been working on paper anyway and some of the idea comes from what he said | 01:12 |
| froud | rob^: all that remains is for others o respect your position and main commiter on that document | 01:12 |
| froud | postion as main | 01:13 |
| === froud has 10 thumbs today | ||
| rob^ | oh, and I appreciate you all standing behind me on this as you have done | 01:13 |
| rob^ | thanks | 01:13 |
| froud | rob^: you are doing a fantastic job. | 01:14 |
| froud | Until you, nobody was doing anything | 01:14 |
| rob^ | yeah, I know | 01:14 |
| mdke | of course we will stand behind the person doing the work | 01:14 |
| mdke | but ideas are good, even if corey in this case has handled it badly | 01:14 |
| froud | rob^: however, there is some positive in their proposal | 01:15 |
| rob^ | froud, I know | 01:15 |
| froud | rob^: first it shows that they do care | 01:15 |
| mdke | we should be working more as a team on specs, because the books we produce affect directly the documentation as a whole | 01:15 |
| rob^ | and I have recognised this with him | 01:15 |
| mdke | [OT] where are the cron logs? | 01:15 |
| froud | rob^: second it shows that people do want to help, but are lacking direction | 01:16 |
| rob^ | in fact, at first I took a look at what he put on that page, and made a few suggestions of my own. | 01:16 |
| froud | rob^: I think that you can help channel their energy into a positive direction that is good for everyone | 01:16 |
| rob^ | its when corey compleatly removed all my suggestions and even my name from the page is when I became annoyed | 01:17 |
| rob^ | thats the only reason I took the stand I did | 01:17 |
| mdke | ouch | 01:17 |
| froud | rob^: I don't thin kitmatters now much | 01:17 |
| mdke | we'll talk to him, ok? | 01:17 |
| rob^ | ok | 01:17 |
| mdke | froud, can you help me on something? | 01:18 |
| froud | rob^: what matters is that you remain focused and resolute on your target. Perhaps express your vision to people, embrace some of their ideas and find a new goal, focus and vision that encompasses the group of people willing to help | 01:19 |
| mdke | i setup a cron job on the docteam server and I can't tell if its working or not | 01:19 |
| mdke | where are the damn logs? | 01:19 |
| froud | syslog no? | 01:19 |
| mdke | lemme see | 01:20 |
| rob^ | hmm | 01:20 |
| === mpt [~mpt@200-171-140-32.dsl.telesp.net.br] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| mdke | hmm indeed | 01:21 |
| rob^ | I agree, my day job is heavily teamwork-focused, I am an expert at it | 01:21 |
| mdke | i don't think the cronjob has worked | 01:22 |
| froud | mdke: does not look like it :-) | 01:22 |
| rob^ | I'm going to attempt to update the spec page with a few things, I am willing to work together so long as other are also | 01:23 |
| rob^ | ^others | 01:23 |
| froud | fair enough, go for it. :-) | 01:23 |
| mdke | rob^, if you like you can create a /talk page for the spec and add comments | 01:24 |
| rob^ | yeah, I might do | 01:24 |
| mdke | ok what have i done wrong. I did "crontab -e" as the relevant user, and added the following: | 01:24 |
| mdke | 0 2 * * * cd /home/ubuntu-docs/trunk && svn up | 01:25 |
| mdke | 0 4 * * * cd /home/ubuntu-docs/trunk/gnome && make all && cd ../build && cp -R gnome/ /srv/docteam.ubuntu.com/www/ | 01:25 |
| mdke | 0 6 * * * cd /home/ubuntu-docs/trunk/kde && make kall && cd ../build && cp -R kde/ /srv/docteam.ubuntu.com/www/ | 01:25 |
| mdke | doesn't look like cron is even trying to use it | 01:25 |
| mpt | Burgundavia: I can understand the existence of (1) an "Ubuntu Manual" for non-admins, designed for print, (2) an "Ubuntu Admin Guide", designed for print, and (3) Ubuntu Help, designed for online use | 01:26 |
| mpt | I'm not sure how the "Quick" Guide fits in to that | 01:26 |
| === mgalvin [~mgalvin@cpe-69-205-46-35.nycap.res.rr.com] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| mpt | Perrhaps it could be the basis for the Ubuntu Manual. | 01:27 |
| mgalvin | hi all | 01:27 |
| mpt | Oh, and (4) a "Quick Reference" designed for print. | 01:27 |
| mpt | That would be a one-page guide. | 01:27 |
| mdke | mgalvin, perhaps you can have a chat with rob^ about this respec business | 01:28 |
| froud | mdke: there is no /var/log/cron and /var/log/messages says nothing | 01:28 |
| froud | well noting about crontab | 01:28 |
| mdke | froud, i looked in syslog, it notes the changes in crontab but nothing else | 01:29 |
| froud | yes, seems it did not run :-( | 01:29 |
| mdke | any idea why? | 01:29 |
| froud | but you ran it as your user | 01:29 |
| froud | your user has rights in /srv | 01:30 |
| froud | Hmm | 01:30 |
| === froud thins | ||
| mdke | hang on a tic | 01:30 |
| === froud thinks | ||
| mdke | if you do "users" it doesn't show that user | 01:30 |
| mdke | also, henrik is gone | 01:30 |
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| mdke | what has happened? | 01:30 |
| froud | youwant my thoughts? | 01:35 |
| mdke | sure | 01:35 |
| froud | we should enable /home/*/public_html | 01:35 |
| froud | in apache and let you run it from there | 01:36 |
| mdke | froud, what about thoughts on the current question? | 01:36 |
| mdke | we can discuss public_html | 01:36 |
| froud | at present, does you account have root | 01:36 |
| froud | full root | 01:36 |
| mdke | the account I'm running the cronjob on is called ubuntu-docs and it has no admin capability | 01:37 |
| froud | if not then how can you run a crontab | 01:37 |
| froud | that requires such permissions | 01:37 |
| mdke | cron jobs can be run by any users | 01:37 |
| froud | hence it fails | 01:37 |
| mdke | no it doesn't! | 01:37 |
| froud | yes you want to copy to srv/ | 01:37 |
| === mdke sighs | ||
| froud | how can ubuntu-docs cp to srv? | 01:38 |
| mdke | because it owns the relevant folder | 01:38 |
| mdke | but that's not the point | 01:38 |
| mdke | the cron job is not running at all | 01:38 |
| === froud checks again | ||
| mdke | but the strange thing is that there seems to be no user called ubuntu-docs | 01:40 |
| mdke | or henrik | 01:40 |
| mdke | although their home directories are still there | 01:41 |
| froud | mdke: I can't use -u | 01:46 |
| froud | trying to see cat /etc/passwd | cut -d: -f1 | xargs crontab -l -u | 01:47 |
| mdke | -u needs a user after it doesn't it? | 01:48 |
| === splatg [~chris@ppp31-82.lns1.syd2.internode.on.net] has left #ubuntu-doc [] | ||
| mdke | and you need admin rights too i think | 01:49 |
| froud | sean@none:/srv/docteam.ubuntu.com/www$ cat /etc/passwd | cut -d: -f1 | xargs crontab -l -u ubuntu-doc | 01:49 |
| froud | crontab: user `ubuntu-doc' unknown | 01:49 |
| froud | sean@none:/srv/docteam.ubuntu.com/www$ | 01:49 |
| mdke | ubuntu-docs | 01:49 |
| froud | sean@none:/srv/docteam.ubuntu.com/www$ cat /etc/passwd | cut -d: -f1 | xargs crontab -l -u ubuntu-docs | 01:50 |
| froud | must be privileged to use -u | 01:50 |
| froud | sean@none:/srv/docteam.ubuntu.com/www$ | 01:50 |
| mdke | yes | 01:50 |
| mdke | hang on | 01:50 |
| mdke | root@none:~ # cat /etc/passwd | cut -d: -f1 | xargs crontab -l -u ubuntu-docs | 01:51 |
| mdke | crontab: usage error: no arguments permitted after this option | 01:51 |
| froud | exactly and that command works on my host | 01:52 |
| froud | without the user | 01:52 |
| froud | I can see all the crottabs on my machine | 01:52 |
| mdke | erm | 01:52 |
| mdke | root@none:~ # crontab -l -u ubuntu-docs | 01:52 |
| mdke | 0 2 * * * cd /home/ubuntu-docs/trunk && svn up | 01:52 |
| mdke | 0 4 * * * cd /home/ubuntu-docs/trunk/gnome && make all && cd ../build && cp -R gnome/ /srv/docteam.ubuntu.com/www/ | 01:52 |
| mdke | 0 6 * * * cd /home/ubuntu-docs/trunk/kde && make kall && cd ../build && cp -R kde/ /srv/docteam.ubuntu.com/www/ | 01:52 |
| mdke | the command is wrong dude | 01:52 |
| mdke | you run hoary on your host? | 01:53 |
| froud | yeah | 01:53 |
| mdke | hmm | 01:53 |
| froud | no my command is used to gather crontabs from all users | 01:53 |
| mdke | ok | 01:54 |
| mgalvin | mdke, yes rob^ and i will get together to talk about the repsec, i am on my way to work in a few min so we will be going over everything in a little while | 01:54 |
| mdke | mgalvin, great news | 01:54 |
| rob^ | yeah | 01:54 |
| mdke | froud, i'll play around later and figure it out | 01:55 |
| mgalvin | bbl | 01:55 |
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| === kbrooks [~kbrooks@d235-163-159.home1.cgocable.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| === froud [~froud@ndn-165-137-215.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| === mgalvin [~mgalvin@host-66-202-95-170.spr.choiceone.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| mgalvin | back | 02:40 |
| rob^ | cool | 02:40 |
| rob^ | yes, so | 03:15 |
| rob^ | the document outline is currently whats in svn | 03:16 |
| mgalvin | just a short recap, rob^ and I had a discussion(off channel) about what transpired yesterday which was forced quite a bit, we have resolved any and all concerns and will continue to move forward in a positve and constructive way, everyone(ESPECIALLY ALL of the most ACTIVE contributors) should be actively included in these types of discussions and developement, so lets get back to business together :) | 03:34 |
| rob^ | yes, I agree | 03:35 |
| jjesse | are you guys talking about the changes to the FAQ guide | 03:44 |
| jjesse | cause i like how it looks | 03:44 |
| rob^ | jjesse, have you see the latest one? | 03:45 |
| jjesse | i looked last night but was there a change made before 11pm EST | 03:45 |
| rob^ | yeah, I have made a few big changes since | 03:46 |
| rob^ | umm.. | 03:46 |
| rob^ | well if you look at svn now, you will see whats up to date :) | 03:47 |
| rob^ | just build it | 03:47 |
| jjesse | ok checking it out | 03:49 |
| rob^ | do you know when the live previews will work on DocteamProjects again? | 03:49 |
| rob^ | (I realise they are in the process of changing servers) | 03:50 |
| jjesse | rob^ where in svn is that kept? | 03:54 |
| rob^ | build/gnome/faqi386 | 03:54 |
| rob^ | or generic/faqguide/C/ for the .xml | 03:55 |
| mgalvin | hey rob^, what do you think about calling "Sound and Video" "Music and Movies", i am kindda partial to calling it that, that was my initial suggestion, seems a little more noob friendly imho | 04:12 |
| rob^ | yeah its much of a muchness really | 04:12 |
| rob^ | knock yourself out :P | 04:12 |
| rob^ | (aussie humor) | 04:13 |
| mgalvin | :) | 04:13 |
| rob^ | I'm about to send a msg to the list saying that comments on the spec should be sent to the list rather then edited on the wiki | 04:14 |
| rob^ | this would exclude you and me however | 04:14 |
| mgalvin | ok | 04:15 |
| mgalvin | i feel so special ;) | 04:15 |
| rob^ | cool | 04:15 |
| rob^ | hehe | 04:15 |
| === jsgotangco [~jgotangco@info12-31.info.com.ph] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| mgalvin | hey jsgotangco | 04:19 |
| jsgotangco | hey hows your day going | 04:22 |
| jsgotangco | hmmm why did the guy who filed in bugzilla sent it as documentation bug when its obviously hardware related | 04:24 |
| rob^ | hehe yeah | 04:24 |
| rob^ | the powerbook thing | 04:24 |
| mgalvin | pretty good, rob^ and I are pushing forward with the faqguide and i think some good progress is being made to resolve issues and make a rocking guide | 04:24 |
| jsgotangco | man the faqguide in svn is burning kudos to you rob^ | 04:25 |
| rob^ | :) thanks | 04:25 |
| jsgotangco | you too mgalvin | 04:25 |
| jsgotangco | i haven't been doing enough stuff lately because of issues at work and home | 04:26 |
| jsgotangco | i've been doing it in small patches though | 04:26 |
| mgalvin | thanks, rob^ has been blazing the trail recently and making great progress | 04:26 |
| jsgotangco | also have to make a main inclusion report after testing some stuff | 04:26 |
| jsgotangco | by chance is anyone here familiar with Oracle Applications? :) | 04:28 |
| rob^ | no, sorry | 04:28 |
| mgalvin | i am a bit, whats up | 04:29 |
| jsgotangco | mgalvin: 11.5.9 you familiar with it | 04:29 |
| mgalvin | latest i have used extensively was 10g, but ask, maybe i can help | 04:29 |
| jsgotangco | (Oracle Financials) | 04:30 |
| jsgotangco | no, not the database | 04:30 |
| jsgotangco | Oracle 11i is E-Business suite using 9i db | 04:30 |
| mgalvin | no sorry, i have not used that one :-/ | 04:30 |
| jsgotangco | its alright its kinda hard to look for people who worked with it really | 04:31 |
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| jsgotangco | i usually talk to some indian at this time, but even we get conflicting solutions heh | 04:31 |
| jsgotangco | mgalvin: have you tried running 9i/10g in Ubuntu? | 04:36 |
| jsgotangco | (if its possible) | 04:36 |
| mgalvin | i haven't tried yet, but i have seen docs describing how to do it, i a pretty positive it should work | 04:37 |
| mgalvin | here is one | 04:38 |
| mgalvin | http://www.sussdorff.de/journal/one-entry?entry_id=27082 | 04:38 |
| mgalvin | again, i haven't personally tired so, no promises | 04:38 |
| mgalvin | oracle docs also have lots of good stuff on what kernel params and such need to be set | 04:39 |
| jsgotangco | it would be interesting if ubuntu will push for support on such and oracle accepts | 04:40 |
| mgalvin | that would be pretty sweet | 04:40 |
| mgalvin | it would make ubuntu even more viable for enterprises | 04:40 |
| mgalvin | http://www.oracle-base.com/articles/10g/OracleDB10gInstallationOnFedora3.php | 04:41 |
| mgalvin | its for fedora, but just make appropriate path mods, etc... | 04:41 |
| mgalvin | rob^, you ok with moving installing flash into the internet section(seems more logical to me to put it there since it for inet stuff) | 05:15 |
| rob^ | yeah, I wasnt sure on that one actually. | 05:15 |
| rob^ | let me commit my change first | 05:16 |
| mgalvin | k | 05:16 |
| mgalvin | rob^, have you been using breezy at all yet? | 05:17 |
| rob^ | I was before they broke x | 05:17 |
| mgalvin | hehe :) | 05:17 |
| mgalvin | i was thinking that we don't need mplayer and the mplayer plugin, totem provides these quite well now | 05:18 |
| mgalvin | i don't really like mplayer, but thats just my personal pref | 05:18 |
| mgalvin | totem, imho, is much nicer and easier to use | 05:18 |
| mgalvin | breezy already has totem and the totem plugin in it | 05:19 |
| rob^ | yes I agree totem is nice, it runs like crap on my pc though, mplayer works good though | 05:21 |
| rob^ | weard, that | 05:21 |
| rob^ | oh, I've done the commit | 05:22 |
| mgalvin | have you tried totem with the xine backends | 05:22 |
| mgalvin | gstreamer is really sluggish | 05:22 |
| rob^ | yeah, might do | 05:22 |
| rob^ | I use to have that going on Breezy IIRC | 05:22 |
| rob^ | hmm that works much better | 05:26 |
| rob^ | stick totem-xine in for sure | 05:26 |
| mgalvin | :) | 05:27 |
| mgalvin | so possibly remove mplayer, this also may be a good idea since i know many people often have issues getting mplayer installed properly, especially on the ppc arch, totem just works | 05:28 |
| === rob^ looks at time, shite its 1:30 am | ||
| rob^ | glad its friday | 05:29 |
| rob^ | well saturday now | 05:29 |
| jsgotangco | heh yeah im ready to crash as well..but then its a weekend | 05:29 |
| mgalvin | ah TGIF | 05:29 |
| mgalvin | still 11:30 on firday here :) | 05:29 |
| mgalvin | am | 05:29 |
| jsgotangco | im in a separate PC across my table playing guild wars | 05:29 |
| jsgotangco | and wife is already asleep so i'll just pig out the whole night | 05:30 |
| rob^ | yeah mine is too | 05:30 |
| mgalvin | rob^ i am gonna run xmlindent on the guide to just to clean it up a bit so its easier to read, any objections? | 05:30 |
| rob^ | I gotta pass a fitness test soon so I cant pig out | 05:31 |
| rob^ | nope | 05:31 |
| rob^ | go ahead | 05:31 |
| mgalvin | k | 05:31 |
| jsgotangco | ahh i love the weekends its the only time my wife allows me to eat junk | 05:32 |
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| === jsgotangco [~jgotangco@info12-31.info.com.ph] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| rob^ | maccas run? | 05:32 |
| rob^ | hehe | 05:32 |
| rob^ | that was a quick maccas run | 05:32 |
| jsgotangco | heheh | 05:32 |
| jsgotangco | i actually had a quarter pounder a few hours ago | 05:32 |
| jsgotangco | its been months since i last had one | 05:33 |
| === rob^ wishes he wasnt to lazy to get in his car and go get one himself | ||
| === rob^ yawns | ||
| rob^ | time to hit the sack I think | 05:33 |
| rob^ | b4 the bub wakes up | 05:34 |
| rob^ | night all, have fun mgalvin | 05:35 |
| jsgotangco | night | 05:35 |
| mgalvin | night rob^ | 05:36 |
| jsgotangco | i gotta sleep too heh | 05:38 |
| jsgotangco | night | 05:38 |
| mgalvin | night jsgotangco | 05:38 |
| mgalvin | rob^ are you still there, quick question | 05:42 |
| mgalvin | oh well, it'll wait till tomorrow | 05:45 |
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| jsgotangco | gyahaahhhh | 06:06 |
| robitaille | yes? | 06:07 |
| jsgotangco | i get to be on the laptop testing team heh...i just got an email right now | 06:07 |
| robitaille | I just got mine as well. I also did the little dance in my kitchen :) | 06:07 |
| jsgotangco | haha congrats to you too | 06:08 |
| jsgotangco | damn its 12am | 06:08 |
| robitaille | 9am here. About to start packing to go camping for the week. | 06:08 |
| robitaille | no computer access for a full 7 days :) | 06:09 |
| jsgotangco | whoa | 06:09 |
| jsgotangco | robitaille: did you read #8 | 06:09 |
| jsgotangco | 3 Ubuntu releases? | 06:09 |
| Burgundavia | you can always return it | 06:10 |
| robitaille | it used to be 2 in a draft version on the wiki. | 06:10 |
| jsgotangco | ahh | 06:10 |
| robitaille | It's only 18 months. | 06:10 |
| jsgotangco | ahh right | 06:10 |
| jsgotangco | that's not too much | 06:10 |
| robitaille | we do the debugging/testing anyway on our own :) | 06:11 |
| jsgotangco | i was reading wikipedia on miss universe winners... | 06:11 |
| robitaille | I see that jsgotangco is having a very busy evening while his wife is already sleeping | 06:12 |
| jsgotangco | hahaha | 06:13 |
| jsgotangco | (at least its wikipedia) | 06:13 |
| jsgotangco | and claire's email suddenly erased thoughts of sleeping | 06:14 |
| Burgundavia | now that is odd | 06:14 |
| Burgundavia | I got an email for Matthew Garret | 06:14 |
| jsgotangco | what about it? | 06:15 |
| Burgundavia | the laptop testing email | 06:15 |
| === jsgotangco hugs gmail label feature | ||
| robitaille | yes it was from Claire, to Matthew. I guess all the testers were BCC to it. | 06:17 |
| jsgotangco | hmmm is LaptopTestingSpec up to date? | 06:18 |
| Burgundavia | oh | 06:18 |
| Burgundavia | I didn't think I put my name down | 06:18 |
| Burgundavia | I didn't | 06:20 |
| Burgundavia | odd | 06:20 |
| jsgotangco | odd? | 06:21 |
| Burgundavia | I got an email from claire, regarding the laptop testing team when I didn't put my name down to be part of it | 06:21 |
| jsgotangco | well maybe they mjg59 has too many laptops in his pad and wants to dispose them | 06:22 |
| jsgotangco | surely he doesn't want to test them all by himself | 06:23 |
| === robitaille is afraid will all each get half-a-dozen laptops each to test at every release | ||
| robitaille | Burgundavia: look at it in a positive way: people really appreciate you bug-finding skills if they really want you on that team | 06:26 |
| jsgotangco | robitaille: scary thought... | 06:26 |
| Burgundavia | I guess so | 06:27 |
| jsgotangco | robitaille: next they'll be sending you servers to test... | 06:27 |
| Burgundavia | someone may have added me | 06:27 |
| === Burgundavia wouldn't mind a server | ||
| jsgotangco | *ahem* blade servers | 06:27 |
| Burgundavia | those are the new and shiny ones, no? | 06:28 |
| Burgundavia | wouldn't mind them | 06:28 |
| robitaille | servers are often a bit noisy to put in my kitchen (the only place where I can fit a computer in this small apartment) | 06:28 |
| jsgotangco | yeah servers would rule as long as they won't get to be no bigger than an as400 machine | 06:29 |
| Burgundavia | I would have to sleep with a server, no thanks | 06:29 |
| Burgundavia | my cunning plan is to get my parents to colo my server, so to speak | 06:30 |
| jsgotangco | Burgundavia: any universe app that might be a candidate for main needs an inclusion report? | 06:31 |
| Burgundavia | yes | 06:31 |
| Burgundavia | for good reason, as you saw in my list | 06:32 |
| Burgundavia | s/list/email to the list | 06:32 |
| jsgotangco | yes i'll make one then as mdz requested | 06:32 |
| Burgundavia | for edubuntu? | 06:33 |
| jsgotangco | well theres one for edubuntu and one for pda spec..or is it too late for an inclusion? | 06:34 |
| === jsgotangco havent been checking schedules | ||
| Burgundavia | no | 06:34 |
| Burgundavia | there is no seed freeze, afaik | 06:34 |
| Burgundavia | the edubuntu one, please put on the edubuntu page | 06:35 |
| jsgotangco | alright | 06:35 |
| === Burgundavia needs to do one for p7zip | ||
| mdke | Burgundavia, have you clarified with rob^ ? | 06:35 |
| Burgundavia | mdke, yes | 06:35 |
| mdke | good :) | 06:35 |
| jsgotangco | hey mdke | 06:35 |
| mdke | hiya | 06:35 |
| jsgotangco | Burgundavia: p7zip is 7zip for nix? | 06:36 |
| Burgundavia | ya | 06:36 |
| jsgotangco | 7z is awesome | 06:36 |
| Burgundavia | at the very least, it needs some fixing | 06:37 |
| jsgotangco | hey mdke how's the tube | 06:37 |
| mdke | i haven't been in london a lot recently... | 06:37 |
| jsgotangco | understandable | 06:37 |
| robitaille | mdke: got the laptop email? | 06:39 |
| mdke | yeah :) | 06:39 |
| mdke | dunno what hardware tho | 06:39 |
| === robitaille high-five mdke | ||
| jsgotangco | well pray its not a samsung or an acer heheh | 06:40 |
| jsgotangco | but the spec mostly covers dell, toshiba, hp and ibm | 06:40 |
| mdke | anything light would really be nice | 06:43 |
| mdke | but what the hell, its free! | 06:43 |
| robitaille | mdke: you're the closest to them. You will get the big paper-weight laptop to save shipping cost | 06:43 |
| jsgotangco | sure after 3 releases heh | 06:43 |
| jsgotangco | robitaille: hahah | 06:43 |
| mdke | noooooooooooo | 06:43 |
| === mdke moves to australia | ||
| jsgotangco | mdke: do uk people free to move in commonwealth states? | 06:44 |
| mdke | no idea | 06:45 |
| mdke | doubt it | 06:45 |
| jsgotangco | so much for having the same queen hehe :P | 06:45 |
| froud | no, but it is easier | 06:45 |
| mdke | froud has been to them all! | 06:46 |
| jsgotangco | is isle of man a state? | 06:46 |
| froud | if you have a BP marked as BC you will find it easy to move around | 06:47 |
| mdke | jsgotangco, part of the UK afaik, but not 100% sure | 06:47 |
| robitaille | jsgotangco: not really. A friend of mine from UK was trying to move to Canada, and he had to go through the usual immigration red-tape. | 06:47 |
| jsgotangco | huh? what kind of englishman are you anyway ;) | 06:47 |
| mdke | bah | 06:48 |
| froud | robitaille: you have to use the channels, but believe me it is easier | 06:48 |
| mdke | i have only half english blood | 06:48 |
| froud | if I tried to move countries with my SA passport it would be difficult | 06:48 |
| jsgotangco | mdke: no tea and lemon biscuits then? | 06:48 |
| mdke | mmm | 06:48 |
| mdke | those come into the half that I've got | 06:48 |
| robitaille | tell that to a poor student who still had to pay hundred of dollars in visa fees :) But I agree, it was probably a little bit easier. | 06:48 |
| jsgotangco | i agree | 06:49 |
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| jsgotangco | to a poor urban professional like me hundreds of dollars is worth a lot | 06:49 |
| jsgotangco | hmmm how i wish OOo2 base would be as clear to use like filemaker | 06:52 |
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| === Burgundavia [~corey@S0106000000cc07fc.gv.shawcable.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| === Burgundavia is testing how well ext3 can recover, by kicking his power cable out | ||
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| jsgotangco | mmm? | 07:04 |
| venda | network splits | 07:05 |
| venda | bah! | 07:05 |
| === robitaille thinks Burgundavia is crazy to try to simulate hd corruptions... | ||
| === Burgundavia thinks he is just crazy | ||
| jsgotangco | thinks? | 07:12 |
| Burgundavia | I like to rabble rouse | 07:12 |
| Burgundavia | haven't you figured that out by now? | 07:12 |
| Kinnison | burgey: you *are* crazy | 07:13 |
| robitaille | the best is probably to find a VERY large pictures. Try to some complex gimp transformation on it. When it start swaping (especially if your swap space is a file on your ext3 disk) like crazy, then pull the plug. | 07:15 |
| robitaille | but a hammer also works very well to simulate disk problems and bad blocks | 07:16 |
| Kinnison | erm s/simulate/stimulate/ | 07:23 |
| jsgotangco | damn i should stop playing san andreas, im beginning to speak like an east side gangster | 07:23 |
| === Burgundavia deletes the 500th "Would you like to buy Windows XP" spam | ||
| Burgundavia | no I don't. I hate XP. I hate windows. I hate MS, go away! | 07:24 |
| jsgotangco | how about your viagra emails heh | 07:25 |
| Burgundavia | ya, get those 2 | 07:25 |
| jsgotangco | alright i really got to sleep now | 07:30 |
| jsgotangco | ciao | 07:30 |
| jjesse | from sean's earlier email i've started using the eclipse docbook plugin | 07:53 |
| jjesse | works great w/ the subversion plugin as well | 07:53 |
| venda | jjesse: have you found a way to stop it from changing the whitespace ? | 07:53 |
| jjesse | venda not yet still working on it, just found the subversion plugin so i'm going to working on it this weekend | 07:54 |
| venda | jjesse: you are talking aboyt vex, right? | 07:54 |
| jjesse | nod vex and subeclipse | 07:54 |
| venda | yes | 07:54 |
| venda | vex is nice for editing, but makes big changes in the whitespace | 07:55 |
| jjesse | thanks for letting me know about that... i will be careful | 07:55 |
| venda | open a file, save it and the diff it against svn you will see what I mean | 07:55 |
| venda | if we can find a way to stop that happening it will be bongo | 07:56 |
| === thechitowncubs [~thechitow@c-67-175-52-127.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| thechitowncubs | Amarok page created last night | 08:39 |
| Burgundavia | noticed that | 08:41 |
| Burgundavia | cool | 08:41 |
| mdke | we need to make an effort on the documentation page to explain the guides. rather than "guide to x", maybe "guide to x, which does y" | 09:01 |
| Burgundavia | we should also spec all the docs ont eh wiki | 09:02 |
| Burgundavia | to prevent what just happened | 09:02 |
| mdke | yes | 09:02 |
| mdke | we agreed to do that two meetings back | 09:03 |
| Burgundavia | oh | 09:03 |
| mdke | although it'll be no use if you come along as say "this spec is wrong" :p | 09:03 |
| Burgundavia | I didn't | 09:03 |
| Burgundavia | there was no spec | 09:03 |
| === mdke nods | ||
| mdke | i was being hypothetical | 09:04 |
| Burgundavia | yes | 09:04 |
| Burgundavia | the quick guide is also misspeced, but meh | 09:04 |
| mdke | lol | 09:04 |
| Burgundavia | I am going to work on the wiki, where I can actually change useful things | 09:04 |
| mdke | you have a real tendency to be very final in your suggestions | 09:04 |
| Burgundavia | I don't mean to | 09:05 |
| mdke | i know dude | 09:05 |
| mdke | just add IMO to every sentence | 09:05 |
| mdke | maybe an email signature :D | 09:05 |
| Burgundavia | ok, IMHO | 09:05 |
| Burgundavia | yes, IMHO | 09:05 |
| mdke | lol | 09:05 |
| mdke | :) | 09:05 |
| Burgundavia | the reason I sound that way is that I tend to spend about 6 months thinking about something | 09:06 |
| Burgundavia | then just move | 09:06 |
| mdke | i understand | 09:06 |
| Burgundavia | rather than dither about | 09:06 |
| mdke | but we have to work as a team | 09:07 |
| mdke | which means gathering opinions | 09:07 |
| Burgundavia | working as a team also means published what we plan to do | 09:07 |
| Burgundavia | I did | 09:07 |
| mdke | takes a bit longer, as Sean complains, but it makes for more love | 09:07 |
| Burgundavia | we need to be more agressive about promoting what we are working on | 09:09 |
| Burgundavia | then we can get more people, if their is a vision | 09:09 |
| mdke | agreed | 09:09 |
| mdke | the server should help | 09:09 |
| Burgundavia | we need spec pages on the wiki | 09:09 |
| Burgundavia | ala the style guide thingy | 09:09 |
| Burgundavia | so people can come in and start working, in a useful manner | 09:10 |
| mdke | agreed | 09:10 |
| Burgundavia | so, back to my thinking and doing | 09:10 |
| Burgundavia | I am going to fork the faqguide | 09:10 |
| mdke | i'm adding some explanations to the UserDocumentation page | 09:11 |
| mdke | oh yeah? | 09:11 |
| Burgundavia | create a common problems guide based on the spec that I worked on | 09:11 |
| mdke | ok | 09:11 |
| Burgundavia | going to keep it in baz | 09:11 |
| mdke | what are you gonna call it? | 09:11 |
| Burgundavia | Common Problems guide | 09:11 |
| mdke | sounds like the sort of thing mpt might be interested in | 09:11 |
| Burgundavia | absolutely | 09:11 |
| Burgundavia | that is the intention | 09:11 |
| mdke | have you got a spec already then? | 09:13 |
| Burgundavia | yes, the one that I created for the FAQGuide respec | 09:13 |
| Burgundavia | as it passed the father test | 09:14 |
| thechitowncubs | is the FAQGuide still under dispute? | 09:14 |
| Burgundavia | no | 09:15 |
| Burgundavia | I forked it | 09:15 |
| thechitowncubs | oh ok | 09:15 |
| Burgundavia | mdke, anything you want raised at the nun meeting? | 09:16 |
| Burgundavia | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CommonProblemsGuideSpec | 09:16 |
| mdke | except for the useless duplication of documentation on the wiki... | 09:16 |
| mdke | nothing else | 09:16 |
| Burgundavia | suggestions welcome | 09:16 |
| thechitowncubs | when is the nun meeting? | 09:17 |
| mdke | Burgundavia, will you be in bad cop mode at the meeting? | 09:17 |
| mdke | want me to come? | 09:17 |
| Burgundavia | I hope not to be | 09:17 |
| Burgundavia | see how it goes | 09:17 |
| mdke | go the diplomacy route... Mez understand our point of view | 09:17 |
| Burgundavia | so does Nalioth | 09:18 |
| mdke | if we get bad cop on them they'll just back into corners | 09:18 |
| Burgundavia | indeed | 09:18 |
| mdke | in the end, all we want to do is ensure that effort gets funnelled in the most efficient way | 09:18 |
| Burgundavia | I got to grab some lunch, feel free to comment on the commonprobs spec | 09:18 |
| mdke | ok | 09:18 |
| mdke | Burgundavia, i'm adding bold font to the program names in UserDocumentation, think its a good idea? | 09:19 |
| Burgundavia | just do it | 09:19 |
| Burgundavia | no idea right now, have to see it | 09:19 |
| mdke | ok yeah | 09:19 |
| mdke | me too | 09:19 |
| mgalvin | i started adding bold font to command name in the faqguide if you want to see an small example | 09:20 |
| mgalvin | look in the installing codecs section | 09:20 |
| === kbrooks [~kbrooks@d235-164-162.home1.cgocable.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| thechitowncubs | i think bolding the links would look better | 09:22 |
| mdke | i've bolded the links in the software section | 09:24 |
| mdke | lemme know what you think | 09:24 |
| mdke | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UserDocumentation | 09:24 |
| thechitowncubs | the links aren't bolded... | 09:27 |
| mdke | no | 09:29 |
| mdke | just the software names | 09:29 |
| mdke | sorry | 09:29 |
| mdke | s/links/names | 09:29 |
| thechitowncubs | i don't like the look of that | 09:29 |
| thechitowncubs | but thats my opinion... | 09:29 |
| mdke | can you explain why | 09:29 |
| mdke | i wanted your opinion :) | 09:29 |
| thechitowncubs | looks sloppy and erratic | 09:30 |
| mdke | ok | 09:35 |
| mdke | any ideas about how to make the names of the programs more readable from the text? italics? | 09:35 |
| thechitowncubs | Trying to think of a way as we speak | 09:36 |
| thechitowncubs | i think it would look better if each description had the name of the program in the same place | 09:37 |
| === Mez [~Mez@cpc2-lich4-3-0-cust115.brhm.cable.ntl.com] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| thechitowncubs | and then having the links in another place, not the first thing | 09:38 |
| thechitowncubs | For example: | 09:39 |
| thechitowncubs | I'm trying to think of the example :) | 09:39 |
| thechitowncubs | lol | 09:39 |
| thechitowncubs | i'll let you know when my idea matures a bit :) | 09:40 |
| mdke | i know what you mean, I think its a good idea | 09:40 |
| === jjesse [~jjesse@mail.ftpb.com] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| thechitowncubs | I don't think the link should be the first focus, i think the program should be and then the link somewhere else that is still highly noticeable | 09:40 |
| Seveas | mdke, ping | 09:43 |
| thechitowncubs | has anyone made a wiki team yet on launchpad? | 09:44 |
| mdke | Seveas, sup | 09:44 |
| mdke | thechitowncubs, no | 09:44 |
| mdke | thechitowncubs, interesting idea | 09:44 |
| thechitowncubs | are there plans for one :) | 09:44 |
| mdke | (the link thing, not the LP one) | 09:44 |
| mdke | thechitowncubs, no | 09:44 |
| Seveas | mdke, NuN meeting in 15 minutes, you wanted me to ping you :) | 09:44 |
| mdke | Seveas, ah thanks, I may not be able to make it I'm afraid, but Burgundavia will hopefully set out the docteam view on stuff :) | 09:45 |
| Seveas | ok | 09:45 |
| kbrooks | So far so good. | 10:15 |
| === highvoltage [~Jono@196.25.192.240] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| === kbrooks thinks he can help | ||
| === highvoltage too | ||
| Burgundavia | any page that you think needs help, can be listed on WikiToDo | 10:31 |
| Burgundavia | if you want to fix up a page, that is also where to go | 10:32 |
| kbrooks | ok, Burgundavia | 10:32 |
| Burgundavia | have any questions, just ask | 10:32 |
| highvoltage | I've written technical documentation for schools. Troubleshooting guides and getting started guides mostly. | 10:32 |
| Burgundavia | FileCompression and AudioCDCreation are fairly good examples | 10:32 |
| mdke | hi highvoltage | 10:32 |
| Burgundavia | of what we are looking for | 10:32 |
| highvoltage | hi mdke | 10:32 |
| mdke | thechitowncubs, i don't like the idea of structuring UserDocumentation by user. I think its better to structure it by subject | 10:32 |
| thechitowncubs | both has pros and cons | 10:33 |
| thechitowncubs | we'll see how things iron out | 10:33 |
| mdke | in terms of finding things, I think that makes it easier | 10:33 |
| mdke | but let's be honest: once that page becomes very long, people will use CTRL F to find stuff | 10:33 |
| Burgundavia | people tend to be tasked based | 10:33 |
| mdke | yes | 10:33 |
| Burgundavia | and there is a wierd mind-trip involved with "novice" and "expert" stuff | 10:34 |
| mdke | yes | 10:34 |
| Burgundavia | some people don't categorize themselves well | 10:34 |
| mdke | there is no dividing line | 10:34 |
| thechitowncubs | scrap that idea then... | 10:34 |
| Burgundavia | observe all the poor fools who do the expert install in Ubuntu and then mess it up | 10:34 |
| thechitowncubs | i just thought some users looking for docs might be burdened by the vocabulary, level of difficulty surrounding the tutorial, etc | 10:34 |
| Burgundavia | then simply the language | 10:35 |
| Burgundavia | I have an MCSE and I still love simple docs | 10:35 |
| mdke | yeah we need to simplify the whole document | 10:35 |
| Burgundavia | s/MCSE/training towards an MCSE/ | 10:35 |
| highvoltage | no comment :) | 10:35 |
| mdke | what is that? | 10:36 |
| thechitowncubs | UserDocumentation has a bright future indeed, i'm excited to start working on it after the meeting | 10:36 |
| Burgundavia | what I am saying is that just becuase you are an "expert" doesn't mean you don't want plain english docs | 10:36 |
| Burgundavia | Microsoft Certified Systems Engineer | 10:36 |
| mdke | eww | 10:36 |
| === Burgundavia is sorry | ||
| highvoltage | I always thought it was Minesweeper Consultant Solitaire Expert. | 10:37 |
| highvoltage | but now we're going OT :) | 10:37 |
| kbrooks | Burgundavia: why do you have a MCSE? | 10:37 |
| Burgundavia | kbrooks, because I do | 10:37 |
| Burgundavia | before I saw the light | 10:37 |
| kbrooks | Burgundavia: silly you | 10:38 |
| Burgundavia | I never want to touch another windows machine in my life | 10:38 |
| Burgundavia | mdke, thechitowncubs just created it | 10:39 |
| mdke | jeez | 10:39 |
| mdke | bloody hell | 10:39 |
| Burgundavia | it can be a subsection of the docteam | 10:39 |
| Burgundavia | lp allows that | 10:39 |
| mdke | this obsession with creating LP teams gets on my nerves SO much | 10:39 |
| Burgundavia | but there is no docteam lp team | 10:39 |
| thechitowncubs | oh :/ | 10:39 |
| thechitowncubs | obsession? | 10:40 |
| mdke | plus, the wiki team is not "people who write docs on the wiki" | 10:40 |
| Burgundavia | it can be | 10:40 |
| mdke | its "people who work on technical problems on the wiki" | 10:40 |
| thechitowncubs | its a team of wiki contributers... thats what i always looked at it as | 10:40 |
| mdke | Burgundavia, no, because there is no reason for creating a team which includes the whole universe | 10:40 |
| mdke | EVERYONE has access to editing the wiki | 10:40 |
| Burgundavia | yes | 10:40 |
| Burgundavia | I think it is useful | 10:41 |
| mdke | the idea of the wiki team was to create a group if it was necessary to implement access rights | 10:41 |
| Burgundavia | well, the people in the wiki team are the people who are heavily editing the wiki | 10:41 |
| mdke | i think it will be used as a status symbol, like many of the other new launchpad teams, and has no purpose | 10:41 |
| thechitowncubs | a team is a group of people working together, so a wiki team sounds ideal | 10:41 |
| Burgundavia | and thus most likely to be trusted with those access rights | 10:41 |
| === mdke puts head in hands | ||
| thechitowncubs | its good for notifying users of changes, stuff like that | 10:41 |
| Burgundavia | mdke, we are eventually going to have to turn off deletion for everybody | 10:42 |
| mdke | launchpad groups have no function except for status symbols | 10:42 |
| Burgundavia | the team merely identifies who is actively working ont eh wiki | 10:42 |
| mdke | Burgundavia, yes, but you can't activate that through launchpad | 10:42 |
| Burgundavia | but as lp gets further integrated into the wiki, it will matter | 10:42 |
| Burgundavia | the point of lp is to be "the place" for this stuff | 10:42 |
| mdke | it will never be sufficiently integrated with the wiki to define access rights on it | 10:43 |
| mdke | s/never/not for a long time | 10:43 |
| thechitowncubs | what is your obbsession with access rights? | 10:43 |
| === thechitowncubs puts head in hands | ||
| mdke | thechitowncubs, let me explain. | 10:43 |
| thechitowncubs | sounds great | 10:43 |
| mdke | thechitowncubs, i see the creation of groups as useful when it serves a purpose. In this case, given that the whole point of the wiki is that EVERYONE can edit and improve it, the only reason for a group would be to define those people who have extended access rights, such as the ability to delete pages, move pages, modify wiki configuration etc. | 10:44 |
| mdke | this isn't implemented | 10:44 |
| mdke | thus, no need for a defined group | 10:44 |
| mdke | especially not a LP team | 10:44 |
| thechitowncubs | i think it just promotes team work and efficiency | 10:45 |
| mdke | what we have now is 2 wiki teams, one designed by us previously as people who take care of the structure of the wiki, another one created now, who edit the content of the wiki | 10:45 |
| mdke | 2 teams, same name | 10:45 |
| mdke | = bad | 10:45 |
| mdke | this is partly the fault of lack of definition of the first team tho, not yours | 10:45 |
| Burgundavia | ouch | 10:46 |
| mdke | this is all my opinion of course | 10:46 |
| === mdke winks at Burgundavia | ||
| mdke | i haven't convinced you tho, thechitowncubs ? | 10:47 |
| robitaille | I don't see the problem. wiki team exist here. Exist on the lauchpad as well as a way to track down its members, and maybe be used for other usage (mailing list...access right to more permanent wiki pages, etc.) | 10:48 |
| mdke | the teams have different objectives as I see it | 10:48 |
| robitaille | right now it is useless..but within 6 month LP will be the center of our Ubuntu Universe. | 10:48 |
| thechitowncubs | The wiki team on launchpad isn't a different team in my view | 10:48 |
| Burgundavia | I suspect that if the work needed to be done regarding wiki/lp integration, then it will happen | 10:49 |
| mdke | thechitowncubs, ah | 10:49 |
| mdke | thechitowncubs, well there is a difference in membership | 10:49 |
| mdke | and I think, objectives | 10:49 |
| robitaille | right....the wiki team on LP IS the wiki team. You want to help...instead of having a wiki page with our members name, we have a group page on LP. | 10:49 |
| thechitowncubs | i just started the team because there wasn't one on launchpad, and i knew there was one created | 10:49 |
| mdke | ok but if it is going to involve taking care of the structure of the wiki, a prerequisite must be knowledge of the wiki software and organisation, rather than the writing of documentation | 10:50 |
| thechitowncubs | fair enough | 10:51 |
| mdke | hmm | 10:51 |
| mdke | we need to get common objectives for the two teams then | 10:51 |
| mdke | i mean the one team | 10:52 |
| thechitowncubs | how large is the "current" more important wiki team? | 10:52 |
| mdke | its not more important | 10:52 |
| mdke | its less important if anything, because the docs are more important than fixing broken links and deleting pages and so on | 10:53 |
| mdke | but so far we have kinda failed to define what the team is about | 10:53 |
| thechitowncubs | Its a team of active wiki contributers that new writers/contributers can look to for question guidance on what to do and also a way of working as a team to get things done quicker without redundancy. | 10:54 |
| mdke | ok | 10:55 |
| mdke | sounds good | 10:55 |
| thechitowncubs | :) | 10:55 |
| mdke | what are we gonna do with the old wiki team? | 10:55 |
| === Burgundavia gets out his murdering axe | ||
| mdke | careful Burgundavia, you're listed too | 10:56 |
| Burgundavia | ahh | 10:56 |
| Burgundavia | yes I know | 10:56 |
| thechitowncubs | should robitaille be considered an administrator? | 10:57 |
| Burgundavia | why I don't run gentoo --> http://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=74072 | 10:57 |
| Burgundavia | thechitowncubs, if he says yes | 10:58 |
| mdke | thechitowncubs, what is the role of an administrator? | 10:58 |
| Burgundavia | approves new people into the group | 10:58 |
| mdke | ah its a moderated team? | 10:58 |
| mdke | okay | 10:58 |
| === mdke applies | ||
| thechitowncubs | its just moderated to get to know new users and just to be more organized and intertwined | 10:59 |
| mdke | we should think about merging this team with WikiTeam on the wiki | 10:59 |
| mdke | thechitowncubs, yeah good idea | 10:59 |
| thechitowncubs | mdke: sounds good to me | 10:59 |
| mdke | change the contact address to the docteam mailing list? | 10:59 |
| thechitowncubs | sounds good, whats the address | 11:00 |
| Burgundavia | I will do it | 11:00 |
| mdke | thechitowncubs, you should subscribe tho | 11:00 |
| mdke | lots of wiki talk goes there | 11:00 |
| thechitowncubs | alright, will do | 11:00 |
| Burgundavia | mdke, I am not an ubuntu-doc admin, can you approve that addy to the list? | 11:00 |
| mdke | sorry I mean WikiTalk *nudges Burgundavia* | 11:00 |
| mdke | Burgundavia, me neither | 11:01 |
| Burgundavia | have to wait for jerome | 11:01 |
| robitaille | thechitowncubs: I can be administrator. no preference one way or the other. | 11:02 |
| Burgundavia | more admin means less likelyhood of awol people holding the whole thing up | 11:02 |
| mdke | thechitowncubs, i've started the merge, will you edit the page https://wiki.ubuntu.com/WikiTeam to add what you see this team doing? | 11:02 |
| thechitowncubs | sounds good :) | 11:02 |
| === kbrooks is happy | ||
| robitaille | can bugs be assigned to a LP team? If we ever get a wiki "bug" via Malone... | 11:03 |
| === mdke steals kbrooks's cookies | ||
| mdke | robitaille, yes i presume so | 11:04 |
| Burgundavia | yes | 11:04 |
| Burgundavia | and we can even own "products" | 11:04 |
| robitaille | so should we do a Docteam team? and send bugs to it? | 11:04 |
| Burgundavia | yes | 11:04 |
| kbrooks | brb | 11:04 |
| mdke | who should the docteam team contain? svn account holders? | 11:05 |
| robitaille | and there is that calendar things that is slowly coming online in LP. I suspect one day, teams will send up their future meeting ammouncement via this. | 11:05 |
| mdke | that's a bit restrictive | 11:05 |
| mdke | yeah the calendar thing looks cool | 11:05 |
| robitaille | and then wiki team will be a member of the doc team. I think teams can be members of other teams. | 11:06 |
| === Burgundavia wants hula integration | ||
| Burgundavia | so we can all have hula addys from launchpad | 11:06 |
| mdke | problem is, if the docteam starts using baz, then the docteam group in launchpad should probably be people who have access to that repository | 11:06 |
| thechitowncubs | this launchpad is really coming together :) | 11:06 |
| Burgundavia | yes | 11:06 |
| mdke | long way to go yet | 11:07 |
| robitaille | but LP is much better than even a couple of months ago. It's actually usable now | 11:07 |
| mdke | more or less... | 11:07 |
| Burgundavia | LP is going to be more usable | 11:08 |
| Burgundavia | and it is being worked on | 11:08 |
| mdke | who has done some sysadmin on an ubuntu system? | 11:08 |
| Burgundavia | god knows how much money sabdfl has spent on lp so far | 11:08 |
| Burgundavia | mdke, what are you trying to do? | 11:08 |
| highvoltage | i have, i think. depending on the definition of sysadmin. | 11:09 |
| mdke | i'm trying to figure out how come my cron job on the docteam server isn't working | 11:09 |
| robitaille | mdke: I sysadmin my computer :) | 11:09 |
| Burgundavia | does the script work? | 11:09 |
| robitaille | and I used to a sysadmin in a previous life | 11:09 |
| mdke | Burgundavia, yeah | 11:09 |
| robitaille | is doesn't run at all? | 11:09 |
| Burgundavia | what isn't it doing? | 11:09 |
| mdke | it doesn't look like it runs at all | 11:10 |
| mdke | do i need the user in a particular group? | 11:10 |
| mdke | also, where are the cron logs? | 11:10 |
| robitaille | are you sure it is running at the time you think it should run? i.e what is the time zone of the box? | 11:10 |
| mdke | they should have their own folder | 11:10 |
| mdke | robitaille, yeah checked | 11:10 |
| robitaille | have you tried a very simple script? maybe something that pipe something to a file to check if it actually runs | 11:12 |
| mdke | the scripts work in the command line... thing is, i can't find a single log that says that something is happening at that time of day | 11:12 |
| mdke | i'll paste the crontab | 11:13 |
| Burgundavia | the other thing to try is to try the script in the cron job on your machine | 11:13 |
| mdke | i have a gentoo server | 11:13 |
| mdke | i'll try on my laptop, good idea | 11:13 |
| mdke | this is the crontab | 11:13 |
| mdke | root@none:/var/log # crontab -l -u ubuntu-docs | 11:13 |
| mdke | 0 2 * * * cd /home/ubuntu-docs/trunk && svn up | 11:13 |
| mdke | 0 4 * * * cd /home/ubuntu-docs/trunk/gnome && make all && cd ../build && cp -R gnome/ /srv/docteam.ubuntu.com/www/ | 11:13 |
| mdke | 0 6 * * * cd /home/ubuntu-docs/trunk/kde && make kall && cd ../build && cp -R kde/ /srv/docteam.ubuntu.com/www/ | 11:14 |
| mdke | it doesn't seem to even have done the first line | 11:15 |
| mdke | trying on my laptop | 11:16 |
| robitaille | why don't you but these commands in one script? I'm always of multiple commands with && in one single crontab line. | 11:17 |
| robitaille | s/^afraid^ | 11:17 |
| mdke | ah ok | 11:17 |
| mdke | but i wanted to make sure each line was done before the next one started | 11:18 |
| mdke | what would the script be? | 11:18 |
| robitaille | then if you remove the hour part, just keep the minute for now for testing purpose; then you can test it every couple of minute. | 11:18 |
| robitaille | You will have 3 script, one per line: | 11:18 |
| robitaille | #!/bin/sh | 11:18 |
| robitaille | cd /home/ubuntu-docs/trunk && svn up | 11:18 |
| mdke | ok | 11:19 |
| mdke | etc | 11:19 |
| mdke | thanks dude | 11:19 |
| mdke | trying | 11:19 |
| robitaille | personally I always found it cleaning to keep the crontab lines very simple. | 11:19 |
| robitaille | s/cleaning/cleaner/ | 11:19 |
| === Burgundavia is bored bored bored | ||
| mdke | robitaille, so is this cool? | 11:23 |
| mdke | ubuntu-docs@none:~$ crontab -l | 11:23 |
| mdke | 0 2 * * * ./svn_up | 11:23 |
| mdke | 0 4 * * * ./copy_gnome_to_webspace | 11:23 |
| mdke | 0 6 * * * ./copy_kde_to_webspace | 11:23 |
| robitaille | you need full paths to these scripts. You have to assume very basic environment for any cron job | 11:24 |
| mdke | argh | 11:24 |
| mdke | sorry | 11:24 |
| mdke | so /home/ubuntu-docs/./svn_up? | 11:24 |
| mdke | sorry for being thick | 11:24 |
| Burgundavia | /home/ubuntu-docs/svn_up | 11:24 |
| Burgundavia | assuming they are in the root of the users home dir | 11:24 |
| robitaille | don't worry...I have done these mistakes many times before; sometimes it works, but not always | 11:24 |
| Burgundavia | ./home/ubuntu-docs/svn_up | 11:24 |
| Burgundavia | I think | 11:24 |
| mdke | /home/ubuntu-docs/svn_up seems to work from the command line | 11:25 |
| robitaille | yes, /home...should work | 11:25 |
| mdke | testing now | 11:28 |
| mdke | we'll see if it works | 11:28 |
| mdke | robitaille, afayk, is the minutes format in the crontab ok? | 11:29 |
| robitaille | looking at my machine | 11:30 |
| robitaille | 00 22 * * * /mnt/music/podcast/bashpodder.shell | 11:30 |
| robitaille | yes, yours shuold be fine. Are far in advance you try it? Some machine need over a minute of no changes to the crontab to make it to work. | 11:31 |
| mdke | hmm | 11:31 |
| mdke | ok i've set it to test for now | 11:31 |
| mdke | 30 17 * * * /home/ubuntu-docs/svn_up | 11:32 |
| mdke | 33 17 * * * /home/ubuntu-docs/copy_gnome_to_webspace | 11:32 |
| mdke | 36 17 * * * /home/ubuntu-docs/copy_kde_to_webspace | 11:32 |
| mdke | not sure if I had a clear minute ;) | 11:32 |
| === qt2 [~qt2@pool-64-222-254-242.port.east.verizon.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| robitaille | so if you do "date", you are at 5pm on that machine? | 11:34 |
| mdke | 17.34 | 11:34 |
| robitaille | great | 11:34 |
| === mdke looks to see | ||
| mdke | have to give it a few minutes | 11:35 |
| === mdke crosses fingers | ||
| robitaille | you can also you | 11:37 |
| robitaille | use "at" to test scripts | 11:37 |
| robitaille | "at now" | 11:37 |
| kbrooks | at? | 11:37 |
| robitaille | then cut and pase your script /home/ubuntu-docs/svn_up then do a control-d | 11:37 |
| robitaille | man at :) | 11:38 |
| thechitowncubs | lol | 11:39 |
| robitaille | I love at.. You can do things like "at now +1min" to run script in the future | 11:40 |
| robitaille | I would offer to actually login on that box to debug it....but I'll be gone for the next week. Maybe when I return. | 11:41 |
| mdke | hmm | 11:44 |
| === Mez [~Mez@cpc2-lich4-3-0-cust115.brhm.cable.ntl.com] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| mdke | thanks robitaille | 11:45 |
| mdke | it hasn't worked :( | 11:45 |
| mdke | script looks alright | 11:45 |
| mdke | cron is obviously just not starting the job | 11:45 |
| mdke | nor on my laptop | 11:46 |
| mdke | oh hang on | 11:47 |
| mdke | it has worked on my laptop | 11:47 |
| robitaille | have you tried without the hour for now: | 11:47 |
| robitaille | 50 * * * * /home/ubuntu-docs/svn_up | 11:47 |
| mdke | trying now | 11:47 |
| robitaille | that would eliminate a time issue | 11:47 |
| mdke | ubuntu-docs@none:/home/matt$ crontab -l | 11:48 |
| mdke | 50 * * * * mkdir /home/ubuntu-docs/test | 11:48 |
| mdke | thechitowncubs, ok i removed the bold from the software section and tried something else - like it? | 11:49 |
| thechitowncubs | I like that a lot ore | 11:50 |
| thechitowncubs | more | 11:50 |
| thechitowncubs | a lot more user friendly :) | 11:50 |
| mdke | robitaille, in my /var/log/syslog on my laptop I can see the cronjob working | 11:51 |
| mdke | not on the server though | 11:51 |
| mdke | thechitowncubs, cool | 11:51 |
| mdke | robitaille, the mkdir /home/ubuntu-docs/test/ hasn't worked | 11:51 |
| robitaille | i'm trying a crontab on my hoary to see if I get something in my logs | 11:53 |
| robitaille | just to double check: chmod u+x /home/ubuntu-docs/svn_up ? | 11:53 |
| Burgundavia | robitaille, are you not subscribed to the whole wiki anymore? | 11:54 |
| robitaille | I removed earlier myself since I'll be gone for the week. I don't want 1000 emails waiting for me next weekend | 11:54 |
| Burgundavia | ah | 11:54 |
| thechitowncubs | smart | 11:54 |
| mdke | robitaille, i did the +x | 11:54 |
| mdke | you can always use RecentChanges rather than email subscriptions | 11:55 |
| mdke | its a lot better than on the previous wiki software | 11:55 |
| kbrooks | someone in #ubuntu? | 11:55 |
| robitaille | yes, on hoary crontab leaves something in /var/log/syslog | 11:55 |
| robitaille | Jul 22 14:54:01 localhost /USR/SBIN/CRON[14643] : (daniel) CMD (/home/daniel/test.sh) | 11:55 |
| Burgundavia | RecentChanges is actually usable | 11:56 |
| mdke | robitaille, yeah i see it on my laptop | 11:56 |
| === mgalvin [~mgalvin@cpe-69-205-46-35.nycap.res.rr.com] has joined #ubuntu-doc | ||
| mdke | robitaille, you think i need to add the user to some kind of group? | 11:58 |
| robitaille | mdke: I don't think so. Unless the setup of that box is more restrictive than a normal hoary install? | 12:00 |
| robitaille | I don't even know where to look for that. | 12:00 |
| mdke | i guess its a server install | 12:00 |
| mdke | he did a warty install then upped it to hoary | 12:00 |
| thechitowncubs | audiocdcreation updated | 12:02 |
| mdke | robitaille, just noticed something that rules that out | 12:02 |
| mdke | robitaille, the root crontab isn't running either | 12:02 |
| mdke | i think | 12:02 |
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