=== _otep [~otep@AP-203.167.31.177.sysads.com] has joined #ubuntu-doc === _otep [~otep@AP-203.167.31.177.sysads.com] has left #ubuntu-doc ["Konversation] === rob^ [~rob@rob-ubuntu.student.supporter.pdpc] has joined #ubuntu-doc === rob^ [~rob@rob-ubuntu.student.supporter.pdpc] has joined #ubuntu-doc === thechitowncubs [~thechitow@c-67-175-52-127.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc [06:30] Salut y'all [06:46] yo === highvoltage [~Jono@196.36.161.235] has joined #ubuntu-doc [07:35] salut rob^ thechitowncubs [07:40] hey === venda [~sean@ndn-165-137-215.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-doc [07:44] African Greetings [07:46] salut venda === highvoltage [~Jono@196.36.161.235] has joined #ubuntu-doc === highvolt1ge [~Jono@196.36.161.235] has joined #ubuntu-doc === jsgotangco [~jgotangco@202.57.97.141] has joined #ubuntu-doc [08:46] hello [08:46] salut jsgotangco [08:46] I see you have bought into my idea of respecing the quick guide [08:47] sure it does make sense [08:47] where is the spec? [08:48] hmmm how do you guys feel about making a launchpad team for UDP [08:48] sounds good [08:48] there's already a wiki team in launchpad [08:48] yeah [08:48] it should be there [08:48] alright, i'll put it up on the meeting before i make it [08:48] although there's really no reason why not :) [08:48] and launchpad is really rocking at the moment [08:49] wonder if its possible to make team calendars [08:51] err what's the difference between an ubuntite and a member? [08:52] ubuntite has signed the thingy [08:52] a member has not [08:52] through launchpad? [08:52] yeah [08:52] ahh [08:52] so its automatic [08:52] yes, when you sign it [08:53] hmmm its been a while since i used launchpad === rob^ should be a ubuntite for example [08:53] launchpad was pretty useless a few months ago [08:53] yeah, there is still a lot of bugs [08:57] hmm [08:57] an Ubuntite has signed the CoC through launchpad but a member is approved by an admin... [08:58] is there a wiki page on recompiling a ubuntu kernel? [08:58] jsgotangco, ah ok [08:58] jsgotangco, seems stupid, but ok [08:59] i'm just looking at the people list in launchpad [09:04] brb === HrdwrBoB [~matt@bob.is.teh.admin.at.vicnet.net.au] has joined #ubuntu-doc === highvoltage [~Jono@196.36.161.235] has joined #ubuntu-doc [09:40] rob^, you just made planetkde.org === highvoltage [~Jono@196.36.161.235] has joined #ubuntu-doc === Seveas [~seveas@seveas.demon.nl] has joined #ubuntu-doc === rob^ [~rob@rob-ubuntu.student.supporter.pdpc] has joined #ubuntu-doc [10:52] rob^, would you mind adding some context to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EthernetOverFirewire [10:52] what it is good for, etc. === Mez [~Mez@cpc2-lich4-3-0-cust115.brhm.cable.ntl.com] has joined #ubuntu-doc [11:23] Burgundavia, you asked about an italian page yesterday? [11:23] mdke, indeed [11:23] sup? [11:23] all the italian docs need some love [11:24] yes [11:24] there is an italian documentation team [11:24] but there was one I was asking if I could kill [11:24] Burgundavia, please don't kill anything [11:24] we're holding off doing any major tidying up until after we move wikis [11:24] ah [11:24] why bother killing pages? [11:25] you only end up upsetting the creator [11:25] mostly because the existance of the page may hold back someone else [11:25] only a few pages I am nixing [11:25] can't the someone else work on improving the current page [11:26] although i don't see how that argument applies to ItalianRosettaDone [11:26] mdke, where are the italian docs now [11:26] Burgundavia, anything beginning in Italian* [11:26] and where are they going? === ealden [~ealden@219.90.91.184] has joined #ubuntu-doc [11:26] to a moin wiki at ubuntu-it.org [11:26] ah ok [11:27] hmm, that is going to make it harder to interwiki [11:27] true [11:27] but we don't do any interwiki-ing [11:27] we need to [11:27] in what way? [11:28] anything that makes moving around a wiki is good [11:28] well obviously the italian websites will be linked in the appropriate places [11:29] Burgundavia, there are very few national teams that have their stuff on the ubuntu wiki [11:29] yes [11:29] the canadian wiki had a big debate about it [11:29] http://www.ubuntu-de.org/wiki/ [11:29] http://wiki.ubuntu-fr.org/ [11:29] etc [11:30] don't canadian people use english and french resources? [11:30] yes [11:30] it is shame that this stuff needs to move off the official wiki [11:30] need something like the wikipedia project does [11:31] i agree [11:31] but since it isn't being done... [11:31] yes [11:31] maybe we can talk after breezy is out about that sort of thing [11:32] ok [11:32] although if that is going to be done, the same needs to be done for the website [11:32] the main reason for moving the wiki is to have it at the same domain as the website and forum [11:32] yes [11:32] I find the whole -COUNTRYCODE thing to be substandard [11:33] ok better raise it at the CC [11:33] whatever [11:33] when I get a job to support loco teams, I will work on that [11:33] re: deleting wiki pages, I think in pages that aren't going to cause problems of duplication or something like that, its best to leave it, because you never know whether the author wants it for something [11:33] a good example is ItalianRosettaDone [11:34] ok [11:34] they don't do any harm [11:35] all the pages I have been editing have no been edited since the wiki move [11:35] anything that looks remotely like a doc I am tagging [11:35] not matter how bad [11:35] the only stuff I am killing is stuff that is short, like the rosetta page [11:36] well if you kill it and then we want it again, we'll just have to recreate it [11:37] which is annoying, given that it does not do anyone any harm [11:37] wiki pages that are left can do harm [11:37] as they create the impression of a usable page [11:37] if they are not linked misleadingly, i disagree [11:38] they are linked by being part of the wiki and can be found by searching === Burgundavia can't believe he is arguing to delete pages on the wiki [11:39] if someone finds a page that is not useful to them, its pretty easy to ignore it [11:41] if you look at all the pages I have deleted, I think you would agree that they should go [11:41] it numbers less than a dozen [11:42] ok [11:42] I am not deleted obivious crap, just tagging it with Cleanup [11:43] sounds good [11:43] basically every doc I find needs to get tagged [11:43] ok [11:43] leave the italian stuff tho please [11:43] I am only tagging english docs === mdke nods [11:44] ok gtg now [11:44] non-english pages I am simply removing that double title issue from the wiki transfer [11:44] thanks for all your work [11:44] its really cool [11:44] the wiki needs work === highvoltage [~Jono@196.36.161.235] has joined #ubuntu-doc [12:02] rob^, if it is a work in progress, that is what the CategoryCleanup is for [12:03] rob^, notice I have tagged this page --> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KeepingUbuntuUpdated [12:03] that I just created but are unsatified with [12:03] umm [12:04] there are a lot of docs is worse shape than yours [12:04] did you not listen to mdke? you dont need to hammer everything [12:04] yes [12:04] what does tagging have to do with deleting something? [12:04] I didn't say deleting [12:04] rob^, I am looking to create the best wiki out there [12:04] Burgundavia: where's this wiki? [12:05] highvoltage, we are discussing changes to the Ubuntu wiki [12:05] yes, you are doing a good job, just be careful on what you want to "clean up" === kane [~kane@202.83.34.144] has joined #ubuntu-doc [12:14] froud: are you there ? [12:15] insanekanefr, he also goes by venda [12:15] Burgundavia: oh thanks :) [12:18] Burgundavia: would you know about Kubuntu documentation ? is it in the docteam.ubuntu.com svn ? [12:19] Burgundavia: ignore that question ... my mistake :) [12:20] Burgundavia: is there some meta-package that I can install to compile all the docbook files into PDF ? [12:23] no idea [12:23] don't really hack much in the svn [12:25] oh ok === insanekane [~kane@202.83.34.144] has joined #ubuntu-doc [12:33] yeah there is a way [12:33] it was asked just the other night [12:34] there is still a LOT of work to be done on Kubuntu documentation [12:34] I doubt whats there is all that useful at the moment [12:34] Kubuntu basically has no baseline, as it didn;t really exist in the breezy cycle [12:34] no [12:35] s/breezy/hoary [12:35] one of the plans, if I get time, is to create a Kubuntu profile for the faq in time for breezy [12:35] I've started [12:36] rob^: is it worthwhile to translate the kubuntu user guide atm ? [12:36] no [12:36] we have a string freeze [12:36] why do you ask that insanekane? [12:36] sep 8 [12:36] oh, probably not === rob^ just realised what you were asking [12:37] hmm [12:37] unless you can have it done in a month :P [12:37] but i have to anyway [12:38] theres no reason not to start work on it [12:38] better to hack on the english docs and then translate like mad in sept [12:39] just because it isn't released with breezy, doesn't mean you cant work on it with the idea to include it with the next ubuntu release either [12:39] translating early in the cycle is not really that great, as that is when we refactor stuff quite heavily [12:40] yeah [12:40] stuff changes alot [12:40] hmm .. [12:40] I mean writing has only really started in the last couple of weeks [12:40] im deriving a distro from Kubuntu, and so I need to translate *something* :) [12:41] what are you deriving for? [12:41] what do you mean ? [12:41] insanekane, just pull a copy of the kubuntu guide out of svn and work on it seperatly for your new distro [12:41] thats what I thought to do .. [12:41] its released under two different open licences [12:41] i dont mind even if under GPL :) [12:41] insanekane, I would talk to the current authors of it [12:42] ok [12:42] insanekane, GFDL and CC by SA 2.0 [12:42] all Ubuntu docs are under those licenses [12:43] insanekane, talk to Sean Wheller or Jonathan Jesse [12:43] they might be able to offer a better suggestion, they know where it is heading [12:43] oho ... well, thats why im here :) looking for froud :) [12:44] right now, i am downloading the deb [12:44] yeah [12:44] ping froud [12:45] what package should I download to compile the docbook to PDF ? [12:45] I wonder what time it is in his part of the world.. [12:45] xmlto should have the necessary stuff [12:45] rob^, UTC+1 for froud [12:45] ok thanks [12:46] insanekane, I think there may be a make script for pdf now for some docs [12:46] rob^, south africa [12:46] yeah [12:46] just did a whois [12:47] hmm, its like day time there then, maybe hes still at work [12:47] yeah .. its about 12 noon [12:48] yeah almost [12:48] or lunch? === poningru [~poningru@pool-68-238-172-217.tampfl.fios.verizon.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc [12:48] hello all [12:48] hi [12:49] I sent an email to someone http://www.advogato.org/person/Burgundavia/diary.html?start=21 [12:49] about me helping with the docs [12:49] poningru, that would be me [12:49] hehe [12:49] insanekane, you could send an email to the mailing list [12:49] ubuntu-doc@lists.ubuntu.com [12:49] I was wondering if there was any place that you guys really needed help with [12:49] or should I just dive in [12:50] anything and everything [12:50] or any place that needs grunt work [12:50] poningru, do you know much about docbook? [12:50] the easiest place to start is the wiki [12:50] rob^: kinda [12:50] we use docbook for the all stuff in SVN [12:50] worked little bit with thunderbird help [12:50] but I didnt like it [12:50] check out ubuntu-doc@lists.ubuntu.com [12:50] oops [12:50] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocteamProjects [12:50] poningru, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocteamGettingStarted [12:51] check that out poningru [12:51] and that [12:51] poningru, if you want to hack the wiki, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/WikiToDo [12:51] ooh searching for that for a while [12:51] read the thing about CategoryCleanup [12:52] heh I guess I can do the thing right under category cleanup [12:52] thunderbird === poningru pets his thunderbird [12:53] sure [12:53] Currently the install guide and the Kubuntu release notes needs love, but others like the Userguide do too [12:53] if you are inspired, go [12:53] yeah [12:53] take your pick [12:53] ooh kubuntu me no likey [12:53] hehe [12:53] but yeah I will work on that category thing [12:53] cool [12:53] err the stuff on the list [12:53] ok thanks guys [12:53] np [12:53] thanks for offering to help out! [12:54] yep np [12:54] I have to sleep now, as it is 4 am here, but good luck [12:54] also you guys seem the most receptive [12:54] if you need me, email me [12:54] ok [12:54] can I ask you guys a question? [12:54] shoot [12:54] about fundraising [12:55] why are we not doing what mofo is doing with the search plugin? [12:55] err mozilla foundation* [12:55] why not insert our own search plugin to make some money [12:55] ubuntu does not need money, trust me [12:55] because thats not what Ubuntu is about [12:56] hehe I know [12:56] but that could be something we will need later wont we? [12:56] after the 10 mil has run out [12:56] dunno, probably not [12:56] unlikely to Ubuntu is going to need more money [12:56] the 10mil was the start [12:56] yep [12:56] there is a lot of backing apart from that [12:56] oh so there is going to be funding injected [12:57] oh [12:57] wow did not know [12:57] mark has publicly stated that he is going to fund it his entire life [12:57] and has planned around that [12:57] ah ic [12:57] the guy that founded verisign or something.. [12:57] he's loaded anyhow.. [12:57] yeah I know the major hitters in the nerd community [12:57] and if he dies, there are plans in his will for the money to survive what would have been his natural life [12:58] rob^, thawte, which he sold to verisign [12:58] thats the one [12:58] heh lets not plan like that [12:58] thawte [12:58] he was also the one who paid like a bunch of money to go to space [12:59] ok I will be off [12:59] night guys [12:59] night [12:59] well early morn [12:59] nah night here :) [12:59] its 0700 here [12:59] night rob^ [12:59] night Burgundavia [01:00] also is there a plan to ever include a large help file in the distro itself? [01:00] yes, several [01:00] apart from the gnome one [01:00] I'm the lead author on the faq guide [01:01] oh the official ubuntuguide? [01:01] yeah [01:01] wait can we include things like css for dvd etc.? [01:01] no [01:01] keep it on the wiki [01:01] right [01:02] we will be including links from the guide pointing to the wiki for more info [01:02] ah gotcha [01:02] so assuming mp3 is out as well [01:02] the idea is the wiki is less official then the documents [01:02] does anyone know where the docs are accessible, after i install the kubuntu docs deb ? [01:02] ok now I really have to go sleep [01:02] night [01:02] so less chance of the smack down [01:02] yes, svn repo [01:02] oh [01:03] somewhere on your system :P [01:03] rob^: :) [01:03] just bring them up using Yelp === carstenh [~carstenh@mkfw.fh-trier.de] has joined #ubuntu-doc [01:03] khelpcentre has them .. [01:04] System -> Help in ubuntu [01:04] now have to figure out how to the docs on a single page :/ [01:04] why? [01:04] docbook isn't designed that way [01:05] they are supposed to be a, *gasp*, book [01:05] :P [01:06] rob^: dude, i have to print it out, and pass the printouts to my non-computer literate translators [01:06] hi, which copyright has information found in the ubuntu-wikis? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/InitScriptHumanDescriptions would be very useful for me [01:06] after a literal translation, i have to do data entry. then i have to verify the translation. [01:06] umm [01:06] the wiki is dual licenced [01:06] like all docteam projects [01:06] well, they are not computer illeterate ... but sure as hell they dont know docbook :) [01:07] under GFDL and CC by SA 2.0 [01:07] rob^: ok, thanks [01:07] insanekane, just print out the different pages and staple them together [01:07] rob^: yeah, i was just hoping I could get a single page :) [01:07] err [01:08] i mean, like a single HTML page [01:08] anyway, nevermind [01:08] heh, gotta love low-tech solutions [01:08] there may be a way using xmlto, I've seen it done on tldp [01:09] yeah, when i worked with docbook years ago, it was possible [01:10] i just dont know how to use xmlto [01:10] i installed xmlto and compiled the docbook ... unfortunately, it failed citing a LOT of errors [01:10] try: xmlto html-nochunks mydoc.xml [01:10] (probably, some kind of tailored docbook modules are used with KDE docs ?) [01:10] insanekane: we use xsltproc [01:10] just look at the makefiles [01:10] rob^: i googled for SA, south africa is probably wrong [01:10] that should create a single page of whatever xml file [01:11] froud: hi froud :) was just waiting for you ... [01:11] hmm [01:11] froud: i dont have the makefiles .. [01:11] carstenh, no no [01:11] froud: how do i get the makefiles ? [01:11] what docbook do you want to transform [01:11] carstenh, Creative Commons [01:11] our user docs [01:12] froud: let me start at the beginning [01:12] insanekane: ok [01:12] froud: i am helping to translate the Kubuntu docs .. [01:12] k [01:12] rob^: CC stands for Creative Commons and SA stands for? [01:12] carstenh, one of their licences [01:12] froud: i have a couple of computer non-experts, and i have to provide a printout to them for translation [01:13] rob^: thanks [01:13] carstenh, http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/2.0/ [01:13] froud: so, could you tell me 1) which doc is best for translation to a manual ? 2) how to make a single HTML page out of it ? [01:13] insanekane: you talking about the docs in our svn? [01:13] or upstream documents [01:13] froud: we will also proof read the existing docs, and add things wherever necessary in the english docs [01:14] froud: i am talking about your docs ... the kubuntu docs [01:14] Ok [01:14] to translate you would use poxml [01:14] from the kdesdk [01:14] froud: well, that is a later stage [01:14] to create single page HTML use xsltproc [01:14] right now, i need to print everything, and pass it on to the translators (who do not know docbook etc) [01:14] aha ok [01:15] it is better if they use pot/po files [01:15] froud: how do i actually get all the docs + images ? [01:15] insanekane: you should checkout the src from svn [01:15] i will use the po files when the data entry stage comes [01:15] froud: are there any instructions for that someplace ? [01:15] on how to do a checkout?\ [01:16] svn checkout .... then what ? [01:16] svn co ...... [01:16] svn checkout https://docteam.ubuntu.com/repos/trunk ubuntu-docs [01:16] thx [01:16] that wil give you all the files from the project [01:17] ie, only the kubuntu docs right ? [01:17] no that is all svn [01:17] svn checkout https://docteam.ubuntu.com/repos/trunk ubuntu-docs/kde would get me only kubuntu stuff ? [01:17] part of it [01:17] hang ten [01:17] hang ten ? [01:17] wait one [01:17] wait a sec [01:18] froud: which document do you suggest I start with ? [01:18] wait out [01:18] OZ this is AD over [01:18] ok [01:18] AD this is OZ over [01:18] insanekane: [01:18] svn co https://docteam.ubuntu.com/repos/trunk/common kubuntu-docs/common [01:18] svn co https://docteam.ubuntu.com/repos/trunk/libs kubuntu-docs/libs [01:18] svn co https://docteam.ubuntu.com/repos/trunk/kde kubuntu-docs/repos [01:18] svn co https://docteam.ubuntu.com/repos/trunk/validate.sh kubuntu-docs === rob^ is comms guy [01:18] that is what you need, I think [01:19] you can drop the last one [01:19] ok .. [01:19]