[12:17] <luminerd> How can I get java for firefox in linux?
[12:17] <luminerd> Will an RPM work?
[12:18] <pv_> You can get java from ubuntu backports, hoary-extras/restricted
[12:18] <luminerd> pv_, uh...
[12:18] <luminerd> pv_, so apt-get install java?
[12:19] <pv_> apt-get install sun-j2sdk1.5
[12:19] <luminerd> great thanks!
[12:20] <pv_> actually sun-j2re1.5 would also work, if you do not plan to develop java apps 
[12:20] <nikkia> pv, i always recommend the dsk
[12:20] <luminerd> hmm
[12:20] <nikkia> sdk
[12:20] <luminerd> that package doesnt exist :/
[12:20] <nikkia> you never know when something is going to depend on running 'javac' 
[12:21] <luminerd> apt-get install sun-j2sdk1.5  -  E: Couldn't find package sun-j2sdk1.
[12:21] <pv_> You have to add the line "deb http://ubuntu-backports.mirrormax.net/ hoary-extras main universe multiverse restricted" to /etc/apt/sources.list
[12:21] <ilba7r> how to kill a an application using its name not the id
[12:21] <nikkia> ilba7r: killall
[12:21] <pv_> ilba7r, pkill
[12:21] <ilba7r> i wana kill gnome-panel
[12:22] <pv_> luminerd, and run "apt-get update" after that
[12:22] <ilba7r> luminerd?
[12:22] <luminerd> hmm
[12:22] <luminerd> emacs won't work as root :/
[12:23] <setite> who knows the name of the winamp preset file...
[12:23] <nikkia> luminerd: use kdesu
[12:23] <nikkia> luminerd: sudo'ing gui apps rarely works
[12:23] <pv_> funny, for me emacs works well
[12:23] <luminerd> kill sudo! sudo sux0rs
[12:23] <luminerd> lol
[12:23] <luminerd> I did sudo passwd or w/e
[12:23] <luminerd> now I'm su'd
[12:23] <nikkia> luminerd: then you're on your own
[12:24] <pv_> use vi ;)
[12:24] <luminerd> lame
[12:24] <luminerd> none work
[12:24] <luminerd> oh wonderful
[12:24] <luminerd> VI does!
[12:24] <luminerd> I hate VI!
[12:24] <luminerd> lol'
[12:24] <nikkia> and no, emacs won't run from su
[12:24] <luminerd> whyn't?
[12:25] <pv_> no, you see that "su" effectively logs you in as root and may set xauth settings as in console mode -> no X access.
[12:25] <nikkia> pv, not just that...
[12:25] <pv_> nikkia, mainly that I believe.
[12:25] <nikkia> pv, but emacs uses your UID to access unix domain sockets in /tmp
[12:25] <nikkia> and things get real nasty real quick
[12:25] <pv_> setting XAUTHORITY="/home/user/.Xauthority" should fix X apps
[12:25] <nikkia> which is one of the things that kdesu does properly
[12:26] <luminerd> when in slackware, emacs works fine whilst you are su'd.
[12:26] <nikkia> luminerd: if its the console version of emacs, sure
[12:26] <luminerd> false.
[12:26] <luminerd> Emacs gui works fine.
[12:26] <nikkia> luminerd: then slackware is shipping their X setup to be insecure by default, which doesn't surprise me
[12:27] <nikkia> they used to set it so *any* user could connect to the local X server
[12:27] <pv_> I still claim that this is due to xauth settings.
[12:27] <nikkia> pv, it probably is
[12:27] <nikkia> pv, but...
[12:27] <nikkia> pv, ubuntu's emacs include several non-standard elisp packages as standard, some of them use unix domain sockets in /tmp
[12:27] <pv_> I don't think the X server even knows whether an application is root or not, it just asks it to send a magic cookie.
[12:27] <luminerd> nikkia, thanks for taking a shit on my profession.  now enjoy the banishment of ignored-land.
[12:28] <nikkia> luminerd: watch your language, please
[12:29] <pv_> (Frankly, I do not see a reason for ignore now.)
[12:29] <luminerd> pv_, what do you mean?
[12:29] <luminerd> and also how can I change the sudo password?
[12:30] <pv_> sudo password should be the same as that of your user account.
[12:30] <pv_> so  passwd
[12:30] <luminerd> pv_, also, thanks for that command.  It's working now...but curious, will I have to do anything else for it to work in Firefox?
[12:30] <luminerd> pv_, hmm, I don't want it the same as my user account...
[12:30] <luminerd> that defeats all purposes of even having password protection
[12:30] <nikkia> pv, thats quite funny, if  luminerd wasn't ignoring me, i could tell him how to change that :P
[12:30] <pv_> Errm, I meant the same as the password that you use for your own account.
[12:30] <luminerd> if the user using these boxen knows the password, I'll have 20 screwed up boxen to fix.
[12:31] <luminerd> pv_, I only have one account on these: caller
[12:31] <luminerd> I want to change the password for sudo, but not caller.
[12:32] <pv_> There is a way to force sudo to ask for root password, see "man sudoers"
[12:32] <luminerd> thanks
[12:34] <luminerd> pv_, that's quite a large file, mind explaining shortly?
[12:34] <pv_> the option is called "rootpw", but I do not remember the format of /etc/sudoers anymore :)
[12:34] <nikkia> pv, there's another option too, that makes sudo behave like su for passwords
[12:36] <luminerd> ah, ok thanks
[12:36] <pv_> ok, nikkia. I haven't tweaked sudo much. 
[12:36] <pv_> or enough to remember all the options ;)
[12:37] <nikkia> pv, there are basically 4 password modes for sudo
[12:37] <nikkia> 1) ask the user's password, 2) ask root's password, 3) ask the sudo target's password, and 4) ask a specified user's password
[12:38] <nikkia> pv, and since the mode is set per rule, you have a LOT of flexibility
[12:38] <pv_> ok, quite enough room at least to shot yourself in the foot
[12:39] <nikkia> pv, you could, for example, set it to ask for your own password when running a common util, like, say, ifconfig, mount, etc, root's password for a root shell, and another user (say, editor) to edit files as root
[12:41] <nikkia> i believe you can even lock down which files can be edited, differently
[12:41] <luminerd> pv_,  will I have to do anything else for it to work in Firefox?
[12:42] <nikkia> so it would make sense to lock down /etc/passwd, /etc/shadow real tight, but relax editing /etc/hosts.deny or so
[12:43] <pv_> luminerd, perhaps ln -fs /usr/lib/j2sdk1.5-sun/jre/plugin/i386/ns7/libjavaplugin_oji.so /usr/lib/mozilla-firefox/plugins/libjavaplugin.so
[12:43] <_john> hey guys, how do i make it so i can have a shared file on my network in linux?
[12:43] <_john> like the windows Shared Documents
[12:44] <jpatrick> Right-click -> properties -> file sharing
[12:44] <nikkia> pv, hmm, thats interesting, you can even lock down sudo so that it only allows LDAP authenticated users
[12:44] <_john> nice
[12:45] <luminerd> pv_, thanks
[12:45] <nikkia> pv, another nice feature, is that if you disable su, and enable NOEXEC mode for sudo, then all programs run as root are run with the NX bit set
[12:46] <nikkia> ah, no, sorry, it prevents system calls to exec
[12:46] <nikkia> documentation is a bit badly worded there :)
[12:48] <luminerd> nikkia, can I give root access to X?
[12:48] <jpatrick> I thought you ignored her
[12:48] <luminerd> * pv_ 
[12:50] <luminerd> pv_, still here?
[12:52] <pv_> what do you mean by "root access to X" ?
[12:53] <pv_> login as root or run programs as root from su
[12:53] <luminerd> yea
[12:53] <luminerd> but
[12:53] <luminerd> is there a way to give su the ability to run emac
[12:53] <pv_> try "export XAUTHORITY=/home/caller/.Xauthority; emacs"
[12:55] <pv_> but -> 
[12:57] <luminerd> where do mozilla plugins go
[12:57] <nikkia> luminerd: and that's likely to help how? you think i'm going to help you now ?
[12:58] <luminerd> nikkia, no, I just thought you might be done trying to personally attack me.  are you?
[12:58] <apokryphos> lala la
[12:58] <jpatrick> lol
[12:58] <nikkia> luminerd: given that i never 'personally attacked you', i dunno wtf you're on about
[12:58] <luminerd> nikkia luminerd: then slackware is shipping their X setup to be insecure by default, which doesn't surprise me
[12:59] <apokryphos> nikkia: tut tut...  personal attacks! Prison next ;-)
[12:59] <luminerd> I don't appreciate that.
[12:59] <jpatrick> I don't get it
[12:59] <apokryphos> luminerd: if you think that's a personal attack, you should study those two words
[12:59] <nikkia> luminerd: why? are you 'slackware' ?
[12:59] <luminerd> go into ##slackware -- they will NEVER attack Kubuntu.  We believe in Linux, not just one distro of it.
[01:00] <apokryphos> hahaha
[01:00] <jpatrick> :?
[01:01] <luminerd> wow.  I'm an idiot
[01:01] <luminerd> why was I so offended by that?
[01:01] <apokryphos> luminerd: well if you think that all Linuxs are the same, then study Debian and then check out Linspire
[01:01] <jpatrick> That's what I was thinking
[01:01] <luminerd> I've said similar things regarding Kubuntu...
[01:01] <luminerd> nikkia, ok, I'm sorry :(
[01:01] <luminerd> apokryphos, didn't say that.
[01:01] <luminerd> apokryphos, I still believe that we Linux users should stick together.  I do not consider Linspire Linux.
[01:01] <apokryphos> luminerd: so if they have differences, does it not follow that some will be better than others?
[01:02] <apokryphos> luminerd: well there's a mistake; what's your definition of Linux?
[01:02] <luminerd> apokryphos, no, they are all useful in different situations.
[01:02] <roguejedix_> Wow, quite a conversation I've walked into. Hi, by the way
[01:02] <apokryphos> luminerd: so they have different strengths
[01:03] <luminerd> apokryphos, I know it is technically linux. but they don't keep as part of the community, they don't have good support, they have ugly defaults in their kde, they screw up their kernel, they don't go open source which pretty much defeats the purpose of linux, and they all around suck.
[01:03] <luminerd> roguejedix_, 'lo
[01:03] <nikkia> apokryphos: what is scary, is 'Linux users' would cover Amithlon users too :)
[01:03] <luminerd> anyway nikkia I'm very sorry I got so offended...looking back I feel like a fool
[01:03] <apokryphos> luminerd: there you go, that's your opinion
[01:03] <luminerd> s/feel like/am
[01:03] <apokryphos> luminerd: now why you think nikkia can't have one about another distro is beyond me
[01:04] <nikkia> apokryphos: one i ran for nigh on 8 years
[01:04] <luminerd> apokryphos, most of that's facts. my opinion is that any remotely reasonable form of linux should be considered linux, distro wars are pointless.
[01:04] <apokryphos> heh
[01:04] <luminerd> Slackware, however, is the purest form of Linux.
[01:04] <apokryphos> luminerd: you'll have to forgive me if I think nikkia knows more than you in this area :)
[01:04] <luminerd> It has nothing to bloat it, nothing to make it user friendly.
[01:04] <apokryphos> hehe
[01:04] <luminerd> It's the perfect distro for learning and the most secure of them all
[01:05] <apokryphos> Too many points to even attack... 
[01:05] <luminerd> apokryphos, no, these are opinions we are discussing, no one can "know more" about them...we all know 100% of our own opinions.
[01:05] <apokryphos> and /me feels in such a good mood -- just booked holiday, woo
[01:05] <luminerd> anyway I'm not here to do this
[01:05] <nikkia> luminerd: there's absolutely no chance its the 'most secure of all', and i'm not bashing it with that
[01:05] <apokryphos> luminerd: errrrm, I was talking about the subject matter, not opinions.
[01:06] <luminerd> I'm sorry that I was such an idiot back then, I'm done discussing distros, and I'd like to know the path to my mozilla
[01:06] <nikkia> but, for example, they still eschew PAM, and their acceptance of shadow passwords wasn't all that long ago
[01:06] <apokryphos> There's a difference between an "opinion", and a substantiated proposition
[01:07] <luminerd> ok, I'm very done with this topic of conversation.  shall I seek my answer elsewhere?
[01:07] <apokryphos> #ubuntu is a better place for that question, in theory, anyhow. But mozilla plugins go in ~/.mozilla
[01:07] <luminerd> apokryphos, thanks :D
[01:08] <luminerd> unfortunately I'm banned from #ubuntu
[01:08] <luminerd> I have no idea why
[01:08] <luminerd> lol
[01:08] <_StarScream> luminerd: i have an idea
[01:08] <luminerd> ?
[01:08] <luminerd> please enlighten me!
[01:08] <_StarScream> luminerd: you harrass ##slackware too
[01:08] <_StarScream> or are you banned from there now as well?
[01:08] <luminerd> _StarScream, lol, no...I never had problems in ##slacwkare
[01:08] <luminerd> *slackware
[01:09] <luminerd> apokryphos, by the way, is .mozilla also the place for plugins for firefox?
[01:09] <Rogue_Jedi_X> local ones, yes
[01:09] <apokryphos> luminerd: check what's in that directory
[01:09] <luminerd> apokryphos, ah, perfect, so they go in .mozilla/firefox?
[01:10] <nikkia> if i'd been in a lousier mood, you might have been banned here, although i'd probably have got in trouble with Riddell for it :)
[01:11] <nikkia> luminerd: you have to be careful, it depends on WHICH firefox you run
[01:11] <apokryphos> luminerd: no, in the plugins/ directory, though it would probably search in firefox/ too (not sure). 
[01:11] <nikkia> there are 2 firefox builds on [k] ubuntu
[01:11] <Rogue_Jedi_X> luminerd: my firefox plugins are in $HOME/.mozilla/plugins
[01:11] <luminerd> nikkia, which umm, hmm, not sure
[01:11] <nikkia> one uses .mozilla/firefox, the other uses .firefox
[01:11] <luminerd> nikkia, I got mozilla-firefox
[01:11] <nikkia> luminerd: that one uses .mozilla/firefox, i believe
[01:11] <luminerd> oh yea
[01:11] <luminerd> must be since I don't have a .firefox :P
[01:11] <Rogue_Jedi_X> nikkia: Which one uses .firefox then?
[01:11] <luminerd> Rogue_Jedi_X, I see...hmmm
[01:11] <nikkia> Rogue_Jedi_X: backport's 'firefox'
[01:12] <Rogue_Jedi_X> Ah, thanks
[01:12] <nikkia> Rogue_Jedi_X: i think, mudding the waters more, backports has a mozilla-firefox too
[01:12] <luminerd> ok so should they go in .mozilla/firefox or .mozilla/plugins (which does not currently exist)
[01:12] <nikkia> luminerd: its a bit more complicated than that
[01:13] <luminerd> Please enter the installation path of the Mozilla, Netscape, or Opera browser (i.e., /usr/lib/mozilla):
[01:13] <luminerd> that's what the flash plugin says
[01:13] <Rogue_Jedi_X> Interesting. Three firefoxes. I think I have backports commented out anyway
[01:13] <apokryphos> .mozilla/plugins then
[01:13] <nikkia> luminerd: you have to find the 'plugins' directory below your profile, to make them unique to firefox, i don't honestly know if .mozilla/plugins is a 'local, global between mozilla/firefox' directory, but if apokryphos says it is, i'll trust his word :)
[01:14] <thoreauputic> global plugins appear to be in /usr/lib/mozilla/plugins here
[01:14] <nikkia> thoreauputic: global ones are, yes
[01:14] <luminerd> nikkia, so uh...I make the directory or?
[01:14] <Rogue_Jedi_X> Same here
[01:15] <nikkia> thoreauputic: they can also be in /usr/lib/firefox/plugins too :)
[01:15] <thoreauputic> nikkia: ah yes :)
[01:15] <nikkia> thoreauputic: again, its the difference between a firefox plugin, and a mozilla/firefox plugin
[01:15] <apokryphos> luminerd: do you not have a ~/.mozilla/plugins ? Well, if you don't, create it.
[01:15] <Rogue_Jedi_X> luminerd: Just point it to $HOME/.mozilla
[01:15] <luminerd> apokryphos, no, no /plugins.. :/
[01:16] <luminerd> Rogue_Jedi_X, oh, ok cool
[01:16] <luminerd> thanks
[01:16] <apokryphos> luminerd: well, then create it
[01:16] <Rogue_Jedi_X> I think it makes the directory on its own if there isn't any
[01:16] <thoreauputic> nikkia: one more reson for eschewing the use of backports...
[01:16] <thoreauputic> *reason
[01:16] <apokryphos> once it's done you'll have a flashplayer.xpt  libflashplayer.so
[01:16] <luminerd> lol
[01:16] <nikkia> i believe Rogue_Jedi_X is correct, its asking for the parent directory of the plugin directory
[01:16] <luminerd> WARNING: Please enter a valid installation path.
[01:16] <apokryphos> luminerd: you didn't make the directory
[01:16] <luminerd> ok
[01:16] <nikkia> thoreauputic: they do do some silly things, but on the other hand, there's useful stuff in there... 
[01:17] <apokryphos> luminerd: mkdir ~/.mozilla/plugins
[01:17] <Rogue_Jedi_X> I was wrong. harikiri time
[01:17] <thoreauputic> nikkia: true I guess - just nothing I need (so far)
[01:17] <luminerd> Please enter the installation path of the Mozilla, Netscape, or Opera browser (i.e., /usr/lib/mozilla): /home/caller/.mozilla/plugins == WARNING: Please enter a valid installation path.
[01:17] <luminerd> apokryphos, I did
[01:17] <luminerd> thanks
[01:17] <apokryphos> luminerd: what *are* you doing?
[01:17] <nikkia> luminerd: it wants the 'mozilla' directory, not the plugins directory
[01:17] <nikkia> luminerd: ie, try /home/caller/.mozilla
[01:17] <luminerd> apokryphos, just trying to get flash, nothin more lol
[01:18] <luminerd> nikkia, tried that too
[01:18] <luminerd> nikkia, same
[01:18] <jpatrick> I'll put it in global
[01:18] <Rogue_Jedi_X> luminerd: A dumb question: does that directory even exist?
[01:18] <nikkia> luminerd: it might not install properly to a personal profile then *shrug* you might have to use /usr/lib/firefox or /usr/lib/mozilla
[01:18] <apokryphos> luminerd: why are you installing it like that anyway?
[01:18] <luminerd> Rogue_Jedi_X, yea, it does
[01:18] <nikkia> apokryphos: because you told him to :P
[01:18] <apokryphos> luminerd: you can -- and should -- get it from the repos
[01:19] <luminerd> nikkia, which/what?
[01:19] <nikkia> apokryphos: oh, i see what you mean :)
[01:19] <luminerd> apokryphos, repos?
[01:19] <luminerd> LOL
[01:19] <luminerd> ok what's the pkg name
[01:19] <apokryphos> !info flashplayer-mozilla
[01:19] <ubotu> flashplayer-mozilla: (Macromedia Flash Player), section multiverse/web, is optional. Version: 7.0.25-0.0 (hoary), Packaged size: 956 kB, Installed size: 2136 kB
[01:19] <luminerd> thanks!
[01:19] <apokryphos> nikkia: did you see BigBrother this year? :P
[01:19] <nikkia> apokryphos: nope, not one second of it, i'm quite proud
[01:20] <Rogue_Jedi_X> Isn't that some reality show?
[01:20] <luminerd> well that sure as crap makes it easier
[01:20] <apokryphos> nikkia: you should be ;-)
[01:20] <nikkia> apokryphos: i even managed not to hear any of their names
[01:20] <apokryphos> nikkia: Anthony won
[01:20] <nikkia> apokryphos: or even know *anything* about it
[01:20] <apokryphos> you have now :P
[01:20] <nikkia> apokryphos: means nothing to me
[01:20] <apokryphos> nikkia: I've never got into it before, but did this time (was reasonably enthralling at first). Got lame near the end, but still quite addcited
[01:20] <luminerd> OMG
[01:21] <apokryphos> nikkia: mostly just put in arrogant people, of course.
[01:21] <nikkia> apokryphos: yeah, i was like that with it last year, thats why i didn't watch it this year
[01:21] <luminerd> some guy's using IE to view MYSPACE on a WINDOWS computer in the office!!!!!  uururutgh!
[01:21] <apokryphos> nikkia: Victor!
[01:21] <nikkia> apokryphos: you'll probably find that you can't bear it next year :)
[01:21] <apokryphos> hopefully
[01:21] <apokryphos> it wastes a lot of time
[01:21] <apokryphos> but makes for good conversation at times. Debates, too. :P
[01:21] <nikkia> apokryphos: you could say that about the whole of C4/E4 :)
[01:21] <apokryphos> Pretty sad though
[01:22] <apokryphos> reality-TV is "bigger", really, than most other stuff like that.
[01:22] <Rogue_Jedi_X> Have any of you seen the Windows Vista beta screenshots? Looks like another facelift to me
[01:22] <apokryphos> I actually don't watch that much at all anymore. Watched the final today though; and watched many BB episodes. Hilarious at first.
[01:22] <nikkia> apokryphos: i quite enjoyed the BBCs reality shows around 2000-2001
[01:22] <apokryphos> Rogue_Jedi_X: yeah, it's improved significantly lately
[01:22] <apokryphos> nikkia: when they were fresh n' new
[01:23] <Rogue_Jedi_X> Improved? How?
[01:23] <nikkia> apokryphos: ie, that one where they were on the island in the shetlands, and paddington green
[01:23] <apokryphos> heh
[01:23] <apokryphos> nikkia: who was your favourite from last series?
[01:23] <apokryphos> Rogue_Jedi_X: check out the screenies
[01:23] <nikkia> apokryphos: tbh, i didn't really attach to any of them, i found them all irritating, but in an amusing way (at first)
[01:23] <apokryphos> Rogue_Jedi_X: iCandy-wise, I mean. Earlier screenshots looked just like a blue XP
[01:24] <nikkia> apokryphos: they've made it look like a black XP now :P
[01:24] <Rogue_Jedi_X> Oh, that. Yeah, that's true. Though I think the close button is waaaaay to wide
[01:24] <apokryphos> nikkia: Yeah. I didn't watch it that much; remember liking VIctor most of the time (hating him at others), and found it a disgrace that Nadia won. :|
[01:24] <apokryphos> Rogue_Jedi_X: effective though, apparently. New Plastik Window-dec for kde 3.5 is a lot bigger
[01:24] <nikkia> apokryphos: i couldn't bear victor, but then, thats the woman's perspective for you :)
[01:25] <Rogue_Jedi_X> *checks*
[01:25] <apokryphos> nikkia: he's the classic character for teenagers to just keep laughing at. Too funny.
[01:25] <apokryphos> Rogue_Jedi_X: though of course it's completely customizable
[01:26] <Rogue_Jedi_X> No doubt. And since when does KDE-look.ord have a KDE 4.0 section?
[01:26] <jpatrick> since yesterday
[01:26] <apokryphos> nikkia: anyhow, this year unfortunately the only character I really liked was voted out about half-way through
[01:27] <Rogue_Jedi_X> jpatrick: Really? Only beta, I assume?
[01:27] <apokryphos> Of course
[01:27] <jpatrick> The KDE 4 section poped up yesterday
[01:27] <apokryphos> weird that they should put it in more than a year than it's expected to come out :)
[01:28] <nikkia> apokryphos: that one with the celebs in the mansion that Ch4 had a while ago was mildly amusing too, if only because if you watched it enough, you realised it was all completely faked
[01:28] <jpatrick> http://dot.kde.com
[01:28] <apokryphos> nikkia: celebs..mansion.. wha? Must've missed it. I don't really watch any others... there's far too many these days
[01:28] <nikkia> apokryphos: it was about oh 16 months ago...
[01:29] <nikkia> apokryphos: james love hewitt was in it
[01:29] <apokryphos> jpatrick: dot.kde.org
[01:29] <jpatrick> oppss
[01:29] <jpatrick> past midnight.. :p
[01:29] <apokryphos> nikkia: not Jessica? Beh :-\
[01:30] <_john> say, when i installed Kmix and i boot it up, there is a little Red circle with an X on it in the tray.  no sound comes out,a nd when i click it, it asks me to select a mixer from a listof mixers, but there are no mixers in the list.
[01:30] <nikkia> apokryphos: anyway, once you watched it for more than about 2-3 hours, you started to realise that the timing wasn't always right, and since the 'mansion' was actually a sound stage in elstree (a fact they didn't really hide) they could have, and probably did, film it all in a day :)
[01:30] <apokryphos> hahaha
[01:30] <apokryphos> That would've been funny
[01:31] <apokryphos> 8 out of 10 cats is gettin' real funny, btw; and it just finished :(
[01:31] <nikkia> apokryphos: the 'sky' outside the windows was cardboard panels on the soundstage, for example
[01:32] <nikkia> apokryphos:  'Back to Reality' according to imdb
[01:32] <nikkia> and i got it wrong, it was 5 not Ch4
[01:33] <apokryphos> nikkia: haha. Sounds like the reality part is pretty central
[01:33] <nikkia> apokryphos: the title could be irony
[01:34] <nikkia> ah, that's why i lagged earlier
[01:34] <nikkia> i just got an email from fcron telling me my IPv6 connection dropped :)
[01:34] <apokryphos> :-s
[01:38] <apokryphos> eloquence of kde4 currently http://www.canllaith.org/svn-features/images/kde4-02.png :P
[01:38] <apokryphos> that yellow in kicker is a feature
[01:39] <nikkia> apokryphos: what about the grey background on 'Location' ?
[01:39] <nikkia> is that a feature too?
[01:39] <apokryphos> nikkia: no
[01:39] <apokryphos> it should be a little lighter
[01:40] <nikkia> by that, i assume you mean 'it should match the surrounding grey' ? :)
[01:40] <apokryphos> nikkia: actually, nope... just checking -- it should be yellow too
[01:40] <nikkia> the icon in the file konqueror window looks cut off too
[01:41] <nikkia> i mean the icon in the location bar, not the window itself
[01:41] <apokryphos> well, is it yellow? If not, then...
[01:42] <apokryphos> Yeah, seems kinda silly to have a section on kde4 made already
[01:42] <apokryphos> maybe it's to "increase the buzz/hype", but kinda silly, as nothing actually works properly on it yet
[01:43] <apokryphos> Voting for Linux Journal finished on 30th of June (or July, let's say). Why exactly is it taking them till November to anounce the votes? :|
[01:47] <nikkia> apokryphos: seen this, btw? http://www.pearpc.net/images/screenshots/1123658799.jpg
[01:47] <apokryphos> amd64 :P
[01:48] <nikkia> apokryphos: OS X hacked to run on generic PCs
[01:48] <nikkia> in that case, under vmware
[01:48] <apokryphos> very nice
[01:52] <apokryphos> nikkia: ever had a mac?
[01:52] <nikkia> yeah, had a few
[01:52] <apokryphos> Tried a friend of mine's not too long ago. Really smooth, actually.
[01:52] <apokryphos> Quite different to our Mac we had about 10 or so years ago (probably more)
[01:53] <nikkia> my server machine when i was living in the US, was actually a G3-400 running yellowdog
[01:53] <apokryphos> we had a paper-boy game on it though, as I recall. Good enough for me
[01:53] <apokryphos> oh
[01:53] <nikkia> did a side-by-side dvd->divx encode on it, against my P3-800, it absolutely crushed the P3
[01:53] <nikkia> like 90 minutes vs 4 hours
[01:53] <apokryphos> wow
[01:53] <Raptoid> selamlar.
[01:54] <apokryphos> nikkia: what do you use for that? I remember in my more adventurous divx days I managed to make a couple, but they were always *very* big, sound wouldn't always lign up etc etc
[01:55] <nikkia> apokryphos: the last mac i owned, and probably the last i'll ever own, was a dual G4-866, whose northbridge blew up 2 days after the warrenty expired
[01:55] <nikkia> apokryphos: i usually use transcode these days
[01:55] <apokryphos> Perfect precision
[01:56] <nikkia> i won't be buying a x86 mac
[01:57] <nikkia> i didn't feel quite so dirty paying 3-5x the price of a PC when i knew i was getting a superior CPU
[01:58] <apokryphos> planning a new computer soon?
[01:58] <nikkia> sort of
[01:58] <apokryphos> What are you running at the moment, again?
[01:58] <nikkia> my boss promised me two shuttle-X systems as a bonus
[01:58] <apokryphos> Yes, your boss does like you indeed 8)
[01:58] <apokryphos> my boss would probably give me an extra shift instead ;-)
[01:58] <nikkia> one is going to be a linux server for email/www/IPv6 tunnel, so i don't have to run all that stuff on my desktop
[01:59] <nikkia> the other is going to my SO
[01:59] <nikkia> the desktop i'm using now will remain tho
[01:59] <apokryphos> right
[01:59] <nikkia> and its a P4-2.8 w 1GB of ram
[01:59] <apokryphos> n-nice
[02:00] <nikkia> not really, its old, its slow, and its clunky
[02:00] <apokryphos> 2.8 still sounds very good to me
[02:00] <apokryphos> and a gig of ram. Though, what type of ram?
[02:00] <nikkia> apokryphos: its an old 2.8
[02:00] <nikkia> no HT, and no 800Mhz FSB
[02:01] <nikkia> apokryphos: just DDR333
[02:01] <apokryphos> still not bad
[02:01] <nikkia> not even dual banked, as the chipset doesn't support it
[02:01] <apokryphos> I only ever go for Athlons though
[02:02] <nikkia> apokryphos: i had a bad experience with AMD a long time ago :P
[02:02] <apokryphos> always much cheaper, for us. Confused about which is actually better, though read more than enough articles :P
[02:02] <nikkia> and i really do mean a LONG time ago
[02:02] <apokryphos> Athlons are easily more popular, too, from where we buy. Most of the sellers regard Athlons more highly
[02:02] <nikkia> i had a 386DX-40
[02:03] <pax> AMD is making cheap fast quiet chips now
[02:04] <nikkia> the problem was, AMD didn't even tackle the issue that the VLB spec called for a max clock of 33MHz at the time
[02:04] <nikkia> so it was terribly unstable, and i blame AMD
[02:04] <nikkia> oddly, the 486DX-50 i replaced it with, didn't have the same issue
[02:04] <apokryphos> dual core sounds good
[02:04] <nikkia> (and it was a first gen DX50, not the crappier 2nd gen that was released at the same time as the DX66)
[02:05] <nikkia> most people didn't realise at the time, that there were two 486DX-50s, and the first-gen one was the best, it would outperform a DX66 for the most part
[02:05] <apokryphos> sounds like ancient talk to me; old indeed
[02:06] <nikkia> (first-gen had a 50Mhz FSB, second gen, and the DX-66 had clock doubling, so a 25Mhz and 33Mhz FSB)
[02:06] <nikkia> if you were IO bound, the DX-50 first gen would stomp all over the DX-66's slower FSB
[02:09] <nikkia> oh, i also owned a K5 P166+ at one point, another reason to hate AMD :P
[02:10] <apokryphos> nikkia: how many have you had in all? Computers?
[02:10] <apokryphos> We've had under 10, but that's only 'cos we've got a big family, really
[02:10] <nikkia> apok, hmmm, lets think, 5 :)
[02:11] <nikkia> erm, thats just x86 desktops
[02:11] <apokryphos> oh :-O. Less than I thought
[02:11] <nikkia> and its a bit deceptive, because each 'PC' went thru 2-3 motherboard/CPU combos :)
[02:12] <nikkia> + 4 laptops and  8 macs
[02:14] <apokryphos> wow; many macs
[02:16] <nikkia> apokryphos: an old quadra 900/950, a biege G3-300, 3 B&W G3s (2*350 + 1*400), a dual G4-866, and 2 333MHz iMacs
[02:17] <apokryphos> Wish I could remember the stats of ours; they were..... bad
[02:17] <apokryphos> though reasonable at the time. A "computer" -- wow.
[02:18] <nikkia> apokryphos: the 3 B&W G3s were the extravagance, they were all pretty much simultaneous purchases
[02:18] <apokryphos> why three?
[02:18] <nikkia> 1 as a server, 1 as a dedicated music workstation, and 1 (the 400) as my development machine
[02:18] <nikkia> the biege G3 was supposed to be the server, but it had a weird fault
[02:18] <apokryphos> heh. Real different user stations
[02:19] <nikkia> it would just lock up after a random amount of up-time, no matter what OS it was running
[02:19] <nikkia> never did work out why, although it stopped doing it near the end
[02:19] <apokryphos> 'bout time
[02:19] <apokryphos> We had a really bad computer as a server
[02:20] <apokryphos> tried to hide it away 'cos it would make an annoying sound. Ended up getting a router instead ;-)
[02:20] <nikkia> apokryphos: heh, our server between 1996 and 1999 was...
[02:21] <nikkia> an 'open' 486DX100 w/64MB of ram, running freebsd
[02:21] <Tm_lag> hi kids
[02:21] <nikkia> by open, i mean, the case was missing 3 of the sides :)
[02:22] <apokryphos> heh. I was just thinking... open-freebsd? 8)
[02:22] <nikkia> apokryphos: it also ran completly off my oldest slowest HDD :)
[02:22] <apokryphos> who stole the sides? Big mystery at work
[02:22] <nikkia> a 1GB SCSI drive that was manufactured in the mid 80s :)
[02:22] <nikkia> full height 5.25" :)
[02:23] <nikkia> apokryphos: istr that i removed the panels
[02:23] <nikkia> i THINK it was when the CPU fan died and i CBA to buy a new one
[02:24] <nikkia> either that, or when i had the problem that the floppy drive would only work if it was upside outside the case - and since freebsd didn't recognise my scsi drive, i had to boot the kernel from floppy :)
[02:24] <apokryphos> Heh
[02:25] <nikkia> apokryphos: good memory
[02:25] <apokryphos> indeed
[02:27] <nikkia> oh well, bedtime, i think
[02:29] <apokryphos> ok; 'night nikkia :)
[02:33] <fatbrain> Hello, what firewall application should I use?
[02:38] <teprrr>  /sb end
[02:38] <teprrr>  /sb end
[02:38] <teprrr> ew
[02:38] <teprrr> ye right
[02:38] <teprrr> pax, got x working.. the msic font path was changed :)
[02:48] <pax> teprrr: good for you; persistence pays eh
[02:52] <teprrr> pax, ye, well, I was going to sauna and drinking beer so I hadn't time to check this out earlier :)
[02:52] <teprrr> but that was easy one, nice to be back in kde :)
[02:52] <fatbrain> Hello, what firewall should I use?
[02:52] <teprrr> but gotta go to sleep, it's almost 4am.. nights
[02:52] <pax> teprrr: night :)
[02:53] <fatbrain> la la la...
[02:54] <pax> fatbrain: if you're looking for an easy to use iptables frontend, check out firestarter
[02:55] <luminerd> anyone here play flash games?
[02:55] <fatbrain> pax: I'm not looking for an easy to use (tho it would be neat) I'm looking for a very secure and wich uPnP support
[02:55] <luminerd> how do you do so
[02:56] <milksteak> uh
[02:56] <milksteak> flash should be in apt
[02:56] <pax> er this is kubuntu, should've suggested guarddog. try shorewall
[02:57] <luminerd> well
[02:57] <luminerd> I have flash
[02:57] <luminerd> but it doesn't actually work.
[02:57] <milksteak> hmmm
[02:57] <luminerd> I can view a flash, and press buttons and such,but if I press my arrow keys nothign happens
[02:57] <milksteak> in firefox?
[02:57] <luminerd> Yea
[02:57] <milksteak> hmmm
[02:58] <milksteak> well I can say I've had any problems with it
[02:58] <milksteak> so I can't really help
[02:58] <milksteak> sorry
[02:58] <luminerd> ...
[02:58] <luminerd> you have not had problems?
[02:58] <luminerd> That's crazy
[02:58] <milksteak> heh\
[02:58] <milksteak> not with flash
[02:58] <milksteak> well
[02:58] <luminerd> I've installed Linux like 12 times on dif. comps
[02:58] <milksteak> heh
[02:58] <luminerd> and every single time flash has not worked.
[02:58] <milksteak> hmmm
[02:59] <milksteak> flash works fine for me
[02:59] <luminerd> wow.
[02:59] <luminerd> how did you get it?
[02:59] <milksteak> apart from when i first installed it
[02:59] <milksteak> didn't have all the fonts
[02:59] <pax> flash games like what?
[02:59] <milksteak> couldn't see text
[02:59] <milksteak> fine now
[02:59] <luminerd> pax, anything that uses the arrow keys
[02:59] <milksteak> hmmm
[02:59] <milksteak> luminerd, link me to the game you're trying to play
[03:00] <luminerd> milksteak, http://newgrounds.com/portal/view/257289 but it won't work on any
[03:00] <luminerd> let me know if that has sound too, if it does my sound is also b0rked
[03:01] <pax> good games, thanks for the link, plays fine here
[03:02] <luminerd> crap.
[03:02] <milksteak> bleh
[03:02] <luminerd> pax, how did you fix it?
[03:02] <milksteak> not even loading for me
[03:02] <milksteak> but I'm guessing it's just my shitty connection
[03:03] <pax> luminerd: I didn't fix anything, did you check the wiki https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FlashPlayerStandalone
[03:03] <luminerd> CRAP.
[03:03] <luminerd> ok thanks :(
[03:04] <pax> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/RestrictedFormats
[03:04] <luminerd> my flash player's b0rked and it always has been on EVERY linux I've ever installed.  It just doesn't make any sense that no one else has that problem.
[03:04] <pax> luminerd: how did you install flash?
[03:05] <luminerd> pax, apt-get install flashplayer-mozilla
[03:05] <luminerd> pax, so you did a wine?
[03:06] <pax>     apt-get install flashplugin-nonfree
[03:06] <wilhelm> voila
[03:06] <pax> no, no wine involved, check the bottom of the page or simply https://wiki.ubuntu.com/RestrictedFormats and scroll down to Macromedia Flash
[03:06] <luminerd> will that work for mozilla?
[03:06] <luminerd> firefox that is?
[03:07] <luminerd> pax, will I have to ln something somewhere?
[03:07] <pax> luminerd: did you sudo apt-get install flashplugin-nonfree ?
[03:08] <luminerd> pax, yea, it's runnin
[03:08] <luminerd> done
[03:08] <pax> restart firefox and check if you can run that game
[03:08] <luminerd> Updating mozilla-firefox chrome registry...done.
[03:08] <luminerd> is that right?
[03:08] <luminerd> ok
[03:09] <luminerd> SWEET
[03:09] <luminerd> sound works
[03:10] <luminerd> GAME WORKS!
[03:10] <luminerd> yea!
[03:10] <luminerd> thankn you!
[03:10] <pax> np
[03:11] <milksteak> hmmm
[03:11] <luminerd> dang
[03:11] <milksteak> no work for me
[03:11] <milksteak> well
[03:11] <milksteak> sound
[03:11] <luminerd> cursor still must be on the flash
[03:11] <milksteak> but arrow keys do nothing
[03:12] <luminerd> but better than nothin
[03:27] <derelm> in kubuntus kde shutdown dialog one can choose which os to boot next time (grub config). is that a standard kde feature, that should work right out of the box on any distro or is that a kubuntu extension? can anyone tell me?
[03:33] <beford> http://www.canllaith.org/svn-features/images/kde4-02.png
[03:33] <pussfeller> gstreamer0.8-faad: Depends: libc6 (>= 2.3.2.ds1-21)
[03:33] <pussfeller> what does that mean
[03:33] <beford> you need to install libc6 too
[03:34] <pussfeller> what is that
[03:35] <beford> a librarie
[03:36] <pussfeller> but 2.3.2.ds1-20ubuntu13 is to be installed
[03:36] <pussfeller> and it says its uptodate
[03:38] <beford> well
[03:38] <beford> install it
[03:39] <beford> apt-get install libc6
[03:41] <jeffbrown> is there a package update applet type thing that will check periodically to see if any installed packages are out of date?
[03:54] <pax> yes, sudo update-manager
[03:54] <pl_ice> hi, anyone can help me with my route tables?
[04:18] <orkid> Hi, does anyone have an idea why kcm won't connect to DCOPserver? It tells me that Authentication failed... It then goes into the dialog that I called up in the first place (Adjust Date & Time) but any time zone changes are not permanent. Any ideas?
[04:30] <troy> does there exist an installable developer version of breezy? or is apt the way to test things out?
[04:35] <pax> troy: ftp://cdimage.ubuntulinux.org/cdimage/releases/breezy/colony-2/breezy-live-i386.iso
[05:00] <troy> don't want the live disk, want the install - but thanks :)
[05:01] <troy> I need a kernel newer than that in hoary in order to install to my SATA disk - so I'll install breezy, and fool around with it
[05:01] <pax> ftp://cdimage.ubuntulinux.org/cdimage/releases/breezy/colony-2/breezy-install-i386.iso
[05:16] <troy> what's the difference between colony-2 and the daily builds?
[06:22] <torz> hmmm just installed VLC and the fullscreen mode is bung. All it does is maximize the window from what I can see. Any suggestions?
[06:25] <HgaaAFK> who knows how to hack..?
[06:26] <torz> you mean lame things like buffer overflows?
[06:26] <HgaaAFK> get into someones sytem..
[06:26] <torz> its gay, dont even bother looking into things like that.
[06:27] <HgaaAFK> nooo
[06:37] <pussfeller> which package has mysql_cxonfig
[06:37] <pussfeller> mysql_config
[08:22] <UyCaRumBa> :O
[08:28] <mijndert> :O
[08:28] <mijndert> hi
[09:41] -hifriend:#kubuntu- lol g, join #bantown and get banned u fuqn JEWS [SOLLOG KNEW BANTOWN WOULD WIN] . #kubuntu SUCKS
[09:45] <CyberMad> hi, does kubuntu support dreamweavers crossoffice?
[09:46] <CyberMad> from www.dreamweavers.com
[09:46] <PieD> dreamweavers crossoffice ?
[09:47] <CyberMad> yes..
[09:47] <CyberMad> a commercial version of wine
[09:47] <Bubbling_Zombie> i think crossover is kind of universal
[09:47] <PieD> I know codeweavers crossoffice
[09:47] <PieD> but not dreamweavers crossoffice
[09:47] <[Surge] > :)
[09:48] <CyberMad> yes, but i just want to know if crossoffice already run very well on kubuntu
[09:48] <PieD> it'll work
[09:48] <CyberMad> codeweavers ;(
[09:48] <CyberMad> i mean that
[09:48] <PieD> if you have said crossoffice only, I'd have answered immediately
[09:48] <CyberMad> hahaha... sorry d00d
[09:49] <PieD> but that's insulting for codeweavers to tell they are "dreamweavers"
[09:49] <PieD> dreamweavers doesn't support opensource !
[09:49] <CyberMad> get accidently exchanged with macromedia :((
[09:49] <CyberMad> lol
[09:50] <CyberMad> once more question, does kubuntu support NAT, i want to make an internet sharing for some pc
[09:51] <hussam> anybody's used Knetstats?
[09:51] <PieD> CyberMad: without any problem off course !
[09:51] <[Surge] > Yeah NAT is no problem on any linux distro
[09:52] <[Surge] > Although personally I recommend a separate firewall running something like IPCop or Smoothwall
[09:52] <[Surge] > Aimed at that sort of task and easy to setup
[09:52] <CyberMad> hehe.. thanks2 i'm newbie in linux :) i would use linux as my main os and windows just for backup
[09:52] <PieD> windows for backup ???
[09:53] <CyberMad> sorry wrong english lang :(
[09:53] <PieD> you mean saving datas ?
[09:53] <CyberMad> i'm working on visual studio .net
[09:53] <PieD> :/
[09:53] <[Surge] > Hissss ...
[09:53] <PieD> (I hate .net)
[09:53] <CyberMad> i read from crossoffice forum and not support it
[09:54] <PieD> you can still use qemu (with its kernel module for speed)
[09:54] <CyberMad> :( yeah.. just my job demand
[09:54] <PieD> you install win2000 in qemu, then visual studio in win2000 in qemu
[09:54] <CyberMad> what is qemu, is it like vmware?
[09:54] <PieD> but that may be a bit slow (one of my friend is going to test that shortly)
[09:54] <PieD> like vmware, but different :)
[09:55] <[Surge] > CyberMad: Yes
[09:55] <PieD> vmware is a virtualiser (is that the right word ?)
[09:55] <PieD> while qemu is an emulator
[09:55] <CyberMad> i will try it.. :)
[09:55] <PieD> qemu is able to emulate PPC systems on x86 systems
[09:55] <[Surge] > qemu is OpenSource as far as I know. VMWare is proprietry.
[09:55] <PieD> while vmware is only able to emulate x86 on x86
[09:55] <CyberMad> PieD wow...
[09:55] <CyberMad> ^^
[09:56] <PieD> qemu supports 4 architectures
[09:56] <PieD> (sparc, arm, ppc and x86)
[09:56] <PieD> sorry : 5 (I forgot x86_64)
[09:57] <CyberMad> what is the site anyway? (qemu)..
[09:57] <PieD> fabrice.bellart.free.fr
[09:57] <CyberMad> thanks..
[09:57] <PieD> no
[09:58] <PieD> my memory is wrong
[09:58] <PieD> http://fabrice.bellart.free.fr
[09:58] <PieD> bellarD and not bellarT
[09:58] <CyberMad> nice help in this community :)
[09:58] <[Surge] > Smart Frenchmen
[09:59] <CyberMad> http://fabrice.bellard.free.fr/qemu/
[10:00] <CyberMad> hmm.. so i think i don't need crossoffice? because all windows apps can run smoothly on qemu, right?
[10:00] <PieD> not as smoothly as with crossoffice
[10:00] <PieD> but crossoffice uses the opensource project wine !
[10:01] <PieD> ho, I forgot : .net is available under linux through mono
[10:01] <CyberMad> what is mono? sorry many question -_-
[10:01] <PieD> and the mono folks are working on a development environment
[10:02] <PieD> mono is a .net implementation for linux :)
[10:03] <PieD> http://www.mono-project.com/Main_Page
[10:03] <PieD> and http://www.monodevelop.com/
[10:04] <PieD> but I think .net is bad (while Java is great)
[10:04] <PieD> (but still not as great as python :)
[10:04] <CyberMad> ok
[10:04] <CyberMad> :D
[10:04] <CyberMad> thanks PieD for ur valuable information
[10:05] <[Surge] > I still haven't figured out what .net or mono are all about.  Have yet to see an app that uses it,
[10:07] <PieD> mono is only a .net implementation
[10:07] <PieD> microsoft calls his implementation .net
[10:08] <JakubS_> [Surge] : see some gnome apps,  all their devs drool over .net and mono
[10:08] <PieD> .net provides a class library
[10:08] <CyberMad> so do i, but at least for me this is make me sure that linux is the best choice
[10:08] <PieD> and a kind of language abstraction layer
[10:08] <PieD> so every language will be compiled to a sort of bytecode
[10:09] <PieD> and thanks to that bytecode, a python.net program is able to use a VB.net class
[10:10] <PieD> but what I don't like with .net is that every language is downgraded to a kind of common capabilities
[10:10] <PieD> personally, I think every language needs its own classes to reflect the language capabilities
[10:11] <CyberMad> PieD do you how to programming PocketPC apps in linux?
[10:11] <PieD> I don't know
[10:11] <PieD> pocketpc is causing troubles under linux :/
[10:12] <CyberMad> PieD do you mean the Active Sync?
[10:12] <PieD> undocumented protocol
[10:12] <PieD> yes
[10:12] <PieD> activesync is a proprietary and undocumented protocol from microsoft
[10:12] <CyberMad> my friend already do the activesycn with PocketPC on linux
[10:12] <CyberMad> www.bigwisu.com
[10:12] <PieD> ?
[10:12] <PieD> my friends were not able to do that 
[10:13] <CyberMad> he can sync his PocketPC contacts with ximian
[10:13] <CyberMad> but not for installing apps hehe
[10:13] <PieD> "Koneksi dan sinkronisasi sebuah Pocket PC dengan Desktop Linux"
[10:14] <PieD> What language is it ??
[10:14] <PieD> CyberMad: that's what I said : it's not full featured under linux
[10:14] <PieD> if you know the activesync protocol, then help projects implementing it under linux !
[10:14] <CyberMad> indonesia
[10:15] <CyberMad> hehe.. just if...
[10:15] <CyberMad> :)
[10:16] <PieD> or something easier to do : implement usb support in qemu :)
[10:35] <[Surge] > Sheesh ... kubuntu's default install doesn't include cvs? Definately catered towards noobs.  :)
[10:37] <seaLne> [Surge] : well you can't fit everything on 1 cd :)
[10:38] <seaLne> its on the dvd version
[10:45] <_frank> i would like to create a local mirror of the universe component (i will be away from any broadband for some time). which parts of the repository do i have to mirror?
[11:25] <luminerd_> What is, in your opinion, the BEST CPU you can buy?  What's the best make?  For fastness, that is, not a server, but a personal computer...the fastest you can get?
[11:26] <buz> athlon64 x2 4800
[11:26] <buz> costs like 1000$ though
[11:26] <buz> it's stupid to buy that really
[11:26] <luminerd_> buz, I see...
[11:27] <luminerd_> buz, ok, what barebone system can I get (no case just parts) for $500?  Emphasis on processor and ram?
[11:27] <buz> amd athlon64 3000+ with board and ram
[11:27] <buz> nothing fancy
[11:28] <buz> but more than good enough for most everythig
[11:28] <Cool^19m> i installed the server version of Kubuntu ie without KDE etc etc....now i'm trying to install X.....any guide as to how?....i managed to get to the X core files..in fact X does start...but i get errors saying there is no Xsession
[11:29] <seaLne> try installing kubuntu-desktop to get all the X and KDE stuff
[11:30] <jpatrick> he doesn't want KDE
[11:30] <Cool^19m> isnt that: sudo apt-get install kdesktop?
[11:30] <jpatrick> no
[11:30] <Cool^19m> the packages do get installed....yet i need X ;)
[11:30] <jpatrick> sudo apt-get install kubuntu-desktop
[11:30] <Cool^19m> i'd rather not have KDE though
[11:31] <jpatrick> well then what?
[11:31] <Cool^19m> i need X alone for now
[11:31] <buz> apt-get install xorg?
[11:32] <Cool^19m> buz: not sure if that will work....do i need to dpkg some stuff?
[11:32] <jpatrick> no :-/
[11:32] <buz> no idea
[11:32] <buz> i'd get kubuntu-desktop ;)
[11:32] <buz> doesnt really hurt
[11:32] <buz> takes some space but that's about it
[11:32] <Cool^19m> buz: but i dont want all the extra little proggies with KDE
[11:32] <Cool^19m> :)
[11:33] <jpatrick> then remove them later
[11:33] <Cool^19m> i'm trying to do that in reverse lol :D
[11:33] <buz> get linux from scratch
[11:33] <buz> or slackware
[11:33] <Cool^19m> no no :)
[11:33] <Cool^19m> i love ubuntu :D
[11:34] <Cool^19m> i just want to learn a little more rather than just go the easy way and install the default desktop
[11:34] <Cool^19m> for once i'm starting to like the console
[11:34] <Cool^19m> btw....m ynick
[11:34] <Cool^19m> *my nick
[11:34] <LuNaTiK^GuY> u mite recognize me now :D
[11:35] <jpatrick> oh wahey
[11:35] <LuNaTiK^GuY> lol
[11:35] <jpatrick> :p
[11:36] <LuNaTiK^GuY> i should try kubuntu-desktop then?
[11:36] <LuNaTiK^GuY> and remove stuff
[11:36] <LuNaTiK^GuY> hmmm
[11:36] <LuNaTiK^GuY> okiees
[11:36] <LuNaTiK^GuY> as long as it works
[11:36] <LuNaTiK^GuY> i want it to be as LEAN and CLEAN as possible
[11:37] <seaLne> probably simplest but overkill if you don't actually want it all
[11:37] <buz> i wouldnt use kubuntu then
[11:37] <LuNaTiK^GuY> i love KDE as a window manager
[11:37] <LuNaTiK^GuY> i just dont like most of the little proggies that come with it
[11:38] <LuNaTiK^GuY> i want it to be that : One media player, one burner, one browser thingy
[11:38] <LuNaTiK^GuY> etc etc
[11:38] <seaLne> you might get away with installing "kde"
[11:38] <LuNaTiK^GuY> sudo apt-get install kde?
[11:38] <LuNaTiK^GuY> that it?
[11:38] <seaLne> yeah
[11:39] <dsmink> ?
[11:39] <seaLne> read what its going to install should be a lot less than kubuntu-desktop
[11:39] <LuNaTiK^GuY> and will it find X as a dependancy?
[11:39] <seaLne> should
[11:39] <LuNaTiK^GuY> thanks
[11:39] <LuNaTiK^GuY> exactly wot i wanted :D
[11:40] <LuNaTiK^GuY> i'll go try it out :D
[11:40] <LuNaTiK^GuY> thanks a lot guys
[11:40] <LuNaTiK^GuY> and GALS
[11:40] <LuNaTiK^GuY> coz last time i got BITTEN for being so masculine ;)
[11:40] <LuNaTiK^GuY> lol
[11:40] <LuNaTiK^GuY> cyaa
[11:51] <Aapzak> goodday people
[12:07] <hussam> will Kubuntu ever get a bootsplash like other distros?
[12:08] <seaLne> hussam: there is talk about it
[12:09] <[Surge] > I prefer text. I can see what's happening but I suppose it means nothing to Windows users anyway
[12:13] <lovelypenguin> I'm making a symlink /dev/modem to point to a tty in /dev and it works until I reboot and the modem link to a tty is gone. I've tried placing it there with sudo and changing to the root user, neither survives reboot. Why not?
[12:13] <hussam> [Surge] : a boot splash will still enable you to press a key to see the text.
[12:13] <nikkia> woohoo, Quake 3 source code to be release RSN
[12:14] <nikkia> lovelypenguin: thats because modern distros don't use a static /dev
[12:14] <nikkia> lovelypenguin: best advice, is to read up on writing udev rules, and create a rule that produces a symlink for your modem
[12:15] <nikkia> lovelypenguin: /dev on most modern distros is actually a tiny ramdisk, and hotplug+udev produce all the device nodes as they are created by the kernel
[12:15] <lovelypenguin> nikkia: thank you for kind advice, sounds like it not a simple solution then, no step by step simple process? if modern distro why then is it more complicated requiring reading? before I could sudo and ln -s /dev/modem /dev/ttywhatever
[12:15] <nikkia> lovelypenguin: its not 'simple' but its not hideously complicated
[12:15] <lovelypenguin> nikkia: thank you for kind information
[12:16] <lovelypenguin> nikkia: ah ha I see now
[12:16] <lovelypenguin> nikkia: thank you I be looking for answer in instruction manuals then
[12:16] <nikkia> lovelypenguin: the reasoning is, to produce a static /dev directory that matches *all* supported hardware results in a /dev that has thousands upon thousands of dev nodes
[12:16] <nikkia> by using udev+hotplug, only the device nodes relevant to your system are created
[12:16] <lovelypenguin> so this is new in 2.6 kernels?
[12:17] <nikkia> lovelypenguin: pretty much, yes
[12:17] <nikkia> lovelypenguin: it replaces devfs
[12:17] <nikkia> lovelypenguin: i don't have a modem rule, but here's my /dev/cdrw rule to give you an idea:
[12:17] <nikkia> BUS="ide", KERNEL="hdd", NAME="%k", SYMLINK+="cdrw cdroms/cdrom%n"
[12:18] <nikkia> lovelypenguin: and a more complex example that shows why this system is great:
[12:18] <nikkia> BUS="scsi", SYSFS{model}=="iPod*", KERNEL="sd?2", NAME="%k", SYMLINK="ipod"
[12:18] <lovelypenguin> wow
[12:18] <lovelypenguin> that sound pretty much better than old way of /dev
[12:18] <nikkia> (which automatically generates a /dev/ipod  node that points to the second partition on whichever scsi device represents my ipod
[12:19] <lovelypenguin> so I have been placing symlinks on a ramdisk then? why did I not think of this 
[12:19] <lovelypenguin> I laugh now at this
[12:19] <lovelypenguin> and thank you for kind advice
[12:19] <nikkia> so if i plug my ipod in then boot, the ipod is /dev/sda*, so /dev/ipod points to /dev/sda2, but if i unplug it, and boot, then my memory card reader gets sda, and the ipod will be sdb2, but that rule ensures that /dev/ipod points to /dev/sdb2 in that situation
[12:19] <lovelypenguin> I was doing it dumb old way I see now
[12:20] <nikkia> lovelypenguin: it really is a more flexible situation with udev, but as you can see, it requires a little bit more work...
[12:20] <lovelypenguin> yes but it sound like it worth the trouble
[12:21] <nikkia> lovelypenguin: for a modem, its going to be easy, just something like "KERNEL="ttyS0"  SYMLINK+="modem"
[12:21] <lovelypenguin> wow I thank you for this help and your wonderful examples, you help a lot very kind!!
[12:22] <lovelypenguin> i now know not to attempt symlinks in /dev in new distros
[12:23] <lovelypenguin> nikkia: be sure that I thank you now for this help
[12:32] <nikkia> working on a freaking saturday is evil :(
[12:42] <granden> Is it possible to install kubuntu and get rid of the visual login manager and kde and use fluxbox?
[01:31] <jpatrick> Any way I can make Monday start the week in Kontact?
[01:32] <[Surge] > Why would you want to do that? That's like having a special calendar.
[01:34] <Timmmm> Hi, what is the default root password in (k)ubunutu? It never asked me for it in the install...
[01:36] <Poromies> well, you dont have root enabled as default
[01:36] <Poromies> use sudo to do root commands
[01:36] <jpatrick> [Surge] : Because I want it like that :p
[01:37] <Poromies> i.e. if you would like to mount all drives as a root, type "sudo mount -a" in the terminal, and it will ask for your password and then execute the command with as root
[01:37] <Timmmm> Ah.. nm - kynaptic was asking for my root password. Worked with my normal user password though... Someone should change the prompt :-)
[01:38] <Poromies> yea
[01:40] <[Surge] > Timmmm: kynaptic only needs the user password of the user you created when you installed. It runs with sudo
[01:40] <[Surge] > But it caught me off guard too.
[01:41] <[Surge] > I am accustomed to Mandrake urpmi asking for root password
[01:42] <nikkia> jpatrick: i think you need to set your locale to a locale that has monday as the start of the week
[01:43] <nikkia> actually, no, you should be able to change it in kcontrol without changing locale
[01:43] <nikkia> jpatrick: its in Regional & Accessibility/Country/Region & Language/Time & Dates
[01:46] <nikkia> and indeed, that changes the week layout in kontact
[02:01] <erb> hello
[02:04] <Poromies> anyone know when the 64bit KDE 3.4.2 will be coming to repos?
[02:05] <Poromies> been waiting for a while now :/
[02:08] <_tobias> how can i select one sound-device as the standard sound-device? amarok plays on my onboard-sound and vlc plays on my 5.1 pci card... at least i wont both applications to play only on one card... any chance to get a hint where to change such settings?
[02:09] <Poromies> search ubuntu forums and wiki, i think i've seen something about that there
[02:11] <jpatrick> Thanks nikkia
[02:11] <nikkia> np
[02:24] <nxv_> hi, i did an update upgrade recently and now kopete doesn't connect anymore, has anybody else this problem?
[02:43] <jpatrick> wb
[02:45] <Timmmm> Hi, kmail *keeps* asking me if I want it to store my password. Everytime I close it (or kontact) it asks "Kwallet is not available (it is really) Do you want kmail to store your password in an insecure format...." and no matter what I do, the next time I close kmail it asks me again! Argh. 
[02:46] <Timmmm> Also, storing anything on IMAP servers doesn't work, and kontact messes up weirdly if kmail asks you for your password (you have to close the password window, and then it reappears and the second time you can actually type in it).
[03:00] <Festnetz> Hi! I added a new user with "adduser". But the new user has not got sound. Why?
[03:01] <thoreauputic> Festnetz: because you need to add the new user to the "audio" group
[03:02] <thoreauputic> Festnetz: and probably a bunch of other groups as well
[03:02] <thoreauputic> for other stuff
[03:02] <Festnetz> How to add the new user to the audio-group?
[03:03] <Festnetz> How to do this?
[03:03] <Festnetz> I there a better way to add a new user?
[03:03] <apokryphos> Oh, it hurts.
[03:03] <Festnetz> Is
[03:03] <thoreauputic> sudo adduser newuser audio
[03:04] <Festnetz> Of wich groups should the new user be a member, too?
[03:05] <thoreauputic> Festnetz: compare with the groups the ol user is in (except admin which is for sudoers only)
[03:05] <thoreauputic> s/ol/old
[03:06] <thoreauputic> note that the new user must logout/in for the chabges to take effect
[03:07] <thoreauputic> bah s/chabges/changes
[03:11] <iZi> now this was rather nice
[03:35] <nikkia> Festnetz: i find kuser is quite nice for adding/changing users/groups
[03:48] <cazon> help me!
[03:50] <cazon> hello?
[03:52] <Raptoid> selam
[03:58] <apokryphos> cazon: no-one can help without knowing the problem
[03:59] <cazon> I already install kubuntu but starts in shell session, do not start the graphic session (by the way is the first time I've install linux)
[04:00] <apokryphos> cazon: after you've entered your username/pass, if you try hitting "startx" what does it say?
[04:00] <uniq_> nikkia: yes, now i am.
[04:00] <nikkia> uniq, good grief :p
[04:01] <nikkia> uniq:can you do me a quick favour, and try hitting my IPv6 address with ssh with some ficticious username 3-4 times ?
[04:01] <uniq> sure.
[04:01] <nikkia> i want to see if my ssh blocking script works
[04:02] <cazon> appears some lines with "Warning: font renderer" then could not init font path element unix/:7100
[04:03] <uniq> nikkia: Password:
[04:03] <nikkia> uniq, try now :P
[04:03] <jesusfish> crimsun: would you happen to have a beta3 deb for amaroK?  I know you posted beta2
[04:04] <cazon> [apokryphos]  "Could not start ksmserver, check your installation" (i don't know what to do) i'm new in linux
[04:04] <jesusfish> or anyone else know of an amaroK 1.3-beta3 deb for Hoary?
[04:04] <apokryphos> hm
[04:04] <nikkia> uniq, the script should have blacklisted you via iptables by now, so it should just hang trying to connect
[04:05] <uniq> Password: :)
[04:05] <jpatrick> cazon: I would think reinstalling would be a good idea
[04:05] <nikkia> uniq, hmmm
[04:05] <uniq> retrying with new username.
[04:05] <cazon> :(
[04:06] <nikkia> uniq, oh, i think i see why :/
[04:06] <nikkia> ip6tables is writing the interface wrong
[04:06] <apokryphos> cazon: do you have an nvidia card?
[04:06] <nikkia> uniq, try connecting NOW :)
[04:07] <cazon> mmm.. noup
[04:07] <nikkia> uniq: it was writing the rules for eth0, but of course, with ipv6 you don't come from eth0, you come from a tunnel device
[04:07] <apokryphos> cazon: ATI?
[04:07] <cazon> I install kubuntu in my laptop (toshiba satellite) intel graphics (integrated)
[04:07] <nikkia> uniq: yeah, its dropped 11 packets from you now :)
[04:08] <uniq> no Password: yet..
[04:08] <nikkia> uniq, yeah, its dropping packets now
[04:08] <nikkia> 3   236 DROP       tcp      *      *       3ffe:80ee:31fe::33/128  ::/0               tcp dpt:22
[04:09] <apokryphos> cazon: I could only speculate on the problem; if you don't get a response from anyone in here, you might wanna try #ubuntu -- probably better for non-kde related issues
[04:09] <uniq> cazon: is this hoary? 
[04:11] <cazon> ah?
[04:11] <apokryphos> cazon: what does cat /etc/issue give?
[04:12] <cazon> i will install again and if I had another problem then i return here
[04:12] <apokryphos> cazon: wait, you might not need to :). What does that command give?
[04:12] <cazon> hehe
[04:13] <cazon> hehehe it's done... the installation it's running
[05:09] <_stef> hello world :-)
[05:10] <Kamping_Kaiser> hi
[05:10] <thoreauputic> bash: hello world - command not found 
[05:10] <thoreauputic> ;)
[05:11] <_stef> hahaha
[05:12] <_stef> Im going to a party tonight
[05:12] <thoreauputic> _stef: time to recompile ;-)
[05:12] <_stef> Is someone else located in germany?
[05:14] <_stef> thoreauputic: But not all the day ;-)
[05:17] <_stef> ohh yeah Im going now to buy 2 bottles wine and than up to the party with alot of punks. some punks here?
[05:18] <_stef> or punkrockers?
[05:21] <_stef> Okay, party on!!!! ;-) 
[05:22] <thoreauputic> heh - I drank too much of it before typing...
[05:22] <thoreauputic> s/chmapagne/champagne
[05:22] <_stef> super
[05:23] <thoreauputic> wow htat'sh g0od chmpange !

[05:24] <_stef> thoreauputic: where are you located? COme , we go together to great party evening!
[05:24] <thoreauputic> _stef: you get to pay the 'plane fare ;) Australia ;)
[05:26] <_stef> ups.. no money! :-( .. hmmm its not so far, or only 12h, or? If you go now you can here to the morning party ;-)
[05:26] <buz> more like 20h flight
[05:26] <_stef> what? ups
[05:26] <buz> and since you will have stop over, i doubt its doable in less than 24h
[05:27] <thoreauputic> _stef: My swimming isn't as good as it used to be.... could take a while to get there ;-)
[05:27] <troy> hey, if I have a breezy cd in one drive and a hoary disk in another, can I boot from the breezy kernel and use the hoary disk as root?
[05:28] <_stef> thoreauputic: hmmm do you have other important things to do?
[05:28] <thoreauputic> _stef: well, sleeping comes to mind :)
[05:29] <_stef> okay, may we see us again. I have also to move, bye :-)
[05:30] <_stef> tomorrow?
[05:30] <thoreauputic> _stef: enjoy the party !
[05:31] <_stef> yeahhhhn Iwill do that!!!, good luck to all and a good sleep for you thoreauputic
[05:31] <thoreauputic> :)
[05:47] <apokryphos> Gonna try out Alpha ;-). bbl
[05:50] <nikkia> poor apok
[05:50] <Tm_T> uh
[05:50] <nikkia> someone should have told him before he broke his connection, that his ISP's DNS servers aren't working :P
[05:55] <Tm_T> nikkia: :p
[05:55] <nikkia> actually, they seem to be working again, now
[05:56] <Tm_T> damn :(
[05:56] <jake1> has anyone here seeing the movie Godsend?
[06:10] <Tm_T> nope
[06:12] <Rogue_Jedi_X> !list cinelerra
[06:12] <ubotu> Rogue_Jedi_X: Bugger all, i dunno
[06:12] <Rogue_Jedi_X> Dang
[06:25] <jpatrick> what is it?
[06:38] <aGNUstic> Hello everyone
[06:41] <jpatrick> hi
[06:42] <Tm_T> killkilldiedie
[06:43] <Tm_T> I mean, hello
[06:56] <aGNUstic> Do I need to ignore Tim T or is he only joking.
[06:57] <aGNUstic> This is my first time in the #Kibuntu chat rrom.
[06:57] <aGNUstic> Kubuntu
[06:58] <jpatrick> he's only joking
[06:58] <jpatrick> o.O I think
[07:00] <aGNUstic> k
[07:00] <aGNUstic> ty
[07:03] <nvidhive> this may be a dumb question
[07:03] <nvidhive> but where is the update manager that the regular install of kubuntu has?
[07:04] <nvidhive> I don't mean the package manager either
[07:04] <nvidhive> eeer.. I mean the regular install of ubuntu.. not kubuntu
[07:04] <jpatrick> I don't think it has one
[07:04] <jpatrick> ah ubuntu
[07:04] <nvidhive> jpatrick: you know what I am referring to?
[07:04] <jpatrick> yes
[07:06] <nvidhive> so it is not in kubuntu?
[07:06] <nvidhive> how do I update like I would normally in ubuntu
[07:06] <nvidhive> sorry to seem so dense
[07:06] <aGNUstic> Does Kubuntu use apt-get?
[07:06] <jpatrick> aGNUstic: yes
[07:07] <nvidhive> because if I am not mistaken.. a bunch of updates for ubuntu were out yesterday
[07:08] <jpatrick> :-/
[07:09] <nvidhive> uh-oh.. I am getting the whck-face...
[07:09] <aGNUstic> jpatrick: ty. It may be a stupid question. I am a Slackware-KDE user. I dwiddled around with Ubuntu a while back. I am downloading all the Kubuntu/Ubuntu Live/Install CD images. I knew Ubuntu was Debian-based but I wasn't sure how it was wired for updates. 
[07:10] <jpatrick> repositories
[07:11] <aGNUstic> Straight from the Debian repositories or from the Ubuntu ones.
[07:12] <jpatrick> Ubuntu
[07:12] <aGNUstic> ty
[07:12] <jpatrick> Debian ones might break your system
[07:12] <aGNUstic> Heh
[07:13] <aGNUstic> An image of sticking a Porche engine into a Volkwagen just came to my mind.
[07:16] <aGNUstic> Are there any Kubuntu users using this distro in a production environment?
[07:17] <buz> as desktop yes
[07:17] <aGNUstic> :-)
[07:18] <nvidhive> I am attempting to
[07:18] <nvidhive> trying to get wireless working atm
[07:18] <nvidhive> however.. it seems like updates may be easier to manage if I just install ubuntu and then add kde..
[07:19] <nvidhive> I am searching forums atm
[07:19] <nvidhive> any suggests?
[07:19] <nvidhive> although I must say.. kudos to the project devs... kubuntu is teh sweetness
[07:26] <nvidhive> ok..
[07:27] <nvidhive> I am about to prepare for a suicide leeming test
[07:27] <nvidhive> I will use kynaptics to add the update gnome update manager and notifier
[07:27] <nvidhive> wish me luck
[07:28] <nvidhive> ._.
[07:28] <nvidhive> .-.
[07:29] <jpatrick> _
[07:29] <nvidhive> is this a bad idea?
[07:29] <nvidhive> cuz I already pushed the button that says do not press
[07:29] <nvidhive> :D
[07:30] <jpatrick> cross your fingers
[07:30] <nvidhive> I just figured the update manager would point to the same repositories.. and then I should pick carefully what to apply
[07:37] <nvidhive> meh
[07:38] <nvidhive> well it doesn't crash the system that way.. but it doesn't werk
[07:38] <nvidhive> so test succesfully lemming safe
[07:38] <nvidhive> :)
[07:39] <nvidhive> oh its trying to run gksudo!
[07:39] <nvidhive> duh!
[07:39] <nvidhive> :(
[07:43] <der__oschni> hihoo
[07:50] <nvidhive> oooga!
[07:50] <nvidhive> yuss!
[07:50] <nvidhive> hey... uh who was it
[07:50] <nvidhive> ?
[07:51] <nvidhive> aGNUstic: you can get the Update Manager to werk I think
[07:51] <nvidhive> but you have to run it manually as root
[07:51] <nvidhive> although I think I will use apt-get and use the repositories.. i just wanted a comprehensive list of what needed to be updated
[07:52] <nvidhive> I don't know if this helps
[08:19] <EasterSunshine> hey, where is the option the decrease the horizontal spacing between icons in konqueror, as well as the rest of kde?
[08:43] <_ubuntu> ddd
[09:12] <_neil> hi
[09:13] <_neil> i'm trying to add a printer using kubuntu, but apparently cups access by http don't work...
[09:14] <_neil> so i also tried "settings:/Peripherals/" in konqueror
[09:14] <_neil> then "printers" but the program die when i try to Add a printer
[09:14] <_neil> (on ppc kubuntu 5.04)
[09:14] <_neil> (freeze not die)
[09:15] <_neil> oh, now it seems to work sorry (after xxxx trials)
[09:19] <jpatrick> try: print:/
[09:20] <person> is there a way to automatically set up internet in kubuntu instead of entering all the ip adresses and host names and such
[09:20] <person> its alreayd installed
[09:20] <person> btw
[09:20] <jpatrick> dchp
[09:20] <person> whats taht
[09:21] <jpatrick> It automatically detects the network
[09:21] <person> what does it stand for?
[09:21] <jpatrick> look it up on: www,wikipedia.org
[09:22] <jpatrick> www.wikipedia.org
[09:22] <person> k
[09:22] <person> it didnt work when it ried it during installation though
[09:23] <jpatrick> You have to have it set up first
[09:24] <person> oh
[09:24] <jpatrick> I don't know how to set it up tho
[09:25] <person> dont u have to set it up on the server
[09:25] <jpatrick> no idea
[09:25] <person> hmm
[09:25] <person> is taht the onyl way?
[09:25] <jpatrick> i prefer to put the numbers in
[09:26] <jpatrick> keeps other people out
[09:26] <person> i dotn no where ot get them thoguh
[09:27] <person> so kubuntu cant autodetect all the numbers?
[09:28] <person> my mac and pc do taht and mandrake did that whn i had it
[09:28] <person> hmmmmm
[09:28] <person> o well
[09:28] <person> tahnks anyway
[09:28] <jpatrick> :-/
[09:49] <luminousnerd> Hello?
[09:50] <luminousnerd> Anyone around here use mondo?
[09:54] <slow-motion> when i had kubuntu installed the first time, then it shows me the first picture from a video when i leave the mouse longer on the file. after an update that was lost. how can i get it back?
[09:56] <slow-motion> i tried many options in the konqueror konfiguration menu but nothing helps
[10:00] <Vectrox> after what update, did you upgrade to KDE 3.4.2 ?
[10:00] <loren> Q: Where's the file located that cyou add your domain name to
[10:02] <luminousnerd> Okay, well, what I want to do is completely duplicate the system I'm on now to 19 others.  I will do this with CD-Rs.  How can I make a bootable CD with all of my computer data, that I can just stick on a currently Windows machine and write exactly what I have?
[10:03] <loadquo> luminous: Don't know exactly, but I would start by modifying a live-cd and learning more about the dd command 
 after what update, did you upgrade to KDE 3.4.2 ? < no, some upgrade after the installation. i dont remember to what version. but i lost the kubuntu theme and the thing with the videos with that update
[10:04] <slow-motion> at the moment i run KDE 3.4.2
[10:05] <slow-motion> still without the kubuntu theme and the video thing
[10:05] <Vectrox> slow-motion: So you did upgrade to KDE 3.4.2.. Are you using Breezy or Hoary ?
[10:05] <slow-motion> hoary
[10:05] <slow-motion> i had the thing already lost before 3.4.2
[10:05] <Vectrox> pretty strange that the picture with the videos just dissapeard..
[10:06] <Vectrox> oo
[10:06] <Vectrox> So even before the upgrade youve lost that ?
[10:06] <loadquo> I asked this over at debian mentors but didn't get a response, so I thought I would try here: I am making an application with something I want to install in /etc/ in a .deb file and under /usr/local/etc in my normal tar.gz of the source. Is there a standard way of doing this in an automake project?
[10:06] <slow-motion> it was this preview popup. with pictures it still works, but with videos never
 So even before the upgrade youve lost that ? < yes. i remember that it was a very common update at this time and everyone was complaining about loosing the kubuntu theme with it
[10:08] <Vectrox> from which source did you upgrade ?
[10:08] <slow-motion> i really dont know
[10:08] <slow-motion> it was an update
[10:08] <slow-motion> long ago
[10:09] <slow-motion> (in a galaxy far away...if youz want)
[10:09] <Vectrox> pretty strange.. you should contact ubuntuforums.org and ask that issue there..
[10:09] <Vectrox> maybe that will help
[10:09] <slow-motion> i only remember i lost the kubuntu theme and the video preview picture.
[10:11] <slow-motion> ok thanks anyway Vectrox 
[10:12] <luminousnerd> cdrecord --scanbus isn't workign that's my problem!
[10:13] <ms12> anyone using enlightenment
[10:17] <Rogue_Jedi_X> Nope. Waiting for a stable D17 release
[10:18] <luminousnerd> I use on my slack box.
[10:18] <ms12> how stable is it lumin and how you rate your experience with it
[10:19] <ms12> i am using D16 now and am thinking of making the switch
[10:19] <luminousnerd> ms12, I LOVE it, it rocks, and I've only had it crash once in about 3 months
[10:19] <Rogue_Jedi_X> Whoops, missed an R. DR17
[10:19] <luminousnerd> ms12, it's not super-unstable I think it's plenty stable but right now not a lot of graphics options since the standards constantly change with all the development
[10:19] <luminousnerd> I love it though
[10:21] <Rogue_Jedi_X> Are there any DR17 repositories out there?
[10:21] <ms12> luminousnerd i found gnome is better not graphics but resol is DR17 better then DR16 if you used it. I just lobe enlight for it is fast and do not consume much of my cpu
[10:21] <ms12> Rouge yes
[10:21] <luminousnerd> http://pastebin.com/336162
[10:21] <luminousnerd> that's my error
[10:21] <ms12> let me send it to you
[10:21] <luminousnerd> oh
[10:21] <luminousnerd> ms12, sry wrong room lol
[10:21] <Rogue_Jedi_X> I'd appreciate that, ms12 
[10:21] <ms12> no prob
[10:22] <luminousnerd> ms12, I never used E16 for longer than a glance.  E17 is completely recoded though, I know that
[10:23] <ms12> #deb http://ubuntu.nooms.de/ hoary/
[10:23] <Rogue_Jedi_X> Thanks, ms12
[10:24] <ms12> read this too http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=54476&page=1&pp=10&highlight=enlightenment+16
[10:24] <Rogue_Jedi_X> Reading...
[10:25] <luminousnerd> crap
[10:25] <ms12> ur welcomed
[10:25] <ms12> thanx luminousnerd
[10:25] <luminousnerd> this really sucks
[10:26] <luminousnerd> np
[10:27] <ms12> take care guys
[10:27] <ms12> and thanks for the help got to go now
[10:27] <Tm_Balor> yaee
[10:30] <slow-motion> bbl
[10:34] <Rogue_Jedi_X> E17. Woo! Can't wait
[10:35] <Tm_lag> err
[10:35] <Tm_lag> what's newest kernel version to hoary
[10:36] <Rogue_Jedi_X> I have 2.6.10-5
[10:36] <Tm_lag> same here
[10:37] <Rogue_Jedi_X> We're probably up to date then
[10:37] <Rogue_Jedi_X> Considering I upgraded all packages yesterday
[10:37] <Tm_lag> well, I also have 2.6.11-7
[10:37] <luminousnerd> WTF
[10:37] <Rogue_Jedi_X> Where?
[10:37] <luminousnerd> why did you slaughter cdrecord?!!!?!?!
[10:38] <Tm_lag> and 2.6.12-1 from breezy and it's not good in hoary as you can imagine
[10:38] <Tm_lag> lumi because I can
[10:39] <luminousnerd> what's up with the ubuntu crap version of cdrecord?
[10:39] <Rogue_Jedi_X> I'm steering clear of breezy for now
[10:39] <Tm_lag> rogue in universe I think
[10:39] <luminousnerd> I JUST SIMPLY WANT TO RUN ONE SIMPLE COMMAND!
[10:39] <Tm_lag> hoh
[10:39] <luminousnerd> cdrecord -scanbus how frickin simple can it get
[10:40] <Tm_lag> =)
[10:40] <nik> is there any sort of software packages availabel for kubuntu?
[10:41] <Rogue_Jedi_X> nik: Tons
[10:41] <nik> whre can i find them
[10:41] <Tm_lag> too much
[10:41] <pa> hi!!! could u help me please? i dont now, how i can install the *.rmp.bin file
[10:41] <Tm_lag> ;)
[10:41] <Tm_lag> pa
[10:41] <Rogue_Jedi_X> Tm_lag: I'd tell you if I have such a kernel package in synaptic, but it's downloading stuff right now
[10:41] <Rogue_Jedi_X> nik: Run synaptic or kynaptic
[10:42] <Verwilst> i tried 2.6.11
[10:42] <Verwilst> froze my system constantly
[10:42] <Tm_lag> =)
[10:42] <Verwilst> hopefully 6.12 fixed that ;)
[10:42] <pa> please!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[10:42] <Rogue_Jedi_X> Verwilst: Do you dare find out? ;)
[10:42] <Tm_lag> pa  think if it's bin, just run it
[10:42] <nik> whre is synaptic?
[10:42] <Tm_lag> +I
[10:42] <nik> is it a program taht comes wiht it or sumthin?
[10:43] <pa> Tm_lag, no, its runin with kate
[10:43] <Rogue_Jedi_X> nik: Kicker -> System -> Package Manager (kynaptic)
[10:44] <Tm_lag> pa you ave to make it to executable
[10:44] <nik> ooh
[10:44] <nik> thanks man
[10:44] <Verwilst> Rogue_Jedi_X: it's my workstation at work :p
[10:44] <pa> _how_
[10:44] <Verwilst> i might try it on tuesday :p
[10:44] <Tm_lag> nik check topic, there's faq ;)
[10:44] <Rogue_Jedi_X> Verwilst: Be sure to report...if you can *queues maniacal laughter*
[10:45] <Tm_lag> pa in konqi: rightclick file -> properties -> figure it out ;)
[10:45] <pa> thanx, i try now
[10:45] <luminousnerd> http://phazeman.mail333.com/Mondo_Rescue_CD_HOWTO.htm how can I accomplish this?  ubuntu ruined cdrecord
[10:45] <Rogue_Jedi_X> Or chmod +x [filename] 
[10:46] <Tm_lag> Verwilst: hmm, breezy package or wat?
[10:46] <nik> are there any desriptions for the software in kynaptic or do i have to google them all
[10:46] <Rogue_Jedi_X> Yeah, kynaptic sucks in that category
[10:46] <Tm_lag> :p
[10:46] <loadquo> You can mouseover to get a short description
[10:46] <Rogue_Jedi_X> nik: Choose synaptic in kynaptic and download that
[10:46] <Tm_lag> apt<3
[10:46] <nik> k lol
[10:47] <nik> what category is taht under
[10:47] <luminousnerd> !!
[10:47] <kinfo> i don't understand.
[10:47] <ubotu> it has been said that ! is what you add before a sentence to talk to me
[10:47] <Verwilst> Rogue_Jedi_X: will do
[10:47] <luminousnerd> help me!
[10:47] <luminousnerd> please
[10:47] <Verwilst> Tm_lag: yhez
[10:47] <Verwilst> well
[10:47] <Verwilst> no
[10:47] <Verwilst> hoary i guess?
[10:47] <Verwilst> dunnow :p
[10:47] <Tm_lag> oh
[10:47] <Rogue_Jedi_X> brb, Switching to E17 and hoping I live
[10:48] <Tm_lag> just if I have net connection in my ubuntu pc
[10:50] <Tm_lag> bah, all this lag is killing me, I'm off
[10:50] <Tm_lag> see ya kids o/
[10:50] <luminousnerd> _please_ HELP ME!  I'm desperate
[10:50] <pa> Tm_lag, write "save changes not possible"
[10:50] <pa> or so
[10:51] <nik> i cant seem to find synaptoc in kynaptic
[10:51] <luminousnerd> http://phazeman.mail333.com/Mondo_Rescue_CD_HOWTO.htm  how would I do this with ubuntu's very lame clone of cdrecord?
[10:51] <nik> synaptic*
[10:52] <Rogue_Jedi_X> nik: Uncomment the line that has the word universe in /etc/apt/sources.list
[10:52] <nik> huh?
[10:52] <nik> oh
[10:53] <pa> can some1 help me?
[10:54] <luminousnerd> PLEASE HELP ME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
[10:54] <jpatrick> with what?
[10:55] <pa> my *.bin file wont install
[10:55] <jpatrick> hmm..
[10:55] <pa> is not executable
[10:56] <uniq> pa: what is it you're trying to install? 
[10:56] <pa> java runtime environment
[10:57] <pa> uniq, can u help me?
[10:58] <Tm_Balor> http://packages.ubuntu.com/hoary/base/
[10:58] <Tm_Balor> =)
[10:58] <uniq> pa, i can give you a link to information on how to install java the 'kubuntu-way'.
[10:59] <Tm_Balor> linux-686 (2.6.10-7)
[10:59] <pa> uniqits very nice!!!
[10:59] <uniq> pa: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Java
[10:59] <Tm_Balor> so looks like no 12 yet
[10:59] <Tm_Balor> but off ->
[10:59] <Rogue_Jedi_X> This E17 is gonna take some getting used to...
[11:00] <Rogue_Jedi_X> I cant even find where to change my keyboard layout
[11:00] <PieD> KDE is better
[11:00] <pa> uniq, thank u
[11:01] <Rogue_Jedi_X> PieD: Seem so. Still, I like to experiment
[11:01] <PieD> I don't know how to experiment with innovation-free softwares
[11:01] <Rogue_Jedi_X> I like to explore, then
[11:05] <uniq> oh my god.. the security alarm almost scared me to death. that sound is very.. noisy.
[11:06] <jpatrick> :o
[11:07] <Rogue_Jedi_X> This blows. KDE, I'm comin home!
[11:08] <Rogue_Jedi_X> Ah. Home.
[11:08] <jpatrick> that fast
[11:09] <Rogue_Jedi_X> jpatrick: I could log out and go out for some coffee and then come back, if you like ;)
[11:11] <PieD> Rogue_Jedi_X: if I understand well what you said, you had the same reaction as me :)
[11:11] <PieD> When I first saw E17, I said it was nice
[11:11] <PieD> shadows looked good
[11:11] <PieD> but when I tested a viewed it more clearly......
[11:12] <PieD> I hope nobody is showing that to a macos user !
[11:12] <luminousnerd> PieD, why?
[11:12] <PieD> that'd be a crime
[11:12] <PieD> you could kill him
[11:12] <luminousnerd> why?
[11:12] <PieD> he would laugh so much that he'd die !
[11:12] <Rogue_Jedi_X> PieD: It's just too complicated for me right now
[11:12] <luminousnerd> laugh? why?
[11:13] <PieD> shadows drawn on the background
[11:13] <PieD> that's totally stupid
[11:13] <luminousnerd> ...
[11:13] <PieD> since years macOS has TRUE shadows
[11:13] <luminousnerd> uh...
[11:13] <PieD> shadows creating a nice kind of 3D effect
[11:13] <luminousnerd> PieD, e17's got true shadows and true transparency
[11:13] <PieD> like on KDE with composite enabled
[11:13] <PieD> no
[11:13] <PieD> it hasn't
[11:13] <luminousnerd> lol PieD I think you ought to research a little more
[11:14] <PieD> or it has never been shown
[11:14] <PieD> it has when you enable xcompmgr
[11:14] <PieD> that's the only way I was told to have it
[11:15] <pax> kubuntu looks good enough with fake transparency :D
[11:15] <luminousnerd> fake transparency sux0rs
[11:15] <PieD> luminousnerd: how do you enable it without a composite manager ?
[11:16] <Rogue_Jedi_X> How can transparency be faked?
[11:16] <luminousnerd> PieD, enable what?
[11:16] <pax> luminousnerd: http://ninux.net/files/ubuntu.png
[11:16] <PieD> true shadows and true translucency
[11:16] <luminousnerd> Rogue_Jedi_X, transparency is almost always faked...
[11:16] <luminousnerd> Rogue_Jedi_X, it takes a snapshot of your desktop wallpaper & icons and blends with the color of the window
[11:16] <PieD> funny background
[11:16] <Rogue_Jedi_X> Ah, cute
[11:17] <PieD> luminousnerd: like what I saw in E17 when I tested it in march (or april)
[11:17] <pax> thanks
[11:17] <luminousnerd> brb
[11:17] <Rogue_Jedi_X> I wish it had an easily accessible config tool like kcontrol
[11:19] <Rogue_Jedi_X> All of a sudden I got a qwerty keyboard layout. Yuck.
[11:19] <pax> kcontrol > regional .. > keyboard layout
[11:20] <Rogue_Jedi_X> Not in KDE, in E17
[11:20] <Rogue_Jedi_X> Although, I suppose you're right. I could run it through eterm
[11:30] <luminousnerd> how do I get rid of grub?
[11:30] <nik> how do i acess my other harddrive taht has windows on it? it says it wont mount
[11:31] <pax> luminousnerd: what do you want to use Lilo?
[11:31] <luminousnerd> nik,  is it nfts or fat32 or?
[11:31] <luminousnerd> pax, yes
[11:31] <nik> ntfs
[11:31] <luminousnerd> pax, I was told it would make this easy
[11:31] <luminousnerd> nik, I believe it's not possible.
[11:31] <luminousnerd> nik, linux can only read fat32 and its own
[11:31] <luminousnerd> don't quote me on it though
[11:32] <nik> hmm
[11:32] <nik> mandrake read it
[11:32] <luminousnerd> oh, well I'm clearly wrong then :P
[11:32] <nik> lol
[11:32] <nik> are u trying to use lilo instead?
[11:32] <luminousnerd> pax, so you know how I get rid of it?
[11:32] <luminousnerd> yes
[11:32] <nik> hmm i wanan do taht too
[11:32] <pax> # liloconfig
[11:33] <luminousnerd> nik, I know that apt-get install lilo gets it
[11:33] <luminousnerd> but then you have to get rid of grub
[11:33] <luminousnerd> pax, no, that won't work
[11:33] <nik> oh
[11:33] <nik> hmm
[11:33] <nik> wait
[11:33] <luminousnerd> you have to get rid of grub first
[11:33] <nik> kubuntu shoudl come with a choice
[11:33] <luminousnerd> indeed
[11:33] <jpatrick> it does
[11:34] <nik> really?
[11:34] <luminousnerd> kubuntu SHOULD do a lot of things...like not entirely slaughter a vital app such as cdrecord
[11:34] <jpatrick> yeah
[11:34] <nik> it didnt ask me
[11:34] <nik> if i wanted lilo
[11:34] <Rogue_Jedi_X> Hehe
[11:34] <pax> it should ask you questions then run lilo to write the changes to the MBR sudo /sbin/lilo -v
[11:34] <nik> can u jsut uninstall grub throguh synaptic and install lilo?
[11:34] <luminousnerd> pax, it can't write it.
[11:35] <nik> what did it do to ur cdrecord?
[11:35] <jpatrick> On the install menu it says 'Install Lilo' under 'Install GRUB'
[11:35] <luminousnerd> nik, it doesn't use cdrecord
[11:35] <luminousnerd> it uses cdrecord-clone
[11:35] <nik> well what did it do to taht
[11:35] <nik> oh
[11:35] <nik> i see what u mean
[11:35] <luminousnerd> which is a lame attempt at being better than cdrecord...those devels think they're so 1337 to make a lame app that replaces cdrecord.  -_- n00bs
[11:36] <nik> lol
[11:36] <nik> is it possible to only install lilo using the install cd ?
[11:36] <luminousnerd> /boot/boot.0301 exists - no boot sector backup copy made.
[11:36] <luminousnerd> Boot sector relocation performed
[11:36] <nik> i no some distros can do taht
[11:36] <luminousnerd> I can't reboot or my system most likely won't work.
[11:37] <nik> o ya
[11:37] <nik> hmm
[11:37] <nik> i can try
[11:37] <nik> and see
[11:37] <nik> but first someone answer if its possible
[11:37] <nik> like in mandrake when i boot off the cd it asks to install mandrake or install other stuff liek bootloader
[11:38] <jpatrick> There should be a HOWTO in the forums
[11:38] <pax> make a Lilo boot diskette, cd /usr/lib/lilo then make -f Makefile.floppy
[11:40] <nik> no floppy drive
[11:40] <jpatrick> :o what?
[11:40] <nik> lol
[11:41] <nik> ya...
[11:41] <nik> anyway...
[11:43] <Rogue_Jedi_X> Floppy drives are soooo 5 minutes ago
[11:43] <nik> lol
[11:43] <luminousnerd> Rogue_Jedi_X, more like 10 years...
[11:44] <Rogue_Jedi_X> Or that
[11:44] <nik> i have a zip drive lol
[11:44] <PieD> luminousnerd: who has the oldest floppy here ? I've got a 20 years old floppy somewhere :p
[11:44] <PieD> sorry, wrong date : 18 years only
[11:45] <nik> drive?
[11:45] <nik> or discette
[11:46] <nik> so umm how do i install lilo?
[11:48] <Rogue_Jedi_X> I remember we bought a computer with the 5,25" floppy drive just as 3.5" ones were becoming popular. We were screwed from the beginning
[11:48] <nik> lol
[11:48] <pax> you americans are spoiled, some people in other parts of the world still use mainly floppies if they are lucky enough to have them
[11:48] <nik> hmm
[11:49] <nik> so how do i install lilo?
[11:49] <jpatrick> www.ubuntuforums.org
[11:49] <jpatrick> search
[11:49] <pax> apt-cache search lilo
[11:50] <Rogue_Jedi_X> Which american are you reffering to, pax?
[11:51] <pax> all americans are blessed to have all the goodies their country/economy can offer
[11:52] <nik> kubuntu can read ntfs right?
[11:52] <pax> why not
[11:52] <nik>  cuz i cant read my windows drive
[11:52] <Rogue_Jedi_X> It can read my sister's hard drive, so probably, yeag
[11:52] <Rogue_Jedi_X> *yeah
[11:53] <jpatrick> NT
[11:53] <jpatrick> NTFS is dangerous to write to I think
[11:53] <luminousnerd> I want to get the settings and every program, the distro, EVERY THING on this pc to the other machines (which are factory installed winblows)
[11:53] <Rogue_Jedi_X> Then again, it's dangerous to use Windows, so what's the harm :)
[11:54] <nik> i jstu wanan read it thoguh
[11:54] <nik> i have a dual boot with an ntfs xp and ext3 kubuntu
[11:54] <nik> i wanan be able to read the xp one
[11:54] <Rogue_Jedi_X> I'm stumped there
[11:55] <nik> well considering the limited knowledge i have of linux i think its less dangerous for me to use windows cuz i dont no what the hell im doiiiiing here
[11:55] <Rogue_Jedi_X> I'll be facing the same problem in a couple of months, though
[11:55] <nik> wait
[11:55] <nik> ok it sees taht there is a drive
[11:56] <nik> btu it wont mount
[11:56] <nik> whats etc/fstab and etc/mstab?
[11:56] <pax> nik this is a script by seveas that can mount your ntfs partition and make it accessible by default http://ninux.net/files/fstab
[11:56] <PieD> nik: that's two configuration files
[11:57] <pax> !ntfs
[11:57] <ubotu> somebody said ntfs was the filesystem used under Windows XP. The Ubuntu installer can safely resize an NTFS partition to create a new partition for you to install Ubuntu. http://www.ubuntulinux.nl/files/winmac_fstab
[11:57] <nik> i have two harddrives so id rather keep them seperate 
[11:58] <nik> do i have to compile that program link?
[11:59] <pax> read it, it has instructions for use
[11:59] <PieD> no no
[12:00] <nik> the instructions are confuzing me
[12:01] <pax> nik, save it, name it something then in console type: sudo bash <whatever_you_named_it>
[12:01] <PieD> I suppose your ntfs partition is the first partition of the harddisk ?
[12:01] <pax> now you can browse your windowsxp