[12:04] <elmo> eh, the hoary installer is trying to give me 12Gb of swap
[12:07] <ogra> elmo, sure, hibernate needs 3x RAM :p
[12:13] <infinity> elmo : Should I light up the buildds again, or is jackass going to be up and down all day?
[12:13] <elmo> fire it up
[12:13] <elmo> I know what's killing it, and I'll just not do that
[12:14] <infinity> Heh.
[12:14] <elmo> I'll not be migrating it to the weekend
[12:14] <elmo> the buildds fail nicely when they can't ssh to jackass tho right?
[12:14] <infinity> Yes.
[12:14] <elmo> ok
[12:14] <infinity> Assuming the hotname won't change when you migrate.
[12:15] <infinity> hostname, even.
[12:15] <elmo> ip/hostname/ssh will all remain the same
[12:15] <infinity> (Well, they'd fail nicely either way, they'd just not stop failing if the hostname changes)
[12:40] <mae> has anyone noticed slight performance hits in drawing operations since gnome 2.12(cairo)
[01:15] <mdz> tseng: monodevelop moved
[01:15] <tseng> mdz: thank you.
[01:15] <tseng> mdz: the rest will follow?
[01:16] <mdz> tseng: the rest?
[01:16] <tseng> mdz: gtk-sharp2 was the goal
[01:16] <mdz> tseng: most of it wants to go to universe, but not the source package
[01:16] <mdz> http://people.ubuntu.com/~mdz/anastacia.txt
[01:17] <mdz> tseng: monodoc-gtk2.0-manual is still in Supported
[01:18] <tseng> im seeing that
[01:18] <tseng> depended on by monodoc-manual
[01:18] <mdz> oh?
[01:18] <tseng> yes.
[01:18] <mdz> I don't see any dependencies on it
[01:19] <tseng> hm yes
[01:19] <tseng> where did i just see this
[01:20] <tseng> oh, -gtk2.0- depends on monodoc-manual
[01:20] <tseng> not the other way
[01:20] <tseng> i see no rdepends for monodoc-gtk2.0-manual
[01:22] <mdz> tseng: I've removed it, cross-merged to kubuntu and edubuntu
[01:22] <mdz> it should fall out in the next germinate run
[01:23] <tseng> mdz: wonderful, ill watch this anastacia page.
[01:27] <mdz> tseng: if you poke me when it disappears from people.ubuntu.com/~cjwatson/germinate-output/ then I'll push it through immediately after
[01:27] <tseng> mdz: can do.
[01:54] <infinito> where should gnome applets files been installed??
[02:16] <elmo> Rejected: lsb-release-udeb_1.4-8ubuntu1_i386.udeb: architecture part of filename (i386) does not match package architecture in the udeb (all).
[02:16] <elmo> ^-- whoever uploaded lsb-release last
[02:16] <elmo> hmm, colin, a month ago
[02:28] <salkin> Hi, this is not a support request. I am just having trouble getting a bugzilla login and I wanted to mention that emacs fails to even start on my breezy/x86 install. No messages when started from console. Strace didn't tell me anything useful with a quick read. I just wanted to make someone aware of that. Thanks.
[03:32] <ajmitch> elmo: could you sync socketapi from debian? c++ lib rename was unnecessary
[03:50] <xhaker> elmo: while you're at syncs check if Scite 1.64-2 is already at the debian pool and sync it
[04:15] <ajmitch> elmo: also sync plucker, drop ubuntu changes 
[04:56] <mdz> tseng: stuff moved
[05:15] <Keybuk> mmm, baz is _so_ fast, oh yes
[05:15] <Keybuk> two hours just to do glibc *sigh*
[05:48] <jdub> GOOD MORNING FREEDOM LOVERS!
[05:49] <whiprush> yay!
[05:58] <ajmitch> morning jdub 
[06:17] <glick> hi all
[06:17] <glick> ok so i checked out the website on ubuntulinux about contributing but i dont see a concrete list of what has to be done or maintained
[06:17] <glick> its all very fuzzy
[06:18] <glick> id like to contribute, maintain a coupla packages but where to begin?
[06:19] <jdub> glick: the motu team!
[06:19] <ajmitch> most packages start off in universe, which is cared for by the masters of the universe
[06:19] <ajmitch> in #ubuntu-motu
[06:19] <jdub> glick: #ubuntu-motu or wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU
[06:19] <glick> hmmm
[06:26] <Keybuk> Dear Shadow Maintainer ... a patch file for every translation change is NOT CLEVER! :p
[06:28] <elmo> jesus, are you kidding?
[06:29] <fabbione> morning
[06:29] <fabbione> Keybuk: ahahaha
[06:30] <Keybuk> syndicate shadow-4.0.3% ls debian/patches
[06:30] <Keybuk>   :
[06:30] <Keybuk> 101_cs.dpatch
[06:30] <Keybuk> 102_de.dpatch
[06:30] <Keybuk>   :
[06:30] <Keybuk> 112_da.dpatch
[06:30] <Keybuk> 113_es.dpatch
[06:30] <Keybuk>   :
[06:30] <Keybuk> 126_tr.dpatch
[06:30] <Keybuk> 127_zh_CN.dpatch
[06:30] <Keybuk>   :
[06:30] <Keybuk> 205_it-manpages.dpatch
[06:30] <Keybuk> 206_ko-manpages.dpatch
[06:30] <Keybuk> etc.
[07:01] <rob^> hey, I'm getting in breezy: The following packages have unmet dependencies:
[07:01] <rob^>   scorched3d: Depends: libwxgtk2.4 (>= 2.4.2.6ubuntu1) which is a virtual package.
[07:02] <rob^> any ideas?
[07:02] <crimsun_> I haven't uploaded the fixed one yet
[07:02] <crimsun_> wait about 3 hours
[07:02] <rob^> thanks :)
[07:02] <crimsun_> (michiel already fixed it)
[07:11] <Keybuk> I want to know when we get the "either that wallpaper goes, or I do" release of initramfs-tools
[07:11] <jdub> i enjoyed the mistake-to-learn-from in the latest release
[07:12] <Keybuk> "Experience is simply the name we give out(sic.) mistakes." ?
[07:13] <Keybuk> Lady Windermere's Fan, iirc
[07:13] <Keybuk> it's a misquote, if it is <g>
[07:14] <Keybuk> Act 3, Scene 1; Dumby: Experience is the name everyone gives to their mistakes.
[07:14] <jdub> s/their/they're/ for good measure
[07:14] <Keybuk> no, that would be wrong
[07:15] <jdub> that would be experience!
[07:15] <Keybuk> heh
[07:15] <jdub> OF FIVE
[07:15] <jdub> fascists.
[07:16] <Keybuk> ya know, I never knew the "The difference between England and America is that when we hold a World Championship for a particular sport, we invite teams from other countries to play too" quote was John Cleese
[07:19] <Keybuk> hmm
[07:19] <Keybuk> what did I call the last release of dpkg?
[07:20] <jdub> i don't think you called it gawn blotto
[07:20] <Keybuk> no, I don't think I even understood that one
[07:21] <Keybuk> it's fine for them to make no sense to other people, but I at least have to get the joke :p
[07:21] <jdub> gawn is australian for gone
[07:21] <jdub> blotto is australian for drunk
[07:21] <Keybuk> I see...
[07:21] <Keybuk> we had an australian one already
[07:22] <jdub> fie.
[07:22] <Keybuk> in fact, we've had two if you count On Like Donkey Kong
[07:22] <jdub> how about 'aloha'?
[07:22] <Keybuk> it's quite worrying that there's about 50 of them in my dpkg-release-names file now
[07:22] <Keybuk> I really need to make some more releases
[07:38] <Keybuk> Four fonts walk into a bar.  Barman says, "oi, get out!  we don't serve your type"
[07:38] <jdub> ha ha ha
[07:39] <jdub> ha ha
[07:39] <Keybuk> Man walks into a bar with a roll of tarmac under his arm, says "pint please, and one for the road"
[07:39] <jdub> that is not as good
[07:40] <jdub> woohoo!
[07:40] <Keybuk> hmm?
[07:41] <Keybuk> SuSE downloaded a last, did it?
[07:41] <jdub> booting opensuse beta3 install cd on this openpower machine
[07:41] <jdub> Loading Installation System (67420 kB) -  10%
[07:41] <jdub> ha ha
[07:41] <Keybuk> I see, defecting are we?
[07:41] <jdub> no
[07:41] <jdub> learning their secrets
[07:42] <jdub> so we too can boot on openpower
[07:42] <Keybuk> do we not?
[07:42] <jdub> nup
[07:42] <Keybuk> cunning
[07:42] <jdub> doesn't recognise the os on the cd
[07:42] <jdub> some funky cd build or yaboot foo involved
[07:42] <Keybuk> he's not coming back
[07:42] <Keybuk> and when he does, he's not allowed more than 8 minutes of installer time a week
[07:42] <Keybuk> he's married now
[07:43] <Keybuk> it'll be different
[07:43] <jdub> that's okay, we're in the same club ;)
[07:43] <Keybuk> yes, but you're married to pia -- which makes you the woman in the family <g>
[07:44] <jdub> wow, their curses installer has no respect for 19200 bps
[07:45] <Keybuk> Gentoo's does
[07:45] <Keybuk> you can install Gentoo over a 300 bps serial line
[07:45] <Keybuk> "make" doesn't need much in the way of fancy graphics
[07:45] <Keybuk> actually, someone told me the other week that Gentoo had a graphical installer now.  I asked whether it was XEmacs
[07:46] <jdub> after configuring the language, timezone and time
[07:46] <jdub> i have "desktop selection"
[07:46] <jdub> describing both kde and gnome as "powerful and intuitive" and which mailer, browser and file manager they use
[07:47] <jdub> comical
[07:47] <Keybuk> you know the whole "innovation" argument
[07:47] <jdub> they ask BEFORE PARTITIONING
[07:47] <Keybuk> where those who claim they're innovating are usually the ones who do all the "ripping off"
[07:48] <Keybuk> well, two of the gay clubs in Birmingham are opposite the road from each other
[07:48] <Keybuk> The Nightingale and DV8
[07:48] <Keybuk> the 'gale, after a refit, opened up during the afternoon and early evening as a bar and restaurant
[07:49] <Keybuk> they called the bar "B5" ... not really sure why, but that's it's name
[07:49] <Keybuk> a few months later, DV8 followed suit and opened up their bar outside of club ours
[07:49] <Keybuk> they called it "innov8"
[07:49] <Keybuk> I've been trying to explain the irony of this to various friends for a while now, but they don't get it
[07:50] <Keybuk> (now I think about it, B5 is probably the postcode)
[07:55] <jdub> why do we do -build versioning again?
[07:55] <crimsun_> jdub: they signify only a rebuild
[07:56] <jdub> yeah, what situations do we do a rebuild without changelog?
[07:56] <Keybuk> libraries underneath them changed
[07:57] <crimsun_> hmm? changelog should at least note rebuild or something to that effect; usually it's to use newer libs, like Keybuk mentioned
[07:57] <jdub> man, this installer stinks over 19200
[07:59] <Keybuk> changelog has to mention it, in fact
[07:59] <Keybuk> I challenge your claim to have seen a build version without a changelog entry
[07:59] <jdub> :-)
[07:59] <Keybuk> BECAUSE, and this is the clever bit, the version number comes _from_ the changelog entry
[08:00] <jdub> yes dear
[08:00] <Keybuk> the only other kinds of rebuilds are when they fail on the buildd for some logical reason that just means you have to give them back
[08:00] <Keybuk> that's the "laaaaamont" kind of rebuild
[08:01] <jdub> gar.
[08:01] <Keybuk> that's usually due to being uploaded before the shared library that changed
[08:01] <jdub> after repartitioning, it suggests i won't be able to boot unless i do a particular thing with partitioning
[08:01] <jdub> eeeediots
[08:01] <jdub> and almost every character change requires a screen update
[08:01] <Keybuk> sweet
[08:01] <Keybuk> I must admit to having never tried debconf over a serial line
[08:01] <Keybuk> does that not suck?
[08:02] <jdub> it's not this bad at all
[08:02] <Keybuk> hmm, I better get in the shower
[08:05] <Keybuk> got to get to Uncle Steve's before we head off to the pub
[08:05] <Keybuk> and it's a 4 hour train ride :-/
[08:05] <jdub> say hello to the gang
[08:05] <Keybuk> will do
[08:05] <Keybuk> ciao
[09:20] <Hieronymus> Treenaks: wakker?
[09:20] <Hieronymus> aargh, er zijn weer random mensen die een pm-window met mij openen
[09:20] <Hieronymus> net als gisteren
[09:21] <Hieronymus> brr... eng
[09:22] <Hieronymus> sorry!
[09:22] <Hieronymus> Wrong channel!
[09:23] <jdub> ;-)
[09:23] <Hieronymus> it's because #ubuntu being weird
[09:26] <ompaul> Seveas, where to now?
[09:59] <mdz> Keybuk was going to Steve's and the pub at 0700?
[10:00] <jdub> mdz: four hour train ride
[10:01] <mdz> jdub: even so...;-)
[10:01] <jdub> i think they have a bbq and stuff ;)
[10:28] <pef> hi
[10:31] <jdub> YAY, ubuntu livecd chroot on the 710 :)
[10:32] <Treenaks> \\o o//
[10:38] <jdub> hrm, no devices detected from the mga driver. hrm.
[10:46] <sivang> jdub: ah, colin has retunred and you made a bootable image? 
[10:46] <jdub> sivang: no, using livecd chroot on top of opensuse
[10:47] <sivang> jdub: ah cool, that leaves for me at least some of the work for sunday/monday :)
[10:47] <sivang> jdub: are you X on the matrox?
[10:48] <jdub> can't get it running atm
[10:48] <jdub> (II) MGA: driver for Matrox chipsets: mga2064w, mga1064sg, mga2164w, mga2164w AGP, mgag100, mgag100 PCI, mgag200, mgag200 PCI, mgag400, mgag550
[10:48] <jdub> (EE) No devices detected.
[10:49] <jdub> very yummy dual-cpu dual-core though :)
[10:49] <sivang> jdub: hehe, I know ;) can you post a photo of your machine? (I'd like to see it)
[10:49] <jdub> um
[10:49] <jdub> no
[10:49] <jdub> camera was nicked while i was in the states
[10:50] <sivang> ah bummers
[10:53] <sivang> jdub: how is oopensuse on that machine, btw?
[10:53] <jdub> seems ok
[10:53] <jdub> only done a minimal install
[10:53] <jdub> have to get rc on here
[10:54] <sivang> jdub: rc?
[10:54] <jdub> red carpet
[10:55] <sivang> eh :) 
[11:04] <sivang> jdub: does the machines weighs alot?
[11:05] <sivang> s/machines/machine/
[11:06] <jdub> not really, it's surprisingly light
[11:06] <jdub> 18-32kg says the box
[11:07] <Treenaks> That's light?
[11:08] <sivang> Treenaks: that's light :)
[11:08] <sivang> jdub: mine is about ~50Kg
[11:08] <sivang> jdub: it's a beast
[11:08] <Treenaks> sivang: what is it then? :)
[11:09] <sivang> Treenaks: pSeries POWER5 , hypervisor enabled virtualization platfrom by IBM
[11:09] <Treenaks> sivang: ah ok :) then it _is_ light ;)
[11:09] <sivang> Treenaks: I am running 6 operating systems on it, at the same time with no apparent latency.
[11:09] <Treenaks> sivang: nice
[11:09] <sivang> Treenaks: It's very interesting piece of hardware
[11:10] <Treenaks> sivang: I still think virtualisation is being overhyped atm :)
[11:10] <sivang> it supports virtualizaion at the hardware level, having a special component multiplexing the hardware in a way that each partition, is truely a machine of its own
[11:11] <Treenaks> sivang: I know what a hypervisor is :)
[11:11] <sivang> ah oops , sorry:)
[11:11] <Treenaks> sivang: np :)
[11:11] <Treenaks> sivang: and it's a really cool idea.. I just don't see the use, that's all :)
[11:12] <Treenaks> ADJECTIVE ADJECTIVE {EXPLETIVE NOUN}!
[11:12] <Treenaks> some "YahooSeeker-Testing/v3.9" is retrieving /log/Ubuntu/keyboard-crack.html every _6_ seconds
[11:13] <sivang> Treenaks: where from? 
[11:13] <Treenaks> sivang: 68.142.195.82
[11:14] <sivang> Treenaks: that your ip?
[11:14] <Treenaks> sivang: no, that's theirs
[11:14] <sivang> Treenaks: what's that file got in it?
[11:18] <Treenaks> sivang: a blog post
[11:18] <Treenaks> sivang: http://foodfight.org/log/Ubuntu/keyboard-crack
[11:19] <sivang> Treenaks: ah :)
[11:49] <HiddenWolf> Is the lastest daily working?
[11:52] <sivang> this testing cycle takes too long..
[12:05] <Treenaks> sivang: you said you had a POWER5 ;)
[12:06] <sivang> Treenaks: nonon :) I don't have 15k$ for a computer machine :) it's at work....
[12:07] <Treenaks> sivang: ssh compilefarm.work :P
[12:07] <sivang> Treenaks: they bought the higher end of this line, since it's also used as a build server and runs both a couple of instances of AIX and linux simultaneously
[12:08] <Treenaks> I _really_ like this ultra high resolution on this laptop
[12:08] <Treenaks> makes the fonts so crisp & clean :)
[12:08] <Treenaks> 1920x1200 @ 15.4"
[12:08] <tseng> mm
[12:08] <HiddenWolf> Treenaks, and you where calling me a showoff when I was happy with my 24" lcd!
[12:09] <Treenaks> HiddenWolf: oh, you were talking about an LCD :P
[12:24] <rubenv> j^: I just installed your network manager packages for breezy, they work like a charm, nicely done :-)
[12:26] <sivang> Treenaks: notification area, is the panel area that displays applets icons? 
[12:27] <Treenaks> sivang: it's the one which displays the red "You need to upgrade" icon, the Gaim icon, etc.
[12:29] <hunger> Is there a fixed network-manager deb yet?
[12:29] <rob^> heh
[12:29] <hunger> Last monday somebody was working on that...
[12:30] <rubenv> hunger: not officialy in the archives, but: http://bootlab.org/~j/NetworkManager-breezy/
[12:30] <sivang> Treenaks: and what is wncklet used for?
[12:30] <rubenv> sivang: window lists etc
[12:30] <rubenv> it's a 3 in 1 applet
[12:31] <hunger> You sure are keeping yourself busy!
[12:31] <Treenaks> sivang: that's the desktop switcher
[12:35] <hunger> Could somebody please update sl-modem-daemon to depend on the linux-restricted-modules instead of sl-modem-modules-new (which does not exist in ubuntu)? Better yet: suggest lrm only since sl-modem-daemon runs with alsa as well.
[12:51] <frans-th> hi all
[12:51] <frans-th> anyone can share with me the ubuntu development process and license?
[12:51] <jsgotangco> hey
[12:51] <frans-th> hi jsg
[12:51] <frans-th> how r u
[12:51] <jsgotangco> brb dinner
[12:51] <Mez> frans-th, ???
[12:51] <frans-th> wow, what time there? here 5 
[12:51] <frans-th> hi Mez :) i am from indonesia
[12:52] <Mez> "<frans-th> anyone can share with me the ubuntu development process and license?"
[12:52] <frans-th> :P thx
[12:53] <frans-th> right now, i have a job from goverment, i think jsgotangco, known it, we did a chat in this channel in several days
[12:53] <frans-th> i have 2 question about ubuntu development.
[12:53] <frans-th> this is not technical question, can share here? or pm better?
[12:54] <Treenaks> frans-th: Language? :)
[12:54] <jdub> frans-th: this is the best channel for it
[12:54] <frans-th> cool
[12:54] <frans-th> hi jdub, 
[12:54] <frans-th> ok
[12:54] <frans-th> right now, i have a donation from canada goverment, called SIDA for open source development
[12:55] <frans-th> we will use webservices and java, 
[12:55] <frans-th> and there is a small project, donation about sun server, for promoting open source, and i will make it become ubuntu repository
[12:55] <frans-th> those are clear, i just wait the time
[12:55] <frans-th> and there is a small project, to change ubuntu name become local brand. the project named by our goverment is merpati, mean piegon in indonesian language
[12:56] <frans-th> but, i am personally better to promote ubuntu, in several way, but need information more about the ubuntu brand.
[12:56] <jdub> go on
[12:56] <frans-th> i believe ubuntu brand is more open thatn redhat, suse, and of course JDS :)
[12:57] <frans-th> JDS here renamed become IGOS Desktop with nick name Garuda, mean eagle in english
[12:57] <frans-th> i believe that make a new brand, is need more time, becuase the team must rename the ubuntu theme to our theme, 
[12:57] <frans-th> and of course, change = make it must be tested first, and it is wasting time
[12:58] <frans-th> i prefer to make the team become part of ubuntu development rather make thi
[12:58] <frans-th> this project to make sure that we have a free and always free linux solution
[12:59] <jdub> all of this is fine
[12:59] <frans-th> any comment on this?
[12:59] <jdub> we encourage rebranding
[12:59] <frans-th> in our experience promoting linux in indonesia
[01:00] <frans-th> there is 2 local brand, made by several of my friend, the software is not good as the original, both is a rebrand from fedora core 3
[01:00] <frans-th> but, Sun make the JDS become "IGOS Desktop"
[01:01] <frans-th> and because the promotor is Sun, several goverment love it, but Sun charge for US$ 50/PC
[01:01] <frans-th> we know JDS is commercial product
[01:01] <frans-th> i think, in this case, we need a local brand of ubuntu, but ubuntu name there
[01:02] <frans-th> that is not possible, because there is no ubuntu indonesia here, and there is canonical branch in indonesia
[01:02] <jdub> hold on
[01:02] <frans-th> so, if we change to local brand, we cannot make the charisma llike ubuntu that happen here
[01:02] <jdub> neither of those are restrictions to you creating an indonesian branded version of ubuntu
[01:03] <frans-th> jdub: what is that mean?
[01:03] <jdub> you can make your own version without canonical's permission
[01:03] <frans-th> i think, this channel is cool, you are very helpfull :P
[01:03] <jdub> also, you could start an indonesian LoCo team
[01:03] <frans-th> jdub: i know, we can change the ubuntu, if we know how to make it, but the problem is, the trust of the new version must be less than ubuntu name
[01:04] <jdub> frans-th: you could put "powered by ubuntu" on it :-)
[01:04] <frans-th> i think, that is better to make ubuntu still :) so the ubuntu brand can become national distro
[01:05] <frans-th> jdub: Waroeng IGOS and Blankon have that word, create based on Fedora Core 3, but i see after 3 month promotions, the popularity is getting down
[01:05] <frans-th> jdub: i personally, love ubuntu more :P 
[01:05] <jdub> why do you think they are less popular?
[01:05] <frans-th> so, my question is, how open ubuntu brand
[01:06] <frans-th> they are less popular, because several goverment wont use Waroeng IGOS and Blankon, they prefer IGOS Desktop from Sun, but of course with out paying
[01:06] <frans-th> i think we need a global brand for this project, or like global support, 
[01:06] <frans-th> honestly, there are no support from Sun, :) 
[01:06] <frans-th> just marketing wording
[01:06] <jdub> ok
[01:06] <jdub> so canonical provides global support for ubuntu
[01:07] <frans-th> what kind of global support?
[01:07] <jdub> but there is also the ubuntu marketplace - a list of companies who are supporting ubuntu
[01:07] <frans-th> i never got this information
[01:07] <jdub> see the support section on www.ubuntu.com :)
[01:07] <frans-th> my point is, i dont want to make a rebranding version :) and the goverment make an exception to make ubuntu become national standard distro, so my job reduced here, just to support ubuntu :P
[01:08] <frans-th> jdub: can explain about the process of ubuntu development
[01:08] <jdub> you could become a support partner
[01:08] <frans-th> ? how open is it?
[01:08] <jdub> totally open
[01:08] <jdub> you can become a maintainer of the supported packages :)
[01:08] <frans-th> that is :) because ubuntu is very very open, make a local brand is not good
[01:08] <jdub> it's not like fedora/rhel
[01:09] <frans-th> i will become a maintainer of support in the future, after the server arrived :) i am in the process to there.
[01:09] <frans-th> that why, because you are more open than fedora, ubuntu brand is the cool brand :)
[01:09] <jdub> frans-th: would it help you if someone from canonical visited to talk to your government agencies about ubuntu, and how they can use it?
[01:09] <frans-th> `can..
[01:09] <frans-th> if there is a canonical guy wanna help me, i can give the goverment contact to you
[01:09] <frans-th> and he is the project manager of those of this kind of open source movement
[01:10] <frans-th> and this job directly from the minister
[01:10] <jdub> frans-th: ok, i would be happy to help
[01:10] <jdub> jeff.waugh@canonical.com
[01:10] <frans-th> ok
[01:10] <frans-th> i will email you and cc to him,
[01:10] <jdub> great!
[01:10] <frans-th> you can ask to those guys, that rebranding is a good case for education, but your investment from canonical, is better the goverment join the ubuntu netwrok
[01:11] <frans-th> what do you think?
[01:11] <jdub> sounds good to me
[01:11] <frans-th> ok
[01:11] <jdub> i will have to find out what sounds good to them ;)
[01:11] <frans-th> i will email you and cc to him
[01:11] <frans-th> cool
[01:11] <hunger> daniels: You maintain the linux-restricted-modules now in addition to X? You must be a busy guy.
[01:11] <frans-th> because if we success, the 800 PC that is donated to the schools here, can become more popular :)
[01:11] <jdub> :-)
[01:12] <frans-th> because the openenst of ubuntu :)
[01:12] <frans-th> wait ok :P
[01:14] <jdub> j^: ping
[01:15] <j^> jdub pong
[01:15] <frans-th> :P
[01:16] <jdub> j^: just trying out your n-m packages - NM is failing to start bind
[01:17] <tseng> speaking of, can we upload those soon?
[01:17] <rubenv> j^: any way to make it not ask my keyring password every time I boot up?
[01:17] <j^> jdub did you make sure it is not running before starting NM?
[01:17] <rubenv> now I have to login
[01:17] <rubenv> wait for it to detect my wired is not cabled
[01:17] <jdub> j^: yeah, i stopped it
[01:17] <rubenv> enter my keyring pass
[01:18] <j^> jdub whats the error in syslog?
[01:18] <rubenv> and then I finally have networking
[01:18] <jdub> aha
[01:18] <jdub> Aug 27 21:00:35 ubuntu named[10522] : couldn't open pid file '/var/lib/NetworkManager/NetworkManager-pid-named': Permission denied
[01:18] <jdub> Aug 27 21:00:35 ubuntu named[10522] : exiting (due to early fatal error)
[01:19] <j^> rubenv i dont know a way, you might ask on networkmanager-list@gnome.org
[01:19] <j^> jdub does /var/lib/NetworkManager/ exist?
[01:19] <rubenv> j^: will do, thx
[01:19] <jdub> yeah
[01:19] <j^> hm
[01:19] <jdub> i'm starting it as root, too ;)
[01:20] <j^> /etc/dbus-1/event.d/25NetworkManager does:
[01:20] <j^>   test -d /var/lib/NetworkManager || mkdir -p /var/lib/NetworkManager
[01:20] <j^>         chown -R bind:bind /var/lib/NetworkManager
[01:20] <j^>         chmod 755 /var/lib/NetworkManager
[01:20] <frans-th> jdub: finished email to you :P
[01:20] <jdub> oh
[01:20] <jdub> aha
[01:20] <jdub> boh
[01:21] <j^> would be cool if /etc/init.d/dbus restart would restart dbus :)
[01:21] <{Seb}> oin #ubuntu
[01:21] <frans-th> jdub: i will call the contact after this, and hopefully he will love it :)
[01:24] <jdub> hj
[01:25] <jdub> j^: ok, so that fixes it, but nm-applet could not start due to missing resources...
[01:25] <j^> jdub missing resources?
[01:25] <jdub> seriously ;)
[01:25] <j^> thats the error message?
[01:26] <jdub> The NetworkManager applet could not find some required resources.  It cannot continue.
[01:26] <j^> never seen that
[01:26] <j^> what does it say in the terminal?
[01:26] <jdub> ** (nm-applet:10963): WARNING **: Icon nm-no-connection missing: Icon 'nm-no-connection' not present in theme
[01:26] <jdub> though it's there
[01:26] <jdub> and i've rebuilt the cache
[01:26] <j^> nm-applet --sm-disable
[01:27] <jdub> yeah, get the error, don't get nicon
[01:27] <jdub> /usr/share/icons/hicolor/22x22/apps/nm-no-connection.png
[01:28] <j^> is that installed?
[01:28] <jdub> yep
[01:28] <jdub> aha!
[01:28] <jdub> i forced an icon cache rebuild for hicolor
[01:28] <jdub> now it's happy
[01:29] <j^> how can one do that? might be something for nms postint
[01:29] <j^> *postinst
[01:29] <jdub> gtk-update-icon-cache -f /usr/share/icons/hicolor/
[01:29] <jdub> maybe don't need the -f, but it worked for me
[01:30] <jdub> hrm, the nicon is annoyingly wide
[01:31] <j^> there is some discussion on the list about it
[01:31] <jdub> so how do you interop with /etc/network/interfaces ?
[01:31] <j^> right now it read /e/n/i on startup,
[01:31] <j^> if it finds iface .. static 
[01:31] <j^> it uses that
[01:31] <jdub> uses that as seed configuration?
[01:31] <jdub> ah, right
[01:31] <j^> nameservers are a problem right now
[01:31] <j^> for static configuration
[01:32] <j^> if nothing or dhcp is fond in /e/n/i NM handles all on its own
[01:32] <j^> modem connections are also read from /e/n/i iface .. inet ppp
[01:33] <j^> but that is all part of the debian backend and can be changed
[01:33] <jdub> excellent :)
[01:33] <jdub> i'll keep testing
[01:33] <j^> enjoy
[01:34] <j^> if you have a vpnc server you can also test that
[01:34] <hunger> j^: When will it hit the ubuntu archives?
[01:34] <j^> i dont, so i only packaged it
[01:34] <hunger> j^: only post-breezy?
[01:35] <j^> hunger thats up to infinity or the person maintaining nm in the end, it could/should go into universe now
[01:35] <j^> since the version in universe does not work at all
[01:35] <hunger> j^: Yeap, I fully agree with you on that:-)
[01:35] <j^> and main inclusion was moved post-breezy if i understand right
[01:36] <hunger> j^: Yes, that was my impression as well.
[01:36] <j^> that would also need some work on things like network-amdin
[01:36] <hunger> j^: And I still do not like nm too much... I hate having several places to configure things.
[01:37] <j^> network-admin and NetworkManager do not like eachother 
[01:37] <j^> hunger several places?
[01:37] <hunger> j^: /e/n/i and wherever NM stores its stuff.
[01:37] <jdub> NM is dynamic :-)
[01:38] <hunger> jdub: It does store wlan keys, etc., dosen't it?
[01:38] <j^> hunger you should not have to use static ips on a laptop in a dynamic workd
[01:38] <j^> *world
[01:38] <tseng> hunger: in gnome keyring
[01:38] <hunger> j^: No, but I do have lots of WLAN ids, currently nicely configured in /e/n/i.
[01:38] <j^> hunger move on and remove it
[01:39] <j^> legacy
[01:39] <j^> if you want to use NM forget about any systemwide wireless configuration
[01:39] <hunger> j^: Yes... but since NM can not handle static IPs I still need those.
[01:40] <j^> hunger you could make NMs static ip support better
[01:40] <j^> or you could stop using static ips on wireless networks
[01:40] <hunger> j^: NM can not handle systemwide WLAN configs? Now that is annoying!
[01:40] <jdub> why are systemwide wlan configs important to you?
[01:40] <j^> hunger complain on networkmanager-list@gnome.org
[01:41] <hunger> j^: Because I do not want my users to set up there own...
[01:41] <j^> hunger in which case NM is not for you
[01:41] <hunger> j^: Only root should do that or they will use their laptops at home and stuff.
[01:41] <j^> NM is for laptops and dynamic network environments
[01:42] <hunger> j^: s/at home/in non-approved environments/ ;-)
[01:42] <j^> not for "i dont want users on my laptop to change the wireless settings, but they are free to take out the battery"
[01:43] <hunger> j^: They can take out the battery all they want... as long as they do not use unlicensed networks:-)
[01:43] <j^> haha, how long does it take you to change the root pwd of you have the laptop on your lap?
[01:44] <hunger> j^: It is not about how long it takes *me*, but how long it takes my users.
[01:44] <j^> one boot with the livecd
[01:44] <j^> security by obscurity?
[01:44] <hunger> j^: Not possible...
[01:45] <hunger> j^: Yes... to an extend.
[01:45] <jdub> hunger: mandatory settings for n-m will turn up fairly soon, probably after it stablises bit
[01:46] <j^> hunger i come back to the point, you can add that functionality to nm if you need it
[01:46] <j^> or not use nm
[01:46] <hunger> j^: I think not using NM is the easier option to take:-)
[01:46] <j^> i for one do not understand what why you would limit wireless access 
[01:46] <j^> like that
[01:47] <hunger> j^: I never claimed I did... ask the management.
[01:47] <j^> its wrong from the conseptual side
[01:47] <j^> fix the management
[01:47] <hunger> j^: I definitly prefer writing NM from scratch to that:-)
[01:48] <j^> haha
[01:48] <j^> i love people that are so confident of how much they can do
[01:48] <j^> see you next year
[01:52] <tseng> the goal was dropped
[01:52] <tseng> the package was not
[01:52] <jdub> the goal was dropped
[01:52] <jdub> heh
[01:52] <tseng> we should add j^'s package
[01:52] <tseng> because they arent spectacuarly broken
[01:52] <jdub> totally
[01:52] <siretart> good idea
[01:52] <jdub> j^: are you a MOTU?
[01:53] <j^> jdub no
[01:53] <siretart> j^: do you have a package ready for upload?
[01:53] <jdub> http://bootlab.org/~j/NetworkManager-breezy/
[01:53] <jdub> :-)
[01:54] <crispin> j^, yeah, thanks for your package, I was using an ancient version, but yours work wonderfully :-)
[01:54] <jdub> oh, hey crispin 
[01:54] <j^> jdub where do i have so sign to be a MOTU
[01:54] <crispin> hi jdub 
[01:54] <siretart> ok. who wants to upload his crack? ;)
[01:54] <jdub> j^: all info on wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU
[01:54] <siretart> j^: /join #ubuntu-motu
[01:55] <jdub> OH SUDDEN PAINS OF HUNGER
[01:55] <tseng> haha
[01:57] <Mithrandir> j^: why on earth do you think that freedesktop #4267 is critical?
[01:57] <HiddenWolf> Who did secondstageinstallerprogress?
[01:57] <jdub> kamion
[01:58] <tseng> i thought mvo
[01:58] <HiddenWolf> In any case, you've got a glaring bug there. It just stalls if it needs to install a dependency and the cdrom is not in the drive. I'll file a bug as soon as I've got a workable system.
[01:59] <HiddenWolf> (discover1, libdiscover & others)
[01:59] <j^> Mithrandir because that breaks using pkg-config on mingw32?
[02:00] <HiddenWolf> daniels, around?
[02:01] <Mithrandir> j^: if you use -uninstalled, yes.  Anyway, if you can find out why it does that, it would be appreciated; I don't have a mingw32 box.
[02:01] <hunger> Any ideas why I get "Invalid module format" on insmods?
[02:01] <j^> Mithrandir first i wanted to creat a bug, later i will check if i can find the problem
[02:02] <Mithrandir> j^: ok, patches accepted.
[02:03] <Lathiat> has gamin / nautilus upating etc stopped working for anyone else recently? it seems to pretty much never work 
[02:04] <jdub> my desktop doesn't seem to list half the files on it sometimes
[02:05] <Lathiat> but pressing control-r finds them?
[02:05] <Lathiat> menu updating hardly works either
[02:13] <infinity> Meh.  Has anyone else seen apt-listchanges segfaulting recently?
[02:14] <Mithrandir> : tfheen@vawad ~ > file =apt-listchanges
[02:14] <Mithrandir> /usr/bin/apt-listchanges: a /usr/bin/python script text executable
[02:15] <infinity> Right, not apt-listchanges itself... An strace show the last thing before death is opening /usr/lib/python2.4/site-packages/gtk-2.0/atk.so
[02:26] <infinity> Fun, it just hangs on another machine.  I guess I need mvo/mdz to give it some love.
[02:32] <jdub> http://stream.fluendo.com:8850
[02:32] <jdub> mark at akademy ^
[02:33] <siretart> w00t!
[02:33] <sivang> jdub: very nice :)
[02:33] <sivang> jdub: talking about KDE in ubuntu?
[02:34] <jdub> hasn't touched on that yet
[02:34] <jdub> he's doing the usual keynote atm
[02:34] <sivang> jdub: ah, is it live feed ?
[02:34] <jdub> yes
[02:36] <HiddenWolf> anyone here working on xorg?
[02:37] <sivang> jdub: cool
[02:39] <HiddenWolf> Guys, I have a sudoer user with "acces to cdromdrives" enabled in users-admin, but I cannot acces my cdroms... where do I file that bug?
[03:04] <joefso> hello
[03:04] <joefso> cdimage.ubuntulinux.org is down
[03:04] <joefso> sometimes it's up for a view seconds
[03:05] <Seveas> try releases.ubuntu.com
[03:05] <Seveas> or se.releases.ubuntu.com
[03:18] <slomo> does somebody know why ffmpeg is in main? it seems like it isn't needed by any main packages
[03:18] <slomo> oh sorry, kino needs it and is in main...
[03:19] <Treenaks> _needs_ it?
[03:19] <siretart> it links against it
[03:20] <slomo> yes... build-depends against libavcodec-dev
[03:20] <azeem> kino does not use gstreamer, unfortunately
[03:20] <azeem> or not yet, dunno
[03:20] <siretart> ffmpeg is really a pita :/
[03:22] <hub_> do we really have the choice ?
[03:22] <hub_> what can replace ffmpeg ?
[03:22] <azeem> well, kino should be replaced with that new, whiz-bang, gstreamer based video editing application
[03:22] <siretart> that would probably be best
[03:22] <azeem> at least mid-term
[03:23] <slomo> hub_: nothing... but currently it's somewhat broken and imho it belongs in multiverse...
[03:25] <hub_> I have heard people bitching about their lack of release process
[03:25] <hub_> so I'm almost not surprised
[03:25] <azeem> "their" == ffmpeg
[03:25] <azeem> ?
[03:25] <hub_> yep
[03:25] <hub_> ffmep release process
[03:26] <siretart> gnaarf
[03:26] <hub_> what is the rule for universe vs mutliverse?
[03:26] <infinity> azeem : What new whizbang video editor is this?
[03:26] <siretart> ffmpeg seems to be a bigger PITA than thought
[03:26] <infinity> azeem : I was under the impression kino was the best we had to offer currently.
[03:26] <siretart> hub_: universe is free software as in dfsg
[03:26] <Alex> mako: Can you give me a shout when you're around please?
[03:27] <siretart> hub_: multiverse is all kind of software with funny licences. some of them are patent encumbered, some not
[03:27] <hub_> ah ok
[03:27] <hub_> so any GPL but patene encumbered go there
[03:27] <siretart> yes
[03:27] <infinity> hub_ : It's easier if you read main and restriced as "supported/free and supported/non-free", and universe and multiverse as "unsupported/free and unsupported/non-free", perhaps.
[03:27] <slomo> hub_: yes... for example lame ;)
[03:27] <hub_> looks like one of my packages on REVU will end up in multiverse
[03:27] <siretart> or mplayer
[03:28] <siretart> hub_: which?
[03:28] <hub_> autopano-sift
[03:28] <hub_> university of BC has a patent in the US
[03:28] <hub_> BC = British Columbia, Canada
[03:28] <infinity> Is it being actively enforced?
[03:28] <azeem> infinity: http://www.pitivi.org/
[03:28] <hub_> infinity: don't know
[03:28] <azeem> http://www.linuxdevcenter.com/pub/a/linux/2005/08/18/linux_video.html
[03:34] <infinity> azeem : Looks reasonably immature still, but promising.
[03:34] <azeem> yeah, I qualified my assertion to 'mid-term' :)
[03:35] <infinity> Is also seems to depend on gst-ffmpeg...
[03:35] <infinity> Not sure how that solves anything. :)
[03:37] <slomo> gst-ffmpeg seems to ship there own version of ffmpeg... at least it doesn't build-depend on libavcodec-dev
[03:37] <infinity> And statically compiling fixes license issues, how? :)
[03:37] <infinity> (or whatever people's concerns are with ffmpeg..)
[03:38] <siretart> it fixes the problems that ffmpeg seems to change apis like other people changing underwear
[03:38] <slomo> infinity: i don't know... but imho this ffmpeg stuff really belongs in multiverse ;)
[03:38] <siretart> it at least in restricted..
[03:40] <j^> pitivi does not depend on gst-ffmpeg
[03:40] <j^> but it depends on gst-0.9
[03:41] <infinity> j^ : The "what should you have installed" bit claims you should have gst-ffmpeg.
[03:41] <j^> and gst-ffmpeg uses its own version of ffmpeg which you can see here http://cvs.freedesktop.org/gstreamer/mirror/ffmpeg/
[03:41] <infinity> Though it also claims gstreamer 0.8.10, so perhaps it's just out of date.
[03:42] <slomo> infinity: it helps to have it... but you can also use it without gst-ffmpeg... gst-ffmpeg only adds support for more formats
[03:42] <infinity> slomo : Sure, but how many people, realistically, won't want support for those formats.  Handwaving with "well, you CAN use it without X, Y, Z" isn't helpful.
[03:42] <j^> infinity are you refering to pitivi 0.1.1=
[03:42] <j^> ?
[03:43] <azeem> indeed, I think the main merit is that you don't need to link against some library, but just decide which gstreamer plugins are available at run-time
[03:43] <infinity> j^ : I'm referring to the website.  <shrug>
[03:43] <j^> Please do not use version 0.1.1 or earlier of PiTiVi. They are deprecated, unsupported and cause cancer. Use at your own risk ! Wait for the next release or try out the cvs version.
[03:43] <j^> you can join working on it, but currently its moving from gst-0.8 to gst-0.9
[03:43] <j^> it would not recomend spending much time packaging the old version
[03:44] <slomo> infinity: noone ;) hm, are main packages allowed to have multiverse/universe ones in Suggests/Recommends?
[03:44] <infinity> Yeah, I wouldn't touch it at asll right now anyway.
[03:44] <infinity> Give it a bit more time ot mature, and I may be interested in supporting it in main for breezy+1... If it really is moving that quickly.
[03:44] <infinity> slomo : In suggests, sure.
[03:45] <siretart> can someone reproduce an instant rythmbox crasher?
[03:45] <infinity> slomo : It's bad form to recommend something non-free, as most decent package frontends attempt to auto-install (or auto-select) Recommended packages.
[03:45] <slomo> infinity: ok... good to know :)
[03:46] <infinity> slomo : If/when all the frontends properly support "Enhances", suggesting anything non-free would also be bad form, as the non-free package should just declare "Enhances: <foo-in-main>"
[03:46] <infinity> slomo : But that's mostly a matter of taste/style, as the end result for the user would be the same.
[03:49] <jordi> elmo: ping
[03:51] <infinity> Does Jani Monoses IRC?
[03:52] <slomo> infinity: yes.. that's janimo... he was yesterday and the day before at least in -motu
[03:52] <infinity> slomo : Ahh, doesn't seem to be around right now.
[03:52] <infinity> slomo : If you see him around, can you smack him around a bit for "fixing" exo by adding libglitz to its build-deps?
[03:53] <slomo> infinity: i've done already ;)
[03:53] <infinity> slomo : seb128's been frantically trying to REMOVE libglitz dependencies (which is why exo was broken).
[03:53] <slomo> infinity: iirc ajmitch wanted to upload a really fixed version soon
[03:53] <infinity> slomo : Anyhow, I've uploaded a glitz-free libxfcegui4 and exo is following it, so that should fix it all up properly.
[03:54] <siretart> those transitions like the libglitz desaster should really be announced on ubuntu-devel
[03:54] <HiddenWolf> anyone here working on udev?
[03:54] <infinity> slomo : I'm not sure really if we have proper procedure for this stuff, but if main changes in a way that breaks a mess of stuff in universe and you guys aren't sure why, it would be nice if you poked some distro guys for answers.
[03:54] <jdub> siretart: yeah, they should
[03:54] <infinity> siretart : Yeah, the glitz thing is/was thpethul.
[03:55] <siretart> thpethul?
[03:55] <infinity> Picture me slamming my limp wrist violently into my chest while I say it.
[03:56] <jdub> siretart: saying 'special' with a strong... speech impediment
[03:56] <slomo> infinity: sure... but it seems some know of it, some don't :(
[03:56] <siretart> aah. thanks..
[03:56] <infinity> slomo : Yes.  Ideally, seb should have posted to -devel (and probably -motu too, now that you have one)
[03:56] <infinity> slomo : I'll try to be more proactive in pinging people about transition issues as I see them from my position (and I see them all, whether I want to or not)
[03:57] <slomo> infinity: not -motu... universe-bugs afaik
[03:58] <siretart> -devel should be fine
[03:58] <jdub> jordi: catalan's primary locale id is CA, right?
[03:58] <infinity> -devel shold be enough, yes.
[03:58] <jordi> yes.
[03:58] <jsgotangco> hey jdub
[03:58] <jordi> which conflicts ubuntu-ca :)
[03:58] <infinity> jordi : Yes, and it confuses every Canadian I know. :)
[03:58] <jdub> jordi: hrm, this is going to get confusing with the canadian loco team
[03:58] <jordi> yup.
[03:59] <jordi> those lists should have been named ubuntu-loco-ca anyway.
[03:59] <jdub> the standard we have is ubuntu-??-l10n
[03:59] <jordi> If it's about territory.
... It's not isolated, though.  Lots of country codes conflict wiht language codes.
[03:59] <jdub> weeeell...
[03:59] <slomo> infinity: maybe we should create/extend a policy for that... "announce transitions to -devel" or something similar
[03:59] <jordi> jdub: there's only one list with that scheme
[03:59] <jordi> and it's brand new.
[03:59] <jdub> there are two
[03:59] <jordi> Maybe we are on time to fix the standard.
[03:59] <jordi> two? hm.
[03:59] <jdub> but seb hasn't made the fr one public
[03:59] <jdub> i don't think the l10n standard is incorrect
[03:59] <jordi> anyway, ubuntu-l10n-ca would match the lp scheme
[04:00] <infinity> slomo : Not sure we need a written policy for it, but asking people politely to explain transition issues on -devel when they break things isn't a terribly bad idea. :)
[04:00] <jdub> and ubuntu-?? covers TLDs and languages, in some cases
[04:00] <jordi> I wonder how many en_CA translators will join.. :)
[04:00] <infinity> slomo : I'll bring it up with seb when he comes back from his short vacation.
[04:00] <jdub> jordi: i standardised on ubuntu-??-l10n for sort order reasons
[04:00] <jdub> and relationship to loco team
[04:01] <slomo> infinity: ok, fine :) or maybe some wikipage which lists all transitions with the current state
[04:01] <jordi> then Catalan, Ukrainian and other langs are left out in the cold I guess. :)
[04:01] <jdub> unfortunately, we had different demands for loco teams
[04:01] <jdub> the french and chinese speakers really wanted language lists, not region lists
[04:01] <jordi> jdub: is mailman-admin@ incorrect?
[04:01] <jdub> i just replied to your email
[04:02] <jordi> k
[04:02] <jdub> it's just mailman@
[04:02] <jordi> ok.
[04:02] <jordi> I will kill carlos.
[04:02] <infinity> slomo : With the exception of really complex transitions (like the C++ transition), editing a massive wiki page to make small changes/progress is a lot more effort than just fixing all the packages and uploading them, at least I find so.
[04:03] <jordi> jdub: for ordering reasons, ubuntu-l10n-* orders lists too
[04:03] <infinity> slomo : I could fix the glitx issues (and am working on it) faster than explaining it to other people in a formal document (and keeping it updated)
[04:03] <jordi> (and I guess all other projects out there do stuff like this
[04:03] <jdub> jordi: not alongside the loco lists, however
[04:03] <slomo> infinity: no i meant just a list of all transitions, not the packages which are involved ;)
[04:03] <infinity> slomo : But I'm not against just sending a quick note to -devel and assuming that everone on distro/motu will read it.
[04:03] <jdub> however, i'm *this* close to switching
[04:03] <jordi> jdub: I guess the code clashes make this incompatible :(
[04:04] <jdub> hrm, seb's not here
[04:04] <slomo> infinity: something like "CXXTransition: done" or "libcairo1 transition: work in progress"
[04:04] <jdub> nor koke+carlos
[04:05] <infinity> slomo : You're welcome to make such a page and ping me for info on the current status (since I keep my finger on the pulse of most transitions in progress)
[04:05] <slomo> infinity: ok, i'll add this to my todo list ;)
[04:05] <infinity> slomo : I don't feel like adding "document transition status" to my list of duties, but I definitely don't mind someone else doing it and asking me for input.
[04:11] <jordi> jdub: just DO IT :)
[04:15] <Mitario> elmo, ping
[04:28] <OculusAquilae> hi
[04:29] <OculusAquilae> are there problems with #ubuntu . It always says, that I'm banned
[04:29] <tseng> its locked to registered users only
[04:29] <tseng> to keep out spambots
[04:30] <OculusAquilae> tseng: how to register?
[04:30] <tseng>  /msg nickserv help
[04:30] <OculusAquilae> thanks
[04:30] <LaschW> How is a registration done? Any HowTo about that?
[04:30] <tseng>  /msg nickserv help
[04:33] <OculusAquilae> tseng: hm, me and another guy are registered and it doesn't work 
[04:33] <tseng> works for me
[04:34] <tseng> did you identify to nickserv?
[04:34] <OculusAquilae> yes
[04:34] <LaschW> tseng: It's me who is the other guy...
[04:34] <LaschW> tseng: me too
[04:34] <OculusAquilae> :-)
[04:34] <tseng> if you are properly registered and identified, i dont see why you would have any problems getting in, sorry.
[04:35] <azeem> 16:25 [OPN]  -!- 0 - #ubuntu: ban *!*@*.dip0.t-ipconnect.de 
[04:35] <azeem> is that not applicable to registered users?
[04:35] <LaschW> tseng: I would see it _very_ strange to be banned whithout _ever_ posting to the channel.
[04:35] <Lathiat> LaschW: its more than your ISP is banned
[04:36] <Lathiat> perhaps someone was being a git
[04:36] <LaschW> tseng: Up to now I've only been listening
[04:36] <tseng> its a ban on the entire block
[04:36] <tseng> i dont run #ubuntu, sorry.
[04:36] <LaschW> tseng: a block on an IP range???
[04:37] <tseng> LaschW: yes???
[04:37] <OculusAquilae> seems so, strange
[04:37] <tseng> he just showed you the hostmask being blocked.
[04:37] <LaschW> tseng: never heared that before, not for irc...
[04:37] <tseng> but im sorry to say, I cannot help you.
[04:37] <LaschW> tseng: who may be able to give a helping hand?
[04:37] <tseng> Seveas is the only oper
[04:38] <OculusAquilae> hm
[04:38] <LaschW> Seveas: Did you follow the thread between tseng, OculusAquilae and me?
[04:39] <Seveas> no, reading back now
[04:40] <Seveas> yeah, that ban is part of spambot prevention
[04:40] <Seveas> it failed anyway, I'll remove it
[04:40] <OculusAquilae> thanks
[04:40] <LaschW> Seveas: Hey seems you are quite close to me, location Friesland, maar het duitse Friesland
[04:41] <Seveas> I'm not in Friesland :)
[04:41] <LaschW> Seveas: Hhhm, but I would say that most dutch counties are much closer to Friesland than bavaria, eg. :-)
[04:42] <Seveas> hehe
[04:42] <Seveas> that's true
[04:44] <LaschW> Seveas: Most people are not able to differentiate between Friesland / Netherland / Denmark. So at least most people who are more than 500km in distance
[04:44] <Seveas> hahaha, how true :)
[04:44] <LaschW> Seveas: differentiate / onderscheidmakentussen
[04:44] <LaschW> Seveas: Pardon my pidgin english
[04:45] <LaschW> Seveas: May I ask how this bann occured, technical? 
[04:45] <Seveas> there are spam bots all over freenode
[04:46] <LaschW> Seveas: Has it been a ban on IP level as tseng mentioned?
[04:46] <Seveas> yup
[04:46] <Seveas> *.dip0.t-ipconnect.de was banned
[04:46] <LaschW> Seveas: Interesting, didn't know that this could be done up to now
[04:47] <Seveas> One can just as much ban *!*@*
[04:47] <Seveas> which means: everyone :)
[04:47] <LaschW> Seveas: *.dip0.t-ipconnect.de is another ip range than my Provider uses...
[04:48] <hunger> where did you ban me?
[04:49] <LaschW> Seveas: And *.dip0.t-ipconnect.de will ban some million german Telecom customers. At least it's the biggest provider, afaik
[04:50] <\sh> it is the biggest
[04:50] <hunger> Seveas: Yeap... and it has lots of subcontractors as well... you basically locked out 95% of all german broadband users.
[04:51] <Seveas> yeah, that's why I removed it
[04:51] <hunger> Seveas: Thanks!
[04:51] <Seveas> the spambots have way too big a net to ban effectively
[04:51] <\sh> Seveas: whats the prob with t-online?
[04:52] <Seveas> one of the nets abused by the spambot attack...
[04:52] <Seveas> (which is still going on)
[04:52] <\sh> hmmm...freenode can file a complaint against t-online users 
[04:53] <\sh> abuse@t-online.de or so
[04:53] <LaschW> Seveas: I've never noticed spam / spambots up to now. How do they occur, as normal users who behave as trolls?
[04:53] <OculusAquilae> i had some spambots today
[04:53] <Seveas> users that quickly enter+exit a channel and then spam all users on the channel in PM
[04:54] <Seveas> has been going on for almost a day now
[04:54] <hunger> \sh: t-offline does not really care in my experience.
[04:54] <Seveas> #ubuntu is currently blocked for non-registered users, these are forwarded to a channel wher I'm announcing this periodically
[04:54] <\sh> hunger: they're caring when the users are blocked on ip range
[04:54] <LaschW> Seveas: PM means per E-Mail not per private chat?
[04:54] <Seveas> PM = private message
[04:55] <hunger> \sh: it is "only" IRC and only one network as well.
[04:56] <OculusAquilae> fucking spammers :-(
[04:56] <\sh> hunger: it's freenode..many opensource devs have dsl from telekom or their subcontractors...so the users will complain as well, and then t-online has to react
[04:57] <LaschW> OculusAquilae: I would say you never have been in contact to t-online abuse team. :-))
[04:57] <\sh> actually...at our company...we're caring about and we're closing the account temporalily during investigation of spam or other activites not allowed in our contracts
[04:57] <LaschW> OculusAquilae: It's better called NOabuse-team or better ProAntiabuse-team.
[04:57] <hunger> \sh: All I am saying that the company is *extremly* unresponsive.
[04:58] <\sh> hunger: lemme ask for the contacts to t-online from my security it boss :)
[04:58] <Mitario> could someone update gconf2? it still depends on libglitz
[04:58] <hunger> \sh: It does not even care about people when they tell them that they are going to leave if they are ignored much longer.
[04:59] <Seveas> grmbl
[04:59] <Seveas> freenode is crap
[04:59] <\sh> hunger: u will always come back to the telecom in this or that way...that's the thing...
[04:59] <Seveas> it's the only network that i'm getting disconnects from
[04:59] <Treenaks> Seveas: try darkernet, it's even more crap ;)
[05:01] <\sh> me has supper right now..a nice dner
[05:02] <infinity> Mitario : Working on it... It's a weekend, expect people to be a bit slack. :)
[05:02] <Mitario> infinity, heh, np :) just discovered it was depending on libglitz when I was looking at rhythmbox :)
[05:05] <infinity> Mitario : No big deal.  Everything that isn't horribly FTBFS will be rebuilt for cairo/glitz in the next day or two.
[05:05] <Mitario> allright great :)
[05:06] <Seveas> hmm, how many transitions were ther in the past months?!
[05:06] <infinity> Seveas : Lots.
[05:06] <Seveas> I certainly lost count
[05:07] <infinity> gcc-4.0, c++ ABI bump, libcairo1 -> libcairo2 -> libcairo2 without gliz, GL/GLU from xorg to mesa, aalib -> libaa, slang1 -> slang2.... Uhm.
[05:07] <infinity> A few.
[05:07] <\sh> cxx, xorg, cairo, slang (ongoing), unmetdeps (ongoing), gl/glu, gl/glu-mesa
[05:07] <\sh> too many
... I don't mind so much.  If we get all this sorted, we'll be in really good shape for a nearly transition-free devel/release cycle for breezy+1.
[05:08] <infinity> Which is high on my list of Really Good Things.
[05:08] <slomo> Seveas: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Transitions  <--- that's the page i created a few minutes ago... because i also lost track ;)
[05:09] <jdub> infinity: *cough*
[05:09] <infinity> jdub : Swallow something?
[05:09] <jdub> infinity: 'sif it's going to be transition free :)
[05:09] <infinity> jdub : I did say "nearly".
[05:10] <jdub> (of course, we could just specify that as a goal, and JFDI(
[05:10] <\sh> infinity: well..regarding main, u r right, regaring universe...I think we will have a bumpy right when breezy is released...and for breezy+1 we have to polish everything
[05:10] <infinity> jdub : In comparision, it will SEEM transition-free.
[05:10] <jdub> haha
[05:10] <Seveas> slomo, that's not complete
[05:10] <infinity> \sh : I keep switching hats back and forth in an effort to try and help you guys keep universe buildable/installable.
[05:10] <Seveas> it misses the mono and X transitions at least ;(
[05:10] <Seveas> ;)
[05:10] <infinity> \sh : I wouldn't be too doom and gloom about it, I think we'll be in good shape in universe.
[05:11] <slomo> Seveas: maybe... so please add it :P
[05:11] <Seveas> I don't know their state..
[05:11] <slomo> Seveas: and mono transition is long over... so not really necessary
[05:11] <slomo> Seveas: set it to unknown... i don't know the state for x transition either
[05:11] <Seveas> and gcc4 of course
[05:11] <\sh> infinity: for breezy+1 we need to "plan those transitions" much better for universe...I talked with ogra about it..and we're working on it :)
[05:12] <infinity> \sh : Building reverse-build-dep and reverse-dep trees/maps can go a long way to making things easier.
[05:12] <\sh> anyways...the week after next...I will hit again :) 
[05:12] <infinity> \sh : If you can do a full transition (modulo FTBFS issues) in one well-ordered string of uploads, life is much easier.
[05:13] <mako> Alex: around
[05:13] <\sh> infinity: yepp but u know...it will be my first ubuntu release and the next will be much better :)
[05:14] <\sh> infinity: so for breezy I didn't know anything at all...(work processes etc. in debian env.) but now..I learned, I'm trained...and lets rock on breezy+1 ,-)
[05:14] <infinity> \sh : Heh.  Debian development in general is an interesting learning experience, and I can imagine that starting with Ubuntu (where our release cycle are short and furious) is even more interesting.
[05:16] <Seveas> "Ubuntu -- where the release cycle are short and furious"
[05:16] <Seveas> nice slogan
[05:16] <\sh> infinity: I mean, I worked on debian packages long ago..but when u r not all day long involved in some working processes..it's really hard to accomplish some things..but now it was a real push of my knowledge and I learned a lot
[05:16] <jdub> having very fast turnaround times for this stuff is a huge benefit
[05:16] <\sh> Seveas: right it down, put a (c) 2005 by Adam Conrad to it..and make it a heading for "DeveloperResources" ,-)
[05:17] <\sh> s/right/write/
[05:17] <\sh> I found a nice logical bug today in launchpad
[05:18] <\sh> bugs filed to products, are not mentioned in common malone buglist...and it's not possible to assign them != upstream maintainer
[05:19] <infinity> jdub : Being able to do transitions rapidly is quite nice, but it can also be a lot more stressful than the Debian environment.
[05:20] <infinity> \sh : I assume you're filing bugs on malone as you find them?... I know Brad loves quality feedback.
[05:20] <HiddenWolf> Any kernel/alsa hackers here?
[05:20] <tseng> jdub: its also an assload of work on people like \sh
[05:20] <infinity> tseng : Bah.  \sh enjoys pain, that's obvious.
[05:21] <\sh> infinity: hahahha
[05:21] <\sh> infinity: I'm not in SM, actually not while I'm working on software ,-)
[05:23] <jdub> infinity: ie. it's hours/days of people pinging you instead of drawing it out over weeks/months ;-)
[05:24] <infinity> jdub : Yeah, but it means I can't ignore my emails for months.  <cough>
[05:24] <infinity> :)
[05:25] <infinity> (funny story: I fired up my Windows laptop the other day to rescue an old email from Outlook, and was informed by Outlook that I had a task that was 230 weeks overdue...)
[05:26] <jdub> heh
[05:26] <jdub> j^: do you not want to use dhcdbd?
[05:27] <j^> jdub not at compile time
[05:28] <j^> its just needed by configure at the moment to get its path
[05:28] <j^> --with-dhcdbd=/sbin/dhcdbd should too too
[05:28] <j^> *doo
[05:29] <jdub> oh
[05:31] <infinity> ls
[05:31] <infinity> -EWIN
[05:31] <\sh> hmmm...I'm in need of a linksys wrt54g router 
[05:31] <\sh> and they sold it last time at saturn for less then 50 
[05:32] <infinity> (base)adconrad@cthulhu:~/cairo$ apt-get source `cat brokenPackages`
[05:32] <infinity> Reading package lists... Done
[05:32] <infinity> Building dependency tree... Done
[05:32] <infinity> Need to get 131MB of source archives.
[05:32] <jdub> *snicker*
[05:43] <Mithrandir> infinity: that's less than just ooo2-amd64 or ia32-libs.  Don't complain.
[06:15] <xhaker> someone using wireless here that can send a file with the iwlist scan output?
[06:15] <xhaker> can't find anything on the net
[06:20] <sivang> does anybody experience problems with irssi? I get the screen all blue every once when a new msg appears
[06:20] <Mithrandir> sivang: you're using screen and gnome-terminal?
[06:21] <sivang> Mithrandir: yeah, what causes it?
[06:21] <Mithrandir> and have switched to another tab after you connected to the screen?
[06:21] <Mithrandir> it seems like it's a bug in gnome-terminal.  Annoying.
[06:23] <sivang> very much, but I think I've opened a new tab, then closed it altogether.
[06:23] <sivang> (and still getting this bug)
[06:24] <Mithrandir> just disconnect and reconnect the screen.
[06:24] <sivang> Mithrandir: ok, I'll do that, thanks
[06:25] <sivang> Mithrandir: hrm, actually you mean to kill the server's screen session and then restart it?
[06:27] <Mithrandir> no, just C-a d  and then screen -rd again
[06:28] <jbailey> C-a c, C-a <spc> is usually enough for me.
[06:28] <jbailey> Or I resize the window.
[06:29] <infinity> I detach and reattach.
[06:29] <infinity> And, for the record, it happens with BitchX too (someone was under the impression that it was only reproducible with irssi)
[06:29] <Mithrandir> I just don't use gnome-terminal. :-)
[06:37] <jbailey> infinity: Aren't you supposed to be asleep?
[06:37] <infinity> Yup.  I'm doing a fantastic job of it, too.
[06:37] <sivang> Mithrandir: what do you use instead?
[06:39] <sivang> [OF]  does anybody know if H.G. Wells was British or American?
[06:39] <infinity> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H.G._Wells
[06:40] <jbailey> sivang: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H._G._Wells mentions a whole bunch of 'royal' this and 'royal' that.
[06:40] <jbailey> So I'm guessing not American.
[06:40] <infinity> He was British, yes.
[06:40] <infinity> Also....
[06:40] <infinity> jbailey : JINX.
[06:40] <\sh> *grmpf*
[06:41] <\sh> I think I have to buy some beer for tonight and have a look to boson-base with a dizzy brain
[06:41] <\sh> I hope that I understand what they're trying to "develop" there...
[06:43] <sivang> \sh: what's boson base?
[06:43] <\sh> a 3d game enviroment...
[06:43] <sivang> infinity: why JINX  ?
[06:45] <\sh> hmm..it looks like it wants to have an older version of kde-games include headers
[06:45] <Mithrandir> sivang: pterm
[06:45] <\sh> no wonder that all *.ui files of this package were broken
[06:45] <\sh> and new version of this, doesn't build as well...hellaluja
[06:56] <[SemTeX] > I just upgraded my hoary to breezy on a laptop and found a problem with the x config
[06:57] <[SemTeX] > it sets a mouse as corepointer, but there was no mouse on the laptop
[06:57] <[SemTeX] > had to fix this manually and set the touchpad as corepointer
[06:59] <\sh> normally it has 2 entries...
[06:59] <\sh> the mouse as core and the touchpad (synaptics normally) as second pointer
[07:00] <[SemTeX] > it had
[07:00] <[SemTeX] > but didn't start with that config
[07:00] <\sh> hmmm..
[07:01] <[SemTeX] > so i commented out the mouse and set synaptics as corepointer
[07:01] <\sh> strange..cause it starts here..
[07:01] <[SemTeX] > weird
[07:01] <[SemTeX] > i'll try to enable the mouse back and test some other things to be sure :)
[07:10] <\sh> sivang: u mean the new movie or the old one?
[07:18] <Coyctecm> I can't disable touchpad via button in keyboard...
[07:28] <sivang> \sh: ah, I've never seen the old one (frmo 1952?) but I can guess its better
[07:29] <sivang> Mithrandir: I had bit quite with the terminal bug, but now it returned
[07:34] <\sh> sivang: i think so...but i don't know the correct movie date...have to look...
[07:38] <jordi> jdub: any update on thel ists stuff?
[07:40] <jordi> I figure he must be sleeping.
[07:41] <jordi> jdub: I'll be back tomorrow night or monday.
[07:41] <jordi> laters.
[08:03] <HiddenWolf> Who is the Alsa guy?
[08:04] <Treenaks> HiddenWolf: you are ;)
[08:05] <HiddenWolf> I'm the guy with an horrific confusing bug that I need to figure out how to fix. :P
[08:07] <HiddenWolf> alsa maintainer field isn't set. :S
[08:10] <crimsun> what type?
[08:11] <HiddenWolf> maintainer is set to some debian email adres. Doesn't tell me who I need to bug to figure this stupid thing out.
[08:11] <crimsun> HiddenWolf: this is probably better addressed in #ubuntu
[08:11] <HiddenWolf> crimsun, I've tried #ubuntu, and -nl. seveas and treenaks don't know. Little hope for me among the general public.
[08:12] <crimsun> I wasn't paying attention, recap
[08:12] <HiddenWolf> I just want to get a clue about what's going wrong, so i can file a meaninful bug. :)
[08:12] <Treenaks> HiddenWolf: bugzilla.ubuntu.com ; file a bug on "alsa"
[08:12] <Treenaks> or something?
[08:13] <HiddenWolf> Treenaks, I did, but the only thing I can tell is that I don't get sound on either soundcard on either an upgrade or a fresh install of Breezy daily.
[08:13] <crimsun> I'm sorry, HiddenWolf, but I'm pressed for time currently. Can you recap in #ubuntu?
[08:13] <HiddenWolf> Now that's not likely to get it fixed fast. :S
[08:35] <pef> hi
[08:40] <\sh> madduck: ping
[08:41] <madduck> \sh: yes?
[08:44] <madduck> \wii \sh
[08:44] <madduck> argh. i have latexitis
[08:45] <\sh> madduck: hehe...
[08:46] <madduck> what's up?
[08:46] <\sh> madduck: u wrote something on your wiki about bazaar and upstream source and debianization
[08:47] <madduck> that's the pkg-zope wiki, but yes.
[08:47] <\sh> on http://debian.madduck.net/pkg-zope/wiki/Arch/Package/Upstream
[08:47] <\sh> yes
[08:48] <madduck> it's all work in progress and there will be changes...
[08:48] <madduck> and i will try to use bzr soon.
[08:48] <\sh> what about patching upstream and creating unified diffs...we had a discussion with j^ about his changes without providing unified diffs
[08:49] <madduck> huh?
[08:49] <\sh> if you pull a source from somewhere and create a baz repos
[08:50] <\sh> change something in the code...debianize the source and build the packages...
[08:50] <\sh> the orig.tar.gz should be always the orig upstream package..so all changes go into diff.gz..which is sometimes not nice
[08:51] <\sh> madduck: have a look to backlog of #u-motu ,-)
[08:51] <madduck> yes.
[08:51] <madduck> i am not logged into u-motu.
[08:51] <\sh> hehe
[08:52] <madduck> i am on too many channels already... wanna send me logs?
[08:52] <\sh> madduck: use the irclogs of fabbione ,-)
[08:52] <madduck> thx
[08:54] <\sh> madduck: thanks to you :) 
[08:55] <madduck> i'll be with you in #u-motu in a bit, okay?
[08:55] <\sh> madduck: u can stay forever :) 
[08:56] <\sh> madduck: actually I don't understand him..or I'm too non-baz alike but I think the first point is more right then the latter
[09:30] <sivang> anybody to sponser my pkg of gnome-panel ?
[09:31] <sivang> (lpi patches)
[10:19] <netdur> hey, I installed breezy, the kernel has some problems, it doesn't load speedtch model, so I can't get online... also usplash thing doesn't work fine (compaq computer) but everything else so far so good! I'm going to install old kernel so I can get online and do more tests
[10:20] <hub_> speedtouch?
[10:20] <hub_> you still use USB ADSL modems?
[10:20] <netdur> yep
[10:20] <netdur> yes
[10:21] <hub_> ghawd
[10:22] <HiddenWolf> crimsun?
[10:22] <netdur> here in Morocco, there speedtouch and sagem usb adsl modem... nothing more
[10:22] <crimsun> HiddenWolf: yes? I'm extremely lagged atm, so I may not respond timely
[10:23] <hub_> speedtouch DO exist as Ethernet. In fact the first one was Ethernet
[10:23] <hub_> I hate these stupid manufacturers
[10:23] <hub_> cut down price to sell crap
[10:23] <HiddenWolf> crimsun: you asked me to check if my audigy sound card worked under colony3. It does, out of box. However, daily does _not_ work.
[10:25] <HiddenWolf> what do you want me to do?
[10:51] <BenC> anyone give me a quick tutorial on installing grub by hand after an install (e.g. a debian system with lilo, upgraded to ubuntu)?
[10:52] <BenC> by hand meaning, I have the package installed, but not grub as the bootloader
[10:55] <HiddenWolf> BenC: grub-install && update-grub
[10:56] <HiddenWolf> something along those lines
[10:57] <crimsun> BenC: to install GRUB in the MBR?
[10:57] <crimsun> HiddenWolf: sorry, my wifi connection sucks today
[10:58] <HiddenWolf> Crimsun: I've attached my /proc/asound and the other things you needed to bug http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=14232
[10:58] <crimsun> HiddenWolf: thanks, I'll take a look in a bit
[10:59] <crimsun> (barring my wifi collapsing completely, grr)
[10:59] <HiddenWolf> crimsun: also, my tvtuner sound chip doesn't show up anymore in alsa / mixers. Is this intentional?
[11:00] <crimsun> HiddenWolf: bt87x?
[11:00] <HiddenWolf> yup. It seems to be disabled completely.
[11:00] <crimsun> HiddenWolf: is it loaded? (snd_bt87x)
[11:01] <HiddenWolf> Doesn't seem to be, no.
[11:01] <HiddenWolf> the kernel has lost it. :P
[11:03] <HiddenWolf> crimsun: I'm slow too. battling with the wiring of my speaker set. ;)
[11:03] <crimsun> snd-bt87x exists in 2.6.12-7-686
[11:04] <HiddenWolf> Doesn't seem to get loaded here.
[11:05] <crimsun> but it exists as /lib/modules/$(uname -r)/kernel/sound/pci/snd-bt87x.ko, correct?
[11:06] <HiddenWolf> it seems to
[11:06] <HiddenWolf> 2.6.12.11-k7
[11:06] <crimsun> err
[11:06] <crimsun> what is that from?
[11:07] <HiddenWolf> that's the version synaptic gives me.
[11:07] <crimsun> my linux-image-$(uname -r) is package version 2.6.12-7.11
[11:08] <HiddenWolf> 2.6.12-6-386
[11:09] <crimsun> you're an abi version behind
[11:09] <crimsun> well, for that package
[11:10] <HiddenWolf> hm
[11:10] <HiddenWolf> I'll reboot to a newer kernel, brb
[11:12] <HiddenWolf> crimsun: 2.6.12-7-k7
[11:12] <crimsun> HiddenWolf: sound quality?
[11:13] <HiddenWolf> crimsun, one sec, Rhythmbox won't run.
[11:14] <HiddenWolf> I've got sound. Still only one channel it seems.
[11:14] <crimsun> are you using an ~/.asoundrc ?
[11:16] <HiddenWolf> Doesn't seem to be the case.
[11:20] <crimsun> HiddenWolf: one channel being?
[11:21] <HiddenWolf> crimsun, sound coming out of my line1, but not line2 or 3 (i'm quite a noob, but seem to need these for 5.1 sounds..) not a big issue one way or another.
[11:22] <crimsun> HiddenWolf: ok
[11:23] <HiddenWolf> the snd_bt87x module isn't loaded still. :(
[11:23] <hunger> Anyone working on updating the linux-restricted-modules so that the new ATI drivers are installed?
[11:25] <HiddenWolf> hunger, daniels isn't here.
[11:27] <hunger> I am feeling really stupid... but I can not get rid of that Mesa GL lib for some reason.
[11:29] <HiddenWolf> crimsun, need I file a bug about that bt87etc module?
[11:30] <crimsun> HiddenWolf: did you attach /proc/asound/cards before (colony 3) and after (daily)?
[11:31] <HiddenWolf> crimsun, what I posted is colony3. Do you need daily too?
[11:33] <hunger> There is no libGL.so* on my system anymore, but glxinfo still claims there is Mesa inderect rendering:-(
[11:34] <crimsun> HiddenWolf: I need to be able to compare what happened after, so yes
[11:35] <HiddenWolf> crimsun, ok, i'll upgrade to daily then. :P
[11:46] <HiddenWolf> crimsun, suddenly getting weird "could not open resource for writing" errors
[11:49] <slowtek> part #ubuntu-devel 
[11:50] <HiddenWolf> and someone should fix that udev annoyance. :P
[11:55] <HiddenWolf> crimsun, upgrading from colony3 to daily leaves me with sound.
[11:55] <HiddenWolf> I can still give you the info, if you want.
[11:56] <crimsun> so what was the issue?
[11:56] <HiddenWolf> No idea
[11:56] <HiddenWolf> If I do a clean daily install, no sound. Upgrade from hoary-> daily no sound, but colony3 and upgrading from it work fine.
[11:57] <crimsun> hoary->colony3?
[11:57] <HiddenWolf> Haven't tried.
[11:57] <HiddenWolf> My route today was daily -> hoary -> daily -> colony -> daily