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| zul | heylo | 02:43 |
|---|---|---|
| zul | yummy...spam | 02:46 |
| fabbione | morning | 05:03 |
| jbailey | Eh... You're early... | 05:09 |
| fabbione | yes | 05:10 |
| fabbione | i couldn't sleep this night? | 05:10 |
| jbailey | Dont confuse me like that. It's still an hour until bedtime. =) | 05:10 |
| fabbione | jbailey: any news about binutils? | 05:10 |
| fabbione | ehhehe | 05:10 |
| jbailey | fabbione: No, last I saw was the elmo told doko that he was working on an update for it. | 05:10 |
| fabbione | ok... | 05:11 |
| jbailey | That was last Friday or so, though. | 05:11 |
| fabbione | yes i recall that | 05:11 |
| jbailey | I was offline the whole weekend, pretty much. | 05:11 |
| fabbione | so was i | 05:11 |
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| zul | i got a freaking song in my head | 02:16 |
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| chmj | what song ? | 02:25 |
| jbailey | zul: Sean Paul? =) | 02:26 |
| jbailey | "let's get it on 'till the early morn..." | 02:26 |
| zul | hell no.. | 02:33 |
| zul | its like "we are on drugs...we are alll on drugs...do you like drugs..." cant remember where i heard it though | 02:34 |
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| fabbione | yo | 03:55 |
| zul | hey fabbione how goes it? | 03:57 |
| fabbione | zul: as usual :) | 03:58 |
| fabbione | you? | 03:58 |
| zul | good...laptop is suppose to arrive today | 03:58 |
| fabbione | ehehe lucky you | 04:00 |
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| zul | the irony is that my package is probably the last one to be deliviered | 04:05 |
| fabbione | zul: why? | 04:07 |
| zul | just my luck and the way the day is going so far | 04:07 |
| fabbione | ahhh | 04:07 |
| BenC | fabbione? | 04:46 |
| zul | its smaaaaaaallllll | 04:51 |
| mjg59 | zul: Got it, then? | 04:53 |
| fabbione | BenC: ? | 04:54 |
| BenC | hey | 04:59 |
| BenC | how long will you be around? | 04:59 |
| BenC | also, is your OCFS2 stuff done and ready in the repo? | 04:59 |
| fabbione | BenC: the last update is in baz. | 05:00 |
| fabbione | i will be around for another 2/3 hours | 05:01 |
| fabbione | BenC: we will need another update later anyway | 05:01 |
| === desrt hits benc over the head with inotify | ||
| fabbione | BenC: http://oss.oracle.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=544 and http://oss.oracle.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=558 | 05:02 |
| desrt | BenC; i just posted a patch to bugzilla... it'd be really awesome if it was in the next build | 05:02 |
| fabbione | BenC: otherwise we are fine imho | 05:02 |
| fabbione | BenC: upstream is working on it right now and we have a test setup at the DC. | 05:02 |
| desrt | ubuntu's inotify is broken | 05:02 |
| fabbione | BenC: there is also 2.6.12.6 out... | 05:02 |
| BenC | yeah | 05:02 |
| fabbione | desrt: what's broken with it? | 05:03 |
| desrt | fabbione; it reissues watch descriptors | 05:03 |
| desrt | fabbione; due to an off-by-one error (one-liner patch) | 05:03 |
| BenC | desrt: bug #? | 05:03 |
| desrt | http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=14364 | 05:03 |
| fabbione | desrt: ah ok.. is the fix upstream already? | 05:03 |
| desrt | yes | 05:03 |
| desrt | in 2.6.13 | 05:03 |
| fabbione | perfect | 05:03 |
| desrt | robert love also just personally looked over the bug report and told me it looks OK | 05:04 |
| BenC | fabbione: that's a question I had, how do we move to new kernels, if at all? | 05:04 |
| BenC | are we at a stage where breezy is just going to be 2.6.12? | 05:04 |
| fabbione | BenC: yes.. breezy is going to be .12 | 05:04 |
| fabbione | BenC: Preview Freeze is in 2 days | 05:04 |
| fabbione | so i'd say we talk with mdz before uploading this kernel | 05:05 |
| === mdz [n=mdz@ca-studio-bsr1o-251.vnnyca.adelphia.net] has joined #ubuntu-kernel | ||
| desrt | spooky | 05:05 |
| BenC | before uploading 2.6.12-8.12? | 05:05 |
| BenC | yeah, very | 05:05 |
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| fabbione | mdz: BenC and I were wondering if we can upload 2.6.12-8 | 05:05 |
| fabbione | or do you prefer us to wait after Preview Freeze? | 05:06 |
| BenC | here's the thing, I want to get 2.6.12-8.12 uploaded because of the recent ABI changes | 05:06 |
| fabbione | BenC: we should get the inotify fixes and 2.6.12.6 in too | 05:06 |
| BenC | yeah | 05:06 |
| fabbione | since we break the ABI, it's a good idea to push the crack in | 05:06 |
| mdz | I would prefer that you do it now | 05:07 |
| BenC | I was thinking of holding off for some more fixes to go in (mjg sent me a lot yesterday) | 05:07 |
| mdz | do matthew's fixes change the ABI still further? | 05:07 |
| BenC | so do the 8.12 now, and then 8.13 in a few days will be ok? | 05:07 |
| BenC | no | 05:07 |
| mdz | yes, that's fine | 05:07 |
| mdz | though I'm considering doing a Colony on thursday | 05:08 |
| mdz | so not thursday | 05:08 |
| fabbione | BenC: if you commit everything in today i can do the ABI dance tomorrow as soon as i wake up | 05:08 |
| BenC | a lot of these fixes would be nice if you are doing a Colony | 05:08 |
| fabbione | that would make us gain 12 hours | 05:08 |
| fabbione | and make Colony for thursday | 05:08 |
| BenC | yeah, we can tag team it | 05:08 |
| fabbione | mdz: would that work for you? | 05:09 |
| BenC | what time do you wake up, I really want to do most of the next upload to get the system down, but have you around to answer questions | 05:09 |
| fabbione | BenC: it depends.. usually around 4 UTC | 05:10 |
| fabbione | but we need to get elmo or Kamion or mdz around to NEW the packages | 05:10 |
| fabbione | + we need to prebuild them everywhere to get the new ABI | 05:10 |
| fabbione | brb | 05:10 |
| BenC | so that's around midnight for me | 05:10 |
| BenC | I can do that | 05:11 |
| desrt | mmm. thanks for the fast response, guys :) | 05:11 |
| BenC | desrt: I see the patch, and it looks good to me | 05:12 |
| mdz | fabbione: what time UTC would that be? | 05:12 |
| desrt | BenC; :) | 05:12 |
| fabbione | mdz: i wake up at 4 UTC.... | 05:12 |
| desrt | cheers | 05:12 |
| fabbione | mdz: so if BenC will do everything and i only need to be around.. | 05:12 |
| fabbione | mdz: i'd say we can finish in the usual 4/6 hours if there is an ftp-master around | 05:13 |
| fabbione | BenC: if you want to upload all yourself, we can gain quite a lot of time... | 05:13 |
| BenC | main thing I need help with is creating the source package, and make sure I have put everythign together right | 05:13 |
| fabbione | BenC: that's the easiest part :) | 05:14 |
| BenC | yeah, but do I need to kill off any baz stuff in the debian tree? | 05:14 |
| fabbione | BenC: that's even easier ;) | 05:14 |
| fabbione | BenC: you got the source package with the debian/ dir from baz... | 05:15 |
| BenC | and I do the dpkg-buildpackage -S, right? | 05:15 |
| fabbione | cd .. | 05:15 |
| fabbione | dpkg-source -b -i linux-source-2.6.12-2.6.12 | 05:15 |
| fabbione | mkdir temp | 05:15 |
| fabbione | cd temp | 05:15 |
| fabbione | dpkg-source -x ../linux-source-2.6.12_2.6.12-8.XX.dsc | 05:15 |
| fabbione | TADA | 05:15 |
| fabbione | no more baz crap in the debian dir :) | 05:16 |
| fabbione | cd linux-source-2.6.12-2.6.12 | 05:16 |
| BenC | ah, so dpkg-source does it | 05:16 |
| fabbione | dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -S -m'Ben I rock Collins' -k$yourkeyid | 05:16 |
| fabbione | done ;) | 05:16 |
| fabbione | upload to jackass.ubuntu.com in ftp.. no need to use any fancy dir | 05:16 |
| fabbione | BenC: iirc there is a flag that you can pass to dpkg-buildpackage directly... | 05:17 |
| fabbione | but i can never remember it | 05:17 |
| fabbione | it's probably -i | 05:17 |
| BenC | what's the i386 dev machine name? | 05:17 |
| fabbione | concordia | 05:17 |
| BenC | yeah, I think it is | 05:17 |
| BenC | that's it, thanks | 05:17 |
| fabbione | use linux32 dchroot -c breezy-i386 | 05:17 |
| fabbione | it's an amd64... | 05:17 |
| BenC | alright, I'll do these patches, test build, and then upload later today | 05:17 |
| fabbione | so you get both at the price of one ;) | 05:18 |
| fabbione | BenC: that's ok.. remember to commit everything in baz ;) | 05:18 |
| BenC | mdz: anyone be around, so 21:00 UTC? | 05:18 |
| BenC | say* | 05:18 |
| mdz | BenC: 2100 today, or 2100 tomorrow? | 05:19 |
| BenC | today | 05:19 |
| BenC | less than 6 hours | 05:19 |
| mdz | ok | 05:19 |
| mdz | I'll be around, certainly | 05:19 |
| fabbione | BenC: i won't be around at that time.... | 05:19 |
| fabbione | so you will have to do it yourself... | 05:19 |
| BenC | fabbione: no problem, I think I got all I need | 05:19 |
| fabbione | but i am sure you can manage fine... | 05:19 |
| BenC | thanks | 05:19 |
| mdz | make sure elmo will be around to do the byhands | 05:19 |
| fabbione | mdz: will you take care of NEW? | 05:20 |
| fabbione | BenC: also.. ask Kamion (since he is around) to prepare d-i... | 05:20 |
| fabbione | BenC: if he can... | 05:20 |
| fabbione | otherwise i can do it for you now... | 05:21 |
| mdz | fabbione: I can process new binaries, but elmo should do the d-i processing | 05:21 |
| fabbione | mdz: yeps.. | 05:21 |
| mdz | fabbione: but if we need elmo anyway, he can do all of it at once | 05:21 |
| mdz | so there is no point in splitting it between the two of us | 05:21 |
| fabbione | mdz: right :) but if both of you know.. it's better... we are not depended on one that can actually die from one sec to another because of a lightning stroke... | 05:22 |
| BenC | elmo will be around | 05:22 |
| fabbione | and still make Colony | 05:22 |
| fabbione | BenC: i did forward you a mail on how to bump the ABI in D-I | 05:23 |
| fabbione | did you check with elmo if you your upload privileges have been fixed? | 05:23 |
| fabbione | s/fixed/granted... | 05:23 |
| BenC | good question | 05:23 |
| fabbione | ARGH.. brb.. wife is in high bitching mode today | 05:25 |
| BenC | elmo claims no knowledge of me being ok'd to do uploads :) | 05:25 |
| BenC | so I guess that's a no | 05:25 |
| BenC | fabbione: raise the pimp hand, and then...do as your told like a good husband :) | 05:26 |
| BenC | he's going to take care of it though | 05:27 |
| fabbione | re | 05:30 |
| fabbione | eheheh | 05:30 |
| fabbione | BenC: ok.. so i am good to go that you will do all of it... | 05:39 |
| fabbione | if something breaks down horribly, i will be around at 4 UTC :) | 05:39 |
| fabbione | or on a plane to somewher without IP | 05:39 |
| BenC | hehe | 05:40 |
| zul | BenC: then carpet bomb his house | 05:45 |
| BenC | zul: how do you think I got him to act so quickly? | 05:45 |
| BenC | elmo's are very furry and flamable | 05:45 |
| zul | lol | 05:46 |
| fabbione | ahha | 05:46 |
| === zul is installing breezy on his new laptop | ||
| fabbione | zul: you got it??? | 05:46 |
| === BenC knows james would hate that joke :) | ||
| fabbione | ahhaha | 05:46 |
| zul | fabbione: came like an hour ago | 05:49 |
| fabbione | zul: is it nice? | 05:50 |
| BenC | ok, wont be paying attention to IRC for the next few hours | 05:50 |
| fabbione | BenC: just answer my question | 05:51 |
| BenC | which one? | 05:51 |
| fabbione | if you are going to collect the ABI for all 6 arches, or do i need to take care of SCC | 05:51 |
| BenC | I'll collect them | 05:51 |
| fabbione | perfect! | 05:51 |
| BenC | or attempt to anyway | 05:51 |
| BenC | Kamion also wants me to do linux-meta | 05:51 |
| fabbione | BenC: well you have i386/amd64/ppc/ia64 at the DC | 05:51 |
| fabbione | you miss sparc/hppa | 05:52 |
| fabbione | BenC: yes. linux-meta and linux-restricted-modules are in the list of pkgs that we discussed on irc... | 05:52 |
| fabbione | kernel -> linux-restriceted-modules -> linux-meta -> d-i | 05:52 |
| zul | fabbione: very nice | 05:52 |
| fabbione | zul: eheh enjoy it :) | 05:52 |
| fabbione | zul: i am considering to buy a powerbook... | 05:52 |
| zul | oh i will...now i can code in the basement during the summer | 05:52 |
| BenC | I need to get a laptop before UBZ | 05:53 |
| fabbione | BenC: and a passport :) | 05:53 |
| BenC | donations accepted | 05:53 |
| fabbione | BenC: talk to mjg59 for one.. on what to get ;) | 05:54 |
| fabbione | BenC: same here... | 05:54 |
| zul | i dont need a passport i just need sponsorshipt | 05:54 |
| BenC | zul: send me your laptop, and consider it done :) | 05:55 |
| zul | :P | 05:55 |
| zul | im off for lunch...biab | 05:55 |
| fabbione | later zul | 05:56 |
| zul | that is a nice laptop but i have to put it away since i need to work | 06:40 |
| jbailey | BenC: Did you see the conversation in #ubuntu-devel yesterday about needing to find a way of asking the currently running kernel to regenerate its initramfs? | 08:09 |
| fabbione | jbailey: you will need to explain me tomorrow why you want something like that... | 08:10 |
| fabbione | i gotta run now.. | 08:11 |
| jbailey | fabbione: By edit of my boss. =) | 08:11 |
| jbailey | edict, rather. | 08:11 |
| fabbione | yes ok.. to achieve what? | 08:11 |
| jbailey | So that new usplashes can update the initramfs. | 08:12 |
| fabbione | they can do it, even without asking the kernel to regenerate the initramfs | 08:13 |
| fabbione | they just have to call the correct mkinitramfs | 08:13 |
| jbailey | Right, except that they have no good way of knowing who's running, who's installed, etc. | 08:13 |
| jbailey | I think the right solution is initramfs bootloader magic, perhaps. | 08:13 |
| fabbione | i wonder why the kernel-team has been never asked to look at the usplash implementation... | 08:14 |
| fabbione | u <- userland :) | 08:14 |
| fabbione | fix it there :P | 08:14 |
| fabbione | now i don't want to sound silly, but people have been pushing crack into the kernel.. | 08:15 |
| jbailey | Bzzt. initramfs belongs to the kernel, you produce it so nothing else should touch it. | 08:15 |
| fabbione | without the kernel team being exactly informed | 08:15 |
| fabbione | jbailey: yes.. usplash is touching initramfs | 08:15 |
| jbailey | that's part of why I like the idea of bootloader assembly. | 08:15 |
| fabbione | and now the kernel team needs to find a solution for what i believe is a design error.. | 08:15 |
| jbailey | That means that the kernel wouldn't have to do that assembly - takes responsibility for it away from you. | 08:15 |
| fabbione | anyway.. i think i am too tired to appreciate usplash, given that it doesn't even work on my machines :) | 08:16 |
| jbailey | Eh, really? | 08:16 |
| fabbione | better to go and get some food | 08:16 |
| jbailey | How does it fail? | 08:16 |
| jbailey | Enjoy, Fabio. | 08:16 |
| fabbione | jbailey: i don't get anything displayed | 08:16 |
| jbailey | And hello from Angie. =) | 08:16 |
| fabbione | give a hug to her :) | 08:17 |
| fabbione | cya | 08:17 |
| === lamont [n=lamont@15.238.5.156] has joined #ubuntu-kernel | ||
| fabbione | jbailey: there is no way the kernel can address that problem, if not providing an extra info to usplash like: touch /lib/kernel/2.6.12-8.isanofficialubuntukernel | 08:40 |
| fabbione | at that point usplash can parse that dir and update the specific initramfs | 08:40 |
| fabbione | dir or configfile or whatever.. but i guess you get the idea | 08:41 |
| zul | jbailey: have you tried out those xen packages from ubuntu-devel? | 08:41 |
| jbailey | zul: I've not. | 08:43 |
| jbailey | fabbione: The kernel could take an md5sum at generation time, and regenerate the version of the initrd pointed to by /initrd.img iff the md5sum still matches. | 08:44 |
| fabbione | jbailey: i don't see how that can help.. the kernel is not supposed to touch stuff... | 08:45 |
| fabbione | and it's truely pointless to ask the kernel to do a job that userland can and in a much simpler way | 08:45 |
| jbailey | Eh? | 08:45 |
| === jbailey smokes some of Fabio's pipe | ||
| jbailey | This is all packaging. =) | 08:45 |
| fabbione | jbailey: ok.. as i understand it: | 08:46 |
| fabbione | - kernel is installed | 08:46 |
| fabbione | - usplash is installed | 08:46 |
| fabbione | now.. | 08:46 |
| fabbione | initramfs needs to be updated by usplash... | 08:46 |
| fabbione | right? | 08:46 |
| jbailey | Well, it needs updating because of a usplash update. | 08:46 |
| fabbione | because each time usplash is update, the user need to reconfigure the kernel as it is now | 08:46 |
| fabbione | perfect.. than we agree | 08:47 |
| jbailey | Right, except that the kernel owns the initramfs | 08:47 |
| jbailey | Or rather, the kernel package owns the initramfs. =) | 08:47 |
| fabbione | wrong... | 08:47 |
| fabbione | the kernel package generates the initramfs | 08:47 |
| fabbione | it doesn't own it | 08:47 |
| jbailey | Sure it does. The 'touched it last' rule. | 08:47 |
| fabbione | it creates it :) | 08:47 |
| jbailey | What I think could happen is that as soon as you create it, you generate an md5sum hash of it. | 08:47 |
| fabbione | yes, but what is the problem you want to address? | 08:48 |
| jbailey | The problem that you don't know if the user has touched it in the meantime. | 08:48 |
| fabbione | you want to avoid usplash updating an initramfs | 08:48 |
| jbailey | The usplash has no way of knowing that information. It doesn't touch the initramfs at all atm. | 08:49 |
| fabbione | hmmm jeee.... | 08:49 |
| fabbione | well what kind of changes do we expect from user to initramfs? | 08:50 |
| fabbione | via /etc/mkinitramfs ? | 08:50 |
| jbailey | Dude, who knows? =) | 08:50 |
| jbailey | These are *users* we're talking about. =) | 08:50 |
| fabbione | yeah ok.. we will need to change this rule for breezy+1 | 08:50 |
| jbailey | But this mechanism could be used to update lvm, evms, or *mumble*. | 08:51 |
| fabbione | we can't keep working around all possible combinations.. especially in front of a 3/5 years support | 08:51 |
| jbailey | Right. I'd love to see it done as boot time assembly. | 08:51 |
| fabbione | you mean bulding the initramfs at boot time? | 08:51 |
| fabbione | i have a better idea :) | 08:52 |
| jbailey | Right, by the bootloaders. | 08:52 |
| jbailey | I have this vague idea that we could do something like: | 08:52 |
| jbailey | Have grub assemble the initramfs at boottime based on whatever modules seem obvious. | 08:53 |
| fabbione | jbailey: grub for i386.. what about the others? | 08:53 |
| jbailey | As part os S99make_it_possible_to_recover_my_system, then generate a static version of that initramfs. | 08:53 |
| jbailey | That way there's a recovery option that should be guaranteed to work. | 08:53 |
| fabbione | jbailey: i have a better idea... | 08:53 |
| jbailey | Sure. =) | 08:53 |
| fabbione | let's hack on http://fabrice.bellard.free.fr/tcc/tccboot.html | 08:53 |
| fabbione | so that it includes an lspci | 08:54 |
| fabbione | we will build the kernel from sources at boottime | 08:54 |
| fabbione | with the proper hw configuration | 08:54 |
| fabbione | we will build everything inline | 08:54 |
| fabbione | and all the devices that we know can't be inside a pc.. as modules | 08:54 |
| fabbione | :) | 08:55 |
| BenC | we should build the whole kernel as just objects and then do linking on install :) | 09:06 |
| fabbione | BenC: that's too easy :) | 09:07 |
| fabbione | it's more fun to build it from sources | 09:07 |
| BenC | what would be nice, actually, is if the device driver objects were the same whether they were module targets or built-in targets | 09:07 |
| BenC | just the linking would be different | 09:07 |
| fabbione | hmmmm | 09:08 |
| fabbione | you can probably achieve that... | 09:08 |
| BenC | yeah, would require a change in the module abi I'm sure | 09:08 |
| fabbione | nope... | 09:08 |
| fabbione | it's easier than you think... | 09:09 |
| fabbione | afaik the stuff you build inline are all the objects compiles at STAGE1 of the kernel | 09:09 |
| fabbione | modules get STAGE1 -> STAGE2 | 09:09 |
| BenC | yeah, but module.h changes a lot of stuff (init/remove) depending on -DMODULE | 09:10 |
| fabbione | in stage2 from the object created in STAGE1, the .mod.c gets created, builded and linked... | 09:10 |
| BenC | I think the driver object is actually a bit different | 09:10 |
| BenC | it could be | 09:10 |
| BenC | they may have thought of this when they did the 2.6 kbuild system | 09:10 |
| fabbione | if you look in a mod.c that's created by that file we fixed for sparc... | 09:10 |
| fabbione | you see exactly the module interface... | 09:11 |
| fabbione | it's worth a try.. also because it's pretty easy | 09:11 |
| BenC | well if the entire module abi is in the .mod.c, then there you have it | 09:11 |
| fabbione | BenC: the only thing i am afraid is code that does: | 09:12 |
| BenC | someone just needs to write the tools and logic to do an install time linking of a static kernel, with modules just for things like hotpluggable devices | 09:12 |
| fabbione | ifdef CONFIG_FOO=m | 09:12 |
| fabbione | endif | 09:12 |
| fabbione | or something like that | 09:12 |
| BenC | yeah, I think ieee1394 may have (or maybe it's gone now) things like that | 09:12 |
| BenC | there's also the ones that have hardcoded "#ifdef MODULE" | 09:13 |
| fabbione | yeah i have seen a bunch of those | 09:13 |
| BenC | I think the scsi layer is littered with them | 09:14 |
| BenC | which defeats most of the advantage of it | 09:14 |
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| fabbione | yeps | 09:14 |
| zul | later | 09:48 |
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