[12:02] <CarlFK> mdz - #ubuntu is bit noisy now.  I am trying to form a good bug report.  isn't this the proper #?
[12:02] <doko> HiddenWolf: I pretend it to be
[12:03] <mdz> CarlFK: no, see /topic
[12:03] <HiddenWolf> doko, interested in a .ppt that makes OOo2 choke?
[12:03] <Kamion> mjg59: my mistake, text drawing works fine. Why does STATUS draw text in the background colour?
[12:03] <mdz> CarlFK: it is not noisy in here and we try to keep it that way ;-)
[12:03] <pitti> HiddenWolf: you mean, really badly choke?
[12:03] <doko> sure, but that's not that unusual
[12:04] <HiddenWolf> pitti, doko, like in become totally unresponsive.
[12:04] <CarlFK> mdz - dont you think "bug report"  is more dev than support?
[12:06] <HiddenWolf> pitti, just tried opening it after the last crash. I've got a nice big grey 1.9.125 screen at the moment, nothing in it, nothing happening.
[12:06] <mdz> CarlFK: it isn't a bug report until you know what the problem is.  until then, it's a support request.  your cooperation in helping us maintain a productive development environment is appreciated
[12:06] <CarlFK> okee dokee
[12:07] <CarlFK> last Q: what package gets bugged for gksudo ?
[12:08] <HiddenWolf> mdz, what about if you know what the problem is, but not how to debug it, or which component to file on?
[12:08] <pitti> CarlFK: gnome-system-tools, according to your description; gksudo seems to work fine
[12:08] <mdz> HiddenWolf: then you ask for help in #ubuntu
[12:08] <CarlFK> pitti - guessing you missed my posts in #ubuntu ;)
[12:08] <HiddenWolf> mdz, ok
[12:09] <HiddenWolf> doko, is there a bug to that extent I can up the .ppt to?
[12:09] <doko> HiddenWolf: no, please open a new one
[12:14] <HiddenWolf> doko, Attachment #3602  to Bug #14919 Created
[12:14] <mdz> Riddell: how are the kubuntu CDs looking?
[12:14] <mdz> Riddell: ready for preview?
[12:15] <Kamion> mjg59: OK, this looks like it works now. Do you want to look over a diff, or shall I just upload once I've done a full test?
[12:16] <mdz> zul: do you have two launchpad accounts (zul and zulcss)?  if so, you should merge them
[12:16] <mdz> zul: you seem to be using one for motu and another for ubuntu-dev
[12:19] <pitti> ... and broken
[12:21] <mdz> Kamion: I don't think we needed busybox-killall; we're already using the real root at that point
[12:21] <mdz> pitti: how broken?
[12:21] <doko> just tried to boot a recent breezy-i386 live cd. it did fail, because it couldn't read the casper-udeb. bad disk, or other problem?
[12:21] <pitti> mdz: some missing imported tarballs, I can work around that
[12:21] <mdz> doko: bad disc
[12:22] <mdz> Kamion: I suspect that chvt 2; killall bterm; wait for bterm to die; chvt 1 might be a workaround
[12:24] <Riddell> mdz: when I tested the daily install build from today it had a kernel fault on the second part of the installer, going back to the install build from a couple of days ago it suddently got the same fault even though it was fine at the time
[12:24] <pitti> infinity, lamont: it seems that some buildds stopped exporting their translation tarballs; e.g. vernadsky stopped at 20050902
[12:25] <pitti> infinity, lamont-away: this means that I'm missing some translations; I can work around this for now, but could you please look at that?
[12:26] <mdz> Riddell: hardware changed?
[12:26] <mdz> Riddell: I assume the ubuntu builds exhibit the same problem
[12:27] <mdz> Riddell: if you want to take advantage of the stability of the preview freeze for kubuntu, it needs to be ready to release at the same time
[12:27] <Riddell> mdz: same hardware
[12:27] <Riddell> mdz: ubuntu build is still downloading
[12:27] <Kamion> mdz: ah, oops, didn't think of that
[12:27] <Kamion> mdz: I'll try that chvt hack in a moment
[12:28] <Riddell> I've made a couple of changes to the seeds, Kamion could you run a re-build on kubuntu
[12:28] <mdz> Kamion: where does the bterm in d-i come from?
[12:28] <Kamion> mdz: bogl
[12:28] <Kamion> Riddell: running
[12:29] <pitti> lamont-away, infinity: looking a bit closer, it seems that some buildds don't even call pkgstriptranslations any more (e. g. control-center_1\:2.12.0-0ubuntu1_20050904-1510-i386-successful). boggle
[12:29] <Riddell> thanks
[12:29] <mdz> Kamion: so my ideas are four: get usplash working as a workaround (you), try to get bterm to clean up after itself (me), fix X (daniels), chvt hack (you).   anything else I missed that someone ought to try?
[12:30] <Kamion> if bterm can't be made to clean up after itself, then make casper do it
[12:30] <Kamion> although I suspect that will be harder
[12:30] <Kamion> or the casper progress bar workaround :-)
[12:31] <Kamion> but those are both fallback options so we probably don't need to look at them right now
[12:31] <Kamion> Riddell: erm, did you want to have your new kubuntu-meta in there too?
[12:33] <Riddell> Kamion: yes, is it not?
[12:33] <Kamion> Riddell: uploads are currently by approval only, and this is enforced - i.e. your kubuntu-meta_0.51 upload is sitting in a queue waiting for approval
[12:33] <Riddell> right, sorry.  can you approve?
[12:33] <Kamion> yes, just looking
[12:34] <Kamion> well, I can when cron.daily isn't running, will have to wait a few minutes
[12:35] <Kamion> I don't really want to randomly kelly stuff into the archive while archive maintenance is going on
[12:35] <elmo> you can kelly stuff while apt-ftparchive's running, fyi
[12:35] <elmo> the thing to avoid is kelly vs kelly or kelly vs jenna
[12:36] <elmo> but given the speed of cron.daily on the new dl385 it might not matter
[12:36] <jbailey> Can I request that milestone 6.04 be added to Bugzilla?  It would be nice to be able to start pruning out bugs that I don't intend to fix for Breezy that are too invasive.
[12:36] <Kamion> oh, I can? in that case done
[12:36] <Riddell> mjg59 et al: will it be possible to get different usplash artwork for kubuntu?
[12:38] <Kamion> Riddell: it should be a simple matter of programming (I think) but at the moment it's still compiled into the usplash binary
[12:38] <jbailey> Riddell: the png file gets compiled into usplash with png2bogl right now.  I don't know if it's trivial to make it dlopen'able at runtime rather than compiled in.
[12:38] <ogra> Riddell, we'll need separate packages for edu/kubuntu for now i guess
[12:38] <mdz> Kamion: what do I pass for the argument to bterm -f?
[12:40] <bddebian> Riddell: Don't know if you saw but I asked elmo to sync debtags et al 1.4 from experimental (just for you ;-) )
[12:40] <Kamion> mdz: pick /lib/unifont.bgf out of bterm-unifont.udeb
[12:40] <Riddell> bddebian: rocking
[12:40] <bddebian> Riddell: Well that doesn't mean he'll do it.  I'm on his list. ;-)
[12:41] <mdz> Kamion: where does that come from?  I don't see it in bogl
[12:41] <elmo> grr
[12:41] <Riddell> ogra: well it's the rebuilding the initfs that's the difficult bit I think
[12:41] <elmo> Kamion: SendEnv LANG LC_* is satanic
[12:41] <Kamion> mdz: bterm-unifont is a separate source package
[12:41] <Kamion> elmo: it's the only way to make things even have a chance of working properly for a lot of people
[12:42] <ogra> Riddell, the is done on install... just change your sed to depend on kusplash
[12:42] <ogra> seed even
[12:42] <Kamion> the workaround for problems with that SendEnv is much easier than the workaround for problems without it
[12:42] <elmo> kamion: it breaks with some non-openssh servers
[12:42] <Kamion> elmo: gah, really?
[12:43] <elmo> yeah
[12:43] <Kamion> I thought that wasn't supposed to happen with ssh2
[12:43] <Kamion> (nice theory)
[12:43] <zul> someone call my name?
[12:43] <dholbach> zul: i think mdz did
[12:43] <zul> oh crud :)
[12:43] <zul> mdz: ping
[12:43] <dholbach> zul: he referred to your launchpad IDs :)
[12:43] <zul> ah ok
 zul: do you have two launchpad accounts (zul and zulcss)?  if so, you should merge them
 zul: you seem to be using one for motu and another for ubuntu-dev
[12:44] <Kamion> it just opens an env channel and sends name/value pairs down it
[12:44] <elmo> debug1: Sending env LANG = en_GB
[12:44] <elmo> dispatch_protocol_error: type 100 seq 7
[12:44] <elmo> buffer_get: trying to get more bytes 4 than in buffer 0
[12:44] <elmo> if I stop it sending env stuff, works fine
[12:44] <Kamion> an env channel for each variable, actually
[12:44] <elmo> granted, the other end is some non-free sshd, but still - it's hardware, I don't have much choice
[12:44] <Kamion> elmo: I'll check the RFCs sometime when I'm less busy
[12:44] <elmo> kamion: sure, I just wanted to whine
[12:44] <Kamion> see whether openssh is straying outside them
[12:45] <jbailey> zul: Carefule when merging accounts.  There's a bug where it doesn't merge you onto teams properly.
[12:45] <zul> i didnt know i had two accounts in the first place
[12:47] <pitti> Riddell: are you still here for a while to test new language packs?
[12:48] <mdz> wtf
[12:48] <mdz> bogl-bterm works, but when I build it from source it doesn't
[12:48] <mdz> "bogl: don't know screen type 4"
[12:48] <BenC> anyone know a direct contact for amd64 kernel bugs?
[12:48] <Riddell> pitti: yep
[12:49] <pitti> Riddell: http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/langpacks/
[12:49] <pitti> Riddell: I built main/gnome for de and main/gnome/kde for fr
[12:50] <pitti> Riddell: I don't expect any breakage, but testing can never hurt at this stage :)
[12:50] <mdz> oh
[12:51] <mdz> mjg59: I think bogl needs the same fix you did to usplash
[12:51] <mdz> mjg59: for dpkg-architecture or such
[12:51] <mdz> I wonder how many other  LURKING EVIL BUGS there are from that
[12:51] <mdz> mjg59: do you have that patch handy?
[12:51] <mdz> bah, I bet he's asleep
[12:52] <mdz> DEB_BUILD_GNU_CPU is what I assume it wants
[12:53] <Riddell> pitti: is there any change or just updates?
[12:54] <pitti> Riddell: no structural changes, just updated translations
[12:54] <pitti> language-pack*-de works fine for me
[12:55] <pitti> Riddell: awaiting your confirmation, then I can upload the lot
[12:58] <mdz> Kamion: ok, fixed bterm
[12:58] <Riddell> pitti: working here
[12:59] <pitti> Riddell: thanks
[12:59] <pitti> mdz: ok, a 250 MB worth of language pack upload waits for me pressing Enter
[01:00] <pitti> mdz: is acknowledging so many packages manually fine for you? or do you temporarily enable uploads again?
[01:01] <Riddell> pitti: is changing kde-i18n-xx to depend on language-pack-kde-xx the right thing to do (post preview)?
[01:01] <mdz> pitti: note that all uploads require manual approval currently
[01:02] <mdz> pitti: it is fine
[01:02] <dholbach> good night guys
[01:02] <ajmitch> mdz: universe has an exception there, I hope?
[01:03] <ajmitch> I'd hate to flood your queue with universe stuff
[01:03] <mdz> ajmitch: only applies to main
[01:03] <ajmitch> ok, great
[01:03] <pitti> mdz: ok, I have the sizes of the old packs, and as soon as they have built, I will record the sizes of the new ones; then I can fill up the CDs if there are no objections
[01:03] <mdz> pitti: I assume this pkgstriptranslations needs to go in as well?
[01:04] <pitti> mdz: Kamion said it was not preview critical; it just disables stripping of debconf-i18n
[01:04] <pitti> mdz: OTOH, it does not change any code, just the blacklist, so it won't hurt either
[01:06] <TheMuso> c
[01:08] <mdz> Kamion: bogl uploaded
[01:08] <mdz> Kamion: I'm also going to change casper to use reset, to handle the non-fb case more gracefully
[01:12] <pitti> mdz: upload rave finished
[01:12] <mdz> pitti: oh, there were more?
[01:12] <mdz> I already processed the ones which were in the queue
[01:12] <pitti> mdz: the script just finished, yes
[01:12] <mdz> damn
[01:13] <mdz> I already ran cron.daily
[01:13] <zul> night night
[01:14] <pitti> night zul
[01:15] <seb128> hey pitti
[01:15] <seb128> pitti: you have updated the language-packs?
[01:16] <pitti> seb128: yes, just pulled, generated, uploaded, still hot and fresh :-)
[01:16] <seb128> pitti: you rock :)
[01:18] <Riddell> cdimage.ubuntu.com doesn't want to let me connect
[01:18] <pitti> seb128: thanks :-) I didn't want to be the preview blocker, so I grabbed a taxi back home
[01:18] <pitti> Riddell: seems to WFM
[01:19] <Riddell> WFM?
[01:19] <elmo> works for me
[01:19] <seb128> pitti: oh, you were out and went back specially for that ? :(
[01:19] <Riddell> works remotely but not locally with any web browser
[01:23] <Kamion> mdz: rock on
[01:23] <Kamion> mdz: can I upload usplash? it works on powerpc now
[01:23] <Kamion> (I'm IRCing from a live CD booted with usplash working perfectly)
[01:24] <Kamion> so presumably having fixed the problem on three fronts it might actually go away
[01:24] <Kamion> I haven't tried out the chvt hack yet
[01:25] <mdz> pitti: ok, all processed now
[01:25] <mdz> Kamion: can I see the diff?  is it a noop on non-powerpc?
[01:26] <pitti> cool
[01:26] <mdz> Kamion: new bogl udebs should be in the archive at :33 with a little luck; can you turn the d-i crank at that time?
[01:28] <mdz> hmm, looks like it may not make it actually
[01:28] <mdz> nm, there they are
[01:28] <mdz> in unchecked now
[01:31] <Kamion> mdz: http://people.ubuntu.com/~cjwatson/tmp/usplash-powerpc.diff
[01:32] <Kamion> mdz: it's a no-op with the exception of the extra centring code
[01:32] <Kamion> which is relatively obviously a no-op iff bogl_xres == 640 && bogl_yres == 480
[01:34] <Kamion> (which should always be true on vga16fb)
[01:39] <Riddell> Kamion: is the kubuntu iso build still going?
[01:42] <Kamion> Riddell: no, because I was waiting for kubuntu-meta binaries to arrive in the archive
[01:42] <Kamion> Riddell: I've started it now
[01:42] <Riddell> groovy
[01:45] <Kamion> mdz: doesn't that "static int quit" in bterm need to be "static volatile int quit"? You're modifying it from a signal handler.
[01:46] <Kamion> although the two tests are probably far enough apart that the optimiser won't decide not to retest quit
[01:48] <mdz> Kamion: it probably should be, yes
[01:49] <Kamion> mdz: the chvt hack doesn't work very well (I end up on tty2 with the previous contents still visible), but I assume it doesn't matter any more since you've fixed bterm
[01:49] <Kamion> d-i building
[01:52] <Kamion> mdz: if I do 'while killall bterm; do sleep 1; done; chvt 2; chvt 1', it almost works, but I get "Bummer, could not run '/sbin/debian-installer': No such file or directory" just above "Starting Ubuntu"
[01:52] <Kamion> a more elegant loop would probably avoid that most of the time, but it's probably not worth it
[01:52] <mdz> Kamion: I've this nagging feeling that we ought to be waiting for bterm to exit
[01:52] <mdz> though I suppose the worst that would happen would be losing some early console messages
[01:53] <Kamion> if that's the worst, we can sort it out post-preview
[01:53] <Kamion> I tend to agree with you that we should be waiting
[01:55] <Kamion> I've uploaded usplash with that powerpc patch; approve/deny as you see fit
[01:55] <mdz> it should exit very quickly anyway, since I check immediately after the select
[01:56] <lamont-away> pitti: which machine?
[01:57] <pitti> elmo: oh, we have 4 NEW language packs, I just seeded them; can you please NEW them?
[01:58] <pitti> lamont-away: I just noticed vernadsky, I didn't check the other ones
[01:58] <jbailey> mjg59: http://people.ubuntu.com/~jbailey/usplash.tgz has a usplash that allows runtime replacement of the png.  The png requires a bit of prep, not much.  And, erm, please forgive the kubuntu logo. =)
[01:58] <ogra> heh
[01:58] <elmo> pitti: nothing in NEW
[01:59] <pitti> elmo: hmm, I got 4 mails (gnome-ku, gnome-ku-base, kde-rw, kde-rw-base)
[01:59] <pitti> elmo: but maybe mdz already processed them
[01:59] <pitti> thanks anyway
[01:59] <mdz> pitti: I processed both the new and non-new packs
[02:00] <pitti> ah, thanks
[02:01] <mdz> Kamion: you tested your patched usplash on non-powerpc? or do I need to?
[02:01] <Kamion> pitti: btw, please tell me when you add new language-pack-* (I don't care about new language-pack-{gnome,kde}-* if there was already a corresponding language-pack-*), because I need to update the choices list of base-config/language-packs when that happens
[02:01] <Kamion> mdz: haven't yet, can do so on i386 in just a few minutes
[02:02] <pitti> Kamion: ok, will do; the two mentioned above already had language-pack-*
[02:05] <mdz> Kamion: d-i finished yet?
[02:05] <lamont-away> pitti: I'll check all of them.
[02:05] <tritium> mdz, are you in the San Jose, CA area?
[02:06] <pitti> lamont-away: did you find the reason on vernadsky?
[02:06] <mdz> tritium: no
[02:06] <pitti> lamont-away: the export might not actually be broken, but I wonder why pkgstriptranslation is not called
[02:07] <tritium> mdz, okay, thought you were, and I'm on travel here
[02:08] <mdz> I don't actually know any Ubuntu folk in the bay area, though I'm sure there are some
[02:08] <lamont-away> pitti: only vernadsky was disabled
[02:08] <lamont-away> pitti: odds are we rebuilt the chroot.. that or your package overwrote the config file... :-)
[02:08] <tritium> I guess I was confused ;)
[02:11] <mdz> Kamion: presumably x<640 or y<480 were already hopeless before you touched it?  does it bomb out somewhere if that's true?
[02:12] <elmo> I assume I should process this d-i?
[02:12] <pitti> Hi daniels
[02:13] <elmo> kamion/mdz: ^--
[02:13] <mdz> elmo: please
[02:13] <bddebian> Ah, elmo is still here..
[02:14] <mdz> Kamion: btw, awty now knows how to peek at jackass too
[02:14] <daniels> pitti: morning
[02:14] <daniels> Kamion: btw, feel free to release when you feel like it
[02:15] <elmo> (done)
[02:15] <mdz> Kamion: happy to roll in the new usplash once you've verified it on i386
[02:21] <mdz> man down
[02:22] <elmo> turn the boat around
[02:30] <mdz> Riddell: did Kamon trigger new kubuntu livefs builds for you too?
[02:30] <daniels> elmo: 'if you kids don't shut up, I'm turning this bloody boat around!'
[02:30] <mdz> Riddell: or do I need to do so?
[02:31] <elmo> daniels: dude, we lost the first mate
[02:35] <bddebian> Uhm down boys and girls :-)\
[02:39] <bddebian> elmo: Did you happen to see my note about debtags et al?
[02:44] <pitti> mdz: ok, new langpacks are in the archive
[02:44] <mdz> elmo: talked to colin; he's offline and also done for the night
[02:44] <mdz> new casper is in too
[02:44] <mdz> I'll roll new CDs
[02:44] <pitti> mdz: I checked and compared their total size, it's only 3 MB smaller than the previous set, so seed adjustments are not worth the trouble IMHO
[02:45] <elmo> mdz: pfft, what a part timer
[02:45] <elmo> bddebian: can you mail me?  I'm disinclned to do universe syncs tonight
[02:45] <pitti> mdz: unless there is something urgent, I'd go to sleep now; my mobile is on in case of another emergency :-)
[02:45] <bddebian> elmo: NP, thx
[02:45] <mdz> pitti: good night
[02:46] <bddebian> elmo: @ubuntu email or other?
[02:46] <mdz> I think I'm probably going to wait for europe to wake up before even considering a release
[02:46] <pitti> mdz: will test images tomorrow morning
[02:46] <mdz> I'll test overnight
[02:46] <elmo> bddebian: @ubuntu or @canonical is fine
[02:46] <pitti> yes, that would be nice
[02:46] <pitti> good night!
[02:46] <mdz> elmo: if you want to plan to be around for the release, now would probably be a good time to sleep as well
[02:47] <elmo> mdz: ok
[02:59] <tseng> jdub: does planet eventually blacklist me if the server is down?
[04:44] <mjg59> Gosh, lots of usplash stuff
[04:44] <mjg59> jbailey: Riddell: I'll check over the runtime replacement stuff in the morning, if that's ok?
[04:45] <mjg59> mdz: The dpkg-architecture patch was just to add i486 to the list where it should be using vga16
[04:45] <mdz> mjg59: did that oo
[04:45] <mdz> too
[04:45] <Gman_> mjg59, thoughts on toshiba laptops?
[04:45] <mdz> mjg59: it also seemed to exchange DEB_HOST_ARCH with DEB_HOST_GNU_CPU or whatever
[04:45] <mdz> I just mimicked what usplash did, and it seemed to work 
[04:50] <mdz> infinity: around?
[04:53] <infinity> mdz : Yup.
[04:54] <mdz> infinity: cron.daily is finishing up, with a new ubuntu-meta.  if we could get the powerpc binaries uploaded in time for :03, that would save me some time
[04:55] <mdz> should be showing up in wanna-build momentarily
[04:55] <infinity> 0.70?
[04:55] <mdz> non-powerpc architectures are unimportant
[04:55] <mdz> yes
[04:55] <infinity> katie has a lock right now, so your timing is impeccable.
[04:56] <mdz> should be done now
[04:56] <mdz> infinity: are you equipped for CD testing?
[04:56] <mdz> this set is looking pretty compelling so far
[04:57] <mjg59> Gman_: Most of them seem ok - there's minor problems with a couple of the Tecras at the moment, but I'm optimistic
[04:58] <tritium> Gman_, we're working the Tecra issues...
[04:58] <Gman_> mjg59, was thinking about getting a tecra m3
[04:58] <Gman_> they seem light, and have a decent battery length
[04:59] <jsgotangco> the Tecras don't reboot atm
[04:59] <jsgotangco> heh
[04:59] <jsgotangco> but overall all function swork
[04:59] <infinity> mdz : Uploaded.  As for CD testing, I'm equipped, but low on bandwidth.  We have a full mirror, if you're generating jigdo files.
[04:59] <Gman_> jsgotangco, good to know
[05:00] <mdz> infinity: jigdo files are available
[05:00] <mjg59> Gman_: At the moment, we seem to have problems with them rebooting if the ipw2200 driver is loaded
[05:00] <mjg59> Other than that, things should work fine
[05:00] <tritium> Well, the Tecra A2 reboots if you don't enable ipw2200 ;)  (but that's no fun)
[05:00] <mjg59> I'm looking into that - it may be easy enough to fix in the ipw2200 driver
[05:00] <mdz> I need to roll new live CDs due to a powerpc issue, which is what ubuntu-meta was about

[05:00] <mjg59> mdz: When are we aiming for preview?
[05:01] <mdz> but the install CDs are untested as yet
[05:01] <mdz> mjg59: 8 Sep
[05:01] <jsgotangco> oohhh
[05:01] <jsgotangco> that's a few hours from now
[05:01] <jsgotangco> (its already sep 8 here)
[05:01] <tritium> Well, I only had 48 oz. of beer tonight.  I have a few more hours of testing left in me...
[05:01] <Gman_> mjg59, ipw220 being the wireless driver?
[05:01] <mjg59> Gman_: Yeah
[05:01] <infinity> I can't test on powerpc, due to my PPC machine being unable to boot from CD (ancient OldWorld G3 motherboard), but I should be able to test live on amd64 and live/install on i386.
[05:01] <mjg59> Gman_: It seems to reboot fine if you unload it first, so I have a reasonable idea how it can be sorted
[05:01] <infinity> Maybe install on amd64 too, if I can find some free space.
[05:02] <mjg59> Gman_: Of course, if you're wanting to run JDS, I'll need to try to get these patches upstream :)
[05:02] <mjg59> mdz: Cool.
[05:02] <Gman_> mjg59, might well be running solaris it seems :/
[05:02] <Gman_> mjg59, but just wanted to know if you had any swearwords for toshiba, but it seems not :)
[05:03] <mjg59> Gman_: Unf. If you're running Solaris, all bets are off. 
[05:03] <mjg59> ACPI works wonderfully under Linux, but...
[05:03] <Gman_> mjg59, :)
[05:03] <mdz> i386 and amd64 livefs seem good
[05:03] <mjg59> (I hear you may have all sorts of internal magic, but still)
[05:03] <Gman_> jsgotangco, you like the m2?
[05:03] <jsgotangco> Gman_, i use an M2
[05:03] <mdz> I'll only rebuild powerpc and then roll new live CDs which should be equivalent on amd64 and i386, and add usplash on powerpc
[05:03] <Gman_> mjg59, the m2 works fine with solaris, or so i've heard
[05:04] <mjg59> Gman_: I don't believe we've actually tested with an M3, but the rest of the Tecra range seems good
[05:04] <mjg59> So unless they've switched the hardware, life should be fine
[05:04] <Gman_> ok, cool
[05:04] <jsgotangco> Gman_, the M2 generally works, although it has an upstream issue with the nvidia geforce go for external display
[05:04] <Gman_> thanks heaps guys
[05:04] <mjg59> Gman_: So, do you have working ACPI suspend with Solaris? :)
[05:05] <Gman_> mjg59, apparently so, at least on the ferraris
[05:05] <mjg59> Gman_: Wow. There's nothing public on that side of things yet, as far as I can tell.
[05:05] <daniels> yeah, the acer ferrari stuff seems to be the flavour of the month at solaris
[05:05] <mjg59> (nnngh Acer)
[05:05] <jsgotangco> gaahh
[05:06] <jsgotangco> the carbon fiber model looks rad though
[05:06] <mjg59> I will be greatly amused if Solaris supports Acers out of the box
[05:06] <Gman_> mjg59, how well it works, i don't know
[05:06] <Gman_> mjg59, but it's starting to get integrated into nevada, which is solaris 10
[05:06] <mjg59> Gman_: Well, there's little to no ACPI support in the Opensolaris tree
[05:06] <mjg59> But it'd be nice if that improved
[05:07] <mjg59> I only really run on laptops now - it'd be nice to be able to run Solaris
[05:07] <Gman_> think it's either recent, or well, just a bunch of hacks
[05:07] <mjg59> Heh
[05:07] <mjg59> What /would/ be nice would be if we could cooperate with Sun over this
[05:07] <Gman_> part of frkit
[05:08] <mjg59> It'd suck to have to be clean-rooming each others source to figure out which bugs we're working around
[05:08] <Gman_> yeah :/
[05:08] <mjg59> (I'm entirely happy to work with CDDL guys over this sort of stuff)
[05:09] <Gman_> there's talk of either a device driver or x86 community being started
[05:09] <Gman_> so that may help being more public about it
[05:10] <mjg59> Ok, cool
[05:10] <jdub> i love being a turtle
[05:11] <diego> this has probably been asked about 300 times today, but is the preview release on schedule?
[05:11] <jdub> diego: yep!
[05:12] <mdz> new install CDs building, to get usplash/powerpc
[05:12] <diego> jdub: nice, on schedule enough to give me an estimated time?
[05:13] <mdz> diego: that has less to do with the schedule than whether we find any last-minute problems
[05:13] <mdz> diego: and we find those faster the more people test ;-)
[05:16] <diego> well, good luck and have fun then, I can't wait to try it out
[05:17] <jdub> mdz: bonus, i'll have to do a test install on my toilet seat
[05:17] <mdz> jigdo adds an extra 30 minutes to each install CD build cycle
[05:17] <ficusplanet> jdub, Is "The Fridge" launching with Breezy's final release or the preview?
[05:18] <jdub> ficusplanet: on the anniversary of warty's preview release, our first public outing :-) (so, in between)
[05:18] <mdz> it will be another 1.5 hours before I have a set of CDs with the known bug fixed, though it was fixed 20 minutes ago
[05:18] <jsgotangco> mdz, i know this is asking too much but is there any chance can we extend the documentation freeze?
[05:18] <ficusplanet> jdub, Ah, cool.
[05:18] <mdz> jdub: please do; I'll shout when the CDs are ready
[05:19] <jdub> mdz: ok
[05:19] <mdz> jsgotangco: extend it?  it lasts until the final release
[05:19] <mdz> it wouldn't make much sense to extend it beyond that ;-)
[05:19] <jsgotangco> mdz, err you mean we don't have a freeze?
[05:19] <ajmitch> jsgotangco: you want the freeze shortened, right?
[05:20] <mdz> jsgotangco: I mean that today, we begin a freeze period during which we avoid changes which would require documentation updates
[05:20] <jsgotangco> ok i got the freeze right then
[05:20] <mdz> are you saying you want it to start sooner next time?
[05:20] <jsgotangco> no no
[05:21] <jsgotangco> i was just thinking about the translators
[05:21] <jdub> http://atomchip.com/_wsn/page4.html <- heh
[05:21] <jsgotangco> because some of our docs are still quite unpolished
[05:21] <jsgotangco> we all thought we stop writing on the 8th
[05:21] <mjg59> heh
[05:21] <mjg59> Someone at zdnet.com.au reads planet Debian
[05:21] <mdz> jsgotangco: oh, that aspect of the freeze
[05:22] <mdz> jsgotangco: yes, that was also part of the plan, to give translators time to translate documentation
[05:22] <jdub> mjg59: brendon or renai?
[05:22] <mjg59> Dunno
[05:22] <mjg59> Ooh
[05:22] <mjg59> Someone in Progeny read dccalliance.biz
[05:23] <jdub> haha
[05:23] <infinity> Yay!
[05:23] <jdub> just wait until they attack you with their TRADEMARK DOGS OF WAR!
[05:24] <mjg59> jdub: As "Bruce" pointed out to me earlier, we have no right of parody
[05:24] <jdub> oh, the prank call?
[05:25] <mjg59> Heh
[05:25] <mjg59> Yes
[05:25] <mjg59> That was fun
[05:25] <jdub> dude, you totally need to get your hands on one of these QUANTUM LAPTOPS
[05:25] <mjg59> "Why has Bruce suddenly gained a London phone number and a strange accent?"
[05:25] <jdub> with ATOMCHIP
[05:26] <wickedpuppy> anyone ever got error while booting like "Kernel Panic , init not found" ??? I passed init=/init to kernel but still having this error
[05:27] <jay> you don't have to pass init.  you need to make sure root= is right htough
[05:27] <jay> err i thought this was #ubuntu
[05:28] <wickedpuppy> i did ask in #ubuntu
[05:28] <jay> better place for that question ;)
[05:28] <wickedpuppy> i know this is devel chan sorry ... but nobody reply me there
[05:38] <whiprush> jdub: http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=161495&cid=13505179
[05:38] <whiprush> heh
[05:42] <tritium> jdub, any stops on your U.S. tour set yet?
[05:44] <jsgotangco> yes 2.12 is out
[05:46] <mdz> jsgotangco: the idea was to give more time for translating documentation, since it takes a long time to translate
[05:49] <jsgotangco> mdz, ok got it we have 2 docs ready atm we'll cook up a release notes later
[05:50] <tritium> jsgotangco, is there any doc/translation work in Tagalog that my wife could help out with?
[05:50] <jsgotangco> tritium, sure we had tl for hoary
[05:50] <jsgotangco> we'll make po files
[05:51] <tritium> jsgotangco, I'll see if she'd like to get involved in that capacity
[05:51] <jsgotangco> tritium, it's hard heh
[05:52] <tritium> the work?  or the convincing?
[05:52] <jsgotangco> the actual work, there is just not enough good tl words for technical docs
[05:52] <jsgotangco> debian-tl is doing good progress though
[05:52] <tritium> Oh, that makes sense
[05:56] <jdub> tritium: see the wiki page for people who've told me about their petitions so far :)
[05:56] <jdub> whiprush: ha ha ha ha ha ha
[05:57] <tritium> jdub, okay, thanks.  I'd like to get you to come to Albuquerque to talk at Sandia if I can generate a good amount of interest
[05:57] <crimsun> jdub: yeah don't worry, we want you to speak at red hat hq, too =)
[05:58] <jdub> tritium: do a petition that isn't just blog comments :-)
[05:58] <jdub> crimsun: yes, that was an amusing one :-)
[05:58] <tritium> jdub, okay...I'm working on it
[05:59] <jdub> crimsun: i have full encouragement from the power that be (singular, sabdfl) to go ;-)
[05:59] <crimsun> jdub: c'mon down
[05:59] <crimsun> (or up, I suppose?)
[05:59] <jdub> very up, at least geographically ;)
[06:00] <diego> good night all
[06:00] <crimsun> :)
[06:16] <daniels_mobile> Telstra suck.
[06:16] <infinity> s
[06:17] <daniels_mobile> ...
[06:18] <jsgotangco> and expensive
[06:18] <daniels_mobile> Yes. And screwing up our lines as I speak.
[06:20] <daniels_mobile> Yay for WAP to IRC gateways.
[06:21] <daniels_mobile> Should really get my laptop down with GPRS through my phone, too.
[06:21] <infinity> WAP-to-IRC is just so wrong.  Maybe it's time to put down the phone and back away from IRC.
[06:21] <infinity> I may just have the technology to, y'know, phone you if you're needed.
[06:22] <daniels_mobile> So X hasn't exploded and killed preview? Good news.
[06:22] <infinity> ... yet.
[06:22] <daniels_mobile> If only someone came up with a way to use the mobile phone for voice communication!
[06:24] <bob2> you could do voip over IRC over WAP
[06:24] <infinity> bob2 : Why are you still allowed to breathe?
[06:24] <bob2> it's my wit and charm
[06:25] <infinity> Oh look, the new dailes hit cdimage, finally.
[06:25] <infinity> dailies, too.
[06:25] <daniels_mobile> Don't knock it, it's a good idea.
[06:25] <infinity> mdz : Are we hoping this one is good enough to be released unchanged as preview?
[06:26] <mdz> infinity: unfortunately not, since I forgot to update the label
[06:27] <infinity> Huzzah.
[06:27] <mdz> there goes another 70 minutes, thanks jigdo!
[06:27] <infinity> But other than that? :0
[06:27] <daniels_mobile> Yay.
[06:27] <mdz> I successfully installed the last one on amd64 and powerpc
[06:27] <mdz> this one is basically unchanged on i386 and amd64,
[06:27] <mdz> and only adds usplash on powerpc
[06:28] <mdz> new live CDs are building now, same story
[06:28] <infinity> Alright.  I'll jigdo it and pound it a bit, but unfortunately not on powerpc.
[06:28] <mdz> after that, I'll do another install build just to get the labels right
[06:29] <daniels_mobile> Seeing if sync ranges get written out when they shouldn't would be rad.
[06:29] <mdz> daniels_mobile: the current CDs have the latest xorg and would be suitable for testing that
[06:30] <infinity> daniels_mobile : under what circumstances would I expect that to happen?
[06:31] <daniels_mobile> Infinity - monitors with DDC. But shouldn't happen.
[06:32] <daniels_mobile> On i386 or powerpc. Not and64.
[06:32] <daniels_mobile> My Pegasos can be used but it takes a fair bit me work and net boot.
[06:33] <daniels_mobile> T9 can blow me.
[06:34] <infinity> Mmm, local mirror + jigdo = love.
[06:34] <daniels_mobile> BBL.
[06:44] <mdz> new PREVIEW CANDIDATE live CDs are up
[06:45] <mdz> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/current/
[06:46] <infinity> amd64-OVERSIZED ... That looks healthy.
[06:47] <fabbione> morning guys
[06:48] <infinity> Hrm.  Is there no clever way to do jigo-ish stuff for livecds?
[06:48] <desrt> preview candidate? :)
[06:48] <desrt> morning fabbio
[06:49] <fabbione> desrt: yo
[06:50] <fabbione> are install cd up too?
[06:50] <jsgotangco> hmmm
[06:50] <jsgotangco> yay
[06:52] <mdz> infinity: yes, we call it "rsync" :-P
[06:52] <hmrocha> hello
[06:52] <mdz> fabbione: yes, but not candidates yet
[06:52] <mdz> wrong iso label
[06:52] <hmrocha> i'm having a big trouble with ubuntu
[06:52] <mdz> so we wait for jigdo another hour
[06:52] <hmrocha> i trying to deploy ubuntu in all pc's of my faculty
[06:52] <fabbione> mdz: ok
[06:53] <mdz> hmrocha: I appreciate your situation, but this channel isn't the right place to ask for help (see the topic)
[06:53] <hmrocha> ok, sorry
[06:53] <hmrocha> i thought developers could help me more easily
[06:54] <hmrocha> because i think you're the ones that decided to make this like it it
[06:54] <mdz> hmrocha: the developers are busy preparing the preview release
[06:55] <mdz> hmrocha: feel free to ask your question if you want to know the reason why something is as it is, but if you need technical support, it needs to be elsewhere
[06:55] <hmrocha> why only the users in group audio can play audio?
[06:56] <hmrocha> i changed all files in /dev to group students, but they still can't use totem to play files
[06:56] <mdz> because it is a security vulnerability to allow everyone access to audio devices
[06:56] <hmrocha> all files that had group audio
[06:56] <mdz> add your students to group audio
[06:57] <hmrocha> the students are stored in AD
[06:57] <hmrocha> its not very easy
[06:57] <hmrocha> AD == Microsoft Active Directory
[06:57] <hmrocha> there are no users in the machines
[06:57] <mdz> add the users to group audio in active directory, then
[06:58] <hmrocha> hmmm, i don't know how to do that, but i'll look into that
[06:59] <hmrocha> thanks
[07:02] <mdz> mjg59: around?
[07:03] <mdz> who here has a laptop with a funky widescreen LCD?
[07:03] <mdz> 1280x800, that sort of thing
[07:03] <mdz> infinity: can I get a copy of the patch daniel gave you, via email?
[07:03] <bob2> jblack has some widescreen sony horror if you're desperate
[07:03] <mdz> infinity: he just called and explained
[07:03] <mdz> bob2: I think he's likely to be asleep
[07:04] <bob2> pretty sure his sleeping pattern is on par with you atm ;)
[07:05] <ajmitch> he was around a few minutes ago
[07:05] <jblack> I hear you're asking for people with weird screens.
[07:05] <mdz> jblack: exactly
[07:05] <infinity> mdz : See this snippet for how it works:
[07:05] <infinity> mdz : http://cerberus.0c3.net/~adconrad/resolutions.sh
[07:06] <mdz> in a bit, we'll need some testing done
[07:06] <jblack> I have a dual-head setup that gives me something like 3360 x 1024
[07:06] <infinity> mdz : I'm patching zorg itself right now (but that shell script proves the fix)
[07:06] <infinity> s/zorg/xorg/
[07:08] <mdz> infinity: wouldn't it be simpler to use sort -n |uniq ?
[07:08] <mdz> s/wouldn't it/it would/
[07:09] <mdz> jblack: I mean an actual display with a funny size, like a widescreen laptop
[07:09] <jblack> The lcd itself is 1920x1200
[07:10] <mdz> jblack: perfect test case
[07:10] <jblack> The lcd on the laptop is 1920x1200. The attached monitor, giving dual head, is 1600x1024 or some such.
[07:10] <mdz> 1920x1200 is one of the modes that is affected
[07:10] <jblack>  What do you need, exactly? 
[07:11] <infinity> mdz : Yeah, sort -nr | uniq should do the same thing.  This was the crack daniels fed me over the phone. :)
[07:11] <infinity> mdz : Your choice, either can be uploaded in a matter of seconds.
[07:13] <infinity> mdz : The former fix is already signed and waiting, mind you.
[07:13] <mdz> infinity: sort -nr |uniq is more readable and intuitive
[07:13] <infinity> Alright, will re-roll with that, then.
[07:13] <mdz> though, your version does seem like it might sort differently
[07:14] <infinity> Oh, wait.
[07:14] <infinity> Yes, I just noticed.
[07:14] <mdz> does sort -nr get the x,y ordering right?
[07:14] <infinity> sotr -nr | uniq will get the y out of order.
[07:14] <mdz> ok
[07:14] <mdz> infinity: please send a debdiff to me
[07:14] <infinity> Daniel's crazy invocatoin seems to get both in order.
[07:16] <infinity> Sent.
[07:18] <mdz> infinity: ok, let's do it
[07:18] <infinity> Uploading.
[07:21] <infinity> Here, katie, katie, katie.
[07:22] <jblack> What did you guys need from me?
[07:22] <mdz> jblack: I need you to test the current live CD and confirm the bug, and then test a new live CD with a fix in about an hour
[07:23] <mdz> jblack: http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/current/
[07:23] <jblack> If I went to sleep now, I'd get 5 1/2 hours of sleep. If I download a cd an hour from now, that'll be... 4 hours of sleep.
[07:23] <jblack> I suppose I can do that.
[07:23] <infinity> Sleep is for the weak.
[07:24] <bob2> s/weak/!week/
[07:24] <infinity> Besides, I'm not allowed to sleep at all next week, I suspect, so you can sacrifice some time this week. :)
[07:24] <jblack> Hopefully somebody will remember the next time I ask for help with ubuntu.
[07:24] <mdz> jblack: if you can't do it, you can't do it, but so far you're the only person we've found who can test this propely
[07:24] <mdz> jblack: your call
[07:25] <jblack> Better somebody internal gets a fritzed laptop then 10k people on the outside. Lets be a team. =) 
[07:25] <infinity> Hey there, daniel's phone.
[07:26] <daniels_mobile> infinity: to confirm.
[07:26] <mdz> infinity: accepted, will be picked up at :33
[07:26] <infinity> You need to stop thinking on public transport.  Bugfix-by-phone is... Just wrong.
[07:26] <mdz> jblack: it's definitely not a risk to your laptop
[07:26] <jblack> Oh, ok. 
[07:26] <mdz> it's just booting a live CD to test the X autoconfiguration
[07:26] <infinity> daniels_mobile : I cobbled upa quick shell script to test the fix, and it seems to DTRT, packages rolled, uploaded, and ACCEPTED, will build at :33.
[07:26] <daniels_mobile> sort -u -t x -k 1,1nr -k 2,2nr
[07:27] <jblack> You never know. That acpi problem that the upstairs laptop caused the mini-laptop upstairs to break for a month. 
[07:27] <daniels_mobile> Excellent.
[07:27] <infinity> daniels_mobile : Yeah, except my -u is at the end of the argument list, not the beginning.  Makes no difference, though.
[07:27] <jblack> I ended up having to pull the battery and power and let the battry drain to get it to boot again.
[07:27] <mdz> infinity: need a keyboard break; send me an SMS when the binaries are uploaded
[07:27] <infinity> daniels_mobile : But yea, I didn't really trust my ears, hence the shell test first.
[07:27] <jblack> internal cmos battery.
[07:28] <infinity> mdz : Does your phone accept email?... I have nothing to SMS from here. (girlfriend has the mobile phone)
[07:28] <daniels_mobile> OK, that's fine. Thanks.
[07:29] <infinity> mdz : Meh, I'll just direct dial and hang up. :)
[07:30] <infinity> daniels_mobile : What got uploaded was this: "sort -t x -k1,1nr -k2,2nr -u" ... So, except for formatting, you're spot on.
[07:31] <infinity> daniels_mobile : We experimented with "sort -nr | uniq", until we realised that got the Y component of X,Y out of order in some cases.
[07:31] <daniels_mobile> Mad phone skills.
[07:32] <daniels_mobile> Right. This sorts by the first part before the x ...
[07:32] <infinity> daniels_mobile : Yeah, I deciphered what it did while I was testing it. :)
[07:32] <daniels_mobile> ... then by the component after x as a tie break.
[07:32] <infinity> daniels_mobile : Mostly cause I have issues randomly changing code I don't understand, so I... Uhh.. Don't until I understand it.
[07:33] <daniels_mobile> Heh.
[07:34] <infinity> 3 hours of silence on breezy-changes, and then one lone xorg upload.  You must be so proud.
[07:34] <bob2> hm, I've never lasted until preview before dist-upgradeing
[07:34] <daniels_mobile> I win at the last-minute upload game!
[07:35] <jsgotangco> the last minute upload borked my resoultion =)
[07:36] <daniels_mobile> WHAT?!?
[07:36] <jsgotangco> Nvidia GeForce Go 5200 blurry rez at 1024x768
[07:37] <infinity> Not the same last minute upload.
[07:37] <jsgotangco> ahh
[07:37] <infinity> The one we're talking about hasn't built yet.
[07:38] <daniels_mobile> I'd love more details on that. Actually ... I see why. I think.
[07:38] <infinity> daniels_mobile : Don't even start thinking about another upload.
[07:38] <infinity> daniels_mobile : Or, if you do, do it QUICK. :)
[07:39] <daniels_mobile> Set DEBUG_XORG_PACKAGE=yes, and just dpkg -i it. If my hunch is right, you'll get 'not probing; writing out sync ranges'.
[07:40] <daniels_mobile> If so, only affects upgrades, so we don't need to block preview on it. Simple fix.
[07:41] <infinity> jsgotangco ---^
[07:41] <jsgotangco> hmm hold on
[07:42] <daniels_mobile> 'it' is the xserver-xorg package, in this case.
[07:43] <infinity> And we're finally building.
[07:50] <jsgotangco> daniels, humans 1 xorg 0
[07:51] <daniels_mobile> So it says that?
[07:51] <jsgotangco> it does
[07:52] <daniels_mobile> Excellent. Easy fix. Only bites upgrades, not new installs, so not preview-critical. Will upload after preview's released.
[07:55] <daniels_mobile> Thanks for testing. I'll BBIAB.
[07:56] <jblack> I dn't have anything to test? 
[08:01] <infinity> jblack : Well, did you test the current live image?
[08:01] <infinity> jblack : To confirm that it doesn't offer you the right res?
[08:01] <jblack> I haven't done anything. I'm still waiting for instructions
[08:01] <infinity> Oh, feh.
[08:02] <infinity> jblack : We wanted you to test the current live image to confirm that it doesn't offer you the res you want/need (1920x1200, right?)
[08:02] <jblack> Correct.
[08:02] <infinity> jblack : Then, shortly, once we've built new livecd images, test again to make sure it does.
[08:02] <jblack> What do you mean "again".
[08:02] <infinity> As in, download the new image and re-test.
[08:02] <infinity> To make sure we've fixed the bug.
[08:03] <infinity> (Though we're pretty sure we have anyway)
[08:03] <jblack> I know you guys want me to test two livecds, but I don't know what special place they're in and what you specifically want me to test (though I surmise "yeah, x runs" is sufficient
[08:03] <infinity> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/current/
[08:03] <jsgotangco> oh!
[08:03] <infinity> The livecd from there right now is the one that should give you an incorrect resolution (or just not work at all, depending on how stubborn your laptop is)
[08:04] <infinity> jblack : And the livecd from that same source in an hour or two should be the "fixed" on.  mdz will let you know when that is.
[08:04] <jblack> Downloading [   ]  breezy-live-i386.iso            08-Sep-2005 05:33  650M  Live CD for PC (Intel x86) computers (standard download).
[08:04] <jblack> eta is 36 minutes
[08:04] <infinity> Danke.
[08:04] <jblack> make that 40.
[08:05] <jdub> mdz: ppc install is up?
[08:06] <infinity> jdub : Yes, but not the final test images (still waiting on the new xorg to build for that)
[08:07] <infinity> jdub : If your resolution isn't some oddball one, test the current image, nothing will change for you with the new one.
[08:07] <jblack> _just in case_ I don't come back, somebody please tell steva where I went.
[08:07] <infinity> jblack : Heh.
[08:10] <mdz> infinity: looks like it's installed on i386 and amd64; what's powerpc's excuse?
[08:11] <mdz> jblack: I gave you the download URL
[08:11] <infinity> mdz : adare is still building.
[08:11] <mdz> jblack: an hour ago
[08:11] <infinity> mdz : Watching it like a hawk, will upload as soon as it's done.
[08:11] <jblack> Hmm. My screen didn't mark it that you spoke to me. did you put jblack: in front of it? 
[08:11] <jdub> infinity: grab the image currently in current? :)
[08:11] <infinity> Aye.
[08:12] <jdub> tops
[08:12] <mdz> Sep 07 22:22:57 <mdz>   jblack: I need you to test the current live CD and confirm the bug, and then test a new live CD with a fix in about an hour
[08:12] <mdz> Sep 07 22:23:13 <mdz>   jblack: http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/current/
[08:12] <ajmitch> latest daily is the same as the one you want tested, then?
[08:13] <mdz> ajmitch: only if you have a funky LCD
[08:13] <mdz> otherwise, we need you to test the next one
[08:13] <jblack> And there it is
[08:13] <jblack> Sorry. Missed it.
[08:13] <ajmitch> ok, mine's normal, I'll test the next one then
[08:13] <jdub> mdz: ooh, ia64 status query coming in on u-d ;)
[08:14] <infinity> mdz : powerpc uploaded.
[08:15] <infinity> If you don't feel like a manual corn.daily, it'll go in at :33, I guess.
[08:15] <infinity> cron, too.
[08:15] <infinity> Mmm, daily corn.
[08:16] <mdz> infinity: cron.daily running
[08:24] <mdz> jdub: there is a ppc install up, but it isn't a candidate for final
[08:24] <mdz> it works though
[08:32] <daniels> bloody hell.
[08:33] <daniels> now, I'm not a telecommunications engimaneer.
[08:33] <daniels> but I can tell you that if you have two pairs of phone line coming into your house, you're not going to be able to put three lines on it.  thankyou, telstra.
[08:33] <jsgotangco> =)
[08:35] <daniels> infinity: probably too late, but there's a recent-ish livecd kicking around on brainfreeze, either ~daniels/canonical/d-i, or ~daniels/canonical/livecd.  amd64.
[08:35] <jdub> daniels: isdn
[08:35] <jdub> quite easy, really :-)
[08:36] <infinity> daniels : Who said anything about 3 lines?... I though they were doing two voice + 1 DSL?... Or was the DSL supposed to be on a dry pair, not on one of the voice lines?
[08:36] <infinity> daniels : Or was it going FROM that to 3 voice + DSL?
[08:36] <pitti> hi
[08:37] <ajmitch> hi pitti 
[08:37] <pitti> Hi Kamion 
[08:37] <pitti> Hi ajmitch 
[08:37] <ajmitch> & Kamion 
[08:37] <mdz> morning folks
[08:37] <infinity> Ooo, the cavalry has arrived.
[08:38] <mdz> Kamion: candidate build is in progress after a xorg bugfix
[08:38] <mdz> ppc usplash works for me
[08:38] <mdz> successful amd64/powerpc install/live on the last set of CDs
[08:38] <mdz> could use some i386 success reports from the channel
[08:39] <daniels> jdub: well, we have one phone line coming in right now, plus dsl.  they were trying to get a second line in, but didn't realise that this may possibly require a third pair.  so I had no landline or DSL for most of the day.
[08:39] <infinity> i386 will be happening on my laptop when I'm sure I can stop caring about last-minute builds and start rebooting. :)
[08:39] <daniels> infinity: the DSL is supposed to be on a dry pair
[08:40] <mdz> infinity: all the builds are in as far as I can tell?
[08:40] <infinity> daniels : Ahh, kay.  Not used to that anymore, since all my DSL in Australia has been Data-over-voice... Though all my DSL lines in Canada were dry pairs.
[08:40] <infinity> mdz : Yup.  And livefs builds are going/good?
[08:41] <mdz> daniels: do you know what this report of a missing module section in xorg.conf on -devel is about?
[08:41] <mdz> infinity: going
[08:41] <Lathiat> daniels: ...you have dsl on a second pair?
[08:41] <infinity> Oh, look, ia64 caught up.
[08:41] <mdz> install CD build in progress, livefs builds in progress, live CD build queued
[08:41] <Lathiat> daniels: never seen that before
[08:41] <Lathiat> that just doesnt happen here.
[08:42] <mdz> Kamion: we need to do something about jigdo before final
[08:42] <mdz> this is just silly
[08:43] <daniels> Lathiat: we have weirdo dsl.  nextep provisioned it themselves, bypassing telstra.
[08:43] <daniels> mdz: there's code to explicitly handle that case in current xorg; it's a hangover from a single bad version earlier on in breezy.
[08:43] <daniels> mdz: so if it's still happening now, today, I'll be surprised.
[08:44] <pitti> mdz: oh, how long until the candidate build? I just download the current daily, but if it arrives fast, I rather wait for some minutes
[08:44] <mdz> daniels: report was 05 sep
[08:44] <Lathiat> daniels: oh right
[08:44] <mdz> pitti: about one hour
[08:44] <Lathiat> daniels: that happens here but they still use the voice pair
[08:45] <pitti> mdz: ok, then I only test the live CDs in that time; no need to waste 45 minutes for an install then
[08:45] <Lathiat> daniels: they just share it with telstra
[08:45] <mdz> pitti: better to wait; there are new live CDs coming too
[08:45] <mdz> and they have X changes
[08:45] <pitti> ok
[08:45] <daniels> mdz: i think that was roughly when I added the brute-force-you-will-get-your-goddamn-modules bit to .config, so we should be okay.
[08:49] <mdz> Kamion: either jigdo needs to get faster, or we need to do it after publishing so that we don't have to wait for it
[08:51] <pitti> mdz: is the live build already running? we need to downsize amd64
[08:51] <mdz> jblack: any luck with that live CD?
[08:51] <TheGodFather> mdz: i had say that live works fine :)
[08:51] <mdz> pitti: no, it isn't yet
[08:51] <jblack> downloaded image and starting to burn now
[08:51] <pitti> mdz: ok, then let's quickly throw out 16 MB
[08:51] <daniels> bbiab
[08:51] <mdz> pitti: but it is too late to process new metapackages
[08:51] <pitti> hm
[08:51] <mdz> that takes an hour
[08:51] <pitti> well, most people won't have a problem with 666 MB
[08:51] <TheGodFather> mdz: other than the net setup that's pretty peculiar in my house
[08:51] <TheGodFather> SCORE!
[08:52] <mdz> TheGodFather: what's peculiar about it?
[08:52] <infinity> pitti : Probably not worth worrying about for preview, almost eveyrone testing it will be using 700 MB blanks anyway.
[08:52] <pitti> infinity: ack
[08:52] <TheGodFather> essid (wifi)
[08:52] <infinity> (Can you even BUY 650 MB blanks anymore?)
[08:52] <TheGodFather> it's not broadcasted
[08:53] <TheGodFather> so there is no way for the livecd to know it in advance
[08:53] <TheGodFather> but the card was detected properly
[08:53] <TheGodFather> cards actually---
[08:53] <pitti> infinity: I don't see them in the shops here
[08:55] <mdz> jdub: who moderated this impi post to ubuntu-announce?
[08:56] <jblack> finalizing... about to reboot. anythhing needed other than a "yes, x starts" ? 
[08:57] <jblack> mdz: ^
[08:57] <jblack> infinity: ^
[08:57] <mdz> daniels: how about the keyboard vs. kbd issue also on -devel in the past 24 hours?
[08:57] <infinity> jblack : Erm, it gave you the right resolution?
[08:57] <jblack> I haven't restarted yet. 
[08:58] <mdz> jblack: the expected behaviour is "X starts with the wrong mode"
[08:58] <jblack> Ok. 
[08:58] <jblack> brb
[08:58] <infinity> jblack : Oh, you're doing install, not live?
[08:58] <pitti> mdz: for the record, I did a hoary->breezy upgrade and then I had "kbd" in xorg.conf
[08:58] <jblack> infinity: live
[08:58] <jblack> brb
[08:58] <mdz> pitti: did it work?
[08:58] <infinity> Oh, finalizing the CD image.  I'm retarded.  I thought you meant finalizing the install. :)
[08:58] <infinity> jblack : Carry on. :)
[08:59] <pitti> mdz: well, the gnome part didn't (#14895), but the X side seemed to be fine
[08:59] <pitti> mdz: I will triage the bug a bit, but it rather seems to be a gnome bzg
[08:59] <pitti> bug, even
[09:06] <jblack> Ok. I'm in the first livecd
[09:06] <jblack> I have 1920x1200 on the main monitor
[09:06] <jblack> on the main lcd, that is
[09:06] <mdz> that's disappointing
[09:07] <infinity> That does seem odd...
[09:07] <jblack> The attached monitor is in mirror mode at 1600x1024
[09:07] <mdz> daniels: ^^^
[09:08] <infinity> The livecd set it up that way by default?
[09:08] <mdz> daniels: I expected this to be a good test case, since we have 1920x1440 and 1920x1200
[09:08] <jblack> All I hit was enter three times and start up a shell to run xwininfo a few times and ssh into mercury to talk.
[09:08] <dholbach> good morning
[09:08] <pitti> Hi dholbach 
[09:09] <dholbach> morning martin
[09:09] <infinity> jblack : Weird.
[09:09] <jblack> by the way, if anyone cares, there was an error during boot about debian-installer. I didn't see the error long enough to write it down.
[09:10] <mdz> Riddell: kubuntu preview status?
[09:10] <mdz> jblack: that's known
[09:10] <jblack> I'm still in the livecd if you want me to look at things.
[09:10] <mdz> jblack: /var/log/casper/post.log would be interesting
[09:11] <jblack> should be at http://mercury.linuxguru.net/~jblack/post.log
[09:12] <infinity> mdz : Hrm, maybe a laptop that only reports one available mode was a bad test. :)
[09:13] <mdz> yeah, on further consideration the impact of this bug was probably smaller than we thought
[09:13] <jblack> This screen used to do other resolutions back in windows.
[09:14] <infinity> mdz : Note that DCRESOLUTIONS doesn't actually include his res in the list, but it gets used anyway, cause his display told us it was the only one it had.
[09:14] <infinity> jblack : The windows drivers blindly ignore what the display claims to be able to do, and just gives you all the options BELOW the max option.
[09:14] <infinity> jblack : And prays your display can stretch to accomodate.
[09:15] <jblack> I say used to because something ate the hal dll and rather than reinstall windows resized the ext3 filesystem.
[09:15] <mdz> infinity: is there still a point in having him test the new one?
[09:15] <infinity> jblack : Not sure whose behaviour is really more correct, but we now should offer a very comprehensive list regardless (but default to your native)
[09:15] <infinity> mdz : Getting a log from the new one would verify the bug is fixed, but in his case, both will (should) obviously work fine.
[09:16] <jblack> If you don't need anything else from this one I'll switch back over so that I can get that rsync --partial started...
[09:16] <infinity> mdz : The only reason it works on the livecd is because we never ask the debconf question.  Clever.
[09:17] <jblack> where's reboot on this thing? 
[09:17] <infinity> mdz : In any scenario where the question actually got asked, jblack would have been screwed (cause his resolution isn't in the select list)
[09:17] <jblack> found it
[09:18] <infinity> mdz : At least, that's how I'm reading this log.  We seed debconf with the list, then just set it to what we got from the earlier probe and ignore the list.
[09:19] <infinity> mdz : If the probe had failed for any reason, he would have been presented with a list that didn't have his resolution in it, I assume.
[09:20] <infinity> Either way, can't go back in time and unfix the bug, so let's just pretend it was urgent enough to postpone testing for a couple of hours and carry on, shall we? :/
[09:22] <jblack> Also, reboot doesn't.
[09:22] <Kamion> mdz: ok, just woken up and am catching up (the IRC client connection was automatic ...)
[09:22] <mdz> jblack: works for me; can you be a touch more specific?
[09:23] <infinity> jblack : DO you have an update-notifier or update-manager process spinning in the background, by any chance?
[09:23] <infinity> jblack : Or anything at all in "ps ax" that looks like it's suspiciously stopping your session from closing?
[09:23] <jblack> Ok. The lcd turns off, the monitor stays on and says something like ...[reboot]  on the bottom. I hold the power button for four seconds to turn the machine off, tap the power button to turn it back on.
[09:23] <jblack> infinity: I'm back in my normal systme setup.
[09:24] <infinity> Oh, it didn't apm/acpi reboot.
[09:24] <infinity> That could be something specific to your laptop.
[09:24] <jblack> Its undoubtedly an acpi problem. ubuntu on this machine was a nightmare on this machine for the last year.
[09:24] <infinity> I'll have to test here and make sure the reboot gets tripped okay on my machine.
[09:24] <jblack> I was getting over 100 megabytes a day of log errors at one point. 
[09:25] <infinity> What kind of laptop is that?
[09:25] <jblack> I eventually solved that with nolapic in grub's config. 
[09:25] <jblack> Whether its still necessary, I don't know.
[09:25] <infinity> And did you just accidentally volunteer to have us commandeer it for the entirety of UBZ?
[09:25] <jblack> Its a Sony Vaio VGN-A190.
[09:26] <jblack> I um... um.. I was looking for an excuse to buy a new baby laptop to replace the dying one in my bedroom, I guess? 
[09:26] <jblack> For all I know you guys fixed it three months ago, though.
[09:27] <jblack> btw, suspend to disk works, suspend to memory doesn't.
[09:27] <infinity> mjg59 : Do we have a facility to fiddle things like turning local apic off and on, depending on system board DMI dumps on anything equally nasty/clever?
[09:27] <jblack> suspend to disk _mostly_ works, actually. The docking station doesn't get powered back up if I suspennd to disk, take the machine out of the docking station, wake up, and put it back 
[09:27] <infinity> jblack : yeah, I would expect that, after the bit about not being able to reboot, and requiring nolapic.
[09:28] <infinity> (Expect that suspend to ram wouldn't work, that is)
[09:28] <jblack> on the baby laptop upstairs, suspend to anything results in the machine coming back up, but the backlight stays off. 
[09:28] <infinity> Suddenly, I feel pretty good about how well my hardware is supported.
[09:28] <jblack> that one is a sony as well.
[09:29] <jblack> anyways, I'm *not* complaining.;
[09:30] <jblack> You guys do a great job. I'm happy with what I've got, and I'm not asking for help
[09:31] <jblack> Do you guys want me to bring the docking station as well to ubz? 
[09:32] <infinity> If it's not too much trouble, and someone has a chance to look at it, it may be educational.
[09:32] <jblack> no problem at all. I'm driving, so I can load up
[09:32] <jblack> I can even bring you a machine that xen can't handle if you wish. :) 
[09:33] <infinity> Oh, rock on, then.  Bring whatever gear you can fit in the car, and if we have a chance to play with it, we will. :)
[09:33] <jblack> that one is one of those 1st gen acpi machines. 
[09:34] <jblack> Ok. I'll bring the minivaio (the baby one), which is on its very last legs, the ex-wife's compaq laptop (broken keyboard and cdrom), comet (the vgn-a190 you had me test) and ...what at one point was called rms. :) 
[09:34] <jblack> the minivaio used to be the ex's too. She was hard on laptops.
[09:35] <jblack> Oh, and I can bring another vaio as well. a....grv550. That's the daughters.
[09:36] <jblack> let me get that rsync started.
[09:39] <siretart> hm. has anyone been using ddd recently?
[09:39] <siretart> moving window around makes it segfaulting for me (current breezy). will investigate further..
[09:39] <jblack> starting:
[09:39] <jblack> jblack@comet:~/Desktop$ rsync -B 65536 -v --partial rsync://cdimage.ubuntu.com/cdimage/daily-live/current/breezy-live-i386.iso  ./breezy-live-i386.iso
[09:40] <jblack> 33%...
[09:41] <jblack> 2/3...
[09:41] <jblack> Hmmm. 
[09:42] <jblack> The new livecd is exactly the same size as the old livecd? 
[09:42] <jblack> jblack@comet:~/Desktop$ -rw-rw-r--    1 jblack jblack  681308160 2005-09-08 02:44 breezy-live-i386.iso
[09:42] <jblack> -rw-rw-r--  1 jblack jblack 681308160 2005-09-08 03:41 breezy-live-i386.iso
[09:42] <Kamion> has anyone tested an install on a wireless-connected machine? there've been some bugs about wireless configuration not being carried over to the second stage, and I'd like to make sure they're isolated rather than systemic
[09:42] <Lathiat> Kamion: worked with colony 4
[09:43] <Kamion> ok, that's probably good enough
[09:43] <Lathiat> Kamion: stage 2 ? reboo t?
[09:43] <Kamion> thanks
[09:43] <Kamion> Lathiat: yes
[09:43] <Lathiat> well i had wireless when i rebooted so
[09:43] <Lathiat> i assume it worked
[09:43] <Lathiat> interface was up, dhcpd
[09:43] <Lathiat> i didnt specify a wep key or anything tho
[09:43] <jblack> infinity: I get a md5sum of 250c5cd3443959f0deea7a43e7818893 on the new image, which has the same filesize as the old image.
[09:43] <Lathiat> so its mostly default apart from knowing it asked for eth1 and dhcp
[09:44] <Mithrandir> doko: do you have any idea about http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=14539 ?
[09:45] <infinity> jblack : Not sure if there IS a new image yet.  You'd have to ask mdz.
[09:45] <jblack> mdz: ^ 
[09:45] <mdz> not yet
[09:45] <mdz> ETA 10m
[09:45] <jblack> Ok. no problem.
[09:45] <mdz> new install CDs are up though
[09:45] <mdz> NEW INSTALL CDS READY FOR TESTING
[09:45] <Kamion> at least new xorg explains why my rsync is taking ages
[09:46] <mdz> 20050908.4
[09:47] <jblack> infinity: Will that shopping list I gave you above help any? 
[09:47] <infinity> mdz : Did you change the labels this time?
[09:47] <infinity> mdz : The jidgo template claims it's: 'Ubuntu 5.10 "Breezy Badger" - Alpha i386' (breezy-install-i386.iso)
[09:48] <mdz> Kamion: I changed CONF.sh as instructed...
[09:48] <mdz>     export OFFICIAL="Preview"
[09:48] <mdz> infinity: 20050908.4?
[09:49] <fabbione> mdz: permission to upload xdm (universe) to fix 14412
[09:49] <infinity> mdz : Oh, wait, I think my jigdo is cacheing.
[09:49] <mdz> fabbione: universe is not frozen
[09:49] <infinity> 'Ubuntu 5.10 "Breezy Badger" - Preview i386' (breezy-install-i386.iso)
[09:49] <infinity> Better.
[09:49] <daniels> nice
[09:49] <infinity> mdz : False alarm.
[09:49] <mdz> phew
[09:49] <doko> Mithrandir: no idea, works for me on amd64
[09:50] <mdz> if I had to wait another 70 minutes for a label change I would have killed
[09:50] <daniels> mdz: i've followed up with more information requested for keyboard vs kbd
[09:50] <Mithrandir> doko: yeah, works for me as well.
[09:50] <mdz> or rather done it by hand
[09:51] <daniels> we finally have two phone lines plus the dsl
[09:51] <daniels> my laptop celebrated this great news by getting down to 3% battery
[09:52] <Lathiat> daniels: mmm
[09:52] <daniels> mdz: the main thing is that 14751's fixed, a) because I think that was the worst manifestation, b) because the submitter is a complete prick and I would love for him to go away
[09:52] <Lathiat> most interesting you were using a separate pair
[09:52] <daniels> Lathiat: nextep, dude.  it's crazy commercial dsl.
[09:52] <Lathiat> daniels: yeh but we have commercial companies with their own dslaams and they share the copper
[09:53] <Lathiat> how they do that sanely is beyond me but they do
[09:53] <Kamion> mdz: yeah, I've incorporated that into arch, thanks, looks fine
[09:56] <daniels> Lathiat: yeah, go figure.  all I know is that NEC have their own kit in the exchange.
[09:56] <Lathiat> daniels: right, same as the other ISPs here but yeh, interesting
[09:57] <daniels> alright, battery's dead.  i'm out for the next 2-3 hours.
[10:00] <mdz> jblack: 20050908.5 is mirroring now
[10:00] <jblack> ok
[10:00] <jblack> looks like its there.
[10:02] <mdz> NOTICE: the current daily and daily-live CDs are preview candidates.  Please test them and report success or failure to the channel!
[10:03] <dholbach> morning seb128 
[10:04] <seb128> hey dholbach
[10:04] <jblack> 33%
[10:05] <jblack> 75%
[10:08] <pitti> yay
[10:08] <Mithrandir> is the live cd VT switching bug tracked down yet?
[10:09] <Burgundavia> jdub, we really need to do something about the Preferences menu in Breezy+1
[10:09] <jblack> rebooting
[10:17] <ubuntu> Ok. I'm in the cd.
[10:17] <ubuntu> mdz: ready
[10:17] <ubuntu> infinity: ready
[10:19] <jblack_> heh. I can't see nicknames in irssi on the livecd. :) 
[10:20] <jblack_> That's better.
[10:20] <daniels> Mithrandir: should be okay
[10:20] <daniels> pitti: tell me about it
[10:21] <jblack_> daniels: Would you be interested in monitors audibly clicking when doing a shutdown now -r ? 
[10:21] <daniels> jblack_: at which point?  a click on a mode switch is pretty normal.
[10:21] <Kamion> Mithrandir: I think we nailed most of that yesterday, over a few iterations
[10:21] <pitti> daniels: ah, it's just a crackful dream I had the other day :-)
[10:22] <daniels> jblack_: if they blow up, I'm interested ... but *totally* not responsible.
[10:22] <daniels> pitti: heh
[10:22] <jblack_> daniels: I dualhead.  When I leave X, the lcd drops to console. The monitor clicks every 2 seconds or so (sounds like the click monitors often do during change of resolution). 
[10:23] <jblack_> That doesn't happen if I ctrl-alt-backspace.
[10:24] <daniels> neat.  running usplash, perchance?
[10:25] <jblack_> not intentionally?
[10:25] <daniels> hrm
[10:25] <daniels> *shrug*
[10:25] <daniels> just one of those things
[10:25] <jblack_> reading apt-cache show, I don't think so.
[10:26] <daniels> anyway, time to go cook dinner.  i'm not going to irc from the stove, like last night.
[10:26] <bob2> soup?
[10:26] <daniels> bob2: nah, just random stir fry over at dad's place
[10:26] <daniels> bob2: thursday -> family dinner
[10:26] <bob2> ah
[10:26] <jblack_> mdz: There? 
[10:27] <jblack_> infinity: Hello? 
[10:27] <daniels> bob2: between last night's effort (I didn't eat any, just froze it all), and some I had frozen before, I have enough soup to last me until UserLinux releases
[10:27] <daniels> (ha ha)
[10:27] <Kamion> whoa, slightly dodgy progress bar in base-config
[10:27] <Kamion> oh well
[10:27] <mdz> jblack_: yes?
[10:27] <bob2> hahah
[10:27] <jblack_> I'm in the second livecd
[10:27] <mdz> Kamion: dodgy how?  I didn't notice anything untoward, but I didn't watch it the entire time either
[10:28] <jblack_> 1920x1200 of course. What would you like? 
[10:28] <Kamion> mdz: it goes up to 11% and then jumps back to 4%, near the start
[10:28] <Kamion> it's only noticeable if you're paying fairly close attention
[10:28] <Kamion> so much not a big deal for preview though
[10:29] <mdz> jblack_: any additional testing you want to do is helpful, but the detection of the panel size is what we wanted to test. thanks.
[10:29] <jblack_> Oke-doke
[10:29] <sivang> morning all
[10:29] <pitti> Hi sivang 
[10:29] <sivang> pitti: how's bugsquashing going?
[10:30] <mdz> sivang: it's CD testing time
[10:30] <pitti> sivang: now it's CD testing time; do you have some time to thest them?
[10:30] <Burgundavia> Kamion, I noticed something similar with my colony 3 install, jumped from 64% backt o 56%
[10:31] <Kamion> Burgundavia: that's much weirder, but colony 3's old enough that I'm not too bothered unless you can reproduce it with newer
[10:31] <Kamion> 64% is in the middle of the desktop installation and it really shouldn't jump around randomly there
[10:31] <Burgundavia> Kamion, I didn't bother filing a bug because I couldn't reproduce it
[10:31] <sivang> mdz, pitti : ofcourse I do, I have a seperate /home and /root , so I can probably install over this office workstation of mine, however is there anyway to save the alredy installed packages?
[10:31] <mdz> Kamion: I didn't think debconf progress bars were capable of going backward
[10:32] <mdz> sivang: just install to a separate partition
[10:32] <Kamion> mdz: they certainly are, you can update them with SET (absolute) as well as STEP (relative)
[10:32] <mdz> Kamion: and base-config does that?
[10:32] <Kamion> mdz: and base-config always uses PROGRESS SET 'cos the maths are much simpler that way
[10:32] <mdke> I'm still getting xkb errors on my hoary->breezy machine, i have touched nothing in the configuration since I installed hoary. Is this known?
[10:32] <sivang> mdz: ok, I'll go fetch me a daily
[10:33] <Kamion> mdz: it means there's a risk of going backward in the event of a programming error, but the counter-risk would be having the progress bar reach 100% far too early and then just sit there ... I prefer this set of risks
[10:33] <sivang> mdz: what about hoary->breezy upgrade tests? are those worthwhile? (should I note anything while at it etc..)
[10:34] <Kamion> and also using STEP would mean I'd have to make the progress bar use only integers throughout, which is impossible because I don't know exactly how long apt's progress bar should be
[10:34] <Kamion> anyway, not important enough to worry about
[10:35] <mdke> is anyone who can answer my xorg question around?
[10:36] <Kamion> mdz: (actually, you might well be able to pass a negative number to PROGRESS STEP, too. I've never tried.)
[10:37] <sivang> hmm, just making sure my testing is useful, shoudl I try with a daily or with colony-4 ?
[10:37] <Kamion> sivang: current daily please
[10:37] <mdz> Kamion: usplash failure on powerpc 
[10:37] <mdz> live
[10:37] <Kamion> boo
[10:37] <Kamion> what happened?
[10:37] <sivang> Kamion: k, thanks
[10:37] <mdz> black screen, no artwork no progress
[10:38] <jdub> mdz: my fault on the impi moderation - thought that was just the start of the mail
[10:39] <mdz> morning sabdfl
[10:39] <ogra> morning mdz 
[10:39] <Kamion> mdz: did it work on install, or have you tried yet?
[10:40] <mdz> Kamion: install is burning now
[10:40] <jdub> download, that is
[10:40] <Kamion> I think I preferred it without the bterm bug fixed, looking at those error messages on live ;-)
[10:41] <Kamion> ah well
[10:41] <sabdfl> hi guys
[10:41] <Kamion> morning
[10:41] <dholbach> sabdfl: hi mark
[10:43] <pitti_live> hi
[10:44] <pitti_live> mdz, Kamion: powerpc live: I get a completely black screen during boot, when usplash is supposed to show up
[10:44] <pitti_live> vt switching on shutdown works, but after ejecting the CD nothing happens, I'm not asked to press enter for shutdown, and pressing enter does nothing
[10:45] <pitti_live> Kamion: The "Bummer, cannot run d-i" is a known issue?
[10:46] <Kamion> pitti_live: yeah
[10:46] <Kamion> it's probably always been there, we just never noticed until we fixed the VT switching
[10:46] <pitti_live> it does not actually seem to do any harm
[10:46] <Kamion> so it looks a bit untidy but it's just the final death throes of the old /
[10:46] <pitti_live> I'm more worried about usplash not working
[10:47] <pitti_live> anyway, I test amd64 shutdown now and brb
[10:47] <Kamion> it would be interesting to know what kind of framebuffers you guys have
[10:47] <Kamion> pseudo/truecolour, colour depth
[10:48] <Kamion> mine's pseudo/8
[10:49] <mdz> Kamion: how do I find out?  fbset -i?
[10:49] <mdz> is there a way to check from d-i? I have an install in progress now
[10:51] <pitti> mdz: amd64 live works flawlessly (apart from the ridiculously looking English and German mix)
[10:51] <mdz> pitti: here as well
[10:51] <mdz> only without the german
[10:51] <dholbach> hehe
[10:51] <lllmanulll> mdz, About CD integrity testing, I asked in a mail to write on the CD download page that CDs should be burned 1/3 slower than the maximum allowed ; I think this solution doesn't involve any code modification and would already prevent a lot of CD burning errors ; what do you think ?
[10:51] <pitti> most menu strings are translated, but there is English in between
[10:52] <mdz> lllmanulll: I read your email; I think a safe guideline is to go no faster than 4x
[10:52] <dholbach> brb - have to re-adjust cables
[10:52] <mdz> lllmanulll: on which page do you think the advice would be most visible?
[10:53] <pitti> Kamion: did you hear any other usplash failures on ppc?
[10:53] <lllmanulll> mdz, On the page where one can download the CD images ?
[10:53] <lllmanulll> Make it bold face, or something like that ?
[10:54] <Mithrandir> mdz/Kamion: ok to upload http://err.no/patches/glib1.2_1.2.10_1.2.10ubuntu1_asm_const_ftbfs.diff after preview? Fixes Ubuntu #13704
[10:54] <pitti> do patches still need manual approval after preview?
[10:54] <mdz> Kamion: /proc/fb says "ATI Radeon If"
[10:55] <mdz> Mithrandir: ok to upload now; it'll be queued for after preview
[10:55] <Mithrandir> mdz: thanks
[10:55] <mdz> pitti: no
[10:55] <sivang> hey sabdfl 
[10:55] <Mithrandir> pitti: hm, point.  I'm not sure, but I'd like to have people at least eyeball stuff I upload in case I overlook something and introduce quiet breakages.
[10:58] <mdz> Kamion: usplash works on your powerpc in the current candidate?
[10:59] <Mithrandir> mdz: so I can just do the uploads I queued yesterday now?
[11:00] <mdz> Mithrandir: which packages?
[11:00] <mdz> preferably not anything in desktop
[11:00] <mdz> in case we need to do uploads targeting preview
[11:00] <Mithrandir> mdz: blender, siege, unifont.
[11:00] <Mithrandir> the last one might be in desktop, I'm not sure
[11:01] <Mithrandir> hm, no, it's not
[11:01] <seb128> brb with liveCD
[11:02] <dholbach> i386 live: the colors of the usplash status messages appear a bit dark overe here, the "ok" is barely readable
[11:03] <dholbach> i386 live: clicking on the help icon -> going over to "desktop" gives me information about gnome 2.10 and gnome 2.6 even - will the doc team revamp this?
[11:03] <Kamion> mdz: I'm still trying to get a reliable enough burn to tell, one moment
[11:03] <sivang> err, 8m ETA for install cd, I wish it finished up already
[11:03] <jsgotangco> dholbach, that's upstream!
[11:04] <ogra> dholbach, ask gnome :)
[11:04] <dholbach> jsgotangco, ogra: that's what i feared :-p
[11:04] <jsgotangco> dholbach, there is work being done for 2.12 though
[11:04] <mdke> dholbach, nothing we can do: if they don't perhaps we should remove it
[11:04] <dholbach> mdke: yes... it's a bit ... well ... confusing to the user :)
[11:04] <jsgotangco> dholbach, im one  of the people contributing to 2.12 wiki atm but its very very slooowww
[11:04] <ogra> mdke, or get 10 additional guys and rewrite it ;)
[11:04] <mdz> Kamion: similar usplash behavior on powerpc install here
[11:05] <mdz> Kamion: worse, in fact, because it seems to clobber the console font
[11:05] <dholbach> apart from mentioned issues - live i386 is fine for me
[11:05] <Kamion> well, I get a black screen on a laptop where you have to use vga=771
[11:05] <Kamion> so it's not just powerpc FWIW
[11:05] <mdz> the dialogs are drawn with garbage rather than line drawing characters
[11:05] <mdz> Kamion: works fine for me on amd64 and i386
[11:06] <\sh> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily/20050908.4/ <- latest daily?
[11:06] <mdz> \sh: /current is a symlink which points to the latest
[11:06] <dholbach> brb
[11:06] <\sh> mdz: k
[11:07] <\sh> downloading
[11:08] <mdz> Kamion: vt switching seems solid, at least
[11:08] <mdz> Kamion: we did fix it several times over ;-)
[11:09] <sivang> mdz: whats the bug number for the vt switching? (/me is curious to know what happened there)
[11:09] <mdz> 14851 or something like that
[11:10] <Kamion> mdz: fbset -i, the Type and Visual lines and the last number in the geometry line
[11:10] <mdz> it's all over the irc log
[11:10] <Kamion> it's not all in the bug
[11:10] <mdz> Kamion: hmm, we don't install fbset?
[11:10] <mdz> which package is it in?
[11:11] <mdz> in universe, even
[11:12] <mdz> it'll have to wait until the install is finished
[11:13] <seb_li386> i386 liveCD works quite fine
[11:13] <mdz> seb_li386: excellent
[11:14] <seb_li386> mdz, I've a network issue though. I've an eth0 and a eth1n eth0 unplugged, eth1 which should gets its IP from DHCP
[11:14] <seb_li386> mdz, on boot eth0 is up and eth1 is not, I've to run sudo dhclient to get it and an IP
[11:14] <seb_li386> is that a known issue?
[11:15] <mdz> seb_li386: that is NOTABUG
[11:15] <mdz> oh, didn't see your first message
[11:15] <mdz> seb_li386: does mii-diag report the link status correctly? has this ever done any different, e.g. in hoary?
[11:16] <mdz> Riddell: ping
[11:18] <seb_li386> mdz, 
[11:18] <seb_li386> $ mii-diag
[11:18] <seb_li386> Using the default interface 'eth0'.
[11:18] <seb_li386> SIOCGMIIPHY on eth0 failed: Operation not supported
[11:18] <sivang> seb_li386: it gives the same for me on my desktop here, which is installed and using network fine
[11:18] <mdz> seb_li386: I see an icon on the panel for evolution on i386 but not on amd64
[11:18] <seb_li386> I'll try with hoary in a sec. I changed my eth cards since hoary and I've not tried with this config
[11:18] <mdz> seb_li386: mii-diag requires root
[11:18] <sivang> mdz: this is on my hoary, using root
[11:18] <seb_li386> mdz, I get the same by running sudo mii-diag
[11:19] <sivang> Using the default interface 'eth0'.
[11:19] <sivang> Basic registers of MII PHY #1:  3100 7809 02a8 0330 05e1 0000 0000 0000.
[11:19] <sivang>  Basic mode control register 0x3100: Auto-negotiation enabled.
[11:19] <sivang>  Basic mode status register 0x7809 ... 7809.
[11:19] <sivang>    Link status: not established.
[11:19] <sivang>    End of basic transceiver information.
[11:19] <mdz> seb_li386: ok, then your hardware/driver doesn't support testing link state
[11:19] <mdz> seb_li386: and so we can't determine if it's plugged in
[11:20] <seb_li386> hum, k
[11:20] <seb_li386> so NOTABUG?
[11:20] <mdz> seb_li386: CANTFIX
[11:20] <seb_li386> dmesg has "[4294702.958000]  eth0: no link during initialization." though
[11:20] <mdz> seb_li386: what about the panel icon issue?
[11:21] <seb_li386> I don't have it on the i386 liveCD
[11:21] <seb_li386> looking at it
[11:21] <mdz> hmm
[11:21] <Kamion> I don't have it on live/i386 either
[11:21] <Kamion> was about to mention that
[11:21] <dholbach> me neither
[11:21] <mdz> any of you using laptops?
[11:21] <Kamion> yes
[11:21] <mdz> interesting
[11:21] <jsgotangco> aye
[11:21] <mdz> is it supposed to be there or not?
[11:21] <seb_li386> /usr/share/gconf/schemas/panel-default-setup.entries:        <string>/usr/share/applications/evolution.desktop</string>
[11:21] <mdz> jsgotangco: and you see the icon, or not?
[11:22] <seb_li386> I hate upstreams
[11:22] <seb_li386> they keep versionning it
[11:22] <seb_li386> it's evolution-2.4.desktop now
[11:22] <jsgotangco> what icon? (im just burning the live atm
[11:22] <seb_li386> we should use evolution-mail.desktop rather, it's shipped with the package and don't move
[11:22] <mdz> jsgotangco: oh, I thought you were responding to my question
[11:23] <dholbach> the hoary -> breezy upgrade i did on another box was particularly fine, just gnome-phone-manager (universe, was fixed today) wasn't installable
[11:25] <mdz> amd64 and powerpc installs both successful 
[11:25] <mdz> though powerpc was ugly as hell
[11:26] <mdz> Kamion: I'm thinking we should roll back usplash on powerpc unless  you already know what the  problem is
[11:26] <Kamion> my fucking CD drive is not helping
[11:26] <mdz> I will get you that fb info though
[11:27] <ogra> seb_li386, does gconfd still need a SIGHUP after you changed a setting with gconftool-2 ? 
[11:27] <Kamion> how about we leave usplash as it is but make base-installer not install it? that way at least live CDs work on some hardware
[11:27] <Kamion> and we don't get the install CD damage
[11:27] <seb_li386> ogra, yep, dh_gconf does it though
[11:27] <mdz> Kamion: the user experience is pretty bad on the live CD
[11:27] <Kamion> the live CD is not massively helped by not having usplash
[11:27] <Kamion> ?
[11:27] <mdz> it just goes blank, no feedback at all
[11:27] <mdz> we could disable it in casper
[11:28] <Kamion> that would save a live fs build
[11:28] <mdz> right
[11:28] <ogra> mdz, the script in 7150 will need to SIGHUP gconfd in the end to make the change valid (in case gconfd already runs while you change the setting)
[11:30] <Kamion> I'm going to have to go out and get a CD cleaner and some new discs
[11:30] <mdz> ogra: gconfd isn't running
[11:30] <ogra> ok
[11:31] <ogra> didnt know when you run it
[11:31] <mdz> Kamion: sent you mail
[11:31] <mdz> Kamion: with the fb
[11:31] <mdz> info and an assertion error from usplash
[11:31] <mdz> ogra: I don't think it's started until login
[11:32] <ogra> yes, it gets started by gnome-session afaik... seb_li386 might speak up if its different :)
[11:32] <mdz> my i386 install definitely gives me the evolution icon
[11:33] <jsgotangco> hmmm
[11:33] <jsgotangco> i have it as well
[11:33] <jsgotangco> (just finished)
[11:33] <seb_li386> mdz, grep evolution /usr/share/gconf/schemas/panel-default-setup.entries ?
[11:33] <mdz> seb_li386: just rebooted, will check
[11:34] <\sh> Mithrandir: if glib is compiled, I can give gabber a new shot
[11:34] <mdz> \sh: it won't be compiled until after preview; it's in main
[11:35] <\sh> mdz: ah ok
[11:35] <mdz> seb_li386: <string>/usr/share/applications/evolution.desktop</string>
[11:35] <seb_li386> mdz, do you have this file?
[11:35] <seb_li386> dpkg -S it?
[11:35] <Mithrandir> \sh: should be by now
[11:36] <Kamion> mdz: please change ->width to ->height on that line in bogl-pcfb.c and bogl-tcfb.c, rebuild, install, rebuild mkinitramfs, reboot
[11:36] <Kamion> mdz:   assert (xx + pixmap->width <= bogl_xres);
[11:37] <Kamion>   assert (yy + pixmap->width <= bogl_yres);
[11:37] <mdz> seb_li386: no
[11:37] <Kamion> obviously bogus :)
[11:37] <Kamion> (not new code though)
[11:37] <seb_li386> mdz, so the bug is that you get the icon, you should not if you don't have the desktop file
[11:37] <pitti> mdz: amd64 install (network, with language-support download) flawless
[11:37] <pitti> mdz: powerpc install a complete failure
[11:38] <mdz> pitti: details?
[11:39] <dholbach> brb
[11:39] <pitti> mdz: #14736, os-prober crashes kernel when probing MacOS X partition
[11:39] <seb_li386> pitti, computer:/// is bogus on the i386 liveCD here
[11:39] <mdz> pitti: ouch
[11:39] <pitti> mdz: after some kill -9 in vt2, yaboot failed to write a boot sector
[11:39] <seb_li386> pitti, I've 2 CD drives, it lists both and the CD has a 3rd icon 
[11:40] <pitti> mdz: manually rebooted, old yaboot installation still worked, got dropped into an empty console (usplash failure)
[11:40] <mdz> pitti: related or unrelated?
[11:40] <pitti> mdz: and base-config does not run
[11:40] <pitti> mdz: I think the yaboot failure is a consequence of my killall os-prober
[11:41] <pitti> I made a screenshot, just need to download
[11:42] <pitti> Kamion: on powerpc: "usphash: bogl-pcfb.c:195: bogl_pcfb_put: Assertion yy + pixmap->width <= bogl_yres failed
[11:42] <pitti> Kamion: does that say anything to you
[11:42] <pitti> mdz: IMHO we should leave usplash disabled on powerpc for now, such last-minute features seem to lead to nothing but trouble
[11:43] <ogra> pitti, yes, he said something similar before you entered the channel
[11:43] <pitti> ah, ok
[11:43] <ogra> pitti, :
 mdz: please change ->width to ->height on that line in bogl-pcfb.c and bogl-tcfb.c, rebuild, install, rebuild mkinitramfs, reboot
 mdz:   assert (xx + pixmap->width <= bogl_xres);
   assert (yy + pixmap->width <= bogl_yres);
[11:43] <ogra> pitti, try that :)
[11:44] <pitti> ogra: oh, yes, that sounds sane :-)
[11:44] <pitti> seb_li386: sorry, ENOTIME
[11:44] <seb_li386> pitti, grumpf, k. I'll try to figure myself if that's a gnome-vfs issue so
[11:44] <seb_li386> but computer:/// is messed
[11:45] <mdz> Kamion: that fixed it
[11:45] <pitti> seb_li386: I actually thought this was already fixed in the last version :-/
[11:45] <seb_li386> pitti, are drives and volumes supposed to have separate icons?
[11:45] <pitti> Kamion: what should actually be executed after the first boot? base-config does not quite DTRT
[11:45] <seb_li386> pitti, I've no 2 drives icons and 2 CD icon, and no eject work
[11:46] <pitti> seb_li386: normall ynot
[11:46] <seb_li386> pitti, it used to change the drive icon to a volume one
[11:46] <Riddell> mdz: hi
[11:46] <seb_li386> pitti, k, will try to figure what's wrong with that
[11:47] <pitti> mdz: http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/shots/ppc-install.jpg <- that's what I get after first ppc boot when switching VT and thus get my screen back; looks familiar?
[11:49] <mdz> pitti: yes
[11:49] <mdz> pitti: see breezy-changes ;-)
[11:50] <pitti> hm, I don't really want to trash my MacOS partition now, since I want to keep it for confirming the kernel crash bug fix
[11:50] <mdz> pitti: we can't leave usplash disabled on powerpc because it is already enabled; we can only disable it ;-)
[11:51] <mdz> pitti: the reason it was enabled was as a workaround for the vt switching bug
[11:51] <mdz> though that is also fixed another way now
[11:51] <pitti> mdz: ok, so we can keep the current i386/amd64 images and only get new ppc ones?
[11:51] <mdz> pitti: not unless we do it by hand, no
[11:53] <dholbach> kubuntu i386 live is fine
[11:53] <mdz> infinity: around?
[11:53] <mdz> dholbach: kubuntu is several generations behind presently, and Riddell is nowhere to be found
[11:53] <pitti> ok, I have to leave for ~2 hours
[11:54] <Riddell> mdz: here I am
[11:54] <dholbach> mdz: he just answered you 
[11:54] <mdz> Riddell: oh, hi
[11:54] <pitti> when I'm back, I can test new images, I will circumvent the os-prober test
[11:54] <mdz> Riddell: need an immediate status update on kubuntu preview
[11:54] <mdz> Riddell:  the last time we spoke, you had no successful CD operations yet
[11:55] <infinity> mdz : Just stepped in.
[11:55] <Riddell> mdz: 20050908 made last night works great on i386 but doesn't contain the language pack updates pitti put in, the normal daily build doesn't seem to have run
[11:55] <mdz> infinity: can I get express treatment for usplash -10 on powerpc?
[11:55] <infinity> mdz : Yup.
[11:56] <Riddell> mdz: the problems I had went away as mysteriously as they came
[11:56] <seb_li386> pitti, is eject supposed to be fixed?
[11:56] <mdz> Riddell: are the seeds and metapackages in order?
[11:57] <Riddell> mdz: yes
[11:57] <infinity> mdz : Uploaded.
[11:58] <mdz> Riddell: so you need a new CD build?
[11:58] <mdz> infinity: thanks
[11:58] <Riddell> mdz: for the new language packs yes
[11:58] <mdz> Riddell: what about the livefs?
[11:58] <Diziet> mdz: Thanks for the browser bugs, btw :-).
[11:58] <Riddell> mdz: livefs?
[11:58] <mdz> Diziet: HTH
[11:59] <mdz> Riddell: the filesystem used on the live CD
[11:59] <mdz> I have no idea if it's up to date or works at all
[11:59] <Riddell> mdz: the live CD works fine
[11:59] <mdz> on i386, ok
[12:00] <mdz> but it won't have the langpacks either and needs to be revved
[12:00] <Riddell> yep
[12:02] <daniels> mdke: pong
[12:02] <daniels> mdke: is it just the gnome 'hey, GNOME and X keyboard settings are different, wtf?' dialog?
[12:04] <mdz> pitti: what's the last powerpc install which worked for you?
[12:04] <pitti> mdz: uh, maybe two weeks ago, I didn't reinstall my laptop so often
[12:05] <mdz> it worked fine here, which leads me to guess that some of your problems are fallout from os-prober
[12:05] <pitti> mdz: yes, I think so; I'll try the next image and just disable the hfs mounting in the os-proper backend
[12:09] <pitti> cu
[12:12] <mvo> fabbione: do you happen to know why we seem to have no "sk98lin" network driver on 2.6.12-8-amd64?
[12:12] <spacey> does someone know why /etc/ld.so.conf is gone? 
[12:13] <fabbione> mvo: there is no sk98lin anywhere.. we ship the free version called skge
[12:13] <spacey> and is there a replacement?
[12:13] <fabbione> the sk98lin kernel driver is utterly broken and the one from upstream is a royal mess
[12:14] <mvo> fabbione: hm, it works on my (on-board) yukon ethernet port but skge does not (it seems to be unable to detect a link or auto-negociate)
[12:15] <fabbione> mvo: other people have the opposite problem. there is no winner
[12:15] <fabbione> skge conflicts with sk98lin to a certain extents of hotplug
[12:15] <fabbione> meaning that they share part of the same pciids space
[12:15] <\sh> mvo: http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=6142
[12:15] <Riddell> mdz: are new kubuntu ISOs being built?
[12:15] <fabbione> making unpredictable what will work where and with what driver
[12:16] <\sh> mvo: same here with the r200 and I'm tweaking my boot iso every time ,-)
[12:16] <mvo> \sh: thanks, I have seen this bugreport
[12:16] <mvo> fabbione: ok, thanks. 
[12:17] <Kamion> mdz: thanks for the usplash upload
[12:17] <\sh> mvo: we have to wait until a good replacement is in the kernel ;)
[12:17] <mdz> Riddell: we can only do one build at a time currently
[12:17] <mdz> Kamion: can we disable the source CDs?
[12:17] <mdz> Kamion: I need to roll new install CDs for usplash and it takes 70 minutes with the current method
[12:18] <mvo> \sh: r200? you probably do not mean the graphic chip from ati, right :) ?
[12:18] <mdz> it shouldn't take more  than 20; it's all jigdo and source CDs
[12:19] <mvo> mdz: should I wait for that? I'm about to start a i386 install test now (cd just burned)
[12:20] <mdz> Riddell: I can roll new install CDs, but live needs to wait for the livefs build to finish on powerpc
[12:20] <\sh> mvo: no...portege r200 from toshiba
[12:21] <mdz> Riddell: kubuntu install build is running (no source, no jigdo)
[12:21] <\sh> I think I have to buy some food stuff 
[12:21] <mdz> Riddell: what other architectures can you test, or find testers for?
[12:22] <seb_lamd64> I got a debconf question with the list of resolution on boot of the amd64 liveCD
[12:23] <seb_lamd64> didn't get it with the i386 CD on the same box
[12:23] <Kamion> mdz: CDIMAGE_NOSOURCE=1 in the environment, being aware that HP have explicitly asked for source CDs of our releases in the past
[12:23] <Kamion> seb_lamd64: yes, xresprobe can't autodetect on amd64 yet
[12:23] <Riddell> mdz: I should be able to find a powerpc tester
[12:23] <mdz> Kamion: dude, it's cost me too much sleep already
[12:23] <Kamion> mdz: I'll refer them to you :-P
[12:23] <mdz> HP can get the source like everyone else
[12:23] <seb_lamd64> Kamion, thanks
[12:23] <mdz> it's only preview
[12:24] <siretart> in breezy, where shoud app-defaults go, /etc/X11/app-defaults or /usr/lib/X11/app-defaults?
[12:24] <jsgotangco> hmm i must have a bad burn on amd64
[12:24] <daniels> the former
[12:24] <seb_lamd64> I've message about S72menu-exist before the splash screen, is that known?
[12:25] <WaterSevenUb> kamion, thanks for correcting the archive-copier.po :) We were sleepy in the evening already :)
[12:25] <\sh> xterm has old link to /usr/lib/X11/app-defaults...fixed it here locally
[12:25] <Kamion> seb_lamd64: yeah, it's the death throes of the old root filesystem, which are visible now that we've fixed the vt switching
[12:25] <Kamion> ugly but harmless
[12:25] <seb_lamd64> k
[12:26] <seb_lamd64> amd64 liveCD works fine here too out of these small notes
[12:27] <Kamion> WaterSevenUb: no problem
[12:27] <seb_lamd64> daniels, when switching between apps with alt-tab the windows are black painted ... any idea of what could do that?
[12:27] <\sh> mdz: ok with u to upload xterm-103 after preview time to fix the location of /etc/X11/app-defaults
[12:28] <mdz> \sh: fine to upload to the queue now
[12:28] <\sh> mdz: thx
[12:29] <siretart> daniels: is it possible that xmkmf makes makefile that make compiled programs look for app-defaults in /usr/lib/app-defaults instead of /etc/X11/app-defaults
[12:29] <Riddell> hmm, oversized kubuntu live CDs
[12:29] <daniels> seb_lamd64: iz gtk bug
[12:29] <seb_lamd64> daniels, cairo?
[12:29] <daniels> seb_lamd64: unless.  do me a favour.  fire up xev, and partially obscure it (so, say, half of it is behind a terminal).
[12:29] <daniels> seb_lamd64: tab over to xev, and back to the terminal.
[12:30] <daniels> seb_lamd64: you should get VisibilityNotifies about it being fully visible, then partially obscured
[12:30] <daniels> if you ever get a FullyObscured VisibilityNotify, X is broken
[12:30] <daniels> seb_lamd64: this is the colourmap-is-null one that I patched straight after you uploaded 2.8; the patch hasn't gone missing, hsa it?
[12:30] <seb_lamd64> VisibilityNotify event, serial 28, synthetic NO, window 0x2a00001,
[12:30] <seb_lamd64>     state VisibilityPartiallyObscured
[12:30] <daniels> siretart: i dunno, possibly
[12:30] <seb_lamd64> VisibilityNotify event, serial 28, synthetic NO, window 0x2a00001,
[12:30] <seb_lamd64>     state VisibilityUnobscured
[12:31] <daniels> seb_lamd64: okay, 'tis a gtk bug :)
[12:31] <seb_lamd64> daniels, patch came from upstream, right?
[12:31] <daniels> yeah
[12:31] <daniels> from otaylor
[12:31] <seb_lamd64> daniels, I'm pretty sure it has been used for new versions
[12:31] <seb_lamd64> we have 2.8.3 atm
[12:31] <seb_lamd64> but it doesn't do that on the same box with my standard install
[12:32] <daniels> seb_lamd64: another easy way to tell is, well, use xev as a litmus test
[12:32] <siretart> daniels: I will check this. if it is, shall I file another bug about this?
[12:32] <daniels> seb_lamd64: see if it only does it with gtk apps, or if it does it with xev also
[12:32] <daniels> siretart: sure
[12:32] <Mithrandir> live amd64 works for me
[12:32] <siretart> ok (off fur lunch now)
[12:32] <seb_lamd64> dand, xev is painted black as weel
[12:32] <seb_lamd64> ups
[12:32] <seb_lamd64> daniels, 
[12:33] <daniels> seb_lamd64: on alt-tab?
[12:33] <daniels> gar, I can't reproduce it
[12:33] <seb_lamd64> daniels, it's painted when I press tab, and keep this way while alt is pressed
[12:33] <daniels> seb_lamd64: painted black?
[12:33] <seb_lamd64> yeah
[12:33] <daniels> hm
[12:33] <seb_lamd64> it goes away when I relax alt
[12:33] <daniels> when I hold down alt, and hit tab, I get the outline of the frames showing
[12:34] <daniels> but I can still see my active window
[12:34] <Kamion> I really, really hate typing 'sudo reboot' on the wrong machine by mistake
[12:34] <seb_lamd64> which is the correct behaviour
[12:34] <daniels> Kamion: yes
[12:34] <daniels> seb_lamd64: so, let me get this right
[12:34] <daniels> seb_lamd64: you hold down alt
[12:34] <daniels> seb_lamd64: hit tab
[12:34] <daniels> seb_lamd64: and the window you're switching to ... its area is drawn completely black, over the current window?
[12:34] <daniels> seb_lamd64: and then you release alt and it paints itself
[12:34] <seb_lamd64> correct
[12:34] <daniels> i've seen that before, but only once, and it heisenbugged itself
[12:34] <daniels> also on amd64
[12:34] <daniels> i'm pretty sure it's a metacity bug
[12:35] <seb_lamd64> it does that with i386 and amd64 liveCD on this box
[12:35] <daniels> x has nothing to do with it at that point -- all painting over the active window is done by metacity
[12:35] <seb_lamd64> and no with i386 install
[12:35] <seb_lamd64> install beeing my working box, no a fresh one
[12:35] <daniels> if you could get me a diff between the Xorg.0.logs on live and install, that would be great, but I'm pretty sure it's a metacity thing
[12:36] <daniels> if you want to make really sure, try starting kwin or fluxbox or something
[12:36] <seb_lamd64> k
[12:36] <dholbach> brb
[12:37] <sivang> I tried to resize the partition on which I Want to install, but I got "due to unknown reason cannot resize partitoin"
[12:37] <hunger> daniels: I keep running into problems with the xdm deb. Its postinst fails with status 1 whenever I upgrade something. Is there a way to work around that? I guess I broke some symlinks trying to fix stuff during the transition.
[12:37] <sivang> the partition is ext3 plain one, with bootable device flag 
[12:37] <daniels> hunger: i dunno man, I didn't do xdm
[12:37] <daniels> hunger: apparently it was broken until today though
[12:37] <hunger> daniels: Oh, I thought you were the big X hacker.
[12:37] <sivang> Kamion: any idea?
[12:38] <daniels> hunger: yeah, but fabbione did a lot of the apps
[12:38] <hunger> daniels: Great, I'll upgrade as soon as I get back into the hotel tonight.
[12:38] <Kamion> sivang: no, check the log files
[12:38] <Kamion> sivang: perhaps it was not cleanly unmounted
[12:38] <Mithrandir> hmm, shouldn't the update-notifier be disabled on the live CD?
[12:38] <Mithrandir> it offers to upgrade usplash here, which seems kinda silly
[12:38] <hunger> daniels: It is always great to hear that it wasn't me who messed up stuff for a change:-)
[12:39] <sivang> Kamion: ah, so should I umount it manually before trying to install using the install cd ?
[12:39] <Kamion> sivang: manually or automatically, don't care :)
[12:39] <seb_lamd64> daniels, Xorg.0.log.diff on my chinstrap dir
[12:39] <Mithrandir> daniels / seb_lamd64 : the black box problem goes away be switching to openbox, fwiw.
[12:39] <Mithrandir> s/be/by/
[12:39] <Kamion> sivang: but I think parted will often refuse to resize a filesystem that wasn't cleanly unmounted
[12:40] <sivang> Kamion: if there's a dirty flag set for this fs, how can I manually unset it?
[12:40] <Kamion> sivang: fsck
[12:40] <Kamion> ah, good, my powerbook's CD drive is much healthier now
[12:40] <daniels> Mithrandir: \o/ metacity problem
[12:40] <sivang> Kamion: k, I'll fsck it now that I manually unmounted it. I really want to see the ext3 resize in action, plus I have all the mirror data on that partition :)
[12:40] <seb_lamd64> daniels, or xorg bug exposed by it :p
[12:41] <daniels> seb_lamd64: what's - and what's +?
[12:41] <sivang> /dev/hda4: clean, 11576/3571712 files, 1680702/7138884 blocks (check in 4 mounts)
[12:41] <seb_lamd64> daniels, out of joke, probably a wm bug, but any help to debug it is welcome, I've no clue on this code
[12:41] <sivang> goody, not back to installation.
[12:41] <daniels> seb_lamd64: actually, I have an idea
[12:41] <seb_lamd64> daniels, - is the working install, + the bugged liveCD
[12:42] <daniels> shazam! fuck I'm smart
[12:43] <seb_lamd64> you found what causes the bog?
[12:43] <daniels> yeah
[12:43] <seb_lamd64> cool
[12:43] <seb_lamd64> you rock :)
[12:43] <seb_lamd64> what is it?
[12:43] <daniels> missing Modules section in xorg.conf -> no extmod
[12:43] <daniels> at a *guess*, I'm going to say missing SHM support
[12:43] <mdz> Riddell: kubuntu install isos are up
[12:44] <seb_lamd64> daniels, why extmod is not used? xorg bog?
[12:46] <Kamion> damn, same os-prober problem here
[12:46] <mdz> Kamion: I'm happy with the current builds, modulo the powerpc/usplash issue
[12:46] <mdz> Kamion: a powerpc livefs build is in progress and should finish soon
[12:46] <mdz> when it does, I'll kick off live and install builds and go to sleep
[12:46] <Kamion> well, kernel problem while running os-prober anyway
[12:46] <Kamion> mdz: ok, cool
[12:47] <Kamion> I don't know what to do about this os-prober thing. Release-note it? The workaround is not entirely trivial.
[12:47] <daniels> seb_lamd64: for some reason, xserver-xorg/config/modules is still empty.  could you please chuck up /var/log/casper/post.log?
[12:47] <Kamion> I could temporarily change os-prober to avoid hfsplus partitions
[12:48] <mdz> Kamion: do we know if the os-prober issue affects all macos partitions, or only some?
[12:48] <mdz> yes, was going to suggest that next
[12:48] <Kamion> mdz: can't prove a negative ... but it's both pitti's and my OS X partitions
[12:48] <seb_lamd64> daniels, on chinstrap too
[12:48] <mdz> Kamion: well, a counterexample would be enough
[12:48] <Kamion> and somebody else's
[12:49] <Kamion> I haven't heard of a counterexample, but I don't really have enough data
[12:49] <mdz> I could install macos here
[12:49] <Kamion> it's hard enough to get people to report successes let alone to get information about what other OSes they have installed ;)
[12:49] <daniels> seb_lamd64: thanks
[12:49] <mdz> Kamion: I have no problem with disabling it; it isn't as if we can resize macos anyway, so dual booting it is something which requires advance planning and some expertise
[12:49] <Kamion> mdz: that might be a plan, although it will take an hour or two
[12:50] <seb_lamd64> daniels, np, thank you for working on it :)
[12:50] <Kamion> mdz: er, I thought parted could shrink hfs fine
[12:50] <mdz> it takes about an hour, an hour of saying "20 minutes remaining"
[12:50] <mdz> Kamion: it can
[12:50] <mdz> ?
[12:50] <Kamion> not that I've ever tried it, but I've seen it in changelogs
[12:50] <sivang> Kamion: still no go, no apparent logging information. any other way to obtain logs of the resize checkup other then ALT+F{1,2,3} ?
[12:50] <Kamion> sivang: alt-f4 for a start
[12:51] <mdz> powerpc livefs just succeeded
[12:51] <Kamion> sivang: but please, if you can find somebody else to help, please do, I'm very busy just now
[12:51] <daniels> seb_lamd64: no worries.  my best guess is either of the damage or shape extensions being missing, but it's sort of irrelevant which.
[12:51] <mdz> Kamion: any reasonable way to avoid rebuilding and retesting i386 and amd64?
[12:51] <sivang> Kamion: ok, I'm sorry, I will go on without resizing then, won't bug anymore
[12:51] <seb_lamd64> daniels, I can try to turn them
[12:51] <daniels> seb_lamd64: what's the value of xserver-xorg/config/modules?
[12:51] <seb_lamd64> daniels, on my standard install, and notice which one breaks it?
[12:52] <Kamion> mdz: not particularly conveniently
[12:52] <seb_lamd64> daniels, how do I get that?
[12:52] <daniels> seb_lamd64: ah, it's okay, doesn't particularly matter at this point
[12:52] <daniels> seb_lamd64: /var/cache/debconf/config.dat :)
[12:52] <mdz> ok
[12:52] <mdz> Kamion: builds running
[12:52] <mdz> I'm turning in
[12:52] <mdz> SMS me if any new blockers are discovered
[12:52] <Kamion> ok
[12:52] <seb_lamd64> Name: xserver-xorg/config/modules
[12:52] <seb_lamd64> Template: xserver-xorg/config/modules
[12:52] <seb_lamd64> Value:
[12:52] <seb_lamd64> Owners: xserver-xorg
[12:52] <seb_lamd64> Flags: seen
[12:53] <Kamion> mdz: can we release before you wake up, if not? :-)
[12:53] <mvo> i386 install is fine here
[12:53] <Kamion> or I guess you have all the announcement-fu
[12:53] <daniels> seb_lamd64: sheeeeet.
[12:53] <daniels> seb_lamd64: okay
[12:53] <daniels> seb_lamd64: this is where it gets hillarious
[12:54] <daniels> seb_lamd64: can you please hack /var/lib/dpkg/info/xserver-xorg.config to run with sh -x, and dump the output of sudo dpkg-reconfigure -pcritical xserver-xorg on chinstrap?
[12:54] <jsgotangco> grrr i seem to have a corrupted rsync image
[12:55] <daniels> (btw, it is shape support rather than damage that causes it.)
[12:57] <seb_lamd64> daniels, xorg-reconfigure.log
[12:57] <seb_lamd64> daniels, and now I have "Value: GLcore,i2c,bitmap,ddc,dri,extmod,freetype,glx,int10,type1,vbe" :/
[12:59] <daniels> seb_lamd64: let me guess, xorg.conf now has a reasonably well-populated Modules section too?
[12:59] <seb_lamd64> daniels, correct
[01:00] <daniels> well, shit.
[01:01] <daniels> gar, it should always be answering it with the default that I can see.
[01:01] <seb_lamd64> daniels, and a new xorg started with startx -- :1 works fine now
[01:01] <daniels> seb_lamd64: sigh
[01:01] <seb_lamd64> daniels, is there any way to get a log of the first boot/config?
[01:01] <daniels> my rsync's still going, I'll get down and dirty with the cloop when it's fone
[01:02] <dholbach> brb
[01:02] <daniels> seb_lamd64: start it with expert, in one of the steps where it's mounted /target but not yet run dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg, drop to the shell, edit /target/var/lib/dpkg/info/xserver-xorg.config (or maybe just /var/lib/dpkg/info/xserver-xorg.config, whatever works), and add sh -x to it
[01:02] <daniels> and post.log should then have the full trace from the config script too
[01:04] <Kamion> powerpc install into second stage, looking fine
[01:05] <seb_lamd64> daniels, lemme try
[01:05] <daniels> sebcheers
[01:05] <daniels> heh
[01:15] <seb_lamd64> daniels, grumpf, the liveCD has no expert mode?
[01:16] <sivang_i386_inst> besides some weirdness in my LCD configuration, and some gibbrish characters when setting up gnome-games (watched using alt+f4) this is pretty awesome install process
[01:17] <daniels> seb_lamd64: live-expert
[01:17] <seb_lamd64> daniels, grra, thanks, brb :)
[01:18] <sivang_i386_inst> the USPlash not that bad either, although I'd like to see it use a higher screen resolution
[01:19] <daniels> sivang_i386_inst: can't
[01:19] <daniels> 640x480 is the only sensible resolution we can ever hope to configure
[01:19] <daniels> even then, it doesn't always work
[01:19] <sivang_i386_inst> daniels: I see, it also had on error there - "failed setting up console font"
[01:19] <sivang_i386_inst> daniels: is there neglectable?
[01:20] <daniels> probably, yeah
[01:20] <sivang_i386_inst> daniels: and still, my console fonts are really weird looking comapred to hoary's...
[01:21] <sivang_i386_inst> daniels: and I had to punch my LG's "auto adjust" so it will stretch and center the display picture.
[01:21] <daniels> yeah, that's because we're using a vga framebuffer
[01:21] <daniels> lots of fun
[01:22] <sivang_i386_inst> daniels: I see. so, how can I make it not use the framebuffer ? :) (I like it how it was in hoary hehe)
[01:23] <sivang_i386_inst> Hmm, I can't see the evolution icon either next to the Yelp one on the top panel..
[01:23] <daniels> sivang_i386_inst: ... don't use usplash.
[01:25] <Kamion> sivang_i386_inst: the evolution icon's broken, was discussed earlier
[01:26] <sivang_i386_inst> Kamion: k,thanks
[01:27] <dholbach> bbl
[01:31] <mjg59> infinity: I think it probably /can/ be done
[01:32] <sivang> daniels: so, due to using the frambuffer for usplash, I get weird gnome-terminal fonts? (I think I understood wrongly)
[01:32] <daniels> sivang: oh, gnome-terminal fonts are something else altogether
[01:32] <daniels> that's probably freetype changing again
[01:33] <sivang> daniels: oh :)
[01:33] <mdke> i can't boot into my windows partition after dist-upgrading yesterday. The entry has disappeared from grub and I can't succeed in booting in manually
[01:33] <mdke> anyone else seen that?
[01:33] <sivang> all in all, very nice install as always, and usplash is refreshing :)
[01:34] <bob2> mdke: you mean grub ignore is, or you don't know how to add it?
[01:34] <mdke> bob2, i tried adding it and it didn't boot, just returned me to the grub menu
[01:36] <ogra> mdz, still here ? 
[01:36] <sivang> mdke: it happens every time a new kernel is added for me 
[01:36] <sivang> mdke: he's off to sleep, I think.
[01:36] <sivang> ops, that was for ogra 
[01:36] <daniels> ogra: he's asleep, yeah
[01:37] <mdke> sivang, ok can you 14947 then pls?
[01:37] <mdke> also, any idea how to put it back?
[01:37] <Kamion> sounds like you didn't put the Windows configuration in the right part of menu.lst
[01:37] <Kamion> the file has clear documentation about which parts are autogenerated and will be rewritten on upgrade
[01:37] <ogra> does anybody know since when the liveCD user has apassword set ? i thought there wasnt one ?
[01:37] <mdke> Kamion, i didn't put anything in there, it was added automatically when I installed Ubuntu, and has been there since, until it was removed randomly yesterday
[01:38] <ogra> (for the ubuntu user that is)
[01:38] <mdke> Kamion, it's a testing machine so i don't play with configuration
[01:39] <mdke> Kamion, when i tried to add it manually, i just did it from the grub command line
[01:40] <daniels> seb_lamd64: hey dude
[01:40] <daniels> seb_lamd64: how was your adventure in live cd land?
[01:40] <seb_lamd64> daniels, I've the log
[01:40] <daniels> seb_lamd64: excellent! thanks a lot
[01:42] <sivang> what more testing needs to be done? (/me is hungry for more QAing..)
[01:42] <seb_lamd64> daniels, post-verbose.log on chinstrap
[01:43] <daniels> okay, what the fuck?
[01:43] <daniels> + db_set xserver-xorg/config/modules GLcore,i2c,bitmap,ddc,dri,extmod,freetype,glx,int10,type1,vbe
[01:43] <daniels> [...] 
[01:43] <daniels> + db_input low xserver-xorg/config/modules
[01:43] <daniels> [...] 
[01:43] <daniels> + RET='question will be asked'
[01:43] <daniels> [...] 
[01:44] <daniels> + db_get xserver-xorg/config/modules
[01:44] <Kamion> is that a multiselect?
[01:44] <daniels> [...] 
[01:44] <Kamion> you probably need ", " instead of ","
[01:44] <daniels> + db_get xserver-xorg/config/modules
[01:44] <daniels> [...] 
[01:44] <daniels> + RET=
[01:44] <daniels> Kamion: nnnnnghargnh
[01:44] <Kamion> cdebconf is a bit less picky there
[01:45] <daniels> seb_lamd64: okay
[01:45] <Kamion> but debconf splits on /,\s+/ not /,\s*/
[01:45] <daniels> seb_lamd64: if you feel like doing another live run ... grep for the line that says GLcore,i2c
[01:45] <daniels> seb_lamd64: and change foo,bar,baz to foo, bar, baz
[01:46] <Kamion> put quotes around it too if they aren't there already
[01:46] <daniels> there are quotes around it, yeah
[01:46] <daniels> it came from debian.  so the quoting was perfect.  it's just everything else that was broken. :P
[01:46] <Kamion> ok
[01:47] <Kamion> what are the consequences of this bug, again?
[01:47] <Kamion> current Debian xserver-xorg seems to use awk with RS=", "
[01:47] <Kamion> I don't see the same hardcoded list there; I guess it's old
[01:48] <daniels> Kamion: it's in another section
[01:48] <mvo> daniels: the amd64 live cd didn't auto-detect my panel resolution. known issue?
[01:48] <daniels> Kamion: the impact is that we don't get any modules loaded
[01:48] <Kamion> hmm, that's bad, right?
[01:48] <daniels> Kamion: -> no xvideo, metacity doing ugly black shading of windows, no gl
[01:48] <daniels> accelerated or no
[01:48] <seb_lamd64> daniels, will give it a try
[01:48] <daniels> yeah, that's not great
[01:48] <daniels> mvo: external panel, not laptop panel, right?
[01:49] <mvo> daniels: external, yes
[01:49] <daniels> mvo: yeah, been there ever since warty ;)
[01:49] <daniels> Kamion: if seb tries this ant it comes up roses, I can do an upload immediately
[01:50] <Kamion> ok, thanks
[01:50] <mvo> daniels: uhhh ... right (/me dosn't have his amd64 for that long)
[01:50] <daniels> and, everyone, I really like your testing, but stop finding bugs :P
[01:51] <HiddenWolf> daniels, why, the more the merrier? ;)
[01:51] <Kamion> daniels: the ", " thing confused me really severely about two months ago, if that's any consolation - that's how come I noticed it immediately above
[01:51] <Kamion> it bit localechooser rather hard
[01:51] <daniels> Kamion: hey man, don't worry about it.  multiseat taught me about writing portable shell, this is teaching me about hillarious debconf semantics. ;)
[01:51] <daniels> HiddenWolf: heh
[01:52] <mvo> other than that, amd64 looks pretty good (modulo the isse that seb reported already)
[01:52] <daniels> yeah
[01:53] <Kamion> I'll do a live run on powerpc with that change in a bit, too
[01:55] <BenC> anyone able to reassign bugs?
[01:55] <BenC> I have two bugs assigned to me that need to be reassigned correctly
[01:55] <Kamion> ogra: could you give BenC editbugs please?
[01:56] <ogra> Kamion, BenC, done :)
[01:56] <Kamion> BenC: you should be able to do it yourself now
[01:56] <BenC> thanks
[01:56] <Kamion> ogra: ta
[01:57] <ogra> Kamion, do you happen to know why the liveCd has a password for the default user now ?
[01:57] <BenC> hmm, assigned-to field is still not editable for me
[01:57] <Kamion> ogra: no - perhaps passwd -l broke?
[01:58] <Kamion> BenC: there should be a reassign radio button further down
[01:58] <BenC> yep, damn bugzilla, doing things all weird
[01:59] <ogra> Kamion, can casper set environment vars before the user gets logged in ? 
[01:59] <mvo> hm, looks like starting the screensaver is not a good idea on the live-cd :P
[01:59] <ogra> mvo, just solved
[01:59] <ogra> ;)
[01:59] <ogra> mvo, but you could be my guineapig if you run the liveCd currently
[01:59] <Kamion> ogra: what are you trying to do?
[02:00] <mvo> ogra: nice picture btw =)
[02:00] <mvo> ogra: I was just rebooting, should I boot back into it?
[02:00] <ogra> Kamion, solving the xscreensaver lock issue
[02:00] <Kamion> ogra: you could hack /etc/environment; bear in mind that every hack performed by casper has to be unhacked by ubuntu-express
[02:00] <ogra> mvo, could you kill xscreensaver after login and export RUNNING_UNDER_GDM="True", then start xscreensaver again and try to lock ?
[02:01] <mvo> ogra: ok, will do (once it's up again)
[02:01] <ogra> Kamion, see that ^^^ it prevents locking at all, i just have to get this var set before the user gets logged in
[02:02] <Kamion> ogra: it would be much better for xscreensaver to detect that the user's password is locked
[02:02] <Kamion> I don't see why that should be infeasible; it surely has the privileges to tell
[02:02] <Lathiat> Kamion: technically, that behavior would be correct
[02:02] <ogra> Kamion, yes... but as a quick fix this will work...
[02:02] <Lathiat> Kamion: (not letting you unlock if is locked)
[02:02] <mpt> mvo: Has "Click on the update icon the link to see the available updates" already been reported?
[02:03] <ogra> Kamion, i.e. for preview since its a one liner :)
[02:03] <Kamion> ogra: did mdz say this is preview-critical?
[02:03] <ogra> Kamion, nope... but a easy fix and i guess the current CD arent final, are they ? 
[02:03] <Lathiat> it should be
[02:03] <Kamion> no, unfortunately they aren't
[02:03] <mvo> mpt: I thought that was fixed in the current image? let me check
[02:04] <Kamion> I want to keep the delta to preview as small as possible, that's all
[02:04] <ogra> Kamion, o adding this one line to casper should be sufficient for now... i'm working on a zero PW chack already, but this will take longer
[02:04] <BenC> who officially handles udev bugs?
[02:04] <BenC> doesn't seem to be just one person assigned udev stuff
[02:04] <ogra> BenC, pitti ? 
[02:05] <BenC> is that scott?
[02:05] <Kamion> a motley selection of pitti, Keybuk, jbailey, and whoever fails to step back first
[02:05] <mvo> mpt: it's not fixed apparently :/ would "Click on the update icon or the link.." be appropriate?
[02:06] <BenC> ah, martin-pitt
[02:06] <mpt> mvo: That would be acceptable, though I'd still wonder why I was being given a choice :-)
[02:06] <HiddenWolf> Guys, I've got trouble with my cdroms again.
[02:06] <HiddenWolf> Don't automount.
[02:07] <mvo> BenC: do you plan a kernel upload after preview? the hook file would need a (small) update to support not showing the reboot notification if a reboot already happend
[02:08] <Kamion> that hfs crash really needs to be fixed before final, so I hope so
[02:08] <BenC> mvo: yeah
[02:08] <Mithrandir> doko_: what do you think about http://err.no/patches/bcel_5.1-4ubuntu2_5.1-4ubuntu3_ftbfs_ant_compiler.diff ?
[02:08] <mvo> mpt: you don't like choices ;) ? I'm fine with just writing "the link" or "the button"
[02:09] <mvo> BenC: the hook file will need the additonal key ""DontShowAfterReboot=true"
[02:09] <pitti> Hi
[02:10] <daniels> hi pitti
[02:11] <pitti> new CD images to test?
[02:11] <sivang> pitti: wb
[02:11] <sivang> pitti: I'm in to more tests as well
[02:12] <pitti> Kamion: thanks Colin for the hfs workaround - so I don't even need to hack in the scripts during install :-)
[02:12] <Kamion> daniels: that X fix seems to have worked
[02:12] <fabbione> hey BenC 
[02:12] <seb_lamd64> daniels, that fixes it
[02:13] <daniels> Kamion: okay, cool
[02:13] <daniels> sweet
[02:13] <seb_lamd64> thanks for debugging it
[02:13] <daniels> Kamion: speak NOW if you don't want me to upload
[02:13] <daniels> seb_lamd64: thank you, dude
[02:13] <Kamion> go ahead
[02:13] <daniels> Kamion: done
[02:13] <daniels> seb_lamd64: i hope you want beer bought for you at ubz
[02:13] <seb_lamd64> was not GTK bog :p
[02:13] <daniels> seb_lamd64: (of course, this means that all bugs from here in are gtk bugs ...)
[02:13] <seb_lamd64> sure :)
[02:13] <daniels> since all the xorg bugs have clearly been fixed
[02:13] <seb_lamd64> ha ha :)
[02:14] <pitti> mvo: btw, I installed with network and download of the l-support pack, worked fine
[02:14] <seb_lamd64> pitti, you are next on my list :)
[02:14] <mpt> mvo: That's not the sort of choice that lets someone increase their long-term productivity, so the only effect will be to slow them down
[02:14] <daniels> i'm so used to mentally reversing your 'ah ah' in my head, I read that as 'ah ah'.
[02:14] <mvo> pitti: yeah! thanks
[02:14] <mpt> mvo: It's rather strange to use hyperlinks in non-Web GUIs anyway, so nuking the link and just saying "click the icon" would be an improvement I think
[02:14] <seb_lamd64> pitti, is the liveCD supposed to be mounted?
[02:14] <pitti> Kamion: during install I noticed quite a few missing translations - did the msgids really change that much or is there a bug somewhere?
[02:14] <pitti> seb_lamd64: well, you can't do without, right?
[02:14] <Kamion> pitti: there's a bug somewhere in debconf->cdebconf passthrough - I'll track it down after preview
[02:15] <seb_lamd64> pitti, hal-device-manager doesn't list it as mounted
[02:15] <pitti> Kamion: yes, should be no preview blocker, I just noticed it
[02:15] <pitti> seb_lamd64: but "mount" does?
[02:15] <seb_lamd64> pitti, neither do mount
[02:15] <seb_lamd64> pitti, nop
[02:15] <mvo> mpt: can't you usability folks have a common opinion :) ? I got a bug a couple of days ago that it's too hard for people to understand what a "update icon" is and that I should add a clickable bit in the notification
[02:15] <seb_lamd64> pitti, but computer:/// and the desktop list "cdrom"
[02:15] <pitti> seb_lamd64: hm, then hal can't either - I look at it in my next live test
[02:15] <seb_lamd64> pitti, I don't get how/why it happens
[02:16] <mvo> mpt: but yeah, I agree that it's lame to have a choice in this question
[02:16] <pitti> seb_lamd64: I suspect that gvfs displays the loopback image as cdrom
[02:16] <mpt> mvo: I agree entirely that it's too hard for people to understand what an update icon is
[02:16] <seb_lamd64> pitti, what loopback?
[02:17] <pitti> seb_lamd64: the live root fs?
[02:17] <mpt> mvo: The long-term solution is not to use an icon, but realistically, that won't get done for Breezy, will it :-)
[02:17] <pitti> seb_lamd64: I will look at it
[02:17] <seb_lamd64> pitti, right
[02:17] <seb_lamd64> pitti, thanks, let me know if you figure something
[02:17] <Kamion> ogra: testing a casper hack now
[02:17] <mpt> mvo: In the short term, saying "please click the icon" with a balloon pointing straight to it should be *obvious*, even if annoying or whatever.
[02:17] <mvo> mpt: no, I'll get eaten alive if I do anthing but (small) fixes at this stage
[02:18] <pitti> ah, I need to change my IP to circumvent my quota, brb
[02:18] <daniels> heh
[02:18] <daniels> and I thought Australian ISPs sucked
[02:18] <ogra> Kamion, great :)
[02:18] <HrdwrBoB> haha
[02:18] <Lathiat> haha
[02:18] <daniels> (well, they do, but still.)
[02:19] <Lathiat> well
[02:19] <HrdwrBoB> that's ok I route traffic through my work because we peer with them
[02:19] <Lathiat> i cant change my IP to avoid quota
[02:19] <Lathiat> wish i could
[02:19] <daniels> HrdwrBoB: oh, dude.  nice.
[02:19] <HrdwrBoB> so I get free traffic
[02:19] <HrdwrBoB> :D
[02:19] <Lathiat> HrdwrBoB: eh heh
[02:19] <Lathiat> i do that when i get shaped
[02:19] <Lathiat> well through a small non profit ISP i look after
[02:19] <Riddell> mdz: can we get new kubuntu live CD builds
[02:20] <daniels> we just have unlimited 1.5/256 at the moment.  iinet are planning to do dsl2 on our exchange, so we should have unlimited 12/lots soonish, but I'm really hanging out for agile's adsl2+, so we get 24/arseloads.
[02:20] <daniels> Riddell: he's asleep at the moment
[02:20] <Lathiat> daniels: unlimited? hahahha
[02:20] <Lathiat> daniels: have you seen iinets plans? :)
[02:20] <Riddell> daniels: quite right too
[02:20] <Riddell> kamion: can we get new kubuntu live CD builds
[02:20] <daniels> Lathiat: i thought they offered an unlimited.  but I sense we're spiralling rapidly offtopic.
[02:20] <Kamion> ogra: are you sure that RUNNING_UNDER_GDM=True won't affect anything else?
[02:20] <Lathiat> daniels: no, the *most* you can get is 40GB
[02:20] <ogra> Kamion, yup
[02:21] <daniels> oh, cock
[02:21] <Lathiat> well, you could pay $190/month
[02:21] <Lathiat> and get 120GB
[02:21] <Kamion> Riddell: is there any point considering that we'll have to rebuild them for new xorg anyway?
[02:21] <Kamion> Riddell: and new casper, for that matter
[02:21] <Riddell> Kamion: when are they coming in?
[02:21] <ogra> Kamion, its a explicit xscreensaver env var
[02:21] <Lathiat> don't forget you'll have to bundle your phone service with them
[02:21] <daniels> Kamion: is there any point filing a wishlist on debconf asking it to scream frigging loudly if it decides to throw away your selections because you're doing something wrong?
[02:22] <daniels> Lathiat: don't use the landline, so I don't care
[02:22] <Kamion> ogra: it's not named like an xscreensaver environment variable :-P
[02:22] <Lathiat> daniels: yeh but the rental is like $12 month more than most people pay to telstra
[02:22] <Kamion> does nobody know about namespaces any more?
[02:22] <Kamion> THIS_IS_MY_ENVIRONMENT_VARIABLE_HONEST_ALL_YOU_OTHER_PEOPLE_CAN_GO_JUMP=True
[02:22] <daniels> Kamion: i'm pretty sure libx11 had LIBRARYPATH at some point
[02:23] <daniels> maybe still does
[02:23] <Kamion> daniels: probably ought to at least show up in DEBCONF_DEBUG=developer logs
[02:23] <Kamion> Riddell: they're on their way, next couple of hours
[02:23] <ogra> Kamion, if you feel better with it, i can add two lines to xscreensaver and add RUNNING_UBUNTU_LIVE as lock prevention
[02:23] <ogra> ;)
[02:23] <ogra> its trivial
[02:23] <Kamion> that doesn't make me feel better, no
[02:24] <daniels> Kamion: that would rock, yeah
[02:24] <Lathiat> ogra: does this fix include asking the screensaver to lock itself?
[02:24] <Riddell> Kamion: right
[02:24] <ogra> i suspected this :)
[02:24] <ogra> Lathiat, yes
[02:24] <Lathiat> ogra: ok cool
[02:24] <ogra> Lathiat, it works n th lowest level...
[02:24] <Kamion> ogra: RUNNING_UNDER_GDM=True in /etc/environment seems to work, anyway; I'll upload that shortly
[02:24] <ogra> Kamion, thaks :)
[02:24] <Kamion> Riddell: when do your last usable live CDs date from?
[02:25] <Kamion> ogra: it really ought to be XSCREENSAVER_*, though, if you're adding future variables
[02:25] <Riddell> Kamion: 2005-09-07 
[02:26] <ogra> Kamion, this var is set normally if you run xscreensaver from GDM to have it switch to a screensaver if nobody logs in...
[02:30] <Lathiat> pitti: was the decision not to restart dbus on any package installations kept?
[02:30] <Lathiat> pitti: (just wondering if we should keep this behavior in the avahi package)
[02:30] <ogra> Lathiat, its an upstream decision
[02:30] <Lathiat> ogra: sure, i more meant the decision on what to do in our packages
[02:30] <Lathiat> i'm aware of the issues/reasons surrounding it
[02:31] <pitti> Lathiat: yes
[02:31] <Kamion> ogra: since it's set by gdm, are you aware of any other code that looks at that environment variable and behaves differently when it's set?
[02:31] <ogra> Kamion, nope ...
[02:31] <Kamion> that's the obvious question
[02:31] <daniels> Lathiat: you should absolutely have code to deal with it
[02:31] <daniels> Lathiat: but it won't be happening by default
[02:32] <Lathiat> daniels: was that the dbus thing?
[02:33] <Lathiat> daniels: basically i dont restart, because that tended to be the consensus, unfortunately as its a system bus service the restart is needed to make avahi-daemon actually able to connect, i should send a patch to get dbus to reload its config files.
[02:33] <daniels> Lathiat: yeah, the dbus restarting thing
[02:33] <ogra> Kamion, sabayon uses it too to prevent locking in the xnest session, i dont think it will do any hram to anything else
[02:33] <ogra> harm even
[02:33] <Lathiat> avahi seems to have single handedly turned up about 10 bugs/annoyances in dbus so far
[02:33] <tseng> Lathiat: haha
[02:34] <Lathiat> really, it has
[02:34] <tseng> Lathiat: and snorp is finding more in dbus-sharp trying to bind avahi
[02:34] <Lathiat> tseng: yeh some of them are those
[02:34] <Lathiat> (was talking to him earlier about that)
[02:34] <Lathiat> not supporting arrays of arrays, didn't haven wrap a 16bit integer (in dbus-sharp)
[02:35] <Lathiat> we had some bugs in the python bindings, the problems with private connections, the fact the system bus address isnt exported, the fact restarting sucks / you can't reload config files, the header files arent ansi C compliant, etc, etc :)
[02:41] <Kamion> Riddell: I'm doing a quick build now for you
[02:41] <Kamion> won't be final though
[02:41] <seb_lamd64> pitti, 
[02:41] <seb_lamd64> vol(0x54f720)[dev: /dev/cdroms/cdrom0, mount: file:///cdrom, device type: 4, handles_trash: 0, icon: gnome-dev-cdrom, name: cdrom, user_visible: 1, drive: (nil)] 
[02:42] <ogra> edubuntu is just to big :(
[02:42] <seb_lamd64> that's from the gnome-vfs volume stuff
[02:42] <Riddell> ogra: twice as much to test
[02:42] <Riddell> ogra: but feel free to test kubuntu CDs on your amd64
[02:42] <ogra> Riddell, but unbelivable promotion advantages
[02:42] <Kamion> ok, I like new xorg, it actually builds in reasonable time
[02:43] <daniels> Kamion: no it fucking well doesn't
[02:43] <daniels> it still takes like 40 minutes on my laptop
[02:43] <pitti> seb_lamd64: and yet this is a lie, i. e. the cdrom is not actually mounted?
[02:43] <seb_lamd64> pitti, nop
[02:43] <Kamion> daniels: I can stay awake for 40 minutes
[02:43] <daniels> (daniels, meet years of accumulated bitterness.  years of accumulated bitterness, meet daniels.)
[02:43] <seb_lamd64> pitti, but I don't get where it founds /dev/cdroms/cdrom0
[02:43] <pitti> daniels: how long does the split server need?
[02:43] <daniels> Kamion: i much preferred the fifteen seconds or so.
[02:44] <Kamion> heh
[02:44] <pitti> seb_lamd64: that indeed looks like devfs...
[02:44] <seb_lamd64> pitti, /dev doesn't even has a /dev/cdroms/cdrom0
[02:44] <Kamion> seb_lamd64: if that's a live CD that's where it is in d-i
[02:44] <pitti> seb_lamd64: did you ever see that problem in an installation?
[02:44] <Kamion> casper copies in /dev/cdroms/ at shutdown
[02:44] <seb_lamd64> pitti, nop
[02:44] <daniels> pitti: it'll land as soon as dapper opens if I don't get it into Debian first.  gravity wants to work on 7.0 now, so hopefully that'll work out pretty well.
[02:44] <Kamion> but that may not be enough
[02:45] <seb_lamd64> Kamion, yep, that happens with amd64 and x86 liveCDs from today
[02:45] <Kamion> seb_lamd64: what's the effect?
[02:45] <seb_lamd64> Kamion, computer:/// and the desktop have a "cdrom" icon
[02:45] <pitti> seb_lamd64: it's not actually wrong, cdrom seems to be the cloop live image, and CD-RW (or whatever) the actual drive
[02:45] <Kamion> that's not a showstopper on the live CD, I don't think
[02:46] <seb_lamd64> nop a stopper, no
[02:46] <pitti> seb_lamd64: ... whcih you can't mount anyway since there already is a CD in it
[02:46] <seb_lamd64> just quite ugly
[02:46] <pitti> Kamion: nope, it's just a cosmetical thing; we eventually shuold make it nicer, but not for preview
[02:46] <hunger> Would it be possible to add zeroconf to /etc/services? Should be 5353/udp IIRC.
[02:46] <Lathiat> hunger: thats not 'zeroconf' its 'multicast dns'
[02:46] <seb_lamd64> pitti, but where does it find it? It's not listed by mtab neither hal
[02:47] <hunger> Lathiat: Could that get added then?
[02:47] <Lathiat> hunger: not the person to ask, just pointing that pout :)
[02:47] <pitti> seb_lamd64: as soon as we get a new CD set with the new xorg and casper, I try the live CD again
[02:48] <seb_lamd64> pitti, k
[02:48] <sivang> when are we expecting to have now images for testing?
[02:49] <Kamion> I am not answering questions of that form. :-)
[02:49] <tepsipakki> nautilus keeps crashning (same for trashapplet) if $HOME is behind a symlink
[02:49] <tepsipakki> -n
[02:49] <tepsipakki> uptodate breezy
[02:50] <seb_lamd64> what an idea to not use a real folder for that
[02:50] <tepsipakki> eh?
[02:50] <sivang> Kamion: oops, s/now/new/ :)
[02:50] <daniels> err
[02:51] <Kamion> still not :)
[02:51] <tepsipakki> seb_lamd64: it is a real folder..
[02:51] <Kamion> os-prober's in, xorg/amd64,i386 is in, xorg/powerpc's in accepted, waiting for casper
[02:51] <daniels> Kamion: so, with all this bugfixing I've been doing in xorg, for releases, it's reminded me of something
[02:51] <daniels> Kamion: y'know how multiseat duplicates all of xserver-xorg's maintainer scripts and shit?
[02:51] <tepsipakki> seb_lamd64: $HOME is /u/lai/lk/uid, but /u -> /home/u because it is a local folder, not behind NFS
[02:52] <Kamion> daniels: uh-huh
[02:52] <daniels> Kamion: we should probably think about disabling it unless explicitly requested for final
[02:52] <Kamion> can it be updated reasonably?
[02:52] <Kamion> but yeah
[02:52] <daniels> 'possibly, but I totally can't be arsed'
[02:53] <Kamion> I've put it on my to-do list, I'll see if I can do it
[02:55] <pitti> carlos: here?
[02:55] <Kamion> lamont-away,infinity: can you hurry casper_1.14 through? it's just an arch: all build
[02:55] <carlos> pitti, hi
[02:55] <carlos> pitti, yes
[02:55] <Kamion> oh, never mind, it's in accepted now
[02:56] <daniels> Kamion: if we're not actually going to be supporting multiseat (read: giving someone some time to do XorgAutoconfiguration), it's probably best to just take it out behind the shed
[02:57] <Kamion> I think some of our approach has to be dictated by whether the people who wanted multiseat in the first place are still interested (to the extent that they'd complain if we dropped it from breezy)
[02:58] <daniels> Kamion: the answer as I know it (in that I was directed to not spend work time on fixing it) is 'no'
[02:59] <seb128> CD sessions froze, if somebody wrote something for me write it again :)
[02:59] <Lathiat> seb128: no one said anything with your name :)
[02:59] <Lathiat> (nobody loves you)
[02:59] <seb128> k
[02:59] <daniels> seb128: just more gtk bugs
[02:59] <pitti> seb128: oh, I just pasted you the patch for a huge gtk bug, but now it's lost
[02:59] <pitti> :-)
[02:59] <pitti> daniels: heh
[02:59] <seb128> :p
[03:05] <tepsipakki> the nautilus-crasher is in gnome-vfs, and it occurs if the first part of $HOME is a symlink (in this case, /u ->). If I make /u a real directory and then add a symlink to the real $HOME under it, everything works
[03:05] <tepsipakki> and that's why I haven't hit this before
[03:08] <seb128> tepsipakki: could you describe what is the first part of a dir?
[03:08] <tepsipakki> umm
[03:08] <seb128> you don't use /home/<user> as home?
[03:08] <tepsipakki> no, this is a campus-wide system
[03:08] <seb128> and...?
[03:09] <seb128> could you describe the setup
[03:09] <tepsipakki> my home is /u/lai/lk/tjaalton.. the "first part" here is /u =)
[03:09] <seb128> and what make it crashing?
[03:09] <seb128> do you have a backtrace?
[03:09] <tepsipakki> normally we have links under a directory named /u, but in this case /u itself is a symlink (under /home/u, laptop ie. local home)
[03:09] <tepsipakki> well, yes but no debugging symbols
[03:12] <tepsipakki> http://users.tkk.fi/~tjaalton/crash.txt
[03:12] <Kamion> live fs and install CDs building
[03:13] <seb128> tepsipakki: apt-get install libgnomevfs2-0-dbg
[03:13] <tepsipakki> seb128: yes, will try
[03:18] <tepsipakki> seb128: http://users.tkk.fi/~tjaalton/crash-dbg-nautilus.txt
[03:19] <tepsipakki> seb128: http://users.tkk.fi/~tjaalton/crash-dbg-trashapplet.txt
[03:19] <tepsipakki> they look similar ;)
[03:20] <ogra> seb128, the issue with 7150 is that disabling the button doesnt solve the problem :)
[03:21] <seb128> tepsipakki: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=308639 upstream
[03:21] <seb128> ogra: I figured that, I don't really get Matt's question though
[03:22] <ogra> seb128, i suspect he expected the key to do what its name says ;)
[03:23] <ogra> seb128, disable_lock_screen should be reamed to disable_lock_button ;)
[03:23] <tepsipakki> seb128: well, this is on login
[03:23] <seb128> /apps/panel
[03:23] <seb128> the namespace count
[03:23] <seb128> tepsipakki: the backtrace is the same
[03:23] <ogra> yup... but still the name of the key is confusing
[03:24] <tepsipakki> seb128: ok, luckily this is easily avoided
[03:24] <seb128> you don't have real bugs to start discussing about key name not beeing optimal?
[03:24] <mjg59> jbailey: 1126184936.3740.139.camel@petra on lkml looks interesting
[03:24] <seb128> tepsipakki: maybe you could comment on the upstream bug saying what you do to get the bug
[03:24] <tepsipakki> seb128: yes
[03:25] <ogra> seb128, haha.... 
[03:39] <Mithrandir> daniels: 9925 works just fine for me; close it?
[03:44] <mjg59> crimsun: Ping?
[03:47] <elmo> Kamion: I take it I shouldn't do the NEW l-p or BYHAND d-i?
[03:47] <Kamion> elmo: not yet, please
[03:47] <elmo> cool, just checking
[03:48] <Kamion> hm, I thought we had those NEW l-p ages ago, but evidently mdz just NEWed the source or something
[03:48] <Kamion> oh well, it'll have to miss preview
[03:48] <lamont> Mithrandir: my bad on that hwclock.sh bug - I fixed it about the same time as I uploaded to ubuntu
[03:48] <Mithrandir> lamont: but you forgot to mention it in the changelog. :-P
[03:48] <daniels> Mithrandir: just did, thanks
[03:49] <lamont> Mithrandir: yeah
[03:49] <lamont> Mithrandir: likewise, I think that the latest debian upload of util-linux is a non-diff for ubuntu
[03:49] <lamont> IIRC
[03:49] <Mithrandir> lamont: that'd be nice.
[03:50] <jbailey> mjg59: It seems too new for google to have indexed.  Who's it from?  I'll look it up in today's lkml.org
[03:50] <lamont> Mithrandir: the bug in question (deb323872 - I think) was fixed in 2.12p-7
[03:51] <Mithrandir> lamont: the ==-bug?  Yeah, it was.
[03:51] <lamont> yeah
[03:51] <lamont> iz the only change in -7
[03:51] <mjg59> jbailey: Karel Zak
[03:52] <lamont> then there's -8, which deals with a dangling symlink, which should not be the case on grandma'
[03:52] <lamont> s computers
[03:52] <Mithrandir> lamont: still the LSB diff, though, and some other smallish cleanups by mdz (usplash friendlyness and such)
[03:52] <herzi> which package do is use to file bugs for linux-image-*? they're not mentioned in bugzilla
[03:52] <mjg59> herzi: linux
[03:52] <herzi> thx
[03:52] <lamont> Mithrandir: ah, ok.  I'll pull the ubuntu changes back into debian then..
[03:53] <mvo> ping jamesh 
[03:53] <lamont> Mithrandir: note that the LSB stuff is down to a 18 line diff or so
[03:53] <jbailey> mjg59: Ooo, the failed resume support there?
[03:53] <jbailey> That's nice.
[03:53] <Mithrandir> lamont: nice.
[03:53] <lamont> Mithrandir: since the debian version includes lines of the form: log_begin_msg () { echo -n "$@"; }
[03:53] <jbailey> My patch to do that is in file, but didn't make it into Debianyet.
[03:53] <lamont> prolly closer to a 25 line diff, but it's one block of text
[03:53] <herzi> BenC: can you take a quick look at http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=14964 and tell me whether this can be achieved within breezy?
[03:54] <Mithrandir> lamont: can't you just wrap that in an if [ ! -f ... ]  ?
[03:54] <lamont> no.  they might have lsb-base installed on the system.
[03:54] <lamont> or do we have a file that we know only exists on ubuntu machines?
[03:55] <hunger> Is the network-manager in universe up to date? I can't install it due to libcairo1 dependency.
[03:55] <Kamion> I'm increasingly of the opinion that it's OK to just start using lsb-base functions on Debian too
[03:55] <Kamion> if there's a difference in required output format, it should be handled in the lsb-base functions in Debian
[03:55] <lamont> Kamion: does it not violate policy?
[03:55] <lamont> ah, woot!
[03:55] <Kamion> lamont: see above
[03:55] <Kamion> lamont: I'm not saying it *is* handled properly there (it wasn't, last I checked), but that seems to be the obviously correct approach ...
[03:56] <lamont> Kamion: I'd be inclined to say let's fix lsb-base, and then we can go there... not the other way around...
[03:56] <Kamion> lamont: a number of people have already started to use lsb-base, so hopefully that'll provide momentum
[03:56] <lamont> nice
[03:58] <Mithrandir> hunger: nm is br0ken because it doesn't recognize the dbus version, so the cairo rebuild failed
[03:59] <Diziet> One of the firefox bugs I'm triaging is more or less equivalent to a wiki page mentioned in the obsolete https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BreezyBadger under `Un-prioritized stuff' but not in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BreezyGoals.
[03:59] <Diziet> (Triageing ?)
[04:00] <Diziet> It claims to be `major' which is an exaggeration anyway, but should I put a reference to it anywhere, or shall I just let it wallow in amongst the `normal' bugs ?
[04:00] <lu|dinner> (triaging)
[04:00] <Kamion> ("triaging", I think, because a following "i" still produces the same "g" sound as a following "e".)
[04:00] <hunger> Mithrandir: Thanks!
[04:01] <Diziet> It's 7023 which I think is equivalent to MimeManagement.
[04:01] <Mithrandir> hunger: I guess prodding a MOTU to update the snapshot might be the best thing to do.
[04:01] <Kamion> MimeManagement already has a link to 7023.
[04:02] <Kamion> and I see 7023 has a link to MimeManagement, too
[04:03] <Diziet> Indeed.  But do they want a link anywhere else ?
[04:03] <Diziet> Also it has `Target Milestone: Ubuntu 5.10'
[04:03] <Kamion> so I think it's probably OK to just reprioritise it as appropriate, and bring it up at the next conference if you think it's a substantial piece of work that you want a chunk of time allocated to
[04:04] <Diziet> Well, actually, I don't think it's that important.  But I don't want to overrule some earlier decision by someone ...
[04:04] <Kamion> let me just find out who set that milestone
[04:04] <mvo> ping niran 
[04:05] <Diziet> It looks to me like it was the submitter./
[04:05] <Kamion> Diziet: Jeff Waugh set the milestone when he made comment #2
[04:05] <Diziet> s,/,,
[04:05] <Kamion> (unfortunately, the only way I know of to find this out is to hunt through mail archives, which is why I keep a full archive of ubuntu-bugs ...)
[04:05] <Diziet> Oh, I should look in `view bug activity'.
[04:05] <Kamion> ah
[04:05] <Kamion> !
[04:06] <Kamion> well, that comment was made around the Hoary release, and I think it's clearly blown past the stage in this release cycle where one might add that feature
[04:06] <Diziet> Indeed so.
[04:07] <Kamion> We should get an "Ubuntu 6.04" milestone added
[04:07] <Diziet> Should I set it to no milestone, normal and email Jeff ?
[04:08] <Kamion> Yes, that sounds reasonable for now
[04:10] <Amaranth> i hate wireless networks
[04:10] <dholbach> re
[04:11] <Kamion> mjg59: did you see this morning's usplash upload as well as my mail about last night's?
[04:11] <Kamion> (I should get those changes back into BOGL)
[04:12] <mjg59> Kamion: Yup
[04:12] <mjg59> Kamion: So it all works now?
[04:13] <daniels> Kamion: g'luck with preview, thanks for dealing with the updates etc.  i'll be back in the 'morn.
[04:14] <Kamion> mjg59: seems to, yes
[04:14] <mjg59> Kamion: Rock
[04:14] <Kamion> beautiful usplash on beautiful huge powerpc framebuffer
[04:14] <elmo> kamion: fyi succesful i386 live test on kinnison's toshiba portege a100
[04:14] <mjg59> Kamion: Ideally, we might want to provide higher coloured images plus a usplash package that uses linear framebuffers on x86
[04:14] <Kamion> ("beautiful" may be an exaggeration. -ed)
[04:14] <mjg59> That way people who use vga=foo could get a nicer picture
[04:14] <mjg59> But probably post-breezy
[04:14] <Kamion> mjg59: yes, having 256 colours would be good on this framebuffer
[04:15] <Kamion> mjg59: the Kubuntu branding requirement is probably pre-breezy, so maybe a 256-colour version could go in at the same time ...?
[04:16] <Kamion> although god knows how to get the right artwork installed that early
[04:16] <elmo> what's the password for ubuntu on live CD?
[04:16] <Kamion> elmo: none
[04:16] <Kamion> (locked)
[04:16] <elmo> kamion: ah
[04:17] <Mithrandir> Kamion: there's a md5 hash in /etc/shadow.
[04:17] <Kamion> elmo: bitten by #7150?
[04:17] <elmo> daniel locked it while testing the hot keys and now can't get in :)
[04:17] <Kamion> elmo: switch to tty1 and 'sudo passwd ubuntu'
[04:17] <elmo> kamion: do we no longer auto-login a console session?
[04:17] <Kamion> elmo: we certainly do
[04:17] <Kamion> six of them
[04:17] <Mithrandir> four of them
[04:17] <Mithrandir> is it six now?
[04:17] <Kamion> yes, we just sed /etc/inittab
[04:18] <Mithrandir> elmo: but it's very secure. :-P
[04:18] <Kamion> s/getty/login/ or something equally bright
[04:18] <elmo> hmm, ok, could be PEBKAC ;)
[04:18] <Kamion> Mithrandir: I think the password is temporarily set to 'ubuntu' and then locked after that
[04:19] <Kamion> preview-candidate install CDs up, please test
[04:19] <elmo> mjg59: is the nx6125 thermal trip work around going to get into before final?
[04:19] <Kamion> live building
[04:19] <Kamion> well, not quite up yet, still mirroring - 20050908.6
[04:21] <Kamion> really up now
[04:22] <mjg59> elmo: Nngh.
[04:22] <mjg59> elmo: With luck
[04:22] <mjg59> elmo: I've tracked it down some more. The behaviour is utterly mad.
[04:23] <mjg59> Basically, the thermal trips are wrong if the timer is overridden from irq 0 to irq 2
[04:23] <mjg59> Which is a bit of a WTF type situation
[04:24] <Lathiat> is there any reason we dont install libesd-alsa0 by default? this woudl free up /dev/dsp for the various applications that use it (games, flash, vmware, etc)
[04:25] <elmo> hmm, ok current live doesn't like nx6125's, it goes screwey as soon as you hit X
[04:25] <mjg59> elmo: Yeah, X is still going to explode
[04:25] <mjg59> We're working on that
[04:25] <pitti> Lathiat: erm, we do
[04:25] <Lathiat> we do?
[04:26] <Kamion> desktop: * libesd-alsa0
[04:26] <elmo> mjg59: ok
[04:26] <Lathiat> err
[04:26] <Lathiat> so we do
[04:26] <Lathiat> when did that change?
[04:26] <Lathiat> it definately was steal using /dev/dsp last week
[04:26] <pitti> Lathiat: maybe two or three months ago
[04:26] <Lathiat> ... weird
[04:27] <Kamion> 2005-05-19 11:36:11 GMT Martin Pitt <martin@piware.de>  patch-31
[04:27] <Kamion>     Summary:
[04:27] <Kamion>       switch from libesd0 to libesd-alsa0
[04:27] <Lathiat> i still had /dev/dsp being used up until last week
[04:27] <pitti> Lathiat: we use alsa dmix by default now
[04:27] <Lathiat> pitti: ya, which is why its nice to keep /dev/dsp free because that doesnt allow you to use it more than once even with dmix
[04:27] <pitti> right, that was the idea
[04:27] <Lathiat> oh well, weird
[04:28] <Lathiat> something must of happened
[04:28] <BenC> anyone have any ntfs partitions on a breezy box with 2.6.12-8 kernel?
[04:28] <Kamion> perhaps you never upgraded to the new ubuntu-desktop until recently (e.g. due to not dist-upgrading)
[04:28] <pitti> BenC: we can't create them, right?
[04:28] <Lathiat> i've been dist-upgrading the whole time
[04:28] <Lathiat> BenC: yes
[04:28] <Lathiat> pitti: not afaik
[04:28] <pitti> Lathiat: and you have u-desktop installed=
[04:29] <BenC> Lathiat: can you mount the ntfs partition?
[04:29] <Lathiat> pitti: yep, its even using alsa now, but it wasnt last week
[04:29] <BenC> I've got a bug report that shows an error mounting an ntfs partition (so grub ignored it, and they couldn't boot to windows anymore)
[04:29] <Lathiat> BenC: interesting
[04:29] <Lathiat> BenC: works fine here
[04:31] <shackan> BenC, here too ( but with 2.6.12-7 )
[04:31] <Kamion> Riddell: Kubuntu live filesystem build running
[04:32] <BenC> probably this guys ntfs partition got borked then
[04:32] <BenC> thanks
[04:32] <elmo> live cd on a 15" PB is fine, but that's probably not surprising
[04:33] <Diziet> http://www.ubuntulinux.org/include/ubuntu1.png has Content-Type: text/plain.  Should I email webmaster like the website says ?
[04:33] <lifeless> how do we turn metacity back to fast mode in breezy ?
[04:33] <pitti> elmo: oh, good to hear; this morning it was completely borked
[04:33] <Kamion> elmo: good stuff. your powerbook's newer than mine so it wasn't guaranteed that the framebuffer was the same
[04:33] <elmo> Diziet: don't bother, hn073 already filed a bug
[04:33] <elmo> hno73 too
[04:33] <sivang> pitti: there's a new one to test?
[04:34] <pitti> sivang: well, according to Kamion there should be a new one, which should be .7
[04:34] <Kamion> just a sec, it's mirroring
[04:34] <pitti> sivang: this is the one withe ppc fixes
[04:34] <Kamion> amd64's still oversized, bah
[04:35] <Kamion> lifeless: install CD or live CD?
[04:35] <sivang> pitti: ah, for ppc64/CHRP booting ?
[04:35] <Kamion> sivang: no
[04:35] <lifeless> Kamion: livecd
[04:35] <Kamion> nothing along those lines has changed recently
[04:35] <pitti> sivang: for the usplash break and hfs kernel hang
[04:35] <sivang> Kamion: k, just wanted to know. 
[04:35] <lifeless> Kamion: the black rectangles on minimise, for instance.
[04:35] <Kamion> lifeless: grab the new live CD, please; that's one of the things we were just fixing
[04:36] <lifeless> Kamion: uhn, that was burnt 10 minutes back, is that new enough ?
[04:36] <Kamion> nope
[04:36] <Diziet> `Mozilla has considerable problems with embedded internally-handled types like text/html and image/gif when they have unusual file extensions' - no shit.
[04:36] <Kamion> try 30 seconds
[04:36] <lifeless> Kamion: K
[04:36] <pitti> yay, .7
[04:36] <Kamion> lifeless: alternatively add a sensible Modules section to xorg.conf
[04:36] <pitti> lifeless: we release fast, don't we? :-)
[04:38] <seb128> pitti: can you note what permission .dmrc has on the new install? That's for #14910
[04:38] <Mithrandir> hey, we have 30 minute days, you can't assume that something which is 1/3 of a day out of date is the latest&greatest.
[04:39] <sivang> pitti: I see the -7 there, will download and test
[04:39] <Keybuk> hmm, so how do people test these CDs?  spare machine you blow away each time?
[04:39] <Kamion> Keybuk: spare partition
[04:39] <elmo> should the CD upgrade work?
[04:39] <mvo> Keybuk: basicly yes
[04:40] <Kamion> EVERYONE: please test current install and live CD images as Breezy preview release candidates
[04:40] <elmo> as in, pop a breezy CD in a hoary machine and hva eit do the right thing?
[04:40] <mvo> elmo: modulo the ubuntu-desktop problem and that it does not rewrite the sources.list 
[04:40] <sivang> Keybuk: I chose to keep data, and installed on my ubuntu mirror fs, works well
[04:40] <elmo> ...
[04:40] <pitti> elmo: we still have three X conffile questions, otherwise it worked reasonably well yesterday
[04:40] <elmo> mvo: hmm, ok will breezy be better?
[04:40] <Keybuk> ok
[04:40] <mvo> elmo: better in the way that it rewrites the sources.list? or that it does not remove ubuntu-desktop :) ?
[04:41] <\sh> Kamion: I will test ubuntu + kubuntu tonight...
[04:41] <Kamion> sivang: it's pretty dodgy to put your new root filesystem on a filesystem that already has stuff on it; I'd caution against doing that in the future
[04:41] <Kamion> \sh: that will be too late
[04:41] <\sh> argl
[04:41] <elmo> mvo: both :)
[04:41] <Kamion> we are releasing the preview today
[04:41] <\sh> I need to get a bloody usb cdrom
[04:41] <sivang> Kamion: sure, but I didn't mind it get blown away - and didn't want to waste more time by moving it since resize didn't work
[04:41] <Keybuk> Kamion: when is too late? :p  it'd gonna take me an hour to get a drive to burn a CD <g>
[04:42] <\sh> i  can't help it...I have to go later into office and grab one there *grrr*
[04:42] <Kamion> Keybuk: you'll probably be in time
[04:42] <Kamion> sivang: yes
[04:42] <Keybuk> ok, I'll head off now then
[04:42] <mvo> elmo: the ubuntu-desktop remove thing will be fixed after preview. the rewriting of the sources.list is tricky, there is a bug open, I probably need advice from mdz if that's something we want to do (and if, if we should do it for breezy)
[04:44] <Kamion> \sh: that said, Kubuntu CD testing tonight definitely won't go to waste
[04:44] <Kamion> even if it's after preview, Kubuntu CDs need more testing in general
[04:44] <elmo> is the live image rsyncable?
[04:45] <Kamion> elmo: yes
[04:45] <pitti> yes
[04:45] <\sh> Kamion: well...i will test them in anyway...but I want to have an original media and not a tweaked one...
[04:45] <pitti> pretty well
[04:45] <pitti> elmo: I get speedups of 10 and above
[04:45] <\sh> but I cried because I saw my tax papers...and what I earned before tax and what I had after tax...it's really sad
[04:45] <sivang> (5 mins differnece, cool)
[04:46] <elmo> hum, what options do I want?
[04:46] <elmo> I'm doing .6 -> .7 and it seems to be doing it from scratch
[04:46] <pitti> elmo: only at the beginning for me, then it becomes really fast
[04:46] <elmo> pitti: ah, ok
[04:46] <pitti> rsync -vP rsync://cdimage.ubuntu.com/cdimage/daily-live/current/breezy-live-amd64.iso breezy-live-amd64.iso
[04:46] <pitti> nothing special
[04:47] <Kamion> the first 4MB or so always seem to re-download from scratch
[04:47] <Kamion> I'm assuming it's an index or something
[04:48] <pitti> elmo: speedup is 20.66 - that's not bad :-)
[04:50] <Diziet> elmo: Do you have a reference for that Content-Type bug ?
[04:51] <elmo> https://rt.admin.canonical.com/Ticket/Display.html?id=38
[04:51] <elmo> Diziet: ?
[04:53] <elmo> err, s/?/^--/
[04:53] <Diziet> Thanks.
[04:53] <Lathiat> hrm, the imaging shrinking in firefox has gotten horrendous
[04:53] <Diziet> (That bug) plus (barmy Firefox) = 8911, which is on my list.
[04:53] <Lathiat> it seems to be just flat dropping pixels or something
[04:55] <elmo> ok, so doing the CD based upgrade:
[04:55] <elmo> a) the debconf dictionary question popped up - wasn't that fixed already?
[04:55] <sivang> :-( 1hr eta for live download...
[04:55] <elmo> b) the graphic debconf front end needs some branding love, it's got a big-ass debian swirl on it
[04:56] <elmo> c) glibc halted the upgrade with the non-debconfified "can I restart services question?"
[04:56] <tim1> is there a specific reason f-spot has been updated to 0.1.1 recently although 0.1.2 was already available at that time?
[04:57] <dholbach> tim1: i suggest you ask in #ubuntu-motu
[04:57] <pitti> wow, usplash on ppc works finally
[04:57] <pitti> Kamion rocks :-)
[04:57] <dholbach> pitti: YAY! :)
[04:57] <dholbach> usplash love! :)
[04:57] <tim1> dholbach: oh, I didn't know that channel, thanks
[04:57] <mpt> woo
[04:57] <dholbach> i'd just like the text to be in a brighter colour
[04:57] <dholbach> but that's just me :)
[04:58] <pitti> dholbach: well, failures stand out better that way IMHO
[04:58] <Kamion> pitti: cool :)
[04:59] <Kamion> elmo: b) I de-branded that post-hoary (debconf 1.4.49ubuntu2)
[04:59] <pitti> so the only thing is that I can't boot MacOS now due to the disabled hfs scanning, but I don't actually care about it anyway :-)
[05:00] <elmo> Kamion: ah, of course, it's still hoary's debconf
[05:01] <elmo> ok, --partial clearly isn't working at all
[05:01] <elmo> hateful rsync
[05:02] <Mithrandir> elmo: partial just means it doesn't eat what you've transferred already.
[05:02] <Kamion> sivang: no
[05:02] <maswan> Mithrandir: partial just means that it will eat your whole almost-correct image and replace it with the first N megabytes. :/
[05:02] <Mithrandir> maswan: that too
[05:02] <Kamion> maswan: amen
[05:02] <Kamion> bloody irritating, that
[05:03] <Kamion> --partial-dir=DIR looks like it ought to help thre
[05:03] <Kamion> there
[05:03] <maswan> btw, would a cdimage.u.c mirror be good for you? and if so, what time of day should I mirror? so far, I have silly large ammount of free space. ;)
[05:03] <Kamion> cdimage.u.c updates throughout the day really, but around 10am London time wouldn't be bad
[05:04] <Kamion> you do realise it's HUGE
[05:04] <maswan> yes, I know the size of it
[05:04] <maswan> would a mirror be a net gain or loss in bandwidth usage for you guys though?
[05:04] <elmo> oh dear
[05:04] <Diziet> Have I moaned about bugzilla today yet ?  It's utterly hateful.
[05:04] <elmo> so rsync --partial works if you do it on the right machine
[05:04] <Kamion> 10am is after the big Ubuntu daily and daily-live cron jobs
[05:04] <elmo> works better
[05:05] <Robot101> Diziet: Status: CLOSED Resolution: WONTFIX
[05:05] <tseng> Diziet: if you think you've hit rock bottom with bugzilla, there is always malone..
[05:05] <Kamion> maswan: I suspect net gain, we certainly have tens of downloads a day of the dailies
[05:05] <maswan> Kamion: *nods*, I'll take a good look at it then.
[05:05] <Kamion> and that's only the reliable ones
[05:05] <mdke> BenC, are you around?
[05:07] <Kamion> maswan: thanks
[05:09] <Riddell> Kamion: the kubuntu live CD is oversized by about 3Megs, is the only option to remove stuff from the desktop seed?
[05:09] <Diziet> How do I make a bug a duplicate of some other bug, and does that do anything useful ?
[05:10] <sivang> ok, /me is going for an install cycle again
[05:10] <sivang> bbl
[05:10] <Kamion> Riddell: it's possible to remove stuff from the live seed too, but I see you've already done most of that
[05:11] <Kamion> Riddell: trying to get it within size now will take too long; let's just live with the live CD being oversized for preview
[05:11] <Kamion> we'll see how the next Kubuntu live CD looks, anyway
[05:13] <Riddell> Kamion: right
[05:17] <Diziet> Oh, I can't mark it as a duplicate when it's closed.
[05:18] <\sh> yay...dancing the xorg dance again ;)
[05:19] <Kamion> the Greek fonts we have installed are pretty awful - hopeless kerning
[05:20] <Kamion> I think characters are coming from a mix of fonts or something
[05:26] <Kamion> Riddell: Kubuntu install CD preview candidate up
[05:28] <slomo> hm, does someone know how i can disable password (and other form data) saving in epiphany?
[05:28] <Riddell> Kamion: great.  how final is the current live CD?
[05:29] <Kamion> Riddell: I'm just building a preview candidate of that now
[05:30] <ogra> jbailey, where is man initramfs.conf ?
[05:30] <dholbach> Kamion: will the partition dialog be translated in the release?
[05:30] <pitti> Kamion: ppc/install is golden; also, nice to have linux-wlan-ng on the CD to get online without trouble :-)
[05:31] <seb128> pitti: have you noted the .dmrc rights?
[05:31] <pitti> -rw-------  1 martin martin 26 2005-07-18 08:06 .dmrc
[05:31] <pitti> what's wrong with that?
[05:32] <seb128> pitti: https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=14910
[05:33] <seb128> pitti: not wrong, but this bug is weird ...
[05:33] <Amaranth> btw, has anyone found any bugs with smeg?
[05:33] <Lathiat> Amaranth: dude! 
[05:33] <Amaranth> the only one brought to me was a bug in pyxdg 0.14 and gnome-menus 2.10.x
[05:33] <ogra> Amaranth !
[05:33] <pitti> seb128: hm, having .dmrc owned by sb else than the owner would indeed be wrong, but fussing about the perms is rather a gdm bug
[05:33] <pitti> anyway, testing ppc live now
[05:34] <Kamion> dholbach: which dialog exactly?
[05:34] <seb128> Amaranth: there is 2 bugzilla bugs on smeg ... should I set you as default assignement for smeg package?
[05:34] <Lathiat> Amaranth: found any kind of reliable net access? :)
[05:34] <ogra> Amaranth, i have several reports with vanishing education menus, the education menu just disappears unintentional for time to time...
[05:34] <dholbach> Kamion: "resize the disk", ... - it has 4 options on it - 3 were not translated into german
[05:34] <dholbach> Kamion: the help text was though
[05:34] <Amaranth> Lathiat: only two days a week on windows machines at school
[05:34] <Amaranth> brb
[05:34] <ogra> Amaranth, any idea what could cause this ? as menu expert ...
[05:34] <Lathiat> Amaranth: ah
[05:35] <Kamion> dholbach: some of those are Ubuntu-specific, I haven't received translations for them yet - feel free
[05:35] <ficusplanet> Speaking of SMEG, you guys know what it is, right? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smegma
[05:35] <Kamion> (nor have I particularly solicited translations, in fairness)
[05:35] <Lathiat> ficusplanet: see also wikipedia.org/en/Smeg
[05:36] <Lathiat> err
[05:36] <Lathiat> en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smeg
[05:37] <jbailey> ogra: Missing atm.  It'll be added right after preview.
[05:37] <dholbach> Kamion: will have a look at them
[05:37] <Kamion> dholbach: thanks
[05:37] <ogra> jbailey, how do i set rsize and wsize for the nfs mount ? 
[05:38] <ogra> jbailey, for the ltsp clinet that is...
[05:39] <Kamion> Riddell: Kubuntu live CD up for you now too
[05:39] <tseng> ogra: in fstab
[05:39] <tseng> ogra: er :)
[05:39] <ogra> tseng, for a boot mount in an initramfs ? 
[05:39] <tseng> ogra: MAGIC VOODOO
[05:39] <ogra> haha
[05:39] <ogra> :)
[05:39] <Lathiat> hey Travis_Watkins_ 
[05:39] <Travis_Watkins_> heh
[05:40] <jbailey> ogra: How do you usually set those?  Are they passed to nfsmount?
[05:40] <Lathiat> windows machine crash on you? ;p
[05:40] <Amaranth> network died
[05:40] <Amaranth> stupid wireless crap
[05:40] <ogra> jbailey, normally i set them as mount options in fstab...
[05:40] <Lathiat> ah
[05:40] <ogra> jbailey, or at the mount command...
[05:40] <jbailey> ogra: There doesn't appear to be any way to set those right now.
[05:41] <ogra> ok
[05:41] <Amaranth> ogra: ok, got any more details?
[05:41] <jbailey> ogra: So how would you like it to look? =)
[05:41] <Amaranth> otherwise i'm going to say people are deleting their menus :)
[05:41] <ogra> jbailey, i'm just trying to triage #12942
[05:41] <ogra> Amaranth, nope, i've seen it too
[05:42] <Kamion> infinity: any idea why the Kubuntu live filesystems are getting language-pack-gnome-en installed in them?
[05:42] <seb128> Amaranth: ping
[05:42] <ogra> Amaranth, it just vanishes, no extra actions required, no special time after which it happens and it doesnt happen every session
[05:42] <Amaranth> ogra: hrm, got a ~/.config/menus/applications.menu from when this problem is showing?
[05:42] <Kamion> the seeds are correct
[05:42] <Amaranth> seb128: pong
[05:42] <ogra> Amaranth, and its happening on fresh installs
[05:42] <Amaranth> *boggle*
[05:43] <seb128> Amaranth: could you reply to the question I asked like 10 min ago? :)
[05:43] <Amaranth> ok, so it's not smeg related ;)
[05:43] <Amaranth> oh, yeah
[05:43] <seb128> Amaranth: dunno if you ignore me on purpose :p
[05:43] <ogra> Amaranth, nope, but i suspect gnome-menu or something related to it...
[05:43] <ogra> worst case gamin :(
[05:43] <Lathiat> Amaranth secretly hates you
[05:43] <Amaranth> seb128: got flooded with question here and irl
[05:43] <Amaranth> in html class, i know more than the teacher so everyone asks me things
[05:44] <jbailey> ogra: Ah, cool.  Aside from adding those options, is there anything else you might need?  Or is a generic "mount options" in initramfs.conf good enough?
[05:44] <seb128> Amaranth: k. So do you want to bugzilla.ubuntu bugs for smeg?
[05:44] <Lathiat> i get that
[05:44] <ogra> jbailey, usplash ;)
[05:44] <Amaranth> seb128: yeah
[05:44] <ogra> jbailey, that'd be all :)
[05:44] <Amaranth> seb128: since that'll send me an email, which is better than the forums now
[05:44] <jbailey> ogra: Sorry, what about usplash?
[05:44] <ogra> jbailey, running on the thin client on boot ;)
[05:44] <Kamion> lamont: please change "ubuntu-live" to "kubuntu-live" in the kubuntu case in livecd.sh
[05:45] <ogra> jbailey, just joking, i think its to much effort now :)
[05:45] <jbailey> 'kay.  You'll inherit that as part of the run-usplash-earlier bit.
[05:45] <jbailey> ogra: BTW, did you see my hack yesterday to replace usplash graphics?
[05:45] <ogra> jbailey, err, i really wasnt serious... i dont expect usplash for thin clients :)
[05:45] <ogra> yup i saw that
[05:46] <ogra> i'll do a pic as soon as i have some spare time
[05:46] <jbailey> ogra: It is in the plans, though.  mjg59 wants usplash to start earlier.
[05:46] <lamont> Kamion: ah, exists now... ok
[05:46] <ogra> jbailey, for breezy already ?
[05:46] <seb128> Amaranth: thanks
[05:46] <jbailey> I don't have the palette numbers handy, butit's like 0 background, 2 is foreground text, and 13 is the failed colour or something like that.
[05:46] <Kamion> lamont: not sure whether we're going to redo preview candidates for this, but I'd like to have the option ...
[05:47] <ogra> jbailey, thanks
[05:47] <Amaranth> can someone work some bugzilla foo and get me a url that shows all the smeg bugs?
[05:48] <lamont> Kamion: I assume you want that pushed all the way to the build trees, yes?
[05:48] <pitti> Kamion: powerpc/live works fine
[05:48] <Kamion> lamont: yes please
[05:49] <Kamion> pitti: great, thanks
[05:49] <Kamion> I have golden i386/install and i386/live, testing amd64/* now
[05:49] <Lathiat> Amaranth: see under 'advanced search'
[05:49] <Lathiat> Amaranth: component->smeg
[05:49] <Amaranth> that only gets me one bug
[05:49] <Amaranth> seb128 said there were two
[05:50] <Amaranth> does http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/buglist.cgi?component=smeg look right?
[05:50] <Lathiat> yeh
[05:50] <Lathiat> ig uess theres only 1?
[05:50] <seb128> Amaranth:  https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=13797 and https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=14614
[05:50] <pitti> Kamion: amd64/install success
[05:50] <seb128> Amaranth: what email do you use? 
[05:50] <Amaranth> seb128: alleykat@gmail.com
[05:51] <seb128> Amaranth: so I can assign smeg bugs to you and reassign them to the right place
[05:51] <Lathiat> right, the first bug is assigned to gnome-menus
[05:51] <Amaranth> seb128: sure
[05:51] <Amaranth> err, for 13797 i thought i switched to GNOME's icon selection dialog so i dunno what i can do there
[05:52] <Lathiat> Amaranth: hrm i just get a standard file selector here
[05:52] <seb128> Amaranth: that's a common widget?
[05:52] <Amaranth> hrm
[05:52] <seb128> Amaranth: the fileselector dialog could be with preview mode
[05:53] <Amaranth> i know i have a preview in there
[05:53] <Lathiat> Amaranth: heh did you try sticking it in the freezer?
[05:53] <Amaranth> Lathiat: that'll fix overheating and frying it?
[05:53] <Lathiat> Amaranth: err
[05:53] <Lathiat> Amaranth: wtf did you do?
[05:53] <Amaranth> had two very hot HDs one on top of another and forgot to move them when i finally got both hooked up
[05:53] <Amaranth> one fsck later and it was dead
[05:54] <Lathiat> hmm
[05:54] <Lathiat> how dead
[05:54] <Lathiat> did it detect?
[05:54] <Amaranth> yes but it lost all the partition information
[05:54] <Amaranth> so i wiped it and reinstalled
[05:54] <Lathiat> oh wow
[05:54] <Lathiat> that sucks
[05:54] <Amaranth> and on the 3rd or so boot my /home partition lost it's superblock
[05:54] <Amaranth> so i'm assuming it's toast
[05:54] <Lathiat> nice
[05:54] <Amaranth> 120GB Maxtor, about a year old
[05:55] <sivang> man
[05:55] <doko> mvo: ping
[05:55] <Lathiat> wow gdesklets has a nice memory leak
[05:55] <sivang> I lost my grub configuration, and installer never even offered me to install grub
[05:55] <Lathiat> it was up to 54%
[05:55] <sivang> defaulted straight to lilo
[05:55] <Lathiat> sivang: using xfs?
[05:55] <mvo> doko: pong
[05:55] <sivang> Lathiat: no, plain ext3 under LVM
[05:55] <sivang> Kamion: I used the "use free space for LVM" option
[05:56] <mvo> doko: sup?
[05:56] <Amaranth> once i get my student loan i should be able to get a new HD and dsl again, otherwise right now all i can do is collect bug reports
[05:56] <Amaranth> wait, i might be able to boot up a hoary live cd on one of the library computers
[05:56] <Lathiat> Amaranth: you cant warranty your existing hard drive?
[05:56] <sivang> Kamion: the preset LVM config uses while fs for / , doesn't offer you to have a seperate home etc..
[05:56] <Amaranth> Lathiat: that doesn't get my breezy install back
[05:57] <Amaranth> Lathiat: or access to the internet to work on things
[05:57] <doko> mvo: how do I upgrade a hoary system to breezy using the update manager?
[05:57] <Lathiat> Amaranth: but saves you buying a new one, good start
[05:58] <mvo> doko: not at all, it's not supposed to do dist-upgrades
[05:58] <Amaranth> brb, switching to the library
[05:58] <mvo> doko: there has been work in this direction but it didn't made it for breezy (unfortunately)
[05:59] <Kamion> sivang: that's fabbione's baby, I haven't looked at it much
[05:59] <Lathiat> sivang: outside of the chroot
[06:00] <Lathiat> sivang: /path/to/hoary/grub-install -R /path/to/breezy
[06:00] <Kamion> sivang: grub doesn't work with LVM AFAIK
[06:00] <Kamion> (/boot on LVM at any rate), or if it does we don't have the autoconfiguration magic for it
[06:01] <Kamion> amd64/live good
[06:01] <sivang> Kamion: I see, then we should probably disable it or something, becasue someone might get tempted to use the "use free space for LVM" option and end up in the same state..:)
[06:01] <Kamion> Lathiat: whoa, don't do that, grub-install calls other binaries like grub, I'm not sure what happens if they mismatch
[06:02] <Lathiat> Kamion: oh? hrm, worked for me last time i needed to :)
[06:02] <Kamion> sivang: talk to fabbione, and I believe it's meant to have a separate /boot outside the LVM ideally
[06:02] <Lathiat> well i used /path/to/breezy/sbin/grub-install -R /path/to/breezy
[06:02] <sivang> Kamion: ok, cool. I will sure metnion this to him if not open a bug report about it
[06:02] <Kamion> sivang: but there is nothing actually wrong with the fallback to lilo, I don't consider it unreleasable just for that
[06:02] <Lathiat> cus using grub-install inside the chroot didnt work
[06:02] <Kamion> Lathiat: guess you were lucky
[06:03] <sivang> Kamion: yes, but I think that me choosing "install lilo on /dev/hda5" which is NOT my boot partitoin messing my boot config, is not what you expect it to do...
[06:03] <Kamion> sivang: I'm pretty sure the lilo-installer default is to install in the MBR, not in a partition
[06:04] <sivang> Kamion: sure thing, but I was offered to install it on /dev/hda5 , and did that (at least so it seemed from the interaction with d-i).
[06:04] <Kamion>  If unsure, install LILO into the Master Boot Record.
[06:04] <Kamion> ^-- lilo-installer/bootdev
[06:05] <Mirv> is rosetta's export-function's failure a known problem? worked the day before yesterday, but not anymore..
[06:05] <dholbach> Kamion: could you please enlighten me regarding the ubuntu-specific partition-installer translation bits? where can i find them?
[06:05] <ogra> dholbach, in the templates file in the udeb
[06:05] <sivang> Kamion: so what you are saying is that even if I choose to have it installed under /dev/hda5 , it still leaves touches my grub config on the MBR
[06:05] <sivang> ?
[06:06] <seb_lamd64> liveCD amd64 works fine
[06:06] <dholbach> ogra: which udeb?
[06:06] <ogra> dholbach, dunno how the prtitioner one is called... partman ?
[06:06] <dholbach> ogra: i see... that's as much as i figured ;)
[06:06] <Keybuk> right, now to install this
[06:07] <mvo> hm, install-i386 installs a i386 kernel on my k7 test-machine
[06:07] <sivang> Lathiat: hrm, seems my grub foo is aging.. how do I restor it ? :)
[06:07] <ogra> mvo, thats normal
[06:07] <sivang> Lathiat: (it misses /dev/null from within the chroot)
[06:07] <dholbach> mvo: wasnt that always the default behaviour?
[06:08] <Lathiat> sivang: like i said earlier (altho kamion seems to think its a bad idea)
[06:08] <Kamion> dholbach: http://people.ubuntu.com/~cjwatson/installer-po/ in theory except that it seems to be missing partman-auto for some reason
[06:08] <Kamion> dholbach: anyway it's partman-auto not partman
[06:08] <ogra> ah
[06:08] <mvo> ogra, dholbach: ok, thanks
[06:08] <dholbach> Kamion: super... will send you the update
[06:10] <Kamion> dholbach: thanks
[06:11] <sivang> Lathiat: well, I mounted /proc and /dev inside the chroot, and now it works well, but it seems to not find and list all of the targets it used to have
[06:11] <bddebian> Howdy
[06:11] <sivang> hey bddebian :)
[06:11] <bddebian> Heya sivang
[06:12] <sivang> anyway, /me is going to reboot to test if grub restore succeded.
[06:16] <dholbach> i386 install: "computer view" shows diskette - though i don't have a drive in the box :)
[06:17] <dholbach> but that's because of the fstab entry
[06:17] <dholbach> removing it, makes it disappear instantly
[06:18] <seb_lx86> liveCD x86 rocking too
[06:20] <pitti_live> Kamion: ok, amd64/live success, too
[06:20] <pitti_live> mdz: for the record, amd64+powerpc live+install 4/4 success
[06:21] <BenC> need ppc64 tested (live only)?
[06:21] <Kamion> BenC: certainly wouldn't hurt, I don't think anyone else has
[06:21] <seb_lx86> mdz, and here liveCD on x86 and amd64 rocking too
[06:21] <BenC> what's the image URL?
[06:21] <Kamion> BenC: http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily/current/breezy-live-powerpc.iso
[06:21] <Kamion> sorry, s/daily/daily-live/
[06:22] <Kamion> BenC: http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/current/breezy-live-powerpc.iso
[06:22] <pitti_live> seb_lx86: indeed: /proc/mounts says "/dev/cdroms/cdrom0 /cdrom iso9660 ro 0 0"
[06:22] <lamont> and, while nearly everyone cares not at all, ia64 remains broken, all isos. :-(
[06:22] <seb_lx86> mvo, this "OK" button not closing the language-selector dialog suck :/
[06:22] <BenC> take about 30 minutes to download, so I'll let you know in about na hour
[06:22] <pitti_live> seb_lx86: so this is not actually a bug in gvfs, it precisely shows what is mounted
[06:22] <sivang> lamont: folks over here say it's a deprecated arch :)
[06:22] <pitti_live> seb_lx86: it's just very unlucky for the live cd
[06:22] <seb_lx86> pitti_live, why doesn't mount list it?
[06:23] <lamont> sivang: depends on who you talk to - that arch is paying my bills right now
[06:23] <pitti_live> seb_lx86: this is mounted before chrooting, so /etc/mtab is not yet writtten
[06:23] <Kamion> seb_lx86: mount uses /etc/mtab by default
[06:23] <seb_lx86> k
[06:23] <sivang> lamont: ah :-) 
[06:24] <seb_lx86> pitti_live, and hal doesn't notice it neither, so we don't get the correct name
[06:24] <lamont> there are, admittedly, a few things ahead of that on the prioritized list...
[06:24] <pitti_live> seb_lx86: hal is not designed to show all mounted thingies, just drives and their volumes
[06:25] <seb_lx86> pitti_live, hum, maybe gnomevfs should do the same?
[06:25] <pitti_live> seb_lx86: mounted image files don't belong to any bus and don't appear in sysfs, so hal does not recognize it
[06:25] <pitti_live> seb_lx86: not sure, I think it is a good thing for gvfs to display mounted images
[06:26] <Kamion> lamont: ahead of the *kernel*? :)
[06:26] <seb_lx86> k, so let's say it's NOTABUG
[06:26] <pitti_live> seb_lx86: jdub wants pmount support for fs images, then this becomes really handy
[06:26] <seb_lx86> still a bit ugly, but whatever
[06:26] <pitti_live> seb_lx86: we could discuss special-casing this in gvfs, but I don't think that it is worth the trouble
[06:26] <seb_lx86> me neither
[06:26] <sivang> oh bed not time to test now...:-(
[06:27] <sivang> s/bed/bad/
[06:27] <sivang> Kamion: until when it is still relevant to do tests?
[06:27] <Kamion> sivang: dunno yet
[06:27] <sivang> (have something in the office now..)
[06:28] <Kamion> depends when mdz gets up ;)
[06:30] <sivang> Kamion: I see, well, I will be able to test that "RC" again late today (around 10UTC) this time on a dell 8200...
[06:30] <bddebian> Later sivang
[06:32] <Amaranth> yay, stupid bookstore finally got my math book in
[06:32] <bddebian> yeah
[06:33] <dholbach> apart from the diskette item and the gnome docs i386 install fine
[06:33] <dholbach> ... is ...
[06:35] <lamont> Kamion: management assigned tasks...  They're um, kinda ahead of ubuntu in general, despite evidence to the contrary...
[06:35] <Kamion> lamont: ah, heh
[06:36] <lamont> Kamion: rather, the kernel debugging is more time than I can get away with committing atm.
[06:36] <lamont> but I hope to have things caught up this week/early next to the point that I can burn a day or 3
[06:37] <mvo> Kamion: i386 install is working fine here
[06:40] <dholbach> ebrb
[06:41] <Keybuk> ok, my desktop should work better-than-ever now
[06:41] <Keybuk> I've put it back together with the _right_ sized screws
[06:42] <Kamion> Keybuk: clearly now you need to benchmark it with glxscrews!
[06:42] <Keybuk> heh, you know I'm going to be filing a "DRI doesn't work on my super-l33t gfx card" bug anyway ... and I'm going to deliberately include glxgears info to amuse daniels
[06:42] <bddebian> hehe
[06:44] <hunger> Keybuk: the new glxgears suck... I have to use strings on it each time I use it to figure out what that stupid option to get the fps is called again.
[06:44] <mjg59> hunger: Why do you want to know the fps?
[06:45] <hunger> glxgears is the one and only GL test for me;-)
[06:45] <Lathiat> hunger: heh what is the option
[06:45] <mjg59> Hmm?
[06:45] <hunger> mjg59: Because I do not see a difference between 40 fps (no accel) and 1500 fps.
[06:45] <mjg59> if glxinfo says you have direct rendering, and if glxgears runs without errors, then you have accelerated 3D
[06:45] <Lathiat> -info ?
[06:46] <hunger> Lathiat: -iknowthisisnotabenchmarkireallydo or something simillar... string glxgears | grep ^-
[06:46] <Lathiat> i see
[06:46] <Lathiat> haha
[06:46] <Lathiat> -iacknowledgethatthistoolisnotabenchmark
[06:46] <Lathiat> i wonder if thats a daniels patch :)
[06:46] <mjg59> Lathiat: Yeah
[06:47] <hunger> mjg59: Right... but if glxgears runs fast then I have DRI running... and it does look way nicer than the output of glxinfo.
[06:47] <ogra> pretty sure :)
[06:47] <Kamion> ogra: are you going to attempt to release Edubuntu with the Ubuntu/Kubuntu previews?
[06:47] <Kamion> i.e. do I need to kick off an updated CD build now?
[06:47] <ogra> Kamion, i'm not ready with the udeb yet
[06:48] <Kamion> ok, has the delay been signed off?
[06:48] <ogra> Kamion, and i'm waitin for a ltsp fix... mdz surely was to busy :
[06:48] <Kamion> (metaphorically speaking)
[06:48] <hunger> mjg59: Besides: glxgears is the only GL app I ever run... so benchmarking using it is fine for me;-)
[06:48] <ogra> Kamion, who would sign that off ?
[06:48] <Kamion> ogra: mdz or JaneW, presumably
[06:49] <ogra> Kamion, with JaneW its clear that we delay one or two days...
[06:49] <Kamion> all right
[06:50] <Kamion> Riddell: new kubuntu daily-live up, with the right set of language packs this time
[06:51] <Keybuk> mjg59: glxinfo says I have direct rending, and glxgears runs without errors
[06:51] <Keybuk> oh, and I get 350fps
[06:51] <Keybuk> maybe this card finally got an accelerated bit and I never noticed <g>
[06:52] <Keybuk> Kamion: how does one rsync these images?
[06:53] <wasabi_> 350fps is pretty slow for glxgears isn't it?
[06:53] <HiddenWolf> wasabi_, yes it is
[06:53] <wasabi_> Mine hits 8000+ fps I think.
[06:53] <Kamion> Keybuk: rsync from cdimage.ubuntu.com::cdimage/daily/current/ etc.
[06:53] <Keybuk> Kamion: right, google beat you :p
[06:53] <Keybuk> well rsync://.... but yeah
[06:53] <Keybuk> (I think that means the same thing)
[06:54] <Kamion> yeah, it does
[06:54] <Kamion> careful not to overload the server, there's an rsync limit in place there
[06:54] <Keybuk> I'm not Tollef
[06:54] <Keybuk> I can't take down random hosts just by downloading things :p
[06:54] <ogra> lol
[06:54] <pitti> fabbione: here?
[06:54] <HiddenWolf> Does ian jackson irc?
[06:54] <pitti> HiddenWolf: Diziet 
[06:55] <HiddenWolf> Diziet: I've upped some info you requested to bug 14729, I have the same problem, altho with lan rather than wlan. let me know if I can help, ok?
[06:56] <HiddenWolf> pitti, thanks, and ubuntu not mounting my cd's was due to having disabled the checkbox on 'mount removable devices' so i'll save you that one.
[06:56] <pitti> HiddenWolf: hah, cool :-)
[06:57] <HiddenWolf> pitti, I had a period when I had a lot of $otherOS gamecds in my dvddrives, must've deselected it to unclutter the desktop. ;)
[06:57] <bddebian> damn I need my uploads rights if for no other reason that to fix my own stupidity... :-(
[06:58] <bddebian> Whoops, sorry, wrong channel
[06:58] <HiddenWolf> bddebian, if you're stupid, that'd be genetic, and unfixable, right? ;)
[06:58] <bddebian> HiddenWolf: Well it kind of is ;-)
[07:00] <HiddenWolf> bddebian, use "dumb behavior" instead. ;)
[07:12] <Diziet> Well, firefox.
[07:13] <bddebian> HiddenWolf: 
[07:13] <Lathiat> nice
[07:13] <Lathiat> which one?
[07:13] <bddebian> uhh
[07:13] <Kamion> mdz: I have to go out for a bit; I'll be back within the hour. My tests are at 5.5/6 (powerpc/install is still running).
[07:13] <pitti> Diziet: please wait before you upload
[07:13] <Diziet> 10257.  Textarea segfault.
[07:13] <HiddenWolf> bb?
[07:13] <Diziet> Sure, I wasn't going to just upload it.
[07:13] <HiddenWolf> bddebian, ?
[07:13] <Lathiat> Diziet: oh nice
[07:13] <pitti> Diziet: fixing> yay :-)
[07:14] <pitti> Diziet: if you upload a new version anyway, could you please add an empty package "mozilla-firefox" that just depends on "firefox"?
[07:14] <bddebian> HiddenWolf: I forgot.. :-) 
[07:14] <pitti> Diziet: we have so many complaints about m-f not being upgraded to ffox 
[07:14] <Diziet> pitti: OK.
[07:15] <pitti> Diziet: #14917, btw
[07:16] <pitti> desrt: bah, I have to apply your battery voltage normalization patch manually...
[07:16] <Diziet> pitti: Ah, thanks.
[07:23] <Diziet> keybuk: Is there a bugzilla bug for us not yet using the new multi-patch-capable source format ?
[07:24] <Keybuk> there's no -b equivalent for it yet
[07:25] <Diziet> Yes, yes :-).  I just want to make another bug depend on it.
[07:26] <Keybuk> there isn't a bug for that, no
[07:26] <Diziet> OK, well I won't insist on filing one.
[07:26] <pitti> a pity, because unpacking already seems to work fine :-/
[07:27] <pitti> I tried it with a hand-crafted .dsc
[07:29] <hughsie> desrt: I still didn;t get your HAL patch - did you get any reponse (i.e. did your mail client truck up, or mine?)
[07:30] <drobbins> hiya
[07:30] <drobbins> sabdfl is mark shuttleworth, right?
[07:30] <Keybuk> right
[07:31] <drobbins> ok :)
[07:31] <Keybuk> or his evil twin brother
[07:32] <lifeless> or sister
[07:32] <jbailey> Didn't he cut his hair?
[07:34] <elmo> no, he's still a long haired hippie
[07:37] <dholbach> mvo: have fun
[07:37] <dholbach> :)
[07:37] <dholbach> he calls it playing hockey... i saw his hockey racket - all the other guys must be in hospital or something...
[07:39] <pitti> dholbach: .. or good armory
[07:40] <dholbach> i doubt it ... they must have little splinters everywhere and are heavily beaten up... stuff you wouldn't expect from mvo
[07:40] <dholbach> ;-p
[07:41] <Lathiat> hehe
[07:41] <pitti> CAN WE UPLOAD YET?
[07:41] <pitti> :-)
[07:42] <mdz> *pawn* morning
[07:42] <pitti> Hi mdz 
[07:42] <mdz> er *yawn*
[07:42] <pitti> hehe - we figured :-)
[07:42] <mdz> Kamion: what's the story?
[07:42] <pitti> it looks fairly well
 mdz: I have to go out for a bit; I'll be back within the hour. My tests are at 5.5/6 (powerpc/install is still running).
[07:43] <mdz> ok, I'll do a test cycle here
[07:43] <pitti> mdz: I tested amd64 and powerpc (live and install), Kamion, too, we also have successful i386 reports
[07:44] <pitti> no reported failures so far
[07:44] <elmo> we tested all 3 arches here
[07:44] <pitti> mdz: powerpc really rocks now
[07:44] <elmo> amd64 failed, but that's the specific laptop
[07:45] <pitti> mdz: on powerpc there is no "press enter" message after CD ejection, and pressing enter does nothing
[07:45] <pitti> mdz: but after half a minute or so the computer reboots anyway, and rebooting maually is fine, too
[07:45] <mdz> pitti: hmm, that worked for me
[07:45] <pitti> that is the only thing I noticed
[07:45] <pitti> certainly not a showstopper
[07:46] <pitti> and some broken translations in the installer, but Kamion knows the reason and will fix it for final
[07:47] <seb128> mdz: liveCD on amd64 and x86 work great here
[07:49] <mdz> seb128: thanks
[07:50] <mdz> pitti: what else was changed since I went to sleep?
[07:51] <mdz> Riddell: how does kubuntu look?
[07:52] <Diziet> Ghods, doing anything with mozilla takes an age because it's so huuuge.
[07:52] <Riddell> mdz: currently installing on both ibook and 386, 
[07:53] <Keybuk> breezy-install still has Debian stuff in pics/
[07:53] <Keybuk> is that deliberate?
[07:53] <pitti> mdz: a workaround for the hfs kernel bug, usplash fix, daniels uploaded one or two new xorgs to fix some option setting
[07:54] <mdz> pitti: ha ha ha
[07:54] <pitti> mdz: however, I might not remember exactly any more, I'm terribly tired
[07:54] <pitti> mdz: ?
[07:54] <mdz> oh  no you were serious about xorg?
[07:54] <mdz> wtf?
[07:54] <pitti> yes
[07:55] <pitti> mdz: -60 at least, not sure whether you still saw infinity's resolution fix in -59
[07:55] <mdz> I saw -59
[07:55] <pitti> xorg (6.8.2-60) breezy; urgency=low
[07:55] <pitti>   * Set module list to be separated by commas and spaces, not just commas, in
[07:55] <pitti>     xserver-xorg.config.in.  Thanks to Colin Watson and Sbastien Bacher.
[07:55] <mdz> and I see -60
[07:56] <mdz> what was the bug exactly?
[07:56] <pitti> however, no idea what that was good for - seb128?
[07:57] <Keybuk> holy multitude of partitioning options, partman!
[08:02] <Treenaks> Keybuk: and the skull/crossbones
[08:02] <Keybuk> I didn't get a skull/crossbones
[08:03] <Treenaks> Keybuk: it's there if you already have swap, for example
[08:03] <Treenaks> maybe it's what you call the dark face
[08:03] <seb128> mdz, pitti: bug was xorg.conf without any "Module" listed, which made window black painted on switch with alt-tab
[08:04] <mdz> seb128: ok, daniel had thought that was an older bug which was fixed
[08:04] <Keybuk> no, that's just a  (as apposed to the  above it)
[08:05] <seb128> mdz: yeah, he started by blaming GTK :)
[08:06] <pitti> seb128: sacrilege!!
[08:06] <ivoks> ;...(
[08:07] <seb128> pitti: :)
[08:08] <Keybuk> I had a dream last night, daniels had died of a drug overdose and couldn't make it to the conference
[08:10] <HiddenWolf> Keybuk, *shock* 
[08:10] <sbartleylinux>  Looking for information on creating an Ubuntu based light distribution using xorg, xfce, firefox, thunderbird and our own application sets.  Any recommendations on where to start looking?
[08:10] <HiddenWolf> sbartleylinux, check out ubuntulite.org
[08:10] <sbartleylinux> thx
[08:12] <Keybuk> hmm, who does "grub"
[08:14] <jbailey> Keybuk: Do you want it to magically autodetect which ones came from breezy, hoary and warty?
[08:15] <mdz> argh, anacron is running on the powerpc live CD for me
[08:15] <mdz> did anyone else notice it was incredibly slow?
[08:15] <Kamion> mdz: as well as what pitti mentioned, a casper workaround for the xscreensaver lock thing
[08:15] <Kamion> live CDs are always incredibly slow for me :P
[08:15] <mdz> I don't see how it started; there are no init links for it
[08:15] <Kamion> I didn't notice slow vs. slower
[08:15] <mdz> but it's running cron.daily
[08:16] <mdz> it's always slowest for me on powerpc, but this is a drastic difference with updatedb running :-P
[08:16] <Kamion> mdz: aside from what you just mentioned, as far as I'm concerned it's now ready
[08:16] <mdz> casper deletes /etc/rc?.d/S??anacron
[08:16] <mdz> has for ages
[08:16] <mdz> anyone know how else it could have been run?
[08:16] <Keybuk> jbailey: it could read /etc/lsb-release no?  ... is just amusing having to guess by kernel release
[08:16] <Kamion> mdz: had to respin kubuntu live because the live rootfs was being built with ubuntu-live instead of kubuntu-live; that's fixed now
[08:17] <mdz> this happened to me earlier (slower than normal) but I didn't investigate
[08:17] <Keybuk> mdz: /etc/cron.daily
[08:17] <mdz> it didn't happen on anything but powerpc
[08:17] <Keybuk> anacron is just a one-shot app, rather than a daemon
[08:17] <mdz> Keybuk: anacron is what runs cron.daily
[08:17] <ogra> Kamion, i just was told there is no delay for edubuntu apparently
[08:17] <jbailey> Keybuk: Sure, but then your 2.6.8 from Warty will say 'breezy badger'.  Is that fine>
[08:17] <Kamion> Keybuk: update-grub rewrites menu.lst every time, so no, it couldn't just check /etc/lsb-release, because that would mean the warty kernel would show up as breezy
[08:17] <mdz> Keybuk: it's a daemon
[08:17] <Keybuk> jbailey: well, it'd be booting into breezy no?
[08:17] <Keybuk> mdz: so isn't
[08:17] <jbailey> Keybuk: Nothing that we'd support as 'breezy' if you filed a bug. ;)
[08:18] <Keybuk> isn'tisn'tisn'tisn'tisn't :p
[08:18] <mdz> hell
[08:18] <ogra> Kamion, so please kick off the builds if the time is up :(
[08:18] <Keybuk> the init script runs anacron if it's been a while since it was last run
[08:18] <Keybuk> and cron.daily makes sure it's run every day
[08:18] <mdz> cron.daily still shouldn't be running at 11:18 EDT
[08:18] <Kamion> ogra: sheesh; ok, running
[08:19] <mdz> anyway, casper just needs to cripple cron too
[08:19] <Kamion> this is why I asked earlier so that we wouldn't have to rush now
[08:19] <Kamion> mdz: preview blocker or not?
[08:19] <ogra> Kamion, there is no ruch at all... 
[08:19] <ogra> rush even
[08:20] <mdz> Kamion: not
[08:20] <Keybuk> hmm, xorg didn't detect useful resolutions for me :-/
[08:20] <Kamion> (mind you I may not anyway, child being here and all that)
[08:20] <mdz> Keybuk: this is the first time you've tested X?  grr....
[08:21] <Keybuk> mdz: on the desktop yeah, it's worked on the laptop ok
[08:21] <Keybuk> are we supposed to always see the "pick your resolutions" screen during install?
[08:22] <HiddenWolf> Keybuk, shouldn't be.
[08:22] <Kamion> Keybuk: depends on whether xresprobe can detect it
[08:22] <Kamion> if not, you'll see that
[08:22] <Keybuk> ok, I'll file a bug
[08:22] <Kamion> what arch?
[08:22] <Keybuk> I did suspect it wouldn't like this card
[08:22] <Keybuk> i386, ATI *mumble*
[08:22] <Kamion> ok
[08:25] <mdz> Kamion: whose child is it?
[08:25] <mdz> Keybuk: you should only see that if we were unable to do the smart thing
[08:25] <Keybuk> *nods*
[08:26] <mdz> i386 + ati in general is well supported for autodetection
[08:26] <Kamion> mdz: my wife's
[08:26] <mdz> unless you have a KVM or a crap monitor
[08:26] <Keybuk> this is a "cheapest card I could buy at PC World"
[08:26] <Keybuk> so it's probably far too advanced for daniels <g>
[08:26] <mdz> Kamion: oh :-)
[08:26] <Kamion> he lives here 50% of the time or so
[08:26] <Keybuk> "xresprobe ati" just says "id:\nres:\nfreq:\ndisptype:\n"
[08:27] <mdz> Kamion: where can I merge your casper change from?
[08:27] <mdz> Keybuk: xresprobe probably isn't even run; we should be able to probe DDC on a desktop
[08:27] <Kamion> mdz: nowhere, because I couldn't figure out where to branch from (you didn't seem to have committed 1.13 anywhere I could see)
[08:28] <mdz> Kamion: ah, my mirror is behind
[08:28] <mdz> Kamion: could you send a patch?
[08:28] <Keybuk> mdz: any quick&easy way to debug that?
[08:28] <Kamion> mdz: ok, I'll do that once my development system is finished doing a test install
[08:29] <mdz> Keybuk: DEBUG_XORG_DEBCONF=yes dpkg-reconfigure -phigh xserver-xorg
[08:29] <mdz> Keybuk: or if you booted the live cd
[08:29] <mdz>  Keybuk /var/log/casper/post.log 
[08:29] <mdz> amd64 in stage 2, powerpc in stage 1 here
[08:29] <mdz> amd64 live and powerpc live successful
[08:31] <Keybuk> mdz: which bit of the output am I looking for?  can't see anything about resolutions in it
[08:31] <mdz> I wonder if using -novtswitch in xresprobe would prevent the screen blanking
[08:31] <mdz> Keybuk: attach it to the bug report
[08:32] <mdz> has anyone looked into why the hotplug init script is missing its "ok"?
[08:32] <Keybuk> it's never had one, has it?
[08:32] <Keybuk> it always used to output a series of following lines which we turne doff
[08:33] <mdz> seb128: still seeing the evolution icon on i386, how strange
[08:34] <mdz> seb128: maybe it has to do with the fact that it's a lapttop, so gnome-panel-data gets reconfigured?
[08:34] <mdz> Keybuk: it used to
[08:34] <pitti> mdz: anacron> never noticed it, I usually accounted my weak CPU and small memory for the slowliness...
[08:35] <Kamion> mdz: OK, I'm 6/6 at last
[08:36] <Keybuk> on hoary is just does
[08:36] <Keybuk> * Starting hotplug subsystem:
[08:36] <Keybuk>   pci.agent             [ok] 
[08:36] <Keybuk>   net.agent             [ok] 
[08:36] <Keybuk> etc.
[08:37] <mdz> Kamion: 4/6 here
[08:37] <pitti> mdz: 2 failed or untested?
[08:37] <mdz> Keybuk: that changed since hoary
[08:37] <mdz> several times
[08:37] <Kamion> usplash fine on powerpc both install and live
[08:37] <mdz> pitti: 2 pending
[08:37] <mdz> Kamion: likewise
[08:37] <pitti> *phew*
[08:39] <Riddell> mdz: kubuntu {i386,powerpc}{live,install} all tested and looking good
[08:39] <Keybuk> #14974 for the X resolution bug
[08:40] <Kamion> Riddell: yay
[08:40] <mdz> Mithrandir: can you assist Riddell with kubuntu/amd64?
[08:41] <pitti> I can check the live CD
[08:41] <mdz> ok
[08:41] <mdz> install needs testing, too, though
[08:41] <Kamion> I can start downloading kubuntu/amd64/install but it'll be at least two hours before I have a result
[08:42] <Kamion> I have not been keeping up with kubuntu CDs due to disk space juggling reasons
[08:42] <mdz> I think I have a recent rsync; I'll see if I can do it
[08:42] <mdz> has to wai tuntil my i386 install is finished in order to use the drive though
[08:42] <Kamion> I wonder if rsyncing against an Ubuntu CD would be worthwhile
[08:42] <pitti> 446.16K/s    ETA 23:45
[08:42] <mdz> probably
[08:42] <pitti> Kamion: hm, good idea
[08:43] <Riddell> the live CDs have a disconcerting message on boot saying "Bummer, could not run /sbin/debian-installer"
[08:43] <pitti> same for ubuntu
[08:43] <pitti> but just cosmetics
[08:43] <Kamion> Riddell: known, fallout from the VT switch bugfixes (it's always been there, we just only started noticing it recently)
[08:44] <Riddell> ok
[08:44] <Kamion> but yeah, it's ugly
[08:45] <Kamion> I'm thinking maybe we can put symlinks to /bin/sleep or something in place of that and the other command it complains about, just to shut init up until it's killed
[08:45] <pitti> Diziet: do we have a new firefox maintainer then? :-)
[08:46] <Kamion> mdz: so should I stick these in releases.ubuntu.com/.pool/ so that mirrors have a chance to pick them up?
[08:50] <Keybuk> nope, still needs a cupsys restart *sigh*
[08:50] <mdz> Kamion: yes, please
[08:50] <mdz> Kamion: do we have any push capability?
[08:50] <Kamion> elmo: ?
[08:50] <Kamion> maswan: are you around?
[08:50] <Riddell> pbbuttonsd went crazy on one of the ibooks I tried, any recommended way to get info for a bug report on that?
[08:51] <Lathiat> Keybuk: yeh ive noticed that with my usb printer
[08:51] <Lathiat> Keybuk: seems silly.
[08:51] <elmo> Kamion: ?
[08:51] <Keybuk> Lathiat: *nods* it only detects usb printers at start, and doesn't listen out for new ones
[08:51] <pitti> Riddell: yes, I think so, wait...
[08:51] <Kamion> elmo: are there any releases.ubuntu.com mirrors we can trigger?
[08:51] <Lathiat> so we write a hal callout to restart cupsys on usb printer detection?
[08:52] <elmo> Kamion: triggering syowa triggers us + se
[08:52] <elmo> and se are part of relases.u.c proper
[08:52] <Kamion> good stuff
[08:52] <pitti> Riddell: #13909
[08:52] <Kamion> maswan: never mind :-)
[08:52] <Kamion> mdz: please don't sync-mirrors for a bit until I have this put together
[08:54] <Keybuk> Lathiat: HALifying cupsys would be hella-sweet
[08:55] <mdz> elmo: so in the release announcement, I  should be able to list '', us. and se.?
[08:55] <pitti> Keybuk: guess what? a while ago I sent seb128 a patched package that at least dbus'ifies it :-)
[08:56] <dholbach> good bye
[08:56] <pitti> bye dholbach 
[08:57] <seb128> pitti: I pointed the patch to start :p
[08:57] <elmo> mdz: yeah
[08:57] <pitti> seb128: right, sorry
[08:57] <Keybuk> this CD Writing thing is fun
[08:58] <Keybuk> I might actually back up lots of things to CD and store them and stuff
[08:58] <pitti> I keep wondering why some CDs are burned in 10 minutes and some in 20...
[08:59] <Keybuk> mine seem to be taking about 3 minutes
[08:59] <mdz> powerpc install  successful
[08:59] <pitti> \o/
[08:59] <mdz> pitti: some of my DVD+RWs are slower than others
[08:59] <mdz> at a guess it seems to be ones I have used to burn larger images and then later smaller ones
[08:59] <Kamion> Daily for breezy amd64 on 20050908.7 is oversized! Continue? [yN] 
[09:00] <pitti> mdz: that might be the reason, I use the same CD-RWs for over a year now (the "Ubuntu test R/Ws")
[09:00] <Kamion> (yay cdimage)
[09:01] <Keybuk> really silly bug
[09:02] <Keybuk> why doesn't "Blank CD-R Disc" turn into "Ubuntu 5.10 Live" when you finish writing it? :;
[09:03] <phlaegel> seb128: I think I've found a fairly strange nautilus bug. Do you want to hear about it or should I take it upstream?
[09:03] <seb128> phlaegel: feel free to describe it
[09:03] <mdz> seb128: the menu masking stuff for non-admin users landed, right?
[09:04] <mdz> i386 install success
[09:04] <mdz> 6/6
[09:04] <HiddenWolf> mdz, you're making speed, are you? ;)
[09:04] <phlaegel> seb128: here goes: some open folders will disappear after being open for an hour or so. If the parent folder is also open, the subfolder won't be shown in it at all until a refresh.
[09:04] <mdz> HiddenWolf: I do them in parallel
[09:04] <seb128> mdz: gnome-menus is patched for it but we have not update desktop files according to that
[09:05] <mdz> seb128: so the functionality is not there
[09:05] <elmo> has anyone seen the evolution icon in the panel being broken by upgrades?
[09:05] <elmo> it still points at evo-2.2 after hoary -> breezy
[09:05] <seb128> mdz: it's here but we don't use it, no. Was a bit short with the freeze and there was some other stuff to push too
[09:05] <ivoks> elmo: yes
[09:06] <elmo> ivoks: know if there's bug about it?
[09:06] <ivoks> elmo: no :( but i can confirm it
[09:06] <Keybuk> Kamion: .18: Can't open S72menu-exit
[09:06] <seb128> elmo: I hate this bug, basically novell guys change the versionning on every update and the panel config is an user setting so it can get updated on upgrade
[09:06] <Kamion> Keybuk: same as Riddell's /sbin/debian-installer mention above; will probably be fixed in the same way
[09:06] <bddebian> elmo!!
[09:06] <elmo> seb128: it's evil but couldn't we have a evo-2.2 -> evo-2.4 symlink? :)
[09:06] <ivoks> :))
[09:06] <sabdfl> seb128: what happened with Terminal?
[09:07] <Keybuk> live seems faster than I remember
[09:07] <Keybuk> like a _lot_ faster
[09:08] <Kamion> mdz: ok, stuff's on its way out to releases.u.c mirrors now in .pool
[09:09] <seb128> sabdfl: the icon change?
[09:09] <seb128> sabdfl: just looking at it. I've made the change and apparently dholbach based his 2.12 upload on the previous version and dropped it 
[09:09] <pitti> kubuntu amd64/live burning
[09:09] <maswan> lets see if you guys or the gnome 2.12 livecds will win the bandwidth usage contest. ;)
[09:09] <lu|away> haha
[09:10] <lu|away> that's a real OS, that's not fair
[09:10] <seb128> s/icon/menu category/
[09:10] <desrt> hughsie; it's stuck in the list.  david needs to release it
[09:10] <desrt> hughsie; it's on the ubuntu bugzilla though
[09:10] <maswan> lu|away: but it's only a pre-release? :)
[09:10] <desrt> pitti; i was going to do it myself but then i got lazy :)
[09:10] <pitti> desrt: no worries, see the bug followup; I already did it, pending upload
[09:11] <desrt> oh
[09:11] <desrt> rocking
[09:11] <mdz> Kamion: writing the announcement
[09:11] <crimsun> mjg59: pong
[09:13] <desrt> hughsie; the patch on the ubuntu bugzilla is actually against HEAD
[09:13] <Kamion> elmo: should torrents work automatically now, then? should I poke you anyway to check?
[09:13] <desrt> hughsie; so even though it didn't work for martin it should work for you :)
[09:14] <Keybuk> *giggle*
[09:14] <Keybuk> I just stuck a warty CD in, and it asked me whether it wanted me to upgrade from it
[09:16] <Lathiat> heh
[09:16] <bddebian> Keybuk: heh
[09:17] <sabdfl> Keybuk: you need "I BREAK SOFTWARE!" on your business card
[09:18] <hughsie> desrt: sorry, just got back from dinner
[09:18] <hughsie> desrt: i would join, and resend it
[09:18] <hughsie> i've lost stuff on hal-devel before
[09:18] <desrt> hughsie; pfah.
[09:18] <desrt> where is david?
[09:19] <desrt> he's been AWOL since last weekend
[09:19] <hughsie> desrt: don;t know. he;s not been on irc for *ages*
[09:19] <desrt> i want him to comment on my application to be added to the 'hal' group on fd.o :p
[09:20] <Riddell> pitti: good luck
[09:20] <Kamion> since we have matching source CDs and now have the scriptage to publish them sanely, I'm putting those on releases.ubuntu.com too (but not anywhere they'll visibly get in the way, don't worry)
[09:20] <Kamion> just 'cos otherwise I have to keep backups of them in my home directory and stuff and risk losing them
[09:20] <hughsie> desrt: i don;t see why not. +1 from me
[09:24] <pitti> Riddell: f***, it did not even boot... I try another CD...
[09:24] <desrt> hughsie; well, currently the official reason "why not" is because david is AWOL :)
[09:24] <hughsie> desrt: :-)
[09:24] <desrt> hughsie; but since, ultimately, he's the one reviewing patches, there's no problem with waiting until he gets back :)
[09:25] <hughsie> desrt: yes, agreed
[09:25] <Kamion> speedup 3.56 from rsyncing Kubuntu amd64/install against Ubuntu amd64/install
[09:25] <Lathiat> Kamion: nice
[09:26] <Kamion> /dev/sda3            562456664 372170536 161714960  70% /
[09:26] <Kamion> I must get round to cleaning up little
[09:27] <Kamion> although it's particularly loaded at the moment because the purge scripts base their decisions on how old images are rather than on how many builds there've been, and we've built something like fifteen rounds of Ubuntu CDs today (counting both install and live)
[09:28] <Kamion> yeah, >70GB in daily and daily-live alone
[09:30] <Surak> hello, I just managed to build the module for conexant modems with ubuntu. They have a closed-source part, which is distributed with the modem in form of 2.4 linux driver. I would like some advice about how to package this for ubuntu.
[09:33] <CarlFK> Surak - try in #ubuntu-motu
[09:34] <pitti> ok, kubuntu live test, take 2...
[09:38] <pitti> hrm, no luck
[09:38] <pitti> Kamion, Riddell: the Kubuntu amd64 live plainly refuses to boot on my box
[09:38] <pitti> I know I'm not supposed to do KDE development, but hey, a short peek at the competition can't hurt
[09:39] <Kamion> pitti: it's an oversized image; perhaps you have a 650MB CD, or a drive that can't do 700MB?
[09:39] <pitti> Kamion: certainly not, 700 MB works well here
[09:39] <pitti> I burned 720 MB images here...
[09:39] <Kamion> that's the only reason I can think of ...
[09:39] <pitti> hm
[09:39] <pitti> I dd the image and check md5
[09:39] <seb128> pitti: I hate you now :p
[09:39] <Kamion> Kubuntu amd64/install boots fine anyway, let's see how it goes
[09:40] <pitti> seb128, please, please, I promise, I will never do it again!!
[09:40] <Riddell> pitti: thanks anyway
[09:40] <Riddell> seb128: you're lucky it didn't boot for him, else he's see the wonder of KDE and never want to leave
[09:40] <seb128> pitti: ok ok, but be careful, I'm watching you :p
[09:41] <seb128> haha 
[09:41] <pitti> breezy-live-amd64.iso           08-Sep-2005 17:43  624M
[09:41] <pitti> Kamion: it's not even close to oversize...
[09:42] <Kamion> pitti: oh, sorry, I was thinking of the i386/powerpc ones
[09:42] <Kamion> you're quite right
[09:42] <pitti> anyway, checking md5....
[09:42] <jbailey> slomo: Around?
[09:42] <slomo> jbailey: yes
[09:43] <jbailey> slomo: What do you mean the kernel detects the harddrisk some seconds earlier?
[09:43] <Keybuk> wow, warty feels so retro
[09:43] <pitti> "warty"?
[09:43] <slomo> jbailey: something like "hda: ST3160023A, ATA DISK drive"  (but this is on my desktop now)
[09:43] <jbailey> slomo: Can you add the word 'break' to the kernel command line, please?
[09:44] <slomo> jbailey: sure... what does it do?
[09:44] <mdz> breaks your computer
[09:44] <jbailey> It should drop you to a shell prompt/  If your harddrive is being detected then it's getting further than it was before.
[09:44] <jbailey> mdz: Shhhh..  You're telling secrets!
[09:45] <mdz> jbailey: do you have success reports for booting from USB hard disks now?
[09:45] <mdz> that ought to just work now
[09:45] <mdz> would be nice for the release notes
[09:45] <pitti> darn, dd'ing /dev/cdrom does not quite produce exactly the same image
[09:45] <slomo> jbailey: then we had some kind of misunderstanding... that was there since the beginning... ok, reboot with break now :)
[09:45] <Keybuk> pitti: I'm trying a warty->breezy upgrade, to see what happens
[09:46] <mdz> Keybuk: do you not have enough work to do? :-P
[09:46] <slomo> jbailey: and break doesn't change anything
[09:46] <Lathiat> hr
[09:46] <Lathiat> m
[09:46] <Lathiat> the arrows on the update notifier are buggering around again
[09:47] <jbailey> mdz: No, sorry.  I'll poke the submitted of the bug I have against initrd-tools so that we can get it for release.
[09:48] <pitti> Riddell: I'll burn the cd in my laptop now, last chance...
[09:48] <pitti> darn, I burned like 20 CDs today without problem...
[09:49] <jbailey> slomo: Hmm.  And you're sure you're using the stock kernels?  It shouldn't be able to detect your harddrive at this point.
[09:49] <Keybuk> mdz: it was a very short-lived experiment <g>
[09:50] <seb128> pitti: that's a sign you should stick with GNOME :)
[09:50] <jbailey> What is our upgrade promise?  Are people expected to go through the releases in sequence if they're upgrading?
[09:50] <slomo> jbailey: sure... i never compiled my own kernel on the ibook
[09:50] <pitti> seb128: yeah, my computer does not seem to be KDE compatible
[09:52] <pitti> seb128: I don't even know how kubuntu looks like...
[09:52] <ogra> pitti, you could test edubuntu to check if a smaller potion of KDE works :)
[09:52] <pitti> ENOBANDWIDTH
[09:53] <pitti> I already used up mine and my flatmate's weekly quota
[09:54] <Keybuk> jbailey: it's certainly not possible to do anything but at the moment
[09:54] <Keybuk> the modularised Xorg packages can only be upgraded from the monolithic Xorg packages by the looks of it
[09:54] <Keybuk> they only declare relationships on xorg-* and not xfree86-* as well
[09:54] <Keybuk> e.g. xinit should replace xfree86-common _as_well_as_ xorg-common
[09:55] <jbailey> Keybuk: Right, and it might be nice to clearly say that.
[09:55] <jbailey> Keybuk: As well as figure eventually what that means for people jumping from long-lived-release to long-lived-release.
[09:55] <Keybuk> mdz: should we add that to the rlease notes?
[09:56] <mdz> Keybuk: "that"?
[09:56] <Keybuk> mdz: you can't upgrade a warty machine to breezy preview
[09:56] <Keybuk> you must first upgrade to hoary
[09:56] <seb128> pitti: probably crappy, it's KDE :p
[09:56] <mdz> Keybuk: I don't think it's necessary
[09:56] <mdz> you can't upgrade from woody either
[09:56] <Keybuk> or sarge
[09:57] <Keybuk> annoyingly
[09:57] <mdz> in fact, since we haven't worked out the upgrade issues yet, I don't think we should put upgrade instructions in the announcement
[09:57] <mdz> sabdfl: any objection to removing that bit?
[09:57] <pitti> Keybuk: maybe we can fix breezy final to be upgradable from warty?
[09:57] <mdz> pitti: I think that time could be better spent fixing upgrades from hoary and sarge, and other bugs
[09:58] <Keybuk> fixing upgrades from sarge would implicitly fix from warty
[09:58] <Keybuk> as it's the same problem
[09:58] <pitti> well, yes
[09:58] <jbailey> Sure, but we need to know what the upgrade-from targets are for testing anyway.
[09:58] <mdz> Keybuk: only one problem?  your test must have been thorough :-P
[09:59] <pitti> the other day sb told me we would support upgrades from any to any currently supported release
[09:59] <Keybuk> mdz: well, two dozen instances of the same problem
[09:59] <Keybuk> force-overwriting the appropriate packages seemed to get me a breezy machine
[09:59] <mdz> pitti: sb = mark?
[09:59] <pitti> no, but some canonical employee 
[09:59] <mdz> pitti: it wasn't me
[10:00] <pitti> well, anyway
[10:00] <pitti> if we don't, so much the better - or easier - for us
[10:00] <mdz> I don't think it makes sense
[10:00] <Keybuk> we probably /should/ support upgrades between supported releases, to be fair
[10:00] <Keybuk> jbailey: some body, I guess
[10:00] <ogra> jbailey, somebody
[10:00] <jbailey> Ah. =)
[10:01] <shackan> ah, someday I hope to have rhythbox not crashing for at least six hours in a row...
[10:01] <jbailey> I don't think it's harmful to say dist-upgrde through each release for the short-lived ones, and support long-lived to long-lived on top of it.
[10:01] <Kamion> mdz: so, can I publish these images properly now?
[10:01] <mdz> Kamion: yes
[10:01] <tseng> jbailey: is there a specific plan for long-lived releases?
[10:01] <pitti> ok you bloody KDE live CD: this is your third and last chance to boot on my box before I give up
[10:02] <tseng> jbailey: or it will just be a regular release with more security time
[10:02] <jbailey> tseng: I am not the keeper of the crystal ball on that one. ;)
[10:02] <Kamion> mdz: hooray
[10:03] <Riddell> Kamion: did you try amd64 kubuntu install?
[10:03] <Kamion> Riddell: it's at 63% second stage
[10:03] <Kamion> mdz: oh, and am I publishing kubuntu at the same time or later?
[10:03] <mdz> Kamion: depends on whether it's ready to be blessed
[10:04] <Kamion> I'll know that before Ubuntu publishing finishes ...
[10:04] <Kamion> well, assuming we take amd64/live on faith
[10:06] <Riddell> pitti: any luck?
[10:06] <shackan> hi pitti, why back so early ? :)
[10:06] <pitti> Kamion, Riddell: nope - three different CDs, two different burners, correct downloaded images - this thing just doesn't boot
[10:07] <shackan> maybe you inserted the cd upside-down..
[10:07] <seb128> :)
[10:07] <pitti> it must have an internal Gnome developer boot protection
[10:07] <seb128>  /msg pitti nice GNOME promoting job, I own you a beer :)
[10:07] <seb128> (ups :p)
[10:08] <shackan> pitti, I've got more than that to whine about
[10:08] <pitti>  /msg seb128 and nobody noticed my syslinux upload that did this :-)
[10:10] <Kamion> Kubuntu amd64/install success
[10:10] <Riddell> Kamion: yay, thanks
[10:10] <Riddell> anyone else able to test amd64 live kubuntu?
[10:10] <Kamion> I'll try it, but subject to usual download time comments
[10:10] <pitti> would be nice to verify/falsify my failure
[10:11] <jbailey> Riddell: Sure, Angie's off her machine.
[10:11] <jbailey> I don't think I sync kubuntu as part of my nightly rsync, though.
[10:11] <ogra> anybody able to test edubuntu ?
[10:11] <ogra> on ppc/amd64 ?
[10:11] <Kamion> unfortunately I doubt it will sync against Ubuntu in the same way the install CD does
[10:11] <Riddell> ogra: I'm 29% downloaded, 40 minutes to go
[10:11] <ogra> Riddell, wow, thanks :)
[10:11] <jbailey> Riddell: I don't.  kubuntu daily/current live from last night okay?
[10:12] <ogra> Riddell, http://edubuntu.org/EdubuntuTesting follow these notes :)
[10:12] <Riddell> ogra: that's i386, if you want me to test powerpc I can stop i386 download and start powerpc
[10:12] <seb128> I can try it, but will take 3 hours to download
[10:12] <ogra> Riddell, yes, that'd be better
[10:12] <seb128> mvo: around?
[10:12] <ogra> Riddell, x86 i just finishing the burn here
[10:12] <ogra> s/i/is
[10:13] <Riddell> jbailey: http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/kubuntu/daily-live/20050908.2/
[10:13] <Riddell> or daily-live/current
[10:13] <sabdfl> mdz: no problem on removing upgrade instructions
[10:13] <jbailey> Mm, weird, I can't highlight text in nano.
[10:14] <Riddell> why does cdimage.ubuntu.com not reject http connections from my IP address, it's most impolite
[10:14] <Riddell> jbailey: shift-click?
[10:14] <mdz> sabdfl: latest draft is https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DraftBreezyPreviewAnnouncement
[10:14] <Riddell> I think nano is one of those spooky ncurses mouse programmes
[10:14] <mdz> sabdfl: spell checked, just needs link checking and then ready to go
[10:15] <mdz> Kamion: ETA for live links?
[10:15] <sabdfl> mdz: can i tighten up the text flow a little?
[10:15] <mdz> sabdfl: formatting or content?
[10:16] <sabdfl> formatting
[10:16] <mdz> sabdfl: certainly
[10:16] <Kamion> Can't count up to 5!
[10:16] <Kamion> best error message EVAH
[10:16] <mdz> Kamion: nice1
[10:16] <Kamion> mdz: couple of minutes
[10:17] <mvo> seb128: yes, just came back
[10:17] <seb128> mvo: what causes this 3s/1s delay for gksu?
[10:18] <sabdfl> mdz: silbs and i have been reviewing desktop item menu placement
[10:18] <jbailey> Riddell: Thanks.  I guess someone X enabled nano.
[10:18] <seb128> mvo: is it waiting for something? Or that's a on purpose waiting?
[10:18] <sabdfl> we need to introduce changes immediately post preview, to give the doc team time to catch up
[10:18] <sabdfl> like the terminal
[10:18] <mvo> seb128: kov is starting sudo to test if it requires to input a password
[10:18] <sabdfl> it reverted
[10:18] <mdz> sabdfl: we noticed a weirdness about the evolution icon on the panel
[10:18] <bddebian> An X enabled nano?? Kick-ass
[10:18] <seb128> mvo: and it takes 3s to sudo to say that?
[10:18] <Keybuk> hmm
[10:18] <mvo> seb128: it times out after ~3s, but with the cvs patch it's killed before (with kill)
[10:19] <Keybuk> did anyone else notice that a lot of other people seem to be releasing betas/previews today too? :p
[10:19] <sabdfl> yes, silbs caught that one
[10:19] <Keybuk> SuSE beat us to 2.12 :p
[10:19] <pitti> darn
[10:19] <bddebian> Yeah but who uses SuSE? ;-)
[10:19] <Kamion> ssh: connect to host frei.ubuntu.com port 22: No route to host
[10:19] <Kamion> elmo: ^-- ?
[10:19] <mdz> sabdfl: the deadline agreed with the doc team for UI changes was August 25th, FWIW
[10:19] <sabdfl> in general, any old menu item that pointed to a version-specific place would be caught out if it had transferred to the panel
[10:19] <Keybuk> so did Foresight (who are they?!)
[10:20] <mdz> sabdfl: and the docs are supposed to be in string freeze now so that they can be translated
[10:20] <seb128> mvo: what timeout? it that an ugly hack like "try a random password and wait to know what it gives"?
[10:20] <tseng> Keybuk: they are based on rPath
[10:20] <Burgundavia> sabdfl, our string freeze is today
[10:20] <tseng> Keybuk: which is the autopackage distro
[10:20] <tseng> Keybuk: cracksmoking abounds
[10:21] <mdz> Keybuk: flattery is the sincerest form of admiration
[10:21] <Keybuk> mdz: indeed
[10:21] <Kamion> UK releases.u.c has the live links; the others are catching up
[10:21] <Kamion> can somebody please test the torrents? I'm off to get some dinner
[10:21] <mdz> er
[10:21] <mdz> imitation
[10:21] <mdz> is the sincerest form of flattery
[10:21] <mdz> rather
[10:21] <Kamion> this is Ubuntu only btw, not Kubuntu yet
[10:22] <mvo> seb128: more like a empty password, but otherwise, yes. the problem is that sudo is _very_ unfriendly for frontends. it does not provide any usefull information (well, there is -l but that isn't enabled by default)
[10:22] <mdz> Keybuk: where is this suse thing?  I see nothing on www.suse.com
[10:22] <tseng> mdz: opensuse
[10:22] <mdz> not that I can read it
[10:22] <tseng> mdz: (.org)
[10:22] <mvo> seb128: there are some other problems like "-p" does not work for e.g. kerberos or opie 
[10:23] <mdz> dude, they are totally mimicking our releases
[10:23] <tseng> of course they are
[10:23] <silbs> mdz, sabdfl: the release announcement ignores large parts of the world (i.e., non-UK, US, Europe).Maybe include something like "download from the site closest to you"
[10:23] <tseng> we are stealing their community
[10:23] <mdz> silbs: I thought you went home!
[10:23] <Kamion> silbs: ideally we'd update /download/ a bit and point to that, I just haven't had a chance yet
[10:24] <Kamion> perhaps somebody else could update that
[10:24] <tseng> mdz: the mono faceoff will be fierce!
[10:24] <silbs> mdz:I did. But I didn't want to miss the excitement.
[10:24] <sabdfl> mdz: formatting done
[10:24] <mjg59> crimsun: Hi - was it you who ended up with the X41?
[10:25] <Keybuk> mdz: planet suse
[10:27] <sabdfl> silbs, mdz, should we have a "Rest of World" link that goes to http://releases.ubuntu.com/5.10/ ?
[10:28] <mvo> seb128: do you have any idea about #14430? 
[10:28] <mdz> seb128: didn't we decide to put add/remove programs at the bottom of Applications?
[10:28] <Nafallo> wow!
[10:28] <mdz> sabdfl: change "United Kingdom" to "Rest of World"?
[10:28] <Nafallo> se.releases.u.c already have it ;-)
[10:29] <sabdfl> mdz: UK guys will likely then goe with Europe
[10:29] <sabdfl> so, i'll have an additional one
[10:30] <mdz> sabdfl: the rest of the world should use the one closest to them
[10:30] <sabdfl> silbs, mdz: I would like to move the "Getting" section to the top
[10:30] <mdz> rather than UK always
[10:30] <sabdfl> mdz: they will, anyway
[10:30] <mdz> then why add a new section?
[10:31] <Lathiat> mdz: see the gnome-menus changelog
[10:31] <Lathiat> mdz: it was reverted
[10:31] <Lathiat> mdz: as in some locales, it makes the menu stupidly wide
[10:32] <Lathiat> mvo: my libnotify arrows are being silly again on both my machines
[10:32] <seb128> mdz: mvo did and we rolled back, it was ugly and there was some technical issue to put a separator before it (not a big deal, but require some gnome-panel patching)
[10:32] <mvo> Lathiat: can you send me a screenshot? 
[10:34] <Lathiat> http://bur.st/~lathiat/libnotify.png
[10:34] <mdz> sabdfl: finished editing?
[10:35] <seb128> mvo: nop, not really 
[10:35] <mvo> Lathiat: that's a interessting one, I haven't seen that one before
[10:35] <sabdfl> mdz: yes
[10:35] <Lathiat> mvo: ive seen that sort of thing the whole time..
[10:35] <mdz> sabdfl: "extra work"?
[10:35] <sabdfl> silbs, mdz, please ack you are ok with the shift
[10:35] <mdz> sounds like a chore :-)
[10:35] <sabdfl> "extra work"?
[10:36] <mdz>   * X.org 6.8.2 with extra work for wider hardware support
[10:36] <mdz> that isn't what I wrote
[10:36] <sabdfl> ah, yes
[10:36] <tseng> Lathiat: that drives me nuts
[10:36] <Lathiat> tseng: mmhmm
[10:36] <ivoks> Lathiat: that notify is here to like that :)
[10:36] <Lathiat> mvo: sounds like you have a problem ;)
[10:36] <sabdfl> mdz: fixed
[10:36] <Lathiat> what the hell does it do
[10:36] <Lathiat> to end up with that
[10:37] <Lathiat> its like it draws its on border
[10:37] <Lathiat> on top of gtk 
[10:37] <Lathiat> *own
[10:37] <silbs> sabdfl: "server,with" -> "server, with" (typo, space)
[10:38] <silbs> sabdfl: "On The Desktop" -> "On the Desktop"
[10:38] <mvo> Lathiat: can you join #notification-debug please? I don't want to distrub this channel too much :)
[10:38] <Lathiat> mvo: ok
[10:39] <silbs> sabdfl: I would reorder the features under installation. OEM and others are more impressive than a progress bar.
[10:40] <mdz> sabdfl: should we point to the forums as well as the mailing list?
[10:40] <hotte-> ^^
[10:41] <ogra> Riddell, btw, i would suggest doing the workstation install, since i doubt you have amd64 thing clients around ;)
[10:41] <mdz> silbs: I've already copy/pasted, spell checked and link checked
[10:41] <mdz> silbs: but if you want to make more edits, go ahead, just somebody let me know when everyone is happy
[10:41] <mdz> keyboard break
[10:41] <silbs> sabdfl, mdz: that's all I see
[10:43] <mdz> silbs: did you fix those?
[10:43] <silbs> mdz: no, I thought someone else was editing. Happy to do so though - should I?
[10:44] <ajmitch> no mention of malone for universe bugs, or you don't want to confuse users? :)
[10:45] <bddebian> heh
[10:45] <sabdfl> mdz: yes, please add forum link
[10:45] <bddebian> Heya ajmitch
[10:45] <ajmitch> hi
[10:45] <BenC> anyone with the laptop folks here?
[10:45] <mdz> Kamion: er, where are the torrents?
[10:46] <mdz> silbs: please
[10:46] <mdz> I need to be off of the keyboard for a while
[10:46] <sabdfl> BenC: could you get our kernels integrated with KLive, please, post preview?
[10:48] <Kamion> mdz: they're on the datacentre mirrors but not on the .se ones
[10:48] <Kamion> dunno why
[10:48] <Kamion> maswan: ?
[10:48] <Kamion> maswan: I guess you're still syncing ...
[10:48] <BenC> sabdfl: maybe if I knew what KLive was :)
[10:50] <maswan> Kamion: .pool/ubuntu-5.10-preview-src-4.iso
[10:51] <silbs> mdz: done. And I added a forums link (please double check). Don't know what the XXX is on the first line.
[10:51] <Burgundavia> BenC, 
[10:51] <Burgundavia> http://klive.cpushare.com/
[10:52] <maswan> seems to average somewhere around 1MByte/s, +-500k/s
[10:53] <Kamion> heh
[10:53] <sabdfl> seriously
[10:53] <ogra> :)
[10:53] <ogra> sabdfl++
[10:54] <BenC> arch_commit: unable to acquire revision lock (internal error in archive-pfs.c(pfs_lock_revision))
[10:54] <BenC> anyone know how to fix that?
[10:55] <BenC> I killed mid commit because it was commiting files I didn't want to, and now I've got that
[10:55] <Kamion> BenC: baz lock-revision -b <revision>
[10:55] <Kamion> ?
[10:55] <BenC> that's a baz commit error
[10:56] <fabbione> BenC: it looks like wrong permissions on the archive
[10:56] <fabbione> same as i was getting when you had the wrong umask
[10:56] <Kamion> I usually find baz lock-revision -b ...whatever... clears that up
[10:56] <BenC> wouldn't be from me
[10:56] <fabbione> BenC: did you interrupt a commit?
[10:57] <ogra> fabbione, yes
[10:57] <BenC> yes
[10:57] <BenC> lock-revision didn't help
[10:57] <fabbione> BenC: ah ok.. that explains :).. use the command Kamion told you
[10:57] <BenC> lock-revision: unkown lock state for kernel-team@ubuntu.com--2005/kernel-team@ubuntu.com--2005/kernel-debian--preX,13--2.6.12--patch-13
[10:57] <BenC>    (lock was in transition -- consider retrying)
[10:57] <fabbione> ok.. let me login and fix it for you
[10:58] <fabbione> BenC: on which branch were you commiting?
[10:58] <BenC> the commit can be tossed
[10:58] <BenC> kernel-debian--preX,13--2.6.12
[10:58] <Kamion> should just be mv ++revision-lock-held--* patch-12/++revision-lock
[10:59] <Kamion> or patch-11/ if you're tossing patch-12
[10:59] <Kamion> oh, no, you're tossing patch-13
[11:00] <BenC> I think I fixed it
[11:00] <BenC> nope
[11:00] <Kamion> you need a +contents subdirectory of ++revision-lock
[11:00] <fabbione> wait
[11:00] <fabbione> i am working on it
[11:00] <silbs> Kamion: do you want a trailing slash on the mailing list link too? :)
[11:00] <fabbione> we can't work all together
[11:00] <BenC> no, I was working on my end
[11:00] <BenC> thought the ,,commit* stuff was causing something, but it isn't
[11:01] <Kamion> silbs: I didn't consider that to be a directory, but I'm not sure how it looks on the backend
[11:01] <Kamion> it doesn't redirect me to a URL with a slash anyway ...
[11:01] <fabbione> BenC: ok try to commit now
[11:02] <maswan> Kamion: better now?
[11:02] <maswan> sent 5007 bytes  received 2334599320 bytes  1180583.73 bytes/sec
[11:02] <maswan> took a while
[11:03] <BenC> fabbione: thanks, working now
[11:03] <Kamion> maswan: all your mirrors look happy; just poking frei.ubuntu.com now
[11:03] <mdz> sabdfl,silbs: announcement ready to go?
[11:03] <Kamion> (which was unrouteable earlier)
[11:03] <mdz> Kamion: mirrors ok?
[11:03] <fabbione> BenC: no problem..
[11:04] <fabbione> maswan: hey dude
[11:04] <Kamion> mdz: as of about fifteen seconds ago, yes
[11:04] <Kamion> mdz: still need a torrent check
[11:04] <mdz> Kamion: I get 0bytes/sec on all torrents
[11:05] <Kamion> elmo: can you check the torrent seeding please?
[11:05] <mdz> elmo: does bt need the usual swift kick in the tail?
[11:05] <Kamion> Znarl: or if you're around and know how
[11:05] <Burgundavia> pitti, that would be supense. Suspension is a bridge
[11:05] <pitti> Burgundavia: oh, thanks :-)
[11:06] <Keybuk> Burgundavia: he could be wearing suspenders
[11:07] <Burgundavia> Keybuk, or driving over a bumpy road?
[11:07] <Kamion> elmo: also, could you please configure durville and frei's apaches to honour my .htaccess files?
[11:08] <maswan> fabbione: hi there
[11:08] <fabbione> maswan: buttercup has been dead for a long time...
[11:09] <fabbione> maswan: i start to think it's hw issue
[11:09] <fabbione> maswan: becuse i am running the same kernel here without problems
[11:09] <maswan> fabbione: ok, I could try installing solaris on it and see if I can get a crash doing something?
[11:09] <fabbione> maswan: can you just preserve the disks in case?
[11:10] <fabbione> or allow me to backup some stuff first?
[11:10] <CarlFK> Kamion - breezy install to hdb, grub on hda mbr, boot, grub error 21.  Smart Boot Managaer will boot breezy from hdb, so I suspect that grub doesn't know where to find boot/.  A) what package do I report against, B) got a quick fix?
[11:10] <maswan> fabbione: yeah, sure
[11:10] <maswan> fabbione: I'll do both. :)
[11:11] <fabbione> maswan: nah.. i mean.. if you can install slowlaris on another disk (without touching the disks with linux) i am ok.. even without backup
[11:11] <fabbione> maswan: if you need to reuse the disks.. than i would be glad to take a backup
[11:11] <Kamion> CarlFK: I've been working for 13 hours, I'm not sure I can even read your question accurately at this point
[11:11] <maswan> fabbione: we have no shortage of 9:ish gig drives, so..
[11:11] <Kamion> send mail or file a bug against debian-installer or something
[11:12] <fabbione> maswan: ok :) perfect :)
[11:12] <CarlFK> Kamion - grub-installer ?
[11:12] <Kamion> fair enough
[11:12] <Kamion> I can always reassign once I understand what's up
[11:12] <Kamion> sorry, thanks for testing, I'm just tired :)
[11:12] <CarlFK> no prob
[11:13] <CarlFK> http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=14989
[11:13] <maswan> Kamion: the tracker does not seem to be running, as far as I can tell. for the torrents.
[11:13] <CarlFK> done.
[11:14] <Kamion> maswan: gah
[11:15] <maswan> at least, the announce url gives me a connection refused
[11:15] <bddebian> SMS elmo?
[11:15] <Kamion> bddebian: SMS. mobile phone. text message.
[11:16] <bddebian> Kamion: Ahh
[11:16] <maswan> If he's not available, you could regenerate the torrents and use the cdimage.d.o tracker I run. But that would probably not be optimal in at least a couple of different ways. :)
[11:16] <crimsun> mjg59: yes
[11:16] <sabdfl> mdz: go from my side, yes
[11:16] <Kamion> maswan: yes and yes :)
[11:17] <mdz> sabdfl: just waiting on torrents
[11:17] <Kamion> james says "on bike. back soon"
[11:17] <Keybuk> one hopes he pulled over to reply
[11:19] <CarlFK> i got some pics here of what happened when I tired to eat a hot-dog while riding...
[11:19] <CarlFK> everything was fine till i tried to shift gears
[11:19] <Kamion> Keybuk: let's not, eh
[11:19] <Kamion> CarlFK: :-)
[11:19] <Kamion> sounds painful
[11:20] <CarlFK> at least the hotdog fell on some grass, so it was still eatable
[11:21] <Keybuk> and where did you fall?
[11:21] <CarlFK> no broken bones, and the fluid dripping from my face was sweat.  
[11:21] <CarlFK> I hit the pavement
[11:21] <CarlFK> lol
[11:22] <Keybuk> side-effect of strapping wheels to your feet as a hobby
[11:25] <bddebian> Anyone know off-hand what provides X11/bitmaps/gray ?
[11:25] <BenC> that sucks, live-ppc cd doesn't boot on the G5
[11:26] <BenC> bddebian: is that a file?
[11:26] <Keybuk> bddebian: http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/breezy/Contents-i386.gz
[11:26] <elmo> kamion: I didn't
[11:26] <BenC> or "dpkg -S X11/bitmaps/gray" if the file is installed
[11:26] <elmo> that was my first SMS on a bike, and boy was it exciting
[11:26] <elmo> kamion: anyhoo, torrent's back
[11:27] <Kamion> elmo: great, thanks
[11:27] <Kamion> BenC: you did boot with live-powerpc64, right?
[11:27] <bddebian> BenC: I tried the dpkg -S route :-)
[11:27] <BenC> Kamion: nope, didn't know there was one
[11:27] <BenC> there's no way to have a single cd for 32/64?
[11:27] <BenC> yaboot can't select a kernel based on the cpu type?
[11:27] <Kamion> BenC: it's a single CD, but you need to select 32/64 at the yaboot prompt; the default is 32
[11:28] <Kamion> BenC: there's a SuSE patch apparently, but not by default no
[11:28] <bddebian> BenC: Oh and it in included in drscheme: #include <X11/bitmaps/gray>
[11:28] <Kamion> I need to look at said patch
[11:28] <BenC> hopefully it's similar to the silo usage
[11:29] <BenC> image[sun4c] =/boot/vmlinuz-32 or image[sun4u] =/boot/vmlinuz-64
[11:29] <Kamion> yeah, it's image[64bit]  I think
[11:29] <Kamion> bah, all my systems are NATted such that I cannot test torrents
[11:30] <mdz> my torrent downloads are still stalled
[11:30] <mdz> just starting to come up at 1k/sec
[11:30] <Kamion> rah
[11:31] <Nafallo> yay! ;-)
[11:31] <BenC> cool, live-powerpc64 is booting now
[11:32] <mdz> is anyone getting realistic rates from torrent?
[11:32] <maswan> Ok, I seem to be seeding a bit now
[11:32] <mdz> maybe it's just me
[11:32] <maswan> this will probably not give a very realistic rate though
[11:32] <maswan> we'll see in a while,but..
[11:32] <Keybuk> I don't have NAT, but then I've also not managed to get torrents to ever work
[11:33] <mdz> pitti: I have NAT, and set up a trivial forwarding rule
[11:33] <bddebian> Keybuk: Sorry to bother you but how does that tell me what package?
[11:33] <Burgundavia> mdz, pulling down 20~40k/sec
[11:33] <Kamion> pitti: ah, --ip is the key
[11:33] <pitti> mdz: but you certainly have to do that on the router that does NAT, right?
[11:33] <mdz> pitti: yes
[11:33] <mvo> Ijust started the torrent download and have 2k/s right now
[11:33] <pitti> mdz: or do you mean some crackful ssh tunnel or so?
[11:33] <Burgundavia> mdz, scrub that, dropping
[11:33] <Kamion> pitti: http://crashrecovery.org/bittorrent/HOWTO.bttr.html
[11:33] <pitti> mdz: ah, that router is at my provider
[11:33] <mvo> (over nat and stuff)
[11:33] <maswan> mvo: it seems that my slow seed is the only one running now. :/
[11:34] <mdz> pitti: so you don't have nat, you are a victim of nat ;-)
[11:34] <HiddenWolf> has preview been released?
[11:34] <Kamion> the DNS hack there seems unnecessary
[11:34] <mdz> HiddenWolf: it'll go to ubuntu-announce and the topic
[11:34] <mvo> it's getting sharpy up now :) 20k now
[11:34] <mdz> you have my word
[11:34] <pitti> bah, jigdo works sooo well without any hacking...
[11:34] <HiddenWolf> mdz, I can seed 1mbit for a few days...
[11:34] <Kamion> oh, hmm, maybe it is necessary after all, hard to say
[11:34] <Riddell> Kamion: it's not looking good for the kubuntu live amd64 CD, two reports of it not booting now
[11:34] <mdz> still stalled here
[11:34] <maswan> mvo: ehm. you on the amd64 install?
[11:35] <Keybuk> bddebian:
[11:35] <mvo> maswan: yes
[11:35] <maswan> mvo: my home machine got a full block and started to upload. :)
[11:35] <Keybuk> syndicate scott% zgrep "X11/bitmaps/gray" Contents-i386.gz
[11:35] <Keybuk> usr/include/X11/bitmaps/gray                                x11/xbitmaps
[11:35] <Keybuk> -- 
[11:35] <Keybuk> so it's in "xbitmaps", which is in the x11 section
[11:35] <maswan> mvo: the one I'm testing the rate in. :)
[11:35] <mvo> maswan: and getting down again ... 5k
[11:35] <pitti> Riddell: bad...
[11:35] <mvo> maswan: hm, should I take a different one then :) ?
[11:35] <bddebian> Keybuk: Ohh, I misunderstood the Location part.  Thank you.
[11:36] <maswan> mvo: *shrug*, it will all even out in a while anyway
[11:36] <mdz> elmo: torrent is not happy
[11:37] <BenC> latest live cd runs on my G5, for whoever cares
[11:37] <pitti> Riddell: it does not even spend any noticeable time on the CD
[11:37] <pitti> BenC: cool
[11:37] <Kamion> BenC: hooray
[11:37] <Kamion> thanks
[11:37] <jbailey> ogra: What needs to be setup aside from just the ppc box?
[11:38] <pitti> ogra: is edubuntu closer to kubuntu or ubuntu?
[11:38] <ogra> pitti, ubuntu
[11:38] <Kamion> torrent stalls at 1.5MB precisely here
[11:38] <pitti> ogra: I can't stay awake much longer anyway, I almost fall asleep
[11:38] <Keybuk> getting about 50KB/s down at the moment
[11:38] <Burgundavia> Kamion, same with me
[11:38] <pitti> ogra: do you want to release edubuntu together with ubuntu? otherwise I can test it tomorrow
[11:38] <ogra> jbailey, i'd be fine if someone just confirms a working install and that all server processes are running
[11:38] <elmo> mdz: ... ? what do you want me to do?  the software's running
[11:39] <elmo> in the same configuration that it's been running for the last two releases
[11:39] <Keybuk> Kamion: here too
[11:39] <mdz> elmo: ...but it isn't worknig properly
[11:39] <mdz> working
[11:39] <BenC> I love that all my mac keyboard special keys work on ubuntu
[11:39] <ogra> pitti, nope, not at all, but mdz wants to... i'd rather fix the two remaining bits...
[11:39] <maswan> I'll add another seed, soon.
[11:39] <maswan> mdz: could it be that the seeding client on elmo's machine is busy checksumming the isos?
[11:40] <mdz> maswan: elmo would know if that's the problem
[11:40] <ogra> jbailey, http://edubuntu.org/EdubuntuTesting for the two manual interventions needed...
[11:40] <jbailey> ogra: Sure, I can dust off the pegasos box fox that.  I have 10 minutes left in another rsync, and probably another 20 to sync the edubuntu disk.
[11:40] <elmo> maswan: not AFAICS, no
[11:40] <Keybuk> it uninstalled for me
[11:40] <Keybuk> than restalled at 2.1MB
[11:40] <ogra> jbailey, that'd be cool
[11:40] <maswan> elmo: annoying, because I can only see my almost infinitely slow ftp.acc seed
[11:41] <Kamion> wasn't there a web page somewhere that showed torrent status?
[11:41] <mdz> Kamion: torrent:6969
[11:41] <Riddell> ogra: I'm still downloading edubuntu ppc
[11:41] <Kamion> mdz: "Server Error"
[11:41] <ogra> mdz, i386 edubuntu is ok so far (i.e. no regressions)
[11:41] <Riddell> 20 mings to download
[11:41] <Riddell> mins
[11:41] <mdz> Kamion: yeah, exactly
[11:41] <ogra> Riddell, err, didnt you say amd64 ? 
[11:41] <Riddell> ogra: I said powerpc
[11:41] <ogra> dmaned
[11:41] <ogra> damned even
[11:42] <Riddell> ogra: you have an amd64 don't you?
[11:42] <ogra> Riddell, yes, but i cant install on it and it only ready DVD for boot... my DVD writer is broken :(
[11:42] <ogra> mvo, do you hav an amd64 to test ? 
[11:43] <jbailey> ogra: Is there a useful amd64 test that I should do instead that doesn't involve wiping out my wife's computer? =)
[11:43] <HiddenWolf> I'd volunteer, but I need to go :(
[11:43] <mdz> Riddell: what are the symptoms of the failure?
[11:43] <pawdro> hello, is gnome available to download for ubuntu?
[11:43] <mvo> ogra: sort of, yes. no free partition, but I can make space
[11:43] <Riddell> pitti: I'm downlodaing edubuntu poewrpc if you don't want to use up your bandwidth
[11:43] <HiddenWolf> pawdro, it's installed by default, but please ask #ubuntu
[11:43] <ogra> jbailey, i have no edubuntu live ...
[11:43] <pawdro> I meant 2.12
[11:43] <Burgundavia> Kamion, did you just stall at 2.5 as well?
[11:43] <Riddell> mdz: acording to jbailey and pitti it just doesn't read the CD at all
[11:44] <HiddenWolf> pawdro, it's in breezy
[11:44] <Kamion> Burgundavia: yes
[11:44] <mdz> Riddell: not even isolinux?
[11:44] <HiddenWolf> pawdro, #ubuntu
[11:44] <Kamion> oh, no, it's continuing
[11:44] <pawdro> ok
[11:44] <pitti> mdz: it just doesn't boot
[11:44] <jbailey> mdz: It just spins at my bios' booting cd... prompt and then falls back to the harddrive to boot.
[11:44] <pitti> same for me
[11:44] <mdz> weird
[11:44] <pitti> as if there were no CD at all
[11:44] <jbailey> mdz: the amd64 ubuntu install cd goes to the expected isolinux prompt
[11:44] <mdz> does it mount OK?
[11:44] <mdz> and md5sum?
[11:44] <jbailey> yes
[11:44] <mvo> I stalled at 2.4, no it goes fast again
[11:44] <jbailey> to mounting.
[11:44] <jbailey> Haven't md5sum'd it.
[11:44] <pitti> mdz: I tried to burn with three different CDs and two burners
[11:44] <Burgundavia> Kamion, we seem to pulling of maswan, who is getting 0.5 meg chunks
[11:45] <maswan> Burgundavia: the 0.5 meg chunks come to me from the seed in 2k/s
[11:45] <pitti> mdz: md5sum of downloaded file was correct, dd'ing the image does not quite produce the same iso, though (probably some padding)
[11:45] <mdz> pitti: I mean the internal md5sum on the CD itself
[11:45] <Burgundavia> maswan, ouch, this is going to take a while
[11:45] <mdz> pitti: md5sum -c
[11:46] <pitti> mdz: I checked the download against the MD5sums file on the web, if you mean that
[11:46] <jbailey> Do we just do md5sum -c foo.iso?
[11:46] <mdz> pitti: no,I mean the md5sum.txt file on the CD
[11:46] <Kamion> the log of that amd64 live build doesn't show any signs of problems
[11:46] <mdz> the integrity check
[11:47] <jbailey> Running it.
[11:47] <jbailey> It looks like all OKs and echo $? gives me 0
[11:47] <Kamion> mdz: md5sum.txt doesn't include isolinux/
[11:48] <jbailey> Should the isolinux.bin be the same as on the ubuntu live cd?
[11:48] <Kamion> jbailey: yes
[11:48] <pitti> check still running, no problems so far
[11:49] <bddebian> Gotta run, thanks for the Contents-i386 tip Keybuk
[11:49] <jbailey> 45265d7515a84c5cc3000a3937a83316  isolinux.bin
[11:49] <jbailey> 8bcdce8b2e28c6ed178e7445e5991011  isolinux.bin
[11:49] <pitti> 45265d7515a84c5cc3000a3937a83316  isolinux.bin
[11:49] <Kamion> hmm, actually it might be modified by mkisofs
[11:50] <pitti> jbailey: at least we have the same file which makes random burn errors unlikely
[11:50] <Kamion> other kubuntu live-amd64 images have the same isolinux.bin md5sum
[11:50] <Lathiat> i have noticied that cdrecord vs nautilus tends to end up with different things
[11:51] <Kamion> live-i386 is the same between ubuntu and kubuntu
[11:54] <pitti> md5sum check complete without any error
[11:55] <pitti> anyway, it's getting late again, and I need some sleep - happy release!
[11:55] <Keybuk> hmm, it would be nice if, for the real release, we could find a version of the firefox totem widget that didn't crash all the time :-/
[11:55] <maswan> some peopel getting better rates now?
[11:56] <maswan> (on the torrents)
[11:56] <Burgundavia> maswan, oh ya
[11:57] <Kamion> ok, we use the -boot-info-table argument, so mkisofs modifies isolinux.bin with information about the CD layout
[11:57] <elmo> Kamion: eh, do we need to put src seeds up for torrent?
[11:58] <mdz> elmo: hey, it's picked up now; did you change anything?
[11:58] <Kamion> elmo: probably not
[11:58] <jbailey> Kamion: Why would just that one be different, though?
[11:58] <Kamion> jbailey: good question
[11:59] <mdz> 4/6 torrents are going well, 2 still stalled
[11:59] <Kamion> elmo: are they overloading things? I'll kill them off if so
[11:59] <maswan> mdz: now all stalled?
[11:59] <elmo> mdz: I've restarted it several times, they'll take a bit to come up
[11:59] <mdz> maswan: argh, yes, all faling now
[12:00] <maswan> mdz: and now up to speed again?
[12:00] <mdz> maswan: yes, same 4
[12:00] <mdz> maswan: are you seeding only 4 of the isos?
[12:00] <maswan> mdz: no, but for some reason the last 2 won't send data...
[12:00] <maswan> ah, there one more
[12:01] <maswan> heh. I'm close to that one
[12:01] <maswan> dl speed: 6199.3 KB/s
[12:01] <maswan> (my testing client at home)
[12:01] <elmo> Kamion: I don't know if they're overloading it, but there's lot of whining about them in the blog