=== mpt [n=mpt@201-1-132-73.dsl.telesp.net.br] has joined #ubuntu-doc [12:30] BurgLaptop: around? [12:34] mpt, yes [12:39] mpt, you there? my connect is flaky here [12:42] BurgLaptop: yo [12:42] BurgLaptop: Want any more help with the Quick Tour? === mpt just woke up [12:47] mpt, sure [12:47] busy working through some stuff right now [12:47] but I don't have commit access here, unfortunately === BurgLaptop looks forward to baz [12:49] heh === highvoltage [n=Jono@196.7.130.34] has joined #ubuntu-doc [12:51] It would be good to know how many language packs 5.10 is going to have [12:53] a bunch [12:53] Martin Pitt (pitti) would be the person to ask [12:56]

Ubuntu 5.10

[12:56] It’s been a whole six months since the last version of Ubuntu. But now we’re back, and better than ever. [12:56]

Ub-what?

[12:56] Ubuntu is a free, complete Linux-based operating system for your Intel, AMD, or Macintosh computer. If you want a Linux system that Just Works, or if you’re tired of Windows and feeling adventurous, give Ubuntu a spin. We think you’ll be impressed. [12:56] where is that from? [12:57] How about that for an introduction? [12:57] ya [12:57] I like it [12:57] would be nice to work in the security support, etc. [12:57] yes, that would probably belong in the very last section [12:58] in the intro or the end of the doc? [12:58] mpt, we shall have to bang our heads together at UBZ about the quicktour for 6.04 [12:59]

What’s the catch?

[12:59] There is none. Ubuntu will always be free of charge. Ubuntu releases are scheduled every six months, and if you don’t want to upgrade, free security updates are provided for 18 months. [12:59] The end of the doc [01:00] hmm, sounds good [01:00] can you email me a patch? [01:00] I will apply to my local versin [01:03] hmmm, I could do that [01:03] geez evince is fast [01:03] Have you measured it against Acrobat Reader? [01:03] not on the same mahcine [01:04] going to do that now [01:04] 2 secs to load http://www.can-tf1.org/Documents/Training2005.pdf [01:04] from the click in epip [01:06] grr, this bloody wireless here stalls on big downloads [01:08] even a forty page doc took 2 secs [01:12] Have you noticed that it's not actually true that Ubuntu "includes the very best in ... accessibility infrastructure"? [01:12] The accessibility stuff isn't installed by default [01:12] why do you say that? [01:13] "The 'gok' package must be installed in order to get on-screen keyboard support, and the 'gnopernicus' package must be installed for screenreading and magnifying capabilities." [01:13] yes === WaterSevenUb [n=WaterSev@bl5-223-154.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #ubuntu-doc [01:13] it is avaible [01:14] yeah, available != included [01:14] I suppose you could make an argument that installed by default !== included [01:14] ya [01:14] it is easily available [01:15] Synaptic isn't easy [01:15] there is a bug open for making that easy, ala the instlalation of nfs/samba support [01:15] just a sec [01:15] Anyway, this serves as a useful demonstration of how giving software packages stupid names is all fun and games until someone loses an eye (or two eyes, or fine motor control, or whatever) [01:17] http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=6386 [01:23] That "Enable assistive technologies" checkbox shouldn't even exist [01:23] Megasyllabic geekery [01:23] but yeah, automatic installation would be nice [01:25] create a bof for ubz [01:26] HumaneAccessibilityConfiguration [01:27] already exists? [01:28] ugh, I hate acrobat reader [01:28] it is ugly [01:28] No, I was just proposing a name for it [01:28] sounds good to me [01:29] Accessibility prefs are perhaps the worst example of reason-based prefs conflicting with subject-based prefs [01:29] I will try the speed tests with acroread at home, when I have a constant and good net connection [01:31] hmm, I could even do it myself === BurgLaptop needs to create a DeathofSystemTools spec [01:42] mpt, got a patch for me? [01:46] getting there [01:47] Meh, Synaptic won't let me add Multiverse [01:47] I check the checkbox and click "OK" and nothing happens === BurgLaptop wonders why the free software magazines website is using gifs [01:48] that dialog needs some work in dapper [01:48] I opened a bug for it, but there is some future-proofing that needs to be done [02:02] ohhhh, now I see [02:03] clicking "Add" opens a dialog entitled "Edit Repository..." [02:03] that's got to be a bug, surely [02:03] argh, there are two "Edit Repository..." dialogs [02:03] and neither of them are for adding a repository === mpt cries === rob^ [n=rob@pdpc/supporter/student/rob-ubuntu] has joined #ubuntu-doc === rob^ [n=rob@pdpc/supporter/student/rob-ubuntu] has joined #ubuntu-doc [02:21] mpt, welcome to synaptic [02:25] mpt, the future proofing that needs to be done is the adding of custom repos when the lp autobuilding stuff starts [02:27] hi BurgLaptop [02:28] no doubt you have heard about the xml thing [02:28] Still, I see numerous reviews of various distros claiming that Synaptic is really easy to use [02:29] So it must be a big improvement on what came before :-) [02:29] what are we talking about? [02:29] mpt, what dpackage? [02:30] the terminal based one [02:33] I don't know === carthik [n=carthik@user-0cej72j.cable.mindspring.com] has joined #ubuntu-doc [02:44] hi carthik [02:45] Hi, the https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBelowZero page says "Monday 30 October" ... 30th happens to be a sunday .. Would've edited it if I had know which "Monday" or "30th" was intended :) [02:45] hi mpt, how's life? Dont blog much lately? [02:45] yeah [02:45] Jorn Barger said something like [02:45] the more interesting your life is, the less time you have to spend on a Weblog [02:45] :-) [02:46] mpt, true, true :) - but that is also true of mechanical lives, where nothing new happens [02:46] I've been pretty crazily busy the past few months [02:46] Was afraid that your life might have taken on a mechanical tone -- glad to know that's not the case :) [02:47] a mechanical tone? [02:47] oh, as in utter routine [02:47] mpt: I understand that -- I have been so too.. trying to get out of the university (with the promised degree) [02:47] ah, I've been there [02:47] In my last year at uni, one of my tutors said "You still here??" [02:47] all but stopped working on/for WordPress :| [02:49] I might be in Montreal around the time of UBZ, and so was checking the page when I found the error... Please tend to it, if it's not too much of an ask. [02:49] I have to get going.. later mpt, folks!! === avanspronsen [n=andrewv@London-HSE-ppp3543971.sympatico.ca] has joined #ubuntu-doc [03:05] "suspend your laptop to save power"??? === mpt reports that as a bug === highvoltage [n=Jono@196.7.130.34] has joined #ubuntu-doc === corey [n=corey@S010600400555133c.gv.shawcable.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc [03:17] mpt, even with free software magazine, which is quite heavy on the images, evince still takes 2 secs to start and renders almost instantly [03:18] and acrobat? [03:19] not been able to pull it down, due to flaky internet [03:23] mpt, but I can tell you this, acrobat with IE 6 on my machine is much much slower, and it freezes the browser while loading the program [03:31] aha === mpt thinks of a place to find large complex PDFs [03:32] that's because acrobat reader is a giant bloated piece of crap [03:33] yes, well, other-platform comparisons aren't very relevant to Ubuntu [03:36] I went for very graphic heavy pdfs [03:36] I need a good legal one, that will be 200+ pages [03:36] groklaw might have one\ [03:39] 46-page design magazine in about 4.8 seconds [03:40] Acrobat Reader: about 2.1 seconds [03:43] ah well, Evince should be faster by 1.0 :-) [03:44] hey, hang on a minute [03:45] In Evince all the text is gibberish :-) [03:45] er, :-( [03:58] mpt, which doc? [03:59] The "free trial issue" at http://indesignmag.com/idm/ [03:59] let me pull it down and file a bug if necessary [04:00] I'm just about to do that [04:00] poppler in the freedesktop bugzilla [04:01] *All* rendering bugs are poppler bugs? [04:01] yes [04:01] right-o [04:01] same with epiphany and gecko [04:01] My flatmate fixed a poppler crasher yesterday :-) [04:01] who is your flatmate? [04:02] Johan Dahlin [04:02] bug 4402 [04:02] mpt: when are you back in NZ? [04:03] ajmitch: December 21st, probably [04:03] great, planning to be at LCA? [04:03] mpt, where are you living currently? [04:04] ajmitch: yep [04:04] corey: So Carlos [04:04] mpt, Brazil? [04:04] mpt, did you move there to be closer to the LP team? [04:05] yes, Brazil [04:05] Even before it was decided that the Launchpad sprint would be here, kiko had invited me to stay for a few months [04:06] so I just stayed on after the sprint [04:06] cool === karlheg [n=karlheg@host-250-237.resnet.pdx.edu] has joined #ubuntu-doc === corey [n=corey@S010600400555133c.gv.shawcable.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc === Burglaptop [n=corey@S010600400555133c.gv.shawcable.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc [04:40] you know, our topic is kind of useless [04:40] you noticed :-) [04:40] the channel's topic? [04:40] "This channel tries to make its way to the sea" === Burglaptop [n=corey@S010600400555133c.gv.shawcable.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc [04:45] ok, external mouse breaks horrible [04:46] how horrible? [04:46] zoomign around the screen for while not moving horrible [04:47] is there any way in xchat to open 2 different servers by default, with 2 different channel listings for each server? [04:47] ie, both freenode and gimp.net [04:48] sure [04:48] I used to have 5 servers with their own channel lists === ajmitch is currently only on 4 :) [04:49] oh wait, laser mouse + shiny surface equals mouse go crazy [04:49] ajmitch, how? [04:49] have each server set to autoconnect, and for each, have a channel list [04:50] eg #ubuntu-motu,#ubuntu-devel,#ubuntu-laptop,#ubuntu-mono [04:50] I think you can't have spaces separating [04:50] ah, now I see [04:50] Burglaptop: ok, one thing that's always confused me [04:50] mpt, yes? [04:50] Burglaptop: When I make a diff, should I give the original file first, or the modified one? [04:50] to the diff command [04:51] original, then modified [04:51] mpt, and do a diff -u === ajmitch uses -Naur when comparing directories, but that's to get all files, including new ones [04:52] corey.burger @ gmail? [04:53] yes === ..[topic/#ubuntu-doc:Burglaptop] : Ubuntu Doc Team - general discussion - backlog at http://people.ubuntu.com/~fabbione/irclogs | We are string frozen for Breezy release | Projects on http://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocteamProjects | SVN - shttps://docteam.ubuntu.com/repos | Remember the Ubuntu community code of conduct @ http://www.ubuntulinux.org/community/conduct first. === ..[topic/#ubuntu-doc:Burglaptop] : Ubuntu Doc Team - general discussion - backlog at http://people.ubuntu.com/~fabbione/irclogs | We are string frozen for Breezy release | Projects on http://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocteamProjects | SVN - https://docteam.ubuntu.com/repos | Remember the Ubuntu community code of conduct @ http://www.ubuntulinux.org/community/conduct first. [04:56] there, an actual useful topic [04:56] Burglaptop: sent [04:57] mpt, ok [04:57] mpt, don't worry, the screenshots will be zoomed in on the useful feature [04:58] mpt, that diff is a bunch of gibberish [04:58] ? === corey_ [n=corey@S010600400555133c.gv.shawcable.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc === corey__ [n=corey@S010600400555133c.gv.shawcable.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc === Burglaptop [n=corey@S010600400555133c.gv.shawcable.net] has joined #ubuntu-doc [05:03] grr [05:03] ok, something froze my machine [05:04] mpt, you diff was gibberish [05:04] mpt, can you just send my your whole quicktour? [05:04] ok [05:11] Burglaptop: sent [05:12] mpt, thanks [05:12] mpt, I should be able to commit it tomorrow evening (24 hours from now) [05:12] bloody work [05:13] mpt, did you edit this on a mac? [05:17] no, gedit [05:18] hmm [05:18] it wants to replace the whole bloody doc [05:20] tab/space? [05:20] I can fix it [05:20] if so, you can try diff -w (ignore whitespace) [05:21] ajmitch, that did it === ubuntulog [n=ubuntulo@port49.ds1-van.adsl.cybercity.dk] has joined #ubuntu-doc === Topic for #ubuntu-doc: Ubuntu Doc Team - general discussion - backlog at http://people.ubuntu.com/~fabbione/irclogs | We are string frozen for Breezy release | Projects on http://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocteamProjects | SVN - https://docteam.ubuntu.com/repos | Remember the Ubuntu community code of conduct @ http://www.ubuntulinux.org/community/conduct first. === Topic (#ubuntu-doc): set by Burglaptop at Sun Sep 11 04:55:55 2005 [07:33] (Burglaptop/#ubuntu-doc) ok, epiphany bookmarks are major cool [07:34] (robitaille/#ubuntu-doc) how? [07:34] you add them and you can type on the address bar to search through them [07:35] full typeahead [07:37] I keep thinking I should try epiphany; people who like it seems to really like it as their browser [07:37] I decided to use it on my laptop full time [07:37] there are a lot of things that drive me nuts, but then so does FF [07:38] they are just different from FF [07:38] but the guys in #epiphany on gimp.net are extremely helpful people [07:39] they are also working on adding a feature where if you click on an rss feed, it can add it to your feedreader (liferea and one other supported right now, blam is coming) === robitaille has enough rss feed to check...don't need new ones :) === mpt [n=mpt@201-1-132-73.dsl.telesp.net.br] has joined #ubuntu-doc [07:46] is the default page for epiphany a new one or an old one? file:///usr/share/ubuntu-artwork/home/index.html [07:46] the fonts are really small on my laptop for that page [07:46] hi [07:51] OK, that was strange - the Rolling Stones album I'm playing right now - on the computer - has a drum sound that *exactly* like one of Ubuntu's notification noises... [07:51] I was wondering what was going horribly wrong on this machine, for a minute! [07:51] heh [07:52] everyone have a good sfd? [07:53] well, the SFD wiki is being hammered right now [07:54] ah [07:54] we all forgot to bring cameras [07:56] Burglaptop: anything more need to be done on the QT tonight? [07:56] Madpilot, not currently [07:56] OK === Burglaptop is wondering when he will next be able to work on the QT [08:00] rob^, have you seen the latest menu changes? Does the quickguide need an fixes? [08:00] there was only a couple I think [08:00] rob^, serpentine, terminal, root terminal and file browser [08:00] the only one that I know we refer to is terminal [08:00] add/remove applications too [08:01] ya [08:01] hey, is the quickguide going to still ship with ubuntu? [08:01] quicktour? yes [08:02] yeah [08:02] did you get the information from the meeting the other day? [08:02] about xml? [08:02] yes [08:02] we are not docbook as source anyway [08:02] I know [08:03] but they are bitching about not being able to translate html [08:03] if it cannot be translated through rosetta, that hurts, but I am not going to shift to docbook at this point [08:04] yes, thats the problem, I had to fix up all the xml in the FAQ Guide to view properly in Yelp [08:05] and you may find that they won't want to ship the quicktour because it is in html [08:05] it was suggested to redo it in xml [08:06] the quicktour is a marketing doc, not a help doc [08:06] the difference is subtle, and those on top really love it (sabdfl, jdub) [08:06] I know [08:06] yes, however jdub and others were in here telling us that html is no good [08:07] for help docs yes [08:07] for translation [08:07] the quicktour is not primarily meant to be read on an Ubuntu machine [08:07] yeah [08:07] so how will it be distributed? via the web site? [08:08] I am working on the html to pdf issues [08:08] the website is another place [08:08] anywhere and everywhere we need to talk about Ubuntu is my goal [08:09] ok [08:10] it could probably replace some of the stuff in the wiki too, such as UbuntuHowCome etc [08:22] ya [08:23] we were talking about a drastic re-write of UbuntuHowCome at one point, weren't we? === highvoltage [n=Jono@196.7.130.34] has joined #ubuntu-doc [08:24] well, lost intrest, and the quickguide will be better than it [08:24] that started [08:24] + the faq guide takes up too much of my time [08:24] maybe just replace the text with links to other places [08:24] how is the tour going? === jdub would like to help a bit, particularly before fridge/final launch [08:26] hello jdub [08:26] jbailey, you around? [08:27] jdub, pretty good. mpt and I have been hacking tonight, but I don't have commit access to the svn repo [08:27] here [08:28] heh === Burglaptop waits for baz === thoreauput1c [n=prospero@wolax8-095.dialup.optusnet.com.au] has joined #ubuntu-doc [08:29] jdub, I will be to commit what I have done tomorrow night [08:30] Burglaptop, if you email it to me I can do it for you [08:30] rob^, can do [08:30] rstoffers@gmail.com [08:30] rob^, here it is [08:31] ok hang on [08:31] rob^: how was your sfd? === Burglaptop is sad that his sfd day was spent at home hacking on the quicktour [08:32] jdub, good, one thing I did notice that after I gave a presentation on ubuntu everyone wanted windows blown away instead of dual-booting === ajmitch didn't know of any sfd activities in dunedin [08:32] jdub, yourself? [08:34] Burglaptop, where does the quickguide live? [08:34] heh [08:34] fun, handed out hundreds of CDs [08:34] jdub, where were you? [08:34] did a talk on ubuntu at the installfest [08:34] sydney, as always [08:34] the new ubuntu cd covers look nice [08:35] we gave away about 50, which is good for townsville [08:35] slightly smaller market ;) [08:35] yep [08:36] http://www.slug.org.au/gallery/sfd05 [08:37] heh, we all forgot cameras :( [08:37] that's a shame [08:37] hehe yep [08:38] jdub, did you all take to the streets? === ealden [n=ealden@219.90.92.176] has joined #ubuntu-doc [08:40] rob^: we had four street teams, and a bunch at the uni for the installfest [08:40] ah, we only had about 6 members, all flat out doing installs or presentations [08:41] but then, there is only like 10 regulars [08:42] is there like a "minumum requirements" page on the wiki? [08:42] my local LUG is more interested in drinking beer than promoting linux [08:42] is quite sad [08:43] I slept like a baby afterwards [08:43] the local LUG has sort of dried up here [08:43] rob^: I don't think so; I had a good look thru CatHardware last night & day before as well. A "min hardware" page is a good idea... [08:43] ajmitch, it really only needs one person to kick start it [08:44] it was just a question bought up a fair few times during the day [08:44] I ended up having to use vector on a 10 year old laptop :) [08:44] anything less than 256 is going to hurt [08:45] though I have used Gnome 2.8 on 64 [08:45] anything less than 600mhz is also going to hurt, but down as far as 400 is probable [08:46] yeah, thats kind of what I thought [08:46] whohoo! sfd discussions. [08:46] jdub, were most of your installs ubuntu? [08:46] here's some of our cape town photos: http://www.go-opensource.org/gallery/SFD2005_CapeTown [08:46] highvoltage, we are really ontopic in here [08:47] Burglaptop: :) [08:47] Burglaptop: i can't remember anything else ;) [08:47] heh we only got one green sfd tshirt between us all [08:47] we didn't have any official sfd t-shirts, but at least we had go-open source t-shirts. [08:48] the ballons were decent though, my 3 yr old son loved em' [08:48] i think i gave out more than a thousand copies of the opencd. felt very tired by 2pm :) [08:48] I was hacking the faq until 3 the night before, then up at 7 [08:49] rob^, ouch, the bloody xml issue? [08:49] geez [08:49] I was a linux-installing zombie on the day [08:49] Burglaptop, yep === jdub can't wait to meet a freedom toaster in the flesh [08:49] Burglaptop: there are people around for the LUG, but they're busy planning LCA :) [08:50] highvoltage: you in any of the photos? [08:50] mmm flesh... [08:51] isn't it supposed to be "Mmmmm brainssss..."? ;) [08:51] jdub: yep: http://www.go-opensource.org/gallery/SFD2005_CapeTown/IMG_0500_copy [08:51] yes, but someone mentioned flesh, and that is almost as tasty! [08:51] some would say the way i stare at that openCD is unhealthy :P [08:52] i took lots more photo's, but my camera's cable is at work, i'll upload them on monday. [08:52] mmm, watch out for the lasers [08:52] http://www.go-opensource.org/gallery/SFD2005_CapeTown/IMG_0669_2_copy [08:52] ha ha [08:52] hey Burglaptop where does the quicktour live in svn? [08:53] heh. nice photo. [08:53] rob^, gnome/quicktour [08:54] jdub, what is the latest news on new theme/icons/etc. for Breezy? [08:56] Madpilot, given that you, robitaille and myself constitute the highest concentration of Ubuntu members in Canada, it is sad we did nothing for SFD [08:56] :( [08:56] next year! [08:56] :) [08:57] indeed, if I am still in Victoria [08:57] http://www.go-opensource.org/gallery/SFD2005_CapeTown/IMG_0589_copy [08:57] Burglaptop: next year! [08:57] the guy with the red t-shirt in that photo is amazing. [08:57] he volunteered for the tuxlab project for more than a year. [08:58] jeremy would have still volunteered if we didn't hire him. a real free software proponent. [08:58] we just need to convince Jerome to move to Victoria, then we'll have our own loco team [09:00] i think a problem that many of us have, is we want to do everything, and do it now. [09:00] hmm forgot the log message on commit [09:00] robitaille: should we set up a LoCoTeamVictoriaBC wiki page? ;) [09:00] Burglaptop, done [09:00] at 1775 [09:01] and we end up being rushed and under pressure and end up doing a lot of thing half way. next year i'm going to be much more focussed that this year. [09:01] rob^, just saw it thanks [09:02] Madpilot, you can pluck the latest QT out of svn now. jdub, you as well [09:03] what the heck? the latest QT out of the SVN won't display properly here. odd text all over the place... [09:04] hmm [09:06] "<<<<<<< .mine" - lots of these all over, and other cruft [09:06] grr [09:06] jdub, do you have commit access to our repo? [09:07] ? [09:07] mine is ok [09:08] never mind [09:08] I deleted and re-svn up'd, and got a clean copy. Not sure what went wrong at my end... sorry. [09:09] jdub, nev mind === karlheg [n=karlheg@host-250-237.resnet.pdx.edu] has joined #ubuntu-doc [09:15] hmmm... all the entries below "Introducing OpenOffice.org 2" are going to have to have their images swapped to the other side [09:17] aside from that formatting detail, it looks good. [09:18] ya, there are things to be fixed up [09:34] jdub, minor bug with g-a-i, needs to have a seperator above it [09:39] Burglaptop: easy fix, just let seb know [09:41] bye all [09:42] jdub, ok [09:43] check this out: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ [09:44] the long blank space URL... delete? [09:52] Madpilot, that is a unicode url with some asian language on it [09:52] really? displays a lot of blank space in Hoary w/ Opera. Just a sec, will try FF [09:53] and I get a load of odd symbols in FF. does it work better in Breezy? [09:54] yes [09:54] even xchat gives me the unicode [09:55] cool [09:57] does FF give you anything? [09:58] not really; I get a load of the little square 'default' font things [09:58] but I've removed a lot of the non-Western fonts from this install [09:58] that would do it [09:59] well, I need to crash, need to work tomorrow [09:59] although a lot of websites still display OK - the BBC, for example [09:59] good night === jsgotangco [n=jsg@203.172.2.37] has joined #ubuntu-doc [10:19] hey all [10:19] hi jsgotangco [10:20] hey i saw you editing some wiki pages heh [10:21] yeah [10:21] doing bits and pieces of CatHardware, after my big push on that a few nights ago... [10:27] yeah that's great [10:27] have you seen the draft release notes? [10:27] not yet [10:39] im gonna take a nap [10:39] brb [10:40] need sleep. back later, all === WaterSevenUb [n=WaterSev@bl5-54-56.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #ubuntu-doc === Mez [n=Mez@cpc4-lich4-3-0-cust247.brhm.cable.ntl.com] has joined #ubuntu-doc === Seveas [n=seveas@fia228-202-100.dsl.mxposure.nl] has joined #ubuntu-doc === WaterSevenUb [n=WaterSev@bl5-133-179.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #ubuntu-doc === sivang [n=sivang@box79162.elkhouse.de] has joined #ubuntu-doc [03:11] hi all [03:11] is anybody attached here? [03:11] attached? [03:12] ajmitch: yeah, as in screen -rf [03:12] s/-rf/-rd/ [03:12] :) === ajmitch uses screen -rUx, actually :) [03:41]