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[12:07] <Kamion> mdke: it is my weekend; I'll reply to you when I've analysed the information you sent
[12:08] <Kamion> mdke: (in other words, I don't know yet)
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[12:08] <mdke> Kamion, np, i just saw you were active so asked on the off chance
[12:09] <mdke> good night
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[12:12] <Kamion> mdke: just stopping by in between playing wesnoth and going to bed. :)
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[02:46] <bob2> hm
[02:46] <bob2> mono-asemblies-arch isn't needed anymore?
[02:47] <slomo> bob2: nope... it's in mono-classlib-1.0 now
[02:48] <bob2> libdbus-cil Depeds on dbus-glib-1-dev?
[02:49] <bob2> that seems odd
[02:49] <slomo> the package is called libdbus-glib-1-dev now... and it is odd ;) tseng?
[02:50] <bob2> and gnumeric is uninstallable
[02:51] <slomo> bob2: hum... there is no libdbus-cil... it's libdbus-1-cil and this depends on libdbus-glib-1-1
[02:51] <bob2> maybe aptitude is being shit
[02:52] <slomo> hm... you're on breezy?
[02:53] <bob2> just looking at upgrading from hoary
[02:53] <slomo> oh ok... libdbus-cil was only in hoary and depended on dbus-glib-1-dev...
[02:54] <slomo> and gnumeric should be installable on breezy ;) what error do you get?
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[03:03] <bob2>   gnumeric: Depends: libgoffice-1 (< 0.0.4) but 0.0.4-1 is to be installed
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[03:04] <elmo> goffice was only just synced
[03:04] <elmo> I'm sure seb will fix it later today
[03:04] <bob2> ah, thanks
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[03:08] <slomo_> elmo: did you already read my mail about ffmpeg?
[03:09] <elmo> slomo: I've got some concerns about demoting it to multiverse when debian have it in main
[03:09] <elmo> but I realise I've been dragging my feet
[03:09] <elmo> I'll try and reply to you tomorrow, sorry
[03:10] <slomo_> elmo: our current version could stay in universe... as it's in debian... but i wanted to upload marillat's version to fix some bugs in the debian package and marillat's has to be in multiverse... but thanks for looking at it tomorrow :)
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[05:15] <jay> Does anybody know if this whole HP all-in-one subsystem is supposed to be run even if there is not one installed?
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[05:40] <infinity> jay : Yes.
[05:43] <jay> infinity: any idea why?  it seems to use a lot of memory while covering a very small use case %
[05:44] <infinity> jay : Because it is?... It would probably be better to start it from hotplug, but we don't have the time to do that and make sure it works in all cases.
[05:44] <infinity> jay : On the other hand, hplip covers a reasonably large range of printers and all-in-one devices, so we'd like it installed by default.
[05:44] <infinity> jay : And no, I don't own one, yes, it runs on my laptop at boot, no, I don't mind much.
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[06:12] <fabbione> morning guys
[06:12] <xTina> waaah!
[06:12] <xTina> 6 am!
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[06:14] <daniels> ... well, good morning to everyone *else*.
[06:14] <Burgundavia> morning daniels 
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[06:22] <fabbione> hey kid
[06:22] <daniels> sup
[06:22] <fabbione> just woke up
[06:27] <fabbione> hmmmm
[06:27] <fabbione> 15008 is going to give headacke
=== fabbione has the feeling that sudo isn't to blame at all
[06:34] <daniels> no, it's the fact that entirely-numeric hostnames a) are complete crack, b) violate RFCs left right and centre IIRC
[06:35] <fabbione> nope
[06:35] <fabbione> you are allowed to have numeric only hostname
[06:35] <fabbione> but yes.. they are pure crack
[06:36] <elmo> there definitely was a RFC which at least said SHOULD not start with a number, but I don't know if got superceded
[06:40] <fabbione> elmo: i will need to dig them anyway
[06:41] <fabbione> because if all numeric is allowed, that's a glibc bug in the resolver
[06:41] <fabbione> if it isn't it's a bug in the installer that allows that
[06:41] <elmo> well, sudo shouldn't really die on regardless of what the resolver returns
[06:41] <elmo> it only needs the hostname for !ALL
[06:41] <elmo> and fragile sudo when, by default it's the only path to root, is baaad
[06:42] <fabbione> if the user sets manually such a hostname, an hologram should appear in the room and beat him to a slow painful death
[06:42] <fabbione> elmo: yes i agree on that too, but we also need to prevent a non RFC compliant situation too
[06:45] <infinity> The RFC about not having a domain name starting with a number was superceded.
[06:45] <infinity> Hence why 3com.com (and my domain, 0c3.net) are now legal.
[06:45] <infinity> But I'm still unsure about a host part that's entirely numerals.
[06:47] <fabbione> i still need more coffee before i can be alive enough to poke into RFC
[06:48] <daniels> alternately, you could not wake up at 6am
[06:48] <daniels> (why elmo's awake yet/still awake, I have no idea)
[06:49] <fabbione> daniels: i just can't sleep longer...  i got so used to wake up at this time that my acpi goes crazy
[06:49] <fabbione> i blame mjg59 
[06:50] <mdz> fabbione: back from the grave?
[06:50] <fabbione> mdz: i was back already last thursday
[06:51] <fabbione> i just didn't spend too much time on IRC
[06:51] <mdz> fabbione: you said you were not entirely feeling better yet
[06:51] <mdz> how are you now?
[06:51] <fabbione> mdz: that's right, thursdy i was still a bit shaky..
[06:51] <fabbione> much better..
[06:51] <fabbione> thanks
[06:52] <fabbione> but it will take sometime to recover 100%
[06:52] <fabbione> it seems like that my body crashed because i tend to have blood sugar drops too fast
[06:52] <fabbione> so now i had to change my diet completely
[06:52] <fabbione> and it's a slow recovery
[06:52] <fabbione> the high fever was a consequence of the crash
[06:53] <fabbione> (at least according to the doc)
[06:54] <mdz> it's good that you rested
[06:54] <fabbione> anyway.. the only annoying part is that i need to eat very often and extremely balanced
[06:55] <fabbione> but the firsts results are already showing up
[06:55] <fabbione> mdz: yes.. i got scared
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[06:55] <fabbione> AHHHHHHHH cool!!!! finally the ocfs2 fix for the tcp pressure is in
[06:56] <fabbione> and no abi changes :!
[06:56] <desrt> so
[06:56] <desrt> i hear that 2.6.13 is gonna be shipped with breezy
[06:56] <fabbione> desrt ????
[06:56] <infinity> fabbione : As I read RFC952, and the clarifications in 1123 and 3696, all-numeric parts are allowed for any portion of a hostname, except the TLD.
[06:57] <fabbione> infinity: ok.. so it is a valid hostname
[06:57] <infinity> fabbione : Unfortunately, yes. :)
[06:58] <fabbione> mdz: i am also working in fixing the last 2/3 sparc FTBFS.. since the changes are not relevant to other arches, am i good to go without pestering you and kamion any further?
[06:58] <infinity> (The restrictoin against all-numeric TLDs is what stops you from confusing a hostname with an IP)
[06:58] <fabbione> infinity: that's good.. it makes thing simpler
[06:58] <mdz> fabbione: yes
[06:58] <fabbione> mdz: ok thanks
[07:00] <fabbione> if we can get the fixes to klibc, we will even be able to install!
[07:04] <infinity> Hrm, actually glibc is probably doing the right thing.
[07:05] <infinity> If he has no domain assinged, then his hostname is also his TLD.
[07:05] <fabbione> infinity: eh????
[07:05] <infinity> Well, is it resolving "1234" with no domain search, or "1234.something.com"?
[07:06] <fabbione> infinity: the user has a domain search
[07:06] <fabbione> look in the bug
[07:06] <infinity> Oh, then glibc is wrong. :)
[07:06] <fabbione> so indipendently or not, the hostname is also in /etc/hosts that by default is preferred to dns lookups
[07:06] <fabbione> infinity: yes, that's what i am afraid of
[07:06] <fabbione> and probably the latest sudo workarounds a glibc bug
[07:07] <fabbione> but we have jbailey!
[07:09] <infinity> The /etc/hosts case is a weird corner case, though.
[07:09] <fabbione> infinity: it's not a corner case... there many things that can happen before hitting a dns lookups
[07:09] <infinity> If his /etc/hosts contained "127.0.0.1 1234.domain.com 1234", it would probably work.
[07:10] <infinity> (untested)
[07:10] <fabbione> infinity: there can be nis/samba/whatever lookup
[07:10] <fabbione> infinity: i am going to test these cases as soon as i can get my workstation free...
[07:10] <fabbione> i can't efford to get it down right now
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[07:30] <dilinger> jbailey: ping
[07:31] <fabbione> hey dilinger 
[07:31] <dilinger> hey
[07:31] <fabbione> infinity: i am looking at #15187
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[07:53] <pitti> Hi
[07:55] <desrt> w3rd.
[07:56] <desrt> pitti; you poke the cdrtools bug yet?
[07:56] <Burgundavia> pitti, did the work by carstenh on the firewall come to frutition?
[07:57] <pitti> Burgundavia: it's not finished yet; the concept is good, but the backend needs much loce
[07:57] <pitti> love, even
[07:58] <pitti> desrt: not yet, weekend was busy
[07:58] <Burgundavia> pitti, ok, just wondering
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[08:00] <pitti> Hey JaneW 
[08:01] <ajmitch> evening all
[08:01] <fabbione> hey pitti
[08:01] <pitti> Hi ajmitch 
[08:01] <pitti> Moin fabbione 
[08:01] <fabbione> hi Jan
[08:02] <ajmitch> so if I do manage to come to UBZ, what days should I care about? just the ubuntu days?
[08:03] <jsgotangco> wow ajmitch is going to UBZ
[08:03] <ajmitch> jsgotangco: if I pay my own way
[08:03] <ajmitch> jsgotangco: found cheaper flights
[08:03] <jsgotangco> ajmitch, that's a lot of money!
[08:03] <ajmitch> I might make a short holiday of it afterwards
=== ajmitch has no wife & family to spend money on :)
[08:04] <jsgotangco> yeah
[08:04] <pitti> mjg59: ping
[08:04] <ajmitch> I think I need to get out of this town every few months to stay sane
[08:05] <Burgundavia> ajmitch, how big is where you live?
[08:05] <ajmitch> Burgundavia: about 120K people
[08:05] <Burgundavia> ajmitch, that is not that small
[08:05] <jsgotangco> there is a smaller place?
[08:05] <ajmitch> yes
[08:05] <ajmitch> I come from a town of 4000
[08:06] <jsgotangco> wow i live in an overcrowded country indeed
[08:06] <ajmitch> there's maybe a million or so people in the south island
[08:07] <Burgundavia> jdub, shall I create a MenuReThink spec?
[08:08] <jdub> Burgundavia: sure!
[08:08] <jdub> Burgundavia: perhaps 'MenusRevisited'
[08:08] <Burgundavia> sure
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[08:17] <JaneW> hi pitti
[08:18] <Burgundavia> jdub, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MenusRevisited
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[08:19] <jdub> Burgundavia: "radically altered" -> "had a top-down review"... surely the aim is not to radically alter things willy-nilly :)
[08:19] <Burgundavia> jdub, yes
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[08:34] <pitti> desrt: btw, what do you mean by cdrtools breakage?
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[08:35] <desrt> pitti; i have a bug open assigned to you
[08:35] <desrt> mkisofs produces bogus output on ppc
[08:36] <ajmitch> jdub: you're an enthusiastic fellow, got ideas for writing up a bug day announcement?
[08:36] <desrt> http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=14990
[08:36] <pitti> desrt: ah, this one; ok
[08:36] <desrt> pitti; it's absolute retardedness
[08:36] <pitti> desrt: really odd, too
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[08:37] <desrt> pitti; jrg shilling stole mjg59's gpl
[08:37] <desrt> pitti; basically... cdrtools uses this really messed up makefile system called shilly
[08:38] <desrt> pitti; and it complains about a 'bug' in gmake
[08:38] <desrt> and accuses gmake of being unmaintained
[08:38] <desrt> and recommends the use of smake
[08:38] <desrt> so i'm wondering if somehow that's causing the makefile oddness
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[08:38] <ajmitch> hi AndyFitz 
[08:40] <AndyFitz> g'day ajmitch
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[09:12] <pitti> jordi: Hi! Do you know about http://savannah.gnu.org/patch/index.php?func=detailitem&item_id=4407 ?
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[09:19] <dholbach> good morning
[09:20] <mvo> good morning dholbach 
[09:20] <ajmitch> hi dholbach, mvo 
[09:20] <dholbach> mvo: hey michael, how is it going?
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[09:21] <dholbach> morning seb128! :)
=== mvo waves to ajmitch 
[09:22] <seb128> hey dholbach
=== mode/#ubuntu-devel [+o fabbione]  by ChanServ
=== mode/#ubuntu-devel [-b *!n=chmj@*]  by fabbione
=== mode/#ubuntu-devel [-o fabbione]  by fabbione
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[09:24] <Burgundavia> seb128, g-a-i is missing a seperator above it on the menu
[09:24] <Burgundavia> seb128, and good morning
[09:25] <seb128> hi
[09:26] <seb128> I don't care, we are UI frozen and that would require some good panel patches but I've other stuff to di
[09:26] <seb128> s/di/do/
[09:26] <Burgundavia> seb128, ok, jdub just pointed me at you when I told him
[09:28] <fabbione> dholbach: ping?
[09:29] <dholbach> fabbione: pong
[09:29] <fabbione> dholbach: what's your BZ email address?
[09:29] <dholbach> fabbione: dh@mailempfang.de
[09:29] <seb128> dholbach: run away, NOW :)
[09:29] <dholbach> seb128: fabbione likes me :)
[09:29] <seb128> he he
=== ajmitch wonders when dholbach will start maintaining FF :)
[09:30] <dholbach> ajmitch, seb128, mvo, pitti: would you please drop it
[09:30] <dholbach> ajmitch, seb128, mvo, pitti: thank you
[09:30] <ajmitch> hehe :)
[09:30] <seb128> I was thinking about that when I've patched firefox yesterday
[09:30] <seb128> "where the heck is Daniel, he should be doing it" :)
[09:30] <jdub> oh, is dholbach taking over ff? rock!
[09:31] <dholbach> *cry desperately*
[09:31] <seb128> hey jdub
[09:31] <ajmitch> better him than me :)
[09:31] <pitti> stop bitching about the poor guy - he is supposed to help seb with breaking the panel...
[09:31] <fabbione> dholbach: you wut 15183
[09:31] <fabbione> ops
[09:31] <Burgundavia> seb128, shall I send you patch for applications.menu?
[09:31] <fabbione> s/wut/win
[09:31] <dholbach> fabbione: thanks, i'll have a look
[09:31] <seb128> Burgundavia: a patch for what? the menu is fine this way
[09:31] <fabbione> dholbach: i already did some debugging
[09:31] <fabbione> dholbach: so it should be farly easy
[09:31] <Burgundavia> seb128, to add a seperator between add programs and the system tools, like run applications used to have
[09:32] <dholbach> fabbione: thank you... that's very nice :)
[09:32] <seb128> Burgundavia: that's not that easy, you need to patch gnome-panel source code
[09:32] <Burgundavia> seb128, ick
[09:32] <Burgundavia> seb128, why?
[09:32] <seb128> because there is no separator element for the .menus
[09:32] <jdub> seb128: (the previous time we had g-a-i there, it was fixed to have a separator - it was rad)
[09:32] <daniels> pitti: seb doesn't need any help breaking the panel, he's great at doing at that on his own
[09:33] <seb128> jdub: not true, we reverted the changes because neither mvo or me wanted to start hacking the panel for that (and it was quite ugly)
[09:33] <jdub> oh
=== mvo nods
=== jdub was sure he had a separator at one stage
[09:33] <jdub> perhaps i was toking too hard
[09:33] <Burgundavia> jdub, we did, for run applications
[09:33] <seb128> nop
[09:33] <seb128> that was upstream code
[09:33] <jdub> Burgundavia: different issue
[09:33] <seb128> we didn't do anything
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[09:36] <pitti> Hi Mithrandir 
[09:36] <Burgundavia> seb128, if it involves icky codes changes, forget about it. Too bad that kind of stuff is not simply built into the .menu spec
[09:36] <dholbach> Mithrandir: morning tollef :)
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[09:42] <herzi> hey all
[09:43] <HiddenWolf> seb128, are you aware of any problems with nautilus-cd-burner blanking discs? It seems to lock the disc down so it can't blank it for me.
[09:44] <seb128> HiddenWolf: your description is weird, but taking a guess I would blame pitti's plugdev change
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[09:45] <HiddenWolf> seb128, I want to burn something to a full -rw, so nautilus offers to blank, then pops up an error that it can't write to disk.
[09:45] <seb128> https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=15098
[09:45] <HiddenWolf> killing nautilus and using cdrecord does the trick.
[09:46] <seb128> can you try with the previous udev package?
[09:49] <pitti> HiddenWolf: right, will fix ASAP
[09:49] <HiddenWolf> pitti, good man. :)
[09:53] <fabbione> dholbach: you have davis :)
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[10:09] <Mithrandir> good morning dholbach 
[10:10] <dholbach> http://www.heise.de/newsticker/meldung/63799 - unfortunately it's in german, but they say that HP loves us :)
[10:10] <Treenaks> do we love them back?
[10:12] <bob2> an rdns-less scott
[10:12] <\sh> dholbach: i think there has to be also an english announcement, because it was in south africa
[10:12] <\sh> http://www.tectonic.co.za/view.php?id=595
[10:13] <\sh> this si the english article
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[10:16] <pitti> HiddenWolf: udev fixed
[10:16] <HiddenWolf> pitti, great
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[10:32] <HiddenWolf> dholbach, search for Ubuntu HP
[10:32] <HiddenWolf> dholbach, you'll find articles left and right
[10:32] <HiddenWolf> including tomshardware, heise, south african newspapers
[10:32] <Treenaks> HiddenWolf: tomshardware was oldn ews
[10:32] <Treenaks> HiddenWolf: from may
[10:32] <seb128> pitti: thanks for the quick fix on this udev bug
[10:33] <pitti> np, sorry for the breakage
[10:33] <HiddenWolf> Treenaks, still news. :)
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[10:38] <mvo> seb128: gnumeric is uninstallable right now?
[10:38] <seb128> mvo: how so?
[10:39] <dholbach> seb128: libgoffice* removes it
[10:39] <jdub> anyone have recommendations for a thin, 14"-15" notebook for pipka?
[10:39] <seb128> mvo: short story: I've asked for libgsf/goffice syncs saturday and elmo did that this night, I've to catch with gnumeric now
[10:39] <dholbach> seb128: maybe it needs a recompile or something? or maybe it was libgsf? *has a look*
[10:39] <seb128> dholbach: I'm on it
[10:39] <dholbach> seb128: super
[10:39] <bob2> jdub: t42!
[10:39] <jdub> bob2: how thin are they?
[10:40] <dholbach> seb128: mvo pushed me towards *bluetooth - i have a look at those again
[10:40] <mvo> seb128: thanks (I'm going over the desktop files of g-a-i right now)
[10:40] <mvo> to make sure that the stuff is installable
[10:40] <seb128> mvo: np
[10:41] <daniels> jdub: the T series isn't that much thicker than X
[10:42] <daniels> maybe 1.5x
[10:42] <jdub> hmm
[10:42] <jdub> IBM might be a bit 'spensive
[10:42] <daniels> but don't take my word for it, check the epscs
[10:42] <daniels> and the specs
[10:42] <daniels> i have to put raster on /ignore, he's making me typo too much
[10:42] <daniels> osmosis
[10:43] <infinity> Yeah, the T-series are pretty dang thin.
[10:43] <infinity> Just much larger desk area, cause the screens are big.
[10:43] <bob2> powerbooks certainly look thin
=== daniels hugs his X40.
[10:43] <daniels> bob2: they aren't thin at all
[10:43] <bob2> and you get 15% off if you're a student
[10:44] <daniels> bob2: the 12" PB is about twice as thick as my X40
=== bob2 hugs his x40 too
[10:44] <daniels> bob2: and weighs way way more
[10:44] <daniels> (2.2kg as opposed to 1.2/1.47kg)
[10:44] <sivang> Morning all!
[10:45] <sivang> T's looks cool, and yes, they don't seem thicker then X's
=== HrdwrBoB hugs hus X40 as well, while we're at it
[10:45] <daniels> jdub: you should hug your X40 to ... oh, wait.  nevermind.
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=== Mithrandir ruffles his x40
[10:46] <HrdwrBoB> jdub: I picked up my X40 off ebay for $700 sans battery and hdd which cost $320
[10:46] <daniels> Mithrandir: and bob2 loves your x40 as well
[10:46] <Mithrandir> daniels: yeah, I know.
[10:47] <Mithrandir> daniels: especially the corner the farthest away from the hard drive.
[10:48] <bob2> dang, ifrename doesn't let you rename eth0:1 interfaces
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[10:48] <Mithrandir> don't use ethX:Y interfaces, then?
[10:48] <Mithrandir> they're so mid-1990s
[10:49] <sivang> speaking of which, I reckon we do support T43 out-of-the-box ?
[10:49] <bob2> Mithrandir: shorewall appears to puke if I just stick my DSL modem and local network on the same interface
[10:49] <Treenaks> sivang: see the LaptopTestingTeam page
[10:49] <bob2> and it's 1849, so no new NIC tonight
[10:49] <Treenaks> sivang: I saw one on there
[10:49] <sivang> Treenaks: k, thanks
[10:49] <daniels> bob2: so don't use shorewall
[10:50] <bob2> daniels: but I'm no iptables hacker, it's too hard for me!
[10:50] <HrdwrBoB> iptables is easy
[10:50] <daniels> bob2: maybe you need to become a Linux Kernel Developer, then
[10:50] <bob2> boomtish
[10:50] <daniels> bob2: step one: borrow rusty's books.  step two: return them three and a half year slater.
[10:50] <bob2> HrdwrBoB: yeah, yeah, but trolling daniels is not
[10:51] <sivang> daniels: I have RML's book, mind booming :)
[10:51] <infinity> sivang : I'm working on a T43 right now.  Everything works fine, except the video is woefully unaccelerated, because we don't support PCI express video yet.
[10:52] <daniels> sivang: i'm sorry to hear that
[10:52] <sivang> daniels: why ?
[10:52] <infinity> (Oh, and it crashes at least once a day, but other than that... <sigh>)
[10:53] <daniels> oh, sorry
[10:53] <daniels> i thought you sai dd rms for a second
[10:53] <daniels> rml's cool though, and by all accounts, his book is good also
[10:53] <sivang> infinity: Hmm well, guess it'd make a good support testing machine :-o ? :_)
[10:54] <sivang> daniels: funny as it should, however you need to give some of the section 2nd and 3rd read
[10:54] <Mithrandir> infinity: hmm, sure we don't support PCIe?  My nvidia works fine..
[10:55] <infinity> Mithrandir : It's set up as pure PCI, and slow as a dog.  Unless you're using binary drivers.
[10:55] <jdub> yeah, don't want X series -> 12" not useful for pipka
[10:55] <infinity> Mithrandir : Unless the nv driver recently got PCIe support, then it's just radeon that's behind the curve.
=== infinity looks at daniels.
[10:55] <daniels> Mithrandir: actually, we do support PCIE, it's just that it's too late in Breezy to backport all the open source PCIE 3D acceleration for ATI
[10:55] <daniels> infinity: stfu
[10:55] <infinity> jdub : I heart my 1400x1050 display on my T series.
[10:56] <jdub> infinity: that'll be pretty tempting
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[10:56] <Treenaks> infinity: ctrl+shift+2665
[10:56] <daniels> i heart my stable laptop
[10:56] <sivang> infinity: it's using nvidia based circuits?
[10:56] <infinity> sivang : No, the T43 is ATI-baed, mine's an X300.
[10:57] <infinity> s/baed/based/
[10:57] <HiddenWolf> infinity, x300 is ati
[10:57] <infinity> HiddenWolf : Yes, and?
[10:57] <sivang> infinity: I see, because when I looked at IBM's site, they have "Intel Accelerated Graphics" nor ATI/nVidia and I was wondering if the ditched them altogether.
[10:57] <infinity> HiddenWolf : Did I ever claim it wasn't?
[10:57] <mjr> daniels, hm, now that you mentioned it, will there be any (even remotely working) r300 code in breezy's X?
[10:57] <Mithrandir> infinity: I'm using binary drivers, yes, but iirc that's because that was the easiest way to get xinerama working. :-P
[10:58] <infinity> daniels : Feh, it's never too late to backport a mess of drivers to support newer hardware.  Clearly, I need to start a petition.
[11:00] <jdub> it's a pity that it's so hard to rip the hdd out of the toilet seat ibooks
[11:00] <infinity> With a chainsaw, nothing is impossible.
[11:01] <jdub> tempting
[11:01] <jdub> i think i'm going to rehouse the machine
[11:01] <sivang> infinity: lol
[11:01] <sivang> Mithrandir: and you have all hw-accel with the binary drivers?
[11:02] <mjr> infinity, right you are; "Well, can you knit a sweater with a chainsaw?" "The _real_ question is *brmmm* do you want to make me one, now?"
=== jdub cheers for elite stage two progress bar
[11:02] <Mithrandir> infinity: have _a bit_ of style, use a dremel
[11:02] <Mithrandir> sivang: iirc, yes.
[11:02] <Mithrandir> sivang: I'm not at home now, so I can't check right now.
[11:03] <daniels> mjgr	no
[11:03] <sivang> Mithrandir: well, seems that's my next dream laptop
[11:03] <doko> watch the trolls (german), "HP im Ubuntu Fieber" -> http://www.heise.de/newsticker/meldung/63799
[11:04] <Mithrandir> sivang: it's a desktop, not a laptop.
[11:04] <sivang> Mithrandir: oops, I had in mind the T43 ;)
[11:05] <Mithrandir> sivang: I have an X40, not a T series.  \infty has a T series
[11:06] <mjr> daniels, bummer
[11:06] <daniels> mjr: tell me about it
[11:06] <sivang> infinity: let me know if you get hrdwr-accel working with bin drivers
[11:06] <daniels> mjr: but it's about 200,000 lines of stuff to backport.  i know how much it sucks -- my desktop is a pcie ati chip.
[11:07] <infinity> sivang : No luck there, fglrx doesn't appear to work on my laptop, so I'm stuck with the Xorg radeon driver.... Which would be good, but it's desperately in need of some CVS updates first.
[11:08] <daniels> (and Mesa DRI, and kernel DRM, and ...)
[11:08] <mjr> yeah, I get it
[11:09] <daniels> oh yeah, and airlied fixed PCIE after anholt committed Exa
[11:09] <daniels> so we'd need to backport all of exa
[11:09] <mjr> :)
[11:09] <daniels> which, I mean, exa is really good, right ...
[11:09] <Mithrandir> daniels: you mean you don't want to support a CVS snapshot of xorg for 18 months?
[11:10] <mjr> on my home box, I'd be content with the AGP stuff. Though at work, I'll need to support PCIE boxes quite soon...
[11:10] <daniels> Mithrandir: *SHOCK*
[11:10] <Mithrandir> daniels: sissy!
[11:10] <daniels> mjr: eh, if youi *need* to support it, just grab CVS
[11:10] <Mithrandir> :-)
[11:10] <mjr> daniels, yes, I know how, was just wondering how much of the pain will I have to endure personally ;)
[11:10] <daniels> mjr: i did packages for the server a couple of weeks back anyway, so maybe I'll update them and throw them on p.u.c when I have some spare time
[11:11] <mjr> yah, thanks
[11:11] <jdub> daniels: is xephyr rough to build?
[11:12] <jdub> might be fun to have it in universe
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[11:14] <daniels> jdub: ross is packaging it, along with kdrive and shit
[11:15] <bob2> hah
[11:15] <sivang> daniels: I might be in for some of that backporting stuff if you and infinity would show me around ;-) (and I'll have my T43 there)
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[11:27] <sabdfl> moin moin
[11:27] <pitti> Hi sabdfl 
[11:27] <sabdfl> a small announcement:
[11:27] <sabdfl> YOU GUYS ROCK
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[11:27] <Mithrandir> sabdfl in da house.
[11:27] <dholbach> :)
[11:27] <dholbach> hi mark
[11:27] <jordi> heh
[11:27] <Mithrandir> sabdfl: what have done now?
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[11:27] <pitti> sabdfl: thanks :-)
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[11:28] <Lathiat> moin sabdfl :)
[11:28] <sabdfl> fabbione, benc: my desktop keeps hanging, how can i give you debug feedback?
[11:28] <jordi> pitti: yes, didn't you get a mail from me?
[11:28] <sabdfl> it locks hard
[11:28] <fabbione> sabdfl: morning.. sure
[11:28] <fabbione> sabdfl: what kernel?
[11:28] <pitti> jordi: hm, can't remember
[11:28] <sabdfl> breezy standard
[11:28] <fabbione> sabdfl: did you upgrade recently?
[11:28] <jordi> pitti: hm. what's your email address?
[11:29] <sabdfl> fabbione: current as of saturday
[11:29] <pitti> jordi: martin.pitt@ubuntu.com
[11:29] <Lathiat> fabbione: mjg59 mentioned an issue with sata stuff where accessing the cdrom at the same time as the hdd results in a hard locK (and we guess tahts whats locking my laptop) any idea about that / when we'll get the fix in ?
[11:29] <jordi> pitti: heh. I mailed pitti@
[11:29] <fabbione> sabdfl: meh.. what kind of load do you have on the machine?
[11:29] <jordi> pitti: bounced.
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[11:29] <jordi> pitti: in short, I asked for a CVE number
[11:29] <sabdfl> fabbione: little, it's locked up during screensavers mostly. not even gl screensavers
[11:29] <fabbione> Lathiat: no, i have no idea, because i am not tracking the kernel anymore
[11:30] <Lathiat> fabbione: oh ok
[11:30] <Lathiat> fabbione: i'll go make it someone elses problem then ;)
[11:30] <sabdfl> hmm... Lathiat might have the same problem as me, it's SATA
[11:30] <fabbione> sabdfl: it's always reproducible? on what kind hw is it?
[11:30] <pitti> jordi: can't find one
[11:30] <sabdfl> Lathiat: need to talk to BenC
[11:30] <Lathiat> sabdfl: ah 
[11:30] <daniels> sivang: seriously non-trivial
[11:30] <jordi> pitti: this was saturday, they may have not processed it.
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[11:30] <sabdfl> fabbione: reproducible in the sense that the desktop has locked most mornings overnight
[11:30] <seb128_> jordi: about what?
[11:30] <Lathiat> sabdfl: yeh apparently thats the problem and that it would be fixed but i odn tknow any more
[11:30] <fabbione> sabdfl: let me take a look on what's boiling in baz...
[11:31] <fabbione> sabdfl: perhaps there is a fix already committed
[11:31] <jordi> seb128_: mailutils
[11:31] <jordi> pitti: saw the LWN article re: security? sad...
[11:31] <jordi> ubuntu is rocking so much in that regard
[11:31] <pitti> jordi: I am not subscribed, which article?
[11:31] <seb128_> jordi: you can reassign the epiphany-browser one to mozilla
[11:31] <Lathiat> sabdfl! you cursed me, it just locked then.
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[11:32] <jordi> pitti: LWN compared the response times to vunerabilities for a few distros
[11:32] <ajmitch> Lathiat: ouch, I haven't seen it on mine
[11:32] <pitti> jordi: ah, that one, I read it on sounder
[11:32] <jordi> Debian's numbers were horrible.
[11:32] <seb128_> pitti: the one pointed by mdz when you replied you have not subscribsion
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[11:32] <jordi> seb128_: sure
[11:32] <jordi> pitti: got my mail?
[11:32] <ajmitch> Lathiat: except I haven't been using the cd much
[11:32] <Lathiat> sabdfl: try keeping a cd in the drive
[11:32] <pitti> jordi: second please, in the middle of USN release
[11:33] <jordi> oh, heh.
[11:33] <jordi> sorry.
[11:33] <ajmitch> hey jordi 
[11:33] <sabdfl> Lathiat: i do have one in the drive. audio cd, and it's been locking. could be the same?
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[11:34] <Lathiat> sabdfl: umm, try taking it out then? :)
[11:34] <sabdfl> Lathiat: it's a home box, will try it tonight
[11:34] <Lathiat> okie
[11:34] <Lathiat> i have no idea how specific this problem is so not sure if tis the same one
[11:35] <Lathiat> find out i guess
[11:37] <pitti> jordi: mail looks fine, you should get a reply soon
[11:38] <fabbione> sabdfl: sorry.. i need a few more minutes.. baz is taking ages to update
[11:38] <doko> pitti: please review pootle / translate-toolkit for inclusion in main
[11:39] <pitti> doko: yep, already saw the mail
[11:39] <doko> pitti: note, that translate-toolkit is in unstable only, and needs to be synced, so better take the package from unstable
[11:39] <sabdfl> doko: happy for it to be in universe, but main implies support, and i'd rather just support rosetta
[11:40] <HiddenWolf> Guys, i'm trying to use linda, and it's looking for it's files in /usr/lib/site-python/ and not /usr/lib/python2.4/site-python/
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[11:43] <doko> sabdfl: therefore the renaming to translate-toolkit and the removal of the pootle files. but currently we need it convert the OOo2 language data to po files. However, we can do after the build as well
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[11:45] <fabbione> sabdfl: you are experiencing this problem http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=13370 <-
[11:45] <fabbione> sabdfl: and it claims to be fixed in baz..
[11:45] <sabdfl> doko, fabbione: thanks
[11:45] <fabbione> sabdfl: would like a test kernel?
[11:45] <fabbione> sabdfl: because that would sort of rock :)
[11:45] <sabdfl> doko: if we need it for our own processes then main is fine
[11:46] <sabdfl> fabbione: sure
[11:46] <fabbione> sabdfl: ok.. i will build it for you, but you will have to upgrade it manually later, when final will be out...
[11:46] <fabbione> or at least i think you will have to
[11:47] <fabbione> Lathiat: what kernel flavour would like? so you can test it too?
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[11:47] <Lathiat> fabbione: 386 is fine
[11:47] <fabbione> sabdfl: for you?
[11:47] <fabbione> 386, 686?
[11:48] <fabbione> Lathiat: 686 is ok too?
[11:48] <Lathiat> fabbione: yeh sure
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[11:52] <infinity> fabbione : Cook up a 686 for me too, yo. :)
[11:52] <fabbione> infinity: sure :)
=== fabbione gets ready to make nagios yell and scream
[11:53] <daniels> fabbione: pleeeeeeease can we have .13 for breezy? or backported drm? :)
[11:54] <fabbione> daniels: *cough*beer*cough*
[11:54] <daniels> i'm getting ready to make my desktop run a non-stock kernel for the first time in its life
[11:54] <daniels> fabbione: eh, i'll buy you a molson in canadia
[11:55] <Treenaks> daniels: does that solve the ATI DRI/DRM version mess?
[11:55] <infinity> fabbione : Any particular reason why we aren't trying to push in .13?
[11:55] <fabbione> daniels: dude.. i am still waiting beer from UDU :P
[11:55] <daniels> Treenaks: no, but it gives you open-source DRI for every ATI card that exists right now
[11:55] <fabbione> infinity: UVF?
[11:55] <daniels> fabbione: eh, bring me to a conference where I'm not dying
[11:55] <Treenaks> daniels: whoa!
[11:55] <infinity> fabbione : Makes more sense to keep rolling upgrades going than to carry around a bunch of patches that make the kernel "almost .13, but not quite".
[11:55] <Lathiat> daniels: oh nice
[11:55] <Treenaks> daniels: even the PCIE ones?
[11:55] <daniels> Treenaks: yes.
[11:55] <infinity> fabbione : The kernel has a standing UVF exception, does it not?
[11:55] <Lathiat> Treenaks: woo
[11:56] <Mithrandir> fabbione: we're not in kernelfreeze, are we?
[11:56] <fabbione> infinity: nope.. we did freeze the main upstream version with all the other stuff
[11:56] <fabbione> Mithrandir: almost.. yes..
[11:56] <fabbione> Mithrandir: we are in strict bug fixing only
[11:56] <fabbione> and in 2 weeks only security 
[11:56] <infinity> fabbione : Meh.  Also, meh.  Moving our patches forward ot .13 sounds easier than backporting DRM. :)
[11:57] <infinity> (I guess we get neither, though)
[11:57] <fabbione> infinity: i am sure you can manage :)
[11:57] <fabbione> infinity: and thanks for offering volunteer :P
[11:57] <fabbione> infinity: portforwarding patches takes around 2 days 
[11:57] <fabbione> just to kill/rediff
[11:57] <fabbione> + another 2 days to get * to build
[11:57] <infinity> fabbione : I'd volunteer to forward-port our patches to .13, but you just told me it's a no-go, so why volunteer to do work that won't be accepted?.. Y'know?
[11:58] <fabbione> infinity: you can make it ready for breezy+1 and breezy backports
[11:58] <fabbione> infinity: seriously.. .12 is pretty stable and a pretty decent kernel
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[11:58] <sabdfl> fabbione: 686
[11:59] <sabdfl> if possible
[11:59] <fabbione> sabdfl: perfect..
[11:59] <infinity> If I'm going to run a backport kernel, I may as well just run a non-stock kernel altogether (which I'll probably end up doing)
[11:59] <fabbione> sure..
[11:59] <fabbione> few minutes and it will be ready
[11:59] <infinity> And yeah, I know .12 is the bomb... For everyone who isn't me. :)
[11:59] <fabbione> infinity: ain't my fault if you buy crappy hw
[11:59] <infinity> Obviously, I'm being selfish in my wish for working ATI/PCIe acceleration.
[11:59] <infinity> s/crappy/new/
[11:59] <fabbione> s/new/crappy
[12:00] <fabbione> infinity: the DRM patch is way too intrusive to push at this point in time
[12:00] <fabbione> infinity: i did try to apply what daniels pushed me a while ago...
[12:00] <fabbione> it was a full reject
[12:00] <infinity> Oh well.  If this SATA patch fixes my constant crashing issues, I'll cope with slow X.
[12:01] <infinity> The speed thing isn't nearly as irritating as having the box lockup every few hours "just cause".
[12:01] <fabbione> wow.. i managed to use 200MB of swap on concordia
[12:02] <Mithrandir> fabbione: she's too slow, then.
[12:02] <fabbione> Mithrandir: yes.. i like davis much much more
[12:02] <fabbione> that's why i am going to buy a powerbook
[12:02] <bob2> davis has less cylons, tho
[12:03] <fabbione> bob2: elmo and I unleashed davis power with a 64bit kernel
[12:03] <Mithrandir> fabbione: I should try building the kernel on rho or pi one day; they're nice-ish boxes.
[12:03] <bob2> bwahaha
[12:03] <fabbione> bob2: more RAM.. SMP. no random segfaults
[12:04] <fabbione> bob2: davis is way faster than concordia
[12:04] <Mithrandir> just four gigs of memory, but dual 265 and 275s.
[12:04] <Diziet> I need to get `mozilla-firefox' (a dummy transition package) into main.
[12:04] <bob2> Mithrandir: your use of "just" offends me and my 512MB laptop
[12:04] <daniels> only 512MB? wtf
[12:04] <bob2> fabbione: heh, did you ever figure out what the segfaults were from?
[12:04] <bob2> daniels: no scotch wraps for you
[12:04] <daniels> bob2: verdammt
[12:04] <fabbione> bob2: yes.. running a 32bit unsupported kernel on a 64bit cpu
[12:05] <bob2> hah
[12:05] <Mithrandir> bob2: apart from my router, I don't use any boxes with less than 1.5GB of memory.
[12:05] <fabbione> bob2: make -j 300 is just perfect :)
[12:05] <fabbione> Mithrandir: we don't all have free hw :P
[12:05] <daniels> fabbione: says you
[12:05] <bob2> fabbione: hahaha
[12:06] <fabbione> daniels: i had freehw when i was working in Ericsson
[12:06] <ajmitch> Mithrandir: I'd be lucky to have a total of 1.5GB over all my boxes here
[12:06] <Mithrandir> fabbione: I spent about 2500 on hardware a few weeks ago.  That's my new and sweet home system. :)
[12:06] <daniels> fabbione: you still scam free hardware of dodgy Danish ISPs
[12:06] <daniels> i need to blow some cash on a stack more RAM for brainfreeze
[12:07] <fabbione> daniels: didn't get any yet :/
[12:07] <fabbione> Mithrandir: ehehe
[12:07] <daniels> a reasonably nice AMD64, but let down by one slow IDE disk (LVMed with SATA, need to get 3 250GB SATA drives) and only having 1GB of RAM
[12:07] <daniels> but it's nice matched-pair low-latency stuff, at least
[12:07] <bob2> you guys all have too much hardware
[12:07] <fabbione> daniels: i just upgraded the trider-g7 with 4x400GB
[12:08] <fabbione> almost 2TB of data around me
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[12:08] <daniels> bob2: dude, I only have 200GB here
[12:08] <daniels> bob2: do you know how much that sucks?
[12:08] <daniels>  25
[12:08] <dholbach> does anybody know anything about stuff like  "../libtool: line 1223: 26661 Segmentation fault"  on the ppc buildd?
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[12:09] <bob2> go libtool, it's your birthday
[12:10] <fabbione> dholbach: hmm sounds like a random segfault...
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[12:10] <Mithrandir> bob2: libtool is a shell script.  It shouldn't segfault. :-P
[12:10] <dholbach> i hope a "give back" makes me happy :)
[12:10] <fabbione> Mithrandir: but bash can :)
[12:10] <bob2> Mithrandir: a shell script which has been Touched by scott
[12:10] <bob2> who knows what powers it has now
[12:10] <dholbach> Mithrandir: that's not the first time i see that message on ppc :)
[12:11] <Mithrandir> dholbach: Iz gtk bug
[12:11] <pitti> dholbach: that's very common again these days, one or more g-b should help
[12:11] <dholbach> Mithrandir: hahaha, of course - how could i possibly forget :)
=== infinity wonders if there's some way he can blame bash.
[12:14] <ogra> Kamion, ping
[12:14] <infinity> dholbach : List of packages that need a give-back, by any chance?
[12:14] <dholbach> infinity: doko will be delighted :)
[12:14] <dholbach> infinity: will look at the buildlogs, just a sec
[12:16] <fabbione> sabdfl, infinity, Lathiat: http://people.ubuntu.com/~fabbione/linux-image-2.6.12-8-686_2.6.12-8.13_i386.deb
[12:17] <fabbione> it's totally untested.. it builds...
[12:18] <sabdfl> fabbione: oops. seems like my home machine has locked, will try the package when I get home
[12:18] <daniels> if I were to compile a list of really terrible failure modes for installing kernels, I'd probably put 'trashing /lib/modules' somewhere near the top
[12:18] <fabbione> sabdfl: ok thanks
[12:19] <dholbach> infinity: at least: totem, gnome-bluetooth, udev
[12:19] <\sh> infinity: ace should be removed from frozenapps libs list...
[12:19] <dholbach> infinity: (on powerpc)
[12:19] <seb128> dholbach: what about totem? libtool issue too?
[12:20] <dholbach> seb128: yep
[12:21] <seb128> k
[12:23] <Mithrandir> elmo: please sync blender
[12:23] <Mithrandir> elmo: please sync sgml2x
[12:24] <infinity> \sh : Can't unfreeze it until it's built everywhere.
[12:25] <\sh> infinity: aye...so bmonty has to fix it...i don't touch it 
[12:26] <infinity> \sh : Looks like it's missing a -fPIC
[12:26] <daniels> oh wait, I see, it's just trashed my initrd.
[12:26] <pitti> brb
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[12:37] <seb128> ogra: putting exagerated values don't fix bugs
[12:37] <seb128> s/values/bugzilla settings/
[12:37] <ogra> seb128, nope, but notifys them as important
[12:37] <seb128> nop
[12:37] <seb128> use the right settings if you want to do this
[12:38] <seb128> anyway that's not a gamin issue for pretty sure
[12:38] <infinity> fabbione : I'll let you know in a couple of days if this patch is helping (I think my record uptime for this machine is just over a day, so 2 or 3 should be enough to know if it's helped)
[12:38] <ogra> seb128, so which would have been the right setting ? i cant releases edubuntu with a randomly dissapearing menu...
[12:38] <\sh> seb128: u mean this directory scanning?
[12:38] <seb128> no reason it works fine on a folder and not on an another one. That's probably an app not putting the same monitors
[12:38] <fabbione> infinity: ok thanks
[12:38] <seb128> \sh: http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=15239
[12:39] <seb128> ogra: the settings are no edubuntu specific, this is not a big issue for Ubuntu
[12:39] <ogra> seb128, its affecting *all* kde apps in the gnome menu apparently... i dont think its a singel app
[12:39] <\sh> seb128: yes...it happens with ubuntu and with kde apps who are installing .desktop files in kde
[12:39] <\sh> seb128: after loggin in, it's all there..and after a randomly time it
[12:40] <\sh> 's disappearin
[12:40] <seb128> ogra: who spoke about a single app?
[12:40] <seb128> \sh: somebody who has the issue will have to debug it
[12:40] <\sh> seb128: how
[12:40] <ogra> <seb128> no reason it works fine on a folder and not on an another one. That's probably an app not putting the same monitors
[12:40] <desrt> pitti; ping
[12:40] <ogra> seb128, you
[12:40] <seb128> ogra: read it again, the app beeing gnome-menus or gnome-panel
[12:40] <koke> hey, I'm testing colony-4 in a dell inspiron 1200 and installer is frozen :(
[12:41] <seb128> ogra: apps just put a .desktop files, they don't monitor anything
[12:41] <koke> in partman step I guess
[12:41] <ogra> seb128, yup
[12:41] <seb128> ogra: so don't say it's not a single app, it is
[12:41] <seb128> either gnomevfs, or gnome-menus or gnome-panel
[12:41] <ogra> ok
[12:41] <Kamion> ogra: yes?
[12:42] <seb128> \sh: good question, the gamin website an a "how to debug page", that's a good start
[12:42] <ogra> Kamion, would it be possible to set ClientAliveInterval in sshd by default...
[12:42] <\sh> seb128: ok....will have a look
[12:42] <seb128> thanks
[12:43] <ogra> Kamion, i have many reports about timeout issues with sshd/ltsp.... the session persists for 30 seconds after a client logs out
[12:43] <Kamion> ogra: no, I'd rather not make that sort of behaviour change from upstream
[12:43] <seb128> \sh: at least try to get a way to get the menu entries changing .. because "log and wait 5 hours" is not going to work to debug
[12:43] <Kamion> ogra: so have ltsp run sshd -o 'ClientAliveInterval whatever'
[12:43] <ogra> Kamion, ah, yes.... thanks... i'll talk to mdz about that ...
[12:44] <\sh> seb128: if i touch a desktop file under kde/ it's coming back (only this app with the touched desktop file) but I will provide some logs
[12:44] <seb128> \sh: but any way to get this masked from the menu?
[12:44] <Mithrandir> elmo: please sync gnome-vfs (universe)
[12:46] <\sh> seb128: u mean that the kde menus/kde apps or whatever is in subdirs to disappear? no..it just happens
[12:46] <seb128> yeah
[12:46] <\sh> and strangewise sometimes it's coming back
[12:46] <seb128> because "it just happens", sometimes
[12:46] <seb128> is not something you want to debug :)
[12:46] <seb128> if you can't trigger the bug to work on it ...
[12:46] <ogra> my edu menu just appeared again after it was gone for the whole morning ...
[12:47] <\sh> seb128: lets check...I will debug this first and see how i can trigger it
[12:47] <ogra> its totally unintentional
[12:53] <doko> Kamion: ok to sync openjade from unstable to fix FTBFS?
[12:55] <Kamion> doko: yes
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[12:56] <reinouts> Kamion: ping
[12:57] <Kamion> reinouts: yes
[12:57] <Kamion> ?
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[01:00] <pitti> infinity: bah, looking at today's buildd list, powerpc failures seem to be much worse than on other days - particularly bad day for royal?
[01:01] <reinouts> Kamion: I was told to talk to you about debian-installer translations
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[01:01] <Diziet> OK, I give up.  Anyone here know anything about how Java is supposed to work in our Firefox ?
[01:01] <reinouts> Kamion: the Dutch GNOME live cd is based on breezy but shows some mixed language messages during boot
[01:01] <reinouts> do you know where I can contribute the missing translations?
[01:03] <pitti> Diziet: the Sun plugin doesn't work?
[01:07] <ogra> Diziet, worksforme with the blackdown packages from multiverse
[01:08] <Diziet> ogra: Is that (multiverse's) the correct answer ?  Because atm firefox seems to invite the user to faff about with its plugin finder, which fails, and that seems to lead to the `do it manually' route.
[01:09] <ogra> Diziet, it does that since we got it... disabling the plugin finder would be the right way i guess
[01:10] <ogra> many users might be hit by that confusion
[01:10] <Diziet> Hmm.  I don't think I know how to do that but I may be able to find out :-).
[01:10] <Diziet> The plugin finder has to keep working for Flash support.
[01:11] <ogra> why ? we offer flash in multiverse too... probably replacing the plugin finder with a option to start synaptic and a hint what/how to install would be right
[01:12] <infinity> pitti : I'm not really sure, TBH.
[01:12] <ogra> but thats very intrusive indeed... and i doubt its abreezy feature
[01:12] <infinity> pitti : I'll have to look more deeply tomorrow.
[01:12] <Diziet> Oh.  Um, hmm.  I think there are some deeper policy questions here.
[01:12] <Diziet> Like how much we want to automatically advertise multiverse.
[01:13] <ogra> yup, that too
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[01:25] <slomo> seb128: i have a bug with patch for you in gst-plugins ;) http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=315144
[01:25] <seb128> slomo: thanks
[01:31] <Kamion> reinouts: depends which ones are missing
[01:33] <Diziet> kamion: Can you sort out my mozilla-firefox package ?  It needs to be in main.
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[01:34] <mvo> Kamion: can you think of any reason to keep "readahead" in universe now that we have readahead-list (in main)? it breaks upgrading right now (see #14842)
[01:34] <infinity> Diziet : Then it needs to be seeded.
[01:35] <Diziet> inf: Yes.
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[01:39] <reinouts> Kamion: for instance 'Loading additional components" and "Preparing for live session"
[01:39] <jbailey> dilinger: pong
[01:41] <mjg59> Keybuk: hotkey-setup is currently being synced from Debian - I'd prefer to upload there first if possible, rather than getting confused about which version I'm looking at
[01:42] <slomo> seems like the ppc buildds are broken... so much stuff fails there without a good reason...
[01:43] <Keybuk> mjg59: yah, I kinda bodged the version number on that one
[01:43] <Kamion> Diziet: you might as well get practice editing seeds; see http://wiki.ubuntu.com/SeedManagement, and add it to the "Transitional packages" / "Upgrades from Hoary" section
[01:43] <mjg59> Keybuk: Just a touch :)
[01:43] <mjg59> Keybuk: What changes did you make?
[01:43] <Kamion> mvo: probably not, although removals are generally an elmo thing
[01:43] <Keybuk> mjg59: default) in a case only matches "default"
[01:43] <Keybuk> mjg59: you mean *)
[01:44] <Kamion> reinouts: "Loading additional components" is a string from Debian, but is currently fuzzy:
[01:44] <Kamion> #, fuzzy
[01:44] <Kamion> msgid "Loading additional components"
[01:44] <Kamion> msgstr "Installatiemodules van Internet ophalen"
[01:44] <Kamion> reinouts: please contact Bart Cornelis <cobaco@linux.be> about that one
[01:45] <mjg59> Keybuk: Ah
[01:45] <mjg59> Yes
[01:45] <Kamion> reinouts: send a translation of "Preparing for live session" (and indeed the rest of the casper source package) to me
[01:45] <reinouts> Kamion: where can I retrieve the nl.po from?
[01:45] <Kamion> reinouts: anna
[01:46] <tepsipakki> any talks about when the next version on U. is released with 5/3yrs of support (after 6.04, that is)
[01:46] <reinouts> anna?
[01:46] <Kamion> reinouts: source package
[01:46] <Kamion> reinouts: er, hang on, sorry
[01:46] <Kamion> reinouts: the nl.po for which string?
[01:46] <Treenaks> tepsipakki: probably before those years expire, I guess
[01:46] <reinouts> sorry I'm not very familiar with debian
[01:46] <reinouts> Kamion: the nl.po for the installer messages I just gave
[01:47] <Treenaks> reinouts: the installer is all kinds of different parts, you need to figure out which part this is, and get the .po from there (I guess?)
[01:47] <tepsipakki> treenask: hopefully, yes ;)
[01:47] <Kamion> reinouts: the first one you mentioned is in the anna source package; the second is in the casper source package
[01:47] <Kamion> reinouts: 'apt-get source casper'
[01:47] <reinouts> great :-s
[01:47] <Kamion> reinouts: but as I say, for the first one please contact Bart Cornelis about getting that unfuzzied
[01:48] <reinouts> Kamion: ok
[01:52] <pitti> infinity: http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/buildlogs/ shows a whole lot of ppc ftbfs, can you please g-b them?
[01:54] <reinouts> Treenaks: do you know what /etc/apt/sources.list should contain for 'apt-get source casper' to work?
[01:54] <slomo> pitti: for me it looks like something broken there... they fail for no good reason ;)
[01:55] <pitti> slomo: ppc buildd has always segfaulted randomly, but today it's particularly bad
[01:55] <seb128> slomo: does it have any noticable effect on an Ubuntu app?
[01:55] <slomo> pitti: ok...
[01:55] <seb128> slomo: the gst-plugins0.8 patch
[01:55] <slomo> seb128: yes... tseng can't rip his cds with banshee ;)
[01:56] <slomo> seb128: (me neither ;) )
[01:56] <seb128> ah, banshee
[01:56] <seb128> will try it
[01:56] <seb128> I'll uploaded a patched package though
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[01:56] <infinity> pitti : Feh, I think it must be something with royal.  Don't see those failures on adare and ross (do you?)..
[01:56] <pitti> infinity: I didn't check that closely
[01:56] <infinity> pitti : I'll shut down the buildd on royal and give-back everything it's registered as building in a bit.
[01:56] <seb128> slomo: are you sure it doesn't break anything? Upstream have not used the patch (yet)
[01:56] <infinity> Then figure out WTF later.
[01:56] <pitti> infinity: that would be nice, thanks
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[01:57] <pitti> infinity: maybe bad memory?
[01:57] <infinity> Who knows.
[01:57] <infinity> Don't have the time to look at it right now, but I'll play later and alert elmo.
[01:57] <slomo> seb128: no idea... what applications use the cdparanoia plugin? soundjuicer? but novell has applied this patch for suse so it should be ok imho... but i'll test later and tell you then :)
[01:58] <seb128> slomo: let's wait for bugs due to the upload :p
[01:58] <seb128> slomo: yep, sj by example
[01:58] <slomo> seb128: hehe... you can point them all to me then ;P
[01:59] <seb128> cf upstream bug
[01:59] <seb128> "Please confirm that this doesn't break gnome-cd, sound-juicer or totem. "
[01:59] <seb128> according to the novell guy it's fine
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[02:00] <slomo> seb128: yes... and abock can be trusted normally ;) i know him a bit from packaging banshee :) but i'll test it anyway later
[02:00] <seb128> k
=== seb128 tries banshee
[02:01] <seb128> the UI looks like rhythmbox
[02:01] <jdub> banshee looks like it will shape up nicely after a bit of work
[02:01] <seb128> expected than the columns suck
[02:01] <seb128> jdub: what's better than rb?
[02:01] <jdub> amarok
[02:01] <seb128> jdub: no, what banshee has over rb
[02:02] <seb128> what part is better than rb ones :)
[02:02] <jdub> (despite the usual widget overload)
[02:02] <jdub> oh
[02:02] <jdub> the license ;)
[02:02] <jdub> it seems more responsive
[02:02] <slomo> is more stable for me
[02:02] <jdub> has a nice loading status bar
[02:02] <slomo> at least when importing music it doesn't crash ;)
[02:02] <seb128> what is the issue with rb license? it's GPL, no?
[02:02] <jdub> makes startup rescanning more clear
[02:02] <jdub> seb128: GPL + mp3 == DOOOOOM
[02:02] <jdub> (section 7)
[02:03] <seb128> oh, but rb is only a frontend
[02:03] <seb128> it has no mp3 playing part
[02:03] <seb128> is that an issue?
[02:03] <seb128> I mean gst is doing the work
[02:03] <Treenaks> slomo: does it handle 14000 oggs nicely? :)
[02:03] <jdub> rb -> gstreamer -> mp3 == same process
[02:04] <slomo> Treenaks: for me it does :)
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[02:04] <jdub> slomo: (heh, very precise answer!)
[02:04] <reinouts> Treenaks: do you know what /etc/apt/sources.list should contain for 'apt-get source casper' to work?
[02:05] <\sh> reinouts: deb-src http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu breezy main restricted universe multiverse
[02:05] <\sh> reinouts: it covers all source package sources of ubuntu
[02:05] <seb128> jdub: anyway all that seems to be details to me (the status bar and the rescanning), not a reason to redo rb ... that's seems to be only "let's do it with C#" novell policy
[02:06] <jdub> seb128: well, no, this was very much about the license
[02:06] <reinouts> \sh, tnx
[02:06] <seb128> jdub: rb has music sharing with zeroconf, etc now
[02:06] <slomo> seb128: banshee will get it in some weeks too ;)
[02:06] <jdub> seb128: and rhythmbox never had a sole copyright holder, so it's too hard to manage relicensing
[02:06] <seb128> slomo: what a waste
[02:06] <seb128> jdub: you "just" have to mail contributors
[02:06] <slomo> seb128: they're already working on daap support... but as a general library for CLI
[02:06] <jdub> seb128: and get their permission
[02:07] <seb128> jdub: yeah, but imho that would not have been an issue
[02:07] <seb128> slomo: still a waste imho, we have 2 apps doing the same thing now
[02:08] <seb128> anyway, seems novell guys are going to rewritting anything they can using C# just to use it :)
[02:09] <slomo> seb128: maybe... let's see which one will be the better in maybe a year ;) but i think a general daap library is useful... and that also provided us with avahi bindings for CLI ;)
[02:09] <hunger> seb128: .. and drag yet another runtime environemnt onto the system...
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[02:09] <slomo> seb128: as long as they don't rewrite whole gnome in c# it's fine for me ;)
[02:09] <hunger> seb128: As if KDE Gnome and java were not enough already.
[02:09] <seb128> slomo: that's not a matter to which one will be better, but if they worked together instead of duplicating ...
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[02:10] <\sh> ok..bittorent uploaded to fix bittorrent-gui
[02:10] <slomo> \sh: good work :) i already wanted to poke you for that ;)
[02:11] <\sh> slomo: well...it took some time for pbuilder creation here on this portege
[02:11] <hunger> What is NetworkManager-named.conf doing in / ?
[02:11] <hunger> j^: Any idea?
[02:13] <hunger> j^: /NetworkManager-named.conf is not part of the deb... maybe I broke something again.
=== sivang wonders if ubuntu-desktop is sufficient to get a running XOrg + GNOME running..
[02:14] <Treenaks> sivang: more than enough
[02:14] <sivang> Treenaks: what about a trim sized installation, with only a lightweight window manager?
[02:15] <Treenaks> sivang: xfce you mean?
[02:15] <Treenaks> sivang: instead of gnome?
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[02:16] <sivang> Treenaks: suppose so, yes
[02:17] <pitti> infinity: I give-back the security build for ppc myself
[02:19] <seb128> pitti: you have buildd powers now? 
[02:19] <pitti> seb128: not really, I can only give-back (but I'm only supposed to do that for security uploads)
[02:19] <seb128> k, it's noted :p
[02:24] <sivang> seb128: what about my gnome-applets lpi love? moved to breezy +1 ? ;-)
[02:25] <seb128> I've not got any mail with a patch nor bugzilla 
[02:26] <sivang> seb128: I sent you a link in IRC a week ago, and you said you'd care for it after preview freeze..in any case, it's here : http://muse.19inch.net/~sivan/lpint/gnome-applets/ let me know if it's upload worthy
[02:28] <seb128> sivang: yeah, but I've a lot to do, so a msg on IRC get quickly out of the scope
[02:28] <seb128> thanks anyway
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[02:31] <pkern> jbailey: ping
[02:33] <sivang> seb128: np, just let me know if it's in so I'll be responsive to bugs :)
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[02:40] <jbailey> pkern: Pong
[02:41] <pkern> jbailey: It just doesn't drop to init, right. It loads the ramdisk (when the additional ramdisk_size parameter is specified), but then it still checks for another root fs. ):
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[02:42] <pkern> jbailey: I just don't get this problem. Even if I call init manually by setting root=/dev/ram0 init=/init it tells me "attempt to kill init" and bails out.
[02:42] <Treenaks> Where are translations launchpad-integration stored? not in rosetta :(
[02:42] <seb128> Treenaks: source package
[02:42] <jbailey> pkern: And you're also on an ibook, yes?
[02:42] <pkern> jbailey: Yep.
[02:42] <Treenaks> seb128: hm, ok.. that means lots of translators will miss it
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[02:43] <Treenaks> seb128: starting translations
[02:43] <pkern> jbailey: iBook G4 1,2GHz (so new style iBooks), and xfs as root filesystem
[02:43] <pkern> jbailey: 2.6.10 of warty works nicely but the upgrade to 2.6.12 broke it.
[02:43] <slomo> jbailey: i have a ibook g4 1ghz with xfs as root fs ;)
[02:43] <seb128> Treenaks: yeah, kick rosetta guys
[02:44] <pkern> jbailey: It didn't even work with a cramfs image instead. I just repacked it for cramfs, it loaded successfully but didn't use the ramdisk to do early userspace work.
[02:44] <jbailey> Either of you two willing to wipe out your partition and try an install on ext3?
[02:44] <jbailey> I'm curious if yaboot is doing something to the image when it's loading it off of a new xfs or something.
[02:45] <jdub> interesting, distrowatch give props to mandriva for boot times
[02:45] <jbailey> I'm still hping benc can prove what it's doing, though.
[02:45] <jdub> daniels: heard of any visual corruption on ati 128 + powerpc?
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[02:47] <slomo> pkern: can you try on ext3?
[02:48] <pkern> slomo: Bah, loading of all those debs just again. Perhaps if it's possible to install it with the hoary install cd. But not in the next days, though.
[02:48] <daniels> jdub: not really
[02:49] <slomo> pkern: me neither in the next days :(
[02:49] <pkern> slomo: Considering that Gnome 2.12 didn't work nicely with my previous home directory it's ok.
[02:49] <pkern> slomo: But school has started today. (=
[02:50] <slomo> pkern: hehe... but hey, it's just school ;) i have to learn for 3 exams the next days... :(
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[02:51] <pkern> slomo: But it's the last year... (o:
[02:53] <seb128> pkern: what was wrong with GNOME 2.12?
[02:55] <pkern> seb128: Most icons disappeared.
[02:56] <seb128> change your icon theme
[02:56] <seb128> you were probably using clearlooks
[02:56] <seb128> and upstream droped the icon theme when they moved it to GNOME
[02:59] <pkern> seb128: Ok, thanks.
[03:00] <seb128> np
[03:00] <pkern> seb128: Couldn't it default to an icon theme when the chosen one is not available?
[03:00] <seb128> it does, it default to GNOME
[03:00] <seb128> but seems that when there is no action it doesn't try to update the icon theme
[03:00] <seb128> that would require some debug
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[03:01] <jbailey> slomo, pkern: No worries - let's see what Ben comes up with.
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=== pkern is hopefully
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[03:11] <Mithrandir> hmm, what's a useful resolution for bugs that don't affect us yet? :-P
[03:11] <mvo> Kamion: permission to upload http://people.ubuntu.com/~mvo/python-apt_0.6.13.1ubuntu1.debdiff? it's needed to make the locking on the various python-apt based apps consistent
[03:11] <seb128> mvo: we need approval for uploads?
[03:11] <Kamion> not if they're within feature freeze restrictions
[03:12] <seb128> right, thanks
[03:12] <Kamion> adding locking support sounds more like a bug fix than a feature to me :-)
[03:12] <Kamion> (so go ahead)
[03:12] <mvo> seb128: this change is not stricly a bugfix, but it's needed to fix other bugs :)
[03:13] <mvo> Kamion: right, thanks 
[03:13] <Kamion> elmo: please sync man-db 2.4.3-2
[03:14] <Riddell> chmj: I'm going to remove bluez-utils depends on bluez-pin if that's OK
[03:21] <Riddell> chmj: and shouldn't bluez-pin depend on bluez-utils?
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[03:24] <Nafallo> Riddell: spammer! ;-)
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[03:25] <Riddell> hay, I can't help it if KDE is so multi-lingual
[03:26] <Diziet> Urgh.  What could be worse than dpatch ?  cdbs.  They're using it for grep.
[03:26] <xerxas> hi
[03:26] <xerxas> is there anyone concerned by the ubuntu-desktop package ?
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[03:27] <xerxas> it depends on python-musicbrainz which depends on python2.4-musicbrainz 
[03:27] <xerxas> which I think don't provide any desktop stuff 
[03:27] <xerxas> xerxas but a python module not used by any software 
[03:27] <Riddell> elmo: could you sync ttf-dejavu from debian?
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[03:29] <bob2> yes, ubuntu installs lots of random python modules by default
[03:29] <tseng> pitti: is there an rss feed for USN?
[03:30] <Kamion> xerxas: that was an explicit request from Mark, if I remember correctly
[03:30] <Kamion> sabdfl: ^--
[03:30] <xerxas> bob2, it's ok to have pyhon modules if they're used 
[03:30] <bob2> you should have seen the original list then
[03:31] <xerxas> Kamion,  and so ? 
[03:31] <xerxas> we can't remove it ? 
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[03:31] <xerxas> it usefull ? 
[03:31] <bddebian> Hello
[03:31] <jdub> xerxas: ubuntu is the ultimate python platform - we put in a lot of useful (and a few less useful) python modules so that lots of python software will work out of the box
[03:31] <Kamion> xerxas: when the boss explicitly asks for something, one doesn't remove it without asking him first. :-)
[03:32] <xerxas> jdub,  picard isn't working with these packages 
[03:32] <xerxas> I didn't find any apt software which uses these packages 
[03:32] <xerxas> and I needed to recompile new version to make picard (the NG tagger) work 
[03:32] <Kamion> it's not for other packaged software, it's for use by users
[03:32] <xerxas> Maybe I should try to make new packaages 
[03:32] <Kamion> if it were for other packaged software, it wouldn't need to be explicitly mentioned in desktop ...
[03:33] <xerxas> Kamion, it's not usable by users, or am I wrong ? 
[03:33] <Kamion> xerxas: are you saying that python-musicbrainz is broken in itself?
[03:33] <Nafallo> xerxas: well, we _are_ in upstream version freeze and will release in a month...
[03:33] <Nafallo> xerxas: try an older version of picard?
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[03:34] <xerxas> Nafallo, you made picard work with current packages ? 
[03:34] <Nafallo> xerxas: I don't use picard. that was a suggestion.
[03:35] <chmj> Riddell: thats ok 
[03:35] <xerxas> Nafallo, ok ok 
[03:35] <chmj> Riddell: bluez-pin doesn't depend on bluez-utils, its the other way around 
[03:35] <xerxas> tahnks 
[03:35] <xerxas> thanks 
[03:36] <tseng> jdub: dude.
[03:37] <tseng> jdub: i reckon the USN rss feed from p.u.c/news is too large to be very useful
[03:37] <tseng> jdub: is that your baby?
[03:37] <jdub> sort of
[03:37] <jdub> it's meant to be news
[03:37] <jdub> but thanks to plone, it's mega-USN instead ;)
[03:38] <tseng> what i mean is ubuntu.com/usn/search_rss?blahblah
[03:38] <tseng> i guess i can narrow it down
[03:38] <tseng> to 10 or so
[03:38] <tseng> is there a magic keyword for that?
[03:38] <jdub> oh, that's a planet thing
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[03:39] <jdub> hrm, there should only be 10 max in the news output
[03:39] <tseng> not on the usn feed
[03:39] <tseng> its like every one ever
[03:40] <jdub> right, direct from plone maybe
[03:40] <jdub> in which case, i have *no* idea ;)
[03:40] <tseng> http://www.ubuntu.com/usn/search_rss?review_state=published&sort_on=effective&sort_order=reverse&limit=10
[03:40] <tseng> limit is not the magic word :)
[03:41] <tseng> too bad ajmitch turned in for the day, he smokes from the plone bong
[03:42] <bddebian> heh
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[03:46] <Nafallo> is there a reason we don't have sbackup in ubuntu?
[03:46] <Nafallo> IIRC that was one of the Google SoCs for us?
[03:47] <ogra> Nafallo, it was dropped afaik... 
[03:48] <Nafallo> ogra: packages.debian.org/sbackup, doesn't look dropped
[03:48] <mjg59> Unfrgiven: Have you filed a bug about your sleep issue?
[03:49] <ogra> Nafallo, but that doesnt look like a ubuntu SoC :)
[03:49] <Nafallo> mjg59: you want any bugs for TargaVisionary811 ?
[03:49] <ogra> Nafallo, since its in debian, but not ubuntu...
[03:49] <Nafallo> ogra: I'll try to find the SoC-page then :-P
[03:50] <ogra> Nafallo, but if it works it'd be cool to have it synced .... at least in universe
[03:50] <mjg59> Nafallo: If stuff doesn't work, then please file bugs (after checking it's no a duplicate)
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[03:51] <Nafallo> mjg59: oki, will do then.
[03:51] <Nafallo> ogra: I'm about to build it ;-)
[03:52] <ogra> great :)
[03:52] <Nafallo> ogra: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SimpleBackupSolution
[03:53] <ogra> Nafallo, i know the SoC page.. i was very much after having it in main and was quite disappointed the SoC student stepped back...
[03:54] <wickedpuppy> hi anyone knows how to sign packages  with dpkg-buildpackages ?? i got  no secret key error
[03:54] <wickedpuppy> i mean how to import key
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[03:54] <bddebian> wickedpuppy: Do you have a key? :-)
[03:54] <jbailey> mjg59: ping re: the usplash pluggable image stuff?
[03:54] <bob2> wickedpuppy: presumably you're not actually going to get Riddell's secret key
[03:55] <bob2> wickedpuppy: run it with -uc -us
[03:55] <mjg59> jbailey: Mm? I replied to you in the other window
[03:55] <seb128> daniels: around?
[03:55] <jbailey> mjg59: Eh?  Which one?
[03:56] <daniels> seb128: yeah?
[03:56] <mjg59> jbailey: You /msged me 15 minutes ago
[03:56] <mjg59> And then I never heard anything back :)
[03:56] <wickedpuppy> thanks guys ... btw the file i need is .dsc file ?
[03:56] <bob2> wickedpuppy: what are you trying to do with it?
[03:56] <bddebian> Heya jb
[03:56] <bddebian> Err jbailey
[03:57] <wickedpuppy> build it
[03:57] <bob2> wickedpuppy: then you presumably want the .debs
[03:57] <jbailey> Right, haven't seen a reply.
[03:57] <jbailey> Are you being beaten with the freenode not-identified stick?
[03:57] <mjg59> jbailey: Oh, probably. Christ.
[03:57] <mjg59> Indeed I am. 
[03:58] <ogra> brb
[03:58] <wickedpuppy> ah but my boss ask me to get the source :P
[03:58] <mjg59> Oh dear. IRC has got less useful.
[03:58] <wickedpuppy> clearly i also wants the source
[03:59] <jbailey> I need to lookup the instructions on how to disable that for my userid again.
[03:59] <bob2> s/IRC/Feenode/
[03:59] <bob2> wickedpuppy: this is not development, #ubuntu
[03:59] <Treenaks> bob2: Feenode, you _have_ to pay now?
[04:02] <pkern> jbailey: /msg nickserv set unfiltered on
[04:04] <jbailey> pkern: Thanks.  Is that permanent?
[04:04] <pkern> jbailey: IIRC yes.
[04:04] <jbailey> Cool.
[04:04] <Kamion> Treenaks: that nickname is almost as old as the network name
[04:05] <Treenaks> Kamion: yeah, since the OpenProjects crap/OFTC split days right?
[04:05] <pkern> Treenaks: Sure, please place your donation in the box over there.
[04:05] <Treenaks> pkern: you sound an awful lot like lilo
[04:05] <pkern> Haha.
[04:05] <pkern> (:
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[04:09] <sabdfl> xerxas: we try to have all useful, and a few more obscure, python modules instantly available
[04:09] <sabdfl> if there's a better module that does the same thing, then we should discuss replacing the current one with that new one
[04:09] <Treenaks> hm, mdke's announcement broke the launchpad?
[04:09] <bob2> they're looking at it
[04:09] <sabdfl> otherwise, i don't mind the extra space in order to live up to the statement that install ubuntu; python will get you what you want
[04:10] <sabdfl> xerxas: since the module is not a dependency of anything else, we would probably be open to an upload of a newer version if it's known to fix issues and considered good by its upstream
[04:10] <sabdfl> xerxas: ack
[04:10] <Nafallo> sabdfl: I think there was a new upstream of the version we got, and the package didn't work with the "old" version.
[04:11] <slomo> Nafallo: the other way around... the old version we have doesn't work with some software afaik
[04:11] <slomo> Nafallo: picard for example
[04:11] <Nafallo> slomo: with some _new_ software ;-)
[04:11] <xerxas> sabdfl,  ack 
[04:11] <xerxas> :)
[04:11] <Nafallo> slomo: I adviced him to try an older version :-)
[04:11] <Nafallo> xerxas: did the older version work?
[04:11] <xerxas> there is some API change in the tunepimp
[04:12] <xerxas> Nafallo, didn't tried yet 
[04:12] <slomo> Nafallo: ok... so i will get back fixing haskell stuff =)
[04:12] <xerxas> will try this evening 
[04:12] <xerxas> gotta go
[04:12] <Nafallo> oki
[04:18] <bddebian> infinity: ping?
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[04:33] <infinity> bddebian : Pong.
[04:34] <maswan> up to a bit over 100Mbit/s of 5.10 preview i386 install iso today too
[04:35] <bddebian> infinity: Please forgive me if this is another dumb question but I uploaded a new version of addresses-for-gnustep, it built on all archs and shows Installed by xxx, but it isn't in the archive.  Where do I look?
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[04:38] <Riddell> mdz: can I upload kdeaddons and kdeartwork 3.4.2?
[04:39] <infinity> bddebian : Uhm, http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/a/addresses-for-gnustep/
[04:39] <infinity> bddebian : That matches the same version as wanna-build claims is installed.
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[04:40] <bddebian> Weird, it doesn't show with apt-get install or apt-cache policy, but does in apt-cache madison.. Hmm
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[04:41] <bddebian> Riddell: I'm still waiting for libdebtags1 but you should have most of your 1.4 stuff now. :-)
[04:44] <pkern> How often is dinstall run for Ubuntu?
[04:44] <daniels> pkern: every half hour
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[04:44] <pkern> daniels: Thanks.
[04:44] <bddebian> infinity: OK, thx, sorry to bother you.
[04:45] <bddebian> elmo: You around?
[04:45] <pkern> daniels: Together with a mirror pulse?
[04:46] <Riddell> bddebian: do you know what the status of libdebtags1 is?
[04:46] <bddebian> Riddell: Sitting in NEW.  Waiting for elmo to OK, I think.
[04:46] <infinity> bddebian : Nope, it's installed.
[04:47] <bddebian> infinity: libdebtags1 is?
[04:47] <infinity> Yes.
[04:47] <Riddell> bddebian: I just uploaded a debtags snapshot which compiles with the libapt-front version
[04:47] <bddebian> Hmm, since when?
[04:47] <infinity> <shrug>... Didn't check the timestamp on the state change, but it's installed.
[04:48] <dholbach> Riddell: i saw a package that was had a wrong/missing builddep libapt-*front*-dev
[04:48] <dholbach> Riddell: dunno which it was
[04:48] <bddebian> Riddell: Looks like I have to fix debtags though
[04:48] <dholbach> but it failed today
[04:49] <daniels> pkern: don't know about the pulses
[04:49] <pkern> daniels: Ok, thanks. (o:
[04:49] <Riddell> bddebian: why do you have to fix it?
[04:50] <bddebian> Riddell: The sync ftbfs'd
[04:50] <Riddell> bddebian: it's missing libapt-front, which is in NEW
[04:51] <mjg59> Keybuk: What codec does alsamixer claim you have?
[04:51] <Riddell> dholbach: any idea where you saw it?
[04:51] <bddebian> dholbach: Oh, that's debtags :-)
[04:52] <slomo> elmo: please remove haskell-cabal from the archives... it is now provided by ghc6 and doesn't work anyway
[04:52] <bddebian> universe/admin/debtags_1.4+svn20050912-0ubuntu1: Dep-Wait by buildd+terranova [optional:out-of-date] 
[04:52] <bddebian>   Dependencies: libapt-front-dev
[04:52] <bddebian> Where did the svn20050912 version of debtags come from?
[04:52] <slomo> elmo: and it breaks some stuff because of not working :(
[04:52] <Riddell> bddebian: I just uploaded it
[04:54] <Keybuk> mjg59: how do I ask it?
[04:54] <mjg59> Keybuk: Run it
[04:54] <mjg59> It'll print it in the information at the top
[04:54] <Keybuk> mjg59: Card: ALI 5451, Chip: Analog Devices AD1981B
[04:54] <mjg59> Ok, rock
[04:54] <mjg59> That makes life nice and easy
[04:54] <Keybuk> oh?
[04:55] <mjg59> Same codec as the Intel ones
[04:55] <Keybuk> right
[04:55] <mjg59> So I just need to add a load of entries to set the quirks up properly
[04:55] <Diziet> keybuk: This dpkg conffiles patch.  Should we (well, I) upload it into breezy now ?
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[05:14] <linuxsbartley> Trying to setup a 5.10beta server installation w/ xdm and xfce.  5.04 worked fine.  5.10beta hangs if I install xdm.  When I start the xdm session, I get a black screen with nothing.  Never get a gui login.
[05:15] <linuxsbartley> 5.04 I get gui login and when logged in, get an xfce desktop as intended.
[05:15] <pkern> linuxsbartley: Does X work on the box?
[05:15] <linuxsbartley> I have to uninstall xdm from the 5.10 to get xfce to work again.
[05:15] <pkern> linuxsbartley: If not please try dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg
[05:16] <linuxsbartley> pkern, tried that.  no good.
[05:16] <linuxsbartley> Uninstalled xdm and then X started working again.
[05:16] <pkern> linuxsbartley: Do you get X but no xfce when you authed against xdm? 
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[05:16] <linuxsbartley> nope
[05:16] <linuxsbartley> just a black screen
[05:16] <linuxsbartley> never get auth screen
[05:17] <linuxsbartley> w/out xdm installed, can do startxfce4 and it comes up fine.  As soon as I install and start xdm, it breaks x
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[05:18] <eruin> heh, xorg-62 five minutes ago, now -63 ;)
[05:18] <linuxsbartley> eruin, will try it again then.
[05:18] <linuxsbartley> my install was from yesterday.
[05:19] <daniels> eh, -62 came sages ago
[05:19] <bddebian> Riddell: Just out of curiousity, what does the svn stuff buy us?
[05:19] <daniels> s/sages/ages/
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=== pitti looks at http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/buildlogs/ and curses the powerpc buildds
[05:20] <linuxsbartley> After server install, I installed the following: xorg-common, xserver-common, xserver-xorg-core, xserver-xorg, xutils, x-window-system-core, xfce4, synaptic & xdm.  Does this look ok?
[05:20] <eruin> daniels, weird. is #14383 ready too since you're in a frenzy?
[05:20] <daniels> no way in hell
[05:21] <eruin> haha :)
[05:21] <daniels> the only reason I'm uploading at 12am is because the embargo for the CAN ended at 1400 UTC, which is 0000 localtime
[05:21] <daniels> and it's a fairly critical fix, so I decided to stay around and up and push it as quickly as I could
[05:21] <daniels> but thanks for reminding me ;)
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[05:21] <eruin> somehow I just can't help but to love daniels
[05:22] <mdke>  [15:09:22]  < Treenaks> hm, mdke's announcement broke the launchpad?
[05:22] <mdke> eh?
[05:22] <mdke> what happened?
[05:23] <pitti> seb128: erm, the mail you replied to with your "use bz, dude" stanza explicitly referred to bz :-)
[05:23] <pitti> seb128: (of course I know that the mail was not really helpful)
[05:23] <seb128> pitti: the guy understand what I said, he put a comment on the pointed bug and got his reply here
[05:24] <pitti> seb128: hehe, good :-)
[05:24] <seb128> ;)
[05:25] <Riddell> bddebian: the svn stuff means it compiles with libapt-front 0.3
[05:26] <bddebian> pitti: I was told you are fixing pgadmin3.  Is that true?
[05:26] <Riddell> and that's the version of libapt-front we have so we kinday need the svn upload
[05:26] <bddebian> Riddell: Oh.. Heh :-)
[05:26] <pitti> bddebian: I already fixed it locally, it just needs a give-back on the buildds
[05:26] <pitti> bddebian: oh, thanks for the reminder
[05:26] <pitti> lamont-away, infinity: can you please give-back pgadmin3?
[05:26] <bddebian> pitti: NP, thank YOU.  You gonna look at pgaccess to or no?
[05:27] <pitti> bddebian: that's harder - nobody packaged libpgtcl for breezy
[05:27] <pitti> bddebian: when you intstall the hoary version, pgaccess installs and runs just fine
[05:27] <bddebian> pitti: Didn't pgadmin3 depend on libpgtcl too?
[05:27] <pitti> bddebian: no, pgadmin failed because of wxgtk 2.5 -> 2.6 transition
[05:28] <bddebian> Ohh
[05:28] <pitti> bddebian: btw, the DD of pgadmin3 contacted me today, I explained him the changes, he will fix Debian soon, too
[05:29] <bddebian> pitti: Great.  Sorry to keep bugging you but one more quick question.  postgresql-plruby.  Should it be redone for just postgre 8 or 7.5.8? And or just ruby1.8?  Or do you care? ;-) 
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[05:30] <pitti> bddebian: for Debian, it should be done for both 7.4 and 8.0 ideally; however, if you don't want to change the package too heavily, then 8.0 is certainly fine
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[05:31] <pitti> bddebian: hmm, I remember having answered an email about this recently...
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[05:33] <lamont-away> pitti: done
[05:33] <pitti> lamont-away: thanks
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[05:35] <bddebian> pitti: From me?
[05:36] <pitti> bddebian: I don't remember any more
[05:36] <bddebian> Hmm
[05:37] <bddebian> Maybe I should just stop bugging the shit out of everyone.. ;-)
[05:39] <pitti> bddebian: oh, that's fine, at least for me
[05:40] <pitti> bddebian: if you want to fix plruby, you might want to take a look at plr (I did the multi-version build for that)
[05:41] <bddebian> pitti: OK, awesome, thanks
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[05:49] <linuxsbartley> ok.  5.04 xdm worked.  Tried install of 5.10beta again w/ xdm and xfce.   Rebooted system.  Tries to launch xdm gui auth screen then goes away and drops me to Alt-F8 w/ last line "Starting X display manager: xdm"
[05:50] <linuxsbartley> Xorg.0.log shows many font renderer warnings and an error regarding font path unix/:7100 not init'd so it removed from list.
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[05:53] <sivang> does anybody know if people tagged as "supporter" in the ubuntu forums have any affiliation with canonical ?
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[05:56] <Kamion> sivang: it seems unlikely to me
[05:58] <tseng> sivang: it sounds more like they donate to the forum
[05:58] <tseng> sivang: freenode has a similar distinction
[05:58] <tseng> sivang: (pdpc.supporter hostmasks)
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[06:04] <sivang> tseng: ah right
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[06:19] <Kamion> mvo: the whole point of /etc/default/gdm was to avoid using /etc/environment, since there was a huge argument about using that file
[06:20] <Mithrandir> because /etc/environment should really have been named /etc/pam_environment or something like that.
[06:21] <seb128> Kamion: even upstream use /etc/environment
[06:22] <seb128> Kamion: we already had this discussion, nobody raised an objection for /etc/environment out of "it maybe change one day"
[06:22] <seb128> and it works better for the moment and that's what people expect
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[06:25] <lamont-away> Kamion: yaboot is ftbfs... - I think I'll go ahead and fix it..
[06:25] <lamont> (undeclared build-depends: gcc-3.3
[06:25] <Kamion> seb128: sigh
[06:26] <Kamion> I hope you got the syntax for /etc/environment right this time, anyway
[06:26] <_elmo> Mithrandir: /go ste
[06:26] <_elmo> meh
[06:26] <Kamion> nope, you didn't
[06:26] <seb128> Kamion: we got it wrong before? 
[06:26] <Kamion> ++  . /etc/environment
[06:26] <Kamion> /etc/environment is not a shell script
[06:26] <seb128> Kamion: mvo did the changes ... mvo? :)
[06:27] <Kamion> seb128: that's certainly a mistake I've seen in suggested patches for this before
[06:27] <seb128> ah, maybe, I've not really followed all the comments on the Debian bug
[06:28] <Mithrandir> seb128: use pam_getenv if you want to do that
[06:29] <Kamion> yeah, pam_getenv would be fine
[06:29] <jbailey> Sam hartmans wrote it exactly for that.
[06:29] <jbailey> Well, to solve the standoff between neuro and I. =)
[06:30] <seb128> mvo: these comments are for you :)
[06:30] <Kamion> pam_getenv has a -l option too which would be appropriate here
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[06:32] <Diziet> gs is is full of strcpy(foo,foo);
[06:33] <Kamion> hmm, pam_getenv seems buggy though
[06:34] <lamont> Kamion: elmo: yaboot has an undeclared build-dep gcc-3.3.... are we leaving 3.3 in main for breezy, or does yaboot need to shift to 3.4?
[06:34] <Kamion> lamont: leaving in main
[06:34] <lamont> ok.
[06:34] <Kamion> I don't want to mess with the compiler used for yaboot at the moment
[06:34] <lamont> -3ubuntu4 should upload sometime later today then, after jbailey finishes testing it for me...
[06:35] <lamont> Kamion: my thinking as well.
[06:35] <mvo> Kamion: thanks, that was my fault, looking at it now
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[06:36] <Kamion> pam_getenv> will fix
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[06:39] <Kamion> jbailey: I think he wrote it but never actually tried running it, or something; it doesn't even parse the proper syntax
[06:41] <Kamion> (it's parsing pam_env.conf style syntax)
[06:41] <jbailey> Kamion: Joy.
[06:41] <jbailey> Well, given that neuro refused to consider using it, despite having suggested it.
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[06:44] <dholbach> HAPPY BIRTHDAY TO YOU!
[06:44] <dholbach> HAPPY BIRTHDAY TO YOU!
[06:45] <dholbach> HAPPY BIRTHDAY DEAR SB
[06:45] <dholbach> HAPPY BIRTHDAY TO YOU! :)
[06:45] <bddebian> heh
=== dholbach hugs seb128  :)
[06:46] <HiddenWolf> Congratulations!
[06:46] <\sh> what? seb128 has birthday? 
[06:46] <sabdfl> seb128: congratulations!
[06:46] <\sh> happy birthday seb128 :) all the best :)
[06:46] <mvo> seb128: HAPPY BIRTHDAY
=== mvo gives a virtual present to seb128 
[06:47] <sivang> HAPPY BIRTHDAY seb128 !!!!!
=== jbailey sings: You're older than you've ever been, and now you're even older..
=== dholbach gives everybody a beer.
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=== jbailey hides
[06:47] <jbailey> =)
[06:47] <\sh> champagne for seb128 :)
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[06:47] <jbailey> seb128: Bonne aniversaire. =)
[06:47] <seb128> thanks everybody :)
[06:47] <sivang> jbailey: so good at stating the obvious which will be right for me as well, in 2 months :)
[06:47] <jbailey> sivang: It's a song by They Might Be Giants.
[06:47] <seb128> jbailey: "bon anniversaire" :)
[06:48] <sivang> jbailey: ah :)
[06:48] <jbailey> seb128: Right, the n is pronounced because of the liason.  Thanks. =)
[06:48] <seb128> THANK YOU dholbach, THANK YOU GUYS :)
[06:48] <seb128> jbailey: correct 
[06:49] <\sh> seb128: if I may ask: how old are u now? :)
[06:49] <lamont> hrm... can I upgrade warty-> breezy, or do I have to stop off at hoary first???
[06:49] <jbailey> lamont: Acc. to Keybuk you have to pass through Hoary.
[06:50] <seb128> \sh: one year less than next year :p
[06:50] <\sh> seb128: ok ,-)
[06:51] <lamont> k
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[06:51] <seb128> lamont: xfree to new xorg has issues it seems
[07:00] <sivang> seb128: what's your sign?
[07:03] <mdke> virgo
[07:03] <mdke> best sign
[07:03] <mdke> Kamion, around by any chance?
[07:04] <sivang> mdke: how do you know ? :)
[07:04] <mdke> mine was yesterday
[07:04] <infinity> lamont : Snapshot the system and try warty->breezy for kicks.  I'm curious.
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[07:05] <seb128> sivang: those are fixed, easy to know, just look on the calendar 
[07:06] <sivang> seb128: a right :) 
[07:06] <Kamion> mdke: yes
[07:06] <mdke> Kamion, just wondered if you had any idea on #14947, because I am about to do a system restore on that system out of desperation
[07:07] <Kamion> mdke: I'm sorry, I'm just about the worst person to attempt to handle Windows bugs
[07:08] <mdke> Kamion, if it's a windows bug then it should be closed. But it's been marked as a grub bug
[07:08] <Kamion> IIRC Windows CDs have some kind of fixboot option
[07:08] <Kamion> I mean bugs relating to Windows
[07:09] <mdke> ok I'm going to restore to factory settings. I'll see if I can reproduce it and otherwise close, but it would be worrying if that will happen to a lot of users when upgrading to Breezy
[07:09] <mdke> Kamion, could it be that there was a problem on the windows partition that didn't bother windows, but which might bother Grub?
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[07:10] <hughsie> desrt: ping
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[07:10] <desrt> hughsie; poke
[07:10] <hughsie> desrt: heh, hi.
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[07:10] <desrt> more hal goodness on the list, i think
[07:10] <hughsie> desrt: mind if i rework that patch you sent to hal-devel a little?
[07:10] <desrt> what did you have in mind?
[07:11] <hughsie> desrt: i'll email you - just stylistic changes, and the way you've done the while loop.
[07:11] <Kamion> mdke: I don't see why the entries should have been removed from your menu.lst file in the first place (update-grub normally doesn't touch them)
=== desrt imagined he might meet some resistance there :)
[07:11] <desrt> k.  send away.
[07:11] <Kamion> mdke: as for GRUB, I honestly have no idea
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[07:11] <mdke> Kamion, me neither :(
[07:11] <Kamion> mdke: you need a GRUB expert
[07:12] <Kamion> I only play one on TV occasionally
[07:12] <mdke> Kamion, reassign the bug to one?
[07:12] <Kamion> that would need an *identified* GRUB expert
=== mdke nods
[07:13] <Kamion> fixing the ntfs module certainly wouldn't hurt, but I know even less about that :)
[07:13] <hughsie> desrt: sent
[07:13] <desrt> k.
[07:13] <hughsie> desrt: what do you tink about my /proc/stat patch?
[07:13] <Kamion> mdke: did you ever edit menu.lst by hand at all?
[07:13] <desrt> i still haven't found it :)
[07:14] <desrt> i sort of have a lot on my plate right now
[07:14] <mdke> Kamion, not before I saw that bug, no. Only afterwards, when trying to readd the entry
[07:14] <hughsie> desrt: no problem
[07:15] <Kamion> 'cos unless somebody's broken it, grub-installer writes Windows entries outside the region that update-grub automatically modifies
[07:16] <hughsie> desrt: (or anyone who knows HAL): http://pastebin.com/361671
[07:16] <mdke> Kamion, the system was installed from colony 2, and the bug appeared after I did a very big dist-upgrade after several weeks without internet access. So maybe there was an update to another package which played with menu.lst?
[07:16] <desrt> hughsie; fwiw, i think it'll be a while before gnome-applets use hal for this sort of thing :)
[07:17] <desrt> hughsie; like... not during 2.14
[07:17] <hughsie> desrt: yup, but g-p-m can use it now :-)
[07:17] <hughsie> desrt: n/p - they will come....
[07:17] <Kamion> mdke: that would be a very serious bug, but I've never heard of anything like that
=== desrt already catching a bit of flak for using it for battery
[07:17] <Kamion> mdke: to my knowledge the only thing that plays with menu.lst is update-grub
[07:17] <mdke> Kamion, ok I'll system restore and then install from colony 2 again and dist-upgrade
[07:17] <hughsie> desrt: but how did things work before?
[07:18] <hughsie> desrt; the battery applet acpi code was *so* crude
[07:18] <Kamion> mdke: if you can manage to keep enough information for somebody to debug the ntfs problem if required, that'd be good
[07:18] <desrt> hughsie; i disagree
[07:18] <mdke> Kamion, hmm, i wouldn't know what to keep
[07:18] <desrt> hughsie; the battery applet acpi code was a finely polished gem
[07:19] <desrt> hughsie; it had years of bug reports smoothing down the rough edges
[07:19] <desrt> hughsie; right now, the hal stuff is what i'd consider 'crude'
[07:19] <desrt> hughsie; but it's rapidly improving
[07:19] <Kamion> mdke: the first few megabytes of the partition ought to be enough
[07:19] <hughsie> desrt: ohh - I got ya. But stuff like mAh was never implimented
[07:20] <hughsie> desrt: i didn;t believe acpi specific code benonged in an applet anyway...
[07:20] <desrt> hughsie; but would have been during this release cycle, since we got bugged about it
[07:20] <desrt> hughsie; neither do i :)
[07:20] <desrt> hughsie; but it was there and it was working
[07:20] <Diziet> mdz: You're right about those grep patches.  I misread the date.
[07:21] <desrt> hughsie; porting to HAL has caused a seemingly endless string of regressions
[07:21] <mdke> Kamion, is there any way that bug can be assigned to someone who can ask for the details needed before I do the system restore?
[07:21] <hughsie> desrt: sometimes you have to break a few eggs to make an ommlette
[07:21] <desrt> hughsie; all i can do is be grateful that we have lots of people running breezy prereleases
[07:21] <desrt> hughsie; absolutely
[07:21] <hughsie> desrt: yes, finding the bugs
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[07:21] <desrt> hughsie; and it had to happen sooner or later
[07:21] <desrt> so why not now? :)
[07:22] <desrt> for this release cycle the code was mature enough that it at least was useable
[07:22] <hughsie> desrt: yes, agreed. it's where it belongs, in hal.
[07:22] <desrt> and it's had the addition benefit that hald has gotten an awful lot of extra feedback
[07:22] <hughsie> desrt: and updating hal is a no brainer for most distros.
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[07:23] <desrt> hughsie; heh.  i dunno.  look at what martin's doing
[07:23] <hughsie> desrt: okay, point :-) heh.
[07:23] <hughsie> bet you are popular :-)
[07:23] <desrt> i have =yet another= hald patch sitting on ubuntu bugzilla now awaiting testing before i send it up to the list
[07:23] <desrt> hah
[07:23] <desrt> popular might not be the right word :)
[07:24] <hughsie> another? whats the link?
[07:24] <desrt> http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=14050
[07:25] <desrt> it's a crude hack.  i'm not even sure if upstream will want it
[07:25] <desrt> it's also a 5AM hack :)
[07:25] <sivang> man these NFS mounts take ages to complete..
[07:25] <hughsie> desrt: just looking now
=== mvo is away for a bit now to play hockey
[07:28] <hughsie> desrt: bodgetastic.
[07:28] <desrt> hughsie; :)
[07:28] <desrt> pretty much
[07:28] <desrt> fortunately, the bodge will hold until the kernel gets fixed
[07:28] <sivang> Kamion: how do you test partman-auto-lvm when you do changes in it?
[07:28] <desrt> because i doubt the kernel will get fixed in time for breezy
[07:29] <hughsie> desrt: i don't see why this couldn;t be in hal -- looks okay to me.
[07:29] <desrt> hughsie; the proper fix belongs in the kernel, really
[07:29] <hughsie> i think it more likely a bios issue than kernel
[07:29] <desrt> hughsie; but after it gets a bit of testing i'll send it to the list
[07:30] <hughsie> desrt: by inspection, the patch looks correct
[07:30] <desrt> nod
[07:30] <desrt> acpi isn't too bad
[07:30] <desrt> i usually nail the patches even without testing :p
[07:30] <hughsie> hal_device_property_set_bool (d, "battery.rechargeable.is_discharging", 0);
[07:30] <hughsie> should be
[07:30] <hughsie> hal_device_property_set_bool (d, "battery.rechargeable.is_discharging", FALSE);
[07:30] <hughsie> nitpick
[07:31] <desrt> true.
[07:31] <hughsie> and davidz likes the comments on a seporate line
[07:31] <desrt> k.  i'll keep those in mind
=== desrt has to write 2 versions of each patch anyway :)
[07:31] <desrt> ahh
[07:31] <desrt> psych or polysci
[07:31] <desrt> or both....
[07:31] <desrt> hmmmmmmm
=== desrt needs to pick up an elective or two
[07:32] <hughsie> desrt: eigh?
[07:32] <desrt> eigh?
[07:32] <hughsie> desrts: what's psych or polysci
[07:32] <desrt> psychology and political science
[07:32] <desrt> generic 1st year courses on the subjects
[07:32] <hughsie> ahh, my girlfiend is a psych undergrad
[07:32] <desrt> maybe i'll take both
[07:33] <desrt> 8 courses + 2 jobs could be fun :)
[07:33] <hughsie> desrt: stick to hal patches :-)
[07:34] <desrt> pfah
[07:34] <desrt> there are more important things in life than free software :)
[07:34] <desrt> like uh... graduating
[07:34] <hughsie> desrt: girls :-)
[07:34] <desrt> hughsie; maybe if i get more time :)
[07:34] <hughsie> desrt: know the feeling - just thinking whether to do a PhD or not..
[07:35] <desrt> hughsie; only wimps say no
[07:35] <desrt> hughsie; only wimps say yes, though
[07:35] <desrt> hughsie; so basically, you're already a wimp and nothing you can do will change that
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[07:35] <hughsie> desrt: not sure about the wimp status. I play rugby..
[07:35] <desrt> rugby is for wimps :)
[07:36] <hughsie> desrt: come here and say that
[07:36] <desrt> hughsie; are you going to UBZ?
[07:36] <hughsie> UBZ?
[07:36] <desrt> ubuntu below zero... the conference
[07:37] <hughsie> where?
[07:37] <desrt> montreal
[07:37] <desrt> (bonjour)
[07:37] <hughsie> bit of a mission. i'm in uk
[07:37] <bddebian> lamont: In case no one as told you lately, your webpages are a Godsend. :-)
[07:37] <desrt> blah
[07:37] <desrt> people are coming from farther :)
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[07:38] <hughsie> desrt: heh, okay. i g2g, dinner;s ready
[07:38] <Kamion> mdke: it's already cc'ed to kernel-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com
[07:38] <desrt> cheers
[07:38] <lamont> bddebian: I wonder which pages those are...
[07:38] <sivang> desrt: you coming from .au ? :)
[07:38] <Kamion> sivang: if you look at the changelog it will be clear that almost all the real work on partman-auto-lvm has been done by fabbione, and I have not done anything that requires much testing
[07:38] <desrt> sivang; pfa.  no :p
[07:39] <sivang> Kamion: ok, sorry I will ping him up about it, thanks anyways.
[07:39] <sivang> desrt: there where? 
[07:39] <bddebian> lamont: All of the above? :)  BuildLogs, lists, etc
[07:39] <desrt> sivang; .ca
[07:39] <lamont> ah, o
[07:39] <lamont> k
=== desrt goes to shower
[07:39] <sivang> desrt: laterz
[07:39] <bddebian> lamont: BTW, do you have or would it be easy to create a list by arch of the latest versions that fail to build for that arch?
=== Kamion fixes pam_getenv
[07:40] <Lathiat> Kamion: is it broken such that it doesnt actually get the variables its supposed to?
[07:40] <lamont> bddebian: buildLogs/Lists/breezy.all.$ARCH has that info, basically.
[07:40] <Kamion> Lathiat: it was broken such that it could not ever have possibly worked
[07:40] <Kamion> so yes
[07:40] <Lathiat> Kamion: right, i was wondering, i was tryign to use it and wondered if i was being stupid
[07:41] <bddebian> lamont: Ah, OK, thx
[07:41] <Kamion> Lathiat: (a) it was parsing /etc/environment using the syntax for a totally different file; (b) even if that accidentally succeeded, it would crash because a variable was declared in the wrong scope
[07:41] <bddebian> Anyone know if libjack0.100.0 is just not there/right/etc?
[07:41] <Lathiat> Kamion: heh
[07:42] <Kamion> well, not crash, but print a warning followed by a blank line
[07:42] <mdz> doko: it doesn't look like you've seeded zope yet
[07:42] <mdz> doko: anastacia is relatively clean for the moment
[07:45] <doko> mdz: ok, I'll seed it
[07:46] <seb128> mdz: hi
[07:46] <mdz> seb128: hi
[07:47] <Kamion> Lathiat: (actually, I was wrong about (b); but who cares, it was hosed)
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[07:47] <seb128> mdz: evolution-plugins should be installed with the desktop, is there any place to discuss that or pinging you on IRC is fine?
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[07:48] <mdz> seb128: is it a universe package currently?
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[07:48] <Lathiat> Kamion: :)
[07:49] <seb128> mdz: right, but it's evolution which has been splitted to a new binary to make plugins optional, not any new code
[07:49] <seb128> mdz: we had these files under the evolution package for hoary ... should we make a wiki page in this case too?
[07:49] <mdz> seb128: if the code was already in main, no report is needed
[07:50] <mdz> just seed it
[07:50] <seb128> ok, will do, thanks
[07:50] <seb128> mdz: should I change the ubuntu-desktop package too to list it?
[07:50] <Kamion> seb128: that's semi-automatic
[07:50] <seb128> I just update the desktop seed so?
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[07:51] <mdz> seb128: yes
[07:51] <mdz> seb128: update the desktop seed, then apt-get source ubuntu-desktop,, run ./update, read changelog and upload
[07:51] <Kamion> if you want ubuntu-desktop updated quickly, update the desktop seed, wait until it propagates to http://people.ubuntu.com/~cjwatson/seeds/breezy/desktop (<= 17 minutes), run ./update in ubuntu-meta
[07:51] <seb128> cool, thanks
[07:52] <seb128> thanks mdz, Kamion
[07:52] <mdz> right, you need to wait for the seed to be published before running update
[07:52] <Kamion> where do SuSE keep their source packages?
[07:52] <mdz> we should fix that one day
[07:52] <mdz> Kamion: .../SRPMS/
[07:52] <mdz> presumably?
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[07:53] <Kamion> ah, they're there for 9.3 but not 10.0
[07:55] <Kamion> yaboot doesn't seem to be there though
[07:55] <bddebian> yaboot is a PITA :-)
[07:55] <Kamion> oh god, they have per-arch source directories
[07:56] <elmo> haha
[07:57] <\sh> Kamion: what? since when ;)
[07:58] <Kamion> \sh: what else would you call ftp://ftp.suse.com/pub/suse/i386/9.3/suse/src/ ?
[07:59] <bddebian> elmo: Can I ask a quick question?  (Don't worry not a sync request) ;-)
[07:59] <\sh> Kamion: the directory for the i386 distri of suse version 9.3
[07:59] <\sh> Kamion: but not the SRPMS directory
[07:59] <Kamion> \sh: that directory is full of source RPMs
[08:00] <jbailey> Kamion: Is it a massive symlink farm like the good ol' pre-pool days of Debian?
[08:00] <\sh> Kamion: yes...it's the source archive of suse for the packages...but I was thinking u refered to /usr/src/redhat/SRPMS/i386/
[08:00] <\sh> because SRPMS are just like ours and laying in /usr/src/redhat/SRPMS
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[08:00] <Kamion> \sh: no, that's why I said "SuSE" not "Red Hat"
[08:01] <\sh> Kamion: even on suse the official RPM building root dir is /usr/src/redhat
[08:01] <Kamion> I don't care about what happens when you're *running* SuSE; I just want their source code
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[08:05] <sabdfl> Kamion: thanks for the new data, worked a treat
[08:05] <Kamion> sabdfl: cool stuff
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[08:06] <bddebian> Worked a treat??
[08:09] <doko> Setting up xserver-xorg (6.8.2-63) ...
[08:09] <doko> /usr/share/debconf/confmodule: line 33: 3: Bad file descriptor
[08:09] <doko> [hangs ...] 
[08:09] <doko> daniels: ^^^
[08:10] <mdz> doko: something funny in your environment?
[08:10] <mdz> I don't see how xorg could cause that
[08:11] <mdz> that's the first thing in the script
[08:11] <Kamion> my guess would be that DEBIAN_HAS_FRONTEND is set
[08:11] <Kamion> which it really shouldn't be unless you're debconf
[08:11] <Kamion> as in, set externally to package installation
[08:12] <Kamion> hm, or perhaps DEBCONF_REDIR
[08:16] <elmo> bddebian: sure
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[08:17] <bddebian> elmo: NM, you answered in the e-mail.  Thank you.
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[08:21] <dholbach> see you all tomorrow, bye
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[08:21] <doko> mdz, Kamion: fun was yesterday. I see this on amd64 only, currently updating another amd64 machine
[08:21] <doko> mdz: please promote translate-toolkit to main, reviewed by pitti
[08:23] <doko> mdz: plone & zope seeded
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[08:24] <mdz> doko: translate-toolkit is not germinated
[08:24] <mdz> doko: see http://people.ubuntu.com/~mdz/anastacia.txt
[08:25] <doko> sorry, when is next germinate run?
[08:25] <mdz> doko: I just ran one 5 minutes ago
[08:26] <doko> ahh, ok, I need to upload ooo2 first, that has t-t as a b-d
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[08:40] <Diziet> mdz: Hello.
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[08:50] <Riddell> mdz: can I upload kdeaddons and kdeartwork 3.4.2?
[08:56] <Diziet> mdz: ping
[08:56] <mdz> Diziet: yes?
[08:57] <mdz> Diziet: if you just say what you need, I can answer you when I see it, instead of waiting another RTT
[08:57] <mdz> Riddell: does anything in Ubuntu depend on them?
[08:58] <mdz> or are they purely desktop packages?
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[09:00] <elmo> Diziet: are you aware 'mozilla-firefox' isn't installable?
[09:01] <elmo> ogra: ?
[09:01] <Diziet> mdz: Ah, OK.  I wanted to talk to you about grep.
[09:01] <Riddell> mdz: only kubuntu-desktop depends on them
[09:01] <Riddell> or packages from them
[09:02] <Diziet> I'm less sure now that you've pointed out that it only went in yesterday.
[09:02] <Diziet> One possibility would be to diff the current Debian package against the Fedora one.
[09:02] <Diziet> How large a risk of damage is acceptable at this stage ?
[09:02] <Diziet> This bug seems to have been quite longstanding.
[09:02] <Diziet> And the fixes have been around for a while too.
[09:03] <Diziet> elmo: No, I wasn't aware of that.  I installed it here I think.
[09:03] <Diziet> elmo: BICBW.
[09:03] <mdz> Diziet: grep is such a critical component, and we are so close to the final release, that our risk tolerance is very low
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[09:03] <elmo> Diziet: firefox Conflicts mozilla-firefox, mozilla-firefox Depends firefox
[09:04] <elmo> ...
[09:04] <Diziet> mdz: In that case we should punt this.
[09:04] <mdz> Riddell: ok
[09:04] <Diziet> To breezy+1.
[09:04] <mdz> Diziet: let's give it a week in Debian and revisit to see if it caught fire there
[09:04] <Diziet> mdz: OK, we could do that.  I'm still a bit nervous.
[09:05] <Diziet> If it had had the month I thought then definitely.
[09:05] <Diziet> I'll do that diff tomorrow and see what it turns up.
[09:05] <Diziet> elmo: OIC, it's not installable together with firefox.  That's OK.
[09:05] <elmo> Diziet: no it's not?
[09:05] <Diziet> The purpose is to trick the package manager into selecting firefox.
[09:06] <Kamion> Diziet: it's not installable *at all*, because it Depends: firefox
[09:06] <Diziet> But you don't want it installed.
[09:06] <Kamion> Does this trick you postulate actually work in practice?
[09:07] <Kamion> because it's not what anyone else does with dummy packages so I doubt that path is tested
[09:07] <Kamion> seeing as e.g. Debian testing won't let such a package in
[09:07] <Diziet> I tested it but obviously it wasn't a pure test because I had to kludge lots of stuff to make it visible at all.
[09:08] <Kamion> we require zero uninstallables in main when we release ...
[09:08] <Diziet> OK, I'll change firefox then.
[09:08] <Diziet> Sorry about that.
[09:08] <Kamion> thanks
[09:08] <Diziet> No problem.  Thanks for the grumble.
[09:08] <Kamion> I realise it requires nasty conflicts <<
[09:09] <Kamion> actually, does it? would just replaces << work?
[09:09] <Diziet> Yers.  Now is perhaps not the time to be fighting that one.
[09:09] <Kamion> but again, now is perhaps not the time to be trying that out
[09:09] <Diziet> No, the reason it's not installable is because  m-f Depends f  f Conflicts m-f  .
[09:09] <Kamion> yeah, I know
[09:10] <Diziet> So just replaces wouldn't work.
[09:10] <Kamion> I'll draw you pictures of what I mean if I see you at post-pizza tonight :-)
[09:10] <Diziet> :-).
=== Kamion runs off to karate
[09:10] <Diziet> Chop well.
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[09:14] <Nafallo> ehm
[09:14] <Nafallo> pizza?
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[09:54] <Riddell> doko: I can't get the openoffice/kaddressbook integration to do much, the only source openoffice seems to list is evolution
[09:54] <Riddell> doko: would it be possible to use KDE file open dialogues by default?  they seem to work fine now
[09:55] <doko> Riddell: it's only possible to enable the default dialogs for kde _and_ gnome, not for just one.
[09:55] <doko> However I didn't check much the gtk dialogs
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[09:58] <bddebian> Goddamn I hate it when I can build a package from Debian fine, I sync it and it explodes.. Grr...
[10:00] <HiddenWolf> bddebian, as #debian is fond of saying, debian _is not_ ubuntu
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[10:09] <bddebian> HiddenWolf: Bah :-)
[10:09] <HiddenWolf> bddebian, sorry, but that was asking for it. ;)
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[10:28] <doko> mdz: heading to bed now, please promote translate-toolkit once it shows up in anastacia output
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[10:35] <crispin> Hmm, I had to hex edit the http method to get rid of the If-Range support as my ISP has a broken proxy :-(
[10:36] <sladen> crispin: transparent proxy too?
[10:36] <crispin> yeah
[10:42] <Lathiat> sladen, crispin: ah those are great, mine causes random apt requests to get reset, usually the first time i talk to a particular server in a while
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[10:48] <crispin> Lathiat, sladen, yeah they suck :-( I'm going to cook up a patch to allow turning off If-Range's to get round my problem
[10:49] <Lathiat> whats this for?
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[10:51] <crispin> Lathiat: my ISP's proxy just returns bogus responses to If-Range requests, causing apt to fail to update 99% of the time
[10:52] <Lathiat> ah
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[11:04] <Evaso> hi guys fpc will be available in ubuntu?
[11:05] <Evaso> i know that debian source package was fixed and now support also amd64
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[11:10] <Evaso> why fpc binary packages aren't available but only the sources pakcages?
[11:10] <Evaso> http://packages.ubuntu.com/breezy/source/fpc
[11:15] <Lathiat> Evaso: because its compilation requires bootstrapping, and no on ehas organised to have that done, and this is an issue you want to talk in  #ubuntu-motu about since its a unvierse package
[11:16] <Evaso> thanks
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[11:38] <ajmitch> morning mdz
[11:38] <mdz> morning
[11:38] <mdz> power is finally restored
[11:38] <mdz> it was out for nearly 2 hours
[11:39] <ajmitch> mdz: I got a request from hypatia to update python-nevow in main (UVF issue)
[11:39] <ajmitch> apparantly 0.3 is quite irritating to use with twisted
[11:39] <ogra> mdz, :(
[11:40] <mdz> ajmitch: can you be a bit more specific?
[11:40] <ajmitch> < hypatia> the justificiation would be something like "nevow 0.3 uses the Twisted 1.3 style component architecture, and while technically compatible wit
[11:40] <ajmitch> h Twisted 2.0.1, requires application developers to do a lot of compatibility wrapping"
[11:41] <ajmitch> python-nevow packages don't appear to have reverse depends in main
[11:41] <mdz> yes, was just checking that
[11:41] <Nafallo> mjg59: can I tell usplash to go and die from an initscript?
[11:41] <mdz> ajmitch: ok with me, as long as you take responsibility for fixing any issues with it (merging, watching to make sure it builds, responding to any reports of regressions)
[11:41] <jbailey> Nafallo: chvt to terminal 1 ought to be enough.
[11:42] <ajmitch> mdz: alright, thanks
[11:42] <mdz> ajmitch: email the request to elmo, CC me
[11:43] <Nafallo> jbailey: the script in question is cryptsetup, usplash should vanish when cryptsetup asks for a password ;-).
[11:43] <Lathiat> mdz: "nearly 2 hours"?  heh when the pwer goes out here 2 hours is usually a minimum :)
[11:43] <mdz> I rarely lose power here
[11:43] <jbailey> Nafallo: Ah, that I don't know.  =)
[11:43] <Nafallo> jbailey: so chvt is probably not an option :-/
[11:43] <mdz> I think that was the only time this year
=== Lathiat has had 3 times this year
[11:43] <mdz> for more than a few seconds, anyway
[11:43] <Lathiat> maybe 4
[11:44] <ajmitch> right, it's not a straight sync as the default python version needs set to 2.4 again
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[11:52] <mdz> elmo: the cron.sync locking still doesn't seem to work for me ("Try praying...")
[11:53] <elmo> mdz: yeah, I've noticed - it's harmless enough
[11:53] <elmo> oh, well I suppose less so if you're running it often
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