=== spacey [n=spacey@flits101-191.flits.rug.nl] has joined #ubuntu-devel [12:05] ok, the bug is filled: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=316527 [12:07] so, for the time being I can use nautilus-cd-burner key, what do you guys think? [12:16] i'll take that as a yes :) [12:17] mdz / Kamion, for the liveCD you should set the boolean gconf key /apps/gnome-screensaver/lock to false in the default settings ;) [12:23] ogra: gconftool-2 -t bool -s /apps/gnome-screensaver/lock false [12:23] ? [12:23] sounds ok [12:26] good night everybody [12:27] night dholbach [12:27] gnight dholbach [12:47] jbailey: about? [12:49] Lathiat: Just back. [12:52] jbailey: ah nevermind, was looking at https://launchpad.net/malone/bugs/1805, turns out its a bug in the package [12:58] Lathiat: Cool, so I don't need to worry about it being a subtle glibc thing? [12:58] jb yep [12:58] jbailey: they use LD_PRELOAD stuff, and __libc_connect is supposed to be the real connect, its been fixed upstream in debian [12:58] <\sh> Mithrandir: partimage is bah [01:00] Ah. [01:01] "Play thou not with the internals of glibc" type of thing. =) [01:01] :) === mpt [n=mpt@201-1-132-73.dsl.telesp.net.br] has joined #ubuntu-devel === sfvt_ [n=sfeehan@pool-64-222-103-115.burl.east.verizon.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:05] \sh: all the n-f-u's are from the c++ transition... do we know that all of it's dependant libs are built? [01:06] <\sh> lamont: all the what? [01:07] not-for-us [01:07] \sh: gfcui in this case. [01:07] <\sh> lamont: oh....gfccore is build long ago... [01:07] <\sh> lamont: wasn't even on the http://cerberus.0c3.net/~adconrad/frozenapps.txt [01:08] \sh: dealt with, although it'll take it a bit before it builds [01:08] <\sh> lamont: np [01:09] it'll realize that it needs to build it in about 30 minutes... [01:10] <\sh> lamont: I think it is not so important...but I was missing it in the buildlogs ;) [01:10] <\sh> lamont: thx :) [01:13] <\sh> lamont: do u have another list of apps which are "n-f-u"s ? I can only see these one from infinitys list [01:13] I'd just grep the file... [01:14] <\sh> lamont: ok... [01:14] /dbbalancer_1: Not-For-Us [:] [01:14] universe/libs/gfcui_2.3.1-2build1: Not-For-Us [optional:out-of-date] [01:14] universe/math/oleo_1.99.16-7build1: Not-For-Us [optional:out-of-date] [01:14] universe/devel/gql_1: Not-For-Us [optional:] [01:14] on i386 [01:14] well, modulo gfcui [01:14] <\sh> lamont: ok...gql will be morgued [01:14] <\sh> and oleo...well...I'll have to fix it, or morgue it ;) [01:14] morgue it. =) [01:14] =) [01:14] <\sh> hihi [01:15] \sh: Dude, I used to be the Oleo maintainer. =) [01:15] <\sh> I transitioned the lib the day before yesterday ;) [01:15] <\sh> jbailey: so u morgue it ; [01:15] jbailey: I need klibc love [01:15] lamont: Yes. [01:15] gimme a sec. [01:16] <\sh> jbailey: ok...I'll put it on the list [01:16] <\sh> lamont: modula oleo ;) [01:16] <\sh> modulo even [01:17] \sh: I mean, unless you think there's a serious population using a text-mode only spreadsheet. =) [01:17] \sh: The X interface was horrible. [01:17] We hacked together a GTK interface and it was so ugly, Miguel went off and wrote Gnumeric. [01:18] They had talked about adding a text controller to gnumeric at one point, and we realised that noone cared. =) [01:18] <\sh> jbailey: I don't even know that oleo exist ;) as I mentioned last time I don't know 90% of the software I touched... [01:19] <\sh> jbailey: but if u say it's obsolete...then it's obsolete and will be burried :) [01:20] \sh: Well, lemme take a look at the changelog, I guess. [01:20] It was obsolete 5 years ago, I can't imagine that it's less so now. [01:21] <\sh> jbailey: if there is a new release please let me know... [01:22] <\sh> jbailey: it's ftbfsing [01:22] 797945 Mar 10 2001 oleo-1.99.16.tar.gz [01:22] Roundfile it, dude. =) [01:22] <\sh> k [01:22] I do have to say that I have a soft spot in my heart for oleo. [01:23] If *only* because there's nothing like: [01:23] 1) Cleaning up after Tom Lord [01:23] 2) Working on a spreadsheet === bddebian [n=bddebian@pcp08717033pcs.phnixv01.pa.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:23] To teach you *more* than you ever wanted to know about C and pointers. [01:23] moi? :-) [01:24] bddebian: No, dear. =) [01:24] Yeah, I know it all already ;-) [01:24] Excellent. [01:24] <\sh> jbailey: thx...but I learned enough about pointers in C when I coded bloody win32 [01:24] I'm sure the FSF would love another Oleo maintainer. =) [01:24] \sh: I tried coding in win32 C too early. The event loop confused me, and the documentation sucked. [01:25] \sh: In hindsight I get it know, but event driven programming drove me nuts. =) [01:25] I couldn't figure out how to register time based events and I didn't know threads, so I kept adding a function at the beginning of my events to do processing. [01:26] If you wanted it to do anything you had to hit a key or move your mouse occasionally. =) [01:26] jbailey: heh. I think I've seen expensive software with similar "features" [01:26] released software anyway [01:27] <\sh> jbailey: hehe...well I was completly confused when I received the MS C/c++ with the MFC (1.0 at this time)...and I switched back to plain C win32 === Burgundavia [n=corey@S0106000000cc07fc.gv.shawcable.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === sfvt_ [n=sfeehan@pool-64-222-103-115.burl.east.verizon.net] has left #ubuntu-devel [] === lamont sighs, wishes mdz had said he was uploading a new lrm [01:39] it was an impulse [01:39] why? === zenrox [n=zenrox@71.115.199.53] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:40] mdz: because the build-deps are b0rked for all of the SCC architectures... [01:40] and I was just doing my final pre-upload testing. [01:40] well, s/b0rked/missing completely/ [01:40] should be a trivial merge; nothing changed in debian/ but the minors [01:40] mdz: mind if I fix it? [01:40] ah, coolness. [01:41] and my change is just changelog and control* [01:41] (and that just the Build-Dep line) === tseng_ [n=tseng@brandonhale.us] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:43] lamont: fine with me === zenrox [n=zenrox@71.115.199.53] has joined #ubuntu-devel === rob^ [n=rob@pdpc/supporter/student/rob-ubuntu] has joined #ubuntu-devel === jorgp3 [n=jorgp@bnet-dial-47.bartnet.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === bmonty_laptop [n=bmontgom@wsip-68-15-230-31.om.om.cox.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:01] <\sh> mdz: thx for the bugs :) [02:03] \sh: want some more? [02:03] \sh: I think Mr. Stomp wanted the new version so he would have a reason to file some bugs ;-) [02:03] *g* === shackan [n=shackan@host135-97.pool8259.interbusiness.it] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:05] <\sh> mdz: the first one is easy ;) audiocds only with ioslaves ;) so he needs some part of kde ;-) [02:06] Audioslave? Not bad, I like Chris Cornel [02:07] bddebian: i liked him 10 years ago. [02:07] Yeah, I don't like Audioslave near as much as Soundgarden [02:07] anyway, yay for rrdtool update === bskahan [n=bskahan@dsl254-074-249.nyc1.dsl.speakeasy.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:09] <\sh> argl...amarok is kde...so u need some parts of kde...at least kdelibs and base ,-) i should amarok depend on kdebase ,-) === WaterSevenUb [n=WaterSev@bl5-40-181.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #ubuntu-devel === crimsun [n=crimsun@sh.nu] has joined #ubuntu-devel === jkossen [n=jochem@jkossen.nl] has joined #Ubuntu-devel [02:17] <\sh> mdz: ok with u to fix at least khelpcenter bug? [02:18] well. that was fun [02:19] \sh: sure; it's harmless enough [02:20] <\sh> mdz: regarding the mem leak...yes it's there (was there also with 1.2.4 ;) and I think it's something in gstreamer-mad cause playing audiocds doesn't increase my mem consumption) [02:20] mdz: I also took the liberty of making linux-restricted-modules-2.6.12-8-sparc* be arch: sparc. :-) [02:27] <\sh> tseng: I have enough to work on ;) [02:33] <\sh> good night gentlemen...enough fun for today [02:33] night \sh [02:33] <\sh> cu ogra === jcape [n=jcape@71.244.185.197] has joined #ubuntu-devel === slomo_ [n=slomo@p5487C032.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Gman [n=Glynn@amfea-proxy-2.sun.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel === LaschW [n=laschw@dyndsl-085-016-011-166.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel === jcape [n=jcape@c-24-14-116-227.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === lamont [n=lamont@15.238.5.82] has joined #ubuntu-devel === lamont wonders why firefox bitches about XML parsing errors [03:54] ogra: the ubuntu splash has the reflection blurred which makes it look more like a refection [03:54] sladen, i'll try to get this in the edubuntu splash... [03:55] thanks for the suggestion :) [03:56] ogra: another thing. see the two dots on the left hand side about 2 pixels away from each othere. There's no way the reflection dot should be brighter and sharper than the original above it :) [03:57] ok, will fix that tomorrow :) [03:59] ogra: and the reflection needs to go 1 pixel to the left ;-) [03:59] thanks :) [03:59] ogra: If you're touching it up, [03:59] ogra: if you have the pre-dithered one, I can try fixing those for you [03:59] ogra: The bottom of the 'ed' letters isn't faded the same as the others. [04:00] removing mozilla-firefox fixed things... /me wonders if that's been captured anywhere.... [04:00] But hey, you saw my skills, so don't worry about what I say. =) === jk- [n=jk@ppp60-136.lns1.cbr1.internode.on.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === lamont tries to remember who to bitch at when PCMCIA cards arent' detected. [04:01] lamont: Define 'detected'? [04:01] lamont: Is it showing up in /sys at all? [04:02] I plug it in, no files created in /dev [04:02] sladen, i didnt keep the pre dithered one... i'll do a new one on ethe weekend, that was only a first try to mimic the ubuntu one... the colors arent right either... [04:03] (the reflection needs to be a lot darker too) [04:03] jbailey: here's a giggle: [04:03] root@rover3:/sys/bus/pcmcia/devices/1.0# grep . * [04:03] grep: card_id: No such device [04:03] grep: func_id: No such device [04:03] function:0x00 [04:03] grep: manf_id: No such device [04:03] grep: prod_id1: No such device [04:04] grep: prod_id2: No such device [04:04] grep: prod_id3: No such device [04:04] grep: prod_id4: No such device === LaschW [n=laschw@dyndsl-085-016-011-166.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has left #ubuntu-devel ["Leaving"] === mxpxpod [n=bryan@unaffiliated/mxpxpod] has joined #ubuntu-devel === jdub [n=jdub@home.waugh.id.au] has joined #ubuntu-devel [04:14] GOOD MORNING FREEDOM LOVERS! [04:15] morning, jeff [04:15] good night jdub :) [04:15] also good night :P [04:15] you guys will have to keep me away from all the cheap beer in montreal [04:16] heh === magnon has had money for the first time in long and is somewhat hammered [04:16] magnon, congrats [04:16] thanks. [04:16] it doesnt feel good atm. :P [04:17] magnon, get some sleep :) [04:17] omw [04:17] ) [04:17] just had some.. issues to fix [04:18] Good morning jdub [04:19] magnon: Almost all the beer is cheap in Montral. [04:19] It's sold in corner stores here. [04:19] jbailey: the norwegian definition of "cheap" is useless in Canada === LaserJock [n=LaserJoc@adsl-69-104-116-176.dsl.renocs.pacbell.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [04:20] magnon: True. An expensive ring here might buy you a bag of chips. [04:20] where the hell did you get that bag of chips you keep mentioning? [04:20] 7-11 =) [04:21] who ever buys chips at 7-11 :P [04:21] we have Bunnpris [04:21] tiny, cramped stores who are allowed to be open on sundays [04:21] It was close to the school where debconf3 was hosted. [04:21] oh, at the subway station? [04:21] I guess. [04:21] there's a Bunnpris 100m from it :p [04:21] It wasn't underground. Is it still a subway? [04:22] yes, it ends up underground at a point :p [04:22] 'k. Mostly making sure we're talking about the same thing. [04:22] hehe [04:22] bunnpris have normal grocery prices and are open like 8-23 every day [04:23] that means only 25 kr for a beer if youre there before 20.00, and 69 for a packet of cigs [04:27] in comparison 7-11 in denmark sells 6 beer for about 50 kr 24/7 :P === cogumbreiro [n=tiago@81.20.250.82] has left #ubuntu-devel [] [04:35] time to sleep off some more-expensive-than-gold beer [04:35] goodnight! [04:36] who has leet magic powers on Bugzilla to view http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=7263 ? [04:37] Not me === robitaille [n=daniel@d154-5-117-228.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === LaserJock [n=LaserJoc@adsl-69-104-116-176.dsl.renocs.pacbell.net] has left #ubuntu-devel [] [04:46] sladen, wow, thats intresting... i even have editusers privileges but cant view it... probably mdz can, else its something to poke kiko with [04:47] weird, not sure how that happened [04:47] it's unrestricted now [04:56] OK, who knows about .desktop files darnit? [04:56] bddebian: there is a wiki page on desktop files [04:57] Do you know where? [04:58] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UniversePackageWithoutDesktopFile [04:58] there are examples linked off that page [04:58] gnomeappdir is what I'm looking for, I just don't know if I should fix the Makefile or copy it as you say in debian/rules [04:59] bmonty_laptop: Uhm, that page is worthless :-) === seth_k|lappy [n=seth@asmallorange.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel === nathanel [i=magiQ@p5492C0EA.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [05:02] on that subject, what's the procedure for getting edit-powers back, I've just found I can't retitle this bug [05:03] mdz: ta [05:03] sladen: HelpingWithBugs [05:03] mdz: You know .desktop stuff? [05:03] a bit === seth_k|lappy [n=seth@asmallorange.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel [05:04] It's a simple problem. gnucash is putting the desktop file in the wrong place. Do I patch the Makefile(s) or just copy the file in debian/rules? [05:05] since it's not specific to the packaging, and should be installed in the standard place regardless of how it's installed, I'd patch it [05:06] Ack, I hate patching config and/or makefiles :-) [05:06] Thx though [05:08] sladen: just let me know that you've read it so that we're all working from the same assumptions, and I'll set editbugs [05:08] http://hwdb.ubuntu.com/buildlogs/?show=http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/v/vpnc/0.3.3-0ubuntu1/vpnc_0.3.3-0ubuntu1_20050917-0138-ia64-failed.gz [05:08] WARNING: The following packages cannot be authenticated! [05:08] etc === silwol_ [n=silwol@212-88-191-36.ADSL.ycn.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel [05:14] mdz: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HelpingWithBugs could do with some guidance on the priority field---I've still failed to work out whether P1 or P5 is more important (*blushes*) [05:15] mdz: yes, read it and the several other linked pages (and the GNOME triage hints at the moment :) === waltz [n=walterbr@69.158.102.161] has joined #ubuntu-devel [05:33] lamont-away: those firefox xml errors can come from installing an updated package without restarting the browser === ugo [n=ugo@128.237.240.88] has joined #ubuntu-devel [05:40] hi guys....i seem to be having a problem compiling open afs on hoary [05:40] ugo: -> #ubuntu [05:40] aargh....the real men are here....! [05:40] :-) [05:40] ok... === otavio_ [n=otavio@unaffiliated/otavio] has joined #ubuntu-devel [05:49] mdz: thanks for fixing madwifi === jcole [n=jcole@atlwebproxy2.core.hp.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel [06:03] phlaegel: I could have sworn I killed all of the old browser instances off [06:10] holy crap [06:10] trilug have over 100 comments on their petition blog now === jcole [n=jcole@atlwebproxy2.core.hp.com] has left #ubuntu-devel [] [06:14] we have 17. [06:14] sweet, vpnc got updated - now it works with network-manager-vpnc. thanks, \sh_away [06:20] jdub: damned straight [06:21] crimsun: interesting discussion about agnosticism on the mailing list [06:21] jdub: heh, when we actually do discuss Linux-related stuff, it's a miracle ;) === jdub has not yet been to another LUG that really competed with SLUG for radness, but trilug looks like it might. :-) [06:22] yeah, we're just zany [06:26] /dev/md1 ext3 187G 56G 122G 32% / [06:26] /dev/md0 ext3 23M 8.3M 14M 39% /boot [06:26] yay [06:26] server's back [06:26] back again [06:26] server's back [06:26] tell a friend [06:30] jdub: tsk.. you forgot lvm on top :) [06:31] i dodged the bullet for now ;) [06:31] chicken :P === poningru [n=poningru@n128-227-27-143.xlate.ufl.edu] has joined #ubuntu-devel === robitaille [n=robitail@d154-5-117-228.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === seth_k|lappy [n=seth@asmallorange.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel === wickedpuppy [n=wicked@cm19.epsilon165.maxonline.com.sg] has joined #ubuntu-devel === beidon [n=toor@218-160-82-204.dynamic.hinet.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === beidon [n=toor@218-160-82-204.dynamic.hinet.net] has left #ubuntu-devel [] === tritium [n=michael@pcp0011975002pcs.sandia01.nm.comcast.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === bytee [n=byte@fedora/byte] has joined #ubuntu-devel [08:22] fabbione: I'm not sure how it happened; 'make clean' works in that dir [08:23] sladen: in general, it's appropriate to leave priority alone, for the assignee and me to use [08:24] sladen: anyway, you have editbugs now [08:26] mdz: no idea either.. === fabbione just got the new workstation spare parts! [08:27] AMD64! === fabbione goes to mount his new playtoy === Kamion [n=cjwatson@83-216-156-196.colinw664.adsl.metronet.co.uk] has joined #ubuntu-devel [08:45] <[Chameleon] > Is Malone for Breezy bugs? [08:46] <[Chameleon] > I'm not clear on its purpose compared to bugzilla.ubuntu.com [08:46] [Chameleon] : it's for universe bugs. Bugs for main still goes to bugzilla [08:46] <[Chameleon] > OK, thanks. [08:49] <[Chameleon] > that should be indicated on the Participate page in the QA section. [08:49] <[Chameleon] > http://www.ubuntu.com/community/participate === rob^ [n=rob@pdpc/supporter/student/rob-ubuntu] has joined #ubuntu-devel [09:08] Any udev-people awake here? [09:15] <[Chameleon] > I'm awake [09:15] <[Chameleon] > though not a udev person [09:15] <[Chameleon] > I know a tiny bit about it, but I'm not a developer of it. [09:29] well, it breaks my system :) [09:29] I think it tries to enable DMA or something on one of my IDE drives (the one which does not support DMA.. it's a CF card) [09:30] because it doesn't try once [09:30] it tries 100s of times [09:30] until other parts of the system start to suffer (another IDE bus starts getting timeouts because the kernel can't keep up) [09:30] <[Chameleon] > bummer === Hirion [n=Hirion@p5487C032.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [09:31] yeah.. it should try once (or not at all) and leave it [09:32] had to sit in a datacentre for 1.5 hours before I figured this out though :( [09:32] <[Chameleon] > file a bug in bugzilla please. [09:32] and I still don't know the exact bug [09:32] that's the problem [09:32] <[Chameleon] > hmm [09:32] (and I can't really test, the machine serves websites + mail for a few friends) [09:33] but I'll try :) [09:33] (I have logs) === pef [n=pef@lns-vlq-39f-81-56-130-224.adsl.proxad.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [09:38] hello [09:41] #15640 ! :) === dholbach [i=foobar@i577B122A.versanet.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel [09:44] good morning === ivoks [n=ivoks@lns01-1234.dsl.iskon.hr] has joined #ubuntu-devel [09:50] udev tries to enable dma? [09:50] that sounds odd === Kamion_ [n=cjwatson@83-216-156-196.colinw664.adsl.metronet.co.uk] has joined #ubuntu-devel [10:00] bob2: it tries to do _something_ with my /dev/hda [10:00] bob2: but it fails, retries, fails, retries, until it takes the rest of the system with it === stratus [n=apc@tbnb-165-193-241.telkomadsl.co.za] has joined #ubuntu-devel [10:09] mdz: thank you for fixing that linux-restricted-modules. is there something like incoming.d.o into ubuntu ? i want to test the new package asap and i see it reach the breezy-changes ML. [10:10] things hit the archive within about 30-odd minutes of being uploaded [10:11] 30 minutes? wow [10:13] btw, thanks bob2 === rob^ [n=rob@pdpc/supporter/student/rob-ubuntu] has joined #ubuntu-devel === pitti [n=pitti@195.227.105.180] has joined #ubuntu-devel [10:23] Hi [10:23] morning pitti === spayne [n=spayne@i-195-137-120-148.freedom2surf.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === spacey [n=spacey@flits101-191.flits.rug.nl] has joined #ubuntu-devel [10:48] moning pitti [10:48] dholbach: [10:49] <\sh> infinity: u awake? I have a patch for ace, if you want to test it === otavio [n=otavio@unaffiliated/otavio] has joined #ubuntu-devel [10:58] <\sh> mdz: I think suggests is better for khelpcenter, then recommends, cause it has nothing to do with the functionality. (#15613) === herzi [n=herzi@p548DE583.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel === MagnusR [n=magru@85.194.14.142] has joined #ubuntu-devel === WaterSevenUb [n=WaterSev@bl5-55-103.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #ubuntu-devel === dand [n=dand@83.103.205.67] has joined #ubuntu-devel === martink [n=martin@p54B3B803.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #ubuntu-devel === terrex [n=terrex@84-122-83-29.onocable.ono.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel === maradong [n=bhentges@vodsl-4486.vo.lu] has joined #ubuntu-devel [11:41] <[Chameleon] > sivang, pitti: I finally got around to writing up that other g-c-m bug. [11:41] <[Chameleon] > https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=15646 [11:42] [Chameleon] : I think pitti already fixed that, have you tried a latest upgrade of breezy? [11:42] [Chameleon] : (it works for me now) [11:42] <[Chameleon] > sivang: 1 sec [11:43] <[Chameleon] > well, I'll be a monkey. [11:43] <[Chameleon] > he sure did. [11:43] <[Chameleon] > I'll close it. [11:43] <[Chameleon] > fastest. bugfix. evar. [11:44] <[Chameleon] > good thing I wear egg on my face well. [11:44] hehe [11:46] [Chameleon] : it appears that cupsys was mangeling the conffile's permissions, and now it dont' [11:46] <[Chameleon] > yep [11:46] <[Chameleon] > I recall that === zyga [n=zyga@2-mi2-1.acn.waw.pl] has joined #ubuntu-devel [11:58] <[Chameleon] > sivang: heh, your Ubuntu Membership is not complete. [11:59] [Chameleon] : what do you mean? [11:59] <[Chameleon] > https://wiki.ubuntu.com//UbuntuMembers === doko_ [n=doko@dsl-084-059-088-000.arcor-ip.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [12:00] [Chameleon] : maybe because i haven't uploaded a GPG key yet ;-) [12:01] sivang: do that then ;) [12:01] <[Chameleon] > :> [12:01] Treenaks: yes, planning to, then I would get my u.c email finally [12:09] BenC, fabbione: ping [12:13] jdub: pong? [12:13] fabbione: hey, have you tried the latest kernel? [12:14] jdub: installing it right now on my new shiny amd64 [12:14] i just rebooted to find that /dev/input didn't exist, my ipw2200 firmware wouldn't load, and a bunch of other mess [12:15] no soundcards found [12:15] no idea [12:15] i didn't really upgrade any of the machines yet [12:15] it's only installing on the new one [12:15] i will give it a try tomorrow [12:15] ok [12:15] on i386 [12:16] jdub: which, 2.6.12-8.13? [12:16] right now i don't have (yet) spare boxes to play [12:16] crimsun: yeah [12:17] seems to work fine on i686 [12:17] that's what i'm running ;) [12:17] jdub: what arch? [12:17] ok [12:17] ipw2200 looks like it's trying to load the wrong file [12:17] (doesn't include the uname -r bit in it) [12:17] jdub: that's hotplug... [12:17] 2.6.12-8.13 runs nicely on my amd64 [12:18] ipw2200 only asks hotplug for a file [12:18] passing a filename [12:18] it's hotplug that does the uname -r magic [12:18] hrm [12:18] so dmesg said it can't load the firmwar [12:19] jdub: check with hotplug [12:19] you can enable debugging in the script [12:19] and see what is called/why/and what is missing [12:19] and with this [12:19] jdub: cat /sys/class/firmware/timeout === fabbione -> off [12:19] i'm going to try again with a fresh mkinitramfs too [12:19] crimsun: 10 [12:20] jdub: please echo 100 to it and reload ipw2200 [12:20] ok, but rebooting atm [12:21] (usplash is teh rawk) [12:22] aha! [12:22] new initramfs appeared to fix the lack of /dev/input [12:23] and everything else [12:23] hmm~ [12:23] hmm! [12:23] jbailey: ping [12:25] the most recent openafs fails to compile with gcc-3.4 [12:25] hey whats the current status of getting a graphical installer in ubuntu? [12:26] i'll do some shopping [12:26] be back later [12:26] rob^: the only likelihood of something like that appearing will be UbuntuExpress (install from livecd) [12:26] ugo: 1.3.82-1? [12:27] jdub, do you mind if I have a play with PGI and see what it can do? [12:27] why would i mind? :) [12:27] hehe ok [12:27] ugo: I filed a bug about it a while ago, and also asked ogra to request a sync of 1.4rc from unstable [12:27] rob^: keep in mind though, it's not something we'd be interested in [12:28] so we don't want a graphical installer at all, or we only want a live cd? [12:28] ugo: https://launchpad.net/malone/bugs/2157 [12:28] (from which to install from) [12:28] there's not a lot of interest in doing the graphical installer on d-i work [12:29] and not a lot of interest in using something other than d-i for the basic installer [12:29] it's quick and mostly painless, so not really worth the effort [12:29] however [12:29] it might be nice at least for the partitioning phase [12:29] UbuntuExpress gives us a great opportunity to do a really good graphical installer, far beyond what current basic graphical installers can do [12:30] (because when you have the whole desktop available to you... lots of interesting things can happen) [12:31] ugo: upstream has released 1.4rc4, with some critical fixes, hopefully it will hit Debian unstable soon, and then I will start poking MOTUs again :-) [12:31] so the plan is to only have one cd that does both live and install then? [12:31] rob^: [12:31] rob^: for mass distribution, yeah [12:31] rob^: but we'll have an install cd too, particularly for the server use case (and possibly even dedicated to that use case) [12:32] ok, makes sense, saves money too [12:32] and for that it only needs to be text based [12:32] aye [12:33] I might check out UbuntuExpress then :) [12:34] :-) [12:34] whats the current target release for UbuntuExpress? === HiddenWolf [n=HiddenWo@136.14.dynamic.phpg.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [12:36] Breezy? [12:37] no [12:37] hopefully dapper [12:37] didn't make it for breezy [12:37] ah I see its been deferred [12:37] (though its absence in breezy may make it less likely for dapper...) === jdub boggles [12:44] somehow my laptop thinks my work maildir is 2.1T === maradong [n=bhentges@vodsl-4486.vo.lu] has joined #ubuntu-devel === vrln [n=vrln@a84-230-69-234.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #ubuntu-devel === rob^ [n=rob@pdpc/supporter/student/rob-ubuntu] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:05] crimsun/jdub: I've seen the ipw2200 firmware timeout several times too [01:07] thanks torkel... [01:08] <\sh> woot? do i read #15299 correctly, that sky2 is sk98lin driver for marvell yukon2 included in 2.6.12-8.14? [01:08] before i leave though...how do i send these red highlighted messages to ppl [01:08] thanks crismun also... [01:08] just use thier name [01:08] their * [01:08] <\sh> BenC: if this is correct...u rock man :) [01:09] (slightly off topic) this is not strictly a development related question, but it is at least a technical one: what does the default ubuntu initrd in Breezy contain? I am wondering if it's used for USplash or the filesystems [01:10] torkel: hey from your bug report you mentioned ure running 1.4RC1 [01:11] torkel: is this on ubuntu using debian's packages...and can i replicate this...? just an overview will suffice im sure i can hack it out myself given that === vrln [n=vrln@a84-230-69-234.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has left #ubuntu-devel ["Leaving"] [01:19] mdz: can you please add me to ubuntu members lp group [01:19] the new wine packages at breezy are the same that can be found at winehq.com? [01:23] is there a gui that controls bluetooth devices? === sivang hopes there's going to be a key signing party in UBZ [01:30] jdub: how do I make "awesome desktop-integrated IM and VOIP" a goal for dapper? :) [01:31] tseng: I'm also having troulbe with my membership - but I havn't uploaded a key yet. [01:32] does anybody know why apt-listchanges gives nothing when invoked on a .deb ? [01:33] Robot101: we'll have to write a spec :-) [01:34] Robot101: \sh is also itnerested in this, you might want to talk to him as well === kent [n=kent@h55d210.delphi.afb.lu.se] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:45] <\sh> Robot101: this is already planned :) [01:45] <\sh> Robot101: http://linux.blogweb.de/archives/94-Thinking-about-the-future.html === cassidy [n=cassidy@76.115-201-80.adsl.skynet.be] has joined #ubuntu-devel === avanspronsen [n=andrewv@London-HSE-ppp3543971.sympatico.ca] has joined #ubuntu-devel === Elleo [n=Elleo@shellsong.plus.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:53] \sh: ipcf.freedesktop.org [01:55] <\sh> Robot101: kopete + kaddressbook have something like this..but it's really crap... [01:55] <\sh> Robot101: 1. we should concentrate on opensource protocols like xmpp [01:56] <\sh> Robot101: 2. all applications on all desktops need to have implementations... [01:56] \sh: no, kopete + kaddressbook share presence information [01:56] this is sharing the entire IM/VOIP server connection over dbus [01:56] <\sh> Robot101: but let us discuss this in #ubuntu-im ;) [01:57] I'm about to catch a train, but consider me interested (we're writing this framework anyway) [01:57] <\sh> Robot101: I would like to work with you on this spec...this is one of the goals which are not really dapper specific..but we have to start :) === shackan [n=shackan@host194-46.pool8261.interbusiness.it] has joined #ubuntu-devel [01:59] \sh: we should start a wiki page about it probably [02:00] \sh: the goals are to provide IM/VOIP/presence functionality wherever it makes sense [02:00] \sh: by using IPCF in the background to do the SIP/Jabber connections [02:01] \sh: then you want to make sure evolution is wired into galago, nautilus lets you send files to people, some other IM app does the chat stuff (gossip if we write it an ipcf backend?) [02:01] <\sh> Robot101: removing MSN/ICQ stuff and all propietary things.. [02:01] <\sh> Robot101: gajim is state of art ;) [02:01] not really, no... [02:02] you can put whatever crack you want into the connectin managers [02:02] a phone app for making calls... it's all about having the appropriate domain-specific UI for the various functionality of IM/VOIP systems === kent [n=kent@h55d210.delphi.afb.lu.se] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:02] can the ubuntu installer resize ntfs partitions or not? [02:03] it doesn't work for me, but others claim it can === dand [n=dand@83.103.205.67] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:03] (thought I'd get the answer from the horses mouth) [02:03] rob^: supposedly it works very nicely (though i haven't tried it) [02:03] how long has it been able to? === Robot101 has used it [02:04] <\sh> Robot101: the idea is, like google talk mentioned it, to add to jabber a sip signalling :) [02:04] \sh: yes, we can trivially accomodate that. you're not thinking big enough though [02:04] Robot101: the network IS the computer!!! [02:04] erm. [02:05] <\sh> Robot101: actually, I want to have all functionality in one app...doesn't matter if you're using single apps for jabber/sip/email or using only one app like evolution to integrate all possibilties... [02:05] \sh: no, that's crap. there's a reason all IM applications have completely ass UI, it's because they do a handful of totally disparate things [02:06] Robot101: so you're suggesting seperating GUI according to funcionality ? [02:06] rob^: never worked for me also [02:07] weard [02:07] sivang: http://robot101.net/files/tmp/IPCF.png [02:07] sivang: you use a phone app to make calls, an IM app to do text, nautilus to send files [02:07] or weird even [02:08] sivang: so yes [02:08] sivang: and it doesn't matter what the protocol underneath is, all the presence is reported to galago and referenced with your address book [02:08] sivang: we're starting with jabber and SIP [02:08] <\sh> Robot101: IM is more then text [02:08] oh so were calling the next version dapper eh....nice... [02:08] <\sh> especially xmpp is more then only text chat... [02:08] yes you need a presence app, buddy list or so [02:09] reminds me of dapper dan from oh brother where art thou [02:09] \sh: yes, but the jabber connection manager splits apart the services and makes them available /in the right place/ [02:10] <\sh> Robot101: how do you want to incorporate xmpp video streaming? another app, or just a jabber client with support for it? === LinuxJones [n=willy@blk-222-89-108.eastlink.ca] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:10] Robot101: nice. We achive higher trivial integration, since each app has it's "net blessed" capabilities and you don't have to fire up the IM for instance, in order to be able to send files and vice versa [02:10] sivang: right :) [02:10] \sh: another app or an existing one, whatever takes your fancy [02:11] \sh: when I say "IM app" I mean presence and text messaging. the other functionality is in other places. the connections to eg Jabber/SIP/MSN/IRC/whatever are in dbus services available across your desktop [02:11] \sh: Evolution tells you if you can IM or phone or video call someone when they e-mail you [02:12] \sh: in nautilus you go right click, Send File To -> Bob, and it will use Jabber or MSN or however bob's available to send files to [02:12] anyway I reallly do need to go [02:12] more later === Robot101 runs off [02:12] Robot101: also, if we have the lib, then every frontend author can use it up to make what he sees fit, and those can all coexist happily. tht would enable us to suit each user preference. I tend to like this. [02:13] <\sh> Robot101: think about it like this: there is no need for propietary protocols anymore...so u need to implement at least some type of xmpp client which supports several JEPs and distribute via whatever to the correct apps [02:13] <\sh> Robot101: which is an awesome goal :) [02:14] \sh: the idea is to integrate numerous different presence systems into one coherent interface === terrex [n=terrex@84-122-83-29.onocable.ono.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel === avanspronsen [n=andrewv@London-HSE-ppp3543971.sympatico.ca] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:16] <\sh> jdub: which doesn't work even for jabber transports...yahoo/aol/ms are changing there specs when they want, and you have to work after...which isn't good...so use at least one open protocol which is very well documented and has a future === persia [n=persia@p3101-ipbf412marunouchi.tokyo.ocn.ne.jp] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:17] \sh: users can use whatever they want [02:18] <\sh> jdub: but leave this to the server .. and concentrate on one access method and protocol specification [02:18] that's not really the poitn [02:18] <\sh> on client side...speak presence manager/connection manager === cogumbreiro [n=tiago@81.20.250.82] has joined #ubuntu-devel === WaterSevenUb [n=WaterSev@bl5-55-194.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:18] lo all [02:18] and it certainly doesn't satisfy user requirements (you know, make it actually work) [02:19] <\sh> jdub: yes it is...see gaim or kopete when aol changes some things in icq/aim connections...u have to fiddle with a lot of crap [02:19] \sh: that's a totally different issue === xTina [n=xTina@dsl-084-056-131-094.arcor-ip.net] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:22] <\sh> jdub: the presence manager/connection manager has to deal with several propietary protocols then...so something changed for some "really kewl presence and messaging protocol" you have to work on it for every change [02:22] \sh: how do you really plan to solve this issue? people will continue to use the prop protocols ....and we would still have to stay on front of tracking them to keep stuff not falling [02:22] <\sh> sivang: as I said...it's a server issue...which can be solved with xmpp transports [02:23] \sh: via separately upgradeable plugins. but that really doesn't matter, and is not different from the current situation. [02:23] it's not a server issue [02:23] because that doesn't solve the problem for most people [02:23] <\sh> jdub: the problem would be solved, when the companies are revealing their secrets [02:23] and they're far more likely to be disconnected than every separate user [02:23] right, so now you're in the realms of fantasy, not problem solving :-) [02:24] \sh: I don't see this happening too early from now ;) [02:24] <\sh> jdub: what are u using most of the time when you are using icq? [02:24] gaim [02:24] \sh: I use gaim [02:24] <\sh> jdub: text chats, or the network games? [02:25] ? === terrex [n=terrex@84-122-83-29.onocable.ono.com] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:25] <\sh> jdub: I'm talking about integrating those protocols in the software...which is here on client side...and if somethings changed, most of the devs are reengineering the protocols === jsgotangco [n=jsg@203.172.2.57] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:27] <\sh> jdub: I know, I'm a bloody xmpp fanatic ;) === harrytuttle [n=harrytut@host216-150.pool80116.interbusiness.it] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:29] <\sh> hmmm...lets see if I can get Peter on board === thesaltydog [n=fabio@host48-222.pool8255.interbusiness.it] has joined #ubuntu-devel [02:49] grmpf [02:51]